From nobody Sun Aug 1 09:43:38 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A6273A093A for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 09:43:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=minilop.net Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JuEWst-zh9Ef for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 09:43:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pl1-x62d.google.com (mail-pl1-x62d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::62d]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 64F233A093B for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 09:43:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pl1-x62d.google.com with SMTP id k1so16870471plt.12 for ; Sun, 01 Aug 2021 09:43:30 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=minilop.net; s=google; h=date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-disposition:in-reply-to; bh=HQldz/lTm6eskUykw79uMUnUAY57XKX3yyb0hELnTO4=; b=Qku3fW92rH7rbB42N4bL86AcJhJ+zafPP4PkKyC7Zrb8lOogsGEg0GuUXmsOT8LYuV gApDbwkjoGi44CcE9wInbD4q9e92Wlq/INS3/Kva51JY1WCmsiGWyjdAoLeuworkbl4L xehy4o0iaQtg/cHyAWjsHNWlPmCEbpw6gwY1k= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references :mime-version:content-disposition:in-reply-to; bh=HQldz/lTm6eskUykw79uMUnUAY57XKX3yyb0hELnTO4=; b=SR/HZYa6hAl0Wkp7brkD9KyphjUq2CVwNL482c8s132hplPc8T6hJGSMplJquQryiQ dhlqGh9d+fBPiiV6GnjuagDjdcOHPrgwIIJfH9QWJInVlppHdbZZEnhvOcOsx707wc6z jL4O7en1GeQMtzdek62kIo2lWzvnN2jAmK5+AMnIgyv8kZ80DBHEUWwL+KCDVPZEMj3w BLcAfcII4L6ajgsFZ+iubUY+Q8/osF85B38qtYH1brI/f5+mtzgCy3Uf2tKspcxH+Ol/ +NpOlKcXXPEkdqZDFBi/YgxI2Y7hcCqf+54HGXAe497qrpDhy8QX0MwNIFbgAAtMjGC/ cYng== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531sWSxf2a21oLkUyOMXGP9GDDlqycw5zGGyEFLL/IVtiIzkgIyC FR8b8Sg6VC9qX/OhoIJVidHxsO1zJkqnzfAh X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJzzj7+j6ETwejyxGIJ31/1U3cw4DhlgJWvkCzPRN/B9895QHYerDLLxQXcDBnyvCfMk+2g6VQ== X-Received: by 2002:a63:d849:: with SMTP id k9mr2936640pgj.67.1627836208592; Sun, 01 Aug 2021 09:43:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from eh (63-230-166-62.ptld.qwest.net. [63.230.166.62]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id h24sm9010458pfn.180.2021.08.01.09.43.26 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 bits=256/256); Sun, 01 Aug 2021 09:43:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: by eh (sSMTP sendmail emulation); Sun, 01 Aug 2021 09:43:26 -0700 Date: Sun, 1 Aug 2021 09:43:26 -0700 From: Jamey Sharp To: John Levine Cc: jmap@ietf.org Message-ID: References: <20210731170047.DE0772563EB0@ary.qy> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <20210731170047.DE0772563EB0@ary.qy> Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] the large email (attachment) problem X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2021 16:43:37 -0000 On Sat, Jul 31, 2021 at 01:00:47PM -0400, John Levine wrote: >It appears that Jamey Sharp said: >>In the text (plain or HTML) parts of the email, large attachments are >>still referenced by a URL provided by the sender, as has become common >>practice today. However, we add new attachment-like parts which serve >>several purposes: to indicate that a given URL should be treated like an >>attachment at the recipient, to provide metadata hints, and to provide >>alternate URLs for retrieving the attachment. ... > >Take a look at message/external-body in RFC 2017, 2046 and 2912. It already has size, >URL, expiration, and content-features parameters. > >We could add a few new attributes to external-body like an optional encryption key. I'd never heard of message/external-body, and wow, that would be perfect if everyone implemented it. The 20 years of personal email archives I've managed to keep don't have a single instance of that type in them though, which is disappointing: I'm guessing there are few, if any, implementers today. I assume the "normal" way to use this in an HTML email would be to assign a Content-ID to the multipart/alternative containing the external-body, if there is one, or to the external-body part itself, and then reference it using "cid:" links, right? But that doesn't work if recipients don't understand message/external-body. Would this work instead? Encourage recipients to collect the URLs from any external-body parts and treat references to those URLs as equivalent to "cid:" references to the corresponding part. Then a sender can still link to e.g. Google Drive in the HTML and plain-text parts, so that recipients that don't understand external-body can at least follow the link if they want to, but supporting implementations can also choose to treat it fully like an attachment. If that seems reasonable, then I think this is indeed most of the way there, and just needs new stuff for integrity and confidentiality. Jamey From nobody Sun Aug 1 10:43:44 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CA193A0CC4 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 10:43:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=iecc.com header.b=Y1aW0JWR; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=taugh.com header.b=U6byd1/J Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ruDlaMaUf1jv for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 10:43:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gal.iecc.com (gal.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:43:6f73:7461]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 667923A0CBD for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 10:43:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 82833 invoked from network); 1 Aug 2021 17:43:33 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type; s=1438f.6106dd45.k2108; bh=GAWl1/VnxAR9vMIlusERn/vN2/t6xpb8hLF1q5oQqI8=; b=Y1aW0JWRZbJ99FMvfk9WDSTt2XapjxS4srJsZ9LQY72fwh1sZMKDCOCLkdW12DYHfbwGxKahiT1uMkOy2JuS79RXNiUx/GS7C1QUw7GF6RO9UjOD1SrElJ5y6bwu0egpmksIeZPwSsJUs38jGa9KSHkbgjMwsZENiv2tylwW5o6DRTRbFtJTj2w9+eVqvN0MP/I5Tx72oL80AR6l1As4+bQVjz5PWPwOlmKr47tguA+j2Alqp79beiq6r+aur4dVhzMBAGmduQiEYaSAtBW934h3EKqnXkb83jLavCxIYwqAh14mThcx7pl6P4j4to/L1Xab9uJf0ipRHlPjhS4VqQ== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=taugh.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type; s=1438f.6106dd45.k2108; bh=GAWl1/VnxAR9vMIlusERn/vN2/t6xpb8hLF1q5oQqI8=; b=U6byd1/JqyjBHEA4H7wm1bDNsOrSVIZ/AdcRASHLAWG7U4YCr2xNIKGbX2qggYm01mWIkyfdGm8V/MosJ5xQhIL0ibmrwtq/YsxPJWjdWRbk8bAjOlUObgg3+zNhtLVbwlgZOs0EJqZUX59Vv6kI2G37w/Z7INu9WnV5NgG6IfIU3GgkXV/KckSiko5U4NcX+gumPJCdZsq+rIg3THRCE976/kipkacdi1qSfeBF6GH8vjC7uAnHrhoaMhJb98D1/nRc6Y3eSO6rqryukOHU9ldNlrBKgEdTLMvT91miVbdhvPg4X0JrOnqFa5kDb6ypqnDtBdwPG09SD2bbu1/USw== Received: from ary.qy ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) by imap.iecc.com ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) with ESMTPS (TLS1.2 ECDHE-RSA AES-256-GCM AEAD) via TCP6; 01 Aug 2021 17:43:32 -0000 Received: by ary.qy (Postfix, from userid 501) id 379C8256FF94; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 13:43:30 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ary.qy (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C61B256FF75; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 13:43:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: 1 Aug 2021 13:43:30 -0400 Message-ID: <44b8d21-afd9-6563-bcb0-2ad0d23154a1@taugh.com> From: "John R Levine" To: "Jamey Sharp" Cc: jmap@ietf.org X-X-Sender: johnl@ary.qy In-Reply-To: References: <20210731170047.DE0772563EB0@ary.qy> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] the large email (attachment) problem X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 01 Aug 2021 17:43:43 -0000 >> Take a look at message/external-body in RFC 2017, 2046 and 2912. It already has size, >> URL, expiration, and content-features parameters. > I assume the "normal" way to use this in an HTML email would be to assign a > Content-ID to the multipart/alternative containing the external-body, if > there is one, or to the external-body part itself, and then reference it > using "cid:" links, right? But that doesn't work if recipients don't > understand message/external-body. External-body parts are just like any other MIME part, and can go anywhere. It is my strong impression that the vast majortity of giant MIME parts are attached videos or other opaque formats so they appear as attachments. I don't see any reaspn a Content-ID wouldn't work but it rarely would be needed. I agree there is a bootstrap problem. Some mail programs implemented it back in the 1990s when people still dialed in to download their mail, then it went away when we all got permanently online, now we need it again as the size of bloatware has pulled away from what mail systems do. Regards, John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Taughannock Networks, Trumansburg NY Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly From nobody Sun Aug 1 18:38:15 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DDCC63A09BE for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 18:38:12 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.797 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.797 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmailteam.com header.b=zppiBDNi; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=ZxUEd1Xq Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7gBD3UAINS8e for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 18:38:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from out5-smtp.messagingengine.com (out5-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.29]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8A9903A09BD for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 18:38:07 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14EF55C0100 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 21:38:06 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Sun, 01 Aug 2021 21:38:06 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= fastmailteam.com; h=mime-version:message-id:in-reply-to :references:date:from:to:subject:content-type; s=fm3; bh=VJheZIX 2pvabuM7D5mjZ0Tn5b1imEUTfugrLuI2IQXc=; b=zppiBDNiJXGo/aEcSNsxKbz kPXHtx/JUTffFXj3xj1rKJHNPEpUjh3PXNjlf/IBocZR03kOXfARMBw1JFO5hLbk I1WHjAFgQvFk7S4ozoaltm0dfHegq8Z1tqdjJpbsv/4RJoRGCxOVgZb4j79Y5eOU eyj2gH+Y58Jig1Acjfm4nwmBlhWFrUoIa0J/TGxKzC6MRRk49NSxJz9wr4qv5oL5 kl+fzGjcAXHpApi0vKXhs5E8yGJrMUtlKeeq1CLRI7HDCMmBpPWXRjuD5sK2KxLK eE6plkfXEuITSMtzhNeF6yO1o1B1kNXI4Conm2COCxkWLTtnJ58TEfaQJhc+9EQ= = DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=VJheZI X2pvabuM7D5mjZ0Tn5b1imEUTfugrLuI2IQXc=; b=ZxUEd1XqsBOwqu5HftoZ7q EDhLh4wuS4uqKltB/Q6TbXWWbP+2MYsW9H+yAwHPbLRmyxlBlPew89z8O754MH97 CORR+e8YgleeoB21YTDAb2K4qrSyBx1lEyJ1ajaeLHuYbZzQrxAwagcqHO7nPWDu DMbUq6MNY1A/IXH7NJsYUcEuPOqVT5E7YIk0JQUxotzRdawIvY+LXsqWWEg5qWo/ 3WzIlcXQ2ngWj7B/zsFBfps017uXEO07TZoW8C720nDq/WnzdTT1CJcycKrsnKWH IMWFZAxzPCLduOQNhJ8sHOY8cSkNSbS+/wFVChBu/REi+C3eBu+lCSBomuJbnsSQ == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvtddriedugdefudcutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenuc fjughrpefofgggkfgjfhffhffvufgtsegrtderreerredtnecuhfhrohhmpedfpfgvihhl ucflvghnkhhinhhsfdcuoehnvghilhhjsehfrghsthhmrghilhhtvggrmhdrtghomheqne cuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhepvedvtedvudelkefhgefhteeftedtlefhheefveffveelkedu tdduffeiveejvefhnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilh hfrhhomhepnhgvihhljhesfhgrshhtmhgrihhlthgvrghmrdgtohhm X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 9B71CAC0E77; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 21:38:05 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-1002-g563fbe43fc-fm-ubox-20210727.001-g563fbe43 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <44b8d21-afd9-6563-bcb0-2ad0d23154a1@taugh.com> References: <20210731170047.DE0772563EB0@ary.qy> <44b8d21-afd9-6563-bcb0-2ad0d23154a1@taugh.com> Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 11:37:47 +1000 From: "Neil Jenkins" To: "IETF JMAP Mailing List" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=20062732f5ee4ab08fa07c4fe5be5aba Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] the large email (attachment) problem X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 01:38:13 -0000 --20062732f5ee4ab08fa07c4fe5be5aba Content-Type: text/plain On Mon, 2 Aug 2021, at 03:43, John R Levine wrote: > I agree there is a bootstrap problem. Some mail programs implemented it > back in the 1990s when people still dialed in to download their mail, then > it went away when we all got permanently online, now we need it again as > the size of bloatware has pulled away from what mail systems do. I *think* the bootstrap problem can be solved if most clients support multiple MIME parts correctly (which I think they probably must, because Apple's clients often produce bodies like that). You have something like this: multipart/mixed text/html *(The message body)* multipart/alternative text/html *(HTML representation of attachments, just like current G Drive etc.)* message/external-body *(For external attachment aware clients)* Neil. --20062732f5ee4ab08fa07c4fe5be5aba Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Mon, 2 Aug 2= 021, at 03:43, John R Levine wrote:
I agree there is a bootstrap problem.  Som= e mail programs implemented it 
back in the 1990s whe= n people still dialed in to download their mail, then 
it went away when we all got permanently online, now we need it again = as 
the size of bloatware has pulled away from what m= ail systems do.

