From lars.eggert@nokia.com Tue Aug 2 06:43:29 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 169C821F86C3 for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2011 06:43:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -103.742 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-103.742 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.746, BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, SARE_NETPROD=0.111, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7o6lhmVATRKw for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2011 06:43:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mgw-da02.nokia.com (smtp.nokia.com [147.243.128.26]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0500E21F86AF for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2011 06:43:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.fit.nokia.com (esdhcp030222.research.nokia.com [172.21.30.222]) by mgw-da02.nokia.com (Switch-3.4.4/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id p72DhZ7c025923 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO) for ; Tue, 2 Aug 2011 16:43:36 +0300 From: Lars Eggert X-Virus-Status: Clean X-Virus-Scanned: clamav-milter 0.97.2 at fit.nokia.com Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_6434A85E-35FA-422E-91BD-278AB8E8FD33"; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 Date: Tue, 2 Aug 2011 16:43:31 +0300 Message-Id: <6A337606-0E26-4CDF-91E7-8D424A4CB333@nokia.com> To: hiprg@irtf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v1244.3) X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1244.3) X-Greylist: Sender succeeded SMTP AUTH, not delayed by milter-greylist-4.2.7 (mail.fit.nokia.com); Tue, 02 Aug 2011 16:43:32 +0300 (EEST) X-Nokia-AV: Clean Subject: [hiprg] Call for Nominations: Applied Networking Research Prize (ANRP) for IETF-82 X-BeenThere: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: anrp@isoc.org List-Id: "Host Identity Protocol \(HIP\) Research Group" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Aug 2011 13:43:29 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_6434A85E-35FA-422E-91BD-278AB8E8FD33 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 CALL FOR NOMINATIONS: APPLIED NETWORKING RESEARCH PRIZE (ANRP) http://irtf.org/anrp *** Submit nominations until August 28 for the ANRP for IETF-82, *** November 13-18, 2011 in Taipei, Taiwan: *** http://fit.nokia.com/anrp/82/ The Applied Networking Research Prize (ANRP) is awarded for recent results in applied networking research that are relevant for transitioning into shipping Internet products and related standardization efforts. Researchers with relevant, recently published results are encouraged to apply for this prize, which will offer them the opportunity to present and discuss their work with the engineers, network operators, policy makers and scientists that participate in the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF) and its research arm, the Internet Research Task Force (IRTF). Third-party nominations for this prize are also encouraged. The goal of the Applied Networking Research Prize (ANRP) is to recognize the best new ideas in networking, and bring them to the IETF and IRTF especially in cases where they would not otherwise see much exposure or discussion. The Applied Networking Research Prize (ANRP) consists of: * cash prize of $500 (USD) * invited talk at the IRTF Open Meeting * travel grant to attend the week-long IETF meeting (airfare, hotel, registration, stipend) * recognition at the IETF plenary * invitation to related social activities * potential for additional travel grants to future IETF meetings, based on community feedback HOW TO APPLY Only a single person can be nominated based on a peer-reviewed, recently-published, original journal, conference or workshop paper they authored. The nominee must be one of the main authors of the nominated paper. Both self nominations (nominating one=92s own paper) and third-party nominations (nominating someone else=92s paper) are encouraged. The nominated paper should provide a scientific foundation for possible future IETF engineering work or IRTF experimentation, analyze the behavior of Internet protocols in operational deployments or realistic testbeds, make an important contribution to the understanding of Internet scalability, performance, reliability, security or capability, or otherwise be of relevance to ongoing or future IETF or IRTF activities. Applicants must briefly describe how the nominated paper relates to these goals, and are encouraged to describe how presentation of these research results will foster their transition into new IETF engineering or IRTF experimentation, or otherwise seed new activities that will have an impact on the