From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Fri Sep 02 11:10:19 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EBDBL-0000ms-Hm for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 11:10:19 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA12964 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 11:10:17 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EBDDT-0006mP-AA for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 11:12:34 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82EvZZB011757 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:57:35 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j82EvZtK011756 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:57:35 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82EvUaP011736 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 15:57:30 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <43186859.5010100@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 15:57:29 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: 64th IETF - Vancouver, BC, Canada Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 856eb5f76e7a34990d1d457d8e8e5b7f Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just a note, to inform you that the IETF has opened registartion and hotel bookings for the coming IETF meeting held 6-11 November 2005 in Vancouver, BC, Canada. Details are at: http://www.ietf.org/meetings/IETF-64.html The ipdvb WG intends to meet at this meeting, although final timing of the ipdvb meeting in Agenda will not be confirmed until 17th October. Other meeting deadlines are described: http://www.ietf.org/meetings/cutoff_dates_64.html Best wishes, Gorry Fairhurst (ipdvb WG Chair) From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Fri Sep 02 12:42:55 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EBEcx-0002Js-6z for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 12:42:55 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id MAA16921 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 12:42:52 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EBEey-0001UI-Ty for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 02 Sep 2005 12:45:11 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j82GXH4S015527 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:33:17 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j82GXHf5015526 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:33:17 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from smtpout03-03.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout03-03.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.73]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with SMTP id j82GX8IU015507 for ; Fri, 2 Sep 2005 17:33:08 +0100 (BST) Received: (qmail 27543 invoked from network); 2 Sep 2005 16:33:02 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO webmail11.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net) (64.202.189.48) by smtpout03-03.mesa1.secureserver.net with SMTP; 2 Sep 2005 16:33:02 -0000 Received: (qmail 27288 invoked by uid 99); 2 Sep 2005 16:33:02 -0000 Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 09:33:02 -0700 From: Marie-Jose Montpetit Subject: RE: 64th IETF - Vancouver, BC, Canada To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Message-ID: <20050902093302.ca5566c7162b3cfcb6c200079b757bd6.edfef20b6c.wbe@email.email.secureserver.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/plain; CHARSET=US-ASCII X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.6, required 6, autolearn=not spam, BAYES_00 -2.60, SPF_HELO_PASS -0.00), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.6, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60, SPF_HELO_PASS -0.00) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 2409bba43e9c8d580670fda8b695204a I'll try to go. This is NA I should have less problems. /mjm > -------- Original Message -------- > Subject: 64th IETF - Vancouver, BC, Canada > From: Gorry Fairhurst > Date: Fri, September 02, 2005 10:57 am > To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk > > Just a note, to inform you that the IETF has opened registartion and hotel > bookings for the coming IETF meeting held 6-11 November 2005 in Vancouver, BC, > Canada. Details are at: > > http://www.ietf.org/meetings/IETF-64.html > > The ipdvb WG intends to meet at this meeting, although final timing of the > ipdvb meeting in Agenda will not be confirmed until 17th October. > > Other meeting deadlines are described: > http://www.ietf.org/meetings/cutoff_dates_64.html > > Best wishes, > > Gorry Fairhurst > (ipdvb WG Chair) From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Sat Sep 03 07:43:09 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EBWQO-0008Fu-St for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 07:43:09 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA00945 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 07:43:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EBWSi-0005lO-DF for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 07:45:35 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j83BXCnu019858 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:33:12 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j83BXCNL019857 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:33:12 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from jive.SoftHome.net (jive.SoftHome.net [66.54.152.27]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with SMTP id j83BWwTW019832 for ; Sat, 3 Sep 2005 12:33:01 +0100 (BST) Received: (qmail 27023 invoked by uid 417); 3 Sep 2005 11:32:57 -0000 Received: from shunt-smtp-out-0 (HELO softhome.net) (172.16.3.12) by shunt-smtp-out-0 with SMTP; 3 Sep 2005 11:32:57 -0000 Received: from tink ([83.131.93.146]) (AUTH: PLAIN emard@softhome.net) by softhome.net with esmtp; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 05:32:56 -0600 Received: from emard by tink with local (Exim 4.52) id 1EBWGP-0003bB-0v for ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk; Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:32:49 +0200 Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:32:49 +0200 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: unsubscribe Message-ID: <20050903113248.GA13737@tink> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i From: emard@softhome.net X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.593, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60, NO_REAL_NAME 0.01, SPF_HELO_PASS -0.00), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.593, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60, NO_REAL_NAME 0.01, SPF_HELO_PASS -0.00) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: bb8eae9af85e4fcfe76f325e38493bf4 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit unsubscribe From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Mon Sep 05 09:17:48 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ECGr4-00041C-Fp for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 05 Sep 2005 09:17:48 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA15832 for ; Mon, 5 Sep 2005 09:17:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ECGtp-0006XC-Cw for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 05 Sep 2005 09:20:38 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j85D9SUG018640 for ; Mon, 5 Sep 2005 14:09:28 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j85D9S99018639 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Mon, 5 Sep 2005 14:09:28 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from notesmta.nera.no (notesmta.nera.no [194.19.8.41]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j85D9JqD018598 for ; Mon, 5 Sep 2005 14:09:19 +0100 (BST) Subject: Harald Skinnemoen does not work for Nera anymore. From: Harald Skinnemoen To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Message-ID: Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2005 15:09:06 +0200 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on NotesMTA/NERA(Release 6.5.3FP1|December 15, 2004) at 2005-09-05 15:09:20 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.175, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60, HTML_10_20 0.25, HTML_MESSAGE 0.00, MIME_HTML_ONLY 0.18), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.175, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60, HTML_10_20 0.25, HTML_MESSAGE 0.00, MIME_HTML_ONLY 0.18) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.1 (/) X-Scan-Signature: d6b246023072368de71562c0ab503126 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I will be out of the office starting 2005-09-01 and will not return= until 2005-12-01.