I think= the bootstrap problem can be solved if most clients support multiple MI= ME parts correctly (which I think they probably must, because Apple's cl= ients often produce bodies like that). You have something like this:
= 

multipart/mixed
    text/html (The message body)
    multipart/alternative
        text/html (HTML representation of attachments, just like curr=
ent G Drive etc.)
        message/external-body (For external attachment aware cli=
ents)

Neil.
--20062732f5ee4ab08fa07c4fe5be5aba-- From nobody Sun Aug 1 19:42:57 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB0B03A0C5F for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 19:42:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmailteam.com header.b=TrWaSsNm; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=Ge8SexEy Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 33ur4aqBOsPg for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 19:42:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from out1-smtp.messagingengine.com (out1-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.25]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E7D493A0C5D for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 19:42:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 241655C0051 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 22:42:47 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Sun, 01 Aug 2021 22:42:47 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= fastmailteam.com; h=mime-version:message-id:in-reply-to :references:date:from:to:subject:content-type; s=fm3; bh=sA8O9TE Y+Snd+pAsZvKFAVWaCmkFGhRvLjOIueeSJS4=; b=TrWaSsNm1P2mWGUUT/80rdu 3PBOEN6qjQOYyF3/0g/yeSdFfLtgbiG3gY/6ktjZDUVpPuEu4Sf3mjCrXb4j6c3e YAOEwNCcld+1KtiyOTggUtAmgI6yG295NpGk94H9M3VXRGSJupfgvh/ckPETei/2 qVj4AGALU5wZjKSt1gehsc23Sa0eham+7OTaMbkoQ4Q0cqGqyMoAwKodRA2ww2wi /EINqrXyxEuWWNToFK/c3yahG8knCSmJ/dKAlSfpa/I1X9gc136lgfkBwD7xnqhU n7VDJS3H8kDcspqNVOZDNioR8a69Oz7PmN6ttM3ft7bPEPoMRMQ29EY7X11J0ig= = DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=sA8O9T EY+Snd+pAsZvKFAVWaCmkFGhRvLjOIueeSJS4=; b=Ge8SexEyLpA5csl1DWpqem Z28/IYdl7K6GM7cq9wRvqbo0O2uuSrEKtNepPWnqq/Zs6Lcw7IjCe2X96ynRvil1 mm4X4P9FLbM0Mipap7PeTFCqATmWBAlhlYzPXRSl4yliyw7Av3H9uwiNmKN/yLsR kVY7H3Lsot05OPm+NV3OsC3YWILvd810ZttEfM1fTQDceIPHEuDusy8UCf2iCynL VLb31vHk2Ed5S5E/0F8aSGrz9syQ0sA4E5UYX8RjQ55MDqfJvQ/NtmiFdcuNfRRQ UyUcgXea6s2oohVJRZ7xj8BWcd+xCo8nm+3KnpmaBE5afac9f99229pHMWB/VYEA == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvtddriedugdegfecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepofgfggfkjghffffhvffutgesrgdtre erreertdenucfhrhhomhepfdeurhhonhcuifhonhgufigrnhgrfdcuoegsrhhonhhgsehf rghsthhmrghilhhtvggrmhdrtghomheqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhepvdduueeihefgvd ehueeujeejuedugfeigfevteefleetfeffgfdtjeejgfeuuddvnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfu ihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomhepsghrohhnghesfhgrshhtmhgrih hlthgvrghmrdgtohhm X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 9798FAC0E77; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 22:42:46 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-1002-g563fbe43fc-fm-ubox-20210727.001-g563fbe43 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <3b47db73-3d30-4019-ad1c-0b3dfd187305@beta.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: <20210731170047.DE0772563EB0@ary.qy> <44b8d21-afd9-6563-bcb0-2ad0d23154a1@taugh.com> Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 12:42:26 +1000 From: "Bron Gondwana" To: jmap@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=3829239a1b5b4aaea0f4d6a0b29a6f98 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] the large email (attachment) problem X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 02:42:57 -0000 --3829239a1b5b4aaea0f4d6a0b29a6f98 Content-Type: text/plain On Mon, Aug 2, 2021, at 11:37, Neil Jenkins wrote: > On Mon, 2 Aug 2021, at 03:43, John R Levine wrote: >> I agree there is a bootstrap problem. Some mail programs implemented it >> back in the 1990s when people still dialed in to download their mail, then >> it went away when we all got permanently online, now we need it again as >> the size of bloatware has pulled away from what mail systems do. > > I *think* the bootstrap problem can be solved if most clients support multiple MIME parts correctly (which I think they probably must, because Apple's clients often produce bodies like that). You have something like this: > > multipart/mixed > text/html *(The message body)* > multipart/alternative > text/html *(HTML representation of attachments, just like current G Drive etc.)* > message/external-body *(For external attachment aware clients)* We've collected a bunch of great ideas here. I think the next sensible step is probably some running code and maybe try to get a group of hackathon people trying things at the next IETF. I'm particularly interested in anyone who knows any clients which currently implement `message/external-body` at all, so we can check that they handle any changes we make to the format. Bron. -- Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Ltd brong@fastmailteam.com --3829239a1b5b4aaea0f4d6a0b29a6f98 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Mon, Aug 2, 2021, at 11:37, Neil Jenkins wrote:
On Mon, 2 Aug= 2021, at 03:43, John R Levine wrote:
I agree there is a bootstrap problem. = ; Some mail programs implemented it 
back in the 1990= s when people still dialed in to download their mail, then 
it went away when we all got permanently online, now we need it a= gain as 
the size of bloatware has pulled away from w= hat mail systems do.

I thin= k the bootstrap problem can be solved if most clients support multip= le MIME parts correctly (which I think they probably must, because Apple= 's clients often produce bodies like that). You have something like this= :

multipart/mixed
    text/html (The message body)
    multipart/alternative
        text/html (HTML representation of attachments, just like curr=
ent G Drive etc.)
        message/external-body (For external attachment aware cli=
ents)

We've collected a bunch of great i= deas here.  I think the next sensible step is probably some running= code and maybe try to get a group of hackathon people trying things at = the next IETF.

I'm particularly interested in anyone who = knows any clients which currently implement message/ex= ternal-body at all, so we can check that they handle any changes = we make to the format.

Bron.
--
 = ; Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Ltd
  brong@fastmailteam.com


