From nobody Sun Jan 11 10:42:03 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 852011A87D1 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 10:42:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.011 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.011 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_40=-0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sX7cSSL4Emrf for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 10:41:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fr.alcatel-lucent.com (fr-hpida-esg-02.alcatel-lucent.com [135.245.210.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0A4AD1A87CB for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 10:41:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from fr712usmtp2.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (unknown [135.239.2.42]) by Websense Email Security Gateway with ESMTPS id 83486809FE9E3 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 18:41:52 +0000 (GMT) Received: from FR711WXCHHUB01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (fr711wxchhub01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com [135.239.2.111]) by fr712usmtp2.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (GMO) with ESMTP id t0BIfs0J028980 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL) for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 19:41:56 +0100 Received: from FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com ([169.254.7.25]) by FR711WXCHHUB01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com ([135.239.2.111]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 19:41:54 +0100 From: "DRAGE, Keith (Keith)" To: "avtext@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Proceedings from IETF 91 (Honolulu) Thread-Index: AdAtzhPqu3wC9AE/QkKMbc0XFUtV2A== Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2015 18:41:53 +0000 Message-ID: <949EF20990823C4C85C18D59AA11AD8B2A13A0@FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com> Accept-Language: en-GB, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [135.239.27.40] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: [avtext] Proceedings from IETF 91 (Honolulu) X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2015 18:42:01 -0000 (As WG cochair) Somewhat belatedly find the proceedings from this meeting below. Regards Keith Tuesday 12th November 2014, 15:20 - 17:20 HST (Room: Kahili) Chairs: Keith Drage / Jonathan Lennox Agenda bash, status update, and review of related protocol items (10 min) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Slides: slides-91-avtext-3.ppt Admin slide (slide 2). Note Well (slide 3). Agenda Bash (slide 4) no comments. Status: Splicing notification (slide 5). One new WG document: draft-ietf-avtext-splicing-notification-00. Two reviews received - Bo Burman, Stephan Botzko. Chairs would like to have= at least one more. Colin Perkins (via Jabber) agreed to provide a review. After that (assuming all issues raised by reviews are resolved) the documen= t should be ready for WGLC. Status: draft-uberti-payload-vp9-00 (Slide 6). Defines RTP payload for VP9. Also proposes new AVPF feedback message: LIR "Layer Intra Request" for part= ial refresh of SST scalable media. Review from AVTEXT would be welcome. Likely useful as a general-purpose mec= hanism. Stefan Wenger agreed to provide a review. Taxonomy (30 min) ------------------ Presenter: Bo Burman draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-02 Slides: slides-91-avtext-0.pdf [Slide 2] No update since IETF90 [Slide 3] Add definition for "multimedia conference". No objection from meeting. New definitions for layered coding transport. seems like there is agreement= on the list for this. [Slide 4] No need for common term for "media source or media sink" Jonathan: "all RTP stream sbetween media source and sink" is not too long a= nd therefore OK. No need for a term for "all RTP streams between a media source and media si= nk". [Slide 5] Keith: WG is satisfied that the document is complete. =20 AD: IETF LC is sufficient for inter-WG review. =20 Way forward: Will have a -03 version with conclusion from meeting, will be = available this week. Ready for WGLC when new document available (will have= three week WGLC due to end of meeting and bridging thanksgiving). [Slides 6 through 10 not presented - backup slides only] RTP Stream Pause / Resume (30min) --------------------------------- Presenter: Bo Burman draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-stream-pause-05 Slides: slides-91-avtext-1.pdf Has already had WGLC. Close all open issues to enable publication request. [Slide 2]=20 IPR disclosure from version 0. [Slide 3] Changes since 01 Clarification on unsolicited PAUSED / TMMBN=3D0. Major re-write of SDP signaling Change refuse to refused - indication Emil Ivov (via Jabber): did we decide ack to unsolicited post message. Presenter: coming to it next slide [1st point on Slide 4]=20 Open issue: Do we need ACK for unsolicited PAUSED. Roni: two directions: just repeat message vs. ack. Timing/ repetition rule= s needed =20 Mo: no ack makes more sense - no need for acknowledge, no need for a state = lock. Transient advisory message. Send periodically as update. Jonathan: Mechanism is designed for group communication. From whom in group= do you expect ACK? Do you expect ack from the whole group? In which case = how to know? Bo: agree this is why repeat is better. Emil (via Jabber): TMMBr has TMMBN, why not ack. Roni: tmnbn is not really an ack, it's more a bandwidth negotiation thing. Keith: people are happy with multiple transmissions? Emil (via Jabber): no objection to not adding ACK. Roni: no Ack, so now we need repetition rules. Bo: proposal on list was to use loss rate as metric.=20 Stephan: don't limit number. Roni: likes idea of text saying tune it to loss rate (informative) Keith as Chair: Will not have ack. Will have informative text for repetitio= n rules indicating "tune it to loss rate". [2nd point on slide 4]=20 retransmission interval for unsolicited PAUSED? Jonathan: limit of RTCP timing rules as sufficient? Emil (via Jabber): one reason to recommend. Colin (via Jabber): every RTCP interval? Stephan: no over specify. Bo proposal: send with evert RTCP compound packet. Bo proposal #2: add : "you can send as often as you wish as long as you do = not exceed limit (informative). Action: send it with every compound RTCP packet as long as want and may sen= d it while not exceeding the RTCP bandwidth. [Slide 5]=20 Chair: any other open issues. Room: no. Action: Editor will spin a new version with these changes, then will have o= ne week second WGLC. Header Extension for SDES Items (20 min) ---------------------------------------- Presenter: Mo Zanaty draft-westerlund-avtext-sdes-hdr-ext-02=20 Decide whether should be adopted as WG item. Slides: slides-91-avtext-2.pdf [Slides 1 through 7 presented]=20 Will be used for critical SDES items required to process media immediately = and fate share with media. It was brought in various WG (RTCWEB. MMUSIC, CLUE) The draft is currently registering CNAME. MID is registered in the bundle d= raft.