From nobody Mon Feb 1 11:29:16 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8E31B3A1403; Mon, 1 Feb 2021 11:29:11 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.24.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <161220775153.7177.12214744094579052738@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 01 Feb 2021 11:29:11 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 01 Feb 2021 19:29:12 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Metrics and Methods for One-way IP Capacity Authors : Al Morton Ruediger Geib Len Ciavattone Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05.txt Pages : 26 Date : 2021-02-01 Abstract: This memo revisits the problem of Network Capacity metrics first examined in RFC 5136. The memo specifies a more practical Maximum IP-layer Capacity metric definition catering for measurement purposes, and outlines the corresponding methods of measurement. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Feb 2 15:26:22 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C7A73A0CF1; Tue, 2 Feb 2021 15:26:17 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: "IETF-Announce" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.25.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk CC: Ian Swett , draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, martin.h.duke@gmail.com, tpauly@apple.com Reply-To: last-call@ietf.org Sender: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <161230837702.20098.12686167682266969029@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 02 Feb 2021 15:26:17 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Last Call: (Metrics and Methods for One-way IP Capacity) to Proposed Standard X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 02 Feb 2021 23:26:17 -0000 The IESG has received a request from the IP Performance Measurement WG (ippm) to consider the following document: - 'Metrics and Methods for One-way IP Capacity' as Proposed Standard The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits final comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the last-call@ietf.org mailing lists by 2021-02-16. Exceptionally, comments may be sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting. Abstract This memo revisits the problem of Network Capacity metrics first examined in RFC 5136. The memo specifies a more practical Maximum IP-layer Capacity metric definition catering for measurement purposes, and outlines the corresponding methods of measurement. The file can be obtained via https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ No IPR declarations have been submitted directly on this I-D. The document contains these normative downward references. See RFC 3967 for additional information: rfc7799: Active and Passive Metrics and Methods (with Hybrid Types In-Between) (Informational - IETF stream) rfc7312: Advanced Stream and Sampling Framework for IP Performance Metrics (IPPM) (Informational - IETF stream) rfc6815: Applicability Statement for RFC 2544: Use on Production Networks Considered Harmful (Informational - IETF stream) rfc5136: Defining Network Capacity (Informational - IETF stream) rfc3148: A Framework for Defining Empirical Bulk Transfer Capacity Metrics (Informational - IETF stream) rfc2544: Benchmarking Methodology for Network Interconnect Devices (Informational - Legacy stream) rfc8337: Model-Based Metrics for Bulk Transport Capacity (Experimental - IETF stream) rfc8468: IPv4, IPv6, and IPv4-IPv6 Coexistence: Updates for the IP Performance Metrics (IPPM) Framework (Informational - IETF stream) From nobody Thu Feb 4 14:12:00 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BC2C3A18B1 for ; Thu, 4 Feb 2021 14:11:59 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PN2wvYRswCXK for ; Thu, 4 Feb 2021 14:11:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lj1-x22b.google.com (mail-lj1-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22b]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5289A3A18AE for ; Thu, 4 Feb 2021 14:11:57 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lj1-x22b.google.com with SMTP id y14so5333758ljn.8 for ; Thu, 04 Feb 2021 14:11:57 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=2VSPwJOgX4wm0GaYYyfhQf6jzRN9K6wIfROPImCxEy0=; b=Q/ZafcPLXYYSW6c+3rqQgLU4Utq87SjwKWqW1/uF7wBoaiyWQKnrJXJaZ1FQaxif+K tL7UvBMvLaQftd35GIC3XaSJDK80xLzfBII6x+W2Cr6lFxBNokGqTGxCDJDADk0ckf72 PYv+Vx1d3AsZjDHgCIHHekwDNTrYC4vujBHBx4KquxMPrEu066sjZndUvseNHAZeDGI3 u+SsARVeEwsOCwJIdEfnwg528No+dSYT/2ZU1x1P55kJL8/VciKNQdAyjeFVdoYp91ES 8zf+rA2EFYD/Gwa0Bqh9ciDnaY3ppAhP75cjvcxXvFobUvBNQk6RuYnW/2TTV0uozqSS bPJA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=2VSPwJOgX4wm0GaYYyfhQf6jzRN9K6wIfROPImCxEy0=; b=BMoGwNqzKWsJeEBmzKKnDmK+fX1PKkMVz0/Be9zmryY+XsIKZHGIrTpx7E0QFltGix 5rLJ2mBAHJZ9GvDBVu8jaTbiWHfulx1oV1zjBEtElRMCwaSAU5eZytVLikq0yC+zB396 2d7mXUn49L+FQN39rrSfuh/wdwhuTYLvUN4U1ggZ7rBuwlHEggxRIXcLOC+YE/MlCXfa mzWIl8byFPeWT5D/eSMfA6bNLUEIAPlGu5bGz2GSZZO3trgPW4j6if6crziWgD7Gn6wn txb79wlaTFXxr7qzh/x0p0TkSloHb7Ddvh9spe0QU44Lh2Z3oUZDlhO+tVV5EJwJy1c9 XxbA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531d5q7YWigdgKzKu23TVXAFpKF1rQb4e1luGPKknFfMnaTg6x7e r/tIbUBYMZoZmfCrNxNQS6dQVMkaQOdp7bCAPVvrRwv/ X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyUFpuFa5DnLBxkSjm/dKKeuxvYEb/JumfroiZ4afW7AmMFixZYlL4YkkFgRo7egMMk+SZGT2YIveEQ18LPNmY= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:88c9:: with SMTP id a9mr808262ljk.107.1612476714888; Thu, 04 Feb 2021 14:11:54 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <161247657565.25962.682719173025568986@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161247657565.25962.682719173025568986@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Thu, 4 Feb 2021 14:11:43 -0800 Message-ID: To: IETF IPPM WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000ccb01805ba89fd23" Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Fwd: New Version Notification for draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 04 Feb 2021 22:11:59 -0000 --000000000000ccb01805ba89fd23 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear All, we've cleaned several nits in this version. We, the authors, welcome and much appreciate your comments, questions, and suggestions. Regards, Greg ---------- Forwarded message --------- From: Date: Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 2:09 PM Subject: New Version Notification for draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01.txt To: Greg Mirsky , Xiao Min A new version of I-D, draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01.txt has been successfully submitted by Greg Mirsky and posted to the IETF repository. Name: draft-mirsky-ippm-epm Revision: 01 Title: Error Performance Measurement in Packet-switched Networks Document date: 2021-02-04 Group: Individual Submission Pages: 6 URL: https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01.txt Status: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-mirsky-ippm-epm/ Htmlized: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-mirsky-ippm-epm Htmlized: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01 Diff: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01 Abstract: This document describes the use of the error performance metric to characterize a packet-switched network's conformance to the pre- defined set of performance objectives. In this document, metrics that characterize error performance in a packet-switched network (PSN) are defined, as well as methods to measure and calculate them. Also, the requirements for an active Operation, Administration, and Maintenance protocol to support the error performance measurement in PSN are discussed, and potential candidate protocols are analyzed. All metrics and measurement methods are equally applicable to underlay and overlay networks. Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. The IETF Secretariat --000000000000ccb01805ba89fd23 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear All,
we've cleaned several nits in this versi= on.
We, the authors, welcome and much appreciate your comments, q= uestions, and suggestions.

Regards,
Greg=


---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: <internet-drafts= @ietf.org>
Date: Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 2:09 PM
Subject: N= ew Version Notification for draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01.txt
To: Greg Mirsky= <gregimirsky@gmail.com>= , Xiao Min <xiao.min2@zte.com.cn= >



A new version of I-D, draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01.txt
has been successfully submitted by Greg Mirsky and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0draft-mirsky-ippm-epm
Revision:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A001
Title:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Error Performance Measurement in P= acket-switched Networks
Document date:=C2=A0 2021-02-04
Group:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Individual Submission
Pages:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 6
URL:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01.txt
Status:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0http= s://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-mirsky-ippm-epm/
Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https= ://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-mirsky-ippm-epm
Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://tool= s.ietf.org/html/draft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01
Diff:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-mirsky-ippm-epm-01

Abstract:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0This document describes the use of the error performance metri= c to
=C2=A0 =C2=A0characterize a packet-switched network's conformance to th= e pre-
=C2=A0 =C2=A0defined set of performance objectives.=C2=A0 In this document,= metrics
=C2=A0 =C2=A0that characterize error performance in a packet-switched netwo= rk
=C2=A0 =C2=A0(PSN) are defined, as well as methods to measure and calculate= them.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Also, the requirements for an active Operation, Administration= , and
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Maintenance protocol to support the error performance measurem= ent in
=C2=A0 =C2=A0PSN are discussed, and potential candidate protocols are analy= zed.
=C2=A0 =C2=A0All metrics and measurement methods are equally applicable to<= br> =C2=A0 =C2=A0underlay and overlay networks.




Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat


--000000000000ccb01805ba89fd23-- From nobody Sat Feb 6 16:37:27 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5131D3A2DBA; Sat, 6 Feb 2021 16:37:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Oh2bHIjFO-Lv; Sat, 6 Feb 2021 16:37:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lf1-x12d.google.com (mail-lf1-x12d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::12d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A316C3A2DB8; Sat, 6 Feb 2021 16:37:22 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lf1-x12d.google.com with SMTP id m22so16592544lfg.5; Sat, 06 Feb 2021 16:37:22 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=Th0sIj1svmLhA7tmWPXLz3N3ZA5QS1PIvKPN9qK3now=; b=CwCQh8nO7kmmcr07Q3IXqaUC9ZTxySJLbZVCVoPcWVbawshJb7V0H3t7yvw0CBuID1 e2KcHq+qcXkLZ8+Yn28j59FAa81LKUkhFWv3UZ2vuwflSY4q2Ilf+7D823ukgnJwm+1B hEiH3GJclEwYb36iP2zFAq5p3VgJ1H/mIB+WKiQqdtRzFAbElQQxNrDgFsJ2mmxfjXvC EHM9hIVUd1NphcLsdL6s0Da8GpjSLVA6JqRwaRaBkh5ooBz519lpS/mJA/LyK8PEo9pC aNMaFdOy05g7pGICBWhVHfMvrbzZvhRA/3OmwWmwey4AhwRCs9MgJ5nT+TG0uVSPj8Hq HiTQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=Th0sIj1svmLhA7tmWPXLz3N3ZA5QS1PIvKPN9qK3now=; b=sbB09yj6gb9eAGJnvmKFUFQDvRwaFjdRezCwl2GNlde2KEXhsqxlwT/MSF8yg36Le+ TLHiupNgNWh4AKyfCRLMxZuYTVtN1diNA2WWLLh87Qx47NiiPhGSudK6edHB5cfKomrM pC9KFyTgaQY+rc+Ug2wilaqsM5/FCffHYkk9pYUFFP3PZeRmC+JBGAMBqu7d+qGMnPqt OW5dxBBEgNmuiPyOAz1uWakoClzL25IyS5fr49IMOnYI8usVZXnZrkYMefdOTScF1NhD RspP5+WQcUccEWjvtj4DolwwabTIFiFTGGcTLREoEW2L5Y/gGIh5OzftAZ5KpvA/GxBY 6f3w== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532tbgJ9baqq1K0XQi1G+TG7vYo1r5U8r4Ba+8qNnse9O7IITBWM n2ngaHAyGhWDLYiBb7OMgdT7f5eL8B0G4XKGVJg= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxAKHuJqtIwNYZm0O9rriQvPArWY+nzveR6u4BFNCWFws1rwHDEmGTHSwon65Yt8MjybiNFS6/TAnTAkFVOja8= X-Received: by 2002:ac2:42cc:: with SMTP id n12mr6149547lfl.364.1612658240369; Sat, 06 Feb 2021 16:37:20 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Greg Mirsky Date: Sat, 6 Feb 2021 16:37:09 -0800 Message-ID: To: "Frank Brockners (fbrockne)" Cc: IETF IPPM WG , IPPM Chairs Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000008fb80e05bab4413b" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] On the integrity of IOAM data fields - new draft draft-brockners-ippm-ioam-data-integrity-00 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 07 Feb 2021 00:37:25 -0000 --0000000000008fb80e05bab4413b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi Frank and Authors, thank you for preparing this well-written and really mature document. I fully agree with your opinion that IOAM security is not limited to identifying potential attack vectors and mitigating threats. This document provides implementors with a comprehensive set of mechanisms to protect the integrity of IOAM data fields. While the draft gives us a detailed analysis of the potential threats and protection solutions for IOAM Trace Options, it could be helpful to expand the scope of the analysis by adding the Direct Export mode of IOAM. I think that for the Direct Export the native security mechanisms of IPv6, i.e., Authentication and Encapsulating Security Payload Headers (RFCs 4302 and 4303 respectively) can be used. Regards, Greg On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 6:20 AM Frank Brockners (fbrockne) wrote: > Dear IPPM WG, > > During the IETF last call, there's been a discussion on how to ensure the > integrity of IOAM data fields for those deployments that require it (see > e.g. the thread below). > > The IPPM chairs inspired an "integrity-00" draft to facility the > discussion and evolve towards a solution. We've just published a first cut > at discussing the different threads along with outlining different methods > for addressing the integrity of IOAM data fields: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-brockners-ippm-ioam-data-integrity-00. > > It would be great to get a view on which method you see as preferable and > for what reasons, along with whether anyone has any additional > methods/solution approaches in mind. > > Thanks, > Frank, Shwetha, Tal. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Benjamin Kaduk > > Sent: Samstag, 28. November 2020 06:11 > > To: Greg Mirsky > > Cc: Tal Mizrahi ; last-call@ietf.org; MORTON, > > ALFRED C (AL) ; IPPM Chairs >; > > draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data@ietf.org; IETF IPPM WG > > Subject: Re: [Last-Call] [ippm] Last Call: > > > (Data Fields for In-situ OAM) to Proposed Standard > > > > Hi Greg, Tal, > > > > On Thu, Nov 26, 2020 at 12:14:42PM -0800, Greg Mirsky wrote: > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 25, 2020 at 1:56 AM Tal Mizrahi > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 11:30 PM Greg Mirsky > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > I would suggest to consider a new IOAM option that incorporates an > > > > HMAC, which can be used alongside the conventional trace options. > > > > This would allow an optional integrity protection capability for > > > > those specific implementations that require it. This new option > > > > could be defined in a new draft, allowing the data draft to proceed > > > > to publication. > > > > > > > GIM>> I think that proceeding without addressing the essential > > > GIM>> security > > > issue of the protocol might be premature and may produce > > > implementations that are vulnerable to attacks. > > > > Thanks for raising this topic. > > > > Based on the discussion so far and skimming the first few sections of > the draft, I > > expect that I would put a discuss ballot in to ensure the availability > of a security > > mechanism such as this, which in effect would negate the intent to > "allow the > > data draft to proceed to publication". > > That said, my stance could change as the thread continues or when I take > a > > closer look at the whole document, so it is okay (from my point of view) > if you > > (Tal) choose to wait and see if this does end up being a discuss point. > > That said, I'd of course prefer if you and Greg can find a solution and > get it into > > place now :) > > > > Thanks, > > > > Ben > > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm > --0000000000008fb80e05bab4413b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Frank and Authors,
thank you for preparing this wel= l-written and really mature document. I fully agree with your opinion that = IOAM security is not limited to identifying potential attack vectors and mi= tigating threats. This document provides implementors=C2=A0with a comprehen= sive set of mechanisms to protect the integrity of IOAM data fields.
<= div>While the draft gives us a detailed analysis of the potential threats a= nd protection solutions for IOAM Trace Options, it could be helpful to expa= nd the scope of the analysis by adding the Direct Export mode of IOAM. I th= ink that for the Direct Export the native security mechanisms of IPv6, i.e.= , Authentication and Encapsulating Security Payload Headers (RFCs 4302 and = 4303 respectively) can be used.

Regards,
Greg
On Mon, Jan 25, 2021 at 6:20 AM Frank Brockners (fbrockne) <f= brockne=3D40cisco.com@dmarc.i= etf.org> wrote:
Dear IPPM WG,

During the IETF last call, there's been a discussion on how to ensure t= he integrity of IOAM data fields for those deployments that require it (see= e.g. the thread below).

The IPPM chairs inspired an "integrity-00" draft to facility the = discussion and evolve towards a solution. We've just published a first = cut at discussing the different threads along with outlining different meth= ods for addressing the integrity of IOAM data fields: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-brockners-ippm-i= oam-data-integrity-00.

It would be great to get a view on which method you see as preferable and f= or what reasons, along with whether anyone has any additional methods/solut= ion approaches in mind.

Thanks,
Frank, Shwetha, Tal.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Benjamin Kaduk <kaduk@mit.edu>
> Sent: Samstag, 28. November 2020 06:11
> To: Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
> Cc: Tal Mizrahi <tal.mizrahi.phd@gmail.com>; last-call@ietf.org; MORTON,
> ALFRED C (AL) <acm@research.att.com>; IPPM Chairs <ippm-chairs@ietf.org>;
> draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data@ietf.org; IETF IPPM WG <ippm@ietf.org>
> Subject: Re: [Last-Call] [ippm] Last Call: <draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-da= ta-11.txt>
> (Data Fields for In-situ OAM) to Proposed Standard
>
> Hi Greg, Tal,
>
> On Thu, Nov 26, 2020 at 12:14:42PM -0800, Greg Mirsky wrote:
> >
> > On Wed, Nov 25, 2020 at 1:56 AM Tal Mizrahi
> > <tal.mizrahi.phd@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > On Tue, Nov 24, 2020 at 11:30 PM Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com&g= t;
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > I would suggest to consider a new IOAM option that incorpora= tes an
> > > HMAC, which can be used alongside the conventional trace opt= ions.
> > > This would allow an optional integrity protection capability= for
> > > those specific implementations that require it. This new opt= ion
> > > could be defined in a new draft, allowing the data draft to = proceed
> > > to publication.
> > >
> > GIM>> I think that proceeding without addressing the essent= ial
> > GIM>> security
> > issue of the protocol might be premature and may produce
> > implementations that are vulnerable to attacks.
>
> Thanks for raising this topic.
>
> Based on the discussion so far and skimming the first few sections of = the draft, I
> expect that I would put a discuss ballot in to ensure the availability= of a security
> mechanism such as this, which in effect would negate the intent to &qu= ot;allow the
> data draft to proceed to publication".
> That said, my stance could change as the thread continues or when I ta= ke a
> closer look at the whole document, so it is okay (from my point of vie= w) if you
> (Tal) choose to wait and see if this does end up being a discuss point= .
> That said, I'd of course prefer if you and Greg can find a solutio= n and get it into
> place now :)
>
> Thanks,
>
> Ben

_______________________________________________
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https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm
--0000000000008fb80e05bab4413b-- From nobody Sun Feb 7 16:29:04 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFD373A0D2A; Sun, 7 Feb 2021 16:29:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Rifaat Shekh-Yusef via Datatracker To: Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method.all@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, last-call@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.25.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <161274414286.20211.7702078583876731294@ietfa.amsl.com> Reply-To: Rifaat Shekh-Yusef Date: Sun, 07 Feb 2021 16:29:02 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Secdir last call review of draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 08 Feb 2021 00:29:03 -0000 Reviewer: Rifaat Shekh-Yusef Review result: Ready I have reviewed this document as part of the security directorate's ongoing effort to review all IETF documents being processed by the IESG. These comments were written primarily for the benefit of the security area directors. Document editors and WG chairs should treat these comments just like any other last call comments. The document relies on an existing and well defined security considerations established by published RFCs. From nobody Wed Feb 10 14:40:03 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56B993A0B93; Wed, 10 Feb 2021 14:39:58 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.25.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <161299679831.7772.7683955638301665491@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 10 Feb 2021 14:39:58 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 10 Feb 2021 22:39:59 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Simple TWAMP (STAMP) Extensions for Segment Routing Networks Authors : Rakesh Gandhi Clarence Filsfils Daniel Voyer Mach(Guoyi) Chen Bart Janssens Filename : draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02.txt Pages : 12 Date : 2021-02-10 Abstract: Segment Routing (SR) leverages the source routing paradigm. SR is applicable to both Multiprotocol Label Switching (SR-MPLS) and IPv6 (SRv6) data planes. This document specifies RFC 8762 (Simple Two-Way Active Measurement Protocol (STAMP)) extensions for SR networks, for both SR-MPLS and SRv6 data planes. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Feb 10 16:41:42 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF6DC3A0CB5; Wed, 10 Feb 2021 16:41:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IBwUXfu9PLpD; Wed, 10 Feb 2021 16:41:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lj1-x230.google.com (mail-lj1-x230.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B33563A0CA2; Wed, 10 Feb 2021 16:41:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lj1-x230.google.com with SMTP id e18so5308989lja.12; Wed, 10 Feb 2021 16:41:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=L2uwfXI/auFwm3/XhbtVv2HvMOPk83IwIio1tsGb9RY=; b=dgsex50jrxteOim1Q+DeRErJ3xTqXfKkCWJsBc5QbkoMf2jzTTqNQhOMMOelm+OeHy ef4C+XTgJnCyBVxBwtYLG+5iNoqIBgJRkNOfTqycJymJih2U5UgfXycLYopnTJtYcS+K C2O92UBKckuK312ffWNSvv8tDvd8JkPYPk4/RoUs51MQOMT8kjHDorLy/9lFWgxl2+iJ MBTeYj9/hhwgjERgX9BtXvbXfcvLW6VE3byXphPxzgvsm9QTntZyK1Nz12Y6nlxiJCa0 WxFvZfrw8psdPX9MGrDGHPUQLCklxG16sLbkcQcBTRYODklzEpPyUHntgu+hvEHezgRI p5lQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=L2uwfXI/auFwm3/XhbtVv2HvMOPk83IwIio1tsGb9RY=; b=f2X6pNUbUSlY3Ap4g7s/sc/L/JWySYaUT35TxLIskyLF6Owv1ZYr22QoF7FJd6CooN sNBWnknHJmTgG7dJFAsiyYZdMKGwDRM5G+lrKY+mdBWf9S43biwwC48s7oWQ9fGecbc7 qTNyy22dxcxeHzsb8kM0bTWX8Vm32S7BRWPs/d1cjVG8QbZSEwmlIOvnxnI2EupIYsxR 2qMNT9CQyPMIjnrAZO9gl43yj7dV2wZlf/tYRxxxkMdK+oZWsr0Ghwha9GvTLKzc5WFk iv41nEvBTtqjGnQLPLU09VUXTeFuwF/TEMRduDfjfd2rWd6vD2Ba8MvY7okDzx/+ZbV1 mDdg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532wegclU4QWEDLefwWcJrWRzlXtV60hPt9Ks/ex/vwULj22nj+f TkJ73TeWJ9xJENRnL4ZEY6lr1Z2z5IaUoLNn0zvn9sSrbzlY X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzWPmb7nEdcSwZS/XKnGHLS9utAt6qOXUPV5KrqykAxyfe7MnloRNvoBpSo5XaMYXfpAzbn0yE5oUKSSzn7VEM= X-Received: by 2002:a05:651c:1393:: with SMTP id k19mr108393ljb.448.1613004095814; Wed, 10 Feb 2021 16:41:35 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <161299679831.7772.7683955638301665491@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161299679831.7772.7683955638301665491@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Rakesh Gandhi Date: Wed, 10 Feb 2021 19:41:24 -0500 Message-ID: To: IETF IPPM WG , IPPM Chairs Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000026fe5605bb04c84b" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 11 Feb 2021 00:41:41 -0000 --00000000000026fe5605bb04c84b Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi WG, This revision has following updates - Updated terminology to align with STAMP - Removed stand-alone direct loss measurement messages - Moved Control Code to Return Path TLV - Replaced TWAMP Light draft with STAMP draft - Various editorial changes to address review comments Many thanks for providing review comments. Welcome your review on the latest updates. Thanks, Rakesh (for the authors) On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 5:40 PM wrote: > > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts > directories. > This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. > > Title : Simple TWAMP (STAMP) Extensions for Segment > Routing Networks > Authors : Rakesh Gandhi > Clarence Filsfils > Daniel Voyer > Mach(Guoyi) Chen > Bart Janssens > Filename : draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02.txt > Pages : 12 > Date : 2021-02-10 > > Abstract: > Segment Routing (SR) leverages the source routing paradigm. SR is > applicable to both Multiprotocol Label Switching (SR-MPLS) and IPv6 > (SRv6) data planes. This document specifies RFC 8762 (Simple Two-Way > Active Measurement Protocol (STAMP)) extensions for SR networks, for > both SR-MPLS and SRv6 data planes. > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm/ > > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02 > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02 > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of > submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm > --00000000000026fe5605bb04c84b Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi WG,
This revision has following updates
  • Updated terminology to align with STAMP
  • Removed stand-alone direct loss measurement messages=
  • Moved Control Code to Return Path TLV
    • Replaced TWAMP Light draft with STAMP draft
  • Various editorial changes to address review comments
Many thanks for providing review comments.
<= /div>
Welcome your review on the latest updates.

