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Fri, 1 Mar 2019 14:55:27 +0000 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ari_Ker=E4nen?= To: ICE WG Thread-Topic: Draft new: draft-holmberg-ice-premature-00 Thread-Index: AQHUzq5rQ4cjYjGrok+RsDk23rIzn6X24D+A Date: Fri, 1 Mar 2019 14:55:27 +0000 Message-ID: References: <6ED3E9B1-648B-40DE-B8E6-4992D61C22EF@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: <6ED3E9B1-648B-40DE-B8E6-4992D61C22EF@ericsson.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=ari.keranen@ericsson.com; x-originating-ip: [89.166.49.243] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: eb41c7a3-b545-453d-e17d-08d69e55f152 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(5600127)(711020)(4605104)(2017052603328)(7153060)(7193020); SRVR:HE1PR07MB1033; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: HE1PR07MB1033: x-ms-exchange-purlcount: 2 x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: =?iso-8859-1?Q?1; 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We are now considering adopting this draft and getting it published = as soon as possible. Please have a look at it and let us know if you have a= ny concerns on this way forward. Cheers, Ari > On 27 Feb 2019, at 17.09, Christer Holmberg wrote: >=20 > Hi,=20 > =20 > Today, 8445 defines that if an ICE endpoint discards its candidates and i= s not able to form candidate pairs, or when the test of all pairs fail, the= ICE agent will trigger ICE failure. > =20 > The ICE agent may do this before it has received any connectivity checks = from the remote peer, and such connectivity checks might trigger candidate = pairs that work. > =20 > Me and Justin put together a draft that updates RFC 8445, by indicating t= hat an ICE agent should wait (there is a suggested duration) for remote con= nectivity checks before it triggers ICE failure. > =20 > Link: > =20 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-holmberg-ice-premature/ > =20 > For the GitHub fans: > =20 > https://github.com/cdh4u/draft-ice-premature > =20 > Regards, > =20 > Christer From nobody Tue Mar 5 06:58:01 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56B4D1275F3 for ; 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Tue, 5 Mar 2019 22:47:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from imap2 ([10.202.2.52]) by compute1.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 05 Mar 2019 22:47:48 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=lowentropy.net; h=message-id:in-reply-to:references:date:from:to:subject :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=fm1; bh=RSF3HkHVDsczQ Z7PZ6lujrlMwOFLhU12keE7lkufDU8=; b=F0lYw+XFov1/QiqqnXc+4IuCdZHI8 I+NmF3trAAXxErW+Dp/upA7rYdwRCAQ/xuFoOQ36vYm2X1EDVywZYCikidFT6V06 2b3eLnoYLTXIIt7SXeRZYyNe1vrYTNUmrMMMlgeW8HZYaN1HifckRNFugWHnTcvv l+760IRbVTLCd1oBe32B1//adfD/JtD2JM0LYQ54u3khGCfEKulozXpDdy7xcpt/ B4EA414cQykinOAhGiBI+ccQfIV0VNK8QxLLwBRGqKWq28rw/IwelAHZppNKtuNm zCsKNiVJnhc5iRXGLteU4wdFoo2n/D7B0qDNpjDMw0ZPWCDC7Ed45yADA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-transfer-encoding:content-type :date:from:in-reply-to:message-id:references:subject:to :x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s= fm2; bh=RSF3HkHVDsczQZ7PZ6lujrlMwOFLhU12keE7lkufDU8=; b=Efa1WxDb Asvr2QbuczyF/5uiGGFmuODTt9EgHn6DPkX3EULpVX7FuyeKDVaFeCazhKy4Ty63 pFBDtZK9/LqOUAvUgHQ0DDnxqB/4aP+MA9LuVD8q4YLxa/Cd+cyTM5YxofV6QSWD rcM0/8kRQa/IvBsHbNBxR1v3lpYTj2upNwkq4hdG7Ks4LVT647vCYD1D9urMOFlj 4+3KMYbgr2h8w98XD5ioEzck3J+s0DvYrH5/tUwVvSrMMrDpOGBv7mLFM2YpTXoD xtKsOa9iJUMJhjd6ieyQGhSieZ+i3GUJ93YD1GnZmwnGDz87ayQZpgZyGFqpddfu J6UckAYWWWmD/Q== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedutddrfeeggdeihecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepofgfkfgjfhffhffvufgtgfesthhqre dtreerjeenucfhrhhomhepfdforghrthhinhcuvfhhohhmshhonhdfuceomhhtsehlohif vghnthhrohhphidrnhgvtheqnecuffhomhgrihhnpehgihhthhhusgdrtghomhdpihgvth hfrdhorhhgnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehmtheslhhofigvnhhtrhhophih rdhnvghtnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptd X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 84C2E7C1EB; Tue, 5 Mar 2019 22:47:47 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.1.5-925-g644bf8c-fmstable-20190228v5 X-Me-Personality: 92534000 Message-Id: <13ab8294-6175-420e-a9fd-ee024de3aef0@www.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: <6ED3E9B1-648B-40DE-B8E6-4992D61C22EF@ericsson.com> Date: Tue, 05 Mar 2019 22:47:50 -0500 From: "Martin Thomson" To: ice@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] Draft new: draft-holmberg-ice-premature-00 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 Mar 2019 03:47:52 -0000 This looks reasonable. The timer might need to be longer than the conne= ctivity check timer, to account for skew in start times, but I doubt tha= t will have any impact in practice. The document needs an abstract. Section 3 is quite repetitive. It really only says one thing. It could= list the ways in which the checklist becomes empty without waiting for = a connectivity check timer to run out a little more succintly. On Sat, Mar 2, 2019, at 01:55, Ari Ker=C3=A4nen wrote: > ICE WG, >=20 > This draft suggests a small but important fix to the standardized ICE=20= > procedures. We are now considering adopting this draft and getting it=20= > published as soon as possible. Please have a look at it and let us kno= w=20 > if you have any concerns on this way forward. >=20 >=20 > Cheers, > Ari >=20 >=20 > > On 27 Feb 2019, at 17.09, Christer Holmberg wrote: > >=20 > > Hi,=20 > > =20 > > Today, 8445 defines that if an ICE endpoint discards its candidates = and is not able to form candidate pairs, or when the test of all pairs f= ail, the ICE agent will trigger ICE failure. > > =20 > > The ICE agent may do this before it has received any connectivity ch= ecks from the remote peer, and such connectivity checks might trigger ca= ndidate pairs that work. > > =20 > > Me and Justin put together a draft that updates RFC 8445, by indicat= ing that an ICE agent should wait (there is a suggested duration) for re= mote connectivity checks before it triggers ICE failure. > > =20 > > Link: > > =20 > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-holmberg-ice-premature/ > > =20 > > For the GitHub fans: > > =20 > > https://github.com/cdh4u/draft-ice-premature > > =20 > > Regards, > > =20 > > Christer >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > From nobody Tue Mar 5 21:23:17 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DED5A130EB8 for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2019 21:23:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id o3raOUJCVpxu for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2019 21:23:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-it1-x132.google.com (mail-it1-x132.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::132]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 605B612D4EF for ; Tue, 5 Mar 2019 21:23:13 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-it1-x132.google.com with SMTP id l139so8299794ita.5 for ; Tue, 05 Mar 2019 21:23:13 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=Kv7GrW9sIq/2+HQP/xLu8pQE/FbF0xfgvv22yu/wEB4=; b=Khp4uYzlh7JSWX3+YehyrinE8jprnfaHxObZWVOp/+KUKPZmyrZ99uQFN8kNpQ2wzE sQ1PyGiBs9Hxw6eos5db70tdxXk5bizRdz3+0KQM9cX4SFnY3Qmed/A6i7IDb9i6SBCd dSdZ+MRiNmHVDyMvZZ73MmfeCVIhq7ajyLQNmhkj5JYu31Y41VELwrTs/uwV1PLvytZ7 /Repgtxp9oHLWLxcTHi4MrZ36b+NRa7Ydujbd4DF7EnMpSw8eAtODlDGFd0wmN3f9kr9 06quKSUOI1i5bpwpYarhmXcoEC2tJ5poieAcbGeHlbqrn/LMzy/knY7uJ2aL11LwikKW XZVg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Kv7GrW9sIq/2+HQP/xLu8pQE/FbF0xfgvv22yu/wEB4=; b=pzSc9k5HTLRhKCvwVtDdIi4z1jmrIuR4SohvE9UUBO/QYOONsPKqNT6JlayLNkvS1W sl0/JZiwndV7skiYyzaayuqniHWLY4q7SSPBYN3Re5zc6yL2Ol8KPdAeHZq1K81QBHw2 68VyiGrXp4vPJPYt2ZKi+MkfVLuWJBLHO+t5ZHEYwJ6Thyzzw3No11xH5e5XHJTEd3mT +ggFGQ+zmxG2f2gSPc5HVyYKMsUk9C6lBfSbXDXPgeqLYF5nZvl43/CFyV2mHzV27f7j h2w8P1YW2j7lwWThJsT/Xb3o6Y+cOnglne8MhVrjnO+Y1iE7uN3SX2ahW02FfA8zjNVO Okrg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUe8eCMa0XWwKevnwdsN4SgKWdjTF1TAqG7g0P1WKAnGpjp5Ku6 qGo1I9a6lrEP7k9ss/gGvwWHtOois9WOz93p6IDBlW7c X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwmxQwbgUR9dpT31HpiJ5rrqe3rtboV6HV5QxxLDMdP49eexCl25yFYLnQs2QDPxF8cHs8BuV5M8JxOWznLf5I= X-Received: by 2002:a24:e00e:: with SMTP id c14mr1070388ith.8.1551849792189; Tue, 05 Mar 2019 21:23:12 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <6ED3E9B1-648B-40DE-B8E6-4992D61C22EF@ericsson.com> <13ab8294-6175-420e-a9fd-ee024de3aef0@www.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: <13ab8294-6175-420e-a9fd-ee024de3aef0@www.fastmail.com> From: Justin Uberti Date: Tue, 5 Mar 2019 21:22:59 -0800 Message-ID: To: Martin Thomson Cc: ice@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000009c16610583662f3a" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] Draft new: draft-holmberg-ice-premature-00 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 Mar 2019 05:23:16 -0000 --0000000000009c16610583662f3a Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Abstract PR here . Section 3 is intentionally verbose because the conditions that can cause this are fairly subtle and distinct (and have not been pointed out until now). If we think this is overly explanatory, it could be tightened up easily. On Tue, Mar 5, 2019 at 7:47 PM Martin Thomson wrote: > This looks reasonable. The timer might need to be longer than the > connectivity check timer, to account for skew in start times, but I doubt > that will have any impact in practice. > > The document needs an abstract. > > Section 3 is quite repetitive. It really only says one thing. It could > list the ways in which the checklist becomes empty without waiting for a > connectivity check timer to run out a little more succintly. > > On Sat, Mar 2, 2019, at 01:55, Ari Ker=C3=A4nen wrote: > > ICE WG, > > > > This draft suggests a small but important fix to the standardized ICE > > procedures. We are now considering adopting this draft and getting it > > published as soon as possible. Please have a look at it and let us know > > if you have any concerns on this way forward. > > > > > > Cheers, > > Ari > > > > > > > On 27 Feb 2019, at 17.09, Christer Holmberg < > christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote: > > > > > > Hi, > > > > > > Today, 8445 defines that if an ICE endpoint discards its candidates > and is not able to form candidate pairs, or when the test of all pairs > fail, the ICE agent will trigger ICE failure. > > > > > > The ICE agent may do this before it has received any connectivity > checks from the remote peer, and such connectivity checks might trigger > candidate pairs that work. > > > > > > Me and Justin put together a draft that updates RFC 8445, by > indicating that an ICE agent should wait (there is a suggested duration) > for remote connectivity checks before it triggers ICE failure. > > > > > > Link: > > > > > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-holmberg-ice-premature/ > > > > > > For the GitHub fans: > > > > > > https://github.com/cdh4u/draft-ice-premature > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Christer > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ice mailing list > > Ice@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > --0000000000009c16610583662f3a Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Abstract PR here.

