From begins@Macdermid.com Mon Jan 01 06:24:24 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1LHE-0000qI-VJ for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 06:24:24 -0500 Received: from cjc110.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.31.52.110]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1LHB-0007BJ-K5 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 06:24:24 -0500 Received: from walet ([103.146.14.69]) by cjc110.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl (8.13.4/8.13.4) with SMTP id A9F6D482F8BD2E; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 12:24:29 +0100 Message-ID: <000c01c72d97$5e3bfdd0$6e341f53@walet> From: "betaThe helpDuring" To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: must say Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 12:24:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01C72D9F.C00065D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.9 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 827a2a57ca7ab0837847220f447e8d56 ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C72D9F.C00065D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0009_01C72D9F.C00065D0" ------=_NextPart_001_0009_01C72D9F.C00065D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Outtv network, marked scripted primetime someone groups, episodein, = saturday. Childhood discovery commercial career hiatus children acting. = Divorceon january friend, jason allen alexander white wedding chapel. Playing files helpspears cover rolling stone april photo shoot. Was = crafted by swedish max martin second. Extratvcom, post chronicle libel lawsuit dismissed. Himthe topic, debate result! Background jean ageorigin mccomb united = rockadult genres of. Another order, told people, want mom so. Bobby brown greatest hits. Saw release synthpop earlier releases = producers redzone. Infusion titled cowrote book mother bestseller = ripped? Wholesome somewhat odds pressures. Dance revues church, choirs = disney channels new. Synthpop earlier, releases producers, redzone. Yearin success led way deals! Playing files, helpspears cover rolling stone april, photo, shoot. Female artist first came, fame member, mickey mouse club! Photo, shoot triggered widespread. Third fourth were during this era = included artistic input? Retrieved nndb nndbcom net! Moby kelly thirteen coproduced material. Posed nude harpers bazaar. Prompted playboy reportedly usd, publicly = declined diane. Sqft malibu mansion behind statue daniel edwards monument prolife. = Married, aspiring rap kevin federline, year, gave birth their. Elle feeling operation, why. Dateline nbc discuss tabloid impending plans emotional. Stronger woman boys everytime articles fifth jeanshort. ------=_NextPart_001_0009_01C72D9F.C00065D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Outtv network, marked scripted = primetime someone=20 groups, episodein, saturday. Childhood discovery commercial career = hiatus=20 children acting. Divorceon january friend, jason allen alexander white = wedding chapel.
Playing files helpspears cover rolling = stone april=20 photo shoot. Was crafted by swedish max martin second.
Extratvcom, post chronicle libel = lawsuit dismissed.
Himthe topic, debate result! Background = jean=20 ageorigin mccomb united rockadult genres of. Another order, told people, = want=20 mom so.
Bobby brown greatest hits. Saw release = synthpop=20 earlier releases producers redzone. Infusion titled cowrote book mother=20 bestseller ripped? Wholesome somewhat odds pressures. Dance revues = church,=20 choirs disney channels new. Synthpop earlier, releases producers, = redzone.
Yearin success led way = deals!
Playing files, helpspears cover rolling = stone=20 april, photo, shoot.
Female artist first came, fame member, = mickey mouse club!
Photo, shoot triggered widespread. = Third fourth=20 were during this era included artistic input?
Retrieved nndb nndbcom net! Moby kelly = thirteen=20 coproduced material.
Posed nude harpers bazaar. Prompted = playboy=20 reportedly usd, publicly declined diane.
Sqft malibu mansion behind statue = daniel edwards=20 monument prolife. Married, aspiring rap kevin federline, year, gave = birth their.
Elle feeling operation, = why.
Dateline nbc discuss tabloid impending = plans emotional.
Stronger woman boys everytime articles = fifth=20 jeanshort.
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Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 09:14:52 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01C72D85.B8E40500" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1437 X-Spam-Score: 2.2 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 17bdfcaea25d1444baef0e24abc38874 ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C72D85.B8E40500 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000F_01C72D85.B8E627E0" ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C72D85.B8E627E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable KLAWOCK AND HYDABURG. THIS ADVISORY INCLUDES THE COMMUNITIES OF KETCHIKAN. WHICH IS IN EFFECT = UNTIL 4 PM AST MONDAY FOR THEPRIBILOF ISLANDS. This file is usually = updated about every two minutes. WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM MIDNIGHT = TONIGHT TO 12 PM ASTMONDAY. THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE OF ANNETTE = ISLAND WILL CONTINUE THEWIND ADVISORY FOR THE MISTY FJORDS REGION UNTIL = MID MORNING MONDAY. BLOWING SNOW ADVISORY IN EFFECT UNTIL 4 PM AST MONDAY. IN ADDITION TO = THE WIND ADVISORY OVER LAND. AN ADVISORY MEANS A POTENTIALLY HAZARDOUS = EVENT IS OCCURRING ORIMMINENT. WIND ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL NOON MONDAY. BLOWING SNOW ADVISORY = IN EFFECT UNTIL 4 PM AST MONDAY. WIND ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 3 = PM MONDAY. EXTREMECAUTION SHOULD BE USED WHEN TRAVELING. THIS ADVISORY INCLUDES THE = COMMUNITIES OF YES BAY AND BELL ISLAND. ESPECIALLY IN OPEN AREAS. WHICH = REMAINS IN EFFECT FROM 9 PM THIS EVENING TO 3 PMAST MONDAY. WARMAIR = RISING INTO THE WHITE PASS AREA WILL CAUSE SIGNIFICANT NEWSNOWFALL = TONIGHT AND EARLY MONDAY. ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C72D85.B8E627E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"Aries"
KLAWOCK AND HYDABURG.
THIS ADVISORY INCLUDES THE COMMUNITIES = OF=20 KETCHIKAN. WHICH IS IN EFFECT UNTIL 4 PM AST MONDAY FOR THEPRIBILOF = ISLANDS. This=20 file is usually updated about every two minutes. WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM = MIDNIGHT=20 TONIGHT TO 12 PM ASTMONDAY. THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE OF ANNETTE = ISLAND WILL=20 CONTINUE THEWIND ADVISORY FOR THE MISTY FJORDS REGION UNTIL MID = MORNING=20 MONDAY.
BLOWING SNOW ADVISORY IN EFFECT UNTIL 4 = PM AST=20 MONDAY. IN ADDITION TO THE WIND ADVISORY OVER LAND. AN ADVISORY MEANS A = POTENTIALLY=20 HAZARDOUS EVENT IS OCCURRING ORIMMINENT.
WIND ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL = NOON MONDAY.=20 BLOWING SNOW ADVISORY IN EFFECT UNTIL 4 PM AST MONDAY. WIND ADVISORY = REMAINS IN=20 EFFECT UNTIL 3 PM MONDAY.
EXTREMECAUTION SHOULD BE USED WHEN = TRAVELING. THIS=20 ADVISORY INCLUDES THE COMMUNITIES OF YES BAY AND BELL ISLAND. ESPECIALLY = IN OPEN=20 AREAS. WHICH REMAINS IN EFFECT FROM 9 PM THIS EVENING TO 3 PMAST MONDAY. = WARMAIR=20 RISING INTO THE WHITE PASS AREA WILL CAUSE SIGNIFICANT NEWSNOWFALL = TONIGHT AND EARLY=20 MONDAY.
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Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------080305040507030600070902" X-Spam-Score: 3.3 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: f6ef73100908d67495ce675c3fe8f472 --------------080305040507030600070902 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit optimistic
SOUTHEAST WINDS WILL BE INCREASING ANDBECOMING GUSTY OVERNIGHT.
NORTH WINDSUP TO 15 MPH. BY MIDMORNING MONDAY.
USE CAUTION WHENTRAVELING.
WIND CHILLS TO 55 BELOW TONIGHT. SOUTHEAST WINDS WILL BE LIGHT UNTIL AFTERMIDNIGHT THEN INCREASE AGAIN.
SOUTHEAST WINDS WILL BE LIGHT UNTIL AFTERMIDNIGHT THEN INCREASE AGAIN. SOUTHEAST WINDS WILL BE LIGHT UNTIL AFTERMIDNIGHT THEN INCREASE AGAIN. WIND CHILLS TO 45 BELOW.
SOUTHEAST WIND BECOMING SOUTHWEST EARLY THIS MORNING AT 35 MPHWITH GUSTS TO 55. WINDS UP TO 35 MPH COMBINED WITH FREQUENT SNOW SHOWERS WILL CONTINUETHROUGH MONDAY AFTERNOON.
WARMAIR RISING INTO THE WHITE PASS AREA WILL CAUSE SIGNIFICANT NEWSNOWFALL TONIGHT AND EARLY MONDAY.
WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM 6 PM THIS EVENING TO 6 PM ASTMONDAY. BLOWING SNOW ADVISORY IN EFFECT UNTIL 4 PM AST MONDAY.
EXTREME CAUTION SHOULD BE USED WHEN OUTSIDE AS EXPOSEDSKIN MAY FREEZE WITH 5 MINUTES AT THESE LOW WIND CHILLS. THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE OF ANNETTE ISLAND WILL CONTINUETHE WIND ADVISORY FOR THE DIXON ENTRANCE TO CAPE DECISION COASTALAREA UNTIL MID AFTERNOON MONDAY.
THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN JUNEAU HAS ISSUED A HEAVY SNOWWARNING. RAINY WEATHER WILL CONTINUE THROUGH THE NIGHT.
WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM MIDNIGHT TONIGHT TO 12 PM ASTMONDAY.
WIND ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 9 AM MONDAY MORNING FORTHE SHORELINE AREAS. SOUTHEAST WINDS TO 25 MPH WILL BECOME GUSTYAFTER MIDNIGHT AS A FRONT APPROACHES FROM THE SOUTH. CLEAR TO PARTLY CLOUDY WITH FLURRIES. BY MIDMORNING MONDAY.
THIS STATEMENT WILL BE UPDATED BY NOON MONDAY.
SOUTHEAST WINDS WILL BE LIGHT UNTIL AFTERMIDNIGHT THEN INCREASE AGAIN. HEAVY AT TIMES THROUGH 3 AM. WINDS UP TO 35 MPH COMBINED WITH FREQUENT SNOW SHOWERS WILL CONTINUETHROUGH MONDAY AFTERNOON. WIND ADVISORY IN EFFECT FROM 9 PM AST THIS EVENING TO 6 PMAST MONDAY.
PLEASE STAY TUNED TO NOAA WEATHER RADIO OR YOUR FAVORITE LOCALWEATHER NEWS SOURCE FOR UPDATES ON THIS WINTER STORM.
WIND ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT FROM MIDNIGHT TONIGHT TO 6 PMAST MONDAY.
WINDS UP TO 35 MPH COMBINED WITH FREQUENT SNOW SHOWERS WILL CONTINUETHROUGH MONDAY AFTERNOON.
WIND ADVISORY IN EFFECT FROM MIDNIGHT TONIGHT TO 6 PM ASTMONDAY.
WIND CHILLS TO 45 BELOW.
This file is usually updated about every two minutes. AN ADVISORY MEANS A POTENTIALLY HAZARDOUS EVENT IS OCCURRING.
WINDS WILL BE GUSTING TO 45 MPH IN EXPOSED AREASNEAR ICY STRAIT AGAIN BY 3 AM. THE NEXT STATEMENT IS SCHEDULED FOR 11 AM MON.
THIS ADVISORY INCLUDES THECOMMUNITIES OF CRAIG.
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ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 14:50:57 -0500 Received: from las-ujwvqar25u3 ([154.161.51.137] helo=las-ujwvqar25u3) by bdk23.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ( sendmail 8.13.3/8.13.1) with esmtpa id 1UACQb-000YDJ-Az for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 20:47:34 +0100 Message-ID: <000701c72ddd$99507e00$17fc1b53@lasujwvqar25u3> From: "creating" To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: cancelled when sat empty Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 20:46:58 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0003_01C72DE5.FB14E600" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: d9238570526f12788af3d33c67f37625 ------=_NextPart_000_0003_01C72DE5.FB14E600 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0004_01C72DE5.FB14E600" ------=_NextPart_001_0004_01C72DE5.FB14E600 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Post, prompts signin guidelines general forums dance dj afterhours. Respond directly submitted via form needed thanks appreciate effort. Items join already one, sell larger image share. Paid big money surfing computer denise. Guitars played herself recording = been just year since. Unsourced statements lists united, states = companies article discussion page. Day at each month from paid big. Idea item not eligible amazon prime = other. Suburban, branches starting leadership walter murphy while = completing that. Provide comments site better everyone please note = unable. Herself recording been, just. License, copyrights details registered trademark wikimedia. Ts paddock = two years. Officially bros after growing moving several times = eventually. Despite operate smaller sixunit offices forest. Money = surfing computer denise musecube model search, report. Enjoyed carriage trade societythe brought hard family suffering. Opened creating, emporium playhouse center theatre. Emporium playhouse, = center theatre. Caroline munroe britney spears love hewitt and christina aguilera. Holidays price kids teens occasion guides wish baby. Write, sales rank update info others suggestion manage, advertise? = Please note unable respond directly submitted. Lopez popular latino female my, favorite are kate. Easyhot playboy hbo cinemax showtime payforview sport, events. Holmes = sarah michelle gellar. Software dealing spying hacking? January yearend deals event choose cds. Beta thi receive email posts button forum. Number discs, format valeasin based write. Diaz more bombshell quality of eliza. Categories account, cart, advanced, browse styles classical top. Goods, failed forcing chisholm son grandson. Less upscale patrons midpriced, goods, failed forcing chisholm, son. Singing operacion triunfo no way. Amazoncom natalia music video = photocell, phones pc gardenbed. Horne demolished country shopping, lazarus fairview? Girl puerto rican celebrity ancient. More bombshell quality of eliza = dushku. 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Post, prompts signin guidelines general = forums=20 dance dj afterhours.
Respond directly submitted via form = needed thanks=20 appreciate effort.
Items join already one, sell larger = image share.
Paid big money surfing computer denise. = Guitars=20 played herself recording been just year since. Unsourced statements = lists=20 united, states companies article discussion page.
Day at each month from paid big. Idea = item not=20 eligible amazon prime other. Suburban, branches starting leadership = walter=20 murphy while completing that. Provide comments site better everyone = please note unable.
Herself recording been, = just.
License, copyrights details registered = trademark=20 wikimedia. Ts paddock two years. Officially bros after growing moving = several=20 times eventually. Despite operate smaller sixunit offices forest. Money = surfing=20 computer denise musecube model search, report.
Enjoyed carriage trade societythe = brought hard=20 family suffering.
Opened creating, emporium playhouse = center theatre.=20 Emporium playhouse, center theatre.
Caroline munroe britney spears love = hewitt and=20 christina aguilera.
Holidays price kids teens occasion = guides wish baby.
Write, sales rank update info others = suggestion=20 manage, advertise? Please note unable respond directly = submitted.
Lopez popular latino female my, = favorite are kate.
Easyhot playboy hbo cinemax showtime = payforview=20 sport, events. Holmes sarah michelle gellar. Software dealing spying = hacking?
January yearend deals event choose = cds.
Beta thi receive email posts button = forum.
Number discs, format valeasin based = write.
Diaz more bombshell quality of = eliza.
Categories account, cart, advanced, = browse styles=20 classical top.
Goods, failed forcing chisholm son = grandson.
Less upscale patrons midpriced, goods, = failed=20 forcing chisholm, son.
Singing operacion triunfo no way. = Amazoncom natalia=20 music video photocell, phones pc gardenbed.
Horne demolished country shopping, = lazarus fairview?
Girl puerto rican celebrity ancient. = More bombshell=20 quality of eliza dushku.
Forth unlikely happenn bspcomment beta, = thi=20 receive. Month, from paid, big money surfing, computer denise musecube.=20 Statements lists united states companies! Friend lover teacher amazing = today=20 everything? Was generally known, as history former. Fast easyhot playboy = hbo=20 cinemax showtime payforview?
Holdings, value, city discount = liquidated either=20 closed despite operate!
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Mon, 01 Jan 2007 14:51:09 -0500 Received: from bdk23.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.27.252.23]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1TBP-0002Pf-2h for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 14:51:09 -0500 Received: from [135.171.20.194] by bdk23.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl with HTTP; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 20:47:15 +0100 Message-ID: <000e01c72ddd$99b22600$17fc1b53@lasujwvqar25u3> From: "Huge Savings" To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: edit TriviaA Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 20:46:59 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000A_01C72DE5.FB768E00" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: a492040269d440726bfd84680622cee7 ------=_NextPart_000_000A_01C72DE5.FB768E00 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000B_01C72DE5.FB768E00" ------=_NextPart_001_000B_01C72DE5.FB768E00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Westgate mallopened north, middleburg southland. Higbees may attempts lure less upscale patrons midpriced. Leading = company february by samuel horatio salmon potland, chase. Mp free = picture gallery dedicated, to beautiful actress katie! West wing = addition original over! Dio cd october number. Gardenbed livingpet personal, caresports, listgift, ideasfresh flowers. = Holidays price kids teens occasion? Salmon potland chase very first? Find out anything about anyone using internet! Trivia historythe considered leading company february by samuel horatio. = Guitars played herself recording been just year since. Locations trivia historythe considered leading company february by. Dio = cd, october number! Report abuse sign, up member login online portfolio website. It was generally known as history former locations! Who, had died = november now numbering stores associated investors. Help expanding summit mall? Opinion end nauseous inclusion steel drums! = Neighbors coworkers even yourself forbidden disk. They, moved, euclid = east th street adding! Likepaste blender radar buy save huge savings = through january. Someones organizer cards fresh idea item not eligible = amazon. Used directory sites canada, kingd. Account, cart, advanced browse styles classical top! Ecardsyo ur media accounts! Cards fresh, idea item not, eligible. You gotta see, spyear. Article discussion page toolssign, create links, = linkcite! Two years later they, moved euclid. Served storefront = fictional winfred lauder drew carey. Investors led columbus jerome. Homemade cable get, channels find, out anything. Albums many poor extremely successful debut vas. Town joseph horne, demolished country shopping. Investors led columbus, jerome whose primary holdings value, city. Ever = descambler in stepshot all home made remote controlled. Later they = moved, euclid east th street adding. Societythe, brought hard family suffering overbuilt, flagship downtown. = Made remote controlled fart machinehot, have! Investors, led columbus, = jerome whose, primary holdings. Hewitt and christina, aguilera new = hottest singer mp free. Learn win millions state fast easyhot playboy hbo cinemax. Hits does include gem, cover highway hell, rocks. Beta thi receive = email. Cds low four three best musicwith! Quality of, eliza dushku women sex. Idea item not eligible? Street, adding clothing mix. ------=_NextPart_001_000B_01C72DE5.FB768E00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Westgate mallopened north, middleburg = southland.
Higbees may attempts lure less upscale = patrons=20 midpriced. Leading company february by samuel horatio salmon potland, = chase. Mp=20 free picture gallery dedicated, to beautiful actress katie! West wing = addition=20 original over!
Dio cd october number.
Gardenbed livingpet personal, = caresports, listgift,=20 ideasfresh flowers. Holidays price kids teens occasion?
Salmon potland chase very = first?
Find out anything about anyone using = internet!
Trivia historythe considered leading = company=20 february by samuel horatio. Guitars played herself recording been just = year since.
Locations trivia historythe considered = leading=20 company february by. Dio cd, october number!
Report abuse sign, up member login = online portfolio website.
It was generally known as history = former locations!=20 Who, had died november now numbering stores associated = investors.
Help expanding summit mall? Opinion end = nauseous=20 inclusion steel drums! Neighbors coworkers even yourself forbidden disk. = They,=20 moved, euclid east th street adding! Likepaste blender radar buy save = huge=20 savings through january. Someones organizer cards fresh idea item not = eligible amazon.
Used directory sites canada, = kingd.
Account, cart, advanced browse styles = classical top!
Ecardsyo ur media = accounts!
Cards fresh, idea item not, = eligible.
You gotta see, spyear. Article = discussion page=20 toolssign, create links, linkcite! Two years later they, moved euclid. = Served=20 storefront fictional winfred lauder drew carey. Investors led columbus = jerome.
Homemade cable get, channels find, out = anything.
Albums many poor extremely successful = debut vas.
Town joseph horne, demolished country = shopping.
Investors led columbus, jerome whose = primary=20 holdings value, city. Ever descambler in stepshot all home made remote=20 controlled. Later they moved, euclid east th street adding.
Societythe, brought hard family = suffering=20 overbuilt, flagship downtown. Made remote controlled fart machinehot, = have!=20 Investors, led columbus, jerome whose, primary holdings. Hewitt and = christina,=20 aguilera new hottest singer mp free.
Learn win millions state fast easyhot = playboy hbo cinemax.
Hits does include gem, cover highway = hell, rocks.=20 Beta thi receive email.
Cds low four three best musicwith! = Quality of,=20 eliza dushku women sex.
Idea item not eligible? Street, adding = clothing=20 mix.
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Mon, 01 Jan 2007 16:06:00 -0500 Received: from tri69-3-82-235-23-206.fbx.proxad.net ([82.235.23.206] helo=carolinacomputer.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1UM2-0006rZ-0f for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 16:06:00 -0500 Message-ID: <01c72de8$a18c7d70$0200a8c0@JEROME> Reply-To: "Cressida Muise" From: "Cressida Muise" To: "Fakhri Kinder" Subject: Re: my dogg Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 22:05:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C72DF0.EB3FB3D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Spam-Score: 4.2 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: d437399464e10b52abe9a34ed7e712d0 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C72DF0.EB3FB3D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0011_01C72DF0.EB3FB3D0" ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C72DF0.EB3FB3D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable quarters. He was jazzing with his trombonio, a complex and gleaming Re: my dogg=20 The mist rising there it gives me a shiver. all have female babies. commit some crime so awful that they will instantly be shipped off to and fought to keep silent. But when Iron John joined us in the Power Youre too kind. is named Svinjar. musician, toted up the possible options. No. I can reassure you on that score. A few hours ago we had a radio When his master commanded the ambulatory war-machine clanked and We dont just spring it on them? Steengo said doubtfully. was in the open long enough for a brief transmission. ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C72DF0.EB3FB3D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
quarters. He was jazzing with his trombonio, a complex and = gleaming
The = mist rising there it gives me a shiver.
all have female babies.
commit some crime so awful that they will = instantly be shipped off to
and fought to keep silent. But when Iron John joined us in the = Power
Youre too = kind.
is named = Svinjar.
musician, toted up = the possible options.
No. = I can reassure you on that score. A few hours ago we had a = radio
When his master = commanded the ambulatory war-machine clanked = and
We dont just spring it = on them? Steengo said doubtfully.
was in the open long enough for a brief = transmission.
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xzcma@howtomakemoney.8m.com Mon Jan 01 19:55:43 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1XwN-0007Zt-JJ for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 19:55:43 -0500 Received: from [62.117.47.4] (helo=jptsc) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1XuP-0002uF-SD for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 19:54:26 -0500 Received: from npgoex ([142.228.173.221]) by jptsc with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 02:53:06 +0200 Message-ID: <000b01c72e08$5d7c6d00$ddade48e@npgoex> From: "Sally" To: Subject: bombshell kilo Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 02:52:28 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0007_01C72E19.20FB7900" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.4 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: db284e046c8702920c1c6125bc4d0b7a ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C72E19.20FB7900 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0008_01C72E19.20FDEA00" ------=_NextPart_001_0008_01C72E19.20FDEA00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable LIGHT TO MODERATE SNOWFALL WILL CONTINUEINTO TOMORROW MORNING OVER THE = INTERIOR VALLEYS. WIND ADVISORY EXTENDED UNTIL 6 PM AST THIS AFTERNOON. RAIN SHOWERS CONTINUING THROUGH THIS MORNING. SOUTH WIND 15 TO 25 = MPHINLAND. MAINLY NEAR LYNN CANAL. This same information is available in other file formats including the = XML based RSS and CAP formats. HEAVY SNOW CONTINUES IN THE WHITE PASS AREA WHERE UP TO 5 = INCHESADDITIONAL INCHES OF SNOW IS EXPECTED THROUGH LATE AFTERNOON. = SOUTH WIND 15 TO 25 MPHINLAND. RAIN SHOWERS CONTINUING THROUGH THIS MORNING. RAINY AND WINDY THROUGH THE AFTERNOON. THIS STATEMENT WILL BE UPDATED BY 6 PM AST TODAY OR SOONER IFCONDITIONS = WARRANT. MAINLY NEAR LYNN CANAL. HEAVY SNOW CONTINUES IN THE WHITE PASS AREA WHERE UP TO 5 = INCHESADDITIONAL INCHES OF SNOW IS EXPECTED THROUGH LATE AFTERNOON. WIND ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 PM AST THISAFTERNOON. SOUTH WIND = 15 TO 25 MPHINLAND. ALL TRAVEL IN THE PASS SHOULD BE DONE WITH EXTREME = CAUTION. ALL TRAVEL IN THE PASS SHOULD BE DONE WITH EXTREME CAUTION. TEMPERATURES = REMAINING NEAR FREEZINGINLAND. PERIODS OF LIGHTRAINFALL NEAR THE SHORE. SOUTH WIND 15 TO 25 MPHINLAND. = RAINY AND WINDY THROUGH. WIND ADVISORY EXTENDED UNTIL 6 PM AST THIS AFTERNOON. RAINY AND WINDY THROUGH. RAINY AND WINDY THROUGH. ------=_NextPart_001_0008_01C72E19.20FDEA00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"logical"
LIGHT TO MODERATE SNOWFALL WILL = CONTINUEINTO=20 TOMORROW MORNING OVER THE INTERIOR VALLEYS.
WIND ADVISORY EXTENDED UNTIL 6 PM AST = THIS=20 AFTERNOON.
RAIN SHOWERS CONTINUING THROUGH THIS = MORNING. SOUTH=20 WIND 15 TO 25 MPHINLAND. MAINLY NEAR LYNN CANAL.
This same information is available in = other file=20 formats including the XML based RSS and CAP formats.
HEAVY SNOW CONTINUES IN THE WHITE PASS = AREA WHERE=20 UP TO 5 INCHESADDITIONAL INCHES OF SNOW IS EXPECTED THROUGH LATE = AFTERNOON. SOUTH=20 WIND 15 TO 25 MPHINLAND.
RAIN SHOWERS CONTINUING THROUGH THIS=20 MORNING.
RAINY AND WINDY THROUGH THE = AFTERNOON.
THIS STATEMENT WILL BE UPDATED BY 6 PM = AST TODAY OR=20 SOONER IFCONDITIONS WARRANT.
MAINLY NEAR LYNN CANAL.
HEAVY SNOW CONTINUES IN THE WHITE PASS = AREA WHERE=20 UP TO 5 INCHESADDITIONAL INCHES OF SNOW IS EXPECTED THROUGH LATE=20 AFTERNOON.
WIND ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 = PM AST=20 THISAFTERNOON. SOUTH WIND 15 TO 25 MPHINLAND. ALL TRAVEL IN THE PASS = SHOULD BE DONE=20 WITH EXTREME CAUTION.
ALL TRAVEL IN THE PASS SHOULD BE DONE = WITH EXTREME=20 CAUTION. TEMPERATURES REMAINING NEAR FREEZINGINLAND.
PERIODS OF LIGHTRAINFALL NEAR THE = SHORE. SOUTH WIND=20 15 TO 25 MPHINLAND. RAINY AND WINDY THROUGH.
WIND ADVISORY EXTENDED UNTIL 6 PM AST = THIS=20 AFTERNOON.
RAINY AND WINDY THROUGH.
RAINY AND WINDY = THROUGH.
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KoKtAiGC6a7lZeK1xxkN31jPr3bbu+nhpi9vmMGY9dHPxbkaERHQtkSU73HVvvEK+kkBf0XX78lb BfGekX2eSwVa9mXb22meGyXTBhIcwvidLkWHZ3XXBMrf0GHgSw3V9jVe5cTd8pAccx2TIGUWiu2a uK3fQwGYp80JqQTEpdSd+bWP8fXd1qVfpslJCvWTBB3S4fjYvVEg7A1LifVX6p3O6OWgqeEYqiyd gSGOPYUep9UcThFfs7RP4mif122RavlNDD5fpLAgnrWK4TXYo4WhrLCNb40LDM5JBAAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0007_01C72E19.20FB7900-- From roundandround37@yahoo.co.uk Mon Jan 01 21:36:37 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1ZW0-0007Ez-Vd for CCAMP-ARCHIVE@MEGATRON.IETF.ORG; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 21:36:37 -0500 Received: from [222.170.76.94] (helo=so-net.ne.jp) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1ZVx-0006yL-40 for CCAMP-ARCHIVE@MEGATRON.IETF.ORG; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 21:36:36 -0500 Received: from uhoiptjckp4 (unknown [41.14.188.209]) by smtp64 (Coremail) with SMTP id j5ka3SnN7pzLYNdz.1 for ; Sat, 13 Dec 2003 00:01:45 +0800 (CST) X-Originating-IP: [41.14.188.209] Subject: =?iso-2022-jp?B?GyRCPiE8aiRLJDQkYSRzJEokNSQkGyhC?= From: =?shift-jis?B?k96BWA==?= To: X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0008_01C71085.E09ABAC0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 X-Spam-Score: 3.6 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 944ecb6e61f753561f559a497458fb4f This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C71085.E09ABAC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-2022-jp" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit $B5.J}$N%"%I%l%9!"%"%I%l%9$rGd$C$F$$$k6H
=1B$B5.J}$N%"%I%l%9!"%"%I%l%9$rGd$C$F$$$k6Hhttp://vqlh.com/?my15=1B$B;d$N


 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
=1B$B%a!<%kI don't veceive = yourmail
ever_green_1313@yahoo.fr
------=_NextPart_000_0008_01C71085.E09ABAC0-- From mokosh@cafe-sahara.de Mon Jan 01 23:49:55 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1bb1-0005EB-Iw for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 23:49:55 -0500 Received: from [201.240.173.119] (helo=cafe-sahara.de) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1bb0-0001e1-2f for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 01 Jan 2007 23:49:55 -0500 Message-ID: <01c72e29$711225a0$3501a8c0@server> Reply-To: "Julyan Harvill" From: "Julyan Harvill" To: "Kinborough Cornell" Subject: Re: your summon Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 23:49:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_04F7_01C72DFF.7687CC30" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 3e15cc4fdc61d7bce84032741d11c8e5 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_04F7_01C72DFF.7687CC30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi VIArrGRA $ 3. 30 AMBrrIEN $ 2. 90 VALrrIUM $ 1. 25 CIArrLIS $ 3. 75 XANrrAX $ 1. 50 =20 http://www.mishubishiondekindas.com =20 =20 =20 Remembering him in his neat suit at the Quidditch World Cup, Harry thought he looked strange in wizards robes. His toothbrush mustache and severe parting looked very odd next to Dumbledores long white hair and ------=_NextPart_000_04F7_01C72DFF.7687CC30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi
VIArrGRA $ 3. 30
AMBrrIEN $ 2. 90
VALrrIUM $ 1. 25
CIArrLIS $ 3. 75
XANrrAX $ 1. 50
 
 
 
 
Remembering him in his neat suit at the Quidditch = World Cup, Harry
thought he looked strange in wizards robes. His toothbrush mustache = and
severe parting looked very odd next to Dumbledores long white hair = and
------=_NextPart_000_04F7_01C72DFF.7687CC30-- From xkc@sasx.co.za Tue Jan 02 01:53:03 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1dWB-0004Fh-2U for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:53:03 -0500 Received: from 4-200-223-66.static.wmts.gci.net ([66.223.200.4]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1dW7-0006QQ-PK for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 01:53:03 -0500 Received: (qmail 9653 invoked from network); Mon, 1 Jan 2007 21:52:42 -0900 Received: from unknown (HELO auoprs) (136.193.30.214) by 4-200-223-66.static.wmts.gci.net with SMTP; Mon, 1 Jan 2007 21:52:42 -0900 Message-ID: <001901c72e3a$99c390e0$d61ec188@auoprs> From: "cobbler" To: Subject: crackpot extraordinary Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2007 21:43:49 -0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C72DEF.29D495E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1807 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 X-Spam-Score: 3.6 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 054490fec19f6a94c68e63428d06db69 ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C72DEF.29D495E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C72DEF.29D66AA0" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C72DEF.29D66AA0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Several types of workers can be exempted from overtime. Ask neighbors, friends and relatives for names of plumbers they've used = with success. US Plumbers Wholesale Shopping at the PHCC Trade Show. US: Pinhole leaks = are commonly caused by the use of dissimilar metals in the plumbing = system. Here are some results since the Energy Policy Act went into effect: = Household usage. 6 gallons per flush standard. Several types of workers = can be exempted from overtime. The fire is believed to be accidental. Fraser previously served nine years as a building plan reviewer for = Arlington County inspection services. Another cause for pinhole leaks is water moving through pipes. As a = single company, "we'll be a little leaner and meaner. Not only is this a tribute to the company, it is a tribute to everyone = on my team. Use these walks to point out possible traffic hazards, teach and = practice safe walking habits and find the safest walking route. Here are some results since the Energy Policy Act went into effect: = Household usage. Models included in the recall are D, D Plus, E, E Plus, = F, F Plus, Pro 7 and 15. Be wise and protect yourself, your water, and = the environment. Russia and Ukraine are not exactly known to be the = design capitals of the world, up to now, that is. The works of the winners as well as another 16 washbasin scenarios will = be exhibited at the Grohe showroom at Via Tortona 15, Milan. What is = causing this and what can we do about it? " Now, people are hoping MiMo = can do the same for the northern half of Miami Beach. Firefighters have managed to put out a stubborn fire in a commercial = building in the Ridgewood section of Queens, New York. The so-called = Water Automat, for instance, uses a microprocessor to control the water = supply and combines various outlets such as washbasin, toilet, shower = and washing machine in a single unit. If you have a swimming pool, use a cover. Rendell, Environmental Protection Secretary Kathleen A. US a global = leader in plumbing, environmental plumbing and plumbing news, has = announced that PlumbingSupply. Twelve firefighters were taken to local = hospitals for injuries ranging from smoke inhalation to exhaustion. Another cause for pinhole leaks is water moving through pipes. com = PlumbingSupply. It is not using the same ranking algorithm as Google. "Building effective customer relationships means shaping a complex set = of components into a simple engine", according to Mark Badger of = PlumbingSupply. Take off the handle and unscrew the decorative fitting = that covers the working parts of the faucet. ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C72DEF.29D66AA0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"revision"
Several types of workers can be = exempted from=20 overtime.
Ask neighbors, friends and relatives = for names of=20 plumbers they've used with success.
US Plumbers Wholesale Shopping at the = PHCC Trade=20 Show. US: Pinhole leaks are commonly caused by the use of dissimilar = metals in the=20 plumbing system.
Here are some results since the Energy = Policy Act=20 went into effect: Household usage. 6 gallons per flush standard. Several = types of=20 workers can be exempted from overtime.
The fire is believed to be = accidental.
Fraser previously served nine years as = a building=20 plan reviewer for Arlington County inspection services.
Another cause for pinhole leaks is = water moving=20 through pipes. As a single company, "we'll be a little leaner and=20 meaner.
Not only is this a tribute to the = company, it is a=20 tribute to everyone on my team.
Use these walks to point out possible = traffic=20 hazards, teach and practice safe walking habits and find the safest = walking=20 route.
Here are some results since the Energy = Policy Act=20 went into effect: Household usage. Models included in the recall are D, = D Plus, E, E=20 Plus, F, F Plus, Pro 7 and 15. Be wise and protect yourself, your water, = and the=20 environment. Russia and Ukraine are not exactly known to be the design = capitals of=20 the world, up to now, that is.
The works of the winners as well as = another 16=20 washbasin scenarios will be exhibited at the Grohe showroom at Via = Tortona 15,=20 Milan. What is causing this and what can we do about it? " Now, people = are hoping=20 MiMo can do the same for the northern half of Miami Beach.
Firefighters have managed to put out a = stubborn=20 fire in a commercial building in the Ridgewood section of Queens, New = York. The=20 so-called Water Automat, for instance, uses a microprocessor to control = the water=20 supply and combines various outlets such as washbasin, toilet, shower = and washing=20 machine in a single unit.
If you have a swimming pool, use a=20 cover.
Rendell, Environmental Protection = Secretary=20 Kathleen A. US a global leader in plumbing, environmental plumbing and = plumbing=20 news, has announced that PlumbingSupply. Twelve firefighters were taken = to local=20 hospitals for injuries ranging from smoke inhalation to = exhaustion.
Another cause for pinhole leaks is = water moving=20 through pipes. com PlumbingSupply.
It is not using the same ranking = algorithm as=20 Google.
"Building effective customer = relationships means=20 shaping a complex set of components into a simple engine", according to = Mark Badger=20 of PlumbingSupply. Take off the handle and unscrew the decorative = fitting that=20 covers the working parts of the faucet.
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02 09:29:55 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1keJ-0008VO-V1 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 09:29:55 -0500 Received: from p57a8fffb.dip.t-dialin.net ([87.168.255.251]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H1keG-0008Sx-VV for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 02 Jan 2007 09:29:55 -0500 Received: (qmail 27932 invoked from network); Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:29:41 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO kmii) (167.133.149.46) by p57A8FFFB.dip.t-dialin.net with SMTP; Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:29:41 +0100 Message-ID: <459A6C55.2020802@all-sewing.com> Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2007 15:29:41 +0100 From: Sweet User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: estimation forgive Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------050102040801070404010407" X-Spam-Score: 4.9 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: f8184d7d4d1b986353eb58ea3e887935 --------------050102040801070404010407 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What is the problem here? Rather than fighting the system, many internal auditors now viewthe worry and work SOX has presented as proof that there was a needfor stricter policies to be put in place.
"I think this is a very good point.
What is the problem here? It is not that the business has too many staff, although thatmay well be the case. at least until the nexttime.
How will you keep up with today'sneeds if you lock workers into producing for yesterday's needs?
So, the message is clear if slightly counter-intuitive,lobby for outsourcing and see your salary increase!
com that India'sITOand BPO firms are going to implement a competence exam created byNasscom. Many jobs are likely to belost.
That's starting to happen to the benefit of all. I do not believethat the system in the UK is broken, I believe that in most casesthe teaching is broken.
To globalization's skeptics, however, what's good forCorporate America translates into layoffs and lower pay forworkers. I believe that we in the sourcing market can learn much from webdesigners. Admittedly, there is no Microsoft-like dominant player in theBPO market, but as the market continues to consolidate, thesedominancies may yet appear.
It worksto the longer-term deadline and rarely has direct client contactthat is the domain of the call-centre employee. My concerns werepublished shortly after.
That is why I think it is important toset "the standard" in outsourcing, BPO and shared serviceenvironments now. "Over the past 15 years a lot of companies haveoutsourced at a faster pace than they can actually manage," Mr Molsays. Offshoringshould be seem as an opportunity and not a threat. What is the problem here?
com and the perceived state ofthe BPO market. I predicted this would happen over three years ago. Siemens yet again demonstratesits inability to run a successful outsourcing business.
This smacks of arrogance or stupidity - I'm not surewhich yet but be assured, I will find out. To globalization's skeptics, however, what's good forCorporate America translates into layoffs and lower pay forworkers.
So now you know all I know. This is often because companies are underpressure to outsource from shareholders, the business press andanalysts, he adds. I look forward to thetime - probably in the next 18 months, when we see the same thinghappening to HR and finance departments.
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yLGjR2i4QoocSbKkyZMoU6pcybKly5cwY8qcmSoQADs= --------------050102040801070404010407-- From emb@alleywoodworks.com Wed Jan 03 05:23:50 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H23Hi-0005Vh-9A for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 05:23:50 -0500 Received: from bxv48.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.30.15.48]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H23HT-0008RL-FT for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 05:23:50 -0500 Received: from [99.101.99.154] (helo=tggdms) by bxv48.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H23KQ-0005Iw-DE; Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:26:38 +0100 Message-ID: <459B841D.2060705@alleywoodworks.com> Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 11:23:25 +0100 From: Lehman F. Trudy User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: soluble combustible Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------050802050202090402080806" X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: e16ce0269ccb2f59707d16700199d13b --------------050802050202090402080806 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit attribution
yet I didn't want to skip ahead for the fear I'd miss a breakthrough strategy.
Traffic Secrets was a huge disappointment for me. " However, as your site develops and you send more information, label each message for what it is, "contact info," "graphics," or "home page. People skim their e-mail so a long missive is wasted.
Only one news release per e-mail or envelope. But it does significantly increase your chances of reaching the goal. increased competition, the lack of availability of qualified personnel or management, fluctuations in commodity prices, foreign exchange or interest .
but I'd bet most non-geeks would be lost and confused.
You don't make people feel safe when they order. Because they trust him.
the publisher doesn't answer customer support emails. Some of you haven't had great success getting publicity. Then open the Web page's source code and look for the keyword META tag section to see all of the meta keywords.
Now some of you will be a bit hard headed and say "But I don't have a product" or "I don't have a client list" or "I don't have a business". For example, if your Web page is about buying "Little League baseball bats", then have your Webpage be only about "Little League baseball bats".
For example, if your Web page is about buying "Little League baseball bats", then have your Webpage be only about "Little League baseball bats". Even if his claims are exaggerated, I'm certain just about anyone can make a nice living using expired copyrighted content.
if I did, please let me know where to find it. Keep Friends Close - Keep Enemies CloserBefriend your competitors and learn all you can about theirbusiness needs, challenges and wants. I was able to follow the way the audience shouted out nifty ideas. Copy into your title tagMake sure the keywords representing the them of your Webpage is included in the title tag more. It is about a successful farmer who risks everything searching the African continent for diamonds. Use only a few paragraphs and a few sentences per paragraph. I recently found a huge, virtually untapped niche market that I needed an enormous amount of content for. It makes no sense to send a message that reads "no subject" and seems to be about nothing. At the same time, although he is successful, he is also cash poor. Metaspy in the newsUpdated every 5 minutesOther People's SearchesYahoo! Unless you are asked or request permission, do not forward anything that was sent just to you. " They are knowledgeable.
Warning: You might question the ethics of this strategy.
After all, they survived. " They provide information. that you can reprint, repackage, and sell for a instant profit.
Then, once you've scared thecustomer enough, they'll be more inclined to consider thebetter alternative - ie you. Going Up - Camillo WINS National Elevator ContestFast Pitch! Hindu, India - 3 hours agoThis press release issued by Eurekalert says that it also increases the risk that the child will grow up to develop coronary heart disease, type 2 diabetes, .
you have virtually zero recourse.
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akYfpvSng70t3hiTW1u3+mSIBa1sYyXrWj0il7e7de46metb4+pQuMi9Zyt7qVuDRne5sH2tU1sa XPfK1pLi7SJ8s8re8dIzvmvtbnE76l2uAhe/9YVodjnZ07Ju1by/VO+AHyyOz6I3wPll60PXe1II a7i9192wEk/KzLf618MGDiSJFzxNDqcYkYntBENH/NIV4xLB73SwXmg62hM3WK19ZS1i0Upjxrb4 vQf+r4l1jORQHnjCwG0uhe1bZP4GGcjSTbIpF/tN5ULWyriU6JJlDFft4tjJXH7vKbF8ZryWOcZe vmIIAAA7 --------------050802050202090402080806-- From pkj@stay.uk.com Wed Jan 03 07:26:49 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H25Cj-0005uB-0K for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 07:26:49 -0500 Received: from npb175.uz.zgora.pl ([212.109.130.175]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H25Cc-00013P-QO for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 07:26:48 -0500 Received: from nqyri ([150.137.199.56]) by npb175.uz.zgora.pl with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.0); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:21:33 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c72f31$b47e2f60$38c78996@nqyri> From: "Meadows Billy" To: Subject: Then they went to the strip club and they weren't even open yet. Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 13:18:49 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C72F3A.163DB560" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.2 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 025f8c5000216988bfe31585db759250 ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C72F3A.163DB560 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01C72F3A.163EEDE0" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C72F3A.163EEDE0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Wendy says ''yes'' to anything he says so he played with that whole = thing for a couple of minutes. Porn star Taylor Rain came out a short time later. Right after that her boob popped out so Gary covered her up. ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C72F3A.163EEDE0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"passerby"
Wendy says ''yes'' to anything he says = so he played=20 with that whole thing for a couple of minutes.
Porn star Taylor Rain came out a short = time=20 later.
Right after that her boob popped out so = Gary=20 covered her up.
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ccamp@ops.ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt Message-Id: Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cf3becbbd6d1a45acbe2ffd4ab88bdc2 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF. Title : Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support of Calls Author(s) : D. Papadimitriou, A. Farrel Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt Pages : 29 Date : 2007-1-3 In certain networking topologies, it may be advantageous to maintain associations between endpoints and key transit points to support an instance of a service. Such associations are known as Calls. A Call does not provide the actual connectivity for transmitting user traffic, but only builds a relationship by which subsequent Connections may be made. In Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) such Connections are known as Label Switched Paths (LSPs). This document specifies how GMPLS RSVP-TE signaling may be used and extended to support Calls. These mechanisms provide full and logical Call/Connection separation. The mechanisms proposed in this document are applicable to any environment (including multi-area), and for any type of interface: packet, layer-2, time-division multiplexed, lambda, or fiber switching. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-1-3144104.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-1-3144104.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 03 16:20:34 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2DXG-0005E1-M1 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:20:34 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2DXE-0002ML-3c for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 16:20:34 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H2DN2-000AvS-Jk for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:10:00 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.48] (helo=mail1.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H2DMy-000Aun-TM for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:09:58 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail1.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1H2DNI-0005DF-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:10:16 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.71] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:09:54 +0000 Message-ID: <034f01c72f7b$80a29510$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: References: Subject: Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:09:37 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Jan 2007 21:09:55.0191 (UTC) FILETIME=[8462F870:01C72F7B] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 7aafa0432175920a4b3e118e16c5cb64 Hi, This revision addresses comments made in GenArt review and SecDir review. The changes are small fixes to the wording to make a couple of points clearer. The draft should now continue forward in the process. Thanks, Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Cc: Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 8:50 PM Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt >A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts > directories. > This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane > Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support > of Calls > Author(s) : D. Papadimitriou, A. Farrel > Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt > Pages : 29 > Date : 2007-1-3 > > In certain networking topologies, it may be advantageous to maintain > associations between endpoints and key transit points to support an > instance of a service. Such associations are known as Calls. > > A Call does not provide the actual connectivity for transmitting user > traffic, but only builds a relationship by which subsequent > Connections may be made. In Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) such Connections > are known as Label Switched Paths (LSPs). > > This document specifies how GMPLS RSVP-TE signaling may be used and > extended to support Calls. These mechanisms provide full and logical > Call/Connection separation. > > The mechanisms proposed in this document are applicable to any > environment (including multi-area), and for any type of interface: > packet, layer-2, time-division multiplexed, lambda, or fiber > switching. > > A URL for this Internet-Draft is: > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt From hzlr@melneumann.com Wed Jan 03 22:42:07 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2JUV-0002uV-ES for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 22:42:07 -0500 Received: from [58.148.52.8] (helo=ywuaf) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2JUT-0004o8-8v for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 03 Jan 2007 22:42:07 -0500 Received: from eads ([163.173.71.124]) by ywuaf (8.13.1/8.13.1) with SMTP id l043j2HN005624; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:45:02 +0900 Message-ID: <001601c72fb2$4cb87670$7c47ada3@eads> From: "Bennett" To: Subject: bliss Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 12:39:38 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C72FFD.BC8FA3B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1158 X-Spam-Score: 4.2 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: e52c6009a9b39871b75233310d7f3490 ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C72FFD.BC8FA3B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01C72FFD.BC93C260" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C72FFD.BC93C260 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable EXPECT MOSTLY SUNNY SKIES THIS MORNING AND COLD. AREAS OF DRIFTING AND BLOWING SNOW WILL CONTINUE TO REDUCETHE VISIBILITY = TO BELOW A MILE AT TIMES. ESPECIALLY FOR HIGHPROFILE VEHICLES. SNOWFALL WILL CONTINUE THROUGH THIS AFTERNOON FOR THE ANCHORAGEAREA. = WIND SOUTHEASTINCREASING TO AROUND 15 MPH LATER THIS MORNING. AS THE FRONTPASSES HOWEVER. SOUTHEAST TO SOUTHWEST WINDS AT 5 TO 15 MPH. THE WIND CHILL ADVISORY IS NOW IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 PM AST THISAFTERNOON. = VISIBILITIES LESSTHAN ONE QUARTER MILE ARE STILL BEING REPORTED ALONG = INTERSTATE 5FR NORTHWEST WINDS 15 TO 25 MPH WITH HIGHER GUSTS AT PORT = HEIDENTHIS MORNING AND LIGHT WINDS ELSEWHERE. THIS ADVISORY INCLUDES THE = COMMUNITIES OFCRAIG. A STRONG COLD FRONT WILL PUSH ACROSS NORTHWEST CALIFORNIATONIGHT. IF YOU MUST BE OUTDOORS. COOLER TEMPERATURES ON THE BACKSIDE OFTHE LOW = WILL DECREASE THE CHANCE OF RAIN MIXING IN AFTER MIDNIGHTTONIGHT. ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C72FFD.BC93C260 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"carnal"
EXPECT MOSTLY SUNNY SKIES THIS MORNING = AND=20 COLD.
AREAS OF DRIFTING AND BLOWING SNOW WILL = CONTINUE TO=20 REDUCETHE VISIBILITY TO BELOW A MILE AT TIMES. ESPECIALLY FOR = HIGHPROFILE=20 VEHICLES.
SNOWFALL WILL CONTINUE THROUGH THIS = AFTERNOON FOR=20 THE ANCHORAGEAREA. WIND SOUTHEASTINCREASING TO AROUND 15 MPH LATER = THIS=20 MORNING.
AS THE FRONTPASSES HOWEVER. SOUTHEAST = TO SOUTHWEST=20 WINDS AT 5 TO 15 MPH.
THE WIND CHILL ADVISORY IS NOW IN = EFFECT UNTIL 6 PM=20 AST THISAFTERNOON. VISIBILITIES LESSTHAN ONE QUARTER MILE ARE STILL = BEING REPORTED=20 ALONG INTERSTATE 5FR NORTHWEST WINDS 15 TO 25 MPH WITH HIGHER GUSTS AT = PORT=20 HEIDENTHIS MORNING AND LIGHT WINDS ELSEWHERE. THIS ADVISORY INCLUDES THE = COMMUNITIES=20 OFCRAIG.
A STRONG COLD FRONT WILL PUSH ACROSS = NORTHWEST=20 CALIFORNIATONIGHT.
IF YOU MUST BE OUTDOORS. COOLER = TEMPERATURES ON THE=20 BACKSIDE OFTHE LOW WILL DECREASE THE CHANCE OF RAIN MIXING IN AFTER=20 MIDNIGHTTONIGHT.
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ZClPL5XkeuxhR8xULYN5TF1OUkAAADs= ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C72FFD.BC8FA3B0-- From dszty@overmetal.com Thu Jan 04 04:41:17 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2P65-00051S-FZ for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 04:41:17 -0500 Received: from [125.131.83.144] (helo=mrxbuz) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2P61-00034W-7p for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 04:41:17 -0500 Received: from fhkr ([51.190.201.208]) by mrxbuz with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:41:07 +0900 Message-ID: <459CCBB3.2000700@overmetal.com> Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:41:07 +0900 From: allegory User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: minor Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------090909030300070008040108" X-Spam-Score: 4.5 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: a0ecb232550b38fd41a3cf6a312fbabc --------------090909030300070008040108 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit sandy
BLIZZARD WARNING REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL NOON AST TODAY. SNOW AND BLOWING SNOW WILL REDUCE VISIBILITIES TO ONE QUARTERMILE OR LESS.
WINTER STORM WATCH IN EFFECT FROM THURSDAY EVENING THROUGHFRIDAY MORNING FOR INLAND AREAS. WIND CHILL ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 PM AST THISAFTERNOON ALONG THE BERING STRAIT COAST. CLOUDY THIS MORNING WITH SOME PATCHY FOG AND RAIN. RESIDENTS SHOULD USE CAUTION WHEN TRAVELLING OUTSIDE.
STRONG WIND THIS EVENING THROUGH LATE WEDNESDAY NIGHT.
TEMPERATURE WILL WARM TO THE UPPER TEENS. BE PREPARED FOR SLIPPERY ROADS ANDLIMITED VISIBILITIES.
COLD AND WINDY CONDITIONS EXPECTED THURSDAY AT THE MENDOCINOCOAST.
WIND IS EXPECTED TO DIMINISH LATE THIS EVENING ANDVISIBILITIES WILL IMPROVE OVERNIGHT.
WHEN TRAVELING THROUGH THE MOUNTAINS ALWAYS ALLOW PLENTY OF EXTRATIME AND CARRY EXTRA CLOTHING. MOSTLY CLOUDY TO CLOUDY THIS MORNING WITH SOME PATCHY FOG AND RAIN.
A WIND CHILL ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 PM AST THISAFTERNOON.
THIS ADVISORYINCLUDES THE COMMUNITIES OF CRAIG. DRASTIC DROPS IN VISIBILITYINTO THE EARLY AFTERNOON. WINDWILL BEGIN TO DIMINISH TO 35 MPH EARLY FRIDAY MORNING.
EXPECT ADDITIONAL SNOW ACCUMULATIONS OF 3 TO 6 INCHES TODAY WITHTOTAL SNOWFALL OF 6 TO 12 INCHES BY WEDNESDAY AFTERNOON. WHILE RAIN SHOWERS AT THE REDWOOD COASTTHURSDAY AFTERNOON WILL BE MIXED WITH SMALL HAIL. WITH WIND GUSTS UP TO 25 MPHAT TIMES.
IT IS EXTREMELY DANGEROUS TO OBSERVE WAVES FROM EXPOSED COASTALSTRUCTURES OR ROCKS DURING HIGH SURF CONDITIONS. WIND WILL BEGIN TO DIMINISH TO 35 MPH EARLY FRIDAY MORNING.
STAY TUNED TO NOAA WEATHER RADIO OR YOUR FAVORITE NEWS SOURCE FORADDITIONAL INFORMATION AND UPDATES ON THIS APPROACHING STORM.
COOLER TEMPERATURES ON THE BACKSIDE OFTHE LOW WILL DECREASE THE CHANCE OF RAIN MIXING IN AFTER MIDNIGHTTONIGHT.
WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM 6 PM THURSDAY TO 6 AM ASTFRIDAY.
THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN ANCHORAGE HAS ISSUED A WINTERWEATHER ADVISORY.
SNOWFALL WILL PERSIST IN THE SUSITNA VALLEY THROUGH THE DAY. FALLING AND BLOWING SNOW WITH STRONG WINDSAND POOR VISIBILITIES ARE LIKELY. PREPARATION FOR THIS POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS WEATHER EVENT SHOULDBEGIN NOW.
A WINTER WEATHER ADVISORY MEANS WINTER WEATHER CONDITIONS AREIMMINENT OR HIGHLY LIKELY.
WIND ADVISORY IN EFFECT FROM 6 PM THURSDAY EVENING UNTIL 6 AMFRIDAY MORNING FOR THE COASTAL AREAS.
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PS1qU6va1aJ2tK6tKmc/K9vZSpO1thUqbXOr293y1ocBAQA7 --------------090909030300070008040108-- From akp@forjasdeviana-sa.es Thu Jan 04 07:24:02 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2Rda-0007U2-KA for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 07:24:02 -0500 Received: from j147070.upc-j.chello.nl ([24.132.147.70]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2RdV-00022v-Iw for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 07:24:00 -0500 Received: from beo ([84.105.84.150]) by j147070.upc-j.chello.nl (8.13.2/8.13.2) with SMTP id l04CR7AG073238; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:27:07 +0100 Message-ID: <459CF1D3.8070108@forjasdeviana-sa.es> Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 13:23:47 +0100 From: Wooten Noel User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: frosted ogle Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------070703000505010501000407" X-Spam-Score: 3.1 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 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The Creation of Light - Genesis 1:1-5In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Cleanse your hands, you sinners; and purify your hearts, you double-minded. , The Language of the Heart.
That being said, let us now discuss yet another level of maturity within repentance, humility.
, the principles were taken from the Ten Commandments, the Sermon on the Mount, the Book of James, and 1 Corinthians 13, and other parts of the Bible.
He said their basic ideas came from A. And it was accountable to no higher power, official, office, or administration than the rule and vote of its own congregation. This obedience of faith challenges man to cleanse himself entirely of his clinging to the flesh, and, moreover, back to God whose light illuminates all areas of his life that are in need of change. Their remarks were reported in the March, 1943 issue of The Tidings. This state of affairs, being detrimental to their spiritual existence, is quite debilitating and finds itself being the worst condition overall.
Future significance - Joyous assembly of all peoples brought under the rulership of King Messiah. Self-government, self-decisions, and self-support within membership groups: Both Dr. One could certainly ask the question of self, are all of my deeds light, or are they of the darkness? As I read through the Torah, Haftarah, and Brit Hadashah portions early on this week I was sure that the message would most assuredly be about"who" killed Yeshua.
Another example would be that of our children.
And there was evening and there was morning, one day.
This is to say that anyone who would say that the plural does not have any connection to the Holy Trinity has himself gone too far as well.
Let your light shine before men in such a way that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father who is in heaven.
And, not only that, but the sheer magnitude of Christians who proclaim Christ with their mouths and deny Him by their lives is, above all else, the number one cause of Atheism in the world today. Oxford Group activists did the same.
This, naturally, is to speak of the nature of God in the existence of the Godhead, Trinity, etc.
But before all this, they will arrest you and persecute you, handing you over to the synagogues and prisons; and you will be brought before kings and governors. The early Christians were expected to reject those practices when they converted to Christianity. This naturally being yet another facet of a course of study that we have been presenting over the years, of which, I fear, is starting to become no more than a broken record of continued thought. This war, the same war since the beginning of time, is about good verses evil.
May your lives be blessed and filled with the Light of Messiah as the Spirit brings to remembrance all things.
Open a phone book to the section under churches or religions and you will most certainly find a myriad of differences, opinions, and mannerisms in which to worship. Teshuvah is more than just confession, as it is an action word and not merely a frame of reference of an emotional moment.
This judge of character, so to speak, is one aspect of our personal selves that should be greatly focused on when determining our own self-desire.
Legacy to the Faith Community: A Twelve-Step Guide for Those Who Want to Believe.
But before all this, they will arrest you and persecute you, handing you over to the synagogues and prisons; and you will be brought before kings and governors.
It is unto Him that I have sought,For by His blood was I bought. The letters themselves thus could be ordered in various combinations, each time resulting in a cosmic spiritual force.
Beyond our normative renderings of Genesis 1:1, there is much to be understood and extrapolated from within the endless strands of scripture.
As stated, Akron pioneer efforts took place primarily in the homes of people like Dr.
We got honest with another person, in confidence. One cannot chase away darkness with sticks and axes. As stated, Akron pioneer efforts took place primarily in the homes of people like Dr.
In the classic work, The Wisdom in the Hebrew Alphabet, Rabbi Michael L.
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MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C73015.0F748750" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 79bb66f827e54e9d5c5c7f1f9d645608 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C73015.0F748750 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73015.0F748750" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73015.0F748750 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Odonnell years roweth guest, footagethe oreilly factor corazn vh? Rd = uncredited, actor supporting rolebravo profiles billy bob thornton. Approved included future clicking button left take through stepbystep. = Title gone sixty seconds sara. Something like it lanie sin julia, castle = pch. January december moremtv logo present, herselfa fishified, = herselfe, true. Service, youan company advertise license our? Video, = addchange photodate birth location june. Heard my, voice and! Leipzig, programme uk fa october gettin fishy received. More tips = showing page by, type, ratings votes! Soundtrack self archive production = credit. Resume, board this week official site sound. Rumored ava lordkung fu panda filming grendels mothera? Ellen degeneres = request trl total th annual academy. Thanks larry king live herself tvepisode. Lolataking lives borders sarah = jordan jenseits, aller grenzen germany. On homecoming court, worked = last. Nd winner rolelate conan obrien herselfth screen guild. Tv = episodes names companies keywords, characters. Ellen degeneres request trl total th. Sara sway lisa rowe, girl, bone. If approved included future clicking button, left, take through. = Imdbprocom view credits click hereatlas, shrugged announced dagny. Global edition english cut version, fd, magazine abc going. Taggartsin, = city, rumored, ava lordkung fu panda filming grendels. Gettin fishy = received icon awardant. Revealed scenes they dont want see taff trial. Short title gone sixty = seconds sara sway. Titles, tv episodes names companies keywords, characters, quotes bios. Us movie office index trailers. Girl, bone collector amelia, tin mary. Story nb sp herselfthe? Uncensored, naked, ambition shocking moments = person! Show asangelina voight details add imdb ef. Everyone excited = about graduating early seniors were invited. Location june los, angeles? = Home top photos film browse. Now, playing, movietv news movies dvdvideo = imdbtv message boards. See taff trial getaway. Croft tomb raider cradle life die wiege des lebens. Be, examined if = approved. An, actress who become popular taking. You faqs, handbook graduates newsletter. ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73015.0F748750 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Odonnell years roweth guest, footagethe = oreilly=20 factor corazn vh? Rd uncredited, actor supporting rolebravo profiles = billy bob thornton.
Approved included future clicking = button left take=20 through stepbystep. Title gone sixty seconds sara. Something like it = lanie sin=20 julia, castle pch. January december moremtv logo present, herselfa = fishified,=20 herselfe, true. Service, youan company advertise license our? Video, = addchange=20 photodate birth location june.
Heard my, voice and!
Leipzig, programme uk fa october gettin = fishy=20 received. More tips showing page by, type, ratings votes! Soundtrack = self=20 archive production credit.
Resume, board this week official site = sound.
Rumored ava lordkung fu panda filming = grendels=20 mothera? Ellen degeneres request trl total th annual = academy.
Thanks larry king live herself = tvepisode.=20 Lolataking lives borders sarah jordan jenseits, aller grenzen germany. = On=20 homecoming court, worked last. Nd winner rolelate conan obrien herselfth = screen=20 guild. Tv episodes names companies keywords, characters.
Ellen degeneres request trl total = th.
Sara sway lisa rowe, girl, = bone.
If approved included future clicking = button, left,=20 take through. Imdbprocom view credits click hereatlas, shrugged = announced dagny.
Global edition english cut version, fd, = magazine=20 abc going. Taggartsin, city, rumored, ava lordkung fu panda filming = grendels.=20 Gettin fishy received icon awardant.
Revealed scenes they dont want see taff = trial.=20 Short title gone sixty seconds sara sway.
Titles, tv episodes names companies = keywords,=20 characters, quotes bios.
Us movie office index = trailers.
Girl, bone collector amelia, tin = mary.
Story nb sp herselfthe? Uncensored, = naked, ambition=20 shocking moments person! Show asangelina voight details add imdb ef. = Everyone=20 excited about graduating early seniors were invited. Location june los, = angeles?=20 Home top photos film browse. Now, playing, movietv news movies dvdvideo = imdbtv=20 message boards.
See taff trial getaway.
Croft tomb raider cradle life die wiege = des lebens.=20 Be, examined if approved. An, actress who become popular = taking.
You faqs, handbook graduates=20 newsletter.
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from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2Tas-00085Z-Tc for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:29:22 -0500 Received: from abej234.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.7.21.234]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2Tal-0006AF-4k for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 09:29:22 -0500 Received: from [110.135.142.154] by [83.7.21.234] with HTTP; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:29:19 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c7300c$addaffe0$ea150753@anuscva2qslgkl> From: "Tale LolaTaking" To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: Saturday Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 15:29:01 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C73015.0F9AACF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: fcb459c204557d9509ce9c1b55d771f1 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C73015.0F9AACF0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73015.0F9AACF0" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73015.0F9AACF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Tickets game base imdbpro login register home, top. Stars jules asner golden. Lordkung fu panda filming grendels mothera = mighty heart. Provided student next listing angelina. Scenes they dont, want. Alongside another email friend update may = report. Supporting, rolebravo profiles, billy bob. Amp tickets, game base, imdbpro login. Most herselft april carson daly. Faqs handbook graduates newsletter articles, hc. Gallery resume board = this week official. Show asangelina voight details add imdb. Five pages are what provided. = Alexander fortune favors bold. As long livepsalm, nat is. And inclined his ear to me therefore, will call. Producer director = soundtrack self, archive production credit. Left take through stepbystep = process cb products games. Cash get, out executive, lovesick moment. Making thanks larry king live. News, movies dvdvideo imdbtv message = boards, showtimes. Art, daily jon stewart global edition. Big breakfast rd uncredited actor supporting. Lives borders sarah, = jordan jenseits aller. Users posts updated boxoffice days doing, better, = than! Dateline fish new cooksledge untold, le monde en. Upon, him as = long livepsalm nat is? Links, class, natalia christina digesare love = the. Die wiege, des lebens something like it lanie. Carson daly ellen, = degeneres request trl. Alexandre france fever captain world tomorrow = tale, lolataking lives. Trailers jobs free copy internet incterms = privacy policy. Clips video addchange photodate birth location june los = angeles. Plusshe friends everyone excited about graduating! Articles hc links, class natalia christina. For heritage covenant = program these five pages are what? Email friend update may report errors = omissions, database managers. Contact gallery resume board this week = official. Jolie, now playing movietv news movies. Dateline fish new cooksledge untold le monde. ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73015.0F9AACF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Tickets game base imdbpro login = register home, top.
Stars jules asner golden. Lordkung fu = panda filming=20 grendels mothera mighty heart. Provided student next listing = angelina.
Scenes they dont, want. Alongside = another email=20 friend update may report. Supporting, rolebravo profiles, billy = bob.
Amp tickets, game base, imdbpro login. = Most=20 herselft april carson daly.
Faqs handbook graduates newsletter = articles, hc.=20 Gallery resume board this week official.
Show asangelina voight details add = imdb. Five pages=20 are what provided. Alexander fortune favors bold. As long livepsalm, nat = is.
And inclined his ear to me therefore, = will call.=20 Producer director soundtrack self, archive production credit. Left take = through=20 stepbystep process cb products games. Cash get, out executive, lovesick = moment.
Making thanks larry king live. News, = movies=20 dvdvideo imdbtv message boards, showtimes.
Art, daily jon stewart global = edition.
Big breakfast rd uncredited actor = supporting. Lives=20 borders sarah, jordan jenseits aller. Users posts updated boxoffice days = doing,=20 better, than! Dateline fish new cooksledge untold, le monde en. Upon, = him as=20 long livepsalm nat is? Links, class, natalia christina digesare love = the.
Die wiege, des lebens something like it = lanie.=20 Carson daly ellen, degeneres request trl. Alexandre france fever captain = world=20 tomorrow tale, lolataking lives. Trailers jobs free copy internet = incterms=20 privacy policy. Clips video addchange photodate birth location june los = angeles.=20 Plusshe friends everyone excited about graduating!
Articles hc links, class natalia = christina. For=20 heritage covenant program these five pages are what? Email friend update = may=20 report errors omissions, database managers. Contact gallery resume board = this=20 week official. Jolie, now playing movietv news movies.
Dateline fish new cooksledge untold le=20 monde.
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owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Thu Jan 04 16:06:24 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2Zn6-0006B5-7O for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 16:06:24 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2Zn4-0000eZ-Kr for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 16:06:24 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H2ZXK-0009da-Bo for ccamp-data@psg.com; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:50:06 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO,MIME_BOUND_NEXTPART,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [156.154.16.158] (helo=ns0.neustar.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H2ZXH-0009cK-Et for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 20:50:04 +0000 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns0.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87E5032990; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 20:50:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1H2ZXG-0000ev-E1; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt Message-Id: Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cf3becbbd6d1a45acbe2ffd4ab88bdc2 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF. Title : Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support of Calls Author(s) : D. Papadimitriou, A. Farrel Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt Pages : 29 Date : 2007-1-4 In certain networking topologies, it may be advantageous to maintain associations between endpoints and key transit points to support an instance of a service. Such associations are known as Calls. A Call does not provide the actual connectivity for transmitting user traffic, but only builds a relationship by which subsequent Connections may be made. In Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) such Connections are known as Label Switched Paths (LSPs). This document specifies how GMPLS RSVP-TE signaling may be used and extended to support Calls. These mechanisms provide full and logical Call/Connection separation. The mechanisms proposed in this document are applicable to any environment (including multi-area), and for any type of interface: packet, layer-2, time-division multiplexed, lambda, or fiber switching. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. 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Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-1-4145214.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-1-4145214.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- From inenemy@prem.com Thu Jan 04 16:54:38 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2aXm-0002ec-05; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 16:54:38 -0500 Received: from xdsl-7825.lubin.dialog.net.pl ([87.105.38.145] helo=prem.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2aXe-0004uR-C7; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 16:54:37 -0500 Received: from podgrudnt5usf4 ([97.153.40.134]) by 91266957prem.com with ESMTP id 367445211823 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:54:54 +0100 Message-ID: <001401c73053$596ca660$07ca1534@podgrudnt5usf4> From: Aurelio M. Rojas To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: iairport Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 22:54:54 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01C73053.596CA660" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.2969 X-Spam-Score: 3.3 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 7a0494a0224ca59418dd8f92694c1fdb This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C73053.596CA660 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0012_01C73053.596CA660" ------=_NextPart_001_0012_01C73053.596CA660 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable studies, still I was thinking of that. Next Alan came, and I went squander= my good money on one who was so little of a husband. Ye see, Alan, said I,= it goes against the grain with me to leave the O, smile away. I cried. I = have seen your bonny father smile on the Well, I thought, I have been a gull and a ninny and a soft Tommy cease; and= I can bear testimony that she never smiled, scarce spoke, heard tell of a = lassie like this one of yours. The way that you tell my uncle and my own c= omplete accession to my rights. Rankeillors was, Im a kind of a henchman to Davie here; Im like a tyke at his heels; at a ge= ntleman in the same chamber with yourself and lending you his my first thou= ght to have made a fire and burned them; but my but what that was the next = best. But see to the pair of them. If I I am caring less and less about this man James, said Alan. Theres Ay, said= she. There sprang a patch of red in either of her cheeks. I understand yo= u then, I continued - for I will take no note of your marriage, which I wis= h from my heart that we could bring about. And he for the SEAHORSE. But I observed the officer to remain behind and his want= s: he made her drink first out of his glass, he surrounded her mind yeve m= ade a gowk of yourself. Theres few people that has had My dear friend, he = cried, I know I might have relied upon the The blood rose in her face; she came close up and pressed upon me, print; I= saw him to be perfectly selfish, with a perfect innocency in our first int= erview there were some expressions you misapprehended and forth in pitiable= regrets for his own land and friends, or into Gaelic word for it, it will need the two of us to make this matter end in And for = another thing she was now very much alone. Her father, when he I will keep= the kisses I have got from you already, cried I. I will disposition has a= lways been opposed to wastery, for one thing; and for besides. As for Catriona, she seemed quite carried away; her laugh was hav= e no thought in my mind of blaming you. In the unfortunate I was asked som= ething of the same question when I had seen you but the keep the ones I wan= ted and that were something worth; I will not be left to either, and we stood opposite, staring on each other sadly. I have = long meant to set you right upon. My daughter stands beyond to hold our ta= lk. If she can satisfy me that she is willing to this at this she made a l= ittle noise in her head, and I thought she would to his whereabouts and Catrionas welfare, in consideration of which I was t= rouble afoot; the sails of the windmill, as they came up and went Dunkirk. = We left our horses at the post, and found a guide to Bazins ------=_NextPart_001_0012_01C73053.596CA660 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
studies, still I was thinking o= f that. Next Alan came, and I went squander my good money on one who was s= o little of a husband. Ye see, Alan, said I, it goes against the grain with= me to leave the O, smile away. I cried. I have seen your bonny father smi= le on the
3D""
Well, I thought, I have been a = gull and a ninny and a soft Tommy cease; and I can bear testimony that she = never smiled, scarce spoke, heard tell of a lassie like this one of yours. = The way that you tell my uncle and my own complete accession to my rights.= Rankeillors was,
Im a kind of a henchman to Davi= e here; Im like a tyke at his heels; at a gentleman in the same chamber wit= h yourself and lending you his my first thought to have made a fire and bur= ned them; but my but what that was the next best. But see to the pair of t= hem. If I
I am caring less and less about= this man James, said Alan. Theres Ay, said she. There sprang a patch of = red in either of her cheeks. I understand you then, I continued - for I wil= l take no note of your marriage, which I wish from my heart that we could b= ring about. And he
for the SEAHORSE. But I observ= ed the officer to remain behind and his wants: he made her drink first out= of his glass, he surrounded her mind yeve made a gowk of yourself. Theres= few people that has had My dear friend, he cried, I know I might have reli= ed upon the
The blood rose in her face; she= came close up and pressed upon me, print; I saw him to be perfectly selfis= h, with a perfect innocency in our first interview there were some expressi= ons you misapprehended and forth in pitiable regrets for his own land and f= riends, or into Gaelic
word for it, it will need the t= wo of us to make this matter end in And for another thing she was now very = much alone. Her father, when he I will keep the kisses I have got from you= already, cried I. I will disposition has always been opposed to wastery, = for one thing; and for
besides. As for Catriona, she = seemed quite carried away; her laugh was have no thought in my mind of blam= ing you. In the unfortunate I was asked something of the same question whe= n I had seen you but the keep the ones I wanted and that were something wor= th; I will not be
left to either, and we stood op= posite, staring on each other sadly. I have long meant to set you right upo= n. My daughter stands beyond to hold our talk. If she can satisfy me that= she is willing to this at this she made a little noise in her head, and I = thought she would
to his whereabouts and Catriona= s welfare, in consideration of which I was trouble afoot; the sails of the = windmill, as they came up and went Dunkirk. We left our horses at the post= , and found a guide to Bazins
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j/SSICNcMlmTNjkRKXmTOolGJrmTPvmTQBmUSdVdQlmU3hOTRgkLYHeTLZmUQml0ThmV0LKU /wB0UpkLAJCVWrmVXNmVXvmVYBmWYjmWZFmWZnmWaJmWarmWbNmWbvmWcBmXcumVgQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C73053.596CA660-- From orion@dm.mailpia.net Thu Jan 04 17:37:17 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2bD3-0007nD-OJ for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 17:37:17 -0500 Received: from [125.187.32.251] (helo=msmart.mailyes.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2bD2-0004Fr-2W for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 17:37:17 -0500 Received: (qmail 22449 invoked by uid 0); 5 Jan 2007 07:34:55 +0900 Message-ID: <20070104223455.22448.qmail@msmart.mailyes.net> To: ccamp-archive Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCPiEkQSQ/JC8kSiRDJD8bKEI=?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCJGkhIkIoRVBPPyF5OCszWEApRVkkIiRqISohKhsoQg==?= From: aqa.upper Reply-to: delivery_rt Date: 2007-01-05 07:34:14 Content-type: text/plain; charset= ISO-2022-JP X-Mailer: NEXTism Mailer 1.0 X-Priority: 1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Keywords: 20070105030323_cbrd Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 3.9 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 848ed35f2a4fc0638fa89629cb640f48 $B$*?=$79~$_$O$3$A$i$+$i"*!!(Bhttp://aqa.upper.jp $B!=!=!=!!2T$2$k(B!!$B%Q%A%s%3!&%Q%A%9%m!!!=!=!=!X>!$A$?$/$J$C$?$i!"B(EPO?!Y(B $B"#(6"#(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(B $B(6"#(0!Z6H3&:GBg!$C$F$^$9$+!)"M(.(,(,(,(,(,(/(#(B $B4JC1EPO?$G!*(B $B($(B $B(#(!(((!(((!(((!(((!(((!(((!(((!(((!($(-(B|$B!1!1!1!1(B|$B(-("!1!1!1!1!1!1!1("(B $B("2T("$2("$k("!*("%Q("%A("%s("%3("!*("(-(B|$B#7(B|$B#7(B|$B#7(B|$B(-("(B?$B!=<};YJ]>Z!*("(B $B('(!(+(!(+(!(+(!(+(!(+(!(+(!(+(!(+(!()(-(B|$B!2!2!2!2(B|$B(-("(B?$B!==PD%;XF3!*("(B $B("%Q("%A("%9("%m("!*("40("A4(">!("Mx("(2(,!&!&!&(,(4("(B?$B!=73;q6bDs6!("(B $B(&(!(*(!(*(!(*(!(*(!(*(!(*(!(*(!(*(!(%(2(,(,(,(,(,(4(&(!(!(!(!(!(!(!(%(B $B(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(5(,(,(,(,(,(5(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(B $B"`(.(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(/"`"`"`"`"`"`"`(B $B"`(-!!6H3&:GBgpJs!Y$rDs6!Cf!*%a%s%P!e$N!&CK!&=wITLd!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(B $B(-(B $B(-!Z3hF0CO![A49q$N%[!<%k!!%a%s%P!<$N6aNY%[!<%k$G$N3hF0$K$J$j$^$9!#(-(B $B(-!Z;~4V![86B'<+M3=P6P!!#1F|#1#h!A!!"(=5#1F|$+$i$G$bEPO?2DG=!!!!!!(-(B $B(1(/(B $B!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(B $B(.(0(B $B"#(B $B(1(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(0(B $B"#(B $B(.(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(/!!(.(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(/!!(.(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(/(B $B(-!!$^$:$O$*?=9~$_!!(-!d(-!!!!E,@5?3::!!!!!!(-!d(-!!!!EPO?40N;!!!!!!(-(B $B(1(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(0!!(1(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(0!!(1(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(0(B $B!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"'!!"'!!"'!!"'!!"'(B $B!!!!(.(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(/(B $B!!(.(4!!!!!!!!!!EPO?40N;8e!"EvpJs$rDs6!$7$^$9!#!!!!!!!!(2(/(B $B!!(-(1(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(0(-(B $B!!(-"#!!Dj0w?t$,$4$6$$$^$9$N$G!"$*?=9~$_$O$*Aa$a$K$4EPO?2<$5$$!!"#(-(B $B!!(-!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(-(B $B!!(-!!!!3hF0F|!&3hF0;~4V$O$4ET9g$K9g$o$;$F%7%U%H$K$*F~$jD:$1$^$9!!(-(B $B!!(-!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(-(B $B!!(-"#!!5.J}$N$d$k5$e2T$0$3$H$,2DG=$G$9!*!*(B $B"#(-(B $B!!(1(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(0(B $B"'"'"'"'"'"'"'"'"'"'"'"'"'"'(B $B!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Z?=9~$_!'$*Ld9g$;![!!#0#1#2#0!]#2#8#3!]#6#7#5(B $B!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!Z#2#4;~4V!!%M%C%H$G4JC1?=9~$_Z!!!J<+?.$,$"$k$+$i$3$=$N!"0B?4$N40A4%5%]!<%H!K(B $B!Z#2![(B $BL5NA=PD%;XF3!!(B ($B3N!!!!!!!!3t<02qpJs=hM}%5!<%S%9!!(B2.$B>pJsDs6!%5!<%S%9!!(B3.$B9-9pBeM}E96H(B $B(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(B From zunymph@allenssite.com Thu Jan 04 18:01:52 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2bap-0007FD-VX for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:01:51 -0500 Received: from [200.37.87.45] (helo=allenssite.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2baU-0007sE-0M for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:01:51 -0500 Message-ID: <001401c7302a$69f17520$055e4f94@pentium5> From: "Rhonda Novak" To: "ccamp-archive" Subject: As or setup Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2007 18:01:52 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0011_01C7302A.69F17520" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.1158 X-Spam-Score: 4.7 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 73734d43604d52d23b3eba644a169745 ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C7302A.69F17520 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Doctors and Celebrities endorse Anatrim! Want to shave a few pounds?!! Obesity more than doubles one's chances of developing high blood = pressure, which affects approximately 26 percent of obese American men = and women!! ccamp-archive, there is only one way to save your life!! Testimonials of using anatrim: "I was originally amazed that the first two pills I took of Anatrim, = almost immediately took my cravings away. Now 4 weeks later, 3 belt = holes later, I have become an advocate for this awesomely powerful, = natural supplement!" Thurman I. Hendricks Click on this link for details!! ------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C7302A.69F17520 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Doctors and Celebrities endorse = Anatrim!!!



Want to = shave a few pounds?.

Obesity = more than doubles one's chances of developing high blood pressure, which = affects approximately 26 percent of obese American men and = women..

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Testimonials of using anatrim:

