From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Thu Jul 3 05:46:30 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46DB03A68BD for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.803 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.803 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001, DATE_IN_FUTURE_24_48=3.196, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mlsVS7rDY9y3 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0B393A6809 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F17C80CDE; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D954580CDD for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2A33142217 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YQpRC5pwpge1 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h1307246.stratoserver.net (block-online.eu [85.214.68.33]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81DD614220E for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 32332 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2008 14:46:02 +0200 Received: from dslb-088-077-069-084.pools.arcor-ip.net (HELO ?192.168.1.34?) (88.77.69.84) by block-online.eu with (DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 3 Jul 2008 14:46:02 +0200 Message-ID: <486E8BF9.5010501@block-online.eu> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 22:45:45 +0200 From: Oliver Block User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Hello everybody, In Sec. 3.6.4. you can find the following about the properties dtend and duration: 1. ABNF: ; the following are OPTIONAL, ; but MUST NOT occur more than once ... / dtend / duration / ... 2. Text: In a free time request, these properties can be used in combination with the "DURATION" property to represent a request for a duration of free time within a specified window of time. Is it intended that 'dtend' and 'duration' my both occur in a VFREEBUSY component? Or shouldn't they be mutually exclusive? Best Regards, Oliver Block _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Thu Jul 3 14:39:07 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 724743A6947 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YSfOkJX4f4uz for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 826983A67FA for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D03880B5E; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:14 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D90967FDFE for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B43D7142213 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tc1iU4vutOm4 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h1307246.stratoserver.net (block-online.eu [85.214.68.33]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99C431421FB for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 12095 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2008 23:39:01 +0200 Received: from dslb-092-072-070-218.pools.arcor-ip.net (HELO ?192.168.1.33?) (92.72.70.218) by block-online.eu with (DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 3 Jul 2008 23:39:01 +0200 Message-ID: <486D46F2.80102@block-online.eu> Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 23:38:58 +0200 From: Oliver Block User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Duration Value Type X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Hello everybody, I'd like to draw your attention to the following text: When computing an exact duration, the greatest order time components MUST be added first, that is, the number of weeks MUST be added first, followed by the number of days, number of hours, number of minutes, and number of seconds. The syntax is defined as follows: dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" (dur-date / dur-time / dur-week) dur-date = dur-day [dur-time] dur-time = "T" (dur-hour / dur-minute / dur-second) dur-week = 1*DIGIT "W" dur-hour = 1*DIGIT "H" [dur-minute] dur-minute = 1*DIGIT "M" [dur-second] dur-second = 1*DIGIT "S" dur-day = 1*DIGIT "D" As far as I've understood the meaning of RFC2445 (not the latest draft) and also of the syntax above, the use of week excludes the use of dur-date and also of dur-time. (I don't know if there is a need of a mixed form of in real life time planning.) So if you want to allow dur-week AND dur-date/dur-time within the same value, you need to change the ABNF to, for example dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" [dur-week] (dur-date / dur-time) or for example dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" (dur-date / dur-time / dur-week) ... dur-week = 1*DIGIT "W" [dur-date] ... If not, you need to change the text: When computing an exact duration, the greatest order time components MUST be added first, that is, the number of days MUST be added first, followed number of hours, number of minutes, and number of seconds. Additionally there could be added an explicit statement if weeks and day/time are both to be used in a Duration value. Do you agree? Best Regards, Oliver Block _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Thu Jul 3 15:23:49 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC3B73A6861 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id I9FaZwwSFz8X for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5E773A683C for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B7887F53C; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 922D37F517 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6731D1421FD for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uy05g+8hrfim for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.80]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 883D41421FC for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.60]) by QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id lP431Z0081HzFnQ580YW00; Thu, 03 Jul 2008 22:23:32 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id laPT1Z0071RyUCv3aaPXYV; Thu, 03 Jul 2008 22:23:32 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=PFsjAnyDAAAA:8 a=ZZJJydU43dLOefVpqY8A:9 a=RZrMXBkRNw9lfc-6h_0A:7 a=khAxDC76M_8YuFDb3FN52xLDhAAA:4 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=gi0PWCVxevcA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Oliver Block'" , Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 18:23:28 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcjdCtJvBYYfcPn+Qv+awujdX2TYPgAUFyKg X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 In-Reply-To: <486E8BF9.5010501@block-online.eu> Message-Id: <20080703222333.883D41421FC@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org I believe DTSTART and DTEND specify the endpoints of the "specified window of time" and DURATION the amount of time requested, in a free time request. In English "I need to find an hour of your free time sometime between 11:00 on 07/03/20008 and 17:00 on 07/11/2008". Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Oliver Block Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 4:46 PM To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY Hello everybody, In Sec. 3.6.4. you can find the following about the properties dtend and duration: 1. ABNF: ; the following are OPTIONAL, ; but MUST NOT occur more than once ... / dtend / duration / ... 2. Text: In a free time request, these properties can be used in combination with the "DURATION" property to represent a request for a duration of free time within a specified window of time. Is it intended that 'dtend' and 'duration' my both occur in a VFREEBUSY component? Or shouldn't they be mutually exclusive? Best Regards, Oliver Block _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 4 05:03:30 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E19373A6C62 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.001 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.001 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.598, BAYES_00=-2.599, DATE_IN_FUTURE_24_48=3.196, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kQbEYn5FeNq1 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05E4A3A6B6A for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA4677F635; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEF267F5BA for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5987142217 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bRfC3aLzw-I4 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h1307246.stratoserver.net (block-online.eu [85.214.68.33]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9130E1421FB for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 14301 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2008 14:03:24 +0200 Received: from dslb-092-072-070-218.pools.arcor-ip.net (HELO localhost) (92.72.70.218) by block-online.eu with (DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 4 Jul 2008 14:03:24 +0200 From: Oliver Block To: "Tim Hare" , ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 00:03:03 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.9 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200807060003.03834.lists@block-online.eu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Am Freitag, 4. Juli 2008 00:23:28 schrieben Sie: > I believe DTSTART and DTEND specify the endpoints of the "specified window > of time" and DURATION the amount of time requested, in a free time request. > > In English "I need to find an hour of your free time sometime between 11:00 > on 07/03/20008 and 17:00 on 07/11/2008". That's a good point. Best Regards, Oliver Block _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 4 06:05:48 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B74DF3A6B77 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oxCDLKmOQTRV for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AF283A6B43 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4466E80C9F; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1B6F80C50 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B92E414220E for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 77zOeQNjQbqb for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agminet01.oracle.com (agminet01.oracle.com [141.146.126.228]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1F6614220D for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by agminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id m64D5Yu8032365; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:05:34 -0500 Received: from acsmt351.oracle.com (acsmt351.oracle.com [141.146.40.151]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m64CvSSs003758; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:05:33 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt350.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703538131215176683; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 06:04:43 -0700 Message-ID: <486E1FE9.30808@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 09:04:41 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oliver Block Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY References: <200807060003.03834.lists@block-online.eu> In-Reply-To: <200807060003.03834.lists@block-online.eu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Hi Oliver, This is issue 67. http://www.ofcourseimright.com/cgi-bin/roundup/calsify/issue67 Resolution is to disallow DURATION in VFREEBUSY components. Check logs starting at [12:59:07]: http://jabber.ietf.org/logs/calsify/2008-03-11.txt Or the minutes of IETF71: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/08mar/minutes/calsify.txt > Consensus on issue 67 is to go with option a): Remove statement from RFC2445bis. Cheers, Bernard Oliver Block wrote: > Am Freitag, 4. Juli 2008 00:23:28 schrieben Sie: >> I believe DTSTART and DTEND specify the endpoints of the "specified window >> of time" and DURATION the amount of time requested, in a free time request. >> >> In English "I need to find an hour of your free time sometime between 11:00 >> on 07/03/20008 and 17:00 on 07/11/2008". > > That's a good point. > > Best Regards, > > Oliver Block > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 4 06:07:48 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A23413A6B82 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gtTcxGJgS8kM for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC3D43A6B2C for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD46880C9F; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F9D780C50 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46D1114220D for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iQQ+K1+pj2KV for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com (rgminet01.oracle.com [148.87.113.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D58AC14220E for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m64D7ZKA011959; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:07:36 -0600 Received: from acsmt351.oracle.com (acsmt351.oracle.com [141.146.40.151]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m64CV2Df029192; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:07:35 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt350.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703538481215176811; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 06:06:51 -0700 Message-ID: <486E206A.30507@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 09:06:50 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oliver Block Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Duration Value Type References: <486D46F2.80102@block-online.eu> In-Reply-To: <486D46F2.80102@block-online.eu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Oliver Block wrote: > Hello everybody, > > I'd like to draw your attention to the following text: > > When computing an exact duration, the greatest order time > components MUST be added first, that is, the number of weeks MUST > be added first, followed by the number of days, number of hours, > number of minutes, and number of seconds. > > The syntax is defined as follows: > > dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" (dur-date / dur-time / dur-week) > > dur-date = dur-day [dur-time] > dur-time = "T" (dur-hour / dur-minute / dur-second) > dur-week = 1*DIGIT "W" > dur-hour = 1*DIGIT "H" [dur-minute] > dur-minute = 1*DIGIT "M" [dur-second] > dur-second = 1*DIGIT "S" > dur-day = 1*DIGIT "D" > > As far as I've understood the meaning of RFC2445 (not the latest draft) > and also of the syntax above, the use of week excludes the use of > dur-date and also of dur-time. (I don't know if there is a need of a > mixed form of in real life time planning.) So if you want to allow > dur-week AND dur-date/dur-time within the same value, you need to change > the ABNF to, for example > > dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" [dur-week] (dur-date / dur-time) > > or for example > > dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" (dur-date / dur-time / dur-week) > ... > dur-week = 1*DIGIT "W" [dur-date] > ... > > If not, you need to change the text: > > When computing an exact duration, the greatest order time > components MUST be added first, that is, the number of days MUST > be added first, followed number of hours, number of minutes, and > number > of seconds. +1 Good catch. Thanks, Bernard > > Additionally there could be added an explicit statement if weeks and > day/time are both to be used in a Duration value. > > > Do you agree? > > > Best Regards, > > Oliver Block > > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 4 06:52:44 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60CEA3A6AB9 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jOu6JmuY0iap for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 640253A6888 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E99C80C9F; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E789B7F635; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEBC8142219; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id j1syP+3coNFq; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com (rgminet01.oracle.com [148.87.113.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D0A314221D; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m64DqMDa032551; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:52:23 -0600 Received: from acsmt350.oracle.com (acsmt350.oracle.com [141.146.40.150]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m641cgU0004575; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:52:22 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt351.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703555821215179541; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 06:52:21 -0700 Message-ID: <486E2B13.2090009@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 09:52:19 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eliot Lear References: <1F85ABB9-62D3-4AB6-8F1D-D3B4507806A8@osafoundation.org> <1213599798.9973.124.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <1213610174.9973.136.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <8838196F-017B-4780-B182-CFF3E37FFCDF@osafoundation.org> <1214218197.9973.325.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <48664825.3010907@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <48664825.3010907@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #1: Use of ALTREP X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org I don't believe the current proposal is appropriate. As it stands, the draft (RFC2445 as well) makes it clear that ALTREP is only allowed on 6 specific text properties, that is, COMMENT, DESCRIPTION, LOCATION, RESOURCES, SUMMARY, and CONTACT. I also believe the meaning of ALTREP is already properly defined. In practice though, I'm not sure there is a single calendar user agent that exposes it (i.e., allow an end user to set its value, or make use of it). Finally, the following search on the web will only report two iCalendar objects that makes use of ALTREP! http://www.google.com/search?q=ALTREP+filetype%3Aics In the past we've discussed limiting the URI schemes allowed for CAL-ADDRESS but never got around to it. Perhaps we should limit the URI schemed allowed both for ALTREP and CAL-ADDRESS (two sets) while we're at it. On the other hand, when applications while actually start making use of ALTREP, I suspect the media type of the resource being pointed at might be the real interop issue (e.g., http URL pointing to an XHTML, HTML, PDF, PNG, or JPG document). Cheers, Bernard Eliot Lear wrote: > Am I correct in that this issue is to be resolved as below? Are there > any objections? > > Eliot > > Lisa Dusseault wrote: >> >> On Jun 23, 2008, at 3:49 AM, Aki Niemi wrote: >> >>> May I suggest an alternative approach? Since the list of "known" uses of >>> ALTREP can actually be narrowed down to about three, I think we should >>> add to the definition of each of these properties exactly what it means >>> to receive one with the ALTREP parameter that contains an HTTP URL. >>> Other URIs permitted, but their meaning is undefined. In other words, >>> document current practice as much as we can, but keep further uses open. >>> >>> And then to ALTREP parameter, add the description you propose, as >>> generic advice to how the parameter should be handled/used. >> >> +1 >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> > > _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 4 07:04:39 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 045233A69A4 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4PsS6WS8uW7G for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42CFE3A68FA for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BC42880CD7; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB1F080C9F; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A24F014221D; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3l+uSkL-5xKM; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agminet01.oracle.com (agminet01.oracle.com [141.146.126.228]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C1A5142219; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by agminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id m64E4S92028391; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 09:04:28 -0500 Received: from acsmt351.oracle.com (acsmt351.oracle.com [141.146.40.151]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m64A15Ph002424; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:04:28 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt351.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703558401215180150; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 07:02:30 -0700 Message-ID: <486E2D74.8060605@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 10:02:28 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Cyrus Daboo References: <1F85ABB9-62D3-4AB6-8F1D-D3B4507806A8@osafoundation.org> <1213599798.9973.124.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <1213610352.9973.140.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <51FFA90ACFC532EAE4DC9862@caldav.corp.apple.com> In-Reply-To: <51FFA90ACFC532EAE4DC9862@caldav.corp.apple.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #2: DIR parameter X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Cyrus Daboo wrote: > Hi Aki, > > --On June 16, 2008 12:59:12 PM +0300 Aki Niemi wrote: > >>> > Section 3.2.6, DIR parameter: This should be limited to LDAP URLs >>> > only, if not by requirement then at least by noting that other types >>> > of URLs are likely to be harmful to interoperability. >> >> For maximum interoperability, a mandatory-to-implement choice should be >> defined. However, is LDAP even widely enough supported in iCalendar >> implementations to justify this? I suspect vCardDAV URLs could in the >> future start appearing here as well. > > I think at the very least HTTP/HTTPS needs to be allowed as well. > cid and mid would be needed in the context of iMIP. Here's a proposal for the mandatory-to-implement: cid data (e.g., to embed vCard directly?) file ftp http https ldap mid Cheers, Bernard _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 4 07:47:36 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4DAD93A6B00 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id l1hOd9mzvqqq for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64B2D3A6866 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20E9180CFF; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D681B80C9F; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACD5614221D; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aNsb0YGXPup5; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com (rgminet01.oracle.com [148.87.113.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 328171421FD; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw2.us.oracle.com (agmgw2.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.213]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m64ElOEO005231; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:47:24 -0600 Received: from acsmt351.oracle.com (acsmt351.oracle.com [141.146.40.151]) by agmgw2.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m63J5KlS008351; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:47:24 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt350.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703583571215182794; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 07:46:34 -0700 Message-ID: <486E37C9.4090005@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 10:46:33 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Aki Niemi Subject: Re: AD review issue #3: Meaning of RELTYPE parameter value of SIBLING (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on 2445bis) References: <1F85ABB9-62D3-4AB6-8F1D-D3B4507806A8@osafoundation.org> <1213599798.9973.124.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <1213610775.9973.151.camel@little.research.nokia.com> In-Reply-To: <1213610775.9973.151.camel@little.research.nokia.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org While I was about to propose that we deprecate SIBLING I found cases where it might be handy in the future... 1- Group multiple to-dos that don't have a parent to-do. Not a very important use cases I think... 2- When breaking an unbounded recurring events in two events (i.e., the truncated unbounded recurring events for past recurrence instances, and a new unbounded recurring event for the "new" future recurrence instances), it might be useful to link the events together with this relationship. Cheers, Bernard Aki Niemi wrote: > ma, 2008-06-16 kello 10:03 +0300, ext Aki Niemi kirjoitti: >>> Section 3.2.15: RELTYPE. What does it mean that a calendar component >>> referenced is the SIBLING of this one? How is a user agent supposed >>> to use this information? Is this parameter ever used except on >>> RELATED-TO? Is it actually in use even there? Health warnings at >>> least. > > Good question. Is there a use case that requires a relationship beyond > parent-child (which currently is the only *defined* relationship in the > document anyway)? > > Cheers, > Aki > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 4 08:08:20 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D1093A6A16 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VZGpu+INjT9U for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D18C3A69F9 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:19 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B7AD80CFF; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 838317F5E3 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B57A14221D for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RsBrXZDjxFgH for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com (rgminet01.oracle.com [148.87.113.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2DE7142215 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m64F7jUc028665; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 09:07:45 -0600 Received: from acsmt350.oracle.com (acsmt350.oracle.com [141.146.40.150]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m642vZX0005809; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 09:07:45 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt350.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703666801215183950; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 08:05:50 -0700 Message-ID: <486E3C4C.3070404@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 11:05:48 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eliot Lear Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) References: <20080617164740.C7897142202@laweleka.osafoundation.org> <48664868.1040307@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <48664868.1040307@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org It's not clear to me what Lisa is suggesting actually. a) Warning about the fact that components type can be mixed? b) Not to ignore unsupported component types silently? Proposed text would be great! Things that should be noted: 1- iTIP does not allow different component types to be mixed. 2- CalDAV provides means to get only the components types that you want. As such, in practice we will only see mixed component types in export scenarios and Internet calendars (aka, webcal). Cheers, Bernard Eliot Lear wrote: > I believe we have consensus as to Lisa's suggestion. Any disagreement? > > Eliot > > Tim Hare wrote: >> As an "informed user" - i.e. not a developer, I definitely support >> NON-silent rejection. I can agree with non-support of certain components >> only if I receive some notification; due to work requirements I am now >> journalling my time on some projects, and it would be good to know if I >> can't import that data into another tool. >> >> >> Tim Hare >> Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org >> [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Cyrus Daboo >> Sent: Monday, June 16, 2008 12:33 PM >> To: Lisa Dusseault >> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org; Bernard Desruisseaux >> Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in >> thesame >> iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) >> >> Hi Lisa, >> >> --On June 16, 2008 9:25:14 AM -0700 Lisa >> Dusseault >> wrote: >> >> >>>> The suggestion of an implementation note that describes the "common >>>> use" of the components and explains that some may be supported and >>>> others not is fine. In fact telling implementors that they need to be >>>> prepared for another system to reject a component would be good. >>>> >>> I can get behind that. I'd also like to recommend that systems not >>> reject a component silently -- a user needs to know if they imported a >>> iCalendar file and lost 50 VJOURNAL components in the process. >>> >> >> Agreed. >> >> Note that iTIP does have a status code for "Unsupported Component" >> (3.13) - >> so informing the originator of the iCalendar data that they are sending >> something that is not supported by the recipient is covered by that. >> >> -- >> Cyrus Daboo >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 4 13:17:32 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C06223A6911 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w+cH21An8jiT for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABB4F3A68D5 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D726380CD4; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05A8580B5E for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D083814222A for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hROWCjJs9zpj for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.32]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97276142229 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA12.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.44]) by QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ltao1Z05y0xGWP8530CF00; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 20:17:20 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA12.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id lwHE1Z00B1RyUCv3YwHLKq; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 20:17:20 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=hX2h3j9qUEwA:10 a=n7_MfodNLFUA:10 a=PFsjAnyDAAAA:8 a=bibtB-wvEzaBVA88f0cA:9 a=o6I5eGVYNT1dALLB1A0A:7 a=B-q0h8oJBkOtrTpSa1OqXft2kwYA:4 a=7DSvI1NPTFQA:10 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=gi0PWCVxevcA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Bernard Desruisseaux'" , "'Eliot Lear'" Subject: RE: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 16:17:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: Acjd58c+MVJORahHQjmrd9Uil6E3IQAKvCNQ X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 In-Reply-To: <486E3C4C.3070404@oracle.com> Message-Id: <20080704201721.97276142229@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org I can't speak for Lisa, but the export/import scenario is one place where b) applies. If by "Internet calendar" you mean an .ics file that is opened via browser, that is also an 'import' scenario I think. Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: Bernard Desruisseaux [mailto:bernard.desruisseaux@oracle.com] Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 11:06 AM To: Eliot Lear Cc: Tim Hare; ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) It's not clear to me what Lisa is suggesting actually. a) Warning about the fact that components type can be mixed? b) Not to ignore unsupported component types silently? Proposed text would be great! Things that should be noted: 1- iTIP does not allow different component types to be mixed. 2- CalDAV provides means to get only the components types that you want. As such, in practice we will only see mixed component types in export scenarios and Internet calendars (aka, webcal). Cheers, Bernard Eliot Lear wrote: > I believe we have consensus as to Lisa's suggestion. Any disagreement? > > Eliot > > Tim Hare wrote: >> As an "informed user" - i.e. not a developer, I definitely support >> NON-silent rejection. I can agree with non-support of certain >> components only if I receive some notification; due to work >> requirements I am now journalling my time on some projects, and it >> would be good to know if I can't import that data into another tool. >> >> >> Tim Hare >> Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org >> [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Cyrus >> Daboo >> Sent: Monday, June 16, 2008 12:33 PM >> To: Lisa Dusseault >> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org; Bernard Desruisseaux >> Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in >> thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review >> on2445bis) >> >> Hi Lisa, >> >> --On June 16, 2008 9:25:14 AM -0700 Lisa >> Dusseault >> wrote: >> >> >>>> The suggestion of an implementation note that describes the "common >>>> use" of the components and explains that some may be supported and >>>> others not is fine. In fact telling implementors that they need to >>>> be prepared for another system to reject a component would be good. >>>> >>> I can get behind that. I'd also like to recommend that systems not >>> reject a component silently -- a user needs to know if they imported >>> a iCalendar file and lost 50 VJOURNAL components in the process. >>> >> >> Agreed. >> >> Note that iTIP does have a status code for "Unsupported Component" >> (3.13) - >> so informing the originator of the iCalendar data that they are >> sending something that is not supported by the recipient is covered by that. >> >> -- >> Cyrus Daboo >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Sat Jul 5 18:51:29 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECD143A680C for ; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.739 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.739 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.74, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HqqkFgsLOP+U for ; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5FD93A67D1 for ; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F80980CDB; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 846D780C3F; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 558C9142234; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id j+DM8xMMfIMm; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from capricorn.notesdev.ibm.com (capricorn.notesdev.ibm.com [205.159.212.202]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50E9414222A; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:10 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <486E2B13.2090009@oracle.com> To: Bernard Desruisseaux Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #1: Use of ALTREP Message-ID: Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2008 21:51:07 -0400 From: "Robert Ransdell" References: <1F85ABB9-62D3-4AB6-8F1D-D3B4507806A8@osafoundation.org><1213599798.9973.124.camel@little.research.nokia.com><1213610174.9973.136.camel@little.research.nokia.com><8838196F-017B-4780-B182-CFF3E37FFCDF@osafoundation.org><1214218197.9973.325.camel@little.research.nokia.com><48664825.3010907@cisco.com> <486E2B13.2090009@oracle.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-KeepSent: 2224BB28:86E023DA-8525747E:000A1EFF; name=$KeepSent; type=4 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Build V85_06262008NP June 26, 2008 X-Disclaimed: 22215 Cc: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" , ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0244772654==" Mime-version: 1.0 Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org --===============0244772654== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 000A2C528525747E_=" --=_alternative 000A2C528525747E_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Notes uses it on Description and Comment. From: Bernard Desruisseaux To: Eliot Lear Cc: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" Date: 07/04/2008 09:56 AM Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #1: Use of ALTREP Sent by: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org I don't believe the current proposal is appropriate. As it stands, the draft (RFC2445 as well) makes it clear that ALTREP is=20 only allowed on 6 specific text properties, that is, COMMENT,=20 DESCRIPTION, LOCATION, RESOURCES, SUMMARY, and CONTACT. I also believe=20 the meaning of ALTREP is already properly defined. In practice though, I'm not sure there is a single calendar user agent=20 that exposes it (i.e., allow an end user to set its value, or make use=20 of it). Finally, the following search on the web will only report two iCalendar=20 objects that makes use of ALTREP! http://www.google.com/search?q=3DALTREP+filetype%3Aics In the past we've discussed limiting the URI schemes allowed for=20 CAL-ADDRESS but never got around to it. Perhaps we should limit the URI=20 schemed allowed both for ALTREP and CAL-ADDRESS (two sets) while we're=20 at it. On the other hand, when applications while actually start making use of=20 ALTREP, I suspect the media type of the resource being pointed at might=20 be the real interop issue (e.g., http URL pointing to an XHTML, HTML,=20 PDF, PNG, or JPG document). Cheers, Bernard Eliot Lear wrote: > Am I correct in that this issue is to be resolved as below? Are there=20 > any objections? >=20 > Eliot >=20 > Lisa Dusseault wrote: >> >> On Jun 23, 2008, at 3:49 AM, Aki Niemi wrote: >> >>> May I suggest an alternative approach? Since the list of "known" uses=20 of >>> ALTREP can actually be narrowed down to about three, I think we should >>> add to the definition of each of these properties exactly what it=20 means >>> to receive one with the ALTREP parameter that contains an HTTP URL. >>> Other URIs permitted, but their meaning is undefined. In other words, >>> document current practice as much as we can, but keep further uses=20 open. >>> >>> And then to ALTREP parameter, add the description you propose, as >>> generic advice to how the parameter should be handled/used. >> >> +1 >> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >=20 >=20 =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify --=_alternative 000A2C528525747E_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Notes uses it on Description and Com= ment.


