On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip = Khasnabish wrote:

You mean interconnection of = TWO separately administered CDNs, right . = .anything beyond two is out of scope . .

pls confirm and clarify that in the charter.

I believe the CDNI solution needs to = allow systems involving multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN = needs to be able to make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each = covering a different geographical footprint).

As = discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a simpler = initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topologies of = CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see h= ttp://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), but = we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once the = trade-offs are better understood.

So I'd = recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic target = (i.e. support systems with multiple = CDNs).

There was a discussion during the BOF = about the fact that "CDN Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This = may have created some confusion since "federation" means different = things to different people. In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies = particular modes of operation across the multiple interconnected CDNs = (e.g. they share some common policies/services etc). While this may be = one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond what a = CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would = define how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with = awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in = the overall system and therefore that delivery features need to operate = in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the = policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that = multi-CDN = system.

Cheers

Francois<= /div>

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the = >interconnection of separately administered CDNs =

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le = Faucheur <flefauch@cisco.com> = wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated = version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the charter = discussion/edits during the BOF.=20
Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment

Content Delivery Networks = Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft = Charter
---------------------------------------------------------------= -

Description of Working = Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such = content includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered = via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, = RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content = Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased = robustness of delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for = large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment = network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone = CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single = delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users = (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces = will be realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for = the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A = "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem and = a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing = scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and = protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more = urgent and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial = set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This = document will list the requirements stemming from the threat = analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface = will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the = downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection.

o CDNI metadata = distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs to exchange = distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers = to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the = distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content = acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or = access control).

o CDNI logging systems. = This interface will allow CDN logging systems to exchange logging = information associated with actions that are relevant across CDNs (such = as content distribution, content delivery and content routing = actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control systems. = In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or = invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for = aspects of the CDN Interconnection problem space that require direct = communication or interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport = or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a = CDN to an End User/User Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of = content or metadata between a CSP and a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and = algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent = Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.
- = Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess = the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream = CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with = making CDNI request routing decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months: = Submit CDNI problem statement = to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: = Submit CDNI framework to IESG = as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: = Submit specification of the = CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata = Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or = dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, = Richard wrote:

Folks,

I wanted everyone to have = an updated version of the CDNI draft charter below, for discussion at = the BOF shortly. This is based on input from many people this week, = including people that attended the informal CDNI gathering last night. = It is available online at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt= >, and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart&g= t;.

The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#w= g-cdni>.

-- Rich and Francois

Content= Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft = Charter
---------------------------------------------------------------= -

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an = infrastructure of network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, = arranged for the efficient distribution and delivery of = digital content. Such content includes, but is not limited to, web = pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media = delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide = services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for = multi-service content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable = content, improved quality of experience for end users and increased = robustness of delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for = large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered = over IP networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their = infrastructure and many Network Service Providers and Enterprise = Service Providers are deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of = the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given item of content can be = delivered to an end user regardless of that end user's location or = attachment network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) = standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as = a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the = interconnection of separately administered CDNs in support of the = end-to-end delivery of content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and = ultimately to end users (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG = aims at delivering a targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe = (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the = CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for = transport and message exchange, and using existing object = notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and = semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are = deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following = items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a = description of the problem and a common terminology.

- A = "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications of = the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the = different components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and = relate to one another.

- A "requirements" document. This = document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols = to support it. In particular, this document will focus on identifying = a reasonable set of more urgent and important requirements that = will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions = produced by the working group.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of:

   = o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform = request redirection.

   o CDNI metadata distribution = systems. This interface will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution = metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the subset = of content metadata that is relevant to the distribution of the = content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may = include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, = enforcement of availability windows or access control).

   o CDNI logging systems. This = interface will allow CDN logging systems to exchange logging information = associated with actions that are relevant across CDNs (such as = content distribution, content delivery and content routing actions) = for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

   o CDN control systems. In = particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or = invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss = and address the security (including threat model), management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of = the CDN Interconnection problem space that require direct communication = or interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will = not define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a = CSP and a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across = CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications = consuming CDNI logs.

The WG will work with other WGs to = assess, and where appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those = WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. = For example, the WG may assess the suitability of the ALTO protocol = as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which = may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing = decisions.

Goals & = Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
&n= bsp;
WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI = problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: = Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to = IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: = Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 = months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + = 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or = dissolve

_____________________________________________= __
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni
=

____________________________________________= ___
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

Francois Le = Faucheur
Distinguished = Engineer
Corporate Development

Cisco Systems = France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 Sophia = Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

Think before you = print.

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Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 06:12:40 -0400 Message-ID: From: Bhumip Khasnabish To: Francois Le Faucheur Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf303f634a49bf4204a06577f4 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:10:59 -0000 --20cf303f634a49bf4204a06577f4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Francois, You already agreed that "*Federation"* is out of scope. I am just remindin= g you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see below.. + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN Federation= " in scope? + *Nabil*: CDNI is about interconnection only. *Federation is a more controlled environment which requires more policies. *+ *Francois*: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. Thi= s can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. *But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is not in the scope. * >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs *Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. Thanks. Best. Bhumip On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur wr= ote: > Hi Bhumip, > > On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > > You mean interconnection of *TWO* separately administered CDNs, right . > .anything beyond two is out of scope . . > pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. > > > I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple CDN= s. > For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of more th= an > one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical footprint)= . > As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a simpl= er > initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topologies of CD= Ns > to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see > http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), but we > felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once the > trade-offs are better understood. > > So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic > target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). > > There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN Federation= " > was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some confusion since > "federation" means different things to different people. In my mind, "CDN > Federation" implies particular modes of operation across the multiple > interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common policies/services etc). > While this may be one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems > beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI W= G > would define how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, > with awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation= in > the overall system and therefore that delivery features need to operate i= n > multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the > policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that multi-C= DN > system. > > Cheers > > Francois > > > > >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection of > separately administered CDNs > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur wrote: > >> Folks, >> >> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the >> charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft >> charter is assessed by the ADs. >> >> Francois & Rich >> >> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on >> comment >> >> >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network element= s >> operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient >> distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but= is >> not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming o= f >> continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically pro= vide >> services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). >> >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service >> content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, impr= oved >> quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery= . >> For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery. >> >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP >> networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and >> many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are >> deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is genera= lly >> desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end >> user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This >> creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they = can >> interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure= . >> >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of >> separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of >> content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via >> their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted= , >> deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the >> industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using >> existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using >> existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI >> objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new >> protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. >> >> The working group will focus on the following items: >> >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem >> and a common terminology. >> >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of >> the CDNI solution and protocols >> >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different >> components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to= one >> another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing = the >> security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specif= ic >> to CDNI. >> >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CD= NI >> architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this docume= nt >> will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important >> requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols= and >> solutions produced by the working group. This document will list the >> requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of = the >> CDNI interfaces. >> >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & >> interoperation of: >> >> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CD= N >> request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information >> necessary to perform request redirection. >> >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs >> to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metad= ata >> refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the >> distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (fo= r >> example, this may include information enabling: content >> acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access >> control). >> >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to >> exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant >> across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content >> routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. >> >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an >> upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >> >> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational >> issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. >> >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN >> Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or >> interoperation between CDNs. >> >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User >> Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a >> CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >> >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, levera= ge >> protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requireme= nts >> and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of t= he >> ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange >> information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routi= ng >> decisions. >> >> >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request >> Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging >> interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control >> interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata >> Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >> >> >> >> >> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >> >> Folks, >> >> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter >> below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from ma= ny >> people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gathe= ring >> last night. It is available online at < >> http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>, and has been >> updated on the BOF wiki < >> http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>. >> >> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: < >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni>. >> >> -- Rich and Francois >> >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network element= s >> operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient >> distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but= is >> not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming o= f >> continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically pro= vide >> services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). >> >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service >> content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, impr= oved >> quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery= . >> For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery. >> >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP >> networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and >> many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are >> deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is genera= lly >> desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end >> user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This >> creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they = can >> interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure= . >> >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of >> separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of >> content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via >> their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted= , >> deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by >> the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized u= sing >> existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using >> existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI >> objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new >> protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. >> >> The working group will focus on the following items: >> >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem >> and a common terminology. >> >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of >> the CDNI solution and protocols >> >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different >> components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to= one >> another. >> >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CD= NI >> architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this docume= nt >> will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important >> requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols= and >> solutions produced by the working group. >> >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & >> interoperation of: >> >> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface wi= ll >> allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstre= am >> CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. >> >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow >> the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribut= ion >> metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to th= e >> distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (fo= r >> example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, >> geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access control). >> >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging >> systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are >> relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and >> content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitori= ng, >> etc. >> >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow = an >> upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >> >> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), >> management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above >> documents and specifications. >> >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN >> Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or >> interoperation between CDNs. >> >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User >> Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a >> CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, levera= ge >> protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requireme= nts >> and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of t= he >> ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange >> information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routi= ng >> decisions. >> >> >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request >> Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging >> interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control >> interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata >> Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> >> > > > > > > * > Francois Le Faucheur* > *Distinguished Engineer* > *Corporate Development* > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: *+33 49 723 2619* > Mobile: *+33 6 19 98 50 90* > > > *Cisco Systems France* > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com > > > > Think before you print. > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole > use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosur= e > by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (= or > authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by re= ply > email and delete all copies of this message. > > Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Cami= lle > Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mouline= aux, > Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la > publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. > > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html > > > --20cf303f634a49bf4204a06577f4 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Francois,

=A0

You already agreed that=A0 "Federation" is = out of scope. I am just reminding you that and requesting to put it in the = charter. PLS see below..

=A0

+ ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN = Federation" in scope?
+ Nabil:=A0CDNI=A0is about i= nterconnection only. Federation is a more controlled environment wh= ich requires more policies.
+ Francois:=A0CDNI=A0only defines how to intercon= nect two CDNs together. This can then be used in different ways, such as al= low many CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "= ;CDN Federation" itself is not in the scope.

=A0

>>interconnection of separately administered CDNs

Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these = two "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.=

=A0

Thanks.

=A0

Best.

=A0

Bhumip

=A0

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Fauc= heur <flefauch@cisco.com> wrote:

Hi Bhumip,=20

On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:

You mean=A0 interconnection of TWO separatel= y administered CDNs, right . .anything beyond two is out of scope . .

pls confirm and clarify that in the charter.

I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple = CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of mor= e than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical footp= rint).=A0

As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a si= mpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topologies o= f CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see=A0http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html= ), but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, o= nce the trade-offs are better understood.

So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the gen= eric target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs).

There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN Fe= deration" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some co= nfusion since "federation" means different things to different pe= ople. In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of op= eration across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some commo= n policies/services etc). While this may be one way that a CDNI solution wo= uld be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In other wor= ds, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN inter-operate with ano= ther CDN for delivery, with awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-t= o-CDN inter-operation in the overall system and therefore that delivery fea= tures need to operate in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concer= n itself with the policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top= of that multi-CDN system.

Cheers

Francois

=A0

=A0

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnec= tion of separately administered CDNs

=A0

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Fau= cheur <flefauch@cisco.com> wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated vers= ion of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the charter discussion/edits durin= g the BOF.=20
Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draf= t charter is assessed by the ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let'= ;s focus on comment

Content Delivery Networks Int= erconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
------------------------------------= ----------------------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elemen= ts operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distrib= ution and delivery of digital content.=A0Such content includes, but is not = limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of conti= nuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically=A0provide s= ervices to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service con= tent delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved q= uality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of delivery. = For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery= .

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP netw= orks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many N= etwork Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deploying t= heir own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable = that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardless o= f that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need f= or interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate an= d collectively behave as=A0a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of s= eparately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of conten= t from CSPs through multiple=A0CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their = respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deploya= ble solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed=A0by the industr= y. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing = IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing objec= t notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and sema= ntics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed ne= cessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "p= roblem statement" document providing a description of the problem and = a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing s= cenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the diffe= rent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate = to one another. This document will also=A0include a "threat analysis&q= uot; discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and priv= acy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirem= ents for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a=A0reasonable set of more urgent a= nd important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI= protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document will= =A0list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by= each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection &a= mp; interoperation of:

= o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an u= pstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the in= formation necessary to perform=A0request redirection.

o CDNI metada= ta distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs to exchange dis= tribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the = subset of=A0content metadata that is relevant to the distribution of the co= ntent and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may inclu= de information enabling: content acquisition,=A0geo-blocking, enforcement o= f availability windows or access control).

o CDNI loggin= g systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to exchange loggin= g information associated with actions that are relevant across CDNs (such a= s content=A0distribution, content delivery and content routing actions) for= purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control= systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remov= e or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operationa= l issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications.
The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN I= nterconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoper= ation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport or n= etwork protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to a= n End User/User Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metad= ata between a CSP and a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and algor= ithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across= CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Manage= ment (DRM) mechanisms

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, lever= age protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirem= ents and CDNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may assess the suitability = of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange in= formation which may aid an upstream CDN with making=A0CDNI request routing = decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months:=A0 Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as I= nformational
WG Creation + 9 months:=A0 Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 1= 2 months:=A0 Subm= it CDNI framework to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informational
WG Creation= + 18 months:=A0 = Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Propo= sed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Pr= oposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as pr= oposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface= to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Recharter or dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, = at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote:

Folks,
=A0
I wanted everyone to have an upd= ated version of the CDNI draft charter below, for discussion at the BOF sho= rtly. This is based on input from many people this week, including people t= hat attended the informal CDNI gathering last night. It is=A0available onli= ne at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt&= gt;, and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.= org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>.
=A0
The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni&= gt;.
=A0
-- Rich and Francois
=A0
Content Delive= ry Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
---------------------= -------------------------------------------
=A0
Description of Workin= g Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D
=A0
A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure o= f network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the e= fficient distribution and delivery of digital=A0content. Such content inclu= des, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and st= reaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typic= ally=A0provide services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).
=A0
CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improve= d quality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of deliver= y. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery.
=A0
As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP n= etworks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and man= y Network Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deployin= g their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirab= le that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardles= s of that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a nee= d for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate= and collectively behave=A0as a single delivery infrastructure.
=A0
The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection o= f separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of con= tent from CSPs through multiple CDNs=A0and ultimately to end users (via the= ir respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, depl= oyable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the=A0indu= stry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existi= ng IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing ob= ject notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and s= emantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed= necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.
=A0
The working group will focus on the following items:
=A0
- A &= quot;problem statement" document providing a description of the proble= m and a common terminology.
=A0
- A "use case" document des= cribing scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and proto= cols
=A0
- A "framework" document providing a description of the di= fferent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and rela= te to one another.
=A0
- A "requirements" document. This do= cument lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to su= pport it. In particular, this document will focus on identifying a=A0reason= able set of more urgent and important requirements that will be addressed i= n the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working g= roup.
=A0
- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection= & interoperation of:
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI request-routin= g systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN request= routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary= =A0to perform request redirection.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interfa= ce will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope= . Distribution metadata refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processe= d by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: content=A0ac= quisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access cont= rol).
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow = CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions= that are relevant across CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content del= ivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, m= onitoring, etc.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDN control systems. In particular, this interfa= ce will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstre= am CDN.
=A0
The WG will discuss and address the security (including t= hreat model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside th= e above documents and specifications.
=A0
The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interope= ration between CDNs.
=A0
In particular, the WG will not define:
- = New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
=A0
The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and whe= re appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to real= ize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may as= sess the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstrea= m CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CD= NI=A0request routing decisions.
=A0
=A0
Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=A0
WG Creation + 6 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Subm= it CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 month= s: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Infor= mational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI requirements t= o IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standar= d
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Loggi= ng interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 = =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as propo= sed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Metad= ata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24= months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Recharter or dissolve
=A0
_______________= ________________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDN= i@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

_____________________________________________= __
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

=A0
<= /div>

Francois Le Faucheur=
Distinguished Engineer
Corporate D= evelopment
flefauch@cisco.com
Phone:=A0+33 49 723 = 2619
Mobile:=A0+33 6 19 98 50 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 Sophia Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

=A0

<= span style=3D"TEXT-TRANSFORM: none; TEXT-INDENT: 0px; BORDER-COLLAPSE: sepa= rate; FONT: medium Helvetica; WHITE-SPACE: normal; LETTER-SPACING: normal; = COLOR: rgb(0,0,0); WORD-SPACING: 0px">

=A0Think before you print.

This email may contain confidential and pri= vileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, us= e, distribution or disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are = not the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), pl= ease contact the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this messag= e.

Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Ca= mille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mou= lineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de l= a publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone.

For corporate legal information go to:
http://= www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html

=

= =A0 --20cf303f634a49bf4204a06577f4-- From hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net Fri Apr 8 03:17:07 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EAAE3A69F4 for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 03:17:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.58 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.58 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.019, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SyBkmtqSr1Gm for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 03:17:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailout-de.gmx.net (mailout-de.gmx.net [213.165.64.22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 782DF3A69EE for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 03:17:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail invoked by alias); 08 Apr 2011 10:18:49 -0000 Received: from a88-115-222-204.elisa-laajakaista.fi (EHLO [192.168.1.3]) [88.115.222.204] by mail.gmx.net (mp038) with SMTP; 08 Apr 2011 12:18:49 +0200 X-Authenticated: #29516787 X-Provags-ID: V01U2FsdGVkX18AX8wyPN8Al5cdgKzhZoW/xxWa7cDtoqSMctrEhc hXGwuwiWhcTOAA Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Hannes Tschofenig In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 13:18:47 +0300 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <2C53310A-159D-4029-8860-CD1C4005D3E6@gmx.net> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com>

To: Bhumip Khasnabish X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) X-Y-GMX-Trusted: 0 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:17:07 -0000 On Apr 8, 2011, at 1:12 PM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >=20 Trust is a fuzzy term. Typically, you have to indicate for what purpose = they trust each other.=20 From vumip1@gmail.com Fri Apr 8 03:22:33 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A88A3A69FF for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 03:22:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.34 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.34 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.258, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BLoXCxmFQWKm for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 03:22:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-gy0-f172.google.com (mail-gy0-f172.google.com [209.85.160.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 905D13A69EE for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 03:22:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by gyf3 with SMTP id 3so1634591gyf.31 for ; Fri, 08 Apr 2011 03:24:17 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=kGWxOGedDuvL2KTbf7r79iGV8A3qIWwnz/MdRFWPfgE=; b=Jf2wKRS0yCnsvGZ0GTYbuPeS+unj4MHi1+NXdA8WLsZGl/K1BdrpHmCDNKX98ae1/z 1nLjCpTcEfaDocFQhW0NYvgXBd2WcW09LCIZguDBPo6etUb6PuA5picFKoMl3y5+6JOn +WF+1zKF1KHKBZUh3UgU9pydeh4PyRw7MSs4w= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=dNuWA2f2U8TLK0KdEuv+A/TvGzP89eiRkMo2el3AA/1gYSOntI+vQFm0cXDvPuwxZP zu2DSsvKJ6ANQ0k/zZI04/eJZFCS2h6zIPCAqiT9WlpDROpFKKgTY7SILOZqCPIS4kBU udDPWEZ4ylCeWqZyFFfUQix8NODD9b6y+rMig= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.236.111.19 with SMTP id v19mr2510696yhg.444.1302258257588; Fri, 08 Apr 2011 03:24:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.108.161 with HTTP; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 03:24:17 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <2C53310A-159D-4029-8860-CD1C4005D3E6@gmx.net> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com>

<2C53310A-159D-4029-8860-CD1C4005D3E6@gmx.net> Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 06:24:17 -0400 Message-ID: From: Bhumip Khasnabish To: Hannes Tschofenig Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0023547c90dfd9736404a065a0f9 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 10:22:33 -0000 --0023547c90dfd9736404a065a0f9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Right. Currently, it is not defined in the charter and hence open to different interpretations by different CDN operators .. so we need to clarify it I guess.. On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 6:18 AM, Hannes Tschofenig wrote: > > On Apr 8, 2011, at 1:12 PM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > > > Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately > administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. > > > > Trust is a fuzzy term. Typically, you have to indicate for what purpose > they trust each other. > > > --0023547c90dfd9736404a065a0f9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Right. Currently, it is not defined in the charter and hence open to differ= ent interpretations by different CDN operators .. so we need to clarify it= =A0 I guess..

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 6:18 AM, Hannes Tschofeni= g <hannes= .tschofenig@gmx.net> wrote:

On Apr 8, 2011, at 1:12 PM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:<= br>
> Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "sepa= rately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.
>

Trust is a fuzzy term. Typically, you have to indicate for what p= urpose they trust each other.

=A0 --0023547c90dfd9736404a065a0f9-- From flefauch@cisco.com Fri Apr 8 05:22:34 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC8CC28C0DF for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 05:22:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -8.278 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-8.278 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.380, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, SARE_GIF_ATTACH=1.42] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YXkfc4g9HVkF for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 05:22:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-2.cisco.com (ams-iport-2.cisco.com [144.254.224.141]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 698123A68DC for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 05:22:28 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=flefauch@cisco.com; l=70609; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1302265454; x=1303475054; h=subject:mime-version:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id: references:to; bh=mlIgW9JeHFeOoNkqVy3b7xhsx3iJke8rlZHozwlnbRw=; b=RStOQRcWar4C4EUhjW92WjtOCXpDRA/rIRDd8G0ah1D9uzIrhTDthpdh YvqtTOPh8EB6ikfNMOTXvj8Tui2e4c2q1TnIurPqjIp6Pnl12qckc1W5c 87W0Lj4Ouow/VXVNAX6pzI9jaQcDIDhJFB7KeksZC49mnNDhA92oPi7jd o=; X-Files: image001.jpg, green.gif : 11041, 87 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: As4DAAX+nk2Q/khLgWdsb2JhbACCYJwrhiJoFAEBFiYliHqbd5w1AoVrBIF9iGCCcQ X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.63,323,1299456000"; d="gif'147?jpg'147,145?scan'147,145,208,145,147,217";a="24982895" Received: from ams-core-2.cisco.com ([144.254.72.75]) by ams-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 08 Apr 2011 12:24:12 +0000 Received: from ams-flefauch-8714.cisco.com (ams-flefauch-8714.cisco.com [10.55.161.197]) by ams-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p38CO93U014569; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 12:24:09 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-389--311730916 From: Francois Le Faucheur In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 14:24:59 +0200 Message-Id: <47D92D63-0FFD-4FFB-A2DC-3F864A4D2F03@cisco.com> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com>

To: Bhumip Khasnabish X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] CDN Federation Re: Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 12:22:35 -0000 --Apple-Mail-389--311730916 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 On 8 Apr 2011, at 12:12, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > Hi Francois, > =20 > You already agreed that "Federation" is out of scope. I am just = reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see = below.. I don't think the text can simply say that CDN "Federation" is out of = scope as "Federation" is not a well understood term. So, how about we = add in the draft charter, under "In particular, the WG will not = define:" something like: " * overarching policies to be followed by all the interconnected = CDNs " Francois > =20 > + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN = Federation" in scope? > + Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only. Federation is a more = controlled environment which requires more policies. > + Francois: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. = This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to = interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is = not in the scope. > =20 > >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs >=20 > Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. > =20 > Thanks. > =20 > Best. > =20 > Bhumip >=20 > =20 > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: > Hi Bhumip, >=20 > On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >=20 >> You mean interconnection of TWO separately administered CDNs, right = . .anything beyond two is out of scope . . >> pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. >=20 > I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple = CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of = more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical = footprint).=20 > As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a = simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the = topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - = see http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), = but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once = the trade-offs are better understood. >=20 > So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic = target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). >=20 > There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN = Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some = confusion since "federation" means different things to different people. = In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation = across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common = policies/services etc). While this may be one way that a CDNI solution = would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In = other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN = inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there = may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system = and therefore that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN = systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the = policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that = multi-CDN system. >=20 > Cheers >=20 > Francois >=20 >> =20 >> =20 >> >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection = of separately administered CDNs >>=20 >> =20 >> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: >> Folks, >>=20 >> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs. >>=20 >> Francois & Rich >>=20 >> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment >>=20 >>=20 >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>=20 >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>=20 >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>=20 >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>=20 >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of = separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>=20 >> The working group will focus on the following items: >>=20 >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>=20 >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>=20 >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI. >>=20 >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and = important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI = protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document = will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be = met by each of the CDNI interfaces. >>=20 >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>=20 >> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream = CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the = information necessary to perform request redirection. >>=20 >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the = CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution = metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to = the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content = acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access = control). >>=20 >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems = to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. >>=20 >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >>=20 >> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications. >>=20 >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>=20 >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >>=20 >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>=20 >>=20 >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata = Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >>=20 >>> Folks, >>> =20 >>> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft = charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input = from many people this week, including people that attended the informal = CDNI gathering last night. It is available online at = , and has been = updated on the BOF wiki = . >>> =20 >>> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: = . >>> =20 >>> -- Rich and Francois >>> =20 >>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>> =20 >>> Description of Working Group >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>> =20 >>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>> =20 >>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>> =20 >>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>> =20 >>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>> =20 >>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>> =20 >>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>> =20 >>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>> =20 >>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. >>> =20 >>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. >>> =20 >>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>> =20 >>> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection. >>> =20 >>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will = allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >>> =20 >>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN = logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions = that are relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content = delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, = analytics, monitoring, etc. >>> =20 >>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. >>> =20 >>> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat = model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the = above documents and specifications. >>> =20 >>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>> =20 >>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>> =20 >>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> Goals & Milestones >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> =20 >>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG = as Informational >>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>> =20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CDNi mailing list >>> CDNi@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> =20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Francois Le Faucheur > Distinguished Engineer > Corporate Development > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: +33 49 723 2619 > Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Cisco Systems France > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com >=20 >=20 > =20 >=20 >=20 > Think before you print. >=20 > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the = sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. >=20 > Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >=20 > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > =20 Francois Le Faucheur Distinguished Engineer Corporate Development flefauch@cisco.com Phone: +33 49 723 2619 Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 Cisco Systems France Greenside 400 Ave de Roumanille 06410 Sophia Antipolis France Cisco.com =20 Think before you print. This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole = use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. For corporate legal information go to: http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html --Apple-Mail-389--311730916 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="text/html"; boundary=Apple-Mail-390--311730915 --Apple-Mail-390--311730915 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252

Hi Francois,

You already agreed that "Federation" is out = of scope. I am just reminding you that and requesting to put it in the = charter. PLS see below..

I don't = think the text can simply say that CDN "Federation" is out of scope as = "Federation" is not a well understood term. So, how about we add in = the draft charter, under "In particular, the WG will not define:" = something like:

* overarching policies to be = followed by all the interconnected = CDNs

Francois

+ ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN = Federation" in scope?
+ Nabil: CDNI is = about interconnection only. Federation is a more controlled = environment which requires more policies.
+ Francois: CDNI only defines how to = interconnect two CDNs together. This can then be used in different ways, = such as allow many CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. But the = notion of "CDN Federation" itself is not in the scope.

>>interconnection of separately administered CDNs

Also, what about trust? Do you assume that = these two "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls = clarify.

Thanks.

Best.

Bhumip
On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le = Faucheur <flefauch@cisco.com> wrote:
Hi Bhumip,=20
On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:

You mean interconnection of TWO = separately administered CDNs, right . .anything beyond two is out of = scope . .

pls confirm and clarify that in the charter.

I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving = multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to = make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different = geographical footprint).

As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a = simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the = topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - = see http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg002= 24.html), but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a = call on, once the trade-offs are better understood.

So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the = generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs).

There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN = Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some = confusion since "federation" means different things to different people. = In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation = across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common = policies/services etc). While this may be one way that a CDNI solution = would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In = other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN = inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there = may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system = and therefore that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN = systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the = policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that = multi-CDN system.

Cheers

Francois

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the = >interconnection of separately administered CDNs

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le = Faucheur <flefauch@cisco.com> wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated = version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the charter = discussion/edits during the BOF.=20
Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment

Content Delivery Networks = Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft = Charter
---------------------------------------------------------------= -

Description of Working = Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such = content includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered = via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, = RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content = Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased = robustness of delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for = large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment = network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone = CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single = delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users = (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces = will be realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for = the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A = "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem and = a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing = scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and = protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more = urgent and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial = set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This = document will list the requirements stemming from the threat = analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface = will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the = downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection.

o CDNI metadata = distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs to exchange = distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers = to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the = distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content = acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or = access control).

o CDNI logging systems. = This interface will allow CDN logging systems to exchange logging = information associated with actions that are relevant across CDNs (such = as content distribution, content delivery and content routing = actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control systems. = In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or = invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for = aspects of the CDN Interconnection problem space that require direct = communication or interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport = or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a = CDN to an End User/User Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of = content or metadata between a CSP and a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and = algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent = Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.
- = Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess = the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream = CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with = making CDNI request routing decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months: = Submit CDNI problem statement = to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: = Submit CDNI framework to IESG = as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: = Submit specification of the = CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata = Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or = dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, = Richard wrote:

Folks,

I wanted everyone to have = an updated version of the CDNI draft charter below, for discussion at = the BOF shortly. This is based on input from many people this week, = including people that attended the informal CDNI gathering last night. = It is available online at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt= >, and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart&g= t;.

The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#w= g-cdni>.

-- Rich and Francois

Content= Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft = Charter
---------------------------------------------------------------= -

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an = infrastructure of network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, = arranged for the efficient distribution and delivery of = digital content. Such content includes, but is not limited to, web = pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media = delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide = services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for = multi-service content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable = content, improved quality of experience for end users and increased = robustness of delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for = large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered = over IP networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their = infrastructure and many Network Service Providers and Enterprise = Service Providers are deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of = the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given item of content can be = delivered to an end user regardless of that end user's location or = attachment network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) = standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as = a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the = interconnection of separately administered CDNs in support of the = end-to-end delivery of content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and = ultimately to end users (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG = aims at delivering a targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe = (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the = CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for = transport and message exchange, and using existing object = notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and = semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are = deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following = items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a = description of the problem and a common terminology.

- A = "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications of = the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the = different components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and = relate to one another.

- A "requirements" document. This = document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols = to support it. In particular, this document will focus on identifying = a reasonable set of more urgent and important requirements that = will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions = produced by the working group.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of:

   = o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform = request redirection.

   o CDNI metadata distribution = systems. This interface will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution = metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the subset = of content metadata that is relevant to the distribution of the = content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may = include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, = enforcement of availability windows or access control).

   o CDNI logging systems. This = interface will allow CDN logging systems to exchange logging information = associated with actions that are relevant across CDNs (such as = content distribution, content delivery and content routing actions) = for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

   o CDN control systems. In = particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or = invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss = and address the security (including threat model), management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of = the CDN Interconnection problem space that require direct communication = or interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will = not define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a = CSP and a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across = CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications = consuming CDNI logs.

The WG will work with other WGs to = assess, and where appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those = WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. = For example, the WG may assess the suitability of the ALTO protocol = as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which = may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing = decisions.

Goals & = Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
&n= bsp;
WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI = problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: = Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to = IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: = Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 = months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + = 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or = dissolve

_____________________________________________= __
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni
=

____________________________________________= ___
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

=
Francois Le = Faucheur
Distinguished = Engineer
Corporate Development
flefauch@cisco.com
Phone: +33 49 723 2619
Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 = 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
400 Ave de = Roumanille
06410 Sophia Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

=

Think before you = print.

This email may = contain confidential and privileged material for the sole use of the = intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosure by = others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (or = authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by = reply email and delete all copies of this message.

Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone.

For corporate legal information go to:
http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/= index.html
Francois Le = Faucheur
Distinguished = Engineer
Corporate Development
Cisco Systems = France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 Sophia = Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

Think before you = print.
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filename=green.gif Content-Type: image/gif; name="green.gif" Content-Id: R0lGODlhEgATAJEAAAAAAP///wCZAP///yH5BAEAAAMALAAAAAASABMAAAIojI+pGyK8nINqUiTf bVnfvHEg1UmhdZRqaawu6XZVjKb0/CYxo8JOAQA7 --Apple-Mail-390--311730915-- --Apple-Mail-389--311730916-- From flefauch@cisco.com Fri Apr 8 05:27:39 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 334573A69FB for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 05:27:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.093 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.093 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.505, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SWTW9ccU3EBH for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 05:27:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-2.cisco.com (ams-iport-2.cisco.com [144.254.224.141]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1469D3A68DC for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 05:27:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=flefauch@cisco.com; l=2468; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1302265763; x=1303475363; h=subject:mime-version:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id: references:to; bh=5bqRWtUiau5Q09KFePGwxNi0C5dpPfZtBGZHqv/YFyc=; b=YkNIBeBhhjueVTybD1M1yJeq/TNY3PNwArvip8KdUNIPKY6c+LPNbscI tD1fESmDZURJYAkeS5KfV55SpA1urC54r+OqUgYkqlUdaij4+quixQEZp IHaMbd2BDpzAfkw5pdZaZf81BreNoO/QxqTRbAgHJ6zo50rxZoQ6X9sWZ A=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.63,323,1299456000"; d="scan'208,217";a="24983577" Received: from ams-core-2.cisco.com ([144.254.72.75]) by ams-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 08 Apr 2011 12:29:22 +0000 Received: from ams-flefauch-8714.cisco.com (ams-flefauch-8714.cisco.com [10.55.161.197]) by ams-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p38CTL8Y016441; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 12:29:21 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1082) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-391--311419484 From: Francois Le Faucheur In-Reply-To: <2C53310A-159D-4029-8860-CD1C4005D3E6@gmx.net> Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 14:30:11 +0200 Message-Id: <65B6208F-244D-44C0-AA4D-6D7084D74650@cisco.com> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> <2C53310A-159D-4029-8860-CD1C4005D3E6@gmx.net> To: Hannes Tschofenig X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1082) Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] Trust Model Re: Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 12:27:39 -0000 --Apple-Mail-391--311419484 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On 8 Apr 2011, at 12:18, Hannes Tschofenig wrote: >=20 > On Apr 8, 2011, at 1:12 PM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >=20 >> Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >>=20 >=20 > Trust is a fuzzy term. Typically, you have to indicate for what = purpose they trust each other.=20 >=20 With respect to the draft charter, the proposal is that the charter = explicitly mentions that the trust model be documented in one of the = deliverables. Latest posted draft charter says: " This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing the = security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues = specific to CDNI. " It sounds like you guys are agreeing this needs to be discussed & = documented. Thanks Francois= --Apple-Mail-391--311419484 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii
On 8 Apr 2011, at 12:18, Hannes Tschofenig wrote:

On Apr 8, 2011, at 1:12 PM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:

Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.

Trust is a fuzzy term. Typically, you have to indicate for what purpose they trust each other.

With respect to the draft charter, the proposal is that the charter explicitly mentions that the trust model be documented in one of the deliverables.

Latest posted draft charter says:
"

This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI.
"

It sounds like you guys are agreeing this needs to be discussed & documented.

