From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Tue Feb 3 00:28:44 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA08441 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:28:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ant6P-0004nE-Kt; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 00:28:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ant5Y-0004lR-JW for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 00:27:08 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id AAA08433 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 00:27:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ant5W-0005nW-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 00:27:06 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ant4e-0005jE-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 00:26:13 -0500 Received: from smtp1.procket.com ([65.174.124.36]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ant4L-0005eY-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 00:25:53 -0500 Received: from miata.procket.com (mil0-fw00-d-1.procket.com [65.174.124.60]) by smtp1.procket.com (8.12.8p1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id i137YLpL032544 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 23:34:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from EXCHANGE0-0.na.procket.com (exchange0b.na.procket.com [10.1.7.8]) by miata.procket.com (8.12.1/8.12.1) with ESMTP id i135PIYB005220 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:25:18 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.6375.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: Thread-Topic: To standardize or not? Thread-Index: AcPqFhuhwg6T6VmeSwCHwQFvtDFaAg== From: "Tony Li" To: X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2004 21:25:18 -0800 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Gents, I've been asked to again provoke a discussion about whether or not we should be putting our changes to IS-IS on the=20 standards track. Opinions? Thanks, Tony & Tony _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Tue Feb 3 01:06:38 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org ([132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA10074 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:06:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AnthC-0000CZ-H0; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 01:06:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AntgK-000090-Nd for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 01:05:08 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA10040 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 01:05:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AntgH-0002Jx-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 01:05:06 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AntfK-0002F8-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 01:04:06 -0500 Received: from prattle.redback.com ([155.53.12.9]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AnteX-0002AO-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 01:03:17 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by prattle.redback.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57A1D72284A; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:03:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from prattle.redback.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (prattle [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 05035-07; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:03:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from redback.com (malt.redback.com [155.53.12.41]) by prattle.redback.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 216CD722845; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:03:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from malt (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by redback.com (8.9.3-LCCHA/8.9.3/null redback solaris client) with ESMTP id WAA29519; Mon, 2 Feb 2004 22:03:11 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200402030603.WAA29519@redback.com> To: "Tony Li" Cc: isis-wg@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? In-reply-to: Mail from "Tony Li" dated Mon, 02 Feb 2004 21:25:18 PST From: Naiming Shen X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at redback.com X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2004 22:03:11 -0800 Tonys, I'm for putting IETF ISIS documents on standards track. This will simplify everyone's life. Providers will trust the features they deploy following the "standards"; ITU can reference them as nomative instead of copying IETF RFCs and making minor changes in order to avoid the copyright issues, which in turn was going to create inconsistency between IETF RFCs and ITU papers. Since most of the recent ISIS related work is done in IETF, we should take this chance and get this done once for all. thanks. ] ]Gents, ] ]I've been asked to again provoke a discussion about whether ]or not we should be putting our changes to IS-IS on the=20 ]standards track. Opinions? ] ]Thanks, ]Tony & Tony ] ]_______________________________________________ ]Isis-wg mailing list ]Isis-wg@ietf.org ]https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg - Naiming _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Tue Feb 3 07:35:43 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA06583 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:35:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Anzlf-0007yn-2j; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 07:35:03 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Anzl1-0007qF-N3 for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 07:34:23 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id HAA06535 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 07:34:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Anzl0-0003DY-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 07:34:23 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Anzk9-000386-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 07:33:30 -0500 Received: from cat.tcb.net ([64.78.150.134] helo=dog.tcb.net) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Anzjt-00032a-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 07:33:13 -0500 Received: from [10.0.11.18] (bedford.lex.arbor.net [204.118.128.2]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by dog.tcb.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFE689425F for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 05:33:12 -0700 (MST) Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) In-Reply-To: <200402030603.WAA29519@redback.com> References: <200402030603.WAA29519@redback.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <208C470F-5645-11D8-BE8D-000393D54EA6@tcb.net> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Danny McPherson Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? To: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 05:33:10 -0700 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Feb 2, 2004, at 11:03 PM, Naiming Shen wrote: > > Tonys, > > I'm for putting IETF ISIS documents on standards track. This will > simplify everyone's life. Providers will trust the features they > deploy following the "standards"; ITU can reference them as nomative > instead of copying IETF RFCs and making minor changes in order > to avoid the copyright issues, which in turn was going to create > inconsistency between IETF RFCs and ITU papers. > > Since most of the recent ISIS related work is done in IETF, we should > take this chance and get this done once for all. I have to agree. It'll likely be a pain getting there but once we do it'll be well worth it. -danny _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Tue Feb 3 08:37:40 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA08271 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:37:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ao0jd-0004IJ-Vv; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:37:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ao0j3-0004HM-KD for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:36:25 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA08265 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 08:36:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ao0j2-0001R7-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:36:24 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ao0i5-0001MT-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:35:25 -0500 Received: from weird-brew.cisco.com ([144.254.15.118] helo=strange-brew.cisco.