Thanks,=
Rakesh (for the authors)


On Wed, Feb 10, 2021 at 5:40 PM <internet-drafts@ietf.org> wrote:

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies.
This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF.=

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Title=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0:= Simple TWAMP (STAMP) Extensions for Segment Routing Networks
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Authors=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0: Rake= sh Gandhi
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Clarence Filsfils
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Daniel Voyer
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Mach(Guoyi) Chen
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Bart Janssens
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Filename=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : draft-gan= dhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02.txt
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pages=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0:= 12
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Date=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 := 2021-02-10

Abstract:
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Segment Routing (SR) leverages the source routing paradigm.=C2= =A0 SR is
=C2=A0 =C2=A0applicable to both Multiprotocol Label Switching (SR-MPLS) and= IPv6
=C2=A0 =C2=A0(SRv6) data planes.=C2=A0 This document specifies RFC 8762 (Si= mple Two-Way
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Active Measurement Protocol (STAMP)) extensions for SR network= s, for
=C2=A0 =C2=A0both SR-MPLS and SRv6 data planes.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft= -gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gandhi-= ippm-stamp-srpm-02
https://datatracker.ietf.org/do= c/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2= =3Ddraft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-02


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


_______________________________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm
--00000000000026fe5605bb04c84b-- From nobody Fri Feb 12 07:39:33 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EB083A174D; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 07:39:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Stewart Bryant via Datatracker To: Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method.all@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, last-call@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.25.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <161314437215.27849.15366890249325519802@ietfa.amsl.com> Reply-To: Stewart Bryant Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2021 07:39:32 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2021 15:39:32 -0000 Reviewer: Stewart Bryant Review result: Ready I am the assigned Gen-ART reviewer for this draft. The General Area Review Team (Gen-ART) reviews all IETF documents being processed by the IESG for the IETF Chair. Please treat these comments just like any other last call comments. For more information, please see the FAQ at . Document: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 Reviewer: Stewart Bryant Review Date: 2021-02-12 IETF LC End Date: 2021-02-16 IESG Telechat date: Not scheduled for a telechat Summary: A well written text ready for publication Major issues: None Minor issues: None Nits/editorial comments: 8.4. Running Code This section is for the benefit of the Document Shepherd's form, and will be deleted prior to final review. SB> I am wondering if this was supposed to be deleted before this review, or whether you plan to keep it? From nobody Fri Feb 12 09:04:48 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F34663A17CD; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 09:04:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.92 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.92 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MNGE3Cg8Pkx7; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 09:04:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.149.140]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2F1333A17C4; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 09:04:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0049295.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0049295.ppops.net-00191d01. 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Fri, 12 Feb 2021 17:04:25 +0000 (GMT) Received: from sldc.sbc.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clph811.sldc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 11CH4Pxj068676; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 11:04:25 -0600 Received: from mail-blue.research.att.com (mail-blue.research.att.com [135.207.178.11]) by clph811.sldc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 11CH4JtS068367; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 11:04:20 -0600 Received: from exchange.research.att.com (njmtcas1.research.att.com [135.207.255.86]) by mail-blue.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CE1D10A18D6; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 12:04:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from njmtexg5.research.att.com ([fe80::b09c:ff13:4487:78b6]) by njmtcas1.research.att.com ([fe80::e881:676b:51b6:905d%12]) with mapi id 14.03.0487.000; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 12:04:33 -0500 From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" To: Stewart Bryant , "gen-art@ietf.org" CC: "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method.all@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" , "last-call@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Genart last call review of draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 Thread-Index: AQHXAVVRNjuS2FwTcEuRLohtdMrgwapUtPyg Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2021 17:04:33 +0000 Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF014769BD6A@njmtexg5.research.att.com> References: <161314437215.27849.15366890249325519802@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161314437215.27849.15366890249325519802@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [24.148.42.167] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.737 definitions=2021-02-12_05:2021-02-12, 2021-02-12 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 malwarescore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 mlxscore=0 adultscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 suspectscore=0 impostorscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 clxscore=1011 priorityscore=1501 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2102120127 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2021 17:04:43 -0000 VGhhbmtzIGZvciB5b3VyIHJldmlldywgU3Rld2FydCENCg0KcGxlYXNlIHNlZSByZXBseSBiZWxv dywNCkFsDQoNCj4gLS0tLS1PcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlLS0tLS0NCj4gRnJvbTogU3Rld2FydCBC cnlhbnQgdmlhIERhdGF0cmFja2VyIFttYWlsdG86bm9yZXBseUBpZXRmLm9yZ10NCj4gU2VudDog RnJpZGF5LCBGZWJydWFyeSAxMiwgMjAyMSAxMDo0MCBBTQ0KLi4uDQo+IFN1bW1hcnk6IEEgd2Vs bCB3cml0dGVuIHRleHQgcmVhZHkgZm9yIHB1YmxpY2F0aW9uDQpbYWNtXSANClRoYW5rcyENCj4g DQo+IE1ham9yIGlzc3VlczogTm9uZQ0KPiANCj4gTWlub3IgaXNzdWVzOiBOb25lDQo+IA0KPiBO aXRzL2VkaXRvcmlhbCBjb21tZW50czoNCj4gOC40LiAgUnVubmluZyBDb2RlDQo+IA0KPiAgICBU aGlzIHNlY3Rpb24gaXMgZm9yIHRoZSBiZW5lZml0IG9mIHRoZSBEb2N1bWVudCBTaGVwaGVyZCdz IGZvcm0sIGFuZA0KPiAgICB3aWxsIGJlIGRlbGV0ZWQgcHJpb3IgdG8gZmluYWwgcmV2aWV3Lg0K PiANCj4gU0I+IEkgYW0gd29uZGVyaW5nIGlmIHRoaXMgd2FzIHN1cHBvc2VkIHRvIGJlIGRlbGV0 ZWQgYmVmb3JlIHRoaXMgcmV2aWV3LA0KPiBvciB3aGV0aGVyIHlvdSBwbGFuIHRvIGtlZXAgaXQ/ DQpbYWNtXSANClllcywgd2UnbGwgY2VydGFpbmx5IGRlbGV0ZSB0aGlzIHNlY3Rpb24gYmVmb3Jl IHRoZSBSRkMgRWRpdG9ycyBzZWUgaXQuIEhvd2V2ZXIsDQp0aGVyZSBpcyBhIGxvdCBvZiByZXZp ZXcgeWV0IHRvIGhhcHBlbi4gSSByZWFsbHkgZG9uJ3QgbWluZCBpZiB0aGUgSUVTRw0Kc2VlcyBp dCBpbiBzb21lIGZvcm0sIGJ1dCB3ZSBkb24ndCB3YW50IHRvIHJpc2sgZW5kb3JzaW5nIG9uZSBp bXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbiwgSUlSQy4NCg0KQWxzbywgdGhpcyBtYXRlcmlhbCBjb3VsZCBtb3ZlIHRv IHRoZSBEb2MgU2hlcGhlcmQncyBmb3JtLCBidXQgaGFzIG5vdCB5ZXQ6DQoJRG9jdW1lbnQgUXVh bGl0eToNCg0KCUFyZSB0aGVyZSBleGlzdGluZyBpbXBsZW1lbnRhdGlvbnMgb2YgdGhlIHByb3Rv Y29sPyAuLi4NCg0KSSBzZWUgdGhhdCB3ZSBuZWVkIHRvIHVwZGF0ZSB0aGUgcmVmZXJlbmNlIGlu IHNlY3Rpb24gOC40Og0KT0xEDQpbdWRwc3RdICAgIEFUJlQsICJVRFAgU3BlZWQgVGVzdCBPcGVu IEJyb2FkYmFuZCBwcm9qZWN0IiwgQXVndXN0DQogICAgICAgICAgICAgIDIwMjAsIDxodHRwczov L2dpdGh1Yi5jb20vQnJvYWRiYW5kRm9ydW0gPFRCRD4+Lg0KTkVXDQpbdWRwc3RdICAgIHVkcHN0 IFByb2plY3QgQ29sbGFib3JhdG9ycywgIlVEUCBTcGVlZCBUZXN0IE9wZW4gQnJvYWRiYW5kIHBy b2plY3QiLCANCiAgICAgICAgICAgICAgRGVjZW1iZXIgMjAyMCwgPGh0dHBzOi8vZ2l0aHViLmNv bS9Ccm9hZGJhbmRGb3J1bS9vYnVkcHN0Pi4NCj4gDQo+IA0KDQo= From nobody Fri Feb 12 16:33:40 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5BB83A0E5F; Fri, 12 Feb 2021 16:33:17 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "\"IETF Secretariat\"" To: , Cc: ippm@ietf.org, martin.h.duke@gmail.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.25.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <161317639766.31337.5210679518142843370@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 12 Feb 2021 16:33:17 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] ippm - Requested sessions have been scheduled for IETF 110 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 13 Feb 2021 00:33:18 -0000 Dear Tommy Pauly, The session(s) that you have requested have been scheduled. Below is the scheduled session information followed by the original request. ippm Session 1 (1:00 requested) Monday, 8 March 2021, Session II 1530-1630 Room Name: Room 7 size: 507 --------------------------------------------- ippm Session 2 (2:00 requested) Friday, 12 March 2021, Session III 1700-1900 Room Name: Room 9 size: 509 --------------------------------------------- iCalendar: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/sessions/ippm.ics Request Information: --------------------------------------------------------- Working Group Name: IP Performance Measurement Area Name: Transport Area Session Requester: Tommy Pauly Number of Sessions: 2 Length of Session(s): 2 Hours, 1 Hour Number of Attendees: 40 Conflicts to Avoid: Chair Conflict: quic httpbis taps add masque Technology Overlap: tcpm 6man spring Key Participant Conflict: bmwg People who must be present: Alfred Channon Morton Frank Brockners Greg Mirsky Ian Swett Martin Duke Tommy Pauly Resources Requested: Special Requests: --------------------------------------------------------- From nobody Mon Feb 15 13:51:50 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86E303A11C0; Mon, 15 Feb 2021 13:51:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.198 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.198 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YPHzv_9FMQYq; Mon, 15 Feb 2021 13:51:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lj1-x235.google.com (mail-lj1-x235.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::235]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 079C83A11CE; Mon, 15 Feb 2021 13:51:18 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lj1-x235.google.com with SMTP id x1so9572129ljj.11; Mon, 15 Feb 2021 13:51:18 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=kv49S1rSzjWPsVNmKRMe59E8wWOaaembCNvmrMrITlQ=; b=hLBrb+lsYmxzrSFtn51k3jr3Lu1+qLqqtYoiaPpd9yDuc2x9ssAYbnnxQB4pAqJM0g fKPlMgUVzHHtKT4/ozMNFlmxb9+DWLadUyqpWhEUFnQStOallIDfEKrZKTqUHH16AJ6b jqrIjzURAUG7EhzaTooseB4Cow/Js05/pLt0RPtG3l/iKreNxIu9RlWAKocgXcTCyOUf kGdUvMDbdQpvLpqygmZAh4lmtrqHvVyD3NmWejvJK/EJjaXcSqHm49N+M1DWCNMpr3Gv uB8/1ihYi7jmLJNLazhsYq9KGn9TJIlBCvC7TtPtQ9D3kqkQM1JlZl3EICkB+ED4+aMJ CjGA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=kv49S1rSzjWPsVNmKRMe59E8wWOaaembCNvmrMrITlQ=; b=G0K2pXlROGCp6Lez+3vQBgfACGqAKoDpAi209ipuqJsi1Sja4x4C5phxG3/IOtm7Pi QfrqOVuY8PlGbuXQq98mQ2oaCMFztGhUaOxGjpesykHjPEKksc8CedH7qhP7MZnlw69r FNuLUZI219DUJQaaE1QhsPceGv2vn2fBgKjWUnVfFv09I+Pxus41vMDnbq2rVrij4PHC 6zdBRfPa6WT+0xjvPMBbs1rlq3N7Ekp0NleePphJqYcfRZ03Q6wqmtenuZ8x/ljHN/7K M3F1Da44HQsXC+yBs08VW2GFmrJZmTk46pjkJzEi5vDgkjJvwhqsqtpecOxNXBIow4bn q6hQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5317u+mYP4Wr4Gd0sqiqBkUnNtlPnqujqrRMqIeA9+A6CxuZsvLb UQD/zJcxU7fMMmVPSlpTL3JSjBK41Hm079aLjhIUA5mv4T467g== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwDvyDR7ZPexD87z4IKvy1w6s37x9LQ/cbuexg9U9T4b3fY/7xjhuc0SjVms2lfqhsOQW6NUolMIolMNLDDtgw= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:730f:: with SMTP id o15mr10927156ljc.145.1613425876494; Mon, 15 Feb 2021 13:51:16 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Greg Mirsky Date: Mon, 15 Feb 2021 13:51:05 -0800 Message-ID: To: IPPM Chairs Cc: IETF IPPM WG , draft-mirsky-ippm-hybrid-two-step@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000003d6ba605bb66fced" Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Presentation slot @ IETF-110 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 15 Feb 2021 21:51:50 -0000 --0000000000003d6ba605bb66fced Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Dear Ian and Tommy, would appreciate an opportunity to present to the IPPM WG updates to draft-mirsky-ippm-hybrid-two-step at IETF-110. Due to conflicts with other groups, would appreciate it if the presentation is on Friday's Session III. draft-mirsky-ippm-hybrid-two-step Presenter: Greg Mirsky Time: 10 min Regards, Greg --0000000000003d6ba605bb66fced Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Dear Ian and Tommy,
would appreciate an opportunity to= present to the IPPM WG updates to=C2=A0draft-mirsky-ippm-hybrid-two-step a= t IETF-110. Due to conflicts with other groups, would appreciate it if the = presentation is on Friday's Session III.=C2=A0

draft-mirsky-ippm-hybrid-two-step=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0= =C2=A0Presenter: Greg Mirsky=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Time= : 10 min

Regards,
Greg
--0000000000003d6ba605bb66fced-- From nobody Tue Feb 16 15:38:01 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A6783A12CF; Tue, 16 Feb 2021 15:38:00 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.25.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <161351868017.23964.11898124551800964529@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 16 Feb 2021 15:38:00 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 Feb 2021 23:38:00 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Metrics and Methods for One-way IP Capacity Authors : Al Morton Ruediger Geib Len Ciavattone Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06.txt Pages : 26 Date : 2021-02-16 Abstract: This memo revisits the problem of Network Capacity metrics first examined in RFC 5136. The memo specifies a more practical Maximum IP-layer Capacity metric definition catering for measurement purposes, and outlines the corresponding methods of measurement. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Feb 17 06:07:32 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D1F293A1A5D; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:07:26 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.25.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <161357084681.9639.16012873591506447169@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:07:26 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 14:07:27 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : In-situ OAM Flags Authors : Tal Mizrahi Frank Brockners Shwetha Bhandari Ramesh Sivakolundu Carlos Pignataro Aviv Kfir Barak Gafni Mickey Spiegel Jennifer Lemon Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04.txt Pages : 11 Date : 2021-02-17 Abstract: In-situ Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (IOAM) records operational and telemetry information in the packet while the packet traverses a path between two points in the network. This document presents new flags in the IOAM Trace Option headers. Specifically, the document defines the Loopback and Active flags. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Feb 17 06:08:53 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9053F3A1A5C; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:08:48 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.25.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <161357092854.24830.10751213943219252886@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:08:48 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 14:08:49 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : In-situ OAM Direct Exporting Authors : Haoyu Song Barak Gafni Tianran Zhou Zhenbin Li Frank Brockners Shwetha Bhandari Ramesh Sivakolundu Tal Mizrahi Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03.txt Pages : 11 Date : 2021-02-17 Abstract: In-situ Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (IOAM) is used for recording and collecting operational and telemetry information. Specifically, IOAM allows telemetry data to be pushed into data packets while they traverse the network. This document introduces a new IOAM option type called the Direct Export (DEX) option, which is used as a trigger for IOAM data to be directly exported without being pushed into in-flight data packets. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Feb 17 06:10:14 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8E6E3A1A5E for ; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:10:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id A8sQi_XYX5eL for ; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:10:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lj1-x22c.google.com (mail-lj1-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A7FDE3A1A56 for ; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:10:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lj1-x22c.google.com with SMTP id g11so16261929ljj.7 for ; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:10:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=cvYAYN0Tk0gL/atl4W+n+XlgsO1Fv1Qo9bma6+unBU0=; b=Ot93i0UiFrKXxwmVuB1Kwgr/Q5cNDALmWYjAWQ5+Za93Z7LlBz48GkPqwfHdSROJTu U+Hfs2fLyCMIKpD2KFRrHS3wj/DN9PwstwDmLA75cX/oUBDDBo8rP6En6j8UabgdRruQ ndOohEQunaCcXsb1dbPz3flADISUPpHL9SE0KS+x/yVjW1tyUGfV768rw3TPJs9PXO3Q WgbJwaJNqwY6I4tmluqstJ0OOvgU1pBNOMRdP7oL2GlkkZpALCSuriiOB/AyUesvFI9Z y9A8BOi4OY2zagAnwAiE8mKyoQQaM7gHUwbxW2NWw08/24Inzqm8Dpvf4W71LuymdW4D ML/g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=cvYAYN0Tk0gL/atl4W+n+XlgsO1Fv1Qo9bma6+unBU0=; b=hKtn1OAjdoFRAxadjTKBLfxOJZFQsh9Fgf8Cv5XT9bsjbgaYUdtuVDhOftol66oO7J r8sIuWxmOLL7fZU91G4DD2vdq8Gi86tVcnzIJdsjg2qMf82ZHRXcmP1Fucd3/af4cYlt LbnFxngwTBpd3Mba/CTKS9RIU4DdjJBt+UWF/Bt87cGOo1uj6c6U/Q4dze8zZ1k66cyo QIFaSkM6nnsq7CLSLrA2bX6rntoQZxrMK3eYI4BqYzX7o46RI85OTFQmjd6UcA8q0DfW nMB7fdZOG5aqARkVtGlQQmHuShUC3kVaOBy9Caf9S7Ei0l7KLVYyblYK1VJeSmskDQ0R R+Yg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531W/L8nCpmldbkykTvYqy12vOslqXi8aTNpC/dJ+ihikBaCI5r7 Mgol21bKzcCdw6fFMxXCWMQ6OIzjidUjF0kh7cwKitgleQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyLkdt4aeNMIm1HyYIRPKwDthA5KWtljQ/L+kkH8OGFnmHlVYU0w6EQANqMW2xDrgrbekcup+qhG569+N2kX2s= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:a555:: with SMTP id e21mr14965431ljn.423.1613571008126; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:10:08 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <161317039399.31293.9074519998478118059@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: From: Rakesh Gandhi Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 09:09:57 -0500 Message-ID: To: IETF IPPM WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000c261fc05bb88c6ac" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] FW: New Version Notification for draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss-00.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 14:10:13 -0000 --000000000000c261fc05bb88c6ac Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi WG, We have posted a new draft on simple direct loss measurement. The procedure was previously part of draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-01 (and draft-gandhi-spring-stamp-srpm-02 before that). The procedure defined is generic and not tied to SRPM drafts. Welcome your comments and suggestions. Thank you for providing comments on the previous versions. Regards, Rakesh (on behalf of authors) > > *From: *internet-drafts@ietf.org > *Date: *Friday, February 12, 2021 at 5:53 PM > *Subject: *New Version Notification for > draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss-00.txt > > > A new version of I-D, draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss-00.txt > has been successfully submitted by Rakesh Gandhi and posted to the > IETF repository. > > Name: draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss > Revision: 00 > Title: Simple Two-Way Direct Loss Measurement Procedure > Document date: 2021-02-12 > Group: Individual Submission > Pages: 15 > URL: > https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss-00.txt > Status: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss/ > Htmlized: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss > Htmlized: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss-00 > > > Abstract: > This document defines Simple Two-Way Direct Loss Measurement (DLM) > procedure that can be used for Alternate-Marking Method for detecting > accurate data packet loss in a network. Specifically, DLM probe > packets are defined for both unauthenticated and authenticated modes > and they are efficient for hardware-based implementation. > > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of > submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > The IETF Secretariat > > --000000000000c261fc05bb88c6ac Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi WG,

=C2=A0= 

We have posted a new draft on simple direct loss measurement. 
T=
he procedure was previously part of draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-01 (and dr=
aft-gandhi-spring-stamp-srpm-02 before that).
The procedure defined is generic and not tied to SRPM draf=
ts.

