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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: "sajassi@cisco.com" <sajassi@cisco.com>
CC: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/VQ988_KaH54yz0HXacxhVDszoHg>
Subject: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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Ali and all,
I have a question regarding one of the aspects of RFC 7432, namely operati=
on of the default Designated Forwarder (DF) election process on an Etherne=
t Segment (ES) that operates in the Single-Active Redundancy Mode.

RFC 7432 defines the Single-Active Redundancy Mode in Section 3 as followi=
ng:
"Only a single PE, among all the PEs attached to an Ethernet segment, is a=
llowed to forward traffic to/from that Ethernet segment for a given VLAN".=


The same RFC in Section 8.5 also specifies that the DF for a specific VLAN=
 on a multi-homed Ethernet segment (ES) is the only PE attached to this se=
gment that is responsible for sending BUM traffic for this VLAN to the CE.=
 It also defined the default DF election procedure that elects a single "l=
ive" PE on the specific ES as the DF for each specific EVI that is represe=
nted on this ES.

These two definitions look contradictory to me, because:

1.       The default DF election procedure only involves the PEs attached =
to the specific ES

2.       In the Single-Active Redundancy mode the elected DF for a specifi=
c VLAN must also be the only PE that is allowed to forward traffic receive=
d with this VLAN from the CEs to the peer PEs. It is not clear to me, how =
this can be achieved.

a.       The RFC mentions MVRP as a possible method to notify the attached=
 CEs that a specific PE is NOT a DF for a specific VLAN in the case of an =
ES that operates in the Single-Active Redundancy Mode. Does this mean that=
 CEs that are attached to a multi-homed ES operating in Single-Active Redu=
ndancy Mode SHOULD support MVRP?

b.       Are there any alternatives to MVRP that can be used for this purp=
ose. In particular, is it possible to use Ethernet Local Management Interf=
ace (E-LMI) as defined in MEF-16<http://www.mef.net/resources/technical-sp=
ecifications/download?id=3D42&fileid=3Dfile1> for this purpose?

c.       The RFC mentions LAG as the method to connect the CE to a multi-h=
omed ES operating in the All-Active Redundancy Mode. Is it possible to con=
nect a CE that uses LAG to a multi-homed ES operating in the Single-Active=
 Redundancy Mode?

Your feedback would be highly appreciated.

Regards, and lots of thanks in advance,
Sasha

Office: +972-39266302
Cell:      +972-549266302
Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com


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<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Ali and all,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have a question regarding one of the aspects of R=
FC 7432, namely operation of the default Designated Forwarder (DF) electio=
n process on an Ethernet Segment (ES) that operates in the Single-Active R=
edundancy Mode.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">RFC 7432 defines the Single-Active Redundancy Mode =
in Section 3 as following:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">&#8220;<b><span style=3D=
"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Only a single PE, among all the PEs =
attached to an Ethernet segment, is allowed to forward traffic to/from tha=
t Ethernet segment for a given VLAN</span></b>&#8221;.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The same RFC in Section 8.5 also specifies that the=
 DF for a specific VLAN on a multi-homed Ethernet segment (ES) is the only=
 PE attached to this segment that is responsible for sending BUM traffic f=
or this VLAN to the CE. It also defined
 the default DF election procedure that elects a single &#8220;live&#8221;=
 PE on the specific ES as the DF for each specific EVI that is represented=
 on this ES.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">These two definitions look contradictory to me, bec=
ause:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 lev=
el1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span sty=
le=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>The default DF election p=
rocedure only involves the PEs attached to the specific ES<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 lev=
el1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span sty=
le=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>In the Single-Active Redu=
ndancy mode the elected DF for a specific VLAN must also be the only PE th=
at is allowed to forward traffic received with this VLAN from the CEs to t=
he peer PEs. It is not clear to me, how
 this can be achieved. <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:72.0pt;text-indent:-18.=
0pt;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">a.<span style=3D"font=
:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>The RFC mentions MVRP as =
a possible method to notify the attached CEs that a specific PE is NOT a D=
F for a specific VLAN in the case of an ES that operates in the Single-Act=
ive Redundancy Mode. Does this mean that
 CEs that are attached to a multi-homed ES operating in Single-Active Redu=
ndancy Mode SHOULD support MVRP?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:72.0pt;text-indent:-18.=
0pt;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">b.<span style=3D"font=
:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>Are there any alternative=
s to MVRP that can be used for this purpose. In particular, is it possible=
 to use Ethernet Local Management Interface (E-LMI) as defined in
<a href=3D"http://www.mef.net/resources/technical-specifications/download?=
id=3D42&amp;fileid=3Dfile1">
MEF-16</a> for this purpose?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:72.0pt;text-indent:-18.=
0pt;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">c.<span style=3D"font=
:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>The RFC mentions LAG as t=
he method to connect the CE to a multi-homed ES operating in the All-Activ=
e Redundancy Mode. Is it possible to connect a CE that uses LAG to a multi=
-homed ES operating in the Single-Active
 Redundancy Mode?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Your feedback would be highly appreciated.<o:p></o:=
p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards, and lots of thanks in advance,<o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sasha<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Office: &#43;972-39266302<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;972-549266=
302<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp; Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com=
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<br clear=3D"both">
__________________________________________________________________________=
_<BR>
<BR>
This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains inform=
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CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have rece=
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From nobody Sun Sep  2 13:33:11 2018
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From: Ines Robles <mariainesrobles@googlemail.com>
To: <gen-art@ietf.org>
Cc: draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib.all@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org
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Subject: [bess] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-15
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Reviewer: Ines Robles
Review result: Ready

I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area
Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed
by the IESG for the IETF Chair.  Please treat these comments just
like any other last call comments.

For more information, please see the FAQ at

<https://trac.ietf.org/trac/gen/wiki/GenArtfaq>.

Document: draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-15
Reviewer: Ines Robles
Review Date: 2018-09-02
IETF LC End Date: 2018-09-03
IESG Telechat date: Not scheduled for a telechat

Summary:
I believe the draft is technically good. This document is well written and
clear to understand.

This document defines a portion of the Management Information Base (MIB) for
use with network management protocols in the Internet community. In particular,
it describes common managed objects used by other MIB modules which are
designed for monitoring and/or configuring both Layer 2 and Layer 3 Virtual
Private Networks (VPN) that support multicast.

Major issues: Not found

Minor issues: Not found

Nits/editorial comments: Not found



From nobody Mon Sep  3 01:18:42 2018
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From: <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>
To: LITKOWSKI Stephane OBS/OINIS <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: WG adoption poll and IPR poll for draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll and IPR poll for draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election
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Hi,

The document has a good level of support and is adopted as a WG document.

Authors, please republish the document as  draft-ietf-bess-evpn-per-mcast-f=
low-df-election-00.

Thanks,


From: BESS [mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of stephane.litkowski@o=
range.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2018 15:38
To: bess@ietf.org
Subject: [bess] WG adoption poll and IPR poll for draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-p=
er-mcast-flow-df-election

Hi WG,

This email begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption of draft-=
sajassi-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election-01 [1]

Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group lis=
t, stating whether or not you support adoption.

We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to th=
is Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF =
IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please re=
spond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any releva=
nt undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won't progr=
ess without answers from all the authors and contributors.

If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly=
 respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed i=
n conformance with IETF rules.

The poll for working group adoption closes on Wed 22th Aug.

Regards,
St=E9phane and Matthew

[1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow=
-df-election/




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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi,<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">The document has a goo=
d level of support and is adopted as a WG document.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Authors, please republ=
ish the document as &nbsp;draft-ietf-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election-0=
0.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> BESS [ma=
ilto:bess-bounces@ietf.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>stephane.litkowski@orange.com<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, August 08, 2018 15:38<br>
<b>To:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] WG adoption poll and IPR poll for draft-sajassi-bess=
-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Hi WG,<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">This emai=
l begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption of draft-sajassi-b=
ess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election-01 [1]<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Please re=
view the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group list, statin=
g whether or not you support adoption.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">We are al=
so polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this Docume=
nt, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules=
 (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for
 more details).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please respond to =
this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevant undisc=
losed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list.
 The document won't progress without answers from all the authors and contr=
ibutors.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly respond =
only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conform=
ance with IETF rules.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">The poll =
for working group adoption closes on Wed 22<sup>th</sup> Aug. &nbsp;<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Regards,<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">St=E9phan=
e and Matthew<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">[1] <a href=3D"https://datatrac=
ker.ietf.org/doc/draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election/">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-=
election/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<pre>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations con=
fidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez=
 recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messag=
es electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deform=
e ou falsifie. Merci.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privilege=
d information that may be protected by law;<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.<=
o:p></o:p></pre>
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<pre>Thank you.<o:p></o:p></pre>
</div>
<PRE>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been =
modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.
</PRE></body>
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From: <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>
To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] new WGLC for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05
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The document has a good level of support to progress. However there are sev=
eral comments raised that have not been answered yet.

Authors,

Could you please address the comments that have been raised on the list (fr=
om Acee, Krysztof, and Luc Andre) ?


Thanks,

Stephane


From: BESS [mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of stephane.litkowski@o=
range.com
Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2018 16:04
To: bess@ietf.org
Subject: [bess] new WGLC for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05


Hello working group,



This email starts a two-week Working Group Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-evp=
n-inter-subnet-forwarding-05 [1].



A significant amount of update has been introduced since the previous WGLC.=
 Please review the updates and provide your feedback.



This poll runs until *the 22th of August*.





Thank you



St=E9phane, Matthew

bess chairs



[1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forw=
arding/



___________________________________________________________________________=
______________________________________________



Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc

pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler

a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,

Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.



This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;

they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.

If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.

As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been =
modified, changed or falsified.

Thank you.

___________________________________________________________________________=
______________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been =
modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.


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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">The document has a goo=
d level of support to progress. However there are several comments raised t=
hat have not been answered yet.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Authors,<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Could you please addre=
ss the comments that have been raised on the list (from Acee, Krysztof, and=
 Luc Andre) ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Stephane<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> BESS [ma=
ilto:bess-bounces@ietf.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>stephane.litkowski@orange.com<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, August 08, 2018 16:04<br>
<b>To:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] new WGLC for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwa=
rding-05<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Hello working group,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">This email starts a two-week Working Group Last C=
all on draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05 [1].<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">A significant amount of update has been introduce=
d since the previous WGLC. Please review the updates and provide your feedb=
ack.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">This poll runs until *the 22th of August*.<o:p></=
o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Thank you<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">St=E9phane, Matthew<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">bess chairs<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">[1] <a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/d=
raft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding/">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwardi=
ng/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<pre>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations con=
fidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez=
 recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messag=
es electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deform=
e ou falsifie. Merci.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privilege=
d information that may be protected by law;<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.<=
o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and=
 delete this message and its attachments.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have =
been modified, changed or falsified.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Thank you.<o:p></o:p></pre>
</div>
<PRE>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been =
modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.
</PRE></body>
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From: "Luc Andre Burdet (lburdet)" <lburdet@cisco.com>
To: LITKOWSKI Stephane OBS/OINIS <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>,
 "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: new WGLC for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05
Thread-Topic: new WGLC for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05
Thread-Index: AdQvIIu4RlFBAoZ3Sxao611kjcgTxQKU1/s6
Date: Tue, 21 Aug 2018 17:56:15 +0000
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To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
CC: LITKOWSKI Stephane OBS/OINIS <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>
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From: <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>
To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining
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Date: Mon, 3 Sep 2018 08:30:23 +0000
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Subject: [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining
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Hello Working Group,



This email starts a two-week Working Group Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-ser=
vice-chaining-05 [1]



This poll runs until *the 17th of September*.



We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to th=
is Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF =
IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).

If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor of this Document please res=
pond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevan=
t undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress without answers from all the=
 Authors and Contributors.



Currently two IPRs have been disclosed against this Document.



If you are not listed as an Author or a Contributor, then please explicitly=
 respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed i=
n conformance with IETF rules.



We are also polling for any existing implementation as per [2].



    Thank you,

    Stephane & Matthew



    [1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining/



    [2] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjq=
Dpw




[Orange logo]<http://www.orange.com/>

Stephane Litkowski
Network Architect
Orange/SCE/EQUANT/OINIS/NET
Orange Expert Future Networks
phone: +33 2 23 06 49 83 <https://monsi.sso.francetelecom.fr/index.asp?targ=
et=3Dhttp%3A%2F%2Fclicvoice.sso.francetelecom.fr%2FClicvoiceV2%2FToolBar.do=
%3Faction%3Ddefault%26rootservice%3DSIGNATURE%26to%3D+33%202%2023%2028%2049=
%2083%20>  NEW !
mobile: +33 6 71 63 27 50 <https://monsi.sso.francetelecom.fr/index.asp?tar=
get=3Dhttp%3A%2F%2Fclicvoice.sso.francetelecom.fr%2FClicvoiceV2%2FToolBar.d=
o%3Faction%3Ddefault%26rootservice%3DSIGNATURE%26to%3D+33%206%2037%2086%209=
7%2052%20>  NEW !
stephane.litkowski@orange.com<mailto:stephane.litkowski@orange.com>


___________________________________________________________________________=
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<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Hello Working Group,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">This email starts a two-week Working Group Last C=
all on draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining-05 [1]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">This poll runs until *the 17th of September*.<o:p=
></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclo=
sed IPR that applies to this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclose=
d in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for=
 more details).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor o=
f this Document please respond to this email and indicate whether or not yo=
u are aware of any relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress wi=
thout answers from all the Authors
 and Contributors.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Currently two IPRs have been disclosed against th=
is Document.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">If you are not listed as an Author or a Contribut=
or, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that ha=
s not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">We are also polling for any existing implementati=
on as per [2].<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Thank you,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Stephane &amp; Matthew<o:p></o=
:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;[1] <a href=3D"https://da=
tatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining/">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining/</a><o:p>=
</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [2] <a href=3D"https://mailarc=
hive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw">
https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw</a><=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"http://www.orange.com/"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;;co=
lor:blue;text-decoration:none"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"40" height=3D"40"=
 id=3D"Picture_x0020_1" src=3D"cid:image001.jpg@01D44371.1F090FC0" alt=3D"O=
range logo"></span></a><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-fam=
ily:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"line-height:15.0pt"><span style=3D"font-siz=
e:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Stephane Litkowski
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roma=
n&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><br>
</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Network Architect
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&qu=
ot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><br>
</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Orange/SCE/EQUANT/OINIS/NET</span><span style=
=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&qu=
ot;"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fam=
ily:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Orange Expert Fut=
ure Networks</span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:=
&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fam=
ily:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">phone:
<a href=3D"https://monsi.sso.francetelecom.fr/index.asp?target=3Dhttp%3A%2F=
%2Fclicvoice.sso.francetelecom.fr%2FClicvoiceV2%2FToolBar.do%3Faction%3Ddef=
ault%26rootservice%3DSIGNATURE%26to%3D&#43;33%202%2023%2028%2049%2083%20">
<span style=3D"color:black">&#43;33 2 23 <b>06</b> 49 83 </span></a>&nbsp;N=
EW&nbsp;!</span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&qu=
ot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><br>
</span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&=
quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">mobile:
<a href=3D"https://monsi.sso.francetelecom.fr/index.asp?target=3Dhttp%3A%2F=
%2Fclicvoice.sso.francetelecom.fr%2FClicvoiceV2%2FToolBar.do%3Faction%3Ddef=
ault%26rootservice%3DSIGNATURE%26to%3D&#43;33%206%2037%2086%2097%2052%20">
<span style=3D"color:black">&#43;33 6 71 63 27 50 </span></a>&nbsp;NEW&nbsp=
;!</span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Time=
s New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><br>
<a href=3D"mailto:stephane.litkowski@orange.com"><span style=3D"font-size:1=
0.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#FF6600">s=
tephane.litkowski@orange.com</span></a>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<PRE>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

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</PRE></body>
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From: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
CC: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
Thread-Index: AdRCuX4OWvLxpG+GTwSFScLNHhlNZwBOYp8A
Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2018 05:00:20 +0000
Message-ID: <E8C974A3-8D6A-4B21-91AA-766C8E7DE8EF@cisco.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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From: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
To: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] WG adoption poll and IPR poll for draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll and IPR poll for draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election
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From: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
To: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: new WGLC for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05
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Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2018 05:20:20 +0000
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References: <9216_1533737011_5B6AF833_9216_196_1_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF924B2291F9@OPEXCLILMA4.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <22856_1535963009_5B8CEF81_22856_75_2_9E32478DFA9976438E7A22F69B08FF924B27D8A4@OPEXCLILMA4.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup>
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Subject: Re: [bess] new WGLC for draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05
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From: <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>
To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2018 07:29:18 +0000
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Subject: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Hi WG,

This email begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption draft-mal=
hotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]

Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group lis=
t, stating whether or not you support adoption.

We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to th=
is Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF =
IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please re=
spond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any releva=
nt undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won't progr=
ess without answers from all the authors and contributors.

If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly=
 respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed i=
n conformance with IETF rules.

The poll for working group adoption closes on Tue 18th September.

Regards,
St=E9phane and Matthew

[1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/






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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Hi WG,<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">This emai=
l begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption draft-malhotra-bes=
s-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Please re=
view the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group list, statin=
g whether or not you support adoption.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">We are al=
so polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this Docume=
nt, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules=
 (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for
 more details).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please respond to =
this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevant undisc=
losed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list.
 The document won't progress without answers from all the authors and contr=
ibutors.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly respond =
only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conform=
ance with IETF rules.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">The poll =
for working group adoption closes on Tue 18<sup>th</sup> September. &nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Regards,<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">St=E9phan=
e and Matthew<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">[1] <a href=3D"https://datatrac=
ker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/</a><o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<PRE>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

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tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
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 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
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ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
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If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
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modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.
</PRE></body>
</html>

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From nobody Tue Sep  4 01:06:21 2018
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Subject: [bess] The BESS WG has placed draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb in state "Candidate for WG Adoption"
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The BESS WG has placed draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb in state
Candidate for WG Adoption (entered by Stephane Litkowski)

The document is available at
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/


From nobody Tue Sep  4 01:39:28 2018
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CC: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/FrLFTtyms6f3sgXqFrMQJhV7hVs>
Subject: Re: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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From nobody Tue Sep  4 01:51:08 2018
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From: IETF Meeting Session Request Tool <session-request@ietf.org>
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Subject: [bess] bess - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 103
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A new meeting session request has just been submitted by Stephane Litkowski, a Chair of the bess working group.


---------------------------------------------------------
Working Group Name: BGP Enabled ServiceS
Area Name: Routing Area
Session Requester: Stephane Litkowski

Number of Sessions: 1
Length of Session(s):  2 Hours
Number of Attendees: 80
Conflicts to Avoid: 
 First Priority: idr nvo3
 Second Priority: spring sfc mpls pim bier pals
 Third Priority: i2rs l2sm


People who must be present:
  Matthew Bocci
  Martin Vigoureux
  Stephane Litkowski
  mankamana prasad mishra

Resources Requested:

Special Requests:
  Our two last sessions had a very busy agenda, it would be great to get a 2h30 slot.

---------------------------------------------------------


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From: Krzysztof Szarkowicz <kszarkowicz@gmail.com>
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Cc: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>
To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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Hi Sasha,

To use LAG in A/S mode on per VLAN basis, you can use =E2=80=98hack=E2=80=99=
, where you use preference-based DF election =
(draft-ietf-bess-evpn-pref-df) to ensure with the configuration that =
*all* VLANs on given ESI use PE1 as DF, and *all* VLANs on that ESI use =
PE2 as non-DF. Then, you need to have a mechanism to signal from PE2 to =
the CE the link standby status (e.g. via LACP, as used in MC-LAG =
deployments; or, I could even imagine per link CFM/LFM/E-LMI), so that =
CE doesn=E2=80=99t use link to PE2.

Thanks,
Krzysztof


> On 2018-Sep-04, at 10:39, Alexander Vainshtein =
<Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:
>=20
> Ali,
> Lots of thanks for a prompt and detailed response.
> It matches my understanding of the situation with Single-Active =
Redundancy Mode of Ethernet Segments in EVPN.
> In particular, your confirmation that =E2=80=9CYou cannot use LAG to =
do active/standby on a per VLAN basis (aka EVPN single-active)=E2=80=9D =
was quite important.
> =20
> I have also noticed that Single-Active is not mentioned at all  in RFC =
8388 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8388>. I wonder what this means =
with regard to actual deployment of this mode.
> =20
> Last but not least, I wonder if the expired draft =
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-brissette-bess-evpn-mh-pa-01> on =
Port-Active multi-homing mode for EVPN will be refreshed and if, as part =
of such refresh, any details on the control plane of EVPN would be =
provided.
> =20
> Regards, and, again, lots of thanks,
> Sasha
> =20
> Office: +972-39266302
> Cell:      +972-549266302
> Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
> =20
> From: Ali Sajassi (sajassi) [mailto:sajassi@cisco.com =
<mailto:sajassi@cisco.com>]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 8:00 AM
> To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>>
> Cc: bess@ietf.org <mailto:bess@ietf.org>; Michael Gorokhovsky =
<Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>>; Shell Nakash =
<Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com <mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>>; Ron =
Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com <mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>>; =
Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com <mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>>
> Subject: Re: A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and =
DF election in RFC 7432
> =20
> Hi Sasha,
> =20
> I don=E2=80=99t see any contradiction between the two statements from =
RFC 7432 that you mentioned below. For All-Active, DF election is for =
BUM traffic of a given VLAN (or group of VLANs in case of VLAN bundling) =
in the egress direction toward an ES. For Single-Active, DF election is =
for all traffic of a given VLAN (or group of VLANs =E2=80=A6) in both =
directions of an ES. Now with respect to notification of active VLANs to =
a CE device: MVRP mechanism that is mentioned in the RFC is an IEEE =
standard way of doing such thing. However, if the CE support E-LMI, then =
that protocol can be used as well. Regarding LAG, it can be used to =
connect a CE in an active/standby mode where one link is active and =
another link in standby mode (assuming two-link bundle). You cannot use =
LAG to do active/standby on a per VLAN basis (aka EVPN single-active).
> =20
> I will be travelling over next few days with limited email access, so =
please expect some delay for my responses.
> =20
> Cheers,
> Ali
> =20
> From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>>
> Date: Sunday, September 2, 2018 at 6:09 AM
> To: Cisco Employee <sajassi@cisco.com <mailto:sajassi@cisco.com>>
> Cc: "bess@ietf.org <mailto:bess@ietf.org>" <bess@ietf.org =
<mailto:bess@ietf.org>>, Michael Gorokhovsky =
<Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>>, Shell Nakash =
<Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com <mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>>, Ron =
Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com <mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>>, =
Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com <mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>>
> Subject: A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF =
election in RFC 7432
> =20
> Ali and all, <>
> I have a question regarding one of the aspects of RFC 7432, namely =
operation of the default Designated Forwarder (DF) election process on =
an Ethernet Segment (ES) that operates in the Single-Active Redundancy =
Mode.
> =20
> RFC 7432 defines the Single-Active Redundancy Mode in Section 3 as =
following:
> =E2=80=9COnly a single PE, among all the PEs attached to an Ethernet =
segment, is allowed to forward traffic to/from that Ethernet segment for =
a given VLAN=E2=80=9D.
> =20
> The same RFC in Section 8.5 also specifies that the DF for a specific =
VLAN on a multi-homed Ethernet segment (ES) is the only PE attached to =
this segment that is responsible for sending BUM traffic for this VLAN =
to the CE. It also defined the default DF election procedure that elects =
a single =E2=80=9Clive=E2=80=9D PE on the specific ES as the DF for each =
specific EVI that is represented on this ES.
> =20
> These two definitions look contradictory to me, because:
> The default DF election procedure only involves the PEs attached to =
the specific ES
> In the Single-Active Redundancy mode the elected DF for a specific =
VLAN must also be the only PE that is allowed to forward traffic =
received with this VLAN from the CEs to the peer PEs. It is not clear to =
me, how this can be achieved.=20
> The RFC mentions MVRP as a possible method to notify the attached CEs =
that a specific PE is NOT a DF for a specific VLAN in the case of an ES =
that operates in the Single-Active Redundancy Mode. Does this mean that =
CEs that are attached to a multi-homed ES operating in Single-Active =
Redundancy Mode SHOULD support MVRP?
> Are there any alternatives to MVRP that can be used for this purpose. =
In particular, is it possible to use Ethernet Local Management Interface =
(E-LMI) as defined in MEF-16 =
<http://www.mef.net/resources/technical-specifications/download?id=3D42&fi=
leid=3Dfile1> for this purpose?
> The RFC mentions LAG as the method to connect the CE to a multi-homed =
ES operating in the All-Active Redundancy Mode. Is it possible to =
connect a CE that uses LAG to a multi-homed ES operating in the =
Single-Active Redundancy Mode?
> =20
> Your feedback would be highly appreciated.
> =20
> Regards, and lots of thanks in advance,
> Sasha
> =20
> Office: +972-39266302
> Cell:      +972-549266302
> Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
> =20
>=20
> =
__________________________________________________________________________=
_
>=20
> This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains =
information which is=20
> CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have =
received this=20
> transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and =
then delete the original=20
> and all copies thereof.
> =
__________________________________________________________________________=
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>=20
>=20
> =
__________________________________________________________________________=
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>=20
> This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains =
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> CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have =
received this=20
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Hi Sasha,<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">To use LAG in A/S mode on per VLAN basis, you can use =
=E2=80=98hack=E2=80=99, where you use preference-based DF election =
(draft-ietf-bess-evpn-pref-df) to ensure with the configuration that =
*all* VLANs on given ESI use PE1 as DF, and *all* VLANs on that ESI use =
PE2 as non-DF. Then, you need to have a mechanism to signal from PE2 to =
the CE the link standby status (e.g. via LACP, as used in MC-LAG =
deployments; or, I could even imagine per link CFM/LFM/E-LMI), so that =
CE doesn=E2=80=99t use link to PE2.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Thanks,</div><div =
class=3D"">Krzysztof</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On 2018-Sep-04, at 10:39, Alexander Vainshtein &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"WordSection1" style=3D"page: WordSection1; font-family: =
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: =
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Ali,<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Lots of thanks for a =
prompt and detailed response.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);" class=3D"">It matches my understanding of the situation with =
Single-Active Redundancy Mode of Ethernet Segments in EVPN.<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">In particular, your =
confirmation that =E2=80=9C</span><span style=3D"background-color: =
yellow; background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial =
initial;" class=3D"">You cannot use LAG to do active/standby on a per =
VLAN basis (aka EVPN single-active)</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);" class=3D"">=E2=80=9D was quite important.<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">I have =
also noticed that Single-Active is not mentioned at all &nbsp;in<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8388" style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114); text-decoration: underline;" class=3D"">RFC 8388</a>. I wonder =
what this means with regard to actual deployment of this mode.<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Last but =
not least, I wonder if the expired<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-brissette-bess-evpn-mh-pa-01" =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">draft</a><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>on =
Port-Active multi-homing mode for EVPN will be refreshed and if, as part =
of such refresh, any details on the control plane of EVPN would be =
provided.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Regards, =
and, again, lots of thanks,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);" class=3D"">Sasha<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);" class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);" class=3D"">Office: +972-39266302<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; +972-549266302<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: =
rgb(149, 79, 114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</a><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-width: 1pt; =
border-top-color: rgb(225, 225, 225); padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><b class=3D"">From:</b><span=
 class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Ali Sajassi (sajassi) [<a =
href=3D"mailto:sajassi@cisco.com" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D"">mailto:sajassi@cisco.com</a>]<span=
 class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, September 4, 2018 =
8:00 AM<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">To:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Alexander Vainshtein &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: =
rgb(149, 79, 114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Cc:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D"">bess@ietf.org</a>; Michael =
Gorokhovsky &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com" =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com</a>&gt;; Shell Nakash &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, =
114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com</a>&gt;; Ron Sdayoor &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, =
114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com</a>&gt;; Rotem Cohen &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, =
114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: A question regarding =
Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">Hi Sasha,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">I don=E2=80=99t see any contradiction between the two =
statements from RFC 7432 that you mentioned below. For All-Active, DF =
election is for BUM traffic of a given VLAN (or group of VLANs in case =
of VLAN bundling) in the egress direction toward an ES. For =
Single-Active, DF election is for all traffic of a given VLAN (or group =
of VLANs =E2=80=A6) in both directions of an ES. Now with respect to =
notification of active VLANs to a CE device: MVRP mechanism that is =
mentioned in the RFC is an IEEE standard way of doing such thing. =
However, if the CE support E-LMI, then that protocol can be used as =
well. Regarding LAG, it can be used to connect a CE in an active/standby =
mode where one link is active and another link in standby mode (assuming =
two-link bundle). You cannot use LAG to do active/standby on a per VLAN =
basis (aka EVPN single-active).<o:p class=3D""></o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">I will be travelling over next few days =
with limited email access, so please expect some delay for my =
responses.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">Cheers,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">Ali<o:p class=3D""></o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-width: 1pt; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, =
223); padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;" class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><b class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt;" =
class=3D"">From:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt;" class=3D"">Alexander Vainshtein &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: =
rgb(149, 79, 114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Date:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>Sunday, September 2, =
2018 at 6:09 AM<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">To:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>Cisco Employee &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:sajassi@cisco.com" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D"">sajassi@cisco.com</a>&gt;<br =
class=3D""><b class=3D"">Cc:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>"<a =
href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D"">bess@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D"">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;, Michael =
Gorokhovsky &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com" =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com</a>&gt;, Shell Nakash &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, =
114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com</a>&gt;, Ron Sdayoor &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, =
114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com</a>&gt;, Rotem Cohen &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, =
114); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Subject:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>A question regarding =
Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><a name=3D"_MailOriginalBody" class=3D"">Ali and all,<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></a></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">I have a question regarding one of the aspects of RFC 7432, =
namely operation of the default Designated Forwarder (DF) election =
process on an Ethernet Segment (ES) that operates in the Single-Active =
Redundancy Mode.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span class=3D"">RFC 7432 defines the =
Single-Active Redundancy Mode in Section 3 as following:<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt =
36pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span=
 class=3D"">=E2=80=9C</span><span class=3D""><b class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-family: 'Courier New';" class=3D"">Only a single PE, among =
all the PEs attached to an Ethernet segment, is allowed to forward =
traffic to/from that Ethernet segment for a given =
VLAN</span></b>=E2=80=9D.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt 36pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">The same RFC in Section 8.5 also specifies that the DF for a =
specific VLAN on a multi-homed Ethernet segment (ES) is the only PE =
attached to this segment that is responsible for sending BUM traffic for =
this VLAN to the CE. It also defined the default DF election procedure =
that elects a single =E2=80=9Clive=E2=80=9D PE on the specific ES as the =
DF for each specific EVI that is represented on this ES.<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">These two definitions look contradictory to =
me, because:<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><ol start=3D"1" type=3D"1" =
style=3D"margin-bottom: 0cm; margin-top: 0cm;" class=3D""><li =
class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span class=3D"">The default DF =
election procedure only involves the PEs attached to the specific ES<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span class=3D"">In the Single-Active Redundancy mode the =
elected DF for a specific VLAN must also be the only PE that is allowed =
to forward traffic received with this VLAN from the CEs to the peer PEs. =
It is not clear to me, how this can be achieved.<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span><ol start=3D"1" type=3D"a" style=3D"margin-bottom:=
 0cm; margin-top: 0cm;" class=3D""><li class=3D"MsoNormal" =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span class=3D"">The RFC mentions MVRP as a =
possible method to notify the attached CEs that a specific PE is NOT a =
DF for a specific VLAN in the case of an ES that operates in the =
Single-Active Redundancy Mode. Does this mean that CEs that are attached =
to a multi-homed ES operating in Single-Active Redundancy Mode SHOULD =
support MVRP?<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span class=3D"">Are there any alternatives to =
MVRP that can be used for this purpose. In particular, is it possible to =
use Ethernet Local Management Interface (E-LMI) as defined in<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><a =
href=3D"http://www.mef.net/resources/technical-specifications/download?id=3D=
42&amp;fileid=3Dfile1" style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">MEF-16</span><span class=3D""></span></a><span class=3D""><span=
 class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>for this purpose?<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span class=3D"">The RFC mentions LAG as the method to =
connect the CE to a multi-homed ES operating in the All-Active =
Redundancy Mode. Is it possible to connect a CE that uses LAG to a =
multi-homed ES operating in the Single-Active Redundancy Mode?<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></li></ol></li></ol><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span class=3D"">Your feedback would be =
highly appreciated.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">Regards, and lots of thanks in advance,<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">Sasha<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span class=3D"">Office: =
+972-39266302<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+972-549266302<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><span class=3D"">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: =
rgb(149, 79, 114); text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</span><span =
class=3D""></span></a><span class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
 style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 12pt; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________________________=
____________<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">This e-mail message is =
intended for the recipient only and contains information which is<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D"">CONFIDENTIAL =
and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have received =
this<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br =
class=3D"">transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or =
fax, and then delete the original<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D"">and all =
copies thereof.<br =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________________________=
____________</span><o:p class=3D""></o:p></p></div><br clear=3D"both" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline =
!important;" =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________________________=
____________</span><br style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=3D""><br style=3D"font-family: =
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: =
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; =
display: inline !important;" class=3D"">This e-mail message is intended =
for the recipient only and contains information which is<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><br =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline =
!important;" class=3D"">CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI =
Telecom. If you have received this<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><br =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; =
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; =
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline =
!important;" class=3D"">transmission in error, please inform us by =
e-mail, phone or fax, and then delete the original<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><br =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
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From: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2018 02:44:51 -0700
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To: "Acee Lindem (acee)" <acee=40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org>
Cc: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Yes/support
On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 02:06 Acee Lindem (acee) <acee=3D
40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:

> I support WG adoption.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Acee
>
>
>
> *From: *BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Stephane Litkowski <
> stephane.litkowski@orange.com>
> *Date: *Tuesday, September 4, 2018 at 3:29 AM
> *To: *"bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *[bess] WG adoption poll for
> draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
>
>
>
> Hi WG,
>
>
>
> This email begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption
> draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]
>
>
>
> Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group
> list, stating whether or not you support adoption.
>
>
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to
> this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with
> IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
> If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please
> respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any
> relevant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won=
't
> progress without answers from all the authors and contributors.
>
>
>
> If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please
> explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been
> disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.
>
>
>
> The poll for working group adoption closes on Tue 18th September.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> St=C3=A9phane and Matthew
>
>
>
> [1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________________=
________________________________________________
>
>
>
> Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confid=
entielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
>
> pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez re=
cu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
>
> a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages =
electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
>
> Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme o=
u falsifie. Merci.
>
>
>
> This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged i=
nformation that may be protected by law;
>
> they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
>
> If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and de=
lete this message and its attachments.
>
> As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have bee=
n modified, changed or falsified.
>
> Thank you.
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>

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Yes/support<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Tue, Sep 4, 2=
018 at 02:06 Acee Lindem (acee) &lt;acee=3D<a href=3D"mailto:40cisco.com@dm=
arc.ietf.org">40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquot=
e class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc sol=
id;padding-left:1ex">





<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"m_3613602804958183625WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">I support WG adopti=
on. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">Thanks,<u></u><u></=
u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt">Acee<u></u><u></u><=
/span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u=
></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><b><span style=3D"font-si=
ze:12.0pt;color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">BESS &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&=
gt; on behalf of Stephane Litkowski &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:stephane.litkowsk=
i@orange.com" target=3D"_blank">stephane.litkowski@orange.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Tuesday, September 4, 2018 at 3:29 AM<br>
<b>To: </b>&quot;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bess@ie=
tf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">bes=
s@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>[bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequa=
l-lb-04<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div></div></div><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple"><div c=
lass=3D"m_3613602804958183625WordSection1">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><a name=3D"m_361360280495=
8183625__MailOriginalBody"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Hi WG=
,</span><u></u><u></u></a></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">This email begins a two-week poll for BESS working =
group adoption draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]</span><u></u><u><=
/u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">Please review the draft and post any comments to th=
e BESS working group list, stating whether or not you support adoption.</sp=
an><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclose=
d IPR that applies to this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed =
in
 compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for mor=
e details).</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">If you are listed as an author or a contributor of =
this document, please respond to this email and indicate whether or not you
 are aware of any relevant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. =
The document won&#39;t progress without answers from all the authors and co=
ntributors.</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">If you are not listed as an author or a contributor=
, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has =
not
 yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.</span><u></u><u></u></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">The poll for working group adoption closes on Tue 1=
8<sup>th</sup> September. =C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">Regards,</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
" style=3D"color:black">St=C3=A9phane and Matthew</span><u></u><u></u></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
">[1]
</span></span><a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-be=
ss-evpn-unequal-lb/" target=3D"_blank"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB">https://d=
atatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/</span></span><=
span></span></a><span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span lang=3D"EN-GB=
">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span style=3D"font=
-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=A0</span><u=
></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><span style=3D"font=
-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,serif">=C2=A0</span><u=
></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u=
></span></p>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>_____________________________________=
___________________________________________________________________________=
_________<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuv=
ent contenir des informations confidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent=
 donc<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copie=
s sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le s=
ignaler<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>a l&#39;expediteur et le detruire ain=
si que les pieces jointes. Les messages electroniques etant susceptibles d&=
#39;alteration,<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>Orange decline toute responsabilite s=
i ce message a ete altere, deforme ou falsifie. Merci.<u></u><u></u></span>=
</pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>This message and its attachments may =
contain confidential or privileged information that may be protected by law=
;<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:.5in"><span>they should not be distributed, used =
or copied without authorisation.<u></u><u></u></span></pre>
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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: Krzysztof Szarkowicz <kszarkowicz@gmail.com>
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Thread-Topic: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/i75664rxiO9ABU1q16IpmKl-ZeM>
Subject: Re: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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From: Krzysztof Szarkowicz <kszarkowicz@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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Hi Sasha,

Yes, the end result is sort of Port-Active from the draft you reference, =
although the tool set (DF election methodology) is not the same.