real-world Internet. The goal of the Applied Networking Research Prize (ANRP) is to foster the transitioning of research results into real-world benefits for the Internet. Therefore, applicants must indicate that they (or the nominee, in case of third-party nominations) are available to attend the respective IETF meeting in person and in its entirety. Nominations must include: * the name and email address of the nominee * a reference to the published nominated paper * a PDF copy of the nominated paper * a statement that describes how the nominated paper fulfills the goals of the award * a statement that the nominee is available to attend the respective IETF meeting in person and in its entirety * a brief biography or CV of the nominee * optionally, any other supporting information (link to nominee's web site, etc.) *** Nominations are submitted via the submission site: *** http://fit.nokia.com/anrp/82/ SELECTION PROCESS A small selection committee comprised of individuals knowledgeable about the IRTF, IETF and the broader networking research community will evaluate the submissions against these selection criteria. The goal is to select 1-2 submissions for the Applied Networking Research Prize (ANRP) during each nomination period. All nominees will be notified by email. IMPORTANT DATES Applications open: August 1, 2011 Applications close: August 28, 2011 Notifications: September 20, 2011 IETF-82 Meeting: November 13-18, 2011 in Taipei, Taiwan=20 SPONSORS The Applied Networking Research Prize (ANRP) is supported by the Internet Society (ISOC), as part of its Internet Research Award Programme, in coordination with the Internet Research Task Force (IRTF).= --Apple-Mail=_6434A85E-35FA-422E-91BD-278AB8E8FD33 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIMRjCCBVAw ggQ4oAMCAQICEGxdPUZzCwUJ8KBiJwH+bYgwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQEFBQAwgd0xCzAJBgNVBAYTAlVT MRcwFQYDVQQKEw5WZXJpU2lnbiwgSW5jLjEfMB0GA1UECxMWVmVyaVNpZ24gVHJ1c3QgTmV0d29y azE7MDkGA1UECxMyVGVybXMgb2YgdXNlIGF0IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnZlcmlzaWduLmNvbS9ycGEg KGMpMDkxHjAcBgNVBAsTFVBlcnNvbmEgTm90IFZhbGlkYXRlZDE3MDUGA1UEAxMuVmVyaVNpZ24g 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tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id e6xDp5TRZJMg for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 04:03:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com (klovia.htt-consult.com [208.83.67.149]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E9BE21F869D for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 04:02:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D5EB62A96 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 11:02:43 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at localhost Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (klovia.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EYVL5kskbvDI for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 07:02:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nc2400.htt-consult.com (nc2400.htt-consult.com [208.83.67.155]) (Authenticated sender: rgm@htt-consult.com) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id D35C862A89 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 07:02:30 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4E3A7C46.2090409@htt-consult.com> Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 07:02:30 -0400 From: Robert Moskowitz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.2.18) Gecko/20110621 Fedora/3.1.11-1.fc14 Thunderbird/3.1.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "hiprg@irtf.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [hiprg] HIP DEX code comment in meeting X-BeenThere: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "Host Identity Protocol \(HIP\) Research Group" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 11:03:07 -0000 I caught a comment from someone in the meeting about status of a C++ HIP DEX codebase. I was focused on something else in the session at the time and failed to identify the talker. Since this comment was not made at the mike, when I went through the audio yesterday, I did not pick it up. So.... Can anyone enlighten me as to work on HIP DEX development? :) From jpellikk@ee.oulu.fi Thu Aug 4 04:38:56 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 12BA821F8B23 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 04:38:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id b7+KIAcCe5Ou for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 04:38:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ees2.oulu.fi (ee.oulu.fi [130.231.61.23]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1743221F8B1D for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 04:38:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [10.20.209.48] (gw1.panoulu.net [212.50.147.101]) (authenticated bits=0) by ees2.oulu.fi (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id p74Bd61L011164 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Thu, 4 Aug 2011 14:39:06 +0300 Message-ID: <4E3A84DA.4070307@ee.oulu.fi> Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 14:39:06 +0300 From: Jani Pellikka User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.18) Gecko/20110617 Lightning/1.0b2 Thunderbird/3.1.