From charles.perkins@earthlink.net Fri May 14 10:56:18 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 640843A69F3 for ; Fri, 14 May 2010 10:56:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.193 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.193 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.427, BAYES_50=0.001, RCVD_IN_SORBS_WEB=0.619] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 29FuYxCwlmvf for ; Fri, 14 May 2010 10:56:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 893B43A6948 for ; Fri, 14 May 2010 10:56:17 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=ezJAYfXgxLt/hs/wSfAv0gJ/m409HfcBz58knm82yKdnVb3COnZvDTxZlu9nLwYK; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:Organization:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [12.204.153.98] (helo=[10.166.254.143]) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1OCz7H-0000AT-3e; Fri, 14 May 2010 13:56:08 -0400 Message-ID: <4BED8EB1.5060708@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 10:56:01 -0700 From: "Charles E. Perkins" Organization: Wichorus Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100317 Thunderbird/3.0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: autoconf@ietf.org References: <4B032CDD.9090803@wichorus.com> <008101ca687f$8c592c30$a50b8490$@nl> In-Reply-To: <008101ca687f$8c592c30$a50b8490$@nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ELNK-Trace: 137d7d78656ed6919973fd6a8f21c4f2d780f4a490ca6956abb457f1b4332f52756b8fdc95946a8d937e13058dcec3af350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 12.204.153.98 Subject: Re: [Autoconf] [Fwd: New Version Notification fordraft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-03] X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 14 May 2010 17:56:18 -0000 Hello folks, With Teco's permission, I am relaying this technical exchange to the mailing list. Emmanuel and I expect to submit a revised draft soon. We hope that the working group will be interested to accept it as a working group document. Regards, Charlie P. ==================================================== Hello Teco, I hope you'll appreciate the timeliness of this response :-) Is it O.K. if I forward the technical substance of your email here to the mailing list? On 11/18/2009 10:46 AM, Teco Boot wrote: > Hi, > > I've two remarks: > > 1: Exposed node. ... > The problem is *prevented from sending*. > The text below Figure 2 is OK. > The text above is not correct, also confirmed by Thomas. > The current text: > Even > though node C cannot hear D, node D can nevertheless hear C, because > node D is outside node A's radio range. As shown, the exposed node > problem is a practical example of the asymmetry of multi-hop ad hoc > wireless communications mentioned in Section 2.1. > - It is not "cannot hear", the ENP is "prohibited to send". > - ENP has nothing to do with asymmetry Thanks for your patient attempts to correct this problem with the draft. I have reformulated the section under discussion in a way that I hope is correct. I also added a new paragraph and figure that does illustrate asymmetry, under the example condition of unequal transmission power. > 2: The DAD trigger. > We came to the conclusion to clean up the addressing model on LLs. > The DAD trigger is true, but it has nothing to do with the model > itself. And there is no trigger for non-LL DAD also. > But by removing the "there is no link down trigger", we lose the > description of this behavior. > I suggest to add this behavior in the multi-hop-wireless-communication > draft. I discussed this with few others at IETF, all confirmed this was > a good relocation. Some said that this behavior also occurs in other > link types (e.g. FrameRelay: short cable end-node to FR switch is always > up, but FR may have some troubles). There are many other examples. But > still, I think it occurs in MANET normal operation and therefore it is > worth mentioning in your draft. Emmanuel is going to take a crack at inserting some text for this, I believe. It is a matter somewhat "unlike" the other problems discussed in our draft, but if it has been discussed by others and no one objects, I am O.K. with including it. However, if people object, I am also O.K. with taking it back out. Regards, Charlie P. From charles.perkins@earthlink.net Mon May 17 13:33:55 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BF2D28C159 for ; Mon, 17 May 2010 13:33:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.164 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.164 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.021, BAYES_40=-0.185] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZvapO1njDbig for ; Mon, 17 May 2010 13:33:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from elasmtp-junco.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-junco.