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From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
To: its@ietf.org
References: <EED81985-1D4C-41B2-8CCA-A46B96390A18@vigilsec.com> <ad3ccd6c-cd99-c47a-d0df-bfb94b5ab40f@gmail.com> <CADnDZ8_wwa91-5UWeqxhJy=nMBp8kwu4ZvfxsAojZCY9DG8jSA@mail.gmail.com> <92850021-914f-ab6a-f8d2-ab793179fa1b@gmail.com> <00d601d5b4ee$01cc9ae0$0565d0a0$@eurecom.fr> <47f48fca-07b9-5657-4cb5-54cc5d63d2e3@gmail.com> <b9ea5f34-0129-614b-d644-0ab95437f6ac@gmail.com> <7664b128-91b7-8fef-1e13-b681b45b1958@gmail.com> <61f9d6f6-1e37-6e15-3a48-48e7047f0fe1@gmail.com> <CADnDZ88tsTvRdr4_jpWxnT0X_3ihTJ8=783-6M-kFNS+uMnA3Q@mail.gmail.com> <b7d40c34-ccdd-2617-0598-62a4b7faf994@gmail.com> <7f2e764a-8d75-a3a8-cd4e-a4406dd8e321@gmail.com> <038fea3b-cdd3-dbe3-04f9-fbe873661cf1@gmail.com> <0e29e730-e62a-f864-ad10-81f5e524bf33@gmail.com> <CADnDZ8-pBQC2DnFJ7gFqH_wzYd8OFyKMDk6XD2Uj533Sn1Mq-w@mail.gmail.com> <DE3E74A6-006F-447A-874B-A561E91AA27B@hxcore.ol> <dd32ce98-6853-28e2-08af-9f3dabb2d867@gmail.com> <a9d9a95a-643e-dfb6-c3ef-b21ab498a2cf@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] Commenting on the FCC plan
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For information,

The FCC plan was to carve out spectrum space for Cellular V2X out of the
ITS 5.9GHz band.

Now there is news about the allocation of ITS frequencies in Europe.

This Decision by EU about the ITS frequencies was released a few days
ago at URL
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/?qid=1602230223168&uri=CELEX:32020D1426

This Decision says a few interesting new things:

- the 5915-5925MHz is for Infrastructure-to-Vehicle communications.
That would mean, my interpretation is, that an RSU (Road-Side Unit)
sending IPv6 RAs would have to put them on that channel, and probably
not on the main control channel 5895-5905MHz, aka CCH, as I was firmly
believing up to now.

- the 5915-5935MHz is for 'urban rail' together with ITS.  There is some
overlap indeed, but they'd expect deployers to figure the overlap out in
different ways at various places, I think.

- most interestingly, in light of the FCC plan, this decision also talks
about 5G and in particular about LTE-V2X (again this term!).  It is said
that ETSI is working on two documents about 'co-channel' and 'adjacent
channel' co-existence methods between ITS G5 and LTE-V2X.  This
Decision's authors expect ETSI documents to be ready by middle of year
2021 or middle of year 2022.

I would like to ask:
- what are the ETSI documents working on co-channel and adjacent-channel
co-existence for ITS and LTE-V2X?
- what is the advancement of the FCC plan about carving out spectrum
space for Cellular V2X out of the 5.9GHZ bands?

Alex

Le 29/09/2020 à 14:19, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
> For information, today some 5G frequencies go on auction in France.
> 
> The bands are in the 3.49-3.8GHz area.
> 
> The price starts at 350MEur for a 50MHz, then down.  I suspect that,
>  this being an 'auction', it means the price will go up too.
> 
> There is no talk of 4.9GHz bands for 5G.  This means probably the FCC
> plan to carve 5G space into 4.9GHz V2X bands does not affect the 
> France plans of 5G.
> 
> Another remarkable point is that the 5G bands auction comes with a 
> requirement for IPv6 compatibility, which is good for IPv6 in general
> but does not affect V2X either ("Par ailleurs, pour accélérer la
> transition vers le protocole de routage IPv6, l'Arcep prévoit une 
> obligation pour rendre les réseaux mobiles compatibles avec 
> celui-ci.", fr.)
> 
> Alex
> 
> Le 10/07/2020 à 17:37, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
>> This IPv6 restriction doubt aside, has now FCC allocated 5.9GHz 
>> channels to non-802.11 technologies?
>> 
>> Le 10/07/2020 à 16:33, fygsimon@gmail.com a écrit :
>>> IPv6 was never restricted on the DSRC Control Channel by the FCC.
>>> I believe this was a restriction mandate by IEEE 1609.x 
>>> standard(s).
>> 
>> I can only hope by now that IEEE 1609.x drafts do say "RFC 8691".
>> 
>>> The applicable US Codes of Federal Regulations are:
>>> 
>>> FCC 47 90.377 for RSU
>>> 
>>> FCC 47 95.325, 95.359, 95.3159, 95.3163, and 95.3167 which 
>>> replace 95.1511 since 2017.
>> 
>> These should say "RFC 8691" to clarify any potential confusion.
>> 
>> Alex
>> 
>>> 
>>> Have any questions, let me know.
>>> 
>>> Francois Simon
>>> 
>>> Sent from Mail <https://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=550986> 
>>> for Windows 10
>>> 
>>> *From: *Abdussalam Baryun <mailto:abdussalambaryun@gmail.com> 
>>> *Sent: *Friday, July 10, 2020 9:31 AM *To: *Alexandre Petrescu 
>>> <mailto:alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>; its <mailto:its@ietf.org>
>>>  *Subject: *Re: [ipwave] Commenting on the FCC plan
>>> 
>>> thanks Alex,
>>> 
>>> On Fri, Jul 10, 2020 at 2:43 PM Alexandre Petrescu 
>>> <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com 
>>> <mailto:alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello,
>>> 
>>> I would like to know wheher FCC advanced well while seeking to 
>>> promote innovation in the 5.9GHz band?
>>> 
>>> In particular, is now IPv6 allowed to run on the control channel
>>>  5895-5905MHz on 802.11 in OCB mode?
>>> 
>>> I think it will be licensed or on demand.
>>> 
>>> The URL to the FCC document stating that seeking of promotion of
>>>  innovation is this, but I cant figure out a conclusion of it(?)
>>> 
>>> https://www.fcc.gov/document/fcc-seeks-promote-innovation-59-ghz-band-0
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 
Best regards
>>> 
>>> AB
>>> 
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list 
>> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
> 
> _______________________________________________ its mailing list 
> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its


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The ITU-R sent a liaison: https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/

Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?

Russ


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Hi Russ,
We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement and Use Cases Draft can be a
good foundation for their work:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19

Thanks.

Best Regards,
Paul

On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM <housley@vigilsec.com> wrote:

> The ITU-R sent a liaison: https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/
>
> Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?
>
> Russ
>
> _______________________________________________
> its mailing list
> its@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>


-- 
===========================
Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
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Sungkyunkwan University
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Email: jaehoon.paul@gmail.com, pauljeong@skku.edu
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<div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Russ,<div>We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement=
 and Use Cases Draft can be a good foundation for their work:</div><div><a =
href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-=
19">https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19</=
a><br></div><div><br></div><div>Thanks.</div><div><br></div><div>Best Regar=
ds,</div><div>Paul</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"lt=
r" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM &lt;<a href=3D"mail=
to:housley@vigilsec.com">housley@vigilsec.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><bloc=
kquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:=
1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">The ITU-R sent a liaison: <a h=
ref=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/" rel=3D"noreferrer" targe=
t=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/</a><br>
<br>
Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?<br>
<br>
Russ<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
its mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:its@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">its@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its" rel=3D"noreferrer" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its</a><br>
</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr">=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D<br>Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.=
D.<br>Associate Professor<br>Department of Computer Science and Engineering=
<br>Sungkyunkwan University<br>Office: +82-31-299-4957<br>Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jaehoon.paul@gmail.com</a=
>,=C2=A0<a href=3D"mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu" style=3D"font-size:12.8px" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">pauljeong@skku.edu</a><br>Personal Homepage: <a href=3D"htt=
p://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php" target=3D"_blank">http://iotl=
ab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php</a><br></div></div></div></div></div><=
/div></div></div>

--00000000000090dbcb05b1d91848--


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To: its@ietf.org
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From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D.

But, since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and Automated 
Vehicles), I think there would be advantageous to point to particular 
places in the draft that make for Connected and for Automated.

For the Connected part it is straightforward, because many communication 
protocols are referred to in the I-D.

For the Automated part, maybe the V2V use-cases described in the I-D.

Maybe other parts of the I-D as well.

Alex


Le 17/10/2020 à 09:47, Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong a écrit :
> Hi Russ,
> We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement and Use Cases Draft can be 
> a good foundation for their work:
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19 
> <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19>
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Best Regards,
> Paul
> 
> On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM <housley@vigilsec.com 
> <mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>> wrote:
> 
>     The ITU-R sent a liaison: https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/
>     <https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/>
> 
>     Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?
> 
>     Russ
> 
>     _______________________________________________
>     its mailing list
>     its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org>
>     https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>     <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its>
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> ===========================
> Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
> Associate Professor
> Department of Computer Science and Engineering
> Sungkyunkwan University
> Office: +82-31-299-4957
> Email: jaehoon.paul@gmail.com <mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>, 
> pauljeong@skku.edu <mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu>
> Personal Homepage: http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php 
> <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>
> 
> _______________________________________________
> its mailing list
> its@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
> 


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From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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(For information, the ISO TC204 'ITS' too is looking at creating, or 
enhancing, an 'ADCG' - Automated Driving Control Group.  It is a group 
trying to oversee how to bring the different characteristics of work 
related to AD into the various WGs of that TC.  They have started a
document titled 'Terms of Reference' on which they might need feedback.

This is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just a FYI.)

Alex


Le 17/10/2020 à 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
> I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D.
> 
> But, since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and Automated 
> Vehicles), I think there would be advantageous to point to
> particular places in the draft that make for Connected and for
> Automated.
> 
> For the Connected part it is straightforward, because many 
> communication protocols are referred to in the I-D.
> 
> For the Automated part, maybe the V2V use-cases described in the 
> I-D.
> 
> Maybe other parts of the I-D as well.
> 
> Alex
> 
> 
> Le 17/10/2020 à 09:47, Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong a écrit :
>> Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement and Use 
>> Cases Draft can be a good foundation for their work: 
>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19
>>
>>  
>> <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
Thanks.
>> 
>> Best Regards, Paul
>> 
>> On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM <housley@vigilsec.com 
>> <mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>> wrote:
>> 
>> The ITU-R sent a liaison: 
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/ 
>> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/>
>> 
>> Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?
>> 
>> Russ
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list 
>> its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org> 
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its 
>> <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its>
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- =========================== Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D. 
>> Associate Professor Department of Computer Science and Engineering
>>  Sungkyunkwan University Office: +82-31-299-4957 Email: 
>> jaehoon.paul@gmail.com <mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>, 
>> pauljeong@skku.edu <mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu> Personal Homepage: 
>> http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php 
>> <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list 
>> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ its mailing list 
> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its


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From: housley@vigilsec.com
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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Since it is from ITU-R, it is about spectrum.

Russ


On 2020-10-17 04:37, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:
> (For information, the ISO TC204 'ITS' too is looking at creating, or
> enhancing, an 'ADCG' - Automated Driving Control Group.  It is a group
> trying to oversee how to bring the different characteristics of work
> related to AD into the various WGs of that TC.  They have started a
> document titled 'Terms of Reference' on which they might need feedback.
>=20
> This is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just a FYI.)
>=20
> Alex
>=20
>=20
> Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a =C3=A9crit :
>> I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D.
>>=20
>> But, since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and Automated=20
>> Vehicles), I think there would be advantageous to point to
>> particular places in the draft that make for Connected and for
>> Automated.
>>=20
>> For the Connected part it is straightforward, because many=20
>> communication protocols are referred to in the I-D.
>>=20
>> For the Automated part, maybe the V2V use-cases described in the I-D.
>>=20
>> Maybe other parts of the I-D as well.
>>=20
>> Alex
>>=20
>>=20
>> Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 09:47, Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong a =C3=A9crit :
>>> Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement and Use Cases=20
>>> Draft can be a good foundation for their work:=20
>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19
>>>=20
>>> =20
>>> <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-1=
9>
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
> Thanks.
>>>=20
>>> Best Regards, Paul
>>>=20
>>> On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM <housley@vigilsec.com=20
>>> <mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>> wrote:
>>>=20
>>> The ITU-R sent a liaison: https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/=20
>>> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/>
>>>=20
>>> Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?
>>>=20
>>> Russ
>>>=20
>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list=20
>>> its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org>=20
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its=20
>>> <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its>
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>>=20
>>> -- =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.=20
>>> Associate Professor Department of Computer Science and Engineering
>>>  Sungkyunkwan University Office: +82-31-299-4957 Email:=20
>>> jaehoon.paul@gmail.com <mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>,=20
>>> pauljeong@skku.edu <mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu> Personal Homepage:=20
>>> http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php=20
>>> <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>
>>>=20
>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list=20
>>> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>>=20
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list=20
>> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> its mailing list
> its@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its


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From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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Le 17/10/2020 à 17:17, housley@vigilsec.com a écrit :
> Since it is from ITU-R, it is about spectrum.

Well, the liaison statement asks this: "Working Party 5A kindly requests
the interested external organizations to provide material on the
description, architecture, applications, technologies, and operational
scenarios of CAVs and the radiocommunication requirements for CAVs."

This is a very broad request.  I think it is much more than just
spectrum requirements for CAVs.  I think only their request of
'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' might indeed relate to
spectrum requirements.

With respect to 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' we could list
the following:
- the use of the 5.9GHz band specific to DSRC as used in automated
   vehicles.  Use IP on the control channel of this band.
- the use of 3.5GHz band specific to 5G as used in demonstrations of
   tele-operation of automated shuttle, such as the October Stockholm
   demonstration made by Ericsson.