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: hiprg@irtf.org References: <4E3A7C46.2090409@htt-consult.com> <4E3A7D2A.2000105@hiit.fi> In-Reply-To: <4E3A7D2A.2000105@hiit.fi> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [hiprg] HIP DEX code comment in meeting X-BeenThere: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: jpellikk@ee.oulu.fi List-Id: "Host Identity Protocol \(HIP\) Research Group" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 11:38:56 -0000 Hi! Like Andrei mentioned we have a DEX implementation written in C++ but unfortunately not yet able to share it publicly. We intend to do this later though. We can probably present results and show what we have used it for in the next IETF meeting. Btw, it is an independent implementation from the existing HIP implementations (HIPL, OpenHIP, ...). Cheers, -- Jani On 08/04/2011 02:06 PM, Andrei Gurtov wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > > Jani from CWC Oulu has made C++ DEX implementation. > > We're not releasing it publicly yet as experiments for a paper are still > ongoing but can share it under some gentleman agreement. > > Andrei > > Robert Moskowitz wrote: >> I caught a comment from someone in the meeting about status of a C++ HIP >> DEX codebase. I was focused on something else in the session at the >> time and failed to identify the talker. Since this comment was not made >> at the mike, when I went through the audio yesterday, I did not pick it >> up. So.... >> >> Can anyone enlighten me as to work on HIP DEX development? :) >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> hiprg mailing list >> hiprg@irtf.org >> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hiprg > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (MingW32) > Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ > > iEYEARECAAYFAk46fSoACgkQP7jp0uceFkSOwACdFSIvmK3fkWhrPptYdMf6otti > NBAAn3QlYHXRyLFxoh34J7HMRubZX5db > =fn9J > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From tapio.leva@aalto.fi Thu Aug 4 06:06:06 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C0D621F8B5A for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 06:06:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XWWUVFEK21Vc for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 06:06:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx05.aalto.fi (mx05.aalto.fi [130.233.222.104]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73B8B21F8B3D for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 06:06:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx05.aalto.fi (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by localhost (Postfix) with SMTP id 10CAF80C5B for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 16:06:17 +0300 (EEST) Received: from EXHUB01.org.aalto.fi (ex-hub01.org.aalto.fi [130.233.222.118]) by mx05.aalto.fi (Postfix) with ESMTP id 081B780C58 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 16:06:16 +0300 (EEST) Received: from EXMDB01.org.aalto.fi ([169.254.2.116]) by EXHUB01.org.aalto.fi ([130.233.222.118]) with mapi id 14.01.0270.001; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 16:06:17 +0300 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lev=E4_Tapio?= To: "hiprg@irtf.org" Thread-Topic: [hiprg] HIP DEX code comment in meeting Thread-Index: AQHMUpsdPt+xwI5NS0yH8U0tx6cBRJUMqNrg Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2011 13:06:16 +0000 Message-ID: <914E4AF9EA753942BBF6770F26EB86D44D6F9539@EXMDB01.org.aalto.fi> References: <4E3A7C46.2090409@htt-consult.com> <4E3A7D2A.2000105@hiit.fi> <7287_1312457954_4E3A84E2_7287_449_1_4E3A84DA.4070307@ee.oulu.fi> In-Reply-To: <7287_1312457954_4E3A84E2_7287_449_1_4E3A84DA.4070307@ee.oulu.fi> Accept-Language: fi-FI, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [130.233.154.22] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [hiprg] HIP DEX code comment in meeting X-BeenThere: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "Host Identity Protocol \(HIP\) Research Group" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 13:06:06 -0000 The comment can be found from Jabber: http://www.ietf.org/jabber/logs/hiprg= /2011-07-28.html=20 Ari was reading it to the mike. [15:14:34] This is Jani