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.63]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4710A28C15E for ; Mon, 17 May 2010 13:30:29 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=YYtgtm0kGyMib5Y4rk3fTAcDmk8CwZfzlosWRhvZflRVKGjSy2Bh4fQJmmizo7sz; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:Organization:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [12.204.153.98] (helo=[10.166.254.143]) by elasmtp-junco.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1OE6x8-0005pJ-PN; Mon, 17 May 2010 16:30:18 -0400 Message-ID: <4BF1A758.5030607@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 13:30:16 -0700 From: "Charles E. Perkins" Organization: Wichorus Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100317 Thunderbird/3.0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Teco Boot References: <4B032CDD.9090803@wichorus.com> <008101ca687f$8c592c30$a50b8490$@nl> In-Reply-To: <008101ca687f$8c592c30$a50b8490$@nl> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ELNK-Trace: 137d7d78656ed6919973fd6a8f21c4f2d780f4a490ca6956abb457f1b4332f525f732bd8e8c7609e8cc53408ee1d7882350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 12.204.153.98 Cc: autoconf@ietf.org, 'Emmanuel Baccelli' Subject: Re: [Autoconf] [Fwd: New Version Notification fordraft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-03] X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 17 May 2010 20:33:55 -0000 Hello Teco, On 11/18/2009 10:46 AM, Teco Boot wrote: > The DAD trigger is true, but it has nothing to do with the model > itself. And there is no trigger for non-LL DAD also. > But by removing the "there is no link down trigger", we lose the > description of this behavior. How about this text from the new revision to be published? ....... For example, there may be no indication to IP when a previously established communication channel becomes unusable. In other words, "link down" triggers are often absent in wireless systems. This lack can potentially break various assumptions that have been used for features designed for wired communication links, and cause failures or poor performance. Regards, Charlie P. From charles.perkins@earthlink.net Mon May 24 15:42:37 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C2A613A67AB for ; Mon, 24 May 2010 15:42:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.073 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.073 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.074, BAYES_50=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6WD-ByYdi++y for ; Mon, 24 May 2010 15:42:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.61]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E12483A63C9 for ; Mon, 24 May 2010 15:42:36 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=Q2+rYtTC78ZHoIAKp3UYtse5RNT00ollspS+eEPVYzrbNrGoGWj542PkAmv8loGa; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:Organization:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:Subject:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [12.204.153.98] (helo=[10.166.254.135]) by elasmtp-galgo.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1OGgLs-0001f7-E1 for autoconf@ietf.org; Mon, 24 May 2010 18:42:29 -0400 Message-ID: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 15:42:23 -0700 From: "Charles E. Perkins" Organization: Wichorus Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100317 Thunderbird/3.0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "autoconf@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ELNK-Trace: 137d7d78656ed6919973fd6a8f21c4f2d780f4a490ca6956abb457f1b4332f52d073de0c5d3ffb71fd672be4528574ee350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 12.204.153.98 Subject: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 22:42:37 -0000 Hello folks, We have submitted a revised version of the draft with some significant corrections. Here is a URL for the revision: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04.txt Would there be interest in the working group to accept this as a working group document? Regards, Charlie P. -------- Original Message -------- Subject: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 17:38:38 -0500 From: IETF I-D Submission Tool To: Perkins, Charles CC: A new version of I-D, draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04.txt has been successfully submitted by Charles Perkins and posted to the IETF repository. Filename: draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication Revision: 04 Title: Multi-hop Ad Hoc Wireless Communication Creation_date: 2010-05-24 WG ID: Independent Submission Number_of_pages: 9 Abstract: This document describes some important characteristics of communication between nodes in a multi-hop ad hoc wireless network. These are not requirements in the sense usually understood as applying to formulation of a requirements document. Nevertheless, protocol engineers and system analysts involved with designing solutions for ad hoc networks must maintain awareness of these characteristics. The IETF Secretariat. From ryuji.wakikawa@gmail.com Mon May 24 16:47:39 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD8B33A67F6 for ; Mon, 24 May 2010 16:47:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EI3JvvXtcLpc for ; Mon, 24 May 2010 16:47:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pv0-f172.google.com (mail-pv0-f172.google.com [74.125.83.