With respect to 'description, architecture, applications, technologies
and operation scenarios' we could provide a pointer to the Internet
Draft titled 'IPv6 Wireless Access in Vehicular Environments (IPWAVE):
Problem Statement and Use Cases'.

With respect to just the 'operational scenarios' we can provide a few
additional pointers to CAV-specific use-cases of communication technologies:
- the 6G use-cases relating to vehicular networking (some such use cases
   are listed in the 6gip email list of IETF),
- the ITU-T FG-NET2030 use-cases that relate to automated driving,
- the recent ToD (Tele Operated Driving) use-case described by 5GAA.

An additional possibility might be to provide a list of projects
involving the use of communication systems in CAVs (Connected Automated
Vehicles).

Alex


> 
> Russ
> 
> 
> On 2020-10-17 04:37, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:
>> (For information, the ISO TC204 'ITS' too is looking at creating, 
>> or enhancing, an 'ADCG' - Automated Driving Control Group.  It is a
>> group trying to oversee how to bring the different characteristics
>> of work related to AD into the various WGs of that TC.  They have
>> started a document titled 'Terms of Reference' on which they might
>> need feedback.
>> 
>> This is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just a FYI.)
>> 
>> Alex
>> 
>> 
>> Le 17/10/2020 à 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
>>> I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D.
>>> 
>>> But, since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and 
>>> Automated Vehicles), I think there would be advantageous to point
>>> to particular places in the draft that make for Connected and for
>>> Automated.
>>> 
>>> For the Connected part it is straightforward, because many 
>>> communication protocols are referred to in the I-D.
>>> 
>>> For the Automated part, maybe the V2V use-cases described in the
>>>  I-D.
>>> 
>>> Maybe other parts of the I-D as well.
>>> 
>>> Alex
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Le 17/10/2020 à 09:47, Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong a écrit :
>>>> Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement and Use
>>>>  Cases Draft can be a good foundation for their work: 
>>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> 
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19>
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>> Thanks.
>>>> 
>>>> Best Regards, Paul
>>>> 
>>>> On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM <housley@vigilsec.com 
>>>> <mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> The ITU-R sent a liaison: 
>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/ 
>>>> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/>
>>>> 
>>>> Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?
>>>> 
>>>> Russ
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing 
>>>> list its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org> 
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its 
>>>> <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its>
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -- =========================== Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
>>>>  Associate Professor Department of Computer Science and 
>>>> Engineering Sungkyunkwan University Office: +82-31-299-4957 
>>>> Email: jaehoon.paul@gmail.com <mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>,
>>>>  pauljeong@skku.edu <mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu> Personal 
>>>> Homepage: http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php 
>>>> <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>
>>>> 
>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing 
>>>> list its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>>> 
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list
>>>  its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>> 
>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list 
>> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its


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From: Russ Housley <housley@vigilsec.com>
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To: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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Alex:

This seems to be well beyond the scope of the IPWAVE WG.  Perhaps you =
should respond as an individual.

Russ


> On Oct 20, 2020, at 8:22 AM, Alexandre Petrescu =
<alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 17:17, housley@vigilsec.com a =C3=A9crit :
>> Since it is from ITU-R, it is about spectrum.
>=20
> Well, the liaison statement asks this: "Working Party 5A kindly =
requests
> the interested external organizations to provide material on the
> description, architecture, applications, technologies, and operational
> scenarios of CAVs and the radiocommunication requirements for CAVs."
>=20
> This is a very broad request.  I think it is much more than just
> spectrum requirements for CAVs.  I think only their request of
> 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' might indeed relate to
> spectrum requirements.
>=20
> With respect to 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' we could =
list
> the following:
> - the use of the 5.9GHz band specific to DSRC as used in automated
>  vehicles.  Use IP on the control channel of this band.
> - the use of 3.5GHz band specific to 5G as used in demonstrations of
>  tele-operation of automated shuttle, such as the October Stockholm
>  demonstration made by Ericsson.
>=20
> With respect to 'description, architecture, applications, technologies
> and operation scenarios' we could provide a pointer to the Internet
> Draft titled 'IPv6 Wireless Access in Vehicular Environments (IPWAVE):
> Problem Statement and Use Cases'.
>=20
> With respect to just the 'operational scenarios' we can provide a few
> additional pointers to CAV-specific use-cases of communication =
technologies:
> - the 6G use-cases relating to vehicular networking (some such use =
cases
>  are listed in the 6gip email list of IETF),
> - the ITU-T FG-NET2030 use-cases that relate to automated driving,
> - the recent ToD (Tele Operated Driving) use-case described by 5GAA.
>=20
> An additional possibility might be to provide a list of projects
> involving the use of communication systems in CAVs (Connected =
Automated
> Vehicles).
>=20
> Alex
>=20
>=20
>> Russ
>> On 2020-10-17 04:37, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:
>>> (For information, the ISO TC204 'ITS' too is looking at creating, or =
enhancing, an 'ADCG' - Automated Driving Control Group.  It is a
>>> group trying to oversee how to bring the different characteristics
>>> of work related to AD into the various WGs of that TC.  They have
>>> started a document titled 'Terms of Reference' on which they might
>>> need feedback.
>>> This is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just a FYI.)
>>> Alex
>>> Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a =C3=A9crit :
>>>> I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D.
>>>> But, since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and Automated =
Vehicles), I think there would be advantageous to point
>>>> to particular places in the draft that make for Connected and for
>>>> Automated.
>>>> For the Connected part it is straightforward, because many =
communication protocols are referred to in the I-D.
>>>> For the Automated part, maybe the V2V use-cases described in the
>>>> I-D.
>>>> Maybe other parts of the I-D as well.
>>>> Alex
>>>> Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 09:47, Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong a =C3=A9crit :
>>>>> Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement and Use
>>>>> Cases Draft can be a good foundation for their work: =
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
> =
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19>
>>> Thanks.
>>>>> Best Regards, Paul
>>>>> On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM <housley@vigilsec.com =
<mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>> wrote:
>>>>> The ITU-R sent a liaison: =
https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/ =
<https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/>
>>>>> Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?
>>>>> Russ
>>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list =
its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org> =
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its =
<https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its>
>>>>> -- =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
>>>>> Associate Professor Department of Computer Science and Engineering =
Sungkyunkwan University Office: +82-31-299-4957 Email: =
jaehoon.paul@gmail.com <mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>,
>>>>> pauljeong@skku.edu <mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu> Personal Homepage: =
http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php =
<http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>
>>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list =
its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list
>>>> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list =
its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its


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To: Russ Housley <housley@vigilsec.com>
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References: <4725B596-F5FA-49F9-A312-BC40CD053F23@kuehlewind.net> <9af15ae85892d25b98fc6dda98a8851c@vigilsec.com> <CAPK2DexczsruB-PwP0VXk6eS89F1ZQitOEJEASB1hAraQJR8cw@mail.gmail.com> <eb8f818c-a246-099f-8de3-567bcbbc023e@gmail.com> <1c00cc5f-3b7e-ae37-6f2f-1c28f0c2d3a4@gmail.com> <0fcd17f5b58ea9249bfb97acd9894ffe@vigilsec.com> <bf630134-5830-d175-efbc-3dc330e7bc50@gmail.com> <ACC30712-CBA5-43B4-BF87-2B762894D1B5@vigilsec.com>
From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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Hi, Russ,

Indeed the scope I wrote might be well beyond the scope of the WG.  I
just listed topics concerning me now.  But I will not be responding to
ITU-R liaison, also because it seems to request material rather from
organizations.

Alex

Le 21/10/2020 à 19:56, Russ Housley a écrit :
> Alex:
> 
> This seems to be well beyond the scope of the IPWAVE WG.  Perhaps
> you should respond as an individual.
> 
> Russ
> 
> 
>> On Oct 20, 2020, at 8:22 AM, Alexandre Petrescu 
>> <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Le 17/10/2020 à 17:17, housley@vigilsec.com a écrit :
>>> Since it is from ITU-R, it is about spectrum.
>> 
>> Well, the liaison statement asks this: "Working Party 5A kindly 
>> requests the interested external organizations to provide material 
>> on the description, architecture, applications, technologies, and 
>> operational scenarios of CAVs and the radiocommunication 
>> requirements for CAVs."
>> 
>> This is a very broad request.  I think it is much more than just 
>> spectrum requirements for CAVs.  I think only their request of 
>> 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' might indeed relate to 
>> spectrum requirements.
>> 
>> With respect to 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' we
>> could list the following: - the use of the 5.9GHz band specific to
>> DSRC as used in automated vehicles.  Use IP on the control channel
>> of this band. - the use of 3.5GHz band specific to 5G as used in 
>> demonstrations of tele-operation of automated shuttle, such as the 
>> October Stockholm demonstration made by Ericsson.
>> 
>> With respect to 'description, architecture, applications, 
>> technologies and operation scenarios' we could provide a pointer
>> to the Internet Draft titled 'IPv6 Wireless Access in Vehicular 
>> Environments (IPWAVE): Problem Statement and Use Cases'.
>> 
>> With respect to just the 'operational scenarios' we can provide a 
>> few additional pointers to CAV-specific use-cases of communication 
>> technologies: - the 6G use-cases relating to vehicular networking 
>> (some such use cases are listed in the 6gip email list of IETF), - 
>> the ITU-T FG-NET2030 use-cases that relate to automated driving, - 
>> the recent ToD (Tele Operated Driving) use-case described by 5GAA.
>> 
>> An additional possibility might be to provide a list of projects 
>> involving the use of communication systems in CAVs (Connected 
>> Automated Vehicles).
>> 
>> Alex
>> 
>> 
>>> Russ On 2020-10-17 04:37, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:
>>>> (For information, the ISO TC204 'ITS' too is looking at 
>>>> creating, or enhancing, an 'ADCG' - Automated Driving Control 
>>>> Group.  It is a group trying to oversee how to bring the 
>>>> different characteristics of work related to AD into the 
>>>> various WGs of that TC.  They have started a document titled 
>>>> 'Terms of Reference' on which they might need feedback. This
>>>> is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just a FYI.) Alex
>>>> Le 17/10/2020 à 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
>>>>> I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D. But,
>>>>> since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and
>>>>> Automated Vehicles), I think there would be advantageous to
>>>>> point to particular places in the draft that make for
>>>>> Connected and for Automated. For the Connected part it is
>>>>> straightforward, because many communication protocols are
>>>>> referred to in the I-D. For the Automated part, maybe the V2V
>>>>> use-cases described in the I-D. Maybe other parts of the I-D
>>>>> as well. Alex Le 17/10/2020 à 09:47, Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong a
>>>>> écrit :
>>>>>> Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement and 
>>>>>> Use Cases Draft can be a good foundation for their work: 
>>>>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19>
>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>> Best Regards, Paul On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM 
>>>>>> <housley@vigilsec.com <mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>> wrote:
>>>>>> The ITU-R sent a liaison: 
>>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/ 
>>>>>> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/> Does anyone 
>>>>>> think that the IPWAVE WG should reply? Russ 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its
>>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org> 
>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its 
>>>>>> <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its> -- 
>>>>>> =========================== Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
>>>>>> Associate Professor Department of Computer Science and
>>>>>> Engineering Sungkyunkwan University Office: +82-31-299-4957
>>>>>> Email: jaehoon.paul@gmail.com 
>>>>>> <mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>, pauljeong@skku.edu 
>>>>>> <mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu> Personal Homepage: 
>>>>>> http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php 
>>>>>> <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php> 
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its
>>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org 
>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing 
>>>>> list its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing 
>>>> list its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
> 


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From: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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Hi, Russ,

I looked again at the liaison statement from ITU-R, and at the freely
available documents it refers to.  I read again our discussions.

I do not know how to answer best to that statement: there is no 
procedure to reply to it, nor a form at some URL, and not sure about
the individual/organization status.

However, I think the questions this liaison raises are very relevant.

Allow me to  respond to these questions here, until I can understand how 
and whether a more 'official' response is needed.

I would like to know what other participants in this group think?

 From document R-QUE-SG05.261-2019-MSW-E.doc:
> 1     What is the definition of connected automated vehicle (CAV) in 
> the context of ITS?

I think the I-D 'Vehicular Networking', the Charter and RFC 8691 do not
define the term CAV.  The Charter does mention 'connected automated
driving'.

> 2	What are the radiocommunication elements for CAVs?

A CAV embarks an Internet Protocol On-Board Unit (IP-OBU.)  Along the
road there might be IP-RSUs deployed.  The IP-OBU and IP-RSU use
communication interfaces.  These communication interfaces are at 5.9GHz
and potentially other frequency bands at PHY layer.  At networking layer
these communication interfaces use IP, as specified in RFC 8691.

> 3	What are the overall objectives and requirements for CAVs, 
> including: –	service requirements: service type, service concept, 
> grade of service;

There are numerous services for CAVs that are implemented using IP.  For
example, in platooning the steering service is used on IP between two CAVs.

> –	radiocommunication requirements: sensors, radio interfaces, data 
> rate, latency, reliability;

Data rate of IP packets on 802.11bgn OCB mode is around 16mbit/s.  The
latency is between 0.9ms and 5ms.  On 802.11ac OCB mode (probably
802.11bd) the data rate might be 1Gbit/s and latency 500microseconds.

> –	improvement factors: safety, control, energy savings, traffic 
> management, congestion control?

> 4	Which radiocommunication systems have the capabilities to support 
> CAV requirements?

802.11-OCB (OCB mode for 802.11bgn and for 802.11ac).
4G, 4G+, and 5G.

> 5	What CAV functions might benefit from spectrum harmonization?

