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Hi James,

Now that I've spent a few hours on our implementation, let me add my two =
cents as well:



On Nov 14, 2012, at 3:06 PM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:

> Gustavo,
>=20
> Below is my feedback for draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01:
>=20
> 	=95 High level
> 		=95 There was support for an <extension> element for =
each of the objects (domain, host, and contact) in =
draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-escrow-02 that never made it into =
draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping.  What is the mechanism to =
include attribute extensions for the objects?
> 	=95 Domain Object
> 		=95 Based on feedback to the NNDN Object I suggest =
adding the following domain object elements:
> 			=95 <uName> - An OPTIONAL UTF-8 encoded fully =
qualified name of the IDN domain name object.
> 			=95 <idn> - An OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating =
if the domain name object is an IDN domain name object.
> 			=95 <language> - An OPTIONAL language tag value =
for an IDN domain name object. The language tag value MUST be one of the =
<language> elements contained in an <idnTableRef> element
> 			=95 <variant> - An OPTIONAL boolean flag =
indicating if the domain name object is an IDN variant domain name =
object. If the <variant> value is "true" the <originalName> SHOULD be =
set with the original IDN domain name object.
> 			=95 <originalName> - An OPTIONAL fully qualified =
name of the original IDN domain name object related to the variant =
domain name object. This value SHOULD be set if <variant> is "true".
> 			=95 <reserved> - An OPTIONAL boolean flag =
indicating if the domain name object is a reserved domain name object. A =
reserved domain name object is not registered by a client but by the =
server to ensure that it can't be registered by a client.



This seems reasonable and it would remove the need to have the NNDN =
Object.



> 		=95 <deDate> is not typically a true data element in the =
SRS since it is calculated by the RGP policies.  There can be other =
statuses that have additional date policies like other pending statuses =
(pendingCreate, pendingUpdate, pendingRestore).  It would be better to =
include a date (created date) that a status was set that matches what is =
typically included in the data model along with a pending status policy =
set of elements.  This way it makes it straight forward to create the =
deposits and consume the deposits.

Agreed, we should remove it!


> 		=95 <variantGenerator> might not be needed.  If variants =
are blocked or available only to the registrant of the original IDN then =
that could be captured in a registry policy descriptor instead of on a =
per domain basis.  Inclusion of the canonical variant won't be of much =
use for an EBERO provider, since the EBERO provider would generate the =
canonical variant using their canonical variant generation function.=20


+1



> =20
> 	=95 Host Object
> 		=95 Should an optional <uName> be supported similar to a =
<uName> element for the domain object?

Yes

> 		=95 Should a <parentDomain> element be added?
> 			=95 An OPTIONAL parent domain name for the =
subordinate host object.


No, this can be calculated by looking at the labels.


> 		=95 Could add an <idn> element similar to what I propose =
for the domain object
> 			=95 An OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the =
host object is an IDN host object.


We could trigger that with the presence of the uName field above.=20


> 	=95 Contact Object
> 		=95 The <roid> element is missing from the list of =
elements
> 		=95 Registrar contacts =E7an be different from object =
contacts since they are typically not provisioned via EPP and they could =
have types directly assigned to them (admin, tech, billing, legal, =
icann, abuse, etc.). It would be good to be able to identify which =
contacts are registrar contacts versus object contacts and support a set =
of optional registrar contact elements. The registrar contact could be =
routed to a different data source (e.g. account / registrar database) =
instead of being included in the registry database directly.  The =
draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping-01 draft defines some of the =
registrar contact specific attributes for reference.

I agree with this approach, we in fact have two separate databases, so =
it makes a lot of sense to me.


> 	=95 Registrar Object
> 		=95 It would be good to support a <status> element that =
could support a single status value like below with an optional name =
attribute to define the sub-status or the custom status name:
> 			=95 ok - A normal status value for a registrar =
object.
> 			=95 Hold - A restricted status value for a =
registrar object.
> 			=95 Terminated - A status for a registrar object =
that has no remaining access or privileges.
> 			=95 Custom - A custom status that is defined =
using the "name" attribute.

Works for me.


> 		=95 Recommend not reusing the <postalInfo> element of =
the contact object for the registrar.  I recommend including the  =
following registrar specific elements:
> 			=95 <name> - One or two <rdeRegistrar:name> =
elements that contain the name of the registrar. Two elements are =
provided so that name information can be provided in both =
internationlized and localized forms
> 			=95 <addr> from the contact <postalInfo> =
element.

+1


> 		=95 I don't believe there is any need for an <authInfo> =
element for the registrar object.


Excellent point, in fact, we don't currently store the registrar's =
password in the clear (it is handled by the database), and since there =
is already the need to get new certificate requests signed for TLS =
validation, that is something that can be configured at that time, no =
need to risk storing passwords in the clear because I'm envisioning that =
there will be humans involved in getting the registrars on board.


> 		=95 Add <crID> <upID> elements similar to the other =
objects.
> 	=95 NNDN Object=20
> 		=95 Wouldn't it be better to merge the domain object =
with the NNDN object, since the NNDN object attributes are just =
additional attributes for domains (e.g. IDN domain)


Yes, lets get rid of it.

Finally, I've been trying to setup the XML Schema Validation, but have =
found the Schemas to be poorly defined, specially when using =
complexTypes from EPP objects. Unless I'm missing something, we'll have =
to re-define the complexTypes in the rde* Schemas, to avoid using the =
EPP namespaces in the rde* instances.

t/tmp/test_01.xml:1: element name: Schemas validity error : Element =
'{urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:rdeContact-1.0}name': This element is not =
expected. Expected is ( {urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:contact-1.0}name ).





Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE=

From fobispo@isc.org  Wed Dec  5 18:00:06 2012
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So I'm now trying to go in more detail on the CSV implementation, to try =
to understand its benefits.

So far I've found the following cons of this approach:

1) It does not eliminate the need of having to code, whoever implements
   this, is going to have to write some scripts to generate the =
enclosing
   XML file, and generate all the CSVs in the right format. In fact, I =
believe
   there is going to be more work associated with this approach, see #2.

2) There's the issue of Validation of the data. The fields are defined
   using an XML Schema (i.e.: <rdeCsv:fName>  Name field with =
type=3D"eppcom:labelType")
   which will create the need of writing a program to implement all of =
the
   types used in the schema for validation.

3) We now have more files to process/store/sign, instead of just one.


I'm not done with my tests yet, but I've been able to compress an XML =
file
with BZIP2 to 1/15th of its original size. I'm not envisioning that this =
is
going to be a problem for most registries.

I'll provide more feedback later,


Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE

On Oct 25, 2012, at 1:43 PM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:

> All,
>=20
> We have created a draft of the Domain Name Registration Data (DNRD) =
Comma-Separated Values (CSV) Objects Mapping that is attached for review =
and feedback.  We intend to post it to the IETF as an I-D once the =
submission page is available on November 5th.  This draft fully supports =
the Registry Data Escrow Specification =
(draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-escrow-04).  It defines the CSV files =
and the order and format of the CSV fields for the data escrow of domain =
name, host, contact, registrar, and IDN language objects.  If there is =
interest in this model we can consider merging it with the Domain Name =
Registration Data (DNRD) Objects Mapping =
(draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01).  The basis of using CSV =
files for DNRD objects includes:
>=20
> 	=95 CSV is a natural format for exporting and importing data =
from and to a database.  This could greatly simplify the generation of =
the data escrow files as well as the consumption of the files by an =
EBERO provider. =20
> 	=95 XML is a highly verbose format that will adversely affect =
the processing of large data sets .  With the draft, XML can be used for =
definition and CSV can be used for data, so the duplication of the =
descriptive information does not have to be used for every record. =20
> 		=95 If you take the domain object (<rdeDomain:domain>) =
example from draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01 and convert it =
to CSV files (domain, dnssec, and domainTransfer) you save around 75% =
uncompressed and 82% compressed using CSV. =20
> 		=95 Extrapolating out the uncompressed size of a =
<rdeDomain:domain> records (1718 bytes versus 416 bytes uncompressed per =
record) for XML and CSV,  you get to 1.7 GB with XML and 443 MB for CSV =
with 1 million records and 170 GB with XML and 44.3 GB for CSV with 100 =
million records.
> 		=95 The deposits are generated uncompressed, validated, =
compressed and transferred by registry, and uncompressed, validated and =
stored by the data escrow provider.  Both the size difference and the =
processing resources required for both the registry and the data escrow =
provider should be considered when comparing the two models. =20
> 		=95 EBERO providers must transfer, uncompress, validate, =
and import the data into their database from the data escrow deposits, =
where the larger the files and the processing resources required, the =
longer it will take to recover the TLD. =20
> 		=95 The full deposit is done weekly, so it is a weekly =
hit for all registries, where the larger the registry the bigger the =
hit. =20
> Please review the attached draft and provide any feedback for =
consideration. =20
>=20
> Thanks,
>=20
> --
>  =20
> JG
> =20
> <86BF0728-DD04-4F90-8380-5AA8A9AB5D0B[81].png>
> =20
> James Gould
> Principal Software Engineer
> jgould@verisign.com
> =20
> 703-948-3271 (Office)
> 12061 Bluemont Way
> Reston, VA 20190
> VerisignInc.com
>=20
>=20
> =
<draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping.txt>____________________________=
___________________
> ire mailing list
> ire@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire


From JGould@verisign.com  Thu Dec  6 06:32:24 2012
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To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] DNRD CSV Draft
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Francisco,

Thanks for the reply, my feedback is embedded below.

--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/5/12 8:59 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>So I'm now trying to go in more detail on the CSV implementation, to try
>to understand its benefits.
>
>So far I've found the following cons of this approach:
>
>1) It does not eliminate the need of having to code, whoever implements
>   this, is going to have to write some scripts to generate the enclosing
>   XML file, and generate all the CSVs in the right format. In fact, I
>believe
>   there is going to be more work associated with this approach, see #2.

I disagree with this.  First the XML definition that follows
draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-escrow-04 would be primarily static
content, with the dynamic content being the file names and optionally the
file checksums.  You could use a templating language (e.g. Apache
Velocity) or simple string replacement to replace the file names and
checksums in the static definition XML file.  This is very straight
forward and might take less time then the time that I'm taking creating
this e-mail.  You define the fields that are applicable to your registry
in the XML definition and then you're free to use any tool (off the shelf
or custom) to generate the CSV files. The CSV files map one-to-one with a
relational schema, so there is very little transformation required.  The
all XML approach of draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01 requires a
relational to object conversion, that is far more complex and is far more
work then dumping fields from a relational schema to a set of CSV files.
=20


>
>2) There's the issue of Validation of the data. The fields are defined
>   using an XML Schema (i.e.: <rdeCsv:fName>  Name field with
>type=3D"eppcom:labelType")
>   which will create the need of writing a program to implement all of the
>   types used in the schema for validation.

I do agree that there is the need to create a custom validation program
that validates XSD field format definitions to the CSV data fields.  I
believe that the community can create this tool, and we would certainly
like to participate in that effort.  The fact that you can validate XML
using an XML parser doesn't mean that we should make the generation and
consumption of the data escrows more complex to forgo having to build a
new validation program.  The field types defined in
draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping-00 utilize XSD types, so it's a
matter of reusing parts of the XML Parsers to validate individual field
elements.    =20


>
>3) We now have more files to process/store/sign, instead of just one.

The files could be placed and compressed into a ZIP file per the AGB, so
the number of contained files is not relevant for transfer, signing, and
storage. =20


>
>
>I'm not done with my tests yet, but I've been able to compress an XML file
>with BZIP2 to 1/15th of its original size. I'm not envisioning that this
>is
>going to be a problem for most registries.

You can also compress the CSV files down to 1/15th of their original size.
 You can't ignore the uncompressed size from the processing though.  The
compression can be done to reduce the transfer time and the storage costs.
 You should compare the uncompressed and compressed deposits using CSV and
XML with incrementally larger randomized data sets.  I believe you will
find a large advantage with the use of CSV from a size perspective.  I
fundamentally believe that the draft should address all registries
independent of its size.  Saying that some of the registries will have an
problem with the use of XML to me is a showstopper for XML deposits.

>
>I'll provide more feedback later,
>
>
>Francisco Obispo=20
>Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>email: fobispo@isc.org
>Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>
>On Oct 25, 2012, at 1:43 PM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>
>> All,
>>=20
>> We have created a draft of the Domain Name Registration Data (DNRD)
>>Comma-Separated Values (CSV) Objects Mapping that is attached for review
>>and feedback.  We intend to post it to the IETF as an I-D once the
>>submission page is available on November 5th.  This draft fully supports
>>the Registry Data Escrow Specification
>>(draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-escrow-04).  It defines the CSV files
>>and the order and format of the CSV fields for the data escrow of domain
>>name, host, contact, registrar, and IDN language objects.  If there is
>>interest in this model we can consider merging it with the Domain Name
>>Registration Data (DNRD) Objects Mapping
>>(draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01).  The basis of using CSV
>>files for DNRD objects includes:
>>=20
>> 	=80 CSV is a natural format for exporting and importing data from and t=
o
>>a database.  This could greatly simplify the generation of the data
>>escrow files as well as the consumption of the files by an EBERO
>>provider. =20
>> 	=80 XML is a highly verbose format that will adversely affect the
>>processing of large data sets .  With the draft, XML can be used for
>>definition and CSV can be used for data, so the duplication of the
>>descriptive information does not have to be used for every record.
>> 		=80 If you take the domain object (<rdeDomain:domain>) example from
>>draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01 and convert it to CSV files
>>(domain, dnssec, and domainTransfer) you save around 75% uncompressed
>>and 82% compressed using CSV.
>> 		=80 Extrapolating out the uncompressed size of a <rdeDomain:domain>
>>records (1718 bytes versus 416 bytes uncompressed per record) for XML
>>and CSV,  you get to 1.7 GB with XML and 443 MB for CSV with 1 million
>>records and 170 GB with XML and 44.3 GB for CSV with 100 million records.
>> 		=80 The deposits are generated uncompressed, validated, compressed and
>>transferred by registry, and uncompressed, validated and stored by the
>>data escrow provider.  Both the size difference and the processing
>>resources required for both the registry and the data escrow provider
>>should be considered when comparing the two models.
>> 		=80 EBERO providers must transfer, uncompress, validate, and import th=
e
>>data into their database from the data escrow deposits, where the larger
>>the files and the processing resources required, the longer it will take
>>to recover the TLD.
>> 		=80 The full deposit is done weekly, so it is a weekly hit for all
>>registries, where the larger the registry the bigger the hit.
>> Please review the attached draft and provide any feedback for
>>consideration. =20
>>=20
>> Thanks,
>>=20
>> --
>>  =20
>> JG
>> =20
>> <86BF0728-DD04-4F90-8380-5AA8A9AB5D0B[81].png>
>> =20
>> James Gould
>> Principal Software Engineer
>> jgould@verisign.com
>> =20
>> 703-948-3271 (Office)
>> 12061 Bluemont Way
>> Reston, VA 20190
>> VerisignInc.com
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>><draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping.txt>___________________________
>>____________________
>> ire mailing list
>> ire@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>


From fobispo@isc.org  Thu Dec  6 10:58:07 2012
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Hi James,

Thanks for replying.

Here's another set of comments:


On Dec 6, 2012, at 6:32 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:

> I disagree with this.  First the XML definition that follows
> draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-escrow-04 would be primarily static
> content, with the dynamic content being the file names and optionally =
the
> file checksums. =20

And the watermark, and options (resend, etc.)


> You could use a templating language (e.g. Apache
> Velocity) or simple string replacement to replace the file names and
> checksums in the static definition XML file.

I've found this to be very dangerous in some situations, so I prefer to =
generate XML files the proper way to assure that they are well formed.

Also we're dealing with Name registries that are already using or will =
be using EPP, which is XML based, so they should have expertise in house =
to deal with that.


>  This is very straight
> forward and might take less time then the time that I'm taking =
creating
> this e-mail.  You define the fields that are applicable to your =
registry
> in the XML definition and then you're free to use any tool (off the =
shelf
> or custom) to generate the CSV files.

I've written both specs in two days, I'm also planning to build a tool =
that can load the XML into a database without the need of having to do =
any conversions. Using a FDW (Foreign Data Wrapper). And if I end up =
with free time, I'll write a XSLT to convert the XML to CSV, which =
should be very straightforward. :-)


> The CSV files map one-to-one with a
> relational schema, so there is very little transformation required.  =
The
> all XML approach of draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01 =
requires a
> relational to object conversion, that is far more complex and is far =
more
> work then dumping fields from a relational schema to a set of CSV =
files.


This is not necessarily true, I've found myself doing some massaging to =
make our schema fit some of the specs, so it might be the case for some =
registries that might be able to do just one SELECT or COPY and export =
the data, but not all.

Also, ICANN might want to enforce a minimum set of fields to make sure =
that the recovered registry is useful, this is something that is up for =
discussion of course.

And BTW, we're not planning to use neither Incremental or Differential =
files, Data Escrow providers will not keep track of the state of the =
registry, just merely validate and store files in case ICANN decides to =
failover a registry. So we decided that the safest method was to use =
full dumps to keep the data consistent at all times.

One last thing:

It seems at least from having implemented both approaches, that both =
solutions will have its pro and its cons, its kind of like trying to =
keep a piece of cardboard flat on the ground , you step on it on one =
side, and the other side comes up.=20

If we make it really easy for registries, we might end up making it =
harder for escrow providers and EBEROs, and if we make it really easy =
for escrow and EBEROs we might end up adding more work for registries.=20=


I personally think that the XML is much easier to recover, it's self =
contained, and with some of the tools mentioned above (FDW, XLTs), =
anyone wanting to consume the data can do it without much effort (at =
least for a registry without complicated extensions). The CSV approach =
might be simpler or not, but will require more effort to recover since =
the consumer will have to implement a recovery procedure based on the =
XML spec and massage data to make it fit to their schemas, and since =
we're allowing registries to specify custom fields, it's not going to be =
trivial.

Best regards,


Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE



From JGould@verisign.com  Thu Dec  6 13:47:36 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] DNRD CSV Draft
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Francisco,=20

My replies are again embedded below.

--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/6/12 1:57 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>Hi James,
>
>Thanks for replying.
>
>Here's another set of comments:
>
>
>On Dec 6, 2012, at 6:32 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>
>> I disagree with this.  First the XML definition that follows
>> draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-escrow-04 would be primarily static
>> content, with the dynamic content being the file names and optionally
>>the
>> file checksums.=20
>
>And the watermark, and options (resend, etc.)

JG - Yes, the watermark and options can be variables in the mostly static
XML definition file.


>
>
>> You could use a templating language (e.g. Apache
>> Velocity) or simple string replacement to replace the file names and
>> checksums in the static definition XML file.
>
>I've found this to be very dangerous in some situations, so I prefer to
>generate XML files the proper way to assure that they are well formed.
>
>Also we're dealing with Name registries that are already using or will be
>using EPP, which is XML based, so they should have expertise in house to
>deal with that.

JG - I'm not saying that the registries can't produce the XML definition
file without the use of templates, I'm just saying that since the XML file
itself is mostly static, simple techniques can be used to fill the dynamic
content.  In either event it should be very straight forward to generate
the XML definition file that includes references to a set of external CSV
files. =20

>
>
>>  This is very straight
>> forward and might take less time then the time that I'm taking creating
>> this e-mail.  You define the fields that are applicable to your registry
>> in the XML definition and then you're free to use any tool (off the
>>shelf
>> or custom) to generate the CSV files.
>
>I've written both specs in two days, I'm also planning to build a tool
>that can load the XML into a database without the need of having to do
>any conversions. Using a FDW (Foreign Data Wrapper). And if I end up with
>free time, I'll write a XSLT to convert the XML to CSV, which should be
>very straightforward. :-)

JG - The good news it that you don't need to do much work at all to
support CSV data files since the databases should already support them :-)

>
>
>> The CSV files map one-to-one with a
>> relational schema, so there is very little transformation required.  The
>> all XML approach of draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01
>>requires a
>> relational to object conversion, that is far more complex and is far
>>more
>> work then dumping fields from a relational schema to a set of CSV files.
>
>
>This is not necessarily true, I've found myself doing some massaging to
>make our schema fit some of the specs, so it might be the case for some
>registries that might be able to do just one SELECT or COPY and export
>the data, but not all.

JG - Correct, one size doesn't fit all.  In general, a registry that is
using a relational database can define the CSV fields in the XML
definition file that matches their system and then generate the CSV files
using standard tools.  The only massaging required is to format some of
the fields in a specific way, like formatting date and times in an XSD
dataTime format. =20


>
>Also, ICANN might want to enforce a minimum set of fields to make sure
>that the recovered registry is useful, this is something that is up for
>discussion of course.

JG - I would like to know what the minimum set of fields would be.  I do
agree that if a registry is supporting EPP that there should be a minimum
set of fields stored in the database and subsequently in the data escrow.

>
>And BTW, we're not planning to use neither Incremental or Differential
>files, Data Escrow providers will not keep track of the state of the
>registry, just merely validate and store files in case ICANN decides to
>failover a registry. So we decided that the safest method was to use full
>dumps to keep the data consistent at all times.

JG - Does this mean that incremental or differential deposits is not a
requirement but an option?

>
>One last thing:
>
>It seems at least from having implemented both approaches, that both
>solutions will have its pro and its cons, its kind of like trying to keep
>a piece of cardboard flat on the ground , you step on it on one side, and
>the other side comes up.
>
>If we make it really easy for registries, we might end up making it
>harder for escrow providers and EBEROs, and if we make it really easy for
>escrow and EBEROs we might end up adding more work for registries.
>
>I personally think that the XML is much easier to recover, it's self
>contained, and with some of the tools mentioned above (FDW, XLTs), anyone
>wanting to consume the data can do it without much effort (at least for a
>registry without complicated extensions). The CSV approach might be
>simpler or not, but will require more effort to recover since the
>consumer will have to implement a recovery procedure based on the XML
>spec and massage data to make it fit to their schemas, and since we're
>allowing registries to specify custom fields, it's not going to be
>trivial.

JG - I believe that CSV will be easier and faster for the EBERO provider
to recover the data.  The EBERO provider will have some target database
schema to import into and they will be given a deposit that includes a
definition file of the records and fields that that can easily map to
their schema.  The extension of attributes is a reality independent of the
deposit format, where an EBERO provider might store additional attributes
in general fields to keep the data together, but might not actually do
anything with them.  In both cases (XML and CSV), extensions are defined
in separate XSD files.  The only difference is that with XML the EBERO
provider would need to decode the XML that includes the attribute
extensions and with CSV they would identify attribute extensions in the
field definition and import them into the appropriate generic location.



>
>Best regards,
>
>
>Francisco Obispo=20
>Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>email: fobispo@isc.org
>Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>
>


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Hi James,

Well, it's ok to disagree on some implementation issues, but I'm glad to =
see that we are mostly in the same page with regards to the rest of the =
implementation.

with regards to:

> JG - Does this mean that incremental or differential deposits is not a
> requirement but an option?

It seems like that is the case, the feedback that I got was that as long =
as what we provide is better than what is required, we should be good to =
go.


Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


From fobispo@isc.org  Fri Dec  7 13:13:14 2012
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From: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
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Subject: Re: [ire] DNRD CSV Draft
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What is the next step on this?

Should we arrange a call between:

* ICANN
* Ebero applicants
* Registry Backend Operators
* Escrow providers
* Anyone else interested

To try to understand the various point of views and try to derive a =
conclusion?

I'm a bit worried that time keeps passing and there are still several =
pieces that have not come to clear definition.

Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE

On Dec 6, 2012, at 1:52 PM, Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

> Hi James,
>=20
> Well, it's ok to disagree on some implementation issues, but I'm glad =
to see that we are mostly in the same page with regards to the rest of =
the implementation.
>=20
> with regards to:
>=20
>> JG - Does this mean that incremental or differential deposits is not =
a
>> requirement but an option?
>=20
> It seems like that is the case, the feedback that I got was that as =
long as what we provide is better than what is required, we should be =
good to go.
>=20
>=20
> Francisco Obispo=20
> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
> email: fobispo@isc.org
> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> ire mailing list
> ire@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire


From JGould@verisign.com  Fri Dec  7 14:18:05 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] DNRD CSV Draft
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Francisco.

A call is a good idea.  Can you set that up?

JG

James F. Gould
Principal Engineer
Verisign

jgould@verisign.com

On Dec 7, 2012, at 4:13 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

> What is the next step on this?
>=20
> Should we arrange a call between:
>=20
> * ICANN
> * Ebero applicants
> * Registry Backend Operators
> * Escrow providers
> * Anyone else interested
>=20
> To try to understand the various point of views and try to derive a concl=
usion?
>=20
> I'm a bit worried that time keeps passing and there are still several pie=
ces that have not come to clear definition.
>=20
> Francisco Obispo=20
> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
> email: fobispo@isc.org
> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>=20
> On Dec 6, 2012, at 1:52 PM, Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:
>=20
>> Hi James,
>>=20
>> Well, it's ok to disagree on some implementation issues, but I'm glad to=
 see that we are mostly in the same page with regards to the rest of the im=
plementation.
>>=20
>> with regards to:
>>=20
>>> JG - Does this mean that incremental or differential deposits is not a
>>> requirement but an option?
>>=20
>> It seems like that is the case, the feedback that I got was that as long=
 as what we provide is better than what is required, we should be good to g=
o.
>>=20
>>=20
>> Francisco Obispo=20
>> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>> email: fobispo@isc.org
>> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
>> ire mailing list
>> ire@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>=20

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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Gustavo,

I noticed the following additional items with draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-obje=
cts-mapping-01:


  1.  The description of the <crID> and <upID> should match what is in the =
EPP RFC's.  Specifically, change "identifier of the registrar" to "identifi=
er of the client".  In our registries we have account users (verisign as we=
ll as registrar) that are reflected in the <crID> and <upID> fields via the=
 user's user name (e.g. jgould).  This is important to track exactly who to=
ok the action, since actions can be taken outside of the EPP channel (Regis=
trar Tool, CSR Tool, batch) that should properly be reflected in the <crID>=
 and <upID> elements.  Now the next logical question is whether there needs=
 to be a deposit for users to link the "client identifiers" to.  I would im=
agine that an EBERO provider would import the <crID> and <upID> fields as s=
trings and replace them (most likely using different fields) with real user=
 identifiers based on future updates to the objects.
  2.  The question is whether the authInfo should be escrowed at all since =
these reflect secret passwords.  Our system stores them encrypted and I don=
't believe it is a good security practice to escrow them in a decrypted for=
m or even provide a tool that can decrypt them.  I believe that the EBERO p=
rovider recovering a registry from the data escrow deposit can generate new=
 random authorization info values and make them available in bulk to the re=
gistrars or on-demand by the registrars submitting an EPP info command for =
the objects.  What are your thoughts with this?