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9EAD3A67DB for ; Mon, 24 May 2010 16:47:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pva18 with SMTP id 18so1091661pva.31 for ; Mon, 24 May 2010 16:47:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:subject:mime-version :content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:content-transfer-encoding :message-id:references:to:x-mailer; bh=OpI4BEwF8Atqr8G1qsFe4qxGseuRjGqFvOWRL8HbdK4=; b=qFF0a0LGQB4vD8ZC8y1gkEeKQcLZe43MYTi+eH0M7jJEh3F7xZ7g9Loqza/tFCq26B PhK51MvRVjQsMUDGlOn3aDGqXRq7mFLeCeTx31VWdkAkJ9jf8PSj94w+kKXqC7KKmJu8 yV7Fk0AR/twnZUN1lK8s4ixagOIxO+gvV28Cc= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=subject:mime-version:content-type:from:in-reply-to:date:cc :content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references:to:x-mailer; b=Mo2nqEe+e1RHXnxlhOT5lPXRONz9aStqVzPdH1NzT4SQ/fC6SXRpJRPEqykrT9kB+J uPJr+adPpl2gD9WAF2RHko7ZSDiT3VMckaguH4CYGbc2OHfjPF6p3QW0eI8p33YpyOwl Qd67M8SNcSZkpRPl2SlMinDKACGvgcB9vKzbQ= Received: by 10.140.55.17 with SMTP id d17mr4622271rva.209.1274744848403; Mon, 24 May 2010 16:47:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.18.100] (adsl-99-49-9-50.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net [99.49.9.50]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id b12sm3604697rvn.10.2010.05.24.16.47.24 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Mon, 24 May 2010 16:47:25 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1078) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ryuji Wakikawa In-Reply-To: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 16:47:22 -0700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <1439431B-E3C6-4C4A-8DDB-1D2E263591CE@gmail.com> References: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> To: Charles E. Perkins X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1078) Cc: "autoconf@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 23:47:39 -0000 Thanks, Charlie for the updates. Apologize chair's delay for updating the charter and sharing it. We will share the new draft charter and move the discussion forward. regards, ryuji On 2010/05/24, at 15:42, Charles E. Perkins wrote: >=20 > Hello folks, >=20 > We have submitted a revised version of the draft > with some significant corrections. Here is a URL > for the revision: > = http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-comm= unication-04.txt >=20 > Would there be interest in the working group to > accept this as a working group document? >=20 > Regards, > Charlie P. >=20 >=20 > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: New Version Notification for = draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 > Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 17:38:38 -0500 > From: IETF I-D Submission Tool > To: Perkins, Charles > CC: >=20 >=20 > A new version of I-D, = draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04.txt has been = successfully submitted by Charles Perkins and posted to the IETF = repository. >=20 > Filename: draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication > Revision: 04 > Title: Multi-hop Ad Hoc Wireless Communication > Creation_date: 2010-05-24 > WG ID: Independent Submission > Number_of_pages: 9 >=20 > Abstract: > This document describes some important characteristics of > communication between nodes in a multi-hop ad hoc wireless network. > These are not requirements in the sense usually understood as > applying to formulation of a requirements document. Nevertheless, > protocol engineers and system analysts involved with designing > solutions for ad hoc networks must maintain awareness of these > characteristics. >=20 >=20 >=20 > The IETF Secretariat. >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Autoconf mailing list > Autoconf@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf From cjbc@it.uc3m.es Tue May 25 11:08:58 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4193F3A6991 for ; Tue, 25 May 2010 11:08:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.449 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.449 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.350, BAYES_50=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cwJRHErRjfZM for ; Tue, 25 May 2010 11:08:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp03.uc3m.es (smtp03.uc3m.es [163.117.176.133]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 444D83A699D for ; Tue, 25 May 2010 11:08:50 -0700 (PDT) X-uc3m-safe: yes Received: from [163.117.139.72] (acorde.it.uc3m.es [163.117.139.72]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp03.uc3m.es (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7333A72D79A; Tue, 25 May 2010 20:08:35 +0200 (CEST) From: Carlos =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jes=FAs?