Thanks,

> On 2018-Sep-04, at 13:53, Alexander Vainshtein =
<Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:
>=20
> Krzysztof,
> Lots of thanks for your email. If I understand you correctly, it =
actually replaces Single-Active Redundancy Mode with the Port-Active one =
as defined in the corresponding draft =
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-brissette-bess-evpn-mh-pa-01> (it =
also uses the Preference-Based DF Election =
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-pref-df-01> mechanism =
but tweaks it in such a way that it selects the same DF for all VLANs).
> =20
> Regards,
> Sasha
> =20
> Office: +972-39266302
> Cell:      +972-549266302
> Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
> =20
> From: Krzysztof Szarkowicz [mailto:kszarkowicz@gmail.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 12:14 PM
> To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
> Cc: Ali Sajassi (sajassi) <sajassi@cisco.com>; Michael Gorokhovsky =
<Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>; Rotem Cohen =
<Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>; Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>; =
bess@ietf.org; Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>
> Subject: Re: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy =
mode and DF election in RFC 7432
> =20
> Hi Sasha,
> =20
> To use LAG in A/S mode on per VLAN basis, you can use =E2=80=98hack=E2=80=
=99, where you use preference-based DF election =
(draft-ietf-bess-evpn-pref-df) to ensure with the configuration that =
*all* VLANs on given ESI use PE1 as DF, and *all* VLANs on that ESI use =
PE2 as non-DF. Then, you need to have a mechanism to signal from PE2 to =
the CE the link standby status (e.g. via LACP, as used in MC-LAG =
deployments; or, I could even imagine per link CFM/LFM/E-LMI), so that =
CE doesn=E2=80=99t use link to PE2.
> =20
> Thanks,
> Krzysztof
> =20
> =20
> On 2018-Sep-04, at 10:39, Alexander Vainshtein =
<Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>> wrote:
> =20
> Ali,
> Lots of thanks for a prompt and detailed response.
> It matches my understanding of the situation with Single-Active =
Redundancy Mode of Ethernet Segments in EVPN.
> In particular, your confirmation that =E2=80=9CYou cannot use LAG to =
do active/standby on a per VLAN basis (aka EVPN single-active)=E2=80=9D =
was quite important.
> =20
> I have also noticed that Single-Active is not mentioned at all  in RFC =
8388 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8388>. I wonder what this means =
with regard to actual deployment of this mode.
> =20
> Last but not least, I wonder if the expired draft =
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-brissette-bess-evpn-mh-pa-01> on =
Port-Active multi-homing mode for EVPN will be refreshed and if, as part =
of such refresh, any details on the control plane of EVPN would be =
provided.
> =20
> Regards, and, again, lots of thanks,
> Sasha
> =20
> Office: +972-39266302
> Cell:      +972-549266302
> Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
> =20
> From: Ali Sajassi (sajassi) [mailto:sajassi@cisco.com =
<mailto:sajassi@cisco.com>]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 8:00 AM
> To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>>
> Cc: bess@ietf.org <mailto:bess@ietf.org>; Michael Gorokhovsky =
<Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>>; Shell Nakash =
<Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com <mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>>; Ron =
Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com <mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>>; =
Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com <mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>>
> Subject: Re: A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and =
DF election in RFC 7432
> =20
> Hi Sasha,
> =20
> I don=E2=80=99t see any contradiction between the two statements from =
RFC 7432 that you mentioned below. For All-Active, DF election is for =
BUM traffic of a given VLAN (or group of VLANs in case of VLAN bundling) =
in the egress direction toward an ES. For Single-Active, DF election is =
for all traffic of a given VLAN (or group of VLANs =E2=80=A6) in both =
directions of an ES. Now with respect to notification of active VLANs to =
a CE device: MVRP mechanism that is mentioned in the RFC is an IEEE =
standard way of doing such thing. However, if the CE support E-LMI, then =
that protocol can be used as well. Regarding LAG, it can be used to =
connect a CE in an active/standby mode where one link is active and =
another link in standby mode (assuming two-link bundle). You cannot use =
LAG to do active/standby on a per VLAN basis (aka EVPN single-active).
> =20
> I will be travelling over next few days with limited email access, so =
please expect some delay for my responses.
> =20
> Cheers,
> Ali
> =20
> From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>>
> Date: Sunday, September 2, 2018 at 6:09 AM
> To: Cisco Employee <sajassi@cisco.com <mailto:sajassi@cisco.com>>
> Cc: "bess@ietf.org <mailto:bess@ietf.org>" <bess@ietf.org =
<mailto:bess@ietf.org>>, Michael Gorokhovsky =
<Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>>, Shell Nakash =
<Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com <mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>>, Ron =
Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com <mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>>, =
Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com <mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>>
> Subject: A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF =
election in RFC 7432
> =20
> Ali and all, <>
> I have a question regarding one of the aspects of RFC 7432, namely =
operation of the default Designated Forwarder (DF) election process on =
an Ethernet Segment (ES) that operates in the Single-Active Redundancy =
Mode.
> =20
> RFC 7432 defines the Single-Active Redundancy Mode in Section 3 as =
following:
> =E2=80=9COnly a single PE, among all the PEs attached to an Ethernet =
segment, is allowed to forward traffic to/from that Ethernet segment for =
a given VLAN=E2=80=9D.
> =20
> The same RFC in Section 8.5 also specifies that the DF for a specific =
VLAN on a multi-homed Ethernet segment (ES) is the only PE attached to =
this segment that is responsible for sending BUM traffic for this VLAN =
to the CE. It also defined the default DF election procedure that elects =
a single =E2=80=9Clive=E2=80=9D PE on the specific ES as the DF for each =
specific EVI that is represented on this ES.
> =20
> These two definitions look contradictory to me, because:
> The default DF election procedure only involves the PEs attached to =
the specific ES
> In the Single-Active Redundancy mode the elected DF for a specific =
VLAN must also be the only PE that is allowed to forward traffic =
received with this VLAN from the CEs to the peer PEs. It is not clear to =
me, how this can be achieved.=20
> The RFC mentions MVRP as a possible method to notify the attached CEs =
that a specific PE is NOT a DF for a specific VLAN in the case of an ES =
that operates in the Single-Active Redundancy Mode. Does this mean that =
CEs that are attached to a multi-homed ES operating in Single-Active =
Redundancy Mode SHOULD support MVRP?
> Are there any alternatives to MVRP that can be used for this purpose. =
In particular, is it possible to use Ethernet Local Management Interface =
(E-LMI) as defined in MEF-16 =
<http://www.mef.net/resources/technical-specifications/download?id=3D42&fi=
leid=3Dfile1> for this purpose?
> The RFC mentions LAG as the method to connect the CE to a multi-homed =
ES operating in the All-Active Redundancy Mode. Is it possible to =
connect a CE that uses LAG to a multi-homed ES operating in the =
Single-Active Redundancy Mode?
> =20
> Your feedback would be highly appreciated.
> =20
> Regards, and lots of thanks in advance,
> Sasha
> =20
> Office: +972-39266302
> Cell:      +972-549266302
> Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com =
<mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
> =20
>=20
> =
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Hi Sasha,<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Yes, the end result is sort of Port-Active from the draft you =
reference, although the tool set (DF election methodology) is not the =
same.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Thanks,</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">On =
2018-Sep-04, at 13:53, Alexander Vainshtein &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"WordSection1" style=3D"page: WordSection1; font-family: =
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: =
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Krzysztof,<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Lots of thanks for your email. If I =
understand you correctly, it actually replaces Single-Active Redundancy =
Mode with the Port-Active one as defined in the corresponding<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-brissette-bess-evpn-mh-pa-01" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">draft</a><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>(it=
 also uses the<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-pref-df-01" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Preference-Based DF Election</a><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>mechanism but tweaks it in =
such a way that it selects the same DF for all VLANs).<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Regards,<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Sasha<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div=
 style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Office: =
+972-39266302<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; +972-549266302<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</a><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-width: 1pt; =
border-top-color: rgb(225, 225, 225); padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><b class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Krzysztof Szarkowicz [<a =
href=3D"mailto:kszarkowicz@gmail.com" =
class=3D"">mailto:kszarkowicz@gmail.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, September 4, 2018 =
12:14 PM<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">To:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Alexander Vainshtein &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Cc:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Ali =
Sajassi (sajassi) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sajassi@cisco.com" =
class=3D"">sajassi@cisco.com</a>&gt;; Michael Gorokhovsky &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com" =
class=3D"">Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com</a>&gt;; Rotem Cohen &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com" =
class=3D"">Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com</a>&gt;; Shell Nakash &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com" =
class=3D"">Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com</a>&gt;; <a =
href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" class=3D"">bess@ietf.org</a>; Ron Sdayoor =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com" =
class=3D"">Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com</a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: [bess] A question =
regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC =
7432<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin:=
 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D"">Hi Sasha,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D"">To use LAG in A/S mode on per VLAN basis, you can use =
=E2=80=98hack=E2=80=99, where you use preference-based DF election =
(draft-ietf-bess-evpn-pref-df) to ensure with the configuration that =
*all* VLANs on given ESI use PE1 as DF, and *all* VLANs on that ESI use =
PE2 as non-DF. Then, you need to have a mechanism to signal from PE2 to =
the CE the link standby status (e.g. via LACP, as used in MC-LAG =
deployments; or, I could even imagine per link CFM/LFM/E-LMI), so that =
CE doesn=E2=80=99t use link to PE2.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D"">Thanks,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D"">Krzysztof<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div =
class=3D""><blockquote style=3D"margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;" =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D"">On =
2018-Sep-04, at 10:39, Alexander Vainshtein &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Ali,</span><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Lots of thanks for a =
prompt and detailed response.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">It matches my =
understanding of the situation with Single-Active Redundancy Mode of =
Ethernet Segments in EVPN.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">In particular, your =
confirmation that =E2=80=9C</span><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; background-color: yellow; =
background-position: initial initial; background-repeat: initial =
initial;" class=3D"">You cannot use LAG to do active/standby on a per =
VLAN basis (aka EVPN single-active)</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">=E2=80=9D was quite important.</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">I =
have also noticed that Single-Active is not mentioned at all =
&nbsp;in<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8388" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" class=3D"">RFC 8388</span></a>. I wonder what this means with =
regard to actual deployment of this mode.</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Last but not least, I wonder if the expired<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-brissette-bess-evpn-mh-pa-01" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" class=3D"">draft</span></a><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>on Port-Active multi-homing =
mode for EVPN will be refreshed and if, as part of such refresh, any =
details on the control plane of EVPN would be provided.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Regards, and, again, lots of thanks,</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Sasha</span><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Office: +972-39266302</span><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+972-549266302</span><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</span></a></span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-width: 1pt; =
border-top-color: rgb(225, 225, 225); padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;" =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><b =
class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">From:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">Ali Sajassi (sajassi) [<a href=3D"mailto:sajassi@cisco.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" =
class=3D"">mailto:sajassi@cisco.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, September 4, 2018 =
8:00 AM<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">To:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Alexander Vainshtein &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;<br =
class=3D""><b class=3D"">Cc:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" =
class=3D"">bess@ietf.org</span></a>; Michael Gorokhovsky &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" class=3D"">Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;; =
Shell Nakash &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" =
class=3D"">Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;; Ron Sdayoor &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" class=3D"">Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;; Rotem =
Cohen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: =
rgb(149, 79, 114);" class=3D"">Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;<br =
class=3D""><b class=3D"">Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: A question regarding =
Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">Hi Sasha,<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">I don=E2=80=99t see any contradiction between =
the two statements from RFC 7432 that you mentioned below. For =
All-Active, DF election is for BUM traffic of a given VLAN (or group of =
VLANs in case of VLAN bundling) in the egress direction toward an ES. =
For Single-Active, DF election is for all traffic of a given VLAN (or =
group of VLANs =E2=80=A6) in both directions of an ES. Now with respect =
to notification of active VLANs to a CE device: MVRP mechanism that is =
mentioned in the RFC is an IEEE standard way of doing such thing. =
However, if the CE support E-LMI, then that protocol can be used as =
well. Regarding LAG, it can be used to connect a CE in an active/standby =
mode where one link is active and another link in standby mode (assuming =
two-link bundle). You cannot use LAG to do active/standby on a per VLAN =
basis (aka EVPN single-active).<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">I will be travelling over next few days with =
limited email access, so please expect some delay for my responses.<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">Cheers,<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">Ali<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div =
style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-width: 1pt; =
border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;" =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><b =
class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">From:<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span></b><span =
style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">Alexander =
Vainshtein &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" =
class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;<br =
class=3D""><b class=3D"">Date:<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>Sunday, September 2, =
2018 at 6:09 AM<br class=3D""><b class=3D"">To:<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>Cisco Employee &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:sajassi@cisco.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" class=3D"">sajassi@cisco.com</span></a>&gt;<br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">Cc:<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>"<a =
href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" =
class=3D"">bess@ietf.org</span></a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" =
class=3D"">bess@ietf.org</span></a>&gt;, Michael Gorokhovsky &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" class=3D"">Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;, =
Shell Nakash &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" =
class=3D"">Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;, Ron Sdayoor &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" class=3D"">Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;, Rotem =
Cohen &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: =
rgb(149, 79, 114);" class=3D"">Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com</span></a>&gt;<br =
class=3D""><b class=3D"">Subject:<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></b>A question regarding =
Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><a =
name=3D"_MailOriginalBody" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">Ali and =
all,</span></a><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">I =
have a question regarding one of the aspects of RFC 7432, namely =
operation of the default Designated Forwarder (DF) election process on =
an Ethernet Segment (ES) that operates in the Single-Active Redundancy =
Mode.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">RFC 7432 defines the Single-Active Redundancy =
Mode in Section 3 as following:<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">=E2=80=9C</span><b class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: 'Courier New';" class=3D"">Only a single PE, among all the =
PEs attached to an Ethernet segment, is allowed to forward traffic =
to/from that Ethernet segment for a given VLAN</span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">=E2=80=9D.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div =
style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;" class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" =
class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">The same RFC in Section 8.5 also specifies that =
the DF for a specific VLAN on a multi-homed Ethernet segment (ES) is the =
only PE attached to this segment that is responsible for sending BUM =
traffic for this VLAN to the CE. It also defined the default DF election =
procedure that elects a single =E2=80=9Clive=E2=80=9D PE on the specific =
ES as the DF for each specific EVI that is represented on this ES.<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">These two definitions look contradictory to me, =
because:<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><ol start=3D"1" =
type=3D"1" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0cm; margin-top: 0cm;" class=3D""><li =
class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">The default DF election =
procedure only involves the PEs attached to the specific ES<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">In the Single-Active Redundancy mode the elected =
DF for a specific VLAN must also be the only PE that is allowed to =
forward traffic received with this VLAN from the CEs to the peer PEs. It =
is not clear to me, how this can be achieved.<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></li></ol><ol start=3D"2" type=3D"1" =
style=3D"margin-bottom: 0cm; margin-top: 0cm;" class=3D""><ol start=3D"1" =
type=3D"a" style=3D"margin-bottom: 0cm; margin-top: 0cm;" class=3D""><li =
class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">The RFC mentions MVRP as a =
possible method to notify the attached CEs that a specific PE is NOT a =
DF for a specific VLAN in the case of an ES that operates in the =
Single-Active Redundancy Mode. Does this mean that CEs that are attached =
to a multi-homed ES operating in Single-Active Redundancy Mode SHOULD =
support MVRP?<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">Are there any alternatives to MVRP that =
can be used for this purpose. In particular, is it possible to use =
Ethernet Local Management Interface (E-LMI) as defined in<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"http://www.mef.net/resources/technical-specifications/download?id=3D=
42&amp;fileid=3Dfile1" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, 79, 114);" =
class=3D"">MEF-16</span></a><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>for this purpose?<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></li><li class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">The RFC mentions LAG as the method to connect =
the CE to a multi-homed ES operating in the All-Active Redundancy Mode. =
Is it possible to connect a CE that uses LAG to a multi-homed ES =
operating in the Single-Active Redundancy Mode?<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></li></ol></ol><div class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">Your feedback would be highly appreciated.<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">Regards, and lots of thanks in advance,<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">Sasha<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div=
 class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">Office: +972-39266302<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+972-549266302<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div =
class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" =
class=3D"">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: rgb(149, =
79, 114);" class=3D"">Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com</span></a><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><div class=3D""><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">&nbsp;<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div></div><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 12pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________________________=
____________<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">This e-mail message is =
intended for the recipient only and contains information which is<span =
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class=3D"">BESS mailing list<br class=3D""></span><a =
href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
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class=3D""></o:p></div></div></blockquote></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;" class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div></div></div><br =
clear=3D"both" style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; =
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-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
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____________</span><br style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; =
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normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: Krzysztof Szarkowicz <kszarkowicz@gmail.com>
CC: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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Subject: Re: [bess] A question regarding Single-Active ES redundancy mode and DF election in RFC 7432
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To: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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From: John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>
To: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/5Tydr9zGbCiRIxAImIZnaJVxFPs>
Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Support, not aware of any IPR.

Yours Irrespectively,

John

From: BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of stephane.litkowski@orange.c=
om
Sent: Tuesday, September 4, 2018 3:29 AM
To: bess@ietf.org
Subject: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04

Hi WG,

This email begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption draft-mal=
hotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]

Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group lis=
t, stating whether or not you support adoption.

We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to th=
is Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF =
IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please re=
spond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any releva=
nt undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won't progr=
ess without answers from all the authors and contributors.

If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly=
 respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed i=
n conformance with IETF rules.

The poll for working group adoption closes on Tue 18th September.

Regards,
St=E9phane and Matthew

[1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/<h=
ttps://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_=
doc_draft-2Dmalhotra-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dunequal-2Dlb_&d=3DDwMFAw&c=3DHAkYuh63r=
suhr6Scbfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&r=3DCRB2tJiQePk0cT-h5LGhEWH-s_xXXup3HzvB=
SMRj5VE&m=3DVjM64NzYpPR3pRiBKT0oADwZyBAU_6r5y6b5hDOb5Ww&s=3DmWFLKysp3p5rxT8=
b-YM-v9rycm4kDB0k9yNrtlncwsI&e=3D>






___________________________________________________________________________=
______________________________________________



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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Support, not aware of =
any IPR.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Yours Irrespectively,<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">John<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> BESS &lt;bess-bounces@ietf.org&gt; <b>O=
n Behalf Of </b>
stephane.litkowski@orange.com<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, September 4, 2018 3:29 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequa=
l-lb-04<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Hi WG,<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">This emai=
l begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption draft-malhotra-bes=
s-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Please re=
view the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group list, statin=
g whether or not you support adoption.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">We are al=
so polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this Docume=
nt, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules=
 (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for
 more details).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please respond to =
this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevant undisc=
losed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list.
 The document won't progress without answers from all the authors and contr=
ibutors.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly respond =
only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conform=
ance with IETF rules.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">The poll =
for working group adoption closes on Tue 18<sup>th</sup> September. &nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Regards,<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">St=E9phan=
e and Matthew<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">[1] <a href=3D"https://urldefen=
se.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=3Dhttps-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_draft-2Dmal=
hotra-2Dbess-2Devpn-2Dunequal-2Dlb_&amp;d=3DDwMFAw&amp;c=3DHAkYuh63rsuhr6Sc=
bfh0UjBXeMK-ndb3voDTXcWzoCI&amp;r=3DCRB2tJiQePk0cT-h5LGhEWH-s_xXXup3HzvBSMR=
j5VE&amp;m=3DVjM64NzYpPR3pRiBKT0oADwZyBAU_6r5y6b5hDOb5Ww&amp;s=3DmWFLKysp3p=
5rxT8b-YM-v9rycm4kDB0k9yNrtlncwsI&amp;e=3D">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/</a><o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,serif"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,serif"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<pre>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations con=
fidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez=
 recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messag=
es electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deform=
e ou falsifie. Merci.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privilege=
d information that may be protected by law;<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.<=
o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and=
 delete this message and its attachments.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have =
been modified, changed or falsified.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Thank you.<o:p></o:p></pre>
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From: "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>
To: "LINGALA, AVINASH" <ar977m@att.com>, "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2018 14:09:49 +0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/-zmSZJDXcgBdLBc4yUWoNQruNpw>
Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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From: "Mankamana Mishra (mankamis)" <mankamis@cisco.com>
To: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2018 14:50:32 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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From: Neeraj Malhotra <neeraj.ietf@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 4 Sep 2018 11:14:25 -0700
Message-ID: <CAF3QiHFWrsXMRA5nUu-Y+aUCoNTAzA6vdfAv8oXpNPn4mf_z+g@mail.gmail.com>
To: stephane.litkowski@orange.com
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/-TCFZ0Jc5itTQjmQJUl4VeQPqh4>
Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Hi,

Support WG adoption as co-author. I am not aware of any IPR related to this
document.

Thanks,
Neeraj


On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 12:29 AM <stephane.litkowski@orange.com> wrote:

> Hi WG,
>
>
>
> This email begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption
> draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]
>
>
>
> Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group
> list, stating whether or not you support adoption.
>
>
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to
> this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with
> IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
> If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please
> respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any
> relevant undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won=
't
> progress without answers from all the authors and contributors.
>
>
>
> If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please
> explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been
> disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.
>
>
>
> The poll for working group adoption closes on Tue 18th September.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
> St=C3=A9phane and Matthew
>
>
>
> [1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________________=
________________________________________________
>
> Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confid=
entielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
> pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez re=
cu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
> a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages =
electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
> Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme o=
u falsifie. Merci.
>
> This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged i=
nformation that may be protected by law;
> they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
> If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and de=
lete this message and its attachments.
> As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have bee=
n modified, changed or falsified.
> Thank you.
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>

--0000000000006dceba05750fa131
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div>Hi,</div><div><br></div><div>Support WG adoption =
as co-author. I am not aware of any IPR related to this document.</div><div=
><br></div><div>Thanks,</div><div>Neeraj</div><div><br></div></div><br><div=
 class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Tue, Sep 4, 2018 at 12:29 AM &lt=
;<a href=3D"mailto:stephane.litkowski@orange.com" target=3D"_blank">stephan=
e.litkowski@orange.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_q=
uote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1e=
x">





<div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"m_-1384153207613100999m_7211704643860919248WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Hi WG,<u>=
</u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">This emai=
l begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption draft-malhotra-bes=
s-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u>=
</u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Please re=
view the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group list, statin=
g whether or not you support adoption.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u>=
</u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">We are al=
so polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this Docume=
nt, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules=
 (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for
 more details).<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please respond to =
this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevant undisc=
losed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list.
 The document won&#39;t progress without answers from all the authors and c=
ontributors.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly respond =
only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conform=
ance with IETF rules.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">The poll =
for working group adoption closes on Tue 18<sup>th</sup> September. =C2=A0<=
u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">=C2=A0<u>=
</u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Regards,<=
u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">St=C3=A9p=
hane and Matthew<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">[1] <a href=3D"https://datatrac=
ker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/" target=3D"_blank">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/</a><u=
></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<pre>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l&#39;expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les message=
s electroniques etant susceptibles d&#39;alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been =
modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.
</pre></div>

_______________________________________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div>

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From: "Krishna Muddenahally Ananthamurthy (kriswamy)" <kriswamy@cisco.com>
To: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Subject: [bess] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election-00.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : Per multicast flow Designated Forwarder Election for EVPN
        Authors         : Ali Sajassi
                          Mankamana Mishra
                          Samir Thoria
                          Jorge Rabadan
                          John Drake
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election-00.txt
	Pages           : 12
	Date            : 2018-09-04

Abstract:
   [RFC7432] describes mechanism to elect designated forwarder (DF) at
   the granularity of (ESI, EVI) which is per VLAN (or per group of
   VLANs in case of VLAN bundle or VLAN-aware bundle service).  However,
   the current level of granularity of per-VLAN is not adequate for some
   applications.[I-D.ietf-bess-evpn-df-election-framework] improves base
   line DF election by introducing HRW DF election.
   [I-D.ietf-bess-evpn-igmp-mld-proxy] introduces applicability of EVPN
   to Multicast flows, routes to sync them and a default DF election.
   This document is an extension to HRW base draft
   [I-D.ietf-bess-evpn-df-election-framework] and further enhances HRW
   algorithm for the Multicast flows to do DF election at the
   granularity of (ESI, VLAN, Mcast flow).


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election-00
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-per-mcast-flow-df-election-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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--_000_4AE44CE959CC4948B2915DF0C0C07D62nokiacom_--


From nobody Wed Sep  5 06:02:20 2018
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From: <thomas.morin@orange.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining
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Hi Stéphane, all,

On 03/09/2018 10:30, stephane.litkowski@orange.com wrote:
>
> We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies 
> to this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance 
> with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
>
> If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor of this Document 
> please respond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware 
> of any relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress without 
> answers from all the Authors and Contributors.
>
I'm not aware of any such undisclosed IPR.

> We are also polling for any existing implementation as per [2].
>
The OpenStack networking-bagpipe [1] project has an implementation of 
the API from the OpenStack networking-sfc [2] project based on the 
specifications in this draft.

Best,

-Thomas

[1] 
https://docs.openstack.org/networking-bagpipe/latest/user/applications.html#service-chaining-sfc
[2] https://docs.openstack.org/networking-sfc/latest



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From: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
To: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Date: Thu, 6 Sep 2018 00:28:39 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: "draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org" <draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org>
CC: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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Subject: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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Dear authors of the EVPN OAM requirements and Framework<https://tools.ietf=
.org/html/draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk-00> draft,
I have looked up the draft, and it looks to me as a good starting point fo=
r work on EVPN OAM.
I would like to clarify two points with regard to the draft:

1.       In order to pass unicast EAOM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the local=
 MAC-VRF must learn the MAC address of the customer MEP and advertise it t=
o remote PEs as a MAC/IP Advertisement route. Should this be considered as=
 a special case of learning from the control plane (in addition to ARP/NDP=
/DHCP/DHCPv6 that are mentioned in RFC 7432)?

2.       Tre draft seems to propose extension of LSP Ping to test/verify c=
onnectivity to the FECs advertised as NRLI of EVPN routes. I have checked =
the IANA Registry, and no values for these FECs have been allocated yet.  =
Do you plan any specific work on this?

Regards,
Sasha

Office: +972-39266302
Cell:      +972-549266302
Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com


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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear authors of <a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/h=
tml/draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk-00">
the EVPN OAM requirements and Framework</a> draft,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have looked up the draft, and it looks to me as a=
 good starting point for work on EVPN OAM.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I would like to clarify two points with regard to t=
he draft:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 lev=
el1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span sty=
le=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>In order to pass unicast =
EAOM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the local MAC-VRF must learn the MAC addres=
s of the customer MEP and advertise it to remote PEs as a MAC/IP Advertise=
ment route. Should this be considered
 as a special case of learning from the control plane (in addition to ARP/=
NDP/DHCP/DHCPv6 that are mentioned in RFC 7432)?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 lev=
el1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span sty=
le=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>Tre draft seems to propos=
e extension of LSP Ping to test/verify connectivity to the FECs advertised=
 as NRLI of EVPN routes. I have checked the IANA Registry, and no values f=
or these FECs have been allocated yet.&nbsp;
 Do you plan any specific work on this?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sasha<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Office: &#43;972-39266302<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;972-549266=
302<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp; Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com=
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<br clear=3D"both">
__________________________________________________________________________=
_<BR>
<BR>
This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains inform=
ation which is <BR>
CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have rece=
ived this <BR>
transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and then =
delete the original <BR>
and all copies thereof.<BR>
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From nobody Thu Sep  6 15:15:58 2018
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From: David Schinazi <dschinazi@apple.com>
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Subject: [bess] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-10
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Reviewer: David Schinazi
Review result: Ready with Nits

I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area
Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed
by the IESG for the IETF Chair.  Please treat these comments just
like any other last call comments.

For more information, please see the FAQ at

<https://trac.ietf.org/trac/gen/wiki/GenArtfaq>.

Document: draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-10
Reviewer: David Schinazi
Review Date: 2018-09-06
IETF LC End Date: 2018-09-03
IESG Telechat date: 2018-09-13

Summary: This document is clearly written and looks ready to me.

Major issues: None found.

Minor issues: None found. 

Nits/editorial comments: Typo "senstive" - please run the internet draft spellchecker tool.



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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : L2L3 VPN Multicast MIB
        Authors         : Zhaohui (Jeffrey) Zhang
                          Hiroshi Tsunoda
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16.txt
	Pages           : 20
	Date            : 2018-09-07

Abstract:
   This memo defines a portion of the Management Information Base (MIB)
   for use with network management protocols in the Internet community.
   In particular, it describes two MIB modules which will be used by
   other MIB modules for monitoring and/or configuring Layer 2 and Layer
   3 Virtual Private Networks that support multicast.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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Subject: [bess] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : BGP/MPLS Layer 3 VPN Multicast Management Information Base
        Author          : Hiroshi Tsunoda
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11.txt
	Pages           : 56
	Date            : 2018-09-07

Abstract:
   This memo defines a portion of the Management Information Base (MIB)
   for use with network management protocols in the Internet community.
   In particular, it describes managed objects to configure and/or
   monitor Multicast communication over IP Virtual Private Networks
   (VPNs) supported by MultiProtocol Label Switching/Border Gateway
   Protcol (MPLS/BGP) on a Provider Edge router.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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Subject: Re: [bess] Comments on draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-mvpn-seamless-interop
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Eric> 1. It seems that the proposal does not do correct ethernet 
emulation.  Intra-subnet multicast only sometimes preserves MAC SA and 
IP TTL, sometimes not, depending upon the topology.