Hei.
Jeg jobber ikke i Nera lenger.
Hvis din henvendelse er Nera relatert, ber jeg deg ta kontakt med Sigbj= =F8rn N=E6ss p=E5 e-post sn@nbs.nera.no
Er det privat, treffes jeg p=E5 epost harald.skinnemoen@gmail.com
---------------
Hi.
I do not work for Nera anymore.
If your inquiry is Nera related, please contact Sigbj=F8rn N=E6ss on e-= mail sn@nbs.nera.no
If it is private, please use my e-mail harald.skinnemoen@gmail.com
Mvh / Best regards,
Harald Skinnemoen= From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Tue Sep 06 13:11:04 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ECgyO-0003H9-0Q for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 06 Sep 2005 13:11:04 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA08380 for ; Tue, 6 Sep 2005 13:11:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ECh1L-0002fS-Oo for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 06 Sep 2005 13:14:10 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j86H0LRp011651 for ; Tue, 6 Sep 2005 18:00:21 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j86H0LpX011650 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Tue, 6 Sep 2005 18:00:21 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from mailg.surrey.ac.uk (mailg.surrey.ac.uk [131.227.102.21]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with SMTP id j86H08hj011629 for ; Tue, 6 Sep 2005 18:00:08 +0100 (BST) Received: from ads33.surrey.ac.uk by mailg.surrey.ac.uk with SMTP Local (PP) with ESMTP; Tue, 6 Sep 2005 17:59:45 +0100 Received: from EVS-EC1-NODE1.surrey.ac.uk ([131.227.102.136]) by ads33.surrey.ac.uk with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Tue, 6 Sep 2005 17:59:44 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5.7226.0 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C5B304.6157EC78" Subject: IP DVB security requirements - document Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 17:59:44 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: yes Thread-Topic: IP DVB security requirements - document Thread-Index: AcWzBGFKzK7Xnzb1Tr6osm7Ns1Imyg== From: "H.Cruickshank" To: ipdvb Cc: smb , bew X-OriginalArrivalTime: 06 Sep 2005 16:59:44.0765 (UTC) FILETIME=[618ABAD0:01C5B304] X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.419, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60, HTML_50_60 0.09, HTML_MESSAGE 0.00, HTML_TEXT_AFTER_BODY 0.06, HTML_TEXT_AFTER_HTML 0.03), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.419, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60, HTML_50_60 0.09, HTML_MESSAGE 0.00, HTML_TEXT_AFTER_BODY 0.06, HTML_TEXT_AFTER_HTML 0.03) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.8 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 47d6e33caab9a47557c20591160ac87c This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C5B304.6157EC78 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_002_01C5B304.6157EC78" ------_=_NextPart_002_01C5B304.6157EC78 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi, =20 Further to the comments in the last IP-DVB meeting in IETF-Paris, here is the ULE security requirements draft. =20 Many thanks to Steve Bellovin input during the meeting. Also many thanks to Brian Weis (MSEC group) for his valuable input and comments during the writing of this draft. Finally, many thanks to Gorry for his input and suggestions. =20 =20 Any comments and input are very welcome. =20 Haitham (& all authors) -- Dr. Haitham S. Cruickshank=20 Lecturer Communications Centre for Communication Systems Research (CCSR)=20 School of Electronics, Computing and Mathematics=20 University of Surrey, Guildford, Surrey GU2 7XH, UK=20 Tel: +44 1483 686007 (indirect 689844)=20 Fax: +44 1483 686011=20 e-mail: H.Cruickshank@surrey.ac.uk=20 http://www.ee.surrey.ac.uk/Personal/H.Cruickshank/ =20 =20 ------_=_NextPart_002_01C5B304.6157EC78 Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message

Hi,
 
Further to the comments in the = last IP-DVB=20 meeting in IETF-Paris, here is the ULE security requirements=20 draft.
 
Many thanks to Steve Bellovin = input during=20 the meeting.  Also many thanks to Brian Weis (MSEC group) for his = valuable=20 input and comments during the writing of this draft.  Finally, many = thanks=20 to Gorry for his input and suggestions.
 
 
Any comments and input are very=20 welcome.
 
Haitham (& all = authors)

--

Dr. Haitham S. Cruickshank

Lecturer

Communications Centre for Communication Systems = Research (CCSR)=20

School of Electronics, Computing and Mathematics =

University of Surrey, Guildford, Surrey GU2 7XH, UK =

Tel: +44 1483 686007 (indirect 689844)

