
From nobody Mon Apr  4 05:01:53 2016
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Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Logging Interface
        Authors         : Francois Le Faucheur
                          Gilles Bertrand
                          Iuniana Oprescu
                          Roy Peterkofsky
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24.txt
	Pages           : 58
	Date            : 2016-04-04

Abstract:
   This memo specifies the Logging interface between a downstream CDN
   (dCDN) and an upstream CDN (uCDN) that are interconnected as per the
   CDN Interconnection (CDNI) framework.  First, it describes a
   reference model for CDNI logging.  Then, it specifies the CDNI
   Logging File format and the actual protocol for exchange of CDNI
   Logging Files.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-logging/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24


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Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-13.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics
        Authors         : Jan Seedorf
                          Jon Peterson
                          Stefano Previdi
                          Ray van Brandenburg
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-13.txt
	Pages           : 22
	Date            : 2016-04-04

Abstract:
   This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
   interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
   "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
   document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
   further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
   for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
   registries can be extended in the future.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-13

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-13


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics
        Authors         : Jan Seedorf
                          Jon Peterson
                          Stefano Previdi
                          Ray van Brandenburg
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-14.txt
	Pages           : 22
	Date            : 2016-04-04

Abstract:
   This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
   interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
   "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
   document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
   further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
   for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
   registries can be extended in the future.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-14

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-14


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Mon Apr  4 09:47:55 2016
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-14.txt
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Cc: "ops-dir@ietf.org" <ops-dir@ietf.org>, "secdir@ietf.org" <secdir@ietf.org>, Jouni <jouni.nospam@gmail.com>, Rick Casarez <rick.casarez@gmail.com>, "Brian Weis \(bew\)" <bew@cisco.com>, "gen-art@ietf.org \(gen-art@ietf.org\)" <gen-art@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-14.txt
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Hi All,

  This latest version addresses secdir, genart, and opsdir comments.

thanx!

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CDNi [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-
> drafts@ietf.org
> Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 12:46 PM
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-14.txt
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio=
n
> of the IETF.
>=20
>         Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilitie=
s
> Semantics
>         Authors         : Jan Seedorf
>                           Jon Peterson
>                           Stefano Previdi
>                           Ray van Brandenburg
>                           Kevin J. Ma
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-
> 14.txt
> 	Pages           : 22
> 	Date            : 2016-04-04
>=20
> Abstract:
>    This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
>    interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
>    "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
>    document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
>    further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
>    for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
>    registries can be extended in the future.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-14
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilitie=
s-
> semantics-14
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
> submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> CDNi mailing list
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Date: Mon, 4 Apr 2016 16:04:34 -0300
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To: Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>
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Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/cdni/3UsNLqbNDVgFNOpsqvRSNfjaY5g>
Cc: "<cdni@ietf.org>" <cdni@ietf.org>, "cdni-chairs@ietf.org" <cdni-chairs@ietf.org>, Francois Le Faucheur <flefauch@gmail.com>, IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-23: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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Hi, Alissa,

On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 3:06 PM, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in> wrote:

>
> On Mar 31, 2016, at 11:00 AM, Francois Le Faucheur <flefauch@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> I will post a new version with all the agreed text as soon as posting
> reopens.
>
>
> Great. I=E2=80=99ll update my ballot when it gets posted.
>

I've read through this version (-24) and am ready to send the approval
e-mail when you clear.

And I echo Francois's thanks.

Spencer


> Alissa
>
>
> Thanks a lot for working with us.
>
> Francois
>
>
> On 31 Mar 2016, at 19:58, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in> wrote:
>
>
> On Mar 31, 2016, at 10:51 AM, Francois Le Faucheur <flefauch@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> On 31 Mar 2016, at 19:43, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in> wrote:
>
>
> On Mar 31, 2016, at 10:26 AM, Francois Le Faucheur <flefauch@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> Hi Alissa,
>
> Thanks for updating your Discuss to Abstain.
>
>
> As several ADs have pointed out to me offline, it turns out abstain
> doesn=E2=80=99t help you, you need one more yes or no-objection.
>
>
> Right.
>
> So let=E2=80=99s see if I can get there.
>
>
> It may be a moot point now, but just for the record:
>
>
>
>
> Maybe I wasn=E2=80=99t clear in articulating my point. The spec clearly s=
upports
> the ability for the dCDN to decide to send logs about an aggregate of
> clients. That isn=E2=80=99t =E2=80=9Ctelling a content provider=E2=80=9D =
what to log or not, but it
> is providing support for a dCDN to not report a piece of data that would
> have been delivered to the content provider if there were no CDN. If that
> is the point of specifying c-groupid the way that it is specified =E2=80=
=94
> including normative recommendations clearly designed to ensure that the
> c-groupid does indeed identify an aggregate and not a single client =E2=
=80=94 then
> it seems to me to undermine the whole point of providing an identifier fo=
r
> an aggregate if the dCDN then includes a bunch of header fields that
> identify an individual client. The spec shouldn=E2=80=99t pretend to supp=
ort
> provision for some protections that it actually doesn=E2=80=99t provide g=
iven the
> way it=E2=80=99s expected to be implemented. I think at a minimum the dra=
ft needs
> to point this out in the paragraph Francois quoted. Personally I don=E2=
=80=99t
> think making the recommendations in the text about cookies normative give=
s
> anyone a fuzzier feeling than the text does as-is, but I=E2=80=99m not go=
ing to say
> that it=E2=80=99s not worth holding up the document over.
>
>
> Double negations sometimes get me, but I think you meant:
> "but I=E2=80=99m not going to say that it=E2=80=99s worth holding up the =
document over =E2=80=9C,
> right?
>
>
> Sorry for that, writing too quickly. Let=E2=80=99s see if making a concre=
te
> suggestion will help.
>
> I feel that we shouldn=E2=80=99t specify features that give the pretense =
of
> privacy protection but don=E2=80=99t actually provide it, without at leas=
t making
> that clear. So here is what I would suggest after the paragraph about
> cookies:
>
> "Furthermore, implementers making use of c-groupid to identify an
> aggregate of clients rather than individual clients should realize that b=
y
> logging certain header fields they may create the possibility to
> re-identify individual clients. In these cases heeding the above advice, =
or
> not logging header fields at all, is particularly important if the goal i=
s
> to provide logs that do not identify individual clients.=E2=80=9D
>
>
> I am fine with that extra text.
>
> Just two minor editorials:
> * I would just propose to replace =E2=80=9Cimplementers=E2=80=9D by =E2=
=80=9CCDNs=E2=80=9D in your text
> above because in the document =E2=80=9Cimplementations=E2=80=9D refer to =
software
> supporting the functionality , while the folks deploying the
> software/functionality are referred to as the =E2=80=9CCDNs=E2=80=9D. Is =
that OK?
> * I would propose to replace =E2=80=9Cshould realize=E2=80=9D by =E2=80=
=9Cought to realize"
> All good?
>
>
> WFM
>
>
> Thanks for providing a specific suggestion.
>
> Francois
>
>
>
> Alissa
>
>
>
>
>
> I did not demand any edits. I asked a question because the text isn=E2=80=
=99t
> clear. I don=E2=80=99t care if the standard is MUST use TLS (which means =
all the
> time) or SHOULD use TLS (which means sometimes). =E2=80=9CMUST use TLS so=
metimes=E2=80=9D
> is not a legitimate choice. This is relevant for the IESG to comment on
> because MUST means something specific everywhere we use it, not just in
> this document, and I=E2=80=99d rather not establish a precedent that MUST=
 means
> =E2=80=9Cuse it sometimes.=E2=80=9D
>
>
> As discussed, the text was not intended to say =E2=80=9Cuse it sometimes=
=E2=80=9D but
> rather =E2=80=9Cunder such circumstances, it MUST be used=E2=80=9D which =
I believe is a
> perfectly IESG-friendly way to use =E2=80=9CMUST=E2=80=9D  8^). I think t=
he updated text
> reflects that more clearly now.
>
> Thanks again for working fast with us to resolution.
>
> Francois
>
>
>
> Alissa
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> COMMENT:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> (1) Per my first DISCUSS point above, I wonder if it makes sense to
> specify a field where the dCDN could report a sanitized version of the
> client User-Agent string. This would allow a uCDN to calculate the
> "terminal type" KPI listed in 2.2.5.5.2 without requiring full,
> potentially identifying User-Agent strings to be logged.
>
>
> I see the idea.
> But I think there are several fields which may contain user identifying
> information.
> So how about we add a statement following the text provided by Stephen to
> the effect that when fields (e.g. User Agent) contain user-identifying
> information they SHOULD be sanitised to remove the sensitive information
> while keeping non-sensitive information (e.g. terminal type) and that the
> sanitisation is to be agreed upon by uCDN and dCDN.
>
>
> Which assumes the uCDN & dCDN are in a position to know which fields
> contains sensitive information and which do not, which in the general cas=
e
> neither the uCDN or dCDN are in a position to know.
>
> (2) I think the use of partial-time in 3.4.1 means that the timestamps
> have no time zone information. It's not clear to me how the uCDN uses
> these timestamps in an absolute sense anyway, but I'm wondering if that
> could create problems if the uCDN does not know what time zone the dCDN
> is in. The time information in that case is somewhat meaningless if the
> uCDN needs to know the actual time at which something occurred.
>
>
> I think this is a problem. We could either move to full-time, or stick
> with partial-time but specify that time is always expressed in GMT. I wil=
l
> poll the list on that.
>
>
> My vote is for partial-time expressed in UTC.
>
> Ben
>
>
>
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Hi, Alissa,<div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gm=
ail_quote">On Thu, Mar 31, 2016 at 3:06 PM, Alissa Cooper <span dir=3D"ltr"=
>&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:alissa@cooperw.in" target=3D"_blank">alissa@cooperw.=
in</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"marg=
in:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div style=3D"wo=
rd-wrap:break-word"><br><div><span class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite"><di=
v>On Mar 31, 2016, at 11:00 AM, Francois Le Faucheur &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
flefauch@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">flefauch@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</di=
v><br><div><div style=3D"word-wrap:break-word">I will post a new version wi=
th all the agreed text as soon as posting reopens.</div></div></blockquote>=
<div><br></div></span><div>Great. I=E2=80=99ll update my ballot when it get=
s posted.</div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I&#39;ve read t=
hrough this version (-24) and am ready to send the approval e-mail when you=
 clear.</div><div><br></div><div>And I echo Francois&#39;s thanks.</div><di=
v><br></div><div>Spencer</div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_q=
uote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1e=
x"><div style=3D"word-wrap:break-word"><div><div><span style=3D"color:rgb(1=
36,136,136)">Alissa</span></div><div><div class=3D"h5"><br><blockquote type=
=3D"cite"><div><div style=3D"word-wrap:break-word"><div><br></div><div>Than=
ks a lot for working with us.</div><div><br></div><div>Francois<br><div><br=
></div><div><br><div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>On 31 Mar 2016, at 19:5=
8, Alissa Cooper &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:alissa@cooperw.in" target=3D"_blank"=
>alissa@cooperw.in</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br><div><div style=3D"word-wrap:bre=
ak-word"><br><div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>On Mar 31, 2016, at 10:51 =
AM, Francois Le Faucheur &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:flefauch@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">flefauch@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</div><br><div><blockquote typ=
e=3D"cite" style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;=
font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:sta=
rt;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"=
><br>On 31 Mar 2016, at 19:43, Alissa Cooper &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:alissa@c=
ooperw.in" target=3D"_blank">alissa@cooperw.in</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br><br><b=
lockquote type=3D"cite">On Mar 31, 2016, at 10:26 AM, Francois Le Faucheur =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:flefauch@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">flefauch@gmail.=
com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br>Hi Alissa,<br><br>Thanks for updating your Discus=
s to Abstain.<br></blockquote><br>As several ADs have pointed out to me off=
line, it turns out abstain doesn=E2=80=99t help you, you need one more yes =
or no-objection.<br></blockquote><br style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-si=
ze:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spa=
cing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-spac=
e:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:1=
2px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing=
:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:no=
rmal;word-spacing:0px;float:none;display:inline!important">Right.</span><br=
 style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-varia=
nt:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-in=
dent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><br style=
=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:nor=
mal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0=
px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><blockquote typ=
e=3D"cite" style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;=
font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:sta=
rt;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"=
>So let=E2=80=99s see if I can get there.<br><br><blockquote type=3D"cite">=
<br>It may be a moot point now, but just for the record:<br><br><blockquote=
 type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite"><br><br></blockquote><br>Maybe I w=
asn=E2=80=99t clear in articulating my point. The spec clearly supports the=
 ability for the dCDN to decide to send logs about an aggregate of clients.=
 That isn=E2=80=99t =E2=80=9Ctelling a content provider=E2=80=9D what to lo=
g or not, but it is providing support for a dCDN to not report a piece of d=
ata that would have been delivered to the content provider if there were no=
 CDN. If that is the point of specifying c-groupid the way that it is speci=
fied =E2=80=94 including normative recommendations clearly designed to ensu=
re that the c-groupid does indeed identify an aggregate and not a single cl=
ient =E2=80=94 then it seems to me to undermine the whole point of providin=
g an identifier for an aggregate if the dCDN then includes a bunch of heade=
r fields that identify an individual client. The spec shouldn=E2=80=99t pre=
tend to support provision for some protections that it actually doesn=E2=80=
=99t provide given the way it=E2=80=99s expected to be implemented. I think=
 at a minimum the draft needs to point this out in the paragraph Francois q=
uoted. Personally I don=E2=80=99t think making the recommendations in the t=
ext about cookies normative gives anyone a fuzzier feeling than the text do=
es as-is, but I=E2=80=99m not going to say that it=E2=80=99s not worth hold=
ing up the document over.<span>=C2=A0</span><br></blockquote><br>Double neg=
ations sometimes get me, but I think you meant:<br>&quot;but I=E2=80=99m no=
t going to say that it=E2=80=99s worth holding up the document over =E2=80=
=9C, right?<br></blockquote><br>Sorry for that, writing too quickly. Let=E2=
=80=99s see if making a concrete suggestion will help.<br><br>I feel that w=
e shouldn=E2=80=99t specify features that give the pretense of privacy prot=
ection but don=E2=80=99t actually provide it, without at least making that =
clear. So here is what I would suggest after the paragraph about cookies:<b=
r><br>&quot;Furthermore, implementers making use of c-groupid to identify a=
n aggregate of clients rather than individual clients should realize that b=
y logging certain header fields they may create the possibility to re-ident=
ify individual clients. In these cases heeding the above advice, or not log=
ging header fields at all, is particularly important if the goal is to prov=
ide logs that do not identify individual clients.=E2=80=9D<br></blockquote>=
<br style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-va=
riant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text=
-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span =
style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-varian=
t:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-ind=
ent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;float:none;=
display:inline!important">I am fine with that extra text.</span><br style=
=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:nor=
mal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0=
px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><br style=3D"fo=
nt-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;fo=
nt-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;tex=
t-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"font-f=
amily:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-w=
eight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-tr=
ansform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;float:none;display:inline!=
important">Just two minor editorials:</span><br style=3D"font-family:Helvet=
ica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal=
;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none=
;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;=
font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;let=
ter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;whi=
te-space:pre-wrap;word-spacing:0px">	</span><span style=3D"font-family:Helv=
etica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:norm=
al;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:no=
ne;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;float:none;display:inline!important"=
>* I would just propose to replace =E2=80=9Cimplementers=E2=80=9D by =E2=80=
=9CCDNs=E2=80=9D in your text above because in the document =E2=80=9Cimplem=
entations=E2=80=9D refer to software supporting the functionality , while t=
he folks deploying the software/functionality are referred to as the =E2=80=
=9CCDNs=E2=80=9D. Is that OK?</span><br style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font=
-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-=
spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-s=
pace:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-siz=
e:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spac=
ing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space=
:pre-wrap;word-spacing:0px">	</span><span style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;fo=
nt-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;lette=
r-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white=
-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;float:none;display:inline!important">* I wou=
ld propose to replace =E2=80=9Cshould realize=E2=80=9D by =E2=80=9Cought to=
 realize&quot;</span><br style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font=
-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;=
text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;wor=
d-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-sty=
le:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text=
-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-sp=
acing:0px;float:none;display:inline!important">All good?</span><br style=3D=
"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal=
;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;=
text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"></div></blockquote=
><div><br></div><div>WFM</div><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><br style=
=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:nor=
mal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0=
px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"=
font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;=
font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;t=
ext-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;float:none;display:i=
nline!important">Thanks for providing a specific suggestion.</span><br styl=
e=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:no=
rmal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:=
0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><br style=3D"f=
ont-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;f=
ont-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;te=
xt-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px"><span style=3D"font-=
family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-=
weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-t=
ransform:none;white-space:normal;word-spacing:0px;float:none;display:inline=
!important">Francois</span><br style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12p=
x;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:n=
ormal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:norm=
al;word-spacing:0px"><br style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font=
-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;=
text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;wor=
d-spacing:0px"><br style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size:12px;font-style=
:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spacing:normal;text-a=
lign:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:normal;word-spac=
ing:0px"><blockquote type=3D"cite" style=3D"font-family:Helvetica;font-size=
:12px;font-style:normal;font-variant:normal;font-weight:normal;letter-spaci=
ng:normal;text-align:start;text-indent:0px;text-transform:none;white-space:=
normal;word-spacing:0px"><br>Alissa<br><br><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><b=
r><blockquote type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite"><br></blockquote><br>=
I did not demand any edits. I asked a question because the text isn=E2=80=
=99t clear. I don=E2=80=99t care if the standard is MUST use TLS (which mea=
ns all the time) or SHOULD use TLS (which means sometimes). =E2=80=9CMUST u=
se TLS sometimes=E2=80=9D is not a legitimate choice. This is relevant for =
the IESG to comment on because MUST means something specific everywhere we =
use it, not just in this document, and I=E2=80=99d rather not establish a p=
recedent that MUST means =E2=80=9Cuse it sometimes.=E2=80=9D<br></blockquot=
e><br>As discussed, the text was not intended to say =E2=80=9Cuse it someti=
mes=E2=80=9D but rather =E2=80=9Cunder such circumstances, it MUST be used=
=E2=80=9D which I believe is a perfectly IESG-friendly way to use =E2=80=9C=
MUST=E2=80=9D =C2=A08^). I think the updated text reflects that more clearl=
y now.<br><br>Thanks again for working fast with us to resolution.<br><br>F=
rancois<br><br><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><br>Alissa<br><br><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite">-----=
-----------------------------------------------------------------<br>COMMEN=
T:<br>---------------------------------------------------------------------=
-<br><br>(1) Per my first DISCUSS point above, I wonder if it makes sense t=
o<br>specify a field where the dCDN could report a sanitized version of the=
<br>client User-Agent string. This would allow a uCDN to calculate the<br>&=
quot;terminal type&quot; KPI listed in 2.2.5.5.2 without requiring full,<br=
>potentially identifying User-Agent strings to be logged.<br></blockquote><=
br>I see the idea.<br>But I think there are several fields which may contai=
n user identifying information.<br>So how about we add a statement followin=
g the text provided by Stephen to the effect that when fields (e.g. User Ag=
ent) contain user-identifying information they SHOULD be sanitised to remov=
e the sensitive information while keeping non-sensitive information (e.g. t=
erminal type) and that the sanitisation is to be agreed upon by uCDN and dC=
DN.<br></blockquote><br>Which assumes the uCDN &amp; dCDN are in a position=
 to know which fields contains sensitive information and which do not, whic=
h in the general case neither the uCDN or dCDN are in a position to know.<s=
pan>=C2=A0</span><br><br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><blockquote type=3D"cite=
">(2) I think the use of partial-time in 3.4.1 means that the timestamps<br=
>have no time zone information. It&#39;s not clear to me how the uCDN uses<=
br>these timestamps in an absolute sense anyway, but I&#39;m wondering if t=
hat<br>could create problems if the uCDN does not know what time zone the d=
CDN<br>is in. The time information in that case is somewhat meaningless if =
the<br>uCDN needs to know the actual time at which something occurred.<br><=
/blockquote><br>I think this is a problem. We could either move to full-tim=
e, or stick with partial-time but specify that time is always expressed in =
GMT. I will poll the list on that.<br></blockquote><br>My vote is for parti=
al-time expressed in UTC.<br><br>Ben</blockquote></blockquote></blockquote>=
</blockquote></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div><b=
r></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div><br></div></blockq=
uote></div><br></div></div>

--001a11491bba370d06052fad6655--


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Subject: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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Alissa Cooper has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: No Objection

When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
introductory paragraph, however.)


Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.


The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-logging/



----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for resolving my DISCUSS points.

I will note that I don't think the issue with partial-time has been
completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-time
as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a
time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all
times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to
use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are
probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice is
here.



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>> Great. I=E2=80=99ll update my ballot when it gets posted.
>
> I've read through this version (-24) and am ready to send the approval
> e-mail when you clear.
>
> And I echo Francois's thanks.

And yay!  We're now there: Alissa has moved to No Objection.

b


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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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--001a11474a4600b08d052fafffae
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

Hi, Francois,

On Apr 4, 2016 4:29 PM, "Alissa Cooper" <alissa@cooperw.in> wrote:
>
> Alissa Cooper has entered the following ballot position for
> draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: No Objection
>
> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> introductory paragraph, however.)
>
>
> Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>
>
> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-logging/
>
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> COMMENT:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Thanks for resolving my DISCUSS points.
>
> I will note that I don't think the issue with partial-time has been
> completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-time
> as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a
> time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all
> times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to
> use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are
> probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice is
> here.

Do you need to take a look at this?

And if you do, just let me know. I can ask Amy to move this to Approved, AD
Follow-up, and the ballot positions won't disappear on Wednesday.

Thanks,

Spencer
_______________________________________________
> CDNi mailing list
> CDNi@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

--001a11474a4600b08d052fafffae
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8

<p dir="ltr">Hi, Francois,</p>
<p dir="ltr">On Apr 4, 2016 4:29 PM, &quot;Alissa Cooper&quot; &lt;<a href="mailto:alissa@cooperw.in">alissa@cooperw.in</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Alissa Cooper has entered the following ballot position for<br>
&gt; draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: No Objection<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all<br>
&gt; email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this<br>
&gt; introductory paragraph, however.)<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Please refer to <a href="https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html">https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html</a><br>
&gt; for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:<br>
&gt; <a href="https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-logging/">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-logging/</a><br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; ----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
&gt; COMMENT:<br>
&gt; ----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Thanks for resolving my DISCUSS points.<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; I will note that I don&#39;t think the issue with partial-time has been<br>
&gt; completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-time<br>
&gt; as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a<br>
&gt; time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all<br>
&gt; times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to<br>
&gt; use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are<br>
&gt; probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice is<br>
&gt; here.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Do you need to take a look at this?</p>
<p dir="ltr">And if you do, just let me know. I can ask Amy to move this to Approved, AD Follow-up, and the ballot positions won&#39;t disappear on Wednesday.</p>
<p dir="ltr">Thanks,</p>
<p dir="ltr">Spencer<br>
 _______________________________________________<br>
&gt; CDNi mailing list<br>
&gt; <a href="mailto:CDNi@ietf.org">CDNi@ietf.org</a><br>
&gt; <a href="https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni</a><br>
</p>

--001a11474a4600b08d052fafffae--


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From: "Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch)" <flefauch@cisco.com>
To: Spencer Dawkins at IETF <spencerdawkins.ietf@gmail.com>, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>
Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2016 11:46:05 +0000
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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Subject: [CDNi] Reminder: LURK BOF
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As a reminder, the LURK BOF (Limited Use of Remote Keys) is happening at =
2pm AST in Atlantico C today (Tuesday, 5 April 2016). It is of extreme =
relevance to the CDN and CDNi communities.

PLEASE be there - we need your use cases, experience, and knowledge!

There is even going to be a CDNi use case discussed.

Thanks, and see you there.


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From nobody Tue Apr  5 06:20:45 2016
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Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : URI Signing for CDN Interconnection (CDNI)
        Authors         : Kent Leung
                          Francois Le Faucheur
                          Ray van Brandenburg
                          Bill Downey
                          Michel Fisher
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07.txt
	Pages           : 45
	Date            : 2016-04-05

Abstract:
   This document describes how the concept of URI signing supports the
   content access control requirements of CDNI and proposes a URI
   signing scheme.

   The proposed URI signing method specifies the information needed to
   be included in the URI and the algorithm used to authorize and to
   validate access requests for the content referenced by the URI.  The
   mechanism described can be used both in CDNI and single CDN
   scenarios.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Tue Apr  5 06:47:58 2016
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From: "Brandenburg, R. (Ray) van" <ray.vanbrandenburg@tno.nl>
To: "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: New version of URI Signing draft
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Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2016 13:47:48 +0000
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From nobody Wed Apr  6 14:56:58 2016
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: "Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch)" <flefauch@cisco.com>, "Spencer Dawkins at IETF" <spencerdawkins.ietf@gmail.com>, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>
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Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2016 21:56:45 +0000
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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From: Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm>
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References: <20160404192859.15723.72071.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <CAKKJt-eTxE9F0bjj6Y8uHU3RExoTK-MNpsqM2a8x3VQdLNMSFg@mail.gmail.com> <68E5681C-BEB2-4EB0-AC37-C3C401EC9ACA@cisco.com> <A419F67F880AB2468214E154CB8A556206D70B90@eusaamb103.ericsson.se>
To: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Kevin,

> On 6 Apr 2016, at 18:56, Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com> wrote:
>=20
> Hi Alissa/all,
> =20
>   I agree with Francois; I don't see a problem.
> =20
>   - We tried to match the W3C spec [https://www.w3.org/TR/WD-logfile] as m=
uch as possible, and for time, they do not include a timezone, but state: "A=
ll times are specified in GMT"
> =20
>   - RFCs 2616/7231 support asctime, which does not include a timezone, and=
 RFC7231 simply states: "values in the asctime format are assumed to be in U=
TC.  A sender that generates HTTP-date values from a local clock ought to us=
e NTP ([RFC5905]) or some similar protocol to synchronize its clock to UTC."=
 [https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7231#section-7.1.1.1].=20
> =20
>   - RFC 3339 itself, wrt unqualified local time, says, "MUST use a mechani=
sm that ensures correct synchronization with UTC.  Some suitable mechanisms a=
re: o  Use Network Time Protocol [NTP] to obtain the time in UTC." [https://=
tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#section-4.4], which seems to be along the same l=
ines as RFCs 2616/7231 in assuming that unqualified local time is UTC?
> =20
>   We could change the text from:
>     "the time, expressed in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC),"
>   to:
>     "the time, which MUST be expressed in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC)=
,"
>   if that would make it clearer?

I think that would help.

Alexey,
Incoming AD for CDNI.
> =20
> thanx.
> =20
> --  Kevin J. Ma
> =20
> From: Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch) [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 7:46 AM
> To: Spencer Dawkins at IETF; Alissa Cooper
> Cc: Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch); <cdni@ietf.org>; draft-ietf-cdni-logg=
ing@ietf.org; The IESG; cdni-chairs@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-loggin=
g-24: (with COMMENT)
> =20
> Alissa and all,
> >
> > I will note that I don't think the issue with partial-time has been
> > completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-tim=
e
> > as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a
> > time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all
> > times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to
> > use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are
> > probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice is=

> > here.
> I don=92t quite see the problem here.
> =20
> The cdni-logging :
> * refers to the definition of partial time, which does not have a time zon=
e, which i understand mean that the timezone is undefined in that format and=
 is to be defined by the context (e.g. by a full-time format, or by whatever=
 uses partial-time)
> * states, in the definition of the one field that uses the partial-time fo=
rmat that it is expressed in UTC. ("the time, expressed in Coordinated Unive=
rsal Time (UTC), at which the processing of request completed on the Surroga=
te".)
> =20
> In other words, I don=92t see a contradiction with the definition of RFC33=
39 and I don=92t see any ambiguity.=20
> Am i missing something?
> =20
> Thanks
> =20
> Francois
> =20
> PS: For the record, I will also remind folks that the document used to def=
ine its own time format (in exactly the same way as partial-time but without=
 referring to RFC3339) and as part of the IESG review, an AD recommended we r=
eplace our own definition and instead pointed to RFC3339. And note that (i) t=
here is an explicit preference from the working group to not include timezon=
e information in the format and (ii) the common practice in CDNs is to not h=
ave timezone included (e.g. see existing W3C log format).
> =20
> =20
>=20
>=20
> Do you need to take a look at this?
> And if you do, just let me know. I can ask Amy to move this to Approved, A=
D Follow-up, and the ballot positions won't disappear on Wednesday.
> Thanks,
> Spencer
> _______________________________________________
> > CDNi mailing list
> > CDNi@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni
> =20

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto"><div>Hi Kevin,</div><div><br>On 6 Apr 2016,=
 at 18:56, Kevin Ma J &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com">kevin.j=
.ma@ericsson.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>=


<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8">
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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;">Hi Alissa/all,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;">&nbsp; I agree with Francois; I don't see a problem.<o:p></o=
:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;">&nbsp; - We tried to match the W3C spec [<a href=3D"https://=
www.w3.org/TR/WD-logfile">https://www.w3.org/TR/WD-logfile</a>] as much as p=
ossible, and for time, they do not include a timezone,
 but state: "</span>All times are specified in GMT<span style=3D"font-size:1=
0.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">"<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<pre>&nbsp; - RFCs 2616/7231 support asctime, which does not include a timez=
one, and RFC7231 simply states: "values in the asctime format are assumed to=
 be in UTC.&nbsp; A sender that generates HTTP-date values from a local cloc=
k ought to use NTP ([<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5905" title=3D=
"&quot;Network Time Protocol Version 4: Protocol and Algorithms Specificatio=
n&quot;">RFC5905</a>]) or some similar protocol to synchronize its clock to U=
TC." [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7231#section-7.1.1.1">https:=
//tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7231#section-7.1.1.1</a>]. <o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp; - RFC 3339 itself, wrt unqualified local time, says, "MUST use a=
 mechanism that ensures correct synchronization with UTC.&nbsp; Some suitabl=
e mechanisms are: o&nbsp; Use Network Time Protocol [<a href=3D"https://tool=
s.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#ref-NTP" title=3D"&quot;Network Time Protocol (Versi=
on 3) Specification, Implementation and Analysis&quot;">NTP</a>] to obtain t=
he time in UTC." [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#section-4.4=
">https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#section-4.4</a>], which seems to be al=
ong the same lines as RFCs 2616/7231 in assuming that unqualified local time=
 is UTC?<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp; We could change the text from:<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; "the time, expressed in Coordinated Universal Time (=
UTC),"<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp; to:<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; "the time, which MUST be expressed in Coordinated Un=
iversal Time (UTC),"<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp; if that would make it clearer?</pre></div></div></blockquote><di=
v><br></div>I think that would help.<div><br></div><div>Alexey,</div><div>In=
coming AD for CDNI.<br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div><div class=3D"WordSect=
ion1"><pre><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>thanx.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>--&nbsp; Kevin J. Ma<o:p></o:p></pre>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cou=
rier New&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4=
.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;=
Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-siz=
e:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> Francois Le=
 Faucheur (flefauch) [<a href=3D"mailto:flefauch@cisco.com">mailto:flefauch@=
cisco.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 05, 2016 7:46 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Spencer Dawkins at IETF; Alissa Cooper<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch); &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cdni@ietf.=
org">cdni@ietf.org</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.o=
rg">draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org</a>; The IESG; <a href=3D"mailto:cdni-c=
hairs@ietf.org">cdni-chairs@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-l=
ogging-24: (with COMMENT)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Alissa and all,<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">&gt;<br>
&gt; I will note that I don't think the issue with partial-time has been<br>=

&gt; completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-ti=
me<br>
&gt; as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a<=
br>
&gt; time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all<br=
>
&gt; times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to<=
br>
&gt; use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are<=
br>
&gt; probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice i=
s<br>
&gt; here.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I don=E2=80=99t quite see the problem here.<o:p></o:p=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The cdni-logging :<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">*&nbsp;refers to the definition of partial time, whic=
h does not have a time zone, which i understand mean that the timezone is un=
defined in that format and is to be defined by the context (e.g. by a full-t=
ime format, or by whatever uses partial-time)<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">* states, in the definition of the one field that use=
s the partial-time format that it is expressed in UTC. ("the time, expressed=
 in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC), at which the processing of request com=
pleted on the Surrogate".)<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In other words, I don=E2=80=99t see a contradiction w=
ith the definition of RFC3339 and I don=E2=80=99t see any ambiguity.&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Am i missing something?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Francois<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">PS: For the record, I will also remind folks that the=
 document used to define its own time format (in exactly the same way as par=
tial-time but without referring to RFC3339) and as part of the IESG review, a=
n AD recommended we replace our
 own definition and instead pointed to RFC3339. And note that (i) there is a=
n explicit preference from the working group to not include timezone informa=
tion in the format and (ii) the common practice in CDNs is to not have timez=
one included (e.g. see existing
 W3C log format).<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Do you need to take a look at this?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">And if you do, just let me know. I can ask Amy to move this to Appro=
ved, AD Follow-up, and the ballot positions won't disappear on Wednesday.<o:=
p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-al=
t:auto">Spencer<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
&gt; CDNi mailing list<br>
&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:CDNi@ietf.org">CDNi@ietf.org</a><br>
&gt; <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni">https://www.ietf=
.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
</div>


</div></blockquote></div></body></html>=

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From: "Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch)" <flefauch@cisco.com>
To: Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm>
Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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Hi
I will post a new rev with the proposed change tomorrow unless i hear disag=
reement about that by then.
Thanks
Francois

Sent from my iPhone

On 06 Apr 2016, at 19:07, Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm<mailto:aa=
melnikov@fastmail.fm>> wrote:

Hi Kevin,

On 6 Apr 2016, at 18:56, Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com<mailto:kevin.j=
.ma@ericsson.com>> wrote:

Hi Alissa/all,

  I agree with Francois; I don't see a problem.

  - We tried to match the W3C spec [https://www.w3.org/TR/WD-logfile] as mu=
ch as possible, and for time, they do not include a timezone, but state: "A=
ll times are specified in GMT"


  - RFCs 2616/7231 support asctime, which does not include a timezone, and =
RFC7231 simply states: "values in the asctime format are assumed to be in U=
TC.  A sender that generates HTTP-date values from a local clock ought to u=
se NTP ([RFC5905<https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5905>]) or some similar pro=
tocol to synchronize its clock to UTC." [https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc723=
1#section-7.1.1.1].



  - RFC 3339 itself, wrt unqualified local time, says, "MUST use a mechanis=
m that ensures correct synchronization with UTC.  Some suitable mechanisms =
are: o  Use Network Time Protocol [NTP<https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#=
ref-NTP>] to obtain the time in UTC." [https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#=
section-4.4], which seems to be along the same lines as RFCs 2616/7231 in a=
ssuming that unqualified local time is UTC?



  We could change the text from:

    "the time, expressed in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC),"

  to:

    "the time, which MUST be expressed in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC),=
"

  if that would make it clearer?

I think that would help.

Alexey,
Incoming AD for CDNI.



thanx.



--  Kevin J. Ma

From: Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch) [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com]
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2016 7:46 AM
To: Spencer Dawkins at IETF; Alissa Cooper
Cc: Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch); <cdni@ietf.org<mailto:cdni@ietf.org>>;=
 draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org<mailto:draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org>;=
 The IESG; cdni-chairs@ietf.org<mailto:cdni-chairs@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging=
-24: (with COMMENT)

Alissa and all,
>
> I will note that I don't think the issue with partial-time has been
> completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-time
> as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a
> time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all
> times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to
> use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are
> probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice is
> here.
I don't quite see the problem here.

The cdni-logging :
* refers to the definition of partial time, which does not have a time zone=
, which i understand mean that the timezone is undefined in that format and=
 is to be defined by the context (e.g. by a full-time format, or by whateve=
r uses partial-time)
* states, in the definition of the one field that uses the partial-time for=
mat that it is expressed in UTC. ("the time, expressed in Coordinated Unive=
rsal Time (UTC), at which the processing of request completed on the Surrog=
ate".)

In other words, I don't see a contradiction with the definition of RFC3339 =
and I don't see any ambiguity.
Am i missing something?