Thanks

Francois
--Apple-Mail-391--311419484-- From eburger@standardstrack.com Fri Apr 8 12:41:18 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E2533A69CF for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 12:41:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.864 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.864 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.661, BAYES_00=-2.599, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id heTfuVg9fe3q for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 12:41:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gs19.inmotionhosting.com (gs19.inmotionhosting.com [66.117.3.189]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AABF63A6975 for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 12:41:15 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=default; d=standardstrack.com; h=Received:Subject:Mime-Version:Content-Type:From:In-Reply-To:Date:Cc:Message-Id:References:To:X-Mailer; b=Iq0a9Y8MGO6IbndNyZwa7tf7HN2niXBZpV9cQpfkt9j2cDMsqXHhnEkjB+WfXpznWoi334Y4KW4UFElw+1zuLbHVzItzNGYTsBrsXt+HWgqo+vyjf1knuZ++Rn908/Uu; Received: from ip68-100-199-8.dc.dc.cox.net ([68.100.199.8] helo=[192.168.15.134]) by gs19.inmotionhosting.com with esmtpa (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Q8HZl-0007Ub-Cj; Fri, 08 Apr 2011 12:42:38 -0700 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-42--285452743; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 From: Eric Burger In-Reply-To: Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 15:42:57 -0400 Message-Id: <19640EB1-2913-4FA3-99F3-90B16F1EBE01@standardstrack.com> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> To: Bhumip Khasnabish X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - gs19.inmotionhosting.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - ietf.org X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [47 12] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - standardstrack.com Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 19:41:18 -0000 --Apple-Mail-42--285452743 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 While Federation in not in scope, what is the value of explicitly saying = it is out of scope? Will that not show up in the milestones and the = fact the focus is on two-party interconnect? It is one thing to say we are not going to work on Federation. It is = another to say we are going to ensure Federation cannot happen. On Apr 8, 2011, at 6:12 AM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > Hi Francois, > =20 > You already agreed that "Federation" is out of scope. I am just = reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see = below.. > =20 > + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN = Federation" in scope? > + Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only. Federation is a more = controlled environment which requires more policies. > + Francois: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. = This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to = interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is = not in the scope. > =20 > >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs >=20 > Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. > =20 > Thanks. > =20 > Best. > =20 > Bhumip >=20 > =20 > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: > Hi Bhumip, >=20 > On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >=20 >> You mean interconnection of TWO separately administered CDNs, right = . .anything beyond two is out of scope . . >> pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. >=20 > I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple = CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of = more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical = footprint).=20 > As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a = simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the = topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - = see http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), = but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once = the trade-offs are better understood. >=20 > So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic = target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). >=20 > There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN = Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some = confusion since "federation" means different things to different people. = In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation = across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common = policies/services etc). While this may be one way that a CDNI solution = would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In = other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN = inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there = may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system = and therefore that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN = systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the = policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that = multi-CDN system. >=20 > Cheers >=20 > Francois >=20 >> =20 >> =20 >> >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection = of separately administered CDNs >>=20 >> =20 >> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: >> Folks, >>=20 >> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs. >>=20 >> Francois & Rich >>=20 >> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment >>=20 >>=20 >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>=20 >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>=20 >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>=20 >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>=20 >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of = separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>=20 >> The working group will focus on the following items: >>=20 >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>=20 >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>=20 >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI. >>=20 >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and = important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI = protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document = will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be = met by each of the CDNI interfaces. >>=20 >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>=20 >> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream = CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the = information necessary to perform request redirection. >>=20 >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the = CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution = metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to = the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content = acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access = control). >>=20 >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems = to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. >>=20 >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >>=20 >> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications. >>=20 >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>=20 >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >>=20 >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>=20 >>=20 >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata = Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >>=20 >>> Folks, >>> =20 >>> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft = charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input = from many people this week, including people that attended the informal = CDNI gathering last night. It is available online at = , and has been = updated on the BOF wiki = . >>> =20 >>> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: = . >>> =20 >>> -- Rich and Francois >>> =20 >>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>> =20 >>> Description of Working Group >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>> =20 >>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>> =20 >>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>> =20 >>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>> =20 >>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>> =20 >>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>> =20 >>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>> =20 >>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>> =20 >>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. >>> =20 >>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. >>> =20 >>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>> =20 >>> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection. >>> =20 >>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will = allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >>> =20 >>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN = logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions = that are relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content = delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, = analytics, monitoring, etc. >>> =20 >>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. >>> =20 >>> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat = model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the = above documents and specifications. >>> =20 >>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>> =20 >>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>> =20 >>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> Goals & Milestones >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> =20 >>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG = as Informational >>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>> =20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CDNi mailing list >>> CDNi@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> =20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Francois Le Faucheur > Distinguished Engineer > Corporate Development > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: +33 49 723 2619 > Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Cisco Systems France > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com >=20 >=20 > =20 >=20 >=20 > Think before you print. >=20 > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the = sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. >=20 > Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >=20 > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni --Apple-Mail-42--285452743 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIILHzCCBN0w 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Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D439C3A6976 for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 13:02:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.42]) by copdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503630.33070535; Fri, 08 Apr 2011 14:07:30 -0600 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB01.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::d1e7:20b5:9b63:21a6%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 16:04:28 -0400 From: "Woundy, Richard" To: Eric Burger , Bhumip Khasnabish Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter Thread-Index: AQHL9YHcSwP7yPA7WkabQiMOoBZlLpRT7aWAgAAVYQCAAJ9WgP//wBKg Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 20:04:27 +0000 Message-ID: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E2132@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> <19640EB1-2913-4FA3-99F3-90B16F1EBE01@standardstrack.com> In-Reply-To: <19640EB1-2913-4FA3-99F3-90B16F1EBE01@standardstrack.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.191.223.245] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 20:02:52 -0000 KG5vdCB3ZWFyaW5nIG15IEJvZiBjby1jaGFpciBoYXQpDQoNCkkgYWdyZWUgd2l0aCBFcmljIC0t IHdoYXQgaXNzdWVzIGFyZSB3ZSBzb2x2aW5nIGJ5IGV4cGxpY2l0bHkgc2F5aW5nIGluIHRoZSBj aGFydGVyIHRoYXQgQ0ROIGZlZGVyYXRpb24gaXMgb3V0IG9mIHNjb3BlPyBPciBieSBzYXlpbmcg 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Lg0KPiANCj4gRm9yIGNvcnBvcmF0ZSBsZWdhbCBpbmZvcm1hdGlvbiBnbyB0bzoNCj4gaHR0cDov L3d3dy5jaXNjby5jb20vd2ViL2Fib3V0L2RvaW5nX2J1c2luZXNzL2xlZ2FsL2NyaS9pbmRleC5o dG1sDQo+IA0KPiANCj4gDQo+IA0KPiANCj4gICBfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiBDRE5pIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiBDRE5pQGlldGYub3Jn DQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vY2RuaQ0KDQo= From grant.watson@bt.com Fri Apr 8 13:15:58 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0DDE3A696D for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 13:15:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.446 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.446 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.600, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, J_CHICKENPOX_41=0.6, J_CHICKENPOX_51=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fHcYwf6SZlhV for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 13:15:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtpe1.intersmtp.com (smtp61.intersmtp.COM [62.239.224.234]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02AA13A694F for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 13:15:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from EVMHT68-UKRD.domain1.systemhost.net (10.36.3.105) by RDW083A005ED61.smtp-e1.hygiene.service (10.187.98.10) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.3.106.1; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 21:17:32 +0100 Received: from EMV64-UKRD.domain1.systemhost.net ([169.254.2.26]) by EVMHT68-UKRD.domain1.systemhost.net ([10.36.3.105]) with mapi; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 21:17:32 +0100 From: To: , , Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 21:17:32 +0100 Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter Thread-Index: AQHL9YHcSwP7yPA7WkabQiMOoBZlLpRT7aWAgAAVYQCAAJ9WgP//wBKggAADZLY= Message-ID: <1F3DE948AD28CB4D905D51039D081AF62627BF429F@EMV64-UKRD.domain1.systemhost.net> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> <19640EB1-2913-4FA3-99F3-90B16F1EBE01@standardstrack.com>, <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E2132@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> In-Reply-To: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E2132@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> Accept-Language: en-US, en-GB Content-Language: en-GB X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US, en-GB Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 20:15:59 -0000 (not wearing any hat) I agree with Rich + Eric. I don't understand the gain from explicitly decla= ring "federation" out of scope, I think that constraining the charter in th= is way seems to be more an attempt to address concern about topology or qty= of CDN rather than the business model as I currently understand it to be. = Either way I don't see a problem with leaving the Charter open in this resp= ect, then let the business model evolve....hopefully consuming CDNI. Grant ________________________________________ From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Woundy, Ri= chard [Richard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com] Sent: 08 April 2011 21:04 To: Eric Burger; Bhumip Khasnabish Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter (not wearing my Bof co-chair hat) I agree with Eric -- what issues are we solving by explicitly saying in the= charter that CDN federation is out of scope? Or by saying that CDN interco= nnection is between *two* CDNs? In the meeting, Eric raised the issue of 'transitive trust', and the meetin= g participants seemed to think that this was a worthy issue to discuss. But= 'transitive trust' implies at least *three* CDNs, right? I am worried that we are trying to constrain the charter in ways that precl= ude future business models. Some people see opportunities for bi-lateral bu= siness arrangements with CDNI, others see opportunities for multi-lateral b= usiness arrangements. There are pros and cons for each model. Do you have c= ompelling reasons why the IETF needs to choose the winning business model r= ight now? What if the right business model changes over time? And as a reminder, the IETF doesn't specify business models. It specifies o= pen interfaces that might be used by various business models. -- Rich -----Original Message----- From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Eri= c Burger Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 3:43 PM To: Bhumip Khasnabish Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter While Federation in not in scope, what is the value of explicitly saying it= is out of scope? Will that not show up in the milestones and the fact the= focus is on two-party interconnect? It is one thing to say we are not going to work on Federation. It is anoth= er to say we are going to ensure Federation cannot happen. On Apr 8, 2011, at 6:12 AM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > Hi Francois, > > You already agreed that "Federation" is out of scope. I am just remindin= g you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see below.. > > + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN Federati= on" in scope? > + Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only. Federation is a more control= led environment which requires more policies. > + Francois: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. This= can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to interconnec= t to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is not in the sco= pe. > > >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs > > Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately administ= ered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. > > Thanks. > > Best. > > Bhumip > > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: > Hi Bhumip, > > On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > >> You mean interconnection of TWO separately administered CDNs, right . .= anything beyond two is out of scope . . >> pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. > > I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple CDN= s. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of more t= han one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical footprin= t). > As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a simpl= er initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topologies of C= DNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see http://www.iet= f.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), but we felt this is som= ething the WG would have to make a call on, once the trade-offs are better = understood. > > So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic ta= rget (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). > > There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN Federation= " was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some confusion since= "federation" means different things to different people. In my mind, "CDN = Federation" implies particular modes of operation across the multiple inter= connected CDNs (e.g. they share some common policies/services etc). While t= his may be one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond wh= at a CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would def= ine how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with aware= ness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the over= all system and therefore that delivery features need to operate in multi-CD= N systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the policies/servic= es that may, or may not, be offered on top of that multi-CDN system. > > Cheers > > Francois > >> >> >> >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection >> >of separately administered CDNs >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur wrote: >> Folks, >> >> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the cha= rter discussion/edits during the BOF. >> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft = charter is assessed by the ADs. >> >> Francois & Rich >> >> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on >> comment >> >> >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network element= s operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distribu= tion and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but is not lim= ited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuo= us media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide servic= es to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). >> >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service cont= ent delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved qu= ality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For= these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. >> >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP netwo= rks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many Ne= twork Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying thei= r own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable tha= t a given item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of tha= t end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for interc= onnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collect= ively behave as a single delivery infrastructure. >> >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of se= parately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of content= from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their res= pective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployable= solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It= is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF = protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing object not= ation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. = In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary= by the WG, the WG will recharter. >> >> The working group will focus on the following items: >> >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem = and a common terminology. >> >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and >> applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >> >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different compon= ents of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one anot= her. This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing the sec= urity concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specific to = CDNI. >> >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CD= NI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this docume= nt will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important = requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols an= d solutions produced by the working group. This document will list the requ= irements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of the CDN= I interfaces. >> >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & i= nteroperation of: >> >> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CD= N request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information = necessary to perform request redirection. >> >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs= to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadat= a refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the distribu= tion of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, = this may include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, e= nforcement of availability windows or access control). >> >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to= exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant acr= oss CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content routin= g actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. >> >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstr= eam CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >> >> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational= issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. >> >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Inte= rconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperati= on between CDNs. >> >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Ag= ent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a= CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >> >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, levera= ge protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requireme= nts and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of = the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange infor= mation which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing decis= ions. >> >> >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as >> Informational WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG >> as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to >> IESG as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI >> requirements to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 18 months: >> Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as >> Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of >> the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + >> 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to >> IESG as proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Submit >> specification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as >> Proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >> >> >> >> >> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >> >>> Folks, >>> >>> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter = below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from many = people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gatherin= g last night. It is available online at , and has been updated on the BOF wiki . >>> >>> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: . >>> >>> -- Rich and Francois >>> >>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> Description of Working Group >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> >>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elemen= ts operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distrib= ution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but is not li= mited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continu= ous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide servi= ces to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). >>> >>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service con= tent delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved q= uality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. Fo= r these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. >>> >>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP netw= orks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many N= etwork Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying the= ir own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable th= at a given item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of th= at end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for inter= connecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collec= tively behave as a single delivery infrastructure. >>> >>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of s= eparately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of conten= t from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their re= spective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployabl= e solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. I= t is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF= protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing object no= tation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and semantics.= In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed necessar= y by the WG, the WG will recharter. >>> >>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>> >>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem= and a common terminology. >>> >>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and >>> applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>> >>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different compo= nents of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one ano= ther. >>> >>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for C= DNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this docum= ent will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important= requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols a= nd solutions produced by the working group. >>> >>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & = interoperation of: >>> >>> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface w= ill allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstr= eam CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. >>> >>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow= the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distributio= n metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the= distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for = example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-bl= ocking, enforcement of availability windows or access control). >>> >>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging s= ystems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are rel= evant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and conte= nt routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. >>> >>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow= an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >>> >>> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), = management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above docume= nts and specifications. >>> >>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Int= erconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperat= ion between CDNs. >>> >>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User A= gent. >>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and = a CDN. >>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>> >>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, lever= age protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirem= ents and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of= the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange info= rmation which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing deci= sions. >>> >>> >>> Goals & Milestones >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> >>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as= Informational >>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informa= tional >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informa= tional >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Info= rmational >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request= Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging= interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control= interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadat= a Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CDNi mailing list >>> CDNi@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> >> >> >> > > > > Francois Le Faucheur > Distinguished Engineer > Corporate Development > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: +33 49 723 2619 > Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 > > > > Cisco Systems France > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com > > > > > > Think before you print. > > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole = use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosure = by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (or= authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by rep= ly email and delete all copies of this message. > > Cisco Systems France, Soci?t? ? responsabiit? limit?e, Rue Camille Desmou= lins - Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Moulineaux, Au ca= pital de 91.470 EUR, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la publication:= Jean-Luc Michel Givone. > > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni _______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni From richard_woundy@cable.comcast.com Fri Apr 8 13:16:31 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF3133A694F for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 13:16:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.867 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.867 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.133, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2BNgeSuI+kf9 for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 13:16:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 739643A68CB for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 13:16:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.41]) by copdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503630.33073251; Fri, 08 Apr 2011 14:20:55 -0600 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB02.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::11d4:f530:37a0:9f4e%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 16:17:59 -0400 From: "Woundy, Richard" To: Bhumip Khasnabish , Francois Le Faucheur Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter Thread-Index: AQHL9YHcSwP7yPA7WkabQiMOoBZlLpRT7aWAgAAVYQCAAGJ9AA== Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 20:17:58 +0000 Message-ID: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E219B@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.191.223.245] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E219BPACDCEXMB05cabl_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 20:16:31 -0000 --_000_1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E219BPACDCEXMB05cabl_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 KG5vdCB3ZWFyaW5nIGNvLWNoYWlyIGhhdCkNCg0KPiBBbHNvLCB3aGF0IGFib3V0IHRydXN0PyBE byB5b3UgYXNzdW1lIHRoYXQgdGhlc2UgdHdvICJzZXBhcmF0ZWx5IGFkbWluaXN0ZXJlZCBDRE5z IiB0cnVzdCBlYWNoIG90aGVyPyBQbHMgY2xhcmlmeS4NCg0KWW91ciBxdWVzdGlvbiBhYm91dCDi gJh0cnVzdOKAmSBpcyBhbWJpZ3VvdXMuDQoNCkxldOKAmXMgdXNlIGEgcHJhY3RpY2FsIGV4YW1w bGUuIFdlIGhhZCBDRE5JIHByZXNlbnRhdGlvbnMgZnJvbSBhIFZlcml6b24gZW1wbG95ZWUgKE5h YmlsIEJpdGFyICkgYW5kIGEgQ29tY2FzdCBlbXBsb3llZSAoWWl1IExlZSkuIEluIHRoZSBVUywg VmVyaXpvbiBhbmQgQ29tY2FzdCBjb21wZXRlIHZpZ29yb3VzbHkgZm9yIGJyb2FkYmFuZC9waG9u ZS9UViBjdXN0b21lcnMuIEJ1dCBJIGNvdWxkIGltYWdpbmUgdGhhdCBWZXJpem9uIGFuZCBDb21j 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amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.277 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.277 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.274, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_41=0.6, J_CHICKENPOX_51=0.6, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jC4Ugqh+6Pl9 for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 15:02:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailex.mailcore.me (mailex.mailcore.me [94.136.40.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 125BA3A6A1F for ; Fri, 8 Apr 2011 15:02:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cpc22-cmbg15-2-0-cust173.5-4.cable.virginmedia.com ([86.27.176.174] helo=[192.168.0.202]) by mail5.atlas.pipex.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Q8Jmk-0006MT-7b; Fri, 08 Apr 2011 23:04:11 +0100 References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> <19640EB1-2913-4FA3-99F3-90B16F1EBE01@standardstrack.com>, <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E2132@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <1F3DE948AD28CB4D905D51039D081AF62627BF429F@EMV64-UKRD.domain1.systemhost.net> In-Reply-To: <1F3DE948AD28CB4D905D51039D081AF62627BF429F@EMV64-UKRD.domain1.systemhost.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1078) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-Id: <3F149FF7-B0C4-436B-A8D8-B2A4612F2735@niven-jenkins.co.uk> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable From: Benjamin Niven-Jenkins Date: Fri, 8 Apr 2011 23:04:07 +0100 To: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1078) X-Mailcore-Auth: 9600544 X-Mailcore-Domain: 172912 Cc: cdni@ietf.org, eburger@standardstrack.com Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Apr 2011 22:02:29 -0000 +1 I think the point being made in the BoF is that the expectation is that = any information exchange would happen between two parties at a time = (e.g. a client/server request/response mechanism would be a sufficient = solution for exchanging CDNI information), not that the scope is limited = to interconnection of only two CDNs. I don't see any need to write that explicitly in the charter though. IMO the charter is fine as it is and is good to go to the ADs/IESG for = approval. Ben On 8 Apr 2011, at 21:17, = wrote: >=20 > (not wearing any hat) >=20 > I agree with Rich + Eric. I don't understand the gain from explicitly = declaring "federation" out of scope, I think that constraining the = charter in this way seems to be more an attempt to address concern about = topology or qty of CDN rather than the business model as I currently = understand it to be. Either way I don't see a problem with leaving the = Charter open in this respect, then let the business model = evolve....hopefully consuming CDNI. >=20 > Grant >=20 > ________________________________________ > From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of = Woundy, Richard [Richard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com] > Sent: 08 April 2011 21:04 > To: Eric Burger; Bhumip Khasnabish > Cc: cdni@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >=20 > (not wearing my Bof co-chair hat) >=20 > I agree with Eric -- what issues are we solving by explicitly saying = in the charter that CDN federation is out of scope? Or by saying that = CDN interconnection is between *two* CDNs? >=20 > In the meeting, Eric raised the issue of 'transitive trust', and the = meeting participants seemed to think that this was a worthy issue to = discuss. But 'transitive trust' implies at least *three* CDNs, right? >=20 > I am worried that we are trying to constrain the charter in ways that = preclude future business models. Some people see opportunities for = bi-lateral business arrangements with CDNI, others see opportunities for = multi-lateral business arrangements. There are pros and cons for each = model. Do you have compelling reasons why the IETF needs to choose the = winning business model right now? What if the right business model = changes over time? >=20 > And as a reminder, the IETF doesn't specify business models. It = specifies open interfaces that might be used by various business models. >=20 > -- Rich >=20 > -----Original Message----- > From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf = Of Eric Burger > Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 3:43 PM > To: Bhumip Khasnabish > Cc: cdni@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >=20 > While Federation in not in scope, what is the value of explicitly = saying it is out of scope? Will that not show up in the milestones and = the fact the focus is on two-party interconnect? >=20 > It is one thing to say we are not going to work on Federation. It is = another to say we are going to ensure Federation cannot happen. >=20 >=20 > On Apr 8, 2011, at 6:12 AM, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >=20 >> Hi Francois, >>=20 >> You already agreed that "Federation" is out of scope. I am just = reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see = below.. >>=20 >> + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN = Federation" in scope? >> + Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only. Federation is a more = controlled environment which requires more policies. >> + Francois: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. = This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to = interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is = not in the scope. >>=20 >>>> interconnection of separately administered CDNs >>=20 >> Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >>=20 >> Thanks. >>=20 >> Best. >>=20 >> Bhumip >>=20 >>=20 >> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: >> Hi Bhumip, >>=20 >> On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >>=20 >>> You mean interconnection of TWO separately administered CDNs, right = . .anything beyond two is out of scope . . >>> pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. >>=20 >> I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple = CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of = more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical = footprint). >> As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a = simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the = topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - = see http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), = but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once = the trade-offs are better understood. >>=20 >> So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the = generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). >>=20 >> There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN = Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some = confusion since "federation" means different things to different people. = In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation = across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common = policies/services etc). While this may be one way that a CDNI solution = would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In = other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN = inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there = may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system = and therefore that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN = systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the = policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that = multi-CDN system. >>=20 >> Cheers >>=20 >> Francois >>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection >>>> of separately administered CDNs >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: >>> Folks, >>>=20 >>> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >>> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs. >>>=20 >>> Francois & Rich >>>=20 >>> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on >>> comment >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>=20 >>> Description of Working Group >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>>=20 >>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>>=20 >>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>>=20 >>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>>=20 >>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>>=20 >>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>>=20 >>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>>=20 >>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and >>> applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>>=20 >>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI. >>>=20 >>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This = document will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis = and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces. >>>=20 >>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>>=20 >>> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an = upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN = the information necessary to perform request redirection. >>>=20 >>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the = CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution = metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to = the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content = acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access = control). >>>=20 >>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging = systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. >>>=20 >>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >>>=20 >>> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications. >>>=20 >>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>>=20 >>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >>>=20 >>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Goals & Milestones >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>=20 >>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as >>> Informational WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG >>> as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to >>> IESG as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI >>> requirements to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 18 months: >>> Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG = as >>> Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of >>> the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation = + >>> 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to >>> IESG as proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Submit >>> specification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as >>> Proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >>>=20 >>>> Folks, >>>>=20 >>>> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft = charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input = from many people this week, including people that attended the informal = CDNI gathering last night. It is available online at = , and has been = updated on the BOF wiki = . >>>>=20 >>>> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: = . >>>>=20 >>>> -- Rich and Francois >>>>=20 >>>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>=20 >>>> Description of Working Group >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>=20 >>>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>>>=20 >>>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>>>=20 >>>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>>>=20 >>>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>>>=20 >>>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>>>=20 >>>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>>>=20 >>>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and >>>> applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>>>=20 >>>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. >>>>=20 >>>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. >>>>=20 >>>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of: >>>>=20 >>>> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection. >>>>=20 >>>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will = allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >>>>=20 >>>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN = logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions = that are relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content = delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, = analytics, monitoring, etc. >>>>=20 >>>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. >>>>=20 >>>> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat = model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the = above documents and specifications. >>>>=20 >>>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>>>=20 >>>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>>>=20 >>>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> Goals & Milestones >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>=20 >>>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to = IESG as Informational >>>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>>>=20 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> CDNi mailing list >>>> CDNi@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CDNi mailing list >>> CDNi@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> Francois Le Faucheur >> Distinguished Engineer >> Corporate Development >> flefauch@cisco.com >> Phone: +33 49 723 2619 >> Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> Cisco Systems France >> Greenside >> 400 Ave de Roumanille >> 06410 Sophia Antipolis >> France >> Cisco.com >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> Think before you print. >>=20 >> This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the = sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. >>=20 >> Cisco Systems France, Soci?t? ? responsabiit? limit?e, Rue Camille = Desmoulins - Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les = Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 EUR, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >>=20 >> For corporate legal information go to: >> http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >=20 > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni From vumip1@gmail.com Sat Apr 9 18:27:08 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 189873A6988 for ; Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:27:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.353 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.353 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.245, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eiqpk0g7lTT4 for ; Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:27:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-gy0-f172.google.com (mail-gy0-f172.google.com [209.85.160.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 53CD23A6905 for ; Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:27:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by gyf3 with SMTP id 3so2214500gyf.31 for ; Sat, 09 Apr 2011 18:28:50 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=ub7jH/SpJEXcayrqPJDCfg/+a/9YnBokKppMpE6Tq90=; b=eBSzXpRFBllQXXmxx6/J6jT/aE915aRDwlQqfF8iT3/HBRsWgd+dfdY6fcJeyYbHnu x35d4r5T4/nQdl6LNEl7JmR8yPbEDFPXQVytCF4/T9h40hVNEHKWcWnrrZRREugVeQr3 UMRgbX+bYC2QoJaKIXj6DgVhTFI0VhekTxJuI= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=oVGrxLRdSoOy6AoKGEvCWC/V/AgwHneLP4xXQdl7zYgSJzntgQWixMQ0vcN6349MFh Fcv7Oj2GfGK05kevNgOdpUmPjxfe90Srd9VsxN/4mlqN1CP5rlZA1gfhXGKfAFophYnP GrOMmhHidmYV0+37I3+KoObEyrY1CM+ufKIvQ= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.236.111.19 with SMTP id v19mr4752596yhg.444.1302398928586; Sat, 09 Apr 2011 18:28:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.108.161 with HTTP; Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:28:48 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E219B@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E219B@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 21:28:48 -0400 Message-ID: From: Bhumip Khasnabish To: "Woundy, Richard" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0023547c90df7e893504a0866194 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 01:27:08 -0000 --0023547c90df7e893504a0866194 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I see. Now if one CDN operator connects to another CDN operator without pre-defined (a) security of the signaling/control interface, and (b) policy for volume/type/... of content exchange, this could that open up both trust and regulatory concerns ... On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard < Richard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote: > (not wearing co-chair hat) > > > > >* Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately > administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. > > > > Your question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous. > > > > Let=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizon > employee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Veri= zon > and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I co= uld > imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnection, > perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher > quality service to their respective customers. > > > > So in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they > not? > > > > There isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92s= why > the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model. > > > > -- Rich > > > > *From:* cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf O= f > *Bhumip Khasnabish > *Sent:* Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM > *To:* Francois Le Faucheur > > *Cc:* cdni@ietf.org > *Subject:* Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter > > > > Hi Francois, > > > > You already agreed that "*Federation"* is out of scope. I am just > reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see below= .. > > > > + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN > Federation" in scope? > + *Nabil*: CDNI is about interconnection only. *Federation is a more > controlled environment which requires more policies.** > *+ *Francois*: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. > This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to > interconnect to many CDNs. *But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is > not in the scope.* > > > > >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs > > > *Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately > administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Best. > > > > Bhumip > > > > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur > wrote: > > Hi Bhumip, > > > > On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > > > > You mean interconnection of *TWO* separately administered CDNs, right . > .anything beyond two is out of scope . . > > pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. > > > > I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple CDN= s. > For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of more th= an > one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical footprint)= . > > As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a simpl= er > initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topologies of CD= Ns > to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see > http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), but we > felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once the > trade-offs are better understood. > > > > So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic > target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). > > > > There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN Federation= " > was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some confusion since > "federation" means different things to different people. In my mind, "CDN > Federation" implies particular modes of operation across the multiple > interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common policies/services etc). > While this may be one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems > beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI W= G > would define how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, > with awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation= in > the overall system and therefore that delivery features need to operate i= n > multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the > policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that multi-C= DN > system. > > > > Cheers > > > > Francois > > > > > > > > >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection of > separately administered CDNs > > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur > wrote: > > Folks, > > Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the > charter discussion/edits during the BOF. > > Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft > charter is assessed by the ADs. > > Francois & Rich > > PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on comme= nt > > > > > Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > Description of Working Group > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D > > A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements > operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient > distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but = is > not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of > continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically prov= ide > services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). > > CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service conte= nt > delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved qual= ity > of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For the= se > reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. > > As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP > networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and > many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are > deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is general= ly > desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end > user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This > creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they c= an > interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure. > > The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of > separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of > content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via > their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, > deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the > industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using > existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using > existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI > objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new > protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. > > The working group will focus on the following items: > > - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem a= nd > a common terminology. > > - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications o= f > the CDNI solution and protocols > > - A "framework" document providing a description of the different > components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one > another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing t= he > security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specifi= c > to CDNI. > > - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CDN= I > architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this documen= t > will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important > requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and > solutions produced by the working group. This document will list the > requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of t= he > CDNI interfaces. > > - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & > interoperation of: > > o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CDN > request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information > necessary to perform request redirection. > > o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs = to > exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata > refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the > distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for > example, this may include information enabling: content > acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access > control). > > o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to > exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant > across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content > routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. > > o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstre= am > CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. > > The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational > issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. > > The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN > Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or > interoperation between CDNs. > > In particular, the WG will not define: > - New session, transport or network protocols. > - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User > Agent. > - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a > CDN. > - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. > - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. > - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. > - New applications consuming CDNI logs. > - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms > > The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverag= e > protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requiremen= ts > and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of th= e > ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange > information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routin= g > decisions. > > > Goals & Milestones > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Information= al > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routin= g > interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging > interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control > interface to IESG as proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata > Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve > > > > > On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: > > > Folks, > > I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter > below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from man= y > people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gather= ing > last night. It is available online at < > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>, and has been > updated on the BOF wiki < > http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>. > > The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: < > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni>. > > -- Rich and Francois > > Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > Description of Working Group > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D > > A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements > operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient > distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but = is > not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of > continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically prov= ide > services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). > > CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service conte= nt > delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved qual= ity > of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For the= se > reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. > > As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP > networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and > many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are > deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is general= ly > desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end > user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This > creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they c= an > interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure. > > The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of > separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of > content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via > their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, > deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by > the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized us= ing > existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using > existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI > objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new > protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. > > The working group will focus on the following items: > > - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem a= nd > a common terminology. > > - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications o= f > the CDNI solution and protocols > > - A "framework" document providing a description of the different > components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one > another. > > - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CDN= I > architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this documen= t > will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important > requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and > solutions produced by the working group. > > - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & > interoperation of: > > o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface wil= l > allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstrea= m > CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. > > o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow t= he > CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution > metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the > distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for > example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, > geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access control). > > o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging > systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are > relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and > content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitorin= g, > etc. > > o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow a= n > upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. > > The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), > management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above > documents and specifications. > > The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN > Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or > interoperation between CDNs. > > In particular, the WG will not define: > - New session, transport or network protocols. > - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User > Agent. > - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a > CDN. > - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. > - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. > - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. > - New applications consuming CDNI logs. > > The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverag= e > protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requiremen= ts > and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of th= e > ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange > information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routin= g > decisions. > > > Goals & Milestones > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request > Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging > interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control > interface to IESG as proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata > Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve > > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > > > > > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > > > > > > > > > > * > Francois Le Faucheur* > *Distinguished Engineer* > *Corporate Development* > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: *+33 49 723 2619* > Mobile: *+33 6 19 98 50 90* > > *Cisco Systems France* > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com > > > > > Think before you print. > > > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole > use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosur= e > by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (= or > authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by re= ply > email and delete all copies of this message. > > Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Cami= lle > Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mouline= aux, > Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la > publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. > > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html > > > > > > > > --0023547c90df7e893504a0866194 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I see. Now if one CDN operator connects to another CDN operator withou= t pre-defined

=A0

(a) security of the signaling/control interface, and

(b) policy for volume/type/... of content exchange,

=A0

this could that open up both trust and regulatory concerns ...

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard = <R= ichard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote:

(not= wearing co-chair hat)

=A0<= /span>

>= Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these t= wo "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.<= span style=3D"COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">

=A0<= /span>

Your= question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous.

=A0<= /span>

Let= =92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizon empl= oyee (Nabil=A0Bitar=A0) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Verizo= n and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I co= uld imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnection= , perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher q= uality service to their respective customers.

=A0<= /span>

So i= n this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they not?

=A0<= /span>

Ther= e isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92s why t= he proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model.

=A0<= /span>

-- R= ich

=A0<= /span>

From:<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf O= f Bhumip Khasnabish
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM
To: Francois Le Fauch= eur=20

Cc: cdni@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of= the CDNI charter

=A0

Hi Francois,

=A0

You already agreed that=A0 "Federation&= quot; is out of scope. I am just reminding you that and requesting= to put it in the charter. PLS see below..

=A0

+ ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs,= but is "CDN Federation" in scope?
+ Nabil:= =A0CDNI=A0is about interconnection only. Federation is a more contr= olled environment which requires more policies.
+ Francois:=A0CDNI=A0only defines how to interconnect = two CDNs together. This can then be used in different ways, such as allow m= any CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN = Federation" itself is not in the scope.

=A0

>>interconnection of separately administered C= DNs

Also, what about trust? Do you = assume that these two "separately administered CDNs" trust each o= ther? Pls clarify.

=A0

Thanks.

=A0

Best.

=A0

Bhumip

=A0

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur= <flefauch@cisco= .com> wrote:

Hi Bhumip,

=A0

On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:

You mean=A0 interconnection of TWO s= eparately administered CDNs, right . .anything beyond two is out of scope .= .

pls confirm and clarify that in the charter.

=A0

I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems i= nvolving multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able = to make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different = geographical footprint).=A0

As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possib= le to specify a simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions o= n the topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs= - see=A0http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/curre= nt/msg00224.html), but we felt this is something the WG would have to m= ake a call on, once the trade-offs are better understood.

=A0

So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open a= nd stating the generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs).

=A0

There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact= that "CDN Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may ha= ve created some confusion since "federation" means different thin= gs to different people. In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies part= icular modes of operation across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. the= y share some common policies/services etc). While this may be one way that = a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal = with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN inte= r-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there may be m= ultiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system and therefore= that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG= should not concern itself with the policies/services that may, or may not,= be offered on top of that multi-CDN system.

=A0

Cheers

=A0

Francois

=A0

=A0

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow t= he >interconnection of separately administered CDNs

=A0

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheu= r <flefauch@cisc= o.com> wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated version of the CDN= I draft charter reflecting the charter discussion/edits during the BOF.

Please bring forward t= he additional comments you have before this draft charter is assessed by th= e ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" comment= s for now, let's focus on comment

=A0

Content Delivery Networks Interconnection = (CDNI) - Draft Charter
-------------------------------------------------= ---------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elemen= ts operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distrib= ution and delivery of digital content.=A0Such content includes, but is not = limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of conti= nuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically=A0provide s= ervices to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service con= tent delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved q= uality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of delivery. = For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery= .

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP netw= orks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many N= etwork Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deploying t= heir own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable = that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardless o= f that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need f= or interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate an= d collectively behave as=A0a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of s= eparately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of conten= t from CSPs through multiple=A0CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their = respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deploya= ble solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed=A0by the industr= y. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing = IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing objec= t notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and sema= ntics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed ne= cessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "p= roblem statement" document providing a description of the problem and = a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing s= cenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the diffe= rent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate = to one another. This document will also=A0include a "threat analysis&q= uot; discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and priv= acy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirem= ents for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a=A0reasonable set of more urgent a= nd important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI= protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document will= =A0list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by= each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection &a= mp; interoperation of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interfac= e will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the down= stream CDN the information necessary to perform=A0request redirection.

o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDN= s to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metada= ta refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is relevant to the distr= ibution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for exampl= e, this may include information enabling: content acquisition,=A0geo-blocki= ng, enforcement of availability windows or access control).

o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems t= o exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant ac= ross CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content delivery and content rou= ting actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upst= ream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG= will discuss and address the security, management and operational issues s= pecific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Int= erconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperat= ion between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New se= ssion, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG= will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverage protoc= ols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements and C= DNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may assess the suitability of the ALT= O protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information = which may aid an upstream CDN with making=A0CDNI request routing decisions.=

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months:=A0 Submit CDNI problem state= ment to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months:=A0 Submit CDNI use= cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI = framework to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Information= al
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:= =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interf= ace to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed S= tandard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Recharter or dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote:

Folks,
=A0
I wanted everyone to have an update= d version of the CDNI draft charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortl= y. This is based on input from many people this week, including people that= attended the informal CDNI gathering last night. It is=A0available online = at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>= , and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.org= /bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>.
=A0
The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni&= gt;.
=A0
-- Rich and Francois
=A0
= Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
-------= ---------------------------------------------------------
=A0
Descrip= tion of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D
=A0
A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure o= f network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the e= fficient distribution and delivery of digital=A0content. Such content inclu= des, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and st= reaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typic= ally=A0provide services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).
=A0
CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improve= d quality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of deliver= y. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery.
=A0
As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP n= etworks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and man= y Network Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deployin= g their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirab= le that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardles= s of that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a nee= d for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate= and collectively behave=A0as a single delivery infrastructure.
=A0
The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection o= f separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of con= tent from CSPs through multiple CDNs=A0and ultimately to end users (via the= ir respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, depl= oyable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the=A0indu= stry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existi= ng IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing ob= ject notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and s= emantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed= necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.
=A0
The working group will focus on the following items:
=A0
- A &= quot;problem statement" document providing a description of the proble= m and a common terminology.
=A0
- A "use case" document des= cribing scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and proto= cols
=A0
- A "framework" document providing a description of the di= fferent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and rela= te to one another.
=A0
- A "requirements" document. This do= cument lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to su= pport it. In particular, this document will focus on identifying a=A0reason= able set of more urgent and important requirements that will be addressed i= n the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working g= roup.
=A0
- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection= & interoperation of:
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI request-routin= g systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN request= routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary= =A0to perform request redirection.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interfa= ce will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope= . Distribution metadata refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processe= d by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: content=A0ac= quisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access cont= rol).
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow = CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions= that are relevant across CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content del= ivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, m= onitoring, etc.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDN control systems. In particular, this interfa= ce will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstre= am CDN.
=A0
The WG will discuss and address the security (including t= hreat model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside th= e above documents and specifications.
=A0
The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interope= ration between CDNs.
=A0
In particular, the WG will not define:
- = New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
=A0
The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and whe= re appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to real= ize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may as= sess the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstrea= m CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CD= NI=A0request routing decisions.
=A0
=A0
Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=A0
WG Creation + 6 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Subm= it CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 month= s: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Infor= mational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI requirements t= o IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standar= d
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Loggi= ng interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 = =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as propo= sed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Metad= ata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24= months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Recharter or dissolve
=A0
_______________= ________________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDN= i@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

=A0

__________________= _____________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailm= an/listinfo/cdni

=A0

=A0

=A0

Francois Le Faucheur=
Distingu= ished Engineer
Corporate Development
flefauch= @cisco.com
Phone:=A0+33 49 723 2619
Mobile:=A0+33 6 19 98 50 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 So= phia Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

=A0

=

=A0= Think before you print.

This email may contain confidential and priv= ileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use= , distribution or disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are n= ot the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), ple= ase contact the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message= .

Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Ca= mille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mou= lineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de l= a publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone.

For corporate legal information go to:
http://= www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html
<= /td>

=A0

=A0
=
--0023547c90df7e893504a0866194-- From vumip1@gmail.com Sat Apr 9 18:43:05 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 872F63A6988 for ; Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:43:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.364 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.364 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.234, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xzIONYVS8kAa for ; Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:43:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yw0-f44.google.com (mail-yw0-f44.google.com [209.85.213.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63C593A694D for ; Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:42:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ywi6 with SMTP id 6so2213285ywi.31 for ; Sat, 09 Apr 2011 18:44:45 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=1kAg4Up5oVO07YHix5f2xaFUmJUJFh6rLg0Ozcje5NA=; b=Bc04EKNGA/cumPxqa5w3xCgFf5sBojuLyVj/GrcO6yp8taJmXGpomEBnX9MRV2jhu+ dqaKu5AVBopsYXNT9htuyghChsPh0d8FsAkGaWJQzw9gdarBXqMheWiSIqUD63LpgSBV lKWwpf14rdxCjkWfYeF2D+5YzyoiMPFiu3igo= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=N2KlXrTqadY19X9pApdFR3xYT/wLZ8kUAHPHKLiqoP8dQA0y7/4pczphA0uN1vaITK 8RtWi/dRNe6/pV6259cce9mnyXJEW5qMxRK5y3acoUU0M5P7Hok6MIlsJIoKCnUt98YX Ppl/eBX+yv9e0CzEnRngBtn/Z/2b/Guw1+2KQ= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.236.153.5 with SMTP id e5mr4782209yhk.511.1302399884233; Sat, 09 Apr 2011 18:44:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.108.161 with HTTP; Sat, 9 Apr 2011 18:44:44 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E219B@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E219B@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 21:44:44 -0400 Message-ID: From: Bhumip Khasnabish To: "Woundy, Richard" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf302ef828748cbe04a0869a6c Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 01:43:05 -0000 --20cf302ef828748cbe04a0869a6c Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >>*network* costs and/or to provide higher quality service to their >>respective customers. Layer 1 to 3 (physical to network) is out of scope, because the charter's opening statement says that "A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements operating at *layer 4 through layer 7*, arranged for the efficient distribution and delivery of digital content." .. the word "network" should probably be taken out of this statement ... On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard < Richard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote: > (not wearing co-chair hat) > > > > >* Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately > administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. > > > > Your question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous. > > > > Let=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizon > employee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Veri= zon > and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I co= uld > imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnection, > perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher > quality service to their respective customers. > > > > So in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they > not? > > > > There isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92s= why > the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model. > > > > -- Rich > > > > *From:* cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf O= f > *Bhumip Khasnabish > *Sent:* Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM > *To:* Francois Le Faucheur > > *Cc:* cdni@ietf.org > *Subject:* Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter > > > > Hi Francois, > > > > You already agreed that "*Federation"* is out of scope. I am just > reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see below= .. > > > > + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN > Federation" in scope? > + *Nabil*: CDNI is about interconnection only. *Federation is a more > controlled environment which requires more policies.** > *+ *Francois*: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. > This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to > interconnect to many CDNs. *But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is > not in the scope.* > > > > >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs > > > *Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately > administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Best. > > > > Bhumip > > > > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur > wrote: > > Hi Bhumip, > > > > On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: > > > > You mean interconnection of *TWO* separately administered CDNs, right . > .anything beyond two is out of scope . . > > pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. > > > > I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple CDN= s. > For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of more th= an > one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical footprint)= . > > As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a simpl= er > initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topologies of CD= Ns > to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see > http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), but we > felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once the > trade-offs are better understood. > > > > So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic > target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). > > > > There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN Federation= " > was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some confusion since > "federation" means different things to different people. In my mind, "CDN > Federation" implies particular modes of operation across the multiple > interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common policies/services etc). > While this may be one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems > beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI W= G > would define how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, > with awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation= in > the overall system and therefore that delivery features need to operate i= n > multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the > policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that multi-C= DN > system. > > > > Cheers > > > > Francois > > > > > > > > >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection of > separately administered CDNs > > > > > On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur > wrote: > > Folks, > > Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the > charter discussion/edits during the BOF. > > Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft > charter is assessed by the ADs. > > Francois & Rich > > PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on comme= nt > > > > > Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > Description of Working Group > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D > > A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements > operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient > distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but = is > not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of > continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically prov= ide > services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). > > CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service conte= nt > delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved qual= ity > of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For the= se > reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. > > As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP > networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and > many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are > deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is general= ly > desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end > user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This > creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they c= an > interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure. > > The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of > separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of > content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via > their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, > deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the > industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using > existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using > existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI > objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new > protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. > > The working group will focus on the following items: > > - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem a= nd > a common terminology. > > - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications o= f > the CDNI solution and protocols > > - A "framework" document providing a description of the different > components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one > another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing t= he > security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specifi= c > to CDNI. > > - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CDN= I > architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this documen= t > will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important > requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and > solutions produced by the working group. This document will list the > requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of t= he > CDNI interfaces. > > - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & > interoperation of: > > o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CDN > request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information > necessary to perform request redirection. > > o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs = to > exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata > refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the > distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for > example, this may include information enabling: content > acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access > control). > > o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to > exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant > across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content > routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. > > o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstre= am > CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. > > The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational > issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. > > The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN > Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or > interoperation between CDNs. > > In particular, the WG will not define: > - New session, transport or network protocols. > - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User > Agent. > - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a > CDN. > - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. > - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. > - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. > - New applications consuming CDNI logs. > - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms > > The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverag= e > protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requiremen= ts > and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of th= e > ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange > information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routin= g > decisions. > > > Goals & Milestones > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Information= al > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routin= g > interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging > interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control > interface to IESG as proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata > Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve > > > > > On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: > > > Folks, > > I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter > below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from man= y > people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gather= ing > last night. It is available online at < > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>, and has been > updated on the BOF wiki < > http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>. > > The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: < > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni>. > > -- Rich and Francois > > Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > Description of Working Group > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D > > A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements > operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient > distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but = is > not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of > continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically prov= ide > services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). > > CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service conte= nt > delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved qual= ity > of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For the= se > reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. > > As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP > networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and > many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are > deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is general= ly > desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end > user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This > creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they c= an > interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure. > > The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of > separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of > content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via > their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, > deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by > the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized us= ing > existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using > existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI > objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new > protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. > > The working group will focus on the following items: > > - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem a= nd > a common terminology. > > - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications o= f > the CDNI solution and protocols > > - A "framework" document providing a description of the different > components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one > another. > > - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CDN= I > architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this documen= t > will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important > requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and > solutions produced by the working group. > > - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & > interoperation of: > > o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface wil= l > allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstrea= m > CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. > > o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow t= he > CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution > metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the > distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for > example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, > geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access control). > > o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging > systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are > relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and > content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitorin= g, > etc. > > o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow a= n > upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. > > The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), > management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above > documents and specifications. > > The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN > Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or > interoperation between CDNs. > > In particular, the WG will not define: > - New session, transport or network protocols. > - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User > Agent. > - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a > CDN. > - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. > - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. > - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. > - New applications consuming CDNI logs. > > The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverag= e > protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requiremen= ts > and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of th= e > ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange > information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routin= g > decisions. > > > Goals & Milestones > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D > > WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as > Informational > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request > Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging > interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control > interface to IESG as proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata > Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve > > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > > > > > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > > > > > > > > > > * > Francois Le Faucheur* > *Distinguished Engineer* > *Corporate Development* > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: *+33 49 723 2619* > Mobile: *+33 6 19 98 50 90* > > *Cisco Systems France* > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com > > > > > Think before you print. > > > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole > use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosur= e > by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (= or > authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by re= ply > email and delete all copies of this message. > > Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Cami= lle > Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mouline= aux, > Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la > publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. > > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html > > > > > > > > --20cf302ef828748cbe04a0869a6c Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
>>network costs and/or to provide higher quality service to their >>resp= ective customers.

Layer 1 to 3 (physical to network) is out of scope, because the charte= r's opening statement says that=A0

"A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network= elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged f= or the efficient distribution and delivery of digital content."

=A0

.. the word "network" should probably be taken out of this s= tatement ...

=A0

=A0

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard = <R= ichard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote:

(not= wearing co-chair hat)

=A0<= /span>

>= Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these t= wo "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.<= span style=3D"COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">

=A0<= /span>

Your= question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous.

=A0<= /span>

Let= =92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizon empl= oyee (Nabil=A0Bitar=A0) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Verizo= n and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I co= uld imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnection= , perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher q= uality service to their respective customers.

=A0<= /span>

So i= n this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they not?

=A0<= /span>

Ther= e isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92s why t= he proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model.

=A0<= /span>

-- R= ich

=A0<= /span>

From:<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf O= f Bhumip Khasnabish
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM
To: Francois Le Fauch= eur=20

Cc: cdni@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of= the CDNI charter

=A0

Hi Francois,

=A0

You already agreed that=A0 "Federation&= quot; is out of scope. I am just reminding you that and requesting= to put it in the charter. PLS see below..

=A0

+ ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs,= but is "CDN Federation" in scope?
+ Nabil:= =A0CDNI=A0is about interconnection only. Federation is a more contr= olled environment which requires more policies.
+ Francois:=A0CDNI=A0only defines how to interconnect = two CDNs together. This can then be used in different ways, such as allow m= any CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN = Federation" itself is not in the scope.

=A0

>>interconnection of separately administered C= DNs

Also, what about trust? Do you = assume that these two "separately administered CDNs" trust each o= ther? Pls clarify.

=A0

Thanks.

=A0

Best.

=A0

Bhumip

=A0

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur= <flefauch@cisco= .com> wrote:

Hi Bhumip,

=A0

On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:

You mean=A0 interconnection of TWO s= eparately administered CDNs, right . .anything beyond two is out of scope .= .

pls confirm and clarify that in the charter.

=A0

I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems i= nvolving multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able = to make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different = geographical footprint).=A0

As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possib= le to specify a simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions o= n the topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs= - see=A0http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/curre= nt/msg00224.html), but we felt this is something the WG would have to m= ake a call on, once the trade-offs are better understood.

=A0

So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open a= nd stating the generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs).

=A0

There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact= that "CDN Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may ha= ve created some confusion since "federation" means different thin= gs to different people. In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies part= icular modes of operation across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. the= y share some common policies/services etc). While this may be one way that = a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal = with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN inte= r-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there may be m= ultiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system and therefore= that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG= should not concern itself with the policies/services that may, or may not,= be offered on top of that multi-CDN system.

=A0

Cheers

=A0

Francois

=A0

=A0

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow t= he >interconnection of separately administered CDNs

=A0

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheu= r <flefauch@cisc= o.com> wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated version of the CDN= I draft charter reflecting the charter discussion/edits during the BOF.

Please bring forward t= he additional comments you have before this draft charter is assessed by th= e ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" comment= s for now, let's focus on comment

=A0

Content Delivery Networks Interconnection = (CDNI) - Draft Charter
-------------------------------------------------= ---------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elemen= ts operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distrib= ution and delivery of digital content.=A0Such content includes, but is not = limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of conti= nuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically=A0provide s= ervices to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service con= tent delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved q= uality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of delivery. = For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery= .