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ao0hu-0001Ge-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 08:35:14 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.3] (ams-clip-vpn-dhcp4278.cisco.com [10.61.80.181]) by strange-brew.cisco.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id i13DYJ723457; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:34:19 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <208C470F-5645-11D8-BE8D-000393D54EA6@tcb.net> References: <200402030603.WAA29519@redback.com> <208C470F-5645-11D8-BE8D-000393D54EA6@tcb.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: stefano previdi Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? To: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 14:35:09 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Feb 3, 2004, at 1:33 PM, Danny McPherson wrote: > > On Feb 2, 2004, at 11:03 PM, Naiming Shen wrote: > >> >> Tonys, >> >> I'm for putting IETF ISIS documents on standards track. This will >> simplify everyone's life. I rarely noticed a simplification of my life due to standardization processes... >> Providers will trust the features they >> deploy following the "standards"; I believe providers trust implementations and proven interoperability more than theoretical standard documents. This interoperability and functionality can be described in any document (standard or not) as long as it is agreed by the community of companies supposed to implement them. ... but I may be wrong of course... s. >> ITU can reference them as nomative >> instead of copying IETF RFCs and making minor changes in order >> to avoid the copyright issues, which in turn was going to create >> inconsistency between IETF RFCs and ITU papers. >> >> Since most of the recent ISIS related work is done in IETF, we should >> take this chance and get this done once for all. > > I have to agree. It'll likely be a pain getting there but once > we do it'll be well worth it. > > -danny > > > _______________________________________________ > Isis-wg mailing list > Isis-wg@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg > _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Tue Feb 3 10:22:40 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA13578 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:22:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ao2ND-0008DS-UC; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 10:21:59 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Ao2Mg-0008Bi-FG for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 10:21:26 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA13467 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:21:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ao2Me-0004fy-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 10:21:24 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Ao2Lf-0004Y5-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 10:20:24 -0500 Received: from [64.115.125.242] (helo=bridge.axiowave.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Ao2Kg-0004Mf-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 10:19:22 -0500 Message-ID: From: Jeff Parker To: isis-wg@ietf.org Subject: RE: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=AWL autolearn=no version=2.60 Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2004 10:18:47 -0500 > I believe providers trust implementations and proven > interoperability more than theoretical standard > documents. > > This interoperability and functionality can be > described in any document (standard or not) as long > as it is agreed by the community of companies > supposed to implement them. Just one data-point on this. We have providers running conformance tests from vendors that test out-of-date aspects. There are various 'failures' that we need to explain or implement around to get past these gatekeepers. I have tried going directly to the vendor of the conformance suite, but they cite the appropriate 'standard'. I don't have much luck citing the interoperability document to either party at present: it may have more mojo if it becomes an approved standard. It is difficult for a provider to figure out the status of any particular document, as there are so many, and they don't always agree. I think that status as a standard provides a bit more weight. Of course, others may have more luck with the document in it's current state than I do, as it could provide evidence of a second person with the same point of view. - jeff parker _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Tue Feb 3 23:34:41 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA22027 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 23:34:41 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoEjh-0002AV-DV; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:34:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoEjZ-0002A5-Ic for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:33:53 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA22019 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 23:33:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoEjX-0006Uv-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:33:51 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AoEib-0006QB-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:32:54 -0500 Received: from smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net ([207.172.4.60]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoEiH-0006LJ-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:32:33 -0500 X-Info: This message was accepted for relay by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net as the sender used SMTP authentication X-Trace: UmFuZG9tSVbRlHj0tIdKhhxP/pjHsTdpKbwBctk6eAkdvK2o+WC89DoyCZjrO1ju Received: from pool-68-163-186-200.bos.east.verizon.net ([68.163.186.200] helo=rcn.com) by smtp01.mrf.mail.rcn.net with asmtp (Exim 3.35 #4) id 1AoEiI-0007a0-00; Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:32:34 -0500 Message-ID: <402075D6.908@rcn.com> From: David Hudek User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/20030624 Netscape/7.1 (ax) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: isis-wg@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 23:32:22 -0500 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >Gents, >I've been asked to again provoke a discussion about whether >or not we should be putting our changes to IS-IS on the >standards track. Opinions? I'm for it. As I recall, when this was brought up the last time there was a general consensus that this made sense to do from a pragmatic point of view (most of the active work on ISIS is being done under the IETF; "standards track" has more clout than "informational"; if put on standards track, the ITU can then make normative references to the RFCs instead of trying to paraphrase their content; etc.). The only fly in the ointment was the issue of potentially hurt feelings by members of another group (JTC1/SC6/WG7) who might, or might not, feel that the IETF was treading on their turf. Things then stalled out on that point. I would be in favor of moving things along, going ahead and putting the ISIS RFCs on standards track, and then dealing with the hypothetical hurt feelings only if they actually come up. In any event, it certainly seems reasonable for the IS-IS WG to put on the standards track RFCs which cover the use of ISIS **in IP networks**. It seems unreasonable for another group to say it cannot be done. My $0.02, dave hudek dhudek@bhawktech.com http://www.bhawktech.com _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Wed Feb 4 01:39:47 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA24618 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 01:39:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoGgf-0001jy-L5; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 01:39:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoGgZ-0001jW-Gd for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 01:38:55 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id BAA24592 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 01:38:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoGgW-0001mx-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 01:38:52 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AoGfY-0001hN-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 01:37:52 -0500 Received: from prattle.redback.com ([155.53.12.9]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoGeb-0001cE-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 01:36:53 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by prattle.redback.