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From: Suresh Krishnan <suresh.krishnan@ericsson.com>
To: Internet Area <int-area@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: AD evaluation: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-03
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Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2017 03:31:41 +0000
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Hi all,=0A=
   I have gone through draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-03 and I found =
no =0A=
issues in it other than some outdated references*. I have sent it along to =
=0A=
IETF Last Call. Please update these references when you submit a new versio=
n =0A=
(either to address comments from IETF Last Call or IESG evaluation)=0A=
=0A=
Thanks=0A=
Suresh=0A=
=0A=
* References to be fixed:=0A=
=0A=
draft-ietf-dhc-dhcp-privacy-05->rfc7819=0A=
draft-ietf-dhc-dhcpv6-privacy-05->rfc7824=0A=
draft-ietf-dhc-anonymity-profile-08->rfc7844=0A=


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From nobody Thu Jan  5 06:28:47 2017
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Cc: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice@ietf.org, int-area@ietf.org, intarea-chairs@ietf.org
Subject: [Int-area] Last Call: <draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-03.txt> (Current Hostname Practice Considered Harmful) to Informational RFC
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The IESG has received a request from the Internet Area Working Group WG
(intarea) to consider the following document:
- 'Current Hostname Practice Considered Harmful'
  <draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-03.txt> as Informational RFC

The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits
final comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the
ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2017-01-19. Exceptionally, comments may be
sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the
beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting.

Abstract


   Giving a hostname to your computer and publishing it as you roam from
   one network to another is the Internet equivalent of walking around
   with a name tag affixed to your lapel.  This current practice can
   significantly compromise your privacy, and something should change in
   order to mitigate these privacy threads.

   There are several possible remedies, such as fixing a variety of
   protocols or avoiding disclosing a hostname at all.  This document
   describes some of the protocols that reveal hostnames today and
   sketches another possible remedy, which is to replace static
   hostnames by frequently changing randomized values.




The file can be obtained via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice/

IESG discussion can be tracked via
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice/ballot/


No IPR declarations have been submitted directly on this I-D.





From nobody Fri Jan  6 14:06:10 2017
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See below for a new draft titled: "Route Information Options in Redirect Me=
ssages".
This document was motivated by discussions on the intarea list from several=
 weeks
ago. Please review and post comments to the list.

Fred Templin
fred.l.templn@boeing.com

-----Original Message-----
From: I-D-Announce [mailto:i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of inte=
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Sent: Friday, January 06, 2017 1:52 PM
To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
Subject: I-D Action: draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00.txt


A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director=
ies.


        Title           : Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
        Author          : Fred L. Templin
	Filename        : draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00.txt
	Pages           : 5
	Date            : 2017-01-06

Abstract:
   The IPv6 Neighbor Discovery protocol provides a Redirect function
   allowing routers to inform hosts of a better next hop on the link
   toward the destination.  This document specifies a backward-
   compatible extension to the Redirect function to allow routers to
   include forwarding information that the source can associate with the
   next hop.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio=
n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

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From nobody Sun Jan  8 23:16:47 2017
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Cc: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice.all@ietf.org, int-area@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org
Subject: [Int-area] Review of draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-03
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Reviewer: Roni Even
Review result: Ready

I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. For background on
Gen-ART, please see the FAQ at
<http://wiki.tools.ietf.org/area/gen/trac/wiki/GenArtfaq>.
Please resolve these comments along with any other Last Call comments
you may receive.
Document:  draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-03
Reviewer: Roni Even
Review Date:2017-1-9
IETF LC End Date: 2017–1-19
IESG Telechat date:  

Summary: This draft is ready for publication as an Informational RFC.


Major issues:

Minor issues:


Nits/editorial comments:



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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: "int-area@ietf.org" <int-area@ietf.org>, 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2017 17:33:10 +0000
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Subject: [Int-area] FW: Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Cross-posting onto "int-area" where discussions motivated this work.

-----Original Message-----
From: ipv6 [mailto:ipv6-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Templin, Fred L
Sent: Monday, January 09, 2017 7:51 AM
To: 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
Subject: Route Information Options in Redirect Messages

See below for a new draft that proposes to update RFC4861 and RFC4191 to
permit the inclusion of Route Information Options in Redirect Messages.
This represents a backward-compatible extension to the IPv6 ND Redirect
function. Please review and comment on the list.

Fred
fred.l.templin@boeing.com

-----Original Message-----
From: I-D-Announce [mailto:i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of inte=
rnet-drafts@ietf.org
Sent: Friday, January 06, 2017 1:52 PM
To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
Subject: I-D Action: draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00.txt


A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director=
ies.


        Title           : Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
        Author          : Fred L. Templin
	Filename        : draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00.txt
	Pages           : 5
	Date            : 2017-01-06

Abstract:
   The IPv6 Neighbor Discovery protocol provides a Redirect function
   allowing routers to inform hosts of a better next hop on the link
   toward the destination.  This document specifies a backward-
   compatible extension to the Redirect function to allow routers to
   include forwarding information that the source can associate with the
   next hop.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio=
n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

_______________________________________________
I-D-Announce mailing list
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From: james woodyatt <jhw@google.com>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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On Jan 9, 2017, at 07:51, Templin, Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> =
wrote:
>=20
> See below for a new draft that proposes to update RFC4861 and RFC4191 =
to
> permit the inclusion of Route Information Options in Redirect =
Messages.
> This represents a backward-compatible extension to the IPv6 ND =
Redirect
> function. Please review and comment on the list.
>=20
> <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect>

p1. I=E2=80=99m interested to see what V6OPS will think of this.

p2. Section 3.3, Host Specification says this:

>>    In light of these considerations, a "Type C" host that receives a
>>    Redirect message containing RIOs adopts the combined behaviors of
>>    both of these specifications.  Namely, the host updates its =
neighbor
>>    cache entry for the Target and updates its routing table per the
>>    included RIOs.  If the Destination address is not the unspecified
>>    address, the host further updates its destination cache.
>>=20
>>    Note that "Type A'" and "Type B" hosts ignore any RIOs and process
>>    the Redirect message according to Section 8.3 of [RFC4861].

And I wonder if you have considered the possibility of a =E2=80=9CType =
D=E2=80=9D host, which in my conception would be capable of *only* =
processing RIO options that appear in ND Redirect messages and *not* in =
RA messages. I=E2=80=99m not sure that=E2=80=99s a type of host we want =
to encourage, but the idea of its possibility was one of the first =
things that sprang to mind when I contemplated the reasons why so few =
Type C hosts are currently deployed in the wild after more than a decade =
since RFC 4191 was published.


--james woodyatt <jhw@google.com>




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To: "int-area@ietf.org" <int-area@ietf.org>, Suresh Krishnan <suresh.krishnan@ericsson.com>
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Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2017 19:04:42 +0000
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Subject: [Int-area] [www.ietf.org/rt #149839] IPv10 (Temp. name IPmix)
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Hi Professor Suresh,

Can you please consider the IPv10 I-D in the Internet Area WGs to be discus=
sed further?

Your co-operation in this matter will be highly appreciated.

Best Regards,

Khaled Omar

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<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Professor Suresh,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Can you please consider the IPv10 I-D in the Interne=
t Area WGs to be discussed further?<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Your co-operation in this matter will be highly appr=
eciated.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Best Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Khaled Omar<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</body>
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--_000_HE1PR04MB1449102B9397497B27EC3FA9BD640HE1PR04MB1449eurp_--


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From: Khaled Omar <eng.khaled.omar@hotmail.com>
To: "int-area@ietf.org" <int-area@ietf.org>, Suresh Krishnan <suresh.krishnan@ericsson.com>
Thread-Topic: [www.ietf.org/rt #149839] IPv10 (Temp. name IPmix)
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Subject: [Int-area] [www.ietf.org/rt #149839] IPv10 (Temp. name IPmix)
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Hi Suresh,

You can find the IPv10 I-D through this link:

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-omar-ipv10/

Best Regards,

Khaled Omar

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<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Suresh,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">You can find the IPv10 I-D through this link:<o:p></=
o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-om=
ar-ipv10/">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-omar-ipv10/</a><o:p></o:p=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Best Regards,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Khaled Omar<o:p></o:p></p>
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From nobody Mon Jan  9 11:53:55 2017
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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: james woodyatt <jhw@google.com>, 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>, INT Area <int-area@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Date: Mon, 9 Jan 2017 19:53:36 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>,  INT Area <int-area@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Date: Tue, 10 Jan 2017 17:55:10 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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From: "Christian Huitema" <huitema@huitema.net>
To: "'Templin, Fred L'" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>, "'Brian E Carpenter'" <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, "'6man WG'" <ipv6@ietf.org>, "'INT Area'" <int-area@ietf.org>
References: <b0d15d2e8b3e414abf4e87c60d39e252@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com> <32fbea25-01c9-aa32-e70f-3e1282f56294@gmail.com> <5cd024891c204a9bb37dcc23796c36c6@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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On Tuesday, January 10, 2017 9:55 AM, Fred Templin wrote:
> ... 
> What is being proposed in the document I submitted is the inclusion of
> RIOs in Redirect messages for a *prefix* that is not on-link, as opposed
> to a singleton destination. So, the same SHOULD in the paragraph above
> would seem to apply also to prefix redirection the same as for ordinary
> destination redirection.

Fred, I am reading the security section of your draft. I think it needs a
bit more work.

Currently, the RIO are only expected in router advertisements. RA are
somewhat special, and there is often specific code in switches to check RA
and prevent RA spoofing -- e.g., RA-Guard. Allowing the option in Redirect
messages could very well bypass the RA specific checks. Doesn't that open
the path for new attacks? Should you not say something about that in the
security section? How about specific mitigations, such as sanity checks when
processing redirect messages?

-- Christian Huitema


 



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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: Christian Huitema <huitema@huitema.net>, "'Brian E Carpenter'" <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, "'6man WG'" <ipv6@ietf.org>, "'INT Area'" <int-area@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Hi Christian,

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Christian Huitema [mailto:huitema@huitema.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 11:34 AM
> To: Templin, Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>; 'Brian E Carpenter' <bri=
an.e.carpenter@gmail.com>; '6man WG' <ipv6@ietf.org>;
> 'INT Area' <int-area@ietf.org>
> Subject: RE: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
>=20
> On Tuesday, January 10, 2017 9:55 AM, Fred Templin wrote:
> > ...
> > What is being proposed in the document I submitted is the inclusion of
> > RIOs in Redirect messages for a *prefix* that is not on-link, as oppose=
d
> > to a singleton destination. So, the same SHOULD in the paragraph above
> > would seem to apply also to prefix redirection the same as for ordinary
> > destination redirection.
>=20
> Fred, I am reading the security section of your draft. I think it needs a
> bit more work.
>=20
> Currently, the RIO are only expected in router advertisements. RA are
> somewhat special, and there is often specific code in switches to check R=
A
> and prevent RA spoofing -- e.g., RA-Guard. Allowing the option in Redirec=
t
> messages could very well bypass the RA specific checks. Doesn't that open
> the path for new attacks? Should you not say something about that in the
> security section? How about specific mitigations, such as sanity checks w=
hen
> processing redirect messages?

Since IP will still operate correctly if transmission of Redirect messages =
is
somehow suppressed (i.e., denial of Redirect service), the more serious
threat to be considered is spoofing. Here is what currently appears under
Security Considerations:

   "Security considerations for Redirect messages that include RIOs are
   the same as for any IPv6 ND messages as specified in Section 11 of
   [RFC4861].  Namely, the protocol must take measures to secure IPv6 ND
   messages on links where spoofing attacks are possible.

   A spoofed Redirect message containing no RIOs could cause corruption
   in the host's destination cache while a spoofed Redirect message
   containing RIOs could corrupt the host's routing tables.  While the
   latter would seem to be a more onerous result, the possibility for
   corruption is unacceptable in either case."

So, from the first paragraph, we can see that the protocol must take
measures to secure IPv6 ND messages on links where spoofing attacks
are possible. The second paragraph then analyzes the consequences of
what could happen if a spoofing attack were successful and we see that
there are unacceptable negative consequences for both traditional
Redirects and Redirects that include RIOs.

The text stops short of saying that "no Redirects of any kind should be
used on links where spoofing attacks are possible". Would adding a
statement such as this address the concern?

Thanks - Fred
fred.l.templin@boeing.com


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To: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>, 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>, INT Area <int-area@ietf.org>
References: <b0d15d2e8b3e414abf4e87c60d39e252@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com> <32fbea25-01c9-aa32-e70f-3e1282f56294@gmail.com> <5cd024891c204a9bb37dcc23796c36c6@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com>
From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
Organization: University of Auckland
Message-ID: <e6e32b7c-7ff3-d357-92ee-0beecbbf5705@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2017 15:23:55 +1300
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/int-area/jMyafADMfdXddx5cfw91f2Heh9M>
Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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On 11/01/2017 06:55, Templin, Fred L wrote:
> Hi Brian,
> 
> I am looking at the section that says:
> 
> "3.4.  Redirects
>    There is potential for adverse interaction with any off-link Redirect
>    (Redirect for a destination that is not on-link) message sent by a
>    router in accordance with Section 8 of [RFC4861].  Hosts SHOULD apply
>    off-link redirects only for the specific pair of source and
>    destination addresses concerned, so the host's Destination Cache
>    might need to contain appropriate source-specific entries.  This
>    extends the validity check specified in Section 8.1 of [RFC4861]."
> 
> What is being proposed in the document I submitted is the inclusion of
> RIOs in Redirect messages for a *prefix* that is not on-link, as opposed
> to a singleton destination. So, the same SHOULD in the paragraph above
> would seem to apply also to prefix redirection the same as for ordinary
> destination redirection.

