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Statement Management Tool To: "Al Morton" Cc: IP Performance Measurement Discussion List , Ian Swett , Martin Duke , Scott Mansfield , Tommy Pauly , Zaheduzzaman Sarker , itu-t-liaison@iab.org, liaison-coordination@iab.org, tsbsg11@itu.int X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.30.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <162160908976.25056.7419404981644606144@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 21 May 2021 07:58:10 -0700 Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 01 Jun 2021 08:48:23 -0700 Subject: [ippm] New Liaison Statement, "Reply to ITU-T SG12 LS - Harmonization of IP Capacity and Latency" X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 21 May 2021 14:58:11 -0000 Title: Reply to ITU-T SG12 LS - Harmonization of IP Capacity and Latency Submission Date: 2021-05-21 URL of the IETF Web page: https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1742/ From: Tommy Pauly To: Al Morton Cc: Scott Mansfield ,Zaheduzzaman Sarker ,itu-t-liaison@iab.org ,IP Performance Measurement Discussion List ,Tommy Pauly ,Martin Duke ,Ian Swett , Response Contacts: Tommy Pauly , Ian Swett Technical Contacts: Purpose: In response Referenced liaison: LS on harmonization of IP Capacity and Latency Parameters: Consent of Draft Rec. Y.1540 on IP packet transfer performance parameters and New Annex A with Lab & Field Evaluation Plans (https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1645/) Body: The IPPM Working Group in IETF thanks ITU-T SG12 for their liaison describing progress on the Maximum IP-layer Capacity metric and methods in revised Rec. Y.1540. The development of a coordinated specification has proceeded successfully in IETF, with the benefit of the review by new experts contributing at the working group and IESG level. The many lab and field test results you shared have been a great asset, so we made references to your results, as well as the testing conducted during Hackathons at recent IETF meetings. The latest draft is available [0], which we expect to be approved shortly. The next step appears to be development/enhancement of a test protocol to support the measurement method with its feeback measurements and dynamic sender rate control. The IPPM Working Group continues to seek participation by all interested parties, and will keep you informed of our progress on the topic of the Maximum IP-layer Capacity metric and methods. Regards, IPPM Chairs Tommy Pauly (tpauly@apple.com) Ian Swett (ianswett@google.com) [0] https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-10 Attachments: No document has been attached From nobody Tue Jun 1 09:06:32 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44EF03A1D6C for ; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 09:06:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=yahoo.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HciODFGwnVVX for ; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 09:06:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from sonic302-27.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com (sonic302-27.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com [66.163.186.153]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 75DC33A1D69 for ; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 09:06:25 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1622563584; bh=aXRxGX14ivkQCDNeXm1RKlBOQoNLe6zNNIzCiMD1ZpI=; h=Date:From:To:Cc:In-Reply-To:References:Subject:From:Subject:Reply-To; b=qmfL8tdhEo+f4ZDyS24AAuWfipwb5y/tRXreL9n3kq0g7Do9R4MC4mqE93uSBsEvRj+5TYzoJN1teTMwkKgp42sywjTqeeHjr8YybMbw20gQFmGNA2C3F7Mw6+baeN5LxID1yDaOqfB0Wdh+2+Qkk39HkWk5y/khMepsQE3yd3oZsH4ZYZRI8Nxi7AggaSTWAJxNk36xSd557rqNQn3rNUMP4Y6WXAWr6KCIu1TsfY87oz3z5kc/CnF8qjycbPsunZmgTIiul5TnVvGsnDjYYZ3zWXVDElTQOYVzhCgaofI1FjWAM6YtcHEJXX0Of/lbrwTiiOBmqL8UdTJL4c02oA== X-SONIC-DKIM-SIGN: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yahoo.com; s=s2048; t=1622563584; bh=Z+zp4fsLMSe+fHizrKO9kj68so6yId8aUoc9j6Y7j2j=; h=X-Sonic-MF:Date:From:To:Subject:From:Subject; b=BkGlcV3O7tfF267mpJE3RPmMiCP1R7pjtp7eZQA8jaHwSJ1KUfv4+bvwEkVRV9SeKqfmEUSutnbgR2zSm0Ybb2nJd6aFuSK1TEPINLa5hkV4K3KSnW0SFL57I+ADfajiGv9FR2PqXadynsnCFlAif//Uzkx9nenK67FYRhjZAuYDgxFXE+UPHG2K+/Rs+NAsYlI8LyeBQuQCvCRnRMguhQa+VvF+98KAk3A3ttEchDLg2cMFEsOL8fPYnhhcwjYOQ2FGZSWrGaHRESuNYu2u/egmEYQfO6tEISr5KUdYJ1KGQCp99u7DyNdZVdRowtYKuN/cDk0IvScsL6XfP8k7TQ== X-YMail-OSG: 9r6Fyf4VM1kBoUrWLHHXPWhDK5uyKCBXBF4fyDuZqSjszAtAXveFiS35UXTF_gq z7dhQubvWtS0B.YIDrFoYBeBaqM1ZNdRqVxvxwsP9Ec6.VKKyKO_dG_dVG7aRqNVD.hKDOS97KaS 3TIr6CqRSOpdeb3IckrJ5mFTnDxCkFRWjDKnccvx5zX0XnCA7bvN0if0PwyXazV8YJ83PkB8siI8 jTuJ.mrY51u2J6pMm4fPEqq3kEK5LXxDTI46Cs2pVcF8rigXf5UwwNTPrq4MMgqkOy.lx13js0Q1 iBydichHQ6mnRsnhH31hiREzZaaVB6LPNGZWUFLnQWxTG63L8Z_tAm0AmCxkFPCh_wHcuN73wXuD ckOB1ldflnoc5SvmuBDpX50SiT58SZ63sgadl8vMkng32kWrB_PEh_vrVYuGBFjput7c7VxbJDQJ ydqs3YUZQDp.5ACzcNT17HmhLBI17JtrjGQ64xPHT9Jxzsw6nuDeSA66UDSl3t899cSwmDKN3Ng. 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We have just posted a new draft to encrypt PDM data.=C2=A0 =C2=A0We feel th= at this is an important feature to add before promoting widespread adoption= of PDM. We would appreciate any thoughts or comments from the group. Thanks, Nalini Elkins CEO and Founder Inside Products, Inc. www.insidethestack.com (831) 659-8360=20 ----- Forwarded Message ----- From: "internet-drafts@ietf.org" To: mackermann@bcbsm.com ; Adnan Ras= hid ; Ameya Deshpande ; Michael = Ackermann ; Nalini Elkins ; Tommaso Pecorella Sent: Tuesday, June = 1, 2021, 12:01:47 PM EDTSubject: New Version Notification for draft-elkins-= ippm-encrypted-pdmv2-00.txt =20 A new version of I-D, draft-elkins-ippm-encrypted-pdmv2-00.txt has been successfully submitted by Nalini Elkins and posted to the IETF repository. Name:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 draft-elkins-ippm-encrypted-pdmv= 2 Revision:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 00 Title:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Encrypted IPv6 Performance and = Diagnostic Metrics Version 2 (EPDMv2) Destination Option Document date:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2021-06-01 Group:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Individual Submission Pages:=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 16 URL:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.ietf.org/archive/= id/draft-elkins-ippm-encrypted-pdmv2-00.txt Status:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-e= lkins-ippm-encrypted-pdmv2/ Htmlized:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-e= lkins-ippm-encrypted-pdmv2 Abstract: =C2=A0 RFC8250 describes an optional Destination Option (DO) header embedde= d =C2=A0 in each packet to provide sequence numbers and timing information as =C2=A0 a basis for measurements.=C2=A0 As this data is sent in clear- text,= this =C2=A0 may create an opportunity for malicious actors to get information fo= r =C2=A0 subsequent attacks.=C2=A0 This document defines PDMv2 which has a =C2=A0 lightweight handshake (registration procedure) and encryption to =C2=A0 secure this data.=C2=A0 Additional performance metrics which may be = of use =C2=A0 are also defined. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 = =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0=20 The IETF Secretariat =20 ------=_Part_2341924_981757150.1622563579713 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hello IPPMers!

We have just posted a new draft to encrypt PDM data.   We fe= el that this is an important feature to add before promoting widespread ado= ption of PDM.

We would appreciate any thoughts or comment= s from the group.

T= hanks,

Nalini Elkins
CEO and Founder
Inside Products, Inc.
= www.insidethestack.com
(831) 659-8360


=20
----- Forwarded Message -----
From: "internet-drafts@ietf.org" <internet-d= rafts@ietf.org>
To: mackermann@bcbsm.com <mackermann= @bcbsm.com>; Adnan Rashid <adnan.rashid@unifi.it>; Ameya Deshpande= <ameyanrd@gmail.com>; Michael Ackermann <mackermann@bcbsm.com>= ; Nalini Elkins <nalini.elkins@insidethestack.com>; Tommaso Pecorella= <tommaso.pecorella@unifi.it>
Sent: Tuesday, June 1,= 2021, 12:01:47 PM EDT
Subject: New Version Notification f= or draft-elkins-ippm-encrypted-pdmv2-00.txt


A new vers= ion of I-D, draft-elkins-ippm-encrypted-pdmv2-00.txt
has been successfully submitted by Nalini Elkins and posted to the
<= /div>
IETF repository.

=
Name:        draft-elkins-ip= pm-encrypted-pdmv2
Revision:    00=
Title:        Encr= ypted IPv6 Performance and Diagnostic Metrics Version 2 (EPDMv2) Destinatio= n Option
Document date:    2021-06= -01
Group:        I= ndividual Submission
Pages:    &nb= sp;   16
Status:        https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-elkins-ippm-encrypted= -pdmv2/

=

Abstract:
  RFC8250 describes an optional Destination Option (DO) header e= mbedded
  in each packet to provide sequenc= e numbers and timing information as
  a bas= is for measurements.  As this data is sent in clear- text, this
  may create an opportunity for malicious actors = to get information for
  subsequent attacks= .  This document defines PDMv2 which has a
&= nbsp; lightweight handshake (registration procedure) and encryption to
=
  secure this data.  Additional performan= ce metrics which may be of use
  are also d= efined.

    =                      = ;                     &nb= sp;                     &= nbsp;            
=