Ali> EVPN doesn't provide LAN service per IEEE 802.1Q but rather an 
emulation of LAN service. This document defines what that emulation means

The fact that the proposal doesn't do correct ethernet emulation cannot 
be resolved by having the proposal redefine "emulation" to mean 
"whatever the proposal does".

EVPN needs to ensure that whatever works on a real ethernet will work on 
the emulated ethernet as well; the externally visible service 
characteristics on which the higher layers may depend must be properly 
offered by the emulation.  This applies to both unicast and multicast 
equally.

Otherwise anyone attempting to replace a real ethernet with EVPN will 
find that not every application and/or protocol working on the real 
ethernet will continue to work on the EVPN.

Eric> TTL handling for inter-subnet multicast seems inconsistent as 
well, depending upon the topology.

Ali> BTW, TTL handling for inter-subnet IP multicast traffic is done 
consistent!

Consider the following in a pure MVPN environment:

- Source S is on subnet1, which is attached to PE1.

- Receivers R1 and R2 are on subnet2, which is attached to both PE1 and PE2.

- Subnet1 and subnet2 are different subnets.

Now every (S,G) packet will follow the same path: either (a) 
subnet1-->PE1-->subnet2 or (b) subnet1-->PE1-->PE2-->subnet2.

Both paths cannot be used at the same time, because L3 multicast will 
not allow both PE1 and PE2 to transmit the (S,G) flow to subnet2.  So an 
(S,G) packet received by R1 will always have the same TTL as the same 
packet received by R2.  TTL scoping will therefore work consistently; 
depending on the routing, and from the perspective of any given flow, 
the two subnets are either one hop away from each other, or two hops 
away from each other.

In the so-called "seamless-mcast" scheme, on the other hand, if R1 and 
R2 get the same (S,G) packet, each may see a different TTL. Suppose R1 
is on an ES attached to PE1 but not to PE2, S is on an ES attached to 
PE1 but not to PE2, and R2 is on an ES attached to PE2 but not to PE1.  
Then a given (S,G) packet received by R1 will have a smaller TTL than 
the same packet received by R2, even though R1 and R2 are on the same 
subnet.

Note that the seamless-mcast proposal does not provide the behavior that 
would be provided by MVPN, despite the claim that it is "just MVPN".

This user-visible inconsistency may break any use of TTL scoping, and is 
just the sort of thing that tends generate a stream of service calls 
from customers that pay attention to this sort of stuff.

In general, TTL should be decremented by 0 for intra-subnet and by 1 
(within the EVPN domain) for inter-subnet.  Failure to handle the TTL 
decrement properly will break anything that depends upon RFC 3682 ("The 
Generalized TTL Security Mechanism").  Have you concluded that no use of 
multicast together with RFC 3682 will, now or in the future, ever need 
to run over EVPN?  I'd like to know how that conclusion is supported.  
You may also wish to do a google search for "multicast ttl scoping".

A related issue is that the number of PEs through which a packet passes 
should not be inferrable by a tenant.  Any sort of multicast traceroute 
tool used by a tenant will give unexpected results if TTL is not handled 
properly; at the very least this will result in service calls.

The OISM proposal (as described in the irb-mcast draft) will decrement 
TTL by 1 when packets go from one subnet to another, as an IP multicast 
frame is distributed unchanged to the PEs that need it, and its TTL is 
decremented by 1 if an egress PE needs to deliver it to a subnet other 
than its source subnet.


The draft still makes the following peculiar claim:

"Based on past experiences with MVPN over last dozen years for supported 
IP multicast applications, layer-3 forwarding of intra-subnet multicast 
traffic should be fine."

Since MVPN does not do intra-subnet multicast, experience with MVPN has 
no bearing whatsoever on the needs of intra-subnet multicast.

Eric> 2. In order to do inter-subnet multicast in EVPN, the proposal 
requires L3VPN/MVPN configuration on ALL the EVPN PEs.  This is required 
even when there is no need for MVPN/EVPN interworking. This is portrayed 
as a "low provisioning" solution!

Ali> Using MVPN constructs doesn't requires additional configuration on 
EVPN PEs beyond multicast configuration needed for IRB-mcast operation.

I think you'll find that if you don't reconfigure all the BGP sessions 
to carry AFI/SAFIs 1/128, 2/128, 1/5, and 2/5, you'll have quite a bit 
of trouble running any of the native MVPN procedures ;-) This is perhaps 
the simplest example of additional configuration that is needed.

If doing MVPN/EVPN interworking, one needs to go to every EVPN PE and 
set up all the RTs used to control the distribution of routes within the 
L3VPN domain.  One has to consider whether the RDs already used by EVPN 
are distinct from the RDs already used by L3VPN.  One has to enable the 
tunneling mechanisms that are used in the L3VPN domain (hopefully the 
EVPN PEs can support those tunneling techniques).  If the L3VPN 
deployment has been set up with particular routing policies (special 
communities carried, or whatever), these need to be configured on every 
EVPN PE.  One needs to take account of whether the L3VPN deployment uses 
segmented P-tunnels or non-segmented P-tunnels, and whether it depends 
upon the use of (C-*,C-*) S-PMSI A-D routes or not.  One needs to 
configure whether the L3VPN is expecting procedures of RFC6514 Section 
13 ("rpt-spt") or whether it is expecting procedures of RFC6514 Section 
14 ("spt-only").  I think there are quite a few other configuration 
items (various timers, and additional stuff that I probably don't even 
know about) that may need to be coordinated with the L3VPN deployment 
with which one is attempting to interwork.

To do interworking between EVPN and L3VPN/MVPN, the L3VPN/MVPN stuff 
obviously needs to be configured at the interworking points.  The 
REQUIREMENT to do ALL this configuration at EVERY single EVPN PE is what 
seems excessive.

Even if one is not doing MVPN/EVPN interworking, all this stuff still 
has to be configured; one just wouldn't have to worry about in that case 
about coordinating with a pre-existing MVPN deployment. But no one ever 
called L3VPN a "low provisioning solution".   EVPN (unlike MVPN), has a 
fair amount of auto-provisioning built-in, and one loses the advantages 
of that if one has to do MVPN provisioning on every PE.

Eric> 3. The draft claims that the exact same control plane should be 
used for EVPN and MVPN, despite the fact that MVPN's control plane is 
unaware of certain information that is very important in EVPN (e.g., 
EVIs, TagIDs).

Ali> IP multicast described in the draft is done at the tenant's level 
(IP-VRF) and not BD level !! So, BD level info such as tagIDs are not 
relevant.

The failure to carry BD level info is what causes the ethernet emulation 
to be done incorrectly.  Remember that most of EVPN is taken from L3VPN, 
with modifications to add stuff that is needed to correctly emulate the 
ethernet service.

Certainly if you look at the control plane used by EVPN to distribute 
unicast IP addresses, you'll see that it does not "just use L3VPN", but 
instead has lots of EVPN-specific stuff.

It's also worth pointing out that the draft does not really use the 
exact same control plane as MVPN, as it seems to require that each IP 
host address be advertised in two routes (an EVPN-specific route and a 
VPN-IP route), and the EVPN-specific routes (types 2 or 5) are now 
required to carry attributes that are typically carried only by the 
VPN-IP routes.  Also, there are the intra-ES tunnels (discussed below), 
something that doesn't exist in MVPN.  And then there are those 
under-specified EVPN-specific 'gateways' (discussed below) that are used 
to connect tunnels of different types.

Eric> 4. The draft proposes to use the same tunnels for MVPN and EVPN, 
i.e., to have tunnels that traverse both the MVPN and the EVPN domains.  
Various "requirements" are stated that seem to require this solution.  
Somewhere along the line it was realized that this requirement cannot be 
met if MVPN and EVPN do not use the same tunnel types.  So for this very 
common scenario, a completely different solution is proposed, that (a) 
tries to keep the EVPN control plane out of the MVPN domain, and vice 
versa, and (b) uses different tunnels in the two domains.  Perhaps the 
"requirements" that suggest using a single cross-domain tunnel are not 
really requirements!

Ali> There are SPDCs with MPLS underlay and there are SPDCs with VxLAN 
underlay. We need a solution that is optimum for both. Just the same way 
that we need both ASBR and GWs to optimize connectivity for inter-AS 
scenarios.

My point is that the document states "requirements", but applies them 
very selectively and very inconsistently.  There is a "requirement" to 
"use the same tunnels for MVPN and EVPN", but there are many deployment 
scenarios in which this "requirement" simply cannot be met.  If the 
"requirement" were stated as "only use tunnels that provide value",  I'd 
have no problem with it.  It seems that many of the specified 
requirements were reverse engineered from the solution as it was 
originally proposed, and then are silently ignored whenever it is 
discovered that they can't be met.

Eric> 5a. In some cases, the "requirements" for optimality in one or 
another respect (e.g., routing, replication) are really only 
considerations that an operator should be able to trade off against 
other considerations.  The real requirement is to be able to create a 
deployment scenario in which such optimality is achievable.  Other 
deployment scenarios, that optimize for other considerations, should not 
be prohibited.

Ali> What deployment scenarios do you think are prohibited ?

The draft does not appear support scenarios in which the MVPN/EVPN 
interworking procedures are confined to a subset of the EVPN PEs, and 
not even visible to the majority of the EVPN PEs.

Eric> While the authors have realized that one cannot have cross-domain 
tunnels when EVPN uses VxLAN and MVPN uses MPLS, they do not seem to 
have acknowledged the multitude of other scenarios in which cross-domain 
tunnels cannot be used.  For instance, MVPN may be using mLDP, while 
EVPN is using IR.  Or EVPN may be using "Assisted Replication", which 
does not exist in MVPN.  Or MVPN may be using PIM while EVPN is using 
RSVP-TE P2MP. Etc., etc.  I suspect that "different tunnel types" will 
be the common case, especially when trying to interwork existing MVPN 
and EVPN deployments.

I note that the latest rev of the draft still does not take this into 
account.

Eric> The gateway-based proposal for interworking MVPN and EVPN when 
they use different tunnel types is severely underspecified.

Ali> Agreed. This will be covered in the subsequent revisions.

It doesn't seem to be in the latest revision.

Eric> One possible approach to this would be to have a single MVPN 
domain that includes the EVPN PEs, and to use MVPN tunnel segmentation 
at the boundary. While that is a complicated solution, at least it is 
known to work. However, that does not seem to be what is being proposed.

Ali> It is not clear to me exactly what you are suggesting here. At the 
boundary, is there any mcast address lookup or not?

If I were working on a proposal like the one in seamless-multicast, I 
would consider whether the MVPN inter-AS segmented P-tunnels feature 
could be leveraged at the border nodes between domains that use 
different tunnel types.  After all, one of the main purposes of MVPN 
inter-AS segmentation is to connect domains that use different tunnel 
types.  Done properly, that does not require any IP lookups at the 
ASBRs.  The draft seems to be trying to reinvent MVPN P-tunnel 
segmentation from scratch.  This is a very intricate part of the MVPN 
specs and you can't just make it up as you go along.

Here is just a selection of some of the problems with section 10.1 
("Control Plane Interconnect") of the -02 revision:

- Much of the document seems to assume that the RTs used in the MVPN 
domain will be the same as the RTs used in the EVPN domain.  If that is 
the case, all the A-D routes from one domain will propagate into the 
other.  This does not appear to be compatible with the sketchy 
description of "gateway" behavior given in Section 10.

- Section 10.1 states that the RD in a Source Active A-D route needs to 
be changed when a such a route is re-originated by a gateway. 
Unfortunately, MVPN requires that the SA A-D route for (S,G) have the 
same RD as the unicast route for S.  So you would need to block all the 
IPVPN routes at the gateway and reoriginate them with new RDs.  The spec 
fails to mention this.  Note that this is not even possible if the EVPN 
PEs share the RTs of the MVPN domain.

- Interesting effects could arise if an EVPN PE chooses a gateway as the 
UMH, but the gateway chooses an EVPN PE as the UMH.  Can you demonstrate 
that this is impossible?

- Section 10.1 says that the C-multicast routes originated by the 
gateway carry the "exported RT list on the IP-VRF".  In MVPN, 
C-multicast routes do not carry the exported RT list, they carry an RT 
created from the VRF Route Import EC of the Selected UMH route.

- Section 10.1 talks about putting the BGP Encapsulation EC on the 
C-multicast routes sent into the MVPN domain.  However, MVPN does not 
make any use of this EC.

- Section 10.1 states that the S-PMSI A-D routes just propagate from one 
domain to the other, but with some unspecified "modifications".

- Leaf A-D routes are not discussed at all, nor is the setting of the 
LIR flag in the PMSI Tunnel attribute.

- Inter-AS I-PMSI A-D routes are not discussed.

This section is still severely underspecified.  It seems to be inventing 
a new way of interconnecting two L3VPN/MVPN domains, but it's not 
"option A", "option B", or "option C", and it's not "segmented 
P-tunnels".  So what is it exactly, and how do we know it works?

Have you thought about cases where multiple domains (i.e., more than 2) 
using different tunnel types are interconnected, perhaps in a cycle?

I think the issue of how to interwork domains that use different tunnel 
types is quite important.  If one wants to interwork an MVPN domain that 
uses mLDP-based P2MP LSPs with an EVPN domain that uses IR, I don't 
think one wants to tell customers that interoperability requires them to 
start using mLDP inside the EVPN domain.  If one is using assisted 
replication (AR) within the EVPN domain, I don't think anyone will want 
to hear "sorry, AR is not supported by MVPN".  I don't think the 
interworking between two domains can be called "seamless" if one has to 
change the tunnel types  of either domain.  But the details for how to 
do the interworking between different tunnel types just don't seem to be 
present.

Furthermore, it is pretty clear that some sort of gateway is going to be 
needed to provide interoperability with RFC 7432 nodes that do not 
implement MVPN; this needs to be addressed as well.

Eric> Another approach would be to set up two independent MVPN domains 
and carefully assign RTs to ensure that routes are not leaked from one 
domain to another.  One would also have to ensure that the boundary 
points send the proper set of routes into the "other" domain.  (This 
includes the unicast routes as well as the multicast routes.)  And one 
would have to include a whole bunch of applicability restrictions, such 
as "don't use the same RR to hold routes of both domains".  I think 
that's what's being proposed, but there isn't enough discussion of RT 
and RD management to be sure, and there isn't much discussion of what 
information the boundary points send into each domain.

Ali> I will expand on that with the RD and RT management aspects. But 
the intention is with a single MVPN domain where both EVPN and MVPN PEs 
participate.

Note that the use of a single RT by both MVPN and EVPN nodes will cause 
routes to be distributed throughout the "single MVPN domain", with no 
opportunity for a gateway to modify the routes.  But section 10.1 does 
seem to require a gateway to modify routes in order to connnect tunnels 
of different types.

Eric> 7. The proposal requires that EVPN export a host route to MVPN for 
each EVPN-attached multicast source.  It's a good thing that there is no 
requirement like "do not burden existing MVPN deployments with a whole 
bunch of additional host routes".  Wait a minute, maybe there is such a 
requirement.

Eric> In fact, whether the host routes are necessary to achieve optimal 
routing depends on the topology.  And this is a case where an operator 
might well want to sacrifice some routing optimality to reduce the 
routing burden on the MVPN nodes.

Ali> If there is mobility, then there is host route advertisement If 
there is no mobility, then prefixes can be advertised.

It seems to me that this is simply not true.  Consider the following 
example:

- BD1 has subnet 192.168.168.0/24.

- BD1 exists on ES1, which is attached to PE1.

- BD2 exists on ES2, which is attached to PE2.  (ES1 and ES2 are not the 
same ES.)

- On BD1/ES1, there are hosts 192.168.168.1, 192.168.168.103, 
192.168.168.204.

- On BD2/ES2 there are hosts 192.168.168.2, 192.168.168.104, 192.168.1.203.

Assume there is no mobility.

In this scenario, I don't see how either PE1 or PE2 can advertise any 
prefix shorter than a /32.  And I don't see how one will prevent all 
these /32 routes from being distributed to all the MVPN nodes.

The fundamental issue here is that while IP addresses can be aggregated 
on a per-BD basis, they cannot be aggregated on a per-ES basis.

I don't think you get "seamless" interworking by requiring all the MVPN 
nodes to receive an unbounded number of host routes.

Eric> 8. The proposal simply does not work when MVPN receivers are 
interested in multicast flows from EVPN sources that are attached to 
all-active multi-homed ethernet segments.

Ali> This issue has been addressed in the new revision.

Yes, this is an improvement.

Suppose PE1 receives an (S,G) IP multicast frame over a local AC from 
BD1/ES1.  And suppose PE2,...,PEn are also attached to ES1. Per the new 
revision, PE1 transmits a copy of the frame on an EVPN-specific tunnel 
to PE2,...,PEn (an "intra-ES1" tunnel), as well as transmitting a copy 
of the contained IP datagram on whatever MVPN tunnel it uses to carry 
(S,G) packets.  Now any EVPN PE attached to the source ES can be 
selected as the UMH by an MVPN node, because all such EVPN PEs get the 
(S,G) frames and can forward forwards them to MVPN receivers.

It's good to see the draft recognizing that IP multicast frames do need 
to be transmitted as frames on EVPN-specific tunnels, in addition to 
being transmitted as packets on MVPN tunnels.  (Of course this solution 
violates the stated "requirement" that a given IP multicast packet not 
be transmitted on two different tunnels. Sigh, another example of 
"requirements" being applied inconsistently.)

However, there are still several problems with this solution.

No control plane is described to support this intra-ES tunneling. Is 
that "for the next revision"? ;-)

There's a suggestion that this solution is trivial, because no one would 
ever home an ES to more than two PEs, and therefore you just have to 
unicast a copy to the other PE.

But the PE receiving a frame has to figure out whether the frame was 
sent to it on an intra-ES tunnel or not, and if so, which ES the tunnel 
is associated with.  It is not clear how the receving PE is supposed to 
make this determination.  One needs to say something more than "just use 
ingress replicaton".

The draft also suggests that "multi-homed" always means "dual-homed", 
which I don't think is acceptable.

Note also that a scheme like this causes EVERY (S,G) frame to get sent 
to EVERY PE that is attached to S's source ES.  This happens even if 
there are NO receivers anywhere interested in (S,G) at all. In effect, 
the LAG hashing algorithm is defeated.  If a switch is multi-homed to n 
PEs, it uses a LAG hashing algorithm to ensure that any given packet is 
sent to just one of those PEs.  Then one EVPN PE gets the packet and 
sends it to the other n-1 PEs, who have to treat the packet as if it had 
just arrived on the AC from the multi-homed switch.  Iit would be better 
to have a "pull model" where PEx gets the (S,G) packet from PE1 only if 
some MVPN PE has sent a C-multicast (S,G) or (*,G) route to PEx.

In addition, the latest rev of the draft is still confused about the way 
UMH selection is done.  It seems to assume all the PEs will select the 
same "Upstream PE" for a given (S,G).  While this is one possible option 
(generally referred to as Single Forwarder Selection), it is not 
required, and I believe the most common deployment scenario is to use 
the "Installed UMH Route" as the "Selected UMH Route".  (See section 
5.1.3 of RFC 6513.)  This means that it is always possible for a PE to 
receive more than one copy of an (S,G) packet, and the PE must therefore 
always be able to apply the "discard from the wrong PE" procedures of 
RFC 6513 Section 9.1.1.

Suppose for example that EVPN-PE1 transmits its IP multicast frames on 
an I-PMSI that is instantiated by a P2MP LSP.  EVPN-PE2 will have to 
join that I-PMSI.  If PE1 and PE2 are both attached to BD1/ES1, then 
when PE1 gets an (S,G) IP multicast frame from BD1/ES1, PE2 will get two 
copies: one on the intra-ES1 tunnel from PE1 and one on the I-PMSI 
tunnel from PE1.  PE2 will probably choose itself as the "Upstream PE" 
for (S,G), in which case it needs to discard the copy that arrives on 
the I-PMSI tunnel from PE1, while accepting the copy that arrives on the 
intra-ES1 tunnel from PE1.  (If PE2 for some reason chose PE1 as the 
Upstream PE for (S,G), it would have to discard the copy arriving on the 
intra-ES1 tunnel and accept the copy arriving on the I-PMSI tunnel.)  
The draft seems to imply, incorrectly, that the "discard from the wrong 
PE" procedure is not necessary.

The "discard from the wrong PE" procedures are also needed to handle the 
case where the source is at a site homed to two or more MVPN PEs, and 
there are MVPN receivers that do not do single forwarder selection.  
This may cause some packets to appear on multiple I-PMSIs, and each 
EVPN-PE will have to join all the I-PMSIs, of course.

(The use of S-PMSIs rather than I-PMSIs does not eliminate this 
problem.  A given S-PMSI from PE1 might carry a flow that PE2 needs from 
PE1, and it might also carry a flow that PE2 is getting on an S-PMSI 
from PE3.)

Please note that if MPLS ingress replication is being used, the "discard 
from the wrong PE" functionality requires that the egress PE be able to 
tell from a packet's encapsulation when a packet is from the wrong 
ingress PE.

If the MVPN nodes are using the "extranet" feature (RFC 7900), "discard 
from the wrong PE" is not actually sufficient, one needs to "discard 
from the wrong ingress VRF".

Since there is no clean layering between MVPN and EVPN protocols in this 
proposal, every little nit and corner case of MVPN has to be examined to 
make sure it will also work in the EVPN domain.

Another problem: according to the draft, if an EVPN PE, say PE1, learns 
of a source via a locally attached all-active multi-homed ES, it will 
originate an IP route for that source.  Consider another PE, say PE2, 
attached to the same multi-homed ES.  When PE2 receives that IP route 
from PE1, PE2 will then originate its own IP route for that source.  
Since PE1 receives PE2's route, it is not clear how the route ever gets 
withdrawn.  If PE1 stops seeing the local traffic, it will still see 
PE2's route, and hence will still originate its own route.  One might 
think this is easily fixed by attaching to PE1's route an EC that 
declares that route to be "authoritative"; PE2's route would not have 
that EC.  Note though that the adding or removal of this "authoritative" 
EC will cause some churn that will be visible to the MVPN-only nodes, 
even though it does not provide them with any useful information.

I would also like to take note of the following issue.  From the draft:

"The EVPN PEs terminate ...  PIM messages from tenant routers on their 
IRB interfaces, thus avoid sending these messages over MPLS/IP core."

A PIM control message from a given PIM router needs to reach whichever 
other PIM router is a possible unicast next hop for any multicast source 
or RP.  The scheme of having each EVPN PE terminate the PIM messages 
presupposes that each tenant router will have the nearest EVPN PE as its 
unicast next hop towards the multicast source or RP.

This is likely to be a common scenario, but it certainly is not the only 
scenario.  A tenant might have several PIM routers on a given BD, where 
each PIM router is attached to a different PE.  The PIM routers could be 
IGP neighbors in the tenant's IGP, and may be exchanging IGP updates 
with each other.  In this case, PIM control messages from one tenant PIM 
router on the BD need to reach the other tenant routers on the BD.

For example, suppose Tenant Router R1 on BD1 attaches to PE1, and Tenant 
Router R2 on a different ES of BD1 attaches to PE2.  If R1 and R2 are 
IGP neighbors, R2 may see R1 as the next hop to a given source S.  In 
that case, R2 may choose to target a PIM Join(S,G) to R1.

In this scenario, the PIM control messages between R1 and R2 have to be 
sent between PE1 and PE2.  Since PIM control messages have a TTL of 1, 
they would have to be sent on BD1's BUM tunnels rather than on the IP 
multicast tunnels.

Now the question is, if R2 sends PIM Join(S,G) to R1, how does R2 get 
the (S,G) traffic from R1?  Either PE1 has to send it on BD1's BUM 
tunnel, or else PE2 has to figure out that it needs to pull (S,G) 
traffic from PE1 on an IP multicast tunnel.  The spec needs to explain 
how this situation is handled.  If the (S,G) traffic travels on BD1's 
BUM tunnel, the spec also has to make it clear how that traffic gets to 
other BDs.

BTW, section 6.5 of the draft says that any frame containing an IP 
packet whose destination address is in the range 224/8 is sent as a BUM 
frame.  I suspect that 224.0.0/24 is what is meant, as that seems to be 
the IPv4 multicast link-local address space.

One more thing.  The draft says that SPT-ONLY (RFC 6514 section 14) mode 
should be the default configuration.  This has several problems:

- SPT-ONLY mode requires each PE to function as an RP, which creates a 
considerable amount of additional work for the PE (handling the register 
messages and maintaining a large number of (S,G) states). It also 
requires the PE to originate a Source Active A-D route for each (S,G), a 
route that would not otherwise be needed.

- If the tenant or MVPN customer already has a multicast infrastructure 
with Rendezvous Points (RPs), it may be impossible to use SPT-ONLY mode, 
as this mode may not be compatible with the customer/tenant's 
infrastructure.  However, it may still be desirable to have RP-free 
operation for multicast groups whose sources and receivers are all in 
the EVPN domain.

- SPT-ONLY mode can sometimes be made compatible with an existing 
tenant/customer multicast infrastructure by having the PEs participate 
in the BSR or Auto-RP protocols, and/or by having the PEs participate in 
MSDP.  This would not generally be regarded as a simplification.

- If one is interworking with an MVPN whose PEs are configured to use 
RPT-SPT mode (RFC 6514 section 13), one must configure the EVPN-PEs to 
use RPT-SPT mode as well, because the two modes are not interoperable.  
I believe most MVPN deployments use RPT-SPT mode.

So I don't see the grounds for recommending the SPT-ONLY mode as the 
default.  The choice between SPT-ONLY mode and RPT-SPT mode depends on 
many factors and requires knowledge of (a) a particular tenant's 
deployment scenario, and (b) if MVPN interworking is being done, the 
mode that is being used by the MVPN nodes.