Thanks

Francois

PS: For the record, I will also remind folks that the document used to defi=
ne its own time format (in exactly the same way as partial-time but without=
 referring to RFC3339) and as part of the IESG review, an AD recommended we=
 replace our own definition and instead pointed to RFC3339. And note that (=
i) there is an explicit preference from the working group to not include ti=
mezone information in the format and (ii) the common practice in CDNs is to=
 not have timezone included (e.g. see existing W3C log format).




Do you need to take a look at this?
And if you do, just let me know. I can ask Amy to move this to Approved, AD=
 Follow-up, and the ballot positions won't disappear on Wednesday.
Thanks,
Spencer
_______________________________________________
> CDNi mailing list
> CDNi@ietf.org<mailto:CDNi@ietf.org>
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni


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<body dir=3D"auto">
<div>Hi&nbsp;</div>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">I will post a new rev with the proposed chan=
ge tomorrow unless i hear disagreement about that by then.&nbsp;</div>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">Thanks</div>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">Francois<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone</div>
<div><br>
On 06 Apr 2016, at 19:07, Alexey Melnikov &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:aamelnikov@=
fastmail.fm">aamelnikov@fastmail.fm</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div>Hi Kevin,</div>
<div><br>
On 6 Apr 2016, at 18:56, Kevin Ma J &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kevin.j.ma@ericss=
on.com">kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<meta name=3D"Generator" content=3D"Microsoft Word 14 (filtered medium)">
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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">Hi Alissa/all,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">&nbsp; I agree with Francois; I don't see a problem.<o:p><=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">&nbsp; - We tried to match the W3C spec [<a href=3D"https:=
//www.w3.org/TR/WD-logfile">https://www.w3.org/TR/WD-logfile</a>] as much a=
s possible, and for time, they do not include a timezone,
 but state: &quot;</span>All times are specified in GMT<span style=3D"font-=
size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">&quot;<o:p></o:p></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<pre>&nbsp; - RFCs 2616/7231 support asctime, which does not include a time=
zone, and RFC7231 simply states: &quot;values in the asctime format are ass=
umed to be in UTC.&nbsp; A sender that generates HTTP-date values from a lo=
cal clock ought to use NTP ([<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5905=
" title=3D"&quot;Network Time Protocol Version 4: Protocol and Algorithms S=
pecification&quot;">RFC5905</a>]) or some similar protocol to synchronize i=
ts clock to UTC.&quot; [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7231#sect=
ion-7.1.1.1">https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7231#section-7.1.1.1</a>]. <o:p=
></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp; - RFC 3339 itself, wrt unqualified local time, says, &quot;MUST=
 use a mechanism that ensures correct synchronization with UTC.&nbsp; Some =
suitable mechanisms are: o&nbsp; Use Network Time Protocol [<a href=3D"http=
s://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#ref-NTP" title=3D"&quot;Network Time Protoc=
ol (Version 3) Specification, Implementation and Analysis&quot;">NTP</a>] t=
o obtain the time in UTC.&quot; [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc=
3339#section-4.4">https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#section-4.4</a>], whi=
ch seems to be along the same lines as RFCs 2616/7231 in assuming that unqu=
alified local time is UTC?<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp; We could change the text from:<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &quot;the time, expressed in Coordinated Universal =
Time (UTC),&quot;<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp; to:<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &quot;the time, which MUST be expressed in Coordina=
ted Universal Time (UTC),&quot;<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp; if that would make it clearer?</pre>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
I think that would help.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Alexey,</div>
<div>Incoming AD for CDNI.<br>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<pre><o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>thanx.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>--&nbsp; Kevin J. Ma<o:p></o:p></pre>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> Francois=
 Le Faucheur (flefauch) [<a href=3D"mailto:flefauch@cisco.com">mailto:flefa=
uch@cisco.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 05, 2016 7:46 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Spencer Dawkins at IETF; Alissa Cooper<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch); &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cdni@ietf=
.org">cdni@ietf.org</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org">draft-ietf-cdni-logging=
@ietf.org</a>; The IESG;
<a href=3D"mailto:cdni-chairs@ietf.org">cdni-chairs@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-=
logging-24: (with COMMENT)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Alissa and all,<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-a=
lt:auto">&gt;<br>
&gt; I will note that I don't think the issue with partial-time has been<br=
>
&gt; completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-t=
ime<br>
&gt; as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a=
<br>
&gt; time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all<b=
r>
&gt; times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to=
<br>
&gt; use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are=
<br>
&gt; probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice =
is<br>
&gt; here.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I don&#8217;t quite see the problem here.<o:p></o:p>=
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The cdni-logging :<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">*&nbsp;refers to the definition of partial time, whi=
ch does not have a time zone, which i understand mean that the timezone is =
undefined in that format and is to be defined by the context (e.g. by a ful=
l-time format, or by whatever uses partial-time)<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">* states, in the definition of the one field that us=
es the partial-time format that it is expressed in UTC. (&quot;the time, ex=
pressed in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC), at which the processing of req=
uest completed on the Surrogate&quot;.)<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In other words, I don&#8217;t see a contradiction wi=
th the definition of RFC3339 and I don&#8217;t see any ambiguity.&nbsp;<o:p=
></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Am i missing something?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Francois<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">PS: For the record, I will also remind folks that th=
e document used to define its own time format (in exactly the same way as p=
artial-time but without referring to RFC3339) and as part of the IESG revie=
w, an AD recommended we replace our
 own definition and instead pointed to RFC3339. And note that (i) there is =
an explicit preference from the working group to not include timezone infor=
mation in the format and (ii) the common practice in CDNs is to not have ti=
mezone included (e.g. see existing
 W3C log format).<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-a=
lt:auto">Do you need to take a look at this?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-a=
lt:auto">And if you do, just let me know. I can ask Amy to move this to App=
roved, AD Follow-up, and the ballot positions won't disappear on Wednesday.=
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-a=
lt:auto">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-a=
lt:auto">Spencer<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
&gt; CDNi mailing list<br>
&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:CDNi@ietf.org">CDNi@ietf.org</a><br>
&gt; <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni">https://www.iet=
f.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni</a><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
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</blockquote>
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Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2016 23:16:13 -0300
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From: Spencer Dawkins at IETF <spencerdawkins.ietf@gmail.com>
To: "Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch)" <flefauch@cisco.com>
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
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Francois,

On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 8:22 PM, Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch) <
flefauch@cisco.com> wrote:

> Hi
> I will post a new rev with the proposed change tomorrow unless i hear
> disagreement about that by then.
>

MUST UTC seems helpful to me as well. Thank you for working through this
(non-blocking) comment.

Spencer, as responsible AD for this document


> Thanks
> Francois
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On 06 Apr 2016, at 19:07, Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm> wrote:
>
> Hi Kevin,
>
> On 6 Apr 2016, at 18:56, Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Alissa/all,
>
>
>
>   I agree with Francois; I don't see a problem.
>
>
>
>   - We tried to match the W3C spec [https://www.w3.org/TR/WD-logfile] as
> much as possible, and for time, they do not include a timezone, but state=
: "All
> times are specified in GMT"
>
>
>
>   - RFCs 2616/7231 support asctime, which does not include a timezone, an=
d RFC7231 simply states: "values in the asctime format are assumed to be in=
 UTC.  A sender that generates HTTP-date values from a local clock ought to=
 use NTP ([RFC5905 <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5905>]) or some similar =
protocol to synchronize its clock to UTC." [https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc=
7231#section-7.1.1.1].
>
>
>
>   - RFC 3339 itself, wrt unqualified local time, says, "MUST use a mechan=
ism that ensures correct synchronization with UTC.  Some suitable mechanism=
s are: o  Use Network Time Protocol [NTP <https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc33=
39#ref-NTP>] to obtain the time in UTC." [https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc33=
39#section-4.4], which seems to be along the same lines as RFCs 2616/7231 i=
n assuming that unqualified local time is UTC?
>
>
>
>   We could change the text from:
>
>     "the time, expressed in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC),"
>
>   to:
>
>     "the time, which MUST be expressed in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC=
),"
>
>   if that would make it clearer?
>
>
> I think that would help.
>
> Alexey,
> Incoming AD for CDNI.
>
>
>
> thanx.
>
>
>
> --  Kevin J. Ma
>
>
>
> *From:* Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch) [mailto:flefauch@cisco.com
> <flefauch@cisco.com>]
> *Sent:* Tuesday, April 05, 2016 7:46 AM
> *To:* Spencer Dawkins at IETF; Alissa Cooper
> *Cc:* Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch); <cdni@ietf.org>;
> draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org; The IESG; cdni-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on
> draft-ietf-cdni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)
>
>
>
> Alissa and all,
>
> >
> > I will note that I don't think the issue with partial-time has been
> > completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-ti=
me
> > as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a
> > time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all
> > times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to
> > use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are
> > probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice i=
s
> > here.
>
> I don=E2=80=99t quite see the problem here.
>
>
>
> The cdni-logging :
>
> * refers to the definition of partial time, which does not have a time
> zone, which i understand mean that the timezone is undefined in that form=
at
> and is to be defined by the context (e.g. by a full-time format, or by
> whatever uses partial-time)
>
> * states, in the definition of the one field that uses the partial-time
> format that it is expressed in UTC. ("the time, expressed in Coordinated
> Universal Time (UTC), at which the processing of request completed on the
> Surrogate".)
>
>
>
> In other words, I don=E2=80=99t see a contradiction with the definition o=
f RFC3339
> and I don=E2=80=99t see any ambiguity.
>
> Am i missing something?
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
>
>
> Francois
>
>
>
> PS: For the record, I will also remind folks that the document used to
> define its own time format (in exactly the same way as partial-time but
> without referring to RFC3339) and as part of the IESG review, an AD
> recommended we replace our own definition and instead pointed to RFC3339.
> And note that (i) there is an explicit preference from the working group =
to
> not include timezone information in the format and (ii) the common practi=
ce
> in CDNs is to not have timezone included (e.g. see existing W3C log forma=
t).
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Do you need to take a look at this?
>
> And if you do, just let me know. I can ask Amy to move this to Approved,
> AD Follow-up, and the ballot positions won't disappear on Wednesday.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Spencer
> _______________________________________________
> > CDNi mailing list
> > CDNi@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni
>
>
>
>

--001a114e7e78a40d02052fdba98b
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr">Francois,<div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmai=
l_quote">On Wed, Apr 6, 2016 at 8:22 PM, Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch) <s=
pan dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:flefauch@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank"=
>flefauch@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quo=
te" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"=
>



<div dir=3D"auto">
<div>Hi=C2=A0</div>
<div>I will post a new rev with the proposed change tomorrow unless i hear =
disagreement about that by then.=C2=A0</div></div></blockquote><div><br></d=
iv><div>MUST UTC seems helpful to me as well. Thank you for working through=
 this (non-blocking) comment.</div><div><br></div><div>Spencer, as responsi=
ble AD for this document</div><div>=C2=A0<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-lef=
t:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto">
<div>Thanks</div>
<div>Francois<br>
<br>
Sent from my iPhone</div><div><div class=3D"h5">
<div><br>
On 06 Apr 2016, at 19:07, Alexey Melnikov &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:aamelnikov@=
fastmail.fm" target=3D"_blank">aamelnikov@fastmail.fm</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div>Hi Kevin,</div>
<div><br>
On 6 Apr 2016, at 18:56, Kevin Ma J &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kevin.j.ma@ericss=
on.com" target=3D"_blank">kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>


<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">Hi Alissa/all,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 I agree with Francois; I don&#39;t see a problem.<u=
></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 - We tried to match the W3C spec [<a href=3D"https:=
//www.w3.org/TR/WD-logfile" target=3D"_blank">https://www.w3.org/TR/WD-logf=
ile</a>] as much as possible, and for time, they do not include a timezone,
 but state: &quot;</span>All times are specified in GMT<span style=3D"font-=
size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">&quot;<u></u><u></u></span=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<pre>=C2=A0 - RFCs 2616/7231 support asctime, which does not include a time=
zone, and RFC7231 simply states: &quot;values in the asctime format are ass=
umed to be in UTC.=C2=A0 A sender that generates HTTP-date values from a lo=
cal clock ought to use NTP ([<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5905=
" title=3D"&quot;Network Time Protocol Version 4: Protocol and Algorithms S=
pecification&quot;" target=3D"_blank">RFC5905</a>]) or some similar protoco=
l to synchronize its clock to UTC.&quot; [<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org=
/html/rfc7231#section-7.1.1.1" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/htm=
l/rfc7231#section-7.1.1.1</a>]. <u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></pre>
<pre>=C2=A0 - RFC 3339 itself, wrt unqualified local time, says, &quot;MUST=
 use a mechanism that ensures correct synchronization with UTC.=C2=A0 Some =
suitable mechanisms are: o=C2=A0 Use Network Time Protocol [<a href=3D"http=
s://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#ref-NTP" title=3D"&quot;Network Time Protoc=
ol (Version 3) Specification, Implementation and Analysis&quot;" target=3D"=
_blank">NTP</a>] to obtain the time in UTC.&quot; [<a href=3D"https://tools=
.ietf.org/html/rfc3339#section-4.4" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.or=
g/html/rfc3339#section-4.4</a>], which seems to be along the same lines as =
RFCs 2616/7231 in assuming that unqualified local time is UTC?<u></u><u></u=
></pre>
<pre><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></pre>
<pre>=C2=A0 We could change the text from:<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 &quot;the time, expressed in Coordinated Universal =
Time (UTC),&quot;<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>=C2=A0 to:<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 &quot;the time, which MUST be expressed in Coordina=
ted Universal Time (UTC),&quot;<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>=C2=A0 if that would make it clearer?</pre>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
I think that would help.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Alexey,</div>
<div>Incoming AD for CDNI.<br>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div>
<pre><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></pre>
<pre>thanx.<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></pre>
<pre>--=C2=A0 Kevin J. Ma<u></u><u></u></pre>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> Francois=
 Le Faucheur (flefauch) [<a href=3D"mailto:flefauch@cisco.com" target=3D"_b=
lank">mailto:flefauch@cisco.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 05, 2016 7:46 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Spencer Dawkins at IETF; Alissa Cooper<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Francois Le Faucheur (flefauch); &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cdni@ietf=
.org" target=3D"_blank">cdni@ietf.org</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:draft-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft=
-ietf-cdni-logging@ietf.org</a>; The IESG;
<a href=3D"mailto:cdni-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">cdni-chairs@ietf.=
org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper&#39;s No Objection on draft-ietf-c=
dni-logging-24: (with COMMENT)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Alissa and all,<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<blockquote style=3D"margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&gt;<br>
&gt; I will note that I don&#39;t think the issue with partial-time has bee=
n<br>
&gt; completely resolved, because the document still says it uses partial-t=
ime<br>
&gt; as defined in RFC 3339, and partial-time by definition does not have a=
<br>
&gt; time zone associated with it, whereas the document text now says all<b=
r>
&gt; times are reported in UTC. Bit of a detail, but it might make sense to=
<br>
&gt; use full-time since you are specifying the time zone offset. There are=
<br>
&gt; probably other folks who know better than I do what standard practice =
is<br>
&gt; here.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I don=E2=80=99t quite see the problem here.<u></u><u=
></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The cdni-logging :<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">*=C2=A0refers to the definition of partial time, whi=
ch does not have a time zone, which i understand mean that the timezone is =
undefined in that format and is to be defined by the context (e.g. by a ful=
l-time format, or by whatever uses partial-time)<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">* states, in the definition of the one field that us=
es the partial-time format that it is expressed in UTC. (&quot;the time, ex=
pressed in Coordinated Universal Time (UTC), at which the processing of req=
uest completed on the Surrogate&quot;.)<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In other words, I don=E2=80=99t see a contradiction =
with the definition of RFC3339 and I don=E2=80=99t see any ambiguity.=C2=A0=
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Am i missing something?<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Francois<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">PS: For the record, I will also remind folks that th=
e document used to define its own time format (in exactly the same way as p=
artial-time but without referring to RFC3339) and as part of the IESG revie=
w, an AD recommended we replace our
 own definition and instead pointed to RFC3339. And note that (i) there is =
an explicit preference from the working group to not include timezone infor=
mation in the format and (ii) the common practice in CDNs is to not have ti=
mezone included (e.g. see existing
 W3C log format).<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Do you need to take a look at this?<u></u><u></u></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">And if you do, just let me know. I can ask Amy to mo=
ve this to Approved, AD Follow-up, and the ballot positions won&#39;t disap=
pear on Wednesday.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Spencer<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
&gt; CDNi mailing list<br>
&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:CDNi@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">CDNi@ietf.org</a><b=
r>
&gt; <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni" target=3D"_blan=
k">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni</a><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div></div></div>

</blockquote></div><br></div></div>

--001a114e7e78a40d02052fdba98b--


From nobody Thu Apr  7 05:23:29 2016
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Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-logging-25.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Logging Interface
        Authors         : Francois Le Faucheur
                          Gilles Bertrand
                          Iuniana Oprescu
                          Roy Peterkofsky
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-logging-25.txt
	Pages           : 58
	Date            : 2016-04-07

Abstract:
   This memo specifies the Logging interface between a downstream CDN
   (dCDN) and an upstream CDN (uCDN) that are interconnected as per the
   CDN Interconnection (CDNI) framework.  First, it describes a
   reference model for CDNI logging.  Then, it specifies the CDNI
   Logging File format and the actual protocol for exchange of CDNI
   Logging Files.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-logging/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-logging-25

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-logging-25


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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Subject: [CDNi] Presenters : check your slides
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To CDNI presenters,

The latest version of all slide decks have been uploaded on the IETF 95 =
Meeting Material page:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/95/materials.html/

Please check that this is exactly the final version you expect.
If not unicast me with the version to be uploaded.

Looking forward to our meeting

Cheers

Fran=C3=A7ois=


From nobody Sat Apr  9 07:22:27 2016
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From: "Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB)" <rob.murray@nokia.com>
To: EXT Vincent Roca <vincent.roca@inria.fr>
Thread-Topic: Secdir review of draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-11
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From: "Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB)" <rob.murray@nokia.com>
To: Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com>, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>
Thread-Topic: Ben Campbell's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-11: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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Subject: [CDNi] draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07 questions and comments
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Dear Ray and Kent,=20

   Thank you very much for taking the time to discuss my questions and =
comments right after IETF-95 CDNI meeting this past week.

