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X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zoCspiySap4v for ; Tue, 7 Aug 2018 18:19:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from bsa2.jck.com (ns.jck.com [70.88.254.51]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EAFC3128CF2 for ; Tue, 7 Aug 2018 18:19:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [198.252.137.10] (helo=PSB) by bsa2.jck.com with esmtp (Exim 4.82 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1fnD7s-000Mfb-38; Tue, 07 Aug 2018 21:19:00 -0400 Date: Tue, 07 Aug 2018 21:18:53 -0400 From: John C Klensin To: Shawn Steele , idna-update@ietf.org Message-ID: <774AA673EDE6104BF9B0F2CD@PSB> In-Reply-To: References: X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.8 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 198.252.137.10 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: john-ietf@jck.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on bsa2.jck.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Idna-update] =?utf-8?q?Question_about_=E2=84=80?= X-BeenThere: idna-update@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.27 Precedence: list List-Id: "Internationalized Domain Names in Applications \(IDNA\) implementation and update discussions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2018 01:19:04 -0000 Shawn, I can't figure out what you are talking about. For starters, the text/plain (first) body part of your message shows up here identified as=20 text/plain charset=3DUTF-8 (and is transmitted in Base64. That should be fine because my system handles plain text messages with that charset just fine. However, what I see instead of whatever you intended (I'm assuming U+2100) is the traditional little box (which you probably see below). =20 Then there is no USE_STD3_ASCII_RULES (or even UseSTD3ASCIIRules, which is what appears in RFC 3490) flag in IDNA2008, even in RFC 5895. As far as IDNA2008 is concerned, U+2100 has General Property So, which causes it to be DISALLOWED for use in domain names, no "mapping step" (whatever that is) needed or relevant. Partially because of that, I don't know what "the tables" you are referring to. There is a "known list of this type of problematic characters", but it is a subset, not identified separately, of the set of characters that IDNA2008 classifies as DISALLOWED. It includes everything with General Property So including, notoriously, all of the emoji. So I either don't know what you are talking about, or you are asking either about the preferred way to violate the standards that the IETF has approved or how to conform to someone else's standard. For either of the latter, this may not be the right place to ask. best, john --On Wednesday, August 8, 2018 00:21 +0000 Shawn Steele wrote: > For characters like =E2=84=80, would it be permissible to = disallow > them in the mapping step? Currently the tables allow mapping > =E2=84=80 to a/c, which is obviously not very great behavior = since / > is illegal in DNS. >=20 > USE_STD3_ASCII_RULES would clearly stomp out things like this, > but it seems to me that it doesn't really make sense to map > these characters at all. >=20 > Am I missing some scenario? Is there already a known list of > this type of problematic characters somewhere? (I can figure > it out, but it doesn't hurt to double check.) From nobody Tue Aug 7 22:31:13 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: idna-update@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: idna-update@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38BF9130DD9 for ; Tue, 7 Aug 2018 22:31:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZNPlRhcrWfef for ; Tue, 7 Aug 2018 22:31:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.frobbit.se (mail.frobbit.se [IPv6:2a02:80:3ffe::176]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E888F126CB6 for ; Tue, 7 Aug 2018 22:31:09 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.10.104] (c-40b2d954.028-114-73746f27.bbcust.telenor.se [84.217.178.64]) by mail.frobbit.se (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C28D42146C; Wed, 8 Aug 2018 07:31:06 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=Apple-Mail-BE4E864F-2669-403F-84A8-07F8C1655027 Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0) From: =?utf-8?Q?Patrik_F=C3=A4ltstr=C3=B6m?= X-Mailer: iPad Mail (15G77) In-Reply-To: Date: Wed, 8 Aug 2018 07:31:06 +0200 Cc: "idna-update@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <65767F4F-4F3C-4C3C-AB2A-3F38D2C6C4D6@frobbit.se> References: To: Shawn Steele Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Idna-update] =?utf-8?q?Question_about_=E2=84=80?= X-BeenThere: idna-update@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.27 Precedence: list List-Id: "Internationalized Domain Names in Applications \(IDNA\) implementation and update discussions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 08 Aug 2018 05:31:12 -0000 --Apple-Mail-BE4E864F-2669-403F-84A8-07F8C1655027 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > On 8 Aug 2018, at 02:21, Shawn Steele wrote: >=20 > For characters like =E2=84=80, would it be permissible to disallow them in= the mapping step? Currently the tables allow mapping =E2=84=80 to a/c, whi= ch is obviously not very great behavior since / is illegal in DNS. There are no tables talking about mapping since IDNA2003. IDNA2008 do allow m= apping before IDNA2008 rules actually are applied, and what mappings you app= ly is context and application dependent. So I am confused about what you mea= n by =E2=80=9Ctables=E2=80=9D. Further, if the code point you refer to is U+= 2100 its derived property value according to IDNA2008 is DISALLOWED. Patrik --Apple-Mail-BE4E864F-2669-403F-84A8-07F8C1655027 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