--3829239a1b5b4aaea0f4d6a0b29a6f98-- From nobody Sun Aug 1 23:23:20 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93DA43A0C47 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 23:23:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.797 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.797 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmailteam.com header.b=HwPxoDpZ; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=Y8WKFlsC Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id puI4tpN6PzfY for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 23:23:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3B71F3A0C46 for ; Sun, 1 Aug 2021 23:23:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DA2C32004CE for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 02:23:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Mon, 02 Aug 2021 02:23:09 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= fastmailteam.com; h=mime-version:message-id:date:from:to:subject :content-type; s=fm3; bh=On/8HEd73/n9z75YYhVmP2pAISjblCwnZwT0Ve/ 4IbU=; b=HwPxoDpZGU+mAwV8XF5WAsoQQrxKPpwC2oWrIf3fcp+MbjbfPtqdbWS kFLJ3YHTTOIS8XI2oUYnw8rjLxaXePs1m8nRYPr4n3UuREyRp3FI6u9J/SMdmNuC dnJU3um1iibgyDcFFzSSQvGQftaLaZw+Sz/18IaEK1vDPDUAvz0asyqQvXAhpamA RWI9aJzWjagKyMb0A7uTSRu3SdmbpSMdjlRjSc8DHo3dgGh0bdyPfHce7BtQjNZh 53n6sVzt7qWGnN8einfKqmZWR2TlqRd6547peKlpGcmrxYsbZ3MUQvbWdv0KjWcV bDmYe4EGNU16i6QXxkTf9BsBZa26pkg== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:message-id :mime-version:subject:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender :x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=On/8HEd73/n9z75YYhVmP2pAISjbl CwnZwT0Ve/4IbU=; b=Y8WKFlsCD9NUrleGTu/0jnIustyIFqAgGpS+eOZxOMx2r ojNjXp6TKfaJpD1t3w1DUXxNG8vh4lGEOq6g7mxbEMSHff2OXO25Mx1r3h3Gejv1 Qy2kXNnjaqX0S1VUCCnWZT5SLQyDHqTgUwWbr80ZyW36DAYcbcZmvomnK5hycQIV VVXUHpjyx6UsVebTXtUeufSYI7kGGEzV2Id8LkwUQIOsZxh+wG6Vw0/VfeIJ2wDK HhXp5Hrq/QFUdZ5ehmO+wghHtr2KiuE670F28WY9v77lIbDBoqC+6bnzYIun9Tln cRM4BOmTuDPckeY4QzULXeDHOPUU0+fXlgHTGGBWA== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvtddriedugdekjecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenuc fjughrpefofgggkfffhffvufgtsegrtderreerredtnecuhfhrohhmpedfpfgvihhlucfl vghnkhhinhhsfdcuoehnvghilhhjsehfrghsthhmrghilhhtvggrmhdrtghomheqnecugg ftrfgrthhtvghrnhepleevkeeuheegteekieetffffheffgfevkeevteevgfevveevvdfg ffffgedtgfefnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrh homhepnhgvihhljhesfhgrshhtmhgrihhlthgvrghmrdgtohhm X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 15676AC0E77; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 02:23:09 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-1029-g70f0079d2d-fm-ubox-20210801.001-g70f0079d Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 16:23:08 +1000 From: "Neil Jenkins" To: "IETF JMAP Mailing List" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=cbcb97954e614bd08e3ee916efd583e9 Archived-At: Subject: [Jmap] JMAP Calendars ACLs X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 06:23:18 -0000 --cbcb97954e614bd08e3ee916efd583e9 Content-Type: text/plain Hi all, Currently, in JMAP Calendars we have the following ACLs controlling what data you may write in the calendar: * `mayAddItems` Can add events to calendar. * `mayUpdateOwn` Can update events you own or have no owner. * `mayUpdateAll` Can update all events (implies mayUpdateOwn, mayUpdatePrivate and mayRSVP). * `mayRemoveOwn` Can delete events you own or have no owner. * `mayRemoveAll` Can delete all events (implies mayRemoveOwn). * `mayUpdatePrivate` Can update private properties (ones that do not affect other participants in the event, e.g. alerts) on events you don't otherwise have permission to modify. * `mayRSVP` Can set the RSVP status of *your* participants in events you don't otherwise have permission to modify. I would like to propose we change the first 5 of those to just two: * `mayWriteOwn` The user may create, modify or destroy an event on this calendar if either they are the owner of the event or the event has no owner. * `mayWriteAll` The user may create, modify or destroy all events in this calendar, or move events to or from this calendar. If this is true, the mayWriteOwn, mayUpdatePrivate and mayRSVP properties MUST all also be true. As calendar events are completely mutable (unlike messages in Email), having separate ACLs for create/update/destroy doesn't seem very helpful, and this simplifies things. Does this sound reasonable? Any objections? Cheers, Neil. --cbcb97954e614bd08e3ee916efd583e9 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi all,

Currently, in JMAP Calendars we have the following= ACLs controlling what data you may write in the calendar:
    =
  • mayAddItems Can add events to calendar.
    =
  • mayUpdateOwn Can update events you own= or have no owner.
  • mayUpdateAll Can= update all events (implies mayUpdateOwn, mayUpdatePrivate and mayRSVP).=
  • mayRemoveOwn Can delete event= s you own or have no owner.
  • mayRemoveAll Can delete all events (implies mayRemoveOwn).
  • mayUpdatePrivate Can update private properties (ones that do = not affect other participants in the event, e.g. alerts) on events you d= on't otherwise have permission to modify.
  • = mayRSVP Can set the RSVP status of your participants in ev= ents you don't otherwise have permission to modify.
I would like to propose we change the first 5 of those to just two:
  • mayWriteOwn The user may create= , modify or destroy an event on this calendar if either they are the own= er of the event or the event has no owner.
    <= li>mayWriteAll The user may create, modify or d= estroy all events in this calendar, or move events to or from this calen= dar. If this is true, the mayWriteOwn, mayUpdatePrivate and mayRSVP prop= erties MUST all also be true.
As calendar e= vents are completely mutable (unlike messages in Email), having separate= ACLs for create/update/destroy doesn't seem very helpful, and this simp= lifies things. Does this sound reasonable? Any objections?

Cheers,
Neil.
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On Mon, Au= g 2, 2021, at 8:23 AM, Neil Jenkins wrote:
I would like to propose we change the fi= rst 5 of those to just two:
  • mayWriteO= wn The user may create, modify or destroy an event on this calend= ar if either they are the owner of the event or the event has no owner.<= br>
  • mayWriteAll The user may create, mo= dify or destroy all events in this calendar, or move events to or from t= his calendar. If this is true, the mayWriteOwn, mayUpdatePrivate and may= RSVP properties MUST all also be true.
Having recently implemented the current ACL scheme, I am mu= ch in favor of this proposal.
--a777f658240c4815a6edbde4e47e7dbe-- From nobody Mon Aug 2 02:17:51 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A06243A1507 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 02:17:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id M58XM7Md6NM4 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 02:17:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.highwayman.com (mail.highwayman.com [82.69.6.249]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0E3DD3A1504 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 02:17:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:33289 helo=happyday.al.cl.cam.ac.uk) by mail.highwayman.com with esmtp (Exim 4.94.2) (envelope-from ) id 1mAU4n-000BEM-Di for jmap@ietf.org; Mon, 02 Aug 2021 09:17:37 +0000 Message-ID: Date: Mon, 2 Aug 2021 10:16:30 +0100 To: jmap@ietf.org From: Richard Clayton References: <20210731170047.DE0772563EB0@ary.qy> <44b8d21-afd9-6563-bcb0-2ad0d23154a1@taugh.com> <3b47db73-3d30-4019-ad1c-0b3dfd187305@beta.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: <3b47db73-3d30-4019-ad1c-0b3dfd187305@beta.fastmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Turnpike Integrated Version 5.03 M Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] the large email (attachment) problem X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 09:17:50 -0000 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 In message <3b47db73-3d30-4019-ad1c-0b3dfd187305@beta.fastmail.com>, Bron Gondwana writes > I'm particularly interested in anyone who knows any clients which > currently implement message/external-body at all, so we can check > that they handle any changes we make to the format. my client (Turnpike) will handle incoming message/external-body but does not generate it https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turnpike_(software) I still use this software every day (see headers), but I haven't seen an example of this MIME type for many years (the IETF used to use it for their notifications of new RFCs and drafts) BTW: there are surely other WGs where any MIME extension work (if you want to add content hashes perhaps, to assist in abuse prevention) will be better handled. If you just want to encourage the use of this MIME type then I doubt it matters where you do it ! - -- richard Richard Clayton Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Benjamin Franklin 11 Nov 1755 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGPsdk version 1.7.1 iQA/AwUBYQe37t2nQQHFxEViEQKSSgCdHHTWoIyPrg1tNCbho0W/rnz8S9sAoK6p BTcpMW9VBJQUNeC/GBjhgJSO =kUpB -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From nobody Mon Aug 2 06:59:13 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietf.org Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CB573A1F7B; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 06:59:03 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: jmap@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.35.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: jmap@ietf.org Message-ID: <162791274337.28850.4299033163262412790@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 06:59:03 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Jmap] I-D Action: draft-ietf-jmap-sieve-05.txt X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 13:59:07 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the JSON Mail Access Protocol WG of the IETF. Title : JMAP for Sieve Scripts Author : Kenneth Murchison Filename : draft-ietf-jmap-sieve-05.txt Pages : 26 Date : 2021-08-02 Abstract: This document specifies a data model for managing Sieve scripts on a server using the JSON Meta Application Protocol (JMAP). The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-sieve/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-jmap-sieve-05 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-jmap-sieve-05 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Mon Aug 2 12:58:44 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A94CA3A19EE for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 12:58:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.399 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.399 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=iecc.com header.b=nJQQcDKI; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=taugh.com header.b=oMiXi6kF Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qWSWZQ9pQvbl for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 12:58:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gal.iecc.com (gal.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:43:6f73:7461]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 48C1C3A19E9 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 12:58:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 21514 invoked from network); 2 Aug 2021 19:58:34 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:cleverness; s=5406.61084e6a.k2108; bh=CYamZs/U+FE6NPwRL8DHANi6hqB2WgutsHsCTxNzyaU=; b=nJQQcDKIZxKmjr58so8SF4HQNJAqwqdVrkQiCvirN47aCfjoZjpWbERWawoQ8qbxgUj8tlvuMSkV2x4ywKGHxonAzl5PKkNaGfxDfOjgQE+KvPGsWWsMsxWU6JRKQ82ndNweY3DpwxXM3DES6LCzEAx6cgsZG9frtuN56UOXZ1d8+ClqqhhgrHRlutooxnTuQ2Ocuh6czXYcbYW0bKSlmgXDLjbvprG/x5Yeyc+7g1r/qakwz8r48rMdSB1Q/1ny8oslgWnQX+9uy3wbD7Co5MYWFjLppP4y21WGUHQg6tyfkA6jjTJWDd12rzJ8c1B7K0MepcRB9WAXx6BE95WZow== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=taugh.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:cleverness; s=5406.61084e6a.k2108; bh=CYamZs/U+FE6NPwRL8DHANi6hqB2WgutsHsCTxNzyaU=; b=oMiXi6kFghSdkCnrsjLrKXnvY00g/vkyi4OEoXM2nThQ2iLY1hBXKyJaPGldoAMpJuQluxJoeJJL5BdOSlvBDCbe+ID3bJfDgvL06xBHUlMK0XFqZ0EFTXADZWlVHIOskGlr3pabaJj/Vf74kUhS7lOde5R5pfrG25NJ+jtcBR1kUBpXJkOSha9zN9zL2Up0C3y2LDF3Gaj2z9Ss+BgT2QWfhMYz3YGM2JUHTFDR+BEOALJ6d9z+ibrHdnDkK1zBiVUXb87ivCl0wINQLTJl9f1G7Fd9t8KOv8WBXuO1idCpvxJe5jNc4wNUOQua4ZYZz98yEjfygTK9Cf8mFk28Rw== Received: from ary.qy ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) by imap.iecc.com ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) with ESMTPS (TLS1.2 ECDHE-RSA AES-256-GCM AEAD) via TCP6; 02 Aug 2021 19:58:33 -0000 Received: by ary.qy (Postfix, from userid 501) id 4DAC9257A28E; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 15:58:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: 2 Aug 2021 15:58:33 -0400 Message-Id: <20210802195833.4DAC9257A28E@ary.qy> From: "John Levine" To: jmap@ietf.org Cc: neilj@fastmailteam.com In-Reply-To: Organization: Taughannock Networks X-Headerized: yes Cleverness: minimal Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] the large email (attachment) problem X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 19:58:42 -0000 It appears that Neil Jenkins said: >I *think* the bootstrap problem can be solved if most clients support multiple MIME parts correctly (which I think they probably must, because Apple's clients often >produce bodies like that). You have something like this: > >multipart/mixed > text/html *(The message body)* > multipart/alternative > text/html *(HTML representation of attachments, just like current G Drive etc.)* > message/external-body *(For external attachment aware clients)* I suppose, but if the HTML fits in the message, what's the point of the external version other than to debug your MUA? R's, John From nobody Mon Aug 2 13:50:02 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBA7C3A1BF4 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:50:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.096 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.096 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_BLOCKED=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmailteam.com header.b=gYnMs1Na; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=BCcXz8Rg Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JQLWARi3E7tX for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:49:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 979C63A1BF3 for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 13:49:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute3.internal (compute3.nyi.internal [10.202.2.43]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D779320091F; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 16:49:41 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute3.internal (MEProxy); Mon, 02 Aug 2021 16:49:41 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= fastmailteam.com; h=mime-version:message-id:in-reply-to :references:date:from:to:subject:content-type; s=fm3; bh=LR+vsGY sRSfaBEjV67N4g247rlsBb6Eb1Wq0vyblmio=; b=gYnMs1Nai2xHy+FpVRaUz02 ePP7qsc5QiGfqKHDlhooZYyhoL6l3VYNA7Csm0/YdE0tYXTC/kBUZ34TbTl+tCHf emX/jVG2DCsxcZNSL6KhdtV+sOOE4rgH4V4znTcqGqtQfRZEdbHPtp+VHiZWQNJJ CXxbB3eMVBIhSJ6zm7Pfpr9hj3lrUFlJ2Wr58N2K/fZkcrZ8wMo/3IMYKyJGWV3/ ZjpbR2bGoSWs6wB5+YQ6DKlPHAMAre3yL3scsxPHlkU4XCozLFRGyxwKY+5CxRxG kUWU2riuOP/uxb/Gt+vIqW2iTlWp8kaHdvunRlTjDZc6k5ze9KtoMuTRaCSZLQw= = DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=LR+vsG YsRSfaBEjV67N4g247rlsBb6Eb1Wq0vyblmio=; b=BCcXz8RgI8iggeL1FAkYmf So9cpiUw1ilfOvGr5b0aAkfUxo4jgHI2qhQzqmo0G6zxrHPoC+AzuePDHp4cplDu GuAQccgGVH732FcymjmYFW4rKO0UowTIOIV6EcD0Pmzf8mjHAgrBZpOI8X6Yv77L rEiwohlLgzfhGaCoyqXNEoUzMi6IXMrbTfsUDp15n2sd+CY15aoTgVG84sqGZSuH FfwNOdnloABUbef4zYynjlK8dPaBJ4lGG+8+BNmKfT6yyDvnMULi7rj0Eqr+tR/W OpLQqDkUOKUOFyaixOdVj2a9jUeXYEfg35htzOTZrwC7mCHNNIHX8NXtvs0CEhSg == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvtddriedvgddugedvucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmne cujfgurhepofgfggfkjghffffhvffutgesrgdtreerreertdenucfhrhhomhepfdfpvghi lhculfgvnhhkihhnshdfuceonhgvihhljhesfhgrshhtmhgrihhlthgvrghmrdgtohhmqe enucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeelffejieeigeetfefgvdfhieeitefgveetueeglefhvddu veefffevjeejffffkeenucffohhmrghinhepvgigrghmphhlvgdrtghomhenucevlhhush htvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehnvghilhhjsehfrghs thhmrghilhhtvggrmhdrtghomh X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id D05C2AC0E77; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 16:49:40 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-1029-g70f0079d2d-fm-ubox-20210801.001-g70f0079d Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <123cd685-5a76-4654-bcce-68c1cf5364bc@dogfood.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: <20210802195833.4DAC9257A28E@ary.qy> References: <20210802195833.4DAC9257A28E@ary.qy> Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2021 06:49:40 +1000 From: "Neil Jenkins" To: "John Levine" , "IETF JMAP Mailing List" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e616afdc605c4ba386f23d861776cade Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] the large email (attachment) problem X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 20:50:01 -0000 --e616afdc605c4ba386f23d861776cade Content-Type: text/plain On Tue, 3 Aug 2021, at 05:58, John Levine wrote: > I suppose, but if the HTML fits in the message, what's the point of the external version other > than to debug your MUA? Sorry, I wasn't clear. The HTML version is a (prettier version) of something like this:

Attachments

whatididonmyholiday.mp4 So if your client doesn't support the external body, it will instead show the sender-generated links to download the attachment (which is exactly what Google, Microsoft etc. currently do). But if it does support the external body, it can show it like any real attachment and offer the advantages we've discussed (immutability, privacy-preserving caching on delivery etc.). This provides a seamless upgrade path to offer the feature. Neil. --e616afdc605c4ba386f23d861776cade Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
On Tue, 3 Aug 2= 021, at 05:58, John Levine wrote:
I suppose, but if the HTML fits in the message, wha= t's the point of the external version other
than to debug = your MUA?

Sorry, I wasn't clea= r. The HTML version is a (prettier version) of something like this:
<= /div>

<h2>Attachments</h2>
<a href=3D"https:=
//example.com/download/large/file">whatididonmyholiday.mp4</a&=
gt;

So if your client doesn't support the e= xternal body, it will instead show the sender-generated links to downloa= d the attachment (which is exactly what Google, Microsoft etc. currently= do). But if it does support the external body, it can show it like any = real attachment and offer the advantages we've discussed (immutability, = privacy-preserving caching on delivery etc.). This provides a seamless u= pgrade path to offer the feature.

Neil.
=
--e616afdc605c4ba386f23d861776cade-- From nobody Mon Aug 2 14:48:43 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 130923A1E4B for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 14:48:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=iecc.com header.b=yhiRR747; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=taugh.com header.b=hMvKINyt Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LpCfY7djjLel for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 14:48:28 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gal.iecc.com (gal.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:43:6f73:7461]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 401DA3A1E0D for ; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 14:48:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 37712 invoked from network); 2 Aug 2021 21:48:25 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type; s=934e.61086829.k2108; bh=O66kqayO8FL6xlm3FQhu49cpSquSqVWO3wpTZ5Kl7e0=; b=yhiRR747klRSy6m1zpmsAIAUBJbNSbYma7uopIYb52c3Wl0DUjnVbOCSgTJ5DBczktKQKQr1f4tnSxAQQlHFsOphJWH9korFzETQmSV7HcIcwVaPd7hSK2pUAh+ioc9gPpUaI00e2nMicsq9+NdUlFyc+PT+Tv9h1E4yoHjgS7hi7lf/rHn9rd3a496UV+XXHApwVUineI00zT/4F0Qws1KLPrm81IUCgW7XlWwOSo8BZ1ISf+WvTTJFX5niCPrQEFcwshZTMCtOarAiNZoA4fOgHgbogqgh6St26UOP1s9rSm2DFsnwF45OvBkogViC5criSlFGLaegFej3K3Af3g== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=taugh.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type; s=934e.61086829.k2108; bh=O66kqayO8FL6xlm3FQhu49cpSquSqVWO3wpTZ5Kl7e0=; b=hMvKINytXQ6RoBze8vmBdouwAPL0eHrnK0MOLTmD3Zv1D9aLCUV8I1RPP6H0w3AWClnuagufuNmG4KOUoMjrHk2AvcZrJXT3T6wzK1wGFynv8Jyx7AH75r2Rvt4iahs/KXHDByqOLANmz/KY7MyBIEYbOus8C0W4t8ZioEyh6PizewFk0x+JinY1ne8vGr2qdM2rncpLD1xnlTQaEqDqn3awJwjAED2hSCXoBLU74M4z45UJZi3c+sXVf0uQqZ4q/qEQNl9UwL18tzqV2iyemh5pxbxmxDjRHRQOaIOTlUGNHovjg1FPhg3RV8Dxr220uYgh/6FxCVsAQNxffmJ7HA== Received: from ary.qy ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) by imap.iecc.com ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) with ESMTPS (TLS1.2 ECDHE-RSA AES-256-GCM AEAD) via TCP6; 02 Aug 2021 21:48:24 -0000 Received: by ary.qy (Postfix, from userid 501) id 48A5C257B626; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 17:48:23 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ary.qy (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0EC7257B608; Mon, 2 Aug 2021 17:48:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: 2 Aug 2021 17:48:23 -0400 Message-ID: <761d547b-e184-f039-fd19-7555556fc88@taugh.com> From: "John R Levine" To: "Neil Jenkins" , "IETF JMAP Mailing List" X-X-Sender: johnl@ary.qy In-Reply-To: <123cd685-5a76-4654-bcce-68c1cf5364bc@dogfood.fastmail.com> References: <20210802195833.4DAC9257A28E@ary.qy> <123cd685-5a76-4654-bcce-68c1cf5364bc@dogfood.fastmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] the large email (attachment) problem X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Aug 2021 21:48:41 -0000 >> I suppose, but if the HTML fits in the message, what's the point of the external version other >> than to debug your MUA? > > Sorry, I wasn't clear. The HTML version is a (prettier version) of something like this: > >