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP netw= orks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many N= etwork Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deploying t= heir own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable = that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardless o= f that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need f= or interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate an= d collectively behave as=A0a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of s= eparately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of conten= t from CSPs through multiple=A0CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their = respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deploya= ble solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed=A0by the industr= y. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing = IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing objec= t notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and sema= ntics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed ne= cessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "p= roblem statement" document providing a description of the problem and = a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing s= cenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the diffe= rent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate = to one another. This document will also=A0include a "threat analysis&q= uot; discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and priv= acy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirem= ents for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a=A0reasonable set of more urgent a= nd important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI= protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document will= =A0list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by= each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection &a= mp; interoperation of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interfac= e will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the down= stream CDN the information necessary to perform=A0request redirection.

o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDN= s to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metada= ta refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is relevant to the distr= ibution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for exampl= e, this may include information enabling: content acquisition,=A0geo-blocki= ng, enforcement of availability windows or access control).

o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems t= o exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant ac= ross CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content delivery and content rou= ting actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upst= ream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG= will discuss and address the security, management and operational issues s= pecific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Int= erconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperat= ion between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New se= ssion, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG= will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverage protoc= ols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements and C= DNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may assess the suitability of the ALT= O protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information = which may aid an upstream CDN with making=A0CDNI request routing decisions.=

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months:=A0 Submit CDNI problem state= ment to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months:=A0 Submit CDNI use= cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI = framework to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Information= al
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:= =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interf= ace to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed S= tandard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Recharter or dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote:

Folks,
=A0
I wanted everyone to have an update= d version of the CDNI draft charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortl= y. This is based on input from many people this week, including people that= attended the informal CDNI gathering last night. It is=A0available online = at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>= , and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.org= /bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>.
=A0
The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni&= gt;.
=A0
-- Rich and Francois
=A0
= Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
-------= ---------------------------------------------------------
=A0
Descrip= tion of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D
=A0
A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure o= f network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the e= fficient distribution and delivery of digital=A0content. Such content inclu= des, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and st= reaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typic= ally=A0provide services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).
=A0
CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improve= d quality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of deliver= y. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery.
=A0
As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP n= etworks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and man= y Network Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deployin= g their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirab= le that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardles= s of that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a nee= d for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate= and collectively behave=A0as a single delivery infrastructure.
=A0
The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection o= f separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of con= tent from CSPs through multiple CDNs=A0and ultimately to end users (via the= ir respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, depl= oyable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the=A0indu= stry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existi= ng IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing ob= ject notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and s= emantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed= necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.
=A0
The working group will focus on the following items:
=A0
- A &= quot;problem statement" document providing a description of the proble= m and a common terminology.
=A0
- A "use case" document des= cribing scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and proto= cols
=A0
- A "framework" document providing a description of the di= fferent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and rela= te to one another.
=A0
- A "requirements" document. This do= cument lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to su= pport it. In particular, this document will focus on identifying a=A0reason= able set of more urgent and important requirements that will be addressed i= n the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working g= roup.
=A0
- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection= & interoperation of:
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI request-routin= g systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN request= routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary= =A0to perform request redirection.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interfa= ce will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope= . Distribution metadata refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processe= d by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: content=A0ac= quisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access cont= rol).
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow = CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions= that are relevant across CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content del= ivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, m= onitoring, etc.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDN control systems. In particular, this interfa= ce will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstre= am CDN.
=A0
The WG will discuss and address the security (including t= hreat model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside th= e above documents and specifications.
=A0
The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interope= ration between CDNs.
=A0
In particular, the WG will not define:
- = New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
=A0
The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and whe= re appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to real= ize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may as= sess the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstrea= m CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CD= NI=A0request routing decisions.
=A0
=A0
Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=A0
WG Creation + 6 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Subm= it CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 month= s: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Infor= mational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI requirements t= o IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standar= d
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Loggi= ng interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 = =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as propo= sed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Metad= ata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24= months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Recharter or dissolve
=A0
_______________= ________________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDN= i@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

=A0

__________________= _____________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailm= an/listinfo/cdni

=A0

=A0

=A0

Francois Le Faucheur=
Distingu= ished Engineer
Corporate Development
flefauch= @cisco.com
Phone:=A0+33 49 723 2619
Mobile:=A0+33 6 19 98 50 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 So= phia Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

=A0

=

=A0= Think before you print.

This email may contain confidential and priv= ileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use= , distribution or disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are n= ot the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), ple= ase contact the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message= .

Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Ca= mille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mou= lineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de l= a publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone.

For corporate legal information go to:
http://= www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html
<= /td>

=A0

=A0
=

=A0 --20cf302ef828748cbe04a0869a6c-- From richard_woundy@cable.comcast.com Sun Apr 10 11:29:57 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28BBA3A698B for ; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 11:29:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -102.815 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.815 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.081, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yhhD9j-vag-J for ; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 11:29:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E3E83A6961 for ; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 11:29:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.42]) by copdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503630.33218792; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 12:32:51 -0600 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB01.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::d1e7:20b5:9b63:21a6%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 14:29:45 -0400 From: "Woundy, Richard" To: Bhumip Khasnabish Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter Thread-Index: AQHL9YHcSwP7yPA7WkabQiMOoBZlLpRT7aWAgAAVYQCAAGJ9AIACNEIAgADS2XA= Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:29:44 +0000 Message-ID: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E284F@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E219B@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com>, In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.191.125.13] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E284FPACDCEXMB05cabl_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:29:57 -0000 --_000_1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E284FPACDCEXMB05cabl_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >.. the word "network" should probably be taken out of this statement ... I provided a statement in email about why two competitors might cooperate o= n CDNI, even as they compete in other areas. I didn't suggest that CDNI sho= uld change anything at the network layer, and I never intended to. I think I understand the charter text. I helped write it. ________________________________ From: Bhumip Khasnabish [vumip1@gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, April 09, 2011 9:44 PM To: Woundy, Richard Cc: Francois Le Faucheur; cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >>network costs and/or to provide higher quality service to their >>respect= ive customers. Layer 1 to 3 (physical to network) is out of scope, because the charter's o= pening statement says that "A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements = operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distributi= on and delivery of digital content." .. the word "network" should probably be taken out of this statement ... On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard > wrote: (not wearing co-chair hat) > Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately administ= ered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. Your question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous. Let=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizon e= mployee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Verizon= and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I cou= ld imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnection,= perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher qu= ality service to their respective customers. So in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they not= ? There isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92s w= hy the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model. -- Rich From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-boun= ces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bhumip Khasnabish Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM To: Francois Le Faucheur Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter Hi Francois, You already agreed that "Federation" is out of scope. I am just reminding = you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see below.. + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN Federation= " in scope? + Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only. Federation is a more controlle= d environment which requires more policies. + Francois: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. This c= an then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to interconnect = to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is not in the scope= . >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately administer= ed CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. Thanks. Best. Bhumip On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur > wrote: Hi Bhumip, On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: You mean interconnection of TWO separately administered CDNs, right . .any= thing beyond two is out of scope . . pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple CDNs.= For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of more tha= n one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical footprint)= . As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a simpler= initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topologies of CDN= s to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see http://www.ietf.= org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), but we felt this is somet= hing the WG would have to make a call on, once the trade-offs are better un= derstood. So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic targ= et (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN Federation" = was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some confusion since "= federation" means different things to different people. In my mind, "CDN Fe= deration" implies particular modes of operation across the multiple interco= nnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common policies/services etc). While thi= s may be one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond what= a CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would defin= e how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awarene= ss that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overal= l system and therefore that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN = systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the policies/services= that may, or may not, be offered on top of that multi-CDN system. Cheers Francois >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection of sep= arately administered CDNs On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur > wrote: Folks, Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the charte= r discussion/edits during the BOF. Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft cha= rter is assessed by the ADs. Francois & Rich PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on comment Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter ---------------------------------------------------------------- Description of Working Group =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements o= perating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distributio= n and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but is not limite= d to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous = media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide services = to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service content= delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved quali= ty of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For th= ese reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP networks= , existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many Netwo= rk Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying their o= wn CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a= given item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of that e= nd user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for interconn= ecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collective= ly behave as a single delivery infrastructure. The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of separ= ately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of content fr= om CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their respec= tive User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployable so= lution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is= expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF pro= tocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing object notati= on grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In = the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by= the WG, the WG will recharter. The working group will focus on the following items: - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem and= a common terminology. - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications of = the CDNI solution and protocols - A "framework" document providing a description of the different component= s of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one another= . This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing the securi= ty concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specific to CDN= I. - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CDNI = architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this document = will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important req= uirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols and s= olutions produced by the working group. This document will list the require= ments stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI i= nterfaces. - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & inte= roperation of: o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CDN r= equest routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information nec= essary to perform request redirection. o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs to= exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata r= efers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the distributio= n of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, thi= s may include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, enfo= rcement of availability windows or access control). o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to ex= change logging information associated with actions that are relevant across= CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content routing a= ctions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream= CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational is= sues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Interco= nnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperation = between CDNs. In particular, the WG will not define: - New session, transport or network protocols. - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= . - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a CD= N. - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. - New applications consuming CDNI logs. - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverage = protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements= and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of the= ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange informat= ion which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing decision= s. Goals & Milestones =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informati= onal WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routing = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interfac= e to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control interfac= e to IESG as proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata Distrib= ution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: Folks, I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter belo= w, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from many peop= le this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gathering la= st night. It is available online at , and has been updated on the BOF wiki . The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: . -- Rich and Francois Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter ---------------------------------------------------------------- Description of Working Group =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements o= perating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distributio= n and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but is not limite= d to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous = media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide services = to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service content= delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved quali= ty of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For th= ese reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP networks= , existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many Netwo= rk Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying their o= wn CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a= given item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of that e= nd user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for interconn= ecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collective= ly behave as a single delivery infrastructure. The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of separ= ately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of content fr= om CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their respec= tive User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployable so= lution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is= expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF pro= tocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing object notati= on grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In = the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by= the WG, the WG will recharter. The working group will focus on the following items: - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem and= a common terminology. - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications of = the CDNI solution and protocols - A "framework" document providing a description of the different component= s of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one another= . - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CDNI = architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this document = will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important req= uirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols and s= olutions produced by the working group. - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & inte= roperation of: o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface will = allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream = CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the= CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution me= tadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the dis= tribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for exam= ple, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocki= ng, enforcement of availability windows or access control). o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging syste= ms to exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevan= t across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content r= outing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), mana= gement and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents = and specifications. The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Interco= nnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperation = between CDNs. In particular, the WG will not define: - New session, transport or network protocols. - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= . - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a CD= N. - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. - New applications consuming CDNI logs. The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverage = protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements= and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of the= ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange informat= ion which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing decision= s. Goals & Milestones =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as Inf= ormational WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Information= al WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Information= al WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informat= ional WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Rou= ting interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging int= erface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control int= erface to IESG as proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata Di= stribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve _______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni _______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni [X] Francois Le Faucheur Distinguished Engineer Corporate Development flefauch@cisco.com Phone: +33 49 723 2619 Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 Cisco Systems France Greenside 400 Ave de Roumanille 06410 Sophia Antipolis France Cisco.com [X] Think before you print. This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole us= e of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosure by= others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (or a= uthorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by reply= email and delete all copies of this message. Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Camill= e Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mouline= aux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la pu= blication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. For corporate legal information go to: http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html --_000_1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E284FPACDCEXMB05cabl_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

>.. the word "network" should probably be taken out of this= statement ...

I provided a statement in email about why two competitors might cooperat= e on CDNI, even as they compete in other areas. I didn't suggest that = CDNI should change anything at the network layer, and I never intended= to.

I think I understand the charter text. I helped write it.

From: Bhumip Khasnabish [vumip1@gmail.com]=
Sent: Saturday, April 09, 2011 9:44 PM
To: Woundy, Richard
Cc: Francois Le Faucheur; cdni@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter

>>network costs and/or to provide higher quality service to their >>resp= ective customers.

Layer 1 to 3 (physical to network) is out of scope, because the charte= r's opening statement says that

"A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network= elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distri= bution and delivery of digital content."

.. the word "network" should probably be taken out of this s= tatement ...

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard = <R= ichard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote:

(not= wearing co-chair hat)

>= Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these t= wo "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.<= span style=3D"COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">

Your= question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous.

Let= =92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizon empl= oyee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, = Verizon and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I could imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on= CDN interconnection, perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or= to provide higher quality service to their respective customers.

So i= n this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they not?

Ther= e isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92s why t= he proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model.

-- R= ich

From:<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> cdni-bounces@iet= f.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bhumip Khasnabish
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM
To: Francois Le Faucheur

Cc: cdni@ietf.org=
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter

Hi Francois,

You already agreed that "Federati= on" is out of scope. I am just reminding you that and request= ing to put it in the charter. PLS see below..

+ ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two C= DNs, but is "CDN Federation" in scope?
+ Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only.= Federation is a more controlled environment which requires more po= licies.
+ Francois: CDNI only defines how to int= erconnect two CDNs together. This can then be used in different ways, such = as allow many CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is not in the s= cope.

>>interconnection of separately administered C= DNs

Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "= ;separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.

Thanks.

Best.

Bhumip

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur= <flefauch@cisco= .com> wrote:

Hi Bhumip,

On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:

You mean interconnection of TWO separately administered CDNs, right . .anything beyond two is out of scop= e . .

pls confirm and clarify that in the charter.

I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems i= nvolving multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able = to make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different = geographical footprint).

As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possib= le to specify a simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions o= n the topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs= - see http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/cu= rrent/msg00224.html), but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once th= e trade-offs are better understood.

So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and s= tating the generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs).

There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact= that "CDN Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may ha= ve created some confusion since "federation" means different thin= gs to different people. In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g= . they share some common policies/services etc). While this may be one way = that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would = deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for de= livery, with awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-ope= ration in the overall system and therefore that delivery features need to o= perate in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the policies/services that may, o= r may not, be offered on top of that multi-CDN system.

Cheers

Francois

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow t= he >interconnection of separately administered CDNs

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheu= r <flefauch@cisc= o.com> wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the charte= r discussion/edits during the BOF.

Please bring forward t= he additional comments you have before this draft charter is assessed by th= e ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" comment= s for now, let's focus on comment

Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
----------------------------------------------------------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements o= perating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distributio= n and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but is not l= imited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP= , etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service Pro= viders (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service content= delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved quali= ty of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. F= or these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP networks= , existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many Netwo= rk Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying th= eir own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given item of content can be del= ivered to an end user regardless of that end user's location or attach= ment network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalo= ne CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of separ= ately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of content fr= om CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their r= espective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 = months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interf= aces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and messa= ge exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and se= mantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed = necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a description of the p= roblem and a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applic= ations of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the different= components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to o= ne another. This document will also include a "threat analysis&qu= ot; discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements= for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this= document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent an= d important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working= group. This document will list the requirements stemming from the thr= eat analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & = interoperation of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CDN r= equest routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information nec= essary to perform request redirection.

o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs to= exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata r= efers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the distri= bution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enablin= g: content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability wind= ows or access control).

o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to ex= change logging information associated with actions that are relevant across= CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content rout= ing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream= CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational is= sues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Interco= nnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperation = between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a CD= N.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverage = protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements= and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability o= f the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream C= DN with making CDNI request routing decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informat= ional
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informa= tional
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Info= rmational
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request= Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging= interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control= interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadat= a Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote:

Folks,

I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter belo= w, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from many peop= le this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gathering la= st night. It is available online at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>= ;, and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.or= g/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>.

The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni>.
-- Rich and Francois

Content Delivery Networks Interconnect= ion (CDNI) - Draft Charter
----------------------------------------------------------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elements o= perating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distributio= n and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but is not l= imited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP= , etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service Pro= viders (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service content= delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved quali= ty of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. F= or these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP networks= , existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many Netwo= rk Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying th= eir own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given item of content can be del= ivered to an end user regardless of that end user's location or attach= ment network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalo= ne CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of separ= ately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of content fr= om CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their r= espective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 = months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interf= aces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and messa= ge exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and se= mantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed = necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a description of the p= roblem and a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applic= ations of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the different= components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to o= ne another.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements= for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this= document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent an= d important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working= group.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & = interoperation of:

   o CDNI request-routing systems. In particu= lar, this interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to ob= tain from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform requ= est redirection.

   o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This= interface will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-C= DN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metada= ta that is relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enab= ling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability w= indows or access control).

   o CDNI logging systems. This interface wil= l allow CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated with= actions that are relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, = content delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

   o CDN control systems. In particular, this= interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a = downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), mana= gement and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents = and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Interco= nnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperation = between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a CD= N.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverage = protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements= and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability o= f the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream C= DN with making CDNI request routing decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem = statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use case= s to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to = IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements = to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of t= he CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of t= he CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of t= he CDNI Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of t= he CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve

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Cisco Systems France
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--_000_1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E284FPACDCEXMB05cabl_-- From yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com Sun Apr 10 18:23:45 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA2A83A6A38 for ; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:23:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.173 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.173 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.289, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_MODEMCABLE=0.768, HOST_EQ_MODEMCABLE=1.368, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Mz6QOmWcN8yY for ; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:23:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pacdcimo01.cable.comcast.com (PacdcIMO01.cable.comcast.com [24.40.8.145]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 847D13A6A30 for ; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:23:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.41]) by pacdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503620.119312335; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:23:34 -0400 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB02.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::11d4:f530:37a0:9f4e%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:23:34 -0400 From: "Lee, Yiu" To: Bhumip Khasnabish , "Woundy, Richard" Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter Thread-Index: AQHL9+cTW+aOBkHoVk+63KF+1iLtLA== Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 01:23:34 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.2.0.101115 x-originating-ip: [147.191.125.13] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_C9C7CFEEC72Dyiuleecablecomcastcom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 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Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2786E3A6A30 for ; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 18:27:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.41]) by copdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503630.33240728; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:30:02 -0600 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB02.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::11d4:f530:37a0:9f4e%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Sun, 10 Apr 2011 21:27:01 -0400 From: "Lee, Yiu" To: Bhumip Khasnabish , "Woundy, Richard" Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter Thread-Index: AQHL9+eOfhdeJjCHXk6CLd5oBSH1JA== Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 01:27:00 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.2.0.101115 x-originating-ip: [147.191.125.13] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_C9C7D064C730yiuleecablecomcastcom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 01:27:14 -0000 --_000_C9C7D064C730yiuleecablecomcastcom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SSBjYW4gaW1hZ2luZSB0d28gQ0ROIHByb3ZpZGVycyB3b3VsZCBoYXZlIHByZS1hcnJhbmdlZCBt dXR1YWwgYWdyZWVtZW50IGJlZm9yZSBpbnRlcmNvbm5lY3RpbmcuIEkgZG9uJ3Qgc2VlIGEgYnVz aW5lc3MgY2FzZSB0d28gQ0ROcyB3b3VsZCBjb25uZWN0IHdpdGhvdXQgcHJlLWFycmFuZ2VtZW50 LiBUaGF0IHNhaWQsIGl0IGlzIHVwIHRvIHRoZSBXRyB0byBkZWNpZGUgaWYgdGhleSB3YW50IHRv IHNvbHZlIHRoaXMgcHJvYmxlbSBvciBub3QuIEluIHRoZSBCb0YsIHBlb3BsZSBhZ3JlZWQgdGhh 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(8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p3B950D9003013; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 09:05:01 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-26--64467293 From: Francois Le Faucheur In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 11:06:03 +0200 Message-Id: <95350AC4-F908-463F-B269-5AE8BADD860A@cisco.com> References: To: Bhumip Khasnabish X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: cdni@ietf.org, Yiu Lee Subject: [CDNi] Trust Model was Re: Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 09:05:12 -0000 --Apple-Mail-26--64467293 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Bhumip, I suggest we clearly distinguish between: *A* discussions on what the charter needs to say about CDNI = trust model *B* discussions about CDNI trust models (and examples of = issues/concerns that need to be covered in future CDNI deliverables). With respect to *A*, I believe there is violent agreement that the = charter needs to mention that the CDNI trust model needs to be discussed = and documented in deliverables (which the draft charter already does). = Let us know if you see differently. With respect to *B*, starting discussion on the trust model topic itself = is all fine, but I recommend you use a different Subject header in order = to make it clear that this does not relate to the draft charter = discussion. Thanks Francois On 11 Apr 2011, at 03:27, Lee, Yiu wrote: > I can imagine two CDN providers would have pre-arranged mutual = agreement before interconnecting. I don't see a business case two CDNs = would connect without pre-arrangement. That said, it is up to the WG to = decide if they want to solve this problem or not. In the BoF, people = agreed that we would need to document the transitive trust model. This = is in scope. >=20 > /Yiu >=20 > From: Bhumip Khasnabish > Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 21:28:48 -0400 > To: Richard Woundy > Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" > Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >=20 > I see. Now if one CDN operator connects to another CDN operator = without pre-defined > =20 > (a) security of the signaling/control interface, and > (b) policy for volume/type/... of content exchange, > =20 > this could that open up both trust and regulatory concerns ...=20 >=20 > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard = wrote: >> (not wearing co-chair hat) >> =20 >> > Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >> =20 >> Your question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous. >> =20 >> Let=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a = Verizon employee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the = US, Verizon and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV = customers. But I could imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate = on CDN interconnection, perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs = and/or to provide higher quality service to their respective customers. >> =20 >> So in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do = they not? >> =20 >> There isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. = That=92s why the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust = model. >> =20 >> -- Rich >> =20 >> From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf = Of Bhumip Khasnabish >> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM >> To: Francois Le Faucheur >>=20 >> Cc: cdni@ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >>=20 >>=20 >> =20 >> Hi Francois, >> =20 >> You already agreed that "Federation" is out of scope. I am just = reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see = below.. >> =20 >> + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN = Federation" in scope? >> + Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only. Federation is a more = controlled environment which requires more policies. >> + Francois: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. = This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to = interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is = not in the scope. >> =20 >> >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs >>=20 >> Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >> =20 >> Thanks. >> =20 >> Best. >> =20 >> Bhumip >>=20 >> =20 >> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: >> Hi Bhumip, >> =20 >> On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >>=20 >>=20 >> You mean interconnection of TWO separately administered CDNs, right = . .anything beyond two is out of scope . . >> pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. >> =20 >> I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple = CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of = more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical = footprint).=20 >> As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a = simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the = topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - = see http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), = but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once = the trade-offs are better understood. >> =20 >> So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the = generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). >> =20 >> There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN = Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some = confusion since "federation" means different things to different people. = In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation = across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common = policies/services etc). While this may be one way that a CDNI solution = would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In = other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN = inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there = may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system = and therefore that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN = systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the = policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that = multi-CDN system. >> =20 >> Cheers >> =20 >> Francois >>=20 >>=20 >> =20 >> =20 >> >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection = of separately administered CDNs >>>=20 >>> =20 >>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: >>> Folks, >>>=20 >>> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >>> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs. >>>=20 >>> Francois & Rich >>>=20 >>> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>=20 >>> Description of Working Group >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>>=20 >>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>>=20 >>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>>=20 >>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>>=20 >>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>>=20 >>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>>=20 >>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>>=20 >>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>>=20 >>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI. >>>=20 >>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This = document will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis = and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces. >>>=20 >>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>>=20 >>> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an = upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN = the information necessary to perform request redirection. >>>=20 >>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the = CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution = metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to = the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content = acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access = control). >>>=20 >>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging = systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. >>>=20 >>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >>>=20 >>> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications. >>>=20 >>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>>=20 >>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >>>=20 >>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Goals & Milestones >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>=20 >>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata = Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Folks, >>> =20 >>> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft = charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input = from many people this week, including people that attended the informal = CDNI gathering last night. It is available online at = , and has been = updated on the BOF wiki = . >>> =20 >>> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: = . >>> =20 >>> -- Rich and Francois >>> =20 >>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>> =20 >>> Description of Working Group >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>> =20 >>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>> =20 >>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>> =20 >>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>> =20 >>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>> =20 >>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>> =20 >>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>> =20 >>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>> =20 >>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. >>> =20 >>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. >>> =20 >>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>> =20 >>> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection. >>> =20 >>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will = allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >>> =20 >>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN = logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions = that are relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content = delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, = analytics, monitoring, etc. >>> =20 >>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. >>> =20 >>> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat = model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the = above documents and specifications. >>> =20 >>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>> =20 >>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>> =20 >>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> Goals & Milestones >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> =20 >>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG = as Informational >>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>> =20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CDNi mailing list >>> CDNi@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CDNi mailing list >>> CDNi@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =20 >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >> Francois Le Faucheur >> Distinguished Engineer >> Corporate Development >> flefauch@cisco.com >> Phone: +33 49 723 2619 >> Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 >>=20 >>=20 >> Cisco Systems France >> Greenside >> 400 Ave de Roumanille >> 06410 Sophia Antipolis >> France >> Cisco.com >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >>=20 >> Think before you print. >>=20 >> This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the = sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. >>=20 >> Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >>=20 >> For corporate legal information go to: >> http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >>=20 >> =20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> =20 > _______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list = CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni Francois Le Faucheur Distinguished Engineer Corporate Development flefauch@cisco.com Phone: +33 49 723 2619 Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 Cisco Systems France Greenside 400 Ave de Roumanille 06410 Sophia Antipolis France Cisco.com =20 Think before you print. This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole = use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. For corporate legal information go to: http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html --Apple-Mail-26--64467293 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="text/html"; boundary=Apple-Mail-27--64467292 --Apple-Mail-27--64467292 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 *A* discussions on what the = charter needs to say about CDNI trust model
*B* = discussions about CDNI trust models (and examples of issues/concerns = that need to be covered in future CDNI = deliverables).

With respect to *A*, I believe = there is violent agreement that the charter needs to mention that the = CDNI trust model needs to be discussed and documented in deliverables = (which the draft charter already does). Let us know if you see = differently.

With respect to *B*, starting = discussion on the trust model topic itself is all fine, but I recommend = you use a different Subject header in order to make it clear that this = does not relate to the draft charter = discussion.

Thanks

Franc= ois

On 11 Apr = 2011, at 03:27, Lee, Yiu wrote:

I can imagine two CDN providers would have pre-arranged mutual = agreement before interconnecting. I don't see a business case two CDNs = would connect without pre-arrangement. That said, it is up to the WG to = decide if they want to solve this problem or not. In the BoF, people agreed that we would need to document the transitive = trust model. This is in scope.

/Yiu

From: Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 21:28:48 = -0400
To: Richard Woundy <Richard_Woundy@cable.comc= ast.com>
Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated = version of the CDNI charter

I see. Now if one CDN operator connects to another CDN operator = without pre-defined

(a) security of the signaling/control interface, and

(b) policy for volume/type/... of content exchange,

this could that open up both trust and regulatory concerns ...

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, = Richard <Richard_Woundy@cable.comc= ast.com> wrote:

(not wearing co-chair hat)

> Also, what about trust? Do you assume = that these two "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls = clarify.

Your question about =91trust=92 is = ambiguous.

Let=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a = Verizon employee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu = Lee). In the US, Verizon and Comcast compete vigorously for = broadband/phone/TV customers. But I could imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate = on CDN interconnection, perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs = and/or to provide higher quality service to their respective = customers.

So = in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they = not?

There isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. = That=92s why the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust = model.

-- = Rich

From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bhumip Khasnabish
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM
To: Francois Le Faucheur

Cc: cdni@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI = charter

Hi Francois,

You already agreed that = "Federation" is out of scope. I am just reminding you = that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see below..

+ ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting = two CDNs, but is "CDN Federation" in scope?
+ Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only. = Federation is a more controlled environment which requires more = policies.
+ Francois: CDNI only defines how to = interconnect two CDNs together. This can then be used in different ways, = such as allow many CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is not in the = scope.

>>interconnection of separately = administered CDNs

Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two = "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.

Thanks.

Best.

Bhumip

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois = Le Faucheur <flefauch@cisco.com> wrote:

Hi Bhumip,

On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish = wrote:

You mean interconnection of = TWO separately administered CDNs, right . .anything = beyond two is out of scope . .

pls confirm and clarify that in the = charter.

I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow = systems involving multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs = to be able to make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each = covering a different geographical footprint).

As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ = be possible to specify a simpler initial solution if we were to place = restrictions on the topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not = support cascaded CDNs - see http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg002= 24.html), but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once = the trade-offs are better understood.

So I'd recommend we keep the charter text = open and stating the generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple = CDNs).

There was a discussion during the BOF = about the fact that "CDN Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This = may have created some confusion since "federation" means different = things to different people. In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation across the multiple interconnected CDNs = (e.g. they share some common policies/services etc). While this may be = one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond what a = CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for = delivery, with awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN = inter-operation in the overall system and therefore that delivery = features need to operate in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the policies/services that = may, or may not, be offered on top of that multi-CDN system.

Cheers

Francois

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is = to allow the >interconnection of separately administered CDNs

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois = Le Faucheur <flefauch@cisco.com> wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF.

Please bring = forward the additional comments you have before this draft charter is = assessed by the ADs.

Francois & = Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" = comments for now, let's focus on comment

Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
----------------------------------------------------------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such = content includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, = RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content = Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased = robustness of delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given item of content can be = delivered to an end user regardless of that end user's location or = attachment network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) = standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of = separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users = (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe = (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the = CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for = transport and message exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and = semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are = deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem = and a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the = working group. This document will list the requirements stemming = from the threat analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI = interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream = CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the = information necessary to perform request redirection.

o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs = to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution = metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant = to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information = enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of = availability windows or access control).

o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to = exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant = across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational = issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a = CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess = the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which may aid an = upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata = Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote:

Folks,

I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter = below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from = many people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI = gathering last night. It is available online at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt= >, and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart&g= t;.

The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#w= g-cdni>.

-- Rich and Francois

Content Delivery Networks = Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
----------------------------------------------------------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such = content includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, = RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content = Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased = robustness of delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given item of content can be = delivered to an end user regardless of that end user's location or = attachment network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) = standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of = separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users = (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe = (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the = CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for = transport and message exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and = semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are = deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem = and a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the = working group.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of:

   o CDNI request-routing systems. In = particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing = system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information = necessary to perform request redirection.

   o CDNI metadata distribution systems. = This interface will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of = inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the subset = of content metadata that is relevant to the distribution of the = content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information = enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of = availability windows or access control).

   o CDNI logging systems. This interface = will allow CDN logging systems to exchange logging information = associated with actions that are relevant across CDNs (such as = content distribution, content delivery and content routing actions) = for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

   o CDN control systems. In particular, = this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate = content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), = management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above = documents and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a = CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess = the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which may aid an = upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem = statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases = to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to = IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements = to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or = dissolve

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CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

Francois Le Faucheur
Distinguished Engineer
Corporate Development
flefauch@cisco.com
Phone: +33 49 723 2619
Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
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06410 Sophia = Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

Think before you = print.
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(8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p3BKbWAG031970 for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:37:32 GMT Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) From: David R Oran In-Reply-To: <95350AC4-F908-463F-B269-5AE8BADD860A@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 16:37:31 -0400 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <2B63C73B-A143-4654-A3A9-5B9CBB78B3D6@cisco.com> References: <95350AC4-F908-463F-B269-5AE8BADD860A@cisco.com> To: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Subject: Re: [CDNi] Trust Model X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 22:14:17 -0000 Crawling out of my hole for a moment... Someone in an earlier post seemed to be saying that you didn't need to = worry about trust transitivity if you only had 2 CDNs peering. I suspect that is wrong. The original content owner is part of the trust = chain, so unless the model is that the content owner has a bi-lateral = trust agreement with each CDN before these two CDNs are allowed to peer = (fairly dubious and a gigantic limitation on CDNi's utility), then = transitivity raises its head in even the simplest of CDNi topologies. Back to your regularly scheduled streaming session... DaveO. On Apr 11, 2011, at 5:06 AM, Francois Le Faucheur wrote: > Bhumip, >=20 > I suggest we clearly distinguish between: > *A* discussions on what the charter needs to say about CDNI = trust model > *B* discussions about CDNI trust models (and examples of = issues/concerns that need to be covered in future CDNI deliverables). >=20 > With respect to *A*, I believe there is violent agreement that the = charter needs to mention that the CDNI trust model needs to be discussed = and documented in deliverables (which the draft charter already does). = Let us know if you see differently. >=20 > With respect to *B*, starting discussion on the trust model topic = itself is all fine, but I recommend you use a different Subject header = in order to make it clear that this does not relate to the draft charter = discussion. >=20 > Thanks >=20 > Francois >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 11 Apr 2011, at 03:27, Lee, Yiu wrote: >=20 >> I can imagine two CDN providers would have pre-arranged mutual = agreement before interconnecting. I don't see a business case two CDNs = would connect without pre-arrangement. That said, it is up to the WG to = decide if they want to solve this problem or not. In the BoF, people = agreed that we would need to document the transitive trust model. This = is in scope. >>=20 >> /Yiu >>=20 >> From: Bhumip Khasnabish >> Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 21:28:48 -0400 >> To: Richard Woundy >> Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" >> Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >>=20 >> I see. Now if one CDN operator connects to another CDN operator = without pre-defined >> =20 >> (a) security of the signaling/control interface, and >> (b) policy for volume/type/... of content exchange, >> =20 >> this could that open up both trust and regulatory concerns ...=20 >>=20 >> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard = wrote: >>> (not wearing co-chair hat) >>> =20 >>> > Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >>> =20 >>> Your question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous. >>> =20 >>> Let=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a = Verizon employee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the = US, Verizon and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV = customers. But I could imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate = on CDN interconnection, perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs = and/or to provide higher quality service to their respective customers. >>> =20 >>> So in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do = they not? >>> =20 >>> There isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. = That=92s why the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust = model. >>> =20 >>> -- Rich >>> =20 >>> From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf = Of Bhumip Khasnabish >>> Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM >>> To: Francois Le Faucheur >>>=20 >>> Cc: cdni@ietf.org >>> Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =20 >>> Hi Francois, >>> =20 >>> You already agreed that "Federation" is out of scope. I am just = reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see = below.. >>> =20 >>> + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN = Federation" in scope? >>> + Nabil: CDNI is about interconnection only. Federation is a more = controlled environment which requires more policies. >>> + Francois: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. = This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to = interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is = not in the scope. >>> =20 >>> >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs >>>=20 >>> Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these two "separately = administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >>> =20 >>> Thanks. >>> =20 >>> Best. >>> =20 >>> Bhumip >>>=20 >>> =20 >>> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: >>> Hi Bhumip, >>> =20 >>> On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> You mean interconnection of TWO separately administered CDNs, right = . .anything beyond two is out of scope . . >>> pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. >>> =20 >>> I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving = multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to = make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different = geographical footprint).=20 >>> As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a = simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the = topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - = see http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), = but we felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once = the trade-offs are better understood. >>> =20 >>> So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the = generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). >>> =20 >>> There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN = Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some = confusion since "federation" means different things to different people. = In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation = across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common = policies/services etc). While this may be one way that a CDNI solution = would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In = other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN = inter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there = may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system = and therefore that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN = systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the = policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that = multi-CDN system. >>> =20 >>> Cheers >>> =20 >>> Francois >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection = of separately administered CDNs >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>>> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote: >>>> Folks, >>>>=20 >>>> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting = the charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >>>> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs. >>>>=20 >>>> Francois & Rich >>>>=20 >>>> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>=20 >>>> Description of Working Group >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>=20 >>>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>>>=20 >>>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>>>=20 >>>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>>>=20 >>>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>>>=20 >>>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>>>=20 >>>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>>>=20 >>>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>>>=20 >>>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI. >>>>=20 >>>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This = document will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis = and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces. >>>>=20 >>>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of: >>>>=20 >>>> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an = upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN = the information necessary to perform request redirection. >>>>=20 >>>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the = CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution = metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to = the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content = acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access = control). >>>>=20 >>>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging = systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. >>>>=20 >>>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >>>>=20 >>>> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications. >>>>=20 >>>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>>>=20 >>>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>>> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >>>>=20 >>>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> Goals & Milestones >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>>=20 >>>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata = Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> Folks, >>>> =20 >>>> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft = charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input = from many people this week, including people that attended the informal = CDNI gathering last night. It is available online at = , and has been = updated on the BOF wiki = . >>>> =20 >>>> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: = . >>>> =20 >>>> -- Rich and Francois >>>> =20 >>>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> =20 >>>> Description of Working Group >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>> =20 >>>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>>> =20 >>>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>>> =20 >>>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>>> =20 >>>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>>> =20 >>>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>>> =20 >>>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>>> =20 >>>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>>> =20 >>>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. >>>> =20 >>>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. >>>> =20 >>>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of: >>>> =20 >>>> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection. >>>> =20 >>>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will = allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >>>> =20 >>>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN = logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions = that are relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content = delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, = analytics, monitoring, etc. >>>> =20 >>>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. >>>> =20 >>>> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat = model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the = above documents and specifications. >>>> =20 >>>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>>> =20 >>>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>>> =20 >>>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>>> =20 >>>> =20 >>>> Goals & Milestones >>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>>> =20 >>>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to = IESG as Informational >>>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>>> =20 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> CDNi mailing list >>>> CDNi@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>>> =20 >>>>=20 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> CDNi mailing list >>>> CDNi@ietf.org >>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>>=20 >>>> =20 >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> =20 >>>=20 >>> Francois Le Faucheur >>> Distinguished Engineer >>> Corporate Development >>> flefauch@cisco.com >>> Phone: +33 49 723 2619 >>> Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Cisco Systems France >>> Greenside >>> 400 Ave de Roumanille >>> 06410 Sophia Antipolis >>> France >>> Cisco.com >>>=20 >>> =20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> Think before you print. >>>=20 >>> This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the = sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. >>>=20 >>> Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >>>=20 >>> For corporate legal information go to: >>> http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >>>=20 >>> =20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>>=20 >>> =20 >> _______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list = CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >=20 > >=20 > Francois Le Faucheur > Distinguished Engineer > Corporate Development > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: +33 49 723 2619 > Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Cisco Systems France > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com >=20 >=20 > =20 >=20 > > Think before you print. >=20 > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the = sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. >=20 > Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >=20 > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni From yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com Mon Apr 11 15:18:06 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 99343E0686 for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:18:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.734 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.734 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W4rYhalClC3c for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:18:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19D6CE0685 for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:17:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.42]) by copdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503630.33409721; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 16:20:58 -0600 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB01.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::d1e7:20b5:9b63:21a6%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 18:17:51 -0400 From: "Lee, Yiu" To: Bhumip Khasnabish Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter Thread-Index: AQHL+JZLhUDPCZR7rUqdlNKMVRqW5g== Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 22:17:49 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.2.0.101115 x-originating-ip: [147.191.125.13] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_C9C8F5F4C7C0yiuleecablecomcastcom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 22:18:06 -0000 --_000_C9C8F5F4C7C0yiuleecablecomcastcom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 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400E3E066A for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:28:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: by yic13 with SMTP id 13so2867123yic.31 for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:27:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=IWZkZaCDLiPlH5tF2MiGGvEzCYMKhzQ5nx8Y2584xD8=; b=ahG+PCZ/CBbt5Hmbz6/SWVNkp+lbk+odRnSIv724B1Ss4WEtuRauj7AtSqywd9LbqV B1EAtYhvIG0GU1ytHYveikE4n5/3xLJfixGzxuC5hUfiXNo2VFjE3pA5otUSJ0hsKx1e dWwP6U6l7RChh8Js5F4NZluxZJ+P1JmrGhMtw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=rO37KsfMvEPNq31JrmF2xT0tZiCGA3VKuzbhtywLfpoE7v1Gob3X5D+t3+DFqglaYi 0lwVWbIkaUp0Sw/D3Qj/At/JsfEYAhrNwdSs1oRfoheWOrzMLQgXWYSw8B0haJ/YGnf6 GYac6zD0SuxnZHyyxlcAApR9F5h1Rut0ANRi8= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.236.189.71 with SMTP id b47mr7735945yhn.176.1302559403633; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:03:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.108.161 with HTTP; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:03:23 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: References: Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 18:03:23 -0400 Message-ID: From: Bhumip Khasnabish To: "Lee, Yiu" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf3040ea4a8d6cf604a0abbe44 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 22:28:16 -0000 --20cf3040ea4a8d6cf604a0abbe44 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If I understood correctly, the focus is *interconnection* (layer 4 to 7) o= f the CDNs, not the network that is used for content distribution/delivery. On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 9:23 PM, Lee, Yiu wrote= : > I respectfully disagree to take out the word "network". CDN is a > "network". In this statement, the network refers to CDN network. I don't = see > any problem of it. > > /Yiu > > From: Bhumip Khasnabish > Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 21:44:44 -0400 > To: Richard Woundy > Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" > > Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter > > >>*network* costs and/or to provide higher quality service to their > >>respective customers. > Layer 1 to 3 (physical to network) is out of scope, because the charter's > opening statement says that > "A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network element= s > operating at *layer 4 through layer 7*, arranged for the efficient > distribution and delivery of digital content." > > .. the word "network" should probably be taken out of this statement ... > > > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard < > Richard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote: > >> (not wearing co-chair hat) >> >> >> >> >* Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately >> administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >> >> >> >> Your question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous. >> >> >> >> Let=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizo= n >> employee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Ver= izon >> and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I c= ould >> imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnection, >> perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher >> quality service to their respective customers. >> >> >> >> So in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they >> not? >> >> >> >> There isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92= s why >> the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model. >> >> >> >> -- Rich >> >> >> >> *From:* cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf >> Of *Bhumip Khasnabish >> *Sent:* Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM >> *To:* Francois Le Faucheur >> >> *Cc:* cdni@ietf.org >> *Subject:* Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >> >> >> >> Hi Francois, >> >> >> >> You already agreed that "*Federation"* is out of scope. I am just >> reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see belo= w.. >> >> >> >> + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN >> Federation" in scope? >> + *Nabil*: CDNI is about interconnection only. *Federation is a more >> controlled environment which requires more policies.** >> *+ *Francois*: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. >> This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to >> interconnect to many CDNs. *But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is >> not in the scope.* >> >> >> >> >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs >> >> >> *Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately >> administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >> >> >> >> Thanks. >> >> >> >> Best. >> >> >> >> Bhumip >> >> >> >> >> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur >> wrote: >> >> Hi Bhumip, >> >> >> >> On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >> >> >> >> You mean interconnection of *TWO* separately administered CDNs, right = . >> .anything beyond two is out of scope . . >> >> pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. >> >> >> >> I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple >> CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of = more >> than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical >> footprint). >> >> As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a >> simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topolog= ies >> of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see >> http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), but we >> felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once the >> trade-offs are better understood. >> >> >> >> So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic >> target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). >> >> >> >> There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN Federatio= n" >> was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some confusion sinc= e >> "federation" means different things to different people. In my mind, "CD= N >> Federation" implies particular modes of operation across the multiple >> interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common policies/services etc). >> While this may be one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this seems >> beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential CDNI = WG >> would define how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for delivery= , >> with awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operatio= n in >> the overall system and therefore that delivery features need to operate = in >> multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern itself with the >> policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on top of that multi-= CDN >> system. >> >> >> >> Cheers >> >> >> >> Francois >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection of >> separately administered CDNs >> >> >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur >> wrote: >> >> Folks, >> >> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the >> charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >> >> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft >> charter is assessed by the ADs. >> >> Francois & Rich >> >> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on >> comment >> >> >> >> >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network element= s >> operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient >> distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but= is >> not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming o= f >> continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically pro= vide >> services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). >> >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service >> content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, impr= oved >> quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery= . >> For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery. >> >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP >> networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and >> many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are >> deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is genera= lly >> desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end >> user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This >> creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they = can >> interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure= . >> >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of >> separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of >> content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via >> their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted= , >> deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the >> industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using >> existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using >> existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI >> objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new >> protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. >> >> The working group will focus on the following items: >> >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem >> and a common terminology. >> >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of >> the CDNI solution and protocols >> >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different >> components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to= one >> another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing = the >> security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specif= ic >> to CDNI. >> >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CD= NI >> architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this docume= nt >> will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important >> requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols= and >> solutions produced by the working group. This document will list the >> requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of = the >> CDNI interfaces. >> >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & >> interoperation of: >> >> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CD= N >> request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information >> necessary to perform request redirection. >> >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs >> to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metad= ata >> refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the >> distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (fo= r >> example, this may include information enabling: content >> acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access >> control). >> >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to >> exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant >> across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content >> routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. >> >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an >> upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >> >> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational >> issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. >> >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN >> Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or >> interoperation between CDNs. >> >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User >> Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a >> CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >> >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, levera= ge >> protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requireme= nts >> and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of t= he >> ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange >> information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routi= ng >> decisions. >> >> >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routi= ng >> interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging >> interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control >> interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata >> Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >> >> >> >> >> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >> >> >> Folks, >> >> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter >> below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from ma= ny >> people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gathe= ring >> last night. It is available online at < >> http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>, and has been >> updated on the BOF wiki < >> http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>. >> >> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: < >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni>. >> >> -- Rich and Francois >> >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network element= s >> operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient >> distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but= is >> not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming o= f >> continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically pro= vide >> services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). >> >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service >> content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, impr= oved >> quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery= . >> For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery. >> >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP >> networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and >> many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are >> deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is genera= lly >> desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end >> user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This >> creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they = can >> interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure= . >> >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of >> separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of >> content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via >> their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted= , >> deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by >> the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized u= sing >> existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using >> existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI >> objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new >> protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. >> >> The working group will focus on the following items: >> >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem >> and a common terminology. >> >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of >> the CDNI solution and protocols >> >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different >> components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to= one >> another. >> >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CD= NI >> architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this docume= nt >> will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important >> requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols= and >> solutions produced by the working group. >> >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & >> interoperation of: >> >> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface wi= ll >> allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstre= am >> CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. >> >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow >> the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribut= ion >> metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to th= e >> distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (fo= r >> example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, >> geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access control). >> >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging >> systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are >> relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and >> content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitori= ng, >> etc. >> >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow = an >> upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >> >> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), >> management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above >> documents and specifications. >> >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN >> Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or >> interoperation between CDNs. >> >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User >> Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a >> CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, levera= ge >> protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requireme= nts >> and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of t= he >> ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange >> information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routi= ng >> decisions. >> >> >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request >> Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging >> interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control >> interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata >> Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> * >> Francois Le Faucheur* >> *Distinguished Engineer* >> *Corporate Development* >> flefauch@cisco.com >> Phone: *+33 49 723 2619* >> Mobile: *+33 6 19 98 50 90* >> >> *Cisco Systems France* >> Greenside >> 400 Ave de Roumanille >> 06410 Sophia Antipolis >> France >> Cisco.com >> >> >> >> >> Think before you print. >> >> >> This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole >> use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosu= re >> by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient = (or >> authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by r= eply >> email and delete all copies of this message. >> >> Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Cam= ille >> Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Moulin= eaux, >> Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la >> publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >> >> For corporate legal information go to: >> http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > --20cf3040ea4a8d6cf604a0abbe44 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable If I understood correctly, the focus is=A0 interconnection = (layer 4 to 7) of the CDNs, not the network that is used for content distri= bution/delivery.