Pellikka from Centre for Wireless Commun= ications, Univ. Oulu, Finland. I want to use this opportunity to announce that we have a C++ implementatio= n of HIP Diet Exchange for Linux. Only the exchange is implemented and it works on IPv4 and IPv6. It is not y= et public as we are experimenting with it and using it in our research project, but later we intend to open s= ource it. Probably in the next IETF meeting we can present some results and show what we have done with it= . I will email the mailing list about this as well. Just FYI. [15:15:28] Jani: to the mic? [15:15:44] Yes, please. [15:15:50] ack=20 Tapio > -----Original Message----- > From: hiprg-bounces@irtf.org [mailto:hiprg-bounces@irtf.org] On Behalf > Of Jani Pellikka > Sent: 4. elokuuta 2011 14:39 > To: hiprg@irtf.org > Subject: Re: [hiprg] HIP DEX code comment in meeting >=20 > Hi! >=20 > Like Andrei mentioned we have a DEX implementation written in C++ but > unfortunately not yet able to share it publicly. We intend to do this > later though. We can probably present results and show what we have > used > it for in the next IETF meeting. >=20 > Btw, it is an independent implementation from the existing HIP > implementations (HIPL, OpenHIP, ...). >=20 > Cheers, >=20 > -- > Jani >=20 > On 08/04/2011 02:06 PM, Andrei Gurtov wrote: > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > Hash: SHA1 > > > > > > Jani from CWC Oulu has made C++ DEX implementation. > > > > We're not releasing it publicly yet as experiments for a paper are > still > > ongoing but can share it under some gentleman agreement. > > > > Andrei > > > > Robert Moskowitz wrote: > >> I caught a comment from someone in the meeting about status of a > C++ HIP > >> DEX codebase. I was focused on something else in the session at > the > >> time and failed to identify the talker. Since this comment was not > made > >> at the mike, when I went through the audio yesterday, I did not > pick it > >> up. So.... > >> > >> Can anyone enlighten me as to work on HIP DEX development? :) > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> hiprg mailing list > >> hiprg@irtf.org > >> https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hiprg > > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > > Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (MingW32) > > Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ > > > > iEYEARECAAYFAk46fSoACgkQP7jp0uceFkSOwACdFSIvmK3fkWhrPptYdMf6otti > > NBAAn3QlYHXRyLFxoh34J7HMRubZX5db > > =3Dfn9J > > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- >=20 > _______________________________________________ > hiprg mailing list > hiprg@irtf.org > https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hiprg From beroset@mindspring.com Thu Aug 4 06:20:44 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BAC221F8B39 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 06:20:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lUZDJbc+dPBQ for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 06:20:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD05921F8B30 for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 06:20:42 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=allHjAt5EhiTH6e/7INOrLrrvlH0svJ9C0GKP6jNnIdJKq2Zpb3tQj6PDb04iLxR; h=Message-ID:Date:From:Reply-To:To:Subject:Mime-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Mailer:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [209.86.224.50] (helo=mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Qoxr5-0002ec-BN; Thu, 04 Aug 2011 09:20:55 -0400 Received: from 72.237.119.67 by webmail.earthlink.net with HTTP; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 09:20:54 -0400 Message-ID: <25658028.1312464055269.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Date: Thu, 4 Aug 2011 09:20:54 -0400 (GMT-04:00) From: Ed Beroset To: "hiprg@irtf.org" , Robert Moskowitz Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: EarthLink Zoo Mail 1.0 X-ELNK-Trace: 105d402e9ac1c2b99649176a89d694c0f43c108795ac45075c064a56a61f5415a2b093023014c642350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 209.86.224.50 Subject: Re: [hiprg] HIP DEX suggestion X-BeenThere: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list Reply-To: Ed Beroset List-Id: "Host Identity Protocol \(HIP\) Research Group" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 13:20:45 -0000 Speaking of implementations, I have a suggestion about HIP DEX. Right now it specifies the use of AES-CBC but I would like to see if we could change that to either AES-CFB or AES-CTR. The reason is that for CBC, one must implement both the AES encrypt and decrypt functions. With CFB and CTR, one only need implement AES encrypt. This saves about 1.5k of code space on a typical small microprocessor