I didn't want to bias your reading, but that was my conclusion too. If
correct, maybe your draft needs to cite RFC8028 and augment it accordingly.

Regards
    Brian

> 
> Thanks - Fred
> fred.l.templin@boeing.com
> 
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Brian E Carpenter [mailto:brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com]
>> Sent: Monday, January 09, 2017 2:08 PM
>> To: Templin, Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>; 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>
>> Subject: Re: Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
>>
>> Fred,
>>
>> Can you check that there would be no adverse interaction with RFC8028,
>> especially https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc8028#section-3.4
>>
>> Regards
>>    Brian
>>
>> On 10/01/2017 04:51, Templin, Fred L wrote:
>>> See below for a new draft that proposes to update RFC4861 and RFC4191 to
>>> permit the inclusion of Route Information Options in Redirect Messages.
>>> This represents a backward-compatible extension to the IPv6 ND Redirect
>>> function. Please review and comment on the list.
>>>
>>> Fred
>>> fred.l.templin@boeing.com
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: I-D-Announce [mailto:i-d-announce-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of internet-drafts@ietf.org
>>> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2017 1:52 PM
>>> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
>>> Subject: I-D Action: draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00.txt
>>>
>>>
>>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
>>>
>>>
>>>         Title           : Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
>>>         Author          : Fred L. Templin
>>> 	Filename        : draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00.txt
>>> 	Pages           : 5
>>> 	Date            : 2017-01-06
>>>
>>> Abstract:
>>>    The IPv6 Neighbor Discovery protocol provides a Redirect function
>>>    allowing routers to inform hosts of a better next hop on the link
>>>    toward the destination.  This document specifies a backward-
>>>    compatible extension to the Redirect function to allow routers to
>>>    include forwarding information that the source can associate with the
>>>    next hop.
>>>
>>>
>>> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect/
>>>
>>> There's also a htmlized version available at:
>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-templin-intarea-rio-redirect-00
>>>
>>>
>>> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
>>> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>>>
>>> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
>>> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> I-D-Announce mailing list
>>> I-D-Announce@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce
>>> Internet-Draft directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html
>>> or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt
>>>
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> IETF IPv6 working group mailing list
>>> ipv6@ietf.org
>>> Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> .
>>>
> 


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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>,  INT Area <int-area@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
Thread-Index: AdJqj8MpX1D7bRpERNaWpSFDneETogAeC3cAABhBxNAAIvXvgAAOSDPg
Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2017 17:14:28 +0000
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References: <b0d15d2e8b3e414abf4e87c60d39e252@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com> <32fbea25-01c9-aa32-e70f-3e1282f56294@gmail.com> <5cd024891c204a9bb37dcc23796c36c6@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com> <e6e32b7c-7ff3-d357-92ee-0beecbbf5705@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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From: Zied Bouziri <zied.bouziri@gmail.com>
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Date: Wed, 11 Jan 2017 22:47:46 +0100
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References: <b0d15d2e8b3e414abf4e87c60d39e252@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com> <32fbea25-01c9-aa32-e70f-3e1282f56294@gmail.com> <5cd024891c204a9bb37dcc23796c36c6@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com> <016f01d26b78$870895a0$9519c0e0$@huitema.net> <6d21dd17f0b94a39a71600944878ec39@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com>
To: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Hi Fred
In section 6 :
"Namely, the protocol must take measures to secure IPv6 ND messages on =
links where spoofing attacks are possible =C2=BB
By reading this passage, I have the impression that there are links =
where attack spoofing is possible and others not !
How can we know if this attack is possible or not in a specified link ?
Thank you=20
Zied

> Le 10 janv. 2017 =C3=A0 22:52, Templin, Fred L =
<Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> a =C3=A9crit :
>=20
> Hi Christian,
>=20
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Christian Huitema [mailto:huitema@huitema.net]
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 11:34 AM
>> To: Templin, Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>; 'Brian E Carpenter' =
<brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>; '6man WG' <ipv6@ietf.org>;
>> 'INT Area' <int-area@ietf.org>
>> Subject: RE: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect =
Messages
>>=20
>> On Tuesday, January 10, 2017 9:55 AM, Fred Templin wrote:
>>> ...
>>> What is being proposed in the document I submitted is the inclusion =
of
>>> RIOs in Redirect messages for a *prefix* that is not on-link, as =
opposed
>>> to a singleton destination. So, the same SHOULD in the paragraph =
above
>>> would seem to apply also to prefix redirection the same as for =
ordinary
>>> destination redirection.
>>=20
>> Fred, I am reading the security section of your draft. I think it =
needs a
>> bit more work.
>>=20
>> Currently, the RIO are only expected in router advertisements. RA are
>> somewhat special, and there is often specific code in switches to =
check RA
>> and prevent RA spoofing -- e.g., RA-Guard. Allowing the option in =
Redirect
>> messages could very well bypass the RA specific checks. Doesn't that =
open
>> the path for new attacks? Should you not say something about that in =
the
>> security section? How about specific mitigations, such as sanity =
checks when
>> processing redirect messages?
>=20
> Since IP will still operate correctly if transmission of Redirect =
messages is
> somehow suppressed (i.e., denial of Redirect service), the more =
serious
> threat to be considered is spoofing. Here is what currently appears =
under
> Security Considerations:
>=20
>   "Security considerations for Redirect messages that include RIOs are
>   the same as for any IPv6 ND messages as specified in Section 11 of
>   [RFC4861].  Namely, the protocol must take measures to secure IPv6 =
ND
>   messages on links where spoofing attacks are possible.
>=20
>   A spoofed Redirect message containing no RIOs could cause corruption
>   in the host's destination cache while a spoofed Redirect message
>   containing RIOs could corrupt the host's routing tables.  While the
>   latter would seem to be a more onerous result, the possibility for
>   corruption is unacceptable in either case."
>=20
> So, from the first paragraph, we can see that the protocol must take
> measures to secure IPv6 ND messages on links where spoofing attacks
> are possible. The second paragraph then analyzes the consequences of
> what could happen if a spoofing attack were successful and we see that
> there are unacceptable negative consequences for both traditional
> Redirects and Redirects that include RIOs.
>=20
> The text stops short of saying that "no Redirects of any kind should =
be
> used on links where spoofing attacks are possible". Would adding a
> statement such as this address the concern?
>=20
> Thanks - Fred
> fred.l.templin@boeing.com
>=20
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> IETF IPv6 working group mailing list
> ipv6@ietf.org
> Administrative Requests: https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6
> --------------------------------------------------------------------

Best Regards, =D9=85=D8=B9 =D8=AA=D8=AD=D9=8A=D8=A7=D8=AA=D9=8A
Zied BOUZIRI=D8=8C =D8=B2=D9=8A=D8=A7=D8=AF =D8=A8=D9=88=D8=B2=D9=8A=D8=B1=
=D9=8A
ISET Charguia, Tunisie
www.bouziri.tn <http://www.bouziri.tn/>

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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">Hi Fred<div class=3D"">In section 6 :</div><div =
class=3D"">"<span style=3D"font-size: 13.333333015441895px;" =
class=3D"">Namely, the protocol must take measures to secure IPv6 =
ND</span><span style=3D"font-size: 13.333333015441895px;" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;messages on links where spoofing attacks are =
possible</span><font size=3D"2" class=3D"">&nbsp;=C2=BB</font></div><div =
class=3D""><font size=3D"2" class=3D"">By reading this passage, I have =
the impression that there are links where attack&nbsp;</font><span =
style=3D"font-size: 13px;" class=3D"">spoofing</span>&nbsp;<span =
style=3D"font-size: small;" class=3D"">is possible and others not =
!</span></div><div class=3D""><font size=3D"2" class=3D"">How can we =
know if this attack is possible or not in a specified link =
?</font></div><div class=3D""><font size=3D"2" class=3D"">Thank =
you&nbsp;</font></div><div class=3D""><font size=3D"2" =
class=3D"">Zied</font></div><div class=3D""><font size=3D"2" =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></font></div><div style=3D""><blockquote =
type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div class=3D"">Le 10 janv. 2017 =C3=A0 22:52, =
Templin, Fred L &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com" =
class=3D"">Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com</a>&gt; a =C3=A9crit :</div><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D"">Hi Christian,<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" =
class=3D"">-----Original Message-----<br class=3D"">From: Christian =
Huitema [<a href=3D"mailto:huitema@huitema.net" =
class=3D"">mailto:huitema@huitema.net</a>]<br class=3D"">Sent: Tuesday, =
January 10, 2017 11:34 AM<br class=3D"">To: Templin, Fred L &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com" =
class=3D"">Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com</a>&gt;; 'Brian E Carpenter' &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com" =
class=3D"">brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com</a>&gt;; '6man WG' &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:ipv6@ietf.org" class=3D"">ipv6@ietf.org</a>&gt;;<br =
class=3D"">'INT Area' &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:int-area@ietf.org" =
class=3D"">int-area@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br class=3D"">Subject: RE: =
[Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages<br =
class=3D""><br class=3D"">On Tuesday, January 10, 2017 9:55 AM, Fred =
Templin wrote:<br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D"">...<br =
class=3D"">What is being proposed in the document I submitted is the =
inclusion of<br class=3D"">RIOs in Redirect messages for a *prefix* that =
is not on-link, as opposed<br class=3D"">to a singleton destination. So, =
the same SHOULD in the paragraph above<br class=3D"">would seem to apply =
also to prefix redirection the same as for ordinary<br =
class=3D"">destination redirection.<br class=3D""></blockquote><br =
class=3D"">Fred, I am reading the security section of your draft. I =
think it needs a<br class=3D"">bit more work.<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">Currently, the RIO are only expected in router =
advertisements. RA are<br class=3D"">somewhat special, and there is =
often specific code in switches to check RA<br class=3D"">and prevent RA =
spoofing -- e.g., RA-Guard. Allowing the option in Redirect<br =
class=3D"">messages could very well bypass the RA specific checks. =
Doesn't that open<br class=3D"">the path for new attacks? Should you not =
say something about that in the<br class=3D"">security section? How =
about specific mitigations, such as sanity checks when<br =
class=3D"">processing redirect messages?<br class=3D""></blockquote><br =
class=3D"">Since IP will still operate correctly if transmission of =
Redirect messages is<br class=3D"">somehow suppressed (i.e., denial of =
Redirect service), the more serious<br class=3D"">threat to be =
considered is spoofing. Here is what currently appears under<br =
class=3D"">Security Considerations:<br class=3D""><br class=3D""> =
&nbsp;&nbsp;"Security considerations for Redirect messages that include =
RIOs are<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;the same as for any IPv6 ND messages =
as specified in Section 11 of<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;[RFC4861]. =
&nbsp;Namely, the protocol must take measures to secure IPv6 ND<br =
class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;messages on links where spoofing attacks are =
possible.<br class=3D""><br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;A spoofed Redirect =
message containing no RIOs could cause corruption<br class=3D""> =
&nbsp;&nbsp;in the host's destination cache while a spoofed Redirect =
message<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;containing RIOs could corrupt the =
host's routing tables. &nbsp;While the<br class=3D""> &nbsp;&nbsp;latter =
would seem to be a more onerous result, the possibility for<br class=3D"">=
 &nbsp;&nbsp;corruption is unacceptable in either case."<br class=3D""><br=
 class=3D"">So, from the first paragraph, we can see that the protocol =
must take<br class=3D"">measures to secure IPv6 ND messages on links =
where spoofing attacks<br class=3D"">are possible. The second paragraph =
then analyzes the consequences of<br class=3D"">what could happen if a =
spoofing attack were successful and we see that<br class=3D"">there are =
unacceptable negative consequences for both traditional<br =
class=3D"">Redirects and Redirects that include RIOs.<br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">The text stops short of saying that "no Redirects of any kind =
should be<br class=3D"">used on links where spoofing attacks are =
possible". Would adding a<br class=3D"">statement such as this address =
the concern?<br class=3D""><br class=3D"">Thanks - Fred<br class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:fred.l.templin@boeing.com" =
class=3D"">fred.l.templin@boeing.com</a><br class=3D""><br =
class=3D"">---------------------------------------------------------------=
-----<br class=3D"">IETF IPv6 working group mailing list<br =
class=3D"">ipv6@ietf.org<br class=3D"">Administrative Requests: =
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ipv6<br =
class=3D"">---------------------------------------------------------------=
-----<br class=3D""></div></blockquote></div><br class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; orphans: =
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div style=3D"color: rgb(34, 34, 34); font-family: arial, =
sans-serif; font-size: small; orphans: 2; widows: 2; background-color: =
rgb(255, 255, 255);" class=3D""><div class=3D""><font color=3D"#0000ff" =
class=3D""><b class=3D"">Best Regards</b></font>,&nbsp;<font =
color=3D"#990000" class=3D""><b class=3D"">=D9=85=D8=B9 =
=D8=AA=D8=AD=D9=8A=D8=A7=D8=AA=D9=8A</b></font></div><div class=3D""><b =
class=3D""><font color=3D"#0000ff" class=3D"">Zied =
BOUZIRI</font></b>=D8=8C&nbsp;<b class=3D""><font color=3D"#990000" =
class=3D"">=D8=B2=D9=8A=D8=A7=D8=AF =D8=A8=D9=88=D8=B2=D9=8A=D8=B1=D9=8A</=
font></b></div><div class=3D"">ISET Charguia, Tunisie</div><div =
class=3D""><a href=3D"http://www.bouziri.tn/" target=3D"_blank" =
style=3D"color: rgb(17, 85, 204);" =
class=3D"">www.bouziri.tn</a></div></div></div>
</div>
<br class=3D""></body></html>=

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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: Zied Bouziri <zied.bouziri@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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From: Tomoyuki Sahara <tsahara@iij.ad.jp>
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To: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Hi, Fred

> If the concern is for backwards compatibility with legacy deployments, =
 the
> proposal honors backwards compatibility per RFC4861. What do you =
think?