Attachments

> whatididonmyholiday.mp4 > > So if your client doesn't support the external body, it will instead show the sender-generated links to download the attachment (which is exactly what Google, Microsoft etc. currently do). But if it does support the external body, it can show it like any real attachment and offer the advantages we've discussed (immutability, privacy-preserving caching on delivery etc.). This provides a seamless upgrade path to offer the feature. Ah. Of course. Regards, John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Taughannock Networks, Trumansburg NY Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly From nobody Thu Aug 19 05:22:51 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietf.org Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E36A3A11D4; Thu, 19 Aug 2021 05:22:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Bron Gondwana via Datatracker To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.36.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Cc: brong@fastmailteam.com, iesg-secretary@ietf.org, jmap-chairs@ietf.org, jmap@ietf.org Message-ID: <162937576809.22451.16366574696832488293@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2021 05:22:48 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Jmap] Publication has been requested for draft-ietf-jmap-smime-07 X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2021 12:22:48 -0000 Bron Gondwana has requested publication of draft-ietf-jmap-smime-07 as Proposed Standard on behalf of the JMAP working group. Please verify the document's state at https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-smime/ From nobody Thu Aug 19 05:24:59 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A8A0C3A11ED for ; Thu, 19 Aug 2021 05:24:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmailteam.com header.b=YRtkXaYR; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=tYZqq4VG Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id efYxBzSXjqwM for ; Thu, 19 Aug 2021 05:24:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from out5-smtp.messagingengine.com (out5-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.29]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EBC4F3A11EB for ; Thu, 19 Aug 2021 05:24:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8023B5C014B; Thu, 19 Aug 2021 08:24:49 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Thu, 19 Aug 2021 08:24:49 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= fastmailteam.com; h=mime-version:message-id:in-reply-to :references:date:from:to:cc:subject:content-type; s=fm3; bh=Qc2S cLAAIZos2B6vMm4b1Evj63rkCP8R+1OqF49s9hM=; b=YRtkXaYRllw3+qCvfhks D+WROsW6uGaK5f5Lp2RIfyEic+JkM2/HgWxpKMkJHROXF2wsW03BcBKfFDzemo3t fufMzU7ZDCa5/s0BNQFknN9IDaZYbwYGQvKVReLQ1+CW0vXwMiLA+iffHCu4cqaI BVfLyp4AS9ZVuX+xOtJwaIYtzV2Q4wpFTN6A6ZLQmCPPf1oyBL1RZtId2QxCB+A/ h3G1UK4bj9DnHFWw/DgEIv/jvx7h8A5l3kH3Ma0HHVeCBJNWQE8FeD2MTD4pvImB ggKRRyKVU3M36AHbZ1VXj7cZm9GE2HGSXTZAJxQVED1F+9mPfhh9mZtAQMy9wiUd yA== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=Qc2ScL AAIZos2B6vMm4b1Evj63rkCP8R+1OqF49s9hM=; b=tYZqq4VGCJSyUiXcxuyG1J QUWGK8d6eZLE/HZI40Qggn6szS7haLhMv4Ozg9QwH0qlZaOSZGngAG9cu9H1K+IW eRfqMXbftZhNlPqfIOm4rZt/2EHaRmQtT09acei3KdlZzHYfqa4VFSaydYC+Z3us w8VEEGURjfdu0VBaDaZB5Yx+jM1B4/HuZe0E6kZpC9LaOXwpcVJhGfH1iUH/vePz eJR09/77zaL8q3q40U+PNW4vT2hxDLFEmj3n5uwbCaLGX6X+97vuQa75PfFvMYmP F5oLo1iqEv076Hkt3XXOfAXSFgr9XasmxJAEUYLW31igXGa2dssyu6+1P+j5dh/Q == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvtddrleejgdehudcutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenuc fjughrpefofgggkfgjfhffhffvufgtsegrtderreerredtnecuhfhrohhmpedfuehrohhn ucfiohhnugifrghnrgdfuceosghrohhnghesfhgrshhtmhgrihhlthgvrghmrdgtohhmqe enucggtffrrghtthgvrhhnpeffveefiefgjeevteehheelgeetleetveeguedthfehgffh tdejhfdvhefhtdekgfenucffohhmrghinhepihgvthhfrdhorhhgnecuvehluhhsthgvrh fuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomhepsghrohhnghesfhgrshhtmhgr ihhlthgvrghmrdgtohhm X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 16A5EAC0DD0; Thu, 19 Aug 2021 08:24:49 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-1118-g75eff666e5-fm-20210816.002-g75eff666 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <44e0696f-efd9-46a3-9946-d72674ba6cf7@dogfood.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: <322b349a-3346-406f-9605-b1aad3911bea@dogfood.fastmail.com> References: <322b349a-3346-406f-9605-b1aad3911bea@dogfood.fastmail.com> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2021 22:24:28 +1000 From: "Bron Gondwana" To: jmap@ietf.org Cc: "Alexey Melnikov" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=6722dd2595284bad808277fa9e33ed99 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] Call for adoption of draft-melnikov-jmap-smime-advanced X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2021 12:24:57 -0000 --6722dd2595284bad808277fa9e33ed99 Content-Type: text/plain Alexey, if you want to go ahead and upload with the working group name - nobody objected, so let's go with it. Bron. On Fri, Jul 30, 2021, at 16:27, Bron Gondwana wrote: > Hi All, > > This is the promised document from Alexey for creating S/MIME emails via JMAP: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-melnikov-jmap-smime-advanced/ > > The meeting at IETF111 had some comment about the name 'advanced', but were otherwise in favour of adoption. > > This message starts a formal call for adoption of this document. Please reply with any comments for or against. This call for adoption runs for 2 weeks and finishes on Friday 13 August 2021. > > If adopted, there will be opportunity for changes (like bikeshedding on the name 'advanced') before publishing. > > Thanks, > > Bron. > > -- > Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Ltd > brong@fastmailteam.com > > > _______________________________________________ > Jmap mailing list > Jmap@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap > -- Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Ltd brong@fastmailteam.com --6722dd2595284bad808277fa9e33ed99 Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Alexey, if you want to go ahead and upload with the w= orking group name - nobody objected, so let's go with it.

Bron.

On Fri, Jul 30, 2021, at 16:27, Bron Gondwana w= rote:
Hi All,

This is the promised docu= ment from Alexey for creating S/MIME emails via JMAP:

The meeting at IETF11= 1 had some comment about the name 'advanced', but were otherwise in favo= ur of adoption.

This message starts a formal call for ado= ption of this document.  Please reply with any comments for or agai= nst.  This call for adoption runs for 2 weeks and finishes on Frida= y 13 August 2021.

<= div style=3D"font-family:Arial;">If adopted, there will be opportunity f= or changes (like bikeshedding on the name 'advanced') before publishing.=

Thanks,

<= /div>
Bron.

--
  Bron Gondwana, C= EO, Fastmail Pty Ltd
  brong@f= astmailteam.com


__________________________= _____________________
Jmap mailing list


--
  Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fas= tmail Pty Ltd
  brong@fastmailtea= m.com


--6722dd2595284bad808277fa9e33ed99-- From nobody Thu Aug 19 05:25:43 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietf.org Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9174D3A11F6 for ; Thu, 19 Aug 2021 05:25:40 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.36.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <162937594057.21397.10865771134795545155@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2021 05:25:40 -0700 From: IETF Secretariat Archived-At: Subject: [Jmap] Milestones changed for jmap WG X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2021 12:25:41 -0000 Changed milestone "Submit JMAP S/MIME signature validation document to the IESG", resolved as "Done". URL: https://datatracker.ietf.org/wg/jmap/about/ From nobody Sat Aug 21 15:24:56 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 625663A1179 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:24:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.097 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mLc8W53uYH64 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:24:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vs1-xe2e.google.com (mail-vs1-xe2e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e2e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EF8CF3A1178 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:24:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vs1-xe2e.google.com with SMTP id t4so5711266vsm.5 for ; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:24:48 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=DNNr7MPMTcGig7p76/Bj5KLHUPtteS+X5nt8wdsIUMM=; b=XfL0ihRU/dTw4IFxcvLYAOiMxSXnyvc2BoYTbQLcwPz6oy/Zq1dUyy/oLBN9F2tvUR vnqu/hjqk9k2I49JRhh928JVPcQ8rbeoXkwZ6C5Jn3ZPvjb4dLaLf41VS7k+C6MeYIWc SiSJy2RcubYAn5J9utGq875gvhNRn15jKagUhuyxp77wBnsdbgu1mAPVWa6HywucVTZN 2R/yWuJ7nG8H8HwNXOqf6/fWs+yrno7oj1jNh4nALZ2QBt+CvJtvoqvHHzclSEUtqJSo I6M/upMzxO5/iuSeYg9fOPEPs18OvPln6m1kFwJ3zrK4U3QuI5+TYSJ3sNOaqdR4mP3k jjRw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to; bh=DNNr7MPMTcGig7p76/Bj5KLHUPtteS+X5nt8wdsIUMM=; b=b0OK2vmGPFbtTMRqdF06C1iSUeebsLbXRLUwW4ERrbR/Z1BlHFraiXrgsPH+ZaNyFW g4enel+dhZgMgveLtfMOF1wIcguOoP+HVMZkmaE9gIj9HpDMTqh0C69w8tQa0G8KbnYs xHGBU14FFDcZg1cK1RmYiQsoku90F2ge5w3J9W/hyNARrAfCfUZ4eVWveCktUFVzKgrb rjTJ0P7aMqj7jQHLjGZiiYfdnky+denwz4/F/+SGqcRYgX6hjU/yGvEDw5Pf5bIO5bHC SuWJHqvpO+hXJBbMlgp0mXjWereaKolK7oDvS0oX5SS5JX8N09AEMq5TUw42VxlLHvzK KvOQ== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530ysoOxFVZQd1xCRQoabyFfJcX/zBVOFsmH4aOCCC6qH6p68iuJ nm/NKCvd5dvMTX3YWhukvT8ZMpNsHGjCW/BDIYKKhtPLzVLTiA== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJw4nbNEhna3i6v3V1sY5s0tQuygns5fFfSh73ifjJGsCWCaQOnn0aRPTisps4YmPbyHD5oYwbIMjsuvnWeBhdA= X-Received: by 2002:a67:f8d5:: with SMTP id c21mr21106166vsp.40.1629584685585; Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:24:45 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <162937576809.22451.16366574696832488293@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <162937576809.22451.16366574696832488293@ietfa.amsl.com> From: "Murray S. Kucherawy" Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 15:24:32 -0700 Message-ID: To: jmap@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000050d9ff05ca19406d" Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] Publication has been requested for draft-ietf-jmap-smime-07 X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Aug 2021 22:24:55 -0000 --00000000000050d9ff05ca19406d Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Hi all, here's my AD review for this short document: Please use the correct boilerplate text for BCP 14. You've got the old version here. I suggest using "specification" rather than "spec" (e.g., in Section 3). And while I'm at it, it might be helpful to identify RFC 8620 as JMAP at its first use in Section 2, because then in Section 3 you refer to "the JMAP spec" but it's not clear which one that is. In Section 4, for "smimeStatus", mapping unrecognized values to "signal/failed" seems a curious choice. Why not allow only "unknown"? For Section 4, I suggest (but you don't have to) giving each property a separate subsection. Otherwise this is in good shape. The above things are minor enough that you can just handle them as Last Call comments, and I'll go request that now. -MSK On Thu, Aug 19, 2021 at 5:22 AM Bron Gondwana via Datatracker < noreply@ietf.org> wrote: > Bron Gondwana has requested publication of draft-ietf-jmap-smime-07 as > Proposed Standard on behalf of the JMAP working group. > > Please verify the document's state at > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-smime/ > > > --00000000000050d9ff05ca19406d Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi all, here's my AD review for this short docume= nt:

Please use the correct boilerplate text for BCP 14.= =C2=A0 You've got the old version here.

I sugg= est using "specification" rather than "spec" (e.g., in = Section 3).=C2=A0 And while I'm at it, it might be helpful to identify = RFC 8620 as JMAP at its first use in Section 2, because then in Section 3 y= ou refer to "the JMAP spec" but it's not clear which one that= is.

In Section 4, for "smimeStatus", ma= pping unrecognized values to "signal/failed" seems a curious choi= ce.=C2=A0 Why not allow only "unknown"?

= For Section 4, I suggest (but you don't have to) giving each property a= separate subsection.

Otherwise this is in good sh= ape.=C2=A0 The above things are minor enough that you can just handle them = as Last Call comments, and I'll go request that now.

-MSK



On Thu, Aug 19, 2021 at = 5:22 AM Bron Gondwana via Datatracker <noreply@ietf.org> wrote:
Bron Gondwana has requested publication of draft-ietf-jm= ap-smime-07 as Proposed Standard on behalf of the JMAP working group.