On 8 Aug= 2018, at 02:21, Shawn Steele <Shawn.Steele=3D40microsoft.com@dmarc.ietf.org>= wrote:

For characters like =E2=84=80, would it be permissible to disallow them in the mapping st= ep?  Currently the tables allow mapping =E2=84=80 t= o a/c, which is obviously not very great behavior since / is illegal in DNS.=

There are no tables talking about mapping since I= DNA2003. IDNA2008 do allow mapping before IDNA2008 rules actually are applie= d, and what mappings you apply is context and application dependent. So I am= confused about what you mean by =E2=80=9Ctables=E2=80=9D. Further, if the c= ode point you refer to is U+2100 its derived property value according to IDN= A2008 is DISALLOWED.

    Patrik



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<20180828113938.173ADB8152A@rfc-editor.org> Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2018 04:39:38 -0700 (PDT) Archived-At: Subject: [Idna-update] [Editorial Errata Reported] RFC5890 (5484) X-BeenThere: idna-update@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.27 Precedence: list List-Id: "Internationalized Domain Names in Applications \(IDNA\) implementation and update discussions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2018 11:40:08 -0000 The following errata report has been submitted for RFC5890, "Internationalized Domain Names for Applications (IDNA): Definitions and Document Framework". -------------------------------------- You may review the report below and at: http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid5484 -------------------------------------- Type: Editorial Reported by: Peter Occil Section: 2.3.2.1 Original Text ------------- For IDNA-aware applications, the three types of valid labels are "A-labels", "U-labels", and "NR-LDH labels", each of which is defined below. Corrected Text -------------- For IDNA-aware applications, the three types of valid labels are "A-labels", "U-labels", and "NR-LDH labels", each of which is defined below and in section 2.3.1. Notes ----- The term NR-LDH label is actually defined in section 2.3.1, not later in this section. Instructions: ------------- This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary. -------------------------------------- RFC5890 (draft-ietf-idnabis-defs-13) -------------------------------------- Title : Internationalized Domain Names for Applications (IDNA): Definitions and Document Framework Publication Date : August 2010 Author(s) : J. Klensin Category : PROPOSED STANDARD Source : Internationalized Domain Names in Applications (Revised) Area : Applications Stream : IETF Verifying Party : IESG From nobody Tue Aug 28 05:55:27 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: idna-update@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: idna-update@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8184130F27 for ; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 05:55:13 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -8.843 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-8.843 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_SOFTFAIL=0.665, T_DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W-tGv0qEYq9g for ; 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boundary="0000000000000ba20205747d86c3" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Idna-update] [Editorial Errata Reported] RFC5890 (5484) X-BeenThere: idna-update@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.27 Precedence: list List-Id: "Internationalized Domain Names in Applications \(IDNA\) implementation and update discussions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2018 12:55:26 -0000 --0000000000000ba20205747d86c3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" i re-read RFC5890 and concur with the erratum. vint cerf On Tue, Aug 28, 2018 at 7:39 AM, RFC Errata System < rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org> wrote: > The following errata report has been submitted for RFC5890, > "Internationalized Domain Names for Applications (IDNA): Definitions and > Document Framework". > > -------------------------------------- > You may review the report below and at: > http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid5484 > > -------------------------------------- > Type: Editorial > Reported by: Peter Occil > > Section: 2.3.2.1 > > Original Text > ------------- > For IDNA-aware applications, the three types of valid labels are > "A-labels", "U-labels", and "NR-LDH labels", each of which is defined > below. > > > Corrected Text > -------------- > For IDNA-aware applications, the three types of valid labels are > "A-labels", "U-labels", and "NR-LDH labels", each of which is defined > below and in section 2.3.1. > > Notes > ----- > The term NR-LDH label is actually defined in section 2.3.1, not later in > this section. > > Instructions: > ------------- > This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, please > use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or > rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party > can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary. > > -------------------------------------- > RFC5890 (draft-ietf-idnabis-defs-13) > -------------------------------------- > Title : Internationalized Domain Names for Applications > (IDNA): Definitions and Document Framework > Publication Date : August 2010 > Author(s) : J. Klensin > Category : PROPOSED STANDARD > Source : Internationalized Domain Names in Applications > (Revised) > Area : Applications > Stream : IETF > Verifying Party : IESG > -- New postal address: Google 1875 Explorer Street, 10th Floor Reston, VA 20190 --0000000000000ba20205747d86c3 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
i re-read RFC5890 and concur with the erratum.