=46rom the section 3. of the draft:

      "The contents of the Reserved field, and of any unrecognized
      options, MUST be ignored.  Future, backward-compatible changes to
      the protocol may specify the contents of the Reserved field or add
      new options; "

RIO options in Redirect Message are not "unrecognized" options
but are "not specified to be used with Redirect memssages". The
next pragraph in RFC4861 is better text to be quoted:

   The contents of any defined options that are not specified to be used
   with Redirect messages MUST be ignored and the packet processed as
   normal.  The only defined options that may appear are the Target
   Link-Layer Address option and the Redirected Header option.

   ( https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc4861#page-74 )

Once the draft is published as a RFC, it shall update the second =
sentence.


Thanks,
Tomoyuki


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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: Tomoyuki Sahara <tsahara@iij.ad.jp>
Thread-Topic: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Thank you, Tomoyuki-san. I agree with your observation, and will make the
necessary changes to the draft.

Fred
fred.l.templin@boeing.com

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Tomoyuki Sahara [mailto:tsahara@iij.ad.jp]
> Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2017 11:28 PM
> To: Templin, Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
> Cc: 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>; INT Area <int-area@ietf.org>
> Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
>=20
> Hi, Fred
>=20
> > If the concern is for backwards compatibility with legacy deployments, =
 the
> > proposal honors backwards compatibility per RFC4861. What do you think?
>=20
> From the section 3. of the draft:
>=20
>       "The contents of the Reserved field, and of any unrecognized
>       options, MUST be ignored.  Future, backward-compatible changes to
>       the protocol may specify the contents of the Reserved field or add
>       new options; "
>=20
> RIO options in Redirect Message are not "unrecognized" options
> but are "not specified to be used with Redirect memssages". The
> next pragraph in RFC4861 is better text to be quoted:
>=20
>    The contents of any defined options that are not specified to be used
>    with Redirect messages MUST be ignored and the packet processed as
>    normal.  The only defined options that may appear are the Target
>    Link-Layer Address option and the Redirected Header option.
>=20
>    ( https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc4861#page-74 )
>=20
> Once the draft is published as a RFC, it shall update the second sentence=
.
>=20
>=20
> Thanks,
> Tomoyuki
>=20



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From: Mikael Abrahamsson <swmike@swm.pp.se>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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On Wed, 11 Jan 2017, Templin, Fred L wrote:

> SEND [RFC3971] provides one possible mitigation in other cases.

Is there anything out there that implements SEND? I see Cisco IOS support, 
quick googling didn't yield anything I found that indicated "widely 
supported". Frankly, I don't even understand how it would work in a 
non-tightly-administrated network, with pre-provisioned cyrptographic 
information.

-- 
Mikael Abrahamsson    email: swmike@swm.pp.se


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> > SEND [RFC3971] provides one possible mitigation in other cases.
> 
> Is there anything out there that implements SEND? I see Cisco IOS support, 
> quick googling didn't yield anything I found that indicated "widely 
> supported". Frankly, I don't even understand how it would work in a 
> non-tightly-administrated network, with pre-provisioned cyrptographic 
> information.

- Juniper, at least in JunOS 15.1 and newer for the MX platform.
- Huawei, at least in VRP 8.100 and newer for the NE40 platform.

Note that I haven't checked in exactly which version it was introduced.

(No, we don't use SEND.)

Steinar Haug, AS2116


From nobody Tue Jan 17 11:00:45 2017
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Hi,

I have reviewed the draft. Please see my comments below. Most of them are
nits.

Yours,
Daniel

                 Special-Purpose IP Address Registries
                        draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02


1.  Introduction

   In order to support new protocols and practices, the IETF
   occasionally reserves an address block for a special purpose.  For
   example, [RFC1122] reserves an IPv4 address block (0.0.0.0/8) to
   represent the local (i.e., "this") network.  Likewise, [RFC4291]
   reserves an IPv6 address block (fe80::/10) to represent link-scoped
   unicast addresses.

   The current list of all special-purpose address blocks are described
   in [RFC6890].

 MGLT: I find this sentence confusing. It sounds like a reference to some
definitions of RFC6890, which somehow contradict the fact this document
obsoletes RFC6890.


   However, several issues have been raised with how
   "global" is defined in that document.  Specifically, the definition
   of global provided in [RFC6890] focuses on the prefix's ability to be
   routed globally within the Internet and does not indicate if the
   prefix is globally scoped (i.e., may be routed beyond the local link;
   described as "global unicast" in the IPv6 addressing architecture
   [RFC4291]).

MGLT: I believe the motivation could be more explicitly specified.

I would probably propose something around the lines:
For each special-purpose address block, [RFC6890] defines information
maintained for IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registries. The use of
the "global" information in [RFC6890]  IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose
Address Registries was misleading as it slightly differed from the
generally accepted definition of "global scope", that is the ability by be
forwarded beyond the boundaries of an administrative domain.



   This memo reiterates the assignments made to the IPv4 and IPv6
   Special-Purpose Address Registries and augments the fields contained
   within the registires in order to address the confusion raised by the
   definition of "global".

MGLT: registires/registries

   Furthermore, this memo defines:

   o  a common set of information that the registries will maintain
      regarding each special-purpose address block
   o  a common set of requirements for future entries

   This memo obsoletes [RFC6890].

MGLT: Although this text is from RFC6890, I understand both bullets to be
section 2.2.1 for ("a common set of requirements for future entries") and
section 2.2.2/3 for ("a common set of information that the registries will
maintain regarding each special-purpose address block"). If I am correct,
the bullets are not in the right order. Although English is not my
language, but the use of "furthermore" seems to give the impression the
current draft defines things that have not been defined in RFC6890, rather
than updating RFC6890.

Feel free to ignore the proposal, but It sounds to me clearer to say
something around the lines:

The current document obsoletes RFC6890. It clarifies the definition for
IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registries as well as provides an
updated list of the IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registries.


2.  IANA Considerations

2.1.  Assignment of an IPv4 Address Block to IANA
2.2.  Restructuring of the IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose Address
      Registries
2.2.1.  Information Requirements

      Forwardable - A boolean value indicating whether a router may
      forward an IP datagram whose destination address is drawn from the
      allocated special-purpose address block between external
      interfaces.

MGLT: Should we specify to clarify that Forwardable is set to True whether
the address is forwarded within an administrative domain or between
different administrative domain.

      Reserved-by-Protocol - A boolean value indicating whether the
      special-purpose address block is reserved by IP, itself.  This
      value is "TRUE" if the RFC that created the special-purpose
      address block requires all compliant IP implementations to behave
      in a special way when processing packets either to or from
      addresses contained by the address block.

MGLT: This is not very clear to me. When "Forwardable" is set to False for
one address block, I interpret it as a specific behavior to implement. This
seems not to be the case. My interpretation of the RFC requires is that
there is a MUST in that RFC and it does not seem either to be the case. I
believe that we should clarify when True, False, N/A should be set.


   If the value of "Destination" is FALSE, the values of "Forwardable"
   and "Globally Reachable" must also be false.

MGLT: Maybe this sentence could be placed in the "Destination" information
description.

MGLT: Maybe Source, Destination, Forwardable, Globally Reachable and
Reserved-by-protocol should clearly state when there value is set to True,
False and N/A. I believe that at some point it might help the person
requesting a block to fill the information appropriately.

2.2.2. IPv4 Special-Purpose Address Registry Entries
Table 1 though Table 16,

MGLT: I might be wrong, but I prefer to double check that is not "Table 1
through Table 16" instead.


         +----------------------+-------------------------------+
         | Attribute            | Value                         |
         +----------------------+-------------------------------+
         | Address Block        | 192.88.99.0/24                |
         | Name                 | Deprecated 6to4 Relay Anycast |
         | RFC                  | [RFC7526]                     |
         | Allocation Date      | June 2001                     |
         | Termination Date     | March 2015                    |
         | Source               | N/A                           |
         | Destination          | N/A                           |
         | Forwardable          | N/A                           |
         | Globally Reachable   | N/A                           |
         | Reserved-by-Protocol | N/A                           |
         +----------------------+-------------------------------+

                       Table 10: 6to4 Relay Anycast


MGLT: Maybe some text should be added to specify that a block even expired
remains registered. I assume that some information are set to N/A as the
block has expired. If that is correct, I believe we need a note in section
2.2.1 that explains the rule in as well as its the motivations.


              +----------------------+----------------------+
              | Attribute            | Value                |
              +----------------------+----------------------+
              | Address Block        | 255.255.255.255/32   |
              | Name                 | Limited Broadcast    |
              | RFC                  | [RFC0919], Section 7 |
              | Allocation Date      | October 1984         |
              | Termination Date     | N/A                  |
              | Source               | False                |
              | Destination          | True                 |
              | Forwardable          | False                |
              | Globally Reachable   | False                |
              | Reserved-by-Protocol | True                 |
              +----------------------+----------------------+

                        Table 16: Limited Broadcast

MGLT: RFC6890 set Reserved-by-protocol to False. I believe that
Reserved-by-Protocol should be clearly formulated so we have no doubts on
how to assign such values. In my case, I have not seen MUST in RFC919
although it mentions "The receiving IP must be able to recognize...". Is
that a sufficient reason ?


2.2.3.  IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registry Entries

                 +----------------------+---------------+
                 | Attribute            | Value         |
                 +----------------------+---------------+
                 | Address Block        | 2002::/16 [2] |
                 | Name                 | 6to4          |
                 | RFC                  | [RFC3056]     |
                 | Allocation Date      | February 2001 |
                 | Termination Date     | N/A           |
                 | Source               | True          |
                 | Destination          | True          |
                 | Forwardable          | True          |
                 | Globally Reachable   | N/A [3]       |
                 | Reserved-by-Protocol | False         |
                 +----------------------+---------------+

                              Table 27: 6to4

   [3] See [RFC3056] for details.

MGLT: Maybe we could provide some additional explanation.

On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.net>
wrote:

> All,
>      This version incorporates a feedback from Mike Heard on the
> 255.255.255.255/32 entry.
>
> Regards,
> Brian
>
>
> -------- Forwarded Message --------
> Subject: New Version Notification for draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
> Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 11:52:25 -0700
> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
> To: Ronald Bonica <rbonica@juniper.net>, Michelle Cotton
> <michelle.cotton@icann.org>, Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.net>,
> Leo Vegoda <leo.vegoda@icann.org>, Ron Bonica <rbonica@juniper.net>,
> Michelle S. Cotton <michelle.cotton@icann.org>
>
>
> A new version of I-D, draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
> has been successfully submitted by Brian Haberman and posted to the
> IETF repository.
>
> Name:           draft-bchv-rfc6890bis
> Revision:       02
> Title:          Special-Purpose IP Address Registries
> Document date:  2016-08-26
> Group:          Individual Submission
> Pages:          22
> URL:
> https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
> Status:         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bchv-rfc6890bis/
> Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02
> Diff:           https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02
>
> Abstract:
>    This memo updates the IANA IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registries to
>    address issues raised by the definition of a global prefix.  For
>    completeness, this memo contains all the assignments made by RFC 6890
>    to the IANA Special-Purpose Address Registries.
>
>    This memo obsoletes RFC 6890.
>
>
>
>
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
> submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>
> The IETF Secretariat
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Int-area@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area
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>

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From: james woodyatt <jhw@google.com>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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On Jan 9, 2017, at 11:53, Templin, Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> =
wrote:
> On Monday, January 09, 2017 11:02 AM, james woodyatt <jhw@google.com> =
wrote:
>>=20
>> p2. Section 3.3, Host Specification says this:
>>=20
>>>>   In light of these considerations, a "Type C" host that receives a
>>>>   Redirect message containing RIOs adopts the combined behaviors of
>>>>   both of these specifications.  Namely, the host updates its =
neighbor
>>>>   cache entry for the Target and updates its routing table per the
>>>>   included RIOs.  If the Destination address is not the unspecified
>>>>   address, the host further updates its destination cache.
>>>>=20
>>>>   Note that "Type A'" and "Type B" hosts ignore any RIOs and =
process
>>>>   the Redirect message according to Section 8.3 of [RFC4861].
>>=20
>> And I wonder if you have considered the possibility of a =E2=80=9CType =
D=E2=80=9D host, which in my conception would be capable of *only* =
processing
>> RIO options that appear in ND Redirect messages and *not* in RA =
messages.
>=20
> Had not considered that, but I don't see a problem with it. FWIW, the =
'Type A/B/C' comes from RFC4191 in case others are wondering.
>=20
>> I=E2=80=99m not sure that=E2=80=99s a type of host we want to =
encourage,
>> but the idea of its possibility was one of the first things that =
sprang to mind when I contemplated the reasons why so few Type C hosts
>> are currently deployed in the wild after more than a decade since RFC =
4191 was published.
>=20
> I am interested in usage inside of a managed network, and not so much =
about
> deployment in the wild. Inside of a managed network, the network =
administrators
> could enable this function among the deployed hosts to provide the =
network with
> a means to manage routing information for more-specific routes.

