From ietf-nomcom-errors@lists.elistx.com Mon Feb 24 17:45:07 2003 Return-Path: Received: from ELIST-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAU0030446ROZ@eListX.com> (original mail from avri@acm.org); Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:37:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAU0030146QOX@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:37:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from DIRECTORY-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAU0030146POW@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:37:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from lakecmmtao02.coxmail.com (lakecmmtao02.coxmail.com [68.99.120.61]) by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) with ESMTP id <0HAU00JPZ46PGU@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:37:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from acm.org ([68.15.42.104]) by lakecmmtao02.coxmail.com (InterMail vM.5.01.04.05 201-253-122-122-105-20011231) with ESMTP id <20030224223702.RATD11973.lakecmmtao02.coxmail.com@acm.org> for ; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:37:02 -0500 Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 17:35:09 -0500 From: Avri Doria Subject: IETF56 Meeting slot for Nomcom WG To: ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com Message-id: <3E5A9E1D.5050801@acm.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en-us, en User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.2) Gecko/20021120 Netscape/7.01 List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: , List-Id: Hi, Shortly, draft-ietf-nomcom-rfc2727bis-03.txt will be available on the ID sites. I think it covers the remaining issues. > 1. The "superior candidate" definition was moved to be with its one and only use in the document. > 2. The eligibility qualifications for the nominating committee was changed to require attendance at 3 out of 5 of the last five meetings, to require volunteers to submit identifying contact information, and to request that volunteers be familiar with IETF processes and procedures. > 3. The method used to select volunteers is now required to produce an ordered list of volunteers. > 4. The process for selecting the 10 voting volunteers had several clarifications and additional requirements added, including a challenge process and the requirement to disallow more than two volunteers with the same primary affiliation. > 5. The process for recalling a sitting member of the IAB and IESG now requires at least 20 eligible members of the IETF community to sign a petition requesting the recall. I have not yet requested a meeting slot for SF. Partially because the current draft was not ready until now, partly because I did not think there were any open issues that needed to be discussed and partly because the list has been very quiet of late. I am hoping, in fact that this version of the draft is ready for WG last call. I do have a few hours left for requesting a meeting slot. If anyone has an agenda item that they believe needs a meeting slot, please speak up immediately. Apologies for waiting until the last minute to make this request. a. From ietf-nomcom-errors@lists.elistx.com Mon Feb 24 23:35:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from ELIST-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAU00J04KIP3C@eListX.com> (original mail from galvin+ietf-nomcom@elistx.com); Mon, 24 Feb 2003 23:30:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAU00J01KIP38@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Mon, 24 Feb 2003 23:30:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from DIRECTORY-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAU00J01KIO37@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Mon, 24 Feb 2003 23:30:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost (one.elistx.com [209.116.252.130]) by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) with ESMTP id <0HAU00I5VKIM0B@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com; Mon, 24 Feb 2003 23:30:24 -0500 (EST) Date: Mon, 24 Feb 2003 23:29:56 -0500 (Eastern Standard Time) From: James M Galvin Subject: Re: IETF56 Meeting slot for Nomcom WG In-reply-to: <3E5A9E1D.5050801@acm.org> To: ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII References: <3E5A9E1D.5050801@acm.org> List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: , List-Id: On Mon, 24 Feb 2003, Avri Doria wrote: Shortly, draft-ietf-nomcom-rfc2727bis-03.txt will be available on the ID sites. Given the timing and likely delay I have placed a copy of the draft alongside the archive: http://lists.elistx.com/archives/ietf-nomcom/draft-ietf-nomcom-rfc2727bis-03.txt Note that that URL has no spaces or line breaks in it. Jim From ietf-nomcom-errors@lists.elistx.com Thu Feb 27 05:55:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from ELIST-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAY00C04RECND@eListX.com> (original