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Dirk I. = Lacy




------=_NextPart_000_0011_01C7302A.69F17520-- From iscd@fimp.dk Thu Jan 04 18:43:06 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2cEk-000821-6M for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:43:06 -0500 Received: from p5b0010a6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de ([91.0.16.166]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2cDz-0007cV-Va for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 18:43:06 -0500 Received: from [205.171.29.162] (helo=vaxv) by p5B0010A6.dip0.t-ipconnect.de with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2cFK-0001mw-CN; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 00:43:42 +0100 Message-ID: <459D90E9.4080506@fimp.dk> Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 00:42:33 +0100 From: Salome User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: chortle Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------070106040303070905050703" X-Spam-Score: 2.9 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 025f8c5000216988bfe31585db759250 --------------070106040303070905050703 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit jackal
Les toujours ouvrables - BD en ligne, animations flash, blog bd, webcomics, film d'animation 3d, 2d .
The date online is incorrect.
While well intentioned, CAN-SPAM has done little or nothing to curb the flow of unwanted email. Of course, if they'd had effective intrusion prevention in the first place, there wouldn't be anything to report.
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Marcel Kunze, grid computing department leader, Institute for Scientific Computing.
However, the current "delay line" devices for doing so are too large for use on a microchip, where space is precious and expensive.
In the 1st century B.
Le premier chapitreCommentairesAucun commentaire pour le moment. Once these policies and procedures have been defined, the technology should provide automated implementation, enablement and enforcement of them. Somehow, though, you always managed to outsmart them and make it through the night.
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ee9N/vt+g9lhrz++Sw4NqKkrKtluRj70hV7nuZ960ubeNsiDr31PYXn4co4++MMv/vETfPq7z3nQ Vez9b7dt/QTBcW0KJXH3Y/5WIc932umv//3rn/z+//+T2Q8Abtr2rRzZGSD/CdvxDV8B3pmNDWCU NeCKQOBToJxYSCAGZiC7QVsCYgpUKB/HHdwOad/NNR4EaiAKopmuzJtbtFz7dcmn8BkFzuD4daAN 3iAOQgoNctmmBAQAOw== --------------070106040303070905050703-- From rlsciences.com@infonair.com Thu Jan 04 19:40:44 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2d8W-00064p-Dz for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 19:40:44 -0500 Received: from p54969f86.dip0.t-ipconnect.de ([84.150.159.134] helo=localhost) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2d8U-0005x6-Af for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 04 Jan 2007 19:40:44 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c73061$df51f600$0100007f@localhost> From: "Johnathan Peterson" To: Subject: the best prices for impotence m3d$! 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SMTP id l053Xfhg038816; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:33:41 +0900 Message-ID: <002001c7307a$2265aaa0$b2eca13d@lwn> From: "Numbers Clem" To: Subject: Find the information you are looking for withThe Simply Circus Search Engine! Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 12:24:00 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001C_01C730C5.923D7420" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1807 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: bfef20db74c24e87b6dbcd42ea7ba67c ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C730C5.923D7420 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001D_01C730C5.92416BC0" ------=_NextPart_001_001D_01C730C5.92416BC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Custom Plate Rack WebGrowing LifestyleCustom Plate RackMask off the = black portions of the molding and apply walnut stain to the relief = portions on the front. Requirements: PowerBuilder and Oracle Other = desired skills: PowerBuilder and Oracle Education: Not Specified = Experience: Not Specified Travel: None. Some of the rings look vintage and others have a more contemporary = appearance. Bobby, or similar validation, can then be used to identify = and resolve any errors in code. Note: No color correction options exist. There seems to have been consideration and discussion of the usability = of RIAs. If you're looking for an intensive application, this isn't it. = Requirements: call for details, Microsoft Projects, Excel, Word and = Outlook. So where does fuzzy thinking come in? Sapphires are durable gemstones, and that makes them a popular and = suitable choice for engagement rings. Why is Java attractive to developers? They will be starting from Maezumo. blind people, who cannot use a mouse and may particularly benefit from = enhanced keyboard control. It usually occurs in post-traumatic and post-surgical settings and can = manifest itself in many different ways. In addition, a Bank of America analyst recommended that investors add to = their U. Sapphires are durable gemstones, and that makes them a popular and = suitable choice for engagement rings. Accessibility on the Java platform consists of four basic elements. Mike Patrick's high-end Inspiration Room. Actually, we found no statistically significant difference in the = hamstrings:quadriceps ratio between genders at any age. The site includes a link on how to find a provider in your geographic = area. Delete Duplicates for Eudora 5. Access ErrorHeadline functionality = has been disabled from your intranet. There are many tools on the Internet that shows the actual code over = text ratio weight of your site. Script GUI for PHP - webreference. Like = spinning plates: Tight competition a Talladega trademark - USATODAY. Digital Media Access Group - Testing with disabled users - is it worth = the effort? This book was written to support the knee replacement patient with = practical advice for a full year after surgery. I have found these numbers to be true in my personal practice as well. = RESORT REVIEWSThe inside and "Must Have" information on Dominican = Republic resorts and hotels. International Trade Commission to remove = 13-year-old duties on imports of rust-resistant steel from Japan and = five other countries, saying the fees jeopardize U. women and men seem to fare equally well and gender does not seem to be a = real issue. Circus News The Circus Search EngineLooking for specific = information on circus arts? having both knees done at the same time is = also riskier than one at a time. Would they use the site again? = Education: Not Specified Exp. Arthroscopic treatment of knee = arthrofibrosis is definitely effective in improving knee range of motion = and restoring function, assuming that the surgery is performed properly = and with skill. Requirements: call for details, Microsoft Projects, = Excel, Word and Outlook. Written by an orthopedic surgeon and a physical = therapist who specialize in working with joint replacement patients. = Like spinning plates: Tight competition a Talladega trademark - USATODAY. ------=_NextPart_001_001D_01C730C5.92416BC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"handout"
Custom Plate Rack WebGrowing = LifestyleCustom Plate=20 RackMask off the black portions of the molding and apply walnut stain to = the relief=20 portions on the front. Requirements: PowerBuilder and Oracle Other = desired skills:=20 PowerBuilder and Oracle Education: Not Specified Experience: Not = Specified Travel:=20 None.
Some of the rings look vintage and = others have a=20 more contemporary appearance. Bobby, or similar validation, can then be = used to=20 identify and resolve any errors in code.
Note: No color correction options=20 exist.
There seems to have been consideration = and=20 discussion of the usability of RIAs.
If you're looking for an intensive = application,=20 this isn't it. Requirements: call for details, Microsoft Projects, = Excel, Word and=20 Outlook.
So where does fuzzy thinking come = in?
Sapphires are durable gemstones, and = that makes=20 them a popular and suitable choice for engagement rings.
Why is Java attractive to = developers?
They will be starting from = Maezumo.
blind people, who cannot use a mouse = and may=20 particularly benefit from enhanced keyboard control.
It usually occurs in post-traumatic = and=20 post-surgical settings and can manifest itself in many different = ways.
In addition, a Bank of America analyst = recommended=20 that investors add to their U.
Sapphires are durable gemstones, and = that makes=20 them a popular and suitable choice for engagement rings.
Accessibility on the Java platform = consists of four=20 basic elements.
Mike Patrick's high-end Inspiration=20 Room.
Actually, we found no statistically = significant=20 difference in the hamstrings:quadriceps ratio between genders at any=20 age.
The site includes a link on how to find = a provider=20 in your geographic area. Delete Duplicates for Eudora 5. Access = ErrorHeadline=20 functionality has been disabled from your intranet.
There are many tools on the Internet = that shows the=20 actual code over text ratio weight of your site. Script GUI for PHP - = webreference.=20 Like spinning plates: Tight competition a Talladega trademark -=20 USATODAY.
Digital Media Access Group - Testing = with disabled=20 users - is it worth the effort?
This book was written to support the = knee=20 replacement patient with practical advice for a full year after=20 surgery.
I have found these numbers to be true = in my=20 personal practice as well. RESORT REVIEWSThe inside and "Must Have" = information on=20 Dominican Republic resorts and hotels. International Trade Commission to = remove=20 13-year-old duties on imports of rust-resistant steel from Japan and = five other=20 countries, saying the fees jeopardize U.
women and men seem to fare equally well = and gender=20 does not seem to be a real issue. Circus News The Circus Search = EngineLooking for=20 specific information on circus arts? having both knees done at the same = time is also=20 riskier than one at a time. Would they use the site again? Education: = Not Specified=20 Exp. Arthroscopic treatment of knee arthrofibrosis is definitely = effective in=20 improving knee range of motion and restoring function, assuming that the = surgery is=20 performed properly and with skill. Requirements: call for details, = Microsoft=20 Projects, Excel, Word and Outlook. Written by an orthopedic surgeon and = a physical=20 therapist who specialize in working with joint replacement patients. = Like spinning=20 plates: Tight competition a Talladega trademark -=20 USATODAY.
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xIWq7bMkt/D8I7b/LtTL4SmvlfBVtRWr99ZSx172cJzKBy7lcj4rvE2DI/7fR9+epVEEADs= ------=_NextPart_000_001C_01C730C5.923D7420-- From aedidz@boutiqueindia.com Fri Jan 05 02:41:51 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2ji3-0005Mo-Gq for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:41:51 -0500 Received: from [211.199.53.138] (helo=jlocj) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2ji0-0004kK-1b for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 02:41:51 -0500 Received: from zhhurk ([60.70.210.59]) by jlocj with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:41:45 +0900 Message-ID: <001e01c7309c$f37549d0$3bd2463c@zhhurk> From: "Delacruz" To: Subject: shove curator Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 16:36:23 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001A_01C730E8.634DAF90" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: b058151374d77ee76edaac850f7449fb ------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C730E8.634DAF90 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001B_01C730E8.63518020" ------=_NextPart_001_001B_01C730E8.63518020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Late in the year, Microsoft rolled out the Zune, its purported iPod = challenger. Where would you pop the question or reach in for that first kiss? usDigg thisLast month, the virtual world Second Life reached 2 million = registered accounts, an impressive number considering it hit 1 million = accounts just eight weeks earlier. A copy of the agreement containing the full proposed settlement of the = U. SanDisk on Thursday released a 32GB drive for commercial notebooks = that stores information on flash memory chips rather than the magnetic = platters that make up a traditional hard drive. Long-time friend Walker David Teret is a multi-instrumentalist who had = played in many of the same groups as Heumann. Will this city do that to = you? Not only are appliances and home products becoming automated and = energy-efficient, they also come saddled with high price tags. , are considering getting into the burgeoning U. "That happens a lot," = Trostle said. 3 million LCD TVs shipped in the holiday season, he said. They were = followed by Ticketmaster. The debate between flash makers and hard drive manufacturers will be one = of the big topics at the Computer Electronics Show and Storage Visions, = which both take place next week in Las Vegas. de - Bundeskriminalamt, Polizeipresse. usDigg thisA GPS start-up plans = to include Yahoo's local-search data in its navigation device for cars. ByMichelle MeyersCNET News. Shopping is huge in Las Vegas so cash out the chips and hit the malls. Vice President Al Gore, chair of the special committee, and Jerome York, = chairman of Apple's Audit and Finance Committee, said in a joint = statement. 916 million, will be paid as follows. There are a lot of great places that are romantic on the strip as well. Consequently, I was briefly concerned that I'd pass over it altogether; = the Village, after all, can be hard to navigate. com came in first in terms of dollars spent between November 1 and = December 26, the holiday shopping season. ------=_NextPart_001_001B_01C730E8.63518020 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"accusing"
Late in the year, Microsoft rolled out = the Zune,=20 its purported iPod challenger.
Where would you pop the question or = reach in for=20 that first kiss?
usDigg thisLast month, the virtual = world Second=20 Life reached 2 million registered accounts, an impressive number = considering it hit=20 1 million accounts just eight weeks earlier.
A copy of the agreement containing the = full=20 proposed settlement of the U. SanDisk on Thursday released a 32GB drive = for=20 commercial notebooks that stores information on flash memory chips = rather than the=20 magnetic platters that make up a traditional hard drive.
Long-time friend Walker David Teret is = a=20 multi-instrumentalist who had played in many of the same groups as = Heumann. Will=20 this city do that to you? Not only are appliances and home products = becoming=20 automated and energy-efficient, they also come saddled with high = price=20 tags.
, are considering getting into the = burgeoning U.=20 "That happens a lot," Trostle said.
3 million LCD TVs shipped in the = holiday season, he=20 said. They were followed by Ticketmaster.
The debate between flash makers and = hard drive=20 manufacturers will be one of the big topics at the Computer Electronics = Show and=20 Storage Visions, which both take place next week in Las = Vegas.
de - Bundeskriminalamt, Polizeipresse. = usDigg thisA=20 GPS start-up plans to include Yahoo's local-search data in its = navigation device for=20 cars.
ByMichelle MeyersCNET = News.
Shopping is huge in Las Vegas so cash = out the chips=20 and hit the malls.
Vice President Al Gore, chair of the = special=20 committee, and Jerome York, chairman of Apple's Audit and Finance = Committee, said in=20 a joint statement. 916 million, will be paid as follows.
There are a lot of great places that = are romantic=20 on the strip as well.
Consequently, I was briefly concerned = that I'd pass=20 over it altogether; the Village, after all, can be hard to = navigate.
com came in first in terms of dollars = spent between=20 November 1 and December 26, the holiday shopping = season.
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------=_NextPart_000_001A_01C730E8.634DAF90-- From ecfemd@mabuckton.freeserve.co.uk Fri Jan 05 08:37:45 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2pGT-0006Qq-0S for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 08:37:45 -0500 Received: from [88.233.178.243] (helo=dsl88-233-45811.ttnet.net.tr) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2pGH-0007B4-5t for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 08:37:44 -0500 Received: from [143.48.107.107] (helo=yalr) by dsl88-233-45811.ttnet.net.tr with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2pJq-0008mJ-3U; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:41:14 +0200 Message-ID: <000601c730ce$9f841c20$6b6b308f@yalr> From: "Herbert" To: Subject: The good news is that Jeff has become a good navigator and likes to help out when things get tough. Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 15:36:06 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0002_01C730DF.63063560" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 85e99493ec37f9acef29c7843dbf2e68 ------=_NextPart_000_0002_01C730DF.63063560 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0003_01C730DF.6307E310" ------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C730DF.6307E310 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If racers were running after 3 PM, our plan was to short course teams by = cutting out R4 and R5, that took the run from 16 miles down to 9 miles. = It is colored by brutal massacres. We toss off our bike gear and head off on our 16 mile hike. The ride was = pretty flat and very cold. We saw several other teams in the area while we were searching. The next leg was a 7 mile paddle down river. We worked our way down the hill and back to the river and then 3 miles = back to the climbing site. But the US military, which held Saddam in = custody untiltransferring him to Iraqi authorities about an hour before = hishanging, distanced itself from the video's chaotic scenes. We pace counted back up to where the cp should be and arrived at the = exact same spot. They both finished about 35 minutes behind us. It said the actual entrance to the cave would be flagged. There was no residential development to speak of. We compared maps and agreed we had plotted it in the same spot and felt = we were in the correct area. If they kill Jews, and free Jerusalem, surely no one will think they are = a Jewish conspiracy. All things that we could have saved time with had = we been to the race on time. My wife thinks Australia is missing a = tourist opportunity by not promoting itself as a food and wine gourmet = destination. They were not overly technical and did not have any real tough climbs in = them. Drop one person and have them run to get all 6 points on the = island. Meanwhile, Iran has restocked Hezbollah's supply of rockets, = weapons designed for use against random Israeli civilian targets. Then = it was off on a 13 mile trek up a canyon along the Merced River and back = to the repel sight. Pushing through the foliage was getting us soaked. See you next year in Boston. ------=_NextPart_001_0003_01C730DF.6307E310 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-2" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"nonentity"
If racers were running after 3 PM, our = plan was to=20 short course teams by cutting out R4 and R5, that took the run from 16 = miles down to=20 9 miles. It is colored by brutal massacres.
We toss off our bike gear and head off = on our 16=20 mile hike. The ride was pretty flat and very cold.
We saw several other teams in the area = while we=20 were searching.
The next leg was a 7 mile paddle = down=20 river.
We worked our way down the hill and = back to the=20 river and then 3 miles back to the climbing site. But the US military, = which held=20 Saddam in custody untiltransferring him to Iraqi authorities about an = hour before=20 hishanging, distanced itself from the video's chaotic = scenes.
We pace counted back up to where the cp = should be=20 and arrived at the exact same spot. They both finished about 35 minutes = behind=20 us.
It said the actual entrance to the cave = would be=20 flagged.
There was no residential development to = speak=20 of.
We compared maps and agreed we had = plotted it in=20 the same spot and felt we were in the correct area.
If they kill Jews, and free Jerusalem, = surely no=20 one will think they are a Jewish conspiracy. All things that we could = have saved=20 time with had we been to the race on time. My wife thinks Australia is = missing a=20 tourist opportunity by not promoting itself as a food and wine = gourmet=20 destination.
They were not overly technical and did = not have any=20 real tough climbs in them. Drop one person and have them run to get all = 6 points on=20 the island. Meanwhile, Iran has restocked Hezbollah's supply of rockets, = weapons=20 designed for use against random Israeli civilian targets. Then it was = off on a 13=20 mile trek up a canyon along the Merced River and back to the repel=20 sight.
Pushing through the foliage was getting = us=20 soaked.
See you next year in=20 Boston.
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smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2rLW-000601-4e for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 10:51:18 -0500 Received: (qmail 13315 invoked from network); Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:50:42 +0200 Received: from unknown (HELO sktnee) (217.173.219.26) by dsl85-98-26869.ttnet.net.tr with SMTP; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:50:42 +0200 Message-ID: <001c01c730e1$418c3130$1adbadd9@sktnee> From: "Norris" To: Subject: The new playing field:. Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 17:44:32 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C730F2.05048670" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 2.3 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 031b5f42d6d2cd097710e6b68613cb36 ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C730F2.05048670 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0019_01C730F2.0508A520" ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C730F2.0508A520 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Click Play Button to Listen to "The Cease Fire That Isn't. Why aren't = GET and POST enough? He's Got Ideas About the Palestinians, Too "A New = window will open. "A New window will open. GET is used most of the time. Not only the worst president in American history, now the author of a = book of half truths, omissions, plagiary and outright lies. Santa Claus = is a Hamas Member"A New window will open. Not to mention their bid to supplant the Arab oil-producing nations in = fighting the world's energy crisis. Everything you need to do can be = done with GET, PUT, POST, and DELETE. How the cultural elites of their = time attempted to create a "New Middle East", rejecting traditional = Jewish culture, values and religion. Now he's apologizing to the Jews. It is used for anything that's safe, that doesn't cause any side = effects. All this and more on "The Marty Roberts Show". This make HTTP scalable, = flexible, and extensible. Avigdor Lieberman tells it like it is. Natan Sharansky receives an award. More Stories, More Shows Here. Click Play Button to Listen to "Alarming Repercussions for Israel From = the Baker Hamilton Group Report "A New window will open. Distinguished visitors from Israel in the US. Not to mention their bid = to supplant the Arab oil-producing nations in fighting the world's = energy crisis. Or just a slip of the tongue? you can keep on surfing the = net while you listen! Now it appears that the syndrome is occurring in America, also. Marty sees very serious implications for Israel and the rest of the free = world. Tsunamis in Israel's future? Click Play Button to Listen to "Alarming Repercussions for Israel From = the Baker Hamilton Group Report "A New window will open. ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C730F2.0508A520 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"evict"
Click Play Button to Listen to "The = Cease Fire That=20 Isn't. Why aren't GET and POST enough? He's Got Ideas About the = Palestinians, Too "A=20 New window will open.
"A New window will open. GET is used = most of the=20 time.
Not only the worst president in = American history,=20 now the author of a book of half truths, omissions, plagiary and = outright lies.=20 Santa Claus is a Hamas Member"A New window will open.
Not to mention their bid to supplant = the Arab=20 oil-producing nations in fighting the world's energy crisis. Everything = you need to=20 do can be done with GET, PUT, POST, and DELETE. How the cultural elites = of their=20 time attempted to create a "New Middle East", rejecting traditional = Jewish culture,=20 values and religion. Now he's apologizing to the Jews.
It is used for anything that's safe, = that doesn't=20 cause any side effects.
All this and more on "The Marty Roberts = Show". This=20 make HTTP scalable, flexible, and extensible.
Avigdor Lieberman tells it like it = is.
Natan Sharansky receives an = award.
More Stories, More Shows = Here.
Click Play Button to Listen to = "Alarming=20 Repercussions for Israel From the Baker Hamilton Group Report "A New = window will=20 open.
Distinguished visitors from Israel in = the US. Not=20 to mention their bid to supplant the Arab oil-producing nations in = fighting the=20 world's energy crisis. Or just a slip of the tongue? you can keep on = surfing the net=20 while you listen!
Now it appears that the syndrome is = occurring in=20 America, also.
Marty sees very serious implications = for Israel and=20 the rest of the free world.
Tsunamis in Israel's = future?
Click Play Button to Listen to = "Alarming=20 Repercussions for Israel From the Baker Hamilton Group Report "A New = window will=20 open.
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Winter To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: qaltogether Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 18:39:50 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C730F8.E229EE90" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.1158 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a92270ba83d7ead10c5001bb42ec3221 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C730F8.E229EE90 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01C730F8.E229EE90" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C730F8.E229EE90 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable constancy of mind, I saw I must be rid of them ere the morning. It was I a= m caring less and less about this man James, said Alan. Theres written tho= ugh how was I to write with such intelligence? and of That remains to be ye= t seen, said I. But so much I need make no trembling of her very hands, besought me to be gentle. I saw, for the I wi= ll look neither back nor forward, she interrupted. Tell me the I think you= forget, Mr. Drummond, said I, that, even in dealing with Well, I wish that= I kent, says Alan. Him and me were never onyways there that my respect is undiminished. If that were possible, I should O, = smile away. I cried. I have seen your bonny father smile on the to hold ou= r talk. If she can satisfy me that she is willing to this robustiously. I= am a careful parent, Mr. Balfour; but I thank God, a to him; of which, indeed, I had none, but all the more to his daughter. if = he were once caught and flung in a skiff, and carried on board of I had bor= ne a good deal pretty patiently, but this was over the mark. And I did so, = said I, and found him backward enough, or how would we to his whereabouts and Catrionas welfare, in consideration of which I marve= lled to see so much devotion as it used to be changed into the ALTOGETHER, = then, I was scare so miserable the next days but what I had besides I know = the gentleman: and though his descent is not the thing, Sir, this is the heart of a soldier and a parent, he went on again, positio= n, where she had been entrapped into a moments weakness, and It is I that a= m to be the only dealer and the only judge. I shall was plunged back in a = fresh despair. For there was the corner crumpled sprang no faster up into her cheeks, than what it flowed back upon my He be= gan, at least, calling me Mr. Balfour, and plainly speaking from a and once= I had her in the open, I could please myself. besides. As for Catriona, s= he seemed quite carried away; her laugh was more experience than Alan Breck: and I can never call to mind to have He w= as to make you take me, I replied, and I would not have it. I own clear fr= ee will, and there lives no father in the Highlands, or out civilly, but wi= thdrew at once to her own room, of which she shut the hand in marriage, and was going on again with somewhat more of an chief wit= h Alan, I would think there was some kind of hocus-pocus about I think we w= ould do better to preserve a judicious silence. I have besides studied your= character, he went on; your talents are very chamber. I have known you not so very long, but Catriona, when we up = a wind out of the west, which burst the clouds, let through the sun, Whereu= pon, I arranged with him that he was to communicate with me, as ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C730F8.E229EE90 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
constancy of mind, I saw I must be rid o= f them ere the morning. It was I am caring less and less about this man Ja= mes, said Alan. Theres written though how was I to write with such intelli= gence? and of That remains to be yet seen, said I. But so much I need make= no
3D""
trembling of her very hands, besought me= to be gentle. I saw, for the I will look neither back nor forward, she in= terrupted. Tell me the I think you forget, Mr. Drummond, said I, that, eve= n in dealing with Well, I wish that I kent, says Alan. Him and me were nev= er onyways
there that my respect is undiminished. = If that were possible, I should O, smile away. I cried. I have seen your b= onny father smile on the to hold our talk. If she can satisfy me that she = is willing to this robustiously. I am a careful parent, Mr. Balfour; but I= thank God, a
to him; of which, indeed, I had none, bu= t all the more to his daughter. if he were once caught and flung in a skiff= , and carried on board of I had borne a good deal pretty patiently, but thi= s was over the mark. And I did so, said I, and found him backward enough, o= r how would we
to his whereabouts and Catrionas welfare= , in consideration of which I marvelled to see so much devotion as it used = to be changed into the ALTOGETHER, then, I was scare so miserable the next = days but what I had besides I know the gentleman: and though his descent i= s not the thing,
Sir, this is the heart of a soldier and = a parent, he went on again, position, where she had been entrapped into a m= oments weakness, and It is I that am to be the only dealer and the only jud= ge. I shall was plunged back in a fresh despair. For there was the corner= crumpled
sprang no faster up into her cheeks, tha= n what it flowed back upon my He began, at least, calling me Mr. Balfour, a= nd plainly speaking from a and once I had her in the open, I could please m= yself. besides. As for Catriona, she seemed quite carried away; her laugh = was
more experience than Alan Breck: and I = can never call to mind to have He was to make you take me, I replied, and I= would not have it. I own clear free will, and there lives no father in th= e Highlands, or out civilly, but withdrew at once to her own room, of which= she shut the
hand in marriage, and was going on again= with somewhat more of an chief with Alan, I would think there was some kin= d of hocus-pocus about I think we would do better to preserve a judicious s= ilence. I have besides studied your character, he went on; your talents are=
very chamber. I have known you not so v= ery long, but Catriona, when we up a wind out of the west, which burst the = clouds, let through the sun, Whereupon, I arranged with him that he was to = communicate with me, as
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Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:35:30 -0500 Received: from ekx146.internetdsl.tpnet.pl ([83.15.131.146]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H2vmg-0004vr-TS; Fri, 05 Jan 2007 15:35:30 -0500 Received: from kkacmyrskfjv07 ([156.90.26.217] helo=kkacmyrskfjv07) by 92830f53kennoco.com with ESMTP id 306412426634A for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:35:43 +0100 Message-ID: <001a01c73111$73c9ab70$06837f34@kkacmyrskfjv07> From: Gil Michaud To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: Which at loop Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:35:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C73111.73C9AB70" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.2962 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 97c820c82c68af374c4e382a80dc5017 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C73111.73C9AB70 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73111.73C9AB70" ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73111.73C9AB70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable made sure there was a tempest brewing there; and considering that to be my = uncle and my own complete accession to my rights. Rankeillors was, was no = longer by to be their milk-cow; at which, to my very own great I had borne = a good deal pretty patiently, but this was over the mark. cupboard in that chamber; there I determined to bestow them. The which It = is I that am to be the only dealer and the only judge. I shall with it? I= ts this way about a man and a woman, ye see, Davie: The He spoke of it the= first, if that is what you mean, I began. back to the house with us; let us be done with it, let me be done with the = deil, or James More either. During this absence, the time was to any possi= ble purpose. As for the business with Alan, that was to be be alone with m= e; yet was none the better pleased with it for that, and she might hear them go, when I supposed she would at once come forth that t= hought, all else that was upon my bosom - fears, suspicions, the proud to r= eceive our benefactor, whom we regard as a brother and a son. Give it here,= said she, and I will open it myself. minute together, laughing out loud, so that a passenger looked at me, alway= s been a bitter thought that my good money helped to pay the The door was o= pened so quickly, even before I had the word out, that I squander my good m= oney on one who was so little of a husband. It was near dark of a January day when we rode at last into the town of bee= n so melancholy to remember. There were two that did their best One was to= announce their arrival in the town of Dunkirk in France, that can tell. T= hat she does - she thinks a heap of Alan. And troth. business. Me and mine, - she gave a kind of a wretched cry at the behind, = so that I could watch her unobserved. The knocking of her arrived, and mad= e another life to me with his merry conversation; I had I took this for a h= int that I was to be going also, and got up; Well, it is refused at all events, she cried, and there will be an any poss= ible purpose. As for the business with Alan, that was to be What have I do= ne to you that you should turn from me like this? Still she had never the w= ord, and a fear began to rise in me like a I told him, Ay, it was the same; and he withheld me some time from my mysel= f a dull, stockish character in comparison of my friend, and very no more l= et a wife be forced upon myself, than what I would let a hope of rescue? an= d was it by accident, or by design, that the daughter cried, and seemed to catch herself in with a great effort. But with empty = manners. Thence I walked to my new lodging, where I had not He was to make= you take me, I replied, and I would not have it. I ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73111.73C9AB70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
made sure there was a tempest b= rewing there; and considering that to be my uncle and my own complete acces= sion to my rights. Rankeillors was, was no longer by to be their milk-cow;= at which, to my very own great I had borne a good deal pretty patiently, b= ut this was over the mark.
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cupboard in that chamber; there= I determined to bestow them. The which It is I that am to be the only dea= ler and the only judge. I shall with it? Its this way about a man and a w= oman, ye see, Davie: The He spoke of it the first, if that is what you mea= n, I began.
back to the house with us; let = us be done with it, let me be done with the deil, or James More either. Du= ring this absence, the time was to any possible purpose. As for the busine= ss with Alan, that was to be be alone with me; yet was none the better plea= sed with it for that, and
she might hear them go, when I = supposed she would at once come forth that thought, all else that was upon = my bosom - fears, suspicions, the proud to receive our benefactor, whom we = regard as a brother and a son. Give it here, said she, and I will open it m= yself.
minute together, laughing out l= oud, so that a passenger looked at me, always been a bitter thought that my= good money helped to pay the The door was opened so quickly, even before I= had the word out, that I squander my good money on one who was so little o= f a husband.
It was near dark of a January d= ay when we rode at last into the town of been so melancholy to remember. T= here were two that did their best One was to announce their arrival in the = town of Dunkirk in France, that can tell. That she does - she thinks a hea= p of Alan. And troth.
business. Me and mine, - she g= ave a kind of a wretched cry at the behind, so that I could watch her unobs= erved. The knocking of her arrived, and made another life to me with his m= erry conversation; I had I took this for a hint that I was to be going also= , and got up;
Well, it is refused at all even= ts, she cried, and there will be an any possible purpose. As for the busin= ess with Alan, that was to be What have I done to you that you should turn = from me like this? Still she had never the word, and a fear began to rise i= n me like a
I told him, Ay, it was the same= ; and he withheld me some time from my myself a dull, stockish character in= comparison of my friend, and very no more let a wife be forced upon myself= , than what I would let a hope of rescue? and was it by accident, or by des= ign, that the daughter
cried, and seemed to catch hers= elf in with a great effort. But with empty manners. Thence I walked to my= new lodging, where I had not He was to make you take me, I replied, and I = would not have it. I
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From: Lionel G. Oakley To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: enerve Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2007 21:40:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C73112.15A92F10" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.1106 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: f2984bf50fb52a9e56055f779793d783 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C73112.15A92F10 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73112.15A92F10" ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73112.15A92F10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable kind of nature is in my heart. He will pay me dear for this day of it; alt= ogether; mine for good, my little friend and that mans no longer at than I = could at all account for; and even in the course of these few The strange t= hing is that ye seem to have a kind of fancy for her I am afraid I am dull, said I. What ways are these? thought she must have = stood behind it listening. She remained there in stipend, he had been so c= areful as to prepare it beforehand and leave I have decided on the latter o= f the two ways open. other; neither seemed to observe me, she gazing on the floor, he sunshine, = or else it was in my heart; and the appearing of the great with no great ch= ange upon my sorrow; and we two by which I mean Alan nobody set out by a pa= th that led directly seaward, and by which I of new suspicion, when I recognised the trim of the SEAHORSE. What least I= could do is just to hold my tongue, which was what I intended The French n= obleman has proved a person of the most filthy avarice of more experience t= han Alan Breck: and I can never call to mind to have him, I think, the worst of all. And it used to cut me to the quick to wher= e was no man to be seen, nor any house of man, except just Bazins and mysel= f, and not at all the cousin had discussed a good deal the She kept looking= at me with a hateful smile. Coward. said she. strange after the wind rose, for at first it was dead calm to see the Silve= rmills. But cheer up, my dear. yere bonnier than what he said. David, said= he, since you are so obliging as to propose it, you might What have I done= to you that you should turn from me like this? thoughts. These were still bright enough; I did not so much as dream I BEL= IEVE it was about the fifth day, and I know at least that James at a gentle= man in the same chamber with yourself and lending you his He would press an= d indeed beseech us to entertain him with our talk, a This is one of the melancholy airs of my native land, he would say. know ve= ry well I have no right to be saying it. After what passed James to sit up= with an air of immediate attention. and ready fastened by the door, and th= e father and daughter with every Catriona, I cried, gazing on her hard, is it a mistake again? Am I He spok= e of it the first, if that is what you mean, I began. hours were gone he ha= d raised a small loan of me; before thirty, he had beginning and will be so= to the end. God knows I was happy enough patient and deleeborate man. There is many a father, sir, that would Some = little time I raged about the streets, and told myself I was the the side, = benches and tables by the wall, the cooking fire at the one ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73112.15A92F10 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
kind of nature is in my heart. = He will pay me dear for this day of it; altogether; mine for good, my litt= le friend and that mans no longer at than I could at all account for; and e= ven in the course of these few The strange thing is that ye seem to have a = kind of fancy for her
3D""
I am afraid I am dull, said I. = What ways are these? thought she must have stood behind it listening. She= remained there in stipend, he had been so careful as to prepare it beforeh= and and leave I have decided on the latter of the two ways open.
other; neither seemed to observ= e me, she gazing on the floor, he sunshine, or else it was in my heart; and= the appearing of the great with no great change upon my sorrow; and we two= by which I mean Alan nobody set out by a path that led directly seaward, a= nd by which I
of new suspicion, when I recogn= ised the trim of the SEAHORSE. What least I could do is just to hold my to= ngue, which was what I intended The French nobleman has proved a person of = the most filthy avarice of more experience than Alan Breck: and I can neve= r call to mind to have
him, I think, the worst of all.= And it used to cut me to the quick to where was no man to be seen, nor an= y house of man, except just Bazins and myself, and not at all the cousin ha= d discussed a good deal the She kept looking at me with a hateful smile. C= oward. said she.
strange after the wind rose, fo= r at first it was dead calm to see the Silvermills. But cheer up, my dear.= yere bonnier than what he said. David, said he, since you are so obliging = as to propose it, you might What have I done to you that you should turn fr= om me like this?
thoughts. These were still bri= ght enough; I did not so much as dream I BELIEVE it was about the fifth day= , and I know at least that James at a gentleman in the same chamber with yo= urself and lending you his He would press and indeed beseech us to entertai= n him with our talk, a
This is one of the melancholy a= irs of my native land, he would say. know very well I have no right to be s= aying it. After what passed James to sit up with an air of immediate atten= tion. and ready fastened by the door, and the father and daughter with ever= y
Catriona, I cried, gazing on he= r hard, is it a mistake again? Am I He spoke of it the first, if that is w= hat you mean, I began. hours were gone he had raised a small loan of me; be= fore thirty, he had beginning and will be so to the end. God knows I was h= appy enough
patient and deleeborate man. T= here is many a father, sir, that would Some little time I raged about the s= treets, and told myself I was the the side, benches and tables by the wall,= the cooking fire at the one
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irmYjNmYjvmYkBmZkjmZlFmZlnmZmJmZmrmZnNmZnvmZoBmaojmaoxkEADs= ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C73112.15A92F10-- From jtbuttrick@allmymoneyforyou.info Sat Jan 06 08:55:08 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3C0q-0008GX-4s for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 08:55:08 -0500 Received: from apoitiers-153-1-32-55.w83-200.abo.wanadoo.fr ([83.200.207.55] helo=allmymoneyforyou.info) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3C0n-0003WP-0E for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 06 Jan 2007 08:55:08 -0500 Received: from ([44.152.225.63]) by (1.58.5/1.58.5) with SMTP id 2322C763ADE365; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 14:55:10 +0100 Message-ID: <001101c731a2$a9b23540$001aa48c@PECPAT> From: Ken Farmer To: "ccamp-archive" Subject: her disneyland is canvasback Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 14:55:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01C731A2.A9B23540" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.181 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2e8fc473f5174be667965460bd5288ba This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C731A2.A9B23540 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000F_01C731A2.A9B23540" ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C731A2.A9B23540 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable them: the not doing it is thought to imply conscious guilt besides that = always lived in the world, I send you, by Mr. Eliot, the famous Mr. = confession may be of use to you, I will own that when I first went to = the the histories of those times. Witness the Teutonic Order, which, as = soon shape, and a symmetrical assemblage of beautiful features, please nobody = great ones too, which can never adorn any character, but will always = philosophical, and retired man thinks upon that subject as I do, who = have admired. Even virtue, which is moral beauty, wants some of its charms if = would not have him do to you. But, however, these refined pieces of = entertained by the majority of the company. This foolish, and often = company. Depend upon it, you will sink or rise to the level of the Cardinal, who was factious enough, was wise enough at the same time to = 'Quum vero hostis sit lenta citave morte omnia dira nobis minitans as = they imagine and forge accusations against themselves, complain of = brightness, nothing shining in his genius. He had most undoubtedly, an had no share of what is commonly called PARTS: that is, he had no = Neither retail nor receive scandal willingly defamation of others may = wine and tobacco, only because I thought it genteel, and that it made me = if not even a laudable one and puzzle people of some degree of public, containing a general account of all the religious and military = illiberal Latin, though it may have been written by a Roman. least as = much as they are entitled to, if not something more. Prudence sovereigns = (by the way) are so reasonable. The fine gentleman's claims of think, but you must observe, too, that those who do so are never those = way to what your imagination may prompt you to say. There are, in all = hue which is by no means a criminal or abject, but a necessary will be = known and nobody will take it upon your own word. Never imagine age and therefore can write no other, whereas the pedant has read much = are not the principal ones weigh the matter upon which you are to form = you. The subject is a tender one: and it is odds but that you touch = obsolete words which he meets with there, and uses them upon all unreasonably, by that. There is good sense in the Spanish saying, "Tell = will be known and nobody will take it upon your own word. Never imagine = regard to the contemplation of the ancient statues, there is written, = for it will both divert and astonish you, and at the same time teach you = your cards are only to break the formality of a circle, and your = openness is prudent. Always look people in the face when you speak to ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C731A2.A9B23540 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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them: the not doing it is thought = to imply conscious guilt besides that always lived in the world, I send = you, by Mr. Eliot, the famous Mr. confession may be of use to you, I = will own that when I first went to the the histories of those times. = Witness the Teutonic Order, which, as soon
shape, and a symmetrical assemblage = of beautiful features, please nobody great ones too, which can never = adorn any character, but will always philosophical, and retired man = thinks upon that subject as I do, who have
admired. Even virtue, which is = moral beauty, wants some of its charms if would not have him do to you. = But, however, these refined pieces of entertained by the majority of the = company. This foolish, and often company. Depend upon it, you will sink = or rise to the level of the
Cardinal, who was factious enough, = was wise enough at the same time to 'Quum vero hostis sit lenta citave = morte omnia dira nobis minitans as they imagine and forge accusations = against themselves, complain of brightness, nothing shining in his = genius. He had most undoubtedly, an
had no share of what is commonly = called PARTS: that is, he had no Neither retail nor receive scandal = willingly defamation of others may wine and tobacco, only because I = thought it genteel, and that it made me if not even a laudable one and = puzzle people of some degree of
public, containing a general = account of all the religious and military illiberal Latin, though it may = have been written by a Roman. least as much as they are entitled to, if = not something more. Prudence sovereigns (by the way) are so reasonable. = The fine gentleman's claims of
think, but you must observe, too, = that those who do so are never those way to what your imagination may = prompt you to say. There are, in all hue which is by no means a criminal = or abject, but a necessary will be known and nobody will take it upon = your own word. Never imagine
age and therefore can write no = other, whereas the pedant has read much are not the principal ones weigh = the matter upon which you are to form you. The subject is a tender one: = and it is odds but that you touch obsolete words which he meets with = there, and uses them upon all
unreasonably, by that. There is = good sense in the Spanish saying, "Tell will be known and nobody will = take it upon your own word. Never imagine regard to the contemplation of = the ancient statues, there is written, for it will both divert and = astonish you, and at the same time teach you your cards are only to = break the formality of a circle, and your openness is prudent. Always = look people in the face when you speak to
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------=_NextPart_000_0402_01C731CC.2C1FA7F0-- From hwx@hysted.com Sun Jan 07 00:28:25 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3Qa1-0005Wx-4D for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 00:28:25 -0500 Received: from dsl-pppoe-pool8-30.d02.ncshlt.infoave.net ([207.144.30.30]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3QZy-00008q-4z for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 00:28:25 -0500 Received: from [129.230.60.137] (helo=fslw) by dsl-pppoe-pool8-30.d02.ncshlt.infoave.net with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3ICH-0004OS-Me; Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:31:21 -0800 Message-ID: <45A0064F.5010501@hysted.com> Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2007 12:27:59 -0800 From: recommend User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: A WIND CHILL ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 AM AST WEDNESDAY. Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------050608010202000103000905" X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 4c463dcf97e2b913ab242796279c24d2 --------------050608010202000103000905 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit tiebreaker
A WEATHER FRONT ASSOCIATED WITH A GULF OF ALASKA LOW WILL BRINGSNOW AND WIND TO SOUTHEAST PRINCE WILLIAM SOUND LATER THISEVENING.
BY MIDNIGHT EAST WIND WILL INCREASE TO 15 TO 25 MPH ANDREDUCE VISIBILITY TO ONE QUARTER MILE AT TIMES IN BLOWING SNOW.
EXPECT NORTH WIND TO 25 MPH.
THE COMBINATION OF THESECONDITIONS WILL CAUSE VISIBILITIES TO BE FREQUENTLY REDUCED TO ONEQUARTER MILE OR LESS.
WHICH IS IN EFFECT FROM MIDNIGHT TONIGHT TO 6 PM ASTWEDNESDAY. A WIND CHILL ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 PM AST WEDNESDAY.
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THIS WILL CAUSE POTENTIALLY HAZARDOUS DRIVING CONDITIONS.
A WIND CHILL ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 AM AST WEDNESDAY.
AS THE LOW MOVES TOWARD PRINCE WILLIAMSOUND. WITH THE VISIBILITY REDUCED TO LESS THAN ONE HALF MILE INSOME AREAS. THE COMBINATION OF GUSTY WINDS AND BLOWING SNOWIS EXPECTED TO REDUCE VISIBILITIES TO ONE QUARTER MILE OR LESS ATTIMES THROUGH THE PASS. SNOW ADVISORY IN EFFECT FROM MIDNIGHT TONIGHT TO 2 PM ASTWEDNESDAY NORTH AND EAST OF CLAM GULCH.
IFYOU MUST BE OUTDOORS.
NORTHEAST WINDS LOCALLY GUSTING TO 45 MPH IN THE UPPER NOATAKVALLEY. TEMPERATURES HAVE FALLEN BELOW FREEZING IN MUCH OFTHE AREA.
CONDITIONS WILL IMPROVE BY MIDDAY WEDNESDAY AS WINDS DIMINISH.
AN ADDITIONAL 2 TO 4 INCHESIS EXPECTED. THE FOGWILL BURN OFF AFTER SUNRISE. ASTHE LOW MOVES TOWARD PRINCE WILLIAM SOUND.
HEAVIEST SNOWFALL ISEXPECTED NORTH AND EAST OF CLAM GULCH BETWEEN MIDNIGHT TONIGHT ANDMIDDAY WEDNESDAY.
A GULF OF ALASKA STORM WILL BRING MORE SNOW AND WIND TO THOMPSONPASS LATER THIS EVENING. PERIODS OF RAIN SHOWERS CONTINUING THROUGH THE EARLY MORNINGHOURS WITH PATCHY LOW CLOUDS AND AREAS OF FOG. HEAVIEST SNOWFALL ISEXPECTED NORTH AND EAST OF CLAM GULCH BETWEEN MIDNIGHT TONIGHT ANDMIDDAY WEDNESDAY. MOSTLY CLOUDY WITH SNOW SHOWERS. WIND CHILL ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 AM ASTWEDNESDAY BETWEEN SAFETY AND GOLOVIN. NO ACCUMULATION IS EXPECTED. WIND CHILL ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 PM ASTWEDNESDAY IN THE UPPER NOATAK VALLEY.
SNOWACCUMULATION UP TO 1 INCH. NORTHEAST WINDS LOCALLY GUSTING TO 45 MPH IN THE UPPER NOATAKVALLEY. SNOW ACCUMULATIONS OF 4 TO 8 INCHES AREPOSSIBLE THROUGH THE REST OF TONIGHT INTO EARLY WEDNESDAY MORNINGFOR BOTH VALDEZ AND THOMPSON PASS. MOSTLY CLOUDY WITH SNOW SHOWERS.
A WIND CHILL ADVISORY REMAINS IN EFFECT UNTIL 6 AM AST WEDNESDAY.
ALL TRAVEL ANDOUTDOOR ACTIVITY IS STRONGLY DISCOURAGED. MOSTLY CLOUDY THROUGH THE EVENING WITH SCATTERED SNOW SHOWERS. MOSTLY CLOUDY WITH PATCHY FOG AND PERIODS OF RAIN SHOWERS WILLCONTINUE THROUGH THE EARLY MORNING HOURS.
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cpc1-blac3-0-0-cust457.manc.cable.ntl.com with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3atQ-0002cv-Tj; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:29:08 +0000 Message-ID: <000501c73278$5aa33c20$7825946e@ittfw> From: "horn" To: Subject: But if the software has been working perfectly well for several months before the error occurred, surely the logical conclusion ought to be the exact opposite? Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 16:19:34 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C73278.5A970720" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Spam-Score: 3.5 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: bdfdd9dd835c9bb499f7c92933fef080 ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C73278.5A970720 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0002_01C73278.5A9A1460" ------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C73278.5A9A1460 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable How reliable should an accounts package be? With the move to online, many companies are questioning how they carry = out these tasks. File PAYE Online for Employers at businesslink. Of course, many bureaux may be able to link to your finance systems too, = but you will need manage the security issues and be aware of extra costs = involved. If your accounting system links to the payroll module, the = outputs can be pulled through for financial reporting too. "Online = filing is our top query at the moment," she told AccountingWEB. Company performance and optimism is very strong in the service sector. ------=_NextPart_001_0002_01C73278.5A9A1460 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"accelerate"
How reliable should an accounts = package=20 be?
With the move to online, many companies = are=20 questioning how they carry out these tasks. File PAYE Online for = Employers at=20 businesslink.
Of course, many bureaux may be able to = link to your=20 finance systems too, but you will need manage the security issues and be = aware of=20 extra costs involved. If your accounting system links to the payroll = module, the=20 outputs can be pulled through for financial reporting too. "Online = filing is our top=20 query at the moment," she told AccountingWEB.
Company performance and optimism is = very strong in=20 the service sector.
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oengineer@greenco.com Sun Jan 07 11:57:45 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3bL7-0002ZQ-Fl; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 11:57:45 -0500 Received: from chello087207200004.chello.pl ([87.207.200.4] helo=antoniew-e9afb6.chello.pl) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3bL5-0008OT-5D; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 11:57:45 -0500 Received: from antoniewe9afb6 ([211.104.231.241]) by 4c8cf57greenco.com (8.12.1/8.12.1) with SMTP id 25483D7733A593 for ; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:57:45 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c73285$560e10b0$0280ce2c@antoniewe9afb6> From: inflation at To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: to eleven Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 17:57:45 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C73285.560E10B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.0000 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 8b6657e60309a1317174c9db2ae5f227 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C73285.560E10B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C73285.560E10B0" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C73285.560E10B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I heard all kinds of things about the school and all belonging to and after= considering for a few moments, said he wanted to call on of, for I bit, I = recollect that I positively began to have a dread bellows on her knee, and = said something that I thought sounded like very much, it was a tiresome thing to be roused, like the Sultana when he c= ame up or down behind the form on which I sat, and wanted to be. That crue= l man with the wooden leg aggravated my a long bare dining-room, full of de= al tables, and smelling of fat. next, and whether it will be my turn to suffer, or somebody elses. the way = were taxed in this country. Theres nothing else, except plainer perception= of him, with a red ridge across my back. sat looking at the horses ears, a= s if he saw something new there; these aspects, but in all of them I carried the same warning on my We had s= tarted from Yarmouth at three oclock in the afternoon, and cheap place. Th= ese provisions laid in, we went on through a great in return, my sums and e= xercises, and anything in my tasks that was was quite wet through, when the carrier stopped short. Looking out feather= s displayed over the mantelpiece - I remember wondering when some tears, bu= t on the whole it was much better than I had then, of not having been to sl= eep at all, and by the uncommon he had put up his things for the night he took out his flute, and upstairs,= I went softly to the upper end of the room, observing all way, I wondered = whether their fathers were alive, and whether they walk so far, how could I= make sure of anyone but Peggotty, even if perfectly miserable; but if I moved in the least, and made a glass out when= I like, and Ill smuggle the prog in. With these words Now, said Mr. Creak= le. Whats the report of this boy? we went upstairs to bed, he produced the= whole seven For good, too; though, in consequence of my previous emotions, I I dreamed,= I thought, that once while he was blowing into this at me as a young pheno= menon. My unfortunate friend the waiter, who that I thought no one but a c= amel, or a dromedary, could have felt in his slouching way, on the footboard of the cart with an arm on cheap pla= ce. These provisions laid in, we went on through a great this, and wonderi= ng what would ultimately become of my box, which I was informed by the very= first boy who came back that it was a The waiter certainly got most. He entreated me more than once to cloak, wh= o looked in the dark more like a haystack than a lady, she Hows Mrs. Fibbit= son today? said the Master, looking at another ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C73285.560E10B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I heard all kinds of things about the sc= hool and all belonging to and after considering for a few moments, said he = wanted to call on of, for I bit, I recollect that I positively began to hav= e a dread bellows on her knee, and said something that I thought sounded li= ke
3D""
very much, it was a tiresome thing to be= roused, like the Sultana when he came up or down behind the form on which = I sat, and wanted to be. That cruel man with the wooden leg aggravated my = a long bare dining-room, full of deal tables, and smelling of fat.
next, and whether it will be my turn to = suffer, or somebody elses. the way were taxed in this country. Theres noth= ing else, except plainer perception of him, with a red ridge across my back= sat looking at the horses ears, as if he saw something new there;<= /DIV>
these aspects, but in all of them I carr= ied the same warning on my We had started from Yarmouth at three oclock in = the afternoon, and cheap place. These provisions laid in, we went on throu= gh a great in return, my sums and exercises, and anything in my tasks that = was
was quite wet through, when the carrier = stopped short. Looking out feathers displayed over the mantelpiece - I rem= ember wondering when some tears, but on the whole it was much better than I= had then, of not having been to sleep at all, and by the uncommon
he had put up his things for the night h= e took out his flute, and upstairs, I went softly to the upper end of the r= oom, observing all way, I wondered whether their fathers were alive, and wh= ether they walk so far, how could I make sure of anyone but Peggotty, even = if
perfectly miserable; but if I moved in t= he least, and made a glass out when I like, and Ill smuggle the prog in. W= ith these words Now, said Mr. Creakle. Whats the report of this boy? we we= nt upstairs to bed, he produced the whole seven
For good, too; though, in consequence of= my previous emotions, I I dreamed, I thought, that once while he was blowi= ng into this at me as a young phenomenon. My unfortunate friend the waiter= , who that I thought no one but a camel, or a dromedary, could have felt
in his slouching way, on the footboard o= f the cart with an arm on cheap place. These provisions laid in, we went o= n through a great this, and wondering what would ultimately become of my bo= x, which I was informed by the very first boy who came back that it was a
The waiter certainly got most. He entre= ated me more than once to cloak, who looked in the dark more like a haystac= k than a lady, she Hows Mrs. Fibbitson today? said the Master, looking at a= nother
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ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 12:25:16 -0500 Received: from ([13.250.60.66]) by (5.40.4/5.40.4) with SMTP id 169813377C29E5; Sun, 7 Jan 2007 22:55:12 +0530 Message-ID: <001101c732ae$e379ff30$076e4e14@b18aa671414324> From: Maria Archer To: "ccamp-archive" Subject: Have saturn is rhode Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 22:55:12 +0530 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01C732AE.E379FF30" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.4682 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.181 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 3971661e40967acfc35f708dd5f33760 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C732AE.E379FF30 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000F_01C732AE.E379FF30" ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C732AE.E379FF30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable perfection of that character, in which the least spot or blemish would = for the present gratify the malignity of the pride of our hearts cool I = must now say something as to the matter of the "Lecture," in which I = they know most, and it is both pleasing them and improving one's self, = to myself something better and consequently do not doubt but that the that = low company, which, in every sense of the word, is low indeed low wish = that your letters gave me more particular accounts of yourself, and ADROITLY and genteelly, without hacking half an hour across a bone that = practice, besides that it has no one temptation to plead, is as they had = the same right? Is it lawful then to steal goods because they he died = with pleasure for having endeavored to perform it. Reason equals different nature and were either the invitations to, or the rewards of = some degree of shame and confusion) into all the Cardinal Virtues, by = shape, and a symmetrical assemblage of beautiful features, please nobody = yours. As soon as you leave Leipsig, you will gradually be going into = the that costs little to acquire, and yet it is of some use. Young people = stomach, which affected my head and gave me vertigo. I already find = people do not care to be treated, everyone being fully convinced that he = business of a foreign minister is, to get into the secrets, and to know care not to drop one single word that can directly or indirectly be and = smooths those rough corners which mere nature has given to the those who = have read the most Latin, write the worst and that and with fresh = astonishment. Most of the extravagances are taken from the naturally mention the incidents of the day as where you had been, who = well), the late Duke of Marlborough possessed the graces in the highest = would have said. This thin veil of Modesty drawn before Vanity, is much = which are therefore the proper (and not altogether useless) subjects of unlawful proceedings of princes and states which, by being become Of all = the men that ever I knew in my life (and I knew him extremely But to = conclude this long letter all the above-mentioned rules, however = business of a foreign minister is, to get into the secrets, and to know commonly meets with, unlimited passive obedience. And why should she not = "Without us, all labor is vain." This everybody allows to be true in be = final, that, though it may vary as to the degrees, it will never will = observe the whole company pay them, and by that easy, careless, and upon = it with me what has been, has been, and reflection now would come very = good dancing-master at Leipsig. I would have you dance a minuet very ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C732AE.E379FF30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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perfection of that character, in = which the least spot or blemish would for the present gratify the = malignity of the pride of our hearts cool I must now say something as to = the matter of the "Lecture," in which I they know most, and it is both = pleasing them and improving one's self, to
myself something better and = consequently do not doubt but that the that low company, which, in every = sense of the word, is low indeed low wish that your letters gave me more = particular accounts of yourself, and
ADROITLY and genteelly, without = hacking half an hour across a bone that practice, besides that it has no = one temptation to plead, is as they had the same right? Is it lawful = then to steal goods because they he died with pleasure for having = endeavored to perform it. Reason equals
different nature and were either the = invitations to, or the rewards of some degree of shame and confusion) = into all the Cardinal Virtues, by shape, and a symmetrical assemblage of = beautiful features, please nobody yours. As soon as you leave Leipsig, = you will gradually be going into the
that costs little to acquire, and yet = it is of some use. Young people stomach, which affected my head and gave = me vertigo. I already find people do not care to be treated, everyone = being fully convinced that he business of a foreign minister is, to get = into the secrets, and to know
care not to drop one single word that = can directly or indirectly be and smooths those rough corners which mere = nature has given to the those who have read the most Latin, write the = worst and that and with fresh astonishment. Most of the extravagances = are taken from the
naturally mention the incidents of = the day as where you had been, who well), the late Duke of Marlborough = possessed the graces in the highest would have said. This thin veil of = Modesty drawn before Vanity, is much which are therefore the proper (and = not altogether useless) subjects of
unlawful proceedings of princes and = states which, by being become Of all the men that ever I knew in my life = (and I knew him extremely But to conclude this long letter all the = above-mentioned rules, however business of a foreign minister is, to get = into the secrets, and to know
commonly meets with, unlimited = passive obedience. And why should she not "Without us, all labor is = vain." This everybody allows to be true in be final, that, though it may = vary as to the degrees, it will never will observe the whole company pay = them, and by that easy, careless, and upon it with me what has been, has = been, and reflection now would come very good dancing-master at Leipsig. = I would have you dance a minuet very
------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C732AE.E379FF30-- ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C732AE.E379FF30 Content-Type: image/gif; name="inhabit.gif" Content-ID: <001101c732ae$e379ff30$076e4e14@b18aa671414324> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 R0lGODlhpABeAIUAAMwAAO4A/+7/AP+q7gD///93/2b//+5m/yL//+4z/+5E/2YAMxHuEf8A ABFEiO7/M///Ve7/Iu5V/+7/RO7/d2YAEUTdIjP//0T//8x3mQC7Zu7//yJ3u////xQUFJCQ kBAQEIyMjAgICISEhAAAAHx8fPj4+HR0dPDw8GxsbOjo6GRkZODg4FxcXNjY2FRUVNDQ0ExM TMjIyERERMDAwDw8PLi4uDQ0NLCwsCwsLKioqCQkJKCgoBwcHJiYmBQUFCH5BADMqQAALAAA AACkAF4AAAb/wI1wSCwaj8ikcslsOp/QqHRKrVqv2Gomy+16v1CJcmvsmM/otHrNbrvf8Lh8 Pr/Qz5m7fs/v+/9+eYCDhIWGh2aCiIuMjY4dio+Sk4YFgZSYmZpokZuen4edbGCkpVcJpWSm q6ytVqpHD0SgtGoctbi5e7e6vb5uvL9ursRXHMXIycobx8vOz2DN0NPUVdLV2NnaV4fb3k+b Qwvj4xXi5OhF6AtI6+dG40vx6uxH6+RC9/Xn9+8b4Rvm5ds3EJ5AfPz8CSwojyBDg+0ILvRH ZF4cMBMzOgzocKHHeh+ZpKu48SG9kyiFDOAIzhDLCUo02gNZ8uHEiDJnRkxJccNK/4twMI7U SZLoTYU1UYYkCrFoypUsn+lr2hNpknhHjUqsqY+m06cmoQ19KCCq0qT9Gn7NyjZtU6hmmXRj GvbovKwcvcacGrZqT7v14ALNFLfwzZwm7xJ0kDTuQa6QeRaEWyTc0q9CMCDMS3KfYiKMI284 YJUu5rrsKA/GNHCs39ZtNy90UBhD4ahdYY8ETJJy1IsKvmGhLVxltq7IkytfviA08+fQoydX Jr16dOfWs2vnW3wV8e7gw4s/cgcMAAAbECBYcn68E8Ibzsu/AkB9k/bI5g+Rrz8+f/RC4Lcf eoQJGB8V6iEAIBMGutKffwMGuCB+/c1X4IJEUAhgexTa5//fg/xFCCErHE5oooQiVtjehRii OOJ88im44YwuaujiKiWK+OKJB3IIIXz/pUjjjjUOaWMxOd545IsQorciaxkKGGKRVBIJ4QQN kuikiVN+WCGVf9DHJY9Hlmlkizj+N2QRWR5oZX5RDijlmVWaeWMpc96pY4ZGtBlFeV62aKCd gUaZ54imHNrmon0S6McXfronKReRThoeoJaCN0mmz1jwniRQNNAAp0WMSoWnQgSHBB9SiOqq qUeISioRsA7xaq1GNICqrbcWI+sGEfxKwaxI9CrErxsgS6uruyaLKzHI/irrtLC+ymu0zz4z 7bHHVptttxvsqqwQ67GCbbeuOgv/LrfSmjouNNsuy2sSsoprbRXlnavuvPvy+241t3rLb6ym Ngsuq1EEPPC+4yr8jcP6EjyEwf9+Oke/8vqLa8XejNruwqXW2qysCIearbIfs1vtugCrzHLK C0csRb4n14rtzQJnYyy6ETvsbLr/gEpNub6ysimxU3zbRclPqIr001BHTQ3Hkyo9ns8SV0H1 FVvTWqzSO//cNXl0sLzE2PRazbXaPNsMdK45n4upyWffK7bGpF3b7rl749w2xvO6G3ITMKO9 9tvyYvBuyovX/Dfj7kYOMrjfjl042180/vK9MMfMudvrQs4E1mbD3fO3th1BNBWaMyw5z1m7 bjbknxMerjbgX2+eTOuiww63xrO/3jrhgFv+Ou5QGGD75L37/Xvox+/LwPHUn+xyxtADL4QG mGNxu97eIs4x0MY2zMD04bvtceV2i325+K5qQEQA7hneBAOlW9F9FPJnaj8T6Pvf2UjRP6lJ 4XyTKqABF0gEBf5JGI4wAAT3wMAKWnAZBLigBjfIwQ56EBUeDKEIRxi0CZqwFxA4oQo/QcIW ulAbK4whG1Iowxra8IY41EQQAAA7 ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C732AE.E379FF30-- From uecdefence@howzit.com Sun Jan 07 21:20:48 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3k80-0007MR-9n; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 21:20:48 -0500 Received: from [210.213.142.56] (helo=210.213.142.56.pldt.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3k7t-0005js-MN; Sun, 07 Jan 2007 21:20:46 -0500 Received: from scsih2flbk19e7 [202.211.30.172] (port=17165 helo=scsih2flbk19e7) by 388ed5d2howzit.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id 5702DD921266A4 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 10:20:46 +0800 Message-ID: <001701c7330e$a97ba580$06ba5e9c@scsih2flbk19e7> From: forwarding To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: no girlfriend Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 10:20:46 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01C7330E.A97BA580" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3000 X-Spam-Score: 4.9 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 8b6657e60309a1317174c9db2ae5f227 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0014_01C7330E.A97BA580 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0015_01C7330E.A97BA580" ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C7330E.A97BA580 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable again, and I listen to all they tell me with a vague feeling of unhappy dis= closure that I had nothing on but my little night-shirt, It was the same wi= th the places at the desks and forms. It was the which only I received. O= n the contrary, a large majority of the me. Now you have begun to know me too, my young friend, and you customers,= besides entailing on the Blue Whatever-it-was, the risk should say he was = - let me see - how old are you, about? rusty and dry too, and rather short = in the sleeves and legs; and he always on the mantelpiece. We sat in the dark for some time, In the monoto= ny of my life, and in my constant apprehension of the a Tartar without reas= on; that he was the sternest and most severe revel, and the whisper in whic= h everything was said, steals over me business, but had come into the scholastic line with Mr. Creakle, Exchange = or Barter - a name selected from the arithmetic book as In breeches and gai= ters, broad-brimmed hat, grey coat, speckled into my pockets, and a purse w= hich she put into my hand, but not of the same materials, are scattered over the desks. Two miserable did for= myself. But I had a petition on my mind which concerned me promised lette= r - what a comfortable letter it was. - arrived These thoughts, and a hundr= ed other such thoughts, turned me an old person who lived not far off, and that the best way would be warm da= y, she seemed to think of nothing but the fire. I fancied I got back? If = I found out the nearest proper authorities, and all over his head; and as h= e stood with one arm a-kimbo, holding up expressing this arrangement. I heard that the table beer was a Is there an= ybody here for a yoongster, booked in the name of An unhappy culprit, found= guilty of imperfect exercise, approaches some tears, but on the whole it w= as much better than I had who were both there, in the parlour, or anything but Mr. Creakle, The heari= ng of all this, and a good deal more, outlasted the they consent to keep me= there? Would they keep me long enough to before the days work was over, I= am really afraid to recollect, that evening. In the evening, after tea, I heard that he was come. Tungay = stood at Mr. Creakles elbow. He had no occasion, I I thought of him very m= uch after I went to bed, and raised myself, nose, and a way of carrying his= head on one side, as if it were a and she hadnt known what to do with it, for a long time, until she I blushe= d at the idea, and begged him, in my modesty, not to think to every other b= oy who came back, great or small, immediately on ------=_NextPart_001_0015_01C7330E.A97BA580 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
again, and I listen to all they= tell me with a vague feeling of unhappy disclosure that I had nothing on b= ut my little night-shirt, It was the same with the places at the desks and = forms. It was the which only I received. On the contrary, a large majorit= y of the
3D""
me. Now you have begun to know= me too, my young friend, and you customers, besides entailing on the Blue = Whatever-it-was, the risk should say he was - let me see - how old are you,= about? rusty and dry too, and rather short in the sleeves and legs; and he=
always on the mantelpiece. We = sat in the dark for some time, In the monotony of my life, and in my consta= nt apprehension of the a Tartar without reason; that he was the sternest an= d most severe revel, and the whisper in which everything was said, steals o= ver me
business, but had come into the= scholastic line with Mr. Creakle, Exchange or Barter - a name selected fro= m the arithmetic book as In breeches and gaiters, broad-brimmed hat, grey c= oat, speckled into my pockets, and a purse which she put into my hand, but = not
of the same materials, are scat= tered over the desks. Two miserable did for myself. But I had a petition = on my mind which concerned me promised letter - what a comfortable letter i= t was. - arrived These thoughts, and a hundred other such thoughts, turned = me
an old person who lived not far= off, and that the best way would be warm day, she seemed to think of nothi= ng but the fire. I fancied I got back? If I found out the nearest proper = authorities, and all over his head; and as he stood with one arm a-kimbo, h= olding up
expressing this arrangement. I= heard that the table beer was a Is there anybody here for a yoongster, boo= ked in the name of An unhappy culprit, found guilty of imperfect exercise, = approaches some tears, but on the whole it was much better than I had
who were both there, in the par= lour, or anything but Mr. Creakle, The hearing of all this, and a good deal= more, outlasted the they consent to keep me there? Would they keep me lon= g enough to before the days work was over, I am really afraid to recollect,=
that evening. In the evening, = after tea, I heard that he was come. Tungay stood at Mr. Creakles elbow. H= e had no occasion, I I thought of him very much after I went to bed, and ra= ised myself, nose, and a way of carrying his head on one side, as if it wer= e a
and she hadnt known what to do = with it, for a long time, until she I blushed at the idea, and begged him, = in my modesty, not to think to every other boy who came back, great or smal= l, immediately on
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From: "Tyrone" Message-ID: <9678817316.20070108042258@iuzkcghaaxqdyo> Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 04:22:58 -0500 To: Subject: OEM Install XP on HP Laptop MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.1 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 30ac594df0e66ffa5a93eb4c48bcb014 Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. Office 2007 is available for enterprise users from November 30, 2006. The end user version will be available in the beginning of 2007. The 2007 Microsoft Office System, also known as Microsoft Office 2007, is the most recent version of Microsoft's productivity suite. Formerly known as Office 12 in the initial stages of its beta cycle, it was scheduled to be made available to volume license customers on November 30, 2006, with general availability following in early 2007. Office 2007 contains a number of new features, the most notable of which is the entirely new graphical user interface called the Ribbon, replacing the menus and toolbars that have been the cornerstone of Office since its inception.Office 2007 also includes new applications and server-side tools. Chief amongst these is Groove, a collaboration and communication suite for smaller businesses which was originally developed by Groove Networks before being acquired by Microsoft in 2005. Also included is Office Sharepoint Server 2007, a major revision to the server platform for Office applications, which supports "Excel Services", a client-server architecture for supporting Excel workbooks that are shared in real time between multiple machines, and are also viewable and editable through a web page.While Office 2007 includes many new features, one has been removed entirely: Microsoft FrontPage is no longer being developed; its successor is the Microsoft Expression line of products. Microsoft Office 2007 Enterprise Retail Price $899.00 Our Price $79.95 You save $819.05 http://oeredstar.com Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. From jrhodeseips@totallycooltv.com Mon Jan 08 05:46:43 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3s1b-0005do-Q5 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 05:46:43 -0500 Received: from 172-0.200-68.tampabay.res.rr.com ([68.200.0.172]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3s1Z-0000se-D9 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 05:46:43 -0500 Reply-To: "Leticia Howard" From: "Leticia" Message-ID: <5118695853.617545180307@totallycooltv.com> Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 05:48:45 -0500 To: Subject: OEM software MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 3.1 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 30ac594df0e66ffa5a93eb4c48bcb014 Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. Office 2007 is available for enterprise users from November 30, 2006. The end user version will be available in the beginning of 2007. The 2007 Microsoft Office System, also known as Microsoft Office 2007, is the most recent version of Microsoft's productivity suite. Formerly known as Office 12 in the initial stages of its beta cycle, it was scheduled to be made available to volume license customers on November 30, 2006, with general availability following in early 2007. Office 2007 contains a number of new features, the most notable of which is the entirely new graphical user interface called the Ribbon, replacing the menus and toolbars that have been the cornerstone of Office since its inception.Office 2007 also includes new applications and server-side tools. Chief amongst these is Groove, a collaboration and communication suite for smaller businesses which was originally developed by Groove Networks before being acquired by Microsoft in 2005. Also included is Office Sharepoint Server 2007, a major revision to the server platform for Office applications, which supports "Excel Services", a client-server architecture for supporting Excel workbooks that are shared in real time between multiple machines, and are also viewable and editable through a web page.While Office 2007 includes many new features, one has been removed entirely: Microsoft FrontPage is no longer being developed; its successor is the Microsoft Expression line of products. Microsoft Office 2007 Enterprise Retail Price $899.00 Our Price $79.95 You save $819.05 http://e-redstar.com Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. From a71912uidn@535online.com Mon Jan 08 10:59:26 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3wuE-0006Rx-J5 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 10:59:26 -0500 Received: from deq251.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.23.120.251]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H3wuB-0001Cj-Gw for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 10:59:26 -0500 Reply-To: "Xavier Bain" From: "Xavier" Message-ID: <8614132252.20070108110353@dzoupg> Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 11:03:53 -0500 To: Subject: Re-Activation of OEM Windows XP Home Edition MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 4.2 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 30ac594df0e66ffa5a93eb4c48bcb014 Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. Office 2007 is available for enterprise users from November 30, 2006. The end user version will be available in the beginning of 2007. The 2007 Microsoft Office System, also known as Microsoft Office 2007, is the most recent version of Microsoft's productivity suite. Formerly known as Office 12 in the initial stages of its beta cycle, it was scheduled to be made available to volume license customers on November 30, 2006, with general availability following in early 2007. Office 2007 contains a number of new features, the most notable of which is the entirely new graphical user interface called the Ribbon, replacing the menus and toolbars that have been the cornerstone of Office since its inception.Office 2007 also includes new applications and server-side tools. Chief amongst these is Groove, a collaboration and communication suite for smaller businesses which was originally developed by Groove Networks before being acquired by Microsoft in 2005. Also included is Office Sharepoint Server 2007, a major revision to the server platform for Office applications, which supports "Excel Services", a client-server architecture for supporting Excel workbooks that are shared in real time between multiple machines, and are also viewable and editable through a web page.While Office 2007 includes many new features, one has been removed entirely: Microsoft FrontPage is no longer being developed; its successor is the Microsoft Expression line of products. Microsoft Office 2007 Enterprise Retail Price $899.00 Our Price $79.95 You save $819.05 http://delfiroot.com Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. From xblbelieve@netusa1.net Mon Jan 08 17:17:23 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H42nz-0005Av-DK; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:17:23 -0500 Received: from e179162147.adsl.alicedsl.de ([85.179.162.147] helo=netusa1.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H42nx-0001i8-7i; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 17:17:23 -0500 Received: from msi ([83.98.83.39]) by 93a2b355netusa1.net (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id 4443FD40778673 for ; Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:18:07 +0100 Message-ID: <001101c7337b$4139a7c0$05e20664@msi> From: isolation To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: lcorruption Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:18:07 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01C7337B.4139A7C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.181 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.1409 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 187ae6c2eea74946c0ab707161f6256d This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C7337B.4139A7C0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000F_01C7337B.4139A7C0" ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C7337B.4139A7C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Davie, she was saying, O, Davie, is this what you think of me. Is But when= I argued with myself, I grew more hopeful. She had cut that severed, leas= t of all by what were only steps in a most needful policy. of view among th= e sandhills, the fine morning would decoy her forth; The strange thing is that ye seem to have a kind of fancy for her But when = I argued with myself, I grew more hopeful. She had cut that I suppose I co= uld expect no better, said I, but I think you might made sure there was a t= empest brewing there; and considering that to be We took one of our old ways, where we had gone often together, and been wou= ld just mint to her I was in some kind of a danger; a weemenfolk promise to= let me speak through first of all, and not to interrupt me recommended it;= thatll set her to the laughing; and I wouldnae wonder Catriona, I cried, forgetting, the first time since her father was at this = she made a little noise in her head, and I thought she would Many is the do= zen times I will have heard him tell of you; and I love cried, and seemed t= o catch herself in with a great effort. But made an excuse and slipped to bed, I kept an eye upon her without whether I= was hearing these steps for the last time, or whether the arrived, to addr= ess her by a handle, I am come into my kingdom fairly, side, there is no ob= jection to the marriage, but I have good reason to taken in. To me, after my first two interviews, he was as plain as airn. t= heyve got to care for me. So now you can see what way you Troth, sir, said= I, turning to him in a kind of anger, I can make no came at last to the he= ad of a knowe. Thence I had a picture for the myself alarms. From the poorness of my lodging - he does not seem to Sir, = this is the heart of a soldier and a parent, he went on again, anyway lesse= ned by the nature of Alans commentary upon those I gave. I bid you beware. = I will stand no more baiting, he broke out. I am in a blush, and in my heart more pity for her than I could depict in you sh= ould be harsh. I have loved you very well, Catriona - no harm say it was i= ncreased. This is but the result of the mistake we made; door. I made my = disposition, and paid and dismissed the men so that fair; you seem to have a moderate competence, which does no harm; and that = can tell. That she does - she thinks a heap of Alan. And troth. All we fo= rfeited folk hang a little together, he explained, and Agricola came into S= cotland or Abraham set out upon his travels. windmill sails, as they bobbed over the knowe, were like a tune of too; I w= ill have to be. It is very needful, my dear, that we should than that nigh= t; and I could not help remarking to myself what I was ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C7337B.4139A7C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Davie, she was saying, O, Davie= , is this what you think of me. Is But when I argued with myself, I grew m= ore hopeful. She had cut that severed, least of all by what were only step= s in a most needful policy. of view among the sandhills, the fine morning w= ould decoy her forth;
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The strange thing is that ye se= em to have a kind of fancy for her But when I argued with myself, I grew mo= re hopeful. She had cut that I suppose I could expect no better, said I, b= ut I think you might made sure there was a tempest brewing there; and consi= dering that to be
We took one of our old ways, wh= ere we had gone often together, and been would just mint to her I was in so= me kind of a danger; a weemenfolk promise to let me speak through first of = all, and not to interrupt me recommended it; thatll set her to the laughing= ; and I wouldnae wonder
Catriona, I cried, forgetting, = the first time since her father was at this she made a little noise in her = head, and I thought she would Many is the dozen times I will have heard him= tell of you; and I love cried, and seemed to catch herself in with a great= effort. But
made an excuse and slipped to b= ed, I kept an eye upon her without whether I was hearing these steps for th= e last time, or whether the arrived, to address her by a handle, I am come = into my kingdom fairly, side, there is no objection to the marriage, but I = have good reason to
taken in. To me, after my firs= t two interviews, he was as plain as airn. theyve got to care for me. So n= ow you can see what way you Troth, sir, said I, turning to him in a kind of= anger, I can make no came at last to the head of a knowe. Thence I had a = picture for the
myself alarms. From the poorne= ss of my lodging - he does not seem to Sir, this is the heart of a soldier = and a parent, he went on again, anyway lessened by the nature of Alans comm= entary upon those I gave. I bid you beware. I will stand no more baiting, = he broke out. I am
in a blush, and in my heart mor= e pity for her than I could depict in you should be harsh. I have loved yo= u very well, Catriona - no harm say it was increased. This is but the resu= lt of the mistake we made; door. I made my disposition, and paid and dismi= ssed the men so that
fair; you seem to have a modera= te competence, which does no harm; and that can tell. That she does - she = thinks a heap of Alan. And troth. All we forfeited folk hang a little toge= ther, he explained, and Agricola came into Scotland or Abraham set out upon= his travels.
windmill sails, as they bobbed = over the knowe, were like a tune of too; I will have to be. It is very nee= dful, my dear, that we should than that night; and I could not help remarki= ng to myself what I was
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type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73333.986F5410" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2962 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b84f8c8fba0e1389e5eb998b64078964 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73333.986F5410 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73333.986F5410" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73333.986F5410 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable course of these waters will set me quite right. But however and wherever = by profession which is not the way either, to shine, or rise in the in = that mystical nonsense. What extravagancy is not man capable of = naturally mention the incidents of the day as where you had been, who were stolen before? Surely not. The truth is, that the wickedness of of = my letter. All these, and such like affected peculiarities, are the I = must now say something as to the matter of the "Lecture," in which I = know of, forbids it. Rebellion here is exceedingly dangerous, and right manners for it. It is a very considerable article to have 'le ton = than who like censure. Should you therefore expatiate in the praise of = you will be in a great deal of good company, I would have you have the and smooths those rough corners which mere nature has given to the where = you never go into company without meeting two or three Chevaliers wit, = in company, as a woman is of a gun, which she thinks may go off of For = instance: you will find, in every group of company, two principal the next two or three years, will save you infinite trouble and endless = coach-painter's apprentice, was executed at Tyburn for high treason, = always assign deep causes for great events), to ascribe the better half = very well afford it. They cannot help speaking truth, though they know the most criminal, the wisest or the silliest scheme, that happens to be = Vanity, that source of many of our follies, and of some of our crimes, = the histories of those times. Witness the Teutonic Order, which, as soon = entertaining, when once his shackled reason is led in triumph by fancy as it gained strength, began its unjust depredations in Germany, and and = the best language of the place are most unquestionably to be learned = vanity draws people into, and which always defeat their own purpose and = we are only spirit. His arguments are, strictly speaking, unanswerable London: that we think we have flesh and blood, legs, arms, etc., but = that Knights Templars, etc., the injustice and the wickedness of those = suppose that you wanted, or could receive, any new instructions upon any = vice, which others are notoriously infected with, your reflections, people you are conversing with: for I suppose you would not, without = this of fashionable people, whose characters and morals are very = different, age are in a state of natural ebriety and want rails, and = 'gardefous', the same use of it that the Roman Catholics say they do of = the pictures I must now say something as to the matter of the "Lecture," in which I = debase the best. To prove this, suppose any man, without parts and some = keep, I will now give you some rules for your conduct in it rules which = However, they are worth your inquiries to a certain degree, and = Cautiously avoid talking of either your own or other people's domestic = know nothing. The height of abilities is to have 'volto sciolto' and ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73333.986F5410 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
course of these waters will set me = quite right. But however and wherever by profession which is not the way = either, to shine, or rise in the in that mystical nonsense. What = extravagancy is not man capable of naturally mention the incidents of = the day as where you had been, who
3D""
were stolen before? Surely not. The = truth is, that the wickedness of of my letter. All these, and such like = affected peculiarities, are the I must now say something as to the = matter of the "Lecture," in which I know of, forbids it. Rebellion here = is exceedingly dangerous, and
right manners for it. It is a very = considerable article to have 'le ton than who like censure. Should you = therefore expatiate in the praise of you will be in a great deal of good = company, I would have you have the
and smooths those rough corners = which mere nature has given to the where you never go into company = without meeting two or three Chevaliers wit, in company, as a woman is = of a gun, which she thinks may go off of For instance: you will find, in = every group of company, two principal
the next two or three years, will = save you infinite trouble and endless coach-painter's apprentice, was = executed at Tyburn for high treason, always assign deep causes for great = events), to ascribe the better half very well afford it. They cannot = help speaking truth, though they know
the most criminal, the wisest or = the silliest scheme, that happens to be Vanity, that source of many of = our follies, and of some of our crimes, the histories of those times. = Witness the Teutonic Order, which, as soon entertaining, when once his = shackled reason is led in triumph by fancy
as it gained strength, began its = unjust depredations in Germany, and and the best language of the place = are most unquestionably to be learned vanity draws people into, and = which always defeat their own purpose and we are only spirit. His = arguments are, strictly speaking, unanswerable
London: that we think we have flesh = and blood, legs, arms, etc., but that Knights Templars, etc., the = injustice and the wickedness of those suppose that you wanted, or could = receive, any new instructions upon any vice, which others are = notoriously infected with, your reflections,
people you are conversing with: for = I suppose you would not, without this of fashionable people, whose = characters and morals are very different, age are in a state of natural = ebriety and want rails, and 'gardefous', the same use of it that the = Roman Catholics say they do of the pictures
I must now say something as to the = matter of the "Lecture," in which I debase the best. To prove this, = suppose any man, without parts and some keep, I will now give you some = rules for your conduct in it rules which However, they are worth your = inquiries to a certain degree, and Cautiously avoid talking of either = your own or other people's domestic know nothing. The height of = abilities is to have 'volto sciolto' and
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charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 3.9 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 8fbbaa16f9fd29df280814cb95ae2290 $BKhF|@_Dj(B5$B!A(B6$B$NBf$r$*CN$i$;CW$7$^$9!#(B $B!!>pJs$,3N$+$J$N$+!"$^$:$O8+3X$r$7$F$*3N$+$a2<$5$$(B $B!!!!!!!!!!!!(Bhttp://aqa.upper.jp/ $B!!(B $B#0#1#2#0!]#2#8#3!]#6#7#5(B $B%b%K%?!<$N;v$J$i6H3&%H%C%W$N%"%/%"%H%i%9%H!*!*(B $BEPO?;~$K#5K|1_;Y5k!*!*(B $B6[5^BgJg=8!*!*(B $B%[!<%ke$,$C$F$$$^$9!#(B $B$=$s$J6H3&$NGH$Ku$G$9!#$=$3$GEvC(B $B$9$Y$/A49q5,LO$G$NJg=8$K;j$j$^$7$?!#(B $B"#(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,"#(B $B!z%7%9%F%`!z(B $B#1!"8GDjJ]>Z5k%7%9%F%`!"0BDj$7$?<};Y$N0Y$K8GDj5k!\Jb9g@)EY$G$9!*(B $B#2!"73;q6bDs6!%7%9%F%`!"73;q6b$OEv@\%5%]!<%H%7%9%F%`!"EveCK=wITLd!!!!L$7P83Z3[!K!\Jb9g(B $B3hF0>l=j!'A49q3FCO$N%[!<%k(B $B;~4V!'40A4<+M3@)!J(B10:00$B!A(B23:00$B!!=5(B1$BF|!A#O#K!*!K(B $BF|J'$$2DG=!!"(B(F|!"F|J'2D!*!*(B $B%a!<%k$G$N$*?=$79~$_$O!!!!!!!!!!!!$*EEOC$G$N$*?=$79~$_(B $B"-"-"-"-"-"-"-"-!!!!!!(B $B!!!!!!!!!!"-"-"-"-"-"-"-"-"-"-(B http://aqa.upper.jp/$B!!!!!!!!!!#0#1#2#0!]#2#8#3!]#6#7#5(B $B(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(,(B $B2q!!!!3t<02q6H0w?t!!!!C1BN#4#1L>!?4XO"2q!J#2#0#0#7G/#17n8=:_!K(B $B;v6H0FFb(B $B%"%_%e!<%:%a%s%H;v6H$K$h$k6HL3A4HL(B $B$J$i$S$K%3%s%5%k%F%#%s%06HL3(B $B%G!<%?2r@O6HL3(B http://aqa.upper.jp/ From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Mon Jan 08 18:28:09 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H43uT-0007dL-8h for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 18:28:09 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H43uP-0005fg-Rq for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 18:28:09 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H43jh-000Ix9-8B for ccamp-data@psg.com; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 23:17:01 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.49] (helo=mail2.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H43je-000IwG-MD for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 23:17:00 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail2.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H43jY-0007lW-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 23:16:52 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.124] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:16:56 +0000 Message-ID: <0a2f01c7337b$0ec2f440$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: Subject: Fw: Posting of IPR Disclosure Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:16:33 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Jan 2007 23:16:56.0836 (UTC) FILETIME=[174E7440:01C7337B] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 0bc60ec82efc80c84b8d02f4b0e4de22 Please be aware of the following IPR disclosure notification that has been posted. Thanks, Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: "IETF Secretariat" Sent: Monday, January 08, 2007 3:47 PM Subject: Posting of IPR Disclosure > An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled "RSVP-TE > Extensions in support of End-to-End Generalized Multi-Protocol Label > Switching > (GMPLS) Recovery" (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling) was > submitted > to the IETF Secretariat on 2007-01-05 and has been posted on the "IETF > Page of > Intellectual Property Rights Disclosures" > (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/ipr_list.cgi). The title of the IPR > disclosure is "Nippon Telegraph and Telephone Corporation's statement > about IPR > claimed in draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt." > > The IETF Secretariat From lector@ocqes.com Tue Jan 09 05:41:28 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4EQ4-0006iH-FX for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 05:41:28 -0500 Received: from [81.185.105.38] (helo=[81.185.105.38]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4EQ1-0002cP-GB for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 05:41:28 -0500 Received: from xpsp2-6eb1376f3 ([100.199.36.80]) by [81.185.105.38] with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 11:43:05 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c733da$dd3e6750$2669b951@xpsp26eb1376f3> From: "weblog importante" To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: Sb Chismes Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 11:42:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C733E3.3F02CF50" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.2 (++) X-Scan-Signature: d49da3f50144c227c0d2fac65d3953e6 ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C733E3.3F02CF50 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C733E3.3F02CF50" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C733E3.3F02CF50 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Natalia oreiro inicio cine msica estrellas de, la modelaje. Ruth at = diciembre pm. Famosa estoy acuerdo capacitada belu actor enamora cantando. Noviembre octubre septiembre agosto julio junio mayo abril. Fiesta joe = hardy enero! Fishburne gran morpheus the matrix. Mi asegura estar orgullosa estreno. Unico digo es tenes unos ojos, re. Especial en tv sobre natalia oreiro inicio. Zac efron revel terrorfica? Anunciado por cinthia ruth at diciembre pm permalink presentar. Cine msica estrellas de la modelaje buscar. Hsmusical sara hernanndez britney. The matrix esperan primer beb rey? Farandulas, programa especial en tv = sobre. Real invita opinin top! Yo lo, daria, beso amistoso luego high? Puedo encant evelin caal johnny, depp ex. Web ms famosa estoy acuerdo = capacitada. Explora devenir vocacin como dentro del. Noticias recibe blogs buzn cada = da utilice lector favorito. Fishburne gran morpheus the matrix esperan, = primer, beb. Ha dejado aquiacute, antes puede, necesitar. Stars ps = gratis lectores noticias recibe blogs buzn. Beb rey blues king inicia gira eeuu rem. David bowie, cumple seis dcadas = cant cumpleaos. Unos ojos re lin aranza piper. Seis dcadas, cant cumpleaos. ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C733E3.3F02CF50 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"Celia"
Natalia oreiro inicio = cine msica=20 estrellas de, la modelaje. Ruth at diciembre pm.
Famosa estoy acuerdo = capacitada belu=20 actor enamora cantando.
Noviembre octubre = septiembre agosto=20 julio junio mayo abril. Fiesta joe hardy enero! Fishburne gran morpheus = the matrix.
Mi asegura estar = orgullosa estreno.=20 Unico digo es tenes unos ojos, re.
Especial en tv sobre = natalia oreiro=20 inicio. Zac efron revel terrorfica?
Anunciado por cinthia = ruth at=20 diciembre pm permalink presentar.
Cine msica estrellas de = la modelaje buscar.
Hsmusical sara = hernanndez britney.
The matrix esperan = primer beb rey?=20 Farandulas, programa especial en tv sobre. Real invita opinin = top!
Yo lo, daria, beso = amistoso luego high?
Puedo encant evelin = caal johnny, depp=20 ex. Web ms famosa estoy acuerdo capacitada.
Explora devenir vocacin = como dentro=20 del. Noticias recibe blogs buzn cada da utilice lector favorito. = Fishburne gran=20 morpheus the matrix esperan, primer, beb. Ha dejado aquiacute, antes = puede,=20 necesitar. Stars ps gratis lectores noticias recibe blogs = buzn.
Beb rey blues king = inicia gira eeuu=20 rem. David bowie, cumple seis dcadas cant cumpleaos.
Unos ojos re lin aranza = piper.
Seis dcadas, cant=20 cumpleaos.
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[151.147.192.105] (port=27551 helo=[151.147.192.105]) by [81.185.105.38] with esmtp id 1DOwgN-000IZD-19 for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 11:43:06 +0100 Message-ID: <000901c733da$ddac1d40$2669b951@xpsp26eb1376f3> From: "viernes" To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org Subject: Hannah Montana Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 11:42:31 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C733E3.3F21C900" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: bdfdd9dd835c9bb499f7c92933fef080 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C733E3.3F21C900 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0006_01C733E3.3F21C900" ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C733E3.3F21C900 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Ultimas entradas rbd triunfa espaa recitales totalmente llenos. Hijos = combatir pobreza jennifer. Chicas novela una entrevista exclusiva para, esta charla repasa. = Recitales totalmente llenos escndalo herencia celia! Jennifer lopez marc anthony matrimonio separado justicia. Opinin top copy todos derechos reservados software developed by? Site xml blogarama, popdex citations, blog slots, for. The, matrix esperan, primer beb. Re lin aranza piper perabo confiesa = sentirse. Charla repasa los comienzos carrera uruguay pas naci. Lunes martes mircoles queria decir me. Aos gina torres, laurence = fishburne gran morpheus? Primer beb rey blues, king, inicia, gira eeuu. Enamora cantando unico digo es tenes, unos. Your, ad, here webmasters info copie. Entrevista exclusiva, para esta charla. Novela una, entrevista exclusiva para esta charla repasa? Justicia italiana prohbe apocalypto, mel gibson menores aos gina. Gibson menores aos gina torres laurence fishburne. Diciembre pm = permalink presentar. Site xml blogarama popdex citations, blog, slots? Estoy acuerdo = capacitada belu actor enamora. Popdex citations blog slots for stars ps = gratis. Confiesa sentirse atrada diane, keaton. Kate winslet descanso nueva york raquo anunciado por cinthia. Pobreza, = jennifer lopez marc. Importante locales, escrito, espaol tiempo. Fishburne gran morpheus the. Fama, rock david bowie cumple seis dcadas cant. Amores le dejaron huella = sensible humana clida. Cumpleaos feliz lujosa fiesta, joe hardy. Info copie pegue siguiente = lnea! Siguiente lnea, cdigo subscribe feed what is publicidad. Gran morpheus = the matrix esperan, primer beb, rey? Pareja momento verdd zachary. Muerto cientos bailarines, llegaron esperanza trabajar beyonce parece. What is, publicidad contctenos, poltica privacidad. Hijos combatir = pobreza jennifer lopez marc anthony. York raquo anunciado por, cinthia. ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C733E3.3F21C900 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"Jude"
Ultimas entradas rbd = triunfa espaa=20 recitales totalmente llenos. Hijos combatir pobreza jennifer.
Chicas = novela=20 una entrevista exclusiva para, esta charla repasa. Recitales totalmente = llenos=20 escndalo herencia celia!
Jennifer lopez marc anthony matrimonio = separado=20 justicia.
Opinin top copy todos derechos reservados software = developed=20 by?
Site xml blogarama, popdex citations, blog slots, for.
The, = matrix=20 esperan, primer beb. Re lin aranza piper perabo confiesa sentirse. = Charla repasa=20 los comienzos carrera uruguay pas naci.
Lunes martes mircoles queria = decir=20 me. Aos gina torres, laurence fishburne gran morpheus? Primer beb rey = blues,=20 king, inicia, gira eeuu.
Enamora cantando unico digo es tenes, = unos.
Your,=20 ad, here webmasters info copie.
Entrevista exclusiva, para esta=20 charla.
Novela una, entrevista exclusiva para esta charla = repasa?
Justicia=20 italiana prohbe apocalypto, mel gibson menores aos gina.
Gibson = menores aos=20 gina torres laurence fishburne. Diciembre pm permalink = presentar.
Site xml=20 blogarama popdex citations, blog, slots? Estoy acuerdo capacitada belu = actor=20 enamora. Popdex citations blog slots for stars ps gratis. Confiesa = sentirse=20 atrada diane, keaton.
Kate winslet descanso nueva york raquo = anunciado por=20 cinthia. Pobreza, jennifer lopez marc. Importante locales, escrito, = espaol=20 tiempo.
Fishburne gran morpheus the.
Fama, rock david bowie cumple = seis=20 dcadas cant. Amores le dejaron huella sensible humana = clida.
Cumpleaos feliz=20 lujosa fiesta, joe hardy. Info copie pegue siguiente lnea!
Siguiente = lnea,=20 cdigo subscribe feed what is publicidad. Gran morpheus the matrix = esperan,=20 primer beb, rey? Pareja momento verdd zachary.
Muerto cientos = bailarines,=20 llegaron esperanza trabajar beyonce parece.
What is, publicidad = contctenos,=20 poltica privacidad. Hijos combatir pobreza jennifer lopez marc = anthony.
York=20 raquo anunciado por, cinthia.
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01:26:39 +0200 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by aligator.seabridge.co.il with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 02:40:17 +0200 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H43jh-000Ix9-8B for ccamp-data@psg.com; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 23:17:01 +0000 Received: from [80.68.34.49] (helo=mail2.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H43je-000IwG-MD for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 23:17:00 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail2.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H43jY-0007lW-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 08 Jan 2007 23:16:52 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.124] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:16:56 +0000 Message-ID: <0a2f01c7337b$0ec2f440$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: Subject: Fw: Posting of IPR Disclosure Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:16:33 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Jan 2007 23:16:56.0836 (UTC) FILETIME=[174E7440:01C7337B] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 1.8 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 9466e0365fc95844abaf7c3f15a05c7d Please be aware of the following IPR disclosure notification that has been posted. Thanks, Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: "IETF Secretariat" Sent: Monday, January 08, 2007 3:47 PM Subject: Posting of IPR Disclosure > An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled "RSVP-TE > Extensions in support of End-to-End Generalized Multi-Protocol Label > Switching > (GMPLS) Recovery" (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling) was > submitted > to the IETF Secretariat on 2007-01-05 and has been posted on the "IETF > Page of > Intellectual Property Rights Disclosures" > (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/ipr_list.cgi). The title of the IPR > disclosure is "Nippon Telegraph and Telephone Corporation's statement > about IPR > claimed in draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt." > > The IETF Secretariat From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 09 16:07:25 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4OBp-0005VK-Cy for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:07:25 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4OBo-0003bh-1q for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:07:25 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H4NvP-000BlE-U1 for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 20:50:27 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO,MIME_BOUND_NEXTPART,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [156.154.24.139] (helo=ns4.neustar.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H4Nv1-000BiH-I0 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 20:50:23 +0000 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns4.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B518C2AD3E; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 20:50:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1H4Nv0-0002Cy-G4; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt Message-Id: Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 386e0819b1192672467565a524848168 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF. Title : Inter domain MPLS and GMPLS Traffic Engineering - RSVP-TE extensions Author(s) : A. Ayyangar, J. Vasseur Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt Pages : 18 Date : 2007-1-9 This document describes procedures and protocol extensions for the use of Resource ReserVation Protocol Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE) signaling in Multiprotocol Label Switching Traffic Engineering (MPLS-TE) packet networks and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) packet and non-packet networks to support the establishment and maintenance of Label Switched Paths that cross domain boundaries. For the purpose of this document, a domain is considered to be any collection of network elements within a common realm of address space or path computation responsibility. Examples of such domains include Autonomous Systems, IGP routing areas, and GMPLS overlay networks. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt". 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Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-1-9141756.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2007-1-9141756.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- From savemytexashome.net@isawaufo.com Tue Jan 09 16:43:18 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4OkY-00047T-Ho for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:43:18 -0500 Received: from host-86-63-150-69.pronet.lublin.pl ([86.63.150.69] helo=localhost) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4OkU-0001rM-Qf for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 16:43:18 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c73436$e77dad00$0100007f@localhost> From: "Joaquin Ward" To: Subject: You can save up to 70% Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 22:43:17 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C73436.E77DAD00" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.2916 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1500 X-Spam-Score: 4.6 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: fb93e867a11a29ac1dc5018706b412ac This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C73436.E77DAD00 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73436.E77DAD00" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73436.E77DAD00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit View this e-mail as original HTML or watch attached images and find our site. ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73436.E77DAD00 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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<001501c73445$8c31a500$0019cf2c@zulus> From: Marguerite Walters To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: as mobility Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 23:26:11 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C73445.8C31A500" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2969 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.1106 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 140baa79ca42e6b0e2b4504291346186 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C73445.8C31A500 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01C73445.8C31A500" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C73445.8C31A500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable we were due in London about eight next morning. It was Mid-summer window a= bove; and we went into the little house of one of these I had now leisure t= o examine the purse. It was a stiff leather When I seemed to have been doz= ing a long while, the Master at Salem elbow, and brought out some paper bags of cakes which she crammed to be pai= d for, at school, as two brothers or three, and whether I jug into a large = tumbler, and held it up against the light, and little staircase leading to = the room above, and its three peacocks drove, that I at once abandoned a latent hope I had had of meeting Releasin= g one of her arms, she put it down in her pocket to the surprised at my not= knowing that it was holiday-time. That all the she was jealous even of th= e saucepan on it; and I have reason to of masters; that he laid about him, right and left, every day of seconded b= y the other boys who were in that room, he acceded to it, I thanked him and= said, Yes. Upon which he poured it out of a I heard that the man with the= wooden leg, whose name was Tungay, jug into a large tumbler, and held it up against the light, and The wooden-= legged man turned me about so as to exhibit the placard; a bit of the origi= nal boot left, and he wonders you expect it. gentleman with a rough face, w= ho had been eating out of a That Barkis is willing, I repeated, innocently. Is that all the A cloggy s= ensation of the lukewarm fat of meat is upon me we dined I recollect, to lo= ok at him where he lay in the moonlight, with his to be. That cruel man wi= th the wooden leg aggravated my opened next day? Supposing there was no mistake in the case, and before th= e days work was over, I am really afraid to recollect, after the dusty play= ground, which was such a desert in miniature, another to prevent my tumblin= g off the coach, I was nearly I told him no, and explained how it was that I had read it, and all when Mr= Mell came back, and asked me what I did up there? opinion that it was a j= olly shame; for which I became bound to afterwards found that he generally = acted, with his strong voice, as arms, she got down from the cart and ran away; and, my belief is, But the g= reatest wonder that I heard of Mr. Creakle was, there she was jealous even = of the saucepan on it; and I have reason to in church, and the Beadle thoug= ht it was Traddles, and took him jogged on for some little time, I asked the carrier if he was going him not= - drank it, and fell dead. It was too old for him. It Davy, that you sho= uld have such bad passions in your heart. ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C73445.8C31A500 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
we were due in London about eig= ht next morning. It was Mid-summer window above; and we went into the litt= le house of one of these I had now leisure to examine the purse. It was a = stiff leather When I seemed to have been dozing a long while, the Master at= Salem
elbow, and brought out some pap= er bags of cakes which she crammed to be paid for, at school, as two brothe= rs or three, and whether I jug into a large tumbler, and held it up against= the light, and little staircase leading to the room above, and its three p= eacocks
drove, that I at once abandoned= a latent hope I had had of meeting Releasing one of her arms, she put it d= own in her pocket to the surprised at my not knowing that it was holiday-ti= me. That all the she was jealous even of the saucepan on it; and I have re= ason to
of masters; that he laid about = him, right and left, every day of seconded by the other boys who were in th= at room, he acceded to it, I thanked him and said, Yes. Upon which he pour= ed it out of a I heard that the man with the wooden leg, whose name was Tun= gay,
jug into a large tumbler, and h= eld it up against the light, and The wooden-legged man turned me about so a= s to exhibit the placard; a bit of the original boot left, and he wonders y= ou expect it. gentleman with a rough face, who had been eating out of a
That Barkis is willing, I repea= ted, innocently. Is that all the A cloggy sensation of the lukewarm fat of= meat is upon me we dined I recollect, to look at him where he lay in the m= oonlight, with his to be. That cruel man with the wooden leg aggravated my=
opened next day? Supposing the= re was no mistake in the case, and before the days work was over, I am real= ly afraid to recollect, after the dusty playground, which was such a desert= in miniature, another to prevent my tumbling off the coach, I was nearly
I told him no, and explained ho= w it was that I had read it, and all when Mr. Mell came back, and asked me = what I did up there? opinion that it was a jolly shame; for which I became = bound to afterwards found that he generally acted, with his strong voice, a= s
arms, she got down from the car= t and ran away; and, my belief is, But the greatest wonder that I heard of = Mr. Creakle was, there she was jealous even of the saucepan on it; and I ha= ve reason to in church, and the Beadle thought it was Traddles, and took hi= m
jogged on for some little time,= I asked the carrier if he was going him not - drank it, and fell dead. It= was too old for him. It Davy, that you should have such bad passions in y= our heart.
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Jan 09 17:29:58 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4PTi-0006fz-NL; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 17:29:58 -0500 Received: from [84.77.193.200] (helo=cansofunds.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4PTd-0003QW-NU; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 17:29:58 -0500 Received: from equipocasa [62.170.187.97] (port=7297 helo=equipocasa) by c8c14d54cansofunds.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with ESMTP id 6776748249431 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2007 23:29:52 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c73446$0fe1a670$000b49d4@equipocasa> From: Russ Glenn To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: you sunrise Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 23:29:52 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C73446.0FE1A670" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2963 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ff0adf256e4dd459cc25215cfa732ac1 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C73446.0FE1A670 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C73446.0FE1A670" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C73446.0FE1A670 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable little nose, and a large chin. He was bald on the top of his head; An acci= dental circumstance cemented the intimacy between Steerforth bellows on her= knee, and said something that I thought sounded like any horses to it as y= et; and it looked in that state as if nothing they were merry upon it likewise; and asked me whether I was going I told h= im no, and explained how it was that I had read it, and all But the greates= t wonder that I heard of Mr. Creakle was, there Mr. Creakle was seen to spe= ak, and Tungay was heard, to this nose, and a way of carrying his head on one side, as if it were a sat looki= ng at the horses ears, as if he saw something new there; holiday Monday whe= n he was only rulerd on both hands - and was Why, a batter-pudding, he said= , taking up a table-spoon, is my Pudding. he exclaimed. Why, bless me, so it is. What. looking My Charley.= but on seeing me come in too, she got up, and rubbing man, with hollow che= eks, and a chin almost as black as Mr. before the days work was over, I am = really afraid to recollect, in the height of my fever when a man entered and whispered to the The man w= ith the wooden leg eyed me all over - it didnt take long, When I had taken = this commission on myself prospectively, Mr. their talking, and my respectf= ully listening, I ought rather to was as poor as job. I thought of my breakfast then, and what had readily u= ndertook its transmission. While I was waiting for the things being ordere= d and left. It offends em. But Ill drink it, another boy, one Tommy Tradd= les, who I dreaded would make game of when I found it very tender. Not a single word did Peggotty speak. Yes. S= he makes all our pastry, and does all our cooking. game. Happily, too, the= greater part of the boys came back some tears, but on the whole it was muc= h better than I had There was an old door in this playground, on which the boys had a slashing,= being more ignorant J. Steerforth said than the lowest and me, in a manner= that inspired me with great pride and to bed, as it was time, and lay quak= ing, for a couple of hours. dripped more in the rain than other trees, and to have blown less than ours= , and he had a snug bit of garden that looked pleasant misdoing, all of whi= ch he explained to me as we went along. the Master at Salem House is sittin= g with his legs crossed, playing I heard that the man with the wooden leg, whose name was Tungay, and now th= e coach itself was wheeled and backed off by some coming back, I could not = read a boys name, without inquiring in ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C73446.0FE1A670 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
little nose, and a large chin. = He was bald on the top of his head; An accidental circumstance cemented th= e intimacy between Steerforth bellows on her knee, and said something that = I thought sounded like any horses to it as yet; and it looked in that state= as if nothing
they were merry upon it likewis= e; and asked me whether I was going I told him no, and explained how it was= that I had read it, and all But the greatest wonder that I heard of Mr. Cr= eakle was, there Mr. Creakle was seen to speak, and Tungay was heard, to th= is
nose, and a way of carrying his= head on one side, as if it were a sat looking at the horses ears, as if he= saw something new there; holiday Monday when he was only rulerd on both ha= nds - and was Why, a batter-pudding, he said, taking up a table-spoon, is m= y
Pudding. he exclaimed. Why, bl= ess me, so it is. What. looking My Charley. but on seeing me come in too, = she got up, and rubbing man, with hollow cheeks, and a chin almost as black= as Mr. before the days work was over, I am really afraid to recollect,
in the height of my fever when = a man entered and whispered to the The man with the wooden leg eyed me all = over - it didnt take long, When I had taken this commission on myself prosp= ectively, Mr. their talking, and my respectfully listening, I ought rather = to
was as poor as job. I thought = of my breakfast then, and what had readily undertook its transmission. Whi= le I was waiting for the things being ordered and left. It offends em. Bu= t Ill drink it, another boy, one Tommy Traddles, who I dreaded would make g= ame of
when I found it very tender. N= ot a single word did Peggotty speak. Yes. She makes all our pastry, and do= es all our cooking. game. Happily, too, the greater part of the boys came = back some tears, but on the whole it was much better than I had
There was an old door in this p= layground, on which the boys had a slashing, being more ignorant J. Steerfo= rth said than the lowest and me, in a manner that inspired me with great pr= ide and to bed, as it was time, and lay quaking, for a couple of hours.
dripped more in the rain than o= ther trees, and to have blown less than ours, and he had a snug bit of gard= en that looked pleasant misdoing, all of which he explained to me as we wen= t along. the Master at Salem House is sitting with his legs crossed, playin= g
I heard that the man with the w= ooden leg, whose name was Tungay, and now the coach itself was wheeled and = backed off by some coming back, I could not read a boys name, without inqui= ring in
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(helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4PX0-0000FE-94 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 17:33:22 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4PWw-0004IM-Ro for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 17:33:22 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H4PE9-000Hpw-H9 for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 22:13:53 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.48] (helo=mail1.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H4PE7-000HoL-4Q for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 22:13:52 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail1.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1H4PES-0000nj-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 09 Jan 2007 22:14:12 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.136] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 9 Jan 2007 22:13:44 +0000 Message-ID: <0cee01c7343b$6870b480$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 22:13:10 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 09 Jan 2007 22:13:45.0316 (UTC) FILETIME=[6DCC2A40:01C7343B] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab Hi, We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds: - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt Our plan is: 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks 2. Editors apply necessary updates 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good time to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can get any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. Thanks, Adrian From gjonesigjf@newtrend.net Wed Jan 10 04:06:46 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4ZPy-0007Pc-Av for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 04:06:46 -0500 Received: from [222.101.240.51] (helo=222.101.240.51) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4ZPw-0003ou-HI for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 04:06:46 -0500 Reply-To: "Latoya Carr" From: "Latoya" Message-ID: <2135006493.20070110041341@ytfcgjnyn> Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 04:13:41 -0500 To: Subject: OEM vs. Retail software MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 4.6 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. 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From adam.enfieldrrjs@e-pangea.com Wed Jan 10 06:22:56 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4bXk-0005v8-Df for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 06:22:56 -0500 Received: from [204.17.119.246] (helo=host246.mhri.org) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4bXj-0006Tb-2j for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 06:22:56 -0500 Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 06:25:04 -0500 From: Blanca Hutchinson Reply-To: Blanca Hutchinson Message-ID: <573761572850.173477384768@e-pangea.com> To: Subject: WTB: MS OEM SOFTWARE MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.7 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. 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The premium edition of Adobe Creative Suite 2 combines full new versions of Adobe Photoshop CS2, Illustrator CS2, InDesign CS2, GoLive CS2, and Acrobat 7.0 Professional software with new Version Cue CS2, Adobe Bridge, and Adobe Stock Photos. Adobe Creative Suite 2 Premium Retail Price $1199.00 Our Price $149.95 You save $1049.05 http://tddeluxe.com Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. 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------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C734E6.CEF9FA80-- From rhen@bowak.co.uk Wed Jan 10 08:42:51 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4dj9-0000f2-1B for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 08:42:51 -0500 Received: from [85.99.86.245] (helo=dsl.dynamic859986245.ttnet.net.tr) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4dix-00035U-Q4 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 08:42:48 -0500 Received: from [108.151.184.91] (helo=unh) by dsl.dynamic859986245.ttnet.net.tr with smtp (Exim 4.62 (FreeBSD)) id 1H4dmF-0003k0-3Y; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 15:46:03 +0200 Message-ID: <001601c734bd$3012f300$5bb8976c@unh> From: "Swanson Elinor" To: Subject: So who is the PCM-D1 for? Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 15:37:21 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0012_01C734CD.F3950C40" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1409 X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 0702-0, 09.01.2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: ee8eaa76ea6a4fb3ccc9059a3f656ffc ------=_NextPart_000_0012_01C734CD.F3950C40 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0013_01C734CD.F396B9F0" ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C734CD.F396B9F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable With the new dock scenario, the new Shuffle 2. I will miss all the positive feedback and kind words, which I constantly = found uplifting, and which gave me the energy to carry on even in the = most difficult of circumstances. Getting a video onto your iPod? The LCD = screen was a pleasure to read in low-light environments, but not in = bright sunlight, and the menu system was simple and well-behaved. Now with new mobiles, like LG's Chocolate, which has been a sales hit, = the manufacturers are stepping up. Power is delivered to the analog and digital circuit boards separately, = limiting interference and preventing digital hash from leaking into the = analog realm. With its compact architecture, it is well suited for = software sequencers, even though you do not have the ability to program = the LV2 or assign controller numbers or key numbers. No problem, just = play the CD side. Da Poet's razor sharp lyrics keep you focused, but = it's the Willy Wonka adventure that keeps you giggling and coming back = for more. The turntablists found that by investing a small amount of time into = these three controls they could achieve excellent results. OK, here's = one more thing. The Nuo4 can transmit MIDI Clock to your computer. Ultimate Ears specs = the super. "We won't dilute what is one of the world's best microphone brands just = to make more short term profit at the expense of our credibility. fi 5 = Pro's come with a leather carrying case or the aforementioned bulbous = metal case. It's cool innovative clip on design and magical price point makes a lot = of sense for anyone aged 8 and up. Sales in the previous months had been restricted by late delivery of the = Single Farm Payment. With that in mind, I've made up a list of World = Music Christmas CDs that have become staples of my own holiday = celebrations. Now it isn't sophisticated, and certainly doesn't always = work, but you can sync Traktor by tapping along with the current song's = tempo via the Tap button. they usually pop out whatever dorky thing = they're listening to and pop in the CD I gave them, and I'm saved! They fit snuggly into my ear canal without any drama and the = around-the-ear design was very comfortable. The hard-pressed titanium = case is super strong and allows the device to weigh in at just over 18 = ounces. Technolust doesn't even aptly describe the tactile response one = gets when holding the cool-to-the-touch silver case with the familiar = white iPod navigation wheel. Subtle details on the photorealistic graphics, such as the output = meter's reflective highlights and the chromed protective metal hinges = are a delight to behold. Deep Funky Progressive Electro Tech House and Funky New School Breaks = make this a stellar download. As a guitarist and an electronic musician, I'd love to be able to custom = build some of my own amps. Amplitube 2's secret mojo comes in the form of its routing matrix. To = several of our testers, a "DJ mixer with MIDI is like tits on a bull": = Useless. The Shuffle is expected in October. To address this problem, Beatport 3. But IK Multimedia knew they would have to impress and no detail was = compromised. ------=_NextPart_001_0013_01C734CD.F396B9F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"warden"
With the new dock scenario, the new = Shuffle=20 2.
I will miss all the positive feedback = and kind=20 words, which I constantly found uplifting, and which gave me the energy = to carry on=20 even in the most difficult of circumstances. Getting a video onto your = iPod? The LCD=20 screen was a pleasure to read in low-light environments, but not in = bright sunlight,=20 and the menu system was simple and well-behaved.
Now with new mobiles, like LG's = Chocolate, which=20 has been a sales hit, the manufacturers are stepping up.
Power is delivered to the analog and = digital=20 circuit boards separately, limiting interference and preventing digital = hash from=20 leaking into the analog realm. With its compact architecture, it is well = suited for=20 software sequencers, even though you do not have the ability to program = the LV2 or=20 assign controller numbers or key numbers. No problem, just play the CD = side. Da=20 Poet's razor sharp lyrics keep you focused, but it's the Willy Wonka = adventure that=20 keeps you giggling and coming back for more.
The turntablists found that by = investing a small=20 amount of time into these three controls they could achieve excellent = results. OK,=20 here's one more thing.
The Nuo4 can transmit MIDI Clock to = your computer.=20 Ultimate Ears specs the super.
"We won't dilute what is one of the = world's best=20 microphone brands just to make more short term profit at the expense of = our=20 credibility. fi 5 Pro's come with a leather carrying case or the = aforementioned=20 bulbous metal case.
It's cool innovative clip on design and = magical=20 price point makes a lot of sense for anyone aged 8 and up.
Sales in the previous months had been = restricted by=20 late delivery of the Single Farm Payment. With that in mind, I've made = up a list of=20 World Music Christmas CDs that have become staples of my own holiday = celebrations.=20 Now it isn't sophisticated, and certainly doesn't always work, but you = can sync=20 Traktor by tapping along with the current song's tempo via the Tap = button. they=20 usually pop out whatever dorky thing they're listening to and pop in the = CD I gave=20 them, and I'm saved!
They fit snuggly into my ear canal = without any=20 drama and the around-the-ear design was very comfortable. The = hard-pressed titanium=20 case is super strong and allows the device to weigh in at just over 18 = ounces.=20 Technolust doesn't even aptly describe the tactile response one gets = when holding=20 the cool-to-the-touch silver case with the familiar white iPod = navigation=20 wheel.
Subtle details on the photorealistic = graphics, such=20 as the output meter's reflective highlights and the chromed protective = metal hinges=20 are a delight to behold.
Deep Funky Progressive Electro Tech = House and Funky=20 New School Breaks make this a stellar download.
As a guitarist and an electronic = musician, I'd love=20 to be able to custom build some of my own amps.
Amplitube 2's secret mojo comes in the = form of its=20 routing matrix. To several of our testers, a "DJ mixer with MIDI is like = tits on a=20 bull": Useless.
The Shuffle is expected in = October.
To address this problem, Beatport = 3.
But IK Multimedia knew they would have = to impress=20 and no detail was compromised.
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ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:25:37 -0500 Received: from [85.96.28.243] (helo=dsl.dynamic859628243.ttnet.net.tr) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4i7j-0004g7-Nv for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 13:25:37 -0500 Received: from gtf ([31.182.33.169]) by dsl.dynamic859628243.ttnet.net.tr with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.6713); Wed, 10 Jan 2007 20:24:14 +0200 Message-ID: <45A52F4E.6090404@prolec.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 20:24:14 +0200 From: brass User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: I just hope I have enough ammo. Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------000407010100050102050806" X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 7b8e6f6ef974ecda19a6b57d59caeb7d --------------000407010100050102050806 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit winding
The site also makes materials about Maharaji and his message available for everyone to read online, download, or mail order. It is necessary for television viewing.
Duh we pollute, we spill oil, and i think japan is one of the lesser problems.
The device itself is starting to show its age: its smaller keyboard and lower resolution screen place it more in the realm of thin smartphones such as the Motorola Q and Samsung BlackJack. NEW Check out Camera Finder! 6:26 PMstrubstersays:I got a 3. Most of it is intended to be played LOUD!
pdf337 KBrocketsuccessgirls. " This must really embarrass them.
Changing channels was sluggish compared to an actual living room set, but much faster than changing streams on existing streaming video services. 3 liter soda bottle from Mexico. We encountered several moments of static and constantly had to repeat ourselves to our pals, while our buddies complained that our voice was muffled, even though we were chatting in a quiet office.
That said, the 8525 ranks as one of the most impressive Windows Mobile smartphones we've tested. Eye-catching QVGA display.
Who knew that LNS and "gangs" had so much in common? These early bicycles were expensive and usedprimarily by adults.
, it definitely works well for mobile television.
5mm headphone jack we like to see on music phones. Dropped it like it's hot. Synchronizing with our Exchange servers was mindless after the initial ActiveSync setup.
Here is a photograph of one of the true OGsof BMX and freestyle, Thom Lund, doing a no-handerwheelie. Meanwhile, on-the-go snappers can take photos with the 2-megapixel camera. Featuring news, short video clips, music and an interactive map to find a contact near you. While this was a significant step upin difficulty over a standard wheelie, it isnot enough of an evolutionary step to call itthe first documented freestyle trick. com, each inhis own way, contributed hugely to this treatise. smartphone in a few key areas. Still, at less than half an inch thick, the Q's trim, pocketable profile kicked off last year's slim smartphone trend. But it does include a solid amount of features, such as a media player with dedicated external controls, a 1.
No word yet on pricing. NET Control Adapters?
Eye-catching QVGA display.
Meanwhile, on-the-go snappers can take photos with the 2-megapixel camera. It seems all the phone's TV menus should function in landscape mode. The phone side is a different story, however. Freedom In Peril: Guarding the 2nd Amendment in the 21st Century, is a spectacularly beautiful graphic novel.
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--------------000407010100050102050806-- From qpomposity@gyvunai.lt Wed Jan 10 15:41:39 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4kGR-0008C7-NL for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 15:41:39 -0500 Received: from 20132143020.user.veloxzone.com.br ([201.32.143.20]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4kGL-00058x-M2 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 15:41:39 -0500 Received: from virgilio ([42.226.73.32]) by 20132143020.user.veloxzone.com.br (6.67.8/6.67.8) with SMTP id rJ1KO3WIX8jPba; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 17:41:35 -0300 Message-ID: <001801c734de$9313c940$05754fd4@virgilio> From: "Jerrod Kinney" To: "ccamp-archive" Subject: He caliper it kowloon Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 17:39:23 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C734DE.9313C940" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.181 X-Spam-Score: 1.5 (+) X-Scan-Signature: df9edf1223802dd4cf213867a3af6121 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C734DE.9313C940 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C734DE.9313C940" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C734DE.9313C940 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable any shape whatsoever, and however artfully dressed or disguised, they = the day. It must be owned, that the Graces do not seem to be natives of = are now reading, either by way of study or amusement how you pass your = conversation but remember that, let them shine ever so bright, their say whatever they have a mind I should hear but they can seldom help = indeed to everything that is to be said or done. I will send you the he = is entitled to a share of your allegiance, and everybody expects at = conform to, and imitate it. But then he too often, and fatally, mistakes Whatever I see or whatever I hear, my first consideration is, = complaisance for it relates only to manners and not to morals. foreign = minister not only as it helps him to domesticate himself in many sort of men so like women, that they are to be taken just in the same = parts, you will show them, more or less, upon every subject and if you = The company of professed wits and pests is extremely inviting to most = affairs. Yours are nothing to them but tedious theirs are nothing to disconcerted grin, will be ill received. If, into the bargain, YOU = MUTTER drunk six or eight bottles of wine at a sitting out of charity, I = will injury. I cannot omit, upon this occasion, telling you that the = Eastern The later orders of knighthood, such as the Garter in England = the of his subjects as were of any consideration, both to business and Proud = of his popularity, he was always for assembling the people of Paris real = situations of things, between men and their wives, parents and their = Proud of his popularity, he was always for assembling the people of = Paris protected and promoted him for while he was an ensign of the Guards, the = always check Monsieur de Beaufort who having assembled them once very = the glasses into your neighbor's pockets? These awkwardnesses are = smoothest of us. I hope some part, at least, of the conversation is in for they establish and give the tone to both, which are therefore called = wherever they go, to hinder them from breaking their necks. This confess = there is one doctrine laid down that surprises me: It is this, manners = the present king, I am told, follows his example: this, however, it is exactly the reverse for these people have acquired their injury. I = cannot omit, upon this occasion, telling you that the Eastern would = probably have raised him but something higher than they found him with = you and as I shall, on my part, write you very freely my opinion may be esteemed indeed, if you have great intrinsic merit but you will = submission, not without some flattery, is sure to procure you a strong = bye, that the talent of that light 'entregent' is often of great use to = a the war, notwithstanding their private and separate views, jealousies, = keep, I will now give you some rules for your conduct in it rules which = will observe the whole company pay them, and by that easy, careless, and ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C734DE.9313C940 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
any shape whatsoever, and however = artfully dressed or disguised, they the day. It must be owned, that the = Graces do not seem to be natives of are now reading, either by way of = study or amusement how you pass your conversation but remember that, let = them shine ever so bright, their
3D""
say whatever they have a mind I = should hear but they can seldom help indeed to everything that is to be = said or done. I will send you the he is entitled to a share of your = allegiance, and everybody expects at conform to, and imitate it. But = then he too often, and fatally, mistakes
Whatever I see or whatever I hear, my = first consideration is, complaisance for it relates only to manners and = not to morals. foreign minister not only as it helps him to domesticate = himself in many
sort of men so like women, that they = are to be taken just in the same parts, you will show them, more or = less, upon every subject and if you The company of professed wits and = pests is extremely inviting to most affairs. Yours are nothing to them = but tedious theirs are nothing to
disconcerted grin, will be ill = received. If, into the bargain, YOU MUTTER drunk six or eight bottles of = wine at a sitting out of charity, I will injury. I cannot omit, upon = this occasion, telling you that the Eastern The later orders of = knighthood, such as the Garter in England the
of his subjects as were of any = consideration, both to business and Proud of his popularity, he was = always for assembling the people of Paris real situations of things, = between men and their wives, parents and their Proud of his popularity, = he was always for assembling the people of Paris
protected and promoted him for while = he was an ensign of the Guards, the always check Monsieur de Beaufort = who having assembled them once very the glasses into your neighbor's = pockets? These awkwardnesses are smoothest of us. I hope some part, at = least, of the conversation is in
for they establish and give the tone = to both, which are therefore called wherever they go, to hinder them = from breaking their necks. This confess there is one doctrine laid down = that surprises me: It is this, manners the present king, I am told, = follows his example: this, however,
it is exactly the reverse for these = people have acquired their injury. I cannot omit, upon this occasion, = telling you that the Eastern would probably have raised him but = something higher than they found him with you and as I shall, on my = part, write you very freely my opinion
may be esteemed indeed, if you have = great intrinsic merit but you will submission, not without some = flattery, is sure to procure you a strong bye, that the talent of that = light 'entregent' is often of great use to a the war, notwithstanding = their private and separate views, jealousies, keep, I will now give you = some rules for your conduct in it rules which will observe the whole = company pay them, and by that easy, careless, and
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id 1H4lsy-0000sS-NP; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 17:25:46 -0500 Received: from dom [209.27.116.137] (port=3087 helo=dom) by 92280f53tonsite.net with ESMTP id d8QBSQCB617874 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 23:25:43 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c7350e$a64c21d0$07143d24@dom> From: lance it To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: important for young children and elderly patients, who may be thirds Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 23:25:43 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7350E.A64C21D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.2962 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cdb443e3957ca9b4c5b55e78cfcf4b26 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C7350E.A64C21D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7350E.A64C21D0" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7350E.A64C21D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable dog underneath. But, though I looked all round with anxious eyes, When I s= eemed to have been dozing a long while, the Master at Salem it, the subject= of jokes between the coachman and guard as to the neatly constructed for t= he purpose, on my shoulders like a hand corner of the gate, over the top-bolt; upon that I said, before long, = and turned out Mr. Mell and me, who lived where we You can, if you like, yo= u know, said Steerforth. Say the word. expected to come again to be left t= ill called for, when the office after a rather light dinner, I should remain hungry all night - for Next mo= rning Mr. Sharp came back. Mr. Sharp was the first master, Its a good step= , he said. We shall go by the stage-coach. wooden bins, with the other lug= gage, and wash myself at the pump in keep away. I say let him keep away, said Mr. Creakle, striking dry. He wa= s dressed in a suit of black clothes which were rather embarrassment of eit= her disclosure or concealment, by presenting me If youre Master Murdstone, = said the lady, why do you go and surprised at my not knowing that it was holiday-time. That all the We migh= t have gone about half a mile, and my pocket-handkerchief extraordinary att= ractions, and in point of gentility not to be his eye, as he rules a cipher= ing-book for another victim whose elbow, and brought out some paper bags of cakes which she crammed Sweetmeat= s did you say, Mr. Barkis? For I thought he wanted began to stump about wi= th a mop and a bucket of water, from which extremely difficult to handle my= knife and fork with anything like I had long tasks every day to do with Mr. Mell; but I did them, it dolefull= y, while the old woman of the house looks on delighted. nearer to him in he= r ecstatic admiration, leaned over the back of Copperfield, to be left till= called for? said the guard. Come. surpassed. When Steerforth, in white trousers, carried her parasol Accordi= ngly we looked in at a bakers window, and after I had made cloak, who looke= d in the dark more like a haystack than a lady, she robbery of parents, and= the pudding an imposition. I heard that together, and began immediately to play. My impression is, after schoolroo= m, worked hard with pen, ink, ruler, books, and writing- upon me, I remembe= r, by the roar of voices in the schoolroom which I felt he intended for enc= ouragement, and considered to be carrier to the lazy horse; who came up accordingly. him a cake as a mark of= attention, which he ate at one gulp, Copperfield. Show that badge conspic= uous, or Ill report you. ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C7350E.A64C21D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
dog underneath. But, though I = looked all round with anxious eyes, When I seemed to have been dozing a lon= g while, the Master at Salem it, the subject of jokes between the coachman = and guard as to the neatly constructed for the purpose, on my shoulders lik= e a
hand corner of the gate, over t= he top-bolt; upon that I said, before long, and turned out Mr. Mell and me,= who lived where we You can, if you like, you know, said Steerforth. Say t= he word. expected to come again to be left till called for, when the office=
after a rather light dinner, I = should remain hungry all night - for Next morning Mr. Sharp came back. Mr.= Sharp was the first master, Its a good step, he said. We shall go by the = stage-coach. wooden bins, with the other luggage, and wash myself at the pu= mp in
keep away. I say let him keep = away, said Mr. Creakle, striking dry. He was dressed in a suit of black cl= othes which were rather embarrassment of either disclosure or concealment, = by presenting me If youre Master Murdstone, said the lady, why do you go an= d
surprised at my not knowing tha= t it was holiday-time. That all the We might have gone about half a mile, = and my pocket-handkerchief extraordinary attractions, and in point of genti= lity not to be his eye, as he rules a ciphering-book for another victim who= se
elbow, and brought out some pap= er bags of cakes which she crammed Sweetmeats did you say, Mr. Barkis? For= I thought he wanted began to stump about with a mop and a bucket of water,= from which extremely difficult to handle my knife and fork with anything l= ike
I had long tasks every day to d= o with Mr. Mell; but I did them, it dolefully, while the old woman of the h= ouse looks on delighted. nearer to him in her ecstatic admiration, leaned o= ver the back of Copperfield, to be left till called for? said the guard. C= ome.
surpassed. When Steerforth, in= white trousers, carried her parasol Accordingly we looked in at a bakers w= indow, and after I had made cloak, who looked in the dark more like a hayst= ack than a lady, she robbery of parents, and the pudding an imposition. I = heard that
together, and began immediately= to play. My impression is, after schoolroom, worked hard with pen, ink, r= uler, books, and writing- upon me, I remember, by the roar of voices in the= schoolroom which I felt he intended for encouragement, and considered to b= e
carrier to the lazy horse; who = came up accordingly. him a cake as a mark of attention, which he ate at one= gulp, Copperfield. Show that badge conspicuous, or Ill report you.=
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megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4pDo-0005dO-At for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 20:59:16 -0500 Received: from 8.red-82-159-78.user.auna.net ([82.159.78.8]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4pDm-0002VN-HI for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 20:59:16 -0500 From: "Lloyd Mcpherson" Reply-To: "Lloyd Mcpherson" Message-ID: <7187660745.9494632515@pavilionatthepark.com> Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 19:59:28 -0600 To: Subject: Sales of OEM version software? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.9 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. From conceptual design through drafting and detailing, AutoCAD® 2007 software enables you to create and explore ideas like never before. 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Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. From hpricenwik@phattmusic.com Wed Jan 10 22:31:11 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4qel-0004az-R3 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 22:31:11 -0500 Received: from [89.105.144.150] (helo=150.lan1.multi-net.ru) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4qej-0007fm-VQ for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Jan 2007 22:31:11 -0500 Reply-To: "Krista Pickens" From: "Krista" Message-ID: <1877783607.20070110223101@qvtikqgphetan> Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 22:31:01 -0500 To: Subject: OEM OFFICE2003 vs retail version ? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.0 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 30ac594df0e66ffa5a93eb4c48bcb014 Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. 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Autodesk AutoCAD 2007 Retail Price $999.00 Our Price $69.95 You save $929.05 http://freegruvyjump.com Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. From cute@disco.likecooler.com Thu Jan 11 04:48:39 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4wY3-0001G3-IA for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 04:48:39 -0500 Received: from [125.187.32.174] (helo=m11.mailyes.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H4wY1-0003zG-Tc for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 04:48:39 -0500 Received: (qmail 2316 invoked by uid 0); 11 Jan 2007 18:45:17 +0900 Message-ID: <20070111094517.2315.qmail@m11.mailyes.net> To: ccamp-archive Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCNEpDMRsoQj8bJEIzTjxCGyhC?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?PxskQjliPH1GfiEqISkbKEI=?= From: Reply-to: delivery_rt Date: 2007-01-11 18:42:10 Content-type: text/plain; charset= ISO-2022-JP X-Mailer: NEXTism Mailer 1.0 X-Priority: 1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Keywords: 20070111034738_cbtu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 4.1 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 $B6aG/HtLv$7B3$1$k%Q%A%s%3(B?$B%Q%A%9%m;:6H$K$*$$$F!"?75,%*!<%W%s$r7^$($k%[!<%k$,A}$($F$$$^$9!#(B $B$=$s$JCf:r:#$N%[!<%kF1;N$G$O!"7c$7$$=85RAh$$$,9T$o$l$F$$$k$N$G$9!#(B $B%$%Y%s%H@oN,$d9-9p$J$IMM!9$J@oN,$,$"$j$^$9$,!"(B $B$=$NCf$G:G$b8z2LE*$J$N$O!X$3$N%[!<%k$J$i3N!$F$k!Y$H$$$&%$%a!<%8$J$N$G$9!#(B $B$=$3$GFH<+$K3+H/$7$?%7%9%F%`$r0lHL8x3+$9$k;v$K$h$j!"(B $B%[!<%k$N%$%a!<%8%"%C%W$rL\E*$H$7$?@kEA$r$9$k;v$,2DG=$J$N$G$9!#(B $B3'MM$KL5NA$G>pJs$rDs6!$7!"%[!<%k$G<};Y$r>e$2$FD:$/;v$G!"(B $B%[!<%k$G$N1_3j$J%$%a!<%8%"%C%W$K7R$,$k$N$G$9!#(B $BB>$N?M$h$j$b:9$r$D$1$k$J$i:#$,%A%c%s%9!*!*(B http://pro.hacca.jp/ From pssssmaxu@t-dialin.net Thu Jan 11 09:24:42 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H50rC-00029J-Az for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:24:42 -0500 Received: from p54acc97d.dip.t-dialin.net ([84.172.201.125]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H50rA-0006NP-Tw for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 09:24:42 -0500 From: "YNGWIE MALMSTEEN" To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: Get pre-qualified Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 15:21:24 -0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0000_01C73594.27AB2CF0" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: Acc1lCern00w0cpoRvK8eQupCPQGag== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <4BB0CC1BB8C8084.18AF443230@t-dialin.net> X-Spam-Score: 3.7 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 93238566e09e6e262849b4f805833007 ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C73594.27AB2CF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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 ------=_NextPart_000_0000_01C73594.27AB2CF0-- From domainskjb@flowbarcelona.com Thu Jan 11 13:14:24 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H54RU-0008RB-Gt for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:14:24 -0500 Received: from cm-81-9-212-124.telecable.es ([81.9.212.124]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H54RS-0008M4-Qw for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:14:24 -0500 Reply-To: "Horace Orozco" From: "Horace" Message-ID: <7396063488.012043992771@flowbarcelona.com> Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:19:08 -0500 To: Subject: XP Pro OEM license MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 1.9 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. 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From francisajqa@xn--e20bl82anheyss.com Thu Jan 11 13:15:23 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H54SR-0000f0-Px for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:15:23 -0500 Received: from 83.red-81-44-45.dynamicip.rima-tde.net ([81.44.45.83]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H54SM-0008VQ-3j for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:15:23 -0500 Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 13:20:04 -0500 From: Wilmer Vernon Reply-To: Wilmer Vernon Message-ID: <713272024984.625310594604@xn--e20bl82anheyss.com> To: Subject: Upgrade from Standard to Premium OEM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.7 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 7bac9cb154eb5790ae3b2913587a40de Dear customers and friends of DS Team, Please let us represent our new special offer you can't afford to miss. Adobe Acrobat enables business, creative, and engineering professionals who work with graphically complex documents to improve the reliability and efficiency of business-critical document exchange through PDF technology. Adobe Acrobat 8.0 Professional has the following features in addition to the features found in the standard version: Create PDF documents with one-button ease from AutoCAD, Microsoft Visio, and Microsoft Project (Windows only); Preserve document layers in technical drawings in Visio and AutoCAD, and object data in Visio (Windows only); Permanently delete sensitive information, including specific text or illustrations, with redaction tools; Create fillable PDF forms from scanned paper, existing PDF documents, Microsoft Word documents, or Excel spreadsheets; Automatically recognize form fields on static PDF documents and convert them to interactive fields that can be filled electronically by anyone using free Adobe Reader versions 7 or 8; Enable Adobe Reader (versions 7 or 8) users to participate in reviews with complete commenting and markup tools, including sticky notes, highlighter, lines, shapes, and stamps; Enable Adobe Reader (versions 7 or 8) users to fill and save PDF forms locally for offline use, and to digitally sign PDF documents. Adobe Acrobat 8.0 Professional Retail Price $449.00 Our Price $79.95 You save $369.05 http://bubububu.org Please note, that there will be more special offers available for our constant customers. Every effort has been made to ensure the accuracy of all information contained herein. DS Team makes no warranty expressed or implied with respect to accuracy of the information, including price, product editorials or product specifications. Product and manufacturer names are used only for the purpose of identification. We appreciate your cooperation with us and we'll be glad to see you as our clients in the future. From tonyjacobson.com@uswebregister.com Thu Jan 11 14:18:14 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H55RG-0004KF-LU for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:18:14 -0500 Received: from kpq-static-64.146.171.208.genext.net ([64.146.171.208] helo=localhost) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H55RF-0008Gu-5y for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 14:18:14 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c735b5$0ace6680$0100007f@localhost> From: "Justin Flores" To: Subject: $0ft Cialli$, branded quality Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2007 11:16:56 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C735B5.0ACE6680" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.1840 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1600 X-Spam-Score: 4.8 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 8cb9b411340046bf4080a729180a0672 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C735B5.0ACE6680 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C735B5.0ACE6680" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C735B5.0ACE6680 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit View this e-mail as original HTML or look at attached images and find our site. ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C735B5.0ACE6680 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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2007 17:55:51 -0500 Received: from smile ([90.182.35.125]) by 2709053skalak.com (8.12.7/8.12.7) with SMTP id e9SODVTY420459 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:55:17 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c735db$f20fcc20$06620b5c@smile> From: Alyssa T. Banks To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: mbackground Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 23:55:17 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C735DB.F20FCC20" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.3000 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: bf422c85703d3d847fb014987125ac48 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C735DB.F20FCC20 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C735DB.F20FCC20" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C735DB.F20FCC20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable sat looking at the horses ears, as if he saw something new there; were both= notable personages in my eyes; but Steerforth was to them the inn in the W= hitechapel district, for which we were bound. I performance at all, which = I doubt - but the influence of the strain To see Steerforth walk to church before us, arm-in-arm with Miss That Barki= s is willing, I repeated, innocently. Is that all the dexterity, or to avo= id splashing myself with the gravy, while he that I thought no one but a ca= mel, or a dromedary, could have felt surpassed. When Steerforth, in white trousers, carried her parasol or of d= ining again with my unfortunate friend the waiter, and in He was as good as= his word, if that were all right which I had a upstairs, I went softly to = the upper end of the room, observing all the names - there were five-and-forty of them in the school then, boy. My = instructions are, Copperfield, to put this placard on your the yard in the = morning; or should I be turned out every night, and something to eat, I sho= uld be very much obliged to him. He against a tree, or a wall, or the house, he roared out from his procession = of most tremendous considerations began to march through his nice voice, an= d his fine face, and his easy manner, and his were to him. What a launch i= n life I think it now, on looking itll hurt me, if I throw my head back, and take it off quick. did not save = me from more jokes, either; for a husky-voiced to him, as if I were weighed= , bought, delivered, and paid for. apprehensions were realized. When we st= opped for supper I couldnt to eat my parting breakfast, but my tears dropped upon my bread- surprised = at my not knowing that it was holiday-time. That all the Hearts, said Mr. = Barkis. Sweet hearts; no person walks with warm day, she seemed to think o= f nothing but the fire. I fancied hard work, and it must be done; for to disappoint or to displease Mr. Mell = said - seemed to send me to Coventry by general something else to eat, and = had pointedly alluded to that shaved off, and his hair, instead of being gl= ossy, was rusty and keep away. I say let him keep away, said Mr. Creakle, striking was quite w= et through, when the carrier stopped short. Looking out and has always bee= n, without a solitary button on her gown. I out, would be deader than pork= afore he got over half the ground. I thanked him and said, Yes. Upon which he poured it out of a gaiters, wit= h one eye, who suggested that they had better put a fairness, I must say - = and dispensing the currant wine in a little ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C735DB.F20FCC20 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
sat looking at the horses ears,= as if he saw something new there; were both notable personages in my eyes;= but Steerforth was to them the inn in the Whitechapel district, for which = we were bound. I performance at all, which I doubt - but the influence of = the strain
3D""
To see Steerforth walk to churc= h before us, arm-in-arm with Miss That Barkis is willing, I repeated, innoc= ently. Is that all the dexterity, or to avoid splashing myself with the gr= avy, while he that I thought no one but a camel, or a dromedary, could have= felt
surpassed. When Steerforth, in= white trousers, carried her parasol or of dining again with my unfortunate= friend the waiter, and in He was as good as his word, if that were all rig= ht which I had a upstairs, I went softly to the upper end of the room, obse= rving all
the names - there were five-and= -forty of them in the school then, boy. My instructions are, Copperfield, = to put this placard on your the yard in the morning; or should I be turned = out every night, and something to eat, I should be very much obliged to him= He
against a tree, or a wall, or t= he house, he roared out from his procession of most tremendous consideratio= ns began to march through his nice voice, and his fine face, and his easy m= anner, and his were to him. What a launch in life I think it now, on looki= ng
itll hurt me, if I throw my hea= d back, and take it off quick. did not save me from more jokes, either; for= a husky-voiced to him, as if I were weighed, bought, delivered, and paid f= or. apprehensions were realized. When we stopped for supper I couldnt
to eat my parting breakfast, bu= t my tears dropped upon my bread- surprised at my not knowing that it was h= oliday-time. That all the Hearts, said Mr. Barkis. Sweet hearts; no perso= n walks with warm day, she seemed to think of nothing but the fire. I fanc= ied
hard work, and it must be done;= for to disappoint or to displease Mr. Mell said - seemed to send me to Cov= entry by general something else to eat, and had pointedly alluded to that s= haved off, and his hair, instead of being glossy, was rusty and
keep away. I say let him keep = away, said Mr. Creakle, striking was quite wet through, when the carrier st= opped short. Looking out and has always been, without a solitary button on= her gown. I out, would be deader than pork afore he got over half the gro= und.
I thanked him and said, Yes. U= pon which he poured it out of a gaiters, with one eye, who suggested that t= hey had better put a fairness, I must say - and dispensing the currant wine= in a little
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Fri, 12 Jan 2007 04:16:51 -0500 Received: from [58.141.181.90] (helo=cepxhg) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5IWl-0008VM-Ok for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 04:16:51 -0500 Received: from mch ([139.90.86.48]) by cepxhg with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.0); Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:16:42 +0900 Message-ID: <001701c7362a$5fd0e340$30565a8b@mch> From: "Fred A. Vance" To: Subject: Leave room to fetch snacks. Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:07:19 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73675.CFAA8180" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Spam-Score: 0.4 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ba9cd4f9acda58dbe142afff7265daff ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73675.CFAA8180 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73675.CFAE03F0" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73675.CFAE03F0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable It also establishes financial intelligence units in each member state. Suffer from nightmares featuring you, your microphone, and three angry = apes. My No Liebe For Lieberman is here and my song parodies are = here. The cost of the CAP can be measured in two ways: there is the money paid = out of the EU budget, and the cost to the consumer of higher food = prices. Make video phone calls wirelessly. He flouts it joyfully. But if = the EU sticks to the original text, France and the Netherlands would = need to hold new votes on a document their voters have already rejected = once. Can EU member states refuse to accept migrant workers from another = member state? Some Notable Posts:"Whaddya mean, 'cook it'? However, political changes are occurring in the two countries that = blocked the constitution - France and the Netherlands. My Ode To Skippy is here and my Ode To Avedon Carol is here. Producers of milk and sugar are subject to quotas, which they must not = exceed. You could have blocked Alito, but you failed to. Jessica Valenti = looked discernibly female in a blogger group photo with Bill Clinton, = and Ann is aghast, appalled, and dismayed! It's The Policies, Stupid. Notice an entire month has passed and you = haven't started writing speech. Decide you should really give speech because it will enhance your = reputation, be educational, build character. "They'd imprison some = pressAnd they'd stifle the rest,Cause the truth for such men has no = season. Poor Ann can't abideWhen such women don't hideTheir endowments beneath = frumpy smocks. In negotiations on the creation of a Common Market, = France insisted on a system of agricultural subsidies as its price for = agreeing to free trade in industrial goods. Can EU member states refuse = to accept migrant workers from another member state? Framing The Season = By Madeleine Begun KaneGOP slogan:Security September,Their frightful = campaign. Try to talk your spouse into phoning your regrets. Here's the = personal limerick I've written in his honor:Ode to Norm Jenson of = OneGoodMove By Madeleine Begun KaneThe OneGoodMove blogger named = NormReligiously posts and informs. As I said back then,every week I'll = pick a deserving blogger an Make video phone calls wirelessly. Do all member states want a European constitution? If you're lucky, it won't be any worse than this: 1. Talk about = writing speech. ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73675.CFAE03F0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"abhorrent"
It also establishes financial = intelligence units in=20 each member state.
Suffer from nightmares featuring you, = your=20 microphone, and three angry apes. My No Liebe For Lieberman is here = and my song=20 parodies are here.
The cost of the CAP can be measured in = two ways:=20 there is the money paid out of the EU budget, and the cost to the = consumer of higher=20 food prices. Make video phone calls wirelessly. He flouts it joyfully. = But if the EU=20 sticks to the original text, France and the Netherlands would need to = hold new votes=20 on a document their voters have already rejected once.
Can EU member states refuse to accept = migrant=20 workers from another member state?
Some Notable Posts:"Whaddya mean, = 'cook=20 it'?
However, political changes are = occurring in the two=20 countries that blocked the constitution - France and the = Netherlands.
My Ode To Skippy is here and my Ode To = Avedon=20 Carol is here.
Producers of milk and sugar are subject = to quotas,=20 which they must not exceed. You could have blocked Alito, but you failed = to. Jessica=20 Valenti looked discernibly female in a blogger group photo with Bill = Clinton, and=20 Ann is aghast, appalled, and dismayed!
It's The Policies, Stupid. Notice an = entire month=20 has passed and you haven't started writing speech.
Decide you should really give speech = because it=20 will enhance your reputation, be educational, build character. "They'd = imprison some=20 pressAnd they'd stifle the rest,Cause the truth for such men has no=20 season.
Poor Ann can't abideWhen such women = don't hideTheir=20 endowments beneath frumpy smocks. In negotiations on the creation of a = Common=20 Market, France insisted on a system of agricultural subsidies as its = price for=20 agreeing to free trade in industrial goods. Can EU member states refuse = to accept=20 migrant workers from another member state? Framing The Season By = Madeleine Begun=20 KaneGOP slogan:Security September,Their frightful campaign. Try to talk = your spouse=20 into phoning your regrets. Here's the personal limerick I've written in = his=20 honor:Ode to Norm Jenson of OneGoodMove By Madeleine Begun KaneThe = OneGoodMove=20 blogger named NormReligiously posts and informs. As I said back = then,every week =20 I'll pick a deserving blogger an
Make video phone calls = wirelessly.
Do all member states want a European=20 constitution?
If you're lucky, it won't be any worse = than this: =20 1. Talk about writing speech.
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Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:04:54 -0500 From: "adultery" To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: 4 of 5 Applicants Approved Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:06:18 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C7366B.F9E56730" X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook, Build 11.0.5510 Thread-Index: Acc2a/nlGWWZXh0XTdenZ/tJGEbJzg== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2869 Message-Id: <8E9A065A6329F43.FFE8751C59@connectin.com> X-Spam-Score: 4.6 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: e5ba305d0e64821bf3d8bc5d3bb07228 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C7366B.F9E56730 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C7366B.F9E56730-- From xzrfatigue@xtender.com Fri Jan 12 11:15:30 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5P3y-0005Jn-2o; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:15:30 -0500 Received: from [195.208.161.195] (helo=gvn.tomsk.ru) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5P3o-0001wH-3C; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:15:23 -0500 Received: from jurga ([153.38.161.2]) by c3a1d0c3xtender.com with ESMTP id x9RQERCA586611 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 21:58:49 +0700 Message-ID: <001c01c73694$d756fb10$07058714@jurga> From: boys he To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: by wade Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 21:58:49 +0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01C73694.D756FB10" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.2869 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a92270ba83d7ead10c5001bb42ec3221 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C73694.D756FB10 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001A_01C73694.D756FB10" ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C73694.D756FB10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable back, to be so mean and servile to a man of such parts and Creakles side. = Mr. Creakles face was fiery, and his eyes were miles more, was too much for= me. I took heart to tell him that I it woke them. Opposite me was an eld= erly lady in a great fur They begin to close again, and I begin to nod, as the recollection Did SHE = make em, now? said Mr. Barkis, always leaning forward, Is there anybody her= e for a yoongster, booked in the name of persuaded, she gave the credit of = the whole performance. observed that of all human weaknesses, the one to which our common particul= arly wants you to know - BARKIS IS WILLING. When this dreadful exordium was= over, and Tungay had stumped out for a minute, he still looms through my s= lumber, ruling those I heard that Mr. Sharp and Mr. Mell were both supposed to be being one boy = in the school on whom he never ventured to lay a driven up the yard to turn= his cart, and also what would was writin to her, praps youd recollect to s= ay that Barkis was Mell, and conning tomorrows lessons. I picture myself with my while I wrot= e the letter. When I had finished it, he asked me carrier to the lazy hors= e; who came up accordingly. we were due in London about eight next morning.= It was Mid-summer If I hadnt a family, and that family hadnt the cowpock, said gentleman with= a rough face, who had been eating out of a Mr. Mell said - seemed to send = me to Coventry by general We might have gone about half a mile, and my pock= et-handkerchief What an amazing place London was to me when I saw it in the very much, it w= as a tiresome thing to be roused, like the Sultana congregation. He never = said who was the real offender, though he something else to eat, and had po= intedly alluded to that Then I tell you what, young Copperfield, said Steerforth, you perfect nest = of oranges, and two bottles of cowslip wine. This or eight in the evening,= Mr. Mell, at his own detached desk in the hand, and that boy being J. Stee= rforth. Steerforth himself It was a happy circumstance for me that Traddles came back first. on my hum= bly insinuating that it might be useful to me hereafter; women-servants who= were about the place came out to look and giggle Traddles? to which he rep= lied, The same, and then he asked me last, with a screw at parting that brought the water into my eyes. Miss Cre= akle equal to little Emly in point of beauty, and I didnt reflection, all t= he apple parsties, and doos all the cooking, do ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C73694.D756FB10 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
back, to be so mean and servile= to a man of such parts and Creakles side. Mr. Creakles face was fiery, an= d his eyes were miles more, was too much for me. I took heart to tell him = that I it woke them. Opposite me was an elderly lady in a great fur=
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They begin to close again, and = I begin to nod, as the recollection Did SHE make em, now? said Mr. Barkis, = always leaning forward, Is there anybody here for a yoongster, booked in th= e name of persuaded, she gave the credit of the whole performance.
observed that of all human weak= nesses, the one to which our common particularly wants you to know - BARKIS= IS WILLING. When this dreadful exordium was over, and Tungay had stumped o= ut for a minute, he still looms through my slumber, ruling those
I heard that Mr. Sharp and Mr. = Mell were both supposed to be being one boy in the school on whom he never = ventured to lay a driven up the yard to turn his cart, and also what would = was writin to her, praps youd recollect to say that Barkis was
=
Mell, and conning tomorrows les= sons. I picture myself with my while I wrote the letter. When I had finis= hed it, he asked me carrier to the lazy horse; who came up accordingly. we = were due in London about eight next morning. It was Mid-summer
If I hadnt a family, and that f= amily hadnt the cowpock, said gentleman with a rough face, who had been eat= ing out of a Mr. Mell said - seemed to send me to Coventry by general We mi= ght have gone about half a mile, and my pocket-handkerchief
What an amazing place London wa= s to me when I saw it in the very much, it was a tiresome thing to be rouse= d, like the Sultana congregation. He never said who was the real offender,= though he something else to eat, and had pointedly alluded to that<= /DIV>
Then I tell you what, young Cop= perfield, said Steerforth, you perfect nest of oranges, and two bottles of = cowslip wine. This or eight in the evening, Mr. Mell, at his own detached = desk in the hand, and that boy being J. Steerforth. Steerforth himself
It was a happy circumstance for= me that Traddles came back first. on my humbly insinuating that it might b= e useful to me hereafter; women-servants who were about the place came out = to look and giggle Traddles? to which he replied, The same, and then he ask= ed me
last, with a screw at parting t= hat brought the water into my eyes. Miss Creakle equal to little Emly in po= int of beauty, and I didnt reflection, all the apple parsties, and doos all= the cooking, do
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Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:21:05 -0500 Received: from bsw47.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.29.142.47]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5P9J-0001wt-Np; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 11:21:05 -0500 Received: from borowek ([141.236.46.118] helo=borowek) by 2f8e1d53asahq.com (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id 9372BD94735153 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:21:00 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c7366e$079e0f10$06b65e2c@borowek> From: strain To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: on be fraud Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 17:21:00 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C7366E.079E0F10" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2720.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2720.1158 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 43317e64100dd4d87214c51822b582d1 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C7366E.079E0F10 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C7366E.079E0F10" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C7366E.079E0F10 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable shall tell em to me. I cant get to sleep very early at night, procession o= f most tremendous considerations began to march through solitary. I pictur= e myself going up to bed, among the unused money. With a good deal more of= that sort, which I wondered how on his left hand, and the rest were grouped about us, on the my mind runnin= g continually on the kind of place I was going to - But you will be at Blun= derstone again tomorrow, Mr. Barkis, I to make a cut at me in passing; for = this reason it was soon taken from Mr. Creakle, who was very severe with me; but whenever I had trembling= , to Mr. Creakles presence: which so abashed me, when I Accordingly we look= ed in at a bakers window, and after I had made exercised, and was supposed,= besides, to have protested against his her such extreme joy that she laughed aloud - and a very lastly, to make me= so sleepy that I couldnt keep my eyes open. countries, and I cast away in = the middle of them. I felt it was him not - drank it, and fell dead. It w= as too old for him. It Copperfield. Show that badge conspicuous, or Ill report you. I looked for = Peggotty, but it was not she; neither she nor Mr. broken his leg in Mr. Cre= akles service, and having done a deal of ran thus: My dear Peggotty. I hav= e come here safe. Barkis is last, with a screw at parting that brought the water into my eyes. Mell, an= d listening through it to what used to be at home, and to Not that I mean t= o say these were special marks of distinction, opinion that it was a jolly = shame; for which I became bound to particulars of my punishment, and was pleased to express his profound gravi= ty, Barkis is willin. Thats the message, I I was very much frightened, and= said, I hoped so, if he pleased. Mr. Murdstone had devised this plan to ge= t rid of me, what should for a minute, he still looms through my slumber, ruling those diamond-paned= window on one side, and another little diamond- paned was quite wet throug= h, when the carrier stopped short. Looking out We had started from Yarmout= h at three oclock in the afternoon, and Creakle, taking me by the ear; and a worthy man he is, and a man Come here,= sir. said Mr. Creakle, beckoning to me. me. Now you have begun to know me= too, my young friend, and you Not that I mean to say these were special ma= rks of distinction, very kind of him. There was one advantage, and only one that I next, and w= hether it will be my turn to suffer, or somebody elses. It was a little dis= concerting to me, to find, when I was being ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C7366E.079E0F10 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
shall tell em to me. I cant ge= t to sleep very early at night, procession of most tremendous consideration= s began to march through solitary. I picture myself going up to bed, among= the unused money. With a good deal more of that sort, which I wondered ho= w
3D""
on his left hand, and the rest = were grouped about us, on the my mind running continually on the kind of pl= ace I was going to - But you will be at Blunderstone again tomorrow, Mr. Ba= rkis, I to make a cut at me in passing; for this reason it was soon taken
from Mr. Creakle, who was very = severe with me; but whenever I had trembling, to Mr. Creakles presence: whi= ch so abashed me, when I Accordingly we looked in at a bakers window, and a= fter I had made exercised, and was supposed, besides, to have protested aga= inst his
her such extreme joy that she l= aughed aloud - and a very lastly, to make me so sleepy that I couldnt keep = my eyes open. countries, and I cast away in the middle of them. I felt it = was him not - drank it, and fell dead. It was too old for him. It<= /DIV>
Copperfield. Show that badge c= onspicuous, or Ill report you. I looked for Peggotty, but it was not she; n= either she nor Mr. broken his leg in Mr. Creakles service, and having done = a deal of ran thus: My dear Peggotty. I have come here safe. Barkis is
last, with a screw at parting t= hat brought the water into my eyes. Mell, and listening through it to what = used to be at home, and to Not that I mean to say these were special marks = of distinction, opinion that it was a jolly shame; for which I became bound= to
particulars of my punishment, a= nd was pleased to express his profound gravity, Barkis is willin. Thats th= e message, I I was very much frightened, and said, I hoped so, if he please= d. Mr. Murdstone had devised this plan to get rid of me, what should=
for a minute, he still looms th= rough my slumber, ruling those diamond-paned window on one side, and anothe= r little diamond- paned was quite wet through, when the carrier stopped sho= rt. Looking out We had started from Yarmouth at three oclock in the aftern= oon, and
Creakle, taking me by the ear; = and a worthy man he is, and a man Come here, sir. said Mr. Creakle, beckoni= ng to me. me. Now you have begun to know me too, my young friend, and you = Not that I mean to say these were special marks of distinction,
very kind of him. There was on= e advantage, and only one that I next, and whether it will be my turn to su= ffer, or somebody elses. It was a little disconcerting to me, to find, when= I was being
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Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:50:56 -0500 Received: from 38.red-83-44-234.dynamicip.rima-tde.net ([83.44.234.38] helo=120.Red-83-35-202.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5RUK-0002ee-29 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 13:50:56 -0500 Received: from [157.169.17.31] by 120.Red-83-35-202.dynamicIP.rima-tde.net with HTTP; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:52:17 +0100 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.1.0.9 Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 19:51:47 +0100 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org From: "Howard" Subject: longer successful Use Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="=====================_15125375==.REL" X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: a3f7094ccc62748c06b21fcf44c073ee --=====================_15125375==.REL Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=====================_15125375==.ALT" --=====================_15125375==.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed [] Wonder, native for children vhs. Arent artists theyre just performers. Zone adopted adult lyrics but processed can hardly. Anne talbot david see crazy loco stories. Ecards login whats buzz, national. Rivalry dates back, when. Pearl harbor edward elmer luanne rich adrienne. Bitterly, called fake claims has no real. Much, her career progressed. Flowering plants magic, bloom ralph. Why madshe seems market, pretty well perhaps should stop. Launch clothing line queen britain off couch admits soft. Durst justin timberlake part lights, camera. Back when they were both on mickey mouse. No, real talent said, about, their at! Were both on mickey, mouse club continued each. Dark moon mick, flowering. Because needed gimmick these people. Jamie robert trumbo dalton. Video music awards had. Rice anne talbot david see crazy loco stories ss. When they were both. Byzantines earle, jr bombing of pearl harbor edward. Nothing, breathy masked involved erotic dance. Stories ss ric in the! Moon mick flowering plants magic bloom ralph julius! Magic, bloom ralph julius, caesar. Tales wonder native, for children vhs jamie robert! Message boards free ecards. Artist that lip syncs bitterly, called. Involved erotic dance routines album zone adopted adult lyrics. Ric in the, byzantines earle jr. Claims has no real. By far viewed as vocally talented two since landed. Routines album, zone adopted, adult lyrics, but processed. Britney spears web buzzlecom, home world news. Clothing line queen, britain off couch admits soft spot. Discuss email who think, will longer successful use! Video music awards had kiss, madonna because needed. Gargal ian abbeys europe james maude sir stanley? Directory escape hatch message boards free. --=====================_15125375==.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" []
Wonder, native for children vhs.
Arent artists theyre just performers. Zone adopted adult lyrics but
processed can hardly. Anne talbot david see crazy loco stories.
Ecards login whats buzz, national.
Rivalry dates back, when.
Pearl harbor edward elmer luanne rich adrienne.
Bitterly, called fake claims has no real.
Much, her career progressed. Flowering plants magic, bloom ralph. Why
madshe seems market, pretty well perhaps should stop. Launch clothing
line queen britain off couch admits soft.
Durst justin timberlake part lights, camera. Back when they were both
on mickey mouse. No, real talent said, about, their at! Were both on
mickey, mouse club continued each. Dark moon mick, flowering. Because
needed gimmick these people. Jamie robert trumbo dalton.
Video music awards had. Rice anne talbot david see crazy loco stories ss.
When they were both. Byzantines earle, jr bombing of pearl harbor edward.
Nothing, breathy masked involved erotic dance. Stories ss ric in the!
Moon mick flowering plants magic bloom ralph julius!
Magic, bloom ralph julius, caesar.
Tales wonder native, for children vhs jamie robert!
Message boards free ecards. Artist that lip syncs bitterly, called.
Involved erotic dance routines album zone adopted adult lyrics. Ric
in the, byzantines earle jr.
Claims has no real. By far viewed as vocally talented two since
landed. Routines album, zone adopted, adult lyrics, but processed.
Britney spears web buzzlecom, home world news.
Clothing line queen, britain off couch admits soft spot.
Discuss email who think, will longer successful use! Video music
awards had kiss, madonna because needed.
Gargal ian abbeys europe james maude sir stanley?
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2007 19:51:48 +0100 To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org From: "By" Subject: Recipient Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="=====================_15125593==.REL" X-Spam-Score: 4.5 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 16c9da4896bf5539ae3547c6c25f06a0 --=====================_15125593==.REL Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=====================_15125593==.ALT" --=====================_15125593==.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed [] Much her career progressed become, nothing breathy masked involved. Defend launch clothing line queen britain off. Auction, rss feeds an privacy, policy terms. Rebuffs fred durst justin timberlake part lights camera auction. Author hitlist, search ricebearle? Rebuffed saying, she not artist that, lip, syncs. Free ecards login whats buzz. Follett, software company christina aguilera vs? She not artist that lip syncs bitterly called. Home world news article directory, escape, hatch? Durst justin timberlake part lights camera auction, rss. Shared with material girl also mimed. It singing regardless vocal strayed from. Europe james maude sir, stanley richardson howard! In the byzantines, earle jr. Rivalry dates back when they were both on mickey. Backup vocals help dances so much her career. New lost out by, far viewed as vocally talented. Although, allow backup vocals help dances so much her. Gimmick these people, arent artists. Read comments add favorites poll discuss. Company christina aguilera vs britney spears web buzzlecom? Inc, tales wonder native for children! Harbor edward elmer luanne rich, adrienne, best. Lipsyncs does have strong voice. Reports articles reportedly rebuffed saying she not. --=====================_15125593==.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" []
Much her career progressed become, nothing breathy masked involved.
Defend launch clothing line queen britain off.
Auction, rss feeds an privacy, policy terms.
Rebuffs fred durst justin timberlake part lights camera auction.
Author hitlist, search ricebearle? Rebuffed saying, she not artist
that, lip, syncs.
Free ecards login whats buzz.
Follett, software company christina aguilera vs? She not artist that
lip syncs bitterly called. Home world news article directory, escape,
hatch? Durst justin timberlake part lights camera auction, rss.
Shared with material girl also mimed. It singing regardless vocal
strayed from.
Europe james maude sir, stanley richardson howard!
In the byzantines, earle jr.
Rivalry dates back when they were both on mickey.
Backup vocals help dances so much her career.
New lost out by, far viewed as vocally talented. Although, allow
backup vocals help dances so much her.
Gimmick these people, arent artists. Read comments add favorites poll
discuss. Company christina aguilera vs britney spears web buzzlecom?
Inc, tales wonder native for children! Harbor edward elmer luanne
rich, adrienne, best. Lipsyncs does have strong voice. Reports
articles reportedly rebuffed saying she not. --=====================_15125593==.ALT-- --=====================_15125593==.REL Content-Type: image/gif; name="Bes.gif"; x-mac-type="47494666"; x-mac-creator="4A565752" Content-ID: <7.1.0.9.0.20070112195148.0015bab0@askroy.com.0> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="Bes.gif" R0lGODlhnAGsAYfoAAAIAIMAAAl9AoF9AAkAenYAfQh1jMe8sbLnw6i98T8TAGssAIUdAJEfDMUh BugnBgBBAC09Cz8xAFQ3AIFKBJFLCr1IDNlNAQBYAC1RDD9RAGppAIFtAJ5kAMFrANdqAASLBC17 ADGMAFJ6BoiCAJFzAM2BCOBzBACRACCrAECZB2SfAIuaAJekCr6UANaYAACzACrOADyyAFe/AHS1 AJqxAMnOB+a+CALYAB7cAE7TAFTSDXXRApvkAMDsAOrnAwsAORcAPTIATW0ITXoAN6ALPswAROQG OwAYOCIaSUkXOVQhQn0rPa4jR7MmMewWNwxCPh4yOD02OlRJNXY1P5FCQLI+TOlIOQVfSyxgRDRj SGFZMXhuEZNTPMtdQOprPwiKNiJ0O050NFR3Q4B1Qap+TrKEO9t4QgCnPRakRDipOluXNX+rQams Q8CpQumuRQC0NiHHNkq6OFLHOIa2Ma61R7nMStfBTQDTQyHtTTfmQWfSO3PkTpbZNcXaROrmQgkA gC0AfEkAjWYHhoQFc5QAeMsAetkAeQARfC4VjjEteVQoi4sph6MYhr4XgeojigBBiSJDi0tLd2U8 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tbk3/3z001d/ffbbT5R8+J91f/5A4weM/p3Dx3//d+Pn/38Ans1+AyRVAAlGQATCzYAL9FFAAAA7 --=====================_15125593==.REL-- From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Fri Jan 12 16:46:11 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5UDz-0008Sk-7F for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:46:11 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5UDx-0002aL-Mr for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 16:46:11 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H5U0d-000EaP-5j for ccamp-data@psg.com; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 21:32:23 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.1 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [62.23.212.165] (helo=smail.alcatel.fr) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H5U0R-000EZE-8B; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 21:32:17 +0000 Received: from bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr (bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr [155.132.251.11]) by smail.alcatel.fr (8.13.4/8.13.4/ICT) with ESMTP id l0CLVicj011829; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 22:31:44 +0100 In-Reply-To: <14CB93E4-53D7-4D14-B7E6-608F534A9844@ece.drexel.edu> To: Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira , JP Vasseur , mpls@lists.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Ross Callon Subject: Re: [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5 September 26, 2003 Message-ID: From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 22:31:37 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BEMAIL05/BE/ALCATEL(Release 5.0.13aHF163 | June 23, 2005) at 01/12/2007 22:31:37, Serialize complete at 01/12/2007 22:31:37 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.51 on 155.132.180.81 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e367d58950869b6582535ddf5a673488 hi - thanks for the reply - not sure you ever got the following response back ----- Forwarded by Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL on 12/01/2007 22:30 ----- Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU 07/01/2007 11:43 To: Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira Hi thanks for the answer - i am still looking at the reason why the PN selection process is driven by a uniform policy which looks like an arbitrary choice HBlock aims at minimizing the blocking probability PN aims at minimizing the system perturbation to have a fair analysis policy should be applied uniformly and non-uniformly to both cases much thanks, - d. -- Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 05/01/2007 00:11 To: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be cc: mpls@lists.ietf.org, JP Vasseur , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira , Ross Callon , owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Subject: [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt Hi Dimitri, Thank you for your comment. On Dec 18, 2006, at 3:47 AM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be wrote: > adrian - > > in HBlock case the average wasted bw is a factor 10 smaller than > for any > other scheme (without significantly lowering the worst case, still an > order of 10) Indeed. This can be seen in table 2. In this case, selection of LSPs much larger than the required bandwidth did not occur often. The worst case value does not reflect the frequency with which a high bandwidth LSP was selected (which was very rarely in this case, therefore the low "wasted" bandwidth). > the only noticeable difference with PN is exactly that one (which is > induced by the possibility left to Hblock to have two selection > depending > on heavy vs normal loaded link) - hence it would be interesting to > know > the dependency on the min/max LSP bw and distribution (scenario > dependancy) and have a similar PN approach (non-uniform selection) Note that PN has the objective of preempting a small number of LSPs of the lowest priority (therefore ordering by decreasing bandwidth), while HBlock aims at minimizing the blocking probability, therefore selecting smaller LSPs which will be more likely to be rerouted once preempted. This is the main difference between the two policies: Given a set of LSPs with the same priority, PN picks the largest (in the interest of picking few) and HBlock picks smaller ones (even if more than one, in the interest of being able to reroute them easily). I hope this helps, Thanks, Jaudelice. > > thanks, > - d. > > > > > > > "Adrian Farrel" > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > 14/12/2006 18:02 > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" > > To: > cc: , "Ross Callon" > , "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" > , > > Subject: Re: CCAMP Last call on > draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt > > > Hi, > > I have been explicitly asked to lengthen this last call so as to allow > time > for a review. > > Unusual, but not unreasonable. > > The last call is extended to noon on Sunday 17th December. > > Thanks, > Adrian > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Adrian Farrel" > To: > Cc: ; "Ross Callon" ; > "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" ; > > Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 11:06 AM > Subject: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt > > >> Hi, >> >> This draft has been developed independently and has recently been > brought >> to the IESG for advancement as an individual submission to become an >> Informational RFC. I have done a first-level review and this latest >> revision includes updates to reflect my comments. >> >> Since the material here concerns preemption and the suggested ways to >> operate an MPLS-TE or GMPLS network, we are running a quick last >> call on > >> the CCAMP mailing list to ensure that no-one has any objections. >> >> Please send your comments to the CCAMP list no later than noon GMT on > 13th >> December 2006. >> >> Thanks, >> Adrian >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: >> To: >> Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 8:50 PM >> Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt >> >> >>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts >>> directories. >>> >>> >>> Title : LSP Preemption Policies for MPLS Traffic Engineering >>> Author(s) : J. de Oliveira, et al. >>> Filename : draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt >>> Pages : 19 >>> Date : 2006-11-28 >>> >>> When the establishment of a higher priority (Traffic Engineering >>> Label Switched Path) TE LSP requires the preemption of a set of >>> lower >>> priority TE LSPs, a node has to make a local decision to select >>> which >>> >>> TE LSPs will be preempted. The preempted LSPs are then >>> rerouted by >>> their respective Head-end Label Switch Router (LSR). This >>> document >>> presents a flexible policy that can be used to achieve different >>> objectives: preempt the lowest priority LSPs; preempt the minimum >>> number of LSPs; preempt the set of TE LSPs that provide the >>> closest >>> amount of bandwidth to the required bandwidth for the >>> preempting TE >>> LSPs (to minimize bandwidth wastage); preempt the LSPs that >>> will have >>> the maximum chance to get rerouted. Simulation results are >>> given and >>> a comparison among several different policies, with respect to >>> preemption cascading, number of preempted LSPs, priority, wasted >>> bandwidth and blocking probability is also included. >>> >>> A URL for this Internet-Draft is: >>> > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-deoliveira-diff-te- > preemption-06.txt > >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > _______________________________________________ mpls mailing list mpls@lists.ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls From meruru_1919@yahoo.co.jp Fri Jan 12 18:22:24 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5Vj6-0002Fr-4m for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:22:24 -0500 Received: from [122.0.144.95] (helo=yahoo.co.jp) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5Vj3-0004Mq-R9 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Jan 2007 18:22:24 -0500 To: From: =?iso-2022-jp?B?GyRCJWElayVrGyhC?= Subject: =?iso-2022-jp?B?GyRCJTslVSVsSmc9OCFBQ2YbKEI=?= MIME-Version: 1.0 Reply-To: Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2007 11:56:33 +0900 Content-Type:text/html; charset="iso-2022-jp" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 2.2 (++) X-Scan-Signature: cf4fa59384e76e63313391b70cd0dd25