Yes, well, as you might imagine, I=E2=80=99m interested in behavior of =
commodity hosts on unmanaged networks.

As far as I know, the most common types of commodity host =
implementations are Type B at this point. Yes, I know at least one has a =
configurable option to enable Type C behavior, but Type B is the =
default, and it=E2=80=99s also rarely changed in managed host =
configurations for mobile workstations and personal devices.

I believe host implementations have not adopted Type C default behavior =
because of security concerns on unmanaged networks like public Wi-Fi =
hotspots, where the damage potentially caused by so-called =E2=80=9Crogue =
routers=E2=80=9D is already perceived to be unacceptably high. The =
theory being that adding support for processing RIO options would =
further lower the network costs of mounting such attacks, in exchange =
for a questionably valuable route optimization from hosts to possibly =
illegitimate routers. I=E2=80=99m not a big fan of this line of =
reasoning, but I=E2=80=99ve often seen it used to counter arguments that =
adding default Type C behavior would be a good idea.

A better argument against RIO options in RA Messages, as far as I=E2=80=99=
m concerned, is that RA Guard [RFC6105] functions are often deployed in =
L2 switching fabrics, and they=E2=80=99ll drop all the RA Messages from =
most routers other than the protected default routers, which are likely =
to be the ones advertising more specific routes. With ND Redirect =
Messages, network operators can still have a reasonable assurance that =
hosts never update their routing tables except at the initiation of one =
of the legitimate default routers, which are protected by RA Guard.

In light of that, I would suggest defining two new types of behavior, =
which would permit implementers to continue resisting the adoption of =
Type C by default, yet would allow them to add support for processing =
RIO options just in ND Redirect messages and not RA messages. Call that =
a Type D host, and call the functional combination Type C+D or =
something.

Here is my proposed text for Section 3.3 Host Specification.

>>> The Host Specification follows Section 8.3 of Neighbor Discovery for =
IP version 6 (IPv6) [RFC4861], Section 3 of Default Router Preferences =
and More-Specific Routes [RFC4191], and Section 3 of First-Hop Router =
Selection by Hosts in a Multi-Prefix Network [RFC8028]. According to =
[RFC4861], a host that receives a valid ND Redirect message updates its =
destination cache per the Destination information and its neighbor cache =
per the Target information. According to [RFC4191], a =E2=80=9CType C=E2=80=
=9D host that receives a valid RA message updates its routing table per =
the RIO elements included in the message. Finally, according to =
[RFC8028], a =E2=80=9CType C=E2=80=9D host operating on a Multi-Prefix =
Network with multiple default routes can make source address selection =
decisions based on information in its route table decorated with =
information derived from the source of the RIO element.
>>>=20
>>> In light of these considerations, this document introduces a new =
=E2=80=9CType D=E2=80=9D behavior for hosts with the same kind of =
routing table as a =E2=80=9CType C=E2=80=9D host, but which processes =
RIO elements in ND Redirect Messages according to this specification =
instead of RA Messages as in RFC 4191. Hosts that process RIO elements =
in both RA messages and ND Redirect Messages are said to have =E2=80=9CTyp=
e C+D=E2=80=9D behavior.
>>>=20
>>> In both the =E2=80=9CType D=E2=80=9D and =E2=80=9CType C+D=E2=80=9D =
cases, hosts process ND Redirect Messages by updating 1) their neighbor =
cache per the Target information, 2) their destination cache per the =
Destination information when the Destination Address field is not the =
unspecified address, and 3) their routing tables per any RIO elements =
present.
>>>=20
>>> RIO elements in RA Messages are processed by =E2=80=9CType D=E2=80=9D =
hosts in the same way that =E2=80=9CType B=E2=80=9D hosts process them, =
i.e. by ignoring them. In =E2=80=9CType C+D=E2=80=9D hosts, RIO elements =
in RA messages are processed in the same way that =E2=80=9CType C=E2=80=9D=
 hosts process them.
>>>=20
>>> In the all the cases where hosts process RIO elements, i.e. in RA =
Messages or in ND Redirect Messages or in both, hosts MAY make source =
address selection decisions, as in [RFC8028], based on their route =
tables decorated with information derived from the sources of received =
RIO elements.
>>>=20
>>> The behaviors of =E2=80=9CType A,=E2=80=9D =E2=80=9CType B=E2=80=9D =
and =E2=80=9CType C=E2=80=9D hosts are not changed by this =
specification. In particular, they all process ND Redirect Messages =
according to Section 8.3 of [RFC4861].


--james woodyatt <jhw@google.com>




From nobody Wed Jan 18 08:44:30 2017
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From: "Templin, Fred L" <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com>
To: james woodyatt <jhw@google.com>, 6man WG <ipv6@ietf.org>, INT Area <int-area@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Route Information Options in Redirect Messages
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From: james woodyatt <jhw@google.com>
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References: <b0d15d2e8b3e414abf4e87c60d39e252@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com> <AEE70A51-720C-4957-AA1C-8D213EB366D8@google.com> <d12b5166bf0b41f1b85021f6e1410b16@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com> <C746D8F4-C8EC-445A-BD42-928522590C8A@google.com> <d4a4753d9a3d41e1bbfb2400283574a4@XCH15-06-08.nw.nos.boeing.com>
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On Jan 18, 2017, at 08:44, Templin, Fred L <Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com> =
wrote:
>=20
> This all sounds good. How would you feel about having this text show =
up in the next draft version (and be included as a co-author)?


Thank you for inviting me to be a co-author! Yes, I would be happy to =
accept. Please sign me up.


--james woodyatt <jhw@google.com <mailto:jhw@google.com>>




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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dus-ascii"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D"">On Jan 18, 2017, at 08:44, Templin, Fred L &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com" =
class=3D"">Fred.L.Templin@boeing.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br =
class=3D""><div><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><div class=3D""><span =
style=3D"font-family: Menlo-Regular; font-size: 11px; font-style: =
normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: =
normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none; display: inline =
!important;" class=3D"">This all sounds good. How would you feel about =
having this text show up&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-family: =
Menlo-Regular; font-size: 11px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: =
normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; =
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: =
normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; =
float: none; display: inline !important;" class=3D"">in the next draft =
version (and be included as a =
co-author)?</span></div></blockquote></div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">Thank you for inviting me to be a =
co-author! Yes, I would be happy to accept. Please sign me up.</div><div =
class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">--james woodyatt &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jhw@google.com" =
class=3D"">jhw@google.com</a>&gt;</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">

</div>
<br class=3D""></body></html>=

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From nobody Thu Jan 19 08:37:06 2017
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FYI. Marc. (sorry for duplicates)
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Subject: [Int-area] WG Adoption Call: IP over Intentionally Partitioned Links
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Dear all,

We would like to start a WG adoption call for =
draft-nordmark-intarea-ippl-05 ("IP over Intentionally Partitioned =
Links=E2=80=9D).
Please indicate your preferences on the mailling list. The deadline is =
Februray 3rd.


Regards,

JC & Wassim





--Apple-Mail=_2BF801C8-E3BD-4EB8-A589-5CC833D7615C
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">Dear all,</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">We would like to start a WG adoption =
call for <u class=3D"">draft-nordmark-intarea-ippl-05</u> ("IP over =
Intentionally Partitioned Links=E2=80=9D).</div><div class=3D""><div =
class=3D"">Please indicate your preferences on the mailling list. The =
deadline is Februray 3rd.</div><div class=3D""><br class=3D""></div><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; orphans: =
auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; =
white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" =
class=3D""><div class=3D"">Regards,</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div><div class=3D"">JC &amp; Wassim</div><div class=3D""><br =
class=3D""></div></div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><br =
class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">

</div>
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From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
To: Wassim Haddad <wassim.haddad@ericsson.com>
Thread-Topic: [Int-area] WG Adoption Call: IP over Intentionally Partitioned Links
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Dear Wassim

I support the adoption. The problem is getting more clear and present as ne=
w technologies are introduced that include radio, mobility and multi link s=
ubnets.

Regards,

Pascal

Le 19 janv. 2017 ? 22:38, Wassim Haddad <wassim.haddad@ericsson.com<mailto:=
wassim.haddad@ericsson.com>> a ?crit :

Dear all,

We would like to start a WG adoption call for draft-nordmark-intarea-ippl-0=
5 ("IP over Intentionally Partitioned Links").
Please indicate your preferences on the mailling list. The deadline is Febr=
uray 3rd.


Regards,

JC & Wassim




_______________________________________________
Int-area mailing list
Int-area@ietf.org<mailto:Int-area@ietf.org>
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area

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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dus-ascii"=
>
</head>
<body dir=3D"auto">
<div>Dear Wassim&nbsp;</div>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature"><br>
</div>
<div id=3D"AppleMailSignature">I support the adoption. The problem is getti=
ng more clear and present as new technologies are introduced that include r=
adio, mobility and multi link subnets.<br>
<div><br>
</div>
Regards,
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Pascal</div>
</div>
<div><br>
Le 19 janv. 2017 &agrave; 22:38, Wassim Haddad &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:wassim=
.haddad@ericsson.com">wassim.haddad@ericsson.com</a>&gt; a &eacute;crit&nbs=
p;:<br>
<br>
</div>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div>
<div class=3D"">Dear all,</div>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
<div class=3D"">We would like to start a WG adoption call for <u class=3D""=
>draft-nordmark-intarea-ippl-05</u> (&quot;IP over Intentionally Partitione=
d Links&#8221;).</div>
<div class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">Please indicate your preferences on the mailling list. The =
deadline is Februray 3rd.</div>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
<br class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; t=
ext-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: norm=
al; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; word-w=
rap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-=
space;" class=3D"">
<div class=3D"">Regards,</div>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
<div class=3D"">JC &amp; Wassim</div>
<div class=3D""><br class=3D"">
</div>
</div>
<br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
<br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline">
</div>
<br class=3D"">
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<blockquote type=3D"cite">
<div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br>
<span>Int-area mailing list</span><br>
<span><a href=3D"mailto:Int-area@ietf.org">Int-area@ietf.org</a></span><br>
<span><a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area">https://ww=
w.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area</a></span><br>
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From nobody Fri Jan 20 09:14:29 2017
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From: Erik Nordmark <nordmark@sonic.net>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] WG Adoption Call: IP over Intentionally Partitioned Links
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Note that the document is only 7.5 pages of content (plus references and 
boiler plate).
So if you haven't read it yet, it is a quick read.

Thanks,
    Erik


On 1/19/17 1:39 PM, Wassim Haddad wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> We would like to start a WG adoption call for 
> _draft-nordmark-intarea-ippl-05_ ("IP over Intentionally Partitioned 
> Links”).
> Please indicate your preferences on the mailling list. The deadline is 
> Februray 3rd.
>
>
> Regards,
>
> JC & Wassim
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Int-area mailing list
> Int-area@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area



From nobody Mon Jan 23 18:48:53 2017
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Subject: [Int-area] I-D Action: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Internet Area Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : Current Hostname Practice Considered Harmful
        Authors         : Christian Huitema
                          Dave Thaler
                          Rolf Winter
	Filename        : draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04.txt
	Pages           : 11
	Date            : 2017-01-23

Abstract:
   Giving a hostname to your computer and publishing it as you roam from
   one network to another is the Internet equivalent of walking around
   with a name tag affixed to your lapel.  This current practice can
   significantly compromise your privacy, and something should change in
   order to mitigate these privacy threats.

