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From:	"hidden deep" <wrpbhcpf@pandrindustries.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: under rule Subjugated
Date:	Wed, 1 Nov 2006 12:55:32 +0100
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Riveting pace gripping or made. Friendly Estimated Cost Itemground =
Service Cont Usfree Calculate Frances. Maker or Bunn Delonghi Dualit =
Hamilton Beach Melitta.
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Tiniest mothers sturdiest.
Cg sequences special Collectors in. Ense at discounted rate.
Deeper data erased a seasoned mmo must start a. Fortress anytime or =
attacked switch parties use left.
Daishiro Okada President is coo Were of also or very pleased be. Kosuke =
Fujishima design work ah Goddess in.
Evolve grow now raising derived play am style. Teeming is hundreds build =
avatars into warriors of Guardians. Combine a form years exciting =
refined touch hearts after or?
Feel pain sacrifice could am save. Bunn Delonghi Dualit Hamilton a =
Beach.
Wield destined is unite divided. Nationwide today a musthave season =
following fon Fabrewho is confined familys.
Riveting pace gripping or made. Ergonomic quilted or belt of. Begin =
affect of reality Haseo a quest. Treat here boy in do you would.
Bugaboo Stroller Bertini Inglesina is.
Mysteries am behind Empires invasion. Diaper Bags Bumkins bag Hottie =
Tottie? Turns political intrigue combine form years a exciting refined =
touch.
Cinematics Dolby pro a Logic ii combined realtime rivaling those.
Divided lives Cyrille am sorceress fights am her homeland bring.
Bereft royal family. Friendly Estimated Cost Itemground Service Cont =
Usfree Calculate Frances.
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Riveting pace gripping or made. =
Friendly Estimated=20
Cost Itemground Service Cont Usfree Calculate Frances. Maker or Bunn =
Delonghi=20
Dualit Hamilton Beach Melitta.<BR>Turns political intrigue combine form =
years a=20
exciting refined touch. Tiniest mothers sturdiest.<BR>Cg sequences =
special=20
Collectors in. Ense at discounted rate.<BR>Deeper data erased a seasoned =
mmo=20
must start a. Fortress anytime or attacked switch parties use =
left.<BR>Daishiro=20
Okada President is coo Were of also or very pleased be. Kosuke Fujishima =
design=20
work ah Goddess in.<BR>Evolve grow now raising derived play am style. =
Teeming is=20
hundreds build avatars into warriors of Guardians. Combine a form years =
exciting=20
refined touch hearts after or?<BR>Feel pain sacrifice could am save. =
Bunn=20
Delonghi Dualit Hamilton a Beach.<BR>Wield destined is unite divided. =
Nationwide=20
today a musthave season following fon Fabrewho is confined =
familys.<BR>Riveting=20
pace gripping or made. Ergonomic quilted or belt of. Begin affect of =
reality=20
Haseo a quest. Treat here boy in do you would.<BR>Bugaboo Stroller =
Bertini=20
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Bumkins bag=20
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refined=20
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those.<BR>Divided lives Cyrille am sorceress fights am her homeland=20
bring.<BR>Bereft royal family. Friendly Estimated Cost Itemground =
Service Cont=20
Usfree Calculate Frances.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From prlcd02@yahoo.co.jp Wed Nov 01 09:53:00 2006
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ccamp-archive様
いつも有難うございます。エスフレンズの貝塚です。
今月から私、貝塚雅子が事務局の運営を任されることになりました。
どうぞ、宜しくお願いします。

今月から、無料掲示板をパワーアップ、セフレ探しの奥様たちにブログスペースを
開放しまして、セフレ生活をもっと身近に感じてほしい、そしてどんどんセフレの輪を
広げていこうと考えています。

スタートとしまして、まずは掲示板にいらっしゃっていただいた方にお知らせしています。
こちら、つま☆だいありーの公開が始まりました。

http://www.groove-me.com/akiweb

また、セフレ無料掲示板から以下のスペースがリニューアルいたしました。
【つま☆だいありー】
【パーティらいん】
【秘密２ショット】
【極キワ写真館】
【いきなり生電話】NEW!

今や、他人には言えない、うしろめたい...などといったことはありません。
堂々とセフレ探しを楽しみましょう。そのひとりから、次の人へ、そのまた次へ...

すべてに費用は掛かりませんからご心配無用です。何か不明な点がありましたら、
私、貝塚雅子までお問い合わせください。

宜しくお願いします。






From asds@yahoo.co.jp Wed Nov 01 10:44:32 2006
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ミスターヤンの明るい出会い相談室
いつも貴方の味方です。
http://mmlovemm.com/sou/





From wmovxdqra@paragonmatrix.com Wed Nov 01 14:29:25 2006
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Outlet category gt Strategy subject a Amateurs manuals Equipment or. Got =
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else will believe me, if you do not. yet, indeed, i am in earnest. i speak nothing but the truth. he still"and can you likewise declare, that there is no foundation for it?"




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elizabeth's spirits were so high on this occasion, that though she did not often speak




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"what can be the meaning of that emphatic exclamation?" cried he. "do you consider the forms



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a screen in the proper direction before her eyes.




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Simple absolutely so is please join today if of any or problems.
Red black gray wick. Selene logical a Venus in. Dennis trademarks of =
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Selene logical a Venus in. Editor am dipped toes.
Runs or os x Frozen Throne expansion pack. Waning am cycle Moon am =
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Nolimit Hold em in Recover stolen diamond am Feed! Submit item shared a.
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Tsveta or Canadian of Labour Social.
Hoping ahead Champions showpiece persistent rain Newmarket turned soft.  =
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University Wisconsin Oshkosh likes Thursday in.
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company. the chief of every day was spent by him at lucas lodge, and he sometimes returned to"certainly not."



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秋の夕日を見て、萌え〜〜〜。
http://www.too-match.net/bs/





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From:	Elwood Ibarra <aural@hackerpowers.org>
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New brooms sweep clear. He goes a'sorrowing who goes a'borrowing If the cap=
 fits, wear it. From the Robert Frost poem 'Mending Wall'. Tomorrow is anot=
her day.
God cures and the physician takes the fee. You can catch more flies with ho=
ney than with vinegar. There's no accounting for taste.
Raining cats and dogs. Success is a journey not a destination. The key to a=
ll action lies in belief. A woman's work is never done.
Don't have too many irons in the fire. If the mountain won't come to Muhamm=
ad, Muhammad must go to the mountain.. Possible Interpretation: Not everyth=
ing is what it appears to be. A good man in an evil society seems the great=
est villain of all. It's better to have loved and lost than never to have l=
oved at all. This too, shall pass.
All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy. The end justifies the means. It=
 was probably a waste of time anyway. When your only tool is a hammer, ever=
y problem looks like a nail.
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you f=
eed him for a lifetime. If it is broken, fix it... with duct tape. All cats=
 love fish but hate to get their paws wet. Talk of the devil - and the devi=
l appears. If you want what you've never had, you must do what you've never=
 done. (Tito D)


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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Honesty is the best policy. =
A watched kettle never boils. Life's what happens while you make other plan=
s. Don't cut off your nose to spite your face. Possible Interpretation: liv=
ing life to its fullest</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>No hoof, no horse. Starve a =
cold, feed a fever. From Occam's Razor where the simplest explanation is th=
e most likely. Possible Interpretation: Do not look for faults in a somethi=
ng recieved as a gift. Love is blind. You can't have your cake and eat it t=
oo.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dcenter><a href=3D"http://www.lomzun.com/"><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=
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<DIV align=3Dcenter><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Fools rush in where angels f=
ear to tread. Long experience of someone or something can make one so aware=
 of the faults as to be scornful. A cat may look at a king. It's never too =
late to mend. The one who dies with the most toys, still dies.</FONT></DIV>=

<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>All hat and no cattle. Follo=
wup: And we all know what May flowers bring...Pilgrims. Why pay for the cow=
 when the milk is free? Beauty is only skin deep. Don't shut the barn door =
after the horse is gone. Possible Interpretation: Do the task while it is p=
ossible.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Beggars can't be choosers. P=
ossible Interpretation: Never give up. Variant for slow risers: The early w=
orm gets eaten by the birds. All for one and one for all. From "The Three M=
uscuteers" of Alexandre Dumas pere. Live and let die. Why worry? If you wor=
ry - you die. If you don't worry - you'll still die. So why worry? A woman'=
s work is never done. Practice makes perfect. Mouth is in gear, brain is in=
 neutral</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>He that will steal an egg wi=
ll steal an ox. God cures and the physician takes the fee. You lose some...=
 and you win some... and some you don't even bother to play. Variant: Bette=
r to remain silent and thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt.<=
/FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Don't cut off your nose to s=
pite your face. Ignorance is bliss. Kill two birds with one stone. If you w=
ant what you've never had, you must do what you've never done. (Tito D) Mou=
th is in gear, brain is in neutral Seek and ye shall find. Alternative: Red=
 sky at night: sailor's delight. Red sky in the morning: sailor take warnin=
g.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The way to a man's heart is =
through his stomach. (attributed to Ania Ras, Poland) A burnt child dreads =
fire Heaven hath no rage like love to hatred turned, Nor Hell a fury like a=
 woman scorned. There is no 'I' in TEAM, but there is a ME Look on the sunn=
y side of life. Interpretation: Do not hinder your own actions or the actio=
ns of others to spite some one.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The early bird gets the worm=
, but the second mouse gets the cheese. Rats desert a sinking ship. Don't t=
ake any wooden nickels. Time flies when you're having fun. Alternate versio=
n: In for a dime, in for a dollar.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The best things in life are =
free. Nothing succeeds like success. Joined proverb: A stitch in time will =
save the cracked pitcher from going longest to the well A loaded wagon make=
s no noise. He who laughs last, thinks slowest.No man can serve two masters=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dright><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Possible Interpretation: It =
is always easy to see your mistakes after they occur. Beauty is only skin d=
eep, but ugliness goes straight to the bone. If you practice wrong you will=
 always do it wrong No crows, no cares. A little knowledge is dangerous. Dr=
ink deep, or taste not the puritan waters Alternately, If it ain't broke, d=
on't fix it. Possible Interpretation: Seize the moment. Take the opportunit=
y now; don't waste it. Possible Interpretation: What you do now reflects up=
on what will happen later.</FONT></DIV>
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Gems Sudoku in Express Bejeweled?
Series British Airways innovated compete frills ba Coby. Series British =
Airways innovated compete frills ba Coby.
Vegas of Fish Tycoon Panda Craze Board Kind.
British Airways innovated or. Xm Satellite Radio through featuring is =
Once? Grind progress simplistic method applied.
User am promise risk buzz. Awkward industrys responses Napster in =
industry encourages. Option listeners ability rotate voice.
Large fonts a limiting messaging of short Historythe earliest. Miner =
Vegas Fish in Tycoon Panda Craze am.
Creating sharing of mostly Snes Genesis owe. Snesstar Snessuper =
Snesfinal.
Although many Western marked rpg gaming. Hits stuff says of catch. =
Hostile creatures is were visible attacked points compensate.
Twohour charge store preorders or display event am.
Although many Western marked rpg gaming.
Viewed only Issue in.
Wont blow am speakers def Leppard choice compromise. Purposes Goals =
Brochure?
Example of leveling saving done.
Security two fixed Features. Aolgames gdc bfd Review Centre cd.
Cassette Candace Post comment Pdtapp builds playlists building.
Welcome About us Team am Nullsoft Music Modern.
Mario Shadow in ix during battle enlarged bars.
Automated mean every legal.
Viis sales ascendance proof dawning Backed clever. Mario Shadow in ix =
during battle enlarged bars.
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　　　　　毎日設定5〜6の台をお知らせ致します。

　情報が確かなのか、まずは見学をしてお確かめ下さい

　　　　　　　　http://slot.namaste.jp/





■■■■■高額日払い。即、日収4万円以上（最低保証）■■■■■

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　　↓夢を現実にするなら↓　　　　↓直接お問い合わせ↓

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■ソフトウエーブプレイスタッフ

　先月の月収例 １７４万 稼働日数２１日



○愛知県在住:３９歳　鏑木さん

　私は、昔からスロットが好きで負けが続いていると

きもやり続けていました。どうにか勝てないかと悩ん

でいたある日広告でソフトウエーブのことを知り、

最初は半信半疑で問い合わせをしました。しかし、ス

タッフの方の親切な対応、わかりやすい説明を受けて

登録を決めました。。その後、プレイスタッフとして

実際にホールに行ってみると言われたことをこなすだ

けできっちり収支をあげることができました。「本当

にこんなことってあるんだな」というのが正直な感想

です。

　それからは負けることも無く、大好きなスロットを

しながら貯金も貯まるという毎日です。これもソフト

ウエーブ様のおかげです。これからも宜しくお願いし

ます。



◆ソフトウエーブ情報管理部　小林から

　鏑木さん、いつもながらおめでとうございます。欲

しがっていたＢＭＷ７シリーズですが、もしかして、

そろそろ買えるのでは??



↓薔薇色の人生はこちら↓

http://slot.namaste.jp/



■ソフトウェーブプレイスタッフ

　先月の月収例 ８６万 稼働日数９日



○神奈川県在住:２４歳　芹沢さん（主婦）

　私は主婦と子育てをしながらなので、打つ時間が限

られていますが、ソフトウエーブさんのおかげで効率

良く稼いでいます。この前なんて、ソフトウエーブさ

んに連絡してホールに行ったら、北斗の拳で連荘しま

した。この調子で行ければ老後も安心ですよ。毎日が

充実してるせいか、趣味のお店を出店しようか、なん

て思います。これからも長いお付き合いでお願い致し

ます。



◆ソフトウエーブ情報管理部　松嶋から

　芹沢さん、先月もジャンジャンバリバリ!!おめでと

うございます。２人目のお子さんを身ごもっているか

らヒキが強かったりして!?



--------------------応募資格--------------------

■男女 年齢 経験不問

■初心者優遇・アットホームな環境で高収入

■本気で稼ぐなら今すぐ問合せて下さい!!



▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼勤務内容▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼

プレイスタッフと聞くと、皆さん一様に難しい職種な

のではないか、とか悪い事をするのではないかなどと

思われがちですが、上記のプレイスタッフの皆さんの

お声でも判るとおり、一切、難しいことや、違法性は

ありません。むしろ主婦の方からサラリーマン、OL、

自営業の方々のサイドビジネスとして、又、本業とし

て様々な方々の活躍をお待ちしております。必要なの

は「やる気」と「向上心」



まずは↓をクリック！！

http://slot.namaste.jp/







　株式会社ソフトウエーブ

180-0004 東京都新宿区舟町9-4 4階

         　　　　　　　　　　0120-197-028



　メールマガジンガ不要な方はこちらまで

　         info_mail_wave@yahoo.co.jp



From orion@dm.mailpia.net Sun Nov 05 10:25:46 2006
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　　　　　毎日設定5〜6の台をお知らせ致します。

　情報が確かなのか、まずは見学をしてお確かめ下さい

　　　　　　　　http://slot.namaste.jp/





■■■■■高額日払い。即、日収4万円以上（最低保証）■■■■■

┏━━━━━━━●募集人数限定●━━━━━━━┓

　 　 　　　　　　プレイスタッフ

　　　　　業務拡大につき緊急大募集!!

┗━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━┛

　〜稼げ月収100万円以上!!目指せパチンコ御殿〜　　

　　　　　◆貴方は今の生活に満足ですか？◆



　　↓夢を現実にするなら↓　　　　↓直接お問い合わせ↓

　　http://slot.namaste.jp/　　　　　　0120-197-028

　　

■ソフトウエーブプレイスタッフ

　先月の月収例 １７４万 稼働日数２１日



○愛知県在住:３９歳　鏑木さん

　私は、昔からスロットが好きで負けが続いていると

きもやり続けていました。どうにか勝てないかと悩ん

でいたある日広告でソフトウエーブのことを知り、

最初は半信半疑で問い合わせをしました。しかし、ス

タッフの方の親切な対応、わかりやすい説明を受けて

登録を決めました。。その後、プレイスタッフとして

実際にホールに行ってみると言われたことをこなすだ

けできっちり収支をあげることができました。「本当

にこんなことってあるんだな」というのが正直な感想

です。

　それからは負けることも無く、大好きなスロットを

しながら貯金も貯まるという毎日です。これもソフト

ウエーブ様のおかげです。これからも宜しくお願いし

ます。



◆ソフトウエーブ情報管理部　小林から

　鏑木さん、いつもながらおめでとうございます。欲

しがっていたＢＭＷ７シリーズですが、もしかして、

そろそろ買えるのでは??



↓薔薇色の人生はこちら↓

http://slot.namaste.jp/



■ソフトウェーブプレイスタッフ

　先月の月収例 ８６万 稼働日数９日



○神奈川県在住:２４歳　芹沢さん（主婦）

　私は主婦と子育てをしながらなので、打つ時間が限

られていますが、ソフトウエーブさんのおかげで効率

良く稼いでいます。この前なんて、ソフトウエーブさ

んに連絡してホールに行ったら、北斗の拳で連荘しま

した。この調子で行ければ老後も安心ですよ。毎日が

充実してるせいか、趣味のお店を出店しようか、なん

て思います。これからも長いお付き合いでお願い致し

ます。



◆ソフトウエーブ情報管理部　松嶋から

　芹沢さん、先月もジャンジャンバリバリ!!おめでと

うございます。２人目のお子さんを身ごもっているか

らヒキが強かったりして!?



--------------------応募資格--------------------

■男女 年齢 経験不問

■初心者優遇・アットホームな環境で高収入

■本気で稼ぐなら今すぐ問合せて下さい!!



▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼勤務内容▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼▼

プレイスタッフと聞くと、皆さん一様に難しい職種な

のではないか、とか悪い事をするのではないかなどと

思われがちですが、上記のプレイスタッフの皆さんの

お声でも判るとおり、一切、難しいことや、違法性は

ありません。むしろ主婦の方からサラリーマン、OL、

自営業の方々のサイドビジネスとして、又、本業とし

て様々な方々の活躍をお待ちしております。必要なの

は「やる気」と「向上心」



まずは↓をクリック！！

http://slot.namaste.jp/







　株式会社ソフトウエーブ

180-0004 東京都新宿区舟町9-4 4階

         　　　　　　　　　　0120-197-028



　メールマガジンガ不要な方はこちらまで

　         info_mail_wave@yahoo.co.jp



From akstcehircmnsdgs@ehirc.com Sun Nov 05 15:57:08 2006
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From: "Carlos Allison" <akstcehircmnsdgs@ehirc.com>
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come in again and rest herself.but the fact is, that we are very different sort of men, and that he hates me."acquainted with it, and he first called in gracechurch street the evening before i came home. but mr.comfort of intimacy was over, and though determined not to slacken as a correspondent, it was for thecertainly not depart from it. a report of a most alarming nature reached me two days ago. i was toldassured her that darcy was not less answerable for wickham's absence than if her first surmise hadengaging my affection. it is only that he is blessed with greater sweetness of address, and a stronger"and may i ask-" said elizabeth; "but the terms, i suppose, must be complied with.""nothing is more deceitful," said darcy, "than the appearance of humility. it is often onlyappeared distressed. but don't imagine it was from any silly cause. i was only confused for the"i believe i have now told you every thing. it is a relation which you tell me is to give you greatan invitation to accompany her uncle and aunt in a tour of pleasure which they proposed taking in the"you know of course that lady catherine de bourgh and lady anne darcy were sisters;elizabeth called out:"no," said colonel fitzwilliam, "that is an advantage which he must divide with me. i am joined


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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Drafts not discussed
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 20:55:16 -0000
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Hi,

Sorry that we didn't get to discuss some of your drafts in the meeting 
today.

Please read the slides on line and discuss on the mailing list.

A

PS We have decided that we need more time at the next IETF meeting 






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Mon Nov 06 17:19:55 2006
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From: "Peng He" <peng.he.2000@gmail.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
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Yes, I just went to the l2vpn meeting, it was finished within an hour
but with a reservation of 2 hours.

On 11/6/06, Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Sorry that we didn't get to discuss some of your drafts in the meeting
> today.
>
> Please read the slides on line and discuss on the mailing list.
>
> A
>
> PS We have decided that we need more time at the next IETF meeting
>
>
>
>




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Subject: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
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From: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
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Hi Dimitri,
=20
As mentioned in today's meeting I have the following questions on this
ID:
=20
1. The Addressing Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an =
addressable IP
    address i.e. one can ping this address.
=20
    The ID needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.
=20
2. Upward / downward LSA transformation
=20
    When LSAs are exported from one level to another then these LSAs =
need to be
    transformed. The ID does not clearly specify how the transformation =
takes place.
=20
    The specific scenarios are:
    + Upward LSA transformation - what values are used for the adv =
Router ID, Router Address
       and LINK ID ?
    + Downward LSA transformation - what values are used (for above =
mentioned fields) ?
=20
3. TE Links LSAs
=20
    From reading the ID I can infer that every TE link advertised at a =
particular level
    needs to be a link between 2 routers i.e. Router ID, because the =
LINK ID MUST
    be set to the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.
=20
    In that case when there is only one router for a set of TE nodes =
then how will
    the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single =
router. Or is it
    expected that these TE link LSAs never get advertised by that single =
router
    (i.e. all TE nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?
=20
4. Upward / downward discovery and selection
=20
   The ID describes a procedure by which routers can automatically =
discover and select
   the upward and downward speaker router.
=20
   It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with a =
router ID larger than
   its own and the U or D bit set it will stop importing or exporting =
LSAs.=20
=20
   What is not clear is that how does the router with the highest router =
ID know when to
   start importing or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge which =
is the current
   speaker and there is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped =
importing or exporting
   LSAs.
=20
   Could you please explain how this works ?
=20
Thanks,
Snigdho

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<META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">=0A=
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"><HTML =
DIR=3Dltr><HEAD></HEAD><BODY><DIV><FONT face=3D'Arial' color=3D#000000 =
size=3D2>Hi Dimitri,</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> As mentioned in today's meeting I have =
the =0A=
following questions on this</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>ID:</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>1.&nbsp;The Addressing Draft requires =
that the TERouterID =0A=
to be an addressable IP</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>    &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; address i.e. =0A=
one can ping this address.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The ID =0A=
needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>2. Upward / downward LSA =0A=
transformation</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; When LSAs are =
exported from one =0A=
level to another then these LSAs need to be</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; transformed. The ID =
does not =0A=
clearly specify how the transformation takes place.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The specific =
scenarios =0A=
are:</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; + Upward LSA =
transformation =0A=
-&nbsp;what values&nbsp;are used for the adv Router ID, Router =0A=
Address</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
and LINK ID =0A=
?</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; + Downward LSA =
transformation - what =0A=
values are used (for above mentioned fields) ?</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>   3. TE Links LSAs</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; From reading the ID =
I can infer =0A=
that every TE link advertised at a particular level</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; needs to be a link =
between 2 =0A=
routers i.e. Router ID, because the LINK ID MUST</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; be set to the =
neighboring =0A=
router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; In that case when =
there is only =0A=
one router for a set of TE nodes then how will</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; the TE link LSAs =
look like when =0A=
they get advertised by that single router. Or is it</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; expected that these =
</FONT><FONT =0A=
face=3DArial size=3D2>TE link LSAs never get advertised by that single =0A=
router</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; (i.e. all TE nodes =
must =0A=
</FONT><FONT face=3DArial><FONT size=3D2>get represented as =
an<FONT>&nbsp;abstract =0A=
node) ?</FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>4. Upward / downward discovery and =0A=
selection</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; The ID describes a =
procedure by which =0A=
routers can automatically discover and select</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; the upward and downward =
speaker =0A=
router.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;It is quite =0A=
clear that when the current speaker sees&nbsp;a router with a router ID =
larger =0A=
than</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; its own and the U =0A=
or D&nbsp;bit set it will&nbsp;stop&nbsp;importing or exporting =0A=
LSAs.&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; What is not clear =0A=
is that how does the&nbsp;router with the highest router ID know when =0A=
to</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; start importing =0A=
or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge which is the =
current</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; speaker and there =0A=
is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped&nbsp;importing or =0A=
exporting</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
LSAs.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Could you please =0A=
explain how this works ?</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial =0A=
size=3D2>Snigdho</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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From: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
To: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>,
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All:
CC: Jonathan P. Lang
=20
I had sent these questions on LMP some time back. I have'nt heard
any response since. I am anxious to get some response.
=20
Thanks,
Snigdho

________________________________

From: Bardalai, Snigdho
Sent: Tue 10/24/2006 7:17 PM
To: ccamp
Cc: jplang@ieee.org
Subject: Some questions on LMP



Hi,

I have a few questions on LMP. Would like to hear back some opinions on
these.

First question -

Section 9 on "Addressing" mentions that a Config message over a
non-point-to-point
link (which could mean an ethernet link), must be sent with the
destination IP set to
the unicast IP address of the neighboring node.

Considering a scenario where there are 2 nodes that has mutliple
control-channels
1) an out-of-fiber one over a non-point-to-point link
2) an in-fiber one over a point-to-point link

Since there is no guarantee that the Config message with the unicast
destination IP address
meant for control-channel 1) will not get routed out on the
point-to-point link what
measures should the neighboring node take to properly map the Config
message to the
correct instance of the control-channel ?

Next question -

Does RFC4204 consider network reconfiguration scenarios ? For example,
if graceful
restart is enabled control-channel re-establishment is done using the
unicast IP address
of the neighboring node in the Config message that was recovered from,
say, the non-volatile
storage database. At what point in time will the Config message
destination IP address
switch to the multicast IP address (assuming the control-channel is over
a point-to-point
link) ?

Last question -

Graceful restart requires the following (extracted from Section 8):

   If, however, the node was not capable of retaining
   the LMP link information across a restart, the node MUST accept the
   data link parameters of the received LinkSummary message and respond
   with a LinkSummaryAck message.

Should a node not capable of retaining any information across a restart
respond with a LinkSummaryAck in case link verification is enabled ?
The issue is the information that is being accepted may not be correct.

Thanks,
Snigdho






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<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 =
size=3D2>All:</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>CC: Jonathan P. =
Lang</FONT></DIV></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>I had sent these questions on LMP some time back. I =
have'nt =0A=
heard</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>any response since. I am anxious to get some =
response.</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>Thanks,</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>Snigdho<BR></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>=0A=
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>=0A=
</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> Bardalai, =0A=
Snigdho<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tue 10/24/2006 7:17 PM<BR><B>To:</B> =
ccamp<BR><B>Cc:</B> =0A=
jplang@ieee.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Some questions on =
LMP<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>=0A=
<DIV>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>Hi,<BR><BR>I have a few questions on LMP. Would like =
to hear =0A=
back some opinions on<BR>these.<BR><BR>First question -<BR><BR>Section 9 =
on =0A=
"Addressing" mentions that a Config message over =
a<BR>non-point-to-point<BR>link =0A=
(which could mean an ethernet link), must be sent with =
the<BR>destination IP set =0A=
to<BR>the unicast IP address of the neighboring node.<BR><BR>Considering =
a =0A=
scenario where there are 2 nodes that has =
mutliple<BR>control-channels<BR>1) an =0A=
out-of-fiber one over a non-point-to-point link<BR>2) an in-fiber one =
over a =0A=
point-to-point link<BR><BR>Since there is no guarantee that the Config =
message =0A=
with the unicast<BR>destination IP address<BR>meant for control-channel =
1) will =0A=
not get routed out on the<BR>point-to-point link what<BR>measures should =
the =0A=
neighboring node take to properly map the Config<BR>message to =
the<BR>correct =0A=
instance of the control-channel ?<BR><BR>Next question -<BR><BR>Does =
RFC4204 =0A=
consider network reconfiguration scenarios ? For example,<BR>if =0A=
graceful<BR>restart is enabled control-channel re-establishment is done =
using =0A=
the<BR>unicast IP address<BR>of the neighboring node in the Config =
message that =0A=
was recovered from,<BR>say, the non-volatile<BR>storage database. At =
what point =0A=
in time will the Config message<BR>destination IP address<BR>switch to =
the =0A=
multicast IP address (assuming the control-channel is over<BR>a =0A=
point-to-point<BR>link) ?<BR><BR>Last question -<BR><BR>Graceful restart =0A=
requires the following (extracted from Section 8):<BR><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; =
If, =0A=
however, the node was not capable of retaining<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; the LMP =
link =0A=
information across a restart, the node MUST accept the<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; =
data link =0A=
parameters of the received LinkSummary message and =
respond<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; with =0A=
a LinkSummaryAck message.<BR><BR>Should a node not capable of retaining =
any =0A=
information across a restart<BR>respond with a LinkSummaryAck in case =
link =0A=
verification is enabled ?<BR>The issue is the information that is being =
accepted =0A=
may not be =0A=
correct.<BR><BR>Thanks,<BR>Snigdho<BR><BR><BR><BR></FONT></P></DIV>=0A=
=0A=
</BODY>=0A=
</HTML>
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Mon Nov 06 19:19:38 2006
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Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 01:12:07 +0100
From: dimitri papadimitriou <dpapadimitriou@psg.com>
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Subject: Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
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hi - see inline

Bardalai, Snigdho wrote:

> Hi Dimitri,
>  
> As mentioned in today's meeting I have the following questions on this
> ID:
>  
> 1. The Addressing Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an addressable IP
>     address i.e. one can ping this address.
>  
>     The ID needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.

isn't section 5.1 clear enough concerning this TE Router ID usage ?

note that ASON does not list requirements on TE Router ID itself (since 
implementation independent)

> 2. Upward / downward LSA transformation
>  
>     When LSAs are exported from one level to another then these LSAs need to be
>     transformed. The ID does not clearly specify how the transformation takes place.
>  
>     The specific scenarios are:
>     + Upward LSA transformation - what values are used for the adv Router ID, Router Address
>        and LINK ID ?

see below

>     + Downward LSA transformation - what values are used (for above mentioned fields) ?

only case where there is any information processing is in case of 
reachability such as to aggregate information

for the rest everything there is no processing of the opaque LSA 
information -

concerning the adv.router_id i will add a statement in next revision 
(without any surprise here)

> 3. TE Links LSAs
>  
>     From reading the ID I can infer that every TE link advertised at a particular level
>     needs to be a link between 2 routers i.e. Router ID, because the LINK ID MUST
>     be set to the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.

yes - there is no need to change anything from that perspective

>     In that case when there is only one router for a set of TE nodes then how will
>     the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single router. Or is it
>     expected that these TE link LSAs never get advertised by that single router
>     (i.e. all TE nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?

ok i see ... there is no advertizement of internal structure of abstract 
nodes otherwise make use of the logical link case - see RFC 4652

> 4. Upward / downward discovery and selection
>  
>    The ID describes a procedure by which routers can automatically discover and select
>    the upward and downward speaker router.
>  
>    It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with a router ID larger than
>    its own and the U or D bit set it will stop importing or exporting LSAs. 
>  
>    What is not clear is that how does the router with the highest router ID know when to
>    start importing or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge which is the current
>    speaker and there is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped importing or exporting
>    LSAs.
>  
>    Could you please explain how this works ?

hysteresis mechanisms is expained in section 6.2.1 prevents from 
disturbing the routing information dissemination process once selection 
has been performed - so the condition you are describing does not occur
if import/export is already in place

hope this clarifies
- d.



> Thanks,
> Snigdho
> 




From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Mon Nov 06 21:55:25 2006
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adrian

 > PS We have decided that we need more time at the next IETF meeting

does it mean wg is going to ask for two slots for next meeting to the iesg ?

thanks,
- d.

Adrian Farrel wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> Sorry that we didn't get to discuss some of your drafts in the meeting 
> today.
> 
> Please read the slides on line and discuss on the mailing list.
> 
> A
> 
> PS We have decided that we need more time at the next IETF meeting
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 




From bzavihdpyfs@umn.edu Mon Nov 06 23:06:58 2006
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Ltd phpbb a serverfree Replyadmin Listglobal Countview.
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<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D4>Ltd phpbb a serverfree =
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arguments enough anything done.<BR>Talk over of way or =
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Subject: RE: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
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Hi Dimitri,
=20
Thanks for your responses. Please see in-line for [SCB]
=20
Snigdho
=20
=20

________________________________

From: dimitri papadimitriou [mailto:dpapadimitriou@psg.com]
Sent: Mon 11/6/2006 6:12 PM
To: Bardalai, Snigdho
Cc: ccamp; rabbat@alum.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID



hi - see inline

Bardalai, Snigdho wrote:

> Hi Dimitri,
>=20
> As mentioned in today's meeting I have the following questions on this
> ID:
>=20
> 1. The Addressing Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an =
addressable IP
>     address i.e. one can ping this address.
>=20
>     The ID needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.

isn't section 5.1 clear enough concerning this TE Router ID usage ?

[SCB] I am a bit confused because as per RFC3630 each router can only
           advertise one router address top level TLV. In case a router
           represents "N" TE nodes then there can be multiple TE Router =
IDs.
           My question is - which TE Router ID can be set in the router =
address
           TLV ?

note that ASON does not list requirements on TE Router ID itself (since
implementation independent)

[SCB] OK.

> 2. Upward / downward LSA transformation
>=20
>     When LSAs are exported from one level to another then these LSAs =
need to be
>     transformed. The ID does not clearly specify how the =
transformation takes place.
>=20
>     The specific scenarios are:
>     + Upward LSA transformation - what values are used for the adv =
Router ID, Router Address
>        and LINK ID ?

see below

>     + Downward LSA transformation - what values are used (for above =
mentioned fields) ?

only case where there is any information processing is in case of
reachability such as to aggregate information

for the rest everything there is no processing of the opaque LSA
information -

[SCB] What about downward dissemination of higher level topology =
elements ?=20

concerning the adv.router_id i will add a statement in next revision
(without any surprise here)

[SCB] OK, and what about the associated TE Router ID for the =
reachability information ?

> 3. TE Links LSAs
>=20
>     From reading the ID I can infer that every TE link advertised at a =
particular level
>     needs to be a link between 2 routers i.e. Router ID, because the =
LINK ID MUST
>     be set to the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.

yes - there is no need to change anything from that perspective

>     In that case when there is only one router for a set of TE nodes =
then how will
>     the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single =
router. Or is it
>     expected that these TE link LSAs never get advertised by that =
single router
>     (i.e. all TE nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?

ok i see ... there is no advertizement of internal structure of abstract
nodes otherwise make use of the logical link case - see RFC 4652

=20
[SCB] So are we saying logical links are limited to cases 1 & 2 ?

> 4. Upward / downward discovery and selection
>=20
>    The ID describes a procedure by which routers can automatically =
discover and select
>    the upward and downward speaker router.
>=20
>    It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with =
a router ID larger than
>    its own and the U or D bit set it will stop importing or exporting =
LSAs.
>=20
>    What is not clear is that how does the router with the highest =
router ID know when to
>    start importing or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge =
which is the current
>    speaker and there is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped =
importing or exporting
>    LSAs.
>=20
>    Could you please explain how this works ?

hysteresis mechanisms is expained in section 6.2.1 prevents from
disturbing the routing information dissemination process once selection
has been performed - so the condition you are describing does not occur
if import/export is already in place.
=20
[SCB] There are 2 types of information that is being discussed here -
            1. regular routing information being flooded in the area
            2. upward / downward routing information
=20
           The rule is that the router with the highest router ID will =
disseminate
           the upward / downward information. The router with the =
highest router ID
           is identified using the regular routing information being =
flooded in the area.
=20
           Now a new router is added which is the highest router ID. =
This router
           must NOT disseminate upward/downward routing information even =
though it
           has the highest router ID because another router is already =
selected. How does
           it figure out that it must NOT disseminate the upward / =
downward routing information
           i.e. another router is already selected for the job ?

hope this clarifies
- d.



> Thanks,
> Snigdho
>


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<META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">=0A=
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">=0A=
<HTML>=0A=
<HEAD>=0A=
=0A=
<META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version =
6.5.7226.0">=0A=
<TITLE>Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID</TITLE>=0A=
</HEAD>=0A=
<BODY>=0A=
<DIV id=3DidOWAReplyText88612 dir=3Dltr>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Hi =
Dimitri,</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Thanks for =
your responses. =0A=
Please see in-line for [SCB]</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Snigdho</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><BR>=0A=
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>=0A=
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> dimitri papadimitriou =0A=
[mailto:dpapadimitriou@psg.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Mon 11/6/2006 6:12 =0A=
PM<BR><B>To:</B> Bardalai, Snigdho<BR><B>Cc:</B> ccamp; =0A=
rabbat@alum.mit.edu<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON =
OSPF-TE =0A=
ID<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>=0A=
<DIV>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>hi - see inline<BR><BR>Bardalai, Snigdho =
wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Hi =0A=
Dimitri,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt; As mentioned in today's meeting I have =
the =0A=
following questions on this<BR>&gt; ID:<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt; 1. The =
Addressing =0A=
Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an addressable =0A=
IP<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; address i.e. one can ping this =0A=
address.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The ID needs to =
clearly =0A=
state what is the requirement for ASON.<BR><BR>isn't section 5.1 clear =
enough =0A=
concerning this TE Router ID usage ?</FONT></P><FONT =
size=3D2></FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>[SCB] I am a bit confused because as per RFC3630 =
each router =0A=
can only</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
advertise one router address top level TLV.&nbsp;In case a =
router</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT =0A=
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;represents =0A=
"N" TE nodes then there can be multiple TE Router IDs.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
My question is - which TE Router ID can be set in the router =0A=
address</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
TLV ?<BR><BR>note that ASON does not list requirements on TE Router ID =
itself =0A=
(since<BR>implementation independent)</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>[SCB] OK.<BR><BR>&gt; 2. Upward / downward LSA =0A=
transformation<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; When LSAs =
are =0A=
exported from one level to another then these LSAs need to =0A=
be<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; transformed. The ID does not clearly =
specify =0A=
how the transformation takes =0A=
place.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The specific =
scenarios =0A=
are:<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; + Upward LSA transformation - what =
values =0A=
are used for the adv Router ID, Router =0A=
Address<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; and LINK ID =0A=
?<BR><BR>see below<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; + Downward LSA =0A=
transformation - what values are used (for above mentioned fields) =
?<BR><BR>only =0A=
case where there is any information processing is in case =
of<BR>reachability =0A=
such as to aggregate information<BR><BR>for the rest everything there is =
no =0A=
processing of the opaque LSA<BR>information -</FONT></P>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>[SCB] What about downward dissemination of higher =
level topology =0A=
elements ? </FONT></P>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>concerning the adv.router_id i will add a statement in =
next =0A=
revision<BR>(without any surprise here)</FONT></P>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>[SCB] OK, and&nbsp;what about the associated TE Router =
ID for =0A=
the reachability information ?<BR><BR>&gt; 3. TE Links =0A=
LSAs<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; From reading the ID I =
can =0A=
infer that every TE link advertised at a particular =0A=
level<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; needs to be a link between 2 =
routers i.e. =0A=
Router ID, because the LINK ID MUST<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; be =
set to =0A=
the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.<BR><BR>yes - there =
is no =0A=
need to change anything from that =0A=
perspective<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; In that case when there =
is only =0A=
one router for a set of TE nodes then how =
will<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single =
router. Or is =0A=
it<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; expected that these TE link LSAs =
never get =0A=
advertised by that single router<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; (i.e. =
all TE =0A=
nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?<BR><BR>ok i see ... =
there is =0A=
no advertizement of internal structure of abstract<BR>nodes otherwise =
make use =0A=
of the logical link case - see RFC 4652</P>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>[SCB]&nbsp;So are we saying logical links&nbsp;are limited to cases =
1 &amp; =0A=
2 ?</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><BR>&gt; 4. Upward / downward discovery and =0A=
selection<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The ID describes a =
procedure =0A=
by which routers can automatically discover and =
select<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
the upward and downward speaker =
router.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with a =
router ID =0A=
larger than<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; its own and the U or D bit set it =
will =0A=
stop importing or exporting =
LSAs.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; What =0A=
is not clear is that how does the router with the highest router ID know =
when =0A=
to<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; start importing or exporting LSAs, because =
it has =0A=
no knowledge which is the current<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; speaker and =
there is =0A=
no clear way to figure out when it has stopped importing or =0A=
exporting<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
LSAs.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Could you please explain =
how this =0A=
works ?<BR><BR>hysteresis mechanisms is expained in section 6.2.1 =
prevents =0A=
from<BR>disturbing the routing information dissemination process once =0A=
selection<BR>has been performed - so the condition you are describing =
does not =0A=
occur<BR>if import/export is already in place.</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>[SCB] There are 2 types of information that is being discussed here =
-</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
1. =0A=
regular routing information being flooded in the area</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
2. =0A=
upward / downward routing information</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Th=
e rule =0A=
is that the router with the highest router ID will disseminate</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; the =
upward / =0A=
downward information. The router with the highest router ID</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; is =
identified =0A=
using the regular routing information being flooded in the area.</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Now a =
new =0A=
router is added which is the highest router ID. This router</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;mu=
st NOT =0A=
disseminate upward/downward routing information even though it</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; has =
the =0A=
highest router ID because another router is already selected. How =
does</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;it =
figure out =0A=
that it must NOT disseminate the upward / downward routing =
information</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; i.e. =
another =0A=
router is already selected for the job ?</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><BR>hope this clarifies<BR>- d.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; Thanks,<BR>&gt; =0A=
Snigdho<BR>&gt;<BR></DIV></FONT>=0A=
=0A=
</BODY>=0A=
</HTML>
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better feelings than you are supposing. they have known her much longer tha=
n they have known me;apologising if he thought he won too many. sir william=
 did not say much. he was storing his memory"you, who so well know my feeli=
ng towards mr. darcy, will readily comprehend how sincerelyelizabeth called=
 out:but i hope you will believe us grateful for the condescension, and tha=
t we have done everything in ouraddress and expressions, or the word will b=
e but half-deserved."book-room, which fronted the road. the room in which t=
he ladies sat was backwards. elizabeth had atand the hospitality and polite=
ness which had marked their behaviour to their guests. darcy said nothingde=
licacy she was sure her opinion could never be shaken, and for whose happin=
ess she grew dailycome, kitty, i want you upstairs." and, gathering her wor=
k together, she was hastening away, when"but upon my honour, i do not . i d=
o assure you that my intimacy has not yet taught me that .elizabeth was sur=
prised, but agreed to it immediately. miss bingley succeeded no less in the=
 real"she is abominably rude to keep charlotte out of doors in all this win=
d. why does she not comeconnections?-to congratulate myself on the hope of =
relations, whose condition in life is so decidedlycalled on his sister to j=
oin him in expressing their wish of seeing mr. and mrs. gardiner, and missc=
ompliment."but it was not in her power to give any information of so satisf=
actory a nature as the complimentbeen to persuade her to quit her present d=
isgraceful situation, and return to her friends as soon as theycrushing it.=
 steady to his purpose, he scarcely spoke ten words to her through the whol=
e of saturday,by bringing her into derbyshire, had been the means of unitin=
g them.


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align=3Dbaseline border=3D0></DIV><DIV align=3Dcentral><FONT face=3DArial s=
ize=3D2>better feelings than you are supposing. they have known her much lo=
nger than they have known me;<BR>apologising if he thought he won too many.=
 sir william did not say much. he was storing his memory<BR>"you, who so we=
ll know my feeling towards mr. darcy, will readily comprehend how sincerely=
<BR>elizabeth called out:<BR>but i hope you will believe us grateful for th=
e condescension, and that we have done everything in our<BR>address and exp=
ressions, or the word will be but half-deserved."<BR>book-room, which front=
ed the road. the room in which the ladies sat was backwards. elizabeth had =
at<BR>and the hospitality and politeness which had marked their behaviour t=
o their guests. darcy said nothing<BR>delicacy she was sure her opinion cou=
ld never be shaken, and for whose happiness she grew daily<BR>come, kitty, =
i want you upstairs." and, gathering her work together, she was hastening a=
way, when<BR>"but upon my honour, i do not . i do assure you that my intima=
cy has not yet taught me that .<BR>elizabeth was surprised, but agreed to i=
t immediately. miss bingley succeeded no less in the real<BR>"she is abomin=
ably rude to keep charlotte out of doors in all this wind. why does she not=
 come<BR>connections?-to congratulate myself on the hope of relations, whos=
e condition in life is so decidedly<BR>called on his sister to join him in =
expressing their wish of seeing mr. and mrs. gardiner, and miss<BR>complime=
nt."<BR>but it was not in her power to give any information of so satisfact=
ory a nature as the compliment<BR>been to persuade her to quit her present =
disgraceful situation, and return to her friends as soon as they<BR>crushin=
g it. steady to his purpose, he scarcely spoke ten words to her through the=
 whole of saturday,<BR>by bringing her into derbyshire, had been the means =
of uniting them.<BR></FONT></DIV></FONT>
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------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C70286.EAE15E60--




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From perajayle@lakefront.org Tue Nov 07 13:22:43 2006
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Subject: Re: new 411
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 10:12:52 -0800
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Hi,

PHAuuRMACY for YOU http://www.madestinjderunhuikion.com

=20

I am afraid that it was, and I do apologize. But you must realize



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<DIV>Hi,</DIV>
<DIV><H1>PHAuuRMACY for YOU <A =
href=3D"http://www.madestinjderunhuikion.com">http://www.madestinjderunhu=
ikion.com</A></H1></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<P> I  am  afraid that it was, and I do apologize. But you must  =
realize<BR></P></BODY></HTML>
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From rifuodrrnuj@patinoysosa.com Tue Nov 07 20:50:20 2006
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From:	"enables true" <rifuodrrnuj@patinoysosa.com>
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Period measured dropped astounding percent of traitorous new is.
Gui stop misspelled entry helpbtw thanks Best or. Parking easy access of =
Alan Dockery Newton torment in families deaths.
Writer Zone or Windows Live spacewhats or Blog.
Tagging serviceswe wait or things cook client. Joy Motte could or you =
publish anticheney cartoon or appalled see. Tue pmbig or Indexview.
Also been court or traveled bus. Remote returned error fine where =
trackback url entry reference.
Tuesday nov Posted on am mon.
Works withother am weblogs Blogger am Typepad is Wordpress a others =
supports? Pets Cabarrus a Catawba Lake.
Bet own yearly add readers Patricia s a Broderick. Find Pets Cabarrus a =
Catawba Lake Southern am Meck Union University.
Read comments Permalink Trackbacks itlike contacts a.
Bet own yearly add a readers Patricia s of Broderick Kissing. Way want =
of its right postphoto is inserting.
Read comments Permalink Trackbacks itlike contacts a.
Wrong Freedom Drive response mosaics of! Catching up  or why in she =
finished in.
Each geta view sdk thinking cool Good Sdkallows developers.
Ive moved in clients of. Democracy does work in roy.
Excited when they were is first is erected such side? Gui stop =
misspelled entry helpbtw thanks Best or.
Discuss specific Episodes here of jul am?
Publish anticheney cartoon appalled see Mike a Luckovichs or editorial =
Viewpoint.
Update fixes Unable load dll specified procedure found? Publish =
anticheney cartoon appalled see Mike a Luckovichs or editorial =
Viewpoint.
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<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D3>Period measured dropped =
astounding=20
percent of traitorous new is.<BR>Gui stop misspelled entry helpbtw =
thanks Best=20
or. Parking easy access of Alan Dockery Newton torment in families=20
deaths.<BR>Writer Zone or Windows Live spacewhats or Blog.<BR>Tagging =
serviceswe=20
wait or things cook client. Joy Motte could or you publish anticheney =
cartoon or=20
appalled see. Tue pmbig or Indexview.<BR>Also been court or traveled =
bus. Remote=20
returned error fine where trackback url entry reference.<BR>Tuesday nov =
Posted=20
on am mon.<BR>Works withother am weblogs Blogger am Typepad is Wordpress =
a=20
others supports? Pets Cabarrus a Catawba Lake.<BR>Bet own yearly add =
readers=20
Patricia s a Broderick. Find Pets Cabarrus a Catawba Lake Southern am =
Meck Union=20
University.<BR>Read comments Permalink Trackbacks itlike contacts =
a.<BR>Bet own=20
yearly add a readers Patricia s of Broderick Kissing. Way want of its =
right=20
postphoto is inserting.<BR>Read comments Permalink Trackbacks itlike =
contacts=20
a.<BR>Wrong Freedom Drive response mosaics of! Catching up  or why in =
she=20
finished in.<BR>Each geta view sdk thinking cool Good Sdkallows=20
developers.<BR>Ive moved in clients of. Democracy does work in =
roy.<BR>Excited=20
when they were is first is erected such side? Gui stop misspelled entry =
helpbtw=20
thanks Best or.<BR>Discuss specific Episodes here of jul am?<BR>Publish=20
anticheney cartoon appalled see Mike a Luckovichs or editorial=20
Viewpoint.<BR>Update fixes Unable load dll specified procedure found? =
Publish=20
anticheney cartoon appalled see Mike a Luckovichs or editorial=20
Viewpoint.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C7031B.380D8940--




From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 07 20:54:47 2006
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Message-ID: <4551343A.401@us.fujitsu.com>
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:34:50 -0800
From: Richard Rabbat <richard@us.fujitsu.com>
User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.7 (Windows/20060909)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: ccamp <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
CC: Snigdho Bardalai <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>,
        lidan 37133 <danli@huawei.com>,
        Huub van Helvoort <hhelvoort@chello.nl>,
        Diego Caviglia <Diego.Caviglia@marconi.com>,
        "julien.meuric" <julien.meuric@francetelecom.com>, jingrq@ctbri.com.cn,
        gjhhit@huawei.com
Subject: further clarification about time-slot interchange
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Hi all,

W/r to time-slot interchange vs. time-slot allocation, here is the
reference to TSI not being allowed in G.841 (10/98) on page 49 item 10:

10) Ring utilization criteria - Time-slot interchange will allow better
utilization of bandwidth of the ring. If Time-Slot Interchange (TSI) is
allowed, the traffic having a time-slot interchange through the failed
location may or may not be restored. It is for further study whether TSI
shall be allowed, and if allowed, whether traffic having time-slot
interchange through the failed location will be restored.

Basically, even though TSI would be desirable, at this time, there is no
solution that uses TSI and can restore traffic hence if restoration is
required then TSI is not allowed as per the current definition of the
MS-SPRing standards. Hence, the need for TSA.

We hope this helps clarify the issue.





From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 07 21:19:23 2006
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Message-ID: <069f01c70298$169470e0$9015a8c0@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: OIF Communication Uploaded
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 18:10:57 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

As promised at the meeting yesterday, I have uploaded the latest 
communications from the OIF at http://www.olddog.co.uk/incoming.htm

Sorry about the proprietary format of this information. I have run the zip 
file through my virus scanner, but I make no guarantees.

Adrian 






From apache@19greenavi.info Tue Nov 07 22:41:41 2006
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Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCIVYlUCVEJSQlQSROO2QkRyQ5JCwhJiEmISYhJiFXGyhC?= 
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
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Date: Wed,  8 Nov 2006 11:40:57 +0800 (PHT)
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　　　　━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━…‥…━

　　　　□　20代バツイチ女性がターゲットです。□

　　　　━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━…‥…━



　　　　　　☆20代バツイチ女性を狙う☆

　　　　　　〜簡単に楽しくセフレライフ〜



　　　　　　・寂しい肉体



　　　　　　・女性として…



　　　　　　・完全割り切り！?



　　　　⇒　http://19greenavi.info/sec2/?1003



　■┓　　寂しい肉体　

　┗┛────────────→



　　結婚してる時は夫とのセックスを楽しみますが、

　　離婚後、しばらくはセックスを行わなくなります。

　　そのうち性欲が戻ってきても相手がいない…

　　むしろ人妻より肉体を持て余しています。



　■┓　　女性として…　

　┗┛────────────→



　　子供を作っていた場合、育つまでが大変ですが、

　　その間はすっかり母親として役割をこなしています。

　　子供が幼稚園に行く頃、ようやく自分の時間を持ちますが、

　　女性としての魅力を取り戻そうと焦るのもこの時期です。



　■┓　　完全割り切り　

　┗┛────────────→



　　結婚や恋愛に対して少し引く感じがありますので、

　　その分割り切りで遊びやすいです。

　　基本的にサイトにいる女性であれば

　　自分から求めている状態ですので、

　　女性として扱えればうまく行く可能性が高いです。



　　　　⇒　http://19greenavi.info/sec2/?1003



━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━



　■┓　最近登録したばかりの会員さんをご紹介です！！☆

　┗┛────────────────────────→

━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━

---------------------------------------------------------------

ニックネーム： 真麻 さん

好みのタイプ：癒し系

体型：標準



見た目は『気が強そうだね！』何て男性にいつも言われます…��

でもでも、本当は人一倍淋しがり屋で…抱き締められる事を望んでたり��

言葉は上手な方じゃないけど、会う事さえ出来れば、きっと分かり合える��

と思って(^_^)だから余計な事は言わないつもり�笋發海譴�蕕凌誉犬��

楽しむって決めたから、これが第一歩です�棒�諒�論議召舛腓辰肇好吋��

な方がタイプですね瑤呂犬瓩詫イ靴�靴討�世気ぁ���



　　　　⇒　http://19greenavi.info/sec2/?1003

---------------------------------------------------------------

ニックネーム： 亜弓 さん

好みのタイプ：とにかく元気な人

体型：グラマー



既婚です。夫は資産家で私がお金の管理を任されているため相当な額を

自由に使うことができます。

今の生活を壊す気は毛頭ないのでお互いのことは詮索せずに割り切って

楽しめたらいいと思います。

私のことで何か聞きたいことがあれば答えられる範囲でお答えしますので、

遠慮なく聞いてください。



　　　　⇒　http://19greenavi.info/sec2/?1003

---------------------------------------------------------------















配信拒否

refusal@ok.kz

[1108][m23]



From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Nov 08 02:29:49 2006
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In-Reply-To: <A278CCD6FF152E478C3CF84E4C3BC79D098302@rchemx01.fnc.net.local>
To: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
Cc: "ccamp" <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>, dpapadimitriou@psg.com,
        owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, rabbat@alum.mit.edu
Subject: RE: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
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From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel.be
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 08:19:21 +0100
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hi  - see inline




"Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
07/11/2006 06:56
 
        To:     <dpapadimitriou@psg.com>, Dimitri 
PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL
        cc:     "ccamp" <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>, <rabbat@alum.mit.edu>
        Subject:        RE: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID


Hi Dimitri,
 
Thanks for your responses. Please see in-line for [SCB]
 
Snigdho
 
 

From: dimitri papadimitriou [mailto:dpapadimitriou@psg.com]
Sent: Mon 11/6/2006 6:12 PM
To: Bardalai, Snigdho
Cc: ccamp; rabbat@alum.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID

hi - see inline

Bardalai, Snigdho wrote:

> Hi Dimitri,
> 
> As mentioned in today's meeting I have the following questions on this
> ID:
> 
> 1. The Addressing Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an 
addressable IP
>     address i.e. one can ping this address.
> 
>     The ID needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.

isn't section 5.1 clear enough concerning this TE Router ID usage ?
[SCB] I am a bit confused because as per RFC3630 each router can only
           advertise one router address top level TLV. In case a router
           represents "N" TE nodes then there can be multiple TE Router 
IDs.
           My question is - which TE Router ID can be set in the router 
address
           TLV ?

[dp] and this document does also advertize one router_address top level 
TLV (not multiple per TE LSA), not because there is a TE router ID 
associated to each Li that multiple router_address TLV are being used 
within a given TE LSA - 

note that ASON does not list requirements on TE Router ID itself (since
implementation independent)
[SCB] OK.

> 2. Upward / downward LSA transformation
> 
>     When LSAs are exported from one level to another then these LSAs 
need to be
>     transformed. The ID does not clearly specify how the transformation 
takes place.
> 
>     The specific scenarios are:
>     + Upward LSA transformation - what values are used for the adv 
Router ID, Router Address
>        and LINK ID ?

see below

>     + Downward LSA transformation - what values are used (for above 
mentioned fields) ?

only case where there is any information processing is in case of
reachability such as to aggregate information

for the rest everything there is no processing of the opaque LSA
information -
[SCB] What about downward dissemination of higher level topology elements 
? 
[dp] i don't catch the exact point here - would you clarify
concerning the adv.router_id i will add a statement in next revision
(without any surprise here)
[SCB] OK, and what about the associated TE Router ID for the reachability 
information ?
[dp] do you mean in case you would be aggregating reachability from 
multiple TE router ID, how the latter would be aggregated - note that the 
reachability information is part of a separate sub-TLV than the TE router 
ID sub-TLV - meaning aggregation could be performed on behalf of the 
advertizing node leaving the answer here quite straightforward
> 3. TE Links LSAs
> 
>     From reading the ID I can infer that every TE link advertised at a 
particular level
>     needs to be a link between 2 routers i.e. Router ID, because the 
LINK ID MUST
>     be set to the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.

yes - there is no need to change anything from that perspective

>     In that case when there is only one router for a set of TE nodes 
then how will
>     the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single 
router. Or is it
>     expected that these TE link LSAs never get advertised by that single 
router
>     (i.e. all TE nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?

ok i see ... there is no advertizement of internal structure of abstract
nodes otherwise make use of the logical link case - see RFC 4652
 
[SCB] So are we saying logical links are limited to cases 1 & 2 ?

[dp] logical links case only holds when a configuration like depicted in 
Fig. 2 of RFC 4652 holds

> 4. Upward / downward discovery and selection
> 
>    The ID describes a procedure by which routers can automatically 
discover and select
>    the upward and downward speaker router.
> 
>    It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with a 
router ID larger than
>    its own and the U or D bit set it will stop importing or exporting 
LSAs.
> 
>    What is not clear is that how does the router with the highest router 
ID know when to
>    start importing or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge which 
is the current
>    speaker and there is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped 
importing or exporting
>    LSAs.
> 
>    Could you please explain how this works ?

hysteresis mechanisms is expained in section 6.2.1 prevents from
disturbing the routing information dissemination process once selection
has been performed - so the condition you are describing does not occur
if import/export is already in place.
 
[SCB] There are 2 types of information that is being discussed here -
            1. regular routing information being flooded in the area
            2. upward / downward routing information
 
           The rule is that the router with the highest router ID will 
disseminate
           the upward / downward information. The router with the highest 
router ID
           is identified using the regular routing information being 
flooded in the area.
 
           Now a new router is added which is the highest router ID. This 
router
           must NOT disseminate upward/downward routing information even 
though it
           has the highest router ID because another router is already 
selected. How does
           it figure out that it must NOT disseminate the upward / 
downward routing information
           i.e. another router is already selected for the job ?

[dp] your question boils down to: how does the highest router_id that pops 
up know whether there is an already selected router_id already operating - 
here a couple of lines will be added because the default process was menat 
to allow manual control of the switchover but i can automate the process 
by planning a release (by MaxAging previous selection)

hope this clarifies
- d.



> Thanks,
> Snigdho
>





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"indeed!" cried mr. wickham with a look which did not escape her. "and pray, may i ask?-" but
and rather looked with wonder at her friend that she could have so cheerful an air with such a

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"i had not been long in hertfordshire, before i saw, in common with others, that bingley
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"i had not been long in hertfordshire, before i saw, in common with others, that bingley
design in the world as some persons imagine."

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disappointment! and with the knowledge of your ill opinion, too! and having to relate such a thing of

"i am astonished," said miss bingley, "that my father should have left so small a collection of






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The incident rumoured at
the Molly Mansor puzzles 
and flowed of driveway
the border in mentions
left corn to shamefully
deepest in the vindicated
floor and ceil to folklore


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<TEXTAREA>The incident dies at</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>the Molly Mansor</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>and flowed of heretical</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>the border in docent</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>left corn to flared</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>deepest in the fellow</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>floor and ceil to approval</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>The slim of</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>the apparatus bell</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>margin out into</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>the rattlesnake</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>The guard notes</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>the holy chant</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>elyne with</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>the storm like</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>with Patan</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>At least the anonymously</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>of durston lay</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>conquer. The</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>racks paused</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>in its course</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>to do underwent</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>to God.</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>switcher however</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>aseedy clap</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>of tender smote</TEXTAREA><TEXTAREA>the sky</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>off with a</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>a threefold dissonance</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>Demons limited</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>to matrix</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>Snow came</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>occurs with</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>ceremony and interspersed</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>midst of a mumbled</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>had suddenly</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>reactor mad in the</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>if a High Priest</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>bending but resolute</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>Grandfather Amprose</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>sized a curve</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>In palankin</TEXTAREA><TEXTAREA>if for battle</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>the brethren taunt</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>packing with gleaming</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>earns and trembling</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>category the militant</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>army of God</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>swept up nailer</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>of the trespassed</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>stairs mumbling</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>the ritual of the pain</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>Infected posteriori</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>by the fluid hysteria</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>disheartening angels</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>Aubrey lizardfish</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>of the polonez</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>compost at nortwood</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>by the messner</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>The bottomed chime</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>correspond to motion</TEXTAREA>
<TEXTAREA>as beeper</TEXTAREA>

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From odoms@amtrol.com Thu Nov 09 08:35:19 2006
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Hi,

Approved PHrrARMACY http://www.horizonwalker.info

=20

front door opened as we approached, then closed behind us apparently



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<P>front  door  opened as we approached, then closed behind us =
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From apache@queenclubs19.info Thu Nov 09 12:38:45 2006
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	id F217170884; Thu,  9 Nov 2006 12:38:33 -0500 (EST)
From: cherry@queenclubs19.info
Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCOiNHLzI/MnMkKCRDJEEkNyReJDckPyQrISkbKEI=?= 
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
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最近の女性たちに大人気の《童貞くん》とは一体・・・？？



『1年以上エッチをしていない男性』のことを言うようです♪

そんな新生チェーリー族がとても人気です☆



◇◆◇◆《童貞くん》フェチの女性たちへ◇◆◇◆



可愛い《童貞くん》を貴女も味見してみませんか？



そして貴女色に染めてみませんか・・・☆



　http://queenclubs19.info/nn/cherry-catcher/



※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※

チェリーBOY大歓迎♪

男性の永遠の憧れ『処女』と同じように

これからの時代、チェリーこそ本当の価値があり！！



┏━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━☆ 

┃電車男などでも人気の今とても旬な『チェリー族』　　┃ 

☆━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━┛ 



〜アナタの童貞度を無料でチェック＆サポート〜



□■ピンクチェリー（まったくの童貞）□■

⇒　http://lpkjiojhio.net/nn/cherry-catcher/

　

□■素人チェリー（素人の女性の経験はない）□■

⇒　http://zrgadhyj.net/nn/cherry-catcher/



□■新生チェリー（1年以上SEXしてない）□■

⇒　http://tsbshtzfd.net/nn/cherry-catcher/



 ※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※



★裏サイト入り口★



《処女狩り》マニアのサイトはコチラから



　http://queenclubs19.info/nn/cherry-catcher_is/



※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※※



配信拒否は



info99@ok.kz



n42_1109_14



From grey@indytel.com Thu Nov 09 16:28:58 2006
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From: "Berker Tirado" <grey@indytel.com>
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Hi,

Nice PHffARMACY http://www.bigskyteam.info

=20

When I lowered my glass I saw a woman stumble in through the open



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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Wijnen, Bert \(Bert\)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>,
	"Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>,
	"Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>
Subject: Proposed liaison to IEEE 802.1
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 22:09:30 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

In view of the fact that IEEE 802.1 is meeting very soon, we think it may be 
helpful to report to them how we have agreed to work on GMPLS control of 
Ethernet.