= Bernardos Cano To: "Charles E. Perkins" In-Reply-To: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> References: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha1"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="=-94o5JcwN2Sd7aCqPnnxy" Organization: Universidad Carlos III de Madrid Date: Tue, 25 May 2010 20:09:10 +0200 Message-ID: <1274810950.3135.247.camel@acorde.it.uc3m.es> Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Evolution 2.28.3 X-TM-AS-Product-Ver: IMSS-7.0.0.3116-6.0.0.1038-17406.000 Cc: "autoconf@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: cjbc@it.uc3m.es List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 25 May 2010 18:08:58 -0000 --=-94o5JcwN2Sd7aCqPnnxy Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-15" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Charlie, I support this kind of document. I think it's useful. I still have to do my homework and read it carefully to provide feedback. Thanks, Carlos On Mon, 2010-05-24 at 15:42 -0700, Charles E. Perkins wrote: > Hello folks, >=20 > We have submitted a revised version of the draft > with some significant corrections. Here is a URL > for the revision: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-co= mmunication-04.txt >=20 > Would there be interest in the working group to > accept this as a working group document? >=20 > Regards, > Charlie P. >=20 >=20 > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: New Version Notification for=20 > draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 > Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 17:38:38 -0500 > From: IETF I-D Submission Tool > To: Perkins, Charles > CC: >=20 >=20 > A new version of I-D,=20 > draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04.txt has been=20 > successfully submitted by Charles Perkins and posted to the IETF reposito= ry. >=20 > Filename: draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication > Revision: 04 > Title: Multi-hop Ad Hoc Wireless Communication > Creation_date: 2010-05-24 > WG ID: Independent Submission > Number_of_pages: 9 >=20 > Abstract: > This document describes some important characteristics of > communication between nodes in a multi-hop ad hoc wireless network. > These are not requirements in the sense usually understood as > applying to formulation of a requirements document. Nevertheless, > protocol engineers and system analysts involved with designing > solutions for ad hoc networks must maintain awareness of these > characteristics. > =20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > The IETF Secretariat. >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Autoconf mailing list > Autoconf@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf --=20 Carlos Jes=FAs Bernardos Cano http://www.netcoms.net GPG FP: D29B 0A6A 639A A561 93CA 4D55 35DC BA4D D170 4F67 --=-94o5JcwN2Sd7aCqPnnxy Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: This is a digitally signed message part -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) iEYEABECAAYFAkv8EkYACgkQNdy6TdFwT2cUvACfRHEb7MCD7KDZHS0hpiIFawko 42kAnjg9wZ2pBIEkwm5KWINwzHFZURQl =TZZq -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --=-94o5JcwN2Sd7aCqPnnxy-- From teco@inf-net.nl Wed May 26 05:27:28 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 310413A6905 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 05:27:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.001 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.001 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kXD1jFOIReU1 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 05:27:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ew0-f216.google.com (mail-ew0-f216.google.com [209.85.219.216]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 696ED3A6908 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 05:27:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ewy8 with SMTP id 8so32019ewy.28 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 05:27:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.213.20.132 with SMTP id f4mr1225593ebb.23.1274876834213; Wed, 26 May 2010 05:27:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.2.171] (ip56530916.direct-adsl.nl [86.83.9.22]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id 14sm21777ewy.6.2010.05.26.05.27.12 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Wed, 26 May 2010 05:27:13 -0700 (PDT) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1078) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Teco