<=
pre style=3D"margin:0cm 0cm 0.0001pt;font-family:"Courier New""><=
font size=3D"2">=
Welcome your comments and suggestions. Thank you for providing comments on =
the previous versions.
=C2=A0=

Regards,
Rakesh (on behalf of authors)<=
/pre>

=C2=A0

From: internet-drafts@ietf.org <<= a href=3D"mailto:internet-drafts@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">internet-draft= s@ietf.org>
Date: Friday, February 12, 2021 at 5:53 PM
Subject: New Version Notification for draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direc= t-loss-00.txt


A new version of I-D, draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss-00.txt
has been successfully submitted by Rakesh Gandhi and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 draft-gan= dhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss
Revision:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 00
Title:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Simple Two-Way= Direct Loss Measurement Procedure
Document date:=C2=A0 2021-02-12
Group:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Individual Sub= mission
Pages:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 15
URL:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss-00.txt=
Status:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss/<= br> Htmlized:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss<= /a>
Htmlized:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-simple-direct-loss-00


Abstract:
=C2=A0=C2=A0 This document defines Simple Two-Way Direct Loss Measurement (= DLM)
=C2=A0=C2=A0 procedure that can be used for Alternate-Marking Method for de= tecting
=C2=A0=C2=A0 accurate data packet loss in a network.=C2=A0 Specifically, DL= M probe
=C2=A0=C2=A0 packets are defined for both unauthenticated and authenticated= modes
=C2=A0=C2=A0 and they are efficient for hardware-based implementation.
<= /p>

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat

--000000000000c261fc05bb88c6ac-- From nobody Wed Feb 17 06:16:56 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 369EE3A1A6E; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:16:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aTyeM_gjGGiK; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:16:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wr1-x429.google.com (mail-wr1-x429.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::429]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7A3AB3A1A6A; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:16:50 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wr1-x429.google.com with SMTP id n8so17535847wrm.10; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:16:50 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=VDQPGEEIrk3lqKTTwxXKU1+jaAVl9xxOwTu5Rm8XaFY=; b=vfGVHuKS8DwxBHsuJfSEmfcVyll55R4bUGT/ymyp2cYFRYzcf7JAadgScOjbfkicZ6 TUCum3PAvBXEYV14B6vrnBf6MBFx3WEYDwPz/8pmoFZzCgBSJnpCrBVEpADpf5soxeGC M+H2QGDs9PrTx8m0+2EOoGgdAIhRMY3/jf3ia0tJ2y8nIDXwLxK7LX0lw4izrZeWXY8K uyTK9/amakmzn8Uqo4kNik/y4rkOZb4l4H2JqynjFmdccEqvmZDk+PpSEGEzTQrnIqba f2MdmwIpoZU46sovzjTebfPBzMxTHh2jiZsrQ32NjN+DxBCg7Hs7rpT/vwaz/L+V51sN pJOQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=VDQPGEEIrk3lqKTTwxXKU1+jaAVl9xxOwTu5Rm8XaFY=; b=G2liG42+N8//oP1ISKHcFHLsFGA1cUVwa9sAP1cYJe8O6LMlDt9dcxDvIAgX4YbKYa KYmrCAgUECu1jYFJ29/kT59p6IfsubaJQSXBMS6cQC8aoW3viXL2UjdQvTaXq6FcHMq+ HdPzfXjyJd6pLB11os/KCEu/fTZ/eAKP9vu+27rf6n2Mk+u9YV2w/5kPZY5YqfA92un5 2HVsIQqAI0lTyTBVPDr0yPtWiRDMtjKse/LT1XptFHJ17/+Pjcvw9eQvATFJM3sOu1sh ogG9z/QKI8/Z9DpVIndEq/hF+y9S9d+bexGrmZWd2HQpHYmuzwcgeMu24sucycIMOsVN LujQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5309Maxy6XWL7XW9/lIyur88ZObFgW49O9ZO0Ezu1DFCP/LcZbel 3a3YjaPXwlLAtesEbsHj9eEmkLgDd4dnadhv8CmTQ3+X/GlwlA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwcroaw7SlNs7wyrss8QcZBD7xLV/+/4YBntFi4mZmyXptw1TE1ZcguGpoNd8FuQ5eL39CKMbpU13xrRRqqvAs= X-Received: by 2002:adf:e542:: with SMTP id z2mr29395406wrm.37.1613571408622; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:16:48 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <161357092854.24830.10751213943219252886@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161357092854.24830.10751213943219252886@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Tal Mizrahi Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 16:16:37 +0200 Message-ID: To: IETF IPPM WG Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export@ietf.org, Martin Duke , IPPM Chairs Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 14:16:55 -0000 Hi, An updated version of the DEX draft has been posted. There are a few minor editorial updates, and one notable update of the security section following the discussion with Martin. We updated the Security Considerations section based on this discussion, and we hope it resolves this issue. A link to the security discussion: https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/UMluZlthNvDhkQV-ULnxSOfPMwg/ There is one major open issue regarding this draft, which we have been discussing for a while now, regarding whether the DEX header should have a fixed length, or two possible lengths (with two possible formats). We hope this can be resolved in IETF 110. Cheers, Tal. On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 4:09 PM wrote: > > > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. > > Title : In-situ OAM Direct Exporting > Authors : Haoyu Song > Barak Gafni > Tianran Zhou > Zhenbin Li > Frank Brockners > Shwetha Bhandari > Ramesh Sivakolundu > Tal Mizrahi > Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03.txt > Pages : 11 > Date : 2021-02-17 > > Abstract: > In-situ Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (IOAM) is used > for recording and collecting operational and telemetry information. > Specifically, IOAM allows telemetry data to be pushed into data > packets while they traverse the network. This document introduces a > new IOAM option type called the Direct Export (DEX) option, which is > used as a trigger for IOAM data to be directly exported without being > pushed into in-flight data packets. > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export/ > > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03 > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export-03 > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm From nobody Wed Feb 17 06:19:56 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93C9C3A0CAF; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:19:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id r01CwOtcmasA; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:19:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wr1-x436.google.com (mail-wr1-x436.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::436]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BD1E03A1A74; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:19:49 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wr1-x436.google.com with SMTP id n8so17546232wrm.10; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:19:49 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=44LeOyZrNRw12K5Loz6uwrff6Q47inD4Rcz9m4/Lj74=; b=gqb4Nd8pYfOyfWkNr0DuFBidzvVqPDIUhWjjMPTm5SufpBz2I71W1KcOHZhTgkxko7 0kyCyX16DRAOaEwnsywZY7sNZO37P04JFscCGMNIbwm8/VVFAWJQNvF2CmyWkpmUY3/L Ngr5gvvxH6cNijXlm/li95ef3sB93I0oSoPSnRLNtSuL/ZPQrb9KPFVM5Nm5AgF/i2sN Cm0CohFSZklB8Mj0drkeD0u2pV81KPj7/oE+hMJn3FDfxv4z9umXCoCwJBLEWfz7Lz+0 H/qTrwZ3Xikt7uoHOrS5sgbfgPwa70kL8gqj2cjsiPw6yp85g8Mwy3YteU+8KAA6QhqU fsfw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=44LeOyZrNRw12K5Loz6uwrff6Q47inD4Rcz9m4/Lj74=; b=PX3nLOwNCCDQf2q1Ujft3Br/5tpyAO0ZhAG8c9lteMVAdX0/vHHX2jYrQ8EIpha7jG ggv5mY2lqxluUVt4KCGaoFeRPD8OMXiyF4MjuzqekbF2/BloSxJuPOzf17gtDvejl1t+ OCaqPIc+Uu+pE22gYV2V5KlaI4pzcDk+sjyrQrjDQFlBVLqILh+a73y3jBraJVh+j6Po sz0NPeAVsYk5a7utkmL1wrzFTRPHIeU3/fWMGwp4NvM6qwBCCMKmDQD2JKqZrxHFDokN jt3wloAbqvWFJ/od0zXfDqxDtEP6B6vlcwmaDMY2TqOOPXcLN4M2DFTXCwIWQiB5L1ue SqPQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5335K5/QrhvMrQKlikD9yUh363wE87z3nbY14zrtbMHJ/xfKlcEZ cW857XXOFYr94qmcuqjuZtINoe+lRNLWnwtFBQmXgFOnygEKgw== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwtKwNckq8XraYaOLvTRteT+HJy8EnxFKCGwgvE7ASoJMSEX5PdbWlXNZsGfRBXWLPP87zWtykmNWLX6UnKQ1M= X-Received: by 2002:adf:ee49:: with SMTP id w9mr24770755wro.144.1613571587812; Wed, 17 Feb 2021 06:19:47 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <161357084681.9639.16012873591506447169@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161357084681.9639.16012873591506447169@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Tal Mizrahi Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 16:19:36 +0200 Message-ID: To: IETF IPPM WG Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags@ietf.org, IPPM Chairs , Martin Duke Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Feb 2021 14:19:55 -0000 Hi, An updated version has been posted. The main update since the last version is related to the security issue that was discussed on the following thread. https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ippm/UMluZlthNvDhkQV-ULnxSOfPMwg/ We believe the current version resolves the issue as indicated on the thread above. Cheers, Tal. On Wed, Feb 17, 2021 at 4:08 PM wrote: > > > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. > This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. > > Title : In-situ OAM Flags > Authors : Tal Mizrahi > Frank Brockners > Shwetha Bhandari > Ramesh Sivakolundu > Carlos Pignataro > Aviv Kfir > Barak Gafni > Mickey Spiegel > Jennifer Lemon > Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04.txt > Pages : 11 > Date : 2021-02-17 > > Abstract: > In-situ Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (IOAM) records > operational and telemetry information in the packet while the packet > traverses a path between two points in the network. This document > presents new flags in the IOAM Trace Option headers. Specifically, > the document defines the Loopback and Active flags. > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags/ > > There are also htmlized versions available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04 > > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-flags-04 > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm From nobody Fri Feb 19 11:53:13 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EE7823A1438 for ; 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Fri, 19 Feb 2021 11:53:07 -0800 (PST) From: Tommy Pauly Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_AECBA0ED-FE60-4692-B743-BB5896BD86BC" MIME-version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.80.0.2.6\)) Message-id: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2021 11:53:07 -0800 To: "IETF IPPM WG (ippm@ietf.org)" X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.80.0.2.6) X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-19_08:2021-02-18, 2021-02-19 signatures=0 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] IETF 110 Draft Agenda Posted X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:53:13 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_AECBA0ED-FE60-4692-B743-BB5896BD86BC Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hello IPPM, I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-ippm-00 = This time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session = on Monday will be focused on trying to close out some discussions and = make decisions for various IOAM documents. The second session on Friday = will focus on the other working group documents, proposed work, and = lightning talks. We do have additional lightning talk slots available, = so please email the chairs if you are interested. Best, Tommy & Ian= --Apple-Mail=_AECBA0ED-FE60-4692-B743-BB5896BD86BC Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Hello= IPPM,

I=E2=80=99ve = just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110:

https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-i= ppm-00

This = time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session on = Monday will be focused on trying to close out some discussions and make = decisions for various IOAM documents. The second session on Friday will = focus on the other working group documents, proposed work, and lightning = talks. We do have additional lightning talk slots available, so please = email the chairs if you are interested.

Best,
Tommy & = Ian
= --Apple-Mail=_AECBA0ED-FE60-4692-B743-BB5896BD86BC-- From nobody Fri Feb 19 13:44:29 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 386433A08C0 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 13:44:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jQnjjFgzsiJ9 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 13:44:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lj1-x230.google.com (mail-lj1-x230.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 61A1B3A08BE for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 13:44:26 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lj1-x230.google.com with SMTP id v6so28935720ljh.9 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 13:44:26 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=L5vFuqI1ysl6JMcehunbaQmke3Qid1n+8IBW2Xq5c/Y=; b=YwO/YvXfdkk0feCJDyOF5py8cFMw0q1q1tiYZ348wyzkw9ZNNEYx9jx6Fx8Ub/jX7v 5lFUkAch0sYCpgZBEogTdcg/x9B4V1enngP4UoTomPRHMwWG5Njz7EhMnnGxiMBe2MT3 TSoH1zcF5N2JnhMm63ETU5smM3nLa0cQsWcmrX1Kc5kmCVQbcBpGrwrXpYdkW9kLr1Qn B71FICOFlGQESSA3Xp3WNYKGoif51OmYKxSBiz2oBv3/gf1v6XCnpbRWtWLGZhCMitd0 +rolwogfi1ZlVkX3p35UF0hY2KilaQbWZfRWVN74qU/j2GSoxWTWl+Xt8l54HFSjl6g8 izNQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=L5vFuqI1ysl6JMcehunbaQmke3Qid1n+8IBW2Xq5c/Y=; b=Duqsa2OGErPO4FWyojEySJjpx5IU1HlbvBfSWh5+KHkU76Qcvw55NhYZXFdYJPPfnu 0yW63jbJy+teDX9C9SiJy0ZWfyIuBzYjsR7BFiGFSk0l/q83m6gHBh0YbjUx3iYncSzm KqtecUgDUNEeDqMR0UY/DqY++L8+1TGfQGRpG8eBskXjV1ZaxY4nGKTy95u58BLJM36h sYgUyoEjeeZVCggNVm/nqTSabVedxPC/4QlL/rTrwD5j4f0Wqbd5i3QFunJyWxfy+/ua PORxOExI31eqR5U/UC/+4kQlN9JCESpUtNjjIE2k/WgTJ9KaLofkwGgzXY/ptqUa/vxe mGEg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533BaJgbPJ2q1OzRoj8uIrTXnvZH3QM7oM1hBPJAzqdfYRoVpJ0p fh7lt0K+j1F48xdsjUAGEmgAkga94ezhjKcea4Eh1zlccg0= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzQTv6B+b/v8P+wFtfryvuViipTe/VYfQ5fQaJozCnFonJcCVEnImGhukqdvFUb6fkxAPsGBmrrfnmHsHd/fqI= X-Received: by 2002:ac2:5285:: with SMTP id q5mr6947521lfm.109.1613771064197; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 13:44:24 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> In-Reply-To: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2021 13:44:12 -0800 Message-ID: To: Tommy Pauly Cc: "IETF IPPM WG (ippm@ietf.org)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000007c3f305bbb75be1" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] IETF 110 Draft Agenda Posted X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2021 21:44:28 -0000 --00000000000007c3f305bbb75be1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tommy, thank you for preparing the agenda. I would not have an update on the STAMP YANG data model for this meeting. The work is going on but it took longer than expected. Regards, Greg On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy Pauly wrote: > Hello IPPM, > > I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-ippm-00 > > This time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session on= Monday > will be focused on trying to close out some discussions and make decision= s > for various IOAM documents. The second session on Friday will focus on th= e > other working group documents, proposed work, and lightning talks. We do > have additional lightning talk slots available, so please email the chair= s > if you are interested. > > Best, > Tommy & Ian > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm > --00000000000007c3f305bbb75be1 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Tommy,
thank you for preparing the agenda. I would = not have an update on the STAMP YANG data model for this meeting. The work = is going on but it took longer than expected.

Rega= rds,
Greg

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy Pauly <t= pauly=3D40apple.com@dmarc.iet= f.org> wrote:
Hello IPPM,

I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110:


This time, we=E2= =80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session on Monday will be fo= cused on trying to close out some discussions and make decisions for variou= s IOAM documents. The second session on Friday will focus on the other work= ing group documents, proposed work, and lightning talks. We do have additio= nal lightning talk slots available, so please email the chairs if you are i= nterested.

Best,
Tommy & Ian
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--00000000000007c3f305bbb75be1-- From nobody Fri Feb 19 19:30:18 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D76503A0FEF for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:30:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BMFVt1kFZNVw for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:30:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lj1-x22f.google.com (mail-lj1-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C0DCD3A123C for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:29:56 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lj1-x22f.google.com with SMTP id k22so34309623ljg.3 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:29:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=z6BH9jzZ9CRwVdqtZ50jUX74lJZb2fqESdohW/h5U1s=; b=lJ8VAC0K13cAfswy1SCoeFimh7pB8D5joFwgz+hU8O4GpKYRdPhMGud/fUfW8Tsgj6 pTmjRJwAYC2uFGMFdcdGVbeYXsw4ytDjsT2UkN31LgxnMo7SXroHeCJBemtckuP/IXhk KzOLdRoUtCkxYkdDGfR0tB6GLWIzgV08gCCZL+vqyin9ryD4f/iMWyarnX8iJCDgAyv6 zKEa+OR4QyHc+dD78xE4+IxUCZdAP7RLNjI5iBjLvLHMQWcxympO6MNktrbf1FbrONmZ KD1L9HMlnVUys9gkui6SUBgFlQE9gckuLMaKjuXFDPvGfJRkiI2TtrugkI/OwChshTYo FMJw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=z6BH9jzZ9CRwVdqtZ50jUX74lJZb2fqESdohW/h5U1s=; b=AKLBP1jyl3teHvoYjHa6Jr3bLPfPNjJcQwynOZ4Vjwou4nhNN8vOXYCZ0FRvxGXp7F ilxj2DyX+l/wmuJ90kmNBkhvJRGP2ZVNVFwZfNhLJdwZ4ThuNEEuywyagvTrrW3Z3/YJ 096Q/x23Mz61OXThXEIpjkJjiQrgThhV8Y/6W4pj663Up8M/6zE5NXHSt1F+WuWARVsu xBAAQHHBZQa77sfT20aS3HT+LNCzfUQ5NfCJljpnFyoyjQhNuI4h0pIJixLGBGs+07Dg LQN1FBPE4VS511HWJoqMznb0InxPfP/F927cq/yh1OHNDMF1fIbkSGPtonz5QBnqVxKI MCEA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM533sFM0x9juCqUt7fGrGiwJ6ZjY8ZmTd+VKq6wYC+Uo//G/BqKjy 2adjX2KkG8jBAK4m6VmEiixLBcusfpX4ZdQ3ff2wKdW1zh0M1Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyggXkPPep85LMXlqTNo31hAf6WoJZeVug17dwh6ZhbsJb5x9NMZxtL0RAz6hYmavt4UT336xRIPDVWMwPmxxM= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6512:108e:: with SMTP id j14mr7009805lfg.364.1613791795039; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:29:55 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> In-Reply-To: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:29:43 -0800 Message-ID: To: Tommy Pauly Cc: "IETF IPPM WG (ippm@ietf.org)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000af503605bbbc2efe" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] IETF 110 Draft Agenda Posted X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 20 Feb 2021 03:30:17 -0000 --000000000000af503605bbbc2efe Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tommy and Ian, the authors of Error Performance Measurement in Packet-switched Networks would appreciate an opportunity to present this work to the group (it was on the IETF-109 agenda but not presented). draft-mirsky-ippm-epm Presenter: Greg Mirsky Time: 10 min Regards, Greg On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy Pauly wrote: > Hello IPPM, > > I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-ippm-00 > > This time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session on= Monday > will be focused on trying to close out some discussions and make decision= s > for various IOAM documents. The second session on Friday will focus on th= e > other working group documents, proposed work, and lightning talks. We do > have additional lightning talk slots available, so please email the chair= s > if you are interested. > > Best, > Tommy & Ian > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm > --000000000000af503605bbbc2efe Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Tommy and Ian,
the authors of Error Performance Mea= surement in Packet-switched Networks would appreciate an opportunity to pre= sent this work to the group (it was on the IETF-109 agenda but not presente= d).

draft-mirsky-ippm-epm=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Presenter: Greg Mirsky=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 Time: 10 min

Regards,
Greg

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy Pauly <tpauly=3D40apple.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
Hello IPPM,

I=E2=80=99ve just p= osted our draft agenda for IETF 110:


