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From: "Chantal Ladouce" <chantal.ladouce@upperside.fr>
To: <iptel@ietf.org>
Date: Thu, 1 Dec 2005 15:12:44 +0100
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Subject: [Iptel] Wireless/WiFi Convergence Conference - Call for Papers 
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The Wireless/WiFi Convergence Conference will be held in Paris on May 16 to
May 19, 2006

 

http://www.upperside.fr/wirelessconvergence2006/wwconvergence2006cfp.htm

 

It is still time to submit proposals. Organizers are looking for UMA papers.

 


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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
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10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>The <strong><b><font face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-family:Arial'>Wireless/WiFi Convergence =
Conference</span></font></b></strong>
will be held in <st1:place w:st=3D"on"><st1:City w:st=3D"on"><span =
class=3Dstyle24>Paris</span></st1:City></st1:place><span
class=3Dstyle24> on May 16 to May 19, 2006</span></span></font><font =
size=3D2><span
lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
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style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><a
href=3D"http://www.upperside.fr/wirelessconvergence2006/wwconvergence2006=
cfp.htm">http://www.upperside.fr/wirelessconvergence2006/wwconvergence200=
6cfp.htm</a><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>It is still time to submit proposals. =
Organizers are
looking for UMA papers.</span></font><font size=3D2><span lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Thu Dec 01 09:35:01 2005
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From: zaghouani hamdi <zag_hamdi@yahoo.fr>
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Subject: [Iptel] how to add a route header 
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hi,

I m using SER server.

the architecture : SipPhone -- server_1 --- server2

I want to create a fonction that allow me to add a new
header. I want to add a new route header, containing
the sip address of server_2, in the message received
by server_1 from SipPhone.

I  write the fonction below and it works(the route
header is added to the sip message). to test my sip
servers(small network), I m using SipPhone to
regester.=20

the problem is that after registering and
de-registering many times (random  number)the server
is shutting down (children process killed). ( for
exemple , in the 7th registration the server shut
down). I think that the problem is due to this
fonction because when I dont put a " Route header" or
I use the fonction "append_fh" in ser.cfg file instead
of mine to add the header , I dont get this problem.

My fonction is :
 =20
int add_hf(struct sip_msg *msg, char* prefix, char*
content, char* suffix) {
	char* hf;
	struct lump* anchor;
	int len =3D strlen(content);

	if (prefix !=3D NULL)
		len +=3D strlen(prefix);
	if (suffix !=3D NULL)
		len +=3D strlen(suffix);

	hf =3D (char*)malloc(len * sizeof(char) + 1);
=09

	if (prefix !=3D NULL)
		strcat(hf, prefix);
	strcat(hf, content);
	if (suffix !=3D NULL)
		strcat(hf, suffix);
	hf[len+1] =3D '\0';
=09
	parse_headers(msg, HDR_EOH, 0);
	anchor =3D anchor_lump(msg , msg->headers->name.s -
msg->buf, 0, 0);
	insert_new_lump_before(anchor, hf, len, 0);

	return 1;
}

thinks a lot=20

Hamdi


=09

=09
	=09
_________________________________________________________________________=
__=20
Appel audio GRATUIT partout dans le monde avec le nouveau Yahoo! Messenge=
r=20
T=E9l=E9chargez cette version sur http://fr.messenger.yahoo.com

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Mon Dec 05 13:50:08 2005
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Message-ID: <43948BC9.5010908@lucent.com>
Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 12:49:45 -0600
From: "Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com>
Organization: Wireless Networks Research and Development
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Subject: [Iptel] Post-nits version of trunk-group submitted
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Folks:

I have submitted the latest version of trunk-group, following the
nits review.

I would request the chairs to send this document to the IESG
once it becomes available in the archives (I will ping the chairs
privately when it is updated in the archives).

The changes socialized on the working group list (please
see http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/iptel/current/msg00973.html)
have been incorporated in the final version.

Until it becomes available in the IETF archives, you can get a copy
from:

http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-05.txt
http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-05.html

Additionally, for those interested in just the changes, a
diff-marked copy between -04 and -05 is also available at:

http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/tg-04-05-diffmarked.txt

This concludes this particular I-D's arduous journey.  On behalf of
my co-author, I would like to thank all of those who have
participated in the discussions as well as those who have helped
review it.

Thank you.

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani, Ph.D.  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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_______________________________________________
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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Mon Dec 05 13:56:31 2005
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Message-ID: <43948D4F.9010901@lucent.com>
Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 12:56:15 -0600
From: "Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com>
Organization: Wireless Networks Research and Development
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Cc: Cullen Jennings <fluffy@cisco.com>
Subject: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
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Folks:

I have submitted the latest version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg.

I will like to request the chairs to determine whether the WG
will adopt this work as an agenda item.  Three I-Ds in IPTEL depend
on the establishment of a tel URI IANA registry -- draft-ietf-
iptel-tel-enumdi, draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np and draft-ietf-iptel-
trunk-group.  Consequently, there may be a normative(?) dependency
of these I-Ds as they go forward on this work.

Until the draft becomes available in the archives, you can view
it at:

http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg-01.txt
http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg-01.html

Thanks,

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani, Ph.D.  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Mon Dec 05 16:32:56 2005
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Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 16:32:14 -0500
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Subject: Re: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
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Vijay K. Gurbani wrote:
> Folks:
> 
> I have submitted the latest version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg.
> 
> I will like to request the chairs to determine whether the WG
> will adopt this work as an agenda item. 

well lets take a straw poll

all in favor ..

all opposed

the in 'favor' have it ..

First lets assume this is a WG item now.

Given the level of dependencies here I think we can despense with too 
much debate and simply A. submit this to the AD's now B or go to WGLC.




  Three I-Ds in IPTEL depend
> on the establishment of a tel URI IANA registry -- draft-ietf-
> iptel-tel-enumdi, draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np and draft-ietf-iptel-
> trunk-group.  Consequently, there may be a normative(?) dependency
> of these I-Ds as they go forward on this work.
> 
> Until the draft becomes available in the archives, you can view
> it at:
> 
> http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg-01.txt
> http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg-01.html
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> - vijay
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Iptel mailing list
> Iptel@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iptel


-- 


 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Richard Shockey, Director - Member of Technical Staff
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Subject: Re: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
References: <43948D4F.9010901@lucent.com> <4394B1DE.3000303@shockey.us>
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Richard Shockey wrote:
> well lets take a straw poll
> 
> all in favor ..
> 
> all opposed
> 
> the in 'favor' have it ..
> 
> First lets assume this is a WG item now.

Wow!  This is the fastest road to a WG agenda item I've ever had
the pleasure of being a part of ;-)

> Given the level of dependencies here I think we can despense with too 
> much debate and simply A. submit this to the AD's now B or go to WGLC.

Any is fine with me ... if (A), it can proceed as a independent
submission shepherded by the ADs, or if (B), I can re-submit as
draft-ietfp-iptel-tel-reg-00.

I will note that the draft has normative language, and I am
not too sure whether independent submissions can become Proposed
standards, or whether a WG needs to officially forward it to
IESG for submission as a Proposed standard.

Just let me know what to do and I can expeditiously do it...

Thanks,

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani, Ph.D.  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Mon Dec 05 17:12:45 2005
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Vijay K. Gurbani wrote:
> Richard Shockey wrote:
> 
>> well lets take a straw poll
>>
>> all in favor ..
>>
>> all opposed
>>
>> the in 'favor' have it ..
>>
>> First lets assume this is a WG item now.
> 
> 
> Wow!  This is the fastest road to a WG agenda item I've ever had
> the pleasure of being a part of ;-)
> 
>> Given the level of dependencies here I think we can despense with too 
>> much debate and simply A. submit this to the AD's now B or go to WGLC.
> 
> 
> Any is fine with me ... if (A), it can proceed as a independent
> submission shepherded by the ADs, or if (B), I can re-submit as
> draft-ietfp-iptel-tel-reg-00.

Frankly I dont care which procedure to use but the need for a registry 
is clear and this document neatly solves the problem.

Plus it would be very very helpful to move those other documents along 
into WGLC at the same time.

> 
> I will note that the draft has normative language, and I am
> not too sure whether independent submissions can become Proposed
> standards, or whether a WG needs to officially forward it to
> IESG for submission as a Proposed standard.
> 
> Just let me know what to do and I can expeditiously do it...

Well the WG chairs need to express some preference as to which tactics 
the prefer to use here but the desire to "get er done" is rather strong.

> 
> Thanks,

No ..thank you :-)

> 
> - vijay


-- 


 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Richard Shockey, Director - Member of Technical Staff
NeuStar Inc.
46000 Center Oak Plaza  -   Sterling, VA  20166
sip:rshockey(at)iptel.org   sip:57141(at)fwd.pulver.com
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<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Mon Dec 05 23:47:29 2005
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I'm not sure on how we want to do this but ... seems like we would not want
an IANA registration in here if we are doing it in the other document.
Alternatively, we could have the other document create the registry but not
put any values in it then have this document put in it's values. I had
originally gone the other way so that this document did not normatively
depend on the one that did the IANA registration. I can see either way
working but either way, I think we need to change one of the documents.