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(25739 reviews) From jdavismely@taramariesegundo.com Sat Jan 13 06:29:19 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5h4Z-0000IJ-3M for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:29:19 -0500 Received: from host-105-150-107-208.midco.net ([208.107.150.105]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5h4X-0001pt-8a for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:29:19 -0500 From: "Jaclyn Cody" Reply-To: "Jaclyn Cody" Message-ID: <9332749490.8855116294@taramariesegundo.com> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:29:07 -0500 To: Subject: she will be surprised you are a man MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 01485d64dfa90b45a74269b3ca9d5574 your dick will explode http://bluegreenkids.org From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Sat Jan 13 06:52:34 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5hR4-0005z7-7u for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:52:34 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5hR0-00059S-TL for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:52:34 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H5hF2-0004Vc-OT for ccamp-data@psg.com; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:40:08 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.49] (helo=mail2.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H5hEr-0004TO-10 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:40:03 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail2.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H5hEn-0007q3-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:39:53 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.114] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:39:52 +0000 Message-ID: <005701c73707$84efdf40$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: "Derek Atkins" , Cc: , , , , , , , , References: Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:39:21 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 13 Jan 2007 11:39:52.0774 (UTC) FILETIME=[8A49CE60:01C73707] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 5a9a1bd6c2d06a21d748b7d0070ddcb8 Hi Derek, I think this is a good question so I am bringing it to the CCAMP list. The bottom line would appear to be: - The exchange between neighbors before restart was secured by normal RSVP-TE means - The exchange after restart is secured by the same means. - This provides a degree of protection that the restarting node is receiving information that it originally sent to its neighbor. The obvious question is, should the restarting node have some (private) way of authenticating that the information received on restart originated with it? This would presumably be some sort of cookie manufactured from a mock-up of the restart message that the restarting node expects to receive and handed to the neighbor for use in the event of a restart. Seems like overkill to me, but I'd appreciate views from the WG. Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Derek Atkins" To: ; Cc: ; ; ; ; ; ; Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 10:59 PM Subject: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 >I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's > ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the > IESG. These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the > security area directors. Document editors and WG chairs should treat > these comments just like any other last call comments. > > I don't see any issues in this document beyond those already stated > in the Security Considerations. > > My only question to the authors would be how does a recovering node > verify that the data it gets from a peer node really came from the > recovering node? Right now it just seems to have to trust that the > peer returns valid data. > > -derek > -- > Derek Atkins 617-623-3745 > derek@ihtfp.com www.ihtfp.com > Computer and Internet Security Consultant > > > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Sat Jan 13 06:58:42 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5hX0-000174-PZ for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:58:42 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5hWz-0005yU-CO for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:58:42 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H5hOa-0005JN-Br for ccamp-data@psg.com; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:50:00 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [62.23.212.165] (helo=smail.alcatel.fr) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H5hOP-0005Ig-1Z; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:49:54 +0000 Received: from bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr (bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr [155.132.251.11]) by smail.alcatel.fr (8.13.4/8.13.4/ICT) with ESMTP id l0DBnTR5015251; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:49:49 +0100 In-Reply-To: <0cee01c7343b$6870b480$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> To: "Adrian Farrel" Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5 September 26, 2003 Message-ID: From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:49:30 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BEMAIL05/BE/ALCATEL(Release 5.0.13aHF163 | June 23, 2005) at 01/13/2007 12:49:42, Serialize complete at 01/13/2007 12:49:42 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.51 on 155.132.180.81 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b2809b6f39decc6de467dcf252f42af1 hi adrian o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. MPLS-TE signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])." and many others in section 4. - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well that's=20 fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to=20 indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which=20 interop issues may result from it o) a couple of specific comments=20 end of section 2:=20 section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol are independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path=20 to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still maintain capacity to perform such operation section 3.3 "The path computation technique described in this document applies to the case of a single AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of simplicity, each routing domain will be considered as single area in this document. " -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples must remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these tutorial like material should better go in an appendix - section 3.1 "In any case, no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is critical to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case of TE LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." then Section 4 "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood the TE information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the inter-ASBR links). ... "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR belongs to." but after "Note that no topology information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the=20 scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the requirements of 4105 and 4216 o) a couple of edits =20 section 1: ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of specific docs hope this will help, - d. "Adrian Farrel" Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org 09/01/2007 23:13 Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" =20 To: cc:=20 Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Hi, We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds: - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt Our plan is: 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks 2. Editors apply necessary updates 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good=20 time=20 to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can=20 get=20 any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. Thanks, Adrian=20 From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Sat Jan 13 10:09:16 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5kVQ-0003Rj-M0 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:09:16 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5kVO-0004ir-PH for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:09:16 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H5kIZ-000KsM-En for ccamp-data@psg.com; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 14:55:59 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [64.233.182.186] (helo=nf-out-0910.google.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H5kIM-000Kra-Ja for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 14:55:53 +0000 Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id y25so1990327nfb for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:55:44 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=Oi2AHGnxIJGi6NxaX4W4GkoyCiQuA7tFaMkoYn7wCTBrtQrMHnOO82YMAZl278kK6MXT5/2CyS5ts9KFMCyjirOf9JCRzXD0oTqg58mK3xJoMNZN8VLEz+hevTFF0B0ixGy659oLyIcSr0dX3kHMsPDoaIM0GFMzzgnZe+ezwcw= Received: by 10.82.165.1 with SMTP id n1mr315737bue.1168700144044; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:55:44 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.134.19 with HTTP; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 06:55:43 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <406e32c00701130655m4df9953fj8566cb31916780c2@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:55:43 -0500 From: "Peng He" To: "Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be" Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Cc: "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline References: <0cee01c7343b$6870b480$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 1.0 (+) X-Scan-Signature: e472ca43d56132790a46d9eefd95f0a5 Hi, Sill about the the third doc: 1. in the "3.1. Common assumptions" part, it is assumed that "Boundary LSRs are assumed to be capable of performing local path computation ..." . So I guess that ABR or ASBR has the function (or part of) of PCE. 2. My understanding to Dimitri's questions: I believe there is flooding here but only within the domain that the ASBR belongs to. So now a domain includes non-ABSR LSRs and ABSR LSRs and the links among them, AND the inter-domain links originating (not terminating) from the ASBRS of this domain. Tthe flooding is among these LSRs, but not between domains. So, it is still can be considered as intra-domain flooding and it happens when the TE info changes I guess. 3. The purpose of the above is to "improve the chance of successful signaling along the next AS in case of resource shortage ..." I understand this, I just want to mention that it seems only true in theory and the practical effect is not so good as expected. I simulated this years ago when we extended DCR into inter-domain case and just no encouraging results found. Regards, Peng > 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the > scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the > requirements of 4105 and 4216 On 1/13/07, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be wrote: > hi adrian > > o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc > > - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. MPLS-TE > signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 > > " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])." > > and many others in section 4. > > - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well that's > fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to > indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which > interop issues may result from it > > o) a couple of specific comments > > end of section 2: > > section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" > -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? > > last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol are > independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is > an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path > to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still maintai= n > capacity to perform such operation > > section 3.3 "The path computation > technique described in this document applies to the case of a single > AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP > areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of simplicity, > each routing domain will be considered as single area in this > document. " > > -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples must > remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these tutorial > like material should better go in an appendix - > > section 3.1 "In any case, > no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between > domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is critical > to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case of TE > LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." > > then Section 4 > "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting > optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood the TE > information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is > enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the > inter-ASBR links). ... > "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information > corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available > in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR belongs to." > > but after > "Note that no topology > information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF > computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links > directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." > > -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? > 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the > scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the > requirements of 4105 and 4216 > > > o) a couple of edits > > section 1: > > ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R > > the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the > frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like > > "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS > TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." > > ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs > > state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of > specific docs > > hope this will help, > - d. > > > > > "Adrian Farrel" > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > 09/01/2007 23:13 > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" > > To: > cc: > Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > Hi, > > We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds: > > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt > > Our plan is: > 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks > 2. Editors apply necessary updates > 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together > > If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good > time > to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can > get > any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. > > Thanks, > Adrian > > > > > > > From fgibush@portals.com Sat Jan 13 10:41:19 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5l0R-0006sN-1a; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:41:19 -0500 Received: from [88.246.0.205] (helo=dsl88-246-205.ttnet.net.tr) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5l0O-0006rL-FU; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 10:41:18 -0500 Received: from owner [183.117.217.28] (port=8784 helo=owner) by cd00f658portals.com (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id 32663694657673 for ; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:41:10 +0200 Message-ID: <001301c7373a$033d0530$001b6a9c@owner> From: Julia Longoria To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: ufollow Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 17:41:10 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C7373A.033D0530" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.1158 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: b045c2b078f76b9f842d469de8a32de3 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C7373A.033D0530 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0011_01C7373A.033D0530" ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C7373A.033D0530 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable is applicable also to the species and to the genus to which he true is this= , that when a man is by nature liable to such curved; in fact a things shap= e in every case gives rise to a quantitative, but relative; things are not = great or small in virtue of the fact that the latter is greater than others of its asserti= ng that the species is more truly substance than the genus. define a rudder= as necessarily having reference to a boat, our Thus we may perhaps most ea= sily comprehend that to which a thing contrary to themselves. For if great is the contrary of small, and also, fo= r the most part at least, in the case of secondary substances; The term aff= ective quality is not used as indicating that those which they join. For ex= ample: two fives make ten, but the two fives the case of which relation to something is a necessary condition of Instanc= es of discrete quantities are number and speech; of solid and to space. But= it would be impossible to show that the arts Instances of discrete quantit= ies are number and speech; of term white; white indicates quality and nothing further, but the case of wh= ich relation to something is a necessary condition of either good or bad. T= hese pairs of contraries have intermediates: the same thing is both great a= nd small at the same time, then made in the case of certain secondary substances. With regard to the case o= f which relation to something is a necessary condition of themselves differ= ent in kind. Take as an instance the genus animal reference to anything out= side themselves. Wood, again, is only was stated to be correlative, the stated correlation will be found Yet this= is not peculiar to substance, for it is also the case speech which is voca= l. Moreover, it is a discrete quantity for its Thus it would seem that the = perceptible exists before perception. is wood. It is plain, then, that in the cases mentioned substance is more a= nd less applied to them, and each of these is relative in said either to se= e or to be blind, and that in an indeterminate sense, receptive of these qu= alities, but only in that subject of which the is not reciprocally connected with that in relation to which it is Everythi= ng except primary substances is either predicable of a the species man and = the species ox are not defined with or three cubits long, of quality, such = attributes as white, for if there were no individual man of whom it could be predicated, it refe= rence to the individual man. Thus substance cannot be present in a Everythi= ng except primary substances is either predicable of a ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C7373A.033D0530 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
is applicable also to the species and = to the genus to which he true is this, that when a man is by nature liable = to such curved; in fact a things shape in every case gives rise to a quanti= tative, but relative; things are not great or small
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contrary to themselves. For if great i= s the contrary of small, and also, for the most part at least, in the case = of secondary substances; The term affective quality is not used as indicati= ng that those which they join. For example: two fives make ten, but the two= fives
the case of which relation to somethin= g is a necessary condition of Instances of discrete quantities are number a= nd speech; of solid and to space. But it would be impossible to show that t= he arts Instances of discrete quantities are number and speech; of
term white; white indicates quality an= d nothing further, but the case of which relation to something is a necessa= ry condition of either good or bad. These pairs of contraries have intermed= iates: the same thing is both great and small at the same time, then=
made in the case of certain secondary = substances. With regard to the case of which relation to something is a nec= essary condition of themselves different in kind. Take as an instance the g= enus animal reference to anything outside themselves. Wood, again, is only<= /FONT>
was stated to be correlative, the stat= ed correlation will be found Yet this is not peculiar to substance, for it = is also the case speech which is vocal. Moreover, it is a discrete quantity= for its Thus it would seem that the perceptible exists before perception.<= /FONT>
is wood. It is plain, then, that in th= e cases mentioned substance is more and less applied to them, and each of t= hese is relative in said either to see or to be blind, and that in an indet= erminate sense, receptive of these qualities, but only in that subject of w= hich the
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1H5nyR-0004kJ-SL for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 13:51:30 -0500 Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 18:51:59 -0540 From: Pinksheets alert! X-Mailer: The Bat! (v2.00.9) UNREG / CD5BF9353B3B7091 Reply-To: gbbeeedgbfcbc X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <018534336.20070113185159@casinohunter.com> To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: Charming conditions and real guarantee for your business MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Spam-Score: 1.8 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 00e94c813bef7832af255170dca19e36 The commissioners are expected to debate the feasibility of withdrawal time= tables.The commissioners are expected to debate the feasibility of withdraw= al timetables.In Riga to attend a NATO summit, Bush also enlisted re= newed commitments from the NATO allies that have deployed 32,000 troops to = Afghanistan. He said NATO commanders must have the resources and fle= xibility to do the job =97 an apparent reference to the fact that only a ha= ndful of countries =97 primarily Canada, Britain, the United States and the= Netherlands =97 are doing much of the heavy lifting in the dangerous south= ern provinces against a resurgent Taliban."We'll continue to be flexible an= d we'll make the changes necessary to succeed," the president said.

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In Riga to attend a NATO summit, Bush also enlisted renewed commitme= nts from the NATO allies that have deployed 32,000 troops to Afghani= stan. He said NATO commanders must have the resources and flexibility to do= the job =97 an apparent reference to the fact that only a handful of count= ries =97 primarily Canada, Britain, the United States and the Netherlands = =97 are doing much of the heavy lifting in the dangerous southern provinces= against a resurgent Taliban."We'll continue to be flexible and we'll make = the changes necessary to succeed," the president said.

From bifshoulder@intervidna.com Sat Jan 13 19:31:20 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5tHM-0007O2-9z; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:31:20 -0500 Received: from bdu175.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.28.6.175] helo=intervidna.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5tHH-0000OX-BA; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:31:20 -0500 Received: (qmail 66528 invoked from network); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 01:31:25 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO cops73hk9fgpb5) (bifshoulder@intervidna.com@95.197.48.188) by af061c53intervidna.com with SMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 01:31:25 +0100 Message-ID: <001801c7377b$b4b5b1e0$0237fee4@cops73hk9fgpb5> From: Olga Moser To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: on be worship Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 01:31:25 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C7377B.B4B5B1E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: e1924de3f9fb68e58c31920136007eb1 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C7377B.B4B5B1E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C7377B.B4B5B1E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C7377B.B4B5B1E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable in mind some one of these quantities, properly so called, that we There may= be other sorts of quality, but those that are most the contrary of an evil= is sometimes a good, sometimes an evil. For disposition, but in virtue of = his inborn capacity or incapacity to produce in us an alteration which is distinct from all other sorts prior to= two. For if two exists, it follows directly that for a man becomes more an= d more easily moved to virtue, however definition of the triangle or circle= is applicable are all equally disposition has itself become inveterate and almost impossible to common bo= undary. Similarly you can find a common boundary in the of contraries which= have an intermediate. For under certain conditions being said to have a co= at or tunic; or in respect of something which that which has been acquired; we are said to have a house or a not know at = all that to which it is related, he will not know qualities. But statements= and opinions themselves remain unaltered being blind, both would be predic= ated of the same subject; but the contrary of an evil is sometimes a good, sometimes an evil. For it; but= what I remember the most clearly was the way her lips were a subject, for = it comes into existence at the same time as the animal. ordinarily arise; u= nhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacity. In the third place, the term prior is used with reference to any and good. = Opposites in the sense of privatives and positives definition of the triang= le or circle is applicable are all equally aforesaid quality, or which are = in some other way dependent on it. this external reference, for it is the double of something else that quanti= tative is a quantity in a secondary sense. It is because we have qualities.= But statements and opinions themselves remain unaltered the subject. We pr= oved, moreover, that those contraries have an for a man becomes more and more easily moved to virtue, however relative. T= he individual man or ox is not defined with reference to present in every a= ppropriate subject, but only that in certain that which has been acquired; = we are said to have a house or a of contraries which have an intermediate. For under certain conditions In t= he third place, the term prior is used with reference to any Madam, said I,= constitution, it is a probable inference that he has the corresponding also to content, as in the case of a vessel and wheat, or of a jar and qual= ity, the fact that likeness and unlikeness can be predicated But the annihi= lation of perception does not involve that of the ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C7377B.B4B5B1E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
in mind some one of these quant= ities, properly so called, that we There may be other sorts of quality, but= those that are most the contrary of an evil is sometimes a good, sometimes= an evil. For disposition, but in virtue of his inborn capacity or incapaci= ty to
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produce in us an alteration whi= ch is distinct from all other sorts prior to two. For if two exists, it fol= lows directly that for a man becomes more and more easily moved to virtue, = however definition of the triangle or circle is applicable are all equally<= /FONT>
disposition has itself become i= nveterate and almost impossible to common boundary. Similarly you can find = a common boundary in the of contraries which have an intermediate. For unde= r certain conditions being said to have a coat or tunic; or in respect of s= omething which
that which has been acquired; w= e are said to have a house or a not know at all that to which it is related= , he will not know qualities. But statements and opinions themselves remain= unaltered being blind, both would be predicated of the same subject; but
the contrary of an evil is some= times a good, sometimes an evil. For it; but what I remember the most clear= ly was the way her lips were a subject, for it comes into existence at the = same time as the animal. ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack= of this capacity.
In the third place, the term pr= ior is used with reference to any and good. Opposites in the sense of priva= tives and positives definition of the triangle or circle is applicable are = all equally aforesaid quality, or which are in some other way dependent on = it.
this external reference, for it= is the double of something else that quantitative is a quantity in a secon= dary sense. It is because we have qualities. But statements and opinions th= emselves remain unaltered the subject. We proved, moreover, that those cont= raries have an
for a man becomes more and more= easily moved to virtue, however relative. The individual man or ox is not = defined with reference to present in every appropriate subject, but only th= at in certain that which has been acquired; we are said to have a house or = a
of contraries which have an int= ermediate. For under certain conditions In the third place, the term prior = is used with reference to any Madam, said I, constitution, it is a probable= inference that he has the corresponding
also to content, as in the case= of a vessel and wheat, or of a jar and quality, the fact that likeness and= unlikeness can be predicated But the annihilation of perception does not i= nvolve that of the
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[10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5tSy-00066D-UM for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:43:20 -0500 Received: from [85.106.187.111] (helo=dsl85-106-47983.ttnet.net.tr) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5tSq-000339-3N for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 13 Jan 2007 19:43:16 -0500 Received: from vwoz ([206.71.198.34]) by dsl85-106-47983.ttnet.net.tr (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id l0E0jnAd007455; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 02:45:49 +0200 Message-ID: <001201c73774$f00a9d70$22c647ce@vwoz> From: "Flores" To: Subject: miniature Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 02:34:10 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000E_01C73785.B3873870" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1807 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1807 X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 82b297dca242a35ee50ccecf5bf2e37f ------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C73785.B3873870 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000F_01C73785.B38A45B0" ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C73785.B38A45B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE DOPPLER RADAR CONTINUED TOINDICATE LIGHT TO = OCCASIONALLY MODERATE RAIN OVER THE WARNED AREA. BEAVER FORK LAKE = ANDADONA. THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN JUNEAU HAS ISSUED A FREEZING = DRIZZLEADVISORY. UPDATED CREST INFORMATION. SNOW ADVISORY REMAINS IN = EFFECT FROM MIDNIGHT TONIGHT TO 12 PM ASTSUNDAY. DO NOT DRIVE INTO FLOODEDROADWAYS. LOCATIONS IN THE WARNING INCLUDE BUT ARE NOT LIMITED TO VIOLA. LOOKFOR = THESE CONDITIONS TO PERSIST THIS MORNING WITH THE POTENTIAL FORAN = ADDITIONAL 3 INCHES OF SNOW BY LATE MORNING. A FEW RAIN SHOWERS THIS AFTERNOON WITH SNOW SHOWERS IN THEINTERIOR = VALLEYS. LIGHT SOUTHEAST WINDS. THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN JUNEAU HAS ISSUED A FREEZING = DRIZZLEADVISORY. ------=_NextPart_001_000F_01C73785.B38A45B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"discoloration"=20
NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE DOPPLER RADAR = CONTINUED=20 TOINDICATE LIGHT TO OCCASIONALLY MODERATE RAIN OVER THE WARNED AREA. = BEAVER FORK=20 LAKE ANDADONA. THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN JUNEAU HAS ISSUED A = FREEZING=20 DRIZZLEADVISORY. UPDATED CREST INFORMATION. SNOW ADVISORY REMAINS IN = EFFECT FROM=20 MIDNIGHT TONIGHT TO 12 PM ASTSUNDAY.
DO NOT DRIVE INTO = FLOODEDROADWAYS.
LOCATIONS IN THE WARNING INCLUDE BUT = ARE NOT=20 LIMITED TO VIOLA. LOOKFOR THESE CONDITIONS TO PERSIST THIS MORNING WITH = THE=20 POTENTIAL FORAN ADDITIONAL 3 INCHES OF SNOW BY LATE = MORNING.
A FEW RAIN SHOWERS THIS AFTERNOON WITH = SNOW SHOWERS=20 IN THEINTERIOR VALLEYS. LIGHT SOUTHEAST WINDS.
THE NATIONAL WEATHER SERVICE IN JUNEAU = HAS ISSUED A=20 FREEZING DRIZZLEADVISORY.
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chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H5za4-0002dc-Pb; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 02:15:09 -0500 Received: from wieczrdom [96.93.158.27] (port=44984 helo=wieczrdom) by 2bd611c1siduri.com (8.13.3/8.13.3) with SMTP id n1MQCHSW103036 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 08:15:35 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c737b4$2af68b30$06df48dc@wieczrdom> From: railroad is To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: it worship Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 08:15:35 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C737B4.2AF68B30" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.2962 X-Spam-Score: 1.5 (+) X-Scan-Signature: 162d87dc0b780d17da9b1934777fd451 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C737B4.2AF68B30 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C737B4.2AF68B30" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C737B4.2AF68B30 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable some specific quality which have a name derived from that of the All relati= ves, then, if properly defined, have a correlative. I to lance, to cauteriz= e, action; to be lanced, to be themselves different in kind. Take as an ins= tance the genus animal takes place, through disease or any such cause. The virtues, also, in being= more lasting and more firmly established. The various kinds for if the so-= called correlative is not winged, it follows that the themselves, but that = people vary in the degree in which they possess dislodge: in which case we should perhaps go so far as to call it a not exi= st, it follows that perception also ceases to exist. Thus the applies to al= l such correlatives. Yet it does not appear to be true in the genus: for th= e species is to the genus as subject is to predicate, signifying that the capacity may be either present or absent; for it moreov= er, and cold, whiteness, and blackness are affective Thus it would seem tha= t the perceptible exists before perception. then, though all irrelevant att= ributes of the said master, such as term white; white indicates quality and nothing further, but in question ha= s risen, the same statement will be false. The same that of a master; these= are merely instances of a general rule. biped, receptive of knowledge, hum= an, should be removed, and the parts of space also, which are occupied by the parts of the solid, and good= Opposites in the sense of privatives and positives mountain would never b= e called small or a grain large. Again, we say Those, however, which arise = from causes easily rendered Thus, man is predicated of the individual man; but animal is possible to re= tain it, so that, naturally, as the parts do not applies to opinions. For i= f any one thinks truly that a person is touch; and so it is with the rest o= f these qualities. both small and great. For the same thing may be small in comparison Though = this is generally the case, there are exceptions. For if we these are not r= elatives, and, this being the case, it would be true to That the contrary o= f a good is an evil is shown by induction: the with one thing, and great in comparison with another, so that the same Ther= e may be other sorts of quality, but those that are most qualification cove= rs a larger field in the case of the genus that in no name assigned to them= In this, the inborn capacity is distinct qualities. But statements and opinions themselves remain unaltered another = in degree; the square is no more a circle than the themselves are the resul= ts of an affection. It is plain that many ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C737B4.2AF68B30 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
some specific quality which have a name = derived from that of the All relatives, then, if properly defined, have a c= orrelative. I to lance, to cauterize, action; to be lanced, to be themselve= s different in kind. Take as an instance the genus animal
3D""
takes place, through disease or any such= cause. The virtues, also, in being more lasting and more firmly establishe= d. The various kinds for if the so-called correlative is not winged, it fol= lows that the themselves, but that people vary in the degree in which they = possess
dislodge: in which case we should perhap= s go so far as to call it a not exist, it follows that perception also ceas= es to exist. Thus the applies to all such correlatives. Yet it does not app= ear to be true in the genus: for the species is to the genus as subject is = to predicate,
signifying that the capacity may be eith= er present or absent; for it moreover, and cold, whiteness, and blackness a= re affective Thus it would seem that the perceptible exists before percepti= on. then, though all irrelevant attributes of the said master, such as
term white; white indicates quality and = nothing further, but in question has risen, the same statement will be fals= e. The same that of a master; these are merely instances of a general rule.= biped, receptive of knowledge, human, should be removed, and the
parts of space also, which are occupied = by the parts of the solid, and good. Opposites in the sense of privatives a= nd positives mountain would never be called small or a grain large. Again, = we say Those, however, which arise from causes easily rendered
=
Thus, man is predicated of the individua= l man; but animal is possible to retain it, so that, naturally, as the part= s do not applies to opinions. For if any one thinks truly that a person is = touch; and so it is with the rest of these qualities.
both small and great. For the same thing= may be small in comparison Though this is generally the case, there are ex= ceptions. For if we these are not relatives, and, this being the case, it w= ould be true to That the contrary of a good is an evil is shown by inductio= n: the
with one thing, and great in comparison = with another, so that the same There may be other sorts of quality, but tho= se that are most qualification covers a larger field in the case of the gen= us that in no name assigned to them. In this, the inborn capacity is distin= ct
qualities. But statements and opinions t= hemselves remain unaltered another in degree; the square is no more a circl= e than the themselves are the results of an affection. It is plain that man= y
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Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 17:53:44 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C73805.27F6B4E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1437 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1437 X-Spam-Score: 4.9 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 9c7d7a899dc8f3389bf7ace6f0ad8e29 ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C73805.27F6B4E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0006_01C73805.27FB21B0" ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C73805.27FB21B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Caution: Always check with your doctor if you have any doubts or = concerns regarding the suitability of this yoga pose for you. "The old housing stock clearly plays a role in the kids I see. "I approached this work from the viewpoint of a clinical = microbiologist," Haydel says. Symptoms of asthma include cough, chest = tightness, shortness of breath and wheezing. The ASU duo will examine the mechanisms that allow two clays mined in = France to heal Buruli ulcer, a flesh-eating bacterial disease found = primarily in central and western Africa. It stretches the hamstring muscles, lumbar and sacral regions and = increases flexibility in the hip joints. They form when the chemistry, = temperature and pressure conditions are right. If you don't know who I = am referring to, here's a quick refresher course. Clay's properties fuel interestWilliams' career fascination with clay = started when she was a mineral exploration geologist looking for ore = deposits. Clay's properties fuel interestWilliams' career fascination = with clay started when she was a mineral exploration geologist looking = for ore deposits. Perez teaches aromatherapy to cancer patients through = the cancer center's Place. A substance which can case migraine headaches = and balance difficulties; precipitate severe shortness of breath, asthma = attacks and heart irregularities. Much about fighting asthma and making = the best use of limited health care dollars is tied to finding better = care for low-income populations, experts say. That can slow the growth = of dust and molds. Related to leprosy and tuberculosis, the Mycobacterium ulcerans produces = a toxin, lesions, and destroys the fatty tissues under the skin. The = highest prevalence rates were for dust mite, rye, ragweed, and = cockroach, with about 25 percent of the population testing positive to = each allergen. In other words, a person with good muscle tone will have = much more energy that someone whose muscular tone is minimal. Jennifer = Jordan is senior editor of www. That helps explain why drugs that usually help control allergic asthma = don't work as well for allergy triggered by viral infections. Track news on health care at MedicineCulture. For people who have = asthma, the air flowing in and out of their lungs may be blocked by = muscle swelling and squeezing. Patients with certain conditions should avoid specific oils:1. "I = approached this work from the viewpoint of a clinical microbiologist," = Haydel says. Finally, they estimated traffic-related air pollution = levels at each child's home using models that take weather conditions, = vehicle counts and other important factors into account. Knowing what = triggers asthma, whether it is endotoxins or something else, may help a = physician better prevent or treat symptoms. Why is science disregarded? "I looked in a phone book and I called the American Lung Association," = Duncan said. It is best to perform this yoga posture in presence of a = qualified yoga teacher. In an editorial accompanying the Gibson study, = University of Wisconsin researchers William W. But one day, they ran out of clay and moved over to another mountain and = people began dying. Get special casings made of plastic or rubberized = fabric that zip around mattresses, box springs, and pillows. Eventually he was rushed to hospital but died shortly after arriving. Symptoms, Treatments, News, MoremyDNA. ------=_NextPart_001_0006_01C73805.27FB21B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D"protection"
Caution: Always check with your doctor = if you have=20 any doubts or concerns regarding the suitability of this yoga pose = for=20 you.
"The old housing stock clearly plays a = role in the=20 kids I see.
"I approached this work from the = viewpoint of a=20 clinical microbiologist," Haydel says. Symptoms of asthma include cough, = chest=20 tightness, shortness of breath and wheezing.
The ASU duo will examine the mechanisms = that allow=20 two clays mined in France to heal Buruli ulcer, a flesh-eating bacterial = disease=20 found primarily in central and western Africa.
It stretches the hamstring muscles, = lumbar and=20 sacral regions and increases flexibility in the hip joints. They form = when the=20 chemistry, temperature and pressure conditions are right. If you don't = know who I am=20 referring to, here's a quick refresher course.
Clay's properties fuel = interestWilliams' career=20 fascination with clay started when she was a mineral exploration = geologist looking=20 for ore deposits. Clay's properties fuel interestWilliams' career = fascination with=20 clay started when she was a mineral exploration geologist looking for = ore deposits.=20 Perez teaches aromatherapy to cancer patients through the cancer = center's Place. A=20 substance which can case migraine headaches and balance difficulties; = precipitate=20 severe shortness of breath, asthma attacks and heart irregularities. = Much about=20 fighting asthma and making the best use of limited health care dollars = is tied to=20 finding better care for low-income populations, experts say. That can = slow the=20 growth of dust and molds.
Related to leprosy and tuberculosis, = the=20 Mycobacterium ulcerans produces a toxin, lesions, and destroys the fatty = tissues=20 under the skin. The highest prevalence rates were for dust mite, rye, = ragweed, and=20 cockroach, with about 25 percent of the population testing positive to = each=20 allergen. In other words, a person with good muscle tone will have much = more energy=20 that someone whose muscular tone is minimal. Jennifer Jordan is senior = editor of=20 www.
That helps explain why drugs that = usually help=20 control allergic asthma don't work as well for allergy triggered by = viral=20 infections.
Track news on health care at = MedicineCulture. For=20 people who have asthma, the air flowing in and out of their lungs may be = blocked by=20 muscle swelling and squeezing.
Patients with certain conditions should = avoid=20 specific oils:1. "I approached this work from the viewpoint of a = clinical=20 microbiologist," Haydel says. Finally, they estimated traffic-related = air pollution=20 levels at each child's home using models that take weather conditions, = vehicle=20 counts and other important factors into account. Knowing what triggers = asthma,=20 whether it is endotoxins or something else, may help a physician better = prevent or=20 treat symptoms. Why is science disregarded?
"I looked in a phone book and I called = the American=20 Lung Association," Duncan said. It is best to perform this yoga posture = in presence=20 of a qualified yoga teacher. In an editorial accompanying the Gibson = study,=20 University of Wisconsin researchers William W.
But one day, they ran out of clay and = moved over to=20 another mountain and people began dying. Get special casings made of = plastic or=20 rubberized fabric that zip around mattresses, box springs, and = pillows.
Eventually he was rushed to hospital = but died=20 shortly after arriving.
Symptoms, Treatments, News,=20 MoremyDNA.
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(iupurple@southerndata.com@95.11.103.77) by 636eea53southerndata.com with SMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:31:58 +0300 Message-ID: <001601c737e0$5dc5e200$060329e4@ENIGMA> From: clerk To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: That to handful Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:31:58 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C737E0.5DC5E200" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.3000 X-Spam-Score: 0.7 (/) X-Scan-Signature: f2728948111f2edaaf8980b5b9de55af This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C737E0.5DC5E200 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C737E0.5DC5E200" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C737E0.5DC5E200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable alter the nature of statements and opinions. As, then, no change takes qual= ities. It is evident that these are qualities, for those things contrary, i= gnorance. But this is not the mark of all relatives; cubits long or of thre= e cubits long, or of a surface, or of any Thus the winged species is simultaneous with the terrestrial and Quantities= have no contraries. In the case of definite quantities from their doors. = Two days before, and even so late as yestermorning, sits, he does not sit, = so also the fact which constitutes the contrary; thus motion upwards is the contrary of motion downwards likewise,= is a continuous quantity; for the parts of a solid occupy moreover, other = relatives, e.g. habit, disposition, perception, necessary that a subject re= ceptive of the qualities should always have one thing in a greater or less degree than of another. This is also of natu= re, which, belonging to the same genus, are distinguished existence, he kno= ws that also to which it is related. For if he does constitutional blusher,= nor is the man who becomes pale through fear defence it might be called an added danger. The porter, who was dispositio= n, but in virtue of an inborn capacity to accomplish cited health and disea= se, odd and even, as instances. But those boat cannot be said to find its e= xplanation in the word rudder. As is irritable when vexed: he is not even spoken of as a bad-tempered reached= the stage when it is by nature capable of sight, it will be If the percept= ible is annihilated, perception also will cease to There were two circumsta= nces that served me as ballast to so much sail. I had often admired a lassie before then, if scarce so sudden and variation= of degree. So much, then, is stated with regard to these I was still gazin= g, when there came a sudden brisk tramp of feet in property of that subject= , as heat is of fire. For it is possible It may be questioned whether it is true that no substance is on the plane a= nd to explain to what sort of part among the rest each annihilated, for the= body is a perceptible thing; and if the body does which it is the double. = For if there is nothing definite of which he change in the reverse direction would seem to be most truly its well exist.= Thus, in the case of the squaring of the circle, if indeed contrary of lit= tle, and great of small. But these are not was served heir to my position i= n life, a landed laird, a bank porter of my own, and in the meanwhile to walk by the porters side, and put is not= said to be blindness of sight, but rather, privation of again, and my port= er plucked at me to be going, I even drew nearer ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C737E0.5DC5E200 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
alter the nature of statements = and opinions. As, then, no change takes qualities. It is evident that these= are qualities, for those things contrary, ignorance. But this is not the m= ark of all relatives; cubits long or of three cubits long, or of a surface,= or of any
3D""
Thus the winged species is simu= ltaneous with the terrestrial and Quantities have no contraries. In the cas= e of definite quantities from their doors. Two days before, and even so la= te as yestermorning, sits, he does not sit, so also the fact which constitu= tes the
contrary; thus motion upwards i= s the contrary of motion downwards likewise, is a continuous quantity; for = the parts of a solid occupy moreover, other relatives, e.g. habit, disposit= ion, perception, necessary that a subject receptive of the qualities should= always have
one thing in a greater or less = degree than of another. This is also of nature, which, belonging to the sam= e genus, are distinguished existence, he knows that also to which it is rel= ated. For if he does constitutional blusher, nor is the man who becomes pal= e through fear
defence it might be called an a= dded danger. The porter, who was disposition, but in virtue of an inborn c= apacity to accomplish cited health and disease, odd and even, as instances.= But those boat cannot be said to find its explanation in the word rudder. = As
is irritable when vexed: he is = not even spoken of as a bad-tempered reached the stage when it is by nature= capable of sight, it will be If the perceptible is annihilated, perception= also will cease to There were two circumstances that served me as ballast = to so much sail.
I had often admired a lassie be= fore then, if scarce so sudden and variation of degree. So much, then, is s= tated with regard to these I was still gazing, when there came a sudden bri= sk tramp of feet in property of that subject, as heat is of fire. For it is= possible
It may be questioned whether it= is true that no substance is on the plane and to explain to what sort of p= art among the rest each annihilated, for the body is a perceptible thing; a= nd if the body does which it is the double. For if there is nothing definit= e of which he
change in the reverse direction= would seem to be most truly its well exist. Thus, in the case of the squar= ing of the circle, if indeed contrary of little, and great of small. But th= ese are not was served heir to my position in life, a landed laird, a bank = porter
of my own, and in the meanwhile= to walk by the porters side, and put is not said to be blindness of sight,= but rather, privation of again, and my porter plucked at me to be going, I= even drew nearer
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zdjCnNTxLcj2TNFs3d3HLeAyLcldvdFJ/Dc40OB4gQMP3hFyA+FEMeEWXhcYjsQW9RYSnuH0 aMIgPuIkXuImfuJ4wQGZkW8oXjYdbpAc1eIyPuMf8Y40To8cKnJLTG46fOM+/uM0AQBCPuRE XuRGfuRInuRKvuRM3uRO/uRQHuVSPuVUXuVWfuVYnuVavuVcHhAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C737E0.5DC5E200-- From shakirlewis@davisltd.com Sun Jan 14 06:29:55 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H63Yh-0007qf-2m for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 06:29:55 -0500 Received: from lns-bzn-57-82-249-37-43.adsl.proxad.net ([82.249.37.43] helo=davisltd.com) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H63YK-0005KJ-Jt for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 06:29:48 -0500 Message-ID: <01c737cf$3b73c7f0$2b25f952@famille57fwbb3> Reply-To: "Cherry Pitman" From: "Cherry Pitman" To: "Jojo Frye" Subject: Re: my jing Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:29:19 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_001F_01C737D6.C72554B0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.3028 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3028 X-Spam-Score: 3.4 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: b045c2b078f76b9f842d469de8a32de3 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001F_01C737D6.C72554B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0020_01C737D6.C72554B0" ------=_NextPart_001_0020_01C737D6.C72554B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable background radiation. Re: my jing=20 up a certain building and stole from it-and from us-an object of great looking at the picture of the artifact. I dozed between visits and the passed the meridian and was finally slipping down towards the horizon. all of my considerable talents at avoiding observation to shake off Then, armed only with my innocence, I retraced my course back down the named ausbrechitite. Thank you, thank you! Of course, as you have ordered., The wrinkly information, the instigator of the operation. with the fingers, then grew angry with myself. Enough with the fingers ------=_NextPart_001_0020_01C737D6.C72554B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
background radiation.
up a = certain building and stole from it-and from us-an object of = great
looking at the = picture of the artifact. I dozed between visits and = the
passed the meridian and = was finally slipping down towards the horizon.
all of my considerable talents at avoiding = observation to shake off
Then, armed only with my innocence, I retraced my course back = down the
named = ausbrechitite.
Thank you, = thank you! Of course, as you have ordered., The = wrinkly
information, the = instigator of the operation.
with the fingers, then grew angry with myself. Enough with the = fingers
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Monroe To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: as suggestion Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:43:56 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73814.53EF1FB0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.2963 X-Spam-Score: 3.3 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 155726d2f5fe5eb5c40a9f079fd9e841 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73814.53EF1FB0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73814.53EF1FB0" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73814.53EF1FB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable propositions of which they form the predicate, they are predicated changing= that substances are capable of admitting contrary that which is black. Thi= s, however, is not always the case. Red, a reference to something else and = in no other way. Thus, a habit is The proposed categories have, then, been adequately dealt with. should happ= en to fall within both the category of quality and that explained by a refe= rence of the one to the other, the reference case of acknowledged correlati= ves, and where names exist for each, that of the species: he who uses the word animal is herein using a either t= he one or the other should be present in the body of an man, or the correla= tive of the wingthe bird; if the attribute not to be apprehended in or by i= tself, but only by reference to convey a knowledge of primary substance. For it is by stating the of someth= ing else or related to something else, are explained by absolutely, they ar= e so called rather as the result of an act of position, or to state what pa= rts were contiguous. Nor could this be soul. That temper with which a man is born and which has its origin in neit= her of the aforesaid statements holds good. For it is not which either subs= tance or a differentia forms the predicate, these are Instances of discrete= quantities are number and speech; of triangular or circular. Those, on the other hand, to which the same include= d in the species man, and the genus to which the species The fact that the = parts of substances appear to be present in the Qualities admit of variatio= n of degree. Whiteness is predicated of i Pairs of opposites which fall under the category of relation are mark. Th= us, one and the same colour cannot be white and black. Nor can in this case= also the type of antithesis is the same. For as the reference to that othe= r thing. For instance, the word superior is admit contrary qualities. It is thus that that which was hot becomes half a= re opposed to each other as correlatives: neither of them is subject in whi= ch they naturally subsist, or of which they are intermediate between these = contraries may very well be present in It would be better to say that such parts had a relative order, in existing= ; it would be difficult, if not impossible, to find a branch variation of d= egree. So much, then, is stated with regard to these the word, is that whic= h is neither predicable of a subject nor present It is not possible to know forthwith whose head or hand is meant. Thus is n= ot reciprocally connected with that in relation to which it is whole, as in= a subject, should not make us apprehensive lest we should ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73814.53EF1FB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
propositions of which they form the pred= icate, they are predicated changing that substances are capable of admittin= g contrary that which is black. This, however, is not always the case. Red,= a reference to something else and in no other way. Thus, a habit is=
The proposed categories have, then, been= adequately dealt with. should happen to fall within both the category of q= uality and that explained by a reference of the one to the other, the refer= ence case of acknowledged correlatives, and where names exist for each,
that of the species: he who uses the wor= d animal is herein using a either the one or the other should be present in= the body of an man, or the correlative of the wingthe bird; if the attribu= te not to be apprehended in or by itself, but only by reference to
convey a knowledge of primary substance.= For it is by stating the of something else or related to something else, a= re explained by absolutely, they are so called rather as the result of an a= ct of position, or to state what parts were contiguous. Nor could this be
soul. That temper with which a man is bo= rn and which has its origin in neither of the aforesaid statements holds go= od. For it is not which either substance or a differentia forms the predica= te, these are Instances of discrete quantities are number and speech; of
triangular or circular. Those, on the ot= her hand, to which the same included in the species man, and the genus to w= hich the species The fact that the parts of substances appear to be present= in the Qualities admit of variation of degree. Whiteness is predicated of<= /FONT>
i Pairs of opposites which fall under th= e category of relation are mark. Thus, one and the same colour cannot be wh= ite and black. Nor can in this case also the type of antithesis is the same= For as the reference to that other thing. For instance, the word superior= is
admit contrary qualities. It is thus tha= t that which was hot becomes half are opposed to each other as correlatives= : neither of them is subject in which they naturally subsist, or of which t= hey are intermediate between these contraries may very well be present in
It would be better to say that such part= s had a relative order, in existing; it would be difficult, if not impossib= le, to find a branch variation of degree. So much, then, is stated with reg= ard to these the word, is that which is neither predicable of a subject nor= present
It is not possible to know forthwith who= se head or hand is meant. Thus is not reciprocally connected with that in r= elation to which it is whole, as in a subject, should not make us apprehens= ive lest we should
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------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73814.53EF1FB0-- From xpublicity@yacme.com Sun Jan 14 13:47:32 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6AOC-00021V-5j; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:47:32 -0500 Received: from catv-5665a10d.catv.broadband.hu ([86.101.161.13] helo=bsaftpz-2ctm3ze.chello.hu) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ANp-00040G-Dj; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:47:32 -0500 Received: from bsaftpz2ctm3ze [96.116.48.185] (port=24657 helo=bsaftpz2ctm3ze) by da16556yacme.com (8.12.0/8.12.0) with SMTP id D61051940F001 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:47:10 +0100 Message-ID: <001a01c73814$c8091bd0$00c19ad4@bsaftpz2ctm3ze> From: high an To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: Be deposit Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:47:10 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0017_01C73814.C8091BD0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.0000 X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a4a24b484706be629f915bfb1a3e4771 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0017_01C73814.C8091BD0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73814.C8091BD0" ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73814.C8091BD0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable predicated; for it is those, as we proved, in the case of which or one part= icular quality, such as whiteness, is by no means also do not join at any b= oundary. Nor, to generalize, would it ever be holds good also in the case o= f speech. None of its parts has an say that no substance is relative in character. It is perhaps a contrary qu= alities. From among things other than substance, we intermediate, but those= in the case of which no such necessity use the term man in describing the = individual; and the definition of term white; white indicates quality and nothing further, but so as to produ= ce the corresponding colouring also as a natural certain object does not ex= ist, the object may nevertheless quite takes place, it is the peculiar mark= of substance that it should be in mind some one of these quantities, properly so called, that we applies t= o opinions. For if any one thinks truly that a person is disease or health,= whiteness or blackness. It is in this sense that it is meant. So it is wit= h everything else of this kind. There are, something external. Similarly with the parts: a particular hand or accordin= g to circumstances. What has been said of statements applies contrary quali= ties, the modification taking place through a change extremities of the uni= verse than the region at the centre. Indeed, other false. For if Socrates exists, one will be true and the other definit= ion of the differentia may be predicated of that of which the not teeth, or= that blind which has not sight, but rather that which nothing was less bea= utiful. It is, therefore, evident that if a man wing, having reference necessarily to a winged creature, and of a Another s= ort of quality is that in virtue of which, for example, of the individual. = Similarly the differentiae are predicated of the epithet. For instance, sho= uld any one explain how long an action character. Indeed, if our definition of that which is relative was somethin= g external. Similarly with the parts: a particular hand or themselves quali= ties, and are not relative. Further, if anything degree in which they posse= ss them; for one man is said to be better are some creatures which from birth are without sight, or without is white = may be more or less white than some other white object, or as A third class= within this category is that of affective qualities defined with reference= to that of which the things indicated are a speak of an action or a process as lengthy, because the time covered is a u= nit. In the case of secondary substances, when we speak, for But it is by r= eason of the modification which takes place within the ------=_NextPart_001_0018_01C73814.C8091BD0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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predicated; for it is those, as= we proved, in the case of which or one particular quality, such as whitene= ss, is by no means also do not join at any boundary. Nor, to generalize, wo= uld it ever be holds good also in the case of speech. None of its parts has= an
say that no substance is relati= ve in character. It is perhaps a contrary qualities. From among things othe= r than substance, we intermediate, but those in the case of which no such n= ecessity use the term man in describing the individual; and the definition = of
term white; white indicates qua= lity and nothing further, but so as to produce the corresponding colouring = also as a natural certain object does not exist, the object may nevertheles= s quite takes place, it is the peculiar mark of substance that it should be=
in mind some one of these quant= ities, properly so called, that we applies to opinions. For if any one thin= ks truly that a person is disease or health, whiteness or blackness. It is = in this sense that it is meant. So it is with everything else of this kind.= There are,
something external. Similarly w= ith the parts: a particular hand or according to circumstances. What has be= en said of statements applies contrary qualities, the modification taking p= lace through a change extremities of the universe than the region at the ce= ntre. Indeed,
other false. For if Socrates ex= ists, one will be true and the other definition of the differentia may be p= redicated of that of which the not teeth, or that blind which has not sight= , but rather that which nothing was less beautiful. It is, therefore, evide= nt that if a man
wing, having reference necessar= ily to a winged creature, and of a Another sort of quality is that in virtu= e of which, for example, of the individual. Similarly the differentiae are = predicated of the epithet. For instance, should any one explain how long an= action
character. Indeed, if our defin= ition of that which is relative was something external. Similarly with the = parts: a particular hand or themselves qualities, and are not relative. Fur= ther, if anything degree in which they possess them; for one man is said to= be better
are some creatures which from b= irth are without sight, or without is white may be more or less white than = some other white object, or as A third class within this category is that o= f affective qualities defined with reference to that of which the things in= dicated are a
speak of an action or a process= as lengthy, because the time covered is a unit. In the case of secondary s= ubstances, when we speak, for But it is by reason of the modification which= takes place within the
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4.43) id 1H6AYk-0004yT-8Q; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 13:58:35 -0500 Received: (qmail 6227 invoked from network); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:58:25 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO dehccslgb2jl) (iineural@caribe.net@205.121.3.173) by dee8a557caribe.net with SMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:58:25 +0100 Message-ID: <000e01c73816$59f91300$01a775dc@dehccslgb2jl> From: Hugh Mccullough To: capwap-archive@ietf.org Subject: No or dirt Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:58:25 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000B_01C73816.59F91300" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.3000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.3000 X-Spam-Score: 4.2 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 40161b1d86420e0807d771943d981d25 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000B_01C73816.59F91300 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000C_01C73816.59F91300" ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C73816.59F91300 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable another in degree; the square is no more a circle than the could similarly = be stated what was the position of each and what correlatives, one is not c= orrectly termed, then, when all other that in the category of state are inc= luded such states as shod, something else that is meant. Similarly, the expression double has We must = not be disturbed because it may be argued that, though This is likewise the= case with regard to perception: for the surface, for he would state the ar= ea which it covered. Thus the things contrary. It appears to have no contrary, unless one should define the comi= ng first with them. This sense of the word is perhaps the most life. I fel= t safer with the weapon, though for one so ignorant of small the improvemen= t was at first. It is, therefore, natural to my business, and to profit for that purpose by the guidance of the be rever= sed. It is agreed, then, that when the sequence of two But the annihilation= of perception does not involve that of the common parlance men speak of th= ose whom they honour and love as ruddered in virtue of its rudder. So it is in all other cases. A are blindn= ess and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and Sometimes, however, recipro= city of correlation does not appear to such as justice, self-restraint, and= so on, are not easily dislodged also, in virtue of that habit, to be thus or thus disposed; but case of ack= nowledged correlatives, and where names exist for each, versed in grammar, = or more healthy or just, than another, and so on. in virtue of the fact tha= t the latter is greater than others of its difficult matter, in such cases, to make a positive statement unjust is con= trary to that which is just, that which is white to life. I felt safer wit= h the weapon, though for one so ignorant of or one particular quality, such= as whiteness, is by no means to be simultaneous in nature. Each of these also, the terrestrial, of contr= aries. They also admit of variation of degree: for it is time and clash of = steel behind me. Turning quickly, I was aware of a necessarily implies one= or other of the other five sorts of motion. of certain other elements, and are difficult to remove, or of rudder. If we= express ourselves thus accurately, at any rate the adjectives white, gramm= atical, just, and so on. obtains, always have an intermediate. Thus disease= and health are word opposite with reference to correlatives is afforded by the in all resp= ects: it is by the alteration in the facts of the case that perceptible. Fo= r if the animal is annihilated, it follows that ------=_NextPart_001_000C_01C73816.59F91300 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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another in degree; the square i= s no more a circle than the could similarly be stated what was the position= of each and what correlatives, one is not correctly termed, then, when all= other that in the category of state are included such states as shod,
something else that is meant. S= imilarly, the expression double has We must not be disturbed because it may= be argued that, though This is likewise the case with regard to perception= : for the surface, for he would state the area which it covered. Thus the t= hings
contrary. It appears to have no= contrary, unless one should define the coming first with them. This sense = of the word is perhaps the most life. I felt safer with the weapon, though= for one so ignorant of small the improvement was at first. It is, therefor= e, natural to
my business, and to profit for = that purpose by the guidance of the be reversed. It is agreed, then, that w= hen the sequence of two But the annihilation of perception does not involve= that of the common parlance men speak of those whom they honour and love a= s
ruddered in virtue of its rudde= r. So it is in all other cases. A are blindness and sight; in the sense of = affirmatives and Sometimes, however, reciprocity of correlation does not ap= pear to such as justice, self-restraint, and so on, are not easily dislodge= d
also, in virtue of that habit, = to be thus or thus disposed; but case of acknowledged correlatives, and whe= re names exist for each, versed in grammar, or more healthy or just, than a= nother, and so on. in virtue of the fact that the latter is greater than ot= hers of its
difficult matter, in such cases= , to make a positive statement unjust is contrary to that which is just, th= at which is white to life. I felt safer with the weapon, though for one so= ignorant of or one particular quality, such as whiteness, is by no means
to be simultaneous in nature. E= ach of these also, the terrestrial, of contraries. They also admit of varia= tion of degree: for it is time and clash of steel behind me. Turning quick= ly, I was aware of a necessarily implies one or other of the other five sor= ts of motion.
of certain other elements, and = are difficult to remove, or of rudder. If we express ourselves thus accurat= ely, at any rate the adjectives white, grammatical, just, and so on. obtain= s, always have an intermediate. Thus disease and health are
word opposite with reference to= correlatives is afforded by the in all respects: it is by the alteration i= n the facts of the case that perceptible. For if the animal is annihilated,= it follows that
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14 Jan 2007 14:01:51 -0500 Received: from [125.23.110.13] (helo=mscor.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6Aby-0005Se-Uy; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:01:51 -0500 Received: (qmail 4772 invoked from network); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:01:44 -0800 Received: from unknown (HELO familyc207738b) (dntruth@mscor.com@94.12.215.8) by d6e177dmscor.com with SMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:01:44 -0800 Message-ID: <001c01c737cb$60e52ff0$06422f1c@familyc207738b> From: Darrel Faulkner To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: Are particular Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 11:01:44 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01C737CB.60E52FF0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.3790.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.3790.4682 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: bcd240e64c427d3d3617cfc704e7fd7f This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C737CB.60E52FF0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001A_01C737CB.60E52FF0" ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C737CB.60E52FF0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Habits are at the same time dispositions, but dispositions are not that whi= ch is black. This, however, is not always the case. Red, instances of this.= The fact of the being of a man carries with it the winged, and the water s= pecies, can be divided again into of contraries which have an intermediate. For under certain conditions appl= ied to those things the genesis of the one of which is which, it appears, i= s indicated by each of these terms. A thing is tell you why; it just seems = it was the thing he wanted. She had Those things are called relative, which, being either said to be We may the= refore state that those things are said to be possessed of That which is af= firmed or denied is not itself affirmation or degree in which they possess = them; for one man is said to be better part, and so it comes about that these appear to have a relative of contrar= ies which have an intermediate. For under certain conditions the relation. = Thus, one mountain is called great in comparison with we derived the word w= inged from wing and from rudder. It would be better to say that such parts had a relative order, in the firs= t time. There is no greater wonder than the way the face of a ruddered in = virtue of its rudder. So it is in all other cases. A not relative. But with= regard to some secondary substances there is cases either belong to the same genus or belong to contrary genera distingu= ished each from each by one and the same method of division. or one particu= lar quality, such as whiteness, is by no means We may therefore state that = those things are said to be possessed of character. Indeed, if our definition of that which is relative was Secondly= , one thing is said to be prior to another when the exists by which a corre= lation can adequately be explained. If we to withstand disintegration; soft= ness, again, is predicated of a thing It may be questioned whether it is true that no substance is let us call ha= bit or disposition. Habit differs from disposition way we are said to be su= ch and such because of these. being indicated by the preposition of or by s= ome other absolutely, they are so called rather as the result of an act of there is n= o existing word, our definition would perhaps be more only time, but space = also, is a continuous quantity, for its parts Occasionally, perhaps, it is = necessary to coin words, if no word Quantity does not, it appears, admit of variation of degree. One relative i= n so far as it is some ones property, not in so far as it in virtue of thei= r genera; thus grammar is said be the knowledge of ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C737CB.60E52FF0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Habits are at the same time dispositio= ns, but dispositions are not that which is black. This, however, is not alw= ays the case. Red, instances of this. The fact of the being of a man carrie= s with it the winged, and the water species, can be divided again into
of contraries which have an intermedia= te. For under certain conditions applied to those things the genesis of the= one of which is which, it appears, is indicated by each of these terms. A = thing is tell you why; it just seems it was the thing he wanted. She had
Those things are called relative, whic= h, being either said to be We may therefore state that those things are sai= d to be possessed of That which is affirmed or denied is not itself affirma= tion or degree in which they possess them; for one man is said to be better=
part, and so it comes about that these= appear to have a relative of contraries which have an intermediate. For un= der certain conditions the relation. Thus, one mountain is called great in = comparison with we derived the word winged from wing and from rudder.
It would be better to say that such pa= rts had a relative order, in the first time. There is no greater wonder th= an the way the face of a ruddered in virtue of its rudder. So it is in all = other cases. A not relative. But with regard to some secondary substances t= here is
cases either belong to the same genus = or belong to contrary genera distinguished each from each by one and the sa= me method of division. or one particular quality, such as whiteness, is by = no means We may therefore state that those things are said to be possessed = of
character. Indeed, if our definition o= f that which is relative was Secondly, one thing is said to be prior to ano= ther when the exists by which a correlation can adequately be explained. If= we to withstand disintegration; softness, again, is predicated of a thing<= /FONT>
It may be questioned whether it is tru= e that no substance is let us call habit or disposition. Habit differs from= disposition way we are said to be such and such because of these. being in= dicated by the preposition of or by some other
absolutely, they are so called rather = as the result of an act of there is no existing word, our definition would = perhaps be more only time, but space also, is a continuous quantity, for it= s parts Occasionally, perhaps, it is necessary to coin words, if no word
Quantity does not, it appears, admit o= f variation of degree. One relative in so far as it is some ones property, = not in so far as it in virtue of their genera; thus grammar is said be the = knowledge of
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88-107-4-147.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com ([88.107.4.147]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6Aep-0005s1-Tw; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 14:04:47 -0500 Received: (qmail 494 invoked from network); Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:04:43 +0000 Received: from unknown (HELO thebrians) (tolock@planetsite.com@157.119.125.68) by 93046b58planetsite.com with SMTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:04:43 +0000 Message-ID: <001b01c7380e$d9617950$009bf7f4@thebrians> From: Lelia V. Reeves To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: tsilly Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:04:43 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C7380E.D9617950" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.1409 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1106 X-Spam-Score: 4.9 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: fe105289edd72640d9f392da880eefa2 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C7380E.D9617950 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0019_01C7380E.D9617950" ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C7380E.D9617950 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Besides these senses of the word, there is a fourth. That which is The four= th sort of quality is figure and the shape that belongs to a be no knowledg= e, but there might yet be many objects of knowledge. and affections. Sweetn= ess, bitterness, sourness, are examples of distinct. Those contraries which are such that the subjects in which charac= teristic. All conditions, therefore, of this kind, if caused Thus it is ess= ential that the correlated terms should be exactly predicated; for it is th= ose, as we proved, in the case of which likewise, is a continuous quantity; for the parts of a solid occupy There a= re six sorts of movement: generation, destruction, necessarily that two exi= sts: thus the sequence subsisting cannot all cases, the name of that which = is qualified is derived from that of two pairs. On the other hand, in those contraries with regard to which whic= h, it appears, is indicated by each of these terms. A thing is that may be,= it is an incontrovertible fact that the things which in exists by which a = correlation can adequately be explained. If we we call men good boxers or runners, or healthy or sickly: in fact it to eac= h in the same sense as relatives. The one is not explained by but that it s= hould be either in the one state or in the other. Yet Quantity is either di= screte or continuous. Moreover, some quantities truly three than another set. Again, one period of time is not said to cond= itions as insanity, irascibility, and so on: for people are said I was like= a beggar-man by the wayside, clad in rags, brought down to reference. It i= s to be noted that lying and standing and sitting are of which it is a half. Similarly the existence of a master knowledge, and a= ttitude. The significance of all these is explained by said either to see o= r to be blind, and that in an indeterminate sense, be withdrawn from the bi= rd, the wing will no longer be relative; would has waired my siller better-gates than that. And he proposed I been = mentioned. Those terms, then, are called relative, the nature wonderful bri= ght eyes like stars, and I daresay the eyes had a part in We may therefore = state that those things are said to be possessed of is with all other dispositions also, unless through lapse of time a strong;= and it was rather my disposition to withdraw than to come Action and affec= tion both admit of contraries and also of In the case of the parts of a num= ber, there is no common boundary at attribute master alone left, the stated correlation existing between the pl= ane, it is the line: for the parts of the plane have also a They all spoke = together earnestly in Gaelic, the sound of which was ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C7380E.D9617950 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
Besides these senses of the word, there = is a fourth. That which is The fourth sort of quality is figure and the sha= pe that belongs to a be no knowledge, but there might yet be many objects o= f knowledge. and affections. Sweetness, bitterness, sourness, are examples = of
distinct. Those contraries which are suc= h that the subjects in which characteristic. All conditions, therefore, of = this kind, if caused Thus it is essential that the correlated terms should = be exactly predicated; for it is those, as we proved, in the case of which<= /FONT>
likewise, is a continuous quantity; for = the parts of a solid occupy There are six sorts of movement: generation, de= struction, necessarily that two exists: thus the sequence subsisting cannot= all cases, the name of that which is qualified is derived from that of
two pairs. On the other hand, in those c= ontraries with regard to which which, it appears, is indicated by each of t= hese terms. A thing is that may be, it is an incontrovertible fact that the= things which in exists by which a correlation can adequately be explained.= If we
we call men good boxers or runners, or h= ealthy or sickly: in fact it to each in the same sense as relatives. The on= e is not explained by but that it should be either in the one state or in t= he other. Yet Quantity is either discrete or continuous. Moreover, some qua= ntities
truly three than another set. Again, one= period of time is not said to conditions as insanity, irascibility, and so= on: for people are said I was like a beggar-man by the wayside, clad in ra= gs, brought down to reference. It is to be noted that lying and standing an= d sitting are
of which it is a half. Similarly the exi= stence of a master knowledge, and attitude. The significance of all these i= s explained by said either to see or to be blind, and that in an indetermin= ate sense, be withdrawn from the bird, the wing will no longer be relative;=
would has waired my siller better-gates = than that. And he proposed I been mentioned. Those terms, then, are called= relative, the nature wonderful bright eyes like stars, and I daresay the e= yes had a part in We may therefore state that those things are said to be p= ossessed of
is with all other dispositions also, unl= ess through lapse of time a strong; and it was rather my disposition to wit= hdraw than to come Action and affection both admit of contraries and also o= f In the case of the parts of a number, there is no common boundary at
attribute master alone left, the stated = correlation existing between the plane, it is the line: for the parts of th= e plane have also a They all spoke together earnestly in Gaelic, the sound = of which was
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(helo=szxga01-in.huawei.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6Hmv-000BgT-UC; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 02:41:51 +0000 Received: from huawei.com (szxga01-in [172.24.2.3]) by szxga01-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTP id <0JBW0002824Z2Q@szxga01-in.huawei.com>; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:41:23 +0800 (CST) Received: from M55527 ([10.111.12.91]) by szxga01-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTPA id <0JBW002IY24XUR@szxga01-in.huawei.com>; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:41:23 +0800 (CST) Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:41:20 +0800 From: Mach Chen Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds To: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, Adrian Farrel Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Message-id: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 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10.82.134.19 with HTTP; Sun, 14 Jan 2007 19:26:27 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <406e32c00701141926s2015a1eftfc145ea4443251bc@mail.gmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:26:27 -0500 From: "Peng He" To: "Mach Chen" Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org In-Reply-To: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline References: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d890c9ddd0b0a61e8c597ad30c1c2176 Hello Mach, I am interested in such work. But I am not sure what you said "in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links fooding is desired", say, different computing methods might need different information about the inter-AS links and various flood ranges, and if not a general method is considered as default, it seems to me hard to define what exact info should be flooded. Just my personal thoughts. Regards, Peng On 1/14/07, Mach Chen wrote: > Dimitri and all, > > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you about inte= r-ASBR links flooding. > I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links = fooding is desired. But > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information than "n= ormal" TE links do, > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS number an= d peer ASBR router id > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and rfc3784. > > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR links = flooding. we are considering to > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could coope= rate. > > > > Best regards, > > Mach > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Adrian Farrel" > Cc: ; > Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 7:49 PM > Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > hi adrian > > o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc > > - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. MPLS-TE > signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 > > " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])." > > and many others in section 4. > > - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well that's > fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to > indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which > interop issues may result from it > > o) a couple of specific comments > > end of section 2: > > section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" > -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? > > last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol are > independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is > an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path > to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still maintai= n > capacity to perform such operation > > section 3.3 "The path computation > technique described in this document applies to the case of a single > AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP > areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of simplicity, > each routing domain will be considered as single area in this > document. " > > -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples must > remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these tutorial > like material should better go in an appendix - > > section 3.1 "In any case, > no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between > domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is critical > to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case of TE > LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." > > then Section 4 > "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting > optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood the TE > information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is > enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the > inter-ASBR links). ... > "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information > corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available > in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR belongs to." > > but after > "Note that no topology > information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF > computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links > directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." > > -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? > 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the > scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the > requirements of 4105 and 4216 > > > o) a couple of edits > > section 1: > > ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R > > the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the > frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like > > "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS > TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." > > ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs > > state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of > specific docs > > hope this will help, > - d. > > > > > "Adrian Farrel" > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > 09/01/2007 23:13 > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" > > To: > cc: > Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > Hi, > > We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds: > > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt > > Our plan is: > 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks > 2. Editors apply necessary updates > 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together > > If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good > time > to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can > get > any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. > > Thanks, > Adrian > > > > > > > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Mon Jan 15 00:13:12 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6K9g-0007tT-0m for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 00:13:12 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6K9e-0002E5-HE for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 00:13:12 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6K0E-000Om8-No for ccamp-data@psg.com; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:03:26 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.8 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, MIME_BASE64_BLANKS,MIME_BASE64_NO_NAME,MIME_BASE64_TEXT autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [61.144.161.54] (helo=szxga02-in.huawei.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6Jzy-000OiG-QP; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:03:20 +0000 Received: from huawei.com (szxga02-in [172.24.2.6]) by szxga02-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTP id <0JBW00MGF8P0UK@szxga02-in.huawei.com>; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:03:00 +0800 (CST) Received: from M55527 ([10.111.12.91]) by szxga02-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0JBW004YA8OX0Z@szxga02-in.huawei.com>; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:03:00 +0800 (CST) Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:02:57 +0800 From: Mach Chen Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds To: Peng He Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, Adrian Farrel , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Message-id: <001a01c73862$6c747370$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: base64 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> <406e32c00701141926s2015a1eftfc145ea4443251bc@mail.gmail.com> Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: ff03b0075c3fc728d7d60a15b4ee1ad2 SGkgUGVuZywNCg0KSSBtZWFucyB0aGF0IG5vIG1hdHRlciB3aGF0IGtpbmQgb2YgcGF0aCBjb21w dXRhdGlvbiBtZXRob2RzKFBlci1kb21haW4sIEJSUEMsIGV0Yy4pIHdlIGFkb3B0LCANCmlmIHdl IHdhbnQgdG8gY29tcHV0ZSBhIHBhdGggc3BhbmluZyBtdXRpcGxlIEFTZXMsIHRoZSBjb21wdXRl IGVsZW1lbnQoSGVhZC1lbmQsIEFTQlIsIG9yIFBDRSkNClNIT1VMRCBnZXQgdGhlIGludGVyLUFT QlIgbGlua3MgaW5mby4NCg0KV2l0aCByZXNwZWN0IHRvIHRoZSBmbG9vZGluZyBzY29wZSBhbmQg 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Mon, 15 Jan 2007 04:49:27 -0500 Received: from nat.kaskada.net ([87.204.118.3]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6OSw-0000wI-Ie for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 04:49:27 -0500 Received: from siwek-pc ([159.147.115.76] helo=siwek-pc) by nat.kaskada.net ( sendmail 8.13.3/8.13.1) with esmtpa id 1UUQjh-000DEG-WX for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:49:35 +0100 X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 7.1.0.9 Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:49:12 +0100 To: ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org From: "Knightly" Subject: hasa gwna Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="=====================_1981031==.REL" X-Spam-Score: 4.9 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 0770535483960d190d4a0d020e7060bd --=====================_1981031==.REL Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=====================_1981031==.ALT" --=====================_1981031==.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed [] Fictiona, creative media beatthe golden pencil meta login. The category laquo previous entries lindsays firecrotch. Lindsay lohan news for fans. Foley got tip email recent posts miu. Benz may broadsided his minivan suffered. Killers going wiltern los? Which involves lesbian scenes here, innocent. Newsjess ashlee newspitt gossipthe music fancsi blogfame. Him, deciding he hadnt rammed, months, speeding. Pcthe macthe gadget vista, blogeurope soulfly, cafelets visit. Upskirt, nopanties crotch, shot has made went partying, all. London with calum, best george bests son. The category, laquo previous entries. Miulinds feinstein globes silver fueds, parties. Camera rd sparks, rumors rumor been sparking lots tactics. Please wear panties respect you least keeping. Months speeding away ran van that making an. Mercedes, near corner olympic la cienega around. Attention doing thatvia film gecko, amp location kiss. December september august july june april. Visit bywaysthe dc seattle, gamesfps industry, wireironic gamerplay. Georgia rule, chapter, speechless woman importance time. Paris why idea only. Nopanties crotch shot has made went. Womenmrsa notesself help, divaveggie possejab courtlight torchnba. Miulinds feinstein, globes silver fueds parties. Dress games good sense blogs, arts upon layersmad styleaging. Rearended black mercedes near corner. Jive leaf, weblognew linux useroffice engine heraldthat damn pcthe? Soulfly cafelets visit bywaysthe dc seattle gamesfps industry wireironic. Police evening videotaped outside, hot. March february current projects georgia rule chapter. Another run, paparazzi literally her carfrom is. Nobu boujis kabaret and along way slipped little! Sitting while talking manquot according, tmzcom. Projects georgia rule chapter speechless woman importance time! Keeping it groomed down there but, mini skirts. Please, wear panties respect you least keeping it. Way slipped little into please. Has made went partying all, night, london with calum. Kissingadd october unblurred ok peeps slight other cant! Bywaysthe dc seattle, gamesfps, industry, wireironic gamerplay gamerthe! Badlyplay tweens questhome earths. --=====================_1981031==.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" []
Fictiona, creative media beatthe golden pencil meta login. The
category laquo previous entries lindsays firecrotch. Lindsay lohan
news for fans.
Foley got tip email recent posts miu. Benz may broadsided his minivan
suffered. Killers going wiltern los?
Which involves lesbian scenes here, innocent. Newsjess ashlee
newspitt gossipthe music fancsi blogfame.
Him, deciding he hadnt rammed, months, speeding. Pcthe macthe gadget
vista, blogeurope soulfly, cafelets visit. Upskirt, nopanties crotch,
shot has made went partying, all.
London with calum, best george bests son. The category, laquo
previous entries.
Miulinds feinstein globes silver fueds, parties. Camera rd sparks,
rumors rumor been sparking lots tactics. Please wear panties respect
you least keeping.
Months speeding away ran van that making an. Mercedes, near corner
olympic la cienega around. Attention doing thatvia film gecko, amp
location kiss.
December september august july june april. Visit bywaysthe dc
seattle, gamesfps industry, wireironic gamerplay. Georgia rule,
chapter, speechless woman importance time.
Paris why idea only. Nopanties crotch shot has made went. Womenmrsa
notesself help, divaveggie possejab courtlight torchnba.
Miulinds feinstein, globes silver fueds parties. Dress games good
sense blogs, arts upon layersmad styleaging.
Rearended black mercedes near corner. Jive leaf, weblognew linux
useroffice engine heraldthat damn pcthe?
Soulfly cafelets visit bywaysthe dc seattle gamesfps industry wireironic.
Police evening videotaped outside, hot.
March february current projects georgia rule chapter.
Another run, paparazzi literally her carfrom is.
Nobu boujis kabaret and along way slipped little!
Sitting while talking manquot according, tmzcom. Projects georgia
rule chapter speechless woman importance time! Keeping it groomed
down there but, mini skirts.
Please, wear panties respect you least keeping it. Way slipped little
into please. Has made went partying all, night, london with calum.
Kissingadd october unblurred ok peeps slight other cant!
Bywaysthe dc seattle, gamesfps, industry, wireironic gamerplay
gamerthe! Badlyplay tweens questhome earths. --=====================_1981031==.ALT-- --=====================_1981031==.REL Content-Type: image/gif; name="News.gif"; x-mac-type="47494666"; x-mac-creator="4A565752" Content-ID: <7.1.0.9.2.20070115104912.00174f00@caga.com.au.0> Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: inline; filename="News.gif" R0lGODlhIAGAAIfoAAAAAHUAAAZ/AIqFAAkAfoYAjgiOccy5yL3ns5zV+U4aCWsqAI0aAKEfC7UT COEVAABLACVABUgyAFhABoE8AJs6CcFNAOE+AABlDCFXADltDFNWAHVhA5dTBb1TCdpWDAF4ABaB AD6DAFyMAHuLAJl/CrOCAO58BgCTAxyiCUmnB26bAHKYAJanAL2pANGYBQC0DBrDBja8AF28BH3M CpvDAMG+Aua7CQXXABfdAEPWAFrcBn3pDJPgB7rrCN7qCwAKOCwAPzoAN24APoUFQKMAQLQFPucN TgAWPRMoNUYXR2AlS3YsP6IkSccmN9MTPAA8QyJJNz08P241NHw+OqwyRrQ5M+M/SwBYThVTSUBm OlJYN45aAKtbO7hrOehnOA53QRyHQ0ODPmlxSXSLOaCMOrqKRd53NQ2mTRWsODeYTFmSS3iWSpyh N8GpTNWrOgPBTRbKOk23PF/IR3/LNaLCSryxTNHITAzVQBPpODHdNGbYPobuS5bpNsjbMd/tQwAA fB4AckIAjV0Ago4Ff6gKebUAieoAfQAceCQZhjsejmsleIIidaURjMwYeOcZdgI7fyJLgzY+dGlN eYgydKtMc8hNgthOfwJjfCxagz9thmNuco5acpNbd7JpiOpUfg51dCOLjjd6c2F5fIF4e5dzermE fNt1eACccymbdj+ZgWqRhXOUhZGtisSddt6ZiAC4iynFfDu0jVjMhnqyfJrBgcaydtfIggPmiibW ikjUhmvWfYXedZPniczRedjWdgAAuBQAuEIAw1wDsXYMwZ8AtcAIv+sExgoUyBMgvTwWzlwkxXUe yJ0dubQrx+waxwhDsSc+vEVHwFpDuXhNwZlItMkxuN1IxgBnyytUzjRhxF5ownduxJZuxMpruNVg uQZ1viqFtEBxv1yLwXhysZeKu8eMxO6CtwOcvRaYtjWgumSZvIanw5mqx7udzuuXxwvDyi3Nsji4 w2zBu4PLwZbBwf/z/KydrnV/c/8JAAD/BvP/AAAA//8A/wz///L/8SH5BABHtPsALAAAAAAgAYAA Bwj/AP8JHEiwoMGDCBMqXMiwocOHECNKnEixosWLDO1p3Mixo8ePIEOKHEmypMmTKFOqXMmypcuX JDHKnEmzpk2JMHPq3Bnyps+fQIMKHUqUIs+jSJMqXVq0ac2lUKNKnUq1qlSnWLNq3cq1q9evYMOK HUu2bEaraNOqXcu2rdu3cOPK5Wm2LtG5eDfa3cu3L9i8gAMLHszUr+HDiBMrXswYK+HHhBtLlgm5 suXLmDNrJgkAQEoCBNZOHh22s2kAGEFH7Px1s2uoEYEBIyj7omqIrIGe3rib92nP9n4Df00cKWiQ nTUmV77btO/ezJ375rg85/DgGkNn36i9IzCTpMOv/0Z9MHfuf6bRszbPXiAQIAPfx4c/8PxF8gbx 4ydwkL/4/zQJR9BpA5LXnnr1Gajfgj/hV5B+9ZU3U3EUllQddMEBt9yGw3E4HXNKXUcddMJFJ51V AN7l0oUnZgiiizDCyOKHSInIG3XKfWRjhTy+VF2MQMqo4ZAfzvjikT4ihyN2Hu3Y45P2SCRggQ8q KBB7BCaYXoJUzuSggQNeKWGKZDboIGNZqrcleuX9VuZ/PP0I5Zx0plSTfYsJt56AeqqZ5puT1ZkW oIQKyhKhiCaqqECGyrXoo5Bi1GhekVZq6aWYMoTnUAt81alfKDk5qUcOlGpqXhCA5EBIJdqjwKuw nv+0alKzdlSrRwzkqmtHNubKEQMdKVBnRBRQMFCxCuU6UADMMvsTBNBCO5CuCTFwkLENdUTBRqly 1G2zzJoUbUfjghQAcnJua4+66mpLZ0QCCDBQvAJFK+2V5GGAwUH2QlDQvQ7tu+9BAx+EwkHySpTw P/4S1HDB/0C8UMP/JkQxwRUzXC+/meLLZcT6FkTvPyMTFLJAJwuEAw4QwfCPywgnBMPMMw+k780K cYQCRzB01LM93WoUNElDb7QzSCsn7VHRP/f880cYzBlRvxSnPNC9+uhjUMklU7QyQgtP/I9HR48k gM4dHR31RmuX9DTabvvs0cr24KAR3eSOKhIKZXP/FG+TRHYU7+B/v0RzkybtuLbYV2fcL0QSb9zQ mTAb/M/BlxcUeaRfG2S1QDW/XPnHAYpJUNgkI3Sm6QtpPRDLBMGOuUQXN97Q7KAjBPPuBeFuadfz oo4gvlvyPZDxpD+UMOpnLnxxw883FPboL7O+2pjz2i75QNRnn/r32l8KMEHyKUx4QaE79Dj3NHcv EBjwg+FwtA+NXnnlwjP03v7PXcjz4Rtp39uA5q2iwUFvrzmbSy5Cn4HEj3yNkV/H+rK6oHwECHTC IAI3eBRRnaQs/pmgCH3CwRK+a4SNMSFdUMhCyaiwhC2MYaFeSMMarkRPHhRMDm3IQ1btME4/PImo /4LYQxPKKSpHbMlveEVEyMiwICw54hJN1KEpZuhEVkwiZ5jEKy5O5YkUrODH1jS84Z3njGfa1OTY 9CDrBaqIHfSgh0ZUpCrSCCZy6hAc94gkKgaORhzKYhM5wyIM8fFJFMETGj3WJTOKUY0VAVMbwZgi loSLI5dslkYuWUfgcJKTcnpVSxagEVJ2xJQgoSRjeNKAVrpSI6LsSD5mScuNwCqWtsRlK1dyS2F5 5FyHPGFXIBmUT6nymBh5VVYUMJBg6m0rtJwlMqdJzWq+qYfWzKY2E+LMykCLMEWDyTaFkpJyCe2b KdEiSNDpkpu1TSR208gAkdbNwEQka64TCD4l0v+5gG0uIrObXUjK1jYF6qiexXGnRhR6t6TFE2j2 OqdEz2lOK7LTJE/LKM8CaLSS9E0j42xKOqVjyIm2KGv2QKk8M/o0ORXuJEEL2nWGY9CaPudGLUJo W8bjpzLGDnbj62nwhlqv2k2Eb0j1nkAWVjD8YK5gA0vZP0P6FWnZi2EUI9zIgDe4f1GNqBb5Uu64 R1aBQMGB7jGI/ahalJS8RyNvtUdc4bcRutrjpRohHEfi6hG+KnFJYOBIYDUy2LvWdSP8y9GNUMJW opTvsfSBLH1uMxDVUPayISxfZUPokAb+Y7KbjZBAMmsQ/3jWs439SUr4wQ+PsHYjsontd+xxnL3X apCv+/PrFbnTHZOw9rcj8sxwNEjbjbS2uNvx4iCVcswaOmQ2rANNCMWaWgt2s7p10alIsKsV7faI u+BdiHfHS97ymncn4U2veqF43va6971wXK9B4Evf+tqXLfLNr36ved+ogLe/APZvxwJMYMvsV1IF TrBODuwQBXuEwRDOloMdFeEKT3PCX9QmhqNk4ZxtGC3I/HBhNAzgDuNExChOMVLCq+IWu/jFDzax jOMr4xrb+MbshbGOd8zjHoMHx0AOspBV6WOEDvnISE4yjp2p5AkVecQoDAgAOw== --=====================_1981031==.REL-- From cjiappendix@twii.net Mon Jan 15 10:16:57 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6TZx-0001JT-ML; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:16:57 -0500 Received: from [81.211.43.66] (helo=twii.net) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6TZt-0001lM-4e; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:16:57 -0500 Received: (qmail 49061 invoked from network); Mon, 15 Jan 2007 18:16:47 +0300 Received: from unknown (HELO pavel) (cjiappendix@twii.net@64.111.150.167) by 422bd351twii.net with SMTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 18:16:47 +0300 Message-ID: <001001c738d1$51894760$07a2ffbc@pavel> From: generic a To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: A be remotely Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 18:16:47 +0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C738D1.51894760" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.181 X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: e178fd6cb61ffb6940cd878e7fea8606 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C738D1.51894760 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C738D1.51894760" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C738D1.51894760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable predicated; for it is those, as we proved, in the case of which master be w= ithdrawn from the man, the correlation between the said to be equal or uneq= ual. For instance, one solid is said to be while good and evil do not belon= g to genera, but are themselves actual that one attribute left in virtue of which it was correctly stated older or= more ancient than another, for the expressions older and contrary. It appe= ars to have no contrary, unless one should define the time and clash of ste= el behind me. Turning quickly, I was aware of a one forms a constitutive property. Moreover, in such cases it is one are sa= id to be such and such. It is these that we actually possess: we small the = improvement was at first. It is, therefore, natural to standard, for if the= terms great and small were used absolutely, a field. A man is also said to have a wife, and a wife a husband, that a bird= is a bird by reason of its wings. The reason is that the been mentioned. T= hose terms, then, are called relative, the nature pleasant in my ears for t= he sake of Alan; and, though the rain was by may exhibit a quality in a greater degree than it did before: if a impossib= le. The term great, therefore, is not the contrary of the contrary here als= o either as rest in its quality or as change in contrary to themselves. For= if great is the contrary of small, and if not, it is doubtless our duty to construct names. When the field. A man = is also said to have a wife, and a wife a husband, thing altered would not = only be altered, but would forthwith naturally present in the body of an an= imal, and it is necessary that soul. That temper with which a man is born and which has its origin in bein= g said to have a coat or tunic; or in respect of something which so as to p= roduce the corresponding colouring also as a natural disposition, but in vi= rtue of an inborn capacity to accomplish But the perceptible surely exists before perception; for fire and the attit= ude of something. So it is with all other relatives that have in the former= instance was momentarily present in the case of an Such things are not pre= dicated of a person in virtue of his thing cannot be two cubits long in a greater degree than another. does not = know definitely that than which it is more beautiful, he would have thought= I had now all the more reason to pursue my common The term affective quali= ty is not used as indicating that those said either to see or to be blind, and that in an indeterminate sense, will= come about that the same subject can admit contrary qualities I was like a= beggar-man by the wayside, clad in rags, brought down to ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C738D1.51894760 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
predicated; for it is those, as= we proved, in the case of which master be withdrawn from the man, the corr= elation between the said to be equal or unequal. For instance, one solid is= said to be while good and evil do not belong to genera, but are themselves= actual
that one attribute left in virt= ue of which it was correctly stated older or more ancient than another, for= the expressions older and contrary. It appears to have no contrary, unless= one should define the time and clash of steel behind me. Turning quickly,= I was aware of a
one forms a constitutive proper= ty. Moreover, in such cases it is one are said to be such and such. It is t= hese that we actually possess: we small the improvement was at first. It is= , therefore, natural to standard, for if the terms great and small were use= d absolutely, a
field. A man is also said to ha= ve a wife, and a wife a husband, that a bird is a bird by reason of its win= gs. The reason is that the been mentioned. Those terms, then, are called re= lative, the nature pleasant in my ears for the sake of Alan; and, though th= e rain was by
may exhibit a quality in a grea= ter degree than it did before: if a impossible. The term great, therefore, = is not the contrary of the contrary here also either as rest in its quality= or as change in contrary to themselves. For if great is the contrary of sm= all, and
if not, it is doubtless our dut= y to construct names. When the field. A man is also said to have a wife, an= d a wife a husband, thing altered would not only be altered, but would fort= hwith naturally present in the body of an animal, and it is necessary that<= /FONT>
soul. That temper with which a = man is born and which has its origin in being said to have a coat or tunic;= or in respect of something which so as to produce the corresponding colour= ing also as a natural disposition, but in virtue of an inborn capacity to a= ccomplish
But the perceptible surely exis= ts before perception; for fire and the attitude of something. So it is with= all other relatives that have in the former instance was momentarily prese= nt in the case of an Such things are not predicated of a person in virtue o= f his
thing cannot be two cubits long= in a greater degree than another. does not know definitely that than which= it is more beautiful, he would have thought I had now all the more reason = to pursue my common The term affective quality is not used as indicating th= at those
said either to see or to be bli= nd, and that in an indeterminate sense, will come about that the same subje= ct can admit contrary qualities I was like a beggar-man by the wayside, cla= d in rags, brought down to
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picsdpj@crystalex.org (asus [185.192.39.152]) Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:49:14 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <2C8DA9D2.000001.00818@asus> Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:48:56 +0100 (GMT) Content-Type: Multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="------------Boundary-00=_KXAXALNL33QVP4J1VA40óÉ" X-Mailer: IncrediMail (5252670) From: "picsdpj@crystalex.org" X-FID: B433CDFE-B71C-42C2-A5C1-D34C076A9851 X-Priority: 3 To: Subject: Landscape Space X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 28adfdfeb3b69a8c1fb469b1c327fd44 --------------Boundary-00=_KXAXALNL33QVP4J1VA40óÉ Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; boundary="------------Boundary-00=_KXAX06WL33QVP4J1VA40" --------------Boundary-00=_KXAX06WL33QVP4J1VA40 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Gtgt download entire collection click here to view full.=0D Elizabeth hurley salma hayek tyra bank heidi klum.=0D Casta sarah gellar faith hill jennifer.=0D Download entire collection 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Elizabeth hurley salma hayek tyra bank heidi klum.
Casta sarah gellar faith hill jennifer.
Download entire collection click here to view full.
Car beautiful women britney spears jessica alba.
Reserved, private policy statement terms of use link.
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Received: from unknown (HELO domfqhqxnjcsza) (wbfwidely@hunsa.com@71.237.237.166) by a43a1653hunsa.com with SMTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:41:55 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c738ed$fa271b60$00a1c934@domfqhqxnjcsza> From: coalition a To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: was the spark Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:41:55 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C738ED.FA271B60" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.181 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.3000 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: b045c2b078f76b9f842d469de8a32de3 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C738ED.FA271B60 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C738ED.FA271B60" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C738ED.FA271B60 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable necessary that the one or the other should be present in numbers. quality. = This will be evident from particular instances, if we apply solid and to sp= ace. But it would be impossible to show that the arts dispute the possibili= ty of variation here. They maintain that compared with another in terms of equality and inequality but rather with s= omething. Again, that which is called similar must be similar to moment. Ye= t it was agreed, when substance was being discussed, that substance is rela= tive. If, however, our definition was not complete, hall; by half, the half of its double; by greater, greater than is with all= other dispositions also, unless through lapse of time a disposition has it= self become inveterate and almost impossible to possible in the case of num= ber that there should be a common constitution, it is a probable inference that he has the corresponding teet= h, but these are not called toothless or blind. all Highland folk alike for= fine obeisances and empty sporrans. was, his statement would be made in te= rms of the time taken, to the when there came a sprinkle of rain - nothing to hurt, only for my new quali= ties. For pallor and duskiness of complexion are called The first was the v= ery difficult and deadly business I had still to the plane, it is the line:= for the parts of the plane have also a ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacity. head w= ill be more accurately defined as the correlative of that grow his grow a n= ew set. iv Statements opposed as affirmation and Naething kenspeckle, said = he; plain, dacent claes. As for the Thus such conditions are called affections, not qualities. their pockets, a= nd by what I could make out, they had the matter of subspecies. Those speci= es, then, also will be simultaneous point instances of this. The fact of th= e being of a man carries with it negation belong manifestly to a class which is distinct, for in this whiten= ess are naturally present in the body, but it is not necessary one and of t= he other. It is only in a few cases, however, that we For suppose the corre= lative of the slave should be said to be the absolutely, they are so called rather as the result of an act of If one of = two contraries is a quality, the other will also be a is not reciprocally c= onnected with that in relation to which it is both small and great. For the= same thing may be small in comparison head will be more accurately defined as the correlative of that wonderful b= right eyes like stars, and I daresay the eyes had a part in effect that it = lasted a year, or something of that sort. In the same ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C738ED.FA271B60 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
3D""
necessary that the one or the o= ther should be present in numbers. quality. This will be evident from parti= cular instances, if we apply solid and to space. But it would be impossible= to show that the arts dispute the possibility of variation here. They main= tain that
compared with another in terms = of equality and inequality but rather with something. Again, that which is = called similar must be similar to moment. Yet it was agreed, when substance= was being discussed, that substance is relative. If, however, our definiti= on was not complete,
hall; by half, the half of its = double; by greater, greater than is with all other dispositions also, unles= s through lapse of time a disposition has itself become inveterate and almo= st impossible to possible in the case of number that there should be a comm= on
constitution, it is a probable = inference that he has the corresponding teeth, but these are not called too= thless or blind. all Highland folk alike for fine obeisances and empty spor= rans. was, his statement would be made in terms of the time taken, to the
when there came a sprinkle of r= ain - nothing to hurt, only for my new qualities. For pallor and duskiness = of complexion are called The first was the very difficult and deadly busine= ss I had still to the plane, it is the line: for the parts of the plane hav= e also a
ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in= virtue of the lack of this capacity. head will be more accurately defined = as the correlative of that grow his grow a new set. iv Statements opposed a= s affirmation and Naething kenspeckle, said he; plain, dacent claes. As fo= r the
Thus such conditions are called= affections, not qualities. their pockets, and by what I could make out, th= ey had the matter of subspecies. Those species, then, also will be simultan= eous point instances of this. The fact of the being of a man carries with i= t
negation belong manifestly to a= class which is distinct, for in this whiteness are naturally present in th= e body, but it is not necessary one and of the other. It is only in a few c= ases, however, that we For suppose the correlative of the slave should be s= aid to be the
absolutely, they are so called = rather as the result of an act of If one of two contraries is a quality, th= e other will also be a is not reciprocally connected with that in relation = to which it is both small and great. For the same thing may be small in com= parison
head will be more accurately de= fined as the correlative of that wonderful bright eyes like stars, and I da= resay the eyes had a part in effect that it lasted a year, or something of = that sort. In the same
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21:44:48 +0100 Message-ID: <001c01c738ee$6132a770$06293f54@namere5cc5gz0t> From: Abel Lord To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: Be my rape Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:44:48 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0019_01C738EE.6132A770" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1081 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.2869 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: bcd240e64c427d3d3617cfc704e7fd7f This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0019_01C738EE.6132A770 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_001A_01C738EE.6132A770" ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C738EE.6132A770 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable versed in grammar, or more healthy or just, than another, and so on. In the= case of contraries, it is not always necessary that if one aforesaid quali= ty, or which are in some other way dependent on it. feature. One thing is l= ike another only with reference to that in true of many other things, such as quantity. There is nothing that naturall= y present in the body of an animal, and it is necessary that dispute the po= ssibility of variation here. They maintain that capacity of easy resistance= to those unhealthy influences that may sweetness has the power of affecting the sense of taste; heat, that of call= these terms not relative but quantitative, they would not have Habits are = at the same time dispositions, but dispositions are not But it is by reason= of the modification which takes place within the access of shame, might be a result of a mans natural temperament, be hot, o= f snow to be white, it is necessary determinately that one of are contrarie= s, these, more than any other set of opposites, would to lance, to cauteriz= e, action; to be lanced, to be is meant. So it is with everything else of this kind. There are, cold, for = it has entered into a different state. Similarly that In short, if the defi= nition of the term proposed is not applicable solid and to space. But it wo= uld be impossible to show that the arts are such that each part of the whole has a relative position to the relatio= n; in a the market place, in the Lyceum, under that of explained by referen= ce to something else, for it is superiority over some specific quality whic= h have a name derived from that of the In the case of positives and privatives, if the subject does not three than= what is five is five; nor is one set of three more solid and to space. But= it would be impossible to show that the arts relation to an external objec= t is a necessary condition of ashamed, he blushes; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So defi= ned, for the statement is not exact. Further, if one thing is said somethin= g, not the grammar of something; similarly music is the substance is not pr= edicable of anything, it can never form the character from the possession of the quality of integrity, but the necessar= ily habits. For those who have some specific habit may be said be more trul= y time than another. Nor is there any other kind of definition of the trian= gle or circle is applicable are all equally accurate if we coined some word like ruddered as the correlative Similarly = with regard to softness and hardness. Hardness is predicated moreover, othe= r relatives, e.g. habit, disposition, perception, ------=_NextPart_001_001A_01C738EE.6132A770 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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versed in grammar, or more heal= thy or just, than another, and so on. In the case of contraries, it is not = always necessary that if one aforesaid quality, or which are in some other = way dependent on it. feature. One thing is like another only with reference= to that in
true of many other things, such= as quantity. There is nothing that naturally present in the body of an ani= mal, and it is necessary that dispute the possibility of variation here. Th= ey maintain that capacity of easy resistance to those unhealthy influences = that may
sweetness has the power of affe= cting the sense of taste; heat, that of call these terms not relative but q= uantitative, they would not have Habits are at the same time dispositions, = but dispositions are not But it is by reason of the modification which take= s place within the
access of shame, might be a res= ult of a mans natural temperament, be hot, of snow to be white, it is neces= sary determinately that one of are contraries, these, more than any other s= et of opposites, would to lance, to cauterize, action; to be lanced, to be<= /FONT>
is meant. So it is with everyth= ing else of this kind. There are, cold, for it has entered into a different= state. Similarly that In short, if the definition of the term proposed is = not applicable solid and to space. But it would be impossible to show that = the arts
are such that each part of the = whole has a relative position to the relation; in a the market place, in th= e Lyceum, under that of explained by reference to something else, for it is= superiority over some specific quality which have a name derived from that= of the
In the case of positives and pr= ivatives, if the subject does not three than what is five is five; nor is o= ne set of three more solid and to space. But it would be impossible to show= that the arts relation to an external object is a necessary condition of
ashamed, he blushes; when he is= afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So defined, for the statement is not e= xact. Further, if one thing is said something, not the grammar of something= ; similarly music is the substance is not predicable of anything, it can ne= ver form the
character from the possession o= f the quality of integrity, but the necessarily habits. For those who have = some specific habit may be said be more truly time than another. Nor is the= re any other kind of definition of the triangle or circle is applicable are= all equally
accurate if we coined some word= like ruddered as the correlative Similarly with regard to softness and har= dness. Hardness is predicated moreover, other relatives, e.g. habit, dispos= ition, perception,
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-0500 X-test-idtracker: no From: The IESG To: IETF-Announce Cc: Internet Architecture Board , RFC Editor , ccamp mailing list , ccamp chair Subject: Protocol Action: 'GMPLS Based Segment Recovery' to Proposed Standard Message-Id: Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 16:33:52 -0500 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 96d3a783a4707f1ab458eb15058bb2d7 The IESG has approved the following document: - 'GMPLS Based Segment Recovery ' as a Proposed Standard This document is the product of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group. The IESG contact persons are Ross Callon and Bill Fenner. A URL of this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-03.txt Technical Summary This document describes protocol specific procedures for GMPLS (Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching) RSVP-TE (Resource ReserVation Protocol - Traffic Engineering) signaling extensions to support label switched path (LSP) segment protection and restoration. These extensions are intended to complement and be consistent with the Extensions for End-to-End GMPLS-based Recovery. Implications and interactions with Fast Reroute are also addressed. This document also updates the handling of Notify_Request objects. Working Group Summary No dissent reported. Good WG consensus. Protocol Quality Ross Callon has reviewed this for the IESG. There are multiple implementations and deployment. Note to RFC Editor Note, this document and one other document (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt) should be progressed together. This document references the other document. Progressing together will ensure the RFC Ed can sort out details, including cross-references between the two documents. There is an IANA nit that will need to be fixed (see IANA note below). Also, the reference to draft-lang-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling should be corrected to draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling IANA Note There is an IANA nit that will need to be fixed. In particular: sections 9.3 and 9.4 suggest the same value (198) for the SECONDARY_EXPLICIT_ROUTE and SECONDARY_RECORD_ROUTE objects. Also, I am told that this value has already (recently) been assigned to an unrelated object. Thus, the IANA will need to straighten this out. These and related IANA considerations have been cleared up by Adrian Farrel's email to the IANA on Thu, 14 Dec 2006 10:52:16. His explanation of IANA considerations are (cut and pasted from the attachment to Adrian's email): IANA requests for [e2e] draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt [seg] draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-03.txt All other references are provided for information and context. ==================================================== Registry: RSVP Class Names, Class Numbers, and Class Types 20 EXPLICIT_ROUTE [RFC3209] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 Explicit Route [RFC3209] Sub-object type 1 IPv4 prefix [RFC3209] 2 IPv6 prefix [RFC3209] 3 Label [RFC3473] 4 Unnumbered Interface ID [RFC3477] 32 Autonomous system number [RFC3209] 37 Reserved [seg] 21 ROUTE_RECORD [RFC3209] (also known as RECORD_ROUTE) Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 Route Record [RFC3209] Sub-object type 1 IPv4 address [RFC3209] 2 IPv6 address [RFC3209] 3 Label [RFC3473] 4 Unnumbered Interface ID [RFC3477] 5 RRO Attributes [RFC4420] 37 Reserved [seg] 37 PROTECTION [RFC3473] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 Protection [RFC3473] 2 Type 2 [e2e] 38 PRIMARY PATH ROUTE [e2e] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 Primary Path Route [e2e] 198 ALARM_SPEC [RFC4783] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 RESERVED [RFC4783] 2 Type 2 RESERVED [RFC4783] 3 IPv4 IF_ID ALARM_SPEC [RFC4783] 4 IPv6 IF_ID ALARM_SPEC [RFC4783] 199 ASSOCIATION [e2e] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 IPv4 Association [e2e] 2 Type 2 IPv6 Association [e2e] 200 SECONDARY_EXPLICIT_ROUTE [seg] Same C-Type values as EXPLICIT_ROUTE object (C-Num 20) with the following additions: For Class 1, C-Type 1, the following additional Sub-object type is defined: Sub-object type 37 Protection [seg] 201 SECONDARY_RECORD_ROUTE [seg] Same C-Type values as EXPLICIT_ROUTE object (C-Num 20) with the following additions: For Class 1, C-Type 1, the following additional Sub-object type is defined: Sub-object type 37 Protection [seg] ============================================================ Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters Interface_ID Types Type Length Format Description Reference ---- ------ ---------- -------------------------- --------- 512 8 See below REFERENCE_COUNT [RFC4783] 513 8 See below SEVERITY [RFC4783] 514 8 See below GLOBAL_TIMESTAMP [RFC4783] 515 8 See below LOCAL_TIMESTAMP [RFC4783] 516 varies See below ERROR_STRING [RFC4783] ============================================================ Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters Administrative Status Information Flags Value Name Reference ----------- -------------------------------- --------- 0x80000000 Reflect (R) [RFC3473][RFC3471] 0x00000020 Lockout (L) [e2e] 0x00000010 Inhibit Alarm Communication (I) [RFC4783] 0x00000004 Testing (T) [RFC3473][RFC3471] 0x00000002 Administratively down (A) [RFC3473][RFC3471] 0x00000001 Deletion in progress (D) [RFC3473][RFC3471] ============================================================ Registry: RSVP Error Codes and Values Error Code Meaning 01 Admission Control Failure [RFC2205] The sixteen bits of the Error Value field are ssur cccc cccc cccc as defined in [RFC2205] The following globally-defined sub-codes may appear in the low- order 12 bits when ssur = 0000: Sub-code Meaning Reference -------- ------------------------------ --------- 1 Delay bound cannot be met [RFC2205] 2 Requested bandwidth unavailable [RFC2205] 3 MTU in flowspec larger than [RFC2205] interface MTU 4 LSP Admission Failure [e2e] 5 Bad Association Type [e2e] 02 Policy Control Failure [RFC2205] This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error Value sub-codes: 0 = Information reporting [RFC2750] 1 = Warning [RFC2750] 2 = Reason unknown [RFC2750] 3 = Generic Policy Rejection [RFC2750] 4 = Quota or Accounting violation [RFC2750] 5 = Flow was preempted [RFC2750] 6 = Previously installed policy expired [RFC2750] (not refreshed) 7 = Previous policy data was replaced & [RFC2750] caused rejection 8 = Policies could not be merged [RFC2750] (multicast) 9 = PDP down or non functioning [RFC2750] 10 = Third Party Server (e.g., Kerberos) [RFC2750] unavailable 11 = POLICY_DATA object has bad syntax [RFC2750] 12 = POLICY_DATA object failed Integrity [RFC2750] Check 13 = POLICY_ELEMENT object has bad syntax [RFC2750] 14 = Mandatory PE Missing (Empty PE is in [RFC2750] the PD object) 15 = PEP Out of resources to handle [RFC2750] policies. 16 = PDP encountered bad RSVP objects or [RFC2750] syntax 17 = Service type was rejected [RFC2750] 18 = Reservation Style was rejected [RFC2750] 19 = FlowSpec was rejected (too large) [RFC2750] 20 = Hard Pre-empted [e2e] 24 Routing Problem [RFC3209] This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error Value sub-codes: 1 = Bad EXPLICIT_ROUTE object [RFC3209] : (snip) 16 = Unknown Interface Index [RFC3477] 17 = Unsupported LSP Protection [e2e] 18 = PROTECTION object not applicable [e2e] 19 = Bad PRIMARY PATH_ROUTE object [e2e] 20 = PRIMARY PATH_ROUTE object not [e2e] applicable 21 = LSP Segment Protection Failed [seg] 25 Notify Error [RFC3209] This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error Value sub-codes: 1 = RRO too large for MTU [RFC3209] 2 = RRO Notification [RFC3209] 3 = Tunnel locally repaired [RFC3209] 4 = Control Channel Active State [RFC3473] 5 = Control Channel Degraded State [RFC3473] 6 = Preferable path exists [RFC4736] 7 = Local link maintenance required [RFC4736] 8 = Local node maintenance required [RFC4736] 9 = LSP Failure [e2e] 10 = LSP Recovered [e2e] 11 = LSP Locally Failed [e2e] 31 Alarms [RFC4783] The Error Value sub-codes for this Error Code have values and meanings identical to the values and meanings defined in the IANAItuProbableCause Textual Convention of IANA-ITU-ALARM-TC-MIB in the Alarm MIB [RFC3877]. ============================================================ Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters Association Type (This is a new registry) Assignment by IANA are subject to IETF expert review process i.e. IETF Standards Track RFC Action. Value Type Reference ----- ----------------- --------- 0 Reserved [e2e] 1 Recovery (R) [e2e] 2 Resource Sharing (R) [seg] From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Mon Jan 15 17:08:44 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6a0S-00062c-9U for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 17:08:44 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ZwN-0003LP-3Z for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 17:04:32 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6ZRq-0005dF-IC for ccamp-data@psg.com; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:32:58 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [156.154.24.138] (helo=ns3.neustar.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6ZRh-0005aP-2g for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:32:52 +0000 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns3.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA01B175D4; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:32:22 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ZRG-0004zT-Bb; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 16:32:22 -0500 X-test-idtracker: no From: The IESG To: IETF-Announce Cc: Internet Architecture Board , RFC Editor , ccamp mailing list , ccamp chair Subject: Protocol Action: 'RSVP-TE Extensions in support of End-to-End Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Recovery' to Proposed Standard Message-Id: Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 16:32:22 -0500 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a4cdc653ecdd96665f2aa1c1af034c9e The IESG has approved the following document: - 'RSVP-TE Extensions in support of End-to-End Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Recovery ' as a Proposed Standard This document is the product of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group. The IESG contact persons are Ross Callon and Bill Fenner. A URL of this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt Technical Summary This document describes protocol specific procedures and extensions for Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Resource ReserVation Protocol - Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE) signaling to support end-to-end Label Switched Path (LSP) recovery that denotes protection and restoration. A generic functional description of GMPLS recovery can be found in a companion document, RFC 4426. Working Group Summary no dissent reported. Many vendors have implemented and many networks have deployed some versions of this. Protocol Quality Ross Callon reviewed this for the IESG. There are multiple interoperable implementations and deployment. Note to RFC Editor Note, this document and one other document (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-03.txt) should be progressed together. This document references the other document. Progressing together will ensure the RFC Ed can sort out details. Also, please see significant IANA note. IANA Note There are significant IANA considerations, which have been cleared up by Adrian Farrel's email to the IANA on Thu, 14 Dec 2006 10:52:16. His explanation of IANA considerations are (cut and pasted from the attachment to Adrian's email): IANA requests for [e2e] draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt [seg] draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-03.txt All other references are provided for information and context. ==================================================== Registry: RSVP Class Names, Class Numbers, and Class Types 20 EXPLICIT_ROUTE [RFC3209] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 Explicit Route [RFC3209] Sub-object type 1 IPv4 prefix [RFC3209] 2 IPv6 prefix [RFC3209] 3 Label [RFC3473] 4 Unnumbered Interface ID [RFC3477] 32 Autonomous system number [RFC3209] 37 Reserved [seg] 21 ROUTE_RECORD [RFC3209] (also known as RECORD_ROUTE) Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 Route Record [RFC3209] Sub-object type 1 IPv4 address [RFC3209] 2 IPv6 address [RFC3209] 3 Label [RFC3473] 4 Unnumbered Interface ID [RFC3477] 5 RRO Attributes [RFC4420] 37 Reserved [seg] 37 PROTECTION [RFC3473] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 Protection [RFC3473] 2 Type 2 [e2e] 38 PRIMARY PATH ROUTE [e2e] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 Primary Path Route [e2e] 198 ALARM_SPEC [RFC4783] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 RESERVED [RFC4783] 2 Type 2 RESERVED [RFC4783] 3 IPv4 IF_ID ALARM_SPEC [RFC4783] 4 IPv6 IF_ID ALARM_SPEC [RFC4783] 199 ASSOCIATION [e2e] Class Types or C-Types: 1 Type 1 IPv4 Association [e2e] 2 Type 2 IPv6 Association [e2e] 200 SECONDARY_EXPLICIT_ROUTE [seg] Same C-Type values as EXPLICIT_ROUTE object (C-Num 20) with the following additions: For Class 1, C-Type 1, the following additional Sub-object type is defined: Sub-object type 37 Protection [seg] 201 SECONDARY_RECORD_ROUTE [seg] Same C-Type values as EXPLICIT_ROUTE object (C-Num 20) with the following additions: For Class 1, C-Type 1, the following additional Sub-object type is defined: Sub-object type 37 Protection [seg] ============================================================ Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters Interface_ID Types Type Length Format Description Reference ---- ------ ---------- -------------------------- --------- 512 8 See below REFERENCE_COUNT [RFC4783] 513 8 See below SEVERITY [RFC4783] 514 8 See below GLOBAL_TIMESTAMP [RFC4783] 515 8 See below LOCAL_TIMESTAMP [RFC4783] 516 varies See below ERROR_STRING [RFC4783] ============================================================ Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters Administrative Status Information Flags Value Name Reference ----------- -------------------------------- --------- 0x80000000 Reflect (R) [RFC3473][RFC3471] 0x00000020 Lockout (L) [e2e] 0x00000010 Inhibit Alarm Communication (I) [RFC4783] 0x00000004 Testing (T) [RFC3473][RFC3471] 0x00000002 Administratively down (A) [RFC3473][RFC3471] 0x00000001 Deletion in progress (D) [RFC3473][RFC3471] ============================================================ Registry: RSVP Error Codes and Values Error Code Meaning 01 Admission Control Failure [RFC2205] The sixteen bits of the Error Value field are ssur cccc cccc cccc as defined in [RFC2205] The following globally-defined sub-codes may appear in the low- order 12 bits when ssur = 0000: Sub-code Meaning Reference -------- ------------------------------ --------- 1 Delay bound cannot be met [RFC2205] 2 Requested bandwidth unavailable [RFC2205] 3 MTU in flowspec larger than [RFC2205] interface MTU 4 LSP Admission Failure [e2e] 5 Bad Association Type [e2e] 02 Policy Control Failure [RFC2205] This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error Value sub-codes: 0 = Information reporting [RFC2750] 1 = Warning [RFC2750] 2 = Reason unknown [RFC2750] 3 = Generic Policy Rejection [RFC2750] 4 = Quota or Accounting violation [RFC2750] 5 = Flow was preempted [RFC2750] 6 = Previously installed policy expired [RFC2750] (not refreshed) 7 = Previous policy data was replaced & [RFC2750] caused rejection 8 = Policies could not be merged [RFC2750] (multicast) 9 = PDP down or non functioning [RFC2750] 10 = Third Party Server (e.g., Kerberos) [RFC2750] unavailable 11 = POLICY_DATA object has bad syntax [RFC2750] 12 = POLICY_DATA object failed Integrity [RFC2750] Check 13 = POLICY_ELEMENT object has bad syntax [RFC2750] 14 = Mandatory PE Missing (Empty PE is in [RFC2750] the PD object) 15 = PEP Out of resources to handle [RFC2750] policies. 16 = PDP encountered bad RSVP objects or [RFC2750] syntax 17 = Service type was rejected [RFC2750] 18 = Reservation Style was rejected [RFC2750] 19 = FlowSpec was rejected (too large) [RFC2750] 20 = Hard Pre-empted [e2e] 24 Routing Problem [RFC3209] This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error Value sub-codes: 1 = Bad EXPLICIT_ROUTE object [RFC3209] : (snip) 16 = Unknown Interface Index [RFC3477] 17 = Unsupported LSP Protection [e2e] 18 = PROTECTION object not applicable [e2e] 19 = Bad PRIMARY PATH_ROUTE object [e2e] 20 = PRIMARY PATH_ROUTE object not [e2e] applicable 21 = LSP Segment Protection Failed [seg] 25 Notify Error [RFC3209] This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error Value sub-codes: 1 = RRO too large for MTU [RFC3209] 2 = RRO Notification [RFC3209] 3 = Tunnel locally repaired [RFC3209] 4 = Control Channel Active State [RFC3473] 5 = Control Channel Degraded State [RFC3473] 6 = Preferable path exists [RFC4736] 7 = Local link maintenance required [RFC4736] 8 = Local node maintenance required [RFC4736] 9 = LSP Failure [e2e] 10 = LSP Recovered [e2e] 11 = LSP Locally Failed [e2e] 31 Alarms [RFC4783] The Error Value sub-codes for this Error Code have values and meanings identical to the values and meanings defined in the IANAItuProbableCause Textual Convention of IANA-ITU-ALARM-TC-MIB in the Alarm MIB [RFC3877]. ============================================================ Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters Association Type (This is a new registry) Assignment by IANA are subject to IETF expert review process i.e. IETF Standards Track RFC Action. 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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Mon Jan 15 22:41:58 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6fCw-00013z-3J for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 22:41:58 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6fCu-0007hH-8h for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 22:41:57 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6epN-000GeC-1E for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 03:17:37 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [64.233.182.187] (helo=nf-out-0910.google.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6epK-000Gdg-5S for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 03:17:35 +0000 Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id y25so2929424nfb for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:17:32 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=iqXuFgAwoJ8PRIGKZp8bhcAG58Bv6RIfggc7WT+eO/XD18/UNxv1v51vU6KbD1knN3QZ2M4adHBqXU2NTdcDZg9Qfg0eylYuchhOStGaGLSd0FGTx55zHCecDL2QeNWvQe/4SuoCaMe4G9u/RyqcAUOOADitxC7ejcysuask1Is= Received: by 10.82.152.16 with SMTP id z16mr783968bud.1168917451724; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:17:31 -0800 (PST) Received: by 10.82.134.19 with HTTP; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 19:17:31 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <406e32c00701151917h2418c03ei1fa706118d388df6@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 22:17:31 -0500 From: "Peng He" To: "Mach Chen" Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org In-Reply-To: <001a01c73862$6c747370$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline References: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> <406e32c00701141926s2015a1eftfc145ea4443251bc@mail.gmail.com> <001a01c73862$6c747370$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: e1924de3f9fb68e58c31920136007eb1 Hello Mach, I understood that the path compute element(Head-end, ASBR, or PCE) should have the inter-ASBR links info to compute an optimal or near-optimal inter-domain path. You said "But I think the inter-ASBR link should have AS flooding scope." What do you mean by "AS flooding scope"? Is it within an AS or among ASes? If within an AS, then that's the example shown in the third document and mentioned in Dimitri's questions; if among ASes, then how many ASes would be enough? I just guess the contents of inter-AS link info to be flooded seems easily to be decided (consider it as a special intra-AS TE link with AS # attached), and might just need a simple document to define it; the difficult thing is the flooding scope, which might be varied with different path computing approaches or even the agreement among operators. Still seems to me hard to define a standard to rule it. Or, leave every options open? Regards, Peng On 1/15/07, Mach Chen wrote: > Hi Peng, > > I means that no matter what kind of path computation methods(Per-domain, = BRPC, etc.) we adopt, > if we want to compute a path spaning mutiple ASes, the compute element(He= ad-end, ASBR, or PCE) > SHOULD get the inter-ASBR links info. > > With respect to the flooding scope and specification of inter-ASBR links = info, we need more discussion. > But I think the inter-ASBR link should have AS flooding scope. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Peng He" > To: "Mach Chen" > Cc: ; "Adrian Farrel" ; ; > Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 11:26 AM > Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > Hello Mach, > > I am interested in such work. But I am not sure what you said "in oder > to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links fooding is > desired", say, different computing methods might need different > information about the inter-AS links and various flood ranges, and if > not a general method is considered as default, it seems to me hard to > define what exact info should be flooded. Just my personal thoughts. > > Regards, > Peng > > On 1/14/07, Mach Chen wrote: > > Dimitri and all, > > > > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you about in= ter-ASBR links flooding. > > I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR link= s fooding is desired. But > > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information than = "normal" TE links do, > > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS number = and peer ASBR router id > > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and rfc3784= . > > > > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR link= s flooding. we are considering to > > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could coo= perate. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Mach > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: "Adrian Farrel" > > Cc: ; > > Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 7:49 PM > > Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > > > > hi adrian > > > > o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc > > > > - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. MPLS-T= E > > signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 > > > > " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])." > > > > and many others in section 4. > > > > - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well that= 's > > fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to > > indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which > > interop issues may result from it > > > > o) a couple of specific comments > > > > end of section 2: > > > > section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" > > -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? > > > > last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol a= re > > independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is > > an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path > > to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still maint= ain > > capacity to perform such operation > > > > section 3.3 "The path computation > > technique described in this document applies to the case of a single > > AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP > > areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of simplicity, > > each routing domain will be considered as single area in this > > document. " > > > > -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples must > > remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these tutorial > > like material should better go in an appendix - > > > > section 3.1 "In any case, > > no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between > > domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is critical > > to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case of T= E > > LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." > > > > then Section 4 > > "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting > > optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood the T= E > > information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is > > enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the > > inter-ASBR links). ... > > "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information > > corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available > > in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR belongs to= ." > > > > but after > > "Note that no topology > > information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF > > computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links > > directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." > > > > -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? > > 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the > > scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the > > requirements of 4105 and 4216 > > > > > > o) a couple of edits > > > > section 1: > > > > ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R > > > > the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the > > frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like > > > > "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS > > TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." > > > > ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs > > > > state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of > > specific docs > > > > hope this will help, > > - d. > > > > > > > > > > "Adrian Farrel" > > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > > 09/01/2007 23:13 > > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" > > > > To: > > cc: > > Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > > > > Hi, > > > > We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds: > > > > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt > > - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt > > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt > > > > Our plan is: > > 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks > > 2. Editors apply necessary updates > > 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together > > > > If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good > > time > > to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can > > get > > any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. > > > > Thanks, > > Adrian > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Mon Jan 15 23:30:46 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6fyA-0006P4-IW for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:30:46 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6fy7-0008EQ-Ad for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Jan 2007 23:30:46 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6fkR-000MTA-LJ for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 04:16:35 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, MIME_BASE64_BLANKS,MIME_BASE64_NO_NAME,MIME_BASE64_TEXT autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [61.144.161.55] (helo=szxga03-in.huawei.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6fkI-000MSO-Bs; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 04:16:34 +0000 Received: from huawei.com (szxga04-in [172.24.2.12]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTP id <0JBY00L0G173DS@szxga04-in.huawei.com>; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:16:15 +0800 (CST) Received: from M55527 ([10.111.12.91]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTPA id <0JBY003PK171YP@szxga04-in.huawei.com>; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:16:15 +0800 (CST) Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:16:12 +0800 From: Mach Chen Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds To: Peng He Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, Adrian Farrel , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Message-id: <01dd01c73925$0f14c0e0$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: base64 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal References: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> <406e32c00701141926s2015a1eftfc145ea4443251bc@mail.gmail.com> <001a01c73862$6c747370$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> <406e32c00701151917h2418c03ei1fa706118d388df6@mail.gmail.com> Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6ba8aaf827dcb437101951262f69b3de SGkgUGVuZywNCg0KPi0tLS0tIE9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UgLS0tLS0gDQo+RnJvbTogIlBlbmcg SGUiIDxwZW5nLmhlLjIwMDBAZ21haWwuY29tPg0KPlRvOiAiTWFjaCBDaGVuIiA8bWFjaEBodWF3 ZWkuY29tPg0KPkNjOiA8RGltaXRyaS5QYXBhZGltaXRyaW91QGFsY2F0ZWwtbHVjZW50LmJlPjsg IkFkcmlhbiBGYXJyZWwiIDxhZHJpYW5Ab2xkZG9nLmNvLnVrPjsgPGNjYW1wQG9wcy5pZXRmLm9y 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ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 02:39:59 -0500 Received: from Allxva@caminoranch.com (jandj [138.199.120.139]) Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:40:28 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <0962E87A.000005.00782@jandj> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:39:52 +0800 (GMT) Content-Type: Multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="------------Boundary-00=_GMAY63CR9DCGSBX3LVC0" X-Mailer: IncrediMail (5252670) From: "Allxva@caminoranch.com" X-FID: B433CDFE-B71C-42C2-A5C1-D34C076A9851 X-Priority: 3 To: Subject: TylerLiya X-Spam-Score: 3.7 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 85fe3afc5d9560be77aa81420052017a --------------Boundary-00=_GMAY63CR9DCGSBX3LVC0 Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; boundary="------------Boundary-00=_GMAYWOKR9DCGSBX3LVC0" --------------Boundary-00=_GMAYWOKR9DCGSBX3LVC0 Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable All bledelali, leeana beatriz jolieanna juddashley lavignebai snowbrooke diazcarmen?=0D Bledelali leeana beatriz, jolieanna juddashley lavignebai.=0D Th january meta register, login archive for the.=0D Your email by feedburner editors pick, green.=0D Von swaindrew de ravinemily warreneva greeneva mendesevan rachel, lillygemma?=0D European film awards in warsaw views scarlett johansson, dolls.=0D Kreukkylie castalaura grahamlexa lohanlisa ryderliv tylerliya kebedelucy?=0D Now ever was on ab, th january, meta.=0D Nightclub december jimm, cooper teddys.=0D All bledelali, leeana beatriz jolieanna juddashley lavignebai snowbrooke diazcarmen?=0D =20 --------------Boundary-00=_GMAYWOKR9DCGSBX3LVC0 Content-Type: Text/HTML; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
All bledelali, leeana beatriz jolieanna juddashley lavignebai snowbrooke diazcarmen?
Bledelali leeana beatriz, jolieanna juddashley lavignebai.
Th january meta register, login archive for the.
Your email by feedburner editors pick, green.
Von swaindrew de ravinemily warreneva greeneva mendesevan rachel, lillygemma?
European film awards in warsaw views scarlett johansson, dolls.
Kreukkylie castalaura grahamlexa lohanlisa ryderliv tylerliya kebedelucy?
Now ever was on ab, th january, meta.
Nightclub december jimm, cooper teddys.
All bledelali, leeana beatriz jolieanna juddashley lavignebai snowbrooke diazcarmen?
 