Fax: +44 1483 686011

e-mail: H.Cruickshank@surrey.ac.uk

http://www.ee.surrey.ac.uk/Personal/H.Cruickshank/

 
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ICAgICAgICAgICAgMTMuIElBTkEgQ29uc2lkZXJhdGlvbnMgICANCiAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg ICBUaGlzIGRvY3VtZW50IGRvZXMgbm90IGRlZmluZSBhbnkgcHJvdG9jb2wgYW5kIGRvZXMgbm90 IHJlcXVpcmUgYW55IA0KICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgSUFOQSBhc3NpZ25tZW50cy4gDQoNCg0K DQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoN Cg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCg0KDQoNCiAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgDQogICAgICAgICAgICAgICBFeHBp cmVzIE1hcmNoIDIwMDYgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg W3BhZ2UgMTNdIA0KDA== ------_=_NextPart_001_01C5B304.6157EC78-- From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Mon Sep 12 10:22:16 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EEpCK-0007Lm-R7 for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 12 Sep 2005 10:22:16 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA21441 for ; Mon, 12 Sep 2005 10:22:04 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EEpGL-00050v-Nw for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 12 Sep 2005 10:26:27 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8CE9utk023528 for ; Mon, 12 Sep 2005 15:09:56 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8CE9uHU023527 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Mon, 12 Sep 2005 15:09:56 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8CE9pUv023509 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 12 Sep 2005 15:09:51 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <43258C2F.4070007@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 15:09:51 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: Status update 12th September 2005. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 9182cfff02fae4f1b6e9349e01d62f32 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm pleased to announce the following two WG I-Ds are now approved and are awaiting action by the RFC-Editor: draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar draft-ietf-ipdvb-arch Some of you may have noticed that we have tidied the ipdvb web site. The new web pages also include a link to the ipdvb status page maintained by the IETF at: http://tools.ietf.org/wg/ipdvb/ The proceedings for the ipdvb WG meeting in Paris are now available on-line at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/public/proceeding_interim.cgi?meeting_num=63 I am expecting new I-Ds for the following documents to be published in the next few weeks: draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar (updated) draft-cantillo-ipdvb-s2encaps (updated) draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req (new I-D) Best wishes, Gorry Fairhurst (ipdvb WG Chair) From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Thu Sep 15 04:28:09 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EFp6H-0000d4-H6 for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 04:28:09 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA26432 for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 04:28:07 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EFpB3-0000t7-7t for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 04:33:05 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8F8KCUT017437 for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 09:20:12 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8F8KCln017436 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 09:20:12 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8F8K7G9017406 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 09:20:07 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <43292EB7.20508@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 09:20:07 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req-00.txt@erg.abdn.ac.uk Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 538aad3a3c4f01d8b6a6477ca4248793 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. Title : Security requirements for the Unidirectional Lightweight Encapsulation (ULE) protocol Author(s) : H. Cruickshank, et al. Filename : draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req-00.txt Pages : Date : 2005-9-14 This document provides a threat analysis and derives security requirements for MPEG-2 transmission links using the Unidirectional Lightweight Encapsulation (ULE). It also provides the motivation for ULE link level security. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req-00.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv at ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Thu Sep 15 04:44:37 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EFpMD-0005c4-1h for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 04:44:37 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA27915 for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 04:44:34 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EFpQx-0001Tc-Oc for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 04:49:33 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8F8JTTN017351 for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 09:19:29 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8F8JTIY017350 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 09:19:29 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8F8JNV5017331 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 09:19:24 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <43292E8C.4020800@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 09:19:24 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar-01.txt Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 02ec665d00de228c50c93ed6b5e4fc1a Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP over DVB Working Group of the IETF. Title : Address Resolution for IP datagrams over MPEG-2 networks Author(s) : G. Fairhurst, M. Montpetit Filename : draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar-01.txt Pages : 0 Date : 2005-9-14 This document describes the process of binding/associating IPv4/IPv6 addresses with MPEG-2 Transport Streams (TS). This procedure is known as Address Resolution (AR), or Neighbour Discovery (ND). Such address resolution complements the higher layer resource discovery tools that are used to advertise IP sessions. In MPEG-2 networks, an IP address must be associated with a Packet ID (PID) and a specific Transmission Multiplex. The document reviews current methods. It also describes the interaction with well-known protocols for address management including DHCP, ARP, and NDP, and provides guidance on usage. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar-01.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar-01.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv at ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar-01.