As I mentioned my implementation is based on =
draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07. I thought it would be a good idea to =
reiterate our discussion.

(1) CDNI URI Signing package uses =E2=80=9C&=E2=80=9D character as IE =
delimiter. OUC and UPC could contain the original URI (OUC) or a list of =
URI patterns (UPC) which in turn could contain =E2=80=9C&=E2=80=9D =
character and possibly even query parameters named the same way like the =
IEs.=20

One way to address this would be to percent-encode UPC. OUC is not =
included in the final package (removed after signing) hence =
percent-encoding it is probably not necessary.

(2) The draft mentions only the following values for HF, DSA, CEA IE - =
=E2=80=9CSHA-256=E2=80=9D, "EC-DSA=E2=80=9D, =E2=80=9CAES-128=E2=80=9D. =
Different encryption implementations use different algorithm names (i.e. =
=E2=80=9CSHA-256=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=80=9CSHA256=E2=80=9D) that could lead =
to signature validation failures due to naming mismatch between =
different CDNI URI Signing implementations.

One way to address this would be to define the algorithm names or point =
to already existing definitions.

(3) The signing algorithm in draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07 uses full =
URIs (excluding scheme component) when signing and verifying and full =
URIs when enforcing distribution policies.=20

We have use-cases where we would sign ignoring the URI scheme and =
authority components. In our implementation verifying, enforcing =
distribution policies based on the whole URI would lead to an =
unnecessary re-assembling of the whole URI from its components already =
disassembled at the beginning stages of the HTTP state machine.

Functionally draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07 already has those use-cases =
covered by using UPC but I was wondering if we could have some means to =
help the implementation optimize its performance (avoiding the extra =
re-assembly).

We had a short discussion and (I think) Ray came up with an interesting =
idea of using well-defined URI patterns to facilitate more optimal =
implementation.

Looking forward to the new version! Thanks again!

Best regards,
--Gancho=


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To: Gancho Tenev <gtenev@apple.com>, "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [CDNi] draft-ietf-cdni-uri-signing-07 questions and comments
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDN Interconnection Metadata
        Authors         : Ben Niven-Jenkins
                          Rob Murray
                          Matt Caulfield
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-14.txt
	Pages           : 62
	Date            : 2016-04-12

Abstract:
   The Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) metadata
   interface enables interconnected Content Delivery Networks (CDNs) to
   exchange content distribution metadata in order to enable content
   acquisition and delivery.  The CDNI metadata associated with a piece
   of content provides a downstream CDN with sufficient information for
   the downstream CDN to service content requests on behalf of an
   upstream CDN.  This document describes both a base set of CDNI
   metadata and the protocol for exchanging that metadata.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-14

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-14


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Tue Apr 12 15:28:36 2016
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
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Thread-Topic: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-14.txt
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Hi All,

  This update includes the removal of ".v1" from payload type names, clarif=
ies that only non-structural generic metadata are optional to support, and =
fixes a typo in the security considerations.

  The authors believe this version is ready for WG LC.

thanx!

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CDNi [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-
> drafts@ietf.org
> Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2016 6:25 PM
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-14.txt
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio=
n
> of the IETF.
>=20
>         Title           : CDN Interconnection Metadata
>         Authors         : Ben Niven-Jenkins
>                           Rob Murray
>                           Matt Caulfield
>                           Kevin J. Ma
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-14.txt
> 	Pages           : 62
> 	Date            : 2016-04-12
>=20
> Abstract:
>    The Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) metadata
>    interface enables interconnected Content Delivery Networks (CDNs) to
>    exchange content distribution metadata in order to enable content
>    acquisition and delivery.  The CDNI metadata associated with a piece
>    of content provides a downstream CDN with sufficient information for
>    the downstream CDN to service content requests on behalf of an
>    upstream CDN.  This document describes both a base set of CDNI
>    metadata and the protocol for exchanging that metadata.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-14
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-metadata-14
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
> submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> CDNi mailing list
> CDNi@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni


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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDN Interconnection Metadata
        Authors         : Ben Niven-Jenkins
                          Rob Murray
                          Matt Caulfield
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-15.txt
	Pages           : 62
	Date            : 2016-04-12

Abstract:
   The Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) metadata
   interface enables interconnected Content Delivery Networks (CDNs) to
   exchange content distribution metadata in order to enable content
   acquisition and delivery.  The CDNI metadata associated with a piece
   of content provides a downstream CDN with sufficient information for
   the downstream CDN to service content requests on behalf of an
   upstream CDN.  This document describes both a base set of CDNI
   metadata and the protocol for exchanging that metadata.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-15

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-15


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Tue Apr 12 16:48:17 2016
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Hi All,

  Fixed missing commas in the JSON examples.

thanx!

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CDNi [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-
> drafts@ietf.org
> Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2016 7:47 PM
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-15.txt
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio=
n
> of the IETF.
>=20
>         Title           : CDN Interconnection Metadata
>         Authors         : Ben Niven-Jenkins
>                           Rob Murray
>                           Matt Caulfield
>                           Kevin J. Ma
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-15.txt
> 	Pages           : 62
> 	Date            : 2016-04-12
>=20
> Abstract:
>    The Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) metadata
>    interface enables interconnected Content Delivery Networks (CDNs) to
>    exchange content distribution metadata in order to enable content
>    acquisition and delivery.  The CDNI metadata associated with a piece
>    of content provides a downstream CDN with sufficient information for
>    the downstream CDN to service content requests on behalf of an
>    upstream CDN.  This document describes both a base set of CDNI
>    metadata and the protocol for exchanging that metadata.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
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> There's also a htmlized version available at:
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>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
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> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics
        Authors         : Jan Seedorf
                          Jon Peterson
                          Stefano Previdi
                          Ray van Brandenburg
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-15.txt
	Pages           : 23
	Date            : 2016-04-12

Abstract:
   This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
   interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
   "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
   document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
   further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
   for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
   registries can be extended in the future.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-15

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-15


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

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ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Tue Apr 12 20:10:23 2016
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>
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Hi All,

  This update clarifies the logging and metadata capabilities, adds footpri=
nts to the FCIBase object, and fixed the missing commas in the JSON example=
.

thanx.

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CDNi [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-
> drafts@ietf.org
> Sent: Tuesday, April 12, 2016 11:02 PM
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-15.txt
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio=
n
> of the IETF.
>=20
>         Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilitie=
s
> Semantics
>         Authors         : Jan Seedorf
>                           Jon Peterson
>                           Stefano Previdi
>                           Ray van Brandenburg
>                           Kevin J. Ma
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-
> 15.txt
> 	Pages           : 23
> 	Date            : 2016-04-12
>=20
> Abstract:
>    This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
>    interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
>    "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
>    document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
>    further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
>    for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
>    registries can be extended in the future.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-15
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilitie=
s-
> semantics-15
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics
        Authors         : Jan Seedorf
                          Jon Peterson
                          Stefano Previdi
                          Ray van Brandenburg
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16.txt
	Pages           : 23
	Date            : 2016-04-13

Abstract:
   This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
   interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
   "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
   document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
   further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
   for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
   registries can be extended in the future.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Wed Apr 13 08:16:32 2016
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Hi All,

  This version just moves logging from informative to normative reference.

thanx!

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CDNi [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-
> drafts@ietf.org
> Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2016 11:14 AM
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-16.txt
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio=
n
> of the IETF.
>=20
>         Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilitie=
s
> Semantics
>         Authors         : Jan Seedorf
>                           Jon Peterson
>                           Stefano Previdi
>                           Ray van Brandenburg
>                           Kevin J. Ma
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-
> 16.txt
> 	Pages           : 23
> 	Date            : 2016-04-13
>=20
> Abstract:
>    This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
>    interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
>    "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
>    document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
>    further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
>    for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
>    registries can be extended in the future.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-16
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilitie=
s-
> semantics-16
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
> submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
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From nobody Fri Apr 15 15:38:04 2016
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From: "Ben Campbell" <ben@nostrum.com>
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Ben Campbell's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-11: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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Hi,

Responses inline. I remove sections that don't seem to need further 
discussion (replaced with [...])

Thanks!

Ben.

On 9 Apr 2016, at 9:29, Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB) wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Sorry, it took me ages to get to the comments before and in the end I 
> had to push out a doc update along with my responses because I was up 
> against the submission deadline - I got a comprehensive telling-off 
> from the ADs during the CDNI WG meeting!
>
>
> Ben - apologies, I completely missed your comments, and only found out 
> in the meeting. Responses inline below.
>
> Alissa - I'm afraid I was also asked to chase responses, are you happy 
> with my responses to your comments, and the updates in "-12"?
>
> Francois/Kevin - there's a question about making the metadata ref 
> normative below, are you ok with that?
>
> Many thanks,
> Rob.
>
>
>
>
>
> On 06/01/2016, 03:40, "Ben Campbell" <ben@nostrum.com> wrote:
>
>> Ben Campbell has entered the following ballot position for
>> draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-11: Discuss
>>
>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut 
>> this
>> introductory paragraph, however.)
>>
>>
>> Please refer to 
>> https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>>
>>
>> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers/
>>
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> DISCUSS:
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> I've got two concerns that I think  leave  ambiguity around important
>> normative requirements. Hopefully they will be easy to resolve:
>>
>> - 4.7, 2nd bullet under handling of offline surrogates:
>>
>> I assume I am missing something here. How does a surrogate know that 
>> the
>> situation exists in the first place? How would a surrogate know about
>> invalidate commands that happened while it was offline?
>
> That's an internal problem for the CDN, not something CDN 
> interconnection can deal with. (The CDNI interface is between CDNs, 
> not between individual caches.)
>
> When a cache (surrogate) comes online it needs to check-for, or be 
> told about, any CI/T commands, metadata, or other config changes it 
> missed. I think this is normal behaviour for CDNs - I'm not sure any 
> clarification is needed, but happy to add something if others do.
>

The text I referred to says surrogates MUST NOT use affected data 
without revalidating if an invalidate command happened when they are 
offline. So at least this part of draft does seem to be about 
surrogates. This seems like a "MUST NOT" that is contingent upon 
something that happened when the surrogate wasn't looking. Maybe the 
"If" part is misleading, and surrogates _always_ need to revalidate any 
cached data when they come back from an offline state?

>
>> - 8.1,  4th paragraph from the end:
>> The language here is ambiguous about whether the use of TLS is 
>> _always_
>> required, or just when "such protection is required." From context, I
>> assume the latter to be the case. But "To that end..." can be 
>> interpreted
>> to mean "In that case, one MUST do X", or to mean "In order to make 
>> that
>> possible when needed, one MUST _always_ do X"
>>
>> I propose the following:
>> OLD:
>>   In an environment where any such protection is required, mutually
>>   authenticated encrypted transport MUST be used to ensure
>>   confidentiality of the CI/T information.  To that end, TLS MUST be
>>   used by CI/T, including authentication of the remote end.
>> NEW:
>>   In an environment where any such protection is required, mutually
>>   authenticated and encrypted TLS MUST be used to ensure
>>   confidentiality of the CI/T information.
>> END.
>
> This text has been discussed at-length in the context of this draft 
> and the others.
>
> Hopefully the version in "-12" is clearer?

Yes, thanks.

>
>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> COMMENT:
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> - 3, paragraph 5:
>> SHOULD should not be equated with "optional to implement". MAY means
>> that. SHOULD is intended to be stronger.
>
> I'll change it to MAY.

I didn't mean to suggest the "SHOULD" should change, as much as the 
"optional-to-implement" description should change. But I am okay with 
whichever the working group prefers.

>
>
>> - 4.5, 2nd paragraph, 1st sentence:
>> This is pretty convoluted. I suggest reformulating without the past 
>> tense
>> "MUST". For example, "The dCNI MUST report the expiration times 
>> if..."
>
> How about:
>
>   "If the dCDN does remove Trigger Status Resources automatically,
>   it MUST report the length of time after which it will do so,
>   using a property of the collection of all Trigger Status Resources"
>

WFM.

>
>> -4.6: "If CDNs B and C delegate delivery of CDN Aâ€™s content to each
>> other"
>> Is this a reasonable configuration? It seems like they might already 
>> have
>> a delegation loop before the trigger interface got involved.
>
> Perhaps it could happen if two CDNs use each other for extra capacity
> during periods of high load.
>
> But it's certainly not an impossible configuration. The request
> routing draft deals with loops, so it seemed best to do so here as
> well.
>
>
> Does that help? Are any mods or explanations needed in the draft?
>

No, your explanation is fine. No change needed.

[...]


>
>
>> - 5.1.3, staleresourcetime, mandatory:
>> Doesn't this effectively mean the value must be the same across all
>> collections?
>
> Yes, but the filtered collections are described as filtered views
> of the collection of all triggers.
>
> I think it'd be odd to use different times for the filtered 
> collections
> (especially longer times) and a little more fiddly to implement. I
> don't think there'd be anything to gain from the extra flexibility?
>

I wasn't suggesting the flexibility, just that the requirement that the 
value be the same across collections might be stronger than the text 
seemed to suggest. But on reflection, I don't think the text needs to 
change.

>
>> - 5.2.1, content.ccid:
>> Seems like the reference to [I-D.ietf-cdni-metadata] should be
>> normative.
>
> Oh, ok... that makes sense, though the logging draft also uses ccid
> with an informative ref to metadata.
>
> I guess a normative ref will mean this draft has a dependency on the
> metadata draft, but perhaps that's the right thing to do.
>
> Francois/Kevin/anyone - any views? Is there another way to fix this,
> or shall I just make the ref normative?

I'm not sure one might fix it short of locally redefining ccid, which 
doesn't seem optimal.

>
>
>> - 6.2.5:
>> it looks like the dCDN is sending the request to itself. Is that the
>> intent?
>
> The first sentence is:
>
>   "The dCDN can delete completed and failed Trigger Status 
> Resources..."
>
> Which is a mistake, I'll change it to:
>
>   "The uCDN can delete completed and failed Trigger Status 
> Resources..."
>
> Is that what you meant, or is there something else wrong in the 
> example?

That would fix it.

>
>
>> - 8.1, last paragraph: "In this case, the dCDN MUST allow each uCDN 
>> from
>> which the content could have been acquired to act upon that content 
>> using
>> CI/T Commands."
>> This seems like a place where local policy might reasonably vary. Is 
>> a
>> MUST really appropriate?
>
>
> That moved to section 2.2.1 para 4 in "-12", and became...
>
>   "CI/T commands originating in the single source uCDN affect metadata
>   and content in all dCDNs but, in a diamond configuration, it may not
>   be possible for the dCDN to determine which uCDN it acquired content
>   from. In this case a dCDN MUST allow each uCDN from which it may
>   have acquired the content to act upon that content using CI/T 
> Commands."
>
> I think a MUST is right though ... if a uCDN wants its data gone, and
> the dCDN thinks it might have some of that data, it had better delete
> it.
>
> So I'd prefer to leave the MUST, is that ok?

I think the my confusion was in the "could have been required" (now "may 
have acquired") clause. Do you assume that the content may only be 
acquired from uCDNs that are authorized to also delete it?


Thanks!

Ben.


From nobody Fri Apr 15 23:32:54 2016
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Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : Request Routing Redirection interface for CDN Interconnection
        Authors         : Ben Niven-Jenkins
                          Ray van Brandenburg
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18.txt
	Pages           : 31
	Date            : 2016-04-15

Abstract:
   The Request Routing Interface comprises (1) the asynchronous
   advertisement of footprint and capabilities by a downstream Content
   Delivery Network (CDN) that allows an upstream CDN to decide whether
   to redirect particular user requests to that downstream CDN; and (2)
   the synchronous operation of an upstream CDN requesting whether a
   downstream CDN is prepared to accept a user request and of a
   downstream CDN responding with how to actually redirect the user
   request.  This document describes an interface for the latter part,
   i.e., the CDNI Request Routing Redirection interface.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-redirection/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Fri Apr 15 23:44:37 2016
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Stephen Farrell's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-17: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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Hi Stephen,

> On 27 Mar 2016, at 17:36, Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> =
wrote:
> On 24/03/16 15:51, Niven - Jenkins, Ben (Nokia - GB) wrote:
>> > On 24 Mar 2016, at 15:49, EXT Stephen Farrell =
<stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> wrote:
>>> Can we agree that as-is, the draft is very much
>>> aiming to meet the commercial requirements and is not taking account
>>> or privacy requirements?
>>=20
>> Yes I think we can agree that. Ben
>=20
> Great. Then I'd suggest that the best next step may be to try get
> a bunch of folks to chat in B-A about how to take privacy into
> account and hopefully that'll also turn out to be a fine way to
> resolve the discuss. (Or if not in B-A then a subsequent concall
> maybe.)

The authors have started a discussion with the advisors Francois & =
yourself suggested/volunteered to help with this. Will let you know the =
outcome of that.

I=E2=80=99ve also published a -18 that contains all the editorial/other =
edits made in response to Ben Campbell=E2=80=99s, Alissa=E2=80=99s & =
your comments.

The only other outstanding thing in your comments as far as I am aware =
is this:

> On 24 Mar 2016, at 15:07, Ben Niven-Jenkins <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk> =
wrote:
>> On 17 Mar 2016, at 10:10, Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> =
wrote:

>> - 4.4.2: a JSON "string" is not the same as a DNS name is it?
>> What about i18n? (ULABEL or ALABEL?) what about odd characters
>> allowed in JSON but not in DNS names?  In general the fields
>> in this dictionary (and others) seem underspecified to me.
>=20
> I=E2=80=99m afraid I=E2=80=99m not an expert in JSON strings, unicode =
or i18n. I think what you=E2=80=99re getting at is that a JSON string =
can contain more characters than allowed by an ALABEL or a ULABEL and we =
should be more precise in constraining the allowed characters? And that =
you think there are other fields in the document that would also benefit =
from constraining the allowable set of characters. If that=E2=80=99s the =
case I=E2=80=99m happy to make the edits to improve the document but I =
will need some help on what the right terminology is and the right =
references for the allowable characters.

Any suggestions for someone who could help with reviewing the doc from a =
unicode & i18n angle and helping me get the terminology and set of =
allowable characters right?