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    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; 1. It seems that the proposal does
      not do correct ethernet emulation.  Intra-subnet multicast only
      sometimes preserves MAC SA and IP TTL, sometimes not, depending
      upon the topology.</font><br>
    <br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; EVPN doesn't provide LAN service per
      IEEE 802.1Q but rather an emulation of LAN service. This document
      defines what that emulation means<br>
    </font><br>
    The fact that the proposal doesn't do correct ethernet emulation
    cannot be resolved by having the proposal redefine "emulation" to
    mean "whatever the proposal does".<br>
    <br>
    EVPN needs to ensure that whatever works on a real ethernet will
    work on the emulated ethernet as well; the externally visible
    service characteristics on which the higher layers may depend must
    be properly offered by the emulation.  This applies to both unicast
    and multicast equally.<br>
    <br>
    Otherwise anyone attempting to replace a real ethernet with EVPN
    will find that not every application and/or protocol working on the
    real ethernet will continue to work on the EVPN.<br>
    <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; TTL handling for inter-subnet
      multicast seems inconsistent as well, depending upon the topology.<br>
    </font><br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; BTW, TTL handling for inter-subnet IP
      multicast traffic is done consistent!</font><br>
    <br>
    Consider the following in a pure MVPN environment:<br>
    <br>
    - Source S is on subnet1, which is attached to PE1.<br>
    <br>
    - Receivers R1 and R2 are on subnet2, which is attached to both PE1
    and PE2.<br>
    <br>
    - Subnet1 and subnet2 are different subnets.<br>
    <br>
    Now every (S,G) packet will follow the same path: either (a)
    subnet1--&gt;PE1--&gt;subnet2 or (b)
    subnet1--&gt;PE1--&gt;PE2--&gt;subnet2.<br>
    <br>
    Both paths cannot be used at the same time, because L3 multicast
    will not allow both PE1 and PE2 to transmit the (S,G) flow to
    subnet2.  So an (S,G) packet received by R1 will always have the
    same TTL as the same packet received by R2.  TTL scoping will
    therefore work consistently; depending on the routing, and from the
    perspective of any given flow, the two subnets are either one hop
    away from each other, or two hops away from each other.<br>
    <br>
    In the so-called "seamless-mcast" scheme, on the other hand, if R1
    and R2 get the same (S,G) packet, each may see a different TTL. 
    Suppose R1 is on an ES attached to PE1 but not to PE2, S is on an ES
    attached to PE1 but not to PE2, and R2 is on an ES attached to PE2
    but not to PE1.  Then a given (S,G) packet received by R1 will have
    a smaller TTL than the same packet received by R2, even though R1
    and R2 are on the same subnet.<br>
    <br>
    Note that the seamless-mcast proposal does not provide the behavior
    that would be provided by MVPN, despite the claim that it is "just
    MVPN".<br>
    <br>
    This user-visible inconsistency may break any use of TTL scoping,
    and is just the sort of thing that tends generate a stream of
    service calls from customers that pay attention to this sort of
    stuff.<br>
    <br>
    In general, TTL should be decremented by 0 for intra-subnet and by 1
    (within the EVPN domain) for inter-subnet.  Failure to handle the
    TTL decrement properly will break anything that depends upon RFC
    3682 ("The Generalized TTL Security Mechanism").  Have you concluded
    that no use of multicast together with RFC 3682 will, now or in the
    future, ever need to run over EVPN?  I'd like to know how that
    conclusion is supported.  You may also wish to do a google search
    for "multicast ttl scoping".<br>
    <br>
    A related issue is that the number of PEs through which a packet
    passes should not be inferrable by a tenant.  Any sort of multicast
    traceroute tool used by a tenant will give unexpected results if TTL
    is not handled properly; at the very least this will result in
    service calls.<br>
    <br>
    The OISM proposal (as described in the irb-mcast draft) will
    decrement TTL by 1 when packets go from one subnet to another, as an
    IP multicast frame is distributed unchanged to the PEs that need it,
    and its TTL is decremented by 1 if an egress PE needs to deliver it
    to a subnet other than its source subnet.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    The draft still makes the following peculiar claim:<br>
    <br>
       <tt>"Based on past experiences with MVPN over last dozen years
      for supported IP multicast applications, layer-3 forwarding of
      intra-subnet multicast traffic should be fine.</tt><tt>"<br>
    </tt><br>
    Since MVPN does not do intra-subnet multicast, experience with MVPN
    has no bearing whatsoever on the needs of intra-subnet multicast.<br>
    <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; 2. In order to do inter-subnet
      multicast in EVPN, the proposal requires L3VPN/MVPN configuration
      on ALL the EVPN PEs.  This is required even when there is no need
      for MVPN/EVPN interworking. This is portrayed as a "low
      provisioning" solution!</font><br>
    <br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; Using MVPN constructs doesn't requires
      additional configuration on EVPN PEs beyond multicast
      configuration needed for IRB-mcast operation.<br>
    </font><br>
    I think you'll find that if you don't reconfigure all the BGP
    sessions to carry AFI/SAFIs 1/128, 2/128, 1/5, and 2/5, you'll have
    quite a bit of trouble running any of the native MVPN procedures ;-)
    This is perhaps the simplest example of additional configuration
    that is needed.<br>
    <br>
    If doing MVPN/EVPN interworking, one needs to go to every EVPN PE
    and set up all the RTs used to control the distribution of routes
    within the L3VPN domain.  One has to consider whether the RDs
    already used by EVPN are distinct from the RDs already used by
    L3VPN.  One has to enable the tunneling mechanisms that are used in
    the L3VPN domain (hopefully the EVPN PEs can support those tunneling
    techniques).  If the L3VPN deployment has been set up with
    particular routing policies (special communities carried, or
    whatever), these need to be configured on every EVPN PE.  One needs
    to take account of whether the L3VPN deployment uses segmented
    P-tunnels or non-segmented P-tunnels, and whether it depends upon
    the use of (C-*,C-*) S-PMSI A-D routes or not.  One needs to
    configure whether the L3VPN is expecting procedures of RFC6514
    Section 13 ("rpt-spt") or whether it is expecting procedures of
    RFC6514 Section 14 ("spt-only").  I think there are quite a few
    other configuration items (various timers, and additional stuff that
    I probably don't even know about) that may need to be coordinated
    with the L3VPN deployment with which one is attempting to interwork.<br>
    <br>
    To do interworking between EVPN and L3VPN/MVPN, the L3VPN/MVPN stuff
    obviously needs to be configured at the interworking points.  The
    REQUIREMENT to do ALL this configuration at EVERY single EVPN PE is
    what seems excessive.<br>
    <br>
    Even if one is not doing MVPN/EVPN interworking, all this stuff
    still has to be configured; one just wouldn't have to worry about in
    that case about coordinating with a pre-existing MVPN deployment. 
    But no one ever called L3VPN a "low provisioning solution".   EVPN
    (unlike MVPN), has a fair amount of auto-provisioning built-in, and
    one loses the advantages of that if one has to do MVPN provisioning
    on every PE.<br>
    <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; 3. The draft claims that the exact
      same control plane should be used for EVPN and MVPN, despite the
      fact that MVPN's control plane is unaware of certain information
      that is very important in EVPN (e.g., EVIs, TagIDs).</font><br>
        <br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; IP multicast described in the draft is
      done at the tenant's level (IP-VRF) and not BD level !! So, BD
      level info such as tagIDs are not relevant.<br>
    </font><br>
    The failure to carry BD level info is what causes the ethernet
    emulation to be done incorrectly.  Remember that most of EVPN is
    taken from L3VPN, with modifications to add stuff that is needed to
    correctly emulate the ethernet service.<br>
    <br>
    Certainly if you look at the control plane used by EVPN to
    distribute unicast IP addresses, you'll see that it does not "just
    use L3VPN", but instead has lots of EVPN-specific stuff.<br>
    <br>
    It's also worth pointing out that the draft does not really use the
    exact same control plane as MVPN, as it seems to require that each
    IP host address be advertised in two routes (an EVPN-specific route
    and a VPN-IP route), and the EVPN-specific routes (types 2 or 5) are
    now required to carry attributes that are typically carried only by
    the VPN-IP routes.  Also, there are the intra-ES tunnels (discussed
    below), something that doesn't exist in MVPN.  And then there are
    those under-specified EVPN-specific 'gateways' (discussed below)
    that are used to connect tunnels of different types.<br>
    <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; 4. The draft proposes to use the same
      tunnels for MVPN and EVPN, i.e., to have tunnels that traverse
      both the MVPN and the EVPN domains.  Various "requirements" are
      stated that seem to require this solution.  Somewhere along the
      line it was realized that this requirement cannot be met if MVPN
      and EVPN do not use the same tunnel types.  So for this very
      common scenario, a completely different solution is proposed, that
      (a) tries to keep the EVPN control plane out of the MVPN domain,
      and vice versa, and (b) uses different tunnels in the two
      domains.  Perhaps the "requirements" that suggest using a single
      cross-domain tunnel are not really requirements!<br>
    </font><br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; There are SPDCs with MPLS underlay and
      there are SPDCs with VxLAN underlay. We need a solution that is
      optimum for both. Just the same way that we need both ASBR and GWs
      to optimize connectivity for inter-AS scenarios.<br>
    </font><br>
    My point is that the document states "requirements", but applies
    them very selectively and very inconsistently.  There is a
    "requirement" to "use the same tunnels for MVPN and EVPN", but there
    are many deployment scenarios in which this "requirement" simply
    cannot be met.  If the "requirement" were stated as "only use
    tunnels that provide value",  I'd have no problem with it.  It seems
    that many of the specified requirements were reverse engineered from
    the solution as it was originally proposed, and then are silently
    ignored whenever it is discovered that they can't be met.<br>
        <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; 5a. In some cases, the "requirements"
      for optimality in one or another respect (e.g., routing,
      replication) are really only considerations that an operator
      should be able to trade off against other considerations.  The
      real requirement is to be able to create a deployment scenario in
      which such optimality is achievable.  Other deployment scenarios,
      that optimize for other considerations, should not be prohibited.</font><br>
        <br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; What deployment scenarios do you think
      are prohibited ?<br>
    </font><br>
    The draft does not appear support scenarios in which the MVPN/EVPN
    interworking procedures are confined to a subset of the EVPN PEs,
    and not even visible to the majority of the EVPN PEs.  <br>
    <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; While the authors have realized that
      one cannot have cross-domain tunnels when EVPN uses VxLAN and MVPN
      uses MPLS, they do not seem to have acknowledged the multitude of
      other scenarios in which cross-domain tunnels cannot be used.  For
      instance, MVPN may be using mLDP, while EVPN is using IR.  Or EVPN
      may be using "Assisted Replication", which does not exist in
      MVPN.  Or MVPN may be using PIM while EVPN is using RSVP-TE P2MP. 
      Etc., etc.  I suspect that "different tunnel types" will be the
      common case, especially when trying to interwork existing MVPN and
      EVPN deployments.</font><br>
    <br>
    I note that the latest rev of the draft still does not take this
    into account.<br>
    <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; The gateway-based proposal for
      interworking MVPN and EVPN when they use different tunnel types is
      severely underspecified.<br>
    </font><br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; Agreed. This will be covered in the
      subsequent revisions.<br>
    </font><br>
    It doesn't seem to be in the latest revision.<br>
    <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; One possible approach to this would
      be to have a single MVPN domain that includes the EVPN PEs, and to
      use MVPN tunnel segmentation at the boundary. While that is a
      complicated solution, at least it is known to work. However, that
      does not seem to be what is being proposed.</font><br>
    <br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; It is not clear to me exactly what you
      are suggesting here. At the boundary, is there any mcast address
      lookup or not?<br>
    </font><br>
    If I were working on a proposal like the one in seamless-multicast,
    I would consider whether the MVPN inter-AS segmented P-tunnels
    feature could be leveraged at the border nodes between domains that
    use different tunnel types.  After all, one of the main purposes of
    MVPN inter-AS segmentation is to connect domains that use different
    tunnel types.  Done properly, that does not require any IP lookups
    at the ASBRs.  The draft seems to be trying to reinvent MVPN
    P-tunnel segmentation from scratch.  This is a very intricate part
    of the MVPN specs and you can't just make it up as you go along.<br>
    <br>
    Here is just a selection of some of the problems with section 10.1
    ("Control Plane Interconnect") of the -02 revision:<br>
    <br>
    - Much of the document seems to assume that the RTs used in the MVPN
    domain will be the same as the RTs used in the EVPN domain.  If that
    is the case, all the A-D routes from one domain will propagate into
    the other.  This does not appear to be compatible with the sketchy
    description of "gateway" behavior given in Section 10.<br>
      <br>
    - Section 10.1 states that the RD in a Source Active A-D route needs
    to be changed when a such a route is re-originated by a gateway. 
    Unfortunately, MVPN requires that the SA A-D route for (S,G) have
    the same RD as the unicast route for S.  So you would need to block
    all the IPVPN routes at the gateway and reoriginate them with new
    RDs.  The spec fails to mention this.  Note that this is not even
    possible if the EVPN PEs share the RTs of the MVPN domain.<br>
    <br>
    - Interesting effects could arise if an EVPN PE chooses a gateway as
    the UMH, but the gateway chooses an EVPN PE as the UMH.  Can you
    demonstrate that this is impossible?<br>
    <br>
    - Section 10.1 says that the C-multicast routes originated by the
    gateway carry the "exported RT list on the IP-VRF".  In MVPN,
    C-multicast routes do not carry the exported RT list, they carry an
    RT created from the VRF Route Import EC of the Selected UMH route.<br>
    <br>
    - Section 10.1 talks about putting the BGP Encapsulation EC on the
    C-multicast routes sent into the MVPN domain.  However, MVPN does
    not make any use of this EC.<br>
    <br>
    - Section 10.1 states that the S-PMSI A-D routes just propagate from
    one domain to the other, but with some unspecified "modifications".<br>
    <br>
    - Leaf A-D routes are not discussed at all, nor is the setting of
    the LIR flag in the PMSI Tunnel attribute.<br>
    <br>
    - Inter-AS I-PMSI A-D routes are not discussed.<br>
    <br>
    This section is still severely underspecified.  It seems to be
    inventing a new way of interconnecting two L3VPN/MVPN domains, but
    it's not "option A", "option B", or "option C", and it's not
    "segmented P-tunnels".  So what is it exactly, and how do we know it
    works?<br>
    <br>
    Have you thought about cases where multiple domains (i.e., more than
    2) using different tunnel types are interconnected, perhaps in a
    cycle?<br>
    <br>
    I think the issue of how to interwork domains that use different
    tunnel types is quite important.  If one wants to interwork an MVPN
    domain that uses mLDP-based P2MP LSPs with an EVPN domain that uses
    IR, I don't think one wants to tell customers that interoperability
    requires them to start using mLDP inside the EVPN domain.  If one is
    using assisted replication (AR) within the EVPN domain, I don't
    think anyone will want to hear "sorry, AR is not supported by
    MVPN".  I don't think the interworking between two domains can be
    called "seamless" if one has to change the tunnel types  of either
    domain.  But the details for how to do the interworking between
    different tunnel types just don't seem to be present.<br>
    <br>
    Furthermore, it is pretty clear that some sort of gateway is going
    to be needed to provide interoperability with RFC 7432 nodes that do
    not implement MVPN; this needs to be addressed as well.<br>
     <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; Another approach would be to set up
      two independent MVPN domains and carefully assign RTs to ensure
      that routes are not leaked from one domain to another.  One would
      also have to ensure that the boundary points send the proper set
      of routes into the "other" domain.  (This includes the unicast
      routes as well as the multicast routes.)  And one would have to
      include a whole bunch of applicability restrictions, such as
      "don't use the same RR to hold routes of both domains".  I think
      that's what's being proposed, but there isn't enough discussion of
      RT and RD management to be sure, and there isn't much discussion
      of what information the boundary points send into each domain.</font><br>
    <br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; I will expand on that with the RD and
      RT management aspects. </font><font color="#3333ff"> But the
      intention is with a single MVPN domain where both EVPN and MVPN
      PEs participate.<br>
    </font><br>
    Note that the use of a single RT by both MVPN and EVPN nodes will
    cause routes to be distributed throughout the "single MVPN domain",
    with no opportunity for a gateway to modify the routes.  But section
    10.1 does seem to require a gateway to modify routes in order to
    connnect tunnels of different types.<br>
        <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; 7. The proposal requires that EVPN
      export a host route to MVPN for each EVPN-attached multicast
      source.  It's a good thing that there is no requirement like "do
      not burden existing MVPN deployments with a whole bunch of
      additional host routes".  Wait a minute, maybe there is such a
      requirement.<br>
          <br>
      Eric&gt; In fact, whether the host routes are necessary to achieve
      optimal routing depends on the topology.  And this is a case where
      an operator might well want to sacrifice some routing optimality
      to reduce the routing burden on the MVPN nodes.<br>
    </font> <br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; If there is mobility, then there is
      host route advertisement If there is no mobility, then prefixes
      can be advertised.<br>
    </font><br>
    It seems to me that this is simply not true.  Consider the following
    example:<br>
    <br>
    - BD1 has subnet 192.168.168.0/24.<br>
    <br>
    - BD1 exists on ES1, which is attached to PE1.<br>
    <br>
    - BD2 exists on ES2, which is attached to PE2.  (ES1 and ES2 are not
    the same ES.)<br>
    <br>
    - On BD1/ES1, there are hosts 192.168.168.1, 192.168.168.103,
    192.168.168.204.<br>
    <br>
    - On BD2/ES2 there are hosts 192.168.168.2, 192.168.168.104,
    192.168.1.203.<br>
    <br>
    Assume there is no mobility.<br>
    <br>
    In this scenario, I don't see how either PE1 or PE2 can advertise
    any prefix shorter than a /32.  And I don't see how one will prevent
    all these /32 routes from being distributed to all the MVPN nodes.<br>
    <br>
    The fundamental issue here is that while IP addresses can be
    aggregated on a per-BD basis, they cannot be aggregated on a per-ES
    basis.  <br>
    <br>
    I don't think you get "seamless" interworking by requiring all the
    MVPN nodes to receive an unbounded number of host routes.<br>
    <br>
    <font color="#993399">Eric&gt; 8. The proposal simply does not work
      when MVPN receivers are interested in multicast flows from EVPN
      sources that are attached to all-active multi-homed ethernet
      segments.</font><br>
    <br>
    <font color="#3333ff">Ali&gt; This issue has been addressed in the
      new revision.<br>
    </font>    <br>
    Yes, this is an improvement.<br>
    <br>
    Suppose PE1 receives an (S,G) IP multicast frame over a local AC
    from BD1/ES1.  And suppose PE2,...,PEn are also attached to ES1. 
    Per the new revision, PE1 transmits a copy of the frame on an
    EVPN-specific tunnel to PE2,...,PEn (an "intra-ES1" tunnel), as well
    as transmitting a copy of the contained IP datagram on whatever MVPN
    tunnel it uses to carry (S,G) packets.  Now any EVPN PE attached to
    the source ES can be selected as the UMH by an MVPN node, because
    all such EVPN PEs get the (S,G) frames and can forward forwards them
    to MVPN receivers.<br>
    <br>
    It's good to see the draft recognizing that IP multicast frames do
    need to be transmitted as frames on EVPN-specific tunnels, in
    addition to being transmitted as packets on MVPN tunnels.  (Of
    course this solution violates the stated "requirement" that a given
    IP multicast packet not be transmitted on two different tunnels.
    Sigh, another example of "requirements" being applied
    inconsistently.)<br>
    <br>
    However, there are still several problems with this solution.<br>
    <br>
    No control plane is described to support this intra-ES tunneling. 
    Is that "for the next revision"? ;-)<br>
    <br>
    There's a suggestion that this solution is trivial, because no one
    would ever home an ES to more than two PEs, and therefore you just
    have to unicast a copy to the other PE.<br>
    <br>
    But the PE receiving a frame has to figure out whether the frame was
    sent to it on an intra-ES tunnel or not, and if so, which ES the
    tunnel is associated with.  It is not clear how the receving PE is
    supposed to make this determination.  One needs to say something
    more than "just use ingress replicaton".<br>
    <br>
    The draft also suggests that "multi-homed" always means
    "dual-homed", which I don't think is acceptable.<br>
    <br>
    Note also that a scheme like this causes EVERY (S,G) frame to get
    sent to EVERY PE that is attached to S's source ES.  This happens
    even if there are NO receivers anywhere interested in (S,G) at all. 
    In effect, the LAG hashing algorithm is defeated.  If a switch is
    multi-homed to n PEs, it uses a LAG hashing algorithm to ensure that
    any given packet is sent to just one of those PEs.  Then one EVPN PE
    gets the packet and sends it to the other n-1 PEs, who have to treat
    the packet as if it had just arrived on the AC from the multi-homed
    switch.  Iit would be better to have a "pull model" where PEx gets
    the (S,G) packet from PE1 only if some MVPN PE has sent a
    C-multicast (S,G) or (*,G) route to PEx.<br>
    <br>
    In addition, the latest rev of the draft is still confused about the
    way UMH selection is done.  It seems to assume all the PEs will
    select the same "Upstream PE" for a given (S,G).  While this is one
    possible option (generally referred to as Single Forwarder
    Selection), it is not required, and I believe the most common
    deployment scenario is to use the "Installed UMH Route" as the
    "Selected UMH Route".  (See section 5.1.3 of RFC 6513.)  This means
    that it is always possible for a PE to receive more than one copy of
    an (S,G) packet, and the PE must therefore always be able to apply
    the "discard from the wrong PE" procedures of RFC 6513 Section
    9.1.1.<br>
    <br>
    Suppose for example that EVPN-PE1 transmits its IP multicast frames
    on an I-PMSI that is instantiated by a P2MP LSP.  EVPN-PE2 will have
    to join that I-PMSI.  If PE1 and PE2 are both attached to BD1/ES1,
    then when PE1 gets an (S,G) IP multicast frame from BD1/ES1, PE2
    will get two copies: one on the intra-ES1 tunnel from PE1 and one on
    the I-PMSI tunnel from PE1.  PE2 will probably choose itself as the
    "Upstream PE" for (S,G), in which case it needs to discard the copy
    that arrives on the I-PMSI tunnel from PE1, while accepting the copy
    that arrives on the intra-ES1 tunnel from PE1.  (If PE2 for some
    reason chose PE1 as the Upstream PE for (S,G), it would have to
    discard the copy arriving on the intra-ES1 tunnel and accept the
    copy arriving on the I-PMSI tunnel.)  The draft seems to imply,
    incorrectly, that the "discard from the wrong PE" procedure is not
    necessary.<br>
    <br>
    The "discard from the wrong PE" procedures are also needed to handle
    the case where the source is at a site homed to two or more MVPN
    PEs, and there are MVPN receivers that do not do single forwarder
    selection.  This may cause some packets to appear on multiple
    I-PMSIs, and each EVPN-PE will have to join all the I-PMSIs, of
    course.<br>
    <br>
    (The use of S-PMSIs rather than I-PMSIs does not eliminate this
    problem.  A given S-PMSI from PE1 might carry a flow that PE2 needs
    from PE1, and it might also carry a flow that PE2 is getting on an
    S-PMSI from PE3.)<br>
    <br>
    Please note that if MPLS ingress replication is being used, the
    "discard from the wrong PE" functionality requires that the egress
    PE be able to tell from a packet's encapsulation when a packet is
    from the wrong ingress PE.  <br>
    <br>
    If the MVPN nodes are using the "extranet" feature (RFC 7900),
    "discard from the wrong PE" is not actually sufficient, one needs to
    "discard from the wrong ingress VRF".<br>
    <br>
    Since there is no clean layering between MVPN and EVPN protocols in
    this proposal, every little nit and corner case of MVPN has to be
    examined to make sure it will also work in the EVPN domain.<br>
    <br>
    Another problem: according to the draft, if an EVPN PE, say PE1,
    learns of a source via a locally attached all-active multi-homed ES,
    it will originate an IP route for that source.  Consider another PE,
    say PE2, attached to the same multi-homed ES.  When PE2 receives
    that IP route from PE1, PE2 will then originate its own IP route for
    that source.  Since PE1 receives PE2's route, it is not clear how
    the route ever gets withdrawn.  If PE1 stops seeing the local
    traffic, it will still see PE2's route, and hence will still
    originate its own route.  One might think this is easily fixed by
    attaching to PE1's route an EC that declares that route to be
    "authoritative"; PE2's route would not have that EC.  Note though
    that the adding or removal of this "authoritative" EC will cause
    some churn that will be visible to the MVPN-only nodes, even though
    it does not provide them with any useful information.<br>
    <br>
    I would also like to take note of the following issue.  From the
    draft:<br>
    <br>
           <tt>"The EVPN PEs terminate ...  PIM messages from tenant
      routers on their IRB interfaces, thus avoid sending these messages
      over MPLS/IP core.</tt><tt>"<br>
    </tt><tt>
    </tt><br>
    A PIM control message from a given PIM router needs to reach
    whichever other PIM router is a possible unicast next hop for any
    multicast source or RP.  The scheme of having each EVPN PE terminate
    the PIM messages presupposes that each tenant router will have the
    nearest EVPN PE as its unicast next hop towards the multicast source
    or RP.<br>
    <br>
    This is likely to be a common scenario, but it certainly is not the
    only scenario.  A tenant might have several PIM routers on a given
    BD, where each PIM router is attached to a different PE.  The PIM
    routers could be IGP neighbors in the tenant's IGP, and may be
    exchanging IGP updates with each other.  In this case, PIM control
    messages from one tenant PIM router on the BD need to reach the
    other tenant routers on the BD.<br>
    <br>
    For example, suppose Tenant Router R1 on BD1 attaches to PE1, and
    Tenant Router R2 on a different ES of BD1 attaches to PE2.  If R1
    and R2 are IGP neighbors, R2 may see R1 as the next hop to a given
    source S.  In that case, R2 may choose to target a PIM Join(S,G) to
    R1.<br>
    <br>
    In this scenario, the PIM control messages between R1 and R2 have to
    be sent between PE1 and PE2.  Since PIM control messages have a TTL
    of 1, they would have to be sent on BD1's BUM tunnels rather than on
    the IP multicast tunnels.  <br>
    <br>
    Now the question is, if R2 sends PIM Join(S,G) to R1, how does R2
    get the (S,G) traffic from R1?  Either PE1 has to send it on BD1's
    BUM tunnel, or else PE2 has to figure out that it needs to pull
    (S,G) traffic from PE1 on an IP multicast tunnel.  The spec needs to
    explain how this situation is handled.  If the (S,G) traffic travels
    on BD1's BUM tunnel, the spec also has to make it clear how that
    traffic gets to other BDs.<br>
    <br>
    BTW, section 6.5 of the draft says that any frame containing an IP
    packet whose destination address is in the range 224/8 is sent as a
    BUM frame.  I suspect that 224.0.0/24 is what is meant, as that
    seems to be the IPv4 multicast link-local address space.<br>
    <br>
    One more thing.  The draft says that SPT-ONLY (RFC 6514 section 14)
    mode should be the default configuration.  This has several
    problems:<br>
    <br>
    - SPT-ONLY mode requires each PE to function as an RP, which creates
    a considerable amount of additional work for the PE (handling the
    register messages and maintaining a large number of (S,G) states). 
    It also requires the PE to originate a Source Active A-D route for
    each (S,G), a route that would not otherwise be needed.<br>
    <br>
    - If the tenant or MVPN customer already has a multicast
    infrastructure with Rendezvous Points (RPs), it may be impossible to
    use SPT-ONLY mode, as this mode may not be compatible with the
    customer/tenant's infrastructure.  However, it may still be
    desirable to have RP-free operation for multicast groups whose
    sources and receivers are all in the EVPN domain.<br>
    <br>
    - SPT-ONLY mode can sometimes be made compatible with an existing
    tenant/customer multicast infrastructure by having the PEs
    participate in the BSR or Auto-RP protocols, and/or by having the
    PEs participate in MSDP.  This would not generally be regarded as a
    simplification.<br>
    <br>
    - If one is interworking with an MVPN whose PEs are configured to
    use RPT-SPT mode (RFC 6514 section 13), one must configure the
    EVPN-PEs to use RPT-SPT mode as well, because the two modes are not
    interoperable.  I believe most MVPN deployments use RPT-SPT mode.<br>
    <br>
    So I don't see the grounds for recommending the SPT-ONLY mode as the
    default.  The choice between SPT-ONLY mode and RPT-SPT mode depends
    on many factors and requires knowledge of (a) a particular tenant's
    deployment scenario, and (b) if MVPN interworking is being done, the
    mode that is being used by the MVPN nodes.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
    <br>
  </body>
</html>

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Subject: Re: [bess] Comments on draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast
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On 8/15/2018 4:07 AM, Ashutosh Gupta wrote:
> Hi Folks,
>
> I have following comments on draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mcast. I also 
> compare it to draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-mvpn-seamless-interop, which 
> utilizes existing MVPN technology to achieve mcast-irb functionality 
> in EVPN.
>
>
> *1. Re-branding MVPN constructs into EVPN *
> /evpn-irb/draft proposes a lot of MVPN constructs into EVPN. 
> Originating multicast receiver interest "per PE"  instead of "per BD", 
> use of selective tunnels are few examples. If solution really is 
> achievable through MVPN, why do we need to re-brand it in EVPN?

As I and others have endeavored to explain in several messages to this 
list, the solution is not achievable by simply using MVPN routes and 
procedures.  Correct emulation of the ethernet muliticast service 
requires the addition of BD-specific information and procedures.  
Without this information, the distinction between "ES" and "BD" is 
lost.   This results in such problems as:

- Failure to correctly emulate ethernet behavior, and

- Inability to summarize routes on a per-subnet basis, thus requiring 
the MVPN PEs to be bombarded with host routes.

The seamless-mcast draft also severely underspecifies the behavior 
needed when interconnecting an EVPN domain to an MVPN domain that uses a 
different tunnel type, and does not appear to recognize either how 
common that scenario is, or how tricky it is to get that right.  (That's 
why the MVPN P-tunnel segmentation procedures are so intricate;  that's 
a whole area that seems to be ignored in the seamless-mcast draft.)

It's also worth reminding folks that 90% of EVPN is based on messages 
and procedures borrowed from L3VPN/MVPN, with the addition of 
information and procedures that are needed to do EVPN-specific things 
involving Ethernet Segments and Broadcast Domains.  This is certainly 
true of the EVPN procedures for advertising unicast IP routes, which do 
not "just use L3VPN".  The OISM proposal in the irb-mcast draft just 
follows along these lines.

Furthermore, it's worth noting that the so-called "seamless-mcast" draft 
has EVPN-specific procedures as well.  And more keep getting added as 
additional problems get discovered (e.g., the new intra-ES tunnels).   
It's very far from being "just use MVPN protocols as is".

Finally, one might also point out that the folks with the most in-depth 
knowledge of MVPN seem to be the least enthusiastic about the 
"seamless-mcast" draft.  Just saying ;-)

In the remainder of this message I want to focus on Ashutosh's 
criticisms of the OISM proposal (as we call the proposal in the 
irb-mcast draft).

> *4. Data Plane considerations*
> *
> *
> *4.1.* The data-plane nuances of solution has been underplayed. For 
> example, if a PE1 has a (S, G) receivers in BD2, BD3 till BD10, 
> whereas source S belongs in BD1 subnet on PE2. And if BD1 is not 
> configured locally on PE1, a special BD (called SBD) is programmed as 
> IIF in forwarding entry. Later if BD1 gets configured on PE1, it would 
> cause IIF to change on PE1 from SBD to BD1.

So far correct.

> This would result in traffic disruption for all existing receivers in 
> BD2, BD3 till BD10.

The IIF in an (S,G) or (*,G) state can change at any time, due to 
distant (or not so distant) link failures, and/or due to other routing 
changes.  It changes whenever the UMH selection changes, and it changes 
if the ingress PE decides to move a flow from an I-PMSI to an S-PMSI.  
Of all the events that might cause a particular multicast state to 
change its IIF, the addition of a BD on the local PE does not seem to be 
one of the more frequent.

Some PIM implementations try to delay changing the IIF in a given (S,G) 
state until an (S,G) packet actually arrives from the new IIF.  However, 
such data-driven state changes introduce a lot of complexity.  MVPN has 
always tried to avoid data-driven state changes, and MVPN 
implementations will generally see some small amount of disruption when 
the IIF changes.  Methods for minimizing this are really an 
implementation matter.

In the case where a new BD is configured, there may be some risk of an 
(S,G) packet getting lost in the following situation:

- Time t0: The packet arrives and gets marked as being from the SBD.
- Time t1: The IIF changes from SBD to BD1
- Time t2: The packet is processed against the (S,G) state and discarded 
as having arrived from the wrong IIF

Given (a) how short the time t2-t0 is, (b) how infrequently new BDs get 
configured on a PE, and (c) the fact that there are many other causes of 
IIF changes, this does not seem like a real problem.  If it is regarded 
as a problem, resolving it would be an implementation matter.

>
> *4.2. *Also, /evpn-irb/ solution proposes to relax the RPF check for a 
> (*, G) multicast entry. This poses a great risk of traffic loops 
> especially in transient network conditions in addition to poor 
> debug-ability.

In the case where the receiving tenant systems ask for (*,G), and all 
the sources are known to be in the EVPN Tenant Domain, a Rendezvous 
Point (RP) is not required, as there is no real need for "source 
discovery", "shared trees", or "switching from shared trees to source 
trees".  Thus some of the most complicated and error-prone features of 
IP multicast can be avoided.  Note that we also avoid the need to create 
an (S,G) state for every source, which may result in a considerable 
reduction in state.  (Though obviously this optimization can only be 
used if there is a priori knowledge that all sources for a given group 
are within the EVPN domain.)

I don't think I've ever heard anybody say "I wish I had more PIM RPs, 
and more switching between shared trees and source trees; that makes 
things really easy to debug!".  I've heard the opposite though, quite a 
lot ;-)

I've heard it suggested that the use of MVPN's SPT-ONLY mode provides an 
equivalent simplification.  However, that is not true at all.  The 
SPT-ONLY mode (RFC 6514 section 14) requires each PE to function as an 
RP.   This creates a whole new set of RPs that need to be managed, 
creates more work for the PEs, and requires each PE to originate more 
routes.  It requires the PE to create a lot of (S,G) states that are not 
otherwise needed.  And if an MVPN customer (or EVPN tenant) already has 
its own RP infrastructure, the PEs may need to participate in BSR or 
Auto-RP, and/or may need to talk MSDP to the other RPs.

If a given multicast group has all its sources and receivers in the EVPN 
domain, it's much simpler if one can avoid RPs entirely for that group.  
And if that EVPN domain has other multicast groups with sources or 
receivers in an MVPN domain, it may even be impossible to configure the 
EVPN-PEs to be in SPT-ONLY mode.  The MVPN nodes are likely to be 
configured with RPT-SPT mode, and the two modes do not interoperate.

With regard to the "great risk of traffic loops ", I'd like to hear more 
specifics.  To get a loop, there'd have to be a situation in which a PE 
gets a (*,G) packet, sends it out one of its local ACs, and then the 
same packet is received back (at the same or at another PE) over an AC.  
Given that the all-active multi-homing procedures are in place, I just 
don't see how this will happen.  (Remember that we're not talking about 
the multicast states used to create trees in the underlay; when creating 
trees in the underlay, looping is more of a worry, but that's not 
relevant to the current discussion.)

> *3. Control plane scale in fabric / core *
> ... each PE one additional Tunnel per BD apart from existing BUM 
> tunnel. Essentially one tunnel for B+U and another for M. This is 
> proposed to avoid all B+U traffic in the BD1, indiscriminately 
> reaching all PE's in domain, irrespective of whether they have BD1 
> configured locally or not. This increases the state in fabric by *"num 
> of PE" x "num of BD"*.

I think the issue alluded to here is actually the data plane state, 
i.e.,  the amount of state that has to be maintained in order to do the 
forwarding.

We should also make clear that when we say things like "one per PE", 
what we really mean is "one per PE per Tenant Domain" (just as MVPN 
tunnels are "one per PE per VPN").  Everything below will be in the 
context of a given Tenant Domain.

Let me point out first that the number of BUM tunnels that exist per RFC 
7432 (assuming P2MP LSPs are used) is *O(number of PEs x number of 
BDs)*.  If one adds a second per-BD tunnel so that one can carry the IP 
multicast frames separately, the number of tunnels is still *O(number of 
PEs x number of BDs)*.

However, for the IP multicast tunnels, I think it would be better to use 
aggregated tunnels, so that a single P2MP LSP from, say, PE1, carries 
the IP multicast frames from all of PE1's locally attached ACs (in the 
given Tenant Domain), no matter which BD the AC is attached to.  That 
is, one really needs only one additional P2MP LSP per PE per Tenant 
Domain, not one per BD.

In order to properly perform the ethernet emulation, an egress PE, say 
PE2, has to be able to determine whether an IP multicast frame from PE1 
came from one of the BDs to which PE1 is locally attached. This means 
that the data plane encapsulation has to contain information that allows 
PE2 to make this determination.  In the draft, this is done by using an 
MPLS label or a VNID (depending upon encapsulation) that identifies the 
frame's source BD.

When using MPLS encapsulation, the assignment of labels to BDs is best 
done by using the technique described in 
draft-zzhang-bess-mvpn-evpn-aggregation-label ("MVPN/EVPN Tunnel 
Aggregation with Common Labels").   Per that draft, each BD would be 
assigned a domain-wide unique label (from a "Domain-Wide Common Block", 
or DCB).  Then the number of BD-identifying labels that each PE needs to 
know is proportional to the number of BDs in the Tenant Domains to which 
it is attached.  So in the data plane the number of labels one has to 
know for receiving is just **"number of BDs *in locally attached Tenant 
Domains";* the number of PEs does not factor in.  (Note that when using 
VXLAN encapsulation, the VNIDs are already domain-wide unique.)

When one is just doing RFC 7432, the number of data plane labels one 
needs is **"number of locally attached BDs", **which will certainly be a 
smaller number, but the difference between these two numbers does not 
seem very scary.

One might well ask though whether the number of labels a receiving PE 
has to know could be reduced from **"number of BDs *in locally attached 
Tenant Domains" *to **"number of locally attached BDs". **This is 
certainly worth exploring.  If one receives a frame on a given P2MP LSP, 
one knows from the top label what Tenant Domain it belongs to.  The 
second label tells one what BD the frame belongs to.  If that second 
label is unrecognized, one could decide to treat the frame as belonging 
to the SBD of the Tenant Domain identified by the top label.  This sort 
of technique would really minimize the data plane state, while still 
allowing the source BD to be identified.  This is worth some further 
invetigation.****

>
> *2. Scale of BGP routes*
> /evpn-irb/ solution mandates a PE to process and store all IMET NLRI's 
> from all peer PE's in tenant domain (as opposed to processing and 
> storing only NLRI's for BD's it has locally present).

Now we're talking about control plane scale.

Just for clarity, please note that when Ingress Replication is used, the 
BD-specific IMETs do not carry the SBD-RT  (see section 3.2.2) and hence 
are not distributed to all PEs in the Tenant Domain. (There are some 
sections of the draft that are inconsistent about this; that will be 
fixed.)  So this issue does not arise in that case.

> This is proposed because multicast traffic could be originating from 
> any PE in any BD. To put this in perspective, lets take an example of 
> a tenant domain with 101 PE's with each PE having 1000 BD's. Each PE 
> has at most 10 BD's common with any other PE in network. In this case 
> PE1 will have to process and store, 100 (remote PE's) x 1000 (BD's per 
> PE) x 1 (IMET per BD) = 0.1 Million IMET routes. Essentially, it is of 
> order *"Num of BD's" x "Num of PE's"*.

I'd like to see the example deployment where a single Tenant Domain 
attaches to 100 PEs, each of those PEs attaches to 1000 BDs of that 
Tenant Domain, and each individual BD attaches to only 10 of those PEs!

However, the basic point is well taken.  In the context of a given 
Tenant Domain, the number of IMET routes a PE receives will be *O(number 
of PEs  x average number of BDs per PE).

*Whether this really presents a significant control plane scaling issue 
is debatable, but let's see if we can reduce this.

If we use aggregate tunnels, the tunnel will be specified in the 
SBD-IMET route.  When a PE sends an SBD-IMET route, it can include in 
that route the label used to identify each of the BDs to which that PE 
is locally attached.  If we do that, we don't need to send the per-BD 
IMET routes to all PEs in the Tenant Domain.  (If there are too many 
locally attached BDs of a given Tenant Domain to fit into a single 
SBD-IMET route, we could borrow the technique of RFC 7432 Section 8.2 to 
send a small number of additional SBD-IMET routes. )  With this minor 
change, we could reduce the number of IMET routes so that it is 
proportional only to the number of PEs

Further, if the labels used to identify the BDs are domain-wide unique, 
it may be possible to omit them from the SBD-IMET routes altogether.   
Or perhaps only the DR for each BD will advertise the label for that 
BD.  Or perhaps they can be learned directly from a controller.  These 
are all options worth exploring as a way of reducing the overhead.

So I think that by making some small adjustments, we can greatly reduce 
the control plane overhead without incurring all the problems of the 
"seamless-mcast" scheme.