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1FA5A566902; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:36:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from prattle.redback.com ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (prattle [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 04689-07; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:36:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from redback.com (malt.redback.com [155.53.12.41]) by prattle.redback.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D7308566904; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:36:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from malt (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by redback.com (8.9.3-LCCHA/8.9.3/null redback solaris client) with ESMTP id WAA17530; Tue, 3 Feb 2004 22:36:53 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200402040636.WAA17530@redback.com> To: stefano previdi Cc: isis-wg@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? In-reply-to: Mail from stefano previdi dated Tue, 03 Feb 2004 14:35:09 +0100 From: Naiming Shen X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new at redback.com X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Tue, 03 Feb 2004 22:36:53 -0800 I must be dense and missed your point. Not sure you were saying the current situation was the best thus no change was needed or you were saying you didn't care. ISIS working group is under IETF, I don't see why it should not follow the Internet standard process as defined in RFC2026. I also don't see how making the ISIS documents on stardards track could compromise the "provider's trust" or "interoperability" or the "functionality". But I could be wrong... ] ] On Feb 3, 2004, at 1:33 PM, Danny McPherson wrote: ] ] > ] > On Feb 2, 2004, at 11:03 PM, Naiming Shen wrote: ] > ] >> ] >> Tonys, ] >> ] >> I'm for putting IETF ISIS documents on standards track. This will ] >> simplify everyone's life. ] ] I rarely noticed a simplification of my life due ] to standardization processes... ] ] >> Providers will trust the features they ] >> deploy following the "standards"; ] ] I believe providers trust implementations and proven ] interoperability more than theoretical standard ] documents. ] ] This interoperability and functionality can be ] described in any document (standard or not) as long ] as it is agreed by the community of companies ] supposed to implement them. ] ] ... but I may be wrong of course... ] ] s. ] ] ] >> ITU can reference them as nomative ] >> instead of copying IETF RFCs and making minor changes in order ] >> to avoid the copyright issues, which in turn was going to create ] >> inconsistency between IETF RFCs and ITU papers. ] >> ] >> Since most of the recent ISIS related work is done in IETF, we should ] >> take this chance and get this done once for all. ] > ] > I have to agree. It'll likely be a pain getting there but once ] > we do it'll be well worth it. ] > ] > -danny ] > ] > ] > _______________________________________________ ] > Isis-wg mailing list ] > Isis-wg@ietf.org ] > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg ] > ] ] ] _______________________________________________ ] Isis-wg mailing list ] Isis-wg@ietf.org ] https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg - Naiming _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Wed Feb 4 03:05:46 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA24718 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 03:05:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoI1u-0007su-0m; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:05:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoI0w-0007rM-Cp for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:04:02 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA24667 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 03:03:59 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoI0s-0002g1-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:03:58 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AoHzw-0002bH-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:03:01 -0500 Received: from sj-iport-3-in.cisco.com ([171.71.176.72] helo=sj-iport-3.cisco.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoHzR-0002Vi-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:02:29 -0500 Received: from sj-core-5.cisco.com (171.71.177.238) by sj-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2004 00:08:48 +0000 Received: from mira-sjc5-a.cisco.com (IDENT:mirapoint@mira-sjc5-a.cisco.com [171.71.163.34]) by sj-core-5.cisco.com (8.12.9/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i1481wDI019438 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:01:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from ginsberg-w2k.cisco.com (sjc-vpn2-36.cisco.com [10.21.112.36]) by mira-sjc5-a.cisco.com (Mirapoint Messaging Server MOS 3.3.6-GR) with ESMTP id ANO63975; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 00:01:57 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20040203235301.01aeff00@mira-sjc5-3.cisco.com> X-Sender: ginsberg@mira-sjc5-3.cisco.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 To: From: Les Ginsberg Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.4 required=5.0 tests=AWL autolearn=no version=2.60 Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 00:01:56 -0800 If I am totally honest about this subject, I have to admit I have a good deal of ambivalence. On the one hand, I believe in the benefits of standardization. It forces us to get the details right, requires interoperability testing, and thereby can improve the quality of the RFCs we turn out. The fact that other organizations, notably the ITU, are currently forced to paraphrase IETF work in order to use it is highly undesirable and even somewhat embarrassing. I have also long felt that the amount of arcane knowledge required to produce an interoperable IS-IS implementation was larger than it needed to be - in part because as features evolve we don't always bother to formalize all the interoperability issues (though thanks to Mr. Parker and the two Interoperability drafts some of the obscurity has disappeared). On the other hand, deployment of IS-IS for IP must be considered a success and I have heard no groundswell of complaints about the lack of standardization from customers. Perhaps it is because the community of implementors shares enough "napkins and libations" to keep interoperability issues at bay. Perhaps most users don't place a high value on standards tracking RFCs. Perhaps users are more interested in getting new features more quickly. Perhaps... In any case, I have yet to see anyone volunteering to be the first among us to shepherd an RFC through the standards track (and yes - that group of non-volunteers includes me). And why should anyone volunteer? Answer: Because A)They place