From:Bernard Desruisseaux <bernard.desruisseaux@oracle.com&g= t;
To:Eliot Lear <lear@= cisco.com>
Cc:"iet= f-calsify@osafoundation.org" <ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org>
Date:07/04/2008 09:56 AM
Subject:[Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #1: Use of ALTREP
Sent by:ietf= -calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org



I don't believe the current proposal is appropriate.
As it stands, the draft (RFC2445 as well) makes it clear that ALTREP = is
only allowed on 6 specific text properties, that is, COMMENT,
DESCR= IPTION, LOCATION, RESOURCES, SUMMARY, and CONTACT. I also believe
the meaning of ALTREP is already properly defined.

In practice t= hough, I'm not sure there is a single calendar user agent
that exposes it (i.e., allow an end user to set its value, or make use
of it).

Finally, the following search on the web will only repor= t two iCalendar
objects that makes use of ALTREP!

http://= www.google.com/search?q=3DALTREP+filetype%3Aics

In the past we've discussed limiting the URI schemes allowed= for
CAL-ADDRESS but never got around to it.  Perhaps we should li= mit the URI
schemed allowed both for ALTREP and CAL-ADDRESS (two sets) while we= 're
at it.

On the other hand, when applications while actually start= making use of
ALTREP, I suspect the media type of the resource being pointed at might
be the real interop issue (e.g., http URL pointing to an XHTML, HTML, <= br>PDF, PNG, or JPG document).

Cheers,
Bernard

Eliot Lear = wrote:
> Am I correct in that this issue is to be resolved as below? =  Are there
> any objections?
>
> Eliot
>
> Lisa= Dusseault wrote:
>>
>> On Jun 23, 2008, at 3:49 AM, Aki = Niemi wrote:
>>
>>> May I suggest an alternative appro= ach? Since the list of "known" uses of
>>> ALTREP can actually be narrowed down to about three= , I think we should
>>> add to the definition of each of these properties= exactly what it means
>>> to receive one with the ALTREP parameter that= contains an HTTP URL.
>>> Other URIs permitted, but their meaning is undefi= ned. In other words,
>>> document current practice as much as we can, but kee= p further uses open.
>>>
>>> And then to ALTREP parameter, ad= d the description you propose, as
>>> generic advice to how the parameter should be handled/us= ed.
>>
>> +1
>> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
>> Ietf-calsify mailing list<= br>>> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org
>> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify
>>
>
>

=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
Ietf-calsif= y mailing list
Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org
http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify



--=_alternative 000A2C528525747E_=-- --===============0244772654== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify --===============0244772654==-- From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Tue Jul 8 13:43:45 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4821528C33F for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sTVRvuonJ1Xu for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D801928C31B for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FB8E7F5F8; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C15097F521 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8574C142213 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id i-mchKmC6rfN for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from daboo.name (daboo.name [151.201.22.177]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 663B5142206 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B0779FAE27 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:43:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at daboo.name Received: from daboo.name ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (chewy.mulberrymail.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7M5klF-LKV3c for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:43:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from caldav.corp.apple.com (unknown [17.101.32.44]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50B4A9FAE20 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:43:39 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 16:43:36 -0400 From: Cyrus Daboo To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Message-ID: <53E80F1BDC08A6A8150ACD31@caldav.corp.apple.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.1.0a1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Hi, (Whilst I realize it is too late for changes to 2445bis now, I think it is still worth raising issues and using the issue tracker to log problems that could be considered in a future revision - assuming Eliot does not mind leaving the tracker up). Currently both 2445 and 2445bis make it impossible to have an empty VCALENDAR object. i.e. a VCALENDAR with only properties - no components. The relevant ABNF is: icalbody = calprops component component = 1*(eventc / todoc / journalc / freebusyc / timezonec / iana-comp / x-comp) The workaround is to send a single VTIMEZONE object or a bogus X- component (perhaps BEGIN:X-2445-IS-SILLY), or a bogus "regular" component. But that seems a little silly. It should be perfectly possible for me to publish an empty calendar. Proposal: relax the restriction that a VCALENDAR object has to contain "one or more" components, to instead allow "zero or more" components, and adjust ABNF and text accordingly. -- Cyrus Daboo _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Tue Jul 8 13:53:46 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5252E3A6ABC for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PpSYpiOGo2eF for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08EA23A6A9E for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4B3580D1D; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB66380D0B for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF22C142229 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iOLGFwOTUIG3 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.32]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EC2014220D for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.36]) by QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nTrK1Z0050mv7h0530Mf00; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:53:39 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nYtb1Z00P1RyUCv3XYtfN2; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:53:39 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=0Y9A2aHLgzwA:10 a=X2-tQCzuBIsA:10 a=PFsjAnyDAAAA:8 a=QJY9Lxbybx8-UOSKxacA:9 a=2VPKdt_jg0sRVu2WlPcA:7 a=CtKDECqvmDauBHL5p0Tpwzg2nEUA:4 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=hpF-ijbX5cwA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Cyrus Daboo'" , Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:53:42 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcjhO1lxICR8mJ11Tdy16pOFyEluYAAAMZqA In-Reply-To: <53E80F1BDC08A6A8150ACD31@caldav.corp.apple.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Message-Id: <20080708205340.8EC2014220D@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org What's the use case for publishing an empty calendar? Why would I want to open that file, assuming I found it using some sort of calendar search? If this _were_ allowed in some future revision, then I would vote that a UA MUST warn that the file is empty when opened. No one wants to open an .ics file (say for example the schedule for the Irish National Hurling Championships) to add something to their calendar, get nothing added, and not be informed. It's already sometimes onerous when a UA opens a calendar file _with_ data but doesn't position you to, or tell you about, the first item added - you then end up hunting through calendar entries to make sure what you thought would happened did in fact happen. Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Cyrus Daboo Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 4:44 PM To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Hi, (Whilst I realize it is too late for changes to 2445bis now, I think it is still worth raising issues and using the issue tracker to log problems that could be considered in a future revision - assuming Eliot does not mind leaving the tracker up). Currently both 2445 and 2445bis make it impossible to have an empty VCALENDAR object. i.e. a VCALENDAR with only properties - no components. The relevant ABNF is: icalbody = calprops component component = 1*(eventc / todoc / journalc / freebusyc / timezonec / iana-comp / x-comp) The workaround is to send a single VTIMEZONE object or a bogus X- component (perhaps BEGIN:X-2445-IS-SILLY), or a bogus "regular" component. But that seems a little silly. It should be perfectly possible for me to publish an empty calendar. Proposal: relax the restriction that a VCALENDAR object has to contain "one or more" components, to instead allow "zero or more" components, and adjust ABNF and text accordingly. -- Cyrus Daboo _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Tue Jul 8 14:04:56 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEC1A28C343 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:04:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.500, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JPMGwO+rXznH for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:04:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 059C028C350 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:04:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D104080D2A; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:05:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3A3C80C39 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:05:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68539142219 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:05:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2SnVFLLCLnLY for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from daboo.name (daboo.name [151.201.22.177]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C623142212 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 334519FB096; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:04:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at daboo.name Received: from daboo.name ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (chewy.mulberrymail.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kt7xIgmsA0-Z; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:04:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from caldav.corp.apple.com (unknown [17.101.32.44]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22AFD9FB07E; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:04:53 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:04:51 -0400 From: Cyrus Daboo To: Tim Hare , ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20080708205344.7061C9FAEF7@daboo.name> References: <20080708205344.7061C9FAEF7@daboo.name> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.1.0a1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Hi Tim, --On July 8, 2008 4:53:42 PM -0400 Tim Hare wrote: > What's the use case for publishing an empty calendar? > > Why would I want to open that file, assuming I found it using some sort of > calendar search? I create a new calendar on my web calendar system that exposes the calendar data as an .ics file (e.g. webcal://). I can send out the subscription URL before events are added (perhaps I am not the one who will add events, I might be the system admin and only tasked with creating calendars for other people who will author them). You want that file because at some point it will have events in it and your client will poll and pick those up. -- Cyrus Daboo _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Tue Jul 8 14:10:22 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B68F93A689F for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6SNqbX-ZQwHo for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB0323A683A for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E085E80CBF; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A1CA80C39 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2BBD142219 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EJ+sZw11kz3F for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.mdlink.net (medusa.mdlink.de [213.211.192.34]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 075D9142213 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.mdlink.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 310821006969; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:10:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ip-77-25-199-136.web.vodafone.de (ip-77-25-199-136.web.vodafone.de [77.25.199.136]) by mail.mdlink.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 482481049F73; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:10:02 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <1C292337-6F81-4D11-BACC-83F0A7DE47F0@opengroupware.org> From: Helge Hess To: "Tim Hare" In-Reply-To: <20080708205340.8EC2014220D@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:09:54 +0200 References: <20080708205340.8EC2014220D@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org +1, makes sense to me. On 08.07.2008, at 22:53, Tim Hare wrote: > What's the use case for publishing an empty calendar? > > Why would I want to open that file, assuming I found it using some > sort of > calendar search? You do not 'open' the 'file', you subscribe it. While it may not contain events now, it might contain some in the future. Using the transport layer for this (eg HTTP 404) is not that good. The calendar actually exists and is valid, its just empty at a specific point in time. The only other option might be to return an empty resource (content- length: 0). But then the calendar component itself might have interesting meta data. Thanks, Helge PS: I'm pretty sure that most iCal tools already work that way ... -- Helge Hess http://helgehess.eu/ _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Tue Jul 8 14:20:25 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9ED23A69F4 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id n512lTYf4beA for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF31C3A689C for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FCC180D01; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9D4280CEB for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DE65142213 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6BnhO3E9X7wW for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.17]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F34541421F2 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.60]) by QMTA10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nXhw1Z0061HzFnQ5AZJbn7; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:19:45 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nZJ41Z00H1RyUCv3aZJ9ga; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:18:09 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=0Y9A2aHLgzwA:10 a=X2-tQCzuBIsA:10 a=_etfLLVQAAAA:8 a=VgLCfYgw6jAQlL-LViEA:9 a=OQ32bPS6Xy2x9NBEqgMA:7 a=OCX1Ot8wKnVyeLUU4AdVYgkfPygA:4 a=srGwhsmx-V4A:10 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=7OmpBygbiDMA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Helge Hess'" Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:18:09 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcjhPwcycwXDm4/NT6u97mhQKH/9qQAALmDA In-Reply-To: <1C292337-6F81-4D11-BACC-83F0A7DE47F0@opengroupware.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Message-Id: <20080708212002.F34541421F2@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org OK I understand the use case now; so my only statement will be that any UA which processes the file (please note, you do not have to subscribe to it, it's perfectly OK to reference an .ics file via an anchor tag and href attribute, with a file association which causes it to be opened by a particular desktop program) MUST warn that it is empty. Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: Helge Hess [mailto:helge.hess@opengroupware.org] Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 5:10 PM To: Tim Hare Cc: 'Cyrus Daboo'; ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? +1, makes sense to me. On 08.07.2008, at 22:53, Tim Hare wrote: > What's the use case for publishing an empty calendar? > > Why would I want to open that file, assuming I found it using some > sort of calendar search? You do not 'open' the 'file', you subscribe it. While it may not contain events now, it might contain some in the future. Using the transport layer for this (eg HTTP 404) is not that good. The calendar actually exists and is valid, its just empty at a specific point in time. The only other option might be to return an empty resource (content- length: 0). But then the calendar component itself might have interesting meta data. Thanks, Helge PS: I'm pretty sure that most iCal tools already work that way ... -- Helge Hess http://helgehess.eu/ _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Tue Jul 8 14:57:23 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 057B33A683A for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.639 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.639 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WPVUYSHYqMTj for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F0173A677E for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D8BD80D01; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0F1D7F517 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94AA914222A for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id f1HQItjBjhJa for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server.kainhofer.com (server.kainhofer.com [88.198.35.52]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EE5914220C for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.108.59.26] (vie-nas-ge-0-2.onenet.at [194.24.158.8]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by server.kainhofer.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0714A6EF03; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:57:14 +0200 (CEST) From: Reinhold Kainhofer Organization: Vienna University of Technology To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:57:10 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.9 References: <20080708212002.F34541421F2@laweleka.osafoundation.org> In-Reply-To: <20080708212002.F34541421F2@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200807082357.13644.reinhold@kainhofer.com> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Am Dienstag, 8. Juli 2008 schrieb Tim Hare: > OK I understand the use case now; so my only statement will be that any UA > which processes the file (please note, you do not have to subscribe to it, > it's perfectly OK to reference an .ics file via an anchor tag and href > attribute, with a file association which causes it to be opened by a > particular desktop program) MUST warn that it is empty. I don't think that should really be a MUST. If I add a remote calendar file (i.e. a URL that will be regularly polled) to my personal organizer, I simply want its events to be displayed in my UA. I don't want to be bothered with "WARNING: The calendar blahblah does not contain any events!" messages whenever the application polls the calendar. Of course, there are situations where a warning makes sense, but in other situations it is simply annoying to the user. Cheers, Reinhold - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ Reinhold Kainhofer, Vienna University of Technology, Austria email: reinhold@kainhofer.com, http://reinhold.kainhofer.com/ * Financial and Actuarial Mathematics, TU Wien, http://www.fam.tuwien.ac.at/ * K Desktop Environment, http://www.kde.org, KOrganizer maintainer * Chorvereinigung "Jung-Wien", http://www.jung-wien.at/ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIc+K5TqjEwhXvPN0RAhFTAKDZaVjsizUUSKKoklxUIb7KuHOubwCgoooA u0LAc/Z9pbOhNnBffRrsxNo= =epvS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Tue Jul 8 18:12:46 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E7623A683A for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 69tyLJwdLIng for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D98F3A6782 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F49C7F4F3; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A7777F489 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0BBC142212 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lAo2wotvBjLW for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.80]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F39314220C for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA04.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.35]) by QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nQWh1Z0050ldTLk580eu00; Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:12:39 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA04.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ndCX1Z00L1RyUCv3QdCczf; Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:12:37 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=0Y9A2aHLgzwA:10 a=X2-tQCzuBIsA:10 a=JzSQ9ok7AAAA:8 a=z_zqISx-AAAA:8 a=3fyaaF4VAAAA:8 a=CXA1BpdiAAAA:8 a=vHVVa43aqSLxgFDiwRkA:9 a=_bcyJkHOxvVe3qmZ5fsA:7 a=GmuumkUBBkV2tcKdA_td8-JrG0oA:4 a=gv0Kfs84wR0A:10 a=4y0hEzCCwVwA:10 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=hpF-ijbX5cwA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Reinhold Kainhofer'" , Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 21:12:36 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcjhRZik5HeA1CNeRO++3gVo/ULb2AAGm+UA In-Reply-To: <200807082357.13644.reinhold@kainhofer.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Message-Id: <20080709011240.7F39314220C@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org When you're discussing polling, you're in the realm of Atom or RSS and subscriptions, where eliminating the error message is "natural" - my RSS reader doesn't tell me when the feed has not been updated. If, however we allow VCALENDARs to be empty, a UA which imports a calendar through mechanisms other than a subscription definitely needs to warn the user. I'll have to think more deeply on this; perhaps there needs to be an iTIP- / iMIP- document to describe behaviors when iCalendar objects are consumed in ways other than mail, CalDAV, or subscriptions? Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: Reinhold Kainhofer [mailto:reinhold@kainhofer.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 5:57 PM To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Cc: Tim Hare; 'Helge Hess' Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Am Dienstag, 8. Juli 2008 schrieb Tim Hare: > OK I understand the use case now; so my only statement will be that > any UA which processes the file (please note, you do not have to > subscribe to it, it's perfectly OK to reference an .ics file via an > anchor tag and href attribute, with a file association which causes it > to be opened by a particular desktop program) MUST warn that it is empty. I don't think that should really be a MUST. If I add a remote calendar file (i.e. a URL that will be regularly polled) to my personal organizer, I simply want its events to be displayed in my UA. I don't want to be bothered with "WARNING: The calendar blahblah does not contain any events!" messages whenever the application polls the calendar. Of course, there are situations where a warning makes sense, but in other situations it is simply annoying to the user. Cheers, Reinhold - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ Reinhold Kainhofer, Vienna University of Technology, Austria email: reinhold@kainhofer.com, http://reinhold.kainhofer.com/ * Financial and Actuarial Mathematics, TU Wien, http://www.fam.tuwien.ac.at/ * K Desktop Environment, http://www.kde.org, KOrganizer maintainer * Chorvereinigung "Jung-Wien", http://www.jung-wien.at/ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIc+K5TqjEwhXvPN0RAhFTAKDZaVjsizUUSKKoklxUIb7KuHOubwCgoooA u0LAc/Z9pbOhNnBffRrsxNo= =epvS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Fri Jul 11 02:58:40 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA5DA3A6ABC for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WTLgfYTWsd8i for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02A0F3A6947 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E376680D70; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2370480D6F for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE2AE142247 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5aZehLCJofpU for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from carancho.yaco.es (38.Red-80-36-82.staticIP.rima-tde.net [80.36.82.38]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21B7614223D for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by carancho.yaco.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 155C99E580C for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:58:49 +0200 (CEST) Received: from carancho.yaco.es ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (carancho.yaco.es [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14411-01-8 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:58:48 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [192.168.11.240] (phoebe.yaco.es [192.168.11.240]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by carancho.yaco.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5C6B9E57FC for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:58:48 +0200 (CEST) From: Ernesto Revilla To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Organization: Yaco Sistemas SL Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:58:35 +0200 Message-Id: <1215770315.7298.21.camel@ganso> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.12.1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new-20030616-p10 (Debian) at yaco.es Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Question about etag support for freebusy report X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Hi. Strong Etags must be supported by CS, as by RFC 4791. Any report method, like freebusy reports, normally do not provide etags. ¿Correct? Thanx. Erny Yaco Sistemas Spain _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Sat Jul 12 15:42:48 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7B693A68F3 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:42:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NXSj7dxNqRnj for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:42:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56E243A6884 for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:42:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E22A80D05; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:43:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 377A080BAB for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:43:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D771014223E for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:43:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AWvZAc3bWbBP for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:42:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.mdlink.net (medusa.mdlink.de [213.211.192.34]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AEAA14221E for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:42:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.mdlink.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50C4A105AD91 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2008 00:42:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ip-77-24-38-212.web.vodafone.de (ip-77-24-38-212.web.vodafone.de [77.24.38.212]) by mail.mdlink.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D49F2105AD62 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2008 00:42:41 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: From: Helge Hess To: IETF-iCalendar In-Reply-To: <1215770315.7298.21.camel@ganso> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Question about etag support for freebusy report Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 00:42:41 +0200 References: <1215770315.7298.21.camel@ganso> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org On 11.07.2008, at 11:58, Ernesto Revilla wrote: > Strong Etags must be supported by CS, as by RFC 4791. > > Any report method, like freebusy reports, normally do not provide =20 > etags. > > =BFCorrect? Yes. Greets, Helge --=20 Helge Hess http://helgehess.eu/= _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Mon Jul 14 11:15:18 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EFC0128C263 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.251 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.251 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.348, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jzwNchmNXj0j for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16A2128C237 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0595580D8F; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 509C980D89 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E600D14223C for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JnTsXtN-6MHC for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.ietf.org (mail.ietf.org [64.170.98.32]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57016142229 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 1C5F03A6A5C; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20080714181502.1C5F03A6A5C@core3.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:02 -0700 (PDT) Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] I-D Action:draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Calendaring and Scheduling Standards Simplification Working Group of the IETF. Title : iCalendar Transport-Independent Interoperability Protocol (iTIP) Author(s) : C. Daboo Filename : draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt Pages : 126 Date : 2008-07-14 This document specifies a protocol using the iCalendar object specification to provide scheduling interoperability between different calendar systems. This is done without reference to a specific transport protocol so as to allow multiple methods of communication between systems. Subsequent documents will define profiles of this protocol using specific interoperable methods of communications between systems. iTIP complements the iCalendar object specification by adding semantics for group scheduling methods commonly available in current calendar systems. These scheduling methods permit two or more calendar systems to perform transactions such as publish, schedule, reschedule, respond to scheduling requests, negotiation of changes or cancel. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-07-14110730.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify --NextPart-- From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Mon Jul 14 12:51:37 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2D87E3A6B09 for ; 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Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:51:17 +0200 Received: from xbh-ams-332.emea.cisco.com (xbh-ams-332.cisco.com [144.254.231.87]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6EJpHQn027748; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 19:51:17 GMT Received: from xfe-ams-332.cisco.com ([144.254.231.73]) by xbh-ams-332.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:51:17 +0200 Received: from adsl-247-5-fixip.tiscali.ch ([10.61.81.182]) by xfe-ams-332.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:51:16 +0200 Message-ID: <487BAE34.10702@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:51:16 +0200 From: Eliot Lear User-Agent: Thunderbird/3.0a2pre (Macintosh; 2008071203) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] I-D Action:draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt References: <20080714181502.1C5F03A6A5C@core3.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <20080714181502.1C5F03A6A5C@core3.amsl.com> X-OriginalArrivalTime: 14 Jul 2008 19:51:16.0781 (UTC) FILETIME=[FA7F3DD0:01C8E5EA] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=5057; t=1216065077; x=1216929077; c=relaxed/simple; s=amsdkim2001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=lear@cisco.com; z=From:=20Eliot=20Lear=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20[Ietf-calsify]=20I-D=20Action=3Adraft-i etf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt |Sender:=20; bh=u629TSEQg0UAVLAzs2/DhqIb3xHP4fUoI0fRv0VgJmI=; b=Szetp9/axq8Axv/mQvO3Z7keyMGHnLNGZLqcxdLktmh7O42cLmjjj731uV kXFfyV7dqN2l0mc4gEOKmzSnk3mQK1kuk0cCD5Q4RQ55GnUN+fEn04/WrE+0 3HFBScF1wf; Authentication-Results: ams-dkim-2; header.From=lear@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/amsdkim2001 verified; ); Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org, i-d-announce@ietf.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0188526654==" Mime-version: 1.0 Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============0188526654== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------040306060904010708060905" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------040306060904010708060905 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thank you, Cyrus, for this update that contains IANA Considerations and an updated Appendix of changes. Eliot Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Calendaring and Scheduling Standards Simplification Working Group of the IETF. > > > Title : iCalendar Transport-Independent Interoperability Protocol (iTIP) > Author(s) : C. Daboo > Filename : draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt > Pages : 126 > Date : 2008-07-14 > > This document specifies a protocol using the iCalendar object > specification to provide scheduling interoperability between > different calendar systems. This is done without reference to a > specific transport protocol so as to allow multiple methods of > communication between systems. Subsequent documents will define > profiles of this protocol using specific interoperable methods of > communications between systems. > > iTIP complements the iCalendar object specification by adding > semantics for group scheduling methods commonly available in current > calendar systems. These scheduling methods permit two or more > calendar systems to perform transactions such as publish, schedule, > reschedule, respond to scheduling requests, negotiation of changes or > cancel. > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader > implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the > Internet-Draft. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > --------------040306060904010708060905 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thank you, Cyrus, for this update that contains IANA Considerations and an updated Appendix of changes.

Eliot

Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: 
A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Calendaring and Scheduling Standards Simplification Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : iCalendar Transport-Independent Interoperability Protocol (iTIP)
	Author(s)       : C. Daboo
	Filename        : draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt
	Pages           : 126
	Date            : 2008-07-14

This document specifies a protocol using the iCalendar object
specification to provide scheduling interoperability between
different calendar systems.  This is done without reference to a
specific transport protocol so as to allow multiple methods of
communication between systems.  Subsequent documents will define
profiles of this protocol using specific interoperable methods of
communications between systems.

iTIP complements the iCalendar object specification by adding
semantics for group scheduling methods commonly available in current
calendar systems.  These scheduling methods permit two or more
calendar systems to perform transactions such as publish, schedule,
reschedule, respond to scheduling requests, negotiation of changes or
cancel.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader
implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the
Internet-Draft.
  

_______________________________________________
Ietf-calsify mailing list
Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org
http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify

--------------040306060904010708060905-- --===============0188526654== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify --===============0188526654==-- From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Mon Jul 14 15:49:11 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1C1A3A6830 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PIqSe9ap-k11 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D35A3A6943 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C590680D9B; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62E4B80D99 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03B2414222A for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id B6qDb3KhB26a; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.1.1.142] (corp.collabrx.com [157.22.41.236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 933C5142215; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:21 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: From: Lisa Dusseault To: Tim Hare In-Reply-To: <20080704201721.97276142229@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:21 -0700 References: <20080704201721.97276142229@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Yes, it's the import scenarios I had in mind. Even if it's not strictly Internet Engineering. Off the top of my head, suggested text change that can certainly be improved upon, particularly the hand-wavy "other situations": OLD: An iCalendar object MUST include the "PRODID" and "VERSION" calendar properties. In addition, it MUST include at least one calendar component. Special forms of iCalendar objects are possible to publish just busy time (i.e., only a "VFREEBUSY" calendar component) or time zone (i.e., only a "VTIMEZONE" calendar component) information. In addition, a complex iCalendar object that is used to capture a complete snapshot of the contents of a calendar is possible (e.g., composite of many different calendar components). More commonly, an iCalendar object will consist of just a single "VEVENT", "VTODO" or "VJOURNAL" calendar component. Applications MUST ignore x-comp and iana-comp they don't recognized. NEW: An iCalendar object MUST include the "PRODID" and "VERSION" calendar properties. In addition, it MUST include at least one calendar component. Applications MUST ignore x-comp and iana-comp they don't recognized. When iCalendar objects are sent out using iTIP, these usually consist of just a single "VEVENT", "VTODO" or "VJOURNAL" calendar component. The recipient is expected to support any of these. In other situtations, iCalendar objects may contain only a "VFREEBUSY" or "VTIMEZONE" calendar component. Finally, complex iCalendar objects containing several different calendar components are used to capture a complete snapshot of the contents of a calendar, task list, project file or other application construct. Applications that support importing iCalendar objects SHOULD support all of the component types defined in this document, and SHOULD NOT silently drop any components as that can lead to user data loss. Lisa On Jul 4, 2008, at 1:17 PM, Tim Hare wrote: > I can't speak for Lisa, but the export/import scenario is one place > where b) > applies. If by "Internet calendar" you mean an .ics file that is > opened via > browser, that is also an 'import' scenario I think. > > > Tim Hare > Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bernard Desruisseaux [mailto:bernard.desruisseaux@oracle.com] > Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 11:06 AM > To: Eliot Lear > Cc: Tim Hare; ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in > thesame > iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) > > It's not clear to me what Lisa is suggesting actually. > > a) Warning about the fact that components type can be mixed? > b) Not to ignore unsupported component types silently? > > Proposed text would be great! > > Things that should be noted: > > 1- iTIP does not allow different component types to be mixed. > > 2- CalDAV provides means to get only the components types that you > want. > > As such, in practice we will only see mixed component types in export > scenarios and Internet calendars (aka, webcal). > > Cheers, > Bernard > > Eliot Lear wrote: >> I believe we have consensus as to Lisa's suggestion. Any >> disagreement? >> >> Eliot >> >> Tim Hare wrote: >>> As an "informed user" - i.e. not a developer, I definitely support >>> NON-silent rejection. I can agree with non-support of certain >>> components only if I receive some notification; due to work >>> requirements I am now journalling my time on some projects, and it >>> would be good to know if I can't import that data into another tool. >>> >>> >>> Tim Hare >>> Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org >>> [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Cyrus >>> Daboo >>> Sent: Monday, June 16, 2008 12:33 PM >>> To: Lisa Dusseault >>> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org; Bernard Desruisseaux >>> Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in >>> thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review >>> on2445bis) >>> >>> Hi Lisa, >>> >>> --On June 16, 2008 9:25:14 AM -0700 Lisa >>> Dusseault >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>>>> The suggestion of an implementation note that describes the >>>>> "common >>>>> use" of the components and explains that some may be supported and >>>>> others not is fine. In fact telling implementors that they need to >>>>> be prepared for another system to reject a component would be >>>>> good. >>>>> >>>> I can get behind that. I'd also like to recommend that systems not >>>> reject a component silently -- a user needs to know if they >>>> imported >>>> a iCalendar file and lost 50 VJOURNAL components in the process. >>>> >>> >>> Agreed. >>> >>> Note that iTIP does have a status code for "Unsupported Component" >>> (3.13) - >>> so informing the originator of the iCalendar data that they are >>> sending something that is not supported by the recipient is >>> covered by > that. >>> >>> -- >>> Cyrus Daboo >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ietf-calsify mailing list >>> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >>> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ietf-calsify mailing list >>> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >>> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Mon Jul 14 15:54:45 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 069433A6B48 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:54:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -107.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-107.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.700, BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, J_CHICKENPOX_57=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZJqnChKCOrzp for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:54:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0029E3A6A40 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:54:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 41C9280DA2; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D223180D99 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68EEF14222A for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4ewaqHeEC-Jt; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.1.1.142] (corp.collabrx.com [157.22.41.236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9F36142215; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: From: Lisa Dusseault To: Tim Hare In-Reply-To: <20080709011240.7F39314220C@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:00 -0700 References: <20080709011240.7F39314220C@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org On Jul 8, 2008, at 6:12 PM, Tim Hare wrote: > When you're discussing polling, you're in the realm of Atom or RSS and > subscriptions, where eliminating the error message is "natural" - my > RSS > reader doesn't tell me when the feed has not been updated. If, > however we > allow VCALENDARs to be empty, a UA which imports a calendar through > mechanisms other than a subscription definitely needs to warn the > user. > > I'll have to think more deeply on this; perhaps there needs to be an > iTIP- / > iMIP- document to describe behaviors when iCalendar objects are > consumed in > ways other than mail, CalDAV, or subscriptions? +1. Actually I think the subscription case needs to be fleshed out too. I drafted some text a little while back, that might have been a 2445 appendix, but could instead get used in a separate doc. This starts out as drafty text but then turns into somewhat of an outline. Lisa ---- X. Importing and exporting iCalendar Data The iCalendar specification is commonly used as the basis for exporting calendar files that can be imported into different software when users need to move their calendars around. This document describes that practice. It is intended to be descriptive rather than normative. The file type and extension are as specified in RFC2445bis. When a user has several calendars for different categories or contexts (such as "home", "work" and "local events"), user agents most commonly export these as separate files rather than using categories within one big file. This works well with user agents that import each ICS file as a new calendar. Another common practice is to name the export file after the calendar, e.g. "work.ics". X.1. Components All iCalendar components can be mixed in the same file. VTIMEZONE components SHOULD be included in the same file where the timezone definitions are used. X.1.1 VTODOs Many, but not all clients, can handle importing VTODOs along with VEVENTS. When the user maintains several different calendars for different contexts, the VTODOs are usually associated with the same contexts as the VEVENTs: (e.g. "home tasks" and "work tasks"). Thus, it's very convenient to export VTODOs in the same file as VEVENTS. However, there are still some calendar agents that don't handle tasks, and users might find their tasks disappearing or even confusing the importing piece of software. It might be a useful feature to allow users the choice of including VTODOs in export files or leaving them out. VTODOs can be recurring items, can have due dates and alarms. This should be supported, otherwise the user must be warned if information is being lost in import. X.1.2 VJOURNALs VJOURNAL components are even less consistently handled. They are used in some time-management software to allow users to enter quick notes, that might turn into tasks or events or may simply be archived as plain notes. However, when a user agent has no ability to display notes as separate components from calendar events, the user at least needs to be made aware that some types of components are not being preserved in the import. Not all properties are routinely supported on VJOURNAL items. CONTACT, ORGANIZER, RECURRING, SEQUENCE properties are not. ,.. what else? Alarms... perhaps attachments should be recommended here, and most other things advised against. X.2. Alarms choice to clear all alarms when importing default choice when exporting should be to include how to convert to local context how the ATTACH property points to a local file importing client MUST be able to handle multiple alarms on the same parent component X.3. Attachments How does this work anyway? Is CID URL really used? Where are the content parts stored, that are referenced? X.4. Other considerationsw The FREEBUSY properties on an iCalendar object should be preserved in this way... The METHOD property should not appear The PRODID property can be dropped/changed on import, but should be saved on export for debugging information. CATEGORIES are generally treated as keywords, either folksonomies or specific categories in some enterprise systems. In either case, categories are not usually given top-level UI treatment -- instead, separate calendars (separate iCalendar files) are more commonly used as the model. COMMENT properties are not common. User agents may fold this into description during import. How are invitations handled? How can a user see, when they import an event into a new piece of software, that this was received as an invitation and from whom and when? How often is RELATED-TO really used and what for? Can a user agent drop this on import? Y. Security Considerations (to add to security considerations already there) Respecting CLASS:private and confidential --- _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Wed Jul 23 05:24:03 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D38AB3A6A6A for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.544 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.544 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.055, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fUL0Pi-5zsEE for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0CE33A6A4F for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F146480D66; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3033F80D61; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A41AF142207; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FQgsohk3sYro; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59C9F142206; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:30 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.31,238,1215388800"; d="scan'208";a="15153177" Received: from ams-dkim-1.cisco.com ([144.254.224.138]) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 23 Jul 2008 12:24:20 +0000 Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (ams-core-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.150]) by ams-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6NCOKAx021696; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:24:20 +0200 Received: from xbh-ams-331.emea.cisco.com (xbh-ams-331.cisco.com [144.254.231.71]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6NCOJ8k006198; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:24:20 GMT Received: from xfe-ams-331.emea.cisco.com ([144.254.231.72]) by xbh-ams-331.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:24:20 +0200 Received: from adsl-247-3-fixip.tiscali.ch ([10.61.80.222]) by xfe-ams-331.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:24:19 +0200 Message-ID: <488722F2.8080002@cisco.com> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:24:18 +0200 From: Eliot Lear User-Agent: Thunderbird/3.0a2pre (Macintosh; 2008072103) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bernard Desruisseaux , Lisa Dusseault , Aki Niemi , "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Jul 2008 12:24:19.0855 (UTC) FILETIME=[0814D1F0:01C8ECBF] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=837; t=1216815860; x=1217679860; c=relaxed/simple; s=amsdkim1002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=lear@cisco.com; z=From:=20Eliot=20Lear=20 |Subject:=20status=20of=20RFC=202445bis |Sender:=20; bh=Z7bbPsr4r7nIOaMDleDIn5ex/pGqiyU/9y33vICebTc=; b=WRbFvhb8NxQvaxuJd8BkOMZj2XkPPHHviqkPkZNNrdL1gIvvJJKVFLgmuT Lsrm5SKvHA16h8+uJ1UpG1192uVWeI+BsJW3LVOpbqvY8CDGLpKHvbS2IW9N jfy0wokdvw; Authentication-Results: ams-dkim-1; header.From=lear@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/amsdkim1002 verified; ); Subject: [Ietf-calsify] status of RFC 2445bis X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Lisa, Bernard, Aki, all: I've held off sending this note because Bernard was on holiday last week. Here is my understanding of the AD issues: AD Issue 1: A disagreement between Bernard and everyone else. Bernard, rough consensus says that you should change the text accordingly. AD Issue 2: There needs to be a statement as to what URIs are allowed and how they are to be resolved (in the case of HTTP and HTTPs). AD Issue 3: Bernard has come up with what seems like sufficient grounds to leave things as they are in the draft. AD Issue 4: Bernard has requested text, but there is consensus that text is needed and we are currently blocking on that. I would like to see this draft move forward quickly after IETF. Bernard, can you please address each issue in an update? Thanks, Eliot _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Wed Jul 23 06:40:11 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E36DA3A691C for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EglJfRnXC7h9 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45A353A67D9 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F27E580CD4; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2228480C35 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95AF3142209 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id La0qMZ9QT+T6 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.80]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79552142201 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA01.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.11]) by QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id tPbt1Z0090EZKEL58RgXE9; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 13:40:31 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA01.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id tRgR1Z00K1RyUCv3MRgWPh; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 13:40:31 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=qdLb6rJokIUA:10 a=vf8T6aPgKYQA:10 a=PFsjAnyDAAAA:8 a=smlba1-Az5dMnDQqgAAA:9 a=6Na0oatYV7qJR1kRenEA:9 a=9gEevFQegFWzuzjtQ5IA:7 a=yWIHeSqL6jPTlVACY0vqGqzmJ2EA:4 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=DLWQtoLnVnAA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Eliot Lear'" , "'Bernard Desruisseaux'" , "'Lisa Dusseault'" , "'Aki Niemi'" , Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] status of RFC 2445bis - AD Issue #4 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 09:40:25 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 In-Reply-To: <488722F2.8080002@cisco.com> Thread-Index: AcjsvxcRWcRtfb8gRmCIwOcI8VG8dwAButTQ X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Message-Id: <20080723134031.79552142201@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Lisa Dusseault had proposed some text: >Yes, it's the import scenarios I had in mind. Even if it's not strictly Internet Engineering. > >Off the top of my head, suggested text change that can certainly be improved upon, particularly the hand-wavy "other situations": > >OLD: > > An iCalendar object MUST include the "PRODID" and "VERSION" calendar > properties. In addition, it MUST include at least one calendar > component. Special forms of iCalendar objects are possible to > publish just busy time (i.e., only a "VFREEBUSY" calendar component) > or time zone (i.e., only a "VTIMEZONE" calendar component) > information. In addition, a complex iCalendar object that is used to > capture a complete snapshot of the contents of a calendar is possible > (e.g., composite of many different calendar components). More > commonly, an iCalendar object will consist of just a single "VEVENT", > "VTODO" or "VJOURNAL" calendar component. Applications MUST ignore > x-comp and iana-comp they don't recognized. > >NEW: > > An iCalendar object MUST include the "PRODID" and "VERSION" calendar > properties. In addition, it MUST include at least one calendar > component. Applications MUST ignore > x-comp and iana-comp they don't recognized. > > When iCalendar objects are sent out using iTIP, these usually > consist of just a single "VEVENT", "VTODO" or "VJOURNAL" calendar > component. The recipient is expected to support any of these. In other > situtations, iCalendar objects may contain only a "VFREEBUSY" > or "VTIMEZONE" calendar component. Finally, complex iCalendar > objects containing several different calendar components are used > to capture a complete snapshot of the contents of a calendar, task list, > project file or other application construct. > > Applications that support importing iCalendar objects SHOULD > support all of the component types defined in this document, and > SHOULD NOT silently drop any components as that can lead > to user data loss. Bernard Desruisseaux had stated previously: >Things that should be noted: > >1- iTIP does not allow different component types to be mixed. I believe multiple component types should be allowed within ITIP for certain METHOD: values, PUBLISH being the first that comes to mind, (although for one of the use cases, moving the entire contents of a calendar, a new method type of TRANSPORT might be in order). I would reword suggest slightly different wording for Lisa's last paragraph (although this could use some work, too, I fear): NEW: Some applications provide a function to read iCalendar objects in a non-scheduling context, for example to import a copy of a calendar which was exported for backup. These applications SHOULD support iCalendar objects which contain several different component types as long as the types are valid component types defined in this document. Applications which import iCalendar objects and which do not process all of the component types in an iCalendar object SHOULD inform the user that some components were ignored, and SHOULD inform the user or create a log of which components were ignored. Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Eliot Lear Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 8:24 AM To: Bernard Desruisseaux; Lisa Dusseault; Aki Niemi; ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] status of RFC 2445bis Lisa, Bernard, Aki, all: I've held off sending this note because Bernard was on holiday last week. Here is my understanding of the AD issues: AD Issue 1: A disagreement between Bernard and everyone else. Bernard, rough consensus says that you should change the text accordingly. AD Issue 2: There needs to be a statement as to what URIs are allowed and how they are to be resolved (in the case of HTTP and HTTPs). AD Issue 3: Bernard has come up with what seems like sufficient grounds to leave things as they are in the draft. AD Issue 4: Bernard has requested text, but there is consensus that text is needed and we are currently blocking on that. I would like to see this draft move forward quickly after IETF. Bernard, can you please address each issue in an update? Thanks, Eliot _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Sun Jul 27 09:54:55 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E5603A693A for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.977 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.977 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Y+SNPT0KI8Qy for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 846E83A6889 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96D117F5F8; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 765CE7F526 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCCA6142211 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WYlFcqjiU0Lc for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from an-out-0708.google.com (an-out-0708.google.com [209.85.132.251]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 819DC142210 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by an-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id d40so928210and.79 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.100.5.16 with SMTP id 16mr6715489ane.35.1217177678425; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.100.124.11 with HTTP; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <219d441c0807270954n647c5ab6u12a35a310d121ed5@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 18:54:38 +0200 From: "Adrian Apthorp" To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Relationship between STATUS, COMPLETED and PERCENT-COMPLETE X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Are there any implied semantics between STATUS, COMPLETED and PERCENT-COMPLETE on VTODO? I'm trying to figure out the best way to indicate status for a task that was performed but was unsuccessful.Is the combination of STATUS NEEDS-ACTION and a COMPLETED date legal? _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Sun Jul 27 13:47:47 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4169C3A69B5 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Fb+osEy3poOi for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 019593A687C for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 277197F528; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6412B7F522 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C937E142207 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cXlnvIhdh0HK for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4DFB142213 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:33 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.31,260,1215388800"; d="scan'208";a="15518877" Received: from ams-dkim-1.cisco.com ([144.254.224.138]) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 27 Jul 2008 20:47:28 +0000 Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (ams-core-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.150]) by ams-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6RKlSxE029311 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 22:47:28 +0200 Received: from xbh-ams-331.emea.cisco.com (xbh-ams-331.cisco.com [144.254.231.71]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6RKlSO7017013 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 20:47:28 GMT Received: from xfe-ams-331.emea.cisco.com ([144.254.231.72]) by xbh-ams-331.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 27 Jul 2008 22:47:28 +0200 Received: from elear-mac.local ([10.61.96.62]) by xfe-ams-331.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 27 Jul 2008 22:47:24 +0200 Message-ID: <488CDEDB.90704@cisco.com> Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:47:23 +0100 From: Eliot Lear User-Agent: Thunderbird/3.0a2pre (Macintosh; 2008072203) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jul 2008 20:47:25.0042 (UTC) FILETIME=[F981D520:01C8F029] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=339; t=1217191648; x=1218055648; c=relaxed/simple; s=amsdkim1002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=lear@cisco.com; z=From:=20Eliot=20Lear=20 |Subject:=20we're=20not=20meeting=20this=20week,=20but.. |Sender:=20; bh=UuRnJ7oxMak6BI8oGeDb5yyduSmgweHwmnGv5YM6ZjA=; b=RhrjZ6trhOGvuCEhqo6BvVKP0A/aLOzTc24eG5Mb2X79P+23t6A43rXg5D cXL4yCxJ6MIXKq637fu5cqazbbAqvcTLIofdhL/blmY/2nkYmtcVywIvdkt7 9G8zmePdzZ; Authentication-Results: ams-dkim-1; header.From=lear@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/amsdkim1002 verified; ); Subject: [Ietf-calsify] we're not meeting this week, but.. X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Dear all, The Calsify WG is not meeting this week. However, if you would like to talk to the chairs, both Aki and I will be available. Also, we are organizing an unofficial social breakfast on Wednesday at 7:30am at the restaurant that offers breakfast ;-) If you'd to join, please drop me a line. All the best, Eliot _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Tue Jul 29 08:53:08 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9595628C34E for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rOXZAGMv07uE for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 652C528C34C for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E87FA80D3C; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A008780D0B for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05E2C142217 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CeaiF7bsrGE1 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from redwood.morsemedia.net (redwood.morsemedia.net [69.50.246.194]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63D47142207 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [75.111.37.127] (helo=[192.168.0.216]) by redwood.morsemedia.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KNrVa-00028R-Dh; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:06 -0700 Message-ID: <488F3CEC.9080901@calconnect.org> Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:16 -0700 From: Dave Thewlis Organization: The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.16 (Windows/20080708) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-calsify list X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - redwood.morsemedia.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - osafoundation.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - calconnect.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Registration Open for CalConnect XIII: Roundtable XIII and CalConnect Interoperability Test Event, October 6-10, 2008, Sunnyvale, California X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1352162468==" Mime-version: 1.0 Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============1352162468== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------000702040005030103070209" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------000702040005030103070209 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Registration is now open for CalConnect XIII comprised of Roundtable XIII and a CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*, hosted by Yahoo/Zimbra in Sunnyvale, California on October 6-10, 2008. Please see http://www.calconnect.org/calconnect13.shtml for logistics information and links to registration for the Roundtable and for the CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*. If you are considering participating in the CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*, note that it begins with breakfast on Monday morning the 6th at 08:00 and runs to noon on Wednesday the 8th. As usual the Roundtable will begin with lunch at 12:30 on Wednesday the 8th and run until early Friday afternoon the 10th. A general schedule of events is provided on the logistics page; the final schedule of TC sessions, together with topical agendas, will be available by mid-September. We will have a *Technology Preview* on Wednesday afternoon at 1600, demonstrating multiple clients and servers participating in Freebusy URL, CalDAV Scheduling, and iSCHEDULE server-server scheduling. (iSCHEDULE is the HTTP-based instance of iTIP being worked on by the iSCHEDULE Technical Committee.) Hope to see you in Sunnyvale in October! Cheers, Dave Thewlis *This CalConnect Interoperability Test Event will be a "regular" IOP test event. The next MOBILE Calendaring Interoperability Test Event will be held in November - see http://www.calconnect.org/miop0811.shtml. (The formal announcement of the Mobile IOP Test Event will be made soon.) -- *Dave Thewlis, Executive Director Calconnect - The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium* +1 707 840 9391 (voice) · +1 707 498 2238 (mobile) http://www.calconnect.org · Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org --------------000702040005030103070209 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Registration is now open for CalConnect XIII comprised of Roundtable XIII and a CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*, hosted by Yahoo/Zimbra in Sunnyvale, California on October 6-10, 2008.

Please see http://www.calconnect.org/calconnect13.shtml for logistics information and links to registration for the Roundtable and for the CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*.

If you are considering participating in the CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*, note that it begins with breakfast on Monday morning the 6th at 08:00 and runs to noon on Wednesday the 8th.  As usual the Roundtable will begin with lunch at 12:30 on Wednesday the 8th  and run until early Friday afternoon the 10th. 

A general schedule of events is provided on the logistics page; the final schedule of TC sessions, together with topical agendas, will be available by mid-September.

We will have a Technology Preview on Wednesday afternoon at 1600, demonstrating multiple clients and servers participating in Freebusy URL, CalDAV Scheduling, and iSCHEDULE server-server scheduling.  (iSCHEDULE is the HTTP-based instance of iTIP being worked on by the iSCHEDULE Technical Committee.)

Hope to see you in Sunnyvale in October!

Cheers,

Dave Thewlis


*This CalConnect Interoperability Test Event will be a "regular" IOP test event.  The next MOBILE Calendaring Interoperability Test Event will be held in November - see http://www.calconnect.org/miop0811.shtml.  (The formal announcement of the Mobile IOP Test Event will be made soon.)

--
Dave Thewlis, Executive Director
Calconnect - The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium
+1 707 840 9391 (voice) · +1 707 498 2238 (mobile)
http://www.calconnect.org · Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org
--------------000702040005030103070209-- --===============1352162468== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify --===============1352162468==-- From ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Wed Jul 30 10:07:32 2008 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-calsify-archive-Feit0ahl@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8C1E3A6C28 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -5.46 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.46 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.138, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LUExjlnHiQTZ for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABAC928C0F5 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from leilani.osafoundation.org (leilani.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 437937F526; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24C947F4F4 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F91814220C for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QsnmGTbqxkt5 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from redwood.morsemedia.net (redwood.morsemedia.net [69.50.246.194]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6EBA142213 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [75.111.37.127] (helo=[192.168.0.216]) by redwood.morsemedia.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KOF9C-0007Dx-6z; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:34 -0700 Message-ID: <48909FD3.1000706@calconnect.org> Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:31 -0700 From: Dave Thewlis Organization: The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.16 (Windows/20080708) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-calsify list X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - redwood.morsemedia.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - osafoundation.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - calconnect.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Subject: [Ietf-calsify] CalConnect announces second Mobile Interoperability Test Event X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0791948469==" Mime-version: 1.0 Sender: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org Errors-To: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============0791948469== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------030606000501070005030201" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------030606000501070005030201 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit CalConnect has announced that its second Mobile Calendaring Interoperability Test Event will be a standalone event November 4-6, 2008, hosted by Kerio Technologies in Plzen, Czech Republic, and registration is now open for the event. Several CalConnect members have indicated a distinct interest in or plan to participate. Logistics and registration information are available at http://www.calconnect.org/miop0811.shtml. The press release announcing this event can be found at http://www.calconnect.org/publicity/080728 CalConnect Mobile IOP Test Event.doc . As always, this event is open to members and non-members alike; however space will be somewhat limited and early registration is advisable. If you have questions about the event, feel free to post to the calmobileiop-l list (you may join the list at http://www.calconnect.org/calmobileioplist.shtml if you are not already a member), or contact me at the e-mail below. Hope to see you in Plzen! Best Regards, Dave Thewlis -- *Dave Thewlis, Executive Director Calconnect - The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium* +1 707 840 9391 (voice) · +1 707 498 2238 (mobile) http://www.calconnect.org · Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org --------------030606000501070005030201 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit CalConnect has announced that its second Mobile Calendaring Interoperability Test Event will be a standalone event November 4-6, 2008, hosted by Kerio Technologies in Plzen, Czech Republic, and registration is now open for the event. Several CalConnect members have indicated a distinct interest in or plan to participate. Logistics and registration information are available at http://www.calconnect.org/miop0811.shtml.  The press release announcing this event can be found at http://www.calconnect.org/publicity/080728 CalConnect Mobile IOP Test Event.doc. 

As always, this event is open to members and non-members alike; however space will be somewhat limited and early registration is advisable.  If you have questions about the event, feel free to post to the calmobileiop-l list (you may join the list at http://www.calconnect.org/calmobileioplist.shtml if you are not already a member), or contact me at the e-mail below.

Hope to see you in Plzen!