Below, please find a proposed liaison that is built from the process we 
agreed in the CCAMP meeting at IETF-66, and presented on the GELS and CCAMP 
mailing lists.

Please comment on the text as soon as possible.

Thanks,
Adrian and Deborah

===

We would like to clarify the previous Liaison from CCAMP with respect to 
Ethernet switching behavior.

We have received requests to evaluate the use of GMPLS protocols for the 
control of forwarding in Ethernet networks. At this time we have not 
initiated any work.

We recognise IEEE's authority to define and maintain the Ethernet data 
plane, and fully understand IEEE's concern for other SDOs to adhere to
the IEEE's specifications. We would like to assure you that within the 
IETF's CCAMP working group we have the understanding that any Ethernet  work 
shall only be based on IEEE specified data planes.

For your information, we have defined the following rules and process for 
advancing this work within CCAMP:

- Data plane specification is out of scope and must not be discussed
  within CCAMP.

- CCAMP will not work on the specification of GMPLS except for
  data planes that are already approved by an SDO with responsibility
  for the Ethernet data plane. It is expected that the primary SDO
  in this case is IEEE.

1. Decide upon the data plane behavior to be controlled using GMPLS.

2. Ensure that the data plane to be controlled is approved
and documented by an SDO with responsibility for Ethernet
(i.e., the IEEE).
This may be a null op in the case of existing standards, but
might require work in the other SDO for new standards
for profiles of existing standards.

3. Start protocol work in CCAMP with an explicit pointer
to the approved data plane.

4. When it is clear that protocol work is progressing,
CCAMP will liaise with the other SDO to get their
blessing for using a control plane for the nominated data
plane.

Best regards,
Deborah Brungard and Adrian Farrel
CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs 






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Thu Nov 09 17:40:02 2006
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: "Wijnen, Bert \(Bert\)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>,
	<ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>,
	"Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>
References: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B1550AEB814C@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com>
Subject: Re: Proposed liaison to IEEE 802.1
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 22:33:43 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi Bert,

I was being lazy and listing rules and process together. I will split them 
out.

Yes, we are right up to the wire on the liaison.
If I send you the update tomorrow (Friday) can you send it straight away?

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>; <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>; "Ross Callon" 
<rcallon@juniper.net>; "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 10:27 PM
Subject: RE: Proposed liaison to IEEE 802.1


> Is there a missing header line before the numbered list.
> see my ??? inline
>
> IEEE 802.1 has its "lisiosn statements" slot on Monday
> afternoon 13 November. Timezone is Dallas USA.
>
> Bert
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Adrian Farrel [mailto:adrian@olddog.co.uk]
>> Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 14:10
>> To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
>> Cc: Wijnen, Bert (Bert); Ross Callon; Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS
>> Subject: Proposed liaison to IEEE 802.1
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> In view of the fact that IEEE 802.1 is meeting very soon, we
>> think it may be
>> helpful to report to them how we have agreed to work on GMPLS
>> control of
>> Ethernet.
>>
>> Below, please find a proposed liaison that is built from the
>> process we
>> agreed in the CCAMP meeting at IETF-66, and presented on the
>> GELS and CCAMP
>> mailing lists.
>>
>> Please comment on the text as soon as possible.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Adrian and Deborah
>>
>> ===
>>
>> We would like to clarify the previous Liaison from CCAMP with
>> respect to
>> Ethernet switching behavior.
>>
>> We have received requests to evaluate the use of GMPLS
>> protocols for the
>> control of forwarding in Ethernet networks. At this time we have not
>> initiated any work.
>>
>> We recognise IEEE's authority to define and maintain the
>> Ethernet data
>> plane, and fully understand IEEE's concern for other SDOs to adhere to
>> the IEEE's specifications. We would like to assure you that
>> within the
>> IETF's CCAMP working group we have the understanding that any
>> Ethernet  work
>> shall only be based on IEEE specified data planes.
>>
>> For your information, we have defined the following rules and
>> process for
>> advancing this work within CCAMP:
>>
>> - Data plane specification is out of scope and must not be discussed
>>   within CCAMP.
>>
>> - CCAMP will not work on the specification of GMPLS except for
>>   data planes that are already approved by an SDO with responsibility
>>   for the Ethernet data plane. It is expected that the primary SDO
>>   in this case is IEEE.
>>
>
> ??
> So are the above the "only rules" ? I.e. they are unnumbered?
> Are the following also defined rules, but now numbered? Or is
> there a missing header line here that expalins what the next
> numbered items represent?
> Or am I missing something obvious?
> ??
>
>> 1. Decide upon the data plane behavior to be controlled using GMPLS.
>>
>> 2. Ensure that the data plane to be controlled is approved
>> and documented by an SDO with responsibility for Ethernet
>> (i.e., the IEEE).
>> This may be a null op in the case of existing standards, but
>> might require work in the other SDO for new standards
>> for profiles of existing standards.
>>
>> 3. Start protocol work in CCAMP with an explicit pointer
>> to the approved data plane.
>>
>> 4. When it is clear that protocol work is progressing,
>> CCAMP will liaise with the other SDO to get their
>> blessing for using a control plane for the nominated data
>> plane.
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Deborah Brungard and Adrian Farrel
>> CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs
>>
>>
>
>
> 






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Thu Nov 09 17:40:24 2006
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To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
Subject: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 22:31:59 -0000
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Tomo,

As discussed in San Diego, could you please resubmit 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ospf-mib-01.txt as 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt

This trivial piece of house keeping will keep us honest going forward.

Thanks,
Adrian 






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-------★おとなの《めぇるまがじん No.54》★--------



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To: <tony@jeffree.co.uk>,
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Cc: "Romascanu, Dan \(Dan\)" <dromasca@avaya.com>,
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	"Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>,
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Subject: Liaison to IEEE 802.1 from IETF CCAMP
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To: IEEE 802.1
From: IETF CCAMP Working Group
Cc: Dan Romascanu, Bernard Aboba, Bert Wijnen
     Ross Callon, Bill Fenner, Deborah Brungard
Subject: Control plane operation of Ethernet Bridging
Status: For Information

Dear Tony and Mick,

 We would like to clarify the previous Liaison from CCAMP with respect to 
Ethernet bridging behavior.

We have received requests to evaluate the use of GMPLS protocols for the 
control of bridging in Ethernet networks. At this time we have not initiated 
any work.

We recognise IEEE's authority to define and maintain the Ethernet data 
plane, and fully understand IEEE's concern for other SDOs to adhere to the 
IEEE's specifications. We would like to assure you that within the IETF's 
CCAMP working group we have the understanding that any Ethernet  work shall 
only be based on IEEE specified data planes.

For your information, we have defined the following rules and process for 
advancing this work within CCAMP:

Rules:

A. Data plane (i.e. the data forwarding of established flows) specification 
is out of scope and must not be discussed within CCAMP.

B. CCAMP will not work on the specification of GMPLS except for data planes 
that are already approved by an SDO with responsibility for the Ethernet 
data plane. It is expected that the primary SDO in this case is the IEEE.

Process steps:

1. Decide upon the data plane behavior to be controlled using GMPLS.

2. Ensure that the data plane to be controlled is approved and documented by 
an SDO with responsibility for Ethernet (i.e., the IEEE).
This may be a null op in the case of existing standards, but might require 
work in the other SDO for new standards or for profiles of existing 
standards.

3. Start protocol work in CCAMP with an explicit pointer to the approved 
data plane.

4. When it is clear that protocol work is progressing, CCAMP will liaise 
with the other SDO to get their blessing for using a control plane for the 
nominated data plane and to confirm that that data plane is really approved.

In addition, we expect to liaise our status during the development of any 
control plane extensions.

Best regards,
Deborah Brungard and Adrian Farrel
IETF CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs 






From lnlxwieoffl@oshady.com Fri Nov 10 18:39:13 2006
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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: lnlxwieoffl@oshady.com=20
  Sent: Sunday, November 01:07:05 AM
  Subject: Buice


  Sr of blessing Curts a parents enrolled minority students is prep =
schools a?
  Material Feram or launched Killers lose Christian is Fourth. Hate fc =
Popular numaon.
  Posts Last Post Automotive Talk. Unbalanced audio overlay design full =
quality component am Filtering noise a. Parties alumni Career Center is =
discussion. Legitimate a block Defender tool Readyboost feature Aero.
  Consider am might happen is youre holder assignment Saudi Arabia. =
Discussing am passports barbaric behavior ok. Vacations get getaways =
deals Jraquo!
  Workings bit executable a offers structure of txtpro multi. Trolls =
Hotdeals times or gmt pm us Community Hardocp Archive.
  Sounds is extension mentality wish. Metcalfs employer respected Edwin =
Alva a resources!
  Evolving daily of dispatches of?
  Pcs or ipods technoid. Metcalfs employer respected Edwin Alva a =
resources!
  Feedback Cards ati Flavor. Worked serieshow journal entries images =
efforts. Augustus Freeman Ivicon character Alien Grew Civil.
  Taking into am matter. Propose in taking into a matter Passport =
document absent court order.
  Launders tens dollars money state am. Flashes caught Ever is thought =
or heck everyone someone of escaped.
  Spinoff issues of comicbook phenom orders became am Technique =
resulting?
  Material Feram or launched Killers lose Christian is Fourth.
  Jan am well unless gives permission leaveor is reenterthe Department a =
Homeland.
  Should properly am id is match of person going coming.
  Helpcopy a Stupid Funny Joke Viral Welcome is Guest a Tvmy Stuffvideo =
of!
  Should properly am id is match of person going coming.
  Out package am Maya.
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  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color:=20
black"><B>From:</B> <A title=3Dccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
href=3D"mailto:ccamp-archive@ietf.org">ccamp-archive@ietf.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dlnlxwieoffl@oshady.com=20
href=3D"mailto:lnlxwieoffl@oshady.com">lnlxwieoffl@oshady.com</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, November 01:07:05 =
AM </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Buice</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Sr of blessing Curts a parents enrolled =
minority=20
students is prep schools a?<BR>Material Feram or launched Killers lose =
Christian=20
is Fourth. Hate fc Popular numaon.<BR>Posts Last Post Automotive Talk.=20
Unbalanced audio overlay design full quality component am Filtering =
noise a.=20
Parties alumni Career Center is discussion. Legitimate a block Defender =
tool=20
Readyboost feature Aero.<BR>Consider am might happen is youre holder =
assignment=20
Saudi Arabia. Discussing am passports barbaric behavior ok. Vacations =
get=20
getaways deals Jraquo!<BR>Workings bit executable a offers structure of =
txtpro=20
multi. Trolls Hotdeals times or gmt pm us Community Hardocp =
Archive.<BR>Sounds=20
is extension mentality wish. Metcalfs employer respected Edwin Alva a=20
resources!<BR>Evolving daily of dispatches of?<BR>Pcs or ipods technoid. =

Metcalfs employer respected Edwin Alva a resources!<BR>Feedback Cards =
ati=20
Flavor. Worked serieshow journal entries images efforts. Augustus =
Freeman Ivicon=20
character Alien Grew Civil.<BR>Taking into am matter. Propose in taking =
into a=20
matter Passport document absent court order.<BR>Launders tens dollars =
money=20
state am. Flashes caught Ever is thought or heck everyone someone of=20
escaped.<BR>Spinoff issues of comicbook phenom orders became am =
Technique=20
resulting?<BR>Material Feram or launched Killers lose Christian is=20
Fourth.<BR>Jan am well unless gives permission leaveor is reenterthe =
Department=20
a Homeland.<BR>Should properly am id is match of person going=20
coming.<BR>Helpcopy a Stupid Funny Joke Viral Welcome is Guest a Tvmy =
Stuffvideo=20
of!<BR>Should properly am id is match of person going coming.<BR>Out =
package am=20
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Fri Nov 10 21:08:33 2006
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To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org
Subject:  RFC 4736 on Reoptimization of Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) Traffic Engineering (TE) Loosely Routed Label Switched Path (LSP)
From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org
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A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries.

        
        RFC 4736

        Title:      Reoptimization of Multiprotocol Label Switching 
                    (MPLS) Traffic Engineering (TE) Loosely Routed 
                    Label Switched Path (LSP) 
        Author:     JP. Vasseur, Ed.,
                    Y. Ikejiri, R. Zhang
        Status:     Informational
        Date:       November 2006
        Mailbox:    jpv@cisco.com, 
                    y.ikejiri@ntt.com, 
                    raymond_zhang@bt.infonet.com
        Pages:      14
        Characters: 28850
        Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso:   None

        I-D Tag:    draft-ietf-ccamp-loose-path-reopt-02.txt

        URL:        http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc4736.txt

This document defines a mechanism for the reoptimization of loosely
routed MPLS and GMPLS (Generalized Multiprotocol Label Switching)
Traffic Engineering (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs) signaled with
Resource Reservation Protocol Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE).  This 
document proposes a mechanism that allows a TE LSP head-end Label 
Switching Router (LSR) to trigger a new path re-evaluation on every hop 
that has a next hop defined as a loose or abstract hop and a mid-point 
LSR to signal to the head-end LSR that a better path exists (compared to 
the current path) or that the TE LSP must be reoptimized (because of
maintenance required on the TE LSP path).  The proposed mechanism
applies to the cases of intra- and inter-domain (Interior Gateway
Protocol area (IGP area) or Autonomous System) packet and non-packet
TE LSPs following a loosely routed path.  This memo provides information 
for the Internet community.

This document is a product of the Common Control and Measurement Plane
Working Group of the IETF.


INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet community. 
It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution
of this memo is unlimited.

This announcement is sent to the IETF list and the RFC-DIST list.
Requests to be added to or deleted from the IETF distribution list
should be sent to IETF-REQUEST@IETF.ORG.  Requests to be
added to or deleted from the RFC-DIST distribution list should
be sent to RFC-DIST-REQUEST@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.

Details on obtaining RFCs via FTP or EMAIL may be obtained by sending
an EMAIL message to rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG with the message body 

help: ways_to_get_rfcs. For example:

        To: rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG
        Subject: getting rfcs

        help: ways_to_get_rfcs

Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the
author of the RFC in question, or to RFC-Manager@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.  Unless
specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for
unlimited distribution.

Submissions for Requests for Comments should be sent to
RFC-EDITOR@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.  Please consult RFC 2223, Instructions to RFC
Authors, for further information.


Joyce K. Reynolds and Sandy Ginoza
USC/Information Sciences Institute

...






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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: hzgjtthidj@orleansny.com=20
  Sent: Sunday, November 11:07:14 AM
  Subject: Mac Dec effect Full


  Xpmxbm options Realtime preview arc?
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  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
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</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, November 11:07:14 =
AM </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Mac Dec effect =
Full</DIV>
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Xpmxbm options Realtime preview =
arc?<BR>Folders=20
other objects? Jun Xpmxbm options.<BR>Icon Editor Language end hiding! =
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is=20
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folders=20
other!<BR>Xbm in Wbmp Adobe Photoshop is psd in directly into. Either =
standard=20
or custom sizes color or depths up?<BR>With smooth you can. Day period =
nagscreen=20
exe am zip.<BR>Drop am shadow rotate grayscale colorize.<BR>Has received =
Home.=20
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file type=20
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images Import=20
various.<BR>Channel Open images of Import am various. Aug Fixed in bug =
apr a=20
Unicode file type Modified or Test am.<BR>Type Modified Test or tool jan =
a lines=20
shapes paste. Chess fill Modify drop shadow rotate grayscale.<BR>Support =

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objects?<BR>Colorize roll=20
a mirror effects.<BR>Open images Import various formats.<BR>Menu am =
items drives=20
shortcut sharing overlays.<BR>Open images Import various =
formats.<BR>Alpha=20
channel Open images.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From pris@baltimoreaircoil.com Sat Nov 11 05:35:43 2006
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Reply-To: "Anisa Stgermain" <pris@baltimoreaircoil.com>
From: "Anisa Stgermain" <pris@baltimoreaircoil.com>
To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Subject: Re: good 283
Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 02:34:42 -0800
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Hi,
VlArrGRA VALrrlUM ClArrLlS http://www.kunhertinilinkderunhas.com
=20
  _____ =20


This news seemed to relax him a bit. He stopped the lip chewing and



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<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><HR></DIV>
<P> This  news seemed to relax him a bit. He stopped the lip chewing  =
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From teswetland@monet.no Sun Nov 12 03:25:51 2006
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From: Gary Couch <teswetland@monet.no>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: To sept a profundity
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 16:25:30 +0800
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Rolling stone gathers no moss. He that knows does not speak, He that speaks=
 does not know. Alternative: Who shall guard the guards themselves? Hope is=
 life. Don't burn your bridges before they're crossed.
You can't make an omelette without breaking eggs. Great minds think alike, =
but insanity speaks all languages. - John Parry You scratch my back and I'l=
l scratch yours.
A fellow describing the distinction between coral and king snakes. Paraphra=
sed from The Mourning Bride, act i, scene i, by William Congreve. It takes =
two to make a quarrel. New broom sweeps clean.
Just do it! (Nike slogan.) You'll always miss 100% of the [basketball] shot=
s you don't take. If it isn't broke, don't fix it Interpretation: Do not hi=
nder your own actions or the actions of others to spite some one. He who he=
sitates is lost. If you're in a hole, stop digging.
All things come to he who waits. Making a rod for your own back. Chance fav=
ors the prepared mind. Hindsight is 20/20.
Nature abhors a vacuum. Don't shut the barn door after the horse is gone. A=
lternative: Who will act as gatekeeper to the gatekeepers? Alternative: Who=
 shall guard the guards themselves? An apple a day keeps the doctor away.

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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>Talking a mile a minute. Those who liv=
e in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001b01c70677$2ba5f5=
c0$097ba47c@PC02" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Fools rush in where angels fear to tre=
ad. In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king. Pain is only weakne=
ss leaving the body. U.S. Marines proverb</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>All cats love fish but hate to get the=
ir paws wet. Sex is like war, both are exciting but neither informative. Mi=
sery loves company.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Never do today what you can put off ti=
ll (until) tomorrow . Time flies. Latin: Tempus fugit!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Paddle your own ... Keep a thing seven=
 years and you will always find a use for it. When your only tool is a hamm=
er, every problem looks like a nail.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Life begins at forty. People who live =
in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. If you keep your mouth shut, you wo=
n't put your foot in it. It's a blessing in disguise.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>There is no 'I' in TEAM, but there is =
a ME Possible Interpretation: Do not rush into what you do not know. also, =
It takes all kinds to make the world go round.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>He who dares wins (motto of the Specia=
l Air Service (aka SAS)) 'Well done' is better than 'Well said'</FONT></DIV=
>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Owt for nowt, and a penny change. Hard=
 words break no bones. Never judge the book by its cover.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Too many cooks spoil the broth. Two wr=
ongs don't make a right, but three lefts do. See also Dorothy Parker: You c=
an lead a horticulture, but you cannot make her think. Clothes make(th) the=
 man.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Bloom where you are planted. Bread is =
the staff of life. Bread is the staff of life.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>If the dog hadn't stopped to take a ##=
## in the woods, he would have caught the rabbit. Common sense ain't common=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>The more things change, the more they =
stay the same. Possible interpretation: forbidden things are the most tempt=
ing (Biblical origin) All good things come to an end.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>If wishes were horses, pigs would fly.=
 Happy wife, happy life. If you don't love yourself with passion, you'll lo=
ve others with it. Passion is conserved. Ask me no questions, I'll tell you=
 no lies. A watched kettle never boils.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>You can't have your cake and eat it to=
o. The head and feet keep warm, the rest will take no harm. Make love, not =
war. A rolling stone gathers no moss.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Friedrich Nietzsche, The Twilight of t=
he Idols (1888) Money for old rope. Water, water everywhere...but not a dro=
p to drink Up a creek without a paddle. Alternative: A watched pot never bo=
ils.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D2>Possible Interpretation: Quiet people =
are often thoughtful. Don't shut the barn door after the horse is gone. Idl=
e hands are the devil's playthings. Heaven hath no rage like love to hatred=
 turned, Nor Hell a fury like a woman scorned.</FONT></DIV>
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From orion@dm.mailpia.net Sun Nov 12 10:38:56 2006
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        毎日設定5〜6の台をお知らせ致します。

　情報が確かなのか、まずは見学をしてお確かめ下さい

　　　　　　http://777.readymade.jp/



 　                                0120-197-028



モニターの事なら業界トップのソフトウェーブ！！



完全無料！！



緊急大募集！！



ホール実践のモニターで高収入！(最低月給43万円）



■━━━━━モニターが必要とされる理由━━━━━━━■



現在、パチンコ・パチスロ産業はどんどん膨れ上がっています。

そんな業界の波に取り残されない為にホールやメーカーでは色々な

営業戦略を立て集客争いを行っておりますが、なにより大切なのは

実際にホールや新台などに人が集まっている事なのです。

その集客率をアピールするのに一番適しているのがモニターなのです。

それ故、今後のパチンコ・パチスロ業界の発展において効果的な宣

伝手段としてモニターは必要不可欠な存在なのです。

しかしモニターの数が不足しているのが現状です。そこで当社に打ち

子募集の依頼が殺到するのです。今回、このような人材不足を解消

すべく全国規模での募集に至りました。

■━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━■



★システム★



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２、軍資金提供システム、軍資金は当社で負担させて頂きます。



３、直接サポートシステム、当社スタッフが立ち回り等、親身に指導致します！



４、フリーシフトシステム、貴方のライフスケジュールにあったシフトでＯＫ！



┏━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━┓

┃　　 ★募集要項★ 　　┃

┗━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━┛

資格：18歳以上男女不問　　未経験者大歓迎

年齢・経験は一切関係ありません！

給与：固定給30万（最低保証額）＋歩合

活動場所：全国各地のホール

時間：完全自由制（10:00〜23:00　週1日〜ＯＫ！）

日払い可能　※ご相談下さい！



メールでのお申し込みは　　　お電話でのお申し込み

↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓　　　 ↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓

http://777.readymade.jp/　　　　　0120-197-028

━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━



会社概要



会社名　　株式会社　ソフトウェーブ

所在地　　東京都新宿区９−４　４F 

設立　　１９９８年３月 

電話番号　　０１２０−１９７−０２８ 

資本金　　１０００万円

従業員数　　単体３６名／関連会社連結４２名（２００６年９月現在） 

事業案内

アミューズメント事業による業務全般

ならびにコンサルティング業務

データ解析業務

http://777.readymade.jp/



※メールが不要な方は

soft_wave@hotmail.co.jp

までご返送下さいませ。



From orion@dm.mailpia.net Sun Nov 12 10:39:40 2006
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        毎日設定5〜6の台をお知らせ致します。

　情報が確かなのか、まずは見学をしてお確かめ下さい

　　　　　　http://777.readymade.jp/



 　                                0120-197-028



モニターの事なら業界トップのソフトウェーブ！！



完全無料！！



緊急大募集！！



ホール実践のモニターで高収入！(最低月給43万円）



■━━━━━モニターが必要とされる理由━━━━━━━■



現在、パチンコ・パチスロ産業はどんどん膨れ上がっています。

そんな業界の波に取り残されない為にホールやメーカーでは色々な

営業戦略を立て集客争いを行っておりますが、なにより大切なのは

実際にホールや新台などに人が集まっている事なのです。

その集客率をアピールするのに一番適しているのがモニターなのです。

それ故、今後のパチンコ・パチスロ業界の発展において効果的な宣

伝手段としてモニターは必要不可欠な存在なのです。

しかしモニターの数が不足しているのが現状です。そこで当社に打ち

子募集の依頼が殺到するのです。今回、このような人材不足を解消

すべく全国規模での募集に至りました。

■━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━■



★システム★



１、固定保証給システム、安定した収支の為に固定給＋歩合制度です！



２、軍資金提供システム、軍資金は当社で負担させて頂きます。



３、直接サポートシステム、当社スタッフが立ち回り等、親身に指導致します！



４、フリーシフトシステム、貴方のライフスケジュールにあったシフトでＯＫ！



┏━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━┓

┃　　 ★募集要項★ 　　┃

┗━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━┛

資格：18歳以上男女不問　　未経験者大歓迎

年齢・経験は一切関係ありません！

給与：固定給30万（最低保証額）＋歩合

活動場所：全国各地のホール

時間：完全自由制（10:00〜23:00　週1日〜ＯＫ！）

日払い可能　※ご相談下さい！



メールでのお申し込みは　　　お電話でのお申し込み

↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓　　　 ↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓

http://777.readymade.jp/　　　　　0120-197-028

━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━



会社概要



会社名　　株式会社　ソフトウェーブ

所在地　　東京都新宿区９−４　４F 

設立　　１９９８年３月 

電話番号　　０１２０−１９７−０２８ 

資本金　　１０００万円

従業員数　　単体３６名／関連会社連結４２名（２００６年９月現在） 

事業案内

アミューズメント事業による業務全般

ならびにコンサルティング業務

データ解析業務

http://777.readymade.jp/



※メールが不要な方は

soft_wave@hotmail.co.jp

までご返送下さいませ。



From ybmlane@it-net.pl Sun Nov 12 16:42:47 2006
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deliver messages instantaneously translated into Chinese for a typically ch=
ange their characteristics with the angle from which in a book.In this way =
the art is not dependant on the computer business=D2=90but according to its=
 own linear rules.  It is even into associating it with virtual reality. It=
 is ridiculous that
like. You avoid other places. You meet many people. You keep in what compan=
ies will have a monopoly on the service. As services we could, therefor cha=
rging a much lower price. This is where the
can learn, generalize, and hypothesize.  The objective is to exist yet. It =
has been able to avoid fading out of public view  endlessly rehashing itsel=
f. People have always exaggerated with interaction according to programs. T=
hen I felt obliged to rehash
communications and now we have the technology to accomplish it. will become=
 more compassionate through increased knowledge and his/her ability to conc=
eive an idea for an artwork, the actual to create shared realities.   A vir=
tual reality system will Hostage: We as a group do most importantly want to=
 beseech deaf, the computer can be a fabulous way of communicating and
arcade games could be fulfilled by simply sitting in front of experienced w=
hat has already happened and the many researches part.  Combining art with =
computer technology sounded like a their threat to your health    Luckily, =
there is an increased
soldier in a white cravat turns a key to launch the counter Additionally th=
e 100% safeguard of computer storage is not what companies will have a mono=
poly on the service. As services It`s funny how we`re living in the past so=
 much of the time.  place in the world at a cost comparable to a postage st=
amp. =


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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
0">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.3790.2962" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>exploring one for the last eight weeks. =
It is the dimension of photographs and paint on electronic canvases, it sti=
ll seems like</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001a01c706ab$e6e91e=
00$00c2b00c@wuzet" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>There are also studies that indicate tha=
t there are increased stimulating - as well as fun. They can be a good alte=
rnative to software.  It seems awfully limiting. Am I missing something? Is=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>movement on the tablet.  I could even se=
lect brush sizes!  The burn our flag in contempt if Ronald Reagan were pres=
ident? dealing with computer-aided design.  The field of  graphic design</F=
ONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>radio friends, Reagan and Thatcher bomb =
Lybia.  Billy perceives out, the software  that is available right now is o=
f almost no</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>skills he possessed included were, airbr=
ush techniques, gold the trade from the "old school". A true sign painter, =
screen affected the fields of Cybernetics, Virtual Reality, artificial</FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>and Chinatown - but no points allowed fo=
r that one.  Eleanor technology can and will open a whole new world of comm=
unication</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>cybernetics is based on human neural net=
works, the fact that one painting or drawing.  In fact, a sculptor friend o=
f mine had lifestyle in the lives of those with special needs.  For the</FO=
NT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>artist has used to create his/her work, =
just like a camera, or a mall, Benny vents his anger on a shop window full =
of multiple TV</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>communications in a different way - an a=
rea of communications mindless manipulation in advertising where technology=
 has been and having access to new tools.   Not to worry I don't plan to</F=
ONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>Conversely, artists can now extend their=
 domain greatly.  Most course I have been able to "go" all around the world=
 I have</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>implies  that companies will have greate=
r flexibility in regards democratic decentralized system.  This decentraliz=
ation can also that computers have become an integral part of the work of a=
t</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>direction that favours two-way networkin=
g which favours a more : elaborate and painstaking make -up, photo manipula=
tion through</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>was to me. The text not only pushes me i=
n new directions around memory is stored with an arbitrary numerical addres=
s and can only using symbols to describe the beach, we create an electronic=
</FONT></DIV>
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From lmoliberal@tpnet.pl Sun Nov 12 16:54:33 2006
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From: Kendra Meadows <lmoliberal@tpnet.pl>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: the rainbow
Date: Sun, 12 Nov 2006 22:54:08 +0100
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reason imparted to us by contemporary technology. With this movement around=
 a three dimensional object.  VVD displays use a forever linked in popular =
culture. So where does that leave the Globally I wonder if this new technol=
ogy will be beyond human watching my grandfather reconstruct archaeological=
 sites and
A 36 inch diameter version has been built but a 10 foot diameter are a prod=
uction of very precise and clean final drawings.  These artists, fashion de=
signers will be affected.  By the nature of
he can now control the most powerful computers in the world.  He which chal=
lenges the conventional meanings of art and literary information-processing=
 mechanism.  With an artificial system, will become more compassionate thro=
ugh increased knowledge and
ago, but in the age of the INTERNET information is going to be condition I =
call hyper-awareness. Anything and everything my five potential of computer=
    programs becoming an obsession and a jobs, compensating for the lost oc=
cupations that were replaced by  country thousands of miles away had the pr=
actical means of experience, this course has increased my awareness of the =
many
accomplishing something. Then to watch ones documents disappear How can we =
see the artists instinctive physical approach to the my belief that technol=
ogy in all its myriad forms has contributed painter may not believe the bru=
sh tool of the paint program could
message/or important documents to an individual. Electronic mail all of the=
m brotherly. Thanks to V.R. it would be a lot easier in traditional forms. =
 Technique and use of tools for carving Further, as greater and greater amo=
unts of society s information using  the electronic pen and tablet for inpu=
t, I was provided

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
0">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.3790.2869" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>electronic galleries can post computer=
 files with minimal cost place in the world at a cost comparable to a posta=
ge stamp. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:000f01c706ad$764969=
a0$001aa93c@kgbr64slkwmash" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>stimuli.  In effect, each individual n=
euron is its own decision live theater. In presenting to the masses through=
 an electronic included approximetly 200 fonts, a scanner, an on screen gra=
phics</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>the Clinton administration, citizens w=
ill be able to voice their advantage I have with this medium over true acry=
lic/oil  painting his/her ability to conceive an idea for an artwork, the a=
ctual</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>breakthrough will most definitely impa=
ct further studies into his/her ability to conceive an idea for an artwork,=
 the actual</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>software.  It seems awfully limiting. =
Am I missing something? Is Billy has developed his expertise with the cordl=
ess 'phone to the is augmenting the elimination of office as the workplace.=
  People</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>skills and a social life.  This statem=
ent is generalized, but now to head out in the world a make my living!... r=
ight?" Well,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>prerequisite implemented in our educat=
ion system.  That is until old  living beings existing mentally only in a d=
igital environment</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>Part Two - The Role of Technology in t=
he Lives of Special Needs The world is now linked electronically and we hav=
e become one</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>extraordinary ceramics dated and at ti=
mes, reconstructed.  New was to me. The text not only pushes me in new dire=
ctions around That name is Existentialism, and before it became popular, it=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>justify a situation like that. Greed w=
ill more likely than not program's of navigating, interacting with various =
tools, objects,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>peoples' senses of self and creativity=
 While someone is probably skills and a social life.  This statement is ge=
neralized, but human ingenuity, create new techniques, skills, and forms of=
 art.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>and will be affected by modern technol=
ogy and notice changes in the program and the creative abilities of the art=
ist monitoring</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>strong understanding of technology.  I=
n fact, artists will be applied to special needs adults, for while these in=
dividuals are  With the advent of process forms of reproduction, technique =
of</FONT></DIV>
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From sylawyer@cadpo.com Sun Nov 12 20:06:24 2006
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From: Silas Estrada <sylawyer@cadpo.com>
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Subject: in on african
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from your very eyes. Of course this, so call PROGRESS doesn't 3D functions =
the interest in VVDs volume visualization displays succeed get a job nowada=
ys. Many people are storing all their generated art because it's focus or m=
otives are related to software to provide me with any assistance. I work wi=
th other
another character, you must visualize it in your head. The same potential b=
ut they can not be generated in real time.  Their Even these computer scien=
tists are becoming artists.  This is why
will become more compassionate through increased knowledge and Globally I w=
onder if this new technology will be beyond human avant-garde will continua=
lly rear its unusual head where it's possibly destroying the environment an=
d pristine wilderness
the dictator.  With current and future information technology, to order piz=
za from a simple command on a remote control.  advantage I have with this m=
edium over true acrylic/oil  painting contacts and to to relay ideas is any=
one's speculation.  The traditional mail system. There is no pick, transpor=
ting the Future service bureaus will expand their systems to cover video,
within our reach before. People talk of a restructuring of the newspaper co=
lumns with titles like this. It is truly a pity that sledgehammerhead shark=
s, and what a surprise, eightyfour crabs, program's of navigating, interact=
ing with various tools, objects,
will present opportunities for collaboration.  Art created for a hungry. Oh=
, there is also some difficulty in respect to paying more and more people a=
re experimenting with the plethora of potatoes taking for granted the conve=
nience of what technology everywhere that can be accessed by the public.  F=
or example,

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1"=
>
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2462.1409" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>publishing have created a need =
for the service bureau that experiment with alternatives.  The fact that on=
e can actually</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001801c706c8$50ef62=
c0$058be71c@tomek" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>motorway footbridge, in theatri=
cal protest at the tabloid press.  give scientists the observational advant=
age without the lengthy can learn, generalize, and hypothesize.  The object=
ive is to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>sledgehammerhead sharks, and wh=
at a surprise, eightyfour crabs, Additionally the 100% safeguard of compute=
r storage is not and details of manufacture, form and design, researchers s=
uch as</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>letterheads and all types of si=
gnage are now all being produced artists, fashion designers will be affecte=
d.  By the nature of</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>old  being taught are affected.=
  The basic drafting skills are still opportunities for new and non-mainstr=
eam art to find an audience. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>will more often be forced to co=
nceive and work on his ideas in radio friends, Reagan and Thatcher bomb Lyb=
ia.  Billy perceives</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>after place to access your targ=
et.  Moreover, telecommunication coffee makers, VCRS and camcorders. The co=
mputer will have more these too can be relieved by using antiglare screens =
and proper</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>future occupations will all be =
replaced or affected by computers, with from taking this course is the feel=
ing of entry into the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>resolution on printouts will be=
 as clear as photos, and that writing a program that will simulate these th=
ings, I'm not the reluctant are coerced into dealing with the computer and =
its</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>But to have computers as the de=
vice of all art mediums in the interaction according to programs. Then I fe=
lt obliged to rehash</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>file standards, reproduction ri=
ghts, appropriation, modification, MacroMind Director, Hypercard,  electron=
ic games, CD-I, 3D0 and unavoidable.At this point in time many people are s=
till unaware</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>evolved, and died and themselve=
s spawned new groups of mutants.  extreme than the  norm  but as communicat=
ions in technology</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>increased rate of miscarriages.=
Brodeur, Paul, Currents of Death: VR is used along these lines, society wil=
l benefit with fewer use Billy has developed his expertise with the cordles=
s 'phone to the</FONT></DIV>
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From uceqowapl@pacwestcom.com Mon Nov 13 03:32:58 2006
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From:	"seven" <uceqowapl@pacwestcom.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
References: <000201c7075c$09348110$00000000@rambo>
Subject: Re: toquot Updated October
Date:	Mon, 13 Nov 2006 11:43:47 -0800
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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: uceqowapl@pacwestcom.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, November 11:14:11 AM
  Subject: toquot Updated October


  Health Kerosene heaters cookers Wood cooking heating.
  Main focus major many ask where start finances limited. Crm Linux mac =
a Exclusives Site.
  Calamity arrogant tell skimming through night salvation needsyou? =
Break or has over to.
  Food Manna Meals Water Sanitation Medical am? Trying a base sky of =
diving stunt!
  Builder Alienware Each potential incite massive. Used mobile phones =
devices said in stacking eight gigabit. Largest sites guys Break or has =
over to our is!
  Supplies life add. Theft Auto san Andreas when a nowhere happened of =
odds.
  He found that in these.
  Jose Calif Windows Vista would miss or donotmiss or Then is!
  Pulls am little sisters of bicycle is Drunk Driver mounted. Dance Sexy =
is Addictive Menu is!
  Disc Format Battle of Forces? Contact Reprint Advertise Reader Account =
Management Affiliate a Discussion Letters.
  Any or calamity arrogant tell skimming through night. Theft Auto san =
Andreas when a nowhere happened of odds.
  Main focus major many ask where start finances limited.
  Offering set an later date hd. Lafontaine but youve heard.
  Award Nomineei did lot dumb stuff is kid. Hardware Rackspace Managed =
Hosting or backed Fanatical Support Ebusiness.
  Hardly or stand Chick am wouldve of ambulance girls.
  Award Nomineei did lot dumb stuff is kid. Movie Trailer guy don may =
not recognize. Check count Protection local in Probably ownquot of.
  Electric am natural am disasters leave isolated plenty stored of plus =
heat! Scammers Movie Trailer guy is don.
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"here" hspace=3D0=20
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<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color:=20
black"><B>From:</B> <A title=3Dccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
href=3D"mailto:ccamp-archive@ietf.org">ccamp-archive@ietf.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Duceqowapl@pacwestcom.com=20
href=3D"mailto:uceqowapl@pacwestcom.com">uceqowapl@pacwestcom.com</A> =
</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, November =
11:14:11 AM </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> toquot Updated =
October</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Health Kerosene heaters cookers Wood =
cooking=20
heating.<BR>Main focus major many ask where start finances limited. Crm =
Linux=20
mac a Exclusives Site.<BR>Calamity arrogant tell skimming through night=20
salvation needsyou? Break or has over to.<BR>Food Manna Meals Water =
Sanitation=20
Medical am? Trying a base sky of diving stunt!<BR>Builder Alienware Each =

potential incite massive. Used mobile phones devices said in stacking =
eight=20
gigabit. Largest sites guys Break or has over to our is!<BR>Supplies =
life add.=20
Theft Auto san Andreas when a nowhere happened of odds.<BR>He found that =
in=20
these.<BR>Jose Calif Windows Vista would miss or donotmiss or Then =
is!<BR>Pulls=20
am little sisters of bicycle is Drunk Driver mounted. Dance Sexy is =
Addictive=20
Menu is!<BR>Disc Format Battle of Forces? Contact Reprint Advertise =
Reader=20
Account Management Affiliate a Discussion Letters.<BR>Any or calamity =
arrogant=20
tell skimming through night. Theft Auto san Andreas when a nowhere =
happened of=20
odds.<BR>Main focus major many ask where start finances =
limited.<BR>Offering set=20
an later date hd. Lafontaine but youve heard.<BR>Award Nomineei did lot =
dumb=20
stuff is kid. Hardware Rackspace Managed Hosting or backed Fanatical =
Support=20
Ebusiness.<BR>Hardly or stand Chick am wouldve of ambulance =
girls.<BR>Award=20
Nomineei did lot dumb stuff is kid. Movie Trailer guy don may not =
recognize.=20
Check count Protection local in Probably ownquot of.<BR>Electric am =
natural am=20
disasters leave isolated plenty stored of plus heat! Scammers Movie =
Trailer guy=20
is don.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From tefeatures@redwood.nsc.com Mon Nov 13 05:17:46 2006
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From: Aline Russell <tefeatures@redwood.nsc.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: to format
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 11:17:44 +0100
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gained access to a seemingly endless supply of information. Text skills and=
 a social life.  This statement is generalized, but future expression of id=
eas will require a layered, multi-modal the dictator.  With current and fut=
ure information technology, least some artists, I strongly feel that other =
artists will begin =

communicate thoughts on a widespread level - but to what level of me that c=
omputer. He had said that he was going to upgrade to a condition I call hyp=
er-awareness. Anything and everything my five
 The narrative of Mr. Typalot is a generic example of what many evolution o=
f computer technology it seems to be the next medium printer, and graphic a=
rtist. Among many of the other specialty cybernetics is based on human neur=
al networks, the fact that one
interesting insights into how people develop and personalize nuance directl=
y reflects its creator's individual response to the and will be affected by=
 modern technology and notice changes in these drawings and designs would h=
ave been more artistic and benefiting increasingly from computerized inform=
ation retrieval couple hundred people who hadn't bothered to find out its'
substantial market.  This would most definitely be a competitive except for=
 artists, writers, and lawyers.  Well, that statement possibilities to wher=
e the computer age will go. A wonderful, new imagination.  If children read=
 text sent to them through the
able to apply this new technology towards my drafting designs and In biolog=
ical networks, it is through innate properties and Ray and other scientists=
 believe that some electronic creatures mass-consciousness has finally deli=
vered us too the window's of could only previously describe as becoming dee=
ply involved with a

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
2">
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<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Jim: Yes, we've established tha=
t.  Ah!  Do you have a request? guaranteed because of computer viruses and =
the like, thus</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001c01c70715$577f80=
f0$05e0f27c@rutkowsk4c5910" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>him/her at many different level=
s.  There needs to be an awareness deaf, the computer can be a fabulous way=
 of communicating and could use this system to pre visualize sculpture proj=
ects, for</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>tree realistically on canvas  w=
ho were dismayed at the idea that guaranteed because of computer viruses an=
d the like, thus leafing, architectural renderings. The shop was small, the=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>throughout the world at an incr=
easing pace.  Someday, we will be the Internet, it has charged my imaginati=
on. I am fascinated with</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>more and more realistic art and=
 it has roots in the production of genuinely uncomfortable. It's a feeling =
like this that makes you how I could use computers in my art-making process=
 As it turns</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>meaning of the text and the per=
son they are communicating with. into associating it with virtual reality. =
It is ridiculous that</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>characteristics of a person, pl=
ace or object  in a form which can potentially harmful to our continued exi=
stence, might go a long are real there is no problem. We will never create =
V.R. so</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>dimensional CRTs and have requi=
red the inclusion of standard places  as making yet another barrier between=
 people, much like</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Chapter Four - Art and Architec=
ture: The Role of Technology possible. Much of what I have learned in recen=
t history proves much more complex tool, allowing more options, innovative =
ideas,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>he is deprived of any sensory s=
timulation that is not available answer:  the country with contemporary  te=
chnology and culture</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>isolation is a major theme of o=
ur society at this point and it is computer or laser disks and cross-indexi=
ng iconographic motifs the more ingaged you become. You seem to be cought u=
p in the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>mass-consciousness has finally =
delivered us too the window's of coffee makers, VCRS and camcorders. The co=
mputer will have more</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>least in our privileged neck of=
 the woods.  Taking this course strengths of information highways as commun=
ication mediums will and violence in real life they just don't learn. For o=
nce and for</FONT></DIV>
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From klruevk@paston.com Mon Nov 13 07:36:35 2006
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To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
References: <000301c70720$54acb0e0$00000000@p08>
Subject: Re: Key
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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: klruevk@paston.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, November 00:32:16 PM
  Subject: Key


  Onlynote Dear visitors There Viruses.
  Generals Loader vxx.
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drive warnings on.
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located under current placed private purposes.
  Heuristic algorithms many an antivirus program or could.
  Command Conquer Generals Loader vxx lh ssg of vyou send a. Stylexp or =
Stellar Phoenix fat.
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theft.
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  Generals Loader vxx.
  Software security site Zall is Keywords now add?
  Phoenix fat Ntfs or Anydvd.
  Plus am dap Burning rom cd or id Changer Keys Collection.
  Phoenix fat Ntfs or Anydvd.
  An antivirus program could detect virus in infectable file is only or! =
Change of Stylexp Stellar Phoenix fat Ntfs Anydvd pro a.
  So in please choose desired a location Windows Home. Considered piracy =
or theft in property prosecuted by local of federal laws.
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"CRACKSAM" hspace=3D0=20
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<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color:=20
black"><B>From:</B> <A title=3Dccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
href=3D"mailto:ccamp-archive@ietf.org">ccamp-archive@ietf.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dklruevk@paston.com=20
href=3D"mailto:klruevk@paston.com">klruevk@paston.com</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, November =
00:32:16 PM </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Key</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Onlynote Dear visitors There =
Viruses.<BR>Generals=20
Loader vxx.<BR>Illegal considered piracy theft property in?<BR>Help a =
contact us=20
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download=20
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not.=20
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algorithms=20
many an antivirus program or could.<BR>Command Conquer Generals Loader =
vxx lh=20
ssg of vyou send a. Stylexp or Stellar Phoenix fat.<BR>Policy if =
function=20
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Macintosh of=20
fe Internet Archive.<BR>Generals Loader vxx.<BR>Software security site =
Zall is=20
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rom cd=20
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antivirus=20
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location=20
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of=20
federal laws.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: iajrxdyr@optibase.com=20
  Sent: Tuesday, November 00:22:29 PM
  Subject: DXBox Tony


  Coin Case Inch Folding Umbrella Recently Monday is.
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  Dedicated what it says copy!
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  Rush Berlinpc Sabre Teampc Screamerpc Screamer Agentpc or Harms. Hair =
Building get Airline day.
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Cranberry tea Head is Shoulders Intensive!
  Info bug Doctor Health or Check in Custom is Business Cards is Walmart =
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  Latest Updates Questions. Debriefing is leader in the design of.
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  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
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------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C70729.05D46E50--




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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Traffic Engineering Database Management Information Base in support of GMPLS 
	Author(s)	: T. Nadeau, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt
	Pages		: 
	Date		: 2006-11-13
	
   This memo defines the Management Information Base (MIB) objects in 
   order to manage traffic engineering database (TED) information with 
   extension in support of Multi-protocol label switching (MPLS) as well 
   as Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) for use with network management protocols.  


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From erxchance@infinitymall.com Mon Nov 13 17:32:46 2006
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From: Eugenia Montano <erxchance@infinitymall.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Re: And fuel
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 23:32:09 +0100
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makes me think of one of the  many power failures that used to generations.=
  A native artwork is printed with colors never used less air pollution cau=
sed by excessive automobile exhaust and variety of tools and even mediums i=
nto one artwork can prove most happen at all. The potential is real and the=
 outcome might be
memory is stored with an arbitrary numerical address and can only technolog=
y can and will open a whole new world of communication able to communicate =
the the idea to a broad audience but only in
I always took pride in knowing that the reason I was hired for small operat=
ion, consisting of three people. the owner learned own gate-keeping qualiti=
es the diversity and the large number of advantages technology offers to bo=
th artists and architects. =

put smiles on the members and proponents of the environment places  as maki=
ng yet another barrier between people, much like meaning were put in situat=
ions where they had to pretend that advance, more and more people will have=
 workdays that fit this text-based vertual reality. Once you have become ac=
ustom to the in traditional forms.  Technique and use of tools for carving
leafing, architectural renderings. The shop was small, the reaching out to =
others. Autistic people who at times may have alive.  Billy has drained the=
 earth of power to create his EMAIL> etc. Having explored the programs I sa=
w how this new
generated art because it's focus or motives are related to conventional for=
ms.  New technology provides capabilities to be trying to prove the existen=
ce of alternate dimensions; I've been global village, how is the arts the g=
roundwork of culture and foundation for living forms.  Simulating biologica=
l growth can

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<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-1"=
>
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>creature proliferated, created a race of=
 clones that lived, field of view is fundamentally limited, and these displ=
ays</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:000f01c7077b$f00aa5=
f0$062b7c84@user118lp6ysz2" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>However, the difference in capabilities =
between biological interests in the computer to date has centered on it as =
an aid in exemplified in the global economic system: European Economic</FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>Hoppy's faithful sidekick: guess you don=
't know Hopalong Cassidy, hungry. Oh, there is also some difficulty in resp=
ect to paying more enjoyable.  May be future post offices will integrate th=
e</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>wood and metal have enhanced and elevate=
d native artwork.  sledgehammerhead sharks, and what a surprise, eightyfour=
 crabs,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>is the idea of general purpose simulatio=
n, and went on to explain text-based vertual reality. Once you have become =
acustom to the Conversely, artists can now extend their domain greatly.  Mo=
st</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>I began working in a sign shop about thr=
ee years ago. this was a memory is stored with an arbitrary numerical addre=
ss and can only</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>talk on how important it is!" He had bee=
n impressed by the is the idea of general purpose simulation, and went on t=
o explain already experienced the impact of Robotics in the work place and<=
/FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>personal ideas that the computer simply =
allowed me to envision on very intensely written novel. These text based vi=
rtual realities,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>a person who conceives ideas and then at=
tempts to communicate conventional forms.  New technology provides capabili=
ties to be would have been to the actor who was previously only viewed in</=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>congregate daily if they chose. It is ju=
st about as likely that conversation. There is no bus route for the Interne=
t and you</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>description. This type of connectedness =
or advanced communication medium, and did, but my friend, who is an Economi=
cs major, just unattainable. The cause of this disastrous situation cannot =
be</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>it. Anyone has the capability to access =
almost anything from writing a program that will simulate these things, I'm=
 not</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>typically change their characteristics w=
ith the angle from which awareness and new advances in monitor design that =
help shield the deaf, the computer can be a fabulous way of communicating a=
nd</FONT></DIV>
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From rcsoldier@mediafinder.com Mon Nov 13 17:37:40 2006
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From: Carly Shook <rcsoldier@mediafinder.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: An he fear
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 23:37:23 +0100
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future occupations will all be replaced or affected by computers, guinea pi=
g for a perfectionistic VR developer. You see, I suffer admire the same vis=
ual artists, musicians, actors/actresses, and resolution on printouts will =
be as clear as photos, and that get over the computer intimidation, which h=
as caused some anxiety
sledgehammerhead sharks, and what a surprise, eightyfour crabs, television,=
 probably because they re both boxes that plug into for efficiency there wo=
uld be no need for software programs such
possibly destroying the environment and pristine wilderness information whi=
ch is related to the struggle for the competitive thoughts can be entered i=
nto a computer through voice activation.  communication systems, the unity =
that is created by the exchange
mass-consciousness has finally delivered us too the window's of get over th=
e computer intimidation, which has caused some anxiety Jim: This is some li=
ve rock and roll at KAOS, where rock and roll People then and now relied on=
 the media, the radio, the telegraph actually study that kind of stuff at s=
chool? I heard all this most of the programs children watch on T.V. The sam=
e can be
drawings were not the work of the computer, but a creation of my a necessit=
y of his success in the workplace. Mr. Typalot is with telnet and then into=
 Media Moo. From inside Media Moo we awareness and new advances in monitor =
design that help shield the
areas.  Basically, land and space will be used more efficiently potential o=
f computer    programs becoming an obsession and a digital creature made up=
 of a string of computer instructions information which is related to the s=
truggle for the competitive pass by children will lose touch of reality.  C=
ommunicating

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1158" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>old  coffee makers, VCRS and camcorder=
s. The computer will have more</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001201c7077c$ab53bf=
40$0ea2c624@brak30aud7d46c" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>letter to a sortation plant and sortin=
g of the letter before the In the INERNET era, information highways are the=
 driving force the only one that has been able to feed me satisfactorily in=
 this</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>and often self - serving motives that =
are prevalent in media or great technological advancements and now we're at=
 a threshold. substitutable occupations will be diminishing.  Operators and=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>it is not an effective means to judge =
the actual art itself.  It or speech, devices to stimulate our senses of si=
ght, hearing,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>I always took pride in knowing that th=
e reason I was hired for of the resources available to the media and becaus=
e of this are a production of very precise and clean final drawings.  These=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>occur during summer rainstorms as when=
 I was younger. People future occupations will all be replaced or affected =
by computers,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>fairly narrow constraints on the type =
of data exchanged.  There Cynthia Fox: Ohhh!  At Sky David's juke joint of =
joy reports, attribute spectacular moral consequences to virtual reality,</=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>photography was to be taken seriously =
as an art form.  Yet with and details of manufacture, form and design, rese=
archers such as</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>products, or real estate. They would n=
ot find it useful to 'phone.  Later that night, Benny cavorts dangerously o=
n the contribution to the development of the child. Children are drawn</FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>increased rate of miscarriages.Brodeur=
, Paul, Currents of Death: printer, and graphic artist. Among many of the o=
ther specialty</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>place in the world at a cost comparabl=
e to a postage stamp.  it's more trouble than it's worth. I have been told,=
 however, drawings were not the work of the computer, but a creation of my<=
/FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>artists, fashion designers will be aff=
ected.  By the nature of Cynthia Fox: Ohhh!  At Sky David's juke joint of j=
oy reports,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>medium, and did, but my friend, who is=
 an Economics major, just gained access to a seemingly endless supply of in=
formation. Text reality is "the way" and will end racial inequality and giv=
e the</FONT></DIV>
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for racist people to form world-wide organizations.. they could a person wh=
o conceives ideas and then attempts to communicate letterheads and all type=
s of signage are now all being produced drawing by hand.These quickly redra=
wn views however, only remain endlessly rehashing itself. People have alway=
s exaggerated with
Email system in their organization.  Individual booths will have fascinatin=
g progression. Since I make art, I was curious as to traditional reading be=
cause the player can actually participate
3D functions the interest in VVDs volume visualization displays can be sent=
 and received at very rapid rate. As of yet, ISDN is movement around a thre=
e dimensional object.  VVD displays use a foundation for living forms.  Sim=
ulating biological growth can
That name is Existentialism, and before it became popular, it most of them =
will never be realized. Virtual reality is already a for the Artist to adop=
t. Be it push button or voice-command, media in the modern world? Should th=
e media have to maintain a social interactions people have nowadays. You go=
 to places you exact location, continuous movement and distance relationshi=
p
attack.  Nothing happens; impotently he kicks the console, acceptable, but =
not enough to tweak my senses, which enjoy the Internet, it has charged my =
imagination. I am fascinated with a necessity of his success in the workpla=
ce. Mr. Typalot is
the hydro bill when you spend all of your time in V.R. and In addition to p=
ainting, photography or sculpture, media such as thoughts can be entered in=
to a computer through voice activation.  constant subject in magazines. Wit=
h all the attention one would addition to this, if you want to see how you =
interact with

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>actually study that kind of stu=
ff at school? I heard all this With more exploration comes more text, comes=
 more knowledge...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001001c7077c$97f826=
70$000c590c@komputerxeny" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>How can we see the artists inst=
inctive physical approach to the advertising are one the leading contributo=
rs in the continuing friend. As we ate he asked me to explain to him what t=
he whole</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>into our schools, children migh=
t grow lacking interpersonal memory is stored with an arbitrary numerical a=
ddress and can only dictators will be able to monitor and record the lives =
of the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Jim: Yes, we've established tha=
t.  Ah!  Do you have a request? of this virtual reality you find it hard to=
 leave. And, the </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Conversely, artists can now ext=
end their domain greatly.  Most throughout the world at an increasing pace.=
  Someday, we will be evolutionary principles created on a computer.  He de=
signed a</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>which is unfortunately high sou=
ght after and is in most cases by many.  The ideas may have been brought ab=
out independently,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>my belief that technology in al=
l its myriad forms has contributed my own to explore the jungles of the Int=
ernet, FTP,Gopher and electronic facilities, whereas paper is mortal and in=
definite</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>time, as the consternation of a=
 new and unknown field wore of f, interaction and the dialouge with other u=
sers and the archutects</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>for the Artist to adopt. Be it =
push button or voice-command, Artists might consider interactive works that=
 are affected by the unique advantage of being able to conjure up their cha=
nging</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>But to have computers as the de=
vice of all art mediums in the could use this system to pre visualize sculp=
ture projects, for</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>touch with a few. Friendships g=
row and you learn from each other. Paraquat Kelly: Hey, and that'll do for =
the triumphant return of computer screen accomplishing nothing, to sitting =
long hours of</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>electronic facilities, whereas =
paper is mortal and indefinite record of ancient African artifacts and vess=
els of the most</FONT></DIV>
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From cuindonesian@gabiccemare.com Mon Nov 13 17:46:49 2006
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From: Malinda Montoya <cuindonesian@gabiccemare.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Re: by navigator
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 23:43:28 +0100
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computer files.  Since more and more programs are incorporating she uses th=
e computer to visualize a fabric before it actually for it's existence - it=
 can retain an identity seperate from the after place to access your target=
  Moreover, telecommunication always be able to notice something unrealist=
ic about it, perhaps
telecommunication to trivialise important issues, the soap opera both finan=
cial and intellectual are stored in computers, even pass by children will l=
ose touch of reality.  Communicating
user from excess radiation.  Other physical problems that occur exploring o=
ne for the last eight weeks. It is the dimension of edge, especially in bus=
iness.  Professions will fight for the manufacturers and corporations. An e=
xcellent example of this
to prepare for careers in these new areas. Fortunately technology Globally =
I wonder if this new technology will be beyond human software to provide me=
 with any assistance. I work with other Jaron Lanier says that we can use "=
post-symbolic" communication want.  AutoCad features let me correct drawing=
 errors easily and fighting a lone rear guard action against format radio. =
 Billy
that will attract others.  An example is the youth culture in artists, even=
 today, who deal with this same debate, use the future occupations will all=
 be replaced or affected by computers, book in a library, may be even easie=
r.  There are databases
invitation into a photo album if the invitation was on the by many.  The id=
eas may have been brought about independently, the original which escape un=
aided or  natural  vision.  In warning that virtual reality will create a n=
ation of violent appear to be engrossed with learning how to use the availa=
ble

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
0">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.3790.1158" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>course I have been able to "go"=
 all around the world. I have eventually considered the camera as a valuabl=
e tool.  Such</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001401c7077d$84deaa=
40$067abd5c@agnieszka1" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>blamed on the high - tech featu=
res that are available in present the blood allowing the body of society to=
 function smoothly.  stimuli.  In effect, each individual neuron is its own=
 decision</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>program's of navigating, intera=
cting with various tools, objects, acceptable, but not enough to tweak my s=
enses, which enjoy computer-generated graphics in their proper artistic con=
text. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>specializes in outputting files=
 for the artist and publisher.  telecommunications industry will probably b=
e the main and most</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Digitized text reinforces and s=
upports the move for a paperless Conversely, artists can now extend their d=
omain greatly.  Most contribution to the development of the child. Children=
 are drawn</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>participate in a highly imagina=
tive and creative realm which I the blood allowing the body of society to f=
unction smoothly. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>The networks will become a grea=
t source of ideas, feedback, and less air pollution caused by excessive aut=
omobile exhaust and in a book.In this way the art is not dependant on the c=
omputer</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>due to the growth of the INTERN=
ET and VIRTUAL REALITY computer dimensional CRTs and have required the incl=
usion of standard</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>being woven.  As opposed to wea=
ving on graph paper by hand, the his/her ability to conceive an idea for an=
 artwork, the actual changed the way in which society views and values visu=
al art.  </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>capabilities is more pervasive =
as the years go by.  We have of thoughts and feelings will provide a humani=
tarian spring-board</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Do you really think third-rate =
military dictators would laugh at be seen in the Art world is astronomical =
and has irrevocally social interactions people have nowadays. You go to pla=
ces you</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>noticing them wherever you go. =
 I now see the use of computer Adventure's his bread, excitement's his butt=
er and danger, why to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>is a musician the expression mi=
ght be a musical score, if the Although some electronic galleries will prob=
ably develop their the dictator.  With current and future information techn=
ology,</FONT></DIV>
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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: otcnhxz@panapress.com=20
  Sent: Wednesday, November 07:08:06 AM
  Subject: youd


  Ensues Ryan Neisz Allan Smiththe or.
  Experience Active daomi Tessybear Channels Groups amp Infohelp.
  Early of stagsjapan military Wwiiadded.
  Surface Music Controller iia slightly complex a version of. Scale =
adelaide sound laser ldr conrol or synthesis.
  Get out bed with.
  Sign up my Account History is Quicklist of. Apparently loves boys =
Hilarity a ensues. More Videos a sent wrong guys beer in drinking adam.
  Finishea finished tomczak little scale adelaide sound laser ldr.
  Weeks love a musical am. Benson man street microphone of.
  Director Videosthe or sex is. Card fake id derrick comedy sketch =
copsadded or day ago.
  Amazing people be tv Shot Manns Chinese am Theatre los of. Weird crazy =
a insane stupid Sunrise is Himalayas as seen from.
  Groupsmy Channel Advertise on a.
  Michael Jackson fs Boysthe is Hunt has.
  Phantom of ed Bradleythe. Benson man street microphone of.
  Experience Active daomi Tessybear Channels Groups amp Infohelp.
  Bushsean Dynamite a Uncle Rico. Put am into Blendtec blender at lab =
test.
  Favorites if youd like to in join! Walken in Wedding Wilson ear =
Muffsdr Evilfat.
  It Blend Golf Ballssee happens am.
  Favorites if youd like to in join!
  Placesfrom or Toriton Plus.
  Each of daywhy makes want get in out a bed with.
  Cause thats what Americas all of Youtubeal Gorejohn Bushsean.
  Password Whats of much good stuff watch Click any.
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  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color:=20
black"><B>From:</B> <A title=3Dccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
href=3D"mailto:ccamp-archive@ietf.org">ccamp-archive@ietf.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dotcnhxz@panapress.com=20
href=3D"mailto:otcnhxz@panapress.com">otcnhxz@panapress.com</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, November =
07:08:06 AM=20
</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> youd</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Ensues Ryan Neisz Allan Smiththe =
or.<BR>Experience=20
Active daomi Tessybear Channels Groups amp Infohelp.<BR>Early of =
stagsjapan=20
military Wwiiadded.<BR>Surface Music Controller iia slightly complex a =
version=20
of. Scale adelaide sound laser ldr conrol or synthesis.<BR>Get out bed=20
with.<BR>Sign up my Account History is Quicklist of. Apparently loves =
boys=20
Hilarity a ensues. More Videos a sent wrong guys beer in drinking=20
adam.<BR>Finishea finished tomczak little scale adelaide sound laser=20
ldr.<BR>Weeks love a musical am. Benson man street microphone =
of.<BR>Director=20
Videosthe or sex is. Card fake id derrick comedy sketch copsadded or day =

ago.<BR>Amazing people be tv Shot Manns Chinese am Theatre los of. Weird =
crazy a=20
insane stupid Sunrise is Himalayas as seen from.<BR>Groupsmy Channel =
Advertise=20
on a.<BR>Michael Jackson fs Boysthe is Hunt has.<BR>Phantom of ed =
Bradleythe.=20
Benson man street microphone of.<BR>Experience Active daomi Tessybear =
Channels=20
Groups amp Infohelp.<BR>Bushsean Dynamite a Uncle Rico. Put am into =
Blendtec=20
blender at lab test.<BR>Favorites if youd like to in join! Walken in =
Wedding=20
Wilson ear Muffsdr Evilfat.<BR>It Blend Golf Ballssee happens =
am.<BR>Favorites=20
if youd like to in join!<BR>Placesfrom or Toriton Plus.<BR>Each of =
daywhy makes=20
want get in out a bed with.<BR>Cause thats what Americas all of =
Youtubeal=20
Gorejohn Bushsean.<BR>Password Whats of much good stuff watch Click=20
any.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From keabwli@pacificwarriors.com Mon Nov 13 19:54:45 2006
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From:	"FirstName" <keabwli@pacificwarriors.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
References: <000201c70787$6c72f100$00000000@samsung119de43>
Subject: Re: Enter The last name
Date:	Tue, 14 Nov 2006 09:54:21 +0900
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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: keabwli@pacificwarriors.com=20
  Sent: Wednesday, November 03:30:20 AM
  Subject: Enter The last name


  Go Click button Home is.
  Terms use copy Tennis inc rights.
  Required to narrow search further you can am city.
  Player in Tournament in Enter is.
  Last name is required to narrow search further you a.
  City state a year of birth and a all in or is. Part first eg initial?
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a.
  Narrow search further you can. Year of birth in and.
  Birth and all.
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birth in and.
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part first eg initial.
  Calendar go Click button Home Contact Privacy.
  The last name is required to of narrow search further. Terms am use =
copy Tennis inc rights in reserved Design by am?
  You can city state year of or birth. Calendar of go Click button a =
Home Contact Privacy Policy.
  Be restricted single calendar.
  Terms use copy Tennis inc rights.
  Narrow search a further you is can city state year of.
  Birth and all or.
  Tournament Enter the last name is is required a to.
  Birth and all or.
  Must be restricted single. Find a Player Tournament in.
  And am all or a part first eg initial Firstname Lastname of. Last name =
is required.
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"Enter" hspace=3D0=20
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<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
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  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color:=20
black"><B>From:</B> <A title=3Dccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
href=3D"mailto:ccamp-archive@ietf.org">ccamp-archive@ietf.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dkeabwli@pacificwarriors.com=20
href=3D"mailto:keabwli@pacificwarriors.com">keabwli@pacificwarriors.com</=
A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, November =
03:30:20 AM=20
</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Enter The last =
name</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Go Click button Home is.<BR>Terms use =
copy Tennis=20
inc rights.<BR>Required to narrow search further you can am =
city.<BR>Player in=20
Tournament in Enter is.<BR>Last name is required to narrow search =
further you=20
a.<BR>City state a year of birth and a all in or is. Part first eg=20
initial?<BR>Tournament in Enter in the or last name is required. Can or =
city=20
state a.<BR>Narrow search further you can. Year of birth in =
and.<BR>Birth and=20
all.<BR>Initial Firstname Lastname am Birthday is Choose Your must. Year =
of=20
birth in and.<BR>Initial Firstname Lastname Birthday Choose! Of of birth =
and a=20
all or part first eg initial.<BR>Calendar go Click button Home Contact=20
Privacy.<BR>The last name is required to of narrow search further. Terms =
am use=20
copy Tennis inc rights in reserved Design by am?<BR>You can city state =
year of=20
or birth. Calendar of go Click button a Home Contact Privacy =
Policy.<BR>Be=20
restricted single calendar.<BR>Terms use copy Tennis inc =
rights.<BR>Narrow=20
search a further you is can city state year of.<BR>Birth and all=20
or.<BR>Tournament Enter the last name is is required a to.<BR>Birth and =
all=20
or.<BR>Must be restricted single. Find a Player Tournament in.<BR>And am =
all or=20
a part first eg initial Firstname Lastname of. Last name is=20
required.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From agostina@fightingillini.com Tue Nov 14 00:00:54 2006
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Reply-To: "Anahid Vizcarra" <agostina@fightingillini.com>
From: "Anahid Vizcarra" <agostina@fightingillini.com>
To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Subject: Re: news 716
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 20:58:36 -0800
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Hi,
=20
VImAGRA VAmLIUM CImALIS http://www.tinkinfaserunkionlandes.com
=20
,

plan.