All CAV functions that use IP might benefit from harmonization at all
layers.  At app layer, CAM messages might benefit from harmonization
with BSM messages to benefit inter-continental markets (a single
software stack).  Further, at networking layer these CAM or BSM messages
might benefit from being transmitted over IP (instead of being
transmitted without networking header when on 5.9GHz and with IP when on
5G).  Finally, on spectrum, the transmission of all V2X-specific
messages - on IP - in only a few (ideally just one) frequency band will
benefit interoperability.

> 6	What are the spectrum requirements for CAV radiocommunication 
> including: –	suitable bands;

Currently most CAVs radiocommunication used for key CAV-specific
operation are at 5.9GHz and some are at 2.6GHz (4G) and some at 3.6GHz
(5G).  However, many CAVs depend also very tightly on localization
involving GNSS systems; the reception of GNSS is around 1.2GHz including
GPS, Galileo and others.

Many CAV-related communication systems involve also IP on WiFi at
2.4GHz, at 5.4GHz and potentially others.
> –	spectrum bandwidth needed?

width of the band?  (like 10MHz?)
or bandwidth ? (like 10Mbit/s ?)

It depends.  Essentially, a CAV might function with a bandwidth
requirement very low (3G-class bandwidth of 300kbit/s) - just attach a
comma.AI-powered smartphone on the dashboard and plug it on the car's
CAN.   Other scenarios might need higher bandwidth requirements
between cars: use IP to stream lidar data between vehicles in a platoon,
or to stream video for 'see-thru'.  That bandwidth requirement is about
1Gbit/s.

 From the document R19-WP5A-C-0085!N16!MSW-E.doc:
> •	Vehicles Platooning - enables the vehicles to dynamically form a 
> group travelling together

Please note the the Internet Draft of IPWAVE WG titled "Vehicular
Networking" also defines platooning, in its section 3.1.


> Spectrum other than that previously recommended for ITS may be 
> desirable for CAV communications. For example, it may be possible 
> that platooning and/or other very close range cooperative
> maneuvering communications could best be effectively supported in EHF
> (30-300 GHz) bands. Laboratory experimentation and field test
> results becoming available during this ITU-R study period are likely
> to identify suitable frequency bands, if any, for these types of 
> communication, which could be specifically used for CAV use cases.

For my part, the experimentations of platooning that I am aware of run
on IP at 5.9GHz.

In order to consider platooning with IP at other frequency bands
(30-300GHz) there is a need for such devices to appear cheaply on the
market, and a need for the 5.9GHz to exhibit overcrowdedness, a need for
codecs to reach limits in providing the necessary bandwidth.

Personally, I am not aware of cheap interfaces in a band somewhere
between 30GHz and 300GHz, but I wonder whether they exist.

The overcrowdedness at 5.9GHz: currently I think too few 5.9GHz
deployments exist to consider them overcrowded.  There are much less
5.9GHz IP-RSUs than there are 2.4GHz Access Points for WiFi, for examle.

The bandwidth requirements: currently bands of 10MHz width in the 5.9GHz
range could be grouped together (maybe into 20MHz or 40MHz bands) such
that the codecs achieve bandwidths of aprroximately 10Gbit/s, in theory.
  If that is not possible because the bands are already reserved for
particular uses, then it would be good to find a new space for such
bands beyond 5.9GHz.  I wonder whether there could be some place found
for this somewhere between 5.9GHz and 30GHz.

Finally, in addition to platooning, I would like to mention a relevant
CAV use case that will  almost certainly need IP and IPv6 in particular.
  The TOD (tele-operated driving, a definition by 5GAA) is a low latency
guaranteed delivery use-case where a vehicle is controlled by an
operator in a control center, or by law enforcement or by the car owner
('call my car').  The controller sends commands to the car and receives
video on a feedback.  In this use-case it is necessary to be able to
discover, identify and reach the car in a scalable manner; the large
IPv6 address space can ensure that is possible  (with IPv4 is not possible).

Alex



Le 21/10/2020 à 21:55, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
> Hi, Russ,
> 
> Indeed the scope I wrote might be well beyond the scope of the WG. I
> just listed topics concerning me now.  But I will not be responding 
> to ITU-R liaison, also because it seems to request material rather 
> from organizations.
> 
> Alex
> 
> Le 21/10/2020 à 19:56, Russ Housley a écrit :
>> Alex:
>> 
>> This seems to be well beyond the scope of the IPWAVE WG.  Perhaps 
>> you should respond as an individual.
>> 
>> Russ
>> 
>> 
>>> On Oct 20, 2020, at 8:22 AM, Alexandre Petrescu 
>>> <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Le 17/10/2020 à 17:17, housley@vigilsec.com a écrit :
>>>> Since it is from ITU-R, it is about spectrum.
>>> 
>>> Well, the liaison statement asks this: "Working Party 5A kindly 
>>> requests the interested external organizations to provide 
>>> material on the description, architecture, applications, 
>>> technologies, and operational scenarios of CAVs and the 
>>> radiocommunication requirements for CAVs."
>>> 
>>> This is a very broad request.  I think it is much more than just 
>>> spectrum requirements for CAVs.  I think only their request of 
>>> 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' might indeed relate
>>> to spectrum requirements.
>>> 
>>> With respect to 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' we 
>>> could list the following: - the use of the 5.9GHz band specific 
>>> to DSRC as used in automated vehicles.  Use IP on the control 
>>> channel of this band. - the use of 3.5GHz band specific to 5G as 
>>> used in demonstrations of tele-operation of automated shuttle, 
>>> such as the October Stockholm demonstration made by Ericsson.
>>> 
>>> With respect to 'description, architecture, applications, 
>>> technologies and operation scenarios' we could provide a pointer
>>>  to the Internet Draft titled 'IPv6 Wireless Access in Vehicular
>>>  Environments (IPWAVE): Problem Statement and Use Cases'.
>>> 
>>> With respect to just the 'operational scenarios' we can provide
>>> a few additional pointers to CAV-specific use-cases of 
>>> communication technologies: - the 6G use-cases relating to 
>>> vehicular networking (some such use cases are listed in the 6gip 
>>> email list of IETF), - the ITU-T FG-NET2030 use-cases that
>>> relate to automated driving, - the recent ToD (Tele Operated
>>> Driving) use-case described by 5GAA.
>>> 
>>> An additional possibility might be to provide a list of projects 
>>> involving the use of communication systems in CAVs (Connected 
>>> Automated Vehicles).
>>> 
>>> Alex
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> Russ On 2020-10-17 04:37, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:
>>>>> (For information, the ISO TC204 'ITS' too is looking at 
>>>>> creating, or enhancing, an 'ADCG' - Automated Driving
>>>>> Control Group.  It is a group trying to oversee how to bring
>>>>> the different characteristics of work related to AD into the 
>>>>> various WGs of that TC.  They have started a document titled 
>>>>> 'Terms of Reference' on which they might need feedback. This
>>>>>  is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just a FYI.) Alex
>>>>>  Le 17/10/2020 à 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a écrit :
>>>>>> I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D. But, 
>>>>>> since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and 
>>>>>> Automated Vehicles), I think there would be advantageous to
>>>>>> point to particular places in the draft that make for 
>>>>>> Connected and for Automated. For the Connected part it is 
>>>>>> straightforward, because many communication protocols are 
>>>>>> referred to in the I-D. For the Automated part, maybe the 
>>>>>> V2V use-cases described in the I-D. Maybe other parts of 
>>>>>> the I-D as well. Alex Le 17/10/2020 à 09:47, Mr. Jaehoon 
>>>>>> Paul Jeong a écrit :
>>>>>>> Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement 
>>>>>>> and Use Cases Draft can be a good foundation for their 
>>>>>>> work: 
>>>>>>> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
> <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19>
>>>>>
>
> 
Thanks.
>>>>>>> Best Regards, Paul On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM 
>>>>>>> <housley@vigilsec.com <mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>> 
>>>>>>> wrote: The ITU-R sent a liaison: 
>>>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/ 
>>>>>>> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/> Does anyone 
>>>>>>> think that the IPWAVE WG should reply? Russ 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its 
>>>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org> 
>>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its 
>>>>>>> <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its> -- 
>>>>>>> =========================== Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, 
>>>>>>> Ph.D. Associate Professor Department of Computer Science 
>>>>>>> and Engineering Sungkyunkwan University Office: 
>>>>>>> +82-31-299-4957 Email: jaehoon.paul@gmail.com 
>>>>>>> <mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>, pauljeong@skku.edu 
>>>>>>> <mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu> Personal Homepage: 
>>>>>>> http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php 
>>>>>>> <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php> 
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its 
>>>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org 
>>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its
>>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org 
>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing 
>>>>> list its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>> 
> 
> _______________________________________________ its mailing list 
> its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its


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From: "Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong" <jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2020 21:32:50 +0900
Message-ID: <CAPK2Dez+PFoNEKY1d2fFLRd0dLfkaEmV2abXO5VJ0+qf3y1NBw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
Cc: its@ietf.org, skku-iotlab-members <skku-iotlab-members@googlegroups.com>,  "Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong" <jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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Hi Alex,
Thanks for your informative answers.

Russ,
you can decide whether to provide some of Alex's answers for ITU-R or not.

Thanks.