Best Regards,

Dave Thewlis

--
Dave Thewlis, Executive Director
Calconnect - The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium
+1 707 840 9391 (voice) · +1 707 498 2238 (mobile)
http://www.calconnect.org · Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org
--------------030606000501070005030201-- --===============0791948469== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify --===============0791948469==-- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24C947F4F4 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F91814220C for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.444 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.444 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.154, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QsnmGTbqxkt5 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from redwood.morsemedia.net (redwood.morsemedia.net [69.50.246.194]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6EBA142213 for ; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [75.111.37.127] (helo=[192.168.0.216]) by redwood.morsemedia.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KOF9C-0007Dx-6z; Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:34 -0700 Message-ID: <48909FD3.1000706@calconnect.org> Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 10:07:31 -0700 From: Dave Thewlis Organization: The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.16 (Windows/20080708) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-calsify list Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------030606000501070005030201" X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - redwood.morsemedia.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - osafoundation.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - calconnect.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Subject: [Ietf-calsify] CalConnect announces second Mobile Interoperability Test Event X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2008 17:07:45 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------030606000501070005030201 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit CalConnect has announced that its second Mobile Calendaring Interoperability Test Event will be a standalone event November 4-6, 2008, hosted by Kerio Technologies in Plzen, Czech Republic, and registration is now open for the event. Several CalConnect members have indicated a distinct interest in or plan to participate. Logistics and registration information are available at http://www.calconnect.org/miop0811.shtml. The press release announcing this event can be found at http://www.calconnect.org/publicity/080728 CalConnect Mobile IOP Test Event.doc . As always, this event is open to members and non-members alike; however space will be somewhat limited and early registration is advisable. If you have questions about the event, feel free to post to the calmobileiop-l list (you may join the list at http://www.calconnect.org/calmobileioplist.shtml if you are not already a member), or contact me at the e-mail below. Hope to see you in Plzen! Best Regards, Dave Thewlis -- *Dave Thewlis, Executive Director Calconnect - The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium* +1 707 840 9391 (voice) · +1 707 498 2238 (mobile) http://www.calconnect.org · Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org --------------030606000501070005030201 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit CalConnect has announced that its second Mobile Calendaring Interoperability Test Event will be a standalone event November 4-6, 2008, hosted by Kerio Technologies in Plzen, Czech Republic, and registration is now open for the event. Several CalConnect members have indicated a distinct interest in or plan to participate. Logistics and registration information are available at http://www.calconnect.org/miop0811.shtml.  The press release announcing this event can be found at http://www.calconnect.org/publicity/080728 CalConnect Mobile IOP Test Event.doc. 

As always, this event is open to members and non-members alike; however space will be somewhat limited and early registration is advisable.  If you have questions about the event, feel free to post to the calmobileiop-l list (you may join the list at http://www.calconnect.org/calmobileioplist.shtml if you are not already a member), or contact me at the e-mail below.

Hope to see you in Plzen!

Best Regards,

Dave Thewlis

--
Dave Thewlis, Executive Director
Calconnect - The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium
+1 707 840 9391 (voice) · +1 707 498 2238 (mobile)
http://www.calconnect.org · Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org
--------------030606000501070005030201-- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A008780D0B for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05E2C142217 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.436 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.436 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.162, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CeaiF7bsrGE1 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from redwood.morsemedia.net (redwood.morsemedia.net [69.50.246.194]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63D47142207 for ; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [75.111.37.127] (helo=[192.168.0.216]) by redwood.morsemedia.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1KNrVa-00028R-Dh; Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:06 -0700 Message-ID: <488F3CEC.9080901@calconnect.org> Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 08:53:16 -0700 From: Dave Thewlis Organization: The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.16 (Windows/20080708) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-calsify list Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------000702040005030103070209" X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - redwood.morsemedia.net X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - osafoundation.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - calconnect.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Registration Open for CalConnect XIII: Roundtable XIII and CalConnect Interoperability Test Event, October 6-10, 2008, Sunnyvale, California X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list Reply-To: Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 29 Jul 2008 15:53:17 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------000702040005030103070209 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Registration is now open for CalConnect XIII comprised of Roundtable XIII and a CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*, hosted by Yahoo/Zimbra in Sunnyvale, California on October 6-10, 2008. Please see http://www.calconnect.org/calconnect13.shtml for logistics information and links to registration for the Roundtable and for the CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*. If you are considering participating in the CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*, note that it begins with breakfast on Monday morning the 6th at 08:00 and runs to noon on Wednesday the 8th. As usual the Roundtable will begin with lunch at 12:30 on Wednesday the 8th and run until early Friday afternoon the 10th. A general schedule of events is provided on the logistics page; the final schedule of TC sessions, together with topical agendas, will be available by mid-September. We will have a *Technology Preview* on Wednesday afternoon at 1600, demonstrating multiple clients and servers participating in Freebusy URL, CalDAV Scheduling, and iSCHEDULE server-server scheduling. (iSCHEDULE is the HTTP-based instance of iTIP being worked on by the iSCHEDULE Technical Committee.) Hope to see you in Sunnyvale in October! Cheers, Dave Thewlis *This CalConnect Interoperability Test Event will be a "regular" IOP test event. The next MOBILE Calendaring Interoperability Test Event will be held in November - see http://www.calconnect.org/miop0811.shtml. (The formal announcement of the Mobile IOP Test Event will be made soon.) -- *Dave Thewlis, Executive Director Calconnect - The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium* +1 707 840 9391 (voice) · +1 707 498 2238 (mobile) http://www.calconnect.org · Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org --------------000702040005030103070209 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Registration is now open for CalConnect XIII comprised of Roundtable XIII and a CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*, hosted by Yahoo/Zimbra in Sunnyvale, California on October 6-10, 2008.

Please see http://www.calconnect.org/calconnect13.shtml for logistics information and links to registration for the Roundtable and for the CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*.

If you are considering participating in the CalConnect Interoperability Test Event*, note that it begins with breakfast on Monday morning the 6th at 08:00 and runs to noon on Wednesday the 8th.  As usual the Roundtable will begin with lunch at 12:30 on Wednesday the 8th  and run until early Friday afternoon the 10th. 

A general schedule of events is provided on the logistics page; the final schedule of TC sessions, together with topical agendas, will be available by mid-September.

We will have a Technology Preview on Wednesday afternoon at 1600, demonstrating multiple clients and servers participating in Freebusy URL, CalDAV Scheduling, and iSCHEDULE server-server scheduling.  (iSCHEDULE is the HTTP-based instance of iTIP being worked on by the iSCHEDULE Technical Committee.)

Hope to see you in Sunnyvale in October!

Cheers,

Dave Thewlis


*This CalConnect Interoperability Test Event will be a "regular" IOP test event.  The next MOBILE Calendaring Interoperability Test Event will be held in November - see http://www.calconnect.org/miop0811.shtml.  (The formal announcement of the Mobile IOP Test Event will be made soon.)

--
Dave Thewlis, Executive Director
Calconnect - The Calendaring and Scheduling Consortium
+1 707 840 9391 (voice) · +1 707 498 2238 (mobile)
http://www.calconnect.org · Dave.Thewlis@calconnect.org
--------------000702040005030103070209-- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6412B7F522 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C937E142207 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.449 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.449 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.151, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cXlnvIhdh0HK for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4DFB142213 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 13:47:33 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.31,260,1215388800"; d="scan'208";a="15518877" Received: from ams-dkim-1.cisco.com ([144.254.224.138]) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 27 Jul 2008 20:47:28 +0000 Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (ams-core-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.150]) by ams-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6RKlSxE029311 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 22:47:28 +0200 Received: from xbh-ams-331.emea.cisco.com (xbh-ams-331.cisco.com [144.254.231.71]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6RKlSO7017013 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 20:47:28 GMT Received: from xfe-ams-331.emea.cisco.com ([144.254.231.72]) by xbh-ams-331.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 27 Jul 2008 22:47:28 +0200 Received: from elear-mac.local ([10.61.96.62]) by xfe-ams-331.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sun, 27 Jul 2008 22:47:24 +0200 Message-ID: <488CDEDB.90704@cisco.com> Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 21:47:23 +0100 From: Eliot Lear User-Agent: Thunderbird/3.0a2pre (Macintosh; 2008072203) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 27 Jul 2008 20:47:25.0042 (UTC) FILETIME=[F981D520:01C8F029] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=339; t=1217191648; x=1218055648; c=relaxed/simple; s=amsdkim1002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=lear@cisco.com; z=From:=20Eliot=20Lear=20 |Subject:=20we're=20not=20meeting=20this=20week,=20but.. |Sender:=20; bh=UuRnJ7oxMak6BI8oGeDb5yyduSmgweHwmnGv5YM6ZjA=; b=RhrjZ6trhOGvuCEhqo6BvVKP0A/aLOzTc24eG5Mb2X79P+23t6A43rXg5D cXL4yCxJ6MIXKq637fu5cqazbbAqvcTLIofdhL/blmY/2nkYmtcVywIvdkt7 9G8zmePdzZ; Authentication-Results: ams-dkim-1; header.From=lear@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/amsdkim1002 verified; ); Subject: [Ietf-calsify] we're not meeting this week, but.. X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 20:47:46 -0000 Dear all, The Calsify WG is not meeting this week. However, if you would like to talk to the chairs, both Aki and I will be available. Also, we are organizing an unofficial social breakfast on Wednesday at 7:30am at the restaurant that offers breakfast ;-) If you'd to join, please drop me a line. All the best, Eliot Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 765CE7F526 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCCA6142211 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WYlFcqjiU0Lc for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from an-out-0708.google.com (an-out-0708.google.com [209.85.132.251]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 819DC142210 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by an-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id d40so928210and.79 for ; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.100.5.16 with SMTP id 16mr6715489ane.35.1217177678425; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.100.124.11 with HTTP; Sun, 27 Jul 2008 09:54:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <219d441c0807270954n647c5ab6u12a35a310d121ed5@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 18:54:38 +0200 From: "Adrian Apthorp" To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Relationship between STATUS, COMPLETED and PERCENT-COMPLETE X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 27 Jul 2008 16:54:45 -0000 Are there any implied semantics between STATUS, COMPLETED and PERCENT-COMPLETE on VTODO? I'm trying to figure out the best way to indicate status for a task that was performed but was unsuccessful.Is the combination of STATUS NEEDS-ACTION and a COMPLETED date legal? Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2228480C35 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95AF3142209 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.75 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.75 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.850, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id La0qMZ9QT+T6 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.80]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79552142201 for ; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 06:40:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA01.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.11]) by QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id tPbt1Z0090EZKEL58RgXE9; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 13:40:31 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA01.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id tRgR1Z00K1RyUCv3MRgWPh; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 13:40:31 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=qdLb6rJokIUA:10 a=vf8T6aPgKYQA:10 a=PFsjAnyDAAAA:8 a=smlba1-Az5dMnDQqgAAA:9 a=6Na0oatYV7qJR1kRenEA:9 a=9gEevFQegFWzuzjtQ5IA:7 a=yWIHeSqL6jPTlVACY0vqGqzmJ2EA:4 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=DLWQtoLnVnAA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Eliot Lear'" , "'Bernard Desruisseaux'" , "'Lisa Dusseault'" , "'Aki Niemi'" , Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] status of RFC 2445bis - AD Issue #4 Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 09:40:25 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 In-Reply-To: <488722F2.8080002@cisco.com> Thread-Index: AcjsvxcRWcRtfb8gRmCIwOcI8VG8dwAButTQ X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Message-Id: <20080723134031.79552142201@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 13:40:44 -0000 Lisa Dusseault had proposed some text: >Yes, it's the import scenarios I had in mind. Even if it's not strictly Internet Engineering. > >Off the top of my head, suggested text change that can certainly be improved upon, particularly the hand-wavy "other situations": > >OLD: > > An iCalendar object MUST include the "PRODID" and "VERSION" calendar > properties. In addition, it MUST include at least one calendar > component. Special forms of iCalendar objects are possible to > publish just busy time (i.e., only a "VFREEBUSY" calendar component) > or time zone (i.e., only a "VTIMEZONE" calendar component) > information. In addition, a complex iCalendar object that is used to > capture a complete snapshot of the contents of a calendar is possible > (e.g., composite of many different calendar components). More > commonly, an iCalendar object will consist of just a single "VEVENT", > "VTODO" or "VJOURNAL" calendar component. Applications MUST ignore > x-comp and iana-comp they don't recognized. > >NEW: > > An iCalendar object MUST include the "PRODID" and "VERSION" calendar > properties. In addition, it MUST include at least one calendar > component. Applications MUST ignore > x-comp and iana-comp they don't recognized. > > When iCalendar objects are sent out using iTIP, these usually > consist of just a single "VEVENT", "VTODO" or "VJOURNAL" calendar > component. The recipient is expected to support any of these. In other > situtations, iCalendar objects may contain only a "VFREEBUSY" > or "VTIMEZONE" calendar component. Finally, complex iCalendar > objects containing several different calendar components are used > to capture a complete snapshot of the contents of a calendar, task list, > project file or other application construct. > > Applications that support importing iCalendar objects SHOULD > support all of the component types defined in this document, and > SHOULD NOT silently drop any components as that can lead > to user data loss. Bernard Desruisseaux had stated previously: >Things that should be noted: > >1- iTIP does not allow different component types to be mixed. I believe multiple component types should be allowed within ITIP for certain METHOD: values, PUBLISH being the first that comes to mind, (although for one of the use cases, moving the entire contents of a calendar, a new method type of TRANSPORT might be in order). I would reword suggest slightly different wording for Lisa's last paragraph (although this could use some work, too, I fear): NEW: Some applications provide a function to read iCalendar objects in a non-scheduling context, for example to import a copy of a calendar which was exported for backup. These applications SHOULD support iCalendar objects which contain several different component types as long as the types are valid component types defined in this document. Applications which import iCalendar objects and which do not process all of the component types in an iCalendar object SHOULD inform the user that some components were ignored, and SHOULD inform the user or create a log of which components were ignored. Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Eliot Lear Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 8:24 AM To: Bernard Desruisseaux; Lisa Dusseault; Aki Niemi; ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] status of RFC 2445bis Lisa, Bernard, Aki, all: I've held off sending this note because Bernard was on holiday last week. Here is my understanding of the AD issues: AD Issue 1: A disagreement between Bernard and everyone else. Bernard, rough consensus says that you should change the text accordingly. AD Issue 2: There needs to be a statement as to what URIs are allowed and how they are to be resolved (in the case of HTTP and HTTPs). AD Issue 3: Bernard has come up with what seems like sufficient grounds to leave things as they are in the draft. AD Issue 4: Bernard has requested text, but there is consensus that text is needed and we are currently blocking on that. I would like to see this draft move forward quickly after IETF. Bernard, can you please address each issue in an update? Thanks, Eliot _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3033F80D61; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A41AF142207; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.441 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.441 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.159, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FQgsohk3sYro; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 59C9F142206; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 05:24:30 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.31,238,1215388800"; d="scan'208";a="15153177" Received: from ams-dkim-1.cisco.com ([144.254.224.138]) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 23 Jul 2008 12:24:20 +0000 Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (ams-core-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.150]) by ams-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6NCOKAx021696; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:24:20 +0200 Received: from xbh-ams-331.emea.cisco.com (xbh-ams-331.cisco.com [144.254.231.71]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6NCOJ8k006198; Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:24:20 GMT Received: from xfe-ams-331.emea.cisco.com ([144.254.231.72]) by xbh-ams-331.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:24:20 +0200 Received: from adsl-247-3-fixip.tiscali.ch ([10.61.80.222]) by xfe-ams-331.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:24:19 +0200 Message-ID: <488722F2.8080002@cisco.com> Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 14:24:18 +0200 From: Eliot Lear User-Agent: Thunderbird/3.0a2pre (Macintosh; 2008072103) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Bernard Desruisseaux , Lisa Dusseault , Aki Niemi , "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 23 Jul 2008 12:24:19.0855 (UTC) FILETIME=[0814D1F0:01C8ECBF] DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=837; t=1216815860; x=1217679860; c=relaxed/simple; s=amsdkim1002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=lear@cisco.com; z=From:=20Eliot=20Lear=20 |Subject:=20status=20of=20RFC=202445bis |Sender:=20; bh=Z7bbPsr4r7nIOaMDleDIn5ex/pGqiyU/9y33vICebTc=; b=WRbFvhb8NxQvaxuJd8BkOMZj2XkPPHHviqkPkZNNrdL1gIvvJJKVFLgmuT Lsrm5SKvHA16h8+uJ1UpG1192uVWeI+BsJW3LVOpbqvY8CDGLpKHvbS2IW9N jfy0wokdvw; Authentication-Results: ams-dkim-1; header.From=lear@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/amsdkim1002 verified; ); Subject: [Ietf-calsify] status of RFC 2445bis X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 23 Jul 2008 12:24:43 -0000 Lisa, Bernard, Aki, all: I've held off sending this note because Bernard was on holiday last week. Here is my understanding of the AD issues: AD Issue 1: A disagreement between Bernard and everyone else. Bernard, rough consensus says that you should change the text accordingly. AD Issue 2: There needs to be a statement as to what URIs are allowed and how they are to be resolved (in the case of HTTP and HTTPs). AD Issue 3: Bernard has come up with what seems like sufficient grounds to leave things as they are in the draft. AD Issue 4: Bernard has requested text, but there is consensus that text is needed and we are currently blocking on that. I would like to see this draft move forward quickly after IETF. Bernard, can you please address each issue in an update? Thanks, Eliot Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D223180D99 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68EEF14222A for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.789 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.789 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.117, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_FAIL=0.693] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4ewaqHeEC-Jt; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.1.1.142] (corp.collabrx.com [157.22.41.236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9F36142215; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:00 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: From: Lisa Dusseault To: Tim Hare In-Reply-To: <20080709011240.7F39314220C@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:55:00 -0700 References: <20080709011240.7F39314220C@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 22:55:07 -0000 On Jul 8, 2008, at 6:12 PM, Tim Hare wrote: > When you're discussing polling, you're in the realm of Atom or RSS and > subscriptions, where eliminating the error message is "natural" - my > RSS > reader doesn't tell me when the feed has not been updated. If, > however we > allow VCALENDARs to be empty, a UA which imports a calendar through > mechanisms other than a subscription definitely needs to warn the > user. > > I'll have to think more deeply on this; perhaps there needs to be an > iTIP- / > iMIP- document to describe behaviors when iCalendar objects are > consumed in > ways other than mail, CalDAV, or subscriptions? +1. Actually I think the subscription case needs to be fleshed out too. I drafted some text a little while back, that might have been a 2445 appendix, but could instead get used in a separate doc. This starts out as drafty text but then turns into somewhat of an outline. Lisa ---- X. Importing and exporting iCalendar Data The iCalendar specification is commonly used as the basis for exporting calendar files that can be imported into different software when users need to move their calendars around. This document describes that practice. It is intended to be descriptive rather than normative. The file type and extension are as specified in RFC2445bis. When a user has several calendars for different categories or contexts (such as "home", "work" and "local events"), user agents most commonly export these as separate files rather than using categories within one big file. This works well with user agents that import each ICS file as a new calendar. Another common practice is to name the export file after the calendar, e.g. "work.ics". X.1. Components All iCalendar components can be mixed in the same file. VTIMEZONE components SHOULD be included in the same file where the timezone definitions are used. X.1.1 VTODOs Many, but not all clients, can handle importing VTODOs along with VEVENTS. When the user maintains several different calendars for different contexts, the VTODOs are usually associated with the same contexts as the VEVENTs: (e.g. "home tasks" and "work tasks"). Thus, it's very convenient to export VTODOs in the same file as VEVENTS. However, there are still some calendar agents that don't handle tasks, and users might find their tasks disappearing or even confusing the importing piece of software. It might be a useful feature to allow users the choice of including VTODOs in export files or leaving them out. VTODOs can be recurring items, can have due dates and alarms. This should be supported, otherwise the user must be warned if information is being lost in import. X.1.2 VJOURNALs VJOURNAL components are even less consistently handled. They are used in some time-management software to allow users to enter quick notes, that might turn into tasks or events or may simply be archived as plain notes. However, when a user agent has no ability to display notes as separate components from calendar events, the user at least needs to be made aware that some types of components are not being preserved in the import. Not all properties are routinely supported on VJOURNAL items. CONTACT, ORGANIZER, RECURRING, SEQUENCE properties are not. ,.. what else? Alarms... perhaps attachments should be recommended here, and most other things advised against. X.2. Alarms choice to clear all alarms when importing default choice when exporting should be to include how to convert to local context how the ATTACH property points to a local file importing client MUST be able to handle multiple alarms on the same parent component X.3. Attachments How does this work anyway? Is CID URL really used? Where are the content parts stored, that are referenced? X.4. Other considerationsw The FREEBUSY properties on an iCalendar object should be preserved in this way... The METHOD property should not appear The PRODID property can be dropped/changed on import, but should be saved on export for debugging information. CATEGORIES are generally treated as keywords, either folksonomies or specific categories in some enterprise systems. In either case, categories are not usually given top-level UI treatment -- instead, separate calendars (separate iCalendar files) are more commonly used as the model. COMMENT properties are not common. User agents may fold this into description during import. How are invitations handled? How can a user see, when they import an event into a new piece of software, that this was received as an invitation and from whom and when? How often is RELATED-TO really used and what for? Can a user agent drop this on import? Y. Security Considerations (to add to security considerations already there) Respecting CLASS:private and confidential --- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62E4B80D99 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 03B2414222A for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.789 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.789 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.117, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_FAIL=0.693] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id B6qDb3KhB26a; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.1.1.142] (corp.collabrx.com [157.22.41.236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 933C5142215; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:21 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: From: Lisa Dusseault To: Tim Hare In-Reply-To: <20080704201721.97276142229@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 15:49:21 -0700 References: <20080704201721.97276142229@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 22:49:34 -0000 Yes, it's the import scenarios I had in mind. Even if it's not strictly Internet Engineering. Off the top of my head, suggested text change that can certainly be improved upon, particularly the hand-wavy "other situations": OLD: An iCalendar object MUST include the "PRODID" and "VERSION" calendar properties. In addition, it MUST include at least one calendar component. Special forms of iCalendar objects are possible to publish just busy time (i.e., only a "VFREEBUSY" calendar component) or time zone (i.e., only a "VTIMEZONE" calendar component) information. In addition, a complex iCalendar object that is used to capture a complete snapshot of the contents of a calendar is possible (e.g., composite of many different calendar components). More commonly, an iCalendar object will consist of just a single "VEVENT", "VTODO" or "VJOURNAL" calendar component. Applications MUST ignore x-comp and iana-comp they don't recognized. NEW: An iCalendar object MUST include the "PRODID" and "VERSION" calendar properties. In addition, it MUST include at least one calendar component. Applications MUST ignore x-comp and iana-comp they don't recognized. When iCalendar objects are sent out using iTIP, these usually consist of just a single "VEVENT", "VTODO" or "VJOURNAL" calendar component. The recipient is expected to support any of these. In other situtations, iCalendar objects may contain only a "VFREEBUSY" or "VTIMEZONE" calendar component. Finally, complex iCalendar objects containing several different calendar components are used to capture a complete snapshot of the contents of a calendar, task list, project file or other application construct. Applications that support importing iCalendar objects SHOULD support all of the component types defined in this document, and SHOULD NOT silently drop any components as that can lead to user data loss. Lisa On Jul 4, 2008, at 1:17 PM, Tim Hare wrote: > I can't speak for Lisa, but the export/import scenario is one place > where b) > applies. If by "Internet calendar" you mean an .ics file that is > opened via > browser, that is also an 'import' scenario I think. > > > Tim Hare > Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Bernard Desruisseaux [mailto:bernard.desruisseaux@oracle.com] > Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 11:06 AM > To: Eliot Lear > Cc: Tim Hare; ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in > thesame > iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) > > It's not clear to me what Lisa is suggesting actually. > > a) Warning about the fact that components type can be mixed? > b) Not to ignore unsupported component types silently? > > Proposed text would be great! > > Things that should be noted: > > 1- iTIP does not allow different component types to be mixed. > > 2- CalDAV provides means to get only the components types that you > want. > > As such, in practice we will only see mixed component types in export > scenarios and Internet calendars (aka, webcal). > > Cheers, > Bernard > > Eliot Lear wrote: >> I believe we have consensus as to Lisa's suggestion. Any >> disagreement? >> >> Eliot >> >> Tim Hare wrote: >>> As an "informed user" - i.e. not a developer, I definitely support >>> NON-silent rejection. I can agree with non-support of certain >>> components only if I receive some notification; due to work >>> requirements I am now journalling my time on some projects, and it >>> would be good to know if I can't import that data into another tool. >>> >>> >>> Tim Hare >>> Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org >>> [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Cyrus >>> Daboo >>> Sent: Monday, June 16, 2008 12:33 PM >>> To: Lisa Dusseault >>> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org; Bernard Desruisseaux >>> Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in >>> thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review >>> on2445bis) >>> >>> Hi Lisa, >>> >>> --On June 16, 2008 9:25:14 AM -0700 Lisa >>> Dusseault >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>>>> The suggestion of an implementation note that describes the >>>>> "common >>>>> use" of the components and explains that some may be supported and >>>>> others not is fine. In fact telling implementors that they need to >>>>> be prepared for another system to reject a component would be >>>>> good. >>>>> >>>> I can get behind that. I'd also like to recommend that systems not >>>> reject a component silently -- a user needs to know if they >>>> imported >>>> a iCalendar file and lost 50 VJOURNAL components in the process. >>>> >>> >>> Agreed. >>> >>> Note that iTIP does have a status code for "Unsupported Component" >>> (3.13) - >>> so informing the originator of the iCalendar data that they are >>> sending something that is not supported by the recipient is >>> covered by > that. >>> >>> -- >>> Cyrus Daboo >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ietf-calsify mailing list >>> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >>> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Ietf-calsify mailing list >>> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >>> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A4F180D92 for ; 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14 Jul 2008 19:51:17 +0000 Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com (ams-core-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.150]) by ams-dkim-2.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id m6EJpHap018343; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:51:17 +0200 Received: from xbh-ams-332.emea.cisco.com (xbh-ams-332.cisco.com [144.254.231.87]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id m6EJpHQn027748; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 19:51:17 GMT Received: from xfe-ams-332.cisco.com ([144.254.231.73]) by xbh-ams-332.emea.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:51:17 +0200 Received: from adsl-247-5-fixip.tiscali.ch ([10.61.81.182]) by xfe-ams-332.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:51:16 +0200 Message-ID: <487BAE34.10702@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 21:51:16 +0200 From: Eliot Lear User-Agent: Thunderbird/3.0a2pre (Macintosh; 2008071203) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] I-D Action:draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt References: <20080714181502.1C5F03A6A5C@core3.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <20080714181502.1C5F03A6A5C@core3.amsl.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; 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charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thank you, Cyrus, for this update that contains IANA Considerations and an updated Appendix of changes. Eliot Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the Calendaring and Scheduling Standards Simplification Working Group of the IETF. > > > Title : iCalendar Transport-Independent Interoperability Protocol (iTIP) > Author(s) : C. Daboo > Filename : draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt > Pages : 126 > Date : 2008-07-14 > > This document specifies a protocol using the iCalendar object > specification to provide scheduling interoperability between > different calendar systems. This is done without reference to a > specific transport protocol so as to allow multiple methods of > communication between systems. Subsequent documents will define > profiles of this protocol using specific interoperable methods of > communications between systems. > > iTIP complements the iCalendar object specification by adding > semantics for group scheduling methods commonly available in current > calendar systems. These scheduling methods permit two or more > calendar systems to perform transactions such as publish, schedule, > reschedule, respond to scheduling requests, negotiation of changes or > cancel. > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader > implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the > Internet-Draft. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > --------------040306060904010708060905 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thank you, Cyrus, for this update that contains IANA Considerations and an updated Appendix of changes.