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    On 8/15/2018 4:07 AM, Ashutosh Gupta wrote:<br>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAPAoC9SBhHExZ8uhbN2c8L2-rREsAk9X4V=Af__mrdmB4T9pEA@mail.gmail.com">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div>Hi Folks, </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div>I have following comments on draft-ietf-bess-evpn-irb-mc<wbr>ast.
          I also compare it to draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-<wbr>mvpn-seamless-interop,
          which utilizes existing MVPN technology to achieve mcast-irb
          functionality in EVPN.   </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <div><b>1. Re-branding MVPN constructs into EVPN </b><br>
        </div>
        <i
style="font-size:small;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial">evpn-irb</i><span
style="font-size:small;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial">
          d</span>raft proposes a lot of MVPN constructs into EVPN.
        Originating <span
style="font-size:small;text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:initial;float:none;display:inline">multicast
          receiver interest "</span>per PE"  instead of "per BD", use of
        selective tunnels are few examples. If solution really is
        achievable through MVPN, why do we need to re-brand it in EVPN?
        <br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    As I and others have endeavored to explain in several messages to
    this list, the solution is not achievable by simply using MVPN
    routes and procedures.  Correct emulation of the ethernet muliticast
    service requires the addition of BD-specific information and
    procedures.  Without this information, the distinction between "ES"
    and "BD" is lost.   This results in such problems as:<br>
    <br>
    - Failure to correctly emulate ethernet behavior, and<br>
    <br>
    - Inability to summarize routes on a per-subnet basis, thus
    requiring the MVPN PEs to be bombarded with host routes.<br>
    <br>
    The seamless-mcast draft also severely underspecifies the behavior
    needed when interconnecting an EVPN domain to an MVPN domain that
    uses a different tunnel type, and does not appear to recognize
    either how common that scenario is, or how tricky it is to get that
    right.  (That's why the MVPN P-tunnel segmentation procedures are so
    intricate;  that's a whole area that seems to be ignored in the
    seamless-mcast draft.)<br>
    <br>
    It's also worth reminding folks that 90% of EVPN is based on
    messages and procedures borrowed from L3VPN/MVPN, with the addition
    of information and procedures that are needed to do EVPN-specific
    things involving Ethernet Segments and Broadcast Domains.  This is
    certainly true of the EVPN procedures for advertising unicast IP
    routes, which do not "just use L3VPN".  The OISM proposal in the
    irb-mcast draft just follows along these lines.<br>
    <br>
    Furthermore, it's worth noting that the so-called "seamless-mcast"
    draft has EVPN-specific procedures as well.  And more keep getting
    added as additional problems get discovered (e.g., the new intra-ES
    tunnels).   It's very far from being "just use MVPN protocols as
    is".   <br>
    <br>
    Finally, one might also point out that the folks with the most
    in-depth knowledge of MVPN seem to be the least enthusiastic about
    the "seamless-mcast" draft.  Just saying ;-)<br>
    <br>
    In the remainder of this message I want to focus on Ashutosh's
    criticisms of the OISM proposal (as we call the proposal in the
    irb-mcast draft). <br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      <div><b>4. Data Plane considerations</b></div>
      <div><b><br>
        </b></div>
      <div><b>4.1.</b> The data-plane nuances of solution has been
        underplayed. For example, if a PE1 has a (S, G) receivers in
        BD2, BD3 till BD10, whereas source S belongs in BD1 subnet on
        PE2. And if BD1 is not configured locally on PE1, a special BD
        (called SBD) is programmed as IIF in forwarding entry. Later if
        BD1 gets configured on PE1, it would cause IIF to change on PE1
        from SBD to BD1. </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    So far correct.<br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      <div>This would result in traffic disruption for all existing
        receivers in BD2, BD3 till BD10. </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    The IIF in an (S,G) or (*,G) state can change at any time, due to
    distant (or not so distant) link failures, and/or due to other
    routing changes.  It changes whenever the UMH selection changes, and
    it changes if the ingress PE decides to move a flow from an I-PMSI
    to an S-PMSI.  Of all the events that might cause a particular
    multicast state to change its IIF, the addition of a BD on the local
    PE does not seem to be one of the more frequent.<br>
    <br>
    Some PIM implementations try to delay changing the IIF in a given
    (S,G) state until an (S,G) packet actually arrives from the new
    IIF.  However, such data-driven state changes introduce a lot of
    complexity.  MVPN has always tried to avoid data-driven state
    changes, and MVPN implementations will generally see some small
    amount of disruption when the IIF changes.  Methods for minimizing
    this are really an implementation matter.  <br>
    <br>
    In the case where a new BD is configured, there may be some risk of
    an (S,G) packet getting lost in the following situation:<br>
    <br>
    - Time t0: The packet arrives and gets marked as being from the SBD.<br>
    - Time t1: The IIF changes from SBD to BD1<br>
    - Time t2: The packet is processed against the (S,G) state and
    discarded as having arrived from the wrong IIF<br>
    <br>
    Given (a) how short the time t2-t0 is, (b) how infrequently new BDs
    get configured on a PE, and (c) the fact that there are many other
    causes of IIF changes, this does not seem like a real problem.  If
    it is regarded as a problem, resolving it would be an implementation
    matter.<br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div><b>4.2. </b>Also, <i>evpn-irb</i> solution proposes to
        relax the RPF check for a (*, G) multicast entry. This poses a
        great risk of traffic loops especially in transient network
        conditions in addition to poor debug-ability.    </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    In the case where the receiving tenant systems ask for (*,G), and
    all the sources are known to be in the EVPN Tenant Domain, a
    Rendezvous Point (RP) is not required, as there is no real need for
    "source discovery", "shared trees", or "switching from shared trees
    to source trees".  Thus some of the most complicated and error-prone
    features of IP multicast can be avoided.  Note that we also avoid
    the need to create an (S,G) state for every source, which may result
    in a considerable reduction in state.  (Though obviously this
    optimization can only be used if there is a priori knowledge that
    all sources for a given group are within the EVPN domain.)  <br>
    <br>
    I don't think I've ever heard anybody say "I wish I had more PIM
    RPs, and more switching between shared trees and source trees; that
    makes things really easy to debug!".  I've heard the opposite
    though, quite a lot ;-) <br>
    <br>
    I've heard it suggested that the use of MVPN's SPT-ONLY mode
    provides an equivalent simplification.  However, that is not true at
    all.  The SPT-ONLY mode (RFC 6514 section 14) requires each PE to
    function as an RP.   This creates a whole new set of RPs that need
    to be managed, creates more work for the PEs, and requires each PE
    to originate more routes.  It requires the PE to create a lot of
    (S,G) states that are not otherwise needed.  And if an MVPN customer
    (or EVPN tenant) already has its own RP infrastructure, the PEs may
    need to participate in BSR or Auto-RP, and/or may need to talk MSDP
    to the other RPs.<br>
    <br>
    If a given multicast group has all its sources and receivers in the
    EVPN domain, it's much simpler if one can avoid RPs entirely for
    that group.  And if that EVPN domain has other multicast groups with
    sources or receivers in an MVPN domain, it may even be impossible to
    configure the EVPN-PEs to be in SPT-ONLY mode.  The MVPN nodes are
    likely to be configured with RPT-SPT mode, and the two modes do not
    interoperate.<br>
    <br>
    With regard to the "great risk of traffic loops ", I'd like to hear
    more specifics.  To get a loop, there'd have to be a situation in
    which a PE gets a (*,G) packet, sends it out one of its local ACs,
    and then the same packet is received back (at the same or at another
    PE) over an AC.  Given that the all-active multi-homing procedures
    are in place, I just don't see how this will happen.  (Remember that
    we're not talking about the multicast states used to create trees in
    the underlay; when creating trees in the underlay, looping is more
    of a worry, but that's not relevant to the current discussion.)<br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite">
      <div><b>3. Control plane scale in fabric / core </b><br>
      </div>
      ... each PE one additional Tunnel per BD apart from existing BUM
      tunnel. Essentially one tunnel for B+U and another for M. This is
      proposed to avoid all B+U traffic in the BD1, indiscriminately
      reaching all PE's in domain, irrespective of whether they have BD1
      configured locally or not. This increases the state in fabric by <b>"num
        of PE" x "num of BD"</b>.</blockquote>
    <br>
    I think the issue alluded to here is actually the data plane state,
    i.e.,  the amount of state that has to be maintained in order to do
    the forwarding.<br>
    <br>
    We should also make clear that when we say things like "one per PE",
    what we really mean is "one per PE per Tenant Domain" (just as MVPN
    tunnels are "one per PE per VPN").  Everything below will be in the
    context of a given Tenant Domain.<br>
    <br>
    Let me point out first that the number of BUM tunnels that exist per
    RFC 7432 (assuming P2MP LSPs are used) is <b>O(number of PEs x
      number of BDs)</b>.  If one adds a second per-BD tunnel so that
    one can carry the IP multicast frames separately, the number of
    tunnels is still <b>O(number of PEs x number of BDs)</b>. <br>
    <br>
    However, for the IP multicast tunnels, I think it would be better to
    use aggregated tunnels, so that a single P2MP LSP from, say, PE1,
    carries the IP multicast frames from all of PE1's locally attached
    ACs (in the given Tenant Domain), no matter which BD the AC is
    attached to.  That is, one really needs only one additional P2MP LSP
    per PE per Tenant Domain, not one per BD.<br>
    <br>
    In order to properly perform the ethernet emulation, an egress PE,
    say PE2, has to be able to determine whether an IP multicast frame
    from PE1 came from one of the BDs to which PE1 is locally attached. 
    This means that the data plane encapsulation has to contain
    information that allows PE2 to make this determination.  In the
    draft, this is done by using an MPLS label or a VNID (depending upon
    encapsulation) that identifies the frame's source BD.<br>
    <br>
    When using MPLS encapsulation, the assignment of labels to BDs is
    best done by using the technique described in
    draft-zzhang-bess-mvpn-evpn-aggregation-label ("MVPN/EVPN Tunnel
    Aggregation with Common Labels").   Per that draft, each BD would be
    assigned a domain-wide unique label (from a "Domain-Wide Common
    Block", or DCB).  Then the number of BD-identifying labels that each
    PE needs to know is proportional to the number of BDs in the Tenant
    Domains to which it is attached.  So in the data plane the number of
    labels one has to know for receiving is just <b><b>"number of BDs </b>in
      locally attached Tenant Domains";</b> the number of PEs does not
    factor in.  (Note that when using VXLAN encapsulation, the VNIDs are
    already domain-wide unique.)<br>
    <br>
    When one is just doing RFC 7432, the number of data plane labels one
    needs is <b><b>"number of locally attached BDs", </b></b>which
    will certainly be a smaller number, but the difference between these
    two numbers does not seem very scary.<br>
    <br>
    One might well ask though whether the number of labels a receiving
    PE has to know could be reduced from <b><b>"number of BDs </b>in
      locally attached Tenant Domains" </b>to <b><b>"number of locally
        attached BDs".  </b></b>This is certainly worth exploring.  If
    one receives a frame on a given P2MP LSP, one knows from the top
    label what Tenant Domain it belongs to.  The second label tells one
    what BD the frame belongs to.  If that second label is unrecognized,
    one could decide to treat the frame as belonging to the SBD of the
    Tenant Domain identified by the top label.  This sort of technique
    would really minimize the data plane state, while still allowing the
    source BD to be identified.  This is worth some further
    invetigation.<b><b> </b></b><br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAPAoC9SBhHExZ8uhbN2c8L2-rREsAk9X4V=Af__mrdmB4T9pEA@mail.gmail.com">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div><br>
        </div>
        <b>2. Scale of BGP routes</b>  <br>
        <div><i>evpn-irb</i> solution mandates a PE to process and store
          all IMET NLRI's from all peer PE's in tenant domain (as
          opposed to processing and storing only NLRI's for BD's it has
          locally present). </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    Now we're talking about control plane scale.<br>
    <br>
    Just for clarity, please note that when Ingress Replication is used,
    the BD-specific IMETs do not carry the SBD-RT  (see section 3.2.2)
    and hence are not distributed to all PEs in the Tenant Domain. 
    (There are some sections of the draft that are inconsistent about
    this; that will be fixed.)  So this issue does not arise in that
    case.<br>
    <br>
    <blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:CAPAoC9SBhHExZ8uhbN2c8L2-rREsAk9X4V=Af__mrdmB4T9pEA@mail.gmail.com">
      <div dir="ltr">
        <div>This is proposed because multicast traffic could be
          originating from any PE in any BD. To put this in perspective,
          lets take an example of a tenant domain with 101 PE's with
          each PE having 1000 BD's. Each PE has at most 10 BD's common
          with any other PE in network. In this case PE1 will have to
          process and store, 100 (remote PE's) x 1000 (BD's per PE) x 1
          (IMET per BD) = 0.1 Million IMET routes. Essentially, it is of
          order <b>"Num of BD's" x "Num of PE's"</b>. <br>
        </div>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
    I'd like to see the example deployment where a single Tenant Domain
    attaches to 100 PEs, each of those PEs attaches to 1000 BDs of that
    Tenant Domain, and each individual BD attaches to only 10 of those
    PEs!<br>
    <br>
    However, the basic point is well taken.  In the context of a given
    Tenant Domain, the number of IMET routes a PE receives will be <b>O(number
      of PEs  x average number of BDs per PE).<br>
      <br>
    </b>Whether this really presents a significant control plane scaling
    issue is debatable, but let's see if we can reduce this.<br>
    <br>
    If we use aggregate tunnels, the tunnel will be specified in the
    SBD-IMET route.  When a PE sends an SBD-IMET route, it can include
    in that route the label used to identify each of the BDs to which
    that PE is locally attached.  If we do that, we don't need to send
    the per-BD IMET routes to all PEs in the Tenant Domain.  (If there
    are too many locally attached BDs of a given Tenant Domain to fit
    into a single SBD-IMET route, we could borrow the technique of RFC
    7432 Section 8.2 to send a small number of additional SBD-IMET
    routes. )  With this minor change, we could reduce the number of
    IMET routes so that it is proportional only to the number of PEs<br>
    <br>
    Further, if the labels used to identify the BDs are domain-wide
    unique, it may be possible to omit them from the SBD-IMET routes
    altogether.   Or perhaps only the DR for each BD will advertise the
    label for that BD.  Or perhaps they can be learned directly from a
    controller.  These are all options worth exploring as a way of
    reducing the overhead.<br>
    <br>
    So I think that by making some small adjustments, we can greatly
    reduce the control plane overhead without incurring all the problems
    of the "seamless-mcast" scheme.<br>
    <br>
    <br>
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Subject: Re: [bess] [Gen-art] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-10
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David, thanks for your review. I have entered a No Objection ballot.

Alissa

> On Sep 6, 2018, at 6:15 PM, David Schinazi <dschinazi@apple.com> =
wrote:
>=20
> Reviewer: David Schinazi
> Review result: Ready with Nits
>=20
> I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area
> Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed
> by the IESG for the IETF Chair.  Please treat these comments just
> like any other last call comments.
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> For more information, please see the FAQ at
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> <https://trac.ietf.org/trac/gen/wiki/GenArtfaq>.
>=20
> Document: draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-10
> Reviewer: David Schinazi
> Review Date: 2018-09-06
> IETF LC End Date: 2018-09-03
> IESG Telechat date: 2018-09-13
>=20
> Summary: This document is clearly written and looks ready to me.
>=20
> Major issues: None found.
>=20
> Minor issues: None found.=20
>=20
> Nits/editorial comments: Typo "senstive" - please run the internet =
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From nobody Tue Sep 11 18:49:52 2018
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From: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
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Cc: draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib@ietf.org, Mach Chen <mach.chen@huawei.com>, bess-chairs@ietf.org, mach.chen@huawei.com, bess@ietf.org
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Subject: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection

When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
introductory paragraph, however.)


Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.


The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/



----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to request
changes to this specific document toward that end, though.

Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)

Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
would aid readability.



From nobody Wed Sep 12 01:29:54 2018
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From: Robert Raszuk <rraszuk@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 12 Sep 2018 10:29:49 +0200
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To: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
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Subject: Re: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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--000000000000d0f7d40575a864a1
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Hi Benjamin,

> A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> implies transport encryption.

Let me observe that for a lot of work in IETF term "VPN" does *not* imply
any form of either transport or payload encryption.

In fact here the MVPN which is derivative of L3VPNs do not imply use of any
encryption at all.

The term "VPN" here is really all about IP reachability separation.

So with this in mind can you please clarify your above comment ?

Kind regards,
Robert.


On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 3:49 AM, Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu> wrote:

> Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
> draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection
>
> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> introductory paragraph, however.)
>
>
> Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>
>
> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> COMMENT:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to
> request
> changes to this specific document toward that end, though.
>
> Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
> considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
> privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
> MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
> mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
> Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
> mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
> mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
>
> Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
> would aid readability.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>

--000000000000d0f7d40575a864a1
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,he=
lvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small">Hi Benjamin,</div><div class=3D"gmail_d=
efault" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><b=
r></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,s=
ans-serif;font-size:small">

<span style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px;background-col=
or:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:ini=
tial;float:none;display:inline">&gt; A general comment that we&#39;ve been =
making on lots of documents in this</span></div><div class=3D"gmail_default=
" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small">&gt;=C2=
=A0<span style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px;background-=
color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-color:=
initial;float:none;display:inline">space is that it would be nice to be in =
a place where the acronym &quot;VPN&quot;</span></div><div class=3D"gmail_d=
efault" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small">&g=
t;=C2=A0<span style=3D"font-family:arial,sans-serif;font-size:12.8px;backgr=
ound-color:rgb(255,255,255);text-decoration-style:initial;text-decoration-c=
olor:initial;float:none;display:inline">implies transport encryption.</span=
>

<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica=
,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=
=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small">Let me observe =
that for a lot of work in IETF term &quot;VPN&quot; does *not* imply any fo=
rm of either transport or payload encryption.=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"gmai=
l_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"=
><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetic=
a,sans-serif;font-size:small">In fact here the MVPN which is derivative of =
L3VPNs do not imply use of any encryption at all.=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"=
gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:sm=
all"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helv=
etica,sans-serif;font-size:small">The term &quot;VPN&quot; here is really a=
ll about IP reachability separation.</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" styl=
e=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div=
 class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;fo=
nt-size:small">So with this in mind can you please clarify your above comme=
nt ?=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,hel=
vetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" s=
tyle=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small">Kind regard=
s,</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,s=
ans-serif;font-size:small">Robert.</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=
=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div></div=
><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Sep 12, =
2018 at 3:49 AM, Benjamin Kaduk <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kad=
uk@mit.edu" target=3D"_blank">kaduk@mit.edu</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><block=
quote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc=
 solid;padding-left:1ex">Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot po=
sition for<br>
draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection<br>
<br>
When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all<br>
email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this<br>
introductory paragraph, however.)<br>
<br>
<br>
Please refer to <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-crit=
eria.html" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/iesg/<=
wbr>statement/discuss-criteria.<wbr>html</a><br>
for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.<br>
<br>
<br>
The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:<br>
<a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/" rel=
=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/<wbr>doc/dra=
ft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>-----=
-----<br>
COMMENT:<br>
------------------------------<wbr>------------------------------<wbr>-----=
-----<br>
<br>
A general comment that we&#39;ve been making on lots of documents in this<b=
r>
space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym &quot;VPN=
&quot;<br>
implies transport encryption.=C2=A0 It&#39;s unclear that it&#39;s appropri=
ate to request<br>
changes to this specific document toward that end, though.<br>
<br>
Perhaps I&#39;m confused, but &quot;mvpnAdvtPeerAddr&quot; appears in the s=
ecurity<br>
considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have<br>
privacy/security impact.=C2=A0 That list is predicated on being &quot;objec=
ts with a<br>
MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible&quot;, but all the instances of<br>
mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.<br=
>
Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,<br>
mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and<br>
mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.=C2=A0 (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAd=
drs<br>
and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final &#39;s&#39;?)<br>
<br>
Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables&#39; descriptions<=
br>
would aid readability.<br>
<br>
<br>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
BESS mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org">BESS@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/bess</a><br>
</blockquote></div><br></div>

--000000000000d0f7d40575a864a1--


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The following errata report has been submitted for RFC8365,
"A Network Virtualization Overlay Solution Using Ethernet VPN (EVPN)".

--------------------------------------
You may review the report below and at:
http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid5497

--------------------------------------
Type: Editorial
Reported by: Klemens Schragel <klemens.schragel@mailbox.org>

Section: 5.1.3

Original Text
-------------
   list of encapsulation types defined in [RFC5512]; they are listed in
   Section 11.

   The MPLS encapsulation tunnel type, listed in Section 11, is needed

Corrected Text
--------------
   list of encapsulation types defined in [RFC5512]; they are listed in
   Section 12.

   The MPLS encapsulation tunnel type, listed in Section 12, is needed

Notes
-----
Typo in the reference, Section 11 is "11.  Security Considerations", but text refers to "12.  IANA Considerations"

Instructions:
-------------
This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please
use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or
rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party  
can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary. 

--------------------------------------
RFC8365 (draft-ietf-bess-evpn-overlay-12)
--------------------------------------
Title               : A Network Virtualization Overlay Solution Using Ethernet VPN (EVPN)
Publication Date    : March 2018
Author(s)           : A. Sajassi, Ed., J. Drake, Ed., N. Bitar, R. Shekhar, J. Uttaro, W. Henderickx
Category            : PROPOSED STANDARD
Source              : BGP Enabled Services
Area                : Routing
Stream              : IETF
Verifying Party     : IESG


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From: Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>
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Subject: Re: [bess] [Gen-art] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-15
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Ines, thank you for your review. I have entered a No Objection ballot.

Alissa

> On Sep 2, 2018, at 4:33 PM, Ines Robles =
<mariainesrobles=3D40googlemail.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
>=20
> Reviewer: Ines Robles
> Review result: Ready
>=20
> I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area
> Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed
> by the IESG for the IETF Chair.  Please treat these comments just
> like any other last call comments.
>=20
> For more information, please see the FAQ at
>=20
> <https://trac.ietf.org/trac/gen/wiki/GenArtfaq>.
>=20
> Document: draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-15
> Reviewer: Ines Robles
> Review Date: 2018-09-02
> IETF LC End Date: 2018-09-03
> IESG Telechat date: Not scheduled for a telechat
>=20
> Summary:
> I believe the draft is technically good. This document is well written =
and
> clear to understand.
>=20
> This document defines a portion of the Management Information Base =
(MIB) for
> use with network management protocols in the Internet community. In =
particular,
> it describes common managed objects used by other MIB modules which =
are
> designed for monitoring and/or configuring both Layer 2 and Layer 3 =
Virtual
> Private Networks (VPN) that support multicast.
>=20
> Major issues: Not found
>=20
> Minor issues: Not found
>=20
> Nits/editorial comments: Not found
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Gen-art mailing list
> Gen-art@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gen-art


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Reviewer: Mahesh Jethanandani
Review result: Ready

{\rtf1\ansi\ansicpg1252\cocoartf1561\cocoasubrtf600
{\fonttbl\f0\fswiss\fcharset0 Helvetica;\f1\fmodern\fcharset0 Courier;}
{\colortbl;\red255\green255\blue255;\red0\green0\blue0;}
{\*\expandedcolortbl;;\cssrgb\c0\c0\c0;}
\margl1440\margr1440\vieww10800\viewh11640\viewkind0
\deftab720
\pard\pardeftab720\partightenfactor0

\f0\fs24 \cf0 \expnd0\expndtw0\kerning0
I have reviewed this document as part of the Operational
directorate\'92s\'a0ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed
by the IESG. \'a0These\'a0comments were written with the intent of improving
the operational\'a0aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that are not addressed
in last call may be included in AD reviews during the IESG review. \'a0Document
editors and\'a0WG chairs should treat these comments just like any other last
call\'a0comments.\ \ Document reviewed:
\'a0draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16\ \ Summary: \ \ Ready\ \ Document
Abstract:\ \ \pard\pardeftab720\sl300\partightenfactor0 \cf2
\outl0\strokewidth0 \strokec2 This memo defines a portion of the Management
Information Base (MIB) for use with network management protocols in the
Internet community. In particular, it describes two MIB modules which will be
used by other MIB modules for monitoring and/or configuring Layer 2 and Layer 3
Virtual Private Networks that support multicast. \f1\fs26\fsmilli13333 \
\pard\pardeftab720\partightenfactor0

\f0\fs24 \cf0 \outl0\strokewidth0 \
Comments:\
\
The document defines a MIB for use with network management protocols. Other
than whether the module is correct and useful or not, which I have little
expertise in determining, there are no operating or management considerations
that need to be discussed.}


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Subject: Re: [bess] [OPS-DIR] Opsdir last call review of draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16
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Arggh!

It is quite clear I do not know what I am doing, and know even less how =
to fix it :-(

Here is the review that I planned on posting. I do not know how to fix =
it in data tracker. We can worry about it later.

I have reviewed this document as part of the Operational directorate=E2=80=
=99s ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the =
IESG.  These comments were written with the intent of improving the =
operational aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that are not addressed =
in last call may be included in AD reviews during the IESG review.  =
Document editors and WG chairs should treat these comments just like any =
other last call comments.

Document reviewed:  draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16

Summary:=20

Ready

Document Abstract:

This memo defines a portion of the Management Information Base (MIB) for =
use with network management protocols in the Internet community. In =
particular, it describes two MIB modules which will be used by other MIB =
modules for monitoring and/or configuring Layer 2 and Layer 3 Virtual =
Private Networks that support multicast.

Comments:

The document defines a MIB for use with network management protocols. =
Other than whether the module is correct and useful or not, which I have =
little expertise in determining, there are no operating or management =
considerations that need to be discussed.

Thanks.

Mahesh Jethanandani
mjethanandani@gmail.com



> On Sep 12, 2018, at 3:59 PM, Mahesh Jethanandani =
<mjethanandani@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> Reviewer: Mahesh Jethanandani
> Review result: Ready
>=20
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> I have reviewed this document as part of the Operational
> directorate\'92s\'a0ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being =
processed
> by the IESG. \'a0These\'a0comments were written with the intent of =
improving
> the operational\'a0aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that are not =
addressed
> in last call may be included in AD reviews during the IESG review. =
\'a0Document
> editors and\'a0WG chairs should treat these comments just like any =
other last
> call\'a0comments.\ \ Document reviewed:
> \'a0draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16\ \ Summary: \ \ Ready\ \ =
Document
> Abstract:\ \ \pard\pardeftab720\sl300\partightenfactor0 \cf2
> \outl0\strokewidth0 \strokec2 This memo defines a portion of the =
Management
> Information Base (MIB) for use with network management protocols in =
the
> Internet community. In particular, it describes two MIB modules which =
will be
> used by other MIB modules for monitoring and/or configuring Layer 2 =
and Layer 3
> Virtual Private Networks that support multicast. \f1\fs26\fsmilli13333 =
\
> \pard\pardeftab720\partightenfactor0
>=20
> \f0\fs24 \cf0 \outl0\strokewidth0 \
> Comments:\
> \
> The document defines a MIB for use with network management protocols. =
Other
> than whether the module is correct and useful or not, which I have =
little
> expertise in determining, there are no operating or management =
considerations
> that need to be discussed.}
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> OPS-DIR mailing list
> OPS-DIR@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ops-dir


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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Arggh!<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">It =
is quite clear I do not know what I am doing, and know even less how to =
fix it :-(</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Here =
is the review that I planned on posting. I do not know how to fix it in =
data tracker. We can worry about it later.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D""><div class=3D"">I have reviewed this =
document as part of the Operational directorate=E2=80=99s ongoing effort =
to review all IETF documents being processed by the IESG. &nbsp;These =
comments were written with the intent of improving the operational =
aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that are not addressed in last call =
may be included in AD reviews during the IESG review. &nbsp;Document =
editors and WG chairs should treat these comments just like any other =
last call comments.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Document reviewed: =
&nbsp;draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Summary:&nbsp;</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Ready</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Document Abstract:</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">This memo defines a =
portion of the Management Information Base (MIB) for use with network =
management protocols in the Internet community. In particular, it =
describes two MIB modules which will be used by other MIB modules for =
monitoring and/or configuring Layer 2 and Layer 3 Virtual Private =
Networks that support multicast.</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Comments:</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">The document defines a MIB for use with =
network management protocols. Other than whether the module is correct =
and useful or not, which I have little expertise in determining, there =
are no operating or management considerations that need to be =
discussed.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Thanks.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">
<div style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); =
font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: =
none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
text-decoration: none;">Mahesh Jethanandani</div><div =
style=3D"caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: =
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: =
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;"><a =
href=3D"mailto:mjethanandani@gmail.com" =
class=3D"">mjethanandani@gmail.com</a></div><div style=3D"caret-color: =
rgb(0, 0, 0); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: =
12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: =
normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: =
auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
</div>
<div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">On Sep 12, 2018, at 3:59 PM, Mahesh Jethanandani &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:mjethanandani@gmail.com" =
class=3D"">mjethanandani@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">Reviewer: Mahesh Jethanandani<br class=3D"">Review result: =
Ready<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">{\rtf1\ansi\ansicpg1252\cocoartf1561\cocoasubrtf600<br =
class=3D"">{\fonttbl\f0\fswiss\fcharset0 Helvetica;\f1\fmodern\fcharset0 =
Courier;}<br =
class=3D"">{\colortbl;\red255\green255\blue255;\red0\green0\blue0;}<br =
class=3D"">{\*\expandedcolortbl;;\cssrgb\c0\c0\c0;}<br =
class=3D"">\margl1440\margr1440\vieww10800\viewh11640\viewkind0<br =
class=3D"">\deftab720<br =
class=3D"">\pard\pardeftab720\partightenfactor0<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">\f0\fs24 \cf0 \expnd0\expndtw0\kerning0<br class=3D"">I have =
reviewed this document as part of the Operational<br =
class=3D"">directorate\'92s\'a0ongoing effort to review all IETF =
documents being processed<br class=3D"">by the IESG. =
\'a0These\'a0comments were written with the intent of improving<br =
class=3D"">the operational\'a0aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that =
are not addressed<br class=3D"">in last call may be included in AD =
reviews during the IESG review. \'a0Document<br class=3D"">editors =
and\'a0WG chairs should treat these comments just like any other last<br =
class=3D"">call\'a0comments.\ \ Document reviewed:<br =
class=3D"">\'a0draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16\ \ Summary: \ \ =
Ready\ \ Document<br class=3D"">Abstract:\ \ =
\pard\pardeftab720\sl300\partightenfactor0 \cf2<br =
class=3D"">\outl0\strokewidth0 \strokec2 This memo defines a portion of =
the Management<br class=3D"">Information Base (MIB) for use with network =
management protocols in the<br class=3D"">Internet community. In =
particular, it describes two MIB modules which will be<br class=3D"">used =
by other MIB modules for monitoring and/or configuring Layer 2 and Layer =
3<br class=3D"">Virtual Private Networks that support multicast. =
\f1\fs26\fsmilli13333 \<br =
class=3D"">\pard\pardeftab720\partightenfactor0<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">\f0\fs24 \cf0 \outl0\strokewidth0 \<br class=3D"">Comments:\<br=
 class=3D"">\<br class=3D"">The document defines a MIB for use with =
network management protocols. Other<br class=3D"">than whether the =
module is correct and useful or not, which I have little<br =
class=3D"">expertise in determining, there are no operating or =
management considerations<br class=3D"">that need to be discussed.}<br =
class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________<br =
class=3D"">OPS-DIR mailing list<br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:OPS-DIR@ietf.org" class=3D"">OPS-DIR@ietf.org</a><br =
class=3D"">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ops-dir<br =
class=3D""></div></div></blockquote></div><br =
class=3D""></div></body></html>=

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From nobody Wed Sep 12 20:27:05 2018
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From: Carlos Pignataro <cpignata@cisco.com>
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Cc: draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track.all@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org
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Subject: [bess] Rtgdir last call review of draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-09
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Reviewer: Carlos Pignataro
Review result: Has Nits

This is a very well written and detailed document.

I have only one concern, which I believe should be addressed before moving this
document forward:

I found the rational and specific details on what this document "Updates" from
three previous RFCs to be lacking, and confusing.

I recommend an "Updates from RFC XYZ" section in which there is a textual
explanation and ideally Old/New specifics on how this document updates previous
RFCs. At least, something more inline with current thinking as per
https://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf/current/msg109106.html

Thanks,

Carlos Pignataro.


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<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear authors,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I have some questions regarding draft-ietf-bess-evpn=
-inter-subnet-forwarding-05.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The last paragraph of <a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.=
org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05#section-4.1.2">
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05=
#section-4.1.2</a> (Page 21) said:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; If EVPN-IRB NVEs are configured not to =
advertise MAC-only routes,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; then upon receiving the first data pack=
et, it learns the MAC address<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; of the TS and updates the MAC entry in =
the corresponding MAC-VRF<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; table with the local adjacency informat=
ion (e.g., local interface).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; It also realizes that there has been a =
MAC move because the same MAC<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; address has been learned remotely from =
the source NVE. <span style=3D"color:#0070C0">
It then sends<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#0070C0">&nbsp;&nbsp; an unicas=
t ARP request to the host and when receiving an ARP<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#0070C0">&nbsp;&nbsp; response,=
 it follows the procedure outlined in
<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-fo=
rwarding-05#section-4.1.1">
<span style=3D"color:#0070C0;text-decoration:none">section 4.1.1</span></a>=
.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Question 1:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A1=B0=A1=AD <span style=3D"color:#0070C0">it follow=
s the procedure outlined in
<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-fo=
rwarding-05#section-4.1.1">
<span style=3D"color:#0070C0;text-decoration:none">section 4.1.1</span></a>=
.</span>=A1=B1,
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Which specific paragraph of section 4.1.1 is followe=
d?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">IMO, It follows the procedure that starts from the s=
econd paragraph of the section 4.1.1:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A1=B0<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; The target NVE upon receiving this ARP =
request, updates its MAC-VRF,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; IP-VRF, and ARP table with the host MAC=
, IP, and local adjacency<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;&nbsp; information (e.g., local interface).<o:=
p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A1=AD<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=A1=B0<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Is my understanding correct?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Question 2:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-family:=CB=CE=CC=
=E5">=A1=B0</span>It then sends an unicast ARP request to the host and when=
 receiving an ARP response<span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-family:=CB=CE=
=CC=E5">=A1=B1</span>.&nbsp;
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I think this sentence means<span lang=3D"ZH-CN" styl=
e=3D"font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=A3=BA</span> The target NVE sends an unicas=
t ARP request to the moved host (TS) and the target NVE receives an ARP res=
ponse from the moved host (TS). Then, per the ARP response,
 the target NVE can recognize that the moved host (TS) has been migrated to=
 the target NVE.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Is my understanding correct?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Shunwan<o:p></o:p></p>
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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: "draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding.authors@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding.authors@ietf.org>
CC: "draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding.notify@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding.notify@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Yechiel Rosengarten <Yechiel.Rosengarten@ecitele.com>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: A couple of questions regarding draft-ietf-bess-inter-subnet-forwrding-05
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Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2018 11:17:57 +0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/tBK89n5pGKyH80K55pwnLNEx53Y>
Subject: [bess] A couple of questions regarding draft-ietf-bess-inter-subnet-forwrding-05
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Dear colleagues,
I would like to clarify a couple of points regarding extended communities =
mentioned in Section 3.2.1 of the draft .