   There are several possible remedies, such as fixing a variety of
   protocols or avoiding disclosing a hostname at all.  This document
   describes some of the protocols that reveal hostnames today and
   sketches another possible remedy, which is to replace static
   hostnames by frequently changing randomized values.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Tue Jan 24 18:25:12 2017
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From: Leo Vegoda <leo.vegoda@icann.org>
To: Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.net>, Daniel Migault <daniel.migault@ericsson.com>, "draft-bchv-rfc6890bis@ietf.org" <draft-bchv-rfc6890bis@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Ext] Re: [Int-area] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
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Date: Wed, 25 Jan 2017 02:25:07 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] [Ext] Re: Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
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Hi,

Brian Haberman wrote:

[...]

> >          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
> >          | Attribute            | Value                         |
> >          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
> >          | Address Block        | 192.88.99.0/24                |
> >          | Name                 | Deprecated 6to4 Relay Anycast |
> >          | RFC                  | [RFC7526]                     |
> >          | Allocation Date      | June 2001                     |
> >          | Termination Date     | March 2015                    |
> >          | Source               | N/A                           |
> >          | Destination          | N/A                           |
> >          | Forwardable          | N/A                           |
> >          | Globally Reachable   | N/A                           |
> >          | Reserved-by-Protocol | N/A                           |
> >          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
> >
> >                        Table 10: 6to4 Relay Anycast
> >
> >
> > MGLT: Maybe some text should be added to specify that a block even
> > expired remains registered. I assume that some information are set to
> > N/A as the block has expired. If that is correct, I believe we need a
> > note in section
> > 2.2.1 that explains the rule in as well as its the motivations.
>
> I think that relates to how IANA manages the block.
>
> Michelle or Leo?

This registry is already quite wide and detailed. Adding additional text 
within the registry entry might make it difficult for readers to get a 
complete view of the registry without a particularly wide screen. Instead, 
perhaps we could add a footnote that paraphrases the last sentence of the IC 
section from RFC 7526:

7.  IANA Considerations

   The document creating the "IANA IPv4 Special-Purpose Address
   Registry" [RFC6890] included the 6to4 Relay Anycast prefix
   (192.88.99.0/24) as Table 10.  Per this document, IANA has marked the
   192.88.99.0/24 prefix (originally defined by [RFC3068]) as
   "Deprecated (6to4 Relay Anycast)" and added a reference to this RFC.
   The Boolean values for the address block 192.88.99.0/24 have been
   removed.  Redelegation of this prefix for any use requires
   justification via an IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].

Does that approach work for people? Does this need to be specified in the 
document updating this registry?

Kind regards,

Leo

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From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] [Ext] Re: Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
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On 25/01/2017 15:25, Leo Vegoda wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> Brian Haberman wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
>>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>>>          | Attribute            | Value                         |
>>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>>>          | Address Block        | 192.88.99.0/24                |
>>>          | Name                 | Deprecated 6to4 Relay Anycast |
>>>          | RFC                  | [RFC7526]                     |
>>>          | Allocation Date      | June 2001                     |
>>>          | Termination Date     | March 2015                    |
>>>          | Source               | N/A                           |
>>>          | Destination          | N/A                           |
>>>          | Forwardable          | N/A                           |
>>>          | Globally Reachable   | N/A                           |
>>>          | Reserved-by-Protocol | N/A                           |
>>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>>>
>>>                        Table 10: 6to4 Relay Anycast
>>>
>>>
>>> MGLT: Maybe some text should be added to specify that a block even
>>> expired remains registered. I assume that some information are set to
>>> N/A as the block has expired. If that is correct, I believe we need a
>>> note in section
>>> 2.2.1 that explains the rule in as well as its the motivations.
>>
>> I think that relates to how IANA manages the block.
>>
>> Michelle or Leo?
> 
> This registry is already quite wide and detailed. Adding additional text 
> within the registry entry might make it difficult for readers to get a 
> complete view of the registry without a particularly wide screen. Instead, 
> perhaps we could add a footnote that paraphrases the last sentence of the IC 
> section from RFC 7526:
> 
> 7.  IANA Considerations
> 
>    The document creating the "IANA IPv4 Special-Purpose Address
>    Registry" [RFC6890] included the 6to4 Relay Anycast prefix
>    (192.88.99.0/24) as Table 10.  Per this document, IANA has marked the
>    192.88.99.0/24 prefix (originally defined by [RFC3068]) as
>    "Deprecated (6to4 Relay Anycast)" and added a reference to this RFC.
>    The Boolean values for the address block 192.88.99.0/24 have been
>    removed.  Redelegation of this prefix for any use requires
>    justification via an IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].
> 
> Does that approach work for people? Does this need to be specified in the 
> document updating this registry?

Hmm. Paraphrasing is always a risk - citing the exact text is safer. Or perhaps
include a definition of 'deprecated' even though it is only used once.

Something like:

An address block marked as Deprecated remains reserved and might still
be in operational use. It should not be used in new deployments and
must not be redelegated except by IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].

    Brian


From nobody Wed Jan 25 05:28:26 2017
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From: Lionel Morand <lionel.morand@orange.com>
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Cc: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice.all@ietf.org, int-area@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org
Subject: [Int-area] Review of draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
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Reviewer: Lionel Morand
Review result: Ready

I have reviewed this document as part of the Operational directorate's
ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
IESG.  These comments were written with the intent of improving the
operational aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that are not
addressed in last call may be included in AD reviews during the IESG
review.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat these comments
just like any other last call comments.

Document: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
Category: Informational
  
Summary:   This document describes some of the protocols that leak
hostnames e.g. DHCP, DNS, mDNS. To solve this problem, this document
proposes to investigate the use of randomized hostnames instead of
static hostnames to overcome the existing privacy issues with hostname
leaking.
    
Main feedback:

This document is ready for publication. The document is simple,
well-written, with a clear and simple argumentation. It does not
promote a specific technical solution but advocates for further
investigations on the use of randomized hostnames instead of static
hostnames.

Very minor comments below.

********************************************************

1)  In the section 1.  Introduction

   There is a long established practice of giving names to computers.
   In the Internet protocols, these names are referred to as
"hostnames"
   [RFC7719] .  Hostnames are normally used in conjunction with a
domain
   name suffix to build the "Fully Qualified Domain Name" (FQDN) of a
   host.

[LM] it would be great if someone could also find a reference for the
definition of FQDN. For IETFer, it seems obvious but from the outside
world, it is not so crystal clear. Not related to this draft but it
could help.

2)  In the section 4.5.  DNS-Based Service Discovery

   Participating hosts publish a service described by an "instance
   name," typically chosen by the user responsible for the
publication.

[LM]

s/by an "instance name," typically/ by an "instance name", typically
(--> coma out of the quotes)

3)  Last paragraph of section 5


   Some operating systems, including Windows, support "per network"
   hostnames, but some other operating systems only support "global"
   hostnames.  In that case, changing the hostname may be difficult
if
   the host is multi-homed, as the same name will be used on several
   networks.  Other operating systems already use potentially
different
   hostnames for different purposes, which might be a good model to
   combine both static hostnames and randomized hostnames based on
their
   potential use and threat to a user's privacy.  Obviously, further
   studies are required before the idea of randomized hostnames can
be
   implemented.

[LM] I would have put the last sentence of this paragraph in a
following stand-alone paragraph, as it is the general conclusion of
this section and of the document.


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Cc: int-area@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Int-area] Review of draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
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Lionel

On FQDN, would RFC1983 do?

Tom Petch

----- Original Message -----
From: "Lionel Morand" <lionel.morand@orange.com>
To: <ops-dir@ietf.org>
Cc: <draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice.all@ietf.org>;
<int-area@ietf.org>; <ietf@ietf.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2017 1:28 PM
> Reviewer: Lionel Morand
> Review result: Ready
>
> I have reviewed this document as part of the Operational directorate's
> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
> IESG.  These comments were written with the intent of improving the
> operational aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that are not
> addressed in last call may be included in AD reviews during the IESG
> review.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat these comments
> just like any other last call comments.
>
> Document: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
> Category: Informational
>
> Summary:   This document describes some of the protocols that leak
> hostnames e.g. DHCP, DNS, mDNS. To solve this problem, this document
> proposes to investigate the use of randomized hostnames instead of
> static hostnames to overcome the existing privacy issues with hostname
> leaking.
>
> Main feedback:
>
> This document is ready for publication. The document is simple,
> well-written, with a clear and simple argumentation. It does not
> promote a specific technical solution but advocates for further
> investigations on the use of randomized hostnames instead of static
> hostnames.
>
> Very minor comments below.
>
> ********************************************************
>
> 1)  In the section 1.  Introduction
>
>    There is a long established practice of giving names to computers.
>    In the Internet protocols, these names are referred to as
> "hostnames"
>    [RFC7719] .  Hostnames are normally used in conjunction with a
> domain
>    name suffix to build the "Fully Qualified Domain Name" (FQDN) of a
>    host.
>
> [LM] it would be great if someone could also find a reference for the
> definition of FQDN. For IETFer, it seems obvious but from the outside
> world, it is not so crystal clear. Not related to this draft but it
> could help.
>
> 2)  In the section 4.5.  DNS-Based Service Discovery
>
>    Participating hosts publish a service described by an "instance
>    name," typically chosen by the user responsible for the
> publication.
>
> [LM]
>
> s/by an "instance name," typically/ by an "instance name", typically
> (--> coma out of the quotes)
>
> 3)  Last paragraph of section 5
>
>
>    Some operating systems, including Windows, support "per network"
>    hostnames, but some other operating systems only support "global"
>    hostnames.  In that case, changing the hostname may be difficult
> if
>    the host is multi-homed, as the same name will be used on several
>    networks.  Other operating systems already use potentially
> different
>    hostnames for different purposes, which might be a good model to
>    combine both static hostnames and randomized hostnames based on
> their
>    potential use and threat to a user's privacy.  Obviously, further
>    studies are required before the idea of randomized hostnames can
> be
>    implemented.
>
> [LM] I would have put the last sentence of this paragraph in a
> following stand-alone paragraph, as it is the general conclusion of
> this section and of the document.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Int-area mailing list
> Int-area@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area


From nobody Wed Jan 25 16:06:21 2017
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From: <lionel.morand@orange.com>
To: t.petch <ietfc@btconnect.com>, "ops-dir@ietf.org" <ops-dir@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Int-area] Review of draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
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Hi Tom,

The definition in RFC 1594 was far better.

      A Fully Qualified Domain Name (FQDN) is a domain name that
      includes all higher level domains relevant to the entity named.
      If you think of the DNS as a tree-structure with each node having
      its own label, a Fully Qualified Domain Name for a specific node
      would be its label followed by the labels of all the other nodes
      between it and the root of the tree.  For example, for a host, a
      FQDN would include the string that identifies the particular host,
      plus all domains of which the host is a part up to and including
      the top-level domain (the root domain is always null).  For
      example, atlas.arc.nasa.gov is a Fully Qualified Domain Name for
      the host at 128.102.128.50.  In addition, arc.nasa.gov is the FQDN
      for the Ames Research Center (ARC) domain under nasa.gov.

Unfortunately, this definition has disappeared in the RFC 2664 that has obs=
oleted RFC 1594.
After investigation, I have failed to find a correct reference for the defi=
nition in IETF documentation... which is weird, isn't it?

As I said, this comment is a minor one and its applicability is broader tha=
n the scope of the present draft. It is not intended to block its publicati=
on.

