From nobody Sun Aug 3 21:51:50 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F0661B284F for ; Sun, 3 Aug 2014 21:51:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id t7I9DxHy2PYh for ; Sun, 3 Aug 2014 21:51:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from trammell.ch (trammell1.nine.ch [5.148.172.66]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9A281B284E for ; Sun, 3 Aug 2014 21:51:46 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [IPv6:2001:470:26:9c2::2] (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:26:9c2::2]) by trammell.ch (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 4C9C71A05C5; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 06:51:15 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_D9D4844C-B8EA-4806-B7F8-1CF23FE0D8CF"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.6\)) From: Brian Trammell In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2014 06:51:14 +0200 Message-Id: <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> References: <5248F368-6558-40B3-A8CC-909797D3E7CB@trammell.ch> To: Greg Mirsky X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.6) Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/S4Z5VledKm3LYc_87fOADw-Rn8Y Cc: "ippm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2014 04:51:49 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_D9D4844C-B8EA-4806-B7F8-1CF23FE0D8CF Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_2D2CE0F0-96F3-4291-8043-C5A7697B5283" --Apple-Mail=_2D2CE0F0-96F3-4291-8043-C5A7697B5283 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii hi Greg, I've updated the posted minutes. Thanks, best regards, Brian On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky wrote: > Hi Brian, > could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of = rate-problem document. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as = well as proposal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the = requirement to "protocol MUST support generating asymmetrical packet = size. Protocol SHOULD support generating packets with asymmetrical = size." "general agreement in the room" in my opinion very accurately = captures the reaction to the proposal. >=20 > Regards, > Greg >=20 >=20 > On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell = wrote: > Greetings, all, >=20 > Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at: >=20 > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm >=20 > Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting. >=20 > If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at = ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Many thanks, best regards, >=20 > Brian > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm >=20 --Apple-Mail=_2D2CE0F0-96F3-4291-8043-C5A7697B5283 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii hi = Greg,

I've updated the posted = minutes.

Thanks, best = regards,

Brian

On 30 = Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> = wrote:

Hi Brian,
could = you please update the minutes in part of discussion of rate-problem = document. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as well as = proposal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the requirement to = "protocol MUST support generating asymmetrical packet size. Protocol = SHOULD support generating packets with asymmetrical size." "general = agreement in the room" in my opinion very accurately captures the = reaction to the proposal.

Regards,
Greg


On Wed, Jul 23, = 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell <ietf@trammell.ch> wrote:
Greetings, all,

Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at:

http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ip= pm

Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting.

If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org.=

Many thanks, best regards,

Brian
_______________________________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm


= --Apple-Mail=_2D2CE0F0-96F3-4291-8043-C5A7697B5283-- --Apple-Mail=_D9D4844C-B8EA-4806-B7F8-1CF23FE0D8CF Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: GPGTools - https://gpgtools.org iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJT3xFCAAoJENt3nsOmbNJce9MH/0hA+jzXwt7nfM003EgN+IVU oZwdh5bWsfSRBhFwIZo6+lQzgpvZQL7Ngvb1i5NWbwLnsPkBadERBxEtqMZxI1K8 XOsPZKnh3aYtVue5tA4MXWIILQziOdlqSlcS6WxE3bk83P8Nakn460nez3myl+c8 PjI1D09DHqElpBlYXwdOdQrRi4BPrdYfdHc6pOwNvu/ibkQQFceOsjYZO4UY3F0s 8Ne0kk0JrYq71qZdyAtlZLL5qdxpedoIAd01diJiwrnO1dQofhBrTR8I4kJz1St3 OPjbFoi25ch7OWUXGta1S/7BOxoPEBEbk+vZP4+AYu0KxqRb3+O2OCw50zMlafk= =fpFY -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_D9D4844C-B8EA-4806-B7F8-1CF23FE0D8CF-- From nobody Mon Aug 4 12:28:00 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E1C0B1A02A0 for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 12:27:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id x2eO8b6W9Y15 for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 12:27:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pink.research.att.com (mail-pink.research.att.com [204.178.8.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 137A81A029F for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 12:27:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-azure.research.att.com (unknown [135.207.255.18]) by mail-pink.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 02C7B121E67; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 15:33:32 -0400 (EDT) Received: from njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com (unknown [135.207.255.243]) by mail-azure.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94E6EE0219; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 15:27:53 -0400 (EDT) Received: from NJFPSRVEXG8.research.att.com ([fe80::cdea:b3f6:3efa:1841]) by njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com ([fe80::cdea:b3f6:3efa:1841%13]) with mapi; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 15:27:53 -0400 From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" To: Brian Trammell , Greg Mirsky Date: Mon, 4 Aug 2014 15:27:52 -0400 Thread-Topic: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker Thread-Index: Ac+vn9nIzK2nSLkISXKG6dfzDwhUPgAeTw6Q Message-ID: <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> References: <5248F368-6558-40B3-A8CC-909797D3E7CB@trammell.ch> <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> In-Reply-To: <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1njfpsrvexg8re_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/VAzDvrT8ExM3VWqkB2Bj3upg1aM Cc: "ippm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2014 19:27:59 -0000 --_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1njfpsrvexg8re_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In the minutes: - Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't want t= o solve this problem, you can choose to ignore it. s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/ missing from minutes, between Greg and Brian: - Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size? (general agreement in the room) - Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetrical size - Brian Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the SHOUL= D Al From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian Trammell Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 12:51 AM To: Greg Mirsky Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatra= cker hi Greg, I've updated the posted minutes. Thanks, best regards, Brian On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky > wrote: Hi Brian, could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of rate-problem d= ocument. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as well as proposal= , after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the requirement to "protocol MU= ST support generating asymmetrical packet size. Protocol SHOULD support gen= erating packets with asymmetrical size." "general agreement in the room" in= my opinion very accurately captures the reaction to the proposal. Regards, Greg On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell > wrote: Greetings, all, Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting. If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at ippm-chairs@to= ols.ietf.org. Many thanks, best regards, Brian _______________________________________________ ippm mailing list ippm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm --_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1njfpsrvexg8re_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

In the minutes:

 

- Al Morton: all tools today sen= d asymmetrical packets; if you don't want to

sol= ve this problem, you can choose to ignore it.

 

s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/=

 

missing from minutes, between Gre= g and Brian:

- Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOU=
LD on packet size? 
(general agreement in the room)
- Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetr=
ical size
- Brian Trammell: there should be a statemen=
t of applicability on the SHOULD

 

Al

 

From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org]= On Behalf Of Brian Trammell
Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014= 12:51 AM
To: Greg Mirsky
Cc: ippm@ietf.org
Subje= ct: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatrac= ker

 =

hi Greg,

<= o:p> 

I've updated the posted= minutes.

 

Thanks, best regards,

 

Brian

 <= /p>

On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky <= ;gregimirsky@gmail.com> wro= te:



Hi Brian,

could you please update the minute= s in part of discussion of rate-problem document. I believe the comments ta= gged 'Mike' were mine as well as proposal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, = to modify the requirement to "protocol MUST support generating asymmet= rical packet size. Protocol SHOULD support generating packets with asymmetr= ical size." "general agreement in the room" in my opinion ve= ry accurately captures the reaction to the proposal.

Regards,

Greg

 

On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:1= 7 PM, Brian Trammell <ietf@trammell.ch> wrote:

Gree= tings, all,

Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at:<= br>
http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-= ippm

Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the me= eting.

If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at = ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org.

Many thanks, best regards,

Brian
______________________= _________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm

 

 

= --_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1njfpsrvexg8re_-- From nobody Mon Aug 4 16:38:52 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE2441A0A6D for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 16:38:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mYrImchamOoS for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 16:38:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from trammell.ch (trammell1.nine.ch [5.148.172.66]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 192F81A0880 for ; Mon, 4 Aug 2014 16:38:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [IPv6:2001:470:26:9c2::2] (unknown [IPv6:2001:470:26:9c2::2]) by trammell.ch (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9C76C1A03F8; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 01:38:15 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_925BF0A3-BF30-4E88-8DDF-370730AE5A8C"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.6\)) From: Brian Trammell In-Reply-To: <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 01:38:14 +0200 Message-Id: References: <5248F368-6558-40B3-A8CC-909797D3E7CB@trammell.ch> <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> To: Al Morton X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.6) Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/ahGx17YYM-uCsLJOG0CyWT4wcDg Cc: "ippm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 04 Aug 2014 23:38:50 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_925BF0A3-BF30-4E88-8DDF-370730AE5A8C Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_6B8F1066-FF67-485A-9D27-BF619C09FFA3" --Apple-Mail=_6B8F1066-FF67-485A-9D27-BF619C09FFA3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii hi Al, all, On 04 Aug 2014, at 21:27, MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) = wrote: > In the minutes: > =20 > - Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't = want to > solve this problem, you can choose to ignore it. > =20 > s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/ Okay, this makes more sense to me now. > =20 > missing from minutes, between Greg and Brian: > - Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size?=20 > (general agreement in the room) > - Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetrical size > - Brian Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the = SHOULD Corrected; added. Thanks, cheers, Brian > Al > =20 > From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian Trammell > Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 12:51 AM > To: Greg Mirsky > Cc: ippm@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to = datatracker > =20 > hi Greg, > =20 > I've updated the posted minutes. > =20 > Thanks, best regards, > =20 > Brian > =20 > On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky wrote: >=20 >=20 > Hi Brian, > could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of = rate-problem document. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as = well as proposal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the = requirement to "protocol MUST support generating asymmetrical packet = size. Protocol SHOULD support generating packets with asymmetrical = size." "general agreement in the room" in my opinion very accurately = captures the reaction to the proposal. >=20 > Regards, > Greg > =20 >=20 > On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell = wrote: > Greetings, all, >=20 > Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at: >=20 > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm >=20 > Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting. >=20 > If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at = ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Many thanks, best regards, >=20 > Brian > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm --Apple-Mail=_6B8F1066-FF67-485A-9D27-BF619C09FFA3 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii hi Al, = all,

On 04 Aug 2014, at 21:27, MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) = <acmorton@att.com> = wrote:

In the = minutes:
 
- Al Morton: all = tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't want = to
solve this = problem, you can choose to ignore it.
 
s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/

Okay, this makes more sense to me = now.

 
missing from = minutes, between Greg and Brian:
- Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size? =

(general agreement in the =
room)
- Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH =
symmetrical and asymmetrical size
- Brian =
Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the =
SHOULD

Corrected; = added.