The IETF Secretariat<= br>


------=_Part_2341924_981757150.1622563579713-- From nobody Tue Jun 1 15:14:50 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C3213A296A; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 15:14:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.30.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <162258568855.4591.2970000059853424661@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 01 Jun 2021 15:14:48 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Jun 2021 22:14:49 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Metrics and Methods for One-way IP Capacity Authors : Al Morton Ruediger Geib Len Ciavattone Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11.txt Pages : 38 Date : 2021-06-01 Abstract: This memo revisits the problem of Network Capacity metrics first examined in RFC 5136. The memo specifies a more practical Maximum IP-Layer Capacity metric definition catering for measurement purposes, and outlines the corresponding methods of measurement. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Jun 1 15:17:23 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F403E3A299D; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 15:17:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K3XEBJNZmkf3; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 15:17:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0b-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.157.136]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8253D3A2997; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 15:17:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pps.filterd (m0083689.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0083689.ppops.net-00191d01. (8.16.0.43/8.16.0.43) with SMTP id 151MEst7048372; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 18:17:00 -0400 Received: from alpi154.enaf.aldc.att.com (sbcsmtp6.sbc.com [144.160.229.23]) by m0083689.ppops.net-00191d01. with ESMTP id 38wp42tmsr-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Tue, 01 Jun 2021 18:17:00 -0400 Received: from enaf.aldc.att.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by alpi154.enaf.aldc.att.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 151MGw29007019; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 18:16:59 -0400 Received: from zlp30486.vci.att.com (zlp30486.vci.att.com [135.47.91.177]) by alpi154.enaf.aldc.att.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 151MGrLg006908 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Tue, 1 Jun 2021 18:16:53 -0400 Received: from zlp30486.vci.att.com (zlp30486.vci.att.com [127.0.0.1]) by zlp30486.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id 7A8FF4005C1C; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 22:16:53 +0000 (GMT) Received: from GAALPA1MSGEX1DE.ITServices.sbc.com (unknown [135.50.89.118]) by zlp30486.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id 34A814005C1B; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 22:16:53 +0000 (GMT) Received: from GAALPA1MSGEX1DB.ITServices.sbc.com (135.50.89.115) by GAALPA1MSGEX1DE.ITServices.sbc.com (135.50.89.118) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2242.10; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 18:16:47 -0400 Received: from GAALPA1MSGEX1DB.ITServices.sbc.com ([135.50.89.115]) by GAALPA1MSGEX1DB.ITServices.sbc.com ([135.50.89.115]) with mapi id 15.01.2242.010; Tue, 1 Jun 2021 18:16:40 -0400 From: "MORTON JR., AL" To: Zaheduzzaman Sarker , The IESG CC: "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org" , "ippm-chairs@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" , Ian Swett , "tpauly@apple.com" Thread-Topic: Zaheduzzaman Sarker's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-10: (with COMMENT) Thread-Index: AQHXU8E5DrkdX1i0cUCjU6i/7U6Trar7EAXQgARVDICAAFObEA== Date: Tue, 1 Jun 2021 22:16:40 +0000 Message-ID: <159f996f90b447f78011928f36306ecc@att.com> References: <162220671966.6728.1925413023818681484@ietfa.amsl.com> <5a07cf8b71d44b8cb54dcccd84592bbb@att.com> <8B99D07A-FFF1-4BE6-AB3D-21CADCD18D3C@ericsson.com> In-Reply-To: <8B99D07A-FFF1-4BE6-AB3D-21CADCD18D3C@ericsson.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [130.10.164.242] x-tm-snts-smtp: 20A2C4180BE98AC3F6B748D0F4762BF376D320C39B4CB84342F3C6D1C90896FC2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: SyFu-0VVt0IMOxDzgwPeFJDB1lM8illX X-Proofpoint-GUID: SyFu-0VVt0IMOxDzgwPeFJDB1lM8illX X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.391, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-06-01_12:2021-06-01, 2021-06-01 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 spamscore=0 adultscore=0 impostorscore=0 bulkscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 priorityscore=1501 phishscore=0 clxscore=1015 mlxscore=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 mlxlogscore=999 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2104190000 definitions=main-2106010148 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Zaheduzzaman Sarker's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-10: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 Jun 2021 22:17:22 -0000 SGkgWmFoZWQsIA0KDQpQbGVhc2Ugc2VlIFthY21dIHJlcGxpZXMgYmVsb3cuDQoNCkkgdGhpbmsg d2UgaGF2ZSByZWFjaGVkIHJlc29sdXRpb24gb2YgYWxsIHlvdXIgY29tbWVudHMgd2l0aCB0aGUg YWRkZWQgcmVxdWlyZW1lbnQgb24gY29uY3VycmVudCB0ZXN0cywNCnNvIEknbSBnb2luZyB0byBz dWJtaXQgdmVyc2lvbiAxMSBub3cuDQoNCkFsDQoNCj4gLS0tLS1PcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlLS0t LS0NCj4gRnJvbTogWmFoZWR1enphbWFuIFNhcmtlciA8emFoZWR1enphbWFuLnNhcmtlckBlcmlj c3Nvbi5jb20+DQo+IFNlbnQ6IFR1ZXNkYXksIEp1bmUgMSwgMjAyMSA4OjUxIEFNDQo+IFRvOiBN 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ZWZlcmVuY2UgbXVjaCBlYXJsaWVyIHRoYW4gdGhhdCE8YnI+DQomZ3Q7IDxicj4NCiZndDsgUmln aHQhIFRoYXQgaXMgcGVyaGFwcyBmaW5lLjxicj4NCiZndDsgPGJyPg0KJmd0OyZuYnNwOyZuYnNw OyZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyBDaGFuZ2VzIGFib3ZlIGhhdmUgYmVlbiBpbXBsZW1lbnRlZCBpbiB0aGUg d29ya2luZyB0ZXh0IGZvciB2ZXJzaW9uIDExLjxicj4NCiZndDsgPGJyPg0KJmd0OyZuYnNwOyZu YnNwOyZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyAmZ3Q7PGJyPg0KJmd0OyZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyAm Z3Q7PGJyPg0KJmd0OyA8YnI+DQo8YnI+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvc3Bhbj48L2ZvbnQ+PC9kaXY+DQo8 L2Rpdj4NCjwvYm9keT4NCjwvaHRtbD4NCg== --_000_HE1PR07MB4187847790A7875BA3F53ABA9F3D9HE1PR07MB4187eurp_-- From nobody Wed Jun 2 11:58:45 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A944A3A1704; Wed, 2 Jun 2021 11:58:38 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Warren Kumari via Datatracker To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, Ian Swett , tpauly@apple.com, tpauly@apple.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.30.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Warren Kumari Message-ID: <162266031819.1253.3100893247232510315@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2021 11:58:38 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Warren Kumari's Yes on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11: (with COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 02 Jun 2021 18:58:39 -0000 Warren Kumari has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11: Yes When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- I've changed my position from NoObj to Yes. I realize that this doesn't change anything at all, but I wanted to signal that I appreciate the time/process wonkery to address the downref. I'm stealing Robert's ballot text, because it perfectly explains my position/views: "Thank you for this document, I found it interesting to read. I have no comments that haven't already been raised by other AD reviews." From nobody Thu Jun 3 04:39:22 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D555D3A07A2; Thu, 3 Jun 2021 04:39:15 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: =?utf-8?q?=C3=89ric_Vyncke_via_Datatracker?= To: "The IESG" Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, Ian Swett , tpauly@apple.com, tpauly@apple.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.30.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: =?utf-8?q?=C3=89ric_Vyncke?= Message-ID: <162272035584.18166.1892710574472210395@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2021 04:39:15 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] =?utf-8?q?=C3=89ric_Vyncke=27s_No_Objection_on_draft-ietf?= =?utf-8?q?-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11=3A_=28with_COMMENT=29?= X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2021 11:39:17 -0000 Éric Vyncke has entered the following ballot position for draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11: No Objection When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this introductory paragraph, however.) Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html for more information about DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ ---------------------------------------------------------------------- COMMENT: ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Thank you for the work put into this document. Please find below some non-blocking COMMENT points (but replies would be appreciated). I hope that this helps to improve the document, Regards, -éric == COMMENTS == Generic comment about the 1 Mbps granularity, this may of course be well suited for many connection but not really for constrained networks where the measurement techniques of this I-D could be applied. Should the payload content random content to avoid some compression techniques on the path ? -- Section 4 -- s/the address of a host/one of the IP addresses of a host/ Should there be a SHOULD rather than a MAY in "The IPv6 flow label MAY be included" ? -- Section 5.3 -- " o n0 is the total number of IP-Layer header and payload bits that can be transmitted in standard-formed packets [RFC8468] from the Src host and correctly received by the Dst host during one contiguous sub-interval, dt in length, during the interval [T, T+I]," If we want to split hairs, in the case of IP fragmentation or NAT64, the received bits will be different than the one sent ;-) I had no time to read RFC 8468 (day job...), but, does the above remark fall in the same category as "Some compression affects on measurement are discussed in Section 6 of [RFC8468]." -- Section 8.3 -- " The number of concurrent, independent tests between the same Source and Destination SHALL be limited to one." Is it between hosts or between network? I.e.n "same source and destination networks?" -- Section 8.4 -- "supports IPv4 and IPv6 address families." does it support a NAT64 function on the path ? From nobody Thu Jun 3 22:01:31 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 902AB3A28CB; Thu, 3 Jun 2021 22:01:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.896 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WkqqoubzWuwU; Thu, 3 Jun 2021 22:01:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx0a-00191d01.pphosted.com (mx0b-00191d01.pphosted.com [67.231.157.136]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 190603A28CA; Thu, 3 Jun 2021 22:01:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from pps.filterd (m0049463.ppops.net [127.0.0.1]) by m0049463.ppops.net-00191d01. (8.16.0.43/8.16.0.43) with SMTP id 1544rrbD048481; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 01:01:00 -0400 Received: from alpi154.enaf.aldc.att.com (sbcsmtp6.sbc.com [144.160.229.23]) by m0049463.ppops.net-00191d01. with ESMTP id 38y1uvmd67-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 04 Jun 2021 01:00:59 -0400 Received: from enaf.aldc.att.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by alpi154.enaf.aldc.att.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 15450w1g030644; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 01:00:59 -0400 Received: from zlp30486.vci.att.com (zlp30486.vci.att.com [135.47.91.177]) by alpi154.enaf.aldc.att.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id 15450u8K030457 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NO); Fri, 4 Jun 2021 01:00:56 -0400 Received: from zlp30486.vci.att.com (zlp30486.vci.att.com [127.0.0.1]) by zlp30486.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id 49A724005C1C; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 05:00:56 +0000 (GMT) Received: from GAALPA1MSGEX1DB.ITServices.sbc.com (unknown [135.50.89.115]) by zlp30486.vci.att.com (Service) with ESMTP id F0DE34005C1B; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 05:00:55 +0000 (GMT) Received: from GAALPA1MSGEX1DB.ITServices.sbc.com (135.50.89.115) by GAALPA1MSGEX1DB.ITServices.sbc.com (135.50.89.115) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2242.10; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 01:00:55 -0400 Received: from GAALPA1MSGEX1DB.ITServices.sbc.com ([135.50.89.115]) by GAALPA1MSGEX1DB.ITServices.sbc.com ([135.50.89.115]) with mapi id 15.01.2242.010; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 01:00:48 -0400 From: "MORTON JR., AL" To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=C9ric_Vyncke?= , The IESG CC: "ippm-chairs@ietf.org" , "draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: =?iso-8859-1?Q?[ippm]_=C9ric_Vyncke's_No_Objection_on_draft-ietf-ippm-cap?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?acity-metric-method-11:_(with_COMMENT)?= Thread-Index: AQHXWG0iAkhDlzVRsUOjhKQze+6pEKsCVC/g Date: Fri, 4 Jun 2021 05:00:48 +0000 Message-ID: References: <162272035584.18166.1892710574472210395@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <162272035584.18166.1892710574472210395@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [130.10.149.153] x-tm-snts-smtp: 64FCB6B87163A21BD003E96F846B685A89AA94BA377D65793BB368242C5490E72 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Proofpoint-GUID: zahqnqudPYwmLOceNzd3bFDADU7BdvPg X-Proofpoint-ORIG-GUID: zahqnqudPYwmLOceNzd3bFDADU7BdvPg X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.391, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-06-04_01:2021-06-04, 2021-06-04 signatures=0 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=outbound_policy_notspam policy=outbound_policy score=0 phishscore=0 priorityscore=1501 mlxscore=0 lowpriorityscore=0 spamscore=0 impostorscore=0 clxscore=1011 malwarescore=0 mlxlogscore=999 bulkscore=0 suspectscore=0 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.12.0-2104190000 definitions=main-2106040038 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] =?iso-8859-1?q?=C9ric_Vyncke=27s_No_Objection_on_draft-ie?= =?iso-8859-1?q?tf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11=3A_=28with_COMMENT=29?= X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2021 05:01:10 -0000 Hi Eric, Thanks for your review - please see replies [acm] below, Al > -----Original Message----- > From: ippm On Behalf Of =C9ric Vyncke via Datatra= cker > Sent: Thursday, June 3, 2021 7:39 AM > To: The IESG > Cc: ippm-chairs@ietf.org; draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org= ; > ippm@ietf.org > Subject: [ippm] =C9ric Vyncke's No Objection on draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-= metric- > method-11: (with COMMENT) >=20 > =C9ric Vyncke has entered the following ballot position for > draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-11: No Objection >=20 ... > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > COMMENT: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >=20 > Thank you for the work put into this document. >=20 > Please find below some non-blocking COMMENT points (but replies would be > appreciated). >=20 > I hope that this helps to improve the document, >=20 > Regards, >=20 > -=E9ric >=20 > =3D=3D COMMENTS =3D=3D >=20 > Generic comment about the 1 Mbps granularity, this may of course be well = suited > for many connection but not really for constrained networks where the > measurement techniques of this I-D could be applied. [acm]=20 We don't mandate the starting rate or the table step-size: ...It is RECOMMENDED that rates begin with 0.5 Mbps at index zero, use 1 Mbps at index one, and then continue in 1 Mbps increments to 1 Gbps. The lowest capacity we have tried to test was 1.5 Mbps, so we didn't make an informed recommendation for low-rate/constrained networks= . The problem we are trying to solve is in a much higher rate range. Perhaps we can add: The sending rate table SHOULD include the maximum capacity where it will=20 make measurements, including constrained rates less than 500kbps if applica= ble.=20 =20 >=20 > Should the payload content random content to avoid some compression techn= iques > on the path ? [acm]=20 This important aspect of IPPM testing is discussed in an update to our meas= urement Framework (RFC 2330), in RFC 7312: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rf= c7312#section-3.1.2 Some packet payloads are more susceptible to compression than others, but optimizers in the measurement path can be out ruled by using incompressible packet payload. This payload content could be supplied by a pseudo-random sequence generator or by using part of a compressed file (e.g., a part of a ZIP compressed archive). We can add "Payload Content" as a metric parameter in section 4. Payload Content This IPPM-conforming measurement adds packet payload c= ontent as a Type-P parameter, which can help to improve measurement determinism. To remove a possible advantage due to compression, payload content SHOUL= D be supplied by a pseudo-random sequence generator, by using part of a compressed file, or by other means. See Section 3.1.2 of RFC7312. >=20 > -- Section 4 -- > s/the address of a host/one of the IP addresses of a host/ [acm] ok >=20 > Should there be a SHOULD rather than a MAY in "The IPv6 flow label MAY be > included" ? {acm] So, this would be recommending the v6 flow label be part of the=20 flow definition under certain circumstances with tunnels and ECMP or LAG: ... Note: The IPv6 flow label MAY be included in the flow definition when routers have complied with [RFC6438] guidelines. s/MAY/SHOULD/ sounds reasonable. >=20 > -- Section 5.3 -- > " o n0 is the total number of IP-Layer header and payload bits that > can be transmitted in standard-formed packets [RFC8468] from the > Src host and correctly received by the Dst host during one > contiguous sub-interval, dt in length, during the interval [T, > T+I]," >=20 > If we want to split hairs, in the case of IP fragmentation or NAT64, the > received bits will be different than the one sent ;-) I had no time to re= ad > RFC > 8468 (day job...), but, does the above remark fall in the same category a= s > "Some compression affects on measurement are discussed in Section 6 of > [RFC8468]." According to https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/rfc8468#section-5 A packet is standard-formed if .... + It is not an IP fragment. So, fragmentation is off the table. However, tests of a transition mechanism might well be the intended subject of a capacity test. As long as the IPv4 and IPv6 packets sent/received are both standard-formed, this should be allowed (and the change in header size easily accounted for on a per-packet basis). >=20 > -- Section 8.3 -- > " The number of concurrent, independent tests between > the same Source and Destination SHALL be limited to one." >=20 > Is it between hosts or between network? I.e.n "same source and destinatio= n > networks?" [acm] I'm not sure that adding "networks" makes the requirement more clear. The Source and Destination networks could be multi-homed, a situation=20 where single flows are assigned to one of the parallel links. We allow multiple flows to comprise a test and produce a measurement of aggregate capacity.=20 But adding "host" isn't the obvious clarification, either. Previously we sa= id: ... Although the default is a single flow (F=3D1) for testing, use of multiple flows may be advantageous for the following reasons: 1. the test host may be able to create higher load than with a single flow, or parallel test hosts may be used to generate 1 flow each. ... Since is one of the last requirements we have added (this week),=20 and only to prohibit what seems (to the authors) to be an obvious=20 mistake in judgement (neither of two independent tests conducted=20 concurrently will be able to correctly measure the maximum capacity),=20 then we should also consider removing the requirement sentence, leaving the advice: It is obviously counter-productive to run more than one independent test (regardless of the number of flows in the test stream) attempting to measure the *maximum* capacity between the same Source and Destination. (and add "concurrent" somewhere above). ?? >=20 > -- Section 8.4 -- > "supports IPv4 and IPv6 address families." does it support a NAT64 functi= on on > the path ? [acm]=20 (this is about the running code) I'm fairly sure we did not test with any v4-v6 transition function on=20 the path, but the possibility exists for surprises - it might work=20 under some circumstances... >=20 >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm__;= !!Bhd > T!zqf-cZZb_zNzvDdwXfO1sq0Mw_SEkhmaDj26jDYUgCEqD76tci1IvLP05gKs$ From nobody Fri Jun 4 03:04:36 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 833523A31C9; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 03:04:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -9.596 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-9.596 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, 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IC0tDQo+ID4gUkFXIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiA+IFJBV0BpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiA+IGh0dHBzOi8v d3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vcmF3DQo+ID4gLS0NCj4gPiBSQVcgbWFpbGlu ZyBsaXN0DQo+ID4gUkFXQGlldGYub3JnDQo+ID4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1h bi9saXN0aW5mby9yYXcNCj4gLS0NCj4gUkFXIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiBSQVdAaWV0Zi5vcmcN Cj4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9yYXcNCg== From nobody Fri Jun 4 13:44:31 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0C1273A206C for ; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 13:44:30 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.794 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.794 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_HIGH=-0.698, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, 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[17.234.49.48]) by rn-mailsvcp-mmp-lapp02.rno.apple.com (Oracle Communications Messaging Server 8.1.0.9.20210415 64bit (built Apr 15 2021)) with ESMTPSA id <0QU700G252XX2Y00@rn-mailsvcp-mmp-lapp02.rno.apple.com> for ippm@ietf.org; Fri, 04 Jun 2021 13:44:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Tommy Pauly Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Apple-Mail=_6AA35D14-DCE2-4C63-BA3C-B1F7F335101C" MIME-version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 15.0 \(3674.0.2\)) Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2021 13:44:21 -0700 References: <161973737124.22024.361534673966887143@ietfa.amsl.com> <5A8BB0C9-DD8F-405F-93F4-39F485970DF0@apple.com> To: IETF IPPM WG In-reply-to: <5A8BB0C9-DD8F-405F-93F4-39F485970DF0@apple.com> Message-id: <0CF4584B-278D-4EB7-B7FD-25A5215567DE@apple.com> X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3674.0.2) X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=fsecure engine=2.50.10434:6.0.391, 18.0.761 definitions=2021-06-04_12:2021-06-04, 2021-06-04 signatures=0 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-03.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2021 20:44:30 -0000 --Apple-Mail=_6AA35D14-DCE2-4C63-BA3C-B1F7F335101C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hello IPPM, Thanks to everyone who reviewed this document, and for the revisions by = the authors. Given the feedback and discussion, the chairs believe that this document = is ready to adopt into IPPM. Our call for adoption that occurred at the = end of last year was inconclusive, but this recent feedback and input = makes us comfortable with moving forward. Thus, we will mark the = document as adopted. Authors, please submit a draft version for = draft-ietf-ippm-stamp-srpm-00, with the pending changes from feedback = incorporated. Best, Tommy & Ian > On May 7, 2021, at 1:42 PM, Tommy Pauly = wrote: >=20 > Hi IPPM, >=20 > This draft has been discussed and debated at length before, and the = chairs would like to get input from the WG on their thoughts on this = version of the document and its direction. Given the interaction with = other working groups, we=E2=80=99d like to make progress on this in a = timely fashion. >=20 > Please do send your thoughts and feedback to the list, particularly if = you support this work, or if you have concerns new or existing. >=20 > Best, > Tommy >=20 >> On May 3, 2021, at 9:42 AM, Rakesh Gandhi > wrote: >>=20 >> Hi WG, >> This revision contains following updates: >> Welcome Richard as a co-author >> Merge Segment List Sub-TLVs >> Various editorial changes >>=20 >> Welcome your review comments and suggestions. >>=20 >> Thanks, >> Rakesh (for co-authors) >>=20 >>=20 >> On Thu, Apr 29, 2021 at 7:03 PM > wrote: >>=20 >> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts = directories. >> This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the = IETF. >>=20 >> Title : Simple TWAMP (STAMP) Extensions for Segment = Routing Networks >> Authors : Rakesh Gandhi >> Clarence Filsfils >> Daniel Voyer >> Mach(Guoyi) Chen >> Bart Janssens >> Richard Foote >> Filename : draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-03.txt >> Pages : 12 >> Date : 2021-04-29 >>=20 >> Abstract: >> Segment Routing (SR) leverages the source routing paradigm. SR is >> applicable to both Multiprotocol Label Switching (SR-MPLS) and = IPv6 >> (SRv6) data planes. This document specifies RFC 8762 (Simple = Two-Way >> Active Measurement Protocol (STAMP)) extensions for SR networks, = for >> both SR-MPLS and SRv6 data planes by augmenting the optional >> extensions defined in RFC 8972. >>=20 >>=20 >> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm/ = >>=20 >> There are also htmlized versions available at: >> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-03 = >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-03 = >>=20 >> A diff from the previous version is available at: >> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-03 = >>=20 >>=20 >> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of = submission >> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org = . >>=20 >> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ = >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> ippm mailing list >> ippm@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm = >> _______________________________________________ >> ippm mailing list >> ippm@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm >=20 > _______________________________________________ > ippm mailing list > ippm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm --Apple-Mail=_6AA35D14-DCE2-4C63-BA3C-B1F7F335101C Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Hello= IPPM,