--

JG

[cid:B4B186C8-7F18-4E68-8BF2-41748125A70A]

James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com

703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com



From: <Gould>, James Gould <jgould@verisign.com<mailto:jgould@verisign.com>=
>
Date: Wednesday, November 14, 2012 6:06 PM
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.or=
g>>, "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>=
>
Subject: Re: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)

Gustavo,

Below is my feedback for draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01:


  *   High level
     *   There was support for an <extension> element for each of the objec=
ts (domain, host, and contact) in draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-escrow-=
02 that never made it into draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping.  What =
is the mechanism to include attribute extensions for the objects?
  *   Domain Object
     *   Based on feedback to the NNDN Object I suggest adding the followin=
g domain object elements:
        *   <uName> - An OPTIONAL UTF-8 encoded fully qualified name of the=
 IDN domain name object.
        *   <idn> - An OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the domain name =
object is an IDN domain name object.
        *   <language> - An OPTIONAL language tag value for an IDN domain n=
ame object. The language tag value MUST be one of the <language> elements c=
ontained in an <idnTableRef> element
        *   <variant> - An OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the domain n=
ame object is an IDN variant domain name object. If the <variant> value is =
"true" the <originalName> SHOULD be set with the original IDN domain name o=
bject.
        *   <originalName> - An OPTIONAL fully qualified name of the origin=
al IDN domain name object related to the variant domain name object. This v=
alue SHOULD be set if <variant> is "true".
        *   <reserved> - An OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the domain =
name object is a reserved domain name object. A reserved domain name object=
 is not registered by a client but by the server to ensure that it can't be=
 registered by a client.
     *   <deDate> is not typically a true data element in the SRS since it =
is calculated by the RGP policies.  There can be other statuses that have a=
dditional date policies like other pending statuses (pendingCreate, pending=
Update, pendingRestore).  It would be better to include a date (created dat=
e) that a status was set that matches what is typically included in the dat=
a model along with a pending status policy set of elements.  This way it ma=
kes it straight forward to create the deposits and consume the deposits.
     *   <variantGenerator> might not be needed.  If variants are blocked o=
r available only to the registrant of the original IDN then that could be c=
aptured in a registry policy descriptor instead of on a per domain basis.  =
Inclusion of the canonical variant won't be of much use for an EBERO provid=
er, since the EBERO provider would generate the canonical variant using the=
ir canonical variant generation function.
  *   Host Object
     *   Should an optional <uName> be supported similar to a <uName> eleme=
nt for the domain object?
     *   Should a <parentDomain> element be added?
        *   An OPTIONAL parent domain name for the subordinate host object.
     *   Could add an <idn> element similar to what I propose for the domai=
n object
        *   An OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the host object is an ID=
N host object.
  *   Contact Object
     *   The <roid> element is missing from the list of elements
     *   Registrar contacts =E7an be different from object contacts since t=
hey are typically not provisioned via EPP and they could have types directl=
y assigned to them (admin, tech, billing, legal, icann, abuse, etc.). It wo=
uld be good to be able to identify which contacts are registrar contacts ve=
rsus object contacts and support a set of optional registrar contact elemen=
ts. The registrar contact could be routed to a different data source (e.g. =
account / registrar database) instead of being included in the registry dat=
abase directly.  The draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping-01 draft defi=
nes some of the registrar contact specific attributes for reference.
  *   Registrar Object
     *   It would be good to support a <status> element that could support =
a single status value like below with an optional name attribute to define =
the sub-status or the custom status name:
        *   ok - A normal status value for a registrar object.
        *   Hold - A restricted status value for a registrar object.
        *   Terminated - A status for a registrar object that has no remain=
ing access or privileges.
        *   Custom - A custom status that is defined using the "name" attri=
bute.
     *   Recommend not reusing the <postalInfo> element of the contact obje=
ct for the registrar.  I recommend including the following registrar specif=
ic elements:
        *   <name> - One or two <rdeRegistrar:name> elements that contain t=
he name of the registrar. Two elements are provided so that name informatio=
n can be provided in both internationlized and localized forms
        *   <addr> from the contact <postalInfo> element.
     *   I don't believe there is any need for an <authInfo> element for th=
e registrar object.
     *   Add <crID> <upID> elements similar to the other objects.
  *   NNDN Object
     *   Wouldn't it be better to merge the domain object with the NNDN obj=
ect, since the NNDN object attributes are just additional attributes for do=
mains (e.g. IDN domain)
     *   The <uName> element could be an optional domain object element
     *   The domain object could include an <idn> element that indicates wh=
ether the domain name is an IDN domain name.
     *   The <nameState> element could be reflected with the following opti=
onal domain object boolean elements:
        *   <reserved> element that matches the "blocked" tag
        *   <withheld> element that matches the "withheld" tag
        *   <variant> element that matches the "allocated" tag.  A domain o=
bject marked as a <variant> SHOULD include a <originalName> domain object e=
lement that includes the name of the original IDN (OIDN).
     *   <crDate> would already be covered by the domain object <crDate>
     *   <originElement> could be handled with an OPTIONAL domain object <o=
riginalName> element that references the domain name of the original IDN (O=
IDN) for a registered variant.  Replicating the registrant I don't believe =
would serve much of a purpose since the business logic could apply registra=
nt equivalence or precedence rules between related IDN domains (OIDN and VI=
DN's).

--

JG



James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com<mailto:jgould@verisign.com>

703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com






On 10/24/12 9:13 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gust=
avo.lozano@icann.org>> wrote:

All,

New versions of both data escrow drafts have been published:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-escrow-04

* The main update is regarding IDN variant handling. ICANN have been
working on the IDN variants project for some time and knowledge gathered
from this project has been incorporated into
draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01.
* Some elements were removed because they were redundant and could be
derived from other elements.
* Several elements are now OPTIONAL to accommodate different domain name
registry business models.

We would like to get feedback regarding these new versions of the drafts,
especially regarding the proposed IDN variants handling approach.

Expect a new version of the drafts shortly in which we propose the
extension mechanism.

Thank you.

Regards,
Gustavo

_______________________________________________
ire mailing list
ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>
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--_000_C41D7AF7FCECBE44940E9477E8E70D7A0D740B8DBRN1WNEXMBX02vc_
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Diso-8859-=
1">
</head>
<body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-lin=
e-break: after-white-space; ">
<div>
<div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, s=
ans-serif; ">
Gustavo,</div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, s=
ans-serif; ">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; "><font face=3D"Consola=
s">I noticed the following additional items with&nbsp;draft-arias-noguchi-d=
nrd-objects-mapping-01:</font></div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; "><font face=3D"Consola=
s"><br>
</font></div>
<ol>
<li><font face=3D"Consolas">The description of the &lt;crID&gt; and &lt;upI=
D&gt; should match what is in the EPP RFC's. &nbsp;Specifically, change &qu=
ot;identifier of the registrar&quot; to &quot;identifier of the client&quot=
;. &nbsp;In our registries we have account users (verisign as well as regis=
trar)
 that are reflected in the &lt;crID&gt; and &lt;upID&gt; fields via the use=
r's user name (e.g. jgould). &nbsp;This is important to track&nbsp;exactly&=
nbsp;who took the action, since actions can be taken outside of the EPP cha=
nnel (Registrar Tool, CSR Tool, batch) that should properly
 be reflected in the &lt;crID&gt; and &lt;upID&gt; elements. &nbsp;Now the =
next logical question is whether there needs to be a deposit for users to l=
ink the &quot;client identifiers&quot; to. &nbsp;I&nbsp;would imagine that =
an EBERO provider would import the &lt;crID&gt; and &lt;upID&gt; fields as =
strings
 and replace them (most likely using different fields) with real user&nbsp;=
identifiers&nbsp;based on&nbsp;future updates to the objects.</font></li><l=
i><font face=3D"Consolas">The question is whether the authInfo should be es=
crowed at all since these reflect secret passwords. &nbsp;Our system stores=
 them encrypted and&nbsp;I&nbsp;don't believe it is a good security&nbsp;pr=
actice to escrow them in a decrypted form or even provide
 a tool that can decrypt them. &nbsp;I&nbsp;believe that the EBERO provider=
 recovering a registry from the data escrow deposit can generate new random=
 authorization info values and make them available in bulk to the registrar=
s or on-demand by the registrars submitting
 an EPP info command for the objects. &nbsp;What are your thoughts with thi=
s?&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></li></ol>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, s=
ans-serif; ">
<div>--&nbsp;</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">JG<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><img width=3D"75" height=3D"66" src=3D"ci=
d:B4B186C8-7F18-4E68-8BF2-41748125A70A" v:shapes=3D"Picture_x0020_1" type=
=3D"image/png"><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); "=
>James Gould</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">=
Principal Software Engineer</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(9, 0, 232); ">j=
gould@verisign.com</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">=
&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">=
703-948-3271 (Office)</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">=
12061 Bluemont Way</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">=
Reston, VA 20190</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: Cambria; ">
<span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); "><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"=
>VerisignInc.com</font></span><span style=3D"font-size: 16pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); "><font face=3D"Calibri" size=
=3D"3"><br>
</font></span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, s=
ans-serif; ">
<br>
</div>
<span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: =
14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:b=
lack; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM:=
 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid;=
 BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span>&lt;Gould&gt;, James Gould &l=
t;<a href=3D"mailto:jgould@verisign.com">jgould@verisign.com</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span>Wednesday, November 14, 2012 =
6:06 PM<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;, &quot;<a =
href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:i=
re@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Subject: </span>Re: [ire] New version (4) =
of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode=
: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">
<div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">Gustavo,</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">Below is my feedback f=
or draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01:</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"C=
onsolas,monospace"><br>
</font></div>
<ul>
<li style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"f=
ont-family: Consolas, monospace; ">High level</span>
<ul>
<li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-style: normal=
; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; font-family: Consolas, monosp=
ace; ">There was support for an &lt;extension&gt; element for each of the o=
bjects (domain, host, and contact) in&nbsp;draft-arias-noguchi-registry-dat=
a-escrow-02
 that never made it into&nbsp;draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping. &nb=
sp;What is the mechanism to include attribute extensions for the objects?</=
span></li></ul>
</li><li style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=
=3D"font-family: Consolas, monospace; ">Domain Object</span>
<ul style=3D"font-size: 14px; ">
<li style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font class=3D"Apple-style=
-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">Based on feedback to the NNDN Object I s=
uggest adding the following domain object elements:</font>
<ul style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<li><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">&lt;uName&=
gt; -&nbsp;</font><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; f=
ont-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-heig=
ht: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-tr=
ansform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-t=
ext-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rg=
b(255, 255, 255); display: inline !important; float: none; font-family: Con=
solas; ">An
 OPTIONAL UTF-8 encoded fully qualified name of the IDN domain name object.=
</span></li><li><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace=
">&lt;idn&gt; -&nbsp;</font><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style:=
 normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;=
 line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0p=
x; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;=
 -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background=
-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline !important; float: none; font-f=
amily: Consolas; ">An
 OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the domain name object is an IDN domai=
n name object.</span></li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-styl=
e: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; font-family: Consola=
s; ">&lt;language&gt; -&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); fon=
t-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing:=
 normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-in=
dent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spaci=
ng: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline !important; float: none=
; font-family: Consolas; ">An
 OPTIONAL language tag value for an IDN domain name object. The language ta=
g value MUST be one of the &lt;language&gt; elements contained in an &lt;id=
nTableRef&gt; element</span></li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); fo=
nt-family: Consolas; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decorati=
on: none; ">&lt;variant&gt; -&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0=
); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-sp=
acing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; t=
ext-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word=
-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0=
px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline !important; float=
: none; font-family: Consolas; ">An
 OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the domain name object is an IDN varia=
nt domain name object. If the &lt;variant&gt; value is &quot;true&quot; the=
 &lt;originalName&gt; SHOULD be set with the original IDN domain name objec=
t.</span></li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; f=
ont-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; font-family: Consolas; ">&lt;ori=
ginalName&gt; -&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style:=
 normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;=
 line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0p=
x; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;=
 -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background=
-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline !important; float: none; font-f=
amily: Consolas; ">An
 OPTIONAL fully qualified name of the original IDN domain name object relat=
ed to the variant domain name object. This value SHOULD be set if &lt;varia=
nt&gt; is &quot;true&quot;.</span></li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, =
0); font-family: Consolas; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-de=
coration: none; ">&lt;reserved&gt; -&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(=
0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; le=
tter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-=
auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: =
2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-w=
idth: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline !important=
; float: none; font-family: Consolas; ">An
 OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the domain name object is a reserved d=
omain name object. A reserved domain name object is not registered by a cli=
ent but by the server to ensure that it can't be registered by a client.</s=
pan></li></ul>
</li><li style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span style=3D"color:=
 rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; =
font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; ">&lt;deDate&gt; is not typical=
ly a true data element in the SRS since it is calculated
 by the RGP policies. &nbsp;There can be other statuses that have additiona=
l date policies like other pending statuses (pendingCreate, pendingUpdate, =
pendingRestore). &nbsp;It would be better to include a date (created date) =
that a status was set that matches what is
 typically included in the data model along with a pending status policy se=
t of elements. &nbsp;This way it makes it straight forward to create the de=
posits and consume the deposits.</span></li><li style=3D"font-family: Calib=
ri, sans-serif; "><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas=
; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration=
: none; ">&lt;variantGenerator&gt; might not be needed. &nbsp;If variants a=
re blocked or available
 only to the registrant of the original IDN then that could be captured in =
a registry policy descriptor instead of on a per domain basis. &nbsp;Inclus=
ion of the canonical variant won't be of much use for an EBERO provider, si=
nce the EBERO provider would generate
 the canonical variant using their canonical variant generation function. &=
nbsp;</span></li></ul>
</li><li style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); fo=
nt-family: Consolas; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-weight: norm=
al; text-decoration: none; ">Host Object</span>
<ul>
<li style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-fa=
mily: Consolas; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; t=
ext-decoration: none; ">Should an optional &lt;uName&gt; be supported simil=
ar to a &lt;uName&gt; element for the domain object?</span></li><li><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas">Should a &lt;parentDomain&gt; e=
lement be added?</font>
<ul>
<li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant: n=
ormal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; or=
phans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;=
 white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjus=
t: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 25=
5); display: inline !important; float: none; font-family: Consolas; ">An
 OPTIONAL parent domain name for the subordinate host object.</span></li></=
ul>
</li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-si=
ze: 14px; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; "=
>Could add an &lt;idn&gt; element similar to what I propose for the domain =
object</span>
<ul>
<li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-style: =
normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; "><span style=3D"color:=
 rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: norma=
l; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -we=
bkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; wid=
ows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-str=
oke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline !impo=
rtant; float: none; font-family: Consolas; ">An
 OPTIONAL boolean flag indicating if the host object is an IDN host object.=
</span></span></li></ul>
</li></ul>
</li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-si=
ze: 14px; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; "=
>Contact Object</span>
<ul>
<li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-size: 1=
4px; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; ">The =
&lt;roid&gt; element is missing from the list of elements</span></li><li><f=
ont class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas">Registrar contacts =E7an b=
e different from object contacts since they are typically not provisioned v=
ia EPP and they could have types directly assigned to them (admin, tech, bi=
lling, legal, icann, abuse, etc.).
 It would be good to be able to identify which contacts are registrar conta=
cts versus object contacts and support a set of optional registrar contact =
elements. The registrar contact could be routed to a different data source =
(e.g. account / registrar database)
 instead of being included in the registry database directly. &nbsp;The&nbs=
p;draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping-01 draft defines some of the reg=
istrar contact specific attributes for reference.</font></li></ul>
</li><li><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas">Registrar Objec=
t</font>
<ul>
<li><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas">It would be good to =
support a &lt;status&gt; element that could support a single status value l=
ike below with an optional name attribute to define the sub-status or the c=
ustom status name:</font>
<ul>
<li><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas">ok -&nbsp;</font><sp=
an style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: =
2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-=
space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto=
; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); dis=
play: inline !important; float: none; font-family: Consolas; ">A
 normal status value for a registrar object.</span></li><li><span style=3D"=
color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decorati=
on: none; font-family: Consolas; ">Hold -&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"color:=
 rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: norma=
l; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -we=
bkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; wid=
ows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-str=
oke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline !impo=
rtant; float: none; font-family: Consolas; ">A
 restricted status value for a registrar object.</span></li><li><span style=
=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-deco=
ration: none; font-family: Consolas; ">Terminated -&nbsp;</span><span style=
=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-wei=
ght: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-=
align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: n=
ormal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webki=
t-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: in=
line !important; float: none; font-family: Consolas; ">A
 status for a registrar object that has no remaining access or privileges.<=
/span></li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font=
-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; font-family: Consolas; ">Custom -&n=
bsp;</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-var=
iant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: nor=
mal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform=
: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-siz=
e-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, =
255, 255); display: inline !important; float: none; font-family: Consolas; =
">A
 custom status that is defined using the &quot;name&quot; attribute.</span>=
</li></ul>
</li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-si=
ze: 14px; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; "=
>Recommend not reusing the &lt;postalInfo&gt; element of the contact object=
 for the registrar. &nbsp;I recommend including the
 following registrar specific elements:</span>
<ul>
<li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-style: =
normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; ">&lt;name&gt; -&nbsp;<=
/span><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-variant:=
 normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; =
orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: non=
e; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adj=
ust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; background-color: rgb(255, 255, =
255); display: inline !important; float: none; font-family: Consolas; ">One
 or two &lt;rdeRegistrar:name&gt; elements that contain the name of the reg=
istrar. Two elements are provided so that name information can be provided =
in both internationlized and localized forms</span></li><li><span style=3D"=
color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decorati=
on: none; font-family: Consolas; ">&lt;addr&gt; from the contact &lt;postal=
Info&gt; element.</span></li></ul>
</li><li><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-si=
ze: 14px; font-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; "=
>I don't believe there is any need for an &lt;authInfo&gt; element for the =
registrar object.</span></li><li><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"C=
onsolas">Add &lt;crID&gt; &lt;upID&gt; elements similar to the other object=
s.</font></li></ul>
</li><li style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><fon=
t class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">NNDN Object&nbsp;<=
/font>
<ul style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<li style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Co=
nsolas,monospace">Wouldn't it be better to merge the domain object with the=
 NNDN object, since the NNDN object attributes are just additional attribut=
es for domains (e.g. IDN domain)</font></li><li style=3D"font-size: 14px; "=
><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-family: Consolas, monospace=
; ">The &lt;uName&gt; element could be an optional domain object element&nb=
sp;</span></li><li style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-s=
pan" style=3D"font-family: Consolas, monospace; "><span class=3D"Apple-styl=
e-span" style=3D"font-family: Calibri; font-size: medium; "><font class=3D"=
Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">The domain object
 could include an &lt;idn&gt; element that indicates whether the domain nam=
e&nbsp;</font></span><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-family:=
 Calibri; font-size: medium; "><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-sty=
le: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: norm=
al; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: -webkit-auto; text-indent:=
 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0=
px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; backgro=
und-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline !important; float: none; fon=
t-family: Consolas; ">is
 an IDN domain name.</span></span></span></li><li style=3D"font-size: 14px;=
 "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-family: Consolas, monospa=
ce; ">The &lt;nameState&gt; element could be reflected with the following o=
ptional domain object boolean elements:</span></li></ul>
<ul style=3D"font-size: 14px; ">
<ul style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<li><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">&lt;reserv=
ed&gt; element that matches the &quot;blocked&quot; tag</font></li><li><spa=
n style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Consolas; font-size: 14px; fon=
t-style: normal; font-weight: normal; text-decoration: none; ">&lt;withheld=
&gt; element that matches the &quot;withheld&quot; tag</span></li><li><font=
 class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas">&lt;variant&gt; element that =
matches the &quot;allocated&quot; tag. &nbsp;A domain object marked as a &l=
t;variant&gt; SHOULD include a &lt;originalName&gt; domain object element t=
hat includes the name of the original IDN (OIDN). &nbsp;</font></li></ul>
<li style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font class=3D"Apple-style=
-span" face=3D"Consolas">&lt;crDate&gt; would already be covered by the dom=
ain object &lt;crDate&gt;</font></li><li style=3D"font-family: Calibri, san=
s-serif; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas">&lt;originEle=
ment&gt; could be handled with an OPTIONAL domain object &lt;originalName&g=
t; element that references the domain name of the original IDN (OIDN) for a=
 registered
 variant. &nbsp;Replicating the registrant I don't believe would serve much=
 of a purpose since the business logic could apply registrant equivalence o=
r precedence rules between related IDN domains (OIDN and VIDN's). &nbsp;</f=
ont></li></ul>
</li></ul>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">--</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">&nbsp;&nbsp;</font></d=
iv>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">JG</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">&nbsp;</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">&nbsp;</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">James Gould</font></di=
v>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">Principal Software Eng=
ineer</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace"><a href=3D"mailto:jgou=
ld@verisign.com">jgould@verisign.com</a></font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">&nbsp;</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">703-948-3271 (Office)<=
/font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">12061 Bluemont Way</fo=
nt></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">Reston, VA 20190</font=
></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace">VerisignInc.com</font>=
</div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Consolas,monospace"><br>
</font></div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Consolas, monospace; font-size: 12px; "><br>
</div>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Consolas, monospace; font-size: 12px; "><br>
</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Consolas, monospace; font-size: 12px; ">On 10/24=
/12 9:13 PM, &quot;Gustavo Lozano&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gustavo.lozan=
o@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt; wrote:</div>
<div style=3D"font-family: Consolas, monospace; font-size: 12px; "><br>
</div>
<blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style=3D"font-family:=
 Consolas, monospace; font-size: 12px; border-left-color: rgb(181, 196, 223=
); border-left-width: 5px; border-left-style: solid; padding-top: 0px; padd=
ing-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-top: 0px; ma=
rgin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 5px; ">
<div>All,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div></div>
<div>New versions of both data escrow drafts have been published:</div>
<div></div>
<div><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects=
-mapping-01">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-ma=
pping-01</a></div>
<div><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arias-noguchi-registry-dat=
a-escrow-04">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-arias-noguchi-registry-data-e=
scrow-04</a></div>
<div></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>* The main update is regarding IDN variant handling. ICANN have been</=
div>
<div>working on the IDN variants project for some time and knowledge gather=
ed</div>
<div>from this project has been incorporated into</div>
<div>draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01.</div>
<div>* Some elements were removed because they were redundant and could be<=
/div>
<div>derived from other elements.</div>
<div>* Several elements are now OPTIONAL to accommodate different domain na=
me</div>
<div>registry business models.</div>
<div></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>We would like to get feedback regarding these new versions of the draf=
ts,</div>
<div>especially regarding the proposed IDN variants handling approach.</div=
>
<div></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Expect a new version of the drafts shortly in which we propose the</di=
v>
<div>extension mechanism.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Thank you.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards,</div>
<div>Gustavo</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>_______________________________________________</div>
<div>ire mailing list</div>
<div><a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a></div>
<div><a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire">https://www.ietf=
.org/mailman/listinfo/ire</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
</div>
</span>
</body>
</html>

--_000_C41D7AF7FCECBE44940E9477E8E70D7A0D740B8DBRN1WNEXMBX02vc_--

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From fobispo@isc.org  Thu Dec 13 09:25:58 2012
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Hi James,

On Dec 13, 2012, at 8:16 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:

> Gustavo,
>=20
> I noticed the following additional items with =
draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01:
>=20
> 	=95 The description of the <crID> and <upID> should match what =
is in the EPP RFC's.  Specifically, change "identifier of the registrar" =
to "identifier of the client".  In our registries we have account users =
(verisign as well as registrar) that are reflected in the <crID> and =
<upID> fields via the user's user name (e.g. jgould).  This is important =
to track exactly who took the action, since actions can be taken outside =
of the EPP channel (Registrar Tool, CSR Tool, batch) that should =
properly be reflected in the <crID> and <upID> elements.  Now the next =
logical question is whether there needs to be a deposit for users to =
link the "client identifiers" to.  I would imagine that an EBERO =
provider would import the <crID> and <upID> fields as strings and =
replace them (most likely using different fields) with real user =
identifiers based on future updates to the objects.

I don't know about that, from the EPP perspective a *ID is a registrar =
not a system user, so interchanging the two doesn't seem like a good =
idea to me.

You could use a separate field to track those changes, without affecting =
the EPP semantics.


> 	=95 The question is whether the authInfo should be escrowed at =
all since these reflect secret passwords.  Our system stores them =
encrypted and I don't believe it is a good security practice to escrow =
them in a decrypted form or even provide a tool that can decrypt them.  =
I believe that the EBERO provider recovering a registry from the data =
escrow deposit can generate new random authorization info values and =
make them available in bulk to the registrars or on-demand by the =
registrars submitting an EPP info command for the objects.  What are =
your thoughts with this? =20
> --=20

I agree with this, specially since the passwords are not the only =
component used to authenticate users, for example, we use IP addresses =
and TLS certificates as well, (we match the information in the =
certificate with the information associated with the clID)

In any case recovering a registry will require some time to setup these =
relationships, so I don't think there's a need to automate every single =
step.

>=20

Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


From JGould@verisign.com  Thu Dec 13 09:43:09 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Francisco,

My feedback is below.


--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/13/12 12:25 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>Hi James,
>
>On Dec 13, 2012, at 8:16 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>
>> Gustavo,
>>=20
>> I noticed the following additional items with
>>draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01:
>>=20
>> 	=80 The description of the <crID> and <upID> should match what is in th=
e
>>EPP RFC's.  Specifically, change "identifier of the registrar" to
>>"identifier of the client".  In our registries we have account users
>>(verisign as well as registrar) that are reflected in the <crID> and
>><upID> fields via the user's user name (e.g. jgould).  This is important
>>to track exactly who took the action, since actions can be taken outside
>>of the EPP channel (Registrar Tool, CSR Tool, batch) that should
>>properly be reflected in the <crID> and <upID> elements.  Now the next
>>logical question is whether there needs to be a deposit for users to
>>link the "client identifiers" to.  I would imagine that an EBERO
>>provider would import the <crID> and <upID> fields as strings and
>>replace them (most likely using different fields) with real user
>>identifiers based on future updates to the objects.
>
>I don't know about that, from the EPP perspective a *ID is a registrar
>not a system user, so interchanging the two doesn't seem like a good idea
>to me.
>
>You could use a separate field to track those changes, without affecting
>the EPP semantics.