This time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separ= ate sessions. The first session on Monday will be focused on trying to clos= e out some discussions and make decisions for various IOAM documents. The s= econd session on Friday will focus on the other working group documents, pr= oposed work, and lightning talks. We do have additional lightning talk slot= s available, so please email the chairs if you are interested.
Best,
Tommy & Ian
___________________= ____________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm
--000000000000af503605bbbc2efe-- From nobody Fri Feb 19 19:37:56 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4CDA3A104B for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:37:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id U_7zYWocJOK5 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:37:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lj1-x234.google.com (mail-lj1-x234.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 1B50C3A1049 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:37:52 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lj1-x234.google.com with SMTP id j6so34367228ljo.5 for ; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:37:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=kUSLXAaCwvXKpLQ7HIvaS01tspZibfx31TBkh4+2EeE=; b=uE8C6mkUZA6pRyynZW2pb82kZN5OuZ5OT5LicHY4lU+b/StmbDtwm37TprrjmkMfYq U3ffwxfh64AqlCZ9lH59JjxyJzKwBIUOSHkgOvFFMevTzZQGnoCx5m/W9Ba8XurZ0I2N +/49hh4SC9mkIwOvPSeo4M5LRI0jaNwQ1RcEgcMJGz+D2DvHE2ZlO3GlGMSDM6efeg3P OqimSsO+K4oYmyZaOBTmnFeZne3Ye1/nZ34kq8/9c1zJpAXLrvIW0iBNszn4fdM7T9Bi hN9cTL2e2SG0Mrpm/Jpimpgs+k/H77bHxV2X/VgE1us3ixxjxDD6gI/IKaJkrW2CuJeR nzqg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=kUSLXAaCwvXKpLQ7HIvaS01tspZibfx31TBkh4+2EeE=; b=RpouuXYWtbRoZqAqBfBeUO1Q/2BcshM4WTe244M1v6lV7TcFdFPuDGbue9bfPHVBFn FN5+WLC9nwdNOfhiLIuIceb+zC0+Za6UqhJzfGdMZPb0TPe8mWr6STp01om5WuFoy/RA wSwjlYdSZaLSD7MCdPi/QOklTSib1k2Zpx+FGk7FMM54I2xnkmZfuLATg0uE7HyUceqD yH8vdQafpr6jnmZp7G5Kew4dsuFfauRaz636CjOnp04cpqv2CjFKLpguh24uJXPlKKwe nW0odzt0SAitHtt+toHJrjiIPt6mkvEHqE4R1iXqapNKIOEl2cmr+g5aUP1Lk4lO47Wc ychQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531+qf+lyu5fuKCUwXilZtb2VoRuTpWsckDQYuzZ50zB0JZAfrA3 zoB+CqDhAqzXql+X3CRqcdQInpO8eyqqzqokFmaqesRnoFqLlA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyUenagpCikmm/GgmZFtC9O+BBLHGV2r0bjEvrhs7WGK7ocbo2Tj8x1NENPxyTiNS2ZHKCmsht74Ay79NRQZ3k= X-Received: by 2002:a2e:860a:: with SMTP id a10mr8015961lji.158.1613792270737; Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:37:50 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> In-Reply-To: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> From: Greg Mirsky Date: Fri, 19 Feb 2021 19:37:39 -0800 Message-ID: To: Tommy Pauly Cc: "IETF IPPM WG (ippm@ietf.org)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000009e37505bbbc4bf8" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] IETF 110 Draft Agenda Posted X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 20 Feb 2021 03:37:55 -0000 --00000000000009e37505bbbc4bf8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tommy and Ian, following comments we've received on draft-li-ippm-pm-on-lag, the authors separated O/TWAMP and STAMP solutions. Also, the STAMP solution is solely TLV-based without updating the STAMP base packet. We would greatly appreciate an opportunity to present updates in one presentation, preferably during the Friday session: draft-li-ippm-otwamp-on-lag; draft-li-ippm-stamp-on-lag Presenter: Greg Mirsky (tentatively) Time: 10 min. Regards, Greg On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy Pauly wrote: > Hello IPPM, > > I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-ippm-00 > > This time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session on= Monday > will be focused on trying to close out some discussions and make decision= s > for various IOAM documents. The second session on Friday will focus on th= e > other working group documents, proposed work, and lightning talks. We do > have additional lightning talk slots available, so please email the chair= s > if you are interested. > > Best, > Tommy & Ian > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm > --00000000000009e37505bbbc4bf8 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Tommy and Ian,
following comments we've receive= d on draft-li-ippm-pm-on-lag, the authors separated O/TWAMP and STAMP solut= ions. Also, the STAMP solution is solely TLV-based without updating the STA= MP base packet. We would greatly appreciate an opportunity to present updat= es in one presentation, preferably during the Friday session:
draft-li-ippm-otwamp-on-lag;=C2=A0draft-li-ippm-stamp-on-lag=C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Presenter: Greg Mirsky (tentatively)=C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Time: 10 min.

Regards,
Greg

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy Pauly <tpauly= =3D40apple.com@dmarc.ietf.org= > wrote:
=
Hello IPPM,

I= =E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110:

=

This time, we=E2=80= =99ll have two separate sessions. The first session on Monday will be focus= ed on trying to close out some discussions and make decisions for various I= OAM documents. The second session on Friday will focus on the other working= group documents, proposed work, and lightning talks. We do have additional= lightning talk slots available, so please email the chairs if you are inte= rested.