Thanks to = everyone who reviewed this document, and for the revisions by the = authors.

Given = the feedback and discussion, the chairs believe that this document is = ready to adopt into IPPM. Our call for adoption that occurred at the end = of last year was inconclusive, but this recent feedback and input makes = us comfortable with moving forward. Thus, we will mark the document as = adopted.

Authors, please submit a draft version = for draft-ietf-ippm-stamp-srpm-00, with the pending changes from = feedback incorporated.

Best,
Tommy & Ian

On May 7, 2021, at 1:42 PM, Tommy Pauly <tpauly=3D40apple.com@dmarc.ietf.org> wrote:

Hi IPPM,

This draft has been = discussed and debated at length before, and the chairs would like to get = input from the WG on their thoughts on this version of the document and = its direction. Given the interaction with other working groups, we=E2=80=99= d like to make progress on this in a timely fashion.

Please do send your = thoughts and feedback to the list, particularly if you support this = work, or if you have concerns new or existing.

Best,
Tommy

On May 3, 2021, at 9:42 AM, Rakesh Gandhi = <rgandhi.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:

Hi = WG,
This revision = contains following updates:
  • Welcome Richard as a co-author
  • Merge Segment List Sub-TLVs
  • Various editorial changes

Welcome your review comments and = suggestions.

Thanks,
Rakesh= (for co-authors)

=

On Thu, Apr 29, 2021 at 7:03 PM <internet-drafts@ietf.org> wrote:

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts = directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the = IETF.

        Title          =  : Simple TWAMP (STAMP) Extensions for Segment Routing Networks
        Authors         : = Rakesh Gandhi
                    =       Clarence Filsfils
                    =       Daniel Voyer
                    =       Mach(Guoyi) Chen
                    =       Bart Janssens
                    =       Richard Foote
        Filename        : = draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-03.txt
        Pages          =  : 12
        Date          =   : 2021-04-29

Abstract:
   Segment Routing (SR) leverages the source routing = paradigm.  SR is
   applicable to both Multiprotocol Label Switching (SR-MPLS) = and IPv6
   (SRv6) data planes.  This document specifies RFC 8762 = (Simple Two-Way
   Active Measurement Protocol (STAMP)) extensions for SR = networks, for
   both SR-MPLS and SRv6 data planes by augmenting the = optional
   extensions defined in RFC 8972.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm/<= /a>

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srpm-03=
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-s= rpm-03

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-gandhi-ippm-stamp-srp= m-03


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of = submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


_______________________________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm
_______________________________________________
ippm = mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm

_______________________________________________
ippm mailing list
ippm@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ippm