Boot In-Reply-To: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 14:27:11 +0200 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <3F22BBC2-A41A-4A6F-8913-263497810A86@inf-net.nl> References: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> To: Charles E. Perkins X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1078) Cc: "autoconf@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 12:27:28 -0000 I support this document being published as RFC. Could be done as WG document, no problems with alternative way. Regards, Teco Op 25 mei 2010, om 00:42 heeft Charles E. Perkins het volgende = geschreven: >=20 > Hello folks, >=20 > We have submitted a revised version of the draft > with some significant corrections. Here is a URL > for the revision: > = http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-comm= unication-04.txt >=20 > Would there be interest in the working group to > accept this as a working group document? >=20 > Regards, > Charlie P. >=20 >=20 > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: New Version Notification for = draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 > Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 17:38:38 -0500 > From: IETF I-D Submission Tool > To: Perkins, Charles > CC: >=20 >=20 > A new version of I-D, = draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04.txt has been = successfully submitted by Charles Perkins and posted to the IETF = repository. >=20 > Filename: draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication > Revision: 04 > Title: Multi-hop Ad Hoc Wireless Communication > Creation_date: 2010-05-24 > WG ID: Independent Submission > Number_of_pages: 9 >=20 > Abstract: > This document describes some important characteristics of > communication between nodes in a multi-hop ad hoc wireless network. > These are not requirements in the sense usually understood as > applying to formulation of a requirements document. Nevertheless, > protocol engineers and system analysts involved with designing > solutions for ad hoc networks must maintain awareness of these > characteristics. >=20 >=20 >=20 > The IETF Secretariat. >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Autoconf mailing list > Autoconf@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf From A.Ramrekha@kingston.ac.uk Wed May 26 05:42:59 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58C3E3A687C for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 05:42:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Z+eWRRN5ZJt7 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 05:42:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail57.messagelabs.com (mail57.messagelabs.com [195.245.230.115]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D31313A691D for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 05:42:57 -0700 (PDT) X-VirusChecked: Checked X-Env-Sender: A.Ramrekha@kingston.ac.uk X-Msg-Ref: server-2.tower-57.messagelabs.com!1274877767!48255892!1 X-StarScan-Version: 6.2.4; banners=kingston.ac.uk,-,- X-Originating-IP: [141.241.22.28] Received: (qmail 3744 invoked from network); 26 May 2010 12:42:47 -0000 Received: from kuexim6.king.ac.uk (HELO kuexim6.king.ac.uk) (141.241.22.28) by server-2.tower-57.messagelabs.com with DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP; 26 May 2010 12:42:47 -0000 Received: from kucahtpr02.kingston.ac.uk ([141.241.71.36] helo=KUCAHTPR02.kuds.kingston.ac.uk) by kuexim6.king.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1OHFwc-0003VM-4F; Wed, 26 May 2010 13:42:46 +0100 Received: from KUMBX.kuds.kingston.ac.uk ([141.241.71.40]) by KUCAHTPR02 ([141.241.71.36]) with mapi; Wed, 26 May 2010 13:42:14 +0100 From: "Ramrekha, Arvind" To: Charles E.Perkins Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 13:42:12 +0100 Thread-Topic: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 Thread-Index: Acr8zt3XIepBJqkyTV+oe76qYRPq6QAAdPbw Message-ID: <31FA0235108C2F43A69AEC26D34E28010189A736350D@KUMBX.kuds.kingston.ac.uk> References: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> <3F22BBC2-A41A-4A6F-8913-263497810A86@inf-net.nl> In-Reply-To: <3F22BBC2-A41A-4A6F-8913-263497810A86@inf-net.nl> Accept-Language: en-US, en-GB Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US, en-GB Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "autoconf@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 12:42:59 -0000 I would also support accepting this as a working group document. Kind regards Arvind. -----Original Message----- From: autoconf-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:autoconf-bounces@ietf.org] On Beha= lf Of Teco Boot Sent: 26 May 2010 13:27 To: Charles E.Perkins Cc: autoconf@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-m= ulti-hop-wireless-communication-04 I support this document being published as RFC. Could be done as WG document, no problems with