Thanks, = cheers,

Brian

Al
 
From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian = Trammell
Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 = 12:51 AM
To: Greg = Mirsky
Cc: ippm@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 = IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to = datatracker
 
hi = Greg,
 
I've = updated the posted minutes.
 
Thanks, best = regards,
 
Brian
 
On 30 = Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> = wrote:


Hi Brian,

could you please update the minutes in part of = discussion of rate-problem document. I believe the comments tagged = 'Mike' were mine as well as proposal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, to = modify the requirement to "protocol MUST support generating asymmetrical = packet size. Protocol SHOULD support generating packets with = asymmetrical size." "general agreement in the room" in my opinion very = accurately captures the reaction to the = proposal.

Regards,
Greg

 

On = Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell <ietf@trammell.ch> = wrote:
Greetings, = all,

Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available = at:

http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm=

Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the = meeting.

If you have any comments or additions, please let us = know at ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org.

Many = thanks, best = regards,

Brian
_______________________________________________ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm

= --Apple-Mail=_6B8F1066-FF67-485A-9D27-BF619C09FFA3-- --Apple-Mail=_925BF0A3-BF30-4E88-8DDF-370730AE5A8C Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: GPGTools - https://gpgtools.org iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJT4BlmAAoJENt3nsOmbNJcVKwH/3ybxMIelfmZKt/LcXbJXl+a p0oAZ+7cXfXJL/vPO7j9uw3bxuzvXu6/VBd7vDbtjneqct8pETlL/LVdrJlvgmmp U6MlN/czPx1eX9HfwO/UICnG4k9D+p8fB6RTtO2K2Fl4nlJNifhZT3xCCUuK86Z3 l95d8j+d1OBccvfwZc6xkhVelJ+tDLsOYo02lO6qXA/vVkisOD6xob/e3JhTOTVL Vj44XLU/+GGR7zrylQZ9NnBZ1sfny3Bc1IWCAAbFhNbRb0jeN6bzCc4m1w3H5flC /v+gVTF3ieR+Akx717i2BxgKhgg5UIi+NtDoy86ZShYIiMkixbux/+6Q+qpL3WU= =lAvj -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_925BF0A3-BF30-4E88-8DDF-370730AE5A8C-- From nobody Tue Aug 5 02:39:31 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 204C81B28DD for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 02:39:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.378 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.378 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, HELO_EQ_IT=0.635, HOST_EQ_IT=1.245, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ANYgidnP-VMq for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 02:39:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from teledg002ba020.telecomitalia.it (teledg002ba020.telecomitalia.it [156.54.233.211]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1AA881B28E4 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 02:39:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from TELCAH006BA020.telecomitalia.local (10.188.101.224) by teledg002ba020.telecomitalia.it (10.188.101.211) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.181.6; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 11:39:22 +0200 Received: from TELMBB001BA020.telecomitalia.local ([169.254.2.208]) by telcah006ba020.telecomitalia.local ([10.188.101.224]) with mapi id 14.03.0181.006; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 11:39:22 +0200 From: Ionta Tiziano To: "'ippm@ietf.org'" Thread-Topic: [ippm] Comments on draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework-02.txt Thread-Index: AQHO91A9HTtBR7qzSUO72FS3WjHqBpvDJKKQ Importance: high X-Priority: 1 Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:39:21 +0000 Message-ID: <0AD5F8BADDD1FF4097676479A6D8F7B331056D55@TELMBB001BA020.telecomitalia.local> References: <52A9D877.9020305@tik.ee.ethz.ch> In-Reply-To: <52A9D877.9020305@tik.ee.ethz.ch> Accept-Language: it-IT, en-US Content-Language: it-IT X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.188.101.187] x-ti-disclaimer: Disclaimer1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/A0D6txFLreiUaA8uTnjvWXgoO9c Subject: [ippm] R: Comments on draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework-02.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2014 09:39:30 -0000 Hi all, here are my comments: (1) Abstract: - the present document DOES NOT specify a passive measurement method, becau= se the document specifying that particular passive measurement method (that= is marking into different blocks of markers by changing one or more bits o= f packets) is the TEMPIA-OPSAWG-P3M (and IPR disclosures have been submitte= d years ago directly on the tempia-opsawg-p3m, thus this passive measuremen= t method cannot be used in other drafts, unless previous authorization) - My proposal is to change the content of the abstract writing the only rea= l added value of the draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework-02, tha= t is: a) the use of IPFIX for reporting the measurement data (obtained through an= y possible passive measurement method, including the colouring method intro= duced in tempia-opsawg-p3m) to a central calculation element for performanc= e metrics calculation b) the definition of a reference model (2) Title: basing on what written above, the keyword "coloring-based" shoul= d be removed from the title (3) Introduction: basing on what written above, the introduction should be = changed consequently (4) Content of the document: basing on what written above, the parts regard= ing the colouring passive measurement method should be removed, thus only m= entioning a general passive measurement method, but not anymore the colouri= ng passive measurement method already defined in the tempia-opsawg-p3m. (4) par. 9: basing on what written above, this paragraph should be removed = from the document. Furthermore, in my experience, the colouring through the= marking of the last reserved bit of the Flag field of the IPv4 header is a= lmost unfeasible, because the policy-map and class-map philosophy does not = allow the check of this field. Consequently any other method for checking t= his field is too heavy for a (medium/large size) router. Best Tiziano Ionta (Telecom Italia) Questo messaggio e i suoi allegati sono indirizzati esclusivamente alle per= sone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione derivante dall= a conoscenza di queste informazioni sono rigorosamente vietate. Qualora abb= iate ricevuto questo documento per errore siete cortesemente pregati di dar= ne immediata comunicazione al mittente e di provvedere alla sua distruzione= , Grazie. This e-mail and any attachments is confidential and may contain privileged = information intended for the addressee(s) only. Dissemination, copying, pri= nting or use by anybody else is unauthorised. If you are not the intended r= ecipient, please delete this message and any attachments and advise the sen= der by return e-mail, Thanks. From nobody Tue Aug 5 03:02:54 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 869EF1B29B9 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 03:02:53 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.021 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.021 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HELO_EQ_IT=0.635, HOST_EQ_IT=1.245, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uB13jjQQ84eP for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 03:02:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from teledg001ba020.telecomitalia.it (teledg001ba020.telecomitalia.it [156.54.233.210]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F3ABC1B2994 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 03:02:49 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="_9b03885e-6f79-4e95-a24d-a4767acd5d00_" Received: from TELCAH003BA020.telecomitalia.local (10.188.101.218) by teledg001ba020.telecomitalia.it (10.188.101.210) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.181.6; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 12:02:47 +0200 Received: from TELMBB001BA020.telecomitalia.local ([169.254.2.208]) by telcah003ba020.telecomitalia.local ([10.188.101.218]) with mapi id 14.03.0181.006; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 12:02:47 +0200 From: Ionta Tiziano To: "'ippm@ietf.org'" Thread-Topic: R: [ippm] Comments on draft-chen-ippm-ipfpm-report-00 Thread-Index: Ac+wlGbxm8g+R9MrRN6bz603ksnuIg== Importance: high X-Priority: 1 Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 10:02:46 +0000 Message-ID: <0AD5F8BADDD1FF4097676479A6D8F7B331056DBC@TELMBB001BA020.telecomitalia.local> Accept-Language: it-IT, en-US Content-Language: it-IT X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.188.101.187] x-ti-disclaimer: Disclaimer1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/n-QJrQKPQczL7pWGNPzyWcWQFI4 Subject: [ippm] R: Comments on draft-chen-ippm-ipfpm-report-00 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2014 10:02:53 -0000 --_9b03885e-6f79-4e95-a24d-a4767acd5d00_ Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_0AD5F8BADDD1FF4097676479A6D8F7B331056DBCTELMBB001BA020t_" --_000_0AD5F8BADDD1FF4097676479A6D8F7B331056DBCTELMBB001BA020t_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, Referring to my recent comments on draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-fra= mework, here are my comments draft-chen-ippm-ipfpm-report-00: (a) Abstract: the sentence "A marking based IP Flow Performance Measurement= (IPFPM) framework is specified in draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-fra= mework" is NOT correct because in draft-chen should be mentioned just a gen= eral passive Performance Measurement method, NOT the "marking based" one, b= ecause this belongs to the TEMPIA-OPSAWG-P3M (and IPR disclosures have been= submitted years ago directly on the tempia-opsawg-p3m, thus this passive m= easurement method cannot be used in other drafts, unless previous authoriza= tion). For the same reason in the introduction of draft-chen-ippm-ipfpm-rep= ort-00 the keyword "marking based" SHOULD be substituted with "Generic pass= ive" (b) Introduction: - the sentence "A marking based IP Flow Performance Measurement (IPFPM) fra= mework is specified in draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework": sa= me as above for the abstract - the sentence "The IPFPM framework describes a mechanism where data packet= s are marked so that they form blocks of data" is NOT true because the abov= e mechanism has been described in TEMPIA-OPSAWG-P3M Best Tiziano Ionta (TELECOM ITALIA) Questo messaggio e i suoi allegati sono indirizzati esclusivamente alle per= sone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione derivante dall= a conoscenza di queste informazioni sono rigorosamente vietate. Qualora abb= iate ricevuto questo documento per errore siete cortesemente pregati di dar= ne immediata comunicazione al mittente e di provvedere alla sua distruzione= , Grazie. This e-mail and any attachments is confidential and may contain privileged = information intended for the addressee(s) only. Dissemination, copying, pri= nting or use by anybody else is unauthorised. If you are not the intended r= ecipient, please delete this message and any attachments and advise the sen= der by return e-mail, Thanks. [rispetta l'ambiente]Rispetta l'ambiente. Non stampare questa mail se non ?= necessario. --_000_0AD5F8BADDD1FF4097676479A6D8F7B331056DBCTELMBB001BA020t_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi all,