Best Regards,
Paul


On Thu, Oct 22, 2020 at 6:53 PM Alexandre Petrescu <
alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi, Russ,
>
> I looked again at the liaison statement from ITU-R, and at the freely
> available documents it refers to.  I read again our discussions.
>
> I do not know how to answer best to that statement: there is no
> procedure to reply to it, nor a form at some URL, and not sure about
> the individual/organization status.
>
> However, I think the questions this liaison raises are very relevant.
>
> Allow me to  respond to these questions here, until I can understand how
> and whether a more 'official' response is needed.
>
> I would like to know what other participants in this group think?
>
>  From document R-QUE-SG05.261-2019-MSW-E.doc:
> > 1     What is the definition of connected automated vehicle (CAV) in
> > the context of ITS?
>
> I think the I-D 'Vehicular Networking', the Charter and RFC 8691 do not
> define the term CAV.  The Charter does mention 'connected automated
> driving'.
>
> > 2     What are the radiocommunication elements for CAVs?
>
> A CAV embarks an Internet Protocol On-Board Unit (IP-OBU.)  Along the
> road there might be IP-RSUs deployed.  The IP-OBU and IP-RSU use
> communication interfaces.  These communication interfaces are at 5.9GHz
> and potentially other frequency bands at PHY layer.  At networking layer
> these communication interfaces use IP, as specified in RFC 8691.
>
> > 3     What are the overall objectives and requirements for CAVs,
> > including: =E2=80=93  service requirements: service type, service conce=
pt,
> > grade of service;
>
> There are numerous services for CAVs that are implemented using IP.  For
> example, in platooning the steering service is used on IP between two CAV=
s.
>
> > =E2=80=93     radiocommunication requirements: sensors, radio interface=
s, data
> > rate, latency, reliability;
>
> Data rate of IP packets on 802.11bgn OCB mode is around 16mbit/s.  The
> latency is between 0.9ms and 5ms.  On 802.11ac OCB mode (probably
> 802.11bd) the data rate might be 1Gbit/s and latency 500microseconds.
>
> > =E2=80=93     improvement factors: safety, control, energy savings, tra=
ffic
> > management, congestion control?
>
> > 4     Which radiocommunication systems have the capabilities to support
> > CAV requirements?
>
> 802.11-OCB (OCB mode for 802.11bgn and for 802.11ac).
> 4G, 4G+, and 5G.
>
> > 5     What CAV functions might benefit from spectrum harmonization?
>
> All CAV functions that use IP might benefit from harmonization at all
> layers.  At app layer, CAM messages might benefit from harmonization
> with BSM messages to benefit inter-continental markets (a single
> software stack).  Further, at networking layer these CAM or BSM messages
> might benefit from being transmitted over IP (instead of being
> transmitted without networking header when on 5.9GHz and with IP when on
> 5G).  Finally, on spectrum, the transmission of all V2X-specific
> messages - on IP - in only a few (ideally just one) frequency band will
> benefit interoperability.
>
> > 6     What are the spectrum requirements for CAV radiocommunication
> > including: =E2=80=93  suitable bands;
>
> Currently most CAVs radiocommunication used for key CAV-specific
> operation are at 5.9GHz and some are at 2.6GHz (4G) and some at 3.6GHz
> (5G).  However, many CAVs depend also very tightly on localization
> involving GNSS systems; the reception of GNSS is around 1.2GHz including
> GPS, Galileo and others.
>
> Many CAV-related communication systems involve also IP on WiFi at
> 2.4GHz, at 5.4GHz and potentially others.
> > =E2=80=93     spectrum bandwidth needed?
>
> width of the band?  (like 10MHz?)
> or bandwidth ? (like 10Mbit/s ?)
>
> It depends.  Essentially, a CAV might function with a bandwidth
> requirement very low (3G-class bandwidth of 300kbit/s) - just attach a
> comma.AI-powered smartphone on the dashboard and plug it on the car's
> CAN.   Other scenarios might need higher bandwidth requirements
> between cars: use IP to stream lidar data between vehicles in a platoon,
> or to stream video for 'see-thru'.  That bandwidth requirement is about
> 1Gbit/s.
>
>  From the document R19-WP5A-C-0085!N16!MSW-E.doc:
> > =E2=80=A2     Vehicles Platooning - enables the vehicles to dynamically=
 form a
> > group travelling together
>
> Please note the the Internet Draft of IPWAVE WG titled "Vehicular
> Networking" also defines platooning, in its section 3.1.
>
>
> > Spectrum other than that previously recommended for ITS may be
> > desirable for CAV communications. For example, it may be possible
> > that platooning and/or other very close range cooperative
> > maneuvering communications could best be effectively supported in EHF
> > (30-300 GHz) bands. Laboratory experimentation and field test
> > results becoming available during this ITU-R study period are likely
> > to identify suitable frequency bands, if any, for these types of
> > communication, which could be specifically used for CAV use cases.
>
> For my part, the experimentations of platooning that I am aware of run
> on IP at 5.9GHz.
>
> In order to consider platooning with IP at other frequency bands
> (30-300GHz) there is a need for such devices to appear cheaply on the
> market, and a need for the 5.9GHz to exhibit overcrowdedness, a need for
> codecs to reach limits in providing the necessary bandwidth.
>
> Personally, I am not aware of cheap interfaces in a band somewhere
> between 30GHz and 300GHz, but I wonder whether they exist.
>
> The overcrowdedness at 5.9GHz: currently I think too few 5.9GHz
> deployments exist to consider them overcrowded.  There are much less
> 5.9GHz IP-RSUs than there are 2.4GHz Access Points for WiFi, for examle.
>
> The bandwidth requirements: currently bands of 10MHz width in the 5.9GHz
> range could be grouped together (maybe into 20MHz or 40MHz bands) such
> that the codecs achieve bandwidths of aprroximately 10Gbit/s, in theory.
>   If that is not possible because the bands are already reserved for
> particular uses, then it would be good to find a new space for such
> bands beyond 5.9GHz.  I wonder whether there could be some place found
> for this somewhere between 5.9GHz and 30GHz.
>
> Finally, in addition to platooning, I would like to mention a relevant
> CAV use case that will  almost certainly need IP and IPv6 in particular.
>   The TOD (tele-operated driving, a definition by 5GAA) is a low latency
> guaranteed delivery use-case where a vehicle is controlled by an
> operator in a control center, or by law enforcement or by the car owner
> ('call my car').  The controller sends commands to the car and receives
> video on a feedback.  In this use-case it is necessary to be able to
> discover, identify and reach the car in a scalable manner; the large
> IPv6 address space can ensure that is possible  (with IPv4 is not
> possible).
>
> Alex
>
>
>
> Le 21/10/2020 =C3=A0 21:55, Alexandre Petrescu a =C3=A9crit :
> > Hi, Russ,
> >
> > Indeed the scope I wrote might be well beyond the scope of the WG. I
> > just listed topics concerning me now.  But I will not be responding
> > to ITU-R liaison, also because it seems to request material rather
> > from organizations.
> >
> > Alex
> >
> > Le 21/10/2020 =C3=A0 19:56, Russ Housley a =C3=A9crit :
> >> Alex:
> >>
> >> This seems to be well beyond the scope of the IPWAVE WG.  Perhaps
> >> you should respond as an individual.
> >>
> >> Russ
> >>
> >>
> >>> On Oct 20, 2020, at 8:22 AM, Alexandre Petrescu
> >>> <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 17:17, housley@vigilsec.com a =C3=A9crit :
> >>>> Since it is from ITU-R, it is about spectrum.
> >>>
> >>> Well, the liaison statement asks this: "Working Party 5A kindly
> >>> requests the interested external organizations to provide
> >>> material on the description, architecture, applications,
> >>> technologies, and operational scenarios of CAVs and the
> >>> radiocommunication requirements for CAVs."
> >>>
> >>> This is a very broad request.  I think it is much more than just
> >>> spectrum requirements for CAVs.  I think only their request of
> >>> 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' might indeed relate
> >>> to spectrum requirements.
> >>>
> >>> With respect to 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' we
> >>> could list the following: - the use of the 5.9GHz band specific
> >>> to DSRC as used in automated vehicles.  Use IP on the control
> >>> channel of this band. - the use of 3.5GHz band specific to 5G as
> >>> used in demonstrations of tele-operation of automated shuttle,
> >>> such as the October Stockholm demonstration made by Ericsson.
> >>>
> >>> With respect to 'description, architecture, applications,
> >>> technologies and operation scenarios' we could provide a pointer
> >>>  to the Internet Draft titled 'IPv6 Wireless Access in Vehicular
> >>>  Environments (IPWAVE): Problem Statement and Use Cases'.
> >>>
> >>> With respect to just the 'operational scenarios' we can provide
> >>> a few additional pointers to CAV-specific use-cases of
> >>> communication technologies: - the 6G use-cases relating to
> >>> vehicular networking (some such use cases are listed in the 6gip
> >>> email list of IETF), - the ITU-T FG-NET2030 use-cases that
> >>> relate to automated driving, - the recent ToD (Tele Operated
> >>> Driving) use-case described by 5GAA.
> >>>
> >>> An additional possibility might be to provide a list of projects
> >>> involving the use of communication systems in CAVs (Connected
> >>> Automated Vehicles).
> >>>
> >>> Alex
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> Russ On 2020-10-17 04:37, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:
> >>>>> (For information, the ISO TC204 'ITS' too is looking at
> >>>>> creating, or enhancing, an 'ADCG' - Automated Driving
> >>>>> Control Group.  It is a group trying to oversee how to bring
> >>>>> the different characteristics of work related to AD into the
> >>>>> various WGs of that TC.  They have started a document titled
> >>>>> 'Terms of Reference' on which they might need feedback. This
> >>>>>  is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just a FYI.) Alex
> >>>>>  Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a =C3=A9crit :
> >>>>>> I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D. But,
> >>>>>> since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and
> >>>>>> Automated Vehicles), I think there would be advantageous to
> >>>>>> point to particular places in the draft that make for
> >>>>>> Connected and for Automated. For the Connected part it is
> >>>>>> straightforward, because many communication protocols are
> >>>>>> referred to in the I-D. For the Automated part, maybe the
> >>>>>> V2V use-cases described in the I-D. Maybe other parts of
> >>>>>> the I-D as well. Alex Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 09:47, Mr. Jaehoon
> >>>>>> Paul Jeong a =C3=A9crit :
> >>>>>>> Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement
> >>>>>>> and Use Cases Draft can be a good foundation for their
> >>>>>>> work:
> >>>>>>>
> https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> > <https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19>
> >>>>>
> >
> >
> Thanks.
> >>>>>>> Best Regards, Paul On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM
> >>>>>>> <housley@vigilsec.com <mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>>
> >>>>>>> wrote: The ITU-R sent a liaison:
> >>>>>>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/
> >>>>>>> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/> Does anyone
> >>>>>>> think that the IPWAVE WG should reply? Russ
> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its
> >>>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org>
> >>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
> >>>>>>> <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its> --
> >>>>>>> =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong,
> >>>>>>> Ph.D. Associate Professor Department of Computer Science
> >>>>>>> and Engineering Sungkyunkwan University Office:
> >>>>>>> +82-31-299-4957 Email: jaehoon.paul@gmail.com
> >>>>>>> <mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com>, pauljeong@skku.edu
> >>>>>>> <mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu> Personal Homepage:
> >>>>>>> http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php
> >>>>>>> <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>
> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its
> >>>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org
> >>>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ its
> >>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org
> >>>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
> >>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing
> >>>>> list its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________ its mailing list
> > its@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>
> _______________________________________________
> its mailing list
> its@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>


--=20
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=3D=3D
Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
Associate Professor
Department of Computer Science and Engineering
Sungkyunkwan University
Office: +82-31-299-4957
Email: jaehoon.paul@gmail.com, pauljeong@skku.edu
Personal Homepage: http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php
<http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>