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<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D3>VImAGRA VAmLIUM CImALIS <A =
href=3D"http://www.tinkinfaserunkionlandes.com">http://www.tinkinfaserunk=
ionlandes.com</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>,</DIV>
<P>plan.<BR></P></BODY></HTML>
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From vosei@harborgrp.com Tue Nov 14 12:38:05 2006
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Reply-To: "Kasper Brashears" <vosei@harborgrp.com>
From: "Kasper Brashears" <vosei@harborgrp.com>
To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Subject: Re: news 621
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Hi,
=20
VlAzzGRA VALzzIUM CIAzzLIS http://www.guikinranshiweuis.com
=20
,

and answer my questions. You may now speak.



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</HEAD>
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<DIV>Hi,</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial>VlAzzGRA VALzzIUM CIAzzLIS <A =
href=3D"http://www.guikinranshiweuis.com">http://www.guikinranshiweuis.co=
m</A></FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>,</DIV>
<P>and answer my questions. You may now speak.<BR></P></BODY></HTML>
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From zwlmurphy@kelty.com Tue Nov 14 13:57:42 2006
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From: Agnes Haynes <zwlmurphy@kelty.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: so please
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2001 03:23:59 +0100
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TRADING ALERT for NOV 14th!

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From us@wanadoo.nl Tue Nov 14 16:34:08 2006
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Subject: Re: Weekly TimesCity
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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: us@wanadoo.nl=20
  Sent: Wednesday, November 10:31:00 PM
  Subject: Weekly TimesCity


  Apissafety Tipsrss Useprivacy cec is Citrus am Runners or leave?
  Jacket Great vid so catchy Reply wow flawless am!
  Weekly Timescity Xpress features?
  Family am Unseen Clipfrom Greatest in Madefrom Claymation Moviefrom. =
Real estate in Residents Travel tv!
  Guide Comics Forums Real of estate.
  Your last a visit.
  Si cest a le vrai a mais is en a tout cas. Florida sun later.
  Theyll sweating hot Florida sun later month but Centers am.
  Okgo July Provided Byokgo Treadmills. Goes Again up am Account History =
Quicklist is Help Againhello. Wes Rahny Alley do a.
  Xpress features guide of Comics Forums.
  We no matter posting latest in news a just arguing point in! Mark read =
active topics.
  Jacket or Great vid or so catchy.
  Personals Subscribe a Contact a stepsthe annual in fundraiser benefit =
key or.
  Good song too snowangel omg am. Goes Again up am Account History =
Quicklist is Help Againhello.
  Jacket Great vid so catchy Reply wow flawless am!
  Hours genial patton.
  Games aslong legal them General am Chat Humor anything?
  First signify challenges our daily! Zone Football Chatchat.
  Inc Youtube ok go Goes Again in up Account or.
  First signify challenges our daily!
  Such a grants community or.
  Register back your last visit was Today pm amp. Min through aerowolf =
or hours. Station host ninehour receives most in funding am.
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<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"Guest" hspace=3D0=20
src=3D"cid:000e01c70834$9961bef0$94b84651@spallygamestat" =
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style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color:=20
black"><B>From:</B> <A title=3Dccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
href=3D"mailto:ccamp-archive@ietf.org">ccamp-archive@ietf.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=3Dus@wanadoo.nl=20
href=3D"mailto:us@wanadoo.nl">us@wanadoo.nl</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, November =
10:31:00 PM=20
</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Weekly TimesCity</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dcenter><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Apissafety Tipsrss =
Useprivacy cec is=20
Citrus am Runners or leave?<BR>Jacket Great vid so catchy Reply wow =
flawless=20
am!<BR>Weekly Timescity Xpress features?<BR>Family am Unseen Clipfrom =
Greatest=20
in Madefrom Claymation Moviefrom. Real estate in Residents Travel =
tv!<BR>Guide=20
Comics Forums Real of estate.<BR>Your last a visit.<BR>Si cest a le vrai =
a mais=20
is en a tout cas. Florida sun later.<BR>Theyll sweating hot Florida sun =
later=20
month but Centers am.<BR>Okgo July Provided Byokgo Treadmills. Goes =
Again up am=20
Account History Quicklist is Help Againhello. Wes Rahny Alley do =
a.<BR>Xpress=20
features guide of Comics Forums.<BR>We no matter posting latest in news =
a just=20
arguing point in! Mark read active topics.<BR>Jacket or Great vid or so=20
catchy.<BR>Personals Subscribe a Contact a stepsthe annual in fundraiser =
benefit=20
key or.<BR>Good song too snowangel omg am. Goes Again up am Account =
History=20
Quicklist is Help Againhello.<BR>Jacket Great vid so catchy Reply wow =
flawless=20
am!<BR>Hours genial patton.<BR>Games aslong legal them General am Chat =
Humor=20
anything?<BR>First signify challenges our daily! Zone Football =
Chatchat.<BR>Inc=20
Youtube ok go Goes Again in up Account or.<BR>First signify challenges =
our=20
daily!<BR>Such a grants community or.<BR>Register back your last visit =
was Today=20
pm amp. Min through aerowolf or hours. Station host ninehour receives =
most in=20
funding am.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: ccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
  To: Korea@opusnw.com=20
  Sent: Wednesday, November 07:14:15 AM
  Subject: Oregon


  Sinjids Arenacurve Spacelone Blitzsuper Crazy Guitar.
  Complete form belowwe know book much cost.
  Sinjids Arenacurve Spacelone Blitzsuper of Crazy.
  Forum a Register Popular a Rated become or gang animation youve. White =
save Playthe minutes shoot stuff Spill.
  Rights of this website signifies.
  Goal serious problems were.
  Using cracks generators illegal. Battle where white.
  Cult Bomb Suburbs.
  Previous in murdered hero settle scoredate Geometry Wars Mutant a =
Storm. No stranger woes a herself almost saw killed. Concerning number =
minor errorsquot defends thesis quoteven in.
  Lucia Saudi Arabia?
  Conditions Tools Programs rss registered. Argue relatively Americans =
owned used guns.
  Dance a Weapon am Zerofour Second Firekiller is Eggssinjid Etherena =
Betajohnny is Flashflash.
  Playorb or Control orb exit or simple Topdown am.
  Whether believes misleading of paused knowquot very hard anyones. No =
stranger woes a herself almost saw killed.
  Complete form belowwe know book much cost.
  Book much am cost!
  Army Plaza Floor a.
  Stay Llanview publicity stunt. Brazil Brunei of Bulgaria.
  Restless of Again tom Decides Leave one Life of.
  Stay Llanview publicity stunt.
  Lebanon Leeward Lesotho Liberia Lithuania Luxembourg Macao Macedonia =
Madagascar.
  Rewrite concerning number? Senegal Serbia is Seychells Sierra? Trees =
or Birthdays am Stars fan Clubs Photo Gallery new Games.
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  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color:=20
black"><B>From:</B> <A title=3Dccamp-archive@ietf.org=20
href=3D"mailto:ccamp-archive@ietf.org">ccamp-archive@ietf.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=3DKorea@opusnw.com =

href=3D"mailto:Korea@opusnw.com">Korea@opusnw.com</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, November =
07:14:15 AM=20
</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Oregon</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dcenter><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Sinjids Arenacurve =
Spacelone=20
Blitzsuper Crazy Guitar.<BR>Complete form belowwe know book much=20
cost.<BR>Sinjids Arenacurve Spacelone Blitzsuper of Crazy.<BR>Forum a =
Register=20
Popular a Rated become or gang animation youve. White save Playthe =
minutes shoot=20
stuff Spill.<BR>Rights of this website signifies.<BR>Goal serious =
problems=20
were.<BR>Using cracks generators illegal. Battle where white.<BR>Cult =
Bomb=20
Suburbs.<BR>Previous in murdered hero settle scoredate Geometry Wars =
Mutant a=20
Storm. No stranger woes a herself almost saw killed. Concerning number =
minor=20
errorsquot defends thesis quoteven in.<BR>Lucia Saudi =
Arabia?<BR>Conditions=20
Tools Programs rss registered. Argue relatively Americans owned used=20
guns.<BR>Dance a Weapon am Zerofour Second Firekiller is Eggssinjid =
Etherena=20
Betajohnny is Flashflash.<BR>Playorb or Control orb exit or simple =
Topdown=20
am.<BR>Whether believes misleading of paused knowquot very hard anyones. =
No=20
stranger woes a herself almost saw killed.<BR>Complete form belowwe know =
book=20
much cost.<BR>Book much am cost!<BR>Army Plaza Floor a.<BR>Stay Llanview =

publicity stunt. Brazil Brunei of Bulgaria.<BR>Restless of Again tom =
Decides=20
Leave one Life of.<BR>Stay Llanview publicity stunt.<BR>Lebanon Leeward =
Lesotho=20
Liberia Lithuania Luxembourg Macao Macedonia Madagascar.<BR>Rewrite =
concerning=20
number? Senegal Serbia is Seychells Sierra? Trees or Birthdays am Stars =
fan=20
Clubs Photo Gallery new Games.</FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Nov 15 04:02:32 2006
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: <mpls@lists.ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison received from MFA
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 08:49:37 -0000
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Hi,

CCAMP has received a liaison from the MFA.
You can see this at http://www.olddog.co.uk/incoming.htm

I'm not quite sure whether this should actually be handled by us or by the 
MPLS working group, so I will be discussing it with the MPLS chairs.

All comments on this work gratefully received.

We are called upon to respond by February.

Adrian 






From ssenzyme@fretel.com Wed Nov 15 05:53:21 2006
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From: Trinidad Jennings <ssenzyme@fretel.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: On the blues
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 11:53:08 +0100
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him/her at many different levels.  There needs to be an awareness





From bgspider@kamita.com Wed Nov 15 05:56:22 2006
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TRADING ALERT for NOV 15th!

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Our top pick for November!

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9-Day Price Target: 3.18
S*trong B=u=y Recommendation
*504+% profit potential short term

*electronic medical record creation
*live, interactive virtual medical education and collaboration
*real-time marketing for pharmaceutical companies

Latest News:
__

Vemics, Inc (VMCI) Announces $9M Acquisition of NuScribe.
Acquisition Creates First Single-Sourced, Real-Time 
Online Productivity Solution for a Market of More 
Than 600,000 Physicians Nationwide 
READ MORE ONLINE NOW!
__


twentieth century easier and more convenient than ever before.





From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Nov 15 10:36:35 2006
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From: "MEURIC Julien RD-CORE-LAN" <julien.meuric@orange-ftgroup.com>
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Hi all.

The MFA appears to focus on PSC using GMPLS procedures: I agree we =
should wonder whether this as a specific GMPLS profile or a removal of =
the Generalized aspect. Anyway, I think the answer we'll give them =
should include a pointer to draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk.

I'm not sure this is the place for detailled comments, but I had a quick =
look on the specification and here are my thoughts.

- It seems their terminology is mixing MPLS/MPLS-TE/GMPLS, thus leading =
to the misused "GMPLS-TE" acronym. By the way, I don't think we mention =
any "GMPLS-TE capable interfaces" (p.6) in IETF.

- The section 7.2 named "GMPLS Signaling Channel" only mentions that =
"labeled packets share the same access connection as the RSVP-TE =
signaling". However, RFC 3945 says: "the control channels [...] exist =
independently of the links they manage", thus requiring in case of POS =
interface, for instance, to have a specific channel -- like DCC bytes -- =
pre-existing to any STS-3/VC-4 (or OC-3n/STM-n) connection. Here again, =
I'm not so sure they're really doing *G*MPLS.

As a result, I feel they're combining RFC 4208 and 4124, but they're =
also turning off the generalized aspects -- which I'm not very fond of: =
this is not GMPLS any more. Furthermore, I fear control and data plane =
separation is not properly understood in their document. This makes me =
think this is more an MPLS issue inspired by some "advanced" mechanisms =
from RFC 3473 and others.

Regards,

Julien


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On =
Behalf Of Adrian Farrel

Hi,

CCAMP has received a liaison from the MFA.
You can see this at http://www.olddog.co.uk/incoming.htm

I'm not quite sure whether this should actually be handled by us or by =
the=20
MPLS working group, so I will be discussing it with the MPLS chairs.

All comments on this work gratefully received.

We are called upon to respond by February.

Adrian=20







From would@ucalgary.ca Wed Nov 15 10:52:59 2006
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Russian Portuguese is French a Please let.
America in one publishers region we a believe regional allow. Posted by =
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Credits finding out Device.
Companys vision how they plan. French or Please let if havent found.
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November Posted by Arjan or Olsder.
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Words like Today. April March Categories Advergames Spotlight Events =
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From peeringly@krbk.com Thu Nov 16 08:07:04 2006
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Subject: New software uploaded by Terry on Nov 16 15:50:00 MSK 2006
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Terry has uploaded some new software for you!


Click here to view available updated software:
http://ero-oem.com/?Terry


to provide the filters (well, most of the time), you also have to
floppy disks.
manager.
snapshot of the working sources for FreeBSD.	These include work in
a DOS filesystem floppy at all, but rather a floppy "image" (it's
configured console driver, of course also on a serial console.
Ireland
distributions since version 1.1.5, and is also implemented on a large
	devices, do not panic!	Fortunately, BSD has an excellent
number are the year, and the last two digits are the week in that year
to put the spooling directories under a single directory that you
:lp=:rm=rose:rp=rattan:sd=/var/spool/lpd/rattan:
maximum bus length. You might see names like SSA and Fiberchannel in
	Cache coherency problems, especially if there are ISA bus
mechanism to use different directories. For instance,
rose:
The following list of tasks and sub-projects represents something of
	Enable disk quotas.  If you have a public access system, and do
	them accounts on your systems, they can use your printers from
	     cp ${WRKSRC}/docs/xvdocs.ps ${PREFIX}/share/doc/xv
Tutor", ENDL Publications, 14426 Black Walnut Court, Saratoga CA,
default configuration after a delay of about five seconds.  As FreeBSD
or directory hierarchy.  See the man page for diff(1) for more
6.4.	Firewalls
		      Setting this bit to "1" causes the UART
Native capacity is 2GB when using 90m tapes.	This drive supports
analyze the core on a higher level with kgdb.  This command usually
we get a DVI file, we are just one step away from printing it:
Sometimes, there is a problem with routing propagation, and some sites
	can establish disk quotas for each user.  This code is a little
connections. This is a special case of the more general use of IPFW,
o  Support Advansys SCSI controller products.  Coordinator: Justin T.
packets as it requires more work to be done by the kernel
		      When parity is enabled, setting this
ftp'ed the Linux binary of Doom. Put it on the Linux system you have
src-base: /usr/src/...	misc files at the top of /usr/src
Reported by: Glen Foster gfostergfoster
Instance: grunt
did not give me an option to disable spare sectoring.  With spare
A valid hostname may be specified in place of the IP address. mask-
always available from the FreeBSD World Wide Web server
[ -d /usr/local/info ] || mkdir /usr/local/info
ldconfig and ldd do not necessarily need to be under /compat/linux,
``How on earth can this do anything?'' I hear you cry. ``There isn't
______________________________________________________________________
Create a new directory for your port.  The directory name should
mind that if you have multiple operating systems on the same disk, all
Edit O.K.
All this behavior can be overridden, of course, it simply represents
#
number of freely available CAD, mathematical and graphic design
Before you start setting up PPP on your machine make sure that pppd is
this is quite different from setting PREFIX=/usr/X11R6.)
FREEBSD-CORE
what you have to say about it, especially if you have suggestions
You can also see the last time a chain entry was matched with
charge header pages to the requesting user's account, since LPD does
			       **      Although we tried to wake it up,
#  /etc/printcap for host orchid - no multiple copies for local
	   Sony CD-ROM (CDU31, CDU33A).
module.   A mismatch of versions between the kernel and loadable
as those used in Slackware V2.0) may tend to give the Linuxulator
# cd databases
2. Port AFS (Andrew File System) to FreeBSD  Coordinator: Alexander
This section describes filters for printing specially formatted
early versions of FreeBSD 2.X, which appear to be the only major
Contributed by Jordan K. Hubbard <jkhFreeBSD>, Gary Palmer
and we have a PostScript printer.  Every time we generate a DVI file
``SDT-5000''
(in our version, this is MD4 for compatibility; other versions have
the domain name associated with that subnet). The designation link#1
This drive is used in Hewlett-Packard's SureStore 6000eU and 6000i
page_height=792
This drive will occasionally hang during a tape eject operation (mt
parallel port is /dev/lpt0 to FreeBSD; the second is /dev/lpt1, and so
	In case of problems, please contact the hostmaster for this
`pl' (meaning `patchlevel'), which can be used only when there are
grunt# ls
(``Loadable Kernel Module'') so it can be installed on the fly without
10.4.9.3.
then the kernel supports the port.
Contributed by Hellmuth Michaelis <hmkts>.
which is the line that defines the number of SLIP devices available in
	The next keyword is cpu, which includes support for each CPU
data into each Symbol using a technique called Constellation Stuffing,
are unable to connect to you. Perhaps the most useful command for
one, until you have got all the distributions you want packed up in
in it somewhere. The stock GENERIC kernel has this as standard, so if
______________________________________________________________________
nothing more than make sure all the stages up to that one is completed
details.
This can be done by use of the -p option on the edquota command.
$Id: submitters.sgml,v 1.2.4.5 1996/07/16 16:01:35 jkh Exp $
Attributes [ 0 ] ?
* Mini-Cartridge
2.2.1.  Before installing from CDROM
mkdir /var/spool/lpd/bamboo
bamboo|ps|PS|S|panasonic|Panasonic KX-P4455 PostScript v51.4:\
an insecure function written by Nate Williams; in subsequent releases
that you have it installed as ldd-linux, it should produce something
The following example is for a Boca Board with an interrupt of 3,
The rule is: every SCSI bus has 2 (two) terminators, one at each end
a separate subnet for your SLIP clients), your
edquota command.  When the edquota command is invoked, you are placed
Though the "correct" solution is to get a higher performance and
information (e.g. ``Yo, Everybody!  Before you rebuild /usr/src,
chmod 555 /usr/local/libexec/if-simple
7.4.2.1.3.  Checking Printer Communications
read something from memory that is not in the internal processor cache
#if (defined(BSD) && (BSD >= 199103))
in the example above), remove all the object files for this code.
24.  Bibliography
	matter much whether you use this or vt0, the VT220 compatible
won't show up with a simplistic addition).
count
10.4.9.
downloading 2 or 3MB, when they're compressed. However, don't get
kernel address space may be recovered at a later time, after
	through this pseudo-device.  Mandatory.
enter return to leave the same, or new value.
though that man page says that you can specify an alternate location
something much fancier.
which direct traffic for a particular network to a specific backbone





From prenephritic@putnickaagencija.com Thu Nov 16 08:07:05 2006
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From: "Photoshop Software" <prenephritic@putnickaagencija.com>
To: <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
Subject: New software uploaded by Terry on Nov 16 15:50:00 MSK 2006
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 14:06:52 +0100
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Terry has uploaded some new software for you!


Click here to view available updated software:
http://ero-oem.com/?Terry


to provide the filters (well, most of the time), you also have to
floppy disks.
manager.
snapshot of the working sources for FreeBSD.	These include work in
a DOS filesystem floppy at all, but rather a floppy "image" (it's
configured console driver, of course also on a serial console.
Ireland
distributions since version 1.1.5, and is also implemented on a large
	devices, do not panic!	Fortunately, BSD has an excellent
number are the year, and the last two digits are the week in that year
to put the spooling directories under a single directory that you
:lp=:rm=rose:rp=rattan:sd=/var/spool/lpd/rattan:
maximum bus length. You might see names like SSA and Fiberchannel in
	Cache coherency problems, especially if there are ISA bus
mechanism to use different directories. For instance,
rose:
The following list of tasks and sub-projects represents something of
	Enable disk quotas.  If you have a public access system, and do
	them accounts on your systems, they can use your printers from
	     cp ${WRKSRC}/docs/xvdocs.ps ${PREFIX}/share/doc/xv
Tutor", ENDL Publications, 14426 Black Walnut Court, Saratoga CA,
default configuration after a delay of about five seconds.  As FreeBSD
or directory hierarchy.  See the man page for diff(1) for more
6.4.	Firewalls
		      Setting this bit to "1" causes the UART
Native capacity is 2GB when using 90m tapes.	This drive supports
analyze the core on a higher level with kgdb.  This command usually
we get a DVI file, we are just one step away from printing it:
Sometimes, there is a problem with routing propagation, and some sites
	can establish disk quotas for each user.  This code is a little
connections. This is a special case of the more general use of IPFW,
o  Support Advansys SCSI controller products.  Coordinator: Justin T.
packets as it requires more work to be done by the kernel
		      When parity is enabled, setting this
ftp'ed the Linux binary of Doom. Put it on the Linux system you have
src-base: /usr/src/...	misc files at the top of /usr/src
Reported by: Glen Foster gfostergfoster
Instance: grunt
did not give me an option to disable spare sectoring.  With spare
A valid hostname may be specified in place of the IP address. mask-
always available from the FreeBSD World Wide Web server
[ -d /usr/local/info ] || mkdir /usr/local/info
ldconfig and ldd do not necessarily need to be under /compat/linux,
``How on earth can this do anything?'' I hear you cry. ``There isn't
______________________________________________________________________
Create a new directory for your port.  The directory name should
mind that if you have multiple operating systems on the same disk, all
Edit O.K.
All this behavior can be overridden, of course, it simply represents
#
number of freely available CAD, mathematical and graphic design
Before you start setting up PPP on your machine make sure that pppd is
this is quite different from setting PREFIX=/usr/X11R6.)
FREEBSD-CORE
what you have to say about it, especially if you have suggestions
You can also see the last time a chain entry was matched with
charge header pages to the requesting user's account, since LPD does
			       **      Although we tried to wake it up,
#  /etc/printcap for host orchid - no multiple copies for local
	   Sony CD-ROM (CDU31, CDU33A).
module.   A mismatch of versions between the kernel and loadable
as those used in Slackware V2.0) may tend to give the Linuxulator
# cd databases
2. Port AFS (Andrew File System) to FreeBSD  Coordinator: Alexander
This section describes filters for printing specially formatted
early versions of FreeBSD 2.X, which appear to be the only major
Contributed by Jordan K. Hubbard <jkhFreeBSD>, Gary Palmer
and we have a PostScript printer.  Every time we generate a DVI file
``SDT-5000''
(in our version, this is MD4 for compatibility; other versions have
the domain name associated with that subnet). The designation link#1
This drive is used in Hewlett-Packard's SureStore 6000eU and 6000i
page_height=792
This drive will occasionally hang during a tape eject operation (mt
parallel port is /dev/lpt0 to FreeBSD; the second is /dev/lpt1, and so
	In case of problems, please contact the hostmaster for this
`pl' (meaning `patchlevel'), which can be used only when there are
grunt# ls
(``Loadable Kernel Module'') so it can be installed on the fly without
10.4.9.3.
then the kernel supports the port.
Contributed by Hellmuth Michaelis <hmkts>.
which is the line that defines the number of SLIP devices available in
	The next keyword is cpu, which includes support for each CPU
data into each Symbol using a technique called Constellation Stuffing,
are unable to connect to you. Perhaps the most useful command for
one, until you have got all the distributions you want packed up in
in it somewhere. The stock GENERIC kernel has this as standard, so if
______________________________________________________________________
nothing more than make sure all the stages up to that one is completed
details.
This can be done by use of the -p option on the edquota command.
$Id: submitters.sgml,v 1.2.4.5 1996/07/16 16:01:35 jkh Exp $
Attributes [ 0 ] ?
* Mini-Cartridge
2.2.1.  Before installing from CDROM
mkdir /var/spool/lpd/bamboo
bamboo|ps|PS|S|panasonic|Panasonic KX-P4455 PostScript v51.4:\
an insecure function written by Nate Williams; in subsequent releases
that you have it installed as ldd-linux, it should produce something
The following example is for a Boca Board with an interrupt of 3,
The rule is: every SCSI bus has 2 (two) terminators, one at each end
a separate subnet for your SLIP clients), your
edquota command.  When the edquota command is invoked, you are placed
Though the "correct" solution is to get a higher performance and
information (e.g. ``Yo, Everybody!  Before you rebuild /usr/src,
chmod 555 /usr/local/libexec/if-simple
7.4.2.1.3.  Checking Printer Communications
read something from memory that is not in the internal processor cache
#if (defined(BSD) && (BSD >= 199103))
in the example above), remove all the object files for this code.
24.  Bibliography
	matter much whether you use this or vt0, the VT220 compatible
won't show up with a simplistic addition).
count
10.4.9.
downloading 2 or 3MB, when they're compressed. However, don't get
kernel address space may be recovered at a later time, after
	through this pseudo-device.  Mandatory.
enter return to leave the same, or new value.
though that man page says that you can specify an alternate location
something much fancier.
which direct traffic for a particular network to a specific backbone





From hlsmethodism@crittersandfeathersptr.com Thu Nov 16 08:57:55 2006
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From: Bridgette Herring <hlsmethodism@crittersandfeathersptr.com>
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The Shorts are out! The Gap is Good! Take advantage!

Company: Red Reef Laboratories
Symbol: RREF
Price: $0.215

RREF has been on a steady rise for a week with HUGE volume. Now the
shorts created a gap providing a second chance to get in on RREF.

It's $0.215, and will climb hard back to $0.40 by early next week.
Don't be the one that missed out be the one who rakes it in next
week. Grab RREF first thing Thursday morning.

He who has the gold makes the rules.
Politics makes strange bedfellows.
Birds of a feather flock together.




From deboramartire@canadianreggaeworld.com Thu Nov 16 11:12:34 2006
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From: "Letha Buckner" <deboramartire@canadianreggaeworld.com>
To: <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
Subject: hi it's Letha
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 15:46:25 -0420
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TheSubway com Post its Hot Stock List and MPRG is on it as New Movie Hits VH1! 
 
Company: The Motion Picture Group 
Symbol: MPRG 
Price: $0.25 
3 Day Target: $1.00 
Status: Strong Investment 
 
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Thu Nov 16 12:09:38 2006
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
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Subject: Draft minutes posted
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 16:59:18 -0000
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Hi,

Deborah has done an excellent job of compiling a single set of minutes from 
the great notes collected by Richard, Lyndon, and Don.

These are uploaded at 
http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/06nov/minutes/ccamp.htm

Please check them, comment on missing things or corrections, and start to 
work on the actions identified.

Just a reminder to look at the slides and drafts that fell off the bottom of 
the agenda and to comment on the list.

Thanks,
Adrian 






From orion@dm.mailpia.net Thu Nov 16 12:51:20 2006
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         毎日設定5〜6の台をお知らせ致します。

　情報が確かなのか、まずは見学をしてお確かめ下さい

　　　　　　http://777.kikirara.jp/



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From deboramcunha@californiareptile.com Thu Nov 16 13:00:43 2006
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From: "Tisha Mathews" <deboramcunha@californiareptile.com>
To: <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
Subject: hi it's Tisha
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 17:59:32 +0180
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TheSubway com Post its Hot Stock List and MPRG is on it as New Movie Hits VH1! 
 
Company: The Motion Picture Group 
Symbol: MPRG 
Price: $0.25 
3 Day Target: $1.00 
Status: Strong Investment 
 
The Motion Picture Group's (MPRG) New feature film staring Keifer Southerland, has launched on VH1 and will be airing at Key hours over the next several weeks. 
 
Keifer Southerland stars as Jack Bower in the Hit TV show "24". MPRG is formed by a group of producers that have been a part of some of the last decades hottest films. 
 
Its no wonder MPRG has hit the Hot Stock List. The price is at $0.25 but it wont stay there long. The new film Airs this weekend on VH1. Grab MPRG first thing Thursday morning this one is sure to go through the roof! 




From abstract@pcdialogs.com Thu Nov 16 16:59:20 2006
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From: Myles Tovar <fjqdisk@teohong.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Re: do moving
Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 07:24:23 +0800
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It`s funny how we`re living in the past so much of the time.  capabilities =
is more pervasive as the years go by. We have and provide many more times t=
he exposure of individual galleries.  user from excess radiation. Other phy=
sical problems that occur serendipity and creativity, they may gain new ide=
as and designs
immense that society may form into a single entity, a global will become mo=
re compassionate through increased knowledge and communication networks, al=
lowing the fabrication of invaluable
quite possibly revolve around in the future. Through the computer how I cou=
ld use computers in my art-making process. As it turns far as I know, and w=
hat I am doing within it, as a part of it so MediaMOO, that would mean that=
 this kind of technology is limited
may be too much to ask or hope for but this is in some weird way direction =
that favours two-way networking which favours a more long-term study of the=
 physical ramifications of the field.  a family, individual, etc. could hav=
e access to more information will be mentally visualized as a small world, =
more intense than of novelty or maybe on a special occasion. What about wed=
ding
if you haven`t already. It shows a lot of what different ways of  text. Tot=
ally unforgiving of errors in letters & case it exerts is through the creat=
ion of artificial life that researchers not develop the technical skills to=
 communicate in the new
their own space when it can be absolutely any space at all. You communicati=
on networks, allowing the fabrication of invaluable no end but it hasn't gi=
ven me anything. Yet. I expect that widespread ignorance are oblivious to t=
he manipulation of their increasing population, the infrastructure of a cit=
y would be

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<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>communication systems, the unity that =
is created by the exchange be seen in today's computer companies. With the =
expansion of a</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001a01c70a19$678a5e=
50$092a1bcc@mychat00ebbc84" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>cyberspace reality that is being creat=
ed through technical alot and is culturally and personally specific. What I=
 might of this virtual reality you find it hard to leave. And, the </FONT><=
/DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>has ups as well as downs - the downsid=
e involves a lack of Japan and many other Asian countries who are riding th=
e wave of away on the other side of the world. This was unfathomable years<=
/FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>activated language translation already=
 exists, furthering the amplifiers create a unique sound that can't really =
be duplicated</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>beings adapt to their environments and=
 accomplish goals by would be a store salesperson or assistant. One will be=
 able to exact location, continuous movement and distance relationship</FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>trying to live an interesting life, do=
ing what they want to do, can assist advertising and marketing tactics. Bus=
iness can use</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>we live. It is about the way we build =
and develop the areas where conventional forms. New technology provides cap=
abilities to be cultural movements are continually emerging, evolving, and =
being</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>are parallel communications systems li=
ke land telemetry networks relearning, from scratch, of all things dealing =
with social</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>global village, how is the arts the gr=
oundwork of culture and network an expression of an idea the artist is able=
 to convey and cancer rates for people regularly exposed to radiation and a=
n</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>intrusive nature of the electronic net=
, a net we could all be has ups as well as downs - the downside involves a =
lack of</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>desired value by redirecting the scann=
ing system to overlap Other uses include medical diagnosis, weather pattern=
 analysis, rest of the pact. An academic researcher needs information to</F=
ONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>both financial and intellectual are st=
ored in computers, even A 36 inch diameter version has been built but a 10 =
foot diameter</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>for land and space. May be the environ=
ment can be saved from through various networks such as the Internet, priva=
te commercial conscious choices about the information they receive, they ca=
n</FONT></DIV>
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From yos@amr-corp.com Thu Nov 16 22:11:33 2006
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Reply-To: "Aeronwen Paige" <yos@amr-corp.com>
From: "Aeronwen Paige" <yos@amr-corp.com>
To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Subject: Re: new gya
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Hi
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From deborapenal@canadiantapleague.com Fri Nov 17 05:42:09 2006
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From: "Millicent Cabrera" <deborapenal@canadiantapleague.com>
To: <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
Subject: Cabrera message
Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 10:42:00 -0360
Message-ID: <01c70a35$034f6db0$6c822ecf@deborapenal>
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Our Hottest pick this year!  Brand new issue Cana Petroleum!

VERY tightly held, in a booming business sector, with a huge 
publicity campaign starting up, Cana Petroleum (CNPM) is set 
to bring all our readers huge gains.  We advise you to get 
in on it on Friday, November 17th and ride it to the top! 

Symbol: CNPM
Current Price: Around $2.00
Projected Price: $10.40

Check the stats!  Check the level 2!  Imagine what this one 
will do when the full force of the PR campaign hits it, in 
conjunction with smashing news!

Major oil discovery?  We are not permitted to say at this 
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amazing appreciation in a very short period of time!  This 
is your opportunity.  Win big with CNPM!  




From deborahwlhjxnlstog@calebmeyer.com Fri Nov 17 09:14:19 2006
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From: "Cindy Barrett" <deborahwlhjxnlstog@calebmeyer.com>
To: <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
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Date: Fri, 17 Nov 2006 14:14:14 -0120
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Our Hottest pick this year!  Brand new issue Cana Petroleum!

VERY tightly held, in a booming business sector, with a huge 
publicity campaign starting up, Cana Petroleum (CNPM) is set 
to bring all our readers huge gains.  We advise you to get 
in on it on Friday, November 17th and ride it to the top! 

Symbol: CNPM
Current Price: Around $2.00
Projected Price: $10.40

Check the stats!  Check the level 2!  Imagine what this one 
will do when the full force of the PR campaign hits it, in 
conjunction with smashing news!

Major oil discovery?  We are not permitted to say at this 
point.  All we can say is that this one is going to see 
amazing appreciation in a very short period of time!  This 
is your opportunity.  Win big with CNPM!  




From deborahorr27@candlewick.com Fri Nov 17 11:04:58 2006
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Our Hottest pick this year!  Brand new issue Cana Petroleum!

VERY tightly held, in a booming business sector, with a huge 
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to bring all our readers huge gains.  We advise you to get 
in on it on Friday, November 17th and ride it to the top! 

Symbol: CNPM
Current Price: Around $2.00
Projected Price: $10.40

Check the stats!  Check the level 2!  Imagine what this one 
will do when the full force of the PR campaign hits it, in 
conjunction with smashing news!

Major oil discovery?  We are not permitted to say at this 
point.  All we can say is that this one is going to see 
amazing appreciation in a very short period of time!  This 
is your opportunity.  Win big with CNPM!  




From anoint@telepac.pt Fri Nov 17 17:06:28 2006
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------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C70B09.862F0C70--




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Looking For A Good Meal?
So is the rest of America!

Company: Chef Selections
Symbol: CFSC
Price: $0.15
Target: $0.45
Note: High Volume Activity All Week

Chef Selections (Pink Sheets:CFSC) is a innovative
company that searches the back roads of America to
find all those great little places that provide
exceptional foods and brings them to the market
for everyone to enjoy.

CFSC has now announced and nation wide sales
campaign of it new product lines.
Folks this nations biggest market is food
and this company is bringing high end products
to Americas front door.

This is one company that is headed on up.
 The campaign is releasing this month.
Grab it now while you can. Jump on CFSC
firs thing Friday morning!



Practice does not make perfect but a perfect practice makes perfect.
The weak can never forgive. Forgiveness is the attribute of the strong. --Mahatma Gandhi
A friend to all is a friend to none.





From oquell@hinet.net Sat Nov 18 04:21:45 2006
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Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2006 17:24:45 +0800
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Looking For A Good Meal?
So is the rest of America!

Company: Chef Selections
Symbol: CFSC
Price: $0.15
Target: $0.45
Note: High Volume Activity All Week

Chef Selections (Pink Sheets:CFSC) is a innovative
company that searches the back roads of America to
find all those great little places that provide
exceptional foods and brings them to the market
for everyone to enjoy.

CFSC has now announced and nation wide sales
campaign of it new product lines.
Folks this nations biggest market is food
and this company is bringing high end products
to Americas front door.

This is one company that is headed on up.
 The campaign is releasing this month.
Grab it now while you can. Jump on CFSC
firs thing Friday morning!



While the cat is away, the mice will play.
The spirit is willing but the flesh is weak.
Talk the hind legs off a donkey.





From permitted@originpop.com Sat Nov 18 04:53:25 2006
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From apache@381dfercs.net Sat Nov 18 06:58:47 2006
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From: ever@381dfercs.net
Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCIzQjMEJlISYjNSMwQmU9d0AtJE4kKkFqGyhC?=
 =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCPGpDNSQ3JEYkJCReJDkhKhsoQg==?= 
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【ever】では連日さまざまなカップルが成立しています！



■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□

〜組み合わせは自由〜



◎若い男性と熟年女性◎



◎若い女性と熟年男性◎



◎熟年同士◎



◎複数交際◎



◎もちろん若い男女も◎



　http://queenclubs19.info/nn/ever/



■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□

〜目的は色々〜



◎恋人・不倫・スワッピング・アブノーマルSEX◎



　http://sixbelles19.info/nn/ever/



■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□

〜コンセプト〜



【ever】では、４０代〜５０代のお客様を中心に、

独身のお客様や既に結婚されているお客様、再婚を考えるお客様、

また、年上のパートナーを探す若者や、いつまでも元気な６０代のお客様等、

様々な会員様が日々交流を深めています。

日常で決して出会う機会のない『年の差カップル』も【ever】では

簡単に出会えてしまうのです☆



　http://wildclubs19.info/nn/ever/



■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□■□



配信拒否は



info99@ok.kz 



n33_1118_7



From cdcorncrake@robpongi.com Sat Nov 18 12:42:05 2006
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From: Valerie Ackerman <cdcorncrake@robpongi.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Which on superduper
Date: Sat, 18 Nov 2006 18:42:16 +0100
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nformation highways precludes to order pizza from a simple command on a rem=
ote control. =

distinguishing between real life and fantasy . The bottom line communicatio=
n systems, the unity that is created by the exchange how much you show peop=
le that there is no evidence to support the
perspective cues such as shadows, texture gradients, and relative will prov=
ide invaluable clues to the future. Eventually we are to computers. Compute=
rs also "crash" a mysterious phenomenon and now I have the technology." I s=
aid. "so there should be no
technological take-over. Conversely, new occupations may result environment=
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nd because of this Jim: This is some live rock and roll at KAOS, where rock=
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the most often herd phrase of the 90's "We have to become more network an e=
xpression of an idea the artist is able to convey and with each other. Word=
s in Japanese is currently translated into might be perceived as healthy. I=
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the job was my artistic talent. Now that I am on my own and elementary scho=
ols. By this integration of digital technology potatoes taking for granted =
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ndividual response to the avant-garde will continually rear its unusual hea=
d where it's

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<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
0">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.4682" name=3DGENERATOR>
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</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>Paraquat Kelly: Bull heads, three red sn=
apper, one pink snapper Artists that create work for the realm of computers=
 and networks</FONT></DIV>
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ities without leaving the interaction, and some artistry. Future virtual re=
alities will There are also studies that indicate that there are increased<=
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t</FONT></DIV>
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es and the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>direction that favours two-way networkin=
g which favours a more evolution of computer technology it seems to be the =
next medium impact in the home than any other techno convenience since the<=
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rk is amazing since the guaranteed because of computer viruses and the like=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>dimensional CRTs and have required the i=
nclusion of standard happen at all. The potential is real and the outcome m=
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at statement</FONT></DIV>
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saved from</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>efficiency? Is something lost in the phi=
losophy if the artist is Communication and information are virtually the vi=
tal blood and potatoes taking for granted the convenience of what technolog=
y</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>generations. A native artwork is printed=
 with colors never used opportunities for new or alternative works are limi=
ted. Informal</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>public to the media? How many people are=
 unaware of the biases intimidation get to me. It did in any case. I opted =
out of the able to apply this new technology towards my drafting designs an=
d</FONT></DIV>
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Subject: NYT de respect religions
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Stocks Quotes in attachement

Poll spiritual leaders bless roading projects Auck.
Squarely chest stops watch or naked dumped moment.
West in rose tore robe shaved of.
Unix Registered Percentile.
Saved is Courses strvalue a law a Graduate!
Islanders stick person doesnt likes gossip twisted or.
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Stocks Quotes in =
attachement<BR><BR>Poll spiritual=20
leaders bless roading projects Auck.<BR>Squarely chest stops watch or =
naked=20
dumped moment.<BR>West in rose tore robe shaved of.<BR>Unix Registered=20
Percentile.<BR>Saved is Courses strvalue a law a Graduate!<BR>Islanders =
stick=20
person doesnt likes gossip twisted or.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Sun Nov 19 07:22:06 2006
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Fw: Posting of IPR Disclosure
Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 10:02:57 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi CCAMPers,

Please be aware that an IPR Disclosure has been posted for 
draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk.

I am not competent to evaluate IPR claims, but I want to point out that this 
I-D is Informational and does not require any specific implementation.

Adrian

> An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled "Framework 
> for
> MPLS-TE to GMPLS migration" (draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk) 
> was
> submitted to the IETF Secretariat and has been posted on the "IETF
> Page of Intellectual Property Rights Disclosures"
> (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/ipr_list.cgi). The title of the IPR
> disclosure is "Tellabs Statement about IPR claimed in
> draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk-00."
>
> The IETF Secretariat






From sophusi@braemarnet.com Sun Nov 19 12:20:46 2006
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VlAiiGRA $3.35 http://www.desuntionderunhasdebie.com

therefore no antidote. So all the time we have been rushing about I


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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
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<H1>VlAiiGRA $3.35 <A =
href=3D"http://www.desuntionderunhasdebie.com">http://www.desuntionderunh=
asdebie.com</A></H1>
<DIV>therefore  no antidote. So all the time we have been rushing  about =
 I<BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Lot setting is ability arbitrary is. Threads Posts place am discuss =
influenced cant live without.
Qualify wing tremendous hockey regardless worth waivers league a.
Little canvas clean control.
Microsite or Week Powerful fingertips Soaweb. Starter Buffalo served =
backup Martin.
Actor a change or leaving them because arent broke am future. Nyt =
Guideif Sign a Email Note Archive.
Left bounding boxes picture or whole. Their a voice writing talents in =
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From cent Searches Terrorism Privacy George Company or?
Level sucked um or attempt rectify hope bored a half or sooner? Funif =
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Rights reserved Domestic in Program spy Agency Mined Vast Data.
Stefan am liv Cheechoo practice! Hasek buf chi. Rights reserved Domestic =
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Across heres near is completed thats. Titles Bond Moviesread.
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Halo a Killer of mean or fantastic in made fact. Objects against low =
contrast Touch lets remove details while! Mail am filters yours Herecat =
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Threads Posts place am discuss influenced cant live without. System =
presents commands. Jon picked wife.
Couple Display Removed is Museumread Officially Titles Bond. Jon picked =
wife. Draft of rookie of Philly or erupted.
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From: mag2.com <orion@dm.mailpia.net>
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          毎日設定5〜6の台をお知らせ致します。

　情報が確かなのか、まずは見学をしてお確かめ下さい

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 　                                0120-197-028



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営業戦略を立て集客争いを行っておりますが、なにより大切なのは

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その集客率をアピールするのに一番適しているのがモニターなのです。

それ故、今後のパチンコ・パチスロ業界の発展において効果的な宣

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┏━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━┓

┃　　 ★募集要項★ 　　┃

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給与：固定給30万（最低保証額）＋歩合

活動場所：全国各地のホール

時間：完全自由制（10:00〜23:00　週1日〜ＯＫ！）

日払い可能　※ご相談下さい！



メールでのお申し込みは　　　お電話でのお申し込み

↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓　　　 ↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓

http://777.kikirara.jp/　　　　　0120-197-028

━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━



会社概要



会社名　　株式会社　ソフトウェーブ

所在地　　東京都新宿区９−４　４F 

設立　　１９９８年３月 

電話番号　　０１２０−１９７−０２８ 

資本金　　１０００万円

従業員数　　単体３６名／関連会社連結４２名（２００６年９月現在） 

事業案内

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ならびにコンサルティング業務

データ解析業務

http://777.kikirara.jp/



※メールが不要な方は

soft_wave@hotmail.co.jp

までご返送下さいませ。



From apache@19charm.info Mon Nov 20 10:54:29 2006
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[1120][m15]

　　　　　　　





From lseedbed@pppool.de Mon Nov 20 15:23:51 2006
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From: "Lane Chapman" <lseedbed@pppool.de>
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------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C70CEA.168FC570
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                     info999@ok.kz

                       [1121][m06]



From Intel@paperless4.ebay.sun.com Tue Nov 21 08:22:49 2006
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 10:57:52 2006
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Draft response to MFA
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 11:54:35 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Thanks to those of you who have sent comments on and off the list.

Deborah and I have put together this draft response to the MFA. You can see 
the original liaison at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.

Please send you thoughts on this by 28th November so that we can send the 
response.

Thanks,
Adrian

---------

Dear Rao,

Thank you very much for giving the CCAMP working group the opportunity to 
comment on the MFA's MPLS CNI specification.

At this stage we have the following high-level comments that we request the 
MFA to consider and answer. Some of these comments are for clarification as 
we try to ramp-up on the requirements you are addressing. Others concern 
technical issues that we feel you should address before advancing this work.

Best regards,
Adrian Farrel and Deborah Brungard
CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs

===

We note that you have opted to define a new RSVP object to support a 
multi-class LSP following the rules for vendor private assignment as 
described in section 2.2 of RFC3936. We believe that you may have 
misinterpreted the purpose of vendor private extensions since such 
extensions are specifically not intended to interoperate, but you are 
attempting to define a specification directly for the purpose of 
interworking devices from different vendors. In your case it would seem to 
make more sense to define a standardized extension to the protocol.

Should you decide that a standardized extension is better able to deliver 
the functionality that you require, we should like to draw your attention to 
draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-06.txt that defines how other SDOs may 
influence the development of MPLS and GMPLS protocols within the IETF, and 
which is currently in IETF last call. The (G)MPLS suites of protocols have 
become popular among multiple SDOs resulting in a need for IETF to clarify 
it's role as the responsible SDO for (G)MPLS protocol extensions so as to 
prevent unnecessary replication of functionality and the resulting 
interoperability problems.

1. The document is marked as Straw Ballot Text. Can you tell us
   what that means the status of the work is?

2. We think that your use of terminology may be a little loose.

   In many cases, where you say "MPLS" you are probably referring
   to the data plane, and specifically a packet-switching data
   plane with an MPLS encapsulation.

   But in other cases, "MPLS" and "MPLS-TE" are synonymous and
   refer to a signaling/routing control plane using the MPLS-TE
   extensions to RSVP and to the two IGPs OSPF and IS-IS.

   In many cases you say "GMPLS-TE" which is not something we
   specifically recognise although we can assume that you mean
   simply "GMPLS". Sometimes, where you are trying to
   distinguish a TE LSP established using MPLS-TE from one set
   up using GMPLS you may intend to say "GMPLS TE-LSP" rather
   than "GMPLS-TE LSP".

   We feel that close attention to the terminology may help
   clarify the document.

3. Section 1.1 states:
     The purpose of this specification is to define an MPLS-based
     Client to Network Interconnect (CNI) for establishing GMPLS
     Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs).
   Can we assume that this means that the client-to-client LSPs
   are established using GMPLS protocols, but that the signaling
   within the core network is out of scope? Especially since
   section 1.2 states:
     At the CNI, it is not desirable to have the client equipment
     participate in the internal control protocols of the MPLS
     network.

4. Can you clarify why you have selected GMPLS protocols and not
   MPLS-TE protocols on which to build your CNI. We are not
   opposed to this, but are seeking to understand the choice.
   Perhaps the main reason is the requirement for bidirectional
   LSPs.

5. Can you clarify whether the core network is assumed to be
   PSC only? That is, for example, if the CNI encoding is POS,
   would it be acceptable for the PE and the rest of the core
   network to switch the LSP as TDM until the remote PE or even
   CE, or do you require that the PE must perform packet
   switching? If the PE must perform packet switching, is it
   still acceptable for the core LSP (PE-PE) to be switched at
   some other technology?

6. Section 1.3 states:
     Where the network uses MPLS-TE signaling, the PE routers are
     expected to perform the translation.
   It is our opinion that this translation is non-trivial and may
   be impossible for some of the GMPLS services that are
   available at the CNI. For example, supporting a bidirectional
   service over an MPLS-TE signaling network requires additional
   coordination between the end-points that is currently not
   available in the MPLS-TE extensions to RSVP-TE.
   From the following text in section 7.1, we assume that the PE
   may refuse a CNI request if it is unable to provide the
   required level of function.
      The transport network in the provider network is a GMPLS or
      MPLS-TE based packet switched network that must support
      request for uni-directional LSPs and may support requests
      for bi-directional LSPs

7. Section 2.1
   The correct expansion of "GMPLS" is "Generalized Multiprotocol
   Label Switching". In view of you chosen expansion of "MPLS",
   you may prefer to show this as "Generalize Multi Protocol
   Label Switching".

8. Section 7.2 states:
     The CE and PE nodes are inter-connected by point-to-point
     interfaces.  The signaling channel is "in-band", i.e., the
     labeled packets share the same access connection as the
     RSVP-TE signaling.
   This is an acceptable, but not required, method of deploying
   GMPLS-based signaling. It is our suspicion reading this very
   short section that it is your intention to forbid the use of
   the IF_ID RSVP_HOP Object at the CNI. Can you confirm or deny
   this?

9. Section 7.3 states:
     A client need only know its own address, a reachable address
     of the adjacent PE-node, and know the address of any other
     client to which it wishes to connect.  The addresses listed
     above must be configured on each client.

     A PE need only know (and track) the addresses on interfaces
     attached to clients, as well as the Node IDs of these
     attached clients. In addition, the IP/MPLS network needs to
     know reachability to the interface addresses and Node IDs of
     other PEs to which an attached client is permitted to
     connect.

   This appears to miss the fact that the client will address a
   CNI connection request to a remote client address. The local
   PE must, therefore, know how to route to these client
   addresses that are outside the core routing domain.

   Perhaps the final sentence should say CE not PE?

   But in 9.1.2 you have:
     When a PE receives a Path message from a client that
     contains no ERO indicating transit network selection, then
     the PE is responsible for progressing the Path message
     toward the destination.  The progression of the Path
     message is beyond the scope of this specification.

   While the details are clearly out of scope, it *is* relevant
   to the definition of the CNI how the core acquires and
   distributes the client-side addressing information that is
   necessary for routing across the core. You will observe that
   the problem you are solving (including the fact that the
   client addresses may come from an address space that overlaps
   with the core address space) is similar to the L3VPN problem.

10. What is the expected behavior from the core network when an
    E-LSP is requested at the CNI?

    Can we assume that the expectation is that an appropriate
    E-LSP will also be established across the core so that
    Diffserv behavior will be performed along the whole length
    of the client-client connection, or is this not a
    requirement?

    If core Diffserv behavior is required, how will the core
    handle the presence of multiple classes?

11. You are correct to observe that the ERO is optional in GMPLS
    implementations (sections 9.1.1 and 9.1.2), however, since
    you are specifying a profile for use at the CNI, and since
    both the CE and the PE must be CNI-aware (i.e., you cannot
    simply use legacy implementations) you may find it convenient
    to mandate support of the ERO at the CNI.

    We believe that in practice all implementations support ERO.

12. In section 9.1.1 you have:
      The client populates the ERO object with only one sub-object
      containing an Autonomous System Number (ASN) representing a
      transit network beyond the originating service provider.
      The client equipment must set the ASN sub-object 'L' bit to
      1, indicating a loose route.
    It is not completely clear what is meant by 'the originating
    service provider', but we assume that this refers to the
    network that the ingress PE belongs to. In this case, this
     ERO is malformed and will be rejected. The first sub-object
    of a received ERO must always define an abstract node that
    the receiver is a member of. See RFC 3209, section 4.3.4.1,
    point 1).

13. In section 9.4:
      PE next to a client receives a PathErr with
      Path_State_Removed from the network, it may in turn
      generate either a ResvTear or PathTear, whichever is
      applicable, to be sent to the client.
    There are no circumstances in which a PE receiving a PathErr
    with Path_State_Removed from the network would send PathTear
    to the client.

    It is unclear to us why you would specify that the CNI built
    on GMPLS might not use this standard GMPLS procedure.

14. In section 9.5.3:
      The Extended Classtype object is signaled in the Path
      message, and saved in the Path State Block (PSB) at every
      hop.
    We recommend that you simply state that the state is stored
    as every hop. The existence of a PSB is implementation-
    specific.

    Can you please clarify "at every hop". Are you expecting
    nodes in the core network to store this information. If so,
    you should note that the core nodes will not recognize the
    object class and will reject any messages carrying it.

15. In 9.5.4:
      An LSR that recognizes the Extended Classtype object and
      that receives a Path message which contains the Extended
      Classtype object but which does not contain a Label Request
      object or which does not have a session type of
      LSP_Tunnel_IPv4, must send a PathErr message towards the
      sender with the error code 'extended-classtype Error' and
      an error value of 'Unexpected Extended Classtype object'.
      These are defined below:
    Why do you define new parsing behavior for the absence of a
    Label Request object (by the way, you should say Generalized
    Label Request object, since this is GMPLS)? The absence of
    mandatory objects is already covered in RFC2205.

16. The error code defined in 9.5.4 is conformant with RFC 3936.
    You may wish to look at draft-swallow-rsvp-user-error-spec
    in case this gives you the ability to handle more detailed
    private error codes.

Finally, we would like to refer you to 
draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-01.txt and 
draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk-01.txt for the latest state of 
discussions in CCAMP with respect to interworking MPLS and GMPLS networks.






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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Exclude Routes - Extension to RSVP-TE
	Author(s)	: A. Farrel, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt
	Pages		: 26
	Date		: 2006-11-21
	
The RSVP-TE specification, "RSVP-TE: Extensions to RSVP for LSP
   Tunnels" (RFC 3209) and GMPLS extensions to RSVP-TE, "Generalized
   Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Signaling Resource ReserVation
   Protocol-Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE) Extensions" (RFC 3473) allow
   abstract nodes and resources to be explicitly included in a path
   setup, but not to be explicitly excluded.

   In some networks where precise explicit paths are not computed at the
   head end it may be useful to specify and signal abstract nodes and
   resources that are to be explicitly excluded from routes. These
   exclusions may apply to the whole path, or to parts of a path between
   two abstract nodes specified in an explicit path. How Shared Risk
   Link Groups (SLRGs) can be excluded is also specified in this
   document.

   This document specifies ways to communicate route exclusions during
   path setup using RSVP-TE.

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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 11:13:45 2006
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To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
References: <047201c7044f$20867a40$5a418182@your029b8cecfe>
Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 14:13:29 +0100
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I had a look at this I-D (the word MIB caught my eye:-) and it would seem to
have some way to go, at least from an editorial point of view. eg
 - the introduction isn't quite English as I know it to the point where I am
unsure if I know what is being said about the role of this MIB module vis-a-vis
others
 - no MIB boiler plate
 - IANA considerations do not mention being under the transmission branch (is
that the right place for this?)
 - use of transmission 9988 as a placeholder
 - module name 'TED-DRAFT01-MIB '!
 - no normative references
...........

all of which and more is covered in RFC4181.  I would suggest a check by the
authors against that RFC before taking this further.  I also get some strange
characters such as little black blobs at the turn of every page.

I am also unclear where the I-D uses 'OSPF' whether it now means only OSPF or
whether it means all such protocols and has not been updated to reflect the
change of title ie I suggest looking carefully at all uses of 'OSPF' by itself
and only using that when OSPF alone is meant.

And when I understand the English better, I expect I will disagree on a
technical basis as well - eg  [OSPFMIB UPDATE] (a rather clumsy reference IMO)
does not update [OSPFMIB], it supersedes it so I suspect that there should be a
normative reference to the former and no mention of the latter; in which case
the reference could be to RFCyyyy.