On Sun, Apr 10, 2011 at 9:23 PM, Lee, Yiu <Yiu_Lee@cable.comcast.com> wrote:

I respectfully disagree to take out the word "network". CDN = is a "network". In this statement, the network refers to CDN netw= ork. I don't see any problem of it.

/Yiu

From: Bhumip Khasnabish <<= a href=3D"mailto:vumip1@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">vumip1@gmail.com&g= t;
Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 = 21:44:44 -0400
To: Richard Woundy <Richard_Woundy@c= able.comcast.com>
Cc: &q= uot;cdni@ietf.org&qu= ot; <cdni@ietf.org>=20

Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updat= ed version of the CDNI charter

>>network costs and/or to provide higher quality service to their >>resp= ective customers.

Layer 1 to 3 (physical to network) is out of scope, because the charte= r's opening statement says that=A0

"A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network= elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged f= or the efficient distribution and delivery of digital content."

=A0

.. the word "network" should probably be taken out of this s= tatement ...

=A0

=A0
On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard = <Richard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote:

(not= wearing co-chair hat)

=A0<= /span>

>= Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these t= wo "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify.<= span style=3D"COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-SIZE: 11pt">

=A0<= /span>

Your= question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous.

=A0<= /span>

Let= =92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizon empl= oyee (Nabil=A0Bitar=A0) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Verizo= n and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I co= uld imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnection= , perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher q= uality service to their respective customers.

=A0<= /span>

So i= n this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they not?

=A0<= /span>

Ther= e isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92s why t= he proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model.

=A0<= /span>

-- R= ich

=A0<= /span>

From:<= span style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt"> cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf O= f Bhumip Khasnabish
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM
To: Francois Le Fauch= eur

Cc: cdni= @ietf.org
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI cha= rter

=A0

Hi Francois,

=A0

You already agreed that=A0 "Federation&= quot; is out of scope. I am just reminding you that and requesting= to put it in the charter. PLS see below..

=A0

+ ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs,= but is "CDN Federation" in scope?
+ Nabil:= =A0CDNI=A0is about interconnection only. Federation is a more contr= olled environment which requires more policies.
+ Francois:=A0CDNI=A0only defines how to interconnect = two CDNs together. This can then be used in different ways, such as allow m= any CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN = Federation" itself is not in the scope.

=A0

>>interconnection of separately administered C= DNs

Also, what about trust? Do you = assume that these two "separately administered CDNs" trust each o= ther? Pls clarify.

=A0

Thanks.

=A0

Best.

=A0

Bhumip

=A0

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur= <flefauch@cisco= .com> wrote:

Hi Bhumip,

=A0

On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:

You mean=A0 interconnection of TWO s= eparately administered CDNs, right . .anything beyond two is out of scope .= .

pls confirm and clarify that in the charter.

=A0

I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems i= nvolving multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able = to make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different = geographical footprint).=A0

As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possib= le to specify a simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions o= n the topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs= - see=A0http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/curre= nt/msg00224.html), but we felt this is something the WG would have to m= ake a call on, once the trade-offs are better understood.

=A0

So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open a= nd stating the generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs).

=A0

There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact= that "CDN Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may ha= ve created some confusion since "federation" means different thin= gs to different people. In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies part= icular modes of operation across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. the= y share some common policies/services etc). While this may be one way that = a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal = with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN inte= r-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there may be m= ultiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system and therefore= that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG= should not concern itself with the policies/services that may, or may not,= be offered on top of that multi-CDN system.

=A0

Cheers

=A0

Francois

=A0

=A0

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow t= he >interconnection of separately administered CDNs

=A0

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheu= r <flefauch@cisc= o.com> wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated version of the CDN= I draft charter reflecting the charter discussion/edits during the BOF.

Please bring forward t= he additional comments you have before this draft charter is assessed by th= e ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" comment= s for now, let's focus on comment

=A0

Content Delivery Networks Interconnection = (CDNI) - Draft Charter
-------------------------------------------------= ---------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elemen= ts operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distrib= ution and delivery of digital content.=A0Such content includes, but is not = limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of conti= nuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically=A0provide s= ervices to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service con= tent delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved q= uality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of delivery. = For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery= .

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP netw= orks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many N= etwork Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deploying t= heir own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable = that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardless o= f that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need f= or interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate an= d collectively behave as=A0a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of s= eparately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of conten= t from CSPs through multiple=A0CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their = respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deploya= ble solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed=A0by the industr= y. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing = IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing objec= t notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and sema= ntics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed ne= cessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "p= roblem statement" document providing a description of the problem and = a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing s= cenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the diffe= rent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate = to one another. This document will also=A0include a "threat analysis&q= uot; discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and priv= acy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirem= ents for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a=A0reasonable set of more urgent a= nd important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI= protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document will= =A0list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by= each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection &a= mp; interoperation of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interfac= e will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the down= stream CDN the information necessary to perform=A0request redirection.

o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDN= s to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metada= ta refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is relevant to the distr= ibution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for exampl= e, this may include information enabling: content acquisition,=A0geo-blocki= ng, enforcement of availability windows or access control).

o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems t= o exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant ac= ross CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content delivery and content rou= ting actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upst= ream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG= will discuss and address the security, management and operational issues s= pecific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Int= erconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperat= ion between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New se= ssion, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG= will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverage protoc= ols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements and C= DNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may assess the suitability of the ALT= O protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information = which may aid an upstream CDN with making=A0CDNI request routing decisions.=

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months:=A0 Submit CDNI problem state= ment to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months:=A0 Submit CDNI use= cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI = framework to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Information= al
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:= =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interf= ace to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed S= tandard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Recharter or dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote:

Folks,
=A0
I wanted everyone to have an update= d version of the CDNI draft charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortl= y. This is based on input from many people this week, including people that= attended the informal CDNI gathering last night. It is=A0available online = at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>= , and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.org= /bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>.
=A0
The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni&= gt;.
=A0
-- Rich and Francois
=A0
= Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
-------= ---------------------------------------------------------
=A0
Descrip= tion of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D
=A0
A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure o= f network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the e= fficient distribution and delivery of digital=A0content. Such content inclu= des, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and st= reaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typic= ally=A0provide services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).
=A0
CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improve= d quality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of deliver= y. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery.
=A0
As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP n= etworks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and man= y Network Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deployin= g their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirab= le that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardles= s of that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a nee= d for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate= and collectively behave=A0as a single delivery infrastructure.
=A0
The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection o= f separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of con= tent from CSPs through multiple CDNs=A0and ultimately to end users (via the= ir respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, depl= oyable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the=A0indu= stry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existi= ng IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing ob= ject notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and s= emantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed= necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.
=A0
The working group will focus on the following items:
=A0
- A &= quot;problem statement" document providing a description of the proble= m and a common terminology.
=A0
- A "use case" document des= cribing scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and proto= cols
=A0
- A "framework" document providing a description of the di= fferent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and rela= te to one another.
=A0
- A "requirements" document. This do= cument lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to su= pport it. In particular, this document will focus on identifying a=A0reason= able set of more urgent and important requirements that will be addressed i= n the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working g= roup.
=A0
- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection= & interoperation of:
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI request-routin= g systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN request= routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary= =A0to perform request redirection.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interfa= ce will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope= . Distribution metadata refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processe= d by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: content=A0ac= quisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access cont= rol).
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow = CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions= that are relevant across CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content del= ivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, m= onitoring, etc.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDN control systems. In particular, this interfa= ce will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstre= am CDN.
=A0
The WG will discuss and address the security (including t= hreat model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside th= e above documents and specifications.
=A0
The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interope= ration between CDNs.
=A0
In particular, the WG will not define:
- = New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
=A0
The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and whe= re appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to real= ize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may as= sess the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstrea= m CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CD= NI=A0request routing decisions.
=A0
=A0
Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=A0
WG Creation + 6 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Subm= it CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 month= s: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Infor= mational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI requirements t= o IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standar= d
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Loggi= ng interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 = =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as propo= sed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Metad= ata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24= months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Recharter or dissolve
=A0
_______________= ________________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDN= i@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

=A0

__________________= _____________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailm= an/listinfo/cdni

=A0

=A0

=A0

Francois Le Faucheur=
Distingu= ished Engineer
Corporate Development
flefauch= @cisco.com
Phone:=A0+33 49 723 2619
Mobile:=A0+33 6 19 98 50 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 So= phia Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

=A0

=

=A0= Think before you print.

This email may contain confidential and priv= ileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use= , distribution or disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are n= ot the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), ple= ase contact the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message= .

Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Ca= mille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mou= lineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de l= a publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone.

For corporate legal information go to:
http://= www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html
<= /td>

=A0

=A0
=

=A0 ______________________________= _________________ CDNi mailing list CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni =

=A0=20 --20cf3040ea4a8d6cf604a0abbe44-- From vumip1@gmail.com Mon Apr 11 15:32:38 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D6B48E0688 for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:32:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.444 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.444 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.266, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, SARE_GIF_ATTACH=1.42] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qdS0gh-kFi0e for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:32:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yw0-f44.google.com (mail-yw0-f44.google.com [209.85.213.44]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83282E067C for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:32:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by ywi6 with SMTP id 6so2863495ywi.31 for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:32:26 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date :message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=7sTFY//YtRadnsorduTdmKIY3YiN6i2ZFJj9oXE3e0s=; b=lE5V77H6KkiMHA/5abOYU8zc8HUNNIFskmjm3onD5TbB9Wm6j27MoS6v4O8zB0O8Nr MgLWvvg5yDgf2UsiX8EF8auoNSKhai+iJYvR+Z6jdGzUJQn19C91t6SJRWKvaLrrLZPZ 7F+Vtc638bHFmDH0ONggLP79WCVrf4ptCUhpw= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; b=s8FRypK5wJ/OQpACfyAJbc3Ibyw095wANqHxS0NkbyAbPTE6bXF7uoNH/xqO0Y9I1J wYeRdVoCoAFA3zwG7dVcigMGT+3pCbXjeCRYsQ3I4cl65x05YhBeKrt7pXjjrG6ln9PK wmWNnCKvy7ASnVsPODk2PFteoOSlSWbDsGUkM= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.236.176.100 with SMTP id a64mr7274009yhm.377.1302559310966; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:01:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.236.108.161 with HTTP; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 15:01:50 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <95350AC4-F908-463F-B269-5AE8BADD860A@cisco.com> References: <95350AC4-F908-463F-B269-5AE8BADD860A@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 18:01:50 -0400 Message-ID: From: Bhumip Khasnabish To: Francois Le Faucheur Content-Type: multipart/related; boundary=20cf303e9f160770ea04a0abb9e5 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Trust Model was Re: Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 22:32:39 -0000 --20cf303e9f160770ea04a0abb9e5 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf303e9f160770e204a0abb9e4 --20cf303e9f160770e204a0abb9e4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Francois , Without getting carried away, I think there is a need to define "the" * mechanism* to *establish* a trusted *interconnection* between two CDN providers .. and any two CDN providers should be able to use it via appropriate bilateral agreement for seamless delivery of content to the end user. Anything else beyond the basic minimum can be developed later. Pls let me know what you think. Thanks. On Mon, Apr 11, 2011 at 5:06 AM, Francois Le Faucheur w= rote: > Bhumip, > > I suggest we clearly distinguish between: > *A* discussions on what the charter needs to say about CDNI trust model > *B* discussions about CDNI trust models (and examples of issues/concerns > that need to be covered in future CDNI deliverables). > > With respect to *A*, I believe there is violent agreement that the charte= r > needs to mention that the CDNI trust model needs to be discussed and > documented in deliverables (which the draft charter already does). Let us > know if you see differently. > > With respect to *B*, starting discussion on the trust model topic itself = is > all fine, but I recommend you use a different Subject header in order to > make it clear that this does not relate to the draft charter discussion. > > Thanks > > Francois > > > > On 11 Apr 2011, at 03:27, Lee, Yiu wrote: > > I can imagine two CDN providers would have pre-arranged mutual agreement > before interconnecting. I don't see a business case two CDNs would connec= t > without pre-arrangement. That said, it is up to the WG to decide if they > want to solve this problem or not. In the BoF, people agreed that we woul= d > need to document the transitive trust model. This is in scope. > > /Yiu > > From: Bhumip Khasnabish > Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 21:28:48 -0400 > To: Richard Woundy > Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" > Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter > > I see. Now if one CDN operator connects to another CDN operator without > pre-defined > > (a) security of the signaling/control interface, and > (b) policy for volume/type/... of content exchange, > > this could that open up both trust and regulatory concerns ... > > On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard < > Richard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote: > >> (not wearing co-chair hat) >> >> >* Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately >> administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >> >> Your question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous. >> >> Let=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizo= n >> employee (Nabil Bitar ) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Ver= izon >> and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I c= ould >> imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnection, >> perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher >> quality service to their respective customers. >> >> So in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they >> not? >> >> There isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92= s why >> the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model. >> >> -- Rich >> >> *From:* cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf >> Of *Bhumip Khasnabish >> *Sent:* Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM >> *To:* Francois Le Faucheur >> >> *Cc:* cdni@ietf.org >> *Subject:* Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter >> >> >> >> Hi Francois, >> >> You already agreed that "*Federation"* is out of scope. I am just >> reminding you that and requesting to put it in the charter. PLS see belo= w.. >> >> + ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDNs, but is "CDN >> Federation" in scope? >> + *Nabil*: CDNI is about interconnection only. *Federation is a more >> controlled environment which requires more policies.** >> *+ *Francois*: CDNI only defines how to interconnect two CDNs together. >> This can then be used in different ways, such as allow many CDNs to >> interconnect to many CDNs. *But the notion of "CDN Federation" itself is >> not in the scope.* >> >> >>interconnection of separately administered CDNs >> >> *Also, what about trust*? Do you assume that these two "separately >> administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify. >> >> Thanks. >> >> Best. >> >> Bhumip >> >> >> On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Faucheur >> wrote: >> Hi Bhumip, >> >> On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote: >> >> >> You mean interconnection of *TWO* separately administered CDNs, right = . >> .anything beyond two is out of scope . . >> pls confirm and clarify that in the charter. >> >> I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems involving multiple >> CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be able to make use of = more >> than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a different geographical >> footprint). >> As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be possible to specify a >> simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions on the topolog= ies >> of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CDNs - see >> http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/current/msg00224.html), but we >> felt this is something the WG would have to make a call on, once the >> trade-offs are better understood. >> >> So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open and stating the generic >> target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs). >> >> There was a discussion during the BOF about the fact that "CDN >> Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may have created some >> confusion since "federation" means different things to different people.= In >> my mind, "CDN Federation" implies particular modes of operation across t= he >> multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. they share some common policies/servi= ces >> etc). While this may be one way that a CDNI solution would be used, this >> seems beyond what a CDNI WG would deal with. In other words, a potential >> CDNI WG would define how a given CDN inter-operate with another CDN for >> delivery, with awareness that there may be multiple such CDN-to-CDN >> inter-operation in the overall system and therefore that delivery featur= es >> need to operate in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI WG should not concern >> itself with the policies/services that may, or may not, be offered on to= p of >> that multi-CDN system. >> >> Cheers >> >> Francois >> >> >> >> >> >The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the >interconnection of >> separately administered CDNs >> >> >> >> On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Faucheur < >> flefauch@cisco.com> wrote: >> Folks, >> >> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the >> charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >> >> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft >> charter is assessed by the ADs. >> >> Francois & Rich >> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on >> comment >> >> >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network element= s >> operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient >> distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but= is >> not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming o= f >> continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically pro= vide >> services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). >> >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service >> content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, impr= oved >> quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery= . >> For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery. >> >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP >> networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and >> many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are >> deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is genera= lly >> desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end >> user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This >> creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they = can >> interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure= . >> >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of >> separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of >> content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via >> their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted= , >> deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the >> industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using >> existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using >> existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI >> objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new >> protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. >> >> The working group will focus on the following items: >> >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem >> and a common terminology. >> >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of >> the CDNI solution and protocols >> >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different >> components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to= one >> another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing = the >> security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specif= ic >> to CDNI. >> >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CD= NI >> architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this docume= nt >> will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important >> requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols= and >> solutions produced by the working group. This document will list the >> requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of = the >> CDNI interfaces. >> >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & >> interoperation of: >> >> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CD= N >> request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information >> necessary to perform request redirection. >> >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs >> to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metad= ata >> refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the >> distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (fo= r >> example, this may include information enabling: content >> acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access >> control). >> >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to >> exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant >> across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content >> routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. >> >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an >> upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >> >> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational >> issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. >> >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN >> Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or >> interoperation between CDNs. >> >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User >> Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a >> CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >> >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, levera= ge >> protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requireme= nts >> and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of t= he >> ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange >> information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routi= ng >> decisions. >> >> >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routi= ng >> interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging >> interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control >> interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata >> Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >> >> >> >> >> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >> >> >> Folks, >> >> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter >> below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from ma= ny >> people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gathe= ring >> last night. It is available online at < >> http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>, and has been >> updated on the BOF wiki < >> http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>. >> >> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: < >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni>. >> >> -- Rich and Francois >> >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network element= s >> operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient >> distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but= is >> not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming o= f >> continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically pro= vide >> services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). >> >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service >> content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, impr= oved >> quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery= . >> For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery. >> >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP >> networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and >> many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are >> deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is genera= lly >> desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end >> user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. This >> creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they = can >> interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure= . >> >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of >> separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of >> content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via >> their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted= , >> deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by >> the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized u= sing >> existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using >> existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI >> objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new >> protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. >> >> The working group will focus on the following items: >> >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem >> and a common terminology. >> >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of >> the CDNI solution and protocols >> >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different >> components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to= one >> another. >> >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CD= NI >> architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this docume= nt >> will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important >> requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols= and >> solutions produced by the working group. >> >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & >> interoperation of: >> >> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface wi= ll >> allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstre= am >> CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. >> >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow >> the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribut= ion >> metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to th= e >> distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (fo= r >> example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, >> geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access control). >> >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging >> systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are >> relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and >> content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitori= ng, >> etc. >> >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow = an >> upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >> >> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), >> management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above >> documents and specifications. >> >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN >> Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or >> interoperation between CDNs. >> >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User >> Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a >> CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, levera= ge >> protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requireme= nts >> and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of t= he >> ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange >> information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routi= ng >> decisions. >> >> >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as >> Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request >> Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging >> interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control >> interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata >> Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> * >> Francois Le Faucheur* >> *Distinguished Engineer* >> *Corporate Development* >> flefauch@cisco.com >> Phone: *+33 49 723 2619* >> Mobile: *+33 6 19 98 50 90* >> >> *Cisco Systems France* >> Greenside >> 400 Ave de Roumanille >> 06410 Sophia Antipolis >> France >> Cisco.com >> >> >> Think before you print. >> >> >> This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole >> use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosu= re >> by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient = (or >> authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by r= eply >> email and delete all copies of this message. >> >> Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Cam= ille >> Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Moulin= eaux, >> Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la >> publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >> >> For corporate legal information go to: >> http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >> >> >> >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni > > > > * > Francois Le Faucheur* > *Distinguished Engineer* > *Corporate Development* > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: *+33 49 723 2619* > Mobile: *+33 6 19 98 50 90* > > > *Cisco Systems France* > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com > > > > Think before you print. > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole > use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosur= e > by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (= or > authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by re= ply > email and delete all copies of this message. > > Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Cami= lle > Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mouline= aux, > Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la > publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. > > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html > > > --20cf303e9f160770e204a0abb9e4 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Francois ,

=A0

Without getting carried away, I think there is a need to define "= the" mechanism to establish a trusted =

interconnection between two CDN providers .. and any t= wo CDN providers should be able to use it

via appropriate bilateral agreement for seamless delivery of content t= o the end user.

=A0

Anything else beyond the basic minimum can be developed later.

Pls let me know what you think. Thanks.

On Mon, Apr 11, 2011 at 5:06 AM, Francois Le Fau= cheur <flefauch@cisco.com> wrote:

Bhumip,=20

I suggest we clearly distinguish between:

*A* discussions on what t= he charter needs to say about CDNI trust model

*B* discussions about CDN= I trust models (and examples of issues/concerns that need to be covered in = future CDNI deliverables).

With respect to *A*, I believe there is violent agreement that the cha= rter needs to mention that the CDNI trust model needs to be discussed and d= ocumented in deliverables (which the draft charter already does). Let us kn= ow if you see differently.

With respect to *B*, starting discussion on the trust model topic itse= lf is all fine, but I recommend you use a different Subject header in order= to make it clear that this does not relate to the draft charter discussion= .

Thanks

Francois

On 11 Apr 2011, at 03:27, Lee, Yiu wrote:

I can imagine two CDN providers would have pre-arranged mutual agreeme= nt before interconnecting. I don't see a business case two CDNs would c= onnect without pre-arrangement. That said, it is up to the WG to decide if = they want to solve this problem or not. In the BoF, people agreed that we w= ould need to document the transitive trust model. This is in scope.

/Yiu

From: Bhumip Khasnabish <vumip1@gmail.com>Date: Sat, 9 Apr 2011 21:28:48 -0= 400
To: Richard Woundy <Richard_Woundy@c= able.comcast.com>
Cc: &q= uot;cdni@ietf.org&qu= ot; <cdni@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated versio= n of the CDNI charter

I see. Now if one CDN operator connects to another CDN operator withou= t pre-defined

=A0

(a) security of the signaling/control interface, and

(b) policy for volume/type/... of content exchange,

=A0

this could that open up both trust and regulatory concerns ...

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Woundy, Richard = <Richard_Woundy@cable.comcast.com> wrote:

(n= ot wearing co-chair hat)

=A0

&g= t; Also, what about trust? Do you assume that these= two "separately administered CDNs" trust each other? Pls clarify= .

=A0

Yo= ur question about =91trust=92 is ambiguous.

=A0

Le= t=92s use a practical example. We had CDNI presentations from a Verizon emp= loyee (Nabil=A0Bitar=A0) and a Comcast employee (Yiu Lee). In the US, Veriz= on and Comcast compete vigorously for broadband/phone/TV customers. But I c= ould imagine that Verizon and Comcast might cooperate on CDN interconnectio= n, perhaps to reduce each other=92s network costs and/or to provide higher = quality service to their respective customers.

=A0

So= in this example, do Verizon and Comcast trust each other? Or do they not?<= /span>

=A0

Th= ere isn=92t a simple binary answer (yes / no) to the question. That=92s why= the proposed charter says that we need to work on a trust model.
=A0

--= Rich

=A0

From: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf= Of Bhumip Khasnabish
Sent: Friday, April 08, 2011 6:13 AM
To: Francois Le Fauch= eur

Cc: cdni= @ietf.org
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI cha= rter

=A0

Hi Francois,

=A0

You already agreed that=A0 "Federatio= n" is out of scope. I am just reminding you that and requesti= ng to put it in the charter. PLS see below..

=A0

+ ?: CDNI only talks about interconnecting two CDN= s, but is "CDN Federation" in scope?
+ Nabil:= =A0CDNI=A0is about interconnection only. Federation is a more contr= olled environment which requires more policies.
+ Francois:=A0CDNI=A0only defines how to interconnect = two CDNs together. This can then be used in different ways, such as allow m= any CDNs to interconnect to many CDNs. But the notion of "CDN = Federation" itself is not in the scope.

=A0

>>interconnection of separately administered= CDNs

Also, what about trust? Do yo= u assume that these two "separately administered CDNs" trust each= other? Pls clarify.

=A0

Thanks.

=A0

Best.

=A0

Bhumip

=A0

On Fri, Apr 8, 2011 at 4:56 AM, Francois Le Fauche= ur <flefauch@cis= co.com> wrote:

Hi Bhumip,

=A0

On 8 Apr 2011, at 02:13, Bhumip Khasnabish wrote:<= /div>

You mean=A0 interconnection of TWO= separately administered CDNs, right . .anything beyond two is out of scope= . .

pls confirm and clarify that in the charter.
=

=A0

I believe the CDNI solution needs to allow systems= involving multiple CDNs. For example, a given upstream CDN needs to be abl= e to make use of more than one downstream CDNs (eg each covering a differen= t geographical footprint).=A0

As discussed on the list earlier, it _may_ be poss= ible to specify a simpler initial solution if we were to place restrictions= on the topologies of CDNs to be supported (e.g. do not support cascaded CD= Ns - see=A0http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/cdni/cur= rent/msg00224.html), but we felt this is something the WG would have to= make a call on, once the trade-offs are better understood.

=A0

So I'd recommend we keep the charter text open= and stating the generic target (i.e. support systems with multiple CDNs).<= /div>

=A0

There was a discussion during the BOF about the fa= ct that "CDN Federation" was outside the scope of CDNI. This may = have created some confusion since "federation" means different th= ings to different people. In my mind, "CDN Federation" implies pa= rticular modes of operation across the multiple interconnected CDNs (e.g. t= hey share some common policies/services etc). While this may be one way tha= t a CDNI solution would be used, this seems beyond what a CDNI WG would dea= l with. In other words, a potential CDNI WG would define how a given CDN in= ter-operate with another CDN for delivery, with awareness that there may be= multiple such CDN-to-CDN inter-operation in the overall system and therefo= re that delivery features need to operate in multi-CDN systems; but a CDNI = WG should not concern itself with the policies/services that may, or may no= t, be offered on top of that multi-CDN system.

=A0

Cheers

=A0

Francois

=A0

=A0

>The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow= the >interconnection of separately administered CDNs

=A0
<= /div>

On Thu, Apr 7, 2011 at 12:59 PM, Francois Le Fauch= eur <flefauch@ci= sco.com> wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated version of the C= DNI draft charter reflecting the charter discussion/edits during the BOF. <= /div>

Please bring forward t= he additional comments you have before this draft charter is assessed by th= e ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" comme= nts for now, let's focus on comment

=A0

Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio= n (CDNI) - Draft Charter
-----------------------------------------------= -----------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network elemen= ts operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distrib= ution and delivery of digital content.=A0Such content includes, but is not = limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of conti= nuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically=A0provide s= ervices to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service con= tent delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved q= uality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of delivery. = For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery= .

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP netw= orks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many N= etwork Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deploying t= heir own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable = that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardless o= f that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need f= or interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate an= d collectively behave as=A0a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of s= eparately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of conten= t from CSPs through multiple=A0CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their = respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deploya= ble solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed=A0by the industr= y. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing = IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing objec= t notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and sema= ntics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed ne= cessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "p= roblem statement" document providing a description of the problem and = a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing s= cenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the diffe= rent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate = to one another. This document will also=A0include a "threat analysis&q= uot; discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and priv= acy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirem= ents for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a=A0reasonable set of more urgent a= nd important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI= protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document will= =A0list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by= each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection &a= mp; interoperation of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interfac= e will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the down= stream CDN the information necessary to perform=A0request redirection.

o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDN= s to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metada= ta refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is relevant to the distr= ibution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for exampl= e, this may include information enabling: content acquisition,=A0geo-blocki= ng, enforcement of availability windows or access control).

o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems t= o exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant ac= ross CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content delivery and content rou= ting actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upst= ream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG= will discuss and address the security, management and operational issues s= pecific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Int= erconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperat= ion between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New se= ssion, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG= will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, leverage protoc= ols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements and C= DNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may assess the suitability of the ALT= O protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information = which may aid an upstream CDN with making=A0CDNI request routing decisions.=

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months:=A0 Submit CDNI problem state= ment to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months:=A0 Submit CDNI use= cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI = framework to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:=A0 Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Information= al
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:= =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:=A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interf= ace to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed S= tandard
WG Creation + 24 months:=A0 Recharter or dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote:

Folks,
=A0
I wanted everyone to have an upda= ted version of the CDNI draft charter below, for discussion at the BOF shor= tly. This is based on input from many people this week, including people th= at attended the informal CDNI gathering last night. It is=A0available onlin= e at <http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt&g= t;, and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.tools.ietf.o= rg/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>.
=A0
The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni&= gt;.
=A0
-- Rich and Francois
=A0
= Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
-------= ---------------------------------------------------------
=A0
Descrip= tion of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D
=A0
A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure o= f network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the e= fficient distribution and delivery of digital=A0content. Such content inclu= des, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and st= reaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typic= ally=A0provide services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).
=A0
CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improve= d quality of experience for end users=A0and increased robustness of deliver= y. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content deliv= ery.
=A0
As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP n= etworks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and man= y Network Service Providers and=A0Enterprise Service Providers are deployin= g their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirab= le that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user=A0regardles= s of that end user's location or attachment network. This creates a nee= d for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate= and collectively behave=A0as a single delivery infrastructure.
=A0
The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection o= f separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of con= tent from CSPs through multiple CDNs=A0and ultimately to end users (via the= ir respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, depl= oyable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the=A0indu= stry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existi= ng IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing ob= ject notation=A0grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and s= emantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed= necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.
=A0
The working group will focus on the following items:
=A0
- A &= quot;problem statement" document providing a description of the proble= m and a common terminology.
=A0
- A "use case" document des= cribing scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and proto= cols
=A0
- A "framework" document providing a description of the di= fferent components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and rela= te to one another.
=A0
- A "requirements" document. This do= cument lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to su= pport it. In particular, this document will focus on identifying a=A0reason= able set of more urgent and important requirements that will be addressed i= n the initial set of CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working g= roup.
=A0
- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection= & interoperation of:
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI request-routin= g systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN request= routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary= =A0to perform request redirection.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interfa= ce will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope= . Distribution metadata refers to the subset of=A0content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processe= d by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: content=A0ac= quisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access cont= rol).
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow = CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions= that are relevant across CDNs (such as content=A0distribution, content del= ivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, m= onitoring, etc.
=A0
=A0=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0o CDN control systems. In particular, this interfa= ce will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstre= am CDN.
=A0
The WG will discuss and address the security (including t= hreat model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside th= e above documents and specifications.
=A0
The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interope= ration between CDNs.
=A0
In particular, the WG will not define:
- = New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User Agent= .
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and= a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocol= s and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consum= ing CDNI logs.
=A0
The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and whe= re appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to real= ize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. For=A0example, the WG may as= sess the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstrea= m CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CD= NI=A0request routing decisions.
=A0
=A0
Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=A0
WG Creation + 6 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Subm= it CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 month= s: =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Infor= mational
WG Creation + 12 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit CDNI requirements t= o IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit spec= ification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standar= d
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Loggi= ng interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: =A0 = =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as propo= sed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Submit specification of the CDNI Metad= ata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24= months: =A0 =A0 =A0 Recharter or dissolve
=A0
_______________= ________________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDN= i@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

=A0

__________________= _____________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailm= an/listinfo/cdni

=A0

=A0

=

=A0

Francois Le Faucheur=
Distingu= ished Engineer
Corporate Development
flefauch= @cisco.com
Phone:=A0+33 49 723 2619
Mobile:=A0+33 6 19 98 50 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 So= phia Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

=A0

= =A0Think before you print.

This email may contain confidential and priv= ileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use= , distribution or disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are n= ot the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), ple= ase contact the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message= .

Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Ca= mille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mou= lineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de l= a publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone.

For corporate legal information go to:
http://= www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html
<= /td>

=A0

=A0
______________________________________________= _ CDNi mailing list CDNi= @ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni
_______________________________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://= www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

Francois Le Faucheur=
Distinguished Engineer
Corporate D= evelopment
flefauch@cisco.com
Phone:=A0+33 49 723 = 2619
Mobile:=A0+33 6 19 98 50 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 Sophia Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

=A0

=A0Think before you print.

This email may contain confidential and pri= vileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, us= e, distribution or disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are = not the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), pl= ease contact the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this messag= e.

Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue Ca= mille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Mou= lineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de l= a publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone.

For corporate legal information go to:
http://= www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html

=

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YVBbQR20McEY2pGoUD6D9T6nueanrWK5Yxj/ACxS+5WOCvV9tWq1bW9pUlO3bmbf66hRRRVGQUUU UAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAf/2Q== --20cf303e9f160770ea04a0abb9e5 Content-Type: image/gif; name="green.gif" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-ID: X-Attachment-Id: cdbafe8bc86b7d30_0.1.2 R0lGODlhEgATAJEAAAAAAP///wCZAP///yH5BAEAAAMALAAAAAASABMAAAIojI+pGyK8nINqUiTf bVnfvHEg1UmhdZRqaawu6XZVjKb0/CYxo8JOAQA7 --20cf303e9f160770ea04a0abb9e5-- From richard_woundy@cable.comcast.com Mon Apr 11 20:21:12 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7B11E06AC for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:21:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -108.463 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-108.463 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_MODEMCABLE=0.768, HOST_EQ_MODEMCABLE=1.368, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xe-hNYQay-uv for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:21:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pacdcimo01.cable.comcast.com (PacdcIMO01.cable.comcast.com [24.40.8.145]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 154F3E069F for ; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 20:21:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.41]) by pacdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503620.119434747; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 18:39:13 -0400 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB02.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::11d4:f530:37a0:9f4e%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Mon, 11 Apr 2011 18:39:13 -0400 From: "Woundy, Richard" To: David R Oran , "cdni@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Trust Model Thread-Index: AQHL+JZQXt3RHemIB0acaZJ2adYttZRZQTMg Date: Mon, 11 Apr 2011 22:39:12 +0000 Message-ID: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E491E@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> References: <95350AC4-F908-463F-B269-5AE8BADD860A@cisco.com> <2B63C73B-A143-4654-A3A9-5B9CBB78B3D6@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <2B63C73B-A143-4654-A3A9-5B9CBB78B3D6@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.191.223.245] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [CDNi] Trust Model X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 03:21:12 -0000 PiBTb21lb25lIGluIGFuIGVhcmxpZXIgcG9zdCBzZWVtZWQgdG8gYmUgc2F5aW5nIHRoYXQgeW91 IGRpZG4ndCBuZWVkIHRvIHdvcnJ5IGFib3V0IHRydXN0IHRyYW5zaXRpdml0eSBpZiB5b3Ugb25s 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RE5pIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiBDRE5pQGlldGYub3JnDQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3Jn L21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vY2RuaQ0KDQpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KQ0ROaSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCkNETmlAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCmh0dHBz Oi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vY2RuaQ0K From flefauch@cisco.com Tue Apr 12 05:50:45 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52914E06F5 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 05:50:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 86O1MZk+W8OW for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 05:50:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from 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(8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p3CCogmu008296 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 12:50:42 GMT From: Francois Le Faucheur Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-108-35475173 Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 14:51:45 +0200 In-Reply-To: To: cdni@ietf.org References: Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Subject: [CDNi] CDNI BOF - final minutes posted X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 12:50:45 -0000 --Apple-Mail-108-35475173 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hello, The comments received on the draft minutes have been incorporated in = updated CDNI BOF Minutes available at: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/minutes/cdni.htm Cheers Francois & Rich On 6 Apr 2011, at 17:53, Francois Le Faucheur wrote: > Hello, >=20 > Draft CDNI BOF minutes are available from the IETF meeting materials = website: > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/minutes/cdni.txt >=20 > Please provide corrections & comments as needed. >=20 > Thanks >=20 > Francois & Richard >=20 > PS: thanks to Emile for providing his notes as the basis for these = minutes. >=20 > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni --Apple-Mail-108-35475173 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii http://www.ie= tf.org/proceedings/80/minutes/cdni.htm

Cheers=

Francois & Rich

On = 6 Apr 2011, at 17:53, Francois Le Faucheur wrote:

Hello,

Draft = CDNI BOF minutes are available from the IETF meeting materials = website:
http://www.ie= tf.org/proceedings/80/minutes/cdni.txt

Please = provide corrections & comments as = needed.

Thanks

Francois = & Richard

PS: thanks to Emile for = providing his notes as the basis for these minutes.

CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/ma= ilman/listinfo/cdni

To: "Francois Le Faucheur" , References: Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 14:58:30 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994 X-Provags-ID: V02:K0:fdvZesQuyBFzULNu48NkfX9MhQz7t8os3Nr0ugHGxcZ Ao6ackEKfD93/7oSVhLxqE73raA85h8RSGvSWK9TpGj6CeqUtU R3yJNPMIWfQgh8kzlOe5ex9fMmqP05QWeaO4UzjvXDPEP2/y4R 2hxfidHjsO90JirRoFQNeoDFc7CSGYdij2/tfYcUXo6N6gfhr2 mdRST1kzzEsbD5tYaLoegqveVcyM7TmE2HkiLh4jVI= Subject: Re: [CDNi] CDNI BOF - final minutes posted X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 19:58:40 -0000 My apologies for late comments, of course. And thanks for a really well-executed BOF. Spencer + Rich: the WG will have to consider and address this privacy issue. + Jason: every IETF document has a security section and it could be covered there. + Spencer Dawkins (?): this has to be handled when the WG is set up - Not sure what the (?) was meant to be - but I also noticed there are a couple of "Spencer Dawkins (IAB)"s further down, but I was actually attending this BOF as an individual. Could the (?) and (IAB)s go away? - What I intended to say was, "this can be handled by the work group, and shouldn't gate chartering". ... + Eric Burger: We should identify the requirements that UltraViolet may place on CDNI. + Jon Peterson (IAB and UltraViolet hat also) : UltraViolet may be relevant (eg they also define metadata). UltraViolet folks are aware of this new CDNI activity. + Spencer Dawkins (IAB): it would be smart to have discussions with these people (for the final charter) - What I meant to say was "It would be smart to have discussions with these people, but that can be added to the charter as one of the groups that the CDNI working group would coordinate with." ... ** Discussion before the hum test + Spencer: did you mention a couple of protocols that may need to be extended? + Francois: only need to define a schema, but no new schema languages and no new protocol or protocol extensions; + Ben: no new schema languages and no new protocol or protocol extensions needed. + ?: but there was mention of potential ALTO extensions? Does this need to be brought up in the charter? + Spencer: no need to do that in the charter - What I meant to say was, "no need to delay chartering to discuss potential ALTO extensions, since you can do CDNI without relying on those extensions". ... + Eric & Spencer: charter to do this without extending existing protocols + Francois: we say that we need only to define several schema. If we need ALTO extensions this still only requires work on schema and not definition of new protocol or protocol extensions per say (whether done in CDNI WG or in ALTO WG). + Bruce Davie: it is pretty clear that CDNI does not require protocol work (ie only schema definition). + Spencer: ok to define a protocol at schema level: are you going to need the extension of protocol that another WG is in charge of? - What I meant to ask here was whether CDNI would rely on any extensions of protocols that another WG is in charge of, so that we would need to discuss those extensions with another WG as part of chartering CDNI. I thought the answer was "no" :D + ? : potential extra work for ALTO need not be decided/spelled out in the charter. From flefauch@cisco.com Tue Apr 12 13:54:42 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A7567E0933 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 13:54:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id q9jb2quqflhe for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 13:54:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-2.cisco.com (ams-iport-2.cisco.com [144.254.224.141]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9BF0DE0688 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 13:54:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=flefauch@cisco.com; l=11432; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1302641680; x=1303851280; h=subject:mime-version:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id: references:to; bh=mEoZwkDC8lP//NzH2xhZVdaQIggL5Aq0BDNA9N9QSy8=; b=P0d4I5DB/fUKNH8IYpK9b/KvvUAduu60UBxhfAO2cgRhMtEFbQeo1+aJ JCf9oqJeeOQ9cDqoQRAtw9wDWwtzzVeuyvcW/sEXzcZNHhtyBNT6ckx5a yJd/aP1NjiEsmHEE59G7FRquElBcMN5GCPqdMtps0tnr/YhvN5KAFixPU Q=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,199,1301875200"; d="scan'208,217";a="25455243" Received: from ams-core-1.cisco.com ([144.254.72.81]) by ams-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 12 Apr 2011 20:54:40 +0000 Received: from ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com (ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com [10.55.161.196]) by ams-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p3CKsc4F018374; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 20:54:39 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-277-64512903 From: Francois Le Faucheur X-Priority: 3 In-Reply-To: <3C24EBED9F2A482E998B740C8CE1A1D9@china.huawei.com> Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 22:55:43 +0200 Message-Id: <582619C4-C408-4250-99FE-31BB83049096@cisco.com> References: <3C24EBED9F2A482E998B740C8CE1A1D9@china.huawei.com> To: "Spencer Dawkins" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] CDNI BOF - final minutes posted X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 20:54:42 -0000 --Apple-Mail-277-64512903 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hello Spencer, On 12 Apr 2011, at 21:58, Spencer Dawkins wrote: > My apologies for late comments, of course. no problems. > And thanks for a really well-executed BOF. >=20 > Spencer >=20 > + Rich: the WG will have to consider and address this privacy issue. > + Jason: every IETF document has a security section and it could be = covered there. > + Spencer Dawkins (?): this has to be handled when the WG is set up >=20 > - Not sure what the (?) was meant to be - but I also noticed there are = a couple of "Spencer Dawkins (IAB)"s further down, but I was actually = attending this BOF as an individual. Could the (?) and (IAB)s go away? fixed. >=20 > - What I intended to say was, "this can be handled by the work group, = and shouldn't gate chartering". >=20 fixed. > ... >=20 > + Eric Burger: We should identify the requirements that UltraViolet = may place on CDNI. > + Jon Peterson (IAB and UltraViolet hat also) : UltraViolet may be = relevant (eg they also define metadata). UltraViolet folks are aware of = this new CDNI activity. > + Spencer Dawkins (IAB): it would be smart to have discussions with = these people (for the final charter) >=20 > - What I meant to say was "It would be smart to have discussions with = these people, but that can be added to the charter as one of the groups = that the CDNI working group would coordinate with." fixed. Sorry for missing that. We 'll also reflect that in the draft charter, = unless we hear dissent.=20 >=20 > ... >=20 > ** Discussion before the hum test >=20 > + Spencer: did you mention a couple of protocols that may need to be = extended? > + Francois: only need to define a schema, but no new schema languages = and no new protocol or protocol extensions; > + Ben: no new schema languages and no new protocol or protocol = extensions needed. > + ?: but there was mention of potential ALTO extensions? Does this = need to be brought up in the charter? > + Spencer: no need to do that in the charter >=20 > - What I meant to say was, "no need to delay chartering to discuss = potential ALTO extensions, since you can do CDNI without relying on = those extensions". >=20 Please see below. > ... >=20 > + Eric & Spencer: charter to do this without extending existing = protocols > + Francois: we say that we need only to define several schema. If we = need ALTO extensions this still only requires work on schema and not = definition of new protocol or protocol extensions per say (whether done = in CDNI WG or in ALTO WG). > + Bruce Davie: it is pretty clear that CDNI does not require protocol = work (ie only schema definition). > + Spencer: ok to define a protocol at schema level: are you going to = need the extension of protocol that another WG is in charge of? >=20 > - What I meant to ask here was whether CDNI would rely on any = extensions of protocols that another WG is in charge of, so that we = would need to discuss those extensions with another WG as part of = chartering CDNI. I thought the answer was "no" :D > + ? : potential extra work for ALTO need not be decided/spelled out in = the charter.=20 Here is how I see the situation. Among other things, the CDNI solution: * _must_ define a base exchange of request-routing information = across CDNs. This would be specified as the "CDNI Request Routing = interface" that is a deliverable of the CDNI WG. * _may_ also define expanded exchange of request-routing related = information across CDNs (eg to allow dynamic discovery of downstream CDN = footprint/capabilities/...). This may or may not be part of the initial = CDNI solution. If it is part of it, how much "expanded" exchange to = support is to be decided by the WG. If is part of it, the WG would = consider several candidate "protocol stacks" to support it which include = (i) incorporate this into the "CDNI Request Routing interface", (ii) get = it incorporated in ALTO and (iii) get it advertised using BGP. I believe the general sense was that the above determinations (i.e. do = we want to do expanded exchange of request-routing info? if yes, how = much? if yes, using which base protocol stack?) would be best done = if/once there is a WG since they require better = understanding/convergence on the trade-offs. So this was intended to be = left open in the draft charter.=20 So, in summary, I would say that the answer to your question was : "CDNI does not rely on extensions that another WG is in charge of, but = may potentially, at a later stage, propose requirements to be taken on = by another WG (ie ALTO). Noting that this is just one of many potential outcomes (eg a CDNI WG = may decide to not cover this functionality in initial scope, or may = conclude that it be better realized in other ways than using ALTO)." Not quite as short answer as "no", 8^).=20 Thanks Francois= --Apple-Mail-277-64512903 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Hello = Spencer,

On 12 Apr 2011, at 21:58, Spencer Dawkins = wrote:

My apologies for late comments, of = course.

no = problems.

And thanks for a = really well-executed BOF.

Spencer

+ Rich: the WG will have = to consider and address this privacy issue.
+ Jason: every IETF = document has a security section and it could be covered there.
+ = Spencer Dawkins (?): this has to be handled when the WG is set = up

- Not sure what the (?) was meant to be - but I also noticed = there are a couple of "Spencer Dawkins (IAB)"s further down, but I was = actually attending this BOF as an individual. Could the (?) and (IAB)s = go = away?

fixed.

- What I intended to say was, "this can be = handled by the work group, and shouldn't gate = chartering".

fixed.
...

+ Eric Burger: We should = identify the requirements that UltraViolet may place on CDNI.
+ Jon = Peterson (IAB and UltraViolet hat also) : UltraViolet may be relevant = (eg they also define metadata). UltraViolet folks are aware of this new = CDNI activity.
+ Spencer Dawkins (IAB): it would be smart to have = discussions with these people (for the final charter)

- What I = meant to say was "It would be smart to have discussions with these = people, but that can be added to the charter as one of the groups that = the CDNI working group would coordinate = with."

fixed.
Sorry = for missing that. We 'll also reflect that in the draft charter, = unless we hear dissent.

...

** Discussion before the hum = test

+ Spencer: did you mention a couple of protocols that may = need to be extended?
+ Francois: only need to define a schema, but no = new schema languages and no new protocol or protocol extensions;
+ = Ben: no new schema languages and no new protocol or protocol extensions = needed.
+ ?: but there was mention of potential ALTO extensions? Does = this need to be brought up in the charter?
+ Spencer: no need to do = that in the charter

- What I meant to say was, "no need to delay = chartering to discuss potential ALTO extensions, since you can do CDNI = without relying on those = extensions".

Please see = below.

...

+ Eric & = Spencer: charter to do this without extending existing protocols
+ = Francois: we say that we need only to define several schema. If we need = ALTO extensions this still only requires work on schema and not = definition of new protocol or protocol extensions per say (whether done = in CDNI WG or in ALTO WG).
+ Bruce Davie: it is pretty clear that = CDNI does not require protocol work (ie only schema definition).
+ = Spencer: ok to define a protocol at schema level: are you going to need = the extension of protocol that another WG is in charge of?

- What = I meant to ask here was whether CDNI would rely on any extensions of = protocols that another WG is in charge of, so that we would need to = discuss those extensions with another WG as part of chartering CDNI. I = thought the answer was "no" = :D

+ = ? : potential extra work for ALTO need not be decided/spelled out in the = charter.

* _must_ define a base exchange of request-routing = information across CDNs. This would be specified as the "CDNI Request = Routing interface" that is a deliverable of the CDNI WG.
* _may_ = also define expanded exchange of request-routing related information = across CDNs (eg to allow dynamic discovery of downstream CDN = footprint/capabilities/...). This may or may not be part of the initial = CDNI solution. If it is part of it, how much "expanded" exchange to = support is to be decided by the WG. If is part of it, the WG would = consider several candidate "protocol stacks" to support it which include = (i) incorporate this into the "CDNI Request Routing interface", (ii) get = it incorporated in ALTO and (iii) get it advertised using = BGP.

I believe the general sense was that the = above determinations (i.e. do we want to do expanded exchange of = request-routing info? if yes, how much? if yes, using which base = protocol stack?) would be best done if/once there is a WG since they = require better understanding/convergence on the trade-offs. So this was = intended to be left open in the draft = charter.

So, in summary, I would say that = the answer to your question was :
"CDNI does not rely on = extensions that another WG is in charge of, but may potentially, at a = later stage, propose requirements to be taken on by another WG (ie = ALTO).
Noting that this is just one of many potential outcomes = (eg a CDNI WG may decide to not cover this functionality in initial = scope, or may conclude that it be better realized in other ways than = using ALTO)."

Not quite as short answer as = "no", = 8^).

Thanks

Francois
= --Apple-Mail-277-64512903-- From spencer@wonderhamster.org Tue Apr 12 15:37:43 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F7E6E07F4 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 15:37:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.99 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.99 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.608, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nuVYjAv1f0bv for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 15:37:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.perfora.net (mout.perfora.net [74.208.4.194]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0B70E07F5 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 15:37:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from S73602b (cpe-76-182-230-135.tx.res.rr.com [76.182.230.135]) by mrelay.perfora.net (node=mrus3) with ESMTP (Nemesis) id 0MNZkg-1QGv5R3s1S-007M73; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 18:37:39 -0400 Message-ID: <4E66884E3D2D4CB7BF654BDF65259E6C@china.huawei.com> From: "Spencer Dawkins" To: "Francois Le Faucheur" References: <3C24EBED9F2A482E998B740C8CE1A1D9@china.huawei.com> <582619C4-C408-4250-99FE-31BB83049096@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 17:37:32 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_260F_01CBF938.4D60DEB0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5931 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5994 X-Provags-ID: V02:K0:cgHIkW8na0n115W9+9WJ+eiZ0LW+p9kw9wZbuHkjZNa KLh2nhEh2U6hgppfoszv4FaCuHocPj+xXD2nUeYfC+sFlkNKNQ 8OEyhkBnjdcp74pWvIYesSLIbeJv1N4Frlkwit+x0mLkk7F5a4 auLgVRy3Vxg5lBffJ3DXVw3gkTZrAno8IGyKEjYVQNAfyrchF2 NCvuX17BW0Uxuf4RAbrWVX3+ZRkqzS1ebUImHGGdj4= Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] CDNI BOF - final minutes posted X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Apr 2011 22:37:43 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_260F_01CBF938.4D60DEB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Francois, Ack, and thanks for your note on my last item. I'm fine with where you = are. Spencer ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Francois Le Faucheur=20 To: Spencer Dawkins=20 Cc: Francois Le Faucheur ; cdni@ietf.org=20 Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2011 3:55 PM Subject: Re: [CDNi] CDNI BOF - final minutes posted Hello Spencer, On 12 Apr 2011, at 21:58, Spencer Dawkins wrote: My apologies for late comments, of course. no problems. And thanks for a really well-executed BOF. Spencer + Rich: the WG will have to consider and address this privacy issue. + Jason: every IETF document has a security section and it could be = covered there. + Spencer Dawkins (?): this has to be handled when the WG is set up - Not sure what the (?) was meant to be - but I also noticed there = are a couple of "Spencer Dawkins (IAB)"s further down, but I was = actually attending this BOF as an individual. Could the (?) and (IAB)s = go away? fixed. - What I intended to say was, "this can be handled by the work = group, and shouldn't gate chartering". fixed. ... + Eric Burger: We should identify the requirements that UltraViolet = may place on CDNI. + Jon Peterson (IAB and UltraViolet hat also) : UltraViolet may be = relevant (eg they also define metadata). UltraViolet folks are aware of = this new CDNI activity. + Spencer Dawkins (IAB): it would be smart to have discussions with = these people (for the final charter) - What I meant to say was "It would be smart to have discussions = with these people, but that can be added to the charter as one of the = groups that the CDNI working group would coordinate with." fixed. Sorry for missing that. We 'll also reflect that in the draft charter, = unless we hear dissent.=20 ... ** Discussion before the hum test + Spencer: did you mention a couple of protocols that may need to be = extended? + Francois: only need to define a schema, but no new schema = languages and no new protocol or protocol extensions; + Ben: no new schema languages and no new protocol or protocol = extensions needed. + ?: but there was mention of potential ALTO extensions? Does this = need to be brought up in the charter? + Spencer: no need to do that in the charter - What I meant to say was, "no need to delay chartering to discuss = potential ALTO extensions, since you can do CDNI without relying on = those extensions". Please see below. ... + Eric & Spencer: charter to do this without extending existing = protocols + Francois: we say that we need only to define several schema. If we = need ALTO extensions this still only requires work on schema and not = definition of new protocol or protocol extensions per say (whether done = in CDNI WG or in ALTO WG). + Bruce Davie: it is pretty clear that CDNI does not require = protocol work (ie only schema definition). + Spencer: ok to define a protocol at schema level: are you going to = need the extension of protocol that another WG is in charge of? - What I meant to ask here was whether CDNI would rely on any = extensions of protocols that another WG is in charge of, so that we = would need to discuss those extensions with another WG as part of = chartering CDNI. I thought the answer was "no" :D + ? : potential extra work for ALTO need not be decided/spelled out = in the charter.=20 Here is how I see the situation. Among other things, the CDNI solution: * _must_ define a base exchange of request-routing information across = CDNs. This would be specified as the "CDNI Request Routing interface" = that is a deliverable of the CDNI WG. * _may_ also define expanded exchange of request-routing related = information across CDNs (eg to allow dynamic discovery of downstream CDN = footprint/capabilities/...). This may or may not be part of the initial = CDNI solution. If it is part of it, how much "expanded" exchange to = support is to be decided by the WG. If is part of it, the WG would = consider several candidate "protocol stacks" to support it which include = (i) incorporate this into the "CDNI Request Routing interface", (ii) get = it incorporated in ALTO and (iii) get it advertised using BGP. I believe the general sense was that the above determinations (i.e. do = we want to do expanded exchange of request-routing info? if yes, how = much? if yes, using which base protocol stack?) would be best done = if/once there is a WG since they require better = understanding/convergence on the trade-offs. So this was intended to be = left open in the draft charter.=20 So, in summary, I would say that the answer to your question was : "CDNI does not rely on extensions that another WG is in charge of, but = may potentially, at a later stage, propose requirements to be taken on = by another WG (ie ALTO). Noting that this is just one of many potential outcomes (eg a CDNI WG = may decide to not cover this functionality in initial scope, or may = conclude that it be better realized in other ways than using ALTO)." Not quite as short answer as "no", 8^).=20 Thanks Francois ------=_NextPart_000_260F_01CBF938.4D60DEB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Francois,

Ack, and thanks for your note on my last item. I'm = fine with=20 where you are.

Spencer

----- Original Message -----
From:=20 Francois Le=20 Faucheur

To: Spencer Dawkins

Cc: Francois Le Faucheur ; cdni@ietf.org =

Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2011 = 3:55=20 PM

Subject: Re: [CDNi] CDNI BOF - = final=20 minutes posted

Hello Spencer,

On 12 Apr 2011, at 21:58, Spencer Dawkins wrote:

My apologies for late comments, of = course.

no problems.

And thanks for a really well-executed = BOF.

Spencer

+=20 Rich: the WG will have to consider and address this privacy = issue.
+=20 Jason: every IETF document has a security section and it could be = covered=20 there.
+ Spencer Dawkins (?): this has to be handled when the WG = is set=20 up

- Not sure what the (?) was meant to be - but I also = noticed there=20 are a couple of "Spencer Dawkins (IAB)"s further down, but I was = actually=20 attending this BOF as an individual. Could the (?) and (IAB)s go=20 away?

fixed.

- What I intended to say was, "this can be handled by the = work=20 group, and shouldn't gate chartering".

fixed.

...

+ Eric Burger: We should identify the requirements = that=20 UltraViolet may place on CDNI.
+ Jon Peterson (IAB and = UltraViolet hat=20 also) : UltraViolet may be relevant (eg they also define metadata).=20 UltraViolet folks are aware of this new CDNI activity.
+ Spencer = Dawkins=20 (IAB): it would be smart to have discussions with these people (for = the=20 final charter)

- What I meant to say was "It would be smart = to have=20 discussions with these people, but that can be added to the charter = as one=20 of the groups that the CDNI working group would coordinate=20 with."

fixed.

Sorry for missing that. We 'll also reflect that in the = draft=20 charter, unless we hear dissent.

...

** Discussion before the hum test

+ = Spencer: did=20 you mention a couple of protocols that may need to be extended?
+ = Francois: only need to define a schema, but no new schema languages = and no=20 new protocol or protocol extensions;
+ Ben: no new schema = languages and=20 no new protocol or protocol extensions needed.
+ ?: but there was = mention=20 of potential ALTO extensions? Does this need to be brought up in the = charter?
+ Spencer: no need to do that in the charter

- = What I=20 meant to say was, "no need to delay chartering to discuss potential = ALTO=20 extensions, since you can do CDNI without relying on those=20 extensions".

Please see below.

...

+ Eric & Spencer: charter to do this without = extending=20 existing protocols
+ Francois: we say that we need only to define = several=20 schema. If we need ALTO extensions this still only requires work on = schema=20 and not definition of new protocol or protocol extensions per say = (whether=20 done in CDNI WG or in ALTO WG).
+ Bruce Davie: it is pretty clear = that=20 CDNI does not require protocol work (ie only schema = definition).
+=20 Spencer: ok to define a protocol at schema level: are you going to = need the=20 extension of protocol that another WG is in charge of?

- What = I meant=20 to ask here was whether CDNI would rely on any extensions of = protocols that=20 another WG is in charge of, so that we would need to discuss those=20 extensions with another WG as part of chartering CDNI. I thought the = answer=20 was "no" :D

+ ? : potential extra work for ALTO need not be decided/spelled = out in=20 the charter.

Here is how I see the situation.

Among other things, the CDNI solution:

*=20 _must_ define a base exchange of request-routing information = across CDNs.=20 This would be specified as the "CDNI Request Routing interface" that = is a=20 deliverable of the CDNI WG.

* = _may_ also=20 define expanded exchange of request-routing related information across = CDNs=20 (eg to allow dynamic discovery of downstream CDN = footprint/capabilities/...).=20 This may or may not be part of the initial CDNI solution. If it is = part of it,=20 how much "expanded" exchange to support is to be decided by the WG. If = is part=20 of it, the WG would consider several candidate "protocol stacks" to = support it=20 which include (i) incorporate this into the "CDNI Request Routing = interface",=20 (ii) get it incorporated in ALTO and (iii) get it advertised using = BGP.

I believe the general sense was that the above determinations = (i.e. do we=20 want to do expanded exchange of request-routing info? if yes, how = much? if=20 yes, using which base protocol stack?) would be best done if/once = there is a=20 WG since they require better understanding/convergence on the = trade-offs. So=20 this was intended to be left open in the draft charter.

So, in summary, I would say that the answer to your question was = :

"CDNI does not rely on extensions that another WG is in charge = of, but=20 may potentially, at a later stage, propose requirements to be taken on = by=20 another WG (ie ALTO).

Noting that this is just one of many potential outcomes (eg a = CDNI WG may=20 decide to not cover this functionality in initial scope, or may = conclude that=20 it be better realized in other ways than using ALTO)."

Not quite as short answer as "no", 8^).

Thanks

Francois
------=_NextPart_000_260F_01CBF938.4D60DEB0-- From zhouzp@huawei.com Tue Apr 12 21:11:45 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12245E06A3 for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 21:11:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 2.53 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.53 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=4.610, BAYES_40=-0.185, FH_RELAY_NODNS=1.451, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, RDNS_NONE=0.1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nlVsCPHh74-i for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 21:11:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from szxga03-in.huawei.com (unknown [119.145.14.66]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB4EDE066A for ; Tue, 12 Apr 2011 21:11:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (szxga03-in [172.24.2.9]) by szxga03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJK00EUPOVIRK@szxga03-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 13 Apr 2011 12:09:18 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxga03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJK00ITIOVIGT@szxga03-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 13 Apr 2011 12:09:18 +0800 (CST) Received: from z54906a ([10.138.73.38]) by szxml06-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LJK00FAVOVE22@szxml06-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 13 Apr 2011 12:09:18 +0800 (CST) Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 12:09:13 +0800 From: zhouzhipeng To: "'Woundy, Richard'" , flefauch@cisco.com Message-id: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_o/EqqTffM8KDagsudsrt7w)" Content-language: zh-cn Thread-index: Acv5kIyHKBUup+JgQLqB7clE9gC4Gg== Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] Editorial comments on the CDNI charter. X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 04:11:45 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_o/EqqTffM8KDagsudsrt7w) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Rich , Francois, all, Some editorial comments for CDNI charter as below: =20 >operating at layer 4 through layer 7 That sentence will bring the meaning that CDN will cover from layer 4 to layer 7. CDN may be considered either on service layer or an layer over = IP layer and below the service layer. And in fact these several words do = not make sense. May be moved. >streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, The RTSP is used to instruct =A1=AEplay=A1=AF or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. May = say =A1=B0delivered via HTTP, RTP=A1=B1. >a description of the different components of the CDNI solution and how = they interact with and relate to one another. I think =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and = =A1=AErelate to=A1=AF seems redundant . >"threat analysis" discussing the security concerns and threats, the = trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI=20 I think all security related issues associated to the architecture is = the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1. Hence it may be :" trust model " discussing the security concerns and threats, and privacy issues specific to CDNI Another , Should CDNI co-work with another WG on security area. >A "framework" document providing a =A1=AD I think it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN should be = defined in the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even if we do not define new protocols. >A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols=20 As for the protocols here, are they existing protocols or new protocols. = Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some protocols will not be defined in this WG. So, clarification is expected. >This document will list the requirements stemming from the threat = analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces How may we understand its relationship to the first sentence in this = section =A1=B0This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it.=A1=B1 >This interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to = obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. May the downstream CDN also request some information from the upstream = CDN for further transfer? I think =A1=AEyes=A1=AF. =20 >Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata I think the =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the superset of = =A1=B0content metadata=A1=B1 not the subset. For example, whether the location = information of the end user belong to =A1=B0 content metadata=A1=B1. >CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. It is not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since two CDNs only take the contract for = CDN interconnection. It may be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1 rather than = =A1=B0control=A1=B1. Besides =A1=B0remove content from the downstream CDN=A1=B1, the upstream CDN = mainly may inform downstream CDN where/who the content is issued to. =20 Another, for all these bullets of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I think the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. = =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) and the explanation following also use the word = =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface will=A1=AD. =20 =20 Thanks. Zhipeng =20 ----------------------------------------------------- Huawei Software Technologies Co.,Ltd. No.101=A3=ACSoftware Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of China Zipcode:210012 E-Mail: zhouzp@huawei.com Phone:(+86) 25-56620690 Fax:(+86) 25-56624081 Mobile:(+86) 13404162849 ----------------------------------------------------- =20 _____ =20 --Boundary_(ID_o/EqqTffM8KDagsudsrt7w) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Rich , = Francois, all,
Some editorial comments for CDNI charter as = below:

>operating at layer 4 through layer = 7
That = sentence will bring the meaning that CDN will cover from layer 4 to = layer 7. CDN may be considered either on service layer or an layer over = IP layer and below the service layer. And in fact these several words do = not make sense. May be moved.
>streaming of continuous media = delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP,
The RTSP is used to instruct = =A1=AEplay=A1=AF or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. May say =A1=B0delivered via = HTTP, RTP=A1=B1.
>a description of the = different components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and = relate to one another.
I think =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF = should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and =A1=AErelate to=A1=AF seems = redundant .
>"threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI =
I = think all security related issues associated to the architecture is the = =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1.
Hence it may be :" trust = model " discussing the security concerns and threats, and privacy = issues specific to CDNI
Another , Should CDNI co-work = with another WG on security area.
>A "framework" document = providing a =A1=AD
I think it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN = should be defined in the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even = if we do not define new protocols.
>A "requirements" = document. This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and = the protocols =
As = for the protocols here, are they existing protocols or new protocols. =
Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some protocols = will not be defined in this WG. So, clarification is = expected.
>This document = will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to = be met by each of the CDNI interfaces
How may we understand its relationship to the first = sentence in this section =A1=B0This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it.=A1=B1
>This interface will = allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the = downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection.
May the downstream CDN also request = some information from the upstream CDN for further transfer? I think = =A1=AEyes=A1=AF.

>Distribution = metadata refers to the subset of content metadata
I think the =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the = superset of =A1=B0content metadata=A1=B1 not the subset. For example, = whether the location information of the end user belong to =A1=B0 = content metadata=A1=B1.
>CDN control systems. In = particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or = invalidate content in a downstream CDN.
It = is not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since two CDNs only take the contract for CDN = interconnection.
It may be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1 rather than = =A1=B0control=A1=B1. Besides =A1=B0remove content from the downstream = CDN=A1=B1, the upstream CDN mainly may inform downstream CDN where/who = the content is issued to.
Another, for all these bullets = of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I think the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better = than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) = and the explanation following also use the word = =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface = will=A1=AD.

Thanks.
Zhipeng

---------------------= --------------------------------
Huawei Software = Technologies Co.,Ltd.
No.101=A3=ACSoftware Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of = China
Zipcode:210012
E-Mail: zhouzp@huawei.= com
Phone:(+86) 25-56620690
Fax:(+86) = 25-56624081
Mobile:(+86) = 13404162849
-----------------------------------------------------

= --Boundary_(ID_o/EqqTffM8KDagsudsrt7w)-- From flefauch@cisco.com Wed Apr 13 01:51:38 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B754E06E7 for ; Wed, 13 Apr 2011 01:51:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -10.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-10.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HboutsK7XS0c for ; Wed, 13 Apr 2011 01:51:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2062E06CA for ; Wed, 13 Apr 2011 01:51:35 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=flefauch@cisco.com; l=34925; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1302684695; x=1303894295; h=subject:mime-version:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id: references:to; bh=w3RfYuQ4/F3+4t1FpxmN4IklVML0m+PIo+QZHMMKr2k=; b=gFNISbm0lXbW4x3oZFtNrpcEw4EhdpdPbimYGqoWuJCHs4/YLMUqXlQe +IuyNyN6EI5SkBGrp/jsn8i9b3Kko6mqeza76cEhKId8A24bmbrTEwjLD xpfYOh7k7qPG9/LdlsGr0LoZg9th9RnTziUNCKp5nIZXDY8WRJQj/U/c/ 4=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,203,1301875200"; d="scan'208,217";a="83365639" Received: from ams-core-2.cisco.com ([144.254.72.75]) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 13 Apr 2011 08:51:35 +0000 Received: from ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com (ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com [10.55.161.196]) by ams-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p3D8pXX0013120; Wed, 13 Apr 2011 08:51:33 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-299-107525860 From: Francois Le Faucheur In-Reply-To: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 10:52:36 +0200 Message-Id: References: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> To: zhouzhipeng X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Editorial comments on the CDNI charter. X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 13 Apr 2011 08:51:38 -0000 --Apple-Mail-299-107525860 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Hello Zhipeng, On 13 Apr 2011, at 06:09, zhouzhipeng wrote: > Rich , Francois, all, > Some editorial comments for CDNI charter as below: I understand that the draft charter would be subject to editing by = IESG/IAB anyways, but let's see if we can converge anyways. > =20 > >operating at layer 4 through layer 7 > That sentence will bring the meaning that CDN will cover from layer 4 = to layer 7. Yes. This sentence is indeed claiming that CDNs can generally be = considered as an overlay on top of an IP network and operating over = layers 4, 5, 6 and 7.=20 That seems reasonable. > CDN may be considered either on service layer or an layer over IP = layer and below the service layer. And in fact these several words do = not make sense. May be moved. > >streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, > The RTSP is used to instruct =A1=AEplay=A1=AF or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. = May say =A1=B0delivered via HTTP, RTP=A1=B1. How about: " ... and streaming of continuous media controlled and delivered via = HTTP, RTSP/RTP, RTMP, etc." > >a description of the different components of the CDNI solution and = how they interact with and relate to one another. > I think =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and = =A1=AErelate to=A1=AF seems redundant . OK. > >"threat analysis" discussing the security concerns and threats, the = trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI > I think all security related issues associated to the architecture is = the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1. > Hence it may be :" trust model " discussing the security concerns and = threats, and privacy issues specific to CDNI I don't agree with that. To me there needs to be a generic "threat analysis" that discusses all = various ways the system may be cheated/attacked. In doing so, it should = discuss the "trust model" which is one particular element of this = analysis. "Privacy" is another particular angle that needs to be = discussed. I don't see an issue with the current text. > Another , Should CDNI co-work with another WG on security area. The draft charter already says that the CDNI WG should work with other = relevant WGs. If there is one particular group where it is very clear = that CDNI would work with, then it could be mentioned in the charter. > >A "framework" document providing a =A1=AD > I think it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN should be = defined in the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even if we do not define new = protocols. It is clear that the framework needs to discuss how content acquisition = needs to take place between CDNs, just like it needs to cover how = request-routing will take place, and how distribution metadata exchange = needs to take place... The current description is deliberately kept succinct and just says the = framework needs to cover all architecture components. I don't see a need = to explicitly bring up "acquisition". > >A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols > As for the protocols here, are they existing protocols or new = protocols. This is an editing issue. This should have been converted to = "interfaces" instead of "protocols". It now reads: "This document lists the requirements for the CDNI architecture and the = CDNI interfaces." > Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some protocols will not = be defined in this WG. So, clarification is expected. > >This document will list the requirements stemming from the threat = analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces > How may we understand its relationship to the first sentence in this = section =A1=B0This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture = and the protocols to support it.=A1=B1 It should be clear now based on the previous correction. i.e. in particular, the "requirements" document will identify the = requirements related to threat/security for each CDNI interface.=20 > >This interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to = obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform = request redirection. > May the downstream CDN also request some information from the upstream = CDN for further transfer? I think =A1=AEyes=A1=AF. Not sure I follow that.=20 > =20 > >Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata > I think the =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the superset of = =A1=B0content metadata=A1=B1 not the subset. Please see the definitions of "Content Metadata" and "Content = Distribution Metadata" in the Problem Statement. > For example, whether the location information of the end user belong = to =A1=B0 content metadata=A1=B1. > >CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. > It is not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since two CDNs only take the contract = for CDN interconnection. It is "control" in the sense that one CDN can trigger actions in another = CDN. > It may be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1 rather than =A1=B0control=A1= =B1. Besides =A1=B0remove content from the downstream CDN=A1=B1, the = upstream CDN mainly may inform downstream CDN where/who the content is = issued to. =20 There is a very strong agreement that CDNI needs to allow the uCDN to = trigger/request removal of content in dCDN. > Another, for all these bullets of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I think the = word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. = =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) and the explanation = following also use the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface = will=A1=AD. The flow of the current text is : " > The working group will focus on the following items:=20 ... - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of: ... o CDNI xxx systems. " So it should be read as saying that the "WG will specify an interface = for the interconnection of CDNI xxx systems." But I can see that the flow is hard to get through the multiple levels = of indentation. So, unless we hear disagreement, we can take your suggestion and make it = read as: " > The working group will focus on the following items:=20 ... - A specification of the CDNI xxx interface: " Thanks Francois > =20 > =20 > Thanks. > Zhipeng > =20 > ----------------------------------------------------- > Huawei Software Technologies Co.,Ltd. > No.101=A3=ACSoftware Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of China > Zipcode:210012 > E-Mail: zhouzp@huawei.com > Phone:(+86) 25-56620690 > Fax:(+86) 25-56624081 > Mobile:(+86) 13404162849 > ----------------------------------------------------- > =20 --Apple-Mail-299-107525860 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=GB2312 Hello Zhipeng,

On 13 Apr 2011, at = 06:09, zhouzhipeng wrote:

Rich , Francois, = all,
Some editorial comments for CDNI charter as = below:

I understand that the draft charter would be subject to editing by = IESG/IAB anyways, but let's see if we can converge = anyways.

>operating at layer = 4 through layer 7
That sentence will bring the meaning that = CDN will cover from layer 4 to layer 7. =

Yes. = This sentence is indeed claiming that CDNs can generally be considered = as an overlay on top of an IP network and operating over layers 4, 5, 6 = and 7.
That seems reasonable.

CDN may be considered either on service = layer or an layer over IP layer and below the service layer. And in fact = these several words do not make sense. May be = moved.
>streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, = RTMP,
The RTSP is used to instruct =A1=AEplay=A1=AF= or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. May say =A1=B0delivered via HTTP, = RTP=A1=B1.

How about:
" ... and streaming of continuous media controlled = and delivered via HTTP, RTSP/RTP, RTMP, etc."

>a description of the different components of the CDNI solution and = how they interact with and relate to one = another.
I think =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF should be = =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and =A1=AErelate to=A1=AF seems redundant = .

OK.

>"threat analysis" discussing the security concerns and threats, = the trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI
I think all security related issues associated to the = architecture is the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1.
Hence it may be :" = trust model " discussing the security concerns and threats, and privacy = issues specific to = CDNI

I don't = agree with that.
To me there needs to be a generic "threat = analysis" that discusses all various ways the system may be = cheated/attacked. In doing so, it should discuss the "trust model" which = is one particular element of this analysis. "Privacy" is another = particular angle that needs to be discussed.
I don't see an = issue with the current text.

Another , Should CDNI = co-work with another WG on security = area.

The draft = charter already says that the CDNI WG should work with other relevant = WGs. If there is one particular group where it is very clear that CDNI = would work with, then it could be mentioned in the = charter.

>A "framework" = document providing a =A1=AD
I think it needs to = clarify acquiring content across CDN should be defined in the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even if we do not define = new = protocols.

It = is clear that the framework needs to discuss how content acquisition = needs to take place between CDNs, just like it needs to cover how = request-routing will take place, and how distribution metadata exchange = needs to take place...
The current description is deliberately = kept succinct and just says the framework needs to cover all = architecture components. I don't see a need to explicitly bring up = "acquisition".

>A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols
As for the protocols here, are they existing protocols or = new = protocols.

This = is an editing issue. This should have been converted to "interfaces" = instead of "protocols". It now reads:
"This document lists the = requirements for the CDNI architecture and the CDNI = interfaces."

Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some = protocols will not be defined in this WG. So, clarification is = expected.
>This document will list the requirements = stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI = interfaces
How may we understand = its relationship to the first sentence in this section =A1=B0This = document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols = to support it.=A1=B1

It = should be clear now based on the previous correction.
i.e. in = particular, the "requirements" document will identify the requirements = related to threat/security for each CDNI = interface.

>This interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system = to obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary to = perform request redirection.
May the downstream CDN also request = some information from the upstream CDN for further transfer? I think = =A1=AEyes=A1=AF.

= Not sure I follow that.

>Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content = metadata
I think the = =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the superset of =A1=B0content = metadata=A1=B1 not the = subset.

Please = see the definitions of "Content Metadata" and "Content Distribution = Metadata" in the Problem Statement.

For example, whether = the location information of the end user belong to =A1=B0 content = metadata=A1=B1.
>CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN.
It is not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since = two CDNs only take the contract for CDN = interconnection.

= It is "control" in the sense that one CDN can trigger actions in another = CDN.

It may be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1= rather than =A1=B0control=A1=B1. Besides =A1=B0remove content from the = downstream CDN=A1=B1, the upstream CDN mainly may inform downstream CDN = where/who the content is issued to. =

There is = a very strong agreement that CDNI needs to allow the uCDN to = trigger/request removal of content in dCDN.

Another, for all these bullets of = =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I think the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better = than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) = and the explanation following also use the word = =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this = interface will=A1=AD.

= The flow of the current text is :
"
= > The working group will focus on the following = items:
...
- A = detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & = interoperation of:
= ...
= o CDNI xxx systems.
"
So it should be read as saying that the "WG = will specify an interface for the interconnection of CDNI xxx = systems."
But I can see that the flow is hard to get = through the multiple levels of indentation.

So, unless we hear disagreement, we can take = your suggestion and make it read as:
"
= > The working group will focus on the following = items:
...
- A = specification of the CDNI xxx interface:
"

Thanks

Francois

Thanks.
Zhipeng

-----------------------------------------------------Huawei Software Technologies Co.,Ltd.
No.101=A3=ACSoftware = Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of = China
Zipcode:210012
E-Mail: Fax:(+86) 25-56624081
Mobile:(+86) = 13404162849
-----------------------------------------------------

= --Apple-Mail-299-107525860-- From zhouzp@huawei.com Thu Apr 14 00:42:42 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B943E071D for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 00:42:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 2.381 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.381 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.684, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GFSgmZe-levx for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 00:42:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from szxga03-in.huawei.com (szxga03-in.huawei.com [119.145.14.66]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A54F1E06D1 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 00:42:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (szxga03-in [172.24.2.9]) by szxga03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJM00MZITCD0F@szxga03-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:41:01 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxga03-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJM00MMHTCD95@szxga03-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:41:01 +0800 (CST) Received: from z54906a ([10.138.73.38]) by szxml06-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LJM005QGTC84S@szxml06-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:41:01 +0800 (CST) Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:40:56 +0800 From: zhouzhipeng In-reply-to: To: 'Francois Le Faucheur' Message-id: <000f01cbfa77$4a8fc760$dfaf5620$@com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_DlZJX57a/F4RZ0M916juDg)" Content-language: zh-cn Thread-index: Acv5uB+eJma0Wpu+SBqFvi9cSHp7fgAvQrVA References: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogRWRpdG9yaWFsIGNvbW1lbnRzIG9uIHRoZSBD?= =?gb2312?b?RE5JIGNoYXJ0ZXIu?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:42:42 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_DlZJX57a/F4RZ0M916juDg) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Francois, all: FYI that: In the =A1=B0Problem Statement=A1=B1, it reads Content Distribution = Metadata rather than Distribution Metadata. Anyway, the terminations may be discussed more later while I think Distribution Metadata and Content Metadata can be two different kinds. =20 For the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1, I had ever sent an email two days = before while seems that it has not been successfully post to the reflector. Here I copy again in this email as below for reference: The market requirement for CDNI is to make the CDN service been = extensible by connecting multiple CDNs. Hence the goal if been realized will be beneficial for the whole CDN industry chain. The CP may cover more consumers. The consumer may get = more services. The CDN will have more development. To achievement the goal as above, the CDNI is very crucial to cover all = the interfaces(connection) including CP-UE, CP-CDN, CDN-CDN. Just because the service chain will include multiple entities, the trust chain should be defined before service initiation.( in fact such trust = chain should be the core problem to be solved in CDNI group)=20 By for now, I just feel the discussion is whether we should give more clarified information in the charter. My opinion is 'yes' since the trust model will determine whether the = CDNI service would be appropriate in the practice hence. The information needed for exchange totally should be based on the trust model. Without the trust model, how may we know exactly what will be exchanged between two CDNs. We should first get a clear view how multiple entities cooperate in a complete service not just a simple picture that two CDNs should exchange some specific information.=20 =20 Zhipeng =20 =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le Faucheur [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C213=C8=D5 16:53 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: zhouzhipeng =B3=AD=CB=CD: Francois Le Faucheur; 'Woundy, Richard'; cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: Editorial comments on the CDNI charter. =20 Hello Zhipeng, =20 On 13 Apr 2011, at 06:09, zhouzhipeng wrote: Rich , Francois, all, Some editorial comments for CDNI charter as below: =20 I understand that the draft charter would be subject to editing by = IESG/IAB anyways, but let's see if we can converge anyways. =20 >operating at layer 4 through layer 7 That sentence will bring the meaning that CDN will cover from layer 4 to layer 7.=20 =20 Yes. This sentence is indeed claiming that CDNs can generally be = considered as an overlay on top of an IP network and operating over layers 4, 5, 6 = and 7.=20 That seems reasonable. CDN may be considered either on service layer or an layer over IP layer = and below the service layer. And in fact these several words do not make = sense. May be moved. >streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, The RTSP is used to instruct =A1=AEplay=A1=AF or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. May = say =A1=B0delivered via HTTP, RTP=A1=B1. =20 How about: " ... and streaming of continuous media controlled and delivered via = HTTP, RTSP/RTP, RTMP, etc." >a description of the different components of the CDNI solution and how = they interact with and relate to one another. I think =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and = =A1=AErelate to=A1=AF seems redundant . =20 OK. >"threat analysis" discussing the security concerns and threats, the = trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI I think all security related issues associated to the architecture is = the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1. Hence it may be :" trust model " discussing the security concerns and threats, and privacy issues specific to CDNI =20 I don't agree with that. To me there needs to be a generic "threat analysis" that discusses all various ways the system may be cheated/attacked. In doing so, it should discuss the "trust model" which is one particular element of this = analysis. "Privacy" is another particular angle that needs to be discussed. I don't see an issue with the current text. Another , Should CDNI co-work with another WG on security area. =20 The draft charter already says that the CDNI WG should work with other relevant WGs. If there is one particular group where it is very clear = that CDNI would work with, then it could be mentioned in the charter. >A "framework" document providing a =A1=AD I think it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN should be = defined in the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even if we do not define new protocols. =20 It is clear that the framework needs to discuss how content acquisition needs to take place between CDNs, just like it needs to cover how request-routing will take place, and how distribution metadata exchange needs to take place... The current description is deliberately kept succinct and just says the framework needs to cover all architecture components. I don't see a need = to explicitly bring up "acquisition". >A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols As for the protocols here, are they existing protocols or new protocols. =20 This is an editing issue. This should have been converted to = "interfaces" instead of "protocols". It now reads: "This document lists the requirements for the CDNI architecture and the = CDNI interfaces." Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some protocols will not be defined in this WG. So, clarification is expected. >This document will list the requirements stemming from the threat = analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces How may we understand its relationship to the first sentence in this = section =A1=B0This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it.=A1=B1 =20 It should be clear now based on the previous correction. i.e. in particular, the "requirements" document will identify the requirements related to threat/security for each CDNI interface.=20 >This interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to = obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. May the downstream CDN also request some information from the upstream = CDN for further transfer? I think =A1=AEyes=A1=AF. =20 Not sure I follow that.=20 =20 >Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata I think the =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the superset of = =A1=B0content metadata=A1=B1 not the subset. =20 Please see the definitions of "Content Metadata" and "Content = Distribution Metadata" in the Problem Statement. For example, whether the location information of the end user belong to = =A1=B0 content metadata=A1=B1. >CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. It is not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since two CDNs only take the contract for = CDN interconnection. =20 It is "control" in the sense that one CDN can trigger actions in another CDN. It may be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1 rather than = =A1=B0control=A1=B1. Besides =A1=B0remove content from the downstream CDN=A1=B1, the upstream CDN = mainly may inform downstream CDN where/who the content is issued to. =20 =20 There is a very strong agreement that CDNI needs to allow the uCDN to trigger/request removal of content in dCDN. Another, for all these bullets of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I think the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. = =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) and the explanation following also use the word = =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface will=A1=AD. =20 The flow of the current text is : " > The working group will focus on the following items:=20 ... - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of: ... o CDNI xxx systems. " So it should be read as saying that the "WG will specify an interface = for the interconnection of CDNI xxx systems." But I can see that the flow is hard to get through the multiple levels = of indentation. =20 So, unless we hear disagreement, we can take your suggestion and make it read as: " > The working group will focus on the following items:=20 ... - A specification of the CDNI xxx interface: " =20 =20 Thanks =20 Francois =20 =20 =20 Thanks. Zhipeng =20 ----------------------------------------------------- Huawei Software Technologies Co.,Ltd. No.101=A3=ACSoftware Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of China Zipcode:210012 E-Mail: zhouzp@huawei.com Phone:(+86) 25-56620690 Fax:(+86) 25-56624081 Mobile:(+86) 13404162849 ----------------------------------------------------- =20 _____ =20 =20 =20 --Boundary_(ID_DlZJX57a/F4RZ0M916juDg) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Francois, all:
FYI that:
In the =A1=B0Problem Statement=A1=B1, it reads Content Distribution Metadata = rather than Distribution = Metadata.
Anyway, the terminations may be discussed more later while I think = Distribution Metadata and Content Metadata can be two different = kinds.