On 12/5/05 10:49 AM, "Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com> wrote:

> Folks:
> 
> I have submitted the latest version of trunk-group, following the
> nits review.
> 
> I would request the chairs to send this document to the IESG
> once it becomes available in the archives (I will ping the chairs
> privately when it is updated in the archives).
> 
> The changes socialized on the working group list (please
> see http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/iptel/current/msg00973.html)
> have been incorporated in the final version.
> 
> Until it becomes available in the IETF archives, you can get a copy
> from:
> 
> http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-05.txt
> http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-05.html
> 
> Additionally, for those interested in just the changes, a
> diff-marked copy between -04 and -05 is also available at:
> 
> http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/tg-04-05-diffmarked.txt
> 
> This concludes this particular I-D's arduous journey.  On behalf of
> my co-author, I would like to thank all of those who have
> participated in the discussions as well as those who have helped
> review it.
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> - vijay

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There still does not seem to be a 02 version of this draft in the directory.
Sometime soon could you guys resubmit. You might want to make an informative
reference to the document with the IANA registrations.

On 11/1/05 5:16 PM, "lconroy" <lconroy@insensate.co.uk> wrote:

> Hi Cullen, folks,
>   Well spotted.
> Why Internet-drafts ->silently<- dropped the original attempt at -02
> I have no idea.
> herewith the new, improved, -02 draft with updated boilerplate.
> (from experience, if we submit it as -03, then it will be rejected as
> it replaces -01).
> 
> I also include an html file with the -01 to -02 delta from rfcdiff.
> 
> In terms of the review, yes - there is only one real change to the
> body text, and that
> was to remove a typo (see the delta web page for details).
> 
> BTW, here is the idnits report on the new draft:
> -----------------------------------------------
> idnits 1.82
> 
> tmp/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-enumdi-02.txt:
> 
> 
>    Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ID-Checklist.html:
> 
>      Checking conformance with RFC 3978/3979 boilerplate...
> 
>      the boilerplate looks good.
>      No nits found.
> 
>    Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-
> guidelines.txt:
>      Nothing found here (but these checks do not cover all of
>      1id-guidelines.txt yet).
> 
>    Miscellaneous warnings:
>      None.
> 
>      No nits found.
> -----------------------------------------------
> 
> enjoy - this one will go into internet-drafts after IETF shadow.
> 
> all the best,
>    Lawrence
> 
> 
> On 29 Oct 2005, at 17:33, Cullen Jennings wrote:
>> > Ok, I'm pretty sure I have tracked down what happened to this. The IPR
>> > statement is wrong and it was rejected. It looks like it has the
>> > 3667 IPR
>> > boiler plate and it needs the 3978. Anything submitted after last May
>> > without the 3978 has been rejected.
>> >
>> > Check you xml has ipr="full3978". Run idnits. XML2RFC will generate
>> > many
>> > things that contain all kinds of problems including lines too wide,
>> > invalid
>> > characters, and bad IPR.
>> >
>> >
>>> >> From a review point of view, it looks like there is no difference
>>> >> from the 01 version to the 02 version that got mailed to the list.
>>> >> Is that correct?
>> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Iptel mailing list
> Iptel@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iptel



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<HTML>
<HEAD>
<TITLE>Re: [Iptel] idnits draft-ietf-iptel-tel-enumdi-01</TITLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY>
<FONT FACE=3D"Verdana, Helvetica, Arial"><SPAN STYLE=3D'font-size:12.0px'><BR>
There still does not seem to be a 02 version of this draft in the directory=
. Sometime soon could you guys resubmit. You might want to make an informati=
ve reference to the document with the IANA registrations. <BR>
<BR>
On 11/1/05 5:16 PM, &quot;lconroy&quot; &lt;lconroy@insensate.co.uk&gt; wro=
te:<BR>
<BR>
</SPAN></FONT><BLOCKQUOTE><FONT SIZE=3D"2"><FONT FACE=3D"Monaco, Courier New"><=
SPAN STYLE=3D'font-size:10.0px'>Hi Cullen, folks,<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;Well spotted.<BR>
Why Internet-drafts -&gt;silently&lt;- dropped the original attempt at -02 =
&nbsp;<BR>
I have no idea.<BR>
herewith the new, improved, -02 draft with updated boilerplate.<BR>
(from experience, if we submit it as -03, then it will be rejected as &nbsp=
;<BR>
it replaces -01).<BR>
<BR>
I also include an html file with the -01 to -02 delta from rfcdiff.<BR>
<BR>
In terms of the review, yes - there is only one real change to the &nbsp;<B=
R>
body text, and that<BR>
was to remove a typo (see the delta web page for details).<BR>
<BR>
BTW, here is the idnits report on the new draft:<BR>
-----------------------------------------------<BR>
idnits 1.82<BR>
<BR>
tmp/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-enumdi-02.txt:<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Checking nits according to <a href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/I=
D-Checklist.html:">http://www.ietf.org/ID-Checklist.html:</a><BR>
<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Checking conformance with RFC 3978/3979 boile=
rplate...<BR>
<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;the boilerplate looks good.<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;No nits found.<BR>
<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Checking nits according to <a href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/i=
etf/1id-">http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-</a> <BR>
guidelines.txt:<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Nothing found here (but these checks do not c=
over all of<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;1id-guidelines.txt yet).<BR>
<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Miscellaneous warnings:<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;None.<BR>
<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;No nits found.<BR>
-----------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
enjoy - this one will go into internet-drafts after IETF shadow.<BR>
<BR>
all the best,<BR>
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Lawrence<BR>
<HR ALIGN=3DCENTER SIZE=3D"3" WIDTH=3D"95%"><BR>
On 29 Oct 2005, at 17:33, Cullen Jennings wrote:<BR>
&gt; Ok, I'm pretty sure I have tracked down what happened to this. The IPR=
<BR>
&gt; statement is wrong and it was rejected. It looks like it has the &nbsp=
;<BR>
&gt; 3667 IPR<BR>
&gt; boiler plate and it needs the 3978. Anything submitted after last May<=
BR>
&gt; without the 3978 has been rejected.<BR>
&gt;<BR>
&gt; Check you xml has ipr=3D&quot;full3978&quot;. Run idnits. XML2RFC will g=
enerate &nbsp;<BR>
&gt; many<BR>
&gt; things that contain all kinds of problems including lines too wide, &n=
bsp;<BR>
&gt; invalid<BR>
&gt; characters, and bad IPR.<BR>
&gt;<BR>
&gt;<BR>
&gt;&gt; From a review point of view, it looks like there is no difference =
&nbsp;<BR>
&gt;&gt; from the 01 version to the 02 version that got mailed to the list.=
 &nbsp;<BR>
&gt;&gt; Is that correct?<BR>
&gt;<BR>
<HR ALIGN=3DCENTER SIZE=3D"3" WIDTH=3D"95%">_____________________________________=
__________<BR>
Iptel mailing list<BR>
Iptel@ietf.org<BR>
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iptel<BR>
</SPAN></FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE><FONT SIZE=3D"2"><FONT FACE=3D"Monaco, Courie=
r New"><SPAN STYLE=3D'font-size:10.0px'><BR>
</SPAN></FONT></FONT>
</BODY>
</HTML>


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Date: Mon, 05 Dec 2005 20:38:18 -0800
Subject: Re: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
From: Cullen Jennings <fluffy@cisco.com>
To: Richard Shockey <richard@shockey.us>, "Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com>
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There has been no comments that said we did not need this draft or comments
that we had it all wrong. It is largely a procedural draft to register work
we already have in progress. I think I am with Richard here. Let's move this
forward as WG draft under the existing milestones. Please resubmit as a WG
draft and I will request publication along with the other draft(s).

On a side note, it is not clear to me that the other drafts have to
normatively depend on this this draft. They could just have no IANA
considerations and we make this draft depend on all of them (like it does
right now). 



On 12/5/05 2:12 PM, "Richard Shockey" <richard@shockey.us> wrote:

> Vijay K. Gurbani wrote:
>> Richard Shockey wrote:
>> 
>>> well lets take a straw poll
>>> 
>>> all in favor ..
>>> 
>>> all opposed
>>> 
>>> the in 'favor' have it ..
>>> 
>>> First lets assume this is a WG item now.
>> 
>> 
>> Wow!  This is the fastest road to a WG agenda item I've ever had
>> the pleasure of being a part of ;-)
>> 
>>> Given the level of dependencies here I think we can despense with too
>>> much debate and simply A. submit this to the AD's now B or go to WGLC.
>> 
>> 
>> Any is fine with me ... if (A), it can proceed as a independent
>> submission shepherded by the ADs, or if (B), I can re-submit as
>> draft-ietfp-iptel-tel-reg-00.
> 
> Frankly I dont care which procedure to use but the need for a registry
> is clear and this document neatly solves the problem.
> 
> Plus it would be very very helpful to move those other documents along
> into WGLC at the same time.
> 
>> 
>> I will note that the draft has normative language, and I am
>> not too sure whether independent submissions can become Proposed
>> standards, or whether a WG needs to officially forward it to
>> IESG for submission as a Proposed standard.
>> 
>> Just let me know what to do and I can expeditiously do it...
> 
> Well the WG chairs need to express some preference as to which tactics
> the prefer to use here but the desire to "get er done" is rather strong.
> 
>> 
>> Thanks,
> 
> No ..thank you :-)
> 
>> 
>> - vijay
> 

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Subject: Re: [Iptel] Sending draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np to IESG
From: Cullen Jennings <fluffy@cisco.com>
To: Richard Shockey <richard@shockey.us>
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Hi all, 

I hoping that someone can do a NITS review of this draft and send James
comments so he can resubmit a version I can request publication on.