= --Apple-Mail=_6AA35D14-DCE2-4C63-BA3C-B1F7F335101C-- From nobody Fri Jun 4 15:49:12 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 085093A240C; Fri, 4 Jun 2021 15:49:11 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.30.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <162284695097.21829.3877885968739594173@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2021 15:49:11 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-stamp-srpm-00.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 04 Jun 2021 22:49:11 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Simple TWAMP (STAMP) Extensions for Segment Routing Networks Authors : Rakesh Gandhi Clarence Filsfils Daniel Voyer Mach(Guoyi) Chen Bart Janssens Richard Foote Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-stamp-srpm-00.txt Pages : 13 Date : 2021-06-04 Abstract: Segment Routing (SR) leverages the source routing paradigm. SR is applicable to both Multiprotocol Label Switching (SR-MPLS) and IPv6 (SRv6) forwarding planes. This document specifies RFC 8762 (Simple Two-Way Active Measurement Protocol (STAMP)) extensions for SR networks, for both SR-MPLS and SRv6 forwarding planes by augmenting the optional extensions defined in RFC 8972. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-stamp-srpm/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-stamp-srpm-00 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Jun 7 18:54:55 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D26483A1BA4; Mon, 7 Jun 2021 18:54:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.31.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <162311729080.2955.14388246156960209342@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 07 Jun 2021 18:54:50 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-xiao-ippm-ioam-conf-state-10.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 08 Jun 2021 01:54:51 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Echo Request/Reply for Enabled In-situ OAM Capabilities Authors : Xiao Min Greg Mirsky Lei Bo Filename : draft-xiao-ippm-ioam-conf-state-10.txt Pages : 18 Date : 2021-06-07 Abstract: This document describes an extension to the echo request/reply mechanisms used in IPv6, MPLS, SFC and BIER environments, which can be used within an IOAM domain, allowing the IOAM encapsulating node to acquire the enabled IOAM capabilities of each IOAM transit node and/or IOAM decapsulating node. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-xiao-ippm-ioam-conf-state/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-xiao-ippm-ioam-conf-state-10 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-xiao-ippm-ioam-conf-state-10 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Jun 9 12:08:33 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19B033A2299; Wed, 9 Jun 2021 12:08:07 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.31.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <162326568698.21136.9489248224881392456@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2021 12:08:07 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-12.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2021 19:08:07 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Metrics and Methods for One-way IP Capacity Authors : Al Morton Ruediger Geib Len Ciavattone Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-12.txt Pages : 38 Date : 2021-06-09 Abstract: This memo revisits the problem of Network Capacity metrics first examined in RFC 5136. The memo specifies a more practical Maximum IP-Layer Capacity metric definition catering for measurement purposes, and outlines the corresponding methods of measurement. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-12 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-12 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Jun 9 13:07:00 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A98F33A248D; Wed, 9 Jun 2021 13:06:14 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: "IETF-Announce" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.31.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Cc: Ian Swett , The IESG , draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method@ietf.org, ippm-chairs@ietf.org, ippm@ietf.org, martin.h.duke@gmail.com, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org, tpauly@apple.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <162326917467.1478.6051085686261269307@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2021 13:06:14 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Protocol Action: 'Metrics and Methods for One-way IP Capacity' to Proposed Standard (draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-12.txt) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 09 Jun 2021 20:06:22 -0000 The IESG has approved the following document: - 'Metrics and Methods for One-way IP Capacity' (draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method-12.txt) as Proposed Standard This document is the product of the IP Performance Measurement Working Group. The IESG contact persons are Zaheduzzaman Sarker and Martin Duke. A URL of this Internet Draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-capacity-metric-method/ Technical Summary This memo revisits the problem of Network Capacity metrics first examined in RFC 5136. The memo specifies a more practical Maximum IP-layer Capacity metric definition catering for measurement purposes, and outlines the corresponding methods of measurement. Working Group Summary The working group has consensus to publish this document. There was no particular controversy in the working group regarding this document, but the group did provide useful and detailed feedback and review. Document Quality This document represents a standardized definition of concepts that have existed and been documented informationally previously (RFC 5136). This document covers the background and motivation for providing a clearer definition of the metric and method for IP capacity. There is one implementation, as described in Section 8.4 (which will be deleted before publication). Personnel Tommy Pauly is the Document Shepherd. Martin Duke is the Responsible Area Director. From nobody Wed Jun 23 20:26:23 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B48423A1D6E; Wed, 23 Jun 2021 20:26:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.895 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ahv0Xu_LSeYM; Wed, 23 Jun 2021 20:26:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from outgoing.mit.edu (outgoing-auth-1.mit.edu [18.9.28.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F06673A1D68; Wed, 23 Jun 2021 20:26:10 -0700 (PDT) Received: from kduck.mit.edu ([24.16.140.251]) (authenticated bits=56) (User authenticated as kaduk@ATHENA.MIT.EDU) by outgoing.mit.edu (8.14.7/8.12.4) with ESMTP id 15O3Pvls010576 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT); Wed, 23 Jun 2021 23:26:02 -0400 Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2021 20:25:57 -0700 From: Benjamin Kaduk To: "Frank Brockners (fbrockne)" Cc: The IESG , "draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data@ietf.org" , "ippm-chairs@ietf.org" , "ippm@ietf.org" , Al Morton , "tal.mizrahi.phd@gmail.com" Message-ID: <20210624032557.GU11634@kduck.mit.edu> References: <161656101267.7087.8167870905178123095@ietfa.amsl.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In-Reply-To: Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-12: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT) X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2021 03:26:18 -0000 Hi Frank, Now it is my turn to apologize for the delay in responsing -- it's been a busy couple months for me! Also inline... On Tue, May 04, 2021 at 06:16:39PM +0000, Frank Brockners (fbrockne) wrote: > Hi Ben, >=20 > Thanks a lot for the very detailed review - and sorry for the delay in re= sponding.=20 > Please find comments and questions inline ("..FB").=20 >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker > > Sent: Mittwoch, 24. M=C3=A4rz 2021 05:44 > > To: The IESG > > Cc: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data@ietf.org; ippm-chairs@ietf.org; ippm@ietf= =2Eorg; > > Al Morton ; acm@research.att.com > > Subject: Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-12: (with > > DISCUSS and COMMENT) > >=20 > > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for > > draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-12: Discuss > >=20 > > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all e= mail > > addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this intro= ductory > > paragraph, however.) > >=20 > >=20 > > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.ht= ml > > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > >=20 > >=20 > > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data/ > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > DISCUSS: > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >=20 > > I think we need some greater clarity on the relationship between IOAM "= layers" > > and IOAM-Namespaces. For example, in Section 4 there is a principle of > > "Layering" that seems to indicate that different layers operate entirely > > independently, such as might occur when traffic from one operator that = uses > > IOAM is conveyed in a tunnel over a different operator's network and bo= th > > operators use IOAM independently. But in Section 5.3 we seem to see so= me > > discussion that IOAM-Namespaces can be used to enforce a separation of = layers > > ("IOAM-Namespaces provide additional context [...] e.g. if an operator = wishes > > to use different node identifiers for different IOAM layers"), and that= namespace > > identifiers allow for determination of which IOAM-Option-Types need to = be > > processed "in case of a layered IOAM deployment". >=20 > ...FB: Roman's DISCUSS touched on a similar topic: Given that draft-ietf-= ippm-ioam-data is focused on the definition of data-fields, we created a "s= ister" document, which is to discuss all deployment related aspects of IOAM= : draft-brockners-opsawg-ioam-deployment (we're working on an updated versi= on as we speak). Namespaces are discussed in section 7.1, layering is disc= ussed in section 7.2, and domains are discussed in section 3. Tal is curren= tly evolving the security section (reflecting Shawn Emery review comments).= In the past IPPM WG meeting we concluded that we'd go for a WG-adoption ca= ll once the updated is available. >=20 > Are you ok to keep "data fields definition" and "deployment aspects" sepa= rated in the two different documents? Otherwise, we would need to create re= dundancies between the documents, making it harder to keep the different do= cuments in synch. My main concern is that we provide a clear and precise picture of what we're defining, including how the pieces fit together; if that means that we put the deployment aspects of namespaces and layers into a separate document and we make clear that you have to read the other document in order to understand those concepts, that should be fine from my perspective. (It might then make sense to remove much of the discussion of namespaces and layers from the data-fields document, since you only need to know that the interpretation of the field depends on the namespace and/or layer but the specifics can be elsewhere.) Having redundancies between documents is a common source of skew/inconsistencies, so I support avoiding the redundancy when possible :) > >=20 > > I think there is also some internal inconsistency relating to the role = of IOAM > > transit nodes. This may be localised in Section 5.2 where we see both = that a > > transit node is one that "read and/or write or process [the] IOAM data"= and that > > a transit node "updates one or more of the IOAM-Data-Fields" (i.e., alw= ays > > writes), but I did not attempt an exhaustive check for other instances. >=20 > ...FB: Thanks for catching this inconsistency. The role of at transit nod= e varies, depending on what type of IOAM Option-Type is contained in the pa= cket, e.g. > * For the Tracing Option-Types (preallocated or incremental), a node will= read the IOAM section (to understand what Option-Types in which namespaces= are present). If the node is configured to operate as a transit node for t= he namespace-id present in the packet and a Tracing Option-Type, it'll also= write new information into the packet (assuming there is space left) and i= t will update fields like RemainingLen. > * For "Direct Export" (draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export), a node will r= ead the associated Option-Type and perform the associated data-gathering, b= ut will not write anything to the packet for this particular Option-Type. > * For "Proof of Transit", a node will read the associated Option-Type and= will update the fields of this data-type, as described in draft-ietf-sfc-p= roof-of-transit >=20 > So the "read and/or write and/or process IOAM data" is the right descript= ion, which captures the various roles a transit node can take. In the next = rev of the document, we'll make sure that this is description is consistent= ly used throughout the document. Excellent, thanks. >=20 > >=20 > > I don't think the definition of the POSIX epoch is correct -- it seems = to be copied > > (roughly) from the definition of the PTP epoch (i.e., using midnight TA= I as the > > reference) but all the references I consulted indicate that the POSIX e= poch > > started at midnight UTC. >=20 > ...FB: Great catch. Reference to TAI is indeed inappropriate. Looking at = the entire section, would you be ok if we reference https://pubs.opengroup.= org/onlinepubs/9699919799/xrat/V4_xbd_chap04.html#tag_21_04_16 instead of t= rying to reexplain things? > I.e. we'd simply add a " For details further details on the POSIX time, i= ncluding handling of leap seconds, see [reference above]" and we'd remove t= he sections on Epoch/Resolution/Wraparound/Synch, because those are rather = restatements of what is defined in a much greater level of detail elsewhere= =2E=20 That seems reasonable to me, since the POSIX publication is easy to get to... > If you agree with the approach, we could go with the same approach for th= e other time formats - making the spec shorter and crisper. > We'd greatly appreciate your guidance. =2E..but the PTP one is, IIRC, less easy to get to. We might need to keep more discussion of the PTP format in-band, and rely on the references only for NTP and POSIX. > >=20 > > As foreshadowed in > > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/last-call/Ak2NAIKQ7p4Rij9jfv123xe= TXQY/ > > I think we need to have a discussion about the expectations and provisi= ons for > > cryptographic (e.g., integrity) protection of IOAM data. > > From my perspective, IOAM is a new (class of) protocols that is seeking > > publication on the IETF stream as Proposed Standard. While we do make > > exceptions for modifications to protocols that were developed before we > > realized how important integrated security mechanisms are, it's general= ly the > > case that new protocols are held to the current IETF expectations for w= hat > > security properties are provided; the default expectation is that a pro= tocol is > > expected to provide secure operation in the internet threat model of RF= C 3552. > > This draft currently only provides a brief note in the security conside= rations that > > there exists an individual draft (draft-brockners-ippm-ioam-data-integr= ity) that > > might provide ways to protect the integrity of IOAM data fields. > > Shouldn't the security mechanisms be getting developed side-by-side by = the > > protocol mechanisms, to ensure that they are properly integrated and fi= t for > > purpose? (This does not necessarily have to be in the same document an= d could > > be part of a cluster of related documents, but I don't think that an in= formative > > reference to a non-WG draft really > > qualifies.) >=20 > ...FB: IMHO there is general agreement in the WG by now that we need to h= ave security mechanisms clearly defined, though I don't think they have to = be in the very same document. The main scope of draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data i= s to define the data fields for IOAM, rather than define procedures on how = the fields are used, or even a new protocol. A good example is the proof-of= -transit work (draft-ietf-sfc-proof-of-transit), which can leverage IOAM da= ta fields for one particular implementation. That said, integrity protectio= n is a special case. The procedures for integrity protection are obviously = tightly linked to the data fields that they are supposed to protect, but th= e mechanisms might not be exclusive to IOAM. So personally, I'd agree that = we should develop the integrity protection mechanisms in close association = with the data fields itself but ensure the solution is as versatile as poss= ible. The =E2=80=9DPerformance and Diagnostic Metrics (PDM) team=E2=80=9D (= Michael, Nalini) already reached out =E2=80=93 with the plan to investigate= whether we can=E2=80=99t create a single solution which would cover PDM an= d IOAM =E2=80=93 something that everyone would for sure appreciate.