Section 3 is intentionally v= erbose because the conditions that can cause this are fairly subtle and dis= tinct (and have not been pointed out until now). If we think this is overly= explanatory, it could be tightened up easily.

On Tue, Mar 5, 2019 at = 7:47 PM Martin Thomson <mt@lowentro= py.net> wrote:
This looks reasonable.=C2=A0 The timer might need to be longer than t= he connectivity check timer, to account for skew in start times, but I doub= t that will have any impact in practice.

The document needs an abstract.

Section 3 is quite repetitive.=C2=A0 It really only says one thing.=C2=A0 I= t could list the ways in which the checklist becomes empty without waiting = for a connectivity check timer to run out a little more succintly.

On Sat, Mar 2, 2019, at 01:55, Ari Ker=C3=A4nen wrote:
> ICE WG,
>
> This draft suggests a small but important fix to the standardized ICE =
> procedures. We are now considering adopting this draft and getting it =
> published as soon as possible. Please have a look at it and let us kno= w
> if you have any concerns on this way forward.
>
>
> Cheers,
> Ari
>
>
> > On 27 Feb 2019, at 17.09, Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericss= on.com> wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >=C2=A0
> > Today, 8445 defines that if an ICE endpoint discards its candidat= es and is not able to form candidate pairs, or when the test of all pairs f= ail, the ICE agent will trigger ICE failure.
> >=C2=A0
> > The ICE agent may do this before it has received any connectivity= checks from the remote peer, and such connectivity checks might trigger ca= ndidate pairs that work.
> >=C2=A0
> > Me and Justin put together a draft that updates RFC 8445, by indi= cating that an ICE agent should wait (there is a suggested duration) for re= mote connectivity checks before it triggers ICE failure.
> >=C2=A0
> > Link:
> >=C2=A0
> > https://datatracker.ietf.org= /doc/draft-holmberg-ice-premature/
> >=C2=A0
> > For the GitHub fans:
> >=C2=A0
> > https://github.com/cdh4u/draft-ice-premature
> >=C2=A0
> > Regards,
> >=C2=A0
> > Christer
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ice mailing list
> Ice@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
>

_______________________________________________
Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
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Thu, 7 Mar 2019 14:01:32 +0000 From: Christer Holmberg To: "ice@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: ICE Premature: No Candidates From Peer Thread-Index: AQHU1O5Fu5rkpt4sokOfSglILNb2yQ== Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2019 14:01:32 +0000 Message-ID: <16BAFE72-DAE4-40BF-BFB7-8EB79C30A8E6@ericsson.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/10.16.1.190220 authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=christer.holmberg@ericsson.com; x-originating-ip: [89.166.49.243] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 1b4121d9-cddd-4b53-5287-08d6a30567ac x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(5600127)(711020)(4605104)(2017052603328)(7153060)(7193020); SRVR:VI1PR07MB4576; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: VI1PR07MB4576: x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-forefront-prvs: 096943F07A x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; 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[209.85.215.180]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x23sm21949331pfe.0.2019.03.07.10.28.00 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 07 Mar 2019 10:28:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pg1-f180.google.com with SMTP id 196so11918392pgf.13 for ; Thu, 07 Mar 2019 10:28:00 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a63:5813:: with SMTP id m19mr12682522pgb.294.1551983279969; Thu, 07 Mar 2019 10:27:59 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <16BAFE72-DAE4-40BF-BFB7-8EB79C30A8E6@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: <16BAFE72-DAE4-40BF-BFB7-8EB79C30A8E6@ericsson.com> From: Roman Shpount Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2019 13:27:50 -0500 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: To: Christer Holmberg Cc: "ice@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000199ae405838544be" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] ICE Premature: No Candidates From Peer X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Mar 2019 18:28:15 -0000 --000000000000199ae405838544be Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Technically speaking we are updating RFC 8445 for exactly this reason. In ice-sip-sdp, default candidate in c=3D and m=3D line can be IN IP4 0.0.0= .0 with port 9, with no candidates listed. This is essentially an offer with no candidates. This was added for trickle, but nothing prohibits doing this when trickle is not used. There is a good use case for this, when client is connecting from behind NAT to an end point with public address. This way, no addresses will need to be collected on the client side when session description is sent. When session description from the end point on public address is received, connectivity check can be sent from the client behind NAT without binding to a specific interface, which will allow this client to use default route to connect to the server on public address. This simplifies the client and has some privacy benefits when VPNs are used. Also, default candidate can be a FQDN, which resolves to more then one address, or an unsupported address family, so it can end up being ignored and you will end up with no candidates at the start of ICE nomination. Regards, _____________ Roman Shpount On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 9:01 AM Christer Holmberg < christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote: > Hi, > > > > Section 3.1 of draft-holmberg-ice-premature-00 says that it=E2=80=99s leg= al (we > should change that to =E2=80=9Callowed=E2=80=9D or something=E2=80=A6) to= provide zero candidates > of its own. > > > > In non-trickle cases, is that really true? My understanding of 8445 is > that an agent will at least provide a default candidate. > > > > In trickle cases, the text is true as far as the initial ICE exchange is > concerned. I don=E2=80=99t know if trickle mandates to actually provide a= ny > candidates at any point, but I assume that a trickle agent will at least > provide a default candidate at some point =E2=80=93 at least I did not fi= nd any > text in trickle-ice overriding that rule. > > > > So, unless I=E2=80=99m wrong in my assumptions above, my suggestion would= be to > scope the section to trickle, and clarify that it applies to the initial > ICE exchange. > > > > Regards, > > > > Christer > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > --000000000000199ae405838544be Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Technically speaking we are updating RFC 8445 for exactly = this reason.

In ice-sip-sdp, default candidate in c=3D a= nd m=3D line can be IN IP4 0.0.0.0 with port 9, with no candidates listed. = This is essentially an offer with no candidates. This was added for trickle= , but nothing prohibits doing this when trickle is not used. There is a goo= d use case for this, when client is connecting from behind NAT to an end po= int with public address. This way, no addresses will need to be collected o= n the client side when session description is sent. When session descriptio= n from the end point on public address is received, connectivity check can = be sent from the client behind NAT without binding to a specific interface,= which will allow this client to use default route to connect to the server= on public address. This simplifies the client and has some privacy benefit= s when VPNs are used.
=C2=A0
Also, default candidat= e can be a FQDN, which resolves to more then one address, or an unsupported= address family, so it can end up being ignored and you will end up with no= candidates at the start of ICE nomination.

Regard= s,
_____________
Roman Shpount

<= /div>

On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 9:01 AM Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wro= te:

Hi,

=C2=A0<= /span>

Sectio= n 3.1 of draft-holmberg-ice-premature-00 says that it=E2=80=99s legal (we s= hould change that to =E2=80=9Callowed=E2=80=9D or something=E2=80=A6) to pr= ovide zero candidates of its own.

=C2=A0

In non= -trickle cases, is that really true? My understanding of 8445 is that an ag= ent will at least provide a default candidate.

=C2=A0

In tri= ckle cases, the text is true as far as the initial ICE exchange is concerne= d. I don=E2=80=99t know if trickle mandates to actually provide any candida= tes at any point, but I assume that a trickle agent will at least provide a default candidate at some point =E2=80=93 at= least I did not find any text in trickle-ice overriding that rule.<= u>

=C2=A0

So, un= less I=E2=80=99m wrong in my assumptions above, my suggestion would be to s= cope the section to trickle, and clarify that it applies to the initial ICE= exchange.

=C2=A0

Regard= s,

=C2=A0

Christ= er

_______________________________________________
Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
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[209.85.210.182]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id y6sm13436714pfy.87.2019.03.07.14.48.51 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Thu, 07 Mar 2019 14:48:51 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-pf1-f182.google.com with SMTP id u9so12587166pfn.1 for ; Thu, 07 Mar 2019 14:48:51 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 2002:a17:902:29cb:: with SMTP id h69mr12751261plb.277.1551998930928; Thu, 07 Mar 2019 14:48:50 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <16BAFE72-DAE4-40BF-BFB7-8EB79C30A8E6@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: From: Roman Shpount Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2019 17:48:42 -0500 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: To: Christer Holmberg Cc: "ice@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000f849bc058388e83c" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] ICE Premature: No Candidates From Peer X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Mar 2019 22:48:55 -0000 --000000000000f849bc058388e83c Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable HI Christer, On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 3:52 PM Christer Holmberg < christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote: > > Technically speaking we are updating RFC 8445 for exactly this reason. > > > > > > In ice-sip-sdp, default candidate in c=3D and m=3D line can be IN IP4 > 0.0.0.0 with port 9, with no candidates listed. This is essentially an > offer with no candidates. > > > This was added for trickle, but nothing prohibits doing this when > trickle is not used. There is a good use case for this, when client is > connecting from > > > behind NAT to an end point with public address. This way, no addresses > will need to be collected on the client side when session description is > sent. > > > When session description from the end point on public address is > received, connectivity check can be sent from the client behind NAT witho= ut > binding > > > to a specific interface, which will allow this client to use default > route to connect to the server on public address. This simplifies the > client and has some > > > privacy benefits when VPNs are used. > > > > My understanding of RFC 8445 is that the default candidate is always > provided. Trickle may override that. > The initial candidate list is created based on rules defined in ice-sip-sdp. Everything, including DNS resolution and pruning candidates with dummy or unsupported addresses is defined there, not in RFC 8445. The ice-sip-sdp draft also deals with default candidate. RFC 8445 does not care about the default candidate, since it only needed for interop with non-ICE endpoints. Based on rules defined in ice-sip-sdp, the initial list of candidates is created and then processed based on rules defined in RFC 8445. What we figured out is that initial candidate list produced based on ice-sip-sdp rules from the remote session description can be empty, but ICE nomination process must still continue and wait for STUN connectivity checks that can produce peer reflexive candidates. This is why ICE premature draft is written and RFC 8445 is updated. > We can check whether we need to change that in RFC 8445, but that is not > the original reason we wrote the draft. The original reason was that one = or > more candidates are provided, but all of them are either discarded or fai= l. > > > > > Also, default candidate can be a FQDN, which resolves to more then one > address, or an unsupported address family, so it can end up > > > being ignored and you will end up with no candidates at the start of IC= E > nomination. > > > > As I=E2=80=99ve said in the mDNS discussion, the ICE procedures do not su= pport > candidates that resolve into multiple addresses. The procedures are writt= en > with the assumption that each candidate is associated with ONE address. > And, if we want to change that, it=E2=80=99s a separate draft. > > > We are not changing this. What I am saying that if FQDN in ICE candidate cannot be resolved or resolves to more then one address, then it is discarded. It is possible to have such FQDN in the c=3D line (default candidate), which result in session description with ICE candidate in the list and default candidate in the c=3D/m=3D line which produces an empty re= mote candidate list in the beginning of ICE nomination. Regards, _____________ Roman Shpount --000000000000f849bc058388e83c Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
HI Christer,

On Thu, M= ar 7, 2019 at 3:52 PM Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote:
<= /div>

> Technically speaking we are updating RFC 8445 f= or exactly this reason.