1.       This section says that the MAC.IP Advertisement EVPN route learne=
d from ARP by the ingress is advertised along with the following two exten=
ded   communities:

a.       Tunnel Type Extended Community

b.       Router's MAC Extended Community
I have tried to find the Tunnel Type Extended Community in the relevant IA=
NA registries, but failed to do so. Did you actually mean the BGP Encapsul=
ation Extended Community (RFC 5512<https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5512>) t=
hat carries the Tunnel Type inside and can be used instead of the BGP Tunn=
el Encapsulation Attribute (defined in the same document) if there is no e=
xplicit encapsulation information to be signaled?

2.       RFC 8365 that extends the list of tunnel types that can be carrie=
d in the BGP Tunnel Encapsulation Attribute or in the BGP Encapsulation Ex=
tended Community to include MPLS encapsulation states in Section 5.1.3 tha=
t ""The MPLS encapsulation tunnel type ... is needed in order to distingui=
sh between an advertising node that only supports non-MPLS encapsulations =
and one that supports MPLS and non-MPLS encapsulations.  An advertising no=
de that only supports MPLS  encapsulation does not need to  advertise any =
encapsulation tunnel types". Does this imply that if Symmetric IRB is used=
 in EVPN-MPLS, there is  no need to attach the BGP Encapsulation Extended =
Community to the MAC/IP Advertisement routes learned by the ingress PE? (S=
ince the draft explicitly states that the Router's MAC Extended Community =
is not required in certain situations that include EVPM-MPLS, this would m=
ean that neither of the extended communities mentioned in the draft is req=
uired in the EVPN-MPLS scenario).

Your timely feedback will be highly appreciated.

Regards, and lots of thanks in advance,
Sasha

Office: +972-39266302
Cell:      +972-549266302
Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com


__________________________________________________________________________=
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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear colleagues,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I would like to clarify a couple of points regardin=
g extended communities mentioned in Section 3.2.1 of the draft .<o:p></o:p=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 lev=
el1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span sty=
le=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>This section says that th=
e MAC.IP Advertisement EVPN route learned from ARP by the ingress is adver=
tised along with the following two extended &nbsp;&nbsp;communities:
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:72.0pt;text-indent:-18.=
0pt;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">a.<span style=3D"font=
:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>Tunnel Type Extended Comm=
unity<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"margin-left:72.0pt;text-indent:-18.=
0pt;mso-list:l0 level2 lfo1">
<![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">b.<span style=3D"font=
:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>Router's MAC Extended Com=
munity<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">I have tried to find t=
he Tunnel Type Extended Community in the relevant IANA registries, but fai=
led to do so. Did you actually mean the BGP Encapsulation Extended Communi=
ty (<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5512">RFC
 5512</a>) that carries the Tunnel Type inside and can be used instead of =
the BGP Tunnel Encapsulation Attribute (defined in the same document) if t=
here is no explicit encapsulation information to be signaled?<o:p></o:p></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 lev=
el1 lfo1"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span sty=
le=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span>RFC 8365 that extends the=
 list of tunnel types that can be carried in the BGP Tunnel Encapsulation =
Attribute or in the BGP Encapsulation Extended Community to include MPLS e=
ncapsulation states in Section 5.1.3
 that &#8220;&#8221;The MPLS encapsulation tunnel type ... is needed in or=
der to distinguish between an advertising node that only supports non-MPLS=
 encapsulations and one that supports MPLS and non-MPLS encapsulations.&nb=
sp;
<span style=3D"background:yellow;mso-highlight:yellow">An advertising node=
 that only supports MPLS &nbsp;encapsulation does not need to &nbsp;advert=
ise any encapsulation tunnel types</span>&#8221;. Does this imply that if =
Symmetric IRB is used in EVPN-MPLS, there is &nbsp;no need
 to attach the BGP Encapsulation Extended Community to the MAC/IP Advertis=
ement routes learned by the ingress PE? (Since the draft explicitly states=
 that the Router&#8217;s MAC Extended Community is not required in certain=
 situations that include EVPM-MPLS, this
 would mean that neither of the extended communities mentioned in the draf=
t is required in the EVPN-MPLS scenario).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Your timely feedback will be highly appreciated.<o:=
p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards, and lots of thanks in advance,<o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sasha<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Office: &#43;972-39266302<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;972-549266=
302<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp; Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com=
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<br clear=3D"both">
__________________________________________________________________________=
_<BR>
<BR>
This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains inform=
ation which is <BR>
CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have rece=
ived this <BR>
transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and then =
delete the original <BR>
and all copies thereof.<BR>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/b_pCM6CNer-FJqMZcFi7XFl8BmE>
Subject: Re: [bess] Rtgdir last call review of draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-09
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On 9/12/2018 11:26 PM, Carlos Pignataro wrote:
> I found the rational and specific details on what this document "Updates" from
> three previous RFCs to be lacking, and confusing.

Carlos,

Thanks for your review.

I don't want to get caught up in the neverending discussion of exactly 
what constitutes an "Update".  This is being discussed right now on the 
IETF list, and it's quite clear that there is no consensus.  As usual, 
every possible opinion is dogmatically held by someone ;-)

The introduction of the expl-track draft explicitly points out a number 
of situations that are not adequately addressed in the prior RFCs, and 
for which the prior RFCs do not provide clear guidance. This is a 
potential source of interoperability problems.

The introduction also indicates a number of new features that are added 
by the draft.

Anyone implementing RFCs 6514, 6625, and/or 7524 will certainly be 
well-advised to read this draft in order to (a) make sure that they 
properly handle the situations that are not explicitly addressed by the 
prior RFCs, and (b) to make sure that they are aware of the new features 
so they can make an informed decision of whether to implement them.

I think this justifies the "Updates" status.

> I recommend an "Updates from RFC XYZ" section in which there is a textual
> explanation and ideally Old/New specifics on how this document updates previous
> RFCs.

I think the introduction covers this in the appropriate level of detail; 
I really don't know what could be added.

Eric


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From: "Carlos Pignataro (cpignata)" <cpignata@cisco.com>
To: Eric C Rosen <erosen@juniper.net>
CC: "rtg-dir@ietf.org" <rtg-dir@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track.all@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track.all@ietf.org>, "ietf@ietf.org" <ietf@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Rtgdir last call review of draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-09
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Date: Thu, 13 Sep 2018 17:10:55 +0000
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--_000_CE5B4EC769B14B7496C2465FF021CFD0ciscocom_--


From nobody Fri Sep 14 06:42:28 2018
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Subject: [bess] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : BGP based Multi-homing in Virtual Private LAN Service
        Authors         : Bhupesh Kothari
                          Kireeti Kompella
                          Wim Henderickx
                          Florin Balus
                          James Uttaro
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02.txt
	Pages           : 20
	Date            : 2018-09-13

Abstract:
   Virtual Private LAN Service (VPLS) is a Layer 2 Virtual Private
   Network (VPN) that gives its customers the appearance that their
   sites are connected via a Local Area Network (LAN).  It is often
   required for the Service Provider (SP) to give the customer redundant
   connectivity to some sites, often called "multi-homing".  This memo
   shows how BGP-based multi-homing can be offered in the context of LDP
   and BGP VPLS solutions.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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Date: Fri, 14 Sep 2018 19:50:54 -0500
From: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
To: Robert Raszuk <rraszuk@gmail.com>
Cc: The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib@ietf.org, Mach Chen <mach.chen@huawei.com>, bess-chairs@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 10:29:49AM +0200, Robert Raszuk wrote:
> Hi Benjamin,
> 
> > A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> > space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> > implies transport encryption.
> 
> Let me observe that for a lot of work in IETF term "VPN" does *not* imply
> any form of either transport or payload encryption.

I am aware that this is the current state, yes.  That's why I used the
phrasing I did, namely, "it would be nice to be in a place", with the
implication that we currently aren't.

> In fact here the MVPN which is derivative of L3VPNs do not imply use of any
> encryption at all.
> 
> The term "VPN" here is really all about IP reachability separation.
> 
> So with this in mind can you please clarify your above comment ?

Sure!  In recent years, the IETF as a whole seems to have shifted toward
placing a greater emphasis on the privacy protection of user data from "the
network" (not the network operators, necessarily, but an attacker that has
coopted or compromised core nodes).  This is, in some sense, the core point
of RFC 7258.  With this renewed interest in "private" and "privacy"
referring to obscuring user data from intermediates (i.e., encryption), 
using the same word "private" to refer to a different concept ("not
shared", as the IP reachability separation embodies) can lead to confusion.
This is particularly pronounced in the case of the acronym "VPN", when
(encrypting) corporate VPNs are nigh-ubiquitous, and end users have
(encrypting) VPNs to pierce firewalls that get in their way, avoid
geographic-based content restrictions, and the like.

While the network engineers and RFC authors know there are different
contexts for the term in current usage, the popular media really does not,
and there are many consumers of RFCs that are not intimately involved in
their development.  So as a matter for the "good of the Internet", my
position is that reducing this potential for confusion is desirable.
>From my view as Security AD, it would be quite a shame if we ended up in an
Internet world where some corporate purchaser buys a product labelled "VPN"
thinking it will protect (encrypt) his company's data, when in fact it only
provides IP reachability separtaion.

I don't have an alternative term I want to push for the "not shared" case
(though just "Virtual Network" and its parallels to network virtualization
does come to mind); even a passing mention that this instance of VPN does
not provide data confidentiality would be a big improvemnet, in my mind.
But this is a very broad topic, and it needs to be eased into gradually, so
I'm starting by just mentioning the potential issue when it comes up, with
no expectation of changing the *current* document -- this is more of a
long-term goal.

-Benjamin

> 
> 
> On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 3:49 AM, Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu> wrote:
> 
> > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
> > draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection
> >
> > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> > introductory paragraph, however.)
> >
> >
> > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
> > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
> >
> >
> > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > COMMENT:
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> > space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> > implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to
> > request
> > changes to this specific document toward that end, though.
> >
> > Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
> > considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
> > privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
> > MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
> > mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
> > Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
> > mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
> > mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> > and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
> >
> > Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
> > would aid readability.
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > BESS mailing list
> > BESS@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> >


From nobody Fri Sep 14 19:08:17 2018
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Subject: Re: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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Dear Tsuno,
      I agree with Benjamin Kaduk's comment on the Security
Considerations section. I understand the following sentence copied
verbatim from The Security Guidelines for IETF MIB modules
  >>     Some of the readable objects in this MIB module (i.e., objects
  >>     with a MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible) may be considered
  >>     sensitive or vulnerable in some network environments.
is causing the confusion. The scope of the readable objects restricted
to "objects with a MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible" is inadequate
here.

Please change the "i.e" to "e.g.". That will clear the confusion and
make the statement accurate.

Glenn

On 2018/09/12 10:49, Benjamin Kaduk wrote:
> Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
> draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection
> 
> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> introductory paragraph, however.)
> 
> 
> Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
> 
> 
> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/
> 
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> COMMENT:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to request
> changes to this specific document toward that end, though.
> 
> Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
> considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
> privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
> MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
> mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
> Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
> mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
> mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
> 
> Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
> would aid readability.
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> 


From nobody Fri Sep 14 19:21:00 2018
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Subject: Re: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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Dear Glenn,

Thank for your advice on the the Security Considerations section.
I am going to revise that section along with your advice.

-- tsuno

2018-09-15 11:07 GMT+09:00 Glenn Mansfield Keeni <glenn@cysols.com>:
> Dear Tsuno,
>      I agree with Benjamin Kaduk's comment on the Security
> Considerations section. I understand the following sentence copied
> verbatim from The Security Guidelines for IETF MIB modules
>  >>     Some of the readable objects in this MIB module (i.e., objects
>  >>     with a MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible) may be considered
>  >>     sensitive or vulnerable in some network environments.
> is causing the confusion. The scope of the readable objects restricted
> to "objects with a MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible" is inadequate
> here.
>
> Please change the "i.e" to "e.g.". That will clear the confusion and
> make the statement accurate.
>
> Glenn
>
>
> On 2018/09/12 10:49, Benjamin Kaduk wrote:
>>
>> Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
>> draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection
>>
>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
>> introductory paragraph, however.)
>>
>>
>> Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>>
>>
>> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/
>>
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> COMMENT:
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
>> space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
>> implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to
>> request
>> changes to this specific document toward that end, though.
>>
>> Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
>> considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
>> privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
>> MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
>> mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
>> Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
>> mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
>> mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
>> and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
>>
>> Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
>> would aid readability.
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> BESS mailing list
>> BESS@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
>>
>
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Subject: Re: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Benjamin,

Thank you very much for your thorough review and comments.
My replies are inline.

> Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
> considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
> privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
> MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
> mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
> Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
> mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
> mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.

I have received the advice from the MIB doctor on this matter and
I am going to update the draft along with the advice.

> (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)

For example, the DESCRPIPTION of mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
says as follows.

         "The network address which, along with the
          corresponding mvpnMrouteCmcastSourcePrefixLength object,
          identifies the sources for which this entry contains
          multicast routing information."

Thus, this object identifies the (multiple) multicast sources, not a
single source.
Consequently, I prefer that the names of these objects are in plural form.

> Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
> would aid readability.

Please let me confirm one thing.
I assume that you are talking about "Sec 3.1. Summary of MIB Module."
Do you mean that the description of each table should be in each
different subsection?
Or, do you mean that there should be one subsection including a set of
tables' descriptions?

Thanks in advance,

-- tsuno

2018-09-12 10:49 GMT+09:00 Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>:
> Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
> draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection
>
> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> introductory paragraph, however.)
>
>
> Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>
>
> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> COMMENT:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to request
> changes to this specific document toward that end, though.
>
> Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
> considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
> privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
> MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
> mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
> Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
> mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
> mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
>
> Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
> would aid readability.
>
>


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Hi Benjamin,

Yes now I see your point and all I can do is to agree with it.

As you know the story with right terminology is evolved to be even more
"funny". The real true and encrypted VPNs in the Internet are called SD-WAN
these days without any indication that there is privacy assurance while VPN
term is merely separating default IP reachability between parties if we
look at say L3VPNs. Sure there are also point to point IPSec VPNs which do
either encrypt or assure not compromised payload delivery.

So I guess indeed terminology is pretty confusing - and in fact it is
confusing even to technical people who are just not that ultimately
familiar with RFC4364 protocol and vendor's implementation details. Also
let's note that RFC4364 is often used outside of Internet and perhaps there
in those enterprise private networks encryption is not that much of a
necessity.

> From my view as Security AD, it would be quite a shame if we ended up in
an
> Internet world where some corporate purchaser buys a product labelled
"VPN"
> thinking it will protect (encrypt) his company's data, when in fact it
only
> provides IP reachability separtaion.

Well I think the market is here to help us ...

Today I see use of L3VPNs from SPs as rather fading away. SD-WAN have clear
advantages from both technical and economical points of view that I am not
sure if struggle to either rename or add mandatory or even optional
encryption to RFC4364 is really worth the effort.

A bit side observation is that the example described above leads me to
believe that the main fundamental problem is that today IETF does not (at
least to the best of my knowledge) coordinate names for new protocols or
protocol extensions in any way. Anyone can invent his own name and once the
document passes WG validating its technical merits I have not heard of many
cases where IESG or IETF wide review would change the name itself of the
proposal. And maybe in some cases it should ....

Kind regards,
Robert.


On Sat, Sep 15, 2018 at 2:51 AM Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu> wrote:

> On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 10:29:49AM +0200, Robert Raszuk wrote:
> > Hi Benjamin,
> >
> > > A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> > > space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> > > implies transport encryption.
> >
> > Let me observe that for a lot of work in IETF term "VPN" does *not* imply
> > any form of either transport or payload encryption.
>
> I am aware that this is the current state, yes.  That's why I used the
> phrasing I did, namely, "it would be nice to be in a place", with the
> implication that we currently aren't.
>
> > In fact here the MVPN which is derivative of L3VPNs do not imply use of
> any
> > encryption at all.
> >
> > The term "VPN" here is really all about IP reachability separation.
> >
> > So with this in mind can you please clarify your above comment ?
>
> Sure!  In recent years, the IETF as a whole seems to have shifted toward
> placing a greater emphasis on the privacy protection of user data from "the
> network" (not the network operators, necessarily, but an attacker that has
> coopted or compromised core nodes).  This is, in some sense, the core point
> of RFC 7258.  With this renewed interest in "private" and "privacy"
> referring to obscuring user data from intermediates (i.e., encryption),
> using the same word "private" to refer to a different concept ("not
> shared", as the IP reachability separation embodies) can lead to confusion.
> This is particularly pronounced in the case of the acronym "VPN", when
> (encrypting) corporate VPNs are nigh-ubiquitous, and end users have
> (encrypting) VPNs to pierce firewalls that get in their way, avoid
> geographic-based content restrictions, and the like.
>
> While the network engineers and RFC authors know there are different
> contexts for the term in current usage, the popular media really does not,
> and there are many consumers of RFCs that are not intimately involved in
> their development.  So as a matter for the "good of the Internet", my
> position is that reducing this potential for confusion is desirable.
> From my view as Security AD, it would be quite a shame if we ended up in an
> Internet world where some corporate purchaser buys a product labelled "VPN"
> thinking it will protect (encrypt) his company's data, when in fact it only
> provides IP reachability separtaion.
>
> I don't have an alternative term I want to push for the "not shared" case
> (though just "Virtual Network" and its parallels to network virtualization
> does come to mind); even a passing mention that this instance of VPN does
> not provide data confidentiality would be a big improvemnet, in my mind.
> But this is a very broad topic, and it needs to be eased into gradually, so
> I'm starting by just mentioning the potential issue when it comes up, with
> no expectation of changing the *current* document -- this is more of a
> long-term goal.
>
> -Benjamin
>
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 3:49 AM, Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu> wrote:
> >
> > > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
> > > draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection
> > >
> > > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> > > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> > > introductory paragraph, however.)
> > >
> > >
> > > Please refer to
> https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
> > > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
> > >
> > >
> > > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > COMMENT:
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > > A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> > > space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> > > implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to
> > > request
> > > changes to this specific document toward that end, though.
> > >
> > > Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
> > > considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
> > > privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects
> with a
> > > MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
> > > mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as
> not-accessible.
> > > Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
> > > mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
> > > mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar
> mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> > > and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
> > >
> > > Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
> > > would aid readability.
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BESS mailing list
> > > BESS@ietf.org
> > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess
> > >
>

--0000000000005282f60575e64ffe
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,he=
lvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small">Hi Benjamin,</div><div class=3D"gmail_d=
efault" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><b=
r></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,s=
ans-serif;font-size:small">Yes now I see your point and all I can do is to =
agree with it.=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family=
:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_=
default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small">A=
s you know the story with right terminology is evolved to be even more &quo=
t;funny&quot;. The real true and encrypted VPNs in the Internet are called =
SD-WAN these days without any indication that there is privacy assurance wh=
ile VPN term is merely separating default IP reachability between parties i=
f we look at say L3VPNs. Sure there are also point to point IPSec VPNs whic=
h do either encrypt or assure not compromised payload delivery.=C2=A0</div>=
<div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-seri=
f;font-size:small"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-fam=
ily:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small">So I guess indeed terminolo=
gy is pretty confusing - and in fact it is confusing even to technical peop=
le who are just not that ultimately familiar with RFC4364 protocol and vend=
or&#39;s implementation details. Also let&#39;s note that RFC4364 is often =
used outside of Internet and perhaps there in those enterprise private netw=
orks encryption is not that much of a necessity.=C2=A0</div><div class=3D"g=
mail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:sma=
ll"><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helve=
tica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><span style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica=
,sans-serif">&gt; From my view as Security AD, it would be quite a shame if=
 we ended up in an</span><br style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-seri=
f"><span style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">&gt; Internet wor=
ld where some corporate purchaser buys a product labelled &quot;VPN&quot;</=
span><br style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">&gt; thinking it will protect (encryp=
t) his company&#39;s data, when in fact it only</span><br style=3D"font-fam=
ily:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,=
sans-serif">&gt; provides IP reachability separtaion.</span><br style=3D"fo=
nt-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" st=
yle=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><span style=
=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><br></span></div><div class=3D"=
gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:sm=
all"><span style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">Well I think th=
e market is here to help us ...=C2=A0</span></div><div class=3D"gmail_defau=
lt" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><span =
style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><br></span></div><div clas=
s=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-si=
ze:small"><span style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">Today I se=
e use of L3VPNs from SPs as rather fading away. SD-WAN have clear advantage=
s from both technical and economical points of view that I am not sure if s=
truggle to either rename or add mandatory or even optional encryption to RF=
C4364 is really worth the effort.=C2=A0</span></div><div class=3D"gmail_def=
ault" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><br></span></div><div cl=
ass=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-=
size:small"><span style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">A bit si=
de observation is that the example described above leads me to believe that=
 the main fundamental problem is that today IETF does not (at least to the =
best of my knowledge) coordinate names for new protocols or protocol extens=
ions in any way. Anyone can invent his own name and once the document passe=
s WG validating its technical merits I have not heard of many cases where I=
ESG or IETF wide review would change the name itself of the proposal. And m=
aybe in some cases it should ....=C2=A0</span></div><div class=3D"gmail_def=
ault" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif"><br></span></div><div cl=
ass=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-=
size:small"><span style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif">Kind reg=
ards,</span></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"font-family:arial,h=
elvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><span style=3D"font-family:Arial,Helve=
tica,sans-serif">Robert.</span></div><div class=3D"gmail_default" style=3D"=
font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:small"><br></div></div><br=
><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Sat, Sep 15, 2018 at 2:51 A=
M Benjamin Kaduk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kaduk@mit.edu">kaduk@mit.edu</a>&gt;=
 wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8=
ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 10:=
29:49AM +0200, Robert Raszuk wrote:<br>
&gt; Hi Benjamin,<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; &gt; A general comment that we&#39;ve been making on lots of documents=
 in this<br>
&gt; &gt; space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym=
 &quot;VPN&quot;<br>
&gt; &gt; implies transport encryption.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Let me observe that for a lot of work in IETF term &quot;VPN&quot; doe=
s *not* imply<br>
&gt; any form of either transport or payload encryption.<br>
<br>
I am aware that this is the current state, yes.=C2=A0 That&#39;s why I used=
 the<br>
phrasing I did, namely, &quot;it would be nice to be in a place&quot;, with=
 the<br>
implication that we currently aren&#39;t.<br>
<br>
&gt; In fact here the MVPN which is derivative of L3VPNs do not imply use o=
f any<br>
&gt; encryption at all.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; The term &quot;VPN&quot; here is really all about IP reachability sepa=
ration.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; So with this in mind can you please clarify your above comment ?<br>
<br>
Sure!=C2=A0 In recent years, the IETF as a whole seems to have shifted towa=
rd<br>
placing a greater emphasis on the privacy protection of user data from &quo=
t;the<br>
network&quot; (not the network operators, necessarily, but an attacker that=
 has<br>
coopted or compromised core nodes).=C2=A0 This is, in some sense, the core =
point<br>
of RFC 7258.=C2=A0 With this renewed interest in &quot;private&quot; and &q=
uot;privacy&quot;<br>
referring to obscuring user data from intermediates (i.e., encryption), <br=
>
using the same word &quot;private&quot; to refer to a different concept (&q=
uot;not<br>
shared&quot;, as the IP reachability separation embodies) can lead to confu=
sion.<br>
This is particularly pronounced in the case of the acronym &quot;VPN&quot;,=
 when<br>
(encrypting) corporate VPNs are nigh-ubiquitous, and end users have<br>
(encrypting) VPNs to pierce firewalls that get in their way, avoid<br>
geographic-based content restrictions, and the like.<br>
<br>
While the network engineers and RFC authors know there are different<br>
contexts for the term in current usage, the popular media really does not,<=
br>
and there are many consumers of RFCs that are not intimately involved in<br=
>
their development.=C2=A0 So as a matter for the &quot;good of the Internet&=
quot;, my<br>
position is that reducing this potential for confusion is desirable.<br>
>From my view as Security AD, it would be quite a shame if we ended up in an=
<br>
Internet world where some corporate purchaser buys a product labelled &quot=
;VPN&quot;<br>
thinking it will protect (encrypt) his company&#39;s data, when in fact it =
only<br>
provides IP reachability separtaion.<br>
<br>
I don&#39;t have an alternative term I want to push for the &quot;not share=
d&quot; case<br>
(though just &quot;Virtual Network&quot; and its parallels to network virtu=
alization<br>
does come to mind); even a passing mention that this instance of VPN does<b=
r>
not provide data confidentiality would be a big improvemnet, in my mind.<br=
>
But this is a very broad topic, and it needs to be eased into gradually, so=
<br>
I&#39;m starting by just mentioning the potential issue when it comes up, w=
ith<br>
no expectation of changing the *current* document -- this is more of a<br>
long-term goal.<br>
<br>
-Benjamin<br>
<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; On Wed, Sep 12, 2018 at 3:49 AM, Benjamin Kaduk &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
kaduk@mit.edu" target=3D"_blank">kaduk@mit.edu</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; &gt; Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for<br>
&gt; &gt; draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to=
 all<br>
&gt; &gt; email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cu=
t this<br>
&gt; &gt; introductory paragraph, however.)<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Please refer to <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/di=
scuss-criteria.html" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.=
org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html</a><br>
&gt; &gt; for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.<br=
>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found her=
e:<br>
&gt; &gt; <a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-=
mib/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc=
/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/</a><br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; -----------------------------------------------------------------=
-----<br>
&gt; &gt; COMMENT:<br>
&gt; &gt; -----------------------------------------------------------------=
-----<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; A general comment that we&#39;ve been making on lots of documents=
 in this<br>
&gt; &gt; space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym=
 &quot;VPN&quot;<br>
&gt; &gt; implies transport encryption.=C2=A0 It&#39;s unclear that it&#39;=
s appropriate to<br>
&gt; &gt; request<br>
&gt; &gt; changes to this specific document toward that end, though.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Perhaps I&#39;m confused, but &quot;mvpnAdvtPeerAddr&quot; appear=
s in the security<br>
&gt; &gt; considerations in the list of address-related objects that may ha=
ve<br>
&gt; &gt; privacy/security impact.=C2=A0 That list is predicated on being &=
quot;objects with a<br>
&gt; &gt; MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible&quot;, but all the instances=
 of<br>
&gt; &gt; mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-acce=
ssible.<br>
&gt; &gt; Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAd=
drs,<br>
&gt; &gt; mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and<br>
&gt; &gt; mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.=C2=A0 (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmca=
stSourceAddrs<br>
&gt; &gt; and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final &#39;s&#39=
;?)<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables&#39; des=
criptions<br>
&gt; &gt; would aid readability.<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt;<br>
&gt; &gt; _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; &gt; BESS mailing list<br>
&gt; &gt; <a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">BESS@ietf.org<=
/a><br>
&gt; &gt; <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess" rel=3D"nor=
eferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a><b=
r>
&gt; &gt;<br>
</blockquote></div>

--0000000000005282f60575e64ffe--


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From: "Samir Thoria (sthoria)" <sthoria@cisco.com>
To: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi=40cisco.com@dmarc.ietf.org>, "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
Thread-Index: AQHURXiOeZJtHfBs1Uem1StM96VN6KTyCBeA
Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2018 01:12:05 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Date: Sat, 15 Sep 2018 21:15:57 -0500
From: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
To: Hiroshi Tsunoda <tsuno@m.ieice.org>
Cc: The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib@ietf.org, Mach Chen <mach.chen@huawei.com>, bess-chairs@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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On Sat, Sep 15, 2018 at 11:38:30AM +0900, Hiroshi Tsunoda wrote:
> Hi Benjamin,
> 
> Thank you very much for your thorough review and comments.
> My replies are inline.
> 
> > Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
> > considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
> > privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
> > MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
> > mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
> > Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
> > mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
> > mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.
> 
> I have received the advice from the MIB doctor on this matter and
> I am going to update the draft along with the advice.

Excellent, I am sure the MIB doctor's advice is better than mine in this
matter.

> > (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> > and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
> 
> For example, the DESCRPIPTION of mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> says as follows.
> 
>          "The network address which, along with the
>           corresponding mvpnMrouteCmcastSourcePrefixLength object,
>           identifies the sources for which this entry contains
>           multicast routing information."
> 
> Thus, this object identifies the (multiple) multicast sources, not a
> single source.
> Consequently, I prefer that the names of these objects are in plural form.

Ah, thank you for the explanation.

> > Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
> > would aid readability.
> 
> Please let me confirm one thing.
> I assume that you are talking about "Sec 3.1. Summary of MIB Module."
> Do you mean that the description of each table should be in each
> different subsection?
> Or, do you mean that there should be one subsection including a set of
> tables' descriptions?

I was thinking about each table having its own subsection.
In particular, when I was reading, it was easy for me to miss the comments
like "-- Table of PMSI information", especially when the comment was on a
different page from the actual MIB contents.  Having a section number might
make those boundaries more clear.

Thanks,

Benjamin

> Thanks in advance,
> 
> -- tsuno
> 
> 2018-09-12 10:49 GMT+09:00 Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>:
> > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
> > draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection
> >
> > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> > introductory paragraph, however.)
> >
> >
> > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
> > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
> >
> >
> > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > COMMENT:
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
> > space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
> > implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to request
> > changes to this specific document toward that end, though.
> >
> > Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
> > considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
> > privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
> > MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
> > mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
> > Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
> > mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
> > mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
> > and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
> >
> > Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
> > would aid readability.
> >
> >


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From: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 16 Sep 2018 18:43:15 -0400
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To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org,  Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com, Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com,  Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com
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Subject: Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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Hi Sasha,

Thanks for your questions. See below.

On Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 9:58 AM Alexander Vainshtein
<Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:
>
> Dear authors of the EVPN OAM requirements and Framework draft,
>
> I have looked up the draft, and it looks to me as a good starting
> point for work on EVPN OAM.

Thanks.

> I would like to clarify two points with regard to the draft:
>
> 1.  In order to pass unicast EAOM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the
> local MAC-VRF must learn the MAC address of the customer MEP and
> advertise it to remote PEs as a MAC/IP Advertisement route. Should
> this be considered as a special case of learning from the control
> plane (in addition to ARP/NDP/DHCP/DHCPv6 that are mentioned in RFC
> 7432)?

Yes, the MAC address of the customer MEP needs to be learned but
Section 9.1 of RFC 7432 includes the following text, which seems
adequate to me:

   The PEs in a particular EVPN instance MUST support local data-plane
   learning using standard IEEE Ethernet learning procedures.

> 2. The draft seems to propose extension of LSP Ping to test/verify
> connectivity to the FECs advertised as NRLI of EVPN routes. I have
> checked the IANA Registry, and no values for these FECs have been
> allocated yet.  Do you plan any specific work on this?

LSP Ping is one mechanism indirectly referenced in Section 2.4 of the
draft via the reference to RFC 6425 but there are others.

Since OAM messages need to follow the same path as data, as far as
practical, it seem to me there should not be any FECs allocated for
OAM beyond those already needed for data. Probably wording in the
draft related to FECs should be checked/adjusted.

Thanks,
Donald
===============================
 Donald E. Eastlake 3rd   +1-508-333-2270 (cell)
 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenport, FL 33896 USA
 d3e3e3@gmail.com


> Regards,
> Sasha
>
> Office: +972-39266302
> Cell:   +972-549266302
> Email:  Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com


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From: "Parag Jain (paragj)" <paragj@cisco.com>
To: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>, Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
CC: "draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org" <draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org>, "Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com" <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, "Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com" <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com" <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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From: Hiroshi Tsunoda <tsuno@m.ieice.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Benjamin,

> I was thinking about each table having its own subsection.
> In particular, when I was reading, it was easy for me to miss the comments
> like "-- Table of PMSI information", especially when the comment was on a
> different page from the actual MIB contents.  Having a section number might
> make those boundaries more clear.

Thank you for your clarification.
I have carefully considered your suggestion, but it looks a bit redundant
for me when each table has its own subsection.
Consequently, I have decided to keep the original style.
I would appreciate your understanding of my decision.