Thanks
Ben


From nobody Fri Apr 15 23:52:11 2016
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-17: (with DISCUSS)
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Hi Alissa,

I wanted to give you an update on where we are:

I=E2=80=99ve published a -18 that contains all the editorial/other edits =
made in response to Ben Campbell=E2=80=99s, Stephen's & your comments. =
That includes aligning the TLS text in the security considerations with =
that in cdni-logging-25.

We have also started a discussion on privacy with some folks Stephen =
recommended and will update the document based on that discussion, which =
may improve the text wrt some of the comments you have made.

As far as I can tell there are no outstanding points in your DISCUSS =
where you are expecting a response from me or my co-authors, although I =
assume you=E2=80=99ll want to re-read the new draft once its published =
based on the edits wrt privacy we will make before clearing your =
DISCUSS?

Thanks
Ben




> On 24 Mar 2016, at 15:05, Ben Niven-Jenkins <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk> =
wrote:
>=20
> Hi Alissa,
> (Francois, Kevin, there is a question from Alissa below that I think =
needs your input as WG chairs)
>=20
>> On 16 Mar 2016, at 23:23, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in> wrote:
>> =
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> DISCUSS:
>> =
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>=20
>> (1)
>> There is some ambiguity in the document about whether the uCDN passes =
the
>> IP address of the UA or its prefix to the dCDN. Sec 4.4.1 says that =
for
>> DNS redirection, the uCDN passes "IP address or prefix" of the UA, =
but
>> then in the definition of resolver-ip specifies it only as the IP =
address
>> of the UA.
>=20
> resolver-ip contains =E2=80=9CThe IP address of the UA=E2=80=99s DNS =
resolver."
>=20
> c-subnet contains the "The IP address (or prefix) of the UA in CIDR =
format."
>=20
> The idea is resolver-ip contains the IP address of the DNS resolver =
making the DNS request to the uCDN. c-subnet contains (if present) the =
address/prefix carried by draft-ietf-dnsop-edns-client-subnet.
>=20
>> Then in Sec 4.5.1 for HTTP redirection the equivalent field is
>> specified as the IP address of the UA and the possibility of sending =
only
>> a prefix is not mentioned.
>=20
> That is because with HTTP the UA connects directly to the uCDN and the =
uCDN can see the UA=E2=80=99s IP address.
>=20
>> Then 5.2 has the para that begins "While it is
>> technically possible to mask some information in the RI Request, such =
as
>> the last bits of the UA IP address ..." which makes it seem like =
prefixes
>> really shouldn't be sent.
>=20
> What we have provided is the ability for the CDNI Redirection =
Interface to encode the properties of the source (DNS or HTTP) requests =
so that uCDNs & dCDNs can make the best dCDN & surrogate selection =
decisions that they can. We=E2=80=99re not suggesting or mandating any =
additional IP address masking behaviour than that provided (or not =
provided) by the source protocol. This may be the source of the =
confusion - we=E2=80=99re not saying =E2=80=9Cyou should mask the IP =
address behind a prefix and this is how to do it=E2=80=9D and then being =
inconsistent about applying it to DNS vs HTTP, we=E2=80=99re saying =
=E2=80=9Chere=E2=80=99s how to encapsulate a DNS or HTTP request into =
our protocol=E2=80=9D.
>=20
>>=20
>> I think the document needs some consistency and clarity here about
>> whether prefixes are expected to be used for either redirection =
method.
>=20
> Does the above explanation change this view? Or change the text you =
would like to see that provides that clarity?
>=20
>> It's also not obvious to me why the document shouldn't recommend to =
uCDNs
>> that if they are polling multiple candidate dCDNs as described in Sec
>> 5.2, they should use only a prefix for such requests. The arguments =
given
>> against this seem pretty thin -- isn't preventing correlation of =
multiple
>> requests to a single UA a good thing, especially when it's being done =
by
>> a bunch of dCDNs? And I don't understand the CGN example -- isn't the
>> root of the problem here that topologically dispersed UAs are sharing =
the
>> same public-facing IP address, in which case the dCDN may have the =
same
>> problem when passed a full IP address as it does a prefix?=20
>=20
> We describe how to encapsulate DNS & HTTP requests in the RI protocol =
and we discuss that in some circumstances it may provide information to =
a dCDN that they would not otherwise have got and that masking IP =
addresses also has downsides.
>=20
> We do not provide any privacy enhancing normative behaviour and we do =
not make a value judgement on whether any possible reduction in privacy =
is more important than the downsides of providing that reduction in =
privacy.
>=20
> The specific example of CGN may not be the best example for us to have =
used. The general point is that dCDNs perform surrogate selection using =
UA IP address (or the closest proxy they can get, e.g. the UA=E2=80=99s =
DNS resolver=E2=80=99s IP address) and that masking the UA IP address =
therefore means dCDNs may make less optimum decisions and that is a =
downside.
>=20
> Maybe we=E2=80=99d be better just saying that rather than trying to =
provide specific scenarios that say that by inference?
>=20
>>=20
>> (2)
>> Ben noted the weakness of the recommendation in 5.1 regarding TLS. I =
see
>> that the language here is the same as it is in
>> draft-ietf-cdni-logging-22. But I thought the agreement on that =
document
>> was MUST use TLS, full stop. So there is ambiguity in both documents =
I
>> think. "In an environment where ..." and "When TLS is used ..." seem
>> inconsistent with "TLS MUST be used ...." I'm happy to clear on this =
if
>> I'm missing something from the previous discussion, which I think
>> happened when I was on leave and resulted from one of Stephen's =
ballots.
>=20
> What I replied to Ben=E2=80=A6"There has been quite a bit of =
discussion in the CDNI WG around this wording and the WG decided to =
align the wording it used across all its documents. The first document =
to progress to IESG was draft-ietf-cdni-logging and the other CDNI =
drafts (including the redirection one we are discussing) use the same =
wording as draft-ietf-cdni-logging.
>=20
> I=E2=80=99m happy to continue to align the wording in this document =
with that in draft-ietf-cdni-logging, but I would suggest we avoid =
repeating the same discussion that is happening around =
draft-ietf-cdni-logging here.
>=20
> Francois/Kevin - Can you help here? Has the discussion around this =
text for draft-ietf-cdni-logging concluded yet?"
>=20
> Ben
>=20


From nobody Fri Apr 15 23:55:51 2016
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Ben Campbell's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-17: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Ben C,

I wanted to give you an update on where we are:

I=E2=80=99ve published a -18 that contains all the editorial/other edits =
made in response to Alissa=E2=80=99s, Stephen's & your comments. That =
includes aligning the TLS text in the security considerations with that =
in cdni-logging-25 which is what was agreed in response to Alissa=E2=80=99=
s DISCUSS.

I believe I have incorporated all the other comments/edits you made into =
-18 and as far as I can tell there are no outstanding points/comments =
where you are expecting a response from me or my co-authors.

Let me know if that is not true and I have missed anything.

Thanks
Ben



> On 29 Mar 2016, at 00:19, Ben Niven-Jenkins <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk> =
wrote:
>=20
> Hi Ben,
>=20
>> On 28 Mar 2016, at 21:52, Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com> wrote:
>> On 24 Mar 2016, at 10:02, Ben Niven-Jenkins wrote:
>>>> On 16 Mar 2016, at 02:21, Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com> wrote:
>>>> =
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> COMMENT:
>>>> =
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>=20
>>>> I have a few comments and questions:
>>>>=20
>>>> # Substantive: #
>>>>=20
>>>> - 3, last paragraph: "Any operational
>>>> mechanisms this requires, e.g., private key distribution to
>>>> surrogates and request routers in dCDNs, are outside the scope of
>>>> this document.  Further mechanisms to notify User Agents of trusted
>>>> redirection are also outside the scope of this document."
>>>>=20
>>>> Is it in scope _somewhere_? As it is, this seems like an excuse to =
avoid
>>>> HTTPS, which is not optimal.
>>>=20
>>> I believe it is in scope of the LURK BoF.
>>>=20
>>> I don=E2=80=99t understand your point about avoiding HTTPS. This is =
saying that once a User Agent connects to a surrogate or request router =
over HTTPS, that surrogate/request router better be able present the =
correct certificate, complete a TLS handshake, etc otherwise content =
delivery will fail. How a surrogate/request router manages to achieve =
that is outside of the scope of the redirection interface this document =
is specifying, similar to how a particular origin/web server/etc =
(without CDNI) manages to achieve that is outside of the scope of the =
HTTPS spec.
>>=20
>> I'm not suggesting this draft has to offer solutions; that's why I =
asked if the work was in scope "somewhere". But it seems like key =
management, especially in an interoperable fashion, is kind of an =
"elephant in the room" for secure redirection.
>=20
> Yes it is currently. Hopefully LURK will solve that in the future. =
Non-standardised techniques similar to some of the LURK proposals are =
deployed today, so the key management bit is solved IMO but are not =
documented in any kind of formal document AFAIK.=20
>=20
>>>> -4, first paragraph:
>>>> Was any thought given to using or supporting HTTP/2?
>>>=20
>>> The authors gave it a bit of thought. It was not raised in the =
working group from what I remember.
>>>=20
>>> I=E2=80=99m not sure HTTP/2 is particularly relevant to the =
specification. The CDNI RI spec is essentially a HTTP API for exchanging =
CDNI redirection requests/responses. Like any HTTP API it can feasibly =
be run over HTTP, HTTPS & HTTP/2 as the semantics of all three are the =
same.
>>=20
>> Is saying it is based on HTTP 1.1 really accurate then? Or maybe it's =
just based on HTTP in general?
>=20
> Good point. I=E2=80=99ve dropped the 1.1 in my working copy of -18.
>=20
>>>> - 4.2, last paragraph (note)
>>>> This explicitly makes an IPv6 only CDN non-compliant. Is that the
>>>> intent?
>>>=20
>>> I=E2=80=99m not sure how it does that, could you explain?
>>>=20
>>> =46rom my point of view the text is stating what formats for parsing =
IPv4 & IPv6 addresses implementations must support. It does not say that =
in order to use the CDNI redirection interface, one=E2=80=99s CDN must =
use IPv4.
>>=20
>> Language of the form "MUST SUPPORT X encoded as Y" can be interpreted =
as "MUST support X and MUST support encoding as Y".
>>=20
>> Suggestion:
>> OLD
>>  All implementations MUST support IPv4 addresses encoded as
>>  specified by the =E2=80=99IPv4address=E2=80=99 rule in Section 3.2.2 =
of [RFC3986] and
>>  MUST support all IPv6 address formats specified in [RFC4291].
>> NEW
>>  All implementations that support IPv4 addresses MUST support
>>  the encoding specified by the =E2=80=99IPv4address=E2=80=99 rule in
>>  Section 3.2.2 of [RFC3986]. Likewise, implementations that support
>>  IPv6 addresses MUST support all IPv6 address formats specified in =
[RFC4291].
>> END
>=20
> Thanks. I=E2=80=99ve adopted your suggested text in my working copy of =
-18.
>=20
>>>> - 4.4.1, table, entry for dns-only:
>>>> The description says "MUST include RTs". That doesn't seem to =
consider
>>>> error cases.
>>>=20
>>> My intention was to state what someone must do under normal =
circumstances and I assumed that in the case of any error that prevented =
them from doing that, that they would return an appropriate error =
response instead.
>>>=20
>>> I can change "If True then dCDN MUST only use DNS redirection and =
MUST include RTs to one or more surrogates in its RI response."
>>>=20
>>> to
>>>=20
>>> "If True then dCDN MUST only use DNS redirection and MUST include =
RTs to one or more surrogates in any successful RI response."
>>>=20
>>> (or any other text you=E2=80=99d prefer) if that would alleviate =
your concern?
>>=20
>> That works for me, thanks!
>=20
> Done.
>=20
>>>> -5.1, 2nd to last paragraph:
>>>> " In an environment where any such protection is required...," is a
>>>> pretty weak recommendation. Would you consider making the default
>>>> behavior secure? Or at least saying something to the effect of =
"Except in
>>>> networks where similar protections are provided by some other
>>>> means,=E2=80=A6"?
>>>=20
>>> There has been quite a bit of discussion in the CDNI WG around this =
wording and the WG decided to align the wording it used across all its =
documents. The first document to progress to IESG was =
draft-ietf-cdni-logging and the other CDNI drafts (including the =
redirection one we are discussing) use the same wording as =
draft-ietf-cdni-logging.
>>>=20
>>> I=E2=80=99m happy to continue to align the wording in this document =
with that in draft-ietf-cdni-logging, but I would suggest we avoid =
repeating the same discussion that is happening around =
draft-ietf-cdni-logging here.
>>>=20
>>> Francois/Kevin - Can you help here? Has the discussion around this =
text for draft-ietf-cdni-logging concluded yet?
>>=20
>> I see Alissa has a DISCUSS position on this (and also on =
cdni-logging). I will defer to the outcome of that discussion.
>=20
> Seems it has already been resolved but I missed the edits to the =
latest logging draft, so I=E2=80=99ve adopted those in my working copy =
of -18 which should hopefully clear this from both yourself & Alissa =
when I publish -18 (there=E2=80=99s a few more still to be agreed with =
Alissa & Stephen).
>=20
>>>> -- third paragraph:
>>>> I wish the text wasn't so dismissive of attempts to anonymize some =
RI
>>>> request data. I agree doing so may reduce RI effectiveness in some =
cases.
>>>> But that needs to be balanced with privacy needs, and that balance =
may
>>>> not always land on the side of RI effectiveness. And  the inability =
to
>>>> correlate UAs between requests can be a feature in some =
circumstances.
>>>=20
>>> I agree where the balance lands may be different depending on =
circumstances. If you can suggest specific edits/new text that comes =
across less dismissive, I=E2=80=99ll incorporate them.
>>>=20
>>=20
>> Suggestion:
>> OLD
>>  While it is technically possible to mask some information in the RI
>>  Request, such as the last bits of the UA IP address, it is important
>>  to note that this will reduce the effectivess of the RI in certain
>>  cases.  As an example, when the UA is behind a Carrier-grade NAT, =
and
>>  the RI is used to find an appropriate delivery node behind the same
>>  NAT, the full IP address might be necessary.  Another potential =
issue
>>  when using IP anonymization is that it is no longer possible to
>>  correlate an RI Request with a subsequent UA request.
>> NEW:
>>  While it is technically possible to mask some information in the RI
>>  Request, such as the last bits of the UA IP address, it is important
>>  to note that this will reduce the effectivess of the RI in certain
>>  cases. CDN deployments need to strike a balance between end-user
>>  privacy and the features impacted by such masking. This balance is
>>  likely to vary from one deployment to another.  As an example, when
>>  the UA is behind a Carrier-grade NAT, and the RI is used to find an
>>  appropriate delivery node behind the same NAT, the full IP address
>>  might be necessary.  Another potential issue when using IP
>>  anonymization is that it is no longer possible to correlate an
>>  RI Request with a subsequent UA request.
>=20
> I=E2=80=99ve adopted your suggested text. Alissa has a comment on the =
language here and Stephen has a discuss on privacy concerns in general =
so I suspect this text might change some more before we=E2=80=99re =
finished with the document.
>=20
>>>> # Editorial: #
>>>>=20
>>>> - General:
>>>> There's quite a bit of repetition and redundant text, including =
redundant
>>>> normative text.
>>>=20
>>> Do you think the repetition is harmful? I=E2=80=99m reluctant to =
rework the document unless really necessary.
>>=20
>> I personally think such repetition has the potential to confuse the =
reader, or to make life harder for people who may update the draft in =
the future. But I recognize a lot of work has gone into getting people =
to agree to the current language, so I think it's your call.
>=20
> I=E2=80=99ll probably need to give the document a full read through =
after making changes to address Stephen=E2=80=99s discuss so I=E2=80=99ll =
look out for obvious repetition then and have a go at reducing some of =
it.
>=20
> Ben
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> CDNi mailing list
> CDNi@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni


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Colleagues,

This version includes editorial changes in response to IESG comments.

We expect to do another version to address the DISCUSSes related to =
privacy once we figure out how to do that with RIch & Brian (our privacy =
advisors).

