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X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: hrpc discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 04 Aug 2020 14:13:56 -0000 Hello Sofía! Just after IETF 108 I'm following this. Thanks for your review and interest. > I opened an issue, as well, on categories that can be introduced and > explained at the 'Online Violence' section: I saw the issue and I think it's very important to work on the types of online -in this case gender based- violence you mention. After working a few months on this draft and trying to figure out how to connect all those feminist principles with IETF work, I was wondering if we may better work on two separate drafts, one of them focused on online gender based violence. > https://github.com/IRTF-HRPC/drafts/issues/20 I'm happy to provide a > definition for all of them and how they intersect with the IETF work. This is an interesting typology made in Latin America, and based on more than 4 years documenting cases. https://www.genderit.org/resources/13-manifestations-gender-based-violence-using-technology I'll take a look on the documents you recommend but I'm sure it would be great if we can provide a technical approach to work done by people and organizations supporting women who face online gender violence. I think a very good reference for such a work is draft-irtf-pearg-censorship. I'll send you an email off the list to continue talking about it. Thanks a lot! Juliana From braman@tamu.edu Tue Aug 4 12:25:37 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1ECD3A10B1 for ; Tue, 4 Aug 2020 12:25:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=tamu-edu.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CagQnhbN4E5f for ; Tue, 4 Aug 2020 12:25:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-io1-xd31.google.com (mail-io1-xd31.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d31]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 51B533A108A for ; Tue, 4 Aug 2020 12:25:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-io1-xd31.google.com with SMTP id u126so6143201iod.12 for ; Tue, 04 Aug 2020 12:25:32 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tamu-edu.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=QcRgbDLJMiTuZWsD8snlyYfcC9HrjhyFoQJAt31SiIU=; b=xPhEE/BM0PcdV38PIXuxJzlG2b6+ZUyMop3DSXrhsmPNtXXYv7z5FsZsGQDSchaS0w 865/eOUjoLGx5nnE/as7Pg/r8gdoe+RXwVRGZ33cX1oNg9ZuKqVj/syJbPKMS/+3cAHc 9zh5zIWmlmDfjjg3jueK1qEogobbbte/k+JkpstwZz+AdPcGq/N0xB4f2r170nxAq+Mm KCf+9kqycZyhk+rBA0X/ph1AR5JQlmKjlVUBEiRr7rET7WWRAC2xL1SbeOTu0EF3LnS8 6a+WiFsZU/0ciCELb/6hzp6McmnrnuOmYQIK2xS/YzOpExYCTV8TLpCUh4kLw6mFhRGC /LWg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=QcRgbDLJMiTuZWsD8snlyYfcC9HrjhyFoQJAt31SiIU=; b=E+WKCGxBMZPdtwg71zoLLe05rfuoo/guOjKWBmcMpYZvhZt2LBdI37oIms5YjVNxFs 6KVHsfAThyAdgbIljOZC/YC1CooIBT4pST96oJdEtKeEDQNT2EiVZ841O0OS1hKL2ZCi bhgz8BE0NRoyotv6d6GF/dbSsR8Nb2p5uyMiuW17bktijAiaF5SNc2FmGt55mxBT7NbK /iQ17USrZnOUc6jDfpbSvqzNY9JKZSAoQii01nVkhh+Z7I9NHbFppMyCERFivqi2jvel jy+iFiIjASIpnN0Zw88MaHsIB9rcdEtdcpfTowJq6PenmFZBrBL84YoNT/x5uQZDYVah ot8Q== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531j5BPwVikU0f9VnYvO1yNp6cFDMOrjPF7c1yUxfTsDKLKupDRT xlV5z+3zJBLhH9at+8e8Pjb61xEkiLGL8PhK/YOtUnTz X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyWlqmhhKs+l6AuHYY6hM7k1zC85vtRjmA4RoZZLQCOGCc20BCO+IWT99zDusACCD6wNdYno8H1seG1HjAdksE= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6602:15c3:: with SMTP id f3mr6853324iow.25.1596569129728; Tue, 04 Aug 2020 12:25:29 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Sandra Braman Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2020 14:27:44 -0500 Message-ID: To: hrpc@irtf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000d6533105ac12374d" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [hrpc] hrpc Digest, Vol 65, Issue 1 X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: hrpc discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 04 Aug 2020 19:29:40 -0000 --000000000000d6533105ac12374d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Forgive me if this has been discussed, as I'm not caught up on reading all posts to hrpc, but what is the argument for pursuing subject-specific hate speech and incitement rather than addressing it generally to cover all "protected classes," as is more commonly the case with legal systems? "Protected classes" would then include these matters when directed at groups defined by ethnicity, race, sexual preference, disability, and in some cases political positions as well. I would think working more generally would both garner more support, be easier to sell, and be more broadly effective. Sandra Braman On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 2:01 PM wrote: > Send hrpc mailing list submissions to > hrpc@irtf.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc__;= !!KwNVnqRv!T4cdDi4yJXlO5LsJEkO4JjCF5swY7l07WA9TS3f5HS41pEktFS5wOUstgK0iRwAj= e7A$ > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > hrpc-request@irtf.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > hrpc-owner@irtf.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of hrpc digest..." > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Review on feminism draft (Juliana Guerra) > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Juliana Guerra > To: hrpc@irtf.org > Cc: > Bcc: > Date: Tue, 4 Aug 2020 09:13:50 -0500 > Subject: Re: [hrpc] Review on feminism draft > Hello Sof=C3=ADa! Just after IETF 108 I'm following this. Thanks for your > review and interest. > > > I opened an issue, as well, on categories that can be introduced and > > explained at the 'Online Violence' section: > > I saw the issue and I think it's very important to work on the types of > online -in this case gender based- violence you mention. After working a > few months on this draft and trying to figure out how to connect all > those feminist principles with IETF work, I was wondering if we may > better work on two separate drafts, one of them focused on online gender > based violence. > > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://github.com/IRTF-HRPC/drafts/issues/20= __;!!KwNVnqRv!T4cdDi4yJXlO5LsJEkO4JjCF5swY7l07WA9TS3f5HS41pEktFS5wOUstgK0iY= 8o6__0$ > I'm happy to provide a > > definition for all of them and how they intersect with the IETF work. > > This is an interesting typology made in Latin America, and based on more > than 4 years documenting cases. > > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.genderit.org/resources/13-manifes= tations-gender-based-violence-using-technology__;!!KwNVnqRv!T4cdDi4yJXlO5Ls= JEkO4JjCF5swY7l07WA9TS3f5HS41pEktFS5wOUstgK0iXc5tIKU$ > > I'll take a look on the documents you recommend but I'm sure it would be > great if we can provide a technical approach to work done by people and > organizations supporting women who face online gender violence. I think > a very good reference for such a work is draft-irtf-pearg-censorship. > > I'll send you an email off the list to continue talking about it. > > Thanks a lot! > > Juliana > > > > _______________________________________________ > hrpc mailing list > hrpc@irtf.org > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/hrpc__;= !!KwNVnqRv!T4cdDi4yJXlO5LsJEkO4JjCF5swY7l07WA9TS3f5HS41pEktFS5wOUstgK0iRwAj= e7A$ > --000000000000d6533105ac12374d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Forgive me if this has been discussed, as I'm not caug= ht up on reading all posts to hrpc, but what is the argument for pursuing s= ubject-specific hate speech and incitement rather than addressing it genera= lly to cover all "protected classes," as is more commonly the cas= e with legal systems?=C2=A0 "Protected classes" would then includ= e these matters when directed at groups defined by ethnicity, race, sexual = preference, disability, and in some cases political positions as well. I wo= uld think working more generally would both garner more support, be easier = to sell, and be more broadly effective.