a high value on the standards process and B)There is a strong business incentive to do it. At the moment, I have a moderate amount of "A" but don't see much of "B". Makes it difficult to be more than mildly supportive. I am willing to help get the train moving, but I'm not eager to fight an uphill battle. Les _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Wed Feb 4 03:43:46 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA25928 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 03:43:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoIcg-000298-35; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:43:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoIbo-00027q-76 for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:42:08 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id DAA25864 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 03:42:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoIbl-0006Yv-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:42:05 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AoIau-0006TE-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:41:13 -0500 Received: from ams-iport-1.cisco.com ([144.254.74.5]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoIaS-0006Me-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 03:40:44 -0500 Received: from cisco.com (144.254.74.60) by ams-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2004 09:40:46 +0100 Received: from cisco.com (mrwint.cisco.com [64.103.71.48]) by ams-msg-core-1.cisco.com (8.12.10/8.12.6) with ESMTP id i148dhL1023691; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 09:39:43 +0100 (MET) Received: from mshand-w2k02.cisco.com (ams-clip-vpn-dhcp4201.cisco.com [10.61.80.104]) by cisco.com (8.8.8/2.6/Cisco List Logging/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA29225; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 08:40:05 GMT Message-Id: <4.3.2.7.2.20040204081933.0251ed88@jaws.cisco.com> X-Sender: mshand@jaws.cisco.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 4.3.2 To: "Tony Li" From: mike shand Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? Cc: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2004 08:39:22 +0000 Like most opinion surveys, the answer you get depends on exactly what question you ask. If the question had been "would you object to putting IS-IS on the standards track", I think the answer would probably be NO. There are clearly benefits in doing so, not least in sorting out the ITU situation. However, if the question is "Would you support it?", then it becomes rather more difficult, since that implies some commitment (and that inevitably means expenditure of company resources) to performing the possibly extensive hoop jumping required to bring this to fruition. It is easy to view the standardization as "A good thing"TM. It is somewhat harder to provide the business case to do it. Or to put it another way. The end goal is clearly a nice place to be, what is not clear is whether the cost of the journey is worth the reward. Maybe it is; maybe it isn't. What makes this a more difficult call than the normal standardization issue is that we are currently perhaps 80% of the way there (choose your own figure), but that last 20% may cost us a lot of resource. If it were simply a question of putting a big "standard" rubber stamp on what we already have, then I think it would be a no brainer. Mike _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Wed Feb 4 05:42:43 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA29597 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 05:42:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoKTq-0002Fm-R6; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 05:42:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoKSu-00028F-Ok for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 05:41:04 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id FAA29555 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 05:41:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoKSr-0002Xc-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 05:41:01 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AoKRu-0002Su-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 05:40:03 -0500 Received: from weird-brew.cisco.com ([144.254.15.118] helo=strange-brew.cisco.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoKR4-0002Ji-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 05:39:10 -0500 Received: from [192.168.1.3] (ams-clip-vpn-dhcp4103.cisco.com [10.61.80.6]) by strange-brew.cisco.com (8.11.7+Sun/8.8.8) with ESMTP id i14Ace721412; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:38:40 +0100 (CET) In-Reply-To: <200402040636.WAA17530@redback.com> References: <200402040636.WAA17530@redback.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v612) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Message-Id: <698D3856-56FE-11D8-B409-000A95C47BAE@cisco.com> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: isis-wg@ietf.org From: stefano previdi Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? To: Naiming Shen X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.612) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 11:39:29 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Feb 4, 2004, at 7:36 AM, Naiming Shen wrote: > > I must be dense and missed your point. Not sure you > were saying the current situation was the best thus no > change was needed or you were saying you didn't care. a kind of combination of both... > ISIS working group is under IETF, I don't see why it > should not follow the Internet standard process as defined > in RFC2026. I also don't see how making the ISIS > documents on stardards track could compromise the > "provider's trust" or "interoperability" or the > "functionality". I didn't mean that. I just meant that I doubt it will bring us much improvement while I see from here the time and energy this will require. Anyway, I won't fight against it. s. > But I could be wrong... > > ] > ] On Feb 3, 2004, at 1:33 PM, Danny McPherson wrote: > ] > ] > > ] > On Feb 2, 2004, at 11:03 PM, Naiming Shen wrote: > ] > > ] >> > ] >> Tonys, > ] >> > ] >> I'm for putting IETF ISIS documents on standards track. This will > ] >> simplify everyone's life. > ] > ] I rarely noticed a simplification of my life due > ] to standardization processes... > ] > ] >> Providers will trust the features they > ] >> deploy following the "standards"; > ] > ] I believe providers trust implementations and proven > ] interoperability more than theoretical standard > ] documents. > ] > ] This interoperability and functionality can be > ] described in any document (standard or not) as long > ] as it is agreed by the community of companies > ] supposed to implement them. > ] > ] ... but I may be wrong of course... > ] > ] s. > ] > ] > ] >> ITU can reference them as nomative > ] >> instead of copying IETF RFCs and making minor changes in order > ] >> to avoid the copyright issues, which in turn was going to create > ] >> inconsistency between IETF RFCs and ITU papers. > ] >> > ] >> Since most of the recent ISIS related work is done in IETF, we > should > ] >> take this chance and get this done once for all. > ] > > ] > I have to agree. It'll likely be a pain getting there but once > ] > we do it'll be well worth it. > ] > > ] > -danny > ] > > ] > > ] > _______________________________________________ > ] > Isis-wg mailing list > ] > Isis-wg@ietf.org > ] > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg > ] > > ] > ] > ] _______________________________________________ > ] Isis-wg mailing list > ] Isis-wg@ietf.org > ] https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg > > - Naiming > > _______________________________________________ > Isis-wg mailing list > Isis-wg@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg > _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Wed Feb 4 10:46:52 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA11664 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:46:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoPE2-0003Kx-2P; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 10:46:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoPDa-0003Iv-Iy for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 10:45:34 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id KAA11576 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:45:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoPDY-0002CH-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 10:45:32 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AoPCd-00024j-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 10:44:36 -0500 Received: from [64.115.125.242] (helo=bridge.axiowave.