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<div dir=3D"ltr">Hi Alex,<div>Thanks for your informative answers.</div><di=
v><br></div><div>Russ,</div><div>you can decide whether to provide some of =
Alex&#39;s answers for ITU-R or not.</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks.</div>=
<div><br></div><div>Best Regards,</div><div>Paul</div><div><br></div></div>=
<br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Thu=
, Oct 22, 2020 at 6:53 PM Alexandre Petrescu &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:alexandr=
e.petrescu@gmail.com">alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div>=
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-=
left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Hi, Russ,<br>
<br>
I looked again at the liaison statement from ITU-R, and at the freely<br>
available documents it refers to.=C2=A0 I read again our discussions.<br>
<br>
I do not know how to answer best to that statement: there is no <br>
procedure to reply to it, nor a form at some URL, and not sure about<br>
the individual/organization status.<br>
<br>
However, I think the questions this liaison raises are very relevant.<br>
<br>
Allow me to=C2=A0 respond to these questions here, until I can understand h=
ow <br>
and whether a more &#39;official&#39; response is needed.<br>
<br>
I would like to know what other participants in this group think?<br>
<br>
=C2=A0From document R-QUE-SG05.261-2019-MSW-E.doc:<br>
&gt; 1=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0What is the definition of connected automated veh=
icle (CAV) in <br>
&gt; the context of ITS?<br>
<br>
I think the I-D &#39;Vehicular Networking&#39;, the Charter and RFC 8691 do=
 not<br>
define the term CAV.=C2=A0 The Charter does mention &#39;connected automate=
d<br>
driving&#39;.<br>
<br>
&gt; 2=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0What are the radiocommunication elements for CAVs=
?<br>
<br>
A CAV embarks an Internet Protocol On-Board Unit (IP-OBU.)=C2=A0 Along the<=
br>
road there might be IP-RSUs deployed.=C2=A0 The IP-OBU and IP-RSU use<br>
communication interfaces.=C2=A0 These communication interfaces are at 5.9GH=
z<br>
and potentially other frequency bands at PHY layer.=C2=A0 At networking lay=
er<br>
these communication interfaces use IP, as specified in RFC 8691.<br>
<br>
&gt; 3=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0What are the overall objectives and requirements =
for CAVs, <br>
&gt; including: =E2=80=93=C2=A0 service requirements: service type, service=
 concept, <br>
&gt; grade of service;<br>
<br>
There are numerous services for CAVs that are implemented using IP.=C2=A0 F=
or<br>
example, in platooning the steering service is used on IP between two CAVs.=
<br>
<br>
&gt; =E2=80=93=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0radiocommunication requirements: sensors,=
 radio interfaces, data <br>
&gt; rate, latency, reliability;<br>
<br>
Data rate of IP packets on 802.11bgn OCB mode is around 16mbit/s.=C2=A0 The=
<br>
latency is between 0.9ms and 5ms.=C2=A0 On 802.11ac OCB mode (probably<br>
802.11bd) the data rate might be 1Gbit/s and latency 500microseconds.<br>
<br>
&gt; =E2=80=93=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0improvement factors: safety, control, ene=
rgy savings, traffic <br>
&gt; management, congestion control?<br>
<br>
&gt; 4=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Which radiocommunication systems have the capabil=
ities to support <br>
&gt; CAV requirements?<br>
<br>
802.11-OCB (OCB mode for 802.11bgn and for 802.11ac).<br>
4G, 4G+, and 5G.<br>
<br>
&gt; 5=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0What CAV functions might benefit from spectrum ha=
rmonization?<br>
<br>
All CAV functions that use IP might benefit from harmonization at all<br>
layers.=C2=A0 At app layer, CAM messages might benefit from harmonization<b=
r>
with BSM messages to benefit inter-continental markets (a single<br>
software stack).=C2=A0 Further, at networking layer these CAM or BSM messag=
es<br>
might benefit from being transmitted over IP (instead of being<br>
transmitted without networking header when on 5.9GHz and with IP when on<br=
>
5G).=C2=A0 Finally, on spectrum, the transmission of all V2X-specific<br>
messages - on IP - in only a few (ideally just one) frequency band will<br>
benefit interoperability.<br>
<br>
&gt; 6=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0What are the spectrum requirements for CAV radioc=
ommunication <br>
&gt; including: =E2=80=93=C2=A0 suitable bands;<br>
<br>
Currently most CAVs radiocommunication used for key CAV-specific<br>
operation are at 5.9GHz and some are at 2.6GHz (4G) and some at 3.6GHz<br>
(5G).=C2=A0 However, many CAVs depend also very tightly on localization<br>
involving GNSS systems; the reception of GNSS is around 1.2GHz including<br=
>
GPS, Galileo and others.<br>
<br>
Many CAV-related communication systems involve also IP on WiFi at<br>
2.4GHz, at 5.4GHz and potentially others.<br>
&gt; =E2=80=93=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0spectrum bandwidth needed?<br>
<br>
width of the band?=C2=A0 (like 10MHz?)<br>
or bandwidth ? (like 10Mbit/s ?)<br>
<br>
It depends.=C2=A0 Essentially, a CAV might function with a bandwidth<br>
requirement very low (3G-class bandwidth of 300kbit/s) - just attach a<br>
comma.AI-powered smartphone on the dashboard and plug it on the car&#39;s<b=
r>
CAN.=C2=A0 =C2=A0Other scenarios might need higher bandwidth requirements<b=
r>
between cars: use IP to stream lidar data between vehicles in a platoon,<br=
>
or to stream video for &#39;see-thru&#39;.=C2=A0 That bandwidth requirement=
 is about<br>
1Gbit/s.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0From the document R19-WP5A-C-0085!N16!MSW-E.doc:<br>
&gt; =E2=80=A2=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Vehicles Platooning - enables the vehicle=
s to dynamically form a <br>
&gt; group travelling together<br>
<br>
Please note the the Internet Draft of IPWAVE WG titled &quot;Vehicular<br>
Networking&quot; also defines platooning, in its section 3.1.<br>
<br>
<br>
&gt; Spectrum other than that previously recommended for ITS may be <br>
&gt; desirable for CAV communications. For example, it may be possible <br>
&gt; that platooning and/or other very close range cooperative<br>
&gt; maneuvering communications could best be effectively supported in EHF<=
br>
&gt; (30-300 GHz) bands. Laboratory experimentation and field test<br>
&gt; results becoming available during this ITU-R study period are likely<b=
r>
&gt; to identify suitable frequency bands, if any, for these types of <br>
&gt; communication, which could be specifically used for CAV use cases.<br>
<br>
For my part, the experimentations of platooning that I am aware of run<br>
on IP at 5.9GHz.<br>
<br>
In order to consider platooning with IP at other frequency bands<br>
(30-300GHz) there is a need for such devices to appear cheaply on the<br>
market, and a need for the 5.9GHz to exhibit overcrowdedness, a need for<br=
>
codecs to reach limits in providing the necessary bandwidth.<br>
<br>
Personally, I am not aware of cheap interfaces in a band somewhere<br>
between 30GHz and 300GHz, but I wonder whether they exist.<br>
<br>
The overcrowdedness at 5.9GHz: currently I think too few 5.9GHz<br>
deployments exist to consider them overcrowded.=C2=A0 There are much less<b=
r>
5.9GHz IP-RSUs than there are 2.4GHz Access Points for WiFi, for examle.<br=
>
<br>
The bandwidth requirements: currently bands of 10MHz width in the 5.9GHz<br=
>
range could be grouped together (maybe into 20MHz or 40MHz bands) such<br>
that the codecs achieve bandwidths of aprroximately 10Gbit/s, in theory.<br=
>
=C2=A0 If that is not possible because the bands are already reserved for<b=
r>
particular uses, then it would be good to find a new space for such<br>
bands beyond 5.9GHz.=C2=A0 I wonder whether there could be some place found=
<br>
for this somewhere between 5.9GHz and 30GHz.<br>
<br>
Finally, in addition to platooning, I would like to mention a relevant<br>
CAV use case that will=C2=A0 almost certainly need IP and IPv6 in particula=
r.<br>
=C2=A0 The TOD (tele-operated driving, a definition by 5GAA) is a low laten=
cy<br>
guaranteed delivery use-case where a vehicle is controlled by an<br>
operator in a control center, or by law enforcement or by the car owner<br>
(&#39;call my car&#39;).=C2=A0 The controller sends commands to the car and=
 receives<br>
video on a feedback.=C2=A0 In this use-case it is necessary to be able to<b=
r>
discover, identify and reach the car in a scalable manner; the large<br>
IPv6 address space can ensure that is possible=C2=A0 (with IPv4 is not poss=
ible).<br>
<br>
Alex<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
Le 21/10/2020 =C3=A0 21:55, Alexandre Petrescu a =C3=A9crit :<br>
&gt; Hi, Russ,<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Indeed the scope I wrote might be well beyond the scope of the WG. I<b=
r>
&gt; just listed topics concerning me now.=C2=A0 But I will not be respondi=
ng <br>
&gt; to ITU-R liaison, also because it seems to request material rather <br=
>
&gt; from organizations.<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Alex<br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; Le 21/10/2020 =C3=A0 19:56, Russ Housley a =C3=A9crit :<br>
&gt;&gt; Alex:<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; This seems to be well beyond the scope of the IPWAVE WG.=C2=A0 Per=
haps <br>
&gt;&gt; you should respond as an individual.<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; Russ<br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; On Oct 20, 2020, at 8:22 AM, Alexandre Petrescu <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com" target=3D"=
_blank">alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 17:17, <a href=3D"mailto:housley@vigilsec=
.com" target=3D"_blank">housley@vigilsec.com</a> a =C3=A9crit :<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Since it is from ITU-R, it is about spectrum.<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; Well, the liaison statement asks this: &quot;Working Party 5A =
kindly <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; requests the interested external organizations to provide <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; material on the description, architecture, applications, <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; technologies, and operational scenarios of CAVs and the <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; radiocommunication requirements for CAVs.&quot;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; This is a very broad request.=C2=A0 I think it is much more th=
an just <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; spectrum requirements for CAVs.=C2=A0 I think only their reque=
st of <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; &#39;radiocommunication requirements for CAVs&#39; might indee=
d relate<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; to spectrum requirements.<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; With respect to &#39;radiocommunication requirements for CAVs&=
#39; we <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; could list the following: - the use of the 5.9GHz band specifi=
c <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; to DSRC as used in automated vehicles.=C2=A0 Use IP on the con=
trol <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; channel of this band. - the use of 3.5GHz band specific to 5G =
as <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; used in demonstrations of tele-operation of automated shuttle,=
 <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; such as the October Stockholm demonstration made by Ericsson.<=
br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; With respect to &#39;description, architecture, applications, =
<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; technologies and operation scenarios&#39; we could provide a p=
ointer<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 to the Internet Draft titled &#39;IPv6 Wireless Access i=
n Vehicular<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 Environments (IPWAVE): Problem Statement and Use Cases&#=
39;.<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; With respect to just the &#39;operational scenarios&#39; we ca=
n provide<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; a few additional pointers to CAV-specific use-cases of <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; communication technologies: - the 6G use-cases relating to <br=
>
&gt;&gt;&gt; vehicular networking (some such use cases are listed in the 6g=
ip <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; email list of IETF), - the ITU-T FG-NET2030 use-cases that<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; relate to automated driving, - the recent ToD (Tele Operated<b=
r>
&gt;&gt;&gt; Driving) use-case described by 5GAA.<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; An additional possibility might be to provide a list of projec=
ts <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; involving the use of communication systems in CAVs (Connected =
<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; Automated Vehicles).<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; Alex<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Russ On 2020-10-17 04:37, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; (For information, the ISO TC204 &#39;ITS&#39; too is l=
ooking at <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; creating, or enhancing, an &#39;ADCG&#39; - Automated =
Driving<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Control Group.=C2=A0 It is a group trying to oversee h=
ow to bring<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; the different characteristics of work related to AD in=
to the <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; various WGs of that TC.=C2=A0 They have started a docu=
ment titled <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; &#39;Terms of Reference&#39; on which they might need =
feedback. This<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just =
a FYI.) Alex<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;=C2=A0 Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a=
 =C3=A9crit :<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D.=
 But, <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; since the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected an=
d <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Automated Vehicles), I think there would be advant=
ageous to<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; point to particular places in the draft that make =
for <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Connected and for Automated. For the Connected par=
t it is <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; straightforward, because many communication protoc=
ols are <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; referred to in the I-D. For the Automated part, ma=
ybe the <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; V2V use-cases described in the I-D. Maybe other pa=
rts of <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; the I-D as well. Alex Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 09:47, =
Mr. Jaehoon <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Paul Jeong a =C3=A9crit :<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem S=
tatement <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; and Use Cases Draft can be a good foundation f=
or their <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; work: <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-i=
etf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tps://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19</a><br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt; &lt;<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular=
-networking-19" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org=
/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19</a>&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;<br>
&gt; <br>
Thanks.<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Best Regards, Paul On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:0=
5 AM <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:housley@vigilsec.com" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">housley@vigilsec.com</a> &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:housl=
ey@vigilsec.com" target=3D"_blank">housley@vigilsec.com</a>&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; wrote: The ITU-R sent a liaison: <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaiso=
n/1686/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/=
liaison/1686/</a> <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt;<a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/li=
aison/1686/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.=
org/liaison/1686/</a>&gt; Does anyone <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; think that the IPWAVE WG should reply? Russ <b=
r>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; ______________________________________________=
_ its <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; mailing list <a href=3D"mailto:its@ietf.org" t=
arget=3D"_blank">its@ietf.org</a> &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:its@ietf.org=
" target=3D"_blank">its@ietf.org</a>&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listin=
fo/its" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/l=
istinfo/its</a> <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt;<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/li=
stinfo/its" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailm=
an/listinfo/its</a>&gt; -- <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Ph.D. Associate Professor Department of Comput=
er Science <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; and Engineering Sungkyunkwan University Office=
: <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; +82-31-299-4957 Email: <a href=3D"mailto:jaeho=
on.paul@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jaehoon.paul@gmail.com</a> <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmai=
l.com" target=3D"_blank">jaehoon.paul@gmail.com</a>&gt;, <a href=3D"mailto:=
pauljeong@skku.edu" target=3D"_blank">pauljeong@skku.edu</a> <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt;mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:pauljeong@skku.ed=
u" target=3D"_blank">pauljeong@skku.edu</a>&gt; Personal Homepage: <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; <a href=3D"http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaeho=
on-jeong.php" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://iotlab.skku.edu/p=
eople-jaehoon-jeong.php</a> <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt;<a href=3D"http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-j=
aehoon-jeong.php" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">http://cpslab.skku.e=
du/people-jaehoon-jeong.php</a>&gt; <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; ______________________________________________=
_ its <br>
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ts" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listi=
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&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; _______________________________________________ its ma=
iling <br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; list <a href=3D"mailto:its@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>its@ietf.org</a> <a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its" rel=
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</a><br>
&gt;&gt; <br>
&gt; <br>
&gt; _______________________________________________ its mailing list <br>
&gt; <a href=3D"mailto:its@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">its@ietf.org</a> <a =
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<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
its mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:its@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">its@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its" rel=3D"noreferrer" ta=
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</blockquote></div><br clear=3D"all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir=3D"ltr"=
 class=3D"gmail_signature"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div=
 dir=3D"ltr"><div><div dir=3D"ltr">=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D<br>Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.=
D.<br>Associate Professor<br>Department of Computer Science and Engineering=
<br>Sungkyunkwan University<br>Office: +82-31-299-4957<br>Email: <a href=3D=
"mailto:jaehoon.paul@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jaehoon.paul@gmail.com</a=
>,=C2=A0<a href=3D"mailto:pauljeong@skku.edu" style=3D"font-size:12.8px" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">pauljeong@skku.edu</a><br>Personal Homepage: <a href=3D"htt=
p://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php" target=3D"_blank">http://iotl=
ab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php</a><br></div></div></div></div></div><=
/div></div></div>

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From: Russ Housley <housley@vigilsec.com>
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To: Alexandre Petrescu <alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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Alex, you have certainly done your homework.  Thanks for putting in the =
effort.  That said, I am quite reluctant to speak to the ITU-R as the =
IETF IPWAVE WG with only two people offering a point of view.  More =
people need to speak up if we are going to make a formal response.