Best,
Tommy & Ian
_______________________________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm
--00000000000009e37505bbbc4bf8-- From nobody Sun Feb 21 11:45:28 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4ABE23A104D; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 11:45:26 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <161393672626.8442.8164673772592413917@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 21 Feb 2021 11:45:26 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-12.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 21 Feb 2021 19:45:26 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Data Fields for In-situ OAM Authors : Frank Brockners Shwetha Bhandari Tal Mizrahi Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-12.txt Pages : 45 Date : 2021-02-21 Abstract: In-situ Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (IOAM) records operational and telemetry information in the packet while the packet traverses a path between two points in the network. This document discusses the data fields and associated data types for in-situ OAM. In-situ OAM data fields can be encapsulated into a variety of protocols such as NSH, Segment Routing, Geneve, IPv6 (via extension header), or IPv4. In-situ OAM can be used to complement OAM mechanisms based on e.g. ICMP or other types of probe packets. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-12 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-12 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-12 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Sun Feb 21 12:59:53 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 00CA73A113B; Sun, 21 Feb 2021 12:59:48 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <161394118795.8151.6101236245760675844@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Sun, 21 Feb 2021 12:59:47 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-ipv6-options-05.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 21 Feb 2021 20:59:48 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : In-situ OAM IPv6 Options Authors : Shwetha Bhandari Frank Brockners Carlos Pignataro Hannes Gredler John Leddy Stephen Youell Tal Mizrahi Aviv Kfir Barak Gafni Petr Lapukhov Mickey Spiegel Suresh Krishnan Rajiv Asati Mark Smith Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-ipv6-options-05.txt Pages : 14 Date : 2021-02-21 Abstract: In-situ Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (IOAM) records operational and telemetry information in the packet while the packet traverses a path between two points in the network. This document outlines how IOAM data fields are encapsulated in IPv6. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-ipv6-options/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-ipv6-options-05 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-ipv6-options-05 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-ipv6-options-05 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Feb 22 07:55:20 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 068D83A1D4A; Mon, 22 Feb 2021 07:55:12 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <161400931197.10738.5607400687244463512@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2021 07:55:12 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2021 15:55:19 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : A Connectivity Monitoring Metric for IPPM Author : Ruediger Geib Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01.txt Pages : 24 Date : 2021-02-22 Abstract: Within a Segment Routing domain, segment routed measurement packets can be sent along pre-determined paths. This enables new kinds of measurements. Connectivity monitoring allows to supervise the state and performance of a connection or a (sub)path from one or a few central monitoring systems. This document specifies a suitable type-P connectivity monitoring metric. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Feb 22 12:22:08 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 136C23A103A for ; Mon, 22 Feb 2021 12:22:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VGnYIQ8QMOOq for ; Mon, 22 Feb 2021 12:22:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-io1-xd31.google.com (mail-io1-xd31.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d31]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 14FDA3A1EE9 for ; Mon, 22 Feb 2021 12:22:05 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-io1-xd31.google.com with SMTP id i8so14677730iog.7 for ; Mon, 22 Feb 2021 12:22:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=Ag1bTh/DNU0bDdXKLBjBRylVweKkQorga4fIsFEkxnA=; b=WXyGliXPJQb3Ful+EIkIg9cdc5yrQBwCET2WrgH7cRKMkB8Q+8voMkIXWsvonXcAI1 GVI7erMBN2+POfQgl6yJRgpVTTVEmYBK9YcpSW4jj2baNS8/NN1iZbtsBEiEr8yAf9/g gi7NGMYtH5x7cV2X4xjdzjZTeK1AhAtFqct7hEmSNwdmAkAYBrJyEUEmN11pZWI071TP aL2s7W4lULij/KwRVk7oIO4/8NWJb7+XiVB11D8G9yA8Bmc2k3PR5bZVbmxvcPTFTRiB 6iyQN3Ko+G/FwZOF38i54v/ODBE3GmbiL1OtaVemtKR5NSmOX2Tq954SJ49kEt74XJOc K2xA== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=Ag1bTh/DNU0bDdXKLBjBRylVweKkQorga4fIsFEkxnA=; b=kKb9whp5ju+vOblqDNNbORmZ48OIFrd1BotIV82bAN+hbsDbltR0JYjTgLerOwYKSv WeD22/RUZOvGAkLCdcHCnDzSxMG9qUtA/ZWKh/LFq3R+0lT+MFiAkvtKkNWpxs4FFFao RfsFsvj1oIzRzRvzFKcBntNEpQTWc5JevMYYD3Q4rnpdDT7Hb7KDJjDb4uVcxZpPOClk NrVbkncA/SWFNS/o0//5Wm6VnChLtmD7BphhepN8hQir/sYcix2okJqdC4bncutJdG/N ptdqBzIX03CZTk8upVIvopWotz+UxYeIeMgEOnQxu0JYT3HeZQCLR1Bk1p1gBp3wbP0t yVVA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM532oNib9zraX9LGV8sCHlut8968s7SYgm3X9zIPbiUPW89qlvArP sQxRRlNVeK14kNzm1F+J726PfuExEPfwmmdkSibdt2eSLQs= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxNTUyxfdeW6Hfo3BMgvxgXVhfbMjiB4qrl01WdRYsNA6x3TZ1vmbogjjORovT4ccy8fJWZKLTjxcLvkF+mxsg= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6602:98:: with SMTP id h24mr9094808iob.19.1614025324057; Mon, 22 Feb 2021 12:22:04 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 From: Martin Duke Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2021 12:22:10 -0800 Message-ID: To: IETF IPPM WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000001958af05bbf28e15" Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] IOAM Registry Designated Experts? X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 22 Feb 2021 20:22:06 -0000 --0000000000001958af05bbf28e15 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Who should be the designated experts the various IANA registries the ioam-data draft sets up? --0000000000001958af05bbf28e15 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Who should be the designated experts the various IANA registries the ioam-data draft sets up?
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charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: FRYP281MB0112.DEUP281.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 6fa24323-74e1-49d4-3cb5-08d8d7c6ac93 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 23 Feb 2021 06:45:57.0716 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: bde4dffc-4b60-4cf6-8b04-a5eeb25f5c4f X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: 3PWXXGDCTtN5JGhuy/THBfBrlNyM5SdNxhIhDTd6avBH7K47yZpQWFLQWnbllfr9rpR9axCypN82Q0Yhkvzat85uuo40nBfG+fSfMP/QR7Y= X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: FRYP281MB0240 X-TM-SNTS-SMTP: B697F275F8C598B1545CA9B7D55DCE61750B1CB20A45F731C7DE4A122CAAF82D2000:8 X-OriginatorOrg: telekom.de Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 23 Feb 2021 06:46:07 -0000 Hi Tommy, dear IPPM WG, The draft has been progressed to -01 before the meeting as -00 didn't conta= in well formulated metrics. A fair number of metric definitions are contain= ed in -01 (including a changepoint detection), but a few are still missing. Regards, Ruediger -----Urspr=FCngliche Nachricht----- Von: ippm Im Auftrag von internet-drafts@ietf.org Gesendet: Montag, 22. Februar 2021 16:55 An: i-d-announce@ietf.org Cc: ippm@ietf.org Betreff: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01.txt A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : A Connectivity Monitoring Metric for IPPM Author : Ruediger Geib Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01.txt Pages : 24 Date : 2021-02-22 Abstract: Within a Segment Routing domain, segment routed measurement packets can be sent along pre-determined paths. This enables new kinds of measurements. Connectivity monitoring allows to supervise the state and performance of a connection or a (sub)path from one or a few central monitoring systems. This document specifies a suitable type-P connectivity monitoring metric. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring/ There are also htmlized versions available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring-01 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitori= ng-01 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-ippm-connectivity-monitoring= -01 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ _______________________________________________ ippm mailing list ippm@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm From nobody Tue Feb 23 22:36:59 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ADD1D3A0A34; Tue, 23 Feb 2021 22:36:52 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Erik Kline via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, Ian Swett , tpauly@apple.com, tpauly@apple.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Erik Kline Message-ID: <161414861268.8652.15719785883972669316@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 23 Feb 2021 22:36:52 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Erik Kline's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 06:36:53 -0000 Erik Kline has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- [[ comments ]] [ section 4 ] * RFC 6438 isn't only about flow label treatment at Tunnel End Points, since other devices in the network can do ECMP where the flow label is part of the flow. Maybe just a full stop after "when routers have complied with RFC6438 guidelines."? [[ questions ]] [ sections 5.6/6.6/7.4 ] * Should the "megabit = 1,000,000 bits" text from section 6.6 be also used in sections 5.6 and 7.4, or even called out separately earlier on? (Maybe it's just my own experience, but I've found that, while "mibi" 100% of the time means base 2, "mega" only mostly means base 10 and occasionally can still be interpreted as base 2.) [[ nits ]] [ section 2 ] * "Also, to foster the development..." This appears to be a sentence fragment rather than a grammatically correct sentence. I assume the point is to say that fostering the development ... is also goal of the document. * "The supporting" -> "Supporting the", might read more naturally? [ section 5.4 ] * "The statistics used to to summarize" -> "The statistics used to summarize" [ section 6.5 ] * "so that is" -> "so that it is"? From nobody Wed Feb 24 06:12:25 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 791BB3A1625; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 06:12:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id i8dJUU5kdEdc; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 06:12:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0b-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.157.136]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5EC083A1624; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 06:12:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0049462.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0049462.ppops.net-00191d01. 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zlp30494.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id 9D0844009E77; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 14:12:02 +0000 (GMT) Received: from sldc.sbc.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clph811.sldc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 11OEC2R8115877; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 08:12:02 -0600 Received: from mail-azure.research.att.com (mail-azure.research.att.com [135.207.255.18]) by clph811.sldc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 11OEBtNv114442; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 08:11:55 -0600 Received: from exchange.research.att.com (njbdcas1.research.att.com [135.197.255.61]) by mail-azure.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EB6310A18D6; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 09:11:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from njmtexg5.research.att.com ([fe80::b09c:ff13:4487:78b6]) by njbdcas1.research.att.com ([fe80::8c6b:4b77:618f:9a01%11]) with mapi id 14.03.0468.000; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 09:12:12 -0500 From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" To: Erik Kline , The IESG CC: "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org" , "ippm-chairs@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" , Ian Swett , "tpauly@apple.com" Thread-Topic: Erik Kline's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHXCneFYUzVXwie1Eytg1RL/4aBG6pnTeXA Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 14:12:11 +0000 Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF014769FD76@njmtexg5.research.att.com> References: <161414861268.8652.15719785883972669316@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161414861268.8652.15719785883972669316@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [24.148.42.167] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-24_04:2021-02-24, 2021-02-24 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 clxscore=1011 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 adultscore=0 impostorscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 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fjughrpegtggfuhfgjfffgkfhfvffosehtqhhmtdhhtddvnecuhfhrohhmpeetlhhishhs rgcuvehoohhpvghruceorghlihhsshgrsegtohhophgvrhifrdhinheqnecuggftrfgrth htvghrnhepjeegiefhvddvgedvffekkefhveelleffjeefffekuedvieeftdetuddtkeef tedvnecuffhomhgrihhnpehgihhthhhusgdrtghomhdpihgvthhfrdhorhhgnecukfhppe dujeefrdefkedruddujedrkeegnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghm pehmrghilhhfrhhomheprghlihhsshgrsegtohhophgvrhifrdhinh X-ME-Proxy: Received: from rtp-alcoop-nitro2.cisco.com (unknown [173.38.117.84]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 3386E108005F; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 11:11:25 -0500 (EST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 13.4 \(3608.120.23.2.4\)) From: Alissa Cooper In-Reply-To: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF014769BD6A@njmtexg5.research.att.com> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 11:11:24 -0500 Cc: "gen-art@ietf.org" , "last-call@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method.all@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <228C8A3B-17F1-40DD-B4C9-432F95EB68A5@cooperw.in> References: <161314437215.27849.15366890249325519802@ietfa.amsl.com> <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF014769BD6A@njmtexg5.research.att.com> To: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" , Stewart Bryant X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3608.120.23.2.4) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] [Gen-art] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 16:11:32 -0000 Stewart, thanks for your review. Al, thanks for responding. I entered a = No Objection ballot. Alissa > On Feb 12, 2021, at 12:04 PM, MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) = wrote: >=20 > Thanks for your review, Stewart! >=20 > please see reply below, > Al >=20 >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Stewart Bryant via Datatracker [mailto:noreply@ietf.org] >> Sent: Friday, February 12, 2021 10:40 AM > ... >> Summary: A well written text ready for publication > [acm]=20 > Thanks! >>=20 >> Major issues: None >>=20 >> Minor issues: None >>=20 >> Nits/editorial comments: >> 8.4. Running Code >>=20 >> This section is for the benefit of the Document Shepherd's form, = and >> will be deleted prior to final review. >>=20 >> SB> I am wondering if this was supposed to be deleted before this = review, >> or whether you plan to keep it? > [acm]=20 > Yes, we'll certainly delete this section before the RFC Editors see = it. However, > there is a lot of review yet to happen. I really don't mind if the = IESG > sees it in some form, but we don't want to risk endorsing one = implementation, IIRC. >=20 > Also, this material could move to the Doc Shepherd's form, but has not = yet: > Document Quality: >=20 > Are there existing implementations of the protocol? ... >=20 > I see that we need to update the reference in section 8.4: > OLD > [udpst] AT&T, "UDP Speed Test Open Broadband project", August > 2020, >. > NEW > [udpst] udpst Project Collaborators, "UDP Speed Test Open Broadband = project",=20 > December 2020, = . >>=20 >>=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Gen-art mailing list > Gen-art@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gen-art From nobody Wed Feb 24 08:13:48 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1297D3A1781; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 08:13:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mpKpxfdpDnvo; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 08:13:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.149.140]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F247B3A177F; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 08:13:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0048589.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0048589.ppops.net-00191d01. (8.16.0.43/8.16.0.43) with SMTP id 11OFsNEu003864; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 11:13:33 -0500 Received: from tlpd255.enaf.dadc.sbc.com (sbcsmtp3.sbc.com [144.160.112.28]) by m0048589.ppops.net-00191d01. with ESMTP id 36wck2b4un-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Wed, 24 Feb 2021 11:13:33 -0500 Received: from enaf.dadc.sbc.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tlpd255.enaf.dadc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 11OGDUfg110447; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:13:32 -0600 Received: from zlp30496.vci.att.com (zlp30496.vci.att.com [135.46.181.157]) by tlpd255.enaf.dadc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 11OGDQjG110238 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:13:26 -0600 Received: from zlp30496.vci.att.com (zlp30496.vci.att.com [127.0.0.1]) by zlp30496.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id 26C4C403A42A; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 16:13:26 +0000 (GMT) Received: from clph811.sldc.sbc.com (unknown [135.41.107.12]) by zlp30496.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id 0398A403A423; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 16:13:25 +0000 (GMT) Received: from sldc.sbc.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by clph811.sldc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 11OGDPxH108335; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:13:25 -0600 Received: from mail-azure.research.att.com (mail-azure.research.att.com [135.207.255.18]) by clph811.sldc.sbc.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 11OGDKAn107727; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:13:20 -0600 Received: from exchange.research.att.com (njmtcas1.research.att.com [135.207.255.86]) by mail-azure.research.att.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79D6C10A18D6; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 11:13:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from njmtexg5.research.att.com ([fe80::b09c:ff13:4487:78b6]) by njmtcas1.research.att.com ([fe80::e881:676b:51b6:905d%12]) with mapi id 14.03.0487.000; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 11:13:36 -0500 From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" To: Alissa Cooper , Stewart Bryant CC: "gen-art@ietf.org" , "last-call@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method.all@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Gen-art] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 Thread-Index: AQHXAVVRNjuS2FwTcEuRLohtdMrgwapUtPyggBMrkAD//6x+8A== Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 16:13:36 +0000 Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A028B@njmtexg5.research.att.com> References: <161314437215.27849.15366890249325519802@ietfa.amsl.com> <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF014769BD6A@njmtexg5.research.att.com> <228C8A3B-17F1-40DD-B4C9-432F95EB68A5@cooperw.in> In-Reply-To: <228C8A3B-17F1-40DD-B4C9-432F95EB68A5@cooperw.in> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [24.148.42.167] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-24_06:2021-02-24, 2021-02-24 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 suspectscore=0 spamscore=0 clxscore=1011 mlxscore=0 adultscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 impostorscore=0 bulkscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2102240124 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] [Gen-art] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-05 X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 16:13:40 -0000 Thanks Alissa! We picked-up the changes below in -06. Al > -----Original Message----- > From: Alissa Cooper [mailto:alissa@cooperw.in] > Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 2021 11:11 AM > To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) ; Stewart Bryant > > Cc: gen-art@ietf.org; last-call@ietf.org; draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric= - > method.all@ietf.org; ippm@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [Gen-art] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-ippm- > capacity-metric-method-05 >=20 > Stewart, thanks for your review. Al, thanks for responding. I entered a N= o > Objection ballot. >=20 > Alissa >=20 >=20 > > On Feb 12, 2021, at 12:04 PM, MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) > wrote: > > > > Thanks for your review, Stewart! > > > > please see reply below, > > Al > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Stewart Bryant via Datatracker [mailto:noreply@ietf.org] > >> Sent: Friday, February 12, 2021 10:40 AM > > ... > >> Summary: A well written text ready for publication > > [acm] > > Thanks! > >> > >> Major issues: None > >> > >> Minor issues: None > >> > >> Nits/editorial comments: > >> 8.4. Running Code > >> > >> This section is for the benefit of the Document Shepherd's form, and > >> will be deleted prior to final review. > >> > >> SB> I am wondering if this was supposed to be deleted before this > review, > >> or whether you plan to keep it? > > [acm] > > Yes, we'll certainly delete this section before the RFC Editors see it. > However, > > there is a lot of review yet to happen. I really don't mind if the IESG > > sees it in some form, but we don't want to risk endorsing one > implementation, IIRC. > > > > Also, this material could move to the Doc Shepherd's form, but has not > yet: > > Document Quality: > > > > Are there existing implementations of the protocol? ... > > > > I see that we need to update the reference in section 8.4: > > OLD > > [udpst] AT&T, "UDP Speed Test Open Broadband project", August > > 2020, > WTy-rSXgIyVrHTemHXduPaFjxrKLvjcfS9WjEPArAVl_pBmiRBvdId2g-JsFM$ >. > > NEW > > [udpst] udpst Project Collaborators, "UDP Speed Test Open Broadband > project", > > December 2020, > !BhdT!3eWTy-rSXgIyVrHTemHXduPaFjxrKLvjcfS9WjEPArAVl_pBmiRBvdIdvdpgG88$ >. > >> > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Gen-art mailing list > > Gen-art@ietf.org > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gen- > art__;!!BhdT!3eWTy- > rSXgIyVrHTemHXduPaFjxrKLvjcfS9WjEPArAVl_pBmiRBvdId7EcuIY4$ From nobody Wed Feb 24 10:26:16 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7492B3A195A; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:26:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JI2tyB8gKol2; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:26:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ot1-x330.google.com (mail-ot1-x330.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::330]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2F74C3A197C; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:26:05 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-ot1-x330.google.com with SMTP id c16so3123436otp.0; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:26:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=thouv/Iugv9Ibk1c9KzTk8Zsgx+FoM9fM+m0l2bDqdk=; b=ooc8h2KXanOK/M5ItFfkTzlSa+VDP0X7rDChaesgaxIrWAzxIbYi8A/J6A9N85U8ZY vkw/nTxZHsVzluYtOTylO+uR/txq9p+wkRBmmE4YxlDao0k20dkUYNZPVvbwF0+aXvsw VmZwjwX4xFLF1T4KItbNxl+Hro4CgklxvHTHVsbZnNw9+orUzgXprw5IBTuLf4JjZn2Y LCgyk6T/zuzmJ5iLplXzRyMt42nUoYY+3HyJDYZsiV/nKoHY5+az5mbzcgUwubee+SHM WBlHlPCTc1VbOzGPwcYxbxky2R5d4iHnSBNv0tAifKXgJZhf7gOdfIcMonZwjNgT5CVA MY5A== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=thouv/Iugv9Ibk1c9KzTk8Zsgx+FoM9fM+m0l2bDqdk=; b=WCITg4muIBFq7ItXgSiOq1KDjXTUU+NFBNbKJy4UE3KsYPWEEcYOKNZk9Z/hzYElx6 KF00BtF5kJFRy4o+8o8XAkURZR1ltC0TAwdf/5BXCWhsv6/i0bN19KsoYElhQYmpjloI CONSs/hZiDohIWp5coP8pUjXf0G7C0wDNVn2y9p2XD2qrPHBGomAxyGxeMxxH4m5S7Gv yMmfBmU5YLPSBexpTu+lxzTT3vgMgG+JUM42YLk/dktf5dVVB97qJ9JrQOBzmEx+NoMT Ipx7MIprcMuBwFBbbOT9NVSf1zv4jnCbfSLtwmoaGM1WhOxsJxeuuH8AbgEwaxKL84jc W1hw== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5306KBeWxg5H2B3otPYVD1bqzINIdGDYKLmOqz6mkgDFmybpWBNy wXL1gM7jQ4k+g+1ZQBoqAUNPZL01E5n661VZCps= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJwLUjYTeE8ZMBZOQd79CME5yxLQZ/hRT0U5nOI3C6iWb1zo7+U5g4TR/x+OqD864o3GT6HeywoWf/LQKwejwjc= X-Received: by 2002:a9d:7591:: with SMTP id s17mr17333712otk.144.1614191164560; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:26:04 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <161414861268.8652.15719785883972669316@ietfa.amsl.com> <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF014769FD76@njmtexg5.research.att.com> In-Reply-To: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF014769FD76@njmtexg5.research.att.com> From: Erik Kline Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 10:25:53 -0800 Message-ID: To: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" Cc: The IESG , Ian Swett , "ippm-chairs@ietf.org" , "tpauly@apple.com" , "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Erik Kline's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 18:26:12 -0000 Thanks! From nobody Wed Feb 24 11:54:21 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D14D3A1A91; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 11:54:15 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, Ian Swett , tpauly@apple.com, tpauly@apple.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Benjamin Kaduk Message-ID: <161419645471.18083.16706266293896961774@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 11:54:15 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 19:54:15 -0000 Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Section 3 5. Less emphasis on ISP gateway measurements, possibly due to less traffic crossing ISP gateways in future. nit: sentence fragment. Section 5 This section sets requirements for the following components to support the Maximum IP-layer Capacity Metric. editorial/nit: I don't think I understand what "the following components" are. Is this referencing some preexisting template for a metric definition? (Same for §6 and §7.) Section 5.3 The number of these IP-layer bits is designated n0[dtn,dtn+1] for a specific dt. (editorial) I'm a little confused by this notation for n0. In Section 4 we say that "dtn" references a specific sub-interval, but the brackets and two items look like they should be the start an end of an interval, for which perhaps just the 'n' would be more appropriate (but we'd want a half-open interval, and would need to worry about 0- vs 1-indexing for n, etc.). Anticipating a Sample of Singletons, the interval dt SHOULD be set to a natural number m so that T+I = T + m*dt with dtn+1 - dtn = dt and with 1 <= n <= m. nit: "dt [...] set to m" doesn't make any sense. nit: this looks like more of a "for 1 <= n <= m" than an "and with". Mathematically, this definition can be represented as: ( n0[dtn,dtn+1] ) C(T,dt,PM) = ------------------------- dt (nit) the "n" appears (in 'dtn') only on the right side but there is no operation applied over it, so this "equation" seems unbalanced without also specifying 'n'. I think the introductory text should mention something about "for each n" or for a given interval dtn" or similar. o n0 is the total number of IP-layer header and payload bits that can be transmitted in Standard Formed packets [RFC8468] from the (nit) RFC 8468 spells it "standard-formed". o C(T,dt,PM) the IP-Layer Capacity, corresponds to the value of n0 measured in any sub-interval ending at dtn (meaning T + n*dt), divided by the length of sub-interval, dt. If it's supposed to be "ending at dtn", then why is the "dtn+1" in the picture at all? o PM represents other performance metrics [see section 5.4 below]; their measurement results SHALL be collected during measurement of IP-layer Capacity and associated with the corresponding dtn for further evaluation and reporting. (nit) this seems to duplicate (be a subset of) the paragraph before "Mathematically, this definition can be represented". o The bit rate of the physical interface of the measurement device must be higher than that of the link whose C(T,I,PM) is to be measured. (nit) I thought we were measuring a path, not a link. Section 5.4 RTD[dtn-1,dtn] is defined as a sample of the [RFC2681] Round-trip Do we really want to be using n0[dtn,dtn+1] but RTD[dtn-1,dtn]? Can we pick a consistent sub-interval notation? Section 6.3 Define the Maximum IP-layer capacity, Maximum_C(T,I,PM), to be the maximum number of IP-layer bits n0[dtn,dtn+1] that can be transmitted in packets from the Src host and correctly received by the Dst host, (nit) the relevant formulae include a dt divisor, but I don't see anything in this prose that would correspond to such a divisor. The interval dt SHOULD be set to a natural number m so that T+I = T + m*dt with dtn+1 - dtn = dt and with 1 <= n <= m. nit: "dt [...] set to m" doesn't make any sense. nit: this looks like more of a "for 1 <= n <= m" than an "and with". Mathematically, this definition can be represented as: max ( n0[dtn,dtn+1] ) [T,T+I] Maximum_C(T,I,PM) = ------------------------- dt where: T T+I _________________________________________ | | | | | | | | | | | dtn=1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 n+1 n=m (nit) as mentioned previously, the definition of "dtn" lists it as being the sub-interval, not the boundary point/time of a sub-interval. Section 6.5 If traffic conditioning (e.g., shaping, policing) applies along a path for which Maximum_C(T,I,PM) is to be determined, different values for dt SHOULD be picked and measurements be executed during multiple intervals [T, T+I]. A single constant interval dt SHOULD be chosen so that is an integer multiple of increasing values k times serialisation delay of a path MTU at the physical interface speed where traffic conditioning is expected. [...] nit: "so that is an integer multiple" seems to be missing a word. Also, this seems to say that different values for dt SHOULD be picked, but also that a constant dt SHOULD be chosen. How can those both be recommended and be consistent with each other? (I mean, I assume that the intent is to multiple runs with different (fixed) dt, but that's not what the text seems to say.) Section 7.3 Define the IP-layer Sender Bit Rate, B(S,st), to be the number of IP- layer bits (including header and data fields) that are transmitted from the Source during one contiguous sub-interval, st, during the test interval S (where S SHALL be longer than I), and where the fixed-size packet count during that single sub-interval st also provides the number of IP-layer bits in any interval: n0[stn-1,stn]. (1) there doesn't seem to be any restriction that the observed packets list Dst as the destination address, so formally it seems this would count *all* traffic generated by Sender, not just the traffic relevant for the (path capacity) test. (2) It seems a little unfortunate that we reuse the 'n0' symbol here for a different meaning than in the earlier capacity metrics. Measurements according to these definitions SHALL use the UDP transport layer. Any feedback from Dst host to Src host received by Src host during an interval [stn-1,stn] MUST NOT result in an adaptation of the Src host traffic conditioning during this interval (rate adjustment occurs on st boundaries). Hmm, this "MUST NOT" is interesting, as it seems to imply extremely tight coordination between the measurement point for this metric and the Source itself. (Note that the toplevel §7 admits the possibility that measurement will occur at a location other than the Src host to network path interface, via "(or as close as practical)".) Section 8.1 At the beginning of a test, the sender begins sending at rate R1 and the receiver starts a feedback timer at interval F (while awaiting It's a little hard to search for, but I didn't find any previous mention of 'F' or it being defined as a parameter or term. Should it be a listed parameter somewhere? If the feedback indicates that sequence number anomalies were detected OR the delay range was above the upper threshold, the offered load rate is decreased. Also, if congestion is now confirmed by the current feedback message being processed, then the offered load rate is decreased by more than one rate (e.g., Rx-30). [...] Does "congestion is now confirmed" mean that "congestion confirmed" is like a one-way latch and this transition only occurs at most once over the course of a test? Or could the Rx-30 happen multiple times? (The pseudocode indicates the former.) If the feedback indicates that there were no sequence number anomalies AND the delay range was above the lower threshold, but below the upper threshold, the offered load rate is not changed. The way this is written suggests that there will always be a lower and an upper threshold for delay, but the rest of the document so far didn't give me that impression. E.g., we talk about PM only as "at least one fundamental metric and target performance threshold MUST be supplied", and to me having both upper and lower thresholds would be two thresholds, not one. Section 8.2 Here, as with any Active Capacity test, the test duration must be kept short. 10 second tests for each direction of transmission are common today. The default measurement interval specified here is I = 10 seconds). In combination with a fast search method and user- network coordination, the concerns raised in RFC 6815[RFC6815] are alleviated. [...] I skimmed RFC 6815 and had a bit of a hard time making the connection for why combining a 10-second interval, fast search method, and user-network coordination alleviate the concerns of RFC 6815. There doesn't seem to be much in 6815 itself about how testing in production can be done safely, so my current working assumption is that the conclusion presented here reflects the results of "new work" being recorded for the first time (in the RFC series) in this document. If that assumption is correct, I'd suggest spending some more words to support the conclusion, e.g., making analogies to other "normal" traffic patterns and how the benchmarking setup is not qualitatively different from them. Section 8.3 As testing continues, implementers should expect some evolution in the methods. The ITU-T has published a Supplement (60) to the Y-series of Recommendations, "Interpreting ITU-T Y.1540 maximum IP- layer capacity measurements", [Y.Sup60], which is the result of continued testing with the metric and method described here. I pulled up the [Y.Sup60] reference, and it does not seem to reference this draft by name. On what basis do we conclude that it "is the result of continued testing with the metric and method described here"? Skimming/searching, I do see many similar formulae and methods presented, but how do we conclude they are precisely the same? Section 10 Should we say something about making sure that I is reasonably bounded? IIRC we say so elsewhere in the text but not exactly here. 2. A REQUIRED user client-initiated setup handshake between cooperating hosts and allows firewalls to control inbound unsolicited UDP which either go to a control port [expected and w/authentication] or to ephemeral ports that are only created as needed. [...] nit: the grammar is odd in the first part of this sentence; the part before the "and" doesn't seem like it can join up with anything after the "and". Is the intent something like "It is REQUIRED to have a user client-initiated setup handshake between cooperating hosts that allows firewalls to [...]"? 3. Integrity protection for feedback messages conveying measurements is RECOMMENDED. (In some sense you want authentication as well as integrity protection.) 5. Senders MUST be rate-limited. This can be accomplished using the pre-built table defining all the offered load rates that will be supported (Section 8.1). The recommended load-control search algorithm results in "ramp up" from the lowest rate in the table. nit: since (effectively) each implementation will have their own pre-built table, I think it should be "using a pre-built table". Appendix 13 If we start at Rx (row) 1, is it going to cause problems when we drop down to Rx = 0 in the loss/congestion cases? The mechcanism in the pseudocode to stop taking large increments in sending rate above the "hSpeedThresh" does not seem to be described in the prose in §8.1. (That said, it seems like a good idea, given the likely table composition.) (Also, indenting one tab for the outer conditionals and two more for the inner ones looks a bit unusual.) Section 14 It's not entirely clear to me why RFC 2330 is classified as normative but RFC 7312 is informative, just based on the locations where they are referenced. 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"tpauly@apple.com" Thread-Topic: Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHXCubpIAgrxqGmcU+aUTtf1usNw6pnzooA Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 03:08:29 +0000 Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A0549@njmtexg5.research.att.com> References: <161419645471.18083.16706266293896961774@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161419645471.18083.16706266293896961774@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [24.148.42.167] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-25_01:2021-02-24, 2021-02-25 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 adultscore=0 phishscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxscore=0 malwarescore=0 spamscore=0 priorityscore=1501 bulkscore=0 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IG11Y2ggaXMgb3dlZCB0byAyMzMwLCBzdGFydGluZyB3aXRoIHRoZSBzaW5nbGV0b24sIHNhbXBs ZSwgc3RhdGlzdGljIG1ldHJpYyBkZXZlbG9wbWVudCwgdW5tZW50aW9uZWQgc3R1ZmYgYWJvdXQg Y2xvY2tzIGFuZCBhY2N1cmFjeSwgZXRjLg0KPiANCj4gDQoNCg== From nobody Wed Feb 24 23:29:33 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7E393A14B5; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 23:29:31 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Murray Kucherawy via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, Ian Swett , tpauly@apple.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Murray Kucherawy Message-ID: <161423817140.3353.1475330199149849094@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 23:29:31 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Murray Kucherawy's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with DISCUSS) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:29:32 -0000 Murray Kucherawy has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: Discuss When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCUSS: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Several of the SHOULDs in this document are giving me trouble. There are two categories in particular: As described in RFC 2119, we typically use this sort of language to describe interoperability or security concerns. How are the SHOULDs in Section 9 related to interoperability or security? Rather, they seem to be describing issues of presentation. Since a SHOULD leaves an implementer with a choice, it's preferable to see prose explaining why one might deviate from the SHOULD advice. Thus, the SHOULDs in Sections 5.3 and 6.3 leave me wondering under what circumstances an implementer might legitimately choose to do something else. If there are none, should it be a MUST? From nobody Wed Feb 24 23:46:32 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B5A43A14F0; Wed, 24 Feb 2021 23:46:26 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Murray Kucherawy via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, Ian Swett , tpauly@apple.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Murray Kucherawy Message-ID: <161423918590.3132.11573095082732904242@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 24 Feb 2021 23:46:26 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Murray Kucherawy's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:46:27 -0000 Murray Kucherawy has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: Discuss When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCUSS: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Several of the SHOULDs in this document are giving me trouble. There are two main categories, one in particular I'd like to discuss: As described in RFC 2119, we typically use this sort of language to describe interoperability or security concerns. How are the SHOULDs in Section 9 related to interoperability or security? Rather, they seem to be describing issues of presentation. Or is this another instance of the "operational advice" exception that's come up on other operational advice documents? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Similar to my DISCUSS POINT: Since a SHOULD leaves an implementer with a choice, it's preferable to see prose explaining why one might deviate from the SHOULD advice. Thus, the SHOULDs in Sections 5.3 and 6.3 leave me wondering under what circumstances an implementer might legitimately choose to do something else. If there are none, should it be a MUST? From nobody Thu Feb 25 06:18:50 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEA8D3A1A5C; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 06:18:43 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Magnus Westerlund via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, Ian Swett , tpauly@apple.com, tpauly@apple.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Magnus Westerlund Message-ID: <161426272345.2083.7668347127672505809@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 06:18:43 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with DISCUSS) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 14:18:44 -0000 Magnus Westerlund has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: Discuss When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DISCUSS: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- A) Section 8. Method of Measurement I think the metrics are fine, what makes me quite worried here is the measurement method. My concerns with it are the following. 1. The application of this measurement method is not clearly scoped. Therefore I will assume that across the Internet measurements are possible. However in that context I think the definition and protection against severe congestion has significant short comings. The main reason is that the during a configurable time period (default 1 s) the sender will attempt to send at a specified rate by a table independently on what happens during that second. 2. The algorithm for adjusting rate is table driven but give no guidance on how to construct the table and limitations on value changes in the table. In addition the algorithm discusses larger steps in the table without any reflection of what theses steps sides may represent in offered load. 3. Third the algorithms reaction to any sequence number gaps is dependent on delay and how it is related to unspecified delay thresholds. Also no text discussion how these thresholds should be configured for safe operation. B) Section 8. Method of Measurement There are no specification of the measurement protocol here that provides sequence numbers, and the feedback channel as well as the control channel. Is this intended to use TWAMP? >From my perspective this document defines the metrics on standards track level. However, the method for actually running the measurements are not specified on a standards track level. No one can build implementation. And if the section is intended to provide requirements on a protocol that performs these measurements I think several aspects are missing. There appear several ways forward here to resolve this; one is to split out the method of measurement and define it separately to standard tracks level using a particular protocol, another is to write it purely as requirements on a measurement protocols. From nobody Thu Feb 25 07:12:45 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCB103A1B00 for ; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:12:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.098 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TL7J36s6vRwy for ; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:12:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-io1-xd35.google.com (mail-io1-xd35.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B4E633A1AFF for ; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:12:42 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-io1-xd35.google.com with SMTP id n14so6207669iog.3 for ; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:12:42 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=reUtRuS6oo8RMPRPwGKd2nWpXs56Z3ZMiPv+J1zFMyU=; b=XLKIHVdXH661MMOQoiCY2KcUrRBzohwBsKldhTZTXOWtQuEykUM14qePKGoxXqp6Zn JImtFdrSmoc8m8oNh7Vr9tvwCI1uNd03ArhdRjZLvgT2UcnJBjVHBv1FgiTGu8EaLXT2 uiLXGf22VGfUW8Uybbzg4k/EGj1VQz2zBu2c4CwEM+1xhM3W7CVd6pB7yt/ihYuvLrla fX4rs6qwweyGZpEXSqdGmd5/vLXaiyrrgPKit5KMkHmskU/6D+0qLRtuRd5MYXht4QLo kEa3jS1Sl70oHmFyuEU7B1JBaRCebP+Za58wusXJzcvJUak6DzptA3v3CzUugG4gGFYz RhuQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=reUtRuS6oo8RMPRPwGKd2nWpXs56Z3ZMiPv+J1zFMyU=; b=nZ/YUJlr1fMw3FsDhlpivpNwlIHJ8e2II7OuiBEajijdc+nHWbjpdqEZ24El1voDM0 TdKe1vJEtlYEtcWY0403yy8blv8DPfIX3me6OLSTIlOp9bH6q53F3UEQLmSvqVQYRyKA 8J4CDVSIg0O6wqFll1Za1EQ8NgxmPN2s9uxGu55aGDyTdrIgIWlfDwG42Zv3PIWoZ9r7 G7AerLiiLmQJwIlJiHzw9+ynSAhbYqpfhbzYRd7x7E/1XMTg/3/Wu7lDH2B0cUv5pG0b pQ6ZrY3SDKni74dTOqpCr9zWkRgqOPHVvp5gFwXgrmjZegoS8TaR5+8wW7os7y72/NTe HLpg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM5331p1gwJOaSjcMP8OSo8tLgYf5jrFkhtBPpXRCHCG02trTZN3pR EKtWgXNjXtYpkf25Ul/ZltRLK/62DZPUtmeUQiAr9und5Ng= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzQc6Y++g4ZZlUc7vAY6bsjm76+vvVXL3ZNS3vpXMnov7GNL/Ooavt7cyBzmh2+Iiy9GdfkZLdcoNxiEDMQzH8= X-Received: by 2002:a5d:818f:: with SMTP id u15mr2974623ion.95.1614265961490; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:12:41 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: In-Reply-To: From: Martin Duke Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:12:30 -0800 Message-ID: To: IETF IPPM WG Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000035303805bc2a9570" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] IOAM Registry Designated Experts? X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 15:12:44 -0000 --00000000000035303805bc2a9570 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Anyone interested? On Mon, Feb 22, 2021 at 12:22 PM Martin Duke wrote: > Who should be the designated experts the various IANA registries the > ioam-data draft sets up? > --00000000000035303805bc2a9570 Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Anyone interested?