>=C2=A0=

> In ice-sip-sdp, default ca= ndidate in c=3D and m=3D line can be IN IP4 0.0.0.0 with port 9, with no ca= ndidates listed. This is essentially an offer with no candidates.

> This was added for trickle= , but nothing prohibits doing this when trickle is not used. There is a good use case for this, when client is connecting from

> behind NAT to an end point= with public address. This way, no addresses will need to be collected on the client side = when session description is sent.

> When session description f= rom the end point on public address is received, connectivity check can be = sent from the client behind NAT without binding

> to a specific interface, which will allow this client to use default rout= e to connect to the server on public address. This simplifies the client and has some

> privacy benefits when VPNs= are used.

=C2=A0

My understanding of RFC 8445 is= that the default candidate is always provided. Trickle may override that.<= /span>


The init= ial candidate list is created based on rules defined in ice-sip-sdp. Everyt= hing, including DNS resolution and pruning candidates with dummy or unsuppo= rted addresses is defined there, not in RFC 8445. The ice-sip-sdp draft als= o deals with default candidate. RFC 8445 does not care about the default ca= ndidate, since it only needed for interop with non-ICE endpoints. Based on = rules defined in ice-sip-sdp, the initial list of candidates is created and= then processed based on rules defined in RFC 8445. What we figured out is = that initial candidate list produced based on ice-sip-sdp rules from the re= mote session description can be empty, but ICE nomination process must stil= l continue and wait for STUN connectivity checks that can produce peer refl= exive candidates. This is why ICE premature draft is written and RFC 8445 i= s updated.
=C2=A0

We can check whether we need to= change that in RFC 8445, but that is not the original reason we wrote the = draft. The original reason was that one or more candidates are provided, bu= t all of them are either discarded or fail.

=C2=A0

> Also, default candidate ca= n be a FQDN, which resolves to more then one address, or an unsupported add= ress family, so it can end up

> being ignored and you will= end up with no candidates at the start of ICE nomination.

=C2=A0

As I=E2=80=99ve said in the mDN= S discussion, the ICE procedures do not support candidates that resolve int= o multiple addresses. The procedures are written with the assumption that e= ach candidate is associated with ONE address. And, if we want to change that, it=E2=80=99s a separate draft.=C2= =A0



We are not changing this. What I am saying that if FQDN in ICE candidate = cannot be resolved or resolves to more then one address, then it is discard= ed. It is possible to have such FQDN in the c=3D line (default candidate), = which result in session description with ICE candidate in the list and defa= ult candidate in the c=3D/m=3D line which produces an empty remote candidat= e list in the beginning of ICE nomination.
=
Regards,
_____________
Roman Shpount


=C2=A0
--000000000000f849bc058388e83c-- From nobody Thu Mar 7 15:31:47 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8797B130EC9 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2019 15:31:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZMcyGQBbsx75 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2019 15:31:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-it1-x135.google.com (mail-it1-x135.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::135]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 58B38130EC7 for ; Thu, 7 Mar 2019 15:31:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-it1-x135.google.com with SMTP id l139so18679636ita.5 for ; Thu, 07 Mar 2019 15:31:42 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=mcwYe5/n5KH0BG7wjTnq9bb6BpKmj6tqeQ3HJg7ctKQ=; b=k9n005g6myaP7Fkj8EqDdP3Ob38mxyTOC2v3Oje6l05V/e+MAFYnr6KUpfIrozpb1r bS3QNRUm8doTlulT2R69xi692jY1lGTFVGlqIUN1Tr0bKAwFFEixBkHajw+1CcBsaJtL f3ejjzAObahabC1mfhNwX7JpicPAt+TDLLWPTRYIHAz1KxleFMRY8COV1eiCWIARKkZ0 YKGeUc9ngDE26zl5GD1hoO6QvpQNn6l6XAPEsgvLf6HR3ssCbEziJvWKktaHlxw/XDQo H322KXjgDpUcbG+EEklPqS83n60Fpcxf+29B6Ckiw22S1K2pLlwGd9CwQtyVqRnKOyrf 3CVw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=mcwYe5/n5KH0BG7wjTnq9bb6BpKmj6tqeQ3HJg7ctKQ=; b=I+2XX1b9VhDccAjfZ1cxfvWuyhqL2b85/A8yHsTcfnNnV7kw7JLWBI+7mLyxSjZR4Y yZNgy1BfUKD6C7JVH+x/wpX5JucqPaDiVFGAPxmBYIiDrRW/ZBIsmQvyXkiEVjNxJBWy Pw3EjYybIfwzH+4K9oJrY1gY2zsdwNKRDjQ7ir7B3Nx9YcS+Xy4rgjBuM86qUVXABN7p vIJdL0D0OSilmh/6J9EwT98yB1/xPU38XvRGF+KNN6I/As117zDjhFREXHC0uxSQ5ueZ 33vnL+PKA0X+4BBd9oBAGmgvMsmUI/AI710JmBtTyIRZjpJTcPpvwUS9dW9jWmgFLPHL N2tA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAVonEdG5DsnmvkfLTh9eCGj4IgBWAOkH5js3z3qVPrJpei/tKaI 3Kcz0YGIjARXKVG5/mZhQvWuOnE1IwAI8qP2oyjTeg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqzhkNYWS0nw5XQh3KiTfN+0HuQxdrycxpUduqyCbdIDI8agyVnMokrhQd3QZX79+z/ObiNsMyexwcSHpXdQyTE= X-Received: by 2002:a24:6588:: with SMTP id u130mr6749043itb.136.1552001501370; Thu, 07 Mar 2019 15:31:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <16BAFE72-DAE4-40BF-BFB7-8EB79C30A8E6@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: From: Justin Uberti Date: Thu, 7 Mar 2019 15:31:29 -0800 Message-ID: To: Roman Shpount Cc: Christer Holmberg , "ice@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002e8456058389825b" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] ICE Premature: No Candidates From Peer X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Mar 2019 23:31:45 -0000 --0000000000002e8456058389825b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 2:48 PM Roman Shpount wrote: > HI Christer, > > On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 3:52 PM Christer Holmberg < > christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote: > >> > Technically speaking we are updating RFC 8445 for exactly this reason. >> >> > >> >> > In ice-sip-sdp, default candidate in c=3D and m=3D line can be IN IP4 >> 0.0.0.0 with port 9, with no candidates listed. This is essentially an >> offer with no candidates. >> >> > This was added for trickle, but nothing prohibits doing this when >> trickle is not used. There is a good use case for this, when client is >> connecting from >> >> > behind NAT to an end point with public address. This way, no addresses >> will need to be collected on the client side when session description is >> sent. >> >> > When session description from the end point on public address is >> received, connectivity check can be sent from the client behind NAT with= out >> binding >> >> > to a specific interface, which will allow this client to use default >> route to connect to the server on public address. This simplifies the >> client and has some >> >> > privacy benefits when VPNs are used. >> >> >> >> My understanding of RFC 8445 is that the default candidate is always >> provided. Trickle may override that. >> > > The initial candidate list is created based on rules defined in > ice-sip-sdp. Everything, including DNS resolution and pruning candidates > with dummy or unsupported addresses is defined there, not in RFC 8445. Th= e > ice-sip-sdp draft also deals with default candidate. RFC 8445 does not ca= re > about the default candidate, since it only needed for interop with non-IC= E > endpoints. Based on rules defined in ice-sip-sdp, the initial list of > candidates is created and then processed based on rules defined in RFC > 8445. What we figured out is that initial candidate list produced based o= n > ice-sip-sdp rules from the remote session description can be empty, but I= CE > nomination process must still continue and wait for STUN connectivity > checks that can produce peer reflexive candidates. This is why ICE > premature draft is written and RFC 8445 is updated. > Agree with Roman. I didn't see any normative language in 8445 that requires > 0 candidates. It might be worthwhile to update ice-sip-sdp to explicitly allow this; we could also adjust the 3.1 text to mention trickle. These examples are not normative, just informative, so we don't need to be super-precise here. Trickle, however, is quite clear on this: Full Trickle: The typical mode of operation for Trickle ICE agents, in which the initial ICE description can include any number of candidates *(even zero candidates)* and does not need to include a full generation of candidates as in half trickle. > > >> We can check whether we need to change that in RFC 8445, but that is not >> the original reason we wrote the draft. The original reason was that one= or >> more candidates are provided, but all of them are either discarded or fa= il. >> >> >> >> > Also, default candidate can be a FQDN, which resolves to more then one >> address, or an unsupported address family, so it can end up >> >> > being ignored and you will end up with no candidates at the start of >> ICE nomination. >> >> >> >> As I=E2=80=99ve said in the mDNS discussion, the ICE procedures do not s= upport >> candidates that resolve into multiple addresses. The procedures are writ= ten >> with the assumption that each candidate is associated with ONE address. >> And, if we want to change that, it=E2=80=99s a separate draft. >> >> >> > We are not changing this. What I am saying that if FQDN in ICE candidate > cannot be resolved or resolves to more then one address, then it is > discarded. It is possible to have such FQDN in the c=3D line (default > candidate), which result in session description with ICE candidate in the > list and default candidate in the c=3D/m=3D line which produces an empty = remote > candidate list in the beginning of ICE nomination. > > --0000000000002e8456058389825b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


=
On Thu, Mar 7, 2019 at 2:48 PM Roman = Shpount <roman@telurix.com> = wrote:
HI Christer,

On Thu, Mar 7, 20= 19 at 3:52 PM Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote:<= br>

> Technically speaking we are updating RFC 8445 f= or exactly this reason.

>=C2=A0=

> In ice-sip-sdp, default ca= ndidate in c=3D and m=3D line can be IN IP4 0.0.0.0 with port 9, with no ca= ndidates listed. This is essentially an offer with no candidates.

> This was added for trickle= , but nothing prohibits doing this when trickle is not used. There is a good use case for this, when client is connecting from

> behind NAT to an end point= with public address. This way, no addresses will need to be collected on the client side = when session description is sent.

> When session description f= rom the end point on public address is received, connectivity check can be = sent from the client behind NAT without binding

> to a specific interface, which will allow this client to use default rout= e to connect to the server on public address. This simplifies the client and has some

> privacy benefits when VPNs= are used.

=C2=A0

My understanding of RFC 8445 is= that the default candidate is always provided. Trickle may override that.<= /span>


The init= ial candidate list is created based on rules defined in ice-sip-sdp. Everyt= hing, including DNS resolution and pruning candidates with dummy or unsuppo= rted addresses is defined there, not in RFC 8445. The ice-sip-sdp draft als= o deals with default candidate. RFC 8445 does not care about the default ca= ndidate, since it only needed for interop with non-ICE endpoints. Based on = rules defined in ice-sip-sdp, the initial list of candidates is created and= then processed based on rules defined in RFC 8445. What we figured out is = that initial candidate list produced based on ice-sip-sdp rules from the re= mote session description can be empty, but ICE nomination process must stil= l continue and wait for STUN connectivity checks that can produce peer refl= exive candidates. This is why ICE premature draft is written and RFC 8445 i= s updated.