Please verify the document's state at htt= ps://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-smime/


--00000000000050d9ff05ca19406d-- From nobody Mon Aug 23 04:23:07 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 600603A0101 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 04:23:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.099 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.099 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=isode.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6Pstu_iJX74X for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 04:23:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from statler.isode.com (Statler.isode.com [62.232.206.189]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 105EA3A0127 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 04:23:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; t=1629717778; d=isode.com; s=june2016; i=@isode.com; bh=1QAiLSnc5hl5W1DdnPTRJb4Z/ua7Vje+F/6BiWbmFn4=; h=From:Sender:Reply-To:Subject:Date:Message-ID:To:Cc:MIME-Version: In-Reply-To:References:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding: Content-ID:Content-Description; b=MSJsbrEswj8SnZLtu5v7tcLbICPE1ReytCFQNiOE+yWfhpujbsr5sE2ZiI3aVPk44kK9iC 3sQfrfrITXvqi6aUbEbP7rCC3Rx2ZSG0NdxfZDbBuVG4nMN9Tr0xEh5cz13bUc8IpfGMmN etBbkOFI0TcTCJjEd/DSGVDXPxJZNiM=; Received: from [192.168.0.5] ((unknown) [94.3.228.58]) by statler.isode.com (submission channel) via TCP with ESMTPSA id ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 12:22:57 +0100 X-SMTP-Protocol-Errors: NORDNS To: "Murray S. Kucherawy" , jmap@ietf.org References: <162937576809.22451.16366574696832488293@ietfa.amsl.com> From: Alexey Melnikov Message-ID: Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 12:22:57 +0100 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:78.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/78.12.0 In-Reply-To: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------BAFD7E286DEE9A48A138901B" Content-Language: en-GB Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] Publication has been requested for draft-ietf-jmap-smime-07 X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 11:23:06 -0000 --------------BAFD7E286DEE9A48A138901B Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Hi Murray, Thank you for your review. On 21/08/2021 23:24, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote: > Hi all, here's my AD review for this short document: > > Please use the correct boilerplate text for BCP 14.=C2=A0 You've got the= =20 > old version here. Fixed in my copy. > I suggest using "specification" rather than "spec" (e.g., in Section 3). Changed. > And while I'm at it, it might be helpful to identify RFC 8620 as JMAP=20 > at its first use in Section 2, because then in Section 3 you refer to=20 > "the JMAP spec" but it's not clear which one that is. Good point. I corrected that. > > In Section 4, for "smimeStatus", mapping unrecognized values to=20 > "signal/failed" seems a curious choice.=C2=A0 Why not allow only "unknown"= ? I think it depends on the application. If one wants to enforce presence=20 of valid S/MIME signatures, anything which is unrecognized is=20 "signed/failed" in a way. But I don't have a strong feeling and can=20 change this. > For Section 4, I suggest (but you don't have to) giving each property=20 > a separate subsection. I will have a look how much work this is. I might ask RFC Editor ;-). Best Regards, Alexey > Otherwise this is in good shape.=C2=A0 The above things are minor enough= =20 > that you can just handle them as Last Call comments, and I'll go=20 > request that now. > > -MSK > > > > On Thu, Aug 19, 2021 at 5:22 AM Bron Gondwana via Datatracker=20 > > wrote: > > Bron Gondwana has requested publication of > draft-ietf-jmap-smime-07 as Proposed Standard on behalf of the > JMAP working group. > > Please verify the document's state at > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-smime/ > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Jmap mailing list > Jmap@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap --------------BAFD7E286DEE9A48A138901B Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Murray,

Thank you for your review.

On 21/08/2021 23:24, Murray S. Kucherawy wrote:
Hi all, here's my AD review for this short document:

Please use the correct boilerplate text for BCP 14.=C2=A0 You'v= e got the old version here.
Fixed in my copy.
I suggest using "specification" rather than "spec" (e.g., in Section 3).
Changed.
And while I'm at it, it might be helpful to identify RFC 8620 as JMAP at its first use in Section 2, because then in Section 3 you refer to "the JMAP spec" but it's not clear which one that is.
Good point. I corrected that.

In Section 4, for "smimeStatus", mapping unrecognized values to "signal/failed" seems a curious choice.=C2=A0 Why not allow only "unknown"?
I think it depends on the application. If one wants to enforce presence of valid S/MIME signatures, anything which is unrecognized is "signed/failed" in a way. But I don't have a strong feeling and can change this.
For Section 4, I suggest (but you don't have to) giving each property a separate subsection.
I will have a look how much work this is. I might ask RFC Editor ;-).


Best Regards,

Alexey

Otherwise this is in good shape.=C2=A0 The above things are minor enough that you can just handle them as Last Call comments, and I'll go request that now.

-MSK



On Thu, Aug 19, 2021 at 5:22 AM Bron Gondwana via Datatracker <norepl= y@ietf.org> wrote:
Bro= n Gondwana has requested publication of draft-ietf-jmap-smime-07 as Proposed Standard on behalf of the JMAP working group.

Please verify the document's state at ht= tps://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-smime/



_______________________________=
________________
Jmap mailing list
Jmap@iet=
f.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap
--------------BAFD7E286DEE9A48A138901B-- From nobody Mon Aug 23 06:59:53 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC4A93A1BDC for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 06:59:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmailteam.com header.b=YoYT+gW5; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=wXWhnrvO Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GN4JwDAiX-3c for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 06:59:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from out3-smtp.messagingengine.com (out3-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.27]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EB07E3A1BD8 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 06:59:44 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute4.internal (compute4.nyi.internal [10.202.2.44]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id D46875C00D6 for ; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 09:59:43 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute4.internal (MEProxy); Mon, 23 Aug 2021 09:59:43 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= fastmailteam.com; h=mime-version:message-id:in-reply-to :references:date:from:to:subject:content-type; s=fm3; bh=L6CAz+8 UCK2pabsRlr4rpfTNCGtBUWi6MTJzQ1umUfw=; b=YoYT+gW5K2zsI9eGThwL2y2 JEdTuvZ/kEUHSh690Jpt4k1/97EX4mXWpRg6AcFc4XgHaLmFS7jVzyNKX0YUdaao 8RjokuIfSkofwUko8/0CVY8KtmtaxRosQJuEJTSLX/sUkR/NWNYhla6sJDgUrmHz ZBrKOYD58rkOO9P0pPo9XYJYMmbqk1ba3r6e8AMRdizJk/KPzsyQFhs3yidtvIJN b0hsR2hFXhs6CAut7sdpdpvR9naXsUi6UiyR15+gvuRzlUf2n/MknCW1NO0Jetmb 3RMBGAwZvRMwTzAYMV0s0gMO7WHv85HiJPjaUd2+G+qEIoJHhIDbbALAn/lImgw= = DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=L6CAz+ 8UCK2pabsRlr4rpfTNCGtBUWi6MTJzQ1umUfw=; b=wXWhnrvO38X7DdfZzAP2yE KbMt9qee7lmXXIFN3om211pskhovE+Byu/mkaLkN15QXQ9cydVEYfNNYMHZ28eOc 8VsqFu1aW0i+ppSuhDwxXE+LlNTUB+GcAg2mBGV8me3gFGpYAokJK47WDVg+QWtX TqPLI/u2FBMku0HaFGn9TBf6cbyzOEKWlbb6DqaBR5gcLBBQiAw/88Jr8g9MAdbw FdpL2BQONnTbgloBAmwLzVSaWKVQOeN8/BSHhuTUD+TIt5ty4T2CZUThMHQGUmMJ tQnHXZWRRPVNnxgbeSRqja7O42/9k1501fwKaDa2D0EGEXyILhTKgiTK+urmX8tA == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvtddruddthedgjedvucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucenucfjughrpefofgggkfgjfhffhffvufgtsegrtd erreerreejnecuhfhrohhmpedftfhosggvrhhtucfuthgvphgrnhgvkhdfuceorhhsthho sehfrghsthhmrghilhhtvggrmhdrtghomheqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnheptdejteffgf evgfeuueekjeevleelteeuuddvieeuieduffefveetgfejfefghfevnecuffhomhgrihhn pehivghtfhdrohhrghdprghuughrihhgrgdrtghomhdpthifihhtthgvrhdrtghomhenuc evlhhushhtvghrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpehrshhtohes fhgrshhtmhgrihhlthgvrghmrdgtohhm X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id E64E0AC0362; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 09:59:42 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-1118-g75eff666e5-fm-20210816.002-g75eff666 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <6ebce8ae-1353-4314-b8fe-845cac6529f8@www.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: <13211b0d-a5c5-5b6e-3477-000d775eadbd@audriga.com> References: <5829f2c2-5ea5-44fb-aff4-5fc9bed78622@dogfood.fastmail.com> <99e9fdfd-7612-1949-0362-8f8c87143775@fastmail.com> <13211b0d-a5c5-5b6e-3477-000d775eadbd@audriga.com> Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 15:59:22 +0200 From: "Robert Stepanek" To: jmap@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=17b122a19c1a47979124197df1d95139 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] JSContact: how to localize content X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 13:59:52 -0000 --17b122a19c1a47979124197df1d95139 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks to all for your feedback. We will replace LocalizedString with th= e "localizations" property in the next draft version. Cheers, Robert On Fri, Jul 23, 2021, at 8:38 AM, Joris Baum wrote: > Total agreement from my side as well :) . >=20 > On 22.07.21 14:42, Ken Murchison wrote: >> I agree with all of Neil's points. >>=20 >>=20 >>=20 >> On 7/22/21 8:05 AM, Neil Jenkins wrote: >>> I am very much in favour of the proposed approach rather than the cu= rrent approach. Our experience with vCards at least is that the vast maj= ority of contact cards to do not store multiple localised forms. The pro= posed approach makes sense both from a consistency point with JSCalendar= , and more importantly it keeps the simple case simple, which makes adop= tion much easier. >>>=20 >>> Neil. >>>=20 >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Jmap mailing list >>> Jmap@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap >>>=20 >> --=20 >> Kenneth Murchison >> Senior Software Developer >> Fastmail US LLC >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Jmap mailing list >> Jmap@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap >>=20 > --=20 > Joris Baum > Tel: +49 721 170293 16 > Fax: +49 721 170293 179 >=20 > http://www.audriga.com | http://www.twitter.com/audriga >=20 > ----------------------------------------------------------------------= ---- > audriga GmbH | Durlacher Allee 47 | 76131 Karlsruhe > Sitz der Gesellschaft: Karlsruhe - Amtsgericht Mannheim - HRB 713034 > Gesch=C3=A4ftsf=C3=BChrer: Dr. Frank Dengler, Dr.-Ing. Hans-J=C3=B6rg = Happel > ----------------------------------------------------------------------= ---- > _______________________________________________ > Jmap mailing list > Jmap@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap >=20 --17b122a19c1a47979124197df1d95139 Content-Type: text/html;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks to = all for your feedback. We will replace LocalizedString with the "localiz= ations" property in the next draft version.

Cheers,
Robert

On Fri, Jul 2= 3, 2021, at 8:38 AM, Joris Baum wrote:

Total agreement from my side as well :) .
<= /p>

On 22.07.21 14:42, Ken Murchison wr= ote:

I agree with all of Neil's points.
=


On 7/22/21 8:05 AM, Nei= l Jenkins wrote:
I am very much in = favour of the proposed approach rather than the current approach. Our experience with vCards at least is that the vast majority of contact cards to do not store multiple localised forms. The proposed approach makes sense both from a consistency point with JSCalendar, and more importantly it keeps the simple case simple, which makes adoption much easier.