Referring to my recent comments on draft-chen-i= ppm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework, here are my comments draft-chen-ippm-ip= fpm-report-00:

 

(a) Abstract: the sentence “A marking bas= ed IP Flow Performance Measurement (IPFPM) framework is specified in draft-= chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework” is NOT correct because in draft-chen should be mentioned just a general pa= ssive Performance Measurement method, NOT the “marking based” o= ne, because this belongs to the TEMPIA-OPSAWG-P3M (and IPR disclo= sures have been submitted years ago directly on the tempia-opsawg-p3m, thus= this passive measurement method cannot be used in other drafts, unless previous authorization). For the same reason in the introduction of draft-chen-= ippm-ipfpm-report-00 the keyword “marking based” SHOULD be substituted with “Generic passive”=

 

(b) Introduction:

- the sentence “A marking based IP Flow P= erformance Measurement (IPFPM) framework is specified in draft-chen-ippm-co= loring-based-ipfpm-framework”:  same as above for the abstract

- the sentence “The IPFPM framework descr= ibes a mechanism where data packets are marked so that they form blocks of = data” is NOT true because the above mechanism has been described in TEMPIA-OPSAWG-P3M

 

Best

Tiziano Ionta (TELECOM ITALIA)

= Questo messaggio e i suoi allegati sono indirizzati esclusivamente alle per= sone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione derivante dalla conoscenza di queste informazioni sono rigoro= samente vietate. Qualora abbiate ricevuto questo documento per errore siete= cortesemente pregati di darne immediata comunicazione al mittente e di pro= vvedere alla sua distruzione, Grazie.

This e-mail and any attachments is confidential and may contain privileged information intended for the addressee(s) only.= Dissemination, copying, printing or use by anybody else is unauthorised. I= f you are not the intended recipient, please delete this message and any at= tachments and advise the sender by return e-mail, Thanks.

3D"rispettaRispetta= l'ambiente. Non stampare questa mail se non è necessario.

--_000_0AD5F8BADDD1FF4097676479A6D8F7B331056DBCTELMBB001BA020t_-- --_9b03885e-6f79-4e95-a24d-a4767acd5d00_ Content-Description: logo Ambiente_foglia2.jpg Content-Type: image/jpeg; name="logo Ambiente_foglia2.jpg" Content-Disposition: inline; filename="logo Ambiente_foglia2.jpg" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-ID: 00000000000000000000000000000003@TI.Disclaimer R0lGODlhGgAoANU5AEiFNnikNyRvNcvYOafCOEOEW3DO3jB2NqjGs9ny9o+zOIOrN+L1+G+ggbzo 8GCUN1SNNv///zx+NrPJOL/ROYPV44zY5YuzmrfQwCZxQlKNaMXZzOfy8NTi2TV6TuLs5vX8/ez5 +4yzmtTj2cXr8mCXdKni62ycN5/f6aDf6X2qjrPl7rLl7Zu6OJbb53nS4PH188bs8sXZzfH18pq9 p0SDWxhnNWbL3NfgOf///wAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACH5BAEAADkALAAAAAAaACgAAAb/wJxw SBQ6WMWkMmm6kZbQ5OvmjFoT1JuBYYWmsrcXqJvEgm8WctFypnI66pyjfXMhCmqGgR4r2S5dIBV0 FjI2h3BRX20VHAUCEjZ4UHNtFo42BA+HCEskbQYOIwU2CjgBNgAZM0kMbSYcIjYCBDg4LTYLf0V6 YCghNBk2DwO2OASZqkS9VBYMCB6pE8bGucidOYJUoaOptdQTFDg2ATgHGkIs2wyyAqbUtgICCwfl uh8ge1sNNhDF8LYiHYKAg4INBJUS8FsAEF6AA6lsHWjg4gYKDDZONGwIAIAtCAX2hPAgYSNHj6ds 3KiA8V3DAQGm2epoS4HKFQ0EmMRhc97Mwge2kN1IoIGgyQECD5wQUO6YygTkdtpCdSgqDl0VoDaV OmDBpm+oTCQoABQgBZfGbIrDAUBDAgcNDnDs98/WA504Buxa0RKgzVkB/h0oi+pDjgQhHtU1RgDi oY6l8gpAJyTBCBsSFtuC6XjWTBuJhIRAgFkmwAmoAkM4mCQCBmEB1sIDIKAFRGytYfDrt4CAuAkn qnrYYCXCBxGkqlYtgbtLhOcbMNSw0SBOEmg2VFj/sGHDhRLCNBC3fqFqARWhowQBADs= --_9b03885e-6f79-4e95-a24d-a4767acd5d00_-- From nobody Tue Aug 5 05:02:51 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 097041A0002 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 05:02:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4nARAorJM171 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 05:02:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pink.research.att.com (mail-pink.research.att.com [204.178.8.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA8C21A0004 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 05:02:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-blue.research.att.com (unknown [135.207.178.11]) by mail-pink.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DE1B41217D6; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 08:07:08 -0400 (EDT) Received: from njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com (unknown [135.207.255.243]) by mail-blue.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CA85F0103; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 08:01:28 -0400 (EDT) Received: from NJFPSRVEXG8.research.att.com ([fe80::cdea:b3f6:3efa:1841]) by njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com ([fe80::cdea:b3f6:3efa:1841%13]) with mapi; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 08:01:28 -0400 From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" To: "steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca" , Brian Trammell , Greg Mirsky Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 08:01:27 -0400 Thread-Topic: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker Thread-Index: Ac+wPJrDDW3YZdAuT6amG2azXn7TVgAaEjDg Message-ID: <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> References: <5248F368-6558-40B3-A8CC-909797D3E7CB@trammell.ch> <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> <7660c1821ae91.53e01589@videotron.ca> <77a0c6f91f28f.53e015c6@videotron.ca> <774095cf19c11.53e01603@videotron.ca> <7760ffa81e376.53e01640@videotron.ca> <76b0d1aa1d3cb.53e0167d@videotron.ca> <76e0e2e919322.53e016ba@videotron.ca> <7650c2461c39b.53e016f7@videotron.ca> <76c0d9b91b7f9.53e01734@videotron.ca> <76d0e5d41b21a.53e01773@videotron.ca> <76a0a6261934f.53e017af@videotron.ca> <7750f6771ae95.53e017ec@videotron.ca> <7740913a18c43.53e01829@videotron.ca> <76a0e0a91c050.53dfe00f@videotron.ca> In-Reply-To: <76a0e0a91c050.53dfe00f@videotron.ca> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757njfpsrvexg8re_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/w9hCtx2YIFe6tuVmjIjy5TRHSos Cc: "ippm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2014 12:02:49 -0000 --_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757njfpsrvexg8re_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Steve, did you come down off the ceiling yet? I was correcting a typo in the minutes... Al From: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca [mailto:steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca= ] Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 7:34 PM To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL); Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatra= cker >Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; This cannot be true! Can you provide the list of tools you have in mind? Are you confusing unidirectional BW measurements and bi-directional BW meas= urements? What is wrong with measuring the forward rate and/or reverse rate of a bidi= rectional path using the same packet size say the path MTU? And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes? What is wrong with measuring the forward rate of a unidirectional path usin= g the same packet size say the path MTU? And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes? -Steve On 8/4/14, "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" > wrote: In the minutes: - Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't want t= o solve this problem, you can choose to ignore it. s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/ missing from minutes, between Greg and Brian: - Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size? (general agreement in the room) - Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetrical size - Brian Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the SHOUL= D Al From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian Trammell Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 12:51 AM To: Greg Mirsky Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatra= cker hi Greg, I've updated the posted minutes. Thanks, best regards, Brian On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky > wrote: Hi Brian, could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of rate-problem d= ocument. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as well as proposal= , after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the requirement to "protocol MU= ST support generating asymmetrical packet size. Protocol SHOULD support gen= erating packets with asymmetrical size." "general agreement in the room" in= my opinion very accurately captures the reaction to the proposal. Regards, Greg On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell > wrote: Greetings, all, Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting. If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at ippm-chairs@to= ols.ietf.org. Many thanks, best regards, Brian _______________________________________________ ippm mailing list ippm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm --_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757njfpsrvexg8re_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Steve, did you come down off the= ceiling yet?