Regards,

Lionel

> -----Message d'origine-----
> De=A0: t.petch [mailto:ietfc@btconnect.com]
> Envoy=E9=A0: mercredi 25 janvier 2017 18:46
> =C0=A0: MORAND Lionel IMT/OLN; ops-dir@ietf.org
> Cc=A0: int-area@ietf.org
> Objet=A0: Re: [Int-area] Review of draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
>=20
> Lionel
>=20
> On FQDN, would RFC1983 do?
>=20
> Tom Petch
>=20
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Lionel Morand" <lionel.morand@orange.com>
> To: <ops-dir@ietf.org>
> Cc: <draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice.all@ietf.org>;
> <int-area@ietf.org>; <ietf@ietf.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2017 1:28 PM
> > Reviewer: Lionel Morand
> > Review result: Ready
> >
> > I have reviewed this document as part of the Operational directorate's
> > ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
> > IESG.  These comments were written with the intent of improving the
> > operational aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that are not
> > addressed in last call may be included in AD reviews during the IESG
> > review.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat these comments
> > just like any other last call comments.
> >
> > Document: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
> > Category: Informational
> >
> > Summary:   This document describes some of the protocols that leak
> > hostnames e.g. DHCP, DNS, mDNS. To solve this problem, this document
> > proposes to investigate the use of randomized hostnames instead of
> > static hostnames to overcome the existing privacy issues with hostname
> > leaking.
> >
> > Main feedback:
> >
> > This document is ready for publication. The document is simple,
> > well-written, with a clear and simple argumentation. It does not
> > promote a specific technical solution but advocates for further
> > investigations on the use of randomized hostnames instead of static
> > hostnames.
> >
> > Very minor comments below.
> >
> > ********************************************************
> >
> > 1)  In the section 1.  Introduction
> >
> >    There is a long established practice of giving names to computers.
> >    In the Internet protocols, these names are referred to as
> > "hostnames"
> >    [RFC7719] .  Hostnames are normally used in conjunction with a
> > domain
> >    name suffix to build the "Fully Qualified Domain Name" (FQDN) of a
> >    host.
> >
> > [LM] it would be great if someone could also find a reference for the
> > definition of FQDN. For IETFer, it seems obvious but from the outside
> > world, it is not so crystal clear. Not related to this draft but it
> > could help.
> >
> > 2)  In the section 4.5.  DNS-Based Service Discovery
> >
> >    Participating hosts publish a service described by an "instance
> >    name," typically chosen by the user responsible for the
> > publication.
> >
> > [LM]
> >
> > s/by an "instance name," typically/ by an "instance name", typically
> > (--> coma out of the quotes)
> >
> > 3)  Last paragraph of section 5
> >
> >
> >    Some operating systems, including Windows, support "per network"
> >    hostnames, but some other operating systems only support "global"
> >    hostnames.  In that case, changing the hostname may be difficult if
> >    the host is multi-homed, as the same name will be used on several
> >    networks.  Other operating systems already use potentially
> > different
> >    hostnames for different purposes, which might be a good model to
> >    combine both static hostnames and randomized hostnames based on
> > their
> >    potential use and threat to a user's privacy.  Obviously, further
> >    studies are required before the idea of randomized hostnames can be
> >    implemented.
> >
> > [LM] I would have put the last sentence of this paragraph in a
> > following stand-alone paragraph, as it is the general conclusion of
> > this section and of the document.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Int-area mailing list
> > Int-area@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area


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From: Richard Li <renwei.li@huawei.com>
To: "int-area@ietf.org" <int-area@ietf.org>, Wassim Haddad <wassim.haddad@ericsson.com>
Thread-Topic: [Int-area] WG Adoption Call: IP over Intentionally Partitioned Links
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Date: Thu, 26 Jan 2017 00:09:31 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] WG Adoption Call: IP over Intentionally Partitioned Links
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] Review of draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
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On 1/25/2017 2:06 PM, lionel.morand@orange.com wrote:
> Hi Tom,
>
> The definition in RFC 1594 was far better.
>
>       A Fully Qualified Domain Name (FQDN) is a domain name that
>       includes all higher level domains relevant to the entity named.
>       If you think of the DNS as a tree-structure with each node having=

>       its own label, a Fully Qualified Domain Name for a specific node
>       would be its label followed by the labels of all the other nodes
>       between it and the root of the tree.  For example, for a host, a
>       FQDN would include the string that identifies the particular host=
,
>       plus all domains of which the host is a part up to and including
>       the top-level domain (the root domain is always null).  For
>       example, atlas.arc.nasa.gov is a Fully Qualified Domain Name for
>       the host at 128.102.128.50.  In addition, arc.nasa.gov is the FQD=
N
>       for the Ames Research Center (ARC) domain under nasa.gov.
>
> Unfortunately, this definition has disappeared in the RFC 2664 that has=
 obsoleted RFC 1594.
> After investigation, I have failed to find a correct reference for the =
definition in IETF documentation... which is weird, isn't it?
I will add a reference to RFC 1983. Better than chasing which RFC is
obsolete.

> As I said, this comment is a minor one and its applicability is broader=
 than the scope of the present draft. It is not intended to block its pub=
lication.
>
> Regards,
>
> Lionel
>
>> -----Message d'origine-----
>> De : t.petch [mailto:ietfc@btconnect.com]
>> Envoy=E9 : mercredi 25 janvier 2017 18:46
>> =C0 : MORAND Lionel IMT/OLN; ops-dir@ietf.org
>> Cc : int-area@ietf.org
>> Objet : Re: [Int-area] Review of draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-=
04
>>
>> Lionel
>>
>> On FQDN, would RFC1983 do?
>>
>> Tom Petch
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Lionel Morand" <lionel.morand@orange.com>
>> To: <ops-dir@ietf.org>
>> Cc: <draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice.all@ietf.org>;
>> <int-area@ietf.org>; <ietf@ietf.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, January 25, 2017 1:28 PM
>>> Reviewer: Lionel Morand
>>> Review result: Ready
>>>
>>> I have reviewed this document as part of the Operational directorate'=
s
>>> ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the
>>> IESG.  These comments were written with the intent of improving the
>>> operational aspects of the IETF drafts. Comments that are not
>>> addressed in last call may be included in AD reviews during the IESG
>>> review.  Document editors and WG chairs should treat these comments
>>> just like any other last call comments.
>>>
>>> Document: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
>>> Category: Informational
>>>
>>> Summary:   This document describes some of the protocols that leak
>>> hostnames e.g. DHCP, DNS, mDNS. To solve this problem, this document
>>> proposes to investigate the use of randomized hostnames instead of
>>> static hostnames to overcome the existing privacy issues with hostnam=
e
>>> leaking.
>>>
>>> Main feedback:
>>>
>>> This document is ready for publication. The document is simple,
>>> well-written, with a clear and simple argumentation. It does not
>>> promote a specific technical solution but advocates for further
>>> investigations on the use of randomized hostnames instead of static
>>> hostnames.
>>>
>>> Very minor comments below.
>>>
>>> ********************************************************
>>>
>>> 1)  In the section 1.  Introduction
>>>
>>>    There is a long established practice of giving names to computers.=

>>>    In the Internet protocols, these names are referred to as
>>> "hostnames"
>>>    [RFC7719] .  Hostnames are normally used in conjunction with a
>>> domain
>>>    name suffix to build the "Fully Qualified Domain Name" (FQDN) of a=

>>>    host.
>>>
>>> [LM] it would be great if someone could also find a reference for the=

>>> definition of FQDN. For IETFer, it seems obvious but from the outside=

>>> world, it is not so crystal clear. Not related to this draft but it
>>> could help.
Hopefully, RFC 1983 is clear enough.
>>> 2)  In the section 4.5.  DNS-Based Service Discovery
>>>
>>>    Participating hosts publish a service described by an "instance
>>>    name," typically chosen by the user responsible for the
>>> publication.
>>>
>>> [LM]
>>>
>>> s/by an "instance name," typically/ by an "instance name", typically
>>> (--> coma out of the quotes)
Yes. The RFC Editor will want that...
>>> 3)  Last paragraph of section 5
>>>
>>>
>>>    Some operating systems, including Windows, support "per network"
>>>    hostnames, but some other operating systems only support "global"
>>>    hostnames.  In that case, changing the hostname may be difficult i=
f
>>>    the host is multi-homed, as the same name will be used on several
>>>    networks.  Other operating systems already use potentially
>>> different
>>>    hostnames for different purposes, which might be a good model to
>>>    combine both static hostnames and randomized hostnames based on
>>> their
>>>    potential use and threat to a user's privacy.  Obviously, further
>>>    studies are required before the idea of randomized hostnames can b=
e
>>>    implemented.
>>>
>>> [LM] I would have put the last sentence of this paragraph in a
>>> following stand-alone paragraph, as it is the general conclusion of
>>> this section and of the document.
OK, will do.

-- Christian Huitema


From nobody Thu Jan 26 10:19:52 2017
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To: Richard Li <renwei.li@huawei.com>, "int-area@ietf.org" <int-area@ietf.org>, Wassim Haddad <wassim.haddad@ericsson.com>
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Subject: Re: [Int-area] WG Adoption Call: IP over Intentionally Partitioned Links
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On 1/25/17 4:09 PM, Richard Li wrote:
>
> Authors:
>
> Do you intend to specify a standard or provide some information about 
> the implementation?
>

Richard,

I'm not sure I understand your question.

The draft specifies constraints on an implementation (with some MUST and 
SHOULD) for both the L2 partitioning layer and for IP running over this 
partitioned L2. That makes it a standard.
Note that in general it is a bad idea to standardize specific behavior 
since we want to allow implementations to try different things.
FWIW I've been bitten by this in the past with the IPv6 NUD standard 
being far to prescriptive with retransmission behaviors so we had to 
make an additional standards-track RFC relaxing the behavior.

> Another question：Assuming your router supports L2VPN or its 
> equivalent, can L2VPN solve your problem?
>

If L2VPN is used to create a fully connected L2 network, then the L2VPN 
link would not be partitioned. Hence you wouldn't need the IPPL handling 
in that case. (But I imagine L2VPN could be used to create a partitially 
partitioned link as well.)

But that doesn't mean that L2VPN would solve the problem people set up 
to solve when they created split horizon for DSL or PVLAN for Ethernets.

We just need to make sure IPv4 and IPv6 can run reliably on such 
partitioned links.

Does that answer your question?

Thanks,
    Erik

> Thanks,
>
> Richard
>
> *From:*Int-area [mailto:int-area-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of 
> *Wassim Haddad
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 19, 2017 1:39 PM
> *To:* int-area@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [Int-area] WG Adoption Call: IP over Intentionally 
> Partitioned Links
>
> Dear all,
>
> We would like to start a WG adoption call for 
> _draft-nordmark-intarea-ippl-05_ ("IP over Intentionally Partitioned 
> Links”).
>
> Please indicate your preferences on the mailling list. The deadline is 
> Februray 3rd.
>
> Regards,
>
> JC & Wassim
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Int-area mailing list
> Int-area@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area



From nobody Thu Jan 26 12:26:19 2017
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To: Daniel Migault <daniel.migault@ericsson.com>, draft-bchv-rfc6890bis@ietf.org
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Hi Daniel,
     Thanks for the comments... I have some responses in-line and a
proposed -03 attached...

Michelle & Leo,
     There is a comment below that could benefit from your IANA role.

On 1/17/17 2:00 PM, Daniel Migault wrote:
> Hi,
>=20
> I have reviewed the draft. Please see my comments below. Most of them a=
re
> nits.
>=20
> Yours,
> Daniel
>=20
>                  Special-Purpose IP Address Registries
>                         draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02
>=20
>=20
> 1.  Introduction
>=20
>    In order to support new protocols and practices, the IETF
>    occasionally reserves an address block for a special purpose.  For
>    example, [RFC1122] reserves an IPv4 address block (0.0.0.0/8) to
>    represent the local (i.e., "this") network.  Likewise, [RFC4291]
>    reserves an IPv6 address block (fe80::/10) to represent link-scoped
>    unicast addresses.
>=20
>    The current list of all special-purpose address blocks are described=

>    in [RFC6890].
>=20
>  MGLT: I find this sentence confusing. It sounds like a reference to so=
me
> definitions of RFC6890, which somehow contradict the fact this document=

> obsoletes RFC6890.

I dropped the sentence as it adds no value.

>=20
>=20
>    However, several issues have been raised with how
>    "global" is defined in that document.  Specifically, the definition
>    of global provided in [RFC6890] focuses on the prefix's ability to b=
e
>    routed globally within the Internet and does not indicate if the
>    prefix is globally scoped (i.e., may be routed beyond the local link=
;
>    described as "global unicast" in the IPv6 addressing architecture
>    [RFC4291]).
>=20
> MGLT: I believe the motivation could be more explicitly specified.
>=20
> I would probably propose something around the lines:
> For each special-purpose address block, [RFC6890] defines information
> maintained for IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registries. The us=
e of
> the "global" information in [RFC6890]  IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose
> Address Registries was misleading as it slightly differed from the
> generally accepted definition of "global scope", that is the ability by=
 be
> forwarded beyond the boundaries of an administrative domain.
>=20

I have re-worded the above motivation.

>=20
>=20
>    This memo reiterates the assignments made to the IPv4 and IPv6
>    Special-Purpose Address Registries and augments the fields contained=

>    within the registires in order to address the confusion raised by th=
e
>    definition of "global".
>=20
> MGLT: registires/registries

Fixed.

>=20
>    Furthermore, this memo defines:
>=20
>    o  a common set of information that the registries will maintain
>       regarding each special-purpose address block
>    o  a common set of requirements for future entries
>=20
>    This memo obsoletes [RFC6890].
>=20
> MGLT: Although this text is from RFC6890, I understand both bullets to =
be
> section 2.2.1 for ("a common set of requirements for future entries") a=
nd
> section 2.2.2/3 for ("a common set of information that the registries w=
ill
> maintain regarding each special-purpose address block"). If I am correc=
t,
> the bullets are not in the right order. Although English is not my
> language, but the use of "furthermore" seems to give the impression the=

> current draft defines things that have not been defined in RFC6890, rat=
her
> than updating RFC6890.
>=20
> Feel free to ignore the proposal, but It sounds to me clearer to say
> something around the lines:
>=20
> The current document obsoletes RFC6890. It clarifies the definition for=

> IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registries as well as provides an=

> updated list of the IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registries.
>=20

I actually dropped the bulleted list and updated the sentence.

>=20
> 2.  IANA Considerations
>=20
> 2.1.  Assignment of an IPv4 Address Block to IANA
> 2.2.  Restructuring of the IPv4 and IPv6 Special-Purpose Address
>       Registries
> 2.2.1.  Information Requirements
>=20
>       Forwardable - A boolean value indicating whether a router may
>       forward an IP datagram whose destination address is drawn from th=
e
>       allocated special-purpose address block between external
>       interfaces.
>=20
> MGLT: Should we specify to clarify that Forwardable is set to True whet=
her
> the address is forwarded within an administrative domain or between
> different administrative domain.