For the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1, I had ever sent an email two days = before while seems that it has not been successfully post to the = reflector.
Here I copy again in this email as below for = reference:
The market requirement for CDNI is to make the CDN service = been extensible by connecting multiple CDNs.
Hence the goal if been realized = will be beneficial for the whole CDN industry chain. The CP may cover = more consumers. The consumer may get more = services.
The CDN will have more development.
To achievement the goal as = above, the CDNI is very crucial to cover all the interfaces(connection) = including CP-UE, CP-CDN, CDN-CDN.
Just because the service chain = will include multiple entities, the trust chain should be defined before = service initiation.( in fact such trust chain should be the core problem = to be solved in CDNI group)
By for now, I just feel the = discussion is whether we should give more clarified information in the = charter.
My opinion is 'yes' since the trust model will determine = whether the CDNI service would be appropriate in the practice = hence.
The information needed for exchange totally should be based = on the trust model. Without the trust model, how may we know exactly = what will be exchanged between two CDNs.
We should first get a clear view = how multiple entities cooperate in a complete service not just a simple = picture that two CDNs should exchange some specific information. =

Zhipeng

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le Faucheur = [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C213=C8=D5 = 16:53
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: = zhouzhipeng
=B3=AD=CB=CD: Francois Le Faucheur; = 'Woundy, Richard'; cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: Editorial comments on = the CDNI charter.

Hello = Zhipeng,

On 13 Apr 2011, at 06:09, = zhouzhipeng wrote:

Rich , = Francois, all,
Some = editorial comments for CDNI charter as = below:

I understand that the draft charter = would be subject to editing by IESG/IAB anyways, but let's see if we can = converge anyways.

=
>= operating at layer 4 = through layer 7=
That sentence will bring the meaning that CDN will cover = from layer 4 to layer 7.

Yes. This sentence is indeed = claiming that CDNs can generally be considered as an overlay on top of = an IP network and operating over layers 4, 5, 6 and = 7.
That seems reasonable.

CDN may = be considered either on service layer or an layer over IP layer and = below the service layer. And in fact these several words do not make = sense. May be moved.
>streaming of continuous media delivered = via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP,
The = RTSP is used to instruct =A1=AEplay=A1=AF or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. = May say =A1=B0delivered via HTTP, = RTP=A1=B1.

How = about:
" ... and streaming of continuous media controlled and = delivered via HTTP, RTSP/RTP, RTMP, = etc."

>a description of the different components = of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one = another.
I think = =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and =A1=AErelate = to=A1=AF seems redundant .

OK.

>"threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI=
I think all security related issues associated to the = architecture is the =A1=B0trust = model=A1=B1.
Hence = it may be :" trust model " discussing the security concerns = and threats, and privacy issues specific to = CDNI

I don't agree with = that.
To me there needs to be a generic "threat = analysis" that discusses all various ways the system may be = cheated/attacked. In doing so, it should discuss the "trust = model" which is one particular element of this analysis. = "Privacy" is another particular angle that needs to be = discussed.
I don't see an issue with the current = text.

Another = , Should CDNI co-work with another WG on security = area.

The draft charter already says that = the CDNI WG should work with other relevant WGs. If there is one = particular group where it is very clear that CDNI would work with, then = it could be mentioned in the charter.

>A "framework" document = providing a =A1=AD
I think = it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN should be defined in = the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even if = we do not define new protocols.

It is clear that the framework = needs to discuss how content acquisition needs to take place between = CDNs, just like it needs to cover how request-routing will take place, = and how distribution metadata exchange needs to take = place...
The current description is deliberately kept succinct and = just says the framework needs to cover all architecture components. I = don't see a need to explicitly bring up = "acquisition".

>A "requirements" = document. This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and = the protocols=
As for the protocols here, are they existing protocols = or new protocols.

This is an editing issue. This = should have been converted to "interfaces" instead of = "protocols". It now reads:
"This document lists the = requirements for the CDNI architecture and the CDNI = interfaces."

Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some = protocols will not be defined in this WG. So, clarification is = expected.
>This document will list the = requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of = the CDNI interfaces
How may = we understand its relationship to the first sentence in this section = =A1=B0This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the = protocols to support it.=A1=B1

It should be clear now based on the = previous correction.
i.e. in particular, the = "requirements" document will identify the requirements related = to threat/security for each CDNI = interface.

>This interface will allow an upstream CDN = request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information = necessary to perform request redirection.
May the = downstream CDN also request some information from the upstream CDN for = further transfer? I think = =A1=AEyes=A1=AF.

Not sure I follow = that.

=
>Distribution metadata refers = to the subset of content metadata=
I think the =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the = superset of =A1=B0content metadata=A1=B1 not the = subset.

Please see the definitions of = "Content Metadata" and "Content Distribution = Metadata" in the Problem Statement.

For = example, whether the location information of the end user belong to = =A1=B0 content metadata=A1=B1.
>CDN control systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in = a downstream CDN.
It is = not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since two CDNs only take the contract for CDN = interconnection.

It is "control" in the = sense that one CDN can trigger actions in another = CDN.

It may = be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1 rather than =A1=B0control=A1=B1. = Besides =A1=B0remove content from the downstream CDN=A1=B1, the upstream = CDN mainly may inform downstream CDN where/who the content is issued to. =

There is a very strong agreement = that CDNI needs to allow the uCDN to trigger/request removal of content = in dCDN.

Another, for all these bullets of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I = think the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. = =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) and the explanation = following also use the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface will=A1=AD.

The flow of the current text is = :
"
    > The working group will focus on the following = items:
       ...
       - A detailed = specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & = interoperation of:
          =     ...
          =     o CDNI xxx = systems.
"
So it should be read as = saying that the "WG will specify an interface for the = interconnection of CDNI xxx systems."
But I can see that the flow = is hard to get through the multiple levels of = indentation.

So, = unless we hear disagreement, we can take your suggestion and make it = read as:
"
    > The working group will focus on the following = items:
       ...
       - A specification of = the CDNI xxx interface:
=
"

Thanks

Francois

Thanks.
Zhipeng
=
-----------------------------------------------------= =
Huawei Software = Technologies Co.,Ltd.=
No.101=A3=ACSoftware = Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of = China
Zipcode:210012
E-Mail: zhou= zp@huawei.com
Phone:(+86) 25-56620690=
Fax:(+86) = 25-56624081=
Mobile:(+86) = 13404162849
-----------------------------------------------------=
=

= --Boundary_(ID_DlZJX57a/F4RZ0M916juDg)-- From flefauch@cisco.com Thu Apr 14 01:20:03 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A490DE06AF for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 01:20:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -7.739 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7.739 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-2.859, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, SARE_GIF_ATTACH=1.42, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qNMyKpZMhDxF for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 01:20:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-2.cisco.com (ams-iport-2.cisco.com [144.254.224.141]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C83DE0698 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 01:19:58 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=flefauch@cisco.com; l=84027; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1302769198; x=1303978798; h=subject:mime-version:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id: references:to; bh=P3D7SN2Xl2W+VD3BkJ0Uu1hhxb2LOFeVPmrFZANxdV0=; b=CoQ1p7f2LdJut1sk0Vs/j+GuoM4g51m5OAmYf7wWh4VjMfmb7iWYALuX l9mNdfRYeM/x1cu4kaoXYF7CMCqdcuz6kE+L6BEHoc0Qo5iZGC0W9gA5h dAF2HAZAzgxP7w2tEjaKpkT1R+TD1MQPBvK84Veu0ksnd7JQFbSrB6dSd I=; X-Files: image001.jpg, green.gif : 11041, 87 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,210,1301875200"; d="gif'147?jpg'147,145?scan'147,145,208,145,147,217";a="25665170" Received: from ams-core-2.cisco.com ([144.254.72.75]) by ams-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Apr 2011 08:19:55 +0000 Received: from ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com (ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com [10.55.161.196]) by ams-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p3E8JqM0000450; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 08:19:52 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-142-192027824 From: Francois Le Faucheur In-Reply-To: <000f01cbfa77$4a8fc760$dfaf5620$@com> Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 10:20:58 +0200 Message-Id: <79680053-E211-437A-BD77-F72F4BFDE162@cisco.com> References: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> <000f01cbfa77$4a8fc760$dfaf5620$@com> To: zhouzhipeng X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiBFZGl0b3JpYWwgY29tbWVudHMgb24gdGhlIENE?= =?utf-8?q?NI_charter=2E?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 08:20:03 -0000 --Apple-Mail-142-192027824 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=GB2312 Hi Zhipeng, On 14 Apr 2011, at 09:40, zhouzhipeng wrote: > Francois, all: > FYI that: > In the =A1=B0Problem Statement=A1=B1, it reads Content Distribution = Metadata rather than Distribution Metadata. OK. the draft charter text has been updated to say "content distribution = metadata". > Anyway, the terminations may be discussed more later while I think = Distribution Metadata and Content Metadata can be two different kinds. > =20 > For the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1, I had ever sent an email two days = before while seems that it has not been successfully post to the = reflector. > Here I copy again in this email as below for reference: > The market requirement for CDNI is to make the CDN service been = extensible by connecting multiple CDNs. > Hence the goal if been realized will be beneficial for the whole CDN = industry chain. The CP may cover more consumers. The consumer may get = more services. > The CDN will have more development. > To achievement the goal as above, the CDNI is very crucial to cover = all the interfaces(connection) including CP-UE, CP-CDN, CDN-CDN. > Just because the service chain will include multiple entities, the = trust chain should be defined before service initiation.( in fact such = trust chain should be the core problem to be solved in CDNI group) > By for now, I just feel the discussion is whether we should give more = clarified information in the charter. > My opinion is 'yes' since the trust model will determine whether the = CDNI service would be appropriate in the practice hence. > The information needed for exchange totally should be based on the = trust model. Without the trust model, how may we know exactly what will = be exchanged between two CDNs. I believe there is agreement that the trust model impacts some detailed = aspects of the CDNI interfaces. This is why the draft charter does identify documentation of the trust = model as part of the early deliverables (the "framework"). Thanks Francois > We should first get a clear view how multiple entities cooperate in a = complete service not just a simple picture that two CDNs should exchange = some specific information. > =20 > Zhipeng > =20 > =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le Faucheur [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]=20= > =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C213=C8=D5 16:53 > =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: zhouzhipeng > =B3=AD=CB=CD: Francois Le Faucheur; 'Woundy, Richard'; cdni@ietf.org > =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: Editorial comments on the CDNI charter. > =20 > Hello Zhipeng, > =20 > On 13 Apr 2011, at 06:09, zhouzhipeng wrote: >=20 >=20 > Rich , Francois, all, > Some editorial comments for CDNI charter as below: > =20 > I understand that the draft charter would be subject to editing by = IESG/IAB anyways, but let's see if we can converge anyways. >=20 >=20 > =20 > >operating at layer 4 through layer 7 > That sentence will bring the meaning that CDN will cover from layer 4 = to layer 7. > =20 > Yes. This sentence is indeed claiming that CDNs can generally be = considered as an overlay on top of an IP network and operating over = layers 4, 5, 6 and 7.=20 > That seems reasonable. >=20 >=20 > CDN may be considered either on service layer or an layer over IP = layer and below the service layer. And in fact these several words do = not make sense. May be moved. > >streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, > The RTSP is used to instruct =A1=AEplay=A1=AF or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. = May say =A1=B0delivered via HTTP, RTP=A1=B1. > =20 > How about: > " ... and streaming of continuous media controlled and delivered via = HTTP, RTSP/RTP, RTMP, etc." >=20 >=20 > >a description of the different components of the CDNI solution and = how they interact with and relate to one another. > I think =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and = =A1=AErelate to=A1=AF seems redundant . > =20 > OK. >=20 >=20 > >"threat analysis" discussing the security concerns and threats, the = trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI > I think all security related issues associated to the architecture is = the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1. > Hence it may be :" trust model " discussing the security concerns and = threats, and privacy issues specific to CDNI > =20 > I don't agree with that. > To me there needs to be a generic "threat analysis" that discusses all = various ways the system may be cheated/attacked. In doing so, it should = discuss the "trust model" which is one particular element of this = analysis. "Privacy" is another particular angle that needs to be = discussed. > I don't see an issue with the current text. >=20 >=20 > Another , Should CDNI co-work with another WG on security area. > =20 > The draft charter already says that the CDNI WG should work with other = relevant WGs. If there is one particular group where it is very clear = that CDNI would work with, then it could be mentioned in the charter. >=20 >=20 > >A "framework" document providing a =A1=AD > I think it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN should be = defined in the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even if we do not define new = protocols. > =20 > It is clear that the framework needs to discuss how content = acquisition needs to take place between CDNs, just like it needs to = cover how request-routing will take place, and how distribution metadata = exchange needs to take place... > The current description is deliberately kept succinct and just says = the framework needs to cover all architecture components. I don't see a = need to explicitly bring up "acquisition". >=20 >=20 > >A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols > As for the protocols here, are they existing protocols or new = protocols. > =20 > This is an editing issue. This should have been converted to = "interfaces" instead of "protocols". It now reads: > "This document lists the requirements for the CDNI architecture and = the CDNI interfaces." >=20 >=20 > Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some protocols will not = be defined in this WG. So, clarification is expected. > >This document will list the requirements stemming from the threat = analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces > How may we understand its relationship to the first sentence in this = section =A1=B0This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture = and the protocols to support it.=A1=B1 > =20 > It should be clear now based on the previous correction. > i.e. in particular, the "requirements" document will identify the = requirements related to threat/security for each CDNI interface.=20 >=20 >=20 > >This interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to = obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform = request redirection. > May the downstream CDN also request some information from the upstream = CDN for further transfer? I think =A1=AEyes=A1=AF. > =20 > Not sure I follow that.=20 >=20 >=20 > =20 > >Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata > I think the =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the superset of = =A1=B0content metadata=A1=B1 not the subset. > =20 > Please see the definitions of "Content Metadata" and "Content = Distribution Metadata" in the Problem Statement. >=20 >=20 > For example, whether the location information of the end user belong = to =A1=B0 content metadata=A1=B1. > >CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. > It is not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since two CDNs only take the contract = for CDN interconnection. > =20 > It is "control" in the sense that one CDN can trigger actions in = another CDN. >=20 >=20 > It may be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1 rather than =A1=B0control=A1= =B1. Besides =A1=B0remove content from the downstream CDN=A1=B1, the = upstream CDN mainly may inform downstream CDN where/who the content is = issued to. =20 > =20 > There is a very strong agreement that CDNI needs to allow the uCDN to = trigger/request removal of content in dCDN. >=20 >=20 > Another, for all these bullets of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I think the = word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. = =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) and the explanation = following also use the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface = will=A1=AD. > =20 > The flow of the current text is : > " > > The working group will focus on the following items:=20 > ... > - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of: > ... > o CDNI xxx systems. > " > So it should be read as saying that the "WG will specify an interface = for the interconnection of CDNI xxx systems." > But I can see that the flow is hard to get through the multiple levels = of indentation. > =20 > So, unless we hear disagreement, we can take your suggestion and make = it read as: > " > > The working group will focus on the following items:=20 > ... > - A specification of the CDNI xxx interface: > " > =20 > =20 > Thanks > =20 > Francois > =20 >=20 >=20 > =20 > =20 > Thanks. > Zhipeng > =20 > ----------------------------------------------------- > Huawei Software Technologies Co.,Ltd. > No.101=A3=ACSoftware Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of China > Zipcode:210012 > E-Mail: zhouzp@huawei.com > Phone:(+86) 25-56620690 > Fax:(+86) 25-56624081 > Mobile:(+86) 13404162849 > ----------------------------------------------------- > =20 > =20 > =20 Francois Le Faucheur Distinguished Engineer Corporate Development flefauch@cisco.com Phone: +33 49 723 2619 Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 Cisco Systems France Greenside 400 Ave de Roumanille 06410 Sophia Antipolis France Cisco.com =20 Think before you print. This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole = use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. Cisco Systems France, Soci=A8=A6t=A8=A6 =A8=A4 responsabiit=A8=A6 = limit=A8=A6e, Rue Camille Desmoulins =A8C Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine = Ilot 7 92130 Issy les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 = RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. For corporate legal information go to: http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html --Apple-Mail-142-192027824 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="text/html"; boundary=Apple-Mail-143-192027824 --Apple-Mail-143-192027824 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=GB2312 Hi Zhipeng,

On 14 Apr 2011, at = 09:40, zhouzhipeng wrote:

Francois, = all:
FYI = that:
In the =A1=B0Problem Statement=A1=B1, it reads Content Distribution Metadata rather than Distribution = Metadata.

OK. the = draft charter text has been updated to say "content distribution = metadata".

Anyway, the = terminations may be discussed more later while I think Distribution = Metadata and Content Metadata can be two different = kinds.

For the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1, = I had ever sent an email two days before while seems that it has not = been successfully post to the reflector.
Here I copy again in this email = as below for reference:
The market requirement for CDNI is to make the CDN = service been extensible by connecting multiple = CDNs.
Hence = the goal if been realized will be beneficial for the whole CDN industry = chain. The CP may cover more consumers. The consumer may get more = services.
The CDN = will have more development.
To achievement the goal as above, the CDNI is = very crucial to cover all the interfaces(connection) including CP-UE, = CP-CDN, CDN-CDN.
Just = because the service chain will include multiple entities, the trust = chain should be defined before service initiation.( in fact such trust = chain should be the core problem to be solved in CDNI = group)
By for = now, I just feel the discussion is whether we should give more clarified = information in the charter.
My opinion is 'yes' since the trust model will = determine whether the CDNI service would be appropriate in the practice = hence.
The = information needed for exchange totally should be based on the trust = model. Without the trust model, how may we know exactly what will be = exchanged between two = CDNs.

I = believe there is agreement that the trust model impacts some detailed = aspects of the CDNI interfaces.
This is why the draft charter = does identify documentation of the trust model as part of the early = deliverables (the = "framework").

Thanks

Fra= ncois

We = should first get a clear view how multiple entities cooperate in a = complete service not just a simple picture that two CDNs should exchange = some specific information.
Zhipeng
=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le = Faucheur [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C213=C8=D5 16:53
=CA=D5=BC=FE= =C8=CB: zhouzhipeng
=B3=AD= =CB=CD: Francois Le Faucheur; = 'Woundy, Richard'; cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: Editorial comments on = the CDNI charter.

Hello = Zhipeng,

On 13 Apr 2011, at 06:09, zhouzhipeng = wrote:

Rich , Francois, = all,
Some = editorial comments for CDNI charter as = below:

I understand that the draft charter would be subject to = editing by IESG/IAB anyways, but let's see if we can converge = anyways.

>operating at layer 4 through layer = 7
That sentence will bring the = meaning that CDN will cover from layer 4 to layer = 7.

Yes. This sentence is indeed claiming that CDNs can = generally be considered as an overlay on top of an IP network and = operating over layers 4, 5, 6 and = 7.
That = seems reasonable.

CDN may be considered either on = service layer or an layer over IP layer and below the service layer. And = in fact these several words do not make sense. May be = moved.
>streaming of continuous media = delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP,
How about:
" ... and streaming of continuous media controlled and = delivered via HTTP, RTSP/RTP, RTMP, = etc."

I think =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF = should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and =A1=AErelate to=A1=AF seems = redundant .

OK.

I think all security related issues associated to the = architecture is the =A1=B0trust = model=A1=B1.
Hence it may be :" trust model " discussing the = security concerns and threats, and privacy issues specific to = CDNI

I don't agree with = that.
To me there = needs to be a generic "threat analysis" that discusses all various ways = the system may be cheated/attacked. In doing so, it should discuss the = "trust model" which is one particular element of this analysis. = "Privacy" is another particular angle that needs to be = discussed.
I = don't see an issue with the current = text.

Another , Should CDNI co-work = with another WG on security = area.

The draft charter already says that the CDNI WG should = work with other relevant WGs. If there is one particular group where it = is very clear that CDNI would work with, then it could be mentioned in = the charter.

=A1=ADI = think it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN should be defined = in the =A1=B0=A1=B1even if we do not define new = protocols.

It is clear that the framework needs to discuss how = content acquisition needs to take place between CDNs, just like it needs = to cover how request-routing will take place, and how distribution = metadata exchange needs to take = place...
The = current description is deliberately kept succinct and just says the = framework needs to cover all architecture components. I don't see a need = to explicitly bring up "acquisition".

As = for the protocols here, are they existing protocols or new = protocols.

This is an editing issue. This should have been converted = to "interfaces" instead of "protocols". It now = reads:
"This document = lists the requirements for the CDNI architecture and the CDNI = interfaces."

Besides, in the end of this = charter, it says some protocols will not be defined in this WG. So, = clarification is = expected.
How may we understand its = relationship to the first sentence in this section =A1=B0This document = lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to = support it.=A1=B1
It should be clear now based on the previous = correction.
i.e. = in particular, the "requirements" document will identify the = requirements related to threat/security for each CDNI = interface.

May the downstream CDN also request some information from = the upstream CDN for further transfer? I think = =A1=AEyes=A1=AF.

Not sure I follow = that.

I think the =A1=B0distribution = metadata=A1=B1 is the superset of =A1=B0content metadata=A1=B1 not the = subset.

Please see the definitions of "Content Metadata" and = "Content Distribution Metadata" in the Problem = Statement.

For example, whether the = location information of the end user belong to =A1=B0 content = metadata=A1=B1.
It is not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 = since two CDNs only take the contract for CDN = interconnection.

It is "control" in the sense that one CDN can trigger = actions in another CDN.

It may be =A1=B0CDN service = management=A1=B1 rather than =A1=B0control=A1=B1. Besides =A1=B0remove = content from the downstream CDN=A1=B1, the upstream CDN mainly may = inform downstream CDN where/who the content is issued to. =

There is a very strong agreement that CDNI needs to allow = the uCDN to trigger/request removal of content in = dCDN.

Another, for all these bullets = of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I think the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better = than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) = and the explanation following also use the word = =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface = will=A1=AD.

The flow of the current text is = :
"
    > The working group will focus on the following = items:
       ...
       - A detailed = specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & = interoperation of:
          = ;    ...
          = ;    o CDNI xxx systems.
"
So it should be read as = saying that the "WG will specify an interface for the interconnection of = CDNI xxx systems."
But I can see that the = flow is hard to get through the multiple levels of = indentation.

So, unless we hear = disagreement, we can take your suggestion and make it read = as:
"
    > The working group will focus on the following = items:
       ...
       - A specification of = the CDNI xxx interface:
"

Thanks

Francois

Zhipeng

-----------------------------------------------------
Huawei Software = Technologies Co.,Ltd.
No.101=A3=ACSoftware = Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of = China
Zipcode:210012
E-Mail:
Fax:(+86) = 25-56624081
Mobile:(+86) = 13404162849
-----------------------------------------------------

Francois Le = Faucheur
Distinguished = Engineer
Corporate Development
Cisco Systems = France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 Sophia = Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

Think before you = print.
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filename=green.gif Content-Type: image/gif; name="green.gif" Content-Id: R0lGODlhEgATAJEAAAAAAP///wCZAP///yH5BAEAAAMALAAAAAASABMAAAIojI+pGyK8nINqUiTf bVnfvHEg1UmhdZRqaawu6XZVjKb0/CYxo8JOAQA7 --Apple-Mail-143-192027824-- --Apple-Mail-142-192027824-- From flefauch@cisco.com Thu Apr 14 02:06:46 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F30F0E06DC for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 02:06:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -8.874 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-8.874 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.580, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, SARE_GIF_ATTACH=1.42] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LXYD-CbAjrwN for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 02:06:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-2.cisco.com (ams-iport-2.cisco.com [144.254.224.141]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 318C0E0664 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 02:06:41 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=flefauch@cisco.com; l=59206; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1302772001; x=1303981601; h=from:mime-version:subject:date:in-reply-to:to:references: message-id; bh=LPGpkqup+KYPl75rwaP2RYV6GKNhlUVUjtcc3Y82IzI=; b=duh01nWkRCTDPI8YOnpNQ3JnlDXSepAtpvOahnT+c1bjKJLM6kh6Ufl4 S6Nqw3WpIx767KqyqVq5tdnQzL/wfCqZd3OzoajTpnYx67orC3tm2B9JW 9ZhGhHc3GLyJdn+rjtUkoi/8GPSc1Afctw4fOBMauCT9dIW4eDwiPvVcN k=; X-Files: image001.jpg, green.gif : 11041, 87 X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: AtsEAGi4pk2Q/khLgWdsb2JhbACCYZtxhyoUAQEWJiWIb5sYnHYChWwEgXqIfYJ4 X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,210,1301875200"; d="gif'147?jpg'147,145?scan'147,145,208,145,147,217";a="25673973" Received: from ams-core-2.cisco.com ([144.254.72.75]) by ams-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Apr 2011 09:06:38 +0000 Received: from ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com (ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com [10.55.161.196]) by ams-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p3E96aW4015287 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 09:06:36 GMT From: Francois Le Faucheur Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-180-194830703 Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 11:07:41 +0200 In-Reply-To: <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> To: cdni@ietf.org References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> Message-Id: X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 09:06:46 -0000 --Apple-Mail-180-194830703 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Hello, The on-line draft charter = (http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt) has been updated = to reflect the charter discussion on the list after the BOF. Changes include: * additional statement that CDNI WG will collaborate with = relevant external groups such as UltraViolet. * editorials on how CDNI interfaces are listed * editorials related to "content distribution metadata" = terminology * editorials related to intro text in first paragraph giving = examples of streaming protocols No changes were done as a result of the "CDN Federation" thread since = more voices argued that it may be counter-productive and unnecessarily = restrictive to attempt to rule out something that is not a well = understood notion. No changes were done as a result of the "trust model" thread since the = draft charter already addresses the concern of documenting the CDNI = trust model. Francois & Rich On 7 Apr 2011, at 18:59, Francois Le Faucheur wrote: > Folks, >=20 > Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF. > Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs. >=20 > Francois & Rich >=20 > PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment >=20 >=20 > Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter > ---------------------------------------------------------------- >=20 > Description of Working Group > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >=20 > CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >=20 > As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >=20 > The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of = separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >=20 > The working group will focus on the following items: >=20 > - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >=20 > - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >=20 > - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI. >=20 > - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and = important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI = protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document = will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be = met by each of the CDNI interfaces. >=20 > - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & = interoperation of: >=20 > o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an = upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN = the information necessary to perform request redirection. >=20 > o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow = the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >=20 > o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging = systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. >=20 > o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow = an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >=20 > The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications. >=20 > The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >=20 > In particular, the WG will not define: > - New session, transport or network protocols. > - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent. > - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and = a CDN. > - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. > - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. > - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. > - New applications consuming CDNI logs. > - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >=20 > The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >=20 >=20 > Goals & Milestones > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >=20 > WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational > WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational > WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard > WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >=20 >=20 >=20 >=20 > On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >=20 >> Folks, >> =20 >> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft = charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input = from many people this week, including people that attended the informal = CDNI gathering last night. It is available online at = , and has been = updated on the BOF wiki = . >> =20 >> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: = . >> =20 >> -- Rich and Francois >> =20 >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >> =20 >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >> =20 >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >> =20 >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >> =20 >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >> =20 >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of = separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >> =20 >> The working group will focus on the following items: >> =20 >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >> =20 >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >> =20 >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. >> =20 >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and = important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI = protocols and solutions produced by the working group. >> =20 >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >> =20 >> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface = will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the = downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. >> =20 >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will = allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >> =20 >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging = systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. >> =20 >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. >> =20 >> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat = model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the = above documents and specifications. >> =20 >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >> =20 >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> =20 >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >> =20 >> =20 >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >> =20 >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG = as Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >> =20 >> _______________________________________________ >> CDNi mailing list >> CDNi@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >=20 >=20 Francois Le Faucheur Distinguished Engineer Corporate Development flefauch@cisco.com Phone: +33 49 723 2619 Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 Cisco Systems France Greenside 400 Ave de Roumanille 06410 Sophia Antipolis France Cisco.com =20 Think before you print. This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole = use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. For corporate legal information go to: http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html --Apple-Mail-180-194830703 Content-Type: multipart/related; type="text/html"; boundary=Apple-Mail-181-194830703 --Apple-Mail-181-194830703 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 http://www.i= etf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt) has been updated to = reflect the charter discussion on the list after the = BOF.

Changes include:
* = additional statement that CDNI WG will collaborate with relevant = external groups such as UltraViolet.
* = editorials on how CDNI interfaces are listed
* = editorials related to "content distribution metadata" = terminology
* editorials related to intro = text in first paragraph giving examples of streaming = protocols

No changes were done as a result of = the "CDN Federation" thread since more voices argued that it may be = counter-productive and unnecessarily restrictive to attempt to rule out = something that is not a well understood = notion.

No changes were done as a result of the = "trust model" thread since the draft charter already addresses the = concern of documenting the CDNI trust = model.

Francois & = Rich

On 7 Apr 2011, at 18:59, Francois = Le Faucheur wrote:

Folks,

Below is an = updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the charter = discussion/edits during the BOF.
Please bring forward the additional = comments you have before this draft charter is assessed by the = ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry = about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment

Content Delivery Networks Interconnection = (CDNI) - Draft = Charter
---------------------------------------------------------------= -

Description of Working = Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an = infrastructure of network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, = arranged for the efficient distribution and delivery of digital = content. Such content includes, but is not limited to, web pages = and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media = delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide = services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs = provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service content = delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved = quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in = content delivered over IP networks, existing CDN providers are scaling = up their infrastructure and many Network Service Providers = and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying their own CDNs. = Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given = item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of that = end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for = interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate = and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow = the interconnection of separately administered CDNs in support of the = end-to-end delivery of content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and = ultimately to end users (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG = aims at delivering a targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe = (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the = CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for = transport and message exchange, and using existing object = notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and = semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are = deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working = group will focus on the following items:

- A "problem statement" = document providing a description of the problem and a common = terminology.

- A "use case" document describing scenarios for = usage and applications of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A = "framework" document providing a description of the different components = of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one = another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. = This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the = protocols to support it. In particular, this document will focus on = identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important = requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and solutions produced by the working group. This document = will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to = be met by each of the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification = of the interfaces for the interconnection & interoperation = of:

o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface = will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the = downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection.

o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This = interface will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of = inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the subset = of content metadata that is relevant to the distribution of the = content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may = include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, = enforcement of availability windows or access = control).

o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow = CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated with = actions that are relevant across CDNs (such as = content distribution, content delivery and content routing actions) = for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, = etc.

o CDN control systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in = a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security, = management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above = documents and specifications.

The working group will only define = solutions for aspects of the CDN Interconnection problem space that = require direct communication or interoperation between CDNs.

In = particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport or = network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN = to an End User/User Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content = or metadata between a CSP and a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring = content across CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN = operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New = applications consuming CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Management (DRM) = mechanisms

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where = appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to = realize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the = WG may assess the suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to = enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream = CDN with making CDNI request routing decisions.

Goals = & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=

WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: = Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 = months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: = Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + = 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routing = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 = months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 = months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 = months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata = Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 = months: Recharter or = dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, = Richard wrote:

Folks,

I = wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter = below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from = many people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI = gathering last night. It is available online at <http://www.i= etf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>, and has been updated = on the BOF wiki <http://trac.to= ols.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>.

The meeting = materials for the BOF are available here: <ht= tps://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni>.
&= nbsp;
-- Rich and Francois

Content Delivery Networks = Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft = Charter
---------------------------------------------------------------= -

Description of Working = Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an = infrastructure of network elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, = arranged for the efficient distribution and delivery of = digital content. Such content includes, but is not limited to, web = pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous media = delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide = services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs = provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service content = delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved = quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in = content delivered over IP networks, existing CDN providers are scaling = up their infrastructure and many Network Service Providers = and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying their own CDNs. = Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given = item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of that = end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for = interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate = and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to = allow the interconnection of separately administered CDNs in support of = the end-to-end delivery of content from CSPs through multiple = CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their respective User = Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, deployable solution = in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It = is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing = IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing = object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI = objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new = protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter.

The working group will focus on the following = items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a = description of the problem and a common terminology.

- A = "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications of = the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document = providing a description of the different components of the CDNI solution = and how they interact with and relate to one another.

- A = "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for CDNI = architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working = group.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of:

   = o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform = request redirection.

   o = CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs = to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution = metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant = to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by = CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability = windows or access control).

   = o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging = systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content = delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, = analytics, monitoring, etc.

   = o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security = (including threat model), management and operational issues specific to = CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications.

The = working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not = define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New = protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a = CSP and a CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across = CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- = Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications = consuming CDNI logs.

The WG will work with other WGs to = assess, and where appropriate, leverage protocols developed by those = WGs, in order to realize the CDNI requirements and CDNI interfaces. = For example, the WG may assess the suitability of the ALTO protocol = as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which = may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing = decisions.

Goals & = Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
&n= bsp;
WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI = problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: = Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit = CDNI framework to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: = Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit = specification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit = specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit = specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit = specification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as = Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: = Recharter or = dissolve

_____________________________________________= __
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/ma= ilman/listinfo/cdni

Francois Le = Faucheur
Distinguished = Engineer
Corporate Development
Cisco Systems = France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 Sophia = Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

Think before you = print.
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Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 17:21:54 +0800 From: zhouzhipeng In-reply-to: <79680053-E211-437A-BD77-F72F4BFDE162@cisco.com> To: 'Francois Le Faucheur' Message-id: <000001cbfa85$65582160$30086420$@com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Content-type: multipart/related; boundary="Boundary_(ID_G7DqTnbet0oDfrLoV3IzOQ)" Content-language: zh-cn Thread-index: Acv6fNEHqEAnlZJ4SD6wnFDiLHg70gABiWQQ References: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> <000f01cbfa77$4a8fc760$dfaf5620$@com> <79680053-E211-437A-BD77-F72F4BFDE162@cisco.com> Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogtPC4tDogRWRpdG9yaWFsIGNvbW1lbnRzIG9u?= =?gb2312?b?IHRoZSBDRE5JIGNoYXJ0ZXIu?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 09:23:50 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_G7DqTnbet0oDfrLoV3IzOQ) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_Mo95tg/3f7XpgyZ2QVCS4g)" --Boundary_(ID_Mo95tg/3f7XpgyZ2QVCS4g) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Francois, As you said, =A1=AEtrust model=A1=AF and =A1=AEframework=A1=AF are the = two sides of one thing. We plan to support different business models(even some new are = expected). Perhaps one sentence may be included into that section: =A1=B0This document will include several architectures in terms of = possible trust models of CDN Interconnection=A1=B1. Thks. Zhipeng =20 =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le Faucheur [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C214=C8=D5 16:21 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: zhouzhipeng =B3=AD=CB=CD: Francois Le Faucheur; 'Woundy, Richard'; cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Editorial comments on the CDNI charter. =20 Hi Zhipeng, =20 On 14 Apr 2011, at 09:40, zhouzhipeng wrote: Francois, all: FYI that: In the =A1=B0Problem Statement=A1=B1, it reads Content Distribution = Metadata rather than Distribution Metadata. =20 OK. the draft charter text has been updated to say "content distribution metadata". Anyway, the terminations may be discussed more later while I think Distribution Metadata and Content Metadata can be two different kinds. =20 For the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1, I had ever sent an email two days = before while seems that it has not been successfully post to the reflector. Here I copy again in this email as below for reference: The market requirement for CDNI is to make the CDN service been = extensible by connecting multiple CDNs. Hence the goal if been realized will be beneficial for the whole CDN industry chain. The CP may cover more consumers. The consumer may get = more services. The CDN will have more development. To achievement the goal as above, the CDNI is very crucial to cover all = the interfaces(connection) including CP-UE, CP-CDN, CDN-CDN. Just because the service chain will include multiple entities, the trust chain should be defined before service initiation.( in fact such trust = chain should be the core problem to be solved in CDNI group) By for now, I just feel the discussion is whether we should give more clarified information in the charter. My opinion is 'yes' since the trust model will determine whether the = CDNI service would be appropriate in the practice hence. The information needed for exchange totally should be based on the trust model. Without the trust model, how may we know exactly what will be exchanged between two CDNs. =20 I believe there is agreement that the trust model impacts some detailed aspects of the CDNI interfaces. This is why the draft charter does identify documentation of the trust = model as part of the early deliverables (the "framework"). =20 Thanks =20 Francois We should first get a clear view how multiple entities cooperate in a complete service not just a simple picture that two CDNs should exchange some specific information. =20 Zhipeng =20 =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le Faucheur [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C213=C8=D5 16:53 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: zhouzhipeng =B3=AD=CB=CD: Francois Le Faucheur; 'Woundy, Richard'; cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: Editorial comments on the CDNI charter. =20 Hello Zhipeng, =20 On 13 Apr 2011, at 06:09, zhouzhipeng wrote: Rich , Francois, all, Some editorial comments for CDNI charter as below: =20 I understand that the draft charter would be subject to editing by = IESG/IAB anyways, but let's see if we can converge anyways. =20 >operating at layer 4 through layer 7 That sentence will bring the meaning that CDN will cover from layer 4 to layer 7. =20 Yes. This sentence is indeed claiming that CDNs can generally be = considered as an overlay on top of an IP network and operating over layers 4, 5, 6 = and 7.=20 That seems reasonable. CDN may be considered either on service layer or an layer over IP layer = and below the service layer. And in fact these several words do not make = sense. May be moved. >streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, The RTSP is used to instruct =A1=AEplay=A1=AF or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. May = say =A1=B0delivered via HTTP, RTP=A1=B1. =20 How about: " ... and streaming of continuous media controlled and delivered via = HTTP, RTSP/RTP, RTMP, etc." >a description of the different components of the CDNI solution and how = they interact with and relate to one another. I think =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and = =A1=AErelate to=A1=AF seems redundant . =20 OK. >"threat analysis" discussing the security concerns and threats, the = trust model and privacy issues specific to CDNI I think all security related issues associated to the architecture is = the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1. Hence it may be :" trust model " discussing the security concerns and threats, and privacy issues specific to CDNI =20 I don't agree with that. To me there needs to be a generic "threat analysis" that discusses all various ways the system may be cheated/attacked. In doing so, it should discuss the "trust model" which is one particular element of this = analysis. "Privacy" is another particular angle that needs to be discussed. I don't see an issue with the current text. Another , Should CDNI co-work with another WG on security area. =20 The draft charter already says that the CDNI WG should work with other relevant WGs. If there is one particular group where it is very clear = that CDNI would work with, then it could be mentioned in the charter. >A "framework" document providing a =A1=AD I think it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN should be = defined in the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even if we do not define new protocols. =20 It is clear that the framework needs to discuss how content acquisition needs to take place between CDNs, just like it needs to cover how request-routing will take place, and how distribution metadata exchange needs to take place... The current description is deliberately kept succinct and just says the framework needs to cover all architecture components. I don't see a need = to explicitly bring up "acquisition". >A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols As for the protocols here, are they existing protocols or new protocols. =20 This is an editing issue. This should have been converted to = "interfaces" instead of "protocols". It now reads: "This document lists the requirements for the CDNI architecture and the = CDNI interfaces." Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some protocols will not be defined in this WG. So, clarification is expected. >This document will list the requirements stemming from the threat = analysis and to be met by each of the CDNI interfaces How may we understand its relationship to the first sentence in this = section =A1=B0This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it.=A1=B1 =20 It should be clear now based on the previous correction. i.e. in particular, the "requirements" document will identify the requirements related to threat/security for each CDNI interface.=20 >This interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to = obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. May the downstream CDN also request some information from the upstream = CDN for further transfer? I think =A1=AEyes=A1=AF. =20 Not sure I follow that.=20 =20 >Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata I think the =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the superset of = =A1=B0content metadata=A1=B1 not the subset. =20 Please see the definitions of "Content Metadata" and "Content = Distribution Metadata" in the Problem Statement. For example, whether the location information of the end user belong to = =A1=B0 content metadata=A1=B1. >CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an = upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. It is not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since two CDNs only take the contract for = CDN interconnection. =20 It is "control" in the sense that one CDN can trigger actions in another CDN. It may be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1 rather than = =A1=B0control=A1=B1. Besides =A1=B0remove content from the downstream CDN=A1=B1, the upstream CDN = mainly may inform downstream CDN where/who the content is issued to. =20 =20 There is a very strong agreement that CDNI needs to allow the uCDN to trigger/request removal of content in dCDN. Another, for all these bullets of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I think the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. = =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) and the explanation following also use the word = =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface will=A1=AD. =20 The flow of the current text is : " > The working group will focus on the following items:=20 ... - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the = interconnection & interoperation of: ... o CDNI xxx systems. " So it should be read as saying that the "WG will specify an interface = for the interconnection of CDNI xxx systems." But I can see that the flow is hard to get through the multiple levels = of indentation. =20 So, unless we hear disagreement, we can take your suggestion and make it read as: " > The working group will focus on the following items:=20 ... - A specification of the CDNI xxx interface: " =20 =20 Thanks =20 Francois =20 =20 =20 Thanks. Zhipeng =20 ----------------------------------------------------- Huawei Software Technologies Co.,Ltd. No.101=A3=ACSoftware Avenue,Yuhuatai District,Nanjing, P.R.of China Zipcode:210012 E-Mail: zhouzp@huawei.com Phone:(+86) 25-56620690 Fax:(+86) 25-56624081 Mobile:(+86) 13404162849 ----------------------------------------------------- =20 _____ =20 =20 =20 =20 =09 =20 Francois Le Faucheur Distinguished Engineer Corporate Development flefauch@cisco.com Phone: +33 49 723 2619 Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 Cisco Systems France Greenside 400 Ave de Roumanille 06410 Sophia Antipolis France Cisco.com =20 =09 Think before you print. This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole = use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosure = by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by = reply email and delete all copies of this message. Cisco Systems France, Soci=A8=A6t=A8=A6 =A8=A4 responsabiit=A8=A6 = limit=A8=A6e, Rue Camille Desmoulins =A8C Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les = Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. For corporate legal information go to: http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html =20 --Boundary_(ID_Mo95tg/3f7XpgyZ2QVCS4g) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Francois,
As you said, =A1=AEtrust model=A1=AF and =A1=AEframework=A1=AF are = the two sides of one thing.
We plan to support different business models(even some new are = expected).
Perhaps one sentence may be included into that = section:
=A1=B0This document will include several architectures in terms of = possible trust models of CDN = Interconnection=A1=B1.
Thks.
Zhipeng

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le Faucheur = [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C214=C8=D5 = 16:21
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: = zhouzhipeng
=B3=AD=CB=CD: Francois Le Faucheur; = 'Woundy, Richard'; cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: Editorial comments on the CDNI = charter.