Thanks,

-- tsuno

2018-09-16 11:15 GMT+09:00 Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>:
> On Sat, Sep 15, 2018 at 11:38:30AM +0900, Hiroshi Tsunoda wrote:
>> Hi Benjamin,
>>
>> Thank you very much for your thorough review and comments.
>> My replies are inline.
>>
>> > Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
>> > considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
>> > privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
>> > MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
>> > mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
>> > Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
>> > mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
>> > mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.
>>
>> I have received the advice from the MIB doctor on this matter and
>> I am going to update the draft along with the advice.
>
> Excellent, I am sure the MIB doctor's advice is better than mine in this
> matter.
>
>> > (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
>> > and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
>>
>> For example, the DESCRPIPTION of mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
>> says as follows.
>>
>>          "The network address which, along with the
>>           corresponding mvpnMrouteCmcastSourcePrefixLength object,
>>           identifies the sources for which this entry contains
>>           multicast routing information."
>>
>> Thus, this object identifies the (multiple) multicast sources, not a
>> single source.
>> Consequently, I prefer that the names of these objects are in plural form.
>
> Ah, thank you for the explanation.
>
>> > Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
>> > would aid readability.
>>
>> Please let me confirm one thing.
>> I assume that you are talking about "Sec 3.1. Summary of MIB Module."
>> Do you mean that the description of each table should be in each
>> different subsection?
>> Or, do you mean that there should be one subsection including a set of
>> tables' descriptions?
>
> I was thinking about each table having its own subsection.
> In particular, when I was reading, it was easy for me to miss the comments
> like "-- Table of PMSI information", especially when the comment was on a
> different page from the actual MIB contents.  Having a section number might
> make those boundaries more clear.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Benjamin
>
>> Thanks in advance,
>>
>> -- tsuno
>>
>> 2018-09-12 10:49 GMT+09:00 Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>:
>> > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for
>> > draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: No Objection
>> >
>> > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
>> > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
>> > introductory paragraph, however.)
>> >
>> >
>> > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
>> > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>> >
>> >
>> > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
>> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > COMMENT:
>> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> > A general comment that we've been making on lots of documents in this
>> > space is that it would be nice to be in a place where the acronym "VPN"
>> > implies transport encryption.  It's unclear that it's appropriate to request
>> > changes to this specific document toward that end, though.
>> >
>> > Perhaps I'm confused, but "mvpnAdvtPeerAddr" appears in the security
>> > considerations in the list of address-related objects that may have
>> > privacy/security impact.  That list is predicated on being "objects with a
>> > MAX-ACCESS other than not-accessible", but all the instances of
>> > mvpnAdvtPeerAddr I found in the body text were marked as not-accessible.
>> > Similarly for mvpnMrouteCmcastGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs,
>> > mvpnMrouteNextHopGroupAddr, mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs, and
>> > mvpnMrouteNextHopAddr.  (Incidentally, why ar mvpnMrouteCmcastSourceAddrs
>> > and mvpnMrouteNextHopSourceAddrs plural with the final 's'?)
>> >
>> > Perhaps using subsections to separate the various tables' descriptions
>> > would aid readability.
>> >
>> >


From nobody Sun Sep 16 19:05:06 2018
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : BGP/MPLS Layer 3 VPN Multicast Management Information Base
        Author          : Hiroshi Tsunoda
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-12.txt
	Pages           : 56
	Date            : 2018-09-16

Abstract:
   This memo defines a portion of the Management Information Base (MIB)
   for use with network management protocols in the Internet community.
   In particular, it describes managed objects to configure and/or
   monitor Multicast communication over IP Virtual Private Networks
   (VPNs) supported by MultiProtocol Label Switching/Border Gateway
   Protcol (MPLS/BGP) on a Provider Edge router.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-12
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-12

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-12


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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From: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
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Subject: Re: [bess] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-11: (with COMMENT)
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On Mon, Sep 17, 2018 at 10:58:59AM +0900, Hiroshi Tsunoda wrote:
> Hi Benjamin,
> 
> > I was thinking about each table having its own subsection.
> > In particular, when I was reading, it was easy for me to miss the comments
> > like "-- Table of PMSI information", especially when the comment was on a
> > different page from the actual MIB contents.  Having a section number might
> > make those boundaries more clear.
> 
> Thank you for your clarification.
> I have carefully considered your suggestion, but it looks a bit redundant
> for me when each table has its own subsection.
> Consequently, I have decided to keep the original style.
> I would appreciate your understanding of my decision.

It is entirely your decision and I can see how my suggestion would not
necessarily be the best choice.

Thanks for letting me know,

Benjamin


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To: "stephane.litkowski@orange.com" <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
Thread-Index: AQHUTpjJeZJtHfBs1Uem1StM96VN6A==
Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2018 15:12:03 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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From: <stephane.litkowski@orange.com>
To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining
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Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2018 15:22:59 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining
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Hi WG,

This WGLC pointed that some discussions are still required on this document=
 and some old comments have not been addressed yet.


Authors,

Please address the comments before we can proceed with this document.

Brgds,


From: BESS [mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of stephane.litkowski@o=
range.com
Sent: Monday, September 03, 2018 10:30
To: bess@ietf.org
Subject: [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bess-servi=
ce-chaining


Hello Working Group,



This email starts a two-week Working Group Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-ser=
vice-chaining-05 [1]



This poll runs until *the 17th of September*.



We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to th=
is Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF =
IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).

If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor of this Document please res=
pond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevan=
t undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress without answers from all the=
 Authors and Contributors.



Currently two IPRs have been disclosed against this Document.



If you are not listed as an Author or a Contributor, then please explicitly=
 respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed i=
n conformance with IETF rules.



We are also polling for any existing implementation as per [2].



    Thank you,

    Stephane & Matthew



    [1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining/



    [2] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjq=
Dpw




[Orange logo]<http://www.orange.com/>

Stephane Litkowski
Network Architect
Orange/SCE/EQUANT/OINIS/NET
Orange Expert Future Networks
phone: +33 2 23 06 49 83 <https://monsi.sso.francetelecom.fr/index.asp?targ=
et=3Dhttp%3A%2F%2Fclicvoice.sso.francetelecom.fr%2FClicvoiceV2%2FToolBar.do=
%3Faction%3Ddefault%26rootservice%3DSIGNATURE%26to%3D+33%202%2023%2028%2049=
%2083%20>  NEW !
mobile: +33 6 71 63 27 50 <https://monsi.sso.francetelecom.fr/index.asp?tar=
get=3Dhttp%3A%2F%2Fclicvoice.sso.francetelecom.fr%2FClicvoiceV2%2FToolBar.d=
o%3Faction%3Ddefault%26rootservice%3DSIGNATURE%26to%3D+33%206%2037%2086%209=
7%2052%20>  NEW !
stephane.litkowski@orange.com<mailto:stephane.litkowski@orange.com>


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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi WG,<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">This WGLC pointed that=
 some discussions are still required on this document and some old comments=
 have not been addressed yet.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Authors,<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Please address the com=
ments before we can proceed with this document.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Brgds,<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> BESS [ma=
ilto:bess-bounces@ietf.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>stephane.litkowski@orange.com<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, September 03, 2018 10:30<br>
<b>To:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] WGLC, IPR and implementation poll for draft-ietf-bes=
s-service-chaining<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Hello Working Group,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">This email starts a two-week Working Group Last C=
all on draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining-05 [1]<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">This poll runs until *the 17th of September*.<o:p=
></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclo=
sed IPR that applies to this Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclose=
d in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for=
 more details).<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">If you are listed as an Author or a Contributor o=
f this Document please respond to this email and indicate whether or not yo=
u are aware of any relevant undisclosed IPR. The Document won't progress wi=
thout answers from all the Authors
 and Contributors.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">Currently two IPRs have been disclosed against th=
is Document.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">If you are not listed as an Author or a Contribut=
or, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any IPR that ha=
s not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">We are also polling for any existing implementati=
on as per [2].<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Thank you,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Stephane &amp; Matthew<o:p></o=
:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;[1] <a href=3D"https://da=
tatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining/">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-service-chaining/</a><o:p>=
</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; [2] <a href=3D"https://mailarc=
hive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw">
https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/cG3X1tTqb_vPC4rg56SEdkjqDpw</a><=
o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"http://www.orange.com/"><span style=3D"fo=
nt-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;;te=
xt-decoration:none"><img border=3D"0" width=3D"40" height=3D"40" id=3D"Pict=
ure_x0020_1" src=3D"cid:image001.jpg@01D44EAB.1453FE10" alt=3D"Orange logo"=
></span></a><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;T=
imes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"line-height:15.0pt"><span style=3D"font-siz=
e:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;">&nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Stephane Litkowski
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roma=
n&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><br>
</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Network Architect
</span><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&qu=
ot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><br>
</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Orange/SCE/EQUANT/OINIS/NET</span><span style=
=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&qu=
ot;"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fam=
ily:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Orange Expert Fut=
ure Networks</span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:=
&quot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fam=
ily:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">phone:
<a href=3D"https://monsi.sso.francetelecom.fr/index.asp?target=3Dhttp%3A%2F=
%2Fclicvoice.sso.francetelecom.fr%2FClicvoiceV2%2FToolBar.do%3Faction%3Ddef=
ault%26rootservice%3DSIGNATURE%26to%3D&#43;33%202%2023%2028%2049%2083%20">
<span style=3D"color:black">&#43;33 2 23 <b>06</b> 49 83 </span></a>&nbsp;N=
EW&nbsp;!</span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&qu=
ot;Times New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><br>
</span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&=
quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">mobile:
<a href=3D"https://monsi.sso.francetelecom.fr/index.asp?target=3Dhttp%3A%2F=
%2Fclicvoice.sso.francetelecom.fr%2FClicvoiceV2%2FToolBar.do%3Faction%3Ddef=
ault%26rootservice%3DSIGNATURE%26to%3D&#43;33%206%2037%2086%2097%2052%20">
<span style=3D"color:black">&#43;33 6 71 63 27 50 </span></a>&nbsp;NEW&nbsp=
;!</span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Time=
s New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><br>
<a href=3D"mailto:stephane.litkowski@orange.com"><span style=3D"font-size:1=
0.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#FF6600">s=
tephane.litkowski@orange.com</span></a>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<pre>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations con=
fidentielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez=
 recu ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messag=
es electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deform=
e ou falsifie. Merci.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privilege=
d information that may be protected by law;<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.<=
o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and=
 delete this message and its attachments.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have =
been modified, changed or falsified.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Thank you.<o:p></o:p></pre>
</div>
<PRE>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
falsifie. Merci.

This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
te this message and its attachments.
As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have been =
modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.
</PRE></body>
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Subject: [bess] Protocol Action: 'BGP/MPLS Layer 3 VPN Multicast Management Information Base' to Proposed Standard (draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-12.txt)
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The IESG has approved the following document:
- 'BGP/MPLS Layer 3 VPN Multicast Management Information Base'
  (draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib-12.txt) as Proposed Standard

This document is the product of the BGP Enabled ServiceS Working Group.

The IESG contact persons are Alvaro Retana, Deborah Brungard and Martin
Vigoureux.

A URL of this Internet Draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-mib/





Technical Summary

   This memo defines a portion of the Management Information Base (MIB)
   for use with network management protocols in the Internet community.
   In particular, it describes managed objects to configure and/or
   monitor Multicast communication over IP Virtual Private Networks
   (VPNs) supported by MultiProtocol Label Switching/Border Gateway
   Protcol (MPLS/BGP) on a Provider Edge router.

Working Group Summary

  There is good consensus from the WG, and there is no controversy.

Document Quality

  The Document has been thoroughly reviewed by MIB Doctor Glenn Mansfield and all of his comments were addressed.

Personnel

  Document Shepherd: Mach Chen
  Responsible Area Director: Martin Vigoureux


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Subject: [bess] Protocol Action: 'L2L3 VPN Multicast MIB' to Proposed Standard (draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16.txt)
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The IESG has approved the following document:
- 'L2L3 VPN Multicast MIB'
  (draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib-16.txt) as Proposed Standard

This document is the product of the BGP Enabled ServiceS Working Group.

The IESG contact persons are Alvaro Retana, Deborah Brungard and Martin
Vigoureux.

A URL of this Internet Draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-l2l3-vpn-mcast-mib/





Technical Summary

  This memo defines a portion of the Management Information Base (MIB)
  for use with network management protocols in the Internet community.
  In particular, it describes two MIB modules which will be used by
  other MIB modules for monitoring and/or configuring Layer 2 and Layer
  3 Virtual Private Networks that support multicast.

Working Group Summary

  There is good consensus from the WG, and there is no controversy.

Document Quality

  The Document has been thoroughly reviewed by MIB Doctor Glenn Mansfield and all of his comments were addressed.

Personnel

  Document Shepherd: Mach Chen
  Responsible Area Director: Martin Vigoureux


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From: Sowmini Varadhan <sowmini05@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 17 Sep 2018 18:47:58 -0400
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Subject: [bess] handling DAD in draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05
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hi,

I have a question about Section 4.1.1 ("Initiating an APR Request upon a Move")
in draft-ietf-bess-evpn-inter-subnet-forwarding-05 which has the paragraph:

"Since this NVE has previously learned the same MAC and IP addresses
 from the source NVE, it recognizes that there has been a MAC move and
 it initiates MAC mobility procedures per [RFC7432] by advertising an
 EVPN MAC/IP route with both the MAC and IP addresses filled in along
 with MAC Mobility Extended Community with the sequence number
 incremented by one."

but the Grat ARP may be an indication of a duplicate address, or it
may have been manufactured  by a malicious node, in which case this is not
a mac-move.

Should the target NVE first check with the src NVE that the
original (ip, mac) binding does not exist at the source NVE
before advertising the MAC route?

The next paragraph in Section 4.1.1 says
"The source NVE upon receiving this MAC/IP advertisement, realizes
 that the MAC has moved to the target NVE. It updates its MAC-VRF and
 IP-VRF table accordingly with the adjacency information of the target
 NVE and withdraws its EVPN MAC/IP route. Furthermore, it sends an ARP
 probe locally to ensure that the MAC is gone and it deletes its ARP
 entry corresponding to that <IP, MAC> when there is no ARP response."

One minor nit here is that the ARP probe should really check that
the IP address is gone (i.e. the IP address is not duplicate),
and this check should be done *before* the target NVE gets to declare
that the TS has moved?

(same thing for section 4.1.2, where the target NVE learns the
<IP, MAC> at the new location from the data packet without an
intervening GARP)

Thanks
--Sowmini


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Thread-Topic: WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04
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Hi,

We have a good level of support for this document.
It is adopted as a WG doc.

Authors,

Please republish the document as  draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-00

Brgds,


From: BESS [mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of stephane.litkowski@o=
range.com
Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2018 09:29
To: bess@ietf.org
Subject: [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04

Hi WG,

This email begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption draft-mal=
hotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]

Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group lis=
t, stating whether or not you support adoption.

We are also polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to th=
is Document, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF =
IPR rules (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details).
If you are listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please re=
spond to this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any releva=
nt undisclosed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list. The document won't progr=
ess without answers from all the authors and contributors.

If you are not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly=
 respond only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed i=
n conformance with IETF rules.

The poll for working group adoption closes on Tue 18th September.

Regards,
St=E9phane and Matthew

[1] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/






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<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi,<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">We have a good level o=
f support for this document.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">It is adopted as a WG =
doc.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Authors,<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Please republish the d=
ocument as &nbsp;draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-00<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Brgds,<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> BESS [ma=
ilto:bess-bounces@ietf.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>stephane.litkowski@orange.com<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, September 04, 2018 09:29<br>
<b>To:</b> bess@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [bess] WG adoption poll for draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequa=
l-lb-04<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Hi WG,<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">This emai=
l begins a two-week poll for BESS working group adoption draft-malhotra-bes=
s-evpn-unequal-lb-04 [1]<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Please re=
view the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group list, statin=
g whether or not you support adoption.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">We are al=
so polling for knowledge of any undisclosed IPR that applies to this Docume=
nt, to ensure that IPR has been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules=
 (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for
 more details).<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e listed as an author or a contributor of this document, please respond to =
this email and indicate whether or not you are aware of any relevant undisc=
losed IPR, copying the BESS mailing list.
 The document won't progress without answers from all the authors and contr=
ibutors.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">If you ar=
e not listed as an author or a contributor, then please explicitly respond =
only if you are aware of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conform=
ance with IETF rules.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black"><o:p>&nbs=
p;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">The poll =
for working group adoption closes on Tue 18<sup>th</sup> September. &nbsp;<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">&nbsp;<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">Regards,<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"color:black">St=E9phan=
e and Matthew<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB">[1] <a href=3D"https://datatrac=
ker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/">
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-malhotra-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/</a><o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-GB"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ti=
mes New Roman&quot;,&quot;serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<pre>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations con=
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<pre>pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez=
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<pre>a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messag=
es electroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deform=
e ou falsifie. Merci.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privilege=
d information that may be protected by law;<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.<=
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<pre>If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and=
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<pre>As emails may be altered, Orange is not liable for messages that have =
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<pre>Thank you.<o:p></o:p></pre>
</div>
<PRE>______________________________________________________________________=
___________________________________________________

Ce message et ses pieces jointes peuvent contenir des informations confiden=
tielles ou privilegiees et ne doivent donc
pas etre diffuses, exploites ou copies sans autorisation. Si vous avez recu=
 ce message par erreur, veuillez le signaler
a l'expediteur et le detruire ainsi que les pieces jointes. Les messages el=
ectroniques etant susceptibles d'alteration,
Orange decline toute responsabilite si ce message a ete altere, deforme ou =
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This message and its attachments may contain confidential or privileged inf=
ormation that may be protected by law;
they should not be distributed, used or copied without authorisation.
If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender and dele=
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modified, changed or falsified.
Thank you.
</PRE></body>
</html>

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From nobody Wed Sep 19 10:13:33 2018
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Subject: [bess] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-00.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : Weighted Multi-Path Procedures for EVPN All-Active Multi-Homing
        Authors         : Neeraj Malhotra
                          Ali Sajassi
                          Jorge Rabadan
                          John Drake
                          Avinash Lingala
                          Samir Thoria
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-00.txt
	Pages           : 18
	Date            : 2018-09-19

Abstract:
   In an EVPN-IRB based network overlay, EVPN LAG enables all-active
   multi-homing for a host or CE device connected to two or more PEs via
   a LAG bundle, such that bridged and routed traffic from remote PEs
   can be equally load balanced (ECMPed) across the multi-homing PEs.
   This document defines extensions to EVPN procedures to optimally
   handle unequal access bandwidth distribution across a set of multi-
   homing PEs in order to:

     o provide greater flexibility, with respect to adding or
       removing individual PE-CE links within the access LAG

     o handle PE-CE LAG member link failures that can result in unequal
       PE-CE access bandwidth across a set of multi-homing PEs


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-00
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-unequal-lb-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
CC: "draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org" <draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/Wr79_-sgKT18SldXmFw8Jt1Lz9k>
Subject: Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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--_000_DB5PR0301MB19098730D14E61E72654C0099D120DB5PR0301MB1909_
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Donald,
Lots of thanks for your response.

I would like to clarify my question regarding learning of the MAC address =
ofcthe cudtomer MEP.

I fully agree that this address will be locally learned by the PE to whic =
the relevant customer site is attached.

But will this address advertised to remote PEs?

My reading of 7432 is that in most cases PEs advertise MAC addresses that =
have been locally learned from some CP protocol; 7432 specifically mention=
es ARP/NDP and DHCP/DHCPv6.

I think that in order to learn and adverise MAC addresses of customer MEPs=
, the PE should trap or snoop Ethernet Service OAM frames (trap is require=
d for LTM frames if MIP us intanciated in the PE).

Does this make sense to you?

Regards

Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein



From: Donald Eastlake
Sent: Monday, September 17, 01:43
Subject: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
To: Alexander Vainshtein
Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael G=
orokhovsky, Ron Sdayoor, Rotem Cohen


Hi Sasha, Thanks for your questions. See below. On Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 9:5=
8 AM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: > > Dear authors of the EVPN OAM requirem=
ents and Framework draft, > > I have looked up the draft, and it looks to =
me as a good starting > point for work on EVPN OAM. Thanks. > I would like=
 to clarify two points with regard to the draft: > > 1. In order to pass u=
nicast EAOM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the > local MAC-VRF must learn the M=
AC address of the customer MEP and > advertise it to remote PEs as a MAC/I=
P Advertisement route. Should > this be considered as a special case of le=
arning from the control > plane (in addition to ARP/NDP/DHCP/DHCPv6 that a=
re mentioned in RFC > 7432)? Yes, the MAC address of the customer MEP need=
s to be learned but Section 9.1 of RFC 7432 includes the following text, w=
hich seems adequate to me: The PEs in a particular EVPN instance MUST supp=
ort local data-plane learning using standard IEEE Ethernet learning proced=
ures. > 2. The draft seems to propose extension of LSP Ping to test/verify=
 > connectivity to the FECs advertised as NRLI of EVPN routes. I have > ch=
ecked the IANA Registry, and no values for these FECs have been > allocate=
d yet. Do you plan any specific work on this? LSP Ping is one mechanism in=
directly referenced in Section 2.4 of the draft via the reference to RFC 6=
425 but there are others. Since OAM messages need to follow the same path =
as data, as far as practical, it seem to me there should not be any FECs a=
llocated for OAM beyond those already needed for data. Probably wording in=
 the draft related to FECs should be checked/adjusted. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D Donald E. Eastlake 3rd +1-508-333-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop C=
ourt, Davenport, FL 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com > Regards, > Sasha > > Offi=
ce: +972-39266302 > Cell: +972-549266302 > Email: Alexander.Vainshtein@eci=
tele.com


__________________________________________________________________________=
_

This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains inform=
ation which is=20
CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have rece=
ived this=20
transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and then =
delete the original=20
and all copies thereof.
__________________________________________________________________________=
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--_000_DB5PR0301MB19098730D14E61E72654C0099D120DB5PR0301MB1909_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii=
">
</head>
<body>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Donald,<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Lots of thanks for your response.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
I would like to clarify my question regarding learning of the MAC address =
ofcthe cudtomer MEP.
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
I fully agree that this address will be locally learned by the PE to whic =
the relevant customer site is attached.
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
But will this address advertised to remote PEs?<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
My reading of 7432 is that in most cases PEs advertise MAC addresses that =
have been locally learned from some CP protocol; 7432 specifically mention=
es ARP/NDP and DHCP/DHCPv6.
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
I think that in order to learn and adverise MAC addresses of customer MEPs=
, the PE should trap or snoop Ethernet Service OAM frames (trap is require=
d for LTM frames if MIP us intanciated in the PE).<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Does this make sense to you?<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Regards<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein</div>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
From: Donald Eastlake<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Sent: Monday, September 17, 01:43<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Subject: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
To: Alexander Vainshtein<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael G=
orokhovsky, Ron Sdayoor, Rotem Cohen<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Hi Sasha, Thanks for your questions. See below. On Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 9:5=
8 AM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: &gt; &gt; Dear authors of the EVPN OAM re=
quirements and Framework draft, &gt; &gt; I have looked up the draft, and =
it looks to me as a good starting &gt; point for work
 on EVPN OAM. Thanks. &gt; I would like to clarify two points with regard =
to the draft: &gt; &gt; 1. In order to pass unicast EAOM frames (LBM/LBR a=
nd LTR), the &gt; local MAC-VRF must learn the MAC address of the customer=
 MEP and &gt; advertise it to remote PEs as a MAC/IP
 Advertisement route. Should &gt; this be considered as a special case of =
learning from the control &gt; plane (in addition to ARP/NDP/DHCP/DHCPv6 t=
hat are mentioned in RFC &gt; 7432)? Yes, the MAC address of the customer =
MEP needs to be learned but Section 9.1 of RFC
 7432 includes the following text, which seems adequate to me: The PEs in =
a particular EVPN instance MUST support local data-plane learning using st=
andard IEEE Ethernet learning procedures. &gt; 2. The draft seems to propo=
se extension of LSP Ping to test/verify
 &gt; connectivity to the FECs advertised as NRLI of EVPN routes. I have &=
gt; checked the IANA Registry, and no values for these FECs have been &gt;=
 allocated yet. Do you plan any specific work on this? LSP Ping is one mec=
hanism indirectly referenced in Section 2.4
 of the draft via the reference to RFC 6425 but there are others. Since OA=
M messages need to follow the same path as data, as far as practical, it s=
eem to me there should not be any FECs allocated for OAM beyond those alre=
ady needed for data. Probably wording
 in the draft related to FECs should be checked/adjusted. Thanks, Donald =3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Donald E. Eastlake 3rd &#43;1-508-333-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro=
 Shop Court, Davenport, FL 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com &gt; Regards, &gt; S=
asha &gt; &gt; Office: &#43;972-39266302
 &gt; Cell: &#43;972-549266302 &gt; Email: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.co=
m <br>
<br>
</div>
<br clear=3D"both">
__________________________________________________________________________=
_<BR>
<BR>
This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains inform=
ation which is <BR>
CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have rece=
ived this <BR>
transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and then =
delete the original <BR>
and all copies thereof.<BR>
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_<BR>
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From: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2018 15:34:06 -0400
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To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org,  Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com, Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com,  Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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Hi Sasha,

On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 1:02 PM Alexander Vainshtein
<Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:
>
> Donald,
> Lots of thanks for your response.
>
> I would like to clarify my question regarding learning of the MAC address=
 of the customer MEP.
>
> I fully agree that this address will be locally learned by the PE to whic=
 the relevant customer site is attached.
>
> But will this address advertised to remote PEs?
>
> My reading of 7432 is that in most cases PEs advertise MAC addresses that=
 have been locally learned from some CP protocol; 7432 specifically mention=
s ARP/NDP and DHCP/DHCPv6.
>
> I think that in order to learn and advertise MAC addresses of customer ME=
Ps, the PE should trap or snoop Ethernet Service OAM frames (trap is requir=
ed for LTM frames if MIP us intanciated in the PE).
>
> Does this make sense to you?

I would agree that a PE has to advertise the MAC addresses it learns
from the local reception Ethernet Service OAM frames if it wants to
support that service and it would be reasonable to mention this in the
EVPN OAM framework document. RFC 7432 was not considering OAM.

Thanks,
Donald
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
 Donald E. Eastlake 3rd   +1-508-333-2270 (cell)
 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenport, FL 33896 USA
 d3e3e3@gmail.com

> Regards
>
> Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein
>
> From: Donald Eastlake
> Sent: Monday, September 17, 01:43
> Subject: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
> To: Alexander Vainshtein
> Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael =
Gorokhovsky, Ron Sdayoor, Rotem Cohen
>
> Hi Sasha, Thanks for your questions. See below. On Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 9:=
58 AM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: > > Dear authors of the EVPN OAM requirem=
ents and Framework draft, > > I have looked up the draft, and it looks to m=
e as a good starting > point for work on EVPN OAM. Thanks. > I would like t=
o clarify two points with regard to the draft: > > 1. In order to pass unic=
ast EAOM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the > local MAC-VRF must learn the MAC a=
ddress of the customer MEP and > advertise it to remote PEs as a MAC/IP Adv=
ertisement route. Should > this be considered as a special case of learning=
 from the control > plane (in addition to ARP/NDP/DHCP/DHCPv6 that are ment=
ioned in RFC > 7432)? Yes, the MAC address of the customer MEP needs to be =
learned but Section 9.1 of RFC 7432 includes the following text, which seem=
s adequate to me: The PEs in a particular EVPN instance MUST support local =
data-plane learning using standard IEEE Ethernet learning procedures. > 2. =
The draft seems to propose extension of LSP Ping to test/verify > connectiv=
ity to the FECs advertised as NRLI of EVPN routes. I have > checked the IAN=
A Registry, and no values for these FECs have been > allocated yet. Do you =
plan any specific work on this? LSP Ping is one mechanism indirectly refere=
nced in Section 2.4 of the draft via the reference to RFC 6425 but there ar=
e others. Since OAM messages need to follow the same path as data, as far a=
s practical, it seem to me there should not be any FECs allocated for OAM b=
eyond those already needed for data. Probably wording in the draft related =
to FECs should be checked/adjusted. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Donal=
d E. Eastlake 3rd +1-508-333-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenport, FL=
 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com > Regards, > Sasha > > Office: +972-39266302 > =
Cell: +972-549266302 > Email: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com


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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
CC: "draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org" <draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2018 06:13:06 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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--_000_DB5PR0301MB190983E13BDD1765806AE4D49D170DB5PR0301MB1909_
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Donald,
Lots of thanks again for a primpt response.
Explicitly stafing that an EVPN PE supporting customer level Ethernet serv=
ice OAM MUST adverise locally learned MAC addresses of the customer's MEPS=
 would address my concerns.

Regards

Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein



From: Donald Eastlake
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 22:34
Subject: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
To: Alexander Vainshtein
Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael G=
orokhovsky, Ron Sdayoor, Rotem Cohen


Hi Sasha, On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 1:02 PM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: > > =
Donald, > Lots of thanks for your response. > > I would like to clarify my=
 question regarding learning of the MAC address of the customer MEP. > > I=
 fully agree that this address will be locally learned by the PE to whic t=
he relevant customer site is attached. > > But will this address advertise=
d to remote PEs? > > My reading of 7432 is that in most cases PEs advertis=
e MAC addresses that have been locally learned from some CP protocol; 7432=
 specifically mentions ARP/NDP and DHCP/DHCPv6. > > I think that in order =
to learn and advertise MAC addresses of customer MEPs, the PE should trap =
or snoop Ethernet Service OAM frames (trap is required for LTM frames if M=
IP us intanciated in the PE). > > Does this make sense to you? I would agr=
ee that a PE has to advertise the MAC addresses it learns from the local r=
eception Ethernet Service OAM frames if it wants to support that service a=
nd it would be reasonable to mention this in the EVPN OAM framework docume=
nt. RFC 7432 was not considering OAM. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D D=
onald E. Eastlake 3rd +1-508-333-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenpor=
t, FL 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com > Regards > > Thumb typed by Sasha Vainsh=
tein > > From: Donald Eastlake > Sent: Monday, September 17, 01:43 > Subje=
ct: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping > To: Alexander Vainshtein > Cc: draft-salam=
-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael Gorokhovsky, Ron=
 Sdayoor, Rotem Cohen > > Hi Sasha, Thanks for your=20questions. See below=
. On Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 9:58 AM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: > > Dear auth=
ors of the EVPN OAM requirements and Framework draft, > > I have looked up=
 the draft, and it looks to me as a good starting > point for work on EVPN=
 OAM. Thanks. > I would like to clarify two points with regard to the draf=
t: > > 1. In order to pass unicast EAOM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the > lo=
cal MAC-VRF must learn the MAC address of the customer MEP and > advertise=
 it to remote PEs as a MAC/IP Advertisement route. Should > this be consid=
ered as a special case of learning from the control > plane (in addition t=
o ARP/NDP/DHCP/DHCPv6 that are mentioned in RFC > 7432)? Yes, the MAC addr=
ess of the customer MEP needs to be learned but Section 9.1 of RFC 7432 in=
cludes the following text, which seems adequate to me: The PEs in a partic=
ular EVPN instance MUST support local data-plane learning using standard I=
EEE Ethernet learning procedures. > 2. The draft seems to propose extensio=
n of LSP Ping to test/verify > connectivity to the FECs advertised as NRLI=
 of EVPN routes. I have > checked the IANA Registry, and no values for the=
se FECs have been > allocated yet. Do you plan any specific work on this? =
LSP Ping is one mechanism indirectly referenced in Section 2.4 of the draf=
t via the reference to RFC 6425 but there are others. Since OAM messages n=
eed to follow the same path as data, as far as practical, it seem to me th=
ere should not be any FECs allocated for OAM beyond those already needed f=
or data. Probably wording in the draft related to FECs should be checked/a=
djusted. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Donald E. Eastlake 3rd +1-508-3=
33-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenport, FL 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.c=
om > Regards, > Sasha > > Office: +972-39266302 > Cell: +972-549266302 > E=
mail: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com


__________________________________________________________________________=
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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii=
">
</head>
<body>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Donald,<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Lots of thanks again for a primpt response.<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Explicitly stafing that an EVPN PE supporting customer level Ethernet serv=
ice OAM MUST adverise locally learned MAC addresses of the customer's MEPS=
 would address my concerns.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Regards<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein</div>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
From: Donald Eastlake<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 22:34<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Subject: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
To: Alexander Vainshtein<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael G=
orokhovsky, Ron Sdayoor, Rotem=20Cohen<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction: ltr; margin: 0; padding: 0; font-fam=
ily: sans-serif; font-size: 11pt; color: black; ">
Hi Sasha, On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 1:02 PM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: &gt;=
 &gt; Donald, &gt; Lots of thanks for your response. &gt; &gt; I would lik=
e to clarify my question regarding learning of the MAC address of the cust=
omer MEP. &gt; &gt; I fully agree that this address will
 be locally learned by the PE to whic the relevant customer site is attach=
ed. &gt; &gt; But will this address advertised to remote PEs? &gt; &gt; My=
 reading of 7432 is that in most cases PEs advertise MAC addresses that ha=
ve been locally learned from some CP protocol;
 7432 specifically mentions ARP/NDP and DHCP/DHCPv6. &gt; &gt; I think tha=
t in order to learn and advertise MAC addresses of customer MEPs, the PE s=
hould trap or snoop Ethernet Service OAM frames (trap is required for LTM =
frames if MIP us intanciated in the PE).
 &gt; &gt; Does this make sense to you? I would agree that a PE=20has to a=
dvertise the MAC addresses it learns from the local reception Ethernet Ser=
vice OAM frames if it wants to support that service and it would be reason=
able to mention this in the EVPN OAM framework
 document. RFC 7432 was not considering OAM. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D Donald E. Eastlake 3rd &#43;1-508-333-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court,=
 Davenport, FL 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com &gt; Regards &gt; &gt; Thumb typ=
ed by Sasha Vainshtein &gt; &gt; From: Donald
 Eastlake &gt; Sent: Monday, September 17, 01:43 &gt; Subject: Re: EVPN FE=
Cs in LSP Ping &gt; To: Alexander Vainshtein &gt; Cc: draft-salam-bess-evp=
n-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael Gorokhovsky, Ron Sdayoor,=
 Rotem Cohen &gt; &gt; Hi Sasha, Thanks for your questions.
 See below. On Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 9:58 AM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: &gt=
; &gt; Dear authors of the EVPN OAM requirements and Framework draft, &gt;=
 &gt; I have looked up the draft, and it looks to me as a good starting &g=
t; point for work on EVPN OAM. Thanks. &gt; I would like
 to clarify two points with regard to the draft: &gt; &gt; 1. In order to =
pass unicast EAOM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the &gt; local MAC-VRF must le=
arn the MAC address of the customer MEP and &gt; advertise it to remote PE=
s as a MAC/IP Advertisement route. Should &gt; this
 be considered as a special case of learning from the control &gt; plane (=
in addition to ARP/NDP/DHCP/DHCPv6 that are mentioned in RFC &gt; 7432)? Y=
es, the MAC address of the customer MEP needs to be learned but Section 9.=
1 of RFC 7432 includes the following text,
 which seems adequate to me: The PEs in a particular EVPN instance MUST su=
pport local data-plane learning using standard IEEE Ethernet learning proc=
edures. &gt; 2. The draft seems to propose extension of LSP Ping to test/v=
erify &gt; connectivity to the FECs advertised
 as NRLI of EVPN routes. I have &gt; checked the IANA Registry, and no val=
ues for these FECs have been &gt; allocated yet. Do you plan any specific =
work on this? LSP Ping is one mechanism indirectly referenced in Section 2=
.4 of the draft via the reference to RFC
 6425 but there are others. Since OAM messages need to follow the same pat=
h as data, as far as practical, it seem to me there should not be any FECs=
 allocated for OAM beyond those already needed for data. Probably wording =
in the draft related to FECs should
 be checked/adjusted. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Donald E. Eastlake =
3rd &#43;1-508-333-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenport, FL 33896 US=
A d3e3e3@gmail.com &gt; Regards, &gt; Sasha &gt; &gt; Office: &#43;972-392=
66302 &gt; Cell: &#43;972-549266302 &gt; Email: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecite=
le.com
<br>
<br>
</div>
<br clear=3D"both">
__________________________________________________________________________=
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This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains inform=
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CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have rece=
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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>, Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
CC: "draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org" <draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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Subject: Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>, "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
CC: "draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org" <draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
Thread-Topic: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/mtqWMNOZZ9OxCGSnjWp_lrb6VbY>
Subject: Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
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--_000_DB5PR0301MB19096AFA316753AA1C989FCA9D170DB5PR0301MB1909_
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Jorge,
Lots of thanks for a prompt response.