I was correcting a typo in the minu= tes...

 

Al

 

From: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca [mailto:steve.baillargeon= @videotron.ca]
Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 7:34 PM
To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL); Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky
Cc: ippm@ie= tf.org
Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes = posted to datatracker

 

 

>Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packet= s; 

This cannot be true!

 

= Can you provide the list of tools you have in mind?

 

Are you confusing unidirectional BW measurements and bi-directional BW mea= surements?

 <= /p>

What is wrong with measuring the forward= rate and/or reverse rate of a bidirectional path using the same packet siz= e say the path MTU?

And repea= ting the test if needed with different packet sizes?

 

What is wrong with measuring the forward rate of a unidirectional path us= ing the same packet size say the path MTU?

And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes?=

 

<= div>

 

-Steve



On 8/4/14, &q= uot;MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" <acmorton@att.com> wrote:

In the minutes:

 

- Al Morton: all tools = today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't want to

=

solve thi= s problem, you can choose to ignore it.

 

s/as= ymmetrical/symmetrical/

 

missing from minutes= , between Greg and Brian:

- Greg: How about MUST =
on rate, SHOULD on packet size? 
(general agreement in=
 the room)
- Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical=
 and asymmetrical size
- Brian Trammell: there should =
be a statement of applicability on the SHOULD

 

Al<= /span>

 

From:= ipp= m [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian Trammell
Sent: Monday, August 04, 20= 14 12:51 AM
To: Greg Mirsky
Cc: ippm@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPP= M WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker

 

hi Greg,

&nbs= p;

I've updated the posted minutes.

 

Thanks, bes= t regards,

 

=

Brian

 

On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote:

<= o:p> 

Hi Brian,

could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of rate-proble= m document. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as well as propo= sal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the requirement to "pro= tocol MUST support generating asymmetrical packet size. Protocol SHOULD sup= port generating packets with asymmetrical size." "general agreeme= nt in the room" in my opinion very accurately captures the reaction to= the proposal.

Regards,

Greg

 

On Wed, = Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell <ietf@trammell.ch> wrote:

Greeti= ngs, all,

Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at:
http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm<= br>
Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting.
If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org.
<= br>Many thanks, best regards,

Brian
_____________________________= __________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm

<= /div>

 

 

 

= --_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757njfpsrvexg8re_-- From nobody Tue Aug 5 05:54:48 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2165D1ABB17 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 05:54:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.202 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.202 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E-43g714ih8k for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 05:54:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pink.research.att.com (mail-pink.research.att.com [204.178.8.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39C241A0AF6 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 05:54:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-azure.research.att.com (unknown [135.207.255.18]) by mail-pink.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37757122AED; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:00:22 -0400 (EDT) Received: from njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com (unknown [135.207.255.243]) by mail-azure.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A1367E03A1; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 08:54:44 -0400 (EDT) Received: from NJFPSRVEXG8.research.att.com ([fe80::cdea:b3f6:3efa:1841]) by njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com ([fe80::cdea:b3f6:3efa:1841%13]) with mapi; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 08:54:45 -0400 From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" To: Ionta Tiziano , "'ippm@ietf.org'" Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 08:54:43 -0400 Thread-Topic: [ippm] R: Comments on draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework-02.txt Thread-Index: AQHO91A9HTtBR7qzSUO72FS3WjHqBpvDJKKQgABElQA= Message-ID: <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F761@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> References: <52A9D877.9020305@tik.ee.ethz.ch> <0AD5F8BADDD1FF4097676479A6D8F7B331056D55@TELMBB001BA020.telecomitalia.local> In-Reply-To: <0AD5F8BADDD1FF4097676479A6D8F7B331056D55@TELMBB001BA020.telecomitalia.local> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/XnOvxLez-R36FbUm83Fzxr7yb8Y Subject: Re: [ippm] R: Comments on draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework-02.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2014 12:54:47 -0000 I have told the authors about overlap with draft-tempia and its IPR several times, privately. Now we have Tiziano's message which clarifies the situation for all.=20 Al > -----Original Message----- > From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ionta Tiziano > Sent: Tuesday, August 05, 2014 5:39 AM > To: 'ippm@ietf.org' > Subject: [ippm] R: Comments on draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm- > framework-02.txt > Importance: High >=20 > Hi all, > here are my comments: >=20 > (1) Abstract: > - the present document DOES NOT specify a passive measurement method, > because the document specifying that particular passive measurement metho= d > (that is marking into different blocks of markers by changing one or more > bits of packets) is the TEMPIA-OPSAWG-P3M (and IPR disclosures have been > submitted years ago directly on the tempia-opsawg-p3m, thus this passive > measurement method cannot be used in other drafts, unless previous > authorization) > - My proposal is to change the content of the abstract writing the only > real added value of the draft-chen-ippm-coloring-based-ipfpm-framework-02= , > that is: > a) the use of IPFIX for reporting the measurement data (obtained through > any possible passive measurement method, including the colouring method > introduced in tempia-opsawg-p3m) to a central calculation element for > performance metrics calculation > b) the definition of a reference model >=20 > (2) Title: basing on what written above, the keyword "coloring-based" > should be removed from the title >=20 > (3) Introduction: basing on what written above, the introduction should b= e > changed consequently >=20 > (4) Content of the document: basing on what written above, the parts > regarding the colouring passive measurement method should be removed, thu= s > only mentioning a general passive measurement method, but not anymore the > colouring passive measurement method already defined in the tempia-opsawg= - > p3m. >=20 > (4) par. 9: basing on what written above, this paragraph should be remove= d > from the document. Furthermore, in my experience, the colouring through > the marking of the last reserved bit of the Flag field of the IPv4 header > is almost unfeasible, because the policy-map and class-map philosophy doe= s > not allow the check of this field. Consequently any other method for > checking this field is too heavy for a (medium/large size) router. >=20 > Best > Tiziano Ionta (Telecom Italia) >=20 > Questo messaggio e i suoi allegati sono indirizzati esclusivamente alle > persone indicate. La diffusione, copia o qualsiasi altra azione derivante > dalla conoscenza di queste informazioni sono rigorosamente vietate. > Qualora abbiate ricevuto questo documento per errore siete cortesemente > pregati di darne immediata comunicazione al mittente e di provvedere alla > sua distruzione, Grazie. >=20 > This e-mail and any attachments is confidential and may contain privilege= d > information intended for the addressee(s) only. Dissemination, copying, > printing or use by anybody else is unauthorised. If you are not the > intended recipient, please delete this message and any attachments and > advise the sender by return e-mail, Thanks. >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm From nobody Tue Aug 5 09:01:11 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 936F21B2A5B for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:01:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.6 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1HS8tUHM-py1 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:00:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from usevmg21.ericsson.net (usevmg21.ericsson.net [198.24.6.65]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 32C721B2A58 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:00:56 -0700 (PDT) X-AuditID: c6180641-f79916d00000623a-34-53e0a9a6c0e5 Received: from EUSAAHC008.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [147.117.188.96]) by usevmg21.ericsson.net (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id AD.0B.25146.6A9A0E35; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 11:53:42 +0200 (CEST) Received: from EUSAAMB105.ericsson.se ([147.117.188.122]) by EUSAAHC008.ericsson.se ([147.117.188.96]) with mapi id 14.03.0174.001; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 12:00:53 -0400 From: Steve Baillargeon To: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" , "steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca" , "Brian Trammell" , Greg Mirsky Thread-Topic: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker Thread-Index: AQHPq4xqrAC33IStakySmcDyASl+hQAaEjDgm8FgdwA= Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 16:00:52 +0000 Message-ID: References: <5248F368-6558-40B3-A8CC-909797D3E7CB@trammell.ch> <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> <7660c1821ae91.53e01589@videotron.ca> <77a0c6f91f28f.53e015c6@videotron.ca> <774095cf19c11.53e01603@videotron.ca> <7760ffa81e376.53e01640@videotron.ca> <76b0d1aa1d3cb.53e0167d@videotron.ca> <76e0e2e919322.53e016ba@videotron.ca> <7650c2461c39b.53e016f7@videotron.ca> <76c0d9b91b7f9.53e01734@videotron.ca> <76d0e5d41b21a.53e01773@videotron.ca> <76a0a6261934f.53e017af@videotron.ca> <7750f6771ae95.53e017ec@videotron.ca> <7740913a18c43.53e01829@videotron.ca> <76a0e0a91c050.53dfe00f@videotron.ca> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> In-Reply-To: <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> Accept-Language: en-CA, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.117.188.11] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_DCF22B50497F7641B6DDD16ECC516F7F3F0B4AF7eusaamb105erics_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFprBIsWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyuXRPgu6ylQ+CDaY3WFhsPTaR0eLbtKes Fhtb3rFZ9Dx4x2yx5dtuRgdWj5f9cxg9ds66y+6xZMlPJo8n+2eyeHx6uoclgDWKyyYlNSez LLVI3y6BK+Pcui7GgnerGCs2TX3B2MB4eTpjFyMnh4SAiURr93FmCFtM4sK99WxdjFwcQgJH GSU+P17JAuEsY5S4+P47WBWbgIXE+rnLmEESIgL7GSXur+5kAkkwCyhL7H01H2yssECgxJd/ nSwgtohAkMSr15vZIGwriRndbUA1HBwsAioSPw7JgoR5BXwl+tp6mCCWnWOTOPmxD6yXUyBM Yv2WB6wgNqOArMTus9ehdolL3HoynwnibAGJJXvOQ70gKvHy8T9WCFtJ4uPv+ewgu5gF8iX2 b6yE2CUocXLmE5YJjKKzkEyahVA1C0kVRImOxILdn9ggbG2JZQtfM8PYZw48ZkIWX8DIvoqR o7Q4tSw33chwEyMwKo9JsDnuYFzwyfIQowAHoxIPr8LLe8FCrIllxZW5hxilOViUxHk1q+cF CwmkJ5akZqemFqQWxReV5qQWH2Jk4uCUamCMeHC+53B4kNvzxQHLuYwP7m7jVarfWu5yexHf 66Znv+Y4lkqqu7ocNmhf+aQ6bp2IZ8otRosoO58vUzXOVtUXbRKLeazy8bfWmeyoNra/slcr fh72vsnJnmatkfwuK9/t92GxPM6VP5g+7nlaxCd9aNJ9Zt0K0WkbEo3UxTdXvu/5/aH2t6QS S3FGoqEWc1FxIgBoeVcOqwIAAA== Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/DK6UoFvxLVJ3RUlwOAGeWqzWiSc Cc: "ippm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2014 16:01:01 -0000 --_000_DCF22B50497F7641B6DDD16ECC516F7F3F0B4AF7eusaamb105erics_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Al, On the contrary, both feet are stuck on the ground with actual PM work = related to customer networks including the one on your badge! I am still curious to know the answers to my previous questions. I am also curious to find why asymmetrical packet size is so important. Are you thinking about a TCP connection measuring the rate in a given direc= tion with data segments of a given size and (short) ACK segments are travel= ling in the opposite direction? -Steve From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of MORTON, ALFRED C (AL= ) Sent: August-05-14 8:01 AM To: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca; Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatra= cker Steve, did you come down off the ceiling yet? I was correcting a typo in the minutes... Al From: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca= [mailto:steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca] Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 7:34 PM To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL); Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatra= cker >Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; This cannot be true! Can you provide the list of tools you have in mind? Are you confusing unidirectional BW measurements and bi-directional BW meas= urements? What is wrong with measuring the forward rate and/or reverse rate of a bidi= rectional path using the same packet size say the path MTU? And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes? What is wrong with measuring the forward rate of a unidirectional path usin= g the same packet size say the path MTU? And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes? -Steve On 8/4/14, "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" > wrote: In the minutes: - Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't want t= o solve this problem, you can choose to ignore it. s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/ missing from minutes, between Greg and Brian: - Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size? (general agreement in the room) - Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetrical size - Brian Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the SHOUL= D Al From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian Trammell Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 12:51 AM To: Greg Mirsky Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatra= cker hi Greg, I've updated the posted minutes. Thanks, best regards, Brian On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky > wrote: Hi Brian, could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of rate-problem d= ocument. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as well as proposal= , after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the requirement to "protocol MU= ST support generating asymmetrical packet size. Protocol SHOULD support gen= erating packets with asymmetrical size." "general agreement in the room" in= my opinion very accurately captures the reaction to the proposal. Regards, Greg On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell > wrote: Greetings, all, Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at: http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting. If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at ippm-chairs@to= ols.ietf.org. Many thanks, best regards, Brian _______________________________________________ ippm mailing list ippm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm --_000_DCF22B50497F7641B6DDD16ECC516F7F3F0B4AF7eusaamb105erics_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Al, On the contrary, both= feet are stuck on the ground with actual PM work related to customer netwo= rks including the one on your badge!