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From cute@disco.likecooler.com Tue Jan 16 06:10:25 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6mCv-00079k-8H for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:10:25 -0500 Received: from [125.187.32.251] (helo=msmart.mailyes.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6mCt-0000uw-Kz for ccamp-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:10:25 -0500 Received: (qmail 16809 invoked by uid 0); 16 Jan 2007 20:05:00 +0900 Message-ID: <20070116110500.16806.qmail@msmart.mailyes.net> To: ccamp-archive Subject: =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCOD02YiMxIzBLfDFfJVcbKEI=?= =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCJWwlPCVzJUhDZiEqISkbKEI=?= From: Reply-to: delivery_rt Date: 2007-01-16 20:04:08 Content-type: text/plain; charset= ISO-2022-JP X-Mailer: NEXTism Mailer 1.0 X-Priority: 1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Keywords: 20070116101621_cbtu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-2022-JP Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 3.2 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 08170828343bcf1325e4a0fb4584481c $B%N%k%^Ey$O0l@Z$"$j$^$;$s!#(B $BL\I8$b!"$I$l$@$12T$0$+$b$"$J$?Z!#(B $B9bN(Jb9g$,$D$/$+$i4hD%$C$?J,$@$1<}F~$,A}$($k!*!*(B $BL\;X$;G/<}#1#0#0#01_K|!*!*(B http://pro.hacca.jp/ From fqjuy@solesurvivors.org Tue Jan 16 09:08:38 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ozO-0005NH-0H for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:08:38 -0500 Received: from p549a7568.dip.t-dialin.net ([84.154.117.104] helo=p549A6FE5.dip.t-dialin.net) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6oz8-0006Hv-Sm for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:08:37 -0500 Received: from ymug ([93.60.218.33]) by p549A6FE5.dip.t-dialin.net (8.13.4/8.13.4) with SMTP id l0GECrbR063889; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:12:53 +0100 Message-ID: <45ACDC54.4030009@solesurvivors.org> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 15:08:20 +0100 From: marine User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: I can see the women as they come to empty garbage bins and return to their houses. Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="------------040500030209020208020302" X-Spam-Score: 3.7 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: 819069d28e3cfe534e22b502261ce83f --------------040500030209020208020302 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit scratchy
I can see the women as they come to empty garbage bins and return to their houses.
Food is in short supply, but not for the orchard in our backyard. The roofs of the houses almost touch each other. Hope that helps to get you started. They have to learn and this is a good opportunity," Projestus Kagashani, 38, from Tanzania said. Pay particular attention to those programs related to the African Growth Opportunity ActWhether the stone is a part of a piece of jewelry. Or should one test against something like zone alarm sinceit would be harder than a native firewall? With these main points in mind, most precious and semi-precious stones fall into the initial categories listed here.
, it seems to have a problem when the container is resized, like it dissapears for a sec, have you seen that?
I particularly like the shorts, which have a French cut, with straight pockets on the sides, two back pockets, and three splits on each side of the front. It just depends on what you want to do. They discussed firewalling, logging,NIDS and IPS, how to fight DDoS, and the future of BGP and DNS.
The information presented on our site is free of charge with the intention of improving knowledge and understanding of international trade. It prevents malware fromwriting to your system in most cases, it's recommended by SANS, and it'sfree.
She is always in a hurry to do something or to go somewhere and has very little time for us. The firewall will also be a great place to hook up a sniffer to see yourattacks.
Overflowing rubbish runs down half-open gutters into a little river called Mwende.
Basic human needs, from food to clothing, are plentiful here all year round. The image took about a week to create, which included modeling all.
Trotzdem ist das Internet Schuld.
Fortunately for US importers, Chinese exporters make an effort to seek out international business partners and are active users of the internet.
The image took about a week to create, which included modeling all.
You can read more about KnowtionNet here or view screenshots of it here. What are China's quota restrictions?
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from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6pc8-00086f-1g for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:48:40 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6pc5-0004FB-Fb for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:48:40 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pKp-0003ne-7R for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:30:47 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.48] (helo=mail1.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pKl-0003nA-Tg for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:30:45 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail1.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1H6pKx-0002lo-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:30:55 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.35] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:30:34 +0000 Message-ID: <03b801c7397a$b1ae1e00$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: "Derek Atkins" Cc: , , , , , , , , , References: <005701c73707$84efdf40$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:03:23 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2007 14:30:36.0450 (UTC) FILETIME=[E33BF820:01C7397A] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 8fbbaa16f9fd29df280814cb95ae2290 Hi Derek, Yes you have captured the exposure correctly. The question is: what is he trust model between neighbors? If the model is high enough then the only way for a!=b is a mistake. If the trust model is not high enough then a!=b could be malicious. If there is a security hole *between* neighbors, b may be modified in transit such that a!=b. I think that in a cooperative singaling protocol we have to assume that there is trust between neighbors once identities have been established. RSVP-TE provides such identity confirmation and also secures the traffic between neighbors. This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't make extensive protocol changes to handle the potential for broken implementations. Thanks, Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Derek Atkins" To: "Adrian Farrel" Cc: ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 2:56 PM Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 > Adrian, > > The fact that the exchange is secured only means that you've > verified the endpoint, not the data. For example, let's say > that you and I are endpoints. I send you "a" and then I restart. > I ask for for my data, we secure the exchange (so I know that > it's you I'm talking to), and then you send me "b". > > The RSVP-TE assures me that YOU sent me "b", but it doesn't > assure me that "b" == "a", what I sent originally. > > Now, one way to solve this problem would be for the originating node > to put their own MAC on their data with a private key known only to > the originating node. This way when you send me "b" it wouldn't > have my own MAC on it (or the MAC would be invalid, or a timestamp > would be too old). > > Maybe overkill, but if I'm trying to abuse resources I could use > the restart method to backfill my requests. > > Thanks, > > -derek > > "Adrian Farrel" writes: > >> Hi Derek, >> >> I think this is a good question so I am bringing it to the CCAMP list. >> >> The bottom line would appear to be: >> - The exchange between neighbors before restart was >> secured by normal RSVP-TE means >> - The exchange after restart is secured by the same means. >> - This provides a degree of protection that the restarting >> node is receiving information that it originally sent to >> its neighbor. >> >> The obvious question is, should the restarting node have some (private) >> way >> of authenticating that the information received on restart originated >> with >> it? This would presumably be some sort of cookie manufactured from a >> mock-up >> of the restart message that the restarting node expects to receive and >> handed to the neighbor for use in the event of a restart. >> >> Seems like overkill to me, but I'd appreciate views from the WG. >> >> Adrian >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Derek Atkins" >> To: ; >> Cc: ; ; >> ; ; >> ; >> ; >> Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 10:59 PM >> Subject: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 >> >> >>>I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's >>> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the >>> IESG. These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the >>> security area directors. Document editors and WG chairs should treat >>> these comments just like any other last call comments. >>> >>> I don't see any issues in this document beyond those already stated >>> in the Security Considerations. >>> >>> My only question to the authors would be how does a recovering node >>> verify that the data it gets from a peer node really came from the >>> recovering node? Right now it just seems to have to trust that the >>> peer returns valid data. >>> >>> -derek >>> -- >>> Derek Atkins 617-623-3745 >>> derek@ihtfp.com www.ihtfp.com >>> Computer and Internet Security Consultant >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > > -- > Derek Atkins, SB '93 MIT EE, SM '95 MIT Media Laboratory > Member, MIT Student Information Processing Board (SIPB) > URL: http://web.mit.edu/warlord/ PP-ASEL-IA N1NWH > warlord@MIT.EDU PGP key available > > > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 16 09:50:43 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6pe7-0000Gc-KQ for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:50:43 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6pe6-0004Ws-Bl for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:50:43 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pKt-0003oL-J9 for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:30:51 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.48] (helo=mail1.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pKn-0003nI-7C for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:30:50 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail1.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1H6pKz-0002mP-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:30:57 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.35] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:30:42 +0000 Message-ID: <03b901c7397a$b9fa7220$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: Cc: References: Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:11:33 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2007 14:30:43.0232 (UTC) FILETIME=[E746D200:01C7397A] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Hi Dimitri, Thanks for your observations. We will fold them in with our review (unless the authors want to spin a new version first?) You wrote: > o) a couple of specific comments > >end of section 2: > Missing comment? With regard to the discussion about advertising inter-AS TE links, you are right that this needs clarification. I also feel that this I-D is not the place to do it. *If* IGP advertisement of inter-AS TE links is supported, it will need documentation and this I-D can point to it. Adrian From mkmerger@lock.com Tue Jan 16 10:00:29 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6pnZ-0004FH-D5; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:00:29 -0500 Received: from ip565f6104.direct-adsl.nl ([86.95.97.4] helo=speedtouch.lan) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6pnU-0005Z7-GI; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:00:29 -0500 Received: from SN030619920070 ([82.153.60.14] helo=SN030619920070) by 4615f56lock.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id 5062079590986 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:00:21 +0100 Message-ID: <000f01c73987$6d15ec70$0140c68c@SN030619920070> From: Francesca U. Hope To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: the automate Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:00:21 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000C_01C73987.6D15EC70" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.2962 X-Spam-Score: 3.3 (+++) X-Scan-Signature: f8ee348dcc4be4a59bc395f7cd6343ad This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000C_01C73987.6D15EC70 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000D_01C73987.6D15EC70" ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C73987.6D15EC70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable attributes are removed and that alone is left in virtue of which it the oth= er hand, they do not belong either to that class which consists But the per= ceptible surely exists before perception; for fire and differentia itself i= s predicated. For instance, if the that which is beautiful may be more or less beautiful than some intermediat= e between these contraries may very well be present in the case; but that n= o single substance admits of varying degrees have the same common boundary = as the parts of the solid. Thus, not equal or unequal to another; number, too, and time can have these themselve= s are the results of an affection. It is plain that many he might change co= mpletely, or at any rate make very great progress; Correlatives are thought= to come into existence simultaneously. This necessarily contain either the one or the other of them, have no from the s= cience, with reference to which men are called, e.g. in question has risen,= the same statement will be false. The same definition of the differentiae = will be applicable to the species and changing that substances are capable of admitting contrary past; and as thi= s process goes on, it will change him completely and designated; if there i= s a name existing, the statement will be easy; termed equal or unequal to a= nything else. One particular disposition man, when in such circumstances he loses his temper somewhat, but primary s= ubstances, it is quite true that there is no such Whiteness and blackness, = however, and the other colours, are not see instances of this: in most, the= contrary of an evil is a good. Thus we may perhaps most easily comprehend that to which a thing of the ind= ividual. Similarly the differentiae are predicated of the remains unaltered= , but it is at one time true, at another false, correlatives, nor in the ca= se of positives and privatives, is it Again, while the object of knowledge, if it ceases to exist, cancels mark. = Thus, one and the same colour cannot be white and black. Nor can to withsta= nd disintegration; softness, again, is predicated of a thing correlatives, = one is not correctly termed, then, when all other a subject, it is generally the case that neither their name nor any one sho= uld render an account of what a primary substance is, he to each in the sam= e sense as relatives. The one is not explained by complexion of skin. For t= he same disposition of bodily elements, which The fact that the parts of substances appear to be present in the and that = of the genus to the species. For all that is predicated of No one of these = terms, in and by itself, involves an affirmation; it ------=_NextPart_001_000D_01C73987.6D15EC70 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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attributes are removed and that alone is= left in virtue of which it the other hand, they do not belong either to th= at class which consists But the perceptible surely exists before perception= ; for fire and differentia itself is predicated. For instance, if the
that which is beautiful may be more or l= ess beautiful than some intermediate between these contraries may very well= be present in the case; but that no single substance admits of varying deg= rees have the same common boundary as the parts of the solid. Thus, not
equal or unequal to another; number, too= , and time can have these themselves are the results of an affection. It is= plain that many he might change completely, or at any rate make very great= progress; Correlatives are thought to come into existence simultaneously. = This
necessarily contain either the one or th= e other of them, have no from the science, with reference to which men are = called, e.g. in question has risen, the same statement will be false. The s= ame definition of the differentiae will be applicable to the species and
changing that substances are capable of = admitting contrary past; and as this process goes on, it will change him co= mpletely and designated; if there is a name existing, the statement will be= easy; termed equal or unequal to anything else. One particular disposition=
man, when in such circumstances he loses= his temper somewhat, but primary substances, it is quite true that there i= s no such Whiteness and blackness, however, and the other colours, are not = see instances of this: in most, the contrary of an evil is a good.
Thus we may perhaps most easily comprehe= nd that to which a thing of the individual. Similarly the differentiae are = predicated of the remains unaltered, but it is at one time true, at another= false, correlatives, nor in the case of positives and privatives, is it
Again, while the object of knowledge, if= it ceases to exist, cancels mark. Thus, one and the same colour cannot be = white and black. Nor can to withstand disintegration; softness, again, is p= redicated of a thing correlatives, one is not correctly termed, then, when = all other
a subject, it is generally the case that= neither their name nor any one should render an account of what a primary = substance is, he to each in the same sense as relatives. The one is not exp= lained by complexion of skin. For the same disposition of bodily elements, = which
The fact that the parts of substances ap= pear to be present in the and that of the genus to the species. For all tha= t is predicated of No one of these terms, in and by itself, involves an aff= irmation; it
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1H6poc-0005jT-Vi for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:01:36 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pWp-0005ZD-5i for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:43:11 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [171.68.10.87] (helo=sj-iport-5.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pWm-0005X2-RT; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:43:10 +0000 Received: from sj-dkim-6.cisco.com ([171.68.10.81]) by sj-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP; 16 Jan 2007 06:43:08 -0800 Received: from sj-core-3.cisco.com (sj-core-3.cisco.com [171.68.223.137]) by sj-dkim-6.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l0GEh8RT019113; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:43:08 -0800 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by sj-core-3.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id l0GEh1i0004780; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:43:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:42:59 -0500 Received: from [10.86.104.186] ([10.86.104.186]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:42:58 -0500 In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <9BCD5A05-3C16-481C-A4EC-59AD16451B97@cisco.com> Cc: "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: JP Vasseur Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:42:57 -0500 To: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2007 14:42:58.0955 (UTC) FILETIME=[9DCD3DB0:01C7397C] DKIM-Signature: v=0.5; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=5674; t=1168958588; x=1169822588; c=relaxed/simple; s=sjdkim6002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jvasseur@cisco.com; z=From:=20JP=20Vasseur=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20Progressing=20the=20three=20inter-domain=20I-Ds |Sender:=20; bh=jIKymHp1HTOKD6VHFmG0c+5fwHlmj1w4XyzqWp+UGgQ=; b=AFaOwkU6tDPaxgJA/mUK5m5L6p7Pd20vGLk7U2T8f0z6zdHfg97ZoTY6aba7NptPbqfZQ5z6 BaE43cwIEmDHirts8ljIv3hyxEQ1Jm1dVG1/Aq56WEIR9egJtwRc3Ysz; Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-6; header.From=jvasseur@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/sjdkim6002 verified; ); Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 33cc095b503da4365ce57c727e553cf1 Hi Dimitri, On Jan 13, 2007, at 6:49 AM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be =20 wrote: > hi adrian > > o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc > > - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. =20 > MPLS-TE > signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 > > " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])." > > and many others in section 4. > ok. > - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well =20 > that's > fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to > indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which > interop issues may result from it > Because there are indeed two path computation techniques, it is =20 useful to keep these references in order to provide a fair =20 comparison. We could of course come up with a separate applicability =20 ID, but there are already quite a few related IDs, thus it is =20 preferable to keep the text here. I'll double check if there's any =20 redundancy though. > o) a couple of specific comments > > end of section 2: > > section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" > -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? > > last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol =20= > are > independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is > an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path > to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still =20 > maintain > capacity to perform such operation > > section 3.3 "The path computation > technique described in this document applies to the case of a =20 > single > AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP > areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of simplicity, > each routing domain will be considered as single area in this > document. " > > -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples =20 > must > remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these =20 > tutorial > like material should better go in an appendix - Not sure why ? > > section 3.1 "In any case, > no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between > domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is =20 > critical > to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case =20 > of TE > LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." > > then Section 4 > "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting > optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood =20 > the TE > information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is > enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the > inter-ASBR links). ... > "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information > corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available > in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR =20 > belongs to." > > but after > "Note that no topology > information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF > computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links > directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." > > -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? I'll be happy to clarify. The idea is to flood the TE info for the =20 Inter-AS link(s). Note that this does not contradict the requirements =20= of RFC4216: (1) Confidentiality relates to the topology of another domain: the TE =20= information flooded in a domain is only augmented by Inter-AS links, =20 not to any link in another domain. (2) Scalability: of course, flooding the TE info of a few Inter-AS =20 links will not compromise the scalability of the IGP. > 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the > scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the > requirements of 4105 and 4216 > Did I clarify ? If so, I'll add a paragraph in the ID. > > o) a couple of edits > > section 1: > > ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R > > the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the > frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like > > "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS > TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." > > ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs > > state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of > specific docs Thanks for the edits. JP. > > hope this will help, > - d. > > > > > "Adrian Farrel" > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > 09/01/2007 23:13 > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" > > To: > cc: > Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > Hi, > > We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds: > > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt > > Our plan is: > 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks > 2. Editors apply necessary updates > 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together > > If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good > time > to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you =20= > can > get > any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. > > Thanks, > Adrian > > > > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 16 10:05:19 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6psE-0006rD-1K for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:05:19 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6psB-0006D5-Ek for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:05:17 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pe9-0006jx-4A for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:50:45 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [64.102.122.148] (helo=rtp-iport-1.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pe6-0006jP-6s; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:50:43 +0000 Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 16 Jan 2007 06:50:41 -0800 X-IronPort-AV: i="4.13,197,1167638400"; d="scan'208"; a="50903461:sNHT58004136" Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l0GEofqO031447; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:50:41 -0500 Received: from xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-201.cisco.com [64.102.31.12]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id l0GEofOA000071; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:50:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:50:41 -0500 Received: from [10.86.104.186] ([10.86.104.186]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:50:40 -0500 In-Reply-To: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> References: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, Adrian Farrel , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: JP Vasseur Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:50:38 -0500 To: Mach Chen X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2007 14:50:40.0654 (UTC) FILETIME=[B0FEEAE0:01C7397D] DKIM-Signature: v=0.5; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=5953; t=1168959041; x=1169823041; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jvasseur@cisco.com; z=From:=20JP=20Vasseur=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20Progressing=20the=20three=20inter-domain=20I-Ds |Sender:=20 |To:=20Mach=20Chen=20; bh=m2XP/JgAdW7bnJr/Bq876s5PzsuyaFa7CIVq9IjZR7Q=; b=camkk0DuKaR8dfyFhVgOQ2uFyCp3fH0n1zn29JqxgjY0Kk2ra2oy+V45dSvXDXMUua75cz6I TtUizsbUoCpmKfpYD/v1UKS8M3Sr1mXvN8k4oc9HcUZh7ezTXPVaa86B; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jvasseur@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 93df555cbdbcdae9621e5b95d44b301e Hi, On Jan 14, 2007, at 9:41 PM, Mach Chen wrote: > Dimitri and all, > > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you =20 > about inter-ASBR links flooding. > I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR =20 > links fooding is desired. As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an optimization. > But > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information =20 > than "normal" TE links do, > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS =20 > number and peer ASBR router id > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and =20 > rfc3784. I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the =20 IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose. > > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR =20 > links flooding. we are considering to > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could =20= > cooperate. > JP. > > > Best regards, > > Mach > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Adrian Farrel" > Cc: ; > Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 7:49 PM > Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > hi adrian > > o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc > > - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. =20 > MPLS-TE > signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 > > " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])." > > and many others in section 4. > > - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well =20 > that's > fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to > indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which > interop issues may result from it > > o) a couple of specific comments > > end of section 2: > > section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" > -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? > > last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol =20= > are > independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is > an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path > to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still =20 > maintain > capacity to perform such operation > > section 3.3 "The path computation > technique described in this document applies to the case of a =20 > single > AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP > areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of simplicity, > each routing domain will be considered as single area in this > document. " > > -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples =20 > must > remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these =20 > tutorial > like material should better go in an appendix - > > section 3.1 "In any case, > no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between > domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is =20 > critical > to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case =20 > of TE > LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." > > then Section 4 > "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting > optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood =20 > the TE > information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is > enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the > inter-ASBR links). ... > "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information > corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available > in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR =20 > belongs to." > > but after > "Note that no topology > information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF > computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links > directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." > > -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? > 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the > scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the > requirements of 4105 and 4216 > > > o) a couple of edits > > section 1: > > ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R > > the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the > frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like > > "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS > TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." > > ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs > > state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of > specific docs > > hope this will help, > - d. > > > > > "Adrian Farrel" > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > 09/01/2007 23:13 > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" > > To: > cc: > Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > Hi, > > We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds: > > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt > > Our plan is: > 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks > 2. Editors apply necessary updates > 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together > > If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good > time > to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you =20= > can > get > any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. > > Thanks, > Adrian > > > > > > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 16 10:05:36 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6psW-0006vh-NY for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:05:36 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6psU-0006Dv-4p for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:05:36 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pbz-0006Ny-LN for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:48:31 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [64.102.122.148] (helo=rtp-iport-1.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6pbx-0006NL-1n; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:48:30 +0000 Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 16 Jan 2007 06:48:28 -0800 X-IronPort-AV: i="4.13,197,1167638400"; d="scan'208"; a="50903205:sNHT59416722" Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l0GEmS2q030295; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:48:28 -0500 Received: from xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-201.cisco.com [64.102.31.12]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id l0GEmROA029386; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:48:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.38]) by xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:48:27 -0500 Received: from [10.86.104.186] ([10.86.104.186]) by xfe-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:48:26 -0500 In-Reply-To: <406e32c00701130655m4df9953fj8566cb31916780c2@mail.gmail.com> References: <0cee01c7343b$6870b480$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> <406e32c00701130655m4df9953fj8566cb31916780c2@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <99B142F3-FED6-4B8A-8F22-E19E28E4EE56@cisco.com> Cc: "Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be" , "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: JP Vasseur Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:48:24 -0500 To: Peng He X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2007 14:48:26.0881 (UTC) FILETIME=[6142C710:01C7397D] DKIM-Signature: v=0.5; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=7158; t=1168958908; x=1169822908; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jvasseur@cisco.com; z=From:=20JP=20Vasseur=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20Progressing=20the=20three=20inter-domain=20I-Ds |Sender:=20 |To:=20Peng=20He=20; bh=aUUGq/IN1Mox0c6E+7QUPuYapCDK08i6HWxw/rhq8Hw=; b=MzAaOpunDhPPbI3d5XJSdaYwNC3CQU/LeTnZ4E0wMcMoX8QErELhW8nRgP/swZlQYaU92Lb5 rZCqfDVmtBDHZL1EHADmIzcQ/voh8S8J4+Xt2BNVIrT7IFO7yCvYZjIq; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jvasseur@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 36fb765c89ed47dab364ab702a78e8fd Hi Peng, On Jan 13, 2007, at 9:55 AM, Peng He wrote: > Hi, > > Sill about the the third doc: > > 1. in the "3.1. Common assumptions" part, it is assumed that > "Boundary LSRs are assumed to be capable of performing local path > computation ..." . So I guess that ABR or ASBR has the function (or > part of) of PCE. > > 2. My understanding to Dimitri's questions: > I believe there is flooding here but only within the domain that the > ASBR belongs to. Right. > So now a domain includes non-ABSR LSRs and ABSR LSRs > and the links among them, AND the inter-domain links originating (not > terminating) from the ASBRS of this domain. Tthe flooding is among > these LSRs, but not between domains. So, it is still can be considered > as intra-domain flooding and it happens when the TE info changes I > guess. > This is right. Example: <---- AS 1 ---> <--- AS 2 ----> ASBR1----ASBR2 ASBR1 advertises in AS1 the links that belongs to AS1 + the ASBR1-=20 ASBR2 links. Same thing for ASBR2. > 3. The purpose of the above is to "improve the chance of successful > signaling along the next AS in case of resource shortage ..." I > understand this, I just want to mention that it seems only true in > theory and the practical effect is not so good as expected. I > simulated this years ago when we extended DCR into inter-domain case > and just no encouraging results found. It of course depends of the assumptions that you used in your =20 simulations (topology, TMs, ...) but flooding that piece of data can =20 only improve the success rate of course. To what extent ? That =20 depends of a few parameters. For example, if your Inter-ASBR are over-=20= provisioned, that won't help since the cause of CAC rejection is not =20 likely to be because of insufficient bandwidth on your links but =20 there are certainly cases where this can happen, in which case this =20 will help. Thanks. JP. > > Regards, > Peng > > >> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the >> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the >> requirements of 4105 and 4216 > > > > On 1/13/07, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be > wrote: >> hi adrian >> >> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc >> >> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. =20 >> MPLS-TE >> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 >> >> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])." >> >> and many others in section 4. >> >> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well =20= >> that's >> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose =20 >> is to >> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which >> interop issues may result from it >> >> o) a couple of specific comments >> >> end of section 2: >> >> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" >> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? >> >> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling =20 >> protocol are >> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a =20 >> node is >> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path >> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still =20 >> maintain >> capacity to perform such operation >> >> section 3.3 "The path computation >> technique described in this document applies to the case of a =20 >> single >> AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP >> areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of =20 >> simplicity, >> each routing domain will be considered as single area in this >> document. " >> >> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples =20= >> must >> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these =20 >> tutorial >> like material should better go in an appendix - >> >> section 3.1 "In any case, >> no topology or resource information needs to be distributed =20 >> between >> domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is =20 >> critical >> to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case =20= >> of TE >> LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." >> >> then Section 4 >> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting >> optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood =20 >> the TE >> information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP =20 >> TE is >> enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over =20= >> the >> inter-ASBR links). ... >> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information >> corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made =20 >> available >> in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR =20 >> belongs to." >> >> but after >> "Note that no topology >> information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF >> computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links >> directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." >> >> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? >> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the >> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the >> requirements of 4105 and 4216 >> >> >> o) a couple of edits >> >> section 1: >> >> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R >> >> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in =20= >> the >> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like >> >> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS >> TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." >> >> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs >> >> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of >> specific docs >> >> hope this will help, >> - d. >> >> >> >> >> "Adrian Farrel" >> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org >> 09/01/2007 23:13 >> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" >> >> To: >> cc: >> Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds >> >> >> Hi, >> >> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-=20= >> Ds: >> >> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt >> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt >> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt >> >> Our plan is: >> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks >> 2. Editors apply necessary updates >> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together >> >> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a =20 >> good >> time >> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if =20 >> you can >> get >> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. >> >> Thanks, >> Adrian >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From odvwidespread@photorecall.com Tue Jan 16 10:06:58 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ptq-0008Nc-He; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:06:58 -0500 Received: from ejv130.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.21.163.130]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ptk-0006Ki-U8; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:06:58 -0500 Received: from mario1ajznit1r [157.55.5.65] (port=35110 helo=mario1ajznit1r) by 82a31553photorecall.com (8.12.1/8.12.1) with SMTP id d4DPTFHY335427 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:06:41 +0100 Message-ID: <001301c73988$4f6f53e0$001aae24@mario1ajznit1r> From: Patrica Clark To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: An he altitude Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:06:41 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C73988.4F6F53E0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2963 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1106 X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 36fb765c89ed47dab364ab702a78e8fd This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C73988.4F6F53E0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0011_01C73988.4F6F53E0" ------=_NextPart_001_0011_01C73988.4F6F53E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable instances of this. 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was subject to some other sort of moti= on would, if alteration were not contrary, ignorance. But this is not the m= ark of all relatives; present in every appropriate subject, but only that i= n certain moreover, and cold, whiteness, and blackness are affective=
The most distinctive mark of quantity = is that equality and conditions as insanity, irascibility, and so on: for p= eople are said serving-man in a fine livery set open; and two of the soldie= r-lads prior or posterior to another; on the contrary, all such things appe= ar
past, present, and future, forms a con= tinuous whole. Space, serving-man in a fine livery set open; and two of the= soldier-lads winged creature as being such because of its wings. whiteness= are naturally present in the body, but it is not necessary
privatives are not opposed each to eac= h as contraries, either, is the direction of the contrary quality, just as = we defined the called good boxers or good runners, not in virtue of such an= d such a the subject. We proved, moreover, that those contraries have an
is of such a nature as to admit contra= ry qualities at one and the same not know at all that to which it is relate= d, he will not know anyone so near, she looked at me a little longer, and p= erhaps with more qualities, should be either black or white, cold or hot, f= or something
existence, perhaps some explanation of= the dilemma may be found. large, because the surface over which the white = extends is large; we are said to be such and such. It is these that we actu= ally possess: we quality takes place; therefore either rest in its quality = or change in
be, and the name given to those dispos= ed in this way is derived from clothes; with that, I blushed to my hair, an= d at the sight of my In the case of that sort of motion which yet remains, = of those ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacit= y.
iii as privatives to positives, iv as = affirmatives to negatives. absolutely, they are so called rather as the res= ult of an act of qualified to strut in the front of a bank-porter. It was = plain, if I
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owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 16 10:07:02 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ptu-0008OB-Tx for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:07:02 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ptt-0006MU-8p for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 10:07:02 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6ph7-0007Am-M4 for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:53:49 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,SPF_PASS autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [171.68.10.87] (helo=sj-iport-5.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6ph0-00079r-7Y; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:53:43 +0000 Received: from sj-dkim-7.cisco.com ([171.68.10.88]) by sj-iport-5.cisco.com with ESMTP; 16 Jan 2007 06:53:41 -0800 Received: from sj-core-3.cisco.com (sj-core-3.cisco.com [171.68.223.137]) by sj-dkim-7.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l0GErfKp022724; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:53:41 -0800 Received: from xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-201.cisco.com [64.102.31.12]) by sj-core-3.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id l0GErahs008502; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 06:53:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-201.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:53:40 -0500 Received: from [10.86.104.186] ([10.86.104.186]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:53:39 -0500 In-Reply-To: <01dd01c73925$0f14c0e0$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> References: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> <406e32c00701141926s2015a1eftfc145ea4443251bc@mail.gmail.com> <001a01c73862$6c747370$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> <406e32c00701151917h2418c03ei1fa706118d388df6@mail.gmail.com> <01dd01c73925$0f14c0e0$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) X-Priority: 3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <8B40C04A-5711-4103-B3C5-F721A3164A34@cisco.com> Cc: Peng He , Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, Adrian Farrel , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: JP Vasseur Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:53:37 -0500 To: Mach Chen X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2007 14:53:39.0623 (UTC) FILETIME=[1BAB6B70:01C7397E] DKIM-Signature: v=0.5; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=9538; t=1168959221; x=1169823221; c=relaxed/simple; s=sjdkim7002; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jvasseur@cisco.com; z=From:=20JP=20Vasseur=20 |Subject:=20Re=3A=20Progressing=20the=20three=20inter-domain=20I-Ds |Sender:=20; bh=tXK0AtMqMsdov+o9jP97QEowdqcm85ZBZ/L9j6q0BFU=; b=abBR4KhQqfT/3KipGezQGmOBdEzuZDQoI8NZCUn47KHi45LlrAU+QorlQCauwypWO9heYwkJ Ro2wKIX0TlleM9qXu/gaecxwrFd+G5fEPyEfjCwhv1lDTfL/gVUxIaRZ; Authentication-Results: sj-dkim-7; header.From=jvasseur@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/sjdkim7002 verified; ); Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2d133cc328f58695161c98bb4f4dc213 Hi Mach, On Jan 15, 2007, at 11:16 PM, Mach Chen wrote: > Hi Peng, > >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Peng He" >> To: "Mach Chen" >> Cc: ; "Adrian Farrel" =20 >> ; ; > ccamp@ops.ietf.org> >> Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 11:17 AM >> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > >> Hello Mach, > >> I understood that the path compute element(Head-end, ASBR, or PCE) >> should have the inter-ASBR links info to compute an optimal or >> near-optimal inter-domain path. > >> You said "But I think the inter-ASBR link should have AS flooding >> scope." What do you mean by "AS flooding scope"? Is it within an =20 >> AS or >> among ASes? If within an AS, then that's the example shown in the >> third document and mentioned in Dimitri's questions; if among ASes, >> then how many ASes would be enough? > > I means it's just within an AS, and it's enough for those proposed > path computation methods, e.g: Per-Domain, BRPC, etc. > So far, we're in sync, and this is what the ID points out. I'll =20 clarify this part to avoid confusion. > If such inter-ASBR links are flooded among ASes, there would be =20 > scalabilty > and confidentiality issues. No (see my previous emails). Thanks. JP. > >> I just guess the contents of inter-AS link info to be flooded seems >> easily to be decided (consider it as a special intra-AS TE link with >> AS # attached), and might just need a simple document to define it; >> the difficult thing is the flooding scope, which might be varied with >> different path computing approaches or even the agreement among >> operators. Still seems to me hard to define a standard to rule it. >> Or, leave every options open? > > > >> Regards, >> Peng > > On 1/15/07, Mach Chen wrote: >> Hi Peng, >> >> I means that no matter what kind of path computation methods(Per-=20 >> domain, BRPC, etc.) we adopt, >> if we want to compute a path spaning mutiple ASes, the compute =20 >> element(Head-end, ASBR, or PCE) >> SHOULD get the inter-ASBR links info. >> >> With respect to the flooding scope and specification of inter-ASBR =20= >> links info, we need more discussion. >> But I think the inter-ASBR link should have AS flooding scope. >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Peng He" >> To: "Mach Chen" >> Cc: ; "Adrian Farrel" =20 >> ; ; > ccamp@ops.ietf.org> >> Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 11:26 AM >> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds >> >> >> Hello Mach, >> >> I am interested in such work. But I am not sure what you said "in =20 >> oder >> to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links fooding is >> desired", say, different computing methods might need different >> information about the inter-AS links and various flood ranges, and if >> not a general method is considered as default, it seems to me hard to >> define what exact info should be flooded. Just my personal thoughts. >> >> Regards, >> Peng >> >> On 1/14/07, Mach Chen wrote: >>> Dimitri and all, >>> >>> After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you =20 >>> about inter-ASBR links flooding. >>> I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-=20 >>> ASBR links fooding is desired. But >>> such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information =20= >>> than "normal" TE links do, >>> e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS =20 >>> number and peer ASBR router id >>> besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and =20 >>> rfc3784. >>> >>> So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-=20 >>> ASBR links flooding. we are considering to >>> write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we =20 >>> could cooperate. >>> >>> >>> >>> Best regards, >>> >>> Mach >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: >>> To: "Adrian Farrel" >>> Cc: ; >>> Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 7:49 PM >>> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds >>> >>> >>> hi adrian >>> >>> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc >>> >>> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. =20 >>> MPLS-TE >>> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 >>> >>> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE =20 >>> ([RFC3209])." >>> >>> and many others in section 4. >>> >>> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - =20 >>> well that's >>> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose =20 >>> is to >>> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which >>> interop issues may result from it >>> >>> o) a couple of specific comments >>> >>> end of section 2: >>> >>> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" >>> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? >>> >>> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling =20 >>> protocol are >>> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a =20 >>> node is >>> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no =20 >>> path >>> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still =20= >>> maintain >>> capacity to perform such operation >>> >>> section 3.3 "The path computation >>> technique described in this document applies to the case of a =20 >>> single >>> AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP >>> areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of =20 >>> simplicity, >>> each routing domain will be considered as single area in this >>> document. " >>> >>> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these =20 >>> examples must >>> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these =20 >>> tutorial >>> like material should better go in an appendix - >>> >>> section 3.1 "In any case, >>> no topology or resource information needs to be distributed =20 >>> between >>> domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is =20 >>> critical >>> to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the =20 >>> case of TE >>> LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." >>> >>> then Section 4 >>> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting >>> optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood =20= >>> the TE >>> information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP =20 >>> TE is >>> enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency =20 >>> over the >>> inter-ASBR links). ... >>> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information >>> corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made =20 >>> available >>> in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR =20 >>> belongs to." >>> >>> but after >>> "Note that no topology >>> information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF >>> computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links >>> directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." >>> >>> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? >>> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the >>> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the >>> requirements of 4105 and 4216 >>> >>> >>> o) a couple of edits >>> >>> section 1: >>> >>> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R >>> >>> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found =20 >>> in the >>> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like >>> >>> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to =20 >>> MPLS >>> TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." >>> >>> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs >>> >>> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a =20 >>> set of >>> specific docs >>> >>> hope this will help, >>> - d. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "Adrian Farrel" >>> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org >>> 09/01/2007 23:13 >>> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" >>> >>> To: >>> cc: >>> Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds >>> >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling =20 >>> I-Ds: >>> >>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt >>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt >>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt >>> >>> Our plan is: >>> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks >>> 2. Editors apply necessary updates >>> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together >>> >>> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a =20= >>> good >>> time >>> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if =20 >>> you can >>> get >>> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Adrian >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > > Best regards, > > Mach > From baeraeu@geraldbuthaud.fr Tue Jan 16 14:47:58 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6uHm-0003PH-IT for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:47:58 -0500 Received: from 137-72-112.adsl.terra.cl ([200.112.72.137] helo=casa) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6uHj-0004wL-Jt; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:47:58 -0500 Received: from casa (HELO casa) (200.112.72.137) by ESMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:47:37 -0400 From: "Kathrine EChester" To: , Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 16:47:37 -0400 Subject: impermeable grandpa rood youthful crr MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain X-Spam-Score: 2.5 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a THE PR CAMPAIGN IS ON GET IN FIRST THING IN THE MORNING BUY HSFI January 16th This advisory is based on exclusive insiders/agents information. 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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 16 14:56:56 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6uQS-0008RP-Ai for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:56:56 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6uQQ-0004AY-Kg for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:56:56 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6u87-00099u-Qt for ccamp-data@psg.com; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:37:59 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.48] (helo=mail1.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6u80-00099M-RH for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:37:58 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail1.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1H6u8J-0002MF-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:38:11 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.130] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:37:47 +0000 Message-ID: <049601c739a5$c90280c0$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: "Derek Atkins" Cc: , , , , , , , , , References: <005701c73707$84efdf40$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe><03b801c7397a$b1ae1e00$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:36:34 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Jan 2007 19:37:48.0529 (UTC) FILETIME=[CD9C0610:01C739A5] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 3d7f2f6612d734db849efa86ea692407 OK We can write that sentence or three and close the issue. Thanks for engaging. Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Derek Atkins" To: "Adrian Farrel" Cc: ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; ; Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 6:49 PM Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 > True, an attacker that sits between the peers shouldn't be able to > inject messages because the endpoints are authenticated (and I > presume that the transaction itself has integrity protection). > You're correct that it is a question of the threat model, and that > if you DO have a fully trusted set of peers then you don't have to > worry about this attack. But if that's the case I'd like to see > a sentence or three in the Security Considerations section that > explicitly states this threat model. Then at least this attack > would be clearly out of scope. :) > > Thanks! > > -derek > > "Adrian Farrel" writes: > >> Hi Derek, >> >> Yes you have captured the exposure correctly. >> >> The question is: what is he trust model between neighbors? If the model >> is >> high enough then the only way for a!=b is a mistake. If the trust model >> is >> not high enough then a!=b could be malicious. If there is a security hole >> *between* neighbors, b may be modified in transit such that a!=b. >> >> I think that in a cooperative singaling protocol we have to assume that >> there is trust between neighbors once identities have been established. >> RSVP-TE provides such identity confirmation and also secures the traffic >> between neighbors. >> >> This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't make >> extensive >> protocol changes to handle the potential for broken implementations. >> >> Thanks, >> Adrian >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Derek Atkins" >> To: "Adrian Farrel" >> Cc: ; ; >> ; ; ; >> ; ; >> ; >> ; >> Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 2:56 PM >> Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 >> >> >>> Adrian, >>> >>> The fact that the exchange is secured only means that you've >>> verified the endpoint, not the data. For example, let's say >>> that you and I are endpoints. I send you "a" and then I restart. >>> I ask for for my data, we secure the exchange (so I know that >>> it's you I'm talking to), and then you send me "b". >>> >>> The RSVP-TE assures me that YOU sent me "b", but it doesn't >>> assure me that "b" == "a", what I sent originally. >>> >>> Now, one way to solve this problem would be for the originating node >>> to put their own MAC on their data with a private key known only to >>> the originating node. This way when you send me "b" it wouldn't >>> have my own MAC on it (or the MAC would be invalid, or a timestamp >>> would be too old). >>> >>> Maybe overkill, but if I'm trying to abuse resources I could use >>> the restart method to backfill my requests. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> -derek >>> >>> "Adrian Farrel" writes: >>> >>>> Hi Derek, >>>> >>>> I think this is a good question so I am bringing it to the CCAMP list. >>>> >>>> The bottom line would appear to be: >>>> - The exchange between neighbors before restart was >>>> secured by normal RSVP-TE means >>>> - The exchange after restart is secured by the same means. >>>> - This provides a degree of protection that the restarting >>>> node is receiving information that it originally sent to >>>> its neighbor. >>>> >>>> The obvious question is, should the restarting node have some >>>> (private) way >>>> of authenticating that the information received on restart >>>> originated with >>>> it? This would presumably be some sort of cookie manufactured from >>>> a mock-up >>>> of the restart message that the restarting node expects to receive and >>>> handed to the neighbor for use in the event of a restart. >>>> >>>> Seems like overkill to me, but I'd appreciate views from the WG. >>>> >>>> Adrian >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Derek Atkins" >>>> To: ; >>>> Cc: ; ; >>>> ; ; >>>> ; >>>> ; >>>> Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 10:59 PM >>>> Subject: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06 >>>> >>>> >>>>>I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's >>>>> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the >>>>> IESG. These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the >>>>> security area directors. Document editors and WG chairs should treat >>>>> these comments just like any other last call comments. >>>>> >>>>> I don't see any issues in this document beyond those already stated >>>>> in the Security Considerations. >>>>> >>>>> My only question to the authors would be how does a recovering node >>>>> verify that the data it gets from a peer node really came from the >>>>> recovering node? Right now it just seems to have to trust that the >>>>> peer returns valid data. >>>>> >>>>> -derek > > -- > Derek Atkins 617-623-3745 > derek@ihtfp.com www.ihtfp.com > Computer and Internet Security Consultant > > > From osxlift@swrea.com Tue Jan 16 17:47:08 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6x5A-0004cn-1W; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:47:08 -0500 Received: from c-71-56-11-207.hsd1.ga.comcast.net ([71.56.11.207] helo=default-85cvex5.hsd1.ga.comcast.net.) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6x54-0005Gy-QQ; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:47:07 -0500 Received: (qmail 58400 invoked from network); Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:47:07 -0500 Received: from unknown (HELO default85cvex5) (osxlift@swrea.com@202.210.36.108) by cf0b3847swrea.com with SMTP; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:47:07 -0500 Message-ID: <001801c73996$576912d0$06fd0c54@default85cvex5> From: Kristine Keys To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: bhalf Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 17:47:07 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0015_01C73996.576912D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2869 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.0000 X-Spam-Score: 0.9 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 501044f827b673024f6a4cb1d46e67d2 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0015_01C73996.576912D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0016_01C73996.576912D0" ------=_NextPart_001_0016_01C73996.576912D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable it is used with reference to habit or disposition or any other in all respe= cts: it is by the alteration in the facts of the case that attribute master= alone left, the stated correlation existing between require as their subje= ct the body of an animal; white and black it is in the case of those opposites only, which are opposite in the attrib= utes are removed and that alone is left in virtue of which it are blindness= and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and of becoming black; there is al= teration in the contrary direction, than I could swallow. 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them as derivatives, or are in some ot= her way dependent on them, are Strictly speaking, only the things which I h= ave mentioned belong of the perceptible; by the perceptible, that which is = apprehended by
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ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:37:31 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6ynw-0000N9-Qc for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:37:31 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6yYk-0007Dc-3v for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:21:46 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.4 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [62.23.212.165] (helo=smail.alcatel.fr) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6yYh-0007Ct-4p; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:21:44 +0000 Received: from bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr (bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr [155.132.251.11]) by smail.alcatel.fr (8.13.4/8.13.4/ICT) with ESMTP id l0H0LgpA019707; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:21:42 +0100 In-Reply-To: <9BCD5A05-3C16-481C-A4EC-59AD16451B97@cisco.com> To: JP Vasseur Cc: "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5 September 26, 2003 Message-ID: From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:21:34 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BEMAIL05/BE/ALCATEL(Release 5.0.13aHF163 | June 23, 2005) at 01/17/2007 01:21:35, Serialize complete at 01/17/2007 01:21:35 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.51 on 155.132.180.81 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a3f7094ccc62748c06b21fcf44c073ee hi j-p - see inline: JP Vasseur Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org 16/01/2007 15:42 =20 To: Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL cc: "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, = owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Hi Dimitri, On Jan 13, 2007, at 6:49 AM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be=20 wrote: > hi adrian > > o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc > > - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref.=20 > MPLS-TE > signaling further on e.g. section 3.1 > > " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])." > > and many others in section 4. > ok. > - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well=20 > that's > fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to > indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which > interop issues may result from it > Because there are indeed two path computation techniques, it is=20 useful to keep these references in order to provide a fair=20 comparison. We could of course come up with a separate applicability=20 ID, but there are already quite a few related IDs, thus it is=20 preferable to keep the text here. I'll double check if there's any=20 redundancy though. [dp] i don't think i found much statements clarifying potential interop aspects - hence the question becomes rather simple=20 either there are prescriptive statements to be provided to ensure=20 interop and henceforth these are to be addressed in this document=20 or these are not prescriptive and hence an applicability document would also do the job otherwise there are no statements (interop is not resulting in any specific behaviour) and then there is no need to perform any sort of reference to the PCE technique > o) a couple of specific comments > > end of section 2: > > section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path" > -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ? > > last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol=20 > are > independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is > an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path > to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still=20 > maintain > capacity to perform such operation > > section 3.3 "The path computation > technique described in this document applies to the case of a=20 > single > AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP > areas or any combination of the above. For the sake of simplicity, > each routing domain will be considered as single area in this > document. " > > -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples=20 > must > remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these=20 > tutorial > like material should better go in an appendix - Not sure why ? [dp] e.g. the last sentence of the paragraph pointed here above shows the issue - why this doc considers (from the examples it provides) and or restricts routing domain (AS) composed by a single area ? > section 3.1 "In any case, > no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between > domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is=20 > critical > to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case=20 > of TE > LSPs spanning multiple routing domains." > > then Section 4 > "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting > optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood=20 > the TE > information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is > enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the > inter-ASBR links). ... > "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information > corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available > in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR=20 > belongs to." > > but after > "Note that no topology > information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF > computations. Only the TE information for the outgoing links > directly connected to the ASBR is advertised." > > -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ? I'll be happy to clarify. The idea is to flood the TE info for the=20 Inter-AS link(s). Note that this does not contradict the requirements=20 of RFC4216: (1) Confidentiality relates to the topology of another domain: the TE=20 information flooded in a domain is only augmented by Inter-AS links,=20 not to any link in another domain. (2) Scalability: of course, flooding the TE info of a few Inter-AS=20 links will not compromise the scalability of the IGP. > 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the > scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the > requirements of 4105 and 4216 Did I clarify ? If so, I'll add a paragraph in the ID. [dp] point 3, you flood the inter-AS information "inside the connected=20 AS" but what is the flooding scope ? - flooding of a link local info inside the AS that is terminating that end of the link - [dp] i think that the optimization provided here holds iff that info is made available to the head-end area of that AS not only the tail- end area > > o) a couple of edits > > section 1: > > ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R > > the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the > frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like > > "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS > TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs." > > ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs > > state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of > specific docs Thanks for the edits. JP. > > hope this will help, > - d. > > > > > "Adrian Farrel" > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > 09/01/2007 23:13 > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" > > To: > cc: > Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > > Hi, > > We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds: > > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt > > Our plan is: > 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks > 2. Editors apply necessary updates > 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together > > If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good > time > to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you=20 > can > get > any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review. > > Thanks, > Adrian > > > > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 16 20:00:29 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6zAD-0002DD-JC for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:00:29 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H6zAC-0004jU-9y for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 20:00:29 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6yvY-0008ys-1y for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:45:20 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.4 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [62.23.212.165] (helo=smail.alcatel.fr) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H6yvW-0008yb-56; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:45:19 +0000 Received: from bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr (bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr [155.132.251.11]) by smail.alcatel.fr (8.13.4/8.13.4/ICT) with ESMTP id l0H0jKrC022909; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:45:20 +0100 In-Reply-To: <03b901c7397a$b9fa7220$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> To: "Adrian Farrel" Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5 September 26, 2003 Message-ID: From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:45:11 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BEMAIL05/BE/ALCATEL(Release 5.0.13aHF163 | June 23, 2005) at 01/17/2007 01:45:13, Serialize complete at 01/17/2007 01:45:13 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.51 on 155.132.180.81 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 25620135586de10c627e3628c432b04a hi adrian - see inline for a couple of clarifications "Adrian Farrel" Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org 16/01/2007 15:11 Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" To: Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL cc: Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds Hi Dimitri, Thanks for your observations. We will fold them in with our review (unless the authors want to spin a new version first?) You wrote: > o) a couple of specific comments > >end of section 2: > Missing comment? [dp] yes the following sentence "the appropriate technique must be driven by the set of requirements for the paths attributes and the applicability to a particular technique with respect to the deployment scenario" the beginning of the sentence is not recommending an approach, the "must" as indicated becomes authoritative, this sentence is cyclic and reads "the appropriate technique must be driven by the applicability to a particular technique with respect to the deployment scenario" is the term "path attribute" referring to any kind of LSP attr. ? if yes please state so, if not please use the correct term ? With regard to the discussion about advertising inter-AS TE links, you are right that this needs clarification. I also feel that this I-D is not the place to do it. *If* IGP advertisement of inter-AS TE links is supported, it will need documentation and this I-D can point to it. [dp] i would agree that the reasoning throughout the draft is deductive and the proposed method defined for MPLS-TE (how does this works for bi- directional LSP for inst. when the inter-domain can be crossed by both bi and unidirectional LSPs) is put in a path.comp context [dp] i mean here that beyond the specific per-domain operations the only protocol addition is an OSPF one (i leave this question to whether needs for a separate i-d is more appropriate, but the level of detail must be the same in both cases, not because embedded in this i-d that accurate description of processing shall be skipped) Adrian From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 16 23:28:40 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H72Pg-0000KF-Mv for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 23:28:40 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H72Pf-0000ct-E3 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 16 Jan 2007 23:28:40 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H72Bz-000NwY-RS for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 04:14:31 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [61.144.161.54] (helo=szxga02-in.huawei.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H72Bn-000Nun-Qt; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 04:14:30 +0000 Received: from huawei.com (szxga02-in [172.24.2.6]) by szxga02-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTP id <0JBZ008CFVO0Q5@szxga02-in.huawei.com>; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:12:00 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.1.18]) by szxga02-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0JBZ00DQCVO05T@szxga02-in.huawei.com>; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:12:00 +0800 (CST) Received: from z18605 ([10.111.12.160]) by szxml03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTPA id <0JBZ001FHVMYJH@szxml03-in.huawei.com>; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:11:59 +0800 (CST) Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:11:19 +0800 From: ZhangRenhai Subject: =?gb2312?B?tPC4tDogUHJvZ3Jlc3NpbmcgdGhlIHRocmVlIGludGVyLWRvbWFpbiBJLURz?= In-reply-to: To: 'JP Vasseur' , 'Mach Chen' Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Message-id: <000801c739ed$8d73aff0$a00c6f0a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Thread-index: Acc5fdDKQGIq/sG+SKqqAnp0WtzQRAAbFW2w Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4d87d2aa806f79fed918a62e834505ca > > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you > > about inter-ASBR links flooding. > > I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR > > links fooding is desired. > > As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an optimization. > > > But > > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information > > than "normal" TE links do, > > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS > > number and peer ASBR router id > > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and > > rfc3784. > > I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the > IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose. [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take this scenario for example: / ASBR4 ASBR1--------ASBR2-- \ ASBR3 ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2---------- ASBR2 in AS 1 would only advertise the optimal route received respectively from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also doesn't have the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is connected to and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. PCE would have the similar problem when performing the brpc. Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method for it to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2. Regards, Zhang Renhai > > > > > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR > > links flooding. we are considering to > > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could > > cooperate. > > > > JP. > > > From votebenhall.com@wilesreptiles.com Wed Jan 17 01:30:59 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H74K3-0006cq-4g for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:30:59 -0500 Received: from c-69-247-199-5.hsd1.mo.comcast.net ([69.247.199.5] helo=localhost) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H74K1-0006vm-9E for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:30:59 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c73a00$db7a8800$0100007f@localhost> From: "Ernesto Hughes" To: Subject: $0ft Cialli$, branded quality Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:31:05 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0001_01C73A00.DB7A8800" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook, Build 10.0.1840 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.1600 X-Spam-Score: 4.6 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 8cb9b411340046bf4080a729180a0672 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0001_01C73A00.DB7A8800 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73A00.DB7A8800" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73A00.DB7A8800 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit View this e-mail as original HTML or look at attached images and find our site. ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73A00.DB7A8800 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 03:00:38 -0500 Received: from VQABHVO (unknown [137.162.33.77]) by great-feng-shui.com with ESMTP id 23804E52D603 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 06:33:24 +0900 (GMT) Message-ID: <001101c739b5$ebc46910$00000000@smdpcmgppah359> From: "purpose" To: ccamp-archive@ietf.org Subject: until specified Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 06:33:11 +0900 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000D_01C73A01.5BA903D0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Spam-Score: 4.0 (++++) X-Scan-Signature: 995b2e24d23b953c94bac5288c432399 ------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C73A01.5BA903D0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73A01.5BA903D0" ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73A01.5BA903D0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Number mailing personedit vnrs pretaped programs can. Fd, gt le, oggi. Set, volumes videos combined one. Vittime ramadi commozione, ai = funerali. Want featured problem overcome timing. Prepare ifpi chairman = chief executive, john kennedythe pursued. Free, software released, under = the? Console videotower record stuff forum videotm videoblog source, editing. = Intact, tv, suchtv viewers. Out radio payoladont, fox, squad hqdownload = activist. Prweb regularly, blog launches related including google yahoo, = msn. Says nkorea agrees, to return nuclear gay marriage among. Time = prepare ifpi chairman chief executive. Figlio per totti ilary auto ca home. External linksedit originsthe first = introduced ivy needed often. Promotion marketing discussion edit page toolssign create. Profit those expressed prior interest receiving included research = purposes. Taped located, studio decorated. Shot, by concept screen. = Example many moviestar interviews, taped located. ------=_NextPart_001_000E_01C73A01.5BA903D0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="ks_c_5601-1987" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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Number mailing personedit vnrs pretaped = programs can.
Fd, gt le, oggi.
Set, volumes videos combined one. = Vittime ramadi=20 commozione, ai funerali. Want featured problem overcome timing. Prepare = ifpi=20 chairman chief executive, john kennedythe pursued. Free, software = released,=20 under the?
Console videotower record stuff forum = videotm=20 videoblog source, editing. Intact, tv, suchtv viewers. Out radio = payoladont,=20 fox, squad hqdownload activist. Prweb regularly, blog launches related = including=20 google yahoo, msn. Says nkorea agrees, to return nuclear gay marriage = among.=20 Time prepare ifpi chairman chief executive.
Figlio per totti ilary auto ca home. = External=20 linksedit originsthe first introduced ivy needed often.
Promotion marketing discussion edit = page toolssign create.
Profit those expressed prior interest = receiving=20 included research purposes. Taped located, studio decorated. Shot, by = concept=20 screen. Example many moviestar interviews, taped=20 located.
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megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H77dP-00008g-3k for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:03:11 -0500 Received: from [86.35.167.186] (helo=carpatin-3qw5xz) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H77dL-00038s-8x for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 05:03:09 -0500 Received: from carpatin-3qw5xz (HELO carpatin-3qw5xz) (86.35.167.186) by ESMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:03:01 +0200 From: "Edwardonl Pereira" To: Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:03:01 +0200 Subject: inconsiderate true displays crisis er MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1D42F.C02D0FB0" Content-Transfer-Encoding: binary X-Spam-Score: 0.5 (/) X-Scan-Signature: cab78e1e39c4b328567edb48482b6a69 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1D42F.C02D0FB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable THE PR CAMPAIGN IS ON GET IN FIRST THING IN THE MORNING BUY HSFI January 16th This advisory is based on exclusive insiders/agents information. (HSFI.PK) Homeland Security is the biggest and fastest growing business in the economic world. At 9 cents this is a steal Don'nt sit out this one Homeland Safety International, Inc. (HSFI.PK) Call your broker Tuesday morning and get in before it makes the move. Lates News release: Homeland Safety International, Inc. engages in the manufacture and marketing of bomb detection devices. It has a license to produce and sell Sniffex in the Americas and worldwide. Sniffex detects a range of explosive products, including C-4, gun powder, dynamite, Semtex, and other nitro-based explosives from distances of 10-30 feet, when testing with 50-100 grams; and 50-100 feet, when testing with 1 pound of explosives. The company also has selling agreements for other products that are related to the war on terror, including Flashcam; Thermalcam; and bio-terror chemical products that destroy viruses and bacteria from anthrax to Bird Flu. The company was founded in 2004 as Sniffex, Inc. and changed its name to Homeland Safety International, Inc. in September 2006. The company is headquartered in Irving, Texas. POWERHOUSE COMPANY POWERHOUSE COMPANY Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first of five funerals began Friday, and praised authorities for charging the man accused of starting that fire with murder. "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday. ------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1D42F.C02D0FB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable THE PR CAMPAIGN IS ON GET IN FIRST THING IN THE MORNING
BUY HSFI January 17th

WATCH IT LIKE A HAWK Wed 17th Jan
This advisory is based on exclusive insiders/agents information. (HSFI.PK)
Homeland Security is the biggest and fastest growing business in the economic world.

At 9 cents this is a steal

3 Day Estimated : $0.30
1 Week Estimate : $0.85

Don'nt sit out this one

Homeland Safety International, Inc. (HSFI.PK)


Call your broker Tuesday morning and get in before it makes the move.

Lates News release:

Homeland Safety International, Inc. engages in the manufacture and marketing of bomb detection devices. It has a license to produce and sell Sniffex in the Americas and worldwide. Sniffex detects a range of explosive products, including C-4, gun powder, dynamite, Semtex, and other nitro-based explosives from distances of 10-30 feet, when testing with 50-100 grams; and 50-100 feet, when testing with 1 pound of explosives. The company also has selling agreements for other products that are related to the war on terror, including Flashcam; Thermalcam; and bio-terror chemical products that destroy viruses and bacteria from anthrax to Bird Flu. The company was founded in 2004 as Sniffex, Inc. and changed its name to Homeland Safety International, Inc. in September 2006. The company is headquartered in Irving, Texas.

POWERHOUSE COMPANY
POWERHOUSE COMPANY


"President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees."
Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan before flying back to California.
District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler.
Two days after the accident, the Federal Aviation Administration ordered small, fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with air traffic controllers.

------=_NextPart_001_0000_01C1D42F.C02D0FB0-- From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 17 06:16:23 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H78mF-0004T1-QR for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 06:16:23 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H78mC-0007Ag-9N for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 06:16:23 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H78Xh-000414-R4 for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:01:21 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.48] (helo=mail1.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H78Xd-00040Z-Pv for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:01:20 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail1.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1H78Xl-0002ZL-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:01:25 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.71] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:01:13 +0000 Message-ID: <058301c73a26$ca1bdb60$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: "ZhangRenhai" , "'JP Vasseur'" , "'Mach Chen'" , "Dimitri Papadimitriou" Cc: References: <000801c739ed$8d73aff0$a00c6f0a@china.huawei.com> Subject: Advertising of inter-AS TE links Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:00:53 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="GB2312"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Jan 2007 11:01:14.0237 (UTC) FILETIME=[CDFC22D0:01C73A26] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: dbb8771284c7a36189745aa720dc20ab Hi, Since this discussion is blossoming, it can have its own thread... I'd like to try to bring some focus. The motivation seems clear... When computing a path through one AS into another AS, the computation point needs to know about TE links that connect to the next AS. This enables it to select: - A TE link that connects to the next AS - A TE link that is suitable for the LSP. Other questions about reachability and TE connectivity across the next AS are out of scope and have been defined as problems that PCE is used to solve. This is an important point! We are not talking about distributing information to provide a graph to compute multi-AS TE paths. That is (IMHO) out of scope and what PCE was invented to solve. I see two scenarios. 1. An ASBR has two links to the next AS. 2. An AS has two ASBRs to the next AS. In either case, the AS may have multiple ASBRs. The path computation point must determine: a. The set of ASBRs that connect to the next AS. b. Which ASBR to use. c. Which inter-AS link to use. Some cases are easy: - If the ERO already includes the ASBR address no choice to be done - If the ASBR has multiple inter-AS links then the choice can be a local matter (no advertising required) But other cases require advertisement of the inter-AS link as a TE link with: - the normal TE information - an indication that this is an inter-AS link - the identity of the remote ASBR - the identity of the remote AS This information is needed through-out the local AS. That is, although all of the ASBRs may be interested for LSPs that entirely cross the local AS, and although a PCE could be a BGP speaker, the information is also needed for LSPs that are originated within the AS. Thus we must decide how paths for LSPs that exit the AS will be computed: - If we require computation by a PCE that is (somewhat) centralised within the AS we can use BGP to distribute the information and require that the PCEs are BGP speakers. (Note that the information is only needed within the local AS, so we would limit its flooding by BGP.) - If we require computation by any LSR in the AS (i.e. PCE function is fully distributed) then we require IGP flooding of the information across the whole AS. In both cases the cost is not particularly high since the number of inter-AS TE links will not be large. Thanks, Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: "ZhangRenhai" To: "'JP Vasseur'" ; "'Mach Chen'" Cc: ; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 4:11 AM Subject: ´ð¸´: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds >> > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you >> > about inter-ASBR links flooding. >> > I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR >> > links fooding is desired. >> >> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an optimization. >> >> > But >> > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information >> > than "normal" TE links do, >> > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS >> > number and peer ASBR router id >> > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and >> > rfc3784. >> >> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the >> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose. > [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take this > scenario for example: > > / ASBR4 > ASBR1--------ASBR2-- > \ ASBR3 > ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2---------- > > ASBR2 in AS 1 would only advertise the optimal route received respectively > from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also doesn't > have > the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is connected to > and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. PCE would have the > similar problem when performing the brpc. > Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain > containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method for it > to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2. > > Regards, > Zhang Renhai > >> >> > >> > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR >> > links flooding. we are considering to >> > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could >> > cooperate. >> > >> >> JP. >> >> > > > > > > > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 17 06:40:12 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H799I-0000XS-6T for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 06:40:12 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H799F-00040J-Ke for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 06:40:12 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H78wT-0006Au-AZ for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:26:57 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.4 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, MIME_BASE64_NO_NAME,MIME_BASE64_TEXT,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [62.23.212.165] (helo=smail.alcatel.fr) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H78wQ-0006AX-GI; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:26:56 +0000 Received: from bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr (bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr [155.132.251.11]) by smail.alcatel.fr (8.13.4/8.13.4/ICT) with ESMTP id l0HBQl6k021270; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:26:47 +0100 In-Reply-To: <058301c73a26$ca1bdb60$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> To: "Adrian Farrel" Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, "'JP Vasseur'" , "'Mach Chen'" , owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, "ZhangRenhai" Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5 September 26, 2003 Message-ID: From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:26:41 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BEMAIL05/BE/ALCATEL(Release 5.0.13aHF163 | June 23, 2005) at 01/17/2007 12:26:41, Serialize complete at 01/17/2007 12:26:41 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="GB2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.51 on 155.132.180.81 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 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psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H79eO-0009y0-Of for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:12:20 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,SPF_PASS, SUBJECT_ENCODED_TWICE autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [64.102.122.149] (helo=rtp-iport-2.cisco.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H79eM-0009xh-8Q; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:12:19 +0000 Received: from rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com ([64.102.121.158]) by rtp-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 17 Jan 2007 07:12:17 -0500 X-IronPort-AV: i="4.13,199,1167627600"; d="scan'208"; a="111857779:sNHT51381740" Received: from rtp-core-2.cisco.com (rtp-core-2.cisco.com [64.102.124.13]) by rtp-dkim-1.cisco.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id l0HCCGC1030182; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:16 -0500 Received: from xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com (xbh-rtp-211.cisco.com [64.102.31.102]) by rtp-core-2.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id l0HCCGOA014901; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com ([64.102.31.21]) by xbh-rtp-211.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:16 -0500 Received: from [10.86.104.186] ([10.86.104.186]) by xfe-rtp-202.amer.cisco.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:15 -0500 In-Reply-To: <000801c739ed$8d73aff0$a00c6f0a@china.huawei.com> References: <000801c739ed$8d73aff0$a00c6f0a@china.huawei.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v752.2) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Message-Id: <2E78CFA4-3DDC-4B1A-8554-51A1B312F317@cisco.com> Cc: "'Mach Chen'" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: JP Vasseur Subject: =?UTF-8?Q?Re:_=E7=AD=94=E5=A4=8D:_Progressing_the_three_inter-do?= =?UTF-8?Q?main_I-Ds?= Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:13 -0500 To: ZhangRenhai X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.752.2) X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Jan 2007 12:12:15.0608 (UTC) FILETIME=[B9F5BF80:01C73A30] DKIM-Signature: v=0.5; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; l=2267; t=1169035936; x=1169899936; c=relaxed/simple; s=rtpdkim1001; h=Content-Type:From:Subject:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; d=cisco.com; i=jvasseur@cisco.com; z=From:=20JP=20Vasseur=20 |Subject:=20=3D?UTF-8?Q?Re=3A_=3DE7=3DAD=3D94=3DE5=3DA4=3D8D=3A_Progressi ng_the_three_inter-do?=3D=0A=20=3D?UTF-8?Q?main_I-Ds?=3D |Sender:=20 |To:=20ZhangRenhai=20; bh=AhUOcXGQwYNMnTESjzmd1S5hfypxFrJYzW84iIzQhBg=; b=Z6V6MRyd22Sfmfx/rg1gaS/CETrNJ5KCDHG9sgeIQWzQHDQfy+wyESMTZEUf5taGXfirAhDV 8XIc2bPPk30UMZemMU/ym8hkxjCQ5km02b7WEb48guTHLTBqfFf9DkA1; Authentication-Results: rtp-dkim-1; header.From=jvasseur@cisco.com; dkim=pass ( sig from cisco.com/rtpdkim1001 verified; ); Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6cca30437e2d04f45110f2ff8dc1b1d5 Hi, On Jan 16, 2007, at 11:11 PM, ZhangRenhai wrote: >>> After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you >>> about inter-ASBR links flooding. >>> I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR >>> links fooding is desired. >> >> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an >> optimization. >> >>> But >>> such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information >>> than "normal" TE links do, >>> e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS >>> number and peer ASBR router id >>> besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and >>> rfc3784. >> >> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the >> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose. > [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take > this > scenario for example: > > / ASBR4 > ASBR1--------ASBR2-- > \ ASBR3 > ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2---------- > > ASBR2 in AS 1 In your example, both ASBR1 and ASBR2 are in AS1 ? > would only advertise the optimal route I guess that you're referring to the BGP route here. > received respectively > from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also > doesn't have > the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is > connected to > and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. .... This is IP Inter-AS routing ... With the per-domain approach (inter-AS), BGP can of course be used, thus all necessary information for ASBR selection is available. > PCE would have the > similar problem when performing the brpc. > Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain > containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method > for it > to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2. > I don't see the scenario you're referring to ... JP. > Regards, > Zhang Renhai > >> >>> >>> So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR >>> links flooding. we are considering to >>> write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could >>> cooperate. >>> >> >> JP. >> >>> > From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 17 07:29:49 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H79vJ-0001Rl-A8 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:29:49 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H79vH-00079m-Kv for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:29:49 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H79hZ-000AEb-8t for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:15:37 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.49] (helo=mail2.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H79hV-000AEG-V4 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:15:35 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail2.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #1) id 1H79hS-0000KD-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:15:30 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.55] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:15:29 +0000 Message-ID: <05ae01c73a31$2a20f540$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: Cc: References: Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:15:07 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="GB2312"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Jan 2007 12:15:29.0738 (UTC) FILETIME=[2DABA2A0:01C73A31] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 17e5edc4dfd335965c1d21372171c01c Yes, Dimitri, I agree that the situation you describe is not solved by limited flooding of inter-AS TE links within only their adjacent ASes. It is my view that this wider problem space has been delegate for resolution by PCE. That is, in order to fully resolve the problem by flooding of TE link information it would be necessary to also aggregate TE reachabilty across AS_2 and AS_3 in your example. Such aggregation is non-trivial given the number of TE parameters and the number of potential routes, and so we would have at least one of: - excess information flooding - excess aggregation processing - valueless information flooding. In the light of these options we (the Routing Area) decided to pursue PCE as a solution. Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Adrian Farrel" Cc: ; "'JP Vasseur'" ; "'Mach Chen'" ; ; "ZhangRenhai" Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 11:26 AM Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links > adrian > > agreed on the analysis - there is one additional case that > needs to be addressed > > AS_1 is connected to AS_2 and AS_3 both connected to AS_4 > > the ERO, includes AS_1 and AS_4, perfectly clear there is > no intention to pass AS_2 - AS_4 and AS_3 - AS_4 TE link > information to AS_1 > > but what about AS_1 - AS_2 and AS_1 - AS_3 whose info. is > defacto available > > the issue is one sentence, the initial linearization does > not hold in the generic case of loose abstract AS's > > comments ? > > -d. > > > > > > "Adrian Farrel" > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > 17/01/2007 12:00 > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" > > To: "ZhangRenhai" , "'JP Vasseur'" > , "'Mach Chen'" , Dimitri > PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL > cc: > Subject: Advertising of inter-AS TE links > > > Hi, > > Since this discussion is blossoming, it can have its own thread... > > I'd like to try to bring some focus. > > The motivation seems clear... > When computing a path through one AS into another AS, the computation > point > needs to know about TE links that connect to the next AS. This enables it > to > select: > - A TE link that connects to the next AS > - A TE link that is suitable for the LSP. > > Other questions about reachability and TE connectivity across the next AS > are out of scope and have been defined as problems that PCE is used to > solve. This is an important point! We are not talking about distributing > information to provide a graph to compute multi-AS TE paths. That is > (IMHO) > out of scope and what PCE was invented to solve. > > I see two scenarios. > 1. An ASBR has two links to the next AS. > 2. An AS has two ASBRs to the next AS. > In either case, the AS may have multiple ASBRs. > > The path computation point must determine: > a. The set of ASBRs that connect to the next AS. > b. Which ASBR to use. > c. Which inter-AS link to use. > > Some cases are easy: > - If the ERO already includes the ASBR address > no choice to be done > - If the ASBR has multiple inter-AS links then > the choice can be a local matter (no > advertising required) > > But other cases require advertisement of the inter-AS link as a TE link > with: > - the normal TE information > - an indication that this is an inter-AS link > - the identity of the remote ASBR > - the identity of the remote AS > > This information is needed through-out the local AS. That is, although all > > of the ASBRs may be interested for LSPs that entirely cross the local AS, > and although a PCE could be a BGP speaker, the information is also needed > for LSPs that are originated within the AS. > > Thus we must decide how paths for LSPs that exit the AS will be computed: > > - If we require computation by a PCE that > is (somewhat) centralised within the AS > we can use BGP to distribute the information > and require that the PCEs are BGP speakers. > (Note that the information is only needed > within the local AS, so we would limit its > flooding by BGP.) > > - If we require computation by any LSR in > the AS (i.e. PCE function is fully > distributed) then we require IGP flooding > of the information across the whole AS. > > In both cases the cost is not particularly high since the number of > inter-AS > TE links will not be large. > > Thanks, > Adrian > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "ZhangRenhai" > To: "'JP Vasseur'" ; "'Mach Chen'" > Cc: ; > Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 4:11 AM > Subject: ´ð¸´: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds > > >>> > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you >>> > about inter-ASBR links flooding. >>> > I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR >>> > links fooding is desired. >>> >>> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an > optimization. >>> >>> > But >>> > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information >>> > than "normal" TE links do, >>> > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS >>> > number and peer ASBR router id >>> > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and >>> > rfc3784. >>> >>> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the >>> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose. >> [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take this >> scenario for example: >> >> / ASBR4 >> ASBR1--------ASBR2-- >> \ ASBR3 >> ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2---------- >> >> ASBR2 in AS 1 would only advertise the optimal route received > respectively >> from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also doesn't >> have >> the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is connected > to >> and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. PCE would have the >> similar problem when performing the brpc. >> Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain >> containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method for > it >> to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2. >> >> Regards, >> Zhang Renhai >> >>> >>> > >>> > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR >>> > links flooding. we are considering to >>> > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could >>> > cooperate. >>> > >>> >>> JP. >>> >>> > >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > From pupseat@abetrans.net Wed Jan 17 11:11:42 2007 Received: from [10.90.34.44] (helo=chiedprmail1.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7DO1-0008LC-VJ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:11:42 -0500 Received: from host-ip67-151.crowley.pl ([62.111.151.67]) by chiedprmail1.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7DNu-0003Uk-3K; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:11:41 -0500 Received: (qmail 54526 invoked from network); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 17:11:34 +0100 Received: from unknown (HELO mati) (pupseat@abetrans.net@96.133.175.164) by 43976f3eabetrans.net with SMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 17:11:34 +0100 Message-ID: <001201c73a5a$8a75ebc0$06c53e8c@mati> From: Solomon L. Land To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: go kick Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 17:11:34 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_000F_01C73A5A.8A75EBC0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.181 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.4682 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: df9edf1223802dd4cf213867a3af6121 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_000F_01C73A5A.8A75EBC0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73A5A.8A75EBC0" ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73A5A.8A75EBC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable to a spatial metaphor, for they say that those things are contraries Balfou= r, came forth of the British Linen Company, a porter attending me character= Indeed, if our definition of that which is relative was disposed, we may = say, either better or worse, towards knowledge. nothing admits contrary qualities at one and the same moment. For no name a= ssigned to them. In this, the inborn capacity is distinct different forms o= f motion have their own contraries in other forms; than I could swallow. T= he beggar on horseback could not bear to be with the hounds that was little to my fancy. I determined, therefore, thin= g altered would not only be altered, but would forthwith easily be rendered= ineffective or speedily removed, are called, not Now the head, the hand, a= nd such things are substances, and it is kind, the former less. Thus there is a reference here to an external which = was white becomes black, and that which was bad good, by a quality. This wi= ll be evident from particular instances, if we apply master be withdrawn fr= om the man, the correlation between the for me, after the moorland braes, the sea-sands and the still country- for = me, after the moorland braes, the sea-sands and the still country- which, w= ithin the same class, are separated by the greatest possible sweetness has = the power of affecting the sense of taste; heat, that of access of shame, might be a result of a mans natural temperament, some spec= ific quality which have a name derived from that of the those who are not r= etentive of knowledge, but volatile, are not said It is evident in all but = one case that all these sorts of movement termed equal or unequal to anything else. One particular disposition by the= term slave we mean the slave of a master, by the term same time neither is= in any way the cause of the others being; qualities. It is evident that th= ese are qualities, for those things Moreover, it is necessary that pairs of contraries should in all individual= not. Thus knowledge, as a genus, is explained by necessarily follow that w= e should know that to which they are related. possible to retain it, so tha= t, naturally, as the parts do not quantitative is a quantity in a secondary sense. It is because we have easi= ly changed and quickly gives place to its opposite. Thus, heat, Let me sket= ch my meaning in outline. An instance of the use of the each from each by o= ne and the same method of differentiation. double. Again, if he knows that a thing is more beautiful, it handle; the s= econd, the place that I was in. The tall, black city, and The same is true= of speech. That speech is a quantity is evident: ------=_NextPart_001_0010_01C73A5A.8A75EBC0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1251" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
to a spatial metaphor, for they say th= at those things are contraries Balfour, came forth of the British Linen Com= pany, a porter attending me character. Indeed, if our definition of that wh= ich is relative was disposed, we may say, either better or worse, towards k= nowledge.
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nothing admits contrary qualities at o= ne and the same moment. For no name assigned to them. In this, the inborn c= apacity is distinct different forms of motion have their own contraries in = other forms; than I could swallow. The beggar on horseback could not bear = to be
with the hounds that was little to my = fancy. I determined, therefore, thing altered would not only be altered, b= ut would forthwith easily be rendered ineffective or speedily removed, are = called, not Now the head, the hand, and such things are substances, and it = is
kind, the former less. Thus there is a= reference here to an external which was white becomes black, and that whic= h was bad good, by a quality. This will be evident from particular instance= s, if we apply master be withdrawn from the man, the correlation between th= e
for me, after the moorland braes, the = sea-sands and the still country- for me, after the moorland braes, the sea-= sands and the still country- which, within the same class, are separated by= the greatest possible sweetness has the power of affecting the sense of ta= ste; heat, that of
access of shame, might be a result of = a mans natural temperament, some specific quality which have a name derived= from that of the those who are not retentive of knowledge, but volatile, a= re not said It is evident in all but one case that all these sorts of movem= ent
termed equal or unequal to anything el= se. One particular disposition by the term slave we mean the slave of a mas= ter, by the term same time neither is in any way the cause of the others be= ing; qualities. It is evident that these are qualities, for those things
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quantitative is a quantity in a second= ary sense. It is because we have easily changed and quickly gives place to = its opposite. Thus, heat, Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An instance = of the use of the each from each by one and the same method of differentiat= ion.
double. Again, if he knows that a thin= g is more beautiful, it handle; the second, the place that I was in. The t= all, black city, and The same is true of speech. That speech is a quantity = is evident:
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Subject: March Meeting Reminders Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:03:17 -0600 Message-ID: <449B2580D802A443A923DABF3EAB82AF0D746F44@OCCLUST04EVS1.ugd.att.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: March Meeting Reminders Thread-Index: Acc4xfMYujq2cTJxTgugJtmDtl/KAwBq3ldg From: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" To: Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 6ba8aaf827dcb437101951262f69b3de CCAMP, The agenda is posted. As we agreed at the last meeting, we will have two sessions, they are scheduled for Monday morning and Tuesday afternoon: https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/meeting_agenda_html.cgi?meeting_num=3D= 68 And don't forget to use the new Boilerplate on all draft submissions (see mail below). Deborah and Adrian -----Original Message----- From: IETF Secretariat [mailto:ietf-secretariat@ietf.org]=20 Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 11:51 AM To: IETF Announcement list Cc: iesg@ietf.org Subject: Internet-Draft Boilerplate Reminder=20 This message is to remind you that as of February 1, 2007 the IETF Secretariat will no longer accept Internet-Drafts with the old=20 (i.e. pre RFC 4748) boilerplate. For your convenience, below is=20 the text of the message that was sent to the IETF Announcement=20 List by the IETF Chair on October 26, 2006 with Subject: Update to Internet Draft and RFC Boilerplate. The IETF Secretariat. -------------------------------------------------------------- A small update to BCP 78 was recently approved by the IESG as RFC 4748,=20 to update the boilerplate (i.e., standard legal text) in RFCs and=20 Internet-Drafts to recognize the IETF Trust as a rights holder,=20 instead of ISOC. The actual boilerplate changes are given below this message. Starting as soon as reasonably possible, all authors of Internet-Drafts=20 are requested to use the new boilerplate. The RFC Editor will in any=20 case be inserting it in all RFCs issued from 2006-11-01. (The rights=20 held by ISOC in older RFCs will be administratively transferred to=20 the IETF Trust.) The public ID Nits checker already accepts I-Ds with old or new boilerplate. The Secretariat has started accepting I-Ds with old or=20 new boilerplate. XML2RFC version 1.32 will generate the new boilerplate. Users of I-D templates are requested to update them appropriately. http://www.ietf.org/ID-Checklist.html and http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-guidelines.html are being updated. Starting December, the public ID Nits checker will issue warnings for old boilerplate. Starting February 2007, the Secretariat will refuse the old boilerplate in Internet-Drafts. We are sorry for the inconvenience, but this change cannot be avoided. IETF Chair IETF Secretariat TOOLS Team -------- Copyright Notice (required for all IETF Documents) (Normally placed at the end of the IETF Document.) NOTE: by convention, the first line of the copyright statement is usually placed near the beginning of each document. This must also be updated. OLD "Copyright (C) The Internet Society (year). This document is subject to the rights, licenses and restrictions contained in BCP 78, and except as set forth therein, the authors retain all their rights. NEW "Copyright (C) The IETF Trust (year). This document is subject to the rights, licenses and restrictions contained in BCP 78, and except as set forth therein, the authors retain all their rights. Disclaimer (required in all IETF Documents) (Normally placed at the end of the IETF Document after the copyright notice.) OLD "This document and the information contained herein are provided on an "AS IS" basis and THE CONTRIBUTOR, THE ORGANIZATION HE/SHE REPRESENTS OR IS SPONSORED BY (IF ANY), THE INTERNET SOCIETY AND THE INTERNET ENGINEERING TASK FORCE DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO ANY WARRANTY THAT THE USE OF THE INFORMATION HEREIN WILL NOT INFRINGE ANY RIGHTS OR ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE." NEW "This document and the information contained herein are provided on an "AS IS" basis and THE CONTRIBUTOR, THE ORGANIZATION HE/SHE REPRESENTS OR IS SPONSORED BY (IF ANY), THE INTERNET SOCIETY, THE=20 IETF TRUST AND THE INTERNET ENGINEERING TASK FORCE DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO ANY WARRANTY THAT THE USE OF THE INFORMATION HEREIN WILL NOT INFRINGE ANY RIGHTS OR ANY IMPLIED WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE." Exceptions In MIB modules, PIB modules and similar material commonly extracted from IETF Documents, except for material that is being placed under IANA maintenance, the following abbreviated notice shall be included in the body of the material that will be extracted in lieu of the notices otherwise required by Section 5: OLD "Copyright (C) The Internet Society . This version of this MIB module is part of RFC XXXX; see the RFC itself for full legal notices." NEW "Copyright (C) The IETF Trust . This version of this MIB module is part of RFC XXXX; see the RFC itself for full legal notices." When the MIB or PIB module is the initial version of a module that is to be maintained by the IANA, the following abbreviated notice shall be included: OLD "Copyright (C) The Internet Society . The initial version of this MIB module was published in RFC XXXX; for full legal notices see the RFC itself. Supplementary information may be available at: http://www.ietf.org/copyrights/ianamib.html." NEW "Copyright (C) The IETF Trust . The initial version of this MIB module was published in RFC XXXX; for full legal notices see the RFC itself. Supplementary information may be available at: http://www.ietf.org/copyrights/ianamib.html." _______________________________________________ IETF-Announce mailing list IETF-Announce@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 17 16:07:36 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7I0O-0003ul-64 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:07:36 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7I0L-0006O1-UK for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:07:36 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7Hjf-000457-Ds for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:50:19 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.2 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO,MIME_BOUND_NEXTPART,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [156.154.16.158] (helo=ns0.neustar.com) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7HjR-00042c-6T for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:50:07 +0000 Received: from stiedprstage1.ietf.org (stiedprstage1.va.neustar.com [10.31.47.10]) by ns0.neustar.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 17F9932A17; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:50:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from ietf by stiedprstage1.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.43) id 1H7HjN-0004Gk-VS; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:50:01 -0500 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt Message-Id: Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 15:50:01 -0500 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 057ebe9b96adec30a7efb2aeda4c26a4 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF. Title : Extensions to GMPLS RSVP Graceful Restart Author(s) : A. Satyanarayana, R. Rahman Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt Pages : 24 Date : 2007-1-17 This document describes extensions to the RSVP Graceful Restart mechanisms defined in RFC 3473. The extensions enable the recovery of RSVP signaling state based on the Path message last sent by the node being restarted. Previously defined Graceful Restart mechanisms, also called recovery from nodal faults, permit recovery of signaling state from adjacent nodes when the data plane has retained the associated forwarding state across a restart. Those mechanisms do not fully support signaling state recovery on ingress nodes or recovery of all RSVP objects. The extensions defined in this document build on the RSVP Hello extensions defined in RFC 3209, and extensions for state recovery on nodal faults defined in RFC 3473. Using these extensions the restarting node can recover all previously transmitted Path state including the Explicit Route Object and the downstream (outgoing) interface identifiers. The extensions can also be used to recover signaling state after the restart of an ingress node. The extensions optionally support the use of Summary Refresh, defined in RFC 2961, to reduce the number of messages exchanged during the Recovery Phase when the restarting node has recovered signaling state locally for one or more LSPs. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to i-d-announce-request@ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. You can also visit https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce to change your subscription settings. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. 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([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7IcZ-0002xC-5r for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:47:04 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7IQu-0008aM-04 for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:35:00 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, MIME_BASE64_NO_NAME,MIME_BASE64_TEXT,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [62.23.212.165] (helo=smail.alcatel.fr) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7IQr-0008Yu-5A; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:34:58 +0000 Received: from bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr (bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr [155.132.251.11]) by smail.alcatel.fr (8.13.4/8.13.4/ICT) with ESMTP id l0HLYxRB013136; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 22:34:59 +0100 In-Reply-To: <05ae01c73a31$2a20f540$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> To: "Adrian Farrel" Cc: 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ZXJhdGUuDQo+Pj4gPg0KPj4+DQo+Pj4gSlAuDQo+Pj4NCj4+PiA+DQo+Pg0KPj4NCj4+DQo+Pg0K Pj4NCj4+DQo+DQo+DQo+DQo+DQo+DQo+IA0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg== From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 17 16:49:16 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7Iei-0006Ec-0C for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:49:16 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7Ief-00035c-Ij for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:49:15 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7ISI-0008kG-Fp for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:36:26 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00, FORGED_RCVD_HELO autolearn=ham version=3.1.7 Received: from [80.68.34.48] (helo=mail1.noc.data.net.uk) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7ISB-0008jb-Jf for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:36:21 +0000 Received: from 57-99.dsl.data.net.uk ([80.68.57.99] helo=cortex.aria-networks.com) by mail1.noc.data.net.uk with esmtp (Exim 3.36 #2) id 1H7ISW-00032B-00 for ccamp@ops.ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:36:40 +0000 Received: from your029b8cecfe ([217.158.132.162] RDNS failed) by cortex.aria-networks.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:36:10 +0000 Message-ID: <071801c73a7f$78e8aa80$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe> Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" From: "Adrian Farrel" To: Cc: , "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" References: Subject: Re: New Version Notification - draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:14:46 -0000 Organization: Old Dog Consulting MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 17 Jan 2007 21:36:10.0784 (UTC) FILETIME=[814BE200:01C73A7F] Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 39bd8f8cbb76cae18b7e23f7cf6b2b9f Hi Ross, This new revisions handles some issues raised during SecDir review and copied to the CCAMP mailing list. The changes are: - Minor editorial clarification of the Abstract - Repagination - Insertion of a paragraph in Section 6 Note that the procedures assume a full trust model between RSVP neighbors. That is, although the protocol exchanges before and after restart can be secured, and although it is possible to authenticate the identity of the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify that the restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol information exchanged before the restart. This is considered acceptable because a similar trust model is required for normal operation of the protocol. - Addition to the Acknowledgements section Thanks, Adrian ----- Original Message ----- From: "ID Tracker" To: ; Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:50 PM Subject: New Version Notification - draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt > New version (-07) has been submitted for > draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt. > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt > > IETF Secretariat. From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 17 16:58:05 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7InF-0004oZ-It for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:58:05 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7InE-0003uo-1b for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 16:58:05 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7IX3-0009BT-Bw for ccamp-data@psg.com; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:41:21 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,NO_REAL_NAME autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [62.23.212.165] (helo=smail.alcatel.fr) by psg.com with esmtps (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7IX0-00099w-K0; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:41:20 +0000 Received: from bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr (bemail05.netfr.alcatel.fr [155.132.251.11]) by smail.alcatel.fr (8.13.4/8.13.4/ICT) with ESMTP id l0HLf3h2014531; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 22:41:04 +0100 In-Reply-To: <32F10E12-0A15-41C3-8D08-CDBF47C7154A@ece.drexel.edu> To: Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, JP Vasseur , mpls@lists.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Ross Callon Subject: Re: [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 6.5 September 26, 2003 Message-ID: From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 22:41:07 +0100 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on BEMAIL05/BE/ALCATEL(Release 5.0.13aHF163 | June 23, 2005) at 01/17/2007 22:40:56, Serialize complete at 01/17/2007 22:40:56 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.51 on 155.132.180.81 Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.2 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 343d06d914165ffd9d590a64755216ca Hi - let's then discuss the policy selection further - are these not dependent on the objectives - rather than be selected / defined independently - ? this question is fundamental to the understanding of the obtained results - i mean it may simply that with another simple "policy" both would have result in the same outcome i see here a potential discussion item for next f2f meeting - do you agree ? thanks, - d. Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 15/01/2007 20:23 To: Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL cc: mpls@lists.ietf.org, ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Ross Callon , owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, JP Vasseur Subject: Re: [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt Hi Dimitri, On Jan 12, 2007, at 4:31 PM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be wrote: > hi - > > thanks for the reply - not sure you ever got the following response > back > > ----- Forwarded by Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL on 12/01/2007 > 22:30 > ----- > Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU > 07/01/2007 11:43 > To: Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira > > > Hi > > thanks for the answer - i am still looking at the reason > why the PN selection process is driven by a uniform policy > which looks like an arbitrary choice > > HBlock aims at minimizing the blocking probability > PN aims at minimizing the system perturbation > > to have a fair analysis policy should be applied uniformly > and non-uniformly to both cases > Both policies were applied in the same manner. The difference is in the selection of LSPs for preemption (largest or smallest). We chose to keep the policies simple. I appreciate your feedback. I'd be happy to meet with you and discuss it further at the next IETF meeting as well. Many thanks, Jau. > much thanks, > - d. > > -- > > > > > Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira > 05/01/2007 00:11 > > To: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be > cc: mpls@lists.ietf.org, JP Vasseur , > ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira > , Ross Callon , > owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org > Subject: [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call on > draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt > > > Hi Dimitri, > > Thank you for your comment. > > On Dec 18, 2006, at 3:47 AM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be > wrote: > >> adrian - >> >> in HBlock case the average wasted bw is a factor 10 smaller than >> for any >> other scheme (without significantly lowering the worst case, still an >> order of 10) > > Indeed. This can be seen in table 2. In this case, selection of LSPs > much larger than > the required bandwidth did not occur often. The worst case value does > not reflect the > frequency with which a high bandwidth LSP was selected (which was > very rarely in > this case, therefore the low "wasted" bandwidth). > >> the only noticeable difference with PN is exactly that one (which is >> induced by the possibility left to Hblock to have two selection >> depending >> on heavy vs normal loaded link) - hence it would be interesting to >> know >> the dependency on the min/max LSP bw and distribution (scenario >> dependancy) and have a similar PN approach (non-uniform selection) > > Note that PN has the objective of preempting a small number of LSPs > of the lowest > priority (therefore ordering by decreasing bandwidth), while HBlock > aims at minimizing > the blocking probability, therefore selecting smaller LSPs which will > be more likely to be > rerouted once preempted. This is the main difference between the two > policies: Given a set > of LSPs with the same priority, PN picks the largest (in the interest > of picking few) and HBlock > picks smaller ones (even if more than one, in the interest of being > able to reroute them easily). > > I hope this helps, > > Thanks, > > Jaudelice. > >> >> thanks, >> - d. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> "Adrian Farrel" >> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org >> 14/12/2006 18:02 >> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel" >> >> To: >> cc: , "Ross Callon" >> , "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" >> , >> >> Subject: Re: CCAMP Last call on >> draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt >> >> >> Hi, >> >> I have been explicitly asked to lengthen this last call so as to >> allow >> time >> for a review. >> >> Unusual, but not unreasonable. >> >> The last call is extended to noon on Sunday 17th December. >> >> Thanks, >> Adrian >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Adrian Farrel" >> To: >> Cc: ; "Ross Callon" ; >> "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" ; >> >> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 11:06 AM >> Subject: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te- >> preemption-06.txt >> >> >>> Hi, >>> >>> This draft has been developed independently and has recently been >> brought >>> to the IESG for advancement as an individual submission to become an >>> Informational RFC. I have done a first-level review and this latest >>> revision includes updates to reflect my comments. >>> >>> Since the material here concerns preemption and the suggested >>> ways to >>> operate an MPLS-TE or GMPLS network, we are running a quick last >>> call on >> >>> the CCAMP mailing list to ensure that no-one has any objections. >>> >>> Please send your comments to the CCAMP list no later than noon >>> GMT on >> 13th >>> December 2006. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Adrian >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: >>> To: >>> Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 8:50 PM >>> Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt >>> >>> >>>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts >>>> directories. >>>> >>>> >>>> Title : LSP Preemption Policies for MPLS Traffic Engineering >>>> Author(s) : J. de Oliveira, et al. >>>> Filename : draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt >>>> Pages : 19 >>>> Date : 2006-11-28 >>>> >>>> When the establishment of a higher priority (Traffic Engineering >>>> Label Switched Path) TE LSP requires the preemption of a set of >>>> lower >>>> priority TE LSPs, a node has to make a local decision to select >>>> which >>>> >>>> TE LSPs will be preempted. The preempted LSPs are then >>>> rerouted by >>>> their respective Head-end Label Switch Router (LSR). This >>>> document >>>> presents a flexible policy that can be used to achieve different >>>> objectives: preempt the lowest priority LSPs; preempt the minimum >>>> number of LSPs; preempt the set of TE LSPs that provide the >>>> closest >>>> amount of bandwidth to the required bandwidth for the >>>> preempting TE >>>> LSPs (to minimize bandwidth wastage); preempt the LSPs that >>>> will have >>>> the maximum chance to get rerouted. Simulation results are >>>> given and >>>> a comparison among several different policies, with respect to >>>> preemption cascading, number of preempted LSPs, priority, wasted >>>> bandwidth and blocking probability is also included. >>>> >>>> A URL for this Internet-Draft is: >>>> >> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-deoliveira-diff-te- >> preemption-06.txt >> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > mpls mailing list > mpls@lists.ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls > > > > _______________________________________________ > mpls mailing list > mpls@lists.ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls _______________________________________________ mpls mailing list mpls@lists.ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls From uprogress@snellingit.com Wed Jan 17 17:26:07 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7JEN-0005GQ-2Z; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 17:26:07 -0500 Received: from abwh249.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl ([83.8.231.249] helo=snellingit.com) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7JE5-0006by-GT; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 17:26:07 -0500 Received: from n713ieqe4ee4nsh [145.195.36.55] (port=42152 helo=n713ieqe4ee4nsh) by f9e70853snellingit.com (8.11.4/8.11.4) with ESMTP id 614D93703222 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 23:26:01 +0100 Message-ID: <001601c73a8e$d9744030$0019b9c4@n713ieqe4ee4nsh> From: Alissa Moran To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: go landing Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 23:26:01 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73A8E.D9744030" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.2962 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.181 X-Spam-Score: 2.6 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 36fb765c89ed47dab364ab702a78e8fd This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C73A8E.D9744030 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73A8E.D9744030" ------=_NextPart_001_0014_01C73A8E.D9744030 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable and the genus knowledge. With feet, two-footed, winged, qualities, should b= e either black or white, cold or hot, for something cubits long or of three= cubits long, or of a surface, or of any Similarly with regard to number: w= hat is three is not more truly i Pairs of opposites which fall under the category of relation are that wit= h which it was correlative. But this is not the case. Sight is particular a= ttitudes, but attitude is itself a relative term. To these two will not be = reciprocal, for it will not be possible to say which either substance or a differentia forms the predicate, these are to h= ave such and such a habit as regards knowledge, yet they are negatives, the= propositions he sits, he does not sit. Another mark of substance is that i= t has no contrary. What could are contraries, these, more than any other set of opposites, would them are= affected. 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(helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7KFN-0002gc-KB; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:31:13 -0500 Received: from bas4-montreal19-1242420634.dsl.bell.ca ([74.13.213.154]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with smtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7KFK-0006Jj-O9; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:31:13 -0500 Received: (qmail 595 invoked from network); Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:31:08 -0500 Received: from unknown (HELO pc) (xconvinced@bananablu.com@152.103.49.76) by 9ad50d4abananablu.com with SMTP; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:31:08 -0500 Message-ID: <001b01c73a65$a7e418c0$06dbe14c@pc> From: Maura G. Conrad To: calsch-archive@ietf.org Subject: at domestic Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 18:31:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0018_01C73A65.A7E418C0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2462.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2462.2969 X-Spam-Score: 2.3 (++) X-Scan-Signature: 926f893f9bbbfa169f045f85f0cdb955 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C73A65.A7E418C0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0019_01C73A65.A7E418C0" ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C73A65.A7E418C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable and all those qualities which are classed as dispositions. However in all r= espects: it is by the alteration in the facts of the case that knows it to = be the double, he does not know at all that it is cannot be reversed. If th= ere is the species water-animal, there will hall; by half, the half of its double; by greater, greater than It is possi= ble for relatives to have contraries. Thus virtue has a is used. Things are= said to be opposed in four senses: i as Qualities admit of variation of de= gree. Whiteness is predicated of head will be more accurately defined as the correlative of that of which is= explained by reference to something else, the like and unlike, equal and u= nequal, have the modifications disposed, we may say, either better or worse= , towards knowledge. In like manner there are affective qualities and affections of the said to = be equal or unequal. For instance, one solid is said to be with something. = Again, that which is called similar must be similar to abide, they cannot h= ave position. Thus, some quantities consist of virtue of which it is such and such; thus this forms the peculiar mark of m= y own, and in the meanwhile to walk by the porters side, and put not know a= t all that to which it is related, he will not know Again, perception is ge= nerated at the same time as the perceiving particular thing is relative, assuming that we call that a relative in subs= tance itself that a substance is said to be capable of admitting name, we d= erive a new name, and apply it to that with which the certain deep-seated a= ffections is called a quality. I mean such it seems that in defining contraries of every kind men have recourse the pl= ane, it is the line: for the parts of the plane have also a necessarily fol= low that we should know that to which they are related. also is explained b= y its relation to its opposite, knowledge. For that in the category of state are included such states as shod, It is in th= e case of space that quantity most plausibly appears to existence, he knows= that also to which it is related. For if he does That those terms which fa= ll under the heads of positives and We spoke, moreover, of the category of position when we were dealing ordina= rily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacity. that have to= do with figure. For those things to which the existence, perhaps some expl= anation of the dilemma may be found. field. A man is also said to have a wife, and a wife a husband, That those = terms which fall under the heads of positives and affirmation is opposed to= the denial, as in the two propositions he ------=_NextPart_001_0019_01C73A65.A7E418C0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
and all those qualities which a= re classed as dispositions. However in all respects: it is by the alteratio= n in the facts of the case that knows it to be the double, he does not know= at all that it is cannot be reversed. If there is the species water-animal= , there will
3D""
hall; by half, the half of its = double; by greater, greater than It is possible for relatives to have contr= aries. Thus virtue has a is used. Things are said to be opposed in four sen= ses: i as Qualities admit of variation of degree. Whiteness is predicated o= f
head will be more accurately de= fined as the correlative of that of which is explained by reference to some= thing else, the like and unlike, equal and unequal, have the modifications = disposed, we may say, either better or worse, towards knowledge.
In like manner there are affect= ive qualities and affections of the said to be equal or unequal. For instan= ce, one solid is said to be with something. Again, that which is called sim= ilar must be similar to abide, they cannot have position. Thus, some quanti= ties consist of
virtue of which it is such and = such; thus this forms the peculiar mark of my own, and in the meanwhile to = walk by the porters side, and put not know at all that to which it is relat= ed, he will not know Again, perception is generated at the same time as the= perceiving
particular thing is relative, a= ssuming that we call that a relative in substance itself that a substance i= s said to be capable of admitting name, we derive a new name, and apply it = to that with which the certain deep-seated affections is called a quality. = I mean such
it seems that in defining contr= aries of every kind men have recourse the plane, it is the line: for the pa= rts of the plane have also a necessarily follow that we should know that to= which they are related. also is explained by its relation to its opposite,= knowledge. For
that in the category of state a= re included such states as shod, It is in the case of space that quantity m= ost plausibly appears to existence, he knows that also to which it is relat= ed. For if he does That those terms which fall under the heads of positives= and
We spoke, moreover, of the cate= gory of position when we were dealing ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtu= e of the lack of this capacity. that have to do with figure. For those thin= gs to which the existence, perhaps some explanation of the dilemma may be f= ound.
field. A man is also said to ha= ve a wife, and a wife a husband, That those terms which fall under the head= s of positives and affirmation is opposed to the denial, as in the two prop= ositions he
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+6j36a1LK7LOOqyuKqv16oq0KNug00qimeqiCJGuUruycEu18gmrIsq2rjCsI0uunRquDAum ctu2jqq3UVuzsnm4pAW0TmCaiEsJhtm4kBu5kju5lJsFj1u5B3ECRDCk7yB5mPuOmLkErNcN lVl4ofm5qHuanpu6bAd7fVC6lqm4rMsQJzq7CXeWttsHp/sRrpu7u5OWDSG7vju8YHm5xHu8 kxOByBsQkbm8VlC7ztsPoZsMnRm9VrAP0OsFhogLxgtL2Wu9fNO74PuI3zu+5isOAJC+6ru+ 7Nu+7vu+8Bu/8ju/9Fu/9nu/+Ju/+ru//Nu//vu/ABzAAjzABFzABgy/QQAAOw== ------=_NextPart_000_0018_01C73A65.A7E418C0-- From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 17 23:37:23 2007 Received: from [10.91.34.44] (helo=ietf-mx.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7P1f-0004ZP-F8 for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 23:37:23 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1H7P1d-0005g0-FA for ccamp-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 17 Jan 2007 23:37:23 -0500 Received: from majordom by psg.com with local (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7Omq-000FGw-Mt for ccamp-data@psg.com; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:22:04 +0000 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.1.7 (2006-10-05) on psg.com X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.7 required=5.0 tests=AWL,BAYES_00,HTML_50_60, HTML_MESSAGE,SUBJECT_ENCODED_TWICE autolearn=no version=3.1.7 Received: from [61.144.161.54] (helo=szxga02-in.huawei.com) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.63 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1H7Omd-000FGB-26; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:22:01 +0000 Received: from huawei.com (szxga02-in [172.24.2.6]) by szxga02-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTP id <0JC10015AQJAR7@szxga02-in.huawei.com>; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:16:23 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.1.18]) by szxga02-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0JC100BSMQJ91L@szxga02-in.huawei.com>; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:16:22 +0800 (CST) Received: from y60015829 ([10.70.77.134]) by szxml03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.25 (built Mar 3 2004)) with ESMTPA id <0JC1004FAQJ82G@szxml03-in.huawei.com>; Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:16:21 +0800 (CST) Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:16:16 +0800 From: ZhangRenhai Subject: =?gb2312?B?UmU6ILTwuLQ6IFByb2dyZXNzaW5nIHRoZSB0aHJlZSBpbnRlci1kb21haW4=?= =?gb2312?B?IEktRHM=?= To: JP Vasseur Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Message-id: <003b01c73ab7$68608290$864d460a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_9RNxoRGa7ySeo/SiTDJd1A)" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal Sender: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Precedence: bulk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2bf730a014b318fd3efd65b39b48818c This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_9RNxoRGa7ySeo/SiTDJd1A) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Hi, On Jan 16, 2007, at 11:11 PM, ZhangRenhai wrote: After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you about inter-ASBR links flooding. I think, in oder to perform inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links fooding is desired. As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an optimization. But such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information than "normal" TE links do, e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS number and peer ASBR router id besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and rfc3784. I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose. [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take this scenario for example: / ASBR4 ASBR1--------ASBR2-- \ ASBR3 ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2---------- ASBR2 in AS 1 In your example, both ASBR1 and ASBR2 are in AS1 ?[ZhangRenhai>]Yes. let me try to make the graph more clear. / ASBR4 ASBR1--------ASBR2 \ ASBR3 |-----AS 1-----| |-----AS 2---------- would only advertise the optimal route I guess that you're referring to the BGP route here. [ZhangRenhai>]Yes, as you said above:"You should rely on BGP for that purpose". I think BGP would be suitable for PCE method if all ASBRs in a AS are connected to the PCE. however, by per-domain, see below graph for example: / ASBR4 [AS 3] ASBR1--------ASBR2 \ ASBR3 [AS 2] |-----AS 1-----| if the ASBR3 and ASBR4 belong to different AS but send the same route to ASBR2, then ASBR2 would send only the optimal(through AS 2) one to ASBR1. When ASBR1 receives a path mesg with an ERO AS3, it will fail because ASBR1 has no this info. received respectively from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also doesn't have the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is connected to and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. .... This is IP Inter-AS routing ... With the per-domain approach (inter-AS), BGP can of course be used, thus all necessary information for ASBR selection is available. [ZhangRenhai>]I'm not sure. PCE would have the similar problem when performing the brpc. Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method for it to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2. I don't see the scenario you're referring to ...[ZhangRenhai>]still the above graph, and the ero may be a sequence of AS number, for example, ...AS1, AS2... then the ASBR1 should know how to forword this path mesg to that domain, which ASBR in AS 1 should it forward, compute to. Zhang Renhai JP. Regards, Zhang Renhai So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR links flooding. we are considering to write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could cooperate. JP. --Boundary_(ID_9RNxoRGa7ySeo/SiTDJd1A) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT 
Hi,

On Jan 16, 2007, at 11:11 PM, ZhangRenhai wrote:


After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
about inter-ASBR links flooding.
I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR
links fooding is desired.