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AoPBw-0001tl-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Wed, 04 Feb 2004 10:43:53 -0500 Message-ID: From: Jeff Parker To: "'mike shand'" , Tony Li Cc: isis-wg@ietf.org Subject: RE: [Isis-wg] To standardize or not? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.6 required=5.0 tests=AWL,WORK_AT_HOME autolearn=no version=2.60 Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2004 10:42:57 -0500 > we are currently perhaps 80% of the way there (choose > your own figure), but that last 20% may cost us a lot > of resource. > > Mike Mike - I will confess my total ignorance on this score. I've always assumed that the last 20% takes 80% of the work. We have two implementations, which is often one sticking point. But other work required? There hasn't been a lot of time or money for me to attend the meetings, but I'm happy to try to take one or more of the interoperability documents as a test case if it is work I can do from home. - jeff parker _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Thu Feb 5 15:41:45 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA04901 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:41:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoqJ3-0006IS-HU; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:41:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AoqIG-0006Fc-Jn for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:40:12 -0500 Received: from CNRI.Reston.VA.US (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA04771; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 15:40:10 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <200402052040.PAA04771@ietf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" To: IETF-Announce: ; Cc: isis-wg@ietf.org From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Reply-to: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: [Isis-wg] I-D ACTION:draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2004 15:40:10 -0500 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. Title : An approach for Routing at Flow level Author(s) : C. Proust Filename : draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt Pages : 58 Date : 2004-2-5 This document proposes an approach that aims at load balancing flows among multiple routes that are estimated to be slightly loaded. Mainly, it designs a router-based, end-to-end, congestion control mechanism by means of a piggybacking procedure which is distributed both in routers and terminals. This document proposes a set of functional extensions that might be applied to the IPv4 protocol and to the ISIS routing protocol A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt To remove yourself from the IETF Announcement list, send a message to ietf-announce-request with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2004-2-5130648.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2004-2-5130648.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Thu Feb 5 16:38:35 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA12318 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:38:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AorCE-0002rO-64; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:38:02 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AorBh-0002ZI-6v for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:37:29 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id QAA12217 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 16:37:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AorBf-0005s0-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:37:27 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AorB2-0005o6-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:36:49 -0500 Received: from ghostrider.gredler.at ([193.83.223.228]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AorA9-0005WD-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2004 16:35:53 -0500 Received: (from hannes@localhost) by ghostrider.gredler.at (8.11.6/8.11.6) id i15LZFX07401; Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:35:15 +0100 From: Hannes Gredler To: christophe.proust@francetelecom.com Cc: isis-wg@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Isis-wg] I-D ACTION:draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt Message-ID: <20040205213514.GA7330@juniper.net> References: <200402052040.PAA04771@ietf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <200402052040.PAA04771@ietf.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.3.28i X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.0 required=5.0 tests=none autolearn=no version=2.60 Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2004 22:35:15 +0100 christophe, just went through your draft and wanted to point your attention to the fact that the majority of hardware based route-lookup engines cannot parse ip options in the fast path; furthermore in most core networks ip options processing [beside the router-alert option] is disabled; as i understand your draft it heavy relies on option processing, which renders the ideas in your draft close to not-deployable; sorry; /hannes On Thu, Feb 05, 2004 at 03:40:10PM -0500, Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: | A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. | | | Title : An approach for Routing at Flow level | Author(s) : C. Proust | Filename : draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt | Pages : 58 | Date : 2004-2-5 | | This document proposes an approach that aims at load balancing flows | among multiple routes that are estimated to be slightly loaded. | Mainly, it designs a router-based, end-to-end, congestion control | mechanism by means of a piggybacking procedure which is distributed | both in routers and terminals. This document proposes a set of | functional extensions that might be applied to the IPv4 protocol and | to the ISIS routing protocol | | A URL for this Internet-Draft is: | http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt | | To remove yourself from the IETF Announcement list, send a message to | ietf-announce-request with the word unsubscribe in the body of the message. | | Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username | "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, | type "cd internet-drafts" and then | "get draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt". | | A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in | http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html | or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt | | | Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. | | Send a message to: | mailserv@ietf.org. | In the body type: | "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-proust-flow-routing-00.txt". | | NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in | MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this | feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" | command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or | a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers | exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with | "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split | up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on | how to manipulate these messages. | | | Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader | implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the | Internet-Draft. _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Fri Feb 6 15:07:37 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA12811 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:07:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ApCFh-0006b2-IF; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 15:07:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1ApCFc-0006Xo-Hy for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 15:06:56 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id PAA12763 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2004 15:06:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ApCFZ-0000Et-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 15:06:53 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1ApCEb-0000B8-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 15:05:53 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1ApCDj-00008N-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 15:04:59 -0500 Received: from [147.28.0.62] (helo=127.0.0.1) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30; FreeBSD) id 1ApCDj-000BAL-AD for isis-wg@ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2004 20:04:59 +0000 From: Alex Zinin X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.62i) Personal Reply-To: Alex Zinin X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <80179267262.20040206120437@psg.com> To: isis-wg@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,RCVD_NUMERIC_HELO autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Isis-wg] IESG on draft-ietf-isis-restart Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2004 12:04:37 -0800 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Folks- draft-ietf-isis-restart has been approved by the IESG for publication as an Informational RFC. A formal announcement to follow shortly. Thanks all for hard work! -- Alex _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Mon Feb 9 13:17:45 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA01519 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:17:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqFxt-0004DD-L0; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 13:17:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AqFxH-000411-05 for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 13:16:23 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id NAA01478 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2004 13:16:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from nobody by optimus.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.20) id 1AqFwm-0003u4-Kv; Mon, 09 Feb 2004 13:15:52 -0500 X-test-idtracker: no From: The IESG To: IETF-Announce:; Cc: Internet Architecture Board , RFC Editor , Message-Id: Subject: [Isis-wg] Document Action: 'Restart signaling for IS-IS' to Informational RFC Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2004 13:15:52 -0500 The IESG has approved the following document: - 'Restart signaling for IS-IS ' as an Informational RFC This document is the product of the IS-IS for IP Internets Working Group. The IESG contact persons are Alex Zinin and Bill Fenner. Technical Summary This document describes a mechanism that helps to avoid unnecessary disruption in an IS-IS domain when a router reloads. The mechanism ensures correct database synchronization and final convergence of the routing algorithm. Working Group Summary The specification went through a substential technical review by the WG. There was a consensus within a WG on this document. Protocol Quality The documents has been reviewed by the Routing Area Directorate (Chris Hopps and Jeff Parker) and Alex Zinin. RFC Editor Note Section 1. "Conventions used in this document", paras 2 and 3: OLD: If the control and forwarding functions in a router can be maintained independently, it is possible for the forwarding function state to be maintained across a control function restart. This functionality is assumed when the terms "restart/restarting" are used in this document. The terms "start/starting" are used to refer to a router in which the control function has either been started for the first time or has been restarted but the forwarding functions have not been maintained in a prior state. NEW: If the control and forwarding functions in a router can be maintained independently, it is possible for the forwarding function state to be maintained across a resumption of control function operations. This functionality is assumed when the terms "restart/restarting" are used in this document. The terms "start/starting" are used to refer to a router in which the control function has either commenced operations for the first time or has resumed operations but the forwarding functions have not been maintained in a prior state." _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Mon Feb 16 06:09:43 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA11366 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 06:09:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AsgcX-0005OV-Ey; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 06:09:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Asgbi-0005Hz-AI for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 06:08:10 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id GAA11282 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 06:08:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1Asgbe-0003cz-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 06:08:06 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1Asgaf-0003Zq-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 06:07:06 -0500 Received: from mta1.huawei.com ([61.144.161.40] helo=huawei.com) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AsgZg-0003Ur-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 06:06:05 -0500 Received: from r27907 (huawei.com [172.17.1.60]) by mta1.huawei.com (iPlanet Messaging Server 5.2 HotFix 1.16 (built May 14 2003)) with ESMTPA id <0HT600I0CBQ3VP@mta1.huawei.com> for isis-wg@ietf.org; Mon, 16 Feb 2004 18:56:28 +0800 (CST) From: shengcheng To: isis-wg@ietf.org Message-id: <002101c3f47c$95a5d0e0$10336e0a@HUAWEI.COM> MIME-version: 1.0 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2919.6600 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2919.6600 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="Boundary_(ID_3qQaifxVjBVn7JOIp1MmPQ)" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-priority: Normal X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.5 required=5.0 tests=AWL,HTML_30_40,HTML_MESSAGE autolearn=no version=2.60 Subject: [Isis-wg] doubt about authentication on IS-IS p-2-p link Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2004 19:04:00 +0800 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --Boundary_(ID_3qQaifxVjBVn7JOIp1MmPQ) Content-type: text/plain; charset=gb2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT Dear all: It is known that only one kind of PDU hello type works as p-2-p link(broadcast has two, level-1 and level-2 respectively) When i configure the authentication on one p-2-p link running IS-IS, the router(such as Cisco's) also give level-1 and level-2 option to choose. I wonder what is the rule to decide which level password configured should the p-2-p link used. Anyone can give some information about this part? Thanks in advance. thanks@regards Shiny --Boundary_(ID_3qQaifxVjBVn7JOIp1MmPQ) Content-type: text/html; charset=gb2312 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7BIT
Dear all:
        It is known that only one kind of PDU hello type works as p-2-p link(broadcast has two, level-1 and level-2 respectively)
When i configure the authentication on one p-2-p link running IS-IS, the router(such as Cisco's) also give level-1 and
level-2 option to choose. I wonder what is the rule to decide which level password configured should the p-2-p link used.
        Anyone can give some information about this part? Thanks in advance.