 <= /p>

I am still curious to kno= w the answers to my previous questions.

 <= /p>

I am also curious to find= why asymmetrical packet size is so important.

Are you thinking about a = TCP connection measuring the rate in a given direction with data segments o= f a given size and (short) ACK segments are travelling in the opposite direction?

 <= /p>

-Steve<= /p>

 <= /p>

From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)
Sent: August-05-14 8:01 AM
To: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca; Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky
Cc: ippm@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to = datatracker

 

Steve, did you come down off the ceiling ye= t?

I was correcting a typo in the minutes...

 

Al

 

From: steve.baillargeon@videotr= on.ca [mailto:steve.b= aillargeon@videotron.ca]
Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 7:34 PM
To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL); Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky
Cc: ippm@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to = datatracker

 

 

>Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; 

This cannot be true!=

 

Can you provide the list of too= ls you have in mind?

 

Are you confusing unidirectiona= l BW measurements and bi-directional BW measurements?

 

What is wrong with measuring th= e forward rate and/or reverse rate of a bidirectional path using the same p= acket size say the path MTU?

And repeating the test if neede= d with different packet sizes?

 

What is wrong with measuring th= e forward rate of a unidirectional path using the same packet size say the = path MTU?

And repeating the test if neede= d with different packet sizes?

 

 

-Steve



On 8/4/14, "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" <acmorton@att.com> wrote:

In the minutes:

 

- Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't wan= t to

solve this problem, you can choose to ignore it.

 

s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/

 

missing from minutes, between Greg and Brian:

- Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size? 

(general agreement in the room)


- Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetrical size=



- Brian Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the =
SHOULD


 


Al


 








From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org]
On Behalf Of Brian Trammell

Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 12:51 AM

To: Greg Mirsky

Cc: ippm@ietf.org

Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to =
datatracker






 


hi Greg,




 






I've updated the posted minutes.






 






Thanks, best regards,






 






Brian






 






On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote:




 










Hi Brian,




could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of rate-proble=
m document. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as well as propo=
sal, after Al's Shakespearean quote,
 to modify the requirement to "protocol MUST support generating asymme=
trical packet size. Protocol SHOULD support generating packets with asymmet=
rical size." "general agreement in the room" in my opinion v=
ery accurately captures the reaction to the proposal.




Regards,




Greg






 




On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell <ietf@trammell.ch> wrote:


Greetings, all,



Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at:



http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm



Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting.



If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at 
ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org.



Many thanks, best regards,



Brian

_______________________________________________

ippm mailing list

ippm@ietf.org

https:/=
/www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm




 






 

 