vint cerf


=
On Tue, Aug 28, 2018 at 7:39 AM, RFC Errata Syst= em <rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org> wrote:
The following errata report has been submitted for RFC5= 890,
"Internationalized Domain Names for Applications (IDNA): Definitions a= nd Document Framework".

--------------------------------------
You may review the report below and at:
http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid5484

--------------------------------------
Type: Editorial
Reported by: Peter Occil <poccil14= @gmail.com>

Section: 2.3.2.1

Original Text
-------------
=C2=A0 =C2=A0For IDNA-aware applications, the three types of valid labels a= re
=C2=A0 =C2=A0"A-labels", "U-labels", and "NR-LDH l= abels", each of which is defined
=C2=A0 =C2=A0below.


Corrected Text
--------------
=C2=A0 =C2=A0For IDNA-aware applications, the three types of valid labels a= re
=C2=A0 =C2=A0"A-labels", "U-labels", and "NR-LDH l= abels", each of which is defined
=C2=A0 =C2=A0below and in section 2.3.1.

Notes
-----
The term NR-LDH label is actually defined in section 2.3.1, not later in th= is section.

Instructions:
-------------
This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, ple= ase
use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or
rejected. When a decision is reached, the verifying party=C2=A0
can log in to change the status and edit the report, if necessary.

--------------------------------------
RFC5890 (draft-ietf-idnabis-defs-13)
--------------------------------------
Title=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0: International= ized Domain Names for Applications (IDNA): Definitions and Document Framewo= rk
Publication Date=C2=A0 =C2=A0 : August 2010
Author(s)=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0: J. Klensin
Category=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : PROPOSED STANDARD
Source=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : Internationalized = Domain Names in Applications (Revised)
Area=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : Applications<= br> Stream=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : IETF
Verifying Party=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0: IESG



