From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Dec 5 20:06:21 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA05304 for ; Fri, 5 Dec 2003 20:06:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASQtZ-00059F-Hl for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:06:05 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hB616560019788 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 5 Dec 2003 20:06:05 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASQtZ-000595-Cm for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:06:05 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA05287 for ; Fri, 5 Dec 2003 20:05:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ASQtX-0005R4-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:06:03 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ASQtW-0005R0-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:06:02 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASQtV-00058V-Tv; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:06:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASQsv-000586-3q for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:05:25 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA05277 for ; Fri, 5 Dec 2003 20:05:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ASQss-0005Qm-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:05:23 -0500 Received: from fmr06.intel.com ([134.134.136.7] helo=caduceus.jf.intel.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ASQss-0005Qf-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:05:22 -0500 Received: from petasus.jf.intel.com (petasus.jf.intel.com [10.7.209.6]) by caduceus.jf.intel.com (8.12.9-20030918-01/8.12.9/d: major-outer.mc,v 1.11 2003/12/03 18:29:28 root Exp $) with ESMTP id hB615OLk023781; Sat, 6 Dec 2003 01:05:24 GMT Received: from orsmsxvs040.jf.intel.com (orsmsxvs040.jf.intel.com [192.168.65.206]) by petasus.jf.intel.com (8.12.9-20030918-01/8.12.9/d: major-inner.mc,v 1.6 2003/12/04 00:48:44 root Exp $) with SMTP id hB613jHl021920; Sat, 6 Dec 2003 01:04:42 GMT Received: from orsmsx331.amr.corp.intel.com ([192.168.65.56]) by orsmsxvs040.jf.intel.com (SAVSMTP 3.1.1.32) with SMTP id M2003120517032413902 ; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 17:03:26 -0800 Received: from orsmsx410.amr.corp.intel.com ([192.168.65.64]) by orsmsx331.amr.corp.intel.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(5.0.2195.5329); Fri, 5 Dec 2003 17:03:06 -0800 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6487.1 Subject: RE: Fw: [GSMP] more changes to the base draft Date: Fri, 5 Dec 2003 17:03:06 -0800 Message-ID: <9CB758BBEE58754F8F33234D75B9F4B00119B2AA@orsmsx410.jf.intel.com> Thread-Topic: Fw: [GSMP] more changes to the base draft Thread-Index: AcO0FE8ollH5HX8hS02nhK8azqouwQHb790w From: "Khosravi, Hormuzd M" To: "Avri Doria" , X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Dec 2003 01:03:06.0587 (UTC) FILETIME=[B52FD2B0:01C3BB94] X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.31 (www . roaringpenguin . com / mimedefang) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Avri I had one question on this.. Technically speaking GRMP seems quite different from GSMP v3 to me. How could you possibly merge these protocols ? I must be missing something here. Thanks Hormuzd -----Original Message----- From: gsmp-admin@ietf.org [mailto:gsmp-admin@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Avri Doria Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 3:55 AM To: gsmp@ietf.org Subject: Re: Fw: [GSMP] more changes to the base draft Hi Weiming, comments inline. On onsdag, nov 26, 2003, at 17:52 Asia/Seoul, Wang,Weiming wrote: > > Hi Avri, > > I'm writing to seek the possiblity in GSMP base header to add=20 > following items: > > 1. A proirity flag to indicate the processing priority for the=20 > message. Can you explain how you would think this should be used? > 2. An optional checksum part in GSMP for error control. Again, can you explain how you would want to see this used? > > If possible, I also ask to leave some space in the Version field for=20 > possible including of other > possible protocols like GRMP=20 > (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-wang-forces-grmp-01.txt). If the two protocols were to be merged it would seem to make the most=20 sense to me for there to be one base protocol which supported the MPLS=20 and GMPLS mode as well as the router mode. I would personally be=20 uncomfortable with one version of the protocol for switches and one for=20 routers. In many respects I think that the support one would need for=20 adding messages for router support already exists. If this merge is something that is of interest to the Wg and something=20 we can get IESG support for (i think it would require a charter=20 amendment) then I think we could certainly work out the details here on=20 the list. I do think your first 2 requests can be discussed within the current =20 work without any charter problems. For the other, I would like to=20 hear from other list members on whether it is something that the WG=20 should pursue. a. _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Dec 5 20:51:20 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA06609 for ; Fri, 5 Dec 2003 20:51:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASRb7-0006dk-0F for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:51:05 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hB61p4Op025518 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 5 Dec 2003 20:51:04 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASRb6-0006dV-T6 for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:51:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA06606 for ; Fri, 5 Dec 2003 20:50:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ASRb4-0005zl-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:51:02 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ASRb4-0005zi-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:51:02 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASRb4-0006c9-Cm; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:51:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ASRaw-0006bl-Bc for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:50:54 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA06596 for ; Fri, 5 Dec 2003 20:50:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ASRat-0005zT-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:50:51 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ASRat-0005zQ-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 05 Dec 2003 20:50:51 -0500 Received: from [147.28.0.62] (helo=acm.org) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.24; FreeBSD 4.9) id 1ASRat-000Jhw-Go for gsmp@ietf.org; Sat, 06 Dec 2003 01:50:51 +0000 Date: Sat, 6 Dec 2003 10:50:14 +0900 Subject: Re: Fw: [GSMP] more changes to the base draft Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) From: Avri Doria To: gsmp@ietf.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In-Reply-To: <9CB758BBEE58754F8F33234D75B9F4B00119B2AA@orsmsx410.jf.intel.com> Message-Id: <890D517F-278E-11D8-A44D-000393CC2112@acm.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On l=F6rdag, dec 6, 2003, at 10:03 Asia/Seoul, Khosravi, Hormuzd M = wrote: > Hi Avri > > I had one question on this.. > Technically speaking GRMP seems quite different from GSMP v3 > to me. How could you possibly merge these protocols ? > I must be missing something here. > > > Thanks > Hormuzd > > The structure of the two protocols is very similar in that GRMP uses=20 similar protocol protocol mechanisms, in fact GRMP imports much of its=20= protocol structure from GSMP almost completely. What is different,=20 primary, is the way the information is expressed. So yes, it is true=20 that the messages for setting state for GMPLS objects is different then=20= the way GRMP sets state for the LFBs, but this can be accommodated by=20 introducing a new message type, or two, for LFBs. I am also assuming,=20= though I have not worked it out yet, that much of the technology=20 specific changes that have been made to support various optical=20 technologies could also be used. As I indicated in my first message to Weiming, we would need to do some=20= work to see if the merge is really feasible, but on the basis of my=20 initial review, I don't think it would be impossible. My initial=20 reasons when the ForCES group first started out for not really being=20 interested in having GSMP adapted to support ForCES was that it could=20 complicate the simple structure of GSMP. Now that we are almost=20 finished with the rework of GSMP, it would be V3.1, for GMPLS, the=20 structure has gotten at once more flexible and more complex and I think=20= the merge could be done with a minimum of pain. The advantage I see in this is that a controller that could use GSMP=20 for controlling GMPLS switches might, with the addition of some=20 specific GRMP-like modules could also support IP forwarders. This=20 could be a very strong argument for the folks in Asia, and perhaps=20 elsewhere, who are already developing and using GSMP for switch=20 control. I guess the point is that now that the GSMP base has been=20 generalized to support any of the varieties of GMPLS switch, it is more=20= like other general carrier protocols (except that it is a vertical=20 protocol) - mostly what you have to do is define a payload format for=20 the content you wish to carry. But, this is a very high level analysis, and if we were to do this, and=20= that would involve ForCES and AD consultation and charter update etc,=20 we would need to put together a design team to work out the details for=20= real. a. _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Wed Dec 10 23:45:35 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA04863 for ; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:45:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUIhF-0008TL-NC for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:45:08 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBB4j5Gb032565 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:45:05 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUIhE-0008TA-Eo for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:45:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA04814 for ; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:45:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUIhB-0002cj-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:45:01 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUIhB-0002cf-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:45:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUIhA-0008SZ-WA; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:45:00 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUIgu-0008SJ-BS for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:44:44 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA04799 for ; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:44:41 -0500 (EST) From: wmwang@mail.hzic.edu.cn Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUIgr-0002ca-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:44:41 -0500 Received: from [61.175.198.82] (helo=ns1.hzic.net) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUIgb-0002bv-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:44:38 -0500 Received: from localhost (unverified [127.0.0.1]) by ns1.hzic.net (Rockliffe SMTPRA 4.5.6) with ESMTP id for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:53:08 +0800 Received: from 218.108.151.161 ( [218.108.151.161]) as user wmwang@mail.hzic.edu.cn@localhost by mail.hzic.edu.cn with HTTP; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:53:08 +0800 Message-ID: <1071118388.3fd7f83a3f651@mail.hzic.edu.cn> Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:53:08 +0800 To: gsmp@ietf.org Subject: Re: Fw: [GSMP] more changes to the base draft MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit User-Agent: Internet Messaging Program (IMP) 3.1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi Hormuzd, Although from the perspective of low, fine grain and implementation level, ForCES has been defined in the way that seems