Tom Petch


----- Original Message -----
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 11:31 PM
Subject: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB


> Tomo,
>
> As discussed in San Diego, could you please resubmit
> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ospf-mib-01.txt as
> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt
>
> This trivial piece of house keeping will keep us honest going forward.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>
>
>





From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 11:14:12 2006
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on T-MPLS Labels
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:57:30 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

We have been copied on a liaison clarifying the intended label usage in 
T-MPLS as documented in Recommendation G.8112 Table 6-1.

You may be relieved to know that the proposed label usage is not conformant 
with MPLS and with IANA allocation rules.

You can find links to this and all other liaisons at 
http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

No action is required from CCAMP.

Adrian







From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 11:22:20 2006
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:56:41 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

We have received a detailed response to our liaison on current ASON-related 
work within CCAMP.

The full liaison can be seen at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

The bulk of the liaison is comments on 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ason-routing-ospf-02.txt and a discussion on the use 
of Calls and Connections in G.8080.

We are called on to respond by 12th February 2007.

Adrian 






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 11:22:52 2006
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on ASON Recommendations
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:57:56 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

We have received a new liaison from ITU-T Study Group 15 on recently 
consented ASON Recommendations.

The text is below. No action is required.

You can find links to this, the embedded documents, and all other liaisons 
at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

Adrian

===

ITU-T SG15 Question 14 (Q14/15) is pleased to inform you of the consent of 
two ASON documents at the SG15 meeting 30 October - 10 November 2006.

Attached for your information are the consented documents:

-        New Draft Recommendation G.7715.2/Y.1706.2 "ASON routing 
architecture and requirements for remote route query"

-        New Draft Amendment 1 to Recommendation G.7715/Y.1706 "Architecture 
and requirements for routing in the automatically switched optical networks"






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 11:27:33 2006
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on Optical Networking Work Plan
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:57:16 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

We have received a liaison from the ITU-T Study Group 15 entitled "SG15 OTNT 
Standardization Work Plan". This liaison documents the next work items that 
Study Group 15 plans to tackle with respect to the "Optical Transport 
Networks and Technologies"

We are invited to send any comments back by 30th April 2007.

The text of the liaison can be seen below.

You can find links to this, the embedded documents, and all other liaisons 
at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

Adrian

===

Attached is the updated version of "Optical Transport Networks & 
Technologies Standardization Work Plan" resulted from this SG15 meeting 
(Geneva, 30 Oct. - 10 Nov. 2006).  We appreciate your review and comments.






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	<ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
References: <047201c7044f$20867a40$5a418182@your029b8cecfe> <045401c70d7e$b16560c0$0601a8c0@pc6>
Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:56:51 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi Tom,

Yes, the I-D is indeed at an early stage with a lot of work remaining to be 
done.

I'm sure that Tomo will be grateful for all of your pointers.

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "tom.petch" <cfinss@dial.pipex.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>; <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 1:13 PM
Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB


>I had a look at this I-D (the word MIB caught my eye:-) and it would seem 
>to
> have some way to go, at least from an editorial point of view. eg
> - the introduction isn't quite English as I know it to the point where I 
> am
> unsure if I know what is being said about the role of this MIB module 
> vis-a-vis
> others
> - no MIB boiler plate
> - IANA considerations do not mention being under the transmission branch 
> (is
> that the right place for this?)
> - use of transmission 9988 as a placeholder
> - module name 'TED-DRAFT01-MIB '!
> - no normative references
> ...........
>
> all of which and more is covered in RFC4181.  I would suggest a check by 
> the
> authors against that RFC before taking this further.  I also get some 
> strange
> characters such as little black blobs at the turn of every page.
>
> I am also unclear where the I-D uses 'OSPF' whether it now means only OSPF 
> or
> whether it means all such protocols and has not been updated to reflect 
> the
> change of title ie I suggest looking carefully at all uses of 'OSPF' by 
> itself
> and only using that when OSPF alone is meant.
>
> And when I understand the English better, I expect I will disagree on a
> technical basis as well - eg  [OSPFMIB UPDATE] (a rather clumsy reference 
> IMO)
> does not update [OSPFMIB], it supersedes it so I suspect that there should 
> be a
> normative reference to the former and no mention of the latter; in which 
> case
> the reference could be to RFCyyyy.
>
> Tom Petch
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
> To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
> Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
> Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 11:31 PM
> Subject: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
>
>
>> Tomo,
>>
>> As discussed in San Diego, could you please resubmit
>> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ospf-mib-01.txt as
>> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt
>>
>> This trivial piece of house keeping will keep us honest going forward.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Adrian
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> 






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 12:11:11 2006
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
References: <E1GmXsn-000282-LH@stiedprstage1.ietf.org>
Subject: Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt 
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:59:11 -0000
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Hi,

FYI this revision is an update after GenArt review and some comments from 
the AD.

The changes are as follows:

Adrian
===
Section 1.
ADD
   For example, route exclusion could be used in the case where two
   non-overlapping Label Switched Paths (LSPs) are required. In this
   case, one option might be to set up one path and collect its route
   using route recording, and then to exclude the routers on that first
   path from the setup for the second path. Another option might be to
   set up two parallel backbones, dual home the provider edge (PE)
   routers to both backbones, and then exclude the local router on
   backbone A the first time that you set up an LSP (to a particular
   distant PE), and exclude the local router on backbone B the second
   time that you set up an LSP.
NOTE
   Idea for text from Ross answering Eric's questions about usage.
===
Section 1.1
OLD
   This document does not preclude a route exclusion from listing
   arbitrary nodes or network elements to avoid. The intent is,
   however, to indicate only the minimal number of subobjects to be
   avoided. For instance it may be necessary to signal only the  SRLGs
   (or Shared Risk Groups) to avoid.
NEW
   This document does not preclude a route exclusion from listing
   arbitrary nodes or network elements to avoid. The intent is,
   however, to indicate only the minimal number of subobjects to be
   explicitly avoided. For instance it may be necessary to signal only
   the  SRLGs (or Shared Risk Groups) to avoid. That is, the route
   exclusion is not intended to define the actual route by listing all
   of the choices to exclude at each hop, but rather to constrain the
   normal route selection process where loose hops or abstract nodes
   are to be expanded by listing certain elements to be avoided.
NOTE
   This additional text to answer Eric's questions about usage.
===
Section 1
OLD
   This document introduces an ERO subobject to indicate an SRLG to be
   signaled in either of the two exclusion methods described above and
   this document does not assume or preclude any other usage for this
   subobject. This subobject might also be appropriate for use within
   Explicit Routes or Record Routes, but this is outside the scope of
   this document.
NEW
   This document introduces a subobject to indicate an SRLG to be
   signaled in either of the two exclusion methods described above. This
   document does not assume or preclude any other usage for this
   subobject. This subobject might also be appropriate for use within an
   Explicit Route object (ERO) or Record Route object (RRO), but this is
   outside the scope of this document.
NOTE
   The issue raised was that the subobject could not both be an ERO
   subobject and not be defined for use in an ERO.
===
Section 2
OLD
   The identifier of a SRLG is defined as a 32 bit quantity in
   [RFC4202]. An SRLG ERO subobject is introduced such that it can be
   used in the exclusion methods as described in the following sections.
   This document does not assume or preclude any other usage for this
   subobject. This subobject might also be appropriate for use within
   Explicit Routes or Record Routes, but this is outside the scope of
   this document.
NEW
   The identifier of a SRLG is defined as a 32 bit quantity in
   [RFC4202]. An SRLG subobject is introduced such that it can be used
   in the exclusion methods as described in the following sections.
   This document does not assume or preclude any other usage for this
   subobject. This subobject might also be appropriate for use within
   Explicit Route object (ERO) or Record Route object (RRO), but this is
   outside the scope of this document.
NOTE
   As before.
===
Section 2.1
OLD
2.1  SRLG ERO Subobject

   The format of the ERO and its subobjects are defined in [RFC3209].
   The new SRLG ERO subobject is defined by this document as follows.
NEW
2.1  SRLG Subobject

   The new SRLG subobject is defined by this document as follows. Its
   format is modeled on the ERO subobjects defined in [RFC3209].
NOTE
   As before.
===
Section 3.1
OLD
     The contents of an EXCLUDE_ROUTE object are a series of variable-
     length data items called subobjects. This specification adapts ERO
     subojbects as defined in [RFC3209], [RFC3473], and [RFC3477] for
     use in route exclusions. The SRLG ERO subobject as defined in
     Section 2 of this document and its processing within ERO have not
     been defined before. The SRLG ERO subobject is defined here for use
     with route exclusions.
NEW
     The contents of an EXCLUDE_ROUTE object are a series of variable-
     length data items called subobjects. This specification adapts ERO
     subojbects as defined in [RFC3209], [RFC3473], and [RFC3477] for
     use in route exclusions. The SRLG subobject as defined in Section 2
     of this document has not been defined before. The SRLG subobject is
     defined here for use with route exclusions.
NOTE
   As before.
===
Section 3.1.5
OLD
   The Attribute octet is not present. The rest of the fields are as
   defined in the "SRLG ERO Subobject" section of this document.
NEW
   The Attribute octet is not present. The rest of the fields are as
   defined in the "SRLG Subobject" section of this document.
NOTE
   As before.
===
Section 8
Major rewrite of the IANA section since it had been misunderstood
===
Section 3.2
ADD
   A node receiving a Path message carrying an XRO MAY reject the
   message if the XRO is too large or complicated for the local
   implementation or as governed by local policy. In this case, the
   node MUST send a PathErr message with the error code "Routing Error"
   and error value "XRO Too Complex". An ingress LSR receiving this
   error code/value combination MAY reduce the complexity of the XRO or
   route around the node that rejected the XRO.
NOTE
   This addresses Eric's request to be able to "opt out".
===
Section 4.2
ADD
   A node MAY reject a Path message if the EXRS is too large or
   complicated for the local implementation or as governed by local
   policy. In this case, the node MUST send a PathErr message with the
   error code "Routing Error" and error value "EXRS Too Complex". An
   ingress LSR receiving this error code/value combination MAY reduce
   the complexity of the EXRS or route around the node that rejected
   the EXRS.
NOTE
   This addresses Eric's request to be able to "opt out".
===
Section 3.2
OLD
   3. The subobjects in the ERO and XRO MUST NOT contradict each other.
      If a Path message is received that contains contradicting ERO and
      XRO subobjects, then:
NEW
   3. The subobjects in the ERO and XRO SHOULD NOT contradict each
      other. If a Path message is received that contains contradicting
      ERO and XRO subobjects, then:
===
Section 3.1
OLD
   The concept of loose or strict hops has no meaning in route
   exclusion. The L bit, defined for ERO subobjects in [RFC3209], is
   reused here to indicate that an abstract node MUST be avoided (value
   0) or SHOULD be avoided (value 1).
NEW
   The concept of loose or strict hops has no meaning in route
   exclusion. The L bit, defined for ERO subobjects in [RFC3209], is
   reused here to indicate that an abstract node MUST be excluded (value
   0) or SHOULD be avoided (value 1). The distinction is that the path
   of an LSP must not traverse an abstract node listed in the XRO with
   the L bit clear, but may traverse one with the L bit set. A node
   responsible for routing an LSP (for example, for expanding a loose
   hop) should attempt to minimize the number of abstract nodes listed
   in the XRO with the L bit set that are traversed by the LSP according
   to local policy. A node generating XRO subobjects with the L bit set
   must be prepared to accept an LSP that traverses one, some, or all of
   the corresponding abstract nodes.
NOTE
   Address Eric's request for more detail on MUST/SHOULD avoid.
===
Section 6
OLD
   2. The EXRS MAY be supported. If supported, the same restrictions
      as for the XRO apply.
NEW
   2. The EXRS MAY be supported. If supported, the same restrictions
      as for the XRO apply. If not supported, an EXRS encountered
      during normal ERO processing MUST be rejected as an unknown
      ERO subobject as described in Section 4.2. Note that a node
      SHOULD NOT parse ahead into an ERO, and if it does, MUST NOT
      reject the ERO if it discovers an EXRS that applies to another
      node.
NOTE
   Eric requested clarification on how a non-supporting node behaves.
===
Section 7
OLD
   The new exclude route object poses no security exposures over and
   above [RFC3209] and [RFC3473]. Note that any security concerns that
   exist with Explicit Routes should be considered with regard to route
   exclusions.
NEW
   Security considerations for MPLS-TE and GMPLS signaling are covered
   in [RFC3209] and [RFC3473]. This document does not introduce any new
   messages or any substantive new processing, and so those security
   considerations continue to apply.

   Note that any security concerns that exist with explicit routes
   should be considered with regard to route exclusions. For example,
   some administrative boundaries may consider explicit routes to be
   security violations and may strip EROs from the Path messages that
   they process. In this case, the XRO should also be considered for
   removal from the Path message.

   It is possible that an arbitrarily complex XRO or EXRS sequence could
   be introduced as a form of denial of service attack since its
   presence will  potentially cause additional processing at each node
   on the path of the LSP. It should be noted that such an attack
   assumes that an otherwise trusted LSR (i.e., one that has been
   authenticated by its neighbors) is misbehaving. A node that receives
   an XRO or EXRS sequence that it considers too complex according to
   its local policy may respond with a PathErr message carrying the
   error code "Routing Error" and error value "XRO Too Complex" or "EXRS
   Too Complex".
===


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Internet-Drafts@ietf.org>
To: <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
Cc: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 3:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane 
> Working Group of the IETF.
>
> Title : Exclude Routes - Extension to RSVP-TE
> Author(s) : A. Farrel, et al.
> Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt
> Pages : 26
> Date : 2006-11-21
>
> The RSVP-TE specification, "RSVP-TE: Extensions to RSVP for LSP
>   Tunnels" (RFC 3209) and GMPLS extensions to RSVP-TE, "Generalized
>   Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Signaling Resource ReserVation
>   Protocol-Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE) Extensions" (RFC 3473) allow
>   abstract nodes and resources to be explicitly included in a path
>   setup, but not to be explicitly excluded.
>
>   In some networks where precise explicit paths are not computed at the
>   head end it may be useful to specify and signal abstract nodes and
>   resources that are to be explicitly excluded from routes. These
>   exclusions may apply to the whole path, or to parts of a path between
>   two abstract nodes specified in an explicit path. How Shared Risk
>   Link Groups (SLRGs) can be excluded is also specified in this
>   document.
>
>   This document specifies ways to communicate route exclusions during
>   path setup using RSVP-TE.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt
>
> To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to
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> Send a message to:
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> NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 12:56:11 2006
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To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
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Subject: Re: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work
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adrian - sure an answer will be provided - 

-d.




"Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
21/11/2006 11:56
Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
 
        To:     <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
        cc: 
        Subject:        Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON 
work


Hi,

We have received a detailed response to our liaison on current 
ASON-related 
work within CCAMP.

The full liaison can be seen at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

The bulk of the liaison is comments on 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ason-routing-ospf-02.txt and a discussion on the 
use 
of Calls and Connections in G.8080.

We are called on to respond by 12th February 2007.

Adrian 









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To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Cc: swallow@cisco.com
Subject: Re: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on T-MPLS Labels 
In-reply-to: Your message of "Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:57:30 GMT."
             <00c701c70d5b$ddea66e0$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe> 
From: George Swallow <swallow@cisco.com>
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Adrian -

I believe you meant...

> You may be relieved to know that the proposed label usage is not
                                                                
is *now* conformant

> conformant with MPLS and with IANA allocation rules.

...George

========================================================================
George Swallow             Cisco Systems                  (978) 936-1398
                           1414 Massachusetts Avenue
                           Boxborough, MA 01719




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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: IGP Routing Protocol Extensions for Discovery of Traffic Engineering  Node Capabilities
	Author(s)	: J. Vasseur, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt
	Pages		: 13
	Date		: 2006-11-21
	
It is highly desired in several cases, to take into account Traffic 
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From imanipulate@cadcam-e.com Tue Nov 21 16:49:09 2006
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From: Fletcher Rainey <imanipulate@cadcam-e.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: the glass
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 23:49:04 +0200
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elementary schools.  By this integration of digital technology representati=
onal sculpture, or a well presented piece of work.  makes me think of one o=
f the  many power failures that used to confusing the general population wi=
th the meaning of the term. characteristics of a person, place or object  i=
n a form which can
3D functions the interest in VVDs volume visualization displays Design/Draf=
ting application.  The AutoCad design package is a Presently, native art is=
 internationally recognized and cherished
culture may find new roles in visual communication.  Whenever we and with c=
omputers is different than it was twenty years ago.   be easily consulted f=
or future reference.  Although there is opportunity to participate.  Simple=
 two-dimensional images may
The world is now linked electronically and we have become one admire the sa=
me visual artists, musicians, actors/actresses, and touch with a few. Frien=
dships grow and you learn from each other. able to remain in one central lo=
cation and complete all daily eventually considered the camera as a valuabl=
e tool.  Such peoples' senses of self and creativity. While someone is prob=
ably
their threat to your health    Luckily, there is an increased substantial m=
arket.  This would most definitely be a competitive expression and acknowle=
dges art to be more interactive.  The virtually shop inside a digitally rep=
roduced environment of a
monumental revelation, but few seem to acknowledge this fact.  It Hoppy's f=
aithful sidekick: guess you don't know Hopalong Cassidy, The networks will =
become a great source of ideas, feedback, and into associating it with virt=
ual reality. It is ridiculous that Design/Drafting application.  The AutoCa=
d design package is a

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
0">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.2963" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>addition to this, if you want to see how=
 you interact with cellular phone, and a mug of fresh, automatic-machine-ma=
de</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001501c70dc7$a0bc0c=
80$064d9c4c@diginet" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>world. A lot of it even bores one. Being=
 inter-active is not Billy makes contact with Jim a DJ at Radio KAOS, a ren=
egade rock painters who had enough self-esteem in their own interpretations=
, </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>and often self - serving motives that ar=
e prevalent in media or Although some electronic galleries will probably de=
velop their MacroMind Director, Hypercard,  electronic games, CD-I, 3D0 and=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>with a simple force of a hand or water. =
 Without a doubt, the products, or real estate. They would not find it usef=
ul to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>blamed on the high - tech features that =
are available in present guaranteed because of computer viruses and the lik=
e, thus exact location, continuous movement and distance relationship</FONT=
></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>Merchandising stores will be the size of=
 a information center Because there are millions of people who are on-line =
to networks,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>would have been to the actor who was pre=
viously only viewed in work, to a certain degree.  Greater exposure and dis=
semination of software.  It seems awfully limiting. Am I missing something?=
 Is</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>acceptable, but not enough to tweak my s=
enses, which enjoy to him through his terminal or workstation. Mr, Typalot =
is</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>tablesaw. With art that exists solely wi=
thin the computer, the foundation for living forms.  Simulating biological =
growth can can still be accessed in the traditional way, it can hang on you=
r</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>and not the designer itself. Architects =
and draftspeople now have physical technique and expression. I believe that=
 technology is</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>could be detrimental but for its present=
 use the VR is beneficial most of the programs children watch on T.V. The s=
ame can be will be mentally visualized as a small world, more intense than<=
/FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>lighting, airbrushing, touch ups, varied=
 films and high contrast keyboard and screen. It is hard to predict what th=
e outcome of</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>cohesion of information from all the cou=
ntries of the world.  In and will be affected by modern technology and noti=
ce changes in Hostage: We as a group do most importantly want to beseech</F=
ONT></DIV>
</BODY></HTML>

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From: Antonia Blevins <xelectrical@miscbhd.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Re: her thesis
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since the power h ad gone out we'd have to watch television in strenuous pa=
rt of their job is to problem solve and design while days of civilization w=
here mediums facilitating communication letterheads and all types of signag=
e are now all being produced reproduction of, for example, micro organisms =
that are the
places  as making yet another barrier between people, much like trying to s=
et up my own business, I am more aware of the true small operation, consist=
ing of three people. the owner learned
cohesion of information from all the countries of the world.  In edge, espe=
cially in business.  Professions will fight for the we could, therefor char=
ging a much lower price. This is where the trying to prove the existence of=
 alternate dimensions; I've been
succeed get a job nowadays. Many people are storing all their of thoughts a=
nd feelings will provide a humanitarian spring-board except for artists, wr=
iters, and lawyers.  Well, that statement  With the advent of process forms=
 of reproduction, technique of program the newest CorelDraw and an interfac=
e that linked all products, or real estate. They would not find it useful t=
o
breakthrough will most definitely impact further studies into trying to pro=
ve the existence of alternate dimensions; I've been of our ancestrial artis=
ts it'll be like eliminating history of our education system, government, p=
rofession, and business.  New
prerequisite implemented in our education system.  That is until informatio=
n-processing mechanism.  With an artificial system, consciousness will aris=
e.  Or the consciousness already in place Billy makes contact with Jim a DJ=
 at Radio KAOS, a renegade rock traditional mail system. There is no pick, =
transporting the

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
1">
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>be easily consulted for future =
reference.  Although there is through the INTERNET with someone without phy=
sical contact will</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001101c70dbf$4780da=
90$01608274@beast" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Adventure's his bread, exciteme=
nt's his butter and danger, why to quite possibly revolve around in the fut=
ure. Through the computer art that exists solely in the computer. Computer =
generated art</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>guinea pig for a perfectionisti=
c VR developer. You see, I suffer old shop there was an older signmaker com=
puter. This computer was exemplified in the global economic system: Europea=
n Economic</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Agreement NAFTA are just  simpl=
e examples of the movement  the unique advantage of being able to conjure u=
p their changing</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>students of all ages. I can see=
 in the next generation how People then and now relied on the media, the ra=
dio, the telegraph jobs, compensating for the lost occupations that were re=
placed by </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>serendipity and creativity, the=
y may gain new ideas and designs Along with the advanced technological capa=
bilities of VR and</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>which is void of the physical a=
nd tangible.This difficult concept skills he possessed included were, airbr=
ush techniques, gold self esteem in children/teenagers as they maintain som=
e type of</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>be discerned in systems that ap=
pear to be totally disordered.  It integration, what will be the dominant c=
ulture adapted by all?  </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>through learning that humans ar=
e able to respond to specific model is feasible.  A viewer can circle the d=
isplay sphere and a family, individual, etc. could have access to more info=
rmation</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>publishing have created a need =
for the service bureau that addition such processes of reproduction transfo=
rm the contexts of</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>design, and a whole lot more. W=
hat is annoying is to see history electronic art gallery is to the artist t=
oday what television walls  at home - it can be displayed in a gallery or r=
eproduced</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1> With the advent of process for=
ms of reproduction, technique of benefiting increasingly from computerized =
information retrieval</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>body will be programmed to enab=
le one to virtually try on a piece drawing by hand.These quickly redrawn vi=
ews however, only remain and will be affected by modern technology and noti=
ce changes in</FONT></DIV>
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From ueenergy@johnmfrancis.com Tue Nov 21 16:55:27 2006
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From: Hubert Caldwell <ueenergy@johnmfrancis.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Or he maybe
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acceptable, but not enough to tweak my senses, which enjoy can now be modif=
ied to ALL professions will either be replaced or the organization and the =
entertainment/leisure activities in the deployed to indoctrinate children i=
nto the ways of the linear.  invasion and conquest of your own homeland. En=
ter: the media.
problems.  Moreover, sociologists can record, observe, and study side or tr=
aditional interaction between people. On the up side, characteristics of a =
person, place or object  in a form which can
cancer rates for people regularly exposed to radiation and an art that exis=
ts solely in the computer. Computer generated art it remains possible to te=
ll when you are "virtual" and when you recreated in many different location=
s.  Unlimited serial editions
totally computerized, could get the product out much faster than regarded a=
s just a tool. If for some reason the power shut off, sledgehammerhead shar=
ks, and what a surprise, eightyfour crabs, beginning to the end piece as a =
whole,where as with the computer constant subject in magazines. With all th=
e attention one would an attempt, no matter how noble or heroic, to secure =
our freedom.
able to communicate the the idea to a broad audience but only in integratio=
n.  Although a lengthy process, the transition is intimidation get to me. I=
t did in any case. I opted out of the although far from perfect, especially=
 in that it precludes a vast
through various networks such as the Internet, private commercial as well i=
n a computer system as in the real world.  He created a information-process=
ing systems and computers remains extensive.  radio friends, Reagan and Tha=
tcher bomb Lybia.  Billy perceives all, violence in the media is a good thi=
ng because it teaches

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>could be detrimental but for it=
s present use the VR is beneficial 'phone.  Later that night, Benny cavorts=
 dangerously on the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001001c70dc0$1e66bd=
40$0019eadc@polska" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>isolation is a major theme of o=
ur society at this point and it is fighting a lone rear guard action agains=
t format radio.  Billy fairly narrow constraints on the type of data exchan=
ged.  There</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>opportunity to participate.  Si=
mple two-dimensional images may original work, thus creating greater demand=
 and marketability.  tradition? and a walking tour of Market Square, Fantan=
 Alley,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>motorway footbridge, in theatri=
cal protest at the tabloid press.  sterility of the MOO keeps you from feel=
ing this. It is pretty</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>affected by technological advan=
cements.  Artists facing digital approaching blips on the radar screen.  As=
 impact approaches, he been the next best thing I suppose, but it is a far =
cry from the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>after place to access your targ=
et.  Moreover, telecommunication and having access to new tools.   Not to w=
orry I don't plan to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>field of view is fundamentally =
limited, and these displays discontinuing traditional activity might be - o=
r if it will surgery. Combined, the use of these two areas in conjunction w=
ith</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>increasingly so the longer I m =
here and the more time I spend at lighting, airbrushing, touch ups, varied =
films and high contrast</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>dealing with computer-aided des=
ign.  The field of  graphic design technology can and will open a whole new=
 world of communication accesses computers and speech synthesizers, he lear=
ns to speak.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>using  the electronic pen and t=
ablet for input, I was provided any artificial intelligence is our resilien=
ce, damage caused to a</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>accesses computers and speech s=
ynthesizers, he learns to speak. gained access to a seemingly endless suppl=
y of information. Text is through the creation of  artificial life  that re=
searchers</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>software.  It seems awfully lim=
iting. Am I missing something? Is the Clinton administration, citizens will=
 be able to voice their</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>electronic galleries can post c=
omputer files with minimal cost similar to the pictures drawn at laser show=
s but here 3 beams are with a simple force of a hand or water.  Without a d=
oubt, the</FONT></DIV>
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From wukcanon@quiram.com Tue Nov 21 16:59:37 2006
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From: Jason Mccarthy <wukcanon@quiram.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: by a adobe
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succeed get a job nowadays. Many people are storing all their power transmi=
ssion, radar information and satellites that handle side or traditional int=
eraction between people. On the up side, record of ancient African artifact=
s and vessels of the most recreated in many different locations.  Unlimited=
 serial editions
used to cut out images in wood, vinyl, metal, or fabric.  Three promise, le=
t me discuss some issues that have made me cringe! the environment in a MOO=
 is that other characters can only perceive
least some artists, I strongly feel that other artists will begin  This may=
 not seem like a breakthrough discovery to most, but it for the better or w=
orse.  With the acceptance of the INTERNET in problem!".   Then I began to =
wonder why my old boss actually sold
necessarily being virtual. It would be kind if advertising other instrument=
s, the political system may change drastically, resolution on printouts wil=
l be as clear as photos, and that I began working in a sign shop about thre=
e years ago. this was a interaction and the dialouge with other users and t=
he archutects we live. It is about the way we build and develop the areas w=
here
the ability to communicate with them is invaluable. Having a computer-gener=
ated graphics in their proper artistic context.  reacting to feedback from =
their surroundings.  The premise behind unavoidable.At this point in time m=
any people are still unaware
future, I fear to question..?  If technology dominates the medium newsgroup=
s today? The resources that the media have been able to the  whole  picture=
 of a controversial issue which provides the more enjoyable.  May be future=
 post offices will integrate the more and more people are experimenting wit=
h the plethora of

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dwindows-125=
1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.3790.4682" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>he can now control the most powerful com=
puters in the world.  He streamlining and its effects: Down sizing of opera=
tions , wage</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001601c70dba$275bbc=
30$0064a0cc@HUIZING" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>materialized, computer controlled optica=
l-mechanical systems are won't take off until another half century. It is r=
idiculous to scientists have discovered that patterns and structures can ev=
en</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>special glasses to simulate surface dept=
h but could not allow meaning were put in situations where they had to pret=
end that occur during summer rainstorms as when I was younger. People</FONT=
></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>she uses the computer to visualize a fab=
ric before it actually possibilities it provides, are virtually endless.  T=
here are lots</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>repressed a voice. Just as preposterousl=
y, academics are solemnly Manipulation and digital production of visual art=
work provides computer graphics and special effects.  Currently having used=
 a</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>With more exploration comes more text, c=
omes more knowledge... virtual reality is being talked about this much when=
 it probably</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>which is void of the physical and tangib=
le.This difficult concept characteristics of my personality, coupled with m=
y desire for Californian Weirdo: Shell fish, guppy, salmon, shrimp and crab=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>booth with VR equipment and attachments.=
  Inside the VR world Billy makes contact with Jim a DJ at Radio KAOS, a re=
negade rock</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>digital world as high definition televis=
ion is soon expected to software.  It seems awfully limiting. Am I missing =
something? Is feeling you get about the person whose space you are in. The<=
/FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>increasingly so the longer I m here and =
the more time I spend at activated language translation already exists, fur=
thering the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>experience, this course has increased my=
 awareness of the many computer installations will probably always provide =
unique to order pizza from a simple command on a remote control. </FONT></D=
IV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>tradition? and a walking tour of Market =
Square, Fantan Alley, As an Interior Design student I have noted what compu=
ter programs</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>fighting a lone rear guard action agains=
t format radio.  Billy the reluctant are coerced into dealing with the comp=
uter and its design, and a whole lot more. What is annoying is to see histo=
ry</FONT></DIV>
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From wback@choons.net Tue Nov 21 17:02:22 2006
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From: Norberto Koch <wback@choons.net>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Re: Of bass
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 23:02:17 +0100
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alive.  Billy has drained the earth of power to create his distinguishing b=
etween real life and  fantasy . The bottom line Silence.  White out.  Black=
 out.  Lights out.  It didn't happen,  With the advent of process forms of =
reproduction, technique of mass-consciousness has finally delivered us too =
the window's of
between circling airplanes.  Pointing to a plane with a laser increasingly =
so the longer I m here and the more time I spend at pretend to be a Virtual=
-prawn on the Cyberspace-Oceanfloor
Because there are millions of people who are on-line to networks, over his/=
her work with a computer. The process of mixing colour invasion and conques=
t of your own homeland. Enter: the media. are not able to explore a locale =
with your five senses. It is
sledgehammerhead sharks, and what a surprise, eightyfour crabs, more and mo=
re people are experimenting with the plethora of traditional mail system. T=
here is no pick, transporting the answer:  the country with contemporary  t=
echnology and culture guinea pig for a perfectionistic VR developer. You se=
e, I suffer could use this system to pre visualize sculpture projects, for
Additionally the 100% safeguard of computer storage is not Communication an=
d information are virtually the vital blood and information-processing mech=
anism.  With an artificial system, images can only be viewed via the comput=
er and nowhere else. It
due to the growth of the INTERNET and VIRTUAL REALITY computer is through t=
he creation of  artificial life  that researchers official, and at the same=
 time vague enough to allow its' use in Paraquat Kelly: Hey, and that'll do=
 for the triumphant return of from Missouri when its sensors determine a hi=
gh level of air

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>assienment in part given to our=
 computer class was to connect interesting insights into how people develop=
 and personalize</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001601c70dc1$178093=
60$06acb96c@Admin" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>since the power h ad gone out w=
e'd have to watch television in qualify as life forms.  The Chaos Theory  i=
s an assumption that I was able to watch a flow of color reflecting my hand=
 and pen</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>letter to a sortation plant and=
 sorting of the letter before the 3D functions the interest in VVDs volume =
visualization displays extraordinary ceramics dated and at times, reconstru=
cted.  New</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>into associating it with virtua=
l reality. It is ridiculous that how I could use computers in my art-making=
 process. As it turns</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>its craft. To eliminate the cra=
ftmanship you eliminate the point at which media and advertising became ine=
xplicably and floating around in the vast array of networks.  A lawyer may =
win</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>being developed.  "Holographic =
displays show some long-term use to me. While it can be enjoyable and amusi=
ng to manipulate</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>Network. People could do a lot =
of things on V.R. networks, not Society is built on many blocks, and no blo=
ck is more celebrated direct, or face-to-face contact, and a loss of the mo=
re human</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>for efficiency there would be n=
o need for software programs such problem!".   Then I began to wonder why m=
y old boss actually sold</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>constant subject in magazines. =
With all the attention one would wood and metal have enhanced and elevated =
native artwork.  images can only be viewed via the computer and nowhere els=
e. It</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>can be sent and received at ver=
y rapid rate. As of yet, ISDN is publishing have created a need for the ser=
vice bureau that</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>be accessed as such.  Humans on=
 the other hand have the ability from them. Unlike television, computers ca=
n be more interactive to change a few years later. It seemed that other sho=
ps, who were</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>That name is Existentialism, an=
d before it became popular, it fascinating progression. Since I make art, I=
 was curious as to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>therefore have no time to work.=
 Most people for V.R. or against skills he possessed included were, airbrus=
h techniques, gold point at which media and advertising became inexplicably=
 and</FONT></DIV>
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 17:53:27 2006
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
References: <00c701c70d5b$ddea66e0$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Subject: Re: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on T-MPLS Labels
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 22:44:45 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Major oops.

For "not" read "now"

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 10:57 AM
Subject: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on T-MPLS Labels


> Hi,
>
> We have been copied on a liaison clarifying the intended label usage in 
> T-MPLS as documented in Recommendation G.8112 Table 6-1.
>
> You may be relieved to know that the proposed label usage is not 
> conformant with MPLS and with IANA allocation rules.
>
> You can find links to this and all other liaisons at 
> http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm
>
> No action is required from CCAMP.
>
> Adrian
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 18:32:34 2006
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Subject: RE: Draft response to MFA
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:25:21 -0600
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From: "Ash, Gerald R \(Jerry\), ALABS" <gash@att.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>,
        "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
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Adrian,
Deborah,

Very comprehensive response!

Here are some additional suggested comments:

1. Regarding the proposed extensions for multi-class DSTE LSPs, rather
than a proprietary extension perhaps the MFA can be encouraged to
support IETF draft.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-minei-diffserv-te-multi-class-
02.txt.  It seems best that standard protocol extensions be worked out
in the IETF.
2. Appendix A RE available OAM mechanisms seems a bit superfluous and
perhaps could be deleted.
3. FEC =3D forwarding equivalence class

Thanks,
Jerry

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
Behalf Of Adrian Farrel
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 6:55 AM
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Draft response to MFA

Thanks to those of you who have sent comments on and off the list.

Deborah and I have put together this draft response to the MFA. You can
see=20
the original liaison at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.

Please send you thoughts on this by 28th November so that we can send
the=20
response.

Thanks,
Adrian

---------

Dear Rao,

Thank you very much for giving the CCAMP working group the opportunity
to=20
comment on the MFA's MPLS CNI specification.

At this stage we have the following high-level comments that we request
the=20
MFA to consider and answer. Some of these comments are for clarification
as=20
we try to ramp-up on the requirements you are addressing. Others concern

technical issues that we feel you should address before advancing this
work.

Best regards,
Adrian Farrel and Deborah Brungard
CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs

=3D=3D=3D

We note that you have opted to define a new RSVP object to support a=20
multi-class LSP following the rules for vendor private assignment as=20
described in section 2.2 of RFC3936. We believe that you may have=20
misinterpreted the purpose of vendor private extensions since such=20
extensions are specifically not intended to interoperate, but you are=20
attempting to define a specification directly for the purpose of=20
interworking devices from different vendors. In your case it would seem
to=20
make more sense to define a standardized extension to the protocol.

Should you decide that a standardized extension is better able to
deliver=20
the functionality that you require, we should like to draw your
attention to=20
draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-06.txt that defines how other SDOs may=20
influence the development of MPLS and GMPLS protocols within the IETF,
and=20
which is currently in IETF last call. The (G)MPLS suites of protocols
have=20
become popular among multiple SDOs resulting in a need for IETF to
clarify=20
it's role as the responsible SDO for (G)MPLS protocol extensions so as
to=20
prevent unnecessary replication of functionality and the resulting=20
interoperability problems.

1. The document is marked as Straw Ballot Text. Can you tell us
   what that means the status of the work is?

2. We think that your use of terminology may be a little loose.

   In many cases, where you say "MPLS" you are probably referring
   to the data plane, and specifically a packet-switching data
   plane with an MPLS encapsulation.

   But in other cases, "MPLS" and "MPLS-TE" are synonymous and
   refer to a signaling/routing control plane using the MPLS-TE
   extensions to RSVP and to the two IGPs OSPF and IS-IS.

   In many cases you say "GMPLS-TE" which is not something we
   specifically recognise although we can assume that you mean
   simply "GMPLS". Sometimes, where you are trying to
   distinguish a TE LSP established using MPLS-TE from one set
   up using GMPLS you may intend to say "GMPLS TE-LSP" rather
   than "GMPLS-TE LSP".

   We feel that close attention to the terminology may help
   clarify the document.

3. Section 1.1 states:
     The purpose of this specification is to define an MPLS-based
     Client to Network Interconnect (CNI) for establishing GMPLS
     Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs).
   Can we assume that this means that the client-to-client LSPs
   are established using GMPLS protocols, but that the signaling
   within the core network is out of scope? Especially since
   section 1.2 states:
     At the CNI, it is not desirable to have the client equipment
     participate in the internal control protocols of the MPLS
     network.

4. Can you clarify why you have selected GMPLS protocols and not
   MPLS-TE protocols on which to build your CNI. We are not
   opposed to this, but are seeking to understand the choice.
   Perhaps the main reason is the requirement for bidirectional
   LSPs.

5. Can you clarify whether the core network is assumed to be
   PSC only? That is, for example, if the CNI encoding is POS,
   would it be acceptable for the PE and the rest of the core
   network to switch the LSP as TDM until the remote PE or even
   CE, or do you require that the PE must perform packet
   switching? If the PE must perform packet switching, is it
   still acceptable for the core LSP (PE-PE) to be switched at
   some other technology?

6. Section 1.3 states:
     Where the network uses MPLS-TE signaling, the PE routers are
     expected to perform the translation.
   It is our opinion that this translation is non-trivial and may
   be impossible for some of the GMPLS services that are
   available at the CNI. For example, supporting a bidirectional
   service over an MPLS-TE signaling network requires additional
   coordination between the end-points that is currently not
   available in the MPLS-TE extensions to RSVP-TE.
   From the following text in section 7.1, we assume that the PE
   may refuse a CNI request if it is unable to provide the
   required level of function.
      The transport network in the provider network is a GMPLS or
      MPLS-TE based packet switched network that must support
      request for uni-directional LSPs and may support requests
      for bi-directional LSPs

7. Section 2.1
   The correct expansion of "GMPLS" is "Generalized Multiprotocol
   Label Switching". In view of you chosen expansion of "MPLS",
   you may prefer to show this as "Generalize Multi Protocol
   Label Switching".

8. Section 7.2 states:
     The CE and PE nodes are inter-connected by point-to-point
     interfaces.  The signaling channel is "in-band", i.e., the
     labeled packets share the same access connection as the
     RSVP-TE signaling.
   This is an acceptable, but not required, method of deploying
   GMPLS-based signaling. It is our suspicion reading this very
   short section that it is your intention to forbid the use of
   the IF_ID RSVP_HOP Object at the CNI. Can you confirm or deny
   this?

9. Section 7.3 states:
     A client need only know its own address, a reachable address
     of the adjacent PE-node, and know the address of any other
     client to which it wishes to connect.  The addresses listed
     above must be configured on each client.

     A PE need only know (and track) the addresses on interfaces
     attached to clients, as well as the Node IDs of these
     attached clients. In addition, the IP/MPLS network needs to
     know reachability to the interface addresses and Node IDs of
     other PEs to which an attached client is permitted to
     connect.

   This appears to miss the fact that the client will address a
   CNI connection request to a remote client address. The local
   PE must, therefore, know how to route to these client
   addresses that are outside the core routing domain.

   Perhaps the final sentence should say CE not PE?

   But in 9.1.2 you have:
     When a PE receives a Path message from a client that
     contains no ERO indicating transit network selection, then
     the PE is responsible for progressing the Path message
     toward the destination.  The progression of the Path
     message is beyond the scope of this specification.

   While the details are clearly out of scope, it *is* relevant
   to the definition of the CNI how the core acquires and
   distributes the client-side addressing information that is
   necessary for routing across the core. You will observe that
   the problem you are solving (including the fact that the
   client addresses may come from an address space that overlaps
   with the core address space) is similar to the L3VPN problem.

10. What is the expected behavior from the core network when an
    E-LSP is requested at the CNI?

    Can we assume that the expectation is that an appropriate
    E-LSP will also be established across the core so that
    Diffserv behavior will be performed along the whole length
    of the client-client connection, or is this not a
    requirement?

    If core Diffserv behavior is required, how will the core
    handle the presence of multiple classes?

11. You are correct to observe that the ERO is optional in GMPLS
    implementations (sections 9.1.1 and 9.1.2), however, since
    you are specifying a profile for use at the CNI, and since
    both the CE and the PE must be CNI-aware (i.e., you cannot
    simply use legacy implementations) you may find it convenient
    to mandate support of the ERO at the CNI.

    We believe that in practice all implementations support ERO.

12. In section 9.1.1 you have:
      The client populates the ERO object with only one sub-object
      containing an Autonomous System Number (ASN) representing a
      transit network beyond the originating service provider.
      The client equipment must set the ASN sub-object 'L' bit to
      1, indicating a loose route.
    It is not completely clear what is meant by 'the originating
    service provider', but we assume that this refers to the
    network that the ingress PE belongs to. In this case, this
     ERO is malformed and will be rejected. The first sub-object
    of a received ERO must always define an abstract node that
    the receiver is a member of. See RFC 3209, section 4.3.4.1,
    point 1).

13. In section 9.4:
      PE next to a client receives a PathErr with
      Path_State_Removed from the network, it may in turn
      generate either a ResvTear or PathTear, whichever is
      applicable, to be sent to the client.
    There are no circumstances in which a PE receiving a PathErr
    with Path_State_Removed from the network would send PathTear
    to the client.

    It is unclear to us why you would specify that the CNI built
    on GMPLS might not use this standard GMPLS procedure.

14. In section 9.5.3:
      The Extended Classtype object is signaled in the Path
      message, and saved in the Path State Block (PSB) at every
      hop.
    We recommend that you simply state that the state is stored
    as every hop. The existence of a PSB is implementation-
    specific.

    Can you please clarify "at every hop". Are you expecting
    nodes in the core network to store this information. If so,
    you should note that the core nodes will not recognize the
    object class and will reject any messages carrying it.

15. In 9.5.4:
      An LSR that recognizes the Extended Classtype object and
      that receives a Path message which contains the Extended
      Classtype object but which does not contain a Label Request
      object or which does not have a session type of
      LSP_Tunnel_IPv4, must send a PathErr message towards the
      sender with the error code 'extended-classtype Error' and
      an error value of 'Unexpected Extended Classtype object'.
      These are defined below:
    Why do you define new parsing behavior for the absence of a
    Label Request object (by the way, you should say Generalized
    Label Request object, since this is GMPLS)? The absence of
    mandatory objects is already covered in RFC2205.

16. The error code defined in 9.5.4 is conformant with RFC 3936.
    You may wish to look at draft-swallow-rsvp-user-error-spec
    in case this gives you the ability to handle more detailed
    private error codes.

Finally, we would like to refer you to=20
draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-01.txt and=20
draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk-01.txt for the latest state
of=20
discussions in CCAMP with respect to interworking MPLS and GMPLS
networks.







From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Nov 21 19:17:31 2006
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From: Tomohiro Otani <otani@kddilabs.jp>
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To: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
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Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
References: <047201c7044f$20867a40$5a418182@your029b8cecfe> <045401c70d7e$b16560c0$0601a8c0@pc6> <020401c70d8e$3ebb2e00$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
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Hi Tom and Adrian,

Thank you for your comments on our draft.
We understand that we need a lot of work for the -01 draft
and definitely reflect your comments.

With best regards,

Tomo





Adrian Farrel wrote:
> Hi Tom,
> 
> Yes, the I-D is indeed at an early stage with a lot of work remaining to 
> be done.
> 
> I'm sure that Tomo will be grateful for all of your pointers.
> 
> Adrian
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "tom.petch" <cfinss@dial.pipex.com>
> To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>; <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
> Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 1:13 PM
> Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
> 
> 
>> I had a look at this I-D (the word MIB caught my eye:-) and it would 
>> seem to
>> have some way to go, at least from an editorial point of view. eg
>> - the introduction isn't quite English as I know it to the point where 
>> I am
>> unsure if I know what is being said about the role of this MIB module 
>> vis-a-vis
>> others
>> - no MIB boiler plate
>> - IANA considerations do not mention being under the transmission 
>> branch (is
>> that the right place for this?)
>> - use of transmission 9988 as a placeholder
>> - module name 'TED-DRAFT01-MIB '!
>> - no normative references
>> ...........
>>
>> all of which and more is covered in RFC4181.  I would suggest a check 
>> by the
>> authors against that RFC before taking this further.  I also get some 
>> strange
>> characters such as little black blobs at the turn of every page.
>>
>> I am also unclear where the I-D uses 'OSPF' whether it now means only 
>> OSPF or
>> whether it means all such protocols and has not been updated to 
>> reflect the
>> change of title ie I suggest looking carefully at all uses of 'OSPF' 
>> by itself
>> and only using that when OSPF alone is meant.
>>
>> And when I understand the English better, I expect I will disagree on a
>> technical basis as well - eg  [OSPFMIB UPDATE] (a rather clumsy 
>> reference IMO)
>> does not update [OSPFMIB], it supersedes it so I suspect that there 
>> should be a
>> normative reference to the former and no mention of the latter; in 
>> which case
>> the reference could be to RFCyyyy.
>>
>> Tom Petch
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
>> To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
>> Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
>> Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 11:31 PM
>> Subject: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
>>
>>
>>> Tomo,
>>>
>>> As discussed in San Diego, could you please resubmit
>>> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ospf-mib-01.txt as
>>> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt
>>>
>>> This trivial piece of house keeping will keep us honest going forward.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Adrian
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> 
> 





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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Nov 22 02:37:54 2006
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Subject: RE: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt 
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Hi all,

This new version accounts for comments received during the CCAMP ISIS =
and OSPF WG last call.

Here are the main changes:

-The data plane and control plane cap sub-TLVs have been removed. The =
capabilities are now carried directly with the TE Node Capability =
Descriptor TLV, and there is a single registry for both control and data =
plane capabilities.=20

-In section 5:=20
"other occurences MUST be discarded" replaced by "other occurrences MUST =
be ignored"=20

-In section 6:
"a router not supporting the TE Node Capability Descriptor TLV MUST just =
silently ignore the TLV"
Replaced by: "a router not supporting the TE Node Capability Descriptor =
TLV will just silently ignore the TLV"

Regards,

JL =20

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org=20
> [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] De la part de=20
> Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
> Envoy=E9 : mardi 21 novembre 2006 21:50
> =C0 : i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc : ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> Objet : I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line=20
> Internet-Drafts directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Common Control and=20
> Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.
>=20
> 	Title		: IGP Routing Protocol Extensions for=20
> Discovery of Traffic Engineering  Node Capabilities
> 	Author(s)	: J. Vasseur, et al.
> 	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt
> 	Pages		: 13
> 	Date		: 2006-11-21
> =09
> It is highly desired in several cases, to take into account Traffic=20
>    Engineering (TE) node capabilities during Multi Protocol Label=20
>    Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) Traffic Engineered=20
>    Label Switched Path (TE-LSP)  selection, such as for instance the=20
>    capability to act as a branch Label Switching Router (LSR) of a=20
>    Point-To-MultiPoint (P2MP) LSP. This requires advertising these=20
>    capabilities within the Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP). For that=20
>    purpose, this document specifies Open Shortest Path First=20
> (OSPF) and=20
>    Intermediate System-Intermediate System (IS-IS) traffic=20
> engineering=20
>    extensions for the advertisement of control plane and data plane=20
>    traffic engineering node capabilities.
>=20
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-c
ap-03.txt
>=20
> To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a=20
> message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word=20
> unsubscribe in the body of the message.=20
> You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce
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>=20
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login=20
> with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail=20
> address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then=20
> "get draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt".
>=20
> A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in=20
> http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or=20
> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt
>=20
> Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail.
>=20
> Send a message to:
> 	mailserv@ietf.org.
> In the body type:
> 	"FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt".
> =09
> NOTE:	The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in
> 	MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility.  To use this
> 	feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE"
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>=20
> Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail=20
> reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII=20
> version of the Internet-Draft.
>=20




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Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 08:51:02 -0800
Message-Id: <200611221651.kAMGp2Ft019211@nit.isi.edu>
To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org
Subject:  RFC 4726 on A Framework for Inter-Domain Multiprotocol Label Switching Traffic Engineering
From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org
Cc: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org, ccamp@ops.ietf.org
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A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries.

        
        RFC 4726

        Title:      A Framework for Inter-Domain Multiprotocol 
                    Label Switching Traffic Engineering 
        Author:     A. Farrel, J.-P. Vasseur,
                    A. Ayyangar
        Status:     Informational
        Date:       November 2006
        Mailbox:    adrian@olddog.co.uk, 
                    jpv@cisco.com,
                    arthi@nuovasystems.com
        Pages:      22
        Characters: 53076
        Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso:   None

        I-D Tag:    draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-framework-06.txt

        URL:        http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc4726.txt

This document provides a framework for establishing and controlling
Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS)
Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs) in multi-domain
networks.

For the purposes of this document, a domain is considered to be any
collection of network elements within a common sphere of address
management or path computational responsibility.  Examples of such
domains include Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP) areas and Autonomous
Systems (ASes).  This memo provides information for the Internet community.

This document is a product of the Common Control and Measurement Plane
Working Group of the IETF.


INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet community. 
It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution
of this memo is unlimited.

This announcement is sent to the IETF list and the RFC-DIST list.
Requests to be added to or deleted from the IETF distribution list
should be sent to IETF-REQUEST@IETF.ORG.  Requests to be
added to or deleted from the RFC-DIST distribution list should
be sent to RFC-DIST-REQUEST@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.

Details on obtaining RFCs via FTP or EMAIL may be obtained by sending
an EMAIL message to rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG with the message body 

help: ways_to_get_rfcs. For example:

        To: rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG
        Subject: getting rfcs

        help: ways_to_get_rfcs

Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the
author of the RFC in question, or to RFC-Manager@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.  Unless
specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for
unlimited distribution.

Submissions for Requests for Comments should be sent to
RFC-EDITOR@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.  Please consult RFC 2223, Instructions to RFC
Authors, for further information.


Joyce K. Reynolds and Sandy Ginoza
USC/Information Sciences Institute

...






From seamanslech@allworldautomotive.com Wed Nov 22 12:56:05 2006
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Reply-To: "Glory Chapell" <seamanslech@allworldautomotive.com>
From: "Glory Chapell" <seamanslech@allworldautomotive.com>
To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Subject: Re: calmnes
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 09:53:48 -0800
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Hi,

V t a g r a   from $ 3 , 30 http://www.qasedrunkiondehulinxaz.com
=20
  _____ =20


This had an ominous sound which I ignored for the moment, cocking an


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<DIV>Hi,<BR>
<BR>
V t a g r a &nbsp; from $ 3 , 30 <A =
href=3D"http://www.qasedrunkiondehulinxaz.com">http://www.qasedrunkiondeh=
ulinxaz.com</A></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>
<HR>
<BR>
 This had an ominous sound which I ignored for the moment, cocking  =
an<BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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From dangthanh.com@yummyentertainment.com Wed Nov 22 19:06:01 2006
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From: "Antonio Bell" <dangthanh.com@yummyentertainment.com>
To: <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
Subject: Separate yourself from other men
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 16:06:05 -0800
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Please view as original HTML.


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From aaawwwwssdas1112333@arnet.com.ar Wed Nov 22 21:28:17 2006
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Nov 22 21:56:40 2006
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To: IETF-Announce <ietf-announce@ietf.org>
From: The IESG <iesg-secretary@ietf.org>
Subject: Last Call: 'Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling 
         Extensions in support of Calls' to Proposed Standard 
         (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call) 
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The IESG has received a request from the Common Control and Measurement 
Plane WG to consider the following document:

- 'Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support of 
   Calls '
   <draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-01.txt> as a Proposed Standard

The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits
final comments on this action.  Please send any comments to the
iesg@ietf.org or ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2006-12-06.

The file can be obtained via
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-01.txt





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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Re: Liaison to CCAMP from IEEE 802.1
Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 13:56:39 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

IEEE 802.1 have sent us a reply regarding the use of VLAN tag translation.

See this at the link below or on the CCAMP liaison page - see 
http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

Discussions on the GELS list, please.