--_000_DCF22B50497F7641B6DDD16ECC516F7F3F0B4AF7eusaamb105erics_-- From nobody Tue Aug 5 09:13:28 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5302F1B2A71 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:13:26 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.902 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.902 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mZ-g4vcCahn0 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:13:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from trammell.ch (trammell1.nine.ch [5.148.172.66]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B966A1B2A72 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:12:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [IPv6:2001:67c:10ec:2a49:8000::1008] (unknown [IPv6:2001:67c:10ec:2a49:8000::1008]) by trammell.ch (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 6586B1A0314; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 18:12:28 +0200 (CEST) Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="Apple-Mail=_4B2A2A82-8602-44AF-9814-8F2220D6FCA6"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; micalg=pgp-sha512 Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 7.3 \(1878.6\)) From: Brian Trammell In-Reply-To: Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 18:12:30 +0200 Message-Id: <94F4DD6B-576F-4398-B187-8DE0B962C33F@trammell.ch> References: <5248F368-6558-40B3-A8CC-909797D3E7CB@trammell.ch> <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> <7660c1821ae91.53e01589@videotron.ca> <77a0c6f91f28f.53e015c6@videotron.ca> <774095cf19c11.53e01603@videotron.ca> <7760ffa81e376.53e01640@videotron.ca> <76b0d1aa1d3cb.53e0167d@videotron.ca> <76e0e2e919322.53e016ba@videotron.ca> <7650c2461c39b.53e016f7@videotron.ca> <76c0d9b91b7f9.53e01734@videotron.ca> <76d0e5d41b21a.53e01773@videotron.ca> <76a0a6261934f.53e017af@videotron.ca> <7750f6771ae95.53e017ec@videotron.ca> <7740913a18c43.53e01829@videotron.ca> <76a0e0a91c050.53dfe00f@videotron.ca> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> To: Steve Baillargeon X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.1878.6) Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/EkOpNTqCC-1f3XYnTq_R0cEmNHs Cc: "ippm@ietf.org" , Al Morton Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2014 16:13:26 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_4B2A2A82-8602-44AF-9814-8F2220D6FCA6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii hi Steve, On 05 Aug 2014, at 18:00, Steve Baillargeon = wrote: > Al, On the contrary, both feet are stuck on the ground with actual PM = work related to customer networks including the one on your badge! > =20 > I am still curious to know the answers to my previous questions. > =20 > I am also curious to find why asymmetrical packet size is so = important. > Are you thinking about a TCP connection measuring the rate in a given = direction with data segments of a given size and (short) ACK segments = are travelling in the opposite direction? Well, that's the simplest example of why asymmetric packet size testing = seems useful to me, especially given that in most access networks with = content-heavy applications, you have one direction that's = pure-ACK-dominated and one direction that's 1500-minus-epsilon = dominated. Different devices on the path will react differently to those = streams, depending on their design. But I'd submit that IPPM is not the = place to rehash the various byte-versus-packet arguments... ...and it looks to me (in the _corrected_ minutes, anyway) as if we have = a workable solution to this dilemma. Cheers, Brian > From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of MORTON, ALFRED = C (AL) > Sent: August-05-14 8:01 AM > To: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca; Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky > Cc: ippm@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to = datatracker > =20 > Steve, did you come down off the ceiling yet? > I was correcting a typo in the minutes... > =20 > Al > =20 > From: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca = [mailto:steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca]=20 > Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 7:34 PM > To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL); Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky > Cc: ippm@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to = datatracker > =20 > =20 > >Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets;=20 > This cannot be true! > =20 > Can you provide the list of tools you have in mind? > =20 > Are you confusing unidirectional BW measurements and bi-directional BW = measurements? > =20 > What is wrong with measuring the forward rate and/or reverse rate of a = bidirectional path using the same packet size say the path MTU? > And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes? > =20 > What is wrong with measuring the forward rate of a unidirectional path = using the same packet size say the path MTU? > And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes? > =20 > =20 > -Steve >=20 >=20 > On 8/4/14, "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" wrote: > In the minutes: > =20 > - Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't = want to > solve this problem, you can choose to ignore it. > =20 > s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/ > =20 > missing from minutes, between Greg and Brian: > - Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size?=20 > (general agreement in the room) > - Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetrical size > - Brian Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the = SHOULD > =20 > Al > =20 > From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian Trammell > Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 12:51 AM > To: Greg Mirsky > Cc: ippm@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to = datatracker > =20 > hi Greg, > =20 > I've updated the posted minutes. > =20 > Thanks, best regards, > =20 > Brian > =20 > On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky wrote: > =20 >=20 > Hi Brian, > could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of = rate-problem document. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as = well as proposal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the = requirement to "protocol MUST support generating asymmetrical packet = size. Protocol SHOULD support generating packets with asymmetrical = size." "general agreement in the room" in my opinion very accurately = captures the reaction to the proposal. >=20 > Regards, > Greg > =20 >=20 > On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell = wrote: > Greetings, all, >=20 > Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at: >=20 > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm >=20 > Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting. >=20 > If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at = ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Many thanks, best regards, >=20 > Brian > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm --Apple-Mail=_4B2A2A82-8602-44AF-9814-8F2220D6FCA6 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: attachment; filename=signature.asc Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name=signature.asc Content-Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: GPGTools - https://gpgtools.org iQEcBAEBCgAGBQJT4QJuAAoJENt3nsOmbNJcVOUH/jHRoNiK3anvjlNajLHr9pkn OM0AwpCpHEjjnOA0r+duNeJaWy6JTX5Z+rWewP+80WV93Ma0hfh3EkYeBLGxALpV 19OLKl7aoYSYH4PU9vIKfkuKnAYj7J4h8mAurUVJziMaQlYr+2jLPcHAnOYJCjMN T0KfNYgdC13d/+9uQ985p67cFPf3Rfoumy4liMK3+racyT08Q55NKwno7SVHnFKK 3IF5oUsi7eVXtqEd2ia/DFcFGZzlpWTYH4NfRF2amjcAoKNnzokOqaVor5Y87o1q wkMK7uk9jxSnhCOhxlvkHF9mGSFD6pcnAbiPufdoIh9KuW8N/3k6+9U6fbtWiv4= =cTJZ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --Apple-Mail=_4B2A2A82-8602-44AF-9814-8F2220D6FCA6-- From nobody Tue Aug 5 09:36:13 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 352541B2A8E for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:36:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kRDb229cnvh9 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:36:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vc0-x22d.google.com (mail-vc0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c03::22d]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id AB01D1B2A8A for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:36:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vc0-f173.google.com with SMTP id hy10so1918851vcb.4 for ; Tue, 05 Aug 2014 09:35:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :cc:content-type; bh=IT4BYmv/fzuSQbovPveSYrlihR/6U4Cx/1VFoVm7IKc=; b=TvG+RZZghxdqdIu4RzhCiu+PszZ+2Mvpkk3JUns8z+UJimyRKMwPmohA/5d5yqYsXM ad+7u7Xj3XTz1LjitfI0FIvan5jWIiwcF5Ktt4mriuQIcp0xc/+LU5LzFbJJYWrFPmHF 9rSVRWkmkoxrG4m4xfNFu8/CIvUSewhcmbb0khNjIBIAKruzq6UIhuDerVKts+7Vl3ck m066Qy8PA4wnw7F0uebhc8PI+HYZOh6k/zAv9162rst2i5iJOlFYka2wLsq5bO5jWoC5 1o/oDSqdNFo3uAinrPm/hC8wWaYObeBiH0KcHf5pPVwsf4490kk8OQVvPNjJEHxH00/s 77hA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.220.190.134 with SMTP id di6mr4878513vcb.43.1407256140439; Tue, 05 Aug 2014 09:29:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.15.136 with HTTP; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:29:00 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <94F4DD6B-576F-4398-B187-8DE0B962C33F@trammell.ch> References: <5248F368-6558-40B3-A8CC-909797D3E7CB@trammell.ch> <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> <7660c1821ae91.53e01589@videotron.ca> <77a0c6f91f28f.53e015c6@videotron.ca> <774095cf19c11.53e01603@videotron.ca> <7760ffa81e376.53e01640@videotron.ca> <76b0d1aa1d3cb.53e0167d@videotron.ca> <76e0e2e919322.53e016ba@videotron.ca> <7650c2461c39b.53e016f7@videotron.ca> <76c0d9b91b7f9.53e01734@videotron.ca> <76d0e5d41b21a.53e01773@videotron.ca> <76a0a6261934f.53e017af@videotron.ca> <7750f6771ae95.53e017ec@videotron.ca> <7740913a18c43.53e01829@videotron.ca> <76a0e0a91c050.53dfe00f@videotron.ca> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> <94F4DD6B-576F-4398-B187-8DE0B962C33F@trammell.ch> Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:29:00 -0700 Message-ID: From: Greg Mirsky To: Brian Trammell Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c1c11c5be73704ffe45a61 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/BUozatuW4rlaOUjS_MIuxv34OYU Cc: "ippm@ietf.org" , Al Morton Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Aug 2014 16:36:07 -0000 --001a11c1c11c5be73704ffe45a61 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi Brian, Al, Brian wrote: ...and it looks to me (in the _corrected_ minutes, anyway) as if we have a workable solution to this dilemma. I believe that the change would be unnoticeable to an untrained eye. Would it be possible to see the proposed sentence (don't think that more than that needs change) before it gets buried in the document? Regards, Greg On Tue, Aug 5, 2014 at 9:12 AM, Brian Trammell wrote: > hi Steve, > > On 05 Aug 2014, at 18:00, Steve Baillargeon < > steve.baillargeon@ericsson.com> wrote: > > > Al, On the contrary, both feet are stuck on the ground with actual PM > work related to customer networks including the one on your badge! > > > > I am still curious to know the answers to my previous questions. > > > > I am also curious to find why asymmetrical packet size is so important. > > Are you thinking about a TCP connection measuring the rate in a given > direction with data segments of a given size and (short) ACK segments are > travelling in the opposite direction? > > > > > Well, that's the simplest example of why asymmetric packet size testing > seems useful to me, especially given that in most access networks with > content-heavy applications, you have one direction that's > pure-ACK-dominated and one direction that's 1500-minus-epsilon dominated. > Different devices on the path will react differently to those streams, > depending on their design. But I'd submit that IPPM is not the place to > rehash the various byte-versus-packet arguments... > > > > ...and it looks to me (in the _corrected_ minutes, anyway) as if we have a > workable solution to this dilemma. > > Cheers, > > Brian > > > From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of MORTON, ALFRED C > (AL) > > Sent: August-05-14 8:01 AM > > To: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca; Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky > > Cc: ippm@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to > datatracker > > > > Steve, did you come down off the ceiling yet? > > I was correcting a typo in the minutes... > > > > Al > > > > From: steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca [mailto: > steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca] > > Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 7:34 PM > > To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL); Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky > > Cc: ippm@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to > datatracker > > > > > > >Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; > > This cannot be true! > > > > Can you provide the list of tools you have in mind? > > > > Are you confusing unidirectional BW measurements and bi-directional BW > measurements? > > > > What is wrong with measuring the forward rate and/or reverse rate of a > bidirectional path using the same packet size say the path MTU? > > And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes? > > > > What is wrong with measuring the forward rate of a unidirectional path > using the same packet size say the path MTU? > > And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes? > > > > > > -Steve > > > > > > On 8/4/14, "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" wrote: > > In the minutes: > > > > - Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don't > want to > > solve this problem, you can choose to ignore it. > > > > s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/ > > > > missing from minutes, between Greg and Brian: > > - Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size? > > (general agreement in the room) > > - Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetrical size > > - Brian Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the > SHOULD > > > > Al > > > > From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian Trammell > > Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 12:51 AM > > To: Greg Mirsky > > Cc: ippm@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to > datatracker > > > > hi Greg, > > > > I've updated the posted minutes. > > > > Thanks, best regards, > > > > Brian > > > > On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky wrote: > > > > > > Hi Brian, > > could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of > rate-problem document. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as > well as proposal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the requirement > to "protocol MUST support generating asymmetrical packet size. Protocol > SHOULD support generating packets with asymmetrical size." "general > agreement in the room" in my opinion very accurately captures the reaction > to the proposal. > > > > Regards, > > Greg > > > > > > On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell > wrote: > > Greetings, all, > > > > Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at: > > > > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ippm > > > > Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting. > > > > If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at > ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org. > > > > Many thanks, best regards, > > > > Brian > > _______________________________________________ > > ippm mailing list > > ippm@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm > > --001a11c1c11c5be73704ffe45a61 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Brian, Al,
Brian wrote:<chair hat on>

...and it looks to me (in the _corrected_ minutes, anyway) as if we have a = workable solution to this dilemma.