Eliot

Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: 
A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Calendaring and Scheduling Standards Simplification Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : iCalendar Transport-Independent Interoperability Protocol (iTIP)
	Author(s)       : C. Daboo
	Filename        : draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt
	Pages           : 126
	Date            : 2008-07-14

This document specifies a protocol using the iCalendar object
specification to provide scheduling interoperability between
different calendar systems.  This is done without reference to a
specific transport protocol so as to allow multiple methods of
communication between systems.  Subsequent documents will define
profiles of this protocol using specific interoperable methods of
communications between systems.

iTIP complements the iCalendar object specification by adding
semantics for group scheduling methods commonly available in current
calendar systems.  These scheduling methods permit two or more
calendar systems to perform transactions such as publish, schedule,
reschedule, respond to scheduling requests, negotiation of changes or
cancel.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader
implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the
Internet-Draft.
  

_______________________________________________
Ietf-calsify mailing list
Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org
http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify

--------------040306060904010708060905-- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 509C980D89 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E600D14223C for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.581 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.581 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.018, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JnTsXtN-6MHC for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.ietf.org (mail.ietf.org [64.170.98.32]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57016142229 for ; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 1C5F03A6A5C; Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:02 -0700 (PDT) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20080714181502.1C5F03A6A5C@core3.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 11:15:02 -0700 (PDT) Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] I-D Action:draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 14 Jul 2008 18:15:39 -0000 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Calendaring and Scheduling Standards Simplification Working Group of the IETF. Title : iCalendar Transport-Independent Interoperability Protocol (iTIP) Author(s) : C. Daboo Filename : draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt Pages : 126 Date : 2008-07-14 This document specifies a protocol using the iCalendar object specification to provide scheduling interoperability between different calendar systems. This is done without reference to a specific transport protocol so as to allow multiple methods of communication between systems. Subsequent documents will define profiles of this protocol using specific interoperable methods of communications between systems. iTIP complements the iCalendar object specification by adding semantics for group scheduling methods commonly available in current calendar systems. These scheduling methods permit two or more calendar systems to perform transactions such as publish, schedule, reschedule, respond to scheduling requests, negotiation of changes or cancel. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-calsify-2446bis-07.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2008-07-14110730.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart-- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 377A080BAB for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:43:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D771014223E for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:43:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AWvZAc3bWbBP for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:42:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.mdlink.net (medusa.mdlink.de [213.211.192.34]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AEAA14221E for ; Sat, 12 Jul 2008 15:42:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.mdlink.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50C4A105AD91 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2008 00:42:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ip-77-24-38-212.web.vodafone.de (ip-77-24-38-212.web.vodafone.de [77.24.38.212]) by mail.mdlink.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D49F2105AD62 for ; Sun, 13 Jul 2008 00:42:41 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: From: Helge Hess To: IETF-iCalendar In-Reply-To: <1215770315.7298.21.camel@ganso> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Question about etag support for freebusy report Date: Sun, 13 Jul 2008 00:42:41 +0200 References: <1215770315.7298.21.camel@ganso> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 12 Jul 2008 22:43:05 -0000 On 11.07.2008, at 11:58, Ernesto Revilla wrote: > Strong Etags must be supported by CS, as by RFC 4791. > > Any report method, like freebusy reports, normally do not provide =20 > etags. > > =BFCorrect? Yes. Greets, Helge --=20 Helge Hess http://helgehess.eu/= Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2370480D6F for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE2AE142247 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: 0.634 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.634 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, DNS_FROM_RFC_BOGUSMX=1.482, FH_HOST_ALMOST_IP=1.751] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5aZehLCJofpU for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from carancho.yaco.es (38.Red-80-36-82.staticIP.rima-tde.net [80.36.82.38]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21B7614223D for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 02:58:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by carancho.yaco.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 155C99E580C for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:58:49 +0200 (CEST) Received: from carancho.yaco.es ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (carancho.yaco.es [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id 14411-01-8 for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:58:48 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [192.168.11.240] (phoebe.yaco.es [192.168.11.240]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by carancho.yaco.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5C6B9E57FC for ; Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:58:48 +0200 (CEST) From: Ernesto Revilla To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Organization: Yaco Sistemas SL Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:58:35 +0200 Message-Id: <1215770315.7298.21.camel@ganso> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.12.1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new-20030616-p10 (Debian) at yaco.es Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Question about etag support for freebusy report X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 11 Jul 2008 09:58:50 -0000 Hi. Strong Etags must be supported by CS, as by RFC 4791. Any report method, like freebusy reports, normally do not provide etags. ¿Correct? Thanx. Erny Yaco Sistemas Spain Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A7777F489 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0BBC142212 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.714 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.714 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.886, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lAo2wotvBjLW for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.80]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F39314220C for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 18:12:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA04.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.35]) by QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nQWh1Z0050ldTLk580eu00; Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:12:39 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA04.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ndCX1Z00L1RyUCv3QdCczf; Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:12:37 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=0Y9A2aHLgzwA:10 a=X2-tQCzuBIsA:10 a=JzSQ9ok7AAAA:8 a=z_zqISx-AAAA:8 a=3fyaaF4VAAAA:8 a=CXA1BpdiAAAA:8 a=vHVVa43aqSLxgFDiwRkA:9 a=_bcyJkHOxvVe3qmZ5fsA:7 a=GmuumkUBBkV2tcKdA_td8-JrG0oA:4 a=gv0Kfs84wR0A:10 a=4y0hEzCCwVwA:10 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=hpF-ijbX5cwA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Reinhold Kainhofer'" , Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 21:12:36 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcjhRZik5HeA1CNeRO++3gVo/ULb2AAGm+UA In-Reply-To: <200807082357.13644.reinhold@kainhofer.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Message-Id: <20080709011240.7F39314220C@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Jul 2008 01:12:53 -0000 When you're discussing polling, you're in the realm of Atom or RSS and subscriptions, where eliminating the error message is "natural" - my RSS reader doesn't tell me when the feed has not been updated. If, however we allow VCALENDARs to be empty, a UA which imports a calendar through mechanisms other than a subscription definitely needs to warn the user. I'll have to think more deeply on this; perhaps there needs to be an iTIP- / iMIP- document to describe behaviors when iCalendar objects are consumed in ways other than mail, CalDAV, or subscriptions? Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: Reinhold Kainhofer [mailto:reinhold@kainhofer.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 5:57 PM To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Cc: Tim Hare; 'Helge Hess' Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Am Dienstag, 8. Juli 2008 schrieb Tim Hare: > OK I understand the use case now; so my only statement will be that > any UA which processes the file (please note, you do not have to > subscribe to it, it's perfectly OK to reference an .ics file via an > anchor tag and href attribute, with a file association which causes it > to be opened by a particular desktop program) MUST warn that it is empty. I don't think that should really be a MUST. If I add a remote calendar file (i.e. a URL that will be regularly polled) to my personal organizer, I simply want its events to be displayed in my UA. I don't want to be bothered with "WARNING: The calendar blahblah does not contain any events!" messages whenever the application polls the calendar. Of course, there are situations where a warning makes sense, but in other situations it is simply annoying to the user. Cheers, Reinhold - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ Reinhold Kainhofer, Vienna University of Technology, Austria email: reinhold@kainhofer.com, http://reinhold.kainhofer.com/ * Financial and Actuarial Mathematics, TU Wien, http://www.fam.tuwien.ac.at/ * K Desktop Environment, http://www.kde.org, KOrganizer maintainer * Chorvereinigung "Jung-Wien", http://www.jung-wien.at/ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIc+K5TqjEwhXvPN0RAhFTAKDZaVjsizUUSKKoklxUIb7KuHOubwCgoooA u0LAc/Z9pbOhNnBffRrsxNo= =epvS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D0F1D7F517 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94AA914222A for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -0.639 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.639 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_BL_SPAMCOP_NET=1.96] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id f1HQItjBjhJa for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from server.kainhofer.com (server.kainhofer.com [88.198.35.52]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EE5914220C for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:57:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.108.59.26] (vie-nas-ge-0-2.onenet.at [194.24.158.8]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by server.kainhofer.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0714A6EF03; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:57:14 +0200 (CEST) From: Reinhold Kainhofer Organization: Vienna University of Technology To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:57:10 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.9 References: <20080708212002.F34541421F2@laweleka.osafoundation.org> In-Reply-To: <20080708212002.F34541421F2@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200807082357.13644.reinhold@kainhofer.com> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:57:28 -0000 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Am Dienstag, 8. Juli 2008 schrieb Tim Hare: > OK I understand the use case now; so my only statement will be that any UA > which processes the file (please note, you do not have to subscribe to it, > it's perfectly OK to reference an .ics file via an anchor tag and href > attribute, with a file association which causes it to be opened by a > particular desktop program) MUST warn that it is empty. I don't think that should really be a MUST. If I add a remote calendar file (i.e. a URL that will be regularly polled) to my personal organizer, I simply want its events to be displayed in my UA. I don't want to be bothered with "WARNING: The calendar blahblah does not contain any events!" messages whenever the application polls the calendar. Of course, there are situations where a warning makes sense, but in other situations it is simply annoying to the user. Cheers, Reinhold - -- - ------------------------------------------------------------------ Reinhold Kainhofer, Vienna University of Technology, Austria email: reinhold@kainhofer.com, http://reinhold.kainhofer.com/ * Financial and Actuarial Mathematics, TU Wien, http://www.fam.tuwien.ac.at/ * K Desktop Environment, http://www.kde.org, KOrganizer maintainer * Chorvereinigung "Jung-Wien", http://www.jung-wien.at/ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIc+K5TqjEwhXvPN0RAhFTAKDZaVjsizUUSKKoklxUIb7KuHOubwCgoooA u0LAc/Z9pbOhNnBffRrsxNo= =epvS -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9D4280CEB for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6DE65142213 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.676 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.676 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.924, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6BnhO3E9X7wW for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.17]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F34541421F2 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:20:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.60]) by QMTA10.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nXhw1Z0061HzFnQ5AZJbn7; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:19:45 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nZJ41Z00H1RyUCv3aZJ9ga; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:18:09 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=0Y9A2aHLgzwA:10 a=X2-tQCzuBIsA:10 a=_etfLLVQAAAA:8 a=VgLCfYgw6jAQlL-LViEA:9 a=OQ32bPS6Xy2x9NBEqgMA:7 a=OCX1Ot8wKnVyeLUU4AdVYgkfPygA:4 a=srGwhsmx-V4A:10 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=7OmpBygbiDMA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Helge Hess'" Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:18:09 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcjhPwcycwXDm4/NT6u97mhQKH/9qQAALmDA In-Reply-To: <1C292337-6F81-4D11-BACC-83F0A7DE47F0@opengroupware.org> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Message-Id: <20080708212002.F34541421F2@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:20:22 -0000 OK I understand the use case now; so my only statement will be that any UA which processes the file (please note, you do not have to subscribe to it, it's perfectly OK to reference an .ics file via an anchor tag and href attribute, with a file association which causes it to be opened by a particular desktop program) MUST warn that it is empty. Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: Helge Hess [mailto:helge.hess@opengroupware.org] Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 5:10 PM To: Tim Hare Cc: 'Cyrus Daboo'; ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? +1, makes sense to me. On 08.07.2008, at 22:53, Tim Hare wrote: > What's the use case for publishing an empty calendar? > > Why would I want to open that file, assuming I found it using some > sort of calendar search? You do not 'open' the 'file', you subscribe it. While it may not contain events now, it might contain some in the future. Using the transport layer for this (eg HTTP 404) is not that good. The calendar actually exists and is valid, its just empty at a specific point in time. The only other option might be to return an empty resource (content- length: 0). But then the calendar component itself might have interesting meta data. Thanks, Helge PS: I'm pretty sure that most iCal tools already work that way ... -- Helge Hess http://helgehess.eu/ Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A1CA80C39 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2BBD142219 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EJ+sZw11kz3F for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.mdlink.net (medusa.mdlink.de [213.211.192.34]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 075D9142213 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:10:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.mdlink.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 310821006969; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:10:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: from ip-77-25-199-136.web.vodafone.de (ip-77-25-199-136.web.vodafone.de [77.25.199.136]) by mail.mdlink.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 482481049F73; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:10:02 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <1C292337-6F81-4D11-BACC-83F0A7DE47F0@opengroupware.org> From: Helge Hess To: "Tim Hare" In-Reply-To: <20080708205340.8EC2014220D@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v926) Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 23:09:54 +0200 References: <20080708205340.8EC2014220D@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.926) Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:10:29 -0000 +1, makes sense to me. On 08.07.2008, at 22:53, Tim Hare wrote: > What's the use case for publishing an empty calendar? > > Why would I want to open that file, assuming I found it using some > sort of > calendar search? You do not 'open' the 'file', you subscribe it. While it may not contain events now, it might contain some in the future. Using the transport layer for this (eg HTTP 404) is not that good. The calendar actually exists and is valid, its just empty at a specific point in time. The only other option might be to return an empty resource (content- length: 0). But then the calendar component itself might have interesting meta data. Thanks, Helge PS: I'm pretty sure that most iCal tools already work that way ... -- Helge Hess http://helgehess.eu/ Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3A3C80C39 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:05:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68539142219 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:05:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -2.525 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.525 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.074, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2SnVFLLCLnLY for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from daboo.name (daboo.name [151.201.22.177]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C623142212 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 14:04:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 334519FB096; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:04:55 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at daboo.name Received: from daboo.name ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (chewy.mulberrymail.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kt7xIgmsA0-Z; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:04:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from caldav.corp.apple.com (unknown [17.101.32.44]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22AFD9FB07E; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 17:04:53 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 17:04:51 -0400 From: Cyrus Daboo To: Tim Hare , ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20080708205344.7061C9FAEF7@daboo.name> References: <20080708205344.7061C9FAEF7@daboo.name> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.1.0a1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 21:05:03 -0000 Hi Tim, --On July 8, 2008 4:53:42 PM -0400 Tim Hare wrote: > What's the use case for publishing an empty calendar? > > Why would I want to open that file, assuming I found it using some sort of > calendar search? I create a new calendar on my web calendar system that exposes the calendar data as an .ics file (e.g. webcal://). I can send out the subscription URL before events are added (perhaps I am not the one who will add events, I might be the system admin and only tasked with creating calendars for other people who will author them). You want that file because at some point it will have events in it and your client will poll and pick those up. -- Cyrus Daboo Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB66380D0B for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:52 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF22C142229 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.634 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.634 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.966, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iOLGFwOTUIG3 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.32]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EC2014220D for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:53:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.36]) by QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nTrK1Z0050mv7h0530Mf00; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:53:39 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id nYtb1Z00P1RyUCv3XYtfN2; Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:53:39 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=0Y9A2aHLgzwA:10 a=X2-tQCzuBIsA:10 a=PFsjAnyDAAAA:8 a=QJY9Lxbybx8-UOSKxacA:9 a=2VPKdt_jg0sRVu2WlPcA:7 a=CtKDECqvmDauBHL5p0Tpwzg2nEUA:4 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=hpF-ijbX5cwA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Cyrus Daboo'" , Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:53:42 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcjhO1lxICR8mJ11Tdy16pOFyEluYAAAMZqA In-Reply-To: <53E80F1BDC08A6A8150ACD31@caldav.corp.apple.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Message-Id: <20080708205340.8EC2014220D@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:53:53 -0000 What's the use case for publishing an empty calendar? Why would I want to open that file, assuming I found it using some sort of calendar search? If this _were_ allowed in some future revision, then I would vote that a UA MUST warn that the file is empty when opened. No one wants to open an .ics file (say for example the schedule for the Irish National Hurling Championships) to add something to their calendar, get nothing added, and not be informed. It's already sometimes onerous when a UA opens a calendar file _with_ data but doesn't position you to, or tell you about, the first item added - you then end up hunting through calendar entries to make sure what you thought would happened did in fact happen. Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Cyrus Daboo Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2008 4:44 PM To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? Hi, (Whilst I realize it is too late for changes to 2445bis now, I think it is still worth raising issues and using the issue tracker to log problems that could be considered in a future revision - assuming Eliot does not mind leaving the tracker up). Currently both 2445 and 2445bis make it impossible to have an empty VCALENDAR object. i.e. a VCALENDAR with only properties - no components. The relevant ABNF is: icalbody = calprops component component = 1*(eventc / todoc / journalc / freebusyc / timezonec / iana-comp / x-comp) The workaround is to send a single VTIMEZONE object or a bogus X- component (perhaps BEGIN:X-2445-IS-SILLY), or a bogus "regular" component. But that seems a little silly. It should be perfectly possible for me to publish an empty calendar. Proposal: relax the restriction that a VCALENDAR object has to contain "one or more" components, to instead allow "zero or more" components, and adjust ABNF and text accordingly. -- Cyrus Daboo _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C15097F521 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8574C142213 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -2.524 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.524 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.075, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id i-mchKmC6rfN for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from daboo.name (daboo.name [151.201.22.177]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 663B5142206 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 13:43:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3B0779FAE27 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:43:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at daboo.name Received: from daboo.name ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (chewy.mulberrymail.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7M5klF-LKV3c for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:43:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from caldav.corp.apple.com (unknown [17.101.32.44]) by daboo.name (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50B4A9FAE20 for ; Tue, 8 Jul 2008 16:43:39 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 16:43:36 -0400 From: Cyrus Daboo To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Message-ID: <53E80F1BDC08A6A8150ACD31@caldav.corp.apple.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.1.0a1 (Mac OS X) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Why no empty calendar? X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Jul 2008 20:43:50 -0000 Hi, (Whilst I realize it is too late for changes to 2445bis now, I think it is still worth raising issues and using the issue tracker to log problems that could be considered in a future revision - assuming Eliot does not mind leaving the tracker up). Currently both 2445 and 2445bis make it impossible to have an empty VCALENDAR object. i.e. a VCALENDAR with only properties - no components. The relevant ABNF is: icalbody = calprops component component = 1*(eventc / todoc / journalc / freebusyc / timezonec / iana-comp / x-comp) The workaround is to send a single VTIMEZONE object or a bogus X- component (perhaps BEGIN:X-2445-IS-SILLY), or a bogus "regular" component. But that seems a little silly. It should be perfectly possible for me to publish an empty calendar. Proposal: relax the restriction that a VCALENDAR object has to contain "one or more" components, to instead allow "zero or more" components, and adjust ABNF and text accordingly. -- Cyrus Daboo Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 846D780C3F; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 558C9142234; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:22 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -3.472 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.472 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=3.126, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id j+DM8xMMfIMm; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from capricorn.notesdev.ibm.com (capricorn.notesdev.ibm.com [205.159.212.202]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50E9414222A; Sat, 5 Jul 2008 18:51:10 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <486E2B13.2090009@oracle.com> To: Bernard Desruisseaux Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #1: Use of ALTREP Message-ID: Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2008 21:51:07 -0400 From: "Robert Ransdell" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 000A2C528525747E_=" References: <1F85ABB9-62D3-4AB6-8F1D-D3B4507806A8@osafoundation.org><1213599798.9973.124.camel@little.research.nokia.com><1213610174.9973.136.camel@little.research.nokia.com><8838196F-017B-4780-B182-CFF3E37FFCDF@osafoundation.org><1214218197.9973.325.camel@little.research.nokia.com><48664825.3010907@cisco.com> <486E2B13.2090009@oracle.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-KeepSent: 2224BB28:86E023DA-8525747E:000A1EFF; name=$KeepSent; type=4 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Build V85_06262008NP June 26, 2008 X-Disclaimed: 22215 Cc: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" , ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2008 01:51:22 -0000 --=_alternative 000A2C528525747E_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Notes uses it on Description and Comment. From: Bernard Desruisseaux To: Eliot Lear Cc: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" Date: 07/04/2008 09:56 AM Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #1: Use of ALTREP Sent by: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org I don't believe the current proposal is appropriate. As it stands, the draft (RFC2445 as well) makes it clear that ALTREP is=20 only allowed on 6 specific text properties, that is, COMMENT,=20 DESCRIPTION, LOCATION, RESOURCES, SUMMARY, and CONTACT. I also believe=20 the meaning of ALTREP is already properly defined. In practice though, I'm not sure there is a single calendar user agent=20 that exposes it (i.e., allow an end user to set its value, or make use=20 of it). Finally, the following search on the web will only report two iCalendar=20 objects that makes use of ALTREP! http://www.google.com/search?q=3DALTREP+filetype%3Aics In the past we've discussed limiting the URI schemes allowed for=20 CAL-ADDRESS but never got around to it. Perhaps we should limit the URI=20 schemed allowed both for ALTREP and CAL-ADDRESS (two sets) while we're=20 at it. On the other hand, when applications while actually start making use of=20 ALTREP, I suspect the media type of the resource being pointed at might=20 be the real interop issue (e.g., http URL pointing to an XHTML, HTML,=20 PDF, PNG, or JPG document). Cheers, Bernard Eliot Lear wrote: > Am I correct in that this issue is to be resolved as below? Are there=20 > any objections? >=20 > Eliot >=20 > Lisa Dusseault wrote: >> >> On Jun 23, 2008, at 3:49 AM, Aki Niemi wrote: >> >>> May I suggest an alternative approach? Since the list of "known" uses=20 of >>> ALTREP can actually be narrowed down to about three, I think we should >>> add to the definition of each of these properties exactly what it=20 means >>> to receive one with the ALTREP parameter that contains an HTTP URL. >>> Other URIs permitted, but their meaning is undefined. In other words, >>> document current practice as much as we can, but keep further uses=20 open. >>> >>> And then to ALTREP parameter, add the description you propose, as >>> generic advice to how the parameter should be handled/used. >> >> +1 >> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >=20 >=20 =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify --=_alternative 000A2C528525747E_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Notes uses it on Description and Com= ment.


From:Bernard Desruisseaux <bernard.desruisseaux@oracle.com&g= t;
To:Eliot Lear <lear@= cisco.com>
Cc:"iet= f-calsify@osafoundation.org" <ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org>
Date:07/04/2008 09:56 AM
Subject:[Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #1: Use of ALTREP
Sent by:ietf= -calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org



I don't believe the current proposal is appropriate.
As it stands, the draft (RFC2445 as well) makes it clear that ALTREP = is
only allowed on 6 specific text properties, that is, COMMENT,
DESCR= IPTION, LOCATION, RESOURCES, SUMMARY, and CONTACT. I also believe
the meaning of ALTREP is already properly defined.

In practice t= hough, I'm not sure there is a single calendar user agent
that exposes it (i.e., allow an end user to set its value, or make use
of it).

Finally, the following search on the web will only repor= t two iCalendar
objects that makes use of ALTREP!

http://= www.google.com/search?q=3DALTREP+filetype%3Aics

In the past we've discussed limiting the URI schemes allowed= for
CAL-ADDRESS but never got around to it.  Perhaps we should li= mit the URI
schemed allowed both for ALTREP and CAL-ADDRESS (two sets) while we= 're
at it.

On the other hand, when applications while actually start= making use of
ALTREP, I suspect the media type of the resource being pointed at might
be the real interop issue (e.g., http URL pointing to an XHTML, HTML, <= br>PDF, PNG, or JPG document).

Cheers,
Bernard

Eliot Lear = wrote:
> Am I correct in that this issue is to be resolved as below? =  Are there
> any objections?
>
> Eliot
>
> Lisa= Dusseault wrote:
>>
>> On Jun 23, 2008, at 3:49 AM, Aki = Niemi wrote:
>>
>>> May I suggest an alternative appro= ach? Since the list of "known" uses of
>>> ALTREP can actually be narrowed down to about three= , I think we should
>>> add to the definition of each of these properties= exactly what it means
>>> to receive one with the ALTREP parameter that= contains an HTTP URL.
>>> Other URIs permitted, but their meaning is undefi= ned. In other words,
>>> document current practice as much as we can, but kee= p further uses open.
>>>
>>> And then to ALTREP parameter, ad= d the description you propose, as
>>> generic advice to how the parameter should be handled/us= ed.
>>
>> +1
>> =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
>> Ietf-calsify mailing list<= br>>> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org
>> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify
>>
>
>

=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F= =5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F=5F
Ietf-calsif= y mailing list
Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org
http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify



--=_alternative 000A2C528525747E_=-- Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05A8580B5E for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D083814222A for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.588 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.588 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=1.012, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hROWCjJs9zpj for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.32]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97276142229 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 13:17:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA12.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.44]) by QMTA03.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id ltao1Z05y0xGWP8530CF00; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 20:17:20 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA12.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id lwHE1Z00B1RyUCv3YwHLKq; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 20:17:20 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=hX2h3j9qUEwA:10 a=n7_MfodNLFUA:10 a=PFsjAnyDAAAA:8 a=bibtB-wvEzaBVA88f0cA:9 a=o6I5eGVYNT1dALLB1A0A:7 a=B-q0h8oJBkOtrTpSa1OqXft2kwYA:4 a=7DSvI1NPTFQA:10 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=gi0PWCVxevcA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Bernard Desruisseaux'" , "'Eliot Lear'" Subject: RE: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2008 16:17:17 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: Acjd58c+MVJORahHQjmrd9Uil6E3IQAKvCNQ X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 In-Reply-To: <486E3C4C.3070404@oracle.com> Message-Id: <20080704201721.97276142229@laweleka.osafoundation.org> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 20:17:34 -0000 I can't speak for Lisa, but the export/import scenario is one place where b) applies. If by "Internet calendar" you mean an .ics file that is opened via browser, that is also an 'import' scenario I think. Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: Bernard Desruisseaux [mailto:bernard.desruisseaux@oracle.com] Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 11:06 AM To: Eliot Lear Cc: Tim Hare; ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) It's not clear to me what Lisa is suggesting actually. a) Warning about the fact that components type can be mixed? b) Not to ignore unsupported component types silently? Proposed text would be great! Things that should be noted: 1- iTIP does not allow different component types to be mixed. 2- CalDAV provides means to get only the components types that you want. As such, in practice we will only see mixed component types in export scenarios and Internet calendars (aka, webcal). Cheers, Bernard Eliot Lear wrote: > I believe we have consensus as to Lisa's suggestion. Any disagreement? > > Eliot > > Tim Hare wrote: >> As an "informed user" - i.e. not a developer, I definitely support >> NON-silent rejection. I can agree with non-support of certain >> components only if I receive some notification; due to work >> requirements I am now journalling my time on some projects, and it >> would be good to know if I can't import that data into another tool. >> >> >> Tim Hare >> Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org >> [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Cyrus >> Daboo >> Sent: Monday, June 16, 2008 12:33 PM >> To: Lisa Dusseault >> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org; Bernard Desruisseaux >> Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in >> thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review >> on2445bis) >> >> Hi Lisa, >> >> --On June 16, 2008 9:25:14 AM -0700 Lisa >> Dusseault >> wrote: >> >> >>>> The suggestion of an implementation note that describes the "common >>>> use" of the components and explains that some may be supported and >>>> others not is fine. In fact telling implementors that they need to >>>> be prepared for another system to reject a component would be good. >>>> >>> I can get behind that. I'd also like to recommend that systems not >>> reject a component silently -- a user needs to know if they imported >>> a iCalendar file and lost 50 VJOURNAL components in the process. >>> >> >> Agreed. >> >> Note that iTIP does have a status code for "Unsupported Component" >> (3.13) - >> so informing the originator of the iCalendar data that they are >> sending something that is not supported by the recipient is covered by that. >> >> -- >> Cyrus Daboo >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 838317F5E3 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B57A14221D for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.44 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.44 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.159, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RsBrXZDjxFgH for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com (rgminet01.oracle.com [148.87.113.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A2DE7142215 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:08:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m64F7jUc028665; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 09:07:45 -0600 Received: from acsmt350.oracle.com (acsmt350.oracle.com [141.146.40.150]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m642vZX0005809; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 09:07:45 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt350.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703666801215183950; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 08:05:50 -0700 Message-ID: <486E3C4C.3070404@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 11:05:48 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eliot Lear Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in thesame iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) References: <20080617164740.C7897142202@laweleka.osafoundation.org> <48664868.1040307@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <48664868.1040307@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 15:08:24 -0000 It's not clear to me what Lisa is suggesting actually. a) Warning about the fact that components type can be mixed? b) Not to ignore unsupported component types silently? Proposed text would be great! Things that should be noted: 1- iTIP does not allow different component types to be mixed. 2- CalDAV provides means to get only the components types that you want. As such, in practice we will only see mixed component types in export scenarios and Internet calendars (aka, webcal). Cheers, Bernard Eliot Lear wrote: > I believe we have consensus as to Lisa's suggestion. Any disagreement? > > Eliot > > Tim Hare wrote: >> As an "informed user" - i.e. not a developer, I definitely support >> NON-silent rejection. I can agree with non-support of certain components >> only if I receive some notification; due to work requirements I am now >> journalling my time on some projects, and it would be good to know if I >> can't import that data into another tool. >> >> >> Tim Hare >> Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org >> [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Cyrus Daboo >> Sent: Monday, June 16, 2008 12:33 PM >> To: Lisa Dusseault >> Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org; Bernard Desruisseaux >> Subject: Re: AD review issue #4: Supporting both VTODO and VEVENT in >> thesame >> iCalendar stream (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on2445bis) >> >> Hi Lisa, >> >> --On June 16, 2008 9:25:14 AM -0700 Lisa >> Dusseault >> wrote: >> >> >>>> The suggestion of an implementation note that describes the "common >>>> use" of the components and explains that some may be supported and >>>> others not is fine. In fact telling implementors that they need to be >>>> prepared for another system to reject a component would be good. >>>> >>> I can get behind that. I'd also like to recommend that systems not >>> reject a component silently -- a user needs to know if they imported a >>> iCalendar file and lost 50 VJOURNAL components in the process. >>> >> >> Agreed. >> >> Note that iTIP does have a status code for "Unsupported Component" >> (3.13) - >> so informing the originator of the iCalendar data that they are sending >> something that is not supported by the recipient is covered by that. >> >> -- >> Cyrus Daboo >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D681B80C9F; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACD5614221D; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.423 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.423 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.176, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aNsb0YGXPup5; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com (rgminet01.oracle.com [148.87.113.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 328171421FD; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:47:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw2.us.oracle.com (agmgw2.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.213]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m64ElOEO005231; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:47:24 -0600 Received: from acsmt351.oracle.com (acsmt351.oracle.com [141.146.40.151]) by agmgw2.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m63J5KlS008351; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:47:24 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt350.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703583571215182794; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 07:46:34 -0700 Message-ID: <486E37C9.4090005@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 10:46:33 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Aki Niemi Subject: Re: AD review issue #3: Meaning of RELTYPE parameter value of SIBLING (was: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review on 2445bis) References: <1F85ABB9-62D3-4AB6-8F1D-D3B4507806A8@osafoundation.org> <1213599798.9973.124.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <1213610775.9973.151.camel@little.research.nokia.com> In-Reply-To: <1213610775.9973.151.camel@little.research.nokia.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 14:47:41 -0000 While I was about to propose that we deprecate SIBLING I found cases where it might be handy in the future... 1- Group multiple to-dos that don't have a parent to-do. Not a very important use cases I think... 2- When breaking an unbounded recurring events in two events (i.e., the truncated unbounded recurring events for past recurrence instances, and a new unbounded recurring event for the "new" future recurrence instances), it might be useful to link the events together with this relationship. Cheers, Bernard Aki Niemi wrote: > ma, 2008-06-16 kello 10:03 +0300, ext Aki Niemi kirjoitti: >>> Section 3.2.15: RELTYPE. What does it mean that a calendar component >>> referenced is the SIBLING of this one? How is a user agent supposed >>> to use this information? Is this parameter ever used except on >>> RELATED-TO? Is it actually in use even there? Health warnings at >>> least. > > Good question. Is there a use case that requires a relationship beyond > parent-child (which currently is the only *defined* relationship in the > document anyway)? > > Cheers, > Aki > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB1F080C9F; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A24F014221D; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.405 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.405 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.194, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3l+uSkL-5xKM; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agminet01.oracle.com (agminet01.oracle.com [141.146.126.228]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C1A5142219; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:04:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by agminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id m64E4S92028391; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 09:04:28 -0500 Received: from acsmt351.oracle.com (acsmt351.oracle.com [141.146.40.151]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m64A15Ph002424; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:04:28 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt351.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703558401215180150; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 07:02:30 -0700 Message-ID: <486E2D74.8060605@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 10:02:28 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Cyrus Daboo References: <1F85ABB9-62D3-4AB6-8F1D-D3B4507806A8@osafoundation.org> <1213599798.9973.124.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <1213610352.9973.140.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <51FFA90ACFC532EAE4DC9862@caldav.corp.apple.com> In-Reply-To: <51FFA90ACFC532EAE4DC9862@caldav.corp.apple.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #2: DIR parameter X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 14:04:43 -0000 Cyrus Daboo wrote: > Hi Aki, > > --On June 16, 2008 12:59:12 PM +0300 Aki Niemi wrote: > >>> > Section 3.2.6, DIR parameter: This should be limited to LDAP URLs >>> > only, if not by requirement then at least by noting that other types >>> > of URLs are likely to be harmful to interoperability. >> >> For maximum interoperability, a mandatory-to-implement choice should be >> defined. However, is LDAP even widely enough supported in iCalendar >> implementations to justify this? I suspect vCardDAV URLs could in the >> future start appearing here as well. > > I think at the very least HTTP/HTTPS needs to be allowed as well. > cid and mid would be needed in the context of iMIP. Here's a proposal for the mandatory-to-implement: cid data (e.g., to embed vCard directly?) file ftp http https ldap mid Cheers, Bernard Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E789B7F635; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEBC8142219; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -2.403 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.403 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=0.196, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id j1syP+3coNFq; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com (rgminet01.oracle.com [148.87.113.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D0A314221D; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:52:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m64DqMDa032551; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:52:23 -0600 Received: from acsmt350.oracle.com (acsmt350.oracle.com [141.146.40.150]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m641cgU0004575; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:52:22 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt351.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703555821215179541; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 06:52:21 -0700 Message-ID: <486E2B13.2090009@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 09:52:19 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Eliot Lear References: <1F85ABB9-62D3-4AB6-8F1D-D3B4507806A8@osafoundation.org> <1213599798.9973.124.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <1213610174.9973.136.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <8838196F-017B-4780-B182-CFF3E37FFCDF@osafoundation.org> <1214218197.9973.325.camel@little.research.nokia.com> <48664825.3010907@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <48664825.3010907@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: "ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org" Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Re: AD review issue #1: Use of ALTREP X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 13:52:47 -0000 I don't believe the current proposal is appropriate. As it stands, the draft (RFC2445 as well) makes it clear that ALTREP is only allowed on 6 specific text properties, that is, COMMENT, DESCRIPTION, LOCATION, RESOURCES, SUMMARY, and CONTACT. I also believe the meaning of ALTREP is already properly defined. In practice though, I'm not sure there is a single calendar user agent that exposes it (i.e., allow an end user to set its value, or make use of it). Finally, the following search on the web will only report two iCalendar objects that makes use of ALTREP! http://www.google.com/search?q=ALTREP+filetype%3Aics In the past we've discussed limiting the URI schemes allowed for CAL-ADDRESS but never got around to it. Perhaps we should limit the URI schemed allowed both for ALTREP and CAL-ADDRESS (two sets) while we're at it. On the other hand, when applications while actually start making use of ALTREP, I suspect the media type of the resource being pointed at might be the real interop issue (e.g., http URL pointing to an XHTML, HTML, PDF, PNG, or JPG document). Cheers, Bernard Eliot Lear wrote: > Am I correct in that this issue is to be resolved as below? Are there > any objections? > > Eliot > > Lisa Dusseault wrote: >> >> On Jun 23, 2008, at 3:49 AM, Aki Niemi wrote: >> >>> May I suggest an alternative approach? Since the list of "known" uses of >>> ALTREP can actually be narrowed down to about three, I think we should >>> add to the definition of each of these properties exactly what it means >>> to receive one with the ALTREP parameter that contains an HTTP URL. >>> Other URIs permitted, but their meaning is undefined. In other words, >>> document current practice as much as we can, but keep further uses open. >>> >>> And then to ALTREP parameter, add the description you propose, as >>> generic advice to how the parameter should be handled/used. >> >> +1 >> _______________________________________________ >> Ietf-calsify mailing list >> Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org >> http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify >> > > Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6F9D780C50 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:53 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 46D1114220D for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.385 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.385 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.214, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iQQ+K1+pj2KV for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rgminet01.oracle.com (rgminet01.oracle.com [148.87.113.118]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D58AC14220E for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:07:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by rgminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.6) with ESMTP id m64D7ZKA011959; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:07:36 -0600 Received: from acsmt351.oracle.com (acsmt351.oracle.com [141.146.40.151]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m64CV2Df029192; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:07:35 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt350.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703538481215176811; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 06:06:51 -0700 Message-ID: <486E206A.30507@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 09:06:50 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oliver Block Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] Duration Value Type References: <486D46F2.80102@block-online.eu> In-Reply-To: <486D46F2.80102@block-online.eu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 13:07:53 -0000 Oliver Block wrote: > Hello everybody, > > I'd like to draw your attention to the following text: > > When computing an exact duration, the greatest order time > components MUST be added first, that is, the number of weeks MUST > be added first, followed by the number of days, number of hours, > number of minutes, and number of seconds. > > The syntax is defined as follows: > > dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" (dur-date / dur-time / dur-week) > > dur-date = dur-day [dur-time] > dur-time = "T" (dur-hour / dur-minute / dur-second) > dur-week = 1*DIGIT "W" > dur-hour = 1*DIGIT "H" [dur-minute] > dur-minute = 1*DIGIT "M" [dur-second] > dur-second = 1*DIGIT "S" > dur-day = 1*DIGIT "D" > > As far as I've understood the meaning of RFC2445 (not the latest draft) > and also of the syntax above, the use of week excludes the use of > dur-date and also of dur-time. (I don't know if there is a need of a > mixed form of in real life time planning.) So if you want to allow > dur-week AND dur-date/dur-time within the same value, you need to change > the ABNF to, for example > > dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" [dur-week] (dur-date / dur-time) > > or for example > > dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" (dur-date / dur-time / dur-week) > ... > dur-week = 1*DIGIT "W" [dur-date] > ... > > If not, you need to change the text: > > When computing an exact duration, the greatest order time > components MUST be added first, that is, the number of days MUST > be added first, followed number of hours, number of minutes, and > number > of seconds. +1 Good catch. Thanks, Bernard > > Additionally there could be added an explicit statement if weeks and > day/time are both to be used in a Duration value. > > > Do you agree? > > > Best Regards, > > Oliver Block > > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1B6F80C50 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B92E414220E for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -4.366 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.366 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=2.233, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 77zOeQNjQbqb for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agminet01.oracle.com (agminet01.oracle.com [141.146.126.228]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1F6614220D for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 06:05:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from agmgw1.us.oracle.com (agmgw1.us.oracle.com [152.68.180.212]) by agminet01.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.4/Switch-3.1.7) with ESMTP id m64D5Yu8032365; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 08:05:34 -0500 Received: from acsmt351.oracle.com (acsmt351.oracle.com [141.146.40.151]) by agmgw1.us.oracle.com (Switch-3.2.0/Switch-3.2.0) with ESMTP id m64CvSSs003758; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 07:05:33 -0600 Received: from dhcp-montreal-17fl-utilca-10-156-43-80.ca.oracle.com by acsmt350.oracle.com with ESMTP id 3703538131215176683; Fri, 04 Jul 2008 06:04:43 -0700 Message-ID: <486E1FE9.30808@oracle.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 09:04:41 -0400 From: Bernard Desruisseaux User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Oliver Block Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY References: <200807060003.03834.lists@block-online.eu> In-Reply-To: <200807060003.03834.lists@block-online.eu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Brightmail-Tracker: AAAAAQAAAAI= X-Whitelist: TRUE X-Whitelist: TRUE Cc: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 13:05:52 -0000 Hi Oliver, This is issue 67. http://www.ofcourseimright.com/cgi-bin/roundup/calsify/issue67 Resolution is to disallow DURATION in VFREEBUSY components. Check logs starting at [12:59:07]: http://jabber.ietf.org/logs/calsify/2008-03-11.txt Or the minutes of IETF71: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/08mar/minutes/calsify.txt > Consensus on issue 67 is to go with option a): Remove statement from RFC2445bis. Cheers, Bernard Oliver Block wrote: > Am Freitag, 4. Juli 2008 00:23:28 schrieben Sie: >> I believe DTSTART and DTEND specify the endpoints of the "specified window >> of time" and DURATION the amount of time requested, in a free time request. >> >> In English "I need to find an hour of your free time sometime between 11:00 >> on 07/03/20008 and 17:00 on 07/11/2008". > > That's a good point. > > Best Regards, > > Oliver Block > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-calsify mailing list > Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org > http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify > Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEF267F5BA for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5987142217 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.001 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.001 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=-1.598, BAYES_00=-2.599, DATE_IN_FUTURE_24_48=3.196] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bRfC3aLzw-I4 for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h1307246.stratoserver.net (block-online.eu [85.214.68.33]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9130E1421FB for ; Fri, 4 Jul 2008 05:03:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 14301 invoked from network); 4 Jul 2008 14:03:24 +0200 Received: from dslb-092-072-070-218.pools.arcor-ip.net (HELO localhost) (92.72.70.218) by block-online.eu with (DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 4 Jul 2008 14:03:24 +0200 From: Oliver Block To: "Tim Hare" , ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: Re: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY Date: Sun, 6 Jul 2008 00:03:03 +0200 User-Agent: KMail/1.9.9 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline Message-Id: <200807060003.03834.lists@block-online.eu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 12:03:35 -0000 Am Freitag, 4. Juli 2008 00:23:28 schrieben Sie: > I believe DTSTART and DTEND specify the endpoints of the "specified window > of time" and DURATION the amount of time requested, in a free time request. > > In English "I need to find an hour of your free time sometime between 11:00 > on 07/03/20008 and 17:00 on 07/11/2008". That's a good point. Best Regards, Oliver Block Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 922D37F517 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6731D1421FD for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -1.537 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.537 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[AWL=1.063, BAYES_00=-2.599, SPF_PASS=-0.001] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uy05g+8hrfim for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.80]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 883D41421FC for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 15:23:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.60]) by QMTA08.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id lP431Z0081HzFnQ580YW00; Thu, 03 Jul 2008 22:23:32 +0000 Received: from THare ([71.203.105.66]) by OMTA14.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id laPT1Z0071RyUCv3aaPXYV; Thu, 03 Jul 2008 22:23:32 +0000 X-Authority-Analysis: v=1.0 c=1 a=PFsjAnyDAAAA:8 a=ZZJJydU43dLOefVpqY8A:9 a=RZrMXBkRNw9lfc-6h_0A:7 a=khAxDC76M_8YuFDb3FN52xLDhAAA:4 a=YewFc9KQ5U8A:10 a=gi0PWCVxevcA:10 From: "Tim Hare" To: "'Oliver Block'" , Subject: RE: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2008 18:23:28 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.6353 Thread-Index: AcjdCtJvBYYfcPn+Qv+awujdX2TYPgAUFyKg X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 In-Reply-To: <486E8BF9.5010501@block-online.eu> Message-Id: <20080703222333.883D41421FC@laweleka.osafoundation.org> X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 22:23:45 -0000 I believe DTSTART and DTEND specify the endpoints of the "specified window of time" and DURATION the amount of time requested, in a free time request. In English "I need to find an hour of your free time sometime between 11:00 on 07/03/20008 and 17:00 on 07/11/2008". Tim Hare Interested Bystander, Non-Inc. -----Original Message----- From: ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org [mailto:ietf-calsify-bounces@osafoundation.org] On Behalf Of Oliver Block Sent: Friday, July 04, 2008 4:46 PM To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Subject: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY Hello everybody, In Sec. 3.6.4. you can find the following about the properties dtend and duration: 1. ABNF: ; the following are OPTIONAL, ; but MUST NOT occur more than once ... / dtend / duration / ... 2. Text: In a free time request, these properties can be used in combination with the "DURATION" property to represent a request for a duration of free time within a specified window of time. Is it intended that 'dtend' and 'duration' my both occur in a VFREEBUSY component? Or shouldn't they be mutually exclusive? Best Regards, Oliver Block _______________________________________________ Ietf-calsify mailing list Ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org http://lists.osafoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-calsify Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D90967FDFE for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B43D7142213 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tc1iU4vutOm4 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h1307246.stratoserver.net (block-online.eu [85.214.68.33]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99C431421FB for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 14:39:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 12095 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2008 23:39:01 +0200 Received: from dslb-092-072-070-218.pools.arcor-ip.net (HELO ?192.168.1.33?) (92.72.70.218) by block-online.eu with (DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 3 Jul 2008 23:39:01 +0200 Message-ID: <486D46F2.80102@block-online.eu> Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 23:38:58 +0200 From: Oliver Block User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Ietf-calsify] Duration Value Type X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 21:39:13 -0000 Hello everybody, I'd like to draw your attention to the following text: When computing an exact duration, the greatest order time components MUST be added first, that is, the number of weeks MUST be added first, followed by the number of days, number of hours, number of minutes, and number of seconds. The syntax is defined as follows: dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" (dur-date / dur-time / dur-week) dur-date = dur-day [dur-time] dur-time = "T" (dur-hour / dur-minute / dur-second) dur-week = 1*DIGIT "W" dur-hour = 1*DIGIT "H" [dur-minute] dur-minute = 1*DIGIT "M" [dur-second] dur-second = 1*DIGIT "S" dur-day = 1*DIGIT "D" As far as I've understood the meaning of RFC2445 (not the latest draft) and also of the syntax above, the use of week excludes the use of dur-date and also of dur-time. (I don't know if there is a need of a mixed form of in real life time planning.) So if you want to allow dur-week AND dur-date/dur-time within the same value, you need to change the ABNF to, for example dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" [dur-week] (dur-date / dur-time) or for example dur-value = (["+"] / "-") "P" (dur-date / dur-time / dur-week) ... dur-week = 1*DIGIT "W" [dur-date] ... If not, you need to change the text: When computing an exact duration, the greatest order time components MUST be added first, that is, the number of days MUST be added first, followed number of hours, number of minutes, and number of seconds. Additionally there could be added an explicit statement if weeks and day/time are both to be used in a Duration value. Do you agree? Best Regards, Oliver Block Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Delivered-To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org (laweleka.osafoundation.org [204.152.186.98]) by leilani.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D954580CDD for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id B2A33142217 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new and clamav at osafoundation.org X-Spam-Score: 0.597 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.597 tagged_above=-50 required=4 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, DATE_IN_FUTURE_24_48=3.196] Received: from laweleka.osafoundation.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (laweleka.osafoundation.org [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YQpRC5pwpge1 for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h1307246.stratoserver.net (block-online.eu [85.214.68.33]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by laweleka.osafoundation.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81DD614220E for ; Thu, 3 Jul 2008 05:46:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 32332 invoked from network); 3 Jul 2008 14:46:02 +0200 Received: from dslb-088-077-069-084.pools.arcor-ip.net (HELO ?192.168.1.34?) (88.77.69.84) by block-online.eu with (DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted) SMTP; 3 Jul 2008 14:46:02 +0200 Message-ID: <486E8BF9.5010501@block-online.eu> Date: Fri, 04 Jul 2008 22:45:45 +0200 From: Oliver Block User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.14 (Windows/20080421) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Ietf-calsify] VFREEBUSY X-BeenThere: ietf-calsify@osafoundation.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "RFC2445, 2446 and 2447 Discusions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 03 Jul 2008 12:46:14 -0000 Hello everybody, In Sec. 3.6.4. you can find the following about the properties dtend and duration: 1. ABNF: ; the following are OPTIONAL, ; but MUST NOT occur more than once ... / dtend / duration / ... 2. Text: In a free time request, these properties can be used in combination with the "DURATION" property to represent a request for a duration of free time within a specified window of time. Is it intended that 'dtend' and 'duration' my both occur in a VFREEBUSY component? Or shouldn't they be mutually exclusive? Best Regards, Oliver Block