Hi = Zhipeng,

On 14 Apr 2011, at 09:40, = zhouzhipeng wrote:

Francois, all:
FYI that:
In the =A1=B0Problem Statement=A1=B1, it reads Content Distribution Metadata rather than Distribution Metadata.

OK. the draft charter text has been = updated to say "content distribution = metadata".

Anyway, the terminations may be discussed more later while I think = Distribution Metadata and Content Metadata can be two different = kinds.

For the =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1, I had ever sent an email two days = before while seems that it has not been successfully post to the = reflector.
Here I copy again in this email as below for reference:
The market = requirement for CDNI is to make the CDN service been extensible by = connecting multiple CDNs.
Hence the = goal if been realized will be beneficial for the whole CDN industry = chain. The CP may cover more consumers. The consumer may get more = services.
The CDN = will have more development.
To = achievement the goal as above, the CDNI is very crucial to cover all the = interfaces(connection) including CP-UE, CP-CDN, = CDN-CDN.
Just = because the service chain will include multiple entities, the trust = chain should be defined before service initiation.( in fact such trust = chain should be the core problem to be solved in CDNI = group)
By for = now, I just feel the discussion is whether we should give more clarified = information in the charter.
My opinion = is 'yes' since the trust model will determine whether the CDNI service = would be appropriate in the practice = hence.
The = information needed for exchange totally should be based on the trust = model. Without the trust model, how may we know exactly what will be = exchanged between two CDNs.

I believe there is agreement that = the trust model impacts some detailed aspects of the CDNI = interfaces.
This is why the draft charter does identify documentation = of the trust model as part of the early deliverables (the = "framework").

Thanks

Francois

We should = first get a clear view how multiple entities cooperate in a complete = service not just a simple picture that two CDNs should exchange some = specific information.

Zhipeng

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le Faucheur = [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C213=C8=D5 16:53
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: zhouzhipeng
=B3=AD=CB=CD: Francois Le = Faucheur; 'Woundy, Richard'; cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2= : Re: Editorial = comments on the CDNI charter.

Hello = Zhipeng,

On 13 Apr 2011, at 06:09, = zhouzhipeng wrote:

Rich , = Francois, all,
Some = editorial comments for CDNI charter as below:

I understand that the draft charter = would be subject to editing by IESG/IAB anyways, but let's see if we can = converge anyways.

>= operating at layer 4 = through layer 7
That = sentence will bring the meaning that CDN will cover from layer 4 to = layer 7.

Yes. This sentence is indeed = claiming that CDNs can generally be considered as an overlay on top of = an IP network and operating over layers 4, 5, 6 and = 7.
That seems = reasonable.

CDN may = be considered either on service layer or an layer over IP layer and = below the service layer. And in fact these several words do not make = sense. May be moved.
>streaming of continuous media delivered = via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP,
The = RTSP is used to instruct =A1=AEplay=A1=AF or =A1=AEpause=A1=AF. = May say =A1=B0delivered via HTTP, RTP=A1=B1.

How = about:
" ... and streaming of = continuous media controlled and delivered via HTTP, RTSP/RTP, RTMP, = etc."

>a description of the different components = of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one = another.
I think = =A1=AEsolution=A1=AF should be =A1=AEarchitecture=A1=AF and =A1=AErelate = to=A1=AF seems redundant .

OK.

>"threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI
I think = all security related issues associated to the architecture is the = =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1.
Hence = it may be :" trust model " discussing the security concerns = and threats, and privacy issues specific to CDNI

I don't agree with = that.
To me there needs to be a generic = "threat analysis" that discusses all various ways the system = may be cheated/attacked. In doing so, it should discuss the "trust = model" which is one particular element of this analysis. = "Privacy" is another particular angle that needs to be = discussed.
I don't see an issue with the = current text.

Another = , Should CDNI co-work with another WG on security area.

The draft charter already says that = the CDNI WG should work with other relevant WGs. If there is one = particular group where it is very clear that CDNI would work with, then = it could be mentioned in the = charter.

>A "framework" document = providing a =A1=AD
I think = it needs to clarify acquiring content across CDN should be defined in = the =A1=B0framework=A1=B1 even if = we do not define new protocols.

It is clear that the framework = needs to discuss how content acquisition needs to take place between = CDNs, just like it needs to cover how request-routing will take place, = and how distribution metadata exchange needs to take = place...
The current description is = deliberately kept succinct and just says the framework needs to cover = all architecture components. I don't see a need to explicitly bring up = "acquisition".

>A "requirements" = document. This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and = the protocols
As for = the protocols here, are they existing protocols or new = protocols.

This is an editing issue. This = should have been converted to "interfaces" instead of = "protocols". It now = reads:
"This document lists the = requirements for the CDNI architecture and the CDNI = interfaces."

Besides, in the end of this charter, it says some = protocols will not be defined in this WG. So, clarification is = expected.
>This document will list the = requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of = the CDNI interfaces
How may = we understand its relationship to the first sentence in this section = =A1=B0This document lists the requirements for CDNI architecture and the = protocols to support it.=A1=B1

It should be clear now based on the = previous correction.
i.e. in particular, the = "requirements" document will identify the requirements related = to threat/security for each CDNI = interface.

>This interface will allow an upstream CDN = request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information = necessary to perform request redirection.
May the = downstream CDN also request some information from the upstream CDN for = further transfer? I think =A1=AEyes=A1=AF.

Not sure I follow = that.

>Distribution metadata refers = to the subset of content metadata
I think = the =A1=B0distribution metadata=A1=B1 is the superset of =A1=B0content = metadata=A1=B1 not the subset.

Please see the definitions of = "Content Metadata" and "Content Distribution = Metadata" in the Problem = Statement.

For = example, whether the location information of the end user belong to = =A1=B0 content metadata=A1=B1.
>CDN control systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in = a downstream CDN.
It is = not =A1=B0control=A1=B1 since two CDNs only take the contract for CDN = interconnection.

It is "control" in the = sense that one CDN can trigger actions in another = CDN.

It may = be =A1=B0CDN service management=A1=B1 rather than =A1=B0control=A1=B1. = Besides =A1=B0remove content from the downstream CDN=A1=B1, the upstream = CDN mainly may inform downstream CDN where/who the content is issued to. =

There is a very strong agreement = that CDNI needs to allow the uCDN to trigger/request removal of content = in dCDN.

Another, for all these bullets of =A1=B0systems=A1=B1, I = think the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1 is better than =A1=B0systems=A1=B1. = =A1=B0Systems=A1=B1 means multiple system:) and the explanation = following also use the word =A1=B0interface=A1=B1: this interface will=A1=AD.

The flow of the current text is = :
"
    > The = working group will focus on the following = items:
       ...
       - A detailed = specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & = interoperation of:
          =     ...
          =     o CDNI xxx systems.
<= div>
"
So = it should be read as saying that the "WG will specify an interface = for the interconnection of CDNI xxx systems."
But = I can see that the flow is hard to get through the multiple levels of = indentation.

So, = unless we hear disagreement, we can take your suggestion and make it = read as:
"
    > The = working group will focus on the following = items:
       ...
       - A specification of = the CDNI xxx interface:
"

Thanks

Francois

Thanks.
Zhipeng

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=
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Distinguished = Engineer
Corporate = Development
flefauch@cisco.com
Phone: +33 49 723 = 2619
Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 = 90

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YVBbQR20McEY2pGoUD6D9T6nueanrWK5Yxj/ACxS+5WOCvV9tWq1bW9pUlO3bmbf66hRRRVGQUUU UAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAf/2Q== --Boundary_(ID_G7DqTnbet0oDfrLoV3IzOQ) Content-id: Content-type: image/gif; name=image002.gif Content-transfer-encoding: base64 Content-disposition: attachment; filename=image002.gif R0lGODlhEgATAJEAAAAAAP///wCZAP///yH5BAEAAAMALAAAAAASABMAAAIojI+pGyK8nINqUiTf bVnfvHEg1UmhdZRqaawu6XZVjKb0/CYxo8JOAQA7 --Boundary_(ID_G7DqTnbet0oDfrLoV3IzOQ)-- From ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk Thu Apr 14 06:46:25 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 63FB7E0889 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 06:46:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.272 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.272 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.725, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_64=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id H0rKE1V9WnNO for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 06:46:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailex.mailcore.me (mailex.mailcore.me [94.136.40.61]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 841B3E0718 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 06:46:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from host1.cachelogic.com ([212.44.43.80] helo=dhcp-108-devlan.cachelogic.com) by mail11.atlas.pipex.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QAMsL-0004dC-Pj; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:46:26 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 From: Ben Niven-Jenkins In-Reply-To: <000001cbfa85$65582160$30086420$@com> Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:46:22 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> <000f01cbfa77$4a8fc760$dfaf5620$@com> <79680053-E211-437A-BD77-F72F4BFDE162@cisco.com> <000001cbfa85$65582160$30086420$@com> To: zhouzhipeng X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) X-Mailcore-Auth: 9600544 X-Mailcore-Domain: 172912 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiDnrZTlpI06IEVkaXRvcmlhbCBjb21tZW50cyBv?= =?utf-8?q?n_the_CDNI_charter=2E?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 13:46:25 -0000 On 14 Apr 2011, at 10:21, zhouzhipeng wrote: > Hi Francois, > As you said, =91trust model=92 and =91framework=92 are the two sides = of one thing. > We plan to support different business models(even some new are = expected). > Perhaps one sentence may be included into that section: > =93This document will include several architectures in terms of = possible trust models of CDN Interconnection=94. I'm concerned that there seems to be a lot of suggestions (of which this = is only one) to try and make the charter overly precise. What we want is a WG to work on the problem, the charter covers the = scope of the WG it does not solve the problem the WG will be tasked to = solve. Once we have a WG, the WG can decide whether a single trust model = architecture is sufficient or not. If we start making decisions like = that now and baking them into the charter without having actually done = the necessary due diligence (as such due diligence is part of the work = of the WG not of the charter scope) the chance that the decision we make = is no better than a random decision is approximately 1 IMO. Ben From richard_woundy@cable.comcast.com Thu Apr 14 07:00:38 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABAF2E06BD for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:00:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.049 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.049 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-5.414, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311, J_CHICKENPOX_64=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cOomUpPl2K08 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:00:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58D3EE069F for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:00:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.41]) by copdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503630.33889200; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 08:03:17 -0600 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB02.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::11d4:f530:37a0:9f4e%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 10:00:07 -0400 From: "Woundy, Richard" To: Ben Niven-Jenkins , zhouzhipeng Thread-Topic: =?big5?B?W0NETmldILWqzmA6ILWqzmA6IEVkaXRvcmlhbCBjb21tZW50cyBvbiB0aGUgQ0RO?= =?big5?Q?I_charter.?= Thread-Index: Acv5kIyHKBUup+JgQLqB7clE9gC4GgASR0kAAC/J2gAAAWXtAAACIMkAAAk8hQD//74OKg== Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:00:07 +0000 Message-ID: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134E6EA5@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> References: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> <000f01cbfa77$4a8fc760$dfaf5620$@com> <79680053-E211-437A-BD77-F72F4BFDE162@cisco.com> <000001cbfa85$65582160$30086420$@com>, In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.191.125.11] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="big5" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] =?big5?b?tarOYDogtarOYDogRWRpdG9yaWFsIGNvbW1lbnRzIG9uIHRo?= =?big5?b?ZSBDRE5JIGNoYXJ0ZXIu?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:00:38 -0000 SSB0ZW5kIHRvIGFncmVlLiBXZSBhcmUgbm90IGdvaW5nIHRvIGRlY2lkZSBvbiB0aGUgZmluYWwg Y2hhcnRlciB0ZXh0IG9uIHRoaXMgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0LiBJdCB3aWxsIGJlIG5lZ290aWF0ZWQg YW5kIGFwcHJvdmVkIGJ5IHRoZSBhcmVhIGRpcmVjdG9yIGFuZCB0aGUgSUVTRy9JQUIuIFNlZSBo dHRwOi8vdG9vbHMuaWV0Zi5vcmcvaHRtbC9yZmMyNDE4I3NlY3Rpb24tMi4yIGZvciBkZXRhaWxz Lg0KDQpJZiB0aGVyZSBhcmUgc2lnbmlmaWNhbnQgbWlzc2luZyBpdGVtcyB3aXRoIHJlZ2FyZHMg dG8gV0cgc2NvcGUsIGxldCdzIGRpc2N1c3MgdGhlbS4gQnV0IGxldCdzIG5vdCBzcGVuZCB0b28g bXVjaCBtb3JlIHRpbWUgd2l0aCBlZGl0b3JpYWwgY2hhbmdlcy4NCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCkZyb206IGNkbmktYm91bmNlc0BpZXRmLm9yZyBbY2Ru aS1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYub3JnXSBvbiBiZWhhbGYgb2YgQmVuIE5pdmVuLUplbmtpbnMgW2JlbkBu aXZlbi1qZW5raW5zLmNvLnVrXQ0KU2VudDogVGh1cnNkYXksIEFwcmlsIDE0LCAyMDExIDk6NDYg QU0NClRvOiB6aG91emhpcGVuZw0KQ2M6IGNkbmlAaWV0Zi5vcmcNClN1YmplY3Q6IFJlOiBbQ0RO aV0gtarOYDogtarOYDogRWRpdG9yaWFsIGNvbW1lbnRzIG9uIHRoZSBDRE5JIGNoYXJ0ZXIuDQoN Ck9uIDE0IEFwciAyMDExLCBhdCAxMDoyMSwgemhvdXpoaXBlbmcgd3JvdGU6DQoNCj4gSGkgRnJh bmNvaXMsDQo+IEFzIHlvdSBzYWlkLCChpXRydXN0IG1vZGVsoaYgYW5kIKGlZnJhbWV3b3JroaYg YXJlIHRoZSB0d28gc2lkZXMgb2Ygb25lIHRoaW5nLg0KPiBXZSBwbGFuIHRvIHN1cHBvcnQgZGlm ZmVyZW50IGJ1c2luZXNzIG1vZGVscyhldmVuIHNvbWUgbmV3IGFyZSBleHBlY3RlZCkuDQo+IFBl cmhhcHMgb25lIHNlbnRlbmNlIG1heSBiZSBpbmNsdWRlZCBpbnRvIHRoYXQgc2VjdGlvbjoNCj4g oadUaGlzIGRvY3VtZW50IHdpbGwgaW5jbHVkZSBzZXZlcmFsIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZXMgaW4gdGVy bXMgb2YgcG9zc2libGUgdHJ1c3QgbW9kZWxzIG9mIENETiBJbnRlcmNvbm5lY3Rpb26hqC4NCg0K SSdtIGNvbmNlcm5lZCB0aGF0IHRoZXJlIHNlZW1zIHRvIGJlIGEgbG90IG9mIHN1Z2dlc3Rpb25z IChvZiB3aGljaCB0aGlzIGlzIG9ubHkgb25lKSB0byB0cnkgYW5kIG1ha2UgdGhlIGNoYXJ0ZXIg b3Zlcmx5IHByZWNpc2UuDQoNCldoYXQgd2Ugd2FudCBpcyBhIFdHIHRvIHdvcmsgb24gdGhlIHBy b2JsZW0sIHRoZSBjaGFydGVyIGNvdmVycyB0aGUgc2NvcGUgb2YgdGhlIFdHIGl0IGRvZXMgbm90 IHNvbHZlIHRoZSBwcm9ibGVtIHRoZSBXRyB3aWxsIGJlIHRhc2tlZCB0byBzb2x2ZS4NCg0KT25j ZSB3ZSBoYXZlIGEgV0csIHRoZSBXRyBjYW4gZGVjaWRlIHdoZXRoZXIgYSBzaW5nbGUgdHJ1c3Qg bW9kZWwgYXJjaGl0ZWN0dXJlIGlzIHN1ZmZpY2llbnQgb3Igbm90LiBJZiB3ZSBzdGFydCBtYWtp bmcgZGVjaXNpb25zIGxpa2UgdGhhdCBub3cgYW5kIGJha2luZyB0aGVtIGludG8gdGhlIGNoYXJ0 ZXIgd2l0aG91dCBoYXZpbmcgYWN0dWFsbHkgZG9uZSB0aGUgbmVjZXNzYXJ5IGR1ZSBkaWxpZ2Vu Y2UgKGFzIHN1Y2ggZHVlIGRpbGlnZW5jZSBpcyBwYXJ0IG9mIHRoZSB3b3JrIG9mIHRoZSBXRyBu b3Qgb2YgdGhlIGNoYXJ0ZXIgc2NvcGUpIHRoZSBjaGFuY2UgdGhhdCB0aGUgZGVjaXNpb24gd2Ug bWFrZSBpcyBubyBiZXR0ZXIgdGhhbiBhIHJhbmRvbSBkZWNpc2lvbiBpcyBhcHByb3hpbWF0ZWx5 IDEgSU1PLg0KDQpCZW4NCg0KDQpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fXw0KQ0ROaSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCkNETmlAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3 LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vY2RuaQ0K From ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk Thu Apr 14 07:04:09 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 70A95E075B for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:04:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.02 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.02 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.817, BAYES_00=-2.599, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JAoSkuV0v+QS for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:04:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailex.mailcore.me (mailex.mailcore.me [94.136.40.64]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 60ABDE066B for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:04:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from host1.cachelogic.com ([212.44.43.80] helo=dhcp-108-devlan.cachelogic.com) by mail5.atlas.pipex.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QAN9T-0004RH-RW; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:04:08 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 From: Ben Niven-Jenkins In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 15:04:05 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <1CA25301D2219F40B3AA37201F0EACD1134D6F07@PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com> <532F64BB-0089-4AEA-A6BC-6FBFBC15CEBB@cisco.com> To: Francois Le Faucheur X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) X-Mailcore-Auth: 9600544 X-Mailcore-Domain: 172912 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:04:09 -0000 Francois, I have read the latest charter and in my opinion it accurately describes = and scopes the work required of a CDNI WG. It is ready to go to our ADs = for discussion with the IESG. Ben On 14 Apr 2011, at 10:07, Francois Le Faucheur wrote: > Hello, >=20 > The on-line draft charter = (http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt) has been updated = to reflect the charter discussion on the list after the BOF. >=20 > Changes include: > * additional statement that CDNI WG will collaborate with = relevant external groups such as UltraViolet. > * editorials on how CDNI interfaces are listed > * editorials related to "content distribution metadata" = terminology > * editorials related to intro text in first paragraph giving = examples of streaming protocols >=20 > No changes were done as a result of the "CDN Federation" thread since = more voices argued that it may be counter-productive and unnecessarily = restrictive to attempt to rule out something that is not a well = understood notion. >=20 > No changes were done as a result of the "trust model" thread since the = draft charter already addresses the concern of documenting the CDNI = trust model. >=20 > Francois & Rich >=20 >=20 > On 7 Apr 2011, at 18:59, Francois Le Faucheur wrote: >=20 >> Folks, >>=20 >> Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF. >> Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this = draft charter is assessed by the ADs. >>=20 >> Francois & Rich >>=20 >> PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment >>=20 >>=20 >> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>=20 >> Description of Working Group >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>=20 >> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>=20 >> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>=20 >> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of = separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>=20 >> The working group will focus on the following items: >>=20 >> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>=20 >> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>=20 >> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" = discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI. >>=20 >> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and = important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI = protocols and solutions produced by the working group. This document = will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be = met by each of the CDNI interfaces. >>=20 >> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>=20 >> o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an = upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN = the information necessary to perform request redirection. >>=20 >> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow = the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >>=20 >> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging = systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and = content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. >>=20 >> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow = an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. >>=20 >> The WG will discuss and address the security, management and = operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and = specifications. >>=20 >> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>=20 >> In particular, the WG will not define: >> - New session, transport or network protocols. >> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent. >> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >> - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms >>=20 >> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>=20 >>=20 >> Goals & Milestones >> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>=20 >> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request = Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging = interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control = interface to IESG as proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: >>=20 >>> Folks, >>> =20 >>> I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft = charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input = from many people this week, including people that attended the informal = CDNI gathering last night. It is available online at = , and has been = updated on the BOF wiki = . >>> =20 >>> The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: = . >>> =20 >>> -- Rich and Francois >>> =20 >>> Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>> =20 >>> Description of Working Group >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D >>> =20 >>> A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the = efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content = includes, but is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via = HTTP, and streaming of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, = etc. CDNs typically provide services to multiple Content Service = Providers (CSPs). >>> =20 >>> CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, = improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of = delivery. For these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale = content delivery. >>> =20 >>> As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and = many Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are = deploying their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is = generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an = end user regardless of that end user's location or attachment network. = This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so = they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery = infrastructure. >>> =20 >>> The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection = of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as = needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be = realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message = exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the = definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol = extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will = recharter. >>> =20 >>> The working group will focus on the following items: >>> =20 >>> - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the = problem and a common terminology. >>> =20 >>> - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and = applications of the CDNI solution and protocols >>> =20 >>> - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. >>> =20 >>> - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements = for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, = this document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent = and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of = CDNI protocols and solutions produced by the working group. >>> =20 >>> - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of: >>> =20 >>> o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this = interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain = from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request = redirection. >>> =20 >>> o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will = allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. = Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is = relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: = content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows = or access control). >>> =20 >>> o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN = logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions = that are relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content = delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, = analytics, monitoring, etc. >>> =20 >>> o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. >>> =20 >>> The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat = model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the = above documents and specifications. >>> =20 >>> The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN = Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or = interoperation between CDNs. >>> =20 >>> In particular, the WG will not define: >>> - New session, transport or network protocols. >>> - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End = User/User Agent. >>> - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP = and a CDN. >>> - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. >>> - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. >>> - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. >>> - New applications consuming CDNI logs. >>> =20 >>> The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the = suitability of the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs = to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI = request routing decisions. >>> =20 >>> =20 >>> Goals & Milestones >>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D >>> =20 >>> WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG = as Informational >>> WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as = Informational >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard >>> WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve >>> =20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> CDNi mailing list >>> CDNi@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni >>=20 >>=20 >=20 > >=20 > Francois Le Faucheur > Distinguished Engineer > Corporate Development > flefauch@cisco.com > Phone: +33 49 723 2619 > Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 >=20 >=20 >=20 > Cisco Systems France > Greenside > 400 Ave de Roumanille > 06410 Sophia Antipolis > France > Cisco.com >=20 >=20 > =20 >=20 > > Think before you print. >=20 > This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the = sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact = the sender by reply email and delete all copies of this message. >=20 > Cisco Systems France, Soci=E9t=E9 =E0 responsabiit=E9 limit=E9e, Rue = Camille Desmoulins =96 Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy = les Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, = Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. >=20 > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > CDNi mailing list > CDNi@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni From flefauch@cisco.com Thu Apr 14 07:34:35 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A192E0787 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:34:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.404 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.404 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.142, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_64=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NraOD8RWPgll for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:34:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com (ams-iport-1.cisco.com [144.254.224.140]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93CC2E0765 for ; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 07:34:34 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=flefauch@cisco.com; l=3531; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1302791674; x=1304001274; h=subject:mime-version:from:in-reply-to:date:cc:message-id: references:to; bh=xweRw8d5D9nXCYIobprkCgf0/wLyw+euC6TD/z3RjGg=; b=hgw0hrlyesw/Mafi3dfD0O6ajCeXn25yGO/YNtqUNfwyoU4/lwYNGbl+ kZ3qVyCrufkjKxHzzoVBA45e4g02d5uiV0anZOduF+jmEughQc5cyyheA CJwQ1ZD1+fRNJqVnwNJ3h/K4ZcbDEDhRnJWLCFoA8q7ekefKfVLe3+oYh o=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.64,211,1301875200"; d="scan'208,217";a="83595364" Received: from ams-core-2.cisco.com ([144.254.72.75]) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Apr 2011 14:34:33 +0000 Received: from ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com (ams-flefauch-8713.cisco.com [10.55.161.196]) by ams-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.3/8.14.3) with ESMTP id p3EEYXuN010222; Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:34:33 GMT Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-254-214499522 From: Francois Le Faucheur In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 16:35:30 +0200 Message-Id: <074C2ADF-A320-43F9-A6F5-FAB63F2E2EC3@cisco.com> References: <000b01cbf990$8cd0eba0$a672c2e0$@com> <000f01cbfa77$4a8fc760$dfaf5620$@com> <79680053-E211-437A-BD77-F72F4BFDE162@cisco.com> <000001cbfa85$65582160$30086420$@com> To: zhouzhipeng 54906 X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiDnrZTlpI06IEVkaXRvcmlhbCBjb21tZW50cyBv?= =?utf-8?q?n_the_CDNI_charter=2E?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 14 Apr 2011 14:34:35 -0000 --Apple-Mail-254-214499522 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 On 14 Apr 2011, at 15:46, Ben Niven-Jenkins wrote: >=20 > On 14 Apr 2011, at 10:21, zhouzhipeng wrote: >=20 >> Hi Francois, >> As you said, =91trust model=92 and =91framework=92 are the two sides = of one thing. >> We plan to support different business models(even some new are = expected). >> Perhaps one sentence may be included into that section: >> =93This document will include several architectures in terms of = possible trust models of CDN Interconnection=94. >=20 > I'm concerned that there seems to be a lot of suggestions (of which = this is only one) to try and make the charter overly precise. >=20 > What we want is a WG to work on the problem, the charter covers the = scope of the WG it does not solve the problem the WG will be tasked to = solve. +1. Francois >=20 > Once we have a WG, the WG can decide whether a single trust model = architecture is sufficient or not. If we start making decisions like = that now and baking them into the charter without having actually done = the necessary due diligence (as such due diligence is part of the work = of the WG not of the charter scope) the chance that the decision we make = is no better than a random decision is approximately 1 IMO. >=20 > Ben >=20 >=20 --Apple-Mail-254-214499522 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252

On 14 Apr 2011, at 10:21, zhouzhipeng = wrote:

Hi = Francois,
As you said, =91trust = model=92 and =91framework=92 are the two sides of one = thing.
We plan to support = different business models(even some new are = expected).
Perhaps one = sentence may be included into that section:
=93This document will include several architectures in = terms of possible trust models of CDN = Interconnection=94.

I'm concerned that there seems = to be a lot of suggestions (of which this is only one) to try and make = the charter overly precise.

What we want is a WG to work on the = problem, the charter covers the scope of the WG it does not solve the = problem the WG will be tasked to = solve.

+1.

<= div>Francois

Once we have a = WG, the WG can decide whether a single trust model architecture is = sufficient or not. If we start making decisions like that now and baking = them into the charter without having actually done the necessary due = diligence (as such due diligence is part of the work of the WG not of = the charter scope) the chance that the decision we make is no better = than a random decision is approximately 1 = IMO.

Ben

<000f01cbfa77$4a8fc760$dfaf5620$@com> <79680053-E211-437A-BD77-F72F4BFDE162@cisco.com> <000001cbfa85$65582160$30086420$@com> <074C2ADF-A320-43F9-A6F5-FAB63F2E2EC3@cisco.com> Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogILTwuLQ6ILTwuLQ6IEVkaXRvcmlhbCBjb21t?= =?gb2312?b?ZW50cyBvbiB0aGUgQ0ROSSBjaGFydGVyLg==?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 06:41:35 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_yldiZj2TR37UC9tahe+QnQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable I tend to agree with U on the understanding of =A1=AEcharter=A1=AF. Although the charter may be renegotiated later, we may solve the = problems once we find them: ) Since the charter covers the scope of the WG, it should be careful of = the wording of the scope.=20 The comment is to avoid the ambiguity clarifying the relationship of = =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1 and the =A1=B0architecture=A1=B1 . =20 Zhipeng =20 =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le Faucheur [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C214=C8=D5 22:35 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: zhouzhipeng 54906 =B3=AD=CB=CD: Le Faucheur Francois; cdni@ietf.org; Niven-Jenkins Ben =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Editorial comments = on the CDNI charter. =20 =20 On 14 Apr 2011, at 15:46, Ben Niven-Jenkins wrote: On 14 Apr 2011, at 10:21, zhouzhipeng wrote: Hi Francois, As you said, =A1=AEtrust model=A1=AF and =A1=AEframework=A1=AF are the = two sides of one thing. We plan to support different business models(even some new are = expected). Perhaps one sentence may be included into that section: =A1=B0This document will include several architectures in terms of = possible trust models of CDN Interconnection=A1=B1. I'm concerned that there seems to be a lot of suggestions (of which this = is only one) to try and make the charter overly precise. What we want is a WG to work on the problem, the charter covers the = scope of the WG it does not solve the problem the WG will be tasked to solve. =20 +1. =20 Francois Once we have a WG, the WG can decide whether a single trust model architecture is sufficient or not. If we start making decisions like = that now and baking them into the charter without having actually done the necessary due diligence (as such due diligence is part of the work of = the WG not of the charter scope) the chance that the decision we make is no = better than a random decision is approximately 1 IMO. Ben =20 =20 --Boundary_(ID_yldiZj2TR37UC9tahe+QnQ) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable
I tend to agree with U on the understanding of = =A1=AEcharter=A1=AF.
Although the charter may be renegotiated later, we may solve the = problems once we find them: )
Since the charter covers the scope of the WG, it should be careful of = the wording of the scope.
The comment is to avoid the ambiguity clarifying the relationship of = =A1=B0trust model=A1=B1 and the =A1=B0architecture=A1=B1 = .

Zhipeng

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Francois Le = Faucheur [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC= =E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C214=C8=D5 22:35
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: zhouzhipeng = 54906
=B3=AD=CB=CD: Le Faucheur Francois; cdni@ietf.org; Niven-Jenkins = Ben
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: Editorial comments on the CDNI = charter.

On 14 Apr 2011, at 15:46, Ben = Niven-Jenkins wrote:

On 14 Apr 2011, at 10:21, = zhouzhipeng wrote:

Hi = Francois,
As you said, =A1=AEtrust = model=A1=AF and =A1=AEframework=A1=AF are the two sides of one = thing.
We plan to support different = business models(even some new are = expected).
Perhaps one sentence may be = included into that = section:
=A1=B0This document will include = several architectures in terms of possible trust models of CDN = Interconnection=A1=B1.

I'm concerned that there seems = to be a lot of suggestions (of which this is only one) to try and make = the charter overly precise.

What we want is a WG to work on the = problem, the charter covers the scope of the WG it does not solve the = problem the WG will be tasked to = solve.

+1.

Francois

Once we have a WG, = the WG can decide whether a single trust model architecture is = sufficient or not. If we start making decisions like that now and baking = them into the charter without having actually done the necessary due = diligence (as such due diligence is part of the work of the WG not of = the charter scope) the chance that the decision we make is no better = than a random decision is approximately 1 = IMO.

Ben

= --Boundary_(ID_yldiZj2TR37UC9tahe+QnQ)-- From hexiaoyan@huawei.com Fri Apr 15 02:42:12 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E4C4E06FC for ; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 02:42:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 4.49 X-Spam-Level: **** X-Spam-Status: No, score=4.49 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-1.11, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_GIF_ATTACH=1.42, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ytnLfY5lxZHG for ; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 02:42:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from szxga04-in.huawei.com (szxga04-in.huawei.com [119.145.14.67]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80614E06B9 for ; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 02:42:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (szxga04-in [172.24.2.12]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJO00COUTJK40@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 17:40:32 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJO00LSYTJKP2@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 17:40:32 +0800 (CST) Received: from w36710x ([10.144.113.87]) by szxml06-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LJO0025ZTJHTU@szxml06-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 17:40:31 +0800 (CST) Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 17:40:29 +0800 From: He Xiaoyan In-reply-to: To: 'Francois Le Faucheur' , cdni@ietf.org Message-id: <00c001cbfb51$28c87660$5771900a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3664 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: multipart/related; boundary="Boundary_(ID_KpLPOIbhxfmFmGfhAWVjRw)" Thread-index: Acv6g2TcYekvk7xuRvq3LKcvEkLhTwAwksUA Subject: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogIFVwZGF0ZWQgdmVyc2lvbiBvZiB0aGUgQ0RO?= =?gb2312?b?SSBjaGFydGVy?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 09:42:12 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_KpLPOIbhxfmFmGfhAWVjRw) Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_704plnFcetvlb7BEMH/DQQ)" --Boundary_(ID_704plnFcetvlb7BEMH/DQQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Francois and all, =20 Although thinking most content of the current charter is clearly and = well defined but I still have a question on the description of the CDNi = control interface, hope it is not too late to raise. =20 In the current charter it says that the CDNi control interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. And in = the requirement I-D, the Req 15 is to reflect this I believe, there is also = Req 51 and Req 52 in metadata API describe actions of addition and = modification of objects. Which confused me, In my opinion, actions like removal or invalidate objects has no essential difference with addition and modification. They all can be categorized as management actions, right? = Why we put some of them under the Control API while others under the = Metadata API? =20 If the above comment is valid, I propose to merge the description=A1=B1 = In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.=A1=B1into metadata API part. Or move the =A1=B0content acquisition=A1=B1 description in metadata API = to control API. Thanks. =20 Best Regards Xiaoyan(Susan) He _____ =20 =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] = =B4=FA=B1=ED Francois Le Faucheur =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C214=C8=D5 17:08 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter =20 Hello, =20 The on-line draft charter = (http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9. txt) has been updated to reflect the charter discussion on the list = after the BOF. =20 Changes include: * additional statement that CDNI WG will collaborate with = relevant external groups such as UltraViolet. * editorials on how CDNI interfaces are listed * editorials related to "content distribution metadata" = terminology * editorials related to intro text in first paragraph giving = examples of streaming protocols =20 No changes were done as a result of the "CDN Federation" thread since = more voices argued that it may be counter-productive and unnecessarily restrictive to attempt to rule out something that is not a well = understood notion. =20 No changes were done as a result of the "trust model" thread since the = draft charter already addresses the concern of documenting the CDNI trust = model. =20 Francois & Rich =20 =20 On 7 Apr 2011, at 18:59, Francois Le Faucheur wrote: Folks, Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF. Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft charter is assessed by the ADs. Francois & Rich PS: do not worry about "editorial" comments for now, let's focus on = comment =20 Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter ---------------------------------------------------------------- Description of Working Group =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but = is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming = of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically = provide services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved = quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For = these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many = Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying their = own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of that = end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate = and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure. The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. The working group will focus on the following items: - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem = and a common terminology. - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of the CDNI solution and protocols - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one = another. This document will also include a "threat analysis" discussing the = security concerns and threats, the trust model and privacy issues specific to = CDNI. - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and solutions produced by the working group. This document will list the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of = the CDNI interfaces. - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & interoperation of: o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an = upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the = information necessary to perform request redirection. o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow = the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to = the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access control). o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging = systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are = relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc. o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow = an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperation between CDNs. In particular, the WG will not define: - New session, transport or network protocols. - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent. - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a CDN. - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. - New applications consuming CDNI logs. - Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of = the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request = routing decisions. Goals & Milestones =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI = Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote: Folks, =20 I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from = many people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI = gathering last night. It is available online at , and has been = updated on the BOF wiki . =20 The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: . =20 -- Rich and Francois =20 Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter ---------------------------------------------------------------- =20 Description of Working Group =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D =20 A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but = is not limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming = of continuous media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically = provide services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs). =20 CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved = quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For = these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery. =20 As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many = Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying their = own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a given item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of that = end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate = and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure. =20 The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a = targeted, deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter. =20 The working group will focus on the following items: =20 - A "problem statement" document providing a description of the problem = and a common terminology. =20 - A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications = of the CDNI solution and protocols =20 - A "framework" document providing a description of the different = components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to one = another. =20 - A "requirements" document. This document lists the requirements for = CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and solutions produced by the working group. =20 - A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection & interoperation of: =20 o CDNI request-routing systems. In particular, this interface = will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to obtain from the = downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection. =20 o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow = the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to = the distribution of the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs = (for example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability windows or access control). =20 o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant across CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, = monitoring, etc. =20 o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow = an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. =20 The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications. =20 The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperation between CDNs. =20 In particular, the WG will not define: - New session, transport or network protocols. - New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent. - New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a CDN. - New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs. - Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations. - Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs. - New applications consuming CDNI logs. =20 The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of = the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request = routing decisions. =20 =20 Goals & Milestones =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =20 WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informational WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or dissolve =20 _______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list CDNi@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni =20 =20 =20 =20 Francois Le Faucheur Distinguished Engineer Corporate Development flefauch@cisco.com Phone: +33 49 723 2619 Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 90 Cisco Systems France Greenside 400 Ave de Roumanille 06410 Sophia Antipolis France Cisco.com =20 =20 Think before you print. This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole = use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or disclosure = by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender by = reply email and delete all copies of this message. Cisco Systems France, Soci=A8=A6t=A8=A6 =A8=A4 responsabiit=A8=A6 = limit=A8=A6e, Rue Camille Desmoulins =A8C Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les = Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone. For corporate legal information go to: http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html =20 --Boundary_(ID_704plnFcetvlb7BEMH/DQQ) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Francois and = all,

<= /span>

Although thinking most content of the current = charter is clearly and well defined but I still have a question on the = description of the CDNi control interface, hope it is not too late to = raise.

In the current charter it says that the CDNi = control interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. And in = the requirement I-D, the Req 15 is to reflect this I believe, there is also Req 51 = and Req 52 = in metadata API describe actions of addition and modification of objects. Which = confused me, In my opinion, actions like removal or invalidate objects has no = essential difference with addition and modification. They all can be categorized = as management actions, right? Why we put some of them under the = Control API while others under the Metadata API?

If the above comment is valid, I propose = to merge the description=A1=B1 In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN = to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.=A1=B1into metadata API part.

Or move the = =A1=B0content acquisition=A1=B1 description in metadata API to control API.

Thanks.=

<= /span>

Best = Regards

Xiaoyan(Susan) = He

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: cdni-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] = =B4=FA= =B1=ED Francois Le Faucheur
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C214=C8=D5 = 17:08
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: [CDNi] Updated version of the CDNI charter

Hello,

The on-line draft charter (http://www.= ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt) has been updated to reflect the charter discussion on the list after the = BOF.

Changes include:

       = * additional statement that CDNI WG will collaborate with = relevant external groups such as UltraViolet.

       = * editorials on how CDNI interfaces are = listed

       = * editorials related to "content distribution = metadata" terminology

       = * editorials related to intro text in first paragraph = giving examples of streaming protocols

No changes were done as a result of the = "CDN Federation" thread since more voices argued that it may be counter-productive and unnecessarily restrictive to attempt to rule out something that is not a well understood = notion.

No changes were done as a result of the = "trust model" thread since the draft charter already addresses the concern = of documenting the CDNI trust model.

Francois & = Rich

On 7 Apr 2011, at 18:59, Francois Le Faucheur = wrote:

Folks,

Below is an updated version of the CDNI draft charter reflecting the = charter discussion/edits during the BOF.

Please bring forward the additional comments you have before this draft charter is = assessed by the ADs.

Francois & Rich

PS: do not worry about "editorial" = comments for now, let's focus on comment

Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
----------------------------------------------------------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient = distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but is not = limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous = media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide = services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For = these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many = Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying = their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a = given item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of that = end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for = interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively = behave as a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, = deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by the = industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing = IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are = deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a description of = the problem and a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the = different components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another. This document will also include a "threat = analysis" discussing the security concerns and threats, the trust model and = privacy issues specific to CDNI.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the = requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and = important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and solutions produced by the working group. This document will list = the requirements stemming from the threat analysis and to be met by each of = the CDNI interfaces.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of:

       = o CDNI request-routing systems. This interface will allow an upstream CDN = request routing system to obtain from the downstream CDN the information = necessary to perform request redirection.

       = o CDNI metadata distribution systems. This interface will allow the CDNs to = exchange distribution metadata of inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers = to the subset of content metadata that is relevant to the distribution of = the content and therefore is to be processed by CDNs (for example, this may = include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, = enforcement of availability windows or access control).

       = o CDNI logging systems. This interface will allow CDN logging systems to = exchange logging information associated with actions that are relevant across = CDNs (such as content distribution, content delivery and content routing = actions) for purposes of accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

       = o CDN control systems. In particular, this interface will allow an upstream = CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security, management and operational = issues specific to CDNI, inside the above documents and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a = CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.
- Digital Right Management (DRM) mechanisms

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of = the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange = information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing = decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months:   = Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months:   = Submit CDNI use cases to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:        = Submit CDNI framework to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months:        = Submit CDNI requirements to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months:        = Submit specification of the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:        = Submit specification of the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 18 months:        = Submit specification of the CDNI Control interface to IESG as proposed = Standard
WG Creation + 24 months:        = Submit specification of the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as = Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months:        = Recharter or dissolve

On 31 Mar 2011, at 16:43, Woundy, Richard wrote:

Folks,

I wanted everyone to have an updated version of the CDNI draft charter = below, for discussion at the BOF shortly. This is based on input from many = people this week, including people that attended the informal CDNI gathering last = night. It is available online at <http://www.= ietf.org/proceedings/80/slides/cdni-9.txt>, and has been updated on the BOF wiki <http://trac.t= ools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart>.

The meeting materials for the BOF are available here: <h= ttps://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/80/materials.html#wg-cdni>.
-- Rich and Francois

Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) - Draft Charter
----------------------------------------------------------------

Description of Working Group
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D

A Content Delivery Network (CDN) is an infrastructure of network = elements operating at layer 4 through layer 7, arranged for the efficient = distribution and delivery of digital content. Such content includes, but is not = limited to, web pages and images delivered via HTTP, and streaming of continuous = media delivered via HTTP, RTSP, RTMP, etc. CDNs typically provide = services to multiple Content Service Providers (CSPs).

CDNs provide numerous benefits: a shared platform for multi-service = content delivery, reduced transmission costs for cacheable content, improved = quality of experience for end users and increased robustness of delivery. For = these reasons they are frequently used for large-scale content delivery.

As a result of the significant growth in content delivered over IP = networks, existing CDN providers are scaling up their infrastructure and many = Network Service Providers and Enterprise Service Providers are deploying = their own CDNs. Subject to the policy of the CSP, it is generally desirable that a = given item of content can be delivered to an end user regardless of that = end user's location or attachment network. This creates a need for = interconnecting (previously) standalone CDNs so they can interoperate and collectively behave as a single delivery infrastructure.