Your interpretation is different from mine of the EPP specifications.  The
term client is generic, where the reference to the "sponsoring client" in
the description of <clID> refers to the registrar.  The reference to
simply "client" in the description of crID and upID can and should refer
to any client including the actual user. It makes no sense to only return
the sponsoring client information for the crID and upID fields, since they
would pretty much almost always match the same value of clID.  It's best
to reference the actual user (Registrar User, Registry User, or whoever)
actually created or updated the object via any of the supported channels
(EPP, Registrar Web Tool, CSR Web Tool, Batch, etc.).  I believe you need
to change the description of the crID and upID fields of the data escrow
to match that of the EPP specifications.  We can continue to debate our
interpretation of the EPP specification as it relates to the crID and upID
elements. =20


>
>
>> 	=80 The question is whether the authInfo should be escrowed at all sinc=
e
>>these reflect secret passwords.  Our system stores them encrypted and I
>>don't believe it is a good security practice to escrow them in a
>>decrypted form or even provide a tool that can decrypt them.  I believe
>>that the EBERO provider recovering a registry from the data escrow
>>deposit can generate new random authorization info values and make them
>>available in bulk to the registrars or on-demand by the registrars
>>submitting an EPP info command for the objects.  What are your thoughts
>>with this? =20
>> --=20
>
>I agree with this, specially since the passwords are not the only
>component used to authenticate users, for example, we use IP addresses
>and TLS certificates as well, (we match the information in the
>certificate with the information associated with the clID)
>
>In any case recovering a registry will require some time to setup these
>relationships, so I don't think there's a need to automate every single
>step.
>
>>=20
>
>Francisco Obispo=20
>Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>email: fobispo@isc.org
>Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>


From gustavo.lozano@icann.org  Thu Dec 13 10:00:11 2012
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From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
To: "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2012 10:00:11 -0800
Thread-Topic: CSV and RFC4180
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Colleagues,

I find the proposal of Comma-Separated Values (CSV) Objects Mapping
interesting and I think that both approaches CSV or XML for escrow data
have its advantages and disadvantages.

The only RFC related to CSV that I have found is RFC4180.

This text from RFC4180 concerns me:
TEXTDATA =3D  %x20-21 / %x23-2B / %x2D-7E

The escrow deposit will contain non US-ASCII data.

How can we be sure that the libraries/database tools used to implement the
export/import of CSV will adequately work with non US-ASCII data? There
are different platforms and architectures used by different players
(EBEROs, registry operators and data escrow agents) that will be upgraded
and will evolve during time.

In this regard I feel more confortable with XML because Unicode support
have been present since the beginning.

Thoughts?

Regards,
Gustavo Lozano


From JGould@verisign.com  Thu Dec 13 10:05:00 2012
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Subject: Re: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
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Gustavo,

I don't believe that the file encoding is the key determinate of the file
format decision.  The CSV draft includes an encoding attribute with the
default of UTF-8.  It's up to the producer and consumer to support the
appropriate encoding of the data in any case whether we're talking about
XML as the file format or CSV.  I don't believe we would have any issue
producing or consuming UTF-8 encoded CSV files.

--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/13/12 1:00 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wrote:

>Colleagues,
>
>I find the proposal of Comma-Separated Values (CSV) Objects Mapping
>interesting and I think that both approaches CSV or XML for escrow data
>have its advantages and disadvantages.
>
>The only RFC related to CSV that I have found is RFC4180.
>
>This text from RFC4180 concerns me:
>TEXTDATA =3D  %x20-21 / %x23-2B / %x2D-7E
>
>The escrow deposit will contain non US-ASCII data.
>
>How can we be sure that the libraries/database tools used to implement the
>export/import of CSV will adequately work with non US-ASCII data? There
>are different platforms and architectures used by different players
>(EBEROs, registry operators and data escrow agents) that will be upgraded
>and will evolve during time.
>
>In this regard I feel more confortable with XML because Unicode support
>have been present since the beginning.
>
>Thoughts?
>
>Regards,
>Gustavo Lozano
>
>_______________________________________________
>ire mailing list
>ire@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire


From gustavo.lozano@icann.org  Thu Dec 13 10:26:56 2012
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From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
To: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2012 10:26:56 -0800
Thread-Topic: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
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James,

I understand that we can produce text files encoded in UTF-8.

My concern is the TEXTDATA ABNF grammar defined in RFC4180: %x20-21 /
%x23-2B / %x2D-7E, which support a subset of US-ASCII extended only.

After pre delegation testing, ICANN will have evidence that the escrow
deposit file is correct, but this is only a snapshot in time. Registries
platforms are updated, RDBMS are updated, libraries are updated and in
general all the components of the SRS evolve during time. My concern is to
find in the future that the escrow deposit file of a registry operator is
corrupted because some library is now following the ABNF grammar in
RFC4180 or other validation rules. The same applies to the EBERO system.

XML being a well defined standard make more comfortable in this regard.

Regards,

Gustavo Lozano

On 12/13/12 10:04 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:

>Gustavo,
>
>I don't believe that the file encoding is the key determinate of the file
>format decision.  The CSV draft includes an encoding attribute with the
>default of UTF-8.  It's up to the producer and consumer to support the
>appropriate encoding of the data in any case whether we're talking about
>XML as the file format or CSV.  I don't believe we would have any issue
>producing or consuming UTF-8 encoded CSV files.
>
>--=20
>
>JG
>=20
>
>=20
>James Gould
>Principal Software Engineer
>jgould@verisign.com
>=20
>703-948-3271 (Office)
>12061 Bluemont Way
>Reston, VA 20190
>VerisignInc.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On 12/13/12 1:00 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wrote:
>
>>Colleagues,
>>
>>I find the proposal of Comma-Separated Values (CSV) Objects Mapping
>>interesting and I think that both approaches CSV or XML for escrow data
>>have its advantages and disadvantages.
>>
>>The only RFC related to CSV that I have found is RFC4180.
>>
>>This text from RFC4180 concerns me:
>>TEXTDATA =3D  %x20-21 / %x23-2B / %x2D-7E
>>
>>The escrow deposit will contain non US-ASCII data.
>>
>>How can we be sure that the libraries/database tools used to implement
>>the
>>export/import of CSV will adequately work with non US-ASCII data? There
>>are different platforms and architectures used by different players
>>(EBEROs, registry operators and data escrow agents) that will be upgraded
>>and will evolve during time.
>>
>>In this regard I feel more confortable with XML because Unicode support
>>have been present since the beginning.
>>
>>Thoughts?
>>
>>Regards,
>>Gustavo Lozano
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>ire mailing list
>>ire@ietf.org
>>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>


From fobispo@isc.org  Thu Dec 13 10:32:00 2012
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On Dec 13, 2012, at 9:42 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:

> Your interpretation is different from mine of the EPP specifications.

I find myself in this situation more ofter than I would like, but it is =
my job to do fine grain review, and you guys have a better view because =
Verisign played an important role in the authorship of the docs, which =
is why I come to these lists to try to get clarification to those grey =
areas.


>  The
> term client is generic, where the reference to the "sponsoring client" =
in
> the description of <clID> refers to the registrar.  The reference to
> simply "client" in the description of crID and upID can and should =
refer
> to any client including the actual user.

Yes, but my interpretation is that those fields track 'registrars' not =
internal users.



> It makes no sense to only return
> the sponsoring client information for the crID and upID fields, since =
they
> would pretty much almost always match the same value of clID.


Not necessarily,=20

1) REGISTRAR_A  creates a domain name (crID and clID =3D REGISTRAR_A)
2) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_B (clID =3D REGISTRAR_B crID =
=3D REGISTRAR_A)
3) Domain name is updated (upID=3DREGISTRAR_B)
4) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_C (clID=3DREGISTRAR_C)

Final state:

clID=3DREGISTRAR_C
crID=3DREGISTRAR_A
upID=3DREGISTRAR_B




>  It's best
> to reference the actual user (Registrar User, Registry User, or =
whoever)
> actually created or updated the object via any of the supported =
channels
> (EPP, Registrar Web Tool, CSR Web Tool, Batch, etc.).  I believe you =
need
> to change the description of the crID and upID fields of the data =
escrow
> to match that of the EPP specifications.  We can continue to debate =
our
> interpretation of the EPP specification as it relates to the crID and =
upID
> elements. =20

My design choice would be to keep the changes done by the registry =
somewhere else and not on these fields since in my opinion, they relate =
to authorized clients (a registry/system user might belong to a client), =
so in your example, it is important that 'verisign' did it and not =
jgould, jgould would be referenced in an audit table as a person acting =
on behalf of verisign performing a specific transaction in the logs.

Regards,


Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


From JGould@verisign.com  Thu Dec 13 10:32:54 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
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Subject: Re: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
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Gustavo,

Doesn't it state in RFC 4180 the following?

  Common usage of CSV is US-ASCII, but other character sets defined
      by IANA for the "text" tree may be used in conjunction with the
      "charset" parameter.

It does not preclude the use of UTF-8 or any other character set
(http://www.iana.org/assignments/character-sets/character-sets.xml), so we
should be good.



--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/13/12 1:26 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wrote:

>James,
>
>I understand that we can produce text files encoded in UTF-8.
>
>My concern is the TEXTDATA ABNF grammar defined in RFC4180: %x20-21 /
>%x23-2B / %x2D-7E, which support a subset of US-ASCII extended only.
>
>After pre delegation testing, ICANN will have evidence that the escrow
>deposit file is correct, but this is only a snapshot in time. Registries
>platforms are updated, RDBMS are updated, libraries are updated and in
>general all the components of the SRS evolve during time. My concern is to
>find in the future that the escrow deposit file of a registry operator is
>corrupted because some library is now following the ABNF grammar in
>RFC4180 or other validation rules. The same applies to the EBERO system.
>
>XML being a well defined standard make more comfortable in this regard.
>
>Regards,
>
>Gustavo Lozano
>
>On 12/13/12 10:04 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>
>>Gustavo,
>>
>>I don't believe that the file encoding is the key determinate of the file
>>format decision.  The CSV draft includes an encoding attribute with the
>>default of UTF-8.  It's up to the producer and consumer to support the
>>appropriate encoding of the data in any case whether we're talking about
>>XML as the file format or CSV.  I don't believe we would have any issue
>>producing or consuming UTF-8 encoded CSV files.
>>
>>--=20
>>
>>JG
>>=20
>>
>>=20
>>James Gould
>>Principal Software Engineer
>>jgould@verisign.com
>>=20
>>703-948-3271 (Office)
>>12061 Bluemont Way
>>Reston, VA 20190
>>VerisignInc.com
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On 12/13/12 1:00 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wrote:
>>
>>>Colleagues,
>>>
>>>I find the proposal of Comma-Separated Values (CSV) Objects Mapping
>>>interesting and I think that both approaches CSV or XML for escrow data
>>>have its advantages and disadvantages.
>>>
>>>The only RFC related to CSV that I have found is RFC4180.
>>>
>>>This text from RFC4180 concerns me:
>>>TEXTDATA =3D  %x20-21 / %x23-2B / %x2D-7E
>>>
>>>The escrow deposit will contain non US-ASCII data.
>>>
>>>How can we be sure that the libraries/database tools used to implement
>>>the
>>>export/import of CSV will adequately work with non US-ASCII data? There
>>>are different platforms and architectures used by different players
>>>(EBEROs, registry operators and data escrow agents) that will be
>>>upgraded
>>>and will evolve during time.
>>>
>>>In this regard I feel more confortable with XML because Unicode support
>>>have been present since the beginning.
>>>
>>>Thoughts?
>>>
>>>Regards,
>>>Gustavo Lozano
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>ire mailing list
>>>ire@ietf.org
>>>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>>
>


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To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
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Subject: Re: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
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One of the things I was thinking, is that the escrow dump is sort of =
like a ship's manifest, it needs to be as internationally 'readable' as =
possible, so that any port in the world can parse it.

Loading and unloading on the database should be secondary to all of =
this, we should be focusing on portability and recoverability.

Francisco

On Dec 13, 2012, at 10:26 AM, Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> =
wrote:

> James,
>=20
> I understand that we can produce text files encoded in UTF-8.
>=20
> My concern is the TEXTDATA ABNF grammar defined in RFC4180: %x20-21 /
> %x23-2B / %x2D-7E, which support a subset of US-ASCII extended only.
>=20
> After pre delegation testing, ICANN will have evidence that the escrow
> deposit file is correct, but this is only a snapshot in time. =
Registries
> platforms are updated, RDBMS are updated, libraries are updated and in
> general all the components of the SRS evolve during time. My concern =
is to
> find in the future that the escrow deposit file of a registry operator =
is
> corrupted because some library is now following the ABNF grammar in
> RFC4180 or other validation rules. The same applies to the EBERO =
system.
>=20
> XML being a well defined standard make more comfortable in this =
regard.
>=20
> Regards,
>=20
> Gustavo Lozano
>=20
> On 12/13/12 10:04 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>=20
>> Gustavo,
>>=20
>> I don't believe that the file encoding is the key determinate of the =
file
>> format decision.  The CSV draft includes an encoding attribute with =
the
>> default of UTF-8.  It's up to the producer and consumer to support =
the
>> appropriate encoding of the data in any case whether we're talking =
about
>> XML as the file format or CSV.  I don't believe we would have any =
issue
>> producing or consuming UTF-8 encoded CSV files.
>>=20
>> --=20
>>=20
>> JG
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> James Gould
>> Principal Software Engineer
>> jgould@verisign.com
>>=20
>> 703-948-3271 (Office)
>> 12061 Bluemont Way
>> Reston, VA 20190
>> VerisignInc.com
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> On 12/13/12 1:00 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> =
wrote:
>>=20
>>> Colleagues,
>>>=20
>>> I find the proposal of Comma-Separated Values (CSV) Objects Mapping
>>> interesting and I think that both approaches CSV or XML for escrow =
data
>>> have its advantages and disadvantages.
>>>=20
>>> The only RFC related to CSV that I have found is RFC4180.
>>>=20
>>> This text from RFC4180 concerns me:
>>> TEXTDATA =3D  %x20-21 / %x23-2B / %x2D-7E
>>>=20
>>> The escrow deposit will contain non US-ASCII data.
>>>=20
>>> How can we be sure that the libraries/database tools used to =
implement
>>> the
>>> export/import of CSV will adequately work with non US-ASCII data? =
There
>>> are different platforms and architectures used by different players
>>> (EBEROs, registry operators and data escrow agents) that will be =
upgraded
>>> and will evolve during time.
>>>=20
>>> In this regard I feel more confortable with XML because Unicode =
support
>>> have been present since the beginning.
>>>=20
>>> Thoughts?
>>>=20
>>> Regards,
>>> Gustavo Lozano
>>>=20
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> ire mailing list
>>> ire@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> ire mailing list
> ire@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire

Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


From gustavo.lozano@icann.org  Thu Dec 13 11:03:47 2012
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From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
To: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2012 11:03:46 -0800
Thread-Topic: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
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Subject: Re: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
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James,

The encoding of the file could be UTF-8, but my reading of the ABNF
grammar (Section 2 of RFC4180) is that the the code point repertory is
limited to %x20-21 / %x23-2B / %x2D-7E.

I have created a text file with non us-ascii code points, fields separated
by "," in my computer and I saved this file as UTF-8. I opened the file
with different applications without problem , but I am not sure that this
file can be considered CSV format compliant.

I am not trying to be picky here, the escrow deposit is a fundamental
piece of the registry transition process and RFC 4180 made me feel that
CSV is not as well as defined as XML.


Regards,

Gustavo


On 12/13/12 10:32 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:

>Gustavo,
>
>Doesn't it state in RFC 4180 the following?
>
>  Common usage of CSV
>is US-ASCII, but other character sets defined
>      by IANA for the "text"
>tree may be used in conjunction with the
>      "charset" parameter.
>
>It does
>not preclude the use of UTF-8 or any other character
>set
>(http://www.iana.org/assignments/character-sets/character-sets.xml), so
>we
>should be good.
>
>
>
>--=20
>
>JG
>=20
>
>=20
>James Gould
>Principal Software
>Engineer
>jgould@verisign.com
>=20
>703-948-3271 (Office)
>12061 Bluemont
>Way
>Reston, VA 20190
>VerisignInc.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On 12/13/12 1:26 PM, "Gustavo
>Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wrote:
>
>>James,
>>
>>I understand that we
>can produce text files encoded in UTF-8.
>>
>>My concern is the TEXTDATA ABNF
>grammar defined in RFC4180: %x20-21 /
>>%x23-2B / %x2D-7E, which support a
>subset of US-ASCII extended only.
>>
>>After pre delegation testing, ICANN
>will have evidence that the escrow
>>deposit file is correct, but this is
>only a snapshot in time. Registries
>>platforms are updated, RDBMS are
>updated, libraries are updated and in
>>general all the components of the SRS
>evolve during time. My concern is to
>>find in the future that the escrow
>deposit file of a registry operator is
>>corrupted because some library is
>now following the ABNF grammar in
>>RFC4180 or other validation rules. The
>same applies to the EBERO system.
>>
>>XML being a well defined standard make
>more comfortable in this regard.
>>
>>Regards,
>>
>>Gustavo Lozano
>>
>>On
>12/13/12 10:04 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
>wrote:
>>
>>>Gustavo,
>>>
>>>I don't believe that the file encoding is the key
>determinate of the file
>>>format decision.  The CSV draft includes an
>encoding attribute with the
>>>default of UTF-8.  It's up to the producer and
>consumer to support the
>>>appropriate encoding of the data in any case
>whether we're talking about
>>>XML as the file format or CSV.  I don't
>believe we would have any issue
>>>producing or consuming UTF-8 encoded CSV
>files.
>>>
>>>--=20
>>>
>>>JG
>>>=20
>>>
>>>=20
>>>James Gould
>>>Principal Software
>Engineer
>>>jgould@verisign.com
>>>=20
>>>703-948-3271 (Office)
>>>12061 Bluemont
>Way
>>>Reston, VA 20190
>>>VerisignInc.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>On 12/13/12
>1:00 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
>wrote:
>>>
>>>>Colleagues,
>>>>
>>>>I find the proposal of Comma-Separated
>Values (CSV) Objects Mapping
>>>>interesting and I think that both approaches
>CSV or XML for escrow data
>>>>have its advantages and
>disadvantages.
>>>>
>>>>The only RFC related to CSV that I have found is
>RFC4180.
>>>>
>>>>This text from RFC4180 concerns me:
>>>>TEXTDATA =3D  %x20-21 /
>%x23-2B / %x2D-7E
>>>>
>>>>The escrow deposit will contain non US-ASCII
>data.
>>>>
>>>>How can we be sure that the libraries/database tools used to
>implement
>>>>the
>>>>export/import of CSV will adequately work with non
>US-ASCII data? There
>>>>are different platforms and architectures used by
>different players
>>>>(EBEROs, registry operators and data escrow agents)
>that will be
>>>>upgraded
>>>>and will evolve during time.
>>>>
>>>>In this
>regard I feel more confortable with XML because Unicode support
>>>>have been
>present since the beginning.
>>>>
>>>>Thoughts?
>>>>
>>>>Regards,
>>>>Gustavo
>Lozano
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>ire mailing
>list
>>>>ire@ietf.org
>>>>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>>>
>>
>
>____
>___________________________________________
>ire mailing
>list
>ire@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>
>


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Subject: Re: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 11:16 AM, Gould, James <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>
> Gustavo,
>
> I noticed the following additional items with
> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping-01:
>
> The description of the <crID> and <upID> should match what is in the EPP
> RFC's.  Specifically, change "identifier of the registrar" to "identifier of
> the client".  In our registries we have account users (verisign as well as
> registrar) that are reflected in the <crID> and <upID> fields via the user's
> user name (e.g. jgould).  This is important to track exactly who took the
> action, since actions can be taken outside of the EPP channel (Registrar
> Tool, CSR Tool, batch) that should properly be reflected in the <crID> and
> <upID> elements.  Now the next logical question is whether there needs to be
> a deposit for users to link the "client identifiers" to.  I would imagine
> that an EBERO provider would import the <crID> and <upID> fields as strings
> and replace them (most likely using different fields) with real user
> identifiers based on future updates to the objects.
> The question is whether the authInfo should be escrowed at all since these
> reflect secret passwords.  Our system stores them encrypted and I don't
> believe it is a good security practice to escrow them in a decrypted form or
> even provide a tool that can decrypt them.  I believe that the EBERO
> provider recovering a registry from the data escrow deposit can generate new
> random authorization info values and make them available in bulk to the
> registrars or on-demand by the registrars submitting an EPP info command for
> the objects.  What are your thoughts with this?

I largely concur...  Yes, indeed, there will be some users that are
not specifically
registrars, so <crID> and <upID> are not strictly "registrars";
sometimes they will
indicate registry operator agents that are not registrars.

As for authinfo values, I'm a bit torn.

On the one hand, there is a significant problem in changing authinfo values on
the registrants, particularly when the registry operator may have no direct
channel for communicating updates to the registrants.  (This is most pointedly
the case for "thin" registries where no contact information is captured in the
registry!)

However, as soon as we are in a situation of switching registry operators, there
are distinctly too many agents that share the secret authinfo values.
It has been
our practice, when taking over operations of registries, to change all authinfo
values.  My instant, kneejerk recommendation upon receiving a dump of data
for a registry is to say, "And we'll be replacing all the authinfos, right?"

I observe that the authinfo values should be considered distinct from user
authentication information for registrars; those are quite different things.  I
see what looks like conflation of the two things downthread.

From JGould@verisign.com  Thu Dec 13 12:22:21 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
Thread-Index: Ac3ZW7D9ufs4LNVoS7qVrGt6cHeCeQAAJiwAAAtDYAD//620gIAAXJYA///CA28=
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2012 20:21:54 +0000
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Cc: "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [ire] CSV and RFC4180
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Gustavo,

The RFC does not restrict it to ASCII and the use of CSV is heavily used in=
 the industry for data export and import, so I don't believe there is an in=
herent advantage in the use of XML in supporting non-ASII data.

JG

James F. Gould
Principal Engineer
Verisign

jgould@verisign.com

On Dec 13, 2012, at 2:03 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wr=
ote:

> James,
>=20
> The encoding of the file could be UTF-8, but my reading of the ABNF
> grammar (Section 2 of RFC4180) is that the the code point repertory is
> limited to %x20-21 / %x23-2B / %x2D-7E.
>=20
> I have created a text file with non us-ascii code points, fields separate=
d
> by "," in my computer and I saved this file as UTF-8. I opened the file
> with different applications without problem , but I am not sure that this
> file can be considered CSV format compliant.
>=20
> I am not trying to be picky here, the escrow deposit is a fundamental
> piece of the registry transition process and RFC 4180 made me feel that
> CSV is not as well as defined as XML.
>=20
>=20
> Regards,
>=20
> Gustavo
>=20
>=20
> On 12/13/12 10:32 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>=20
>> Gustavo,
>>=20
>> Doesn't it state in RFC 4180 the following?
>>=20
>> Common usage of CSV
>> is US-ASCII, but other character sets defined
>>     by IANA for the "text"
>> tree may be used in conjunction with the
>>     "charset" parameter.
>>=20
>> It does
>> not preclude the use of UTF-8 or any other character
>> set
>> (http://www.iana.org/assignments/character-sets/character-sets.xml), so
>> we
>> should be good.
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> --=20
>>=20
>> JG
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> James Gould
>> Principal Software
>> Engineer
>> jgould@verisign.com
>>=20
>> 703-948-3271 (Office)
>> 12061 Bluemont
>> Way
>> Reston, VA 20190
>> VerisignInc.com
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> On 12/13/12 1:26 PM, "Gustavo
>> Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wrote:
>>=20
>>> James,
>>>=20
>>> I understand that we
>> can produce text files encoded in UTF-8.
>>>=20
>>> My concern is the TEXTDATA ABNF
>> grammar defined in RFC4180: %x20-21 /
>>> %x23-2B / %x2D-7E, which support a
>> subset of US-ASCII extended only.
>>>=20
>>> After pre delegation testing, ICANN
>> will have evidence that the escrow
>>> deposit file is correct, but this is
>> only a snapshot in time. Registries
>>> platforms are updated, RDBMS are
>> updated, libraries are updated and in
>>> general all the components of the SRS
>> evolve during time. My concern is to
>>> find in the future that the escrow
>> deposit file of a registry operator is
>>> corrupted because some library is
>> now following the ABNF grammar in
>>> RFC4180 or other validation rules. The
>> same applies to the EBERO system.
>>>=20
>>> XML being a well defined standard make
>> more comfortable in this regard.
>>>=20
>>> Regards,
>>>=20
>>> Gustavo Lozano
>>>=20
>>> On
>> 12/13/12 10:04 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
>> wrote:
>>>=20
>>>> Gustavo,
>>>>=20
>>>> I don't believe that the file encoding is the key
>> determinate of the file
>>>> format decision.  The CSV draft includes an
>> encoding attribute with the
>>>> default of UTF-8.  It's up to the producer and
>> consumer to support the
>>>> appropriate encoding of the data in any case
>> whether we're talking about
>>>> XML as the file format or CSV.  I don't
>> believe we would have any issue
>>>> producing or consuming UTF-8 encoded CSV
>> files.
>>>>=20
>>>> --=20
>>>>=20
>>>> JG
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> James Gould
>>>> Principal Software
>> Engineer
>>>> jgould@verisign.com
>>>>=20
>>>> 703-948-3271 (Office)
>>>> 12061 Bluemont
>> Way
>>>> Reston, VA 20190
>>>> VerisignInc.com
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> On 12/13/12
>> 1:00 PM, "Gustavo Lozano" <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
>> wrote:
>>>>=20
>>>>> Colleagues,
>>>>>=20
>>>>> I find the proposal of Comma-Separated
>> Values (CSV) Objects Mapping
>>>>> interesting and I think that both approaches
>> CSV or XML for escrow data
>>>>> have its advantages and
>> disadvantages.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> The only RFC related to CSV that I have found is
>> RFC4180.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> This text from RFC4180 concerns me:
>>>>> TEXTDATA =3D  %x20-21 /
>> %x23-2B / %x2D-7E
>>>>>=20
>>>>> The escrow deposit will contain non US-ASCII
>> data.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> How can we be sure that the libraries/database tools used to
>> implement
>>>>> the
>>>>> export/import of CSV will adequately work with non
>> US-ASCII data? There
>>>>> are different platforms and architectures used by
>> different players
>>>>> (EBEROs, registry operators and data escrow agents)
>> that will be
>>>>> upgraded
>>>>> and will evolve during time.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> In this
>> regard I feel more confortable with XML because Unicode support
>>>>> have been
>> present since the beginning.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Thoughts?
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>> Gustavo
>> Lozano
>>>>>=20
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> ire mailing
>> list
>>>>> ire@ietf.org
>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>>=20
>> ____
>> ___________________________________________
>> ire mailing
>> list
>> ire@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ire
>=20

From gustavo.lozano@icann.org  Thu Dec 13 16:28:23 2012
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From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
To: "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2012 16:28:20 -0800
Thread-Topic: Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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Subject: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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--_000_CCEFB2A46A69gustavolozanoicannorg_
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Colleagues,



Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:



" (5) If [1] includes a verification process, that will be applied at this =
step."



We are in the process of defining the extended verification process that th=
e data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow deposit file. This =
process will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.



The purpose of this continuous verification process is to mitigate the risk=
 of  an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.


In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full=
 and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification pr=
ocess.


I am interested in your feedback regarding:

 1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.

 2. The proposed tests itself.


Proposed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the fi=
nal list of tests with your input):

 1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD i=
ncluding extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new g=
TLD base agreement.

 2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pre=
sent.

 3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are presen=
t.