Ben

> Begin forwarded message:
>=20
> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18.txt
> Date: 16 April 2016 07:32:50 BST
> To: <i-d-announce@ietf.org>
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts =
directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks =
Interconnection of the IETF.
>=20
>        Title           : Request Routing Redirection interface for CDN =
Interconnection
>        Authors         : Ben Niven-Jenkins
>                          Ray van Brandenburg
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18.txt
> 	Pages           : 31
> 	Date            : 2016-04-15
>=20
> Abstract:
>   The Request Routing Interface comprises (1) the asynchronous
>   advertisement of footprint and capabilities by a downstream Content
>   Delivery Network (CDN) that allows an upstream CDN to decide whether
>   to redirect particular user requests to that downstream CDN; and (2)
>   the synchronous operation of an upstream CDN requesting whether a
>   downstream CDN is prepared to accept a user request and of a
>   downstream CDN responding with how to actually redirect the user
>   request.  This document describes an interface for the latter part,
>   i.e., the CDNI Request Routing Redirection interface.
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-redirection/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of =
submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> CDNi mailing list
> CDNi@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni


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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dus-ascii"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Colleagues,<div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">This version includes editorial changes in response to IESG =
comments.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">We =
expect to do another version to address the DISCUSSes related to privacy =
once we figure out how to do that with RIch &amp; Brian (our privacy =
advisors).</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><div =
class=3D"">Ben<br class=3D""><div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite"=
 class=3D""><div class=3D"">Begin forwarded message:</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div style=3D"margin-top: 0px; =
margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span=
 style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">From: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:internet-drafts@ietf.org" =
class=3D"">internet-drafts@ietf.org</a><br class=3D""></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Subject: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D""><b class=3D"">[CDNi] I-D =
Action: draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18.txt</b><br =
class=3D""></span></div><div style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: =
0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Date: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D"">16 April 2016 07:32:50 BST<br =
class=3D""></span></div><div style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: =
0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">To: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D"">&lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:i-d-announce@ietf.org" =
class=3D"">i-d-announce@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br class=3D""></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Cc: </b></span><span =
style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><a href=3D"mailto:cdni@ietf.org" =
class=3D"">cdni@ietf.org</a><br class=3D""></span></div><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><br class=3D"">A New Internet-Draft is =
available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.<br class=3D"">This=
 draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection =
of the IETF.<br class=3D""><br class=3D""> =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Title =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;: Request =
Routing Redirection interface for CDN Interconnection<br class=3D""> =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Authors =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;: Ben Niven-Jenkins<br =
class=3D""> =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;Ray van Brandenburg<br class=3D""><span class=3D"Apple-tab-span" =
style=3D"white-space:pre">	</span>Filename =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;: =
draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18.txt<br class=3D""><span =
class=3D"Apple-tab-span" style=3D"white-space:pre">	</span>Pages =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;: 31<br =
class=3D""><span class=3D"Apple-tab-span" style=3D"white-space:pre">	=
</span>Date =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;: =
2016-04-15<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">Abstract:<br class=3D""> =
&nbsp;&nbsp;The Request Routing Interface comprises (1) the =
asynchronous<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;advertisement of footprint and =
capabilities by a downstream Content<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;Delivery =
Network (CDN) that allows an upstream CDN to decide whether<br class=3D"">=
 &nbsp;&nbsp;to redirect particular user requests to that downstream =
CDN; and (2)<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;the synchronous operation of an =
upstream CDN requesting whether a<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;downstream =
CDN is prepared to accept a user request and of a<br class=3D""> =
&nbsp;&nbsp;downstream CDN responding with how to actually redirect the =
user<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;request. &nbsp;This document describes =
an interface for the latter part,<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;i.e., the =
CDNI Request Routing Redirection interface.<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">The IETF datatracker status page for this =
draft is:<br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-redirection/" =
class=3D"">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-redirection/</=
a><br class=3D""><br class=3D"">There's also a htmlized version =
available at:<br =
class=3D"">https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">A diff from the previous version is available =
at:<br =
class=3D"">https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-redirection=
-18<br class=3D""><br class=3D""><br class=3D"">Please note that it may =
take a couple of minutes from the time of submission<br class=3D"">until =
the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">Internet-Drafts are also available by =
anonymous FTP at:<br class=3D"">ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/<br =
class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">_______________________________________________<br =
class=3D"">CDNi mailing list<br class=3D"">CDNi@ietf.org<br =
class=3D"">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni<br =
class=3D""></div></blockquote></div><br class=3D""></div></body></html>=

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From nobody Sun Apr 17 04:38:50 2016
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Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Control Interface / Triggers
        Authors         : Rob Murray
                          Ben Niven-Jenkins
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13.txt
	Pages           : 44
	Date            : 2016-04-17

Abstract:
   This document describes the part of the CDN Interconnection Control
   Interface that allows a CDN to trigger activity in an interconnected
   CDN that is configured to deliver content on its behalf.  The
   upstream CDN can use this mechanism to request that the downstream
   CDN pre-positions metadata or content, or that it invalidates or
   purges metadata or content.  The upstream CDN can monitor the status
   of activity that it has triggered in the downstream CDN.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

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From: "Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB)" <rob.murray@nokia.com>
To: Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com>, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>, "Alexey Melnikov" <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm>
Thread-Topic: Ben Campbell's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-11: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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Date: Sun, 17 Apr 2016 11:40:30 +0000
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Cc: "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Ben Campbell's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-11: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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From: "Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB)" <rob.murray@nokia.com>
To: EXT Vincent Roca <vincent.roca@inria.fr>
Thread-Topic: Secdir review of draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-11
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From: "Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB)" <rob.murray@nokia.com>
To: EXT Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com>
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Ben Campbell's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-17: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Ben N-J :-)

I notice in section 4 that you dropped the "1.1" from the mention of 
HTTP. But the reference to RFC 7230 is still 1.1 specific. You might 
consider also adding a reference for http/2.

I will defer to whatever is worked out with Stephen and Alissa for 5.1.

Otherwise, this seems to address all of my comments.

Thanks!

Ben.

On 16 Apr 2016, at 1:55, Ben Niven-Jenkins wrote:

> Hi Ben C,
>
> I wanted to give you an update on where we are:
>
> Iâ€™ve published a -18 that contains all the editorial/other edits 
> made in response to Alissaâ€™s, Stephen's & your comments. That 
> includes aligning the TLS text in the security considerations with 
> that in cdni-logging-25 which is what was agreed in response to 
> Alissaâ€™s DISCUSS.
>
> I believe I have incorporated all the other comments/edits you made 
> into -18 and as far as I can tell there are no outstanding 
> points/comments where you are expecting a response from me or my 
> co-authors.
>
> Let me know if that is not true and I have missed anything.
>
> Thanks
> Ben
>
>
>
>> On 29 Mar 2016, at 00:19, Ben Niven-Jenkins <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk> 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Ben,
>>
>>> On 28 Mar 2016, at 21:52, Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com> wrote:
>>> On 24 Mar 2016, at 10:02, Ben Niven-Jenkins wrote:
>>>>> On 16 Mar 2016, at 02:21, Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com> wrote:
>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> COMMENT:
>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> I have a few comments and questions:
>>>>>
>>>>> # Substantive: #
>>>>>
>>>>> - 3, last paragraph: "Any operational
>>>>> mechanisms this requires, e.g., private key distribution to
>>>>> surrogates and request routers in dCDNs, are outside the scope of
>>>>> this document.  Further mechanisms to notify User Agents of 
>>>>> trusted
>>>>> redirection are also outside the scope of this document."
>>>>>
>>>>> Is it in scope _somewhere_? As it is, this seems like an excuse to 
>>>>> avoid
>>>>> HTTPS, which is not optimal.
>>>>
>>>> I believe it is in scope of the LURK BoF.
>>>>
>>>> I donâ€™t understand your point about avoiding HTTPS. This is 
>>>> saying that once a User Agent connects to a surrogate or request 
>>>> router over HTTPS, that surrogate/request router better be able 
>>>> present the correct certificate, complete a TLS handshake, etc 
>>>> otherwise content delivery will fail. How a surrogate/request 
>>>> router manages to achieve that is outside of the scope of the 
>>>> redirection interface this document is specifying, similar to how a 
>>>> particular origin/web server/etc (without CDNI) manages to achieve 
>>>> that is outside of the scope of the HTTPS spec.
>>>
>>> I'm not suggesting this draft has to offer solutions; that's why I 
>>> asked if the work was in scope "somewhere". But it seems like key 
>>> management, especially in an interoperable fashion, is kind of an 
>>> "elephant in the room" for secure redirection.
>>
>> Yes it is currently. Hopefully LURK will solve that in the future. 
>> Non-standardised techniques similar to some of the LURK proposals are 
>> deployed today, so the key management bit is solved IMO but are not 
>> documented in any kind of formal document AFAIK.
>>
>>>>> -4, first paragraph:
>>>>> Was any thought given to using or supporting HTTP/2?
>>>>
>>>> The authors gave it a bit of thought. It was not raised in the 
>>>> working group from what I remember.
>>>>
>>>> Iâ€™m not sure HTTP/2 is particularly relevant to the 
>>>> specification. The CDNI RI spec is essentially a HTTP API for 
>>>> exchanging CDNI redirection requests/responses. Like any HTTP API 
>>>> it can feasibly be run over HTTP, HTTPS & HTTP/2 as the semantics 
>>>> of all three are the same.
>>>
>>> Is saying it is based on HTTP 1.1 really accurate then? Or maybe 
>>> it's just based on HTTP in general?
>>
>> Good point. Iâ€™ve dropped the 1.1 in my working copy of -18.
>>
>>>>> - 4.2, last paragraph (note)
>>>>> This explicitly makes an IPv6 only CDN non-compliant. Is that the
>>>>> intent?
>>>>
>>>> Iâ€™m not sure how it does that, could you explain?
>>>>
>>>> From my point of view the text is stating what formats for parsing 
>>>> IPv4 & IPv6 addresses implementations must support. It does not say 
>>>> that in order to use the CDNI redirection interface, oneâ€™s CDN 
>>>> must use IPv4.
>>>
>>> Language of the form "MUST SUPPORT X encoded as Y" can be 
>>> interpreted as "MUST support X and MUST support encoding as Y".
>>>
>>> Suggestion:
>>> OLD
>>>  All implementations MUST support IPv4 addresses encoded as
>>>  specified by the â€™IPv4addressâ€™ rule in Section 3.2.2 of 
>>> [RFC3986] and
>>>  MUST support all IPv6 address formats specified in [RFC4291].
>>> NEW
>>>  All implementations that support IPv4 addresses MUST support
>>>  the encoding specified by the â€™IPv4addressâ€™ rule in
>>>  Section 3.2.2 of [RFC3986]. Likewise, implementations that support
>>>  IPv6 addresses MUST support all IPv6 address formats specified in 
>>> [RFC4291].
>>> END
>>
>> Thanks. Iâ€™ve adopted your suggested text in my working copy of -18.
>>
>>>>> - 4.4.1, table, entry for dns-only:
>>>>> The description says "MUST include RTs". That doesn't seem to 
>>>>> consider
>>>>> error cases.
>>>>
>>>> My intention was to state what someone must do under normal 
>>>> circumstances and I assumed that in the case of any error that 
>>>> prevented them from doing that, that they would return an 
>>>> appropriate error response instead.
>>>>
>>>> I can change "If True then dCDN MUST only use DNS redirection and 
>>>> MUST include RTs to one or more surrogates in its RI response."
>>>>
>>>> to
>>>>
>>>> "If True then dCDN MUST only use DNS redirection and MUST include 
>>>> RTs to one or more surrogates in any successful RI response."
>>>>
>>>> (or any other text youâ€™d prefer) if that would alleviate your 
>>>> concern?
>>>
>>> That works for me, thanks!
>>
>> Done.
>>
>>>>> -5.1, 2nd to last paragraph:
>>>>> " In an environment where any such protection is required...," is 
>>>>> a
>>>>> pretty weak recommendation. Would you consider making the default
>>>>> behavior secure? Or at least saying something to the effect of 
>>>>> "Except in
>>>>> networks where similar protections are provided by some other
>>>>> means,â€¦"?
>>>>
>>>> There has been quite a bit of discussion in the CDNI WG around this 
>>>> wording and the WG decided to align the wording it used across all 
>>>> its documents. The first document to progress to IESG was 
>>>> draft-ietf-cdni-logging and the other CDNI drafts (including the 
>>>> redirection one we are discussing) use the same wording as 
>>>> draft-ietf-cdni-logging.
>>>>
>>>> Iâ€™m happy to continue to align the wording in this document with 
>>>> that in draft-ietf-cdni-logging, but I would suggest we avoid 
>>>> repeating the same discussion that is happening around 
>>>> draft-ietf-cdni-logging here.
>>>>
>>>> Francois/Kevin - Can you help here? Has the discussion around this 
>>>> text for draft-ietf-cdni-logging concluded yet?
>>>
>>> I see Alissa has a DISCUSS position on this (and also on 
>>> cdni-logging). I will defer to the outcome of that discussion.
>>
>> Seems it has already been resolved but I missed the edits to the 
>> latest logging draft, so Iâ€™ve adopted those in my working copy of 
>> -18 which should hopefully clear this from both yourself & Alissa 
>> when I publish -18 (thereâ€™s a few more still to be agreed with 
>> Alissa & Stephen).
>>
>>>>> -- third paragraph:
>>>>> I wish the text wasn't so dismissive of attempts to anonymize some 
>>>>> RI
>>>>> request data. I agree doing so may reduce RI effectiveness in some 
>>>>> cases.
>>>>> But that needs to be balanced with privacy needs, and that balance 
>>>>> may
>>>>> not always land on the side of RI effectiveness. And  the 
>>>>> inability to
>>>>> correlate UAs between requests can be a feature in some 
>>>>> circumstances.
>>>>
>>>> I agree where the balance lands may be different depending on 
>>>> circumstances. If you can suggest specific edits/new text that 
>>>> comes across less dismissive, Iâ€™ll incorporate them.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Suggestion:
>>> OLD
>>>  While it is technically possible to mask some information in the RI
>>>  Request, such as the last bits of the UA IP address, it is 
>>> important
>>>  to note that this will reduce the effectivess of the RI in certain
>>>  cases.  As an example, when the UA is behind a Carrier-grade NAT, 
>>> and
>>>  the RI is used to find an appropriate delivery node behind the same
>>>  NAT, the full IP address might be necessary.  Another potential 
>>> issue
>>>  when using IP anonymization is that it is no longer possible to
>>>  correlate an RI Request with a subsequent UA request.
>>> NEW:
>>>  While it is technically possible to mask some information in the RI
>>>  Request, such as the last bits of the UA IP address, it is 
>>> important
>>>  to note that this will reduce the effectivess of the RI in certain
>>>  cases. CDN deployments need to strike a balance between end-user
>>>  privacy and the features impacted by such masking. This balance is
>>>  likely to vary from one deployment to another.  As an example, when
>>>  the UA is behind a Carrier-grade NAT, and the RI is used to find an
>>>  appropriate delivery node behind the same NAT, the full IP address
>>>  might be necessary.  Another potential issue when using IP
>>>  anonymization is that it is no longer possible to correlate an
>>>  RI Request with a subsequent UA request.
>>
>> Iâ€™ve adopted your suggested text. Alissa has a comment on the 
>> language here and Stephen has a discuss on privacy concerns in 
>> general so I suspect this text might change some more before weâ€™re 
>> finished with the document.
>>
>>>>> # Editorial: #
>>>>>
>>>>> - General:
>>>>> There's quite a bit of repetition and redundant text, including 
>>>>> redundant
>>>>> normative text.
>>>>
>>>> Do you think the repetition is harmful? Iâ€™m reluctant to rework 
>>>> the document unless really necessary.
>>>
>>> I personally think such repetition has the potential to confuse the 
>>> reader, or to make life harder for people who may update the draft 
>>> in the future. But I recognize a lot of work has gone into getting 
>>> people to agree to the current language, so I think it's your call.
>>
>> Iâ€™ll probably need to give the document a full read through after 
>> making changes to address Stephenâ€™s discuss so Iâ€™ll look out for 
>> obvious repetition then and have a go at reducing some of it.
>>
>> Ben
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> CDNi mailing list
>> CDNi@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni


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Mirja KÃ¼hlewind has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: No Objection

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I did enter enter 'No Objection' because non of my comments should hold
up publication, however, I really would like to see another revision of
this doc to make it easier to read and understand.

1) Intended status
This documents contains two things
   a) Requirements (or here called Design Decision) for a FCI protocol
   b) Definition of the mandatory base object as well as  needed
registries
While a) would clearly be an informational document, I would see b)
rather as being a Standards track document.
Further, the document reads as if b) was added late in the process. 
So my question is: was the intended status discussed in the working group
and why was it decided to go for information?

2) footprint vs. capabilities
I'm sure (I hope) these terms are well understood in the wg, however, for
me it is still not clear why a footprint is not just a capability but
something special. I understood that other capabilities can be bounded to
a footprint, however, can this not also be true for other capabilities?
E.g. a certain protocol is only supported for a certain content type...
or something like this?
Further, I still don't understand why you need a new term called
footprint. In 2.2 you only talk about coverage which would be the better
(more easy to understand) term for me. Also if you don't support
something because of resource restrictions, this would still simple mean
that you don't cover something.
If those terms are well understand and use in the wg, I do understand if
you don't want to apply any changes anymore here. However, for the
readability it might be helpful to at least add a terminology section at
the very beginning of the doc.

3) Reduce Redundancy
I think it would help the readability if the requirements and the
specification bits would be more clearly separated. I guess all
requirements are listed and explained well in section 2. Therefore all
reasoning given in the later section can simply be removed (and if needed
replaced by a reference to the respective subsection in 2). Further, it's
a little confusion that the requirements are phrased as if they should be
addressesd in a future doc, while some of the requirements are already
addressed in this doc by the given definitions.

4) Requirements
   a) It is mentioned a few times that the additional network load by
sending these information must be limited to a reasonable amount,
however, there is no explicit requirement in section 2 that is saying
this. Would it make sense to add one more requirement here?
   b) Not sure if Focusing on Main Use Cases can/should actually be a
requirement. The question might be rather but are the restrictions you
will have by only focusing on the main use case/what cannot/does not have
to be supported (overlapping coverage?)... however, that might only be a
wording thing.



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Mirja KÃ¼hlewind has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: No Objection

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I did enter enter 'No Objection' because non of my comments should hold
up publication, however, I really would like to see another revision of
this doc to make it easier to read and understand.

1) Intended status
This documents contains two things
   a) Requirements (or here called Design Decision) for a FCI protocol
   b) Definition of the mandatory base object as well as  needed
registries
While a) would clearly be an informational document, I would see b)
rather as being a Standards track document.
Further, the document reads as if b) was added late in the process. 
So my question is: was the intended status discussed in the working group
and why was it decided to go for information?

2) footprint vs. capabilities
I'm sure (I hope) these terms are well understood in the wg, however, for
me it is still not clear why a footprint is not just a capability but
something special. I understood that other capabilities can be bounded to
a footprint, however, can this not also be true for other capabilities?
E.g. a certain protocol is only supported for a certain content type...
or something like this?
Further, I still don't understand why you need a new term called
footprint. In 2.2 you only talk about coverage which would be the better
(more easy to understand) term for me. Also if you don't support
something because of resource restrictions, this would still simple mean
that you don't cover something.
If those terms are well understand and use in the wg, I do understand if
you don't want to apply any changes anymore here. However, for the
readability it might be helpful to at least add a terminology section at
the very beginning of the doc.

3) Reduce Redundancy
I think it would help the readability if the requirements and the
specification bits would be more clearly separated. I guess all
requirements are listed and explained well in section 2. Therefore all
reasoning given in the later section can simply be removed (and if needed
replaced by a reference to the respective subsection in 2). Further, it's
a little confusion that the requirements are phrased as if they should be
addressesd in a future doc, while some of the requirements are already
addressed in this doc by the given definitions.

4) Requirements
   a) It is mentioned a few times that the additional network load by
sending these information must be limited to a reasonable amount,
however, there is no explicit requirement in section 2 that is saying
this. Would it make sense to add one more requirement here?
   b) Not sure if Focusing on Main Use Cases can/should actually be a
requirement. The question might be rather but are the restrictions you
will have by only focusing on the main use case/what cannot/does not have
to be supported (overlapping coverage?)... however, that might only be a
wording thing.

