From nobody Mon Nov 14 16:57:12 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C63731295F5 for ; Mon, 14 Nov 2016 16:57:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.449 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.449 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CEelRy88Gxvh for ; Mon, 14 Nov 2016 16:57:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-it0-x22e.google.com (mail-it0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c0b::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5CA74129452 for ; Mon, 14 Nov 2016 16:57:08 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-it0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id q124so137897257itd.1 for ; Mon, 14 Nov 2016 16:57:08 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=gOREkAavhvHG1TNYLmbBSWrUjbWFwUSq9xtMM1/NUEo=; b=po6fJVtYmeQ0bocKNgWGTA1A/2Ru2uzkoOoUdoYHy0gjtRdWyQ7fxvE8QvCVD+4ZWD VGcLCaml4UzNNZRAJ1U/UpeLTLjhLJxc/6OskA8pNDg6mXi0o0CgHAhCqoX70bxCIob7 BzQ+R4q18aT2VvLG1lwkn75jciszrTm1LY8uyNuTDSyjFTXNI3QznlEOdkhu3VME7QeJ vIrv7khaJ23m4HEnGgv00yh9nlaAGG7oNKYZxBMh2MUk/zvfldF0AEgp1WfEFmxnavwS ReL+cj1ainLq3KvuXZhj1/QbUSg3Q8BYCkFb0ZxH7uIB3YGKE/0R0p1InO7ropKpI5WT s74g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=gOREkAavhvHG1TNYLmbBSWrUjbWFwUSq9xtMM1/NUEo=; b=Vi+BwL9dKNtIpSui5gYYsmVRkAa1fZzJNMQnkr8NA9ufLzSNW4oCVbyDNw927ILegj aS0hIxFkrgU+ihOAFdfTj0ARVg3UYyHQgvanPUwhR199TuqlwAYo7B12tweiDj33S69w UNAjGrps1urrsqUvlWxnpcgkCg74EIDGKdoMXKHK7tm0UAi0XUFJ1nUlc9Ry6JHUN3Pv 8WApN0WE+yRa3pcjWLCmthTkBKW+MYBq4okqL36khlDUD++2Z4cxwR+itJZJbM7pCmFw 9mfUhlm8P1oDfefOYOwuxAbhG+p91yzmmAuJn9T/V5jrJJJ8jIPqJFl84mT5jpwLU7tQ FFcA== X-Gm-Message-State: ABUngvfMKk8Mhntg2exdEu8BCQYk7F8PAtUSBPEZ4BTxQJxeD4/pFRGruWDUWwovJXE1Vz3g1H2wDYoM1in4Cg== X-Received: by 10.107.175.80 with SMTP id y77mr21124848ioe.12.1479171427541; Mon, 14 Nov 2016 16:57:07 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.107.163.136 with HTTP; Mon, 14 Nov 2016 16:56:52 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: Donald Eastlake Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 19:56:52 -0500 Message-ID: To: Babel at IETF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a114496bc8028e205414c6f8f Archived-At: Subject: Re: [babel] Call for presentations at the BABEL WG meeting in Seoul X-BeenThere: babel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the Babel Routing Protocol." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2016 00:57:11 -0000 --001a114496bc8028e205414c6f8f Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi, An agenda and slides for the currently scheduled presentations has been uploaded. See https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/97/materials I believe there is still enough time for an additional presentation if someone wants to get something in at the last minute. If so, contact babel-chirs@ietf.org. Thanks, Donald =============================== Donald E. Eastlake 3rd +1-508-333-2270 (cell) 155 Beaver Street, Milford, MA 01757 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 12:06 AM, Donald Eastlake wrote: > Hi, > > If you'd like to present at the Babel WG meeting Friday of the > upcoming IETF meeting in Seoul, please reply or send mail to > babel-chairs@ietf.org. > (We have made note of Denis Ovslenko's desire to present remotely.) > > Thanks, > Donald > =============================== > Donald E. Eastlake 3rd +1-508-333-2270 (cell) > 155 Beaver Street, Milford, MA 01757 USA > d3e3e3@gmail.com > --001a114496bc8028e205414c6f8f Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

An agenda and slides for the curren= tly scheduled presentations has been uploaded. See

<= div>I believe there is still enough time for an additional presentation if = someone wants to get something in at the last minute. If so, contact babel-chirs@ietf.org.