Thanks, Cullen


On 10/29/05 1:15 PM, "Richard Shockey" <richard@shockey.us> wrote:

> Cullen Jennings wrote:
>> I reviewed this and would like one other person to do a careful NITS review
>> of of draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np-07 and send any typos to James and list. Can
>> someone please volunteer for this.
> 
> Sure .. I'll ask Alex Mayrhofer to take a look at it ASAP he's now ENUM
> WG Secretary and Patrik and I are having him run the NITS review on all
> our documents.
> 
>> 
>> Once James submits a new version I plan to submit this to IESG the day it
>> gets in the drafts directory which could be as early as Nov 7. This was
>> already WGLC and the comments from WGLC were incorporated.
>> 
>> Cullen
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> Iptel mailing list
>> Iptel@ietf.org
>> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iptel
>> 
> 

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From: lconroy <lconroy@insensate.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 10:30:06 +0000
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Hi Folks,
  me too :)

Can I ASSUME that there will be a draft-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt out  
there RSN?

Also, can I ASSUME that it will be as -jennings-tel-reg (i.e. include  
the
IANA Registrations in itself)? Personally, I'd like that.

I think that means we can include a 1 line IANA Considerations section
with an informative ref. to this putative WG draft inside the -02 of
enumdi - will this work?

all the best,
   Lawrence

On 6 Dec 2005, at 04:38, Cullen Jennings wrote:
> There has been no comments that said we did not need this draft or  
> comments
> that we had it all wrong. It is largely a procedural draft to  
> register work
> we already have in progress. I think I am with Richard here. Let's  
> move this
> forward as WG draft under the existing milestones. Please resubmit  
> as a WG
> draft and I will request publication along with the other draft(s).
>
> On a side note, it is not clear to me that the other drafts have to
> normatively depend on this this draft. They could just have no IANA
> considerations and we make this draft depend on all of them (like  
> it does
> right now).
>
> On 12/5/05 2:12 PM, "Richard Shockey" <richard@shockey.us> wrote:
>> Vijay K. Gurbani wrote:
>>> Richard Shockey wrote:
>>>> well lets take a straw poll
>>>> all in favor ..
>>>>
>>>> all opposed
>>>>
>>>> the in 'favor' have it ..
>>>> First lets assume this is a WG item now.
>>> Wow!  This is the fastest road to a WG agenda item I've ever had
>>> the pleasure of being a part of ;-)


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From: lconroy <lconroy@insensate.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
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Hi again folks,
   I of course was asking for a draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt.

On 6 Dec 2005, at 10:30, lconroy wrote:
> <snip>
> Can I ASSUME that there will be a draft-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt out  
> there RSN?
<snip>

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Subject: RE: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
Date: Tue, 6 Dec 2005 12:27:14 +0100
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Thread-Topic: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
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From: "Stastny Richard" <Richard.Stastny@oefeg.at>
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	"Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com>
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Me too

Richard

> -----Original Message-----
> From: iptel-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iptel-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf
Of
> lconroy
> Sent: Tuesday, December 06, 2005 11:35 AM
> To: Cullen Jennings; Vijay K. Gurbani
> Cc: iptel@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg
> submitted
>=20
> Hi again folks,
>    I of course was asking for a draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt.
>=20
> On 6 Dec 2005, at 10:30, lconroy wrote:
> > <snip>
> > Can I ASSUME that there will be a draft-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt out
> > there RSN?
> <snip>
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Iptel mailing list
> Iptel@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iptel

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Tue Dec 06 08:04:28 2005
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Cullen Jennings wrote:
> Hi all, 
> 
> I hoping that someone can do a NITS review of this draft and send James
> comments so he can resubmit a version I can request publication on.

I'm going to review this. I'll try to do it by tomorrow, but i'm a bit 
"disconnected" here at the ITU ;)

cheers

alex

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Cullen Jennings wrote:
> I'm not sure on how we want to do this but ... seems like we would not want
> an IANA registration in here if we are doing it in the other document.
> Alternatively, we could have the other document create the registry but not
> put any values in it then have this document put in it's values. I had
> originally gone the other way so that this document did not normatively
> depend on the one that did the IANA registration. I can see either way
> working but either way, I think we need to change one of the documents.

Cullen, all:

In the spirit of least resistance, I will stick with what Cullen
had in mind originally; i.e., the IANA registration for trunk-group,
tel-enumdi, and tel-np (and rfc3966) will be done in tel-reg.

I will put an empty IANA registration in trunk-group and resubmit.
As an FYI, of the remaining two I-Ds, tel-np does not have any IANA
Consideration sections (a nit) and tel-enumdi has an empty one.

Thanks,

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani, Ph.D.  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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Message-ID: <4395AB53.5020506@lucent.com>
Date: Tue, 06 Dec 2005 09:16:35 -0600
From: "Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com>
Organization: Wireless Networks Research and Development
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To: Cullen Jennings <fluffy@cisco.com>
Subject: Re: [Iptel] Revised version of draft-jennings-iptel-tel-reg submitted
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Cullen Jennings wrote:
> There has been no comments that said we did not need this draft or
> comments that we had it all wrong. It is largely a procedural draft
> to register work we already have in progress. I think I am with
> Richard here. Let's move this forward as WG draft under the existing
> milestones. Please resubmit as a WG draft and I will request
> publication along with the other draft(s).

OK, will do.

> On a side note, it is not clear to me that the other drafts have to 
> normatively depend on this this draft. They could just have no IANA 
> considerations and we make this draft depend on all of them (like it
> does right now).

OK (see previous email on trunk-group thread).

Thanks,

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani, Ph.D.  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Tue Dec 06 10:55:20 2005
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lconroy wrote:
> Hi Folks,
>  me too :)
> 
> Can I ASSUME that there will be a draft-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt out  there 
> RSN?

Yes .. and everyting can go to WGLC

> 
> Also, can I ASSUME that it will be as -jennings-tel-reg (i.e. include  the
> IANA Registrations in itself)? Personally, I'd like that.
> 
> I think that means we can include a 1 line IANA Considerations section
> with an informative ref. to this putative WG draft inside the -02 of
> enumdi - will this work?

Yes .. and resubmit ASAP


> 
> all the best,
>   Lawrence
> 

-- 


 >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Richard Shockey, Director - Member of Technical Staff
NeuStar Inc.
46000 Center Oak Plaza  -   Sterling, VA  20166
sip:rshockey(at)iptel.org   sip:57141(at)fwd.pulver.com
ENUM +87810-13313-31331
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Fax: +1 815.333.1237
<mailto:richard(at)shockey.us> or
<mailto:richard.shockey(at)neustar.biz>
<http://www.neustar.biz> ; <http://www.enum.org>
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Wed Dec 07 10:38:37 2005
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Folks:

I have submitted draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.

Until it becomes available in the archives, you can get it from

http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt
http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.html

Thanks.

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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Subject: [Iptel] draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-06 submitted
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Folks:

I have submitted draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-06.  Until it
is available in the archives, you can get a copy from:

http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-06.txt
http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-06.html

The only change from -05 is the removal of matter in the "IANA
consideration" section.  It now simply reads:

    This specification requires no IANA actions beyond those
    specified in [7].

I understand that something along these lines are what the other
authors of the I-Ds (enumdi and tel-np) are going to use.

Thanks,

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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Subject: [Iptel] how to add a hdr_field in sip structure ?
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 hi,
 =20
  please, how can I add a "hdr_field" in "sip_msg" structure ?.(I want to=
 add a  "path" header).
 =20
  what I did : I added the field in "sip_msg" structure and I compiled  t=
he SER server with "make all" and I run it.  when I try to  register with=
 a SIP client , the server shutdown.
 =20
  thinks a lot
 =20
  Hamdi   =20
 =20

	=09
---------------------------------
 Appel audio GRATUIT partout dans le monde avec le nouveau Yahoo! Messeng=
er
 T=E9l=E9chargez le ici ! =20
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<div id=3D"RTEContent">&nbsp;hi,<br>  <br>  please, how can I add a "hdr_=
field" in "sip_msg" structure ?.(I want to add a&nbsp; "path" header).<br=
>  <br>  what I did : I added the field in "sip_msg" structure and I comp=
iled  the SER server with "make all" and I run it.&nbsp; when I try to  r=
egister with a SIP client , the server shutdown.<br>  <br>  thinks a lot<=
br>  <br>  Hamdi &nbsp;  <br>  </div><p>
		<hr size=3D1>=20
<b><font color=3D#FF0000>Appel audio GRATUIT</font> partout dans le monde=
</b> avec le nouveau Yahoo! Messenger<br>=20
<a href=3D"http://us.rd.yahoo.com/messenger/mail_taglines/default/*http:/=
/fr.messenger.yahoo.com">T=E9l=E9chargez le ici !</a>=20
=20

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Thu Dec 08 11:05:23 2005
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Date: Thu, 08 Dec 2005 10:04:33 -0600
From: "Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com>
Organization: Wireless Networks Research and Development
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Subject: Re: [Iptel] Sending draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np to IESG
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Cullen Jennings wrote:
> Hi all, 
> 
> I hoping that someone can do a NITS review of this draft and send James
> comments so he can resubmit a version I can request publication on.