 
 
thanks@regards
Shiny
--Boundary_(ID_3qQaifxVjBVn7JOIp1MmPQ)-- _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Tue Feb 17 02:02:46 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA02897 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 02:02:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AszF2-0006ZB-VU; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 02:02:00 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AszEt-0006Vv-5w for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 02:01:51 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id CAA01807 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 02:01:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AszEp-0002hi-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 02:01:47 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AszDv-0002eT-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 02:00:51 -0500 Received: from [202.106.154.132] (helo=heian.fujitsu.com.cn) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AszD8-0002bm-00 for Isis-wg@ietf.org; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 02:00:03 -0500 Received: from edo.cn.fujitsu.com (edo.cn.fujitsu.com [10.167.33.5]) by heian.fujitsu.com.cn (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1H6vXhi003398; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:57:33 +0800 (CST) Received: from fcc.cn.fujitsu.com (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by edo.cn.fujitsu.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id i1H6xrsK022684; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:59:53 +0800 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: edo.cn.fujitsu.com: iscan owned process doing -bs Received: from LUHOUQIN ([10.167.34.198]) by fcc.cn.fujitsu.com (8.11.6/8.11.6) with SMTP id i1H6s4K07191; Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:54:04 +0800 Message-ID: <012301c3f523$a3daecc0$c622a70a@LUHOUQIN> From: "Jack Lv" To: Cc: "Tony Li" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0120_01C3F566.B1E2B580" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1158 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1165 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=1.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,HTML_70_80,HTML_MESSAGE, MIME_BASE64_TEXT autolearn=no version=2.60 Subject: [Isis-wg] Thanks Tony Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 14:59:51 +0800 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0120_01C3F566.B1E2B580 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Umdkcw0KDQpKYWNr ------=_NextPart_000_0120_01C3F566.B1E2B580 Content-Type: text/html; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 PCFET0NUWVBFIEhUTUwgUFVCTElDICItLy9XM0MvL0RURCBIVE1MIDQuMCBUcmFuc2l0aW9uYWwv L0VOIj4NCjxIVE1MPjxIRUFEPg0KPE1FVEEgaHR0cC1lcXVpdj1Db250ZW50LVR5cGUgY29udGVu dD0idGV4dC9odG1sOyBjaGFyc2V0PWdiMjMxMiI+DQo8TUVUQSBjb250ZW50PSJNU0hUTUwgNi4w MC4yODAwLjEyNzYiIG5hbWU9R0VORVJBVE9SPg0KPFNUWUxFPjwvU1RZTEU+DQo8L0hFQUQ+DQo8 Qk9EWSBiZ0NvbG9yPSNmZmZmZmY+DQo8RElWPjxGT05UIGZhY2U9VGFob21hPlJnZHM8L0ZPTlQ+ PC9ESVY+DQo8RElWPjxGT05UIGZhY2U9VGFob21hPjwvRk9OVD4mbmJzcDs8L0RJVj4NCjxESVY+ PEZPTlQgZmFjZT1UYWhvbWE+SmFjazwvRk9OVD48L0RJVj48L0JPRFk+PC9IVE1MPg0K ------=_NextPart_000_0120_01C3F566.B1E2B580-- _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Thu Feb 26 08:51:54 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA12917 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:51:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwLun-0005BP-VG; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:51:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwLuM-0005Ai-T4 for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:50:34 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id IAA12867 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:50:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwLuL-0002lK-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:50:33 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwLtS-0002hF-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:49:38 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwLsv-0002ct-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 08:49:05 -0500 Received: from [147.28.0.62] (helo=127.0.0.1) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30; FreeBSD) id 1AwLsu-0009bd-Pv for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 13:49:04 +0000 From: Alex Zinin X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.62i) Personal Reply-To: Alex Zinin X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <1051820057.20040226054839@psg.com> To: isis-wg@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,RCVD_NUMERIC_HELO autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Isis-wg] IESG on draft-ietf-isis-gmpls-extensions Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 05:48:39 -0800 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Folks- draft-ietf-isis-gmpls-extensions has been approved by the IESG for publication as an Informational RFC. A formal announcement to follow shortly. -- Alex _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Thu Feb 26 09:06:39 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA13893 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:06:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwM9J-0006UO-Jy; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:06:01 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwM97-0006TB-HR for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:05:49 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id JAA13851 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:05:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwM96-0004k9-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:05:48 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwM8E-0004cT-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:04:54 -0500 Received: from psg.com ([147.28.0.62] ident=mailnull) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwM7L-0004Ub-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 09:03:59 -0500 Received: from [147.28.0.62] (helo=127.0.0.1) by psg.com with esmtp (Exim 4.30; FreeBSD) id 1AwM7K-000Bd1-JD for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 14:03:58 +0000 From: Alex Zinin X-Mailer: The Bat! (v1.62i) Personal Reply-To: Alex Zinin X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Message-ID: <192712981.20040226060332@psg.com> To: isis-wg@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.3 required=5.0 tests=AWL,RCVD_NUMERIC_HELO autolearn=no version=2.60 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: [Isis-wg] New WG chairs for ISIS Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 06:03:32 -0800 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is the announcement of a management change for the ISIS working group, effective immediately. The new working group chairs-- Chris Hopps David Ward --will be replacing Tony Li and Tony Przygienda, who decided to step down. I would like to thank Tony and Tony for their years of service, hard work, and contributions to the technology. I would also like to welcome Chris and Dave to their new positions. -- Alex Zinin IETF Routing Area Co-Director _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Thu Feb 26 21:10:42 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA22529 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:10:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwXRz-0006H6-9B; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:10:03 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1AwXRt-0006Gc-AS for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:09:57 -0500 Received: from ietf-mx (ietf-mx.ietf.org [132.151.6.1]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id