alternative way. Regards, Teco Op 25 mei 2010, om 00:42 heeft Charles E. Perkins het volgende geschreven:= >=20 > Hello folks, >=20 > We have submitted a revised version of the draft > with some significant corrections. Here is a URL > for the revision: > =09http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless= -communication-04.txt >=20 > Would there be interest in the working group to > accept this as a working group document? >=20 > Regards, > Charlie P. >=20 >=20 > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-= communication-04 > Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 17:38:38 -0500 > From: IETF I-D Submission Tool > To: Perkins, Charles > CC: >=20 >=20 > A new version of I-D, draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04= .txt has been successfully submitted by Charles Perkins and posted to the = IETF repository. >=20 > Filename:=09 draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication > Revision:=09 04 > Title:=09=09 Multi-hop Ad Hoc Wireless Communication > Creation_date:=09 2010-05-24 > WG ID:=09=09 Independent Submission > Number_of_pages: 9 >=20 > Abstract: > This document describes some important characteristics of > communication between nodes in a multi-hop ad hoc wireless network. > These are not requirements in the sense usually understood as > applying to formulation of a requirements document. Nevertheless, > protocol engineers and system analysts involved with designing > solutions for ad hoc networks must maintain awareness=20of these > characteristics. >=20 >=20 >=20 > The IETF Secretariat. >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Autoconf mailing list > Autoconf@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf _______________________________________________ Autoconf mailing list Autoconf@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. This email has been scanned for all viruses by the MessageLabs Email Security System. From paul@marvell.com Wed May 26 10:34:23 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1422C3A66B4 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 10:34:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OsbqY+jcPwMC for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 10:34:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dakia2.marvell.com (dakia2.marvell.com [65.219.4.35]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A2553A6805 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 10:34:22 -0700 (PDT) X-ASG-Debug-ID: 1274895252-44a46ada0001-tL4nV1 Received: from MSI-MTA.marvell.com (msi-mta.marvell.com [10.68.76.91]) by dakia2.marvell.com with ESMTP id kFhIEO9076pzWsc0; Wed, 26 May 2010 10:34:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Barracuda-Envelope-From: paul@marvell.com Received: from sc-owa01.marvell.com ([10.93.76.21]) by MSI-MTA.marvell.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Wed, 26 May 2010 10:34:12 -0700 Received: from SC-vEXCH2.marvell.com ([10.93.76.134]) by SC-OWA01.marvell.com ([10.93.76.21]) with mapi; Wed, 26 May 2010 10:34:12 -0700 From: Paul Lambert To: Teco Boot , Charles E.Perkins Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 10:34:10 -0700 X-ASG-Orig-Subj: RE: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 Thread-Topic: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-ASG-Orig-Subj: RE: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 Thread-Index: Acr8zs1frlgbJ5ruQ/SV2uBG12HRkQAKaiLg Message-ID: <7BAC95F5A7E67643AAFB2C31BEE662D013D5626F13@SC-VEXCH2.marvell.com> References: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> <3F22BBC2-A41A-4A6F-8913-263497810A86@inf-net.nl> In-Reply-To: <3F22BBC2-A41A-4A6F-8913-263497810A86@inf-net.nl> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 May 2010 17:34:12.0427 (UTC) FILETIME=[A7B629B0:01CAFCF9] X-Barracuda-Connect: msi-mta.marvell.com[10.68.76.91] X-Barracuda-Start-Time: 1274895252 X-Barracuda-URL: http://10.68.76.222:80/cgi-mod/mark.cgi X-Barracuda-Spam-Score: -1002.00 X-Barracuda-Spam-Status: No, SCORE=-1002.00 using global scores of TAG_LEVEL=1000.0 QUARANTINE_LEVEL=1000.0 KILL_LEVEL=1000.0 Cc: "autoconf@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 17:34:23 -0000 I find this document misleading and confusing in that it does not mention t= he use of link layer acknowledgments. It assumes one particular link layer= service type and does not indicate that it is only referring to unacknowle= dged transmission. Radio links that require ACKs are symmetric.