Russ


> On Oct 22, 2020, at 5:52 AM, Alexandre Petrescu =
<alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> Hi, Russ,
>=20
> I looked again at the liaison statement from ITU-R, and at the freely
> available documents it refers to.  I read again our discussions.
>=20
> I do not know how to answer best to that statement: there is no =
procedure to reply to it, nor a form at some URL, and not sure about
> the individual/organization status.
>=20
> However, I think the questions this liaison raises are very relevant.
>=20
> Allow me to  respond to these questions here, until I can understand =
how and whether a more 'official' response is needed.
>=20
> I would like to know what other participants in this group think?
>=20
> =46rom document R-QUE-SG05.261-2019-MSW-E.doc:
>> 1     What is the definition of connected automated vehicle (CAV) in =
the context of ITS?
>=20
> I think the I-D 'Vehicular Networking', the Charter and RFC 8691 do =
not
> define the term CAV.  The Charter does mention 'connected automated
> driving'.
>=20
>> 2	What are the radiocommunication elements for CAVs?
>=20
> A CAV embarks an Internet Protocol On-Board Unit (IP-OBU.)  Along the
> road there might be IP-RSUs deployed.  The IP-OBU and IP-RSU use
> communication interfaces.  These communication interfaces are at =
5.9GHz
> and potentially other frequency bands at PHY layer.  At networking =
layer
> these communication interfaces use IP, as specified in RFC 8691.
>=20
>> 3	What are the overall objectives and requirements for CAVs, =
including: =E2=80=93	service requirements: service type, service =
concept, grade of service;
>=20
> There are numerous services for CAVs that are implemented using IP.  =
For
> example, in platooning the steering service is used on IP between two =
CAVs.
>=20
>> =E2=80=93	radiocommunication requirements: sensors, radio =
interfaces, data rate, latency, reliability;
>=20
> Data rate of IP packets on 802.11bgn OCB mode is around 16mbit/s.  The
> latency is between 0.9ms and 5ms.  On 802.11ac OCB mode (probably
> 802.11bd) the data rate might be 1Gbit/s and latency 500microseconds.
>=20
>> =E2=80=93	improvement factors: safety, control, energy savings, =
traffic management, congestion control?
>=20
>> 4	Which radiocommunication systems have the capabilities to =
support CAV requirements?
>=20
> 802.11-OCB (OCB mode for 802.11bgn and for 802.11ac).
> 4G, 4G+, and 5G.
>=20
>> 5	What CAV functions might benefit from spectrum harmonization?
>=20
> All CAV functions that use IP might benefit from harmonization at all
> layers.  At app layer, CAM messages might benefit from harmonization
> with BSM messages to benefit inter-continental markets (a single
> software stack).  Further, at networking layer these CAM or BSM =
messages
> might benefit from being transmitted over IP (instead of being
> transmitted without networking header when on 5.9GHz and with IP when =
on
> 5G).  Finally, on spectrum, the transmission of all V2X-specific
> messages - on IP - in only a few (ideally just one) frequency band =
will
> benefit interoperability.
>=20
>> 6	What are the spectrum requirements for CAV radiocommunication =
including: =E2=80=93	suitable bands;
>=20
> Currently most CAVs radiocommunication used for key CAV-specific
> operation are at 5.9GHz and some are at 2.6GHz (4G) and some at 3.6GHz
> (5G).  However, many CAVs depend also very tightly on localization
> involving GNSS systems; the reception of GNSS is around 1.2GHz =
including
> GPS, Galileo and others.
>=20
> Many CAV-related communication systems involve also IP on WiFi at
> 2.4GHz, at 5.4GHz and potentially others.
>> =E2=80=93	spectrum bandwidth needed?
>=20
> width of the band?  (like 10MHz?)
> or bandwidth ? (like 10Mbit/s ?)
>=20
> It depends.  Essentially, a CAV might function with a bandwidth
> requirement very low (3G-class bandwidth of 300kbit/s) - just attach a
> comma.AI-powered smartphone on the dashboard and plug it on the car's
> CAN.   Other scenarios might need higher bandwidth requirements
> between cars: use IP to stream lidar data between vehicles in a =
platoon,
> or to stream video for 'see-thru'.  That bandwidth requirement is =
about
> 1Gbit/s.
>=20
> =46rom the document R19-WP5A-C-0085!N16!MSW-E.doc:
>> =E2=80=A2	Vehicles Platooning - enables the vehicles to =
dynamically form a group travelling together
>=20
> Please note the the Internet Draft of IPWAVE WG titled "Vehicular
> Networking" also defines platooning, in its section 3.1.
>=20
>=20
>> Spectrum other than that previously recommended for ITS may be =
desirable for CAV communications. For example, it may be possible that =
platooning and/or other very close range cooperative
>> maneuvering communications could best be effectively supported in EHF
>> (30-300 GHz) bands. Laboratory experimentation and field test
>> results becoming available during this ITU-R study period are likely
>> to identify suitable frequency bands, if any, for these types of =
communication, which could be specifically used for CAV use cases.
>=20
> For my part, the experimentations of platooning that I am aware of run
> on IP at 5.9GHz.
>=20
> In order to consider platooning with IP at other frequency bands
> (30-300GHz) there is a need for such devices to appear cheaply on the
> market, and a need for the 5.9GHz to exhibit overcrowdedness, a need =
for
> codecs to reach limits in providing the necessary bandwidth.
>=20
> Personally, I am not aware of cheap interfaces in a band somewhere
> between 30GHz and 300GHz, but I wonder whether they exist.
>=20
> The overcrowdedness at 5.9GHz: currently I think too few 5.9GHz
> deployments exist to consider them overcrowded.  There are much less
> 5.9GHz IP-RSUs than there are 2.4GHz Access Points for WiFi, for =
examle.
>=20
> The bandwidth requirements: currently bands of 10MHz width in the =
5.9GHz
> range could be grouped together (maybe into 20MHz or 40MHz bands) such
> that the codecs achieve bandwidths of aprroximately 10Gbit/s, in =
theory.
> If that is not possible because the bands are already reserved for
> particular uses, then it would be good to find a new space for such
> bands beyond 5.9GHz.  I wonder whether there could be some place found
> for this somewhere between 5.9GHz and 30GHz.
>=20
> Finally, in addition to platooning, I would like to mention a relevant
> CAV use case that will  almost certainly need IP and IPv6 in =
particular.
> The TOD (tele-operated driving, a definition by 5GAA) is a low latency
> guaranteed delivery use-case where a vehicle is controlled by an
> operator in a control center, or by law enforcement or by the car =
owner
> ('call my car').  The controller sends commands to the car and =
receives
> video on a feedback.  In this use-case it is necessary to be able to
> discover, identify and reach the car in a scalable manner; the large
> IPv6 address space can ensure that is possible  (with IPv4 is not =
possible).
>=20
> Alex
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Le 21/10/2020 =C3=A0 21:55, Alexandre Petrescu a =C3=A9crit :
>> Hi, Russ,
>> Indeed the scope I wrote might be well beyond the scope of the WG. I
>> just listed topics concerning me now.  But I will not be responding =
to ITU-R liaison, also because it seems to request material rather from =
organizations.
>> Alex
>> Le 21/10/2020 =C3=A0 19:56, Russ Housley a =C3=A9crit :
>>> Alex:
>>> This seems to be well beyond the scope of the IPWAVE WG.  Perhaps =
you should respond as an individual.
>>> Russ
>>>> On Oct 20, 2020, at 8:22 AM, Alexandre Petrescu =
<alexandre.petrescu@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 17:17, housley@vigilsec.com a =C3=A9crit :
>>>>> Since it is from ITU-R, it is about spectrum.
>>>> Well, the liaison statement asks this: "Working Party 5A kindly =
requests the interested external organizations to provide material on =
the description, architecture, applications, technologies, and =
operational scenarios of CAVs and the radiocommunication requirements =
for CAVs."
>>>> This is a very broad request.  I think it is much more than just =
spectrum requirements for CAVs.  I think only their request of =
'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' might indeed relate
>>>> to spectrum requirements.
>>>> With respect to 'radiocommunication requirements for CAVs' we could =
list the following: - the use of the 5.9GHz band specific to DSRC as =
used in automated vehicles.  Use IP on the control channel of this band. =
- the use of 3.5GHz band specific to 5G as used in demonstrations of =
tele-operation of automated shuttle, such as the October Stockholm =
demonstration made by Ericsson.
>>>> With respect to 'description, architecture, applications, =
technologies and operation scenarios' we could provide a pointer
>>>> to the Internet Draft titled 'IPv6 Wireless Access in Vehicular
>>>> Environments (IPWAVE): Problem Statement and Use Cases'.
>>>> With respect to just the 'operational scenarios' we can provide
>>>> a few additional pointers to CAV-specific use-cases of =
communication technologies: - the 6G use-cases relating to vehicular =
networking (some such use cases are listed in the 6gip email list of =
IETF), - the ITU-T FG-NET2030 use-cases that
>>>> relate to automated driving, - the recent ToD (Tele Operated
>>>> Driving) use-case described by 5GAA.
>>>> An additional possibility might be to provide a list of projects =
involving the use of communication systems in CAVs (Connected Automated =
Vehicles).
>>>> Alex
>>>>> Russ On 2020-10-17 04:37, Alexandre Petrescu wrote:
>>>>>> (For information, the ISO TC204 'ITS' too is looking at creating, =
or enhancing, an 'ADCG' - Automated Driving
>>>>>> Control Group.  It is a group trying to oversee how to bring
>>>>>> the different characteristics of work related to AD into the =
various WGs of that TC.  They have started a document titled 'Terms of =
Reference' on which they might need feedback. This
>>>>>> is not a liaison statement from ISO TC204, just a FYI.) Alex
>>>>>> Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 10:31, Alexandre Petrescu a =C3=A9crit :
>>>>>>> I think too it is a good idea to point to our I-D. But, since =
the ITU-R liaison is about CAV (Connected and Automated Vehicles), I =
think there would be advantageous to
>>>>>>> point to particular places in the draft that make for Connected =
and for Automated. For the Connected part it is straightforward, because =
many communication protocols are referred to in the I-D. For the =
Automated part, maybe the V2V use-cases described in the I-D. Maybe =
other parts of the I-D as well. Alex Le 17/10/2020 =C3=A0 09:47, Mr. =
Jaehoon Paul Jeong a =C3=A9crit :
>>>>>>>> Hi Russ, We can point out our IPWAVE Problem Statement and Use =
Cases Draft can be a good foundation for their work: =
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19
>>>>>>>>=20
>> =
<https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-ipwave-vehicular-networking-19>
>>>>>>=20
>>=20
> Thanks.
>>>>>>>> Best Regards, Paul On Sat, Oct 17, 2020 at 4:05 AM =
<housley@vigilsec.com <mailto:housley@vigilsec.com>> wrote: The ITU-R =
sent a liaison: https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/ =
<https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/> Does anyone think that the =
IPWAVE WG should reply? Russ =
_______________________________________________ its mailing list =
its@ietf.org <mailto:its@ietf.org> =
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its =
<https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its> -- =
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=
=3D=3D Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D. Associate Professor Department of =
Computer Science and Engineering Sungkyunkwan University Office: =
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<http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php> =
_______________________________________________ its mailing list =
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>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its
>>>>>>> mailing list its@ietf.org =
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its
>>>>>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list =
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>> _______________________________________________ its mailing list =
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>=20
> _______________________________________________
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> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/its


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From: Russ Housley <housley@vigilsec.com>
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Subject: [ipwave] Fwd: LS: Future Technology Trends for the evolution of IMT towards 2030 and beyond
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> From: "Loewenstein, Uwe" <uwe.loewenstein@itu.int>
> Subject: LS: Future Technology Trends for the evolution of IMT towards =
2030 and beyond
> Date: October 27, 2020 at 8:25:23 AM EDT
> To: "adrian.scrase@etsi.org" <adrian.scrase@etsi.org>, =
"housley@vigilsec.com" <housley@vigilsec.com>, "Keith.Wilson@sae.org" =
<Keith.Wilson@sae.org>, "MJLynch@mjlallc.com" <MJLynch@mjlallc.com>, =
"s-nishioka@arib.or.jp" <s-nishioka@arib.or.jp>, "3GPPLiaison@etsi.org" =
<3GPPLiaison@etsi.org>, "5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org" <5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org>, =
"aguan@itsa.org" <aguan@itsa.org>, "akmittal@tsdsi.org" =
<akmittal@tsdsi.org>, "alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de" =
<alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de>, "Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org" =
<Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org>, "arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp" =
<arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp>, "aroytblat@wi-fi.org" <aroytblat@wi-fi.org>, =
"balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com" <balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com>, =
"chairman@tsdsi.in" <chairman@tsdsi.in>, "chantal.bonardi@etsi.org" =
<chantal.bonardi@etsi.org>, "ckoh@tta.or.kr" <ckoh@tta.or.kr>, =
"cpignata@cisco.com" <cpignata@cisco.com>, "dbain@tiaonline.org" =
<dbain@tiaonline.org>, "ddgstd.tec@gov.in" <ddgstd.tec@gov.in>, =
"dg@tsdsi.in" <dg@tsdsi.in>, "dominique.everaere@ericsson.com" =
<dominique.everaere@ericsson.com>, "dz1069@att.com" <dz1069@att.com>, =
"fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com" <fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com>, =
"freqmgr@ieee.org" <freqmgr@ieee.org>, =
"giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it" <giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it>, =
"Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de" <Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de>, =
"hwryu@tta.or.kr" <hwryu@tta.or.kr>, "info@multefire.org" =
<info@multefire.org>, "jayeeta@tsdsi.org" <jayeeta@tsdsi.org>, =
"jennifer.collins@sae.org" <jennifer.collins@sae.org>, =
"jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com" <jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com>, =
"Joern.Krause@etsi.org" <Joern.Krause@etsi.org>, =
"john.lewis@ties.itu.int" <john.lewis@ties.itu.int>, =
"john.meredith@etsi.org" <john.meredith@etsi.org>, =
"Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com" <Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com>, =
"jwlim@korea.kr" <jwlim@korea.kr>, "kckoo@tta.or.kr" <kckoo@tta.or.kr>, =
"kishore.ygsc@gov.in" <kishore.ygsc@gov.in>, "kjwee56@rapa.or.kr" =
<kjwee56@rapa.or.kr>, "klutto@cewit.org.in" <klutto@cewit.org.in>, =
"krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in" <krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in>, =
"lasse.wieweg@ericsson.com" <lasse.wieweg@ericsson.com>, =
"Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com" <Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com>, =
"Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at" <Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at>, =
"nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it" =
<nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it>, "npa@anemonetechnology.com" =
<npa@anemonetechnology.com>, "parvez@apt.int" <parvez@apt.int>, =
"rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in" <rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in>, "sbarclay@atis.org" =
<sbarclay@atis.org>, "srddg.tec@gov.in" <srddg.tec@gov.in>, =
"susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org" <susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org>, =
"wangzhiqin@catr.cn" <wangzhiqin@catr.cn>, "wanyi@caict.ac.cn" =
<wanyi@caict.ac.cn>, "y-kato@arib.or.jp" <y-kato@arib.or.jp>, =
"yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr" <yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr>, =
"zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn" <zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn>, "zhu.longming@zte.com.cn" =
<zhu.longming@zte.com.cn>, "zhuying@caict.ac.cn" <zhuying@caict.ac.cn>, =
"chsieh@itri.org.tw" <chsieh@itri.org.tw>
> Cc: "BLUST, STEPHEN M" <SB8927@att.com>, "Buonomo, Sergio" =
<sergio.buonomo@itu.int>
>=20
> Addressed to: 3GPP, 5G Automotive Association, 79 GHz Project, ARIB, =
ATIS, AWG, C2C CC, CCSA, CEPT ECC, C-Roads, ETSI ISG MEC, ETSI TC ERM, =
ETSI TC ITS, ETSI TC MSG, GSA, IEEE, IETF ITS, ISO TC 204, ITRI, MFA, =
SAE C-V2X TC, TEC, TIA, TSDSI, TTA, Wi-Fi Alliance
> =20
> Dear Sir/Madam,
> =20
> Please find attached a Liaison Statement from ITU-R Working Party 5D =
regarding the =E2=80=9CFuture Technology Trends for the evolution of IMT =
towards 2030 and beyond=E2=80=9D.
> =20
> The Attachment is an extract from the WP 5D Chairman=E2=80=99s Report =
(Att. 7.4 to Document 5D/360) that can be found at =
(https://www.itu.int/md/R19-WP5D-C-0360/en =
<https://www.itu.int/md/R19-WP5D-C-0360/en>) (TIES Restricted access).
> =20
> Documents mentioned in the Liaison Statement are normally publicly =
available, in case of difficulties please feel free to contact me.
> =20
> Yours Sincerely,
> Uwe
> =20
> =20
>    Uwe L=C3=96WENSTEIN
>     Counsellor for ITU-R Study Group 5 (SGD/SG5)
>     International Telecommunication Union
>     Tel: +41 22 730 6046 | Fax: +41 22 730 5806
>     Mobile: + 41 79 89 37378
>     www.itu.int <http://www.itu.int/>   uwe.loewenstein@itu.int =
<mailto:uwe.loewenstein@itu.int>
>    =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20