quite different from GSMP, the overall architecture is still the same, which is, they are all based on a control and forwarding separation and open programmable architecture. Therefore, the idea GRMP is based is that it may not be an unwise approach to aboriginally consider and leave some space for possible future integration of the techniques that catually belongs to the same technical category and have quite the same application destination ( an open programmable Network Element). Of course there may be problems to actually make such an integration currently, but we just think it means to make it a thinking point in advance and have it go as a gradual process. Thank you for the attention. Weiming ----- Original Message ----- From: "Khosravi, Hormuzd M" To: "Avri Doria" ; Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2003 9:03 AM Subject: RE: Fw: [GSMP] more changes to the base draft Hi Avri I had one question on this.. Technically speaking GRMP seems quite different from GSMP v3 to me. How could you possibly merge these protocols ? I must be missing something here. Thanks Hormuzd -----Original Message----- From: gsmp-admin@ietf.org [mailto:gsmp-admin@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Avri Doria Sent: Wednesday, November 26, 2003 3:55 AM To: gsmp@ietf.org Subject: Re: Fw: [GSMP] more changes to the base draft Hi Weiming, comments inline. On onsdag, nov 26, 2003, at 17:52 Asia/Seoul, Wang,Weiming wrote: > > Hi Avri, > > I'm writing to seek the possiblity in GSMP base header to add > following items: > > 1. A proirity flag to indicate the processing priority for the > message. Can you explain how you would think this should be used? > 2. An optional checksum part in GSMP for error control. Again, can you explain how you would want to see this used? > > If possible, I also ask to leave some space in the Version field for > possible including of other > possible protocols like GRMP > (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-wang-forces-grmp-01.txt). If the two protocols were to be merged it would seem to make the most sense to me for there to be one base protocol which supported the MPLS and GMPLS mode as well as the router mode. I would personally be uncomfortable with one version of the protocol for switches and one for routers. In many respects I think that the support one would need for adding messages for router support already exists. If this merge is something that is of interest to the Wg and something we can get IESG support for (i think it would require a charter amendment) then I think we could certainly work out the details here on the list. I do think your first 2 requests can be discussed within the current work without any charter problems. For the other, I would like to hear from other list members on whether it is something that the WG should pursue. a. _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through HUCNIC Webmail system. _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Dec 11 12:02:00 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA09789 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:02:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUUBt-0005KB-RB for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:01:32 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBBH1Tuc020466 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:01:29 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUUBt-0005K1-L4 for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:01:29 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA09762 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:01:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUUBn-0000m9-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:01:23 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUUBn-0000m6-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:01:23 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUUBd-0005Ds-L1; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:01:13 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUUAv-000511-0q for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:00:29 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA09726 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:00:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUUAt-0000le-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:00:27 -0500 Received: from auemail2.lucent.com ([192.11.223.163] helo=auemail2.firewall.lucent.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUUAs-0000lM-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:00:27 -0500 Received: from nl0006exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-85-76-62.lucent.com [135.85.76.62]) by auemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id hBBGxaS17358 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 11:00:00 -0600 (CST) Received: by nl0006exch001h.nl.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:58:22 +0100 Message-ID: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6EBA@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" To: Kenneth Sundell , avri , gsmp Cc: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , Alex Zinin Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:58:20 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain Subject: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , GSMP WG members, I think this WG should be closed: - The below message was posted to this WG list Nov 9th. - We are now 1 month further, I have seen virtually NO reaction to it - Alex and I have spoken with WG chairs at IETF with the implied message that I am ready to shut down the WG. - Your WG chairs defended VERY SERIOUS why the WG should continue and that WG pariticipation would IMPROVE imminently (such was promised back in the Vienna IETF also). - But I do not see any of that happening. - I do see that Avri delivered on the revision of the base spec (albeit with a note that yet more changes are needed) - It cause two comments, but basically resulted in discussion of GRMP. - Other authors have not lived up to any promises - I see no volunteering for the docs that have no editor/author. I will be speaking with rest of IESG to close the WG. I cannot support the claim that this WG is actually a Working Group. Thanks, Bert > -----Original Message----- > From: Kenneth Sundell [mailto:ksundell@nortelnetworks.com] > Sent: zondag 9 november 2003 18:02 > To: gsmp > Cc: Wijnen, Bert (Bert); Alex Zinin; avri > Subject: GSMP WG Status > > > > Hi, > > As has probably been noticed, the GSMP group is not scheduled > to meet at > this IETF. The reason for this is that there hasn't been enough > dialogue on the list to warrant a meeting. It is not that > work hasn't > been continuing, it is that not enough of it has been done and not > enough commenting has been done. > > But, the IETF meetings are a time for updating status. So, it seemed > appropriate to put together a brief status report on the > status of the > group from the co-chairs' perspective. > > 1. Why GSMP > > But first, a recap of why we are doing this work. The simple > answer is > to support GMPLS. But this doesn't really answer the > question of why. > Why does GMPLS need the support? As most know, GMPLS requires that a > routing/signaling control plane be associated with each switching > device. In the original concept, this means that a single box will > contain both the control plane and data plane entities. GSMP > is meant to > provide the ability to decouple the control plane from the > data plane. > For new equipment, the tightly couple method of deploying GMPLS is > certainly a reasonable way for vendors to sell their > solutions. Leaving > aside the issue of whether this is always the most > advantageous solution > for their customers, there is still good reason to decouple the the > control plane entities from the data plane entities. If > GMPLS is to be > deployed in the near term on equipment which is already deployed in > customer networks, it will be necessary to find a way to deliver the > control instructions to the data plane in a de-coupled manner. There > may be other ways to this, e.g. TL/1 messaging, CLI > messaging, SNMP and > perhaps, someday XMLconf. GSMP offers a well defined and efficient > means of doing providing this control link for MPLS and, if we finish > our task, will provide an effective means of doing this for GMPLS as > well. This info is included here because the main point, the > fact that > completing GSMP can aid in the deployment speed of GMPLS is sometimes > overlooked when deciding on the priority for work items. > > 2. Status of work items > > We have missed our remaining milestones. These need to be > reworked and > to able to do that, we need to understand where we are at with the > remaining work and with group participation. > > 2.1. Requirements Specification Completed and released since the last > IETF as RFC3604. > > 2.2. Base Specification: Avri Doria > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-gsmp-v3-base-sp > ec-04.txt > This has gone through several revisions since the last IETF. Most of > the requirements from RFC 3604, have been met, though there is still > some explanatory text to be written. there is, however, a deficiency > that has not yet been met that is not covered in the > requirements. The > structure for defining and controlling the optical layers is still > open. While this may be useful for other technology specific > areas, it > will be critical for the TDM Technology support. More on > this below. > Once the layer information and updated text is produced, this > spec will > be ready for WGLC. > > 2.3 Packet Capable Switch Specification: Kenneth Sundell > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-gsmp-packet-spec-02.txt > The draft has been updated to use the redefined base spec. > The Base Doc > + the Packet Switch document together are the functional > equivalent of > the existing GSMPv3 specification: RFC 3292. This specification is > essentially done, but since it is dependent on the base spec it is > waiting for WGLC until that spec is completed. There have > been reviews > of this specification on the list as of yet.. > > 2.4 Optical Switch Specification: Jung Yul Choi > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-gsmp-optical-sp > ec-02.txt > (-03 was sent to the list but didn't make it to the i-d repositories > before the deadline). > This draft is in its third revision. Many of the extension > techniques > generalized and imported into the base draft originated in > the Optical > spec. The Optical spec is being brought into alignment the > base spec. > Unfortunately this spec has not yet received extensive WG review. > > 2.5 TDM Switch Specification: Jonathan Sadler > As of yet unavailable. > > 2.6 Review and possible update to RFC 3295 - MIB for Base and Packet > Capable - No owner > > 2.7 Review and possible update to RFC 3293 - encapsulation (as per > requirements in RFC 3604) - no owner > > 2.8 MIB to cover Optical Switch Options - No Owner, but could be > responsibility of team working on optical spec. > > 2.9 MIB to cover TDM Switch Options - No Owner, but could be > responsibility of team working on TDM spec. > > 2.10. MIB/PIB/XMLconf for Dynamic partitioning: No Owner > A lot of work was done on a PIB and a MIB for this before the WG was > diverted into working on dynamic requirements specification RFC 3532. > > > 3.0 Liaison with ITU-T SG15 > > Avri was invited to attend the latest ITU meeting as a representative > from the GSMP group. The ITU is currently reviewing > possibilities for > protocols that satisfy the CCI interface in the ASON > architecture. GSMP > is seen as a strong candidate. One deficiency is the support > that GSMP > offers for supporting Optical layering. A requirements doc is > forthcoming from Jonathan Sadler explicitly covering this requirement > and making recommendations for its solution. This document > was promised > during the IETF timeframe, though of course it can be submitted until > after the draft freeeze. > > 4.0 ForCES and GRMP > > Since the first days of ForCES there has been an assumption that GSMP > may offer a vehicle for satisfying the ForCES protocol requirements. > Investigating