=20 >=20 > Since the discussion you've mentioned above, we've made quite a bit of pr= ogress. We've not only created draft-brockners-ippm-ioam-data-integrity - = but also agreed on a way forward in the WG to move from a discussion of opt= ions to solve the problem to an implementation discussion. I.e., the guidan= ce from the last WG meeting was to focus on "Method 3" and spell this metho= d out further. This would also allow us to move from an informative documen= t to a standards track document. Here is the current WIP - still needs mor= e touches, e.g. reflecting the discussion that IPPM WG had at the last IETF= meeting to reflect the needs to different deployments, i.e. deployments wh= ich require very strong protection and are ready to compromise performance = for that and vice versa: > https://github.com/inband-oam/ietf/blob/master/drafts/versions/02/draft-b= rockners-ippm-ioam-data-integrity-02.txt >=20 > Given that draft-brockners-ippm-ioam-data-integrity was created as a resu= lt of the WG review and discussions - expectation is that it'll also be WG = adopted (IPPM chairs, any view from your perspective)? > Now the big question: Assuming that draft-brockners-ippm-ioam-data-integr= ity would become a standards track document, does draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data= need to wait for the work on ippm-ioam-data-integrity to finish, by e.g. f= orcing a normative reference? We should acknowledge that while integrity pr= otection might be considered important for some future deployment, current = uses of early implementations of IOAM or similar are in =E2=80=9Climited an= d isolated domains=E2=80=9D and they do well without an integrity protectio= n solution.=20 I'm pretty reluctant to just leave things open-ended here, though I do acknowledge that the data fields themselves are not a complete protocol. Perhaps we could require that an embedding of these fields into a protocol provide means for cryptographic protection, whether vy incorporating the draft-brockners-ippm-ioam-data-integrity mechanism to protect the field directly or by using a feature of the containing protocol? > >=20 > >=20 > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > COMMENT: > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > >=20 > > Thanks to Shawn Emery for the secdir review. > >=20 > > I have grave misgivings about the proposed behavior that provides for a > > separate domain boundary at the granularity of IOAM-Namespace. It does= not > > quite rise to a Discuss because it is technically possible to implement= successfully > > if done perfectly, but it seems incredibly risky and very hard to get r= ight, and > > there does not seem to be sufficient motivation presented for the benef= its of > > this behavior to justify the risk. Specifically, by partitioning all I= OAM behaviors > > by IOAM-Namespace, we require a node to know whether or not it is to be= have > > as ingress/egress for a domain on a per-namespace basis. In effect, it= allows for > > a proliferation of as many distinct and partially overlapping IOAM Doma= ins as > > there are namespace values, and whether a node is ingress (or egress) f= or any > > given domain has to be looked up on the basis of the specific IOAM-Name= space > > value. I find this concerning because the security properties of the s= ystem rely > > on properly policing the domain boundary, so that IOAM markings from ou= tside > > the domain are rejected at ingress, and IOAM data is not leaked out of = the > > domain by policing at egress. While we have ample evidence to suggest = that it is > > feasible to maintain a single tightly controlled domain that properly p= olices > > ingress and egress (e.g., MPLS), I don't know of evidence to suggest th= at it is > > feasible to do so with a spate of partially overlapping domains where d= omains > > and domain membership are malleable based the interaction of configurat= ion > > and in-band protocol elements. > > It seems incredibly likely that some domain boundary somewhere will be > > inadvertently permeable, and compromise the security properties of the = system. >=20 > ...FB: Your, as well the comments from other reviewers, show that the doc= ument needs to be even crisper on the role of namespaces. We'll need to add= ress this for sure in the next rev. The role of namespaces is to provide ad= ditional context to IOAM data fields. The draft is quite explicit about nam= espaces: =E2=80=9CIOAM-Namespaces add further context to IOAM-Option-Types = and associated IOAM-Data-Fields.", i.e. they are not intended as e.g. a ten= ant-identifier or organization-identifier. What we should definitively cla= rify further is that this additional context that namespaces provide is wit= hin a limited domain, i.e., an IOAM domain. An IOAM domain is an umbrella f= or all the groupings that are associated with a particular namespace-id wit= hin an IOAM domain. This is articulated by Section 5.2. "An IOAM decapsula= ting node situated at the edge of an IOAM domain MUST remove all IOAM-Optio= n-Types and associated encapsulation headers for all IOAM-Namespaces from t= he packet.". If in the next rev of the doc, we'd explain the purpose of nam= espaces a bit more using details and also clarifying that an IOAM limited d= omain is really an umbrella on top of the grouping that namespace-ids provi= de, would that help? Yes, I think that would help. IIRC (it's been longer than it should have been), my mental picture for how the namespaces ought to work (which is distinct from what my mental picture of what the document currently says) involved something roughly as you describe here, with namespaces being sub-divisions of a broader domain, and any given (layer, node) is only part of one namespace (possibly with the exception of the border filtering, though I don't think I was sure about that either way). The picture I got =66rom the document iself was a bit middled, though, and suggested that the namespaces had to act independently and receive independent boundary protection, and when combined with the ability for a given node to belong to multiple namespaces would be very hard to protect. So more clarity is greatly appreciated! > >=20 > > Section 1 > >=20 > > (side note) There's perhaps something of a philosophical question of wh= ether a > > mechanism really qualifies as "in situ" if it involves encapsulating th= e packet in a > > full-fledged tunnel (as at least the IPv6 encapsulation does, as is nee= ded to add > > the additional EHs that hold IOAM data fields). That said, I don't rea= lly have any > > alternative suggestions, and I am sure that IOAM is a well-established > > terminology, so this is just a side node. >=20 > ...FB: Philosophical indeed :-) -- naming is always hard. Things started = out with "in-band OAM" - which was considered inappropriate and there were = a lot of discussions some 5 years ago - and it was Erik Nordmark who came u= p with the term "in-situ OAM" which everyone was ok with so far.=20 >=20 > >=20 > > Section 4 > >=20 > > Scope: This document defines the data fields and associated data > > types for in-situ OAM. The in-situ OAM data field can be > > encapsulated in a variety of protocols, including NSH, Segment > > Routing, Geneve, IPv6, or IPv4. Specification details for these > >=20 > > I found drafts (split between targeting ippm and "the relevant working > > groups") that would cover Geneve and IPv6, but not anything for IPv4. > > Are we fully confident that the aim is actually achievable for IPv4? >=20 > ...FB: "Fully confident" are big words. We should probably change the sen= tence to include an "e.g." and only state protocols where there are progres= sing draft: "The in-situ OAM data field can be encapsulated in a variety of= protocols, including e.g., NSH, GRE, IPv6, etc.".=20 Makes sense. > There's been efforts to also do something for v4, but those didn't go fur= ther than -00 so far: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-gafni-ippm-ioam-ipv4-options-00 >=20 > >=20 > > Deployment domain (or scope) of in-situ OAM deployment: IOAM is a > > network domain focused feature, with "network domain" being a set of > > network devices or entities within a single administration. For > > example, a network domain can include an enterprise campus using > > physical connections between devices or an overlay network using > > virtual connections / tunnels for connectivity between said devices. > >=20 > > If these virtual connections/tunnels do not provide cryptographic confi= dentiality > > and integrity protection, then the security considerations for IOAM nee= d to > > include the full physical deployment scope including the underaly over = which the > > overlay is constructed, not just the "administrative domain" as defined= here. > >=20 > > Furthermore, there seems to be a very questionable interaction between > > labeling the IOAM deployment domain an administrative domain yet allowi= ng > > for multiple partially overlapping IOAM domains as distinguished by nam= espace > > ID. Does the administrative domain have to encompass the union of all = the > > different IOAM domains (as identified by namespace ID)? >=20 > ...FB: IOAM domains are limited domains per RFC8799. As mentioned in the = discussion on Roman's DISCUSS, we'll add an explicit reference to RFC8799.= =20 > The assumption - and we should indeed make this clear in the text as you = hint at - is that an all virtual connections/tunnels/overlay and underlays = are associated to the one limited domain.=20 > And as mentioned above, your assumption of the admin domain (i.e., limite= d domain) being the union/umbrella of all the groupings associated to Names= pace-IDs is the logical model the document follows. I trust this will also get a bit more text in the pending revisions, thanks :) > >=20 > > Section 5.2 > >=20 > > An "IOAM transit node" updates one or more of the IOAM-Data-Fields. > >=20 > > (per the discuss) > > The previous discussion suggested that even a node that only reads IOAM- > > DataFields is still considered a "transit node", and that updating the = field > > contents is not necessary in order to justify that moniker. > > That said, the notion that a transit node is writing (e.g., to update t= race option- > > types) seems to be prevailing throughout later portions of the document= , so > > perhaps it is the text a few paragraphs earlier that is in error. >=20 > ...FB: See the explanation above. It depends on the IOAM Option-Type what= a transit node will do with the IOAM data-fields. >=20 > >=20 > > If both the Pre-allocated and the Incremental Trace Option-Types are > > present in the packet, each IOAM transit node based on configuration > > and available implementation of IOAM populates IOAM trace data in > > either Pre-allocated or Incremental Trace Option-Type but not both. > >=20 > > (per the discuss) > > Likewise, is this "populates" mandatory? >=20 > ...FB: In case of Trace Options-Types, "populates" indeed makes sense, be= cause the transit node will write information to the packet. >=20 > >=20 > > A transit node MUST ignore IOAM-Option-Types that it does not > > understand. A transit node MUST NOT add new IOAM-Option-Types to a > > packet, MUST NOT remove IOAM-Option-Types from a packet, and MUST NOT > > change the IOAM-Data-Fields of an IOAM Edge-to-Edge Option-Type. > >=20 > > Almost all of this (not the Edge-to-Edge stuff) seems fairly tautologic= al, in that if > > a node did that stuff it would be an encapsulating and/or decapsulating= node, > > possibly in addition to being a transit node. >=20 > ...FB: Agree that this states the obvious, but IMHO it also does not hurt= either. Are you suggesting that we're rather remove the obvious pieces? Not quite so strong as a suggestion, just confirming that it was a conscious choice to have it this way. > >=20 > > The role of an IOAM-encapsulating, IOAM-transit or IOAM-decapsulating > > node is always performed within a specific IOAM-Namespace. This > > means that an IOAM node which is e.g. an IOAM-decapsulating node for > > IOAM-Namespace "A" but not for IOAM-Namespace "B" will only remove > > the IOAM-Option-Types for IOAM-Namespace "A" from the packet. Note > > that this applies even for IOAM-Option-Types that the node does not > > understand, for example an IOAM-Option-Type other than the four > > described above, that is added in a future revision. An IOAM > > decapsulating node situated at the edge of an IOAM domain MUST remove > > all IOAM-Option-Types and associated encapsulation headers for all > > IOAM-Namespaces from the packet. > >=20 > > I can only make sense of this paragraph as a whole if the last sentence= instead > > says "MUST remove from the packet [...] for all IOAM-Namespaces for whi= ch > > the node is a decapsulating node. The current text says to remove lite= rally all > > IOAM information for literally all IOAM-Namespaces, which seems to cont= radict > > the separation of namespaces depicted earlier in the paragraph. >=20 > ...FB: Per the discussion above, the IOAM limited domain is a union/umbre= lla of all the groupings associated to Namespace-IDs. As such, if a node ha= ppens to be located at the edge, it would indeed remove all IOAM Option-Typ= es from the packet. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 5.4 > >=20 > > A particular implementation of IOAM MAY choose to support only one of > > the two trace option types. In the event that both options are > > utilized at the same time, the Incremental Trace-Option MUST be > > placed before the Pre-allocated Trace-Option. Deployments which mix > > devices with either the Incremental Trace-Option or the Pre-allocated > > Trace-Option could result in both Option-Types being present in a > > packet. Given that the operator knows which equipment is deployed in > > a particular IOAM, the operator will decide by means of configuration > > which type(s) of trace options will be used for a particular domain. > >=20 > > Up in Section 5.2 we said that "each IOAM transit node based on configu= ration > > and available implementation" populates exactly one trace option type. = I think I > > can read the two statements as being consistent with each other, but it= might be > > useful to harmonize the specific language used to make it very clear th= at these > > refer to the same behavior. >=20 > ...FB: Good point - and we'll harmonized things in the next rev. These ar= e some of the (unfortunate) artefacts of the document having many authors.= =20 >=20 > >=20 > > Section 5.4.1 > >=20 > > Just to check my understanding: when I first read the discussion of thi= s being an > > "array" and there being a potential "Opaque State Snapshot" > > component, I assumed that the length of this opaque snapshot would need= to be > > fixed per array element (i.e., as part of the namespace definition). H= aving read a > > bit more, it seems that my initial assumption is incorrect, since there= is a length > > field in the opaque state snapshot framing, and so a node parsing the a= rray of > > elements will be able to skip over the approprate (variable) length for= each > > element in the array. Please confirm that my updated understanding is = correct. >=20 > ...FB: That is true. "Opaque State Snapshot" can have variable length whi= ch is defined in the "Length" field of Opaque State Snapshot (see 5.4.2.13.) >=20 > >=20 > > Namespace-ID: 16-bit identifier of an IOAM-Namespace. The > > Namespace-ID value of 0x0000 is defined as the "Default-Namespace- > > ID" (see Section 5.3) and MUST be known to all the nodes > > implementing IOAM. For any other Namespace-ID value that does not > > match any Namespace-ID the node is configured to operate on, the > > node MUST NOT change the contents of the IOAM-Data-Fields. > >=20 > > Though it may seem banal to do so, explicitly listing "change, add, or = remove" > > might help avoid future questions of how to interpret this text. > > E.g., there is some similar text in RFC 2460 about "examined or process= ed" that > > proved to be highly controversial and was changed in RFC 8200. >=20 > ...FB: Good point. Will do. Avoiding a future discussion similar to what = 6man went through is for sure a big plus! >=20 > >=20 > > A node receiving an IOAM Pre-allocated or Incremental Trace-Option > > relies on the NodeLen value, or it can ignore the NodeLen value > > and calculate the node length from the IOAM-Trace-Type bits (see > > below). > >=20 > > Allowing an implementation to pick one or the other option like this in= troduces > > fragility to the system as a whole and requires strict controls that en= capsulating > > nodes always set the value even if their implementation does not use it= =2E I would > > prefer if we had a single well-specified required behavior for all node= s, that > > could be easily tested for conformance. >=20 > ...FB: Good point. We can simply shorten the sentence to "A node receivin= g an IOAM Pre-allocated or Incremental Trace-Option relies on the NodeLen v= alue." > Calculating the length from the IOAM-Trace-Type bits was just mentioned a= s an alternate, though more complicated way.