I know Alex graciously volunteered for this, but I was also able
to find some time to do a nits review of tel-np.  Hopefully, along
with Alex's, this'll help the author as well.

Overall, the document is well written and easy to read.  The nits
I found are listed below.

0) At various point in the document, a SHALL strength is used
  where (to me) a MUST strength is applicable (like adding the
  "npdi" parameter, removing the "cic" and so on).  Is it
  intentional that SHALL has been used and not MUST?  It could
  be that I am missing some history on this, since I have not
  tracked the draft from inception; and if so, please disregard
  this comment.
1) Since the I-D is > 10 pages long, I think a ToC is a good idea.
2) In preparation for IESG LC, take out "This work is being discussed
  on the iptel@ietf.org mailing list."
3) Since RFC3966 extols implementations to order parameters by
  lexicographical ordering, certain examples in Section 6 should be
  redone to have the ";npdi" parameter appear before the ";rn"
  parameter.
4) An "IANA Consideration" section should be added referring simply
  to draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.

Thank you.

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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From iptel-bounces@ietf.org Thu Dec 08 11:20:29 2005
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Subject: Re: [Iptel] Sending draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np to IESG
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RFC 2119 makes MUST and SHALL equivalent.

Vijay K. Gurbani wrote:
> Cullen Jennings wrote:
> 
>> Hi all,
>> I hoping that someone can do a NITS review of this draft and send James
>> comments so he can resubmit a version I can request publication on.
> 
> 
> I know Alex graciously volunteered for this, but I was also able
> to find some time to do a nits review of tel-np.  Hopefully, along
> with Alex's, this'll help the author as well.
> 
> Overall, the document is well written and easy to read.  The nits
> I found are listed below.
> 
> 0) At various point in the document, a SHALL strength is used
>  where (to me) a MUST strength is applicable (like adding the
>  "npdi" parameter, removing the "cic" and so on).  Is it
>  intentional that SHALL has been used and not MUST?  It could
>  be that I am missing some history on this, since I have not
>  tracked the draft from inception; and if so, please disregard
>  this comment.
...


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Tom-PT Taylor wrote:
> RFC 2119 makes MUST and SHALL equivalent.

So it does ... however, to the uninitiated reader of the specification,
having a MUST somehow seems more authoritative than having a SHALL
(I had to look up rfc2119, and I am a wee bit initiated in the
ways of the IETF ...)

I'll leave it up to the author to decide what to do.

Thanks,

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Telephony Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Representing trunk groups in tel/sip Uniform Resource Identifiers (URIs)
	Author(s)	: C. Jennings, V. Gurbani
	Filename	: draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-05.txt
	Pages		: 16
	Date		: 2005-12-8
	
This document describes a standardized mechanism to convey trunk
   group-related information in sip and tel Uniform Resource Identifiers
   (URIs).  An extension to the "tel" URI is defined for this purpose.

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From: Alexander Mayrhofer <alexander.mayrhofer@enum.at>
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To: "iptel@ietf.org" <iptel@ietf.org>, James Yu <james.yu@neustar.biz>
Subject: Re: [Iptel] Sending draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np to IESG
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Cullen Jennings wrote:

> I hoping that someone can do a NITS review of this draft and send James
> comments so he can resubmit a version I can request publication on.

Hi,

I've completed my review, here are my comments - disclaimer: I've not read 
any discussion about this draft, so if i'm repeating something that has 
already been addressed please excuse my ignorance.

Summary: I think that technically this is pretty mature, however, certain
parts of the text should be improved for clarity and brevity. Here we go:

- The online ID-NITS checker reports that there is an issue with the IPR 
boilerplate. I've not investigated this in more detail. Additionally, it 
reports the missing IANA section. Here is the raw output:

----
idnits 1.74

iptel/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np-07.txt:


   Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ID-Checklist.html:
   * The document seems to lack an IANA Considerations section.
     Checking conformance with RFC 3978/3979 boilerplate...
   * The document seems to lack an RFC 3978 Section 5.1 IPR Disclosure
     Acknowledgement -- however, there's a paragraph with a matching
     beginning. Boilerplate error?

   Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-guidelines.txt:
     Nothing found here (but these checks do not cover all of
     1id-guidelines.txt yet).

   Miscellaneous warnings:
     None.

     Summary: 2 nits, 0 warnings

     Run idnits with the --verbose option for more detailed information.
----

- Title: I'm not really happy with the word "new" in the title. The RFC
would still be named like that in 20 years (when, hoepfully, those parameters
will no be new anymore at all) - my recommendation is to simply remove the
word from the title, or even change the title to 'Number Portability 
Parameters for the "tel" URI'

- Abstract: same issue with "new". Could be left out here as well. My
feeling is that the abstract is a pretty long sentence. Probably it should
be split after "... related information", and continue with "This
information could...". As i'm not a native speaker, i'm unsure here, 
however. comments appreciated

- Abstract, sentence mentioning the mailing list: This should be removed 
prior publication (or the RFC editors should be instructed to do so).

- I'm missing a ToC

- 2. Introduction:

First para: Personally, i'd remove the word "the" in front of "telephony
subscribers". "800 numbers in the North America" should be changed to
"numbers within the 800 area code in the North American Numbering Plan".
Generally, i don't think the sentence "The NP implementations in many
countries..." is neccessary here, because it does not provide any additional
information relevant for the protocol described (and readers can be expected
to be familiar with ranges that support NP, anyways).

Second/Third para: [disclaimer: I know close to nothing about SS7 etc.] Is
this really specific to geographic numbers? In all countries? I think that
this should be generalized. Also, are numbers really "located" at a carrier?
I think that they are "serviced" or "initially allocated". I'm sure that
other members of the group could provide more precise terms for this.

4th para: Is this specific to "freephone" only? Again, in which countries?
Rephrasing this to "... identifies the current carrier of the respective
phone number" (in what network? ahhh...). Does the second sentence also
refer to free phone numbers?

Personally, i'd reduce the introduction to a few sentences which explain 
what the parameters to be introduced are - the NP mechanics should already 
be explained in RFC3482 to which you are refering anyways.

The last few sentences of the the introduction would become redundant if 
you'd introduce a more formal ToC.

- I like the "abbreviations" section. It gives a good overview. However, you 
can safely remove "IETF" and "IP" from the lists as those two are considered 
well known abbreviations within the IETF, and don't need to be spelled out.

- Formal syntax: The ABNF and the description what goes into the URI are a 
bit inconsistent. First, the "phonedigit" definition is never used (all 
relevant parameters contain "phonedigit-hex"), so it could be safely 
removed. Additionally, i don't understand why you have the following 
definitions there, since they just "rename" other definitions: rn, npdi, 
cic. What is the reason for introducing 2 names for those definitions?

You should state which part of the "tel" URI definition is to be extended by 
those parameters (that would be the "par" definition in RFC3966, afais).

The ABNF validator at http://rtg.ietf.org/~fenner/abnf.cgi suggests a few 
changes with regards to normalization, btw.

- Section 5: Again, i'm not happy with the specifics regarding "freephone" 
and "geographic" number ranges. I'm sure that i don't have enough insight 
into number portability, but i suspect that those parameters might be useful 
in other scenarios as well (like mobile number portability). You are 
basically excluding such scenarios.

I'd like to see comments from number portability gurus _outside_ the NANP 
here - they are for sure more competent in reviewing this than i am.

- Section "5.2" - you are refering to section "5.3.4" which does not exist 
in the document. That should probably be "5.2.4".

- Section 6, example "A": "service provide with" should be corrected to 
"service provider with"
- Section 6, example "B": That should read "service providers" instead of 
"service provider's".
- Section 6, example "G": "If the valid" should be "If valid" - generally, 
my impression is that there are a few "the"s in the example section where i 
would not expect them ('... value of the "rn" of "cic" ...') - again, i'm 
not a native speaker.

- IANA section: Please include one, probably with "there are no 
considerations for IANA" with an explaination to the RFC editors that those 
parameters are already included in the upcoming tel URI parameter registry 
document.

hope that helps

cheers

alex


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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Telephony Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Representing trunk groups in tel/sip Uniform Resource Identifiers (URIs)
	Author(s)	: C. Jennings, V. Gurbani
	Filename	: draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group-06.txt
	Pages		: 16
	Date		: 2005-12-9
	
This document describes a standardized mechanism to convey trunk
   group-related information in sip and tel Uniform Resource Identifiers
   (URIs).  An extension to the "tel" URI is defined for this purpose.

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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Telephony Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: The ENUM Dip Indicator parameter for the "tel" URI
	Author(s)	: R. Stastny, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-iptel-tel-enumdi-02.txt
	Pages		: 12
	Date		: 2005-12-12
	
This document defines a new parameter "enumdi" in the "tel" Uniform
   Resource Identifier (URI) as defined in RFC3966 to support the
   handling of ENUM queries in SIP proxies, H.323 gatekeepers and other
   VoIP network elements.  The presence of the "enumdi" parameter
   indicates to the VoIP network element receiving an URI containing an
   E.164 number that an ENUM query as defined in RFC3761 has already
   been performed on the E.164 number indicated by the previous VoIP
   network element.