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Fri Sep 16 04:10:49 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EGBJ3-0001ET-8Q for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 04:10:49 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA01518 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 04:10:46 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EGBO1-000637-9u for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 04:15:57 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8G7jHRw007120 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 08:45:17 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8G7jHfN007119 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 08:45:17 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from loewe.cosy.sbg.ac.at (loewe.cosy.sbg.ac.at [141.201.2.12]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8G7jAbj007102 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 08:45:11 +0100 (BST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (milbe.cosy.sbg.ac.at [141.201.2.21]) by loewe.cosy.sbg.ac.at (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA03854 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 09:45:10 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <432A77E5.1030301@cosy.sbg.ac.at> Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 09:44:37 +0200 From: Bernhard Collini-Nocker User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.2 (Windows/20050317) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: Re: Adding ULE into a network already using MPE... References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.599, required 6, autolearn=not spam, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.599, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 68ba2b07ef271dba6ee42a93832cfa4c Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Just came across that (again), and am adding a few thoughts on the autodetection of MPE/ULE. Gorry Fairhurst wrote: > There ways to do this I can think of three, and I think John you are asking > about C? > A) You could parse the SI/PSI signalling (if any) and extract the > information from there. > B) You could configure it (out of band) or using IP > configuration/resolution, etc. > C) I once worked through an "auto-detect mode", where you knew the PID but > didn't know the type of encapsulation. > > ---- > > The basic rule is only one type of encapsulation is allowed for a single > PID. So how can you find out which is used? > > I note there is a reasonably strong CRC there in the ULE framing, and you > can easily extract framing alignment to the TS from the PUSI setting in the > TS header: > > (i) Supposing your receiver starts as unconfigured. > > (ii) The receiver looks for a PUSI setting and extracts the PP value. Before extracting PP the value of AFC field could be checked as well. If adaptation field is present, it is clearly not ULE. > (iii) It then tries reassembly of the first section as a ULE packet. If it > succeeds with a valid CRC-32 and Length, it is probably safe to assume this > is ULE. One could do probably a little better than this in looking the first byte of the Length field, which might be a valid table_id and consequently would very unlikely be part of a reasonable ULE Length. If not cheking this some many TS cells would have to be read and skipped until the potential ULE SNDU is captured and the CRC fails. > (iv) If the CRC fails, it tries a DSM-CC section reassembly (being aware the > integrity check is interpreted in more than one way in MPE). The MPE start > code is also another "hint" that this may not be ULE, but this value *could* > appear as the start of a ULE field - (Note one needs to be aware that MPE > and ATSC use different start values). > > (v) You could (probably should!!!) verify the next few SNDUs to increase > your confidence, as in any alignment algorithm. It would also be wise to > re-initialise the detection if you suffer an alignment failure. This could > be a result of a change of mutliplexing policy. > > Note: This is orthogonal to the generation of SI/PSI tables used to control > the TS multiplexing layer itself. If you use a transport stream multiplexor > as a part of your L2 MPEG transmission network, this may need the SI/PSI to > allow the PID to reach the Receiver. > > Thoughts? It is a nice exercise to think about an auto-detection mode, maybe it is even worth to continue thinking about it... > Gorry Bernhard > On 3/8/05 8:39 pm, "John Border" wrote: > >> I was thinking along those lines. The sender associates the >>encapsulation method with a particular PID and "knows" (via AR) which >>PID to use to send to a particular receiver. Receivers which only >>understand MPE only use MPE PIDs. Receivers which understand ULE and >>MPE determine which method is being used by which PID is being >>received. (I think the ULE capable receivers will still need to support >>MPE for multicast traffic that is shared with "older" terminals.) >> >> I was wondering if there is a way for the receiver to look at the >>header and determine if it is ULE or MPE on the fly. I haven't taken a >>close look at it yet. But, I suspect that it is not reliably possible... >> >>John >> >> >>Marie-Jose Montpetit wrote: >> >> >>>I think this is one thing that could be solved by some of the >>>configuration work that was started where you could associate a PID to >>>an encapsulation. You may not want to ignore the new encapsulation. >>> >>>Marie-Jose >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>>-------- Original Message -------- >>>>Subject: RE: Adding ULE into a network already using MPE... >>>>From: "Allison, Art" >>>>Date: Wed, August 03, 2005 2:05 pm >>>>To: >>>> >>>>Use of the MRD will enable a device on a MPEG-2 network that does not >>>>understand that MRD's signaling/meaning to ignore the new encapsulation. >>>> >>>> >>>>Of course if the existing network just used private data with out >>>>signaling what it was, a problem may exist. >>>>__________________ >>>>Art Allison >>>>Director, Advanced Engineering >>>>NAB Science & Technology >>>>1771 N St NW, Washington DC 20036 >>>>202 429 5418 >>>>-----Original Message----- >>>>From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk [mailto:owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk] >>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 11:32 AM >>>>To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk >>>>Subject: Adding ULE into a network already using MPE... >>>> >>>> >>>> Has anyone looked at the operational problems associated with adding >>>>ULE use to a network which has some deployed terminals which only >>>>understand MPE? >>>> >>>> >>>>John >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> > > From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Fri Sep 16 04:18:32 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EGBQW-00045J-NM for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 04:18:32 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id EAA01849 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 04:18:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EGBVU-0006IQ-Te for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 04:23:41 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8G8C9MG010599 for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 09:12:09 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8G8C9Ic010598 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 09:12:09 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8G8C3MF010580 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Fri, 16 Sep 2005 09:12:03 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <432A7E53.3030204@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 09:12:03 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: Re: Adding ULE into a network already using MPE... References: <432A77E5.1030301@cosy.sbg.ac.at> In-Reply-To: <432A77E5.1030301@cosy.sbg.ac.at> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-5.899, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -3.30, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 156eddb66af16eef49a76ae923b15b92 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit A few comments in-line. Bernhard Collini-Nocker wrote: > Just came across that (again), and am adding a few thoughts on the > autodetection of MPE/ULE. > > Gorry Fairhurst wrote: > >> There ways to do this I can think of