Sandra Braman


On Tue, Aug 4, 2020 at 2:01 PM <hrpc-request@irtf.org> wrote:
Send hrpc mailing list submissions = to
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Today's Topics:

=C2=A0 =C2=A01. Re: Review on feminism draft (Juliana Guerra)



---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:=C2=A0Juliana G= uerra <juliana@derechosdigitales.org>
To:=C2=A0hrpc@irtf.org
Cc:=C2=A0
Bcc:=C2=A0Date:=C2=A0Tue, 4 Aug 2020 09:13:50 -0500
Subject:=C2=A0Re: [hrpc] Revi= ew on feminism draft
Hello Sof=C3=ADa! Just after IETF 108 I'm follo= wing this. Thanks for your
review and interest.

> I opened an issue, as well, on categories that can be introduced and > explained at the 'Online Violence' section:

I saw the issue and I think it's very important to work on the types of=
online -in this case gender based- violence you mention. After working a few months on this draft and trying to figure out how to connect all
those feminist principles with IETF work, I was wondering if we may
better work on two separate drafts, one of them focused on online gender based violence.

> https://urldefe= nse.com/v3/__https://github.com/IRTF-HRPC/drafts/issues/20__;!!KwNVnqRv!T4c= dDi4yJXlO5LsJEkO4JjCF5swY7l07WA9TS3f5HS41pEktFS5wOUstgK0iY8o6__0$=C2=A0= I'm happy to provide a
> definition for all of them and how they intersect with the IETF work.<= br>
This is an interesting typology made in Latin America, and based on more than 4 years documenting cases.

https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.genderit.= org/resources/13-manifestations-gender-based-violence-using-technology__;!!= KwNVnqRv!T4cdDi4yJXlO5LsJEkO4JjCF5swY7l07WA9TS3f5HS41pEktFS5wOUstgK0iXc5tIK= U$

I'll take a look on the documents you recommend but I'm sure it wou= ld be
great if we can provide a technical approach to work done by people and
organizations supporting women who face online gender violence. I think
a very good reference for such a work is draft-irtf-pearg-censorship.

I'll send you an email off the list to continue talking about it.

Thanks a lot!