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Subject: Re: [Iptel] Sending draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np to IESG
From: Cullen Jennings <fluffy@cisco.com>
To: Alexander Mayrhofer <alexander.mayrhofer@enum.at>,
	"iptel@ietf.org" <iptel@ietf.org>, James Yu <james.yu@neustar.biz>
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Alex thanks for the detail review.

James, any idea when we could have a rev that addressed these and Vijay's
comments? I would really really like to have this sent to the AD before the
holidays. 

Thanks, Cullen.


PS - I agree that SHALL or MUST is left to your discretion - I'm happy
either way. I will note that the MAY/SHOULD/MUST are used the most and many
people seem more familiar with those.



On 12/9/05 1:43 AM, "Alexander Mayrhofer" <alexander.mayrhofer@enum.at>
wrote:

> Cullen Jennings wrote:
> 
>> I hoping that someone can do a NITS review of this draft and send James
>> comments so he can resubmit a version I can request publication on.
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I've completed my review, here are my comments - disclaimer: I've not read
> any discussion about this draft, so if i'm repeating something that has
> already been addressed please excuse my ignorance.
> 
> Summary: I think that technically this is pretty mature, however, certain
> parts of the text should be improved for clarity and brevity. Here we go:
> 
> - The online ID-NITS checker reports that there is an issue with the IPR
> boilerplate. I've not investigated this in more detail. Additionally, it
> reports the missing IANA section. Here is the raw output:
> 
> ----
> idnits 1.74
> 
> iptel/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np-07.txt:
> 
> 
>    Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ID-Checklist.html:
>    * The document seems to lack an IANA Considerations section.
>      Checking conformance with RFC 3978/3979 boilerplate...
>    * The document seems to lack an RFC 3978 Section 5.1 IPR Disclosure
>      Acknowledgement -- however, there's a paragraph with a matching
>      beginning. Boilerplate error?
> 
>    Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-guidelines.txt:
>      Nothing found here (but these checks do not cover all of
>      1id-guidelines.txt yet).
> 
>    Miscellaneous warnings:
>      None.
> 
>      Summary: 2 nits, 0 warnings
> 
>      Run idnits with the --verbose option for more detailed information.
> ----
> 
> - Title: I'm not really happy with the word "new" in the title. The RFC
> would still be named like that in 20 years (when, hoepfully, those parameters
> will no be new anymore at all) - my recommendation is to simply remove the
> word from the title, or even change the title to 'Number Portability
> Parameters for the "tel" URI'
> 
> - Abstract: same issue with "new". Could be left out here as well. My
> feeling is that the abstract is a pretty long sentence. Probably it should
> be split after "... related information", and continue with "This
> information could...". As i'm not a native speaker, i'm unsure here,
> however. comments appreciated
> 
> - Abstract, sentence mentioning the mailing list: This should be removed
> prior publication (or the RFC editors should be instructed to do so).
> 
> - I'm missing a ToC
> 
> - 2. Introduction:
> 
> First para: Personally, i'd remove the word "the" in front of "telephony
> subscribers". "800 numbers in the North America" should be changed to
> "numbers within the 800 area code in the North American Numbering Plan".
> Generally, i don't think the sentence "The NP implementations in many
> countries..." is neccessary here, because it does not provide any additional
> information relevant for the protocol described (and readers can be expected
> to be familiar with ranges that support NP, anyways).
> 
> Second/Third para: [disclaimer: I know close to nothing about SS7 etc.] Is
> this really specific to geographic numbers? In all countries? I think that
> this should be generalized. Also, are numbers really "located" at a carrier?
> I think that they are "serviced" or "initially allocated". I'm sure that
> other members of the group could provide more precise terms for this.
> 
> 4th para: Is this specific to "freephone" only? Again, in which countries?
> Rephrasing this to "... identifies the current carrier of the respective
> phone number" (in what network? ahhh...). Does the second sentence also
> refer to free phone numbers?
> 
> Personally, i'd reduce the introduction to a few sentences which explain
> what the parameters to be introduced are - the NP mechanics should already
> be explained in RFC3482 to which you are refering anyways.
> 
> The last few sentences of the the introduction would become redundant if
> you'd introduce a more formal ToC.
> 
> - I like the "abbreviations" section. It gives a good overview. However, you
> can safely remove "IETF" and "IP" from the lists as those two are considered
> well known abbreviations within the IETF, and don't need to be spelled out.
> 
> - Formal syntax: The ABNF and the description what goes into the URI are a
> bit inconsistent. First, the "phonedigit" definition is never used (all
> relevant parameters contain "phonedigit-hex"), so it could be safely
> removed. Additionally, i don't understand why you have the following
> definitions there, since they just "rename" other definitions: rn, npdi,
> cic. What is the reason for introducing 2 names for those definitions?
> 
> You should state which part of the "tel" URI definition is to be extended by
> those parameters (that would be the "par" definition in RFC3966, afais).
> 
> The ABNF validator at http://rtg.ietf.org/~fenner/abnf.cgi suggests a few
> changes with regards to normalization, btw.
> 
> - Section 5: Again, i'm not happy with the specifics regarding "freephone"
> and "geographic" number ranges. I'm sure that i don't have enough insight
> into number portability, but i suspect that those parameters might be useful
> in other scenarios as well (like mobile number portability). You are
> basically excluding such scenarios.
> 
> I'd like to see comments from number portability gurus _outside_ the NANP
> here - they are for sure more competent in reviewing this than i am.
> 
> - Section "5.2" - you are refering to section "5.3.4" which does not exist
> in the document. That should probably be "5.2.4".
> 
> - Section 6, example "A": "service provide with" should be corrected to
> "service provider with"
> - Section 6, example "B": That should read "service providers" instead of
> "service provider's".
> - Section 6, example "G": "If the valid" should be "If valid" - generally,
> my impression is that there are a few "the"s in the example section where i
> would not expect them ('... value of the "rn" of "cic" ...') - again, i'm
> not a native speaker.
> 
> - IANA section: Please include one, probably with "there are no
> considerations for IANA" with an explaination to the RFC editors that those
> parameters are already included in the upcoming tel URI parameter registry
> document.
> 
> hope that helps
> 
> cheers
> 
> alex

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Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2005 19:26:35 -0800
From: Cullen Jennings <fluffy@cisco.com>
To: Richard Shockey <richard@shockey.us>,
	Stastny Richard <Richard.Stastny@oefeg.at>,
	Lawrence Conroy <lconroy@insensate.co.uk>
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Thread-Topic: iptel-tel-enumdi-02, one more try 
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Subject: [Iptel] iptel-tel-enumdi-02, one more try 
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Glad to see the document made it into the directory but I was sort of sad to
see it had not taken into account Alex's comments (ok and mine too :-).
Could you take a stab at fixing those up and just resubmit. It is probably
30 minutes work. 

I think it would be nice (and very clear for IANA) if the IANA section
started with a sentence along lines of "This specification requires no IANA
actions", then continued with rest of stuff that is there now.


On 11/3/05 4:59 AM, "Alexander Mayrhofer" <alexander.mayrhofer@enum.at>
wrote:

> All,
> 
>> Cullen Jennings wrote:
>>> The BNF does not add the enumdi to the par rule in the tel RFC. And
>>> the IANA
>>> registry question would also impact this.
>>> 
>>> I'm also wondering if I am nuts thinking that the we need to say that
>>> this
>>> draft updates the par line. It makes sense to me but if others think
>>> this is
>>> not needed - let me know I am nuts.
> 
> I second that we need to say this. The last sentence of the section (which,
> btw, should mention "enumdi" instead of "enum-dip-indicator"?) should at
> least specify where in the tel URI can appear. I like the style from
> draft-ietf-iptel-trunk-group, btw.
> 
> I also think that "No considerations for IANA" should be clarified. Without
> the background of the tel URI registry draft this is a imho bit misleading
> (and, could be interpreted as an suggestion that tel URI parameters do not
> need to be registered/coordinated at all [otoh, 3966 section 5.4 clarifies
> this already]).
> 
>>> Can we also get someone to do a NITS review of this draft. It the
>>> review was
>>> already done in the ENUM group then I am happy to skip it.
> 
> My comments are as follows:
> 
> - As Cullen already pointed out, there's a IPR Boilerplate issue. I've not
> investigated this in detail.
> 
> - Secion 1 has a small typo in it: "thisdocument"
> 
> - Abbreviations: There are a lot of abbreviations which are never spelled
> out. I've spotted "VoIP", "UAS", "UAC", "ENUM", "PSTN", "URI" (spelled out
> in abstract only - is this ok?), "NAPTR", "RR" not to be on the list of well
> known abbreviations.
> 
> - Abstract: The second sentenct of the abstract is a bit too long for my
> poor Engrish ;), would appreciate comments from native speakers here. In
> addition, it only talks about "receiving" an enumdi URI which could lead to
> the impression that the document is only about handling, but not creating
> the parameter in URIs. Furthermore, the ID-Checklist mandates to not use any
> citations in abstracts - Please remove references to RFCs from it. Please
> expand any abbreviations - this could lead to cluttering of the first
> sentence, maybe "SIP Proxies, H.323 gatekeepers and other VoIP elements"
> should be simply replaced by "network elements".
> 
> - Readability: Generally, there are a few rather long nested sentences. It
> makes the document hard to read in some points.
> 
> - URI examples: "<" and ">" are not part of the URI itself - they are a way
> of embedding URIs in other protocols. Please remove them from the examples.
> 
> - IANA considerations: see comment above.
> 
> - ABNF is used in the document: Please change its reference to normative.
> 
> cheers
> 
> Alex Mayrhofer
> enum.at

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(not as chair) I think we should go for MUST; this is used much more 
often in the RAI set of specifications, and we should be consistent.