that possibility was also included in the GSMP > charter. > Recently Weiming Wang has produced a forCES candidate protocol called > GRMP. GRMP is a derivative of GSMPv3. Weiming and Avri have been > working together on reviewing the changes that might be necessary to > both the base and to GRMP in order to make GRMP fit as another > technology specific option to GSMPV3. This work is not yet > completed, > but has gone far enough to indicate that the integration of the two > protocols is possible and would not be too onerous. Of course it is > unknown at this time whether GRMP will be among the options > selected by > the ForCES WG. > > 5.0 Group Participation > > As has been discussed on the list WG participation or the > lack of it is > a real problem. While there are 5 or 6 people who are working on the > specs or who do participate, the WG list is overly quiet. We > need more > people writing specs and we need many more reviewing the new > specs and > commenting publicly. > As Bert wrote to the list, this is a real problem in terms of > the being > able to continue the WG until we finish the work, this has become a > liability. while the ADs have not yet threatened to close the group, > Bert has threatened to threaten. > > 6.0 Implementation > > Privately the WG chairs have been informed of several implementations > (>5). Unfortunately none of them is public. This is not terribly > helpful to fostering cooperation. We should be shortly > getting to the > point where different versions are tested for interoperability. This > can't be done if folks are unwilling to speak publicly about > their work. > > Ken and Avri > Co-chairs GSMP WG > > > _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Dec 11 17:24:31 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA29007 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:24:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUZE3-0004TT-W6 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:24:04 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBBMO3aP017198 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:24:03 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUZE3-0004TH-SU for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:24:03 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA28982 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:24:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUZE1-0003T8-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:24:01 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUZE1-0003T4-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:24:01 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUZE1-0004Sl-8s; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:24:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUZDC-0004QJ-2I for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:23:10 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id RAA28961 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:23:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUZD9-0003Rj-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:23:07 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUZD9-0003RZ-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 17:23:07 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.24; FreeBSD 4.9) id 1AUZCw-000D3X-Un; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:22:55 +0000 Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 23:22:10 +0100 Subject: Re: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) Cc: Kenneth Sundell , gsmp , Alex Zinin To: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" From: avri In-Reply-To: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6EBA@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> Message-Id: <76A2326C-2C28-11D8-8C67-000393CC2112@psg.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On torsdag, dec 11, 2003, at 17:58 Europe/Zurich, Wijnen, Bert (Bert) wrote: > GSMP WG members, > > I think this WG should be closed: As you and state below, I strongly disagree. > > - The below message was posted to this WG list Nov 9th. > - We are now 1 month further, I have seen virtually NO reaction to it > - Alex and I have spoken with WG chairs at IETF with the implied > message that I am ready to shut down the WG. > - Your WG chairs defended VERY SERIOUS why the WG should continue > and that WG pariticipation would IMPROVE imminently (such was > promised back in the Vienna IETF also). And there was improvement after Vienna, just not as much as you wanted. There has been traffic on the list, and just becasue it was about GRMP is no reason to discount the conversation. > - But I do not see any of that happening. > - I do see that Avri delivered on the revision of the base spec > (albeit with a note that yet more changes are needed) The guarantee was that the next rev would go out with the layer changes included. not that the document would be finished in November. > - It cause two comments, but basically resulted in discussion of > GRMP. > - Other authors have not lived up to any promises The other document which is promised in promised for December,. It is early to say that promise has not been lived up to. > - I see no volunteering for the docs that have no editor/author. There have been volunteers and the co-chairs are in the process of working out specifics. > > I will be speaking with rest of IESG to close the WG. > I cannot support the claim that this WG is actually a Working Group. I think you are acting prematurely and I do not support your your claim that it is not a working group. there are small groups and there are big groups. there are quiet groups and there are noisy groups. the work is progressing. I am at least one voice in the working group who thinks that closing the group is wrong. I hope there are other. And I hope that they speak up. Best Regards, a. _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Dec 11 19:01:40 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA03796 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:01:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUak6-0000Ku-Tp for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:01:15 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBC01E3W001289 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:01:14 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUak6-0000Kd-KA for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:01:14 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA03783 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:01:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUak3-00060b-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:01:11 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUajr-00060M-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:00:59 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUajt-0000IY-8A; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:01:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUajg-0000Hh-BB for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:00:48 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA03757 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:00:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUajd-0005zt-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:00:45 -0500 Received: from tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.102]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUajc-0005zm-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:00:44 -0500 Received: from vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.39.110]) by tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id hBC00WUC018153 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:00:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id hBC00Vpo024698 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:00:32 +0900 (JST) Received: from dmailsv1.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp (dmailsv1.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.53.14]) by nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id hBC00T8H004110 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:00:29 +0900 (JST) Received: from mailsv04.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp by dmailsv1.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.10/dmailsv-1.1c) with ESMTP id hBC00Sww008401 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:00:28 +0900 (JST) Received: from localhost by mailsv04.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.10/Lab-1.2a) with ESMTP id hBC00Sh3024703 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:00:28 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <5.1.1.9.2.20031212085357.055f92a0@mailsv4.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp> X-Sender: wi002@mailsv4.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1-Jr3 Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:02:19 +0900 To: gsmp From: Wataru Imajuku In-Reply-To: <76A2326C-2C28-11D8-8C67-000393CC2112@psg.com> References: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6EBA@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, All I also strongly disagree with closing this WG. I think current GSMP specifications lacks management feature of switching hardwares, especially, if you think adaptation of GSMP to legacy-switches such as SDH-XC. Still, we have lot of work to do. W. Imajuku@NTT >>GSMP WG members, >> >>I think this WG should be closed: > >As you and state below, I strongly disagree. > >> >>- The below message was posted to this WG list Nov 9th. >>- We are now 1 month further, I have seen virtually NO reaction to it >>- Alex and I have spoken with WG chairs at IETF with the implied >> message that I am ready to shut down the WG. >>- Your WG chairs defended VERY SERIOUS why the WG should continue >> and that WG pariticipation would IMPROVE imminently (such was >> promised back in the Vienna IETF also). > >And there was improvement after Vienna, just not as much as you wanted. >There has been traffic on the list, and just becasue it was about GRMP is >no reason to discount the conversation. > >>- But I do not see any of that happening. >>- I do see that Avri delivered on the revision of the base spec >> (albeit with a note that yet more changes are needed) > >The guarantee was that the next rev would go out with the layer changes >included. not that the document would be finished in November. > >>- It cause two comments, but basically resulted in discussion of >> GRMP. >>- Other authors have not lived up to any promises > >The other document which is promised in promised for December,. It is >early to say that promise has not been lived up to. > >>- I see no volunteering for the docs that have no editor/author. > >There have been volunteers and the co-chairs are in the process of >working out specifics. > >> >>I will be speaking with rest of IESG to close the WG. >>I cannot support the claim that this WG is actually a Working Group. > >I think you are acting prematurely and I do not support your your claim >that it is not a working group. there are small groups and there are big >groups. there are quiet groups and there are noisy groups. the work is >progressing. > >I am at least one voice in the working group who thinks that closing the >group is wrong. I hope there are other. > >And I hope that they speak up. > >Best Regards, > >a. > > > >_______________________________________________ >GSMP mailing list >GSMP@ietf.org >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp I have changed E-mail address from April 1/2003!!!! --------------------------------------------- Wataru Imajuku NTT Network Innovation Labs. 807A, 1-1 Hikari-no-oka, Yokosuka, Kanagawa, Japan Zip: 239-0847 E-mail: imajuku.wataru@lab.ntt.co.jp TEL: +81-46-859-4315 FAX: +81-46-859-3396 _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Dec 11 19:10:47 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA04155 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:10:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUasv-0001C0-Cp for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:10:21 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBC0ALcA004578 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:10:21 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUasv-0001Bl-8B for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:10:21 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA04024 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:10:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUasr-00068Y-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:10:17 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUasr-00068V-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:10:17 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUasi-00011A-Np; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:10:08 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUasN-0000rT-KO for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:09:47 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id TAA03963 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:09:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUasK-000673-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:09:44 -0500 Received: from ihemail2.lucent.com ([192.11.222.163] helo=ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUasJ-00066B-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 19:09:43 -0500 Received: from nl0006exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-85-76-62.lucent.com [135.85.76.62]) by ihemail2.