On Mon, Feb 22, 2021 at 12:22 PM Mar= tin Duke <martin.h.duke@gmail= .com> wrote:
Who should be the designated experts the various IANA = registries the ioam-data draft sets up?
--00000000000035303805bc2a9570-- From nobody Thu Feb 25 07:21:23 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D45493A1B83; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:21:15 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Murray Kucherawy via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, Ian Swett , tpauly@apple.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.26.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Murray Kucherawy Message-ID: <161426647584.14166.5269938969946072865@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 07:21:15 -0800 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Murray Kucherawy's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 15:21:17 -0000 Murray Kucherawy has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Since a SHOULD leaves an implementer with a choice, it's preferable to see prose explaining why one might deviate from the SHOULD advice. Thus, the SHOULDs in Sections 5.3 and 6.3 leave me wondering under what circumstances an implementer might legitimately choose to do something else. If there are none, should it be a MUST? 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Thu, 25 Feb 2021 15:54:13 +0000 From: "Frank Brockners (fbrockne)" To: Martin Duke , IETF IPPM WG Thread-Topic: [ippm] IOAM Registry Designated Experts? 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From nobody Thu Feb 25 14:03:49 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1214C3A0C99; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 14:03:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wlHGq6geB-kZ; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 14:03:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EE53A3A0C8A; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 14:03:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from kduck.mit.edu ([24.16.140.251]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as kaduk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 11PM3Qux007940 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 25 Feb 2021 17:03:30 -0500 Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 14:03:25 -0800 From: Benjamin Kaduk To: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" Cc: The IESG , "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org" , "ippm-chairs@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" , Ian Swett , "tpauly@apple.com" Message-ID: <20210225220325.GX21@kduck.mit.edu> References: <161419645471.18083.16706266293896961774@ietfa.amsl.com> <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A0549@njmtexg5.research.att.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A0549@njmtexg5.research.att.com> Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 25 Feb 2021 22:03:42 -0000 Hi Al, Also inline... On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 03:08:29AM +0000, MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) wrote: > Hi Ben, > > Thanks for your detailed review; it will be a better draft when we're done, as always! > > All the changes identified below are implemented in my working version. > > Please see replies below, [acm] > Al > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker [mailto:noreply@ietf.org] > > Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 2021 2:54 PM > > To: The IESG > > Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org; ippm-chairs@ietf.org; > > ippm@ietf.org; Ian Swett ; tpauly@apple.com; > > tpauly@apple.com > > Subject: Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric- > > method-06: (with COMMENT) > > > > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for > > draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: No Objection > > > ... > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > COMMENT: > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Section 3 > > > > 5. Less emphasis on ISP gateway measurements, possibly due to less > > traffic crossing ISP gateways in future. > > > > nit: sentence fragment. > [acm] > ok > s/Less/There is less/ > > > > > Section 5 > > > > This section sets requirements for the following components to > > support the Maximum IP-layer Capacity Metric. > > > > editorial/nit: I don't think I understand what "the following > > components" are. > [acm] > I see your point. In the IPPM Framework RFC2330 (Section 11), the singleton and the sample metrics are defined separately, and statistics are the metrics that summarize samples. > > We could say this more directly: > > This section sets requirements for the singleton metric that supports the Maximum IP-layer Capacity Metric definition in Section 6. > > > > Is this referencing some preexisting template for a > > metric definition? (Same for §6 and §7.) > [acm] > Yes. The original template has its origins in RFC1242 (1991 in BMWG). BMWG and IPPM shared a single session at IETF meetings during IPPM's formation, and the first IPPM metric in RFC2498 uses a template very similar to RFC1242. > > Sorry if this is TMI. Not at all! I was wondering if there was a foundational RFC that laid out "when defining a metric, use this format", and it sounds like there isn't quite that, but there is a de facto standard format and thus this will be familiar to most readers. > > > > Section 5.3 > > > > The number of these IP-layer bits is designated n0[dtn,dtn+1] for a > > specific dt. > > > > (editorial) I'm a little confused by this notation for n0. In Section 4 > > we say that "dtn" references a specific sub-interval, but the brackets > > and two items look like they should be the start an end of an interval, > > for which perhaps just the 'n' would be more appropriate (but we'd want > > a half-open interval, and would need to worry about 0- vs 1-indexing for > > n, etc.). > [acm] > Maybe if we tweak the definition of dtn in section 4, we can help without causing more confusion: > OLD > o dtn, a specific sub-interval, n, one of m sub-intervals in I > NEW > o dtn, the beginning boundary of a specific sub-interval, n, one of m sub-intervals in I That would probably do the trick; good idea! > > > > > Anticipating a Sample of Singletons, the interval dt SHOULD be set to > > a natural number m so that T+I = T + m*dt with dtn+1 - dtn = dt and > > with 1 <= n <= m. > > > > nit: "dt [...] set to m" doesn't make any sense. > > nit: this looks like more of a "for 1 <= n <= m" than an "and with". > [acm] > Ok, here's the revised text I suggest: > > Anticipating a Sample of Singletons, the number of sub-intervals with duration dt SHOULD be set to a natural number m, so that T+I = T + m*dt with dtn+1 - dtn = dt for 1 <= n <= m. > > (The definition of dt in Section 4 effectively defines m with fewer dependencies, but this sentence tries to tie the whole system of variables together.) > > > > > Mathematically, this definition can be represented as: > > > > ( n0[dtn,dtn+1] ) > > C(T,dt,PM) = ------------------------- > > dt > > > > (nit) the "n" appears (in 'dtn') only on the right side but there is no > > operation applied over it, so this "equation" seems unbalanced without > > also specifying 'n'. I think the introductory text should mention > > something about "for each n" or for a given interval dtn" or similar. > [acm] > Thanks, that's a good fix. > > > > > o n0 is the total number of IP-layer header and payload bits that > > can be transmitted in Standard Formed packets [RFC8468] from the > > > > (nit) RFC 8468 spells it "standard-formed". > [acm] > Thanks, fixed. > > > > > o C(T,dt,PM) the IP-Layer Capacity, corresponds to the value of n0 > > measured in any sub-interval ending at dtn (meaning T + n*dt), > > divided by the length of sub-interval, dt. > > > > If it's supposed to be "ending at dtn", then why is the "dtn+1" in the > > picture at all? > [acm] > Good catch, there was a version where dtn was at the end of the sub-interval in the IPPM memo, but we moved it for consistency with other specifications. > Fixed as "...beginning at dtn, ..." > Section 6.3 too. > > > > > o PM represents other performance metrics [see section 5.4 below]; > > their measurement results SHALL be collected during measurement of > > IP-layer Capacity and associated with the corresponding dtn for > > further evaluation and reporting. > > > > (nit) this seems to duplicate (be a subset of) the paragraph before > > "Mathematically, this definition can be represented". > [acm] > It's a simplification of the paragraph above: it seemed odd not to list PM and a short explanation along with the other dependent aspects. > > > > > o The bit rate of the physical interface of the measurement device > > must be higher than that of the link whose C(T,I,PM) is to be > > measured. > > > > (nit) I thought we were measuring a path, not a link. > [acm] > yes, path, and s/device/devices/ > Similar in 6.3. > > > > > > Section 5.4 > > > > RTD[dtn-1,dtn] is defined as a sample of the [RFC2681] Round-trip > > > > Do we really want to be using n0[dtn,dtn+1] but RTD[dtn-1,dtn]? Can we > > pick a consistent sub-interval notation? > [acm] > Sorry to have left a few of these behind in the notation conversion! > Fixed. > > > > > Section 6.3 > > > > Define the Maximum IP-layer capacity, Maximum_C(T,I,PM), to be the > > maximum number of IP-layer bits n0[dtn,dtn+1] that can be transmitted > > in packets from the Src host and correctly received by the Dst host, > > > > (nit) the relevant formulae include a dt divisor, but I don't see > > anything in this prose that would correspond to such a divisor. > [acm] > Yes, you're right: > Define the Maximum IP-layer capacity, Maximum_C(T,I,PM), to be the > maximum number of IP-layer bits n0[dtn,dtn+1] divided by dt that ... > > > > > > The interval dt SHOULD be set to a natural number m so that T+I = T + > > m*dt with dtn+1 - dtn = dt and with 1 <= n <= m. > > > > nit: "dt [...] set to m" doesn't make any sense. > > nit: this looks like more of a "for 1 <= n <= m" than an "and with". > [acm] > Same fix as Section 5.3 > > The number of sub-intervals with duration dt SHOULD be set to a natural number m, so that T+I = T + m*dt with dtn+1 - dtn = dt for 1 <= n <= m. > > > > > Mathematically, this definition can be represented as: > > > > max ( n0[dtn,dtn+1] ) > > [T,T+I] > > Maximum_C(T,I,PM) = ------------------------- > > dt > > where: > > T T+I > > _________________________________________ > > | | | | | | | | | | | > > dtn=1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 n+1 > > n=m > > > > (nit) as mentioned previously, the definition of "dtn" lists it as being > > the sub-interval, not the boundary point/time of a sub-interval. > [acm] > Right, tweaked in the parameter definition now, section 4. > > > > > > Section 6.5 > > > > If traffic conditioning (e.g., shaping, policing) applies along a > > path for which Maximum_C(T,I,PM) is to be determined, different > > values for dt SHOULD be picked and measurements be executed during > > multiple intervals [T, T+I]. A single constant interval dt SHOULD be > > chosen so that is an integer multiple of increasing values k times > > serialisation delay of a path MTU at the physical interface speed > > where traffic conditioning is expected. [...] > > > > nit: "so that is an integer multiple" seems to be missing a word. > [acm] > Yes, "it" is the word, thanks. > > > > > Also, this seems to say that different values for dt SHOULD be picked, > > but also that a constant dt SHOULD be chosen. How can those both be > > recommended and be consistent with each other? (I mean, I assume that > > the intent is to multiple runs with different (fixed) dt, but that's not > > what the text seems to say.) > [acm] > Yes, I see your point, this paragraph describes tests at multiple values of dt. > > OLD > A single constant interval dt SHOULD be chosen so that it is an integer > multiple of increasing values k times serialisation delay of a path MTU > at the physical interface speed where traffic conditioning is expected. > NEW > Each duration dt SHOULD be chosen so that it is an integer > multiple of increasing values k times serialization delay of a path MTU > at the physical interface speed where traffic conditioning is expected. Thanks! > > > > > Section 7.3 > > > > Define the IP-layer Sender Bit Rate, B(S,st), to be the number of IP- > > layer bits (including header and data fields) that are transmitted > > from the Source during one contiguous sub-interval, st, during the > > test interval S (where S SHALL be longer than I), and where the > > fixed-size packet count during that single sub-interval st also > > provides the number of IP-layer bits in any interval: n0[stn-1,stn]. > > > > (1) there doesn't seem to be any restriction that the observed packets > > list Dst as the destination address, so formally it seems this would > > count *all* traffic generated by Sender, not just the traffic relevant > > for the (path capacity) test. > [acm] > Yes, I agree that's not what we intended. Let's add both Src and Dst: > > ... that are transmitted from the Source with address pair Src and Dst > during one contiguous sub-interval, st, ... > > > (2) It seems a little unfortunate that we reuse the 'n0' symbol here for > > a different meaning than in the earlier capacity metrics. > [acm] > Yes, the earlier definition of n0 demands correct reception at the destination > and we can't assure that at a sender measurement point with UDP. > > I think we can just drop n0: > OLD > ... and where the fixed-size packet count during that single sub-interval st also > provides the number of IP-layer bits in any interval: n0[stn-1,stn]. > NEW > ... and where the fixed-size packet count during that single sub-interval st also > provides the number of IP-layer bits in any interval, [stn,stn+1]. > > Now, it strikes me that we didn't define stn with the same rigor as dtn, so I added > a definition for stn in section 7.2 Parameters section above: > > o stn, the beginning boundary of a specific sub-interval, n, one of N sub-intervals in S > > > > > > > Measurements according to these definitions SHALL use the UDP > > transport layer. Any feedback from Dst host to Src host received by > > Src host during an interval [stn-1,stn] MUST NOT result in an > > adaptation of the Src host traffic conditioning during this interval > > (rate adjustment occurs on st boundaries). > > > > Hmm, this "MUST NOT" is interesting, as it seems to imply extremely > > tight coordination between the measurement point for this metric and the > > Source itself. (Note that the toplevel §7 admits the possibility that > > measurement will occur at a location other than the Src host to network > > path interface, via "(or as close as practical)".) > [acm] > Yes, that's what we had in mind, but we also envision the measurement point > *internal* to the Src host making synchronization of rate adjustments and > measurements more practical, too. We're just asking to get very close to the > physical interface. > > so in toplevel §7: > ... (or as close as practical within the Src host). I was expecting the common case to be in the host, at least, but I guess I hadn't thought too much about the location within the host as being so important. Thanks for clarifying! > But now, all the realities of measurement in front of mind, I think SHOULD NOT > will be sufficient. > > > > > > Section 8.1 > > > > At the beginning of a test, the sender begins sending at rate R1 and > > the receiver starts a feedback timer at interval F (while awaiting > > > > It's a little hard to search for, but I didn't find any previous mention > > of 'F' or it being defined as a parameter or term. Should it be a > > listed parameter somewhere? > [acm] > We define a lot of variables in this section, with limited scope of use. > F is one of them, but I found that we had already defined F in Section 4! > So... F becomes FT, and like R1 and ss and cc, gets no special treatment > beyond a definition in the text (IF you're ok with that). That should be fine. > > > > If the feedback indicates that sequence number anomalies were > > detected OR the delay range was above the upper threshold, the > > offered load rate is decreased. Also, if congestion is now confirmed > > by the current feedback message being processed, then the offered > > load rate is decreased by more than one rate (e.g., Rx-30). [...] > > > > Does "congestion is now confirmed" mean that "congestion confirmed" is > > like a one-way latch and this transition only occurs at most once over > > the course of a test? Or could the Rx-30 happen multiple times? > > (The pseudocode indicates the former.) > [acm] > Yes, we are trying to describe the pseudocode, and "congestion confirmed" > latches when the slowAdjCount equals the slowAdjThresh (and after that, > slowAdjCount continues upward, the slowAdjCount < slowAdjThresh condition > fails and slowAdjCount is never reset to zero). > > So, I think we want to say: > OLD > Also, if congestion is now confirmed by the current feedback message... > NEW > Also, if congestion is now confirmed for the first time by the > current feedback message... +1 > > > > If the feedback indicates that there were no sequence number > > anomalies AND the delay range was above the lower threshold, but > > below the upper threshold, the offered load rate is not changed. > > > > The way this is written suggests that there will always be a lower and > > an upper threshold for delay, but the rest of the document so far didn't > > give me that impression. E.g., we talk about PM only as "at least one > > fundamental metric and target performance threshold MUST be supplied", > > and to me having both upper and lower thresholds would be two > > thresholds, not one. > [acm] > That's true, we tried not to force our current/best algorithm into the > metric definition. We require some measurement to use for feedback > in rate adjustment, otherwise you just have iPerf or other fixed rate > tools that can only blast packets. > > You can build an "ok" feedback system with just one metric and one threshold, > but there are drawbacks and it may take longer duration tests to measure > the true maximum capacity due to a technical limitation. > So, we gave a really good algorithm, in 8.1, in pseudocode, and even > in running code That all makes sense to me. I'm not sure if there's a good way to shoehorn some of that insight into the text of the document itself, but it also doesn't seem like something that's critical to do. > > > > > Section 8.2 > > > > Here, as with any Active Capacity test, the test duration must be > > kept short. 10 second tests for each direction of transmission are > > common today. The default measurement interval specified here is I = > > 10 seconds). In combination with a fast search method and user- > > network coordination, the concerns raised in RFC 6815[RFC6815] are > > alleviated. [...] > > > > I skimmed RFC 6815 and had a bit of a hard time making the connection > > for why combining a 10-second interval, fast search method, and > > user-network coordination alleviate the concerns of RFC 6815. There > > doesn't seem to be much in 6815 itself about how testing in production > > can be done safely, > [acm] > That's certainly true, but we did say: > > The world will not spin off axis while waiting for appropriate and > standardized methods to emerge from the consensus process. > > > so my current working assumption is that the > > conclusion presented here reflects the results of "new work" being > > recorded for the first time (in the RFC series) in this document. > [acm] > > When you put it that way, yes. Although it is a different metric from > RFC2544 Throughput, the load adjustment search algorithm alone helps > to make this method safer to use than any fixed-rate UDP packet blaster, > or even a binary search-controlled measurement because of near real-time > feedback. > > The other reasons why this work is different are that > RFC 2544 Throughput measurements intend to overload the isolated test > environment for extended periods of time: > > 24. Trial duration (from https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2544#section-24) > > The aim of these tests is to determine the rate continuously > supportable by the DUT. The actual duration of the test trials must > be a compromise between this aim and the duration of the benchmarking > test suite. The duration of the test portion of each trial SHOULD be > at least 60 seconds. ... > > Many automated RFC2544 test devices start a test at the highest load, and > search their way down to the zero-loss Throughput, subjecting the > device under test to potentially extreme overload multiple times before > reaching the test outcome > > > If that assumption is correct, I'd suggest spending some more words to > > support the conclusion, e.g., making analogies to other "normal" traffic > > patterns and how the benchmarking setup is not qualitatively different > > from them. > [acm] > > OK, I put some more background together and made the case stronger: > the memo we wrote hear is exactly what the RFC6815 authors were asking for. > > The Max IP Capacity metric and method for assessing is very different from classic RFC2544 > Throughput metric and methods : it uses near-real-time load adjustments that are sensitive to loss and delay, similar to other congestion control algorithms used on the Internet every day, along with limited duration. On the other hand, RFC2544 Throughput measurements can produce sustained overload conditions for extended periods of time. Individual trials in a test governed by a binary search can last 60 seconds for each step, and the final confirmation trial may be even longer. This is very different from "normal" traffic levels, but overload conditions are not a concern in the isolated test environment. The concerns raised in RFC6815 were that RFC2544 methods would be let loose on production networks, and instead the authors challenged the standards community to develop metrics and methods like those described in this memo. Thanks; that is what I was asking for. I think this is related to Magnus's Discuss point, though, and I cannot speak for whether it will make him happy as well... > > > > > Section 8.3 > > > > As testing continues, implementers should expect some evolution in > > the methods. The ITU-T has published a Supplement (60) to the > > Y-series of Recommendations, "Interpreting ITU-T Y.1540 maximum IP- > > layer capacity measurements", [Y.Sup60], which is the result of > > continued testing with the metric and method described here. > > > > I pulled up the [Y.Sup60] reference, and it does not seem to reference > > this draft by name. On what basis do we conclude that it "is the result > > of continued testing with the metric and method described here"? > > Skimming/searching, I do see many similar formulae and methods > > presented, but how do we conclude they are precisely the same? > [acm] > I'll soften that a bit. The Max IP-Layer Capacity metric is > the same, but it is likely that a few details in the method have diverged > over time -- much of the ITU-T testing and spec development came first. > > NEW > ... [Y.Sup60], which is the result of continued testing with the metric, > and those results have improved the method described here. Thanks. My primary concern here was that it seemed like we were making statements about what some other SDO did, and typically it's good to have sign-off from the other SDO before doing that. The NEW option doesn't seem to have that issue, so it should be good. > > > > > > Section 10 > > > > Should we say something about making sure that I is reasonably bounded? > > IIRC we say so elsewhere in the text but not exactly here. > [acm] > I added a direct reference to I at the end of item 6.: > > ... Testing with the Service Provider's measurement hosts SHOULD be limited in frequency and/or overall volume of test traffic (for example, the range of I duration values SHOULD be limited). > > > > 2. A REQUIRED user client-initiated setup handshake between > > cooperating hosts and allows firewalls to control inbound > > unsolicited UDP which either go to a control port [expected and > > w/authentication] or to ephemeral ports that are only created as > > needed. [...] > > > > nit: the grammar is odd in the first part of this sentence; the part > > before the "and" doesn't seem like it can join up with anything after > > the "and". Is the intent something like "It is REQUIRED to have a user > > client-initiated setup handshake between cooperating hosts that allows > > firewalls to [...]"