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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">From: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D"">"Loewenstein, Uwe" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:uwe.loewenstein@itu.int" =
class=3D"">uwe.loewenstein@itu.int</a>&gt;<br class=3D""></span></div><div=
 style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Subject: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D""><b class=3D"">LS: Future =
Technology Trends for the evolution of IMT towards 2030 and =
beyond</b><br class=3D""></span></div><div style=3D"margin-top: 0px; =
margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span=
 style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Date: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D"">October 27, 2020 at 8:25:23 AM =
EDT<br class=3D""></span></div><div style=3D"margin-top: 0px; =
margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span=
 style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">To: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D"">"<a =
href=3D"mailto:adrian.scrase@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">adrian.scrase@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:adrian.scrase@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">adrian.scrase@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:housley@vigilsec.com" class=3D"">housley@vigilsec.com</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:housley@vigilsec.com" =
class=3D"">housley@vigilsec.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Keith.Wilson@sae.org" class=3D"">Keith.Wilson@sae.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Keith.Wilson@sae.org" =
class=3D"">Keith.Wilson@sae.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:MJLynch@mjlallc.com" class=3D"">MJLynch@mjlallc.com</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:MJLynch@mjlallc.com" =
class=3D"">MJLynch@mjlallc.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:s-nishioka@arib.or.jp" =
class=3D"">s-nishioka@arib.or.jp</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:s-nishioka@arib.or.jp" =
class=3D"">s-nishioka@arib.or.jp</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:3GPPLiaison@etsi.org" class=3D"">3GPPLiaison@etsi.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:3GPPLiaison@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">3GPPLiaison@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org" =
class=3D"">5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org" =
class=3D"">5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:aguan@itsa.org" class=3D"">aguan@itsa.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:aguan@itsa.org" class=3D"">aguan@itsa.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:akmittal@tsdsi.org" class=3D"">akmittal@tsdsi.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:akmittal@tsdsi.org" =
class=3D"">akmittal@tsdsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de" =
class=3D"">alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de" =
class=3D"">alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp" class=3D"">arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp" =
class=3D"">arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:aroytblat@wi-fi.org" class=3D"">aroytblat@wi-fi.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:aroytblat@wi-fi.org" =
class=3D"">aroytblat@wi-fi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com" =
class=3D"">balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com" =
class=3D"">balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:chairman@tsdsi.in" class=3D"">chairman@tsdsi.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chairman@tsdsi.in" =
class=3D"">chairman@tsdsi.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:chantal.bonardi@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">chantal.bonardi@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:chantal.bonardi@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">chantal.bonardi@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:ckoh@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">ckoh@tta.or.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:ckoh@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">ckoh@tta.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:cpignata@cisco.com" class=3D"">cpignata@cisco.com</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cpignata@cisco.com" =
class=3D"">cpignata@cisco.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:dbain@tiaonline.org" class=3D"">dbain@tiaonline.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dbain@tiaonline.org" =
class=3D"">dbain@tiaonline.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:ddgstd.tec@gov.in" class=3D"">ddgstd.tec@gov.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ddgstd.tec@gov.in" =
class=3D"">ddgstd.tec@gov.in</a>&gt;, "<a href=3D"mailto:dg@tsdsi.in" =
class=3D"">dg@tsdsi.in</a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dg@tsdsi.in" =
class=3D"">dg@tsdsi.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:dominique.everaere@ericsson.com" =
class=3D"">dominique.everaere@ericsson.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:dominique.everaere@ericsson.com" =
class=3D"">dominique.everaere@ericsson.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:dz1069@att.com" class=3D"">dz1069@att.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:dz1069@att.com" class=3D"">dz1069@att.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com" =
class=3D"">fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com" =
class=3D"">fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:freqmgr@ieee.org" class=3D"">freqmgr@ieee.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:freqmgr@ieee.org" class=3D"">freqmgr@ieee.org</a>&gt;, =
"<a href=3D"mailto:giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it" =
class=3D"">giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it" =
class=3D"">giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de" =
class=3D"">Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de" =
class=3D"">Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:hwryu@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">hwryu@tta.or.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:hwryu@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">hwryu@tta.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:info@multefire.org" class=3D"">info@multefire.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:info@multefire.org" =
class=3D"">info@multefire.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:jayeeta@tsdsi.org" class=3D"">jayeeta@tsdsi.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jayeeta@tsdsi.org" =
class=3D"">jayeeta@tsdsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:jennifer.collins@sae.org" =
class=3D"">jennifer.collins@sae.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:jennifer.collins@sae.org" =
class=3D"">jennifer.collins@sae.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com" =
class=3D"">jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com" =
class=3D"">jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Joern.Krause@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">Joern.Krause@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Joern.Krause@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">Joern.Krause@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:john.lewis@ties.itu.int" =
class=3D"">john.lewis@ties.itu.int</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:john.lewis@ties.itu.int" =
class=3D"">john.lewis@ties.itu.int</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:john.meredith@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">john.meredith@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:john.meredith@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">john.meredith@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com" =
class=3D"">Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com" =
class=3D"">Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:jwlim@korea.kr" class=3D"">jwlim@korea.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:jwlim@korea.kr" class=3D"">jwlim@korea.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:kckoo@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">kckoo@tta.or.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:kckoo@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">kckoo@tta.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:kishore.ygsc@gov.in" class=3D"">kishore.ygsc@gov.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kishore.ygsc@gov.in" =
class=3D"">kishore.ygsc@gov.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:kjwee56@rapa.or.kr" class=3D"">kjwee56@rapa.or.kr</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kjwee56@rapa.or.kr" =
class=3D"">kjwee56@rapa.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:klutto@cewit.org.in" class=3D"">klutto@cewit.org.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:klutto@cewit.org.in" =
class=3D"">klutto@cewit.org.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in" =
class=3D"">krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in" =
class=3D"">krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:lasse.wieweg@ericsson.com" =
class=3D"">lasse.wieweg@ericsson.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:lasse.wieweg@ericsson.com" =
class=3D"">lasse.wieweg@ericsson.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com" =
class=3D"">Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com" =
class=3D"">Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at" =
class=3D"">Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at" =
class=3D"">Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it" =
class=3D"">nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it" =
class=3D"">nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:npa@anemonetechnology.com" =
class=3D"">npa@anemonetechnology.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:npa@anemonetechnology.com" =
class=3D"">npa@anemonetechnology.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:parvez@apt.int" class=3D"">parvez@apt.int</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:parvez@apt.int" class=3D"">parvez@apt.int</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in" class=3D"">rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in" =
class=3D"">rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:sbarclay@atis.org" class=3D"">sbarclay@atis.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sbarclay@atis.org" =
class=3D"">sbarclay@atis.org</a>&gt;, "<a href=3D"mailto:srddg.tec@gov.in"=
 class=3D"">srddg.tec@gov.in</a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:srddg.tec@gov.in" =
class=3D"">srddg.tec@gov.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:wangzhiqin@catr.cn" class=3D"">wangzhiqin@catr.cn</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:wangzhiqin@catr.cn" =
class=3D"">wangzhiqin@catr.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:wanyi@caict.ac.cn" class=3D"">wanyi@caict.ac.cn</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:wanyi@caict.ac.cn" =
class=3D"">wanyi@caict.ac.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:y-kato@arib.or.jp" class=3D"">y-kato@arib.or.jp</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:y-kato@arib.or.jp" =
class=3D"">y-kato@arib.or.jp</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr" =
class=3D"">yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr" =
class=3D"">yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn" class=3D"">zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn" =
class=3D"">zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:zhu.longming@zte.com.cn" =
class=3D"">zhu.longming@zte.com.cn</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:zhu.longming@zte.com.cn" =
class=3D"">zhu.longming@zte.com.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:zhuying@caict.ac.cn" class=3D"">zhuying@caict.ac.cn</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:zhuying@caict.ac.cn" =
class=3D"">zhuying@caict.ac.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:chsieh@itri.org.tw" class=3D"">chsieh@itri.org.tw</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chsieh@itri.org.tw" =
class=3D"">chsieh@itri.org.tw</a>&gt;<br class=3D""></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Cc: </b></span><span =
style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">"BLUST, STEPHEN M" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:SB8927@att.com" class=3D"">SB8927@att.com</a>&gt;, =
"Buonomo, Sergio" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sergio.buonomo@itu.int" =
class=3D"">sergio.buonomo@itu.int</a>&gt;<br class=3D""></span></div><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D"WordSection1" style=3D"page: =
WordSection1; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; =
font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: =
none;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Addressed to:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><b class=3D"">3GPP, 5G =
Automotive Association, 79 GHz Project, ARIB, ATIS, AWG, C2C CC, CCSA, =
CEPT ECC, C-Roads, ETSI ISG MEC, ETSI TC ERM, ETSI TC ITS, ETSI TC MSG, =
GSA, IEEE, IETF ITS, ISO TC 204, ITRI, MFA, SAE C-V2X TC, TEC, TIA, =
TSDSI, TTA, Wi-Fi Alliance<o:p class=3D""></o:p></b></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Dear Sir/Madam,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Please find attached a Liaison Statement from ITU-R Working =
Party 5D regarding the =E2=80=9C</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: red;" class=3D"">Future Technology =
Trends for the evolution of IMT towards 2030 and beyond</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D"">=E2=80=9D.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D"">The Attachment is an extract from the WP 5D Chairman=E2=80=99s =
Report (Att. 7.4 to Document 5D/360) that can be found at (<a =
href=3D"https://www.itu.int/md/R19-WP5D-C-0360/en" style=3D"color: =
rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">https://www.itu.int/md/R19-WP5D-C-0360/en</a>) (TIES =
Restricted access).<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D"">Documents mentioned in the Liaison Statement are normally =
publicly available, in case of difficulties please feel free to contact =
me.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D"">Yours Sincerely,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" class=3D"">Uwe<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><b class=3D""><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D"">Uwe =
L=C3=96WENSTEIN</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color: rgb(10, =
124, 192);" class=3D""><br class=3D""><i class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Counsellor for ITU-R Study Group 5 (SGD/SG5)</i><br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; International Telecommunication =
Union</b><br class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tel: +41 22 730 6046 | Fax: =
+41 22 730 5806<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"FR" =
style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D"">Mobile: + 41 79 89 =
37378<br class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D""><a =
href=3D"http://www.itu.int/" style=3D"color: rgb(5, 99, 193); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"FR" =
class=3D"">www.itu.int</span></a></span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"color: =
rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:uwe.loewenstein@itu.int" style=3D"color: rgb(5, 99, 193); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"FR" =
class=3D"">uwe.loewenstein@itu.int</span></a></span><span lang=3D"FR" =
style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"FR" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
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> From: "Loewenstein, Uwe" <uwe.loewenstein@itu.int>
> Subject: LS: Development of a draft new Report ITU-R M.[IMT.C-V2X] =E2=80=
=93 The use of the terrestrial component of IMT systems for =
Cellular-Vehicle-to-Everything
> Date: October 27, 2020 at 8:48:14 AM EDT
> To: "adrian.scrase@etsi.org" <adrian.scrase@etsi.org>, =
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"krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in" <krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in>, =
"Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com" <Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com>, =
"Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at" <Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at>, =
"nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it" =
<nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it>, "npa@anemonetechnology.com" =
<npa@anemonetechnology.com>, "parvez@apt.int" <parvez@apt.int>, =
"rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in" <rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in>, "sbarclay@atis.org" =
<sbarclay@atis.org>, "srddg.tec@gov.in" <srddg.tec@gov.in>, =
"susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org" <susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org>, =
"wangzhiqin@catr.cn" <wangzhiqin@catr.cn>, "wanyi@caict.ac.cn" =
<wanyi@caict.ac.cn>, "y-kato@arib.or.jp" <y-kato@arib.or.jp>, =
"yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr" <yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr>, =
"zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn" <zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn>, "zhu.longming@zte.com.cn" =
<zhu.longming@zte.com.cn>, "zhuying@caict.ac.cn" <zhuying@caict.ac.cn>
> Cc: "Yang, Xiaoya" <xiaoya.yang@itu.int>, "Polidori, Stefano" =
<stefano.polidori@itu.int>, "BLUST, STEPHEN M" <SB8927@att.com>, =
"Buonomo, Sergio" <sergio.buonomo@itu.int>
>=20
> Addressed to: 3GPP, 5G Automotive Association, 79 GHz Project, ARIB, =
ATIS, AWG, C2C CC, CCSA, CEPT ECC, C-Roads, ETSI ISG MEC, ETSI TC ERM, =
ETSI TC ITS, ETSI TC MSG, GSA, IEEE, IETF ITS, ISO TC 204, MFA, SAE =
C-V2X TC, TEC, TIA, TSDSI, TTA, Wi-Fi Alliance
> Copied to: ITU-T SG 17, CITS
> =20
> Dear Sir/Madam,
> =20
> Please find attached a Liaison Statement from ITU-R Working Party 5D =
regarding the =E2=80=9Cdevelopment of a draft new Report ITU-R =
M.[IMT.C-V2X] =E2=80=93 The use of the terrestrial component of IMT =
systems for Cellular-Vehicle-to-Everything=E2=80=9D.
> =20
> The Attachment is an extract from the WP 5D Chairman=E2=80=99s Report =
(Att. 7.4 to Document 5D/360) that can be found at =
(https://www.itu.int/md/R19-WP5D-C-0360/en =
<https://www.itu.int/md/R19-WP5D-C-0360/en>) (TIES Restricted access).
> =20
> Documents mentioned in the Liaison Statement are normally publicly =
available, in case of difficulties please feel free to contact me.
> =20
> Yours Sincerely,
> Uwe
> =20
> =20
>    Uwe L=C3=96WENSTEIN
>     Counsellor for ITU-R Study Group 5 (SGD/SG5)
>     International Telecommunication Union
>     Tel: +41 22 730 6046 | Fax: +41 22 730 5806
>     Mobile: + 41 79 89 37378
>     www.itu.int <http://www.itu.int/>   uwe.loewenstein@itu.int =
<mailto:uwe.loewenstein@itu.int>
>    =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20
> =20