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id hBC09A029713 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 18:09:11 -0600 (CST) Received: by nl0006exch001h.nl.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 01:09:09 +0100 Message-ID: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6FA0@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" To: Wataru Imajuku , gsmp Subject: RE: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 01:09:04 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-2022-jp" Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , And can you tell me when was the last time that you contributed anyting to GSMP WG? I see no email postings from you to the WG list since mid-2002 You may be a new member who will now be posting great review comments in the next few days. In that case I appologize for the above. Thanks, Bert > -----Original Message----- > From: Wataru Imajuku [mailto:imajuku.wataru@lab.ntt.co.jp] > Sent: vrijdag 12 december 2003 1:02 > To: gsmp > Subject: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status > > > Hi, All > > I also strongly disagree with closing this WG. > > I think current GSMP specifications lacks management feature of > switching hardwares, especially, if you think adaptation of GSMP to > legacy-switches such as SDH-XC. > > Still, we have lot of work to do. > > W. Imajuku@NTT > > >>GSMP WG members, > >> > >>I think this WG should be closed: > > > >As you and state below, I strongly disagree. > > > >> > >>- The below message was posted to this WG list Nov 9th. > >>- We are now 1 month further, I have seen virtually NO > reaction to it > >>- Alex and I have spoken with WG chairs at IETF with the implied > >> message that I am ready to shut down the WG. > >>- Your WG chairs defended VERY SERIOUS why the WG should continue > >> and that WG pariticipation would IMPROVE imminently (such was > >> promised back in the Vienna IETF also). > > > >And there was improvement after Vienna, just not as much as > you wanted. > >There has been traffic on the list, and just becasue it was > about GRMP is > >no reason to discount the conversation. > > > >>- But I do not see any of that happening. > >>- I do see that Avri delivered on the revision of the base spec > >> (albeit with a note that yet more changes are needed) > > > >The guarantee was that the next rev would go out with the > layer changes > >included. not that the document would be finished in November. > > > >>- It cause two comments, but basically resulted in discussion of > >> GRMP. > >>- Other authors have not lived up to any promises > > > >The other document which is promised in promised for > December,. It is > >early to say that promise has not been lived up to. > > > >>- I see no volunteering for the docs that have no editor/author. > > > >There have been volunteers and the co-chairs are in the process of > >working out specifics. > > > >> > >>I will be speaking with rest of IESG to close the WG. > >>I cannot support the claim that this WG is actually a Working Group. > > > >I think you are acting prematurely and I do not support your > your claim > >that it is not a working group. there are small groups and > there are big > >groups. there are quiet groups and there are noisy groups. > the work is > >progressing. > > > >I am at least one voice in the working group who thinks that > closing the > >group is wrong. I hope there are other. > > > >And I hope that they speak up. > > > >Best Regards, > > > >a. > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > >GSMP mailing list > >GSMP@ietf.org > >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp > > > I have changed E-mail address from April 1/2003!!!! > --------------------------------------------- > Wataru Imajuku > NTT Network Innovation Labs. > 807A, 1-1 Hikari-no-oka, Yokosuka, Kanagawa, Japan > Zip: 239-0847 > E-mail: imajuku.wataru@lab.ntt.co.jp > TEL: +81-46-859-4315 > FAX: +81-46-859-3396 > > > _______________________________________________ > GSMP mailing list > GSMP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp > _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Dec 11 20:04:33 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA05795 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:04:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUbiv-0003jT-6A for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:04:05 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBC145xw014341 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:04:05 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUbiu-0003jE-V0 for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:04:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA05772 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:04:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUbis-0007FO-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:04:02 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUbis-0007FL-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:04:02 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUbiq-0003ip-LS; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:04:00 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUbiN-0003hU-7u for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:03:31 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id UAA05724 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:03:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUbiL-0007Dj-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:03:29 -0500 Received: from tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp ([129.60.39.102]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUbiK-0007Dg-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 20:03:28 -0500 Received: from vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.39.110]) by tama5.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id hBC13QUC029481 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:03:26 +0900 (JST) Received: from nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by vcs3.rdh.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id hBC13Ppo005423 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:03:25 +0900 (JST) Received: from dmailsv1.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp (dmailsv1.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp [129.60.53.14]) by nttmail3.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.8p1/8.12.8) with ESMTP id hBC13O8H021766 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:03:25 +0900 (JST) Received: from mailsv04.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp by dmailsv1.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.10/dmailsv-1.1c) with ESMTP id hBC13Oww013688 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:03:24 +0900 (JST) Received: from localhost by mailsv04.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp (8.12.10/Lab-1.2a) with ESMTP id hBC13Nh3028388 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:03:23 +0900 (JST) Message-Id: <5.1.1.9.2.20031212091503.055fbfd8@mailsv4.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp> X-Sender: wi002@mailsv4.y.ecl.ntt.co.jp X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.1-Jr3 Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 10:05:15 +0900 To: gsmp From: Wataru Imajuku In-Reply-To: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6FA0@nl0006exch001u.nl .lucent.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP"; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [GSMP] Adding functionality to support Restoration Functionality Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, All and Mr. Bert >And can you tell me when was the last time that you contributed anyting to >GSMP WG? I see no email postings from you to the WG list since mid-2002 >You may be a new member who will now be posting great review comments i>n the next few days. In that case I appologize for the above. Yes, I'm new commer entered this mailing list just two days ago. I believe GSMP can brought tremendous chance for NW operators to upgrade existing NW elements toward unified GMPLS controlplane. In such network, the counter action to link or nodal failure is one of most important issue. This is the reason that the one of hot issue in CCAMP-WG be the support of restoration functionality in RSVP/CR-LDP. My first technical comments is for draft-ietf-gsmp-v3-base-spec. * 6.1 Port Management Message I think this message should contain Port Type Specific Data Block as can be see in Port Configuration Data in order to support legacy switches. In such Port Type specific Data Block, some kind of functionality to set admin-state up/down, PathTrace information for the switches. In the case of SDH-XC, the information of J0 Byte would be set. And, the information of OTU/ODU-TTI would be set in the case of OTN-XC. * 9. Event Message I think this message should add Alarming functionality, such as Event[Communication Alarm], to notify failure event in D-Plane to decoupled C-Plane. This message would trriger the initiation of restoration signaling as discussed in CCAMP-WG. My second technical comments is for draft-ietf-gsmp-optical-spec. * 4. Connection Management Messages The addition of recovery specific Add Branch Message is made in this draft. But, I think this issue is generic, so I think this description sould be contained in base-spec draft. W. Imajuku >And can you tell me when was the last time that you contributed anyting to >GSMP WG? I see no email postings from you to the WG list since mid-2002 > >You may be a new member who will now be posting great review comments >in the next few days. In that case I appologize for the above. > >Thanks, >Bert > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Wataru Imajuku [mailto:imajuku.wataru@lab.ntt.co.jp] > > Sent: vrijdag 12 december 2003 1:02 > > To: gsmp > > Subject: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status > > > > > > Hi, All > > > > I also strongly disagree with closing this WG. > > > > I think current GSMP specifications lacks management feature of > > switching hardwares, especially, if you think adaptation of GSMP to > > legacy-switches such as SDH-XC. > > > > Still, we have lot of work to do. > > > > W. Imajuku@NTT > > > > >>GSMP WG members, > > >> > > >>I think this WG should be closed: > > > > > >As you and state below, I strongly disagree. > > > > > >> > > >>- The below message was posted to this WG list Nov 9th. > > >>- We are now 1 month further, I have seen virtually NO > > reaction to it > > >>- Alex and I have spoken with WG chairs at IETF with the implied > > >> message that I am ready to shut down the WG. > > >>- Your WG chairs defended VERY SERIOUS why the WG should continue > > >> and that WG pariticipation would IMPROVE imminently (such was > > >> promised back in the Vienna IETF also). > > > > > >And there was improvement after Vienna, just not as much as > > you