On Mon, Oct 24, 2016 at 12:06 AM, Donald Eas= tlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,

If you'd like to present at the Babel WG meeting Friday of the
upcoming IETF meeting in Seoul, please reply or send mail to
babel-chairs@iet= f.org.
(We have made note of Denis Ovslenko's desire to present remotely.)

Thanks,
Donald
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=C2=A0Donald E. Eastlake 3rd=C2=A0 =C2=A0+1-508-333-2270 (cell)
=C2=A0155 Beaver Street, Milford, MA 01757 USA
=C2=A0d3e3e3@gmail.co= m

--001a114496bc8028e205414c6f8f-- From nobody Tue Nov 15 15:23:36 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A918B129478 for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 15:23:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.902 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.902 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gSnpgu-zMio6 for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 15:23:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from sender163-mail.zoho.com (sender163-mail.zoho.com [74.201.84.163]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8C6B1127A91 for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 15:23:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.zoho.com by mx.zohomail.com with SMTP id 147925221005558.77829221817683; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 15:23:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2016 23:23:30 +0000 From: Denis Ovsienko To: "Babel at IETF" , "babel-users " Message-ID: <1586a4d7183.fbd074d13381.1221014016757734504@ovsienko.info> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: Medium User-Agent: Zoho Mail X-Mailer: Zoho Mail Archived-At: Subject: [babel] feedback this Friday X-BeenThere: babel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the Babel Routing Protocol." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 15 Nov 2016 23:23:35 -0000 Hello list(s). This coming Friday meeting of the Babel WG includes my slides and I plan to present remotely. My concern is two issues: one is how bidirectional neighbour detection controls the rest of the protocol operation and another is how the bidirectional detection itself can be made more secure considering a particular form of replay attack. It seems to me both issues are important enough to discuss and to decide how to action, this mostly concerns RFC 6126-bis but may also have something to do with RFC 7298. The slides are in the meeting materials: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/97/materials/#rtg It would be great if on one of the remaining days before the meeting you could look through the slides and the (quite short) sections in RFC 6126 referred from one of the first slides. Your feedback and questions will be welcome at the meeting and on the babel@ietf mailing list. Thank you. -- Denis Ovsienko From nobody Tue Nov 15 22:42:36 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B248D12962D for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 22:42:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 33QMDR8IGdEt for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 22:42:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from korolev.univ-paris7.fr (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2FD9E1295C0 for ; Tue, 15 Nov 2016 22:42:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [81.194.30.253]) by korolev.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay1/56228) with ESMTP id uAG6gPXZ011955; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 07:42:25 +0100 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81699D7973; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 07:42:25 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at math.univ-paris-diderot.fr Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10023) with ESMTP id EX5gFjwju2H2; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 07:42:24 +0100 (CET) Received: from trurl.irif.fr (col75-1-78-194-40-74.fbxo.proxad.net [78.194.40.74]) (Authenticated sender: jch) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 76FB6D795F; Wed, 16 Nov 2016 07:42:24 +0100 (CET) Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 07:42:27 +0100 Message-ID: <87zil03oz0.wl-jch@pps.univ-paris-diderot.fr> From: Juliusz Chroboczek To: Denis Ovsienko In-Reply-To: <1586a4d7183.fbd074d13381.1221014016757734504@ovsienko.info> References: <1586a4d7183.fbd074d13381.1221014016757734504@ovsienko.info> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.15.9 MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI-EPG 1.14.7 - "Harue") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.138]); Wed, 16 Nov 2016 07:42:25 +0100 (CET) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 582BFFD1.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 582BFFD1.000 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 582BFFD1.000 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: Cc: babel-users , Babel at IETF Subject: Re: [babel] feedback this Friday X-BeenThere: babel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the Babel Routing Protocol." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 06:42:29 -0000 Hi Denis, The Babel neighbour sensing mechanism is exactly as you describe: if a given IP address hasn't sent you a Hello, it doesn't exist, and all packets from it are silently dropped until it sends a Hello. This is by design. You are correct that an IHU does not carry explicit information about individual hellos, but just a single integer that summarises the link quality. That's by design, and that's the reason why IHU is called IHU, not Ack. I haven't been able to understand the attack that you outline just from looking at the slides, so I suggest we discuss it after you've done your presentation. -- Juliusz From nobody Thu Nov 17 21:09:17 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25EC512957E for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 21:09:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ld47cNPW6aUM for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 21:09:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from korolev.univ-paris7.fr (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D70A11293FB for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 21:09:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [81.194.30.253]) by korolev.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay1/56228) with ESMTP id uAI59D9b019813 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:09:13 +0100 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 26F1AD7ACD for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:09:13 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at math.univ-paris-diderot.fr Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10023) with ESMTP id 47-ubtRXO05t for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:09:12 +0100 (CET) Received: from trurl.irif.fr (col75-1-78-194-40-74.fbxo.proxad.net [78.194.40.74]) (Authenticated sender: jch) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 1E087D7ACF for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:09:12 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:09:15 +0100 Message-ID: <87shqpjrwk.wl-jch@irif.fr> From: Juliusz Chroboczek To: babel@ietf.org User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.15.9 MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI-EPG 1.14.7 - "Harue") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.138]); Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:09:13 +0100 (CET) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 582E8CF9.001 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 582E8CF9.001 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 582E8CF9.001 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: Subject: [babel] Summary of my comments about Denis' talk X-BeenThere: babel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the Babel Routing Protocol." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2016 05:09:16 -0000 Concerning Denis' talk, I'm of the opinion that Appendix A should remain an informative appendix. Further constraining neighbour discovery and link-quality sensing should only be done as a last recourse, and after serious thought. It is intended by the protocol that a neighbour only exists after it sent a Hello. If that's not clear in the spec, it should be clarified, or else a different policy defined. I'm not sure it matters much, though. The spec is very clear about Acks: after your receive an Ack Request, you MUST send an Ack within the deadling. No other requirements are made -- how to deal with missed Acks is an implementation issue. I believe that there is consensus that Hellos should not be further constrained (thanks, David). If the HMAC extension needs extra data, it can put further constraints when HMAC is enabled -- for example, HMAC could require the RTT extension (which is pretty cool, but requires generating a timestamp for every Hello packet -- is that prohibitive?), or it can put its own sub-TLV in Hello, or it can require that Hellos only be sent in a packet that carries a TS TLV. (The RTT extension does something similar -- it requires that IHUs be only sent in packets that carry a Hello.) -- Juliusz From nobody Thu Nov 17 21:18:35 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13F71129706 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 21:18:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id et7qbA4gsij4 for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 21:18:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from korolev.univ-paris7.fr (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6D8DF1295FA for ; Thu, 17 Nov 2016 21:18:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [81.194.30.253]) by korolev.