I have made this clarification.

>=20
>       Reserved-by-Protocol - A boolean value indicating whether the
>       special-purpose address block is reserved by IP, itself.  This
>       value is "TRUE" if the RFC that created the special-purpose
>       address block requires all compliant IP implementations to behave=

>       in a special way when processing packets either to or from
>       addresses contained by the address block.
>=20
> MGLT: This is not very clear to me. When "Forwardable" is set to False =
for
> one address block, I interpret it as a specific behavior to implement. =
This
> seems not to be the case. My interpretation of the RFC requires is that=

> there is a MUST in that RFC and it does not seem either to be the case.=
 I
> believe that we should clarify when True, False, N/A should be set.
>=20

I don't think hard and fast rules are applicable here. The document
defining the special address need to select the values appropriate for
the use they are designing.

>=20
>    If the value of "Destination" is FALSE, the values of "Forwardable"
>    and "Globally Reachable" must also be false.
>=20
> MGLT: Maybe this sentence could be placed in the "Destination" informat=
ion
> description.

The problem with that is one of a forward reference to fields that
haven't been described yet.

>=20
> MGLT: Maybe Source, Destination, Forwardable, Globally Reachable and
> Reserved-by-protocol should clearly state when there value is set to Tr=
ue,
> False and N/A. I believe that at some point it might help the person
> requesting a block to fill the information appropriately.

See my above comment about giving flexibility to future special address
definitions. New scenarios may not fit existing rules.

>=20
> 2.2.2. IPv4 Special-Purpose Address Registry Entries
> Table 1 though Table 16,
>=20
> MGLT: I might be wrong, but I prefer to double check that is not "Table=
 1
> through Table 16" instead.

I don't understand this comment.

>=20
>=20
>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>          | Attribute            | Value                         |
>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>          | Address Block        | 192.88.99.0/24                |
>          | Name                 | Deprecated 6to4 Relay Anycast |
>          | RFC                  | [RFC7526]                     |
>          | Allocation Date      | June 2001                     |
>          | Termination Date     | March 2015                    |
>          | Source               | N/A                           |
>          | Destination          | N/A                           |
>          | Forwardable          | N/A                           |
>          | Globally Reachable   | N/A                           |
>          | Reserved-by-Protocol | N/A                           |
>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>=20
>                        Table 10: 6to4 Relay Anycast
>=20
>=20
> MGLT: Maybe some text should be added to specify that a block even expi=
red
> remains registered. I assume that some information are set to N/A as th=
e
> block has expired. If that is correct, I believe we need a note in sect=
ion
> 2.2.1 that explains the rule in as well as its the motivations.

I think that relates to how IANA manages the block.

Michelle or Leo?

>=20
>=20
>               +----------------------+----------------------+
>               | Attribute            | Value                |
>               +----------------------+----------------------+
>               | Address Block        | 255.255.255.255/32   |
>               | Name                 | Limited Broadcast    |
>               | RFC                  | [RFC0919], Section 7 |
>               | Allocation Date      | October 1984         |
>               | Termination Date     | N/A                  |
>               | Source               | False                |
>               | Destination          | True                 |
>               | Forwardable          | False                |
>               | Globally Reachable   | False                |
>               | Reserved-by-Protocol | True                 |
>               +----------------------+----------------------+
>=20
>                         Table 16: Limited Broadcast
>=20
> MGLT: RFC6890 set Reserved-by-protocol to False. I believe that
> Reserved-by-Protocol should be clearly formulated so we have no doubts =
on
> how to assign such values. In my case, I have not seen MUST in RFC919
> although it mentions "The receiving IP must be able to recognize...". I=
s
> that a sufficient reason ?

The change in value of Reserved-by-Protocol was one of the errata that
this draft is fixing.

>=20
>=20
> 2.2.3.  IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registry Entries
>=20
>                  +----------------------+---------------+
>                  | Attribute            | Value         |
>                  +----------------------+---------------+
>                  | Address Block        | 2002::/16 [2] |
>                  | Name                 | 6to4          |
>                  | RFC                  | [RFC3056]     |
>                  | Allocation Date      | February 2001 |
>                  | Termination Date     | N/A           |
>                  | Source               | True          |
>                  | Destination          | True          |
>                  | Forwardable          | True          |
>                  | Globally Reachable   | N/A [3]       |
>                  | Reserved-by-Protocol | False         |
>                  +----------------------+---------------+
>=20
>                               Table 27: 6to4
>=20
>    [3] See [RFC3056] for details.
>=20
> MGLT: Maybe we could provide some additional explanation.

We originally tried to do that in 6890 and it ended up looking like a
copy/paste of 3056. That was the reason for using a reference.

Regards,
Brian

>=20
> On Fri, Aug 26, 2016 at 2:56 PM, Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.n=
et>
> wrote:
>=20
>> All,
>>      This version incorporates a feedback from Mike Heard on the
>> 255.255.255.255/32 entry.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Brian
>>
>>
>> -------- Forwarded Message --------
>> Subject: New Version Notification for draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
>> Date: Fri, 26 Aug 2016 11:52:25 -0700
>> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
>> To: Ronald Bonica <rbonica@juniper.net>, Michelle Cotton
>> <michelle.cotton@icann.org>, Brian Haberman <brian@innovationslab.net>=
,
>> Leo Vegoda <leo.vegoda@icann.org>, Ron Bonica <rbonica@juniper.net>,
>> Michelle S. Cotton <michelle.cotton@icann.org>
>>
>>
>> A new version of I-D, draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
>> has been successfully submitted by Brian Haberman and posted to the
>> IETF repository.
>>
>> Name:           draft-bchv-rfc6890bis
>> Revision:       02
>> Title:          Special-Purpose IP Address Registries
>> Document date:  2016-08-26
>> Group:          Individual Submission
>> Pages:          22
>> URL:
>> https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02.txt
>> Status:         https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-bchv-rfc6890bis=
/
>> Htmlized:       https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02
>> Diff:           https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-bchv-rfc6890=
bis-02
>>
>> Abstract:
>>    This memo updates the IANA IPv6 Special-Purpose Address Registries =
to
>>    address issues raised by the definition of a global prefix.  For
>>    completeness, this memo contains all the assignments made by RFC 68=
90
>>    to the IANA Special-Purpose Address Registries.
>>
>>    This memo obsoletes RFC 6890.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of
>> submission
>> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>>
>> The IETF Secretariat
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Int-area mailing list
>> Int-area@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area
>>
>>
>=20

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--001a114f7de48d06bd0547070b35
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

Hi,

I believe I was confused as the draft defines a new attribute: "Globally
Reachable", but the values True/False/Boolean are not defined by the draft
- inferred from RFCs - , but by the referenced RFC itself. I believe this
example is a good one to indicate that "deprecation" as well as creation or
any updates requires an IETF standard Action. In this case RFC7526
obsoletes RFC3068. Maybe some text could be added to emphasize that this
draft is not supposed to define the values.

I agree the reference to RFC7526 is sufficient and no text needs to be
added. I apology for the confusion.

Yours,
Daniel




On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 11:28 PM, Brian E Carpenter <
brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 25/01/2017 15:25, Leo Vegoda wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > Brian Haberman wrote:
> >
> > [...]
> >
> >>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
> >>>          | Attribute            | Value                         |
> >>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
> >>>          | Address Block        | 192.88.99.0/24                |
> >>>          | Name                 | Deprecated 6to4 Relay Anycast |
> >>>          | RFC                  | [RFC7526]                     |
> >>>          | Allocation Date      | June 2001                     |
> >>>          | Termination Date     | March 2015                    |
> >>>          | Source               | N/A                           |
> >>>          | Destination          | N/A                           |
> >>>          | Forwardable          | N/A                           |
> >>>          | Globally Reachable   | N/A                           |
> >>>          | Reserved-by-Protocol | N/A                           |
> >>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
> >>>
> >>>                        Table 10: 6to4 Relay Anycast
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> MGLT: Maybe some text should be added to specify that a block even
> >>> expired remains registered. I assume that some information are set to
> >>> N/A as the block has expired. If that is correct, I believe we need a
> >>> note in section
> >>> 2.2.1 that explains the rule in as well as its the motivations.
> >>
> >> I think that relates to how IANA manages the block.
> >>
> >> Michelle or Leo?
> >
> > This registry is already quite wide and detailed. Adding additional text
> > within the registry entry might make it difficult for readers to get a
> > complete view of the registry without a particularly wide screen.
> Instead,
> > perhaps we could add a footnote that paraphrases the last sentence of
> the IC
> > section from RFC 7526:
> >
> > 7.  IANA Considerations
> >
> >    The document creating the "IANA IPv4 Special-Purpose Address
> >    Registry" [RFC6890] included the 6to4 Relay Anycast prefix
> >    (192.88.99.0/24) as Table 10.  Per this document, IANA has marked the
> >    192.88.99.0/24 prefix (originally defined by [RFC3068]) as
> >    "Deprecated (6to4 Relay Anycast)" and added a reference to this RFC.
> >    The Boolean values for the address block 192.88.99.0/24 have been
> >    removed.  Redelegation of this prefix for any use requires
> >    justification via an IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].
> >
> > Does that approach work for people? Does this need to be specified in the
> > document updating this registry?
>
> Hmm. Paraphrasing is always a risk - citing the exact text is safer. Or
> perhaps
> include a definition of 'deprecated' even though it is only used once.
>
> Something like:
>
> An address block marked as Deprecated remains reserved and might still
> be in operational use. It should not be used in new deployments and
> must not be redelegated except by IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].
>
>     Brian
>
> _______________________________________________
> Int-area mailing list
> Int-area@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area
>

--001a114f7de48d06bd0547070b35
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>Hi, <br><br></div>I believe I was confused =
as the draft defines a new attribute: &quot;Globally Reachable&quot;, but t=
he values True/False/Boolean are not defined by the draft - inferred from R=
FCs - , but by the referenced RFC itself. I believe this example is a good =
one to indicate that &quot;deprecation&quot; as well as creation or any upd=
ates requires an IETF standard Action. In this case RFC7526 obsoletes RFC30=
68. Maybe some text could be added to emphasize that this draft is not supp=
osed to define the values.<br><br>I agree the reference to RFC7526 is suffi=
cient and no text needs to be added. I apology for the confusion.=C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 <br><br></div>Yours, <br></div>Daniel<br><div><div><br><br>=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 <br></div></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_q=
uote">On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 11:28 PM, Brian E Carpenter <span dir=3D"ltr"=
>&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">brian=
.e.carpenter@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_=
quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1=
ex"><div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D"h5">On 25/01/2017 15:25, Leo Vegoda=
 wrote:<br>
&gt; Hi,<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Brian Haberman wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; [...]<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 +----------------------+----=
--<wbr>-------------------------+<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Attribute=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Value=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 +----------------------+----=
--<wbr>-------------------------+<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Address Block=C2=A0 =C2=A0=
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | <a href=3D"http://192.88.99.0/24" rel=3D"noreferrer" targe=
t=3D"_blank">192.88.99.0/24</a>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 |<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Name=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| Deprecated 6to4 Relay Anycast |<=
br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | RFC=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | [RFC7526]=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Allocation Date=C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 | June 2001=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Termination Date=C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0| March 2015=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Source=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| N/A=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Destination=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | N/A=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Forwardable=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | N/A=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Globally Reachable=C2=A0 =
=C2=A0| N/A=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Reserved-by-Protocol | N/A=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 +----------------------+----=
--<wbr>-------------------------+<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Table 10: 6to4 Relay Anycast<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; MGLT: Maybe some text should be added to specify that a block =
even<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; expired remains registered. I assume that some information are=
 set to<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; N/A as the block has expired. If that is correct, I believe we=
 need a<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; note in section<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; 2.2.1 that explains the rule in as well as its the motivations=
.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; I think that relates to how IANA manages the block.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; Michelle or Leo?<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; This registry is already quite wide and detailed. Adding additional te=
xt<br>
&gt; within the registry entry might make it difficult for readers to get a=
<br>
&gt; complete view of the registry without a particularly wide screen. Inst=
ead,<br>
&gt; perhaps we could add a footnote that paraphrases the last sentence of =
the IC<br>
&gt; section from RFC 7526:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; 7.=C2=A0 IANA Considerations<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 The document creating the &quot;IANA IPv4 Special-Purpose=
 Address<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Registry&quot; [RFC6890] included the 6to4 Relay Anycast =
prefix<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 (<a href=3D"http://192.88.99.0/24" rel=3D"noreferrer" tar=
get=3D"_blank">192.88.99.0/24</a>) as Table 10.=C2=A0 Per this document, IA=
NA has marked the<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"http://192.88.99.0/24" rel=3D"noreferrer" targ=
et=3D"_blank">192.88.99.0/24</a> prefix (originally defined by [RFC3068]) a=
s<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 &quot;Deprecated (6to4 Relay Anycast)&quot; and added a r=
eference to this RFC.<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 The Boolean values for the address block <a href=3D"http:=
//192.88.99.0/24" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">192.88.99.0/24</a> h=
ave been<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 removed.=C2=A0 Redelegation of this prefix for any use re=
quires<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 justification via an IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Does that approach work for people? Does this need to be specified in =
the<br>
&gt; document updating this registry?<br>
<br>
</div></div>Hmm. Paraphrasing is always a risk - citing the exact text is s=
afer. Or perhaps<br>
include a definition of &#39;deprecated&#39; even though it is only used on=
ce.<br>
<br>
Something like:<br>
<br>
An address block marked as Deprecated remains reserved and might still<br>
be in operational use. It should not be used in new deployments and<br>
must not be redelegated except by IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].<br>
<span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Brian<br>
</font></span><div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D"h5"><br>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Int-area mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Int-area@ietf.org">Int-area@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area" rel=3D"noreferre=
r" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/int-area</a=
><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>

--001a114f7de48d06bd0547070b35--


From nobody Sat Jan 28 23:32:16 2017
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Cc: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice.all@ietf.org, int-area@ietf.org, ietf@ietf.org
Subject: [Int-area] Review of draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-04
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Reviewer: Roni Even
Review result: Ready

I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area
Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed
by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please wait for direction from your
document shepherd or AD before posting a new version of the draft.