wanted. > > >There has been traffic on the list, and just becasue it was > > about GRMP is > > >no reason to discount the conversation. > > > > > >>- But I do not see any of that happening. > > >>- I do see that Avri delivered on the revision of the base spec > > >> (albeit with a note that yet more changes are needed) > > > > > >The guarantee was that the next rev would go out with the > > layer changes > > >included. not that the document would be finished in November. > > > > > >>- It cause two comments, but basically resulted in discussion of > > >> GRMP. > > >>- Other authors have not lived up to any promises > > > > > >The other document which is promised in promised for > > December,. It is > > >early to say that promise has not been lived up to. > > > > > >>- I see no volunteering for the docs that have no editor/author. > > > > > >There have been volunteers and the co-chairs are in the process of > > >working out specifics. > > > > > >> > > >>I will be speaking with rest of IESG to close the WG. > > >>I cannot support the claim that this WG is actually a Working Group. > > > > > >I think you are acting prematurely and I do not support your > > your claim > > >that it is not a working group. there are small groups and > > there are big > > >groups. there are quiet groups and there are noisy groups. > > the work is > > >progressing. > > > > > >I am at least one voice in the working group who thinks that > > closing the > > >group is wrong. I hope there are other. > > > > > >And I hope that they speak up. > > > > > >Best Regards, > > > > > >a. > > > > > > > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > >GSMP mailing list > > >GSMP@ietf.org > > >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp > > > > > > I have changed E-mail address from April 1/2003!!!! > > --------------------------------------------- > > Wataru Imajuku > > NTT Network Innovation Labs. > > 807A, 1-1 Hikari-no-oka, Yokosuka, Kanagawa, Japan > > Zip: 239-0847 > > E-mail: imajuku.wataru@lab.ntt.co.jp > > TEL: +81-46-859-4315 > > FAX: +81-46-859-3396 > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > GSMP mailing list > > GSMP@ietf.org > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp > > > >_______________________________________________ >GSMP mailing list >GSMP@ietf.org >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp I have changed E-mail address from April 1/2003!!!! --------------------------------------------- Wataru Imajuku NTT Network Innovation Labs. 807A, 1-1 Hikari-no-oka, Yokosuka, Kanagawa, Japan Zip: 239-0847 E-mail: imajuku.wataru@lab.ntt.co.jp TEL: +81-46-859-4315 FAX: +81-46-859-3396 _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Thu Dec 11 22:59:33 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id WAA10186 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:59:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUeSG-0003gM-Jy for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:59:07 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBC3x49E014151 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:59:04 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUeSG-0003gA-EM for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:59:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id WAA10173 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:59:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUeSC-0002Qn-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:59:00 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUeSC-0002Qk-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:59:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUeSE-0003fe-OX; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:59:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUeRk-0003f6-CJ for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:58:32 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id WAA10165 for ; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:58:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUeRg-0002QQ-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:58:28 -0500 Received: from [61.175.198.82] (helo=ns1.hzic.net) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUeRf-0002QE-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Thu, 11 Dec 2003 22:58:27 -0500 Received: from WWM (unverified [61.175.198.84]) by ns1.hzic.net (Rockliffe SMTPRA 4.5.6) with SMTP id for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:07:12 +0800 Message-ID: <013b01c3c064$3c22c4c0$845c21d2@Necom.hzic.edu.cn> From: "Wang,Weiming" To: Subject: Fw: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 11:58:43 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2600.0000 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2600.0000 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 DQpJIGFsc28gc3Ryb25nbHkgZGlzYWdyZWUgdG8gY2xvc2UgdGhlIGdyb3VwLCBlc3BlY2lhbGx5 IGF0IHRoZSBtb21lbnQuIEl0J3MgbGlrZSB0aGUgDQpwaG9uZSBsaW5lIGlzIGN1dCB3aGlsZSB3 ZSBhcmUgYWN0dWFsbHkgdGFsa2luZyBhYm91dCBzb21ldGhpbmcgdmlhIHRoZSBwaG9uZS4gDQpJ IHRoaW5rIHdoYXQgd2UgYXJlIHRhbGtpbmcgYWJvdXQgR1JNUCBvbiB0aGlzICBsaXN0IGlzIGhp Z2hseSByZWxhdGVkIHRvIEdTTVB2MyBiYXNlIHNwZWMuLCBpc24ndCBpdD8NCiANCiBSZWdhcmRz LA0KV2VpbWluZw0KIA0KPiAtLS0tLSBPcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlIC0tLS0tIA0KPiBGcm9tOiAi V2lqbmVuLCBCZXJ0IChCZXJ0KSIgPGJ3aWpuZW5AbHVjZW50LmNvbT4NCj4gVG86ICJLZW5uZXRo IFN1bmRlbGwiIDxrc3VuZGVsbEBub3J0ZWxuZXR3b3Jrcy5jb20+OyAiYXZyaSIgPGF2cmlAcHNn LmNvbT47ICJnc21wIiA8Z3NtcEBpZXRmLm9yZz4NCj4gQ2M6ICJXaWpuZW4sIEJlcnQgKEJlcnQp IiA8Yndpam5lbkBsdWNlbnQuY29tPjsgIkFsZXggWmluaW4iIDx6aW5pbkBwc2cuY29tPg0KPiBT ZW50OiBGcmlkYXksIERlY2VtYmVyIDEyLCAyMDAzIDEyOjU4IEFNDQo+IFN1YmplY3Q6IFtHU01Q XSBSRTogR1NNUCBXRyBTdGF0dXMNCj4gDQo+IA0KPiA+IEdTTVAgV0cgbWVtYmVycywNCj4gPiAN Cj4gPiBJIHRoaW5rIHRoaXMgV0cgc2hvdWxkIGJlIGNsb3NlZDoNCj4gPiANCj4gPiAtIFRoZSBi ZWxvdyBtZXNzYWdlIHdhcyBwb3N0ZWQgdG8gdGhpcyBXRyBsaXN0IE5vdiA5dGguDQo+ID4gLSBX ZSBhcmUgbm93IDEgbW9udGggZnVydGhlciwgSSBoYXZlIHNlZW4gdmlydHVhbGx5IE5PIHJlYWN0 aW9uIHRvIGl0DQo+ID4gLSBBbGV4IGFuZCBJIGhhdmUgc3Bva2VuIHdpdGggV0cgY2hhaXJzIGF0 IElFVEYgd2l0aCB0aGUgaW1wbGllZA0KPiA+ICAgbWVzc2FnZSB0aGF0IEkgYW0gcmVhZHkgdG8g c2h1dCBkb3duIHRoZSBXRy4gDQo+ID4gLSBZb3VyIFdHIGNoYWlycyBkZWZlbmRlZCBWRVJZIFNF UklPVVMgd2h5IHRoZSBXRyBzaG91bGQgY29udGludWUNCj4gPiAgIGFuZCB0aGF0IFdHIHBhcml0 aWNpcGF0aW9uIHdvdWxkIElNUFJPVkUgaW1taW5lbnRseSAoc3VjaCB3YXMNCj4gPiAgIHByb21p c2VkIGJhY2sgaW4gdGhlIFZpZW5uYSBJRVRGIGFsc28pLg0KPiA+IC0gQnV0IEkgZG8gbm90IHNl ZSBhbnkgb2YgdGhhdCBoYXBwZW5pbmcuDQo+ID4gLSBJIGRvIHNlZSB0aGF0IEF2cmkgZGVsaXZl cmVkIG9uIHRoZSByZXZpc2lvbiBvZiB0aGUgYmFzZSBzcGVjDQo+ID4gICAoYWxiZWl0IHdpdGgg YSBub3RlIHRoYXQgeWV0IG1vcmUgY2hhbmdlcyBhcmUgbmVlZGVkKQ0KPiA+IC0gSXQgY2F1c2Ug dHdvIGNvbW1lbnRzLCBidXQgYmFzaWNhbGx5IHJlc3VsdGVkIGluIGRpc2N1c3Npb24gb2YNCj4g PiAgIEdSTVAuDQo+ID4gLSBPdGhlciBhdXRob3JzIGhhdmUgbm90IGxpdmVkIHVwIHRvIGFueSBw cm9taXNlcw0KPiA+IC0gSSBzZWUgbm8gdm9sdW50ZWVyaW5nIGZvciB0aGUgZG9jcyB0aGF0IGhh dmUgbm8gZWRpdG9yL2F1dGhvci4NCj4gPiANCj4gPiBJIHdpbGwgYmUgc3BlYWtpbmcgd2l0aCBy ZXN0IG9mIElFU0cgdG8gY2xvc2UgdGhlIFdHLg0KPiA+IEkgY2Fubm90IHN1cHBvcnQgdGhlIGNs YWltIHRoYXQgdGhpcyBXRyBpcyBhY3R1YWxseSBhIFdvcmtpbmcgR3JvdXAuDQo+ID4gDQo+ID4g VGhhbmtzLA0KPiA+IEJlcnQgDQo+ID4gDQo+ID4gPiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0t LQ0KPiA+ID4gRnJvbTogS2VubmV0aCBTdW5kZWxsIFttYWlsdG86a3N1bmRlbGxAbm9ydGVsbmV0 d29ya3MuY29tXQ0KPiA+ID4gU2VudDogem9uZGFnIDkgbm92ZW1iZXIgMjAwMyAxODowMg0KPiA+ ID4gVG86IGdzbXANCj4gPiA+IENjOiBXaWpuZW4sIEJlcnQgKEJlcnQpOyBBbGV4IFppbmluOyBh dnJpDQo+ID4gPiBTdWJqZWN0OiBHU01QIFdHIFN0YXR1cw0KPiA+ID4gDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+ IA0KPiA+ID4gSGksDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+IEFzIGhhcyBwcm9iYWJseSBiZWVuIG5vdGljZWQs IHRoZSBHU01QIGdyb3VwIGlzIG5vdCBzY2hlZHVsZWQgDQo+ID4gPiB0byBtZWV0IGF0IA0KPiA+ ID4gdGhpcyBJRVRGLiAgVGhlIHJlYXNvbiBmb3IgdGhpcyBpcyB0aGF0IHRoZXJlIGhhc24ndCBi ZWVuIGVub3VnaCANCj4gPiA+IGRpYWxvZ3VlIG9uIHRoZSBsaXN0IHRvIHdhcnJhbnQgYSBtZWV0 aW5nLiAgSXQgaXMgbm90IHRoYXQgDQo+ID4gPiB3b3JrIGhhc24ndCANCj4gPiA+IGJlZW4gY29u dGludWluZywgaXQgaXMgdGhhdCBub3QgZW5vdWdoIG9mIGl0IGhhcyBiZWVuIGRvbmUgYW5kIG5v dCANCj4gPiA+IGVub3VnaCBjb21tZW50aW5nIGhhcyBiZWVuIGRvbmUuDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+ IEJ1dCwgdGhlIElFVEYgbWVldGluZ3MgYXJlIGEgdGltZSBmb3IgdXBkYXRpbmcgc3RhdHVzLiBT bywgaXQgc2VlbWVkIA0KPiA+ID4gYXBwcm9wcmlhdGUgdG8gcHV0IHRvZ2V0aGVyIGEgYnJpZWYg c3RhdHVzIHJlcG9ydCBvbiB0aGUgDQo+ID4gPiBzdGF0dXMgb2YgdGhlIA0KPiA+ID4gZ3JvdXAg ZnJvbSB0aGUgY28tY2hhaXJzJyBwZXJzcGVjdGl2ZS4NCj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ID4gMS4gV2h5IEdT TVANCj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ID4gQnV0IGZpcnN0LCBhIHJlY2FwIG9mIHdoeSB3ZSBhcmUgZG9pbmcg dGhpcyB3b3JrLiAgVGhlIHNpbXBsZSANCj4gPiA+IGFuc3dlciBpcyANCj4gPiA+IHRvIHN1cHBv cnQgR01QTFMuICBCdXQgdGhpcyBkb2Vzbid0IHJlYWxseSBhbnN3ZXIgdGhlIA0KPiA+ID4gcXVl c3Rpb24gb2Ygd2h5LiAgDQo+ID4gPiBXaHkgZG9lcyBHTVBMUyBuZWVkIHRoZSBzdXBwb3J0PyAg QXMgbW9zdCBrbm93LCBHTVBMUyByZXF1aXJlcyB0aGF0IGEgDQo+ID4gPiByb3V0aW5nL3NpZ25h bGluZyBjb250cm9sIHBsYW5lIGJlIGFzc29jaWF0ZWQgd2l0aCBlYWNoIHN3aXRjaGluZyANCj4g PiA+IGRldmljZS4gIEluIHRoZSBvcmlnaW5hbCBjb25jZXB0LCB0aGlzIG1lYW5zIHRoYXQgYSBz aW5nbGUgYm94IHdpbGwgDQo+ID4gPiBjb250YWluIGJvdGggdGhlIGNvbnRyb2wgcGxhbmUgYW5k IGRhdGEgcGxhbmUgZW50aXRpZXMuIEdTTVAgDQo+ID4gPiBpcyBtZWFudCB0byANCj4gPiA+IHBy b3ZpZGUgdGhlIGFiaWxpdHkgdG8gZGVjb3VwbGUgdGhlIGNvbnRyb2wgcGxhbmUgZnJvbSB0aGUg DQo+ID4gPiBkYXRhIHBsYW5lLiAgDQo+ID4gPiBGb3IgbmV3IGVxdWlwbWVudCwgdGhlIHRpZ2h0 bHkgY291cGxlIG1ldGhvZCBvZiBkZXBsb3lpbmcgR01QTFMgaXMgDQo+ID4gPiBjZXJ0YWlubHkg YSByZWFzb25hYmxlIHdheSBmb3IgdmVuZG9ycyB0byBzZWxsIHRoZWlyIA0KPiA+ID4gc29sdXRp b25zLiAgTGVhdmluZyANCj4gPiA+IGFzaWRlIHRoZSBpc3N1ZSBvZiB3aGV0aGVyIHRoaXMgaXMg YWx3YXlzIHRoZSBtb3N0IA0KPiA+ID4gYWR2YW50YWdlb3VzIHNvbHV0aW9uIA0KPiA+ID4gZm9y IHRoZWlyIGN1c3RvbWVycywgdGhlcmUgaXMgc3RpbGwgZ29vZCByZWFzb24gdG8gZGVjb3VwbGUg dGhlIHRoZSANCj4gPiA+IGNvbnRyb2wgcGxhbmUgZW50aXRpZXMgZnJvbSB0aGUgZGF0YSBwbGFu ZSBlbnRpdGllcy4gIElmIA0KPiA+ID4gR01QTFMgaXMgdG8gYmUgDQo+ID4gPiBkZXBsb3llZCBp biB0aGUgbmVhciB0ZXJtIG9uIGVxdWlwbWVudCB3aGljaCBpcyBhbHJlYWR5IGRlcGxveWVkIGlu IA0KPiA+ID4gY3VzdG9tZXIgbmV0d29ya3MsIGl0IHdpbGwgYmUgbmVjZXNzYXJ5IHRvIGZpbmQg YSB3YXkgdG8gZGVsaXZlciB0aGUgDQo+ID4gPiBjb250cm9sIGluc3RydWN0aW9ucyB0byB0aGUg ZGF0YSBwbGFuZSBpbiBhIGRlLWNvdXBsZWQgbWFubmVyLiAgVGhlcmUgDQo+ID4gPiBtYXkgYmUg b3RoZXIgd2F5cyB0byB0aGlzLCBlLmcuIFRMLzEgbWVzc2FnaW5nLCBDTEkgDQo+ID4gPiBtZXNz YWdpbmcsIFNOTVAgYW5kIA0KPiA+ID4gcGVyaGFwcywgc29tZWRheSBYTUxjb25mLiAgR1NNUCBv ZmZlcnMgYSB3ZWxsIGRlZmluZWQgYW5kIGVmZmljaWVudCANCj4gPiA+IG1lYW5zIG9mIGRvaW5n IHByb3ZpZGluZyB0aGlzIGNvbnRyb2wgbGluayBmb3IgTVBMUyBhbmQsIGlmIHdlIGZpbmlzaCAN Cj4gPiA+IG91ciB0YXNrLCB3aWxsIHByb3ZpZGUgYW4gZWZmZWN0aXZlIG1lYW5zIG9mIGRvaW5n IHRoaXMgZm9yIEdNUExTIGFzIA0KPiA+ID4gd2VsbC4gIFRoaXMgaW5mbyBpcyBpbmNsdWRlZCBo ZXJlIGJlY2F1c2UgdGhlIG1haW4gcG9pbnQsIHRoZSANCj4gPiA+IGZhY3QgdGhhdCANCj4gPiA+ IGNvbXBsZXRpbmcgR1NNUCBjYW4gYWlkIGluIHRoZSBkZXBsb3ltZW50IHNwZWVkIG9mIEdNUExT IGlzIHNvbWV0aW1lcyANCj4gPiA+IG92ZXJsb29rZWQgd2hlbiBkZWNpZGluZyBvbiB0aGUgcHJp b3JpdHkgZm9yIHdvcmsgaXRlbXMuDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+IDIuIFN0YXR1cyBvZiB3b3JrIGl0 ZW1zDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+IFdlIGhhdmUgbWlzc2VkIG91ciByZW1haW5pbmcgbWlsZXN0b25l cy4gIFRoZXNlIG5lZWQgdG8gYmUgDQo+ID4gPiByZXdvcmtlZCBhbmQgDQo+ID4gPiB0byBhYmxl IHRvIGRvIHRoYXQsIHdlIG5lZWQgdG8gdW5kZXJzdGFuZCB3aGVyZSB3ZSBhcmUgYXQgd2l0aCB0 aGUgDQo+ID4gPiByZW1haW5pbmcgd29yayBhbmQgd2l0aCBncm91cCBwYXJ0aWNpcGF0aW9uLg0K PiA+ID4gDQo+ID4gPiAyLjEuIFJlcXVpcmVtZW50cyBTcGVjaWZpY2F0aW9uIENvbXBsZXRlZCBh bmQgcmVsZWFzZWQgc2luY2UgdGhlIGxhc3QgDQo+ID4gPiBJRVRGIGFzIFJGQzM2MDQuDQo+ID4g PiANCj4gPiA+IDIuMi4gQmFzZSBTcGVjaWZpY2F0aW9uOiAgQXZyaSBEb3JpYQ0KPiA+ID4gaHR0 cDovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9pbnRlcm5ldC1kcmFmdHMvZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1nc21wLXYzLWJhc2Ut c3ANCj4gPiA+IGVjLTA0LnR4dA0KPiA+ID4gVGhpcyBoYXMgZ29uZSB0aHJvdWdoIHNldmVyYWwg cmV2aXNpb25zIHNpbmNlIHRoZSBsYXN0IElFVEYuICBNb3N0IG9mIA0KPiA+ID4gdGhlIHJlcXVp cmVtZW50cyBmcm9tICBSRkMgMzYwNCwgaGF2ZSBiZWVuIG1ldCwgdGhvdWdoIHRoZXJlIGlzIHN0 aWxsIA0KPiA+ID4gc29tZSBleHBsYW5hdG9yeSB0ZXh0IHRvIGJlIHdyaXR0ZW4uICB0aGVyZSBp cywgaG93ZXZlciwgYSBkZWZpY2llbmN5IA0KPiA+ID4gdGhhdCBoYXMgbm90IHlldCBiZWVuIG1l dCB0aGF0IGlzIG5vdCBjb3ZlcmVkIGluIHRoZSANCj4gPiA+IHJlcXVpcmVtZW50cy4gIFRoZSAN