Thanks,
Jonathan R.

Cullen Jennings wrote:

> Alex thanks for the detail review.
> 
> James, any idea when we could have a rev that addressed these and Vijay's
> comments? I would really really like to have this sent to the AD before the
> holidays. 
> 
> Thanks, Cullen.
> 
> 
> PS - I agree that SHALL or MUST is left to your discretion - I'm happy
> either way. I will note that the MAY/SHOULD/MUST are used the most and many
> people seem more familiar with those.
> 
> 
> 
> On 12/9/05 1:43 AM, "Alexander Mayrhofer" <alexander.mayrhofer@enum.at>
> wrote:
> 
> 
>>Cullen Jennings wrote:
>>
>>
>>>I hoping that someone can do a NITS review of this draft and send James
>>>comments so he can resubmit a version I can request publication on.
>>
>>Hi,
>>
>>I've completed my review, here are my comments - disclaimer: I've not read
>>any discussion about this draft, so if i'm repeating something that has
>>already been addressed please excuse my ignorance.
>>
>>Summary: I think that technically this is pretty mature, however, certain
>>parts of the text should be improved for clarity and brevity. Here we go:
>>
>>- The online ID-NITS checker reports that there is an issue with the IPR
>>boilerplate. I've not investigated this in more detail. Additionally, it
>>reports the missing IANA section. Here is the raw output:
>>
>>----
>>idnits 1.74
>>
>>iptel/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np-07.txt:
>>
>>
>>   Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ID-Checklist.html:
>>   * The document seems to lack an IANA Considerations section.
>>     Checking conformance with RFC 3978/3979 boilerplate...
>>   * The document seems to lack an RFC 3978 Section 5.1 IPR Disclosure
>>     Acknowledgement -- however, there's a paragraph with a matching
>>     beginning. Boilerplate error?
>>
>>   Checking nits according to http://www.ietf.org/ietf/1id-guidelines.txt:
>>     Nothing found here (but these checks do not cover all of
>>     1id-guidelines.txt yet).
>>
>>   Miscellaneous warnings:
>>     None.
>>
>>     Summary: 2 nits, 0 warnings
>>
>>     Run idnits with the --verbose option for more detailed information.
>>----
>>
>>- Title: I'm not really happy with the word "new" in the title. The RFC
>>would still be named like that in 20 years (when, hoepfully, those parameters
>>will no be new anymore at all) - my recommendation is to simply remove the
>>word from the title, or even change the title to 'Number Portability
>>Parameters for the "tel" URI'
>>
>>- Abstract: same issue with "new". Could be left out here as well. My
>>feeling is that the abstract is a pretty long sentence. Probably it should
>>be split after "... related information", and continue with "This
>>information could...". As i'm not a native speaker, i'm unsure here,
>>however. comments appreciated
>>
>>- Abstract, sentence mentioning the mailing list: This should be removed
>>prior publication (or the RFC editors should be instructed to do so).
>>
>>- I'm missing a ToC
>>
>>- 2. Introduction:
>>
>>First para: Personally, i'd remove the word "the" in front of "telephony
>>subscribers". "800 numbers in the North America" should be changed to
>>"numbers within the 800 area code in the North American Numbering Plan".
>>Generally, i don't think the sentence "The NP implementations in many
>>countries..." is neccessary here, because it does not provide any additional
>>information relevant for the protocol described (and readers can be expected
>>to be familiar with ranges that support NP, anyways).
>>
>>Second/Third para: [disclaimer: I know close to nothing about SS7 etc.] Is
>>this really specific to geographic numbers? In all countries? I think that
>>this should be generalized. Also, are numbers really "located" at a carrier?
>>I think that they are "serviced" or "initially allocated". I'm sure that
>>other members of the group could provide more precise terms for this.
>>
>>4th para: Is this specific to "freephone" only? Again, in which countries?
>>Rephrasing this to "... identifies the current carrier of the respective
>>phone number" (in what network? ahhh...). Does the second sentence also
>>refer to free phone numbers?
>>
>>Personally, i'd reduce the introduction to a few sentences which explain
>>what the parameters to be introduced are - the NP mechanics should already
>>be explained in RFC3482 to which you are refering anyways.
>>
>>The last few sentences of the the introduction would become redundant if
>>you'd introduce a more formal ToC.
>>
>>- I like the "abbreviations" section. It gives a good overview. However, you
>>can safely remove "IETF" and "IP" from the lists as those two are considered
>>well known abbreviations within the IETF, and don't need to be spelled out.
>>
>>- Formal syntax: The ABNF and the description what goes into the URI are a
>>bit inconsistent. First, the "phonedigit" definition is never used (all
>>relevant parameters contain "phonedigit-hex"), so it could be safely
>>removed. Additionally, i don't understand why you have the following
>>definitions there, since they just "rename" other definitions: rn, npdi,
>>cic. What is the reason for introducing 2 names for those definitions?
>>
>>You should state which part of the "tel" URI definition is to be extended by
>>those parameters (that would be the "par" definition in RFC3966, afais).
>>
>>The ABNF validator at http://rtg.ietf.org/~fenner/abnf.cgi suggests a few
>>changes with regards to normalization, btw.
>>
>>- Section 5: Again, i'm not happy with the specifics regarding "freephone"
>>and "geographic" number ranges. I'm sure that i don't have enough insight
>>into number portability, but i suspect that those parameters might be useful
>>in other scenarios as well (like mobile number portability). You are
>>basically excluding such scenarios.
>>
>>I'd like to see comments from number portability gurus _outside_ the NANP
>>here - they are for sure more competent in reviewing this than i am.
>>
>>- Section "5.2" - you are refering to section "5.3.4" which does not exist
>>in the document. That should probably be "5.2.4".
>>
>>- Section 6, example "A": "service provide with" should be corrected to
>>"service provider with"
>>- Section 6, example "B": That should read "service providers" instead of
>>"service provider's".
>>- Section 6, example "G": "If the valid" should be "If valid" - generally,
>>my impression is that there are a few "the"s in the example section where i
>>would not expect them ('... value of the "rn" of "cic" ...') - again, i'm
>>not a native speaker.
>>
>>- IANA section: Please include one, probably with "there are no
>>considerations for IANA" with an explaination to the RFC editors that those
>>parameters are already included in the upcoming tel URI parameter registry
>>document.
>>
>>hope that helps
>>
>>cheers
>>
>>alex
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
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-- 
Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D.                   600 Lanidex Plaza
Cisco Fellow                                   Parsippany, NJ 07054-2711
Cisco Systems
jdrosen@cisco.com                              FAX:   (973) 952-5050
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Cc: IETF IPTEL WG <iptel@ietf.org>, Cullen Jennings <fluffy@cisco.com>
Subject: [Iptel] Re: draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00 submitted
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Thanks for the quick turnaround on all this stuff, guys. Here are some 
comments on the draft. A couple are more than just nits and may require 
some discussion:

> This document creates an Internet Assigned Number Authority (IANA)
>    registry for the tel Uniform Resource Identifier (URI) parameters,

s/for the tel/for tel

and remove the comma at the end of the second line

> It also lists the already existing parameters to
>    be used as initial values for that registry.

I think this is better said thusly:

It also populates the registry with the parameters defined in the tel 
URI specification, along with the parameters in extensions defined for 
number portability and trunk groups.

> Jennings & Gurbani        Expires June 9, 2006                  [Page 1]
> 
> Internet-Draft    IANA Registry for TEL URI Parameters          Dec 2005

s/TEL/tel

> 1.  Introduction
> 
>    RFC 3966 [1] allows new tel URI parameters, and new parameter values
>    to be defined.  

Suggest:

The tel URI, defined in RFC 3966 [1], defines a URI that can be used to 
represent resources identified by telephone numbers. The tel URI, like 
many other URIs, provides extensibility through the definition of new 
URI parameters and new values for existing parameters.

> RFCs defining tel URI parameters, or parameter values MUST register
>    them with IANA as described below.

remove the comma

>  Registered tel URI parameters and their values are to be considered
>    "reserved words".  In order to preserve interoperability, registered
>    parameters MUST be used in a manner consistent with that described in
>    their defining RFC.  Implementations MUST NOT utilize "private" or
>    "locally defined" URI parameters that conflict with registered
>    parameters.

this paragraph basically says to read the specs and be good. THats 
motherhood and apple-pie kind of stuff. I think you should remove the 
paragraph, it seems out of place anyway.

> Some tel URI parameters only accept a set of predefined parameter
>    values while others can take any value.  There are also parameters
>    that can not have any value.  

suggest for the last sentence:

There are also parameters which take no values; they are used as flags.

> Registering all parameter values for
>    all tel URI parameters of this type would require a large number of
>    sub-registries. 

this sentence doesn't work where its currently placed. The words "this 
type" would normally refer to the previous sentence. But they don't; the 
previous sentence talks about parameters with no values. I'd suggest:

Those URI parameters which take on predefined values typically take on a 
large number of values. Registering each of those values, or creating a 
sub-registry for each such parameter, is not appropriate.