for which HIP DEX is intended and has at least equivalent (and some say better) security properties. Ed Beroset From rgm@htt-consult.com Thu Aug 4 07:28:29 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54D2E21F886C for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 07:28:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mev79a9KrE7x for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 07:28:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com (klovia.htt-consult.com [208.83.67.149]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C902621F884E for ; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 07:28:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFD8662ABB; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 14:28:16 +0000 (UTC) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at localhost Received: from klovia.htt-consult.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (klovia.htt-consult.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id a0xlxKInP3Z8; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 10:28:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from nc2400.htt-consult.com (nc2400.htt-consult.com [208.83.67.155]) (Authenticated sender: rgm@htt-consult.com) by klovia.htt-consult.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8FE0562A89; Thu, 4 Aug 2011 10:28:06 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <4E3AAC76.8000203@htt-consult.com> Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 10:28:06 -0400 From: Robert Moskowitz User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.9.2.18) Gecko/20110621 Fedora/3.1.11-1.fc14 Thunderbird/3.1.11 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ed Beroset References: <25658028.1312464055269.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net> In-Reply-To: <25658028.1312464055269.JavaMail.root@mswamui-swiss.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: "hiprg@irtf.org" Subject: Re: [hiprg] HIP DEX suggestion X-BeenThere: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "Host Identity Protocol \(HIP\) Research Group" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Aug 2011 14:28:29 -0000 On 08/04/2011 09:20 AM, Ed Beroset wrote: > Speaking of implementations, I have a suggestion about HIP DEX. Right now it specifies the use of AES-CBC but I would like to see if we could change that to either AES-CFB or AES-CTR. The reason is that for CBC, one must implement both the AES encrypt and decrypt functions. With CFB and CTR, one only need implement AES encrypt. This saves about 1.5k of code space on a typical small microprocessor for which HIP DEX is intended and has at least equivalent (and some say better) security properties. Very good point. Plus hardware that does AES-CCM should be able to do CTR 'easily'. But I have to look at what the counter would be. CBC was 'easy' in that there was a natural nonce. From rene.hummen@informatik.rwth-aachen.de Wed Aug 10 05:06:03 2011 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hiprg@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 078F321F877F for ; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 05:06:03 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.501 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.501 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_DE=0.35, HELO_MISMATCH_DE=1.448, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Yp15S8Gi1ada for ; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 05:06:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mta-1.ms.rz.rwth-aachen.de (mta-1.ms.rz.RWTH-Aachen.DE [134.130.7.72]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B511421F877D for ; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 05:06:01 -0700 (PDT) MIME-version: 1.0 Received: from ironport-out-1.rz.rwth-aachen.de ([134.130.5.40]) by mta-1.ms.rz.RWTH-Aachen.de (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 6.3-7.04 (built Sep 26 2008)) with ESMTP id <0LPP00BEWOAU2T00@mta-1.ms.rz.RWTH-Aachen.de> for hiprg@irtf.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 14:06:30 +0200 (CEST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.67,350,1309730400"; d="p7s'?scan'208";a="129860827" Received: from relay-auth-1.ms.rz.rwth-aachen.de (HELO relay-auth-1) ([134.130.7.78]) by ironport-in-1.rz.rwth-aachen.de with ESMTP; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 14:06:31 +0200 Received: from umic-i4-137-226-45-181.nn.rwth-aachen.de ([unknown] [137.226.45.181]) by relay-auth-1.ms.rz.rwth-aachen.de (Sun Java(tm) System Messaging Server 7.0-3.01 64bit (built Dec 9 2008)) with ESMTPA id <0LPP006Z1OAUWL50@relay-auth-1.ms.rz.rwth-aachen.de> for hiprg@irtf.org; Wed, 10 Aug 2011 14:06:30 +0200 (CEST) From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ren=E9_Hummen?