Neil.

_____________________=
__________________________
Jmap mailing list
J=
map@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap

--=20
Kenneth Murchison
Senior Software Developer
Fastmail US LLC

=
_______________________________________________
Jmap mailing list
J=
map@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap

--=20
Joris Baum
Tel: +49 721 170293 16
Fax: +49 721 170293 179

ht=
tp://www.audriga.com | http://www.twitter.com/audriga

------------------------------------------------------------------------=
--
audriga GmbH | Durlacher Allee 47 | 76131 Karlsruhe
Sitz der Gesellschaft: Karlsruhe - Amtsgericht Mannheim - HRB 713034
Gesch=C3=A4ftsf=C3=BChrer: Dr. Frank Dengler, Dr.-Ing. Hans-J=C3=B6rg Ha=
ppel
------------------------------------------------------------------------=
--
_______________________________________________
Jmap mailing list
<= div>

--17b122a19c1a47979124197df1d95139-- From nobody Mon Aug 23 09:34:02 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietf.org Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B16033A1480; Mon, 23 Aug 2021 09:34:00 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: The IESG To: "IETF-Announce" X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.36.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk CC: brong@fastmailteam.com, draft-ietf-jmap-smime@ietf.org, jmap-chairs@ietf.org, jmap@ietf.org, superuser@gmail.com Reply-To: last-call@ietf.org Sender: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <162973643988.9956.6643048610278386263@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 09:34:00 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Jmap] Last Call: (S/MIME signature verification extension to JMAP) to Proposed Standard X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Aug 2021 16:34:01 -0000 The IESG has received a request from the JSON Mail Access Protocol WG (jmap) to consider the following document: - 'S/MIME signature verification extension to JMAP' as Proposed Standard The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits final comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the last-call@ietf.org mailing lists by 2021-09-04. Exceptionally, comments may be sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the beginning of the Subject line to allow automated sorting. Abstract This document specifies an extension to JMAP for returning S/MIME signature verification status. The file can be obtained via https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-smime/ No IPR declarations have been submitted directly on this I-D. From nobody Tue Aug 24 00:30:37 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietf.org Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07D2E3A0AF1; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 00:30:36 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: jmap@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.36.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: jmap@ietf.org Message-ID: <162979023587.19029.15509717875037771799@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 00:30:35 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Jmap] I-D Action: draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02.txt X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 07:30:36 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the JSON Mail Access Protocol WG of the IETF. Title : JMAP for Quotas Author : René Cordier Filename : draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2021-08-24 Abstract: This document specifies a data model for handling quotas on accounts with a server using JMAP. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-quotas/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Aug 24 00:33:58 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A5953A0B69 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 00:33:54 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.221 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.221 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_INVALID=0.1, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTML_MIME_NO_HTML_TAG=0.377, MIME_HTML_ONLY=0.1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=neutral reason="invalid (public key: not available)" header.d=linagora.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aoCTsKIrdftl for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 00:33:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.linagora.com (smtp.linagora.com [54.36.8.78]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 94E433A0B53 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 00:33:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?Open?PaaS?SMTP?server?for?Linagora? (unknown [51.83.109.124]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by smtp.linagora.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 09CDC4193F for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 09:33:42 +0200 (CEST) DKIM-Signature: a=rsa-sha256; b=BcN1dU8WnGh/ptwmGOIfPPhyl683lEB02aVWvmvOgqll9qBLg4Cp8A48LFsSgfsRMxzRcksVmCdDoazoa3DxS4Qjn+6z3QM407bm8DWcW8kAOlQeDdHgXQYKXTzTHSh2Mc1sDvoaQwpHflrh7O30TRokrdt8eCqB2udwz0MxkpJCpHEERYCByKfAVhClXGJ9pLSHlH1cJkCN6Cd+6i692vTcoWST7/cKyqMYn9PjmHz4h2regm/9RDEHin/ZOWkwmn25Dc+O4vXRV+viEL4mtxIxMyNzVIWUQqpZEjLYJ9uAwhrOLmh+qWVMvWZ6207zOpvXVfo5EdMDeG+9mbLfIw==; s=smtpoutjames; d=linagora.com; v=1; bh=3JT9a/QK4ATm56RAe6P8DbREEfogrLwkdDWBP9hNcRU=; h=from : reply-to : subject : date : to : cc : resent-date : resent-from : resent-sender : resent-to : resent-cc : in-reply-to : references : list-id : list-help : list-unsubscribe : list-subscribe : list-post : list-owner : list-archive; MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-LINAGORA-Copy-Delivery-Done: 1 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Ren=E9_CORDIER?= Sender: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Ren=E9_CORDIER?= Reply-To: rcordier@linagora.com To: "jmap@ietf.org" Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 07:33:40 +0000 References: <162979023587.19029.15509717875037771799@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <162979023587.19029.15509717875037771799@ietfa.amsl.com> Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] I-D Action: draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02.txt X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 07:33:55 -0000

Hi guys,

Sorry it took me a while before getting back to it, but h= ere is a new draft=2E I tried to make it gender neutral, and more generic (= it was a bit too mail term based before), modified a few other things and r= eorganize some sections=2E

Let me know what you think, any kind of fe= edback is always appreciated=2E

Cheers,

Rene=2E

On= August 24, 2021 2:30 PM, from internet-drafts@ietf=2EorgA New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directo= ries=2E
This draft is a work item of the JSON Mail Access Protocol WG of= the IETF=2E

Title : JMAP for Quotas
Au= thor : Ren=C3=A9 Cordier
Filename : draft-ietf-jmap-quo= tas-02=2Etxt
Pages : 9
Date : 2021-08-24
Abstract:
This document specifies a data model for handling quotas = on accounts
with a server using JMAP=2E


The IETF datatrack= er status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker=2Eietf=2Eorg/doc/d= raft-ietf-jmap-quotas/

There is also an htmlized version available a= t:
https://datatracker=2Eietf=2Eorg/doc/html/draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02
A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www=2Eie= tf=2Eorg/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02


Internet-Draft= s are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp=2Eietf=2Eorg/interne= t-drafts/


_______________________________________________
Jma= p mailing list
Jmap@ietf=2Eorg
https://www=2Eietf=2Eorg/mailman/listi= nfo/jmap From nobody Tue Aug 24 04:05:32 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8A783A2294 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 04:05:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmailteam.com header.b=o22QkYc4; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=D6Xy1CXj Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CiZTa0wHz-_x for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 04:05:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wout3-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout3-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.19]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 89C483A2295 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 04:05:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67E0C3200A63; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 07:05:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 24 Aug 2021 07:05:21 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= fastmailteam.com; h=mime-version:message-id:in-reply-to :references:date:from:to:subject:content-type; s=fm3; bh=1z6fwz+ AChvP1RCcKRLw05uqwgJgv77+RNsoH+lBDLI=; b=o22QkYc4jWA4UPV4mYMx+iy iSBNNQojENLMFKrOkpnrjijfvUSmtpZ14/o5hjy09vuXxU4Hawu22KPOGlkuFOJC a5yCtNPQcGKZnnYOJmBS8Gi7Cam8gqI/a7jrCf1FJBB+ljiUTfX5FCydJJ9OmHPE uINGXGPdD27hfYAE4DK5+zVtUdQMHV8pjLvP2MTRr09r4mHlZEAXLianyACjmZYk NKTBfCNG7B47/bCDehnW6JISPNSgUPVvjfSY3xKD0lf2b7GA7NznMyHlH6gJYNeV x7qnCi1jEP2c/LO+m3ongYbg69OKYlHWOtdDO2iqaHyFLEbnse0BVKSV1snby8Q= = DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=1z6fwz +AChvP1RCcKRLw05uqwgJgv77+RNsoH+lBDLI=; b=D6Xy1CXjtIwUw5O2QoG64y xonQh0lHmg4uHHDQtjKPNq37x4U8g0OC9AYRwUC9zW+C2AndBQcBa0Z5TC8+L3tP O4kKV09NDfRjxM6Fc/h08S2kxuGLs/VVaH6pkIwn5XTTn9ZI+yRQJ9o++KS7ALzc KeIOEVJSCXoTOQGWqtqNETedK9yXiVLDkc3HtYx2tm85QErIj+kIieeaLhmc+fbL iwhTNVldc92Tt+OIDWMgFW/rizVI2ai5D7W2wnWaBN41KsC4tElhFps/6MyXIRby 10IgZWZbbrc0JmefyMsydUi9bHuOatvQE5PP7hSwPuIYvv9gnpj+2b9a4o5PBY1Q == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvtddruddtjedgfeeiucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmne cujfgurhepofgfggfkjghffffhvffutgesrgdtreerreerjeenucfhrhhomhepfdeurhho nhcuifhonhgufigrnhgrfdcuoegsrhhonhhgsehfrghsthhmrghilhhtvggrmhdrtghomh eqnecuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhepffdvkeefgeelieeutedttdffheevvefffeekuddvtddt keeigfejuddvhfdvudelnecuffhomhgrihhnpehivghtfhdrohhrghenucevlhhushhtvg hrufhiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpegsrhhonhhgsehfrghsthhm rghilhhtvggrmhdrtghomh X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 55E91AC0E93; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 07:05:20 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-1124-g8f1c7cb9de-fm-20210824.001-g8f1c7cb9 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <162979023587.19029.15509717875037771799@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 21:05:00 +1000 From: "Bron Gondwana" To: =?UTF-8?Q?Ren=C3=A9_CORDIER?= , "jmap@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=231580848aee4466b4ab14386b24cdf4 Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] I-D Action: draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02.txt X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 11:05:30 -0000 --231580848aee4466b4ab14386b24cdf4 Content-Type: text/plain;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks for this! Everyone, please review this version so we can keep this draft moving. Cheers, Bron. On Tue, Aug 24, 2021, at 17:33, Ren=C3=A9 CORDIER wrote: > Hi guys, >=20 > Sorry it took me a while before getting back to it, but here is a new = draft. I tried to make it gender neutral, and more generic (it was a bit= too mail term based before), modified a few other things and reorganize= some sections. >=20 > Let me know what you think, any kind of feedback is always appreciated. >=20 > Cheers, >=20 > Rene. >=20 > On August 24, 2021 2:30 PM, from internet-drafts@ietf.org >> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts di= rectories. >> This draft is a work item of the JSON Mail Access Protocol WG of the = IETF. >>=20 >> Title : JMAP for Quotas >> Author : Ren=C3=A9 Cordier >> Filename : draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02.txt >> Pages : 9 >> Date : 2021-08-24 >>=20 >> Abstract: >> This document specifies a data model for handling quotas on accounts >> with a server using JMAP. >>=20 >>=20 >> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-quotas/ >>=20 >> There is also an htmlized version available at: >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02 >>=20 >> A diff from the previous version is available at: >> https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02 >>=20 >>=20 >> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >>=20 >>=20 >> _______________________________________________ >> Jmap mailing list >> Jmap@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap > _______________________________________________ > Jmap mailing list > Jmap@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/jmap >=20 -- Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Ltd brong@fastmailteam.com --231580848aee4466b4ab14386b24cdf4 Content-Type: text/html;charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Thanks for this!