? > [acm] > Thanks, good re-wording, it's in. > > > > > 3. Integrity protection for feedback messages conveying measurements > > is RECOMMENDED. > > > > (In some sense you want authentication as well as integrity protection.) > [acm] > Yes. The running code has optional authentication now. > > NEW > 3. Client-server authentication and integrity protection for feedback > messages conveying measurements is RECOMMENDED. > > > > > 5. Senders MUST be rate-limited. This can be accomplished using the > > pre-built table defining all the offered load rates that will be > > supported (Section 8.1). The recommended load-control search > > algorithm results in "ramp up" from the lowest rate in the table. > > > > nit: since (effectively) each implementation will have their own > > pre-built table, I think it should be "using a pre-built table". > [acm] > OK, "a" it is. > > > > > > Appendix 13 > > > > If we start at Rx (row) 1, is it going to cause problems when we drop > > down to Rx = 0 in the loss/congestion cases? > [acm] > It would, but the current table includes a Row zero, which is where we > cold-start. I guess it would less confusing to say: > > Rx = 0 # The current sending rate (equivalent to a row of the table) Yes, I think so. > > > > > The mechcanism in the pseudocode to stop taking large increments in > > sending rate above the "hSpeedThresh" does not seem to be described in > > the prose in §8.1. (That said, it seems like a good idea, given the > > likely table composition.) > [acm] > It's getting late here now, but I think it's in the first two If statements: > > if ( seqErr == 0 && delay < lowThresh ) { # no loss or delay problems, and > if ( Rx < hSpeedTresh && slowAdjCount < slowAdjThresh ) { # Rate < hSpeedThresh && etc. > Rx += highSpeedDelta; # can still use large increments > slowAdjCount = 0; > } else { # otherwise (Rate >= hSpeedThresh) > if ( Rx < maxLoadRates - 1 ) # after checking headroom, > Rx++; # can only increase by one I followed up on this out-of-band -- I agree that the pseudocode is good, and was wondering that the prose in Section 8.1 was divergent from the pseudocode. Your proposal for new prose text looks good: % However, if a rate threshold between high and very high sending % rates (such as 1Gbps) is exceeded, the offered load rate is only % increased by one (Rx+1) above the rate threshold in any congestion state. > > > > > (Also, indenting one tab for the outer conditionals and two more for the > > inner ones looks a bit unusual.) > [acm] > I like unusual :-) > > > > > Section 14 > > > > It's not entirely clear to me why RFC 2330 is classified as normative > > but RFC 7312 is informative, just based on the locations where they are > > referenced. > [acm] > It's more than that. RFC 7312 describes some unusual access conditions that might be encountered and is only cited at the end of the Intro, once. Certainly the measured evidence of bimodal (turbo-mode) access behavior is in the category of RFC 7312 "messy stuff", but we still manage that pretty well and it's not specifically mentioned in 7312. > > OTOH, RFC 2330 is the IPPM Framework, with an exception to be Informative status, yet Normative in our memos, and much is owed to 2330, starting with the singleton, sample, statistic metric development, unmentioned stuff about clocks and accuracy, etc. > Understood. Thanks for all the updates and explanations! -Ben From nobody Thu Feb 25 22:05:26 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 190983A0ECB; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 22:05:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DUoNmFtHk2hR; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 22:05:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.149.140]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id CE3D13A0EC0; Thu, 25 Feb 2021 22:05:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0049297.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0049297.ppops.net-00191d01. 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Thread-Topic: Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with DISCUSS) Thread-Index: AQHXC4EzqJ5daDOk8keYoMTRANvS6qpo9txg Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 06:05:13 +0000 Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A0C0E@njmtexg5.research.att.com> References: <161426272345.2083.7668347127672505809@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161426272345.2083.7668347127672505809@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [24.148.42.167] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-26_01:2021-02-24, 2021-02-26 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 lowpriorityscore=0 priorityscore=1501 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 bulkscore=0 adultscore=0 malwarescore=0 mlxlogscore=999 impostorscore=0 phishscore=0 suspectscore=0 clxscore=1011 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2102260047 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with DISCUSS) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 06:05:25 -0000 SGkgTWFnbnVzLCBUaGFua3MgZm9yIHlvdXIgcmV2aWV3Lg0KDQpQbGVhc2Ugc2VlIHJlcGxpZXMg dG8geW91ciByZXZpZXcgYW5kIGNvbW1lbnRzIGZyb20gTGVuIGFuZCBtZSwgY29uc29saWRhdGVk IGFuZCBtYXJrZWQgW2FjbV0gYmVsb3csDQoNCkFsDQoNCj4gLS0tLS1PcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdl LS0tLS0NCj4gRnJvbTogTWFnbnVzIFdlc3Rlcmx1bmQgdmlhIERhdGF0cmFja2VyIFttYWlsdG86 bm9yZXBseUBpZXRmLm9yZ10NCj4gU2VudDogVGh1cnNkYXksIEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDI1LCAyMDIxIDk6 MTkgQU0NCj4gVG86IFRoZSBJRVNHIDxpZXNnQGlldGYub3JnPg0KPiBDYzogZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1p 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X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: HE1PR0702MB3772.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 1750bf28-20d8-4f8e-e353-08d8da428c96 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 26 Feb 2021 10:37:43.3181 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 92e84ceb-fbfd-47ab-be52-080c6b87953f X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: MTdFtdXtjdxS6u/ttwKRZvyFqKoFO56IPRwjxHk9uBsPuhTS9LwRH6ORWkmutgWp1Afvs0fYo89h7aSo28piNFl+KmlL2xBKAm8CNoWGfA8= X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: HE1PR0702MB3706 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with DISCUSS) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 10:38:13 -0000 --=-ErrqRk71o7lHxe16vdkZ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Al, Please see inline.=20 On Fri, 2021-02-26 at 06:05 +0000, MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) wrote: > Hi Magnus, Thanks for your review. >=20 > Please see replies to your review and comments from Len and me, consolida= ted > and marked [acm] below, >=20 > Al >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Magnus Westerlund via Datatracker [mailto:noreply@ietf.org] > > Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2021 9:19 AM > > To: The IESG > > Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org; ippm-chairs@ietf.o= rg; > > ippm@ietf.org; Ian Swett ; tpauly@apple.com; > > tpauly@apple.com > > Subject: Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric= - > > method-06: (with DISCUSS) > >=20 > > Magnus Westerlund has entered the following ballot position for > > draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: Discuss > >=20 >=20 > ... > >=20 > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > DISCUSS: > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >=20 > > A) Section 8. Method of Measurement > >=20 > > I think the metrics are fine, what makes me quite worried here is the > > measurement method. My concerns with it are the following. > >=20 > > 1. The application of this measurement method is not clearly scoped. > > Therefore > > I will assume that across the Internet measurements are possible.=20 >=20 > [acm] >=20 > Like all the ad hoc Internet Speed measurements in the world today, our > primary interest is access measurement. I added "Applicability" to the S= cope > and Goals section 2, as follows: >=20 > NEW paragraph > The primary application of this metric and method of measurement describe= d > here is the same as in Section 2 of RFC7479, where: >=20 > o The access portion of the network is the focus of this problem statemen= t. > The user typically subscribes to a service with bidirectional access part= ly > described by rates in bits per second. >=20 Good, I guess that this was the case, but it wasn't stated explicitly.=20 The reason I am worried is that this metric and also the method of measurem= ent as noted creates impact on the network. What makes me extra worried is that= the congestion avoidance property is currently not well documented and the rath= er big parameterization space that is left without guidance and will impact th= e properties.=20 > -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D- >=20 > [acm] Obviously we won't be able to stop application beyond access, just = like > we can't stop people from grabbing one of any number of utilities and any= where > and sending at any rate they can achieve, but we have made an applicabili= ty > statement.=20 >=20 > > However in > > that context I think the definition and protection against severe conge= stion > > has significant short comings. The main reason is that the during a > > configurable time period (default 1 s) the sender will attempt to send = at > > a specified rate by a table independently on what happens during that > > second. >=20 > [acm]=20 > Not quite, 1 second is the default measurement interval for Capacity, but > sender rate adjustments occur much faster (and we add a default at 50ms).= This > is a an important point (and one that Ben also noticed, regarding variabl= e F > in section 8.1). So, I have added FT as a parameter in section 4: >=20 > o FT, the feedback time interval between status feedback messages > communicating measurement results, sent from the receiver to control the > sender. The results are evaluated to determine how to adjust the current > offered load rate at the sender (default 50ms) >=20 > -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D- > Note that variable F in section 8.1 is redundant with parameter F in Sect= ion > 4,=20 > the number of flows (in-06). So we changed the section 8.1 variable F to = FT=20 > in the working text. Okay, that makes things clearer. With all the equal intervals in the metric= s I had missinterpreted that also the transmission would be uniform during the measurement intervals.=20 However, when rereading Section 8.1 I do have to wonder if the non-cumaltiv= e feedback actually creates two issues. First, it appears to loose informatio= n for reordering that crosses the time when the FT timer fires, due to reset. In addition if the feedback is not reliable it looses the information for that interval. And making feedback reliabel could cause worse HOL issues for rea= cting to later feedback that are recived prior to the lost one.=20 >=20 >=20 > >=20 > > 2. The algorithm for adjusting rate is table driven but give no guidanc= e on > > how > > to construct the table and limitations on value changes in the table. I= n > > addition the algorithm discusses larger steps in the table without any > > reflection of what theses steps sides may represent in offered load. >=20 > [acm]=20 > We can add (Len suggested the following text addition): > OLD > 8.1. Load Rate Adjustment Algorithm >=20 > A table SHALL be pre-built defining all the offered load rates that > will be supported (R1 through Rn, in ascending order, corresponding > to indexed rows in the table). Each rate is defined as datagrams of... >=20 > NEW > 8.1. Load Rate Adjustment Algorithm >=20 > A table SHALL be pre-built defining all the offered load rates that > will be supported (R1 through Rn, in ascending order, corresponding > to indexed rows in the table). It is RECOMMENDED that rates begin with > 0.5 Mbps at index zero, use 1 Mbps at index one, and then continue in > 1 Mbps increments to 1 Gbps. Above 1 Gbps, and up to 10 Gbps, it is > RECOMMENDED that 100 Mbps increments be used. Above 10 Gbps, > increments of 1 Gbps are RECOMMENDED. Each rate is defined as... Is this what you actually used in your test implementation? At my first gla= nce this recommendation looks to suffer from rather severe step effects and als= o make the respond to losses behave strange around the transitions. Wouldn't = some type of logarithmic progression be more appropriate here for initial probin= g? If I have 1 GBPS line rate, there is a 1000 steps in the table to this valu= e. Even if I increase with the suggested 10 steps until first congestion seen,= it will take 100 steps, and with 50 ms feedback interval that is 5 seconds bef= ore it is in the right ball park. And I get one random loss at 10 mbps, then it= s 990 steps, In such a situation the whole measurement period (10 s) would be ove= r before one has reached actual capacity.=20 To me it appears that the probing (slow start) equivalent do need logarithm= ic increase to reach likely capacity quickly. Then how big the adjustment is actually dependent on what extra delay one consider the target for the test= . Having a step size of 1 GBPS if probing a 2.5 GBPS path would likely make i= t very hard to keep the delay in the intended interval when it would fluxtuat= e between 500 mbps to much traffic and then 500 mbps to little. Sure with sufficiently short FT it will likely work in this algorithm. However, I won= der about regulation stability here for differnet RTT, FTs and buffer depth fluxtuations.=20 =46rom my perspective I think this is a indication that the load rate adjustm= ent algorithm is not ready to be a standards track specification.=20 I would recommend that you actually take out the control algorithm and writ= e a high level functional description of what needs to happen when measuring th= is capacity.=20 If I understand this correctly the requirements on the measurement are the following. - Need to seek the available capacity so that several measurement period ar= e likely to be done at capacity - Must not create persistent congestion as the capacity measurement should = be based on traffic capacity that doesn't cause more standing queue that X, wh= ere X is some additiona delay in ms compared to minimal one way delay. And X is actually something that is configurable for a measurement campagin as capac= ity for a given one way delay and delay variation can be highly relevant to kno= w.=20 What else is needed? Are synchronized clocks needed or just relative delay changes necessary?= =20 >=20 > -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D- >=20 > >=20 > > 3. Third the algorithms reaction to any sequence number gaps is depende= nt on > > delay and how it is related to unspecified delay thresholds. Also no te= xt > > discussion how these thresholds should be configured for safe operation= . >=20 > [acm]=20 > We can add some details in the paragraph below: > OLD > If the feedback indicates that sequence number anomalies were detected OR= =20 > the delay range was above the upper threshold, the offered load rate is > decreased.=20 > Also, if congestion is now ... > NEW > If the feedback indicates that sequence number anomalies were detected OR= =20 > the delay range was above the upper threshold, the offered load rate is > decreased.=20 > The RECOMMENDED values are 0 for sequence number gaps and 30-90 ms for lo= wer=20 > and upper delay thresholds. Also, if congestion is now ... Ok, but the delay values as I noted before highly dependent of what my goal= with the capacity metric is. If I want to figure out the capacity for like say X= R or cloud gaming applications that maybe have much lower OWD variances and abso= lute values so maybe my values are 10-25 ms.=20 How much explaration have you done of the control stability over a range of parameters? Do you have any material about that?=20 >=20 > -=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D-=3D- >=20 > Please also note many requirements for safe operation in Section 10,=20 > Security Considerations. >=20 > >=20 > > B) Section 8. Method of Measurement > >=20 > > There are no specification of the measurement protocol here that provid= es > > sequence numbers, and the feedback channel as well as the control chann= el. >=20 > [acm]=20 > That is correct. The Scope does not include protocol development. >=20 > > Is this intended to use TWAMP? >=20 > [acm]=20 > Maybe, but a lot of extensions would be involved. >=20 > >=20 > > From my perspective this document defines the metrics on standards trac= k > > level. However, the method for actually running the measurements are no= t > > specified on a standards track level.=20 >=20 > [acm] > In IPPM work, the methods of measurement are described more broadly than= =20 > the metrics, as actions and operations the Src and Dst hosts perform to= =20 > send and receive, and calculate the results.=20 >=20 > IPPM Methods of Measurement have not included protocol requirements in= =20 > the past, in any of our Standards Track Metrics RFCs. In fact, we develo= ped=20 > a measurement-specific criteria for moving our RFCs along the standards t= rack=20 > that has nothing to do with protocols or interoperability.=20 > See BCP 176 aka RFC 6576: https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6576 > IP Performance Metrics (IPPM) Standard Advancement Testing=20 >=20 > > No one can build implementation.=20 >=20 > [acm]=20 > I'm sorry, but that is not correct. Please see Section 8.4. Sorry, that was poorly formulated. I mean that you can't give this specific= ation to a guy on a island without external communication and have them implement= ed it and it will work with someone else implementation. You have clearly impleme= nted a solutiont that works for some set of parameters. And I am asking how much= of the reasonable parameter space you have tested.=20 Based on this discussion I don't think I can build an implementation that fulfills the measurement goals, becasue I have questions about them. And I suspect it would take substantial amount of experimentation to get it to wo= rk correctly over a broader range of input parameters.=20 >=20 > > And if the section is > > intended to provide requirements on a protocol that performs these > > measurements > > I think several aspects are missing. There appear several ways forward = here > > to > > resolve this; one is to split out the method of measurement and define = it > > separately to standard tracks level using a particular protocol, anothe= r > > is to write it purely as requirements on a measurement protocols. >=20 > [acm]=20 > As stated above, connecting a method with a single protocol is not IPPM's= way. That is fine. However, I find the attempt to specify a specific load regula= tor in the method of measurement to take this specification beyond a general me= thod of measurment. The high level requirement appear to be that to correctly fi= nd the capacity, and that requires that one load to the point where buffers ar= e filled sufficiently to introduce extra delay or where AQM starts dropping o= r marking some of the load. Thus, I am questioning if the described algorithm= will adqueately solve that issue over a wider range of parameters.=20 So if you have more information to show at least which range it has been pr= oven to do its work and with what input parameters? I hope you understand that I expect this load control algorithm to get simularly scrutinized to congesti= on control algorithms that we standardize in IETF.=20 I would very much prefer to take out the load algorithm and place it in a seperate document where it can have a tighter scope description and more discussion about about that it does its job.=20 I hope this clarifies what my concerns are with this document in its curren= t form.=20 Cheers Magnus --=-ErrqRk71o7lHxe16vdkZ Content-Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIAGCSqGSIb3DQEHAqCAMIACAQExDzANBglghkgBZQMEAgEFADCABgkqhkiG9w0BBwEAAKCCErYw ggX0MIID3KADAgECAg8BdlE9InYZOYLl1zGep4IwDQYJKoZIhvcNAQELBQAwRzELMAkGA1UEBhMC U0UxETAPBgNVBAoMCEVyaWNzc29uMSUwIwYDVQQDDBxFcmljc3NvbiBOTCBJbmRpdmlkdWFsIENB IHYzMB4XDTIwMTIxMTA5NTg0OVoXDTIzMTIxMjA5NTg0OVowXjERMA8GA1UECgwIRXJpY3Nzb24x 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<0QP500J00OMQVH00@rn-mailsvcp-mmp-lapp03.rno.apple.com>; Fri, 26 Feb 2021 13:52:56 -0800 (PST) X-Va-A: X-Va-T-CD: 1b7e4f4dab179820cbb0a121fe2fe7dc X-Va-E-CD: 1e7dd13ecde7d090b3daf1b528e222b3 X-Va-R-CD: 400895f1e849f3520eb15e7550c5307d X-Va-CD: 0 X-Va-ID: abfb1d04-2400-462e-9132-304958738e8d X-V-A: X-V-T-CD: 1b7e4f4dab179820cbb0a121fe2fe7dc X-V-E-CD: 1e7dd13ecde7d090b3daf1b528e222b3 X-V-R-CD: 400895f1e849f3520eb15e7550c5307d X-V-CD: 0 X-V-ID: bfd987d1-0065-4ed7-8d66-f339de293649 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-26_09:2021-02-26, 2021-02-26 signatures=0 Received: from smtpclient.apple (unknown [17.234.119.38]) by rn-mailsvcp-mmp-lapp03.rno.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.1.0.7.20201203 64bit (built Dec 3 2020)) with ESMTPSA id <0QP5001FTOQZPY00@rn-mailsvcp-mmp-lapp03.rno.apple.com>; Fri, 26 Feb 2021 13:52:56 -0800 (PST) From: Tommy Pauly Message-id: Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_329459EA-7AE8-496D-A383-2AD1ABE82AFB" MIME-version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 14.0 \(3654.80.0.2.6\)) Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 13:52:56 -0800 In-reply-to: Cc: "IETF IPPM WG (ippm@ietf.org)" To: Greg Mirsky References: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3654.80.0.2.6) X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-26_09:2021-02-26, 2021-02-26 signatures=0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] IETF 110 Draft Agenda Posted X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 21:53:03 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_329459EA-7AE8-496D-A383-2AD1ABE82AFB Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hi Greg, I=E2=80=99ve removed STAMP YANG, and added the two other talks you=E2=80=99= ve requested. Updated agenda here: = https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-ippm-01 = Best, Tommy > On Feb 19, 2021, at 7:37 PM, Greg Mirsky = wrote: >=20 > Hi Tommy and Ian, > following comments we've received on draft-li-ippm-pm-on-lag, the = authors separated O/TWAMP and STAMP solutions. Also, the STAMP solution = is solely TLV-based without updating the STAMP base packet. We would = greatly appreciate an opportunity to present updates in one = presentation, preferably during the Friday session: >=20 > draft-li-ippm-otwamp-on-lag; draft-li-ippm-stamp-on-lag = Presenter: Greg Mirsky (tentatively) Time: 10 min. >=20 > Regards, > Greg >=20 > On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy Pauly = > wrote: > Hello IPPM, >=20 > I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110: >=20 > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-ippm-00 = >=20 > This time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session = on Monday will be focused on trying to close out some discussions and = make decisions for various IOAM documents. The second session on Friday = will focus on the other working group documents, proposed work, and = lightning talks. We do have additional lightning talk slots available, = so please email the chairs if you are interested. >=20 > Best, > Tommy & Ian > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm = --Apple-Mail=_329459EA-7AE8-496D-A383-2AD1ABE82AFB Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Hi = Greg,