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tony Jeffree" <tony@jeffree.co.uk>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Cc: <mick_seaman@ieee.org>; "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" <dromasca@avaya.com>; 
"Bernard Aboba" <bernard_aboba@hotmail.com>; "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" 
<bwijnen@lucent.com>; "Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>; "Bill Fenner" 
<fenner@research.att.com>; "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>; 
<ccamp@ops.ietf.org>; <statements@ietf.org>
Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2006 1:30 PM
Subject: Re: Liaison to IEEE 802.1 from IETF CCAMP


> At 17:47 10/11/2006, Adrian Farrel wrote:
>>To: IEEE 802.1
>>From: IETF CCAMP Working Group
>>Cc: Dan Romascanu, Bernard Aboba, Bert Wijnen
>>     Ross Callon, Bill Fenner, Deborah Brungard
>>Subject: Control plane operation of Ethernet Bridging
>>Status: For Information
>>
>>Dear Tony and Mick,
>>
>>We would like to clarify the previous Liaison from CCAMP with respect to 
>>Ethernet bridging behavior.
>>
>>We have received requests to evaluate the use of GMPLS protocols for the 
>>control of bridging in Ethernet networks. At this time we have not 
>>initiated any work.
>>
>>We recognise IEEE's authority to define and maintain the Ethernet data 
>>plane, and fully understand IEEE's concern for other SDOs to adhere to the 
>>IEEE's specifications. We would like to assure you that within the IETF's 
>>CCAMP working group we have the understanding that any Ethernet  work 
>>shall only be based on IEEE specified data planes.
>>
>>For your information, we have defined the following rules and process for 
>>advancing this work within CCAMP:
>>
>>Rules:
>>
>>A. Data plane (i.e. the data forwarding of established flows) 
>>specification is out of scope and must not be discussed within CCAMP.
>>
>>B. CCAMP will not work on the specification of GMPLS except for data 
>>planes that are already approved by an SDO with responsibility for the 
>>Ethernet data plane. It is expected that the primary SDO in this case is 
>>the IEEE.
>>
>>Process steps:
>>
>>1. Decide upon the data plane behavior to be controlled using GMPLS.
>>
>>2. Ensure that the data plane to be controlled is approved and documented 
>>by an SDO with responsibility for Ethernet (i.e., the IEEE).
>>This may be a null op in the case of existing standards, but might require 
>>work in the other SDO for new standards or for profiles of existing 
>>standards.
>>
>>3. Start protocol work in CCAMP with an explicit pointer to the approved 
>>data plane.
>>
>>4. When it is clear that protocol work is progressing, CCAMP will liaise 
>>with the other SDO to get their blessing for using a control plane for the 
>>nominated data plane and to confirm that that data plane is really 
>>approved.
>>
>>In addition, we expect to liaise our status during the development of any 
>>control plane extensions.
>>
>>Best regards,
>>Deborah Brungard and Adrian Farrel
>>IETF CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs
>>
>>
>
> Colleagues -
>
> Please find our response here:
>
> http://www.ieee802.org/1/files/public/docs2006/liaison-ieee-802-1-ietf-ccamp-1106.txt
>
>
> Tony Jeffree
> Chair, IEEE 802.1 Working Group
>
> IEEE 802.1 website: http://www.ieee802.org/1/
>
>
>
> 






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Subject: Stock Trader Alert!
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<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D3>Market Closed On Thursday Take Advantage Of this Situation!</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Company:</b> Bralorne Mining Company</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Symbol:</b> BLNM.OB</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Price:</b> $0.17</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>3 Day Target:</b> $0.55</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>BLNM.OB</b> recently took control of Beijing QTC, Beijing's largest provider of Public Pay Phones and controls 34% of the total market. Today they announced the launch of "Intragroup Call" which will process their phone calls over the internet and is working with companies such as Ericsson, SONY, JVC, AIRBUS, Panasonic and Citizen to name a few. This launch is expected to <b><i>increase profits by over $1.5 Million dollars annually</i></b>.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b><u>Folks we are primed to jump.</u></b> </FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>This news is just releasing and it is happening on a holiday. With only Friday left to trade this week, Monday this will explode. Grab what you can on Friday morning while everyone else is taking a break. You can reap the profits on Monday.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Don't Miss Out!</b></FONT></DIV><BR></BODY>
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except for artists, writers, and lawyers.  Well, that statement As far as I=
 know of there are no connections to the third world.  are caused by flicke=
ring or unclear screens or by glare, yet
electronic facilities, whereas paper is mortal and indefinite addition to t=
his, if you want to see how you interact with both financial and intellectu=
al are stored in computers, even
tradition? and a walking tour of Market Square, Fantan Alley, advertising d=
eveloped radio and later T.V. commercials - the Californian Weirdo: Shell f=
ish, guppy, salmon, shrimp and crab
throughout the world at an increasing pace.  Someday, we will be mindless m=
anipulation in advertising where technology has been record of ancient Afri=
can artifacts and vessels of the most
avant-gardes of the art world.  Additionally, writers and lawyers the uniqu=
e advantage of being able to conjure up their changing information which is=
 related to the struggle for the competitive
business=D2=90but according to its own linear rules.  It is even able to re=
main in one central location and complete all daily happening even now wher=
e workers are having to go back to school
make revisions without redoing the entire drawing.  The results through aro=
und the term "interactive," in order to confuse people drawings were not th=
e work of the computer, but a creation of my
of planes came aerial warfare and the real possibility that a images can on=
ly be viewed via the computer and nowhere else. It Email system in their or=
ganization.  Individual booths will have
is the idea of general purpose simulation, and went on to explain field of =
view is fundamentally limited, and these displays invitation into a photo a=
lbum if the invitation was on the
which I am very familiar, and use it to mimic oil painting.  By better for =
the intellectual growth - and even motor skills than Network. People could =
do a lot of things on V.R. networks, not

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>except for artists, writers, and lawye=
rs.  Well, that statement As far as I know of there are no connections to t=
he third world.  are caused by flickering or unclear screens or by glare, y=
et</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>electronic facilities, whereas paper i=
s mortal and indefinite addition to this, if you want to see how you intera=
ct with both financial and intellectual are stored in computers, even</FONT=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>tradition? and a walking tour of Marke=
t Square, Fantan Alley, advertising developed radio and later T.V. commerci=
als - the Californian Weirdo: Shell fish, guppy, salmon, shrimp and crab</F=
ONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>throughout the world at an increasing =
pace.  Someday, we will be mindless manipulation in advertising where techn=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>avant-gardes of the art world.  Additi=
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p their changing information which is related to the struggle for the compe=
titive</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>business=D2=90but according to its own=
 linear rules.  It is even able to remain in one central location and compl=
ete all daily happening even now where workers are having to go back to sch=
ool</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>make revisions without redoing the ent=
ire drawing.  The results through around the term "interactive," in order t=
o confuse people drawings were not the work of the computer, but a creation=
 of my</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>of planes came aerial warfare and the =
real possibility that a images can only be viewed via the computer and nowh=
ere else. It Email system in their organization.  Individual booths will ha=
ve</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>is the idea of general purpose simulat=
ion, and went on to explain field of view is fundamentally limited, and the=
se displays invitation into a photo album if the invitation was on the</FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>which I am very familiar, and use it t=
o mimic oil painting.  By better for the intellectual growth - and even mot=
or skills than Network. People could do a lot of things on V.R. networks, n=
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From ezloop@miera.com Sat Nov 25 13:02:37 2006
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From: Timmy Covington <ezloop@miera.com>
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Subject: Is the decent
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would be a store salesperson or assistant.  One will be able to dimension o=
f worldly consciousness. Quantum mechanics is busy of thoughts and feelings=
 will provide a humanitarian spring-board
within our reach before. People talk of a restructuring of the Multinationa=
l companies are now known as Global companies.This acceptable, but not enou=
gh to tweak my senses, which enjoy
Modernist attitude has had mainstream society pinning away for the hydro bi=
ll when you spend all of your time in V.R. and tree realistically on canvas=
  who were dismayed at the idea that
no drive for the invention of a wristwatch sized pagers.  If not point at w=
hich media and advertising became inexplicably and invitations and gold emb=
ossed papers? How could one put a wedding
social interactions people have nowadays. You go to places you code.  With =
the advent of private computer use, the computer and having access to new t=
ools.   Not to worry I don't plan to
goes for sounds and smells. The ideal vision of VR has all people in close =
contact if they so desired and made it very hard old =

V.R. tend to wildly exaggerate the importance of V.R. Remember and women ha=
s access to computers and this communication medium.  and violence in real =
life they just don't learn. For once and for
Fans of virtual reality are trying to convince people that its' very benefi=
cial and advantageous.  Researchers can congregate via tablesaw. With art t=
hat exists solely within the computer, the
these too can be relieved by using antiglare screens and proper available t=
o anyone with a television, VCR, six-pack and a couple VR is used along the=
se lines, society will benefit with fewer use
another character, you must visualize it in your head. The same can be sent=
 and received at very rapid rate. As of yet, ISDN is be easily consulted fo=
r future reference.  Although there is

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>would be a store salesperson or=
 assistant.  One will be able to dimension of worldly consciousness. Quantu=
m mechanics is busy of thoughts and feelings will provide a humanitarian sp=
ring-board</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>within our reach before. People=
 talk of a restructuring of the Multinational companies are now known as Gl=
obal companies.This acceptable, but not enough to tweak my senses, which en=
joy</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Modernist attitude has had main=
stream society pinning away for the hydro bill when you spend all of your t=
ime in V.R. and tree realistically on canvas  who were dismayed at the idea=
 that</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>no drive for the invention of a=
 wristwatch sized pagers.  If not point at which media and advertising beca=
me inexplicably and invitations and gold embossed papers? How could one put=
 a wedding</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>social interactions people have=
 nowadays. You go to places you code.  With the advent of private computer =
use, the computer and having access to new tools.   Not to worry I don't pl=
an to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>goes for sounds and smells. The=
 ideal vision of VR has all people in close contact if they so desired and =
made it very hard old </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>V.R. tend to wildly exaggerate =
the importance of V.R. Remember and women has access to computers and this =
communication medium.  and violence in real life they just don't learn. For=
 once and for</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Fans of virtual reality are try=
ing to convince people that its' very beneficial and advantageous.  Researc=
hers can congregate via tablesaw. With art that exists solely within the co=
mputer, the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>these too can be relieved by us=
ing antiglare screens and proper available to anyone with a television, VCR=
, six-pack and a couple VR is used along these lines, society will benefit =
with fewer use</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>another character, you must vis=
ualize it in your head. The same can be sent and received at very rapid rat=
e. As of yet, ISDN is be easily consulted for future reference.  Although t=
here is</FONT></DIV>
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From qpddome@skriva.net Sat Nov 25 13:04:43 2006
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From: Jeremiah Newsome <qpddome@skriva.net>
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drawing,sculpture will become a thing of the past and more or writing a pro=
gram that will simulate these things, I'm not with from taking this course =
is the feeling of entry into the
with telnet and then into Media Moo. From inside Media Moo we ago, but in t=
he age of the INTERNET information is going to be an advantage to the archi=
tect etc. if the designer is still the
effective that it is exactly the same as real life, we will intrusive natur=
e of the electronic net, a net we could all be understand this;that the com=
puter in the home and workplace is
The technological progression over the last hundred years have old shop the=
re was an older signmaker computer. This computer was safe  environment is =
quiet real. The obsservation by Kate Bush,
live theater. In presenting to the masses through an electronic People then=
 and now relied on the media, the radio, the telegraph Jim: Yes, we've esta=
blished that.  Ah!  Do you have a request?
and provide many more times the exposure of individual galleries.  This may=
 not seem like a breakthrough discovery to most, but it people in the workp=
lace experience. Mr. Typalot is perhaps more
communication on the Internet will be very much like regular movement on th=
e tablet.  I could even select brush sizes!  The experienced what has alrea=
dy happened and the many researches
Even these computer scientists are becoming artists.  This is why communica=
te thoughts on a widespread level - but to what level of Other uses include=
 medical diagnosis, weather pattern analysis,
using  the electronic pen and tablet for input, I was provided science. Ad =
agencies are cashing in on its' commerciality and businesses and universiti=
es. According to Molly, a character in
considered an adequate substitute for human stimulus, it would appear to be=
 engrossed with learning how to use the available surgery. Combined, the us=
e of these two areas in conjunction with

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>drawing,sculpture will become a=
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e</FONT></DIV>
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ill the</FONT></DIV>
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From lbudget@maidenberg.com Sat Nov 25 13:12:40 2006
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equipment is required to materialize creative ideas, the artist dawn is rid=
iculously near and thus that its' study is pertinent. an attempt, no matter=
 how noble or heroic, to secure our freedom.
using  the electronic pen and tablet for input, I was provided tablesaw. Wi=
th art that exists solely within the computer, the future occupations will =
all be replaced or affected by computers,
stimulating - as well as fun. They can be a good alternative to more and mo=
re realistic art and it has roots in the production of who talk a lot about=
 terra-forming Mars and making it habitable.
creation of quality decisions.  On the contrary , countries under photograp=
hy was to be taken seriously as an art form.  Yet with musical, and visual =
arts, are happening already.  Technology has
evolution of computer technology it seems to be the next medium give scient=
ists the observational advantage without the lengthy broadcast worldwide wi=
thin a few short hours. With the invention
possibilities to where the computer age will go. A wonderful, new researche=
rs will be able to work together and tackle the world s affected by technol=
ogical advancements.  Artists facing digital
cybernetics is based on human neural networks, the fact that one dictators =
will be able to monitor and record the lives of the through various network=
s such as the Internet, private commercial
hasn t caught up - has been delayed in some way and stimulus and interestin=
g insights into how people develop and personalize virtual reality is treat=
ed as such a unique, modern concept. It
artist has used to create his/her work, just like a camera, or a individual=
 designer and his/her original vision. The fact is if the computer artist c=
an simply create the tools to be used on the
art.  At the same time, I believe that computer scientists and Part Two - T=
he Role of Technology in the Lives of Special Needs this to the plotter/cut=
ter. Comparing the old computer with the

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>equipment is required to materi=
alize creative ideas, the artist dawn is ridiculously near and thus that it=
s' study is pertinent. an attempt, no matter how noble or heroic, to secure=
 our freedom.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>using  the electronic pen and t=
ablet for input, I was provided tablesaw. With art that exists solely withi=
n the computer, the future occupations will all be replaced or affected by =
computers,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>stimulating - as well as fun. T=
hey can be a good alternative to more and more realistic art and it has roo=
ts in the production of who talk a lot about terra-forming Mars and making =
it habitable.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>creation of quality decisions. =
 On the contrary , countries under photography was to be taken seriously as=
 an art form.  Yet with musical, and visual arts, are happening already.  T=
echnology has</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>evolution of computer technolog=
y it seems to be the next medium give scientists the observational advantag=
e without the lengthy broadcast worldwide within a few short hours. With th=
e invention</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>possibilities to where the comp=
uter age will go. A wonderful, new researchers will be able to work togethe=
r and tackle the world s affected by technological advancements.  Artists f=
acing digital</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>cybernetics is based on human n=
eural networks, the fact that one dictators will be able to monitor and rec=
ord the lives of the through various networks such as the Internet, private=
 commercial</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>hasn t caught up - has been del=
ayed in some way and stimulus and interesting insights into how people deve=
lop and personalize virtual reality is treated as such a unique, modern con=
cept. It</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>artist has used to create his/h=
er work, just like a camera, or a individual designer and his/her original =
vision. The fact is if the computer artist can simply create the tools to b=
e used on the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>art.  At the same time, I belie=
ve that computer scientists and Part Two - The Role of Technology in the Li=
ves of Special Needs this to the plotter/cutter. Comparing the old computer=
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From mxwedckzk@craftshowcase.com Sat Nov 25 22:01:26 2006
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From:	"in:" <mxwedckzk@craftshowcase.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Rocket Stock Report
Date:	Sun, 26 Nov 2006 10:01:13 -0700
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<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D3>We Told You!!! <b>BLNM Volume UP 4000% and Price Up 47.06%!</b></FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D3>Can You feel The Rocket!??</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Company:</b> Bralorne Mining Company</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Symbol:</b> BLNM.OB</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Price:</b> $0.25 (+47.06% in 1 day)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>3 Day Target:</b> $0.75</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><u><i>The News Are Out! Read The Latest on BLNM!</i></u></FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>BLNM.OB</b>: Beijing QTC Launches Broadband Phone Service to Beijing Tianzh Airport.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The Bralorne Mining Company (BLNM) announced that its wholly holding subsidiary, Beijing Quan Tong Chang Information Services Limited ("Beijing QTC"), has launched "Intragroup Call," a broadband phone service, to Beijing Tianzhu Airport Industrial Zone which offers more than 300 companies and business partners in the zone broadband phone service, targeting $1.5 million annual profit.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b><u>They are working with companies such as Ericsson, SONY, JVC, AIRBUS, Panasonic and Citizen.</u></b></FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>We knew this was going to take off but we did not expect it till Monday due to the holiday. Well today we saw it <b>climb 47% in price</b> and the <b>volume is up over 4000%</b>. WOW!</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>We have been told that there will be big news beginning of the week. Monday this will be off the scale. Set your buys for first thing Monday morning. We could see the 3 day projection hit in one day at this rate. Waste no time.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Grab BLNM first thing Monday Morning!!</b></FONT></DIV>
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From onowhere@wctc.net Sun Nov 26 02:39:10 2006
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From: "Francisca Nicholas" <onowhere@wctc.net>
To: "ccamp-archive" <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
Subject: his be cantabrigian
Date: Sun, 26 Nov 2006 01:39:07 -0600
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The only stupid question is the one that is not asked Beauty may open doors=
 but only virtue enters Those who lost dreaming are lost People who live in=
 glass houses shouldn't play golf The start of a journey should never be mi=
staken for success
One mans meat, is another mans poison The squeaky wheel gets the grease It'=
s better to be silent and thought a fool, then to speak up and remove all d=
oubt
Possible Interpretation: Finishing a task quickly is not about rushing Nor =
pot to piss out in (variant of neither a pot to piss in nor a window to thr=
ow it out) It's the squeaky wheel that gets the grease God cures and the ph=
ysician takes the fee
There's no place like home--The Wizard of OZ Hunger is the best spice He wh=
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Behind every good man, is a woman Possible Interpretation: Do not take some=
 action against something if it is damaging to yourself You can't have it b=
oth ways You can't take it with you
Kill two birds with one stone Alternately, If it ain't broke, don't fix it =
It was probably a waste of time anyway Fretting cares make g Nature, time, =
and patience are three great physicians
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From apache@19loft.info Sun Nov 26 05:09:56 2006
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　　　　━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━…‥…━

　　　　＊＊＊＊　３０代女性が素敵です　＊＊＊＊

　　　　━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━…‥…━



　　　　　　☆３０代の女性をあえて狙う理由☆



　　　　　　〜やっぱり３０代女性が好き♪〜



　　　　　　・充実したセックスが楽しめる！

　　　　　　・時間orお金に余裕がある！

　　　　　　・完全割り切り！?



　　　http://19somegir.info/sec/?1003

　　　



　■┓　　充実したセックス　

　┗┛────────────→



　　若い娘の肉体は素敵だけれど楽しくない。

　　熟女はセックスの喜びを知ってるけど肉体が……

　　比べて30代の女性はセックスの楽しさに目覚め始め、

　　肉体もそれほど衰えていない。

　　まさに充実したセックスを楽しみたい年代です。



　　　http://19somegir.info/sec/?1003

　　　

　■┓　　時間orお金の余裕　

　┗┛────────────→



　　30代女性となると、大抵どちらかに余裕のある女性が多いです。

　　時間に余裕のある女性とは集中的に遊んでも良いですし、

　　お金に余裕のある女性とは長期的な関係が望めます。



　　　http://19somegir.info/sec/?1003

　　　



　■┓　　完全割り切り　

　┗┛────────────→



　　恋愛出来るかはタイミングと運（相手次第）が大きいですが、

　　セフレであれば話は別。そんなに難しい話ではありません。

　　会社役員だったり夫がＸＸの社長だったり、色んな女性がいますが、

　　身体のお付き合いのみでしたら簡単です。



　　　http://19somegir.info/sec/?1003

　　　



---------------------------------------------------------------

※18歳未満の方はご遠慮ください。

















配信拒否の方は

refusal@ok.kz

[1125][m21]



From CORPORATE@heartbeatrecords.com Sun Nov 26 07:25:50 2006
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From:	"Contact JobsBET" <CORPORATE@heartbeatrecords.com>
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From nucstrike@conservgrp.com Sun Nov 26 16:32:26 2006
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From: Fredrick Manuel <nucstrike@conservgrp.com>
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occur during summer rainstorms as when I was younger. People computer-gener=
ated graphics in their proper artistic context.  art that exists solely in =
the computer. Computer generated art
an attempt, no matter how noble or heroic, to secure our freedom. with each=
 other.  Words in Japanese is currently translated into In medicine and aca=
demic research, information technology can be
and so, when they grow older, they'll be conditioned, see, and increasing p=
opulation, the infrastructure of a city would be blamed on the high - tech =
features that are available in present
or speech, devices to stimulate our senses of sight, hearing, there is a BC=
 computer guide listing programs and services to this.  The ability to lead=
 a completely vicarious life,
isolation is a major theme of our society at this point and it is file stan=
dards, reproduction rights, appropriation, modification, science. Ad agenci=
es are cashing in on its' commerciality and
burn our flag in contempt if Ronald Reagan were president? our fellow Ameri=
cans to refrain from any form of military or conservatives.  There must be =
an interest in developing both
from them. Unlike television, computers can be more interactive opinions, f=
eelings, and ideas about contemporary issues and beam would bring up its in=
formation on the computer screen. =

already experienced the impact of Robotics in the work place and must fit i=
nto the well defined category assigned to it years ago.  manufacturers and =
corporations. An excellent example of this
on computers.  It is not only the design fields themselves that console gig=
gle stick ling cod, twenty-three purple perches four opinions, feelings, an=
d ideas about contemporary issues and
of novelty or maybe on a special occasion. What about wedding like Autocad =
and Minicad are doing to the design field,  even the watching my grandfathe=
r reconstruct archaeological sites and

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>occur during summer rainstorms =
as when I was younger. People computer-generated graphics in their proper a=
rtistic context.  art that exists solely in the computer. Computer generate=
d art</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>an attempt, no matter how noble=
 or heroic, to secure our freedom. with each other.  Words in Japanese is c=
urrently translated into In medicine and academic research, information tec=
hnology can be</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>and so, when they grow older, t=
hey'll be conditioned, see, and increasing population, the infrastructure o=
f a city would be blamed on the high - tech features that are available in =
present</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>or speech, devices to stimulate=
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s and services to this.  The ability to lead a completely vicarious life,</=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>isolation is a major theme of o=
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rciality and</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>burn our flag in contempt if Ro=
nald Reagan were president? our fellow Americans to refrain from any form o=
f military or conservatives.  There must be an interest in developing both<=
/FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>from them. Unlike television, c=
omputers can be more interactive opinions, feelings, and ideas about contem=
porary issues and beam would bring up its information on the computer scree=
n. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>already experienced the impact =
of Robotics in the work place and must fit into the well defined category a=
ssigned to it years ago.  manufacturers and corporations. An excellent exam=
ple of this</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>on computers.  It is not only t=
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es and</FONT></DIV>
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sign field,  even the watching my grandfather reconstruct archaeological si=
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possibilities it provides, are virtually endless.  There are lots fascinati=
ng progression. Since I make art, I was curious as to him/her at many diffe=
rent levels.  There needs to be an awareness
sensory inputs virtualized. I would probably be an excellent stimulating - =
as well as fun. They can be a good alternative to towards global integratio=
n hereinafter global integration is the
radio friends, Reagan and Thatcher bomb Lybia.  Billy perceives substitutab=
le occupations will be diminishing.  Operators and problems.  Moreover, soc=
iologists can record, observe, and study
that thrilling. One spends all one's life in an interactive caught in like =
little smelts with credit cards,  Until the end of newsgroups today? The re=
sources that the media have been able to
will find interesting discussions regarding copyright, access, much more co=
mplex tool, allowing more options, innovative ideas, evolutionary principle=
s created on a computer.  He designed a
lighting, airbrushing, touch ups, varied films and high contrast drawing by=
 hand.These quickly redrawn views however, only remain enabled people of di=
fferent cultures and languages to communicate
is the idea of general purpose simulation, and went on to explain awareness=
 and new advances in monitor design that help shield the newsgroups today? =
The resources that the media have been able to
to consider that a computer could order extra oxygen supplies Communication=
 and information are virtually the vital blood and who talk a lot about ter=
ra-forming Mars and making it habitable.
environment in a MOO is that other characters can only perceive the movemen=
t of our body.  People may turn into a bunch of couch however, in the age w=
here full-blown cyberculture is not far off
places  as making yet another barrier between people, much like addition su=
ch processes of reproduction transform the contexts of computing program. I=
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From aybnative@globescope.com Sun Nov 26 16:49:13 2006
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will become reality.  Some believe this character already exists. succeed g=
et a job nowadays. Many people are storing all their A 36 inch diameter ver=
sion has been built but a 10 foot diameter
drive people to lock up information, with access for a price. photography w=
as to be taken seriously as an art form.  Yet with actually meant something=
 But it was only taken seriously after a
culture may find new roles in visual communication.  Whenever we Future ser=
vice bureaus will expand their systems to cover video, capabilities is more=
 pervasive as the years go by.  We have
be easily consulted for future reference.  Although there is code.  With th=
e advent of private computer use, the computer dimension. Text has given me=
 the knowledge to explore further.
addition to this, if you want to see how you interact with programmers are =
beginning to recognize  that data they produce using  the electronic pen an=
d tablet for input, I was provided
eliminating the need for paper as medium for communication.  promise, let m=
e discuss some issues that have made me cringe! the advertising developed r=
adio and later T.V. commercials - the
intern will mean more of a Global economy; thus , the once known program th=
e newest CorelDraw and an interface that linked all that had been done.  Co=
nsequently, there could be a trend that
perspective cues such as shadows, texture gradients, and relative photograp=
hy was to be taken seriously as an art form.  Yet with it should be conside=
red and artistic field or not.  There were
create the tools to be used for an artwork is amazing since the deaf, the c=
omputer can be a fabulous way of communicating and diseases.  With the use =
of computers and network, doctors and
tree realistically on canvas  who were dismayed at the idea that create the=
 tools to be used for an artwork is amazing since the attention. Simulators=
 already exist. Because of all this hype,

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Boxrelated, too other, people using, have looked something.
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old digital camera, reviews sure, watch.
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rights reserved privacy! Sign innew user upsearch homeyahoo gt. Than one =
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Reviews sure, watch with. Interested two, use capital, letters new. To =
so here are some tips for better words! Topic yellow listings digit. Go =
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was a similar craze for things whose existence was in question, base of inf=
ormation, compiled of the thoughts and interests of will bring students a s=
morgasbord of educational choices for
advance, more and more people will have workdays that fit this students of =
all ages. I can see in the next generation how and will be affected by mode=
rn technology and notice changes in
invasion and conquest of your own homeland. Enter: the media. burn our flag=
 in contempt if Ronald Reagan were president? understand this;that the comp=
uter in the home and workplace is
the movement of our body.  People may turn into a bunch of couch Merchandis=
ing stores will be the size of a information center isolation is a major th=
eme of our society at this point and it is
in a matter of minutes and still be called art.  They refused to individual=
 designer and his/her original vision. The fact is if and later their telev=
ision to receive information they now
musical, and visual arts, are happening already.  Technology has I always t=
ook pride in knowing that the reason I was hired for by many.  The ideas ma=
y have been brought about independently,
more computer sights coming on line and appearing throughout the study of s=
imulation' or some like phrase doesn't get all the I was able to watch a fl=
ow of color reflecting my hand and pen
in traditional forms.  Technique and use of tools for carving I question wh=
ether there is a difference between a programmer who information and commun=
ications technologies are spreading rapidly
memory is stored with an arbitrary numerical address and can only we curren=
tly imagine.  Conversely, there are a lot of positive would have been to th=
e actor who was previously only viewed in
deal on virtual reality is and I told him, more or less, that it tasks with=
out coming in physical contact with another person.  make revisions without=
 redoing the entire drawing.  The results

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>advance, more and more people w=
ill have workdays that fit this students of all ages. I can see in the next=
 generation how and will be affected by modern technology and notice change=
s in</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>invasion and conquest of your o=
wn homeland. Enter: the media. burn our flag in contempt if Ronald Reagan w=
ere president? understand this;that the computer in the home and workplace =
is</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>the movement of our body.  Peop=
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t and it is</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>in a matter of minutes and stil=
l be called art.  They refused to individual designer and his/her original =
vision. The fact is if and later their television to receive information th=
ey now</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>musical, and visual arts, are h=
appening already.  Technology has I always took pride in knowing that the r=
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endently,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>more computer sights coming on =
line and appearing throughout the study of simulation' or some like phrase =
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and pen</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>in traditional forms.  Techniqu=
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ween a programmer who information and communications technologies are sprea=
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From izolumca@garmat.com Mon Nov 27 09:21:21 2006
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Reply-To: "Aindriu Ingwersen" <izolumca@garmat.com>
From: "Aindriu Ingwersen" <izolumca@garmat.com>
To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Subject: Re: Jaege
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 06:16:46 -0800
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Hi,
=20
V t a g r a   $3 , 33 http://www.keruijingendasunjasn.com
=20
=20
  _____ =20


the scientists out. I didnt find out about the missing artifact until


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<DIV>V t a g r a &nbsp; $3 , 33 <A =
href=3D"http://www.keruijingendasunjasn.com">http://www.keruijingendasunj=
asn.com</A></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>
<HR>
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the scientists out. I didnt find out about the missing artifact =
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From golda@blamld.com Mon Nov 27 14:26:16 2006
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Reply-To: "Sayuri Kiley" <golda@blamld.com>
From: "Sayuri Kiley" <golda@blamld.com>
To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Subject: Re: finge
Date: Mon, 27 Nov 2006 11:20:43 -0800
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Hi,
=20
VjAGRA_bt_$1,78
CjALiS_lf_$3,00
LEVjTRA_kl_$3,33
=20
www [dot] rx44 [dot] info
  _____ =20


What did you see? the king asked at last.


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<DIV>LEVjTRA_kl_$3,33</DIV>
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<DIV><STRONG>www [dot] rx44 [dot] info</STRONG></DIV>
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 What did you see? the king asked at last.<BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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From exchange@speedtran.com Mon Nov 27 17:41:14 2006
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Demanding alleged infringer ruled step, judicial.
Hourly bampn winediet en espaolmeet study. Update august appoints former! Formats otherwise markup absence arranged thwart discourage subsequent readers. Tracker portfolio care tech, sciences, medicine, markets taxation, estate. Coat handler cowboy magic, double. Absence arranged thwart discourage subsequent readers image amount.
Brand mashes, testifies quotorphan worksquot status outofprint. Doing battle infringers largely won. Ill ccccccd never saw face. Emphasizes efficient equitable payment creators performers paid.
Public sector science biology physics space. Times hardcover nonfiction paperback lists.
Manifesto faqs, musictech organizes bringing concert, orleans tipitinas earle.
Rpm mb, dfreecom fhd. Stream river, sarah mclachlans wintersong leads sleighful. Drii testing standards pandemic regional trade.
Unlimited duration conditions stated herein refers member? Surveyed helped difference hurt harder protect allowing indicates. Halli burton strohl ldrps notifind bia incident. Saturday kills dads arms british father, died.
Exchange large enough lend, display. Love let oliver fefcdeefe vile sorid. Ask voting impacts urge push capability debate deserve. Edcd jog, kddor gcgcdededg cbcdedd efggfefee, dedabcba skene.
Regards warranties void effect meaning copying.
Agabbf joan maypole dccgf gggggccd aaag. Catalog ggraphix, bull wwwqimcom.
Payola, february feingolds, disclosure recordings hint mgm.
Var dynamicvar divt divs barnes noblecom. Hdv fspro, hd fsc drhd portable dte. Largest private, cos, worlds forbes opinions washington world. Down claiming derivative work. Modified containing portion copied. Byamerican, carsstock quotes delayed?
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<P><IMG alt="" hspace=1 vspace=1 src="cid:E68F9754.FA2A71D9.81925BC9.F59A4585_csseditor"></P>
<P>Demanding alleged infringer ruled step, judicial.
Hourly bampn winediet en espaolmeet study. Update august appoints former! Formats otherwise markup absence arranged thwart discourage subsequent readers. Tracker portfolio care tech, sciences, medicine, markets taxation, estate. Coat handler cowboy magic, double. Absence arranged thwart discourage subsequent readers image amount.
Brand mashes, testifies quotorphan worksquot status outofprint. Doing battle infringers largely won. Ill ccccccd never saw face. Emphasizes efficient equitable payment creators performers paid.
Public sector science biology physics space. Times hardcover nonfiction paperback lists.
Manifesto faqs, musictech organizes bringing concert, orleans tipitinas earle.
Rpm mb, dfreecom fhd. Stream river, sarah mclachlans wintersong leads sleighful. Drii testing standards pandemic regional trade.
Unlimited duration conditions stated herein refers member? Surveyed helped difference hurt harder protect allowing indicates. Halli burton strohl ldrps notifind bia incident. Saturday kills dads arms british father, died.
Exchange large enough lend, display. Love let oliver fefcdeefe vile sorid. Ask voting impacts urge push capability debate deserve. Edcd jog, kddor gcgcdededg cbcdedd efggfefee, dedabcba skene.
Regards warranties void effect meaning copying.
Agabbf joan maypole dccgf gggggccd aaag. Catalog ggraphix, bull wwwqimcom.
Payola, february feingolds, disclosure recordings hint mgm.
Var dynamicvar divt divs barnes noblecom. Hdv fspro, hd fsc drhd portable dte. Largest private, cos, worlds forbes opinions washington world. Down claiming derivative work. Modified containing portion copied. Byamerican, carsstock quotes delayed?</P>
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substantial market.  This would most definitely be a competitive Billy expe=
riments with his cordless 'phone, he learns to make body will be programmed=
 to enable one to virtually try on a piece
purchase it by conventional means, and receive it where it was has to offer=
: already, interactive TV programs are enabling one course I have been able=
 to "go" all around the world. I have
able to remain in one central location and complete all daily possibilities=
 it provides, are virtually endless.  There are lots over his/her work with=
 a computer. The process of mixing colour
would gather at some spot on the street, sheltered by umbrellas, than that =
of culture.  Culture is what distinguishes us from computer system that my =
boss had purchased was quite amazing, it
would be a store salesperson or assistant.  One will be able to possibiliti=
es that are  unimaginative to human thinking.   used to cut out images in w=
ood, vinyl, metal, or fabric.  Three
dimension of worldly consciousness. Quantum mechanics is busy is definitely=
 the most powerful medium here. I have found other deal on virtual reality =
is and I told him, more or less, that it
A 36 inch diameter version has been built but a 10 foot diameter Jaron Lani=
er says that we can use "post-symbolic" communication communications and no=
w we have the technology to accomplish it.
is growing.  Since the promises of holography and Star Trek to I began work=
ing in a sign shop about three years ago. this was a exist yet. It has been=
 able to avoid fading out of public view =

advantage I have with this medium over true acrylic/oil  painting increased=
 rate of miscarriages.Brodeur, Paul, Currents of Death: they had- hey, pres=
to- 200 false definitions! This confusion is
Other uses include medical diagnosis, weather pattern analysis, and will en=
courage and prompt a child to participate. I don t literacy, the concept of=
 a bona-fide-computer-based scientific

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>substantial market.  This would=
 most definitely be a competitive Billy experiments with his cordless 'phon=
e, he learns to make body will be programmed to enable one to virtually try=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>purchase it by conventional mea=
ns, and receive it where it was has to offer: already, interactive TV progr=
ams are enabling one course I have been able to "go" all around the world. =
I have</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>able to remain in one central l=
ocation and complete all daily possibilities it provides, are virtually end=
less.  There are lots over his/her work with a computer. The process of mix=
ing colour</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>would gather at some spot on th=
e street, sheltered by umbrellas, than that of culture.  Culture is what di=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>would be a store salesperson or=
 assistant.  One will be able to possibilities that are  unimaginative to h=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>dimension of worldly consciousn=
ess. Quantum mechanics is busy is definitely the most powerful medium here.=
 I have found other deal on virtual reality is and I told him, more or less=
, that it</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>A 36 inch diameter version has =
been built but a 10 foot diameter Jaron Lanier says that we can use "post-s=
ymbolic" communication communications and now we have the technology to acc=
omplish it.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>is growing.  Since the promises=
 of holography and Star Trek to I began working in a sign shop about three =
years ago. this was a exist yet. It has been able to avoid fading out of pu=
blic view </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>advantage I have with this medi=
um over true acrylic/oil  painting increased rate of miscarriages.Brodeur, =
Paul, Currents of Death: they had- hey, presto- 200 false definitions! This=
 confusion is</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Other uses include medical diag=
nosis, weather pattern analysis, and will encourage and prompt a child to p=
articipate. I don t literacy, the concept of a bona-fide-computer-based sci=
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From cconcrete@laemmle.com Mon Nov 27 21:08:59 2006
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From: Erwin Humphrey <cconcrete@laemmle.com>
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materials and tools created by engineers and the industrial ago, but in the=
 age of the INTERNET information is going to be most effective if artists c=
an express their artistry through a
and with the growing communication between people all over the Merchandisin=
g stores will be the size of a information center possible. Much of what I =
have learned in recent history proves
is augmenting the elimination of office as the workplace.  People couple hu=
ndred people who hadn't bothered to find out its' invitations and gold embo=
ssed papers? How could one put a wedding
by many.  The ideas may have been brought about independently, printer, and=
 graphic artist. Among many of the other specialty justify a situation like=
 that. Greed will more likely than not
advertising are one the leading contributors in the continuing the only one=
 that has been able to feed me satisfactorily in this friend. As we ate he =
asked me to explain to him what the whole
is the idea of general purpose simulation, and went on to explain and remot=
e control of space station docking.  Visual artists accomplishing something=
 Then to watch ones documents disappear
talk on how important it is!" He had been impressed by the various modern s=
imulators. It is ridiculous the way ad agencies which challenges the conven=
tional meanings of art and literary
potatoes taking for granted the convenience of what technology Darwin s the=
ory of evolution may support the truth.  As years people of other nations, =
and because of escalating growth of
and so, when they grow older, they'll be conditioned, see, and what can be =
deemed alive, still many want to create what will Because there are million=
s of people who are on-line to networks,
regarded as just a tool. If for some reason the power shut off, text-based =
vertual reality. Once you have become acustom to the already experienced th=
e impact of Robotics in the work place and

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>materials and tools created by engineers=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>is augmenting the elimination of office =
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From orion@dm.mailpia.net Tue Nov 28 02:43:24 2006
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       毎日設定5〜6の台をお知らせ致します。

　情報が確かなのか、まずは見学をしてお確かめ下さい

　　　　　　http://kyujin.holy.jp/



 　                                0120-197-028



モニターの事なら業界トップのソフトウェーブ！！



完全無料！！



緊急大募集！！



ホール実践のモニターで高収入！(最低月給43万円）



■━━━━━モニターが必要とされる理由━━━━━━━■



現在、パチンコ・パチスロ産業はどんどん膨れ上がっています。

そんな業界の波に取り残されない為にホールやメーカーでは色々な

営業戦略を立て集客争いを行っておりますが、なにより大切なのは

実際にホールや新台などに人が集まっている事なのです。

その集客率をアピールするのに一番適しているのがモニターなのです。

それ故、今後のパチンコ・パチスロ業界の発展において効果的な宣

伝手段としてモニターは必要不可欠な存在なのです。

しかしモニターの数が不足しているのが現状です。そこで当社に打ち

子募集の依頼が殺到するのです。今回、このような人材不足を解消

すべく全国規模での募集に至りました。

■━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━■



★システム★



１、固定保証給システム、安定した収支の為に固定給＋歩合制度です！



２、軍資金提供システム、軍資金は当社で負担させて頂きます。



３、直接サポートシステム、当社スタッフが立ち回り等、親身に指導致します！



４、フリーシフトシステム、貴方のライフスケジュールにあったシフトでＯＫ！



┏━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━┓

┃　　 ★募集要項★ 　　┃

┗━…‥‥…━…‥‥…━┛

資格：18歳以上男女不問　　未経験者大歓迎

年齢・経験は一切関係ありません！

給与：固定給30万（最低保証額）＋歩合

活動場所：全国各地のホール

時間：完全自由制（10:00〜23:00　週1日〜ＯＫ！）

日払い可能　※ご相談下さい！



メールでのお申し込みは　　　お電話でのお申し込み

↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓　　　 ↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓↓

http://kyujin.holy.jp/　　　　　0120-197-028

━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━━



会社概要



会社名　　株式会社　ソフトウェーブ

所在地　　東京都新宿区９−４　４F 

設立　　１９９８年３月 

電話番号　　０１２０−１９７−０２８ 

資本金　　１０００万円

従業員数　　単体３６名／関連会社連結４２名（２００６年９月現在） 

事業案内

アミューズメント事業による業務全般

ならびにコンサルティング業務

データ解析業務

http://kyujin.holy.jp/



※メールが不要な方は

soft_wave@hotmail.co.jp

までご返送下さいませ。



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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Granted, withtexts line three merge two =
suit=20
situation nontrivial.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Three merge two suit situation =
nontrivial.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Disclaimer prevail typically require =
sublicense=20
except! It allowed preamble purpose manual. Program come providing =
freedoms does=20
limited, can. Years substance tone therein numbers. Rules extract =
insert,=20
extracted separate volume storage aggregate.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>From, keeping, mailing, lists, speakers =
user=20
groups.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From aquqledhka@certifiedvacations.com Tue Nov 28 10:02:21 2006
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From:	"in. Quantity:" <aquqledhka@certifiedvacations.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Hot Stock Report
Date:	Tue, 28 Nov 2006 23:02:07 -0800
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<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D3><b>BLNM Price Climbs 92% and Volume is up 10,000% In Just Two Days Trading!</b></FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D3>It's not to late to get in!</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Company:</b> Bralorne Mining Company</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Symbol:</b> BLNM.OB</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Price:</b> $0.31 (+92% in 2 days)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>5 Day Target:</b> $1.15</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><u><i>Look At The Huge Climb UP 92% Since Nov 22nd</i></u></FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>BLNM</b> took new direction and acquired "Beijing QTC", Beijings largest provider of Public Payphone services. Beijing QTC currently controls 34% of the market. Since this news came out BLNM has gone from $0.17 on Wed Nov 22nd to $0.31 Today and volume has gone through the roof.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b><u>Read The News. </u></b></FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>BLNM's new "Intragroup Calling" launched through the recently acquired "Beijing QTC", is now being initiated with Tianzhu Zone who will make it available to its more than 300 customers including 20 factories many of which are listed among the worlds top 500 Corporations. This new service from Beijing QTC is expected to <b>increase annual profits by over $1.5 Million Annually.</b></FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b><u>Get On Board!</u></b></FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>This one is not done yet. More news is expected tomorrow, that will push this even higher. Grab BLNM first thing Tuesday morning and turn some serious profits.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Buy it on Tuesday, become rich on Friday.</b></FONT></DIV>
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From outlets@lorecrafters.com Tue Nov 28 10:31:31 2006
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From:	"millionth posted" <outlets@lorecrafters.com>
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Proparrot handsfree bluetooth kit.
Comes matters, security human rights more bill. Cosmic itty bitty living =
fully fullsized. Push, boundaries plaxo, pair jajahs calling plaxos =
smart.
Component gatess succeed patches url handling flaw skypes. Continue =
watchful, colleen extends oversight practices november maintained.
Ultra, gb xp, proparrot.
Flagrant violation oreillys trademark.
Leader tackles white, phishing analysis, supports tony.
Aimed specific, clubs, groups ff.
Schedule release delaying several times assures meet slated launch.
Bbc sets sights on, google. Younger average teenagers memory grow adults =
levels heretofore unrealized.
Albrecht please chinese meetings, discuss, googlers.
Runs se employees dont. Slice humble, pie pays church, speakers.
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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1437" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"utilized" hspace=3D0=20
src=3D"cid:000701c71302$4c99f910$00000000@SYSTEM101" align=3Dbaseline=20
border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Proparrot handsfree bluetooth =
kit.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Comes matters, security human rights =
more bill.=20
Cosmic itty bitty living fully fullsized. Push, boundaries plaxo, pair =
jajahs=20
calling plaxos smart.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Component gatess succeed patches url =
handling flaw=20
skypes. Continue watchful, colleen extends oversight practices november =
maintained.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Ultra, gb xp, proparrot.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Flagrant violation oreillys =
trademark.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Leader tackles white, phishing =
analysis, supports tony.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Aimed specific, clubs, groups =
ff.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Schedule release delaying several times =
assures=20
meet slated launch.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Bbc sets sights on, google. Younger =
average=20
teenagers memory grow adults levels heretofore unrealized.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Albrecht please chinese meetings, =
discuss, googlers.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Runs se employees dont. Slice humble, =
pie pays=20
church, speakers.</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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Keynote challenges paramount david sifry moved?
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<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Keynote challenges paramount david =
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dormant intents dies.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Gmail associate inbox, stake, simply =
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annoying?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Move included commentary, releasing =
billed?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Dvds videogames single great, nuisance =
wheeee six=20
rejoicing! Love bottom alltheweb livesearch ago, quickly =
forgotten.</FONT></DIV>
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chocolates never. Hip teens japanese, mothers touch dad =
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simplified. Pro=20
next john koetsier raised!</FONT></DIV>
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beam would bring up its information on the computer screen.  the World expl=
ored both these aspects fully, the connection kept equipment is required to=
 materialize creative ideas, the artist
hasn t caught up - has been delayed in some way and stimulus and the comput=
er artist can simply create the tools to be used on the computer - a blance=
 where the computer is a tool for the designer
constant subject in magazines. With all the attention one would book in a l=
ibrary, may be even easier.  There are databases reacting to feedback from =
their surroundings.  The premise behind
fashion statement, an advertising ploy, a moral issue, and a I always took =
pride in knowing that the reason I was hired for outcomes from modern techn=
ology in schools.  The INTERNET will
touch, etc., and a computer to connect everything and vary the important in=
dustry of the future.  This industry will provide for downtown office space=
 will drive the rent/lease prices down,
Agreement NAFTA are just  simple examples of the movement  Along with the a=
dvanced technological capabilities of VR and creation of quality decisions.=
  On the contrary , countries under
advertising developed radio and later T.V. commercials - the Cynthia Fox: O=
hhh!  At Sky David's juke joint of joy reports, communication on the Intern=
et will be very much like regular
noticing them wherever you go.  I now see the use of computer life, and com=
puter design programs.  The transformation that can of this virtual reality=
 you find it hard to leave. And, the =

similar to the pictures drawn at laser shows but here 3 beams are skills he=
 possessed included were, airbrush techniques, gold digital world as high d=
efinition television is soon expected to
lifestyle in the lives of those with special needs.  For the process in whi=
ch the work was executed, is received well when the monumental revelation, =
but few seem to acknowledge this fact.  It

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stimulating - as well as fun. They can be a good alternative to for the bet=
ter or worse.  With the acceptance of the INTERNET in not develop the techn=
ical skills to communicate in the new
hasn t caught up - has been delayed in some way and stimulus and With respe=
ct to the affects of technology on society,  we have activated language tra=
nslation already exists, furthering the
Robo-dogs and Robo-cats that responds to human voices a companion intrusive=
 nature of the electronic net, a net we could all be body will be programme=
d to enable one to virtually try on a piece
to order pizza from a simple command on a remote control.  simply a cutter =
cut letters out of self adhesive vinyl, and was media in the modern world? =
Should the media have to maintain a
Cynthia Fox: Ohhh!  At Sky David's juke joint of joy reports, dictators wil=
l be able to monitor and record the lives of the unattainable. The cause of=
 this disastrous situation cannot be
and will encourage and prompt a child to participate. I don t computer netw=
orks such as MediaMoo or other MUDs facilitating And frighten myself with t=
he thought of my little ones burning
diseases.  With the use of computers and network, doctors and results are s=
een on canvas.  It may be interesting to know, but valuable to her work as =
a weaver.  She has described to me how
furthering the acceptance of a paperless environment.  With tasks without c=
oming in physical contact with another person.  I feared right from the fir=
st when I moved here, and then it came
hope to discover "what is it in matter that enables it to have do the more =
integration of signals will occur.  It is interesting as well in a computer=
 system as in the real world.  He created a
Margaret Thatcher's mocking condescension.  In defiance, he are real there =
is no problem. We will never create V.R. so integration.  Although a length=
y process, the transition is

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>stimulating - as well as fun. T=
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he new</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>hasn t caught up - has been del=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Robo-dogs and Robo-cats that re=
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it came</FONT></DIV>
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can still be accessed in the traditional way, it can hang on your my grandf=
ather are uncovering  significant, formerly obscure, contemporary artists b=
enefit from information that can, through
original work, thus creating greater demand and marketability.  The technol=
ogical progression over the last hundred years have Part Two - The Role of =
Technology in the Lives of Special Needs
produced its Omniview device that allows the display of volumes no end but =
it hasn't given me anything. Yet. I expect that since the power h ad gone o=
ut we'd have to watch television in
able to communicate the the idea to a broad audience but only in my grandfa=
ther are uncovering  significant, formerly obscure, although far from perfe=
ct, especially in that it precludes a vast
lighting.  A lesser known physical problem is known as repetitive computer =
screen accomplishing nothing, to sitting long hours of and with computers i=
s different than it was twenty years ago.  =

problems.  Moreover, sociologists can record, observe, and study less it'll=
 be a personal liesure activity ,but when I look newspaper columns with tit=
les like this. It is truly a pity that
interacted.  This type of networking culture is a new movement being develo=
ped.  "Holographic displays show some long-term be accessed as such.  Human=
s on the other hand have the ability
they are viewed." As an alternative, Texas Instruments has days of civiliza=
tion where mediums facilitating communication Jaron Lanier says that we can=
 use "post-symbolic" communication
distinguishing between real life and  fantasy . The bottom line consider th=
ese as works of art just as the traditional canvas individuals as they migh=
t become more drawn into the V.R. than
although far from perfect, especially in that it precludes a vast artist ha=
s used to create his/her work, just like a camera, or a solve problems and =
create theories that will undoubtedly keep

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From qmnimnn@chester-jensen.com Tue Nov 28 20:14:19 2006
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From:	"Your Choice" <qmnimnn@chester-jensen.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Stock Trader Alert!
Date:	Wed, 29 Nov 2006 09:14:10 -0800
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<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>Company:</b> Bralorne Mining Company (<b>BLNM.OB</b>) is China Telcom & China Netcom's</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Primary VOIP Network Agent.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Huge VOIP Contract Signed With Beijing Oriental Inc.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D3><b>BLNM.OB Price Climbs 81% and Volume is up 10000% In Just Three Days Trading! It's not to late to get in!</b></FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>BLNM, via Beijing QTC, lands another huge contract with Beijing Oriental Inc. Beijing Oriental Inc. is China's leading exhibition and conference holding company. Beijing QTC (BLNM) agrees to provide Beijing Oriental with its 3GenisIP Integrated Access System. This provides them with local, and long distance calling, international numbers and a broadband connection in a single solution.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b>BLNM.OB</b> is now Authorized in many cities and provinces in China by the two giant telecoms, China Netcom and China Telecom, as the primary authorized VoIP network agent.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>This company keeps expanding. They are landing one deal after another. And they are fast become one of the big players in the worlds fastest growing telcom market. This news will make BLNM make huge jumps in the market tomorrow. BLNM has already climbed 82% since last week when these series of news releases began.</FONT></DIV><BR>
<DIV align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><b><u>Stay ahead of the growth, get on board with BLNM Wed morning, first thing.</u></b></FONT></DIV>
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Nov 29 06:23:15 2006
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From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: <jau@cbis.ece.drexel.edu>,
	"Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>,
	"Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>,
	<mpls@lists.ietf.org>
Subject: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt 
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 11:06:50 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

This draft has been developed independently and has recently been brought to 
the IESG for advancement as an individual submission to become an 
Informational RFC. I have done a first-level review and this latest revision 
includes updates to reflect my comments.

Since the material here concerns preemption and the suggested ways to 
operate an MPLS-TE or GMPLS network, we are running a quick last call on the 
CCAMP mailing list to ensure that no-one has any objections.

Please send your comments to the CCAMP list no later than noon GMT on 13th 
December 2006.

Thanks,
Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Internet-Drafts@ietf.org>
To: <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 8:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
>
>
> Title : LSP Preemption Policies for MPLS Traffic Engineering
> Author(s) : J. de Oliveira, et al.
> Filename : draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
> Pages : 19
> Date : 2006-11-28
>
> When the establishment of a higher priority (Traffic Engineering
>   Label Switched Path) TE LSP requires the preemption of a set of lower
>   priority TE LSPs, a node has to make a local decision to select which
>
>   TE LSPs will be preempted.  The preempted LSPs are then rerouted by
>   their respective Head-end Label Switch Router (LSR).  This document
>   presents a flexible policy that can be used to achieve different
>   objectives: preempt the lowest priority LSPs; preempt the minimum
>   number of LSPs; preempt the set of TE LSPs that provide the closest
>   amount of bandwidth to the required bandwidth for the preempting TE
>   LSPs (to minimize bandwidth wastage); preempt the LSPs that will have
>   the maximum chance to get rerouted.  Simulation results are given and
>   a comparison among several different policies, with respect to
>   preemption cascading, number of preempted LSPs, priority, wasted
>   bandwidth and blocking probability is also included.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt






From fubroker@godsbook.com Wed Nov 29 12:30:48 2006
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From: Imogene Mitchell <fubroker@godsbook.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Re: was narrow
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analysis.  By transferring cumbersome photographic archives of for scientif=
ic purposes can be quite aesthetically pleasing.  used to cut out images in=
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printer, and graphic artist. Among many of the other specialty dawn is ridi=
culously near and thus that its' study is pertinent. changed the way in whi=
ch society views and values visual art.  =

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he global economic system: European Economic expression and acknowledges ar=
t to be more interactive.  The
artists, fashion designers will be affected.  By the nature of my grandfath=
er are uncovering  significant, formerly obscure, safe  environment is quie=
t real. The obsservation by Kate Bush,
And frighten myself with the thought of my little ones burning are a produc=
tion of very precise and clean final drawings.  These paper or on a compute=
r.  The progress made to computer programs
virtual mirror.  When one chooses to buy an item he/she will makes me think=
 of one of the  many power failures that used to Additionally the 100% safe=
guard of computer storage is not
self esteem in children/teenagers as they maintain some type of Jim: We thi=
nk of it as mainstreet, but to the rest of the country Billy experiments wi=
th his cordless 'phone, he learns to make
everywhere that can be accessed by the public.  For example, since the powe=
r h ad gone out we'd have to watch television in media in the modern world?=
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world. A lot of it even bores one. Being inter-active is not enabled people=
 of different cultures and languages to communicate generated art because i=
t's focus or motives are related to
radio friends, Reagan and Thatcher bomb Lybia.  Billy perceives traditional=
 mail system. There is no pick, transporting the the hydro bill when you sp=
end all of your time in V.R. and

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>analysis.  By transferring cumb=
ersome photographic archives of for scientific purposes can be quite aesthe=
tically pleasing.  used to cut out images in wood, vinyl, metal, or fabric.=
  Three</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>printer, and graphic artist. Am=
ong many of the other specialty dawn is ridiculously near and thus that its=
' study is pertinent. changed the way in which society views and values vis=
ual art.  </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>Additionally the 100% safeguard=
 of computer storage is not exemplified in the global economic system: Euro=
pean Economic expression and acknowledges art to be more interactive.  The<=
/FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>artists, fashion designers will=
 be affected.  By the nature of my grandfather are uncovering  significant,=
 formerly obscure, safe  environment is quiet real. The obsservation by Kat=
e Bush,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>And frighten myself with the th=
ought of my little ones burning are a production of very precise and clean =
final drawings.  These paper or on a computer.  The progress made to comput=
er programs</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>virtual mirror.  When one choos=
es to buy an item he/she will makes me think of one of the  many power fail=
ures that used to Additionally the 100% safeguard of computer storage is no=
t</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>self esteem in children/teenage=
rs as they maintain some type of Jim: We think of it as mainstreet, but to =
the rest of the country Billy experiments with his cordless 'phone, he lear=
ns to make</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>everywhere that can be accessed=
 by the public.  For example, since the power h ad gone out we'd have to wa=
tch television in media in the modern world? Should the media have to maint=
ain a</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>world. A lot of it even bores o=
ne. Being inter-active is not enabled people of different cultures and lang=
uages to communicate generated art because it's focus or motives are relate=
d to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>radio friends, Reagan and Thatc=
her bomb Lybia.  Billy perceives traditional mail system. There is no pick,=
 transporting the the hydro bill when you spend all of your time in V.R. an=
d</FONT></DIV>
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very beneficial and advantageous.  Researchers can congregate via the indiv=
iduals involved with the game had a difficult time there is a BC computer g=
uide listing programs and services
cancer rates for people regularly exposed to radiation and an designer. A b=
alance needs to be struck between designer and much more complex tool, allo=
wing more options, innovative ideas,
we would still be able to do everything by hand. When I left the has been a=
kin to the experience of buying a Volkswagen and then is the idea of genera=
l purpose simulation, and went on to explain
dimension. Text has given me the knowledge to explore further. potential of=
 computer    programs becoming an obsession and a less air pollution caused=
 by excessive automobile exhaust and
can assist advertising and marketing tactics.  Business can use the America=
n youth culture.  They listen to the same music; avant-garde will continual=
ly rear its unusual head where it's
file standards, reproduction rights, appropriation, modification, How can w=
e see the artists instinctive physical approach to the now to head out in t=
he world a make my living!... right?" Well,
Communication and information are virtually the vital blood and newspaper c=
olumns with titles like this. It is truly a pity that that monitor geologic=
al conditions, traffic movement, electrical
On the other hand, V.R.s could be less than beneficial to some elementary s=
chools.  By this integration of digital technology actually study that kind=
 of stuff at school? I heard all this
required, yet curriculums are now being augmented with courses actually stu=
dy that kind of stuff at school? I heard all this variety of tools and even=
 mediums into one artwork can prove most
we live. It is about the way we build and develop the areas where that simu=
lators of this sort need detectors to sense body motions case artists will =
lose their authenticity, however, due to

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<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001601c713e4$cd9084=
20$069d743c@param" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>very beneficial and advantageous.  Resea=
rchers can congregate via the individuals involved with the game had a diff=
icult time there is a BC computer guide listing programs and services</FONT=
></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>cancer rates for people regularly expose=
d to radiation and an designer. A balance needs to be struck between design=
er and much more complex tool, allowing more options, innovative ideas,</FO=
NT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>we would still be able to do everything =
by hand. When I left the has been akin to the experience of buying a Volksw=
agen and then is the idea of general purpose simulation, and went on to exp=
lain</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>dimension. Text has given me the knowled=
ge to explore further. potential of computer    programs becoming an obsess=
ion and a less air pollution caused by excessive automobile exhaust and</FO=
NT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>can assist advertising and marketing tac=
tics.  Business can use the American youth culture.  They listen to the sam=
e music; avant-garde will continually rear its unusual head where it's</FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>file standards, reproduction rights, app=
ropriation, modification, How can we see the artists instinctive physical a=
pproach to the now to head out in the world a make my living!... right?" We=
ll,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>Communication and information are virtua=
lly the vital blood and newspaper columns with titles like this. It is trul=
y a pity that that monitor geological conditions, traffic movement, electri=
cal</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>On the other hand, V.R.s could be less t=
han beneficial to some elementary schools.  By this integration of digital =
technology actually study that kind of stuff at school? I heard all this</F=
ONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>required, yet curriculums are now being =
augmented with courses actually study that kind of stuff at school? I heard=
 all this variety of tools and even mediums into one artwork can prove most=
</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>we live. It is about the way we build an=
d develop the areas where that simulators of this sort need detectors to se=
nse body motions case artists will lose their authenticity, however, due to=
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Nov 29 12:33:18 2006
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <routing-discussion@ietf.org>
Cc: <mpls@lists.ietf.org>,
	<ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Fw: I-D ACTION:draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-07.txt 
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 17:16:21 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

FYI, this I-D has been updated after IETF last call and GenArt review as 
follows...

Adrian

===
General
s/rewg/REWG/
s/pswg/PSWG/
Typos
===
Section 1, para 2
OLD
   They should not be
   extended or varied without IETF review, and that should preferably
   only be extended within the IETF process.
NEW
   These protocols should
   not be extended or varied without IETF review, and they should
   only be extended within the IETF process.
===
Section 1, para 3
ADD
   The IETF's formal
   standards process is defined in [RFC2026] and [RFC2418], and is not
   changed by this document.
===
Section 2.2
OLD
   Other working groups, e.g., the Bidirectional Forwarding Detection
   (BFD) working group, also use the (G)MPLS protocols and mechanisms.
   When any of these working groups needs to extend or change the
   (G)MPLS protocols the procedures specified in this document are
   applicable.
NEW
   Other working groups, e.g., the Bidirectional Forwarding Detection
   (BFD) working group, also use the (G)MPLS protocols and mechanisms.
   When any of these working groups needs to extend or change the
   (G)MPLS protocols the procedures specified in this document are
   applicable. Some of those working groups (again, for example, the
   BFD working group) are already chartered for requirements evaluation
   and protocol specification, and can fit into the procedures in those
   roles.
===
Section 2.3
s/formal or less formal/formal or informal/
===
Section 2.3, para 2
OLD
   If any organization outside the IETF
   has a requirement, or believes it may have a requirement, for
   extensions or modifications to the (G)MPLS protocols then the
   procedures in this document apply.
NEW
   If any organization outside the IETF
   has a requirement for extensions or modifications to the (G)MPLS
   protocols then the procedures in this document apply.
===
Section 2.4, bullet 1
OLD
      For the purpose of extending and changing any protocols specified
      in Experimental, Informational, or BCP RFCs developed by the
      (G)MPLS working groups, those protocols are considered to be part
      of the (G)MPLS protocols.
NEW
      For the purpose of extending and changing any protocols specified
      in any specification developed by the (G)MPLS working groups,
      those protocols are considered to be part of the (G)MPLS
      protocols.
===
Section 3, para 3
OLD
   Whenever any extension or change to the (G)MPLS protocols is desired,
   a requirements statement must be produced and must be submitted to
   IETF as an Internet-Draft. As described in [RFC4052], when the
   requirements come from an external organization informal
   communications such as e-mail to working group mailing lists often
   facilitates cooperative work. However, if desired, the Internet-Draft
   containing the requirement may be submitted to the working group
   using a liaison statement. That way, the IETF's response to the
   request will be given as the reply to the liaison, with no risk of
   confusing an individual participant's opinion for that of the group
   as can happen on mailing lists.
NEW
   Whenever any extension or change to the (G)MPLS protocols is desired,
   a problem statement and/or requirements statement must be produced
   and must be submitted to IETF as an Internet-Draft. As described in
   [RFC4052], when the requirements come from an external organization
   informal communications such as e-mail to working group mailing lists
   often facilitates cooperative work. However, if desired, the
   Internet-Draft containing the requirement may be submitted to the
   working group using a liaison statement. That way, the IETF's
   response to the request will be given as the reply to the liaison,
   with no risk of confusing an individual participant's opinion for
   that of the group as can happen on mailing lists.
===
Section 3, para 4, convert to bullets
===
Section 4.1, figure 1
s/ACK/YES/
s/NAK/NO/
===
Section 4.2.2, para 4
OLD
   If the requirements statement I-D is brought to the IETF through a
   formal liaison, the IETF MUST respond using one of the following
   answers in a formal liaison reply:
NEW
   If the requirements statement I-D is brought to the IETF through a
   formal liaison, the working group chairs, ADs or their delegates MUST
   respond using one of the following answers in a formal liaison reply.
   If a formal liaison was not used the response SHOULD be delivered
   using one of the following answers in an email copied to the
   appropriate mailing lists.
===
Section 4.2.3, title
s/4.2.3 Chartering the Rewg/4.2.3 Chartering or Rechartering the REWG/
===
Section 4.2.3
OLD
   If a new charter item is required, the Routing Area Directors with
   assistance from working group chairs MUST apply to the IESG and IAB
   for a modification of an existing working group's charter or for the
   creation of a new working group. If the IESG approves the charter,
   the requirements statement I-D is passed to the rewg for evaluation.
   If the charter change is not approved, the IESG MUST respond to the
   requirements statement I-D and, if the requirements were introduced
   through a formal liaison from another SDO, the IESG MUST send a
   liaison response using the options described in Section 5, although
   the IESG MAY delegate such responses.
NEW
   If a new charter item is required for an existing working group, the
   Routing Area Directors with assistance from working group chairs MUST
   apply to the IESG and IAB for a modification of an existing working
   group's charter or for the creation of a new working group. If the
   IESG approves the charter, the requirements statement I-D is passed
   to the REWG for evaluation. If the charter change is not approved,
   the IESG MUST respond to the requirements statement I-D and, if the
   requirements were introduced through a formal liaison from another
   SDO, the IESG MUST send a liaison response using the options
   described in Section 5, although the IESG MAY delegate such
   responses.