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay1/56228) with ESMTP id uAI5IUuY023898; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:18:30 +0100 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0D13ED7ACD; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:18:30 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at math.univ-paris-diderot.fr Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10023) with ESMTP id qdwFemiinOCc; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:18:29 +0100 (CET) Received: from trurl.irif.fr (col75-1-78-194-40-74.fbxo.proxad.net [78.194.40.74]) (Authenticated sender: jch) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 5FB82D7973; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:18:28 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:18:31 +0100 Message-ID: <87r369jrh4.wl-jch@irif.fr> From: Juliusz Chroboczek To: babel@ietf.org User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.15.9 MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI-EPG 1.14.7 - "Harue") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.138]); Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:18:30 +0100 (CET) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 582E8F26.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 582E8F26.000 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 582E8F26.000 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: Cc: zhang.zheng@zte.com.cn, prz@juniper.net Subject: [babel] Summary of my comments about Sandy's talk X-BeenThere: babel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the Babel Routing Protocol." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 18 Nov 2016 05:18:34 -0000 I'd be thrilled to work on BIER in Babel. Babel claims that it is a flexible protocol, and getting BIER to work in Babel would be an opportunity to prove this claim. I do however have some concerns about draft-zhang-bier-babel-extensions-00. First, the encoding does not fit Babel's extension mechanism for two reasons: it speaks about a transitive, optional sub-TLV, and Babel does not have these bits. Depending on the intended semantics, this extension should be encoded either as a sub-TLV of the Update TLV, as a sub-TLV of the Router-Id TLV, as a new TLV, or as an Update TLV with a new AE. I believe I have an opinion, but I'm not sure. Second, this version of the draft only speaks about the packet format -- it doesn't describe the semantics of the data, it doesn't say what an implementation actually does with the extra data. I'm going to do some reading about BIER (Pierre, fancy a beer at some point?), but I'd appreciate some references. (Side note: what requirements does BIER make on the topology? Are non-transitive (meshy) links fine?) Finally, I think this work only makes sense if people are serious about building a prototype. I'll be glad to help. -- Juliusz From nobody Fri Nov 18 06:25:47 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45ADF129576 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:25:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.357 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.357 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DATE_IN_PAST_24_48=1.34, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-1.497, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8kHDT7UsUFc8 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:25:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx5.zte.com.cn (mx5.zte.com.cn [63.217.80.70]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 356B312941C for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 06:25:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from out1.zte.com.cn (unknown [192.168.168.120]) by Websense Email Security Gateway with ESMTP id 3CAD65F700258 for ; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 22:25:33 +0800 (CST) X-MAILFROM: X-RCPTTO: X-FROMIP: 10.30.3.20 X-SEG-Scaned: 1 X-Received: unknown,10.30.3.20,20161118213607 Received: from unknown (HELO mse01.zte.com.cn) (10.30.3.20) by localhost with SMTP; 18 Nov 2016 13:36:07 -0000 Received: from notes_smtp.zte.com.cn ([10.30.1.239]) by mse01.zte.com.cn with ESMTP id uAIDaZOe008861; Fri, 18 Nov 2016 21:36:35 +0800 (GMT-8) (envelope-from zhang.zheng@zte.com.cn) In-Reply-To: <87r369jrh4.wl-jch@irif.fr> References: <87r369jrh4.wl-jch@irif.fr> To: Juliusz Chroboczek MIME-Version: 1.0 X-KeepSent: 2471F4B6:4D9C0D43-4825806F:0045BA6B; type=4; name=$KeepSent X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 8.5.3 September 15, 2011 Message-ID: From: zhang.zheng@zte.com.cn Date: Thu, 17 Nov 2016 12:30:56 +0800 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on notes_smtp/zte_ltd(Release 8.5.3FP6|November 21, 2013) at 2016-11-18 21:36:35, Serialize complete at 2016-11-18 21:36:35 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 003766144825806C_=" X-MAIL: mse01.zte.com.cn uAIDaZOe008861 X-HQIP: 127.0.0.1 Archived-At: Cc: prz@juniper.net, babel@ietf.org Subject: Re: [babel] Summary of my comments about Sandy's talk X-BeenThere: babel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the Babel Routing Protocol." 