Subject: [dns-dir] Short preliminary summary DNS-DIR @IETF80

From: Peter Koch <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2011 10:30:49 +0200

Dear DNS Directorate,

five of us met over breakfast to discuss some aspects of the directorate's
work:

1) early warning/dns radar
   The EW tool that scans I-Ds currently is suspended, there were concerns
   re: the volume of messages
   Finding WGs that make use of or think of making use of the DNS as a
   building block currently works on an ad-hoc basis, either by DNS Dir
   members attending WGs because of other duties, curiosity or
   occasionally by invitation of the relevant WG chairs or ADs.
   To improve this, we thought about recruiting "scouts" that would
    watch WGs to get back to the directorate or further review and
    response; to be continued

2) outreach
   The basic RFCs 1034/1035 are not covering enough of the DNS environment
   to understand the interdependencies of protocol, operations, roles
    and governance issues that frame the boundaries within which workable,
    scalable solutions may fit.  There are overview documents, including
    but not limited to, the more recent RFC 5507, 6055 and the current
    IAB I-D draft-iab-dns-applications-01.txt as well as the DNS tutorial
    (IETF Sunday tutorial program), but for more outreach it might be helpful
    to document more of the "unwritten rules" (to the extent they exist,
    i.e., basic assumption).

    Other than that there are a couple of successful recent examples where
    addressing DNS issues within the WGs (list and/or meeting) has worked
    to get the direction right. There are also less successful examples,
    where the problems were identified and communicated (this may or may
    not include the suggestion of alternative approaches (to the extent
    they exist).

3) advise to the ADs
   As a first step we agreed to compile a short list of WGs we attended
   with DNS on their agenda/roadmap to identify those that might need
   more (and probably hiher) attention. Please stay tuned.

-Peter

PS: these are not minutes but my personal summary; contributions and further
   discussion welcome (always with the caveat that this list is publicly archived)

---

From: Lars-Johan Liman <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2011 14:38:40 +0200

> Dear DNS Directorate,

Thanks for these valuable notes, Peter!

>     response; to be continued

There are a few technologies that seem to be used in many places in the
IETF. DNS is one of them, but there are a more (SNMP comes to mind) but
not many. Would it be useful to try to put into the IETF WG framework an
instruction to WG Chairs that "if any of your drafts/technologies intend
to make use of any of technology XXXX, please notify this corresponding
point of contact: YYYY", and produce a map with technologies and contact
points. In the DNS case it could be "send a mail to DNSDIR".

>     to document more of the "unwritten rules" (to the extent they exist,

Good idea. Much work to be done in this field!

>     not include the suggestion of alternative approaches (to the extent

Well, much of what falls under these "unwritten rules" is in the field
of operation, and while I strongly support more text in future RFCs that
deal with the semantics of DNS, and operational requirements and
motivations thereof, it believe there is merit in producing document(s)
that collect the current wisdom. This may serve as input to zone owners
who are procuring service, and don't know what to look for. I could even
envisage two versions: the quick overview "for dummies guide", and the
"gory detail" version for people to really want to learn and understand.

> 3) advise to the ADs
>    As a first step we agreed to compile a short list of WGs we
>    attended with DNS on their agenda/roadmap to identify those that
>    might need more (and probably hiher) attention. Please stay tuned.

This might also serve as a reminder to us all which groups we _should_
attend, and where documents with DNS contenct are likely to appear.

> PS: these are not minutes but my personal summary; contributions and
>     further discussion welcome (always with the caveat that this list
>     is publicly archived)

But even as such they are much valuable to a reader who didn't attend.

				Cheers,
				  /Liman

---

From: Olafur Gudmundsson <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 31 Mar 2011 10:29:35 -0400

> five of us met over breakfast to discuss some aspects of the directorate's
Andrew, Peter, Steven, Tom and me.

> _______________________________________________

Good summary Peter,
Steven Morris agreed to take the pen on #2) i.e. start collecting text 
and items that might fall into that.

We also talked about the DNS implications of Aggressive DNS pre-fetching 
by browsers and its implications. There are number of dimensions to this 
before we can even give guidance if this is bad/ok practice, how to do 
it better, privacy implications, etc.

We should reach out to some researchers to measure how common this is 
and how much reuse data in Caches actually gets.

I will post a followup message to dns-directorate to kick-off discussion 
on this topic.

	Olafur