Cj4gPiA+IHN0cnVjdHVyZSBmb3IgZGVmaW5pbmcgYW5kIGNvbnRyb2xsaW5nIHRoZSBvcHRpY2Fs IGxheWVycyBpcyBzdGlsbCANCj4gPiA+IG9wZW4uICBXaGlsZSB0aGlzIG1heSBiZSB1c2VmdWwg Zm9yIG90aGVyIHRlY2hub2xvZ3kgc3BlY2lmaWMgDQo+ID4gPiBhcmVhcywgaXQgDQo+ID4gPiB3 aWxsIGJlIGNyaXRpY2FsIGZvciB0aGUgVERNIFRlY2hub2xvZ3kgc3VwcG9ydC4gIE1vcmUgb24g DQo+ID4gPiB0aGlzIGJlbG93LiAgDQo+ID4gPiBPbmNlIHRoZSBsYXllciBpbmZvcm1hdGlvbiBh bmQgdXBkYXRlZCB0ZXh0IGlzIHByb2R1Y2VkLCB0aGlzIA0KPiA+ID4gc3BlYyB3aWxsIA0KPiA+ ID4gYmUgcmVhZHkgZm9yIFdHTEMuDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+IDIuMyBQYWNrZXQgQ2FwYWJsZSBT d2l0Y2ggU3BlY2lmaWNhdGlvbjogIEtlbm5ldGggU3VuZGVsbA0KPiA+ID4gaHR0cDovL3d3dy5p ZXRmLm9yZy9pbnRlcm5ldC1kcmFmdHMvZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1nc21wLXBhY2tldC1zcGVjLTAyLnR4 dA0KPiA+ID4gVGhlIGRyYWZ0IGhhcyBiZWVuIHVwZGF0ZWQgdG8gdXNlIHRoZSByZWRlZmluZWQg YmFzZSBzcGVjLiAgDQo+ID4gPiBUaGUgQmFzZSBEb2MgDQo+ID4gPiArIHRoZSBQYWNrZXQgU3dp dGNoIGRvY3VtZW50IHRvZ2V0aGVyIGFyZSB0aGUgZnVuY3Rpb25hbCANCj4gPiA+IGVxdWl2YWxl bnQgb2YgDQo+ID4gPiB0aGUgZXhpc3RpbmcgR1NNUHYzIHNwZWNpZmljYXRpb246IFJGQyAzMjky LiAgICBUaGlzIHNwZWNpZmljYXRpb24gaXMgDQo+ID4gPiBlc3NlbnRpYWxseSBkb25lLCBidXQg c2luY2UgaXQgaXMgZGVwZW5kZW50IG9uIHRoZSBiYXNlIHNwZWMgaXQgaXMgDQo+ID4gPiB3YWl0 aW5nIGZvciBXR0xDIHVudGlsIHRoYXQgc3BlYyBpcyBjb21wbGV0ZWQuICBUaGVyZSBoYXZlIA0K PiA+ID4gYmVlbiByZXZpZXdzIA0KPiA+ID4gb2YgdGhpcyBzcGVjaWZpY2F0aW9uIG9uIHRoZSBs aXN0IGFzIG9mIHlldC4uDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+IDIuNCAgT3B0aWNhbCBTd2l0Y2ggU3BlY2lm aWNhdGlvbjogIEp1bmcgWXVsIENob2kNCj4gPiA+IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvaW50ZXJu ZXQtZHJhZnRzL2RyYWZ0LWlldGYtZ3NtcC1vcHRpY2FsLXNwDQo+ID4gPiBlYy0wMi50eHQgDQo+ ID4gPiAoLTAzIHdhcyBzZW50IHRvIHRoZSBsaXN0IGJ1dCBkaWRuJ3QgbWFrZSBpdCB0byB0aGUg aS1kIHJlcG9zaXRvcmllcyANCj4gPiA+IGJlZm9yZSB0aGUgZGVhZGxpbmUpLg0KPiA+ID4gVGhp cyBkcmFmdCBpcyBpbiBpdHMgdGhpcmQgcmV2aXNpb24uICAgTWFueSBvZiB0aGUgZXh0ZW5zaW9u IA0KPiA+ID4gdGVjaG5pcXVlcyANCj4gPiA+IGdlbmVyYWxpemVkIGFuZCAgaW1wb3J0ZWQgaW50 byB0aGUgYmFzZSBkcmFmdCBvcmlnaW5hdGVkIGluIA0KPiA+ID4gdGhlIE9wdGljYWwgDQo+ID4g PiBzcGVjLiAgVGhlIE9wdGljYWwgc3BlYyBpcyBiZWluZyBicm91Z2h0IGludG8gYWxpZ25tZW50 IHRoZSANCj4gPiA+IGJhc2Ugc3BlYy4gIA0KPiA+ID4gVW5mb3J0dW5hdGVseSB0aGlzIHNwZWMg aGFzIG5vdCB5ZXQgcmVjZWl2ZWQgZXh0ZW5zaXZlIFdHIHJldmlldy4NCj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ID4g Mi41IFRETSBTd2l0Y2ggU3BlY2lmaWNhdGlvbjogSm9uYXRoYW4gU2FkbGVyDQo+ID4gPiBBcyBv ZiB5ZXQgdW5hdmFpbGFibGUuDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+IDIuNiBSZXZpZXcgYW5kIHBvc3NpYmxl IHVwZGF0ZSB0byBSRkMgMzI5NSAtIE1JQiBmb3IgQmFzZSBhbmQgUGFja2V0IA0KPiA+ID4gQ2Fw YWJsZSAtIE5vIG93bmVyDQo+ID4gPiANCj4gPiA+IDIuNyBSZXZpZXcgYW5kIHBvc3NpYmxlIHVw ZGF0ZSB0byBSRkMgMzI5MyAtIGVuY2Fwc3VsYXRpb24gKGFzIHBlciANCj4gPiA+IHJlcXVpcmVt ZW50cyBpbiBSRkMgMzYwNCkgLSBubyBvd25lcg0KPiA+ID4gDQo+ID4gPiAyLjggTUlCIHRvIGNv dmVyIE9wdGljYWwgU3dpdGNoIE9wdGlvbnMgLSBObyBPd25lciwgYnV0IGNvdWxkIGJlIA0KPiA+ ID4gcmVzcG9uc2liaWxpdHkgb2YgdGVhbSB3b3JraW5nIG9uIG9wdGljYWwgc3BlYy4NCj4gPiA+ IA0KPiA+ID4gMi45IE1JQiB0byBjb3ZlciBURE0gU3dpdGNoIE9wdGlvbnMgLSBObyBPd25lciwg YnV0IGNvdWxkIGJlIA0KPiA+ID4gcmVzcG9uc2liaWxpdHkgb2YgdGVhbSB3b3JraW5nIG9uIFRE TSBzcGVjLg0KPiA+ID4gDQo+ID4gPiAyLjEwLiBNSUIvUElCL1hNTGNvbmYgZm9yIER5bmFtaWMg cGFydGl0aW9uaW5nOiBObyBPd25lcg0KPiA+ID4gQSBsb3Qgb2Ygd29yayB3YXMgZG9uZSBvbiBh IFBJQiBhbmQgYSBNSUIgZm9yIHRoaXMgYmVmb3JlIHRoZSBXRyB3YXMgDQo+ID4gPiBkaXZlcnRl ZCBpbnRvIHdvcmtpbmcgb24gZHluYW1pYyByZXF1aXJlbWVudHMgc3BlY2lmaWNhdGlvbiBSRkMg MzUzMi4NCj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ID4gDQo+ID4gPiAzLjAgTGlhaXNvbiB3aXRoIElUVS1UIFNHMTUN Cj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ID4gQXZyaSB3YXMgaW52aXRlZCB0byBhdHRlbmQgdGhlIGxhdGVzdCBJVFUg bWVldGluZyBhcyBhIHJlcHJlc2VudGF0aXZlIA0KPiA+ID4gZnJvbSB0aGUgR1NNUCBncm91cC4g IFRoZSBJVFUgaXMgY3VycmVudGx5IHJldmlld2luZyANCj4gPiA+IHBvc3NpYmlsaXRpZXMgZm9y IA0KPiA+ID4gcHJvdG9jb2xzIHRoYXQgc2F0aXNmeSB0aGUgQ0NJIGludGVyZmFjZSBpbiB0aGUg QVNPTiANCj4gPiA+IGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZS4gIEdTTVAgDQo+ID4gPiBpcyBzZWVuIGFzIGEgc3Ry b25nIGNhbmRpZGF0ZS4gIE9uZSBkZWZpY2llbmN5IGlzIHRoZSBzdXBwb3J0IA0KPiA+ID4gdGhh dCBHU01QIA0KPiA+ID4gb2ZmZXJzIGZvciBzdXBwb3J0aW5nIE9wdGljYWwgbGF5ZXJpbmcuICBB IHJlcXVpcmVtZW50cyBkb2MgaXMgDQo+ID4gPiBmb3J0aGNvbWluZyBmcm9tIEpvbmF0aGFuIFNh ZGxlciBleHBsaWNpdGx5IGNvdmVyaW5nIHRoaXMgcmVxdWlyZW1lbnQgDQo+ID4gPiBhbmQgbWFr aW5nIHJlY29tbWVuZGF0aW9ucyBmb3IgaXRzIHNvbHV0aW9uLiAgVGhpcyBkb2N1bWVudCANCj4g PiA+IHdhcyBwcm9taXNlZCANCj4gPiA+IGR1cmluZyB0aGUgSUVURiB0aW1lZnJhbWUsIHRob3Vn aCBvZiBjb3Vyc2UgaXQgY2FuIGJlIHN1Ym1pdHRlZCB1bnRpbCANCj4gPiA+IGFmdGVyIHRoZSBk cmFmdCBmcmVlZXplLg0KPiA+ID4gDQo+ID4gPiA0LjAgRm9yQ0VTIGFuZCBHUk1QDQo+ID4gPiAN Cj4gPiA+IFNpbmNlIHRoZSBmaXJzdCBkYXlzIG9mIEZvckNFUyB0aGVyZSBoYXMgYmVlbiBhbiBh c3N1bXB0aW9uIHRoYXQgR1NNUCANCj4gPiA+IG1heSBvZmZlciBhIHZlaGljbGUgZm9yIHNhdGlz ZnlpbmcgdGhlIEZvckNFUyBwcm90b2NvbCByZXF1aXJlbWVudHMuICANCj4gPiA+IEludmVzdGln YXRpbmcgdGhhdCBwb3NzaWJpbGl0eSB3YXMgYWxzbyBpbmNsdWRlZCBpbiB0aGUgR1NNUCANCj4g PiA+IGNoYXJ0ZXIuICANCj4gPiA+IFJlY2VudGx5IFdlaW1pbmcgV2FuZyBoYXMgcHJvZHVjZWQg YSBmb3JDRVMgY2FuZGlkYXRlIHByb3RvY29sIGNhbGxlZCANCj4gPiA+IEdSTVAuICBHUk1QIGlz IGEgZGVyaXZhdGl2ZSBvZiBHU01QdjMuICBXZWltaW5nIGFuZCBBdnJpIGhhdmUgYmVlbiANCj4g PiA+IHdvcmtpbmcgdG9nZXRoZXIgb24gcmV2aWV3aW5nIHRoZSBjaGFuZ2VzIHRoYXQgbWlnaHQg YmUgbmVjZXNzYXJ5IHRvIA0KPiA+ID4gYm90aCB0aGUgYmFzZSBhbmQgdG8gR1JNUCBpbiBvcmRl ciB0byBtYWtlIEdSTVAgZml0IGFzIGFub3RoZXIgDQo+ID4gPiB0ZWNobm9sb2d5IHNwZWNpZmlj IG9wdGlvbiB0byBHU01QVjMuICBUaGlzIHdvcmsgaXMgbm90IHlldCANCj4gPiA+IGNvbXBsZXRl ZCwgDQo+ID4gPiBidXQgaGFzIGdvbmUgZmFyIGVub3VnaCB0byBpbmRpY2F0ZSB0aGF0IHRoZSBp bnRlZ3JhdGlvbiBvZiB0aGUgdHdvIA0KPiA+ID4gcHJvdG9jb2xzIGlzIHBvc3NpYmxlIGFuZCB3 b3VsZCBub3QgYmUgdG9vIG9uZXJvdXMuICBPZiBjb3Vyc2UgaXQgaXMgDQo+ID4gPiB1bmtub3du IGF0IHRoaXMgdGltZSB3aGV0aGVyIEdSTVAgd2lsbCBiZSBhbW9uZyB0aGUgb3B0aW9ucyANCj4g PiA+IHNlbGVjdGVkIGJ5IA0KPiA+ID4gdGhlIEZvckNFUyBXRy4NCj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ID4gNS4w IEdyb3VwIFBhcnRpY2lwYXRpb24NCj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ID4gQXMgaGFzIGJlZW4gZGlzY3Vzc2Vk IG9uIHRoZSBsaXN0IFdHIHBhcnRpY2lwYXRpb24gb3IgdGhlIA0KPiA+ID4gbGFjayBvZiBpdCBp cyANCj4gPiA+IGEgcmVhbCBwcm9ibGVtLiAgV2hpbGUgdGhlcmUgYXJlIDUgb3IgNiBwZW9wbGUg d2hvIGFyZSB3b3JraW5nIG9uIHRoZSANCj4gPiA+IHNwZWNzIG9yIHdobyBkbyBwYXJ0aWNpcGF0 ZSwgdGhlIFdHIGxpc3QgaXMgb3Zlcmx5IHF1aWV0LiAgV2UgDQo+ID4gPiBuZWVkIG1vcmUgDQo+ ID4gPiBwZW9wbGUgd3JpdGluZyBzcGVjcyBhbmQgd2UgbmVlZCBtYW55IG1vcmUgcmV2aWV3aW5n IHRoZSBuZXcgDQo+ID4gPiBzcGVjcyBhbmQgDQo+ID4gPiBjb21tZW50aW5nIHB1YmxpY2x5Lg0K PiA+ID4gQXMgQmVydCB3cm90ZSB0byB0aGUgbGlzdCwgdGhpcyBpcyBhIHJlYWwgcHJvYmxlbSBp biB0ZXJtcyBvZiANCj4gPiA+IHRoZSBiZWluZyANCj4gPiA+IGFibGUgdG8gY29udGludWUgdGhl IFdHIHVudGlsIHdlIGZpbmlzaCB0aGUgd29yaywgdGhpcyBoYXMgYmVjb21lIGEgDQo+ID4gPiBs aWFiaWxpdHkuICB3aGlsZSB0aGUgQURzIGhhdmUgbm90IHlldCB0aHJlYXRlbmVkIHRvIGNsb3Nl IHRoZSBncm91cCwgDQo+ID4gPiBCZXJ0IGhhcyB0aHJlYXRlbmVkIHRvIHRocmVhdGVuLg0KPiA+ ID4gDQo+ID4gPiA2LjAgSW1wbGVtZW50YXRpb24NCj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ID4gUHJpdmF0ZWx5IHRo ZSBXRyBjaGFpcnMgaGF2ZSBiZWVuIGluZm9ybWVkIG9mIHNldmVyYWwgaW1wbGVtZW50YXRpb25z IA0KPiA+ID4gKD41KS4gIFVuZm9ydHVuYXRlbHkgbm9uZSBvZiB0aGVtIGlzIHB1YmxpYy4gIFRo aXMgaXMgbm90IHRlcnJpYmx5IA0KPiA+ID4gaGVscGZ1bCB0byBmb3N0ZXJpbmcgY29vcGVyYXRp b24uICBXZSBzaG91bGQgYmUgc2hvcnRseSANCj4gPiA+IGdldHRpbmcgdG8gdGhlIA0KPiA+ID4g cG9pbnQgd2hlcmUgZGlmZmVyZW50IHZlcnNpb25zIGFyZSB0ZXN0ZWQgZm9yIGludGVyb3BlcmFi aWxpdHkuICBUaGlzIA0KPiA+ID4gY2FuJ3QgYmUgZG9uZSBpZiBmb2xrcyBhcmUgdW53aWxsaW5n IHRvIHNwZWFrIHB1YmxpY2x5IGFib3V0IA0KPiA+ID4gdGhlaXIgd29yay4NCj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+ ID4gS2VuIGFuZCBBdnJpDQo+ID4gPiBDby1jaGFpcnMgR1NNUCBXRw0KPiA+ID4gDQo+ID4gPiAN Cj4gPiA+IA0KPiA+IA0KPiA+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fDQo+ID4gR1NNUCBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj4gPiBHU01QQGlldGYub3JnDQo+ID4g aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cxLmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vZ3NtcA0KPiANCg== _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Dec 12 03:28:47 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA01067 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:28:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUiee-00071Z-5U for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:28:18 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBC8S7iJ026994 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:28:07 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUiec-00071J-0b for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:28:06 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA01057 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:28:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUieZ-0007On-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:28:03 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUieZ-0007Ok-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:28:03 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUieW-00070v-Si; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:28:00 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUidy-000707-1Y for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:27:26 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA01053 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:27:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUidv-0007Nc-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:27:23 -0500 Received: from hoemail1.lucent.com ([192.11.226.161] helo=hoemail1.firewall.lucent.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUidv-0007NR-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 03:27:23 -0500 Received: from nl0006exch001h.wins.lucent.com (h135-85-76-62.lucent.com [135.85.76.62]) by hoemail1.firewall.lucent.com (Switch-2.2.8/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id hBC8QoF11118 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 02:26:51 -0600 (CST) Received: by nl0006exch001h.nl.lucent.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) id ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:26:49 +0100 Message-ID: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6FAF@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> From: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" To: "Wang,Weiming" , gsmp@ietf.org Subject: RE: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 09:26:44 +0100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2656.59) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , > -----Original Message----- > From: Wang,Weiming [mailto:wmwang@mail.hzic.edu.cn] > Sent: vrijdag 12 december 2003 4:59 > To: gsmp@ietf.org > Subject: Fw: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status > > I also strongly disagree to close the group, especially at > the moment. It's like the phone line is cut while we are > actually talking about something via the phone. > I think what we are talking about GRMP on this list is > highly related to GSMPv3 base spec., isn't it? > Why would "closing the WG" be similar to "cutting the phone line"?? The mailing list can/will continue to exist. So you can keep talking/emailing (as little as has been done till now, or as much as you all think/promise you are going to be doing). And once the (small) set of people on this list comes to closure on their documents, they can still submit them as (individual) contributions via RFC-Editor. We will consider them. Bert > Regards, > Weiming _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Dec 12 06:09:31 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA04166 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:09:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUlAP-0005Cn-67 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:09:05 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBCB955Q020004 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:09:05 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUlAO-0005CZ-Hm for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:09:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA04163 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:09:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUlAK-00026M-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:09:00 