 4. All the required glue records are present.

 5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in =
other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: =
RFC5735 and RFC6598.

 6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the ex=
ception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.

 7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.

 8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.


Note: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names=
 escrowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by t=
he data escrow agents to ICANN.


Regards,
Gustavo Lozano





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<!--StartFragment-->

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Colleagues,<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Specification 2, Part A, 8. of
the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">" (5) If [1] includes a
verification process, that will be applied at this step."<o:p></o:p></font>=
</span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">We are in the process of
defining the extended verification process that the data escrow agents must
perform daily with the escrow deposit file. This process will be included i=
n new
versions of the data escrow draft.<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The purpose of this continuous
verification process is to mitigate the risk of<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:=
yes">&nbsp;
</span>an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>=
</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Ca=
libri">In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the la=
st full and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verifica=
tion process.</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-spa=
n" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">I am interested in your feedback regarding:=
<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Other tests that you
consider should be present in the draft.<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;2. The proposed tests itself.</font><=
/span></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Cal=
ibri"><br></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Prop=
osed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the final =
list of tests with your input):<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined
for the TLD including extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2=
 of the new
gTLD base agreement.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit
files are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit
files are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;4. All the required glue records are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global
address, or in other words not present in the special use IPv4 address bloc=
ks
defined in: RFC5735 and RFC6598.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3
with the exception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the
future.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>=
</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Ca=
libri">Note: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domai=
n names escrowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report se=
nt by the data escrow agents to ICANN.&nbsp;</font></p><p class=3D"Default"=
><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p>

<span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px; ">Regards,</span=
></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Gus=
tavo Lozano</span><br>

<p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: =
22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: =
22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<!--EndFragment--></div></div></body></html>

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From: James Mitchell <james.mitchell@ausregistry.com.au>
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Date: Sat, 15 Dec 2012 01:45:08 +1100
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Comments below.

James

From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.=
org>>
Date: Friday, 14 December 2012 11:28 AM
To: "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>>
Subject: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files


Colleagues,



Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:



" (5) If [1] includes a verification process, that will be applied at this =
step."



We are in the process of defining the extended verification process that th=
e data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow deposit file. This =
process will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.



The purpose of this continuous verification process is to mitigate the risk=
 of  an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.


In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full=
 and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification pr=
ocess.


I am interested in your feedback regarding:

 1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.

 2. The proposed tests itself.

JM: My biggest gripe with this is that valid is subjective to the party tha=
t has to restore the registry. I say this because different registries have=
 different business rules, or have different interpretations of specificati=
ons etc. Verisign's comments on the provreg list about the crID field mirro=
rs exactly that. We (ARI) would expect the crID field to be a registrar id,=
 matching the same definition of client as used in the definition of clID (=
sponsoring client) and would consider invalid any deposit where the crID is=
 not a registrar. We store the creating user information separate however t=
his is not available through the EPP interface.

I am fairly concerned that introducing this validation seems a somewhat rou=
ndabout way at mandating business rules on the registry's provisioning syst=
ems. Consider four possible scenarios:

 *   The EBERO compares contact identifiers in a case insensitive manner (l=
ets assume that they store them uppercase), however they receive a deposit =
from a registry where contact identifiers "abc" and "ABC" match different R=
OIDs.
 *   The EBERO can store domain passwords up to 16 characters, however they=
 receive a deposit with a password that is 17 characters.
 *   The EBERO requires contact country codes are on the ISO 3166-2 list, h=
owever they receive a deposit with a contact having 'xx' or '12' as their c=
ountry.
 *   The EBERO uses a schema validating parser, however receives a deposit =
where the contact identifiers "abc def" and "abc  def" (two spaces) match d=
ifferent ROIDs.

I could go on for quite awhile but I hope by now you get my point. If you w=
ant to make sure that data is valid then I would much prefer the discussion=
 is about provisioning system requirements and it is made clear that every =
registry would have to implement these requirements (to the theme of consen=
sus policy or equivalent). As a side note, if you want to go so far as to s=
tate all these validations then I would expect to see these requirements so=
mewhere in the EBERO contract.


Proposed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the fi=
nal list of tests with your input):

 1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD i=
ncluding extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new g=
TLD base agreement.

JM: Fine. I am dubious to what value this provides other than syntactical v=
alidation of certain fields (date, phone etc). I could theoretically put "t=
he quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" as a domain name and apparently=
 you'd never think this invalid.


 2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pre=
sent.

JM: Agree. I see no reason for referenced contact objects to be missing.


 3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are presen=
t.

JM: Disagree. Hosts are required to be objects only for glue records. There=
 is no  reason for the host "ns1.example.com" to be an object in my registr=
y because 1) it cannot have addresses, 2) we do not allow change of host na=
me. A registrar could create the aforementioned host, however they will nev=
er be able to do anything with it.

Have you considered that registries may use host attributes instead of host=
 objects? Perhaps those yet unknown SRSU registries may use attributes for =
simplicity since they have to implement EPP even though there will be only =
one registrar...


 4. All the required glue records are present.

JM: What is a required glue record? If a registrar omits glue address recor=
ds then the name may not resolve. This is indifferent to the registrar prov=
iding the wrong name servers, or failing to supply name servers for delegat=
ion when the child zone is "live". Registrars will fix the issue if it is a=
 problem. I disagree with validation of glue records.


 5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in =
other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: =
RFC5735 and RFC6598.

 6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the ex=
ception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.

JM: I see no real problem with the above two. I am wary of having too many =
restrictions that will require changes if and when new allocations are made=
.


 7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.



JM: This test seems to provide no value, especially given that it should be=
 almost impossible for a registry to have data that would invalidate this t=
est. Testing that the creation date is not later than the last update date =
makes some sense as it may identify producers that have selected data into =
the wrong field/element.


8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.

JM: Please define the syntax that registries will be held accountable to fo=
r validation of email addresses. Note that I do not see anywhere that the r=
egistry must validate email addresses (we do not send emails to registrants=
). Actually, if email data is incorrect then ICANN should be looking at the=
 registrars who provided "invalid" data to the registry.


Note: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names=
 escrowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by t=
he data escrow agents to ICANN.

JM: fine as long as your heuristics are not considered immediate validation=
 failures.


Regards,
Gustavo Lozano





--_000_CCF16E3F3D5E3jamesmitchellausregistrycomau_
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 space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-si=
ze: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div>Comments below.</div><di=
v><br></div><div>James</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION=
"><div style=3D"font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color=
:black; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTO=
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nn.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold=
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<![endif]--><!--StartFragment--><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: =
windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Colleagues,=
<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: win=
dowtext; "><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</f=
ont></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext;=
 "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Specification 2, Part =
A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:<o:p></o:p></font></spa=
n></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p><p=
 class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple=
-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">" (5) If [1] includes a verification process,=
 that will be applied at this step."<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=
=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-=
style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"Defa=
ult"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" f=
ace=3D"Calibri">We are in the process of defining the extended verification=
 process that the data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow dep=
osit file. This process
 will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p>=
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span=
></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The purpose of this continuous verif=
ication process is to mitigate the risk of<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:yes">=
&nbsp;
</span>an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><b=
r></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"=
Calibri">In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the =
last full and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verifi=
cation process.</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-s=
pan" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"co=
lor: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">I am i=
nterested in your feedback regarding:<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=
=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style=
-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Other tests that you consider should be pr=
esent in the draft.<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span =
style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Cali=
bri">&nbsp;2. The proposed tests itself.</font></span></p></div></div></div=
></div></span><div><br></div><div>JM:&nbsp;My biggest gripe with this is th=
at <i>valid</i> is subjective to the party that has to restore the registry=
. I say this because different registries have different business rules, or=
 have different interpretations of specifications etc. Verisign's comments =
on the provreg list about the crID field mirrors exactly that. We (ARI) wou=
ld expect the crID field to be a registrar id, matching the same definition=
 of client as used in the definition of clID (sponsoring client) and would =
consider invalid any deposit where the crID is not a registrar. We store th=
e <i>creating user</i> information separate however this is not available t=
hrough the EPP interface.</div><div><br></div><div>I am fairly concerned th=
at introducing this validation seems a somewhat roundabout way at mandating=
 business rules on the registry's provisioning systems. Consider four possi=
ble scenarios:</div><ul><li>The EBERO compares contact identifiers in a cas=
e insensitive manner (lets assume that they store them uppercase), however =
they receive a deposit from a registry where contact identifiers "abc" and =
"ABC" match different ROIDs.</li><li>The EBERO can store domain passwords u=
p to 16 characters, however they receive a deposit with a password that is =
17 characters.</li><li>The EBERO requires contact country codes are on the =
ISO 3166-2 list, however they receive a deposit with a contact having 'xx' =
or '12' as their country.</li><li>The EBERO uses a schema validating parser=
, however receives a deposit where the contact identifiers&nbsp;"abc def" a=
nd "abc &nbsp;def"&nbsp;(two spaces) match different ROIDs.</li></ul><div>I=
 could go on for quite awhile but I hope by now you get my point. If you wa=
nt to make sure that data is valid then I would much prefer the discussion =
is about provisioning system requirements and it is made clear that every r=
egistry would have to implement these requirements (to the theme of consens=
us policy or equivalent).&nbsp;As a side note, if you want to go so far as =
to state all these validations then I would expect to see these requirement=
s somewhere in the EBERO contract.</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_=
BODY_SECTION"><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: =
space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><=
div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">=
Proposed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the fi=
nal list of tests with your input):<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Defaul=
t"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Validate the =
escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD including extensio=
ns as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new gTLD base agreemen=
t.</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><div><br></div><div>JM: Fine. I=
 am dubious to what value this provides other than syntactical validation o=
f certain fields (date, phone etc). I could theoretically put "the quick br=
own fox jumps over the lazy dog" as a domain name and apparently you'd neve=
r think this invalid.</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"=
><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webki=
t-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=
=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p><=
/font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Cal=
ibri">&nbsp;2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit fi=
les are present.</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><div><br></div><d=
iv>JM: Agree. I see no reason for referenced contact objects to be missing.=
</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div><div style=3D"w=
ord-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-w=
hite-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font cla=
ss=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"=
Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;3. All hos=
ts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are present.</font></=
p></div></div></div></div></span><div><br></div><div>JM: Disagree. Hosts ar=
e required to be objects only for glue records. There is no &nbsp;reason fo=
r the host "ns1.example.com" to be an object in my registry because 1) it c=
annot have addresses, 2) we do not allow change of host name. A registrar c=
ould create the aforementioned host, however they will never be able to do =
anything with it.</div><div><br></div><div>Have you considered that&nbsp;re=
gistries may&nbsp;use host attributes instead of host objects? Perhaps thos=
e yet unknown SRSU registries may use attributes for simplicity since they&=
nbsp;<i>have to</i>&nbsp;implement EPP even though there will be only one r=
egistrar...</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div><div=
 style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-bre=
ak: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default=
"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><=
p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp=
;4. All the required glue records are present.</font></p></div></div></div>=
</div></span><div><br></div><div>JM: What is a <i>required</i> glue record?=
 If a registrar omits glue address records then the name may not resolve. T=
his is indifferent to the registrar providing the wrong name servers, or fa=
iling to supply name servers for delegation when the child zone is "live". =
Registrars will fix the issue if it is a problem. I disagree with validatio=
n of glue records.</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><d=
iv><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-l=
ine-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"=
Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></fon=
t></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri=
">&nbsp;5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address,=
 or in other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defin=
ed in: RFC5735 and RFC6598.</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><span =
id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webk=
it-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0=
, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" fac=
e=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue rec=
ords are part of 2000::/3 with the exception of sub allocations mentioned i=
n RFC5156.</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><div><br></div><div>JM:=
 I see no real problem with the above two. I am wary of having too many res=
trictions that will require changes if and when new allocations are made.</=
div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div><div style=3D"wor=
d-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-whi=
te-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"De=
fault"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;7. The creat=
ion and last update date of objects is not in the future.<o:p></o:p></font>=
</p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">=
&nbsp;</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><div>JM: This test seems to=
 provide no value, especially given that it should be almost impossible for=
 a registry to have data that would invalidate this test. Testing that the =
creation date is not later than the last update date makes some sense as it=
 may identify producers that have selected data into the wrong field/elemen=
t.</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div><div style=3D=
"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after=
-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">8. Email addresses are syntactic=
ally valid.</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><div><br></div><div>JM=
: Please define the syntax that registries will be held accountable to for =
validation of email addresses.&nbsp;Note that I do not see anywhere that th=
e registry must validate email addresses (we do not send emails to registra=
nts). Actually, if email data is incorrect then ICANN should be looking at =
the registrars who provided "invalid" data to the registry.</div><span id=
=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit=
-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, =
0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=
=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Appl=
e-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Note: heuristics tests like the a=
brupt increase or decrease of domain names escrowed will be performed by IC=
ANN using the data escrow report sent by the data escrow agents to ICANN.&n=
bsp;</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><div><br></div><div>JM: fine =
as long as your heuristics are not considered immediate validation failures=
.</div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: brea=
k-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; co=
lor: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-st=
yle-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"font-size: 16px; ">Regards,</span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-=
style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Gustavo Lozano</span><br><p class=3D=
"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 22px; "><o:=
p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-=
serif; font-size: 22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><!--EndFragment--></div></di=
v></div></div></span></body></html>

--_000_CCF16E3F3D5E3jamesmitchellausregistrycomau_--

From JGould@verisign.com  Fri Dec 14 07:40:27 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Subject: Re: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Francisco,=20

>From a high-level, independent of the EPP RFC's interpretation that I will
cover below, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements must
exactly match the description in the EPP RFC's.  The data escrow draft
must not attempt to apply a specific interpretation of the EPP RFC's.

Below is the text from RFC 5731 for the matching <clID>, <crID>, and
<upID> elements of draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping:

-  A <domain:clID> element that contains the identifier of the
      sponsoring client.

   -  An OPTIONAL <domain:crID> element that contains the identifier of
      the client that created the domain object.

-  An OPTIONAL <domain:upID> element that contains the identifier of
      the client that last updated the domain object.  This element MUST
      NOT be present if the domain has never been modified.

As I pointed out in my past message, the <domain:clID> element references
"sponsoring client" and the <domain:crID> and the <domain:upID> elements
reference simply "client".  The proper interpretation of "sponsoring
client" is to indicate the registrar and the "client" to indicate the
user.  A registry might provide additional tools beyond EPP, like a
Registrar Web Tool, for registrars to manage the objects, where the access
to these tools would require user authentication.  A registry will also
have additional tools and components for authorized internal(registry)
users to make changes like a CSR Web Tool or batches.  The security model
should require different user login credentials per actual user and all
actions taken by that user would be tracked in the system.  If one of the
users created or updated an object, obviously the crDate or upDate should
be set, but the crID or upID fields should be set to the actual user that
took the action.  I'm sure the Registrar would like to know exactly who in
their organization or in the registry created or updated the object.  The
crID and upID fields should reflect the detail of exactly who took the
action.  If the crID and upID fields only referenced the organization, the
registrar would have no way other then reaching out to the registry to
look in their audit tables for the detail of who took the action.  By
linking to the user of the account (registrar or registry) and not
directly to the account for these fields, the registrar and registry
directly knows who took the action without having to scan the audit
records.  The info response would return the detail required via the crID
and upID fields.

Assuming that you do change the text of
draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping to match RFC 5731 for the <crID>,
and <upID> elements, there is still the open question of what needs to be
deposited for successful recovery by an EBERO provider.  I see the
following options:

1. Include a user deposit that at a minimum would include a user
identifier (e.g. login name) and an account (clID) element.  The account
could be the registrar or registry account.  The crID and upID would link
to the user identifier.
2. Just include the crID and upID as simple strings without any object
references (user or account).  The EBERO provider most likely will not
actually attempt to activate any of the users in the user deposit, so the
crID and upID migrated fields are simply informational and kept to ensure
that the info response is consistent after the transition.  The EBERO
provider would have another set of fields that would properly link to
users (or accounts if that is how their system is built) for future
creates and updates.  If there was any question to who actually created or
updated the object, the EBERO provider would indicate that the user in the
string form was imported from the data escrow that has no additional
information.  =20

I don't believe referencing the registrar in place of the actual user for
the crID and upID is the intent of the EPP RFC's, but a level of
indirection (user's account) wouldn't be completely out of the question.
The data escrow would then need to support both, meaning that option #2
above would be the only real option.  In any case as stated in my first
sentence above, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements in
draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping must match the description of
those fields in the EPP RFC's.


--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/13/12 1:31 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>
>
>
>
>On Dec 13, 2012, at 9:42 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>
>> Your interpretation is different from mine of the EPP specifications.
>
>I find myself in this situation more ofter than I would like, but it is
>my job to do fine grain review, and you guys have a better view because
>Verisign played an important role in the authorship of the docs, which is
>why I come to these lists to try to get clarification to those grey areas.
>
>
>>  The
>> term client is generic, where the reference to the "sponsoring client"
>>in
>> the description of <clID> refers to the registrar.  The reference to
>> simply "client" in the description of crID and upID can and should refer
>> to any client including the actual user.
>
>Yes, but my interpretation is that those fields track 'registrars' not
>internal users.
>
>
>
>> It makes no sense to only return
>> the sponsoring client information for the crID and upID fields, since
>>they
>> would pretty much almost always match the same value of clID.
>
>
>Not necessarily,=20
>
>1) REGISTRAR_A  creates a domain name (crID and clID =3D REGISTRAR_A)
>2) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_B (clID =3D REGISTRAR_B crID =
=3D
>REGISTRAR_A)
>3) Domain name is updated (upID=3DREGISTRAR_B)
>4) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_C (clID=3DREGISTRAR_C)
>
>Final state:
>
>clID=3DREGISTRAR_C
>crID=3DREGISTRAR_A
>upID=3DREGISTRAR_B
>
>
>
>
>>  It's best
>> to reference the actual user (Registrar User, Registry User, or whoever)
>> actually created or updated the object via any of the supported channels
>> (EPP, Registrar Web Tool, CSR Web Tool, Batch, etc.).  I believe you
>>need
>> to change the description of the crID and upID fields of the data escrow
>> to match that of the EPP specifications.  We can continue to debate our
>> interpretation of the EPP specification as it relates to the crID and
>>upID
>> elements. =20
>
>My design choice would be to keep the changes done by the registry
>somewhere else and not on these fields since in my opinion, they relate
>to authorized clients (a registry/system user might belong to a client),
>so in your example, it is important that 'verisign' did it and not
>jgould, jgould would be referenced in an audit table as a person acting
>on behalf of verisign performing a specific transaction in the logs.
>
>Regards,
>
>
>Francisco Obispo=20
>Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>email: fobispo@isc.org
>Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>


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Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 11:07:40 -0500
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From: Christopher Browne <cbbrowne@afilias.info>
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
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Cc: "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 7:28 PM, Gustavo Lozano
<gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wrote:
> In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full
> and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification
> process.
>
>
> I am interested in your feedback regarding:
>
>  1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.

In keeping with James Mitchell's comments about "the quick brown fox
jumps over the lazy dog", which could be set as a domain name, which
may be "structurally valid," but structurally nonsense, I would
suggest that mere comparison of escrow deposits is nowhere near
sufficient.

We could have a near-infinite number of policies, for each bit of the
escrow format, and someone with a Markov Chain generator could make up
a conforming escrow file out of random, but still policy-conforming,
junk.  Verifying that it's not just junk requires looking to other
sources such as WHOIS or DNS.

I daresay I have seen all the cases he mentions as problems, and more.
 Most typical and painful to resolve is to receive phone numbers not
complying with the ITU E164 standard. My "favourite" was receiving
contact <contact:id> values that did not conform to RFC 5733, so that
I had to remap them to new values in multiple places before
proceeding.

A more legitimate test would be more "end-to-end"; it would compare
escrow with other notionally authoritative sources.

The approach that comes to mind is to select data from 4 sources and
make sure that they match:

The data sources:

1.  Escrow is the one that is obviously at hand;

2.  Zone files tend to be not difficult to obtain, and they indicate
the state of the resolving portions of the 'portfolio' of domains in a
registry;

3.  WHOIS reports information on the state of the registry, albeit on
a one-by-one per-request basis;

4.  Submitting DNS requests to the authoritative DNS resolver for the
registry returns authoritative information on resolution information
for active domains.

#1 and #2 (perhaps just #1) are available "en masse", for the entire registry.

A test that escrow matches against the registry would be to pick a
sample of domain names from sources 1 (escrow) and 2 (zone file), and
agree them against WHOIS (#3) and the DNS resolver (#4).

It would not be reasonable to try to do this with all names in the
registry; a reasonably small statistically random sample should, if
collected regularly, provide confidence that samples taken from escrow
match against the "real data" in the registry.  Using stratification
would be appropriate to make sure that different sorts of cases get
examined (or perhaps avoided - it's desirable not to have many "false
mismatches" as would happen when objects legitimately change between
the time escrow is dumped and when validation tests are done.)

Over time, a validation involving doing a domain data reconciliation
of even as small a sample as a few dozen names per day should provide
useful assurance that the sources are not vastly out of sync,
particularly if discrepancies get escalated into larger targeted
samples.  Note that this is the standard sort of thing you'll find in
literature on auditing procedures.

From fobispo@isc.org  Fri Dec 14 09:45:16 2012
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From: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
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To: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
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Subject: Re: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Hi James,

I don't agree with your interpretation to me it looks more like:

clID -> Sponsoring Client
crID -> Client who was sponsoring at the time of creation
upID -> Client who was sponsoring when the last update occurred

The details of who (which user) updated what, to me is outside the scope =
of the EPP protocol, I'm not saying it's not important from the =
registry's perspective.

Our system also has tools like the one you mentioned, for example, the =
Registrar Web Interface provides the means for registrars to have =
multiple account with different roles associated with them, and even =
though we keep detail accounting of who does what, the operations on the =
SRS are done via the 'role' account, not the individual.

We as a registry are capable of answering a question who did what, from =
where and at what time.

The interpretation has to do with functionality. If there was a problem =
with "documentation" lets assume the domain required specific set of =
paperwork (physical), as the current sponsor (not who created domain), I =
could look at the <crID> and ask for the paperwork, or if an update =
occurred that seemed inappropriate in the past, I could also call the =
<upID> and ask for information.=20

Sharing the detail of which individual user (not the registrar or =
registry org) who performed the [create|update] operation seems useless =
for me because as an EBERO I would not have that information/nor will =
need it for anything useful.

Francisco


On Dec 14, 2012, at 7:39 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:

> Francisco,=20
>=20
>> =46rom a high-level, independent of the EPP RFC's interpretation that =
I will
> cover below, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements must
> exactly match the description in the EPP RFC's.  The data escrow draft
> must not attempt to apply a specific interpretation of the EPP RFC's.
>=20
> Below is the text from RFC 5731 for the matching <clID>, <crID>, and
> <upID> elements of draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping:
>=20
> -  A <domain:clID> element that contains the identifier of the
>      sponsoring client.
>=20
>   -  An OPTIONAL <domain:crID> element that contains the identifier of
>      the client that created the domain object.
>=20
> -  An OPTIONAL <domain:upID> element that contains the identifier of
>      the client that last updated the domain object.  This element =
MUST
>      NOT be present if the domain has never been modified.
>=20
> As I pointed out in my past message, the <domain:clID> element =
references
> "sponsoring client" and the <domain:crID> and the <domain:upID> =
elements
> reference simply "client".  The proper interpretation of "sponsoring
> client" is to indicate the registrar and the "client" to indicate the
> user.  A registry might provide additional tools beyond EPP, like a
> Registrar Web Tool, for registrars to manage the objects, where the =
access
> to these tools would require user authentication.  A registry will =
also
> have additional tools and components for authorized internal(registry)
> users to make changes like a CSR Web Tool or batches.  The security =
model
> should require different user login credentials per actual user and =
all
> actions taken by that user would be tracked in the system.  If one of =
the
> users created or updated an object, obviously the crDate or upDate =
should
> be set, but the crID or upID fields should be set to the actual user =
that
> took the action.  I'm sure the Registrar would like to know exactly =
who in
> their organization or in the registry created or updated the object.  =
The
> crID and upID fields should reflect the detail of exactly who took the
> action.  If the crID and upID fields only referenced the organization, =
the
> registrar would have no way other then reaching out to the registry to
> look in their audit tables for the detail of who took the action.  By
> linking to the user of the account (registrar or registry) and not
> directly to the account for these fields, the registrar and registry
> directly knows who took the action without having to scan the audit
> records.  The info response would return the detail required via the =
crID
> and upID fields.
>=20
> Assuming that you do change the text of
> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping to match RFC 5731 for the =
<crID>,
> and <upID> elements, there is still the open question of what needs to =
be
> deposited for successful recovery by an EBERO provider.  I see the
> following options:
>=20
> 1. Include a user deposit that at a minimum would include a user
> identifier (e.g. login name) and an account (clID) element.  The =
account
> could be the registrar or registry account.  The crID and upID would =
link
> to the user identifier.
> 2. Just include the crID and upID as simple strings without any object
> references (user or account).  The EBERO provider most likely will not
> actually attempt to activate any of the users in the user deposit, so =
the
> crID and upID migrated fields are simply informational and kept to =
ensure
> that the info response is consistent after the transition.  The EBERO
> provider would have another set of fields that would properly link to
> users (or accounts if that is how their system is built) for future
> creates and updates.  If there was any question to who actually =
created or
> updated the object, the EBERO provider would indicate that the user in =
the
> string form was imported from the data escrow that has no additional
> information.  =20
>=20
> I don't believe referencing the registrar in place of the actual user =
for
> the crID and upID is the intent of the EPP RFC's, but a level of
> indirection (user's account) wouldn't be completely out of the =
question.
> The data escrow would then need to support both, meaning that option =
#2
> above would be the only real option.  In any case as stated in my =
first
> sentence above, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements in
> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping must match the description of
> those fields in the EPP RFC's.
>=20
>=20
> --=20
>=20
> JG
>=20
>=20
>=20
> James Gould
> Principal Software Engineer
> jgould@verisign.com
>=20
> 703-948-3271 (Office)
> 12061 Bluemont Way
> Reston, VA 20190
> VerisignInc.com
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On 12/13/12 1:31 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:
>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> On Dec 13, 2012, at 9:42 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> =
wrote:
>>=20
>>> Your interpretation is different from mine of the EPP =
specifications.
>>=20
>> I find myself in this situation more ofter than I would like, but it =
is
>> my job to do fine grain review, and you guys have a better view =
because
>> Verisign played an important role in the authorship of the docs, =
which is
>> why I come to these lists to try to get clarification to those grey =
areas.
>>=20
>>=20
>>> The
>>> term client is generic, where the reference to the "sponsoring =
client"
>>> in
>>> the description of <clID> refers to the registrar.  The reference to
>>> simply "client" in the description of crID and upID can and should =
refer
>>> to any client including the actual user.
>>=20
>> Yes, but my interpretation is that those fields track 'registrars' =
not
>> internal users.
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>> It makes no sense to only return
>>> the sponsoring client information for the crID and upID fields, =
since
>>> they
>>> would pretty much almost always match the same value of clID.
>>=20
>>=20
>> Not necessarily,=20
>>=20
>> 1) REGISTRAR_A  creates a domain name (crID and clID =3D REGISTRAR_A)
>> 2) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_B (clID =3D REGISTRAR_B =
crID =3D
>> REGISTRAR_A)
>> 3) Domain name is updated (upID=3DREGISTRAR_B)
>> 4) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_C (clID=3DREGISTRAR_C)
>>=20
>> Final state:
>>=20
>> clID=3DREGISTRAR_C
>> crID=3DREGISTRAR_A
>> upID=3DREGISTRAR_B
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>> It's best
>>> to reference the actual user (Registrar User, Registry User, or =
whoever)
>>> actually created or updated the object via any of the supported =
channels
>>> (EPP, Registrar Web Tool, CSR Web Tool, Batch, etc.).  I believe you
>>> need
>>> to change the description of the crID and upID fields of the data =
escrow
>>> to match that of the EPP specifications.  We can continue to debate =
our
>>> interpretation of the EPP specification as it relates to the crID =
and
>>> upID
>>> elements. =20
>>=20
>> My design choice would be to keep the changes done by the registry
>> somewhere else and not on these fields since in my opinion, they =
relate
>> to authorized clients (a registry/system user might belong to a =
client),
>> so in your example, it is important that 'verisign' did it and not
>> jgould, jgould would be referenced in an audit table as a person =
acting
>> on behalf of verisign performing a specific transaction in the logs.
>>=20
>> Regards,
>>=20
>>=20
>> Francisco Obispo=20
>> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>> email: fobispo@isc.org
>> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>>=20

Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


From JGould@verisign.com  Fri Dec 14 10:01:53 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Subject: Re: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Francisco,

You are adding text to the RFC that doesn't exist.  If the intention was
to include the "sponsoring client" or "registrar" it would have stated it,
but it does not.  You can't simply add text that doesn't exist and then
include that text in a data escrow draft that is based on your
interpretation.  We can agree to disagree on this one, but in either event
you need to change the description of the field in
draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping to match the RFC to support both
interpretations.  "Client" in our system means user and in your system and
James's system it means registrar.  The data escrow should correctly
capture the data stored by the registry and not attempt to normalize it to
some interpretation that does match the RFC.