As Donald has mentioned, 7432 simply left Ethernet service OAM out of scop=
e, so there are quite a few things tbat require specification in this area=
.

Regards



Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein

________________________________
From: Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
Sent: Monday, September 24, 2018 12:37:13 PM
To: Alexander Vainshtein; Donald Eastlake
Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org; Michael Gorokhovsky; Ron=
 Sdayoor; bess@ietf.org; Rotem Cohen
Subject: Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping

Sasha,

That is an excellent point. I agree the text should say that any MEP/MIP M=
AC addresses local to the PE should be advertised in EVPN.
I would even add that, since those MACs are not subject to mobility, the P=
E should advertise them as =93static=94, i.e., with sticky bit set.

Thanks.
Jorge


From: BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Alexander Vainshtein <Alex=
ander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
Date: Monday, September 24, 2018 at 8:13 AM
To: Donald Eastlake <d3e3e3@gmail.com>
Cc: "draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org" <draft-salam-bess-evpn-=
oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org>, Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.=
com>, Ron Sdayoor <Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.or=
g>, Rotem Cohen <Rotem.Cohen@ecitele.com>
Subject: Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping

Donald,
Lots of thanks again for a primpt response.
Explicitly stafing that an EVPN PE supporting customer level Ethernet serv=
ice OAM MUST adverise locally learned MAC addresses of the customer's MEPS=
 would address my concerns.
Regards
Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein


From: Donald Eastlake
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 22:34
Subject: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping
To: Alexander Vainshtein
Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael G=
orokhovsky, Ron Sdayoor, Rotem Cohen

Hi Sasha, On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 1:02 PM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: > > =
Donald, > Lots of thanks for your response. > > I would like to clarify my=
 question regarding learning of the MAC address of the customer MEP. > > I=
 fully agree that this address will be locally learned by the PE to whic t=
he relevant customer site is attached. > > But will this address advertise=
d to remote PEs? > > My reading of 7432 is that in most cases PEs advertis=
e MAC addresses that have been locally learned from some CP protocol; 7432=
 specifically mentions ARP/NDP and DHCP/DHCPv6. > > I think that in order =
to learn and advertise MAC addresses of customer MEPs, the PE should trap =
or snoop Ethernet Service OAM frames (trap is required for LTM frames if M=
IP us intanciated in the PE). > > Does this make sense to you? I would agr=
ee that a PE has to advertise the MAC addresses it learns from the local r=
eception Ethernet Service OAM frames if it wants to support that service a=
nd it would be reasonable to mention this in the EVPN OAM framework docume=
nt. RFC 7432 was not considering OAM. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D D=
onald E. Eastlake 3rd +1-508-333-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenpor=
t, FL 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com > Regards > > Thumb typed by Sasha Vainsh=
tein > > From: Donald Eastlake > Sent: Monday, September 17, 01:43 > Subje=
ct: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP Ping > To: Alexander Vainshtein > Cc: draft-salam=
-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael Gorokhovsky, Ron=
 Sdayoor, Rotem Cohen > > Hi Sasha, Thanks for your questions. See below. =
On Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 9:58 AM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: > > Dear author=
s of the EVPN OAM requirements and Framework draft, > > I have looked up t=
he draft, and it looks to me as a good starting > point for work on EVPN O=
AM. Thanks. > I would like to clarify two points with regard to the draft:=
 > > 1. In order to pass unicast EAOM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the > loca=
l MAC-VRF must learn the MAC address of the customer MEP and > advertise i=
t to remote PEs as a MAC/IP Advertisement route. Should > this be consider=
ed as a special case of learning from the control > plane (in addition to =
ARP/NDP/DHCP/DHCPv6 that are mentioned in RFC > 7432)? Yes, the MAC addres=
s of the customer MEP needs to be learned but Section 9.1 of RFC 7432 incl=
udes the following text, which seems adequate to me: The PEs in a particul=
ar EVPN instance MUST support local data-plane learning using standard IEE=
E Ethernet learning procedures. > 2. The draft seems to propose extension =
of LSP Ping to test/verify > connectivity to the FECs advertised as NRLI o=
f EVPN routes. I have > checked the IANA Registry, and no values for these=
 FECs have been > allocated yet. Do you plan any specific work on this? LS=
P Ping is one mechanism indirectly referenced in Section 2..4 of the draft=
 via the reference to RFC 6425 but there are others. Since OAM messages ne=
ed to follow the same path as data, as far as practical, it seem to me the=
re should not be any FECs allocated for OAM beyond those already needed fo=
r data. Probably wording in the draft related to FECs should be checked/ad=
justed. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Donald E. Eastlake 3rd +1-508-3=
33-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenport, FL 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.c=
om > Regards, > Sasha > > Office: +972-39266302 > Cell: +972-549266302 > E=
mail: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com

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--_000_DB5PR0301MB19096AFA316753AA1C989FCA9D170DB5PR0301MB1909_
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<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction:ltr; margin:0; padding:0; font-family=
:sans-serif; font-size:11pt; color:black">
Jorge,<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction:ltr; margin:0; padding:0; font-family=
:sans-serif; font-size:11pt; color:black">
Lots of thanks for a prompt response.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction:ltr; margin:0; padding:0; font-family=
:sans-serif; font-size:11pt; color:black">
As Donald has mentioned, 7432 simply left Ethernet service OAM out of scop=
e, so there are quite a few things tbat require specification in this area=
.<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction:ltr; margin:0; padding:0; font-family=
:sans-serif; font-size:11pt; color:black">
Regards<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction:ltr; margin:0; padding:0; font-family=
:sans-serif; font-size:11pt; color:black">
<div dir=3D"auto" style=3D"direction:ltr; margin:0; padding:0; font-family=
:sans-serif; font-size:11pt; color:black">
Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein</div>
<br>
</div>
<hr tabindex=3D"-1" style=3D"display:inline-block; width:98%">
<div id=3D"divRplyFwdMsg" dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Calibri, sans-serif" c=
olor=3D"#000000" style=3D"font-size:11pt"><b>From:</b> Rabadan, Jorge (Nok=
ia - US/Mountain View) &lt;jorge.rabadan@nokia.com&gt;<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, September 24, 2018 12:37:13 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Alexander Vainshtein; Donald Eastlake<br>
<b>Cc:</b> draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org; Michael Gorokhovs=
ky; Ron Sdayoor; bess@ietf.org; Rotem Cohen<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping</font>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
</div>
<div>
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">Sasha,</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">That is an excellent point. I agree the text should say that any MEP/M=
IP MAC addresses local to the PE should be advertised in EVPN.</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">I would even add that, since those MACs are not subject to mobility, t=
he PE should advertise them as =93static=94, i.e., with sticky bit set.</s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">Thanks.</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">Jorge</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">&nbsp;</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt; font-family:Consol=
as">&nbsp;</span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none; border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt; padding:3.0pt 0=
cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"font=
-size:12.0pt; color:black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt; color:black">BESS &lt;bess-bou=
nces@ietf.org&gt; on behalf of Alexander Vainshtein &lt;Alexander.Vainshte=
in@ecitele.com&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Monday, September 24, 2018 at 8:13 AM<br>
<b>To: </b>Donald Eastlake &lt;d3e3e3@gmail.com&gt;<br>
<b>Cc: </b>&quot;draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org&quot; &lt;dr=
aft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org&gt;, Michael Gorokhovsky &lt;Mi=
chael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com&gt;, Ron Sdayoor &lt;Ron.Sdayoor@ecitele.com=
&gt;, &quot;bess@ietf.org&quot; &lt;bess@ietf.org&gt;, Rotem Cohen &lt;Rot=
em.Cohen@ecitele.com&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [bess] EVPN FECs in LSP Ping</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">&nbsp;</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Donald,</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Lots of thanks again for a=
 primpt response.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; ma=
rgin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Expl=
icitly stafing that an EVPN PE supporting customer level Ethernet service =
OAM MUST adverise locally learned MAC addresses of the customer's MEPS wou=
ld address my concerns.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; ma=
rgin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Rega=
rds</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Thumb typed by Sasha Vains=
htein</span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; ma=
rgin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black"><br>=

<br>
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">From: Donald Eastlake</spa=
n></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Sent: Sunday, September 23=
, 22:34</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Subject: Re: EVPN FECs in =
LSP Ping</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-fa=
mily:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">To: Alexander Vainshtein</=
span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; ma=
rgin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Cc: =
draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael Gorok=
hovsky, Ron Sdayoor, Rotem Cohen<br>
<br>
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-right:0cm; margin-bottom:12.0pt; ma=
rgin-left:36.0pt">
<span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,sans-serif; color:black">Hi S=
asha, On Fri, Sep 21, 2018 at 1:02 PM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: &gt; &gt=
; Donald, &gt; Lots of thanks for your response. &gt; &gt; I would like to=
 clarify my question regarding learning of the MAC address of
 the customer MEP. &gt; &gt; I fully agree that this address will be local=
ly learned by the PE to whic the relevant customer site is attached. &gt; =
&gt; But will this address advertised to remote PEs? &gt; &gt; My reading =
of 7432 is that in most cases PEs advertise MAC addresses
 that have been locally learned from some CP protocol; 7432 specifically m=
entions ARP/NDP and DHCP/DHCPv6. &gt; &gt; I think that in order to learn =
and advertise MAC addresses of customer MEPs, the PE should trap or snoop =
Ethernet Service OAM frames (trap is required
 for LTM frames if MIP us intanciated in the PE). &gt; &gt; Does this make=
 sense to you? I would agree that a PE has to advertise the MAC addresses =
it learns from the local reception Ethernet Service OAM frames if it wants=
 to support that service and it would be
 reasonable to mention this in the EVPN OAM framework document. RFC 7432 w=
as not considering OAM. Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Donald E. Eastla=
ke 3rd &#43;1-508-333-2270 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenport, FL 33896=
 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com &gt; Regards
 &gt; &gt; Thumb typed by Sasha Vainshtein &gt; &gt; From: Donald Eastlake=
 &gt; Sent: Monday, September 17, 01:43 &gt; Subject: Re: EVPN FECs in LSP=
 Ping &gt; To: Alexander Vainshtein &gt; Cc: draft-salam-bess-evpn-oam-req=
-frmwk@ietf.org, bess@ietf.org, Michael Gorokhovsky, Ron Sdayoor,
 Rotem Cohen &gt; &gt; Hi Sasha, Thanks for your questions. See below. On =
Thu, Sep 6, 2018 at 9:58 AM Alexander Vainshtein wrote: &gt; &gt; Dear aut=
hors of the EVPN OAM requirements and Framework draft, &gt; &gt; I have lo=
oked up the draft, and it looks to me as a good starting
 &gt; point for work on EVPN OAM. Thanks. &gt; I would like to clarify two=
 points with regard to the draft: &gt; &gt; 1. In order to pass unicast EA=
OM frames (LBM/LBR and LTR), the &gt; local MAC-VRF must learn the MAC add=
ress of the customer MEP and &gt; advertise it to remote
 PEs as a MAC/IP Advertisement route. Should &gt; this be considered as a =
special case of learning from the control &gt; plane (in addition to ARP/N=
DP/DHCP/DHCPv6 that are mentioned in RFC &gt; 7432)? Yes, the MAC address =
of the customer MEP needs to be learned but
 Section 9.1 of RFC 7432 includes the following text, which seems adequate=
 to me: The PEs in a particular EVPN instance MUST support local data-plan=
e learning using standard IEEE Ethernet learning procedures. &gt; 2. The d=
raft seems to propose extension of LSP
 Ping to test/verify &gt; connectivity to the FECs advertised as NRLI of E=
VPN routes. I have &gt; checked the IANA Registry, and no values for these=
 FECs have been &gt; allocated yet. Do you plan any specific work on this?=
 LSP Ping is one mechanism indirectly referenced
 in Section 2..4 of the draft via the reference to RFC 6425 but there are =
others. Since OAM messages need to follow the same path as data, as far as=
 practical, it seem to me there should not be any FECs allocated for OAM b=
eyond those already needed for data.
 Probably wording in the draft related to FECs should be checked/adjusted.=
 Thanks, Donald =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Donald E. Eastlake 3rd &#43;1-508-333-22=
70 (cell) 1424 Pro Shop Court, Davenport, FL 33896 USA d3e3e3@gmail.com &g=
t; Regards, &gt; Sasha &gt; &gt; Office:
 &#43;972-39266302 &gt; Cell: &#43;972-549266302 &gt; Email: Alexander.Vai=
nshtein@ecitele.com </span>
</p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><br>
__________________________________________________________________________=
_<br>
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CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have rece=
ived this
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transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and then =
delete the original
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__________________________________________________________________________=
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<BR>
This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains inform=
ation which is <BR>
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From: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02
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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
To: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02
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From: "Henderickx, Wim (Nokia - BE/Antwerp)" <wim.henderickx@nokia.com>
To: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>, "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02
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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2018 18:21:50 +0000
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Subject: Re: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02
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From: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2018 12:31:28 -0700
Cc: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>, "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
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To: "Henderickx, Wim (Nokia - BE/Antwerp)" <wim.henderickx@nokia.com>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/BnG9yeYsPJb2OrGZ9xsqNDRr83I>
Subject: Re: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02
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Yes/support=20

Regards,
Jeff

> On Sep 24, 2018, at 11:21, Henderickx, Wim (Nokia - BE/Antwerp) <wim.hende=
rickx@nokia.com> wrote:
>=20
> Agreed.
> =20
> From: BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Jorge Rabadan <jorge.rabad=
an@nokia.com>
> Date: Monday, 24 September 2018 at 17:16
> To: "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>, "bess@ietf.or=
g" <bess@ietf.org>
> Subject: Re: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihomin=
g-02
> =20
> I fully support the publication of this document.
> It should have been an RFC long time back. I don=E2=80=99t understand why i=
t took so long.
> =20
> Nokia has an implementation of this draft in SROS.
> =20
> Thanks.
> Jorge
> =20
> From: BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - G=
B)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
> Date: Monday, September 24, 2018 at 1:04 PM
> To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
> Subject: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02=

> =20
> All
> =20
> Since we have received a recent IPR declaration on this draft and the firs=
t WG last call was so long ago, we are running a second last call to reaffir=
m WG consensus to publish the draft as an RFC.
> =20
> Therefore, this email begins a two-week working group last call for draft-=
ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02.txt
> =20
> Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group li=
st.
> =20
> Currently there is one IPR declaration against this document.
> =20
> We are also polling for any existing implementations.
> =20
> The working group last call closes on Monday 8th Oct 2018.=20
> =20
> Regards,
> Matthew and St=C3=A9phane
> =20
> =20
> =20
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Yes/support&nbsp;<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMa=
ilSignature" dir=3D"ltr">Regards,<div>Jeff</div></div><div dir=3D"ltr"><br>O=
n Sep 24, 2018, at 11:21, Henderickx, Wim (Nokia - BE/Antwerp) &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:wim.henderickx@nokia.com">wim.henderickx@nokia.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br=
><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr">

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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Agreed.<o:p></o:p></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></s=
pan></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0=
cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"color:black">From: </span></b><span=
 style=3D"color:black">BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounces@ietf.org">bes=
s-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of Jorge Rabadan &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
jorge.rabadan@nokia.com">jorge.rabadan@nokia.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Monday, 24 September 2018 at 17:16<br>
<b>To: </b>"Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:matthew.bocci=
@nokia.com">matthew.bocci@nokia.com</a>&gt;, "<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.or=
g">bess@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>=
&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>Re: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multi=
homing-02<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></s=
pan></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>I fully support the publication of this document.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>It should have been an RFC long time back. I don=E2=80=99t understand why i=
t took so long.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>Nokia has an implementation of this draft in SROS.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>Thanks.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>Jorge</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0=
cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"color:=
black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"color:black">BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounc=
es@ietf.org">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of "Bocci, Matthew (Nok=
ia - GB)" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:matthew.bocci@nokia.com">matthew.bocci@nokia=
.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Monday, September 24, 2018 at 1:04 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>"<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>[bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihomi=
ng-02</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">All<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Since we have received a=
 recent IPR declaration on this draft and the first WG last call was so long=
 ago, we are running a second last call to reaffirm WG consensus to publish t=
he draft as an RFC.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Therefore, this email begins a two-week working group last call for draf=
t-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02.txt</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group l=
ist.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Currently there is one IPR declaration against this document.</span><o:p=
></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">We are also polling for any existing implementations.</span><o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">The working group last call closes on Monday 8<sup>th</sup> Oct 2018.&nb=
sp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Matthew&nbsp;and St=C3=A9phane</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>


</div></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=3D"ltr"><span>________=
_______________________________________</span><br><span>BESS mailing list</s=
pan><br><span><a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org">BESS@ietf.org</a></span><br><=
span><a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess">https://www.ietf=
.org/mailman/listinfo/bess</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>=

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From: Nabeel Cocker <nabeel@nuagenetworks.net>
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To: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/g0GYNopNYqodP6ZQM3GR_L13nsY>
Subject: Re: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02
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--Apple-Mail-483FAA4D-EA6D-4E56-A89A-87FCFB40E068
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Support.=20

Regards,
Nabeel

> On Sep 24, 2018, at 11:16 AM, Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) <j=
orge.rabadan@nokia.com> wrote:
>=20
> I fully support the publication of this document.
> It should have been an RFC long time back. I don=E2=80=99t understand why i=
t took so long.
> =20
> Nokia has an implementation of this draft in SROS.
> =20
> Thanks.
> Jorge
> =20
> From: BESS <bess-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of "Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - G=
B)" <matthew.bocci@nokia.com>
> Date: Monday, September 24, 2018 at 1:04 PM
> To: "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>
> Subject: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02=

> =20
> All
> =20
> Since we have received a recent IPR declaration on this draft and the firs=
t WG last call was so long ago, we are running a second last call to reaffir=
m WG consensus to publish the draft as an RFC.
> =20
> Therefore, this email begins a two-week working group last call for draft-=
ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02.txt
> =20
> Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group li=
st.
> =20
> Currently there is one IPR declaration against this document.
> =20
> We are also polling for any existing implementations.
> =20
> The working group last call closes on Monday 8th Oct 2018.=20
> =20
> Regards,
> Matthew and St=C3=A9phane
> =20
> =20
> =20
> _______________________________________________
> BESS mailing list
> BESS@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess

--Apple-Mail-483FAA4D-EA6D-4E56-A89A-87FCFB40E068
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto">Support.&nbsp;<br><br><div id=3D"AppleMailS=
ignature">Regards,<div>Nabeel</div></div><div><br>On Sep 24, 2018, at 11:16 A=
M, Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jorge.rab=
adan@nokia.com">jorge.rabadan@nokia.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockqu=
ote type=3D"cite"><div>

<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8">
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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>I fully support the publication of this document.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>It should have been an RFC long time back. I don=E2=80=99t understand why i=
t took so long.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>Nokia has an implementation of this draft in SROS.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>Thanks.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
>Jorge<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:Consolas"=
><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0=
cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><b><span style=3D"color:=
black">From:
</span></b><span style=3D"color:black">BESS &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:bess-bounc=
es@ietf.org">bess-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt; on behalf of "Bocci, Matthew (Nok=
ia - GB)" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:matthew.bocci@nokia.com">matthew.bocci@nokia=
.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Date: </b>Monday, September 24, 2018 at 1:04 PM<br>
<b>To: </b>"<a href=3D"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:bess@ietf.org">bess@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Subject: </b>[bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihomi=
ng-02<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">All<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">Since we have received a=
 recent IPR declaration on this draft and the first WG last call was so long=
 ago, we are running a second last call to reaffirm WG consensus to publish t=
he draft as an RFC.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Therefore, this email begins a two-week working group last call for draf=
t-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02.txt</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Please review the draft and post any comments to the BESS working group l=
ist.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Currently there is one IPR declaration against this document.</span><o:p=
></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">We are also polling for any existing implementations.</span><o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">The working group last call closes on Monday 8<sup>th</sup> Oct 2018.&nb=
sp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">Matthew&nbsp;and St=C3=A9phane</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"color:bla=
ck">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>


</div></blockquote><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><span>____________________=
___________________________</span><br><span>BESS mailing list</span><br><spa=
n><a href=3D"mailto:BESS@ietf.org">BESS@ietf.org</a></span><br><span><a href=
=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/bess">https://www.ietf.org/mailman=
/listinfo/bess</a></span><br></div></blockquote></body></html>=

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From: "Bidgoli, Hooman (Nokia - CA/Ottawa)" <hooman.bidgoli@nokia.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/ZyeHReVGbKwCWGw6tFc-l-U94nw>
Subject: Re: [bess] Second WG Last Call on draft-ietf-bess-vpls-multihoming-02
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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: "draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org" <draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org>
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Thread-Topic: All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/faB_hmjQ9sXlVZn69Vq0Y82YaPU>
Subject: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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Dear authors of the EVPN Virtual Ethernet Segment<https://tools.ietf.org/h=
tml/draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-03> draft,
My colleagues and I have a question pertaining to support of All-Active re=
dundancy mode in EVPN that uses virtual Ethernet Segments.

Section 8.5 of RFC 7432<https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7432#section-8.5> s=
ays:

   If a bridged network is multihomed to more than one PE in an EVPN
   network via switches, then the support of All-Active redundancy mode
   requires the bridged network to be connected to two or more PEs using
   a LAG.

   If a bridged network does not connect to the PEs using a LAG, then
   only one of the links between the bridged network and the PEs must be
   the active link for a given <ES, VLAN> or <ES, VLAN bundle>.  In this
   case, the set of Ethernet A-D per ES routes advertised by each PE
   MUST have the "Single-Active" bit in the flags of the ESI Label
   extended community set to 1.

This restriction is easy to understand, since, with the All-Active multi-h=
oming mode of an Ethernet Segment, a CE attached to such a segment potenti=
ally would receive traffic from all the PEs attached to this  segment. Sin=
ce A CE that is part of a bridged network must learn MAC addresses of the =
received traffic, it would potentially experience continuous MAC Move even=
ts - with undesirable consequences.

The EVPN Virtual Ethernet Segment draft replaces Ethernet links (forming a=
 "real" ES) with Ethernet PWs, and claims support of both Single-homed and=
 multi-homed multi-homing modes. When I compare these claims with the quot=
ed above statement from RFC 7432, I see two possibilities:

*         Either a CE that is connected to an All-Active vES cannot be par=
t of a bridged network (and thus would not do any MAC learning)

*         Or  an extension of LAG that deals with Ethernet PWs instead of =
Ethernet links is required.

Could you please clarify which of these two options is correct?

Note: The draft includes Informative references to the two drafts that hav=
e been published as RFC 7432 and RFC 7623.

Regards,
Sasha

Office: +972-39266302
Cell:      +972-549266302
Email:   Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com


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<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear authors of the <a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.o=
rg/html/draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment-03">
EVPN Virtual Ethernet Segment</a> draft,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">My colleagues and I have a question pertaining to s=
upport of All-Active redundancy mode in EVPN that uses virtual Ethernet Se=
gments.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7432#sect=
ion-8.5">Section 8.5 of RFC 7432</a> says:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; If a bridged network is multiho=
med to more than one PE in an EVPN<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; network via switches, then the =
support of All-Active redundancy mode<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; requires the bridged network to=
 be connected to two or more PEs using<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; a LAG.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; If a bridged network does not c=
onnect to the PEs using a LAG, then<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; only one of the links between t=
he bridged network and the PEs must be<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; the active link for a given &lt=
;ES, VLAN&gt; or &lt;ES, VLAN bundle&gt;.&nbsp; In this<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; case, the set of Ethernet A-D p=
er ES routes advertised by each PE<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; MUST have the &quot;Single-Acti=
ve&quot; bit in the flags of the ESI Label<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
ourier New&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp; extended community set to 1.<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">This restriction is easy to understand, since, with=
 the All-Active multi-homing mode of an Ethernet Segment, a CE attached to=
 such a segment potentially would receive traffic from all the PEs attache=
d to this&nbsp; segment. Since A CE that is
 part of a bridged network must learn MAC addresses of the received traffi=
c, it would potentially experience continuous MAC Move events &#8211; with=
 undesirable consequences.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The EVPN Virtual Ethernet Segment draft replaces Et=
hernet links (forming a &#8220;real&#8221; ES) with Ethernet PWs, and clai=
ms support of both Single-homed and multi-homed multi-homing modes. When I=
 compare these claims with the quoted above statement
 from RFC 7432, I see two possibilities:<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 lev=
el1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:Symbol"><span st=
yle=3D"mso-list:Ignore">&middot;<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New =
Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><b><u>Either</u></=
b> a CE that is connected to an All-Active vES cannot be part of a bridged=
 network (and thus would not do any MAC learning)<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 lev=
el1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-family:Symbol"><span st=
yle=3D"mso-list:Ignore">&middot;<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New =
Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><b><u>Or </u></b>&=
nbsp;an extension of LAG that deals with Ethernet PWs instead of Ethernet =
links is required.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Could you please clarify which of these two options=
 is correct?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>Note</b>: The draft includes Informative referen=
ces to the two drafts that have been published as RFC 7432 and RFC 7623.<o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Sasha<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Office: &#43;972-39266302<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Cell:&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &#43;972-549266=
302<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Email:&nbsp;&nbsp; Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com=
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<br clear=3D"both">
__________________________________________________________________________=
_<BR>
<BR>
This e-mail message is intended for the recipient only and contains inform=
ation which is <BR>
CONFIDENTIAL and which may be proprietary to ECI Telecom. If you have rece=
ived this <BR>
transmission in error, please inform us by e-mail, phone or fax, and then =
delete the original <BR>
and all copies thereof.<BR>
__________________________________________________________________________=
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--_000_DB5PR0301MB1909A786D9210D59FD523FCE9D160DB5PR0301MB1909_--


From nobody Tue Sep 25 06:26:23 2018
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From: The IESG <iesg-secretary@ietf.org>
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CC: draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track@ietf.org, bess-chairs@ietf.org, martin.vigoureux@nokia.com, bess@ietf.org, stephane.litkowski@orange.com
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Date: Tue, 25 Sep 2018 06:26:15 -0700
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/bJynhgcua1vznpe1jKUBM9BRJik>
Subject: [bess] Last Call: <draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-09.txt> (Explicit Tracking with Wild Card Routes in Multicast VPN) to Proposed Standard
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The IESG has received a request from the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG (bess) to
consider the following document: - 'Explicit Tracking with Wild Card Routes
in Multicast VPN'
  <draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-09.txt> as Proposed Standard

The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits final
comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the
ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2018-10-09. Exceptionally, comments may be
sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the beginning of
the Subject line to allow automated sorting.

Abstract


   The MVPN specifications provide procedures to allow a multicast
   ingress node to invoke "explicit tracking" for a multicast flow or
   set of flows, thus learning the egress nodes for that flow or set of
   flows.  However, the specifications are not completely clear about
   how the explicit tracking procedures work in certain scenarios.  This
   document provides the necessary clarifications.  It also specifies a
   new, optimized explicit tracking procedure.  This new procedure
   allows an ingress node, by sending a single message, to request
   explicit tracking of each of a set of flows, where the set of flows
   is specified using a wildcard mechanism.  This document updates RFCs
   6514, 6625, and 7524.




The file can be obtained via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track/

IESG discussion can be tracked via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track/ballot/

The following IPR Declarations may be related to this I-D:

   https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/2807/






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From: "Luc Andre Burdet (lburdet)" <lburdet@cisco.com>
To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>, "draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org" <draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org>
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--_004_955DFADF91C548F990C679C4AB5FB46Cciscocom_--


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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: "Luc Andre Burdet (lburdet)" <lburdet@cisco.com>
CC: Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Alexander Ferdman <Alexander.Ferdman@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org" <draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org>, "pals@ietf.org" <pals@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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Subject: [bess] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-10.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : Explicit Tracking with Wild Card Routes in Multicast VPN
        Authors         : Andrew Dolganow
                          Jayant Kotalwar
                          Eric C. Rosen
                          Zhaohui Zhang
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-10.txt
	Pages           : 18
	Date            : 2018-09-25

Abstract:
   The MVPN specifications provide procedures to allow a multicast
   ingress node to invoke "explicit tracking" for a multicast flow or
   set of flows, thus learning the egress nodes for that flow or set of
   flows.  However, the specifications are not completely clear about
   how the explicit tracking procedures work in certain scenarios.  This
   document provides the necessary clarifications.  It also specifies a
   new, optimized explicit tracking procedure.  This new procedure
   allows an ingress node, by sending a single message, to request
   explicit tracking of each of a set of flows, where the set of flows
   is specified using a wildcard mechanism.  This document updates RFCs
   6514, 6625, and 7524.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-10
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-10

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bess-mvpn-expl-track-10


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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--_004_1BB94F7F521D4AC88CD74CCBC681B1F9ciscocom_--


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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: "Luc Andre Burdet (lburdet)" <lburdet@cisco.com>, "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
CC: Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Alexander Ferdman <Alexander.Ferdman@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org" <draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org>, "pals@ietf.org" <pals@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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Subject: Re: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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--_004_DB5PR0301MB1909191E45A877E32D0F36539D150DB5PR0301MB1909_--


From nobody Thu Sep 27 09:11:40 2018
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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>, "Luc Andre Burdet (lburdet)" <lburdet@cisco.com>, "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
CC: Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Alexander Ferdman <Alexander.Ferdman@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org" <draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org>, "pals@ietf.org" <pals@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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Date: Thu, 27 Sep 2018 16:11:22 +0000
Message-ID: <57D21004-A02F-4AB2-9EEB-036458652D78@nokia.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/D94lESPBmpafwos8uCZcdHCBVpE>
Subject: Re: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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From: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>
To: "Luc Andre Burdet (lburdet)" <lburdet@cisco.com>, "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>, "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
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Subject: Re: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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From: "Rabadan, Jorge (Nokia - US/Mountain View)" <jorge.rabadan@nokia.com>
To: Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>, "Luc Andre Burdet (lburdet)" <lburdet@cisco.com>, "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>
CC: Michael Gorokhovsky <Michael.Gorokhovsky@ecitele.com>, Alexander Ferdman <Alexander.Ferdman@ecitele.com>, Shell Nakash <Shell.Nakash@ecitele.com>, "bess@ietf.org" <bess@ietf.org>, "draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org" <draft-sajassi-bess-evpn-virtual-eth-segment.authors@ietf.org>, "pals@ietf.org" <pals@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/bess/LVXVc1Sv8LY1K9nRQsx8vG12Org>
Subject: Re: [bess] All-Active Multi-homing and Virtual Ethernet Segments: A Question
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--_004_690E3414E27C4BD59AF6B86293EF8D08nokiacom_--


From nobody Sun Sep 30 02:10:40 2018
Return-Path: <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
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Subject: [bess] I-D Action: draft-ietf-bess-evpn-optimized-ir-04.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the BGP Enabled ServiceS WG of the IETF.

        Title           : Optimized Ingress Replication solution for EVPN
        Authors         : Jorge Rabadan
                          Senthil Sathappan
                          Wen Lin
                          Mukul Katiyar
                          Ali Sajassi
	Filename        : draft-ietf-bess-evpn-optimized-ir-04.txt
	Pages           : 25
	Date            : 2018-09-30

Abstract:
   Network Virtualization Overlay (NVO) networks using EVPN as control
   plane may use ingress replication (IR) or PIM-based trees to convey
   the overlay BUM traffic. PIM provides an efficient solution to avoid
   sending multiple copies of the same packet over the same physical
   link, however it may not always be deployed in the NVO core network.
   IR avoids the dependency on PIM in the NVO network core. While IR
   provides a simple multicast transport, some NVO networks with
   demanding multicast applications require a more efficient solution
   without PIM in the core. This document describes a solution to
   optimize the efficiency of IR in NVO networks.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-optimized-ir/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-optimized-ir-04
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-bess-evpn-optimized-ir-04

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-bess-evpn-optimized-ir-04


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