= Content-type: multipart/signed; boundary=Apple-Mail-39--336656102; protocol="application/pkcs7-signature"; micalg=sha1 Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2011 14:06:32 +0200 Message-id: To: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1084) Subject: Re: [hiprg] Starting a list of RG topics of importance/interest X-BeenThere: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "Host Identity Protocol \(HIP\) Research Group" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Aug 2011 12:06:03 -0000 --Apple-Mail-39--336656102 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hi, thanks for the already extensive list of research questions. I'll write = down my thoughts inline. On 29.07.2011, at 00:07, Tobias Heer wrote: > * HIP interaction with middleboxes >=20 > HIP can be a burden or a big advantage for middleboxes. In the last 2 = years > we've seen quite some proposals to enable secure signaling to = middleboxes and > inclusion of middleboxes in the HIP communication flow to enable = different goals > ranging from security to mobility and ease of deployment. With = stronger focus > on these things, the RG could help to channel the individual efforts = into a > coherent and complete analysis and could foster the creation of = comprehensive > solutions. HIP was designed to be middlebox friendly. However, some aspects (such = as draft-heer-hip-middle-auth) are still required for this statement to = be true. Furthermore, there are still some interesting things that HIP = can do for middleboxes. One rather obvious example is inbound connection = establishment through HIP-aware NATs. Still, I have only found = "draft-nikander-hip-nat-00 (to be issued)" with a quick Google search = regarding this topic. > Drafts on my mind are: > - draft-lagutin-hip-pla > - draft-heer-hip-middle-auth But there is other research in this are = as well IMO, some spec about secure state establishment for middleboxes is = essential when talking about HIP-aware middleboxes. So, this is = important to follow up on. > - (Rene Hummen is working on related topics). I am working on end-to-middle signaling mechanisms to improve middlebox = services. The inbound NAT described above is a simple use case for these = signaling mechanisms. > - The femtocell presentation today also used HIP middleboxes as = specified in > draft-heer-hip-middle-auth - HIP mobility with focus on middleboxes would be another important = area. One question to ask here: How middlebox-friendly is the update = process when NATs are located on the communication path? > * HIP as part of the infrastructure >=20 > There are a number of drafts and papers that use HIP within the = network to > connect different networks and to create VPN-like network overlays. = People have > presented quite some ideas within the RG and the RG could be a place = to moderate > and align these efforts. >=20 > Ongoing work in this area: >=20 > - draft-henderson-hip-vpls > - HIP and femtocell technology > - We have a similar solutions under development at RWTH in the context = of the > Mobile ACcess project (there were presentations in Beijing and = Anaheim) > - I guess Mobile Router would also fit in here I agree that these are very useful and interesting use cases for HIP. = One thing that would be important to have, though, would be a sound = analysis of the benefits of these approaches compared to existing = solutions. > * HIP derivates for application specific use cases >=20 > The RFID and the DEX documents are two siblings or offsprings of HIP = that target > specific scenarios. Nevertheless, these protocols share a common set = of > features and ideas. Right now these protocols are completely separate = but I had > discussions with Bob and Pascal and we agreed that some sort of = interoperability > would be good or even required. However, creating interoperability of = these > protocols is more than just defining conversion rules because some = essential > differences remain. An interesting question for me is how we can = create that > _family_ of interoperable HIP protocols that Bob envisioned. What are = the > requirements for new family members? Which mechanisms (in = standardization and > protocol design) are required to achieve a maintainable and evolvable = set of > protocols. >=20 > Documents:=20 > - draft-moskowitz-hip-rg-dex > - draft-irtf-hiprg-rfid > - current efforts with the IEEE and IoT-related groups Seeing that HIP will probably not be the next big thing in the Internet, = I think the right way to go is find niche markets for HIP. HIP in the = infrastructure surely is one of these niches. Another one might be the = embedded domain. So I strongly agree with this. > * HIT and ORCHID