The usefulness of the information for an EBERO provider is a separate
topic from the interpretation of the EPP RFC's.  We would need to come to
an agreement with how these elements should be handled (e.g. user deposit,
simple string) by the EBERO provider.

--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/14/12 12:45 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>Hi James,
>
>I don't agree with your interpretation to me it looks more like:
>
>clID -> Sponsoring Client
>crID -> Client who was sponsoring at the time of creation
>upID -> Client who was sponsoring when the last update occurred
>
>The details of who (which user) updated what, to me is outside the scope
>of the EPP protocol, I'm not saying it's not important from the
>registry's perspective.
>
>Our system also has tools like the one you mentioned, for example, the
>Registrar Web Interface provides the means for registrars to have
>multiple account with different roles associated with them, and even
>though we keep detail accounting of who does what, the operations on the
>SRS are done via the 'role' account, not the individual.
>
>We as a registry are capable of answering a question who did what, from
>where and at what time.
>
>The interpretation has to do with functionality. If there was a problem
>with "documentation" lets assume the domain required specific set of
>paperwork (physical), as the current sponsor (not who created domain), I
>could look at the <crID> and ask for the paperwork, or if an update
>occurred that seemed inappropriate in the past, I could also call the
><upID> and ask for information.
>
>Sharing the detail of which individual user (not the registrar or
>registry org) who performed the [create|update] operation seems useless
>for me because as an EBERO I would not have that information/nor will
>need it for anything useful.
>
>Francisco
>
>
>On Dec 14, 2012, at 7:39 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>
>> Francisco,=20
>>=20
>>> From a high-level, independent of the EPP RFC's interpretation that I
>>>will
>> cover below, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements must
>> exactly match the description in the EPP RFC's.  The data escrow draft
>> must not attempt to apply a specific interpretation of the EPP RFC's.
>>=20
>> Below is the text from RFC 5731 for the matching <clID>, <crID>, and
>> <upID> elements of draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping:
>>=20
>> -  A <domain:clID> element that contains the identifier of the
>>      sponsoring client.
>>=20
>>   -  An OPTIONAL <domain:crID> element that contains the identifier of
>>      the client that created the domain object.
>>=20
>> -  An OPTIONAL <domain:upID> element that contains the identifier of
>>      the client that last updated the domain object.  This element MUST
>>      NOT be present if the domain has never been modified.
>>=20
>> As I pointed out in my past message, the <domain:clID> element
>>references
>> "sponsoring client" and the <domain:crID> and the <domain:upID> elements
>> reference simply "client".  The proper interpretation of "sponsoring
>> client" is to indicate the registrar and the "client" to indicate the
>> user.  A registry might provide additional tools beyond EPP, like a
>> Registrar Web Tool, for registrars to manage the objects, where the
>>access
>> to these tools would require user authentication.  A registry will also
>> have additional tools and components for authorized internal(registry)
>> users to make changes like a CSR Web Tool or batches.  The security
>>model
>> should require different user login credentials per actual user and all
>> actions taken by that user would be tracked in the system.  If one of
>>the
>> users created or updated an object, obviously the crDate or upDate
>>should
>> be set, but the crID or upID fields should be set to the actual user
>>that
>> took the action.  I'm sure the Registrar would like to know exactly who
>>in
>> their organization or in the registry created or updated the object.
>>The
>> crID and upID fields should reflect the detail of exactly who took the
>> action.  If the crID and upID fields only referenced the organization,
>>the
>> registrar would have no way other then reaching out to the registry to
>> look in their audit tables for the detail of who took the action.  By
>> linking to the user of the account (registrar or registry) and not
>> directly to the account for these fields, the registrar and registry
>> directly knows who took the action without having to scan the audit
>> records.  The info response would return the detail required via the
>>crID
>> and upID fields.
>>=20
>> Assuming that you do change the text of
>> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping to match RFC 5731 for the
>><crID>,
>> and <upID> elements, there is still the open question of what needs to
>>be
>> deposited for successful recovery by an EBERO provider.  I see the
>> following options:
>>=20
>> 1. Include a user deposit that at a minimum would include a user
>> identifier (e.g. login name) and an account (clID) element.  The account
>> could be the registrar or registry account.  The crID and upID would
>>link
>> to the user identifier.
>> 2. Just include the crID and upID as simple strings without any object
>> references (user or account).  The EBERO provider most likely will not
>> actually attempt to activate any of the users in the user deposit, so
>>the
>> crID and upID migrated fields are simply informational and kept to
>>ensure
>> that the info response is consistent after the transition.  The EBERO
>> provider would have another set of fields that would properly link to
>> users (or accounts if that is how their system is built) for future
>> creates and updates.  If there was any question to who actually created
>>or
>> updated the object, the EBERO provider would indicate that the user in
>>the
>> string form was imported from the data escrow that has no additional
>> information.  =20
>>=20
>> I don't believe referencing the registrar in place of the actual user
>>for
>> the crID and upID is the intent of the EPP RFC's, but a level of
>> indirection (user's account) wouldn't be completely out of the question.
>> The data escrow would then need to support both, meaning that option #2
>> above would be the only real option.  In any case as stated in my first
>> sentence above, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements in
>> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping must match the description of
>> those fields in the EPP RFC's.
>>=20
>>=20
>> --=20
>>=20
>> JG
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> James Gould
>> Principal Software Engineer
>> jgould@verisign.com
>>=20
>> 703-948-3271 (Office)
>> 12061 Bluemont Way
>> Reston, VA 20190
>> VerisignInc.com
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> On 12/13/12 1:31 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:
>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> On Dec 13, 2012, at 9:42 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>=20
>>>> Your interpretation is different from mine of the EPP specifications.
>>>=20
>>> I find myself in this situation more ofter than I would like, but it is
>>> my job to do fine grain review, and you guys have a better view because
>>> Verisign played an important role in the authorship of the docs, which
>>>is
>>> why I come to these lists to try to get clarification to those grey
>>>areas.
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>> The
>>>> term client is generic, where the reference to the "sponsoring client"
>>>> in
>>>> the description of <clID> refers to the registrar.  The reference to
>>>> simply "client" in the description of crID and upID can and should
>>>>refer
>>>> to any client including the actual user.
>>>=20
>>> Yes, but my interpretation is that those fields track 'registrars' not
>>> internal users.
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>> It makes no sense to only return
>>>> the sponsoring client information for the crID and upID fields, since
>>>> they
>>>> would pretty much almost always match the same value of clID.
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> Not necessarily,
>>>=20
>>> 1) REGISTRAR_A  creates a domain name (crID and clID =3D REGISTRAR_A)
>>> 2) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_B (clID =3D REGISTRAR_B crID=
 =3D
>>> REGISTRAR_A)
>>> 3) Domain name is updated (upID=3DREGISTRAR_B)
>>> 4) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_C (clID=3DREGISTRAR_C)
>>>=20
>>> Final state:
>>>=20
>>> clID=3DREGISTRAR_C
>>> crID=3DREGISTRAR_A
>>> upID=3DREGISTRAR_B
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>> It's best
>>>> to reference the actual user (Registrar User, Registry User, or
>>>>whoever)
>>>> actually created or updated the object via any of the supported
>>>>channels
>>>> (EPP, Registrar Web Tool, CSR Web Tool, Batch, etc.).  I believe you
>>>> need
>>>> to change the description of the crID and upID fields of the data
>>>>escrow
>>>> to match that of the EPP specifications.  We can continue to debate
>>>>our
>>>> interpretation of the EPP specification as it relates to the crID and
>>>> upID
>>>> elements. =20
>>>=20
>>> My design choice would be to keep the changes done by the registry
>>> somewhere else and not on these fields since in my opinion, they relate
>>> to authorized clients (a registry/system user might belong to a
>>>client),
>>> so in your example, it is important that 'verisign' did it and not
>>> jgould, jgould would be referenced in an audit table as a person acting
>>> on behalf of verisign performing a specific transaction in the logs.
>>>=20
>>> Regards,
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> Francisco Obispo
>>> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>>> email: fobispo@isc.org
>>> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>>> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>>>=20
>
>Francisco Obispo=20
>Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>email: fobispo@isc.org
>Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>


From fobispo@isc.org  Fri Dec 14 10:11:11 2012
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On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:01 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> =
wrote:

> Francisco,
>=20
> You are adding text to the RFC that doesn't exist.  If the intention =
was
> to include the "sponsoring client" or "registrar" it would have stated =
it,
> but it does not.

The problem is, that it doesn't say it's a user either, it says =
"client", and you could ask yourself, who is the "client" of an EPP =
service ? we can't assure a registrar, because in a registry model =
without registrars' it could be the registry or anyone.


>  You can't simply add text that doesn't exist and then
> include that text in a data escrow draft that is based on your
> interpretation. =20

I did not added any text, it was my interpretation.

> We can agree to disagree on this one, but in either event
> you need to change the description of the field in
> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping to match the RFC to support =
both
> interpretations.  "Client" in our system means user and in your system =
and
> James's system it means registrar.

That would be Francisco Arias (ICANN) or Shoji Noguchi (JPRS).


>  The data escrow should correctly
> capture the data stored by the registry and not attempt to normalize =
it to
> some interpretation that does match the RFC.
>=20
> The usefulness of the information for an EBERO provider is a separate
> topic from the interpretation of the EPP RFC's.  We would need to come =
to
> an agreement with how these elements should be handled (e.g. user =
deposit,
> simple string) by the EBERO provider.
>=20

Well actually it is not, it is what we're trying to discuss here, we are =
trying to figure out how to make the Data escrow system work for =
Internet Registries.

Francisco


> --=20
>=20
> JG
>=20
>=20
>=20
> James Gould
> Principal Software Engineer
> jgould@verisign.com
>=20
> 703-948-3271 (Office)
> 12061 Bluemont Way
> Reston, VA 20190
> VerisignInc.com
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
>=20
> On 12/14/12 12:45 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:
>=20
>> Hi James,
>>=20
>> I don't agree with your interpretation to me it looks more like:
>>=20
>> clID -> Sponsoring Client
>> crID -> Client who was sponsoring at the time of creation
>> upID -> Client who was sponsoring when the last update occurred
>>=20
>> The details of who (which user) updated what, to me is outside the =
scope
>> of the EPP protocol, I'm not saying it's not important from the
>> registry's perspective.
>>=20
>> Our system also has tools like the one you mentioned, for example, =
the
>> Registrar Web Interface provides the means for registrars to have
>> multiple account with different roles associated with them, and even
>> though we keep detail accounting of who does what, the operations on =
the
>> SRS are done via the 'role' account, not the individual.
>>=20
>> We as a registry are capable of answering a question who did what, =
from
>> where and at what time.
>>=20
>> The interpretation has to do with functionality. If there was a =
problem
>> with "documentation" lets assume the domain required specific set of
>> paperwork (physical), as the current sponsor (not who created =
domain), I
>> could look at the <crID> and ask for the paperwork, or if an update
>> occurred that seemed inappropriate in the past, I could also call the
>> <upID> and ask for information.
>>=20
>> Sharing the detail of which individual user (not the registrar or
>> registry org) who performed the [create|update] operation seems =
useless
>> for me because as an EBERO I would not have that information/nor will
>> need it for anything useful.
>>=20
>> Francisco
>>=20
>>=20
>> On Dec 14, 2012, at 7:39 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> =
wrote:
>>=20
>>> Francisco,=20
>>>=20
>>>> =46rom a high-level, independent of the EPP RFC's interpretation =
that I
>>>> will
>>> cover below, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements must
>>> exactly match the description in the EPP RFC's.  The data escrow =
draft
>>> must not attempt to apply a specific interpretation of the EPP =
RFC's.
>>>=20
>>> Below is the text from RFC 5731 for the matching <clID>, <crID>, and
>>> <upID> elements of draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping:
>>>=20
>>> -  A <domain:clID> element that contains the identifier of the
>>>     sponsoring client.
>>>=20
>>>  -  An OPTIONAL <domain:crID> element that contains the identifier =
of
>>>     the client that created the domain object.
>>>=20
>>> -  An OPTIONAL <domain:upID> element that contains the identifier of
>>>     the client that last updated the domain object.  This element =
MUST
>>>     NOT be present if the domain has never been modified.
>>>=20
>>> As I pointed out in my past message, the <domain:clID> element
>>> references
>>> "sponsoring client" and the <domain:crID> and the <domain:upID> =
elements
>>> reference simply "client".  The proper interpretation of "sponsoring
>>> client" is to indicate the registrar and the "client" to indicate =
the
>>> user.  A registry might provide additional tools beyond EPP, like a
>>> Registrar Web Tool, for registrars to manage the objects, where the
>>> access
>>> to these tools would require user authentication.  A registry will =
also
>>> have additional tools and components for authorized =
internal(registry)
>>> users to make changes like a CSR Web Tool or batches.  The security
>>> model
>>> should require different user login credentials per actual user and =
all
>>> actions taken by that user would be tracked in the system.  If one =
of
>>> the
>>> users created or updated an object, obviously the crDate or upDate
>>> should
>>> be set, but the crID or upID fields should be set to the actual user
>>> that
>>> took the action.  I'm sure the Registrar would like to know exactly =
who
>>> in
>>> their organization or in the registry created or updated the object.
>>> The
>>> crID and upID fields should reflect the detail of exactly who took =
the
>>> action.  If the crID and upID fields only referenced the =
organization,
>>> the
>>> registrar would have no way other then reaching out to the registry =
to
>>> look in their audit tables for the detail of who took the action.  =
By
>>> linking to the user of the account (registrar or registry) and not
>>> directly to the account for these fields, the registrar and registry
>>> directly knows who took the action without having to scan the audit
>>> records.  The info response would return the detail required via the
>>> crID
>>> and upID fields.
>>>=20
>>> Assuming that you do change the text of
>>> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping to match RFC 5731 for the
>>> <crID>,
>>> and <upID> elements, there is still the open question of what needs =
to
>>> be
>>> deposited for successful recovery by an EBERO provider.  I see the
>>> following options:
>>>=20
>>> 1. Include a user deposit that at a minimum would include a user
>>> identifier (e.g. login name) and an account (clID) element.  The =
account
>>> could be the registrar or registry account.  The crID and upID would
>>> link
>>> to the user identifier.
>>> 2. Just include the crID and upID as simple strings without any =
object
>>> references (user or account).  The EBERO provider most likely will =
not
>>> actually attempt to activate any of the users in the user deposit, =
so
>>> the
>>> crID and upID migrated fields are simply informational and kept to
>>> ensure
>>> that the info response is consistent after the transition.  The =
EBERO
>>> provider would have another set of fields that would properly link =
to
>>> users (or accounts if that is how their system is built) for future
>>> creates and updates.  If there was any question to who actually =
created
>>> or
>>> updated the object, the EBERO provider would indicate that the user =
in
>>> the
>>> string form was imported from the data escrow that has no additional
>>> information.  =20
>>>=20
>>> I don't believe referencing the registrar in place of the actual =
user
>>> for
>>> the crID and upID is the intent of the EPP RFC's, but a level of
>>> indirection (user's account) wouldn't be completely out of the =
question.
>>> The data escrow would then need to support both, meaning that option =
#2
>>> above would be the only real option.  In any case as stated in my =
first
>>> sentence above, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements in
>>> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping must match the description =
of
>>> those fields in the EPP RFC's.
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> --=20
>>>=20
>>> JG
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> James Gould
>>> Principal Software Engineer
>>> jgould@verisign.com
>>>=20
>>> 703-948-3271 (Office)
>>> 12061 Bluemont Way
>>> Reston, VA 20190
>>> VerisignInc.com
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> On 12/13/12 1:31 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:
>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> On Dec 13, 2012, at 9:42 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>=20
>>>>> Your interpretation is different from mine of the EPP =
specifications.
>>>>=20
>>>> I find myself in this situation more ofter than I would like, but =
it is
>>>> my job to do fine grain review, and you guys have a better view =
because
>>>> Verisign played an important role in the authorship of the docs, =
which
>>>> is
>>>> why I come to these lists to try to get clarification to those grey
>>>> areas.
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>> The
>>>>> term client is generic, where the reference to the "sponsoring =
client"
>>>>> in
>>>>> the description of <clID> refers to the registrar.  The reference =
to
>>>>> simply "client" in the description of crID and upID can and should
>>>>> refer
>>>>> to any client including the actual user.
>>>>=20
>>>> Yes, but my interpretation is that those fields track 'registrars' =
not
>>>> internal users.
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>> It makes no sense to only return
>>>>> the sponsoring client information for the crID and upID fields, =
since
>>>>> they
>>>>> would pretty much almost always match the same value of clID.
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> Not necessarily,
>>>>=20
>>>> 1) REGISTRAR_A  creates a domain name (crID and clID =3D =
REGISTRAR_A)
>>>> 2) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_B (clID =3D REGISTRAR_B =
crID =3D
>>>> REGISTRAR_A)
>>>> 3) Domain name is updated (upID=3DREGISTRAR_B)
>>>> 4) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_C (clID=3DREGISTRAR_C)
>>>>=20
>>>> Final state:
>>>>=20
>>>> clID=3DREGISTRAR_C
>>>> crID=3DREGISTRAR_A
>>>> upID=3DREGISTRAR_B
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>> It's best
>>>>> to reference the actual user (Registrar User, Registry User, or
>>>>> whoever)
>>>>> actually created or updated the object via any of the supported
>>>>> channels
>>>>> (EPP, Registrar Web Tool, CSR Web Tool, Batch, etc.).  I believe =
you
>>>>> need
>>>>> to change the description of the crID and upID fields of the data
>>>>> escrow
>>>>> to match that of the EPP specifications.  We can continue to =
debate
>>>>> our
>>>>> interpretation of the EPP specification as it relates to the crID =
and
>>>>> upID
>>>>> elements. =20
>>>>=20
>>>> My design choice would be to keep the changes done by the registry
>>>> somewhere else and not on these fields since in my opinion, they =
relate
>>>> to authorized clients (a registry/system user might belong to a
>>>> client),
>>>> so in your example, it is important that 'verisign' did it and not
>>>> jgould, jgould would be referenced in an audit table as a person =
acting
>>>> on behalf of verisign performing a specific transaction in the =
logs.
>>>>=20
>>>> Regards,
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> Francisco Obispo
>>>> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>>>> email: fobispo@isc.org
>>>> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>>>> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>>>>=20
>>=20
>> Francisco Obispo=20
>> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>> email: fobispo@isc.org
>> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>>=20

Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


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On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:10 AM, Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>> You can't simply add text that doesn't exist and then
>> include that text in a data escrow draft that is based on your
>> interpretation.=20

BTW, the fact that Arias, and Noguchi decided to use the EPP format as a =
guideline, is plausible, but if you are correct but what is needed is =
the registrar/client and not the individual user information, then the =
requirement in the escrow needs to reflect what is needed and not what =
the EPP protocol says.

I'm just trying to say that one protocol is not bound to the other, and =
if that was the case, we would not be discussing XML over CSV or =
viceversa.


Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


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From: "Hollenbeck, Scott" <shollenbeck@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
Thread-Topic: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: ire-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ire-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of
> Francisco Obispo
> Sent: Friday, December 14, 2012 1:11 PM
> To: Gould, James
> Cc: Luis Mu=F1oz; ire@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD
> (1)
>=20
>=20
> On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:01 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
> wrote:
>=20
> > Francisco,
> >
> > You are adding text to the RFC that doesn't exist.  If the intention
> > was to include the "sponsoring client" or "registrar" it would have
> > stated it, but it does not.
>=20
> The problem is, that it doesn't say it's a user either, it says
> "client", and you could ask yourself, who is the "client" of an EPP
> service ? we can't assure a registrar, because in a registry model
> without registrars' it could be the registry or anyone.

The EPP fields are intended to capture the value of the <clID> element prov=
ided with the <login> command of the client (in the context of a client-ser=
ver relationship) that performed the create or update action. The clID, crI=
D, and upID values don't tell you anything about the client's role.

Scott

From JGould@verisign.com  Fri Dec 14 10:32:10 2012
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To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Francisco,

My replies are below.


--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/14/12 1:10 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>
>On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:01 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>
>> Francisco,
>>=20
>> You are adding text to the RFC that doesn't exist.  If the intention was
>> to include the "sponsoring client" or "registrar" it would have stated
>>it,
>> but it does not.
>
>The problem is, that it doesn't say it's a user either, it says "client",
>and you could ask yourself, who is the "client" of an EPP service ? we
>can't assure a registrar, because in a registry model without registrars'
>it could be the registry or anyone.

The client is the user that is interfacing with the system (web UI user,
EPP user, batch user).  All user's of a registrar and registry are clients
to the service and should be reflected in the crID and upID.  We only
support a single user of the registrar to interface with the EPP service,
but that user (B2B) is still separate and distinct from the Registrar
itself.  We support many users via the other channels.


>
>
>>  You can't simply add text that doesn't exist and then
>> include that text in a data escrow draft that is based on your
>> interpretation.=20
>
>I did not added any text, it was my interpretation.

I'm referring to adding text to the data escrow draft that doesn't match
the EPP RFC.

>
>> We can agree to disagree on this one, but in either event
>> you need to change the description of the field in
>> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping to match the RFC to support
>>both
>> interpretations.  "Client" in our system means user and in your system
>>and
>> James's system it means registrar.
>
>That would be Francisco Arias (ICANN) or Shoji Noguchi (JPRS).

That would also include Gustavo I assume.  My feedback is that the text
needs to match the EPP RFC.  Gustavo, can you or one of your co-authors
make that change? =20

>
>
>>  The data escrow should correctly
>> capture the data stored by the registry and not attempt to normalize it
>>to
>> some interpretation that does match the RFC.
>>=20
>> The usefulness of the information for an EBERO provider is a separate
>> topic from the interpretation of the EPP RFC's.  We would need to come
>>to
>> an agreement with how these elements should be handled (e.g. user
>>deposit,
>> simple string) by the EBERO provider.
>>=20
>
>Well actually it is not, it is what we're trying to discuss here, we are
>trying to figure out how to make the Data escrow system work for Internet
>Registries.

Yes, now that we know that user's do exist in registry data models, the
question is whether they need to be escrowed along with the registrar
information?  If so, what attributes need to be escrowed?  If not, what do
we do with the crID and upID fields that "in some systems" reference users
and not registrars.