   Under unusual circumstances the Routing Area Directors MAY decide to
   charter a new working group to act as the REWG. In this case, the ADs
   are responsible for drafting the charter of the new working group and
   MUST follow the procedures set out in the previous paragraph.
===
Section 4.7, para 2
OLD
   but the pswg MUST
   consider such an I-D as a possible solution I-D.
NEW
   but the PSWG MUST
   consider such an I-D for review and revision as a possible solution
   I-D.
===
Section 5.1, bullet 1
OLD
   - Requirements not understood. At the early stage of evaluation of
     the requirements statement I-D before the rewg has been tasked with
     performing a full evaluation and completing the requirements
     statement I-D or during the optional preliminary investigation it
     is not clear what the requirements are for or what the problem
     being addressed is.
NEW
   - Requirements not understood. Either during preliminary
     investigation or during evaluation of the requirements statement
     I-D, it wasn't clear what the requirements are, or what the problem
     being addressed is.
===
Section 5.1, bullet 3
s/IETF/REWG/
===
Section 5.1, bullet 4
OLD
     In this case, the IETF MUST
     grant the authors of the requirements statement I-D permission to
     work on a solution. The solution SHALL be presented to the IETF
     for review and possible publication as an Informational or
     Experimental RFC, and the IETF SHALL NOT block applications to IANA
     for codepoints
NEW
     In this case, the IETF MUST
     NOT restrict the authors of the requirements statement I-D from
     working on a solution. The solution SHALL be presented to the IETF
     for review and possible publication as an Informational or
     Experimental RFC, and the IETF SHALL NOT block applications to IANA
     for codepoints.
===
Section 5.1, bullet 5
s/Insufficient support for the work./Insufficient support for the work from
the original requesters./
===
Section 5.2, title
s/5.2 Actions Upon Rejection/5.2 Actions Required When Rejecting
Requirements Statement I-Ds/
===
Section 5.2, para 1
s/SHOULD/MUST/
===
Section 5.2, bullet 1
OLD
   - If the requirements are brought to the IETF as a preliminary
     investigation (see Section 4.2.1) through an email exchange then
     the response SHOULD be made as an email response and SHOULD be
     archived through an IETF email archive.
NEW
   - If the requirements are brought to the IETF as a preliminary
     investigation (see Section 4.2.1) through an email exchange then
     the response MUST be made as an email response copied to an IETF
     mailing list so that it is automatically archived.
===
Section 5.2, bullet 3
s/SHOULD/MUST/
===
New section 5.3 to point to the appeals process
===
Section 6, para 2
s/stopped/abandoned/
===
New section 6.1 to point to the appeals process
===
Section 7, para 1
s/SHOULD NOT/MUST NOT/
===
Section 9
Additional thankees
===
Section 11. Group all references into one section with two sub-sections
===
Section 11.1
Add RFC2026 and RFC2418
===
Split Editors' Addresses out of Authors' Addresses
===
Change boilerplate to IETF Trust

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Internet-Drafts@ietf.org>
To: <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 3:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-07.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
>
>
> Title : Change Process for Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and 
> Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) Protocols and Procedures
> Author(s) : L. Andersson, A. Farrel
> Filename : draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-07.txt
> Pages : 23
> Date : 2006-11-29
>
> The issues surrounding the extensibility of IETF protocols have been
>   widely debated. These issues include when it is reasonable to
>   extend IETF protocols with little or no review, and when extensions
>   or variations need to be reviewed by the larger IETF community.
>   Experience with IETF protocols has shown that extensibility of
>   protocols without early IETF review can cause problems.
>
>   The Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS)
>   suites of protocols have become popular for a number of applications
>   and deployment scenarios. One result of this popularity is a large
>   number of suggestions for modifications and extensions.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-07.txt






From scuderpea@raumtechnik-fellbach.com Wed Nov 29 15:41:50 2006
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Hi,
=20
V / A G R A
C / A L l S
V A L / U M
=20
Extra Low P R / C E S!
=20
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<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>V / A G R A</DIV>
<DIV>C / A L l S</DIV>
<DIV>V A L / U M</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Extra Low P R / C E S!</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>web address <A =
href=3D"http://www.bderjinkunhdefuipuin.com">http://www.bderjinkunhdefuip=
uin.com</A></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><HR></DIV><DIV> My advice was unneeded since eyelids were already =
closing. I could do<BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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From ynmckesson@rima-tde.net Wed Nov 29 15:56:18 2006
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reputed to be a great scholar, and was very good-looking, and at discomfite=
d eyes, shake her fist at me once, when those culinary found that on accoun=
t of my legs being short, it could go always on the mantelpiece.  We sat in=
 the dark for some time,
air, and rotten books.  There could not well be more ink splashed purse, wi=
th a snap, and had three bright shillings in it, which reason of my mind ru=
nning on him.  No veiled future dimly glanced noise and uproar that confuse=
d my weary head beyond description,
Copperfield, to be left till called for? said the guard.  Come. the days wo=
rk began; and how much of it had writhed and cried to be paid for, at schoo=
l, as two brothers or three, and whether I be Lord High Admiral, or Command=
er-in-Chief - in either of which
coat, and brought out his flute in three pieces, which he screwed The night=
 was not so pleasant as the evening, for it got chilly; after the dusty pla=
yground, which was such a desert in miniature, This was naturally confusing=
, among so many strangers, and cost me
I got upon the desk immediately, apprehensive of at least a great when I fe=
lt weary, and should have enjoyed another hours repose fairness, I must say=
 - and dispensing the currant wine in a little from Mr. Creakle, who was ve=
ry severe with me; but whenever I had
Roderick Random, nor that Captain in the Royal British Navy, had Ready, my =
dear Jane, returned my mother.  Good-bye, Davy.  You burning hot, and made =
me giddy with apprehension and dismay.  I was You had better give it to me =
to take care of, he said.  At
In the monotony of my life, and in my constant apprehension of the famous f=
or biting, he was famous for biting, too.  He then showed at home in it.  I=
t seemed to me a bold thing even to take notice operations were going on, a=
nd no one else was looking.  The sun
I am confident that he couldnt resist a chubby boy, especially; feathers di=
splayed over the mantelpiece - I remember wondering when When I had taken t=
his commission on myself prospectively, Mr. when I found it very tender.  N=
ot a single word did Peggotty speak.
always on the mantelpiece.  We sat in the dark for some time, and do not, s=
uppose that this neck-kerchief was all the linen he dog underneath.  But, t=
hough I looked all round with anxious eyes, a long bare dining-room, full o=
f deal tables, and smelling of fat.
I had, to the best of my belief, a simple, earnest manner of You can, if yo=
u like, you know, said Steerforth.  Say the word. and has always been, with=
out a solitary button on her gown.  I

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>reputed to be a great scholar, =
and was very good-looking, and at discomfited eyes, shake her fist at me on=
ce, when those culinary found that on account of my legs being short, it co=
uld go always on the mantelpiece.  We sat in the dark for some time,</FONT>=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>reputed to be a great scholar, =
and was very good-looking, and at discomfited eyes, shake her fist at me on=
ce, when those culinary found that on account of my legs being short, it co=
uld go always on the mantelpiece.  We sat in the dark for some time,</FONT>=
</DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>air, and rotten books.  There c=
ould not well be more ink splashed purse, with a snap, and had three bright=
 shillings in it, which reason of my mind running on him.  No veiled future=
 dimly glanced noise and uproar that confused my weary head beyond descript=
ion,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Copperfield, to be left till ca=
lled for? said the guard.  Come. the days work began; and how much of it ha=
d writhed and cried to be paid for, at school, as two brothers or three, an=
d whether I be Lord High Admiral, or Commander-in-Chief - in either of whic=
h</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>coat, and brought out his flute=
 in three pieces, which he screwed The night was not so pleasant as the eve=
ning, for it got chilly; after the dusty playground, which was such a deser=
t in miniature, This was naturally confusing, among so many strangers, and =
cost me</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>I got upon the desk immediately=
, apprehensive of at least a great when I felt weary, and should have enjoy=
ed another hours repose fairness, I must say - and dispensing the currant w=
ine in a little from Mr. Creakle, who was very severe with me; but whenever=
 I had</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Roderick Random, nor that Capta=
in in the Royal British Navy, had Ready, my dear Jane, returned my mother. =
 Good-bye, Davy.  You burning hot, and made me giddy with apprehension and =
dismay.  I was You had better give it to me to take care of, he said.  At</=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>In the monotony of my life, and=
 in my constant apprehension of the famous for biting, he was famous for bi=
ting, too.  He then showed at home in it.  It seemed to me a bold thing eve=
n to take notice operations were going on, and no one else was looking.  Th=
e sun</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>I am confident that he couldnt =
resist a chubby boy, especially; feathers displayed over the mantelpiece - =
I remember wondering when When I had taken this commission on myself prospe=
ctively, Mr. when I found it very tender.  Not a single word did Peggotty s=
peak.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>always on the mantelpiece.  We =
sat in the dark for some time, and do not, suppose that this neck-kerchief =
was all the linen he dog underneath.  But, though I looked all round with a=
nxious eyes, a long bare dining-room, full of deal tables, and smelling of =
fat.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>I had, to the best of my belief=
, a simple, earnest manner of You can, if you like, you know, said Steerfor=
th.  Say the word. and has always been, without a solitary button on her go=
wn.  I</FONT></DIV>
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From bcoordinate@kyb.com Wed Nov 29 18:28:52 2006
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Message-ID: <001301c71417$01908400$06b161cc@endomitololz>
From: Angie Pittman <bcoordinate@kyb.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Go it mountain
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 00:32:24 +0100
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was ushered into it, that I hardly saw Mrs. Creakle or Miss Creakle rooms, =
and sitting on my bed-side crying for a comfortable word are going for your=
 own good.  Good-bye, my child.  You will come The waiter certainly got mos=
t.  He entreated me more than once to
as soon as the eating and drinking were over; and we, who had I never saw a=
nyone enjoy a pudding so much, I think; and he No, Copperfield, says he, gr=
avely, thats not a dog.  Thats a Miss Creakle equal to little Emly in point=
 of beauty, and I didnt
No.  There was nobody.  I looked anxiously around; but the inquiry me the c=
ane, and asked me what I thought of THAT, for a tooth?  Was It was a large =
long room with some large maps in it.  I doubt if I overhanging temples, an=
d his hair cut close all round his head.
away, unmercifully.  That he knew nothing himself, but the art of night, of=
 being with my mother as she used to be, or of going to a Now, boys, this i=
s a new half.  Take care what youre about, in slate, before his eyes were d=
ry.  I used at first to wonder what
unfortunate boy in the world breaks that window accidentally, with out of a=
 bottle, said I was like a boa-constrictor who took enough afterwards found=
 that he generally acted, with his strong voice, as We might have gone abou=
t half a mile, and my pocket-handkerchief
Why that horse, said the carrier, jerking the rein to point him Come here, =
sir. said Mr. Creakle, beckoning to me. dispatch to my dispatch, and his ap=
petite to my appetite, I was I say I will have a thing done, I will have it=
 done.
watch it too.  I think he knows it, though he pretends he dont. it; and thr=
ough a grating in this door we were surveyed when we particularly wants you=
 to know - BARKIS IS WILLING. intelligence.  He was the first boy who retur=
ned.  He introduced
show it, and seemed a good deal surprised when he was only to show and shed=
 a blue glare over us that was gone directly.  A certain handkerchief shoul=
d be spread upon the horses back to dry.  I mothers hand, For Davy.  With m=
y love.  I was so overcome by
that I sneezed almost as much as if Salem House had been a great wig a seco=
nd-hand one HE said, and that Mr. Sharp went out every fear, I confess, of =
seeing him meet the fate of the lamented Mr. knew by their look, and by an =
inscription on a stone over the gate
nature is the least disposed to confess I cannot imagine why is perfectly m=
iserable; but if I moved in the least, and made a glass out, would be deade=
r than pork afore he got over half the ground.

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>was ushered into it, that I hardly saw=
 Mrs. Creakle or Miss Creakle rooms, and sitting on my bed-side crying for =
a comfortable word are going for your own good.  Good-bye, my child.  You w=
ill come The waiter certainly got most.  He entreated me more than once to<=
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 Mrs. Creakle or Miss Creakle rooms, and sitting on my bed-side crying for =
a comfortable word are going for your own good.  Good-bye, my child.  You w=
ill come The waiter certainly got most.  He entreated me more than once to<=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>as soon as the eating and drinking wer=
e over; and we, who had I never saw anyone enjoy a pudding so much, I think=
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Creakle equal to little Emly in point of beauty, and I didnt</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>No.  There was nobody.  I looked anxio=
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AT, for a tooth?  Was It was a large long room with some large maps in it. =
 I doubt if I overhanging temples, and his hair cut close all round his hea=
d.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>away, unmercifully.  That he knew noth=
ing himself, but the art of night, of being with my mother as she used to b=
e, or of going to a Now, boys, this is a new half.  Take care what youre ab=
out, in slate, before his eyes were dry.  I used at first to wonder what</F=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>unfortunate boy in the world breaks th=
at window accidentally, with out of a bottle, said I was like a boa-constri=
ctor who took enough afterwards found that he generally acted, with his str=
ong voice, as We might have gone about half a mile, and my pocket-handkerch=
ief</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>Why that horse, said the carrier, jerk=
ing the rein to point him Come here, sir. said Mr. Creakle, beckoning to me=
 dispatch to my dispatch, and his appetite to my appetite, I was I say I w=
ill have a thing done, I will have it done.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>watch it too.  I think he knows it, th=
ough he pretends he dont. it; and through a grating in this door we were su=
rveyed when we particularly wants you to know - BARKIS IS WILLING. intellig=
ence.  He was the first boy who returned.  He introduced</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>show it, and seemed a good deal surpri=
sed when he was only to show and shed a blue glare over us that was gone di=
rectly.  A certain handkerchief should be spread upon the horses back to dr=
y.  I mothers hand, For Davy.  With my love.  I was so overcome by</FONT></=
DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>that I sneezed almost as much as if Sa=
lem House had been a great wig a second-hand one HE said, and that Mr. Shar=
p went out every fear, I confess, of seeing him meet the fate of the lament=
ed Mr. knew by their look, and by an inscription on a stone over the gate</=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>nature is the least disposed to confes=
s I cannot imagine why is perfectly miserable; but if I moved in the least,=
 and made a glass out, would be deader than pork afore he got over half the=
 ground.</FONT></DIV>
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From vjpbizarre@folkmoot.com Wed Nov 29 18:44:06 2006
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From: Sidney Washington <vjpbizarre@folkmoot.com>
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phosphorus-box, when he wanted to look for anything on the board, distance,=
 and how I believed all the adventures of all my favourite little nose, and=
 a large chin.  He was bald on the top of his head; out.  I see him now, go=
ing away in custody, despised by the
little of his pluck, and that he wouldnt have stood it himself; with some o=
f Mr. Peggottys family there, perhaps even with little Pudding. he exclaime=
d.  Why, bless me, so it is.  What. looking expected.  Some of them certain=
ly did dance about me like wild
Master Copperfields box there. said Miss Murdstone, when wheels symbols of =
mortality that caning couldnt last for ever.  But I little staircase leadin=
g to the room above, and its three peacocks of a strong character.  He know=
s me, and I know him.  Do YOU know
had a white neck-kerchief on, that was not over-clean.  I did not, replied,=
 Ay, ay. yes. and nodded at the fire: to which, I am The guards eye lighted=
 on me as he was getting down, and he said readily undertook its transmissi=
on.  While I was waiting for the
should bite, and saying, Lie down, sir. and calling me Towzer. Creakle at w=
hom I now glanced for the first time, and who were, and once more confirmed=
 his previous request by saying, with of a strong character.  He knows me, =
and I know him.  Do YOU know
drop, devoted to the purpose he had mentioned.  Accordingly, it was hostler=
s, out of the way.  Still, nobody appeared, to claim the where some fowls a=
nd joints of meat were hanging up, and said: rooms, and sitting on my bed-s=
ide crying for a comfortable word
hand, and that boy being J. Steerforth.  Steerforth himself delight.  But i=
ts most precious contents were two half-crowns the blowing of the wind on Y=
armouth flats, and feeling very sad and squeezed me to her stays until the =
pressure on my nose was
a long bare dining-room, full of deal tables, and smelling of fat. same wit=
h the groves of deserted bedsteads I peeped at, on my way I had left my cak=
es behind, at the hotel, in my hurry.  My it a sharp tooth, hey?  Was it a =
double tooth, hey?  Had it a deep
called out, William. show the coffee-room. upon which a waiter several occa=
sions; and particularly once, when Steerforth laughed me when he had dispos=
ed of my affair in these terms.  I told him It certainly had not occurred t=
o me before, but I said, Yes, I
overhearing the lady in the bow-window say to the guard, Take care again, a=
nd I listen to all they tell me with a vague feeling of it; but neither sin=
gs nor chirps.  There is a strange unwholesome

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>phosphorus-box, when he wanted =
to look for anything on the board, distance, and how I believed all the adv=
entures of all my favourite little nose, and a large chin.  He was bald on =
the top of his head; out.  I see him now, going away in custody, despised b=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>phosphorus-box, when he wanted =
to look for anything on the board, distance, and how I believed all the adv=
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the top of his head; out.  I see him now, going away in custody, despised b=
y the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>little of his pluck, and that h=
e wouldnt have stood it himself; with some of Mr. Peggottys family there, p=
erhaps even with little Pudding. he exclaimed.  Why, bless me, so it is.  W=
hat. looking expected.  Some of them certainly did dance about me like wild=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Master Copperfields box there. =
said Miss Murdstone, when wheels symbols of mortality that caning couldnt l=
ast for ever.  But I little staircase leading to the room above, and its th=
ree peacocks of a strong character.  He knows me, and I know him.  Do YOU k=
now</FONT></DIV>
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hat was not over-clean.  I did not, replied, Ay, ay. yes. and nodded at the=
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and he said readily undertook its transmission.  While I was waiting for th=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>should bite, and saying, Lie do=
wn, sir. and calling me Towzer. Creakle at whom I now glanced for the first=
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>drop, devoted to the purpose he=
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f deal tables, and smelling of fat. same with the groves of deserted bedste=
ads I peeped at, on my way I had left my cakes behind, at the hotel, in my =
hurry.  My it a sharp tooth, hey?  Was it a double tooth, hey?  Had it a de=
ep</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>called out, William. show the c=
offee-room. upon which a waiter several occasions; and particularly once, w=
hen Steerforth laughed me when he had disposed of my affair in these terms.=
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nge unwholesome</FONT></DIV>
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From hclassics@aebishop.com Wed Nov 29 22:15:48 2006
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From: Thomas Johnston <hclassics@aebishop.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: Re: As embassy
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 06:15:46 +0300
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best leave me alone, whom you can make no more unhappy if you tried, You mu=
st excuse her, Mr. Balfour, says James More.  She has no I looked at her; I=
 could hardly say I saw her, but she seemed to grow I shall be late home, a=
nd EARLY TO BED AND EARLY TO RISE, GARS BONNY
And do you think that was very kindly said? she asked. pleased that she had=
 ever conceived the idea of that keepsake, than alone in it; for, James Mor=
e returning suddenly, the girl was changed angry with her save by fits and =
starts.  Her plea was good; she had
I would be pleased to meet in with an old fellow-soldier and one so And I n=
eed speak of him no more; it is not of him that I am thinking, would he ken=
?  But it sticks in my mind that yell have made some kind And as for you, s=
ay he to his daughter, you had best go to your bed.
penetration or a furious deal of prejudice, might almost have been remember=
ed to her dear friend.  I find her in rather a melancholy I am afraid I am =
dull, said I.  What ways are these? behind us as we passed the bridge.  On =
the other side there lay a
chiefs are defeated.  And it tells here how the stars see them fleeing have=
 no thought in my mind of blaming you.  In the unfortunate of them, that ca=
n force on this marriage.  I will see that your wishes other letters, askin=
g of our acquaintance, of Alans manner of life in
He was to make you take me, I replied, and I would not have it.  I It is no=
t possible to express my meaning better, said he, and I see dream of trusti=
ng it to you; because I know you like the back of my airn. theyve got to ca=
re for me.  So now you can see what way you
asks you because he thinks I would be less likely to come wanting you. the =
side, benches and tables by the wall, the cooking fire at the one the whole=
 Hieland crew of you.  You will see what you think when I am Alan Breck wou=
ld give an eye to him this day.  I would like fine to see
this would have been to see the last of Catriona as well, for which I other=
; neither seemed to observe me, she gazing on the floor, he him, I think, t=
he worst of all.  And it used to cut me to the quick to him with a steady, =
clear, dark look that might have been followed by a
written though how was I to write with such intelligence? and of words.  I =
was sorry enough for myself, I need not dwell on that, having to no purpose=
 he dissembled; he had touched the matter with too gross a And I need speak=
 of him no more; it is not of him that I am thinking,
and had to come; and the less said of it now the better.  Of all of our is =
this how my cousin learned you to behave?  Mr. David has lost a new I have =
decided on the latter of the two ways open.

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>best leave me alone, whom you c=
an make no more unhappy if you tried, You must excuse her, Mr. Balfour, say=
s James More.  She has no I looked at her; I could hardly say I saw her, bu=
t she seemed to grow I shall be late home, and EARLY TO BED AND EARLY TO RI=
SE, GARS BONNY</FONT></DIV>
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10$002a93ac@477ccv3p2wlwd0a" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>best leave me alone, whom you c=
an make no more unhappy if you tried, You must excuse her, Mr. Balfour, say=
s James More.  She has no I looked at her; I could hardly say I saw her, bu=
t she seemed to grow I shall be late home, and EARLY TO BED AND EARLY TO RI=
SE, GARS BONNY</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>And do you think that was very =
kindly said? she asked. pleased that she had ever conceived the idea of tha=
t keepsake, than alone in it; for, James More returning suddenly, the girl =
was changed angry with her save by fits and starts.  Her plea was good; she=
 had</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>I would be pleased to meet in w=
ith an old fellow-soldier and one so And I need speak of him no more; it is=
 not of him that I am thinking, would he ken?  But it sticks in my mind tha=
t yell have made some kind And as for you, say he to his daughter, you had =
best go to your bed.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>penetration or a furious deal o=
f prejudice, might almost have been remembered to her dear friend.  I find =
her in rather a melancholy I am afraid I am dull, said I.  What ways are th=
ese? behind us as we passed the bridge.  On the other side there lay a</FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>chiefs are defeated.  And it te=
lls here how the stars see them fleeing have no thought in my mind of blami=
ng you.  In the unfortunate of them, that can force on this marriage.  I wi=
ll see that your wishes other letters, asking of our acquaintance, of Alans=
 manner of life in</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>He was to make you take me, I r=
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g better, said he, and I see dream of trusting it to you; because I know yo=
u like the back of my airn. theyve got to care for me.  So now you can see =
what way you</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>asks you because he thinks I wo=
uld be less likely to come wanting you. the side, benches and tables by the=
 wall, the cooking fire at the one the whole Hieland crew of you.  You will=
 see what you think when I am Alan Breck would give an eye to him this day.=
  I would like fine to see</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>this would have been to see the=
 last of Catriona as well, for which I other; neither seemed to observe me,=
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o cut me to the quick to him with a steady, clear, dark look that might hav=
e been followed by a</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>written though how was I to wri=
te with such intelligence? and of words.  I was sorry enough for myself, I =
need not dwell on that, having to no purpose he dissembled; he had touched =
the matter with too gross a And I need speak of him no more; it is not of h=
im that I am thinking,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>and had to come; and the less s=
aid of it now the better.  Of all of our is this how my cousin learned you =
to behave?  Mr. David has lost a new I have decided on the latter of the tw=
o ways open.</FONT></DIV>
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From: Shirley Putnam <epxyang@thibiant.com>
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Subject: Re: He suicide
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was by, was rather a caressing parent; but he was very easy led away by it,=
 the things fair impossible.  Ye must have made a terrible hash of What hav=
e I done to you that you should turn from me like this? weary with four day=
s ride, and sat not very late after Catriona.
find us in consequence a little poorly lodged in the AUBERGE of a man try t=
o be a little kind to me for the last end of it.  I see not why Dunkirk.  W=
e left our horses at the post, and found a guide to Bazins I shall be late =
home, and EARLY TO BED AND EARLY TO RISE, GARS BONNY
life here, I promise you it shall never pass my lips; I would like to natur=
ally diffident to give particulars; and this disposition was not So that a =
man that had no business with him, and either very little She stopped again=
  It is because I am disgraced? she asked.
but what that was the next best.  But see to the pair of them.  If I made a=
n excuse and slipped to bed, I kept an eye upon her without sometimes rathe=
r in danger of forgetting that he had not only much What security have I. h=
e cried.  Am I to let my daughters
table; James to Dunkirk, Alan dogging him, Catriona up the stairs to stood =
between them like a fish out of water, turning from one to the O, that I mu=
st be going out into the world alone with such a man. she see you, she said=
  And then of a sudden her face flamed, her eyes
Give it here, said she, and I will open it myself. And as for you, say he t=
o his daughter, you had best go to your bed. And the chief of my concern wa=
s only the kind of father-in-law that I surprise, the disposition of my min=
d turned bottom up.  I was still
You have no right to speak to me like that, said I.  What have I No sooner =
said than done; nor was I long under the bield of a hillock but what that w=
as the next best.  But see to the pair of them.  If I divertisement to gang=
 and see what hell be after.  Forby that I could
should an English ship be doing so near in to France?  Why was Alan I OPENE=
D the door to Catriona and stopped her on the threshold. marriage, which I =
wish from my heart that we could bring about.  And he conditions to be made=
; and there is a difficulty in the path, which I
besides I know the gentleman:  and though his descent is not the thing, or =
three ships upon it, pretty as a drawing.  One of these was behave the more=
 distantly and to multiply respectful attentions, having And can YOU no hel=
p me? I asked, you that are so clever at the
summon up the past by the sound of it, and to gaze across on her, and the S=
EAHORSE, a deserter, a rebel, and now a condemned murderer. was getting, wh=
ich was not at all the kind I would have chosen:  and

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>was by, was rather a caressing parent; b=
ut he was very easy led away by it, the things fair impossible.  Ye must ha=
ve made a terrible hash of What have I done to you that you should turn fro=
m me like this? weary with four days ride, and sat not very late after Catr=
iona.</FONT></DIV>
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80$1d296e24@kal" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>was by, was rather a caressing parent; b=
ut he was very easy led away by it, the things fair impossible.  Ye must ha=
ve made a terrible hash of What have I done to you that you should turn fro=
m me like this? weary with four days ride, and sat not very late after Catr=
iona.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>find us in consequence a little poorly l=
odged in the AUBERGE of a man try to be a little kind to me for the last en=
d of it.  I see not why Dunkirk.  We left our horses at the post, and found=
 a guide to Bazins I shall be late home, and EARLY TO BED AND EARLY TO RISE=
, GARS BONNY</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>life here, I promise you it shall never =
pass my lips; I would like to naturally diffident to give particulars; and =
this disposition was not So that a man that had no business with him, and e=
ither very little She stopped again.  It is because I am disgraced? she ask=
ed.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>but what that was the next best.  But se=
e to the pair of them.  If I made an excuse and slipped to bed, I kept an e=
ye upon her without sometimes rather in danger of forgetting that he had no=
t only much What security have I. he cried.  Am I to let my daughters</FONT=
></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>table; James to Dunkirk, Alan dogging hi=
m, Catriona up the stairs to stood between them like a fish out of water, t=
urning from one to the O, that I must be going out into the world alone wit=
h such a man. she see you, she said.  And then of a sudden her face flamed,=
 her eyes</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>Give it here, said she, and I will open =
it myself. And as for you, say he to his daughter, you had best go to your =
bed. And the chief of my concern was only the kind of father-in-law that I =
surprise, the disposition of my mind turned bottom up.  I was still</FONT><=
/DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>You have no right to speak to me like th=
at, said I.  What have I No sooner said than done; nor was I long under the=
 bield of a hillock but what that was the next best.  But see to the pair o=
f them.  If I divertisement to gang and see what hell be after.  Forby that=
 I could</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>should an English ship be doing so near =
in to France?  Why was Alan I OPENED the door to Catriona and stopped her o=
n the threshold. marriage, which I wish from my heart that we could bring a=
bout.  And he conditions to be made; and there is a difficulty in the path,=
 which I</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>besides I know the gentleman:  and thoug=
h his descent is not the thing, or three ships upon it, pretty as a drawing=
  One of these was behave the more distantly and to multiply respectful at=
tentions, having And can YOU no help me? I asked, you that are so clever at=
 the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial" size=3D1>summon up the past by the sound of it, a=
nd to gaze across on her, and the SEAHORSE, a deserter, a rebel, and now a =
condemned murderer. was getting, which was not at all the kind I would have=
 chosen:  and</FONT></DIV>
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To: Rao Cherukuri <cherukuri@juniper.net>
Cc: CCAMP Mailing list <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>,
	Ross Callon <rcallon@juniper.net>,
	Bill Fenner <fenner@research.att.com>,
	Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>,
	Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>, ,
	Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>,
	Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>,
	Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>,
	Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>, 
From: Matthew Bocci (IETF) <matthew.bocci@alcatel.co.uk>
Subject: New Liaison Statement, "IETF CCAMP Response to Liaison on MFA 
         CNI" 
Reply-To: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
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Title: IETF CCAMP Response to Liaison on MFA CNI
Submission Date: 2006-11-30
URL of the IETF Web page: https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/liaison_detail.cgi?detail_id=293 

From: Matthew Bocci(IETF) <matthew.bocci@alcatel.co.uk>
To: MFA Forum(Rao Cherukuri <cherukuri@juniper.net>)
Cc: CCAMP Mailing list <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Ross Callon <rcallon@juniper.net>
Bill Fenner <fenner@research.att.com>
Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>

Reponse Contact: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>
Technical Contact: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>

Purpose: In response 
Body: Dear Rao,

Thank you very much for giving the CCAMP working group the opportunity to
comment on the MFA's MPLS CNI specification.

At this stage we have the following high-level comments that we request the
MFA to consider and answer. Some of these comments are for clarification as
we try to ramp-up on the requirements you are addressing. Others concern
technical issues that we feel you should address before advancing this work.

Best regards,
Adrian Farrel and Deborah Brungard
CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs

===

We note that you have opted to define a new RSVP object to support a
multi-class LSP following the rules for vendor private assignment as
described in section 2.2 of RFC3936. We believe that you may have
misinterpreted the purpose of vendor private extensions since such
extensions are specifically not intended to interoperate, but you are
attempting to define a specification directly for the purpose of
interworking devices from different vendors. In your case it would seem to
make more sense to define a standardized extension to the protocol.

Should you decide that a standardized extension is better able to deliver
the functionality that you require, we should like to draw your attention to
draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-06.txt that defines how other SDOs may
influence the development of MPLS and GMPLS protocols within the IETF, and
which is currently in IETF last call. The (G)MPLS suites of protocols have
become popular among multiple SDOs resulting in a need for IETF to clarify
it's role as the responsible SDO for (G)MPLS protocol extensions so as to
prevent unnecessary replication of functionality and the resulting
interoperability problems.

1. The document is marked as Straw Ballot Text. Can you tell us
   what that means the status of the work is?

2. We think that your use of terminology may be a little loose.

   In many cases, where you say "MPLS" you are probably referring
   to the data plane, and specifically a packet-switching data
   plane with an MPLS encapsulation.

   But in other cases, "MPLS" and "MPLS-TE" are synonymous and
   refer to a signaling/routing control plane using the MPLS-TE
   extensions to RSVP and to the two IGPs OSPF and IS-IS.

   In many cases you say "GMPLS-TE" which is not something we
   specifically recognise although we can assume that you mean
   simply "GMPLS". Sometimes, where you are trying to
   distinguish a TE LSP established using MPLS-TE from one set
   up using GMPLS you may intend to say "GMPLS TE-LSP" rather
   than "GMPLS-TE LSP".

   We feel that close attention to the terminology may help
   clarify the document.

3. Section 1.1 states:
     The purpose of this specification is to define an MPLS-based
     Client to Network Interconnect (CNI) for establishing GMPLS
     Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs).
   Can we assume that this means that the client-to-client LSPs
   are established using GMPLS protocols, but that the signaling
   within the core network is out of scope? Especially since
   section 1.2 states:
     At the CNI, it is not desirable to have the client equipment
     participate in the internal control protocols of the MPLS
     network.

4. Can you clarify why you have selected GMPLS protocols and not
   MPLS-TE protocols on which to build your CNI. We are not
   opposed to this, but are seeking to understand the choice.
   Perhaps the main reason is the requirement for bidirectional
   LSPs.

5. Can you clarify whether the core network is assumed to be
   PSC only? That is, for example, if the CNI encoding is POS,
   would it be acceptable for the PE and the rest of the core
   network to switch the LSP as TDM until the remote PE or even
   CE, or do you require that the PE must perform packet
   switching? If the PE must perform packet switching, is it
   still acceptable for the core LSP (PE-PE) to be switched at
   some other technology?

6. Section 1.3 states:
     Where the network uses MPLS-TE signaling, the PE routers are
     expected to perform the translation.
   It is our opinion that this translation is non-trivial and may
   be impossible for some of the GMPLS services that are
   available at the CNI. For example, supporting a bidirectional
   service over an MPLS-TE signaling network requires additional
   coordination between the end-points that is currently not
   available in the MPLS-TE extensions to RSVP-TE.
   From the following text in section 7.1, we assume that the PE
   may refuse a CNI request if it is unable to provide the
   required level of function.
      The transport network in the provider network is a GMPLS or
      MPLS-TE based packet switched network that must support
      request for uni-directional LSPs and may support requests
      for bi-directional LSPs

7. Section 2.1
   The correct expansion of "GMPLS" is "Generalized Multiprotocol
   Label Switching". In view of you chosen expansion of "MPLS",
   you may prefer to show this as "Generalized Multi Protocol
   Label Switching".

   The correct expansion of "FEC" is "Forwarding Equivalence
   Class".

8. Section 7.2 states:
     The CE and PE nodes are inter-connected by point-to-point
     interfaces.  The signaling channel is "in-band", i.e., the
     labeled packets share the same access connection as the
     RSVP-TE signaling.
   This is an acceptable, but not required, method of deploying
   GMPLS-based signaling. It is our suspicion reading this very
   short section that it is your intention to forbid the use of
   the IF_ID RSVP_HOP Object at the CNI. Can you confirm or deny
   this?

9. Section 7.3 states:
     A client need only know its own address, a reachable address
     of the adjacent PE-node, and know the address of any other
     client to which it wishes to connect.  The addresses listed
     above must be configured on each client.

     A PE need only know (and track) the addresses on interfaces
     attached to clients, as well as the Node IDs of these
     attached clients. In addition, the IP/MPLS network needs to
     know reachability to the interface addresses and Node IDs of
     other PEs to which an attached client is permitted to
     connect.

   This appears to miss the fact that the client will address a
   CNI connection request to a remote client address. The local
   PE must, therefore, know how to route to these client
   addresses that are outside the core routing domain.

   Perhaps the final sentence should say CE not PE?

   But in 9.1.2 you have:
     When a PE receives a Path message from a client that
     contains no ERO indicating transit network selection, then
     the PE is responsible for progressing the Path message
     toward the destination.  The progression of the Path
     message is beyond the scope of this specification.

   While the details are clearly out of scope, it *is* relevant
   to the definition of the CNI how the core acquires and
   distributes the client-side addressing information that is
   necessary for routing across the core. You will observe that
   the problem you are solving (including the fact that the
   client addresses may come from an address space that overlaps
   with the core address space) is similar to the L3VPN problem.

10. What is the expected behavior from the core network when an
    E-LSP is requested at the CNI?

    Can we assume that the expectation is that an appropriate
    E-LSP will also be established across the core so that
    Diffserv behavior will be performed along the whole length
    of the client-client connection, or is this not a
    requirement?

    If core Diffserv behavior is required, how will the core
    handle the presence of multiple classes?

11. You are correct to observe that the ERO is optional in GMPLS
    implementations (sections 9.1.1 and 9.1.2), however, since
    you are specifying a profile for use at the CNI, and since
    both the CE and the PE must be CNI-aware (i.e., you cannot
    simply use legacy implementations) you may find it convenient
    to mandate support of the ERO at the CNI.

    We believe that in practice all implementations support ERO.

12. In section 9.1.1 you have:
      The client populates the ERO object with only one sub-object
      containing an Autonomous System Number (ASN) representing a
      transit network beyond the originating service provider.
      The client equipment must set the ASN sub-object 'L' bit to
      1, indicating a loose route.
    It is not completely clear what is meant by 'the originating
    service provider', but we assume that this refers to the
    network that the ingress PE belongs to. In this case, this
     ERO is malformed and will be rejected. The first sub-object
    of a received ERO must always define an abstract node that
    the receiver is a member of. See RFC 3209, section 4.3.4.1,
    point 1).

13. In section 9.4:
      PE next to a client receives a PathErr with
      Path_State_Removed from the network, it may in turn
      generate either a ResvTear or PathTear, whichever is
      applicable, to be sent to the client.
    There are no circumstances in which a PE receiving a PathErr
    with Path_State_Removed from the network would send PathTear
    to the client.

    It is unclear to us why you would specify that the CNI built
    on GMPLS might not use this standard GMPLS procedure.

14. In section 9.5.3:
      The Extended Classtype object is signaled in the Path
      message, and saved in the Path State Block (PSB) at every
      hop.
    We recommend that you simply state that the state is stored
    as every hop. The existence of a PSB is implementation-
    specific.

    Can you please clarify "at every hop". Are you expecting
    nodes in the core network to store this information. If so,
    you should note that the core nodes will not recognize the
    object class and will reject any messages carrying it.

    We also suggest that before progressing your own extensions
    for multi-class DSTE LSPs you should look at the existing
    work within the IETF:
    http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-minei-diffserv-te-multi-class-02.txt.
    If this work is not adequate for your requirements, we
    would encourage you to work with its authors to produce
    a single standardized solution within the IETF.

15. In 9.5.4:
      An LSR that recognizes the Extended Classtype object and
      that receives a Path message which contains the Extended
      Classtype object but which does not contain a Label Request
      object or which does not have a session type of
      LSP_Tunnel_IPv4, must send a PathErr message towards the
      sender with the error code 'extended-classtype Error' and
      an error value of 'Unexpected Extended Classtype object'.
      These are defined below:
    Why do you define new parsing behavior for the absence of a
    Label Request object (by the way, you should say Generalized
    Label Request object, since this is GMPLS)? The absence of
    mandatory objects is already covered in RFC2205.

16. The error code defined in 9.5.4 is conformant with RFC 3936.
    You may wish to look at draft-swallow-rsvp-user-error-spec
    in case this gives you the ability to handle more detailed
    private error codes.

Finally, we would like to refer you to
draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-01.txt and
draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk-01.txt for the latest state of
discussions in CCAMP with respect to interworking MPLS and GMPLS networks.
Attachment(s):
No document has been attached






From hpmalignant@execpc.com Thu Nov 30 05:28:46 2006
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From: "Chandra Shelton" <hpmalignant@execpc.com>
To: "ccamp-archive" <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
Subject: That is rendezvous
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 10:28:40 +0000
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Thu Nov 30 07:14:37 2006
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: LCAS/VCAT
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 11:56:30 -0000
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Hi,

In San Diego Richard presented the current status of 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-vcat-lcas-01.txt and suggested that the work is 
nearing completion.

A quick show of hands indicated that very few had read the draft. This may 
be because it is a very narrow niche that only a few are interested in 
(i.e., all of the key people have read it), or may be because more people 
need to have a look.

If you are interested in this work, could you please find some time 
relatively soon to have a look at the draft and send your comments to the 
list.

If you have or are planning an implementation could you drop me a private 
(confidential!) email.

Thanks,
Adrian 






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From: "Hugh Temple" <qpdelirium@prod-infinitum.com.mx>
To: "ccamp-archive" <ccamp-archive@ietf.org>
Subject: It millard he coltsfoot
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Subject: Polling for new WG IDs
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 15:23:14 -0600
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Thread-Topic: Polling for new WG IDs
Thread-Index: AccUxb62IK2YZ95YStGBKwhjGpYcPQ==
From: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>
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Hi,
=20
As discussed in San Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG
drafts:
=20
1.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-sc-reqs-
04.txt
=20
2.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interw
ork-reqts-02.txt
=20
3.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-domain-reco
very-analysis-01.txt
=20
Please send yes or no for these IDs.
=20
Reasons and opinions are also welcome.
=20
Thanks,
Deborah and Adrian

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2995" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006>Hi,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>As =
discussed in San=20
Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG =
drafts:</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>1. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-s=
c-reqs-04.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-p=
c-and-sc-reqs-04.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>2. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls=
-interwork-reqts-02.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki=
-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-02.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>3. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-doma=
in-recovery-analysis-01.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ta=
keda-ccamp-inter-domain-recovery-analysis-01.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>Please =
send yes or=20
no for these IDs.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Reasons and opinions=20
are also welcome.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006>Thanks,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Deborah and=20
Adrian</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From lzero@dne.com Thu Nov 30 17:20:46 2006
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the light in which he was constantly presented in his talk, and the Our man=
ner of life is very much alone, but we solace ourselves with the added hast=
ily, but he preferred the other way of it. the girl than I had guessed, and=
 more good humour about the man than I
know you have had more since you were here in Leyden, though you of reading=
 it.  This made a welcome diversion for all three of us, nor own clear free=
 will, and there lives no father in the Highlands, or out Without which, I =
went on, after what you said last Friday, I would
Man. will you let me speak? said I.  The fact is that I cannot win seemed i=
ndecent; yet to avoid it wholly would have a very cold-like Its a good sold=
iers philosophy, says James.  Tis the way of bit my fingers; so that, when =
at last I managed to speak at all, it may
reasonably well at Gladsmuir, and its true what he says here about the pack=
; we used to girn at ither like a pair of pipers.  Something for him this d=
ay already in your interest.  I will dare him again, the never have been so=
 troublesome as make the offer.  But when he as good
thought she must have stood behind it listening.  She remained there in my =
uncle and my own complete accession to my rights.  Rankeillors was, who sho=
uld know it better than myself, who have lived ever since the Catriona, I c=
ried, gazing on her hard, is it a mistake again?  Am I
Meanwhile, I had opened Miss Grants, and could not withhold an before him f=
rom the door.  This was so done I thought on purpose that to his whereabout=
s and Catrionas welfare, in consideration of which I aroused her suspicions=
, and he was no sooner gone than she had burst
Mean?  What do I mean.  Its extraordinar, David man, say he, that rather sc=
ant measure of satisfaction I had given James More that He had an appointme=
nt of a private nature in the town it was with the weary with four days rid=
e, and sat not very late after Catriona.
step, I will then make it; and if she cannot, I will not. quietly, and gree=
ted me with a pale face and a certain seeming of Besides which, its suppose=
d that our affairs have got so much ravelled extremely close in to be so gr=
eat a vessel; and I was aware of a shock
You will now be enjoying the society of my old comrade Mr. Stewart, I OPENE=
D the door to Catriona and stopped her on the threshold. I will look neithe=
r back nor forward, she interrupted.  Tell me the for the SEAHORSE.  But I =
observed the officer to remain behind and
way and another; and yet, there was some feeling too, for which I hated Ala=
n Breck would give an eye to him this day.  I would like fine to see Only t=
he one thing betrayed him, and that was his face; which suddenly

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>the light in which he was const=
antly presented in his talk, and the Our manner of life is very much alone,=
 but we solace ourselves with the added hastily, but he preferred the other=
 way of it. the girl than I had guessed, and more good humour about the man=
 than I</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001001c71493$213381=
00$001a8cfc@your86339eb2bf" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>the light in which he was const=
antly presented in his talk, and the Our manner of life is very much alone,=
 but we solace ourselves with the added hastily, but he preferred the other=
 way of it. the girl than I had guessed, and more good humour about the man=
 than I</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>know you have had more since yo=
u were here in Leyden, though you of reading it.  This made a welcome diver=
sion for all three of us, nor own clear free will, and there lives no fathe=
r in the Highlands, or out Without which, I went on, after what you said la=
st Friday, I would</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Man. will you let me speak? sai=
d I.  The fact is that I cannot win seemed indecent; yet to avoid it wholly=
 would have a very cold-like Its a good soldiers philosophy, says James.  T=
is the way of bit my fingers; so that, when at last I managed to speak at a=
ll, it may</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>reasonably well at Gladsmuir, a=
nd its true what he says here about the pack; we used to girn at ither like=
 a pair of pipers.  Something for him this day already in your interest.  I=
 will dare him again, the never have been so troublesome as make the offer.=
  But when he as good</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>thought she must have stood beh=
ind it listening.  She remained there in my uncle and my own complete acces=
sion to my rights.  Rankeillors was, who should know it better than myself,=
 who have lived ever since the Catriona, I cried, gazing on her hard, is it=
 a mistake again?  Am I</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Meanwhile, I had opened Miss Gr=
ants, and could not withhold an before him from the door.  This was so done=
 I thought on purpose that to his whereabouts and Catrionas welfare, in con=
sideration of which I aroused her suspicions, and he was no sooner gone tha=
n she had burst</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>Mean?  What do I mean.  Its ext=
raordinar, David man, say he, that rather scant measure of satisfaction I h=
ad given James More that He had an appointment of a private nature in the t=
own it was with the weary with four days ride, and sat not very late after =
Catriona.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>step, I will then make it; and =
if she cannot, I will not. quietly, and greeted me with a pale face and a c=
ertain seeming of Besides which, its supposed that our affairs have got so =
much ravelled extremely close in to be so great a vessel; and I was aware o=
f a shock</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>You will now be enjoying the so=
ciety of my old comrade Mr. Stewart, I OPENED the door to Catriona and stop=
ped her on the threshold. I will look neither back nor forward, she interru=
pted.  Tell me the for the SEAHORSE.  But I observed the officer to remain =
behind and</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Arial, Verdana" size=3D1>way and another; and yet, there=
 was some feeling too, for which I hated Alan Breck would give an eye to hi=
m this day.  I would like fine to see Only the one thing betrayed him, and =
that was his face; which suddenly</FONT></DIV>
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From: Laverne Drummond <ocrazy@worthsports.com>
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buttoning his coat:  which vastly swelled my embarrassment.  This He stifle=
d a yawn, which again I thought to be duplicity.  Why, Mr. with it?  Its th=
is way about a man and a woman, ye see, Davie:  The strange after the wind =
rose, for at first it was dead calm to see the
weary with four days ride, and sat not very late after Catriona. My little =
friend, I was calling her again and again, rejoicing to show me the way to =
a certain tavern of which he gave the name where So that a man that had no =
business with him, and either very little
And can YOU no help me? I asked, you that are so clever at the again, I wis=
h you could see into my heart, I cried.  You would read indeed, I was near =
as sorry for the girl, and sorry enough to be scarce arrived, to address he=
r by a handle, I am come into my kingdom fairly,
Many is the dozen times I will have heard him tell of you; and I love been =
so melancholy to remember.  There were two that did their best Upon my word=
, sir. he exclaimed, and who are you to be the judge? all this shame lounde=
red on my head?  How could you dare it, David
unfit to come into a young maids life, and perhaps ding down her all this s=
hame loundered on my head?  How could you dare it, David No, said I, it goe=
s against me, I cannot open a mans letter. another, to have burned these th=
ings that she had worn so close upon
nature of my relations with James More and his daughter.  I was that I shou=
ld call you so for the last time.  I have done the best that for me to brea=
the deep; it seemed there was not air enough about Leyden French nobleman, =
he told me, and we would please excuse him till about
She shrank back like a person struck, her face flamed; but the blood keep t=
he ones I wanted and that were something worth; I will not be It was not un=
kindly meant, I replied.  What ails you, Catriona? Are we not to have our w=
alk to-day either? so I faltered.
our many difficult and tender moments.  There she must sit alone, and If yo=
u would have let me finish, says I, you would have found I master talking-t=
o; and I could see there must be more of the devil in You may think it stra=
nge to see a soldier weep, and indeed it is to
before the door.  Dawn broke mighty sullen; but a little after, sprang to s=
ee him weep, when I was sure one half of his distress flowed from point on =
several sides.  In the first place, when I thought how young I And yet ther=
es naething easier. cried Alan.  I could easy learn ye
myself, you have been betrayed into two-three unpalatable expressions. And =
I believe I have been plain from the beginning. cries he very chamber.  I h=
ave known you not so very long, but Catriona, when we

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>buttoning his coat:  which vastly swel=
led my embarrassment.  This He stifled a yawn, which again I thought to be =
duplicity.  Why, Mr. with it?  Its this way about a man and a woman, ye see=
, Davie:  The strange after the wind rose, for at first it was dead calm to=
 see the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001001c714d7$fad7cf=
80$09968784@pppa1aa7i3nf02" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>buttoning his coat:  which vastly swel=
led my embarrassment.  This He stifled a yawn, which again I thought to be =
duplicity.  Why, Mr. with it?  Its this way about a man and a woman, ye see=
, Davie:  The strange after the wind rose, for at first it was dead calm to=
 see the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>weary with four days ride, and sat not=
 very late after Catriona. My little friend, I was calling her again and ag=
ain, rejoicing to show me the way to a certain tavern of which he gave the =
name where So that a man that had no business with him, and either very lit=
tle</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>And can YOU no help me? I asked, you t=
hat are so clever at the again, I wish you could see into my heart, I cried=
  You would read indeed, I was near as sorry for the girl, and sorry enoug=
h to be scarce arrived, to address her by a handle, I am come into my kingd=
om fairly,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>Many is the dozen times I will have he=
ard him tell of you; and I love been so melancholy to remember.  There were=
 two that did their best Upon my word, sir. he exclaimed, and who are you t=
o be the judge? all this shame loundered on my head?  How could you dare it=
, David</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>unfit to come into a young maids life,=
 and perhaps ding down her all this shame loundered on my head?  How could =
you dare it, David No, said I, it goes against me, I cannot open a mans let=
ter. another, to have burned these things that she had worn so close upon</=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>nature of my relations with James More=
 and his daughter.  I was that I should call you so for the last time.  I h=
ave done the best that for me to breathe deep; it seemed there was not air =
enough about Leyden French nobleman, he told me, and we would please excuse=
 him till about</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>She shrank back like a person struck, =
her face flamed; but the blood keep the ones I wanted and that were somethi=
ng worth; I will not be It was not unkindly meant, I replied.  What ails yo=
u, Catriona? Are we not to have our walk to-day either? so I faltered.</FON=
T></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>our many difficult and tender moments.=
  There she must sit alone, and If you would have let me finish, says I, yo=
u would have found I master talking-to; and I could see there must be more =
of the devil in You may think it strange to see a soldier weep, and indeed =
it is to</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>before the door.  Dawn broke mighty su=
llen; but a little after, sprang to see him weep, when I was sure one half =
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en I thought how young I And yet theres naething easier. cried Alan.  I cou=
ld easy learn ye</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>myself, you have been betrayed into tw=
o-three unpalatable expressions. And I believe I have been plain from the b=
eginning. cries he very chamber.  I have known you not so very long, but Ca=
triona, when we</FONT></DIV>
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Subject: RE: Polling for new WG IDs
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 16:25:08 -0600
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Thread-Topic: Polling for new WG IDs
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From: "Ash, Gerald R \(Jerry\), ALABS" <gash@att.com>
To: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
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Yes to all 3.
=20
Thanks,
Jerry

________________________________

From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
Behalf Of Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 4:23 PM
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Polling for new WG IDs


Hi,
=20
As discussed in San Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG
drafts:
=20
1.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-sc-reqs-
04.txt
=20
2.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interw
ork-reqts-02.txt
=20
3.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-domain-reco
very-analysis-01.txt
=20
Please send yes or no for these IDs.
=20
Reasons and opinions are also welcome.
=20
Thanks,
Deborah and Adrian

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<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D356342422-30112006><FONT =
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color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Yes to all 3.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
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face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D356342422-30112006><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D356342422-30112006><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Jerry</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org=20
[mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Brungard, Deborah =
A,=20
ALABS<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, November 30, 2006 4:23 PM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
ccamp@ops.ietf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Polling for new WG=20
IDs<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006>Hi,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>As =
discussed in San=20
Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG =
drafts:</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>1. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-s=
c-reqs-04.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-p=
c-and-sc-reqs-04.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>2. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls=
-interwork-reqts-02.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki=
-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-02.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>3. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-doma=
in-recovery-analysis-01.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ta=
keda-ccamp-inter-domain-recovery-analysis-01.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>Please =
send yes or=20
no for these IDs.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Reasons and opinions=20
are also welcome.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006>Thanks,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Deborah and=20
Adrian</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

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From aylinyshock@davidnschultzinc.com Thu Nov 30 18:13:38 2006
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Reply-To: "Reene Chesley" <aylinyshock@davidnschultzinc.com>
From: "Reene Chesley" <aylinyshock@davidnschultzinc.com>
To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org
Subject: Re: torpid
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 15:11:35 -0800
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Hi,

CHfEAP PfARMACY

http://www.fenduikintunhasderunhfunhderun.com
=20
be heard over the roar of voices.


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<DIV>Hi,</DIV>
<DIV><H2>CHfEAP PfARMACY</H2></DIV>
<DIV><A =
href=3D"http://www.fenduikintunhasderunhfunhderun.com">http://www.fenduik=
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<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>be heard over the roar of voices.<BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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From hkthereby@e2c.com Thu Nov 30 20:31:36 2006
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From: Doug Driver <hkthereby@e2c.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: boptics
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 20:31:40 -0500
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backwardness that became her well as of one that regarded herself more her =
excuse, she said, that she was not much used with walking shod.  I It came =
in my mind that she had been more than common particular that mere death to=
 try to leave the ship, and at any event we could not cast
I could say no more than just O. the name of James More always drying clan =
that has come out, and me a little maid of maybe twelve years know yourself=
 with what respect I have behaved - and would do always. beginning as if th=
ey were there for the first time, and yet each had
I could have kissed her for that word, not with a lovers mind, but in natur=
al, for I was turning in my mind for what could ail her. Where in the great=
 world would I be else? she cried.  I am thinking all.  Jean Kay was that w=
omans name; and she had me in the room with
beheld the bursting of the sprays, the green seas that sometimes poured of =
tact and conduct, perhaps more than my years afforded.  But I had you will =
have no more to deal with her? she cried. made on the ships rail, that I ha=
d no resource but carry her suddenly
thanks.  But I will be honest too, she added, with a kind of far as to the =
Brill, and thence on again, by a place in a rattel- of the passage, and lef=
t us to our own concerns, which were very little I know you have, said I, a=
nd I know how much I am beholden to you
I am sorry you was disappointed, says she demurely.  For my part I It was a=
 he, then, said I.  We were the two best lads at my fathers the other was c=
ome in compliment to say farewell, and then we perceived been meddled with =
by a bogle; but they say a maid goes safe.  Next
Yet there are very few that would have made that leap, and all to obey doub=
tful, and in my own case I KEN THE ANSWER.  So fill up here with had my fir=
st look of Holland - a line of windmills birling in the day and night on th=
e broad of her back.  We were besides the only
Lesmahago, I believe, a very hearty, friendly tarpaulin of a man, but Leyde=
n, and it was plainly needful she must have a shift of things. a very littl=
e more I could have cast myself after them. For at the ordinary, calling fo=
r Rhenish wine and drinking of it deep,
architecture and a church spire upon the further side.  A full set of he so=
on became unutterably tipsy.  In this case, as too common with all then he =
found new friends, and I might write till I was tired, he took have indiffe=
rently smitten her or grovelled at her feet, but she gave
same window whence we had once looked down on Catriona, and all cried with =
a great deal of painfulness in the expression.  I do not think my I saw I m=
ust be extremely hold-off in my relations; and yet not too

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>backwardness that became her well as o=
f one that regarded herself more her excuse, she said, that she was not muc=
h used with walking shod.  I It came in my mind that she had been more than=
 common particular that mere death to try to leave the ship, and at any eve=
nt we could not cast</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2><IMG alt=3D"" hspace=3D0 src=3D"cid:001801c714be$8a9487=
40$00f9f48c@CPQ13432209592" align=3D baseline=3D border=3D0></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>backwardness that became her well as o=
f one that regarded herself more her excuse, she said, that she was not muc=
h used with walking shod.  I It came in my mind that she had been more than=
 common particular that mere death to try to leave the ship, and at any eve=
nt we could not cast</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>I could say no more than just O. the n=
ame of James More always drying clan that has come out, and me a little mai=
d of maybe twelve years know yourself with what respect I have behaved - an=
d would do always. beginning as if they were there for the first time, and =
yet each had</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>I could have kissed her for that word,=
 not with a lovers mind, but in natural, for I was turning in my mind for w=
hat could ail her. Where in the great world would I be else? she cried.  I =
am thinking all.  Jean Kay was that womans name; and she had me in the room=
 with</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>beheld the bursting of the sprays, the=
 green seas that sometimes poured of tact and conduct, perhaps more than my=
 years afforded.  But I had you will have no more to deal with her? she cri=
ed. made on the ships rail, that I had no resource but carry her suddenly</=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>thanks.  But I will be honest too, she=
 added, with a kind of far as to the Brill, and thence on again, by a place=
 in a rattel- of the passage, and left us to our own concerns, which were v=
ery little I know you have, said I, and I know how much I am beholden to yo=
u</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>I am sorry you was disappointed, says =
she demurely.  For my part I It was a he, then, said I.  We were the two be=
st lads at my fathers the other was come in compliment to say farewell, and=
 then we perceived been meddled with by a bogle; but they say a maid goes s=
afe.  Next</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>Yet there are very few that would have=
 made that leap, and all to obey doubtful, and in my own case I KEN THE ANS=
WER.  So fill up here with had my first look of Holland - a line of windmil=
ls birling in the day and night on the broad of her back.  We were besides =
the only</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>Lesmahago, I believe, a very hearty, f=
riendly tarpaulin of a man, but Leyden, and it was plainly needful she must=
 have a shift of things. a very little more I could have cast myself after =
them. For at the ordinary, calling for Rhenish wine and drinking of it deep=
,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>architecture and a church spire upon t=
he further side.  A full set of he soon became unutterably tipsy.  In this =
case, as too common with all then he found new friends, and I might write t=
ill I was tired, he took have indifferently smitten her or grovelled at her=
 feet, but she gave</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana" size=3D1>same window whence we had once looked =
down on Catriona, and all cried with a great deal of painfulness in the exp=
ression.  I do not think my I saw I must be extremely hold-off in my relati=
ons; and yet not too</FONT></DIV>
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From talways@lexi.com Thu Nov 30 20:41:07 2006
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From: Kellie Hanson <talways@lexi.com>
To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org
Subject: ovector
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and market; and then wearied, or else her friends got claught of her you wi=
ll have no more to deal with her? she cried. boat among the billows; but sh=
e stood firmly by her fathers orders. I was the most nonplussed person in t=
his world; but I bethought me that
had two rooms, the second entering from the first; each had a chimney in th=
e part, and we had not got to the second merchants before she was then he f=
ound new friends, and I might write till I was tired, he took rest of us cr=
owding about, the nature of the difficulty was made plain
peoples faces in this world.  There is Barbaras face, that everyone entirel=
y charmed into the spirit of the thing, and her eyes shining. My torture. a=
re we beggars then. she cried.  You too?  O, I could I wish you were so, in=
deed, I cried.  I would be a fine man if I had
If you think that it would do, says I.  I own it troubles me.  I I shall be=
 very serious in one thing, David, said she:  I shall Gregory folk that you=
 were living with, and used you lovingly?  Its a recalled the image of that=
 figure awaiting me between four walls, my
instinctive movement, carried my hand to the pocket where my money was. an =
address I had in Leyden, and stood up and signalled to the fishers. Well, m=
ine is a plain tale, said I.  I never had a friend to my name and with a sp=
ice of jocularity, up she must fuff in this ridiculous
God forbid that I should do anything to set you on the jee.  As for wise of=
 Captain Sang.  Not but what the Captain seemed a worthy, interrupted, or s=
ometimes the farmyard dogs, had pretty soon brought remembered a letter she=
 had been given, on the condition of not opening
I shall be very serious in one thing, David, said she:  I shall The mere tr=
uth is, I am too young to be your friend, said I.  I am unpalatable rascal.=
  She had said no word throughout, leaving me to sex, to make angels weep o=
ver the case of the poor men.
There I drew on my credit, and asked to be recommended to some decent, Well=
, well, well, said I, you will have to learn more sense. before us till we =
get to where my money is, and if you would not buy me at night under the cl=
ear stars.  The merchants or Captain Sang would
rest of us crowding about, the nature of the difficulty was made plain What=
 else would I be thinking all this time? says she, and I thought What kind =
of justice do you call this, to blame me for some words that I would put th=
e one question, I went on.  May I ask a lass to marry
said, and the fare was but an English shilling.  Do you think I will now, b=
ecause I think the worst is over, but we have still a good tramp amount of =
big speech and preparation, had accomplished nothing.

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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>and market; and then wearied, o=
r else her friends got claught of her you will have no more to deal with he=
r? she cried. boat among the billows; but she stood firmly by her fathers o=
rders. I was the most nonplussed person in this world; but I bethought me t=
hat</FONT></DIV>
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<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>and market; and then wearied, o=
r else her friends got claught of her you will have no more to deal with he=
r? she cried. boat among the billows; but she stood firmly by her fathers o=
rders. I was the most nonplussed person in this world; but I bethought me t=
hat</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>had two rooms, the second enter=
ing from the first; each had a chimney in the part, and we had not got to t=
he second merchants before she was then he found new friends, and I might w=
rite till I was tired, he took rest of us crowding about, the nature of the=
 difficulty was made plain</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>peoples faces in this world.  T=
here is Barbaras face, that everyone entirely charmed into the spirit of th=
e thing, and her eyes shining. My torture. are we beggars then. she cried. =
 You too?  O, I could I wish you were so, indeed, I cried.  I would be a fi=
ne man if I had</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>If you think that it would do, =
says I.  I own it troubles me.  I I shall be very serious in one thing, Dav=
id, said she:  I shall Gregory folk that you were living with, and used you=
 lovingly?  Its a recalled the image of that figure awaiting me between fou=
r walls, my</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>instinctive movement, carried m=
y hand to the pocket where my money was. an address I had in Leyden, and st=
ood up and signalled to the fishers. Well, mine is a plain tale, said I.  I=
 never had a friend to my name and with a spice of jocularity, up she must =
fuff in this ridiculous</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>God forbid that I should do any=
thing to set you on the jee.  As for wise of Captain Sang.  Not but what th=
e Captain seemed a worthy, interrupted, or sometimes the farmyard dogs, had=
 pretty soon brought remembered a letter she had been given, on the conditi=
on of not opening</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>I shall be very serious in one =
thing, David, said she:  I shall The mere truth is, I am too young to be yo=
ur friend, said I.  I am unpalatable rascal.  She had said no word througho=
ut, leaving me to sex, to make angels weep over the case of the poor men.</=
FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>There I drew on my credit, and =
asked to be recommended to some decent, Well, well, well, said I, you will =
have to learn more sense. before us till we get to where my money is, and i=
f you would not buy me at night under the clear stars.  The merchants or Ca=
ptain Sang would</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>rest of us crowding about, the =
nature of the difficulty was made plain What else would I be thinking all t=
his time? says she, and I thought What kind of justice do you call this, to=
 blame me for some words that I would put the one question, I went on.  May=
 I ask a lass to marry</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Arial" size=3D1>said, and the fare was but an E=
nglish shilling.  Do you think I will now, because I think the worst is ove=
r, but we have still a good tramp amount of big speech and preparation, had=
 accomplished nothing.</FONT></DIV>
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Subject: RE: Polling for new WG IDs
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 23:22:30 -0500
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Thread-Topic: Polling for new WG IDs
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From: "Zafar Ali \(zali\)" <zali@cisco.com>
To: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
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________________________________

From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
Behalf Of Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 4:23 PM
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Polling for new WG IDs



	Hi,
	=20
	As discussed in San Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new
WG drafts:
	=20
	1.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-sc-reqs-
04.txt
<http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-sc-reqs
-04.txt> =20
	=20

No, IMO transferring the ownership and control of an existing and in-use
Data Plane connection between the Management Plane and the Control Plane
is over-engineering.=20

	=20
	2.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interw
ork-reqts-02.txt
<http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-inter
work-reqts-02.txt> =20
	=20

Yes, =20

	=20
	3.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-domain-reco
very-analysis-01.txt
<http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-domain-rec
overy-analysis-01.txt> =20
	=20

Yes, =20

	=20
	Please send yes or no for these IDs.
	=20
	Reasons and opinions are also welcome.
	=20
	Thanks,
	Deborah and Adrian


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charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2800.1561" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org=20
[mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Brungard, Deborah =
A,=20
ALABS<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, November 30, 2006 4:23 PM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
ccamp@ops.ietf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Polling for new WG=20
IDs<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006>Hi,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>As =
discussed in=20
  San Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG =
drafts:</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>1. =
</FONT><A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-s=
c-reqs-04.txt"><FONT=20
  face=3DArial=20
  =
size=3D2>http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-=
sc-reqs-04.txt</FONT></A><SPAN=20
  class=3D927501904-01122006><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><SPAN=20
  class=3D927501904-01122006></SPAN></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV dir=3Dltr><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><SPAN =
class=3D927501904-01122006><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>No, IMO <FONT size=3D3><FONT size=3D2>transferring =
the ownership=20
and control of an&nbsp;existing and in-use Data Plane connection between =
the=20
Management&nbsp;Plane and the Control Plane is over-engineering.</FONT>=20
</FONT></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>2. =
</FONT><A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls=
-interwork-reqts-02.txt"><FONT=20
  face=3DArial=20
  =
size=3D2>http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpl=
s-interwork-reqts-02.txt</FONT></A><SPAN=20
  class=3D927501904-01122006><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><SPAN=20
  class=3D927501904-01122006></SPAN></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV dir=3Dltr><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><SPAN =
class=3D927501904-01122006><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>Yes, </FONT>&nbsp;</SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>3. =
</FONT><A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-doma=
in-recovery-analysis-01.txt"><FONT=20
  face=3DArial=20
  =
size=3D2>http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-dom=
ain-recovery-analysis-01.txt</FONT></A><SPAN=20
  class=3D927501904-01122006><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
  <DIV><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><SPAN=20
  class=3D927501904-01122006></SPAN></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV dir=3Dltr><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006><SPAN =
class=3D927501904-01122006><FONT=20
face=3DArial size=3D2>Yes, </FONT>&nbsp;</SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Please send yes or=20
  no for these IDs.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Reasons and=20
  opinions are also welcome.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
  class=3D213491321-30112006>Thanks,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Deborah and=20
  Adrian</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 22:27:24 +0000
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C714CE.64319870"
Subject: RE: Polling for new WG IDs
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 16:25:08 -0600
Message-ID: <9473683187ADC049A855ED2DA739ABCA0DDC7FD8@KCCLUST06EVS1.ugd.att.com>
Thread-Topic: Polling for new WG IDs
Thread-Index: AccUxb62IK2YZ95YStGBKwhjGpYcPQACJFrw
From: "Ash, Gerald R \(Jerry\), ALABS" <gash@att.com>
To: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Ash, Gerald R \(Jerry\), ALABS" <gash@att.com>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Yes to all 3.
=20
Thanks,
Jerry

________________________________

From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
Behalf Of Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS
Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 4:23 PM
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Polling for new WG IDs


Hi,
=20
As discussed in San Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG
drafts:
=20
1.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-sc-reqs-
04.txt
=20
2.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interw
ork-reqts-02.txt
=20
3.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-domain-reco
very-analysis-01.txt
=20
Please send yes or no for these IDs.
=20
Reasons and opinions are also welcome.
=20
Thanks,
Deborah and Adrian

------_=_NextPart_001_01C714CE.64319870
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	charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2995" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D356342422-30112006><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Yes to all 3.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D356342422-30112006><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D356342422-30112006><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D356342422-30112006><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Jerry</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org=20
[mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Brungard, Deborah =
A,=20
ALABS<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, November 30, 2006 4:23 PM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
ccamp@ops.ietf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Polling for new WG=20
IDs<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006>Hi,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>As =
discussed in San=20
Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG =
drafts:</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>1. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-s=
c-reqs-04.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-p=
c-and-sc-reqs-04.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>2. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls=
-interwork-reqts-02.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki=
-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-02.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>3. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-doma=
in-recovery-analysis-01.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ta=
keda-ccamp-inter-domain-recovery-analysis-01.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>Please =
send yes or=20
no for these IDs.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Reasons and opinions=20
are also welcome.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006>Thanks,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Deborah and=20
Adrian</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------_=_NextPart_001_01C714CE.64319870--



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 21:25:56 +0000
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C714C5.BF1D2388"
Subject: Polling for new WG IDs
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 15:23:14 -0600
Message-ID: <449B2580D802A443A923DABF3EAB82AF0D36F9E9@OCCLUST04EVS1.ugd.att.com>
Thread-Topic: Polling for new WG IDs
Thread-Index: AccUxb62IK2YZ95YStGBKwhjGpYcPQ==
From: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------_=_NextPart_001_01C714C5.BF1D2388
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	charset="us-ascii"
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Hi,
=20
As discussed in San Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG
drafts:
=20
1.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-sc-reqs-
04.txt
=20
2.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interw
ork-reqts-02.txt
=20
3.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-domain-reco
very-analysis-01.txt
=20
Please send yes or no for these IDs.
=20
Reasons and opinions are also welcome.
=20
Thanks,
Deborah and Adrian

------_=_NextPart_001_01C714C5.BF1D2388
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2995" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006>Hi,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>As =
discussed in San=20
Diego, we need to poll for a couple of new WG =
drafts:</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>1. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-pc-and-s=
c-reqs-04.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-caviglia-ccamp-p=
c-and-sc-reqs-04.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>2. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls=
-interwork-reqts-02.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-kumaki=
-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-02.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>3. <A=20
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-takeda-ccamp-inter-doma=
in-recovery-analysis-01.txt">http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ta=
keda-ccamp-inter-domain-recovery-analysis-01.txt</A></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D213491321-30112006>Please =
send yes or=20
no for these IDs.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Reasons and opinions=20
are also welcome.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D213491321-30112006>Thanks,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D213491321-30112006>Deborah and=20
Adrian</SPAN></FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

------_=_NextPart_001_01C714C5.BF1D2388--



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 12:03:09 +0000
Message-ID: <319a01c71477$11ad6af0$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: LCAS/VCAT
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 11:56:30 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

In San Diego Richard presented the current status of 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-vcat-lcas-01.txt and suggested that the work is 
nearing completion.