I=E2=80=99ve = removed STAMP YANG, and added the two other talks you=E2=80=99ve = requested.

Updated agenda here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-i= ppm-01

Best,
Tommy


On Feb 19, 2021, at 7:37 PM, Greg Mirsky = <gregimirsky@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Tommy and Ian,
following comments we've = received on draft-li-ippm-pm-on-lag, the authors separated O/TWAMP and = STAMP solutions. Also, the STAMP solution is solely TLV-based without = updating the STAMP base packet. We would greatly appreciate an = opportunity to present updates in one presentation, preferably during = the Friday session:

draft-li-ippm-otwamp-on-lag; draft-li-ippm-stamp-on-lag&nb= sp;       Presenter: Greg Mirsky (tentatively)  =         Time: 10 min.

Regards,
Greg

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy = Pauly <tpauly=3D40apple.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
Hello IPPM,

I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft = agenda for IETF 110:

https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-i= ppm-00

This = time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session on = Monday will be focused on trying to close out some discussions and make = decisions for various IOAM documents. The second session on Friday will = focus on the other working group documents, proposed work, and lightning = talks. We do have additional lightning talk slots available, so please = email the chairs if you are interested.

Best,
Tommy & = Ian
_______________________________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm

= --Apple-Mail=_329459EA-7AE8-496D-A383-2AD1ABE82AFB-- From nobody Fri Feb 26 14:11:05 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DA063A0D52 for ; Fri, 26 Feb 2021 14:11:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id j8EFt9QOExV9 for ; Fri, 26 Feb 2021 14:11:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-lf1-x134.google.com (mail-lf1-x134.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::134]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DA4CD3A0D4E for ; Fri, 26 Feb 2021 14:11:01 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-lf1-x134.google.com with SMTP id p21so16028071lfu.11 for ; Fri, 26 Feb 2021 14:11:01 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=dSHP4VBqMNc7QAgjKaofnuJCXqVz2GvTTF9mTU1+ipI=; b=vQU+1kcIOflhXrpJo2Iem+b12J3NfrcVsCCUMvKaVqSkczr8PMgSJIDPfZNEihglja UbiSmuY4i6glGwd4BrDkSAFe85AfcvxEiQLjGZSfQ8njqtlV5xdXtrfGUJziKyG1mI0z N+DOU2gpaBJvtRbIW+ulglN0qmHX1mSNvGq5x64StTVYNuC5b1WdtsQSygq+md5IGsYi 5ek/DtT3BIKZJNh6DQYMl/6wgvq4d0rt5pzXKOGZI//7Rb7Yaws6E4uU+vuTMVWpKDTg r1WQ1hW8YwBMkptHzzEEJAH0LNrRM6ozrtnXL2kVRVdgyFCgPPKADv17zbfDbNBZlbKU lcpQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=dSHP4VBqMNc7QAgjKaofnuJCXqVz2GvTTF9mTU1+ipI=; b=cH1HoswW7JnV3MEJBNMdE37yCZohh8bBrxKylcenx5AzKGsGwPrlWnk2fQWIIYhYd/ DKeMMAr7vPon9HpB4R/i+Lm2mITK4UepyltOZ/Haac3E3nnMEH2acCG2lVtsFLWtua2a wYKEHSvj6jvg8Rrw54x+F707ygFdG4EvgTzU7BBKGcc/Xv50EOgEoJnfBtaCwOwZmZVI vtQPlJQvKbIr8emlCQnOVzZZSTNYzUFOZeNPkkckDtNidd4oFU+Ajd3KK6pNq5F3U8C9 +RHVcmjQoBkREdVKoHHEFD7C0kdAZexELJRJZxAmsRsA0LkNrPRz1/DECeBIpUvwfSR7 zKeg== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530X8oY+IthStd8B/Zh52geghY3sk5i8/bDQTH0pQq+qvevO3ZlG UXBuEpQA1A1hDrXdn/3RYvvqCMZgHn8vrjpriYF5zKwV6AM= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJw/xu5Rn3X69q6y4Dgyw4vLNcLDWZncpdHMXy0IW0hTfTbJDxWpWTIDMpRnrcK1gtsrOd5lW1tZnjm+GL7+8s4= X-Received: by 2002:ac2:5f56:: with SMTP id 22mr2944413lfz.35.1614377460151; Fri, 26 Feb 2021 14:11:00 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <5F5C0A34-DD09-4622-8828-6D3625703B06@apple.com> In-Reply-To: From: Greg Mirsky Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 14:10:48 -0800 Message-ID: To: Tommy Pauly Cc: "IETF IPPM WG (ippm@ietf.org)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0000000000000bb95005bc448bee" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] IETF 110 Draft Agenda Posted X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2021 22:11:04 -0000 --0000000000000bb95005bc448bee Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Tommy, many thanks. Regards, Greg On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 1:52 PM Tommy Pauly wrote: > Hi Greg, > > I=E2=80=99ve removed STAMP YANG, and added the two other talks you=E2=80= =99ve requested. > > Updated agenda here: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-ippm-01 > > Best, > Tommy > > > On Feb 19, 2021, at 7:37 PM, Greg Mirsky wrote: > > Hi Tommy and Ian, > following comments we've received on draft-li-ippm-pm-on-lag, the authors > separated O/TWAMP and STAMP solutions. Also, the STAMP solution is solely > TLV-based without updating the STAMP base packet. We would greatly > appreciate an opportunity to present updates in one presentation, > preferably during the Friday session: > > draft-li-ippm-otwamp-on-lag; draft-li-ippm-stamp-on-lag Presenter: > Greg Mirsky (tentatively) Time: 10 min. > > Regards, > Greg > > On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM Tommy Pauly 40apple.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote: > >> Hello IPPM, >> >> I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110: >> >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/110/materials/agenda-110-ippm-00 >> >> This time, we=E2=80=99ll have two separate sessions. The first session o= n Monday >> will be focused on trying to close out some discussions and make decisio= ns >> for various IOAM documents. The second session on Friday will focus on t= he >> other working group documents, proposed work, and lightning talks. We do >> have additional lightning talk slots available, so please email the chai= rs >> if you are interested. >> >> Best, >> Tommy & Ian >> _______________________________________________ >> ippm mailing list >> ippm@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm >> > > --0000000000000bb95005bc448bee Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi Tommy,
many thanks.

Regard= s,
Greg

On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 1:52 PM Tommy Pauly <tpauly@apple.com> wrote:
Hi Greg,

I=E2=80=99ve removed STAMP YANG,= and added the two other talks you=E2=80=99ve requested.

Best,
Tommy


On Feb 19, 2021, at 7:37 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com&g= t; wrote:

Hi Tommy and Ian,
following co= mments we've received on draft-li-ippm-pm-on-lag, the authors separated= O/TWAMP and STAMP solutions. Also, the STAMP solution is solely TLV-based = without updating the STAMP base packet. We would greatly appreciate an oppo= rtunity to present updates in one presentation, preferably during the Frida= y session:

draft-li-ippm-otwamp-on-lag;=C2=A0draft= -li-ippm-stamp-on-lag=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Presenter: Greg Mirsky (te= ntatively)=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Time: 10 min.
Regards,
Greg

On Fri, Feb 19, 2021 at 11:53 AM = Tommy Pauly <tpauly=3D40apple.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:
Hello IPPM,

I=E2=80=99ve just posted our draft agenda for IETF 110:


This time, we=E2=80= =99ll have two separate sessions. The first session on Monday will be focus= ed on trying to close out some discussions and make decisions for various I= OAM documents. The second session on Friday will focus on the other working= group documents, proposed work, and lightning talks. We do have additional= lightning talk slots available, so please email the chairs if you are inte= rested.

Best,
Tommy & Ian
_______________________________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm

--0000000000000bb95005bc448bee-- From nobody Sat Feb 27 10:54:20 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3219A3A1271; Sat, 27 Feb 2021 10:54:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 51m67Nt6WGju; Sat, 27 Feb 2021 10:54:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.149.140]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D9F3C3A1270; Sat, 27 Feb 2021 10:54:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from pps.filterd (m0049287.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0049287.ppops.net-00191d01. 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"ippm-chairs@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Magnus Westerlund's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with DISCUSS) Thread-Index: AQHXC4EzqJ5daDOk8keYoMTRANvS6qpo9txggAGffICAACldMA== Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2021 18:54:07 +0000 Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A0FE3@njmtexg5.research.att.com> References: <161426272345.2083.7668347127672505809@ietfa.amsl.com> <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A0C0E@njmtexg5.research.att.com> <66f367953ae838c8ba7505c60e51367843117787.camel@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: <66f367953ae838c8ba7505c60e51367843117787.camel@ericsson.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [24.148.42.167] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-27_13:2021-02-26, 2021-02-27 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: 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([fe80::8c6b:4b77:618f:9a01%11]) with mapi id 14.03.0468.000; Sat, 27 Feb 2021 15:19:44 -0500 From: "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" To: Benjamin Kaduk CC: The IESG , "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org" , "ippm-chairs@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" , Ian Swett , "tpauly@apple.com" Thread-Topic: Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHXCubpIAgrxqGmcU+aUTtf1usNw6pnzooAgAHzjYCAAqh1sA== Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2021 20:19:43 +0000 Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A103F@njmtexg5.research.att.com> References: <161419645471.18083.16706266293896961774@ietfa.amsl.com> <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A0549@njmtexg5.research.att.com> <20210225220325.GX21@kduck.mit.edu> In-Reply-To: <20210225220325.GX21@kduck.mit.edu> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [24.148.42.167] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-27_13:2021-02-26, 2021-02-27 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 mlxscore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 suspectscore=0 priorityscore=1501 malwarescore=0 clxscore=1015 spamscore=0 impostorscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 adultscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2102270172 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2021 20:20:03 -0000 Hi Ben, Thanks for your reply. I deleted some early agreements below, and added very few more replies. Please see [acm] with no indents... > -----Original Message----- > From: Benjamin Kaduk [mailto:kaduk@mit.edu] > Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2021 5:03 PM > To: MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) > Cc: The IESG ; draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric- > method@ietf.org; ippm-chairs@ietf.org; ippm@ietf.org; Ian Swett > ; tpauly@apple.com > Subject: Re: Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity- > metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) >=20 > Hi Al, >=20 > Also inline... >=20 > On Thu, Feb 25, 2021 at 03:08:29AM +0000, MORTON, ALFRED C (AL) wrote: > > Hi Ben, > > > > Thanks for your detailed review; it will be a better draft when we're > done, as always! > > > > All the changes identified below are implemented in my working version. > > > > Please see replies below, [acm] > > Al > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker [mailto:noreply@ietf.org] > > > Sent: Wednesday, February 24, 2021 2:54 PM > > > To: The IESG > > > Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org; ippm- > chairs@ietf.org; > > > ippm@ietf.org; Ian Swett ; tpauly@apple.com; > > > tpauly@apple.com > > > Subject: Benjamin Kaduk's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity- > metric- > > > method-06: (with COMMENT) > > > > > > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for > > > draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: No Objection > > > > > ... > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------= - > > > COMMENT: > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------= - ... > > > Section 8.1 > > > > > > At the beginning of a test, the sender begins sending at rate R1 > and > > > the receiver starts a feedback timer at interval F (while awaiting > > > > > > It's a little hard to search for, but I didn't find any previous > mention > > > of 'F' or it being defined as a parameter or term. Should it be a > > > listed parameter somewhere? > > [acm] > > We define a lot of variables in this section, with limited scope of use= . > > F is one of them, but I found that we had already defined F in Section > 4! > > So... F becomes FT, and like R1 and ss and cc, gets no special treatmen= t > > beyond a definition in the text (IF you're ok with that). >=20 > That should be fine. [acm]=20 Since this came-up again with Magnus, I made FT a parameter in section 4. >=20 > > > > > > If the feedback indicates that sequence number anomalies were > > > detected OR the delay range was above the upper threshold, the > > > offered load rate is decreased. Also, if congestion is now > confirmed > > > by the current feedback message being processed, then the offered > > > load rate is decreased by more than one rate (e.g., Rx-30). [...] > > > > > > Does "congestion is now confirmed" mean that "congestion confirmed" i= s > > > like a one-way latch and this transition only occurs at most once ove= r > > > the course of a test? Or could the Rx-30 happen multiple times? > > > (The pseudocode indicates the former.) > > [acm] > > Yes, we are trying to describe the pseudocode, and "congestion > confirmed" > > latches when the slowAdjCount equals the slowAdjThresh (and after that, > > slowAdjCount continues upward, the slowAdjCount < slowAdjThresh > condition > > fails and slowAdjCount is never reset to zero). > > > > So, I think we want to say: > > OLD > > Also, if congestion is now confirmed by the current feedback message... > > NEW > > Also, if congestion is now confirmed for the first time by the > > current feedback message... >=20 > +1 >=20 > > > > > > If the feedback indicates that there were no sequence number > > > anomalies AND the delay range was above the lower threshold, but > > > below the upper threshold, the offered load rate is not changed. > > > > > > The way this is written suggests that there will always be a lower an= d > > > an upper threshold for delay, but the rest of the document so far did= n't > > > give me that impression. E.g., we talk about PM only as "at least on= e > > > fundamental metric and target performance threshold MUST be supplied"= , > > > and to me having both upper and lower thresholds would be two > > > thresholds, not one. > > [acm] > > That's true, we tried not to force our current/best algorithm into the > > metric definition. We require some measurement to use for feedback > > in rate adjustment, otherwise you just have iPerf or other fixed rate > > tools that can only blast packets. > > > > You can build an "ok" feedback system with just one metric and one thre= shold, > > but there are drawbacks and it may take longer duration tests to measur= e > > the true maximum capacity due to a technical limitation. > > So, we gave a really good algorithm, in 8.1, in pseudocode, and even > > in running code >=20 > That all makes sense to me. I'm not sure if there's a good way to shoeho= rn > some of that insight into the text of the document itself, but it also > doesn't seem like something that's critical to do. [acm]=20 Thanks. >=20 > > > > > > > > Section 8.2 > > > > > > Here, as with any Active Capacity test, the test duration must be > > > kept short. 10 second tests for each direction of transmission are > > > common today. The default measurement interval specified here is = I > =3D > > > 10 seconds). In combination with a fast search method and user- > > > network coordination, the concerns raised in RFC 6815[RFC6815] are > > > alleviated. [...] > > > > > > I skimmed RFC 6815 and had a bit of a hard time making the connection > > > for why combining a 10-second interval, fast search method, and > > > user-network coordination alleviate the concerns of RFC 6815. There > > > doesn't seem to be much in 6815 itself about how testing in productio= n > > > can be done safely, > > [acm] > > That's certainly true, but we did say: > > > > The world will not spin off axis while waiting for appropriate and > > standardized methods to emerge from the consensus process. > > > > > so my current working assumption is that the > > > conclusion presented here reflects the results of "new work" being > > > recorded for the first time (in the RFC series) in this document. > > [acm] > > > > When you put it that way, yes. Although it is a different metric from > > RFC2544 Throughput, the load adjustment search algorithm alone helps > > to make this method safer to use than any fixed-rate UDP packet blaster= , > > or even a binary search-controlled measurement because of near real-tim= e > > feedback. > > > > The other reasons why this work is different are that > > RFC 2544 Throughput measurements intend to overload the isolated test > > environment for extended periods of time: > > > > 24. Trial duration (from > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2544*section-2= 4__;Iw!!BhdT!zEoCgaLen-TJZODnn94eTalwD4PeqYAT9DJPq4WKsUdT8dlW3SvLdotESTp-B0= s$ ) > > > > The aim of these tests is to determine the rate continuously > > supportable by the DUT. The actual duration of the test trials must > > be a compromise between this aim and the duration of the benchmarkin= g > > test suite. The duration of the test portion of each trial SHOULD b= e > > at least 60 seconds. ... > > > > Many automated RFC2544 test devices start a test at the highest load, > and > > search their way down to the zero-loss Throughput, subjecting the > > device under test to potentially extreme overload multiple times before > > reaching the test outcome > > > > > If that assumption is correct, I'd suggest spending some more words t= o > > > support the conclusion, e.g., making analogies to other "normal" > traffic > > > patterns and how the benchmarking setup is not qualitatively differen= t > > > from them. > > [acm] > > > > OK, I put some more background together and made the case stronger: > > the memo we wrote hear is exactly what the RFC6815 authors were asking > for. > > > > The Max IP Capacity metric and method for assessing is very different > from classic RFC2544 > > Throughput metric and methods : it uses near-real-time load adjustments > that are sensitive to loss and delay, similar to other congestion control > algorithms used on the Internet every day, along with limited duration. O= n > the other hand, RFC2544 Throughput measurements can produce sustained > overload conditions for extended periods of time. Individual trials in a > test governed by a binary search can last 60 seconds for each step, and > the final confirmation trial may be even longer. This is very different > from "normal" traffic levels, but overload conditions are not a concern i= n > the isolated test environment. The concerns raised in RFC6815 were that > RFC2544 methods would be let loose on production networks, and instead th= e > authors challenged the standards community to develop metrics and methods > like those described in this memo. >=20 > Thanks; that is what I was asking for. [acm]=20 Great! > I think this is related to Magnus's Discuss point, though, and I cannot > speak for whether it will make him happy as well... [acm]=20 Of course. It's part of the topic: testing production networks safely. We've been running versions of this method on the Internet for years, as the references and IPPM's literature clearly show. >=20 > > > > > > > > Section 8.3 > > > > > > As testing continues, implementers should expect some evolution in > > > the methods. The ITU-T has published a Supplement (60) to the > > > Y-series of Recommendations, "Interpreting ITU-T Y.1540 maximum IP= - > > > layer capacity measurements", [Y.Sup60], which is the result of > > > continued testing with the metric and method described here. > > > > > > I pulled up the [Y.Sup60] reference, and it does not seem to referenc= e > > > this draft by name. On what basis do we conclude that it "is the res= ult > > > of continued testing with the metric and method described here"? > > > Skimming/searching, I do see many similar formulae and methods > > > presented, but how do we conclude they are precisely the same? > > [acm] > > I'll soften that a bit. The Max IP-Layer Capacity metric is > > the same, but it is likely that a few details in the method have diverg= ed > > over time -- much of the ITU-T testing and spec development came first. > > > > NEW > > ... [Y.Sup60], which is the result of continued testing with the metric= , > > and those results have improved the method described here. >=20 > Thanks. My primary concern here was that it seemed like we were making > statements about what some other SDO did, and typically it's good to have > sign-off from the other SDO before doing that. The NEW option doesn't se= em > to have that issue, so it should be good. [acm]=20 Nice, thanks. >=20 > > > > > > > > > > Section 10 > > > > > > Should we say something about making sure that I is reasonably > bounded? > > > IIRC we say so elsewhere in the text but not exactly here. > > [acm] > > I added a direct reference to I at the end of item 6.: > > > > ... Testing with the Service Provider's measurement hosts SHOULD be > limited in frequency and/or overall volume of test traffic (for example, > the range of I duration values SHOULD be limited). > > > > > > 2. A REQUIRED user client-initiated setup handshake between > > > cooperating hosts and allows firewalls to control inbound > > > unsolicited UDP which either go to a control port [expected an= d > > > w/authentication] or to ephemeral ports that are only created > as > > > needed. [...] > > > > > > nit: the grammar is odd in the first part of this sentence; the part > > > before the "and" doesn't seem like it can join up with anything after > > > the "and". Is the intent something like "It is REQUIRED to have a us= er > > > client-initiated setup handshake between cooperating hosts that allow= s > > > firewalls to [...]"? > > [acm] > > Thanks, good re-wording, it's in. > > > > > > > > 3. Integrity protection for feedback messages conveying measureme= nts > > > is RECOMMENDED. > > > > > > (In some sense you want authentication as well as integrity protectio= n.) > > [acm] > > Yes. The running code has optional authentication now. > > > > NEW > > 3. Client-server authentication and integrity protection for feedback > > messages conveying measurements is RECOMMENDED. > > > > > > > > 5. Senders MUST be rate-limited. This can be accomplished using = the > > > pre-built table defining all the offered load rates that will = be > > > supported (Section 8.1). The recommended load-control search > > > algorithm results in "ramp up" from the lowest rate in the tab= le. > > > > > > nit: since (effectively) each implementation will have their own > > > pre-built table, I think it should be "using a pre-built table". > > [acm] > > OK, "a" it is. > > > > > > > > > > Appendix 13 > > > > > > If we start at Rx (row) 1, is it going to cause problems when we drop > > > down to Rx =3D 0 in the loss/congestion cases? > > [acm] > > It would, but the current table includes a Row zero, which is where we > > cold-start. I guess it would less confusing to say: > > > > Rx =3D 0 # The current sending rate (equivalent to a row of the table) >=20 > Yes, I think so. >=20 > > > > > > > > The mechcanism in the pseudocode to stop taking large increments in > > > sending rate above the "hSpeedThresh" does not seem to be described i= n > > > the prose in =A78.1. (That said, it seems like a good idea, given th= e > > > likely table composition.) [acm]=20 We fixed this in a separate exchange, after you discovered my mis-read. Thanks! > > [acm] > > It's getting late here now, but I think it's in the first two If > statements: > > > > if ( seqErr =3D=3D 0 && delay < lowThresh ) { #= no > loss or delay problems, and > > if ( Rx < hSpeedTresh && slowAdjCount < slowAdjThresh ) { # Rat= e > < hSpeedThresh && etc. > > Rx +=3D highSpeedDelta; # c= an > still use large increments > > slowAdjCount =3D 0; > > } else { # > otherwise (Rate >=3D hSpeedThresh) > > if ( Rx < maxLoadRates - 1 ) # > after checking headroom, > > Rx++; # can > only increase by one >=20 > I followed up on this out-of-band -- I agree that the pseudocode is good, > and was wondering that the prose in Section 8.1 was divergent from the > pseudocode. Your proposal for new prose text looks good: >=20 > % However, if a rate threshold between high and very high sending > % rates (such as 1Gbps) is exceeded, the offered load rate is only > % increased by one (Rx+1) above the rate threshold in any congestion > state. >=20 > > > > > > > > (Also, indenting one tab for the outer conditionals and two more for = the > > > inner ones looks a bit unusual.) > > [acm] > > I like unusual :-) > > > > > > > > Section 14 > > > > > > It's not entirely clear to me why RFC 2330 is classified as normative > > > but RFC 7312 is informative, just based on the locations where they a= re > > > referenced. > > [acm] > > It's more than that. RFC 7312 describes some unusual access conditions > that might be encountered and is only cited at the end of the Intro, once= . > Certainly the measured evidence of bimodal (turbo-mode) access behavior i= s > in the category of RFC 7312 "messy stuff", but we still manage that prett= y > well and it's not specifically mentioned in 7312. > > > > OTOH, RFC 2330 is the IPPM Framework, with an exception to be > Informative status, yet Normative in our memos, and much is owed to 2330, > starting with the singleton, sample, statistic metric development, > unmentioned stuff about clocks and accuracy, etc. > > >=20 > Understood. >=20 > Thanks for all the updates and explanations! >=20 > -Ben [acm]=20 You're welcome. Thanks for a very productive exchange! 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"tpauly@apple.com" Thread-Topic: Murray Kucherawy's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHXC4nxBVc8bVjRIEG0L+qbBEEkzapsdkBQ Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2021 21:27:42 +0000 Message-ID: <4D7F4AD313D3FC43A053B309F97543CF01476A1087@njmtexg5.research.att.com> References: <161426647584.14166.5269938969946072865@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <161426647584.14166.5269938969946072865@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [24.148.42.167] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.369, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-02-27_16:2021-02-26, 2021-02-27 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 phishscore=0 clxscore=1011 priorityscore=1501 adultscore=0 mlxlogscore=999 malwarescore=0 bulkscore=0 impostorscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 suspectscore=0 mlxscore=0 spamscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2009150000 definitions=main-2102270182 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Murray Kucherawy's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-06: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2021 21:27:42 -0000 PiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBNdXJyYXkgS3VjaGVyYXd5IHZp YSBEYXRhdHJhY2tlciBbbWFpbHRvOm5vcmVwbHlAaWV0Zi5vcmddDQo+IFNlbnQ6IFRodXJzZGF5 LCBGZWJydWFyeSAyNSwgMjAyMSAxMDoyMSBBTQ0KPiBUbzogVGhlIElFU0cgPGllc2dAaWV0Zi5v cmc+DQo+IENjOiBkcmFmdC1pZXRmLWlwcG0tY2FwYWNpdHktbWV0cmljLW1ldGhvZEBpZXRmLm9y ZzsgaXBwbS1jaGFpcnNAaWV0Zi5vcmc7DQo+IGlwcG1AaWV0Zi5vcmc7IElhbiBTd2V0dCA8aWFu c3dldHRAZ29vZ2xlLmNvbT47IHRwYXVseUBhcHBsZS5jb20NCj4gU3ViamVjdDogTXVycmF5IEt1 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