>
>Francisco
>
>
>> --=20
>>=20
>> JG
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> James Gould
>> Principal Software Engineer
>> jgould@verisign.com
>>=20
>> 703-948-3271 (Office)
>> 12061 Bluemont Way
>> Reston, VA 20190
>> VerisignInc.com
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>>=20
>> On 12/14/12 12:45 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:
>>=20
>>> Hi James,
>>>=20
>>> I don't agree with your interpretation to me it looks more like:
>>>=20
>>> clID -> Sponsoring Client
>>> crID -> Client who was sponsoring at the time of creation
>>> upID -> Client who was sponsoring when the last update occurred
>>>=20
>>> The details of who (which user) updated what, to me is outside the
>>>scope
>>> of the EPP protocol, I'm not saying it's not important from the
>>> registry's perspective.
>>>=20
>>> Our system also has tools like the one you mentioned, for example, the
>>> Registrar Web Interface provides the means for registrars to have
>>> multiple account with different roles associated with them, and even
>>> though we keep detail accounting of who does what, the operations on
>>>the
>>> SRS are done via the 'role' account, not the individual.
>>>=20
>>> We as a registry are capable of answering a question who did what, from
>>> where and at what time.
>>>=20
>>> The interpretation has to do with functionality. If there was a problem
>>> with "documentation" lets assume the domain required specific set of
>>> paperwork (physical), as the current sponsor (not who created domain),
>>>I
>>> could look at the <crID> and ask for the paperwork, or if an update
>>> occurred that seemed inappropriate in the past, I could also call the
>>> <upID> and ask for information.
>>>=20
>>> Sharing the detail of which individual user (not the registrar or
>>> registry org) who performed the [create|update] operation seems useless
>>> for me because as an EBERO I would not have that information/nor will
>>> need it for anything useful.
>>>=20
>>> Francisco
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> On Dec 14, 2012, at 7:39 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>=20
>>>> Francisco,=20
>>>>=20
>>>>> From a high-level, independent of the EPP RFC's interpretation that I
>>>>> will
>>>> cover below, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements must
>>>> exactly match the description in the EPP RFC's.  The data escrow draft
>>>> must not attempt to apply a specific interpretation of the EPP RFC's.
>>>>=20
>>>> Below is the text from RFC 5731 for the matching <clID>, <crID>, and
>>>> <upID> elements of draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping:
>>>>=20
>>>> -  A <domain:clID> element that contains the identifier of the
>>>>     sponsoring client.
>>>>=20
>>>>  -  An OPTIONAL <domain:crID> element that contains the identifier of
>>>>     the client that created the domain object.
>>>>=20
>>>> -  An OPTIONAL <domain:upID> element that contains the identifier of
>>>>     the client that last updated the domain object.  This element MUST
>>>>     NOT be present if the domain has never been modified.
>>>>=20
>>>> As I pointed out in my past message, the <domain:clID> element
>>>> references
>>>> "sponsoring client" and the <domain:crID> and the <domain:upID>
>>>>elements
>>>> reference simply "client".  The proper interpretation of "sponsoring
>>>> client" is to indicate the registrar and the "client" to indicate the
>>>> user.  A registry might provide additional tools beyond EPP, like a
>>>> Registrar Web Tool, for registrars to manage the objects, where the
>>>> access
>>>> to these tools would require user authentication.  A registry will
>>>>also
>>>> have additional tools and components for authorized internal(registry)
>>>> users to make changes like a CSR Web Tool or batches.  The security
>>>> model
>>>> should require different user login credentials per actual user and
>>>>all
>>>> actions taken by that user would be tracked in the system.  If one of
>>>> the
>>>> users created or updated an object, obviously the crDate or upDate
>>>> should
>>>> be set, but the crID or upID fields should be set to the actual user
>>>> that
>>>> took the action.  I'm sure the Registrar would like to know exactly
>>>>who
>>>> in
>>>> their organization or in the registry created or updated the object.
>>>> The
>>>> crID and upID fields should reflect the detail of exactly who took the
>>>> action.  If the crID and upID fields only referenced the organization,
>>>> the
>>>> registrar would have no way other then reaching out to the registry to
>>>> look in their audit tables for the detail of who took the action.  By
>>>> linking to the user of the account (registrar or registry) and not
>>>> directly to the account for these fields, the registrar and registry
>>>> directly knows who took the action without having to scan the audit
>>>> records.  The info response would return the detail required via the
>>>> crID
>>>> and upID fields.
>>>>=20
>>>> Assuming that you do change the text of
>>>> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping to match RFC 5731 for the
>>>> <crID>,
>>>> and <upID> elements, there is still the open question of what needs to
>>>> be
>>>> deposited for successful recovery by an EBERO provider.  I see the
>>>> following options:
>>>>=20
>>>> 1. Include a user deposit that at a minimum would include a user
>>>> identifier (e.g. login name) and an account (clID) element.  The
>>>>account
>>>> could be the registrar or registry account.  The crID and upID would
>>>> link
>>>> to the user identifier.
>>>> 2. Just include the crID and upID as simple strings without any object
>>>> references (user or account).  The EBERO provider most likely will not
>>>> actually attempt to activate any of the users in the user deposit, so
>>>> the
>>>> crID and upID migrated fields are simply informational and kept to
>>>> ensure
>>>> that the info response is consistent after the transition.  The EBERO
>>>> provider would have another set of fields that would properly link to
>>>> users (or accounts if that is how their system is built) for future
>>>> creates and updates.  If there was any question to who actually
>>>>created
>>>> or
>>>> updated the object, the EBERO provider would indicate that the user in
>>>> the
>>>> string form was imported from the data escrow that has no additional
>>>> information. =20
>>>>=20
>>>> I don't believe referencing the registrar in place of the actual user
>>>> for
>>>> the crID and upID is the intent of the EPP RFC's, but a level of
>>>> indirection (user's account) wouldn't be completely out of the
>>>>question.
>>>> The data escrow would then need to support both, meaning that option
>>>>#2
>>>> above would be the only real option.  In any case as stated in my
>>>>first
>>>> sentence above, the description of the <crID> and <upID> elements in
>>>> draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping must match the description of
>>>> those fields in the EPP RFC's.
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> --=20
>>>>=20
>>>> JG
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> James Gould
>>>> Principal Software Engineer
>>>> jgould@verisign.com
>>>>=20
>>>> 703-948-3271 (Office)
>>>> 12061 Bluemont Way
>>>> Reston, VA 20190
>>>> VerisignInc.com
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> On 12/13/12 1:31 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:
>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>> On Dec 13, 2012, at 9:42 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Your interpretation is different from mine of the EPP
>>>>>>specifications.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> I find myself in this situation more ofter than I would like, but it
>>>>>is
>>>>> my job to do fine grain review, and you guys have a better view
>>>>>because
>>>>> Verisign played an important role in the authorship of the docs,
>>>>>which
>>>>> is
>>>>> why I come to these lists to try to get clarification to those grey
>>>>> areas.
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>> The
>>>>>> term client is generic, where the reference to the "sponsoring
>>>>>>client"
>>>>>> in
>>>>>> the description of <clID> refers to the registrar.  The reference to
>>>>>> simply "client" in the description of crID and upID can and should
>>>>>> refer
>>>>>> to any client including the actual user.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Yes, but my interpretation is that those fields track 'registrars'
>>>>>not
>>>>> internal users.
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>> It makes no sense to only return
>>>>>> the sponsoring client information for the crID and upID fields,
>>>>>>since
>>>>>> they
>>>>>> would pretty much almost always match the same value of clID.
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Not necessarily,
>>>>>=20
>>>>> 1) REGISTRAR_A  creates a domain name (crID and clID =3D REGISTRAR_A)
>>>>> 2) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_B (clID =3D REGISTRAR_B
>>>>>crID =3D
>>>>> REGISTRAR_A)
>>>>> 3) Domain name is updated (upID=3DREGISTRAR_B)
>>>>> 4) Domain name is transferred to REGISTRAR_C (clID=3DREGISTRAR_C)
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Final state:
>>>>>=20
>>>>> clID=3DREGISTRAR_C
>>>>> crID=3DREGISTRAR_A
>>>>> upID=3DREGISTRAR_B
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>> It's best
>>>>>> to reference the actual user (Registrar User, Registry User, or
>>>>>> whoever)
>>>>>> actually created or updated the object via any of the supported
>>>>>> channels
>>>>>> (EPP, Registrar Web Tool, CSR Web Tool, Batch, etc.).  I believe you
>>>>>> need
>>>>>> to change the description of the crID and upID fields of the data
>>>>>> escrow
>>>>>> to match that of the EPP specifications.  We can continue to debate
>>>>>> our
>>>>>> interpretation of the EPP specification as it relates to the crID
>>>>>>and
>>>>>> upID
>>>>>> elements. =20
>>>>>=20
>>>>> My design choice would be to keep the changes done by the registry
>>>>> somewhere else and not on these fields since in my opinion, they
>>>>>relate
>>>>> to authorized clients (a registry/system user might belong to a
>>>>> client),
>>>>> so in your example, it is important that 'verisign' did it and not
>>>>> jgould, jgould would be referenced in an audit table as a person
>>>>>acting
>>>>> on behalf of verisign performing a specific transaction in the logs.
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>> Francisco Obispo
>>>>> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>>>>> email: fobispo@isc.org
>>>>> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>>>>> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>>>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> Francisco Obispo
>>> Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>>> email: fobispo@isc.org
>>> Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>>> PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>>>=20
>
>Francisco Obispo=20
>Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>email: fobispo@isc.org
>Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>


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On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:29 AM, "Hollenbeck, Scott" =
<shollenbeck@verisign.com> wrote:

> The EPP fields are intended to capture the value of the <clID> element =
provided with the <login> command of the client (in the context of a =
client-server relationship) that performed the create or update action. =
The clID, crID, and upID values don't tell you anything about the =
client's role.

So clID -> Sposoring Client, which means: a user that was able to login =
via an EPP <login> command, which is consider to sponsor the domain name =
right?

Which means that crID =3D=3D clID that registered the domain name

and

upID =3D> clID that last updated the domain name

I don't see any ambiguity here.



Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


From JGould@verisign.com  Fri Dec 14 10:45:13 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Francisco,

EPP is the provisioning protocol for the systems that you are going to
escrow, so naturally it is the basis in determining the set of fields and
intent of the fields to escrow.  I don't believe you can separate the two
in the discussion.=20

--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/14/12 1:29 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>
>On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:10 AM, Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:
>
>>> You can't simply add text that doesn't exist and then
>>> include that text in a data escrow draft that is based on your
>>> interpretation.
>
>BTW, the fact that Arias, and Noguchi decided to use the EPP format as a
>guideline, is plausible, but if you are correct but what is needed is the
>registrar/client and not the individual user information, then the
>requirement in the escrow needs to reflect what is needed and not what
>the EPP protocol says.
>
>I'm just trying to say that one protocol is not bound to the other, and
>if that was the case, we would not be discussing XML over CSV or
>viceversa.
>
>
>Francisco Obispo=20
>Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>email: fobispo@isc.org
>Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>


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On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:31 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> =
wrote:

> The client is the user that is interfacing with the system (web UI =
user,
> EPP user, batch user).  All user's of a registrar and registry are =
clients
> to the service and should be reflected in the crID and upID. =20

For us, we have separate systems: the SRS, which is the authoritative =
source for registry information, and the Registrar Web Interface, which =
has the other role accounts. When a user of this system needs to perform =
an operation in the SRS, we do that with the 'role' account credentials, =
not the individual user, because SRS doesn't know about the users of =
this other system.


> We only
> support a single user of the registrar to interface with the EPP =
service,
> but that user (B2B) is still separate and distinct from the Registrar
> itself.  We support many users via the other channels.

We do that as well, and we supported as described above.

Regards,

Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


From shollenbeck@verisign.com  Fri Dec 14 10:57:50 2012
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From: "Hollenbeck, Scott" <shollenbeck@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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> -----Original Message-----
> From: Francisco Obispo [mailto:fobispo@isc.org]
> Sent: Friday, December 14, 2012 1:34 PM
> To: Hollenbeck, Scott
> Cc: Gould, James; ire@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD
> (1)
>=20
>=20
> On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:29 AM, "Hollenbeck, Scott"
> <shollenbeck@verisign.com> wrote:
>=20
> > The EPP fields are intended to capture the value of the <clID>
> element provided with the <login> command of the client (in the context
> of a client-server relationship) that performed the create or update
> action. The clID, crID, and upID values don't tell you anything about
> the client's role.
>=20
> So clID -> Sposoring Client, which means: a user that was able to login
> via an EPP <login> command, which is consider to sponsor the domain
> name right?

EPP doesn't refer to clients as "users" since that word has anthropomorphic=
 meaning and clients don't have to be human. It does say this about the "sp=
onsor" word (in section 1.1 of RFC 5730):

"A protocol client that is authorized to manage an existing object is descr=
ibed as a "sponsoring" client throughout this document."

Scott

From fobispo@isc.org  Fri Dec 14 11:01:30 2012
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From: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
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Date: Fri, 14 Dec 2012 11:01:18 -0800
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To: "Hollenbeck, Scott" <shollenbeck@verisign.com>
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Cc: "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [ire] New version (4) of the spec and new draft on DNRD (1)
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Yes,

I mentioned in a previous email that "registrar" was also wrong, because =
we're assuming that there is one, when it could be anyone.

I agree with the concept of "Client" but I just want to make sure we're =
referring to the same type of client across upID, crID and clID.

So if a "client" was able to login via EPP, that ID will be reflected in =
any of those fields in the corresponding object's information as part of =
a transaction that occurred.

So when exporting the data to the escrow, those fields must include an =
identifier that is present in the "client"'s table, and if clients =
happen to be registrar, it will be a registrar ID.

Francisco


On Dec 14, 2012, at 10:57 AM, "Hollenbeck, Scott" =
<shollenbeck@verisign.com> wrote:

> EPP doesn't refer to clients as "users" since that word has =
anthropomorphic meaning and clients don't have to be human. It does say =
this about the "sponsor" word (in section 1.1 of RFC 5730):
>=20
> "A protocol client that is authorized to manage an existing object is =
described as a "sponsoring" client throughout this document."
>=20
> Scott

Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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Gustavo,

Has the concept of an "extended verification process" for the data escrow a=
gents been previously discussed or documented?   It looks like some of the =
data integrity checks (linked contacts and hosts) along with business rules=
 like whether or not there are glue records and the creation and last updat=
e dates in the future are better handled by an EBERO provider based on the =
deposits made.  The Data Escrow Provider should be able to validate the com=
pleteness of the deposit by verifying the signatures and verify the deposit=
 against the format definition.  Items like email address validation should=
 be covered by the XSD format definition.  Applying differential deposits t=
o the full deposit also sounds like the job of the EBERO provider and not t=
he Data Escrow Provider.    In summary, I believe that only #1 below should=
 be required of the Data Escrow Provider and the remainder should be discus=
sed as a requirement for an EBERO provider.

--

JG

[cid:2FE192F5-206E-41B1-B26D-69A4A5A73698]

James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com

703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com



From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.=
org>>
Date: Thursday, December 13, 2012 7:28 PM
To: "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>>
Subject: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files


Colleagues,



Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:



" (5) If [1] includes a verification process, that will be applied at this =
step."



We are in the process of defining the extended verification process that th=
e data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow deposit file. This =
process will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.



The purpose of this continuous verification process is to mitigate the risk=
 of  an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.


In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full=
 and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification pr=
ocess.


I am interested in your feedback regarding:

 1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.

 2. The proposed tests itself.


Proposed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the fi=
nal list of tests with your input):

 1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD i=
ncluding extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new g=
TLD base agreement.

 2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pre=
sent.

 3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are presen=
t.

 4. All the required glue records are present.

 5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in =
other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: =
RFC5735 and RFC6598.

 6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the ex=
ception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.

 7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.

 8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.


Note: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names=
 escrowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by t=
he data escrow agents to ICANN.


Regards,
Gustavo Lozano





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e-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-fami=
ly: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<div>
<div>
<div>Gustavo,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Has the concept of an &quot;extended verification process&quot; for th=
e data escrow agents been previously discussed or documented? &nbsp; It loo=
ks like some of the data integrity checks (linked contacts and hosts) along=
 with business rules like whether or not there
 are glue records and the creation and last update dates in the future are =
better handled by an EBERO provider based on the deposits made. &nbsp;The D=
ata Escrow Provider should be able to validate the completeness of the depo=
sit by verifying the signatures and verify
 the deposit against the format definition. &nbsp;Items like email address =
validation should be covered by the XSD format definition. &nbsp;Applying d=
ifferential deposits to the full deposit also sounds like the job of the EB=
ERO provider and not the Data Escrow Provider.
 &nbsp; &nbsp;In summary, I believe that only #1 below should be required o=
f the Data Escrow Provider and the remainder should be discussed as a requi=
rement for an EBERO provider. &nbsp;</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>--&nbsp;</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">JG<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p><=
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(13, 62, 137); ">James Gould</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">703-948-3271 (Office)</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">12061 Bluemont Way</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">Reston, VA 20190</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); "><font face=
=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">VerisignInc.com</font></span><span style=3D"font-si=
ze: 16pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); "><font face=3D"Calibri" size=
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<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:b=
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<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span>Thursday, December 13, 2012 7=
:28 PM<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span>&quot;<a href=3D"mailto:ire@iet=
f.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.=
org</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Subject: </span>[ire] Extended verificatio=
n process of the escrow deposit files<br>
</div>
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<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Colleagues,<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD=
 applicant guidebook specifies:<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&quot; (5) If [1] includes a verification p=
rocess, that will be applied at this step.&quot;<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">We are in the process of defining the exten=
ded verification process that the data escrow agents must perform daily wit=
h the escrow deposit file. This process
 will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The purpose of this continuous verification=
 process is to mitigate the risk of<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:yes">&nbsp;
</span>an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">In c=
ase of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full and=
 all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification proces=
s.</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">I am interested in your feedback regarding:=
<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Other tests that you consider shou=
ld be present in the draft.<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;2. The proposed tests itself.</font><=
/span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Prop=
osed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the final =
list of tests with your input):<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD =
including extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new =
gTLD base agreement.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pr=
esent.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are prese=
nt.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;4. All the required glue records are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in=
 other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in:=
 RFC5735 and RFC6598.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the e=
xception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.<o:p=
></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Note=
: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names esc=
rowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by the d=
ata escrow agents to ICANN.&nbsp;</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px; ">Regards,</span=
></div>
<div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Gustavo Lo=
zano</span><br>
<p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: =
22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: =
22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<!--EndFragment--></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</span>
</body>
</html>

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From gustavo.lozano@icann.org  Mon Dec 17 12:44:29 2012
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From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
To: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2012 12:44:22 -0800
Thread-Topic: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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James, James, and Christopher,

Thank you for your comments.

The objective of the extended verification process is to reduce the risk of=
 finding that the escrow deposit is inconsistent when it is too late (e.g. =
the EBERO is needed and the current registry operator is uncooperative or u=
nable to provide the requisite data).

The objective is not to create provisioning requirements nor create an audi=
t process.

ICANN access to the escrow deposit is sporadic; therefore the data escrow a=
gent is in the best position to execute a verification procedure of the dat=
a escrow deposit file.

The standard verification procedure performed by the data escrow agent, spe=
cification 2 of the new gTLD AGB part A, 8, 1-4, basically require the data=
 escrow agent verify the signature and validate using the XML schema of the=
 dnrd draft. The XML schema of the dnrd draft is too generic and it does no=
t include extensions.

Step 5 of the verification procedure mentioned in the AGB (specification 2 =
of the new gTLD AGB, part A, 5) is there to define extra tests that must be=
 performed by the escrow agent. We envisioned use step 5 to at least define=
 that escrow agents must validate the escrow deposit file using the customi=
zed XML schema for the new gTLD and the data escrow extensions.

We want to add more tests to this verification procedure (step 5) in order =
to reduce the risk mentioned above. These tests must be universally applica=
ble regarding of the business model of the registry operator. We believe th=
at the expertise present in this list could help to refine this extended ve=
rification process to narrow the filter of what appears to be a consistent =
data escrow deposit.

The extended verification tests could be separated in two categories: appli=
cable to all TLDs (e.g. ccTLDs) and applicable to the new gTLD program.

It is worth mentioned that the extended verification process is not the onl=
y mechanism envisioned by ICANN to mitigate the risk of an inconsistent esc=
row deposit file.

Thank you.

Regards,
Gustavo

From: <Gould>, James <JGould@verisign.com<mailto:JGould@verisign.com>>
Date: Monday, December 17, 2012 10:57 AM
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.or=
g>>, "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>=
>
Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit file=
s

Gustavo,

Has the concept of an "extended verification process" for the data escrow a=
gents been previously discussed or documented?   It looks like some of the =
data integrity checks (linked contacts and hosts) along with business rules=
 like whether or not there are glue records and the creation and last updat=
e dates in the future are better handled by an EBERO provider based on the =
deposits made.  The Data Escrow Provider should be able to validate the com=
pleteness of the deposit by verifying the signatures and verify the deposit=
 against the format definition.  Items like email address validation should=
 be covered by the XSD format definition.  Applying differential deposits t=
o the full deposit also sounds like the job of the EBERO provider and not t=
he Data Escrow Provider.    In summary, I believe that only #1 below should=
 be required of the Data Escrow Provider and the remainder should be discus=
sed as a requirement for an EBERO provider.

--

JG

[cid:2FE192F5-206E-41B1-B26D-69A4A5A73698]

James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com<mailto:jgould@verisign.com>

703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com



From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.=
org>>
Date: Thursday, December 13, 2012 7:28 PM
To: "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>>
Subject: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files


Colleagues,



Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:



" (5) If [1] includes a verification process, that will be applied at this =
step."



We are in the process of defining the extended verification process that th=
e data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow deposit file. This =
process will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.



The purpose of this continuous verification process is to mitigate the risk=
 of  an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.


In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full=
 and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification pr=
ocess.


I am interested in your feedback regarding:

 1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.

 2. The proposed tests itself.


Proposed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the fi=
nal list of tests with your input):

 1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD i=
ncluding extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new g=
TLD base agreement.

 2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pre=
sent.

 3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are presen=
t.

 4. All the required glue records are present.

 5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in =
other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: =
RFC5735 and RFC6598.

 6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the ex=
ception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.

 7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.

 8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.


Note: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names=
 escrowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by t=
he data escrow agents to ICANN.


Regards,
Gustavo Lozano





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</head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -web=
kit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><span class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">James, James, and Christop=
her,</span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: =
14px;"><br></span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font=
-size: 14px;">Thank you for your comments.</span></div><div><span class=3D"=
Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 14px;"><br></span></div><div>










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<!--StartFragment-->

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 14px;">The
objective of the extended verification process is to reduce the risk of fin=
ding
that the escrow deposit is inconsistent when it is too late (e.g. the EBERO=
 is
needed and the current registry operator is uncooperative or unable to prov=
ide
the requisite data).<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibr=
i" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">&nbsp;</font></o:p></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 14px;">The objective
is not to create provisioning requirements nor create an audit process.<o:p=
></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibr=
i" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">&nbsp;</font></o:p></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 14px;">ICANN access
to the escrow deposit is sporadic; therefore the data escrow agent is in th=
e
best position to execute a verification procedure of the data escrow deposi=
t
file.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibr=
i" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">&nbsp;</font></o:p></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 14px;">The standard
verification procedure performed by the data escrow agent, specification 2 =
of
the new gTLD AGB part A, 8, 1-4, basically require the data escrow agent ve=
rify
the signature and validate using the XML schema of the dnrd draft. The XML
schema of the dnrd draft is too generic and it does not include extensions.=
<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibr=
i" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">&nbsp;</font></o:p></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 14px;">Step 5 of
the verification procedure mentioned in the AGB (specification 2 of the new
gTLD AGB, part A, 5) is there to define extra tests that must be performed =
by
the escrow agent. We envisioned use step 5 to at least define that escrow
agents must validate the escrow deposit file using the customized XML schem=
a
for the new gTLD and the data escrow extensions. <o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibr=
i" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">&nbsp;</font></o:p></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 14px;">We want to
add more tests to this verification procedure (step 5) in order to reduce t=
he
risk mentioned above. These tests must be universally applicable regarding =
of
the business model of the registry operator. We believe that the expertise
present in this list could help to refine this extended verification proces=
s to
narrow the filter of what appears to be a consistent data escrow deposit.<o=
:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibr=
i" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">&nbsp;</font></o:p></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 14px;">The extended verification tests could be separated=
 in
two categories: applicable to all TLDs (e.g. ccTLDs) and applicable to the =
new
gTLD program.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibr=
i" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">&nbsp;</font></o:p></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 14px;">It is worth mentioned that the extended verificati=
on process
is not the only mechanism envisioned by ICANN to mitigate the risk of an
inconsistent escrow deposit file.<o:p></o:p></font></p>

<!--EndFragment--></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font=
-size: 14px;"><br></span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=
=3D"font-size: 14px;">Thank you.</span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-styl=
e-span" style=3D"font-size: 14px;"><br></span></div><div><span class=3D"App=
le-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">Regards,</span></div><div><span c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 14px;">Gustavo</span></div><d=
iv><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 14px;"><br></span><=
/div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div style=3D"font-family:Calibri; f=
ont-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:black; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BO=
RDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIG=
HT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-=
TOP: 3pt"><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span> &lt;Gould&gt;, Jam=
es &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:JGould@verisign.com">JGould@verisign.com</a>&gt;<b=
r><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span> Monday, December 17, 2012 =
10:57 AM<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span> Gustavo Lozano &lt=
;<a href=3D"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&g=
t;, "<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailt=
o:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Su=
bject: </span> Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposi=
t files<br></div><div style=3D"font-size: 22px; font-family: Calibri, sans-=
serif; "><br></div><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 22px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; border-left-color=
: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-left-width: 5px; border-left-style: solid; pad=
ding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 5px; =
margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 5px; "=
><div><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf=
-8"><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-=
line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-f=
amily: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div><div>Gustavo,</div><div><br></div><=
div>Has the concept of an "extended verification process" for the data escr=
ow agents been previously discussed or documented? &nbsp; It looks like som=
e of the data integrity checks (linked contacts and hosts) along with busin=
ess rules like whether or not there
 are glue records and the creation and last update dates in the future are =
better handled by an EBERO provider based on the deposits made. &nbsp;The D=
ata Escrow Provider should be able to validate the completeness of the depo=
sit by verifying the signatures and verify
 the deposit against the format definition. &nbsp;Items like email address =
validation should be covered by the XSD format definition. &nbsp;Applying d=
ifferential deposits to the full deposit also sounds like the job of the EB=
ERO provider and not the Data Escrow Provider.
 &nbsp; &nbsp;In summary, I believe that only #1 below should be required o=
f the Data Escrow Provider and the remainder should be discussed as a requi=
rement for an EBERO provider. &nbsp;</div><div><br></div><div><div>--&nbsp;=
</div><div><br></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" siz=
e=3D"3">JG<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibr=
i" size=3D"3">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=
=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><img width=3D"75" height=3D"66" src=3D"cid:2FE192F5=
-206E-41B1-B26D-69A4A5A73698" v:shapes=3D"Picture_x0020_1" type=3D"image/pn=
g"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=
=3D"3">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Cal=
ibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); ">James Gould</spa=
n><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=
=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">Principal Software Engineer=
</span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" =
size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(9, 0, 232); "><a href=3D"mailto:jgould=
@verisign.com">jgould@verisign.com</a></span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(=
70, 72, 76); ">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><f=
ont face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">70=
3-948-3271 (Office)</span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><fon=
t face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">1206=
1 Bluemont Way</span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font fac=
e=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">Reston, V=
A 20190</span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"c=
olor: rgb(13, 62, 137); "><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">VerisignInc.com=
</font></span><span style=3D"font-size: 16pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-se=
rif; "><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 1=
37); "><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><br></font></span></div><div><br><=
/div></div></div></div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><di=
v style=3D"font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:blac=
k; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0i=
n; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BO=
RDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt"><span style=3D"font-weight:bold"=
>From: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org=
">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date=
: </span>Thursday, December 13, 2012 7:28 PM<br><span style=3D"font-weight:=
bold">To: </span>"<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-we=
ight:bold">Subject: </span>[ire] Extended verification process of the escro=
w deposit files<br></div><div><br></div><div><meta name=3D"Title" content=
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<![endif]--><!--StartFragment--><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: =
windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Colleagues,=
<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: win=
dowtext; "><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</f=
ont></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext;=
 "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Specification 2, Part =
A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:<o:p></o:p></font></spa=
n></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p><p=
 class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple=
-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">" (5) If [1] includes a verification process,=
 that will be applied at this step."<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=
=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-=
style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"Defa=
ult"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" f=
ace=3D"Calibri">We are in the process of defining the extended verification=
 process that the data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow dep=
osit file. This process
 will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p>=
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span=
></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The purpose of this continuous verif=
ication process is to mitigate the risk of<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:yes">=
&nbsp;
</span>an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><b=
r></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"=
Calibri">In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the =
last full and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verifi=
cation process.</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-s=
pan" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"co=
lor: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">I am i=
nterested in your feedback regarding:<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=
=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style=
-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Other tests that you consider should be pr=
esent in the draft.<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span =
style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Cali=
bri">&nbsp;2. The proposed tests itself.</font></span></p><p class=3D"Defau=
lt"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p cla=
ss=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Proposed t=
ests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the final list o=
f tests with your input):<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Validate the escrow dep=
osit file using the schema defined for the TLD including extensions as defi=
ned in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new gTLD base agreement.<o:p></o=
:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D=
"Calibri">&nbsp;2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposi=
t files are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;3. All hosts linked to domain =
names in the escrow deposit files are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p clas=
s=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;4. Al=
l the required glue records are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"D=
efault"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;5. The IPv4=
 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in other words =
not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: RFC5735 and =
RFC6598.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-sty=
le-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records a=
re part of 2000::/3 with the exception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5=
156.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-s=
pan" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;7. The creation and last update date of objects=
 is not in the future.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font clas=
s=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;8. Email addresses are syntac=
tically valid.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Note: heuristics tests like the =
abrupt increase or decrease of domain names escrowed will be performed by I=
CANN using the data escrow report sent by the data escrow agents to ICANN.&=
nbsp;</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=
=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-=
size: 16px; ">Regards,</span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" st=
yle=3D"font-size: 16px;">Gustavo Lozano</span><br><p class=3D"Default" styl=
e=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p>=
</p><p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-si=
ze: 22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><!--EndFragment--></div></div></div></div>=
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Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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Hi *,

On Dec 17, 2012, at 10:57 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> =
wrote:
...
> The Data Escrow Provider should be able to validate the completeness =
of the deposit by verifying the signatures and verify the deposit =
against the format definition.  Items like email address validation =
should be covered by the XSD format definition.=20


As long as we use the XML, if the CSV is used, the validation will have =
to proceed by type-checking the values in each file.