design. >=20 > How can we enable hierarchies within the flat HIP namespace to make = things like > revocation and HIP/IP resolution simpler. This may sound easy at a = first glance > but there are some tough decisions to make: How many bits can we = sacrifice to > encode a hierarchy in a HIT. Are there smart ways of avoiding security > penalties? Can we use techniques to strengthen the security of the = HIT (e.g., > similar to CGAs). Are we even moving towards CGAs? How do hierarchies = affect > other mechanisms in HIP (e.g., cipher negotiation in RFC5201-bis)? How = can we > manage and use these hierarchies? >=20 > Related documents: >=20 > -draft-xu-hip-hierarchical >=20 >=20 > * Use cases for HIP certificates >=20 > The definition of HIP certificates deliberately excludes the = specification of > specific use cases. However the certificates were mentioned in quite = many > presentations in the past. Hence, scenario dependent and scenario = independent > methods to generate and handle certificates are still largely = undefined and > unaligned. It would be great if the RG could collect different use = cases and > condense these in a "best-practices" or "use-cases" document. In = addition, > mechanisms to signal that certificates are required need to be = defined. As > these are not part of the minimal set of features required for HIP, I = assume > that the RG is a good place to bootstrap such work. >=20 > - draft-heer-hip-service > - draft-henderson-hip-vpls > - draft-pellikka-hiprg-certreq > - HIP and femtocell technology > - I have seen certificates pop up in some other places here and there This is definitely worth following up on. I would also like to see some = numbers in such a best-practices document, e.g., "If you want to use RSA = certs with 2048 bit keys, you can only add them to R2 due to excessive = size", etc. As we do not have a single "use certificates this way" = document, we should avoid that we have to evaluate these numbers for = each use case again. > ------------ >=20 > There may be more research and problem areas that I missed. There may = also be > additional documents, papers and drafts that I did not mention here. = If so, it > would be great if people could extend this list. I am missing one research area in your list, but I am not exactly sure = which category it would belong to: draft-cao-hiprg-flow-mobility-00. = This draft was presented by Zhen Cao in Prague. With flow mobility, = end-hosts can decide which locators to use for communication on a = per-flow instead of a per-association basis. Flow mobility could be = generalized to hip-on-packet-flows (something I have been working on as = well). BR, Ren=E9 -- Dipl.-Inform. Rene Hummen, Ph.D. Student Chair of Communication and Distributed Systems RWTH Aachen University, Germany tel: +49 241 80 20772 web: http://www.comsys.rwth-aachen.de/team/rene-hummen/ --Apple-Mail-39--336656102 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=smime.p7s Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name=smime.p7s Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExCzAJBgUrDgMCGgUAMIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAQAAoIIN7zCCBCEw ggMJoAMCAQICAgDHMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBBQUAMHExCzAJBgNVBAYTAkRFMRwwGgYDVQQKExNEZXV0 c2NoZSBUZWxla29tIEFHMR8wHQYDVQQLExZULVRlbGVTZWMgVHJ1c3QgQ2VudGVyMSMwIQYDVQQD ExpEZXV0c2NoZSBUZWxla29tIFJvb3QgQ0EgMjAeFw0wNjEyMTkxMDI5MDBaFw0xOTA2MzAyMzU5 MDBaMFoxCzAJBgNVBAYTAkRFMRMwEQYDVQQKEwpERk4tVmVyZWluMRAwDgYDVQQLEwdERk4tUEtJ MSQwIgYDVQQDExtERk4tVmVyZWluIFBDQSBHbG9iYWwgLSBHMDEwggEiMA0GCSqGSIb3DQEBAQUA A4IBDwAwggEKAoIBAQDpm8NnhfkNrvWNVMOWUDU9YuluTO2U1wBblSJ01CDrNI/W7MAxBAuZgeKm FNJSoCgjhIt0iQReW+DieMF4yxbLKDU5ey2QRdDtoAB6fL9KDhsAw4bpXCsxEXsM84IkQ4wcOItq 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([130.247.25.83]) by XCH-NWHT-02.nw.nos.boeing.com ([130.247.70.248]) with mapi; Fri, 19 Aug 2011 16:53:10 -0700 From: "Henderson, Thomas R" To: "hiprg@irtf.org" Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 16:53:09 -0700 Thread-Topic: IETF 81 meeting minutes posted Thread-Index: AcxeyyYb4lPKqpmVQYCs2vlP3R5fJA== Message-ID: <7CC566635CFE364D87DC5803D4712A6C4CEFAF0605@XCH-NW-10V.nw.nos.boeing.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [hiprg] IETF 81 meeting minutes posted X-BeenThere: hiprg@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12 Precedence: list List-Id: "Host Identity Protocol \(HIP\) Research Group" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 19 Aug 2011 23:52:26 -0000 I've posted meeting minutes from the RG meeting here: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/81/minutes/HIPRG.txt transcribed from the audio. If any changes are needed, they will need to b= e done before 26 August. - Tom