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ZW9wbGUgYXJlIHNlcmlvdXMNCmFib3V0PGJyPg0KJmd0OyBidWlsZGluZyBhIHByb3RvdHlwZS4g Jm5ic3A7SSdsbCBiZSBnbGFkIHRvIGhlbHAuPGJyPg0KJmd0OyA8YnI+DQomZ3Q7IC0tIEp1bGl1 c3o8YnI+DQo8L2ZvbnQ+PC90dD4NCg== --=_alternative 003766144825806C_=-- From nobody Mon Nov 21 09:15:34 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0137129AC9 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 09:15:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.902 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.902 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0nB5rCjXhcFc for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 09:15:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from sender163-mail.zoho.com (sender163-mail.zoho.com [74.201.84.163]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D9C541296D5 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 09:15:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail.zoho.com by mx.zohomail.com with SMTP id 1479748521810210.42944126898908; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 09:15:21 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2016 17:15:21 +0000 From: Denis Ovsienko To: "Babel at IETF" Message-ID: <15887e28f4d.f284d44076035.5227359549384558673@ovsienko.info> In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: Medium User-Agent: Zoho Mail X-Mailer: Zoho Mail Archived-At: Subject: [babel] 6126-bis XML to git? X-BeenThere: babel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the Babel Routing Protocol." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2016 17:15:33 -0000 Hello group. Let me say thank you once again for the questions and comments you had provided during the last meeting, and for the patience to listen through the talk as I am not a good presenter. Hopefully the two issues reviewed in the slides now make enough sense to work on them further. A bit later I would like to try preparing the small editorial clarifications to address the 1st issue so the WG can review them and make into the 6126-bis draft if there is a consensus. Would anybody be willing to set up a public git repository with the WG documents (at least draft-ietf-babel-rfc6126bis) XML files? -- Denis Ovsienko From nobody Mon Nov 21 12:59:57 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: babel@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56B88129560 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 12:59:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PtYVpP6Fn9En for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 12:59:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from korolev.univ-paris7.fr (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4E725129BB2 for ; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 12:59:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:1]) by korolev.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay1/56228) with ESMTP id uALKxpD6018066 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Mon, 21 Nov 2016 21:59:51 +0100 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [81.194.30.253]) by potemkin.univ-paris7.fr (8.14.4/8.14.4/relay2/56228) with ESMTP id uALKxpg2026080; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 21:59:51 +0100 Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C30CD7ACD; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 21:59:51 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at math.univ-paris-diderot.fr Received: from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10023) with ESMTP id ka-6S2bhrZeF; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 21:59:50 +0100 (CET) Received: from trurl.irif.fr (col75-1-78-194-40-74.fbxo.proxad.net [78.194.40.74]) (Authenticated sender: jch) by mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C3D02D7973; Mon, 21 Nov 2016 21:59:49 +0100 (CET) Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2016 21:59:49 +0100 Message-ID: <874m30zgze.wl-jch@irif.fr> From: Juliusz Chroboczek To: Denis Ovsienko In-Reply-To: <15887e28f4d.f284d44076035.5227359549384558673@ovsienko.info> References: <15887e28f4d.f284d44076035.5227359549384558673@ovsienko.info> User-Agent: Wanderlust/2.15.9 MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI-EPG 1.14.7 - "Harue") Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (korolev.univ-paris7.fr [IPv6:2001:660:3301:8000::1:2]); Mon, 21 Nov 2016 21:59:51 +0100 (CET) X-Greylist: Sender IP whitelisted, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (potemkin.univ-paris7.fr [194.254.61.141]); Mon, 21 Nov 2016 21:59:51 +0100 (CET) X-Miltered: at korolev with ID 58336047.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-Miltered: at potemkin with ID 58336047.000 by Joe's j-chkmail (http : // j-chkmail dot ensmp dot fr)! X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 58336047.000 from potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/null/potemkin.univ-paris7.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Enveloppe: 58336047.000 from mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/null/mailhub.math.univ-paris-diderot.fr/ X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 58336047.000 on korolev.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Score: MSGID : 58336047.000 on potemkin.univ-paris7.fr : j-chkmail score : . : R=. U=. O=. B=0.000 -> S=0.000 X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham X-j-chkmail-Status: Ham Archived-At: Cc: Babel at IETF Subject: Re: [babel] 6126-bis XML to git? X-BeenThere: babel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the Babel Routing Protocol." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2016 20:59:55 -0000 > Would anybody be willing to set up a public git repository with the WG > documents (at least draft-ietf-babel-rfc6126bis) XML files? I'll do so ASAP. I need a break from marking student papers anyway. -- Juliusz