> The tel URI parameter registry contains a column that indicates
>    whether or not each parameter only accepts a set of predefined
>    values.  The column can contain Yes, No, or NA.  Implementers of
>    parameters with a "yes" in that column need to find all the valid
>    parameter values in the RFCs provided as references.  Parameters that
>    are not allowed to have a parameters have a value of "NA".

So, what does "No" mean? None of the entries in the registry are "No". I 
originally thought No applied to parameters whose values were either 
infinite in scope, or were a finite set, but from a set not defined 
through enumeration (for example, the set of phone numbers). But, things 
like isub are "Yes", so I'm confused.

>  New tel URI parameters and new parameter values are registered by the
>    IANA.

...and new parameter values for existing URI parameters are registered...

> When registering a new tel parameter or a new value for a
>    parameter,

..new value for an existing parameter...


Actually, I'd suggest a different template for registering a new 
parameter vs. a new value for an existing parameter. In the former case, 
you need everything you've listed. In the latter case, you only provide 
the parameter name and the RFC number; you shouldn't provide a value for 
the "predefined value" column. Indeed, you can only register new values 
for parameters whose "preddefined value" columnb is "Yes", and the 
instructions to IANA need to state that.

>  As per the terminology in RFC 2434 [3], the registration policy for
>    tel URI parameters shall be "Specification Required".

Hmm. Thats not what the intro says. It says:

The tel URI parameters and values for these parameters MUST be
    documented in a standards-track RFC in order to be registered by
    IANA.

If you read RFC2434, it says this about "specification required":

  Specification Required - Values and their meaning must be
            documented in an RFC or other permanent and readily available
            reference, in sufficient detail so that interoperability
            between independent implementations is possible.

            Examples: SCSP [SCSP]


"specification required" allows for informational and experimental 
documents. The text in the intro really seems to imply "standards 
action", defined in RFC 2434 as:

Standards Action - Values are assigned only for Standards Track
            RFCs approved by the IESG.

            Examples: MIME top level types [MIME-REG]



Thanks,
Jonahtan R.

Vijay K. Gurbani wrote:

> Folks:
> 
> I have submitted draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.
> 
> Until it becomes available in the archives, you can get it from
> 
> http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt
> http://www.iit.edu/~gurbvij/I-D/draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.html
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> - vijay

-- 
Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D.                   600 Lanidex Plaza
Cisco Fellow                                   Parsippany, NJ 07054-2711
Cisco Systems
jdrosen@cisco.com                              FAX:   (973) 952-5050
http://www.jdrosen.net                         PHONE: (973) 952-5000
http://www.cisco.com

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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Telephony Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: The Internet Assigned Number Authority (IANA)
                          tel Uniform Resource Identifier (URI) 
                          Parameter Registry
	Author(s)	: C. Jennings, V. Gurbani
	Filename	: draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt
	Pages		: 7
	Date		: 2005-12-15
	
   This document creates an Internet Assigned Number Authority (IANA)
   registry for the tel Uniform Resource Identifier (URI) parameters,
   and their values.  It also lists the already existing parameters to
   be used as initial values for that registry.

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From: "Dhaval N. Shah \(dhaval\)" <dhaval@cisco.com>
To: "Cullen Jennings \(fluffy\)" <fluffy@cisco.com>,
	"Manjunath Bangalore \(manjax\)" <manjax@cisco.com>,
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Unless I missed something, Jonathan?

Thx,
Dhaval=20

-----Original Message-----
From: Cullen Jennings (fluffy)=20
Sent: Saturday, October 29, 2005 4:55 PM
To: Manjunath Bangalore (manjax); Dhaval N. Shah (dhaval); Jonathan
Rosenberg (jdrosen)
Cc: iptel@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Iptel] 64th IETF Agenda=20


I think that Jonathan is going to need to review this one.

On 10/27/05 9:52 AM, "Bangalore, Manjunath" <manjax@cisco.com> wrote:

> Cullen,
>=20
> I just wanted to confirm that there are no other open issues besides=20
> positioning TGREP as a profile of TRIP. We have addressed all other=20
> feedback that was received when it was put out for WGLC sometime ago.
>=20
> Can we get some assistance from yourself and Jonathan in addressing=20
> this one item?
>=20
> Regards,
> -Manjax
> =20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: iptel-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:iptel-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf

> Of Cullen Jennings
> Sent: Tuesday, October 18, 2005 8:53 PM
> To: Dhaval N Shah; Jonathan Rosenberg
> Cc: iptel@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Iptel] 64th IETF Agenda
>=20
>=20
> Hi Dhaval,
>=20
> Unfortunately we did not request any agenda time. Jonathan and I did=20
> think (or did not realize) that there were any open issues that could=20
> not be solved on the list. My notes have that the major open issue is=20
> that we need to massage the draft to make it a profile of TRIP instead

> of a different protocol. Are there other issues? Can we sort them out=20
> on the list? Any estimate of when we might get the next revision? The=20
> current one is from
> 2001
>=20
> Cullen
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On 10/17/05 4:36 PM, "Dhaval N. Shah (dhaval)" <dhaval@cisco.com>
wrote:
>=20
>> =20
>> Jonathan/Cullen,
>>=20
>> We'd like a 15 minute slot in the IPTEL WG meeting in the upcoming=20
>> IETF to conclude any open issues for TGREP to move closer towards RFC

>> status.
>>=20
>> Thx,
>> Dhaval and Manjunath
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
>> Iptel mailing list
>> Iptel@ietf.org
>> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iptel
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Iptel mailing list
> Iptel@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/iptel

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Vijay,

I would have expected to find "phone-context" in the initial list of
parameters. Is there any particular reason why it is not mentioned? If
so, a note explaining the reason would help inexperienced readers like
myself.

Thanks,
Ernst Horvath
Siemens AG

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From: Jonathan Rosenberg <jdrosen@cisco.com>
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Subject: [Iptel] comments on trunk-group doc
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Well, first I have to apologize for the tardiness of these comments. I 
promised them ages ago and finally dedicated some time today to iptel 
matters and so got around to this.

Unfortunately I have many substantive comments on the document, see below:


> referred to as "trunks") between Time Division Multiplexed (TDM)
>    circuit switches.  In large switches, a group of trunks that connects

connect

> vendor.  Absent such guidelines, inter-operability will suffer as a
>    proxy vendor must conform to the expectations of a gateway as to

interoperability

>  The trunk group information can be carried in either the "sip" URI or
>    the "tel" URI.  Since trunks groups are intimately associated with

trunk groups


> 4.  Requirements and rationale

you should at least provide some introductory text here, saying that 
this section overviews some of the motivations for the design decisions 
that went into the development of the spec.
> anyway).  Furthermore, using the tel URL also allows this format to
>    be reused by non-SIP VoIP protocols (which could include anything

tel URI, not URL

> normative procedures of Section 19.1.6 of [3] can be used to derive
>    an equivalent "sip" URI from a "tel" URI, complete with the trunk

here, you put the URI schemes in quotes, whereas this wasnt done before. 
Leave unquoted.

>  respectively, signifies the intent.  A proxy (or any other
>    intermediary -- see next section) MAY insert a trunk group appears in
>    the R-URI; to the next downstream entity this signifies an egress (or
>    terminating) trunk group to be used.

this section is really informative and shouldn't have any normative 
statements in it like this. Also, the sentence doesn't make sense, looks 
like "appears" is extraneous. Suggest:

A trunk group parameter in the request URI is an indication from a SIP 
entity (for example, a proxy) to the next downstream entity that a 
specific egress trunk group should be used.

> To the processing User Agent Server (UAS), a trunk group in the R-URI
>    implies that it should use the named trunk group for the outbound
>    call.  If a UAS supports trunk groups but is not configured with the
>    particular trunk group identified in the R-URI, it SHOULD not use any
>    other trunk group other than the one requested.

more normative text in a requirements section. Actually, this is pretty 
fundamental processing steps here. My suggestion is to create a seperate 
section, called "Client Behavior" (using client in the sip transaction 
sense), which describes rules by which any entity acting as a sip client 
can insert a tg parameter in the R-uri, and another section on Server 
Behavior, that discusses treatment on receipt. Then, make this section 4 
entirely informative and move it below. As written now it is very 
confusing about what this is.

Also, in terms of the specific normative strength here, this is a 
SHOULD. What would be the conditions by which you would ignore that tg 
parameter and send it elsewhere? Seems like ignoring it could cause 
interop problems.

>  A User Agent Client (UAC) that initiates a call and supports this
>    specification MAY include the trunk group in the Contact header.  If
>    it does so, the trunk group in the Contact header represents the
>    originating trunk group.  Subsequent requests destined to that UAC
>    MUST copy the trunk group from the Contact header into the R-URI.

this is confusing. I think you are referring to mid-dialog reuqests, 
which will, as a consequence of rfc3261 processing, result in the 
contact appearing in the r-uri. If so, there is no need to re-specify 
rfc3261 behavior. I'll also note that this won't happen for non-dialog 
requests like MESSAGE, which can come through a pstn gateway (SMS to 
SIP), and can have a trunk group in the contact, so this text is not 
really accurate anyway.