Juliana



_______________________________________________
hrpc mailing list
hrpc@irtf.org
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charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [hrpc] Review on feminism draft X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: hrpc discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 09 Aug 2020 03:33:31 -0000 Dear, Juliana, > I saw the issue and I think it's very important to work on the types of > online -in this case gender based- violence you mention. After working a > few months on this draft and trying to figure out how to connect all > those feminist principles with IETF work, I was wondering if we may > better work on two separate drafts, one of them focused on online gender > based violence. I think that too as well. We can definitely take inspiration from the draft-irtf-pearg-censorship for it. > This is an interesting typology made in Latin America, and based on more > than 4 years documenting cases. > > https://www.genderit.org/resources/13-manifestations-gender-based-violence-using-technology This is great! I'll review it this weekend. > I'll send you an email off the list to continue talking about it. For sure! Thanks! -- Sofía Celi @claucece http://claucece.github.io/ Cryptographic research and implementation at many places, but mainly at Cloudflare FAB9 3EDC 7CDD 1198 DCFD  4558 91BB 6B45 6F44 2D02 From nobody Mon Aug 10 12:56:45 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF9943A0C9B for ; Mon, 10 Aug 2020 12:56:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.088 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.088 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_FILL_THIS_FORM_SHORT=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=riseup.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VIgE-1GWHIlp for ; 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charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: [hrpc] Invitation to participate of the Secure Messaging Summit X-BeenThere: hrpc@irtf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: hrpc discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 10 Aug 2020 19:56:45 -0000 Dear, list, We are organizing a Secure Messaging Summit, a place where people from different places (academia, industry, open source implementations, and legal/political perspectives) talk about the latest problems and advancements on the secure messaging sphere. This is an online event but you need to register. More details over here: https://claucece.github.io/Secure-Messaging-Summit/ It will run for two days: the 3rd and 4th of September, 2020, centered around times convenient to the morning in the Americas, the afternoon in Europe and Africa, and the evening in Western Asia. On the first day, we have a set of speakers: - Rosario Gennaro speaking around deniability and the simulation paradigm, - Nik Unger speaking around usability and secure messaging, - Paul Rösler speaking around concurrent group ratcheting, - Daniel Kales speaking around mobile private contact discovery, - Thomas Ristenpart speaking around message franking, - Raphael Robert speaking around group messaging On the second day, we have a set of people speaking in a panel. The topics of the panel will be sent next week; but manly the idea is to talk about the threats/challenges that secure messaging faces from a legal/political and even sociological perspective in different regions. We will have perspectives from Hong Kong, Latin America, US, Tibet and more. The participants are: * Danny O'Brien from EFF * Erica Portnoy from EFF * Glacier Kwong from Keyboard Freedom * Lobsang Gyatso from the Tibetan Action Institute * Carolina Botero from Fundacion Karisma * Paulina Gutiérrez from Article 19 One can register here: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSf1Knazuv88jaoZW1HAvK9XpHHMHh4YS2UlYsWSZoqAjKdHQw/viewform or you can send an email, as outlined here: https://claucece.github.io/Secure-Messaging-Summit/#how-to-register