=20 >=20 > >=20 > > Bit 0 "Overflow" (O-bit) (most significant bit). If there are > > not enough octets left to record node data, the network element > > MUST NOT add any fields and MUST set the overflow "O-bit" to > > "1" in the IOAM-Trace-Option header. This is useful for > > transit nodes to ignore further processing of the option. > >=20 > > This makes things awkward for a lot of the earlier statements that requ= ire transit > > nodes to populate trace data. How is the document internally consisten= t in this > > regard, if transit nodes are both required to populate trace data and r= equired to > > not add trace data? >=20 > ...FB: The intended behavior of a transit node for any of the Trace Optio= n-Types is: "Write information into the packet as long as there is space av= ailable". If there isn't sufficient space available, a transit node won't b= e able to write information to the packet. To avoid the transit node trying= to write information to the packet only to find out that there isn't enoug= h space, the overflow bit is to help the transit node determine whether the= re is indeed space available for the write operation.=20 > Any suggestion how we can explain this in a better/clearer way? I think that much of my state has been lost to time, unfortunately. One thought would be to preface the requirements to write with "when adding data to the packet" or similar, as in "when adding data to the packet, each node MUST prepend its node data", etc.. But in the grand scheme of things, it would not be the end of the world if we left this text alone -- it seems unlikely that an implementor would get confused by the document as a whole. >=20 > >=20 > > NodeLen - sizeof(opaque snapshot) in 4 octet units. If > > RemainingLen in a pre-allocated trace option exceeds the length of > > the option, as specified in the preceding header, then the node > > MUST NOT add any fields. > >=20 > > What is the "preceding header"? This seems like perhaps it originated = in a > > description of a concrete protocol encoding of this data item and does = not quite > > apply to the abstract description thereof. >=20 > ...FB: Good catch - and you're probably even right on the origin. With e.= g. v6 one would have an "Opt Data Len" field that could be evaluated - but = this clearly does not belong here but into the associated protocol specific= encapsulation spec (like e.g., draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-ipv6-options). We'll = remove that sentence. >=20 > >=20 > > Bit 12-21 Undefined. An IOAM encapsulating node MUST set the > > value of each of these bits to 0. If an IOAM transit > > node receives a packet with one or more of these bits set > > to 1, it MUST either: > >=20 > > 1. Add corresponding node data filled with the reserved > > value 0xFFFFFFFF, after the node data fields for the > > IOAM-Trace-Type bits defined above, such that the > >=20 > > Just to confirm: this means that there cannot be any future allocations= of bits to > > "wide format" items and thus that only bits 8-10 will ever consume 2 un= its each > > of four-octets? (This does not preclude allocating two adjacent bits t= o indicate > > a single logical data item, of course, with appropriate error handling = for when > > only one of the two is set.) >=20 > ...FB: Another good catch - and excluding future allocations in "wide" fo= rmat wasn't the intention from what I know. To simplify things, we can avoi= d the "either" behavior and simply state: >=20 > Bit 12-21 Undefined, see section 8.2. for future registrations. > =20 > An IOAM encapsulating node MUST set the > value of each reserved bit to 0. If an IOAM transit > node receives a packet with one or more of the reserved bi= ts set > to 1, it MUST not add any node data fields to the packet, = even for > the IOAM-Trace-Type bits defined above. This would work, but I think the situation from Tal's follow-up note is probably better (more robust). > >=20 > > Bit 23 Reserved: MUST be set to zero upon transmission and > > ignored upon receipt. > >=20 > > I note that this description for the "reserved" bit has a different spe= cified > > behavior than the unallocated bits 12-21 (that require a node to fill t= he data with > > ones if the bit is set). Do we have a sense for any ways in which this= reserved > > bit's semantics could be used for future extensibility, vs being locked= into these > > (basically useless) semantics forever? >=20 > ... FB: The idea was to set aside a bit which won't be consumed for any a= dditional IOAM-Trace-Type, but rather allow some future RFC to extend the T= race-Type bit field, in case there should ever be the need for it. Should w= e just state this here? If that's the intent, I'd probably label it "Reserved for future protocol extension" or similar. There are lots of ways to write this that would be fine (including how it currently is), I think. > >=20 > > Section 5.4.2 > >=20 > > Some IOAM-Data-Fields defined below, such as interface identifiers or > > IOAM-Namespace specific data, are defined in both "short format" as > > well as "wide format". Their use is not exclusive. A deployment > > could choose to leverage both. [...] > >=20 > > While the text goes on to clarify that, based on per-domain configurati= on, they > > can hold qualitatively different types of information, I still must ask= if there is > > any entity that is or might be tasked with enforcing that there is cons= istency > > between the two fields (mostly for when they are different representati= ons of > > the same information, but not necessarily exclusively so). >=20 > ...FB: The main logic that the draft follows is to specify the syntax, bu= t avoid specifying the semantics of the data-fields. That way the nodes can= supply the information in their native format - and the interpretation wou= ld be happening in network management systems / analytics systems, which wo= uld transform and process the information in any cases. The combination of = a particular data-field and the namespace-id should provide for the context= to interpret the provided data appropriately. As a consequence, consistenc= y checks would happen at the network management station. That makes sense, thanks for the additional explanation. > >=20 > > Section 5.4.2.1 > >=20 > > Hop_Lim: 1-octet unsigned integer. It is set to the Hop Limit value > > in the packet at the node that records this data. Hop Limit > >=20 > > "In the packet" at ingress to, or egress from, the node? >=20 > ...FB: Should be egress. We'll add this clarification. >=20 > >=20 > > node_id: 3-octet unsigned integer. Node identifier field to > > uniquely identify a node within the IOAM-Namespace and associated > > IOAM-Domain. The procedure to allocate, manage and map the > > node_ids is beyond the scope of this document. > >=20 > > Even if we attempt to leave allocation/management of node_ids out of sc= ope > > for this document, I think we still need to talk about what goes wrong = and how > > to recover in case of collision. >=20 > ...FB: While the discussion of potential collisions etc. is important, dr= aft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data is probably the wrong place for the discussion, bec= ause it is a deployment consideration. > Would you be ok if we add this to the list of topics that we'd add to dra= ft-brockners-opsawg-ioam-deployment? Okay. I'd be happier if we could have a specific reference to that document from the description of the field here. > >=20 > > Section 5.4.2.2 > >=20 > > I kind of expected some note that the interpretation of the interface i= dentifier > > fields here is (or might be?) going to be specified by the node they ap= ply to and > > can only be interpreted in that context. Or are these expected to be a= llocated > > by a central entity? >=20 > ...FB: Similar to the note above: The focus is on specifying the syntax a= nd leaving the semantics and even the allocation to a specific deployment. = Which means, that IDs could be allocated centrally, or locally on the node.= Personally I'd expect that latter to be the more likely, but it would be o= ut of scope for the document. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 5.4.2.12 > >=20 > > The "buffer occupancy" field is a 4-octet unsigned integer field. > > This field indicates the current status of the occupancy of the > > common buffer pool used by a set of queues. The units of this field > > are implementation specific. Hence, the units are interpreted within > > the context of an IOAM-Namespace and/or node-id if used. The authors > > acknowledge that in some operational cases there is a need for the > > units to be consistent across a packet path through the network, > > hence it is RECOMMENDED for implementations to use standard units > > such as Bytes. > >=20 > > I guess I'm not sure that I understand exactly what this field should b= e indicating, > > even if my implementation does adhere to the recommendation to "use > > standard units such as Bytes" (which, by the way, could probably stand = to be a > > stronger recommendation for a single distinguished unit chosen by the a= uthors). > > That is, if I suppose that the node in question has some common pool of= buffers > > that's shared across queues. Maybe all the buffers are the same size, = maybe > > not. But in order to measure "occupancy", is it more important to know= how > > many bytes are occupied, how many buffers are in use, or what proportio= n of > > the total buffers are in use? Just knowing the number of bytes or buff= ers in use > > does not convey much information if the total capacity is unknown, and = having > > 40 MB of buffers in use would mean something very different for a CPE r= outer vs > > "big iron". Can we give a bit more clarity into at least what portions= of the > > semantics need to be set at a per-namespace level, even if we can't nai= l them > > down more tightly as part of the protocol spec? >=20 > ...FB: Given that different devices are implementing scheduling/buffering= in very different ways, it is hard to come up with anything that would mee= t all expectations. > Hence we're back to the "focus on syntax and leave the semantics and unit= s definition to a particular deployment".=20 > Similar to what I mentioned above, we can add a discussion as you suggest= to draft-brockners-opsawg-ioam-deployment. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 5.4.13 > >=20 > > Schema ID: 3-octet unsigned integer identifying the schema of Opaque > > data. > >=20 > > Just to check my understanding: the interpretation of this schema ID is= per > > IOAM-Namespace, which is mostly going to be something maintained by the > > individual operators. So in some sense each operator will have to main= tain and > > publish (internally) a registry of these Schema IDs and avoid collision= s. Is this the > > sort of thing that is already a common practice, or is there a risk of = operational > > fragility being introduced? >=20 > ...FB: Expectation is exactly what you describe above - i.e., it would be= the operator that maintains an internal registry. > Personally I don't have any experience with Opaque state snapshot deploym= ents. Maybe others can chime in here. >=20 > >=20 > > Furthermore, some of the Namespace IDs are not operator-managed, e.g., > > 0x0000. Is the opaque state snapshot functionality just not going to b= e used for > > those well-known namespaces? If so, we should say so explicitly. >=20 > ...FB: I don't think that there is an intention to exclude any fields fro= m the "Default-Namespace-ID". The Default-Namespace-ID just indicates that = no specific namespace is associated with the IOAM data fields in the packe= t. >=20 >=20 > >=20 > > Section 5.5 > >=20 > > o Random: Unique identifier for the packet (e.g., 64-bits allow for > > the unique identification of 2^64 packets). > >=20 > > We should probably say that this is generated using a cryptographic-str= ength > > PRNG (i.e., not rand()). BCP 106 covers randomness requirements for se= curity. > >=20 > > Also, due to the birthday paradox, an actual 64-bit random identifier w= ill > > produce collisions well before 2^64 packets. Since these identifiers > > (AFAICT) need to be assigned in an uncoordinated fashion, the random > > allocation scheme may well be the best scheme (or "least bad"), but if = that's the > > case I don't think we should make bold statements like "allow for the u= nique > > identification of 2^64 packets". >=20 > ...FB: Good point - and it was also pointed out by other reviewers. And i= t indeed needs to be a random number (see draft-ietf-sfc-proof-of-transit-0= 8, section 3.2.2) - as it represents the constant part of the polynomial us= ed. We'll reword the section accordingly. >=20 > >=20 > > IOAM POT flags: 8-bit. Following flags are defined: > >=20 > > It's slightly surprising to me that the flags are defined as having glo= bal semantics > > across all POT values, as opposed to being interpreted in the context o= f the POT > > type they are used with, but that's not inherently problematic. > >=20 > > Section 5.5.1 > >=20 > > Should we just say that the Namespace-ID, POT Type, and flags are as de= fined in > > Section 5 rather than repeating the definitions wholesale (or, as we cu= rrently do, > > having to modify the definition text slightly)? > > In particular (but not exclusively), it's pretty distracting to have Se= ction 5 refer to > > "Bit 0" and "Bit 1-7" but Section 5.5.1 refer to the "P bit" and "R (7 = bits)" >=20 > ...FB: Good catch. We'll clean this up. Another left-over of "many cooks = (authors) in the kitchen". >=20 > >=20 > > P bit: 1-bit. "Profile-to-use" (P-bit) (most significant bit). > > Indicates which POT-profile is used to generate the Cumulative. > > Any node participating in POT will have a maximum of 2 profiles > > configured that drive the computation of cumulative. The two > > profiles are numbered 0, 1. This bit conveys whether profile 0 or > > profile 1 is used to compute the Cumulative. > >=20 > > Is it worth saying a few more words about how the P bit is used as a "g= eneration > > count" for performing incremental/in-place updates of what profile to u= se, and > > that profile 0 can be repurposed for something new once all uses of its= previous > > interpretation have been removed from the network? ("No" is a fine ans= wer, > > but it might be worth proactively allaying the concern that you can onl= y have > > two profiles, ever.) >=20 > ...FB: We can add a reference to draft-ietf-sfc-proof-of-transit, which d= etails how the profiles are being used. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 5.6 > >=20 > > I suggest giving some guidance as to whether the initial sequence numbe= r should > > (not) start at zero, for the fields indicated by bits 0 and 1. > > I note that draft-gont-numeric-ids-sec-considerations has some discussi= on > > supporting starting at non-zero values. It seems that the "increment b= y one for > > each packet" behavior is needed, though, in order to be able to use thi= s value to > > detect loss. >=20 > ...FB: Good point - and something which IMHO would be a good fit for draf= t-brockners-opsawg-ioam-deployment >=20 > >=20 > > Bit 0 (Most significant bit) When set indicates presence of a > > 64-bit sequence number added to a specific "packet group" > > which is used to detect packet loss, packet reordering, > > or packet duplication within the group. The "packet > > group" is deployment dependent and defined at the IOAM > > encapsulating node e.g. by n-tuple based classification > > of packets. > >=20 > > Bit 1 When set indicates presence of a 32-bit sequence number > > added to a specific "packet group" which is used to > > detect packet loss, packet reordering, or packet > > duplication within that group. The "packet group" is > > deployment dependent and defined at the IOAM > > encapsulating node e.g. by n-tuple based classification > > of packets. > >=20 > > When both of these bits are set, are the contained values agglomerated = into a > > hybrid 96-bit sequence number? If so, in which order? >=20 > ...FB: My understanding so far was either Bit 0 or Bit 1. We can clarify = that in the next rev. I'm happy to see clarification (and have very little opinion about what behavior is chosen). No further comments from me -- everything else either makes sense or is analogous to other discussions, and I trust you will handle analogously. Thanks again for the responses and explanations! -Ben > >=20 > > Bit 2 When set indicates presence of timestamp seconds, > > [...] > > packet is encapsulated into the tunnel. Each > > implementation has to document when the E2E timestamp > > that is going to be put in the packet is retrieved. This > >=20 > > It seems a little awkward that an operator is going to have to base the= ir > > processing logic on knowledge of what *implementation* the encapsulating > > node is, especially on a heterogeneous network. But I suppose it would= be an > > RFC 6919 "MUST (BUT WE KNOW YOU WON'T)" if we said that implementations > > had to allow configuring the different possibilities, based on the IOAM- > > Namespace... >=20 > ...FB: True :-) - this is why we have namespace-ids. The namespace-id wil= l (hopefully) help the backend systems apply the right processing logic to = the data. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 6.3 (POSIX-based Timestamp Format) > >=20 > > The POSIX-based timestamp format is affected by leap seconds; it > > represents the number of seconds since the epoch minus the number > > of leap seconds that have occurred since the epoch. The value of > > a timestamp during or slightly after a leap second could be > > temporarily inaccurate. > >=20 > > (If I'm wrong about the Discuss point, this description seems inconsist= ent with > > the POSIX epoch being midnight TAI.) >=20 > ...FB: You're correct. Already covered in the DISCUSS section above. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 8 > >=20 > > I note that the "RFC Required" policy lets ISE and IRTF stream documents > > allocate values, in theory without any IETF review at all. It seems un= likely that > > this is what is intended in all of the cases where "RFC Required" is sp= ecified, such > > asa the 4-bit IOAM Trace-Flags registry that has only three unallocated > > codepoints. >=20 > ...FB: Discussion on Francesca's DISCUSS concluded that we'd switch to "I= ETF review" - which is the process that all extensions in flight are follow= ing already. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 8.4 > >=20 > > 0: 16 Octet POT data > >=20 > > I'd suggest a slightly more descriptive name, as there may well be othe= r POT > > formats that want to use 16 octets for their data. >=20 > ...FB: Sure. We can add additional description and add the reference to d= raft-ietf-sfc-proof-of-transit. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 8.7 > >=20 > > I suggest removing the sentence "Upon a new allocation request, the > > responsible AD will appoint a designated expert, who will review the al= location > > request." as it is not really accurate (the IESG appoints > > DEs) and is not helpful for the potential registrant. It's arguably al= so needlessly > > restrictive, preventing the IESG from appointing an expert before there= is a > > request to review. >=20 > ...FB: Ack. Will follow your suggestion. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 10 > >=20 > > "Direct Export" sounds like a self-induced DoS attack by traffic amplif= ication, but > > that's probably more a matter to be discussed in that document, not thi= s one. > > (Though, do we need to mention direct export here at all?) >=20 > ...FB: As you know, this is a topic of ongoing discussion in the IPPM WG.= We can remove the reference to direct export from the security considerati= on of this document. draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-direct-export is the more appropr= iate location for the discussion. >=20 > >=20 > > We should probably say that the opaque snapshot, namespace specific dat= a, > > etc., will have security considerations corresponding to their defined = data > > contents that should be described where those formats are defined. >=20 > ...FB: Ack. We'll add this note. >=20 > >=20 > > From a confidentiality perspective, although IOAM options do not > > contain user data, they can be used for network reconnaissance, > >=20 > > Given that we provide multiple fields that essentially carry opaque or = operator- > > defined data, the blanket "do not contain" may be too strong of a state= ment. > > (What if someone decides to put a subscriber identifier in the namespac= e- > > specific data?) So maybe "are not expected to" is more appropriate". >=20 > ...FB: Ack. We'll follow your suggestion. >=20 > >=20 > > allowing attackers to collect information about network paths, > > performance, queue states, buffer occupancy and other information. > >=20 > > One possible application of such reconiassance is to gauge the effectiv= eness of > > an ongoing attack (e.g., if buffers and queues are overflowing). I don= 't know > > whether it's particularly useful to mention that scenario here or not, = though. > >=20 > > IOAM can be used as a means for implementing Denial of Service (DoS) > > attacks, or for amplifying them. For example, a malicious attacker > > can add an IOAM header to packets in order to consume the resources > > of network devices that take part in IOAM or entities that receive, > > collect or analyze the IOAM data. [...] > >=20 > > Messing up the POT data seems worth calling out here as well (though the > > particular behavior when proof of transit fails is not defined in this = document, of > > course). >=20 > ...FB: Ack. We can add a brief note on this here. >=20 > >=20 > > Notably, in most cases IOAM is expected to be deployed in specific > > network domains, thus confining the potential attack vectors to > >=20 > > Where does the "most cases" come from? I thought the definitions restr= icted > > IOAM to the IOAM domain. >=20 > ...FB: Excellent catch! We'll correct this one. >=20 > >=20 > > Indeed, in order to limit the scope of threats > > mentioned above to within the current network domain the network > > operator is expected to enforce policies that prevent IOAM traffic > > from leaking outside of the IOAM domain, and prevent IOAM data from > > outside the domain to be processed and used within the domain. > >=20 > > It would be great if we could provide a bit more detail on the scope of > > consequences if the operator fails to do so. >=20 > ...FB: We can add more detail. That said - and other reviewers brought th= is up as well - the question is whether the discussion of potential risks a= nd consequences really belongs into this document, or should rather be in t= he deployment-focused draft-brockners-opsawg-ioam-deployment. >=20 > >=20 > > Section 12.1 > >=20 > > The 2008 POSIX reference has since been superseded by the 2017 version. >=20 > ...FB: Ack. > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > >=20 > > NITS > >=20 > > Abstract > >=20 > > nits: NSH is not listed as "well known" at the RFC Editor's abbreviatio= n list, so > > should probably be written out in full. Also, please put commas before= and after > > "e.g." (which will presumably help with the spurious double-space as we= ll). > >=20 > > Section 1 > >=20 > > cannot be considered passive. In terms of the classification given > > in [RFC7799] IOAM could be portrayed as Hybrid Type 1. IOAM > >=20 > > RFC 7799 writes it with a majuscule 'I', not the numeral '1'. > >=20 > > Section 3 > >=20 > > Please use the updated RFC 8174 version of the BCP 14 boilerplate. > >=20 > > Section 4 > >=20 > > Scope: This document defines the data fields and associated data > > types for in-situ OAM. The in-situ OAM data field can be > > encapsulated in a variety of protocols, including NSH, Segment > > Routing, Geneve, IPv6, or IPv4. [...] > >=20 > > s/field/fields/, and s/or/and/ > >=20 > > Section 5.3 > >=20 > > A subset or all of the IOAM-Option-Types and their corresponding > > IOAM-Data-Fields can be associated to an IOAM-Namespace. IOAM- > >=20 > > The way this is written seems to imply that any given IOAM-Option-Type = is > > associated with at most one IOAM-Namespace, which I think is not the in= tent. > >=20 > > Namespaces add further context to IOAM-Option-Types and associated > > IOAM-Data-Fields. Any IOAM-Namespace MUST interpret the IOAM-Option- > > Types and associated IOAM-Data-Fields per the definition in this > > document. IOAM-Namespaces group nodes to support different > >=20 > > Presumably this ("MUST interpret") only applies to the option-type and = data > > fields defined in this document? >=20 > ...FB: Ack. We'll add this clarification. >=20 > >=20 > > deployment approaches of IOAM (see a few example use-cases below) as > >=20 > > IIUC the meaning here is "IOAM-Namespaces provide a way to group nodes" > > and would be easier to read if formulated in that manner. > >=20 > > The RFC Editor will probably have a hard time in this section with whic= h things > > that end in 's' are possessives (and thus benefit from an > > apostrophe) and which are not, though it may not be an efficient use of= time to > > try to tidy up before the document gets to them. > >=20 > > o whether IOAM-Option-Type(s) has to be removed from the packet, > > e.g. at a domain edge or domain boundary. > >=20 > > there's a singular/plural mismatch here (irrespective of the "(s)" -- "= whether an > > [option-type] has to be removed" vs "whether [option-types] have to be > > removed" > >=20 > > Section 5.4.2.3 > >=20 > > The "timestamp seconds" field is a 4-octet unsigned integer field. > > Absolute timestamp in seconds that specifies the time at which the > >=20 > > s/Absolute timestamp/It contains the absolute timestamp/ > >=20 > > Section 5.4.2.4 > >=20 > > The "timestamp subseconds" field is a 4-octet unsigned integer field. > > Absolute timestamp in subseconds that specifies the time at which the > >=20 > > s/Absolute timestamp/It contains the absolute timestamp/ > >=20 > > Section 5.4.2.9 > >=20 > > Please use the exact same wording in the description of the Hop_Lim fie= ld that > > was used in Section 5.4.2.1 (or just incorporate that definition by ref= erence). > > (The node_id descriptions properly differ only in the 3-octet vs 7-octe= t phrase.) > >=20 > > Section 5.4.3 > >=20 > > An entry in the "node data list" array can have different formats, > > following the needs of the deployment. [...] > >=20 > > This phrasing seems needlessly confusing. Within a single "node data l= ist" (i.e., a > > single packet), all the list entries have the same format. What we wan= t to be > > describing is that the per-entry format can vary across packets and acr= oss > > deployments. So perhaps just "the format used for the entries in a pac= ket's > > "node data list" array can vary from packet to packet and deployment to > > deployment". > > (Also, there's a singular/plural mismatch between "an entry" and "diffe= rent > > formats".) > >=20 > > Section 5.5, 5.6 > >=20 > > When we talk about how the different Data-Fields "MUST be 4-octet align= ed", > > having the figure show a variable-height entry might be helpful; the cu= rrent > > formulation looks like it's exactly a 32-bit field. > >=20 > > Section 5.5 > >=20 > > IOAM Proof of Transit Option-Type is to support path or service > > function chain [RFC7665] verification use cases. Proof-of-transit > >=20 > > s/is to/is used to/ > >=20 > > Sections 6.1, 6.2, 6.3 > >=20 > > Seconds: specifies the integer portion of the number of seconds > > since the epoch. > >=20 > > I suggest writing out "the PTP epoch", "the NTP epoch", and "the Unix e= poch" in > > the respective sections, to avoid giving the impression (via the defini= te article) > > that there is a single distinguished epoch, when there is not. (Simila= rly for the > > Fractions.) > >=20 > >=20 >=20 > Thanks again for the really thorough review, all your comments and the ni= ts you caught. Greatly appreciated! >=20 > Cheers, Frank >=20 From nobody Thu Jun 24 10:00:14 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B50F3A23C8; Thu, 24 Jun 2021 10:00:09 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.32.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <162455400932.4299.16270975039105859656@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2021 10:00:09 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-13.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2021 17:00:10 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Data Fields for In-situ OAM Authors : Frank Brockners Shwetha Bhandari Tal Mizrahi Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-13.txt Pages : 48 Date : 2021-06-24 Abstract: In-situ Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (IOAM) records operational and telemetry information in the packet while the packet traverses a path in the network. This document discusses the data fields and associated data types for in-situ OAM. In-situ OAM data fields can be encapsulated into a variety of protocols such as NSH, Segment Routing, Geneve, or IPv6. In-situ OAM can be used to complement OAM mechanisms based on, e.g., ICMP or other types of probe packets. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-13 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-13 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Jun 24 10:27:21 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietf.org Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8EA913A24B7; Thu, 24 Jun 2021 10:27:19 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: ippm@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.32.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: ippm@ietf.org Message-ID: <162455563953.18240.17980308616556944896@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2021 10:27:19 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] I-D Action: draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-14.txt X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2021 17:27:20 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the IP Performance Measurement WG of the IETF. Title : Data Fields for In-situ OAM Authors : Frank Brockners Shwetha Bhandari Tal Mizrahi Filename : draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-14.txt Pages : 48 Date : 2021-06-24 Abstract: In-situ Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (IOAM) records operational and telemetry information in the packet while the packet traverses a path in the network. This document discusses the data fields and associated data types for in-situ OAM. In-situ OAM data fields can be encapsulated into a variety of protocols such as NSH, Segment Routing, Geneve, or IPv6. In-situ OAM can be used to complement OAM mechanisms based on, e.g., ICMP or other types of probe packets. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-14 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-ippm-ioam-data-14 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Jun 30 11:00:12 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A1E73A24DD; Wed, 30 Jun 2021 11:00:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.089 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.089 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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boundary="_000_BY3PR13MB47872479EB11E92CB77F69CD9A019BY3PR13MB4787namp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: Futurewei.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthAs: Internal X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-AuthSource: BY3PR13MB4787.namprd13.prod.outlook.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 1b16d70e-c64d-4559-1f62-08d93bf0dfe3 X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 30 Jun 2021 17:59:58.3023 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 0fee8ff2-a3b2-4018-9c75-3a1d5591fedc X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-mailboxtype: HOSTED X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-userprincipalname: lwjiZsT7qjFUsQR41BNW8Xn7JFYdDXXI+irpkLiFBN6TOOFqKhOCVEml0MgeB7/xKU/0Qz5sLeDTw1tGz7yBQw== X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BY3PR13MB5009 Archived-At: Subject: [ippm] Request for WG adoption X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 30 Jun 2021 18:00:11 -0000 --_000_BY3PR13MB47872479EB11E92CB77F69CD9A019BY3PR13MB4787namp_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dear IPPM Chairs, I'm writing to request the IPPM WG to adopt the following draft "Postcard-b= ased On-Path Flow Data Telemetry using Packet Marking" https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-song-ippm-postcard-based-telemetry/ Now the draft is in -09 version and we have colleagues from Cisco, ZTE, Hua= wei as well as some network operators to coauthor this work. As another on-path telemetry technique, PBT based on packet marking complem= ents the other works such as IOAM, DEX, and HTS to make the ecosystem compl= ete, and I believe each can find its application scenarios. For example, th= e PBT based on packet marking has been applied in "draft-ietf-6man-spring-s= rv6-oam" (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-6man-spring-srv6= -oam) which I believe has passed the last call, but the detailed mechanisms= such as configuration, data format, and export method are not covered ther= e. Given the technique is equally applicable to other types of networks, we= believe it's necessary to have a document to formalized the method. The draft has undergone a long line of developments since it was published = in 2018. It originally covers two related but different techniques. One was= latter stripped off to form an independent draft, IOAM DEX, which has been= adopted by IPPM. The remaining one, PBT based on packet marking, is the co= re of the current draft. Thanks for the numerous discussions and feedbacks = from the WG, we now have a draft with focused direction and relatively matu= re content. Given the community interest and the technical merit, we now request the WG= to adopt the draft and engage the WG to work on it. Please let us know if there are any concerns, comments, and suggestions. = Thank you very much for your consideration! Best regards, Haoyu --_000_BY3PR13MB47872479EB11E92CB77F69CD9A019BY3PR13MB4787namp_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Dear IPPM Chairs,