three, and I think John you are >> asking >> about C? >> A) You could parse the SI/PSI signalling (if any) and extract the >> information from there. >> B) You could configure it (out of band) or using IP >> configuration/resolution, etc. >> C) I once worked through an "auto-detect mode", where you knew the PID >> but >> didn't know the type of encapsulation. >> >> ---- >> >> The basic rule is only one type of encapsulation is allowed for a single >> PID. So how can you find out which is used? >> >> I note there is a reasonably strong CRC there in the ULE framing, and you >> can easily extract framing alignment to the TS from the PUSI setting >> in the >> TS header: >> >> (i) Supposing your receiver starts as unconfigured. >> >> (ii) The receiver looks for a PUSI setting and extracts the PP value. > > > Before extracting PP the value of AFC field could be checked as well. If > adaptation field is present, it is clearly not ULE. > True - but there was at least two people said they would have liked AFC support (although it's not in the standard for ULE), and so I'd hate to close the door on this more, so maybe I'd urge that we ignore AFC. >> (iii) It then tries reassembly of the first section as a ULE packet. >> If it >> succeeds with a valid CRC-32 and Length, it is probably safe to assume >> this >> is ULE. > > > One could do probably a little better than this in looking the first > byte of the Length field, which might be a valid table_id and > consequently would very unlikely be part of a reasonable ULE Length. If > not cheking this some many TS cells would have to be read and skipped > until the potential ULE SNDU is captured and the CRC fails. > Agreed, this could also be a good "hint". >> (iv) If the CRC fails, it tries a DSM-CC section reassembly (being >> aware the >> integrity check is interpreted in more than one way in MPE). The MPE >> start >> code is also another "hint" that this may not be ULE, but this value >> *could* >> appear as the start of a ULE field - (Note one needs to be aware that MPE >> and ATSC use different start values). >> >> (v) You could (probably should!!!) verify the next few SNDUs to increase >> your confidence, as in any alignment algorithm. It would also be wise to >> re-initialise the detection if you suffer an alignment failure. This >> could >> be a result of a change of mutliplexing policy. >> >> Note: This is orthogonal to the generation of SI/PSI tables used to >> control >> the TS multiplexing layer itself. If you use a transport stream >> multiplexor >> as a part of your L2 MPEG transmission network, this may need the >> SI/PSI to >> allow the PID to reach the Receiver. >> >> Thoughts? > > > It is a nice exercise to think about an auto-detection mode, maybe it is > even worth to continue thinking about it... > Perhaps there are some useful applications of this, the one that comes to my mind is that it is a useful tool for decoding bitstreams for analysis (aka ethereal). >> Gorry > > > Bernhard > >> On 3/8/05 8:39 pm, "John Border" wrote: >> >>> I was thinking along those lines. The sender associates the >>> encapsulation method with a particular PID and "knows" (via AR) which >>> PID to use to send to a particular receiver. Receivers which only >>> understand MPE only use MPE PIDs. Receivers which understand ULE and >>> MPE determine which method is being used by which PID is being >>> received. (I think the ULE capable receivers will still need to support >>> MPE for multicast traffic that is shared with "older" terminals.) >>> >>> I was wondering if there is a way for the receiver to look at the >>> header and determine if it is ULE or MPE on the fly. I haven't taken a >>> close look at it yet. But, I suspect that it is not reliably >>> possible... >>> >>> John >>> >>> >>> Marie-Jose Montpetit wrote: >>> >>> >>>> I think this is one thing that could be solved by some of the >>>> configuration work that was started where you could associate a PID to >>>> an encapsulation. You may not want to ignore the new encapsulation. >>>> >>>> Marie-Jose >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> -------- Original Message -------- >>>>> Subject: RE: Adding ULE into a network already using MPE... >>>>> From: "Allison, Art" >>>>> Date: Wed, August 03, 2005 2:05 pm >>>>> To: >>>>> >>>>> Use of the MRD will enable a device on a MPEG-2 network that does not >>>>> understand that MRD's signaling/meaning to ignore the new >>>>> encapsulation. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Of course if the existing network just used private data with out >>>>> signaling what it was, a problem may exist. >>>>> __________________ >>>>> Art Allison >>>>> Director, Advanced Engineering >>>>> NAB Science & Technology >>>>> 1771 N St NW, Washington DC 20036 >>>>> 202 429 5418 >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk [mailto:owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk] >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 11:32 AM >>>>> To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk >>>>> Subject: Adding ULE into a network already using MPE... >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Has anyone looked at the operational problems associated with adding >>>>> ULE use to a network which has some deployed terminals which only >>>>> understand MPE? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> John >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >> >> > > From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Mon Sep 19 14:26:28 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EHQLT-0001jW-Ux for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:26:27 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id OAA12363 for ; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:26:26 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EHQR8-0008Q9-Ho for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:32:20 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8JIHfAq015664 for ; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 19:17:41 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8JIHfWu015663 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 19:17:41 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8JIHXDJ015645 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Mon, 19 Sep 2005 19:17:33 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <432F00BD.7070100@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 19:17:33 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: Draft Agenda fro the 64th IETF - Vancouver, BC, Canada Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-4.399, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-4.399, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 41c17b4b16d1eedaa8395c26e9a251c4 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Sixty-fourth IETF meeting will be held 6-11 November 2005. Please find below, the Draft Agenda foir the next ipdvb WG meeting. Please send any additions/corrections to me. Please also do let me know if you intend to submit a *NEW* I-D on a subject covered by the ipdvb Charter. Best wishes, Gorry Fairhurst ----- IP over Digital Video Broadcast (IPDVB) WG 1. Agenda Bashing (10 minutes) - Chair * Agenda changes * Election of Scribe for Proceedings * Jabber Scribe 2. Document Status (5 minutes) - Chair * Updated milestones. * Documents in Last Call - None. * Documents in IESG Review - None. * Documents in RFC Editor Queue: draft-ietf-ipdvb-ule-06 (Proposed Standard) draft-ietf-ipdvb-arch-04 (Informational) * Published RFCs - None. 3. Address Resolution (15 minutes) - M-J Montpetit http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar-01.txt * L2 Resolution * L3 Resolution: ND, UDLR, etc. * Contributions required 4. IP Address Configuration for ipdvb (10 minutes) - M Stiemerling http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-stiemerling-ipdvb-config-01.txt * Future directions for this draft 5. ULE Security Requirements (20 minutes) - Haitham Cruikshank http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req-00.txt -00 * Requirements and threat analysis * Contributions required 6. ULE Security Extension (10 minutes) - Haitham Cruikshank http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-00.txt * Security Header Extension proposal * Appropriateness of the technique 7. IP Encapsulation for DVB-S.2 (20 minutes) - Jerome Lacan http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-cantillo-ipdvb-s2encaps-00.txt * Requirements and scenarios * Future directions for this draft 8. A.O.B. Archive: http://www.erg.abdn.ac.uk/ipdvb/archive Other related drafts: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bormann-rohc-over-802-01.txt http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-montpetit-ipdvb-config-00.txt http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-miloucheva-udlr-mipv6-00.txt ---- From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Tue Sep 20 05:28:13 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EHeQ9-0000pc-Ke for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 05:28:13 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA18428 for ; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 05:28:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EHeVv-00074D-1y for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 05:34:13 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8K9G1wi007437 for ; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:16:01 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8K9G15l007436 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:16:01 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8K9FuTn007412 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT) for ; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:15:57 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <432FD34C.1090702@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:15:56 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: New web pages and milestones for ipdvb Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-4.399, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-4.399, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 798b2e660f1819ae38035ac1d8d5e3ab Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I've updated the web pages for the ipdvb WG at: http://www.erg.abdn.ac.uk/ip-dvb/ http://www.ietf.org/html.charters/ipdvb-charter.html Specifically, this includes a URL to the newly approved milestones for the ipdvb WG, following discussion with our AD after the last IETF meeting in Paris. There are two changes: * Repositioning of milestones to allow more time to discuss AR requirements and issues, prior to protocol specification. * I am pleased to announce the addition of new milestones to define security REQUIREMENTS (for INFORMATIONAL RFC) - the aim being to understand the security issues, threats, concerns, and to give guidance on usage to support IP. This new milestone does not presume any decision on whether to progress specific security-related extensions to protocols within the WG. Gorry From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Tue Sep 20 05:31:14 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1EHeT3-0001Cy-T5 for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 05:31:14 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA18514 for ; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 05:31:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1EHeYr-00078S-BU for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 05:37:13 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8K9ISM0007538 for ; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:18:28 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8K9ISgv007537 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:18:28 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8K9I6vb007484 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:18:06 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <432FD3CE.50805@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 10:18:06 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk CC: Haitham Cruickshank , S.Iyengar@surrey.ac.uk, stephane.combes@space.alcatel.fr, Laurence.Duquerroy@space.alcatel.fr References: <43292EB7.20508@erg.abdn.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <43292EB7.20508@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-4.399, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-4.399, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60) Subject: Thoughts on draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req-00.txt Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 31247fb3be228bb596db9127becad0bc Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This draft raises several issues, and seems to me to be a good start, at a document that would be useful to this WG. I'd like to get more opinions on what the document does say, and what it does not, so that we can understand whether this fits the needs of this WG. Can I encourage people to read thsi and send comments to the list? I have some comments below, to start this process: Section 1.1: ----- 1) In 1.1 it is may also be worth stating that the service to be protected is the stream (TS Logical Channel) that is between the Encapsulation Gateway and Receiver. This stream is identified at the Gateway and Receiver by a unique PID value associated with the stream (although at the two ends of the link may have differing values, since this can be and is modified in the MPEG2 Transmission Network). ----- 2) It also could perhaps be staring that although a number of components operate within the network. For the IP network service, they do not modify the packet payload. ----- Section 2: Threats ----- 3) I wonder if there are any thoughts on the different "Access to the Channel" related to the set of scenarios in section 3.1 of draft-ietf-ipdvb-arch-xx.txt. - Specifically do people see different threats being important in TV-oriented networks that are contribution/broadcast carrying IP data and networks that are more IP-oriented (with smaller transmit hubs/power)? - I do. - In broadcast networks, it is probably hard to access the ground network at the transmitter (or the contribution feed, in a digital TV scenario). It is therefore hard to modify the traffic sent on the broadcast up-link (from the modulator to the headend/satellite/mast) which would impact all receivers - this typically requires access to facilities and/or a large transmit power (as in Captain Midnight [Ref]). - In contrast, access to the air-interface of specific receivers is much easier. The signal at a Receiver is often much weaker (due to path propagation loss). This could potentially be jammed/replayed/over-loaded with another signal (e.g. A transmitter injecting a signal into the side-lobe of a satellite receive antenna). - DoS, traffic analysis, and other networking threats are more significant for IP-data than TV services, where the potential damage from malicous manipulation is greater. ETC.... ----- 4) I would like to have seen some discussion of the impact of modified/corrupted/forged signalling information on the Receiver. It is usually hard to inject different traffic or modify existing TS Packets within a stream, but through configuration of the (re)multiplexor, access to the physical media (e.g. connections between components), etc it is possible to