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUlAK-00026J-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:09:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUlAL-0005C8-ND; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:09:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUlAE-0005Bq-0l for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:08:54 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA04158 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:08:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUlAA-00025y-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:08:50 -0500 Received: from tokyo.netlab.nec.de ([195.37.70.2] helo=tokyo.ccrle.nec.de) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUlA9-00025i-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 06:08:49 -0500 Received: from tokyo.ccrle.nec.de (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tokyo.ccrle.nec.de (8.12.10/8.12.9) with ESMTP id hBCB8Iq6022661 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:08:19 +0100 (CET) Received: (from defang@localhost) by tokyo.ccrle.nec.de (8.12.10/8.12.8/Submit) id hBCB3UZ7022099 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:03:30 +0100 (CET) X-Authentication-Warning: tokyo.ccrle.nec.de: defang set sender to using -f Received: from venus.office (venus.office [10.1.1.11]) by pluto.office (8.12.9/8.12.9+MIMEDefang) with ESMTP id hBCB3Tq4022082; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:03:30 +0100 (CET) Received: from [10.1.1.130] (brunner.office [10.1.1.130]) by venus.office (Postfix on SuSE Linux eMail Server 3.0) with ESMTP id 1285EE0A55; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:03:28 +0100 (CET) Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:03:28 +0100 From: Marcus Brunner Reply-To: Marcus Brunner To: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , Kenneth Sundell , avri , gsmp Cc: Alex Zinin Subject: Re: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status Message-ID: <11032974.1071230608@[10.1.1.130]> In-Reply-To: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6EBA@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> References: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6EBA@nl0006exch001u.nl.luce nt.com> X-Mailer: Mulberry/3.0.2 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-Scanned-By: MIMEDefang 2.35 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bert, We promised to take a look at the MIBs and actually started already but will now immediately stop the effort to get that problem solved. Marcus > - I see no volunteering for the docs that have no editor/author. > -------------------------------------- Dr. Marcus Brunner Network Laboratories NEC Europe Ltd. E-Mail: brunner@ccrle.nec.de WWW: http://www.ccrle.nec.de/ Phone: +49 (0) 6221 905 11 29 Mobile: +49 (0) 163 275 17 43 personal home page: http://www.brubers.org/marcus _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Dec 12 07:01:30 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA05188 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:01:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUlyj-0006yF-1W for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:01:05 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBCC15Dm026795 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:01:05 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUlyi-0006y6-Qw for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:01:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA05164 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:00:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUlye-0002m0-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:01:00 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUlye-0002lx-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:01:00 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUlyg-0006xK-1A; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:01:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUlyV-0006wv-K8 for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:00:51 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA05161 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:00:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUlyR-0002lu-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:00:47 -0500 Received: from zctfs063.nortelnetworks.com ([47.164.128.120]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUlyM-0002lq-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 07:00:42 -0500 Received: from zctfc006.europe.nortel.com (zctfc006.europe.nortel.com [47.164.129.47]) by zctfs063.nortelnetworks.com (Switch-2.2.6/Switch-2.2.0) with ESMTP id hBCBxuT06533; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:59:56 +0100 (MET) Received: from zctfc002.europe.nortel.com ([47.164.129.43]) by zctfc006.europe.nortel.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id W37837X0; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:59:57 +0100 Received: from nortelnetworks.com (ksundell-1.europe.nortel.com [47.167.132.173]) by zctfc002.europe.nortel.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.2653.13) id XTZR6R25; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 12:59:56 +0100 Message-ID: <3FD9AE36.2060005@nortelnetworks.com> Date: Fri, 12 Dec 2003 13:01:58 +0100 X-Sybari-Space: 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 From: Kenneth Sundell User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:0.9.4) Gecko/20011019 Netscape6/6.2 X-Accept-Language: en-us MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" CC: gsmp@ietf.org Subject: Re: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status References: <7D5D48D2CAA3D84C813F5B154F43B155031D6FAF@nl0006exch001u.nl.lucent.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------060208070600070301010200" Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , --------------060208070600070301010200 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bert, Wijnen, Bert (Bert) wrote: >> >Why would "closing the WG" be similar to "cutting the phone line"?? >The mailing list can/will continue to exist. So you can keep >talking/emailing (as little as has been done till now, or as much >as you all think/promise you are going to be doing). > The recent message from Marcus Brunner is one of the possible answers to that question: Marcus Brunner wrote: >Bert, >We promised to take a look at the MIBs and actually started already but will now immediately stop the effort to get that problem solved. >Marcus Regards, Ken > > >And once the (small) set of people on this list comes to closure >on their documents, they can still submit them as (individual) >contributions via RFC-Editor. We will consider them. > >Bert > >> Regards, >>Weiming >> > >_______________________________________________ >GSMP mailing list >GSMP@ietf.org >https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp > -- Kenneth Sundell Sr. Protocols Architect CTO/ATI Strategic Protocols Nortel Networks (Sweden) ESN 521-3538, Ext IAC+46 8 5088-3538 --------------060208070600070301010200 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Bert,

Wijnen, Bert (Bert) wrote:

Why would "closing the WG" be similar to "cutting the phone line"??
The mailing list can/will continue to exist.  So you can keep
talking/emailing (as little as has been done till now, or as much 
as you all think/promise you are going to be doing).
The recent message from Marcus Brunner is one of the possible answers to that question:

Marcus Brunner wrote:
>Bert,

>We promised to take a look at the MIBs and actually started already but will now immediately stop the effort to get that problem solved.

>Marcus

Regards,
Ken


And once the (small) set of people on this list comes to closure 
on their documents, they can still submit them as (individual) 
contributions via RFC-Editor. We will consider them.

Bert
 Regards,
Weiming

_______________________________________________
GSMP mailing list
GSMP@ietf.org
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp


-- 

Kenneth Sundell
Sr. Protocols Architect
CTO/ATI Strategic Protocols
Nortel Networks (Sweden)
ESN 521-3538, Ext IAC+46 8 5088-3538

--------------060208070600070301010200-- _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Dec 12 08:16:03 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA07618 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:16:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUn8o-0001dC-SP for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:15:35 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBCDFYEa006267 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:15:34 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUn8o-0001d0-Ow for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:15:34 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA07605 for ; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:15:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUn8n-0004LW-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:15:33 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUn8c-0004LH-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:15:22 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUn8I-0001af-Lw; Fri, 12 Dec 2003 08:15:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AUIQq-0007kt-FQ for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:28:08 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA04513 for ; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:28:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUIQn-0002P6-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:28:05 -0500 Received: from [218.108.250.185] (helo=hzcnc.com) by ietf-mx with smtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AUIQm-0002Oy-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Wed, 10 Dec 2003 23:28:04 -0500 Received: from wwm1([218.108.151.161]) by hzcnc.com(AIMC 2.9.5.3) with SMTP id jm83fd83250; Thr, 11 Dec 2003 12:25:55 +0800 Message-ID: <003e01c3bf9e$dadb77e0$010aa8c0@wwm1> From: "Weiming Wang" To: References: <9CB758BBEE58754F8F33234D75B9F4B00119B2AA@orsmsx410.jf.intel.com> Subject: Re: Fw: [GSMP] more changes to the base draft Date: Thu, 11 Dec 2003 12:25:46 +0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1106 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1106 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SGkgSG9ybXV6ZCwNCg0KQWx0aG91Z2ggZnJvbSB0aGUgcGVyc3BlY3RpdmUgb2YgbG93LCBmaW5l IGdyYWluIGFuZCBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbiBsZXZlbCwgRm9yQ0VTIGhhcyBiZWVuIGRlZmluZWQg DQppbiB0aGUgd2F5IHRoYXQgc2VlbXMgcXVpdGUgZGlmZmVyZW50IGZyb20gR1NNUCwgIHRoZSBv dmVyYWxsIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZSBpcyBzdGlsbCB0aGUgc2FtZSwgd2hpY2ggaXMsIHRoZXkNCmFy ZSBhbGwgYmFzZWQgb24gYSBjb250cm9sIGFuZCBmb3J3YXJkaW5nIHNlcGFyYXRpb24gYW5kIG9w ZW4gcHJvZ3JhbW1hYmxlIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZS4gVGhlcmVmb3JlLCANCnRoZSBpZGVhIEdSTVAg aXMgYmFzZWQgaXMgdGhhdCBpdCBtYXkgbm90IGJlIGFuIHVud2lzZSBhcHByb2FjaCB0byBhYm9y aWdpbmFsbHkgY29uc2lkZXIgYW5kIGxlYXZlIHNvbWUgDQpzcGFjZSBmb3IgcG9zc2libGUgZnV0 dXJlIGludGVncmF0aW9uIG9mIHRoZSB0ZWNobmlxdWVzIHRoYXQgY2F0dWFsbHkgYmVsb25ncyB0 byB0aGUgc2FtZSB0ZWNobmljYWwgY2F0ZWdvcnkgYW5kIGhhdmUgcXVpdGUgdGhlIA0Kc2FtZSBh cHBsaWNhdGlvbiBkZXN0aW5hdGlvbiAoIGFuIG9wZW4gcHJvZ3JhbW1hYmxlIE5ldHdvcmsgRWxl bWVudCkuIE9mIGNvdXJzZSB0aGVyZSBtYXkgYmUNCnByb2JsZW1zIHRvIGFjdHVhbGx5IG1ha2Ug c3VjaCBhbiBpbnRlZ3JhdGlvbiBjdXJyZW50bHksIGJ1dCAgd2UganVzdCB0aGluayAgaXQgbWVh bnMgdG8gbWFrZSBpdCBhIHRoaW5raW5nIHBvaW50IGluIGFkdmFuY2UNCmFuZCBoYXZlIGl0IGdv IGFzIGEgZ3JhZHVhbCBwcm9jZXNzLiANCg0KVGhhbmsgeW91IGZvciB0aGUgYXR0ZW50aW9uLg0K DQpXZWltaW5nDQoNCi0tLS0tIE9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UgLS0tLS0gDQpGcm9tOiAiS2hvc3Jh dmksIEhvcm11emQgTSIgPGhvcm11emQubS5raG9zcmF2aUBpbnRlbC5jb20+DQpUbzogIkF2cmkg RG9yaWEiIDxhdnJpQGFjbS5vcmc+OyA8Z3NtcEBpZXRmLm9yZz4NClNlbnQ6IFNhdHVyZGF5LCBE ZWNlbWJlciAwNiwgMjAwMyA5OjAzIEFNDQpTdWJqZWN0OiBSRTogRnc6IFtHU01QXSBtb3JlIGNo YW5nZXMgdG8gdGhlIGJhc2UgZHJhZnQNCg0KDQpIaSBBdnJpDQoNCkkgaGFkIG9uZSBxdWVzdGlv biBvbiB0aGlzLi4NClRlY2huaWNhbGx5IHNwZWFraW5nIEdSTVAgc2VlbXMgcXVpdGUgZGlmZmVy ZW50IGZyb20gR1NNUCB2Mw0KdG8gbWUuIEhvdyBjb3VsZCB5b3UgcG9zc2libHkgbWVyZ2UgdGhl c2UgcHJvdG9jb2xzID8NCkkgbXVzdCBiZSBtaXNzaW5nIHNvbWV0aGluZyBoZXJlLg0KDQoNClRo