 

I’m writing to request the IPPM WG to adopt th= e following draft “Postcard-based On-Path Flow Data Telemetry using P= acket Marking”

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-s= ong-ippm-postcard-based-telemetry/

 

Now the draft is in -09 version and we have colleagu= es from Cisco, ZTE, Huawei as well as some network operators to coauthor th= is work.

As another on-path telemetry technique, PBT based on= packet marking complements the other works such as IOAM, DEX, and HTS to m= ake the ecosystem complete, and I believe each can find its application sce= narios. For example, the PBT based on packet marking has been applied in “draft-ietf-6man-spring-srv6-o= am” (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-6man-spr= ing-srv6-oam) which I believe has passed the last call, but the detailed mechanisms such as configuration, data format,= and export method are not covered there. Given the technique is equally ap= plicable to other types of networks, we believe it’s necessary to hav= e a  document to formalized the method.

 

The draft has undergone a long line of developments = since it was published in 2018. It originally covers two related but differ= ent techniques. One was latter stripped off to form an independent draft, I= OAM DEX, which has been adopted by IPPM. The remaining one, PBT based on packet marking, is the core of the c= urrent draft. Thanks for the numerous discussions and feedbacks from the WG= , we now have a draft with focused direction and relatively mature content.=

 

Given the community interest and the technical merit= , we now request the WG to adopt the draft and engage the WG to work on it.

Please let us know if there are any concerns, commen= ts, and suggestions.   Thank you very much for your consideration= !  

 

Best regards,

Haoyu

--_000_BY3PR13MB47872479EB11E92CB77F69CD9A019BY3PR13MB4787namp_-- From nobody Wed Jun 30 18:42:51 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ippm@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EC583A0B8C; Wed, 30 Jun 2021 18:42:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9oHkruDIZI_n; Wed, 30 Jun 2021 18:42:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from frasgout.his.huawei.com (frasgout.his.huawei.com [185.176.79.56]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A76493A0B8A; Wed, 30 Jun 2021 18:42:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fraeml707-chm.china.huawei.com (unknown [172.18.147.206]) by frasgout.his.huawei.com (SkyGuard) with ESMTP id 4GFgkN2zTtz6H6nQ; Thu, 1 Jul 2021 09:34:52 +0800 (CST) Received: from nkgeml705-chm.china.huawei.com (10.98.57.154) by fraeml707-chm.china.huawei.com (10.206.15.35) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2176.2; Thu, 1 Jul 2021 03:42:39 +0200 Received: from nkgeml707-chm.china.huawei.com (10.98.57.157) by nkgeml705-chm.china.huawei.com (10.98.57.154) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_128_GCM_SHA256) id 15.1.2176.2; Thu, 1 Jul 2021 09:42:37 +0800 Received: from nkgeml707-chm.china.huawei.com ([10.98.57.157]) by nkgeml707-chm.china.huawei.com ([10.98.57.157]) with mapi id 15.01.2176.012; Thu, 1 Jul 2021 09:42:37 +0800 From: Tianran Zhou To: Haoyu Song , IPPM Chairs , IETF IPPM WG CC: "draft-song-ippm-postcard-based-telemetry@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: Request for WG adoption Thread-Index: Addt1c+1WBY/cdcRSfGA5wbarzJ+TgARG1Dw Date: Thu, 1 Jul 2021 01:42:37 +0000 Message-ID: <95ca6914dccb4810aba59826db7c5a45@huawei.com> References: In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.108.243.128] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_95ca6914dccb4810aba59826db7c5a45huaweicom_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [ippm] Request for WG adoption X-BeenThere: ippm@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: IETF IP Performance Metrics Working Group List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 01 Jul 2021 01:42:49 -0000 --_000_95ca6914dccb4810aba59826db7c5a45huaweicom_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I support the WG to consider adoption of this draft. Tianran From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Haoyu Song Sent: Thursday, July 1, 2021 2:00 AM To: IPPM Chairs ; IETF IPPM WG Cc: draft-song-ippm-postcard-based-telemetry@ietf.org Subject: [ippm] Request for WG adoption Dear IPPM Chairs, I'm writing to request the IPPM WG to adopt the following draft "Postcard-b= ased On-Path Flow Data Telemetry using Packet Marking" https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-song-ippm-postcard-based-telemetry/ Now the draft is in -09 version and we have colleagues from Cisco, ZTE, Hua= wei as well as some network operators to coauthor this work. As another on-path telemetry technique, PBT based on packet marking complem= ents the other works such as IOAM, DEX, and HTS to make the ecosystem compl= ete, and I believe each can find its application scenarios. For example, th= e PBT based on packet marking has been applied in "draft-ietf-6man-spring-s= rv6-oam" (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-6man-spring-srv6= -oam) which I believe has passed the last call, but the detailed mechanisms= such as configuration, data format, and export method are not covered ther= e. Given the technique is equally applicable to other types of networks, we= believe it's necessary to have a document to formalized the method. The draft has undergone a long line of developments since it was published = in 2018. It originally covers two related but different techniques. One was= latter stripped off to form an independent draft, IOAM DEX, which has been= adopted by IPPM. The remaining one, PBT based on packet marking, is the co= re of the current draft. Thanks for the numerous discussions and feedbacks = from the WG, we now have a draft with focused direction and relatively matu= re content. Given the community interest and the technical merit, we now request the WG= to adopt the draft and engage the WG to work on it. Please let us know if there are any concerns, comments, and suggestions. = Thank you very much for your consideration! Best regards, Haoyu --_000_95ca6914dccb4810aba59826db7c5a45huaweicom_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I support the WG to co= nsider adoption of this draft.

 

Tianran

 

From: ippm [mailto:ippm-bounces@ietf.org] = On Behalf Of Haoyu Song
Sent: Thursday, July 1, 2021 2:00 AM
To: IPPM Chairs <ippm-chairs@ietf.org>; IETF IPPM WG <ippm@= ietf.org>
Cc: draft-song-ippm-postcard-based-telemetry@ietf.org
Subject: [ippm] Request for WG adoption

 

Dear IPPM Chairs,

 

I’m writing to request the IPPM WG to adopt th= e following draft “Postcard-based On-Path Flow Data Telemetry using P= acket Marking”

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-s= ong-ippm-postcard-based-telemetry/

 

Now the draft is in -09 version and we have colleagu= es from Cisco, ZTE, Huawei as well as some network operators to coauthor th= is work.

As another on-path telemetry technique, PBT based on= packet marking complements the other works such as IOAM, DEX, and HTS to m= ake the ecosystem complete, and I believe each can find its application sce= narios. For example, the PBT based on packet marking has been applied in “draft-ietf-6man-spring-srv6-o= am” (https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-6man-spr= ing-srv6-oam) which I believe has passed the last call, but the detailed mechanisms such as configuration, data format,= and export method are not covered there. Given the technique is equally ap= plicable to other types of networks, we believe it’s necessary to hav= e a  document to formalized the method.

 

The draft has undergone a long line of developments = since it was published in 2018. It originally covers two related but differ= ent techniques. One was latter stripped off to form an independent draft, I= OAM DEX, which has been adopted by IPPM. The remaining one, PBT based on packet marking, is the core of the c= urrent draft. Thanks for the numerous discussions and feedbacks from the WG= , we now have a draft with focused direction and relatively mature content.=

 

Given the community interest and the technical merit= , we now request the WG to adopt the draft and engage the WG to work on it.

Please let us know if there are any concerns, commen= ts, and suggestions.   Thank you very much for your consideration= !  

 

Best regards,

Haoyu

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