=20 Paul > -----Original Message----- > From: autoconf-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:autoconf-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf Of Teco Boot > Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2010 5:27 AM > To: Charles E.Perkins > Cc: autoconf@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli- > multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 >=20 > I support this document being published as RFC. > Could be done as WG document, no problems with alternative way. > Regards, Teco >=20 > Op 25 mei 2010, om 00:42 heeft Charles E. Perkins het volgende geschreven= : >=20 > > > > Hello folks, > > > > We have submitted a revised version of the draft > > with some significant corrections. Here is a URL > > for the revision: > > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-baccelli-multi-hop- > wireless-communication-04.txt > > > > Would there be interest in the working group to > > accept this as a working group document? > > > > Regards, > > Charlie P. > > > > > > -------- Original Message -------- > > Subject: New Version Notification for draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless= - > communication-04 > > Date: Mon, 24 May 2010 17:38:38 -0500 > > From: IETF I-D Submission Tool > > To: Perkins, Charles > > CC: > > > > > > A new version of I-D, draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication- > 04.txt has been successfully submitted by Charles Perkins and posted to > the IETF repository. > > > > Filename: draft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication > > Revision: 04 > > Title: Multi-hop Ad Hoc Wireless Communication > > Creation_date: 2010-05-24 > > WG ID: Independent Submission > > Number_of_pages: 9 > > > > Abstract: > > This document describes some important characteristics of > > communication between nodes in a multi-hop ad hoc wireless network. > > These are not requirements in the sense usually understood as > > applying to formulation of a requirements document. Nevertheless, > > protocol engineers and system analysts involved with designing > > solutions for ad hoc networks must maintain awareness of these > > characteristics. > > > > > > > > The IETF Secretariat. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Autoconf mailing list > > Autoconf@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Autoconf mailing list > Autoconf@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/autoconf From charles.perkins@earthlink.net Wed May 26 10:51:46 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A7B03A686A for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 10:51:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.001 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.001 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IEYarbIfe+d8 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 10:51:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF3023A67CF for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 10:51:45 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=earthlink.net; b=mQXv5UAaXmnsyJGVbR/Xa9mrBWPOmZYhsmFFVJiUNTUZxUO/SRgYNGUQLYvos952; h=Received:Message-ID:Date:From:Organization:User-Agent:MIME-Version:To:CC:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [12.204.153.98] (helo=[10.166.254.150]) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1OHKlS-00020m-VP; Wed, 26 May 2010 13:51:35 -0400 Message-ID: <4BFD5FA5.80404@earthlink.net> Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 10:51:33 -0700 From: "Charles E. Perkins" Organization: Wichorus Inc. User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.1.9) Gecko/20100317 Thunderbird/3.0.4 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Paul Lambert References: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> <3F22BBC2-A41A-4A6F-8913-263497810A86@inf-net.nl> <7BAC95F5A7E67643AAFB2C31BEE662D013D5626F13@SC-VEXCH2.marvell.com> In-Reply-To: <7BAC95F5A7E67643AAFB2C31BEE662D013D5626F13@SC-VEXCH2.marvell.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ELNK-Trace: 137d7d78656ed6919973fd6a8f21c4f2d780f4a490ca6956abb457f1b4332f52df100603d599506c0e83a12bd564a389350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 12.204.153.98 Cc: autoconf@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification fordraft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 17:51:46 -0000 Hello Paul On 5/26/2010 10:34 AM, Paul Lambert wrote: > I find this document misleading and confusing in that it does not > mention the use of link layer acknowledgments. It assumes one > particular link layer service type and does not indicate that it > is only referring to unacknowledged transmission. I don't think this omission causes the entire document to be misleading and/or confusing. Plus, it is a problem easily solved. Would you like to propose some text that would (a) mention link-layer acknowledgements, and (b) eliminate the confusion that you found? I haven't checked with Emmanuel, but speaking only for myself I'd be happy to support the update. > Radio links that require ACKs are symmetric. What about multicast? Regards, Charlie P. From paul@marvell.com Wed May 26 11:31:35 2010 Return-Path: X-Original-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: autoconf@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 