> Among other sources of request arrival (not shown in Figure) at the
>    proxy is GW1.

I found this sentence confusing; GW1 is shown in the figure. "Not shown" 
apparently refers to other sources. But, they're not relevant anyway, so 
why mention it?

> GW1 in Figure 1 is always cognizant of any requests that arrive over
>    trunk group TG1-1.  If it wishes to propagate the ingress trunk group
>    to the proxy, it MUST arrange for the trunk group to appear in the
>    Contact header of the SIP request destined to the proxy.  

here too, normative statements seem out of scope for a section on 
reference architecture; these need to be collected into a section on 
behaviors of clients and servers.

> the proxy MUST arrange for the trunk group to appear in the
>    SIP R-URI of the request destined to that gateway.

as above

>   [2]  Crocker, D. and P. Overell, "Augmented BNF for Syntax
>         Specifications: ABNF", RFC 2234, November 1997.

update to 4234

>   trunk-group-label = *1( unreserved / escaped /
>                             trunk-group-unreserved )

shouldn't this be 1* and not *1

>   trunk-group-unreserved is the intersection of param-unreserved
>       defined in [4] and user-unreserved defined in [3].  Since the

There is no user-unreserved defined in the grammar. unreserved and 
escaped are used; you need to say where those are defined. unreserved is 
actually in BOTH 3966 and 3261 it seems; though thankfully they appear 
to be the same definition.

>  Since the
>       trunk group is an extension to the tel URI and will end up as the
>       user portion of a SIP URI, the ABNF for it has to ensure that it
>       can be adequately represented in both the constructs.
>       descriptor is defined in [4].

Hmm. This should not be needed. Note the grammar for the SIP URI:

SIP-URI          =  "sip:" [ userinfo ] hostport
                     uri-parameters [ headers ]
userinfo         =  ( user / telephone-subscriber ) [ ":" password ] "@"

note that userinfo can contain telephone-subscriber directly. That, 
through further definition, includes the extension characters for the 
tel URI. Thus, there is no need to perform this intersection as you have 
done. If it was needed, it would have been a bug in 3966.

>   If the receiver of a SIP request is not the owner of the domain (or
>    global prefix) specified in the "trunk-context", it MUST treat the
>    trunk group as if it was not there.

It is my understanding that normally trunk group identifiers are scoped 
to the switch to which they are attached. That is, two switches in the 
same network can both use the same identifier. If so, the usage of 
descriptor as a scoping tool is a little odd; descriptor is meant to 
provide a scope for service providers or countries, where numbering 
plans are scoped. You could use a descriptor to define a switch, if you 
used a domain name equal to the host name of the machine, i.e., 
gw22.provider.net. But the phone number prefix would never be useful.

So, if I am correct and trunk group identifiers are in fact scoped to a 
switch/gateway, this requires further discussion in the document at least.

Another point on this text. Its not actually clear what it means to 
"treat the trunk group as if it were not there". What is the meaining of 
"trunk group" in this sentence? Do you mean the two URI parameters 
(i.e., ignore tgrp and trunk-context)? I would think that, if a gateway 
receives a request targeted to a trunk group that doesnt exist, its akin 
to get a request with a domain name that doesn't match your own, and you 
would reject with 404.


> F1:
>    INVITE sip:+16305554554@example.com
>    ...
>    Contact: <sip:4554;phone-context=example.com;tgrp=TG1-1;
>       trunk-context=example.com@gw1.example.com>

Well, I'll first quote draft-ietf-sip-guidelines here:

  For an example of how to construct a good examples section, see the
    message flows and message formatting defined in the Basic Call Flows
    specification [21].  Note that complete messages SHOULD be used.  Be

which says that you should use complete messages. The messages here are 
not only incomplete, they are gramatically wrong even for the pieces 
they show. Note the missing SIP/2.0 in the r-uri. The URI in the R-URI 
also omits user=phone which probably should be there.

> reached GW1.  Under normal circumstances (i.e., instances where the
>    calling party number is present in signaling), GW1 would derive a sip
>    URI to insert into the Contact header.  This sip URI may contain, as
>    its user portion, the calling party number from from the incoming SS7
>    signaling information.  The trunk group information then becomes part
>    of the user portion as discussed previously.

this is really an implementation choice; I actually don't think that 
this is that common. YMMV. Anyway, I think its important to point out 
that putting the phone number in the user part of the contact is 
optional and an implementation choice anyway. As such, the whole bit 
about handling incoming calls without a calling number is merely a 
statement of the obvious - your local implementation can put in whatever 
it wants, but obviously not the information thats not there...

> Once the request is in the domain of example.net, the namespace
>    imposed by the "trunk-context" parameter in the Contact header
>    prevents collisions with similiar trunk groups maintained by the
>    example.net domain.

this doesn't make sense. The contact in the invite is not used by the 
recipient in any way except to get the request routed back the 
originator, which uses the domain part of the SIP URI. The user part of 
the contact is only ever looked at by the entity that inserted it, so 
consequently namespace collisions are not an issue.

The main use for the namespace scoping is really in the r-uri, I think, 
to make sure that a request goes to a trunk group on the gateway that 
houses it. Largely to deal with configuration problems.

> 8.  Security considerations
> 
>    The extension defined in this document does not add any additional
>    security concerns beyond those already enumerated in [3].  

I disagree. Consider this; modifying the r-uri in a request in-transit 
would allow me to cause the gateway to use one specific trunk group over 
another. I can launch all kinds of nice attacks by making gateways use 
the wrong trunk group. For example, a service provider gets charged when 
they route inter-lata traffic over a local trunk. Or, there might be a 
toll-free trunk that I can force calls on and get free calls or 
something. Thus, integrity of this thing is important.


Thanks,
Jonathan R.
-- 
Jonathan D. Rosenberg, Ph.D.                   600 Lanidex Plaza
Cisco Fellow                                   Parsippany, NJ 07054-2711
Cisco Systems
jdrosen@cisco.com                              FAX:   (973) 952-5050
http://www.jdrosen.net                         PHONE: (973) 952-5000
http://www.cisco.com

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Date: Fri, 16 Dec 2005 09:23:57 -0600
From: "Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com>
Organization: Wireless Networks Research and Development
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To: Horvath Ernst <ernst.horvath@siemens.com>
Subject: Re: [Iptel] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-iptel-tel-reg-00.txt
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Horvath Ernst wrote:
> Vijay,
> 
> I would have expected to find "phone-context" in the initial list of
> parameters. Is there any particular reason why it is not mentioned? If
> so, a note explaining the reason would help inexperienced readers like
> myself.

Looks like an inadverdent omission.  Will fix in next release.

Thanks,

- vijay
-- 
Vijay K. Gurbani  vkg@{lucent.com,research.bell-labs.com,acm.org}
Lucent Technologies/Bell Laboratories, 2000 Lucent Lane, Rm 6G-440
Naperville, Illinois 60566     Voice: +1 630 224 0216

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From: "Vijay K. Gurbani" <vkg@lucent.com>
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Jonathan:

This is an ACK for the comments on trunk-group and tel-reg.
Thanks for the detailed review of both.

I'll follow-up with any ensuing discussions on the list,
followed by revisions of both the docs.

Thanks,

- vijay


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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Telephony Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: The ENUM Dip Indicator parameter for the "tel" URI
	Author(s)	: R. Stastny, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-iptel-tel-enumdi-03.txt
	Pages		: 8
	Date		: 2005-12-20
	
This document defines a new parameter "enumdi" for the "tel" Uniform
   Resource Identifier (URI) to support the handling of ENUM queries in
   VoIP (Voice over Internet Protocol) network elements.  A VoIP network
   element may receive an URI containing an E.164 number, where that URI
   contains an "enumdi" parameter.  The presence of the "enumdi"
   parameter indicates that an ENUM query has already been performed on
   the E.164 number by a previous VoIP network element.  Equally, if a
   VoIP network element sends such an URI, it asserts that an ENUM query
   has been carried out on this number.

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Subject: RE: [Iptel] Sending draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np to IESG
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Cullen,

I just submitted -08 version.

This is to inform the list that the title of the I-D has changed.   Any
future reference to this document should reflect the new title in
addition to the new version # and new date.

James

-----Original Message-----
From: Cullen Jennings [mailto:fluffy@cisco.com]=20
Sent: Tuesday, December 13, 2005 8:49 PM
To: Alexander Mayrhofer; iptel@ietf.org; Yu, James
Cc: Rich Shockey
Subject: Re: [Iptel] Sending draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np to IESG


Alex thanks for the detail review.

James, any idea when we could have a rev that addressed these and
Vijay's
comments? I would really really like to have this sent to the AD before
the
holidays.=20

Thanks, Cullen.


PS - I agree that SHALL or MUST is left to your discretion - I'm happy
either way. I will note that the MAY/SHOULD/MUST are used the most and
many
people seem more familiar with those.




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--NextPart

A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the IP Telephony Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Number Portability Parameters for the "tel" URI
	Author(s)	: J. Yu
	Filename	: draft-ietf-iptel-tel-np-08.txt
	Pages		: 13
	Date		: 2005-12-21
	
This document defines five parameters in the "tel" Uniform Resource 
   Identifier (URI) to carry the number portability (NP)-related 
   information.  Those parameters can be passed to the next-hop network 
   node after an NP database dip has been performed.

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