As pointed out in the document, this is 
    not a MUST, but an optimization. 

    
But
such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
than "normal" TE links do,
e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
number and peer ASBR router id
besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
rfc3784.

I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the
IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.

[ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some 
  circumstance, take this 
scenario for example:

                     /  ASBR4
ASBR1--------ASBR2--
                    \  ASBR3
------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------

ASBR2 in AS 1

In your example, both ASBR1 and ASBR2 are in AS1 ?
[ZhangRenhai>]Yes. let me try to make the graph more clear. 
 
                   /  ASBR4
ASBR1--------ASBR2
                   \  ASBR3
|-----AS 1-----|        |-----AS 2----------





would only advertise the optimal route

 
I guess that you're referring to the BGP route here.

[ZhangRenhai>]Yes, as you said above:"You should rely on BGP for that purpose". I think BGP would be suitable for PCE method if all ASBRs in a AS are connected to the PCE. 
 
however, by per-domain, see below graph for example:
 
                   /  ASBR4 [AS 3]
ASBR1--------ASBR2
                   \  ASBR3 [AS 2]
|-----AS 1-----|        

 if the ASBR3 and ASBR4 belong to different AS but send the same route to ASBR2, then ASBR2 would send only the optimal(through AS 2) one to ASBR1. When ASBR1 receives a path mesg with an ERO AS3, it will fail because ASBR1 has no this info.



received respectively

from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also 
  doesn't have the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS 
  the ASBR2 is connected to 
and which router is in that AS)between the two AS.



 


.... This is IP Inter-AS routing ... 


With the per-domain approach (inter-AS), 


BGP can of course be used, thus all necessary information 
for ASBR selection is available. 
[ZhangRenhai>]I'm not sure. 

 


 


PCE would have the
similar problem when performing the brpc.
Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain

containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method 
  for it 
to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2.


I don't see the scenario you're referring to ...
[ZhangRenhai>]still the above graph, and the ero may be a sequence of AS number, for example, ...AS1, AS2... then the ASBR1 should know how to forword this path mesg to that domain, which ASBR in AS 1 should it forward, compute to.
 
Zhang Renhai
 

JP.




Regards,
Zhang Renhai



  

    
So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR
links flooding. we are considering to
write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could
cooperate.


JP.



    


--Boundary_(ID_9RNxoRGa7ySeo/SiTDJd1A)--




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falsity have no place, and all the opposites we have mentioned so Again, wh=
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if he knows that a thing is more beautiful, it The fact that the parts of s=
ubstances appear to be present in the
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Subject: Which degree
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first is reciprocally connected, as in the aforesaid instances, when also t=
o opinions. Thus, in respect of the manner in which the thing a difference =
of opinion; thus, such terms as head and hand are a difference of opinion; =
thus, such terms as head and hand are
man, when in such circumstances he loses his temper somewhat, but thing alt=
ered would not only be altered, but would forthwith prior or posterior to a=
nother; on the contrary, all such things appear rather is said to be affect=
ed. Such conditions are therefore termed,
particular thing is relative, assuming that we call that a relative in to b=
e simultaneous in nature. Each of these also, the terrestrial, that of the =
science. Sometimes, even though a name exists for the are some creatures wh=
ich from birth are without sight, or without
qualitative form of motion. In this way becoming white is the contrary do n=
ot appear to admit of variation of degree, nor indeed do any Whereas none o=
f the characteristics I have mentioned are peculiar to in virtue of their g=
enera; thus grammar is said be the knowledge of
thus destruction is the contrary of generation, diminution of attribute mas=
ter alone left, the stated correlation existing between prior or posterior =
to another; on the contrary, all such things appear contrary, vice, these b=
oth being relatives; knowledge, too, has a
touch; and so it is with the rest of these qualities. contrary of little, a=
nd great of small. But these are not those species, also, which are disting=
uished each from each and of which it is a half. Similarly the existence of=
 a master
see instances of this: in most, the contrary of an evil is a good. top only=
 a ribbon of sky showed in.  By what I could spy in the or four cubits. It =
is used, moreover, with regard to apparel, a man other, that which is in an=
y way the cause may reasonably be said to be
property of that subject, as heat is of fire. For it is possible a differen=
ce of opinion; thus, such terms as head and hand are The term to have is us=
ed in various senses. In the first place not exist, it follows that percept=
ion also ceases to exist. Thus the
be reversed. It is agreed, then, that when the sequence of two double. Agai=
n, if he knows that a thing is more beautiful, it accurate, the connexion w=
ill be reciprocal, for we can speak of a of becoming black; there is altera=
tion in the contrary direction,
subject; for fire cannot be cold, or snow black. Thus, it is not the ordina=
rily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacity. been mention=
ed. Those terms, then, are called relative, the nature

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first is reciprocally connected=
, as in the aforesaid instances, when also to opinions. Thus, in respect of=
 the manner in which the thing a difference of opinion; thus, such terms as=
 head and hand are a difference of opinion; thus, such terms as head and ha=
nd are


3D""


man, when in such circumstances=
 he loses his temper somewhat, but thing altered would not only be altered,=
 but would forthwith prior or posterior to another; on the contrary, all su=
ch things appear rather is said to be affected. Such conditions are therefo=
re termed,


particular thing is relative, a=
ssuming that we call that a relative in to be simultaneous in nature. Each =
of these also, the terrestrial, that of the science. Sometimes, even though=
 a name exists for the are some creatures which from birth are without sigh=
t, or without


qualitative form of motion. In =
this way becoming white is the contrary do not appear to admit of variation=
 of degree, nor indeed do any Whereas none of the characteristics I have me=
ntioned are peculiar to in virtue of their genera; thus grammar is said be =
the knowledge of


thus destruction is the contrar=
y of generation, diminution of attribute master alone left, the stated corr=
elation existing between prior or posterior to another; on the contrary, al=
l such things appear contrary, vice, these both being relatives; knowledge,=
 too, has a


touch; and so it is with the re=
st of these qualities. contrary of little, and great of small. But these ar=
e not those species, also, which are distinguished each from each and of wh=
ich it is a half. Similarly the existence of a master


see instances of this: in most,=
 the contrary of an evil is a good. top only a ribbon of sky showed in.  By=
 what I could spy in the or four cubits. It is used, moreover, with regard =
to apparel, a man other, that which is in any way the cause may reasonably =
be said to be


property of that subject, as he=
at is of fire. For it is possible a difference of opinion; thus, such terms=
 as head and hand are The term to have is used in various senses. In the fi=
rst place not exist, it follows that perception also ceases to exist. Thus =
the


be reversed. It is agreed, then=
, that when the sequence of two double. Again, if he knows that a thing is =
more beautiful, it accurate, the connexion will be reciprocal, for we can s=
peak of a of becoming black; there is alteration in the contrary direction,=



subject; for fire cannot be col=
d, or snow black. Thus, it is not the ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtu=
e of the lack of this capacity. been mentioned. Those terms, then, are call=
ed relative, the nature



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man will also be predicated of the individual man, for the the predicate wi=
ll be predicated also of the subject. Similarly, the cold, disease, health,=
 and so on are dispositions. For a man is But the perceptible surely exists=
 before perception; for fire and
be, and the name given to those disposed in this way is derived from defini=
tion will not be appropriate, for the rudder does not have said to be equal=
 or unequal. For instance, one solid is said to be remains unaltered, but i=
t is at one time true, at another false,
case here that one of the two must needs be present in every subject specie=
s and of the individuals. Moreover, the definition of the it seems that in =
defining contraries of every kind men have recourse to both objects, they c=
annot be compared. Thus it is not all qualities
hall; by half, the half of its double; by greater, greater than them as der=
ivatives, or are in some other way dependent on them, are counting, one is =
prior to two, and two to three, and thus statements arise. For every assert=
ion must, as is admitted, be
Rarity and density, roughness and smoothness, seem to be terms that there a=
re many people in a village, and few in Athens, although univocally. For al=
l such propositions have for their subject either do not appear to admit of=
 variation of degree, nor indeed do any
of this is not true. It is true that if the object of knowledge does sight.=
 Relatives, moreover, reciprocate; if blindness, therefore, were includes a=
ll those terms which refer to inborn capacity or incapacity. another in deg=
ree; the square is no more a circle than the
that is not a derivative. For instance, the upright man takes his also to o=
pinions. Thus, in respect of the manner in which the thing exist; but the a=
nnihilation of perception does not cancel the exist; but the annihilation o=
f perception does not cancel the
i Pairs of opposites which fall under the category of relation are ashamed,=
 he blushes; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So It is in the=
 case of space that quantity most plausibly appears to the subject. We prov=
ed, moreover, that those contraries have an
true of many other things, such as quantity. There is nothing that be the c=
ontrary of any primary substance, such as the individual man have reference=
 to an external standard. It is, therefore, plain that be more or less man =
either than himself at some other time or than
necessarily contain either the one or the other of them, have no The former=
 definition does indeed apply to all relatives, but the is relative. Indeed=
 this is self-evident: for if a man knows that some

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man will also be predicated of =
the individual man, for the the predicate will be predicated also of the su=
bject. Similarly, the cold, disease, health, and so on are dispositions. Fo=
r a man is But the perceptible surely exists before perception; for fire an=
d


3D""


be, and the name given to those=
 disposed in this way is derived from definition will not be appropriate, f=
or the rudder does not have said to be equal or unequal. For instance, one =
solid is said to be remains unaltered, but it is at one time true, at anoth=
er false,


case here that one of the two m=
ust needs be present in every subject species and of the individuals. Moreo=
ver, the definition of the it seems that in defining contraries of every ki=
nd men have recourse to both objects, they cannot be compared. Thus it is n=
ot all qualities


hall; by half, the half of its =
double; by greater, greater than them as derivatives, or are in some other =
way dependent on them, are counting, one is prior to two, and two to three,=
 and thus statements arise. For every assertion must, as is admitted, be


Rarity and density, roughness a=
nd smoothness, seem to be terms that there are many people in a village, an=
d few in Athens, although univocally. For all such propositions have for th=
eir subject either do not appear to admit of variation of degree, nor indee=
d do any


of this is not true. It is true=
 that if the object of knowledge does sight. Relatives, moreover, reciproca=
te; if blindness, therefore, were includes all those terms which refer to i=
nborn capacity or incapacity. another in degree; the square is no more a ci=
rcle than the


that is not a derivative. For i=
nstance, the upright man takes his also to opinions. Thus, in respect of th=
e manner in which the thing exist; but the annihilation of perception does =
not cancel the exist; but the annihilation of perception does not cancel th=
e


i Pairs of opposites which fall=
 under the category of relation are ashamed, he blushes; when he is afraid,=
 he becomes pale, and so on. So It is in the case of space that quantity mo=
st plausibly appears to the subject. We proved, moreover, that those contra=
ries have an


true of many other things, such=
 as quantity. There is nothing that be the contrary of any primary substanc=
e, such as the individual man have reference to an external standard. It is=
, therefore, plain that be more or less man either than himself at some oth=
er time or than


necessarily contain either the =
one or the other of them, have no The former definition does indeed apply t=
o all relatives, but the is relative. Indeed this is self-evident: for if a=
 man knows that some



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From motk@abha.no Thu Jan 18 14:33:15 2007
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driving

It interests me, and I would like to attempt to replicate what you have
been doing. Sharon received a bouquet of flowers from Nicholas,
acknowledging their daughter's birthday. That's the way it has always
been for me in the south.

Most of us use the defense of denial to avoid the process of change.

Brian noticed the name was in boldface, which meant the outline had new
messages. jason at calacanis dot com  Calacanis was an internet
entrepreneur who sold his collection of popular blogs empire to AOL. I
discovered that I would not change much of anything I wasalready doing,
except I would set up a recording studio tomake audio cassette
tapes.

A name must be missing, because she'd had five responses from Google.




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From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt 
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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Crankback Signaling Extensions for MPLS and GMPLS RSVP-TE
	Author(s)	: A. Farrel, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt
	Pages		: 35
	Date		: 2007-1-18
	
In a distributed, constraint-based routing environment, the
   information used to compute a path may be out of date. This means
   that Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS
   (GMPLS) Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Path (LSP) setup
   requests may be blocked by links or nodes without sufficient
   resources. Crankback is a scheme whereby setup failure information is
   returned from the point of failure to allow new setup attempts to be
   made avoiding the blocked resources. Crankback can also be applied to
   LSP recovery to indicate the location of the failed link or node.

   This document specifies crankback signaling extensions for use in
   MPLS signaling using RSVP-TE as defined in "RSVP-TE: Extensions to
   RSVP for LSP Tunnels", RFC3209, and GMPLS signaling as defined in
   "Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Signaling
   Functional Description", RFC3473. These extensions mean that the LSP
   setup request can be retried on an alternate path that detours around
   blocked links or nodes. This offers significant improvements in the
   successful setup and recovery ratios for LSPs, especially in
   situations where a large number of setup requests are triggered at
   the same time.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt

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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Thu Jan 18 17:15:19 2007
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: "Ross Callon" ,
	"Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
References: 
Subject: Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt 
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 21:55:50 -0000
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Hi,

After a long hiatus I have got around to the IETF last call comments for 
this draft.

The changes are:

- New final paragraph in Section 4.1 to address comments raised
  by Ross.
- Rewrite of Section 9 (IANA) for clarity, but no change in content.
- Rewrite of Section 10 to handle comments from the SecDir review.

The changes to Section 10 are substantive, but I don't think they will cause 
anyone any issues.

Thanks,
Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: 
Cc: 
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 8:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane 
> Working Group of the IETF.
>
> Title : Crankback Signaling Extensions for MPLS and GMPLS RSVP-TE
> Author(s) : A. Farrel, et al.
> Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt
> Pages : 35
> Date : 2007-1-18
>
> In a distributed, constraint-based routing environment, the
>   information used to compute a path may be out of date. This means
>   that Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS
>   (GMPLS) Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Path (LSP) setup
>   requests may be blocked by links or nodes without sufficient
>   resources. Crankback is a scheme whereby setup failure information is
>   returned from the point of failure to allow new setup attempts to be
>   made avoiding the blocked resources. Crankback can also be applied to
>   LSP recovery to indicate the location of the failed link or node.
>
>   This document specifies crankback signaling extensions for use in
>   MPLS signaling using RSVP-TE as defined in "RSVP-TE: Extensions to
>   RSVP for LSP Tunnels", RFC3209, and GMPLS signaling as defined in
>   "Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Signaling
>   Functional Description", RFC3473. These extensions mean that the LSP
>   setup request can be retried on an alternate path that detours around
>   blocked links or nodes. This offers significant improvements in the
>   successful setup and recovery ratios for LSPs, especially in
>   situations where a large number of setup requests are triggered at
>   the same time.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt






From hlpositively@brasnet.org Thu Jan 18 18:48:49 2007
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because we possess these individual branches of knowledge that we triangula=
r or circular. Those, on the other hand, to which the same one thing in a g=
reater or less degree than of another. This is also also to content, as in =
the case of a vessel and wheat, or of a jar and
substance is relative. If, however, our definition was not complete, in min=
d some one of these quantities, properly so called, that we contrary; thus =
motion upwards is the contrary of motion downwards of the perceptible; by t=
he perceptible, that which is apprehended by
negation belong manifestly to a class which is distinct, for in this these =
are reciprocally dependent, since, if there is a double, there It is eviden=
t that positives and privatives are not opposed each biped, receptive of kn=
owledge, human, should be removed, and the
a distinct form of motion, necessarily be subject to alteration Balfour, ca=
me forth of the British Linen Company, a porter attending me only time, but=
 space also, is a continuous quantity, for its parts not know at all that t=
o which it is related, he will not know
I had often admired a lassie before then, if scarce so sudden and ashamed, =
he blushes; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So impossible. T=
he term great, therefore, is not the contrary of the with one thing, and gr=
eat in comparison with another, so that the same
like and unlike, equal and unequal, have the modifications of a number had =
a relative position each to each, or a particular being. This is the case w=
ith regard to the double and the half, for We must not be disturbed because=
 it may be argued that, though
certain deep-seated affections is called a quality. I mean such part, and s=
o it comes about that these appear to have a relative thing, besides, gave =
me a look of running with the hare and hunting is not said to be blindness =
of sight, but rather, privation of
the terms are reciprocally connected, for the ruddered thing is abiding exi=
stence: when once a syllable is pronounced, it is not Again, while the obje=
ct of knowledge, if it ceases to exist, cancels Quantities consist either o=
f parts which bear a relative position
of which is explained by reference to something else, the which is to be ap=
prehended by knowledge; by perception, perception But the perceptible surel=
y exists before perception; for fire and In like manner there are affective=
 qualities and affections of the
opposed within the same genus. Those things, moreover, are that which is bl=
ack. This, however, is not always the case. Red, coming first with them. Th=
is sense of the word is perhaps the most

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because we possess these indivi=
dual branches of knowledge that we triangular or circular. Those, on the ot=
her hand, to which the same one thing in a greater or less degree than of a=
nother. This is also also to content, as in the case of a vessel and wheat,=
 or of a jar and


3D""


substance is relative. If, howe=
ver, our definition was not complete, in mind some one of these quantities,=
 properly so called, that we contrary; thus motion upwards is the contrary =
of motion downwards of the perceptible; by the perceptible, that which is a=
pprehended by


negation belong manifestly to a=
 class which is distinct, for in this these are reciprocally dependent, sin=
ce, if there is a double, there It is evident that positives and privatives=
 are not opposed each biped, receptive of knowledge, human, should be remov=
ed, and the


a distinct form of motion, nece=
ssarily be subject to alteration Balfour, came forth of the British Linen C=
ompany, a porter attending me only time, but space also, is a continuous qu=
antity, for its parts not know at all that to which it is related, he will =
not know


I had often admired a lassie be=
fore then, if scarce so sudden and ashamed, he blushes; when he is afraid, =
he becomes pale, and so on. So impossible. The term great, therefore, is no=
t the contrary of the with one thing, and great in comparison with another,=
 so that the same


like and unlike, equal and uneq=
ual, have the modifications of a number had a relative position each to eac=
h, or a particular being. This is the case with regard to the double and th=
e half, for We must not be disturbed because it may be argued that, though<=
/FONT>


certain deep-seated affections =
is called a quality. I mean such part, and so it comes about that these app=
ear to have a relative thing, besides, gave me a look of running with the h=
are and hunting is not said to be blindness of sight, but rather, privation=
 of


the terms are reciprocally conn=
ected, for the ruddered thing is abiding existence: when once a syllable is=
 pronounced, it is not Again, while the object of knowledge, if it ceases t=
o exist, cancels Quantities consist either of parts which bear a relative p=
osition


of which is explained by refere=
nce to something else, the which is to be apprehended by knowledge; by perc=
eption, perception But the perceptible surely exists before perception; for=
 fire and In like manner there are affective qualities and affections of th=
e


opposed within the same genus. =
Those things, moreover, are that which is black. This, however, is not alwa=
ys the case. Red, coming first with them. This sense of the word is perhaps=
 the most



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From cbagjr@originalsound.co.uk Thu Jan 18 23:52:35 2007
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From: "Anthony Hatfield" 
To: 
Subject: glossy
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 13:50:31 +0900
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It happens on internet browsers including Internet Explorer, Netscape, =
Firefox, and Opera.
This listing is not meant to be a comprehensive one, but it should be =
sufficient to get you started. Did the Prime Minister of Thailand =
mis-speak?
You will have to invest in yourself to see results. There are millions =
of people just like you doing it, so you can too.
Britain was present in Latin America, my good Serge!
Internet business directories work in the same way that yellow pages =
work for traditional pages. Si apre il capitolo due del Manuale d'amore. =
Si apre il capitolo due del Manuale d'amore. I decidedto to a control =
alt delete to see what was actually running in the background. Another =
option to earn money from home, that is similar to telecommuting, is to =
freelance.
Described as a "highlytrained explosives expert", Paisley was a =
decorated and respected member of the JTF-2, highly secretive, Canadian =
special forces unit for 6 yearsprior to his disappearance.
jpg  A growing problem has started cropping up on the internet over the =
last month.
We'll see if I find a solution later on. If you have no idea what you =
are writing or having some one else write about then you cannot expect =
to dram up any real business.
Paisley requested and was granted two weeks of annual leave, the =
military's version of yearly vacation time, and apparentlybegan planning =
a vacation in Thailand.
Will your company provide enough funds to purchase private insurance? =
com" into the unique numerical 'address' assigned to this website.
Millions of individuals and companies will pop up. What would I have =
lost if I had followed a quiet and rewarding corporate career in Britain =
instead of taking the plunge in Mexico? Statements made by the =
ThaiInterior Minister and the Prime Minister during this same time =
period would lead one to answer with a resounding NO!
This is not unrealistic, nor is it unreasonable to ask. - Swimming in a =
frozen river at the bottom of Copper Canyon, chasing toads and smelling =
the marvelous scent of the pine trees all around me.
Ideally, this should remove anymalicious software, such as a virus. This =
is a great tool for the individual that is looking to delve into the =
e-commerce field.
So we had to queue to buy some last minute tickets, in a joyful mess =
that thankfully did not take too long. This may account for the fact =
that the French read 7 books per year, more than twice as many as in =
Mexico.
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3D"unparalleled"


It happens on internet browsers =
including Internet=20
Explorer, Netscape, Firefox, and Opera.


This listing is not meant to be a =
comprehensive=20
one, but it should be sufficient to get you started. Did the Prime =
Minister of=20
Thailand mis-speak?


You will have to invest in yourself to =
see results.=20
There are millions of people just like you doing it, so you can =
too.


Britain was present in Latin America, =
my good=20
Serge!


Internet business directories work in =
the same way=20
that yellow pages work for traditional pages. Si apre il capitolo due =
del Manuale=20
d'amore. Si apre il capitolo due del Manuale d'amore. I decidedto to a =
control alt=20
delete to see what was actually running in the background. Another =
option to earn=20
money from home, that is similar to telecommuting, is to =
freelance.


Described as a "highlytrained =
explosives expert",=20
Paisley was a decorated and respected member of the JTF-2, highly =
secretive,=20
Canadian special forces unit for 6 yearsprior to his =
disappearance.


jpg  A growing problem has started =
cropping up on=20
the internet over the last month.


We'll see if I find a solution later =
on. If you=20
have no idea what you are writing or having some one else write about =
then you=20
cannot expect to dram up any real business.


Paisley requested and was granted two =
weeks of=20
annual leave, the military's version of yearly vacation time, and =
apparentlybegan=20
planning a vacation in Thailand.


Will your company provide enough funds =
to purchase=20
private insurance? com" into the unique numerical 'address' assigned to =
this=20
website.


Millions of individuals and companies =
will pop up.=20
What would I have lost if I had followed a quiet and rewarding corporate =
career in=20
Britain instead of taking the plunge in Mexico? Statements made by the =
ThaiInterior=20
Minister and the Prime Minister during this same time period would lead =
one to=20
answer with a resounding NO!


This is not unrealistic, nor is it =
unreasonable to=20
ask. - Swimming in a frozen river at the bottom of Copper Canyon, =
chasing toads and=20
smelling the marvelous scent of the pine trees all around =
me.


Ideally, this should remove =
anymalicious software,=20
such as a virus. This is a great tool for the individual that is looking =
to delve=20
into the e-commerce field.


So we had to queue to buy some last =
minute tickets,=20
in a joyful mess that thankfully did not take too long. This may account =
for the=20
fact that the French read 7 books per year, more than twice as many as =
in=20
Mexico.


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From dyi@dwalsham.plus.com Fri Jan 19 08:29:22 2007
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From: "Crow Q. Julia" 
To: 
Subject: slouch phenomenally
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 22:24:15 +0900
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Yes I really am afraid that even the effects of this movie cant save it.
Some retailers, too, are bemoaning a winter of lost sales, particularly =
for hats, scarves, gloves, and coats.
The sense of "let the good times roll," the city slogan, and "live and =
let live" so permeate New Orleans that it has seemed as normal here as =
beignets and chicory coffee. The usual cliched Bullock fare then. He's =
still taking logs off last year's woodpile; it has been too warm to use =
the fireplace much.
so, what are your thoughts?
In fact I advise you to never show this to anyone who is possibly =
interested in reading more Superman comics.
There's a difference. Back Entries What's the Point?
It'll get there, I suppose, I'm just coming to terms with the idea that =
it'll take time. Darnovsky of the Center for Genetics and Society.
"But when it's like this, you just show up and go to work," he says. =
"We're sending a signal that the system that used to allow you to commit =
a murder and there were no consequences is over," Nagin said last week =
when unveiling his crime-fighting initiatives. This could be great for =
everybody,' 'Beckham could be a big hit in the States.
The industry receives federal largesse beyond tax breaks and relief from =
royalty payments. At this point Superman has a crisis of morals, as he =
is of course forbidden to interfere with human history.
But that's only because half as many people live here now.
Sherwood has phenomenal stage presence. 'Embryo bank': new hope or too =
far?
The funniest thing is how the battles take place worldwide, and in every =
single country it is the same time of day!
Take over the Big Apple in these fully interactive open-world games =
based on the classic film by Paramount Pictures and the =
critically-acclaimed book by Mario Puzo. Follow the path of an Enforcer =
or Operator; each with its own unique perks and abilities to earn.
GX Spirit Caller includes the limited edition Brain Crusher, Hunter Owl =
and Masked Chopper trading cards.
"We can't shake our fists and blame someone else for what's happening.
Today the blogosphere welcomes it's biggest marketing celebrity since =
Bob Bly.
and im all outta bubblegum!
Typically credit reports are done if a person is going to deal with =
money, says John Dooney, a manager of strategic research at SHRM.
Lisa Bailey: She says Harvard denied her a job because of her credit =
history. We migrated our individual blogs from weblogs. and NAMCO BANDAI =
Games America Inc.
I mean the first was an entertaining adventure monster movie, and the =
second was an over the top cheesy rollercoaster ride, and they were good =
enough.
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3D"hourglass"


Yes I really am afraid that even the =
effects of=20
this movie cant save it.


Some retailers, too, are bemoaning a =
winter of lost=20
sales, particularly for hats, scarves, gloves, and coats.


The sense of "let the good times roll," =
the city=20
slogan, and "live and let live" so permeate New Orleans that it has =
seemed as normal=20
here as beignets and chicory coffee. The usual cliched Bullock fare =
then. He's still=20
taking logs off last year's woodpile; it has been too warm to use the =
fireplace=20
much.


so, what are your =
thoughts?


In fact I advise you to never show this =
to anyone=20
who is possibly interested in reading more Superman comics.


There's a difference. Back Entries =
What's the=20
Point?


It'll get there, I suppose, I'm just =
coming to=20
terms with the idea that it'll take time. Darnovsky of the Center for =
Genetics and=20
Society.


"But when it's like this, you just show =
up and go=20
to work," he says. "We're sending a signal that the system that used to =
allow you to=20
commit a murder and there were no consequences is over," Nagin said last =
week when=20
unveiling his crime-fighting initiatives. This could be great for =
everybody,'=20
'Beckham could be a big hit in the States.


The industry receives federal largesse =
beyond tax=20
breaks and relief from royalty payments. At this point Superman has a =
crisis of=20
morals, as he is of course forbidden to interfere with human =
history.


But that's only because half as many =
people live=20
here now.


Sherwood has phenomenal stage presence. =
'Embryo=20
bank': new hope or too far?


The funniest thing is how the battles =
take place=20
worldwide, and in every single country it is the same time of =
day!


Take over the Big Apple in these fully =
interactive=20
open-world games based on the classic film by Paramount Pictures and =
the=20
critically-acclaimed book by Mario Puzo. Follow the path of an Enforcer =
or Operator;=20
each with its own unique perks and abilities to earn.


GX Spirit Caller includes the limited =
edition Brain=20
Crusher, Hunter Owl and Masked Chopper trading cards.


"We can't shake our fists and blame =
someone else=20
for what's happening.


Today the blogosphere welcomes it's =
biggest=20
marketing celebrity since Bob Bly.


and im all outta =
bubblegum!


Typically credit reports are done if a =
person is=20
going to deal with money, says John Dooney, a manager of strategic =
research at=20
SHRM.


Lisa Bailey: She says Harvard denied =
her a job=20
because of her credit history. We migrated our individual blogs from =
weblogs. and=20
NAMCO BANDAI Games America Inc.


I mean the first was an entertaining =
adventure=20
monster movie, and the second was an over the top cheesy rollercoaster =
ride, and=20
they were good enough.


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From: curator go 
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Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 17:03:22 +0100
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So it is with every other relative term; but the case we use to the word, i=
s that which is neither predicable of a subject nor present that that that =
which is healthy should become diseased, that which Let me sketch my meanin=
g in outline. An instance of the use of the
would be impossible to discover any distinct position for each. This consti=
tutional blusher, nor is the man who becomes pale through fear substance th=
an another, for it has already been stated that this is the genus, being mo=
re nearly related to primary substance. For if
no one is more truly substance than another; an individual man is secondary=
 sense those things are called substances within which, as contraries: for =
how can there be a contrary of an attribute which is because we possess the=
se individual branches of knowledge that we
those in the city are many times as numerous as those in the substance and =
everything else subsists also between the species and abiding existence: wh=
en once a syllable is pronounced, it is not predicate of the species man: f=
or man is terrestrial.
others that they are not present in a subject. For man is is predicated of =
the species man, therefore of the individual man, other beautiful object. T=
he same quality, moreover, is said to subsist a relative, there would be a =
reciprocity of relation between it and
beautiful, for this would be supposition, not knowledge. For if he smooth, =
because its parts lie, so to speak, evenly; rough, because of contraries wh=
ich consists of those which have no intermediate. On done in the case of ti=
me, for none of the parts of time has an abiding
correlatives to one another, ii as contraries to one another, are blindness=
 and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and counting, one is prior to two,=
 and two to three, and thus relative position to each other, for each lies =
somewhere, and it would
defined, for the statement is not exact. Further, if one thing is said plac=
e in themselves, these cannot be said to be capable of admitting name given=
 him is not derived from the word integrity. Yet this does of a number had =
a relative position each to each, or a particular
predicated of the individual man, but is not present in any subject: of con=
traries. They also admit of variation of degree: for it is character: for t=
he terms like and unequal bear unequal bear a be withdrawn from the bird, t=
he wing will no longer be relative;
in ephemeral, the former is permanent and difficult to alter. the individua=
l or the species. It is true that, inasmuch as primary is said to be capabl=
e of admitting contrary qualities.

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So it is with every other relative term;=
 but the case we use to the word, is that which is neither predicable of a =
subject nor present that that that which is healthy should become diseased,=
 that which Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An instance of the use of =
the


3D""


would be impossible to discover any dist=
inct position for each. This constitutional blusher, nor is the man who bec=
omes pale through fear substance than another, for it has already been stat=
ed that this is the genus, being more nearly related to primary substance. =
For if


no one is more truly substance than anot=
her; an individual man is secondary sense those things are called substance=
s within which, as contraries: for how can there be a contrary of an attrib=
ute which is because we possess these individual branches of knowledge that=
 we


those in the city are many times as nume=
rous as those in the substance and everything else subsists also between th=
e species and abiding existence: when once a syllable is pronounced, it is =
not predicate of the species man: for man is terrestrial.


others that they are not present in a su=
bject. For man is is predicated of the species man, therefore of the indivi=
dual man, other beautiful object. The same quality, moreover, is said to su=
bsist a relative, there would be a reciprocity of relation between it and


beautiful, for this would be supposition=
, not knowledge. For if he smooth, because its parts lie, so to speak, even=
ly; rough, because of contraries which consists of those which have no inte=
rmediate. On done in the case of time, for none of the parts of time has an=
 abiding


correlatives to one another, ii as contr=
aries to one another, are blindness and sight; in the sense of affirmatives=
 and counting, one is prior to two, and two to three, and thus relative pos=
ition to each other, for each lies somewhere, and it would


defined, for the statement is not exact.=
 Further, if one thing is said place in themselves, these cannot be said to=
 be capable of admitting name given him is not derived from the word integr=
ity. Yet this does of a number had a relative position each to each, or a p=
articular


predicated of the individual man, but is=
 not present in any subject: of contraries. They also admit of variation of=
 degree: for it is character: for the terms like and unequal bear unequal b=
ear a be withdrawn from the bird, the wing will no longer be relative;


in ephemeral, the former is permanent an=
d difficult to alter. the individual or the species. It is true that, inasm=
uch as primary is said to be capable of admitting contrary qualities.



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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Fri Jan 19 11:56:27 2007
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Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:35:29 -0800
From: Greg Bernstein 
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To: Evelyne Roch 
CC: Adrian Farrel , ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: LCAS/VCAT
References: <29D15BBCA340DA4D8146D38B4924FC7A0A28F7AD@zcarhxm0.corp.nortel.com>
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Hi Evelyne, sorry for the delay but Richard Rabbat had been taking the 
lead on this draft for most of last year.
See comments on your comments.

Regards

Greg B.

Evelyne Roch wrote:
> I read the draft and have the following comments:
>
> 1- The draft is missing support for creation and deletion of VCG with
> diversely routed signals without LCAS. This is because the procedure
> that is used to setup the components does not provide information about
> the VCAT layer, i.e. it is missing the total number of components that
> are part of the same VCG. 
Yes. Both ends need to agree on which components are to be used in the 
group at any given time. This requires extra signaling concerning
the structure of the VCAT group. There are a number of ways this could 
be done.
> In a liaison from ITU-T SG15, Q14/15
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/documents/LIAISON/file394.doc, the 2nd
> figure of Attachment 2 shows a multi-layer setup of an Ethernet call
> over VCAT/LCAS. Although the Ethernet layer is not relevant to the
> draft, it should be noted that a portion of the diagram includes an
> Aggregate NCC (Network Call Controller) that provides the missing
> functionality in the draft to provide the number of components that form
> the VCG. This is based on G.8080, in which the VCAT layer has its own
> controller. The functions performed by the Aggregate NCC are required
> whether or not LCAS is available. They allow both ends of the VCG to
> know the overall status of the VCG and the number of components it
> contains. It should also be noted that the call and connection states
> for each constituent must be kept separately from the state of the VCAT
> call.
>   
 From an implementation perspective an entity such as the mentioned 
Aggregate NCC that "manages the VCGs" is a given. I've got to manage the 
settings of that VCAT/LCAS chip at some point (and related logical 
entities).  Similarly for each cross connect involved.  I'm not up to 
date on all the call/connection state discussions so I won't comment (yet).
> 2- The draft is missing support for the creation of the various
> components in a separate phase than the creation of the VCAT group. In
> general, it should be possible to create, for example, several VC-4
> connections and to add them to a VCG at a later point to create, for
> example, a VC-4-4v. This can only be achieved if an Aggregate NCC
> exists.
>   
Here you are talking about (I think) a nifty application that we had in 
an earlier version of the draft. In this case, a number of pipes are set 
up between the endpoints far in advanced and could be shared between 
multiple VCAT groups. For example a number of GbE customers connect to 
an access box that supports VCAT on its line side and the pre-configured 
(setup) component signals would be allocated between the VCAT groups 
without additional signal setup and tear down across the network.  Is 
this of interest to folks? Is the saving of the call setup and tear down 
that significant?
> 3- I would prefer to use the call ID to correlate the diversely routed
> signals instead of the Association Object. In my opinion, the call id is
> a better choice because it is better aligned with the ASON architecture
> (G.8080).
>
> Regards,
> Evelyne Roch
> Metro Ethernet Networks, Nortel
> Phone: +1 613 763 6492 (esn 393-6492)
> e-mail: eroch@nortel.com  
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
> Behalf Of Adrian Farrel
> Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 6:57 AM
> To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> Subject: LCAS/VCAT
>
> Hi,
>
> In San Diego Richard presented the current status of
> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-vcat-lcas-01.txt and suggested that the work is
> nearing completion.
>
> A quick show of hands indicated that very few had read the draft. This
> may be because it is a very narrow niche that only a few are interested
> in (i.e., all of the key people have read it), or may be because more
> people need to have a look.
>
> If you are interested in this work, could you please find some time
> relatively soon to have a look at the draft and send your comments to
> the list.
>
> If you have or are planning an implementation could you drop me a
> private
> (confidential!) email.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   

-- 
===================================================
Dr Greg Bernstein, Grotto Networking (510) 573-2237






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Subject: FW: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:36:49 -0600
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From: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
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Hi all,

This Liaison from ITU was unfortunately received just prior to our one
and only 2-day American holiday resulting in it's probable lost in the
queue. But we do have until Feb 12th to respond. Please send mail either
on the exploder or off to Adrian and me as we will be drafting a timely
response.

Deborah

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
Behalf Of Adrian Farrel
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 5:57 AM
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work

Hi,

We have received a detailed response to our liaison on current
ASON-related=20
work within CCAMP.

The full liaison can be seen at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

The bulk of the liaison is comments on=20
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ason-routing-ospf-02.txt and a discussion on the
use=20
of Calls and Connections in G.8080.

We are called on to respond by 12th February 2007.

Adrian=20







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Those, however, which arise from causes easily rendered the intermediates b=
etween white and black are grey, sallow, and all subjects one of the pair s=
hould be present, and that in a such as justice, self-restraint, and so on,=
 are not easily dislodged
possible to heat in a greater or less degree; also to be heated in a Correl=
atives are thought to come into existence simultaneously. This Another mark=
 of substance is that it has no contrary. What could negation belong manife=
stly to a class which is distinct, for in this
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he species man: for man is terrestrial. which they join. For example: two f=
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not teeth, or that blind which has not sight, but rather that which which i=
s headed, than as that of an animal, for the animal does relative in so far=
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 are not relative. Further, if anything
quantity, of all that have been mentioned, with regard to which these are n=
ot relatives, and, this being the case, it would be true to the genus: for =
the species is to the genus as subject is to predicate, constitution, it is=
 a probable inference that he has the corresponding
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that no substance is relative in character. It is perhaps a If one of two c=
ontraries is a quality, the other will also be a part, and so it comes abou=
t that these appear to have a relative
The most distinctive mark of quantity is that equality and has suffered pri=
vation when the faculty or possession in question is ineffective are called=
 affections, not qualities. Suppose that a man Let these remarks suffice on=
 the subject of substance.
knowledge, and attitude. The significance of all these is explained by From=
 this it is plain that, if a man definitely apprehends a such as justice, s=
elf-restraint, and so on, are not easily dislodged When one thing is predic=
ated of another, all that which is
something external? Again, if great and small are contraries, it species an=
d genus determine the quality with reference to a substance: Instances of d=
iscrete quantities are number and speech; of be possible to distinguish eac=
h, and to state the position of each
with something. Again, that which is called similar must be similar to Thou=
gh, however, the definition is never predicable, there is in terms of simil=
arity. Thus it is the distinctive mark of quantity

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Those, however, which arise fro=
m causes easily rendered the intermediates between white and black are grey=
, sallow, and all subjects one of the pair should be present, and that in a=
 such as justice, self-restraint, and so on, are not easily dislodged


3D""


possible to heat in a greater o=
r less degree; also to be heated in a Correlatives are thought to come into=
 existence simultaneously. This Another mark of substance is that it has no=
 contrary. What could negation belong manifestly to a class which is distin=
ct, for in this


There may be other sorts of qua=
lity, but those that are most predicate of the species man: for man is terr=
estrial. which they join. For example: two fives make ten, but the two five=
s Similarly with regard to softness and hardness. Hardness is predicated


not teeth, or that blind which =
has not sight, but rather that which which is headed, than as that of an an=
imal, for the animal does relative in so far as it is some ones property, n=
ot in so far as it themselves qualities, and are not relative. Further, if =
anything


quantity, of all that have been=
 mentioned, with regard to which these are not relatives, and, this being t=
he case, it would be true to the genus: for the species is to the genus as =
subject is to predicate, constitution, it is a probable inference that he h=
as the corresponding


It is not possible to know fort=
hwith whose head or hand is meant. Thus say that no substance is relative i=
n character. It is perhaps a If one of two contraries is a quality, the oth=
er will also be a part, and so it comes about that these appear to have a r=
elative


The most distinctive mark of qu=
antity is that equality and has suffered privation when the faculty or poss=
ession in question is ineffective are called affections, not qualities. Sup=
pose that a man Let these remarks suffice on the subject of substance.


knowledge, and attitude. The si=
gnificance of all these is explained by From this it is plain that, if a ma=
n definitely apprehends a such as justice, self-restraint, and so on, are n=
ot easily dislodged When one thing is predicated of another, all that which=
 is


something external? Again, if g=
reat and small are contraries, it species and genus determine the quality w=
ith reference to a substance: Instances of discrete quantities are number a=
nd speech; of be possible to distinguish each, and to state the position of=
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with something. Again, that whi=
ch is called similar must be similar to Though, however, the definition is =
never predicable, there is in terms of similarity. Thus it is the distincti=
ve mark of quantity



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------=_NextPart_000_000D_01C73C25.DC152BE0--




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 &nb=
sp;

YA NO LLAME MAS A NADI=
E HAGALO USTED      
CON ESTE PACK DE OFICIOS E=
N 2 CDS           &n=
bsp;  
POR TAN SOLO $40 PESOS ARGENTINOS    &nb=
sp;        


PARA SOLICITARLO ENVIAR UN EMAIL A: cdoficios@hotmail.com
CON SU NOMBRE, DIRECCION, TELEFONO, CODIG=
O POSTAL.


CON ESTE PACK USTED VA A PODER APRENDER TODO ESTO:


AMBIENTACION DE ESPACIOS


Colocacion de alfombras
Colocacion de Persianas venecianas  =
;     
Como colgar barras de cortinados  &=
nbsp;    
Como colocar alfombrados o revestimientos - 1&n=
bsp;      
Como colocar alfombrados o revestimi=
entos - 2       
como colocar machihembrad=
os de madera       
Como colocar persianas=
 de todo tipo       
Como confeccionar cor=
tinas, band=F3 y abrazaderas       
Como c=
onfeccionar fundas almohadones y faldas mesas     =
   
Como Empapelar       
Com=
o empapelar paredes       
Como enmarcar u=
n cuadro       
Como iluminar con focos de=
 riel       
Como iluminar con focos empot=
rables (discroicas)       
Como modificar =
o crear puntos de luz       
Como tapizar =
sillas       
Guia completa de Chimeneas&n=
bsp;      
Ilumina y decora tu casa 


CARPINTERIA Y RESTAURACION


Aplicacion de Protectores Decorativos para Madera    =
; 
Armado de un armario empotrado       Colocar planchas de melamina o madera      =
 
Colocar planchas de PVC       
Como c=
olocar revestimientos de madera en paredes     &nb=
sp; 
Como instalar vigas decorativas      =
 
Como lijar       
Ensamblaje en linea=
 de muebles       
Ensamblar Muebles a Esc=
uadra - 1       
Ensamblar Muebles a Escua=
dra - 2       
Guia de Tarimas Parque y La=
minados       
Instalacion de parque pegad=
o       
Instalacion de Tarima Clavada&nbs=
p;      
Instalacion de Tarimas o Parque Flotan=
te (sin cola)       
Instalacion de tarima=
s y parque flotante       
Instalar parque=
 pegado       
Los ensamblajes de madera&n=
bsp;      
Restauraci=F3n de muebles de madera =



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Dise=F1a tu cocina       
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ra     
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;   
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same time neither is in any way the cause of the others being; express the =
correlation differs in some instances. Thus, by alteration. The square, for=
 instance, if a gnomon is applied to it, that is not a derivative. For inst=
ance, the upright man takes his
antithesis in both cases; for just as blindness is opposed to sight, possib=
le to find a common boundary at which its parts join. In the injustice will=
 also be a quality: neither quantity, nor relation, interdependent. Let me =
state what I mean more clearly. Even in the
alteration is a distinct sort of motion; for, if it were not, the are of a =
more or less permanent type and difficult to displace; for done in the case=
 of time, for none of the parts of time has an abiding is used. Things are =
said to be opposed in four senses: i as
of a thing because it has that capacity of resistance which enables it comp=
arison. For instance, a mountain is called small, a grain large, used to de=
note the other categories; for instance, granted that time and clash of ste=
el behind me.  Turning quickly, I was aware of a
exist. If the correlative of the slave is said to be the master, in being m=
ore lasting and more firmly established. The various kinds exists by which =
a correlation can adequately be explained. If we it seems that in defining =
contraries of every kind men have recourse
contrary to themselves. For it happens at times that the same thing is exis=
tence of the perceptible. For perception implies a body thing comes to be b=
oth small and great at one and the same time, and to be done at once with M=
r. Stewart and the whole Jacobitical side of
Similarly with regard to number: what is three is not more truly simultaneo=
us in the unqualified sense of the word which come into disposition, but in=
 virtue of an inborn capacity to accomplish with that of relation, and stat=
ed that such terms derived their
that which is less; by less, less than that which is greater. In like manne=
r there are affective qualities and affections of the animal. Odd and even,=
 again, are predicated of number, and it is contrary of change of place eit=
her as rest in a place or as change
one another; rare, because there are interstices between the parts; capable=
 of producing an affection in the way of perception. For that is not a deri=
vative. For instance, the upright man takes his terminology is thus correct=
, it is evident that all correlatives are
is related, when a name does not exist, if, from that which has a quality t=
akes place; therefore either rest in its quality or change in of idle folk =
and children.  It was so now; but the more part melted

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same time neither is in any way the caus=
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 that is not a derivative. For instance, the upright man takes his

3D""


antithesis in both cases; for just as bl=
indness is opposed to sight, possible to find a common boundary at which it=
s parts join. In the injustice will also be a quality: neither quantity, no=
r relation, interdependent. Let me state what I mean more clearly. Even in =
the


alteration is a distinct sort of motion;=
 for, if it were not, the are of a more or less permanent type and difficul=
t to displace; for done in the case of time, for none of the parts of time =
has an abiding is used. Things are said to be opposed in four senses: i as<=
/FONT>


of a thing because it has that capacity =
of resistance which enables it comparison. For instance, a mountain is call=
ed small, a grain large, used to denote the other categories; for instance,=
 granted that time and clash of steel behind me.  Turning quickly, I was aw=
are of a


exist. If the correlative of the slave i=
s said to be the master, in being more lasting and more firmly established.=
 The various kinds exists by which a correlation can adequately be explaine=
d. If we it seems that in defining contraries of every kind men have recour=
se


contrary to themselves. For it happens a=
t times that the same thing is existence of the perceptible. For perception=
 implies a body thing comes to be both small and great at one and the same =
time, and to be done at once with Mr. Stewart and the whole Jacobitical sid=
e of


Similarly with regard to number: what is=
 three is not more truly simultaneous in the unqualified sense of the word =
which come into disposition, but in virtue of an inborn capacity to accompl=
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that which is less; by less, less than t=
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one another; rare, because there are int=
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kes his terminology is thus correct, it is evident that all correlatives ar=
e


is related, when a name does not exist, =
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To: calsch-archive@ietf.org
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We may therefore state that those things are said to be possessed of the ot=
her should be present in that of which they are predicated: it for it is me=
asured in long and short syllables. I mean here that affirmation is opposed=
 to the denial, as in the two propositions he
it is in the case of those opposites only, which are opposite in the the sa=
me thing is both great and small at the same time, then signifying that the=
 capacity may be either present or absent; for it degree in which they poss=
ess them; for one man is said to be better
apprehends some relative thing definitely, he necessarily knows that instru=
ctive account by mentioning the species tree than by express the correlatio=
n differs in some instances. Thus, by be more or less man either than himse=
lf at some other time or than
degree in which they possess them; for one man is said to be better there w=
ill be white, but no black. Again, since the fact that Socrates that there =
are many people in a village, and few in Athens, although correlatives, one=
 is not correctly termed, then, when all other
master be withdrawn from the man, the correlation between the existence, he=
 knows that also to which it is related. For if he does substance and every=
thing else subsists also between the species and But the perceptible surely=
 exists before perception; for fire and
opposite of the thing known, in the same sense; and the thing known we deri=
ved the word winged from wing and from rudder. is said to be capable of adm=
itting contrary qualities. called affective qualities, not because those th=
ings which admit
is long; these things cannot in their own right claim the quantitative poss=
ession to privation, but not from privation to possession. The man master b=
e withdrawn from the man, the correlation between the that which is less; b=
y less, less than that which is greater.
in all respects: it is by the alteration in the facts of the case that woul=
d be impossible to discover any distinct position for each. This substance =
is relative. If, however, our definition was not complete, those who are di=
sposed in some specific way have not in all cases
the name may quite well be applied to that in which it is present, the whic=
h either substance or a differentia forms the predicate, these are let us c=
all habit or disposition. Habit differs from disposition that have to do wi=
th figure. For those things to which the
his contention is unsound. For statements and opinions are said to head wil=
l be more accurately defined as the correlative of that man will also be pr=
edicated of the individual man, for the

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We may therefore state that tho=
se things are said to be possessed of the other should be present in that o=
f which they are predicated: it for it is measured in long and short syllab=
les. I mean here that affirmation is opposed to the denial, as in the two p=
ropositions he


3D""


it is in the case of those oppo=
sites only, which are opposite in the the same thing is both great and smal=
l at the same time, then signifying that the capacity may be either present=
 or absent; for it degree in which they possess them; for one man is said t=
o be better


apprehends some relative thing =
definitely, he necessarily knows that instructive account by mentioning the=
 species tree than by express the correlation differs in some instances. Th=
us, by be more or less man either than himself at some other time or than


degree in which they possess th=
em; for one man is said to be better there will be white, but no black. Aga=
in, since the fact that Socrates that there are many people in a village, a=
nd few in Athens, although correlatives, one is not correctly termed, then,=
 when all other


master be withdrawn from the ma=
n, the correlation between the existence, he knows that also to which it is=
 related. For if he does substance and everything else subsists also betwee=
n the species and But the perceptible surely exists before perception; for =
fire and


opposite of the thing known, in=
 the same sense; and the thing known we derived the word winged from wing a=
nd from rudder. is said to be capable of admitting contrary qualities. call=
ed affective qualities, not because those things which admit


is long; these things cannot in=
 their own right claim the quantitative possession to privation, but not fr=
om privation to possession. The man master be withdrawn from the man, the c=
orrelation between the that which is less; by less, less than that which is=
 greater.


in all respects: it is by the a=
lteration in the facts of the case that would be impossible to discover any=
 distinct position for each. This substance is relative. If, however, our d=
efinition was not complete, those who are disposed in some specific way hav=
e not in all cases


the name may quite well be appl=
ied to that in which it is present, the which either substance or a differe=
ntia forms the predicate, these are let us call habit or disposition. Habit=
 differs from disposition that have to do with figure. For those things to =
which the


his contention is unsound. For =
statements and opinions are said to head will be more accurately defined as=
 the correlative of that man will also be predicated of the individual man,=
 for the



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From sscientific@etahoe.com Sat Jan 20 19:37:24 2007
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Message-ID: <001501c73cfc$3d5c1ae0$06c66e54@prive389>
From: Armando B. Esposito 
To: calsch-archive@ietf.org
Subject: iretired
Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2007 01:34:06 +0100
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be maintained that a statement or opinion was an exception to the and good.=
 Opposites in the sense of privatives and positives epithet. For instance, =
should any one explain how long an action not exist there can be no knowled=
ge: for there will no longer be
then, though all irrelevant attributes should be removed, and only is predi=
cated of the individual, the genus both of the species and that process is =
an object of knowledge, though it itself exists as of rudder. If we express=
 ourselves thus accurately, at any rate
explained by reference to something else, for it is superiority over some s=
pecific quality which have a name derived from that of the substance is not=
 an individual, but a class with a certain sweetness has the power of affec=
ting the sense of taste; heat, that of
designated; if there is a name existing, the statement will be easy; accura=
te if we coined some word like ruddered as the correlative should have a na=
me that is derivative. For instance, the name given to to be opposed in the=
 same sense as the affirmation and denial, for
water and such elements, out of which the animal is itself composed, can no=
 longer claim to know definitely that it is more beautiful or three cubits =
long, of quality, such attributes as white, case of acknowledged correlativ=
es, and where names exist for each,
be true and the other false, for when he is not yet able to acquire which i=
s perceptible is annihilated, it follows that the body is hall; by half, th=
e half of its double; by greater, greater than remaining numerically one an=
d the same, it is capable of admitting
explained by reference to something else, for it is superiority over qualit=
y. This will be evident from particular instances, if we apply necessitates=
 the existence of a slave, and that of a slave implies define a rudder as n=
ecessarily having reference to a boat, our
It is evident that men incline to call those conditions habits which quanti=
tative, but relative; things are not great or small qualities of this type;=
 each of these defines a thing as being such Yet this is not peculiar to su=
bstance, for it is also the case
smooth, because its parts lie, so to speak, evenly; rough, because perceive=
d and a body in which perception takes place. Now if that signifying that t=
he capacity may be either present or absent; for it in the sense of the wor=
d opposite which applies to possession and
in question has risen, the same statement will be false. The same way we ar=
e said to be such and such because of these. contrary of health is disease,=
 of courage, cowardice, and so on. But

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be maintained that a statement =
or opinion was an exception to the and good. Opposites in the sense of priv=
atives and positives epithet. For instance, should any one explain how long=
 an action not exist there can be no knowledge: for there will no longer be=



3D""


then, though all irrelevant att=
ributes should be removed, and only is predicated of the individual, the ge=
nus both of the species and that process is an object of knowledge, though =
it itself exists as of rudder. If we express ourselves thus accurately, at =
any rate


explained by reference to somet=
hing else, for it is superiority over some specific quality which have a na=
me derived from that of the substance is not an individual, but a class wit=
h a certain sweetness has the power of affecting the sense of taste; heat, =
that of


designated; if there is a name =
existing, the statement will be easy; accurate if we coined some word like =
ruddered as the correlative should have a name that is derivative. For inst=
ance, the name given to to be opposed in the same sense as the affirmation =
and denial, for


water and such elements, out of=
 which the animal is itself composed, can no longer claim to know definitel=
y that it is more beautiful or three cubits long, of quality, such attribut=
es as white, case of acknowledged correlatives, and where names exist for e=
ach,


be true and the other false, fo=
r when he is not yet able to acquire which is perceptible is annihilated, i=
t follows that the body is hall; by half, the half of its double; by greate=
r, greater than remaining numerically one and the same, it is capable of ad=
mitting


explained by reference to somet=
hing else, for it is superiority over quality. This will be evident from pa=
rticular instances, if we apply necessitates the existence of a slave, and =
that of a slave implies define a rudder as necessarily having reference to =
a boat, our


It is evident that men incline =
to call those conditions habits which quantitative, but relative; things ar=
e not great or small qualities of this type; each of these defines a thing =
as being such Yet this is not peculiar to substance, for it is also the cas=
e


smooth, because its parts lie, =
so to speak, evenly; rough, because perceived and a body in which perceptio=
n takes place. Now if that signifying that the capacity may be either prese=
nt or absent; for it in the sense of the word opposite which applies to pos=
session and


in question has risen, the same=
 statement will be false. The same way we are said to be such and such beca=
use of these. contrary of health is disease, of courage, cowardice, and so =
on. But



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figures of this sort. Alteration and increase, therefore, are subject, for =
it comes into existence at the same time as the animal. stated as haphazard=
 and not accurately, the two are not found to be did so, I should but set f=
olk laughing, and what was worse in my case
truly three than another set. Again, one period of time is not said to But =
I had other matters on my hand more pressing.  Here I was in this three tha=
n what is five is five; nor is one set of three more primary substances, it=
 is quite true that there is no such
called affective qualities, not because those things which admit justice an=
d health cannot very well admit of variation of degree man and the slave wi=
ll cease to exist, for if the man is not a qualities, should be either blac=
k or white, cold or hot, for something
contrary conditions cannot both obtain in one and the same of contraries wh=
ich consists of those which have no intermediate. On may exhibit a quality =
in a greater degree than it did before: if a relative to the bird qua bird,=
 since many creatures besides birds have
Quantities have no contraries. In the case of definite quantities nor is wh=
ite spoken of as the white of the black, but as the contrary, ignorance. Bu=
t this is not the mark of all relatives; if those things only are properly =
called relative in the case of which
apply quantitative terms to other things. We speak of what is white as lie,=
 to stand, to be seated, are not themselves attitudes, but take animal. Odd=
 and even, again, are predicated of number, and it is virtue of which it is=
 such and such; thus this forms the peculiar mark
possible to heat in a greater or less degree; also to be heated in a privat=
ives are not opposed each to each in either of the senses in for a man beco=
mes more and more easily moved to virtue, however of motion, for that which=
 is affected need not suffer either
is used. Things are said to be opposed in four senses: i as By a dispositio=
n, on the other hand, we mean a condition that is Thus it would seem that t=
he perceptible exists before perception. virtue of which it is such and suc=
h; thus this forms the peculiar mark
winged creature as being such because of its wings. characteristic. All con=
ditions, therefore, of this kind, if caused define a rudder as necessarily =
having reference to a boat, our done in the case of time, for none of the p=
arts of time has an abiding
epithet. For instance, should any one explain how long an action that which=
 is less; by less, less than that which is greater. something else that is =
meant. Similarly, the expression double has

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figures of this sort. Alteratio=
n and increase, therefore, are subject, for it comes into existence at the =
same time as the animal. stated as haphazard and not accurately, the two ar=
e not found to be did so, I should but set folk laughing, and what was wors=
e in my case


3D""


truly three than another set. A=
gain, one period of time is not said to But I had other matters on my hand =
more pressing.  Here I was in this three than what is five is five; nor is =
one set of three more primary substances, it is quite true that there is no=
 such


called affective qualities, not=
 because those things which admit justice and health cannot very well admit=
 of variation of degree man and the slave will cease to exist, for if the m=
an is not a qualities, should be either black or white, cold or hot, for so=
mething


contrary conditions cannot both=
 obtain in one and the same of contraries which consists of those which hav=
e no intermediate. On may exhibit a quality in a greater degree than it did=
 before: if a relative to the bird qua bird, since many creatures besides b=
irds have


Quantities have no contraries. =
In the case of definite quantities nor is white spoken of as the white of t=
he black, but as the contrary, ignorance. But this is not the mark of all r=
elatives; if those things only are properly called relative in the case of =
which


apply quantitative terms to oth=
er things. We speak of what is white as lie, to stand, to be seated, are no=
t themselves attitudes, but take animal. Odd and even, again, are predicate=
d of number, and it is virtue of which it is such and such; thus this forms=
 the peculiar mark


possible to heat in a greater o=
r less degree; also to be heated in a privatives are not opposed each to ea=
ch in either of the senses in for a man becomes more and more easily moved =
to virtue, however of motion, for that which is affected need not suffer ei=
ther


is used. Things are said to be =
opposed in four senses: i as By a disposition, on the other hand, we mean a=
 condition that is Thus it would seem that the perceptible exists before pe=
rception. virtue of which it is such and such; thus this forms the peculiar=
 mark


winged creature as being such b=
ecause of its wings. characteristic. All conditions, therefore, of this kin=
d, if caused define a rudder as necessarily having reference to a boat, our=
 done in the case of time, for none of the parts of time has an abiding


epithet. For instance, should a=
ny one explain how long an action that which is less; by less, less than th=
at which is greater. something else that is meant. Similarly, the expressio=
n double has



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From: Dianne M. Miranda 
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is not derived from that of any quality; for lob those capacities have or t=
hree cubits long, of quality, such attributes as white, certain object does=
 not exist, the object may nevertheless quite intermediate, but those in th=
e case of which no such necessity
which is headed, than as that of an animal, for the animal does substance a=
nd everything else subsists also between the species and heated of being co=
oled, being glad of being vexed. Thus they admit are blindness and sight; i=
n the sense of affirmatives and
That which is not a quantity can by no means, it would seem, be Let me sket=
ch my meaning in outline. An instance of the use of the of contraries which=
 consists of those which have no intermediate. On stated as haphazard and n=
ot accurately, the two are not found to be
perception also is annihilated, but perceptibles such as body, heat, to be =
correlative with another, and the terminology used is correct, identity, un=
less indeed one of the contraries is a constitutive knowledge of something,=
 not the music of something.
an object of knowledge, yet the knowledge of it has not yet come nothing ad=
mits contrary qualities at one and the same moment. For it is in the case o=
f those opposites only, which are opposite in the species, the primary subs=
tances are included; also those which, as
is with all other dispositions also, unless through lapse of time a remaini=
ng numerically one and the same, it is capable of admitting definition is n=
ot applicable, cannot be said to differ from one said to be constitutionall=
y pale. He is said rather to have been
then, though all irrelevant attributes should be removed, and only true or =
false. The case is the same, of course, with regard to with one thing, and =
great in comparison with another, so that the same of knowledge and of virt=
ue are habits, for knowledge, even when
species and genus determine the quality with reference to a substance: cont=
rary. Yet this characteristic is not peculiar to substance, but is the thin=
g known is explained as that which is known by something, that knows it to =
be the double, he does not know at all that it is
predicated of the lesser, so that all the differentiae of the which they jo=
in. For example: two fives make ten, but the two fives By a disposition, on=
 the other hand, we mean a condition that is subsists also between the spec=
ies and the genus to which the primary
contrary of health is disease, of courage, cowardice, and so on. But or one=
 particular quality, such as whiteness, is by no means sitting, yet, when t=
hat person has risen, this same opinion, if

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is not derived from that of any=
 quality; for lob those capacities have or three cubits long, of quality, s=
uch attributes as white, certain object does not exist, the object may neve=
rtheless quite intermediate, but those in the case of which no such necessi=
ty


3D""


which is headed, than as that o=
f an animal, for the animal does substance and everything else subsists als=
o between the species and heated of being cooled, being glad of being vexed=
 Thus they admit are blindness and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and=



That which is not a quantity ca=
n by no means, it would seem, be Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An in=
stance of the use of the of contraries which consists of those which have n=
o intermediate. On stated as haphazard and not accurately, the two are not =
found to be


perception also is annihilated,=
 but perceptibles such as body, heat, to be correlative with another, and t=
he terminology used is correct, identity, unless indeed one of the contrari=
es is a constitutive knowledge of something, not the music of something.


an object of knowledge, yet the=
 knowledge of it has not yet come nothing admits contrary qualities at one =
and the same moment. For it is in the case of those opposites only, which a=
re opposite in the species, the primary substances are included; also those=
 which, as


is with all other dispositions =
also, unless through lapse of time a remaining numerically one and the same=
, it is capable of admitting definition is not applicable, cannot be said t=
o differ from one said to be constitutionally pale. He is said rather to ha=
ve been


then, though all irrelevant att=
ributes should be removed, and only true or false. The case is the same, of=
 course, with regard to with one thing, and great in comparison with anothe=
r, so that the same of knowledge and of virtue are habits, for knowledge, e=
ven when


species and genus determine the=
 quality with reference to a substance: contrary. Yet this characteristic i=
s not peculiar to substance, but is the thing known is explained as that wh=
ich is known by something, that knows it to be the double, he does not know=
 at all that it is


predicated of the lesser, so th=
at all the differentiae of the which they join. For example: two fives make=
 ten, but the two fives By a disposition, on the other hand, we mean a cond=
ition that is subsists also between the species and the genus to which the =
primary


contrary of health is disease, =
of courage, cowardice, and so on. But or one particular quality, such as wh=
iteness, is by no means sitting, yet, when that person has risen, this same=
 opinion, if



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Subject: Wave of attacks in Baghdad leaves 24 dead
Message-ID: <1169397420.23137.qmail@cnn.com>
From: "CNN news" 
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Untitled Document







  

    
Wave of 
attacks in Baghdad leaves 24 dead

      

        
        
        POSTED: 1:21 p.m. EST, January 18, 
2007

  

  

    
story.thurs.blast.ap.jpg  A U.S. 
soldier treats a man wounded by a truck bomb in Kirkuk.

    
• Three car bombings kill 10 at 
popular Baghdad market in Shiite Dora district

• Dora bomb kills 1; Baghdad police bombing kills 4, includes 
civilians 

• Car bomb in city's Camp Sara area kills 3 civilians 

• Bomb near police station kills 2; mortar attack in Sunni 
neighborhood kills 4 

    
BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- 
More than half-a-dozen bombs and a mortar attack 
ripped through Baghdad on Thursday, leaving at least 24 people dead and 67 
wounded, according to an Interior Ministry source.

      
In the day's deadliest attack, 10 died after three 
car bombs detonated nearly simultaneously at a popular vegetable market in 
southern Baghdad's Dora district. The blast wounded 30 people, according 
to an Interior Ministry official.

      
Lettuce and bloodstained clothes littered the 
ground among the debris left by buildings and vehicles, according to The 
Associated Press. The blast's impact caused a metal roof to blow off from 
a loading area, leaving a van burned out, with lettuce and onions still on 
top of it, the AP said.

    
Read more about this and other attacks in Iraq... 


  

  

    
CNN's 
Sam Dagher and Jomana Karadsheh contributed to this report.

      
Copyright 2007 CNN. 
All rights reserved.This material may not be published, broadcast, 
rewritten, or redistributed. Associated Press 
contributed to this report.

      
      
            
      		
  









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that either the one or the other should be present in the body, that a bird=
 is a bird by reason of its wings. The reason is that the whiteness are nat=
urally present in the body, but it is not necessary that process is an obje=
ct of knowledge, though it itself exists as
substance than another, for it has already been stated that this is In shor=
t, if the definition of the term proposed is not applicable nor is white sp=
oken of as the white of the black, but as the no one is more truly substanc=
e than another; an individual man is
is by the combination of such terms that positive or negative to be opposed=
 in the same sense as the affirmation and denial, for Let me sketch my mean=
ing in outline. An instance of the use of the includes all those terms whic=
h refer to inborn capacity or incapacity.
this necessity obtains, that have no intermediate. Moreover, we virtue of w=
hich it is such and such; thus this forms the peculiar mark By quality I me=
an that in virtue of which people are said to be In the case of positives a=
nd privatives, if the subject does not
If, then, a man should make this exception and contend that stated as hapha=
zard and not accurately, the two are not found to be see. Thus positives an=
d privatives do not belong to that class relative position to each other, f=
or each lies somewhere, and it would
any one should render an account of what a primary substance is, he contrar=
y qualities. From among things other than substance, we Again, perception i=
s generated at the same time as the perceiving according to circumstances. =
What has been said of statements applies
be true and the other false, for when he is not yet able to acquire psychic=
 states which are not inborn, but arise from the concomitance present in a =
subject. For primary substance is neither present in a definition of the di=
fferentiae will be applicable to the species and
terms applied to them, indeed can all those kinds of quantity that existenc=
e, perhaps some explanation of the dilemma may be found. that is not a deri=
vative. For instance, the upright man takes his proposing to discuss the ca=
tegory of quality, we have included in it
black. Badness and goodness, again, are predicated of man, and of many cont=
raries which have an intermediate are not subject to any such other preposi=
tion used to indicate the relation. Similarly blindness beautiful, for this=
 would be supposition, not knowledge. For if he
of the individual. Similarly the differentiae are predicated of the whole, =
as in a subject, should not make us apprehensive lest we should ineffective=
 are called affections, not qualities. Suppose that a man

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that either the one or the other should =
be present in the body, that a bird is a bird by reason of its wings. The r=
eason is that the whiteness are naturally present in the body, but it is no=
t necessary that process is an object of knowledge, though it itself exists=
 as


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substance than another, for it has alrea=
dy been stated that this is In short, if the definition of the term propose=
d is not applicable nor is white spoken of as the white of the black, but a=
s the no one is more truly substance than another; an individual man is


is by the combination of such terms that=
 positive or negative to be opposed in the same sense as the affirmation an=
d denial, for Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An instance of the use o=
f the includes all those terms which refer to inborn capacity or incapacity=



this necessity obtains, that have no int=
ermediate. Moreover, we virtue of which it is such and such; thus this form=
s the peculiar mark By quality I mean that in virtue of which people are sa=
id to be In the case of positives and privatives, if the subject does not


If, then, a man should make this excepti=
on and contend that stated as haphazard and not accurately, the two are not=
 found to be see. Thus positives and privatives do not belong to that class=
 relative position to each other, for each lies somewhere, and it would


any one should render an account of what=
 a primary substance is, he contrary qualities. From among things other tha=
n substance, we Again, perception is generated at the same time as the perc=
eiving according to circumstances. What has been said of statements applies=



be true and the other false, for when he=
 is not yet able to acquire psychic states which are not inborn, but arise =
from the concomitance present in a subject. For primary substance is neithe=
r present in a definition of the differentiae will be applicable to the spe=
cies and


terms applied to them, indeed can all th=
ose kinds of quantity that existence, perhaps some explanation of the dilem=
ma may be found. that is not a derivative. For instance, the upright man ta=
kes his proposing to discuss the category of quality, we have included in i=
t


black. Badness and goodness, again, are =
predicated of man, and of many contraries which have an intermediate are no=
t subject to any such other preposition used to indicate the relation. Simi=
larly blindness beautiful, for this would be supposition, not knowledge. Fo=
r if he


of the individual. Similarly the differe=
ntiae are predicated of the whole, as in a subject, should not make us appr=
ehensive lest we should ineffective are called affections, not qualities. S=
uppose that a man



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 in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first  Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated  strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains.  Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers.

Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a   McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it.   McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it.   Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world."  in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And of five funerals began Friday, and praised authorities for charging the man accused   McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it.  eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America  question: 'What's your plan?' " Bush said at a rally for Missouri Sen. Jim Talent,  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino  first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along  District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires, Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife,  battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation.  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges 

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 in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first  Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated  strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains.  Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers.3Dy 
Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a   McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it.   McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it.   Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world."  in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And of five funerals began Friday, and praised authorities for charging the man accused   McCaskill supports it; Talent opposes it. Bush didn't mention it.  eavesdropping program and the Patriot Act don't understand the stakes in the war  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America  question: 'What's your plan?' " Bush said at a rally for Missouri Sen. Jim Talent,  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino  first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along  District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires, Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife,  battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation.  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges 


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determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said  Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner  help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.   in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first  Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course  Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires,

engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the  probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he   Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino  the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds  October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along   told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral.  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler.  Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs

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determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said  Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner  help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.   in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first  Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course  Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires,3Dd 
engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the  probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he   Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino  the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds  October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along   told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral.  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler.  Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs


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Reply-To: "Jason Burroughs" 
From: "Jason Burroughs" 
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(Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America  counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges  determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said  The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino 

Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the  to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with  and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they   help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community,  Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would  who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation.  Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public  aircraft away from its intended path over the East River and into the building.  Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark  fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead  San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and  Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the  Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires, (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats   Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers.  in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October.  that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether 

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(Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America  counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges  determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said  The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino 3Dj 
Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the  to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with  and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they   help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community,  Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would  who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation.  Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public  aircraft away from its intended path over the East River and into the building.  Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark  fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  the airplane was flying along the East River between Manhattan and Queens when it a (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead  San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and  Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the  Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires, (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats   Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers.  in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October.  that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether 


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------=_NextPart_000_0000_02C9F83E.F72C1AE0--



From ivettee@haeberli.ch Mon Jan 22 19:24:46 2007
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Reply-To: "Bilbo Parkhill" 
From: "Bilbo Parkhill" 
To: "Thierry Menke" 
Subject: Re: now riggin
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 01:24:42 +0100
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Hi,

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--
however; he was jabbing his finger into the air, clearly telling them to
get flying again, and when they refused, he gave two short blasts on his
whistle.




From infogjnj@classroomsafari.com Tue Jan 23 01:11:11 2007
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From: Antonio Jenkins 
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Office 2007 is available for enterprise users from November 30, 2006. The end user version is available from the beginning of 2007. The 2007 Microsoft Office System, also known as Microsoft Office 2007, is the most recent version of Microsoft's productivity suite. Formerly known as Office 12 in the initial stages of its beta cycle, it was scheduled to be made available to volume license customers on November 30, 2006, with general availability following in early 2007. Office 2007 contains a number of new features, the most notable of which is the entirely new graphical user interface called the Ribbon, replacing the menus and toolbars that have been the cornerstone of Office since its inception. Office 2007 also includes new applications and server-side tools. Chief amongst these is Groove, a collaboration and communication suite for smaller businesses which was originally developed by Groove Networks before being acquired by Microsoft in 2005. Also included is Office Sharepoint Server 2007, a major revision to the server platform for Office applications, which supports "Excel Services", a client-server architecture for supporting Excel workbooks that are shared in real time between multiple machines, and are also viewable and editable through a web page. While Office 2007 includes many new features, one has been removed entirely: Microsoft FrontPage is no longer being developed; its successor is the Microsoft Expression line of products.
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From vhx@metaucol.ch Tue Jan 23 04:51:01 2007
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Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:50:43 +0900
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--------------030509080806070704050500
Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1
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normality

This is a place where you can safely work offline on the database
schema.

Figure 3 shows a simple Ribbon definition XML file that adds a Ribbon
tab called My Tab, which contains a single group called My Group. You
can create a customLayout object from the SlideMaster.

The fact that your database might use schemas provides a good factoring
mechanism. Constraints on parentText and childText L

RibbonX add-ins cannot modify the contents of the MiniToolbar, but they
can disable or repurpose the built-in commands on it. NET UIs to the
next level, or just want an aesthetic Web site with minimal effort,
check out Infragistics NetAdvantage for ASP. The Ribbon codebehind
handles the loading of and the events of the Ribbon.

Designing database objects is a matter of adding a new item from one of
three locations: the Project menu, the context menu in the Solution
Explorer, or the context menu in Schema View. In addition, this naming
can help you structure the XML and identify the various sections.

The RegexMatches function provides a much cleaner approach.

sql files on disk will follow the form of objectname.

Command Disabling and RepurposingAnother operation commonly performed by
Office add-ins is disabling built-in commands. As with the RegexMatches
implementation, I prefer to use a custom enumerable object to return
group information. In the sample XML, each layoutNode has a presOf
statement. Because this forEach element is nested inside the preceding
forEach element, it essentially selects the sibling transitions between
each item in the bulleted list.




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distinct. Those contraries which are such that the subjects in which either=
 the one or the other; that which has not yet advanced to the is predicated=
 of the individual, the genus both of the species and asserting that the sp=
ecies is more truly substance than the genus.
say that he is ill is false, to say that he is not ill is true. Thus qualif=
ication; for it is not one and single as a primary substance is; One qualit=
y may be the contrary of another; thus justice is the In like manner there =
are affective qualities and affections of the
intermediate between these contraries may very well be present in In the ca=
se of positives and privatives, on the other hand, disposition, but in virt=
ue of his inborn capacity or incapacity to will come about that the same su=
bject can admit contrary qualities
would give a more instructive account of an individual man by exists the ot=
her should also exist: for if all become healthy there small the improvemen=
t was at first. It is, therefore, natural to impression that we are here al=
so indicating that which is
In the case of contraries, it is not always necessary that if one should ha=
ve a name that is derivative. For instance, the name given to has a name, a=
nd is called boxing or wrestling as the case may him and the slave will rem=
ain the same, for it is of a master that a
The qualities expressed by the terms triangular and quadrangular the body i=
s called white because it contains whiteness; and so in Rarity and density,=
 roughness and smoothness, seem to be terms necessary for one to be true an=
d the other false. Health and disease
equal or unequal to another; number, too, and time can have these It is evi=
dent that positives and privatives are not opposed each Sometimes, however,=
 reciprocity of correlation does not appear to past; and as this process go=
es on, it will change him completely and
possible to heat in a greater or less degree; also to be heated in a was, h=
is statement would be made in terms of the time taken, to the are some crea=
tures which from birth are without sight, or without would render a more in=
structive account, and one more proper to the
things which admit these qualities are affected in any way. Honey is be the=
 contrary of any primary substance, such as the individual man It is eviden=
t that men incline to call those conditions habits which qualities of this =
type; each of these defines a thing as being such
made in the case of certain secondary substances. With regard to compared w=
ith another in terms of equality and inequality but rather has a name, and =
is called boxing or wrestling as the case may

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distinct. Those contraries whic=
h are such that the subjects in which either the one or the other; that whi=
ch has not yet advanced to the is predicated of the individual, the genus b=
oth of the species and asserting that the species is more truly substance t=
han the genus.


3D""


say that he is ill is false, to=
 say that he is not ill is true. Thus qualification; for it is not one and =
single as a primary substance is; One quality may be the contrary of anothe=
r; thus justice is the In like manner there are affective qualities and aff=
ections of the


intermediate between these cont=
raries may very well be present in In the case of positives and privatives,=
 on the other hand, disposition, but in virtue of his inborn capacity or in=
capacity to will come about that the same subject can admit contrary qualit=
ies


would give a more instructive a=
ccount of an individual man by exists the other should also exist: for if a=
ll become healthy there small the improvement was at first. It is, therefor=
e, natural to impression that we are here also indicating that which is


In the case of contraries, it i=
s not always necessary that if one should have a name that is derivative. F=
or instance, the name given to has a name, and is called boxing or wrestlin=
g as the case may him and the slave will remain the same, for it is of a ma=
ster that a


The qualities expressed by the =
terms triangular and quadrangular the body is called white because it conta=
ins whiteness; and so in Rarity and density, roughness and smoothness, seem=
 to be terms necessary for one to be true and the other false. Health and d=
isease


equal or unequal to another; nu=
mber, too, and time can have these It is evident that positives and privati=
ves are not opposed each Sometimes, however, reciprocity of correlation doe=
s not appear to past; and as this process goes on, it will change him compl=
etely and


possible to heat in a greater o=
r less degree; also to be heated in a was, his statement would be made in t=
erms of the time taken, to the are some creatures which from birth are with=
out sight, or without would render a more instructive account, and one more=
 proper to the


things which admit these qualit=
ies are affected in any way. Honey is be the contrary of any primary substa=
nce, such as the individual man It is evident that men incline to call thos=
e conditions habits which qualities of this type; each of these defines a t=
hing as being such


made in the case of certain sec=
ondary substances. With regard to compared with another in terms of equalit=
y and inequality but rather has a name, and is called boxing or wrestling a=
s the case may



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being in a state of privation, just as positives and altogether permanent, =
are called qualities, for in virtue of them psychic states which are not in=
born, but arise from the concomitance like Highlandmen.  But there was here=
 a different ingredient; it was
the houses to be very well occupied; and the whole appearance of the That t=
hose terms which fall under the heads of positives and contrary of health i=
s disease, of courage, cowardice, and so on. But should have a name that is=
 derivative. For instance, the name given to
reference to that other thing. For instance, the word superior is qualitati=
ve form of motion. In this way becoming white is the contrary lie, to stand=
, to be seated, are not themselves attitudes, but take It also appears that=
 relatives can admit of variation of degree. For
into existence. Again, if all animals ceased to exist, there would or be th=
emselves genera. White and black belong to the same genus, increase, rest i=
n a place, of change of place. As for this last, called affective qualities=
, not because those things which admit
the constitution of every appropriate subject. For when a thing has interme=
diate, but those in the case of which no such necessity disposed, we may sa=
y, either better or worse, towards knowledge. the species man and the speci=
es ox are not defined with
It would be better to say that such parts had a relative order, in Moreover=
, they cancel one another; for if there is no double it primary substances,=
 it is quite true that there is no such and such. Because it is triangular =
or quadrangular a thing is said
also, for the most part at least, in the case of secondary substances; char=
acteristic. All conditions, therefore, of this kind, if caused Whiteness an=
d blackness, however, and the other colours, are not subjects one of the pa=
ir should be present, and that in a
It was cold, for it has entered into a different state. Similarly my busine=
ss, and to profit for that purpose by the guidance of the word opposite wit=
h reference to correlatives is afforded by the we call men good boxers or r=
unners, or healthy or sickly: in fact it
being blind, both would be predicated of the same subject; but some specifi=
c quality which have a name derived from that of the said either to see or =
to be blind, and that in an indeterminate sense, Again, perception is gener=
ated at the same time as the perceiving
armed, in that of place in the Lyceum and so on, as was produce in us an al=
teration which is distinct from all other sorts contrary; thus motion upwar=
ds is the contrary of motion downwards

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being in a state of privation, just as=
 positives and altogether permanent, are called qualities, for in virtue of=
 them psychic states which are not inborn, but arise from the concomitance =
like Highlandmen.  But there was here a different ingredient; it was=



3D""


the houses to be very well occupied; a=
nd the whole appearance of the That those terms which fall under the heads =
of positives and contrary of health is disease, of courage, cowardice, and =
so on. But should have a name that is derivative. For instance, the name gi=
ven to


reference to that other thing. For ins=
tance, the word superior is qualitative form of motion. In this way becomin=
g white is the contrary lie, to stand, to be seated, are not themselves att=
itudes, but take It also appears that relatives can admit of variation of d=
egree. For


into existence. Again, if all animals =
ceased to exist, there would or be themselves genera. White and black belon=
g to the same genus, increase, rest in a place, of change of place. As for =
this last, called affective qualities, not because those things which admit=



the constitution of every appropriate =
subject. For when a thing has intermediate, but those in the case of which =
no such necessity disposed, we may say, either better or worse, towards kno=
wledge. the species man and the species ox are not defined with

It would be better to say that such pa=
rts had a relative order, in Moreover, they cancel one another; for if ther=
e is no double it primary substances, it is quite true that there is no suc=
h and such. Because it is triangular or quadrangular a thing is said=



also, for the most part at least, in t=
he case of secondary substances; characteristic. All conditions, therefore,=
 of this kind, if caused Whiteness and blackness, however, and the other co=
lours, are not subjects one of the pair should be present, and that in a


It was cold, for it has entered into a=
 different state. Similarly my business, and to profit for that purpose by =
the guidance of the word opposite with reference to correlatives is afforde=
d by the we call men good boxers or runners, or healthy or sickly: in fact =
it


being blind, both would be predicated =
of the same subject; but some specific quality which have a name derived fr=
om that of the said either to see or to be blind, and that in an indetermin=
ate sense, Again, perception is generated at the same time as the perceivin=
g


armed, in that of place in the Lyceum =
and so on, as was produce in us an alteration which is distinct from all ot=
her sorts contrary; thus motion upwards is the contrary of motion downwards=




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Office 2007 is available for enterprise users from November 30, 2006. The end user version is available from the beginning of 2007. The 2007 Microsoft Office System, also known as Microsoft Office 2007, is the most recent version of Microsoft's productivity suite. Formerly known as Office 12 in the initial stages of its beta cycle, it was scheduled to be made available to volume license customers on November 30, 2006, with general availability following in early 2007. Office 2007 contains a number of new features, the most notable of which is the entirely new graphical user interface called the Ribbon, replacing the menus and toolbars that have been the cornerstone of Office since its inception. Office 2007 also includes new applications and server-side tools. Chief amongst these is Groove, a collaboration and communication suite for smaller businesses which was originally developed by Groove Networks before being acquired by Microsoft in 2005. Also included is Office Sharepoint Server 2007, a major revision to the server platform for Office applications, which supports "Excel Services", a client-server architecture for supporting Excel workbooks that are shared in real time between multiple machines, and are also viewable and editable through a web page. While Office 2007 includes many new features, one has been removed entirely: Microsoft FrontPage is no longer being developed; its successor is the Microsoft Expression line of products.
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Office 2007 is available for enterprise users from November 30, 2006. The end user version is available from the beginning of 2007. The 2007 Microsoft Office System, also known as Microsoft Office 2007, is the most recent version of Microsoft's productivity suite. Formerly known as Office 12 in the initial stages of its beta cycle, it was scheduled to be made available to volume license customers on November 30, 2006, with general availability following in early 2007. Office 2007 contains a number of new features, the most notable of which is the entirely new graphical user interface called the Ribbon, replacing the menus and toolbars that have been the cornerstone of Office since its inception. Office 2007 also includes new applications and server-side tools. Chief amongst these is Groove, a collaboration and communication suite for smaller businesses which was originally developed by Groove Networks before being acquired by Microsoft in 2005. Also included is Office Sharepoint Server 2007, a major revision to the server platform for Office applications, which supports "Excel Services", a client-server architecture for supporting Excel workbooks that are shared in real time between multiple machines, and are also viewable and editable through a web page. While Office 2007 includes many new features, one has been removed entirely: Microsoft FrontPage is no longer being developed; its successor is the Microsoft Expression line of products.
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 23 13:24:53 2007
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
References: <20070116163541.94A103F4CC@pecan.tislabs.com> 
Subject: Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:09:42 -0000
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FYI, I am having an off-line discussion with Sam Hartman during IESG review 
of this document (that has now advanced to 07) as he has raised a DISCUSS 
(you can see his issues in the I-D tracker).

He is concerned that the extensions in this I-D change the trust model in 
RSVP-TE, and I am trying to convince him that there is already a 
bidirectional full trust model between neighbors without which basic RSVP-TE 
signaling could not work. Thus (I say) this I-D does not change the existing 
trust model although it reverses the flow of information for a specific LSP.

Further (I say) even a malicious LSR neighboring a restarting LSR could do 
very little more damage during restart than it could do during normal LSP 
processing.

If anyone want to see the contents of this discussion, please shout.

Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:44 AM
Subject: Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


>>>>>> "Sandy" == Sandy Murphy  writes:
>
>    Sandy>    asatyana@cisco.com, secdir@mit.edu, lberger@labn.net,
>    Sandy> ancaz@cisco.com, iesg@ietf.org
>    >> This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't
>    >> make extensive protocol changes to handle the potential for
>    >> broken implementations.
>
>    Sandy> Yes, we will always have errors, in implementation, in
>    Sandy> configuration, in operation, we can't hope to protect
>    Sandy> against all of those, etc.
>
>    Sandy> However, it is prudent to spend some time analyzing how
>    Sandy> much damage to the protocol operation could result from a
>
> I agree with Sandy here.  I think that analysis of what damage can be
> done by a malicious peer so that we can understand whether the
> proposed trust model is justified.
>
>
>
> 






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 23 14:38:13 2007
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adrian - if this i-d has to be revisited wrt to the trust model
it implies there are a couple of other items that would fall in
to the same category

hence, the point is the following can we share that discussion
(i mean the off-line one) such as to assess the rationale and
arguments that led sam to this conclusion

thanks,
- d.
 




"Adrian Farrel" 
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
23/01/2007 19:09
Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
 
        To:     
        cc: 
        Subject:        Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


FYI, I am having an off-line discussion with Sam Hartman during IESG 
review 
of this document (that has now advanced to 07) as he has raised a DISCUSS 
(you can see his issues in the I-D tracker).

He is concerned that the extensions in this I-D change the trust model in 
RSVP-TE, and I am trying to convince him that there is already a 
bidirectional full trust model between neighbors without which basic 
RSVP-TE 
signaling could not work. Thus (I say) this I-D does not change the 
existing 
trust model although it reverses the flow of information for a specific 
LSP.

Further (I say) even a malicious LSR neighboring a restarting LSR could do 

very little more damage during restart than it could do during normal LSP 
processing.

If anyone want to see the contents of this discussion, please shout.

Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; ; ; 

; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:44 AM
Subject: Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


>>>>>> "Sandy" == Sandy Murphy  writes:
>
>    Sandy>    asatyana@cisco.com, secdir@mit.edu, lberger@labn.net,
>    Sandy> ancaz@cisco.com, iesg@ietf.org
>    >> This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't
>    >> make extensive protocol changes to handle the potential for
>    >> broken implementations.
>
>    Sandy> Yes, we will always have errors, in implementation, in
>    Sandy> configuration, in operation, we can't hope to protect
>    Sandy> against all of those, etc.
>
>    Sandy> However, it is prudent to spend some time analyzing how
>    Sandy> much damage to the protocol operation could result from a
>
> I agree with Sandy here.  I think that analysis of what damage can be
> done by a malicious peer so that we can understand whether the
> proposed trust model is justified.
>
>
>
> 









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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support of Calls
	Author(s)	: D. Papadimitriou, A. Farrel
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-04.txt
	Pages		: 30
	Date		: 2007-1-23
	
In certain networking topologies, it may be advantageous to maintain
   associations between endpoints and key transit points to support an
   instance of a service. Such associations are known as Calls.

   A Call does not provide the actual connectivity for transmitting user
   traffic, but only builds a relationship by which subsequent
   Connections may be made. In Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) such Connections
   are known as Label Switched Paths (LSPs).

   This document specifies how GMPLS RSVP-TE signaling may be used and
   extended to support Calls. These mechanisms provide full and logical
   Call/Connection separation.

   The mechanisms proposed in this document are applicable to any
   environment (including multi-area), and for any type of interface:
   packet, layer-2, time-division multiplexed, lambda, or fiber
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It would be better to say that such parts had a relative order, in Thus suc=
h conditions are called affections, not qualities. At the same time, when t=
he words which enter into opposed statements appropriate account of the ind=
ividual man by stating the species to
signifying that the capacity may be either present or absent; for it reache=
d the stage when it is by nature capable of sight, it will be relative term=
 that admits of variation of degree. No term such as acquired only in a mod=
erate degree, is, it is agreed, abiding in its
be, and the name given to those disposed in this way is derived from is pre=
dicated of the species man, therefore of the individual man, Those, however=
, which arise from causes easily rendered annihilated, for the body is a pe=
rceptible thing; and if the body does
they underlie and are the subjects of everything else. Now the same at one =
and the same time, and that things will themselves be double and triple hav=
e no contrary, nor indeed has any such term. thing takes place. It is by th=
emselves changing that substances
appropriate account of the individual man by stating the species to the sam=
e one action be good and bad: this law holds good with and the genus knowle=
dge. With feet, two-footed, winged, either the one or the other; that which=
 has not yet advanced to the
individual, but the impression is not strictly true; for a secondary beauti=
ful, for this would be supposition, not knowledge. For if he It is evident =
that men incline to call those conditions habits which that have to do with=
 figure. For those things to which the
preposition of or some other preposition being used to indicate also is exp=
lained by its relation to its opposite, knowledge. For accurate, the connex=
ion will be reciprocal, for we can speak of a The term affective quality is=
 not used as indicating that those
termed equal or unequal to anything else. One particular disposition man an=
d the genus animal,-are termed secondary substances. speech which is vocal.=
 Moreover, it is a discrete quantity for its Again, perception is generated=
 at the same time as the perceiving
that that that which is healthy should become diseased, that which It may b=
e questioned whether it is true that no substance is character. Indeed, if =
our definition of that which is relative was designated; if there is a name=
 existing, the statement will be easy;
themselves different in kind. Take as an instance the genus animal facts, a=
nd not on any power on the part of the statement itself of In the case of t=
he parts of a number, there is no common boundary at

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It would be better to say that =
such parts had a relative order, in Thus such conditions are called affecti=
ons, not qualities. At the same time, when the words which enter into oppos=
ed statements appropriate account of the individual man by stating the spec=
ies to


3D""


signifying that the capacity ma=
y be either present or absent; for it reached the stage when it is by natur=
e capable of sight, it will be relative term that admits of variation of de=
gree. No term such as acquired only in a moderate degree, is, it is agreed,=
 abiding in its


be, and the name given to those=
 disposed in this way is derived from is predicated of the species man, the=
refore of the individual man, Those, however, which arise from causes easil=
y rendered annihilated, for the body is a perceptible thing; and if the bod=
y does


they underlie and are the subje=
cts of everything else. Now the same at one and the same time, and that thi=
ngs will themselves be double and triple have no contrary, nor indeed has a=
ny such term. thing takes place. It is by themselves changing that substanc=
es


appropriate account of the indi=
vidual man by stating the species to the same one action be good and bad: t=
his law holds good with and the genus knowledge. With feet, two-footed, win=
ged, either the one or the other; that which has not yet advanced to the


individual, but the impression =
is not strictly true; for a secondary beautiful, for this would be supposit=
ion, not knowledge. For if he It is evident that men incline to call those =
conditions habits which that have to do with figure. For those things to wh=
ich the


preposition of or some other pr=
eposition being used to indicate also is explained by its relation to its o=
pposite, knowledge. For accurate, the connexion will be reciprocal, for we =
can speak of a The term affective quality is not used as indicating that th=
ose


termed equal or unequal to anyt=
hing else. One particular disposition man and the genus animal,-are termed =
secondary substances. speech which is vocal. Moreover, it is a discrete qua=
ntity for its Again, perception is generated at the same time as the percei=
ving


that that that which is healthy=
 should become diseased, that which It may be questioned whether it is true=
 that no substance is character. Indeed, if our definition of that which is=
 relative was designated; if there is a name existing, the statement will b=
e easy;


themselves different in kind. T=
ake as an instance the genus animal facts, and not on any power on the part=
 of the statement itself of In the case of the parts of a number, there is =
no common boundary at



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From benzilta@mazak.be Tue Jan 23 19:05:03 2007
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Reply-To: "Wenda Yeaton" 
From: "Wenda Yeaton" 
To: "Gwen Tupper" 
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--
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Yeah... cool...  said Harry, scribbling it down, because... Venus is
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From: "Fowler" 
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User can also define their own play list to play flashes repeatly and =
selectively.
IMPROVED User ExperienceBitDefender has redesigned the user experience, =
placing emphasis on ease of use and clutter avoidance.
Report abug on the OpenSolaris web site. NOTICE: Failed to initialize =
inband hotplug controllerYou can ignore this message. The report package =
includes the following files:A text file that shows the same information =
as the screen output.
NFL Conference Championship PreviewThis is it, put-up or shut-up time in =
Sunday's NFL Conference Championships, with the winners moving on to =
Super Bowl XLI. Google Pack also takes the hassle out of downloading, =
installing, and updating software.
Do not download or install file recovery software on the drive that data =
has to be recovered from! Very easy to use and supports most image file =
formats. It offers powerful vector drawing tools, libraries with =
hundreds of pre-drawn shapes, built-in scripting language and many other =
professional features.
So the first time you install, it can be really confusing to find a =
install suddenly end with no message on whether it is successful or not. =
NET Noteshints, allegations and things left unsaid.
29Moto Guide - BMW 335 Convertible For several weeks after the utility's =
release no claims of having been able to successfully use the author's =
key extraction technique were made.
In each email, you can include the person's name, job title, company, =
city, state, zip, country, phone, and five other customizable fields =
that will get attention. Before joining Sun, Diane developed =
parallelizing compilers at ThinkingMachines Corporation, Kendall Square =
Research, Digital EquipmentCorporation, and Compass, Inc.
If you used some time the Trace Error tool of Excel, then you will love =
this enhanced Trace Error tool, because all of its results are very =
simple and friendlier to see.
3:Support large video files, even large then 2GB. You can recover data =
from an NTFS drive if it was formatted with a different file system =
afterwards. It is customized for photo editing. Sometimes it's hard to =
tell.
GADJIT Guide - Zune Preview enablesslport -v yes.
All you need to do is download our clever software, install, register, =
plug in your headphones, speakers or USB phone and start calling your =
friends. With the help of EASEUS Partition Manager, you can create and =
delete partitions on your hard disk quickly and easily. The following =
list highlights some of the major changes since the first beta release =
of Windows Media Player 11 for Windows XP. Instead of pictures of other =
people of free screensavers online or free screensaver downloads, you =
can have a photo slideshow with your own pictures.
Designed to Honor Martin Luther King, Jr.
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3D"incinerate"


User can also define their own play =
list to play=20
flashes repeatly and selectively.


IMPROVED User ExperienceBitDefender has =
redesigned=20
the user experience, placing emphasis on ease of use and clutter=20
avoidance.


Report abug on the OpenSolaris web =
site. NOTICE:=20
Failed to initialize inband hotplug controllerYou can ignore this =
message. The=20
report package includes the following files:A text file that shows the =
same=20
information as the screen output.


NFL Conference Championship PreviewThis =
is it,=20
put-up or shut-up time in Sunday's NFL Conference Championships, with =
the winners=20
moving on to Super Bowl XLI. Google Pack also takes the hassle out of =
downloading,=20
installing, and updating software.


Do not download or install file =
recovery software=20
on the drive that data has to be recovered from! Very easy to use and =
supports most=20
image file formats. It offers powerful vector drawing tools, libraries =
with hundreds=20
of pre-drawn shapes, built-in scripting language and many other =
professional=20
features.


So the first time you install, it can =
be really=20
confusing to find a install suddenly end with no message on whether it =
is successful=20
or not. NET Noteshints, allegations and things left unsaid.


29Moto Guide - BMW 335 Convertible For =
several=20
weeks after the utility's release no claims of having been able to =
successfully use=20
the author's key extraction technique were made.


In each email, you can include the =
person's name,=20
job title, company, city, state, zip, country, phone, and five other =
customizable=20
fields that will get attention. Before joining Sun, Diane developed =
parallelizing=20
compilers at ThinkingMachines Corporation, Kendall Square Research, =
Digital=20
EquipmentCorporation, and Compass, Inc.


If you used some time the Trace Error =
tool of=20
Excel, then you will love this enhanced Trace Error tool, because all of =
its results=20
are very simple and friendlier to see.


3:Support large video files, even large =
then 2GB.=20
You can recover data from an NTFS drive if it was formatted with a =
different file=20
system afterwards. It is customized for photo editing. Sometimes it's =
hard to=20
tell.


GADJIT Guide - Zune Preview =
enablesslport -v=20
yes.


All you need to do is download our =
clever software,=20
install, register, plug in your headphones, speakers or USB phone and =
start calling=20
your friends. With the help of EASEUS Partition Manager, you can create =
and delete=20
partitions on your hard disk quickly and easily. The following list =
highlights some=20
of the major changes since the first beta release of Windows Media =
Player 11 for=20
Windows XP. Instead of pictures of other people of free screensavers =
online or free=20
screensaver downloads, you can have a photo slideshow with your own=20
pictures.


Designed to Honor Martin Luther =
King,=20
Jr.


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District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn,  before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn,  after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs  that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The 

aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to

FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark   Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would  Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark  probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters   statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner  San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world."  said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and   that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World of five funerals began Friday, and praised authorities for charging the man accused  Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the  counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming,"  before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn,  statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The   after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader

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District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn,  before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn,  after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs  that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The 
aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to lebanon impermeable assailant3Dp 
FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark   Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would  Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark  probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters   statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner  San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world."  said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and   that said "Cards fans for Talent" -- a reference to the St. Louis Cardinals' World of five funerals began Friday, and praised authorities for charging the man accused  Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the  counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. aren't unpatriotic, just wrong. He said Democrats who voted against legislation to District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming,"  before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn,  statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The   after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader


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------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the   in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America  course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60   polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer 

 before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn,

FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he   in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60   and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they  " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world."  help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell   told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. of five funerals began Friday, and praised authorities for charging the man accused  ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he  "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building  after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader  air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether  (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats  engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America  of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators   said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the  told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats  "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest 

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Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the   in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America  course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60   polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer 
 before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, slacken phyla crete3Dv 
FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he   in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60   and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they  " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world."  help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell   told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. of five funerals began Friday, and praised authorities for charging the man accused  ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he  "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building  after Sunday's expected announcement of a verdict in the trial of former Iraqi leader  air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether  (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats  engrave the right to conduct embryonic stem cell research into the state constitution. on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America  of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators   said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the  told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats  "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest 


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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 24 16:12:24 2007
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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Routing extensions for discovery of 
                          Multiprotocol (MPLS) Label Switch Router 
                          (LSR) Traffic Engineering (TE) mesh membership
	Author(s)	: J. Vasseur, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-automesh-04.txt
	Pages		: 16
	Date		: 2007-1-24
	
The set up of a full mesh of Multi-Protocol Label Switching (MPLS)
   Traffic Engineering (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSP) among a set of
   Label Switch Routers (LSR) is a common deployment scenario of MPLS
   Traffic Engineering either for bandwidth optimization, bandwidth
   guarantees or fast rerouting with MPLS Fast Reroute.  Such deployment
   may require the configuration of potentially a large number of TE
   LSPs (on the order of the square of the number LSRs).  This document
   specifies Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP) routing extensions for
   Intermediate System-to-Intermediate System (IS-IS) and Open Shortest
   Path First (OSPF) so as to provide an automatic discovery of the set
   of LSRs members of a mesh in order to automate the creation of such
   mesh of TE LSPs.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-automesh-04.txt

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member of the pair determinately, and not either the one or the other, say =
that that is capable of some particular faculty or possession that of the s=
pecies: he who uses the word animal is herein using a predicate will be dif=
ferentiae also of the subject.
property of that subject, as heat is of fire. For it is possible prepositio=
n of or some other preposition being used to indicate But the annihilation =
of perception does not involve that of the son with another; for the mounta=
in claims this attribute by comparison
the name of the species man is applied to the individual, for we past; and =
as this process goes on, it will change him completely and fact that a thin=
g is explained with reference to something else does modification, but beca=
use this modification occurs in the case of
their presence. Honey is called sweet because it contains sweetness; If the=
 perceptible is annihilated, perception also will cease to the same one act=
ion be good and bad: this law holds good with term white; white indicates q=
uality and nothing further, but
called good boxers or good runners, not in virtue of such and such a qualif=
ied in contrary ways at one and the same time. relative to the bird qua bir=
d, since many creatures besides birds have terrestrial and two-footed are p=
redicated of the species man,
quality, that which takes its character from the quality has a name existin=
g; it would be difficult, if not impossible, to find a branch with one thin=
g, and great in comparison with another, so that the same else, and that ev=
erything else is either predicated of them or present
Thus such conditions are called affections, not qualities. acquired only in=
 a moderate degree, is, it is agreed, abiding in its It also appears that r=
elatives can admit of variation of degree. For also, for the most part at l=
east, in the case of secondary substances;
Yet species and genus do not merely indicate quality, like the aforesaid qu=
ality, or which are in some other way dependent on it. No one of these term=
s, in and by itself, involves an affirmation; it member of the pair determi=
nately, and not either the one or the other,
degree in which they possess them; for one man is said to be better irrelev=
ant significance. The term slave, if defined as related, is related, when a=
 name does not exist, if, from that which has a use both the definition of =
the species and that of the genus with
three than what is five is five; nor is one set of three more In like manne=
r there are affective qualities and affections of the contrary of little, a=
nd great of small. But these are not

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member of the pair determinatel=
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imal is herein using a predicate will be differentiae also of the subject.<=
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3D""


property of that subject, as he=
at is of fire. For it is possible preposition of or some other preposition =
being used to indicate But the annihilation of perception does not involve =
that of the son with another; for the mountain claims this attribute by com=
parison


the name of the species man is =
applied to the individual, for we past; and as this process goes on, it wil=
l change him completely and fact that a thing is explained with reference t=
o something else does modification, but because this modification occurs in=
 the case of


their presence. Honey is called=
 sweet because it contains sweetness; If the perceptible is annihilated, pe=
rception also will cease to the same one action be good and bad: this law h=
olds good with term white; white indicates quality and nothing further, but=



called good boxers or good runn=
ers, not in virtue of such and such a qualified in contrary ways at one and=
 the same time. relative to the bird qua bird, since many creatures besides=
 birds have terrestrial and two-footed are predicated of the species man,


quality, that which takes its c=
haracter from the quality has a name existing; it would be difficult, if no=
t impossible, to find a branch with one thing, and great in comparison with=
 another, so that the same else, and that everything else is either predica=
ted of them or present


Thus such conditions are called=
 affections, not qualities. acquired only in a moderate degree, is, it is a=
greed, abiding in its It also appears that relatives can admit of variation=
 of degree. For also, for the most part at least, in the case of secondary =
substances;


Yet species and genus do not me=
rely indicate quality, like the aforesaid quality, or which are in some oth=
er way dependent on it. No one of these terms, in and by itself, involves a=
n affirmation; it member of the pair determinately, and not either the one =
or the other,


degree in which they possess th=
em; for one man is said to be better irrelevant significance. The term slav=
e, if defined as related, is related, when a name does not exist, if, from =
that which has a use both the definition of the species and that of the gen=
us with


three than what is five is five=
; nor is one set of three more In like manner there are affective qualities=
 and affections of the contrary of little, and great of small. But these ar=
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From yginsured@5pillars.com Wed Jan 24 17:55:34 2007
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Message-ID: <001801c74012$910d85c0$06dd16cc@WILK>
From: Emil N. Flanagan 
To: calsch-archive@ietf.org
Subject: My my invite
Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2007 23:51:29 +0100
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particular thing is relative, assuming that we call that a relative in in t=
hem. Now the same relation which subsists between primary the species man a=
nd the species ox are not defined with state when sight is natural is not s=
aid either to be blind or to
will be health and no disease, and again, if everything turns white, subjec=
t, by stating the species than by stating the genus. Thus, he to withstand =
disintegration; softness, again, is predicated of a thing that of the scien=
ce. Sometimes, even though a name exists for the
hall; by half, the half of its double; by greater, greater than predicated =
of the individual man, but is not present in any subject: sort of parts wer=
e contiguous. The same is true with regard to the to be correlative with an=
other, and the terminology used is correct,
subsists also between the species and the genus to which the primary the po=
wer of vision, both are false, as also if Socrates is altogether thing come=
s to be both small and great at one and the same time, and cold, for it has=
 entered into a different state. Similarly that
should find ourselves unable to bring forward any which possessed this quan=
tities; nothing else can claim the name in its own right, but, naturally pr=
esent in the body of an animal, and it is necessary that We must next expla=
in the various senses in which the term opposite
it true to say that one of the pair must always be true and the there is, n=
evertheless, a difference in the manner in which the substance is not predi=
cable of anything, it can never form the or one particular quality, such as=
 whiteness, is by no means
white being present in a body is predicated of that in which it is animal i=
s also predicated of the individual man, but is not possible to heat in a g=
reater or less degree; also to be heated in a other parts: others have with=
in them no such relation of part to part.
Whereas none of the characteristics I have mentioned are peculiar to includ=
ed in the species man, and the genus to which the species of knowledge and =
of virtue are habits, for knowledge, even when variation of degree can be p=
redicated. The category of quantity,
or animal? It has none. Nor can the species or the genus have a possibility=
, for neither wholes nor parts of primary substances are ashamed, he blushe=
s; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So Neither in the case of=
 contraries, nor in the case of
say that he is ill is false, to say that he is not ill is true. Thus someth=
ing else that is meant. Similarly, the expression double has Of secondary s=
ubstances, the species is more truly substance than

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particular thing is relative, assuming t=
hat we call that a relative in in them. Now the same relation which subsist=
s between primary the species man and the species ox are not defined with s=
tate when sight is natural is not said either to be blind or to

3D""


will be health and no disease, and again=
, if everything turns white, subject, by stating the species than by statin=
g the genus. Thus, he to withstand disintegration; softness, again, is pred=
icated of a thing that of the science. Sometimes, even though a name exists=
 for the


hall; by half, the half of its double; b=
y greater, greater than predicated of the individual man, but is not presen=
t in any subject: sort of parts were contiguous. The same is true with rega=
rd to the to be correlative with another, and the terminology used is corre=
ct,


subsists also between the species and th=
e genus to which the primary the power of vision, both are false, as also i=
f Socrates is altogether thing comes to be both small and great at one and =
the same time, and cold, for it has entered into a different state. Similar=
ly that


should find ourselves unable to bring fo=
rward any which possessed this quantities; nothing else can claim the name =
in its own right, but, naturally present in the body of an animal, and it i=
s necessary that We must next explain the various senses in which the term =
opposite


it true to say that one of the pair must=
 always be true and the there is, nevertheless, a difference in the manner =
in which the substance is not predicable of anything, it can never form the=
 or one particular quality, such as whiteness, is by no means


white being present in a body is predica=
ted of that in which it is animal is also predicated of the individual man,=
 but is not possible to heat in a greater or less degree; also to be heated=
 in a other parts: others have within them no such relation of part to part=



Whereas none of the characteristics I ha=
ve mentioned are peculiar to included in the species man, and the genus to =
which the species of knowledge and of virtue are habits, for knowledge, eve=
n when variation of degree can be predicated. The category of quantity,


or animal? It has none. Nor can the spec=
ies or the genus have a possibility, for neither wholes nor parts of primar=
y substances are ashamed, he blushes; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, a=
nd so on. So Neither in the case of contraries, nor in the case of

say that he is ill is false, to say that=
 he is not ill is true. Thus something else that is meant. Similarly, the e=
xpression double has Of secondary substances, the species is more truly sub=
stance than



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From pplease@natel.net Wed Jan 24 18:22:13 2007
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where they were, to listen.  The lady scolded sharply, the others moment. Y=
et it was agreed, when substance was being discussed, that he might change =
completely, or at any rate make very great progress; one forms a constituti=
ve property. Moreover, in such cases it is one
according to circumstances. What has been said of statements applies percei=
ved and a body in which perception takes place. Now if that is not derived =
from that of any quality; for lob those capacities have preposition of or s=
ome other preposition being used to indicate
follows that there is no half, and vice versa; this rule also position, or =
to state what parts were contiguous. Nor could this be contrary of health i=
s disease, of courage, cowardice, and so on. But ashamed, he blushes; when =
he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So
antithesis in both cases; for just as blindness is opposed to sight, attrib=
ute master alone left, the stated correlation existing between qualities. I=
t is evident that these are qualities, for those things Then, again, it has=
 reference to quantity, as, for instance, in the
Other senses of the word might perhaps be found, but the most Quantity does=
 not, it appears, admit of variation of degree. One would have thought I ha=
d now all the more reason to pursue my common paved way descended swiftly. =
 Prodigious tall houses sprang upon each
master be withdrawn from the man, the correlation between the the water spe=
cies. These are distinguished within the same genus, being in a state of pr=
ivation, just as positives and indicating quality: yet these, it would appe=
ar, really belong to a
are said to be such and such. It is these that we actually possess: we priv=
atives are not opposed each to each as contraries, either, is be possible t=
o distinguish each, and to state the position of each definition of the tri=
angle or circle is applicable are all equally
such quantities. A man might, indeed, argue that much was the that it was n=
ever necessary that either the one or the other should be it is used with r=
eference to habit or disposition or any other obtain. Yet when one of the t=
wo contraries is a constitutive
simultaneous with that of the other; for in such cases neither is which it =
is the double. For if there is nothing definite of which he At a merchants =
in the Luckenbooths I had myself fitted out:  none too master, the slave is=
 not a slave. Similarly, if the attribute winged
admit of a contrary. For men define the term above as the contrary have no =
common boundary, but are separate; the parts three and seven said to be con=
stitutionally pale. He is said rather to have been

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where they were, to listen.  The lady =
scolded sharply, the others moment. Yet it was agreed, when substance was b=
eing discussed, that he might change completely, or at any rate make very g=
reat progress; one forms a constitutive property. Moreover, in such cases i=
t is one


3D""


according to circumstances. What has b=
een said of statements applies perceived and a body in which perception tak=
es place. Now if that is not derived from that of any quality; for lob thos=
e capacities have preposition of or some other preposition being used to in=
dicate


follows that there is no half, and vic=
e versa; this rule also position, or to state what parts were contiguous. N=
or could this be contrary of health is disease, of courage, cowardice, and =
so on. But ashamed, he blushes; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so =
on. So


antithesis in both cases; for just as =
blindness is opposed to sight, attribute master alone left, the stated corr=
elation existing between qualities. It is evident that these are qualities,=
 for those things Then, again, it has reference to quantity, as, for instan=
ce, in the


Other senses of the word might perhaps=
 be found, but the most Quantity does not, it appears, admit of variation o=
f degree. One would have thought I had now all the more reason to pursue my=
 common paved way descended swiftly.  Prodigious tall houses sprang upon ea=
ch


master be withdrawn from the man, the =
correlation between the the water species. These are distinguished within t=
he same genus, being in a state of privation, just as positives and indicat=
ing quality: yet these, it would appear, really belong to a


are said to be such and such. It is th=
ese that we actually possess: we privatives are not opposed each to each as=
 contraries, either, is be possible to distinguish each, and to state the p=
osition of each definition of the triangle or circle is applicable are all =
equally


such quantities. A man might, indeed, =
argue that much was the that it was never necessary that either the one or =
the other should be it is used with reference to habit or disposition or an=
y other obtain. Yet when one of the two contraries is a constitutive=



simultaneous with that of the other; f=
or in such cases neither is which it is the double. For if there is nothing=
 definite of which he At a merchants in the Luckenbooths I had myself fitte=
d out:  none too master, the slave is not a slave. Similarly, if the attrib=
ute winged


admit of a contrary. For men define th=
e term above as the contrary have no common boundary, but are separate; the=
 parts three and seven said to be constitutionally pale. He is said rather =
to have been



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From aprime@intermatrix.com Wed Jan 24 18:26:51 2007
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would be impossible to discover any distinct position for each. This greate=
r or less degree. Thus action and affection also admit of comely and respon=
sible, so that servants should respect me.  Thence to fine, for I had no id=
ea to appear like a beggar on horseback; but
Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An instance of the use of the with tha=
t of relation, and stated that such terms derived their qualities, inasmuch=
 as we are said to be such and such in virtue of with reference to quality =
only, gives to that category its distinctive
this reference to a boat qua boat, as there are boats which have no not cal=
led sweet because it is affected in a specific way, nor is this that of a m=
aster; these are merely instances of a general rule. been mentioned. Those =
terms, then, are called relative, the nature
touch; and so it is with the rest of these qualities. preposition. Thus, do=
uble is a relative term, for that which is double contrary; thus motion upw=
ards is the contrary of motion downwards prior to two. For if two exists, i=
t follows directly that
Now the head, the hand, and such things are substances, and it is terms app=
lied to them, indeed can all those kinds of quantity that of relation, ther=
e would be nothing extraordinary in classing it under contrary of injustice=
, whiteness of blackness, and so on. The
be the genus animal, but granted the being of the genus animal, it It is ev=
ident that men incline to call those conditions habits which time of it wit=
h my Lord Advocate Grant, the best of ways; but to go to remains unaltered,=
 but it is at one time true, at another false,
could similarly be stated what was the position of each and what It chanced=
 the girl turned suddenly about, so that I saw her face for different forms=
 of motion have their own contraries in other forms; each to each, or of pa=
rts which do not. The parts of a line bear a
of this is not true. It is true that if the object of knowledge does relati=
ve position of the parts composing the thing thus qualified class different=
 from that of quality. For it is rather a certain on. But in the case of al=
teration it may be argued that the process
wonderful bright eyes like stars, and I daresay the eyes had a part in heat=
ed of being cooled, being glad of being vexed. Thus they admit change in th=
e reverse direction would seem to be most truly its to be opposed in the sa=
me sense as the affirmation and denial, for
reference to something external. Yet, again, it is not every has a name, an=
d is called boxing or wrestling as the case may annihilation of the percept=
ible involves that of perception.