--
Ne= w postal address:
Google
1875 Explorer Street, 10th Floor
=
Reston, VA 20190
--0000000000000ba20205747d86c3-- From nobody Tue Aug 28 08:22:55 2018 Return-Path: X-Original-To: idna-update@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: idna-update@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8C761130E62 for ; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 08:22:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4CsJtOiiSqhU for ; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 08:22:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mork.alvestrand.no (mork.alvestrand.no [158.38.152.117]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CD13D130DF2 for ; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 08:22:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mork.alvestrand.no (Postfix) id 167F37C0A48; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 17:22:45 +0200 (CEST) Delivered-To: idna-update@alvestrand.no Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mork.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTP id F391C7C09CA for ; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 17:22:44 +0200 (CEST) X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at alvestrand.no Received: from mork.alvestrand.no ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mork.alvestrand.no [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mJc5uSQDjmTZ for ; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 17:22:43 +0200 (CEST) X-Greylist: delayed 00:24:58 by SQLgrey-1.8.0 X-Greylist: from auto-whitelisted by SQLgrey-1.8.0 Received-SPF: None (no SPF record) identity=mailfrom; client-ip=70.88.254.51; helo=bsa2.jck.com; envelope-from=john-ietf@jck.com; receiver=idna-update@alvestrand.no Received: from bsa2.jck.com (bsa2.jck.com [70.88.254.51]) by mork.alvestrand.no (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F28977C09B1 for ; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 17:22:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=JcK-T100) by bsa2.jck.com with esmtp (Exim 4.82 (FreeBSD)) (envelope-from ) id 1fufQz-000Bt1-LM; Tue, 28 Aug 2018 10:57:33 -0400 Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2018 10:57:33 -0400 From: John C Klensin To: RFC Errata System , ben@nostrum.com, aamelnikov@fastmail.fm, adam@nostrum.com, vint@google.com cc: poccil14@gmail.com, idna-update@alvestrand.no Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <20180828113938.173ADB8152A@rfc-editor.org> References: <20180828113938.173ADB8152A@rfc-editor.org> X-Mailer: Mulberry/4.0.8 (Win32) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: ::1 X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: john-ietf@jck.com X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on bsa2.jck.com); SAEximRunCond expanded to false Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Idna-update] [Editorial Errata Reported] RFC5890 (5484) X-BeenThere: idna-update@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.27 Precedence: list List-Id: "Internationalized Domain Names in Applications \(IDNA\) implementation and update discussions" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 28 Aug 2018 15:22:53 -0000 This erratum, as Vint indicates, is correct. In the evolution of 5890, the definitions were reshuffled several times and it is easy to guess how the error might have occurred. I don't know why neither I nor the RFC Editor missed it in the final version, but mea culpa. For a future version, almost certainly the right fix is to rearrange the text again so that all of the definitions either follow or precede that comment. Peter, thanks for the careful reading. john --On Tuesday, August 28, 2018 04:39 -0700 RFC Errata System wrote: > The following errata report has been submitted for RFC5890, > "Internationalized Domain Names for Applications (IDNA): > Definitions and Document Framework". > > -------------------------------------- > You may review the report below and at: > http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata/eid5484 > > -------------------------------------- > Type: Editorial > Reported by: Peter Occil > > Section: 2.3.2.1 > > Original Text > ------------- > For IDNA-aware applications, the three types of valid > labels are "A-labels", "U-labels", and "NR-LDH labels", > each of which is defined below. > > > Corrected Text > -------------- > For IDNA-aware applications, the three types of valid > labels are "A-labels", "U-labels", and "NR-LDH labels", > each of which is defined below and in section 2.3.1. > > Notes > ----- > The term NR-LDH label is actually defined in section 2.3.1, > not later in this section. > > Instructions: > ------------- > This erratum is currently posted as "Reported". If necessary, > please use "Reply All" to discuss whether it should be > verified or rejected. When a decision is reached, the > verifying party can log in to change the status and edit the > report, if necessary. > > -------------------------------------- > RFC5890 (draft-ietf-idnabis-defs-13) > -------------------------------------- > Title : Internationalized Domain Names for > Applications (IDNA): Definitions and Document Framework > Publication Date : August 2010 > Author(s) : J. Klensin > Category : PROPOSED STANDARD > Source : Internationalized Domain Names in > Applications (Revised) Area : Applications > Stream : IETF > Verifying Party : IESG