Registration closes on the 30 of August. As stated, further information can be found here: https://claucece.github.io/Secure-Messaging-Summit Register if you are interested! Thank you! Secure Messaging Summit September 3 and 4, 2020 https://claucece.github.io/Secure-Messaging-Summit -- Sofía Celi @claucece http://claucece.github.io/ Cryptographic research and implementation at many places, but mainly at Cloudflare FAB9 3EDC 7CDD 1198 DCFD  4558 91BB 6B45 6F44 2D02 From nobody Thu Aug 27 23:19:59 2020 Return-Path: X-Original-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: hrpc@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CDE033A0D3A for ; Thu, 27 Aug 2020 23:19:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DAONyvTmpiln for ; Thu, 27 Aug 2020 23:19:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx4.nic.fr (mx4.nic.fr [IPv6:2001:67c:2218:2::4:12]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A5B5F3A0D39 for ; 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: drafts-update-ref@iana.org, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: ietf-announce-bounces@ietf.org Sender: "IETF-Announce" X-PMX-Version: 6.4.9.2830568, Antispam-Engine: 2.7.2.2107409, Antispam-Data: 2020.8.27.235717, AntiVirus-Engine: 5.77.0, AntiVirus-Data: 2020.8.27.5770003 X-PerlMx-Spam: Gauge=IIIIIIIII, Probability=9%, Report=' MULTIPLE_RCPTS 0.1, UTF8_SUBJ_OBFU 0.1, HTML_00_01 0.05, HTML_00_10 0.05, BODYTEXTP_SIZE_3000_LESS 0, BODY_SIZE_1800_1899 0, BODY_SIZE_2000_LESS 0, BODY_SIZE_5000_LESS 0, BODY_SIZE_7000_LESS 0, DATE_TZ_NA 0, DKIM_SIGNATURE 0, FROM_SAME_AS_TO_DOMAIN 0, HAS_X_PHP_SCRIPT 0, KNOWN_MTA_TFX 0, LEGITIMATE_SIGNS 0, LIST_HEADER 0, MTA_POSTFIX_PHP_UID 0, MULTIPLE_REAL_RCPTS 0, NO_REAL_NAME 0, PRECEDENCE_HEADER 0, SENDER_NO_AUTH 0, SXL_IP_TFX_WM 0, URI_WITH_PATH_ONLY 0, __ANY_URI 0, __BODY_NO_MAILTO 0, __CP_URI_IN_BODY 0, __CT 0, __CTE 0, __CT_TEXT_PLAIN 0, __FROM_DOMAIN_IN_ANY_CC1 0, __FROM_DOMAIN_IN_RCPT 0, __FROM_DOMAIN_NOT_IN_BODY 0, __FROM_NAME_NOT_IN_ADDR 0, __FROM_NAME_NOT_IN_BODY 0, __FROM_NO_NAME 0, __HAS_ARCHIVED_AT 0, __HAS_CC_HDR 0, __HAS_ERRORS_TO 0, __HAS_FROM 0, __HAS_LIST_ARCHIVE 0, __HAS_LIST_HEADER 0, __HAS_LIST_HELP 0, __HAS_LIST_ID 0, __HAS_LIST_POST 0, __HAS_LIST_SUBSCRIBE 0, __HAS_LIST_UNSUBSCRIBE 0, __HAS_MSGID 0, __HAS_SENDER 0, __HAS_X_PHP_ORIG_SCRIPT 0, __HTTPS_URI 0, __MIME_TEXT_ONLY 0, __MIME_TEXT_P 0, __MIME_TEXT_P1 0, __MIME_VERSION 0, __MULTIPLE_RCPTS_CC_X2 0, __MULTIPLE_RCPTS_TO_X2 0, __MULTIPLE_URI_TEXT 0, __NO_HTML_TAG_RAW 0, __PHISH_SPEAR_SUBJ_SUBJECT 0, __PRECEDENCE_LIST 0, __RCVD_PASS 0, __RCVD_POSTFIX_UID 0, __SANE_MSGID 0, __SUBJ_ALPHA_END 0, __TO_DOMAIN_IN_FROM 0, __TO_DOMAIN_IN_MSGID 0, __TO_MALFORMED_2 0, __TO_NO_NAME 0, __URI_HAS_HYPHEN_USC 0, __URI_IN_BODY 0, __URI_MAILTO 0, __URI_NOT_IMG 0, __URI_NS , __URI_WITH_PATH 0, __UTF8_SUBJ 0, __X_PHP_ORIG_UID 0' X-Bogosity: Ham, tests=bogofilter, spamicity=0.000000, version=1.2.4 Subject: RFC 8890 on The Internet is for End Users From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries. RFC 8890 Title: The Internet is for End Users Author: M. Nottingham Status: Informational Stream: IAB Date: August 2020 Mailbox: mnot@mnot.net Pages: 10 Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso: None I-D Tag: draft-iab-for-the-users-04.txt URL: https://www.rfc-editor.org/info/rfc8890 DOI: 10.17487/RFC8890 This document explains why the IAB believes that, when there is a conflict between the interests of end users of the Internet and other parties, IETF decisions should favor end users. It also explores how the IETF can more effectively achieve this. This document is a product of the Internet Architecture Board. INFORMATIONAL: This memo provides information for the Internet community. It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution of this memo is unlimited. This announcement is sent to the IETF-Announce and rfc-dist lists. 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