=20 The syntax is just put the header extension in an RTP header extension. = =20 [Slide 8] Propose to adopt as AVTEXT WG item. Keith: is this the right direction forward? Have concerns be addressed? Harald: no concerns with present scope of draft. Bernard: no concerns. Rob Hansen: would like to use it. Humm for adopt. Unanimous in favor Confirm on list. Chairs will ask for milestone. 16:50 Close ----------- Stephan: There is payload issue, H265 payload vs. updated terminology in ta= xonomy. People asked to look at it. Thanks to Stefan Wenger and Roni Even for providing notes for the meeting. = Thanks to Harald Alvestrand for acting as Jabber scribe.= From nobody Sun Jan 11 18:01:07 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB3451A8A0E for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 18:01:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pQ0S7zBMl2zB for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 18:01:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fr.alcatel-lucent.com (fr-hpgre-esg-01.alcatel-lucent.com [135.245.210.22]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7E46F1A87E8 for ; Sun, 11 Jan 2015 18:01:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from fr711usmtp1.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (unknown [135.239.2.122]) by Websense Email Security Gateway with ESMTPS id BDE0ECFA3EEE1 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 02:01:00 +0000 (GMT) Received: from FR711WXCHHUB01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (fr711wxchhub01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com [135.239.2.111]) by fr711usmtp1.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (GMO) with ESMTP id t0C211RT001137 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL) for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 03:01:01 +0100 Received: from FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com ([169.254.7.25]) by FR711WXCHHUB01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com ([135.239.2.111]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 03:01:01 +0100 From: "DRAGE, Keith (Keith)" To: "avtext@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-03.txt Thread-Index: AQHQAAM2TU9IvAskwUumiAHVoVNISJxgYKPwgFu2RTA= Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2015 02:01:01 +0000 Message-ID: <949EF20990823C4C85C18D59AA11AD8B2A158E@FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com> Accept-Language: en-GB, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [135.239.27.40] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-03.txt X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2015 02:01:05 -0000 (As WG cochair) A double check here - is there anyone still planning to submit comments on = this WGLC (that has not already done so). Regards Keith =20 > -----Original Message----- > From: DRAGE, Keith (Keith)=20 > Sent: 14 November 2014 17:32 > To: avtext@ietf.org > Subject: [avtext] I-D Action:=20 > draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-03.txt >=20 > (As WG cochair)=20 >=20 > This is to start a working group last call on=20 > draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-03. >=20 > To cater for the end of the IETF meeting, and for various=20 > national holidays, this working group last call will last three weeks. >=20 > Therefore please comment on this document by Friday 5th December 2014. >=20 > Please send comments to the working group list. >=20 > It is helpful to give some assessment of the nature of your=20 > comment, as to whether you regard it as editorial, minor=20 > technical, or a rather more major flaw. >=20 > Regards >=20 > Keith >=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: avtext [mailto:avtext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of=20 > internet-drafts@ietf.org > Sent: 14 November 2014 12:05 > To: i-d-announce@ietf.org > Cc: avtext@ietf.org > Subject: [avtext] I-D Action:=20 > draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-03.txt >=20 >=20 > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line=20 > Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Audio/Video Transport=20 > Extensions Working Group of the IETF. >=20 > Title : A Taxonomy of Grouping Semantics=20 > and Mechanisms for Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) Sources > Authors : Jonathan Lennox > Kevin Gross > Suhas Nandakumar > Gonzalo Salgueiro > Bo Burman > Filename : draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-03.txt > Pages : 42 > Date : 2014-11-14 >=20 > Abstract: > The terminology about, and associations among, Real-Time Transport > Protocol (RTP) sources can be complex and somewhat opaque. This > document describes a number of existing and proposed relationships > among RTP sources, and attempts to define common terminology for > discussing protocol entities and their relationships. >=20 >=20 > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-groupin > g-taxonomy/ >=20 > There's also a htmlized version available at: > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-03 >=20 > A diff from the previous version is available at: > http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-avtext-rtp-groupin > g-taxonomy-03 >=20 >=20 > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the=20 > time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are=20 > available at tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >=20 > _______________________________________________ > avtext mailing list > avtext@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext > = From nobody Fri Jan 16 00:50:17 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C18F1AC3AF; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:50:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BWUx-p5ElJkC; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:50:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94C621A1B45; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:50:12 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.10.0.p8 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20150116085012.3936.23603.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:50:12 -0800 Archived-At: Cc: avtext@ietf.org Subject: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 08:50:14 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Audio/Video Transport Extensions Working Group of the IETF. Title : A Taxonomy of Grouping Semantics and Mechanisms for Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) Sources Authors : Jonathan Lennox Kevin Gross Suhas Nandakumar Gonzalo Salgueiro Bo Burman Filename : draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt Pages : 42 Date : 2015-01-16 Abstract: The terminology about, and associations among, Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) sources can be complex and somewhat opaque. This document describes a number of existing and proposed relationships among RTP sources, and attempts to define common terminology for discussing protocol entities and their relationships. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Jan 16 00:59:06 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BCE681A6F2D for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:59:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ue-Rn8F3wAW7 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:59:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from sesbmg22.ericsson.net (sesbmg22.ericsson.net [193.180.251.48]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4CE7D1A0194 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 00:59:01 -0800 (PST) X-AuditID: c1b4fb30-f79106d000001184-22-54b8d2d35cbd Received: from ESESSHC005.