Agree with Rom= an. I didn't see any normative language in 8445 that requires > 0 ca= ndidates. It might be worthwhile to update ice-sip-sdp to explicitly allow = this; we could also adjust the 3.1 text to mention trickle. These examples = are not normative, just informative, so we don't need to be super-preci= se here.

Trickle, however, is quite clear on this:= 

      Full Trickle:  The typical mode of operation for Trickle ICE agent=
s,
      in which the initial ICE description can include any number of
      candidates (even zero candidates) and does not need to include=
 a
      full generation of candidates as in half trickle.

=C2=A0
=
=C2=A0

We can check whether we need to= change that in RFC 8445, but that is not the original reason we wrote the = draft. The original reason was that one or more candidates are provided, bu= t all of them are either discarded or fail.

=C2=A0

> Also, default candidate ca= n be a FQDN, which resolves to more then one address, or an unsupported add= ress family, so it can end up

> being ignored and you will= end up with no candidates at the start of ICE nomination.

=C2=A0

As I=E2=80=99ve said in the mDN= S discussion, the ICE procedures do not support candidates that resolve int= o multiple addresses. The procedures are written with the assumption that e= ach candidate is associated with ONE address. And, if we want to change that, it=E2=80=99s a separate draft.=C2= =A0



We are not changing this. What I am saying that if FQDN in ICE candidate = cannot be resolved or resolves to more then one address, then it is discard= ed. It is possible to have such FQDN in the c=3D line (default candidate), = which result in session description with ICE candidate in the list and defa= ult candidate in the c=3D/m=3D line which produces an empty remote candidat= e list in the beginning of ICE nomination.
=

=C2=A0
--0000000000002e8456058389825b-- From nobody Fri Mar 8 22:33:04 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52F15127971 for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2019 22:33:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.501 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.501 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G7kzhOMdeiId for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2019 22:33:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-vs1-xe33.google.com (mail-vs1-xe33.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e33]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0EA06124BAA for ; Fri, 8 Mar 2019 22:33:01 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-vs1-xe33.google.com with SMTP id m20so7988436vsq.8 for ; Fri, 08 Mar 2019 22:33:00 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=C9TNYJaG8La3ZrRCkoM9XPqr+AB72t7marx+dmx9Xj0=; b=PJHpIDdjnu0iyaiTDUyv8xLPGVXwQ3UxMceH1sZMFAiFWm5/Gsk7AXf3474ubMp84k nvPdl2sIjn/0ulpz7l8nIPlaRTbwexBjJXfewXxeXeoryOO6VNrZHvElSlfPjsywl3tF QS2cSDpB7dyIoEnbjI76oKeXo3KjHBac8gQqJcZhoResiuowyW/btU+Jn9M2aJDOMTZ5 Ze7s1WK+N1Hji04XGUWc7vWZEvzTlAbRMxpG68MMp6LCwbGAC/1cNdiQPhnXMlyI3HLi TRaSDXnhnT+G1fQAnHlPCNR12RYK2gN4W8LK7+sDyOjaRCfmx3bTVtsCuKmc9rr6y4Q0 u8GA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=C9TNYJaG8La3ZrRCkoM9XPqr+AB72t7marx+dmx9Xj0=; b=aO9W882H9gPfew6zFH1E1A9Inyqu5hrR3/gDQwjKy1c9s8g23FzZn+MMNEckH2uSmP 0859nRvZwqhci7jlRg/2WzX03/xe7EPfh1n5KOJxpu/ifM/ENHPUQciWwp2i/LC+G441 fMXJO7IrDzFCxorjDgBaPlxJhPzf+QEs5oZEyRZARHxMbXRiLwLUmghicmUpdHldHvPC rg5Jki/+KdvOuXeksFy7drYWdhB7tGSpqePUms9qEac/g1dqPXLelB/EBxLeL2ZV79IP 7Ksn42F86sxRQjpve+ec3rKomi9Auc0pFA5N36zP9Bf397gOCrlFB6rIBNs6oLl4DifU 9tqw== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUOF+1JGbx2CdQWteITCLGcYd8qIS5El6bCam5zGoxf/oWvvNab cE1KBhuTj9MSGoerXCFLDo9AmsGN0WJniMA/4YuDcnL1xVE= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqy0Uimq9maYUubBqz5BoKaD8EYfvIHD1sliXesfBA6G5wjvODTvud6GbJveR6B9U/ImeAIUqKj1QN/XrmsR0Jg= X-Received: by 2002:a67:8e85:: with SMTP id q127mr11714096vsd.50.1552113179380; Fri, 08 Mar 2019 22:32:59 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Peter Thatcher Date: Fri, 8 Mar 2019 22:32:48 -0800 Message-ID: To: ICE WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000b5a3090583a382ba" Archived-At: Subject: [Ice] Thoughts on the "remote side gives 0 candidates" issue X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 09 Mar 2019 06:33:03 -0000 --000000000000b5a3090583a382ba Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Sorry for the slow reply to this issue, but I wanted to think it through thoroughly. I started a new mail thread since there were already so many I wasn't sure which was the right one and which people wouldn't notice mail to. Anyway, here's what I've thought of so far: 1. Yes, these all are issues (the 3 scenarios described in draft-holmberg-ice-premature.xml) for a strict ICE impl that is what you might call "impatient". 2. I'm guessing that in practice all ICE impls will have some timeout (be "patient"), but I agree that writing that down in an RFC is a good idea. 3. Doing it in the ICE WG makes sense. 4. I'd prefer to call it "ICE patience" or "Patient ICE" rather than "no premature failure". Then it's a virtue rather than a lack of a problem :). 5. The current draft says "MUST wait for" and "N SHOULD be X". But together, that amounts to "SHOULD wait for X", so the whole RFC ends up being a big SHOULD. Is that normal for an RFC to only have SHOULDs and not MUSTs? Seems less meaningful because you can't rely on the remote side doing the right thing. 6. The more I think about the timeout should be, the more I think this problem is bigger than the issues outlined in the draft. If you have very slow signaling, it's possible that you will end up in this same situation regardless of how many candidates are signaled (since the slow signaling prevents the candidates from getting there). For example: - Caller initiates ICE with no candidates - Callee receives offer with no candidates, sets a timer of N seconds, and sends back an answer with several candidates - Caller receives candidates after N seconds and sends connectivity checks - Callee times out and goes to failed state - Callee receives connectivity checks, but it's too late To avoid this problem, the timeout the callee uses must be based on the expected signaling delay. So, I think our "SHOULD be X" should incorporate signaling delay" 7. I wonder if we should include a suggested workaround for RFC 8445 clients that are "impatient". For example, if you trickle, do not send "end-of-candidates" to the remote side until after N seconds (to prevent it from going to the failed state). --000000000000b5a3090583a382ba Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Sorry for the slow reply to this issue, but I wanted to th= ink it through thoroughly.=C2=A0 I started a new mail thread since there we= re already so many I wasn't sure which was the right one and which peop= le wouldn't notice mail to.

Anyway, here's what = I've thought of so far:

1.=C2=A0 Yes, these all are = issues (the 3 scenarios described in=C2=A0draft-holmberg-ice-premature.xml)= for a strict ICE impl that is what you might call "impatient".= =C2=A0=C2=A0

2.=C2=A0 I'm guessing that in pra= ctice all ICE impls will have some timeout (be "patient"), but I = agree that writing that down in an RFC is a good idea.

=
3.=C2=A0 Doing it in the ICE WG makes sense.

= 4.=C2=A0 I'd prefer to call it "ICE patience" or "Patien= t ICE" rather than "no premature failure".=C2=A0 Then it'= ;s a virtue rather than a lack of a problem :).

5.= =C2=A0 The current draft says "MUST wait for" and "N SHOULD = be X".=C2=A0 But together, that amounts to "SHOULD wait for X&quo= t;, so the whole RFC ends up being a big SHOULD.=C2=A0 Is that normal for a= n RFC to only have SHOULDs and not MUSTs?=C2=A0 Seems less meaningful becau= se you can't rely on the remote side doing the right thing.
<= br>
6.=C2=A0 The more I think about the timeout should be, the mo= re I think this problem is bigger than the issues outlined in the draft.=C2= =A0 If you have very slow signaling, it's possible that you will end up= in this same situation regardless of how many candidates are signaled (sin= ce the slow signaling prevents the candidates from getting there).=C2=A0 = =C2=A0 For example:

- Caller initiates ICE with no= candidates
- Callee receives offer with no candidates, sets a ti= mer of N seconds, and sends back an answer with several candidates
- Caller receives candidates after N seconds and sends connectivity check= s
- Callee times out and goes to failed state
- Callee = receives connectivity checks, but it's too late

To avoid this problem, the timeout the callee uses must be based on the e= xpected signaling delay.=C2=A0 So, I think our "SHOULD be X" shou= ld incorporate signaling delay"