>  Applying differential deposits to the full deposit also sounds like =
the job of the EBERO provider and not the Data Escrow Provider.   =20

I agree,

What I propose is to ICANN use its contracted EBEROs to validate and =
confirm that they can rebuild a registry with the information in the =
deposits. I would say at least two (selected at random).


> In summary, I believe that only #1 below should be required of the =
Data Escrow Provider and the remainder should be discussed as a =
requirement for an EBERO provider. =20

+1



Francisco Obispo=20
Director of Applications and Services - ISC
email: fobispo@isc.org
Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE


From JGould@verisign.com  Mon Dec 17 13:13:36 2012
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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Francisco Obispo <fobispo@isc.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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Francisco,

Just to clarify the comment on CSV and XML.  The CSV format is defined in
XML and via XSD(s), so a validator (custom) would be able to verify the
CSV field formats of the CSV files in a similar fashion as using an XML
parser to validate an individual XML file against the XSD(s).  The email
address field value would be validated against the XSD simple element type
in either event. =20
 =20
--=20

JG
=20

=20
James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com
=20
703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com







On 12/17/12 4:00 PM, "Francisco Obispo" <fobispo@isc.org> wrote:

>Hi *,
>
>On Dec 17, 2012, at 10:57 AM, "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com> wrote:
>...
>> The Data Escrow Provider should be able to validate the completeness of
>>the deposit by verifying the signatures and verify the deposit against
>>the format definition.  Items like email address validation should be
>>covered by the XSD format definition.
>
>
>As long as we use the XML, if the CSV is used, the validation will have
>to proceed by type-checking the values in each file.
>
>>  Applying differential deposits to the full deposit also sounds like
>>the job of the EBERO provider and not the Data Escrow Provider.
>
>I agree,
>
>What I propose is to ICANN use its contracted EBEROs to validate and
>confirm that they can rebuild a registry with the information in the
>deposits. I would say at least two (selected at random).
>
>
>> In summary, I believe that only #1 below should be required of the Data
>>Escrow Provider and the remainder should be discussed as a requirement
>>for an EBERO provider.
>
>+1
>
>
>
>Francisco Obispo=20
>Director of Applications and Services - ISC
>email: fobispo@isc.org
>Phone: +1 650 423 1374 || INOC-DBA *3557* NOC
>PGP KeyID =3D B38DB1BE
>


From gustavo.lozano@icann.org  Mon Dec 17 13:33:30 2012
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From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
To: James Mitchell <james.mitchell@ausregistry.com.au>
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2012 13:33:25 -0800
Thread-Topic: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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--_000_CCF4CF9E6C62gustavolozanoicannorg_
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James,

Comments below.

From: James Mitchell <james.mitchell@ausregistry.com.au<mailto:james.mitche=
ll@ausregistry.com.au>>
Date: Friday, December 14, 2012 6:45 AM
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.or=
g>>, "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>=
>
Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit file=
s

Comments below.

James

From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.=
org>>
Date: Friday, 14 December 2012 11:28 AM
To: "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>>
Subject: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files


Colleagues,



Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:



" (5) If [1] includes a verification process, that will be applied at this =
step."



We are in the process of defining the extended verification process that th=
e data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow deposit file. This =
process will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.



The purpose of this continuous verification process is to mitigate the risk=
 of  an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.


In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full=
 and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification pr=
ocess.


I am interested in your feedback regarding:

 1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.

 2. The proposed tests itself.

JM: My biggest gripe with this is that valid is subjective to the party tha=
t has to restore the registry. I say this because different registries have=
 different business rules, or have different interpretations of specificati=
ons etc. Verisign's comments on the provreg list about the crID field mirro=
rs exactly that. We (ARI) would expect the crID field to be a registrar id,=
 matching the same definition of client as used in the definition of clID (=
sponsoring client) and would consider invalid any deposit where the crID is=
 not a registrar. We store the creating user information separate however t=
his is not available through the EPP interface.

I am fairly concerned that introducing this validation seems a somewhat rou=
ndabout way at mandating business rules on the registry's provisioning syst=
ems. Consider four possible scenarios:

 *   The EBERO compares contact identifiers in a case insensitive manner (l=
ets assume that they store them uppercase), however they receive a deposit =
from a registry where contact identifiers "abc" and "ABC" match different R=
OIDs.
 *   The EBERO can store domain passwords up to 16 characters, however they=
 receive a deposit with a password that is 17 characters.
 *   The EBERO requires contact country codes are on the ISO 3166-2 list, h=
owever they receive a deposit with a contact having 'xx' or '12' as their c=
ountry.
 *   The EBERO uses a schema validating parser, however receives a deposit =
where the contact identifiers "abc def" and "abc  def" (two spaces) match d=
ifferent ROIDs.

I could go on for quite awhile but I hope by now you get my point. If you w=
ant to make sure that data is valid then I would much prefer the discussion=
 is about provisioning system requirements and it is made clear that every =
registry would have to implement these requirements (to the theme of consen=
sus policy or equivalent). As a side note, if you want to go so far as to s=
tate all these validations then I would expect to see these requirements so=
mewhere in the EBERO contract.


Proposed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the fi=
nal list of tests with your input):

 1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD i=
ncluding extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new g=
TLD base agreement.

JM: Fine. I am dubious to what value this provides other than syntactical v=
alidation of certain fields (date, phone etc). I could theoretically put "t=
he quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" as a domain name and apparently=
 you'd never think this invalid.

The main value is to validate using the schema and extensions specific for =
that TLD.

The schema validation won't tell us that the content is valid but we will k=
now that the format is correct, the escrow deposit file can be processed an=
d the syntax validations passed.



 2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pre=
sent.

JM: Agree. I see no reason for referenced contact objects to be missing.


 3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are presen=
t.

JM: Disagree. Hosts are required to be objects only for glue records. There=
 is no  reason for the host "ns1.example.com" to be an object in my registr=
y because 1) it cannot have addresses, 2) we do not allow change of host na=
me. A registrar could create the aforementioned host, however they will nev=
er be able to do anything with it.

Have you considered that registries may use host attributes instead of host=
 objects? Perhaps those yet unknown SRSU registries may use attributes for =
simplicity since they have to implement EPP even though there will be only =
one registrar...

This could be solved with levels of indirection, but if no support for this=
 test is gathered on the list it won't make it to the draft.



 4. All the required glue records are present.

JM: What is a required glue record? If a registrar omits glue address recor=
ds then the name may not resolve. This is indifferent to the registrar prov=
iding the wrong name servers, or failing to supply name servers for delegat=
ion when the child zone is "live". Registrars will fix the issue if it is a=
 problem. I disagree with validation of glue records.

This test was a cross match with the DNS zone provided by the registry oper=
ator, but if no support for this test is gathered on the list it won't make=
 it to the draft.



 5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in =
other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: =
RFC5735 and RFC6598.

 6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the ex=
ception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.

JM: I see no real problem with the above two. I am wary of having too many =
restrictions that will require changes if and when new allocations are made=
.


 7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.



JM: This test seems to provide no value, especially given that it should be=
 almost impossible for a registry to have data that would invalidate this t=
est. Testing that the creation date is not later than the last update date =
makes some sense as it may identify producers that have selected data into =
the wrong field/element.

Agree with your proposed test.



8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.

JM: Please define the syntax that registries will be held accountable to fo=
r validation of email addresses. Note that I do not see anywhere that the r=
egistry must validate email addresses (we do not send emails to registrants=
). Actually, if email data is incorrect then ICANN should be looking at the=
 registrars who provided "invalid" data to the registry.

The idea of this test is to verify that the syntax is correct and not the c=
ontent.



Note: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names=
 escrowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by t=
he data escrow agents to ICANN.

JM: fine as long as your heuristics are not considered immediate validation=
 failures.

Yes, we will contact the registry operator in order to verify if this was a=
n expected behaviour.



Gustavo Lozano





--_000_CCF4CF9E6C62gustavolozanoicannorg_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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tor" content=3D"Microsoft Word 14"><meta name=3D"Originator" content=3D"Mic=
rosoft Word 14"><link rel=3D"File-List" href=3D"file://localhost/Users/gust=
avolozano/Library/Caches/TemporaryItems/msoclip/0/clip_filelist.xml"><title=
>_</title><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
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</xml><![endif]--><link rel=3D"themeData" href=3D"file://localhost/Users/gu=
stavolozano/Library/Caches/TemporaryItems/msoclip/0/clip_themedata.xml"><!-=
-[if gte mso 9]><xml>
 <w:WordDocument>
  <w:View>Normal</w:View>
  <w:Zoom>0</w:Zoom>
  <w:TrackMoves/>
  <w:TrackFormatting/>
  <w:PunctuationKerning/>
  <w:ValidateAgainstSchemas/>
  <w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>false</w:SaveIfXMLInvalid>
  <w:IgnoreMixedContent>false</w:IgnoreMixedContent>
  <w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>false</w:AlwaysShowPlaceholderText>
  <w:DoNotPromoteQF/>
  <w:LidThemeOther>EN-US</w:LidThemeOther>
  <w:LidThemeAsian>JA</w:LidThemeAsian>
  <w:LidThemeComplexScript>X-NONE</w:LidThemeComplexScript>
  <w:Compatibility>
   <w:BreakWrappedTables/>
   <w:SnapToGridInCell/>
   <w:WrapTextWithPunct/>
   <w:UseAsianBreakRules/>
   <w:DontGrowAutofit/>
   <w:SplitPgBreakAndParaMark/>
   <w:EnableOpenTypeKerning/>
   <w:DontFlipMirrorIndents/>
   <w:OverrideTableStyleHps/>
   <w:UseFELayout/>
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  <m:mathPr>
   <m:mathFont m:val=3D"Cambria Math"/>
   <m:brkBin m:val=3D"before"/>
   <m:brkBinSub m:val=3D"&#45;-"/>
   <m:smallFrac m:val=3D"off"/>
   <m:dispDef/>
   <m:lMargin m:val=3D"0"/>
   <m:rMargin m:val=3D"0"/>
   <m:defJc m:val=3D"centerGroup"/>
   <m:wrapIndent m:val=3D"1440"/>
   <m:intLim m:val=3D"subSup"/>
   <m:naryLim m:val=3D"undOvr"/>
  </m:mathPr></w:WordDocument>
</xml><![endif]--><!--[if gte mso 9]><xml>
 <w:LatentStyles DefLockedState=3D"false" DefUnhideWhenUsed=3D"true"
  DefSemiHidden=3D"true" DefQFormat=3D"false" DefPriority=3D"99"
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  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"0" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"Normal"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"heading 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"=
heading 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"=
heading 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"=
heading 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"=
heading 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"=
heading 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"=
heading 7"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"=
heading 8"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"9" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"=
heading 9"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 7"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 8"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"toc 9"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"0" Name=3D"footnote text"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"35" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D=
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  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"0" Name=3D"footnote referenc=
e"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"10" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"Title"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"1" Name=3D"Default Paragraph=
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  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"11" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"Subtitle"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"22" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"Strong"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"20" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"Emphasis"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"59" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Table Grid"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Placeho=
lder Text"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"1" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"No Spacing"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Shading"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light List"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Grid"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Dark List"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Shading"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful List"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Grid"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Shading Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light List Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Revisio=
n"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"34" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"List Paragraph"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"29" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"Quote"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"30" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"Intense Quote"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Shading Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful List Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Accent 1"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Shading Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light List Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Shading Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful List Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Accent 2"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Shading Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light List Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Shading Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful List Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Accent 3"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Shading Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light List Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Shading Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful List Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Accent 4"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Shading Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light List Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Shading Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful List Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Accent 5"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Shading Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light List Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" SemiHidden=3D"false"
   UnhideWhenUsed=3D"false" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Accent 6"/>
  <w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" SemiHidden=3D"false"
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<![endif]--></head><body style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); word-wrap: break-wor=
d; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; font-si=
ze: 22px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div style=3D"font-family: Ca=
libri, sans-serif; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 1=
6px;">James,&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-ser=
if; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></spa=
n></div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span class=3D"Ap=
ple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Comments below.</span></div><div=
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pan id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"font-size: 22px; font-family: Cali=
bri, sans-serif; "><div style=3D"font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-=
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ne; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP:=
 #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt"><span styl=
e=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span>James Mitchell &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ja=
mes.mitchell@ausregistry.com.au">james.mitchell@ausregistry.com.au</a>&gt;<=
br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span>Friday, December 14, 2012 =
6:45 AM<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<=
a href=3D"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;=
, "<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:=
ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Subj=
ect: </span>Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit f=
iles<br></div><div><br></div><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOC=
KQUOTE" style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #b5c4df 5 solid; PADDING:0 0 0 5; MARGIN:0 0 =
0 5;"><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -=
webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px;=
 font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div>Comments below.</div><div><br></d=
iv><div>James</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div st=
yle=3D"font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:black; B=
ORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; P=
ADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER=
-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt"><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Fro=
m: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gu=
stavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </=
span>Friday, 14 December 2012 11:28 AM<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">=
To: </span>"<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight=
:bold">Subject: </span>[ire] Extended verification process of the escrow de=
posit files<br></div><div><br></div><div><meta name=3D"Title" content=3D"_"=
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<![endif]--><!--StartFragment--><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: =
windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Colleagues,=
<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: win=
dowtext; "><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</f=
ont></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext;=
 "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Specification 2, Part =
A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:<o:p></o:p></font></spa=
n></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p><p=
 class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple=
-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">" (5) If [1] includes a verification process,=
 that will be applied at this step."<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=
=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-=
style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"Defa=
ult"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" f=
ace=3D"Calibri">We are in the process of defining the extended verification=
 process that the data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow dep=
osit file. This process
 will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p>=
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span=
></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The purpose of this continuous verif=
ication process is to mitigate the risk of<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:yes">=
&nbsp;
</span>an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><b=
r></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"=
Calibri">In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the =
last full and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verifi=
cation process.</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-s=
pan" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"co=
lor: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">I am i=
nterested in your feedback regarding:<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=
=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style=
-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Other tests that you consider should be pr=
esent in the draft.<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span =
style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Cali=
bri">&nbsp;2. The proposed tests itself.</font></span></p></div></div></div=
></div></span><div><br></div><div>JM:&nbsp;My biggest gripe with this is th=
at <i>valid</i> is subjective to the party that has to restore the registry=
. I say this because different registries have different business rules, or=
 have different interpretations of specifications etc. Verisign's
 comments on the provreg list about the crID field mirrors exactly that. We=
 (ARI) would expect the crID field to be a registrar id, matching the same =
definition of client as used in the definition of clID (sponsoring client) =
and would consider invalid any deposit
 where the crID is not a registrar. We store the <i>creating user</i> infor=
mation separate however this is not available through the EPP interface.</d=
iv><div><br></div><div>I am fairly concerned that introducing this validati=
on seems a somewhat roundabout way at mandating business rules on the regis=
try's provisioning systems. Consider four possible scenarios:</div><ul><li>=
The EBERO compares contact identifiers in a case insensitive manner (lets a=
ssume that they store them uppercase), however they receive a deposit from =
a registry where contact identifiers "abc" and "ABC" match different ROIDs.=
</li><li>The EBERO can store domain passwords up to 16 characters, however =
they receive a deposit with a password that is 17 characters.</li><li>The E=
BERO requires contact country codes are on the ISO 3166-2 list, however the=
y receive a deposit with a contact having 'xx' or '12' as their country.</l=
i><li>The EBERO uses a schema validating parser, however receives a deposit=
 where the contact identifiers&nbsp;"abc def" and "abc &nbsp;def"&nbsp;(two=
 spaces) match different ROIDs.</li></ul><div>I could go on for quite awhil=
e but I hope by now you get my point. If you want to make sure that data is=
 valid then I would much prefer the discussion is about provisioning system=
 requirements and it is made clear that every registry would have to implem=
ent
 these requirements (to the theme of consensus policy or equivalent).&nbsp;=
As a side note, if you want to go so far as to state all these validations =
then I would expect to see these requirements somewhere in the EBERO contra=
ct.</div><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><div><div style=
=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: af=
ter-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><fon=
t class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Proposed tests (this is not a=
 final list of tests, we want to create the final list of tests with your i=
nput):<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style=
-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the=
 schema defined for the TLD including extensions as defined in Specificatio=
n 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new gTLD base agreement.</font></p></div></div></di=
v></div></span><div><br></div><div>JM: Fine. I am dubious to what value thi=
s provides other than syntactical validation of certain fields (date, phone=
 etc). I could theoretically put "the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy d=
og" as a domain name and apparently you'd never think this invalid.</div></=
div></div></blockquote></span><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=
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<![endif]--><!--StartFragment--><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple=
-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The main value is to validate using the schem=
a and extensions specific for that TLD.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><=
p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The=
 schema validation won't tell us that the content is valid but we will know=
 that the format is correct, the escrow deposit file can be processed and t=
he syntax validations passed.</font></p><!--EndFragment--></div><div><span =
class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><spa=
n id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLO=
CKQUOTE" style=3D"border-left-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-left-width:=
 5px; border-left-style: solid; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; paddi=
ng-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; marg=
in-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 5px; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-wor=
d; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: =
rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"f=
ont-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div style=3D"word=
-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-whit=
e-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"De=
fault"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;2. All conta=
cts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are present.</font><=
/p></div></div></div></div></span><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-=
serif; font-size: 14px; "><br></div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, san=
s-serif; font-size: 14px; ">JM: Agree. I see no reason for referenced conta=
ct objects to be missing.</div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-ser=
if; font-size: 14px; "><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D=
"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div style=3D"wo=
rd-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-wh=
ite-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font clas=
s=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"D=
efault"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;3. All host=
s linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are present.</font></p=
></div></div></div></div></span><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-se=
rif; font-size: 14px; "><br></div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-=
serif; font-size: 14px; ">JM: Disagree. Hosts are required to be objects on=
ly for glue records. There is no &nbsp;reason for the host "ns1.example.com=
" to be an object in my registry because 1) it cannot have addresses, 2)
 we do not allow change of host name. A registrar could create the aforemen=
tioned host, however they will never be able to do anything with it.</div><=
div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; "><br></div=
><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; ">Have yo=
u considered that&nbsp;registries may&nbsp;use host attributes instead of h=
ost objects? Perhaps those yet unknown SRSU registries may use attributes f=
or simplicity since they&nbsp;<i>have to</i>&nbsp;implement
 EPP even though there will be only one registrar...</div></div></div></blo=
ckquote></span><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span clas=
s=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><div sty=
le=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" =
style=3D"font-size: 16px;">This could be solved with levels of indirection,=
 but if no support for this test is gathered on the list it won't make it t=
o the draft.</span></div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">=
<span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></di=
v><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-ser=
if; "><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style=3D"border=
-left-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-left-width: 5px; border-left-style:=
 solid; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-=
left: 5px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-l=
eft: 5px; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: sp=
ace; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-famil=
y: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" =
style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webk=
it-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0=
, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" fac=
e=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;4. All the required glue records are =
present.</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><div style=3D"font-size: =
14px; "><br></div><div style=3D"font-size: 14px; ">JM: What is a <i>require=
d</i> glue record? If a registrar omits glue address records then the name =
may not resolve. This is indifferent to the registrar providing the wrong n=
ame servers, or failing to supply name servers for delegation
 when the child zone is "live". Registrars will fix the issue if it is a pr=
oblem. I disagree with validation of glue records.</div></div></div></block=
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<![endif]--><!--StartFragment--><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"f=
ont-size: 16px;">This
 test was a cross match with the DNS zone provided by the registry operator=
,&nbsp;but if no support for this test is gathered on the list it won't mak=
e it to the draft.</span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=
=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><b=
lockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style=3D"border-left-co=
lor: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-left-width: 5px; border-left-style: solid; =
padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 5p=
x; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 5px=
; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -we=
bkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div style=3D"fo=
nt-size: 14px; "><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"font-=
size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div style=3D"word-wra=
p: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-sp=
ace; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"A=
pple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default=
"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;5. The IPv4 addre=
sses of the glue records are valid global address, or in other words not pr=
esent in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: RFC5735 and RFC659=
8.</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTIO=
N" style=3D"font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div =
style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-brea=
k: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"=
><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p=
 class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;=
6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the exc=
eption of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.</font></p></div></div></div=
></div></span><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14=
px; "><br></div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: =
14px; ">JM: I see no real problem with the above two. I am wary of having t=
oo many restrictions that will require changes if and when new allocations =
are made.</div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 1=
4px; "><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"font-size: 14px=
; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-w=
ord; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color=
: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style=
-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;7. The creation and last up=
date date of objects is not in the future.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D=
"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></=
p></div></div></div></div></span><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-s=
erif; font-size: 14px; ">JM: This test seems to provide no value, especiall=
y given that it should be almost impossible for a registry to have data tha=
t would invalidate this test. Testing that the creation date is not
 later than the last update date makes some sense as it may identify produc=
ers that have selected data into the wrong field/element.</div></div></div>=
</blockquote></span><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-siz=
e: 16px;"><br></span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"f=
ont-size: 16px;">Agree with your proposed test.</span></div><div><span clas=
s=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><span id=
=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQU=
OTE" style=3D"border-left-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-left-width: 5px=
; border-left-style: solid; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-b=
ottom: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-b=
ottom: 0px; margin-left: 5px; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -=
webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(=
0, 0, 0); "><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14px=
; "><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"font-size: 14px; f=
ont-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word=
; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: r=
gb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-sp=
an" face=3D"Calibri">8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.</font></p>=
</div></div></div></div></span><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-ser=
if; font-size: 14px; "><br></div><div style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-s=
erif; font-size: 14px; ">JM: Please define the syntax that registries will =
be held accountable to for validation of email addresses.&nbsp;Note that I =
do not see anywhere that the registry must validate email addresses (we
 do not send emails to registrants). Actually, if email data is incorrect t=
hen ICANN should be looking at the registrars who provided "invalid" data t=
o the registry.</div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"font-size: =
14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: bre=
ak-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; c=
olor: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-s=
tyle-span" face=3D"Calibri"><o:p></o:p></font></p></div></div></div></div><=
/span></div></div></blockquote></span><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span"=
 style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-styl=
e-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">The idea of this test is to verify that =
the syntax is correct and not the content.&nbsp;</span></div><div><span cla=
ss=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><span i=
d=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQ=
UOTE" style=3D"border-left-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-left-width: 5p=
x; border-left-style: solid; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-=
bottom: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-=
bottom: 0px; margin-left: 5px; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb=
(0, 0, 0); "><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"font-family: Calibr=
i, sans-serif; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mod=
e: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><di=
v><div><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibr=
i"><br></font></p><p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><font cl=
ass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Note: heuristics tests like the a=
brupt increase or decrease of domain names escrowed will be performed by IC=
ANN using the data escrow report sent by the data escrow agents
 to ICANN.&nbsp;</font></p></div></div></div></div></span><div style=3D"fon=
t-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; "><br></div><div style=3D"f=
ont-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; ">JM: fine as long as you=
r heuristics are not considered immediate validation failures.</div></div><=
/div></blockquote></span><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"fon=
t-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=
=3D"font-size: 16px;">Yes, we will contact the registry operator in order t=
o verify if this was an expected behaviour.</span></div><div><span class=3D=
"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><span id=3D"=
OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION"><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE"=
 style=3D"border-left-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-left-width: 5px; bo=
rder-left-style: solid; padding-top: 0px; padding-right: 0px; padding-botto=
m: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-botto=
m: 0px; margin-left: 5px; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webk=
it-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0=
, 0); "><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sa=
ns-serif; "><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: sp=
ace; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><di=
v><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><b=
r></font></p></div><div style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><span class=3D"Apple-st=
yle-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Gustavo Lozano</span><br><p class=3D"D=
efault" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 22px; "><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-se=
rif; font-size: 22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><!--EndFragment--></div></div>=
</div></div></span></div></div></blockquote></span></body></html>

--_000_CCF4CF9E6C62gustavolozanoicannorg_--

From gustavo.lozano@icann.org  Mon Dec 17 13:39:37 2012
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From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
To: Christopher Browne <cbbrowne@afilias.info>
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2012 13:39:30 -0800
Thread-Topic: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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Christopher,

Comments below.

On 12/14/12 8:07 AM, "Christopher Browne" <cbbrowne@afilias.info> wrote:

>On Thu, Dec 13, 2012 at 7:28 PM, Gustavo Lozano
><gustavo.lozano@icann.org> wrote:
>> In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last
>>full
>> and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification
>> process.
>>
>>
>> I am interested in your feedback regarding:
>>
>>  1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.
>
>In keeping with James Mitchell's comments about "the quick brown fox
>jumps over the lazy dog", which could be set as a domain name, which
>may be "structurally valid," but structurally nonsense, I would
>suggest that mere comparison of escrow deposits is nowhere near
>sufficient.
>
>We could have a near-infinite number of policies, for each bit of the
>escrow format, and someone with a Markov Chain generator could make up
>a conforming escrow file out of random, but still policy-conforming,
>junk.  Verifying that it's not just junk requires looking to other
>sources such as WHOIS or DNS.

GL. The objective of this extended verification procedure is to verify
that the escrow deposit file appears to be consistent.