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.124]) by sesbmg22.ericsson.net (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 38.63.04484.3D2D8B45; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 09:58:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from ESESSMB105.ericsson.se ([169.254.5.190]) by ESESSHC005.ericsson.se ([153.88.183.33]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 09:58:59 +0100 From: Bo Burman To: "avtext@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt Thread-Index: AQHQMWl1tl9CKg2jMUmYRPhatrmRcJzCcKcA Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 08:58:58 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20150116085012.3936.23603.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <20150116085012.3936.23603.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: sv-SE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [153.88.183.17] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrGLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyM+Jvje7lSztCDC7vV7b4eO8GqwOjx5Il P5kCGKO4bFJSczLLUov07RK4MhZ8+sxacESmovX1V8YGxouiXYycHBICJhKntn9ihLDFJC7c W8/WxcjFISRwhFHi5cKDzCAJIYEljBJbPuqD2GwCGhLzd9wFaxARUJe4M/0CG4gtLBAkMfXz L2aIeLDE4XVroGwjiUmPO5lAbBYBVYkHk06A1fMK+ErcnLebDWK+g0TbntUsIDangKPEr2Nb weYzCshK3P9+DyzOLCAucevJfCaIQwUkluw5zwxhi0q8fPyPtYuRA8hWlFjeLwdRriOxYPcn NghbW2LZwtfMEGsFJU7OfMIygVF0FpKps5C0zELSMgtJywJGllWMosWpxUm56UZGeqlFmcnF xfl5enmpJZsYgRFxcMtvgx2ML587HmIU4GBU4uH9sG1HiBBrYllxZe4hRmkOFiVx3jyHDSFC AumJJanZqakFqUXxRaU5qcWHGJk4OKUaGIWv9NSfVvqhfWZhx/x1m7SnNidmm3/rD33252l5 +t3aBRM3ns7svNNUcusEV9Ib83n/LBL//j3u58SuO3tdVovM9lf8lRsatp7Uc9O2cI0PiOWb lnxiodgiixlyZje/f5p7le+m25YpvV8emxTWmxmwi6Yu4zp1xNLtwcquN2szPH7+bY8xmqjE UpyRaKjFXFScCABaz9qpaQIAAA== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 08:59:04 -0000 This update should address all comments received so far during the WGLC. Update notes between -03 and -04 (copied from the document, for your conven= ience): o Changed "Media Redundancy" and "Media Repair" to "RTP-based Redundancy" and "RTP-based Repair", since those terms are more specific and correct. o Changed "End Point" to "Endpoint" and removed Editor's Note on this. o Clarified that a Media Capture may impose constraints on clock handling. o Clarified that mixing multiple Raw Streams into a Source Stream is not possible, since that requires mixed streams to have a timing relation, requiring them to be Source Streams, and added an example. o Clarified that RTP-based Redundancy excludes the type of encoding redundancy found within the encoded media format in an Encoded Stream. o Clarified that a Media Transport contains only a single RTP Session, but a single RTP Session can span multiple Media Transports. o Clarified that packets with seemingly correct checksum that are received by a Media Transport Receiver may still be corrupt. o Clarified that a corrupt packet in a Media Transport Receiver is typically either discarded or somehow marked and passed on in the Received RTP Stream. o Added Synchronization Context to Figure 6. o Editorial improvements and clarifications. Cheers /Bo > -----Original Message----- > From: avtext [mailto:avtext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-draft= s@ietf.org > Sent: den 16 januari 2015 09:50 > To: i-d-announce@ietf.org > Cc: avtext@ietf.org > Subject: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.= txt >=20 >=20 > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts direct= ories. > This draft is a work item of the Audio/Video Transport Extensions Workin= g Group of the IETF. >=20 > Title : A Taxonomy of Grouping Semantics and Mechanisms= for Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) Sources > Authors : Jonathan Lennox > Kevin Gross > Suhas Nandakumar > Gonzalo Salgueiro > Bo Burman > Filename : draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt > Pages : 42 > Date : 2015-01-16 >=20 > Abstract: > The terminology about, and associations among, Real-Time Transport > Protocol (RTP) sources can be complex and somewhat opaque. This > document describes a number of existing and proposed relationships > among RTP sources, and attempts to define common terminology for > discussing protocol entities and their relationships. >=20 >=20 > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy/ >=20 > There's also a htmlized version available at: > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04 >=20 > A diff from the previous version is available at: > http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonom= y-04 >=20 >=20 > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submiss= ion until the htmlized version and diff are > available at tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >=20 > _______________________________________________ > avtext mailing list > avtext@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext From nobody Fri Jan 16 05:59:15 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DBA21ACCFE for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 05:59:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Z3I44fDjvon6 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 05:59:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fr.alcatel-lucent.com (fr-hpgre-esg-01.alcatel-lucent.com [135.245.210.22]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D86E41ABC75 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 05:59:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from fr711usmtp1.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (unknown [135.239.2.122]) by Websense Email Security Gateway with ESMTPS id 2F3FBEA2ABCBF; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 13:59:06 +0000 (GMT) Received: from FR711WXCHHUB01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (fr711wxchhub01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com [135.239.2.111]) by fr711usmtp1.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com (GMO) with ESMTP id t0GDx5CP021861 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Fri, 16 Jan 2015 14:59:08 +0100 Received: from FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com ([169.254.7.25]) by FR711WXCHHUB01.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com ([135.239.2.111]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 14:59:07 +0100 From: "DRAGE, Keith (Keith)" To: Bo Burman , "avtext@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt Thread-Index: AQHQMWl3WcA8jtIdHES+RgkjB93E1ZzCYb0AgABiVyA= Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 13:59:06 +0000 Message-ID: <949EF20990823C4C85C18D59AA11AD8B2A4D70@FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com> References: <20150116085012.3936.23603.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-GB, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [135.239.27.40] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 13:59:13 -0000 (As WG chair) I have received no notification that we have any further comments to come f= rom the WGLC. I would also all commenters (and others) to review to ensure the changes ar= e appropriate.