For more information, please see the FAQ at

<https://trac.ietf.org/trac/gen/wiki/GenArtfaq>.

Document: draft-ietf-intarea-hostname-practice-??
Reviewer: Roni Even
Review Date: 2017-01-28
IETF LC End Date: 2017-01-19
IESG Telechat date: 2017-02-02

Summary:
This draft is ready for publication as an Informational RFC

Major issues:

Minor issues:

Nits/editorial comments: 



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--94eb2c03bb2271d54205475086e1
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

Hi,

Just to be more specific:
The introduction mentions:
"""
Furthermore, this memo defines:

   o  a common set of information that the registries will maintain
      regarding each special-purpose address block
   o  a common set of requirements for future entries
"""

I think it would be good to make clear that these requirements MUST
 be provided when future allocation are requested.

The reasons to insist on it might be that it has not been always the case,
this RFC changes one type, some values as well, some RFCs mentions
these information as "boolean values"....

I am not saying the text is not mentioned, but maybe we could be more
specific and not waiting for section 2.2 to have this clear.

"""
The "IANA Considerations" section MUST include all
   of the information specified in Section 2.2.1
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02#section-2.2.1>
of this document.
"""

Regards,

Daniel


On Thu, Jan 26, 2017 at 5:41 PM, Daniel Migault <daniel.migault@ericsson.com
> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I believe I was confused as the draft defines a new attribute: "Globally
> Reachable", but the values True/False/Boolean are not defined by the draft
> - inferred from RFCs - , but by the referenced RFC itself. I believe this
> example is a good one to indicate that "deprecation" as well as creation or
> any updates requires an IETF standard Action. In this case RFC7526
> obsoletes RFC3068. Maybe some text could be added to emphasize that this
> draft is not supposed to define the values.
>
> I agree the reference to RFC7526 is sufficient and no text needs to be
> added. I apology for the confusion.
>
> Yours,
> Daniel
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 11:28 PM, Brian E Carpenter <
> brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 25/01/2017 15:25, Leo Vegoda wrote:
>> > Hi,
>> >
>> > Brian Haberman wrote:
>> >
>> > [...]
>> >
>> >>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>> >>>          | Attribute            | Value                         |
>> >>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>> >>>          | Address Block        | 192.88.99.0/24                |
>> >>>          | Name                 | Deprecated 6to4 Relay Anycast |
>> >>>          | RFC                  | [RFC7526]                     |
>> >>>          | Allocation Date      | June 2001                     |
>> >>>          | Termination Date     | March 2015                    |
>> >>>          | Source               | N/A                           |
>> >>>          | Destination          | N/A                           |
>> >>>          | Forwardable          | N/A                           |
>> >>>          | Globally Reachable   | N/A                           |
>> >>>          | Reserved-by-Protocol | N/A                           |
>> >>>          +----------------------+-------------------------------+
>> >>>
>> >>>                        Table 10: 6to4 Relay Anycast
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> MGLT: Maybe some text should be added to specify that a block even
>> >>> expired remains registered. I assume that some information are set to
>> >>> N/A as the block has expired. If that is correct, I believe we need a
>> >>> note in section
>> >>> 2.2.1 that explains the rule in as well as its the motivations.
>> >>
>> >> I think that relates to how IANA manages the block.
>> >>
>> >> Michelle or Leo?
>> >
>> > This registry is already quite wide and detailed. Adding additional text
>> > within the registry entry might make it difficult for readers to get a
>> > complete view of the registry without a particularly wide screen.
>> Instead,
>> > perhaps we could add a footnote that paraphrases the last sentence of
>> the IC
>> > section from RFC 7526:
>> >
>> > 7.  IANA Considerations
>> >
>> >    The document creating the "IANA IPv4 Special-Purpose Address
>> >    Registry" [RFC6890] included the 6to4 Relay Anycast prefix
>> >    (192.88.99.0/24) as Table 10.  Per this document, IANA has marked
>> the
>> >    192.88.99.0/24 prefix (originally defined by [RFC3068]) as
>> >    "Deprecated (6to4 Relay Anycast)" and added a reference to this RFC.
>> >    The Boolean values for the address block 192.88.99.0/24 have been
>> >    removed.  Redelegation of this prefix for any use requires
>> >    justification via an IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].
>> >
>> > Does that approach work for people? Does this need to be specified in
>> the
>> > document updating this registry?
>>
>> Hmm. Paraphrasing is always a risk - citing the exact text is safer. Or
>> perhaps
>> include a definition of 'deprecated' even though it is only used once.
>>
>> Something like:
>>
>> An address block marked as Deprecated remains reserved and might still
>> be in operational use. It should not be used in new deployments and
>> must not be redelegated except by IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].
>>
>>     Brian
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Int-area mailing list
>> Int-area@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area
>>
>
>

--94eb2c03bb2271d54205475086e1
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><pre class=3D"gmail-newpage">Hi, <br><br>Just to be more s=
pecific:<br>The introduction mentions:<br>&quot;&quot;&quot;<br>Furthermore=
, this memo defines:

   o  a common set of information that the registries will maintain
      regarding each special-purpose address block<br>   o  a common set of=
 requirements for future entries
&quot;&quot;&quot;<br><br></pre><pre class=3D"gmail-newpage">I think it wou=
ld be good to make clear that these requirements MUST<br>=C2=A0be provided =
when future allocation are requested.  <span class=3D"gmail-grey"></span></=
pre><pre class=3D"gmail-newpage">The reasons to insist on it might be that =
it has not been always the case,<br>this RFC changes one type, some values =
as well, some RFCs mentions <br>these information as &quot;boolean values&q=
uot;....<br><br></pre><pre class=3D"gmail-newpage">I am not saying the text=
 is not mentioned, but maybe we could be more <br>specific and not waiting =
for section 2.2 to have this clear. <br></pre><pre class=3D"gmail-newpage">=
&quot;&quot;&quot;<br>The &quot;IANA Considerations&quot; section MUST incl=
ude all
   of the information specified in <a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/d=
raft-bchv-rfc6890bis-02#section-2.2.1">Section 2.2.1</a> of this document.<=
br>&quot;&quot;&quot;<br><br></pre><pre class=3D"gmail-newpage">Regards, <b=
r></pre><pre class=3D"gmail-newpage">Daniel<br></pre></div><div class=3D"gm=
ail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jan 26, 2017 at 5:41 PM, =
Daniel Migault <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:daniel.migault@erics=
son.com" target=3D"_blank">daniel.migault@ericsson.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote=
:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-le=
ft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>Hi, <br=
><br></div>I believe I was confused as the draft defines a new attribute: &=
quot;Globally Reachable&quot;, but the values True/False/Boolean are not de=
fined by the draft - inferred from RFCs - , but by the referenced RFC itsel=
f. I believe this example is a good one to indicate that &quot;deprecation&=
quot; as well as creation or any updates requires an IETF standard Action. =
In this case RFC7526 obsoletes RFC3068. Maybe some text could be added to e=
mphasize that this draft is not supposed to define the values.<br><br>I agr=
ee the reference to RFC7526 is sufficient and no text needs to be added. I =
apology for the confusion.=C2=A0 =C2=A0 <br><br></div>Yours, <br></div>Dani=
el<br><div><div><br><br>=C2=A0=C2=A0 <br></div></div></div><div class=3D"HO=
EnZb"><div class=3D"h5"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_=
quote">On Tue, Jan 24, 2017 at 11:28 PM, Brian E Carpenter <span dir=3D"ltr=
">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">bria=
n.e.carpenter@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail=
_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:=
1ex"><div class=3D"m_-6544650559305661462HOEnZb"><div class=3D"m_-654465055=
9305661462h5">On 25/01/2017 15:25, Leo Vegoda wrote:<br>
&gt; Hi,<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Brian Haberman wrote:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; [...]<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 +----------------------+----=
--<wbr>-------------------------+<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Attribute=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Value=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 +----------------------+----=
--<wbr>-------------------------+<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Address Block=C2=A0 =C2=A0=
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | <a href=3D"http://192.88.99.0/24" rel=3D"noreferrer" targe=
t=3D"_blank">192.88.99.0/24</a>=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 |<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Name=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| Deprecated 6to4 Relay Anycast |<=
br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | RFC=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | [RFC7526]=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Allocation Date=C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 | June 2001=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Termination Date=C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0| March 2015=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 |<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Source=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=
 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0| N/A=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Destination=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | N/A=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Forwardable=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | N/A=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Globally Reachable=C2=A0 =
=C2=A0| N/A=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 | Reserved-by-Protocol | N/A=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0|<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 +----------------------+----=
--<wbr>-------------------------+<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Table 10: 6to4 Relay Anycast<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; MGLT: Maybe some text should be added to specify that a block =
even<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; expired remains registered. I assume that some information are=
 set to<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; N/A as the block has expired. If that is correct, I believe we=
 need a<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; note in section<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; 2.2.1 that explains the rule in as well as its the motivations=
.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; I think that relates to how IANA manages the block.<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt; Michelle or Leo?<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; This registry is already quite wide and detailed. Adding additional te=
xt<br>
&gt; within the registry entry might make it difficult for readers to get a=
<br>
&gt; complete view of the registry without a particularly wide screen. Inst=
ead,<br>
&gt; perhaps we could add a footnote that paraphrases the last sentence of =
the IC<br>
&gt; section from RFC 7526:<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; 7.=C2=A0 IANA Considerations<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 The document creating the &quot;IANA IPv4 Special-Purpose=
 Address<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Registry&quot; [RFC6890] included the 6to4 Relay Anycast =
prefix<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 (<a href=3D"http://192.88.99.0/24" rel=3D"noreferrer" tar=
get=3D"_blank">192.88.99.0/24</a>) as Table 10.=C2=A0 Per this document, IA=
NA has marked the<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 <a href=3D"http://192.88.99.0/24" rel=3D"noreferrer" targ=
et=3D"_blank">192.88.99.0/24</a> prefix (originally defined by [RFC3068]) a=
s<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 &quot;Deprecated (6to4 Relay Anycast)&quot; and added a r=
eference to this RFC.<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 The Boolean values for the address block <a href=3D"http:=
//192.88.99.0/24" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">192.88.99.0/24</a> h=
ave been<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 removed.=C2=A0 Redelegation of this prefix for any use re=
quires<br>
&gt;=C2=A0 =C2=A0 justification via an IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; Does that approach work for people? Does this need to be specified in =
the<br>
&gt; document updating this registry?<br>
<br>
</div></div>Hmm. Paraphrasing is always a risk - citing the exact text is s=
afer. Or perhaps<br>
include a definition of &#39;deprecated&#39; even though it is only used on=
ce.<br>
<br>
Something like:<br>
<br>
An address block marked as Deprecated remains reserved and might still<br>
be in operational use. It should not be used in new deployments and<br>
must not be redelegated except by IETF Standards Action [RFC5226].<br>
<span class=3D"m_-6544650559305661462HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Brian<br>
</font></span><div class=3D"m_-6544650559305661462HOEnZb"><div class=3D"m_-=
6544650559305661462h5"><br>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Int-area mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Int-area@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">Int-area@ietf.org</a=
><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/int-area" rel=3D"noreferre=
r" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/l<wbr>istinfo/int-area</a=
><br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br></div>

--94eb2c03bb2271d54205475086e1--


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Stephen Farrell has entered the following ballot position for
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
COMMENT:
----------------------------------------------------------------------

- section 3: given affiliation changes, you might
want to s/huitema/thaler/g in this section:-)



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On 1/31/2017 2:27 AM, Stephen Farrell wrote
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> COMMENT:
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> - section 3: given affiliation changes, you might
> want to s/huitema/thaler/g in this section:-)

Yes, we could easily make that change. Unless Dave objects, I will do it
in the next version.

-- Christian Huitema