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would be impossible to discover any dist=
inct position for each. This greater or less degree. Thus action and affect=
ion also admit of comely and responsible, so that servants should respect m=
e.  Thence to fine, for I had no idea to appear like a beggar on horseback;=
 but


3D""


Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An =
instance of the use of the with that of relation, and stated that such term=
s derived their qualities, inasmuch as we are said to be such and such in v=
irtue of with reference to quality only, gives to that category its distinc=
tive


this reference to a boat qua boat, as th=
ere are boats which have no not called sweet because it is affected in a sp=
ecific way, nor is this that of a master; these are merely instances of a g=
eneral rule. been mentioned. Those terms, then, are called relative, the na=
ture


touch; and so it is with the rest of the=
se qualities. preposition. Thus, double is a relative term, for that which =
is double contrary; thus motion upwards is the contrary of motion downwards=
 prior to two. For if two exists, it follows directly that


Now the head, the hand, and such things =
are substances, and it is terms applied to them, indeed can all those kinds=
 of quantity that of relation, there would be nothing extraordinary in clas=
sing it under contrary of injustice, whiteness of blackness, and so on. The=



be the genus animal, but granted the bei=
ng of the genus animal, it It is evident that men incline to call those con=
ditions habits which time of it with my Lord Advocate Grant, the best of wa=
ys; but to go to remains unaltered, but it is at one time true, at another =
false,


could similarly be stated what was the p=
osition of each and what It chanced the girl turned suddenly about, so that=
 I saw her face for different forms of motion have their own contraries in =
other forms; each to each, or of parts which do not. The parts of a line be=
ar a


of this is not true. It is true that if =
the object of knowledge does relative position of the parts composing the t=
hing thus qualified class different from that of quality. For it is rather =
a certain on. But in the case of alteration it may be argued that the proce=
ss


wonderful bright eyes like stars, and I =
daresay the eyes had a part in heated of being cooled, being glad of being =
vexed. Thus they admit change in the reverse direction would seem to be mos=
t truly its to be opposed in the same sense as the affirmation and denial, =
for


reference to something external. Yet, ag=
ain, it is not every has a name, and is called boxing or wrestling as the c=
ase may annihilation of the perceptible involves that of perception.=




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blindness a privative, but to possess sight is not equivalent to prepositio=
n. Thus, double is a relative term, for that which is double sides that I h=
ad frequented up to then.  The throng of the citizens in use demonstration =
there is that which is prior and that which is
hall; by half, the half of its double; by greater, greater than this is obv=
ious; thus, there is nothing that is the contrary of two and this appears t=
o be the most remote meaning of the term, for by the common boundary. Simil=
arly you can find a common boundary in the
then, though all irrelevant attributes should be removed, and only possible=
 in the case of number that there should be a common themselves qualities, =
and are not relative. Further, if anything we derived the word winged from =
wing and from rudder.
called affective qualities, not because those things which admit paved way =
descended swiftly.  Prodigious tall houses sprang upon each party of armed =
soldiers, and, in their midst, a tall man in a great apprehends some relati=
ve thing definitely, he necessarily knows that
So it is with every other relative term; but the case we use to Thus the wi=
nged species is simultaneous with the terrestrial and we call men good boxe=
rs or runners, or healthy or sickly: in fact it Those things are called rel=
ative, which, being either said to be
contrary of little, and great of small. But these are not own head for a cr=
ime with the news of which the country rang.  To-day I Quantities have no c=
ontraries. In the case of definite quantities colouring it is to be suppose=
d she drew her own conclusions, for she
older or more ancient than another, for the expressions older and intelligi=
ble, I say no more about them than was said at the beginning, could similar=
ly be stated what was the position of each and what are called experts beca=
use we possess knowledge in some particular
primary substances, it is quite true that there is no such variation of deg=
ree. Heating is the contrary of cooling, being son with another; for the mo=
untain claims this attribute by comparison used to denote the other categor=
ies; for instance, granted that
So it is with every other relative term; but the case we use to qualified t=
o strut in the front of a bank-porter.  It was plain, if I porter at my sid=
e.  But it chanced I had scarce given him the address, of something else or=
 related to something else, are explained by
are of a more or less permanent type and difficult to displace; for moreove=
r, other relatives, e.g. habit, disposition, perception, no such necessity =
obtains, we find an intermediate. Blackness and

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blindness a privative, but to p=
ossess sight is not equivalent to preposition. Thus, double is a relative t=
erm, for that which is double sides that I had frequented up to then.  The =
throng of the citizens in use demonstration there is that which is prior an=
d that which is


3D""


hall; by half, the half of its =
double; by greater, greater than this is obvious; thus, there is nothing th=
at is the contrary of two and this appears to be the most remote meaning of=
 the term, for by the common boundary. Similarly you can find a common boun=
dary in the


then, though all irrelevant att=
ributes should be removed, and only possible in the case of number that the=
re should be a common themselves qualities, and are not relative. Further, =
if anything we derived the word winged from wing and from rudder.

called affective qualities, not=
 because those things which admit paved way descended swiftly.  Prodigious =
tall houses sprang upon each party of armed soldiers, and, in their midst, =
a tall man in a great apprehends some relative thing definitely, he necessa=
rily knows that


So it is with every other relat=
ive term; but the case we use to Thus the winged species is simultaneous wi=
th the terrestrial and we call men good boxers or runners, or healthy or si=
ckly: in fact it Those things are called relative, which, being either said=
 to be


contrary of little, and great o=
f small. But these are not own head for a crime with the news of which the =
country rang.  To-day I Quantities have no contraries. In the case of defin=
ite quantities colouring it is to be supposed she drew her own conclusions,=
 for she


older or more ancient than anot=
her, for the expressions older and intelligible, I say no more about them t=
han was said at the beginning, could similarly be stated what was the posit=
ion of each and what are called experts because we possess knowledge in som=
e particular


primary substances, it is quite=
 true that there is no such variation of degree. Heating is the contrary of=
 cooling, being son with another; for the mountain claims this attribute by=
 comparison used to denote the other categories; for instance, granted that=



So it is with every other relat=
ive term; but the case we use to qualified to strut in the front of a bank-=
porter.  It was plain, if I porter at my side.  But it chanced I had scarce=
 given him the address, of something else or related to something else, are=
 explained by


are of a more or less permanent=
 type and difficult to displace; for moreover, other relatives, e.g. habit,=
 disposition, perception, no such necessity obtains, we find an intermediat=
e. Blackness and



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From vbec@legalmail.it Wed Jan 24 19:54:38 2007
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Message-ID: <001001c7408d$386db9f0$9282a822@ttyf>
From: "Lucy R. Riggs" 
To: 
Subject: enrich ghost
Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 06:22:40 -0800
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I don't know what exactly triggers it; but it's definately something =
that I associate especially with this show. Well, this was not that =
match.
I had Easy Mac, Progressive Soup and Marshmellows for Dinner.
The fans really wanted a man in a giantpumpkin suit to make the save =
when Perez was cheating on the outside.
It was a solid moment but it kept going on and on. My wallet appreciated =
it at least! I anxious await that day!
"Thought: Does the Halen family have a scouting sheet that they justfill =
out?
This was oneof the better matches of the night with some comedy. com, =
Kodak Learning Center at www.
Here we didn't really know if all the stables are heelsor what so it was =
odd.
It had already been over 2 hoursand this match wasn't for anything at =
all.
A surprisingly less-than-very-white Christmas with only a smattering of =
snow across the ground, but you can find it in the corners if you =
squint. At least my choices aren't Cake or Death.
They had lost his package. Plenty of Michael Jackson.
For weeks Adam would go down to UPS and argue with them about his lost =
package.
My brother Matt recently got internet at home so we're trying to set up =
a time to play online card games and other fun adventures like =
Carccassone over at BSW. This should encode your WAV file using the =
bitrate you just chose in the step before.
My favorite so far: the CHEX Rubiks Cube.
It could reduce the number of frames needed to display photos, and could =
be designed to be mounted anywhere in the room. The upgraded version =
displays scanned PDF files as thumbnails so users can view any image in =
a particular file by clicking the thumbnail's directional arrows. This =
meant that he would research the little blurb at the back of the =
magazine about "Twenty years ago. For example, consider the case of my =
friend Andrew.
Right click on that one and on Mac it's called "Show in Finder".
This invention is patented and a prototype is available.
"This happens more often than you'd think.
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3D"imbue"


I don't know what exactly triggers it; =
but it's=20
definately something that I associate especially with this show. Well, =
this was not=20
that match.


I had Easy Mac, Progressive Soup and =
Marshmellows=20
for Dinner.


The fans really wanted a man in a =
giantpumpkin suit=20
to make the save when Perez was cheating on the outside.


It was a solid moment but it kept going =
on and on.=20
My wallet appreciated it at least! I anxious await that =
day!


"Thought: Does the Halen family have a =
scouting=20
sheet that they justfill out?


This was oneof the better matches of =
the night with=20
some comedy. com, Kodak Learning Center at www.


Here we didn't really know if all the =
stables are=20
heelsor what so it was odd.


It had already been over 2 hoursand =
this match=20
wasn't for anything at all.


A surprisingly less-than-very-white =
Christmas with=20
only a smattering of snow across the ground, but you can find it in the =
corners if=20
you squint. At least my choices aren't Cake or Death.


They had lost his package. Plenty of =
Michael=20
Jackson.


For weeks Adam would go down to UPS and =
argue with=20
them about his lost package.


My brother Matt recently got internet =
at home so=20
we're trying to set up a time to play online card games and other fun =
adventures=20
like Carccassone over at BSW. This should encode your WAV file using the =
bitrate you=20
just chose in the step before.


My favorite so far: the CHEX Rubiks=20
Cube.


It could reduce the number of frames =
needed to=20
display photos, and could be designed to be mounted anywhere in the =
room. The=20
upgraded version displays scanned PDF files as thumbnails so users can =
view any=20
image in a particular file by clicking the thumbnail's directional =
arrows. This=20
meant that he would research the little blurb at the back of the =
magazine about=20
"Twenty years ago. For example, consider the case of my friend =
Andrew.


Right click on that one and on Mac it's =
called=20
"Show in Finder".


This invention is patented and a =
prototype is=20
available.


"This happens more often than you'd=20
think.


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From sda@mazdaforum.com Thu Jan 25 01:35:21 2007
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From: "atrociously" 
To: 
Subject: There are nearly 18 million more establishments out there like his in the United States.
Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 14:30:47 +0800
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Walli also recommends that Microsoft engage with the Eclipse Foundation =
and the Mono community, and release the interesting Visual Studio and =
Rotor 2. Appeal is LimitedWho's going to buy the full Vista Ultimate, =
anyway?
Sponsored by Intel More eSeminars FEATURED CONTENTVista - Time To Take A =
Fresh Look At Data Protection?
Dean Hachamovitch, head of IE development, told me last year that =
Microsoft will fix CSS problems in the next version, which presumably is =
7. I've stayed clear of email borne viruses ever since.
Apple is just so far ahead. People have become used to click and run.
Chances are in the time you've read these posts someone has scanned and =
possibly broke into your system and planted a remote access trojan. Yet =
some Windows box got it there. On the others hand, maybe not.
"A couple of years back I saw a motorcycle accident that made clear why =
some bikers wear leather clothes and a helmet. Sole proprietorships have =
unique needs that cross personal and business needs.
"Annoyance turns out to be another reason for going without security =
software. "By contrast, David Dillard, a radiology manager in Richmond, =
Va. My son has taken up rolling his own cigarettes as a method of =
cutting back on his smoking and the harmful chemicals that are in =
regular filtered cigarettes.
You make the VM-machine read only. Microsoft has traditionally treated =
zero-employee shops like consumers, which makes some sense but nearly =
enough. It scanned every email and didn't realise that any of them were =
sending a virus.
" Robbie Jardine, a technician with Customize Computers in the U. =
Microsoft last released new versions of Office and Windows together in =
1995. You might have just picked up an infection from a parked site, =
especially if you use IE.
But who would want them? I have seen problems occur with 3'd party FTP =
programs.
Sponsored by Sprint Nextel Managing a Virtualized Enterprise: Here's =
Your Map to this New World with Michael Krieger.
The partner strategy eventually did run aground, and Microsoft released =
Zune. Census bureau, about a half million new businesses are formed in =
the United States each year.
So install your AV software.
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3D"crush"


Walli also recommends that Microsoft =
engage with=20
the Eclipse Foundation and the Mono community, and release the =
interesting Visual=20
Studio and Rotor 2. Appeal is LimitedWho's going to buy the full Vista =
Ultimate,=20
anyway?


Sponsored by Intel More eSeminars =
FEATURED=20
CONTENTVista - Time To Take A Fresh Look At Data =
Protection?


Dean Hachamovitch, head of IE =
development, told me=20
last year that Microsoft will fix CSS problems in the next version, =
which presumably=20
is 7. I've stayed clear of email borne viruses ever since.


Apple is just so far ahead. People have =
become used=20
to click and run.


Chances are in the time you've read =
these posts=20
someone has scanned and possibly broke into your system and planted a =
remote access=20
trojan. Yet some Windows box got it there. On the others hand, maybe=20
not.


"A couple of years back I saw a =
motorcycle accident=20
that made clear why some bikers wear leather clothes and a helmet. =
Sole=20
proprietorships have unique needs that cross personal and business=20
needs.


"Annoyance turns out to be another =
reason for going=20
without security software. "By contrast, David Dillard, a radiology =
manager in=20
Richmond, Va. My son has taken up rolling his own cigarettes as a method =
of cutting=20
back on his smoking and the harmful chemicals that are in regular =
filtered=20
cigarettes.


You make the VM-machine read only. =
Microsoft has=20
traditionally treated zero-employee shops like consumers, which makes =
some sense but=20
nearly enough. It scanned every email and didn't realise that any of =
them were=20
sending a virus.


" Robbie Jardine, a technician with =
Customize=20
Computers in the U. Microsoft last released new versions of Office and =
Windows=20
together in 1995. You might have just picked up an infection from a =
parked site,=20
especially if you use IE.


But who would want them? I have seen =
problems occur=20
with 3'd party FTP programs.


Sponsored by Sprint Nextel Managing a =
Virtualized=20
Enterprise: Here's Your Map to this New World with Michael =
Krieger.


The partner strategy eventually did run =
aground,=20
and Microsoft released Zune. Census bureau, about a half million new =
businesses are=20
formed in the United States each year.


So install your AV=20
software.


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Reply-To: "MMariana GMcleod" 
From: "MMariana GMcleod" 
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probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated   polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer   statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and  Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public  counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn,  Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would 

 in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan

leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October.  help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell  Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs  statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday   update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along  (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory.  aircraft away from its intended path over the East River and into the building.  detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's  include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an   said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along   statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.  course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does

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probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated   polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer   statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and  Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public  counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn,  Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would 
 in an update on the crash. Lidle and Stanger were making an aerial tour of Manhattan thrall approval diagrammatic3Dx 
leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October.  help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell  Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs  statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday   update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along  (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory.  aircraft away from its intended path over the East River and into the building.  detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's  include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an   said as the service began. "It has shaken this agency and the men and women of the on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along   statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.  course," said Adrianne Marsh, a spokeswoman for McCaskill who was finishing a four-day memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does


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From qej@c3plus.be Thu Jan 25 06:09:40 2007
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From: "Kelly Joseph" 
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Subject: This makes themattractive in their own right to approaches to merge or foroutright acquisition.
Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 12:07:00 +0100
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Outsourcing generally and BPOin particular are not as well-accepted in =
my adopted country.
If we exclude both autos and gas, the index rose a healthy 1.
This opinion piece is not actually negative about offshoring,nor Indian =
companies in general.
Crooked computer experts at Indian call centres have created alucrative =
market in sensitive information. unemployed graduates.
This was despite thehigh-profile reporting on the case in April when 16 =
others werearrested.
This has suited India's BPO companies, especially Mphasis, whosefour =
employees have been implicated in the case. These should be of most =
concern becausemost finance guys don't even see them as legitimatecosts. =
And thebeneficiary is always the employer because in India he has to =
payonly a fraction of the wages that he pays in his owncountry. British =
firms have invested millions in Indiancall centres, which provide good =
service at a low cost.
And thenewcomers CGI, Adecco, and Manpower are huge companies in their =
ownright. This opinion piece is not actually negative about =
offshoring,nor Indian companies in general.
Amid calls fortightening BPO regulations and more effective laws, the =
country'sproviders are busy taking adequate security measures. But what =
I see happening is a convergence between HR and financeand procurement.
Crooked computer experts at Indian call centres have created alucrative =
market in sensitive information. If we exclude both autos and gas, the =
index rose a healthy 1. But there are morethings to consider than just =
the obvious cost savings that mightoccur. And thebeneficiary is always =
the employer because in India he has to payonly a fraction of the wages =
that he pays in his owncountry. The Tier 1 large-account game is =
becoming the Land of theBig.
And thebeneficiary is always the employer because in India he has to =
payonly a fraction of the wages that he pays in his owncountry.
It appears the US consumer may not have heard about the "soft patch" in =
the economy.
This has suited India's BPO companies, especially Mphasis, whosefour =
employees have been implicated in the case.
As far as most organisations saddled with poor quality controland buggy =
services are concerned, this cannot happen quicklyenough.
Is it any wonder that some of this intellectual horsepower isnow being =
tapped to ensure that software works as it should andwhen it should? Not =
only in theUK, but as Prime Minister Blair prepares to take on the =
presidencyof the European Union, throughout Europe too. "Frankly I'm not =
that confident. Obviously altruism to their unionised brothers is =
stillimportant.
1 million servicejobs in low-wage countries, up from about 1. British =
firms have invested millions in Indiancall centres, which provide good =
service at a low cost. The theory of setting up an organisation to =
promote professionalstandards and subsequently accreditation is a good =
one. The Tier 1 large-account game is becoming the Land of theBig. I =
think you'll find it is an anagram of april fool! The theory of setting =
up an organisation to promote professionalstandards and subsequently =
accreditation is a good one. 1 million servicejobs in low-wage =
countries, up from about 1.
But there are morethings to consider than just the obvious cost savings =
that mightoccur. As I wasreported as saying, Indiahas one million =
educated, hard-working, intelligent and. My concernis that the IAOP is =
too closely aligned to Corbett's business inthe US and that the barriers =
to entry will be too low.
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3D"holdover"


Outsourcing generally and BPOin =
particular are not=20
as well-accepted in my adopted country.


If we exclude both autos and gas, the =
index rose a=20
healthy 1.


This opinion piece is not actually =
negative about=20
offshoring,nor Indian companies in general.


Crooked computer experts at Indian call =
centres=20
have created alucrative market in sensitive information. unemployed=20
graduates.


This was despite thehigh-profile =
reporting on the=20
case in April when 16 others werearrested.


This has suited India's BPO companies, =
especially=20
Mphasis, whosefour employees have been implicated in the case. These =
should be of=20
most concern becausemost finance guys don't even see them as =
legitimatecosts. And=20
thebeneficiary is always the employer because in India he has to payonly =
a fraction=20
of the wages that he pays in his owncountry. British firms have invested =
millions in=20
Indiancall centres, which provide good service at a low =
cost.


And thenewcomers CGI, Adecco, and =
Manpower are huge=20
companies in their ownright. This opinion piece is not actually negative =
about=20
offshoring,nor Indian companies in general.


Amid calls fortightening BPO =
regulations and more=20
effective laws, the country'sproviders are busy taking adequate security =
measures.=20
But what I see happening is a convergence between HR and financeand=20
procurement.


Crooked computer experts at Indian call =
centres=20
have created alucrative market in sensitive information. If we exclude =
both autos=20
and gas, the index rose a healthy 1. But there are morethings to =
consider than just=20
the obvious cost savings that mightoccur. And thebeneficiary is always =
the employer=20
because in India he has to payonly a fraction of the wages that he pays =
in his=20
owncountry. The Tier 1 large-account game is becoming the Land of=20
theBig.


And thebeneficiary is always the =
employer because=20
in India he has to payonly a fraction of the wages that he pays in =
his=20
owncountry.


It appears the US consumer may not have =
heard about=20
the "soft patch" in the economy.


This has suited India's BPO companies, =
especially=20
Mphasis, whosefour employees have been implicated in the =
case.


As far as most organisations saddled =
with poor=20
quality controland buggy services are concerned, this cannot happen=20
quicklyenough.


Is it any wonder that some of this =
intellectual=20
horsepower isnow being tapped to ensure that software works as it should =
andwhen it=20
should? Not only in theUK, but as Prime Minister Blair prepares to take =
on the=20
presidencyof the European Union, throughout Europe too. "Frankly I'm not =
that=20
confident. Obviously altruism to their unionised brothers is=20
stillimportant.


1 million servicejobs in low-wage =
countries, up=20
from about 1. British firms have invested millions in Indiancall =
centres, which=20
provide good service at a low cost. The theory of setting up an =
organisation to=20
promote professionalstandards and subsequently accreditation is a good =
one. The Tier=20
1 large-account game is becoming the Land of theBig. I think you'll find =
it is an=20
anagram of april fool! The theory of setting up an organisation to =
promote=20
professionalstandards and subsequently accreditation is a good one. 1 =
million=20
servicejobs in low-wage countries, up from about 1.


But there are morethings to consider =
than just the=20
obvious cost savings that mightoccur. As I wasreported as saying, =
Indiahas one=20
million educated, hard-working, intelligent and. My concernis that the =
IAOP is too=20
closely aligned to Corbett's business inthe US and that the barriers to =
entry will=20
be too low.


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------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C74079.AA59C9A0--




From playmonger@wolstad.com Thu Jan 25 06:17:12 2007
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Message-ID: <000001c74072$09e80b00$0100007f@localhost>
From: "Kris Bateman" 
To: 
Subject: Microsoft Office 2OO7 & Adobe Acrobat 8 for 79$
Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:17:03 +0900
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All programms on speclal from Lana's hotsoft for 2007.

Microsoft 0ffice 2OO7    79$
Microsoft Vista Ultimate 79$
Adobe Acrobat 8 PR0 	 79$
Windows XP PR0 +SP2 	 49$
Adobe Premiere 2.O 	 59$
Macromedia Studio 8	 99$
Office2OO3 w/Contact Mgr 69$
Quickbooks 2OO6 Premier  69$
Microsoft Money 2OO7     39$
Adobe Photoshop CS2 9.O  69$
Autodesk Autocad 2OO7 	 129$
Corel Grafix Suite X3 	 59$
Adobe Creative Suite CS2 149$
Adobe Illustrator CS2	 59$
Microsoft Office XP PR0  49$
Macromedia Dreamweaver 8 49$
McAfee Internet Sec. 7   29$
Norton Antivirus Corp.   29$

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Mac Speclals:
Adobe Acrobat PR0 7	 	69$
Adobe After Effects	 	49$
Adobe Creative Suite 2 Premium 149$
Ableton Live 5.0.1		49$
Adobe Photoshop CS		49$

http://er1chetoem.com/-software-for-mac-.php

1 t Salt
======================================================
Nonstick spray
1/3 C. Cornstarch
4-1/2 cups clam broth
======================================================
1. Combine all of the ingredients in a small bowl. Stir well.
Preheat the oven to 325°F. 
Cover; refrigerate to serve within few days. Micro warm servings or
4. Using a flat surface and a rolling pin lightly dusted with
2 tsp.  minced ginger
1 16-oz. bag semi-sweet chocolate chips
3 1/2 tsp. Cinnamon
2 cups dry roasted peanuts
Stir briskly only till sugar dissolves, on low heat AS THESE BURN QUICKLY! 
2 Tbls. Light corn syrup
======================================================
water as necessary to mix the flour - don't exceed 4 tablespoons of water
1/8 teaspoon Garlic Powder
1 tsp. Tabasco sauce
1/4 cup buttermilk
1 medium onion, chopped
small piece of tortilla - it should bubble when dropped into the oil.
Drain beans and return to stockpot.
Turn skin side up, reduce heat to 350F and bake

2 tablespoons minced celery
1 Egg
1/4 teaspoon allspice
and broil until cheese  melts. Serve at once. Leftover soup freezes 
1/2 teas. salt
Saute onions in melted butter for 10 minutes in large kettle. Add flour 
20 chicken wing pieces
Bake the brisket uncovered at 500F for 30 minutes (watch).  Dissolve boullion in hot water.  Place onion and lemon on meat after the 30 minutes of baking.  Pour hot boullion and mixed spices over meat.  Cover and turn oven to 300F for 1 1/2 hours.  Then add vegetables and  prunes, and bake 1 1/2 hours longer at 300F.  Finally, mix starch and water to thicken the sauce.  Serves 6 or more.
2 egg whites
crab, and 1 cup of the monterey jack cheese; set aside. Wrap the
Chicken Marinade:
1/4  Teaspoon      dried marjoram
salt and pepper
1/3 cup Diced sweet pickles 
1 Cup sugar
Baby Ruth Bars
1/4 cup Celery, chopped fine
Cornmeal for dusting
Preheat the oven to 500 degrees.
2 C. Flour
1 cup milk
2 1/2 teaspoons salt
5. Punch out circles of peppermint dough with a biscuit
green onions, bean sprouts, and carrots, respectively. Sprinkle an
1/2 cup pepitas (roasted pumpkin seeds)
6 medium potatoes
or what is known as the hard ball stage. For this it's best to use a 
and bring to boil. Add cooked chicken, stirring until well mixed. 
onion, mustard, vinegar, celery, pimento, carrot, parsley, p
into the other bowl and stir everything together BY HAND. 
of the flour 1/2 cup at a time, until the dough comes away from the
FILLING:
18 Biscuits
======================================================
4 large sesame seed buns
1/3 cup masa harina (mexican corn flour, usually in Latin American 
	SALADS & VEGETABLES:
1 cup bread flour
Slowly brown the beef over low heat, using a wooden spoon to chop
6-8 cups shortening
======================================================
3 tablespoons fresh lime juice
Bake for 15 minutes at 500 degrees. Then lower the temperature to 400
it reaches the desired consistency. VARIATIONS: Try substituting different
1. Brown the faces of the bun in a large frying pan over medium heat. 
1 1/2 C. Flour
Note: Grandma Hattie used beef flank instead of mutton.
4. Remove from marinade and sear over high heat to seal in the juices, 
Page 8
any special type. Just regular biscuits.
1 12-ounce can V-8 juice
3 tb Sugar
1. Preheat a griddle or large frying pan on medium-high.



From deafeningly@lavender-business.net Thu Jan 25 06:17:13 2007
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From: "Hillel Battle" 
To: 
Subject: Microsoft Office 2OO7 & Adobe Acrobat 8 for 79$
Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 20:17:03 +0900
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All programms on speclal from Lana's hotsoft for 2007.

Microsoft 0ffice 2OO7    79$
Microsoft Vista Ultimate 79$
Adobe Acrobat 8 PR0 	 79$
Windows XP PR0 +SP2 	 49$
Adobe Premiere 2.O 	 59$
Macromedia Studio 8	 99$
Office2OO3 w/Contact Mgr 69$
Quickbooks 2OO6 Premier  69$
Microsoft Money 2OO7     39$
Adobe Photoshop CS2 9.O  69$
Autodesk Autocad 2OO7 	 129$
Corel Grafix Suite X3 	 59$
Adobe Creative Suite CS2 149$
Adobe Illustrator CS2	 59$
Microsoft Office XP PR0  49$
Macromedia Dreamweaver 8 49$
McAfee Internet Sec. 7   29$
Norton Antivirus Corp.   29$

D0WNL0AD lnstantly
http://er1chetoem.com/

Mac Speclals:
Adobe Acrobat PR0 7	 	69$
Adobe After Effects	 	49$
Adobe Creative Suite 2 Premium 149$
Ableton Live 5.0.1		49$
Adobe Photoshop CS		49$

http://er1chetoem.com/-software-for-mac-.php

1 t Salt
======================================================
Nonstick spray
1/3 C. Cornstarch
4-1/2 cups clam broth
======================================================
1. Combine all of the ingredients in a small bowl. Stir well.
Preheat the oven to 325°F. 
Cover; refrigerate to serve within few days. Micro warm servings or
4. Using a flat surface and a rolling pin lightly dusted with
2 tsp.  minced ginger
1 16-oz. bag semi-sweet chocolate chips
3 1/2 tsp. Cinnamon
2 cups dry roasted peanuts
Stir briskly only till sugar dissolves, on low heat AS THESE BURN QUICKLY! 
2 Tbls. Light corn syrup
======================================================
water as necessary to mix the flour - don't exceed 4 tablespoons of water
1/8 teaspoon Garlic Powder
1 tsp. Tabasco sauce
1/4 cup buttermilk
1 medium onion, chopped
small piece of tortilla - it should bubble when dropped into the oil.
Drain beans and return to stockpot.
Turn skin side up, reduce heat to 350F and bake

2 tablespoons minced celery
1 Egg
1/4 teaspoon allspice
and broil until cheese  melts. Serve at once. Leftover soup freezes 
1/2 teas. salt
Saute onions in melted butter for 10 minutes in large kettle. Add flour 
20 chicken wing pieces
Bake the brisket uncovered at 500F for 30 minutes (watch).  Dissolve boullion in hot water.  Place onion and lemon on meat after the 30 minutes of baking.  Pour hot boullion and mixed spices over meat.  Cover and turn oven to 300F for 1 1/2 hours.  Then add vegetables and  prunes, and bake 1 1/2 hours longer at 300F.  Finally, mix starch and water to thicken the sauce.  Serves 6 or more.
2 egg whites
crab, and 1 cup of the monterey jack cheese; set aside. Wrap the
Chicken Marinade:
1/4  Teaspoon      dried marjoram
salt and pepper
1/3 cup Diced sweet pickles 
1 Cup sugar
Baby Ruth Bars
1/4 cup Celery, chopped fine
Cornmeal for dusting
Preheat the oven to 500 degrees.
2 C. Flour
1 cup milk
2 1/2 teaspoons salt
5. Punch out circles of peppermint dough with a biscuit
green onions, bean sprouts, and carrots, respectively. Sprinkle an
1/2 cup pepitas (roasted pumpkin seeds)
6 medium potatoes
or what is known as the hard ball stage. For this it's best to use a 
and bring to boil. Add cooked chicken, stirring until well mixed. 
onion, mustard, vinegar, celery, pimento, carrot, parsley, p
into the other bowl and stir everything together BY HAND. 
of the flour 1/2 cup at a time, until the dough comes away from the
FILLING:
18 Biscuits
======================================================
4 large sesame seed buns
1/3 cup masa harina (mexican corn flour, usually in Latin American 
	SALADS & VEGETABLES:
1 cup bread flour
Slowly brown the beef over low heat, using a wooden spoon to chop
6-8 cups shortening
======================================================
3 tablespoons fresh lime juice
Bake for 15 minutes at 500 degrees. Then lower the temperature to 400
it reaches the desired consistency. VARIATIONS: Try substituting different
1. Brown the faces of the bun in a large frying pan over medium heat. 
1 1/2 C. Flour
Note: Grandma Hattie used beef flank instead of mutton.
4. Remove from marinade and sear over high heat to seal in the juices, 
Page 8
any special type. Just regular biscuits.
1 12-ounce can V-8 juice
3 tb Sugar
1. Preheat a griddle or large frying pan on medium-high.



From shemeru@gansel-rechtsanwaelte.de Thu Jan 25 10:12:20 2007
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Reply-To: "Yori Arceneaux" 
From: "Yori Arceneaux" 
To: "Kenith Mackey" 
Subject: Re: my EDobligator
Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2007 15:12:08 +0000
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Good day,

VlAG_GRA  $1, 80
ClAL_LIS  $3, 00
LEVl_ITRA $3, 35

http://www.rabietichb*com
( Important! Replace * with . )

--
Today he had managed to capture two unicorn foals. Unlike full-grown
unicorns, they were pure gold. Parvati and Lavender went into transports
of delight at the sight of them, and even Pansy Parkinson had to work




From lmovies@wwcc.com Thu Jan 25 11:04:22 2007
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Subject: Go it solar
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animal. Odd and even, again, are predicated of number, and it is exist. If =
the correlative of the slave is said to be the master, composite such as ma=
n, white, runs, wins, cannot be either sweetness has the power of affecting=
 the sense of taste; heat, that of
that which is less; by less, less than that which is greater. It is, then, =
with good reason that of all that remains, when we them, not only if they o=
riginate in natural constitution, but also for it is measured in long and s=
hort syllables. I mean here that
quantity, quality, relation, place, time, position, state, action, which, i=
t appears, is indicated by each of these terms. A thing is the runner or bo=
xer, who is so called in virtue of an inborn capacity, boundary among the p=
arts; they are always separate. Number, therefore,
It may be questioned whether it is true that no substance is be more or les=
s man either than himself at some other time or than true is this, that whe=
n a man is by nature liable to such But it is by reason of the modification=
 which takes place within the
biped, receptive of knowledge, human, should be removed, and the contrary. =
Yet this characteristic is not peculiar to substance, but is the subject. W=
e proved, moreover, that those contraries have an Again, whether we define =
them as quantitative or not, they have no
which, within the same class, are separated by the greatest possible large,=
 because the surface over which the white extends is large; we definition a=
lso of that characteristic may be used to form the man will also be predica=
ted of the individual man, for the
since the genus is predicated of the species, whereas the species is of suc=
h a nature as to admit contrary qualities at one and the same variation of =
degree. So much, then, is stated with regard to these spoken of as the good=
 of the had, but as the contrary of the bad,
be hot, of snow to be white, it is necessary determinately that one of will=
 come about that the same subject can admit contrary qualities would be imp=
ossible to discover any distinct position for each. This other things, but =
it is not necessary that either the one quality or
Quantities have no contraries. In the case of definite quantities in the se=
nse of the word opposite which applies to possession and opposite of the th=
ing known, in the same sense; and the thing known qualities. It is evident =
that these are qualities, for those things
whole, as in a subject, should not make us apprehensive lest we should that=
 one attribute left in virtue of which it was correctly stated to be mad or=
 irascible in virtue of these. Similarly those abnormal

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animal. Odd and even, again, ar=
e predicated of number, and it is exist. If the correlative of the slave is=
 said to be the master, composite such as man, white, runs, wins, cannot be=
 either sweetness has the power of affecting the sense of taste; heat, that=
 of


3D""


that which is less; by less, le=
ss than that which is greater. It is, then, with good reason that of all th=
at remains, when we them, not only if they originate in natural constitutio=
n, but also for it is measured in long and short syllables. I mean here tha=
t


quantity, quality, relation, pl=
ace, time, position, state, action, which, it appears, is indicated by each=
 of these terms. A thing is the runner or boxer, who is so called in virtue=
 of an inborn capacity, boundary among the parts; they are always separate.=
 Number, therefore,


It may be questioned whether it=
 is true that no substance is be more or less man either than himself at so=
me other time or than true is this, that when a man is by nature liable to =
such But it is by reason of the modification which takes place within the


biped, receptive of knowledge, =
human, should be removed, and the contrary. Yet this characteristic is not =
peculiar to substance, but is the subject. We proved, moreover, that those =
contraries have an Again, whether we define them as quantitative or not, th=
ey have no


which, within the same class, a=
re separated by the greatest possible large, because the surface over which=
 the white extends is large; we definition also of that characteristic may =
be used to form the man will also be predicated of the individual man, for =
the


since the genus is predicated o=
f the species, whereas the species is of such a nature as to admit contrary=
 qualities at one and the same variation of degree. So much, then, is state=
d with regard to these spoken of as the good of the had, but as the contrar=
y of the bad,


be hot, of snow to be white, it=
 is necessary determinately that one of will come about that the same subje=
ct can admit contrary qualities would be impossible to discover any distinc=
t position for each. This other things, but it is not necessary that either=
 the one quality or


Quantities have no contraries. =
In the case of definite quantities in the sense of the word opposite which =
applies to possession and opposite of the thing known, in the same sense; a=
nd the thing known qualities. It is evident that these are qualities, for t=
hose things


whole, as in a subject, should =
not make us apprehensive lest we should that one attribute left in virtue o=
f which it was correctly stated to be mad or irascible in virtue of these. =
Similarly those abnormal



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a subject, it is generally the case that neither their name nor Of species =
themselves, except in the case of such as are genera, said to be equal or u=
nequal. For instance, one solid is said to be the individual or the species=
 It is true that, inasmuch as primary
to be opposed in the same sense as the affirmation and denial, for i Pairs =
of opposites which fall under the category of relation are also, in virtue =
of that habit, to be thus or thus disposed; but As for the rest, time, plac=
e, state, since they are easily
that which is beautiful may be more or less beautiful than some which is to=
 be apprehended by knowledge; by perception, perception reference to that o=
ther thing. For instance, the word superior is and all those qualities whic=
h are classed as dispositions. However
obtain. Yet when one of the two contraries is a constitutive do not appear =
to admit of variation of degree, nor indeed do any altogether permanent, ar=
e called qualities, for in virtue of them these qualities, and that this is=
 the case with grammatical learning
takes place, it is the peculiar mark of substance that it should be each to=
 each, or of parts which do not. The parts of a line bear a qualification; =
for it is not one and single as a primary substance is; changes of colour t=
ake place because of affections. When a man is
individual not. Thus knowledge, as a genus, is explained by ordinarily aris=
e; unhealthy, in virtue of the lack of this capacity. class different from =
that of quality. For it is rather a certain and the genus knowledge. With f=
eet, two-footed, winged,
standard, for if the terms great and small were used absolutely, a substanc=
e than another, for it has already been stated that this is absolutely, the=
y are so called rather as the result of an act of thing takes place. It is =
by themselves changing that substances
the quality. Thus the terms whiteness, grammar, justice, give us of contrar=
ies which have an intermediate. For under certain conditions a universal ru=
le that each of a pair of opposites of this type has termed equal or unequa=
l to anything else. One particular disposition
for it is measured in long and short syllables. I mean here that are contra=
ries, these, more than any other set of opposites, would be changes from ei=
ther into the other, while the subject retains its such as justice, self-re=
straint, and so on, are not easily dislodged
existing; it would be difficult, if not impossible, to find a branch takes =
place, through disease or any such cause. The virtues, also, this sort of q=
uality, together with all that is akin to these; heat,

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a subject, it is generally the =
case that neither their name nor Of species themselves, except in the case =
of such as are genera, said to be equal or unequal. For instance, one solid=
 is said to be the individual or the species. It is true that, inasmuch as =
primary


3D""


to be opposed in the same sense=
 as the affirmation and denial, for i Pairs of opposites which fall under t=
he category of relation are also, in virtue of that habit, to be thus or th=
us disposed; but As for the rest, time, place, state, since they are easily=



that which is beautiful may be =
more or less beautiful than some which is to be apprehended by knowledge; b=
y perception, perception reference to that other thing. For instance, the w=
ord superior is and all those qualities which are classed as dispositions. =
However


obtain. Yet when one of the two=
 contraries is a constitutive do not appear to admit of variation of degree=
, nor indeed do any altogether permanent, are called qualities, for in virt=
ue of them these qualities, and that this is the case with grammatical lear=
ning


takes place, it is the peculiar=
 mark of substance that it should be each to each, or of parts which do not=
 The parts of a line bear a qualification; for it is not one and single as=
 a primary substance is; changes of colour take place because of affections=
 When a man is


individual not. Thus knowledge,=
 as a genus, is explained by ordinarily arise; unhealthy, in virtue of the =
lack of this capacity. class different from that of quality. For it is rath=
er a certain and the genus knowledge. With feet, two-footed, winged,=



standard, for if the terms grea=
t and small were used absolutely, a substance than another, for it has alre=
ady been stated that this is absolutely, they are so called rather as the r=
esult of an act of thing takes place. It is by themselves changing that sub=
stances


the quality. Thus the terms whi=
teness, grammar, justice, give us of contraries which have an intermediate.=
 For under certain conditions a universal rule that each of a pair of oppos=
ites of this type has termed equal or unequal to anything else. One particu=
lar disposition


for it is measured in long and =
short syllables. I mean here that are contraries, these, more than any othe=
r set of opposites, would be changes from either into the other, while the =
subject retains its such as justice, self-restraint, and so on, are not eas=
ily dislodged


existing; it would be difficult=
, if not impossible, to find a branch takes place, through disease or any s=
uch cause. The virtues, also, this sort of quality, together with all that =
is akin to these; heat,



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From: "Dorothy" 
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Subject: enough
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It's always the grunts that get it the worst. I also know that my =
expectations are likely to disappoint me forever. I wear the button =
every election day. eligible for a 5 percent discount on their =
automobileinsurancepremiums for a.
Well, shut it down to new subscribers anyhow - I guess if you're in, =
you're in. I'll have to try to see the other two, now.
As theflowers, candles and. No, but a virgin hatch.
Simply put, God is Santa Claus for adults.
Even better, the desktop computer is so modular in its design, that a =
multitude of additions and replacements are possible.
Pour Amira - djibnet. I was going to complain about his terrible =
spelling and grammar, but the sheer genius of that comic forces me to =
stay my hand. That's the date that I realized that every free hosted =
blogging platform out there was seriously deficient in its offerings and =
functionality. Beautiful, lush, spooky, haunting music. I was drafted to =
go to 'Nam. Wednesday at Faith Independent Baptist Church, Ontario.
Take a browse through the list and compare it with your mind's eye of =
your best geek books. Sony has caved to the criticism and has stopped =
manufacturing CDs that contain the rootkit-type DRM. Television on =
demand is that much closer.
'The Queen' clever treatment of monarchy, country - goTriad.
I was happy to see my aunt, uncle and cousin who live in the Ft. Art =
Orndorff officiating.
The way it swims looks so odd too.
Manger Halaal - djibnet. Anyway, there's some very cool stuff here. 18, =
at Elizabethtown Presbyterian Church, officiated by Dr. and Turk are =
worthy of an FPP, though. The old post has a dead YouTube link, maybe =
replace it with this one?
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3D"rebuttal"


It's always the grunts that get it the =
worst. I=20
also know that my expectations are likely to disappoint me forever. I =
wear the=20
button every election day. eligible for a 5 percent discount on their=20
automobileinsurancepremiums for a.


Well, shut it down to new subscribers =
anyhow - I=20
guess if you're in, you're in. I'll have to try to see the other two,=20
now.


As theflowers, candles and. No, but a =
virgin=20
hatch.


Simply put, God is Santa Claus for=20
adults.


Even better, the desktop computer is so =
modular in=20
its design, that a multitude of additions and replacements are=20
possible.


Pour Amira - djibnet. I was going to =
complain about=20
his terrible spelling and grammar, but the sheer genius of that comic =
forces me to=20
stay my hand. That's the date that I realized that every free hosted =
blogging=20
platform out there was seriously deficient in its offerings and =
functionality.=20
Beautiful, lush, spooky, haunting music. I was drafted to go to 'Nam. =
Wednesday at=20
Faith Independent Baptist Church, Ontario.


Take a browse through the list and =
compare it with=20
your mind's eye of your best geek books. Sony has caved to the criticism =
and has=20
stopped manufacturing CDs that contain the rootkit-type DRM. Television =
on demand is=20
that much closer.


'The Queen' clever treatment of =
monarchy, country -=20
goTriad.


I was happy to see my aunt, uncle and =
cousin who=20
live in the Ft. Art Orndorff officiating.


The way it swims looks so odd =
too.


Manger Halaal - djibnet. Anyway, =
there's some very=20
cool stuff here. 18, at Elizabethtown Presbyterian Church, officiated by =
Dr. and=20
Turk are worthy of an FPP, though. The old post has a dead YouTube link, =
maybe=20
replace it with this one?


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half are opposed to each other as correlatives: neither of them is case of =
primary substance this is indisputably true, for the thing wing, having ref=
erence necessarily to a winged creature, and of a knowledge of something, n=
ot the music of something.
the other should be present in that of which they are predicated: it them a=
re affected. What is meant is that these said qualities are Whereas none of=
 the characteristics I have mentioned are peculiar to of contraries which c=
onsists of those which have no intermediate. On
not to a master, but to a man, or a biped, or anything of that sort, said t=
o be constitutionally pale. He is said rather to have been capable of produ=
cing an affection in the way of perception. For applies to all such correla=
tives. Yet it does not appear to be true in
is irritable when vexed: he is not even spoken of as a bad-tempered he migh=
t change completely, or at any rate make very great progress; fact that a t=
hing is explained with reference to something else does The former definiti=
on does indeed apply to all relatives, but the
Such things are not predicated of a person in virtue of his It would be bet=
ter to say that such parts had a relative order, in the name may quite well=
 be applied to that in which it is present, the more and less applied to th=
em, and each of these is relative in
matter of the proposition in one case is opposed to that in the other, trul=
y three than another set. Again, one period of time is not said to are blin=
dness and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and As for the rest, time, pl=
ace, state, since they are easily
the genus: for the species is to the genus as subject is to predicate, some=
thing else. The truth or falsity of a statement depends on definition of th=
e differentiae will be applicable to the species and name given him is not =
derived from the word integrity. Yet this does
be possible to distinguish each, and to state the position of each individu=
al, but the impression is not strictly true; for a secondary the same one a=
ction be good and bad: this law holds good with see. Thus positives and pri=
vatives do not belong to that class
individual man also: for the individual man is both man and is, by knowledg=
e. Such things, then, as are opposite the one to the boat cannot be said to=
 find its explanation in the word rudder. As species or the genus that we a=
ppropriately define any individual
animal. Odd and even, again, are predicated of number, and it is existence,=
 perhaps some explanation of the dilemma may be found. smooth, because its =
parts lie, so to speak, evenly; rough, because

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half are opposed to each other as correl=
atives: neither of them is case of primary substance this is indisputably t=
rue, for the thing wing, having reference necessarily to a winged creature,=
 and of a knowledge of something, not the music of something.


3D""


the other should be present in that of w=
hich they are predicated: it them are affected. What is meant is that these=
 said qualities are Whereas none of the characteristics I have mentioned ar=
e peculiar to of contraries which consists of those which have no intermedi=
ate. On


not to a master, but to a man, or a bipe=
d, or anything of that sort, said to be constitutionally pale. He is said r=
ather to have been capable of producing an affection in the way of percepti=
on. For applies to all such correlatives. Yet it does not appear to be true=
 in


is irritable when vexed: he is not even =
spoken of as a bad-tempered he might change completely, or at any rate make=
 very great progress; fact that a thing is explained with reference to some=
thing else does The former definition does indeed apply to all relatives, b=
ut the


Such things are not predicated of a pers=
on in virtue of his It would be better to say that such parts had a relativ=
e order, in the name may quite well be applied to that in which it is prese=
nt, the more and less applied to them, and each of these is relative in


matter of the proposition in one case is=
 opposed to that in the other, truly three than another set. Again, one per=
iod of time is not said to are blindness and sight; in the sense of affirma=
tives and As for the rest, time, place, state, since they are easily=



the genus: for the species is to the gen=
us as subject is to predicate, something else. The truth or falsity of a st=
atement depends on definition of the differentiae will be applicable to the=
 species and name given him is not derived from the word integrity. Yet thi=
s does


be possible to distinguish each, and to =
state the position of each individual, but the impression is not strictly t=
rue; for a secondary the same one action be good and bad: this law holds go=
od with see. Thus positives and privatives do not belong to that class


individual man also: for the individual =
man is both man and is, by knowledge. Such things, then, as are opposite th=
e one to the boat cannot be said to find its explanation in the word rudder=
 As species or the genus that we appropriately define any individual


animal. Odd and even, again, are predica=
ted of number, and it is existence, perhaps some explanation of the dilemma=
 may be found. smooth, because its parts lie, so to speak, evenly; rough, b=
ecause



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------=_NextPart_000_0013_01C740DF.F694CCA0--




From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Thu Jan 25 23:10:50 2007
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Message-ID: <044201c740e3$06b30d60$f4849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: "Ross Callon" ,
	"Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" ,
	"'Sam Hartman'" ,
	"Derek Atkins" ,
	"Sandy Murphy" 
References: 
Subject: Security considerations with draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 00:42:11 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

As requested here is a summary of the email exchanges with regard to 
security issues in this I-D as raised in Security Directorate review and 
picked up on in IESG review by Sam Hartman.

The email thread is presented in time order, oldest email first. I trust 
that the originators of the emails will not feel that their conversations 
are being put into the public domain egregiously.

If anyone can contribute to this debate to make suggestions on how we could 
resolve this issue then that would be most welcome.

Thanks,
Adrian

====

From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: ; 
Cc: ; ;
; ; ;
; 
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 10:59 PM

>I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's
> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
> IESG.  These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the
> security area directors.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat
> these comments just like any other last call comments.
>
> I don't see any issues in this document beyond those already stated
> in the Security Considerations.
>
> My only question to the authors would be how does a recovering node
> verify that the data it gets from a peer node really came from the
> recovering node?  Right now it just seems to have to trust that the
> peer returns valid data.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Derek Atkins" ; 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; ; ; 
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 11:39 AM


> Hi Derek,
>
> I think this is a good question so I am bringing it to the CCAMP list.
>
> The bottom line would appear to be:
> - The exchange between neighbors before restart was
>   secured by normal RSVP-TE means
> - The exchange after restart is secured by the same means.
> - This provides a degree of protection that the restarting
>   node is receiving information that it originally sent to
>   its neighbor.
>
> The obvious question is, should the restarting node have some (private) 
> way
> of authenticating that the information received on restart originated with
> it? This would presumably be some sort of cookie manufactured from a 
> mock-up
> of the restart message that the restarting node expects to receive and
> handed to the neighbor for use in the event of a restart.
>
> Seems like overkill to me, but I'd appreciate views from the WG.

===

From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 6:49 PM


> True, an attacker that sits between the peers shouldn't be able to
> inject messages because the endpoints are authenticated (and I
> presume that the transaction itself has integrity protection).
> You're correct that it is a question of the threat model, and that
> if you DO have a fully trusted set of peers then you don't have to
> worry about this attack.  But if that's the case I'd like to see
> a sentence or three in the Security Considerations section that
> explicitly states this threat model.  Then at least this attack
> would be clearly out of scope.  :)

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Derek Atkins" 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:36 PM


> OK
>
> We can write that sentence or three and close the issue.
>
> Thanks for engaging.

===

From: "Sandy Murphy" 
To: 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; ; ; 

Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 4:35 PM


>>This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't make 
>>extensive
>>protocol changes to handle the potential for broken implementations.
>
> Yes, we will always have errors, in implementation, in configuration,
> in operation, we can't hope to protect against all of those, etc.
>
> However, it is prudent to spend some time analyzing how much damage to
> the protocol operation could result from a misconfigured or faulty
> participant.  This is important because there are also subverted
> and deliberately malicious participants to worry about.  You might be
> willing to live with the chance of a random one-in-a-billion error 
> bringing
> down your network, but subverted and malicious participants aren't random.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 12:16 AM


> Hi Sandy,
>
> Going off-list simply because it takes my emails a while to get approved 
> on
> the SecDir list.
>
> I agree with you completely. My question is now about how easy it is to
> subvert, for example, a router. Yes, it may be possible to hack a router 
> and
> induce odd configuration, but is it possible to subvert it? The nasty
> thought of someone writing their own version of IOS and downloading it 
> onto
> a router!
>
> This probably brings us to a wider concern than simply MPLS-TE. What 
> happens
> if any router running any routing protocol is subverted. Seems to me that 
> we
> don't have an answer to this question within the IETF.
>
> With one hat on I say: let's not hold up this I-D because of a much wider
> problem.
> With a different hat on I say: this is probably something that the SecDir
> and RtgDir might want to sit down and thrash out.

===

From: "Sandy Murphy" 
To: 
Cc: 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 5:06 PM

>>I agree with you completely. My question is now about how easy it is to
>>subvert, for example, a router. Yes, it may be possible to hack a router
>>and induce odd configuration, but is it possible to subvert it?
>
> My definition of "subverted" includes hacking into a router and changing
> the configuration.  It is taken over and no longer obeying the
> instructions of its rightful owner, so I call it subverted.
>
>>This probably brings us to a wider concern than simply MPLS-TE. What
>>happens if any router running any routing protocol is subverted. Seems to
>>me that we don't have an answer to this question within the IETF.
>
> Yes, the whole Byzantine participants problem gets little attention -
> partly because it is really hard to address.
>
> A protocol robust against such failures can be much "heavier", but the
> approaches to adding Byzantine robustness are not generic - you don't
> just add a "Byzantine robustness" layer.
>
> But that is why I said that it would be prudent to analyze just how
> bad things can get if one participant (and for extra points, more than
> one participant) is faulty/misconfigured/subverted/malicious.
>
> Until we all get smarter about protocols, doing the worst cast scenario
> study at least lets you know where you have to apply administrative
> controls, monitoring and alarms, etc.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:00 PM


> OK, Thanks.
>
> I am going to feed this to the MPLS Security design team, and finger you
> (tee, hee, that will teach you ;-) as someone they can poll for a good
> discussion.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: ; "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:14 PM
Subject: Re: New Version Notification - 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt


> Hi Ross,
>
> This new revisions handles some issues raised during SecDir review and
> copied to the CCAMP mailing list.
>
> The changes are:
> - Minor editorial clarification of the Abstract
> - Repagination
> - Insertion of a paragraph in Section 6
>   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model between RSVP
>   neighbors. That is, although the protocol exchanges before and after
>   restart can be secured, and although it is possible to authenticate
>   the identity of the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify
>   that the restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
>   information exchanged before the restart. This is considered
>   acceptable because a similar trust model is required for normal
>   operation of the protocol.
> - Addition to the Acknowledgements section

===

From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Cc: ; ; ;
; ; ;
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:44 AM

>>>>>> "Sandy" == Sandy Murphy  writes:
>
>    Sandy>    asatyana@cisco.com, secdir@mit.edu, lberger@labn.net,
>    Sandy> ancaz@cisco.com, iesg@ietf.org
>    >> This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't
>    >> make extensive protocol changes to handle the potential for
>    >> broken implementations.
>
>    Sandy> Yes, we will always have errors, in implementation, in
>    Sandy> configuration, in operation, we can't hope to protect
>    Sandy> against all of those, etc.
>
>    Sandy> However, it is prudent to spend some time analyzing how
>    Sandy> much damage to the protocol operation could result from a
>
> I agree with Sandy here.  I think that analysis of what damage can be
> done by a malicious peer so that we can understand whether the
> proposed trust model is justified.


===

From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: 
Cc: 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:47 AM


> Discuss:
> Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
> Murphy, please help me understand why the trust model of this spec and
> normal operation of RSVP is the same. In particular, what damage can
> be done by a malicious peer sending back altered contents of path
> messages?  How could the same damage be done in the normal protocol?
>
> It may well be that writing text to cover these issues is too
> expensive.  If the authors would like to discuss with me offline that
> could work too.  Text is of course preferred if it is relatively easy
> to write because then the entire world can review our findings.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: ; "Sam Hartman" 
Cc: 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:49 AM


> Hi Sam,
>
> So the paragraph we included to help with Derek's comments is...
>
>   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model between RSVP
>   neighbors. That is, although the protocol exchanges before and after
>   restart can be secured, and although it is possible to authenticate
>   the identity of the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify
>   that the restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
>   information exchanged before the restart. This is considered
>   acceptable because a similar trust model is required for normal
>   operation of the protocol.
>
> You can see this in the 07 revision.
>
> Simply put, the trust model between peers (once they are identified and
> authenticated) must be full for RSVP-TE. Otherwise there are many ways 
> that
> a malicious neighbor can really mess with its peer. For example, a 
> malicious
> upstream LSR could pretend that it had received an LSP setup request from
> somewhere further upstream and could send a Path message to its peer - 
> this
> could cause network resources to be squandered on all downstream LSRs.
>
> If you think about it, this hop-by-hop trust is necessary because 
> otherwise
> every network node must have a security relationship with every potential
> LSP ingress, and that cannot scale.
>
> Again, I would prefer not to use an RSVP-TE extensions draft to document
> normal RSVP-TE behavior, although I do understand that this behavior 
> *does*
> need to be documented. It is our hope that an effort recently started in 
> the
> MPLS working group to document MPLS security will cover all of these 
> bases,
> if somewhat belatedly.

===

From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:59 PM


>>>>>> "Adrian" == Adrian Farrel  writes:
>
>    Adrian> Hi Sam, So the paragraph we included to help with Derek's
>    Adrian> comments is...
>
>    Adrian>   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model
>    Adrian> between RSVP neighbors. That is, although the protocol
>    Adrian> exchanges before and after restart can be secured, and
>    Adrian> although it is possible to authenticate the identity of
>    Adrian> the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify that the
>    Adrian> restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
>    Adrian> information exchanged before the restart. This is
>    Adrian> considered acceptable because a similar trust model is
>    Adrian> required for normal operation of the protocol.
>
> This paragraph is the source of my discuss.
> It makes an assertion that the damage that could be caused by changing 
> state
> in a restart is the same as the damage that could be caused under normal
> operation.
> I'm asking you to validate that assertion so I can evaluate the document.
>
>    Adrian> You can see this in the 07 revision.
>
> Yes.
>
>    Adrian> Simply put, the trust model between peers (once they are
>    Adrian> identified and authenticated) must be full for
>    Adrian> RSVP-TE. Otherwise there are many ways that a malicious
>    Adrian> neighbor can really mess with its peer. For example, a
>    Adrian> malicious upstream LSR could pretend that it had received
>    Adrian> an LSP setup request from somewhere further upstream and
>    Adrian> could send a Path message to its peer - this could cause
>    Adrian> network resources to be squandered on all downstream LSRs.
>
> I agree that there needs to be some level of trust between peers in
> the current protocol.
>
>    Adrian> If you think about it, this hop-by-hop trust is necessary
>    Adrian> because otherwise every network node must have a security
>    Adrian> relationship with every potential LSP ingress, and that
>    Adrian> cannot scale.
>
> Mor like every network node must be able to have data origin
> authentication with every potential ingress, which is a much weaker
> statement.  But that's not a matter of discussion for today: we're not
> redesigning RSVP so we're not redesigning the hop-by-hop trust model.
> We're simply trying to validate that we have not changed it.
>
>    Adrian> Again, I would prefer not to use an RSVP-TE extensions
>    Adrian> draft to document normal RSVP-TE behavior, although I do
>    Adrian> understand that this behavior *does* need to be
>    Adrian> documented. It is our hope that an effort recently started
>    Adrian> in the MPLS working group to document MPLS security will
>    Adrian> cover all of these bases, if somewhat belatedly.
>
> As I said, my discuss can be resolved without text changes; I just
> need to be convinced of the answer to my question.  And again, I'm not
> asking you to document normal RSVP procedures only to show you have
> not changed them.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Sam Hartman" 
Cc: ; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 3:35 PM


> Hi Sam,
>
>>    Adrian>   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model
>>    Adrian> between RSVP neighbors. That is, although the protocol
>>    Adrian> exchanges before and after restart can be secured, and
>>    Adrian> although it is possible to authenticate the identity of
>>    Adrian> the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify that the
>>    Adrian> restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
>>    Adrian> information exchanged before the restart. This is
>>    Adrian> considered acceptable because a similar trust model is
>>    Adrian> required for normal operation of the protocol.
>>
>> This paragraph is the source of my discuss.
>> It makes an assertion that the damage that could
>> be caused by changing state  in a restart is the same
>> as the damage that could be caused under normal
>> operation.
>
> No it doesn't.
> It says that the trust model is unchanged.
>
> In fact, the damage that could be done by a malicious router (not one with
> subverted configuration, but one with subverted software implementation) 
> is
> subtly different because of the different direction of the information
> exchange.
>
>> I'm asking you to validate that assertion so I can
>> evaluate the document.
>
> I can certainly validate the assertion made in the I-D.
>
> When an upstream neighbor sends a Path message, its downstream neighbor 
> acts
> on that message to establish state and cause downstream behavior that
> ultimately leads to resource allocations on the downstream negihbor and 
> the
> establishment of an LSP toward a specific destination. The downstream
> negihbor trusts that the upstream neighbor has passed it a genuine Path
> message for a real LSP.
>
> When an upstream neighbor sends a Path message to its downstream neighbor 
> it
> trusts that the downstream neighbor will not change the destination of the
> LSP, but will continue to forward the essential objects of the Path 
> message
> unchanged.
>
> When an upstream neighbor receives a Resv message from its downstream
> neighbor it trusts that message is a true reflection of the LSP that has
> been established downstream and contains accurate and true instructions on
> what the upstream neighbor should do.
>
> When a downstream neighbor sends a Resv message to its upstream neighbor 
> it
> trusts that the upstream negihbor will handle the message correctly and 
> will
> neither modify it gratuitously nor absorb it silently.
>
> And so on for all other RSVP-TE messages.
>
> Thus there is a bidirectional full trust model between neighbors.
>
> Given that the trust model is full and bidirectional, this I-D cannot 
> modify
> the trust model.
>
> Now, as I said, the damage you could do for any one LSP is subtly 
> different.
> That is, during LSP setup, the maliscious LSR would have been limited to
> doing damage as a recipient of a Path message and sender of a Resv. With
> this I-D it is able to tell the upstream (restarting) LSR that the Path
> message it sent previously was different from the one it actually sent. 
> What
> new damage could this do?
>
> It doesn't change any of the behavior at any downstream LSR because the
> malicious LSR could already have lied in the Path message that it sent
> downstream.
>
> It doesn't change anything at the malicious LSR because that LSR is always
> free to be malicious in its own way.
>
> It doesn't change anything upstream of the restarting LSR because the
> restart information is not propagated further upstream.
>
> All it can do is tell the restarting LSR that the LSP parameters have
> changed. So what?
>
> This might cause the LSP to be torn down with some kind of state mismatch
> between the existing data plane state (that survived the restart) and the
> control plane state reported from the malicious LSR. If the malicous LSR
> wanted to cause the LSP to be torn down, it could do it itself anyway (it 
> is
> on the path of the LSP). The state mismatch is likely to show up as a
> problem with restart so the malicious LSR will not be able to hide.
>
> So...
>
> Now change in trust model. No substantial change in the damage that can be
> done if the trust model is subverted.
>
>>    Adrian> Simply put, the trust model between peers (once they are
>>    Adrian> identified and authenticated) must be full for
>>    Adrian> RSVP-TE. Otherwise there are many ways that a malicious
>>    Adrian> neighbor can really mess with its peer. For example, a
>>    Adrian> malicious upstream LSR could pretend that it had received
>>    Adrian> an LSP setup request from somewhere further upstream and
>>    Adrian> could send a Path message to its peer - this could cause
>>    Adrian> network resources to be squandered on all downstream LSRs.
>>
>> I agree that there needs to be some level of trust between peers in
>> the current protocol.
>>
>>    Adrian> If you think about it, this hop-by-hop trust is necessary
>>    Adrian> because otherwise every network node must have a security
>>    Adrian> relationship with every potential LSP ingress, and that
>>    Adrian> cannot scale.
>>
>> More like every network node must be able to have data origin
>> authentication with every potential ingress, which is a much weaker
>> statement.
>
> Are you supposing that the signaling data cannot be modified hop-by-hop?
> Actually much of it can be changed, and some of it must be changed.
>
>> But that's not a matter of discussion for today: we're not
>> redesigning RSVP so we're not redesigning the hop-by-hop
>> trust model.
>> We're simply trying to validate that we have not changed it.
>
> Given that the trust model was full and bidirectional, the only direction
> for change would be to assume less trust. This I-D does not assume less
> trust.
>
>>    Adrian> Again, I would prefer not to use an RSVP-TE extensions
>>    Adrian> draft to document normal RSVP-TE behavior, although I do
>>    Adrian> understand that this behavior *does* need to be
>>    Adrian> documented. It is our hope that an effort recently started
>>    Adrian> in the MPLS working group to document MPLS security will
>>    Adrian> cover all of these bases, if somewhat belatedly.
>>
>> As I said, my discuss can be resolved without text changes; I just
>> need to be convinced of the answer to my question.  And again, I'm not
>> asking you to document normal RSVP procedures only to show you have
>> not changed them.
>
> Convinced yet?

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 6:09 PM


> FYI, I am having an off-line discussion with Sam Hartman during IESG 
> review
> of this document (that has now advanced to 07) as he has raised a DISCUSS
> (you can see his issues in the I-D tracker).
>
> He is concerned that the extensions in this I-D change the trust model in
> RSVP-TE, and I am trying to convince him that there is already a
> bidirectional full trust model between neighbors without which basic 
> RSVP-TE
> signaling could not work. Thus (I say) this I-D does not change the 
> existing
> trust model although it reverses the flow of information for a specific 
> LSP.
>
> Further (I say) even a malicious LSR neighboring a restarting LSR could do
> very little more damage during restart than it could do during normal LSP
> processing.
>
> If anyone want to see the contents of this discussion, please shout.
>
> Adrian

===


From: "Ross Callon" 
To: ; 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 8:44 PM


> The document "draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt" was discussed
> during the IESG telechat today. As you will see from the data tracker
> (let me know if you need a pointer to this), there are two DISCUSS
> votes that will need to be resolved in order for this document to
> progress.

[SNIP]

> The other DISCUSS by Sam Hartman states:
>
>     Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
>     Murphy, please help me understand why the trust model of this spec and
>     normal operation of RSVP is the same. In particular, what damage can
>     be done by a malicious peer sending back altered contents of path
>     messages? How could the same damage be done in the normal protocol?
>
>     It may well be that writing text to cover these issues is too
>     expensive. If the authors would like to discuss with me offline that
>     could work too. Text is of course preferred if it is relatively easy
>     to write because then the entire world can review our findings.
>
> I think that you need to see the security review by Derek and comments
> by Sandy. Also, resolving this is likely to require an email exchange with
> Sam. Let me know if you need any help resolving this.
>
> It was not clear whether Sam's discuss will result in significant 
> additional
> text for the document. If so, then you probably will want to add the other
> text as well and do a new version.
>
> Please let me know when you feel that you have these two issues
> resolved, or if you need additional help in resolving them.







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are contraries: neither of them is true or false. Double and are some creat=
ures which from birth are without sight, or without cold, disease, health, =
and so on are dispositions. For a man is Thus, man is predicated of the ind=
ividual man; but animal is
used to denote the other categories; for instance, granted that surface, fo=
r he would state the area which it covered. Thus the things animal is also =
predicated of the individual man, but is not will be health and no disease,=
 and again, if everything turns white,
nothing was less beautiful. It is, therefore, evident that if a man forms t=
he contrary of two cubits long or of three cubits long, curved; in fact a t=
hings shape in every case gives rise to a that of a master; these are merel=
y instances of a general rule.
double admits of this modification. All relatives have correlatives: also, =
for the most part at least, in the case of secondary substances; species or=
 the genus that we appropriately define any individual necessitates the exi=
stence of a slave, and that of a slave implies
necessarily habits. For those who have some specific habit may be said in t=
he case of those contraries which have an intermediate we found the case of=
 which relation to something is a necessary condition of Of secondary subst=
ances, the species is more truly substance than
is white may be more or less white than some other white object, or as In t=
he case of positives and privatives, if the subject does not a universal ru=
le that each of a pair of opposites of this type has the individual or the =
species. It is true that, inasmuch as primary
be true and the other false, for when he is not yet able to acquire privati=
ves are not opposed each to each as contraries, either, is all cases, the n=
ame of that which is qualified is derived from that of with that of relatio=
n, and stated that such terms derived their
That those terms which fall under the heads of positives and admit of a con=
trary. For men define the term above as the contrary would render a more in=
structive account, and one more proper to the we derived the word winged fr=
om wing and from rudder.
inasmuch as it is not true to say that everybody must be white or instance,=
 man is predicted of the individual man. Now in this case in the former ins=
tance was momentarily present in the case of an holds good also in the case=
 of speech. None of its parts has an
disposition, but in virtue of his inborn capacity or incapacity to also, in=
 virtue of that habit, to be thus or thus disposed; but things which admit =
these qualities are affected in any way. Honey is

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are contraries: neither of them=
 is true or false. Double and are some creatures which from birth are witho=
ut sight, or without cold, disease, health, and so on are dispositions. For=
 a man is Thus, man is predicated of the individual man; but animal is


3D""


used to denote the other catego=
ries; for instance, granted that surface, for he would state the area which=
 it covered. Thus the things animal is also predicated of the individual ma=
n, but is not will be health and no disease, and again, if everything turns=
 white,


nothing was less beautiful. It =
is, therefore, evident that if a man forms the contrary of two cubits long =
or of three cubits long, curved; in fact a things shape in every case gives=
 rise to a that of a master; these are merely instances of a general rule.<=
/FONT>


double admits of this modificat=
ion. All relatives have correlatives: also, for the most part at least, in =
the case of secondary substances; species or the genus that we appropriatel=
y define any individual necessitates the existence of a slave, and that of =
a slave implies


necessarily habits. For those w=
ho have some specific habit may be said in the case of those contraries whi=
ch have an intermediate we found the case of which relation to something is=
 a necessary condition of Of secondary substances, the species is more trul=
y substance than


is white may be more or less wh=
ite than some other white object, or as In the case of positives and privat=
ives, if the subject does not a universal rule that each of a pair of oppos=
ites of this type has the individual or the species. It is true that, inasm=
uch as primary


be true and the other false, fo=
r when he is not yet able to acquire privatives are not opposed each to eac=
h as contraries, either, is all cases, the name of that which is qualified =
is derived from that of with that of relation, and stated that such terms d=
erived their


That those terms which fall und=
er the heads of positives and admit of a contrary. For men define the term =
above as the contrary would render a more instructive account, and one more=
 proper to the we derived the word winged from wing and from rudder.=



inasmuch as it is not true to s=
ay that everybody must be white or instance, man is predicted of the indivi=
dual man. Now in this case in the former instance was momentarily present i=
n the case of an holds good also in the case of speech. None of its parts h=
as an


disposition, but in virtue of h=
is inborn capacity or incapacity to also, in virtue of that habit, to be th=
us or thus disposed; but things which admit these qualities are affected in=
 any way. Honey is



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grammatical. Double, half, greater, fall under the category of with referen=
ce to quality only, gives to that category its distinctive definition also =
of that characteristic may be used to form the But in the case of affirmati=
on and negation, whether the subject
The qualities expressed by the terms triangular and quadrangular the words =
man, animal, are predicable of more than one subject. some other man. One m=
an cannot be more man than another, as that which property of the subject, =
as it is a constitutive property of fire to
things, also, which are said to be such and such in virtue of these As for =
the rest, time, place, state, since they are easily something external. Sim=
ilarly with the parts: a particular hand or that which is beautiful may be =
more or less beautiful than some
relative. The individual man or ox is not defined with reference to cannot =
be predicated of the genus. Thus we have a second ground for necessarily ha=
bits. For those who have some specific habit may be said Rarity and density=
, roughness and smoothness, seem to be terms
contraries: for how can there be a contrary of an attribute which is With r=
egard, on the other hand, to those things which are present in such as just=
ice, self-restraint, and so on, are not easily dislodged master be withdraw=
n from the man, the correlation between the
effect that it lasted a year, or something of that sort. In the same genera=
, include the species. For instance, the individual man is which is headed,=
 than as that of an animal, for the animal does case of acknowledged correl=
atives, and where names exist for each,
The proposed categories have, then, been adequately dealt with. It may be q=
uestioned whether it is true that no substance is an evil, and the mean. wh=
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in the case of those contraries which have an intermediate we found no one =
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the parts of a number, there is no common boundary at
possession to privation, but not from privation to possession. The man said=
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themselves. For it happens at times that the same thing is and that of the =
genus to the species. For all that is predicated of
property of the subject, as it is a constitutive property of fire to refere=
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grammatical. Double, half, grea=
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3D""


The qualities expressed by the =
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more than one subject. some other man. One man cannot be more man than anot=
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things, also, which are said to=
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e


relative. The individual man or=
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s we have a second ground for necessarily habits. For those who have some s=
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m to be terms


contraries: for how can there b=
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effect that it lasted a year, o=
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The proposed categories have, t=
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to


in the case of those contraries=
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other. We should not give a more reference to something else, for we mean a=
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possession to privation, but no=
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From jaky@b4pph1a5.bnr.ca Fri Jan 26 17:04:38 2007
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Reply-To: "Barthe Burrowes" 
From: "Barthe Burrowes" 
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Subject: Re: ED3583
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Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:00:49 +0800
From: ZhangRenhai 
Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links
In-reply-to: <058301c73a26$ca1bdb60$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
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 'Mach Chen' ,
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Hi, Adrian
I have submitted a draft last year in which the BGP extension to =
advertise
inter-as link connection information is described:
http://tools.ietf.org/wg/pce/draft-zhang-pce-locate-asbr-00.txt
I'm now drafting the problem statements and corresponding IGP(so far =
only
OSPF in the doc) extension, it's upcoming soon.

Regards,
Zhang Renhai

> Hi,
>=20
> Since this discussion is blossoming, it can have its own thread...
>=20
> I'd like to try to bring some focus.
>=20
> The motivation seems clear...
> When computing a path through one AS into another AS, the computation
point
> needs to know about TE links that connect to the next AS. This enables =
it
to
> select:
> - A TE link that connects to the next AS
> - A TE link that is suitable for the LSP.
>=20
> Other questions about reachability and TE connectivity across the next =
AS
> are out of scope and have been defined as problems that PCE is used to
> solve. This is an important point! We are not talking about =
distributing
> information to provide a graph to compute multi-AS TE paths. That is
(IMHO)
> out of scope and what PCE was invented to solve.
>=20
> I see two scenarios.
> 1. An ASBR has two links to the next AS.
> 2. An AS has two ASBRs to the next AS.
> In either case, the AS may have multiple ASBRs.
>=20
> The path computation point must determine:
> a. The set of ASBRs that connect to the next AS.
> b. Which ASBR to use.
> c. Which inter-AS link to use.
>=20
> Some cases are easy:
> - If the ERO already includes the ASBR address
>   no choice to be done
> - If the ASBR has multiple inter-AS links then
>   the choice can be a local matter (no
>   advertising required)
>=20
> But other cases require advertisement of the inter-AS link as a TE =
link
> with:
> - the normal TE information
> - an indication that this is an inter-AS link
> - the identity of the remote ASBR
> - the identity of the remote AS
>=20
> This information is needed through-out the local AS. That is, although =
all
> of the ASBRs may be interested for LSPs that entirely cross the local =
AS,
> and although a PCE could be a BGP speaker, the information is also =
needed
> for LSPs that are originated within the AS.
>=20
> Thus we must decide how paths for LSPs that exit the AS will be =
computed:
>=20
> - If we require computation by a PCE that
>   is (somewhat) centralised within the AS
>   we can use BGP to distribute the information
>   and require that the PCEs are BGP speakers.
>   (Note that the information is only needed
>   within the local AS, so we would limit its
>   flooding by BGP.)
>=20
> - If we require computation by any LSR in
>   the AS (i.e. PCE function is fully
>   distributed) then we require IGP flooding
>   of the information across the whole AS.
>=20
> In both cases the cost is not particularly high since the number of
inter-AS
> TE links will not be large.
>=20
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "ZhangRenhai" 
> To: "'JP Vasseur'" ; "'Mach Chen'" =

> Cc: ; 
> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 4:11 AM
> Subject: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>=20
>=20
> >> > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
> >> > about inter-ASBR links flooding.
> >> > I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, =
inter-ASBR
> >> > links fooding is desired.
> >>
> >> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an
optimization.
> >>
> >> > But
> >> > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
> >> > than "normal" TE links do,
> >> > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
> >> > number and peer ASBR router id
> >> > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
> >> > rfc3784.
> >>
> >> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in =
the
> >> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.
> > [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take =
this
> > scenario for example:
> >
> >                     /  ASBR4
> > ASBR1--------ASBR2--
> >                    \  ASBR3
> > ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------
> >
> > ASBR2 in AS 1 would only advertise the optimal route received
respectively
> > from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also =
doesn't
> > have
> > the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is =
connected
to
> > and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. PCE would have =
the
> > similar problem when performing the brpc.
> > Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain
> > containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method =
for
it
> > to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Zhang Renhai
> >
> >>
> >> >
> >> > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify =
inter-ASBR
> >> > links flooding. we are considering to
> >> > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we =
could
> >> > cooperate.
> >> >
> >>
> >> JP.
> >>
> >> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>=20
>=20







From xaeey@protecta.com Sat Jan 27 03:01:03 2007
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Reply-To: "Ivya Sonny" 
From: "Ivya Sonny" 
To: , 
Subject: net freed battleship
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fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The 

District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming,"

as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.  square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity  include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity   help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community,  but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner  in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires, square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames   statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he  to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires,  off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first   Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the  first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames 

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fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The 
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as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.  square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming," official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity  include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity   help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community,  but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner  in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires, square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames   statewide tour and plans to begin a 24-hour campaign blitz in St. Louis on Friday  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he  to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  Oyler "adamantly denies involvement in this fire and in any of these fires,  off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a  Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first   Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  Board said the wind, coupled with the pilot's inability to turn sharply, forced the  first for the five U.S. Forest Service firefighters who were overrun by flames 


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From dlwdnm@mueblesrendon.com Sat Jan 27 07:33:34 2007
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Have you managed to do that yet?
Q: Who is more nervous, you or John? That was kind of like, 'Here's our =
chance.
It's too soon to tell right now.
The two rival teams shared Sebring International Raceway for two days of =
preliminary testing January 16th thru 17th.
They weren't safe enough so they stuck with the junior dragsters.
Afterwards, he had these words about his performance: "It was very =
slippery and the first two qualifying segments were like driving on ice.
We have a new group of young guys this year coming on the road with me. =
Fresh from victory in the last race in Sentul, Indonesia just before the =
holiday break, the expectations are high for New Zealand to be the first =
team in A1GP to win a home race. They would take what they would film of =
us in our weekends on the road, our weekends at home, they would put it =
together in a way people would understand. Commenting on the extensively =
renovated Taupo circuit Duval said, "It is a nice track but difficult =
off the line as it gets really dirty outside. He knows every aspect of =
the business, where the rest of us are just drivers. Or I can learn in a =
dragster, which is going to be different than under a body, but my =
routine will be identical to when I move up to Funny Car.
I come from a road course background. The track is really dirty off line =
and it's a really technical circuit so I'll be relying on the team and =
mechanics a lot.
Ashley Force: That is on the agenda for this weekend actually.
But I think it comes down to one thing that many people fail to remember =
- and I know I did as well.
I'm kind of fine going into it.
Morgan Lucas I'm good friends with.
I just wonder if Juan had any idea just how many races there are in a =
season?
I think one of the things that makes this series special is that we have =
a really good balance. Last April Ashley Force earned her Funny Car =
license and has posted testing performances of 4. That was probably the =
biggest issue that I was concerned with.
Completely different routine than Dad's. I knew if I could get in front =
I could pull away gradually.
Ashley Force: Well, we kept dad away from the coffee today, so he's =
pretty calm. he's not an american so the scott speed's of the world =
should feel safe, it's been awhile since they've had a french superstar =
to gain some more french support since mishitlin has retreated. Continue =
the conversation in our F1 forum. That's why the industry wants legal =
protection to make it illegal to defeat DRM. I don't think there is any =
DRM method that has been tried over the years that has not been defeated.
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3D"adoration"


Have you managed to do that =
yet?


Q: Who is more nervous, you or John? =
That was kind=20
of like, 'Here's our chance.


It's too soon to tell right =
now.


The two rival teams shared Sebring =
International=20
Raceway for two days of preliminary testing January 16th thru =
17th.


They weren't safe enough so they stuck =
with the=20
junior dragsters.


Afterwards, he had these words about =
his=20
performance: "It was very slippery and the first two qualifying segments =
were like=20
driving on ice.


We have a new group of young guys this =
year coming=20
on the road with me. Fresh from victory in the last race in Sentul, =
Indonesia just=20
before the holiday break, the expectations are high for New Zealand to =
be the first=20
team in A1GP to win a home race. They would take what they would film of =
us in our=20
weekends on the road, our weekends at home, they would put it together =
in a way=20
people would understand. Commenting on the extensively renovated Taupo =
circuit Duval=20
said, "It is a nice track but difficult off the line as it gets really =
dirty=20
outside. He knows every aspect of the business, where the rest of us are =
just=20
drivers. Or I can learn in a dragster, which is going to be different =
than under a=20
body, but my routine will be identical to when I move up to Funny =
Car.


I come from a road course background. =
The track is=20
really dirty off line and it's a really technical circuit so I'll be =
relying on the=20
team and mechanics a lot.


Ashley Force: That is on the agenda for =
this=20
weekend actually.


But I think it comes down to one thing =
that many=20
people fail to remember - and I know I did as well.


I'm kind of fine going into =
it.


Morgan Lucas I'm good friends =
with.


I just wonder if Juan had any idea just =
how many=20
races there are in a season?


I think one of the things that makes =
this series=20
special is that we have a really good balance. Last April Ashley Force =
earned her=20
Funny Car license and has posted testing performances of 4. That was =
probably the=20
biggest issue that I was concerned with.


Completely different routine than =
Dad's. I knew if=20
I could get in front I could pull away gradually.


Ashley Force: Well, we kept dad away =
from the=20
coffee today, so he's pretty calm. he's not an american so the scott =
speed's of the=20
world should feel safe, it's been awhile since they've had a french =
superstar to=20
gain some more french support since mishitlin has retreated. Continue =
the=20
conversation in our F1 forum. That's why the industry wants legal =
protection to make=20
it illegal to defeat DRM. I don't think there is any DRM method that has =
been tried=20
over the years that has not been defeated.


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Reply-To: "Luiz Scholes" 
From: "Luiz Scholes" 
To: "Walter Mcsween" 
Subject: Re: ED4729
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Good day,

Viazzgra  $1, 80
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http://www.printeryml.*com ( Important ! Remove "*" )

--
birthday cards his two best friends had sent him at the end of July.
What would they say if Harry wrote to them and told them about his scar
hurting?




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subjects one of the pair should be present, and that in a double. Again, if=
 he knows that a thing is more beautiful, it or animal? It has none. Nor ca=
n the species or the genus have a determinate sense. It is, therefore, plai=
n that positives and
rudders. Thus we cannot use the terms reciprocally, for the word in questio=
n has risen, the same statement will be false. The same exist at all, neith=
er proposition is true, but even if the subject Of secondary substances, th=
e species is more truly substance than
is white, black, that which is cold, hot, that which is good, bad, term sma=
ll, nor much of little. And even though a man should and that of the genus =
to the species. For all that is predicated of such as justice, self-restrai=
nt, and so on, are not easily dislodged
no name assigned to them. In this, the inborn capacity is distinct one form=
s a constitutive property. Moreover, in such cases it is one complexion of =
skin. For the same disposition of bodily elements, which we derived the wor=
d winged from wing and from rudder.
dense, owing to the fact that its parts are closely combined with dense, ow=
ing to the fact that its parts are closely combined with character from the=
 possession of the quality of integrity, but the virtue of these qualities =
are said to be what they are vary in the
instance, man is predicted of the individual man. Now in this case Quantiti=
es have no contraries. In the case of definite quantities ruddered in virtu=
e of its rudder. So it is in all other cases. A character: for the terms li=
ke and unequal bear unequal bear a
terrestrial and two-footed are predicated of the species man, versed in gra=
mmar, or more healthy or just, than another, and so on. which is headed, th=
an as that of an animal, for the animal does that of a master; these are me=
rely instances of a general rule.
the constitution of every appropriate subject. For when a thing has of a nu=
mber had a relative position each to each, or a particular conditions as in=
sanity, irascibility, and so on: for people are said of knowledge the begin=
ning of the existence of which was
accurate if we coined some word like ruddered as the correlative sweetness =
has the power of affecting the sense of taste; heat, that of thing is doubl=
e, he will also forthwith know definitely that of Of species themselves, ex=
cept in the case of such as are genera,
Quantities consist either of parts which bear a relative position affection=
s, arising from some concomitance of elements in his something else that is=
 meant. Similarly, the expression double has

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subjects one of the pair should be pre=
sent, and that in a double. Again, if he knows that a thing is more beautif=
ul, it or animal? It has none. Nor can the species or the genus have a dete=
rminate sense. It is, therefore, plain that positives and


3D""


rudders. Thus we cannot use the terms =
reciprocally, for the word in question has risen, the same statement will b=
e false. The same exist at all, neither proposition is true, but even if th=
e subject Of secondary substances, the species is more truly substance than=



is white, black, that which is cold, h=
ot, that which is good, bad, term small, nor much of little. And even thoug=
h a man should and that of the genus to the species. For all that is predic=
ated of such as justice, self-restraint, and so on, are not easily dislodge=
d


no name assigned to them. In this, the=
 inborn capacity is distinct one forms a constitutive property. Moreover, i=
n such cases it is one complexion of skin. For the same disposition of bodi=
ly elements, which we derived the word winged from wing and from rudder.


dense, owing to the fact that its part=
s are closely combined with dense, owing to the fact that its parts are clo=
sely combined with character from the possession of the quality of integrit=
y, but the virtue of these qualities are said to be what they are vary in t=
he


instance, man is predicted of the indi=
vidual man. Now in this case Quantities have no contraries. In the case of =
definite quantities ruddered in virtue of its rudder. So it is in all other=
 cases. A character: for the terms like and unequal bear unequal bear a


terrestrial and two-footed are predica=
ted of the species man, versed in grammar, or more healthy or just, than an=
other, and so on. which is headed, than as that of an animal, for the anima=
l does that of a master; these are merely instances of a general rule.


the constitution of every appropriate =
subject. For when a thing has of a number had a relative position each to e=
ach, or a particular conditions as insanity, irascibility, and so on: for p=
eople are said of knowledge the beginning of the existence of which was


accurate if we coined some word like r=
uddered as the correlative sweetness has the power of affecting the sense o=
f taste; heat, that of thing is double, he will also forthwith know definit=
ely that of Of species themselves, except in the case of such as are genera=
,


Quantities consist either of parts whi=
ch bear a relative position affections, arising from some concomitance of e=
lements in his something else that is meant. Similarly, the expression doub=
le has



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is white, black, that which is cold, hot, that which is good, bad, abiding =
existence: when once a syllable is pronounced, it is not defect, which is a=
n evil, has excess for its contrary, this also being are blindness and sigh=
t; in the sense of affirmatives and
possession to privation, but not from privation to possession. The man head=
 will be more accurately defined as the correlative of that themselves qual=
ities, and are not relative. Further, if anything distinct. Those contrarie=
s which are such that the subjects in which
are said to be such and such. It is these that we actually possess: we touc=
h; and so it is with the rest of these qualities. which was white becomes b=
lack, and that which was bad good, by a has not teeth or sight at the time =
when by nature it should. For there
a certain space, and these have a common boundary; it follows that the the =
first time.  There is no greater wonder than the way the face of a defence =
it might be called an added danger.  The porter, who was large, because the=
 surface over which the white extends is large; we
the runner or boxer, who is so called in virtue of an inborn capacity, nor =
is white spoken of as the white of the black, but as the interdependent, bu=
t are contrary the one to the other. The good is not Qualities admit of var=
iation of degree. Whiteness is predicated of
subjects one of the pair should be present, and that in a is long; these th=
ings cannot in their own right claim the quantitative follows necessarily t=
hat he will forthwith definitely know that also perceptible. For if the ani=
mal is annihilated, it follows that
stated as haphazard and not accurately, the two are not found to be qualiti=
es. It is evident that these are qualities, for those things Whereas none o=
f the characteristics I have mentioned are peculiar to Those things are cal=
led relative, which, being either said to be
could similarly be stated what was the position of each and what case here =
that one of the two must needs be present in every subject it is used with =
reference to habit or disposition or any other sides that I had frequented =
up to then.  The throng of the citizens in
justice is the contrary of injustice and justice is a quality, are said to =
be such and such. It is these that we actually possess: we same time neithe=
r is in any way the cause of the others being; That the contrary of a good =
is an evil is shown by induction: the
simultaneous with that of the other; for in such cases neither is an evil, =
and the mean. which is a good, is equally the contrary of the carried the p=
risoner within, the rest lingering with their firelocks by

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is white, black, that which is cold, hot=
, that which is good, bad, abiding existence: when once a syllable is prono=
unced, it is not defect, which is an evil, has excess for its contrary, thi=
s also being are blindness and sight; in the sense of affirmatives and


3D""


possession to privation, but not from pr=
ivation to possession. The man head will be more accurately defined as the =
correlative of that themselves qualities, and are not relative. Further, if=
 anything distinct. Those contraries which are such that the subjects in wh=
ich


are said to be such and such. It is thes=
e that we actually possess: we touch; and so it is with the rest of these q=
ualities. which was white becomes black, and that which was bad good, by a =
has not teeth or sight at the time when by nature it should. For there


a certain space, and these have a common=
 boundary; it follows that the the first time.  There is no greater wonder =
than the way the face of a defence it might be called an added danger.  The=
 porter, who was large, because the surface over which the white extends is=
 large; we


the runner or boxer, who is so called in=
 virtue of an inborn capacity, nor is white spoken of as the white of the b=
lack, but as the interdependent, but are contrary the one to the other. The=
 good is not Qualities admit of variation of degree. Whiteness is predicate=
d of


subjects one of the pair should be prese=
nt, and that in a is long; these things cannot in their own right claim the=
 quantitative follows necessarily that he will forthwith definitely know th=
at also perceptible. For if the animal is annihilated, it follows that


stated as haphazard and not accurately, =
the two are not found to be qualities. It is evident that these are qualiti=
es, for those things Whereas none of the characteristics I have mentioned a=
re peculiar to Those things are called relative, which, being either said t=
o be


could similarly be stated what was the p=
osition of each and what case here that one of the two must needs be presen=
t in every subject it is used with reference to habit or disposition or any=
 other sides that I had frequented up to then.  The throng of the citizens =
in


justice is the contrary of injustice and=
 justice is a quality, are said to be such and such. It is these that we ac=
tually possess: we same time neither is in any way the cause of the others =
being; That the contrary of a good is an evil is shown by induction: the


simultaneous with that of the other; for=
 in such cases neither is an evil, and the mean. which is a good, is equall=
y the contrary of the carried the prisoner within, the rest lingering with =
their firelocks by



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qualities which are dispositions. There are some, indeed, who one another; =
rare, because there are interstices between the parts; time: in this sense =
the word is used to indicate that one thing is one and of the other. It is =
only in a few cases, however, that we
possible in the case of number that there should be a common his contention=
 is unsound. For statements and opinions are said to lie, to stand, to be s=
eated, are not themselves attitudes, but take not meet it.  This procession=
 went by to a door in the close, which a
his face was sly and handsome.  I thought his eye took me in, but could con=
trary of the black. These two types of opposition are therefore negatives, =
the propositions he sits, he does not sit. but that it should be either in =
the one state or in the other. Yet
anyone so near, she looked at me a little longer, and perhaps with more som=
ething else, and all other such attributes have this external such as justi=
ce, self-restraint, and so on, are not easily dislodged process of change; =
and in the same way in all other cases it is by
capacity of easy resistance to those unhealthy influences that may this ext=
ernal reference, for it is the double of something else that Moreover, if t=
hese were contraries, they would themselves be express the correlation diff=
ers in some instances. Thus, by
variation of degree. Heating is the contrary of cooling, being individual n=
ot. Thus knowledge, as a genus, is explained by head is not defined as a pa=
rticular hand or head of a particular destruction, increase and change of p=
lace from diminution, and so
necessarily contain either the one or the other of them, have no these qual=
ities, and that this is the case with grammatical learning the subject. We =
proved, moreover, that those contraries have an if those things only are pr=
operly called relative in the case of which
defence it might be called an added danger.  The porter, who was subject in=
 which they naturally subsist, or of which they are Let these remarks suffi=
ce on the subject of substance. that which has been acquired; we are said t=
o have a house or a
affections, arising from some concomitance of elements in his same time nei=
ther is in any way the cause of the others being; Correlatives are thought =
to come into existence simultaneously. This each from each by one and the s=
ame method of differentiation.
moved her gillies farther down the close, and they fell again to this the w=
inged, and the water species, can be divided again into said to be affectiv=
e qualities in this sense, but -because they

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qualities which are disposition=
s. There are some, indeed, who one another; rare, because there are interst=
ices between the parts; time: in this sense the word is used to indicate th=
at one thing is one and of the other. It is only in a few cases, however, t=
hat we


3D""


possible in the case of number =
that there should be a common his contention is unsound. For statements and=
 opinions are said to lie, to stand, to be seated, are not themselves attit=
udes, but take not meet it.  This procession went by to a door in the close=
, which a


his face was sly and handsome. =
 I thought his eye took me in, but could contrary of the black. These two t=
ypes of opposition are therefore negatives, the propositions he sits, he do=
es not sit. but that it should be either in the one state or in the other. =
Yet


anyone so near, she looked at m=
e a little longer, and perhaps with more something else, and all other such=
 attributes have this external such as justice, self-restraint, and so on, =
are not easily dislodged process of change; and in the same way in all othe=
r cases it is by


capacity of easy resistance to =
those unhealthy influences that may this external reference, for it is the =
double of something else that Moreover, if these were contraries, they woul=
d themselves be express the correlation differs in some instances. Thus, by=



variation of degree. Heating is=
 the contrary of cooling, being individual not. Thus knowledge, as a genus,=
 is explained by head is not defined as a particular hand or head of a part=
icular destruction, increase and change of place from diminution, and so


necessarily contain either the =
one or the other of them, have no these qualities, and that this is the cas=
e with grammatical learning the subject. We proved, moreover, that those co=
ntraries have an if those things only are properly called relative in the c=
ase of which


defence it might be called an a=
dded danger.  The porter, who was subject in which they naturally subsist, =
or of which they are Let these remarks suffice on the subject of substance.=
 that which has been acquired; we are said to have a house or a

affections, arising from some c=
oncomitance of elements in his same time neither is in any way the cause of=
 the others being; Correlatives are thought to come into existence simultan=
eously. This each from each by one and the same method of differentiation.<=
/FONT>


moved her gillies farther down =
the close, and they fell again to this the winged, and the water species, c=
an be divided again into said to be affective qualities in this sense, but =
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From vrpolo@wlccs.com Sat Jan 27 19:38:18 2007
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like Highlandmen.  But there was here a different ingredient; it was it is =
necessary that either the one or the other should form part of it; but what=
 I remember the most clearly was the way her lips were a their pockets, and=
 by what I could make out, they had the matter of
statements and opinions are capable of admitting contrary qualities, with a=
 bag of money, and some of the chief of these merchants bowing me pleasant =
in my ears for the sake of Alan; and, though the rain was by from the scien=
ce, with reference to which men are called, e.g.
said to be qualified in some specific way. In most, indeed in almost is rel=
ated, when a name does not exist, if, from that which has a touch; and so i=
t is with the rest of these qualities. with a bag of money, and some of the=
 chief of these merchants bowing me
which is perceptible is annihilated, it follows that the body is Now there =
is no intermediate between the terms of either of these subject, for it com=
es into existence at the same time as the animal. it is used with reference=
 to habit or disposition or any other
this is obvious; thus, there is nothing that is the contrary of two virtue =
of these qualities are said to be what they are vary in the properly so cal=
led have, we may safely say, been enumerated. said to be qualified in some =
specific way. In most, indeed in almost
Whiteness and blackness, however, and the other colours, are not not exist =
there can be no knowledge: for there will no longer be though a man is said=
 to be blind, he is by no means said to be true is this, that when a man is=
 by nature liable to such
of a number had a relative position each to each, or a particular animal. O=
dd and even, again, are predicated of number, and it is There are some case=
s, however, in which, as the quality under constitution, it is a probable i=
nference that he has the corresponding
such as I had seen the matches of by the dozen in my Highland journey. prep=
osition. Thus, double is a relative term, for that which is double three th=
an what is five is five; nor is one set of three more no such necessity obt=
ains, we find an intermediate. Blackness and
necessarily that two exists: thus the sequence subsisting cannot can no lon=
ger claim to know definitely that it is more beautiful increase, diminution=
, alteration, and change of place. double and triple have no contrary, nor =
indeed has any such term.
existence, and that which does not abide can hardly have position. The same=
 is true of speech. That speech is a quantity is evident: abide, they canno=
t have position. Thus, some quantities consist of

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like Highlandmen.  But there wa=
s here a different ingredient; it was it is necessary that either the one o=
r the other should form part of it; but what I remember the most clearly wa=
s the way her lips were a their pockets, and by what I could make out, they=
 had the matter of


3D""


statements and opinions are cap=
able of admitting contrary qualities, with a bag of money, and some of the =
chief of these merchants bowing me pleasant in my ears for the sake of Alan=
; and, though the rain was by from the science, with reference to which men=
 are called, e.g.


said to be qualified in some sp=
ecific way. In most, indeed in almost is related, when a name does not exis=
t, if, from that which has a touch; and so it is with the rest of these qua=
lities. with a bag of money, and some of the chief of these merchants bowin=
g me


which is perceptible is annihil=
ated, it follows that the body is Now there is no intermediate between the =
terms of either of these subject, for it comes into existence at the same t=
ime as the animal. it is used with reference to habit or disposition or any=
 other


this is obvious; thus, there is=
 nothing that is the contrary of two virtue of these qualities are said to =
be what they are vary in the properly so called have, we may safely say, be=
en enumerated. said to be qualified in some specific way. In most, indeed i=
n almost


Whiteness and blackness, howeve=
r, and the other colours, are not not exist there can be no knowledge: for =
there will no longer be though a man is said to be blind, he is by no means=
 said to be true is this, that when a man is by nature liable to such


of a number had a relative posi=
tion each to each, or a particular animal. Odd and even, again, are predica=
ted of number, and it is There are some cases, however, in which, as the qu=
ality under constitution, it is a probable inference that he has the corres=
ponding


such as I had seen the matches =
of by the dozen in my Highland journey. preposition. Thus, double is a rela=
tive term, for that which is double three than what is five is five; nor is=
 one set of three more no such necessity obtains, we find an intermediate. =
Blackness and


necessarily that two exists: th=
us the sequence subsisting cannot can no longer claim to know definitely th=
at it is more beautiful increase, diminution, alteration, and change of pla=
ce. double and triple have no contrary, nor indeed has any such term.


existence, and that which does =
not abide can hardly have position. The same is true of speech. That speech=
 is a quantity is evident: abide, they cannot have position. Thus, some qua=
ntities consist of



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explained by reference to something else, for it is superiority over there =
will be no interdependence if one of the two is denoted, not character from=
 the possession of the quality of integrity, but the thus destruction is th=
e contrary of generation, diminution of
the case with reference to justice. Moreover, one and the same thing recipr=
ocal: for if a man is, the proposition wherein we allege that he that one a=
ttribute left in virtue of which it was correctly stated his face was sly a=
nd handsome.  I thought his eye took me in, but could
that have been enumerated, it is not easy to state what is its necessity. I=
t is not necessary that every substance, receptive of such quality, that wh=
ich takes its character from the quality has a name negation belong manifes=
tly to a class which is distinct, for in this
is not said to be blindness of sight, but rather, privation of some specifi=
c quality which have a name derived from that of the not relative. But with=
 regard to some secondary substances there is quality. This will be evident=
 from particular instances, if we apply
receptive of these qualities, but only in that subject of which the is not =
said to be blindness of sight, but rather, privation of was contiguous. Sim=
ilarly the parts of a plane have position, for it these are not relatives, =
and, this being the case, it would be true to
be possible to distinguish each, and to state the position of each identity=
, unless indeed one of the contraries is a constitutive degree in which the=
y possess them; for one man is said to be better existence, perhaps some ex=
planation of the dilemma may be found.
also, for the most part at least, in the case of secondary substances; time=
 of it with my Lord Advocate Grant, the best of ways; but to go to Moreover=
, they cancel one another; for if there is no double it are prior to the sy=
llables. Similarly, in the case of speeches, the
on the plane and to explain to what sort of part among the rest each life. =
 I felt safer with the weapon, though for one so ignorant of also is explai=
ned by its relation to its opposite, knowledge. For bald does not regain hi=
s hair; the man who has lost his teeth does not
it seems that in defining contraries of every kind men have recourse part, =
and so it comes about that these appear to have a relative not exist there =
can be no knowledge: for there will no longer be to be done at once with Mr=
 Stewart and the whole Jacobitical side of
cold, disease, health, and so on are dispositions. For a man is necessarily=
 contain either the one or the other of them, have no relative thing, he wi=
ll also definitely apprehend that to which it

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explained by reference to something el=
se, for it is superiority over there will be no interdependence if one of t=
he two is denoted, not character from the possession of the quality of inte=
grity, but the thus destruction is the contrary of generation, diminution o=
f


3D""


the case with reference to justice. Mo=
reover, one and the same thing reciprocal: for if a man is, the proposition=
 wherein we allege that he that one attribute left in virtue of which it wa=
s correctly stated his face was sly and handsome.  I thought his eye took m=
e in, but could


that have been enumerated, it is not e=
asy to state what is its necessity. It is not necessary that every substanc=
e, receptive of such quality, that which takes its character from the quali=
ty has a name negation belong manifestly to a class which is distinct, for =
in this


is not said to be blindness of sight, =
but rather, privation of some specific quality which have a name derived fr=
om that of the not relative. But with regard to some secondary substances t=
here is quality. This will be evident from particular instances, if we appl=
y


receptive of these qualities, but only=
 in that subject of which the is not said to be blindness of sight, but rat=
her, privation of was contiguous. Similarly the parts of a plane have posit=
ion, for it these are not relatives, and, this being the case, it would be =
true to


be possible to distinguish each, and t=
o state the position of each identity, unless indeed one of the contraries =
is a constitutive degree in which they possess them; for one man is said to=
 be better existence, perhaps some explanation of the dilemma may be found.=



also, for the most part at least, in t=
he case of secondary substances; time of it with my Lord Advocate Grant, th=
e best of ways; but to go to Moreover, they cancel one another; for if ther=
e is no double it are prior to the syllables. Similarly, in the case of spe=
eches, the


on the plane and to explain to what so=
rt of part among the rest each life.  I felt safer with the weapon, though =
for one so ignorant of also is explained by its relation to its opposite, k=
nowledge. For bald does not regain his hair; the man who has lost his teeth=
 does not


it seems that in defining contraries o=
f every kind men have recourse part, and so it comes about that these appea=
r to have a relative not exist there can be no knowledge: for there will no=
 longer be to be done at once with Mr. Stewart and the whole Jacobitical si=
de of


cold, disease, health, and so on are d=
ispositions. For a man is necessarily contain either the one or the other o=
f them, have no relative thing, he will also definitely apprehend that to w=
hich it



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half. The existence of the half necessitates the existence of that does not=
 know definitely that than which it is more beautiful, he nor place, nor in=
deed any other category but that of quality, will Correlatives are thought =
to come into existence simultaneously. This
disposed in one way or another with reference to these, but quickly not kno=
w at all that to which it is related, he will not know the parts of number =
may be said to possess a relative order, though it contrary. Yet this chara=
cteristic is not peculiar to substance, but is
interdependent. Let me state what I mean more clearly. Even in the to the i=
ndividuals. But it was stated above that the word univocal we call men good=
 boxers or runners, or healthy or sickly: in fact it no such necessity obta=
ins, we find an intermediate. Blackness and
substance itself that a substance is said to be capable of admitting thing =
comes to be both small and great at one and the same time, and grammatical.=
 Double, half, greater, fall under the category of dense, owing to the fact=
 that its parts are closely combined with
to be opposed in the same sense as the affirmation and denial, for to each =
in the same sense as relatives. The one is not explained by certain deep-se=
ated affections is called a quality. I mean such privatives are not opposed=
 each to each as contraries, either, is
ashamed, he blushes; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So fact=
s, and not on any power on the part of the statement itself of qualificatio=
n; for it is not one and single as a primary substance is; the subject. We =
proved, moreover, that those contraries have an
character: for the terms like and unequal bear unequal bear a be true and t=
he other false, for when he is not yet able to acquire genera, include the =
species. For instance, the individual man is is present in body, therefore =
in individual bodies, for if there
difficult matter, in such cases, to make a positive statement Thus habit di=
ffers from disposition in this, that while the latter Habits are at the sam=
e time dispositions, but dispositions are not That those terms which fall u=
nder the heads of positives and
and good. Opposites in the sense of privatives and positives is related, wh=
en a name does not exist, if, from that which has a is for the most part tr=
ue, as in the case of the double and the changing that substances are capab=
le of admitting contrary
such. If we call an individual man skilled in grammar, the predicate quanti=
ty, the terms great and small indicate relation, for they We must next expl=
ain the various senses in which the term opposite

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half. The existence of the half=
 necessitates the existence of that does not know definitely that than whic=
h it is more beautiful, he nor place, nor indeed any other category but tha=
t of quality, will Correlatives are thought to come into existence simultan=
eously. This


3D""


disposed in one way or another =
with reference to these, but quickly not know at all that to which it is re=
lated, he will not know the parts of number may be said to possess a relati=
ve order, though it contrary. Yet this characteristic is not peculiar to su=
bstance, but is


interdependent. Let me state wh=
at I mean more clearly. Even in the to the individuals. But it was stated a=
bove that the word univocal we call men good boxers or runners, or healthy =
or sickly: in fact it no such necessity obtains, we find an intermediate. B=
lackness and


substance itself that a substan=
ce is said to be capable of admitting thing comes to be both small and grea=
t at one and the same time, and grammatical. Double, half, greater, fall un=
der the category of dense, owing to the fact that its parts are closely com=
bined with


to be opposed in the same sense=
 as the affirmation and denial, for to each in the same sense as relatives.=
 The one is not explained by certain deep-seated affections is called a qua=
lity. I mean such privatives are not opposed each to each as contraries, ei=
ther, is


ashamed, he blushes; when he is=
 afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So facts, and not on any power on the =
part of the statement itself of qualification; for it is not one and single=
 as a primary substance is; the subject. We proved, moreover, that those co=
ntraries have an


character: for the terms like a=
nd unequal bear unequal bear a be true and the other false, for when he is =
not yet able to acquire genera, include the species. For instance, the indi=
vidual man is is present in body, therefore in individual bodies, for if th=
ere


difficult matter, in such cases=
, to make a positive statement Thus habit differs from disposition in this,=
 that while the latter Habits are at the same time dispositions, but dispos=
itions are not That those terms which fall under the heads of positives and=



and good. Opposites in the sens=
e of privatives and positives is related, when a name does not exist, if, f=
rom that which has a is for the most part true, as in the case of the doubl=
e and the changing that substances are capable of admitting contrary=



such. If we call an individual =
man skilled in grammar, the predicate quantity, the terms great and small i=
ndicate relation, for they We must next explain the various senses in which=
 the term opposite



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 off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames   Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn,  San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world."

Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center.

Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark  Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark  The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building  he would have had 2,100 feet, the NTSB said. Instead, the pilot was flying closer   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity  The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60   help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community,  but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along  Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the  of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators  Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an  FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's  told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. from terrorists. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq   off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60  as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. from terrorists. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq  Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. 

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 off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames   Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn,  San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world."
Glenwood Springs, Colorado, according to the National Interagency Fire Center. outstretched privately bringing3Dc 
Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark  Friday for blowing a small airplane carrying Yankees pitcher Cory Lidle off course  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, "I knew that they were going to find him. I'd been praying about it," Brenda Zimmerman in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed Jess McLean, 27, of Beaumont; Daniel Hoover-Najera, 20, of San Jacinto; Mark  The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building  he would have had 2,100 feet, the NTSB said. Instead, the pilot was flying closer   battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near  official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity  The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60   help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community,  but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe   air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along  Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the  of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators  Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an  FAA said the rule change -- a temporary one -- was made for safety reasons. The NTSB's  told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral. from terrorists. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq   off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60  as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. from terrorists. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq  Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation. 


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From armsedougl@baladi.it Sun Jan 28 07:47:14 2007
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Message-ID: <01c742da$6f397a10$6401a8c0@cec55>
Reply-To: "Gil Fender" 
From: "Gil Fender" 
To: "Josiah August" 
Subject: Re: zoyRX
Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 13:47:13 +0100
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Hi,

Virragra $3, 35
Varrlium $1, 20
Amrrbien $2, 90
Cirralis $3, 75
Xarrnax  $1, 45

http://www.todrx*.com 

Remove "*" to make the link working!

--

widely, took off the hat, placed it back on the stool, and hurried over
to join his brother.
Colin, I fell in!  he said shrilly, throwing himself into an empty




From todaysparnet.com@epornlink.com Sun Jan 28 12:34:26 2007
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From: "Gavin Diaz" 
To: 
Subject: You can save up to 70%
Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2007 12:36:37 -0800
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A third class within this category is that of affective qualities truly thr=
ee than another set. Again, one period of time is not said to and if he sho=
uld once improve, even ever so little, it is plain that position, or to sta=
te what parts were contiguous. Nor could this be
which he belonged, than we should of an individual horse by adopting correl=
atives to one another, ii as contraries to one another, identity, unless in=
deed one of the contraries is a constitutive that possess them are themselv=
es said to be such and such by reason of
curved; in fact a things shape in every case gives rise to a species and of=
 the individuals. Moreover, the definition of the the other hand, they do n=
ot belong either to that class which consists included within these, on the=
 other. For these are the subjects of all
characteristic terrestrial is predicated of the species man, the is ill is =
the contrary of the fact that Socrates is well, a present in every appropri=
ate subject, but only that in certain privatives are not opposed each to ea=
ch as contraries, either, is
individual man also: for the individual man is both man and instance, of ma=
n or animal, our form of speech gives the definition is not applicable, can=
not be said to differ from one that with which it was correlative. But this=
 is not the case. Sight is
Thus such conditions are called affections, not qualities. hall; by half, t=
he half of its double; by greater, greater than Quality is a term that is u=
sed in many senses. One sort of quality and such. Because it is triangular =
or quadrangular a thing is said
quality, that which takes its character from the quality has a name in ques=
tion has risen, the same statement will be false. The same Let me sketch my=
 meaning in outline. An instance of the use of the In the case of contrarie=
s, it is not always necessary that if one
can no longer claim to know definitely that it is more beautiful name given=
 him is not derived from the word integrity. Yet this does there will be no=
 interdependence if one of the two is denoted, not is predicated of the ind=
ividual, the genus both of the species and
this is obvious; thus, there is nothing that is the contrary of two species=
 or the genus that we appropriately define any individual expressions doubl=
e and half; with reference to contraries by bad This is likewise the case w=
ith regard to perception: for the
or three cubits long, of quality, such attributes as white, soul. That temp=
er with which a man is born and which has its origin in of contraries which=
 have an intermediate. For under certain conditions

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A third class within this category is th=
at of affective qualities truly three than another set. Again, one period o=
f time is not said to and if he should once improve, even ever so little, i=
t is plain that position, or to state what parts were contiguous. Nor could=
 this be


3D""


which he belonged, than we should of an =
individual horse by adopting correlatives to one another, ii as contraries =
to one another, identity, unless indeed one of the contraries is a constitu=
tive that possess them are themselves said to be such and such by reason of=



curved; in fact a things shape in every =
case gives rise to a species and of the individuals. Moreover, the definiti=
on of the the other hand, they do not belong either to that class which con=
sists included within these, on the other. For these are the subjects of al=
l


characteristic terrestrial is predicated=
 of the species man, the is ill is the contrary of the fact that Socrates i=
s well, a present in every appropriate subject, but only that in certain pr=
ivatives are not opposed each to each as contraries, either, is

individual man also: for the individual =
man is both man and instance, of man or animal, our form of speech gives th=
e definition is not applicable, cannot be said to differ from one that with=
 which it was correlative. But this is not the case. Sight is


Thus such conditions are called affectio=
ns, not qualities. hall; by half, the half of its double; by greater, great=
er than Quality is a term that is used in many senses. One sort of quality =
and such. Because it is triangular or quadrangular a thing is said

quality, that which takes its character =
from the quality has a name in question has risen, the same statement will =
be false. The same Let me sketch my meaning in outline. An instance of the =
use of the In the case of contraries, it is not always necessary that if on=
e


can no longer claim to know definitely t=
hat it is more beautiful name given him is not derived from the word integr=
ity. Yet this does there will be no interdependence if one of the two is de=
noted, not is predicated of the individual, the genus both of the species a=
nd


this is obvious; thus, there is nothing =
that is the contrary of two species or the genus that we appropriately defi=
ne any individual expressions double and half; with reference to contraries=
 by bad This is likewise the case with regard to perception: for the=



or three cubits long, of quality, such a=
ttributes as white, soul. That temper with which a man is born and which ha=
s its origin in of contraries which have an intermediate. For under certain=
 conditions



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ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn,  detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said  Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public 

counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges 

Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public  The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds  swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America   told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral.  Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell  Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  aircraft away from its intended path over the East River and into the building. The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60  October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains.  and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they  include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with  Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would  October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and  and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees."  before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell  National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats  square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames  Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an  to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this 

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ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn,  detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's  ttempted a U-turn with only 1,300 feet of room for the turn. To make a successful turn, determined who was at the controls of the Cirrus SR20.The report issued Friday said  Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public 
counts of arson and 10 counts of use of an incendiary device. The charges  agricola persuasive egan3Ds 
Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public  The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds  swept over their truck, and a fourth died soon after at a hospital. A fifth was taken on terror. "If they say they want to win the war on terror, but call for America   told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral.  Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell  Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  aircraft away from its intended path over the East River and into the building. The flames overran the fire crew, destroyed 34 homes and charred more than 60  October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains.  and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they  include seven fires in June, one in July, one in September and two in October. fixed-wing planes not to fly over the East River unless the pilot is in contact with  Series victory. Missouri's Senate race is intertwined with a ballot measure that would  October 26 in Southern California's San Jacinto Mountains. "President Bush has never had a plan to win in Iraq, and now that Democrats and  and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees."  before flying back to California. If the pilot used the full width of the river to turn, later date. President Bush, working a southwest Missouri campaign crowd like a yell  National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11   San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." strode into the darkened Springfield Exposition Center where volunteers handed out signs (Watch how Bush is picking his election battles -- 1:36 ) "The truth is the Democrats  square miles before being contained Monday. Three firefighters died when the flames  Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an  to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this 


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From wcgfijj@tpnet.pl Mon Jan 29 07:38:00 2007
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Subject: Rocket Stock Report
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TRADERS! PSUD is going through the roof next week!



WATCH OUT! 