=20 Commenters please confirm your comments have been addressed. Keith > -----Original Message----- > From: avtext [mailto:avtext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bo Burman > Sent: 16 January 2015 08:59 > To: avtext@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action:=20 > draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt >=20 > This update should address all comments received so far=20 > during the WGLC. >=20 > Update notes between -03 and -04 (copied from the document,=20 > for your convenience): >=20 > o Changed "Media Redundancy" and "Media Repair" to "RTP-based > Redundancy" and "RTP-based Repair", since those terms are more > specific and correct. >=20 > o Changed "End Point" to "Endpoint" and removed Editor's Note on > this. >=20 > o Clarified that a Media Capture may impose constraints on clock > handling. >=20 > o Clarified that mixing multiple Raw Streams into a=20 > Source Stream is > not possible, since that requires mixed streams to have a timing > relation, requiring them to be Source Streams, and added an > example. >=20 > o Clarified that RTP-based Redundancy excludes the type=20 > of encoding > redundancy found within the encoded media format in an Encoded > Stream. >=20 > o Clarified that a Media Transport contains only a single RTP > Session, but a single RTP Session can span multiple Media > Transports. >=20 > o Clarified that packets with seemingly correct checksum that are > received by a Media Transport Receiver may still be corrupt. >=20 > o Clarified that a corrupt packet in a Media Transport Receiver is > typically either discarded or somehow marked and passed=20 > on in the > Received RTP Stream. >=20 > o Added Synchronization Context to Figure 6. >=20 > o Editorial improvements and clarifications. >=20 > Cheers > /Bo >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: avtext [mailto:avtext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of=20 > > internet-drafts@ietf.org > > Sent: den 16 januari 2015 09:50 > > To: i-d-announce@ietf.org > > Cc: avtext@ietf.org > > Subject: [avtext] I-D Action:=20 > > draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt > >=20 > >=20 > > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line=20 > Internet-Drafts directories. > > This draft is a work item of the Audio/Video Transport=20 > Extensions Working Group of the IETF. > >=20 > > Title : A Taxonomy of Grouping Semantics=20 > and Mechanisms for Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) Sources > > Authors : Jonathan Lennox > > Kevin Gross > > Suhas Nandakumar > > Gonzalo Salgueiro > > Bo Burman > > Filename : draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt > > Pages : 42 > > Date : 2015-01-16 > >=20 > > Abstract: > > The terminology about, and associations among, Real-Time=20 > Transport > > Protocol (RTP) sources can be complex and somewhat opaque. This > > document describes a number of existing and proposed=20 > relationships > > among RTP sources, and attempts to define common terminology for > > discussing protocol entities and their relationships. > >=20 > >=20 > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > >=20 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxono > > my/ > >=20 > > There's also a htmlized version available at: > >=20 > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04 > >=20 > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > >=20 > http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxono > > my-04 > >=20 > >=20 > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of=20 > > submission until the htmlized version and diff are=20 > available at tools.ietf.org. > >=20 > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > >=20 > > _______________________________________________ > > avtext mailing list > > avtext@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext >=20 > _______________________________________________ > avtext mailing list > avtext@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext > = From nobody Fri Jan 16 08:20:30 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DC6C1ACEA0 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 08:20:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XOP9_TJxZiV2 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 08:20:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from haggis.mythic-beasts.com (haggis.mythic-beasts.com [IPv6:2a00:1098:0:86:1000:0:2:1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 962ED1ACE97 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 08:20:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from [130.209.247.112] (port=50767 helo=mangole.dcs.gla.ac.uk) by haggis.mythic-beasts.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1YC9dE-0006GL-Mr; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 16:20:21 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.6\)) From: Colin Perkins In-Reply-To: <949EF20990823C4C85C18D59AA11AD8B2A4D70@FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 16:20:16 +0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20150116085012.3936.23603.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <949EF20990823C4C85C18D59AA11AD8B2A4D70@FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com> To: "DRAGE, Keith (Keith)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.6) X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: -28 X-Mythic-Debug: Threshold = On = Archived-At: Cc: "avtext@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 16:20:28 -0000 Keith, I=92ve reviewed this version. The changes look good to me. Colin On 16 Jan 2015, at 13:59, DRAGE, Keith (Keith) = wrote: > (As WG chair) >=20 > I have received no notification that we have any further comments to = come from the WGLC. >=20 > I would also all commenters (and others) to review to ensure the = changes are appropriate.=20 >=20 > Commenters please confirm your comments have been addressed. >=20 > Keith >=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: avtext [mailto:avtext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bo Burman >> Sent: 16 January 2015 08:59 >> To: avtext@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action:=20 >> draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt >>=20 >> This update should address all comments received so far=20 >> during the WGLC. >>=20 >> Update notes between -03 and -04 (copied from the document,=20 >> for your convenience): >>=20 >> o Changed "Media Redundancy" and "Media Repair" to "RTP-based >> Redundancy" and "RTP-based Repair", since those terms are more >> specific and correct. >>=20 >> o Changed "End Point" to "Endpoint" and removed Editor's Note on >> this. >>=20 >> o Clarified that a Media Capture may impose constraints on clock >> handling. >>=20 >> o Clarified that mixing multiple Raw Streams into a=20 >> Source Stream is >> not possible, since that requires mixed streams to have a timing >> relation, requiring them to be Source Streams, and added an >> example. >>=20 >> o Clarified that RTP-based Redundancy excludes the type=20 >> of encoding >> redundancy found within the encoded media format in an Encoded >> Stream. >>=20 >> o Clarified that a Media Transport contains only a single RTP >> Session, but a single RTP Session can span