VAA22519 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:09:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from ietf-mx ([132.151.6.1]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwXRq-0004cl-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:09:54 -0500 Received: from exim by ietf-mx with spam-scanned (Exim 4.12) id 1AwXQt-0004Yo-00 for isis-wg@ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:08:56 -0500 Received: from gamma.isi.edu ([128.9.144.145]) by ietf-mx with esmtp (Exim 4.12) id 1AwXQT-0004Uq-00; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 21:08:29 -0500 Received: from ISI.EDU (jet.isi.edu [128.9.160.87]) by gamma.isi.edu (8.11.6p2+0917/8.11.2) with ESMTP id i1R28Tk26562; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:08:29 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200402270208.i1R28Tk26562@gamma.isi.edu> To: IETF-Announce: ; Cc: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org, isis-wg@ietf.org From: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary=NextPart X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 2.60 (1.212-2003-09-23-exp) on ietf-mx.ietf.org X-Spam-Status: No, hits=-9.0 required=5.0 tests=AWL,MIME_BOUND_NEXTPART, NO_REAL_NAME,USER_IN_DEF_WHITELIST autolearn=no version=2.60 Subject: [Isis-wg] RFC 3719 on Recommendations for Interoperable Networks using Intermediate System to Intermediate System (IS-IS) Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 18:08:28 -0800 --NextPart A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries. RFC 3719 Title: Recommendations for Interoperable Networks using Intermediate System to Intermediate System (IS-IS) Author(s): J. Parker, Ed. Status: Informational Date: February 2004 Mailbox: jparker@axiowave.com Pages: 15 Characters: 33939 Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso: None I-D Tag: draft-ietf-isis-iso-interoperable-02.txt URL: ftp://ftp.rfc-editor.org/in-notes/rfc3719.txt This document discusses a number of differences between the Intermediate System to Intermediate System (IS-IS) protocol as described in ISO 10589 and the protocol as it is deployed today. These differences are discussed as a service to those implementing, testing, and deploying the IS-IS Protocol. A companion document discusses differences between the protocol described in RFC 1195 and the protocol as it is deployed today for routing IP traffic. This document is a product of the IS-IS for IP Internets Working Group of the IETF. This memo provides information for the Internet community. It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution of this memo is unlimited. This announcement is sent to the IETF list and the RFC-DIST list. Requests to be added to or deleted from the IETF distribution list should be sent to IETF-REQUEST@IETF.ORG. Requests to be added to or deleted from the RFC-DIST distribution list should be sent to RFC-DIST-REQUEST@RFC-EDITOR.ORG. Details on obtaining RFCs via FTP or EMAIL may be obtained by sending an EMAIL message to rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG with the message body help: ways_to_get_rfcs. For example: To: rfc-info@RFC-EDITOR.ORG Subject: getting rfcs help: ways_to_get_rfcs Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the author of the RFC in question, or to RFC-Manager@RFC-EDITOR.ORG. Unless specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for unlimited distribution.echo Submissions for Requests for Comments should be sent to RFC-EDITOR@RFC-EDITOR.ORG. Please consult RFC 2223, Instructions to RFC Authors, for further information. Joyce K. Reynolds and Sandy Ginoza USC/Information Sciences Institute ... Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant Mail Reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the RFCs. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="RFC-INFO@RFC-EDITOR.ORG" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <040226180641.RFC@RFC-EDITOR.ORG> RETRIEVE: rfc DOC-ID: rfc3719 --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="rfc3719.txt"; site="ftp.isi.edu"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="in-notes" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <040226180641.RFC@RFC-EDITOR.ORG> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg From isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Thu Feb 26 23:55:40 2004 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA29021 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:55:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from localhost.localdomain ([127.0.0.1] helo=www1.ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Awa1f-0007D1-BU; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:55:03 -0500 Received: from odin.ietf.org ([132.151.1.176] helo=ietf.org) by optimus.ietf.org with esmtp (Exim 4.20) id 1Awa1c-0007CW-0d for isis-wg@optimus.ietf.org; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:55:00 -0500 Received: from optimus.ietf.org (optimus.ietf.org [132.151.1.19]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with ESMTP id XAA29010 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:54:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from nobody by optimus.ietf.org with local (Exim 4.20) id 1Awa17-0007AE-Lb; Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:54:29 -0500 X-test-idtracker: no From: The IESG To: IETF-Announce:; Cc: Internet Architecture Board , RFC Editor , Message-Id: Subject: [Isis-wg] Document Action: 'IS-IS Extensions in Support of Generalized MPLS' to Informational RFC Sender: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org Errors-To: isis-wg-admin@ietf.org X-BeenThere: isis-wg@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.12 Precedence: bulk List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: IETF IS-IS working group List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , List-Archive: Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 23:54:29 -0500 The IESG has approved the following document: - 'IS-IS Extensions in Support of Generalized MPLS ' as an Informational RFC This document is the product of the IS-IS for IP Internets Working Group. The IESG contact persons are Alex Zinin and Bill Fenner. Technical Summary This document specifies additional IS-IS link attributes required to support GMPLS. Working Group Summary The document has been extensively discussed in and reviewed by the WG. The WG had consensus on progressing the spec. Protocol Quality The document has been reviewed for the IESG by Alex Zinin. RFC Editor Note: Section 5. "Security Considerations" OLD: This document specifies the contents of GMPLS TE TLVs in ISIS. As these TLVs are not used for SPF computation or normal routing, the extensions specified here have no direct effect on IP routing. Tampering with GMPLS TE TLVs may have an effect on the underlying transport (optical and/or SONET-SDH) network. Mechanisms to secure ISIS Link State PDUs and/or the TE TLVs can be used to secure the GMPLS TE TLVs as well. NEW: 5. Security Considerations This document specifies the contents of GMPLS TE TLVs in ISIS. As these TLVs are not used for SPF computation or normal routing, the extensions specified here have no direct effect on IP routing. Tampering with GMPLS TE TLVs may have an effect on the underlying transport (optical and/or SONET-SDH) network. Mechanisms to secure ISIS Link State PDUs and/or the TE TLVs [ISIS-HMAC] can be used to secure the GMPLS TE TLVs as well. Section "Normative References" ADD: [ISIS-HMAC] Li, T., and R. Atkinson, "Intermediate System to Intermediate System (IS-IS) Cryptographic Authentication", RFC 3567, July 2003. _______________________________________________ Isis-wg mailing list Isis-wg@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/isis-wg