mail from brian@hursley.ibm.com) ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 05:49:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAY00C01RECNB@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 05:49:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from DIRECTORY-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAY00C01REBNA@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 05:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from d12lmsgate-5.de.ibm.com (d12lmsgate-5.de.ibm.com [194.196.100.238]) by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) with ESMTP id <0HAY0084TRE7P0@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 05:49:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from d12relay02.de.ibm.com (d12relay02.de.ibm.com [9.165.215.23]) by d12lmsgate-5.de.ibm.com (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1RAmfb0079856 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 11:48:41 +0100 Received: from ochsehorn.zurich.ibm.com (ochsehorn.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.140]) by d12relay02.de.ibm.com (8.12.3/NCO/VER6.5) with SMTP id h1RAmWId044900 for ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 11:48:34 +0100 Received: from dhcp23-27.zurich.ibm.com by ochsehorn.zurich.ibm.com (AIX 4.3/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA21704 from ; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 11:48:31 +0100 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 11:47:36 +0100 From: Brian E Carpenter Subject: Question on draft-ietf-nomcom-rfc2727bis-03.txt To: ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com Message-id: <3E5DECC8.B9B7EE3@hursley.ibm.com> Organization: IBM MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr,de References: <3E5A9E1D.5050801@acm.org> List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: , List-Id: Hi, I'll send some typos and editos direct to Jim, but I did have one question that might be substantive. See rule 11 in section 5: > Nominating committee members are not eligible to be considered > for filling any open position. They become ineligible as soon > as the term of the nominating committee on which they serve > officially begins. They remain ineligible for the duration of > that nominating committee's term. Nomcom N overlaps by about 3 months with Nomcom N+1. Due to this overlap, is a member of Nomcom N ineligible for nomination by Nomcom N+1? As I read the timeline, there are probably a few hours or days after the Third IETF when a member of Nomcom N would become eligible, i.e. after Nomcom N is dissolved but before nominations close. Is this correct? Whatever the answer, I think the document should state it. To put it another way, is it our intention that Nomcom members are immunized for one year or two years? Brian Avri Doria wrote: > > Hi, > > Shortly, draft-ietf-nomcom-rfc2727bis-03.txt will be > available on the ID sites. I think it covers the > remaining issues. > > > 1. The "superior candidate" definition was moved to be with its one > and only use in the document. > > > 2. The eligibility qualifications for the nominating committee was > changed to require attendance at 3 out of 5 of the last five > meetings, to require volunteers to submit identifying contact > information, and to request that volunteers be familiar with IETF > processes and procedures. > > > 3. The method used to select volunteers is now required to produce > an ordered list of volunteers. > > > 4. The process for selecting the 10 voting volunteers had several > clarifications and additional requirements added, including a > challenge process and the requirement to disallow more than two > volunteers with the same primary affiliation. > > > 5. The process for recalling a sitting member of the IAB and IESG > now requires at least 20 eligible members of the IETF community to > sign a petition requesting the recall. > > I have not yet requested a meeting slot for SF. > Partially because the current draft was not ready > until now, partly because I did not think there > were any open issues that needed to be discussed and > partly because the list has been very quiet of late. > I am hoping, in fact that this version of the draft > is ready for WG last call. > > I do have a few hours left for requesting a meeting > slot. If anyone has an agenda item that they believe > needs a meeting slot, please speak up immediately. > > Apologies for waiting until the last minute to make > this request. > > a. > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > To subscribe or unsubscribe from this elist use the subscription > manager: -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Brian E Carpenter Distinguished Engineer, Internet Standards & Technology, IBM On assignment at the IBM Zurich Laboratory, Switzerland From ietf-nomcom-errors@lists.elistx.com Thu Feb 27 11:05:01 2003 Return-Path: Received: from ELIST-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAZ00A045OWFZ@eListX.com> (original mail from tytso@thunk.org); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:58:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAZ00A015OVFX@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:58:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from DIRECTORY-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAZ00A015OVFW@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:58:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from thunker.thunk.org (thunk.org [140.239.227.29]) by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) with ESMTP id <0HAZ001BE5OUBC@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:58:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from [216.175.175.162] (helo=think.thunk.org) authenticated as tytso by thunker.thunk.org with asmtp (tls_cipher TLSv1:DES-CBC3-SHA:168) (tls_peerdn /C=US/ST=Massachusetts/L=Medford/O=Thunking Systems/OU=SMTP-client/CN=think.thunk.org/Email=tytso@thunk.org) (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18oQNg-0002Ce-00; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:55:32 -0500 Received: from tytso authenticated as tytso by think.thunk.org with local (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 18oQNf-0000om-00; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:55:31 -0500 Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 10:55:31 -0500 From: Theodore Ts'o Subject: Re: Question on draft-ietf-nomcom-rfc2727bis-03.txt In-reply-to: <3E5DECC8.B9B7EE3@hursley.ibm.com> To: Brian E Carpenter Cc: ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com Message-id: <20030227155531.GR24322@think.thunk.org> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.4i References: <3E5A9E1D.5050801@acm.org> <3E5DECC8.B9B7EE3@hursley.ibm.com> List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: , List-Id: On Thu, Feb 27, 2003 at 11:47:36AM +0100, Brian E Carpenter wrote: > See rule 11 in section 5: > > > Nominating committee members are not eligible to be considered > > for filling any open position. They become ineligible as soon > > as the term of the nominating committee on which they serve > > officially begins. They remain ineligible for the duration of > > that nominating committee's term. > > Nomcom N overlaps by about 3 months with Nomcom N+1. Due to this overlap, > is a member of Nomcom N ineligible for nomination by Nomcom N+1? As I read > the timeline, there are probably a few hours or days after the Third IETF > when a member of Nomcom N would become eligible, i.e. after Nomcom N is > dissolved but before nominations close. Is this correct? Whatever the > answer, I think the document should state it. > > To put it another way, is it our intention that Nomcom members are > immunized for one year or two years? I would argue one year was the original intent of the wording; it was just perhaps a bit too clumsy. How about the following rewording, which I believe is clearer and conforms with the original intent? Nominating committee members are not eligible to be considered for filling any open position by the nominating committee on which they serve. They shall remain ineligible even if they are resign or are removed from the nominating committee. - Ted From ietf-nomcom-errors@lists.elistx.com Thu Feb 27 12:15:02 2003 Return-Path: Received: from ELIST-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAZ00F04920UZ@eListX.com> (original mail from ekr@rtfm.com); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:10:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAZ00F01920UX@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:10:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from DIRECTORY-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HAZ00F0191ZUW@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:10:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from romeo.rtfm.com (romeo.rtfm.com [198.144.203.242]) by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) with ESMTP id <0HAZ00MJD91YV3@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 12:10:47 -0500 (EST) Received: by romeo.rtfm.com (Postfix, from userid 556) id 7694FAB5C; Thu, 27 Feb 2003 09:15:06 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 27 Feb 2003 09:15:06 -0800 From: Eric Rescorla Subject: Re: Question on draft-ietf-nomcom-rfc2727bis-03.txt In-reply-to: <3E5DECC8.B9B7EE3@hursley.ibm.com> Sender: ekr@romeo.rtfm.com To: Brian E Carpenter Cc: ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com Reply-to: EKR Message-id: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii User-Agent: Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) XEmacs/21.1 (Cuyahoga Valley) Lines: 25 References: <3E5A9E1D.5050801@acm.org> <3E5DECC8.B9B7EE3@hursley.ibm.com> List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: , List-Id: Brian E Carpenter writes: > See