>
>I daresay I have seen all the cases he mentions as problems, and more.
> Most typical and painful to resolve is to receive phone numbers not
>complying with the ITU E164 standard. My "favourite" was receiving
>contact <contact:id> values that did not conform to RFC 5733, so that
>I had to remap them to new values in multiple places before
>proceeding.
>
>A more legitimate test would be more "end-to-end"; it would compare
>escrow with other notionally authoritative sources.
>
>The approach that comes to mind is to select data from 4 sources and
>make sure that they match:
>
>The data sources:
>
>1.  Escrow is the one that is obviously at hand;
>
>2.  Zone files tend to be not difficult to obtain, and they indicate
>the state of the resolving portions of the 'portfolio' of domains in a
>registry;
>
>3.  WHOIS reports information on the state of the registry, albeit on
>a one-by-one per-request basis;
>
>4.  Submitting DNS requests to the authoritative DNS resolver for the
>registry returns authoritative information on resolution information
>for active domains.
>
>#1 and #2 (perhaps just #1) are available "en masse", for the entire
>registry.
>
>A test that escrow matches against the registry would be to pick a
>sample of domain names from sources 1 (escrow) and 2 (zone file), and
>agree them against WHOIS (#3) and the DNS resolver (#4).
>
>It would not be reasonable to try to do this with all names in the
>registry; a reasonably small statistically random sample should, if
>collected regularly, provide confidence that samples taken from escrow
>match against the "real data" in the registry.  Using stratification
>would be appropriate to make sure that different sorts of cases get
>examined (or perhaps avoided - it's desirable not to have many "false
>mismatches" as would happen when objects legitimately change between
>the time escrow is dumped and when validation tests are done.)

GL. As you mentioned this steps are appropriate for an audit procedure. I
will send your suggestions to the persons involved in the audit process
for new gTLD.


>Over time, a validation involving doing a domain data reconciliation
>of even as small a sample as a few dozen names per day should provide
>useful assurance that the sources are not vastly out of sync,
>particularly if discrepancies get escalated into larger targeted
>samples.  Note that this is the standard sort of thing you'll find in
>literature on auditing procedures.


From gustavo.lozano@icann.org  Mon Dec 17 14:02:07 2012
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From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>
To: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Date: Mon, 17 Dec 2012 14:02:03 -0800
Thread-Topic: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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James,

Comments below.

From: <Gould>, James <JGould@verisign.com<mailto:JGould@verisign.com>>
Date: Monday, December 17, 2012 10:57 AM
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.or=
g>>, "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>=
>
Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit file=
s

Gustavo,

Has the concept of an "extended verification process" for the data escrow a=
gents been previously discussed or documented?   It looks like some of the =
data integrity checks (linked contacts and hosts) along with business rules=
 like whether or not there are glue records and the creation and last updat=
e dates in the future are better handled by an EBERO provider based on the =
deposits made.  The Data Escrow Provider should be able to validate the com=
pleteness of the deposit by verifying the signatures and verify the deposit=
 against the format definition.

GL. The problem perceived with this approach is that the format definition =
on the draft is too generic. An extension mechanism is being incorporated i=
n the new version of the draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping draft and=
 we require that data escrow agents validate the data related to extensions=
. I understand that you define some extensions guidelines in the draft-goul=
d-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping draft as well.

 Items like email address validation should be covered by the XSD format de=
finition.  Applying differential deposits to the full deposit also sounds l=
ike the job of the EBERO provider and not the Data Escrow Provider.    In s=
ummary, I believe that only #1 below should be required of the Data Escrow =
Provider and the remainder should be discussed as a requirement for an EBER=
O provider.

GL. Requiring the EBEROs perform verification of the escrow deposit files f=
requently is an unlikely scenario. The data escrow agent is the party other=
 than the registry with frequent (daily) access to escrow files, therefore =
the data escrow agent is in best position to perform a verification procedu=
re. Depending on the day of the week, the full deposit and differentials ar=
e require to have a snapshot of the SRS database at that point in time, and=
 it is expected that the extended verification procedure will require acces=
s to a snapshot of the SRS database.


--

JG

[cid:2FE192F5-206E-41B1-B26D-69A4A5A73698]

James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com<mailto:jgould@verisign.com>

703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com



From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.=
org>>
Date: Thursday, December 13, 2012 7:28 PM
To: "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>>
Subject: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files


Colleagues,



Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:



" (5) If [1] includes a verification process, that will be applied at this =
step."



We are in the process of defining the extended verification process that th=
e data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow deposit file. This =
process will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.



The purpose of this continuous verification process is to mitigate the risk=
 of  an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.


In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full=
 and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification pr=
ocess.


I am interested in your feedback regarding:

 1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.

 2. The proposed tests itself.


Proposed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the fi=
nal list of tests with your input):

 1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD i=
ncluding extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new g=
TLD base agreement.

 2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pre=
sent.

 3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are presen=
t.

 4. All the required glue records are present.

 5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in =
other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: =
RFC5735 and RFC6598.

 6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the ex=
ception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.

 7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.

 8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.


Note: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names=
 escrowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by t=
he data escrow agents to ICANN.







--_000_CCF4D1356C74gustavolozanoicannorg_
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<html><head></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode:=
 space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div style=3D"color: rgb(0=
, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-spa=
n" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">James,</span></div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0=
, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-spa=
n" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></span></div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, =
0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span"=
 style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Comments below.</span></div><div style=3D"color=
: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 22px; "><br></=
div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-si=
ze: 22px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div style=3D"font-family:Cal=
ibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:black; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium n=
one; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADD=
ING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; P=
ADDING-TOP: 3pt"><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span> &lt;Gould&g=
t;, James &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:JGould@verisign.com">JGould@verisign.com</a=
>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span> Monday, December 17=
, 2012 10:57 AM<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span> Gustavo Loz=
ano &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.or=
g</a>&gt;, "<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight=
:bold">Subject: </span> Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escr=
ow deposit files<br></div><div><br></div><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTR=
IBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #b5c4df 5 solid; PADDING:0 0 0 5;=
 MARGIN:0 0 0 5;"><div><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/ht=
ml; charset=3Dutf-8"><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode=
: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-s=
ize: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div><div>Gustavo,</div=
><div><br></div><div>Has the concept of an "extended verification process" =
for the data escrow agents been previously discussed or documented? &nbsp; =
It looks like some of the data integrity checks (linked contacts and hosts)=
 along with business rules like whether or not there
 are glue records and the creation and last update dates in the future are =
better handled by an EBERO provider based on the deposits made. &nbsp;The D=
ata Escrow Provider should be able to validate the completeness of the depo=
sit by verifying the signatures and verify
 the deposit against the format definition. </div></div></div></div></div><=
/blockquote></span><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri,=
 sans-serif; "><br></div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Ca=
libri, sans-serif; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 1=
6px;"><div>GL. The problem perceived with this approach is that the format =
definition on the draft is too generic. An extension mechanism is being inc=
orporated in the new version of the draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mappin=
g draft and we require that data escrow agents validate the data related to=
 extensions. I understand that you define some extensions guidelines in the=
 draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping draft as well.</div><div><br></di=
v></span></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, =
0); font-size: 22px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><blockquote id=3D"=
MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #b5c4df 5 solid; =
PADDING:0 0 0 5; MARGIN:0 0 0 5;"><div><div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word;=
 -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; color: rg=
b(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div>=
<div>&nbsp;Items like email address validation should be covered by the XSD=
 format definition. &nbsp;Applying differential deposits to the full deposi=
t also sounds like the job of the EBERO provider and not the Data Escrow Pr=
ovider.
 &nbsp; &nbsp;In summary, I believe that only #1 below should be required o=
f the Data Escrow Provider and the remainder should be discussed as a requi=
rement for an EBERO provider. &nbsp;</div></div></div></div></div></blockqu=
ote></span><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-se=
rif; "><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br></sp=
an></div><div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0)=
; font-size: 16px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">GL.&nbsp;</span><fon=
t class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri,sans-serif"><span class=3D"App=
le-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Requiring the EBEROs perform veri=
fication of the escrow deposit files frequently is an unlikely scenario. Th=
e data escrow agent is the party other than the registry with frequent (dai=
ly) access to escrow files, therefore the data escrow agent is in best posi=
tion to perform a verification procedure. Depending on the day of the week,=
 the full deposit and differentials are require to have a snapshot of the S=
RS database at that point in time, and it is expected that the extended ver=
ification procedure will require access to a snapshot of the SRS database.<=
/span></font></div><div><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri,sa=
ns-serif"><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br><=
/span></font></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"color: rgb(0,=
 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_A=
TTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style=3D"border-left-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); bord=
er-left-width: 5px; border-left-style: solid; padding-top: 0px; padding-rig=
ht: 0px; padding-bottom: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-top: 0px; margin-ri=
ght: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 5px; "><div><div style=3D"word-w=
rap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-=
space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><div><div><=
div><br></div><div style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><div>--&nbsp;</div><div><br>=
</div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">JG<o:p>=
</o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">&=
nbsp;<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" si=
ze=3D"3"><img width=3D"75" height=3D"66" src=3D"cid:2FE192F5-206E-41B1-B26D=
-69A4A5A73698" v:shapes=3D"Picture_x0020_1" type=3D"image/png"><o:p></o:p><=
/font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">&nbsp;<o=
:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3=
"><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); ">James Gould</span><o:p></o:p></=
font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span sty=
le=3D"color: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">Principal Software Engineer</span><o:p></o:=
p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span=
 style=3D"color: rgb(9, 0, 232); "><a href=3D"mailto:jgould@verisign.com">j=
gould@verisign.com</a></span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><=
font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">&=
nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Cali=
bri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">703-948-3271 (Offi=
ce)</span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibr=
i" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">12061 Bluemont Way</=
span><o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" si=
ze=3D"3"><span style=3D"color: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">Reston, VA 20190</span><o=
:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62=
, 137); "><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">VerisignInc.com</font></span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 16pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p></o:=
p></span></p></div><div><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); "><font fac=
e=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><br></font></span></div><div><br></div></div></div=
></div><div style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><br></div><span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_=
SECTION" style=3D"font-size: 14px; "><div style=3D"font-family:Calibri; fon=
t-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:black; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORD=
ER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT=
: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TO=
P: 3pt"><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<a=
 href=3D"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;<=
br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span>Thursday, December 13, 201=
2 7:28 PM<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span>"<a href=3D"mailto=
:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ie=
tf.org</a>&gt;<br><span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Subject: </span>[ire] Ex=
tended verification process of the escrow deposit files<br></div><div><br><=
/div><div><meta name=3D"Title" content=3D"_"><meta name=3D"Keywords" conten=
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<![endif]--><!--StartFragment--><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: =
windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Colleagues,=
<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: win=
dowtext; "><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</f=
ont></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext;=
 "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Specification 2, Part =
A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:<o:p></o:p></font></spa=
n></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p><p=
 class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple=
-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">" (5) If [1] includes a verification process,=
 that will be applied at this step."<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=
=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=3D"Apple-=
style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p><p class=3D"Defa=
ult"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" f=
ace=3D"Calibri">We are in the process of defining the extended verification=
 process that the data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow dep=
osit file. This process
 will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p>=
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span=
></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The purpose of this continuous verif=
ication process is to mitigate the risk of<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:yes">=
&nbsp;
</span>an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><b=
r></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"=
Calibri">In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the =
last full and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verifi=
cation process.</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-s=
pan" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"co=
lor: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">I am i=
nterested in your feedback regarding:<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=
=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style=
-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Other tests that you consider should be pr=
esent in the draft.<o:p></o:p></font></span></p><p class=3D"Default"><span =
style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Cali=
bri">&nbsp;2. The proposed tests itself.</font></span></p><p class=3D"Defau=
lt"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p cla=
ss=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Proposed t=
ests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the final list o=
f tests with your input):<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Validate the escrow dep=
osit file using the schema defined for the TLD including extensions as defi=
ned in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new gTLD base agreement.<o:p></o=
:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D=
"Calibri">&nbsp;2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposi=
t files are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;3. All hosts linked to domain =
names in the escrow deposit files are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p clas=
s=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;4. Al=
l the required glue records are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"D=
efault"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;5. The IPv4=
 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in other words =
not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: RFC5735 and =
RFC6598.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-sty=
le-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records a=
re part of 2000::/3 with the exception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5=
156.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-s=
pan" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;7. The creation and last update date of objects=
 is not in the future.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font clas=
s=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;8. Email addresses are syntac=
tically valid.<o:p></o:p></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font c=
lass=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Note: heuristics tests like the =
abrupt increase or decrease of domain names escrowed will be performed by I=
CANN using the data escrow report sent by the data escrow agents to ICANN.&=
nbsp;</font></p><p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=
=3D"Calibri"><br></font></p></div><div><br><p class=3D"Default" style=3D"fo=
nt-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p =
class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 22p=
x; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><!--EndFragment--></div></div></div></div></span>=
</div></div></blockquote></span></body></html>

--_000_CCF4D1356C74gustavolozanoicannorg_--

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--_004_CCF4D1356C74gustavolozanoicannorg_--

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From: "Gould, James" <JGould@verisign.com>
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org>, "ire@ietf.org" <ire@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files
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Gustavo,

My feedback is below.

--

JG

[cid:CD6ED76A-6C4B-40ED-8E7F-B9D6E7BE6635]

James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com

703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com



From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.=
org>>
Date: Monday, December 17, 2012 5:02 PM
To: James Gould <jgould@verisign.com<mailto:jgould@verisign.com>>, "ire@iet=
f.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>>
Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit file=
s

James,

Comments below.

From: <Gould>, James <JGould@verisign.com<mailto:JGould@verisign.com>>
Date: Monday, December 17, 2012 10:57 AM
To: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.or=
g>>, "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>=
>
Subject: Re: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit file=
s

Gustavo,

Has the concept of an "extended verification process" for the data escrow a=
gents been previously discussed or documented?   It looks like some of the =
data integrity checks (linked contacts and hosts) along with business rules=
 like whether or not there are glue records and the creation and last updat=
e dates in the future are better handled by an EBERO provider based on the =
deposits made.  The Data Escrow Provider should be able to validate the com=
pleteness of the deposit by verifying the signatures and verify the deposit=
 against the format definition.

GL. The problem perceived with this approach is that the format definition =
on the draft is too generic. An extension mechanism is being incorporated i=
n the new version of the draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping draft and=
 we require that data escrow agents validate the data related to extensions=
. I understand that you define some extensions guidelines in the draft-goul=
d-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping draft as well.

JG - I don't believe that the extensions changes anything related to the re=
sponsibility of the data escrow agent.  Both draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objec=
ts-mapping and draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping provide extensibili=
ty of attributes and objects by the registry defining their own extension X=
SD, which I'm assuming would need to be passed to the data escrow agent out=
-of-band or with each deposit.  The data escrow agent would be able to veri=
fy the completeness of the deposit by verifying the signatures and verifyin=
g the deposit (standard and extensions) against the format definition.


 Items like email address validation should be covered by the XSD format de=
finition.  Applying differential deposits to the full deposit also sounds l=
ike the job of the EBERO provider and not the Data Escrow Provider.    In s=
ummary, I believe that only #1 below should be required of the Data Escrow =
Provider and the remainder should be discussed as a requirement for an EBER=
O provider.

GL. Requiring the EBEROs perform verification of the escrow deposit files f=
requently is an unlikely scenario. The data escrow agent is the party other=
 than the registry with frequent (daily) access to escrow files, therefore =
the data escrow agent is in best position to perform a verification procedu=
re. Depending on the day of the week, the full deposit and differentials ar=
e require to have a snapshot of the SRS database at that point in time, and=
 it is expected that the extended verification procedure will require acces=
s to a snapshot of the SRS database.

JG =96 I am still not sure where the requirement for an extended verificati=
on procedure has been defined.  It sounds like you are adding new requireme=
nts for the data escrow providers that has contractual and policy impacts. =
 The data escrow providers simply take the data, do completeness and format=
 checks, archive the data, and make the data available based on contractual=
 conditions.  I have never heard of a deep data scrub that is being referre=
d to as "extended verification" for the data escrow provider.  This kind of=
 deep data scrub would be within the expertise of the EBERO provider to per=
form if they had access to the data.


--

JG

[cid:2FE192F5-206E-41B1-B26D-69A4A5A73698]

James Gould
Principal Software Engineer
jgould@verisign.com<mailto:jgould@verisign.com>

703-948-3271 (Office)
12061 Bluemont Way
Reston, VA 20190
VerisignInc.com



From: Gustavo Lozano <gustavo.lozano@icann.org<mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.=
org>>
Date: Thursday, December 13, 2012 7:28 PM
To: "ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>" <ire@ietf.org<mailto:ire@ietf.org>>
Subject: [ire] Extended verification process of the escrow deposit files


Colleagues,



Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD applicant guidebook specifies:



" (5) If [1] includes a verification process, that will be applied at this =
step."



We are in the process of defining the extended verification process that th=
e data escrow agents must perform daily with the escrow deposit file. This =
process will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.



The purpose of this continuous verification process is to mitigate the risk=
 of  an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.


In case of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full=
 and all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification pr=
ocess.


I am interested in your feedback regarding:

 1. Other tests that you consider should be present in the draft.

 2. The proposed tests itself.


Proposed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the fi=
nal list of tests with your input):

 1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD i=
ncluding extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new g=
TLD base agreement.

 2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pre=
sent.

 3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are presen=
t.

 4. All the required glue records are present.

 5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in =
other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in: =
RFC5735 and RFC6598.

 6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the ex=
ception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.

 7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.

 8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.


Note: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names=
 escrowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by t=
he data escrow agents to ICANN.







--_000_C41D7AF7FCECBE44940E9477E8E70D7A0D7465CFBRN1WNEXMBX02vc_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252"
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<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3DWindows-1=
252">
</head>
<body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-lin=
e-break: after-white-space; ">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-s=
ize: 14px; ">
<div>
<div>Gustavo,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>My feedback is below.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>--&nbsp;</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">JG<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p><=
/font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><img width=3D"75" =
height=3D"66" src=3D"cid:CD6ED76A-6C4B-40ED-8E7F-B9D6E7BE6635" v:shapes=3D"=
Picture_x0020_1" type=3D"image/png"><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p><=
/font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(13, 62, 137); ">James Gould</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">Principal Software Engineer</span><o:p></o:p></font>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(9, 0, 232); ">jgould@verisign.com</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(70, 72, 76); ">703-948-3271 (Office)</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">12061 Bluemont Way</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3"><span style=3D"col=
or: rgb(68, 70, 74); ">Reston, VA 20190</span><o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); "><font face=
=3D"Calibri" size=3D"3">VerisignInc.com</font></span><span style=3D"font-si=
ze: 16pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div><span style=3D"color: rgb(13, 62, 137); "><font face=3D"Calibri" size=
=3D"3"><br>
</font></span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-s=
ize: 14px; ">
<br>
</div>
<span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family=
: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; ">
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:b=
lack; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM:=
 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid;=
 BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span>Monday, December 17, 2012 5:0=
2 PM<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span>James Gould &lt;<a href=3D"mail=
to:jgould@verisign.com">jgould@verisign.com</a>&gt;, &quot;<a href=3D"mailt=
o:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">=
ire@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Subject: </span>Re: [ire] Extended verific=
ation process of the escrow deposit files<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line=
-break: after-white-space; ">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><spa=
n class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px; ">James,</span></div=
>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><spa=
n class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br>
</span></div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><spa=
n class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Comments below.</sp=
an></div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-s=
ize: 22px; ">
<br>
</div>
<span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: =
22px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<div style=3D"font-family:Calibri; font-size:11pt; text-align:left; color:b=
lack; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM:=
 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid;=
 BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span>&lt;Gould&gt;, James &lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:JGould@verisign.com">JGould@verisign.com</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span>Monday, December 17, 2012 10:=
57 AM<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;, &quot;<a =
href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:i=
re@ietf.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Subject: </span>Re: [ire] Extended verific=
ation process of the escrow deposit files<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style=3D"BORDER-LEFT:=
 #b5c4df 5 solid; PADDING:0 0 0 5; MARGIN:0 0 0 5;">
<div>
<div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line=
-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-famil=
y: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<div>
<div>
<div>Gustavo,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Has the concept of an &quot;extended verification process&quot; for th=
e data escrow agents been previously discussed or documented? &nbsp; It loo=
ks like some of the data integrity checks (linked contacts and hosts) along=
 with business rules like whether or not there
 are glue records and the creation and last update dates in the future are =
better handled by an EBERO provider based on the deposits made. &nbsp;The D=
ata Escrow Provider should be able to validate the completeness of the depo=
sit by verifying the signatures and verify
 the deposit against the format definition. </div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</span>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><br>
</div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><spa=
n class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">
<div>GL. The problem perceived with this approach is that the format defini=
tion on the draft is too generic. An extension mechanism is being incorpora=
ted in the new version of the draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping draf=
t and we require that data escrow
 agents validate the data related to extensions. I understand that you defi=
ne some extensions guidelines in the draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mappi=
ng draft as well.</div>
</span></div>
</div>
</div>
</span>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-s=
ize: 14px; ">
<br>
</div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><spa=
n style=3D"font-size: 16px;">JG - I don't believe that the extensions chang=
es anything related to the responsibility of the data escrow agent. &nbsp;B=
oth&nbsp;draft-arias-noguchi-dnrd-objects-mapping
 and&nbsp;draft-gould-thippeswamy-dnrd-csv-mapping provide extensibility of=
 attributes and objects by the registry defining their own extension XSD, w=
hich I'm assuming would need to be passed to the data escrow agent out-of-b=
and or with each deposit. &nbsp;The data escrow
 agent would be able to verify the completeness of the deposit by verifying=
 the signatures and verifying the deposit (standard and extensions) against=
 the format definition.
</span>&nbsp;</div>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-s=
ize: 14px; ">
<br>
</div>
<span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family=
: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: 14px; ">
<div>
<div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line=
-break: after-white-space; ">
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><spa=
n class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px; ">
<div><br>
</div>
</span></div>
<span id=3D"OLK_SRC_BODY_SECTION" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: =
22px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<blockquote id=3D"MAC_OUTLOOK_ATTRIBUTION_BLOCKQUOTE" style=3D"BORDER-LEFT:=
 #b5c4df 5 solid; PADDING:0 0 0 5; MARGIN:0 0 0 5;">
<div>
<div style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line=
-break: after-white-space; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 14px; font-famil=
y: Calibri, sans-serif; ">
<div>
<div>
<div>&nbsp;Items like email address validation should be covered by the XSD=
 format definition. &nbsp;Applying differential deposits to the full deposi=
t also sounds like the job of the EBERO provider and not the Data Escrow Pr=
ovider. &nbsp; &nbsp;In summary, I believe that only
 #1 below should be required of the Data Escrow Provider and the remainder =
should be discussed as a requirement for an EBERO provider. &nbsp;</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</span>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><spa=
n class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;"><br>
</span></div>
<div><span class=3D"Apple-style-span" style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-si=
ze: 16px; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; ">GL.&nbsp;</span><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri,sans-serif"><span class=3D"Apple-styl=
e-span" style=3D"font-size: 16px;">Requiring the EBEROs
 perform verification of the escrow deposit files frequently is an unlikely=
 scenario. The data escrow agent is the party other than the registry with =
frequent (daily) access to escrow files, therefore the data escrow agent is=
 in best position to perform a verification
 procedure. Depending on the day of the week, the full deposit and differen=
tials are require to have a snapshot of the SRS database at that point in t=
ime, and it is expected that the extended verification procedure will requi=
re access to a snapshot of the SRS
 database.</span></font></div>
</div>
</div>
</span>
<div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; "><br>
</div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri,sans-serif"><span style=3D"font-size: 16px;">JG&=
nbsp;=96&nbsp;I&nbsp;am still not sure where the requirement for an extende=
d verification&nbsp;procedure&nbsp;has been defined. &nbsp;It sounds like y=
ou are adding new requirements for the data escrow providers that has
 contractual and policy impacts. &nbsp;The data escrow providers simply tak=
e the data, do completeness and format checks, archive the data, and make t=
he data available based on contractual conditions. &nbsp;I&nbsp;have&nbsp;n=
ever heard of a deep data scrub that is being referred
 to as &quot;extended verification&quot; for the data escrow provider. &nbs=
p;This kind of deep data scrub would be within the&nbsp;expertise&nbsp;of t=
he EBERO provider to perform if they had access to the data. &nbsp; &nbsp;<=
/span></font></div>
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<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">From: </span>Gustavo Lozano &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:gustavo.lozano@icann.org">gustavo.lozano@icann.org</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Date: </span>Thursday, December 13, 2012 7=
:28 PM<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">To: </span>&quot;<a href=3D"mailto:ire@iet=
f.org">ire@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ire@ietf.org">ire@ietf.=
org</a>&gt;<br>
<span style=3D"font-weight:bold">Subject: </span>[ire] Extended verificatio=
n process of the escrow deposit files<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
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<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Colleagues,<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Specification 2, Part A, 8. of the new gTLD=
 applicant guidebook specifies:<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&quot; (5) If [1] includes a verification p=
rocess, that will be applied at this step.&quot;<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">We are in the process of defining the exten=
ded verification process that the data escrow agents must perform daily wit=
h the escrow deposit file. This process
 will be included in new versions of the data escrow draft.<o:p></o:p></fon=
t></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><o:p><font class=
=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;</font></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">The purpose of this continuous verification=
 process is to mitigate the risk of<span style=3D"mso-spacerun:yes">&nbsp;
</span>an inconsistent data escrow deposit file.<o:p></o:p></font></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">In c=
ase of differentials deposits, the escrow agent shall use the last full and=
 all the differentials deposits to perform the extended verification proces=
s.</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">I am interested in your feedback regarding:=
<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;1. Other tests that you consider shou=
ld be present in the draft.<o:p></o:p></font></span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><span style=3D"color: windowtext; "><font class=3D"App=
le-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbsp;2. The proposed tests itself.</font><=
/span></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Prop=
osed tests (this is not a final list of tests, we want to create the final =
list of tests with your input):<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;1. Validate the escrow deposit file using the schema defined for the TLD =
including extensions as defined in Specification 2, Part A, 3.2 of the new =
gTLD base agreement.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;2. All contacts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are pr=
esent.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;3. All hosts linked to domain names in the escrow deposit files are prese=
nt.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;4. All the required glue records are present.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;5. The IPv4 addresses of the glue records are valid global address, or in=
 other words not present in the special use IPv4 address blocks defined in:=
 RFC5735 and RFC6598.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;6. The IPv6 addresses of the glue records are part of 2000::/3 with the e=
xception of sub allocations mentioned in RFC5156.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;7. The creation and last update date of objects is not in the future.<o:p=
></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">&nbs=
p;8. Email addresses are syntactically valid.<o:p></o:p></font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri">Note=
: heuristics tests like the abrupt increase or decrease of domain names esc=
rowed will be performed by ICANN using the data escrow report sent by the d=
ata escrow agents to ICANN.&nbsp;</font></p>
<p class=3D"Default"><font class=3D"Apple-style-span" face=3D"Calibri"><br>
</font></p>
</div>
<div><br>
<p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: =
22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"Default" style=3D"font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; font-size: =
22px; "><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<!--EndFragment--></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</span></div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</span></div>
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