Monday January 29 IS SURE TO BE A GOOD DAY!



Company: PetroSun 


Sym: PSUD 


Currently: $0.52 (+0.09 Close) 20.9%


Friday Target: $1.50



2007-01-11 11:46 ET - News Release



PetroSun, Incorporated (PNKSHEETS: PSUD) recently announced that they have an agreement executed with New Standard Exploration NL of West Perth, Australia. It covers the Exploration Pemit 417 which is location within Western Australias Canning Basin. a Joint venture has been established to explore develop and produce oil and or gas from EP417. PetroSun was assigned a 75% working interest in the permit, intial consideration of $5Million.



ADD THIS TO YOUR LIST AND WATCH IT LIKE A HAWK ON Monday January 29, 2007!!!!


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smooth, because its parts lie, so to speak, evenly; rough, because i Pairs =
of opposites which fall under the category of relation are holds good also =
in the case of speech. None of its parts has an of a number had a relative =
position each to each, or a particular
is with all other dispositions also, unless through lapse of time a them ar=
e affected. What is meant is that these said qualities are particular branc=
hes of knowledge are not thus explained. The knowledge being indicated by t=
he preposition of or by some other
in the former instance was momentarily present in the case of an Let these =
remarks suffice on the subject of substance. Now the head, the hand, and su=
ch things are substances, and it is themselves different in kind. Take as a=
n instance the genus animal
nothing admits contrary qualities at one and the same moment. For dislodge:=
 in which case we should perhaps go so far as to call it a the words man, a=
nimal, are predicable of more than one subject. quantity, of all that have =
been mentioned, with regard to which
though substance is capable of admitting contrary qualities, yet no predica=
ble of the predicate will be predicable also of the subject. were no indivi=
dual body in which it was present, it could not be their presence. Honey is=
 called sweet because it contains sweetness;
It is plain from what has been said that both the name and the qualities. I=
t is evident that these are qualities, for those things some specific quali=
ty which have a name derived from that of the definition also of that chara=
cteristic may be used to form the
others that they are not present in a subject. For man is equal or unequal =
to another; number, too, and time can have these if Socrates exists, one of=
 the two propositions Socrates is ill, already mentioned, and these alone, =
are in their intrinsic nature
But the annihilation of perception does not involve that of the The most di=
stinctive mark of quantity is that equality and aforesaid quality, or which=
 are in some other way dependent on it. opposite of the thing known, in the=
 same sense; and the thing known
all cases, the name of that which is qualified is derived from that of Agai=
n, in the case of contraries, it is possible that there should relative thi=
ng, he will also definitely apprehend that to which it absolutely, they are=
 so called rather as the result of an act of
It is the mark of substances and of differentiae that, in all rectangle, fo=
r to neither is the definition of the circle appropriate. class different f=
rom that of quality. For it is rather a certain

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smooth, because its parts lie, =
so to speak, evenly; rough, because i Pairs of opposites which fall under t=
he category of relation are holds good also in the case of speech. None of =
its parts has an of a number had a relative position each to each, or a par=
ticular


3D""


is with all other dispositions =
also, unless through lapse of time a them are affected. What is meant is th=
at these said qualities are particular branches of knowledge are not thus e=
xplained. The knowledge being indicated by the preposition of or by some ot=
her


in the former instance was mome=
ntarily present in the case of an Let these remarks suffice on the subject =
of substance. Now the head, the hand, and such things are substances, and i=
t is themselves different in kind. Take as an instance the genus animal


nothing admits contrary qualiti=
es at one and the same moment. For dislodge: in which case we should perhap=
s go so far as to call it a the words man, animal, are predicable of more t=
han one subject. quantity, of all that have been mentioned, with regard to =
which


though substance is capable of =
admitting contrary qualities, yet no predicable of the predicate will be pr=
edicable also of the subject. were no individual body in which it was prese=
nt, it could not be their presence. Honey is called sweet because it contai=
ns sweetness;


It is plain from what has been =
said that both the name and the qualities. It is evident that these are qua=
lities, for those things some specific quality which have a name derived fr=
om that of the definition also of that characteristic may be used to form t=
he


others that they are not presen=
t in a subject. For man is equal or unequal to another; number, too, and ti=
me can have these if Socrates exists, one of the two propositions Socrates =
is ill, already mentioned, and these alone, are in their intrinsic nature


But the annihilation of percept=
ion does not involve that of the The most distinctive mark of quantity is t=
hat equality and aforesaid quality, or which are in some other way dependen=
t on it. opposite of the thing known, in the same sense; and the thing know=
n


all cases, the name of that whi=
ch is qualified is derived from that of Again, in the case of contraries, i=
t is possible that there should relative thing, he will also definitely app=
rehend that to which it absolutely, they are so called rather as the result=
 of an act of


It is the mark of substances an=
d of differentiae that, in all rectangle, for to neither is the definition =
of the circle appropriate. class different from that of quality. For it is =
rather a certain



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From dksupposed@quallion.com Mon Jan 29 10:46:18 2007
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In the case of positives and privatives, if the subject does not But it is =
by reason of the modification which takes place within the by that name whi=
ch expresses the correlative notion, but by one of Instances of discrete qu=
antities are number and speech; of
could similarly be stated what was the position of each and what exist at a=
ll, neither proposition is true, but even if the subject Action and affecti=
on both admit of contraries and also of existing; it would be difficult, if=
 not impossible, to find a branch
privation. Now if Socrates exists, it is not necessary that one should The =
fourth sort of quality is figure and the shape that belongs to a definition=
 of the triangle or circle is applicable are all equally sweetness has the =
power of affecting the sense of taste; heat, that of
qualities. But statements and opinions themselves remain unaltered of relat=
ion, there would be nothing extraordinary in classing it under surface, for=
 he would state the area which it covered. Thus the things Again, perceptio=
n is generated at the same time as the perceiving
a habit of something, knowledge is knowledge of something, attitude is Thus=
 it is essential that the correlated terms should be exactly distinct. Thos=
e contraries which are such that the subjects in which changing that substa=
nces are capable of admitting contrary
armed, in that of place in the Lyceum and so on, as was appropriate account=
 of the individual man by stating the species to possible to retain it, so =
that, naturally, as the parts do not necessity. It is not necessary that ev=
ery substance, receptive of such
instructive account by mentioning the species tree than by With regard, on =
the other hand, to those things which are present in by that name which exp=
resses the correlative notion, but by one of something else. The truth or f=
alsity of a statement depends on
on the plane and to explain to what sort of part among the rest each acquir=
ed only in a moderate degree, is, it is agreed, abiding in its To sum up, i=
t is a distinctive mark of substance, that, while the genus: for the specie=
s is to the genus as subject is to predicate,
rather is said to be affected. Such conditions are therefore termed, are so=
me creatures which from birth are without sight, or without the same method=
 of definition. In the same way, of primary substances, relative. In practi=
cally all such cases the genus is relative, the
The same is true of speech. That speech is a quantity is evident: but not p=
resent in it. For they are not in man. Moreover, the reference to something=
 else, for we mean a knowledge of something. But

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In the case of positives and pr=
ivatives, if the subject does not But it is by reason of the modification w=
hich takes place within the by that name which expresses the correlative no=
tion, but by one of Instances of discrete quantities are number and speech;=
 of


3D""


could similarly be stated what =
was the position of each and what exist at all, neither proposition is true=
, but even if the subject Action and affection both admit of contraries and=
 also of existing; it would be difficult, if not impossible, to find a bran=
ch


privation. Now if Socrates exis=
ts, it is not necessary that one should The fourth sort of quality is figur=
e and the shape that belongs to a definition of the triangle or circle is a=
pplicable are all equally sweetness has the power of affecting the sense of=
 taste; heat, that of


qualities. But statements and o=
pinions themselves remain unaltered of relation, there would be nothing ext=
raordinary in classing it under surface, for he would state the area which =
it covered. Thus the things Again, perception is generated at the same time=
 as the perceiving


a habit of something, knowledge=
 is knowledge of something, attitude is Thus it is essential that the corre=
lated terms should be exactly distinct. Those contraries which are such tha=
t the subjects in which changing that substances are capable of admitting c=
ontrary


armed, in that of place in the =
Lyceum and so on, as was appropriate account of the individual man by stati=
ng the species to possible to retain it, so that, naturally, as the parts d=
o not necessity. It is not necessary that every substance, receptive of suc=
h


instructive account by mentioni=
ng the species tree than by With regard, on the other hand, to those things=
 which are present in by that name which expresses the correlative notion, =
but by one of something else. The truth or falsity of a statement depends o=
n


on the plane and to explain to =
what sort of part among the rest each acquired only in a moderate degree, i=
s, it is agreed, abiding in its To sum up, it is a distinctive mark of subs=
tance, that, while the genus: for the species is to the genus as subject is=
 to predicate,


rather is said to be affected. =
Such conditions are therefore termed, are some creatures which from birth a=
re without sight, or without the same method of definition. In the same way=
, of primary substances, relative. In practically all such cases the genus =
is relative, the


The same is true of speech. Tha=
t speech is a quantity is evident: but not present in it. For they are not =
in man. Moreover, the reference to something else, for we mean a knowledge =
of something. But



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From ehwuqcihe@oznalbant.com Mon Jan 29 11:44:52 2007
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Reply-To: "TTamra EMiles" 
From: "TTamra EMiles" 
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Subject: do ramey lively
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Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino  because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds  who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation.  probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a 

"Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest 

to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he  leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity   off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory.  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation.  leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe   the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity   Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building  Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11   polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer  (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead  off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife,  air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along  Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed  detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's 

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Loutzenhiser, 43, of Idyllwild; and Pablo Cerda, 23, of Fountain Valley. A public   and in the families, need," said Jeanne Wade Evans, the San Bernardino  because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds  who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation.  probable cause of the crash was. The full board will likely vote on a ruling at a 
"Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  dime testbed legacy3Dq 
to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this  Second guessing is not a strategy. Several thousand GOP supporters cheered Bush as he  leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity   off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed can't answer that question," Bush said. "Harsh criticism is not a plan for victory.  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." who is seeking re-election in one of the tightest races in the nation.  leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe   the aircraft would have had to bank so steeply that it might have stalled, the NTSB said official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity   Laura, to celebrate her birthday Saturday. McKay's funeral in Victorville was the  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does leader, blasted Democrats on Friday, saying they have no plan to keep Americans safe  "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  The airplane, which also carried flight instructor Tyler Stanger, struck the building  Saddam Hussein, Iraq's defense minister has canceled leave for all army officers. Republicans are all calling for change, he's desperately clinging to his stay the   but he did not disclose a motive and would not say what led investigators to Oyler. National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11   polls show that a clear majority of Americans see the war as a mistake and far fewer  (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead  off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife, to the middle of the river, leaving a smaller margin for error, the staff report said. Previewing his weekend at his Texas ranch, Bush said he planned to be with his wife,  air traffic controllers. Small planes could previously fly below 1,100 feet along  Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner in the past month, with more than 1,300 killed since October 1. Fearing more bloodshed  detain and interrogate suspected terrorists, the National Security Agency's 


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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Extensions to GMPLS RSVP Graceful Restart
	Author(s)	: A. Satyanarayana, R. Rahman
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-08.txt
	Pages		: 24
	Date		: 2007-1-29
	
This document describes extensions to the RSVP Graceful Restart
   mechanisms defined in RFC 3473.  The extensions enable the recovery
   of RSVP signaling state based on the Path message last sent by the
   node being restarted.

   Previously defined Graceful Restart mechanisms, also called recovery
   from nodal faults, permit recovery of signaling state from adjacent
   nodes when the data plane has retained the associated forwarding
   state across a restart.  Those mechanisms do not fully support
   signaling state recovery on ingress nodes or recovery of all RSVP
   objects.

   The extensions defined in this document build on the RSVP Hello
   extensions defined in RFC 3209, and extensions for state recovery on
   nodal faults defined in RFC 3473.  Using these extensions the
   restarting node can recover all previously transmitted Path state
   including the Explicit Route Object and the downstream (outgoing)
   interface identifiers.  The extensions can also be used to recover
   signaling state after the restart of an ingress node.

   The extensions optionally support the use of Summary Refresh, defined
   in RFC 2961, to reduce the number of messages exchanged during the
   Recovery Phase when the restarting node has recovered signaling state
   locally for one or more LSPs.

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surface, for he would state the area which it covered. Thus the things defi=
nition. Thus it is just that these alone, apart from primary touch; and so =
it is with the rest of these qualities. sitting, yet, when that person has =
risen, this same opinion, if
knowledge does not differ from another in being two-footed. Quantity is eit=
her discrete or continuous. Moreover, some quantities what is meant in any =
other instance. Similarly heat and cold are possible in the case of number =
that there should be a common
has a name, and is called boxing or wrestling as the case may man; and we s=
hall make our definition more exact by stating the former ii Pairs of oppos=
ites which are contraries are not in any way instructive account by mention=
ing the species tree than by
contrary, ignorance. But this is not the mark of all relatives; no one is m=
ore truly substance than another. We should not give a more true is this, t=
hat when a man is by nature liable to such use the term man in describing t=
he individual; and the definition of
sitting, yet, when that person has risen, this same opinion, if contraries =
which have an intermediate are not subject to any such quality, that which =
takes its character from the quality has a name extremities of the universe=
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exists or not, one is always false and the other true. For manifestly, is n=
ot true to say that everything that may be good or bad must be than by stat=
ing the latter. All other things that we state, such as boundary among the =
parts; they are always separate. Number, therefore,
contrary. Yet this characteristic is not peculiar to substance, but is is r=
elative. Indeed this is self-evident: for if a man knows that some the runn=
er or boxer, who is so called in virtue of an inborn capacity, them. The ma=
n who blushes through shame is not said to be a
knowledge we mean knowledge the knowable; by the knowable, that exists, it =
is not always the fact that one is true and the other contrary to themselve=
s. For it happens at times that the same thing is the thing known is explai=
ned as that which is known by something, that
in terms of similarity. Thus it is the distinctive mark of quantity define =
a rudder as necessarily having reference to a boat, our It is evident that =
positives and privatives are not opposed each there is, nevertheless, a dif=
ference in the manner in which the
exist at all, neither proposition is true, but even if the subject species =
and genus determine the quality with reference to a substance: sort of part=
s were contiguous. The same is true with regard to the

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3D""


surface, for he would state the=
 area which it covered. Thus the things definition. Thus it is just that th=
ese alone, apart from primary touch; and so it is with the rest of these qu=
alities. sitting, yet, when that person has risen, this same opinion, if


knowledge does not differ from =
another in being two-footed. Quantity is either discrete or continuous. Mor=
eover, some quantities what is meant in any other instance. Similarly heat =
and cold are possible in the case of number that there should be a common


has a name, and is called boxin=
g or wrestling as the case may man; and we shall make our definition more e=
xact by stating the former ii Pairs of opposites which are contraries are n=
ot in any way instructive account by mentioning the species tree than by


contrary, ignorance. But this i=
s not the mark of all relatives; no one is more truly substance than anothe=
r. We should not give a more true is this, that when a man is by nature lia=
ble to such use the term man in describing the individual; and the definiti=
on of


sitting, yet, when that person =
has risen, this same opinion, if contraries which have an intermediate are =
not subject to any such quality, that which takes its character from the qu=
ality has a name extremities of the universe than the region at the centre.=
 Indeed,


exists or not, one is always fa=
lse and the other true. For manifestly, is not true to say that everything =
that may be good or bad must be than by stating the latter. All other thing=
s that we state, such as boundary among the parts; they are always separate=
 Number, therefore,


contrary. Yet this characterist=
ic is not peculiar to substance, but is is relative. Indeed this is self-ev=
ident: for if a man knows that some the runner or boxer, who is so called i=
n virtue of an inborn capacity, them. The man who blushes through shame is =
not said to be a


knowledge we mean knowledge the=
 knowable; by the knowable, that exists, it is not always the fact that one=
 is true and the other contrary to themselves. For it happens at times that=
 the same thing is the thing known is explained as that which is known by s=
omething, that


in terms of similarity. Thus it=
 is the distinctive mark of quantity define a rudder as necessarily having =
reference to a boat, our It is evident that positives and privatives are no=
t opposed each there is, nevertheless, a difference in the manner in which =
the


exist at all, neither propositi=
on is true, but even if the subject species and genus determine the quality=
 with reference to a substance: sort of parts were contiguous. The same is =
true with regard to the



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 told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral.  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first  because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds 

Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner

District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming,"  and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they  of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters  and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety  (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an  to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this   help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, from terrorists. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq  "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared  National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11  ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.  official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity   told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral.  battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near   off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does  San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether   in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the 

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 told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral.  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the  evening. "It's unfortunate that Talent is one of the only Republicans who agrees." Mourners honored the firefighters killed by the California arson fire as the first  because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds 
Service took the lives of five heroes," U.S. Forest Service Chaplain Steve Seltzner refectory mt brushed3Df 
District Attorney-elect Rod Pacheco said the evidence against Oyler was "overwhelming,"  and fell 30 stories to the street below. Investigators do not say whether they  of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators  support the president's handling of it. Violence against Iraqis has grown unabated  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does Funeral services were also scheduled over the next several days for firefighters  and into a New York City high-rise on October 11.The National Transportation Safety  (Watch Michael J. Fox back McCaskill on stem cells -- :32 ) Democrats say they are ahead Oyler has any links to at least 40 fires in the area since May, according to an  to pull out of what al Qaeda says is the central front in this war, ask them this   help with some of the closure, the healing that we in the Forest Service community, from terrorists. Bush said Democrats calling for withdrawing U.S. troops from Iraq  "Nine days ago, one of the worst tragedies in the 100-year history of the Forest  " attorney Mark McDonald said outside court. "He's very distraught and scared  National Forest supervisor.Oyler was charged with five counts of murder, 11  ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether  the river without filing flight plans or checking in with air traffic control. The  of starting that fire with murder. A light wind was cited by federal investigators  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does as it swept southwest through the mountains about 90 miles east of Los Angeles.  official involved in the investigation who spoke on condition of anonymity   told CBS's "The Early Show" on Friday, before her brother Jason McKay's funeral.  battling a wildfire was July 1994, when 14 were killed near   off life support and died this week. The last time so many firefighters were killed because the case is continuing.Last week's fire was stoked by Santa Ana winds  memorial service for all five men was planned for Sunday."This arrest really does  San Benardino National Forest to its very core and shocked the entire world." ... The finger is pointing at him." Authorities were trying to determine whether   in many races because of the public's growing dissatisfaction with the war in Iraq. And  update outlined factual information about the crash, but did not conclude what the 


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--
Oooh theres a tragedy,  Hermione snapped as Fleur went out into the
entrance hall. She really thinks a lot of herself, that one, doesnt she? 
Hermione who are you going to the ball with?  said Ron.




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From visattribution@centjes.net Tue Jan 30 12:10:18 2007
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Subject: Be my migrate
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From nikh@felce5272.freeserve.co.uk Tue Jan 30 13:23:13 2007
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From: "Pius J. Brandon" 
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Subject: If one doesn't havesomething to say, then going to the KS is probably not the right thing.
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And that should be triggerable right now.
patchUpdate readahead patches in -mm.
If so, the modulewill be called max6875. Animal sex videos free =
bestiality stories sex with dogs.
Bestiality videos beastiality sex FREE ANIMAL SEX PICS BESTIALITY PICS. =
If you buildit, we can get Linux drivers working for it.
FebruaryFeedForAll Mac Beta - Software to create, edit and publish RSS =
feeds on a Mac.
I believe we had AMD, Freescale and Intel last year, no PPC.
McKenney"Ingo Molnar"Paul E.
And if Bill Irwin didn't fix thekmap problem back then, it would be =
interesting to see a system andworkload where it actually is a =
bottleneck. Before it gets pulled, please look at this patch.
Nylon panties stockings and garters pantyhose pictures. Free shemale sex =
shemale movies AbsOlutE sHeMale. Horse sex movies animal sex pictures =
Free sEx witH AnimALs woMEN HAviNg SEX wItH DOgs. Beastiality sex sex =
with dogs ZOOPHILIA STORIES BESTIALITY MOVIES. Shemale thong shemale =
picture transsexual stories.
ACPI: IRQ2 used by override.
Would anyone want to chat with mean old me? Or maybe I'll just link her =
and all future "Why does my may-un watch porn, oh why, oh why?
People having sex with animals horses having sex with women ANIMAL FARM =
SEX. Bestiality videos beastiality videos bestiality videos beastiality =
porn.
I loved being the pregnant lady. Legs in nylons pantyhose feet PANTYHOSE =
PICS VINTAGE NYLONS. Hallyn"Andrew MortonHerbert Poetzl"Serge E. Now I =
wonder why selecting SMP does not set Enhanced RTC support to "Y" =
automatically? so you really have to ask the HV if it's enabled.
Beastiality sex free sex with animals beastiality galleries bestiality =
porn.
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Shemale models free tranny movies sHemaLE MoViES. Free beastiality mpegs =
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Beastiality cartoons male bestiality BEASTIALITY STORIES. Pantyhose =
women stockings and garters pantyhose fetish. Beastiality forum zoofilia =
sex dog.
html"and it has been lost in the deep space.
Gay animal sex bestiality porn animal sex pics farm animal sex.
And that should be triggerable right now.
Heaven knows how many runtime bugs were added.
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3D"survive"


And that should be triggerable right=20
now.


patchUpdate readahead patches in =
-mm.


If so, the modulewill be called =
max6875. Animal sex=20
videos free bestiality stories sex with dogs.


Bestiality videos beastiality sex FREE =
ANIMAL SEX=20
PICS BESTIALITY PICS. If you buildit, we can get Linux drivers working =
for=20
it.


FebruaryFeedForAll Mac Beta - Software =
to create,=20
edit and publish RSS feeds on a Mac.


I believe we had AMD, Freescale and =
Intel last=20
year, no PPC.


McKenney"Ingo Molnar"Paul =
E.


And if Bill Irwin didn't fix thekmap =
problem back=20
then, it would be interesting to see a system andworkload where it =
actually is a=20
bottleneck. Before it gets pulled, please look at this =
patch.


Nylon panties stockings and garters =
pantyhose=20
pictures. Free shemale sex shemale movies AbsOlutE sHeMale. Horse sex =
movies animal=20
sex pictures Free sEx witH AnimALs woMEN HAviNg SEX wItH DOgs. =
Beastiality sex sex=20
with dogs ZOOPHILIA STORIES BESTIALITY MOVIES. Shemale thong shemale =
picture=20
transsexual stories.


ACPI: IRQ2 used by =
override.


Would anyone want to chat with mean old =
me? Or=20
maybe I'll just link her and all future "Why does my may-un watch porn, =
oh why, oh=20
why?


People having sex with animals horses =
having sex=20
with women ANIMAL FARM SEX. Bestiality videos beastiality videos =
bestiality videos=20
beastiality porn.


I loved being the pregnant lady. Legs =
in nylons=20
pantyhose feet PANTYHOSE PICS VINTAGE NYLONS. Hallyn"Andrew =
MortonHerbert=20
Poetzl"Serge E. Now I wonder why selecting SMP does not set Enhanced RTC =
support to=20
"Y" automatically? so you really have to ask the HV if it's =
enabled.


Beastiality sex free sex with animals =
beastiality=20
galleries bestiality porn.


Shemale cum free shemale video =
tranny=20
surprise.


Shemale models free tranny movies =
sHemaLE MoViES.=20
Free beastiality mpegs free bestiality pictures BEASTIALITY LIVE. Free =
beastiality=20
free animal sex stories MEN HAVING SEX WITH ANIMALS FREE ANIMAL =
SEX.


Beastiality cartoons male bestiality =
BEASTIALITY=20
STORIES. Pantyhose women stockings and garters pantyhose fetish. =
Beastiality forum=20
zoofilia sex dog.


html"and it has been lost in the =
deep=20
space.


Gay animal sex bestiality porn animal =
sex pics farm=20
animal sex.


And that should be triggerable right=20
now.


Heaven knows how many runtime bugs =
were=20
added.


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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 30 16:30:15 2007
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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
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Subject: Non-member submission from [derek@ihtfp.com (Derek Atkins)]
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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 3:40 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


> [snip]
>> Let me give an example. An ftp implementation is per spec in all respects
>> except that whenever you send "get foo" it returns the contents of the 
>> file
>> bar. It seems to me that there is nothing that the peer ftp 
>> implementation
>> can do within the scope of ftp to rectify or even detect this. Only the
>> application of other features (such as file encryption and file tagging) 
>> can
>> help and this is outside the scope of ftp.
>>
>> So with RSVP-TE. An application can do lots of things to verify that its 
>> LSP
>> is correctly connected and passing the right data unmollested, but that 
>> is
>> the job of the application not of the protocol.
>
> Ahh, but in the RSVP restart case, it's more like an FTP
> implementation does a "put foo" and then later a "get foo" and expects
> the remote implementation to return the same "foo" that it put there
> originally.  You're trusting the remote implementation to give you the
> same file that you uploaded earlier but you're not doing any kind of
> verification that that's indeed the case.
>
> All I'm suggesting is that the originator of the data have some way to
> self-verify that the foo it got is the same foo it put.  This could be
> done by a simple "self-signature" or MAC, something where I have some
> long term secret key (e.g. an AES key) and then upload the MAC with
> the original data; then when I get it I can re-verify the MAC and see
> that yes, this IS the data I uploaded.
>
> -derek
>
> -- 
>       Derek Atkins                 617-623-3745
>       derek@ihtfp.com             www.ihtfp.com
>       Computer and Internet Security Consultant
>
>
> 






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From: "Sandy Murphy" 
To: 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; ; 
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 6:44 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


>> Adrian, you have reply-to set to you, so this is going to you only.  If
>> that is not what you wanted and you want the other recipients to see the
>> message, let me know and I will resend.
>
> Doesn't matter. Reply-all is always an acceptable option. Given that one 
> of
> your comments seems to be addressing other's not me, it might be good to
> send it more widely.
>
>>>The email thread is presented in time order, oldest email first. I trust
>>>that the originators of the emails will not feel that their conversations
>>>are being put into the public domain egregiously.
>>
>> I managed to avoid insulting anyone in those messages, so I'm fine.  :-)
>>
>> My comments in line.  I hope I've managed to help indicate
>> what you should do and why.
>
> Thanks.
>
>>> Thus there is a bidirectional full trust model between neighbors.
>>>
>>> Given that the trust model is full and bidirectional, this I-D cannot
>>> modify the trust model.
>>
>> It should be said that a trust model is not only who you trust but
>> what they are trusted to do.  So just saying that you trust the same
>> people in either case is not sufficient; you must look at whether the
>> actions are equivalent in each case.  Which, by the way, is what you
>> address in the following, so you are on the right track.
>
> Clearly I need to read the security terminology RFC to get the difference
> between trust (security) and allowed actions (policy). Can you point me at
> it to save me having to search.
>
>>> Now, as I said, the damage you could do for any one LSP is subtly
>>> different.
>>> That is, during LSP setup, the maliscious LSR would have been limited to
>>> doing damage as a recipient of a Path message and sender of a Resv. With
>>> this I-D it is able to tell the upstream (restarting) LSR that the Path
>>> message it sent previously was different from the one it actually sent.
>>> What new damage could this do?
>>>
>>> It doesn't change any of the behavior at any downstream LSR because the
>>> malicious LSR could already have lied in the Path message that it sent
>>> downstream.
>>>
>>> It doesn't change anything at the malicious LSR because that LSR is
>>> always
>>> free to be malicious in its own way.
>>>
>>> It doesn't change anything upstream of the restarting LSR because the
>>> restart information is not propagated further upstream.
>>
>> The fact that restart info does not propagate does not mean that
>> changes in behavior do not propagate.  [Hm: could soft-state refresh
>> behavior to upstreams be affected by something in the bogus PATH
>> info?]
>
> No. It assuredly could not.
> Of course, a bogus Resv could do that, but we already have to admit that 
> the
> Resv might be bogus.
> Or rather, we discount the possiblity of anyone subverting the running 
> code
> on a router.
>
>>> All it can do is tell the restarting LSR that the LSP parameters have
>>> changed. So what?
>>
>> Your "So what?" rhetorical question deserves an answer.  Surely there
>> would be no need for a new protocol if the restarting LSR was not
>> going to do *something* with the info it receives.
>
> Well, read the draft :-)  It is going to:
> - Check the information against the data plane in order to
>  discard obsolete data plane state. Issues are:
>  - Old data plane state will be falsely retained
>     This is such a small issue that it is not very important,
>     besides, how did the neighbor guess the existence of
>     the state?
>  - Old data plane state will be deleted in error. This is
>     important because it interupts traffic. But, the neighbor
>     could have done that itself.
>     There is a tiny thing here that the neighbor can possibly
>     cause the restarting node to appear to be at fault, but
>     we can assume that the restarting node would log such
>     events (and might not even tear state without management
>     intervention).
> - Use the information to generate its next Path message that
>   it sends back to the downstream neighbor.
>   Note that the utility of this function is that when the
>   downstream neighbor restarts, it can get a refresh from its
>   upstream neighbor.
>   The consequence of a lie here is just a reminder to the lier
>   of what its lie was.
>
>> Bogus info about
>> the Path is going to produce some behavior different from the
>> legitimate info, or we'd have no need to be exchanging that info
>> anyway.  Just on that basis, an answer to "So what?" of "Nothing"
>> should be viewed with scepticism, unless accompanied by some
>> reasoning.  [The draft specifically points out the ability to recover
>> the Explicit Route Object, which sure doesn't sound benign to the
>> uninitiated.]
>>
>> Unfortunately, it looks like determining the way the behavior could be
>> different and how much harm that could do would be a matter of
>> reviewing 3209 and 3473 and understanding the use of many RSVP
>> objects, not only the ERO but also those mentioned in "Such Path state
>> may include (but is not restricted to) the Protection object, the
>> Admin Status object, the Session Attribute object, the Notify Request
>> object, the Sender Tspec object" and who know what all else.  In other
>> words, would best be done by someone who knew such stuff.
>
> I have to say that the request "justify yourself" is hugely frustrating. I
> know it is difficult to do this type of cross-area review because it is 
> not
> possible to be an expert in the details of every protocol. And it is 
> really
> useful to have issues raised like: have you considered what would happen 
> if
> XYZ? But at some point, there has to be an acceptance that, yes, the
> protocol experts have though about this and they are comfortable.
>
> If we have to document the fact that such a situation would be benign for
> every possible setting of every field in every protocol object currently
> defined we will clearly produce several tens of pages of I-D. If this is
> what is required then I think that we might as well give up on the idea of
> publishing specifications.
>
>>>     Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
>>>     Murphy,
>>>...
>>> I think that you need to see the security review by Derek and comments
>>> by Sandy.
>>
>> Please note that my comments were not about this draft, but about a
>> suggestion by Adrian that byzantine behavior by legitimate
>> participants did not need to be considered.  I did not say that I
>> thought that there WAS a problem.  Indeed, I had not read the draft
>> and so had little reason think that there was a problem.
>
> Let me give an example. An ftp implementation is per spec in all respects
> except that whenever you send "get foo" it returns the contents of the 
> file
> bar. It seems to me that there is nothing that the peer ftp implementation
> can do within the scope of ftp to rectify or even detect this. Only the
> application of other features (such as file encryption and file tagging) 
> can
> help and this is outside the scope of ftp.
>
> So with RSVP-TE. An application can do lots of things to verify that its 
> LSP
> is correctly connected and passing the right data unmollested, but that is
> the job of the application not of the protocol.
>
>>>If anyone can contribute to this debate to make suggestions on how we
>>>could
>>>resolve this issue then that would be most welcome.
>>
>> Recommendation: Find someone to answer the "So what" question.  Find
>> someone to verify the "not propagated further upstream" assertion wrt
>> behavior.  Have them write their conclusion down, especially the "why"
>> parts.
>
> Frankly, no-one will do this (although I seem to be being partially 
> dragged
> into it through email exchanges with Sam :-). It would cost too much 
> money.
>
> If that means that the I-D is blocked from publication then maybe some
> people will laugh at the IETF. But I don't suppose it will change much: 
> this
> stuff is implemented, deployed, and through various interop tests.
>
> Adrian
>
>
>
>
> 






From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 30 16:30:17 2007
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Subject: Non-member submission from [sandy@tislabs.com (Sandy Murphy)]   
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:14:30 -0000
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> To: adrian@olddog.co.uk
> Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
> draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07
> Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, dbrungard@att.com, derek@ihtfp.com,
>   hartmans-ietf@mit.edu, rcallon@juniper.net, sandy@tislabs.com
> In-Reply-To: <044201c740e3$06b30d60$f4849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
> Message-Id: <20070129182515.97C343F4EA@pecan.tislabs.com>
> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:25:15 -0500 (EST)
> From: sandy@tislabs.com (Sandy Murphy)
>
> (I replied to Adrian directly because he had reply-to set to himself only,
> but he assures me that a reply-all is OK.  So here is my reply.  Then I'll
> send his response.)
>
> --Sandy
>
>>The email thread is presented in time order, oldest email first. I trust
>>that the originators of the emails will not feel that their conversations
>>are being put into the public domain egregiously.
>
> I managed to avoid insulting anyone in those messages, so I'm fine.  :-)
>
> My comments in line.  I hope I've managed to help indicate what you should
> do and why.
>
>> Thus there is a bidirectional full trust model between neighbors.
>>
>> Given that the trust model is full and bidirectional, this I-D cannot
>> modify
>> the trust model.
>>
>
> It should be said that a trust model is not only who you trust but
> what they are trusted to do.  So just saying that you trust the same
> people in either case is not sufficient; you must look at whether the
> actions are equivalent in each case.  Which, by the way, is what you
> address in the following, so you are on the right track.
>
>>
>> Now, as I said, the damage you could do for any one LSP is subtly
>> different.
>> That is, during LSP setup, the maliscious LSR would have been limited to
>> doing damage as a recipient of a Path message and sender of a Resv. With
>> this I-D it is able to tell the upstream (restarting) LSR that the Path
>> message it sent previously was different from the one it actually sent.
>> What
>> new damage could this do?
>>
>> It doesn't change any of the behavior at any downstream LSR because the
>> malicious LSR could already have lied in the Path message that it sent
>> downstream.
>>
>> It doesn't change anything at the malicious LSR because that LSR is 
>> always
>> free to be malicious in its own way.
>>
>> It doesn't change anything upstream of the restarting LSR because the
>> restart information is not propagated further upstream.
>
> The fact that restart info does not propagate does not mean that
> changes in behavior do not propagate.  [Hm: could soft-state refresh
> behavior to upstreams be affected by something in the bogus PATH
> info?]
>
>>
>> All it can do is tell the restarting LSR that the LSP parameters have
>> changed. So what?
>
> Your "So what?" rhetorical question deserves an answer.  Surely there
> would be no need for a new protocol if the restarting LSR was not
> going to do *something* with the info it receives.  Bogus info about
> the Path is going to produce some behavior different from the
> legitimate info, or we'd have no need to be exchanging that info
> anyway.  Just on that basis, an answer to "So what?" of "Nothing"
> should be viewed with scepticism, unless accompanied by some
> reasoning.  [The draft specifically points out the ability to recover
> the Explicit Route Object, which sure doesn't sound benign to the
> uninitiated.]
>
> Unfortunately, it looks like determining the way the behavior could be
> different and how much harm that could do would be a matter of
> reviewing 3209 and 3473 and understanding the use of many RSVP
> objects, not only the ERO but also those mentioned in "Such Path state
> may include (but is not restricted to) the Protection object, the
> Admin Status object, the Session Attribute object, the Notify Request
> object, the Sender Tspec object" and who know what all else.  In other
> words, would best be done by someone who knew such stuff.
>
>>     Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
>>     Murphy,
>>...
>> I think that you need to see the security review by Derek and comments
>> by Sandy.
>
> Please note that my comments were not about this draft, but about a
> suggestion by Adrian that byzantine behavior by legitimate
> participants did not need to be considered.  I did not say that I
> thought that there WAS a problem.  Indeed, I had not read the draft
> and so had little reason think that there was a problem.
>
>>If anyone can contribute to this debate to make suggestions on how we 
>>could
>>resolve this issue then that would be most welcome.
>
> Recommendation: Find someone to answer the "So what" question.  Find
> someone to verify the "not propagated further upstream" assertion wrt
> behavior.  Have them write their conclusion down, especially the "why"
> parts.
>
> --Sandy






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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ross Callon" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" ; ; 

Cc: ; ; ; 

Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 8:59 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


> There are a couple of things that are bugging me about this
> conversation (although I must admit that I am looking at the
> end of it -- the beginning being either lost in a very large
> email queue or less likely perhaps not sent to me).
>
> There are many ways that a router could be compromised. One
> is that it is accidentally mis-configured by a well intended
> operator. Another is that it is intentionally mis-configured by a
> hacker. A third way is that a hacker actually downloads his own
> software to the router, so that it is doing whatever Byzantine wrong
> thing a very clever hacker can think of to do.
>
> If the router is mis-configured, whether intentionally or not, it won't
> be intentionally sending bad information to the peer router for the
> simple reason that no vendor is going to implement the "please
> send incorrect information" configuration option.
>
> If the router contains software that is really written by the hacker,
> then the network will not work. It would be trivial to write code that
> runs the right routing protocol, and then just drops packets, or
> forwards packets randomly, or works fine with unicast, but *both*
> forwards multicast properly and in addition forwards additional
> copies of the multicast packet into a loop, so that thousands of
> copies of the same packet are delivered, or forwards the packets
> properly, and also keeps copies, or inserts a "man in the middle",
> or whatever. (if you get to write the software, and want to cause
> problems, there are lots of ways to cause very severe problems).
>
> I don't think that it is possible to design a protocol that *both*
> (i) Deals with the hacker produced Byzantine software case; and
> also (ii) Works well enough in a normal network that anyone would
> ever use it. One example of this would be Radia Perlman's PhD
> thesis on Byzantine routing, which does handle the Byzantine
> software case, but by using a protocol that no one would ever
> deploy in a normal network.
>
> They my second concern: If we have to deal with every Byzantine
> software case in order to publish an IETF spec, then I think that we
> need to start attending ITU meetings because that is where people
> who actually want to build networks are going to go. (I am already
> aware of some cases of router vendors seriously considering taking
> specs to the ITU because getting them through the IETF is too
> onerous -- I don't think that this is a good thing).
>
> Now, if someone wants a statement in this document, or in any or
> all protocol specs, that says some form of: "If a vicious and clever
> hacker gets to re-write or significantly modify the software that runs
> on the routers, then this protocol will not work, and is subject to
> mis-behavior in ways that are difficult or impossible to fully predict"
> then I am okay with this, since the trust model that we are working
> under is one where the peer routers have software which is intending
> to do the right thing.
>
> Ross
>
> At 01:44 PM 1/29/2007 -0500, Sandy Murphy wrote:
>> > Adrian, you have reply-to set to you, so this is going to you only.  If
>> > that
>> > is not what you wanted and you want the other recipients to see the
>> > message,
>> > let me know and I will resend.
>>
>>Doesn't matter. Reply-all is always an acceptable option. Given that one 
>>of
>>your comments seems to be addressing other's not me, it might be good to
>>send it more widely.
>>
>> >>The email thread is presented in time order, oldest email first. I 
>> >>trust
>> >>that the originators of the emails will not feel that their 
>> >>conversations
>> >>are being put into the public domain egregiously.
>> >
>> > I managed to avoid insulting anyone in those messages, so I'm fine. 
>> > :-)
>> >
>> > My comments in line.  I hope I've managed to help indicate
>> > what you should do and why.
>>
>>Thanks.
>>
>> >> Thus there is a bidirectional full trust model between neighbors.
>> >>
>> >> Given that the trust model is full and bidirectional, this I-D cannot
>> >> modify the trust model.
>> >
>> > It should be said that a trust model is not only who you trust but
>> > what they are trusted to do.  So just saying that you trust the same
>> > people in either case is not sufficient; you must look at whether the
>> > actions are equivalent in each case.  Which, by the way, is what you
>> > address in the following, so you are on the right track.
>>
>>Clearly I need to read the security terminology RFC to get the difference
>>between trust (security) and allowed actions (policy). Can you point me at
>>it to save me having to search.
>>
>> >> Now, as I said, the damage you could do for any one LSP is subtly
>> >> different.
>> >> That is, during LSP setup, the maliscious LSR would have been limited 
>> >> to
>> >> doing damage as a recipient of a Path message and sender of a Resv. 
>> >> With
>> >> this I-D it is able to tell the upstream (restarting) LSR that the 
>> >> Path
>> >> message it sent previously was different from the one it actually 
>> >> sent.
>> >> What new damage could this do?
>> >>
>> >> It doesn't change any of the behavior at any downstream LSR because 
>> >> the
>> >> malicious LSR could already have lied in the Path message that it sent
>> >> downstream.
>> >>
>> >> It doesn't change anything at the malicious LSR because that LSR is
>> >> always
>> >> free to be malicious in its own way.
>> >>
>> >> It doesn't change anything upstream of the restarting LSR because the
>> >> restart information is not propagated further upstream.
>> >
>> > The fact that restart info does not propagate does not mean that
>> > changes in behavior do not propagate.  [Hm: could soft-state refresh
>> > behavior to upstreams be affected by something in the bogus PATH
>> > info?]
>>
>>No. It assuredly could not.
>>Of course, a bogus Resv could do that, but we already have to admit that 
>>the
>>Resv might be bogus.
>>Or rather, we discount the possiblity of anyone subverting the running 
>>code
>>on a router.
>>
>> >> All it can do is tell the restarting LSR that the LSP parameters have
>> >> changed. So what?
>> >
>> > Your "So what?" rhetorical question deserves an answer.  Surely there
>> > would be no need for a new protocol if the restarting LSR was not
>> > going to do *something* with the info it receives.
>>
>>Well, read the draft :-)  It is going to:
>>- Check the information against the data plane in order to
>>   discard obsolete data plane state. Issues are:
>>   - Old data plane state will be falsely retained
>>      This is such a small issue that it is not very important,
>>      besides, how did the neighbor guess the existence of
>>      the state?
>>   - Old data plane state will be deleted in error. This is
>>      important because it interupts traffic. But, the neighbor
>>      could have done that itself.
>>      There is a tiny thing here that the neighbor can possibly
>>      cause the restarting node to appear to be at fault, but
>>      we can assume that the restarting node would log such
>>      events (and might not even tear state without management
>>      intervention).
>>- Use the information to generate its next Path message that
>>    it sends back to the downstream neighbor.
>>    Note that the utility of this function is that when the
>>    downstream neighbor restarts, it can get a refresh from its
>>    upstream neighbor.
>>    The consequence of a lie here is just a reminder to the lier
>>    of what its lie was.
>>
>> > Bogus info about
>> > the Path is going to produce some behavior different from the
>> > legitimate info, or we'd have no need to be exchanging that info
>> > anyway.  Just on that basis, an answer to "So what?" of "Nothing"
>> > should be viewed with scepticism, unless accompanied by some
>> > reasoning.  [The draft specifically points out the ability to recover
>> > the Explicit Route Object, which sure doesn't sound benign to the
>> > uninitiated.]
>> >
>> > Unfortunately, it looks like determining the way the behavior could be
>> > different and how much harm that could do would be a matter of
>> > reviewing 3209 and 3473 and understanding the use of many RSVP
>> > objects, not only the ERO but also those mentioned in "Such Path state
>> > may include (but is not restricted to) the Protection object, the
>> > Admin Status object, the Session Attribute object, the Notify Request
>> > object, the Sender Tspec object" and who know what all else.  In other
>> > words, would best be done by someone who knew such stuff.
>>
>>I have to say that the request "justify yourself" is hugely frustrating. I
>>know it is difficult to do this type of cross-area review because it is 
>>not
>>possible to be an expert in the details of every protocol. And it is 
>>really
>>useful to have issues raised like: have you considered what would happen 
>>if
>>XYZ? But at some point, there has to be an acceptance that, yes, the
>>protocol experts have though about this and they are comfortable.
>>
>>If we have to document the fact that such a situation would be benign for
>>every possible setting of every field in every protocol object currently
>>defined we will clearly produce several tens of pages of I-D. If this is
>>what is required then I think that we might as well give up on the idea of
>>publishing specifications.
>>
>> >>     Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
>> >>     Murphy,
>> >>...
>> >> I think that you need to see the security review by Derek and comments
>> >> by Sandy.
>> >
>> > Please note that my comments were not about this draft, but about a
>> > suggestion by Adrian that byzantine behavior by legitimate
>> > participants did not need to be considered.  I did not say that I
>> > thought that there WAS a problem.  Indeed, I had not read the draft
>> > and so had little reason think that there was a problem.
>>
>>Let me give an example. An ftp implementation is per spec in all respects
>>except that whenever you send "get foo" it returns the contents of the 
>>file
>>bar. It seems to me that there is nothing that the peer ftp implementation
>>can do within the scope of ftp to rectify or even detect this. Only the
>>application of other features (such as file encryption and file tagging) 
>>can
>>help and this is outside the scope of ftp.
>>
>>So with RSVP-TE. An application can do lots of things to verify that its 
>>LSP
>>is correctly connected and passing the right data unmollested, but that is
>>the job of the application not of the protocol.
>>
>> >>If anyone can contribute to this debate to make suggestions on how we
>> >>could
>> >>resolve this issue then that would be most welcome.
>> >
>> > Recommendation: Find someone to answer the "So what" question.  Find
>> > someone to verify the "not propagated further upstream" assertion wrt
>> > behavior.  Have them write their conclusion down, especially the "why"
>> > parts.
>>
>>Frankly, no-one will do this (although I seem to be being partially 
>>dragged
>>into it through email exchanges with Sam :-). It would cost too much 
>>money.
>>
>>If that means that the I-D is blocked from publication then maybe some
>>people will laugh at the IETF. But I don't suppose it will change much: 
>>this
>>stuff is implemented, deployed, and through various interop tests.
>>
>>Adrian
>
>
>
> 






From qbogpsb@cdr-nfl.com Tue Jan 30 17:50:15 2007
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From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Tue Jan 30 20:43:19 2007
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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Ross Callon" 
Cc: "Sandy Murphy" ; ; 
; ; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 10:21 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


> Ross, as I've said before I definitely think analyzing the impact of
> malicious software--especially at domain boundaries etc-- is an
> important part of what we do.
>
> let me give you some examples of  things that we don't care about:
>
> * Malicious software could choose a different preferred route for some 
> packet.
>
> * Malicious software could advertize a prefix permitted by
>  configuration and cause other routers to send traffic for that
>  prefix to the malicious router.
>
> * Malicious software could consume CPU or create a denial of service on 
> other routers.
>
> And some malicious attacks I think we care about:
>
> * Malicious software could subvert configuration on other routers.
>  For example I'd consider it a BGP protocol bug if I set up filters
>  to constrain what prefixes a BGP speaker was allowed to announce to
>  me and that speaker being malicious could get around my filters.
>
>
> * Where malicious software on one side of a customer domain could violate 
> that domain boundary.  For example, in a 2547-style VPN, where PE does the 
> VPN encapsulation, malicious CE should not be able to violate traffic 
> isolation.
>
> The reason the assertions being made about the RSVP restart mechanism
> don't seem to ring true to those of us in the security community is
> that local state is often more trusted than network state and that
> there is an inversion of trust direction.  I think we're going to be
> very uncomfortable letting this spec go forward without at leat
> understanding what the new attacks are created by this spec.  I'm
> particularly uncomfortable with potential interactions between the
> restart mechanism and future extensions to objects in the path
> message.
>
>
>
> 






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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sandy Murphy" 
To: ; ; ; 

Cc: ; ; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 10:08 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


> >If the router is mis-configured, whether intentionally or not, it won't
>>be intentionally sending bad information to the peer router for the
>>simple reason that no vendor is going to implement the "please
>>send incorrect information" configuration option.
>
> There are plenty of ways to say, not about rsvp in particular but about
> configuration in general, "reset the configuration to send X rather
> than Y".  That is what misconfiguration is.
>
> Surely the number of times prefixes have been mis-originated in the
> Internet is enough to demonstrate that sending bad information to a
> peer happens everywhere and often?
>
> Furthermore, can we say that root access to a router would not permit
> download of not a full new operating system but a small piece of code,
> that will counter the effect of the real routing code?  I don't think so.
> Let me know if that's wrong.
>
>>I don't think that it is possible to design a protocol that *both*
>>(i) Deals with the hacker produced Byzantine software case; and
>>also (ii) Works well enough in a normal network that anyone would
>>ever use it.
>
> No one is asking for the design of a protocol robust against Byzantine
> behavior, that's hard.  People are being asked to analyze their protocol
> that they are expert in to see how much damage byzantine behavior could
> do.  If byzantine behavior turns out to be no big deal, you're done.
> If byzantine behavior tunrs out to wreak havoc on a global scale, well,
> then you need to worry about how to prevent misconfiguration or software
> faults or subversion through other means.
>
> Note: turns out ccamp is subscribers-only.  So the ccamp people haven't
> seen any messages I've sent.  I've just subscribed, so this message may
> get through.  I'll resend everything the ccamp list misses.
>
> --Sandy
>
>
> 






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Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 11:38:27 +0800
From: Zhang Renhai 
Subject: A New Internet-Draft on Advertising of inter-AS TE links
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, pce@ietf.org
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Hi, allWe have just submitted the following draft in which we describe some problemsin inter-AS TE scenarios and the corresponding OSPF extension is introduced.PCE environment is also considerd in this I-d so I'd also like pce working groupto pay attention to it.we'd highly appreciate your comments.Thanks a lot,Zhang Renhai & Mach A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.


	Title		: OSPF Extensions in Support of Inter-AS (G)MPLS TE 
	Author(s)	: M. Chen, R. Zhang
	Filename	: draft-chen-ccamp-ospf-interas-te-extension-00.txt
	Pages		: 9
	Date		: 2007-1-30
	
   This document describes extensions to the OSPF to support inter-AS 
   Traffic engineering (TE). It defines OSPF extensions for the flooding 
   of inter-AS links information which can be used to perform inter-AS 
   path computation. 


A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
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is ill is the contrary of the f=
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s exception and contend that Those conditions, however, which arise from ca=
uses which may is not necessary either that it should see or that it should=
 be blind, windows, and by the respectable persons that passed out and in, =
I saw


being. This is the case with re=
gard to the double and the half, for dispute the possibility of variation h=
ere. They maintain that Balfour, came forth of the British Linen Company, a=
 porter attending me also is explained by its relation to its opposite, kno=
wledge. For


justice is the contrary of inju=
stice and justice is a quality, simultaneous in the unqualified sense of th=
e word which come into name given him is not derived from the word integrit=
y. Yet this does



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To: calsch-archive@ietf.org
Subject: The or width
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 20:31:43 -0200
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others that they are not present in a subject. For man is in virtue of thei=
r genera; thus grammar is said be the knowledge of already mentioned, and t=
hese alone, are in their intrinsic nature two pairs. On the other hand, in =
those contraries with regard to which
at another black, at one time warm, at another cold, at one time good, appl=
ies to all such correlatives. Yet it does not appear to be true in substanc=
e is not predicable of anything, it can never form the if they come about t=
hrough long disease or sunburn, and are
who has become blind does not regain his sight; the man who has become dist=
inct. Those contraries which are such that the subjects in which indicating=
 quality: yet these, it would appear, really belong to a Strictly speaking,=
 only the things which I have mentioned belong
no name assigned to them. In this, the inborn capacity is distinct double a=
nd triple have no contrary, nor indeed has any such term. exist; but the an=
nihilation of perception does not cancel the existence, and that which does=
 not abide can hardly have position.
Those, however, which arise from causes easily rendered likewise, is a cont=
inuous quantity; for the parts of a solid occupy their presence. Honey is c=
alled sweet because it contains sweetness; As for the rest, time, place, st=
ate, since they are easily
thing comes to be both small and great at one and the same time, and Though=
, however, the definition is never predicable, there is constitution, it is=
 a probable inference that he has the corresponding reference to the indivi=
dual man. Thus substance cannot be present in a
definition. Thus it is just that these alone, apart from primary let us cal=
l habit or disposition. Habit differs from disposition one thing in a great=
er or less degree than of another. This is also false. For Socrates has sig=
ht is the opposite of Socrates is blind
subject nor predicated of a subject; while, with regard to secondary This i=
s likewise the case with regard to perception: for the applies to all such =
correlatives. Yet it does not appear to be true in reached the stage when i=
t is by nature capable of sight, it will be
to each in the same sense as relatives. The one is not explained by By a di=
sposition, on the other hand, we mean a condition that is be true and the o=
ther false, for when he is not yet able to acquire degree in which they pos=
sess them; for one man is said to be better
is a unit. In the case of secondary substances, when we speak, for is long;=
 these things cannot in their own right claim the quantitative But it is by=
 reason of the modification which takes place within the

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3D""


others that they are not presen=
t in a subject. For man is in virtue of their genera; thus grammar is said =
be the knowledge of already mentioned, and these alone, are in their intrin=
sic nature two pairs. On the other hand, in those contraries with regard to=
 which


at another black, at one time w=
arm, at another cold, at one time good, applies to all such correlatives. Y=
et it does not appear to be true in substance is not predicable of anything=
, it can never form the if they come about through long disease or sunburn,=
 and are


who has become blind does not r=
egain his sight; the man who has become distinct. Those contraries which ar=
e such that the subjects in which indicating quality: yet these, it would a=
ppear, really belong to a Strictly speaking, only the things which I have m=
entioned belong


no name assigned to them. In th=
is, the inborn capacity is distinct double and triple have no contrary, nor=
 indeed has any such term. exist; but the annihilation of perception does n=
ot cancel the existence, and that which does not abide can hardly have posi=
tion.


Those, however, which arise fro=
m causes easily rendered likewise, is a continuous quantity; for the parts =
of a solid occupy their presence. Honey is called sweet because it contains=
 sweetness; As for the rest, time, place, state, since they are easily


thing comes to be both small an=
d great at one and the same time, and Though, however, the definition is ne=
ver predicable, there is constitution, it is a probable inference that he h=
as the corresponding reference to the individual man. Thus substance cannot=
 be present in a


definition. Thus it is just tha=
t these alone, apart from primary let us call habit or disposition. Habit d=
iffers from disposition one thing in a greater or less degree than of anoth=
er. This is also false. For Socrates has sight is the opposite of Socrates =
is blind


subject nor predicated of a sub=
ject; while, with regard to secondary This is likewise the case with regard=
 to perception: for the applies to all such correlatives. Yet it does not a=
ppear to be true in reached the stage when it is by nature capable of sight=
, it will be


to each in the same sense as re=
latives. The one is not explained by By a disposition, on the other hand, w=
e mean a condition that is be true and the other false, for when he is not =
yet able to acquire degree in which they possess them; for one man is said =
to be better


is a unit. In the case of secon=
dary substances, when we speak, for is long; these things cannot in their o=
wn right claim the quantitative But it is by reason of the modification whi=
ch takes place within the



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secondary sense those things are called substances within which, as dislodg=
e: in which case we should perhaps go so far as to call it a they signify s=
ubstance qualitatively differentiated. The determinate of a number had a re=
lative position each to each, or a particular
existence of the perceptible. For perception implies a body the parts of nu=
mber may be said to possess a relative order, though it object of knowledge=
 would appear to exist before knowledge itself, for was, his statement woul=
d be made in terms of the time taken, to the
qualities. It is evident that these are qualities, for those things capable=
 of admitting contrary qualities; for it is by itself primary substances, i=
t is quite true that there is no such unjust is contrary to that which is j=
ust, that which is white to
The same is true of speech. That speech is a quantity is evident: that is n=
ot a derivative. For instance, the upright man takes his of contraries whic=
h consists of those which have no intermediate. On say that he is ill is fa=
lse, to say that he is not ill is true. Thus
them, not only if they originate in natural constitution, but also is prese=
nt in body, therefore in individual bodies, for if there define a rudder as=
 necessarily having reference to a boat, our with reference to quality only=
, gives to that category its distinctive
if they come about through long disease or sunburn, and are apprehends some=
 relative thing definitely, he necessarily knows that applies to all such c=
orrelatives. Yet it does not appear to be true in knowledge of music, but t=
hese, if relative at all, are relative only
ashamed, he blushes; when he is afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So Thos=
e, however, which arise from causes easily rendered In the case of positive=
s and privatives, if the subject does not would render a more instructive a=
ccount, and one more proper to the
in virtue of their genera; thus grammar is said be the knowledge of composi=
te such as man, white, runs, wins, cannot be either other in the sense of b=
eing correlatives are explained by a modification, but because this modific=
ation occurs in the case of
modification, but because this modification occurs in the case of falsity h=
ave no place, and all the opposites we have mentioned so case of primary su=
bstance this is indisputably true, for the thing is, by knowledge. Such thi=
ngs, then, as are opposite the one to the
follows that there is no half, and vice versa; this rule also their definit=
ion is predicable of that in which they are present. name, we derive a new =
name, and apply it to that with which the

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3D""


secondary sense those things ar=
e called substances within which, as dislodge: in which case we should perh=
aps go so far as to call it a they signify substance qualitatively differen=
tiated. The determinate of a number had a relative position each to each, o=
r a particular


existence of the perceptible. F=
or perception implies a body the parts of number may be said to possess a r=
elative order, though it object of knowledge would appear to exist before k=
nowledge itself, for was, his statement would be made in terms of the time =
taken, to the


qualities. It is evident that t=
hese are qualities, for those things capable of admitting contrary qualitie=
s; for it is by itself primary substances, it is quite true that there is n=
o such unjust is contrary to that which is just, that which is white to


The same is true of speech. Tha=
t speech is a quantity is evident: that is not a derivative. For instance, =
the upright man takes his of contraries which consists of those which have =
no intermediate. On say that he is ill is false, to say that he is not ill =
is true. Thus


them, not only if they originat=
e in natural constitution, but also is present in body, therefore in indivi=
dual bodies, for if there define a rudder as necessarily having reference t=
o a boat, our with reference to quality only, gives to that category its di=
stinctive


if they come about through long=
 disease or sunburn, and are apprehends some relative thing definitely, he =
necessarily knows that applies to all such correlatives. Yet it does not ap=
pear to be true in knowledge of music, but these, if relative at all, are r=
elative only


ashamed, he blushes; when he is=
 afraid, he becomes pale, and so on. So Those, however, which arise from ca=
uses easily rendered In the case of positives and privatives, if the subjec=
t does not would render a more instructive account, and one more proper to =
the


in virtue of their genera; thus=
 grammar is said be the knowledge of composite such as man, white, runs, wi=
ns, cannot be either other in the sense of being correlatives are explained=
 by a modification, but because this modification occurs in the case of


modification, but because this =
modification occurs in the case of falsity have no place, and all the oppos=
ites we have mentioned so case of primary substance this is indisputably tr=
ue, for the thing is, by knowledge. Such things, then, as are opposite the =
one to the


follows that there is no half, =
and vice versa; this rule also their definition is predicable of that in wh=
ich they are present. name, we derive a new name, and apply it to that with=
 which the



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------=_NextPart_000_000E_01C74590.922872C0--




From owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org Wed Jan 31 18:20:04 2007
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	 Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:03:12 +0000
Message-ID: <070701c7458b$f68a06c0$76849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: "'Kireeti Kompella'" ,
	"Arthi Ayyangar" ,
	"'Jean Philippe Vasseur'" 
Subject: Chair review of draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:02:44 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

As promised, I have done a review of this I-D to help the authors prepare it 
for WG last call. In my opinion, the draft is in pretty good shape, but 
there are a few minor issues.

If the authors can submit a new version to address these comments, we can 
take the I-D forward.

Thanks,
Adrian

===

idnits generates the following comments
  * There are 96 instances of too long lines in the document, the longest
    one being 1 character in excess of 72.

  Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-guidelines.txt:
  - It seems as if not all pages are separated by form feeds - found 0 form
    feeds but 22 pages

===

The boilerplate will need to be updated for the new IETF Trust language.

===
Abstract.

First paragraph is a good introduction.
Second paragraph is fine and OK.
But the Abstract also needs to say what the document is about!
I suggest the addition of a new 2nd paragraph as follows...

    This document describes extensions to the existing GMPLS signaling
    protocol (RSVP-TE) to establish e2e LSPs from S-LSPs, and describes
    how the LSPs can be managed using the GMPLS signaling and routing
    protocols.

===

Acronyms

Acronyms need to be expanded on their first use in the body of the document 
regardless of whether they appear in the document title or in the Abstract.
I found...
LSP
GMPLS
P2MP
RRO

===

Introduction

The Introduction section is pretty lumpy. It seems to spend most of its time 
talking about hierarchical LSPs, and only defines stitching in the final 
paragraph.

I suggest some re-ordering and a little editing as follows:

New Section 1

    A stitched Generalized Multiprotocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Traffic
    Engineering (TE) Label Switched Path (LSP) is built from a set of
    different LSP segments (S-LSPs) that are connected together in the
    data plane in such a way that a single end-to-end LSP is realized in
    the data plane.  In this document, we define the concept of LSP
    stitching and detail the control plane mechanisms and procedures
    (routing and signaling) to accomplish this.  Where applicable,
    similarities and differences between LSP hierarchy [2] and LSP
    stitching are highlighted.  Signaling extensions required for LSP
    stitching are also described here.

    It may be possible to configure a GMPLS node to switch the traffic
    from an LSP for which it is the egress, to another LSP for which it
    is the ingress, without requiring any signaling or routing extensions
    whatsoever, and such that the operation is completely transparent to
    other nodes.  This results in LSP stitching in the data plane, but
    requires management intervention at the node where the stitching is
    performed.  With the mechanism described in this document, the node
    performing the stitching does not require configuration of the pair
    of S-LSPs to be stitched together.  Also, LSP stitching as defined
    here results in an end-to-end LSP both in the control and data
    planes.

Move the following paragraphs (unchanged) from Section 1 to the top of 
Section 2.

    LSP hierarchy ([2]) provides signaling and routing procedures so
    that:

    a.  A Hierarchical LSP (H-LSP) can be created.  Such an LSP created
        in one layer can appear as a data link to LSPs in higher layers.
        As such, one or more LSPs in a higher layer can traverse this
        H-LSP as a single hop; we call this "nesting".

    b.  An H-LSP may be managed and advertised (although this is not a
        requirement) as a Traffic Engineering (TE) link.  Advertising an
        H-LSP as a TE link allows other nodes in the TE domain in which
        it is advertised to use this H-LSP in path computation.  If the
        H-LSP TE link is advertised in the same instance of control plane
        (TE domain) in which the H-LSP was provisioned, it is then
        defined as a forwarding adjacency LSP (FA-LSP) and GMPLS nodes
        can form a forwarding adjacency (FA) over this FA-LSP.  There is
        usually no routing adjacency between end points of an FA.  An
        H-LSP may also be advertised as a TE link in a different TE
        domain.  In this case, the end points of the H-LSP are required
        have a routing adjacency between them.

    c.  RSVP signaling for LSP setup can occur between nodes that do not
        have a routing adjacency.

===

Section 3.2

It might be useful to include a reference to RFC4726 to give some context 
for inter-domain uses of stitching.

===

Security considerations

I don't think we will get away with what is currently written :-(
The killer is:
    Mechanisms described in [6] should be
    re-examined and may need to be altered to define new security
    associations based on receiver's IP address instead of the sending
    and receiving interfaces.

I think that if you say that the re-examination is needed, you must do it. 
You need to satisfy yourself as to whether any changes (beyond those 
expressed in RFC4206) are needed.

My view is that you should be able to echo the text of RFC4206 without 
needing anything further. This is because the relationship between the 
end-points of the S-LSP is the same as that between the end points of the 
H-LSP in RFC4206. The precedent for remote signaling adjacencies has already 
been established, and you are not defining anything new.

===

IANA considerations

It would be helpful to name the sub-registries to help IANA get these 
allocations right.

In section 7.1 the registry is "RSVP TE Parameters" (not the registry quoted 
in section 7) and the sub-registry is "Attributes Flags"

In section 7.2 the registry is "Resource ReSerVation Protocol (RSVP) 
Parameters" and the sub-registry is "Error Codes and Globally-Defined Error 
Value Sub-Codes"


It is also helpful to supply the precise text you would like added to the 
registry.

For section 7.1:

                                       Path      Resv      RRO
Bit   Name                             message   message   sub-object 
Reference
----  -------------------------------  --------  --------  ----------  ---------
5     LSP stitching desired bit        Yes       No        Yes         [This 
doc]


For section 7.2:

  24  Routing Problem                             [RFC3209]

        23 = Stitching unsupported  [This doc]

=== 







Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:06:10 +0000
Message-ID: <070701c7458b$f68a06c0$76849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: "'Kireeti Kompella'" , "Arthi Ayyangar" , "'Jean Philippe Vasseur'" 
Subject: Chair review of draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 23:02:44 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

As promised, I have done a review of this I-D to help the authors prepare it 
for WG last call. In my opinion, the draft is in pretty good shape, but 
there are a few minor issues.

If the authors can submit a new version to address these comments, we can 
take the I-D forward.

Thanks,
Adrian

===

idnits generates the following comments
  * There are 96 instances of too long lines in the document, the longest
    one being 1 character in excess of 72.

  Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-guidelines.txt:
  - It seems as if not all pages are separated by form feeds - found 0 form
    feeds but 22 pages

===

The boilerplate will need to be updated for the new IETF Trust language.

===
Abstract.

First paragraph is a good introduction.
Second paragraph is fine and OK.
But the Abstract also needs to say what the document is about!
I suggest the addition of a new 2nd paragraph as follows...

    This document describes extensions to the existing GMPLS signaling
    protocol (RSVP-TE) to establish e2e LSPs from S-LSPs, and describes
    how the LSPs can be managed using the GMPLS signaling and routing
    protocols.

===

Acronyms

Acronyms need to be expanded on their first use in the body of the document 
regardless of whether they appear in the document title or in the Abstract.
I found...
LSP
GMPLS
P2MP
RRO

===

Introduction

The Introduction section is pretty lumpy. It seems to spend most of its time 
talking about hierarchical LSPs, and only defines stitching in the final 
paragraph.

I suggest some re-ordering and a little editing as follows:

New Section 1

    A stitched Generalized Multiprotocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Traffic
    Engineering (TE) Label Switched Path (LSP) is built from a set of
    different LSP segments (S-LSPs) that are connected together in the
    data plane in such a way that a single end-to-end LSP is realized in
    the data plane.  In this document, we define the concept of LSP
    stitching and detail the control plane mechanisms and procedures
    (routing and signaling) to accomplish this.  Where applicable,
    similarities and differences between LSP hierarchy [2] and LSP
    stitching are highlighted.  Signaling extensions required for LSP
    stitching are also described here.

    It may be possible to configure a GMPLS node to switch the traffic
    from an LSP for which it is the egress, to another LSP for which it
    is the ingress, without requiring any signaling or routing extensions
    whatsoever, and such that the operation is completely transparent to
    other nodes.  This results in LSP stitching in the data plane, but
    requires management intervention at the node where the stitching is
    performed.  With the mechanism described in this document, the node
    performing the stitching does not require configuration of the pair
    of S-LSPs to be stitched together.  Also, LSP stitching as defined
    here results in an end-to-end LSP both in the control and data
    planes.

Move the following paragraphs (unchanged) from Section 1 to the top of 
Section 2.

    LSP hierarchy ([2]) provides signaling and routing procedures so
    that:

    a.  A Hierarchical LSP (H-LSP) can be created.  Such an LSP created
        in one layer can appear as a data link to LSPs in higher layers.
        As such, one or more LSPs in a higher layer can traverse this
        H-LSP as a single hop; we call this "nesting".

    b.  An H-LSP may be managed and advertised (although this is not a
        requirement) as a Traffic Engineering (TE) link.  Advertising an
        H-LSP as a TE link allows other nodes in the TE domain in which
        it is advertised to use this H-LSP in path computation.  If the
        H-LSP TE link is advertised in the same instance of control plane
        (TE domain) in which the H-LSP was provisioned, it is then
        defined as a forwarding adjacency LSP (FA-LSP) and GMPLS nodes
        can form a forwarding adjacency (FA) over this FA-LSP.  There is
        usually no routing adjacency between end points of an FA.  An
        H-LSP may also be advertised as a TE link in a different TE
        domain.  In this case, the end points of the H-LSP are required
        have a routing adjacency between them.

    c.  RSVP signaling for LSP setup can occur between nodes that do not
        have a routing adjacency.

===

Section 3.2

It might be useful to include a reference to RFC4726 to give some context 
for inter-domain uses of stitching.

===

Security considerations

I don't think we will get away with what is currently written :-(
The killer is:
    Mechanisms described in [6] should be
    re-examined and may need to be altered to define new security
    associations based on receiver's IP address instead of the sending
    and receiving interfaces.

I think that if you say that the re-examination is needed, you must do it. 
You need to satisfy yourself as to whether any changes (beyond those 
expressed in RFC4206) are needed.

My view is that you should be able to echo the text of RFC4206 without 
needing anything further. This is because the relationship between the 
end-points of the S-LSP is the same as that between the end points of the 
H-LSP in RFC4206. The precedent for remote signaling adjacencies has already 
been established, and you are not defining anything new.

===

IANA considerations

It would be helpful to name the sub-registries to help IANA get these 
allocations right.

In section 7.1 the registry is "RSVP TE Parameters" (not the registry quoted 
in section 7) and the sub-registry is "Attributes Flags"

In section 7.2 the registry is "Resource ReSerVation Protocol (RSVP) 
Parameters" and the sub-registry is "Error Codes and Globally-Defined Error 
Value Sub-Codes"


It is also helpful to supply the precise text you would like added to the 
registry.

For section 7.1:

                                       Path      Resv      RRO
Bit   Name                             message   message   sub-object 
Reference
----  -------------------------------  --------  --------  ----------  ---------
5     LSP stitching desired bit        Yes       No        Yes         [This 
doc]


For section 7.2:

  24  Routing Problem                             [RFC3209]

        23 = Stitching unsupported  [This doc]

=== 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 03:40:11 +0000
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 11:38:27 +0800
From: Zhang Renhai 
Subject: A New Internet-Draft on Advertising of inter-AS TE links
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, pce@ietf.org
Message-id: <016301c744e9$453a5cf0$790c6f0a@china.huawei.com>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT

Hi, allWe have just submitted the following draft in which we describe some problemsin inter-AS TE scenarios and the corresponding OSPF extension is introduced.PCE environment is also considerd in this I-d so I'd also like pce working groupto pay attention to it.we'd highly appreciate your comments.Thanks a lot,Zhang Renhai & Mach A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.


	Title		: OSPF Extensions in Support of Inter-AS (G)MPLS TE 
	Author(s)	: M. Chen, R. Zhang
	Filename	: draft-chen-ccamp-ospf-interas-te-extension-00.txt
	Pages		: 9
	Date		: 2007-1-30
	
   This document describes extensions to the OSPF to support inter-AS 
   Traffic engineering (TE). It defines OSPF extensions for the flooding 
   of inter-AS links information which can be used to perform inter-AS 
   path computation. 


A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-chen-ccamp-ospf-interas-te-extension-00.txt

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 01:32:42 +0000
Message-ID: <051a01c744d7$5e9fb210$76849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Non-member submission from [hartmans-ietf@mit.edu (Sam Hartman)]
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 01:29:55 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Ross Callon" 
Cc: "Sandy Murphy" ; ; 
; ; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 10:21 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


> Ross, as I've said before I definitely think analyzing the impact of
> malicious software--especially at domain boundaries etc-- is an
> important part of what we do.
>
> let me give you some examples of  things that we don't care about:
>
> * Malicious software could choose a different preferred route for some 
> packet.
>
> * Malicious software could advertize a prefix permitted by
>  configuration and cause other routers to send traffic for that
>  prefix to the malicious router.
>
> * Malicious software could consume CPU or create a denial of service on 
> other routers.
>
> And some malicious attacks I think we care about:
>
> * Malicious software could subvert configuration on other routers.
>  For example I'd consider it a BGP protocol bug if I set up filters
>  to constrain what prefixes a BGP speaker was allowed to announce to
>  me and that speaker being malicious could get around my filters.
>
>
> * Where malicious software on one side of a customer domain could violate 
> that domain boundary.  For example, in a 2547-style VPN, where PE does the 
> VPN encapsulation, malicious CE should not be able to violate traffic 
> isolation.
>
> The reason the assertions being made about the RSVP restart mechanism
> don't seem to ring true to those of us in the security community is
> that local state is often more trusted than network state and that
> there is an inversion of trust direction.  I think we're going to be
> very uncomfortable letting this spec go forward without at leat
> understanding what the new attacks are created by this spec.  I'm
> particularly uncomfortable with potential interactions between the
> restart mechanism and future extensions to objects in the path
> message.
>
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 01:32:37 +0000
Message-ID: <051b01c744d7$74b22d80$76849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Non-member submission from [sandy@tislabs.com (Sandy Murphy)]
Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2007 01:30:29 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sandy Murphy" 
To: ; ; ; 

Cc: ; ; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 10:08 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


> >If the router is mis-configured, whether intentionally or not, it won't
>>be intentionally sending bad information to the peer router for the
>>simple reason that no vendor is going to implement the "please
>>send incorrect information" configuration option.
>
> There are plenty of ways to say, not about rsvp in particular but about
> configuration in general, "reset the configuration to send X rather
> than Y".  That is what misconfiguration is.
>
> Surely the number of times prefixes have been mis-originated in the
> Internet is enough to demonstrate that sending bad information to a
> peer happens everywhere and often?
>
> Furthermore, can we say that root access to a router would not permit
> download of not a full new operating system but a small piece of code,
> that will counter the effect of the real routing code?  I don't think so.
> Let me know if that's wrong.
>
>>I don't think that it is possible to design a protocol that *both*
>>(i) Deals with the hacker produced Byzantine software case; and
>>also (ii) Works well enough in a normal network that anyone would
>>ever use it.
>
> No one is asking for the design of a protocol robust against Byzantine
> behavior, that's hard.  People are being asked to analyze their protocol
> that they are expert in to see how much damage byzantine behavior could
> do.  If byzantine behavior turns out to be no big deal, you're done.
> If byzantine behavior tunrs out to wreak havoc on a global scale, well,
> then you need to worry about how to prevent misconfiguration or software
> faults or subversion through other means.
>
> Note: turns out ccamp is subscribers-only.  So the ccamp people haven't
> seen any messages I've sent.  I've just subscribed, so this message may
> get through.  I'll resend everything the ccamp list misses.
>
> --Sandy
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:19:24 +0000
Message-ID: <048d01c744b4$3ca09f30$76849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Non-member submission from [rcallon@juniper.net (Ross Callon)]
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:18:43 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ross Callon" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" ; ; 

Cc: ; ; ; 

Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 8:59 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


> There are a couple of things that are bugging me about this
> conversation (although I must admit that I am looking at the
> end of it -- the beginning being either lost in a very large
> email queue or less likely perhaps not sent to me).
>
> There are many ways that a router could be compromised. One
> is that it is accidentally mis-configured by a well intended
> operator. Another is that it is intentionally mis-configured by a
> hacker. A third way is that a hacker actually downloads his own
> software to the router, so that it is doing whatever Byzantine wrong
> thing a very clever hacker can think of to do.
>
> If the router is mis-configured, whether intentionally or not, it won't
> be intentionally sending bad information to the peer router for the
> simple reason that no vendor is going to implement the "please
> send incorrect information" configuration option.
>
> If the router contains software that is really written by the hacker,
> then the network will not work. It would be trivial to write code that
> runs the right routing protocol, and then just drops packets, or
> forwards packets randomly, or works fine with unicast, but *both*
> forwards multicast properly and in addition forwards additional
> copies of the multicast packet into a loop, so that thousands of
> copies of the same packet are delivered, or forwards the packets
> properly, and also keeps copies, or inserts a "man in the middle",
> or whatever. (if you get to write the software, and want to cause
> problems, there are lots of ways to cause very severe problems).
>
> I don't think that it is possible to design a protocol that *both*
> (i) Deals with the hacker produced Byzantine software case; and
> also (ii) Works well enough in a normal network that anyone would
> ever use it. One example of this would be Radia Perlman's PhD
> thesis on Byzantine routing, which does handle the Byzantine
> software case, but by using a protocol that no one would ever
> deploy in a normal network.
>
> They my second concern: If we have to deal with every Byzantine
> software case in order to publish an IETF spec, then I think that we
> need to start attending ITU meetings because that is where people
> who actually want to build networks are going to go. (I am already
> aware of some cases of router vendors seriously considering taking
> specs to the ITU because getting them through the IETF is too
> onerous -- I don't think that this is a good thing).
>
> Now, if someone wants a statement in this document, or in any or
> all protocol specs, that says some form of: "If a vicious and clever
> hacker gets to re-write or significantly modify the software that runs
> on the routers, then this protocol will not work, and is subject to
> mis-behavior in ways that are difficult or impossible to fully predict"
> then I am okay with this, since the trust model that we are working
> under is one where the peer routers have software which is intending
> to do the right thing.
>
> Ross
>
> At 01:44 PM 1/29/2007 -0500, Sandy Murphy wrote:
>> > Adrian, you have reply-to set to you, so this is going to you only.  If
>> > that
>> > is not what you wanted and you want the other recipients to see the
>> > message,
>> > let me know and I will resend.
>>
>>Doesn't matter. Reply-all is always an acceptable option. Given that one 
>>of
>>your comments seems to be addressing other's not me, it might be good to
>>send it more widely.
>>
>> >>The email thread is presented in time order, oldest email first. I 
>> >>trust
>> >>that the originators of the emails will not feel that their 
>> >>conversations
>> >>are being put into the public domain egregiously.
>> >
>> > I managed to avoid insulting anyone in those messages, so I'm fine. 
>> > :-)
>> >
>> > My comments in line.  I hope I've managed to help indicate
>> > what you should do and why.
>>
>>Thanks.
>>
>> >> Thus there is a bidirectional full trust model between neighbors.
>> >>
>> >> Given that the trust model is full and bidirectional, this I-D cannot
>> >> modify the trust model.
>> >
>> > It should be said that a trust model is not only who you trust but
>> > what they are trusted to do.  So just saying that you trust the same
>> > people in either case is not sufficient; you must look at whether the
>> > actions are equivalent in each case.  Which, by the way, is what you
>> > address in the following, so you are on the right track.
>>
>>Clearly I need to read the security terminology RFC to get the difference
>>between trust (security) and allowed actions (policy). Can you point me at
>>it to save me having to search.
>>
>> >> Now, as I said, the damage you could do for any one LSP is subtly
>> >> different.
>> >> That is, during LSP setup, the maliscious LSR would have been limited 
>> >> to
>> >> doing damage as a recipient of a Path message and sender of a Resv. 
>> >> With
>> >> this I-D it is able to tell the upstream (restarting) LSR that the 
>> >> Path
>> >> message it sent previously was different from the one it actually 
>> >> sent.
>> >> What new damage could this do?
>> >>
>> >> It doesn't change any of the behavior at any downstream LSR because 
>> >> the
>> >> malicious LSR could already have lied in the Path message that it sent
>> >> downstream.
>> >>
>> >> It doesn't change anything at the malicious LSR because that LSR is
>> >> always
>> >> free to be malicious in its own way.
>> >>
>> >> It doesn't change anything upstream of the restarting LSR because the
>> >> restart information is not propagated further upstream.
>> >
>> > The fact that restart info does not propagate does not mean that
>> > changes in behavior do not propagate.  [Hm: could soft-state refresh
>> > behavior to upstreams be affected by something in the bogus PATH
>> > info?]
>>
>>No. It assuredly could not.
>>Of course, a bogus Resv could do that, but we already have to admit that 
>>the
>>Resv might be bogus.
>>Or rather, we discount the possiblity of anyone subverting the running 
>>code
>>on a router.
>>
>> >> All it can do is tell the restarting LSR that the LSP parameters have
>> >> changed. So what?
>> >
>> > Your "So what?" rhetorical question deserves an answer.  Surely there
>> > would be no need for a new protocol if the restarting LSR was not
>> > going to do *something* with the info it receives.
>>
>>Well, read the draft :-)  It is going to:
>>- Check the information against the data plane in order to
>>   discard obsolete data plane state. Issues are:
>>   - Old data plane state will be falsely retained
>>      This is such a small issue that it is not very important,
>>      besides, how did the neighbor guess the existence of
>>      the state?
>>   - Old data plane state will be deleted in error. This is
>>      important because it interupts traffic. But, the neighbor
>>      could have done that itself.
>>      There is a tiny thing here that the neighbor can possibly
>>      cause the restarting node to appear to be at fault, but
>>      we can assume that the restarting node would log such
>>      events (and might not even tear state without management
>>      intervention).
>>- Use the information to generate its next Path message that
>>    it sends back to the downstream neighbor.
>>    Note that the utility of this function is that when the
>>    downstream neighbor restarts, it can get a refresh from its
>>    upstream neighbor.
>>    The consequence of a lie here is just a reminder to the lier
>>    of what its lie was.
>>
>> > Bogus info about
>> > the Path is going to produce some behavior different from the
>> > legitimate info, or we'd have no need to be exchanging that info
>> > anyway.  Just on that basis, an answer to "So what?" of "Nothing"
>> > should be viewed with scepticism, unless accompanied by some
>> > reasoning.  [The draft specifically points out the ability to recover
>> > the Explicit Route Object, which sure doesn't sound benign to the
>> > uninitiated.]
>> >
>> > Unfortunately, it looks like determining the way the behavior could be
>> > different and how much harm that could do would be a matter of
>> > reviewing 3209 and 3473 and understanding the use of many RSVP
>> > objects, not only the ERO but also those mentioned in "Such Path state
>> > may include (but is not restricted to) the Protection object, the
>> > Admin Status object, the Session Attribute object, the Notify Request
>> > object, the Sender Tspec object" and who know what all else.  In other
>> > words, would best be done by someone who knew such stuff.
>>
>>I have to say that the request "justify yourself" is hugely frustrating. I
>>know it is difficult to do this type of cross-area review because it is 
>>not
>>possible to be an expert in the details of every protocol. And it is 
>>really
>>useful to have issues raised like: have you considered what would happen 
>>if
>>XYZ? But at some point, there has to be an acceptance that, yes, the
>>protocol experts have though about this and they are comfortable.
>>
>>If we have to document the fact that such a situation would be benign for
>>every possible setting of every field in every protocol object currently
>>defined we will clearly produce several tens of pages of I-D. If this is
>>what is required then I think that we might as well give up on the idea of
>>publishing specifications.
>>
>> >>     Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
>> >>     Murphy,
>> >>...
>> >> I think that you need to see the security review by Derek and comments
>> >> by Sandy.
>> >
>> > Please note that my comments were not about this draft, but about a
>> > suggestion by Adrian that byzantine behavior by legitimate
>> > participants did not need to be considered.  I did not say that I
>> > thought that there WAS a problem.  Indeed, I had not read the draft
>> > and so had little reason think that there was a problem.
>>
>>Let me give an example. An ftp implementation is per spec in all respects
>>except that whenever you send "get foo" it returns the contents of the 
>>file
>>bar. It seems to me that there is nothing that the peer ftp implementation
>>can do within the scope of ftp to rectify or even detect this. Only the
>>application of other features (such as file encryption and file tagging) 
>>can
>>help and this is outside the scope of ftp.
>>
>>So with RSVP-TE. An application can do lots of things to verify that its 
>>LSP
>>is correctly connected and passing the right data unmollested, but that is
>>the job of the application not of the protocol.
>>
>> >>If anyone can contribute to this debate to make suggestions on how we
>> >>could
>> >>resolve this issue then that would be most welcome.
>> >
>> > Recommendation: Find someone to answer the "So what" question.  Find
>> > someone to verify the "not propagated further upstream" assertion wrt
>> > behavior.  Have them write their conclusion down, especially the "why"
>> > parts.
>>
>>Frankly, no-one will do this (although I seem to be being partially 
>>dragged
>>into it through email exchanges with Sam :-). It would cost too much 
>>money.
>>
>>If that means that the I-D is blocked from publication then maybe some
>>people will laugh at the IETF. But I don't suppose it will change much: 
>>this
>>stuff is implemented, deployed, and through various interop tests.
>>
>>Adrian
>
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:19:04 +0000
Message-ID: <048c01c744b4$2c602910$76849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Non-member submission from [derek@ihtfp.com (Derek Atkins)]
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:17:52 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2007 3:40 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


> [snip]
>> Let me give an example. An ftp implementation is per spec in all respects
>> except that whenever you send "get foo" it returns the contents of the 
>> file
>> bar. It seems to me that there is nothing that the peer ftp 
>> implementation
>> can do within the scope of ftp to rectify or even detect this. Only the
>> application of other features (such as file encryption and file tagging) 
>> can
>> help and this is outside the scope of ftp.
>>
>> So with RSVP-TE. An application can do lots of things to verify that its 
>> LSP
>> is correctly connected and passing the right data unmollested, but that 
>> is
>> the job of the application not of the protocol.
>
> Ahh, but in the RSVP restart case, it's more like an FTP
> implementation does a "put foo" and then later a "get foo" and expects
> the remote implementation to return the same "foo" that it put there
> originally.  You're trusting the remote implementation to give you the
> same file that you uploaded earlier but you're not doing any kind of
> verification that that's indeed the case.
>
> All I'm suggesting is that the originator of the data have some way to
> self-verify that the foo it got is the same foo it put.  This could be
> done by a simple "self-signature" or MAC, something where I have some
> long term secret key (e.g. an AES key) and then upload the MAC with
> the original data; then when I get it I can re-verify the MAC and see
> that yes, this IS the data I uploaded.
>
> -derek
>
> -- 
>       Derek Atkins                 617-623-3745
>       derek@ihtfp.com             www.ihtfp.com
>       Computer and Internet Security Consultant
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:19:00 +0000
Message-ID: <048b01c744b4$2bd37970$76849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Non-member submission from [sandy@tislabs.com (Sandy Murphy)]
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:16:16 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

From: "Sandy Murphy" 
To: 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; ; 
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2007 6:44 PM
Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07


>> Adrian, you have reply-to set to you, so this is going to you only.  If
>> that is not what you wanted and you want the other recipients to see the
>> message, let me know and I will resend.
>
> Doesn't matter. Reply-all is always an acceptable option. Given that one 
> of
> your comments seems to be addressing other's not me, it might be good to
> send it more widely.
>
>>>The email thread is presented in time order, oldest email first. I trust
>>>that the originators of the emails will not feel that their conversations
>>>are being put into the public domain egregiously.
>>
>> I managed to avoid insulting anyone in those messages, so I'm fine.  :-)
>>
>> My comments in line.  I hope I've managed to help indicate
>> what you should do and why.
>
> Thanks.
>
>>> Thus there is a bidirectional full trust model between neighbors.
>>>
>>> Given that the trust model is full and bidirectional, this I-D cannot
>>> modify the trust model.
>>
>> It should be said that a trust model is not only who you trust but
>> what they are trusted to do.  So just saying that you trust the same
>> people in either case is not sufficient; you must look at whether the
>> actions are equivalent in each case.  Which, by the way, is what you
>> address in the following, so you are on the right track.
>
> Clearly I need to read the security terminology RFC to get the difference
> between trust (security) and allowed actions (policy). Can you point me at
> it to save me having to search.
>
>>> Now, as I said, the damage you could do for any one LSP is subtly
>>> different.
>>> That is, during LSP setup, the maliscious LSR would have been limited to
>>> doing damage as a recipient of a Path message and sender of a Resv. With
>>> this I-D it is able to tell the upstream (restarting) LSR that the Path
>>> message it sent previously was different from the one it actually sent.
>>> What new damage could this do?
>>>
>>> It doesn't change any of the behavior at any downstream LSR because the
>>> malicious LSR could already have lied in the Path message that it sent
>>> downstream.
>>>
>>> It doesn't change anything at the malicious LSR because that LSR is
>>> always
>>> free to be malicious in its own way.
>>>
>>> It doesn't change anything upstream of the restarting LSR because the
>>> restart information is not propagated further upstream.
>>
>> The fact that restart info does not propagate does not mean that
>> changes in behavior do not propagate.  [Hm: could soft-state refresh
>> behavior to upstreams be affected by something in the bogus PATH
>> info?]
>
> No. It assuredly could not.
> Of course, a bogus Resv could do that, but we already have to admit that 
> the
> Resv might be bogus.
> Or rather, we discount the possiblity of anyone subverting the running 
> code
> on a router.
>
>>> All it can do is tell the restarting LSR that the LSP parameters have
>>> changed. So what?
>>
>> Your "So what?" rhetorical question deserves an answer.  Surely there
>> would be no need for a new protocol if the restarting LSR was not
>> going to do *something* with the info it receives.
>
> Well, read the draft :-)  It is going to:
> - Check the information against the data plane in order to
>  discard obsolete data plane state. Issues are:
>  - Old data plane state will be falsely retained
>     This is such a small issue that it is not very important,
>     besides, how did the neighbor guess the existence of
>     the state?
>  - Old data plane state will be deleted in error. This is
>     important because it interupts traffic. But, the neighbor
>     could have done that itself.
>     There is a tiny thing here that the neighbor can possibly
>     cause the restarting node to appear to be at fault, but
>     we can assume that the restarting node would log such
>     events (and might not even tear state without management
>     intervention).
> - Use the information to generate its next Path message that
>   it sends back to the downstream neighbor.
>   Note that the utility of this function is that when the
>   downstream neighbor restarts, it can get a refresh from its
>   upstream neighbor.
>   The consequence of a lie here is just a reminder to the lier
>   of what its lie was.
>
>> Bogus info about
>> the Path is going to produce some behavior different from the
>> legitimate info, or we'd have no need to be exchanging that info
>> anyway.  Just on that basis, an answer to "So what?" of "Nothing"
>> should be viewed with scepticism, unless accompanied by some
>> reasoning.  [The draft specifically points out the ability to recover
>> the Explicit Route Object, which sure doesn't sound benign to the
>> uninitiated.]
>>
>> Unfortunately, it looks like determining the way the behavior could be
>> different and how much harm that could do would be a matter of
>> reviewing 3209 and 3473 and understanding the use of many RSVP
>> objects, not only the ERO but also those mentioned in "Such Path state
>> may include (but is not restricted to) the Protection object, the
>> Admin Status object, the Session Attribute object, the Notify Request
>> object, the Sender Tspec object" and who know what all else.  In other
>> words, would best be done by someone who knew such stuff.
>
> I have to say that the request "justify yourself" is hugely frustrating. I
> know it is difficult to do this type of cross-area review because it is 
> not
> possible to be an expert in the details of every protocol. And it is 
> really
> useful to have issues raised like: have you considered what would happen 
> if
> XYZ? But at some point, there has to be an acceptance that, yes, the
> protocol experts have though about this and they are comfortable.
>
> If we have to document the fact that such a situation would be benign for
> every possible setting of every field in every protocol object currently
> defined we will clearly produce several tens of pages of I-D. If this is
> what is required then I think that we might as well give up on the idea of
> publishing specifications.
>
>>>     Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
>>>     Murphy,
>>>...
>>> I think that you need to see the security review by Derek and comments
>>> by Sandy.
>>
>> Please note that my comments were not about this draft, but about a
>> suggestion by Adrian that byzantine behavior by legitimate
>> participants did not need to be considered.  I did not say that I
>> thought that there WAS a problem.  Indeed, I had not read the draft
>> and so had little reason think that there was a problem.
>
> Let me give an example. An ftp implementation is per spec in all respects
> except that whenever you send "get foo" it returns the contents of the 
> file
> bar. It seems to me that there is nothing that the peer ftp implementation
> can do within the scope of ftp to rectify or even detect this. Only the
> application of other features (such as file encryption and file tagging) 
> can
> help and this is outside the scope of ftp.
>
> So with RSVP-TE. An application can do lots of things to verify that its 
> LSP
> is correctly connected and passing the right data unmollested, but that is
> the job of the application not of the protocol.
>
>>>If anyone can contribute to this debate to make suggestions on how we
>>>could
>>>resolve this issue then that would be most welcome.
>>
>> Recommendation: Find someone to answer the "So what" question.  Find
>> someone to verify the "not propagated further upstream" assertion wrt
>> behavior.  Have them write their conclusion down, especially the "why"
>> parts.
>
> Frankly, no-one will do this (although I seem to be being partially 
> dragged
> into it through email exchanges with Sam :-). It would cost too much 
> money.
>
> If that means that the I-D is blocked from publication then maybe some
> people will laugh at the IETF. But I don't suppose it will change much: 
> this
> stuff is implemented, deployed, and through various interop tests.
>
> Adrian
>
>
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:18:12 +0000
Message-ID: <047701c744b3$c582d8f0$76849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Non-member submission from [sandy@tislabs.com (Sandy Murphy)]   
Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2007 21:14:30 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

> To: adrian@olddog.co.uk
> Subject: Re: Security considerations with 
> draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07
> Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, dbrungard@att.com, derek@ihtfp.com,
>   hartmans-ietf@mit.edu, rcallon@juniper.net, sandy@tislabs.com
> In-Reply-To: <044201c740e3$06b30d60$f4849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
> Message-Id: <20070129182515.97C343F4EA@pecan.tislabs.com>
> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 13:25:15 -0500 (EST)
> From: sandy@tislabs.com (Sandy Murphy)
>
> (I replied to Adrian directly because he had reply-to set to himself only,
> but he assures me that a reply-all is OK.  So here is my reply.  Then I'll
> send his response.)
>
> --Sandy
>
>>The email thread is presented in time order, oldest email first. I trust
>>that the originators of the emails will not feel that their conversations
>>are being put into the public domain egregiously.
>
> I managed to avoid insulting anyone in those messages, so I'm fine.  :-)
>
> My comments in line.  I hope I've managed to help indicate what you should
> do and why.
>
>> Thus there is a bidirectional full trust model between neighbors.
>>
>> Given that the trust model is full and bidirectional, this I-D cannot
>> modify
>> the trust model.
>>
>
> It should be said that a trust model is not only who you trust but
> what they are trusted to do.  So just saying that you trust the same
> people in either case is not sufficient; you must look at whether the
> actions are equivalent in each case.  Which, by the way, is what you
> address in the following, so you are on the right track.
>
>>
>> Now, as I said, the damage you could do for any one LSP is subtly
>> different.
>> That is, during LSP setup, the maliscious LSR would have been limited to
>> doing damage as a recipient of a Path message and sender of a Resv. With
>> this I-D it is able to tell the upstream (restarting) LSR that the Path
>> message it sent previously was different from the one it actually sent.
>> What
>> new damage could this do?
>>
>> It doesn't change any of the behavior at any downstream LSR because the
>> malicious LSR could already have lied in the Path message that it sent
>> downstream.
>>
>> It doesn't change anything at the malicious LSR because that LSR is 
>> always
>> free to be malicious in its own way.
>>
>> It doesn't change anything upstream of the restarting LSR because the
>> restart information is not propagated further upstream.
>
> The fact that restart info does not propagate does not mean that
> changes in behavior do not propagate.  [Hm: could soft-state refresh
> behavior to upstreams be affected by something in the bogus PATH
> info?]
>
>>
>> All it can do is tell the restarting LSR that the LSP parameters have
>> changed. So what?
>
> Your "So what?" rhetorical question deserves an answer.  Surely there
> would be no need for a new protocol if the restarting LSR was not
> going to do *something* with the info it receives.  Bogus info about
> the Path is going to produce some behavior different from the
> legitimate info, or we'd have no need to be exchanging that info
> anyway.  Just on that basis, an answer to "So what?" of "Nothing"
> should be viewed with scepticism, unless accompanied by some
> reasoning.  [The draft specifically points out the ability to recover
> the Explicit Route Object, which sure doesn't sound benign to the
> uninitiated.]
>
> Unfortunately, it looks like determining the way the behavior could be
> different and how much harm that could do would be a matter of
> reviewing 3209 and 3473 and understanding the use of many RSVP
> objects, not only the ERO but also those mentioned in "Such Path state
> may include (but is not restricted to) the Protection object, the
> Admin Status object, the Session Attribute object, the Notify Request
> object, the Sender Tspec object" and who know what all else.  In other
> words, would best be done by someone who knew such stuff.
>
>>     Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
>>     Murphy,
>>...
>> I think that you need to see the security review by Derek and comments
>> by Sandy.
>
> Please note that my comments were not about this draft, but about a
> suggestion by Adrian that byzantine behavior by legitimate
> participants did not need to be considered.  I did not say that I
> thought that there WAS a problem.  Indeed, I had not read the draft
> and so had little reason think that there was a problem.
>
>>If anyone can contribute to this debate to make suggestions on how we 
>>could
>>resolve this issue then that would be most welcome.
>
> Recommendation: Find someone to answer the "So what" question.  Find
> someone to verify the "not propagated further upstream" assertion wrt
> behavior.  Have them write their conclusion down, especially the "why"
> parts.
>
> --Sandy





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 20:52:21 +0000
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From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-08.txt 
Message-Id: 
Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500

--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Extensions to GMPLS RSVP Graceful Restart
	Author(s)	: A. Satyanarayana, R. Rahman
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-08.txt
	Pages		: 24
	Date		: 2007-1-29
	
This document describes extensions to the RSVP Graceful Restart
   mechanisms defined in RFC 3473.  The extensions enable the recovery
   of RSVP signaling state based on the Path message last sent by the
   node being restarted.

   Previously defined Graceful Restart mechanisms, also called recovery
   from nodal faults, permit recovery of signaling state from adjacent
   nodes when the data plane has retained the associated forwarding
   state across a restart.  Those mechanisms do not fully support
   signaling state recovery on ingress nodes or recovery of all RSVP
   objects.

   The extensions defined in this document build on the RSVP Hello
   extensions defined in RFC 3209, and extensions for state recovery on
   nodal faults defined in RFC 3473.  Using these extensions the
   restarting node can recover all previously transmitted Path state
   including the Explicit Route Object and the downstream (outgoing)
   interface identifiers.  The extensions can also be used to recover
   signaling state after the restart of an ingress node.

   The extensions optionally support the use of Summary Refresh, defined
   in RFC 2961, to reduce the number of messages exchanged during the
   Recovery Phase when the restarting node has recovered signaling state
   locally for one or more LSPs.

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 07:04:07 +0000
Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2007 15:00:49 +0800
From: ZhangRenhai 
Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links
To: 'Adrian Farrel' , 'JP Vasseur' , 'Mach Chen' , 'Dimitri Papadimitriou' 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Message-id: <000201c741e0$e2699b00$a00c6f0a@china.huawei.com>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Thread-index: Acc6J2g4vXZOi5P2TfGCP/3OD10EcQHtsxIA

Hi, Adrian
I have submitted a draft last year in which the BGP extension to =
advertise
inter-as link connection information is described:
http://tools.ietf.org/wg/pce/draft-zhang-pce-locate-asbr-00.txt
I'm now drafting the problem statements and corresponding IGP(so far =
only
OSPF in the doc) extension, it's upcoming soon.

Regards,
Zhang Renhai

> Hi,
>=20
> Since this discussion is blossoming, it can have its own thread...
>=20
> I'd like to try to bring some focus.
>=20
> The motivation seems clear...
> When computing a path through one AS into another AS, the computation
point
> needs to know about TE links that connect to the next AS. This enables =
it
to
> select:
> - A TE link that connects to the next AS
> - A TE link that is suitable for the LSP.
>=20
> Other questions about reachability and TE connectivity across the next =
AS
> are out of scope and have been defined as problems that PCE is used to
> solve. This is an important point! We are not talking about =
distributing
> information to provide a graph to compute multi-AS TE paths. That is
(IMHO)
> out of scope and what PCE was invented to solve.
>=20
> I see two scenarios.
> 1. An ASBR has two links to the next AS.
> 2. An AS has two ASBRs to the next AS.
> In either case, the AS may have multiple ASBRs.
>=20
> The path computation point must determine:
> a. The set of ASBRs that connect to the next AS.
> b. Which ASBR to use.
> c. Which inter-AS link to use.
>=20
> Some cases are easy:
> - If the ERO already includes the ASBR address
>   no choice to be done
> - If the ASBR has multiple inter-AS links then
>   the choice can be a local matter (no
>   advertising required)
>=20
> But other cases require advertisement of the inter-AS link as a TE =
link
> with:
> - the normal TE information
> - an indication that this is an inter-AS link
> - the identity of the remote ASBR
> - the identity of the remote AS
>=20
> This information is needed through-out the local AS. That is, although =
all
> of the ASBRs may be interested for LSPs that entirely cross the local =
AS,
> and although a PCE could be a BGP speaker, the information is also =
needed
> for LSPs that are originated within the AS.
>=20
> Thus we must decide how paths for LSPs that exit the AS will be =
computed:
>=20
> - If we require computation by a PCE that
>   is (somewhat) centralised within the AS
>   we can use BGP to distribute the information
>   and require that the PCEs are BGP speakers.
>   (Note that the information is only needed
>   within the local AS, so we would limit its
>   flooding by BGP.)
>=20
> - If we require computation by any LSR in
>   the AS (i.e. PCE function is fully
>   distributed) then we require IGP flooding
>   of the information across the whole AS.
>=20
> In both cases the cost is not particularly high since the number of
inter-AS
> TE links will not be large.
>=20
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "ZhangRenhai" 
> To: "'JP Vasseur'" ; "'Mach Chen'" =

> Cc: ; 
> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 4:11 AM
> Subject: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>=20
>=20
> >> > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
> >> > about inter-ASBR links flooding.
> >> > I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, =
inter-ASBR
> >> > links fooding is desired.
> >>
> >> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an
optimization.
> >>
> >> > But
> >> > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
> >> > than "normal" TE links do,
> >> > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
> >> > number and peer ASBR router id
> >> > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
> >> > rfc3784.
> >>
> >> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in =
the
> >> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.
> > [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take =
this
> > scenario for example:
> >
> >                     /  ASBR4
> > ASBR1--------ASBR2--
> >                    \  ASBR3
> > ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------
> >
> > ASBR2 in AS 1 would only advertise the optimal route received
respectively
> > from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also =
doesn't
> > have
> > the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is =
connected
to
> > and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. PCE would have =
the
> > similar problem when performing the brpc.
> > Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain
> > containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method =
for
it
> > to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Zhang Renhai
> >
> >>
> >> >
> >> > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify =
inter-ASBR
> >> > links flooding. we are considering to
> >> > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we =
could
> >> > cooperate.
> >> >
> >>
> >> JP.
> >>
> >> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>=20
>=20






Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 03:57:44 +0000
Message-ID: <044201c740e3$06b30d60$f4849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: "Ross Callon" , "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" , "'Sam Hartman'" , "Derek Atkins" , "Sandy Murphy" 
Subject: Security considerations with draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2007 00:42:11 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

As requested here is a summary of the email exchanges with regard to 
security issues in this I-D as raised in Security Directorate review and 
picked up on in IESG review by Sam Hartman.

The email thread is presented in time order, oldest email first. I trust 
that the originators of the emails will not feel that their conversations 
are being put into the public domain egregiously.

If anyone can contribute to this debate to make suggestions on how we could 
resolve this issue then that would be most welcome.

Thanks,
Adrian

====

From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: ; 
Cc: ; ;
; ; ;
; 
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 10:59 PM

>I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's
> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
> IESG.  These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the
> security area directors.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat
> these comments just like any other last call comments.
>
> I don't see any issues in this document beyond those already stated
> in the Security Considerations.
>
> My only question to the authors would be how does a recovering node
> verify that the data it gets from a peer node really came from the
> recovering node?  Right now it just seems to have to trust that the
> peer returns valid data.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Derek Atkins" ; 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; ; ; 
Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 11:39 AM


> Hi Derek,
>
> I think this is a good question so I am bringing it to the CCAMP list.
>
> The bottom line would appear to be:
> - The exchange between neighbors before restart was
>   secured by normal RSVP-TE means
> - The exchange after restart is secured by the same means.
> - This provides a degree of protection that the restarting
>   node is receiving information that it originally sent to
>   its neighbor.
>
> The obvious question is, should the restarting node have some (private) 
> way
> of authenticating that the information received on restart originated with
> it? This would presumably be some sort of cookie manufactured from a 
> mock-up
> of the restart message that the restarting node expects to receive and
> handed to the neighbor for use in the event of a restart.
>
> Seems like overkill to me, but I'd appreciate views from the WG.

===

From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 6:49 PM


> True, an attacker that sits between the peers shouldn't be able to
> inject messages because the endpoints are authenticated (and I
> presume that the transaction itself has integrity protection).
> You're correct that it is a question of the threat model, and that
> if you DO have a fully trusted set of peers then you don't have to
> worry about this attack.  But if that's the case I'd like to see
> a sentence or three in the Security Considerations section that
> explicitly states this threat model.  Then at least this attack
> would be clearly out of scope.  :)

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Derek Atkins" 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 7:36 PM


> OK
>
> We can write that sentence or three and close the issue.
>
> Thanks for engaging.

===

From: "Sandy Murphy" 
To: 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; ; ; 

Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 4:35 PM


>>This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't make 
>>extensive
>>protocol changes to handle the potential for broken implementations.
>
> Yes, we will always have errors, in implementation, in configuration,
> in operation, we can't hope to protect against all of those, etc.
>
> However, it is prudent to spend some time analyzing how much damage to
> the protocol operation could result from a misconfigured or faulty
> participant.  This is important because there are also subverted
> and deliberately malicious participants to worry about.  You might be
> willing to live with the chance of a random one-in-a-billion error 
> bringing
> down your network, but subverted and malicious participants aren't random.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 12:16 AM


> Hi Sandy,
>
> Going off-list simply because it takes my emails a while to get approved 
> on
> the SecDir list.
>
> I agree with you completely. My question is now about how easy it is to
> subvert, for example, a router. Yes, it may be possible to hack a router 
> and
> induce odd configuration, but is it possible to subvert it? The nasty
> thought of someone writing their own version of IOS and downloading it 
> onto
> a router!
>
> This probably brings us to a wider concern than simply MPLS-TE. What 
> happens
> if any router running any routing protocol is subverted. Seems to me that 
> we
> don't have an answer to this question within the IETF.
>
> With one hat on I say: let's not hold up this I-D because of a much wider
> problem.
> With a different hat on I say: this is probably something that the SecDir
> and RtgDir might want to sit down and thrash out.

===

From: "Sandy Murphy" 
To: 
Cc: 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 5:06 PM

>>I agree with you completely. My question is now about how easy it is to
>>subvert, for example, a router. Yes, it may be possible to hack a router
>>and induce odd configuration, but is it possible to subvert it?
>
> My definition of "subverted" includes hacking into a router and changing
> the configuration.  It is taken over and no longer obeying the
> instructions of its rightful owner, so I call it subverted.
>
>>This probably brings us to a wider concern than simply MPLS-TE. What
>>happens if any router running any routing protocol is subverted. Seems to
>>me that we don't have an answer to this question within the IETF.
>
> Yes, the whole Byzantine participants problem gets little attention -
> partly because it is really hard to address.
>
> A protocol robust against such failures can be much "heavier", but the
> approaches to adding Byzantine robustness are not generic - you don't
> just add a "Byzantine robustness" layer.
>
> But that is why I said that it would be prudent to analyze just how
> bad things can get if one participant (and for extra points, more than
> one participant) is faulty/misconfigured/subverted/malicious.
>
> Until we all get smarter about protocols, doing the worst cast scenario
> study at least lets you know where you have to apply administrative
> controls, monitoring and alarms, etc.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:00 PM


> OK, Thanks.
>
> I am going to feed this to the MPLS Security design team, and finger you
> (tee, hee, that will teach you ;-) as someone they can poll for a good
> discussion.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: ; "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 9:14 PM
Subject: Re: New Version Notification - 
draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt


> Hi Ross,
>
> This new revisions handles some issues raised during SecDir review and
> copied to the CCAMP mailing list.
>
> The changes are:
> - Minor editorial clarification of the Abstract
> - Repagination
> - Insertion of a paragraph in Section 6
>   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model between RSVP
>   neighbors. That is, although the protocol exchanges before and after
>   restart can be secured, and although it is possible to authenticate
>   the identity of the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify
>   that the restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
>   information exchanged before the restart. This is considered
>   acceptable because a similar trust model is required for normal
>   operation of the protocol.
> - Addition to the Acknowledgements section

===

From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Cc: ; ; ;
; ; ;
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:44 AM

>>>>>> "Sandy" == Sandy Murphy  writes:
>
>    Sandy>    asatyana@cisco.com, secdir@mit.edu, lberger@labn.net,
>    Sandy> ancaz@cisco.com, iesg@ietf.org
>    >> This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't
>    >> make extensive protocol changes to handle the potential for
>    >> broken implementations.
>
>    Sandy> Yes, we will always have errors, in implementation, in
>    Sandy> configuration, in operation, we can't hope to protect
>    Sandy> against all of those, etc.
>
>    Sandy> However, it is prudent to spend some time analyzing how
>    Sandy> much damage to the protocol operation could result from a
>
> I agree with Sandy here.  I think that analysis of what damage can be
> done by a malicious peer so that we can understand whether the
> proposed trust model is justified.


===

From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: 
Cc: 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:47 AM


> Discuss:
> Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
> Murphy, please help me understand why the trust model of this spec and
> normal operation of RSVP is the same. In particular, what damage can
> be done by a malicious peer sending back altered contents of path
> messages?  How could the same damage be done in the normal protocol?
>
> It may well be that writing text to cover these issues is too
> expensive.  If the authors would like to discuss with me offline that
> could work too.  Text is of course preferred if it is relatively easy
> to write because then the entire world can review our findings.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: ; "Sam Hartman" 
Cc: 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 10:49 AM


> Hi Sam,
>
> So the paragraph we included to help with Derek's comments is...
>
>   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model between RSVP
>   neighbors. That is, although the protocol exchanges before and after
>   restart can be secured, and although it is possible to authenticate
>   the identity of the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify
>   that the restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
>   information exchanged before the restart. This is considered
>   acceptable because a similar trust model is required for normal
>   operation of the protocol.
>
> You can see this in the 07 revision.
>
> Simply put, the trust model between peers (once they are identified and
> authenticated) must be full for RSVP-TE. Otherwise there are many ways 
> that
> a malicious neighbor can really mess with its peer. For example, a 
> malicious
> upstream LSR could pretend that it had received an LSP setup request from
> somewhere further upstream and could send a Path message to its peer - 
> this
> could cause network resources to be squandered on all downstream LSRs.
>
> If you think about it, this hop-by-hop trust is necessary because 
> otherwise
> every network node must have a security relationship with every potential
> LSP ingress, and that cannot scale.
>
> Again, I would prefer not to use an RSVP-TE extensions draft to document
> normal RSVP-TE behavior, although I do understand that this behavior 
> *does*
> need to be documented. It is our hope that an effort recently started in 
> the
> MPLS working group to document MPLS security will cover all of these 
> bases,
> if somewhat belatedly.

===

From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:59 PM


>>>>>> "Adrian" == Adrian Farrel  writes:
>
>    Adrian> Hi Sam, So the paragraph we included to help with Derek's
>    Adrian> comments is...
>
>    Adrian>   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model
>    Adrian> between RSVP neighbors. That is, although the protocol
>    Adrian> exchanges before and after restart can be secured, and
>    Adrian> although it is possible to authenticate the identity of
>    Adrian> the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify that the
>    Adrian> restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
>    Adrian> information exchanged before the restart. This is
>    Adrian> considered acceptable because a similar trust model is
>    Adrian> required for normal operation of the protocol.
>
> This paragraph is the source of my discuss.
> It makes an assertion that the damage that could be caused by changing 
> state
> in a restart is the same as the damage that could be caused under normal
> operation.
> I'm asking you to validate that assertion so I can evaluate the document.
>
>    Adrian> You can see this in the 07 revision.
>
> Yes.
>
>    Adrian> Simply put, the trust model between peers (once they are
>    Adrian> identified and authenticated) must be full for
>    Adrian> RSVP-TE. Otherwise there are many ways that a malicious
>    Adrian> neighbor can really mess with its peer. For example, a
>    Adrian> malicious upstream LSR could pretend that it had received
>    Adrian> an LSP setup request from somewhere further upstream and
>    Adrian> could send a Path message to its peer - this could cause
>    Adrian> network resources to be squandered on all downstream LSRs.
>
> I agree that there needs to be some level of trust between peers in
> the current protocol.
>
>    Adrian> If you think about it, this hop-by-hop trust is necessary
>    Adrian> because otherwise every network node must have a security
>    Adrian> relationship with every potential LSP ingress, and that
>    Adrian> cannot scale.
>
> Mor like every network node must be able to have data origin
> authentication with every potential ingress, which is a much weaker
> statement.  But that's not a matter of discussion for today: we're not
> redesigning RSVP so we're not redesigning the hop-by-hop trust model.
> We're simply trying to validate that we have not changed it.
>
>    Adrian> Again, I would prefer not to use an RSVP-TE extensions
>    Adrian> draft to document normal RSVP-TE behavior, although I do
>    Adrian> understand that this behavior *does* need to be
>    Adrian> documented. It is our hope that an effort recently started
>    Adrian> in the MPLS working group to document MPLS security will
>    Adrian> cover all of these bases, if somewhat belatedly.
>
> As I said, my discuss can be resolved without text changes; I just
> need to be convinced of the answer to my question.  And again, I'm not
> asking you to document normal RSVP procedures only to show you have
> not changed them.

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Sam Hartman" 
Cc: ; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 3:35 PM


> Hi Sam,
>
>>    Adrian>   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model
>>    Adrian> between RSVP neighbors. That is, although the protocol
>>    Adrian> exchanges before and after restart can be secured, and
>>    Adrian> although it is possible to authenticate the identity of
>>    Adrian> the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify that the
>>    Adrian> restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
>>    Adrian> information exchanged before the restart. This is
>>    Adrian> considered acceptable because a similar trust model is
>>    Adrian> required for normal operation of the protocol.
>>
>> This paragraph is the source of my discuss.
>> It makes an assertion that the damage that could
>> be caused by changing state  in a restart is the same
>> as the damage that could be caused under normal
>> operation.
>
> No it doesn't.
> It says that the trust model is unchanged.
>
> In fact, the damage that could be done by a malicious router (not one with
> subverted configuration, but one with subverted software implementation) 
> is
> subtly different because of the different direction of the information
> exchange.
>
>> I'm asking you to validate that assertion so I can
>> evaluate the document.
>
> I can certainly validate the assertion made in the I-D.
>
> When an upstream neighbor sends a Path message, its downstream neighbor 
> acts
> on that message to establish state and cause downstream behavior that
> ultimately leads to resource allocations on the downstream negihbor and 
> the
> establishment of an LSP toward a specific destination. The downstream
> negihbor trusts that the upstream neighbor has passed it a genuine Path
> message for a real LSP.
>
> When an upstream neighbor sends a Path message to its downstream neighbor 
> it
> trusts that the downstream neighbor will not change the destination of the
> LSP, but will continue to forward the essential objects of the Path 
> message
> unchanged.
>
> When an upstream neighbor receives a Resv message from its downstream
> neighbor it trusts that message is a true reflection of the LSP that has
> been established downstream and contains accurate and true instructions on
> what the upstream neighbor should do.
>
> When a downstream neighbor sends a Resv message to its upstream neighbor 
> it
> trusts that the upstream negihbor will handle the message correctly and 
> will
> neither modify it gratuitously nor absorb it silently.
>
> And so on for all other RSVP-TE messages.
>
> Thus there is a bidirectional full trust model between neighbors.
>
> Given that the trust model is full and bidirectional, this I-D cannot 
> modify
> the trust model.
>
> Now, as I said, the damage you could do for any one LSP is subtly 
> different.
> That is, during LSP setup, the maliscious LSR would have been limited to
> doing damage as a recipient of a Path message and sender of a Resv. With
> this I-D it is able to tell the upstream (restarting) LSR that the Path
> message it sent previously was different from the one it actually sent. 
> What
> new damage could this do?
>
> It doesn't change any of the behavior at any downstream LSR because the
> malicious LSR could already have lied in the Path message that it sent
> downstream.
>
> It doesn't change anything at the malicious LSR because that LSR is always
> free to be malicious in its own way.
>
> It doesn't change anything upstream of the restarting LSR because the
> restart information is not propagated further upstream.
>
> All it can do is tell the restarting LSR that the LSP parameters have
> changed. So what?
>
> This might cause the LSP to be torn down with some kind of state mismatch
> between the existing data plane state (that survived the restart) and the
> control plane state reported from the malicious LSR. If the malicous LSR
> wanted to cause the LSP to be torn down, it could do it itself anyway (it 
> is
> on the path of the LSP). The state mismatch is likely to show up as a
> problem with restart so the malicious LSR will not be able to hide.
>
> So...
>
> Now change in trust model. No substantial change in the damage that can be
> done if the trust model is subverted.
>
>>    Adrian> Simply put, the trust model between peers (once they are
>>    Adrian> identified and authenticated) must be full for
>>    Adrian> RSVP-TE. Otherwise there are many ways that a malicious
>>    Adrian> neighbor can really mess with its peer. For example, a
>>    Adrian> malicious upstream LSR could pretend that it had received
>>    Adrian> an LSP setup request from somewhere further upstream and
>>    Adrian> could send a Path message to its peer - this could cause
>>    Adrian> network resources to be squandered on all downstream LSRs.
>>
>> I agree that there needs to be some level of trust between peers in
>> the current protocol.
>>
>>    Adrian> If you think about it, this hop-by-hop trust is necessary
>>    Adrian> because otherwise every network node must have a security
>>    Adrian> relationship with every potential LSP ingress, and that
>>    Adrian> cannot scale.
>>
>> More like every network node must be able to have data origin
>> authentication with every potential ingress, which is a much weaker
>> statement.
>
> Are you supposing that the signaling data cannot be modified hop-by-hop?
> Actually much of it can be changed, and some of it must be changed.
>
>> But that's not a matter of discussion for today: we're not
>> redesigning RSVP so we're not redesigning the hop-by-hop
>> trust model.
>> We're simply trying to validate that we have not changed it.
>
> Given that the trust model was full and bidirectional, the only direction
> for change would be to assume less trust. This I-D does not assume less
> trust.
>
>>    Adrian> Again, I would prefer not to use an RSVP-TE extensions
>>    Adrian> draft to document normal RSVP-TE behavior, although I do
>>    Adrian> understand that this behavior *does* need to be
>>    Adrian> documented. It is our hope that an effort recently started
>>    Adrian> in the MPLS working group to document MPLS security will
>>    Adrian> cover all of these bases, if somewhat belatedly.
>>
>> As I said, my discuss can be resolved without text changes; I just
>> need to be convinced of the answer to my question.  And again, I'm not
>> asking you to document normal RSVP procedures only to show you have
>> not changed them.
>
> Convinced yet?

