From dcpel-bounces@ietf.org Thu Sep 29 14:46:52 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EL3Qi-0006aM-La; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 14:46:52 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EL3Qg-0006Zp-BW; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 14:46:50 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA27769; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 14:46:48 -0400 (EDT) Received: from outbound.mailhop.org ([63.208.196.171] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EL3YO-0001kc-MW; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 14:54:48 -0400 Received: from c-24-6-155-12.hsd1.ca.comcast.net ([24.6.155.12] helo=[10.1.1.74]) by outbound.mailhop.org with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.51) id 1EL3Qf-000IoT-2z; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 14:46:49 -0400 X-Mail-Handler: MailHop Outbound by DynDNS X-Originating-IP: 24.6.155.12 X-Report-Abuse-To: abuse@dyndns.com (see http://www.mailhop.org/outbound/abuse.html for abuse reporting information) X-MHO-User: kmnichols Message-ID: <433C368A.7010003@pollere.com> Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 11:46:34 -0700 From: Kathleen Nichols User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Macintosh/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diffserv-interest@ietf.org, end2end-interest@postel.org, dcpel@ietf.org X-Enigmail-Version: 0.90.1.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 538aad3a3c4f01d8b6a6477ca4248793 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Subject: [Dcpel] diffserv control plane X-BeenThere: dcpel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Mailing list for possible diffserv control plane elements WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: dcpel-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: dcpel-bounces@ietf.org We've been working toward a possible IETF BoF on diffserv control plane elements to be under the Operations and Management Area. Our in-progress Background and Goals for the BoF: It's been some time since the Diffserv forwarding path elements were standardized. At that time, the approach was to get the mechanisms deployed in routers so that approaches to service creation and control plane could be attempted. Before closing, the Diffserv WG defined the concept of Per-Domain Behaviors (PDBs) in RFC 3086, but left the approach to controling PDBs open. Now Diffserv forwarding elements are available in most routers and are in use to create services in some networks. A variety of approaches are being used for control and management of Diffserv but there appears to be some commonality. A possible path for IETF work is to enumerate and classify the common elements and to work toward some best common practices. Additionally, it may be useful to present specifications for a range of diffserv control plane elements using common interfaces. The major issues to deploying Diffserv-based services are primarily operational. The deployment must be cost-effective, be secured against vulnerabilities and not become a vehicle for denial of service attacks. Standardization should result in existing toolsets being either expanded to cover more needed functionality or to interact with other tools. A standardization effort should cover how to secure the architecture to mitigate vulnerabilities. Standards for a control plane QoS agent for routers may be useful. A desired outcome of IETF efforts is to make multiple products available to network operators, obviating the time and personnel expense of individual solutions. The end goal is to enable more services, both for network customers and for control of the network, without taxing personnel. The starting point for a BoF is to look at what's out there, determine if there is indeed some uniformity of approach useful as a starting point, and determine what's missing. The intial focus would be the intradomain control plane moving to interdomain or AS under same provider and finally to interprovider or interoperator. ------------------------------------------------------------------ The entire in-progress proposal for the BoF can be viewed at www.pollere.com under Resources, then Current Work. If you are interested in helping to further shape the proposal, please sign up for the email list dcpel@ietf.org through www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcpel and comment on the list. thanks, Kathie Nichols Scott Bradner _______________________________________________ Dcpel mailing list Dcpel@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcpel From dcpel-bounces@ietf.org Thu Sep 29 16:25:44 2005 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=megatron.ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EL4yO-0004i4-0j; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:25:44 -0400 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EL4yM-0004gs-AG for dcpel@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:25:42 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA11054 for ; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:25:39 -0400 (EDT) Received: from outbound.mailhop.org ([63.208.196.171] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EL563-0006ym-Dm for dcpel@ietf.org; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:33:41 -0400 Received: from c-24-6-155-12.hsd1.ca.comcast.net ([24.6.155.12] helo=[10.1.1.74]) by outbound.mailhop.org with esmtpsa (TLSv1:AES256-SHA:256) (Exim 4.51) id 1EL4yI-000816-SA for dcpel@ietf.org; Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:25:39 -0400 X-Mail-Handler: MailHop Outbound by DynDNS X-Originating-IP: 24.6.155.12 X-Report-Abuse-To: abuse@dyndns.com (see http://www.mailhop.org/outbound/abuse.html for abuse reporting information) X-MHO-User: kmnichols Message-ID: <433C4DB5.5020703@pollere.com> Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:25:25 -0700 From: Kathleen Nichols User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0 (Macintosh/20041206) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dcpel@ietf.org X-Enigmail-Version: 0.90.1.0 X-Enigmail-Supports: pgp-inline, pgp-mime Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 36c793b20164cfe75332aa66ddb21196 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Dcpel] text version of propsal X-BeenThere: dcpel@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Mailing list for possible diffserv control plane elements WG List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: dcpel-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: dcpel-bounces@ietf.org I'm sending this to the list so it ends up in the archives. Apologies to those of you currently subscribed. Kathie ------------------------------------------------------------------- Diffserv Control Plane Elements (DCPEl) Strawman post to mailing list: dcpel@ietf.org information at: [https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcpel] Goals: It's been some time since the Diffserv forwarding path elements were standardized. At that time, the approach was to get the mechanisms deployed in routers so that approaches to service creation and control plane could be attempted. Before closing, the Diffserv WG defined the concept of Per-Domain Behaviors (PDBs) in RFC 3086, but left the approach to controling PDBs open. Now Diffserv forwarding elements are available in most routers and are in use to create services in some networks. A variety of approaches are being used for control and management of Diffserv but there appears to be some commonality. A possible path for IETF work is to enumerate and classify the common elements and to work toward some best common practices. Additionally, it may be useful to present specifications for a range of diffserv control plane elements using common interfaces. The major issues to deploying Diffserv-based services are primarily operational. The deployment must be cost-effective, be secured against vulnerabilities and not become a vehicle for denial of service attacks. Standardization should result in existing toolsets being either expanded to cover more needed functionality or to interact with other tools. A standardization effort should cover how to secure the architecture to mitigate vulnerabilities. Standards for a control plane QoS agent for routers may be useful. A desired outcome of IETF efforts is to make multiple products available to network operators, obviating the time and personnel expense of individual solutions. The end goal is to enable more services, both for network customers and for control of the network, without taxing personnel. The starting point for a BoF is to look at what's out there, determine if there is indeed some uniformity of approach useful as a starting point, and determine what's missing. The intial focus would be the intradomain control plane moving to interdomain or AS under same provider and finally to interprovider or interoperator. Proposed itinerary: 1. Present the goal of a possible WG through presentation of a strawman enumeration of common elements of all Diffserv CPs. This may include examples, commercial and research, of diffserv control planes or elements thereof. 2. Discussion of whether these (some) elements need standardization or better if options presented in informationals or not at all. Do the strawman common elements hold up, if this is useful, which might require standardization - are these the right elements? require standardization? useful to have set of standards? Best proprietary? 3. Is categorization of the capabilities of diffserv forwarding path mechanisms also needed? 4. Is there other IETF work that applies? 5. Close with checking for consensus on WG goals, different goals, no WG? Strawman elements: * Network state / resource map - include path control approaches or path awareness (databases), query language * "server" / allocator / QoS service * Control and configuration of edge (CP to edge devices) * Provisioning approaches / set up * signaling/messaging protocol(s) - host/user/originator to CP and interdomain CP communication * performance monitoring * policy repository - DB, query language, etc * authentication of requesters - credentials, certificates, etc * a QoS agent for routers - setting FP elements in response to CP messages Example Products and Projects Useful for Diffserv Control: * Operax * Allot * Grid approach to BB, authentication * Intelliden * IPsum, PacketDesign * Telcordia BB * PacketCable * Cariden Example Service Products Using Diffserv Control: * Any examples? _______________________________________________ Dcpel mailing list Dcpel@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dcpel