7.=C2=A0 I wo= nder if we should include a suggested workaround for RFC 8445 clients that = are "impatient".=C2=A0 For example, if you trickle, do not send &= quot;end-of-candidates" to the remote side until after N seconds (to p= revent it from going to the failed state).=C2=A0
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VJwIAHjR1E4nAwAA Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] ICE Premature: No Candidates From Peer X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2019 15:25:31 -0000 SGksDQoNCi4uLg0KDQo+Pj4gTXkgdW5kZXJzdGFuZGluZyBvZiBSRkMgODQ0NSBpcyB0aGF0IHRo ZSBkZWZhdWx0IGNhbmRpZGF0ZSBpcyBhbHdheXMgcHJvdmlkZWQuIFRyaWNrbGUgbWF5IG92ZXJy aWRlIHRoYXQuDQo+Pg0KPj4gPCBSb21hbidzIGNvbW1lbnQ+DQo+Pg0KPiBBZ3JlZSB3aXRoIFJv bWFuLiBJIGRpZG4ndCBzZWUgYW55IG5vcm1hdGl2ZSBsYW5ndWFnZSBpbiA4NDQ1IHRoYXQgcmVx dWlyZXMgMCBjYW5kaWRhdGVzLiANCg0KSSBndWVzcyB5b3UgYXJlIHJpZ2h0LiBUaGUgODQ0NSB0 ZXh0IG9ubHkgdGFsa3MgYWJvdXQgcGlja2luZyBhIGRlZmF1bHQgY2FuZGlkYXRlLCBidXQgbm90 IHdoZW4vaWYgaXQgaXMgZXhjaGFuZ2VkLg0KDQouLi4NCg0KPiBUcmlja2xlLCBob3dldmVyLCBp cyBxdWl0ZSBjbGVhciBvbiB0aGlzOg0KPg0KPiAgICAgIEZ1bGwgVHJpY2tsZTogIFRoZSB0eXBp 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09:30:28 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Justin Uberti Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2019 09:30:17 -0700 Message-ID: To: Christer Holmberg Cc: Peter Thatcher , ICE WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000002d98b00583d417dc" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] Thoughts on the "remote side gives 0 candidates" issue X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 11 Mar 2019 16:30:32 -0000 --0000000000002d98b00583d417dc Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Mon, Mar 11, 2019 at 9:06 AM Christer Holmberg < christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote: > Hi, > > > > > Anyway, here's what I've thought of so far: > > > > > > 1. Yes, these all are issues (the 3 scenarios described > in draft-holmberg-ice-premature.xml) for a strict ICE impl that is what y= ou > might call "impatient". > > > > Ice will melt if you wait too long=E2=80=A6 ;) > > > > > 2. I'm guessing that in practice all ICE impls will have some timeout > (be "patient"), but I agree that writing that down in an RFC is a good id= ea. > > > > > > 3. Doing it in the ICE WG makes sense. > > > > > > 4. I'd prefer to call it "ICE patience" or "Patient ICE" rather than > "no premature failure". Then it's a virtue rather than a lack of a probl= em > :). > > > > So, just to clarify, you suggest =E2=80=9CInteractive Connectivity Establ= ishment > (ICE) Patience=E2=80=9D as the title, not only in the draft name? > > > > Works for me. > > > > > 5. The current draft says "MUST wait for" and "N SHOULD be X". But > together, that amounts to "SHOULD wait for X", so the whole > > > RFC ends up being a big SHOULD. Is that normal for an RFC to only have > SHOULDs and not MUSTs? Seems less meaningful because > > > you can't rely on the remote side doing the right thing. > > > > We did not want to mandate a specific duration. An endpoint can determine > the duration value based on many things, including the number of candidat= es > it provides and/or the number of streams, the reliability of the network > (see below) etc etc etc. > This is a reasonable point. We could say that the implementation MUST wait for enough time to receive peer-reflexive candidates. This value SHOULD be the local connectivity check timeout. > > > > 6. The more I think about the timeout should be, the more I think this > problem is bigger than the issues outlined in the draft. > > > If you have very slow signaling, it's possible that you will end up in > this same situation regardless of how many candidates are > > > signaled (since the slow signaling prevents the candidates from getting > there). For example: > > > > > > - Caller initiates ICE with no candidates > > > - Callee receives offer with no candidates, sets a timer of N seconds, > and sends back an answer with several candidates > > > - Caller receives candidates after N seconds and sends connectivity > checks > > > - Callee times out and goes to failed state > > > - Callee receives connectivity checks, but it's too late > > > > > > To avoid this problem, the timeout the callee uses must be based on the > expected signaling delay. So, I think our "SHOULD be X" should > incorporate signaling delay" > > > Absolutely. We can for sure add more guidance regarding things an endpoin= t > has to take into consideration when setting the N value. > Maybe, but this number will never be precise. The connectivity check timeout itself is fairly arbitrary, but large enough to effectively address the problem. The existing text has a mention of this. > > > > 7. I wonder if we should include a suggested workaround for RFC 8445 > clients that are "impatient". For example, if you trickle, do not > > > send "end-of-candidates" to the remote side until after N seconds (to > prevent it from going to the failed state). > > > > Note that the draft text only covers the case when an endpoint receives > candidates, discards all of them, and waits for peer-reflexive candidates > to arrive. These could be initial candidates, or trickled candidates. > > > > But, when it comes to trickle, and how long an endpoint waits for the pee= r > to SIGNAL additional candidates, I think that shall be covered in trickle= . > TBH, I think it sort of invalidates end-of-candidates, since it's now clear that you can't start pruning upon receiving end-of-candidates. We might just want to never send it (and perhaps remove it in a future revision). --0000000000002d98b00583d417dc Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


=
On Mon, Mar 11, 2019 at 9:06 AM Chris= ter Holmberg <christer= .holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote:

Hi,

=C2=A0

> Anyway, here's what I&= #39;ve thought of so far:

>=C2=A0=

> 1.=C2=A0 Yes, these all are issues (the 3 scena= rios described in=C2=A0draft-holmberg-ice-premature.xml) for a strict ICE i= mpl that is what you might call "impatient".=C2=A0=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Ice will melt if you wait too l= ong=E2=80=A6 ;)

=C2=A0

> 2.=C2=A0 I'm guessing that in practice all = ICE impls will have some timeout (be "patient"), but I agree that= writing that down in an RFC is a good idea.

>=C2=A0

> 3.=C2=A0 Doing it in the ICE WG makes sense.=

>=C2=A0

> 4.=C2=A0 I'd prefer to call it "ICE pa= tience" or "Patient ICE" rather than "no premature fail= ure".=C2=A0 Then it's a virtue rather than a lack of a problem :).=

=C2=A0

So, just to clarify, you sugges= t =E2=80=9CInteractive Connectivity Establishment (ICE) Patience=E2=80=9D a= s the title, not only in the draft name?

=C2=A0

Works for me.

=C2=A0

> 5.=C2=A0 The current draft says "MUST wait= for" and "N SHOULD be X".=C2=A0 But together, that amounts = to "SHOULD wait for X", so the whole

> RFC ends up being a big SHOULD.=C2=A0 Is that normal for an RFC to only have SHOULDs and not MUSTs?=C2=A0 = Seems less meaningful because

> you can't rely on the remote side doing the right thing.

=C2=A0

We did not want to mandate a sp= ecific duration. An endpoint can determine the duration value based on many= things, including the number of candidates it provides and/or the number o= f streams, the reliability of the network (see below) etc etc etc.


This is a reasonable point. We could say that the i= mplementation MUST wait for enough time to receive peer-reflexive candidate= s. This value SHOULD be the local connectivity check timeout.=C2=A0

=C2=A0

> 6.=C2=A0 The more I think about the timeout sho= uld be, the more I think this problem is bigger than the issues outlined in= the draft.=C2=A0

> If you have very slow signaling, it's possible that you will end up i= n this same situation regardless of how many candidates are

> signaled (since the slow signaling prevents the candidates from getting t= here).=C2=A0 =C2=A0 For example:

>=C2=A0=

> - Caller initiates ICE wit= h no candidates

> - Callee receives offer wi= th no candidates, sets a timer of N seconds, and sends back an answer with = several candidates

> - Caller receives candidat= es after N seconds and sends connectivity checks

> - Callee times out and goe= s to failed state

> - Callee receives connecti= vity checks, but it's too late

>=C2=A0=

> To avoid this problem, the= timeout the callee uses must be based on the expected signaling delay.=C2= =A0 So, I think our "SHOULD be X" should incorporate signaling= delay"=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Absolutely. We can for sure add= more guidance regarding things an endpoint has to take into consideration = when setting the N value.


Maybe, but this number will never be precise. The c= onnectivity check timeout itself is fairly arbitrary, but large enough to e= ffectively address the problem. The existing text has a mention of this.

=C2=A0

> 7.=C2=A0 I wonder if we should include a sugges= ted workaround for RFC 8445 clients that are "impatient".=C2=A0 F= or example, if you trickle, do not

> send "end-of-candidates" to the remote side until after N secon= ds (to prevent it from going to the failed state).=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Note that the draft text only c= overs the case when an endpoint receives candidates, discards all of them, = and waits for peer-reflexive candidates to arrive. These could be initial c= andidates, or trickled candidates.

=C2=A0

But, when it comes to trickle, = and how long an endpoint waits for the peer to SIGNAL additional candidates= , I think that shall be covered in trickle.