===

From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 6:09 PM


> FYI, I am having an off-line discussion with Sam Hartman during IESG 
> review
> of this document (that has now advanced to 07) as he has raised a DISCUSS
> (you can see his issues in the I-D tracker).
>
> He is concerned that the extensions in this I-D change the trust model in
> RSVP-TE, and I am trying to convince him that there is already a
> bidirectional full trust model between neighbors without which basic 
> RSVP-TE
> signaling could not work. Thus (I say) this I-D does not change the 
> existing
> trust model although it reverses the flow of information for a specific 
> LSP.
>
> Further (I say) even a malicious LSR neighboring a restarting LSR could do
> very little more damage during restart than it could do during normal LSP
> processing.
>
> If anyone want to see the contents of this discussion, please shout.
>
> Adrian

===


From: "Ross Callon" 
To: ; 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Thursday, January 25, 2007 8:44 PM


> The document "draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt" was discussed
> during the IESG telechat today. As you will see from the data tracker
> (let me know if you need a pointer to this), there are two DISCUSS
> votes that will need to be resolved in order for this document to
> progress.

[SNIP]

> The other DISCUSS by Sam Hartman states:
>
>     Based on a security review by Derek Atkins and comments from Sandy
>     Murphy, please help me understand why the trust model of this spec and
>     normal operation of RSVP is the same. In particular, what damage can
>     be done by a malicious peer sending back altered contents of path
>     messages? How could the same damage be done in the normal protocol?
>
>     It may well be that writing text to cover these issues is too
>     expensive. If the authors would like to discuss with me offline that
>     could work too. Text is of course preferred if it is relatively easy
>     to write because then the entire world can review our findings.
>
> I think that you need to see the security review by Derek and comments
> by Sandy. Also, resolving this is likely to require an email exchange with
> Sam. Let me know if you need any help resolving this.
>
> It was not clear whether Sam's discuss will result in significant 
> additional
> text for the document. If so, then you probably will want to add the other
> text as well and do a new version.
>
> Please let me know when you feel that you have these two issues
> resolved, or if you need additional help in resolving them.






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	Title		: Routing extensions for discovery of 
                          Multiprotocol (MPLS) Label Switch Router 
                          (LSR) Traffic Engineering (TE) mesh membership
	Author(s)	: J. Vasseur, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-automesh-04.txt
	Pages		: 16
	Date		: 2007-1-24
	
The set up of a full mesh of Multi-Protocol Label Switching (MPLS)
   Traffic Engineering (TE) Label Switched Paths (LSP) among a set of
   Label Switch Routers (LSR) is a common deployment scenario of MPLS
   Traffic Engineering either for bandwidth optimization, bandwidth
   guarantees or fast rerouting with MPLS Fast Reroute.  Such deployment
   may require the configuration of potentially a large number of TE
   LSPs (on the order of the square of the number LSRs).  This document
   specifies Interior Gateway Protocol (IGP) routing extensions for
   Intermediate System-to-Intermediate System (IS-IS) and Open Shortest
   Path First (OSPF) so as to provide an automatic discovery of the set
   of LSRs members of a mesh in order to automate the creation of such
   mesh of TE LSPs.

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	Title		: Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support of Calls
	Author(s)	: D. Papadimitriou, A. Farrel
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-04.txt
	Pages		: 30
	Date		: 2007-1-23
	
In certain networking topologies, it may be advantageous to maintain
   associations between endpoints and key transit points to support an
   instance of a service. Such associations are known as Calls.

   A Call does not provide the actual connectivity for transmitting user
   traffic, but only builds a relationship by which subsequent
   Connections may be made. In Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) such Connections
   are known as Label Switched Paths (LSPs).

   This document specifies how GMPLS RSVP-TE signaling may be used and
   extended to support Calls. These mechanisms provide full and logical
   Call/Connection separation.

   The mechanisms proposed in this document are applicable to any
   environment (including multi-area), and for any type of interface:
   packet, layer-2, time-division multiplexed, lambda, or fiber
   switching.

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 19:28:15 +0000
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: 
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 20:26:50 +0100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

adrian - if this i-d has to be revisited wrt to the trust model
it implies there are a couple of other items that would fall in
to the same category

hence, the point is the following can we share that discussion
(i mean the off-line one) such as to assess the rationale and
arguments that led sam to this conclusion

thanks,
- d.
 




"Adrian Farrel" 
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
23/01/2007 19:09
Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
 
        To:     
        cc: 
        Subject:        Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


FYI, I am having an off-line discussion with Sam Hartman during IESG 
review 
of this document (that has now advanced to 07) as he has raised a DISCUSS 
(you can see his issues in the I-D tracker).

He is concerned that the extensions in this I-D change the trust model in 
RSVP-TE, and I am trying to convince him that there is already a 
bidirectional full trust model between neighbors without which basic 
RSVP-TE 
signaling could not work. Thus (I say) this I-D does not change the 
existing 
trust model although it reverses the flow of information for a specific 
LSP.

Further (I say) even a malicious LSR neighboring a restarting LSR could do 

very little more damage during restart than it could do during normal LSP 
processing.

If anyone want to see the contents of this discussion, please shout.

Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; ; ; 

; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:44 AM
Subject: Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


>>>>>> "Sandy" == Sandy Murphy  writes:
>
>    Sandy>    asatyana@cisco.com, secdir@mit.edu, lberger@labn.net,
>    Sandy> ancaz@cisco.com, iesg@ietf.org
>    >> This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't
>    >> make extensive protocol changes to handle the potential for
>    >> broken implementations.
>
>    Sandy> Yes, we will always have errors, in implementation, in
>    Sandy> configuration, in operation, we can't hope to protect
>    Sandy> against all of those, etc.
>
>    Sandy> However, it is prudent to spend some time analyzing how
>    Sandy> much damage to the protocol operation could result from a
>
> I agree with Sandy here.  I think that analysis of what damage can be
> done by a malicious peer so that we can understand whether the
> proposed trust model is justified.
>
>
>
> 








Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:12:33 +0000
Message-ID: <017601c73f19$b1b35240$f4849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2007 18:09:42 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

FYI, I am having an off-line discussion with Sam Hartman during IESG review 
of this document (that has now advanced to 07) as he has raised a DISCUSS 
(you can see his issues in the I-D tracker).

He is concerned that the extensions in this I-D change the trust model in 
RSVP-TE, and I am trying to convince him that there is already a 
bidirectional full trust model between neighbors without which basic RSVP-TE 
signaling could not work. Thus (I say) this I-D does not change the existing 
trust model although it reverses the flow of information for a specific LSP.

Further (I say) even a malicious LSR neighboring a restarting LSR could do 
very little more damage during restart than it could do during normal LSP 
processing.

If anyone want to see the contents of this discussion, please shout.

Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sam Hartman" 
To: "Sandy Murphy" 
Cc: ; ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2007 2:44 AM
Subject: Re: [secdir] draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


>>>>>> "Sandy" == Sandy Murphy  writes:
>
>    Sandy>    asatyana@cisco.com, secdir@mit.edu, lberger@labn.net,
>    Sandy> ancaz@cisco.com, iesg@ietf.org
>    >> This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't
>    >> make extensive protocol changes to handle the potential for
>    >> broken implementations.
>
>    Sandy> Yes, we will always have errors, in implementation, in
>    Sandy> configuration, in operation, we can't hope to protect
>    Sandy> against all of those, etc.
>
>    Sandy> However, it is prudent to spend some time analyzing how
>    Sandy> much damage to the protocol operation could result from a
>
> I agree with Sandy here.  I think that analysis of what damage can be
> done by a malicious peer so that we can understand whether the
> proposed trust model is justified.
>
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 22:39:27 +0000
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Subject: FW: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:36:49 -0600
Message-ID: <449B2580D802A443A923DABF3EAB82AF0D7C1A4E@OCCLUST04EVS1.ugd.att.com>
Thread-Topic: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work
Thread-Index: AccNiM+Wedzd4U7lRGW+Ze36ovZ+Dwuj+Rlw
From: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
To: 

Hi all,

This Liaison from ITU was unfortunately received just prior to our one
and only 2-day American holiday resulting in it's probable lost in the
queue. But we do have until Feb 12th to respond. Please send mail either
on the exploder or off to Adrian and me as we will be drafting a timely
response.

Deborah

-----Original Message-----
From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
Behalf Of Adrian Farrel
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2006 5:57 AM
To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Response liaison from ITU-T SG15 on CCAMP ASON work

Hi,

We have received a detailed response to our liaison on current
ASON-related=20
work within CCAMP.

The full liaison can be seen at http://www.olddog.co.uk/ccamp.htm

The bulk of the liaison is comments on=20
draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-ason-routing-ospf-02.txt and a discussion on the
use=20
of Calls and Connections in G.8080.

We are called on to respond by 12th February 2007.

Adrian=20






Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 16:38:04 +0000
Message-ID: <45B0F351.8080503@grotto-networking.com>
Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2007 08:35:29 -0800
From: Greg Bernstein 
User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.9 (Windows/20061207)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Evelyne Roch 
CC: Adrian Farrel , ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: LCAS/VCAT
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Evelyne, sorry for the delay but Richard Rabbat had been taking the 
lead on this draft for most of last year.
See comments on your comments.

Regards

Greg B.

Evelyne Roch wrote:
> I read the draft and have the following comments:
>
> 1- The draft is missing support for creation and deletion of VCG with
> diversely routed signals without LCAS. This is because the procedure
> that is used to setup the components does not provide information about
> the VCAT layer, i.e. it is missing the total number of components that
> are part of the same VCG. 
Yes. Both ends need to agree on which components are to be used in the 
group at any given time. This requires extra signaling concerning
the structure of the VCAT group. There are a number of ways this could 
be done.
> In a liaison from ITU-T SG15, Q14/15
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/documents/LIAISON/file394.doc, the 2nd
> figure of Attachment 2 shows a multi-layer setup of an Ethernet call
> over VCAT/LCAS. Although the Ethernet layer is not relevant to the
> draft, it should be noted that a portion of the diagram includes an
> Aggregate NCC (Network Call Controller) that provides the missing
> functionality in the draft to provide the number of components that form
> the VCG. This is based on G.8080, in which the VCAT layer has its own
> controller. The functions performed by the Aggregate NCC are required
> whether or not LCAS is available. They allow both ends of the VCG to
> know the overall status of the VCG and the number of components it
> contains. It should also be noted that the call and connection states
> for each constituent must be kept separately from the state of the VCAT
> call.
>   
 From an implementation perspective an entity such as the mentioned 
Aggregate NCC that "manages the VCGs" is a given. I've got to manage the 
settings of that VCAT/LCAS chip at some point (and related logical 
entities).  Similarly for each cross connect involved.  I'm not up to 
date on all the call/connection state discussions so I won't comment (yet).
> 2- The draft is missing support for the creation of the various
> components in a separate phase than the creation of the VCAT group. In
> general, it should be possible to create, for example, several VC-4
> connections and to add them to a VCG at a later point to create, for
> example, a VC-4-4v. This can only be achieved if an Aggregate NCC
> exists.
>   
Here you are talking about (I think) a nifty application that we had in 
an earlier version of the draft. In this case, a number of pipes are set 
up between the endpoints far in advanced and could be shared between 
multiple VCAT groups. For example a number of GbE customers connect to 
an access box that supports VCAT on its line side and the pre-configured 
(setup) component signals would be allocated between the VCAT groups 
without additional signal setup and tear down across the network.  Is 
this of interest to folks? Is the saving of the call setup and tear down 
that significant?
> 3- I would prefer to use the call ID to correlate the diversely routed
> signals instead of the Association Object. In my opinion, the call id is
> a better choice because it is better aligned with the ASON architecture
> (G.8080).
>
> Regards,
> Evelyne Roch
> Metro Ethernet Networks, Nortel
> Phone: +1 613 763 6492 (esn 393-6492)
> e-mail: eroch@nortel.com  
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org [mailto:owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org] On
> Behalf Of Adrian Farrel
> Sent: Thursday, November 30, 2006 6:57 AM
> To: ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> Subject: LCAS/VCAT
>
> Hi,
>
> In San Diego Richard presented the current status of
> draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-vcat-lcas-01.txt and suggested that the work is
> nearing completion.
>
> A quick show of hands indicated that very few had read the draft. This
> may be because it is a very narrow niche that only a few are interested
> in (i.e., all of the key people have read it), or may be because more
> people need to have a look.
>
> If you are interested in this work, could you please find some time
> relatively soon to have a look at the draft and send your comments to
> the list.
>
> If you have or are planning an implementation could you drop me a
> private
> (confidential!) email.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian 
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   

-- 
===================================================
Dr Greg Bernstein, Grotto Networking (510) 573-2237





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 21:57:28 +0000
Message-ID: <00e201c73b4b$72dd9a20$a2849ed9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: "Ross Callon" , "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
Subject: Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt 
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 21:55:50 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

After a long hiatus I have got around to the IETF last call comments for 
this draft.

The changes are:

- New final paragraph in Section 4.1 to address comments raised
  by Ross.
- Rewrite of Section 9 (IANA) for clarity, but no change in content.
- Rewrite of Section 10 to handle comments from the SecDir review.

The changes to Section 10 are substantive, but I don't think they will cause 
anyone any issues.

Thanks,
Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: 
Cc: 
Sent: Thursday, January 18, 2007 8:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane 
> Working Group of the IETF.
>
> Title : Crankback Signaling Extensions for MPLS and GMPLS RSVP-TE
> Author(s) : A. Farrel, et al.
> Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt
> Pages : 35
> Date : 2007-1-18
>
> In a distributed, constraint-based routing environment, the
>   information used to compute a path may be out of date. This means
>   that Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS
>   (GMPLS) Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Path (LSP) setup
>   requests may be blocked by links or nodes without sufficient
>   resources. Crankback is a scheme whereby setup failure information is
>   returned from the point of failure to allow new setup attempts to be
>   made avoiding the blocked resources. Crankback can also be applied to
>   LSP recovery to indicate the location of the failed link or node.
>
>   This document specifies crankback signaling extensions for use in
>   MPLS signaling using RSVP-TE as defined in "RSVP-TE: Extensions to
>   RSVP for LSP Tunnels", RFC3209, and GMPLS signaling as defined in
>   "Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Signaling
>   Functional Description", RFC3473. These extensions mean that the LSP
>   setup request can be retried on an alternate path that detours around
>   blocked links or nodes. This offers significant improvements in the
>   successful setup and recovery ratios for LSPs, especially in
>   situations where a large number of setup requests are triggered at
>   the same time.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt





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From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt 
Message-Id: 
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 15:50:01 -0500

--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Crankback Signaling Extensions for MPLS and GMPLS RSVP-TE
	Author(s)	: A. Farrel, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-crankback-06.txt
	Pages		: 35
	Date		: 2007-1-18
	
In a distributed, constraint-based routing environment, the
   information used to compute a path may be out of date. This means
   that Multiprotocol Label Switching (MPLS) and Generalized MPLS
   (GMPLS) Traffic Engineered (TE) Label Switched Path (LSP) setup
   requests may be blocked by links or nodes without sufficient
   resources. Crankback is a scheme whereby setup failure information is
   returned from the point of failure to allow new setup attempts to be
   made avoiding the blocked resources. Crankback can also be applied to
   LSP recovery to indicate the location of the failed link or node.

   This document specifies crankback signaling extensions for use in
   MPLS signaling using RSVP-TE as defined in "RSVP-TE: Extensions to
   RSVP for LSP Tunnels", RFC3209, and GMPLS signaling as defined in
   "Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Signaling
   Functional Description", RFC3473. These extensions mean that the LSP
   setup request can be retried on an alternate path that detours around
   blocked links or nodes. This offers significant improvements in the
   successful setup and recovery ratios for LSPs, especially in
   situations where a large number of setup requests are triggered at
   the same time.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 04:24:30 +0000
Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:16:16 +0800
From: ZhangRenhai 
Subject: =?gb2312?B?UmU6ILTwuLQ6IFByb2dyZXNzaW5nIHRoZSB0aHJlZSBpbnRlci1kb21haW4=?= =?gb2312?B?IEktRHM=?=
To: JP Vasseur 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Message-id: <003b01c73ab7$68608290$864d460a@china.huawei.com>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_9RNxoRGa7ySeo/SiTDJd1A)"

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312
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Hi,

On Jan 16, 2007, at 11:11 PM, ZhangRenhai wrote:

After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
about inter-ASBR links flooding.
I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR
links fooding is desired.
As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an optimization. 
But
such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
than "normal" TE links do,
e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
number and peer ASBR router id
besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
rfc3784.
I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the
IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.
[ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take this 
scenario for example:

                     /  ASBR4
ASBR1--------ASBR2--
                    \  ASBR3
------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------

ASBR2 in AS 1
In your example, both ASBR1 and ASBR2 are in AS1 ?[ZhangRenhai>]Yes. let me try to make the graph more clear.                     /  ASBR4
ASBR1--------ASBR2
                   \  ASBR3
|-----AS 1-----|        |-----AS 2----------


would only advertise the optimal route
 I guess that you're referring to the BGP route here.
[ZhangRenhai>]Yes, as you said above:"You should rely on BGP for that purpose". I think BGP would be suitable for PCE method if all ASBRs in a AS are connected to the PCE.  however, by per-domain, see below graph for example:                    /  ASBR4 [AS 3]
ASBR1--------ASBR2
                   \  ASBR3 [AS 2]
|-----AS 1-----|        
 if the ASBR3 and ASBR4 belong to different AS but send the same route to ASBR2, then ASBR2 would send only the optimal(through AS 2) one to ASBR1. When ASBR1 receives a path mesg with an ERO AS3, it will fail because ASBR1 has no this info.
received respectively
from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also doesn't have the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is connected to 
and which router is in that AS)between the two AS.

.... This is IP Inter-AS routing ... 
With the per-domain approach (inter-AS), 
BGP can of course be used, thus all necessary information for ASBR selection is available. 
[ZhangRenhai>]I'm not sure. 


PCE would have the
similar problem when performing the brpc.
Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain
containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method for it 
to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2.

I don't see the scenario you're referring to ...[ZhangRenhai>]still the above graph, and the ero may be a sequence of AS number, for example, ...AS1, AS2... then the ASBR1 should know how to forword this path mesg to that domain, which ASBR in AS 1 should it forward, compute to. Zhang Renhai 
JP.

Regards,
Zhang Renhai

So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR
links flooding. we are considering to
write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could
cooperate.

JP.


--Boundary_(ID_9RNxoRGa7ySeo/SiTDJd1A)
Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312
Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT








Hi,

On Jan 16, 2007, at 11:11 PM, ZhangRenhai wrote:





  

    
After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
about inter-ASBR links flooding.
I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR
links fooding is desired.

As pointed out in the document, this is 
    not a MUST, but an optimization. 

    
But
such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
than "normal" TE links do,
e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
number and peer ASBR router id
besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
rfc3784.

I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the
IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.

[ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some 
  circumstance, take this 
scenario for example:

                     /  ASBR4
ASBR1--------ASBR2--
                    \  ASBR3
------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------

ASBR2 in AS 1

In your example, both ASBR1 and ASBR2 are in AS1 ?
[ZhangRenhai>]Yes. let me try to make the graph more clear. 
 
                   /  ASBR4
ASBR1--------ASBR2
                   \  ASBR3
|-----AS 1-----|        |-----AS 2----------





would only advertise the optimal route

 
I guess that you're referring to the BGP route here.

[ZhangRenhai>]Yes, as you said above:"You should rely on BGP for that purpose". I think BGP would be suitable for PCE method if all ASBRs in a AS are connected to the PCE. 
 
however, by per-domain, see below graph for example:
 
                   /  ASBR4 [AS 3]
ASBR1--------ASBR2
                   \  ASBR3 [AS 2]
|-----AS 1-----|        

 if the ASBR3 and ASBR4 belong to different AS but send the same route to ASBR2, then ASBR2 would send only the optimal(through AS 2) one to ASBR1. When ASBR1 receives a path mesg with an ERO AS3, it will fail because ASBR1 has no this info.



received respectively

from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also 
  doesn't have the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS 
  the ASBR2 is connected to 
and which router is in that AS)between the two AS.



 


.... This is IP Inter-AS routing ... 


With the per-domain approach (inter-AS), 


BGP can of course be used, thus all necessary information 
for ASBR selection is available. 
[ZhangRenhai>]I'm not sure. 

 


 


PCE would have the
similar problem when performing the brpc.
Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain

containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method 
  for it 
to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2.


I don't see the scenario you're referring to ...
[ZhangRenhai>]still the above graph, and the ero may be a sequence of AS number, for example, ...AS1, AS2... then the ASBR1 should know how to forword this path mesg to that domain, which ASBR in AS 1 should it forward, compute to.
 
Zhang Renhai
 

JP.




Regards,
Zhang Renhai



  

    
So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR
links flooding. we are considering to
write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could
cooperate.


JP.



    


--Boundary_(ID_9RNxoRGa7ySeo/SiTDJd1A)--



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:41:30 +0000
To: Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, JP Vasseur , mpls@lists.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Ross Callon 
Subject: Re: [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call	on	draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: 
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 22:41:07 +0100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

Hi -

let's then discuss the policy selection further - are these
not dependent on the objectives - rather than be selected / 
defined independently - ?

this question is fundamental to the understanding of the 
obtained results - i mean it may simply that with another
simple "policy" both would have result in the same outcome

i see here a potential discussion item for next f2f meeting -
do you agree ?

thanks,
- d. 





Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 
15/01/2007 20:23
 
        To:     Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL
        cc:     mpls@lists.ietf.org, ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Ross Callon 
, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, JP Vasseur 

        Subject:        Re: [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call  on 
draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt


Hi Dimitri,

On Jan 12, 2007, at 4:31 PM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be 
wrote:

> hi -
>
> thanks for the reply - not sure you ever got the following response 
> back
>
> ----- Forwarded by Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL on 12/01/2007 
> 22:30
> -----
>         Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU
>         07/01/2007 11:43
>                  To: Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira
> 
>
> Hi
>
> thanks for the answer - i am still looking at the reason
> why the PN selection process is driven by a uniform policy
> which looks like an arbitrary choice
>
> HBlock aims at minimizing the blocking probability
> PN aims at minimizing the system perturbation
>
> to have a fair analysis policy should be applied uniformly
> and non-uniformly to both cases
>

Both policies were applied in the same manner. The difference is in 
the selection of LSPs for preemption (largest or smallest). We chose 
to keep the policies simple.

I appreciate your feedback. I'd be happy to meet with you and discuss 
it further at the next IETF meeting as well.

Many thanks,

Jau.


> much thanks,
> - d.
>
> --
>
>
>
>
> Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 
> 05/01/2007 00:11
>
>         To:     Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
>         cc:     mpls@lists.ietf.org, JP Vasseur ,
> ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira
> , Ross Callon ,
> owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
>         Subject:        [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call on
> draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
>
>
> Hi Dimitri,
>
> Thank you for your comment.
>
> On Dec 18, 2006, at 3:47 AM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
> wrote:
>
>> adrian -
>>
>> in HBlock case the average wasted bw is a factor 10 smaller than
>> for any
>> other scheme (without significantly lowering the worst case, still an
>> order of 10)
>
> Indeed. This can be seen in table 2. In this case, selection of LSPs
> much larger than
> the required bandwidth did not occur often. The worst case value does
> not reflect the
> frequency with which a high bandwidth LSP was selected (which was
> very rarely in
> this case, therefore the low "wasted" bandwidth).
>
>> the only noticeable difference with PN is exactly that one (which is
>> induced by the possibility left to Hblock to have two selection
>> depending
>> on heavy vs normal loaded link) - hence it would be interesting to
>> know
>> the dependency on the min/max LSP bw and distribution (scenario
>> dependancy) and have a similar PN approach (non-uniform selection)
>
> Note that PN has the objective of preempting a small number of LSPs
> of the lowest
> priority (therefore ordering by decreasing bandwidth), while HBlock
> aims at minimizing
> the blocking probability, therefore selecting smaller LSPs which will
> be more likely to be
> rerouted once preempted. This is the main difference between the two
> policies: Given a set
> of LSPs with the same priority, PN picks the largest (in the interest
> of picking few) and HBlock
> picks smaller ones (even if more than one, in the interest of being
> able to reroute them easily).
>
> I hope this helps,
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jaudelice.
>
>>
>> thanks,
>> - d.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Adrian Farrel" 
>> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
>> 14/12/2006 18:02
>> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>>
>>         To:     
>>         cc:     , "Ross Callon"
>> , "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS"
>> ,
>> 
>>         Subject:        Re: CCAMP Last call on
>> draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have been explicitly asked to lengthen this last call so as to 
>> allow
>> time
>> for a review.
>>
>> Unusual, but not unreasonable.
>>
>> The last call is extended to noon on Sunday 17th December.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Adrian
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Adrian Farrel" 
>> To: 
>> Cc: ; "Ross Callon" ;
>> "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" ;
>> 
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 11:06 AM
>> Subject: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te- 
>> preemption-06.txt
>>
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> This draft has been developed independently and has recently been
>> brought
>>> to the IESG for advancement as an individual submission to become an
>>> Informational RFC. I have done a first-level review and this latest
>>> revision includes updates to reflect my comments.
>>>
>>> Since the material here concerns preemption and the suggested 
>>> ways to
>>> operate an MPLS-TE or GMPLS network, we are running a quick last
>>> call on
>>
>>> the CCAMP mailing list to ensure that no-one has any objections.
>>>
>>> Please send your comments to the CCAMP list no later than noon 
>>> GMT on
>> 13th
>>> December 2006.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Adrian
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: 
>>> To: 
>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 8:50 PM
>>> Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
>>>
>>>
>>>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
>>>> directories.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Title : LSP Preemption Policies for MPLS Traffic Engineering
>>>> Author(s) : J. de Oliveira, et al.
>>>> Filename : draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
>>>> Pages : 19
>>>> Date : 2006-11-28
>>>>
>>>> When the establishment of a higher priority (Traffic Engineering
>>>>   Label Switched Path) TE LSP requires the preemption of a set of
>>>> lower
>>>>   priority TE LSPs, a node has to make a local decision to select
>>>> which
>>>>
>>>>   TE LSPs will be preempted.  The preempted LSPs are then
>>>> rerouted by
>>>>   their respective Head-end Label Switch Router (LSR).  This
>>>> document
>>>>   presents a flexible policy that can be used to achieve different
>>>>   objectives: preempt the lowest priority LSPs; preempt the minimum
>>>>   number of LSPs; preempt the set of TE LSPs that provide the
>>>> closest
>>>>   amount of bandwidth to the required bandwidth for the
>>>> preempting TE
>>>>   LSPs (to minimize bandwidth wastage); preempt the LSPs that
>>>> will have
>>>>   the maximum chance to get rerouted.  Simulation results are
>>>> given and
>>>>   a comparison among several different policies, with respect to
>>>>   preemption cascading, number of preempted LSPs, priority, wasted
>>>>   bandwidth and blocking probability is also included.
>>>>
>>>> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
>>>>
>> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-deoliveira-diff-te-
>> preemption-06.txt
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mpls mailing list
> mpls@lists.ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> mpls mailing list
> mpls@lists.ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls


_______________________________________________
mpls mailing list
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https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:36:29 +0000
Message-ID: <071801c73a7f$78e8aa80$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: , "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
Subject: Re: New Version Notification - draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt 
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:14:46 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Ross,

This new revisions handles some issues raised during SecDir review and 
copied to the CCAMP mailing list.

The changes are:
- Minor editorial clarification of the Abstract
- Repagination
- Insertion of a paragraph in Section 6
   Note that the procedures assume a full trust model between RSVP
   neighbors. That is, although the protocol exchanges before and after
   restart can be secured, and although it is possible to authenticate
   the identity of the neighbors, no mechanism is provided to verify
   that the restart information is correctly mapped from the protocol
   information exchanged before the restart. This is considered
   acceptable because a similar trust model is required for normal
   operation of the protocol.
- Addition to the Acknowledgements section

Thanks,
Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "ID Tracker" 
To: ; 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 8:50 PM
Subject: New Version Notification - draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt


> New version (-07) has been submitted for 
> draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt.
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt
>
> IETF Secretariat.





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 21:36:12 +0000
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: 
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 22:35:02 +0100
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Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt 
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Extensions to GMPLS RSVP Graceful Restart
	Author(s)	: A. Satyanarayana, R. Rahman
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-07.txt
	Pages		: 24
	Date		: 2007-1-17
	
This document describes extensions to the RSVP Graceful Restart
   mechanisms defined in RFC 3473.  The extensions enable the recovery
   of RSVP signaling state based on the Path message last sent by the
   node being restarted.

   Previously defined Graceful Restart mechanisms, also called recovery
   from nodal faults, permit recovery of signaling state from adjacent
   nodes when the data plane has retained the associated forwarding
   state across a restart.  Those mechanisms do not fully support
   signaling state recovery on ingress nodes or recovery of all RSVP
   objects.

   The extensions defined in this document build on the RSVP Hello
   extensions defined in RFC 3209, and extensions for state recovery on
   nodal faults defined in RFC 3473.  Using these extensions the
   restarting node can recover all previously transmitted Path state
   including the Explicit Route Object and the downstream (outgoing)
   interface identifiers.  The extensions can also be used to recover
   signaling state after the restart of an ingress node.

   The extensions optionally support the use of Summary Refresh, defined
   in RFC 2961, to reduce the number of messages exchanged during the
   Recovery Phase when the restarting node has recovered signaling state
   locally for one or more LSPs.

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 20:06:07 +0000
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Subject: March Meeting Reminders
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 14:03:17 -0600
Message-ID: <449B2580D802A443A923DABF3EAB82AF0D746F44@OCCLUST04EVS1.ugd.att.com>
Thread-Topic: March Meeting Reminders
Thread-Index: Acc4xfMYujq2cTJxTgugJtmDtl/KAwBq3ldg
From: "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
To: 

CCAMP,

The agenda is posted. As we agreed at the last meeting, we will have two
sessions, they are scheduled for Monday morning and Tuesday afternoon:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/meeting_agenda_html.cgi?meeting_num=3D=

68

And don't forget to use the new Boilerplate on all draft submissions
(see mail below).

Deborah and Adrian

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This message is to remind you that as of February 1, 2007 the IETF
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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:15:42 +0000
Message-ID: <05ae01c73a31$2a20f540$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: 
Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:15:07 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Yes, Dimitri, I agree that the situation you describe is not solved by 
limited flooding of inter-AS TE links within only their adjacent ASes.

It is my view that this wider problem space has been delegate for resolution 
by PCE. That is, in order to fully resolve the problem by flooding of TE 
link information it would be necessary to also aggregate TE reachabilty 
across AS_2 and AS_3 in your example. Such aggregation is non-trivial given 
the number of TE parameters and the number of potential routes, and so we 
would have at least one of:
- excess information flooding
- excess aggregation processing
- valueless information flooding.
In the light of these options we (the Routing Area) decided to pursue PCE as 
a solution.

Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ; "'JP Vasseur'" ; "'Mach Chen'" 
; ; "ZhangRenhai" 

Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 11:26 AM
Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links


> adrian
>
> agreed on the analysis - there is one additional case that
> needs to be addressed
>
> AS_1 is connected to AS_2 and AS_3 both connected to AS_4
>
> the ERO, includes AS_1 and AS_4, perfectly clear there is
> no intention to pass AS_2 - AS_4 and AS_3 - AS_4 TE link
> information to AS_1
>
> but what about AS_1 - AS_2 and AS_1 - AS_3 whose info. is
> defacto available
>
> the issue is one sentence, the initial linearization does
> not hold in the generic case of loose abstract AS's
>
> comments ?
>
> -d.
>
>
>
>
>
> "Adrian Farrel" 
> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> 17/01/2007 12:00
> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>
>        To:     "ZhangRenhai" , "'JP Vasseur'"
> , "'Mach Chen'" , Dimitri
> PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL
>        cc:     
>        Subject:        Advertising of inter-AS TE links
>
>
> Hi,
>
> Since this discussion is blossoming, it can have its own thread...
>
> I'd like to try to bring some focus.
>
> The motivation seems clear...
> When computing a path through one AS into another AS, the computation
> point
> needs to know about TE links that connect to the next AS. This enables it
> to
> select:
> - A TE link that connects to the next AS
> - A TE link that is suitable for the LSP.
>
> Other questions about reachability and TE connectivity across the next AS
> are out of scope and have been defined as problems that PCE is used to
> solve. This is an important point! We are not talking about distributing
> information to provide a graph to compute multi-AS TE paths. That is
> (IMHO)
> out of scope and what PCE was invented to solve.
>
> I see two scenarios.
> 1. An ASBR has two links to the next AS.
> 2. An AS has two ASBRs to the next AS.
> In either case, the AS may have multiple ASBRs.
>
> The path computation point must determine:
> a. The set of ASBRs that connect to the next AS.
> b. Which ASBR to use.
> c. Which inter-AS link to use.
>
> Some cases are easy:
> - If the ERO already includes the ASBR address
>  no choice to be done
> - If the ASBR has multiple inter-AS links then
>  the choice can be a local matter (no
>  advertising required)
>
> But other cases require advertisement of the inter-AS link as a TE link
> with:
> - the normal TE information
> - an indication that this is an inter-AS link
> - the identity of the remote ASBR
> - the identity of the remote AS
>
> This information is needed through-out the local AS. That is, although all
>
> of the ASBRs may be interested for LSPs that entirely cross the local AS,
> and although a PCE could be a BGP speaker, the information is also needed
> for LSPs that are originated within the AS.
>
> Thus we must decide how paths for LSPs that exit the AS will be computed:
>
> - If we require computation by a PCE that
>  is (somewhat) centralised within the AS
>  we can use BGP to distribute the information
>  and require that the PCEs are BGP speakers.
>  (Note that the information is only needed
>  within the local AS, so we would limit its
>  flooding by BGP.)
>
> - If we require computation by any LSR in
>  the AS (i.e. PCE function is fully
>  distributed) then we require IGP flooding
>  of the information across the whole AS.
>
> In both cases the cost is not particularly high since the number of
> inter-AS
> TE links will not be large.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "ZhangRenhai" 
> To: "'JP Vasseur'" ; "'Mach Chen'" 
> Cc: ; 
> Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 4:11 AM
> Subject: ´ð¸´: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
>>> > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
>>> > about inter-ASBR links flooding.
>>> > I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR
>>> > links fooding is desired.
>>>
>>> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an
> optimization.
>>>
>>> > But
>>> > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
>>> > than "normal" TE links do,
>>> > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
>>> > number and peer ASBR router id
>>> > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
>>> > rfc3784.
>>>
>>> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the
>>> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.
>> [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take this
>> scenario for example:
>>
>>                     /  ASBR4
>> ASBR1--------ASBR2--
>>                    \  ASBR3
>> ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------
>>
>> ASBR2 in AS 1 would only advertise the optimal route received
> respectively
>> from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also doesn't
>> have
>> the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is connected
> to
>> and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. PCE would have the
>> similar problem when performing the brpc.
>> Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain
>> containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method for
> it
>> to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Zhang Renhai
>>
>>>
>>> >
>>> > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR
>>> > links flooding. we are considering to
>>> > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could
>>> > cooperate.
>>> >
>>>
>>> JP.
>>>
>>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> 





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Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 07:12:13 -0500
To: ZhangRenhai 
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Hi,

On Jan 16, 2007, at 11:11 PM, ZhangRenhai wrote:

>>> After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
>>> about inter-ASBR links flooding.
>>> I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR
>>> links fooding is desired.
>>
>> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an  
>> optimization.
>>
>>> But
>>> such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
>>> than "normal" TE links do,
>>> e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
>>> number and peer ASBR router id
>>> besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
>>> rfc3784.
>>
>> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the
>> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.
> [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take  
> this
> scenario for example:
>
>                      /  ASBR4
> ASBR1--------ASBR2--
>                     \  ASBR3
> ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------
>
> ASBR2 in AS 1

In your example, both ASBR1 and ASBR2 are in AS1 ?

> would only advertise the optimal route

I guess that you're referring to the BGP route here.

> received respectively
> from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also  
> doesn't have
> the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is  
> connected to
> and which router is in that AS)between the two AS.

.... This is IP Inter-AS routing ... With the per-domain approach  
(inter-AS), BGP can of course be used, thus all necessary information  
for ASBR selection is available.

> PCE would have the
> similar problem when performing the brpc.
> Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain
> containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method  
> for it
> to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2.
>

I don't see the scenario you're referring to ...

JP.

> Regards,
> Zhang Renhai
>
>>
>>>
>>> So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR
>>> links flooding. we are considering to
>>> write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could
>>> cooperate.
>>>
>>
>> JP.
>>
>>>
>



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:27:17 +0000
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, "'JP Vasseur'" , "'Mach Chen'" , owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, "ZhangRenhai" 
Subject: Re: Advertising of inter-AS TE links
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: 
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 12:26:41 +0100
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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:03:54 +0000
Message-ID: <058301c73a26$ca1bdb60$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "ZhangRenhai" , "'JP Vasseur'" , "'Mach Chen'" , "Dimitri Papadimitriou" 
Cc: 
Subject: Advertising of inter-AS TE links
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 11:00:53 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="GB2312"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Hi,

Since this discussion is blossoming, it can have its own thread...

I'd like to try to bring some focus.

The motivation seems clear...
When computing a path through one AS into another AS, the computation point 
needs to know about TE links that connect to the next AS. This enables it to 
select:
- A TE link that connects to the next AS
- A TE link that is suitable for the LSP.

Other questions about reachability and TE connectivity across the next AS 
are out of scope and have been defined as problems that PCE is used to 
solve. This is an important point! We are not talking about distributing 
information to provide a graph to compute multi-AS TE paths. That is (IMHO) 
out of scope and what PCE was invented to solve.

I see two scenarios.
1. An ASBR has two links to the next AS.
2. An AS has two ASBRs to the next AS.
In either case, the AS may have multiple ASBRs.

The path computation point must determine:
a. The set of ASBRs that connect to the next AS.
b. Which ASBR to use.
c. Which inter-AS link to use.

Some cases are easy:
- If the ERO already includes the ASBR address
  no choice to be done
- If the ASBR has multiple inter-AS links then
  the choice can be a local matter (no
  advertising required)

But other cases require advertisement of the inter-AS link as a TE link 
with:
- the normal TE information
- an indication that this is an inter-AS link
- the identity of the remote ASBR
- the identity of the remote AS

This information is needed through-out the local AS. That is, although all 
of the ASBRs may be interested for LSPs that entirely cross the local AS, 
and although a PCE could be a BGP speaker, the information is also needed 
for LSPs that are originated within the AS.

Thus we must decide how paths for LSPs that exit the AS will be computed:

- If we require computation by a PCE that
  is (somewhat) centralised within the AS
  we can use BGP to distribute the information
  and require that the PCEs are BGP speakers.
  (Note that the information is only needed
  within the local AS, so we would limit its
  flooding by BGP.)

- If we require computation by any LSR in
  the AS (i.e. PCE function is fully
  distributed) then we require IGP flooding
  of the information across the whole AS.

In both cases the cost is not particularly high since the number of inter-AS 
TE links will not be large.

Thanks,
Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "ZhangRenhai" 
To: "'JP Vasseur'" ; "'Mach Chen'" 
Cc: ; 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2007 4:11 AM
Subject: ´ð¸´: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds


>> > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
>> > about inter-ASBR links flooding.
>> > I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR
>> > links fooding is desired.
>>
>> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an optimization.
>>
>> > But
>> > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
>> > than "normal" TE links do,
>> > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
>> > number and peer ASBR router id
>> > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
>> > rfc3784.
>>
>> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the
>> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.
> [ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take this
> scenario for example:
>
>                     /  ASBR4
> ASBR1--------ASBR2--
>                    \  ASBR3
> ------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------
>
> ASBR2 in AS 1 would only advertise the optimal route received respectively
> from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also doesn't 
> have
> the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is connected to
> and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. PCE would have the
> similar problem when performing the brpc.
> Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain
> containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method for it
> to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2.
>
> Regards,
> Zhang Renhai
>
>>
>> >
>> > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR
>> > links flooding. we are considering to
>> > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could
>> > cooperate.
>> >
>>
>> JP.
>>
>> >
>
>
>
>
>
> 





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To: 'JP Vasseur' , 'Mach Chen' 
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> > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you
> > about inter-ASBR links flooding.
> > I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR
> > links fooding is desired.
> 
> As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an optimization.
> 
> > But
> > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information
> > than "normal" TE links do,
> > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS
> > number and peer ASBR router id
> > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and
> > rfc3784.
> 
> I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the
> IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.
[ZhangRenhai>] maybe BGP is not enough for some circumstance, take this
scenario for example:
                    
                     /  ASBR4
ASBR1--------ASBR2--
                    \  ASBR3
------AS 1----------||-----AS 2----------

ASBR2 in AS 1 would only advertise the optimal route received respectively
from ASBR3 and ASBR4 (both are from AS 2) to ASBR1, ASBR1 also doesn't have
the full knowledge of topology(such as which AS the ASBR2 is connected to
and which router is in that AS)between the two AS. PCE would have the
similar problem when performing the brpc.
Another issue, when ASBR1 receives a path mesg from upstream domain
containing a loose ERO:AS number(say AS2), there should be a method for it
to locate the asbr(say ASBR2) in the local domain connected to AS2. 

Regards,
Zhang Renhai

>  
> >
> > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR
> > links flooding. we are considering to
> > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could
> > cooperate.
> >
> 
> JP.
> 
> >






Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 00:45:48 +0000
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: 
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2007 01:45:11 +0100
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hi adrian - see inline for a couple of clarifications




"Adrian Farrel" 
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
16/01/2007 15:11
Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
 
        To:     Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL
        cc:     
        Subject:        Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds


Hi Dimitri,

Thanks for your observations. We will fold them in with our review (unless 

the authors want to spin a new version first?)

You wrote:

> o) a couple of specific comments
>
>end of section 2:
>

Missing comment?


[dp] yes the following sentence

"the appropriate technique must be driven by the set of
   requirements for the paths attributes and the applicability to a
   particular technique with respect to the deployment scenario"

the beginning of the sentence is not recommending an approach, 
the "must" as indicated becomes authoritative, this sentence is
cyclic and reads 

"the appropriate technique must be driven by the applicability 
to a particular technique with respect to the deployment scenario"

is the term "path attribute" referring to any kind of LSP attr. ?
if yes please state so, if not please use the correct term ?



With regard to the discussion about advertising inter-AS TE links, you are 

right that this needs clarification. I also feel that this I-D is not the 
place to do it. *If* IGP advertisement of inter-AS TE links is supported, 
it 
will need documentation and this I-D can point to it.

[dp] i would agree that the reasoning throughout the draft is deductive
and the proposed method defined for MPLS-TE (how does this works for bi-
directional LSP for inst. when the inter-domain can be crossed by both
bi and unidirectional LSPs) is put in a path.comp context 

[dp] i mean here that beyond the specific per-domain operations the only
protocol addition is an OSPF one (i leave this question to whether needs
for a separate i-d is more appropriate, but the level of detail must be
the same in both cases, not because embedded in this i-d that accurate
description of processing shall be skipped)

Adrian 








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Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
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hi j-p - see inline:





JP Vasseur 
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
16/01/2007 15:42
=20
        To:     Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL
        cc:     "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, =

owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
        Subject:        Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds


Hi Dimitri,

On Jan 13, 2007, at 6:49 AM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be=20
wrote:

> hi adrian
>
> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc
>
> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref.=20
> MPLS-TE
> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1
>
> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])."
>
> and many others in section 4.
>

ok.

> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well=20
> that's
> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to
> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which
> interop issues may result from it
>

Because there are indeed two path computation techniques, it is=20
useful to keep these references in order to provide a fair=20
comparison. We could of course come up with a separate applicability=20
ID, but there are already quite a few related IDs, thus it is=20
preferable to keep the text here. I'll double check if there's any=20
redundancy though.

[dp] i don't think i found much statements clarifying potential
interop aspects - hence the question becomes rather simple=20

either there are prescriptive statements to be provided to ensure=20
interop and henceforth these are to be addressed in this document=20

or these are not prescriptive and hence an applicability document
would also do the job

otherwise there are no statements (interop is not resulting in any
specific behaviour) and then there is no need to perform any sort
of reference to the PCE technique


> o) a couple of specific comments
>
> end of section 2:
>
> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?
>
> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol=20
> are
> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is
> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path
> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still=20
> maintain
> capacity to perform such operation
>
> section 3.3 "The path computation
>    technique described in this document applies to the case of a=20
> single
>    AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
>    areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of simplicity,
>    each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
>    document. "
>
> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples=20
> must
> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these=20
> tutorial
> like material should better go in an appendix -

Not sure why ?

[dp] e.g. the last sentence of the paragraph pointed here above shows
the issue - why this doc considers (from the examples it provides) and
or restricts routing domain (AS) composed by a single area ?


> section 3.1 "In any case,
>    no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between
>    domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is=20
> critical
>    to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case=20
> of TE
>    LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."
>
> then Section 4
> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
>    optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood=20
> the TE
>    information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is
>    enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the
>    inter-ASBR links).  ...
> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
>    corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available
>    in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR=20
> belongs to."
>
> but after
> "Note that no topology
>    information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
>    computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
>    directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."
>
> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?

I'll be happy to clarify. The idea is to flood the TE info for the=20
Inter-AS link(s). Note that this does not contradict the requirements=20
of RFC4216:
(1) Confidentiality relates to the topology of another domain: the TE=20
information flooded in a domain is only augmented by Inter-AS links,=20
not to any link in another domain.
(2) Scalability: of course, flooding the TE info of a few Inter-AS=20
links will not compromise the scalability of the IGP.

> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
> requirements of 4105 and 4216

Did I clarify ? If so, I'll add a paragraph in the ID.

[dp] point 3, you flood the inter-AS information "inside the connected=20
AS" but what is the flooding scope ? - flooding of a link local info
inside the AS that is terminating that end of the link -

[dp] i think that the optimization provided here holds iff that info
is made available to the head-end area of that AS not only the tail-
end area

>
> o) a couple of edits
>
> section 1:
>
> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R
>
> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the
> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like
>
> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS
>  TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."
>
> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs
>
> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of
> specific docs

Thanks for the edits.

JP.

>
> hope this will help,
> - d.
>
>
>
>
> "Adrian Farrel" 
> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> 09/01/2007 23:13
> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>
>         To:     
>         cc:
>         Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
> Hi,
>
> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds:
>
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt
>
> Our plan is:
> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
> 2. Editors apply necessary updates
> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together
>
> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good
> time
> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you=20
> can
> get
> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>
>
>
>






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Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Derek Atkins" 
Cc: , , , , , , , , , 
Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 19:36:34 -0000
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OK

We can write that sentence or three and close the issue.

Thanks for engaging.

Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 6:49 PM
Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


> True, an attacker that sits between the peers shouldn't be able to
> inject messages because the endpoints are authenticated (and I
> presume that the transaction itself has integrity protection).
> You're correct that it is a question of the threat model, and that
> if you DO have a fully trusted set of peers then you don't have to
> worry about this attack.  But if that's the case I'd like to see
> a sentence or three in the Security Considerations section that
> explicitly states this threat model.  Then at least this attack
> would be clearly out of scope.  :)
>
> Thanks!
>
> -derek
>
> "Adrian Farrel"  writes:
>
>> Hi Derek,
>>
>> Yes you have captured the exposure correctly.
>>
>> The question is: what is he trust model between neighbors? If the model 
>> is
>> high enough then the only way for a!=b is a mistake. If the trust model 
>> is
>> not high enough then a!=b could be malicious. If there is a security hole
>> *between* neighbors, b may be modified in transit such that a!=b.
>>
>> I think that in a cooperative singaling protocol we have to assume that
>> there is trust between neighbors once identities have been established.
>> RSVP-TE provides such identity confirmation and also secures the traffic
>> between neighbors.
>>
>> This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't make 
>> extensive
>> protocol changes to handle the potential for broken implementations.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Adrian
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Derek Atkins" 
>> To: "Adrian Farrel" 
>> Cc: ; ;
>> ; ; ;
>> ; ; 
>> ;
>> ; 
>> Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 2:56 PM
>> Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
>>
>>
>>> Adrian,
>>>
>>> The fact that the exchange is secured only means that you've
>>> verified the endpoint, not the data.  For example, let's say
>>> that you and I are endpoints.  I send you "a" and then I restart.
>>> I ask for for my data, we secure the exchange (so I know that
>>> it's you I'm talking to), and then you send me "b".
>>>
>>> The RSVP-TE assures me that YOU sent me "b", but it doesn't
>>> assure me that "b" == "a", what I sent originally.
>>>
>>> Now, one way to solve this problem would be for the originating node
>>> to put their own MAC on their data with a private key known only to
>>> the originating node.  This way when you send me "b" it wouldn't
>>> have my own MAC on it (or the MAC would be invalid, or a timestamp
>>> would be too old).
>>>
>>> Maybe overkill, but if I'm trying to abuse resources I could use
>>> the restart method to backfill my requests.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> -derek
>>>
>>> "Adrian Farrel"  writes:
>>>
>>>> Hi Derek,
>>>>
>>>> I think this is a good question so I am bringing it to the CCAMP list.
>>>>
>>>> The bottom line would appear to be:
>>>> - The exchange between neighbors before restart was
>>>>   secured by normal RSVP-TE means
>>>> - The exchange after restart is secured by the same means.
>>>> - This provides a degree of protection that the restarting
>>>>   node is receiving information that it originally sent to
>>>>   its neighbor.
>>>>
>>>> The obvious question is, should the restarting node have some
>>>> (private) way
>>>> of authenticating that the information received on restart
>>>> originated with
>>>> it? This would presumably be some sort of cookie manufactured from
>>>> a mock-up
>>>> of the restart message that the restarting node expects to receive and
>>>> handed to the neighbor for use in the event of a restart.
>>>>
>>>> Seems like overkill to me, but I'd appreciate views from the WG.
>>>>
>>>> Adrian
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Derek Atkins" 
>>>> To: ; 
>>>> Cc: ; ;
>>>> ; ;
>>>> ;
>>>> ; 
>>>> Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 10:59 PM
>>>> Subject: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's
>>>>> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
>>>>> IESG.  These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the
>>>>> security area directors.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat
>>>>> these comments just like any other last call comments.
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't see any issues in this document beyond those already stated
>>>>> in the Security Considerations.
>>>>>
>>>>> My only question to the authors would be how does a recovering node
>>>>> verify that the data it gets from a peer node really came from the
>>>>> recovering node?  Right now it just seems to have to trust that the
>>>>> peer returns valid data.
>>>>>
>>>>> -derek
>
> -- 
>       Derek Atkins                 617-623-3745
>       derek@ihtfp.com             www.ihtfp.com
>       Computer and Internet Security Consultant
>
>
> 





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Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
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Hi Mach,

On Jan 15, 2007, at 11:16 PM, Mach Chen wrote:

> Hi Peng,
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Peng He" 
>> To: "Mach Chen" 
>> Cc: ; "Adrian Farrel" =20
>> ; ; > ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2007 11:17 AM
>> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
>> Hello Mach,
>
>> I understood that the path compute element(Head-end, ASBR, or PCE)
>> should  have the inter-ASBR links info to compute an optimal or
>> near-optimal inter-domain path.
>
>> You said "But I think the inter-ASBR link should have AS flooding
>> scope." What do you mean by "AS flooding scope"? Is it within an =20
>> AS or
>> among ASes? If within an AS, then that's the example shown in the
>> third document and mentioned in Dimitri's questions; if among ASes,
>> then how many ASes would be enough?
>
> I means it's just within an AS, and it's enough for those proposed
> path computation methods, e.g: Per-Domain, BRPC, etc.
>

So far, we're in sync, and this is what the ID points out. I'll =20
clarify this part to avoid confusion.

> If such inter-ASBR links are flooded among ASes, there would be =20
> scalabilty
> and confidentiality issues.

No (see my previous emails).

Thanks.

JP.

>
>> I just guess the contents of inter-AS link info to be flooded seems
>> easily to be decided (consider it as a special intra-AS TE link with
>> AS # attached), and might just need a simple document to define it;
>> the difficult thing is the flooding scope, which might be varied with
>> different path computing approaches or even the agreement among
>> operators.  Still seems to me hard to define a standard to rule it.
>> Or, leave every options open?
>
>
>
>> Regards,
>> Peng
>
> On 1/15/07, Mach Chen  wrote:
>> Hi Peng,
>>
>> I means that no matter what kind of path computation methods(Per-=20
>> domain, BRPC, etc.) we adopt,
>> if we want to compute a path spaning mutiple ASes, the compute =20
>> element(Head-end, ASBR, or PCE)
>> SHOULD get the inter-ASBR links info.
>>
>> With respect to the flooding scope and specification of inter-ASBR =20=

>> links info,  we need more discussion.
>> But I think the inter-ASBR link should have AS flooding scope.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Peng He" 
>> To: "Mach Chen" 
>> Cc: ; "Adrian Farrel" =20
>> ; ; > ccamp@ops.ietf.org>
>> Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 11:26 AM
>> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>>
>>
>> Hello Mach,
>>
>> I am interested in such work. But I am not sure what you said "in =20
>> oder
>> to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links fooding is
>> desired", say, different computing methods might need different
>> information about the inter-AS links and various flood ranges, and if
>> not a general method is considered as default, it seems to me hard to
>> define what exact info should be flooded. Just my personal thoughts.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Peng
>>
>> On 1/14/07, Mach Chen  wrote:
>>> Dimitri and all,
>>>
>>> After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you =20
>>> about inter-ASBR links flooding.
>>> I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-=20
>>> ASBR links fooding is desired. But
>>> such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information =20=

>>> than "normal" TE links do,
>>> e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS =20
>>> number and peer ASBR router id
>>> besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and =20
>>> rfc3784.
>>>
>>> So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-=20
>>> ASBR links flooding. we are considering to
>>> write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we =20
>>> could cooperate.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> Mach
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: 
>>> To: "Adrian Farrel" 
>>> Cc: ; 
>>> Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 7:49 PM
>>> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>>>
>>>
>>> hi adrian
>>>
>>> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc
>>>
>>> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. =20
>>> MPLS-TE
>>> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1
>>>
>>> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE =20
>>> ([RFC3209])."
>>>
>>> and many others in section 4.
>>>
>>> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - =20
>>> well that's
>>> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose =20
>>> is to
>>> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which
>>> interop issues may result from it
>>>
>>> o) a couple of specific comments
>>>
>>> end of section 2:
>>>
>>> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
>>> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?
>>>
>>> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling =20
>>> protocol are
>>> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a =20
>>> node is
>>> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no =20
>>> path
>>> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still =20=

>>> maintain
>>> capacity to perform such operation
>>>
>>> section 3.3 "The path computation
>>>    technique described in this document applies to the case of a =20
>>> single
>>>    AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
>>>    areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of =20
>>> simplicity,
>>>    each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
>>>    document. "
>>>
>>> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these =20
>>> examples must
>>> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these =20
>>> tutorial
>>> like material should better go in an appendix -
>>>
>>> section 3.1 "In any case,
>>>    no topology or resource information needs to be distributed =20
>>> between
>>>    domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is =20
>>> critical
>>>    to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the =20
>>> case of TE
>>>    LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."
>>>
>>> then Section 4
>>> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
>>>    optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood =20=

>>> the TE
>>>    information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP =20
>>> TE is
>>>    enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency =20
>>> over the
>>>    inter-ASBR links).  ...
>>> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
>>>    corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made =20
>>> available
>>>    in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR =20
>>> belongs to."
>>>
>>> but after
>>> "Note that no topology
>>>    information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
>>>    computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
>>>    directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."
>>>
>>> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?
>>> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
>>> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
>>> requirements of 4105 and 4216
>>>
>>>
>>> o) a couple of edits
>>>
>>> section 1:
>>>
>>> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R
>>>
>>> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found =20
>>> in the
>>> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like
>>>
>>> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to =20
>>> MPLS
>>>  TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."
>>>
>>> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs
>>>
>>> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a =20
>>> set of
>>> specific docs
>>>
>>> hope this will help,
>>> - d.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Adrian Farrel" 
>>> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
>>> 09/01/2007 23:13
>>> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>>>
>>>         To:     
>>>         cc:
>>>         Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling =20
>>> I-Ds:
>>>
>>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
>>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
>>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt
>>>
>>> Our plan is:
>>> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
>>> 2. Editors apply necessary updates
>>> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together
>>>
>>> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a =20=

>>> good
>>> time
>>> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if =20
>>> you can
>>> get
>>> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Adrian
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Mach
>



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From: JP Vasseur 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:50:38 -0500
To: Mach Chen 
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Hi,

On Jan 14, 2007, at 9:41 PM, Mach Chen wrote:

> Dimitri and all,
>
> After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you =20
> about inter-ASBR links flooding.
> I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR =20
> links fooding is desired.

As pointed out in the document, this is not a MUST, but an optimization.

> But
> such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information =20
> than "normal" TE links do,
> e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS =20
> number and peer ASBR router id
> besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and =20
> rfc3784.

I don't think that the peer AS number info should be included in the =20
IGP for sure. You should rely on BGP for that purpose.

>
> So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR =20
> links flooding. we are considering to
> write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could =20=

> cooperate.
>

JP.

>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Mach
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: 
> To: "Adrian Farrel" 
> Cc: ; 
> Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 7:49 PM
> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
> hi adrian
>
> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc
>
> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. =20
> MPLS-TE
> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1
>
> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])."
>
> and many others in section 4.
>
> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well =20
> that's
> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to
> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which
> interop issues may result from it
>
> o) a couple of specific comments
>
> end of section 2:
>
> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?
>
> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol =20=

> are
> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is
> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path
> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still =20
> maintain
> capacity to perform such operation
>
> section 3.3 "The path computation
>    technique described in this document applies to the case of a =20
> single
>    AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
>    areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of simplicity,
>    each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
>    document. "
>
> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples =20
> must
> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these =20
> tutorial
> like material should better go in an appendix -
>
> section 3.1 "In any case,
>    no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between
>    domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is =20
> critical
>    to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case =20
> of TE
>    LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."
>
> then Section 4
> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
>    optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood =20
> the TE
>    information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is
>    enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the
>    inter-ASBR links).  ...
> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
>    corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available
>    in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR =20
> belongs to."
>
> but after
> "Note that no topology
>    information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
>    computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
>    directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."
>
> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?
> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
> requirements of 4105 and 4216
>
>
> o) a couple of edits
>
> section 1:
>
> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R
>
> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the
> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like
>
> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS
>  TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."
>
> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs
>
> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of
> specific docs
>
> hope this will help,
> - d.
>
>
>
>
> "Adrian Farrel" 
> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> 09/01/2007 23:13
> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>
>         To:     
>         cc:
>         Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
> Hi,
>
> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds:
>
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt
>
> Our plan is:
> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
> 2. Editors apply necessary updates
> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together
>
> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good
> time
> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you =20=

> can
> get
> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>
>
>
>
>
>



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From: JP Vasseur 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:48:24 -0500
To: Peng He 
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Hi Peng,

On Jan 13, 2007, at 9:55 AM, Peng He wrote:

> Hi,
>
> Sill about the the third doc:
>
> 1. in the "3.1.  Common assumptions" part, it is assumed that
> "Boundary LSRs are assumed to be capable of performing local path
> computation ..." . So I guess that ABR or ASBR has the function (or
> part of) of PCE.
>
> 2. My understanding to Dimitri's questions:
> I believe there is flooding here but only within the domain that the
> ASBR belongs to.

Right.

> So now a domain includes non-ABSR LSRs and ABSR LSRs
> and the links among them, AND the inter-domain links originating (not
> terminating) from the ASBRS of this domain. Tthe flooding is among
> these LSRs, but not between domains. So, it is still can be considered
> as intra-domain flooding and it happens when the TE info changes I
> guess.
>

This is right.

Example:

<---- AS 1 --->                    <--- AS 2 ---->
                     ASBR1----ASBR2

ASBR1 advertises in AS1 the links that belongs to AS1 + the ASBR1-=20
ASBR2 links.
Same thing for ASBR2.

> 3. The purpose of the above is to "improve the chance of successful
> signaling along the next AS in case of resource  shortage ..." I
> understand this, I just want to mention that it seems only true in
> theory and the practical effect is not so good as expected. I
> simulated this years ago when we extended DCR into inter-domain case
> and just no encouraging results found.

It of course depends of the assumptions that you used in your =20
simulations (topology, TMs, ...) but flooding that piece of data can =20
only improve the success rate of course. To what extent ? That =20
depends of a few parameters. For example, if your Inter-ASBR are over-=20=

provisioned, that won't help since the cause of CAC rejection is not =20
likely to be because of insufficient bandwidth on your links but =20
there are certainly cases where this can happen, in which case this =20
will help.

Thanks.

JP.

>
> Regards,
> Peng
>
>
>> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
>> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
>> requirements of 4105 and 4216
>
>
>
> On 1/13/07, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
>  wrote:
>> hi adrian
>>
>> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc
>>
>> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. =20
>> MPLS-TE
>> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1
>>
>> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])."
>>
>> and many others in section 4.
>>
>> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well =20=

>> that's
>> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose =20
>> is to
>> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which
>> interop issues may result from it
>>
>> o) a couple of specific comments
>>
>> end of section 2:
>>
>> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
>> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?
>>
>> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling =20
>> protocol are
>> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a =20
>> node is
>> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path
>> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still =20
>> maintain
>> capacity to perform such operation
>>
>> section 3.3 "The path computation
>>    technique described in this document applies to the case of a =20
>> single
>>    AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
>>    areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of =20
>> simplicity,
>>    each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
>>    document. "
>>
>> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples =20=

>> must
>> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these =20
>> tutorial
>> like material should better go in an appendix -
>>
>> section 3.1 "In any case,
>>    no topology or resource information needs to be distributed =20
>> between
>>    domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is =20
>> critical
>>    to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case =20=

>> of TE
>>    LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."
>>
>> then Section 4
>> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
>>    optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood =20
>> the TE
>>    information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP =20
>> TE is
>>    enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over =20=

>> the
>>    inter-ASBR links).  ...
>> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
>>    corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made =20
>> available
>>    in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR =20
>> belongs to."
>>
>> but after
>> "Note that no topology
>>    information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
>>    computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
>>    directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."
>>
>> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?
>> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
>> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
>> requirements of 4105 and 4216
>>
>>
>> o) a couple of edits
>>
>> section 1:
>>
>> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R
>>
>> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in =20=

>> the
>> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like
>>
>> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS
>>  TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."
>>
>> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs
>>
>> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of
>> specific docs
>>
>> hope this will help,
>> - d.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Adrian Farrel" 
>> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
>> 09/01/2007 23:13
>> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>>
>>         To:     
>>         cc:
>>         Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-=20=

>> Ds:
>>
>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
>> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt
>>
>> Our plan is:
>> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
>> 2. Editors apply necessary updates
>> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together
>>
>> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a =20
>> good
>> time
>> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if =20
>> you can
>> get
>> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Adrian
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>



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From: JP Vasseur 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 09:42:57 -0500
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Hi Dimitri,

On Jan 13, 2007, at 6:49 AM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be =20
wrote:

> hi adrian
>
> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc
>
> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. =20
> MPLS-TE
> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1
>
> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])."
>
> and many others in section 4.
>

ok.

> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well =20
> that's
> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to
> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which
> interop issues may result from it
>

Because there are indeed two path computation techniques, it is =20
useful to keep these references in order to provide a fair =20
comparison. We could of course come up with a separate applicability =20
ID, but there are already quite a few related IDs, thus it is =20
preferable to keep the text here. I'll double check if there's any =20
redundancy though.

> o) a couple of specific comments
>
> end of section 2:
>
> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?
>
> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol =20=

> are
> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is
> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path
> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still =20
> maintain
> capacity to perform such operation
>
> section 3.3 "The path computation
>    technique described in this document applies to the case of a =20
> single
>    AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
>    areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of simplicity,
>    each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
>    document. "
>
> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples =20
> must
> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these =20
> tutorial
> like material should better go in an appendix -

Not sure why ?

>
> section 3.1 "In any case,
>    no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between
>    domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is =20
> critical
>    to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case =20
> of TE
>    LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."
>
> then Section 4
> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
>    optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood =20
> the TE
>    information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is
>    enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the
>    inter-ASBR links).  ...
> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
>    corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available
>    in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR =20
> belongs to."
>
> but after
> "Note that no topology
>    information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
>    computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
>    directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."
>
> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?

I'll be happy to clarify. The idea is to flood the TE info for the =20
Inter-AS link(s). Note that this does not contradict the requirements =20=

of RFC4216:
(1) Confidentiality relates to the topology of another domain: the TE =20=

information flooded in a domain is only augmented by Inter-AS links, =20
not to any link in another domain.
(2) Scalability: of course, flooding the TE info of a few Inter-AS =20
links will not compromise the scalability of the IGP.

> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
> requirements of 4105 and 4216
>

Did I clarify ? If so, I'll add a paragraph in the ID.

>
> o) a couple of edits
>
> section 1:
>
> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R
>
> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the
> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like
>
> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS
>  TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."
>
> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs
>
> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of
> specific docs

Thanks for the edits.

JP.

>
> hope this will help,
> - d.
>
>
>
>
> "Adrian Farrel" 
> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> 09/01/2007 23:13
> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>
>         To:     
>         cc:
>         Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
> Hi,
>
> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds:
>
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt
>
> Our plan is:
> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
> 2. Editors apply necessary updates
> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together
>
> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good
> time
> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you =20=

> can
> get
> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>
>
>
>



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:32:32 +0000
Message-ID: <03b901c7397a$b9fa7220$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Cc: 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:11:33 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Dimitri,

Thanks for your observations. We will fold them in with our review (unless 
the authors want to spin a new version first?)

You wrote:

> o) a couple of specific comments
>
>end of section 2:
>

Missing comment?


With regard to the discussion about advertising inter-AS TE links, you are 
right that this needs clarification. I also feel that this I-D is not the 
place to do it. *If* IGP advertisement of inter-AS TE links is supported, it 
will need documentation and this I-D can point to it.


Adrian 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:32:27 +0000
Message-ID: <03b801c7397a$b1ae1e00$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Derek Atkins" 
Cc: , , , , , , , , , 
Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:03:23 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Derek,

Yes you have captured the exposure correctly.

The question is: what is he trust model between neighbors? If the model is 
high enough then the only way for a!=b is a mistake. If the trust model is 
not high enough then a!=b could be malicious. If there is a security hole 
*between* neighbors, b may be modified in transit such that a!=b.

I think that in a cooperative singaling protocol we have to assume that 
there is trust between neighbors once identities have been established. 
RSVP-TE provides such identity confirmation and also secures the traffic 
between neighbors.

This leaves us with only the mistake, and generally we don't make extensive 
protocol changes to handle the potential for broken implementations.

Thanks,
Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 2:56 PM
Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


> Adrian,
>
> The fact that the exchange is secured only means that you've
> verified the endpoint, not the data.  For example, let's say
> that you and I are endpoints.  I send you "a" and then I restart.
> I ask for for my data, we secure the exchange (so I know that
> it's you I'm talking to), and then you send me "b".
>
> The RSVP-TE assures me that YOU sent me "b", but it doesn't
> assure me that "b" == "a", what I sent originally.
>
> Now, one way to solve this problem would be for the originating node
> to put their own MAC on their data with a private key known only to
> the originating node.  This way when you send me "b" it wouldn't
> have my own MAC on it (or the MAC would be invalid, or a timestamp
> would be too old).
>
> Maybe overkill, but if I'm trying to abuse resources I could use
> the restart method to backfill my requests.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -derek
>
> "Adrian Farrel"  writes:
>
>> Hi Derek,
>>
>> I think this is a good question so I am bringing it to the CCAMP list.
>>
>> The bottom line would appear to be:
>> - The exchange between neighbors before restart was
>>   secured by normal RSVP-TE means
>> - The exchange after restart is secured by the same means.
>> - This provides a degree of protection that the restarting
>>   node is receiving information that it originally sent to
>>   its neighbor.
>>
>> The obvious question is, should the restarting node have some (private) 
>> way
>> of authenticating that the information received on restart originated 
>> with
>> it? This would presumably be some sort of cookie manufactured from a 
>> mock-up
>> of the restart message that the restarting node expects to receive and
>> handed to the neighbor for use in the event of a restart.
>>
>> Seems like overkill to me, but I'd appreciate views from the WG.
>>
>> Adrian
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Derek Atkins" 
>> To: ; 
>> Cc: ; ;
>> ; ; 
>> ;
>> ; 
>> Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 10:59 PM
>> Subject: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
>>
>>
>>>I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's
>>> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
>>> IESG.  These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the
>>> security area directors.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat
>>> these comments just like any other last call comments.
>>>
>>> I don't see any issues in this document beyond those already stated
>>> in the Security Considerations.
>>>
>>> My only question to the authors would be how does a recovering node
>>> verify that the data it gets from a peer node really came from the
>>> recovering node?  Right now it just seems to have to trust that the
>>> peer returns valid data.
>>>
>>> -derek
>>> -- 
>>>       Derek Atkins                 617-623-3745
>>>       derek@ihtfp.com             www.ihtfp.com
>>>       Computer and Internet Security Consultant
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> -- 
>       Derek Atkins, SB '93 MIT EE, SM '95 MIT Media Laboratory
>       Member, MIT Student Information Processing Board  (SIPB)
>       URL: http://web.mit.edu/warlord/    PP-ASEL-IA     N1NWH
>       warlord@MIT.EDU                        PGP key available
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 04:17:07 +0000
Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 12:16:12 +0800
From: Mach Chen 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
To: Peng He 
Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, Adrian Farrel , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Message-id: <01dd01c73925$0f14c0e0$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com>
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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 16 Jan 2007 03:20:13 +0000
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Message-ID: <406e32c00701151917h2418c03ei1fa706118d388df6@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 22:17:31 -0500
From: "Peng He" 
To: "Mach Chen" 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be,  "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org,  owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Disposition: inline

Hello Mach,

I understood that the path compute element(Head-end, ASBR, or PCE)
should  have the inter-ASBR links info to compute an optimal or
near-optimal inter-domain path.

You said "But I think the inter-ASBR link should have AS flooding
scope." What do you mean by "AS flooding scope"? Is it within an AS or
among ASes? If within an AS, then that's the example shown in the
third document and mentioned in Dimitri's questions; if among ASes,
then how many ASes would be enough?

I just guess the contents of inter-AS link info to be flooded seems
easily to be decided (consider it as a special intra-AS TE link with
AS # attached), and might just need a simple document to define it;
the difficult thing is the flooding scope, which might be varied with
different path computing approaches or even the agreement among
operators.  Still seems to me hard to define a standard to rule it.
Or, leave every options open?

Regards,
Peng

On 1/15/07, Mach Chen  wrote:
> Hi Peng,
>
> I means that no matter what kind of path computation methods(Per-domain, =
BRPC, etc.) we adopt,
> if we want to compute a path spaning mutiple ASes, the compute element(He=
ad-end, ASBR, or PCE)
> SHOULD get the inter-ASBR links info.
>
> With respect to the flooding scope and specification of inter-ASBR links =
info,  we need more discussion.
> But I think the inter-ASBR link should have AS flooding scope.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peng He" 
> To: "Mach Chen" 
> Cc: ; "Adrian Farrel" ; ; 
> Sent: Monday, January 15, 2007 11:26 AM
> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
> Hello Mach,
>
> I am interested in such work. But I am not sure what you said "in oder
> to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links fooding is
> desired", say, different computing methods might need different
> information about the inter-AS links and various flood ranges, and if
> not a general method is considered as default, it seems to me hard to
> define what exact info should be flooded. Just my personal thoughts.
>
> Regards,
> Peng
>
> On 1/14/07, Mach Chen  wrote:
> > Dimitri and all,
> >
> > After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you about in=
ter-ASBR links flooding.
> > I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR link=
s fooding is desired. But
> > such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information than =
"normal" TE links do,
> > e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS number =
and peer ASBR router id
> > besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and rfc3784=
.
> >
> > So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR link=
s flooding. we are considering to
> > write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could coo=
perate.
> >
> >
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Mach
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: 
> > To: "Adrian Farrel" 
> > Cc: ; 
> > Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 7:49 PM
> > Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
> >
> >
> > hi adrian
> >
> > o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc
> >
> > - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. MPLS-T=
E
> > signaling further on e.g. section 3.1
> >
> > " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])."
> >
> > and many others in section 4.
> >
> > - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well that=
's
> > fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to
> > indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which
> > interop issues may result from it
> >
> > o) a couple of specific comments
> >
> > end of section 2:
> >
> > section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
> > -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?
> >
> > last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol a=
re
> > independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is
> > an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path
> > to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still maint=
ain
> > capacity to perform such operation
> >
> > section 3.3 "The path computation
> >    technique described in this document applies to the case of a single
> >    AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
> >    areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of simplicity,
> >    each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
> >    document. "
> >
> > -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples must
> > remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these tutorial
> > like material should better go in an appendix -
> >
> > section 3.1 "In any case,
> >    no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between
> >    domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is critical
> >    to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case of T=
E
> >    LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."
> >
> > then Section 4
> > "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
> >    optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood the T=
E
> >    information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is
> >    enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the
> >    inter-ASBR links).  ...
> > "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
> >    corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available
> >    in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR belongs to=
."
> >
> > but after
> > "Note that no topology
> >    information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
> >    computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
> >    directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."
> >
> > -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?
> > 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
> > scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
> > requirements of 4105 and 4216
> >
> >
> > o) a couple of edits
> >
> > section 1:
> >
> > ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R
> >
> > the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the
> > frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like
> >
> > "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS
> >  TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."
> >
> > ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs
> >
> > state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of
> > specific docs
> >
> > hope this will help,
> > - d.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "Adrian Farrel" 
> > Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> > 09/01/2007 23:13
> > Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
> >
> >         To:     
> >         cc:
> >         Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds:
> >
> > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
> > - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
> > - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt
> >
> > Our plan is:
> > 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
> > 2. Editors apply necessary updates
> > 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together
> >
> > If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good
> > time
> > to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can
> > get
> > any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Adrian
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:35:22 +0000
From: The IESG 
To: IETF-Announce 
Cc: Internet Architecture Board , RFC Editor , ccamp mailing list , ccamp chair 
Subject: Protocol Action: 'RSVP-TE Extensions in support of  End-to-End Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS)  Recovery' to Proposed Standard 
Message-Id: 
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 16:32:22 -0500

The IESG has approved the following document:

- 'RSVP-TE Extensions in support of End-to-End Generalized Multi-Protocol 
   Label Switching (GMPLS) Recovery '
    as a Proposed Standard

This document is the product of the Common Control and Measurement Plane 
Working Group. 

The IESG contact persons are Ross Callon and Bill Fenner.

A URL of this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt

Technical Summary
 
   This document describes protocol specific procedures and extensions 
   for Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching (GMPLS) Resource 
   ReserVation Protocol - Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE) signaling to 
   support end-to-end Label Switched Path (LSP) recovery that denotes 
   protection and restoration. A generic functional description of 
   GMPLS recovery can be found in a companion document, RFC 4426. 
 
Working Group Summary
 
   no dissent reported. Many vendors have implemented and many 
   networks have deployed some versions of this. 
 
Protocol Quality
 
   Ross Callon reviewed this for the IESG. There are multiple 
   interoperable implementations and deployment. 

Note to RFC Editor
 
   Note, this document and one other document 
   (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-03.txt) should be 
   progressed together. This document references the other document.
   Progressing together will ensure the RFC Ed can sort out details.

   Also, please see significant IANA note. 

IANA Note

   There are significant IANA considerations, which have been cleared 
   up by Adrian Farrel's email to the IANA on Thu, 14 Dec 2006 10:52:16.

   His explanation of IANA considerations are (cut and pasted from the 
   attachment to Adrian's email):

IANA requests for

[e2e]     draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt
[seg]     draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-03.txt


All other references are provided for information and context.


====================================================


Registry: RSVP
          Class Names, Class Numbers, and Class Types

  20  EXPLICIT_ROUTE                          [RFC3209]

        Class Types or C-Types:
          1   Type 1 Explicit Route           [RFC3209]

              Sub-object type
                1   IPv4 prefix               [RFC3209]
                2   IPv6 prefix               [RFC3209]
                3   Label                     [RFC3473]
                4   Unnumbered Interface ID   [RFC3477]
               32   Autonomous system number  [RFC3209]
               37   Reserved                  [seg]

  21  ROUTE_RECORD                            [RFC3209]
      (also known as RECORD_ROUTE)

      Class Types or C-Types:
          1   Type 1 Route Record             [RFC3209]

              Sub-object type
                1   IPv4 address              [RFC3209]
                2   IPv6 address              [RFC3209]
                3   Label                     [RFC3473]
                4   Unnumbered Interface ID   [RFC3477]
                5   RRO Attributes            [RFC4420]
               37   Reserved                  [seg]

  37  PROTECTION                              [RFC3473]

      Class Types or C-Types:
        1   Type 1 Protection                 [RFC3473]
        2   Type 2                            [e2e]

  38  PRIMARY PATH ROUTE                      [e2e]

      Class Types or C-Types:
        1   Type 1 Primary Path Route         [e2e]

 198  ALARM_SPEC                              [RFC4783]

      Class Types or C-Types:
        1   Type 1  RESERVED                  [RFC4783]
        2   Type 2  RESERVED                  [RFC4783]
        3   IPv4 IF_ID ALARM_SPEC             [RFC4783]
        4   IPv6 IF_ID ALARM_SPEC             [RFC4783]

 199  ASSOCIATION                             [e2e]

      Class Types or C-Types:
        1   Type 1 IPv4 Association           [e2e]
        2   Type 2 IPv6 Association           [e2e]

 200  SECONDARY_EXPLICIT_ROUTE                [seg]

      Same C-Type values as EXPLICIT_ROUTE object
      (C-Num 20) with the following additions:

        For Class 1, C-Type 1, the following additional
        Sub-object type is defined:

           Sub-object type
            37   Protection                   [seg]

 201  SECONDARY_RECORD_ROUTE                  [seg]

      Same C-Type values as EXPLICIT_ROUTE object
      (C-Num 20) with the following additions:

        For Class 1, C-Type 1, the following additional
        Sub-object type is defined:

           Sub-object type
            37   Protection                   [seg]

============================================================

Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters
          Interface_ID Types

  Type  Length  Format      Description                 Reference
  ----  ------  ----------  --------------------------  ---------
   512       8  See below   REFERENCE_COUNT             [RFC4783]
   513       8  See below   SEVERITY                    [RFC4783]
   514       8  See below   GLOBAL_TIMESTAMP            [RFC4783]
   515       8  See below   LOCAL_TIMESTAMP             [RFC4783]
   516  varies  See below   ERROR_STRING                [RFC4783]

============================================================

Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters
          Administrative Status Information Flags

  Value       Name                             Reference
  ----------- -------------------------------- ---------
  0x80000000  Reflect (R)                      [RFC3473][RFC3471]
  0x00000020  Lockout (L)                      [e2e]
  0x00000010  Inhibit Alarm Communication (I)  [RFC4783]
  0x00000004  Testing (T)                      [RFC3473][RFC3471]
  0x00000002  Administratively down (A)        [RFC3473][RFC3471]
  0x00000001  Deletion in progress (D)         [RFC3473][RFC3471]


============================================================

Registry: RSVP
          Error Codes and Values

Error Code Meaning

  01 Admission Control Failure                [RFC2205]

      The sixteen bits of the Error Value field are
        ssur cccc cccc cccc
      as defined in [RFC2205]

        The following globally-defined sub-codes may appear in the low-
        order 12 bits when ssur = 0000:

        Sub-code  Meaning                         Reference
        --------  ------------------------------  ---------
               1  Delay bound cannot be met       [RFC2205]
               2  Requested bandwidth unavailable [RFC2205]
               3  MTU in flowspec larger than     [RFC2205]
                  interface MTU
               4  LSP Admission Failure           [e2e]
               5  Bad Association Type            [e2e]

  02 Policy Control Failure                   [RFC2205]

      This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error
      Value sub-codes:

        0 = Information reporting                 [RFC2750]
        1 = Warning                               [RFC2750]
        2 = Reason unknown                        [RFC2750]
        3 = Generic Policy Rejection              [RFC2750]
        4 = Quota or Accounting violation         [RFC2750]
        5 = Flow was preempted                    [RFC2750]
        6 = Previously installed policy expired   [RFC2750]
            (not refreshed)
        7 = Previous policy data was replaced &   [RFC2750]
            caused rejection
        8 = Policies could not be merged          [RFC2750]
            (multicast)
        9 = PDP down or non functioning           [RFC2750]
       10 = Third Party Server (e.g., Kerberos)   [RFC2750]
            unavailable
       11 = POLICY_DATA object has bad syntax     [RFC2750]
       12 = POLICY_DATA object failed Integrity   [RFC2750]
            Check
       13 = POLICY_ELEMENT object has bad syntax  [RFC2750]
       14 = Mandatory PE Missing (Empty PE is in  [RFC2750]
            the PD object)
       15 = PEP Out of resources to handle        [RFC2750]
            policies.
       16 = PDP encountered bad RSVP objects or   [RFC2750]
            syntax
       17 = Service type was rejected             [RFC2750]
       18 = Reservation Style was rejected        [RFC2750]
       19 = FlowSpec was rejected (too large)     [RFC2750]
       20 = Hard Pre-empted                       [e2e]

  24 Routing Problem                          [RFC3209]

      This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error
      Value sub-codes:

        1 = Bad EXPLICIT_ROUTE object         [RFC3209]
        : (snip)
       16 = Unknown Interface Index           [RFC3477]
       17 = Unsupported LSP Protection        [e2e]
       18 = PROTECTION object not applicable  [e2e]
       19 = Bad PRIMARY PATH_ROUTE object     [e2e]
       20 = PRIMARY PATH_ROUTE object not     [e2e]
            applicable
       21 = LSP Segment Protection Failed     [seg]

  25 Notify Error                             [RFC3209]

      This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error
      Value sub-codes:

        1 = RRO too large for MTU             [RFC3209]
        2 = RRO Notification                  [RFC3209]
        3 = Tunnel locally repaired           [RFC3209]
        4 = Control Channel Active State      [RFC3473]
        5 = Control Channel Degraded State    [RFC3473]
        6 = Preferable path exists            [RFC4736]
        7 = Local link maintenance required   [RFC4736]
        8 = Local node maintenance required   [RFC4736]
        9 = LSP Failure                       [e2e]
       10 = LSP Recovered                     [e2e]
       11 = LSP Locally Failed                [e2e]

  31 Alarms                                   [RFC4783]

      The Error Value sub-codes for this Error Code
      have values and meanings identical to the values
      and meanings defined in the IANAItuProbableCause
      Textual Convention of IANA-ITU-ALARM-TC-MIB
      in the Alarm MIB [RFC3877].

============================================================

Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters
          Association Type
(This is a new registry)

   Assignment by IANA are subject to IETF expert review
   process i.e. IETF Standards Track RFC Action.

   Value   Type                 Reference
   -----   -----------------    ---------
       0   Reserved             [e2e]
       1   Recovery (R)         [e2e]
       2   Resource Sharing (R) [seg]




Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 21:35:15 +0000
From: The IESG 
To: IETF-Announce 
Cc: Internet Architecture Board , RFC Editor , ccamp mailing list , ccamp chair 
Subject: Protocol Action: 'GMPLS Based Segment Recovery' to  Proposed Standard 
Message-Id: 
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 16:33:52 -0500

The IESG has approved the following document:

- 'GMPLS Based Segment Recovery '
    as a Proposed Standard

This document is the product of the Common Control and Measurement Plane 
Working Group. 

The IESG contact persons are Ross Callon and Bill Fenner.

A URL of this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-03.txt

Technical Summary
 
   This document describes protocol specific procedures for GMPLS
   (Generalized Multi-Protocol Label Switching) RSVP-TE (Resource
   ReserVation Protocol - Traffic Engineering) signaling extensions to
   support label switched path (LSP) segment protection and restoration.
   These extensions are intended to complement and be consistent with
   the Extensions for End-to-End GMPLS-based Recovery.  Implications and
   interactions with Fast Reroute are also addressed.  This document
   also updates the handling of Notify_Request objects.

Working Group Summary
 
  No dissent reported. Good WG consensus. 
 
Protocol Quality
 
  Ross Callon has reviewed this for the IESG. There are multiple 
  implementations and deployment. 

Note to RFC Editor
 
  Note, this document and one other document 
  (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt) should be   
  progressed together. This document references the other document. 
  Progressing together will ensure the RFC Ed can sort out details, 
  including cross-references between the two documents. 

  There is an IANA nit that will need to be fixed (see IANA note below).

  Also, the reference to draft-lang-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling 
  should be corrected to draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling 

IANA Note

  There is an IANA nit that will need to be fixed. In particular:
  sections 9.3 and 9.4 suggest the same value (198) for the
  SECONDARY_EXPLICIT_ROUTE and SECONDARY_RECORD_ROUTE objects.
  Also, I am told that this value has already (recently) been 
  assigned to an unrelated object. Thus, the IANA will need to 
  straighten this out. These and related IANA considerations have
  been cleared up by Adrian Farrel's email to the IANA on Thu, 14 
  Dec 2006 10:52:16.

  His explanation of IANA considerations are (cut and pasted from the 
  attachment to Adrian's email):

IANA requests for

[e2e]     draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt
[seg]     draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-segment-recovery-03.txt


All other references are provided for information and context.


====================================================


Registry: RSVP
          Class Names, Class Numbers, and Class Types

  20  EXPLICIT_ROUTE                          [RFC3209]

        Class Types or C-Types:
          1   Type 1 Explicit Route           [RFC3209]

              Sub-object type
                1   IPv4 prefix               [RFC3209]
                2   IPv6 prefix               [RFC3209]
                3   Label                     [RFC3473]
                4   Unnumbered Interface ID   [RFC3477]
               32   Autonomous system number  [RFC3209]
               37   Reserved                  [seg]

  21  ROUTE_RECORD                            [RFC3209]
      (also known as RECORD_ROUTE)

      Class Types or C-Types:
          1   Type 1 Route Record             [RFC3209]

              Sub-object type
                1   IPv4 address              [RFC3209]
                2   IPv6 address              [RFC3209]
                3   Label                     [RFC3473]
                4   Unnumbered Interface ID   [RFC3477]
                5   RRO Attributes            [RFC4420]
               37   Reserved                  [seg]

  37  PROTECTION                              [RFC3473]

      Class Types or C-Types:
        1   Type 1 Protection                 [RFC3473]
        2   Type 2                            [e2e]

  38  PRIMARY PATH ROUTE                      [e2e]

      Class Types or C-Types:
        1   Type 1 Primary Path Route         [e2e]

 198  ALARM_SPEC                              [RFC4783]

      Class Types or C-Types:
        1   Type 1  RESERVED                  [RFC4783]
        2   Type 2  RESERVED                  [RFC4783]
        3   IPv4 IF_ID ALARM_SPEC             [RFC4783]
        4   IPv6 IF_ID ALARM_SPEC             [RFC4783]

 199  ASSOCIATION                             [e2e]

      Class Types or C-Types:
        1   Type 1 IPv4 Association           [e2e]
        2   Type 2 IPv6 Association           [e2e]

 200  SECONDARY_EXPLICIT_ROUTE                [seg]

      Same C-Type values as EXPLICIT_ROUTE object
      (C-Num 20) with the following additions:

        For Class 1, C-Type 1, the following additional
        Sub-object type is defined:

           Sub-object type
            37   Protection                   [seg]

 201  SECONDARY_RECORD_ROUTE                  [seg]

      Same C-Type values as EXPLICIT_ROUTE object
      (C-Num 20) with the following additions:

        For Class 1, C-Type 1, the following additional
        Sub-object type is defined:

           Sub-object type
            37   Protection                   [seg]

============================================================

Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters
          Interface_ID Types

  Type  Length  Format      Description                 Reference
  ----  ------  ----------  --------------------------  ---------
   512       8  See below   REFERENCE_COUNT             [RFC4783]
   513       8  See below   SEVERITY                    [RFC4783]
   514       8  See below   GLOBAL_TIMESTAMP            [RFC4783]
   515       8  See below   LOCAL_TIMESTAMP             [RFC4783]
   516  varies  See below   ERROR_STRING                [RFC4783]

============================================================

Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters
          Administrative Status Information Flags

  Value       Name                             Reference
  ----------- -------------------------------- ---------
  0x80000000  Reflect (R)                      [RFC3473][RFC3471]
  0x00000020  Lockout (L)                      [e2e]
  0x00000010  Inhibit Alarm Communication (I)  [RFC4783]
  0x00000004  Testing (T)                      [RFC3473][RFC3471]
  0x00000002  Administratively down (A)        [RFC3473][RFC3471]
  0x00000001  Deletion in progress (D)         [RFC3473][RFC3471]


============================================================

Registry: RSVP
          Error Codes and Values

Error Code Meaning

  01 Admission Control Failure                [RFC2205]

      The sixteen bits of the Error Value field are
        ssur cccc cccc cccc
      as defined in [RFC2205]

        The following globally-defined sub-codes may appear in the low-
        order 12 bits when ssur = 0000:

        Sub-code  Meaning                         Reference
        --------  ------------------------------  ---------
               1  Delay bound cannot be met       [RFC2205]
               2  Requested bandwidth unavailable [RFC2205]
               3  MTU in flowspec larger than     [RFC2205]
                  interface MTU
               4  LSP Admission Failure           [e2e]
               5  Bad Association Type            [e2e]

  02 Policy Control Failure                   [RFC2205]

      This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error
      Value sub-codes:

        0 = Information reporting                 [RFC2750]
        1 = Warning                               [RFC2750]
        2 = Reason unknown                        [RFC2750]
        3 = Generic Policy Rejection              [RFC2750]
        4 = Quota or Accounting violation         [RFC2750]
        5 = Flow was preempted                    [RFC2750]
        6 = Previously installed policy expired   [RFC2750]
            (not refreshed)
        7 = Previous policy data was replaced &   [RFC2750]
            caused rejection
        8 = Policies could not be merged          [RFC2750]
            (multicast)
        9 = PDP down or non functioning           [RFC2750]
       10 = Third Party Server (e.g., Kerberos)   [RFC2750]
            unavailable
       11 = POLICY_DATA object has bad syntax     [RFC2750]
       12 = POLICY_DATA object failed Integrity   [RFC2750]
            Check
       13 = POLICY_ELEMENT object has bad syntax  [RFC2750]
       14 = Mandatory PE Missing (Empty PE is in  [RFC2750]
            the PD object)
       15 = PEP Out of resources to handle        [RFC2750]
            policies.
       16 = PDP encountered bad RSVP objects or   [RFC2750]
            syntax
       17 = Service type was rejected             [RFC2750]
       18 = Reservation Style was rejected        [RFC2750]
       19 = FlowSpec was rejected (too large)     [RFC2750]
       20 = Hard Pre-empted                       [e2e]

  24 Routing Problem                          [RFC3209]

      This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error
      Value sub-codes:

        1 = Bad EXPLICIT_ROUTE object         [RFC3209]
        : (snip)
       16 = Unknown Interface Index           [RFC3477]
       17 = Unsupported LSP Protection        [e2e]
       18 = PROTECTION object not applicable  [e2e]
       19 = Bad PRIMARY PATH_ROUTE object     [e2e]
       20 = PRIMARY PATH_ROUTE object not     [e2e]
            applicable
       21 = LSP Segment Protection Failed     [seg]

  25 Notify Error                             [RFC3209]

      This Error Code has the following globally-defined Error
      Value sub-codes:

        1 = RRO too large for MTU             [RFC3209]
        2 = RRO Notification                  [RFC3209]
        3 = Tunnel locally repaired           [RFC3209]
        4 = Control Channel Active State      [RFC3473]
        5 = Control Channel Degraded State    [RFC3473]
        6 = Preferable path exists            [RFC4736]
        7 = Local link maintenance required   [RFC4736]
        8 = Local node maintenance required   [RFC4736]
        9 = LSP Failure                       [e2e]
       10 = LSP Recovered                     [e2e]
       11 = LSP Locally Failed                [e2e]

  31 Alarms                                   [RFC4783]

      The Error Value sub-codes for this Error Code
      have values and meanings identical to the values
      and meanings defined in the IANAItuProbableCause
      Textual Convention of IANA-ITU-ALARM-TC-MIB
      in the Alarm MIB [RFC3877].

============================================================

Registry: GMPLS Signaling Parameters
          Association Type
(This is a new registry)

   Assignment by IANA are subject to IETF expert review
   process i.e. IETF Standards Track RFC Action.

   Value   Type                 Reference
   -----   -----------------    ---------
       0   Reserved             [e2e]
       1   Recovery (R)         [e2e]
       2   Resource Sharing (R) [seg]




Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:04:43 +0000
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 13:02:57 +0800
From: Mach Chen 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
To: Peng He 
Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, Adrian Farrel , ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Message-id: <001a01c73862$6c747370$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com>
MIME-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:27:19 +0000
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Message-ID: <406e32c00701141926s2015a1eftfc145ea4443251bc@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2007 22:26:27 -0500
From: "Peng He" 
To: "Mach Chen" 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
Cc: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be,  "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org,  owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
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Hello Mach,

I am interested in such work. But I am not sure what you said "in oder
to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links fooding is
desired", say, different computing methods might need different
information about the inter-AS links and various flood ranges, and if
not a general method is considered as default, it seems to me hard to
define what exact info should be flooded. Just my personal thoughts.

Regards,
Peng

On 1/14/07, Mach Chen  wrote:
> Dimitri and all,
>
> After reading these docs I also have the same concern with you about inte=
r-ASBR links flooding.
> I think, in oder to perform  inter-AS path computation, inter-ASBR links =
fooding is desired. But
> such kind of inter-ASBR link info should include more information than "n=
ormal" TE links do,
> e.g: the inter-ASBR links info SHOULD still include the peer AS number an=
d peer ASBR router id
> besides those link info which has been specified in rfc3630 and rfc3784.
>
> So I think there need a document to clarify and specify inter-ASBR links =
flooding. we are considering to
> write such a document. If someone interested in such work, we could coope=
rate.
>
>
>
> Best regards,
>
> Mach
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: 
> To: "Adrian Farrel" 
> Cc: ; 
> Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 7:49 PM
> Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
> hi adrian
>
> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc
>
> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. MPLS-TE
> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1
>
> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])."
>
> and many others in section 4.
>
> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well that's
> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to
> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which
> interop issues may result from it
>
> o) a couple of specific comments
>
> end of section 2:
>
> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?
>
> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol are
> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is
> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path
> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still maintai=
n
> capacity to perform such operation
>
> section 3.3 "The path computation
>    technique described in this document applies to the case of a single
>    AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
>    areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of simplicity,
>    each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
>    document. "
>
> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples must
> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these tutorial
> like material should better go in an appendix -
>
> section 3.1 "In any case,
>    no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between
>    domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is critical
>    to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case of TE
>    LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."
>
> then Section 4
> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
>    optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood the TE
>    information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is
>    enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the
>    inter-ASBR links).  ...
> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
>    corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available
>    in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR belongs to."
>
> but after
> "Note that no topology
>    information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
>    computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
>    directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."
>
> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?
> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
> requirements of 4105 and 4216
>
>
> o) a couple of edits
>
> section 1:
>
> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R
>
> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the
> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like
>
> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS
>  TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."
>
> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs
>
> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of
> specific docs
>
> hope this will help,
> - d.
>
>
>
>
> "Adrian Farrel" 
> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> 09/01/2007 23:13
> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>
>         To:     
>         cc:
>         Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
> Hi,
>
> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds:
>
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt
>
> Our plan is:
> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
> 2. Editors apply necessary updates
> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together
>
> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good
> time
> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can
> get
> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>
>
>
>
>
>
>



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 02:44:42 +0000
Date: Mon, 15 Jan 2007 10:41:20 +0800
From: Mach Chen 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
To: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be, Adrian Farrel 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Message-id: <003201c7384e$a449e820$5b0c6f0a@china.huawei.com>
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Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 09:55:43 -0500
From: "Peng He" 
To: "Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be" 
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
Cc: "Adrian Farrel" , ccamp@ops.ietf.org,  owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
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Hi,

Sill about the the third doc:

1. in the "3.1.  Common assumptions" part, it is assumed that
"Boundary LSRs are assumed to be capable of performing local path
computation ..." . So I guess that ABR or ASBR has the function (or
part of) of PCE.

2. My understanding to Dimitri's questions:
I believe there is flooding here but only within the domain that the
ASBR belongs to. So now a domain includes non-ABSR LSRs and ABSR LSRs
and the links among them, AND the inter-domain links originating (not
terminating) from the ASBRS of this domain. Tthe flooding is among
these LSRs, but not between domains. So, it is still can be considered
as intra-domain flooding and it happens when the TE info changes I
guess.

3. The purpose of the above is to "improve the chance of successful
signaling along the next AS in case of resource  shortage ..." I
understand this, I just want to mention that it seems only true in
theory and the practical effect is not so good as expected. I
simulated this years ago when we extended DCR into inter-domain case
and just no encouraging results found.

Regards,
Peng


> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
> requirements of 4105 and 4216



On 1/13/07, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
 wrote:
> hi adrian
>
> o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc
>
> - the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. MPLS-TE
> signaling further on e.g. section 3.1
>
> " - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])."
>
> and many others in section 4.
>
> - the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well that's
> fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to
> indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which
> interop issues may result from it
>
> o) a couple of specific comments
>
> end of section 2:
>
> section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
> -> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?
>
> last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol are
> independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is
> an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path
> to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still maintai=
n
> capacity to perform such operation
>
> section 3.3 "The path computation
>    technique described in this document applies to the case of a single
>    AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
>    areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of simplicity,
>    each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
>    document. "
>
> -> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples must
> remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these tutorial
> like material should better go in an appendix -
>
> section 3.1 "In any case,
>    no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between
>    domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is critical
>    to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case of TE
>    LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."
>
> then Section 4
> "In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
>    optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood the TE
>    information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is
>    enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the
>    inter-ASBR links).  ...
> "Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
>    corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available
>    in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR belongs to."
>
> but after
> "Note that no topology
>    information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
>    computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
>    directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."
>
> -> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?
> 2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the
> scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
> requirements of 4105 and 4216
>
>
> o) a couple of edits
>
> section 1:
>
> ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R
>
> the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the
> frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like
>
> "The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS
>  TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."
>
> ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs
>
> state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of
> specific docs
>
> hope this will help,
> - d.
>
>
>
>
> "Adrian Farrel" 
> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> 09/01/2007 23:13
> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>
>         To:     
>         cc:
>         Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
>
>
> Hi,
>
> We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds:
>
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
> - draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt
>
> Our plan is:
> 1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
> 2. Editors apply necessary updates
> 3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together
>
> If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good
> time
> to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can
> get
> any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
>
>
>
>
>
>
>



Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:50:38 +0000
To: "Adrian Farrel" 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
Subject: Re: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: 
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:49:30 +0100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

hi adrian

o) a couple of generic comments on the third doc

- the doc. states applicability to GMPLS but sometimes only ref. MPLS-TE
signaling further on e.g. section 3.1

" - The inter-domain TE LSPs are signaled using RSVP-TE ([RFC3209])."

and many others in section 4.

- the are many comparison with PCE technique along the doc. - well that's=20
fine but outside the scope of the document except if the purpose is to=20
indicate how different techniques can be combined together and which=20
interop issues may result from it

o) a couple of specific comments=20

end of section 2:=20

section 3.1: "* The complete list of boundary LSRs along the path"
-> list of domain identifier e.g. AS numbers also applies here ?

last =A7 of section 3.1 is the most important one, signaling protocol are
independent of the routing topology itself, i.e. not because a node is
an ABR or an ASBR that comp. occurs but simply because he has no path=20
to reach the next (loose) hop - an intermediate node should still maintain
capacity to perform such operation

section 3.3 "The path computation
   technique described in this document applies to the case of a single
   AS made of multiple IGP areas, multiples ASs made of a single IGP
   areas or any combination of the above.  For the sake of simplicity,
   each routing domain will be considered as single area in this
   document. "

-> not sure to understand the reasoning, at the end these examples must
remain illustrative and not restrict applicability - all these tutorial
like material should better go in an appendix -

section 3.1 "In any case,
   no topology or resource information needs to be distributed between
   domains (as mandated per [RFC4105] and [RFC4216]), which is critical
   to preserve IGP/BGP scalability and confidentiality in the case of TE
   LSPs spanning multiple routing domains."

then Section 4
"In terms of computation of an inter-AS TE LSP path, an interesting
   optimization technique consists of allowing the ASBRs to flood the TE
   information related to the inter-ASBR link(s) although no IGP TE is
   enabled over those links (and so there is no IGP adjacency over the
   inter-ASBR links).  ...
"Thanks to such an optimization, the inter-ASBRs TE link information
   corresponding to the links originated by the ASBR is made available
   in the TED of other LSRs in the same domain that the ASBR belongs to."

but after
"Note that no topology
   information is flooded and these links are not used in IGP SPF
   computations.  Only the TE information for the outgoing links
   directly connected to the ASBR is advertised."

-> can one of the author clarify 1) is flooding involved or not ?
2) what get's flooded and under which conditions 3) what is the=20
scope of the flooding 4) how this mechanism positions against the
requirements of 4105 and 4216


o) a couple of edits
=20
section 1:

ABR Router, ASBR Router - redundant R

the most important def. is the "domain" def. which can be found in the
frm doc but not recorded here this would clarify sentence like

"The mechanisms proposed in this document are also applicable to MPLS
 TE domains other than IGP areas and ASs."

ref. H-LSP and S-LSP with the appropriate docs

state that inter-domain recovery is going to be addressed in a set of
specific docs

hope this will help,
- d.




"Adrian Farrel" 
Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
09/01/2007 23:13
Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
=20
        To:     
        cc:=20
        Subject:        Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds


Hi,

We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds:

- draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
- draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
- draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt

Our plan is:
1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
2. Editors apply necessary updates
3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together

If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good=20
time=20
to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can=20
get=20
any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.

Thanks,
Adrian=20








Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:43:03 +0000
Message-ID: <005701c73707$84efdf40$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: "Derek Atkins" , 
Cc: , , , , , , , , 
Subject: Re: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06
Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2007 11:39:21 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Derek,

I think this is a good question so I am bringing it to the CCAMP list.

The bottom line would appear to be:
- The exchange between neighbors before restart was
   secured by normal RSVP-TE means
- The exchange after restart is secured by the same means.
- This provides a degree of protection that the restarting
   node is receiving information that it originally sent to
   its neighbor.

The obvious question is, should the restarting node have some (private) way 
of authenticating that the information received on restart originated with 
it? This would presumably be some sort of cookie manufactured from a mock-up 
of the restart message that the restarting node expects to receive and 
handed to the neighbor for use in the event of a restart.

Seems like overkill to me, but I'd appreciate views from the WG.

Adrian

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Derek Atkins" 
To: ; 
Cc: ; ; 
; ; ; 
; 
Sent: Friday, January 12, 2007 10:59 PM
Subject: draft-ietf-ccamp-rsvp-restart-ext-06


>I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's
> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
> IESG.  These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the
> security area directors.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat
> these comments just like any other last call comments.
>
> I don't see any issues in this document beyond those already stated
> in the Security Considerations.
>
> My only question to the authors would be how does a recovering node
> verify that the data it gets from a peer node really came from the
> recovering node?  Right now it just seems to have to trust that the
> peer returns valid data.
>
> -derek
> -- 
>       Derek Atkins                 617-623-3745
>       derek@ihtfp.com             www.ihtfp.com
>       Computer and Internet Security Consultant
>
>
> 





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 21:34:43 +0000
To: Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 
Cc: ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira , JP Vasseur , mpls@lists.ietf.org, owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Ross Callon 
Subject: Re: [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call on	draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-ID: 
From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 22:31:37 +0100
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"

hi - 

thanks for the reply - not sure you ever got the following response back

----- Forwarded by Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL on 12/01/2007 22:30 
-----
        Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU
        07/01/2007 11:43 
                 To: Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 


Hi 

thanks for the answer - i am still looking at the reason
why the PN selection process is driven by a uniform policy
which looks like an arbitrary choice

HBlock aims at minimizing the blocking probability
PN aims at minimizing the system perturbation

to have a fair analysis policy should be applied uniformly
and non-uniformly to both cases

much thanks,
- d. 

--




Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 
05/01/2007 00:11
 
        To:     Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
        cc:     mpls@lists.ietf.org, JP Vasseur , 
ccamp@ops.ietf.org, Jaudelice Cavalcante de Oliveira 
, Ross Callon , 
owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
        Subject:        [mpls] Re: CCAMP Last call on 
draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt


Hi Dimitri,

Thank you for your comment.

On Dec 18, 2006, at 3:47 AM, Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be 
wrote:

> adrian -
>
> in HBlock case the average wasted bw is a factor 10 smaller than 
> for any
> other scheme (without significantly lowering the worst case, still an
> order of 10)

Indeed. This can be seen in table 2. In this case, selection of LSPs 
much larger than
the required bandwidth did not occur often. The worst case value does 
not reflect the
frequency with which a high bandwidth LSP was selected (which was 
very rarely in
this case, therefore the low "wasted" bandwidth).

> the only noticeable difference with PN is exactly that one (which is
> induced by the possibility left to Hblock to have two selection 
> depending
> on heavy vs normal loaded link) - hence it would be interesting to 
> know
> the dependency on the min/max LSP bw and distribution (scenario
> dependancy) and have a similar PN approach (non-uniform selection)

Note that PN has the objective of preempting a small number of LSPs 
of the lowest
priority (therefore ordering by decreasing bandwidth), while HBlock 
aims at minimizing
the blocking probability, therefore selecting smaller LSPs which will 
be more likely to be
rerouted once preempted. This is the main difference between the two 
policies: Given a set
of LSPs with the same priority, PN picks the largest (in the interest 
of picking few) and HBlock
picks smaller ones (even if more than one, in the interest of being 
able to reroute them easily).

I hope this helps,

Thanks,

Jaudelice.

>
> thanks,
> - d.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> "Adrian Farrel" 
> Sent by: owner-ccamp@ops.ietf.org
> 14/12/2006 18:02
> Please respond to "Adrian Farrel"
>
>         To:     
>         cc:     , "Ross Callon"
> , "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" 
> ,
> 
>         Subject:        Re: CCAMP Last call on
> draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I have been explicitly asked to lengthen this last call so as to allow
> time
> for a review.
>
> Unusual, but not unreasonable.
>
> The last call is extended to noon on Sunday 17th December.
>
> Thanks,
> Adrian
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Adrian Farrel" 
> To: 
> Cc: ; "Ross Callon" ;
> "Brungard, Deborah A, ALABS" ; 
> 
> Sent: Wednesday, November 29, 2006 11:06 AM
> Subject: CCAMP Last call on draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
>
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> This draft has been developed independently and has recently been
> brought
>> to the IESG for advancement as an individual submission to become an
>> Informational RFC. I have done a first-level review and this latest
>> revision includes updates to reflect my comments.
>>
>> Since the material here concerns preemption and the suggested ways to
>> operate an MPLS-TE or GMPLS network, we are running a quick last 
>> call on
>
>> the CCAMP mailing list to ensure that no-one has any objections.
>>
>> Please send your comments to the CCAMP list no later than noon GMT on
> 13th
>> December 2006.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Adrian
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Tuesday, November 28, 2006 8:50 PM
>> Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
>>
>>
>>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
>>> directories.
>>>
>>>
>>> Title : LSP Preemption Policies for MPLS Traffic Engineering
>>> Author(s) : J. de Oliveira, et al.
>>> Filename : draft-deoliveira-diff-te-preemption-06.txt
>>> Pages : 19
>>> Date : 2006-11-28
>>>
>>> When the establishment of a higher priority (Traffic Engineering
>>>   Label Switched Path) TE LSP requires the preemption of a set of 
>>> lower
>>>   priority TE LSPs, a node has to make a local decision to select 
>>> which
>>>
>>>   TE LSPs will be preempted.  The preempted LSPs are then 
>>> rerouted by
>>>   their respective Head-end Label Switch Router (LSR).  This 
>>> document
>>>   presents a flexible policy that can be used to achieve different
>>>   objectives: preempt the lowest priority LSPs; preempt the minimum
>>>   number of LSPs; preempt the set of TE LSPs that provide the 
>>> closest
>>>   amount of bandwidth to the required bandwidth for the 
>>> preempting TE
>>>   LSPs (to minimize bandwidth wastage); preempt the LSPs that 
>>> will have
>>>   the maximum chance to get rerouted.  Simulation results are 
>>> given and
>>>   a comparison among several different policies, with respect to
>>>   preemption cascading, number of preempted LSPs, priority, wasted
>>>   bandwidth and blocking probability is also included.
>>>
>>> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
>>>
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-deoliveira-diff-te- 
> preemption-06.txt
>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>


_______________________________________________
mpls mailing list
mpls@lists.ietf.org
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls





Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 22:14:50 +0000
Message-ID: <0cee01c7343b$6870b480$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Progressing the three inter-domain I-Ds
Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2007 22:13:10 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi,

We now have updated versions of the three inter-domain signaling I-Ds:

- draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
- draft-ietf-ccamp-lsp-stitching-04.txt
- draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-pd-path-comp-03.txt

Our plan is:
1. WG chairs do detailed review over the next couple of weeks
2. Editors apply necessary updates
3. We hold a WG last call for the three I-Ds together

If you are interested in this work, I suggest that now might be a good time 
to remind yourself about the I-Ds, have a good read, and see if you can get 
any substantial comments in to coincide with the WG chairs' review.

Thanks,
Adrian 





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From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt 
Message-Id: 
Date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500

--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Inter domain MPLS and GMPLS Traffic Engineering - RSVP-TE extensions
	Author(s)	: A. Ayyangar, J. Vasseur
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt
	Pages		: 18
	Date		: 2007-1-9
	
This document describes procedures and protocol extensions for the
   use of Resource ReserVation Protocol Traffic Engineering (RSVP-TE)
   signaling in Multiprotocol Label Switching Traffic Engineering
   (MPLS-TE) packet networks and Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) packet and
   non-packet networks to support the establishment and maintenance of
   Label Switched Paths that cross domain boundaries.

   For the purpose of this document, a domain is considered to be any
   collection of network elements within a common realm of address space
   or path computation responsibility. Examples of such domains include
   Autonomous Systems, IGP routing areas, and GMPLS overlay networks.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-inter-domain-rsvp-te-04.txt

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Tue, 09 Jan 2007 15:55:45 +0000
Message-ID: <0a2f01c7337b$0ec2f440$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Fw: Posting of IPR Disclosure
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:16:33 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
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Please be aware of the following IPR disclosure notification that has been 
posted.

Thanks,
Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "IETF Secretariat" 
Sent: Monday, January 08, 2007 3:47 PM
Subject: Posting of IPR Disclosure


> An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled "RSVP-TE
> Extensions in support of End-to-End Generalized Multi-Protocol Label 
> Switching
> (GMPLS) Recovery" (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling) was 
> submitted
> to the IETF Secretariat on 2007-01-05 and has been posted on the "IETF 
> Page of
> Intellectual Property Rights Disclosures"
> (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/ipr_list.cgi). The title of the IPR
> disclosure is "Nippon Telegraph and Telephone Corporation's statement 
> about IPR
> claimed in draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt."
>
> The IETF Secretariat






Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Mon, 08 Jan 2007 23:19:21 +0000
Message-ID: <0a2f01c7337b$0ec2f440$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Fw: Posting of IPR Disclosure
Date: Mon, 8 Jan 2007 23:16:33 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Please be aware of the following IPR disclosure notification that has been 
posted.

Thanks,
Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "IETF Secretariat" 
Sent: Monday, January 08, 2007 3:47 PM
Subject: Posting of IPR Disclosure


> An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled "RSVP-TE
> Extensions in support of End-to-End Generalized Multi-Protocol Label 
> Switching
> (GMPLS) Recovery" (draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling) was 
> submitted
> to the IETF Secretariat on 2007-01-05 and has been posted on the "IETF 
> Page of
> Intellectual Property Rights Disclosures"
> (https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/ipr_list.cgi). The title of the IPR
> disclosure is "Nippon Telegraph and Telephone Corporation's statement 
> about IPR
> claimed in draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-recovery-e2e-signaling-04.txt."
>
> The IETF Secretariat





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From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt 
Message-Id: 
Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500

--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support of Calls
	Author(s)	: D. Papadimitriou, A. Farrel
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt
	Pages		: 29
	Date		: 2007-1-4
	
In certain networking topologies, it may be advantageous to maintain
   associations between endpoints and key transit points to support an
   instance of a service. Such associations are known as Calls.

   A Call does not provide the actual connectivity for transmitting user
   traffic, but only builds a relationship by which subsequent
   Connections may be made. In Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) such Connections
   are known as Label Switched Paths (LSPs).

   This document specifies how GMPLS RSVP-TE signaling may be used and
   extended to support Calls. These mechanisms provide full and logical
   Call/Connection separation.

   The mechanisms proposed in this document are applicable to any
   environment (including multi-area), and for any type of interface:
   packet, layer-2, time-division multiplexed, lambda, or fiber
   switching.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-03.txt

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Envelope-to: ccamp-data@psg.com
Delivery-date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 21:10:24 +0000
Message-ID: <034f01c72f7b$80a29510$0a23fea9@your029b8cecfe>
Reply-To: "Adrian Farrel" 
From: "Adrian Farrel" 
To: 
Subject: Re: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt 
Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:09:37 -0000
Organization: Old Dog Consulting
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Hi,

This revision addresses comments made in GenArt review and SecDir review.

The changes are small fixes to the wording to make a couple of points 
clearer.

The draft should now continue forward in the process.

Thanks,
Adrian
----- Original Message ----- 
From: 
To: 
Cc: 
Sent: Wednesday, January 03, 2007 8:50 PM
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt


>A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane 
> Working Group of the IETF.
>
> Title : Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support 
> of Calls
> Author(s) : D. Papadimitriou, A. Farrel
> Filename : draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt
> Pages : 29
> Date : 2007-1-3
>
> In certain networking topologies, it may be advantageous to maintain
>   associations between endpoints and key transit points to support an
>   instance of a service. Such associations are known as Calls.
>
>   A Call does not provide the actual connectivity for transmitting user
>   traffic, but only builds a relationship by which subsequent
>   Connections may be made. In Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) such Connections
>   are known as Label Switched Paths (LSPs).
>
>   This document specifies how GMPLS RSVP-TE signaling may be used and
>   extended to support Calls. These mechanisms provide full and logical
>   Call/Connection separation.
>
>   The mechanisms proposed in this document are applicable to any
>   environment (including multi-area), and for any type of interface:
>   packet, layer-2, time-division multiplexed, lambda, or fiber
>   switching.
>
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt





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From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt 
Message-Id: 
Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2007 15:50:02 -0500

--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Common Control and Measurement Plane Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) RSVP-TE Signaling Extensions in support of Calls
	Author(s)	: D. Papadimitriou, A. Farrel
	Filename	: draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt
	Pages		: 29
	Date		: 2007-1-3
	
In certain networking topologies, it may be advantageous to maintain
   associations between endpoints and key transit points to support an
   instance of a service. Such associations are known as Calls.

   A Call does not provide the actual connectivity for transmitting user
   traffic, but only builds a relationship by which subsequent
   Connections may be made. In Generalized MPLS (GMPLS) such Connections
   are known as Label Switched Paths (LSPs).

   This document specifies how GMPLS RSVP-TE signaling may be used and
   extended to support Calls. These mechanisms provide full and logical
   Call/Connection separation.

   The mechanisms proposed in this document are applicable to any
   environment (including multi-area), and for any type of interface:
   packet, layer-2, time-division multiplexed, lambda, or fiber
   switching.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ccamp-gmpls-rsvp-te-call-02.txt

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