5) References:
[RFC2818], [RFC5226], [RFC7230], and [RFC7525] should be informational,
while potentially some of the informational refernces, e.g. RFC6770,
should be normative.



From nobody Wed Apr 20 09:03:48 2016
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Mirja KÃ¼hlewind has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: No Objection

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I did enter enter 'No Objection' because non of my comments should hold
up publication, however, I really would like to see another revision of
this doc to make it easier to read and understand.

1) Intended status
This documents contains two things
   a) Requirements (or here called Design Decision) for a FCI protocol
   b) Definition of the mandatory base object as well as  needed
registries
While a) would clearly be an informational document, I would see b)
rather as being a Standards track document.
Further, the document reads as if b) was added late in the process. 
So my question is: was the intended status discussed in the working group
and why was it decided to go for information?

2) footprint vs. capabilities
I'm sure (I hope) these terms are well understood in the wg, however, for
me it is still not clear why a footprint is not just a capability but
something special. I understood that other capabilities can be bounded to
a footprint, however, can this not also be true for other capabilities?
E.g. a certain protocol is only supported for a certain content type...
or something like this?
Further, I still don't understand why you need a new term called
footprint. In 2.2 you only talk about coverage which would be the better
(more easy to understand) term for me. Also if you don't support
something because of resource restrictions, this would still simple mean
that you don't cover something.
If those terms are well understand and use in the wg, I do understand if
you don't want to apply any changes anymore here. However, for the
readability it might be helpful to at least add a terminology section at
the very beginning of the doc.

3) Reduce Redundancy
I think it would help the readability if the requirements and the
specification bits would be more clearly separated. I guess all
requirements are listed and explained well in section 2. Therefore all
reasoning given in the later section can simply be removed (and if needed
replaced by a reference to the respective subsection in 2). Further, it's
a little confusion that the requirements are phrased as if they should be
addressesd in a future doc, while some of the requirements are already
addressed in this doc by the given definitions.

4) Requirements
   a) It is mentioned a few times that the additional network load by
sending these information must be limited to a reasonable amount,
however, there is no explicit requirement in section 2 that is saying
this. Would it make sense to add one more requirement here?
   b) Not sure if Focusing on Main Use Cases can/should actually be a
requirement. The question might be rather but are the restrictions you
will have by only focusing on the main use case/what cannot/does not have
to be supported (overlapping coverage?)... however, that might only be a
wording thing.

5) References:
[RFC2818], [RFC5226], [RFC7230], and [RFC7525] should be informative,
while potentially some of the innformative refernces, e.g. RFC6770,
should be normative.



From nobody Wed Apr 20 11:19:52 2016
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Alissa Cooper has entered the following ballot position for
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
DISCUSS:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I agree with Mirja's point #1, and I think it is DISCUSS-worthy. The
document seems to be a mix of almost stream-of-conscious reasoning for
how the WG arrived at particular design decisions (which probably doesn't
need to be in the document at all), requirements on the CDNI FCI,
requirements on CDNs (Sec. 5), and then the definition of objects the FCI
will use. At a minimum, the last two of these seem like they need to be
in a standards-track document if interoperability is to be achieved.
Thinking about it another way, when an FCI solution document does get
written, won't it need a normative reference to this document because of
Section 7? My hunch is that the answer is yes.


----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

(1) In line with Mirja's points #1 and #3, I also that the intermingling
and redundancy in the text makes the document unclear and probably not
too easily accessible for implementers (e.g., burying requirements about
what CDNs should and shouldn't advertise in the middle of a document that
up to that point seemed to be mostly about the motivations for designing
footprints/capabilities in particular ways). I would suggest streamlining
the text so that the requirements on the FCI are clearly enumerated, and
the motivation text is stripped or moved later in the document.

(2) Section 4: "For all of these mandatory-to-implement footprint types
..." seems like a misuse of the term "mandatory-to-implement." I thought
this section was specifying requirements for the FCI which is to be
specified, but this implies that all conforming implementations would
also have to implement all of the footprint types (country code, AS, and
IP prefix). Has that already been decided as well? If so, it could be
explained more clearly in the text.



From nobody Wed Apr 20 13:12:30 2016
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I agree with Alissa's discuss and comments (and transitively, Mirja's
comments). Specifically, I agree that the object definitions seem like
they should be PS, and that much of the motivational text seems like
input to the working group process, not output from it.

Additionally, I find the mix of using 2119 language for implementation
requirements and requirements on protocol work confusing--especially in
those sections where 2119 keywords are intermixed with the aforementioned
motivational text.



From nobody Wed Apr 20 15:20:21 2016
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: Ben Campbell <ben@nostrum.com>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Ben Campbell's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: (with COMMENT)
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Ben Campbell's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: (with COMMENT)
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To: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>, Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
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From: Jan Seedorf <jan.seedorf@hft-stuttgart.de>
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Date: Thu, 21 Apr 2016 09:56:00 +0200
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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Hi Alissa and Mirja,

just add to Kevin's points below:
-- We are open for suggestions on how to resolve the normative reference 
issue.
-- Indeed a lot of the text explains how the WG arrived at some design 
decisions. Since some of these decisions were not so obvious at the 
beginning (and are the result of lengthy discussions and consensus 
building), the documents tries to capture our reasoning for the future, 
i.e. the time when the CDNI WG will have finished its work. Having said 
that, the text can most likely be shortened and streamlined, Kevin and I 
will try that.

  - Jan

Am 21.04.2016 um 00:38 schrieb Kevin Ma J:
> Hi Alissa,
>
>    Thanks for the review.  Some responses to your comments:
>
>    As mentioned in the response to Mirja's comments, a lot of the text is historical and was intended to document how we came to the decisions that we did, after having spent a lot of time in circular discussions, to try and avoid getting into those discussions again in the future.
>
>    wrt normative references to this document, your hunch is correct, and in my latest version of draft-ma-cdni-capabilities-08 I did make the reference to this document normative.  As mentioned in the response to Mirja's comments, I'm open to suggestions on the best resolution.
>
>    1. I can try to edit the doc for better flow/readability.
>
>    2. The footprint discussion in CDNI has a long history (of arguing about what is a "good" footprint), but we agreed to take these 3 footprint types, which we agreed would be useful, and start with them; we also then agreed to have a registry where we could define new (better, more flavourful) footprint types in the future.  The footprint types in this document match the footprint types defined in the forthcoming CDNI Metadata interface document (which creates the registry and registers these types).  I think what we mean by "mandatory-to-implement" is that all implementations must understand how to parse these footprint types.  The question of how to interpret them, i.e., how to map a US country code footprint, or a specific AS number footprint, to a client request is beyond the scope of the document.  I could try to clarify that in the text.
>
> thanx!
>
> --  Kevin J. Ma
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Alissa Cooper [mailto:alissa@cooperw.in]
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2016 2:20 PM
>> To: The IESG
>> Cc: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics@ietf.org; Francois Le
>> Faucheur; cdni-chairs@ietf.org; flefauch@cisco.com; cdni@ietf.org
>> Subject: Alissa Cooper's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-
>> capabilities-semantics-16: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
>>
>> Alissa Cooper has entered the following ballot position for
>> draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: Discuss
>>
>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
>> introductory paragraph, however.)
>>
>>
>> Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>>
>>
>> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
>> semantics/
>>
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> DISCUSS:
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> I agree with Mirja's point #1, and I think it is DISCUSS-worthy. The
>> document seems to be a mix of almost stream-of-conscious reasoning for
>> how the WG arrived at particular design decisions (which probably doesn't
>> need to be in the document at all), requirements on the CDNI FCI,
>> requirements on CDNs (Sec. 5), and then the definition of objects the FCI
>> will use. At a minimum, the last two of these seem like they need to be
>> in a standards-track document if interoperability is to be achieved.
>> Thinking about it another way, when an FCI solution document does get
>> written, won't it need a normative reference to this document because of
>> Section 7? My hunch is that the answer is yes.
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> COMMENT:
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> (1) In line with Mirja's points #1 and #3, I also that the intermingling
>> and redundancy in the text makes the document unclear and probably not
>> too easily accessible for implementers (e.g., burying requirements about
>> what CDNs should and shouldn't advertise in the middle of a document that
>> up to that point seemed to be mostly about the motivations for designing
>> footprints/capabilities in particular ways). I would suggest streamlining
>> the text so that the requirements on the FCI are clearly enumerated, and
>> the motivation text is stripped or moved later in the document.
>>
>> (2) Section 4: "For all of these mandatory-to-implement footprint types
>> ..." seems like a misuse of the term "mandatory-to-implement." I thought
>> this section was specifying requirements for the FCI which is to be
>> specified, but this implies that all conforming implementations would
>> also have to implement all of the footprint types (country code, AS, and
>> IP prefix). Has that already been decided as well? If so, it could be
>> explained more clearly in the text.
>>
> _______________________________________________
> CDNi mailing list
> CDNi@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni

-- 
****************************
Prof. Dr. Jan Seedorf
jan.seedorf@hft-stuttgart.de
****************************
Hochschule für Technik Stuttgart
Fakultät Vermessung, Informatik und Mathematik
Schellingstr. 24
D-70174 Stuttgart
www.hft-stuttgart.de
****************************



  


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Subject: [CDNi] Stephen Farrell's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: (with COMMENT)
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Stephen Farrell has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: No Objection

When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
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Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
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The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/



----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------


- I wonder if IETF participants know if the phrase "included in
a standard adopted by IETF" used in the IPR declaration does
or does not apply to this informational document? FWIW, I do
not know.  (We see this from time to time and mostly I think
it's just a case of using company-standard IPR boilerplate and
not considering informational and experimental RFCs, but who
knows. I think I do recall one company modifying their IPR
boilerplate before when this ambiguity was pointed out to
them, so maybe if someone knows someone here, that'd be good
info to pass on...:-)

- section 4: I don't get why a full IP address is needed here,
i.e. the v4 /32 or v6 /128. Why is that? And if it is needed,
will it cause the usual CDNI privacy issue for a standards
track document?

- 7.5: the value "https1.1" is odd - would that really be
used?



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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics
        Authors         : Jan Seedorf
                          Jon Peterson
                          Stefano Previdi
                          Ray van Brandenburg
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17.txt
	Pages           : 27
	Date            : 2016-04-23

Abstract:
   This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
   interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
   "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
   document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
   further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
   for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
   registries can be extended in the future.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17.txt
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Hi All,

  This update is to address IESG review comments:
  - It moves most of the historical information to appendices
  - It adds a terminology section to define footprints and capabilities
  - It adds the logging and metadata objects
  - It removes the requirement for /32 and /128 IPv4 and IPv6 addresses res=
pectively
  - It removes mandatory-to-implement footprint types
  - It changes the draft from Informational to Standards Track

thanx.

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CDNi [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-
> drafts@ietf.org
> Sent: Saturday, April 23, 2016 12:51 PM
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-17.txt
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio=
n
> of the IETF.
>=20
>         Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilitie=
s
> Semantics
>         Authors         : Jan Seedorf
>                           Jon Peterson
>                           Stefano Previdi
>                           Ray van Brandenburg
>                           Kevin J. Ma
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-
> 17.txt
> 	Pages           : 27
> 	Date            : 2016-04-23
>=20
> Abstract:
>    This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
>    interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
>    "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
>    document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
>    further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
>    for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
>    registries can be extended in the future.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-17
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilitie=
s-
> semantics-17
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
> submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
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> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>=20
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
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From nobody Sat Apr 23 10:59:36 2016
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Stephen Farrell's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: (with COMMENT)
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Stephen Farrell's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: (with COMMENT)
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: Alissa Cooper <alissa@cooperw.in>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Alissa Cooper's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's Discuss on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
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A new meeting session request has just been submitted by Kevin J. Ma, a Chair of the cdni working group.


---------------------------------------------------------
Working Group Name: Content Delivery Networks Interconnection
Area Name: Applications and Real-Time Area
Session Requester: Kevin Ma

Number of Sessions: 1
Length of Session(s):  2 Hours
Number of Attendees: 50
Conflicts to Avoid: 
 First Priority: alto httpbis lurk tls
 Second Priority: appsawg dispatch



Special Requests:
  
---------------------------------------------------------


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---------------------------------------------------------
Working Group Name: Content Delivery Networks Interconnection
Area Name: Applications and Real-Time Area
Session Requester: Kevin Ma

Number of Sessions: 1
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 First Priority: alto httpbis lurk tls
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Special Requests:
  
---------------------------------------------------------


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Hi Kevin,

thanks a lot for performing these changes. The document is much clearer =
now. Did you confirm these changes on the wg mailing list to make the wg =
aware of it?

There are a few minor nits the RCF editor will for sure care about. I =
only have three remaining comments/questions:

1) section 2.5. reads still a little weird because it rather seems to be =
a summary or conclusion of the previous sections than a new subsection =
on the same level than the previous ones. However, I don=E2=80=99t have =
a real suggestion how to fix that. Maybe just add one more introductory =
sentence. But t=E2=80=99s also okay to leave it as it is.

2) In section 6 I found the term "hop-by-hop transport-layer security =
mechanisms=E2=80=9C. Shouldn=E2=80=99t this be =E2=80=9Eend-to-end =
=E2=80=A6=E2=80=9C?

3) Please also check the references again. I=E2=80=99ve added this =
comment later to my ballot position, so you=E2=80=99ve probably have not =
seen it. I still believe that probably the second half of the normative =
references should be informative and 1-2 of the CDNi informative ones =
should be normative. Please check again!

Mirja


> Am 23.04.2016 um 19:13 schrieb Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>:
>=20
> Hi Mirja,
>=20
>  We have restructured the document, removing the focus on the main use =
case and moving the main use case and other historical stuff to =
appendices and trying to make clear just what the decisions were and =
what the requirements are.  This should address the redundancy issue.  =
We have also added a terminology section to better clarify what we mean =
by footprint and capability.  Finally, we changed the document from =
Informational to Standards Track and moved over the two missing object =
definitions from draft-ma-cdni-capabilities.
>=20
>  I think the document is much more readable and functional now.  Thank =
you for your input.
>=20
> thanx!
>=20
> --  Kevin J. Ma
>=20
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Kevin Ma J
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2016 6:21 PM
>> To: 'Mirja Kuehlewind'; The IESG
>> Cc: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics@ietf.org; cdni-
>> chairs@ietf.org; cdni@ietf.org
>> Subject: RE: Mirja K=C3=BChlewind's No Objection on =
draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-
>> capabilities-semantics-16: (with COMMENT)
>>=20
>> Hi Mirja,
>>=20
>>  Thank you for the review.  Some responses to your comments:
>>=20
>>  1. You are correct, the base object definition was added later.  The =
WG
>> had agreed that this draft would create a registry for capabilities =
(which
>> we later aligned with the forthcoming Metadata interface draft to use =
the
>> Payload Type registry) and register the mandatory capabilities listed =
in
>> the document.  The discussion with the AD was that just creating a
>> registry was not a reason to make it Standards Track.  The Payload =
Type
>> registry, though, requires an object definition and serialization =
example,
>> so the objects were added to this document.
>>=20
>>     I guess I see three options:
>>=20
>>     a) Leave the document as Informational,
>>     b) Change the document to Standards Track, or
>>     c) Move the object definitions and Payload Type registrations to
>> another draft.
>>=20
>>     I'm open to suggestions as to what the best approach here would =
be?
>>=20
>>  2. Footprint is the term used in the Problem Statement (RFC6707), =
Use
>> Case (RFC6770) and corresponding Metadata =
(draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-13)
>> documents, so I'd prefer to keep the term, but I can add a =
Terminology
>> section in the next version.
>>=20
>>  3. Understood.  A lot of the sections are there for historical =
context,
>> but I'll give it another read through and try to remove some =
redundancy in
>> the next version.
>>=20
>>  4. a) The WG spent a lot of time debating what is the correct amount =
of
>> data to send, which was the reason we wrote this document.  I don't =
think
>> we want to limit the sending of more data; our goal was to limit the
>> problem scope WG.  I'm not sure we need to add another requirement =
for
>> network load; I'm also not sure how we would quantify it.
>>     b) I agree that there is probably more emphasis than necessary on =
the
>> Main Use Case.  As a historical note, that was there to help move us
>> forward toward a decision.  I can try to wordsmith that in the next
>> version.
>>=20
>> thanx!
>>=20
>> --  Kevin J. Ma
>>=20
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Mirja Kuehlewind [mailto:ietf@kuehlewind.net]
>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2016 11:29 AM
>>> To: The IESG
>>> Cc: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics@ietf.org; =
Francois
>> Le
>>> Faucheur; cdni-chairs@ietf.org; flefauch@cisco.com; cdni@ietf.org
>>> Subject: Mirja K=C3=BChlewind's No Objection on =
draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-
>>> capabilities-semantics-16: (with COMMENT)
>>>=20
>>> Mirja K=C3=BChlewind has entered the following ballot position for
>>> draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-16: No Objection
>>>=20
>>> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to =
all
>>> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut =
this
>>> introductory paragraph, however.)
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-
>> criteria.html
>>> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
>>> =
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
>>> semantics/
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> =
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> COMMENT:
>>> =
----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>=20
>>> I did enter enter 'No Objection' because non of my comments should =
hold
>>> up publication, however, I really would like to see another revision =
of
>>> this doc to make it easier to read and understand.
>>>=20
>>> 1) Intended status
>>> This documents contains two things
>>>   a) Requirements (or here called Design Decision) for a FCI =
protocol
>>>   b) Definition of the mandatory base object as well as  needed
>>> registries
>>> While a) would clearly be an informational document, I would see b)
>>> rather as being a Standards track document.
>>> Further, the document reads as if b) was added late in the process.
>>> So my question is: was the intended status discussed in the working
>> group
>>> and why was it decided to go for information?
>>>=20
>>> 2) footprint vs. capabilities
>>> I'm sure (I hope) these terms are well understood in the wg, =
however,
>> for
>>> me it is still not clear why a footprint is not just a capability =
but
>>> something special. I understood that other capabilities can be =
bounded
>> to
>>> a footprint, however, can this not also be true for other =
capabilities?
>>> E.g. a certain protocol is only supported for a certain content =
type...
>>> or something like this?
>>> Further, I still don't understand why you need a new term called
>>> footprint. In 2.2 you only talk about coverage which would be the =
better
>>> (more easy to understand) term for me. Also if you don't support
>>> something because of resource restrictions, this would still simple =
mean
>>> that you don't cover something.
>>> If those terms are well understand and use in the wg, I do =
understand if
>>> you don't want to apply any changes anymore here. However, for the
>>> readability it might be helpful to at least add a terminology =
section at
>>> the very beginning of the doc.
>>>=20
>>> 3) Reduce Redundancy
>>> I think it would help the readability if the requirements and the
>>> specification bits would be more clearly separated. I guess all
>>> requirements are listed and explained well in section 2. Therefore =
all
>>> reasoning given in the later section can simply be removed (and if
>> needed
>>> replaced by a reference to the respective subsection in 2). Further,
>> it's
>>> a little confusion that the requirements are phrased as if they =
should
>> be
>>> addressesd in a future doc, while some of the requirements are =
already
>>> addressed in this doc by the given definitions.
>>>=20
>>> 4) Requirements
>>>   a) It is mentioned a few times that the additional network load by
>>> sending these information must be limited to a reasonable amount,
>>> however, there is no explicit requirement in section 2 that is =
saying
>>> this. Would it make sense to add one more requirement here?
>>>   b) Not sure if Focusing on Main Use Cases can/should actually be a
>>> requirement. The question might be rather but are the restrictions =
you
>>> will have by only focusing on the main use case/what cannot/does not
>> have
>>> to be supported (overlapping coverage?)... however, that might only =
be a
>>> wording thing.
>>>=20
>=20


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From nobody Tue Apr 26 21:29:01 2016
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Subject: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18: (with COMMENT)
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Alissa Cooper has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-cdni-redirection-18: No Objection

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for explaining the parts I didn't get and addressing the rest of
my DISCUSS.