TBH, I think it sort of invalidat= es end-of-candidates, since it's now clear that you can't start pru= ning upon receiving end-of-candidates. We might just want to never send it = (and perhaps remove it in a future revision).
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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 17 Mar 2019 22:11:43 -0000 Changed milestone "Submit Dual-stack Fairness with ICE as Proposed Standard ", set description to "Submit Dual-stack Fairness with ICE as Proposed Standard". Changed milestone "Submit a revision of ICE (RFC 5245) as Proposed Standard (draft-ietf-mmusic-ice-sip-sdp remains in MMUSIC) ", set description to "Submit a revision of ICE (RFC 5245) as Proposed Standard (draft-ietf-mmusic-ice-sip-sdp remains in MMUSIC)". Changed milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed Standard", set state to active from review, accepting new milestone. URL: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/ice/about/ From nobody Mon Mar 18 00:52:51 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD88412797A for ; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 00:52:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.302 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.302 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=QdbJVBoF; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com header.b=LUSvyRg+ Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Y8BVvDIiaudY for ; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 00:52:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sessmg22.ericsson.net (sessmg22.ericsson.net [193.180.251.58]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EAD8612870E for ; 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Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:52:36 +0000 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ari_Ker=E4nen?= To: ICE WG Thread-Topic: [Ice] Milestones changed for ice WG Thread-Index: AQHU3Q6B1OhZur29I0OjNnYXYptyAqYRBP0A Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:52:36 +0000 Message-ID: <11C9226B-9B5A-4D36-BBA0-AF0CCD95FBD6@ericsson.com> References: <155286070282.13567.10314799568476641406.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <155286070282.13567.10314799568476641406.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=ari.keranen@ericsson.com; x-originating-ip: [89.166.49.243] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 31d08e6f-827d-46b8-46ed-08d6ab76b005 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(5600127)(711020)(4605104)(2017052603328)(7153060)(7193020); SRVR:HE1PR07MB4201; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: HE1PR07MB4201: x-ms-exchange-purlcount: 2 x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-forefront-prvs: 098076C36C x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; 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For the other two "changed milestones" below nothing really changed. Cheers, Ari=20 > On 18 Mar 2019, at 0.11, IETF Secretariat wrote: >=20 > Changed milestone "Submit Dual-stack Fairness with ICE as Proposed Standa= rd > ", set description to "Submit Dual-stack Fairness with ICE as Proposed > Standard". >=20 > Changed milestone "Submit a revision of ICE (RFC 5245) as Proposed Standa= rd=20 > (draft-ietf-mmusic-ice-sip-sdp remains in MMUSIC) ", set description to > "Submit a revision of ICE (RFC 5245) as Proposed Standard=20 > (draft-ietf-mmusic-ice-sip-sdp remains in MMUSIC)". >=20 > Changed milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed Standard", set state t= o > active from review, accepting new milestone. >=20 > URL: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/ice/about/ >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice From nobody Mon Mar 18 00:53:32 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B0BE128661 for ; 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Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:53:23 +0000 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ari_Ker=E4nen?= To: ICE WG Thread-Topic: WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 Thread-Index: AQHU3V+pa06DuJnrF0iiXjdLU8F+EA== Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:53:23 +0000 Message-ID: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [89.166.49.243] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: d952acfe-cacc-4468-fa5f-08d6ab76cbba x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(5600127)(711020)(4605104)(2017052603328)(7153060)(7193020); SRVR:HE1PR07MB3388; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: HE1PR07MB3388: x-ms-exchange-purlcount: 1 x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-forefront-prvs: 098076C36C x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10009020)(396003)(366004)(39860400002)(376002)(136003)(346002)(189003)(199004)(2616005)(71200400001)(71190400001)(5660300002)(81156014)(86362001)(97736004)(81166006)(106356001)(105586002)(8936002)(66066001)(25786009)(486006)(476003)(4744005)(83716004)(186003)(6486002)(82746002)(26005)(6436002)(6512007)(6506007)(316002)(6346003)(6306002)(53936002)(102836004)(33656002)(256004)(478600001)(7736002)(6916009)(6116002)(36756003)(305945005)(3846002)(8676002)(14454004)(99286004)(966005)(2906002)(68736007); DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; SCL:1; SRVR:HE1PR07MB3388; H:HE1PR07MB4236.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ericsson.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=ari.keranen@ericsson.com; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: hIco90Qynp8JoIuHmLIeNFWAIoct82S5ZMMU0ltmRu8k8tR6KwK6Apmm21F2cqRG4yat0nlrIvWnucf/E2/H16voIiIPYNLfe2ZFmnX9VLZYkdLHFmjyCD5hOrPUhJHMmn+mxkozSW9iCxqOL5Nd8Yam4f4aSQmspBFJRJn+Q62o61Dv/dYXhIp5j4GJnxQ+YnigvoyREk7kVgc1vjH+HIgFRQYvKoe4nnzP1wiX3Db9qR3w9SoGW24/VWefmTsRu5oncmmyOdnxOC0dup1JZMecRl8Z15u7PG4OzCxJvfIJ4zxo2xkehrj+jSzW40BLLgCXJfer5JZBwzs5j+pruKXim4mER6qIlhUPz4oOT5GGGuaRJGmFpNuXE/GtCnt21yCkLZbrPRb3oKiv2pDrIkjpbsInd/vgOrQOX1lRQrc= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-ID: Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: d952acfe-cacc-4468-fa5f-08d6ab76cbba X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 18 Mar 2019 07:53:23.1162 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 92e84ceb-fbfd-47ab-be52-080c6b87953f X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: HE1PR07MB3388 X-OriginatorOrg: ericsson.com X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFmpnleLIzCtJLcpLzFFi42KZGbG9WrfUrz/GoP2/lcW3C7UOjB5Llvxk CmCM4rJJSc3JLEst0rdL4MqYsusLW8EclorT82eyNDDuYO5i5OSQEDCRWHb8NJDNxSEkcIRR onvvflYI5xujxIXO/ywgVUICS5gkPvUWgCRYBCYwS/y+/48RIjGZSWJ9YzVExyNGib51i8E6 2ATsJSav+QhWJCIgKdHyZyMriC0MtO/l5bvMEHFLiS0HZrBA2HoSB1r2sYHYLAKqEst27gHr 5QWaM/fRBbB6RgExie+n1jCB2MwC4hK3nsxngvhBQGLJnvNQ/4hKvHz8jxXCVpQ4++4hVI2s xKX53YwQtq9E48LLjCBHSwjcZJT4+mMbVLOWxMZJDVC2lMSJi0ehBmVLtPc/h2qWkbh8YiET RPMyVomrF6dDwyhVYvnaVkaIS6MlXp06yQ7RICexqvchC0TDeWaJ42tWskO8oCdxY+oUtgmM 2rOQfDQLSQrC9pA4v+MQO4StLbFs4WvmWeCQEZQ4OfMJywJG1lWMosWpxcW56UZGeqlFmcnF xfl5enmpJZsYgcnj4JbfVjsYDz53PMQowMGoxMPr7dMfI8SaWFZcmXuIUYKDWUmE194TKMSb klhZlVqUH19UmpNafIhRmoNFSZz3j5BgjJBAemJJanZqakFqEUyWiYNTqoGxyuCn6jSNZZu+ MqUvS5DP51w/12jyy2Zmu28O71b8vlOSk6F6ZvWF24pzr8vPkPrLa+9Q57lkR5NU0L6CVIaD n89OdDm+ZI6PVOpN+3lPFDQz/urfc2Rf7Gbc/Vsr1mVd9N5te97c43URN+y79+hSl6TPVJM5 DH2p2z1jLZ5dfrWs6Jvw+iBJJZbijERDLeai4kQAY0BjZhoDAAA= Archived-At: Subject: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:53:30 -0000 ICE WG, We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of the draft "Inte= ractive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectivity (ICE PAC= )" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed Standard": https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thread by end of n= ext Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns, please reply= to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed). 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Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:56:37 +0000 From: Christer Holmberg To: =?utf-8?B?QXJpIEtlcsOkbmVu?= , ICE WG Thread-Topic: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 Thread-Index: AQHU3WAcIEbQXx0G1kinOe8Wg47R/A== Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:56:37 +0000 Message-ID: <76FFCF19-0F6C-4AAF-A60A-39A3C00FCB98@ericsson.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/10.16.1.190220 x-originating-ip: [89.166.49.243] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 1beb9624-7ae2-42ce-4480-08d6ab773f85 x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(2390118)(7020095)(4652040)(8989299)(5600127)(711020)(4605104)(4534185)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(8990200)(2017052603328)(7153060)(7193020); SRVR:HE1PR07MB1034; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: HE1PR07MB1034: x-ms-exchange-purlcount: 2 x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-forefront-prvs: 098076C36C x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10009020)(376002)(396003)(346002)(39860400002)(366004)(136003)(189003)(199004)(8936002)(14454004)(229853002)(33656002)(58126008)(256004)(316002)(25786009)(110136005)(68736007)(99286004)(6116002)(97736004)(6506007)(105586002)(86362001)(3846002)(102836004)(71190400001)(44832011)(71200400001)(6346003)(26005)(106356001)(5660300002)(7736002)(4744005)(305945005)(82746002)(53936002)(6246003)(83716004)(36756003)(186003)(6436002)(8676002)(2616005)(486006)(6486002)(966005)(81156014)(6512007)(66066001)(2906002)(81166006)(478600001)(6306002)(476003); 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[209.85.210.178]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id t10sm14818999pgo.27.2019.03.18.03.26.32 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Mar 2019 03:26:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf1-f178.google.com with SMTP id r15so8188648pfn.9 for ; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 03:26:32 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 2002:a65:4608:: with SMTP id v8mr17316224pgq.9.1552904792081; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 03:26:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <76FFCF19-0F6C-4AAF-A60A-39A3C00FCB98@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: <76FFCF19-0F6C-4AAF-A60A-39A3C00FCB98@ericsson.com> From: Roman Shpount Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 06:27:03 -0400 X-Gmail-Original-Message-ID: Message-ID: To: Christer Holmberg Cc: =?UTF-8?B?QXJpIEtlcsOkbmVu?= , ICE WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000808b5505845bd267" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 10:26:36 -0000 --000000000000808b5505845bd267 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable +1 _____________ Roman Shpount On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 3:56 AM Christer Holmberg < christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote: > +1 > > Regards, > > Christer > > > =EF=BB=BFOn 18/03/2019, 9.54, "Ice on behalf of Ari Ker=C3=A4nen" on behalf of ari.keranen@ericsson.com> wrote: > > ICE WG, > > We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of the draft > "Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectivity > (ICE PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed > Standard": > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 > > If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thread by en= d > of next Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns, please > reply to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed). > > > Thanks, > Ari > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > > > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > --000000000000808b5505845bd267 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+1
_____________
Roman Shpount=


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 3:56 AM Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com= > wrote:
= +1

Regards,

Christer


=EF=BB=BFOn 18/03/2019, 9.54, "Ice on behalf of Ari Ker=C3=A4nen"= <ice-bounces@= ietf.org on behalf of ari.keranen@ericsson.com> wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 ICE WG,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of t= he draft "Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Co= nnectivity (ICE PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patien= ce as Proposed Standard":

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://tools.ietf.org/htm= l/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thre= ad by end of next Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns= , please reply to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed)= .


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ari
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 _______________________________________________
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ice mailing list
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ice@ietf.or= g
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice=


_______________________________________________
Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
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([2600:380:8030:f422:b10c:422d:7a65:beea]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id b15sm19235497pfj.167.2019.03.18.07.53.04 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:53:04 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-7A0675B8-67E3-4DA7-8181-C7365827AAFB Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: Bernard Aboba X-Mailer: iPhone Mail (16D57) In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 07:53:03 -0700 Cc: Christer Holmberg , =?utf-8?Q?Ari_Ker=C3=A4nen?= , ICE WG Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: References: <76FFCF19-0F6C-4AAF-A60A-39A3C00FCB98@ericsson.com> To: Roman Shpount Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 14:53:08 -0000 --Apple-Mail-7A0675B8-67E3-4DA7-8181-C7365827AAFB Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable +1 > On Mar 18, 2019, at 3:27 AM, Roman Shpount wrote: >=20 > +1 > _____________ > Roman Shpount >=20 >=20 >> On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 3:56 AM Christer Holmberg wrote: >> +1 >>=20 >> Regards, >>=20 >> Christer >>=20 >>=20 >> =EF=BB=BFOn 18/03/2019, 9.54, "Ice on behalf of Ari Ker=C3=A4nen" wrote: >>=20 >> ICE WG, >>=20 >> We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of the draft= "Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectivity (IC= E PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed Standard":= >>=20 >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 >>=20 >> If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thread by en= d of next Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns, please r= eply to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed).. >>=20 >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Ari >> _______________________________________________ >> Ice mailing list >> Ice@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Ice mailing list >> Ice@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice --Apple-Mail-7A0675B8-67E3-4DA7-8181-C7365827AAFB Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+1<= /div>

On Mar 18, 2019, at 3:27 AM, Roman Shpount <roman@telurix.com> wrote:

+1
_____________
Roman Shpount


On Mon, Mar 18, 20= 19 at 3:56 AM Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote:
+1

Regards,

Christer


=EF=BB=BFOn 18/03/2019, 9.54, "Ice on behalf of Ari Ker=C3=A4nen" <ice-bounces@ietf.org= on behalf of = ari.keranen@ericsson.com> wrote:

    ICE WG,

    We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of th= e draft "Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectiv= ity (ICE PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed Sta= ndard":

      https://tools.ietf.org/html/= draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01

    If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this threa= d by end of next Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns, p= lease reply to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed)..

    Thanks,
    Ari
    _______________________________________________
    Ice mailing list
    Ice@ietf.org=
    https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice

_______________________________________________
Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
________= _______________________________________
Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org= /mailman/listinfo/ice
= --Apple-Mail-7A0675B8-67E3-4DA7-8181-C7365827AAFB-- From nobody Mon Mar 18 10:28:47 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 762681312B3 for ; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 10:28:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.501 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.501 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vWt_x2oTWUR1 for ; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 10:28:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-it1-x136.google.com (mail-it1-x136.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::136]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A44D81312A9 for ; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 10:28:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-it1-x136.google.com with SMTP id l139so22581364ita.5 for ; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 10:28:36 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=bUF7Beslq7YU+4jOaPjzi1Sg1t9rKFOhkSmaO/RAYso=; b=tjIsNR7L3otgy/4A79At+X5SP1TjU2qrGuh35w843ATpRCLOLj1vlEJ5IPhkRqOiFV EpG9kY2UDYcjoatyClGesBV2s6ySqhrkH5PtFUQ0GPskqAMbjTGjIwjw5YrMlZXpxKcA CrV16JFJ9PD0sFzwSm1IzXvo/jxCd6CgweT6I57GoiKIaYsf3AP9TrNnDUhfzQOs7q/K fuOGvE2sNiNrVe98v0CwUFKUj7F4R/G1k7X+H/HY+DMs72HKgQvrnom9LMJTJ5wDAmeJ Df2wbpr3z2xRkvbYUU6+MgDhPDkQm72zXCn40RU7yMhoBzqQOp40Z8eouu8lFYwAyI0E MfRg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=bUF7Beslq7YU+4jOaPjzi1Sg1t9rKFOhkSmaO/RAYso=; b=f/97HQZ4zT+9kbqm+RvHW2/iB1/D9esnulv0CapPVNVre2xTwboUVsCYOM+Py6oTlB nPtUFhmya8UH+kUzD5ucz8DwuxUcKqLM/nKspCEHVEsdJXX8bItMDL5JBAunsNMH6SoW RBAOtPAlbCkGWRqiyQnfl8GSqdNoJa5157qOtIRIPiG7Lq8sBLkLbfEDuSvHGmDf6lGA tazvcuYvdmitDOtO7SfpWKObi2JQjqdSTGyH3F8i1ZlhP2PkRS0NOqjKkw8KBcSKHCDS 4xY121I8xrf1kOdubth/4B8WKIXQTepwZzPK2EJfqbbkxoPYvOVdxixd/oqXgQAKtKsx ZBTA== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAXEqLgLinUIDuq5F9EnsxcgctyuQ+e2umhv5mTT+m+yyZwM9wve rHtIeEy14D1a+v1SzDYt955EqWDA9KOpZM8o+iMJqA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqwmDTeFspgPNFphu8K9fF+0oZqxu1EzJfP71pE2hyyTRI/zNnnFKi9JjoZtpF1RgaA7GI9SMnAl5YgxSVnJYqo= X-Received: by 2002:a24:ccc5:: with SMTP id x188mr11237929itf.123.1552930115685; Mon, 18 Mar 2019 10:28:35 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <76FFCF19-0F6C-4AAF-A60A-39A3C00FCB98@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: From: Justin Uberti Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 10:28:24 -0700 Message-ID: To: Bernard Aboba Cc: Roman Shpount , ICE WG , =?UTF-8?B?QXJpIEtlcsOkbmVu?= , Christer Holmberg Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e8aeb3058461b75a" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 17:28:46 -0000 --000000000000e8aeb3058461b75a Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable +1 On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 7:53 AM Bernard Aboba wrote: > +1 > > On Mar 18, 2019, at 3:27 AM, Roman Shpount wrote: > > +1 > _____________ > Roman Shpount > > > On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 3:56 AM Christer Holmberg < > christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote: > >> +1 >> >> Regards, >> >> Christer >> >> >> =EF=BB=BFOn 18/03/2019, 9.54, "Ice on behalf of Ari Ker=C3=A4nen" < >> ice-bounces@ietf.org on behalf of ari.keranen@ericsson.com> wrote: >> >> ICE WG, >> >> We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of the draf= t >> "Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectivity >> (ICE PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed >> Standard": >> >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 >> >> If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thread by >> end of next Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns, >> please reply to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed= ).. >> >> >> Thanks, >> Ari >> _______________________________________________ >> Ice mailing list >> Ice@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ice mailing list >> Ice@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice >> > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > --000000000000e8aeb3058461b75a Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+1

On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 7:53 AM Bernard Aboba <bernard.aboba@gmail.com> wr= ote:
+1
On Mar 18, 2019, at 3:27 AM, Roman Shpount <roman@telurix.com> wrote:

<= blockquote type=3D"cite">
+1
_____________
Roman Shpount


On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 3= :56 AM Christer Holmberg <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com> wrote:
+1

Regards,

Christer


=EF=BB=BFOn 18/03/2019, 9.54, "Ice on behalf of Ari Ker=C3=A4nen"= <ice-bounces@= ietf.org on behalf of ari.keranen@ericsson.com> wrote:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 ICE WG,

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of t= he draft "Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Co= nnectivity (ICE PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patien= ce as Proposed Standard":

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://tools.ietf.org/htm= l/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thre= ad by end of next Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns= , please reply to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed)= ..


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Thanks,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ari
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 _______________________________________________
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ice mailing list
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Ice@ietf.or= g
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice=


_______________________________________________
Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
_______= ________________________________________
Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.o= rg
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
_______________________________________________ Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
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Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.3 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Language: en-US Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Mar 2019 17:34:06 -0000 +1 On 3/18/19 11:28 AM, Justin Uberti wrote: > +1 > > On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 7:53 AM Bernard Aboba > wrote: > > +1 > > On Mar 18, 2019, at 3:27 AM, Roman Shpount > wrote: > >> +1 >> _____________ >> Roman Shpount >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 3:56 AM Christer Holmberg >> > > wrote: >> >> +1 >> >> Regards, >> >> Christer >> >> >> On 18/03/2019, 9.54, "Ice on behalf of Ari Keränen" >> on behalf >> of ari.keranen@ericsson.com > >> wrote: >> >>     ICE WG, >> >>     We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call >> of the draft "Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently >> Awaiting Connectivity (ICE PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone >> "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed Standard": >> >>       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 >> >>     If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this >> thread by end of next Monday (March 25th). If you have any >> comments or concerns, please reply to this thread (or directly >> to the chairs/authors if needed)... >> >> >>     Thanks, >>     Ari >>     _______________________________________________ >>     Ice mailing list >>     Ice@ietf.org >>     https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ice mailing list >> Ice@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Ice mailing list >> Ice@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > > > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > From nobody Wed Mar 20 17:59:07 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08F73131188 for ; Wed, 20 Mar 2019 17:59:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id j5sbrqVIIQTy for ; Wed, 20 Mar 2019 17:59:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vs1-xe36.google.com (mail-vs1-xe36.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e36]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B6BA81310B8 for ; Wed, 20 Mar 2019 17:59:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vs1-xe36.google.com with SMTP id w26so2692593vsk.13 for ; Wed, 20 Mar 2019 17:59:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=hbUKJ65gXpswTMscwfRPG/mmUmGD7RPZXe2t9tISq/w=; b=rtM/pMPWyVif0fTPZLgLv4Wdzmcub4eYGRsiHL0b6w/FcfgK4+OgEI4kjSmIvqXjzC hhfqf4dNF0Hd5BPbSUl9tcahRIw5logVAXEQtqpNY68shgIC7fKGGzmFy8o3zLJN/+AU gmlNzUKhfYKTx+uHygZaVcnRymhPsYy/bjKzmhR1hmr1xVtkH3HFWqkug7oAdKwJSro3 RIhY4mO4WiLvC2lkX3Ca+WWjl/HvkcGEQhSleBleT5tm/g6e30ndGuHt+1m85NmaP4L3 1EqQVgQzOa255Q0auRTeIyoIwFV/Xb9groO2mOvwBNIcGYMC7YpfcDqdXQNnUau0XP9q 5RLw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=hbUKJ65gXpswTMscwfRPG/mmUmGD7RPZXe2t9tISq/w=; b=gTs8VuyEAybi5Fxc1laIc5tNuUjNA1CqqcdYsFXofii4ACwtPRMC/bamKetDsQlctt wyiFqS8nxH0fOdDM/1Ds12H+XpNzEpZs5q5MRzjXR31es1RzYJbfM0Vc6cHlXlTB1Va5 S6SVCJaUFYIq9A41UQGNOV4IVleWPzC3p3PxlbDPz2iu8k9lnUy9B9w9n1H4Z5SzRNC6 Hif9PXAIHX1z0CR+ObdOVoa9J91vV3VqW90cY/9Zqfofn+8+v8AuNOUUks6moVFhRTId PDtJi5JYosPej0c/0zkROSGlqxzXdeBv9O+Sk9Yo86MZwJ64RRz3XyfQJdPrlzWC4LYD 0mmg== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUaGul/zIbhCUl5GO2BAVsinD5GryBeLA1JqRIzRzkLWfQR3pam oG+OQpKNt0hPSVZwBTbHjOdikaa8vKO6/dNVT2W6iw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyVA8/1F4MO+p1kphoTnKPF6Yl2LvVmydQfkUWqqKdi0EeR2Y08bCVUU9/SIN2EQ6BIJwP3vhO5OUUkeOjSV9M= X-Received: by 2002:a67:f41a:: with SMTP id p26mr408915vsn.140.1553129942564; Wed, 20 Mar 2019 17:59:02 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Peter Thatcher Date: Wed, 20 Mar 2019 17:58:51 -0700 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?B?QXJpIEtlcsOkbmVu?= Cc: ICE WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000084a0690584903eb9" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 21 Mar 2019 00:59:06 -0000 --00000000000084a0690584903eb9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable +1 (chair hat off) On Mon, Mar 18, 2019 at 12:53 AM Ari Ker=C3=A4nen wrote: > ICE WG, > > We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of the draft > "Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectivity > (ICE PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed > Standard": > > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 > > If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thread by end of > next Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns, please > reply to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed). > > > Thanks, > Ari > _______________________________________________ > Ice mailing list > Ice@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice > --00000000000084a0690584903eb9 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
+1=C2=A0

(chair hat off)

On Mo= n, Mar 18, 2019 at 12:53 AM Ari Ker=C3=A4nen <ari.keranen@ericsson.com> wrote:
ICE WG,

We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of the draft "= ;Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectivity (IC= E PAC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed= Standard":

=C2=A0 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holmbe= rg-ice-pac-01

If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thread by end of n= ext Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns, please reply= to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed).