replace a Stream with a different stream. This could also arise on the broadcast physical link (e.g. An unauthorised high-power transmitter overriding the intended transmission). However, note that the transmissions are normally continuous (rather than the discrete bursts, e.g. Used in 802.11, WiMAX). To successfully inject new/replacement traffic requires the physical layer FEC/modulation to be acquired by the Receiver. L2 signalling (MPEG2 SI) also needs to be consistent with the TS packets being sent. However, the current specifications for MPEG-2 [....] do not specify a method for authentication (or encryption) of the L2 signalling information. - Could we try to define some security properties of the signalling plane (I'd be happy to contribute some starting text)? - Perhaps this should also be identified as an assumption/issue in the Security Considerations section? ----- Hope that helps, Gorry From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Fri Sep 30 07:13:45 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ELIpl-0001uv-Fb for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 07:13:45 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA05033 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 07:13:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ELIxc-0002YE-9X for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 07:21:52 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8UB0etH027355 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 12:00:40 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8UB0eaW027354 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 12:00:40 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from erg.abdn.ac.uk (gresley.erg.abdn.ac.uk [139.133.207.106]) (authenticated bits=0) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8UB0LBi027335 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=NOT); Fri, 30 Sep 2005 12:00:22 +0100 (BST) Message-ID: <433D1AC4.7050905@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 12:00:20 +0100 From: Gorry Fairhurst Organization: University of Aberdeen User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; PPC Mac OS X Mach-O; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: agenda@ietf.org CC: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Subject: ipdvb WG Agenda: Sixty-fourth IETF, 6-11 November 2005. Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam (whitelisted), SpamAssassin (score=-4.399, required 6, autolearn=not spam, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-4.399, required 6, ALL_TRUSTED -1.80, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 4b800b1eab964a31702fa68f1ff0e955 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is the Agenda for the ipdvb WG meeting on 6-11 November 2005. Best wishes, Gorry Fairhurst (ipdvb WG Chair) ----- IP over Digital Video Broadcast (IPDVB) WG Internet Area ipdvb WG Chair: Gorry Fairhurst gorry@erg.abdn.ac.uk 1. Agenda Bashing (10 minutes) - Chair * Agenda changes * Election of Scribe for Proceedings * Jabber Scribe 2. Document Status (5 minutes) - Chair * Updated milestones. * Documents in Last Call - None. * Documents in IESG Review - None. * Documents in RFC Editor Queue: draft-ietf-ipdvb-ule-06 (Proposed Standard) draft-ietf-ipdvb-arch-04 (Informational) * Published RFCs - None. 3. Address Resolution (15 minutes) - M-J Montpetit http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ipdvb-ar-01.txt * L2 Resolution: MPEG signaling. * Non-IETF ULE Code-points (ATSC, SMPTE). * L3 Resolution: ND, UDLR, etc. * Contributions required. 4. IP Address Configuration for ipdvb (10 minutes) - Martin Stiemerling http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-stiemerling-ipdvb-config-01.txt * Future directions for this draft 5. ULE Security Requirements (20 minutes) - Haitham Cruikshank http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-req-00.txt * Requirements and threat analysis. * Contributions required. 6. ULE Security Extension (5 minutes) - Haitham Cruikshank http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-cruickshank-ipdvb-sec-00.txt * Update on document plans. 7. IP Encapsulation for DVB-S.2 (20 minutes) - Juan Cantillo http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-cantillo-ipdvb-s2encaps-01.txt * Requirements and scenarios. * Future directions for this draft. 8. ULE Implementation Status (10 minutes) - Chair/Various * Current status of implementations. 9. A.O.B. Archive: http://www.erg.abdn.ac.uk/ipdvb/archive Other related drafts: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-bormann-rohc-over-802-01.txt http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-montpetit-ipdvb-config-00.txt http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-miloucheva-udlr-mipv6-00.txt ---- From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Fri Sep 30 08:02:43 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ELJb8-0005a7-TQ for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 08:02:43 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA06679 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 08:02:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ELJiy-0003fs-S4 for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 08:10:50 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8UBoFZ2000871 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 12:50:15 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8UBoFtk000870 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 12:50:15 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from mermoz.ensica.fr (hermes.ensica.fr [192.70.110.90]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8UBo6N4000643 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 12:50:06 +0100 (BST) Received: from DrCerebro (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mermoz.ensica.fr (8.10.2+Sun/jtpda-5.3.1) with SMTP id j8UBo5W01201 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 13:50:05 +0200 (MEST) Message-ID: <000c01c5c5b5$0b3767a0$877a36c1@DrCerebro> From: "Juan Cantillo" To: References: Subject: IP over DVB-S2 requirements draft Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 13:49:41 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0009_01C5C5C5.CE723EB0" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.2180 X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.598, required 6, autolearn=not spam, BAYES_00 -2.60, HTML_MESSAGE 0.00), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.598, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60, HTML_MESSAGE 0.00) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-Spam-Score: 0.3 (/) X-Scan-Signature: 386e0819b1192672467565a524848168 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C5C5C5.CE723EB0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: Non-IP Protocol SupportDear all, Following the 63th meeting discussions, we have produced a brand-new = version of our document concerning the IP/DVB-S2 issues. The I-D = "draft-cantillo-ipdvb-s2encaps-01.txt" si bnow available online at:=20 http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-cantillo-ipdvb-s2encaps-01.txt We look forward to discussing the draft together in Vancouver. Of = course, we warmly encourage you to take a look at it from now; comments, = questions and remarks are most welcome via @. Best regards, ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Juan CANTILLO - SatComs PhD. Researcher Tel +33 6 23 54 59 65- Fax +33 5 61 61 86 88 ENST/TeSA/ENSICA/AAS, Toulouse, FR ------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C5C5C5.CE723EB0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Re: Non-IP Protocol Support
Dear=20 all,
 
