Subject: RE: ASCII text message option (option 56)

From: Nathan Lane <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 12:57:42 -0500

But how does AAA work when the DHCP server has already denied any network
connectivity at all? Or placed you in a different class (i.e., more limited)
of service than you expected?

This option is ideal for it...I could put up a message saying "Oops, you
plugged your Mac into a network that doesn't have Appletalk turned on." 

This option is something I can use right now, in any form and applies to me
both in the limited sense that Apple is doing it and, if others adopt it, I
could apply it more generally.

-Nathan Lane
Wal-Mart Stores, Inc.
(501) 277-5786

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Barr Hibbs [SMTP:[email-masked]]
> Sent:	Thursday, June 29, 2000 5:24 PM
> To:	DHCPv4 discussion list
> Subject:	RE: ASCII text message option (option 56) 
> 
> 
> > > ...I would oppose the creation of a new option for such a
> > limited purpose as
> >
> > Limited purpose?   What about as the basis for a network sign-on?
> > The potential here is huge, and IMHO entirely appropriate for DHCP.
> > Where else would you put this?   Invent an entirely new protocol?
> >
> 
> ...maybe I'm just a doddering old curmudgeon, but I don't see the value
> here.  I really don't see the need for using DHCP as a network messaging
> system.  As for network sign-on, look at the AAA (Accounting,
> Authentication, and Authorization) working group to see how network
> sign-on
> is being approached.
> 
> --Barr

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---

From: "Barr Hibbs" <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 11:28:04 -0700

> From: Nathan Lane
> Sent: Friday, June 30, 2000 10:58 AM

> connectivity at all? Or placed you in a different class (i.e.,
> more limited) of service than you expected?
>
...admittedly, if DHCP doesn't provide an IP address lease to a client there
is no way for AAA to work, although if a DHCP server sends a NAK (rather
than just ignoring the DISCOVER) option 56 can provide useful information.
I don't understand your point about class of service:  DHCP really doesn't
support that functionality in the way I understand it (e.g., delay, packet
loss, and bandwidth characteristics.)

> plugged your Mac into a network that doesn't have Appletalk turned on."
...forgive me, Nathan, but how can DHCP do this, given that it is largely
protocol independent?  I don't think we should be cognizant of anything in
the protocol stack above the IP layer.

> This option is something I can use right now, in any form and
> applies to me both in the limited sense that Apple is doing it
> and, if others  adopt it, I could apply it more generally.
>
...I don't see how we could implement this without some fairly fundamental
changes to the protocol:  specifically, requiring the DHCP server to reply
(with a NAK or a new message type) rather than ignoring DISCOVERs and
REQUESTs in some circumstances, and requiring DHCP clients to react to the
contents of this option (rather than merely displaying it, would have to
start a web browser following Stuart's suggestion, but without an IP
address, how does that work?)

--Barr

---

From: Ted Lemon <[email-masked]>
Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 11:51:25 -0700

> loss, and bandwidth characteristics.)

I think he means class in the sense of ISC DHCP classes and allocation
pools, not in the sense of different levels of service implemented in
IP.   It's a very common application for people to set up a net 10
subnet on each wire and a routeable subnet on each wire and give you a
net 10 address if you haven't registered, but a routable address if
you have.

It makes perfect sense to me that Telcordia isn't very interested in
this, and that you aren't either, but I definitely wouldn't describe
this as an obscure application with limited applicability.   Please,
folks, try to think of other peoples' requirements as well as your
own... :'}

			       _MelloN_