Everyone, please review th= is version so we can keep this draft moving.

Cheers,
<= /div>

Bron.


On Tue, Aug 24, 2021, at 17:33, Ren=C3=A9 CORDIER wrote:

Hi guys,

So= rry it took me a while before getting back to it, but here is a new draf= t. I tried to make it gender neutral, and more generic (it was a bit too= mail term based before), modified a few other things and reorganize som= e sections.

Let me know what you think, any kind of feedback i= s always appreciated.

Cheers,

Rene.

On August 24, 2021 2:30 PM, from internet-drafts@ietf.org
A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line = Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of = the JSON Mail Access Protocol WG of the IETF.

Title : JMAP for Quotas
Author : R= en=C3=A9 Cordier
Filename : draft-ietf-jmap-quotas= -02.txt
Pages : 9
Date = : 2021-08-24

Abstract:
Thi= s document specifies a data model for handling quotas on accounts
with a server using JMAP.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-quotas/
=
There is also an htmlized version available at:
=
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-jmap-quotas-02
=

A diff from the previous version is available = at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-jmap-qu= otas-02


Internet-Drafts are = also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/int= ernet-drafts/


______________= _________________________________
Jmap mailing list
Jmap@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinf= o/jmap
______________________________________= _________
Jmap mailing list


--
<= /div>
  Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Lt= d
  brong@fastmailteam.com


--231580848aee4466b4ab14386b24cdf4-- From nobody Tue Aug 24 05:26:32 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietf.org Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3ED633A0E8A; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 05:26:29 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: Cc: jmap@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 7.36.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Reply-To: jmap@ietf.org Message-ID: <162980798919.22507.16547384340961436175@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 05:26:29 -0700 Archived-At: Subject: [Jmap] I-D Action: draft-ietf-jmap-smime-sender-extensions-00.txt X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 12:26:30 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the JSON Mail Access Protocol WG of the IETF. Title : JMAP extension for S/MIME signing and encryption Author : Alexey Melnikov Filename : draft-ietf-jmap-smime-sender-extensions-00.txt Pages : 6 Date : 2021-08-19 Abstract: This document specifies an extension to JMAP for sending S/MIME signed and S/MIME encrypted messages. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-smime-sender-extensions/ There is also an htmlized version available at: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-jmap-smime-sender-extensions-00 Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Tue Aug 24 12:33:11 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCC0C3A0E48 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 12:33:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.897 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id MQawr_aLyEBS for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 12:33:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail.smeinc.net (mail.smeinc.net [209.135.209.11]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 244AD3A0E52 for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 12:33:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mail.smeinc.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95F6D300CBA for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 15:24:44 -0400 (EDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at mail.smeinc.net Received: from mail.smeinc.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mail.smeinc.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id HBb0OcAPggQy for ; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 15:24:42 -0400 (EDT) Received: from a860b60074bd.fios-router.home (pool-141-156-161-153.washdc.fios.verizon.net [141.156.161.153]) by mail.smeinc.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 9FAE0300BFC; Tue, 24 Aug 2021 15:24:42 -0400 (EDT) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 12.4 \(3445.104.21\)) From: Russ Housley In-Reply-To: <162973643988.9956.6643048610278386263@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 15:24:41 -0400 Cc: draft-ietf-jmap-smime@ietf.org, jmap-chairs@ietf.org, jmap@ietf.org, Last Call Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: <70253C0A-38DF-4229-9105-36C63EC5DB4C@vigilsec.com> References: <162973643988.9956.6643048610278386263@ietfa.amsl.com> To: Alexey Melnikov X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.104.21) Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Jmap] Last Call: (S/MIME signature verification extension to JMAP) to Proposed Standard X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 19:33:09 -0000 If the server performs a signature verification, and then the client = performs a signature verification, the results might not be the same due = to different trust anchor stores or a revocation that takes place = between the two verifications. I think this situation should be = described in the Security Considerations. Russ > On Aug 23, 2021, at 12:34 PM, The IESG = wrote: >=20 >=20 > The IESG has received a request from the JSON Mail Access Protocol WG = (jmap) > to consider the following document: - 'S/MIME signature verification > extension to JMAP' > as Proposed Standard >=20 > The IESG plans to make a decision in the next few weeks, and solicits = final > comments on this action. Please send substantive comments to the > last-call@ietf.org mailing lists by 2021-09-04. Exceptionally, = comments may > be sent to iesg@ietf.org instead. In either case, please retain the = beginning > of the Subject line to allow automated sorting. >=20 > Abstract >=20 > This document specifies an extension to JMAP for returning S/MIME > signature verification status. >=20 > The file can be obtained via > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-smime/ >=20 From nobody Wed Aug 25 06:42:10 2021 Return-Path: X-Original-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: jmap@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 691613A0922; Wed, 25 Aug 2021 06:42:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.1 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.1 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=fastmailteam.com header.b=S/iKCPBC; dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com header.b=svhwvaM/ Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5TQT6jEyugxQ; Wed, 25 Aug 2021 06:41:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com (wout5-smtp.messagingengine.com [64.147.123.21]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EA6763A0932; Wed, 25 Aug 2021 06:41:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from compute6.internal (compute6.nyi.internal [10.202.2.46]) by mailout.west.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C5EB32003D3; Wed, 25 Aug 2021 09:41:55 -0400 (EDT) Received: from imap43 ([10.202.2.93]) by compute6.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 25 Aug 2021 09:41:55 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= fastmailteam.com; h=mime-version:message-id:date:from:to:cc :subject:content-type; s=fm3; bh=+Mge5Fml0RtkjJUuEqQY9Ea5kYoyWwM 0jEx/TJdfxOA=; b=S/iKCPBC15kf9k/m3VfH0WikCvh9I8p2L8AgtzJdsPbFv8M guAdGMr7Qy9AM96vLgkBzbJwGBk/cKGbhNaszUWPa0AHs7poVCVNHtC/NCLJXbjz w0Sl1MVMj9BlZ7bWkL1BgoK1IDbvdT+o+9gUwE04/2B13L+h+uMSzdTEJcGYxqq1 7afrJSB7lfBMinptEBK9dtxr+bfjJIF5oJCTV+umv0fnM292DDF4/Cogp8gaA8LF 4NR2Fh5UJToi0eII5xv+YW/53I8p7ttoEsSQSPJKSW55RrClazvAa4QEcy037m0e yLv5R1wYQFEAmyw/kjOOBnoX3QanTChW+nYNYDw== DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=cc:content-type:date:from:message-id :mime-version:subject:to:x-me-proxy:x-me-proxy:x-me-sender :x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm3; bh=+Mge5Fml0RtkjJUuEqQY9Ea5kYoyW wM0jEx/TJdfxOA=; b=svhwvaM/ji/wRBi+ZrJYKJXBW85DejRW8/Si2PAtm7llw xfbROQx9QyNoslByGfhzVx58l7jtzAqBIzlTTOZG3EtMZhCD7M9LuZpkBCBkmSZX IRuok74Gl56PawmiVUXQFzugDjg3pbpImAyB3qesjUCh9cSGXCxS+cxpkRb4XbMF pMu4w56iv/8J5SQaWcwVajGU7uGyPRjcjC5y/CXjqKOEZgfeIEafaIH8LCgL+EpA pVUHlbmwXv3OGmtRLB8tEA4E3zQ9B4xh8DaDze7VIB5BD38UxVVtNVqBmRjzR4O3 UTzIUMTk2T89fVVdWNMPcsRlpTCsrY35LmSsSijuQ== X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedvtddruddtledgieekucetufdoteggodetrfdotf fvucfrrhhofhhilhgvmecuhfgrshhtofgrihhlpdfqfgfvpdfurfetoffkrfgpnffqhgen uceurghilhhouhhtmecufedttdenucesvcftvggtihhpihgvnhhtshculddquddttddmne cujfgurhepofgfggfkfffhvffutgesrgdtreerreertdenucfhrhhomhepfdeurhhonhcu ifhonhgufigrnhgrfdcuoegsrhhonhhgsehfrghsthhmrghilhhtvggrmhdrtghomheqne cuggftrfgrthhtvghrnhephfejheekjeekheevuedtjeetiefhffefudeitddtjefhleet veeuheduledtueffnecuffhomhgrihhnpehivghtfhdrohhrghenucevlhhushhtvghruf hiiigvpedtnecurfgrrhgrmhepmhgrihhlfhhrohhmpegsrhhonhhgsehfrghsthhmrghi lhhtvggrmhdrtghomh X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 7F750AC0DD1; Wed, 25 Aug 2021 09:41:54 -0400 (EDT) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.5.0-alpha0-1125-g685cec594c-fm-20210825.001-g685cec59 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2021 23:41:29 +1000 From: "Bron Gondwana" To: calsify@ietf.org, jmap@ietf.org Cc: "Joris Baum" , =?UTF-8?Q?Happel_Hans-J=C3=B6rg?= Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=e5963580dbb7413db651f4233c5e18ff Archived-At: Subject: [Jmap] Call for review: draft-ietf-calext-ical-tasks-00 X-BeenThere: jmap@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: JSON Message Access Protocol List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Aug 2021 13:42:05 -0000 --e5963580dbb7413db651f4233c5e18ff Content-Type: text/plain Hi All, (I have included both the CALEXT and JMAP working group lists on this message) This document has now been uploaded as a working group document for CALEXT. Per our meeting at IETF111, then plan is to work on this immediately with a goal of publishing soon. I'm not quite ready to do a working group last call yet, but hopefully we can do one soon. The document is here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-calext-ical-tasks/ I'm particularly interested in some cross review against the planned JMAP tasks work, hence including the JMAP group as well: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-jmap-tasks/ *Please note:* there has been an IPR disclosure for an earlier version of this document. It's worth reading that too (it's not very long) to see which parts of the document may be affected: https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/2518/ Regards, Bron. -- Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Ltd brong@fastmailteam.com --e5963580dbb7413db651f4233c5e18ff Content-Type: text/html Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi All,

(I have included both the CALEXT an= d JMAP working group lists on this message)

This document= has now been uploaded as a working group document for CALEXT.  Per= our meeting at IETF111, then plan is to work on this immediately with a= goal of publishing soon.  I'm not quite ready to do a working grou= p last call yet, but hopefully we can do one soon.  The document is= here:


=
I'm particularly interested in some cr= oss review against the planned JMAP tasks work, hence including the JMAP= group as well:

https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-j= map-tasks/

Please note: there has been an IPR disc= losure for an earlier version of this document.   It's worth r= eading that too (it's not very long) to see which parts of the document = may be affected:

https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/2518/

Regards= ,

Bron.

--
  Bron Gondwana, CEO, Fastmail Pty Ltd
<= div class=3D"signature">  brong@fastmailteam.com


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