197DF3A69B1 for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 11:31:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.67 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.67 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.930, BAYES_20=-0.74] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ez2fzArmMtTK for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 11:31:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from dakia2.marvell.com (dakia2.marvell.com [65.219.4.35]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF08D3A680C for ; Wed, 26 May 2010 11:31:33 -0700 (PDT) X-ASG-Debug-ID: 1274898684-449d6c000001-tL4nV1 Received: from MSI-MTA.marvell.com (msi-mta.marvell.com [10.68.76.91]) by dakia2.marvell.com with ESMTP id fhHbaQWHhsAOgTLX; Wed, 26 May 2010 11:31:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Barracuda-Envelope-From: paul@marvell.com Received: from sc-owa02.marvell.com ([10.93.76.22]) by MSI-MTA.marvell.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Wed, 26 May 2010 11:31:24 -0700 Received: from SC-vEXCH2.marvell.com ([10.93.76.134]) by sc-owa02.marvell.com ([10.93.76.22]) with mapi; Wed, 26 May 2010 11:31:24 -0700 From: Paul Lambert To: "Charles E. Perkins" Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 11:31:23 -0700 X-ASG-Orig-Subj: RE: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification fordraft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 Thread-Topic: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification fordraft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-ASG-Orig-Subj: RE: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification fordraft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 Thread-Index: Acr8/CAJYnkzmbXjSemiHGGRH+WJHQAAxtgQ Message-ID: <7BAC95F5A7E67643AAFB2C31BEE662D013D5626F6D@SC-VEXCH2.marvell.com> References: <4BFB00CF.7040701@earthlink.net> <3F22BBC2-A41A-4A6F-8913-263497810A86@inf-net.nl> <7BAC95F5A7E67643AAFB2C31BEE662D013D5626F13@SC-VEXCH2.marvell.com> <4BFD5FA5.80404@earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <4BFD5FA5.80404@earthlink.net> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 May 2010 18:31:24.0433 (UTC) FILETIME=[A558B810:01CAFD01] X-Barracuda-Connect: msi-mta.marvell.com[10.68.76.91] X-Barracuda-Start-Time: 1274898684 X-Barracuda-URL: http://10.68.76.222:80/cgi-mod/mark.cgi X-Barracuda-Spam-Score: -1002.00 X-Barracuda-Spam-Status: No, SCORE=-1002.00 using global scores of TAG_LEVEL=1000.0 QUARANTINE_LEVEL=1000.0 KILL_LEVEL=1000.0 Cc: "autoconf@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification fordraft-baccelli-multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 X-BeenThere: autoconf@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Ad-Hoc Network Autoconfiguration WG discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 26 May 2010 18:31:35 -0000 Yes - easily solved with a sentence or two somewhere ... the base terminolo= gy and models are useful. It's just that most shorter distance wireless te= chnologies (like 802.11) have acknowledgment based reliability.=20 Wireless links are typically not open-loop, but have feedback with acks tha= t provide reliability and indications of the link connectivity. =20 > What about multicast? There are now reliable multicast mechanisms (802.11aa). These are not comm= on (yet), but would have the same considerations and would always be symmet= ric. =20 Perhaps a sentence or two that mentions acknowledged versus unacknowledged = link layers - and that the asymmetric behavior described is for unacknowled= ged link layer frames.=20 Hope this helps ... Paul PS - sorry for the not very timely comment ... I lurk on this list infreque= ntly > -----Original Message----- > From: Charles E. Perkins [mailto:charles.perkins@earthlink.net] > Sent: Wednesday, May 26, 2010 10:52 AM > To: Paul Lambert > Cc: Teco Boot; autoconf@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Autoconf] Fwd: New Version Notification fordraft-baccelli- > multi-hop-wireless-communication-04 >=20 >=20 > Hello Paul >=20 > On 5/26/2010 10:34 AM, Paul Lambert wrote: >=20 > > I find this document misleading and confusing in that it does not > > mention the use of link layer acknowledgments. It assumes one > > particular link layer service type and does not indicate that it > > is only referring to unacknowledged transmission. >=20 > I don't think this omission causes the entire > document to be misleading and/or confusing. > Plus, it is a problem easily solved. >=20 > Would you like to propose some text that would > (a) mention link-layer acknowledgements, and > (b) eliminate the confusion that you found? > I haven't checked with Emmanuel, but speaking > only for myself I'd be happy to support the update. >=20 > > Radio links that require ACKs are symmetric. >=20 > What about multicast? >=20 > Regards, > Charlie P.