The goal of the CDNI Working Group is to allow the interconnection of separately administered CDNs in support of the end-to-end delivery of = content from CSPs through multiple CDNs and ultimately to end users (via = their respective User Agents). The CDNI WG aims at delivering a targeted, = deployable solution in a short timeframe (18-24 months) as needed by = the industry. It is expected that the CDNI interfaces will be realized using existing = IETF protocols for transport and message exchange, and using existing object notation grammars/languages for the definition of CDNI objects and semantics. In the event that protocol extensions or new protocols are = deemed necessary by the WG, the WG will recharter.

The working group will focus on the following items:

- A "problem statement" document providing a description of = the problem and a common terminology.

- A "use case" document describing scenarios for usage and applications of the CDNI solution and protocols

- A "framework" document providing a description of the = different components of the CDNI solution and how they interact with and relate to = one another.

- A "requirements" document. This document lists the = requirements for CDNI architecture and the protocols to support it. In particular, this = document will focus on identifying a reasonable set of more urgent and = important requirements that will be addressed in the initial set of CDNI protocols = and solutions produced by the working group.

- A detailed specification of the interfaces for the interconnection = & interoperation of:

   o CDNI request-routing systems. In = particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN request routing system to = obtain from the downstream CDN the information necessary to perform request redirection.

   o CDNI metadata distribution systems. = This interface will allow the CDNs to exchange distribution metadata of = inter-CDN scope. Distribution metadata refers to the subset of content = metadata that is relevant to the distribution of the content and therefore is to be = processed by CDNs (for example, this may include information enabling: content acquisition, geo-blocking, enforcement of availability = windows or access control).

   o CDNI logging systems. This interface = will allow CDN logging systems to exchange logging information associated = with actions that are relevant across CDNs (such as = content distribution, content delivery and content routing actions) for purposes of = accounting, analytics, monitoring, etc.

   o CDN control systems. In particular, = this interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in = a downstream CDN.

The WG will discuss and address the security (including threat model), management and operational issues specific to CDNI, inside the above = documents and specifications.

The working group will only define solutions for aspects of the CDN Interconnection problem space that require direct communication or interoperation between CDNs.

In particular, the WG will not define:
- New session, transport or network protocols.
- New protocols for delivering content from a CDN to an End User/User = Agent.
- New protocols for ingestion of content or metadata between a CSP and a = CDN.
- New protocols for acquiring content across CDNs.
- Protocols and algorithms for intra-CDN operations.
- Support for Transparent Caching across CDNs.
- New applications consuming CDNI logs.

The WG will work with other WGs to assess, and where appropriate, = leverage protocols developed by those WGs, in order to realize the CDNI = requirements and CDNI interfaces. For example, the WG may assess the suitability of = the ALTO protocol as a protocol to enable downstream CDNs to exchange = information which may aid an upstream CDN with making CDNI request routing = decisions.

Goals & Milestones
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

WG Creation + 6 months: Submit CDNI problem statement to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 9 months: Submit CDNI use cases = to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI framework to = IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 12 months: Submit CDNI requirements = to IESG as Informational
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Request Routing interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Logging interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 18 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Control interface to IESG as proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Submit specification of = the CDNI Metadata Distribution interface to IESG as Proposed Standard
WG Creation + 24 months: Recharter or = dissolve

_______________________________________________
CDNi mailing list
CDNi@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

Francois Le Faucheur
Distinguished Engineer
Corporate Development
flefauch@cisco.com
Phone: +33 49 723 2619
Mobile: +33 6 19 98 50 = 90

Cisco Systems France
Greenside
400 Ave de Roumanille
06410 Sophia Antipolis
France
Cisco.com

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This email may contain confidential and privileged material for the = sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, use, distribution or = disclosure by others is strictly prohibited. If you are not the intended = recipient (or authorized to receive for the recipient), please contact the sender = by reply email and delete all copies of this message.

Cisco Systems France, Soci=A8=A6t=A8=A6 =A8=A4 responsabiit=A8=A6 = limit=A8=A6e, Rue Camille Desmoulins =A8C Imm Atlantis Zac Forum Seine Ilot 7 92130 Issy les = Moulineaux, Au capital de 91.470 =80, 349 166 561 RCS Nanterre, Directeur de la = publication: Jean-Luc Michel Givone.

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YVBbQR20McEY2pGoUD6D9T6nueanrWK5Yxj/ACxS+5WOCvV9tWq1bW9pUlO3bmbf66hRRRVGQUUU UAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAFFFFABRRRQAUUUUAf/2Q== --Boundary_(ID_KpLPOIbhxfmFmGfhAWVjRw) Content-id: Content-type: image/gif; name=image002.gif Content-transfer-encoding: base64 Content-disposition: attachment; filename=image002.gif R0lGODlhEgATAJEAAAAAAP///wCZAP///yH5BAEAAAMALAAAAAASABMAAAIojI+pGyK8nINqUiTf bVnfvHEg1UmhdZRqaawu6XZVjKb0/CYxo8JOAQA7 --Boundary_(ID_KpLPOIbhxfmFmGfhAWVjRw)-- From ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk Fri Apr 15 04:48:23 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 429C4E06A8 for ; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 04:48:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.271 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.271 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.124, BAYES_00=-2.599, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HQpO25gI4V8F for ; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 04:48:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailex.mailcore.me (mailex.mailcore.me [94.136.40.64]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0334E0684 for ; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 04:48:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from host1.cachelogic.com ([212.44.43.80] helo=dhcp-108-devlan.cachelogic.com) by mail5.atlas.pipex.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QAhVf-0006gg-Hu; Fri, 15 Apr 2011 12:48:23 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii From: Ben Niven-Jenkins In-Reply-To: <00c001cbfb51$28c87660$5771900a@china.huawei.com> Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 12:48:16 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <5475D2AB-0D2F-4E32-BCB9-134A8DD42BCE@niven-jenkins.co.uk> References: <00c001cbfb51$28c87660$5771900a@china.huawei.com> To: He Xiaoyan X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) X-Mailcore-Auth: 9600544 X-Mailcore-Domain: 172912 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAgVXBkYXRlZCB2ZXJzaW9uIG9mIHRoZSBDRE5J?= =?utf-8?q?_charter?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 15 Apr 2011 11:48:23 -0000 On 15 Apr 2011, at 10:40, He Xiaoyan wrote: > Hi Francois and all, > =20 > Although thinking most content of the current charter is clearly and = well defined but I still have a question on the description of the CDNi = control interface, hope it is not too late to raise. > =20 > In the current charter it says that the CDNi control interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. And in the requirement I-D, the Req 15 is to reflect this I = believe, there is also Req 51 and Req 52 in metadata API describe = actions of addition and modification of objects. Which confused me, In = my opinion, actions like removal or invalidate objects has no essential = difference with addition and modification. They all can be categorized = as management actions, right? Why we put some of them under the Control = API while others under the Metadata API? Requirement 51 & 52 relate to the addition/modification/removal of the = CDNI Metadata associated with the content, not the actual content = itself. Requirement 15 relates to removal/invalidation of the content itself. Ben From hexiaoyan@huawei.com Sun Apr 17 19:27:40 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFC84E0761 for ; Sun, 17 Apr 2011 19:27:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 4.505 X-Spam-Level: **** X-Spam-Status: No, score=4.505 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.015, BAYES_50=0.001, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, CN_BODY_35=0.339, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id leoz3w+tsgXM for ; Sun, 17 Apr 2011 19:27:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from szxga04-in.huawei.com (szxga04-in.huawei.com [119.145.14.67]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97411E066C for ; Sun, 17 Apr 2011 19:27:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (szxga04-in [172.24.2.12]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJT00NJVTHR3A@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 10:27:27 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJT00D1TTHR4V@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 10:27:27 +0800 (CST) Received: from w36710x ([10.144.113.87]) by szxml06-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LJT004DHTHQ2A@szxml06-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 10:27:27 +0800 (CST) Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2011 10:27:26 +0800 From: He Xiaoyan In-reply-to: <5475D2AB-0D2F-4E32-BCB9-134A8DD42BCE@niven-jenkins.co.uk> To: 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' Message-id: <00f701cbfd70$28b49980$5771900a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3664 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_CZUhFWydUMBTcwEllUj1PA)" Thread-index: Acv7YxrKJFkgtoRATreRvq4OCU3zVgCA9HjA Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogILTwuLQ6ICBVcGRhdGVkIHZlcnNpb24gb2Yg?= =?gb2312?b?dGhlIENETkkgY2hhcnRlcg==?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2011 02:27:41 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_CZUhFWydUMBTcwEllUj1PA) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Ben, In the latest I-D draft"draft-lefaucheur-cdni-requirements-01", Req15 relates not only to content but also metadata. And Req15 is just an = example, you could also find that Req 17 also relates to metadata but is putting under the control API now. =20 So, I think first consensus is needed on the relations of APIs (control = API and metadata API) and data( metadata and content itself), if you = proposed control API is related to content and metadata API relate to the CDNI metadata, that's OK for me. Then the charter needs to be revised to = reflect this, e.g. move the "content acquisition" out of the control API and add content acquisition description to the metadata API,e.g." In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to add, remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN".=20 =20 Best Regards Xiaoyan(Susan) He =20 -----=D3=CA=BC=FE=D4=AD=BC=FE----- =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Ben Niven-Jenkins [mailto:ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C215=C8=D5 19:48 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan =B3=AD=CB=CD: 'Francois Le Faucheur'; cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI = charter =20 =20 On 15 Apr 2011, at 10:40, He Xiaoyan wrote: =20 > Hi Francois and all, > =20 > Although thinking most content of the current charter is clearly and = well defined but I still have a question on the description of the CDNi = control interface, hope it is not too late to raise. > =20 > In the current charter it says that the CDNi control interface will = allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN. And = in the requirement I-D, the Req 15 is to reflect this I believe, there is = also Req 51 and Req 52 in metadata API describe actions of addition and modification of objects. Which confused me, In my opinion, actions like removal or invalidate objects has no essential difference with addition = and modification. They all can be categorized as management actions, right? = Why we put some of them under the Control API while others under the = Metadata API? =20 Requirement 51 & 52 relate to the addition/modification/removal of the = CDNI Metadata associated with the content, not the actual content itself. =20 Requirement 15 relates to removal/invalidation of the content itself. =20 Ben --Boundary_(ID_CZUhFWydUMBTcwEllUj1PA) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Ben,

In the latest I-D = draft"draft-lefaucheur-cdni-requirements-01", Req15 relates not only to content but also metadata. And Req15 is just = an example, you could also find that Req 17 also relates to metadata but is putting under the control API now.

So, I think first consensus is needed on the relations of APIs = (control API and metadata API) and data( metadata and content itself), if you = proposed control API is related to content and metadata API relate to the CDNI = metadata, that's OK for me. Then the charter needs to be revised to reflect this, = e.g. move the "content acquisition" out of the control API and add = content acquisition description to the metadata API,e.g." In particular, = this interface will allow an upstream CDN to add, remove or = invalidate content in a downstream CDN".

Best Regards

Xiaoyan(Susan) He

-----=D3=CA=BC=FE=D4=AD=BC=FE-----
=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Ben Niven-Jenkins = [mailto:ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C215=C8=D5 19:48
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan
=B3=AD=CB=CD: 'Francois Le Faucheur'; = cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: [CDNi] = =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter

On 15 Apr 2011, at 10:40, He Xiaoyan = wrote:

> Hi Francois and all,

>

> Although thinking most content of the current charter is = clearly and well defined but I still have a question on the description of the = CDNi control interface, hope it is not too late to = raise.

>

> In the current charter it says that the CDNi control = interface will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. And in the requirement I-D, the Req 15 is to reflect this I believe, = there is also Req 51 and Req 52 in metadata API describe actions of addition and modification of objects. = Which confused me, In my opinion, actions like removal or invalidate objects = has no essential difference with addition and modification. They all can be categorized as management actions, right? Why we put some of them = under the Control API while others under the Metadata = API?

Requirement 51 & 52 relate to the = addition/modification/removal of the CDNI Metadata associated with the content, not the actual content = itself.

Requirement 15 relates to removal/invalidation of the content = itself.

Ben

--Boundary_(ID_CZUhFWydUMBTcwEllUj1PA)-- From yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com Mon Apr 18 13:57:39 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 021E6E0897 for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 13:57:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -95.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-95.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-6.336, BAYES_50=0.001, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, CN_BODY_35=0.339, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_BASE64_TEXT=1.753, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gdp1bPwnskEm for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 13:57:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8669CE0892 for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 13:57:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.41]) by copdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503630.34537651; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 15:00:49 -0600 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by PACDCEXHUB02.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::11d4:f530:37a0:9f4e%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 16:57:29 -0400 From: "Lee, Yiu" To: He Xiaoyan , 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' Thread-Topic: =?gb2312?B?W0NETmldILTwuLQ6ICC08Li0OiAgVXBkYXRlZCB2ZXJzaW9uIG9mIHRoZSBD?= =?gb2312?Q?DNI_charter?= Thread-Index: AQHL/gs5qcWTAQEwHkyaj755lE5ozA== Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2011 20:57:28 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <00f701cbfd70$28b49980$5771900a@china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.2.0.101115 x-originating-ip: [147.191.125.11] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_C9D21AADCD5Byiuleecablecomcastcom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogILTwuLQ6ICBVcGRhdGVkIHZlcnNpb24gb2Yg?= =?gb2312?b?dGhlIENETkkgY2hhcnRlcg==?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2011 20:57:39 -0000 --_000_C9D21AADCD5Byiuleecablecomcastcom_ Content-Type: text/plain; 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charset="gb2312" Content-ID: <6C8E161FC894A54797A0D334B0B16536@cable.comcast.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Xiaoyan,

The requirement draft is still an individual draft. If you don't agree= with some requirements, we can work on it after the WG is form.

Speaking of the content acquisition and metadata, I am a little bit co= nfused by your suggestion. As Ben stated, Req 15 is about "remove/inva= lidation of the content", and Req 51 & 52 relate to add/modify/rem= ove CDNI metadata. Control API will be used to control "the content" in the downstream CDN and Metadata API wil= l be used to control "the Metadata" associated with the content i= n the downstream CDN. As such, Control API will address Req 15 and Metadata= API will address Req 51 & 52. I don't agree we should move the "content acquisition" from Control API to Metadata API.=

Kind regards,

Yiu

From: He Xiaoyan <hexiaoyan@huawei.com>
Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2011 10:27:26 = 3;0800
To: 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk>
Cc: <cdni@ietf.org>
Subject: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4= =F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter

Hi Ben,

In the latest I-D draft"draft-lefaucheur-cdni-requirements-01&q= uot;, Req15 relates not only to content but also metadata. And Req15 is jus= t an example, you could also find that Req 17 also relates to metadata but is putting under the control API = now.

So, I think first consensus is needed on the relations of APIs (cont= rol API and metadata API) and data( metadata and content itself), if you pr= oposed control API is related to content and metadata API relate to the CDNI metadata, that's OK= for me. Then the charter needs to be revised to reflect this, e.g. move th= e "content acquisition" out of the control API and add content ac= quisition description to the metadata API,e.g." In particular, this interface will allow an upstream CDN to add,= remove or invalidate content in a downstream CDN".

Best Regards

Xiaoyan(Susan) He

-----=D3=CA=BC=FE=D4=AD=BC=FE-----
=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Ben Niven-Jenkins [mailto:ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C215=C8=D5 19:48
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan
=B3=AD=CB=CD: 'Francois Le Faucheur'; cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter

On 15 Apr 2011, at 10:40, He Xiaoyan wrote:=

> Hi Francois and all,

>

> Although thinking most content of the current charter is clearl= y and well defined but I still have a question on the description of the CD= Nicontrol interface, hope it is not too late to raise.

>

> In the current charter it says that the CDNi control interface = will allow an upstream CDN to remove or invalidate content in a downstream = CDN. And in the requirement I-D, the Req 15 is to reflect this I believe, there is also Req 51 a= nd Req 52 in metadata API describe actions of addition and mo= dification of objects. Which confused me, In my opinion, actions like remov= al or invalidate objects has no essential difference with addition and modi= fication. They all can be categorized as management actions, right? Why we put some of them under the Cont= rol API while others under the Metadata API?

Requirement 51 & 52 relate to the addition/modification/removal = of the CDNI Metadata associated with the content, not the actual content it= self.

Requirement 15 relates to removal/invalidation of the content itself= .

Ben

_______________________________________________ CDNi mailing list CDNi@ietf.org ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni --_000_C9D21AADCD5Byiuleecablecomcastcom_-- From yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com Mon Apr 18 20:17:06 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06B32E06E3 for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 20:17:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.188 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.188 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=4.822, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_MODEMCABLE=0.768, HOST_EQ_MODEMCABLE=1.368, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-8, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jpaKvP+Fenyh for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 20:17:05 -0700 (PDT) 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hexiaoyan@huawei.com Mon Apr 18 20:42:31 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 65E32E06AA for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 20:42:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 4.047 X-Spam-Level: **** X-Spam-Status: No, score=4.047 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=2.466, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Dw1s5hlCKxrg for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 20:42:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from szxga04-in.huawei.com (szxga04-in.huawei.com [119.145.14.67]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC4BAE0696 for ; Mon, 18 Apr 2011 20:42:29 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (szxga04-in [172.24.2.12]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJV00LZ2RMSM1@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:42:29 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJV00LOURMSLH@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:42:28 +0800 (CST) Received: from w36710x ([10.144.113.87]) by szxml04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LJV00AN2RMSD4@szxml04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:42:28 +0800 (CST) Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:42:28 +0800 From: He Xiaoyan In-reply-to: To: "'Lee, Yiu'" , 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' Message-id: <000801cbfe43$ce2eab20$5771900a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3664 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_urS/dsKA8eW02Aze3depEw)" Thread-index: AQHL/kA67voA8NwfB0OGorBY0UkHppRkiCTw Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogtPC4tDogILTwuLQ6ICC08Li0OiAgVXBkYXRl?= =?gb2312?b?ZCB2ZXJzaW9uIG9mIHRoZSBDRE5JIGNoYXJ0ZXI=?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 03:42:31 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_urS/dsKA8eW02Aze3depEw) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Yiu, IMO, content acquisition is equivalent to add or inject the content = which means pre-position or dynamic acquisition alternatives in technique = words. We=A1=AFve already have some description of content acquisition in the = charter. What=A1=AFs your thought on the difference of =A1=B0content = acquisition=A1=B1 and =A1=B1add or inject a content=A1=B1?=20 =20 Best Regards Xiaoyan(Susan) He _____ =20 =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Lee, Yiu [mailto:Yiu_Lee@Cable.Comcast.com]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C219=C8=D5 11:17 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan; 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' =B3=AD=CB=CD: cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: = Updated version of the CDNI charter =20 Hi Xiaoyan, =20 IMHO why we only explicitly mention removal and invalidate of the = content because there is a business requirement to remove a content. However, = there is no business requirement to add or inject the content. When we design = the content API, I think it is natural to define an API to ask the dCDN to = add a content, however, the dCDN can reject it if it dodsn't want to add it. = For removal, the dCDN must honor it due to business (legal) requirement. = This is why only removal was listed in the charter. =20 Does this make sense to you? =20 Kind regards, Yiu =20 From: He Xiaoyan Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:09:02 +0800 To: Microsoft Office User , 'Ben = Niven-Jenkins' Cc: Subject: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated = version of the CDNI charter =20 My comment is control of a content not only includes removal and = invalidate, it should also includes ingesting/adding a content? Why we exclude = adding the content but emphasize removal and invalidate in control API in the charter? Then where is the description of adding a content (if content acquisition under metadata API in not equivalent to adding a content)? Thanks for your clarification. --Boundary_(ID_urS/dsKA8eW02Aze3depEw) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Hi = Yiu,

IMO, content = acquisition is equivalent to add or inject the content which means pre-position or = dynamic acquisition alternatives in technique words. We=A1=AFve already = have some description of content acquisition in the = charter.

What=A1=AFs your = thought on the difference of =A1=B0content acquisition=A1=B1 and =A1=B1add or inject a = content=A1=B1?

<= /span>

Best Regards

Xiaoyan(Susan) = He

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Lee, Yiu [mailto:Yiu_Lee@Cable.Comcast.com]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C219=C8=D5 11:17
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan; 'Ben Niven-Jenkins'
=B3=AD=CB=CD: cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] = =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI = charter

Hi = Xiaoyan,

IMHO why we = only explicitly mention removal and invalidate of the content because there = is a business requirement to remove a content. However, there is no business requirement to add or inject the content. When we design the content = API, I think it is natural to define an API to ask the dCDN to add a content, = however, the dCDN can reject it if it dodsn't want to add it. For removal, the dCDN = must honor it due to business (legal) requirement. This is why only removal = was listed in the charter.

Does this = make sense to you?

Kind = regards,

Yiu=

From: He Xiaoyan <hexiaoyan@huawei.com>
Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 = 11:09:02 +0800
To: Microsoft Office User = <yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com&g= t;, 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk> Cc: <cdni@ietf.org>
Subject: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI = charter

My comment is control = of a content not only includes removal and invalidate, it should also = includes ingesting/adding a content? Why we exclude adding the content but emphasize removal and invalidate in control API in the charter? Then = where is the description of adding a content (if content acquisition under = metadata API in not equivalent to adding a content)?

Thanks for your = clarification.

--Boundary_(ID_urS/dsKA8eW02Aze3depEw)-- From yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com Tue Apr 19 06:24:23 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7D4D5E068E for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 06:24:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -96.049 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-96.049 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-4.247, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_BASE64_TEXT=1.753, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NzLXaZJ9GBjR for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 06:24:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 442E7E0663 for ; 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charset="gb2312" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Xiaoyan,

IMHO, the charter should not be too specific of what method we would s= upport for the CDNI (pre-position vs. dynamic content acquisition). This is= more like an architecture discussion. This is why the charter doesn't ment= ion pre-position or dynamic content acquisition. That said, the charter explicitly mentions we need to support= content removal because this is a strong requirement coming from both Cont= ent Providers and CDN operators to make sure the content must be invalidate= d by request.

Thoughts?

/Yiu

From: He Xiaoyan <hexiaoyan@huawei.com>
Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:42:28 = 3;0800
To: Microsoft Office User <yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com>, = 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' <ben@nive= n-jenkins.co.uk>
Cc: <cdni@ietf.org>
Subject: =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4= : [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter

Hi Yiu,=

IMO,= content acquisition is equivalent to add or inject the content which means= pre-position or dynamicacquisition alternatives in technique words. We=A1=AFve already have some description of cont= ent acquisition in the charter.

What= =A1=AFs your thought on the difference of =A1=B0content acquisition=A1=B1 a= nd =A1=B1add or inject a content=A1=B1?

Best Regards=

Xiaoyan(Susan)= He

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: L= ee, Yiu [mailto:Yiu_Lee@Cable.= Comcast.com]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C219=C8=D5 11:17
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB:<= font size=3D"2"> He Xiaoyan= ; 'Ben Niven-Jenkins'
=B3=AD=CB=CD: cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8= =B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter

Hi Xiaoyan,

IMHO why we only explicitly mention removal and invalidate of the conten= t because there is abusiness requirement to remove a content. However, there is no business requirement to add or inje= ct the content. When we design the content API, I think it is natural to de= fine an API to ask the dCDN to add a content, however, the dCDN can reject = it if it dodsn't want to add it. For removal, the dCDN musthonor it due to business (legal) requirement. Th= is is why only removal was listed in the charter.<= /p>

Does this make sense to you?

Kind regards,

Yiu

From: = He Xiaoyan <hexiaoy= an@huawei.com>
Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:09= :02 +0800
To: Microsoft Office User &l= t;yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com>, 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' <b= en@niven-jenkins.co.uk>
Cc: <cdni@ietf.org>
Subject: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter=

My comment is control of acontent not only includes removal and invalidate, i= t should also includes ingesting/adding a content? Why we exclude add= ing the content but emphasize removal and invalidate in control API in the = charter? Then where is the description of adding a content (if content acquisition under metadata API in not equi= valent to adding a content)?

Thanks for your clarification.

--_000_C9D302BFCDE8yiuleecablecomcastcom_-- From ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk Tue Apr 19 06:44:55 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11727E06E9 for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 06:44:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.269 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.269 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.122, BAYES_00=-2.599, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1, SARE_SUB_ENC_UTF8=0.152, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GkCo+co8H-QJ for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 06:44:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailex.mailcore.me (mailex.mailcore.me [94.136.40.61]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F4CBE068E for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 06:44:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from host1.cachelogic.com ([212.44.43.80] helo=dhcp-108-devlan.cachelogic.com) by mail10.atlas.pipex.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCBEa-0004mj-VH; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 14:44:53 +0100 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1084) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 From: Ben Niven-Jenkins In-Reply-To: <000001cbfe3f$23195a90$5771900a@china.huawei.com> Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 14:44:51 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <000001cbfe3f$23195a90$5771900a@china.huawei.com> To: He Xiaoyan X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) X-Mailcore-Auth: 9600544 X-Mailcore-Domain: 172912 Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: Re: [CDNi] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAg562U5aSNOiAg562U5aSNOiAgVXBkYXRlZCB2?= =?utf-8?q?ersion_of_the_CDNI_charter?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 13:44:55 -0000 On 19 Apr 2011, at 04:09, He Xiaoyan wrote: > I am also OK with the roles of control API and metadata API regarding = the content and metadata as you and Ben stated =93Control API will be = used to control "the content" in the downstream CDN and Metadata API = will be used to control "the Metadata" associated with the content in = the downstream CDN=94. > =20 > My comment is control of a content not only includes removal and = invalidate, it should also includes ingesting/adding a content? No. Look at how the majority of deployed CDNs operate today. Content = acquisition is performed dynamically on demand, it is not "controlled" = directly by an upstream point (Content Provider or in the case of CDNI = an upstream CDN). When a surrogate receives a request for content from a user it retrieves = the metadata associated with that content, validates that it should = deliver the content (e.g. geo-blocking and authorisation policies are = met) and then acquires the content on demand if it is not already = cached. The description of how to acquire the content is part of the = distribution metadata. It is not a specific control request. > Why we exclude adding the content but emphasize removal and = invalidate in control API in the charter? Then where is the description = of adding a content (if content acquisition under metadata API in not = equivalent to adding a content)? > Thanks for your clarification. As I stated during my presentation at the BoF the control interface is = primarily about effecting or reporting state changes in another CDN. When a Content Provider (or upstream CDN) needs a downstream CDN to = invalidate or remove content they need to specifically ask for that = action to occur - i.e. "Can you please invalidate/remove this content". = They would not typically specifically request an acquisition action - = i.e. the acquisition semantic is for the upstream CDN to say "here is = the metadata for the content and it includes how to come and get it when = you need to do that", the semantic is not "Can you come and acquire this = piece of content now". Also remember that content invalidation/removal is a strong requirement = placed on deployed CDNs today and therefore critical to having a = solution that is acceptable to the market. Content pre-positioning is = not. Ben From lpeterson@verivue.com Tue Apr 19 11:32:39 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1998CE0755 for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:32:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xv8BdAXWQ25y for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:32:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from exprod8og112.obsmtp.com (exprod8og112.obsmtp.com [64.18.3.24]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DFE2E0700 for ; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:32:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from vvexch.verivue.com ([63.64.170.198]) (using TLSv1) by exprod8ob112.postini.com ([64.18.7.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKTa3VQQA/8bwyZz6YacNtgVh9qmExtcPF@postini.com; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:32:34 PDT Received: from vvexch.verivue.com ([10.10.6.20]) by vvexch.verivue.com ([10.10.6.20]) with mapi; Tue, 19 Apr 2011 14:32:32 -0400 From: "Peterson, Larry" To: "cdni@ietf.org" Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 14:32:30 -0400 Thread-Topic: new Internet Draft Thread-Index: Acv+wCTyxRA1YJ7ORsKgdLt613Ztdw== Message-ID: <73B09441-5D82-4CA6-B665-1F7072D654BF@verivue.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [CDNi] new Internet Draft X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 18:32:39 -0000 Dear all, =20 We have posted a new I-D, available at http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-peterson-cdni-strawman-00 It presents a strawman for CDN interconnection,=20 and is meant to spur discussion. Looking forward to your feedback. Larry From hexiaoyan@huawei.com Wed Apr 20 00:26:04 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61137E078F for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 00:26:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 3.581 X-Spam-Level: *** X-Spam-Status: No, score=3.581 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.946, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, CN_BODY_35=0.339, J_CHICKENPOX_52=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2PE7XAf+hjoE for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 00:26:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from szxga04-in.huawei.com (szxga04-in.huawei.com [119.145.14.67]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62B9BE0778 for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 00:26:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (szxga04-in [172.24.2.12]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJX00GPBWND9M@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:26:02 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJX00FGSWNDZY@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:26:01 +0800 (CST) Received: from w36710x ([10.144.113.87]) by szxml04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LJX00A99WNDK9@szxml04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:26:01 +0800 (CST) Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:26:03 +0800 From: He Xiaoyan In-reply-to: To: 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' Message-id: <000401cbff2c$34cb3e50$5771900a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3664 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Thread-index: Acv+l/tPK1+7da5/RNOD0bZT9xLatQAiveuA Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogtPC4tDogILTwuLQ6ICC08Li0OiAgVXBkYXRl?= =?gb2312?b?ZCB2ZXJzaW9uIG9mIHRoZSBDRE5JIGNoYXJ0ZXI=?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 07:26:04 -0000 Hi Ben, I do not have any strong position on content pre-position, I agree that whether to support it in CDNi is up to the operators. I think our opinion diverge from each other on which API should link to = the dynamic content acquisition request. IMO, when cache miss occurred in a downstream CDN, the request of it send to the upstream CDN to know where = and how to obtain the content is an implementation of content = acquisition(pull model) ,this is relevant to content not metadata, hence,It should be put under the control API (relevant to content) not metadata API. Dynamic content acquisition request, and other content management requests(removal, invalidation, distribution status report etc) should = all implement in one API, split them to two different APIs will make Control = API incomplete(lack of content acquisition request)=A3=AC meanwhile will = make Metadata API intertwined(involved both content acquisition request, and other metadata distribution request). Whether to put dynamic content acquisition request under control API is = not a strong opinion. However, IMO, it would make metadata and control API = more clear from functionality definition.=20 Best Regards Xiaoyan(Susan) He -----=D3=CA=BC=FE=D4=AD=BC=FE----- =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Ben Niven-Jenkins [mailto:ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C219=C8=D5 21:45 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan =B3=AD=CB=CD: 'Lee, Yiu'; cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: = Updated version of the CDNI charter On 19 Apr 2011, at 04:09, He Xiaoyan wrote: > I am also OK with the roles of control API and metadata API regarding = the content and metadata as you and Ben stated =A1=B0Control API will be = used to control "the content" in the downstream CDN and Metadata API will be = used to control "the Metadata" associated with the content in the downstream = CDN=A1=B1. > =20 > My comment is control of a content not only includes removal and invalidate, it should also includes ingesting/adding a content? No. Look at how the majority of deployed CDNs operate today. Content acquisition is performed dynamically on demand, it is not "controlled" directly by an upstream point (Content Provider or in the case of CDNI = an upstream CDN). When a surrogate receives a request for content from a user it retrieves = the metadata associated with that content, validates that it should deliver = the content (e.g. geo-blocking and authorisation policies are met) and then acquires the content on demand if it is not already cached. The = description of how to acquire the content is part of the distribution metadata. It = is not a specific control request. > Why we exclude adding the content but emphasize removal and = invalidate in control API in the charter? Then where is the description of adding a content (if content acquisition under metadata API in not equivalent to adding a content)? > Thanks for your clarification. As I stated during my presentation at the BoF the control interface is primarily about effecting or reporting state changes in another CDN. When a Content Provider (or upstream CDN) needs a downstream CDN to invalidate or remove content they need to specifically ask for that = action to occur - i.e. "Can you please invalidate/remove this content". They = would not typically specifically request an acquisition action - i.e. the acquisition semantic is for the upstream CDN to say "here is the = metadata for the content and it includes how to come and get it when you need to = do that", the semantic is not "Can you come and acquire this piece of = content now". Also remember that content invalidation/removal is a strong requirement placed on deployed CDNs today and therefore critical to having a = solution that is acceptable to the market. Content pre-positioning is not. Ben From hexiaoyan@huawei.com Wed Apr 20 00:32:59 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CCDBE077E for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 00:32:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 3.23 X-Spam-Level: *** X-Spam-Status: No, score=3.23 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.648, BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HTML_FONT_FACE_BAD=0.884, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_NONELEMENT_30_40=0.001, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, MIME_CHARSET_FARAWAY=2.45, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, SARE_SUB_ENC_GB2312=1.345] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jloS45M4kP9z for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 00:32:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from szxga04-in.huawei.com (szxga04-in.huawei.com [119.145.14.67]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A44BE06CC for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 00:32:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from huawei.com (szxga04-in [172.24.2.12]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJX00A5CWU0IV@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:30:00 +0800 (CST) Received: from huawei.com ([172.24.2.119]) by szxga04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTP id <0LJX00AN9WU0R8@szxga04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:30:00 +0800 (CST) Received: from w36710x ([10.144.113.87]) by szxml04-in.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 2.14 (built Aug 8 2006)) with ESMTPA id <0LJX00BKFWTZ3Y@szxml04-in.huawei.com> for cdni@ietf.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:30:00 +0800 (CST) Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 15:30:02 +0800 From: He Xiaoyan In-reply-to: To: "'Lee, Yiu'" , 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' Message-id: <000501cbff2c$c33ab6c0$5771900a@china.huawei.com> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3664 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_yzR4sCTgZw14F0WepZFHEQ)" Thread-index: AQHL/pUPADcjhUBZuES3JZO3dsxlVZRmW2gA Cc: cdni@ietf.org Subject: [CDNi] =?gb2312?b?tPC4tDogtPC4tDogILTwuLQ6ICC08Li0OiAgtPC4tDog?= =?gb2312?b?IFVwZGF0ZWQgdmVyc2lvbiBvZiB0aGUgQ0ROSSBjaGFydGVy?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 07:32:59 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_yzR4sCTgZw14F0WepZFHEQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Yiu, Please see my response to Ben in another e-mail.=20 =20 Best Regards Xiaoyan(Susan) He _____ =20 =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Lee, Yiu [mailto:Yiu_Lee@Cable.Comcast.com]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C219=C8=D5 21:24 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan; 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' =B3=AD=CB=CD: cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter =20 Hi Xiaoyan, =20 IMHO, the charter should not be too specific of what method we would = support for the CDNI (pre-position vs. dynamic content acquisition). This is = more like an architecture discussion. This is why the charter doesn't mention pre-position or dynamic content acquisition. That said, the charter explicitly mentions we need to support content removal because this is a strong requirement coming from both Content Providers and CDN operators = to make sure the content must be invalidated by request. =20 Thoughts? /Yiu =20 From: He Xiaoyan Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:42:28 +0800 To: Microsoft Office User , 'Ben = Niven-Jenkins' Cc: Subject: =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: = Updated version of the CDNI charter =20 Hi Yiu, IMO, content acquisition is equivalent to add or inject the content = which means pre-position or dynamicacquisition alternatives in technique = words. We=A1=AFve already have some description of content acquisition in the = charter. What=A1=AFs your thought on the difference of =A1=B0content = acquisition=A1=B1 and =A1=B1add or inject a content=A1=B1?=20 =20 Best Regards Xiaoyan(Susan) He _____ =20 =B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Lee, Yiu [mailto:Yiu_Lee@Cable.Comcast.com]=20 =B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C219=C8=D5 11:17 =CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan; 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' =B3=AD=CB=CD: cdni@ietf.org =D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: = Updated version of the CDNI charter =20 Hi Xiaoyan, =20 IMHO why we only explicitly mention removal and invalidate of the = content because there is abusiness requirement to remove a content. However, = there is no business requirement to add or inject the content. When we design = the content API, I think it is natural to define an API to ask the dCDN to = add a content, however, the dCDN can reject it if it dodsn't want to add it. = For removal, the dCDN musthonor it due to business (legal) requirement. This = is why only removal was listed in the charter. =20 Does this make sense to you? =20 Kind regards, Yiu =20 From: He Xiaoyan Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 11:09:02 +0800 To: Microsoft Office User , 'Ben = Niven-Jenkins' Cc: Subject: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated = version of the CDNI charter =20 My comment is control of acontent not only includes removal and = invalidate, it should also includes ingesting/adding a content? Why we exclude = adding the content but emphasize removal and invalidate in control API in the charter? Then where is the description of adding a content (if content acquisition under metadata API in not equivalent to adding a content)? Thanks for your clarification. --Boundary_(ID_yzR4sCTgZw14F0WepZFHEQ) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Hi = Yiu,

Please see my = response to Ben in another e-mail.

<= /span>

Best Regards

Xiaoyan(Susan) = He

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Lee, Yiu [mailto:Yiu_Lee@Cable.Comcast.com]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C219=C8=D5 21:24
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan; 'Ben Niven-Jenkins'
=B3=AD=CB=CD: cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8=B4: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter

Hi = Xiaoyan,

IMHO, the = charter should not be too specific of what method we would support for the CDNI (pre-position vs. dynamic content acquisition). This is more like an architecture discussion. This is why the charter doesn't mention = pre-position or dynamic content acquisition. That said, the charter explicitly = mentions we need to support content removal because this is a strong requirement = coming from both Content Providers and CDN operators to make sure the content = must be invalidated by request.

Thoughts?=

/Yiu

From: He Xiaoyan <hexiaoyan@huawei.com>
Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 = 11:42:28 +0800
To: Microsoft Office User = <yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com&g= t;, 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk> Cc: <cdni@ietf.org>
Subject: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter

Hi = Yiu,

IMO, content = acquisition is equivalent to add or inject the content which means pre-position or dynamicacquisition alternatives in technique words. We=A1=AFve = already have some description of content acquisition in the = charter.

What=A1=AFs your = thought on the difference of =A1=B0content acquisition=A1=B1 and =A1=B1add or inject a = content=A1=B1?

Best Regards

Xiaoyan(Susan) = He

=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Lee, Yiu [mailto:Yiu_Lee@Cable.Comcast.co= m]
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2011=C4=EA4=D4=C219=C8=D5 11:17
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: He Xiaoyan; 'Ben Niven-Jenkins'
=B3=AD=CB=CD: cdni@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: Re: =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI charter

Hi Xiaoyan,

IMHO why we = only explicitly mention removal and invalidate of the content because there = is abusiness requirement to remove a content. However, there is no business requirement to add or inject the content. When we design the content = API, I think it is natural to define an API to ask the dCDN to add a content, = however, the dCDN can reject it if it dodsn't want to add it. For removal, the = dCDN musthonor it due to business (legal) requirement. This is why only = removal was listed in the charter.

Does this = make sense to you?

Kind = regards,

Yiu

From: He Xiaoyan <hexiaoyan@huawei.com>
Date: Tue, 19 Apr 2011 = 11:09:02 +0800
To: Microsoft Office User = <yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com&g= t;, 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk> Cc: <cdni@ietf.org>
Subject: = =B4=F0=B8=B4: [CDNi] =B4=F0=B8=B4: =B4=F0=B8=B4: Updated version of the CDNI = charter

My comment is control = of acontent not only includes removal and invalidate, it should also = includes ingesting/adding a content? Why we exclude adding the content but emphasize removal and invalidate in control API in the charter? Then = where is the description of adding a content (if content acquisition under = metadata API in not equivalent to adding a content)?=

Thanks for your = clarification.

--Boundary_(ID_yzR4sCTgZw14F0WepZFHEQ)-- From yiu_lee@cable.comcast.com Wed Apr 20 06:19:42 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Delivered-To: cdni@ietfc.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 252F8E06D9 for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 06:19:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -98.235 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-98.235 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, HELO_MISMATCH_COM=0.553, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([208.66.40.236]) by localhost (ietfc.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GfS5qOcSSdlz for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 06:19:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from cable.comcast.com (copdcimo01.potomac.co.ndcwest.comcast.net [76.96.32.251]) by ietfc.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A802E06AD for ; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 06:19:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ([24.40.55.40]) by copdcimo01.cable.comcast.com with ESMTP with TLS id 5503630.34799706; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 07:22:45 -0600 Received: from PACDCEXMB05.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::a5b0:e5c4:df1b:2367]) by pacdcexhub03.cable.comcast.com ([fe80::d1dd:b302:b617:3755%12]) with mapi id 14.01.0289.001; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 09:19:23 -0400 From: "Lee, Yiu" To: He Xiaoyan , 'Ben Niven-Jenkins' Thread-Topic: =?big5?B?tarOYDogILWqzmA6IFtDRE5pXSC1qs5gOiAgtarOYDogIFVwZGF0ZWQgdmVyc2lv?= =?big5?Q?n_of_the_CDNI_charter?= Thread-Index: AQHL/12Q298RXCKHnUeeGSDpzkeX8Q== Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:19:22 +0000 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <000401cbff2c$34cb3e50$5771900a@china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/14.2.0.101115 x-originating-ip: [68.82.28.202] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="big5" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [CDNi] =?big5?b?tarOYDogILWqzmA6ICC1qs5gOiAgtarOYDogIFVwZGF0ZWQg?= =?big5?b?dmVyc2lvbiBvZiB0aGUgQ0ROSSBjaGFydGVy?= X-BeenThere: cdni@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "This list is to discuss issues associated with the Interconnection of Content Delivery Networks $CDNs$" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:19:42 -0000 SGkgWGlhb3lhbiwNCg0KSSB0aGluayB0aGlzIGlzIHdoZXJlIHdlIGRpdmVyc2UuIFRoZSBjdXJy ZW50IGNoYXJ0ZXIgb25seSBzdGF0ZXMgd2hhdCB0aGUNCldHIG11c3Qgd29yayBvbiwgaXQgYWJz b2x1dGVseSBtYWtlcyBubyBhc3N1bXB0aW9uICJob3ciIHRoZSBBUEkgc2hvdWxkDQpsb29rIGxp a2UuIFdoZW4gd2UgZGV2ZWxvcCB0aGUgcHJvdG9jb2wgYW5kIGRlY2lkZSB0byBoYXZlIGEgc2lu Z2xlIEFQSQ0KZm9yIGFsbCB0aGVzZSBmdW5jdGlvbnMsIGl0IGlzIGZpbmUuIEJ1dCB0aGlzIHNo b3VsZCBub3QgcGFydCBvZiB0aGUNCmNoYXJ0ZXIuDQoNClJlZ2FyZHMsDQovWWl1DQoNCk9uIDQv MjAvMTEgMzoyNiBBTSwgIkhlIFhpYW95YW4iIDxoZXhpYW95YW5AaHVhd2VpLmNvbT4gd3JvdGU6 DQoNCj5BUElzIHdpbGwgbWFrZSBDb250cm9sIEFQSQ0KPmluY29tcGxldGUobGFjayBvZiBjb250 ZW50IGFjcXVpc2l0aW9uIHJlcXVlc3QpoUEgbWVhbndoaWxlIHdpbGwgbWFrZQ0KPk1ldGFkYXRh IEFQSSBpbnRlcnR3aW5lZChpbnZvbHZlZCBib3RoIGNvbnRlbnQgYWNxdWlzaXRpb24gcmVxdWVz dCwgYW5kDQo+b3RoZXIgbWV0YWRhdGEgZGlzdHJpYnV0aW9uIHJlcXVlc3QpLg0KDQo=