Thanks,
Ari
_______________________________________________
Ice mailing list
Ice@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ice
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DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; SCL:1; SRVR:HE1PR07MB3323; H:HE1PR07MB4236.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ericsson.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: Ba2uOJ5eu7ELH5cbwiULQPOFU7fK78u/awnvgf8XfLHRknZSl6l+LBtApt7JIVWjiDmR9LhKfZZk2/hNzIn/SRf/ADAGnanLNt6wKkfOOuMj+i5mGgDFFtdSJTqp7mVuqi7ohXn+Csw28xsoiD+5V4cLYgKM5d80H2KRbV8QuobRNbJj011lea7cJPjpX7rY3MQuhLWMZsP/t7+wXkW8y0bWCj3Gk+8tkIFlhBVPG4FGTHSD+oOxd4tDVif2Rgnwx9r6IB3AaDc9TiwuRkZfB1kutCoSoRnoTYKtg0y/hZPb2yVxgb1LxJh4GYrYnFuhKoyOz+H7y+qnoHQJp2zseUhBp5QL30Kq9rrdOkI7jYOM5C4v7/vYxwJouFTHCpdcDhrndBylPb4a/NMDdzvfT5kAleyYpEljdJiT4evSm4A= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: ericsson.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: a33060c1-6162-4cc0-a204-08d6b1c32024 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 26 Mar 2019 08:14:53.4203 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 92e84ceb-fbfd-47ab-be52-080c6b87953f X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: HE1PR07MB3323 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 08:15:05 -0000 ICE WG,=0A= =0A= We have a set of people on and off list supporting the adoption of this =0A= draft and we have not seen any concerns expressed. Therefore we consider = =0A= the WGLC concluded and the draft adopted.=0A= =0A= Authors, please submit a draft-ietf-ice version of the document.=0A= =0A= All, please review the document and send your comments to the list. Also = =0A= let us know if you don't have any comments but think the draft is ready =0A= to move towards publication. This is a short and simple draft and we aim = =0A= to move to WGLC as soon as possible.=0A= =0A= =0A= Thanks,=0A= Ari=0A= =0A= On 18/03/2019 8.53, Ari Ker=E4nen wrote:=0A= > ICE WG,=0A= > =0A= > We are starting now a 1-week working group adoption call of the draft "In= teractive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectivity (ICE P= AC)" for the ICE WG milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed Standard":= =0A= > =0A= > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01=0A= > =0A= > If you support adopting this document, please +1 on this thread by end of= next Monday (March 25th). If you have any comments or concerns, please rep= ly to this thread (or directly to the chairs/authors if needed).=0A= > =0A= > =0A= > Thanks,=0A= > Ari=0A= > =0A= From nobody Tue Mar 26 01:18:56 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BD67120293; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 01:18:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.002 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.002 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EODDKNHvLXoV; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 01:18:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from EUR04-DB3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-eopbgr60056.outbound.protection.outlook.com [40.107.6.56]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2C1521202B1; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 01:18:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ericsson.com; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=MqwwNxRzupvf2YzfXe8206ap1/fC3WHP0SbtrVNxJkQ=; b=bT6y0rRfUD+5jLo4F1+trNRVnGezEOQhb6uC6NAdAI4peCYLi7mctnJmlVsScYWlloGidUNOL6ERHPnaZMSA9wKALUz7amH8NuuEHvVQlFrNADtNdgxIJE2V3eqwFb8lW834a1psoI8PqMGoukfSX3mumA6oDBrDh7RIBPPZipA= Received: from HE1PR07MB4236.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (20.176.166.145) by HE1PR07MB3211.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.170.246.14) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.1730.15; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 08:18:41 +0000 Received: from HE1PR07MB4236.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::c061:dce3:6941:3bd5]) by HE1PR07MB4236.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::c061:dce3:6941:3bd5%4]) with mapi id 15.20.1750.014; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 08:18:41 +0000 From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Ari_Ker=E4nen?= To: ICE WG , "draft-holmberg-ice-pac@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 Thread-Index: AQHU3V+pVB4OCPbLl02cJzeEP5gT6w== Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 08:18:40 +0000 Message-ID: References: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [89.166.49.243] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 6a0b3ad7-824e-4644-6fcd-08d6b1c3a7cc x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0; 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MX:1; A:1; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ericsson.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=ari.keranen@ericsson.com; x-ms-exchange-senderadcheck: 1 x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: oV99OW7xVF3f1BuN1CEYdoH02/s2cR6wBddMMd95rDeKJ6AnfZPiQ9imuQb5Gs8K6oBlslbpdWPUcyvAmWwo6L48lEro3slV90fDjlFKbr0LhFhv41P3cPmLvgAV+YOI/p2+8VP3Zksx4LEJiP4WvjifkpCYzN4IumWXfhv24fXLbroOHpmfqr2uKrU3ktxv4U5wgBIwr5K2zCIg37lClWSbKNGk55XtqH8ZaWSjMeroyFViq+T+UV8Jh3HHwkKqLW8v3LAsn0XQzSkTpqYEn0dzQrlERg8dx7iVbSjXrrIIa87NUvMfWSoSL0Q5schD4pByK+a8OVjcs+IYbT0tjAfJGSYl5bBKbrT08dAQhSiHffGWuU82m9kHkUkFSTlLT/zOtHL1WTaWbjlEPjRHvkqARJa2fT9Ku8jkrpsHDjI= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: ericsson.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 6a0b3ad7-824e-4644-6fcd-08d6b1c3a7cc X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 26 Mar 2019 08:18:40.9494 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 92e84ceb-fbfd-47ab-be52-080c6b87953f X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: HE1PR07MB3211 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Ice] WG Adoption call: draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 08:18:55 -0000 On 26/03/2019 9.15, Ari Ker=E4nen wrote:=0A= > Therefore we consider=0A= > the WGLC concluded and the draft adopted.=0A= =0A= s/WGLC/WG adoption call/=0A= =0A= We're almost there, but not yet.=0A= =0A= =0A= Cheers,=0A= Ari=0A= From nobody Tue Mar 26 02:20:13 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietf.org Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 375D71202ED; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 02:19:57 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ice@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.94.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ice@ietf.org Message-ID: <155359199710.20833.17158796675661056295@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 02:19:57 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Ice] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ice-pac-00.txt X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 09:20:05 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Interactive Connectivity Establishment WG of the IETF. Title : Interactive Connectivity Establishment Patiently Awaiting Connectivity (ICE PAC) Authors : Christer Holmberg Justin Uberti Filename : draft-ietf-ice-pac-00.txt Pages : 5 Date : 2019-03-26 Abstract: During the process of creating a peer-to-peer connection, ICE implementations can encounter situations where they have no candidate pairs to check, and, as a result, conclude that ICE processing has failed. However, because additional candidate pairs can be discovered during ICE processing, declaring failure at this point may be premature. This document discusses when these situations can occur and proposes a way to avoid premature failure. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ice-pac/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ice-pac-00 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ice-pac-00 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Mar 26 02:24:45 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietf.org Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4F4931202AD for ; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 02:24:33 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.94.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <155359227331.20676.1987373552095866902.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 02:24:33 -0700 From: IETF Secretariat Archived-At: Subject: [Ice] Milestones changed for ice WG X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 09:24:34 -0000 Changed milestone "Submit ICE Patience as Proposed Standard", added draft-ietf-ice-pac to milestone. URL: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/ice/about/ From nobody Tue Mar 26 03:29:31 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D172F1202B0; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 03:29:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.001 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.001 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4A92kx7wL3CM; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 03:29:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from EUR03-VE1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-ve1eur03on0602.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe09::602]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 253D61202AF; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 03:29:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=ericsson.com; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version:X-MS-Exchange-SenderADCheck; bh=wQ4XuQJBDBOJxABGZgKbOU61rJzp9oTIT8vATf9A5+Q=; b=T4k6WaPwgkRWAIH76ZQdSOGRbRyQB4K/ck9g0/S9c6rzaai3MjWsAonADnceKQyEGYhGjYwRCsZLxzLwl8vW6ub1nvpeW0qEFgOToc5dYTbQeivSK6goHx9u0/sKiViUCBcq5XqGhaOtDT5qSwJwL3pEeehKxMnm93dCuqFEjLo= Received: from HE1PR07MB3161.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.170.245.23) by HE1PR07MB4393.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (20.176.167.30) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.1750.10; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 10:29:22 +0000 Received: from HE1PR07MB3161.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::a832:85f:a8bb:73b9]) by HE1PR07MB3161.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::a832:85f:a8bb:73b9%5]) with mapi id 15.20.1750.014; Tue, 26 Mar 2019 10:29:22 +0000 From: Christer Holmberg To: "ice@ietf.org" CC: "ice-chairs@ietf.org" , Justin Uberti Thread-Topic: Draft new: draft-ietf-ice-pac-00 Thread-Index: AQHU477HUhE4bHtBoUqsBC9qgH/iZw== Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 10:29:22 +0000 Message-ID: <6C4FA46D-5A08-4F87-8B6E-E97B8020F7C7@ericsson.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: user-agent: Microsoft-MacOutlook/10.16.1.190220 authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=christer.holmberg@ericsson.com; 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[70.119.64.92]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id o84sm7711314oib.21.2019.03.26.06.56.59 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 26 Mar 2019 06:57:00 -0700 (PDT) To: ice@ietf.org From: Byron Campen Message-ID: <9217809f-b09a-321e-34b6-2cf6fee9c07b@mozilla.com> Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 08:56:59 -0500 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.13; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Language: en-US Archived-At: Subject: [Ice] Firefox review of draft-ietf-ice-pac-00 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Mar 2019 13:57:03 -0000     This looks fine to me. It isn't quite the same as what Firefox does already, but it will do the trick. (we set the timer when we have both started ICE, _and_ have a trickle candidate) Best regards, Byron Campen From nobody Fri Mar 29 18:04:51 2019 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ice@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8DB5120282 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2019 18:04:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -17.501 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.501 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NJS7K9O7iWh9 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2019 18:04:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-oi1-x22f.google.com (mail-oi1-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 26ADB1200D7 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2019 18:04:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-oi1-x22f.google.com with SMTP id l203so2464282oia.3 for ; Fri, 29 Mar 2019 18:04:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=JqspP/jj6jcxa2H5hfpD+PjAxB9o/fEkPupTFpko1NA=; b=mVGjpyg2P6uLO8XpS4PtcznQRYarq7uLKd3ca5sik3rvC9QVNy7Xefju6TYBs8fNo4 496v276yw9QIdBtKtJMjfu06xDmBvCerrt0R9o8qfqUQTHXjT9UTmIcZpKs47i0OmmVn uq3s47oaUlWhoferY1D0MWL9N2WWItLFWXZiUJF8Gf6ku4kb1m0lefe2azxCtqKSPnr3 /H5BmuXoB2j+wwIomPxTCzEIvXDcJP6cYG06Jknt5WIktDgowWp+n6pchimOhFHB+xd8 4WHomIhqzBhrpZhgEfY3ITU4eg1W5QIRDBZE2i1jXGMq0q00RffS1oTDgPHLjcenIpwq +0Cg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=JqspP/jj6jcxa2H5hfpD+PjAxB9o/fEkPupTFpko1NA=; b=hh2WrnoP547cF1evPIk0Bb8XXQv3IPpSwOuihH3+ux+CuSxnbkuCvvJ3KD4YCV6KGd TrI5BO3Vp724cutC7lr55FBHqYq6vOstsNK3mq6z/YkJdcvpXI05rrPaQHabZB5x16US 46nO4df5TTi0TQVa3rhkFGmqRwz5A48irDqb7ipFXXoUI7YXCXilsfhMObHjyHtG/rhd oHOYBiC+nE4yMGp9WDByVe7HDhjmoDKd3qHP1ieOjmdnvZO5JrUGOJq7dAT07RnaWAC2 0cqOqdrDajXNkmIjcr1+5r6k4/VErKFIwFquq544RSqSArGOt42JId/dcKYpSXR3GTJr y8zQ== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAWOBfHx8k9CaSJDTYZOdXydNqfGmyEwP9LiLRUiu+kjgLxM+XW6 zLQ4O4WVyeEkyx4GsSdYWtajPtX0RYSsQyL9F8BccGeREFyQVg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqy7p16KvucFm3zWT4jqVlKywhuOL8B+sjzFzdB7mDTHFy1Wa/Ig8f5tOCw3C5U1w8COIXij96xP6QUDt4dydK4= X-Received: by 2002:aca:c5cd:: with SMTP id v196mr5247046oif.90.1553907887280; Fri, 29 Mar 2019 18:04:47 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Qingsi Wang Date: Fri, 29 Mar 2019 18:04:36 -0700 Message-ID: To: ice@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000a2facf0585455fd0" Archived-At: Subject: [Ice] Review of draft-holmberg-ice-pac-01 X-BeenThere: ice@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Interactive Connectivity Establishment \(ICE\)" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 30 Mar 2019 01:04:50 -0000 --000000000000a2facf0585455fd0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" If all available candidate pairs have either performed triggered checks or sent check response, but have timed out their checks however, should we cancel the timer and conclude a failure? The rationale is to wait for inbound checks, but if at least one round of checks are received, it's unclear to me if the waiting would benefit compared to allowing the app trigger an ICE restart after firing an failure. The rest looks good to me. Best, Qingsi --000000000000a2facf0585455fd0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
If all available candidate pairs have either performe= d triggered checks or sent check response, but have timed out their checks = however, should we cancel the timer and conclude a failure? The rationale i= s to wait for inbound checks, but if at least one round of checks are recei= ved, it's unclear to me if the waiting would benefit compared to allowi= ng the app trigger an ICE restart after firing an failure.

The rest looks good=C2=A0to me.

Best,
Qingsi
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