Following = the 63th=20 meeting discussions, we have produced a brand-new version of our=20 document concerning the IP/DVB-S2 issues. The = I-D "draft-cantillo-ipdvb-s2encaps-01.txt" si bnow = available=20 online at:
 
 
We look = forward to=20 discussing the draft together in Vancouver. Of course, we warmly = encourage you=20 to take a look at it from now; comments, questions and remarks are most = welcome=20 via @.
 
Best=20 regards,

-----------------------------------------------------= ------------------
Juan=20 CANTILLO - SatComs PhD. Researcher
Tel +33 6 23 54 59 65- Fax  = +33 5 61=20 61 86 88
ENST/TeSA/ENSICA/AAS, Toulouse, FR
 
 
 
------=_NextPart_000_0009_01C5C5C5.CE723EB0-- From owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Fri Sep 30 11:48:16 2005 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by megatron.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.32) id 1ELN7O-0001Ok-FK for ipdvb-archive@megatron.ietf.org; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 11:48:16 -0400 Received: from ietf-mx.ietf.org (ietf-mx [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id LAA17627 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 11:48:12 -0400 (EDT) Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk ([139.133.204.82] helo=erg.abdn.ac.uk) by ietf-mx.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ELNFD-0000Qe-Ce for ipdvb-archive@ietf.org; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 11:56:24 -0400 Received: from dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8UFdG6R018077 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 16:39:16 +0100 (BST) Received: (from majordomo.lists@localhost) by dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.12.2/Submit) id j8UFdGkN018076 for ipdvb-subscribed-users; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 16:39:16 +0100 (BST) X-Authentication-Warning: dee.erg.abdn.ac.uk: majordomo.lists set sender to owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk using -f Received: from istanbul.uab.es (istanbul.uab.es [158.109.168.138]) by erg.abdn.ac.uk (8.13.4/8.13.4) with ESMTP id j8UFdAq2018029 for ; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 16:39:10 +0100 (BST) Received: from istanbul.uab.es (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by istanbul.uab.es (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.1 HotFix 0.10 (built Jan 6 2005)) with ESMTP id <0INM00EGFZLN7200@istanbul.uab.es> for ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 17:41:47 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] ([158.109.69.162]) by istanbul.uab.es (Sun Java System Messaging Server 6.1 HotFix 0.10 (built Jan 6 2005)) with ESMTP id <0INM00CMBZLMFSC0@istanbul.uab.es> for ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk; Fri, 30 Sep 2005 17:41:47 +0200 (CEST) Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 17:39:50 +0200 From: Fausto Vieira Subject: IP over DVB-S2 early structure In-reply-to: <000c01c5c5b5$0b3767a0$877a36c1@DrCerebro> To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Message-id: <433D5C46.7030909@sunaut.uab.es> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed X-Accept-Language: en-us, en References: <000c01c5c5b5$0b3767a0$877a36c1@DrCerebro> User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) X-ERG-MailScanner: Found to be clean, Found to be clean X-ERG-MailScanner-SpamCheck: not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.599, required 6, autolearn=not spam, BAYES_00 -2.60), not spam, SpamAssassin (score=-2.599, required 6, BAYES_00 -2.60) Sender: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk X-ERG-MailScanner-From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by erg.abdn.ac.uk id j8UFdG6R018077 X-Spam-Score: 0.0 (/) X-Scan-Signature: a7d2e37451f7f22841e3b6f40c67db0f Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Some ideas for encapsulation protocol of IP over DVB-S2. This is not in=20 a draft structure because it is still an idea and I have never done a=20 IETF draft. No security support is described yet. ------------------------------------------ The frames should fit the exact size of the BBFRAME DATAFIELD. The structure would be something like: HEADER+OPTIONAL_FIELDS+PAYLOAD+PADDING+OPTIONAL_CRC or for multiple packet encapsulation: HEADER+OPTIONAL_FIELDS+PAYLOAD+MINI_HEADER+PADDING+OPTIONAL_CRC The HEADER should consist of: ID - Required to determine encapsulation protocol VERSION - Required for future versions on the protocol ENCAP_PROTO - Network layer protocol ID: IPv4 unicast, IPv4 multicast,=20 IPv6 unicast, IPv6 multicast, IPv4/IPv6 compressed datagrams, other=20 (specified in optional field MULTI_PACKETS - True if more than one packet in the encapsulation frame MAC_FIELDS - MAC addresses present for this packet. Four possible=20 values: No MAC addresses, Destination only MAC address, Source only MAC=20 address, Source and Destination MAC address FRAG_STATUS - Four possible values: NO - packet not fragmented, BEGIN -=20 packet is fragmented and starts in this frame, CONTINUED - The start of=20 the packet was in a past frame and it will continue in a future frame OTHER_FIELDS - Defines if a next_field+field_data kind of structure is=20 present in this frame CRC_CHECK - Exists CRC field in the end of the frame. Four possible=20 values: NO, CRC8, CRC16, CRC32 This would be the fixed header. According to the options in the header,=20 possible fields may follow the header: If ENCAP_PROTO is not native, this field would specify the protocol with=20 a ETHER_TYPE field. If MAC_FIELDS is different from NO, then one or two MAC addresses will=20 follow according to the value of the MAC_fields If FRAG_STATUS is not NO, then a FRAG_ID number is inserted here in=20 other to send several fragmented packets in non-consecutive frames. If MULTI_PACKETS is true then offset field is inserted here to inform=20 the decoder where to jump to process next packet. From the information=20 sent to this point, the decoder probably knows if the packet is meant=20 for it. If OTHER_FIELDS is true then a sequence of NEXT_FIELD+FIELD_DATA is=20 inserted here. After these fields, the payload itself would be inserted here. PAYLOAD After the PAYLOAD, another packet may be present, but if not jump to=20 PADDING section. MULTI_PACKETS must be true for this to be allowed. The other packets present in the frame do not require the same header=20 information. These packets could be preceded by the following: MINI_HEADER: ENCAP_PROTO+MAC_FIELDS+FRAG_STATUS+MULTI_PACKETS+OTHER_FIELDS The sequence of optional fields should follow according to the MINI_HEADE= R. After these fields, the payload itself would be inserted here. PAYLOAD After the PAYLOAD, another packet may be present, but if not jump to=20 PADDING section. MULTI_PACKETS must be true for this to be allowed. PADDING - even with multiple packets and fragmentation in one frame,=20 these may not fit perfectly inside the frame and therefore some padding=20 could be required. OPTIONAL_CRC - This field could be mandatory for some payload. CRC=20 checks could be chosen according to the free space in the frame that=20 would be otherwise wasted on padding. --=20 Fausto Vieira Researcher Dpt. Telecomunicaci=F3 i d'Enginyeria de Sistemes ETSE - UNIVERSITAT AUT=D2NOMA DE BARCELONA Campus Universitari, s/n 08193 Bellatera Barcelona SPAIN Phone :(34) 935813843 Fax :(34) 935814031=20