I do still think the CGN example in 5.2 is not clear as written --
probably needs further explanation or removal as Ben suggested.



From nobody Wed Apr 27 07:57:44 2016
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Subject: [CDNi] Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17: (with COMMENT)
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Alexey Melnikov has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17: Yes

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Are examples in the document in JSON? If yes, you need to have JSON as a
reference. Informative if they are just examples, Normative otherwise.



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To: Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm>
Thread-Topic: Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17: (with COMMENT)
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Alexey,

  Thanks for the review!  I will add a JSON reference.

thanx!

--  Kevin J. Ma

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 27, 2016, at 10:57 AM, Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm> wr=
ote:
>=20
> Alexey Melnikov has entered the following ballot position for
> draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17: Yes
>=20
> When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> introductory paragraph, however.)
>=20
>=20
> Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html
> for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
>=20
>=20
> The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-s=
emantics/
>=20
>=20
>=20
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> COMMENT:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>=20
> Are examples in the document in JSON? If yes, you need to have JSON as a
> reference. Informative if they are just examples, Normative otherwise.
>=20
>=20


From nobody Thu Apr 28 07:34:02 2016
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Alissa Cooper has entered the following ballot position for
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for updating the document status. Will re-review when it comes
back to the IESG. Leaving my comment below since I haven't re-reviewed
yet.

(2) Section 4: "For all of these mandatory-to-implement footprint types
..." seems like a misuse of the term "mandatory-to-implement." I thought
this section was specifying requirements for the FCI which is to be
specified, but this implies that all conforming implementations would
also have to implement all of the footprint types (country code, AS, and
IP prefix). Has that already been decided as well? If so, it could be
explained more clearly in the text.



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The IESG has received a request from the Content Delivery Networks
Interconnection WG (cdni) to consider the following document:
- 'CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics'
  <draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17.txt> as Proposed
Standard

This is a Second IETF LC, because the document status changed from
Informational to Proposed Standard. 

The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits
final comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the
ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2016-05-12. Exceptionally, comments may be
sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the
beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting.

Abstract

   This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
   interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
   "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
   document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
   further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
   for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
   registries can be extended in the future.

The file can be obtained via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/

IESG discussion can be tracked via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/ballot/


The following IPR Declarations may be related to this I-D:

   https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/2656/


From nobody Thu Apr 28 09:32:59 2016
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Below is my AD review. I am sorry if my comments are a bit cryptic, feel
free to ask for clarifying questions.

First mention of HTTP, its methods or response codes needs to have a
reference to RFC 7230. This applies to section 2.
Similarly, the first reference to URL should clarify that you only mean
http/https URLs and use RFC 7230 as well.

In Section 4 you are referencing generic HTTP without any version number
and saying that any HTTP feature can be used. I think you really need to
have at least a version number here, because I don't think you mean
HTTP/2.0. Adding the above references probably makes this comment
unimportant.

In 4.1, at the bottom of page 10: "dCDN SHOULD track and report..." -
how?

In 4.6: a normative reference that defines AS is needed here.

How is HTTP Authentication done?

Does CBOR-CDDL reference needs to be Normative? While the Appendix is
Informative, CBOR-CDDL need to be understood in order to interpret it.

In 5.2.2: is the list of trigger types extensible? If yes, does it need
an IANA registry?

Similar: 5.2.7 (error types). I suspect the answer is yes here.

Media type: should it have +json suffix? Is the currently defined media
type deployed?

On page 36 - should the URL include "pending", not "complete" (as per the
description before this and the previous request/response).



From nobody Thu Apr 28 09:53:56 2016
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDN Interconnection Metadata
        Authors         : Ben Niven-Jenkins
                          Rob Murray
                          Matt Caulfield
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-16.txt
	Pages           : 62
	Date            : 2016-04-28

Abstract:
   The Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) metadata
   interface enables interconnected Content Delivery Networks (CDNs) to
   exchange content distribution metadata in order to enable content
   acquisition and delivery.  The CDNI metadata associated with a piece
   of content provides a downstream CDN with sufficient information for
   the downstream CDN to service content requests on behalf of an
   upstream CDN.  This document describes both a base set of CDNI
   metadata and the protocol for exchanging that metadata.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-16

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-16


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Thu Apr 28 09:55:31 2016
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-16.txt
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Hi All,

  I updated the references to make I-JSON normative.

thanx.

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CDNi [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-
> drafts@ietf.org
> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2016 12:54 PM
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-16.txt
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio=
n
> of the IETF.
>=20
>         Title           : CDN Interconnection Metadata
>         Authors         : Ben Niven-Jenkins
>                           Rob Murray
>                           Matt Caulfield
>                           Kevin J. Ma
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-16.txt
> 	Pages           : 62
> 	Date            : 2016-04-28
>=20
> Abstract:
>    The Content Delivery Networks Interconnection (CDNI) metadata
>    interface enables interconnected Content Delivery Networks (CDNs) to
>    exchange content distribution metadata in order to enable content
>    acquisition and delivery.  The CDNI metadata associated with a piece
>    of content provides a downstream CDN with sufficient information for
>    the downstream CDN to service content requests on behalf of an
>    upstream CDN.  This document describes both a base set of CDNI
>    metadata and the protocol for exchanging that metadata.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-metadata-16
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-metadata-16
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
> submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>=20
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Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-18.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnection of the IETF.

        Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics
        Authors         : Jan Seedorf
                          Jon Peterson
                          Stefano Previdi
                          Ray van Brandenburg
                          Kevin J. Ma
	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-18.txt
	Pages           : 27
	Date            : 2016-04-28

Abstract:
   This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
   interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
   "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
   Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
   document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
   further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
   for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
   registries can be extended in the future.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-18

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-18


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Thu Apr 28 10:08:18 2016
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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-18.txt
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Hi All,

  This update addresses additional comments from the IESG:
  - Made the conclusion in section 2.5 its own section for readability
  - Added an encoding section (mostly lifted from metadata) that makes I-JS=
ON a MUST.
  - Moved the HTTPS references informative, and made the Framework and JSON=
 references normative

thanx.

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: CDNi [mailto:cdni-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-
> drafts@ietf.org
> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2016 1:05 PM
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: [CDNi] I-D Action: draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-18.txt
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
> directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Content Delivery Networks Interconnectio=
n
> of the IETF.
>=20
>         Title           : CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilitie=
s
> Semantics
>         Authors         : Jan Seedorf
>                           Jon Peterson
>                           Stefano Previdi
>                           Ray van Brandenburg
>                           Kevin J. Ma
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-
> 18.txt
> 	Pages           : 27
> 	Date            : 2016-04-28
>=20
> Abstract:
>    This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
>    interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
>    "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
>    document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
>    further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
>    for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
>    registries can be extended in the future.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics-18
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilitie=
s-
> semantics-18
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
> submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> CDNi mailing list
> CDNi@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/cdni


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From: Kevin Ma J <kevin.j.ma@ericsson.com>
To: Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm>
Thread-Topic: Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17: (with COMMENT)
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Cc: Francois Le Faucheur <flefauch@cisco.com>, "cdni-chairs@ietf.org" <cdni-chairs@ietf.org>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, "cdni@ietf.org" <cdni@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Alexey,

  I added a new section in -18 requiring I-JSON encoding.

thanx!

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Kevin Ma J
> Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2016 1:13 PM
> To: Alexey Melnikov
> Cc: The IESG; draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics@ietf.org;
> Francois Le Faucheur; cdni-chairs@ietf.org; cdni@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-
> capabilities-semantics-17: (with COMMENT)
>=20
> Hi Alexey,
>=20
>   Thanks for the review!  I will add a JSON reference.
>=20
> thanx!
>=20
> --  Kevin J. Ma
>=20
> Sent from my iPhone
>=20
> > On Apr 27, 2016, at 10:57 AM, Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm>
> wrote:
> >
> > Alexey Melnikov has entered the following ballot position for
> > draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17: Yes
> >
> > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all
> > email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this
> > introductory paragraph, however.)
> >
> >
> > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-
> criteria.html
> > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions.
> >
> >
> > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here:
> > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities=
-
> semantics/
> >
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > COMMENT:
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Are examples in the document in JSON? If yes, you need to have JSON as =
a
> > reference. Informative if they are just examples, Normative otherwise.
> >
> >


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From nobody Thu Apr 28 13:32:33 2016
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From: "Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB)" <rob.murray@nokia.com>
To: EXT Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm>
Thread-Topic: [CDNi] Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13: (with COMMENT)
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Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2016 20:32:26 +0000
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Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13: (with COMMENT)
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From: Alexey Melnikov <aamelnikov@fastmail.fm>
To: "Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB)" <rob.murray@nokia.com>
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Cc: flefauch@cisco.com, cdni@ietf.org, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers@ietf.org, cdni-chairs@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Alexey Melnikov's Yes on draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13: (with COMMENT)
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Hi Rob,

On Thu, Apr 28, 2016, at 09:32 PM, Murray, Rob (Nokia - GB) wrote:
> Hi Alexey - thank you for the review. Responses inline...
> 
> Rob.
> 
> 
> On 28/04/2016, 17:32, "CDNi on behalf of EXT Alexey Melnikov"
> <cdni-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of aamelnikov@fastmail.fm> wrote:

 [snip]

> >----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >COMMENT:
> >----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Below is my AD review. I am sorry if my comments are a bit cryptic, feel
> >free to ask for clarifying questions.
> >
> >First mention of HTTP, its methods or response codes needs to have a
> >reference to RFC 7230. This applies to section 2.
> >
> >Similarly, the first reference to URL should clarify that you only mean
> >http/https URLs and use RFC 7230 as well.
> 
> How about I add this paragraph to section 2? ...
> 
>   The CI/T interface builds on top of HTTP/1.1 [RFC7230]. References
>   to URL in this document relate to http/https URIs, as defined in
>   [RFC7230] section 2.7.

Looks good to me.

> >In Section 4 you are referencing generic HTTP without any version number
> >and saying that any HTTP feature can be used. I think you really need to
> >have at least a version number here, because I don't think you mean
> >HTTP/2.0. Adding the above references probably makes this comment
> >unimportant.
> 
> I don't think there's any reason CI/T wouldn't work under HTTP/2.0 but
> yes, for interop we need to pick a version - and I think we've all been
> assuming HTTP/1.1. As you say, the reference should cover it.

Right.

> >In 4.1, at the bottom of page 10: "dCDN SHOULD track and report..." -
> >how?
> 
> I guess you mean how should it report, not how should it track (which
> is down to the implementation of course).
> 
> Section 2 already says:
> 
>    The CI/T interface is a web service offered by the dCDN.  It allows
>    CI/T commands to be issued, and triggered activity to be tracked.
>    When the dCDN accepts a CI/T Command it creates a resource describing
>    status of the triggered activity, a Trigger Status Resource.  The
>    uCDN can poll Trigger Status Resources to monitor progress.
> 
> So I could change section 4.1's sentence:
> 
>    The dCDN SHOULD track and report on progress of CI/T Trigger
>    Commands. 
> 
> To:
> 
>    The dCDN SHOULD track and report on progress of CI/T Trigger
>    Commands using a Trigger Status Resource (Section 5.1.2).

Yes, this is much better. Thank you.

> >In 4.6: a normative reference that defines AS is needed here.
> 
> Would RFC 1930 be the right choice?

I think so. Are you using 16bit or 32bit version?

> >How is HTTP Authentication done?
> 
> Sorry, not sure what the context is. Section 8.1 says:
> 
>    TLS MUST be used by the server-side (dCDN) and the client-side (uCDN)
>    of the CI/T interface, including authentication of the remote end
>    [...]
> 
> (But I think I'm missing your point?)

I think this section needs more details on how client and server
identities are verified. In particular what should the client side look
for in server certificates?

> >Does CBOR-CDDL reference needs to be Normative? While the Appendix is
> >Informative, CBOR-CDDL need to be understood in order to interpret it.
> 
> I don't think so. It's an informative section, so if the reader wants to
> be informed they can read the informative reference. It doesn't affect
> the normative spec of the interface.
> 
> Making the JSON formalisation and its ref non-normative was the outcome
> of discussion on the list, following Barry's AD review...
> 
>   https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/cdni/c_UwFN-pCAJ9GyE_0G-i_nR6mAI

Ok. I think if CDDL nevers gets published, there is still a possibility
of the appendix becoming pointless, but I can live with this.

> Also, if I was implementing CI/T from the draft, I think I'd find it
> handy
> with just an intuitive understanding of the notation.

 [snip]

> >Media type: should it have +json suffix? Is the currently defined media
> >type deployed?
> 
> Not sure, I thought it was JSON by-definition, but happy to be corrected.
> I don't think it's deployed.

I think it might be useful to stick +json at the end (and update all
examples to match).

> >On page 36 - should the URL include "pending", not "complete" (as per the
> >description before this and the previous request/response).
> 
> That's section 6.2.5, the example where "/triggers/0" gets deleted?
> 
> I think "complete" is right, section 6.2.4 follows it through
> "pending" to "complete" (on page 35).

At the bottom of page 34 there is the following text:

When the CI/T Trigger Command is complete, the contents of the
 filtered collections will be updated along with their Entity Tags.
 For example, when the two example CI/T Trigger Commands are complete,
 the collections of pending and complete Trigger Status Resources
 might look like:

after that there are 2 examples on pages 35 and 36, both with URI
"/triggers/complete". I think one of the should be " /triggers/pending,
I think it is the one on page 35.

Best Regards,
Alexey


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From: "Niven - Jenkins, Ben (Nokia - GB)" <ben.niven-jenkins@nokia.com>
To: EXT Ben Niven-Jenkins <ben@niven-jenkins.co.uk>, Stephen Farrell <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie>
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From nobody Fri Apr 29 13:20:58 2016
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From: "Alissa Cooper" <alissa@cooperw.in>
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Cc: flefauch@cisco.com, cdni@ietf.org, draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers@ietf.org, cdni-chairs@ietf.org
Subject: [CDNi] Alissa Cooper's No Objection on draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13: (with COMMENT)
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Alissa Cooper has entered the following ballot position for
draft-ietf-cdni-control-triggers-13: No Objection

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for addressing my comments.



From nobody Fri Apr 29 13:39:49 2016
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Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/cdni/XRhzirDDCM3J70Tt7hBcFPkoJBI>
Subject: Re: [CDNi] Last Call: <draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17.txt> (CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics) to Proposed Standard
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Hi All,

  You have hopefully seen (and read) the emails and discussion with the ADs=
 about the FCI Semantics draft, and seen (and read) the recent draft update=
s.  A new last call has been issued, ending May 12.

  The -18 version addresses all the AD comments thus far.  If anyone has co=
ncerns about the elevation of the document to Standards Track or the focus =
on the FCI objects and decisions (while moving background discussion to app=
endices) please let us know.

thanx!

--  Kevin J. Ma

> -----Original Message-----
> From: iesg-secretary@ietf.org [mailto:iesg-secretary@ietf.org]
> Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2016 11:58 AM
> To: IETF-Announce
> Cc: flefauch@cisco.com; cdni-chairs@ietf.org; draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-
> capabilities-semantics@ietf.org; alexey.melnikov@isode.com; cdni@ietf.org=
;
> Francois Le Faucheur
> Subject: Last Call: <draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-
> 17.txt> (CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics) to
> Proposed Standard
>=20
>=20
> The IESG has received a request from the Content Delivery Networks
> Interconnection WG (cdni) to consider the following document:
> - 'CDNI Request Routing: Footprint and Capabilities Semantics'
>   <draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-semantics-17.txt> as Proposed
> Standard
>=20
> This is a Second IETF LC, because the document status changed from
> Informational to Proposed Standard.
>=20
> The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits
> final comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the
> ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2016-05-12. Exceptionally, comments may be
> sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the
> beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting.
>=20
> Abstract
>=20
>    This document captures the semantics of the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement" part of the CDNI Request Routing
>    interface, i.e., the desired meaning of "Footprint" and
>    "Capabilities" in the CDNI context, and what the "Footprint and
>    Capabilities Advertisement Interface (FCI)" offers within CDNI.  The
>    document also provides guidelines for the CDNI FCI protocol.  It
>    further defines a Base Advertisement Object, the necessary registries
>    for capabilities and footprints, and guidelines on how these
>    registries can be extended in the future.
>=20
> The file can be obtained via
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics/
>=20
> IESG discussion can be tracked via
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-cdni-footprint-capabilities-
> semantics/ballot/
>=20
>=20
> The following IPR Declarations may be related to this I-D:
>=20
>    https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/2656/