YW5rcw0KSG9ybXV6ZA0KDQotLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJvbTogZ3NtcC1h ZG1pbkBpZXRmLm9yZyBbbWFpbHRvOmdzbXAtYWRtaW5AaWV0Zi5vcmddIE9uIEJlaGFsZiBPZiBB dnJpDQpEb3JpYQ0KU2VudDogV2VkbmVzZGF5LCBOb3ZlbWJlciAyNiwgMjAwMyAzOjU1IEFNDQpU bzogZ3NtcEBpZXRmLm9yZw0KU3ViamVjdDogUmU6IEZ3OiBbR1NNUF0gbW9yZSBjaGFuZ2VzIHRv IHRoZSBiYXNlIGRyYWZ0DQoNCg0KSGkgV2VpbWluZywNCg0KY29tbWVudHMgaW5saW5lLg0KDQpP biBvbnNkYWcsIG5vdiAyNiwgMjAwMywgYXQgMTc6NTIgQXNpYS9TZW91bCwgV2FuZyxXZWltaW5n IHdyb3RlOg0KDQo+DQo+ICBIaSBBdnJpLA0KPg0KPiAgSSdtIHdyaXRpbmcgdG8gc2VlayB0aGUg cG9zc2libGl0eSBpbiBHU01QIGJhc2UgaGVhZGVyIHRvIGFkZCANCj4gZm9sbG93aW5nIGl0ZW1z Og0KPg0KPiAgMS4gQSBwcm9pcml0eSBmbGFnIHRvIGluZGljYXRlIHRoZSBwcm9jZXNzaW5nIHBy aW9yaXR5IGZvciB0aGUgDQo+IG1lc3NhZ2UuDQoNCkNhbiB5b3UgZXhwbGFpbiBob3cgeW91IHdv dWxkIHRoaW5rIHRoaXMgc2hvdWxkIGJlIHVzZWQ/DQoNCj4gIDIuIEFuIG9wdGlvbmFsIGNoZWNr c3VtIHBhcnQgaW4gR1NNUCBmb3IgZXJyb3IgY29udHJvbC4NCg0KQWdhaW4sIGNhbiB5b3UgZXhw bGFpbiBob3cgeW91IHdvdWxkIHdhbnQgdG8gc2VlIHRoaXMgdXNlZD8NCg0KPg0KPiAgSWYgcG9z c2libGUsIEkgYWxzbyBhc2sgdG8gbGVhdmUgc29tZSBzcGFjZSBpbiB0aGUgVmVyc2lvbiBmaWVs ZCBmb3IgDQo+IHBvc3NpYmxlIGluY2x1ZGluZyBvZiBvdGhlcg0KPiAgcG9zc2libGUgcHJvdG9j b2xzIGxpa2UgR1JNUCANCj4gKGh0dHA6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvaW50ZXJuZXQtZHJhZnRzL2Ry YWZ0LXdhbmctZm9yY2VzLWdybXAtMDEudHh0KS4NCg0KICBJZiB0aGUgdHdvIHByb3RvY29scyB3 ZXJlIHRvIGJlIG1lcmdlZCBpdCB3b3VsZCBzZWVtIHRvIG1ha2UgdGhlIG1vc3QgDQpzZW5zZSB0 byBtZSBmb3IgdGhlcmUgdG8gYmUgb25lIGJhc2UgcHJvdG9jb2wgd2hpY2ggc3VwcG9ydGVkIHRo ZSBNUExTIA0KYW5kIEdNUExTIG1vZGUgYXMgd2VsbCBhcyB0aGUgcm91dGVyIG1vZGUuICBJIHdv dWxkIHBlcnNvbmFsbHkgYmUgDQp1bmNvbWZvcnRhYmxlIHdpdGggb25lIHZlcnNpb24gb2YgdGhl IHByb3RvY29sIGZvciBzd2l0Y2hlcyBhbmQgb25lIGZvciANCnJvdXRlcnMuICBJbiBtYW55IHJl c3BlY3RzIEkgdGhpbmsgdGhhdCB0aGUgc3VwcG9ydCAgb25lIHdvdWxkIG5lZWQgZm9yIA0KYWRk aW5nIG1lc3NhZ2VzIGZvciByb3V0ZXIgc3VwcG9ydCBhbHJlYWR5IGV4aXN0cy4NCg0KSWYgdGhp cyBtZXJnZSBpcyBzb21ldGhpbmcgdGhhdCBpcyBvZiBpbnRlcmVzdCB0byB0aGUgV2cgYW5kIHNv bWV0aGluZyANCndlIGNhbiBnZXQgSUVTRyBzdXBwb3J0IGZvciAoaSB0aGluayBpdCB3b3VsZCBy ZXF1aXJlIGEgY2hhcnRlciANCmFtZW5kbWVudCkgdGhlbiBJIHRoaW5rIHdlIGNvdWxkIGNlcnRh aW5seSB3b3JrIG91dCB0aGUgZGV0YWlscyBoZXJlIG9uIA0KdGhlIGxpc3QuDQoNCkkgZG8gdGhp bmsgeW91ciBmaXJzdCAyIHJlcXVlc3RzIGNhbiBiZSBkaXNjdXNzZWQgd2l0aGluIHRoZSBjdXJy ZW50ICANCndvcmsgd2l0aG91dCBhbnkgY2hhcnRlciAgcHJvYmxlbXMuICBGb3IgdGhlIG90aGVy LCBJIHdvdWxkIGxpa2UgdG8gDQpoZWFyIGZyb20gb3RoZXIgbGlzdCBtZW1iZXJzIG9uIHdoZXRo ZXIgaXQgaXMgc29tZXRoaW5nIHRoYXQgdGhlIFdHIA0Kc2hvdWxkIHB1cnN1ZS4NCg0KYS4NCg0K DQpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KR1NNUCBt YWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCkdTTVBAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3MS5pZXRmLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFu L2xpc3RpbmZvL2dzbXANCg0KX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX18NCkdTTVAgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQpHU01QQGlldGYub3JnDQpodHRwczovL3d3dzEu aWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9nc21w _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Mon Dec 15 03:21:37 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA28946 for ; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:21:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AVnyV-00006T-Kj for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:21:08 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBF8L6Qj000391 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:21:06 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AVnyT-00006E-Rm for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:21:05 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA28943 for ; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:21:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AVnyR-0006tU-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:21:03 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AVnyR-0006tQ-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:21:03 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AVnyQ-00005m-Jg; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:21:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AVnyH-00005G-B7 for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:20:53 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA28937 for ; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:20:51 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AVnyF-0006tK-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:20:51 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AVnyE-0006tF-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 03:20:50 -0500 Received: from [147.28.0.62] (helo=acm.org) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.24; FreeBSD 4.9) id 1AVnyE-000HQT-Ch; Mon, 15 Dec 2003 08:20:50 +0000 Date: Mon, 15 Dec 2003 17:20:05 +0900 Subject: Re: [GSMP] RE: GSMP WG Status Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-2-827408354 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) Cc: "Wijnen, Bert (Bert)" , gsmp@ietf.org To: Kenneth Sundell From: Avri Doria In-Reply-To: <3FD9AE36.2060005@nortelnetworks.com> Message-Id: <7CA9709A-2ED7-11D8-8876-000393CC2112@acm.org> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , --Apple-Mail-2-827408354 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, i find it so sad to realize that the threat to kill the group may actually force people to stop the work. And thus the effort being put into closing this group by the ADs is effectively an effort to stop the work. I can only wonder why there is the rush to kill this work group. it is not using up great amounts of resource and it is, in my opinion, doing useful work. Is there only one type of acceptable way of working in the IETF now? I have never read any documentation that describes an acceptable level of discussion and participation. a. On fredag, dec 12, 2003, at 13:01 Europe/Zurich, Kenneth Sundell wrote: > > Bert, > > Wijnen, Bert (Bert) wrote: > > > > Why would "closing the WG" be similar to "cutting the phone line"?? > The mailing list can/will continue to exist. So you can keep > talking/emailing (as little as has been done till now, or as much > as you all think/promise you are going to be doing). > > The recent message from Marcus Brunner is one of the possible answers > to that question: > > Marcus Brunner wrote: > >Bert, > > >We promised to take a look at the MIBs and actually started already > but will now immediately stop the effort to get that problem solved. > > >Marcus > > Regards, > Ken > > > > And once the (small) set of people on this list comes to closure > on their documents, they can still submit them as (individual) > contributions via RFC-Editor. We will consider them. > > Bert > > Regards, > Weiming > > > _______________________________________________ > GSMP mailing list > GSMP@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp > > > -- > > Kenneth Sundell > Sr. Protocols Architect > CTO/ATI Strategic Protocols > Nortel Networks (Sweden) > ESN 521-3538, Ext IAC+46 8 5088-3538 > > > --Apple-Mail-2-827408354 Content-Type: text/enriched; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Yes, i find it so sad to realize that the threat to kill the group may actually force people to stop the work. And thus the effort being put into closing this group by the ADs is effectively an effort to stop the work. I can only wonder why there is the rush to kill this work group. it is not using up great amounts of resource and it is, in my opinion, doing useful work. Is there only one type of acceptable way of working in the IETF now? I have never read any documentation that describes an acceptable level of discussion and participation. a. On fredag, dec 12, 2003, at 13:01 Europe/Zurich, Kenneth Sundell wrote: Bert, Wijnen, Bert (Bert) wrote: Why would "closing the WG" be similar to "cutting the phone line"?? The mailing list can/will continue to exist. So you can keep talking/emailing (as little as has been done till now, or as much as you all think/promise you are going to be doing). The recent message from Marcus Brunner is one of the possible answers to that question: Marcus Brunner wrote: >Bert, >We promised to take a look at the MIBs and actually started already but will now immediately stop the effort to get that problem solved. >Marcus Regards, Ken And once the (small) set of people on this list comes to closure on their documents, they can still submit them as (individual) contributions via RFC-Editor. We will consider them. Bert Regards, Weiming _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list 1998,1998,FFFEGSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp -- Kenneth Sundell Sr. Protocols Architect CTO/ATI Strategic Protocols Nortel Networks (Sweden) ESN 521-3538, Ext IAC+46 8 5088-3538 --Apple-Mail-2-827408354-- _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp From exim@www1.ietf.org Fri Dec 19 08:00:37 2003 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA07493 for ; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AXKEh-0007Zr-FW for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:07 -0500 Received: (from exim@localhost) by www1.ietf.org (8.12.8/8.12.8/Submit) id hBJD07Dc029121 for gsmp-archive@odin.ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:07 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AXKEg-0007Ya-4j for gsmp-web-archive@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:06 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA07472 for ; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AXKEf-00021M-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:05 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AXKEe-00021E-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:04 -0500 Received: from [132.151.1.19] (helo=optimus.ietf.org) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AXKEd-00021B-00 for gsmp-web-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:03 -0500 Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AXKEb-0007Xu-IP; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 08:00:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AXKE8-0007XB-Ts for gsmp@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:59:32 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA07415 for ; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:59:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AXKE7-00020a-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:59:31 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AXKE7-00020T-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:59:31 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AXKE6-00020P-00 for gsmp@ietf.org; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 07:59:31 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62]) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.24; FreeBSD) id 1AXKDr-0001nn-Oj; Fri, 19 Dec 2003 12:59:15 +0000 Date: Fri, 19 Dec 2003 21:58:25 +0900 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v553) Cc: Bert (Bert) Wijnen , Alex (E-mail) To: gsmp@ietf.org From: avri Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <08593E18-3223-11D8-85F6-000393CC2112@psg.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.553) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [GSMP] GSMP WG closure Sender: gsmp-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: gsmp-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: gsmp@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: General Switch Management Protocol WG List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To the GSMP group, It has been over a week since Bert threatened to close this group because of inactivity. In that time very few people have spoken up with a reason for why the group should not be closed. At this point, given the silence, we can only assume that Bert is correct and that group does not have the energy, coherence or desire to remain a WG. If this is really case, as the co-chairs, we can only bow to Bert's greater perception and stand aside. It has been a pleasure working with the group. Thanks The GSMP WG Co-chairs Avri and Kenneth _______________________________________________ GSMP mailing list GSMP@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gsmp