multiple Media >> Transports. >>=20 >> o Clarified that packets with seemingly correct checksum that are >> received by a Media Transport Receiver may still be corrupt. >>=20 >> o Clarified that a corrupt packet in a Media Transport Receiver is >> typically either discarded or somehow marked and passed=20 >> on in the >> Received RTP Stream. >>=20 >> o Added Synchronization Context to Figure 6. >>=20 >> o Editorial improvements and clarifications. >>=20 >> Cheers >> /Bo >>=20 >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: avtext [mailto:avtext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of=20 >>> internet-drafts@ietf.org >>> Sent: den 16 januari 2015 09:50 >>> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org >>> Cc: avtext@ietf.org >>> Subject: [avtext] I-D Action:=20 >>> draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line=20 >> Internet-Drafts directories. >>> This draft is a work item of the Audio/Video Transport=20 >> Extensions Working Group of the IETF. >>>=20 >>> Title : A Taxonomy of Grouping Semantics=20 >> and Mechanisms for Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) Sources >>> Authors : Jonathan Lennox >>> Kevin Gross >>> Suhas Nandakumar >>> Gonzalo Salgueiro >>> Bo Burman >>> Filename : draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt >>> Pages : 42 >>> Date : 2015-01-16 >>>=20 >>> Abstract: >>> The terminology about, and associations among, Real-Time=20 >> Transport >>> Protocol (RTP) sources can be complex and somewhat opaque. This >>> document describes a number of existing and proposed=20 >> relationships >>> among RTP sources, and attempts to define common terminology for >>> discussing protocol entities and their relationships. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: >>>=20 >> = https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxono >>> my/ >>>=20 >>> There's also a htmlized version available at: >>>=20 >> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04 >>>=20 >>> A diff from the previous version is available at: >>>=20 >> = http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxono >>> my-04 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of=20 >>> submission until the htmlized version and diff are=20 >> available at tools.ietf.org. >>>=20 >>> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >>> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> avtext mailing list >>> avtext@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> avtext mailing list >> avtext@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext >>=20 > _______________________________________________ > avtext mailing list > avtext@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext --=20 Colin Perkins https://csperkins.org/ From nobody Fri Jan 16 21:11:52 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B5241A9162 for ; 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Sat, 17 Jan 2015 05:11:23 +0000 From: Stephan Wenger To: "DRAGE, Keith (Keith)" , Bo Burman , "avtext@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt Thread-Index: AQHQMWl3xFBMCjKLhEWzFSETaxmqqJzCcoAAgABT3ACAAHi2gA== Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2015 05:11:22 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20150116085012.3936.23603.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <949EF20990823C4C85C18D59AA11AD8B2A4D70@FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com> In-Reply-To: <949EF20990823C4C85C18D59AA11AD8B2A4D70@FR712WXCHMBA11.zeu.alcatel-lucent.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [50.174.124.226] authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=stewe@stewe.org; x-dmarcaction-test: None x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:(3005004);SRVR:CY1PR0701MB1273; x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:CY1PR0701MB1273; x-forefront-prvs: 04599F3534 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(189002)(51704005)(199003)(479174004)(377424004)(24454002)(13464003)(99286002)(19580405001)(2501002)(2656002)(19580395003)(122556002)(230783001)(86362001)(101416001)(92566002)(66066001)(46102003)(64706001)(87936001)(15975445007)(107886001)(40100003)(106116001)(105586002)(50986999)(2900100001)(76176999)(97736003)(2950100001)(36756003)(62966003)(1720100001)(77156002)(102836002)(54356999)(68736005)(42262002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:CY1PR0701MB1273; H:CY1PR0701MB1276.namprd07.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:0; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: stewe.org does not designate permitted sender hosts) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-ID: <091DBE1EB0ADAD49ADBE40312E35C138@namprd07.prod.outlook.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: stewe.org X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 17 Jan 2015 05:11:22.2028 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 865fc51c-5fae-4322-98ef-0121a85df0b6 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: CY1PR0701MB1273 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2015 05:11:50 -0000 I=B9m happy with the current version. Stephan On 1/16/15, 05:59, "DRAGE, Keith (Keith)" wrote: >(As WG chair) > >I have received no notification that we have any further comments to come >from the WGLC. > >I would also all commenters (and others) to review to ensure the changes >are appropriate.=20 > >Commenters please confirm your comments have been addressed. > >Keith > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: avtext [mailto:avtext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bo Burman >> Sent: 16 January 2015 08:59 >> To: avtext@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action: >> draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt >>=20 >> This update should address all comments received so far >> during the WGLC. >>=20 >> Update notes between -03 and -04 (copied from the document, >> for your convenience): >>=20 >> o Changed "Media Redundancy" and "Media Repair" to "RTP-based >> Redundancy" and "RTP-based Repair", since those terms are more >> specific and correct. >>=20 >> o Changed "End Point" to "Endpoint" and removed Editor's Note on >> this. >>=20 >> o Clarified that a Media Capture may impose constraints on clock >> handling. >>=20 >> o Clarified that mixing multiple Raw Streams into a >> Source Stream is >> not possible, since that requires mixed streams to have a timing >> relation, requiring them to be Source Streams, and added an >> example. >>=20 >> o Clarified that RTP-based Redundancy excludes the type >> of encoding >> redundancy found within the encoded media format in an Encoded >> Stream. >>=20 >> o Clarified that a Media Transport contains only a single RTP >> Session, but a single RTP Session can span multiple Media >> Transports. >>=20 >> o Clarified that packets with seemingly correct checksum that are >> received by a Media Transport Receiver may still be corrupt. >>=20 >> o Clarified that a corrupt packet in a Media Transport Receiver is >> typically either discarded or somehow marked and passed >> on in the >> Received RTP Stream. >>=20 >> o Added Synchronization Context to Figure 6. >>=20 >> o Editorial improvements and clarifications. >>=20 >> Cheers >> /Bo >>=20 >> > -----Original Message----- >> > From: avtext [mailto:avtext-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of >> > internet-drafts@ietf.org >> > Sent: den 16 januari 2015 09:50 >> > To: i-d-announce@ietf.org >> > Cc: avtext@ietf.org >> > Subject: [avtext] I-D Action: >> > draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt >> >=20 >> >=20 >> > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line >> Internet-Drafts directories. >> > This draft is a work item of the Audio/Video Transport >> Extensions Working Group of the IETF. >> >=20 >> > Title : A Taxonomy of Grouping Semantics >> and Mechanisms for Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) Sources >> > Authors : Jonathan Lennox >> > Kevin Gross >> > Suhas Nandakumar >> > Gonzalo Salgueiro >> > Bo Burman >> > Filename : draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04.txt >> > Pages : 42 >> > Date : 2015-01-16 >> >=20 >> > Abstract: >> > The terminology about, and associations among, Real-Time >> Transport >> > Protocol (RTP) sources can be complex and somewhat opaque. This >> > document describes a number of existing and proposed >> relationships >> > among RTP sources, and attempts to define common terminology for >> > discussing protocol entities and their relationships. >> >=20 >> >=20 >> > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: >> >=20 >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxono >> > my/ >> >=20 >> > There's also a htmlized version available at: >> >=20 >> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-04 >> >=20 >> > A diff from the previous version is available at: >> >=20 >> http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxono >> > my-04 >> >=20 >> >=20 >> > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of >> > submission until the htmlized version and diff are >> available at tools.ietf.org. >> >=20 >> > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >> > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >> >=20 >> > _______________________________________________ >> > avtext mailing list >> > avtext@ietf.org >> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> avtext mailing list >> avtext@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext >>=20 >_______________________________________________ >avtext mailing list >avtext@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/avtext From nobody Thu Jan 22 01:21:57 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 070AF1A049C for ; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 01:21:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XgzyRHbzDjEL for ; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 01:21:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from sesbmg23.ericsson.net (sesbmg23.ericsson.net [193.180.251.37]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5DCD51A0469 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 01:21:52 -0800 (PST) X-AuditID: c1b4fb25-f791c6d00000617b-03-54c0c12e7643 Received: from ESESSHC017.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.124]) by sesbmg23.ericsson.net (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 78.A3.24955.E21C0C45; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 10:21:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from ESESSMB105.ericsson.se ([169.254.5.233]) by ESESSHC017.ericsson.se ([153.88.183.69]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 10:21:49 +0100 From: Bo Burman To: "avtext@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Retransmission rules for RESUME in draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-stream-pause-05 Thread-Index: AdA2ImIR23jMWYBTRr2V5a7v5w6LQw== Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 09:21:48 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: sv-SE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [153.88.183.20] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_BBE9739C2C302046BD34B42713A1E2A22E45F213ESESSMB105erics_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrBLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyM+Jvja7ewQMhBo9OSVl8vHeD1YHRY8mS n0wBjFFcNimpOZllqUX6dglcGW3HfjMV9KtUrF79gKmBsVO+i5GTQ0LARGLq5l5mCFtM4sK9 9WxdjFwcQgJHGCVmLF/NCuEsYZTYPekqO0gVm4CGxPwddxlBbBEBdYk70y+wgdjCAsES1z+3 QsUjJO729rNB2HoSJybNAtvAIqAqcefQfbA4r4CvxNajh8HijAKyEve/32MBsZkFxCVuPZnP BHGRgMSSPeehrhOVePn4HyuErShxdfpyJoj6fIkvG08yQ8wUlDg58wnLBEahWUhGzUJSNgtJ GURcR2LB7k9sELa2xLKFr5lh7DMHHjMhiy9gZF/FKFqcWpyUm25krJdalJlcXJyfp5eXWrKJ ERgVB7f8Vt3BePmN4yFGAQ5GJR7eD/MPhAixJpYVV+YeYpTmYFES581z2BAiJJCeWJKanZpa kFoUX1Sak1p8iJGJg1OqgbGh98g3sXN1SwRTpDz/9XbnvdcpU/zcGXEsRnrH2RXxhRdZdN+U CZ2uY+oXFlLg4tXQi/tnHB/7k3/dnNKne7pu69+3SGoOmNmrn7ja8r9my9m+/t/vP6vdvef3 xHuzjUF7V7v99MAlX5geXfp45VOH9pRbVzaLlhjGRujnzLMVyspbny30WomlOCPRUIu5qDgR ADXu9xFrAgAA Archived-At: Subject: [avtext] Retransmission rules for RESUME in draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-stream-pause-05 X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 09:21:55 -0000 --_000_BBE9739C2C302046BD34B42713A1E2A22E45F213ESESSMB105erics_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable While adding text on retransmission of PAUSED ("to increase the probability= that the message reaches the receiver in a timely fashion") into the Messa= ge Details section, according to comments received at AVTEXT session in Hon= olulu, I realize it would probably be appropriate to have similar text also= for RESUME. There is already text saying that RESUME can be time critical,= but there is no specific text mentioning that retransmission can be used t= o handle possible loss. For PAUSED, there is no obvious trigger when to stop sending the message as= long as the pause condition remains. As commented in Honolulu, I thus adde= d text that while the pause condition remains, PAUSED MAY be sent in every = compound RTCP, as long as the negotiated RTCP bandwidth is not exceeded. For RESUME, there are clear triggers when to stop any retransmissions: when= receiving RTP packets from the targeted stream, or when a REFUSED with a v= alid PauseID for the targeted RTP stream is received, and I suggest clearly= stating that too. Comments? Cheers, Bo --_000_BBE9739C2C302046BD34B42713A1E2A22E45F213ESESSMB105erics_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

While adding text on retransmission of PAUSED (̶= 0;to increase the probability that the message reaches the receiver in a ti= mely fashion”) into the Message Details section, according to comment= s received at AVTEXT session in Honolulu, I realize it would probably be appropriate to have similar text also for RESUME. The= re is already text saying that RESUME can be time critical, but there is no= specific text mentioning that retransmission can be used to handle possibl= e loss.

 

For PAUSED, there is no obvious trigger when to stop= sending the message as long as the pause condition remains. As commented i= n Honolulu, I thus added text that while the pause condition remains, PAUSE= D MAY be sent in every compound RTCP, as long as the negotiated RTCP bandwidth is not exceeded.

 

For RESUME, there are clear triggers when to stop an= y retransmissions: when receiving RTP packets from the targeted stream, or = when a REFUSED with a valid PauseID for the targeted RTP stream is received= , and I suggest clearly stating that too.

 

Comments?