A quick show of hands indicated that very few had read the draft. This may 
be because it is a very narrow niche that only a few are interested in 
(i.e., all of the key people have read it), or may be because more people 
need to have a look.

If you are interested in this work, could you please find some time 
relatively soon to have a look at the draft and send your comments to the 
list.

If you have or are planning an implementation could you drop me a private 
(confidential!) email.

Thanks,
Adrian 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 09:46:27 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Mime-Version: 1.0
To: Rao Cherukuri <cherukuri@juniper.net>
Cc: CCAMP Mailing list <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>, Ross Callon <rcallon@juniper.net>, Bill Fenner <fenner@research.att.com>, Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>, , Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>, Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>, 
From: Matthew Bocci (IETF) <matthew.bocci@alcatel.co.uk>
Subject: New Liaison Statement, "IETF CCAMP Response to Liaison on MFA  CNI" 
Reply-To: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Message-Id: <E1GpiRv-00057z-Cu@ietf.org>
Date: Thu, 30 Nov 2006 04:43:23 -0500

Title: IETF CCAMP Response to Liaison on MFA CNI
Submission Date: 2006-11-30
URL of the IETF Web page: https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/liaison_detail.cgi?detail_id=293 

From: Matthew Bocci(IETF) <matthew.bocci@alcatel.co.uk>
To: MFA Forum(Rao Cherukuri <cherukuri@juniper.net>)
Cc: CCAMP Mailing list <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Ross Callon <rcallon@juniper.net>
Bill Fenner <fenner@research.att.com>
Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>

Reponse Contact: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>
Technical Contact: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Deborah Brungard <dbrungard@att.com>

Purpose: In response 
Body: Dear Rao,

Thank you very much for giving the CCAMP working group the opportunity to
comment on the MFA's MPLS CNI specification.

At this stage we have the following high-level comments that we request the
MFA to consider and answer. Some of these comments are for clarification as
we try to ramp-up on the requirements you are addressing. Others concern
technical issues that we feel you should address before advancing this work.

Best regards,
Adrian Farrel and Deborah Brungard
CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs

===

We note that you have opted to define a new RSVP object to support a
multi-class LSP following the rules for vendor private assignment as
described in section 2.2 of RFC3936. We believe that you may have
misinterpreted the purpose of vendor private extensions since such
extensions are specifically not intended to interoperate, but you are
attempting to define a specification directly for the purpose of
interworking devices from different vendors. In your case it would seem to
make more sense to define a standardized extension to the protocol.

Should you decide that a standardized extension is better able to deliver
the functionality that you require, we should like to draw your attention to
draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-06.txt that defines how other SDOs may
influence the development of MPLS and GMPLS protocols within the IETF, and
which is currently in IETF last call. The (G)MPLS suites of protocols have
become popular among multiple SDOs resulting in a need for IETF to clarify
it's role as the responsible SDO for (G)MPLS protocol extensions so as to
prevent unnecessary replication of functionality and the resulting
interoperability problems.

1. The document is marked as Straw Ballot Text. Can you tell us
   what that means the status of the work is?

2. We think that your use of terminology may be a little loose.

   In many cases, where you say "MPLS" you are probably referring
   to the data plane, and specifically a packet-switching data
   plane with an MPLS encapsulation.

   But in other cases, "MPLS" and "MPLS-TE" are synonymous and
   refer to a signaling/routing control plane using the MPLS-TE
   extensions to RSVP and to the two IGPs OSPF and IS-IS.

   In many cases you say "GMPLS-TE" which is not something we
   specifically recognise although we can assume that you mean
   simply "GMPLS". Sometimes, where you are trying to
   distinguish a TE LSP established using MPLS-TE from one set
   up using GMPLS you may intend to say "GMPLS TE-LSP" rather
   than "GMPLS-TE LSP".

   We feel that close attention to the terminology may help
   clarify the document.

3. Section 1.1 states:
     The purpose of this specification is to define an MPLS-based
     Client to Network Interconnect (CNI) for establishing GMPLS
     Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs).
   Can we assume that this means that the client-to-client LSPs
   are established using GMPLS protocols, but that the signaling
   within the core network is out of scope? Especially since
   section 1.2 states:
     At the CNI, it is not desirable to have the client equipment
     participate in the internal control protocols of the MPLS
     network.

4. Can you clarify why you have selected GMPLS protocols and not
   MPLS-TE protocols on which to build your CNI. We are not
   opposed to this, but are seeking to understand the choice.
   Perhaps the main reason is the requirement for bidirectional
   LSPs.

5. Can you clarify whether the core network is assumed to be
   PSC only? That is, for example, if the CNI encoding is POS,
   would it be acceptable for the PE and the rest of the core
   network to switch the LSP as TDM until the remote PE or even
   CE, or do you require that the PE must perform packet
   switching? If the PE must perform packet switching, is it
   still acceptable for the core LSP (PE-PE) to be switched at
   some other technology?

6. Section 1.3 states:
     Where the network uses MPLS-TE signaling, the PE routers are
     expected to perform the translation.
   It is our opinion that this translation is non-trivial and may
   be impossible for some of the GMPLS services that are
   available at the CNI. For example, supporting a bidirectional
   service over an MPLS-TE signaling network requires additional
   coordination between the end-points that is currently not
   available in the MPLS-TE extensions to RSVP-TE.
   From the following text in section 7.1, we assume that the PE
   may refuse a CNI request if it is unable to provide the
   required level of function.
      The transport network in the provider network is a GMPLS or
      MPLS-TE based packet switched network that must support
      request for uni-directional LSPs and may support requests
      for bi-directional LSPs

7. Section 2.1
   The correct expansion of "GMPLS" is "Generalized Multiprotocol
   Label Switching". In view of you chosen expansion of "MPLS",
   you may prefer to show this as "Generalized Multi Protocol
   Label Switching".

   The correct expansion of "FEC" is "Forwarding Equivalence
   Class".

8. Section 7.2 states:
     The CE and PE nodes are inter-connected by point-to-point
     interfaces.  The signaling channel is "in-band", i.e., the
     labeled packets share the same access connection as the
     RSVP-TE signaling.
   This is an acceptable, but not required, method of deploying
   GMPLS-based signaling. It is our suspicion reading this very
   short section that it is your intention to forbid the use of
   the IF_ID RSVP_HOP Object at the CNI. Can you confirm or deny
   this?

9. Section 7.3 states:
     A client need only know its own address, a reachable address
     of the adjacent PE-node, and know the address of any other
     client to which it wishes to connect.  The addresses listed
     above must be configured on each client.

     A PE need only know (and track) the addresses on interfaces
     attached to clients, as well as the Node IDs of these
     attached clients. In addition, the IP/MPLS network needs to
     know reachability to the interface addresses and Node IDs of
     other PEs to which an attached client is permitted to
     connect.

   This appears to miss the fact that the client will address a
   CNI connection request to a remote client address. The local
   PE must, therefore, know how to route to these client
   addresses that are outside the core routing domain.

   Perhaps the final sentence should say CE not PE?

   But in 9.1.2 you have:
     When a PE receives a Path message from a client that
     contains no ERO indicating transit network selection, then
     the PE is responsible for progressing the Path message
     toward the destination.  The progression of the Path
     message is beyond the scope of this specification.

   While the details are clearly out of scope, it *is* relevant
   to the definition of the CNI how the core acquires and
   distributes the client-side addressing information that is
   necessary for routing across the core. You will observe that
   the problem you are solving (including the fact that the
   client addresses may come from an address space that overlaps
   with the core address space) is similar to the L3VPN problem.

10. What is the expected behavior from the core network when an
    E-LSP is requested at the CNI?

    Can we assume that the expectation is that an appropriate
    E-LSP will also be established across the core so that
    Diffserv behavior will be performed along the whole length
    of the client-client connection, or is this not a
    requirement?

    If core Diffserv behavior is required, how will the core
    handle the presence of multiple classes?

11. You are correct to observe that the ERO is optional in GMPLS
    implementations (sections 9.1.1 and 9.1.2), however, since
    you are specifying a profile for use at the CNI, and since
    both the CE and the PE must be CNI-aware (i.e., you cannot
    simply use legacy implementations) you may find it convenient
    to mandate support of the ERO at the CNI.

    We believe that in practice all implementations support ERO.

12. In section 9.1.1 you have:
      The client populates the ERO object with only one sub-object
      containing an Autonomous System Number (ASN) representing a
      transit network beyond the originating service provider.
      The client equipment must set the ASN sub-object 'L' bit to
      1, indicating a loose route.
    It is not completely clear what is meant by 'the originating
    service provider', but we assume that this refers to the
    network that the ingress PE belongs to. In this case, this
     ERO is malformed and will be rejected. The first sub-object
    of a received ERO must always define an abstract node that
    the receiver is a member of. See RFC 3209, section 4.3.4.1,
    point 1).

13. In section 9.4:
      PE next to a client receives a PathErr with
      Path_State_Removed from the network, it may in turn
      generate either a ResvTear or PathTear, whichever is
      applicable, to be sent to the client.
    There are no circumstances in which a PE receiving a PathErr
    with Path_State_Removed from the network would send PathTear
    to the client.

    It is unclear to us why you would specify that the CNI built
    on GMPLS might not use this standard GMPLS procedure.

14. In section 9.5.3:
      The Extended Classtype object is signaled in the Path
      message, and saved in the Path State Block (PSB) at every
      hop.
    We recommend that you simply state that the state is stored
    as every hop. The existence of a PSB is implementation-
    specific.

    Can you please clarify "at every hop". Are you expecting
    nodes in the core network to store this information. If so,
    you should note that the core nodes will not recognize the
    object class and will reject any messages carrying it.

    We also suggest that before progressing your own extensions
    for multi-class DSTE LSPs you should look at the existing
    work within the IETF:
    http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-minei-diffserv-te-multi-class-02.txt.
    If this work is not adequate for your requirements, we
    would encourage you to work with its authors to produce
    a single standardized solution within the IETF.

15. In 9.5.4:
      An LSR that recognizes the Extended Classtype object and
      that receives a Path message which contains the Extended
      Classtype object but which does not contain a Label Request
      object or which does not have a session type of
      LSP_Tunnel_IPv4, must send a PathErr message towards the
      sender with the error code 'extended-classtype Error' and
      an error value of 'Unexpected Extended Classtype object'.
      These are defined below:
    Why do you define new parsing behavior for the absence of a
    Label Request object (by the way, you should say Generalized
    Label Request object, since this is GMPLS)? The absence of
    mandatory objects is already covered in RFC2205.

16. The error code defined in 9.5.4 is conformant with RFC 3936.
    You may wish to look at draft-swallow-rsvp-user-error-spec
    in case this gives you the ability to handle more detailed
    private error codes.

Finally, we would like to refer you to
draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-01.txt and
draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk-01.txt for the latest state of
discussions in CCAMP with respect to interworking MPLS and GMPLS networks.
Attachment(s):
No document has been attached





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 17:21:31 +0000
Message-ID: <30a501c713da$697bd570$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <routing-discussion@ietf.org>
Cc: <mpls@lists.ietf.org>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Fw: I-D ACTION:draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-07.txt 
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 17:16:21 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

FYI, this I-D has been updated after IETF last call and GenArt review as 
follows...

Adrian

===
General
s/rewg/REWG/
s/pswg/PSWG/
Typos
===
Section 1, para 2
OLD
   They should not be
   extended or varied without IETF review, and that should preferably
   only be extended within the IETF process.
NEW
   These protocols should
   not be extended or varied without IETF review, and they should
   only be extended within the IETF process.
===
Section 1, para 3
ADD
   The IETF's formal
   standards process is defined in [RFC2026] and [RFC2418], and is not
   changed by this document.
===
Section 2.2
OLD
   Other working groups, e.g., the Bidirectional Forwarding Detection
   (BFD) working group, also use the (G)MPLS protocols and mechanisms.
   When any of these working groups needs to extend or change the
   (G)MPLS protocols the procedures specified in this document are
   applicable.
NEW
   Other working groups, e.g., the Bidirectional Forwarding Detection
   (BFD) working group, also use the (G)MPLS protocols and mechanisms.
   When any of these working groups needs to extend or change the
   (G)MPLS protocols the procedures specified in this document are
   applicable. Some of those working groups (again, for example, the
   BFD working group) are already chartered for requirements evaluation
   and protocol specification, and can fit into the procedures in those
   roles.
===
Section 2.3
s/formal or less formal/formal or informal/
===
Section 2.3, para 2
OLD
   If any organization outside the IETF
   has a requirement, or believes it may have a requirement, for
   extensions or modifications to the (G)MPLS protocols then the
   procedures in this document apply.
NEW
   If any organization outside the IETF
   has a requirement for extensions or modifications to the (G)MPLS
   protocols then the procedures in this document apply.
===
Section 2.4, bullet 1
OLD
      For the purpose of extending and changing any protocols specified
      in Experimental, Informational, or BCP RFCs developed by the
      (G)MPLS working groups, those protocols are considered to be part
      of the (G)MPLS protocols.
NEW
      For the purpose of extending and changing any protocols specified
      in any specification developed by the (G)MPLS working groups,
      those protocols are considered to be part of the (G)MPLS
      protocols.
===
Section 3, para 3
OLD
   Whenever any extension or change to the (G)MPLS protocols is desired,
   a requirements statement must be produced and must be submitted to
   IETF as an Internet-Draft. As described in [RFC4052], when the
   requirements come from an external organization informal
   communications such as e-mail to working group mailing lists often
   facilitates cooperative work. However, if desired, the Internet-Draft
   containing the requirement may be submitted to the working group
   using a liaison statement. That way, the IETF's response to the
   request will be given as the reply to the liaison, with no risk of
   confusing an individual participant's opinion for that of the group
   as can happen on mailing lists.
NEW
   Whenever any extension or change to the (G)MPLS protocols is desired,
   a problem statement and/or requirements statement must be produced
   and must be submitted to IETF as an Internet-Draft. As described in
   [RFC4052], when the requirements come from an external organization
   informal communications such as e-mail to working group mailing lists
   often facilitates cooperative work. However, if desired, the
   Internet-Draft containing the requirement may be submitted to the
   working group using a liaison statement. That way, the IETF's
   response to the request will be given as the reply to the liaison,
   with no risk of confusing an individual participant's opinion for
   that of the group as can happen on mailing lists.
===
Section 3, para 4, convert to bullets
===
Section 4.1, figure 1
s/ACK/YES/
s/NAK/NO/
===
Section 4.2.2, para 4
OLD
   If the requirements statement I-D is brought to the IETF through a
   formal liaison, the IETF MUST respond using one of the following
   answers in a formal liaison reply:
NEW
   If the requirements statement I-D is brought to the IETF through a
   formal liaison, the working group chairs, ADs or their delegates MUST
   respond using one of the following answers in a formal liaison reply.
   If a formal liaison was not used the response SHOULD be delivered
   using one of the following answers in an email copied to the
   appropriate mailing lists.
===
Section 4.2.3, title
s/4.2.3 Chartering the Rewg/4.2.3 Chartering or Rechartering the REWG/
===
Section 4.2.3
OLD
   If a new charter item is required, the Routing Area Directors with
   assistance from working group chairs MUST apply to the IESG and IAB
   for a modification of an existing working group's charter or for the
   creation of a new working group. If the IESG approves the charter,
   the requirements statement I-D is passed to the rewg for evaluation.
   If the charter change is not approved, the IESG MUST respond to the
   requirements statement I-D and, if the requirements were introduced
   through a formal liaison from another SDO, the IESG MUST send a
   liaison response using the options described in Section 5, although
   the IESG MAY delegate such responses.
NEW
   If a new charter item is required for an existing working group, the
   Routing Area Directors with assistance from working group chairs MUST
   apply to the IESG and IAB for a modification of an existing working
   group's charter or for the creation of a new working group. If the
   IESG approves the charter, the requirements statement I-D is passed
   to the REWG for evaluation. If the charter change is not approved,
   the IESG MUST respond to the requirements statement I-D and, if the
   requirements were introduced through a formal liaison from another
   SDO, the IESG MUST send a liaison response using the options
   described in Section 5, although the IESG MAY delegate such
   responses.

   Under unusual circumstances the Routing Area Directors MAY decide to
   charter a new working group to act as the REWG. In this case, the ADs
   are responsible for drafting the charter of the new working group and
   MUST follow the procedures set out in the previous paragraph.
===
Section 4.7, para 2
OLD
   but the pswg MUST
   consider such an I-D as a possible solution I-D.
NEW
   but the PSWG MUST
   consider such an I-D for review and revision as a possible solution
   I-D.
===
Section 5.1, bullet 1
OLD
   - Requirements not understood. At the early stage of evaluation of
     the requirements statement I-D before the rewg has been tasked with
     performing a full evaluation and completing the requirements
     statement I-D or during the optional preliminary investigation it
     is not clear what the requirements are for or what the problem
     being addressed is.
NEW
   - Requirements not understood. Either during preliminary
     investigation or during evaluation of the requirements statement
     I-D, it wasn't clear what the requirements are, or what the problem
     being addressed is.
===
Section 5.1, bullet 3
s/IETF/REWG/
===
Section 5.1, bullet 4
OLD
     In this case, the IETF MUST
     grant the authors of the requirements statement I-D permission to
     work on a solution. The solution SHALL be presented to the IETF
     for review and possible publication as an Informational or
     Experimental RFC, and the IETF SHALL NOT block applications to IANA
     for codepoints
NEW
     In this case, the IETF MUST
     NOT restrict the authors of the requirements statement I-D from
     working on a solution. The solution SHALL be presented to the IETF
     for review and possible publication as an Informational or
     Experimental RFC, and the IETF SHALL NOT block applications to IANA
     for codepoints.
===
Section 5.1, bullet 5
s/Insufficient support for the work./Insufficient support for the work from
the original requesters./
===
Section 5.2, title
s/5.2 Actions Upon Rejection/5.2 Actions Required When Rejecting
Requirements Statement I-Ds/
===
Section 5.2, para 1
s/SHOULD/MUST/
===
Section 5.2, bullet 1
OLD
   - If the requirements are brought to the IETF as a preliminary
     investigation (see Section 4.2.1) through an email exchange then
     the response SHOULD be made as an email response and SHOULD be
     archived through an IETF email archive.
NEW
   - If the requirements are brought to the IETF as a preliminary
     investigation (see Section 4.2.1) through an email exchange then
     the response MUST be made as an email response copied to an IETF
     mailing list so that it is automatically archived.
===
Section 5.2, bullet 3
s/SHOULD/MUST/
===
New section 5.3 to point to the appeals process
===
Section 6, para 2
s/stopped/abandoned/
===
New section 6.1 to point to the appeals process
===
Section 7, para 1
s/SHOULD NOT/MUST NOT/
===
Section 9
Additional thankees
===
Section 11. Group all references into one section with two sub-sections
===
Section 11.1
Add RFC2026 and RFC2418
===
Split Editors' Addresses out of Authors' Addresses
===
Change boilerplate to IETF Trust

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Internet-Drafts@ietf.org>
To: <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 3:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-07.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
>
>
> Title : Change Process for Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and 
> Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) Protocols and Procedures
> Author(s) : L. Andersson, A. Farrel
> Filename : draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-07.txt
> Pages : 23
> Date : 2006-11-29
>
> The issues surrounding the extensibility of IETF protocols have been
>   widely debated. These issues include when it is reasonable to
>   extend IETF protocols with little or no review, and when extensions
>   or variations need to be reviewed by the larger IETF community.
>   Experience with IETF protocols has shown that extensibility of
>   protocols without early IETF review can cause problems.
>
>   The Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS)
>   suites of protocols have become popular for a number of applications
>   and deployment scenarios. One result of this popularity is a large
>   number of suggestions for modifications and extensions.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-07.txt





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 11:09:36 +0000
Message-ID: <301d01c713a6$7e9dd400$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: <jau@cbis.ece.drexel.edu>, "Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>, "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>, <mpls@lists.ietf.org>
Subject: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt 
Date: Wed, 29 Nov 2006 11:06:50 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

This draft has been developed independently and has recently been brought to 
the IESG for advancement as an individual submission to become an 
Informational RFC. I have done a first-level review and this latest revision 
includes updates to reflect my comments.

Since the material here concerns preemption and the suggested ways to 
operate an MPLS-TE or GMPLS network, we are running a quick last call on the 
CCAMP mailing list to ensure that no-one has any objections.

Please send your comments to the CCAMP list no later than noon GMT on 13th 
December 2006.

Thanks,
Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Internet-Drafts@ietf.org>
To: <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 8:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
>
>
> Title : LSP Preemption Policies for MPLS Traffic Engineering
> Author(s) : J. de Oliveira, et al.
> Filename : draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
> Pages : 19
> Date : 2006-11-28
>
> When the establishment of a higher priority (Traffic Engineering
>   Label Switched Path) TE LSP requires the preemption of a set of lower
>   priority TE LSPs, a node has to make a local decision to select which
>
>   TE LSPs will be preempted.  The preempted LSPs are then rerouted by
>   their respective Head-end Label Switch Router (LSR).  This document
>   presents a flexible policy that can be used to achieve different
>   objectives: preempt the lowest priority LSPs; preempt the minimum
>   number of LSPs; preempt the set of TE LSPs that provide the closest
>   amount of bandwidth to the required bandwidth for the preempting TE
>   LSPs (to minimize bandwidth wastage); preempt the LSPs that will have
>   the maximum chance to get rerouted.  Simulation results are given and
>   a comparison among several different policies, with respect to
>   preemption cascading, number of preempted LSPs, priority, wasted
>   bandwidth and blocking probability is also included.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 14:00:40 +0000
Message-ID: <03fd01c70f07$5b826b50$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Re: Liaison to CCAMP from IEEE 802.1
Date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 13:56:39 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

IEEE 802.1 have sent us a reply regarding the use of VLAN tag translation.

See this at the link below or on the CCAMP liaison page - see 
http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

Discussions on the GELS list, please.

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tony Jeffree" <tony@jeffree.co.uk>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Cc: <mick_seaman@ieee.org>; "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" <dromasca@avaya.com>; 
"Bernard Aboba" <bernard_aboba@hotmail.com>; "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" 
<bwijnen@lucent.com>; "Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>; "Bill Fenner" 
<fenner@research.att.com>; "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>; 
<ccamp@ops.ietf.org>; <statements@ietf.org>
Sent: Thursday, November 23, 2006 1:30 PM
Subject: Re: Liaison to IEEE 802.1 from IETF CCAMP


> At 17:47 10/11/2006, Adrian Farrel wrote:
>>To: IEEE 802.1
>>From: IETF CCAMP Working Group
>>Cc: Dan Romascanu, Bernard Aboba, Bert Wijnen
>>     Ross Callon, Bill Fenner, Deborah Brungard
>>Subject: Control plane operation of Ethernet Bridging
>>Status: For Information
>>
>>Dear Tony and Mick,
>>
>>We would like to clarify the previous Liaison from CCAMP with respect to 
>>Ethernet bridging behavior.
>>
>>We have received requests to evaluate the use of GMPLS protocols for the 
>>control of bridging in Ethernet networks. At this time we have not 
>>initiated any work.
>>
>>We recognise IEEE's authority to define and maintain the Ethernet data 
>>plane, and fully understand IEEE's concern for other SDOs to adhere to the 
>>IEEE's specifications. We would like to assure you that within the IETF's 
>>CCAMP working group we have the understanding that any Ethernet  work 
>>shall only be based on IEEE specified data planes.
>>
>>For your information, we have defined the following rules and process for 
>>advancing this work within CCAMP:
>>
>>Rules:
>>
>>A. Data plane (i.e. the data forwarding of established flows) 
>>specification is out of scope and must not be discussed within CCAMP.
>>
>>B. CCAMP will not work on the specification of GMPLS except for data 
>>planes that are already approved by an SDO with responsibility for the 
>>Ethernet data plane. It is expected that the primary SDO in this case is 
>>the IEEE.
>>
>>Process steps:
>>
>>1. Decide upon the data plane behavior to be controlled using GMPLS.
>>
>>2. Ensure that the data plane to be controlled is approved and documented 
>>by an SDO with responsibility for Ethernet (i.e., the IEEE).
>>This may be a null op in the case of existing standards, but might require 
>>work in the other SDO for new standards or for profiles of existing 
>>standards.
>>
>>3. Start protocol work in CCAMP with an explicit pointer to the approved 
>>data plane.
>>
>>4. When it is clear that protocol work is progressing, CCAMP will liaise 
>>with the other SDO to get their blessing for using a control plane for the 
>>nominated data plane and to confirm that that data plane is really 
>>approved.
>>
>>In addition, we expect to liaise our status during the development of any 
>>control plane extensions.
>>
>>Best regards,
>>Deborah Brungard and Adrian Farrel
>>IETF CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs
>>
>>
>
> Colleagues -
>
> Please find our response here:
>
> http://www.ieee802.org/1/files/public/docs2006/liaison-ieee-802-1-ietf-ccamp-1106.txt
>
>
> Tony Jeffree
> Chair, IEEE 802.1 Working Group
>
> IEEE 802.1 website: http://www.ieee802.org/1/
>
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 23 Nov 2006 02:48:42 +0000
To: IETF-Announce <ietf-announce@ietf.org>
From: The IESG <iesg-secretary@ietf.org>
Subject: Last Call: 'Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling  Extensions in support of Calls' to Proposed Standard  (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call) 
Reply-To: iesg@ietf.org
Cc: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Message-Id: <E1Gn4bB-00066d-B0@stiedprstage1.ietf.org>
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 21:46:01 -0500

The IESG has received a request from the Common Control and Measurement 
Plane WG to consider the following document:

- 'Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support of 
   Calls '
   <draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-01.txt> as a Proposed Standard

The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits
final comments on this action.  Please send any comments to the
iesg@ietf.org or ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2006-12-06.

The file can be obtained via
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-01.txt




Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 16:53:42 +0000
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 08:51:02 -0800
Message-Id: <200611221651.kAMGp2Ft019211@nit.isi.edu>
To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org
Subject:  RFC 4726 on A Framework for Inter-Domain Multiprotocol Label Switching Traffic Engineering
From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org
Cc: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org, ccamp@ops.ietf.org

A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries.

        
        RFC 4726

        Title:      A Framework for Inter-Domain Multiprotocol 
                    Label Switching Traffic Engineering 
        Author:     A. Farrel, J.-P. Vasseur,
                    A. Ayyangar
        Status:     Informational
        Date:       November 2006
        Mailbox:    adrian@olddog.co.uk, 
                    jpv@cisco.com,
                    arthi@nuovasystems.com
        Pages:      22
        Characters: 53076
        Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso:   None

        I-D Tag:    draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-framework-06.txt

        URL:        http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc4726.txt

This document provides a framework for establishing and controlling
Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS)
Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs) in multi-domain
networks.

For the purposes of this document, a domain is considered to be any
collection of network elements within a common sphere of address
management or path computational responsibility.  Examples of such
domains include Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP) areas and Autonomous
Systems (ASes).  This memo provides information for the Internet community.

This document is a product of the Common Control and Measurement Plane
Working Group of the IETF.


INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet community. 
It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution
of this memo is unlimited.

This announcement is sent to the IETF list and the RFC-DIST list.
Requests to be added to or deleted from the IETF distribution list
should be sent to IETF-REQUEST@IETF.ORG.  Requests to be
added to or deleted from the RFC-DIST distribution list should
be sent to RFC-DIST-REQUEST@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.

Details on obtaining RFCs via FTP or EMAIL may be obtained by sending
an EMAIL message to rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG with the message body 

help: ways_to_get_rfcs. For example:

        To: rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG
        Subject: getting rfcs

        help: ways_to_get_rfcs

Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the
author of the RFC in question, or to RFC-Manager@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.  Unless
specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for
unlimited distribution.

Submissions for Requests for Comments should be sent to
RFC-EDITOR@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.  Please consult RFC 2223, Instructions to RFC
Authors, for further information.


Joyce K. Reynolds and Sandy Ginoza
USC/Information Sciences Institute

...





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 07:28:17 +0000
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Subject: RE: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt 
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 08:25:27 +0100
Message-ID: <D109C8C97C15294495117745780657AE0669F82B@ftrdmel1.rd.francetelecom.fr>
Thread-Topic: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt 
Thread-Index: AccNrxwsPR4Le0NXTCevXXvOwrBwWwAV+JBA
From: "LE ROUX Jean-Louis RD-CORE-LAN" <jeanlouis.leroux@orange-ftgroup.com>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>

Hi all,

This new version accounts for comments received during the CCAMP ISIS =
and OSPF WG last call.

Here are the main changes:

-The data plane and control plane cap sub-TLVs have been removed. The =
capabilities are now carried directly with the TE Node Capability =
Descriptor TLV, and there is a single registry for both control and data =
plane capabilities.=20

-In section 5:=20
"other occurences MUST be discarded" replaced by "other occurrences MUST =
be ignored"=20

-In section 6:
"a router not supporting the TE Node Capability Descriptor TLV MUST just =
silently ignore the TLV"
Replaced by: "a router not supporting the TE Node Capability Descriptor =
TLV will just silently ignore the TLV"

Regards,

JL =20

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De : owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org=20
> [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] De la part de=20
> Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
> Envoy=E9 : mardi 21 novembre 2006 21:50
> =C0 : i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc : ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> Objet : I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line=20
> Internet-Drafts directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Common Control and=20
> Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.
>=20
> 	Title		: IGP Routing Protocol Extensions for=20
> Discovery of Traffic Engineering  Node Capabilities
> 	Author(s)	: J. Vasseur, et al.
> 	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt
> 	Pages		: 13
> 	Date		: 2006-11-21
> =09
> It is highly desired in several cases, to take into account Traffic=20
>    Engineering (TE) node capabilities during Multi Protocol Label=20
>    Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) Traffic Engineered=20
>    Label Switched Path (TE-LSP)  selection, such as for instance the=20
>    capability to act as a branch Label Switching Router (LSR) of a=20
>    Point-To-MultiPoint (P2MP) LSP. This requires advertising these=20
>    capabilities within the Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP). For that=20
>    purpose, this document specifies Open Shortest Path First=20
> (OSPF) and=20
>    Intermediate System-Intermediate System (IS-IS) traffic=20
> engineering=20
>    extensions for the advertisement of control plane and data plane=20
>    traffic engineering node capabilities.
>=20
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-c
ap-03.txt
>=20
> To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a=20
> message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word=20
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>=20
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>=20
> A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in=20
> http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or=20
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>=20
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> =09
> NOTE:	The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in
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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 00:10:53 +0000
Message-ID: <4563950E.1020406@kddilabs.jp>
Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2006 09:08:46 +0900
From: Tomohiro Otani <otani@kddilabs.jp>
User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.8 (Windows/20061025)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Cc: "tom.petch" <cfinss@dial.pipex.com>, ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Tom and Adrian,

Thank you for your comments on our draft.
We understand that we need a lot of work for the -01 draft
and definitely reflect your comments.

With best regards,

Tomo





Adrian Farrel wrote:
> Hi Tom,
> 
> Yes, the I-D is indeed at an early stage with a lot of work remaining to 
> be done.
> 
> I'm sure that Tomo will be grateful for all of your pointers.
> 
> Adrian
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "tom.petch" <cfinss@dial.pipex.com>
> To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>; <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
> Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 1:13 PM
> Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
> 
> 
>> I had a look at this I-D (the word MIB caught my eye:-) and it would 
>> seem to
>> have some way to go, at least from an editorial point of view. eg
>> - the introduction isn't quite English as I know it to the point where 
>> I am
>> unsure if I know what is being said about the role of this MIB module 
>> vis-a-vis
>> others
>> - no MIB boiler plate
>> - IANA considerations do not mention being under the transmission 
>> branch (is
>> that the right place for this?)
>> - use of transmission 9988 as a placeholder
>> - module name 'TED-DRAFT01-MIB '!
>> - no normative references
>> ...........
>>
>> all of which and more is covered in RFC4181.  I would suggest a check 
>> by the
>> authors against that RFC before taking this further.  I also get some 
>> strange
>> characters such as little black blobs at the turn of every page.
>>
>> I am also unclear where the I-D uses 'OSPF' whether it now means only 
>> OSPF or
>> whether it means all such protocols and has not been updated to 
>> reflect the
>> change of title ie I suggest looking carefully at all uses of 'OSPF' 
>> by itself
>> and only using that when OSPF alone is meant.
>>
>> And when I understand the English better, I expect I will disagree on a
>> technical basis as well - eg  [OSPFMIB UPDATE] (a rather clumsy 
>> reference IMO)
>> does not update [OSPFMIB], it supersedes it so I suspect that there 
>> should be a
>> normative reference to the former and no mention of the latter; in 
>> which case
>> the reference could be to RFCyyyy.
>>
>> Tom Petch
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
>> To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
>> Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
>> Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 11:31 PM
>> Subject: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
>>
>>
>>> Tomo,
>>>
>>> As discussed in San Diego, could you please resubmit
>>> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ospf-mib-01.txt as
>>> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt
>>>
>>> This trivial piece of house keeping will keep us honest going forward.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Adrian
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> 
> 
> 




Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 23:26:39 +0000
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Subject: RE: Draft response to MFA
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:25:21 -0600
Message-ID: <9473683187ADC049A855ED2DA739ABCA0DDC7F9B@KCCLUST06EVS1.ugd.att.com>
Thread-Topic: Draft response to MFA
Thread-Index: AccNg7h7RkNBzJXHSOWcZxj7hMEcCAAPa/Cg
From: "Ash, Gerald R \(Jerry\), ALABS" <gash@att.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Ash, Gerald R \(Jerry\), ALABS" <gash@att.com>

Adrian,
Deborah,

Very comprehensive response!

Here are some additional suggested comments:

1. Regarding the proposed extensions for multi-class DSTE LSPs, rather
than a proprietary extension perhaps the MFA can be encouraged to
support IETF draft.
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-minei-diffserv-te-multi-class-
02.txt.  It seems best that standard protocol extensions be worked out
in the IETF.
2. Appendix A RE available OAM mechanisms seems a bit superfluous and
perhaps could be deleted.
3. FEC =3D forwarding equivalence class

Thanks,
Jerry

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
Behalf Of Adrian Farrel
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 6:55 AM
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Draft response to MFA

Thanks to those of you who have sent comments on and off the list.

Deborah and I have put together this draft response to the MFA. You can
see=20
the original liaison at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.

Please send you thoughts on this by 28th November so that we can send
the=20
response.

Thanks,
Adrian

---------

Dear Rao,

Thank you very much for giving the CCAMP working group the opportunity
to=20
comment on the MFA's MPLS CNI specification.

At this stage we have the following high-level comments that we request
the=20
MFA to consider and answer. Some of these comments are for clarification
as=20
we try to ramp-up on the requirements you are addressing. Others concern

technical issues that we feel you should address before advancing this
work.

Best regards,
Adrian Farrel and Deborah Brungard
CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs

=3D=3D=3D

We note that you have opted to define a new RSVP object to support a=20
multi-class LSP following the rules for vendor private assignment as=20
described in section 2.2 of RFC3936. We believe that you may have=20
misinterpreted the purpose of vendor private extensions since such=20
extensions are specifically not intended to interoperate, but you are=20
attempting to define a specification directly for the purpose of=20
interworking devices from different vendors. In your case it would seem
to=20
make more sense to define a standardized extension to the protocol.

Should you decide that a standardized extension is better able to
deliver=20
the functionality that you require, we should like to draw your
attention to=20
draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-06.txt that defines how other SDOs may=20
influence the development of MPLS and GMPLS protocols within the IETF,
and=20
which is currently in IETF last call. The (G)MPLS suites of protocols
have=20
become popular among multiple SDOs resulting in a need for IETF to
clarify=20
it's role as the responsible SDO for (G)MPLS protocol extensions so as
to=20
prevent unnecessary replication of functionality and the resulting=20
interoperability problems.

1. The document is marked as Straw Ballot Text. Can you tell us
   what that means the status of the work is?

2. We think that your use of terminology may be a little loose.

   In many cases, where you say "MPLS" you are probably referring
   to the data plane, and specifically a packet-switching data
   plane with an MPLS encapsulation.

   But in other cases, "MPLS" and "MPLS-TE" are synonymous and
   refer to a signaling/routing control plane using the MPLS-TE
   extensions to RSVP and to the two IGPs OSPF and IS-IS.

   In many cases you say "GMPLS-TE" which is not something we
   specifically recognise although we can assume that you mean
   simply "GMPLS". Sometimes, where you are trying to
   distinguish a TE LSP established using MPLS-TE from one set
   up using GMPLS you may intend to say "GMPLS TE-LSP" rather
   than "GMPLS-TE LSP".

   We feel that close attention to the terminology may help
   clarify the document.

3. Section 1.1 states:
     The purpose of this specification is to define an MPLS-based
     Client to Network Interconnect (CNI) for establishing GMPLS
     Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs).
   Can we assume that this means that the client-to-client LSPs
   are established using GMPLS protocols, but that the signaling
   within the core network is out of scope? Especially since
   section 1.2 states:
     At the CNI, it is not desirable to have the client equipment
     participate in the internal control protocols of the MPLS
     network.

4. Can you clarify why you have selected GMPLS protocols and not
   MPLS-TE protocols on which to build your CNI. We are not
   opposed to this, but are seeking to understand the choice.
   Perhaps the main reason is the requirement for bidirectional
   LSPs.

5. Can you clarify whether the core network is assumed to be
   PSC only? That is, for example, if the CNI encoding is POS,
   would it be acceptable for the PE and the rest of the core
   network to switch the LSP as TDM until the remote PE or even
   CE, or do you require that the PE must perform packet
   switching? If the PE must perform packet switching, is it
   still acceptable for the core LSP (PE-PE) to be switched at
   some other technology?

6. Section 1.3 states:
     Where the network uses MPLS-TE signaling, the PE routers are
     expected to perform the translation.
   It is our opinion that this translation is non-trivial and may
   be impossible for some of the GMPLS services that are
   available at the CNI. For example, supporting a bidirectional
   service over an MPLS-TE signaling network requires additional
   coordination between the end-points that is currently not
   available in the MPLS-TE extensions to RSVP-TE.
   From the following text in section 7.1, we assume that the PE
   may refuse a CNI request if it is unable to provide the
   required level of function.
      The transport network in the provider network is a GMPLS or
      MPLS-TE based packet switched network that must support
      request for uni-directional LSPs and may support requests
      for bi-directional LSPs

7. Section 2.1
   The correct expansion of "GMPLS" is "Generalized Multiprotocol
   Label Switching". In view of you chosen expansion of "MPLS",
   you may prefer to show this as "Generalize Multi Protocol
   Label Switching".

8. Section 7.2 states:
     The CE and PE nodes are inter-connected by point-to-point
     interfaces.  The signaling channel is "in-band", i.e., the
     labeled packets share the same access connection as the
     RSVP-TE signaling.
   This is an acceptable, but not required, method of deploying
   GMPLS-based signaling. It is our suspicion reading this very
   short section that it is your intention to forbid the use of
   the IF_ID RSVP_HOP Object at the CNI. Can you confirm or deny
   this?

9. Section 7.3 states:
     A client need only know its own address, a reachable address
     of the adjacent PE-node, and know the address of any other
     client to which it wishes to connect.  The addresses listed
     above must be configured on each client.

     A PE need only know (and track) the addresses on interfaces
     attached to clients, as well as the Node IDs of these
     attached clients. In addition, the IP/MPLS network needs to
     know reachability to the interface addresses and Node IDs of
     other PEs to which an attached client is permitted to
     connect.

   This appears to miss the fact that the client will address a
   CNI connection request to a remote client address. The local
   PE must, therefore, know how to route to these client
   addresses that are outside the core routing domain.

   Perhaps the final sentence should say CE not PE?

   But in 9.1.2 you have:
     When a PE receives a Path message from a client that
     contains no ERO indicating transit network selection, then
     the PE is responsible for progressing the Path message
     toward the destination.  The progression of the Path
     message is beyond the scope of this specification.

   While the details are clearly out of scope, it *is* relevant
   to the definition of the CNI how the core acquires and
   distributes the client-side addressing information that is
   necessary for routing across the core. You will observe that
   the problem you are solving (including the fact that the
   client addresses may come from an address space that overlaps
   with the core address space) is similar to the L3VPN problem.

10. What is the expected behavior from the core network when an
    E-LSP is requested at the CNI?

    Can we assume that the expectation is that an appropriate
    E-LSP will also be established across the core so that
    Diffserv behavior will be performed along the whole length
    of the client-client connection, or is this not a
    requirement?

    If core Diffserv behavior is required, how will the core
    handle the presence of multiple classes?

11. You are correct to observe that the ERO is optional in GMPLS
    implementations (sections 9.1.1 and 9.1.2), however, since
    you are specifying a profile for use at the CNI, and since
    both the CE and the PE must be CNI-aware (i.e., you cannot
    simply use legacy implementations) you may find it convenient
    to mandate support of the ERO at the CNI.

    We believe that in practice all implementations support ERO.

12. In section 9.1.1 you have:
      The client populates the ERO object with only one sub-object
      containing an Autonomous System Number (ASN) representing a
      transit network beyond the originating service provider.
      The client equipment must set the ASN sub-object 'L' bit to
      1, indicating a loose route.
    It is not completely clear what is meant by 'the originating
    service provider', but we assume that this refers to the
    network that the ingress PE belongs to. In this case, this
     ERO is malformed and will be rejected. The first sub-object
    of a received ERO must always define an abstract node that
    the receiver is a member of. See RFC 3209, section 4.3.4.1,
    point 1).

13. In section 9.4:
      PE next to a client receives a PathErr with
      Path_State_Removed from the network, it may in turn
      generate either a ResvTear or PathTear, whichever is
      applicable, to be sent to the client.
    There are no circumstances in which a PE receiving a PathErr
    with Path_State_Removed from the network would send PathTear
    to the client.

    It is unclear to us why you would specify that the CNI built
    on GMPLS might not use this standard GMPLS procedure.

14. In section 9.5.3:
      The Extended Classtype object is signaled in the Path
      message, and saved in the Path State Block (PSB) at every
      hop.
    We recommend that you simply state that the state is stored
    as every hop. The existence of a PSB is implementation-
    specific.

    Can you please clarify "at every hop". Are you expecting
    nodes in the core network to store this information. If so,
    you should note that the core nodes will not recognize the
    object class and will reject any messages carrying it.

15. In 9.5.4:
      An LSR that recognizes the Extended Classtype object and
      that receives a Path message which contains the Extended
      Classtype object but which does not contain a Label Request
      object or which does not have a session type of
      LSP_Tunnel_IPv4, must send a PathErr message towards the
      sender with the error code 'extended-classtype Error' and
      an error value of 'Unexpected Extended Classtype object'.
      These are defined below:
    Why do you define new parsing behavior for the absence of a
    Label Request object (by the way, you should say Generalized
    Label Request object, since this is GMPLS)? The absence of
    mandatory objects is already covered in RFC2205.

16. The error code defined in 9.5.4 is conformant with RFC 3936.
    You may wish to look at draft-swallow-rsvp-user-error-spec
    in case this gives you the ability to handle more detailed
    private error codes.

Finally, we would like to refer you to=20
draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-01.txt and=20
draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk-01.txt for the latest state
of=20
discussions in CCAMP with respect to interworking MPLS and GMPLS
networks.






Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 22:49:26 +0000
Message-ID: <025d01c70dbf$0a96fb50$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Re: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on T-MPLS Labels
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 22:44:45 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Major oops.

For "not" read "now"

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 10:57 AM
Subject: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on T-MPLS Labels


> Hi,
>
> We have been copied on a liaison clarifying the intended label usage in 
> T-MPLS as documented in Recommendation G.8112 Table 6-1.
>
> You may be relieved to know that the proposed label usage is not 
> conformant with MPLS and with IANA allocation rules.
>
> You can find links to this and all other liaisons at 
> http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm
>
> No action is required from CCAMP.
>
> Adrian
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 





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Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt 
Message-Id: <E1GmcZ7-0006To-Be@stiedprstage1.ietf.org>
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 15:50:01 -0500

--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: IGP Routing Protocol Extensions for Discovery of Traffic Engineering  Node Capabilities
	Author(s)	: J. Vasseur, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt
	Pages		: 13
	Date		: 2006-11-21
	
It is highly desired in several cases, to take into account Traffic 
   Engineering (TE) node capabilities during Multi Protocol Label 
   Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) Traffic Engineered 
   Label Switched Path (TE-LSP)  selection, such as for instance the 
   capability to act as a branch Label Switching Router (LSR) of a 
   Point-To-MultiPoint (P2MP) LSP. This requires advertising these 
   capabilities within the Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP). For that 
   purpose, this document specifies Open Shortest Path First (OSPF) and 
   Intermediate System-Intermediate System (IS-IS) traffic engineering 
   extensions for the advertisement of control plane and data plane 
   traffic engineering node capabilities.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-te-node-cap-03.txt

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 20:05:53 +0000
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Cc: swallow@cisco.com
Subject: Re: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on T-MPLS Labels 
From: George Swallow <swallow@cisco.com>
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 15:04:00 -0500
Message-Id: <20061121200400.656D9347BDB@swallow-mini-mac.cisco.com>
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Adrian -

I believe you meant...

> You may be relieved to know that the proposed label usage is not
                                                                
is *now* conformant

> conformant with MPLS and with IANA allocation rules.

...George

========================================================================
George Swallow             Cisco Systems                  (978) 936-1398
                           1414 Massachusetts Avenue
                           Boxborough, MA 01719



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:51:21 +0000
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <OF0E7729FC.3DD7FE64-ONC125722D.005DFEA0-C125722D.0061F7B8@netfr.alcatel.fr>
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel.be
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 18:50:03 +0100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

adrian - sure an answer will be provided - 

-d.




"Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
21/11/2006 11:56
Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
 
        To:     <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
        cc: 
        Subject:        Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON 
work


Hi,

We have received a detailed response to our liaison on current 
ASON-related 
work within CCAMP.

The full liaison can be seen at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

The bulk of the liaison is comments on 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ason-routing-ospf-02.txt and a discussion on the 
use 
of Calls and Connections in G.8080.

We are called on to respond by 12th February 2007.

Adrian 








Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:00:12 +0000
Message-ID: <020701c70d8e$62f810d0$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt 
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:59:11 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

FYI this revision is an update after GenArt review and some comments from 
the AD.

The changes are as follows:

Adrian
===
Section 1.
ADD
   For example, route exclusion could be used in the case where two
   non-overlapping Label Switched Paths (LSPs) are required. In this
   case, one option might be to set up one path and collect its route
   using route recording, and then to exclude the routers on that first
   path from the setup for the second path. Another option might be to
   set up two parallel backbones, dual home the provider edge (PE)
   routers to both backbones, and then exclude the local router on
   backbone A the first time that you set up an LSP (to a particular
   distant PE), and exclude the local router on backbone B the second
   time that you set up an LSP.
NOTE
   Idea for text from Ross answering Eric's questions about usage.
===
Section 1.1
OLD
   This document does not preclude a route exclusion from listing
   arbitrary nodes or network elements to avoid. The intent is,
   however, to indicate only the minimal number of subobjects to be
   avoided. For instance it may be necessary to signal only the  SRLGs
   (or Shared Risk Groups) to avoid.
NEW
   This document does not preclude a route exclusion from listing
   arbitrary nodes or network elements to avoid. The intent is,
   however, to indicate only the minimal number of subobjects to be
   explicitly avoided. For instance it may be necessary to signal only
   the  SRLGs (or Shared Risk Groups) to avoid. That is, the route
   exclusion is not intended to define the actual route by listing all
   of the choices to exclude at each hop, but rather to constrain the
   normal route selection process where loose hops or abstract nodes
   are to be expanded by listing certain elements to be avoided.
NOTE
   This additional text to answer Eric's questions about usage.
===
Section 1
OLD
   This document introduces an ERO subobject to indicate an SRLG to be
   signaled in either of the two exclusion methods described above and
   this document does not assume or preclude any other usage for this
   subobject. This subobject might also be appropriate for use within
   Explicit Routes or Record Routes, but this is outside the scope of
   this document.
NEW
   This document introduces a subobject to indicate an SRLG to be
   signaled in either of the two exclusion methods described above. This
   document does not assume or preclude any other usage for this
   subobject. This subobject might also be appropriate for use within an
   Explicit Route object (ERO) or Record Route object (RRO), but this is
   outside the scope of this document.
NOTE
   The issue raised was that the subobject could not both be an ERO
   subobject and not be defined for use in an ERO.
===
Section 2
OLD
   The identifier of a SRLG is defined as a 32 bit quantity in
   [RFC4202]. An SRLG ERO subobject is introduced such that it can be
   used in the exclusion methods as described in the following sections.
   This document does not assume or preclude any other usage for this
   subobject. This subobject might also be appropriate for use within
   Explicit Routes or Record Routes, but this is outside the scope of
   this document.
NEW
   The identifier of a SRLG is defined as a 32 bit quantity in
   [RFC4202]. An SRLG subobject is introduced such that it can be used
   in the exclusion methods as described in the following sections.
   This document does not assume or preclude any other usage for this
   subobject. This subobject might also be appropriate for use within
   Explicit Route object (ERO) or Record Route object (RRO), but this is
   outside the scope of this document.
NOTE
   As before.
===
Section 2.1
OLD
2.1  SRLG ERO Subobject

   The format of the ERO and its subobjects are defined in [RFC3209].
   The new SRLG ERO subobject is defined by this document as follows.
NEW
2.1  SRLG Subobject

   The new SRLG subobject is defined by this document as follows. Its
   format is modeled on the ERO subobjects defined in [RFC3209].
NOTE
   As before.
===
Section 3.1
OLD
     The contents of an EXCLUDE_ROUTE object are a series of variable-
     length data items called subobjects. This specification adapts ERO
     subojbects as defined in [RFC3209], [RFC3473], and [RFC3477] for
     use in route exclusions. The SRLG ERO subobject as defined in
     Section 2 of this document and its processing within ERO have not
     been defined before. The SRLG ERO subobject is defined here for use
     with route exclusions.
NEW
     The contents of an EXCLUDE_ROUTE object are a series of variable-
     length data items called subobjects. This specification adapts ERO
     subojbects as defined in [RFC3209], [RFC3473], and [RFC3477] for
     use in route exclusions. The SRLG subobject as defined in Section 2
     of this document has not been defined before. The SRLG subobject is
     defined here for use with route exclusions.
NOTE
   As before.
===
Section 3.1.5
OLD
   The Attribute octet is not present. The rest of the fields are as
   defined in the "SRLG ERO Subobject" section of this document.
NEW
   The Attribute octet is not present. The rest of the fields are as
   defined in the "SRLG Subobject" section of this document.
NOTE
   As before.
===
Section 8
Major rewrite of the IANA section since it had been misunderstood
===
Section 3.2
ADD
   A node receiving a Path message carrying an XRO MAY reject the
   message if the XRO is too large or complicated for the local
   implementation or as governed by local policy. In this case, the
   node MUST send a PathErr message with the error code "Routing Error"
   and error value "XRO Too Complex". An ingress LSR receiving this
   error code/value combination MAY reduce the complexity of the XRO or
   route around the node that rejected the XRO.
NOTE
   This addresses Eric's request to be able to "opt out".
===
Section 4.2
ADD
   A node MAY reject a Path message if the EXRS is too large or
   complicated for the local implementation or as governed by local
   policy. In this case, the node MUST send a PathErr message with the
   error code "Routing Error" and error value "EXRS Too Complex". An
   ingress LSR receiving this error code/value combination MAY reduce
   the complexity of the EXRS or route around the node that rejected
   the EXRS.
NOTE
   This addresses Eric's request to be able to "opt out".
===
Section 3.2
OLD
   3. The subobjects in the ERO and XRO MUST NOT contradict each other.
      If a Path message is received that contains contradicting ERO and
      XRO subobjects, then:
NEW
   3. The subobjects in the ERO and XRO SHOULD NOT contradict each
      other. If a Path message is received that contains contradicting
      ERO and XRO subobjects, then:
===
Section 3.1
OLD
   The concept of loose or strict hops has no meaning in route
   exclusion. The L bit, defined for ERO subobjects in [RFC3209], is
   reused here to indicate that an abstract node MUST be avoided (value
   0) or SHOULD be avoided (value 1).
NEW
   The concept of loose or strict hops has no meaning in route
   exclusion. The L bit, defined for ERO subobjects in [RFC3209], is
   reused here to indicate that an abstract node MUST be excluded (value
   0) or SHOULD be avoided (value 1). The distinction is that the path
   of an LSP must not traverse an abstract node listed in the XRO with
   the L bit clear, but may traverse one with the L bit set. A node
   responsible for routing an LSP (for example, for expanding a loose
   hop) should attempt to minimize the number of abstract nodes listed
   in the XRO with the L bit set that are traversed by the LSP according
   to local policy. A node generating XRO subobjects with the L bit set
   must be prepared to accept an LSP that traverses one, some, or all of
   the corresponding abstract nodes.
NOTE
   Address Eric's request for more detail on MUST/SHOULD avoid.
===
Section 6
OLD
   2. The EXRS MAY be supported. If supported, the same restrictions
      as for the XRO apply.
NEW
   2. The EXRS MAY be supported. If supported, the same restrictions
      as for the XRO apply. If not supported, an EXRS encountered
      during normal ERO processing MUST be rejected as an unknown
      ERO subobject as described in Section 4.2. Note that a node
      SHOULD NOT parse ahead into an ERO, and if it does, MUST NOT
      reject the ERO if it discovers an EXRS that applies to another
      node.
NOTE
   Eric requested clarification on how a non-supporting node behaves.
===
Section 7
OLD
   The new exclude route object poses no security exposures over and
   above [RFC3209] and [RFC3473]. Note that any security concerns that
   exist with Explicit Routes should be considered with regard to route
   exclusions.
NEW
   Security considerations for MPLS-TE and GMPLS signaling are covered
   in [RFC3209] and [RFC3473]. This document does not introduce any new
   messages or any substantive new processing, and so those security
   considerations continue to apply.

   Note that any security concerns that exist with explicit routes
   should be considered with regard to route exclusions. For example,
   some administrative boundaries may consider explicit routes to be
   security violations and may strip EROs from the Path messages that
   they process. In this case, the XRO should also be considered for
   removal from the Path message.

   It is possible that an arbitrarily complex XRO or EXRS sequence could
   be introduced as a form of denial of service attack since its
   presence will  potentially cause additional processing at each node
   on the path of the LSP. It should be noted that such an attack
   assumes that an otherwise trusted LSR (i.e., one that has been
   authenticated by its neighbors) is misbehaving. A node that receives
   an XRO or EXRS sequence that it considers too complex according to
   its local policy may respond with a PathErr message carrying the
   error code "Routing Error" and error value "XRO Too Complex" or "EXRS
   Too Complex".
===


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Internet-Drafts@ietf.org>
To: <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
Cc: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 3:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane 
> Working Group of the IETF.
>
> Title : Exclude Routes - Extension to RSVP-TE
> Author(s) : A. Farrel, et al.
> Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt
> Pages : 26
> Date : 2006-11-21
>
> The RSVP-TE specification, "RSVP-TE: Extensions to RSVP for LSP
>   Tunnels" (RFC 3209) and GMPLS extensions to RSVP-TE, "Generalized
>   Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Signaling Resource ReserVation
>   Protocol-Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE) Extensions" (RFC 3473) allow
>   abstract nodes and resources to be explicitly included in a path
>   setup, but not to be explicitly excluded.
>
>   In some networks where precise explicit paths are not computed at the
>   head end it may be useful to specify and signal abstract nodes and
>   resources that are to be explicitly excluded from routes. These
>   exclusions may apply to the whole path, or to parts of a path between
>   two abstract nodes specified in an explicit path. How Shared Risk
>   Link Groups (SLRGs) can be excluded is also specified in this
>   document.
>
>   This document specifies ways to communicate route exclusions during
>   path setup using RSVP-TE.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt
>
> To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to
> i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of
> the message.
> You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce
> to change your subscription settings.
>
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the
> username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After
> logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then
> "get draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt".
>
> A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in
> http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html
> or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt
>
> Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail.
>
> Send a message to:
> mailserv@ietf.org.
> In the body type:
> "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt".
>
> NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in
> MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility.  To use this
> feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE"
> command.  To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or
> a MIME-compliant mail reader.  Different MIME-compliant mail readers
> exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with
> "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split
> up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on
> how to manipulate these messages.
>
> Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader
> implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the
> Internet-Draft.
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 17:00:00 +0000
Message-ID: <020401c70d8e$3ebb2e00$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: "tom.petch" <cfinss@dial.pipex.com>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:56:51 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Tom,

Yes, the I-D is indeed at an early stage with a lot of work remaining to be 
done.

I'm sure that Tomo will be grateful for all of your pointers.

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "tom.petch" <cfinss@dial.pipex.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>; <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 1:13 PM
Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB


>I had a look at this I-D (the word MIB caught my eye:-) and it would seem 
>to
> have some way to go, at least from an editorial point of view. eg
> - the introduction isn't quite English as I know it to the point where I 
> am
> unsure if I know what is being said about the role of this MIB module 
> vis-a-vis
> others
> - no MIB boiler plate
> - IANA considerations do not mention being under the transmission branch 
> (is
> that the right place for this?)
> - use of transmission 9988 as a placeholder
> - module name 'TED-DRAFT01-MIB '!
> - no normative references
> ...........
>
> all of which and more is covered in RFC4181.  I would suggest a check by 
> the
> authors against that RFC before taking this further.  I also get some 
> strange
> characters such as little black blobs at the turn of every page.
>
> I am also unclear where the I-D uses 'OSPF' whether it now means only OSPF 
> or
> whether it means all such protocols and has not been updated to reflect 
> the
> change of title ie I suggest looking carefully at all uses of 'OSPF' by 
> itself
> and only using that when OSPF alone is meant.
>
> And when I understand the English better, I expect I will disagree on a
> technical basis as well - eg  [OSPFMIB UPDATE] (a rather clumsy reference 
> IMO)
> does not update [OSPFMIB], it supersedes it so I suspect that there should 
> be a
> normative reference to the former and no mention of the latter; in which 
> case
> the reference could be to RFCyyyy.
>
> Tom Petch
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
> To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
> Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
> Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 11:31 PM
> Subject: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
>
>
>> Tomo,
>>
>> As discussed in San Diego, could you please resubmit
>> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ospf-mib-01.txt as
>> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt
>>
>> This trivial piece of house keeping will keep us honest going forward.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Adrian
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:22:58 +0000
Message-ID: <00c601c70d5b$dd3791a0$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on Optical Networking Work Plan
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:57:16 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

We have received a liaison from the ITU-T Study Group 15 entitled "SG15 OTNT 
Standardization Work Plan". This liaison documents the next work items that 
Study Group 15 plans to tackle with respect to the "Optical Transport 
Networks and Technologies"

We are invited to send any comments back by 30th April 2007.