rule 11 in section 5: > > > Nominating committee members are not eligible to be considered > > for filling any open position. They become ineligible as soon > > as the term of the nominating committee on which they serve > > officially begins. They remain ineligible for the duration of > > that nominating committee's term. > > Nomcom N overlaps by about 3 months with Nomcom N+1. Due to this overlap, > is a member of Nomcom N ineligible for nomination by Nomcom N+1? As I read > the timeline, there are probably a few hours or days after the Third IETF > when a member of Nomcom N would become eligible, i.e. after Nomcom N is > dissolved but before nominations close. Is this correct? Whatever the > answer, I think the document should state it. > > To put it another way, is it our intention that Nomcom members are > immunized for one year or two years? Unless we're changing existing practice, it must be one year. Otherwise, the liasons could not be nominated the following term, making nomcom liason a ticket out of the IESG/IAB. Or have I missed something? -Ekr From ietf-nomcom-errors@lists.elistx.com Fri Feb 28 03:25:10 2003 Return-Path: Received: from ELIST-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HB000L04F40DH@eListX.com> (original mail from brian@hursley.ibm.com) ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 03:19:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from CONVERSION-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HB000L01F3ZDF@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Fri, 28 Feb 2003 03:19:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from DIRECTORY-DAEMON.eListX.com by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) id <0HB000L01F3ZDE@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@elist.lists.elistx.com (ORCPT ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com); Fri, 28 Feb 2003 03:19:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from d12lmsgate-4.de.ibm.com (d12lmsgate-4.de.ibm.com [194.196.100.237]) by eListX.com (PMDF V6.0-025 #44856) with ESMTP id <0HB000HHHF3TPX@eListX.com> for ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 03:19:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from d12relay02.de.ibm.com (d12relay02.de.ibm.com [9.165.215.23]) by d12lmsgate-4.de.ibm.com (8.12.3/8.12.3) with ESMTP id h1S8ITLD037798; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:18:30 +0100 Received: from ochsehorn.zurich.ibm.com (ochsehorn.zurich.ibm.com [9.4.16.140]) by d12relay02.de.ibm.com (8.12.3/NCO/VER6.5) with SMTP id h1S8IMsa066736; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:18:23 +0100 Received: from dhcp23-27.zurich.ibm.com by ochsehorn.zurich.ibm.com (AIX 4.3/UCB 5.64/4.03) id AA38788 from ; Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:18:20 +0100 Date: Fri, 28 Feb 2003 09:17:25 +0100 From: Brian E Carpenter Subject: Re: Question on draft-ietf-nomcom-rfc2727bis-03.txt To: EKR Cc: ietf-nomcom@lists.elistx.com Message-id: <3E5F1B15.9727074C@hursley.ibm.com> Organization: IBM MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.79 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-Accept-Language: en,fr,de References: <3E5A9E1D.5050801@acm.org> <3E5DECC8.B9B7EE3@hursley.ibm.com> List-Owner: List-Post: List-Subscribe: , List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Help: , List-Id: Eric Rescorla wrote: > > Brian E Carpenter writes: > > See rule 11 in section 5: > > > > > Nominating committee members are not eligible to be considered > > > for filling any open position. They become ineligible as soon > > > as the term of the nominating committee on which they serve > > > officially begins. They remain ineligible for the duration of > > > that nominating committee's term. > > > > Nomcom N overlaps by about 3 months with Nomcom N+1. Due to this overlap, > > is a member of Nomcom N ineligible for nomination by Nomcom N+1? As I read > > the timeline, there are probably a few hours or days after the Third IETF > > when a member of Nomcom N would become eligible, i.e. after Nomcom N is > > dissolved but before nominations close. Is this correct? Whatever the > > answer, I think the document should state it. > > > > To put it another way, is it our intention that Nomcom members are > > immunized for one year or two years? > Unless we're changing existing practice, it must be one year. > > Otherwise, the liasons could not be nominated the following > term, making nomcom liason a ticket out of the IESG/IAB. > > Or have I missed something? I completely agree with you and Ted. But I think this needs an extra sentence to clarify it, such as: Although each nominating committee's term overlaps with the following nominating committee's activity, the timeline is such that members of a given committee are eligible for nomination by the following committee, if not otherwise disqualified. (and maybe a related note is needed in the timeline Appendix). Brian