 

Cheers,

Bo

 

--_000_BBE9739C2C302046BD34B42713A1E2A22E45F213ESESSMB105erics_-- From nobody Thu Jan 22 04:12:32 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E80171ACC86; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:12:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Gxff2EIKmDaJ; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:12:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B4671ACC89; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:12:14 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.10.0.p8 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20150122121214.29622.15892.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:12:14 -0800 Archived-At: Cc: avtext@ietf.org Subject: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05.txt X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 12:12:26 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Audio/Video Transport Extensions Working Group of the IETF. Title : A Taxonomy of Grouping Semantics and Mechanisms for Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) Sources Authors : Jonathan Lennox Kevin Gross Suhas Nandakumar Gonzalo Salgueiro Bo Burman Filename : draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05.txt Pages : 42 Date : 2015-01-22 Abstract: The terminology about, and associations among, Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) sources can be complex and somewhat opaque. This document describes a number of existing and proposed relationships among RTP sources, and attempts to define common terminology for discussing protocol entities and their relationships. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Jan 22 04:15:08 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A98AD1ACC88 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:15:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GvbRoeTHKOHI for ; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:15:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from sessmg22.ericsson.net (sessmg22.ericsson.net [193.180.251.58]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F24A51A1A10 for ; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:15:00 -0800 (PST) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3a-f79116d000000fec-dc-54c0e9c25b97 Received: from ESESSHC008.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.124]) by sessmg22.ericsson.net (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 6F.80.04076.2C9E0C45; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 13:14:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from ESESSMB105.ericsson.se ([169.254.5.233]) by ESESSHC008.ericsson.se ([153.88.183.42]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 13:14:58 +0100 From: Bo Burman To: "avtext@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05.txt Thread-Index: AQHQNjy5/5gWi/duj0y6bb/nkIJlCJzMDRtg Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 12:14:58 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20150122121214.29622.15892.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <20150122121214.29622.15892.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: sv-SE, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [153.88.183.16] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFrrKLMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyM+Jvje7hlwdCDH5eZrX4eO8GqwOjx5Il P5kCGKO4bFJSczLLUov07RK4Mhp6ljIW7BWq+LB7F3MD43a+LkYODgkBE4kbs4O6GDmBTDGJ C/fWs3UxcnEICRxhlNh0/x87hLOEUeLLuQfsIFVsAhoS83fcZQSxRQTUJe5Mv8AGMkhYwF2i 76IMRNhDYsmz11AlRhLHV2xhBrFZBFQlLh6YCzaGV8BX4l7fE3aQViEBR4m3i3lBwpwCThKT 761iAbEZBWQl7n+/B2YzC4hL3HoynwniTgGJJXvOM0PYohIvH/9jhbAVJXaebWeGqNeRWLD7 ExuErS2xbOFrZoi1ghInZz5hmcAoOgvJ2FlIWmYhaZmFpGUBI8sqRtHi1OLi3HQjI73Uoszk 4uL8PL281JJNjMB4OLjlt9UOxoPPHQ8xCnAwKvHwfph/IESINbGsuDL3EKM0B4uSOG+ew4YQ IYH0xJLU7NTUgtSi+KLSnNTiQ4xMHJxSDYxlje/fLru4/KF8jPPs7MXT7m4U/fheaXPOntV3 tyxetl2pitmPT89hjpLdgRVb9BRKhEsMJ3DEVFv1O4tZK+V9Ks5Uy9aY9HPWubtV9n8FF5rI fWw02Vma26h5OmLZvq18PbtKTpbo5XDv2WAbeuKh7FunZjVB27u3nvvW8e6f9a340bnOkgwl luKMREMt5qLiRAClxq8NaAIAAA== Archived-At: Subject: Re: [avtext] I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05.txt X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 12:15:05 -0000 This version includes a few editorial improvements. Cheers, Bo > -----Original Message----- > From: I-D-Announce [mailto:i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of in= ternet-drafts@ietf.org > Sent: den 22 januari 2015 13:12 > To: i-d-announce@ietf.org > Cc: avtext@ietf.org > Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05.txt >=20 >=20 > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts direct= ories. > This draft is a work item of the Audio/Video Transport Extensions Workin= g Group of the IETF. >=20 > Title : A Taxonomy of Grouping Semantics and Mechanisms= for Real-Time Transport Protocol (RTP) Sources > Authors : Jonathan Lennox > Kevin Gross > Suhas Nandakumar > Gonzalo Salgueiro > Bo Burman > Filename : draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05.txt > Pages : 42 > Date : 2015-01-22 >=20 > Abstract: > The terminology about, and associations among, Real-Time Transport > Protocol (RTP) sources can be complex and somewhat opaque. This > document describes a number of existing and proposed relationships > among RTP sources, and attempts to define common terminology for > discussing protocol entities and their relationships. >=20 >=20 > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy/ >=20 > There's also a htmlized version available at: > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05 >=20 > A diff from the previous version is available at: > http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonom= y-05 >=20 >=20 > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submiss= ion until the htmlized version and diff are > available at tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >=20 > _______________________________________________ > I-D-Announce mailing list > I-D-Announce@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce > Internet-Draft directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.= ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt From nobody Fri Jan 30 07:39:35 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: avtext@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B90D1A1A88 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 2015 07:39:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id biNao7Sb0GLm for ; Fri, 30 Jan 2015 07:39:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from sessmg22.ericsson.net (sessmg22.ericsson.net [193.180.251.58]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B9B2D1A1A45 for ; Fri, 30 Jan 2015 07:39:30 -0800 (PST) X-AuditID: c1b4fb3a-f79116d000000fec-f0-54cba5b0e723 Received: from ESESSHC001.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [153.88.253.124]) by sessmg22.ericsson.net (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 49.AB.04076.0B5ABC45; Fri, 30 Jan 2015 16:39:28 +0100 (CET) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (153.88.183.153) by smtp.internal.ericsson.com (153.88.183.23) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 14.3.195.1; Fri, 30 Jan 2015 16:39:28 +0100 Message-ID: <54CBA5AF.7040006@ericsson.com> Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2015 16:39:27 +0100 From: Magnus Westerlund User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "avtext@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFvrGJMWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyM+Jvje6GpadDDK7ukLX4eO8GqwOjx5Il P5kCGKO4bFJSczLLUov07RK4Mt5f3ctWcMqjonvmXpYGxpt6XYycHBICJhJ/L95mhbDFJC7c W8/WxcjFISRwhFHi39FjTBDOckaJtoZdjCBVvALaEvvvnQazWQRUJfZd3MYGYrMJWEjc/NEI ZosKBEssfv6UFaJeUOLkzCcsILaIgLrEnekXwGqEBewllly+ydzFyMHBLKApsX6XPkiYWUBe onnrbGYQWwhoVUNTB+sERr5ZSCbNQuiYhaRjASPzKkbR4tTi4tx0IyO91KLM5OLi/Dy9vNSS TYzAgDq45bfVDsaDzx0PMQpwMCrx8G74fCpEiDWxrLgy9xCjNAeLkjivnfGhECGB9MSS1OzU 1ILUovii0pzU4kOMTBycUg2MUjk19ZOvBzey5wi4Vwv9/JZyLd7Q49mlPp//PevD/ZlfC5cm SGyYmrWw4ZuP09fAZ3ZxaVUd3u9S3uudnMEhNNNxTmpnzKLXS7dP/2DP/q700c2aZWY/pJt1 H8c4afGwnPokevxV/+kkpdOLm8QP79G+2ev7+vb8TT5d2yfNbit99CXVd4OgEktxRqKhFnNR cSIA1ftZ1wkCAAA= Archived-At: Subject: [avtext] Comments on draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05 X-BeenThere: avtext@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Audio/Video Transport Extensions working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 30 Jan 2015 15:39:33 -0000 Hi, I have just reviewed draft-ietf-avtext-rtp-grouping-taxonomy-05 and think it is in good shape. However, I do have some few comments and reflections for the WG to consider. 