The text of the liaison can be seen below.

You can find links to this, the embedded documents, and all other liaisons 
at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

Adrian

===

Attached is the updated version of "Optical Transport Networks & 
Technologies Standardization Work Plan" resulted from this SG15 meeting 
(Geneva, 30 Oct. - 10 Nov. 2006).  We appreciate your review and comments.





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:19:00 +0000
Message-ID: <00c401c70d5b$c606fc00$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:56:41 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

We have received a detailed response to our liaison on current ASON-related 
work within CCAMP.

The full liaison can be seen at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

The bulk of the liaison is comments on 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ason-routing-ospf-02.txt and a discussion on the use 
of Calls and Connections in G.8080.

We are called on to respond by 12th February 2007.

Adrian 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:18:49 +0000
Message-ID: <00c801c70d5b$ece90e30$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on ASON Recommendations
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:57:56 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

We have received a new liaison from ITU-T Study Group 15 on recently 
consented ASON Recommendations.

The text is below. No action is required.

You can find links to this, the embedded documents, and all other liaisons 
at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

Adrian

===

ITU-T SG15 Question 14 (Q14/15) is pleased to inform you of the consent of 
two ASON documents at the SG15 meeting 30 October - 10 November 2006.

Attached for your information are the consented documents:

-        New Draft Recommendation G.7715.2/Y.1706.2 "ASON routing 
architecture and requirements for remote route query"

-        New Draft Amendment 1 to Recommendation G.7715/Y.1706 "Architecture 
and requirements for routing in the automatically switched optical networks"





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:07:05 +0000
Message-ID: <045401c70d7e$b16560c0$0601a8c0@pc6>
Reply-To: "tom.petch" <cfinss@dial.pipex.com>
From: "tom.petch" <cfinss@dial.pipex.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
Subject: Re: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 14:13:29 +0100
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I had a look at this I-D (the word MIB caught my eye:-) and it would seem to
have some way to go, at least from an editorial point of view. eg
 - the introduction isn't quite English as I know it to the point where I am
unsure if I know what is being said about the role of this MIB module vis-a-vis
others
 - no MIB boiler plate
 - IANA considerations do not mention being under the transmission branch (is
that the right place for this?)
 - use of transmission 9988 as a placeholder
 - module name 'TED-DRAFT01-MIB '!
 - no normative references
...........

all of which and more is covered in RFC4181.  I would suggest a check by the
authors against that RFC before taking this further.  I also get some strange
characters such as little black blobs at the turn of every page.

I am also unclear where the I-D uses 'OSPF' whether it now means only OSPF or
whether it means all such protocols and has not been updated to reflect the
change of title ie I suggest looking carefully at all uses of 'OSPF' by itself
and only using that when OSPF alone is meant.

And when I understand the English better, I expect I will disagree on a
technical basis as well - eg  [OSPFMIB UPDATE] (a rather clumsy reference IMO)
does not update [OSPFMIB], it supersedes it so I suspect that there should be a
normative reference to the former and no mention of the latter; in which case
the reference could be to RFCyyyy.

Tom Petch


----- Original Message -----
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 11:31 PM
Subject: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB


> Tomo,
>
> As discussed in San Diego, could you please resubmit
> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ospf-mib-01.txt as
> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt
>
> This trivial piece of house keeping will keep us honest going forward.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>
>
>




Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 16:06:38 +0000
Message-ID: <00c701c70d5b$ddea66e0$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison from ITU-T SG15 on T-MPLS Labels
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:57:30 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Hi,

We have been copied on a liaison clarifying the intended label usage in 
T-MPLS as documented in Recommendation G.8112 Table 6-1.

You may be relieved to know that the proposed label usage is not conformant 
with MPLS and with IANA allocation rules.

You can find links to this and all other liaisons at 
http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

No action is required from CCAMP.

Adrian






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From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt 
Message-Id: <E1GmXsn-000282-LH@stiedprstage1.ietf.org>
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 10:50:01 -0500

--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Exclude Routes - Extension to RSVP-TE
	Author(s)	: A. Farrel, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-te-exclude-route-06.txt
	Pages		: 26
	Date		: 2006-11-21
	
The RSVP-TE specification, "RSVP-TE: Extensions to RSVP for LSP
   Tunnels" (RFC 3209) and GMPLS extensions to RSVP-TE, "Generalized
   Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Signaling Resource ReserVation
   Protocol-Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE) Extensions" (RFC 3473) allow
   abstract nodes and resources to be explicitly included in a path
   setup, but not to be explicitly excluded.

   In some networks where precise explicit paths are not computed at the
   head end it may be useful to specify and signal abstract nodes and
   resources that are to be explicitly excluded from routes. These
   exclusions may apply to the whole path, or to parts of a path between
   two abstract nodes specified in an explicit path. How Shared Risk
   Link Groups (SLRGs) can be excluded is also specified in this
   document.

   This document specifies ways to communicate route exclusions during
   path setup using RSVP-TE.

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 15:42:18 +0000
Message-ID: <016b01c70d73$13798680$0f849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Draft response to MFA
Date: Tue, 21 Nov 2006 11:54:35 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Thanks to those of you who have sent comments on and off the list.

Deborah and I have put together this draft response to the MFA. You can see 
the original liaison at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.

Please send you thoughts on this by 28th November so that we can send the 
response.

Thanks,
Adrian

---------

Dear Rao,

Thank you very much for giving the CCAMP working group the opportunity to 
comment on the MFA's MPLS CNI specification.

At this stage we have the following high-level comments that we request the 
MFA to consider and answer. Some of these comments are for clarification as 
we try to ramp-up on the requirements you are addressing. Others concern 
technical issues that we feel you should address before advancing this work.

Best regards,
Adrian Farrel and Deborah Brungard
CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs

===

We note that you have opted to define a new RSVP object to support a 
multi-class LSP following the rules for vendor private assignment as 
described in section 2.2 of RFC3936. We believe that you may have 
misinterpreted the purpose of vendor private extensions since such 
extensions are specifically not intended to interoperate, but you are 
attempting to define a specification directly for the purpose of 
interworking devices from different vendors. In your case it would seem to 
make more sense to define a standardized extension to the protocol.

Should you decide that a standardized extension is better able to deliver 
the functionality that you require, we should like to draw your attention to 
draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-06.txt that defines how other SDOs may 
influence the development of MPLS and GMPLS protocols within the IETF, and 
which is currently in IETF last call. The (G)MPLS suites of protocols have 
become popular among multiple SDOs resulting in a need for IETF to clarify 
it's role as the responsible SDO for (G)MPLS protocol extensions so as to 
prevent unnecessary replication of functionality and the resulting 
interoperability problems.

1. The document is marked as Straw Ballot Text. Can you tell us
   what that means the status of the work is?

2. We think that your use of terminology may be a little loose.

   In many cases, where you say "MPLS" you are probably referring
   to the data plane, and specifically a packet-switching data
   plane with an MPLS encapsulation.

   But in other cases, "MPLS" and "MPLS-TE" are synonymous and
   refer to a signaling/routing control plane using the MPLS-TE
   extensions to RSVP and to the two IGPs OSPF and IS-IS.

   In many cases you say "GMPLS-TE" which is not something we
   specifically recognise although we can assume that you mean
   simply "GMPLS". Sometimes, where you are trying to
   distinguish a TE LSP established using MPLS-TE from one set
   up using GMPLS you may intend to say "GMPLS TE-LSP" rather
   than "GMPLS-TE LSP".

   We feel that close attention to the terminology may help
   clarify the document.

3. Section 1.1 states:
     The purpose of this specification is to define an MPLS-based
     Client to Network Interconnect (CNI) for establishing GMPLS
     Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs).
   Can we assume that this means that the client-to-client LSPs
   are established using GMPLS protocols, but that the signaling
   within the core network is out of scope? Especially since
   section 1.2 states:
     At the CNI, it is not desirable to have the client equipment
     participate in the internal control protocols of the MPLS
     network.

4. Can you clarify why you have selected GMPLS protocols and not
   MPLS-TE protocols on which to build your CNI. We are not
   opposed to this, but are seeking to understand the choice.
   Perhaps the main reason is the requirement for bidirectional
   LSPs.

5. Can you clarify whether the core network is assumed to be
   PSC only? That is, for example, if the CNI encoding is POS,
   would it be acceptable for the PE and the rest of the core
   network to switch the LSP as TDM until the remote PE or even
   CE, or do you require that the PE must perform packet
   switching? If the PE must perform packet switching, is it
   still acceptable for the core LSP (PE-PE) to be switched at
   some other technology?

6. Section 1.3 states:
     Where the network uses MPLS-TE signaling, the PE routers are
     expected to perform the translation.
   It is our opinion that this translation is non-trivial and may
   be impossible for some of the GMPLS services that are
   available at the CNI. For example, supporting a bidirectional
   service over an MPLS-TE signaling network requires additional
   coordination between the end-points that is currently not
   available in the MPLS-TE extensions to RSVP-TE.
   From the following text in section 7.1, we assume that the PE
   may refuse a CNI request if it is unable to provide the
   required level of function.
      The transport network in the provider network is a GMPLS or
      MPLS-TE based packet switched network that must support
      request for uni-directional LSPs and may support requests
      for bi-directional LSPs

7. Section 2.1
   The correct expansion of "GMPLS" is "Generalized Multiprotocol
   Label Switching". In view of you chosen expansion of "MPLS",
   you may prefer to show this as "Generalize Multi Protocol
   Label Switching".

8. Section 7.2 states:
     The CE and PE nodes are inter-connected by point-to-point
     interfaces.  The signaling channel is "in-band", i.e., the
     labeled packets share the same access connection as the
     RSVP-TE signaling.
   This is an acceptable, but not required, method of deploying
   GMPLS-based signaling. It is our suspicion reading this very
   short section that it is your intention to forbid the use of
   the IF_ID RSVP_HOP Object at the CNI. Can you confirm or deny
   this?

9. Section 7.3 states:
     A client need only know its own address, a reachable address
     of the adjacent PE-node, and know the address of any other
     client to which it wishes to connect.  The addresses listed
     above must be configured on each client.

     A PE need only know (and track) the addresses on interfaces
     attached to clients, as well as the Node IDs of these
     attached clients. In addition, the IP/MPLS network needs to
     know reachability to the interface addresses and Node IDs of
     other PEs to which an attached client is permitted to
     connect.

   This appears to miss the fact that the client will address a
   CNI connection request to a remote client address. The local
   PE must, therefore, know how to route to these client
   addresses that are outside the core routing domain.

   Perhaps the final sentence should say CE not PE?

   But in 9.1.2 you have:
     When a PE receives a Path message from a client that
     contains no ERO indicating transit network selection, then
     the PE is responsible for progressing the Path message
     toward the destination.  The progression of the Path
     message is beyond the scope of this specification.

   While the details are clearly out of scope, it *is* relevant
   to the definition of the CNI how the core acquires and
   distributes the client-side addressing information that is
   necessary for routing across the core. You will observe that
   the problem you are solving (including the fact that the
   client addresses may come from an address space that overlaps
   with the core address space) is similar to the L3VPN problem.

10. What is the expected behavior from the core network when an
    E-LSP is requested at the CNI?

    Can we assume that the expectation is that an appropriate
    E-LSP will also be established across the core so that
    Diffserv behavior will be performed along the whole length
    of the client-client connection, or is this not a
    requirement?

    If core Diffserv behavior is required, how will the core
    handle the presence of multiple classes?

11. You are correct to observe that the ERO is optional in GMPLS
    implementations (sections 9.1.1 and 9.1.2), however, since
    you are specifying a profile for use at the CNI, and since
    both the CE and the PE must be CNI-aware (i.e., you cannot
    simply use legacy implementations) you may find it convenient
    to mandate support of the ERO at the CNI.

    We believe that in practice all implementations support ERO.

12. In section 9.1.1 you have:
      The client populates the ERO object with only one sub-object
      containing an Autonomous System Number (ASN) representing a
      transit network beyond the originating service provider.
      The client equipment must set the ASN sub-object 'L' bit to
      1, indicating a loose route.
    It is not completely clear what is meant by 'the originating
    service provider', but we assume that this refers to the
    network that the ingress PE belongs to. In this case, this
     ERO is malformed and will be rejected. The first sub-object
    of a received ERO must always define an abstract node that
    the receiver is a member of. See RFC 3209, section 4.3.4.1,
    point 1).

13. In section 9.4:
      PE next to a client receives a PathErr with
      Path_State_Removed from the network, it may in turn
      generate either a ResvTear or PathTear, whichever is
      applicable, to be sent to the client.
    There are no circumstances in which a PE receiving a PathErr
    with Path_State_Removed from the network would send PathTear
    to the client.

    It is unclear to us why you would specify that the CNI built
    on GMPLS might not use this standard GMPLS procedure.

14. In section 9.5.3:
      The Extended Classtype object is signaled in the Path
      message, and saved in the Path State Block (PSB) at every
      hop.
    We recommend that you simply state that the state is stored
    as every hop. The existence of a PSB is implementation-
    specific.

    Can you please clarify "at every hop". Are you expecting
    nodes in the core network to store this information. If so,
    you should note that the core nodes will not recognize the
    object class and will reject any messages carrying it.

15. In 9.5.4:
      An LSR that recognizes the Extended Classtype object and
      that receives a Path message which contains the Extended
      Classtype object but which does not contain a Label Request
      object or which does not have a session type of
      LSP_Tunnel_IPv4, must send a PathErr message towards the
      sender with the error code 'extended-classtype Error' and
      an error value of 'Unexpected Extended Classtype object'.
      These are defined below:
    Why do you define new parsing behavior for the absence of a
    Label Request object (by the way, you should say Generalized
    Label Request object, since this is GMPLS)? The absence of
    mandatory objects is already covered in RFC2205.

16. The error code defined in 9.5.4 is conformant with RFC 3936.
    You may wish to look at draft-swallow-rsvp-user-error-spec
    in case this gives you the ability to handle more detailed
    private error codes.

Finally, we would like to refer you to 
draft-kumaki-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-reqts-01.txt and 
draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk-01.txt for the latest state of 
discussions in CCAMP with respect to interworking MPLS and GMPLS networks.





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 12:13:34 +0000
Message-ID: <3fd801c70bd3$853ed140$5a418182@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Fw: Posting of IPR Disclosure
Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2006 10:02:57 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi CCAMPers,

Please be aware that an IPR Disclosure has been posted for 
draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk.

I am not competent to evaluate IPR claims, but I want to point out that this 
I-D is Informational and does not require any specific implementation.

Adrian

> An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled "Framework 
> for
> MPLS-TE to GMPLS migration" (draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk) 
> was
> submitted to the IETF Secretariat and has been posted on the "IETF
> Page of Intellectual Property Rights Disclosures"
> (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/ipr_list.cgi). The title of the IPR
> disclosure is "Tellabs Statement about IPR claimed in
> draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk-00."
>
> The IETF Secretariat





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 17:02:03 +0000
Message-ID: <3c5b01c709a0$93b37ee0$5a418182@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Draft minutes posted
Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2006 16:59:18 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

Deborah has done an excellent job of compiling a single set of minutes from 
the great notes collected by Richard, Lyndon, and Don.

These are uploaded at 
http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/06nov/minutes/ccamp.htm

Please check them, comment on missing things or corrections, and start to 
work on the actions identified.

Just a reminder to look at the slides and drafts that fell off the bottom of 
the agenda and to comment on the list.

Thanks,
Adrian 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 15:12:18 +0000
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Subject: RE: Liaison received from MFA
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 16:09:54 +0100
Message-ID: <7DBAFEC6A76F3E42817DF1EBE64CB026040B2092@FTRDMEL2.rd.francetelecom.fr>
Thread-Topic: Liaison received from MFA
Thread-Index: AccIlMskPZaAR+rFRF21QNTWk3ZckAAED7fA
From: "MEURIC Julien RD-CORE-LAN" <julien.meuric@orange-ftgroup.com>
To: <adrian@olddog.co.uk>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>

Hi all.

The MFA appears to focus on PSC using GMPLS procedures: I agree we =
should wonder whether this as a specific GMPLS profile or a removal of =
the Generalized aspect. Anyway, I think the answer we'll give them =
should include a pointer to draft-ietf-ccamp-mpls-gmpls-interwork-fmwk.

I'm not sure this is the place for detailled comments, but I had a quick =
look on the specification and here are my thoughts.

- It seems their terminology is mixing MPLS/MPLS-TE/GMPLS, thus leading =
to the misused "GMPLS-TE" acronym. By the way, I don't think we mention =
any "GMPLS-TE capable interfaces" (p.6) in IETF.

- The section 7.2 named "GMPLS Signaling Channel" only mentions that =
"labeled packets share the same access connection as the RSVP-TE =
signaling". However, RFC 3945 says: "the control channels [...] exist =
independently of the links they manage", thus requiring in case of POS =
interface, for instance, to have a specific channel -- like DCC bytes -- =
pre-existing to any STS-3/VC-4 (or OC-3n/STM-n) connection. Here again, =
I'm not so sure they're really doing *G*MPLS.

As a result, I feel they're combining RFC 4208 and 4124, but they're =
also turning off the generalized aspects -- which I'm not very fond of: =
this is not GMPLS any more. Furthermore, I fear control and data plane =
separation is not properly understood in their document. This makes me =
think this is more an MPLS issue inspired by some "advanced" mechanisms =
from RFC 3473 and others.

Regards,

Julien


-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On =
Behalf Of Adrian Farrel

Hi,

CCAMP has received a liaison from the MFA.
You can see this at http://www.olddog.co.uk/incoming.htm

I'm not quite sure whether this should actually be handled by us or by =
the=20
MPLS working group, so I will be discussing it with the MPLS chairs.

All comments on this work gratefully received.

We are called upon to respond by February.

Adrian=20






Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 08:52:28 +0000
Message-ID: <14e901c70893$004512d0$5a418182@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: <mpls@lists.ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison received from MFA
Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 08:49:37 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

CCAMP has received a liaison from the MFA.
You can see this at http://www.olddog.co.uk/incoming.htm

I'm not quite sure whether this should actually be handled by us or by the 
MPLS working group, so I will be discussing it with the MPLS chairs.

All comments on this work gratefully received.

We are called upon to respond by February.

Adrian 





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Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt 
Message-Id: <E1Gjikj-0001Lu-Ma@stiedprstage1.ietf.org>
Date: Mon, 13 Nov 2006 15:50:01 -0500

--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Traffic Engineering Database Management Information Base in support of GMPLS 
	Author(s)	: T. Nadeau, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt
	Pages		: 
	Date		: 2006-11-13
	
   This memo defines the Management Information Base (MIB) objects in 
   order to manage traffic engineering database (TED) information with 
   extension in support of Multi-protocol label switching (MPLS) as well 
   as Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) for use with network management protocols.  


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Content-ID:	<2006-11-13145731.I-D@ietf.org>

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Sat, 11 Nov 2006 02:01:13 +0000
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 17:58:47 -0800
Message-Id: <200611110158.kAB1wlsP019693@nit.isi.edu>
To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org
Subject:  RFC 4736 on Reoptimization of Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) Traffic Engineering (TE) Loosely Routed Label Switched Path (LSP)
From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org
Cc: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org, ccamp@ops.ietf.org

A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries.

        
        RFC 4736

        Title:      Reoptimization of Multiprotocol Label Switching 
                    (MPLS) Traffic Engineering (TE) Loosely Routed 
                    Label Switched Path (LSP) 
        Author:     JP. Vasseur, Ed.,
                    Y. Ikejiri, R. Zhang
        Status:     Informational
        Date:       November 2006
        Mailbox:    jpv@cisco.com, 
                    y.ikejiri@ntt.com, 
                    raymond_zhang@bt.infonet.com
        Pages:      14
        Characters: 28850
        Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso:   None

        I-D Tag:    draft-ietf-ccamp-loose-path-reopt-02.txt

        URL:        http://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc/rfc4736.txt

This document defines a mechanism for the reoptimization of loosely
routed MPLS and GMPLS (Generalized Multiprotocol Label Switching)
Traffic Engineering (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSPs) signaled with
Resource Reservation Protocol Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE).  This 
document proposes a mechanism that allows a TE LSP head-end Label 
Switching Router (LSR) to trigger a new path re-evaluation on every hop 
that has a next hop defined as a loose or abstract hop and a mid-point 
LSR to signal to the head-end LSR that a better path exists (compared to 
the current path) or that the TE LSP must be reoptimized (because of
maintenance required on the TE LSP path).  The proposed mechanism
applies to the cases of intra- and inter-domain (Interior Gateway
Protocol area (IGP area) or Autonomous System) packet and non-packet
TE LSPs following a loosely routed path.  This memo provides information 
for the Internet community.

This document is a product of the Common Control and Measurement Plane
Working Group of the IETF.


INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet community. 
It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution
of this memo is unlimited.

This announcement is sent to the IETF list and the RFC-DIST list.
Requests to be added to or deleted from the IETF distribution list
should be sent to IETF-REQUEST@IETF.ORG.  Requests to be
added to or deleted from the RFC-DIST distribution list should
be sent to RFC-DIST-REQUEST@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.

Details on obtaining RFCs via FTP or EMAIL may be obtained by sending
an EMAIL message to rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG with the message body 

help: ways_to_get_rfcs. For example:

        To: rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG
        Subject: getting rfcs

        help: ways_to_get_rfcs

Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the
author of the RFC in question, or to RFC-Manager@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.  Unless
specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for
unlimited distribution.

Submissions for Requests for Comments should be sent to
RFC-EDITOR@RFC-EDITOR.ORG.  Please consult RFC 2223, Instructions to RFC
Authors, for further information.


Joyce K. Reynolds and Sandy Ginoza
USC/Information Sciences Institute

...





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 17:50:44 +0000
Message-ID: <060801c704f0$59425510$5a418182@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <tony@jeffree.co.uk>, <mick_seaman@ieee.org>
Cc: "Romascanu, Dan \(Dan\)" <dromasca@avaya.com>, "Bernard Aboba" <bernard_aboba@hotmail.com>, "Wijnen, Bert \(Bert\)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>, "Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>, "Bill Fenner" <fenner@research.att.com>, "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>, <statements@ietf.org>
Subject: Liaison to IEEE 802.1 from IETF CCAMP
Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2006 17:47:42 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

To: IEEE 802.1
From: IETF CCAMP Working Group
Cc: Dan Romascanu, Bernard Aboba, Bert Wijnen
     Ross Callon, Bill Fenner, Deborah Brungard
Subject: Control plane operation of Ethernet Bridging
Status: For Information

Dear Tony and Mick,

 We would like to clarify the previous Liaison from CCAMP with respect to 
Ethernet bridging behavior.

We have received requests to evaluate the use of GMPLS protocols for the 
control of bridging in Ethernet networks. At this time we have not initiated 
any work.

We recognise IEEE's authority to define and maintain the Ethernet data 
plane, and fully understand IEEE's concern for other SDOs to adhere to the 
IEEE's specifications. We would like to assure you that within the IETF's 
CCAMP working group we have the understanding that any Ethernet  work shall 
only be based on IEEE specified data planes.

For your information, we have defined the following rules and process for 
advancing this work within CCAMP:

Rules:

A. Data plane (i.e. the data forwarding of established flows) specification 
is out of scope and must not be discussed within CCAMP.

B. CCAMP will not work on the specification of GMPLS except for data planes 
that are already approved by an SDO with responsibility for the Ethernet 
data plane. It is expected that the primary SDO in this case is the IEEE.

Process steps:

1. Decide upon the data plane behavior to be controlled using GMPLS.

2. Ensure that the data plane to be controlled is approved and documented by 
an SDO with responsibility for Ethernet (i.e., the IEEE).
This may be a null op in the case of existing standards, but might require 
work in the other SDO for new standards or for profiles of existing 
standards.

3. Start protocol work in CCAMP with an explicit pointer to the approved 
data plane.

4. When it is clear that protocol work is progressing, CCAMP will liaise 
with the other SDO to get their blessing for using a control plane for the 
nominated data plane and to confirm that that data plane is really approved.

In addition, we expect to liaise our status during the development of any 
control plane extensions.

Best regards,
Deborah Brungard and Adrian Farrel
IETF CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 22:34:26 +0000
Message-ID: <047301c7044f$214a1860$5a418182@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: "Wijnen, Bert \(Bert\)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>, <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>, "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>
Subject: Re: Proposed liaison to IEEE 802.1
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 22:33:43 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Bert,

I was being lazy and listing rules and process together. I will split them 
out.

Yes, we are right up to the wire on the liaison.
If I send you the update tomorrow (Friday) can you send it straight away?

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>; <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>; "Ross Callon" 
<rcallon@juniper.net>; "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 10:27 PM
Subject: RE: Proposed liaison to IEEE 802.1


> Is there a missing header line before the numbered list.
> see my ??? inline
>
> IEEE 802.1 has its "lisiosn statements" slot on Monday
> afternoon 13 November. Timezone is Dallas USA.
>
> Bert
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Adrian Farrel [mailto:adrian@olddog.co.uk]
>> Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 14:10
>> To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
>> Cc: Wijnen, Bert (Bert); Ross Callon; Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS
>> Subject: Proposed liaison to IEEE 802.1
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> In view of the fact that IEEE 802.1 is meeting very soon, we
>> think it may be
>> helpful to report to them how we have agreed to work on GMPLS
>> control of
>> Ethernet.
>>
>> Below, please find a proposed liaison that is built from the
>> process we
>> agreed in the CCAMP meeting at IETF-66, and presented on the
>> GELS and CCAMP
>> mailing lists.
>>
>> Please comment on the text as soon as possible.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Adrian and Deborah
>>
>> ===
>>
>> We would like to clarify the previous Liaison from CCAMP with
>> respect to
>> Ethernet switching behavior.
>>
>> We have received requests to evaluate the use of GMPLS
>> protocols for the
>> control of forwarding in Ethernet networks. At this time we have not
>> initiated any work.
>>
>> We recognise IEEE's authority to define and maintain the
>> Ethernet data
>> plane, and fully understand IEEE's concern for other SDOs to adhere to
>> the IEEE's specifications. We would like to assure you that
>> within the
>> IETF's CCAMP working group we have the understanding that any
>> Ethernet  work
>> shall only be based on IEEE specified data planes.
>>
>> For your information, we have defined the following rules and
>> process for
>> advancing this work within CCAMP:
>>
>> - Data plane specification is out of scope and must not be discussed
>>   within CCAMP.
>>
>> - CCAMP will not work on the specification of GMPLS except for
>>   data planes that are already approved by an SDO with responsibility
>>   for the Ethernet data plane. It is expected that the primary SDO
>>   in this case is IEEE.
>>
>
> ??
> So are the above the "only rules" ? I.e. they are unnumbered?
> Are the following also defined rules, but now numbered? Or is
> there a missing header line here that expalins what the next
> numbered items represent?
> Or am I missing something obvious?
> ??
>
>> 1. Decide upon the data plane behavior to be controlled using GMPLS.
>>
>> 2. Ensure that the data plane to be controlled is approved
>> and documented by an SDO with responsibility for Ethernet
>> (i.e., the IEEE).
>> This may be a null op in the case of existing standards, but
>> might require work in the other SDO for new standards
>> for profiles of existing standards.
>>
>> 3. Start protocol work in CCAMP with an explicit pointer
>> to the approved data plane.
>>
>> 4. When it is clear that protocol work is progressing,
>> CCAMP will liaise with the other SDO to get their
>> blessing for using a control plane for the nominated data
>> plane.
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Deborah Brungard and Adrian Farrel
>> CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs
>>
>>
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 22:34:17 +0000
Message-ID: <047201c7044f$20867a40$5a418182@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Tomohiro Otani" <otani@kddilabs.jp>
Subject: Renaming the GMPLS TED/OSPF MIB
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 22:31:59 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Tomo,

As discussed in San Diego, could you please resubmit 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ospf-mib-01.txt as 
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ted-mib-00.txt

This trivial piece of house keeping will keep us honest going forward.

Thanks,
Adrian 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 09 Nov 2006 22:11:52 +0000
Message-ID: <041e01c7044b$be6532f0$5a418182@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: "Wijnen, Bert \(Bert\)" <bwijnen@lucent.com>, "Ross Callon" <rcallon@juniper.net>, "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" <dbrungard@att.com>
Subject: Proposed liaison to IEEE 802.1
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 22:09:30 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

In view of the fact that IEEE 802.1 is meeting very soon, we think it may be 
helpful to report to them how we have agreed to work on GMPLS control of 
Ethernet.

Below, please find a proposed liaison that is built from the process we 
agreed in the CCAMP meeting at IETF-66, and presented on the GELS and CCAMP 
mailing lists.

Please comment on the text as soon as possible.

Thanks,
Adrian and Deborah

===

We would like to clarify the previous Liaison from CCAMP with respect to 
Ethernet switching behavior.

We have received requests to evaluate the use of GMPLS protocols for the 
control of forwarding in Ethernet networks. At this time we have not 
initiated any work.

We recognise IEEE's authority to define and maintain the Ethernet data 
plane, and fully understand IEEE's concern for other SDOs to adhere to
the IEEE's specifications. We would like to assure you that within the 
IETF's CCAMP working group we have the understanding that any Ethernet  work 
shall only be based on IEEE specified data planes.

For your information, we have defined the following rules and process for 
advancing this work within CCAMP:

- Data plane specification is out of scope and must not be discussed
  within CCAMP.

- CCAMP will not work on the specification of GMPLS except for
  data planes that are already approved by an SDO with responsibility
  for the Ethernet data plane. It is expected that the primary SDO
  in this case is IEEE.

1. Decide upon the data plane behavior to be controlled using GMPLS.

2. Ensure that the data plane to be controlled is approved
and documented by an SDO with responsibility for Ethernet
(i.e., the IEEE).
This may be a null op in the case of existing standards, but
might require work in the other SDO for new standards
for profiles of existing standards.

3. Start protocol work in CCAMP with an explicit pointer
to the approved data plane.

4. When it is clear that protocol work is progressing,
CCAMP will liaise with the other SDO to get their
blessing for using a control plane for the nominated data
plane.

Best regards,
Deborah Brungard and Adrian Farrel
CCAMP Working Group Co-Chairs 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 07:22:35 +0000
To: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
Cc: "ccamp" <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>, dpapadimitriou@psg.com, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, rabbat@alum.mit.edu
Subject: RE: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: <OF7412E6A4.3D44DD41-ONC125721F.002F2F1E-C1257220.002844A9@netfr.alcatel.fr>
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel.be
Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2006 08:19:21 +0100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

hi  - see inline




"Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
07/11/2006 06:56
 
        To:     <dpapadimitriou@psg.com>, Dimitri 
PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL
        cc:     "ccamp" <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>, <rabbat@alum.mit.edu>
        Subject:        RE: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID


Hi Dimitri,
 
Thanks for your responses. Please see in-line for [SCB]
 
Snigdho
 
 

From: dimitri papadimitriou [mailto:dpapadimitriou@psg.com]
Sent: Mon 11/6/2006 6:12 PM
To: Bardalai, Snigdho
Cc: ccamp; rabbat@alum.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID

hi - see inline

Bardalai, Snigdho wrote:

> Hi Dimitri,
> 
> As mentioned in today's meeting I have the following questions on this
> ID:
> 
> 1. The Addressing Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an 
addressable IP
>     address i.e. one can ping this address.
> 
>     The ID needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.

isn't section 5.1 clear enough concerning this TE Router ID usage ?
[SCB] I am a bit confused because as per RFC3630 each router can only
           advertise one router address top level TLV. In case a router
           represents "N" TE nodes then there can be multiple TE Router 
IDs.
           My question is - which TE Router ID can be set in the router 
address
           TLV ?

[dp] and this document does also advertize one router_address top level 
TLV (not multiple per TE LSA), not because there is a TE router ID 
associated to each Li that multiple router_address TLV are being used 
within a given TE LSA - 

note that ASON does not list requirements on TE Router ID itself (since
implementation independent)
[SCB] OK.

> 2. Upward / downward LSA transformation
> 
>     When LSAs are exported from one level to another then these LSAs 
need to be
>     transformed. The ID does not clearly specify how the transformation 
takes place.
> 
>     The specific scenarios are:
>     + Upward LSA transformation - what values are used for the adv 
Router ID, Router Address
>        and LINK ID ?

see below

>     + Downward LSA transformation - what values are used (for above 
mentioned fields) ?

only case where there is any information processing is in case of
reachability such as to aggregate information

for the rest everything there is no processing of the opaque LSA
information -
[SCB] What about downward dissemination of higher level topology elements 
? 
[dp] i don't catch the exact point here - would you clarify
concerning the adv.router_id i will add a statement in next revision
(without any surprise here)
[SCB] OK, and what about the associated TE Router ID for the reachability 
information ?
[dp] do you mean in case you would be aggregating reachability from 
multiple TE router ID, how the latter would be aggregated - note that the 
reachability information is part of a separate sub-TLV than the TE router 
ID sub-TLV - meaning aggregation could be performed on behalf of the 
advertizing node leaving the answer here quite straightforward
> 3. TE Links LSAs
> 
>     From reading the ID I can infer that every TE link advertised at a 
particular level
>     needs to be a link between 2 routers i.e. Router ID, because the 
LINK ID MUST
>     be set to the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.

yes - there is no need to change anything from that perspective

>     In that case when there is only one router for a set of TE nodes 
then how will
>     the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single 
router. Or is it
>     expected that these TE link LSAs never get advertised by that single 
router
>     (i.e. all TE nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?

ok i see ... there is no advertizement of internal structure of abstract
nodes otherwise make use of the logical link case - see RFC 4652
 
[SCB] So are we saying logical links are limited to cases 1 & 2 ?

[dp] logical links case only holds when a configuration like depicted in 
Fig. 2 of RFC 4652 holds

> 4. Upward / downward discovery and selection
> 
>    The ID describes a procedure by which routers can automatically 
discover and select
>    the upward and downward speaker router.
> 
>    It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with a 
router ID larger than
>    its own and the U or D bit set it will stop importing or exporting 
LSAs.
> 
>    What is not clear is that how does the router with the highest router 
ID know when to
>    start importing or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge which 
is the current
>    speaker and there is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped 
importing or exporting
>    LSAs.
> 
>    Could you please explain how this works ?

hysteresis mechanisms is expained in section 6.2.1 prevents from
disturbing the routing information dissemination process once selection
has been performed - so the condition you are describing does not occur
if import/export is already in place.
 
[SCB] There are 2 types of information that is being discussed here -
            1. regular routing information being flooded in the area
            2. upward / downward routing information
 
           The rule is that the router with the highest router ID will 
disseminate
           the upward / downward information. The router with the highest 
router ID
           is identified using the regular routing information being 
flooded in the area.
 
           Now a new router is added which is the highest router ID. This 
router
           must NOT disseminate upward/downward routing information even 
though it
           has the highest router ID because another router is already 
selected. How does
           it figure out that it must NOT disseminate the upward / 
downward routing information
           i.e. another router is already selected for the job ?

[dp] your question boils down to: how does the highest router_id that pops 
up know whether there is an already selected router_id already operating - 
here a couple of lines will be added because the default process was menat 
to allow manual control of the switchover but i can automate the process 
by planning a release (by MaxAging previous selection)

hope this clarifies
- d.



> Thanks,
> Snigdho
>




Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 08 Nov 2006 01:46:19 +0000
Message-ID: <4551343A.401@us.fujitsu.com>
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 17:34:50 -0800
From: Richard Rabbat <richard@us.fujitsu.com>
User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.7 (Windows/20060909)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: ccamp <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
CC: Snigdho Bardalai <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>, lidan 37133 <danli@huawei.com>, Huub van Helvoort <hhelvoort@chello.nl>, Diego Caviglia <Diego.Caviglia@marconi.com>, "julien.meuric" <julien.meuric@francetelecom.com>, jingrq@ctbri.com.cn, gjhhit@huawei.com
Subject: further clarification about time-slot interchange
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi all,

W/r to time-slot interchange vs. time-slot allocation, here is the
reference to TSI not being allowed in G.841 (10/98) on page 49 item 10:

10) Ring utilization criteria - Time-slot interchange will allow better
utilization of bandwidth of the ring. If Time-Slot Interchange (TSI) is
allowed, the traffic having a time-slot interchange through the failed
location may or may not be restored. It is for further study whether TSI
shall be allowed, and if allowed, whether traffic having time-slot
interchange through the failed location will be restored.

Basically, even though TSI would be desirable, at this time, there is no
solution that uses TSI and can restore traffic hence if restoration is
required then TSI is not allowed as per the current definition of the
MS-SPRing standards. Hence, the need for TSA.

We hope this helps clarify the issue.




Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 18:13:10 +0000
Message-ID: <069f01c70298$169470e0$9015a8c0@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: OIF Communication Uploaded
Date: Tue, 7 Nov 2006 18:10:57 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

As promised at the meeting yesterday, I have uploaded the latest 
communications from the OIF at http://www.olddog.co.uk/incoming.htm

Sorry about the proprietary format of this information. I have run the zip 
file through my virus scanner, but I make no guarantees.

Adrian 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 05:58:47 +0000
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C70231.81A1A0AB"
Subject: RE: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 23:56:45 -0600
Message-ID: <A278CCD6FF152E478C3CF84E4C3BC79D098302@rchemx01.fnc.net.local>
Thread-Topic: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
Thread-Index: AccCAUj/gl1SayniTX2VOl1CYR9MFQAFxayZ
From: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
To: <dpapadimitriou@psg.com>, <dimitri.papadimitriou@alcatel.be>
Cc: "ccamp" <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>, <rabbat@alum.mit.edu>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

------_=_NextPart_001_01C70231.81A1A0AB
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Dimitri,
=20
Thanks for your responses. Please see in-line for [SCB]
=20
Snigdho
=20
=20

________________________________

From: dimitri papadimitriou [mailto:dpapadimitriou@psg.com]
Sent: Mon 11/6/2006 6:12 PM
To: Bardalai, Snigdho
Cc: ccamp; rabbat@alum.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID



hi - see inline

Bardalai, Snigdho wrote:

> Hi Dimitri,
>=20
> As mentioned in today's meeting I have the following questions on this
> ID:
>=20
> 1. The Addressing Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an =
addressable IP
>     address i.e. one can ping this address.
>=20
>     The ID needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.

isn't section 5.1 clear enough concerning this TE Router ID usage ?

[SCB] I am a bit confused because as per RFC3630 each router can only
           advertise one router address top level TLV. In case a router
           represents "N" TE nodes then there can be multiple TE Router =
IDs.
           My question is - which TE Router ID can be set in the router =
address
           TLV ?

note that ASON does not list requirements on TE Router ID itself (since
implementation independent)

[SCB] OK.

> 2. Upward / downward LSA transformation
>=20
>     When LSAs are exported from one level to another then these LSAs =
need to be
>     transformed. The ID does not clearly specify how the =
transformation takes place.
>=20
>     The specific scenarios are:
>     + Upward LSA transformation - what values are used for the adv =
Router ID, Router Address
>        and LINK ID ?

see below

>     + Downward LSA transformation - what values are used (for above =
mentioned fields) ?

only case where there is any information processing is in case of
reachability such as to aggregate information

for the rest everything there is no processing of the opaque LSA
information -

[SCB] What about downward dissemination of higher level topology =
elements ?=20

concerning the adv.router_id i will add a statement in next revision
(without any surprise here)

[SCB] OK, and what about the associated TE Router ID for the =
reachability information ?

> 3. TE Links LSAs
>=20
>     From reading the ID I can infer that every TE link advertised at a =
particular level
>     needs to be a link between 2 routers i.e. Router ID, because the =
LINK ID MUST
>     be set to the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.

yes - there is no need to change anything from that perspective

>     In that case when there is only one router for a set of TE nodes =
then how will
>     the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single =
router. Or is it
>     expected that these TE link LSAs never get advertised by that =
single router
>     (i.e. all TE nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?

ok i see ... there is no advertizement of internal structure of abstract
nodes otherwise make use of the logical link case - see RFC 4652

=20
[SCB] So are we saying logical links are limited to cases 1 & 2 ?

> 4. Upward / downward discovery and selection
>=20
>    The ID describes a procedure by which routers can automatically =
discover and select
>    the upward and downward speaker router.
>=20
>    It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with =
a router ID larger than
>    its own and the U or D bit set it will stop importing or exporting =
LSAs.
>=20
>    What is not clear is that how does the router with the highest =
router ID know when to
>    start importing or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge =
which is the current
>    speaker and there is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped =
importing or exporting
>    LSAs.
>=20
>    Could you please explain how this works ?

hysteresis mechanisms is expained in section 6.2.1 prevents from
disturbing the routing information dissemination process once selection
has been performed - so the condition you are describing does not occur
if import/export is already in place.
=20
[SCB] There are 2 types of information that is being discussed here -
            1. regular routing information being flooded in the area
            2. upward / downward routing information
=20
           The rule is that the router with the highest router ID will =
disseminate
           the upward / downward information. The router with the =
highest router ID
           is identified using the regular routing information being =
flooded in the area.
=20
           Now a new router is added which is the highest router ID. =
This router
           must NOT disseminate upward/downward routing information even =
though it
           has the highest router ID because another router is already =
selected. How does
           it figure out that it must NOT disseminate the upward / =
downward routing information
           i.e. another router is already selected for the job ?

hope this clarifies
- d.



> Thanks,
> Snigdho
>


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=0A=
<META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version =
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<DIV id=3DidOWAReplyText88612 dir=3Dltr>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Hi =
Dimitri,</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Thanks for =
your responses. =0A=
Please see in-line for [SCB]</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Snigdho</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><BR>=0A=
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>=0A=
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> dimitri papadimitriou =0A=
[mailto:dpapadimitriou@psg.com]<BR><B>Sent:</B> Mon 11/6/2006 6:12 =0A=
PM<BR><B>To:</B> Bardalai, Snigdho<BR><B>Cc:</B> ccamp; =0A=
rabbat@alum.mit.edu<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON =
OSPF-TE =0A=
ID<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>=0A=
<DIV>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>hi - see inline<BR><BR>Bardalai, Snigdho =
wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Hi =0A=
Dimitri,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt; As mentioned in today's meeting I have =
the =0A=
following questions on this<BR>&gt; ID:<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt; 1. The =
Addressing =0A=
Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an addressable =0A=
IP<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; address i.e. one can ping this =0A=
address.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The ID needs to =
clearly =0A=
state what is the requirement for ASON.<BR><BR>isn't section 5.1 clear =
enough =0A=
concerning this TE Router ID usage ?</FONT></P><FONT =
size=3D2></FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>[SCB] I am a bit confused because as per RFC3630 =
each router =0A=
can only</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
advertise one router address top level TLV.&nbsp;In case a =
router</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT =0A=
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;represents =0A=
"N" TE nodes then there can be multiple TE Router IDs.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
My question is - which TE Router ID can be set in the router =0A=
address</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
TLV ?<BR><BR>note that ASON does not list requirements on TE Router ID =
itself =0A=
(since<BR>implementation independent)</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>[SCB] OK.<BR><BR>&gt; 2. Upward / downward LSA =0A=
transformation<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; When LSAs =
are =0A=
exported from one level to another then these LSAs need to =0A=
be<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; transformed. The ID does not clearly =
specify =0A=
how the transformation takes =0A=
place.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The specific =
scenarios =0A=
are:<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; + Upward LSA transformation - what =
values =0A=
are used for the adv Router ID, Router =0A=
Address<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; and LINK ID =0A=
?<BR><BR>see below<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; + Downward LSA =0A=
transformation - what values are used (for above mentioned fields) =
?<BR><BR>only =0A=
case where there is any information processing is in case =
of<BR>reachability =0A=
such as to aggregate information<BR><BR>for the rest everything there is =
no =0A=
processing of the opaque LSA<BR>information -</FONT></P>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>[SCB] What about downward dissemination of higher =
level topology =0A=
elements ? </FONT></P>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>concerning the adv.router_id i will add a statement in =
next =0A=
revision<BR>(without any surprise here)</FONT></P>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>[SCB] OK, and&nbsp;what about the associated TE Router =
ID for =0A=
the reachability information ?<BR><BR>&gt; 3. TE Links =0A=
LSAs<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; From reading the ID I =
can =0A=
infer that every TE link advertised at a particular =0A=
level<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; needs to be a link between 2 =
routers i.e. =0A=
Router ID, because the LINK ID MUST<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; be =
set to =0A=
the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.<BR><BR>yes - there =
is no =0A=
need to change anything from that =0A=
perspective<BR><BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; In that case when there =
is only =0A=
one router for a set of TE nodes then how =
will<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single =
router. Or is =0A=
it<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; expected that these TE link LSAs =
never get =0A=
advertised by that single router<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; (i.e. =
all TE =0A=
nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?<BR><BR>ok i see ... =
there is =0A=
no advertizement of internal structure of abstract<BR>nodes otherwise =
make use =0A=
of the logical link case - see RFC 4652</P>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>[SCB]&nbsp;So are we saying logical links&nbsp;are limited to cases =
1 &amp; =0A=
2 ?</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><BR>&gt; 4. Upward / downward discovery and =0A=
selection<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The ID describes a =
procedure =0A=
by which routers can automatically discover and =
select<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
the upward and downward speaker =
router.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with a =
router ID =0A=
larger than<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; its own and the U or D bit set it =
will =0A=
stop importing or exporting =
LSAs.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; What =0A=
is not clear is that how does the router with the highest router ID know =
when =0A=
to<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; start importing or exporting LSAs, because =
it has =0A=
no knowledge which is the current<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; speaker and =
there is =0A=
no clear way to figure out when it has stopped importing or =0A=
exporting<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
LSAs.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Could you please explain =
how this =0A=
works ?<BR><BR>hysteresis mechanisms is expained in section 6.2.1 =
prevents =0A=
from<BR>disturbing the routing information dissemination process once =0A=
selection<BR>has been performed - so the condition you are describing =
does not =0A=
occur<BR>if import/export is already in place.</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>[SCB] There are 2 types of information that is being discussed here =
-</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
1. =0A=
regular routing information being flooded in the area</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
2. =0A=
upward / downward routing information</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Th=
e rule =0A=
is that the router with the highest router ID will disseminate</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; the =
upward / =0A=
downward information. The router with the highest router ID</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; is =
identified =0A=
using the regular routing information being flooded in the area.</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Now a =
new =0A=
router is added which is the highest router ID. This router</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;mu=
st NOT =0A=
disseminate upward/downward routing information even though it</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; has =
the =0A=
highest router ID because another router is already selected. How =
does</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;it =
figure out =0A=
that it must NOT disseminate the upward / downward routing =
information</DIV>=0A=
<DIV>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; i.e. =
another =0A=
router is already selected for the job ?</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><BR>hope this clarifies<BR>- d.<BR><BR><BR><BR>&gt; Thanks,<BR>&gt; =0A=
Snigdho<BR>&gt;<BR></DIV></FONT>=0A=
=0A=
</BODY>=0A=
</HTML>
------_=_NextPart_001_01C70231.81A1A0AB--



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 02:48:13 +0000
Message-ID: <454FF3D8.3070107@psg.com>
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 03:47:52 +0100
From: dimitri papadimitriou <dpapadimitriou@psg.com>
Reply-To:  dpapadimitriou@psg.com,  dimitri.papadimitriou@alcatel.be
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.11) Gecko/20050728
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
CC:  ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: Drafts not discussed
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

adrian

 > PS We have decided that we need more time at the next IETF meeting

does it mean wg is going to ask for two slots for next meeting to the iesg ?

thanks,
- d.

Adrian Farrel wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> Sorry that we didn't get to discuss some of your drafts in the meeting 
> today.
> 
> Please read the slides on line and discuss on the mailing list.
> 
> A
> 
> PS We have decided that we need more time at the next IETF meeting
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 00:13:46 +0000
Message-ID: <454FCF57.2030707@psg.com>
Date: Tue, 07 Nov 2006 01:12:07 +0100
From: dimitri papadimitriou <dpapadimitriou@psg.com>
Reply-To:  dpapadimitriou@psg.com,  dimitri.papadimitriou@alcatel.be
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.11) Gecko/20050728
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
CC: ccamp <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>,  rabbat@alum.mit.edu
Subject: Re: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

hi - see inline

Bardalai, Snigdho wrote:

> Hi Dimitri,
>  
> As mentioned in today's meeting I have the following questions on this
> ID:
>  
> 1. The Addressing Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an addressable IP
>     address i.e. one can ping this address.
>  
>     The ID needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.

isn't section 5.1 clear enough concerning this TE Router ID usage ?

note that ASON does not list requirements on TE Router ID itself (since 
implementation independent)

> 2. Upward / downward LSA transformation
>  
>     When LSAs are exported from one level to another then these LSAs need to be
>     transformed. The ID does not clearly specify how the transformation takes place.
>  
>     The specific scenarios are:
>     + Upward LSA transformation - what values are used for the adv Router ID, Router Address
>        and LINK ID ?

see below

>     + Downward LSA transformation - what values are used (for above mentioned fields) ?

only case where there is any information processing is in case of 
reachability such as to aggregate information

for the rest everything there is no processing of the opaque LSA 
information -

concerning the adv.router_id i will add a statement in next revision 
(without any surprise here)

> 3. TE Links LSAs
>  
>     From reading the ID I can infer that every TE link advertised at a particular level
>     needs to be a link between 2 routers i.e. Router ID, because the LINK ID MUST
>     be set to the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.

yes - there is no need to change anything from that perspective

>     In that case when there is only one router for a set of TE nodes then how will
>     the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single router. Or is it
>     expected that these TE link LSAs never get advertised by that single router
>     (i.e. all TE nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?

ok i see ... there is no advertizement of internal structure of abstract 
nodes otherwise make use of the logical link case - see RFC 4652

> 4. Upward / downward discovery and selection
>  
>    The ID describes a procedure by which routers can automatically discover and select
>    the upward and downward speaker router.
>  
>    It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with a router ID larger than
>    its own and the U or D bit set it will stop importing or exporting LSAs. 
>  
>    What is not clear is that how does the router with the highest router ID know when to
>    start importing or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge which is the current
>    speaker and there is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped importing or exporting
>    LSAs.
>  
>    Could you please explain how this works ?

hysteresis mechanisms is expained in section 6.2.1 prevents from 
disturbing the routing information dissemination process once selection 
has been performed - so the condition you are describing does not occur
if import/export is already in place

hope this clarifies
- d.



> Thanks,
> Snigdho
> 



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 23:10:17 +0000
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C701F8.AC48050D"
Subject: RE: Some questions on LMP
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 17:09:55 -0600
Message-ID: <A278CCD6FF152E478C3CF84E4C3BC79D098301@rchemx01.fnc.net.local>
Thread-Topic: Some questions on LMP
Thread-Index: AccB99T91rrPVVo5ROmiqwKkz4oHKw==
From: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
To: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>, "ccamp" <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: <jplang@ieee.org>

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All:
CC: Jonathan P. Lang
=20
I had sent these questions on LMP some time back. I have'nt heard
any response since. I am anxious to get some response.
=20
Thanks,
Snigdho

________________________________

From: Bardalai, Snigdho
Sent: Tue 10/24/2006 7:17 PM
To: ccamp
Cc: jplang@ieee.org
Subject: Some questions on LMP



Hi,

I have a few questions on LMP. Would like to hear back some opinions on
these.

First question -

Section 9 on "Addressing" mentions that a Config message over a
non-point-to-point
link (which could mean an ethernet link), must be sent with the
destination IP set to
the unicast IP address of the neighboring node.

Considering a scenario where there are 2 nodes that has mutliple
control-channels
1) an out-of-fiber one over a non-point-to-point link
2) an in-fiber one over a point-to-point link

Since there is no guarantee that the Config message with the unicast
destination IP address
meant for control-channel 1) will not get routed out on the
point-to-point link what
measures should the neighboring node take to properly map the Config
message to the
correct instance of the control-channel ?

Next question -

Does RFC4204 consider network reconfiguration scenarios ? For example,
if graceful
restart is enabled control-channel re-establishment is done using the
unicast IP address
of the neighboring node in the Config message that was recovered from,
say, the non-volatile
storage database. At what point in time will the Config message
destination IP address
switch to the multicast IP address (assuming the control-channel is over
a point-to-point
link) ?

Last question -

Graceful restart requires the following (extracted from Section 8):

   If, however, the node was not capable of retaining
   the LMP link information across a restart, the node MUST accept the
   data link parameters of the received LinkSummary message and respond
   with a LinkSummaryAck message.

Should a node not capable of retaining any information across a restart
respond with a LinkSummaryAck in case link verification is enabled ?
The issue is the information that is being accepted may not be correct.

Thanks,
Snigdho






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<META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">=0A=
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 3.2//EN">=0A=
<HTML>=0A=
<HEAD>=0A=
=0A=
<META NAME=3D"Generator" CONTENT=3D"MS Exchange Server version =
6.5.7226.0">=0A=
<TITLE>Some questions on LMP</TITLE>=0A=
</HEAD>=0A=
<BODY>=0A=
<DIV id=3DidOWAReplyText66368 dir=3Dltr>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 =
size=3D2>All:</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>CC: Jonathan P. =
Lang</FONT></DIV></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>I had sent these questions on LMP some time back. I =
have'nt =0A=
heard</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>any response since. I am anxious to get some =
response.</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>Thanks,</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>Snigdho<BR></DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr>=0A=
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>=0A=
</DIV>=0A=
<DIV dir=3Dltr><FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> Bardalai, =0A=
Snigdho<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tue 10/24/2006 7:17 PM<BR><B>To:</B> =
ccamp<BR><B>Cc:</B> =0A=
jplang@ieee.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Some questions on =
LMP<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>=0A=
<DIV>=0A=
<P><FONT size=3D2>Hi,<BR><BR>I have a few questions on LMP. Would like =
to hear =0A=
back some opinions on<BR>these.<BR><BR>First question -<BR><BR>Section 9 =
on =0A=
"Addressing" mentions that a Config message over =
a<BR>non-point-to-point<BR>link =0A=
(which could mean an ethernet link), must be sent with =
the<BR>destination IP set =0A=
to<BR>the unicast IP address of the neighboring node.<BR><BR>Considering =
a =0A=
scenario where there are 2 nodes that has =
mutliple<BR>control-channels<BR>1) an =0A=
out-of-fiber one over a non-point-to-point link<BR>2) an in-fiber one =
over a =0A=
point-to-point link<BR><BR>Since there is no guarantee that the Config =
message =0A=
with the unicast<BR>destination IP address<BR>meant for control-channel =
1) will =0A=
not get routed out on the<BR>point-to-point link what<BR>measures should =
the =0A=
neighboring node take to properly map the Config<BR>message to =
the<BR>correct =0A=
instance of the control-channel ?<BR><BR>Next question -<BR><BR>Does =
RFC4204 =0A=
consider network reconfiguration scenarios ? For example,<BR>if =0A=
graceful<BR>restart is enabled control-channel re-establishment is done =
using =0A=
the<BR>unicast IP address<BR>of the neighboring node in the Config =
message that =0A=
was recovered from,<BR>say, the non-volatile<BR>storage database. At =
what point =0A=
in time will the Config message<BR>destination IP address<BR>switch to =
the =0A=
multicast IP address (assuming the control-channel is over<BR>a =0A=
point-to-point<BR>link) ?<BR><BR>Last question -<BR><BR>Graceful restart =0A=
requires the following (extracted from Section 8):<BR><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; =
If, =0A=
however, the node was not capable of retaining<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; the LMP =
link =0A=
information across a restart, the node MUST accept the<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; =
data link =0A=
parameters of the received LinkSummary message and =
respond<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp; with =0A=
a LinkSummaryAck message.<BR><BR>Should a node not capable of retaining =
any =0A=
information across a restart<BR>respond with a LinkSummaryAck in case =
link =0A=
verification is enabled ?<BR>The issue is the information that is being =
accepted =0A=
may not be =0A=
correct.<BR><BR>Thanks,<BR>Snigdho<BR><BR><BR><BR></FONT></P></DIV>=0A=
=0A=
</BODY>=0A=
</HTML>
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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 23:00:55 +0000
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Subject: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 17:00:09 -0600
Message-ID: <A278CCD6FF152E478C3CF84E4C3BC79D0982FB@rchemx01.fnc.net.local>
Thread-Topic: Questions on GMPLS ASON OSPF-TE ID
Thread-Index: AccB1vgdtPWOM003QyOIi+qPTPXa6A==
From: "Bardalai, Snigdho" <Snigdho.Bardalai@us.fujitsu.com>
To: "ccamp" <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Cc: <rabbat@alum.mit.edu>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Hi Dimitri,
=20
As mentioned in today's meeting I have the following questions on this
ID:
=20
1. The Addressing Draft requires that the TERouterID to be an =
addressable IP
    address i.e. one can ping this address.
=20
    The ID needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.
=20
2. Upward / downward LSA transformation
=20
    When LSAs are exported from one level to another then these LSAs =
need to be
    transformed. The ID does not clearly specify how the transformation =
takes place.
=20
    The specific scenarios are:
    + Upward LSA transformation - what values are used for the adv =
Router ID, Router Address
       and LINK ID ?
    + Downward LSA transformation - what values are used (for above =
mentioned fields) ?
=20
3. TE Links LSAs
=20
    From reading the ID I can infer that every TE link advertised at a =
particular level
    needs to be a link between 2 routers i.e. Router ID, because the =
LINK ID MUST
    be set to the neighboring router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.
=20
    In that case when there is only one router for a set of TE nodes =
then how will
    the TE link LSAs look like when they get advertised by that single =
router. Or is it
    expected that these TE link LSAs never get advertised by that single =
router
    (i.e. all TE nodes must get represented as an abstract node) ?
=20
4. Upward / downward discovery and selection
=20
   The ID describes a procedure by which routers can automatically =
discover and select
   the upward and downward speaker router.
=20
   It is quite clear that when the current speaker sees a router with a =
router ID larger than
   its own and the U or D bit set it will stop importing or exporting =
LSAs.=20
=20
   What is not clear is that how does the router with the highest router =
ID know when to
   start importing or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge which =
is the current
   speaker and there is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped =
importing or exporting
   LSAs.
=20
   Could you please explain how this works ?
=20
Thanks,
Snigdho

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<META HTTP-EQUIV=3D"Content-Type" CONTENT=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">=0A=
<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"><HTML =
DIR=3Dltr><HEAD></HEAD><BODY><DIV><FONT face=3D'Arial' color=3D#000000 =
size=3D2>Hi Dimitri,</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2> As mentioned in today's meeting I have =
the =0A=
following questions on this</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>ID:</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>1.&nbsp;The Addressing Draft requires =
that the TERouterID =0A=
to be an addressable IP</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>    &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; address i.e. =0A=
one can ping this address.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The ID =0A=
needs to clearly state what is the requirement for ASON.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>2. Upward / downward LSA =0A=
transformation</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; When LSAs are =
exported from one =0A=
level to another then these LSAs need to be</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; transformed. The ID =
does not =0A=
clearly specify how the transformation takes place.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The specific =
scenarios =0A=
are:</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; + Upward LSA =
transformation =0A=
-&nbsp;what values&nbsp;are used for the adv Router ID, Router =0A=
Address</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
and LINK ID =0A=
?</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; + Downward LSA =
transformation - what =0A=
values are used (for above mentioned fields) ?</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>   3. TE Links LSAs</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; From reading the ID =
I can infer =0A=
that every TE link advertised at a particular level</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; needs to be a link =
between 2 =0A=
routers i.e. Router ID, because the LINK ID MUST</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; be set to the =
neighboring =0A=
router's Router ID as per RFC 3630.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; In that case when =
there is only =0A=
one router for a set of TE nodes then how will</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; the TE link LSAs =
look like when =0A=
they get advertised by that single router. Or is it</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; expected that these =
</FONT><FONT =0A=
face=3DArial size=3D2>TE link LSAs never get advertised by that single =0A=
router</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; (i.e. all TE nodes =
must =0A=
</FONT><FONT face=3DArial><FONT size=3D2>get represented as =
an<FONT>&nbsp;abstract =0A=
node) ?</FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>4. Upward / downward discovery and =0A=
selection</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; The ID describes a =
procedure by which =0A=
routers can automatically discover and select</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; the upward and downward =
speaker =0A=
router.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;It is quite =0A=
clear that when the current speaker sees&nbsp;a router with a router ID =
larger =0A=
than</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; its own and the U =0A=
or D&nbsp;bit set it will&nbsp;stop&nbsp;importing or exporting =0A=
LSAs.&nbsp;</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; What is not clear =0A=
is that how does the&nbsp;router with the highest router ID know when =0A=
to</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; start importing =0A=
or exporting LSAs, because it has no knowledge which is the =
current</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; speaker and there =0A=
is no clear way to figure out when it has stopped&nbsp;importing or =0A=
exporting</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; =0A=
LSAs.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; Could you please =0A=
explain how this works ?</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial =0A=
size=3D2>Snigdho</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>
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Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 17:09:53 -0500
From: "Peng He" <peng.he.2000@gmail.com>
To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Drafts not discussed
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
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Yes, I just went to the l2vpn meeting, it was finished within an hour
but with a reservation of 2 hours.

On 11/6/06, Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> Sorry that we didn't get to discuss some of your drafts in the meeting
> today.
>
> Please read the slides on line and discuss on the mailing list.
>
> A
>
> PS We have decided that we need more time at the next IETF meeting
>
>
>
>



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 06 Nov 2006 20:58:58 +0000
Message-ID: <04a901c701e5$fa99caf0$9015a8c0@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
From: "Adrian Farrel" <adrian@olddog.co.uk>
To: <ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
Subject: Drafts not discussed
Date: Mon, 6 Nov 2006 20:55:16 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

Sorry that we didn't get to discuss some of your drafts in the meeting 
today.

Please read the slides on line and discuss on the mailing list.

A

PS We have decided that we need more time at the next IETF meeting 