I believe that the change would be unnoticeable to an untrained e= ye. Would it be possible to see the proposed sentence (don't think that= more than that needs change) before it gets buried in the document?

Regards,
Greg

On Tue, Aug 5, 2014 at 9:12 AM, Brian Trammell= <ietf@trammell.ch> wrote:
hi Steve,

On 05 Aug 2014, at 18:00, Steve Baillargeon <steve.baillargeon@ericsson.com> wrote:

> Al, On the contrary, both feet are stuck on the ground with actual PM = work related to customer networks including the one on your badge!
>
> I am still curious to know the answers to my previous questions.
>
> I am also curious to find why asymmetrical packet size is so important= .
> Are you thinking about a TCP connection measuring the rate in a given = direction with data segments of a given size and (short) ACK segments are t= ravelling in the opposite direction?

<chair hat off>
<tcp measurement geek hat on>

Well, that's the simplest example of why asymmetric packet size testing= seems useful to me, especially given that in most access networks with con= tent-heavy applications, you have one direction that's pure-ACK-dominat= ed and one direction that's 1500-minus-epsilon dominated. Different dev= ices on the path will react differently to those streams, depending on thei= r design. But I'd submit that IPPM is not the place to rehash the vario= us byte-versus-packet arguments...

<chair hat on>

...and it looks to me (in the _corrected_ minutes, anyway) as if we have a = workable solution to this dilemma.

Cheers,

Brian

> From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounc= es@ietf.org] On Behalf Of MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)
> Sent: August-05-14 8:01 AM
> To: steve.baillargeo= n@videotron.ca; Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky
> Cc: ippm@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to da= tatracker
>
> Steve, did you come down off the ceiling yet?
> I was correcting a typo in the minutes...
>
> Al
>
> From: steve.baillarg= eon@videotron.ca [mailto:steve.baillargeon@videotron.ca]
> Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 7:34 PM
> To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL); Brian Trammell; Greg Mirsky
> Cc: ippm@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to da= tatracker
>
>
> >Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets;
> This cannot be true!
>
> Can you provide the list of tools you have in mind?
>
> Are you confusing unidirectional BW measurements and bi-directional BW= measurements?
>
> What is wrong with measuring the forward rate and/or reverse rate of a= bidirectional path using the same packet size say the path MTU?
> And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes?
>
> What is wrong with measuring the forward rate of a unidirectional path= using the same packet size say the path MTU?
> And repeating the test if needed with different packet sizes?
>
>
> -Steve
>
>
> On 8/4/14, "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" <acmorton@att.com> wrote:
> In the minutes:
>
> - Al Morton: all tools today send asymmetrical packets; if you don'= ;t want to
> solve this problem, you can choose to ignore it.
>
> s/asymmetrical/symmetrical/
>
> missing from minutes, between Greg and Brian:
> - Greg: How about MUST on rate, SHOULD on packet size?
> (general agreement in the room)
> - Al: then it's SHOULD for BOTH symmetrical and asymmetrical size<= br> > - Brian Trammell: there should be a statement of applicability on the = SHOULD
>
> Al
>
> From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounc= es@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Brian Trammell
> Sent: Monday, August 04, 2014 12:51 AM
> To: Greg Mirsky
> Cc: ippm@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to da= tatracker
>
> hi Greg,
>
> I've updated the posted minutes.
>
> Thanks, best regards,
>
> Brian
>
> On 30 Jul 2014, at 02:22, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Brian,
> could you please update the minutes in part of discussion of rate-prob= lem document. I believe the comments tagged 'Mike' were mine as wel= l as proposal, after Al's Shakespearean quote, to modify the requiremen= t to "protocol MUST support generating asymmetrical packet size. Proto= col SHOULD support generating packets with asymmetrical size." "g= eneral agreement in the room" in my opinion very accurately captures t= he reaction to the proposal.
>
> Regards,
> Greg
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 1:17 PM, Brian Trammell <ietf@trammell.ch> wrote:
> Greetings, all,
>
> Draft minutes for yesterday's meeting are available at:
>
> http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/90/minutes/minutes-90-ip= pm
>
> Many thanks to Sarah Banks for taking minutes during the meeting.
>
> If you have any comments or additions, please let us know at ippm-chairs@tools.ietf.org.
>
> Many thanks, best regards,
>
> Brian
> _______________________________________________
> ippm mailing list
> ippm@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm


--001a11c1c11c5be73704ffe45a61-- From nobody Tue Aug 5 09:49:59 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFF1D1A039D for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:49:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.201 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.201 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iX4__texThKK for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:49:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pink.research.att.com (mail-pink.research.att.com [204.178.8.22]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 418931A03A6 for ; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 09:49:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-azure.research.att.com (unknown [135.207.255.18]) by mail-pink.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0719A122A59; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 12:55:33 -0400 (EDT) Received: from njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com (unknown [135.207.255.243]) by mail-azure.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBA9CE03A1; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 12:49:54 -0400 (EDT) Received: from NJFPSRVEXG8.research.att.com ([fe80::cdea:b3f6:3efa:1841]) by njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com ([fe80::cdea:b3f6:3efa:1841%13]) with mapi; Tue, 5 Aug 2014 12:49:54 -0400 From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" To: Greg Mirsky , Brian Trammell Date: Tue, 5 Aug 2014 12:49:53 -0400 Thread-Topic: [ippm] Draft IETF 90 IPPM WG meeting minutes posted to datatracker Thread-Index: Ac+wymLk6RrrtEHrQU+/8fEhx1eNJAAAnR+w Message-ID: <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E6594B1B@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> References: <5248F368-6558-40B3-A8CC-909797D3E7CB@trammell.ch> <3E68952B-F0F1-4913-9D2D-8A9D12FFD7AB@trammell.ch> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F6A1@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> <7660c1821ae91.53e01589@videotron.ca> <77a0c6f91f28f.53e015c6@videotron.ca> <774095cf19c11.53e01603@videotron.ca> <7760ffa81e376.53e01640@videotron.ca> <76b0d1aa1d3cb.53e0167d@videotron.ca> <76e0e2e919322.53e016ba@videotron.ca> <7650c2461c39b.53e016f7@videotron.ca> <76c0d9b91b7f9.53e01734@videotron.ca> <76d0e5d41b21a.53e01773@videotron.ca> <76a0a6261934f.53e017af@videotron.ca> <7750f6771ae95.53e017ec@videotron.ca> <7740913a18c43.53e01829@videotron.ca> <76a0e0a91c050.53dfe00f@videotron.ca> <2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E639F757@njfpsrvexg8.research.att.com> <94F4DD6B-576F-4398-B187-8DE0B962C33F@trammell.ch> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E6594B1Bnjfpsrvexg8re_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/8ggMM-10yfgVr8uiKfkIr8jaYYI Cc: "ippm@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [ippm] Draft 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--_000_2845723087023D4CB5114223779FA9C803E6594B1Bnjfpsrvexg8re_-- From nobody Thu Aug 7 06:17:02 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B36A21B2A22; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 06:16:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YtlTOt_qm2zZ; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 06:16:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C97A81B29E6; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 06:16:34 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.2.p5 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20140807131634.22366.48958.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2014 06:16:34 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/Uhkiob_5bcGaTd9jw8FeSHaoOMc Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-lmap-path-05.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2014 13:16:36 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group of the IETF. Title : A Reference Path and Measurement Points for LMAP Authors : Marcelo Bagnulo Trevor Burbridge Sam Crawford Phil Eardley Al Morton Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-lmap-path-05.txt Pages : 15 Date : 2014-08-07 Abstract: This document defines a reference path for Large-scale Measurement of Broadband Access Performance (LMAP) and measurement points for commonly used performance metrics. Other similar measurement projects may also be able to use the extensions described here for measurement point location. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-lmap-path/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-lmap-path-05 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-lmap-path-05 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Aug 7 06:17:33 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07AF21B29E6; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 06:17:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QgEaD-kgUWUG; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 06:17:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A31D51B2A22; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 06:16:42 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.2.p5 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20140807131642.13745.81398.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2014 06:16:42 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/p485ioOzdBNmxW643yfP_PZlsCI Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2014 13:17:04 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group of the IETF. Title : Rate Measurement Test Protocol Problem Statement Author : Al Morton Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2014-08-07 Abstract: This memo presents an access rate-measurement problem statement for test protocols to measure IP Performance Metrics. The rate measurement scenario has wide-spread attention of Internet access subscribers and seemingly all industry players, including regulators. Key test protocol aspects require the ability to control packet size on the tested path and enable asymmetrical packet size testing in a controller-responder architecture. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Aug 7 10:54:07 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58FAD1A0196 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 10:54:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0DQ2S0ZSFvNE for ; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 10:54:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vc0-x22e.google.com (mail-vc0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400c:c03::22e]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 430021A0172 for ; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 10:54:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vc0-f174.google.com with SMTP id la4so6668050vcb.5 for ; Thu, 07 Aug 2014 10:54:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:date:message-id:subject:from:to :content-type; bh=/hp9kb+ZLWDgv6Kas7pMjqAPY/bc/7EQ0Szy1vll56E=; b=j3WgW++HhGmtwbVa3FlbNchun8da0yO7dIR4tPL+CwQsdjuV/ViVU/YGkWVn8GWY5p 016zN6k3ZeGIDbVgEb/ThatRz6zfmui8Uiw49tt6pK+1PWIkkoBvH2VUr2PDr3brg7xR 23amVPaZlWMqaYluWBmOXSVW5SVxTWFZD53HIxePW5mIANi3H5L5BzUazFz5+8MoOUYg oxoYdwOCouPLUEqmzJ6X3x4OzTR/7kheXN0LTVmRxDXSFi7KTi0RVBE6ekoDDW6/bZzb FKjZoa/1t5qG9VAHY/k/QPp2ErG4cieixGKiZg2vXNqSyYCp9qNtoA0jzzfnPcwAw+ax 88ug== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.52.5.40 with SMTP id p8mr3281518vdp.28.1407434040406; Thu, 07 Aug 2014 10:54:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.15.136 with HTTP; Thu, 7 Aug 2014 10:54:00 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <20140807131642.13745.81398.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <20140807131642.13745.81398.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 7 Aug 2014 10:54:00 -0700 Message-ID: From: Greg Mirsky To: "ippm@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20cf3033447f05fa6705000dc6c0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/FB3s3I32FnCt9qUWCaEdajXC28s Subject: [ippm] Fwd: I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 07 Aug 2014 17:54:04 -0000 --20cf3033447f05fa6705000dc6c0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Dear Authors, et. al, a comment to the updated version: - The last sentence does not provide much information and its closing, highlighted, effectively makes RECOMMENDED into REQUIRED: Implementations MAY support control and generation for only symmetric packet sizes when none of the above conditions hold. I propose: - to remove the last sentence; - s/generation capability is necessary/generation capability is useful/ Regards, Greg ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Date: Thu, Aug 7, 2014 at 6:16 AM Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06.txt To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: ippm@ietf.org A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group of the IETF. Title : Rate Measurement Test Protocol Problem Statement Author : Al Morton Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2014-08-07 Abstract: This memo presents an access rate-measurement problem statement for test protocols to measure IP Performance Metrics. The rate measurement scenario has wide-spread attention of Internet access subscribers and seemingly all industry players, including regulators. Key test protocol aspects require the ability to control packet size on the tested path and enable asymmetrical packet size testing in a controller-responder architecture. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ _______________________________________________ ippm mailing list ippm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm --20cf3033447f05fa6705000dc6c0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear Authors, et. al,
a comment to the = updated version:
  • = The last sentence does not provide much information and its closing, highli= ghted, effectively makes RECOMMENDED into REQUIRED:
Implementations MAY support control and generation for only symmetric
packet sizes when none of the above conditions hold.

=
I propose:
  • to remove the last sentence= ;
  • s/generation capability is necessary/generation capability is useful/

Regards,
Greg

---------- Forwa= rded message ----------
From: <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
= Date: Thu, Aug 7, 2014 at 6:16 AM
Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf= -ippm-rate-problem-06.txt
To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
C= c: ippm@ietf.org



A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies.
=C2=A0This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Metrics Working Group= of the IETF.

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Title =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : Rate= Measurement Test Protocol Problem Statement
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Author =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0: Al M= orton
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Filename =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0: draft-iet= f-ippm-rate-problem-06.txt
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pages =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : 12 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Date =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0:= 2014-08-07

Abstract:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0This memo presents an access rate-measurement problem statemen= t for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0test protocols to measure IP Performance Metrics. =C2=A0The ra= te
=C2=A0 =C2=A0measurement scenario has wide-spread attention of Internet acc= ess
=C2=A0 =C2=A0subscribers and seemingly all industry players, including regu= lators.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Key test protocol aspects require the ability to control packe= t size
=C2=A0 =C2=A0on the tested path and enable asymmetrical packet size testing= in a
=C2=A0 =C2=A0controller-responder architecture.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-rate-pro= blem/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-rate-problem-06

A diff from the previous version is available at:
http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-ippm-ra= te-problem-06


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp= .ietf.org/internet-drafts/

_______________________________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm

--20cf3033447f05fa6705000dc6c0-- From nobody Fri Aug 8 06:15:03 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC4681B2BBD; Fri, 8 Aug 2014 06:14:59 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zZc0MLN9aWsP; Fri, 8 Aug 2014 06:14:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AAAC01B2BAA; Fri, 8 Aug 2014 06:14:57 -0700 (PDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: IETF-Announce X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.2.p5 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Sender: Message-ID: <20140808131457.8602.96688.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2014 06:14:57 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/Pb7IyaHvirPpko1ucXg7tNM8wUY Cc: ippm@ietf.org Subject: [ippm] Last Call: (A Reference Path and Measurement Points for LMAP) to Informational RFC X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Reply-To: ietf@ietf.org List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Aug 2014 13:14:59 -0000 The IESG has received a request from the IP Performance Metrics WG (ippm) to consider the following document: - 'A Reference Path and Measurement Points for LMAP' as Informational RFC The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits final comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the ietf@ietf.org mailing lists by 2014-08-22. Exceptionally, comments may be sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting. Abstract This document defines a reference path for Large-scale Measurement of Broadband Access Performance (LMAP) and measurement points for commonly used performance metrics. Other similar measurement projects may also be able to use the extensions described here for measurement point location. The file can be obtained via http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-lmap-path/ IESG discussion can be tracked via http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-lmap-path/ballot/ No IPR declarations have been submitted directly on this I-D. From nobody Tue Aug 26 10:36:30 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED2F91A0043 for ; Tue, 26 Aug 2014 10:36:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HfgLcfDZRNEB for ; Tue, 26 Aug 2014 10:36:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yh0-x230.google.com (mail-yh0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4002:c01::230]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E27631A0035 for ; Tue, 26 Aug 2014 10:36:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-yh0-f48.google.com with SMTP id i57so12084504yha.7 for ; Tue, 26 Aug 2014 10:36:27 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:date:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=CmacpL7Oidhr5OomCivqulwonQwTK8pgcpWRp2gG7q4=; b=tsZ6scTECr2W39WqGV8DZIET/AOZKgLj34GhLWqu96OLbV8tyYcJs6fETjd6Y3SJMd SyNJK6+TGrxUAb5z88XHRggM0X0fYL2sJVEVRJAzJZiSvNTJ8U4YXFB+0EgEyHPRJA+C 01TDA+Sn909Ed++Rj1hyytRyIVB3TmwwoHq1qBhoXGLzDdAjLI6iSy3/iI+kSEHp93f9 mc1fbSuaRnoI7tAmQNpRYyld2Rw+ZAdVOyucQueyVgOZqDpm/s05vC/gd9gYvUSfaQ87 Hsel4Trx21hsGukPVhxGdbAsadboCZzwaCtd60AM+fD2FNoVyclSm3yEw/oVVeVvvcOT RxuA== MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Received: by 10.220.74.10 with SMTP id s10mr1486406vcj.61.1409074587170; Tue, 26 Aug 2014 10:36:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.220.189.199 with HTTP; Tue, 26 Aug 2014 10:36:27 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2014 10:36:27 -0700 Message-ID: From: Greg Mirsky To: "ippm@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e89a8f6471933afb7b05018bbe39 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/sxFp8HaxInIuuMnDA5Zd6nidosQ Cc: draft-hedin-ippm-type-p-monitor@tools.ietf.org Subject: [ippm] Looking for feedback and comments on DSCP/ECN Monitoring in TWAMP X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 26 Aug 2014 17:36:29 -0000 --e89a8f6471933afb7b05018bbe39 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Dear All, in the meeting in Toronto some graciously volunteered to read the draft and provide the WG with their comments. Authors welcome your feedback and recommendation on WG adoption call. Kind regards, Greg --e89a8f6471933afb7b05018bbe39 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Dear All,
in the meeting in Toronto some graciously volunteered to read the draft and provide the WG with their comments. Authors welcome your feedback and recommendation on WG adoption call.

Kind regards,
Greg
--e89a8f6471933afb7b05018bbe39--