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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; line-break: after-white-space;" class=3D""><br =
class=3D""><div><br class=3D""><blockquote type=3D"cite" class=3D""><div =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">From: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D"">"Loewenstein, Uwe" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:uwe.loewenstein@itu.int" =
class=3D"">uwe.loewenstein@itu.int</a>&gt;<br class=3D""></span></div><div=
 style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Subject: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D""><b class=3D"">LS: Development =
of a draft new Report ITU-R M.[IMT.C-V2X] =E2=80=93 The use of the =
terrestrial component of IMT systems for =
Cellular-Vehicle-to-Everything</b><br class=3D""></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Date: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D"">October 27, 2020 at 8:48:14 AM =
EDT<br class=3D""></span></div><div style=3D"margin-top: 0px; =
margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span=
 style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif; color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">To: =
</b></span><span style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica =
Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif;" class=3D"">"<a =
href=3D"mailto:adrian.scrase@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">adrian.scrase@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:adrian.scrase@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">adrian.scrase@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:housley@vigilsec.com" class=3D"">housley@vigilsec.com</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:housley@vigilsec.com" =
class=3D"">housley@vigilsec.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Keith.Wilson@sae.org" class=3D"">Keith.Wilson@sae.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:Keith.Wilson@sae.org" =
class=3D"">Keith.Wilson@sae.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:MJLynch@mjlallc.com" class=3D"">MJLynch@mjlallc.com</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:MJLynch@mjlallc.com" =
class=3D"">MJLynch@mjlallc.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:s-nishioka@arib.or.jp" =
class=3D"">s-nishioka@arib.or.jp</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:s-nishioka@arib.or.jp" =
class=3D"">s-nishioka@arib.or.jp</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:3GPPLiaison@etsi.org" class=3D"">3GPPLiaison@etsi.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:3GPPLiaison@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">3GPPLiaison@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org" =
class=3D"">5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org" =
class=3D"">5gaa-liaison@5gaa.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:aguan@itsa.org" class=3D"">aguan@itsa.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:aguan@itsa.org" class=3D"">aguan@itsa.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:akmittal@tsdsi.org" class=3D"">akmittal@tsdsi.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:akmittal@tsdsi.org" =
class=3D"">akmittal@tsdsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de" =
class=3D"">alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de" =
class=3D"">alexander.kuehn@bnetza.de</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">Andrea.Lorelli@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp" class=3D"">arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp" =
class=3D"">arib-3gpp@arib.or.jp</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:aroytblat@wi-fi.org" class=3D"">aroytblat@wi-fi.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:aroytblat@wi-fi.org" =
class=3D"">aroytblat@wi-fi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com" =
class=3D"">balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com" =
class=3D"">balazs.bertenyi@nokia.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:chairman@tsdsi.in" class=3D"">chairman@tsdsi.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:chairman@tsdsi.in" =
class=3D"">chairman@tsdsi.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:chantal.bonardi@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">chantal.bonardi@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:chantal.bonardi@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">chantal.bonardi@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:ckoh@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">ckoh@tta.or.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:ckoh@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">ckoh@tta.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:cpignata@cisco.com" class=3D"">cpignata@cisco.com</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:cpignata@cisco.com" =
class=3D"">cpignata@cisco.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:dbain@tiaonline.org" class=3D"">dbain@tiaonline.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dbain@tiaonline.org" =
class=3D"">dbain@tiaonline.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:ddgstd.tec@gov.in" class=3D"">ddgstd.tec@gov.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ddgstd.tec@gov.in" =
class=3D"">ddgstd.tec@gov.in</a>&gt;, "<a href=3D"mailto:dg@tsdsi.in" =
class=3D"">dg@tsdsi.in</a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:dg@tsdsi.in" =
class=3D"">dg@tsdsi.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:dominique.everaere@ericsson.com" =
class=3D"">dominique.everaere@ericsson.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:dominique.everaere@ericsson.com" =
class=3D"">dominique.everaere@ericsson.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:dz1069@att.com" class=3D"">dz1069@att.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:dz1069@att.com" class=3D"">dz1069@att.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com" =
class=3D"">fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com" =
class=3D"">fkhatibi@qti.qualcomm.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:freqmgr@ieee.org" class=3D"">freqmgr@ieee.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:freqmgr@ieee.org" class=3D"">freqmgr@ieee.org</a>&gt;, =
"<a href=3D"mailto:giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it" =
class=3D"">giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it" =
class=3D"">giovanni.romano@telecomitalia.it</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de" =
class=3D"">Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de" =
class=3D"">Holger.Butscheidt@bnetza.de</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:hwryu@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">hwryu@tta.or.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:hwryu@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">hwryu@tta.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:info@multefire.org" class=3D"">info@multefire.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:info@multefire.org" =
class=3D"">info@multefire.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:jayeeta@tsdsi.org" class=3D"">jayeeta@tsdsi.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jayeeta@tsdsi.org" =
class=3D"">jayeeta@tsdsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:jennifer.collins@sae.org" =
class=3D"">jennifer.collins@sae.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:jennifer.collins@sae.org" =
class=3D"">jennifer.collins@sae.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com" =
class=3D"">jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com" =
class=3D"">jishnu@india.tejasnetworks.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Joern.Krause@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">Joern.Krause@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Joern.Krause@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">Joern.Krause@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:john.lewis@ties.itu.int" =
class=3D"">john.lewis@ties.itu.int</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:john.lewis@ties.itu.int" =
class=3D"">john.lewis@ties.itu.int</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:john.meredith@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">john.meredith@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:john.meredith@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">john.meredith@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com" =
class=3D"">Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com" =
class=3D"">Juergen.Hildebrandt@de.bosch.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:jwlim@korea.kr" class=3D"">jwlim@korea.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:jwlim@korea.kr" class=3D"">jwlim@korea.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:kckoo@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">kckoo@tta.or.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:kckoo@tta.or.kr" class=3D"">kckoo@tta.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:kishore.ygsc@gov.in" class=3D"">kishore.ygsc@gov.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kishore.ygsc@gov.in" =
class=3D"">kishore.ygsc@gov.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:kjwee56@rapa.or.kr" class=3D"">kjwee56@rapa.or.kr</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:kjwee56@rapa.or.kr" =
class=3D"">kjwee56@rapa.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:klutto@cewit.org.in" class=3D"">klutto@cewit.org.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:klutto@cewit.org.in" =
class=3D"">klutto@cewit.org.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in" =
class=3D"">krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in" =
class=3D"">krishnaj@ee.iitm.ac.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com" =
class=3D"">Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com" =
class=3D"">Mark.Younge@T-Mobile.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at" =
class=3D"">Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at" =
class=3D"">Martin.Boehm@austriatech.at</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it" =
class=3D"">nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it" =
class=3D"">nicolapio.magnani@telecomitalia.it</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:npa@anemonetechnology.com" =
class=3D"">npa@anemonetechnology.com</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:npa@anemonetechnology.com" =
class=3D"">npa@anemonetechnology.com</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:parvez@apt.int" class=3D"">parvez@apt.int</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:parvez@apt.int" class=3D"">parvez@apt.int</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in" class=3D"">rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in" =
class=3D"">rganti@ee.iitm.ac.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:sbarclay@atis.org" class=3D"">sbarclay@atis.org</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sbarclay@atis.org" =
class=3D"">sbarclay@atis.org</a>&gt;, "<a href=3D"mailto:srddg.tec@gov.in"=
 class=3D"">srddg.tec@gov.in</a>" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:srddg.tec@gov.in" =
class=3D"">srddg.tec@gov.in</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org" =
class=3D"">susanna.Kooistra@etsi.org</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:wangzhiqin@catr.cn" class=3D"">wangzhiqin@catr.cn</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:wangzhiqin@catr.cn" =
class=3D"">wangzhiqin@catr.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:wanyi@caict.ac.cn" class=3D"">wanyi@caict.ac.cn</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:wanyi@caict.ac.cn" =
class=3D"">wanyi@caict.ac.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:y-kato@arib.or.jp" class=3D"">y-kato@arib.or.jp</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:y-kato@arib.or.jp" =
class=3D"">y-kato@arib.or.jp</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr" =
class=3D"">yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr" =
class=3D"">yongjun.chung@tta.or.kr</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn" class=3D"">zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn" =
class=3D"">zhaosz@ccsa.org.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:zhu.longming@zte.com.cn" =
class=3D"">zhu.longming@zte.com.cn</a>" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:zhu.longming@zte.com.cn" =
class=3D"">zhu.longming@zte.com.cn</a>&gt;, "<a =
href=3D"mailto:zhuying@caict.ac.cn" class=3D"">zhuying@caict.ac.cn</a>" =
&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:zhuying@caict.ac.cn" =
class=3D"">zhuying@caict.ac.cn</a>&gt;<br class=3D""></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; =
margin-left: 0px;" class=3D""><span style=3D"font-family: =
-webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, sans-serif; =
color:rgba(0, 0, 0, 1.0);" class=3D""><b class=3D"">Cc: </b></span><span =
style=3D"font-family: -webkit-system-font, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, =
sans-serif;" class=3D"">"Yang, Xiaoya" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:xiaoya.yang@itu.int" =
class=3D"">xiaoya.yang@itu.int</a>&gt;, "Polidori, Stefano" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:stefano.polidori@itu.int" =
class=3D"">stefano.polidori@itu.int</a>&gt;, "BLUST, STEPHEN M" &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:SB8927@att.com" class=3D"">SB8927@att.com</a>&gt;, =
"Buonomo, Sergio" &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:sergio.buonomo@itu.int" =
class=3D"">sergio.buonomo@itu.int</a>&gt;<br class=3D""></span></div><br =
class=3D""><div class=3D""><div class=3D"WordSection1" style=3D"page: =
WordSection1; caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; =
font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; =
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; =
word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: =
none;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Addressed to:<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><b class=3D"">3GPP, 5G =
Automotive Association, 79 GHz Project, ARIB, ATIS, AWG, C2C CC, CCSA, =
CEPT ECC, C-Roads, ETSI ISG MEC, ETSI TC ERM, ETSI TC ITS, ETSI TC MSG, =
GSA, IEEE, IETF ITS, ISO TC 204, MFA, SAE C-V2X TC, TEC, TIA, TSDSI, =
TTA, Wi-Fi Alliance<o:p class=3D""></o:p></b></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">Copied to:<b class=3D""><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>ITU-T SG 17, CITS<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></b></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Dear Sir/Madam,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" =
class=3D"">Please find attached a Liaison Statement from ITU-R Working =
Party 5D regarding the =E2=80=9C</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: red;" class=3D"">development of a draft =
new Report ITU-R M.[IMT.C-V2X] =E2=80=93 The use of the terrestrial =
component of IMT systems for Cellular-Vehicle-to-Everything</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D"">=E2=80=9D.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D"">The Attachment is an extract from the WP 5D Chairman=E2=80=99s =
Report (Att. 7.4 to Document 5D/360) that can be found at (<a =
href=3D"https://www.itu.int/md/R19-WP5D-C-0360/en" style=3D"color: =
rgb(5, 99, 193); text-decoration: underline;" =
class=3D"">https://www.itu.int/md/R19-WP5D-C-0360/en</a>) (TIES =
Restricted access).<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D"">Documents mentioned in the Liaison Statement are normally =
publicly available, in case of difficulties please feel free to contact =
me.<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D""><o:p class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" =
class=3D"">Yours Sincerely,<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" class=3D"">Uwe<o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(55, 96, 146);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; =
font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D"">&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span style=3D"color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</span><b class=3D""><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D"">Uwe =
L=C3=96WENSTEIN</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color: rgb(10, =
124, 192);" class=3D""><br class=3D""><i class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Counsellor for ITU-R Study Group 5 (SGD/SG5)</i><br class=3D""><b =
class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; International Telecommunication =
Union</b><br class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tel: +41 22 730 6046 | Fax: =
+41 22 730 5806<o:p class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm; font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"FR" =
style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D"">Mobile: + 41 79 89 =
37378<br class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D""><a =
href=3D"http://www.itu.int/" style=3D"color: rgb(5, 99, 193); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"FR" =
class=3D"">www.itu.int</span></a></span><span lang=3D"FR" style=3D"color: =
rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D""><a =
href=3D"mailto:uwe.loewenstein@itu.int" style=3D"color: rgb(5, 99, 193); =
text-decoration: underline;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"FR" =
class=3D"">uwe.loewenstein@itu.int</span></a></span><span lang=3D"FR" =
style=3D"color: rgb(10, 124, 192);" class=3D""><o:p =
class=3D""></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm; font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;" class=3D""><span lang=3D"FR" =
class=3D"">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span></div></div></div></bl=
ockquote></div></body></html>=

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From: Abdussalam Baryun <abdussalambaryun@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2020 18:59:10 +0200
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To: housley <housley@vigilsec.com>
Cc: its <its@ietf.org>, scott.mansfield@ericsson.com
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Subject: Re: [ipwave] ITU-R liaison statement 1686
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On Fri, Oct 16, 2020 at 9:05 PM <housley@vigilsec.com> wrote:

> The ITU-R sent a liaison: https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/
>
> Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?
>

I don't think we should reply, because that CAV network concerns the
control plane which most probably should be centralised for safety and
should  be at 2 layer. I think  this IPWAVE WG considers
applications/networks of the IP communication for combined data and control
planes.

Best wishes,

AB

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr"><br></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">=
<div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D"gmail_attr">On Fri, Oct 16, 2020 at 9:05 PM &lt;<=
a href=3D"mailto:housley@vigilsec.com">housley@vigilsec.com</a>&gt; wrote:<=
br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8e=
x;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">The ITU-R sent a=
 liaison: <a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/" rel=3D"nor=
eferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1686/</a><b=
r>
<br>
Does anyone think that the IPWAVE WG should reply?<br></blockquote><div><br=
></div><div>I don&#39;t think we should reply, because that CAV network=C2=
=A0concerns the control plane which most probably should be centralised for=
 safety and should=C2=A0 be at 2 layer. I think=C2=A0 this IPWAVE WG consid=
ers applications/networks of the IP communication for combined data and con=
trol planes.=C2=A0</div><div><br></div><div>Best wishes,</div><div><br></di=
v><div>AB=C2=A0=C2=A0</div></div></div>

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