1. The case when there are no source RTP stream, only redundancy RTP streams. This relates to two different sections: 2.1.12. Redundancy RTP Stream A RTP Stream (Section 2.1.10) that contains no original source data, only redundant data that may be combined with one or more Received RTP Stream (Section 2.1.19) to produce Repaired RTP Streams (Section 2.1.22). 2.1.21. RTP-based Repair RTP-based Repair is a Transformation that takes as input one or more Received RTP Streams (Section 2.1.19) and Received Redundancy RTP Streams (Section 2.1.20), and produces one or more Repaired RTP Streams (Section 2.1.22) that are as close to the corresponding sent Source RTP Streams (Section 2.1.10) as possible, using different RTP- based repair methods, for example the ones referred in RTP-based Redundancy (Section 2.1.11). I think the formulation is likely to allow for this case when one applies a FEC transform that results in no source RTP stream only redundancy symbols that are encoded into a Redundancy RTP stream. In 2.1.12 the important part is: ... only redundant data that may be combined with one or more Received RTP Stream (Section 2.1.19) ... The "may" here allows the case for no other stream to combine it with. In 2.1.21 the text I react to is: "... that takes as input one or more Received RTP Streams (Section 2.1.19) and Received Redundancy RTP Streams (Section 2.1.20), ..." This text is not super clear that what we are talking about are 1*(Recevied_RTP_Stream | Received_Redundancy_RTP_Stream) It is not that the case for no source stream is ruled out, but it also not clear and thus easily missed that this may occur. So either some informative sentence about this case, or maybe clarifying in 2.1.21 that it is zero or more Received RTP Streams and 1 or more Received Redundancy RTP to create a Repaired RTP stream. 2. Figure 6: +------------------------------------------------------------+ | Communication Session | | | | +----------------+ +----------------+ | | | Participant A | +------------+ | Participant B | | | | | | Multimedia | | | | | | +-------------+|<==>| Session |<==>|+-------------+ | | | | | Endpoint A || | | || Endpoint B | | | | | | || +------------+ || | | | | | | +-----------++----------------------++-----------+ | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | RTP Session|---Media Transport--->| | | | | | | | | Audio |<---Media Transport---| | | | | | | | | | ^ | | | | | | | | +-----------++----------|-----------++-----------+ | | | | | | || v || | | | | | | || +-----------------+ || | | | | | | || | Synchronization | || | | | | | | || | Context | || | | | | | | || +-----------------+ || | | | | | | || ^ || | | | | | | +-----------++----------|-----------++-----------+ | | | | | | | | v | | | | | | | | | RTP Session|<---Media Transport---| | | | | | | | | Video |---Media Transport--->| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | +-----------++----------------------++-----------+ | | | | | +-------------+| |+-------------+ | | | +----------------+ +----------------+ | +------------------------------------------------------------+ What I am reacting to is that the Media Transports are terminated against the Participant line rather than the endpoint line. I would prefer that they would terminate at that level. This could look like this: +------------------------------------------------------------+ | Communication Session | | | | +----------------+ +----------------+ | | | Participant A | +------------+ | Participant B | | | | | | Multimedia | | | | | | +-------------+|<==>| Session |<==>|+-------------+ | | | | | Endpoint A || | | || Endpoint B | | | | | | || +------------+ || | | | | | | +-----------++----------------------++-----------+ | | | | | | | || || | | | | | | | |RTP Session|----Media Transport---->| | | | | | | | |Audio |<---Media Transport-----| | | | | | | | | || ^ || | | | | | | | +-----------++----------|-----------++-----------+ | | | | | | || v || | | | | | | || +-----------------+ || | | | | | | || | Synchronization | || | | | | | | || | Context | || | | | | | | || +-----------------+ || | | | | | | || ^ || | | | | | | +-----------++----------|-----------++-----------+ | | | | | | | || v || | | | | | | | |RTP Session|<---Media Transport-----| | | | | | | | |Video |----Media Transport---->| | | | | | | | | || || | | | | | | | +-----------++----------------------++-----------+ | | | | | +-------------+| |+-------------+ | | | +----------------+ +----------------+ | +------------------------------------------------------------+ 3. Section 2.2.1 o An Endpoint can be associated with at most one Participant (Section 2.2.3) at any single point in time. o In some contexts, an Endpoint would typically correspond to a single "host", for example a computer using a single network interface and being used by a single human user. I think we might need to clarify how one should consider endpoints in the following scenario. A multi-user host, where two participants are communicating with each other using T.140 text (To avoid i/o issues of multi-user environments). The first bullet above requires then this host two have two endpoints. I think the current intuitive feeling for endpoint is that is it can be identified by an network address. However, if the above case are two endpoints they may actually have the same network address. I believe the most simple solution going forward would be to make it clear that in some cases there be multiple endpoints at a single host. I would propose to add to the second bullet above the following: In other contexts, a single 'host' can serve multiple Participants, in which case each Participant's Endpoint may share properties, for the IP address part of a transport address. 4. section 3.5: 2. In Multi-Session Transmission (MST), the SVC Media Encoder sends Encoded Streams and Dependent Streams distributed across multiple RTP Streams in one or more RTP Sessions. and MST denotes one or more RTP Streams (SSRC) per Media Source in each of multiple RTP Sessions. Is these two sentence really consistent. It is less than clear that "multiple" is equivalent to "one or more". 5. section 3.5: I wonder if we should at this stage create a special version of MRMT which has one and only one RTP stream per Media Source and media transport? The reason for such a one is exactly the discussion held in Section 3.8 about using the same SSRC value in multiple RTP sessions. 6. Section 3.7: As MDC is used in three places only, I think a reference is needed for the occurrence here in Section 3.7 back to Section 2.1.6. I will be away next week, so I will follow up on this after the 8th of February. Cheers Magnus Westerlund ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Services, Media and Network features, Ericsson Research EAB/TXM ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Ericsson AB | Phone +46 10 7148287 Färögatan 6 | Mobile +46 73 0949079 SE-164 80 Stockholm, Sweden | mailto: magnus.westerlund@ericsson.com ----------------------------------------------------------------------