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Subject: [keyprov] PSKC phone conference meeting Minutes 28/10/07
Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2007 11:54:00 +0100
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Thread-Topic: [keyprov] PSKC phone conference meeting Minutes 28/10/07
Thread-Index: AcgcdYJoObidqSrrQJyZceJaRw15sQ==
From: "Philip Hoyer" <philip.hoyer@actividentity.com>
To: <Hannes.Tschofenig@gmx.net>, "Hallam-Baker, Phillip" <pbaker@verisign.com>,
	"Pei, Mingliang" <mpei@verisign.com>,
	"CHANG Shuh" <shuh.chang@gemalto.com>, <smachani@diversinet.com>
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Attendees:

Philip Hoyer, Ming Pei, Shuh Chang.

Apologies: Phillip Hallam Baker

=20

Discussed new version of the PSKC schema that Ming prepared for new
version of DSKPP.

=20

=20

1)       Missing URIs, what do we do. Philip proposed adding the one we
know. We need to agree at least on HOTP. Should we define URI in the
PSKC document or somewhere else? Agree to define in PSKC. Ming to send
email to Siddhart and David M'Raihi and Phillip Hallam Baker to ask if
URI should be defined in PSKC or other specs.

2)       Agreed via emails and reaffirmed that all attributes should be
capital - Ming to do changes and distribute new schema to the list

3)       Remove AlgorithmIdentifier (OATH legacy structure) not needed
anymore with move to URIs

4)       How do we distinguish between HOTP counter and HOTP time based?
Is URI enough? Thinking is yes. ASlo mentioned that time based will have
mandatory data elements such as 'TIME_INTERVAL'

5)       What about usageType should they be in the data elements?
Current thinking is to keep as explicit XML type.

6)       Ming to do schema changes and reflect changes in the document.
Including the examples.

7)       Philip mentioned about concerns from RSA about using PKCS5 and
xmlenc, Shuh, Ming to compose email with cons to spark discussion

8)       What about using xmlenc encryptionmethod and xmlenc encrypted
value? Agreed to take into consideration but defer to next revision.

9)       Ming to think about PIN transfer proposal, Philip would like to
add to this rev.

10)   We use next call to decide when to release new rev.

=20

Philip

=20

=20

=20

________________________________

=20

Philip Hoyer=20

=20

Senior Architect - Office of CTO

=20

ActivIdentity (UK)

109 Borough High Street

London SE1 1NL

=20

Telephone: +44 (0) 20 7744 6248

Direct: +44 (0) 20 7744 6455

Fax: +44 (0) 20 7744 6249

=20

Private and confidential: This message and any attachments may contain

privileged / confidential information. If you are not an intended
recipient,

you must not copy, distribute, discuss or take any action in reliance on
it.

If you have received this communication in error, please notify the
sender

and delete this message immediately.

=20


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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
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10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Attendees:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Philip Hoyer, <st1:place w:st=3D"on"><st1:City =
w:st=3D"on">Ming</st1:City>
 <st1:State w:st=3D"on">Pei</st1:State></st1:place>, Shuh =
Chang.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Apologies: Phillip Hallam =
Baker<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Discussed new version of the PSKC schema that =
Ming
prepared for new version of DSKPP.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>1)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Missing
URIs, what do we do. Philip proposed adding the one we know. We need to =
agree
at least on HOTP. Should we define URI in the PSKC document or somewhere =
else?
Agree to define in PSKC. Ming to send email to Siddhart and David =
M&#8217;Raihi
and Phillip Hallam Baker to ask if URI should be defined in PSKC or =
other specs.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>2)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Agreed
via emails and reaffirmed that all attributes should be capital &#8211; =
Ming to
do changes and distribute new schema to the =
list<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>3)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Remove
AlgorithmIdentifier (OATH legacy structure) not needed anymore with move =
to
URIs<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>4)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>How
do we distinguish between HOTP counter and HOTP time based? Is URI =
enough?
Thinking is yes. ASlo mentioned that time based will have mandatory data
elements such as =
&#8216;TIME_INTERVAL&#8217;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>5)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>What
about usageType should they be in the data elements? Current thinking is =
to
keep as explicit XML type.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>6)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Ming
to do schema changes and reflect changes in the document. Including the =
examples.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>7)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Philip
mentioned about concerns from RSA about using PKCS5 and xmlenc, Shuh, =
Ming to
compose email with cons to spark discussion<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>8)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>What
about using xmlenc encryptionmethod and xmlenc encrypted value? Agreed =
to take
into consideration but defer to next =
revision.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>9)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New =
Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Ming
to think about PIN transfer proposal, Philip would like to add to this =
rev.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 =
lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><span
style=3D'mso-list:Ignore'>10)<font size=3D1 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'>&nbsp;&nbsp; =
</span></font></span></span></font><![endif]><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>We
use next call to decide when to release new =
rev.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Philip<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-left:18.0pt'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></fo=
nt></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st=3D"on"><font size=3D2 =
face=3D"Courier New"><span
 lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>Philip Hoyer</span></font></st1:PersonName><font
size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Senior Architect - =
Office of
CTO<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>ActivIdentity =
(<st1:country-region
w:st=3D"on"><st1:place =
w:st=3D"on">UK</st1:place></st1:country-region>)<o:p></o:p></span></font>=
</p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:Street w:st=3D"on"><st1:address =
w:st=3D"on"><font size=3D2
  face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>109
  Borough High Street</span></font></st1:address></st1:Street><font =
size=3D2
face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:City w:st=3D"on"><st1:place w:st=3D"on"><font =
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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 02 16:02:50 2007
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Organizing these has taken more time than I expected. I have still not =
got round to entering the identifiers Russ sent me for the ECC =
algorithms into the database.=20
=20
I thought best to prove that I can extract data first.
=20
So far I don't have references for the OTP algorithms. What I need for =
each is:
=20
1) Document where the algorithm is defined
2) Document(s) where identifiers are assigned (if different)
3) Identifiers assigned
=20
=20
The source for the tool is an XML flat file and it spits out XMLRFC =
format.
=20
The formatting is pretty rough at the moment.
=20
=20
To do list:
=20
1) Modify the new tool to create references for all REF/ID pairs
2) Add sections listing algorithms by identifier type (e.g. all IPSEC, =
all OID, all URI, ...)
3) Add means of tracking algorithm status, e.g. DEPRECATED
4) Add in Deprecated algorithms referenced in existing IETF/W3C specs
=20
5) Add in the OASIS WS-* and SAML identifiers
=20

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<HTML dir=3Dltr><HEAD>=0A=
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dunicode">=0A=
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.16546" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>=0A=
<BODY>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#000000 size=3D2>Organizing these has =
taken more time than I expected. I have still not got round to entering =
the identifiers Russ sent me for the ECC algorithms into the database. =
</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I thought best to prove that I can =
extract data first.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>So far I don't have references for the =
OTP algorithms. What I need for each is:</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>1) Document where the algorithm is =
defined</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>2) Document(s) where identifiers are =
assigned (if different)</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>3) Identifiers assigned</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The source for the tool is an&nbsp;XML =
flat file and it spits out XMLRFC format.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>The formatting is pretty rough at the =
moment.</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>To do list:</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>1) Modify the new tool to create =
references for all REF/ID pairs</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>2) Add sections listing algorithms by =
identifier type (e.g. all IPSEC, all OID, all URI, ...)</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>3) Add means of tracking algorithm =
status, e.g. DEPRECATED</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>4) Add in Deprecated algorithms =
referenced in existing IETF/W3C specs</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>5) Add in the OASIS WS-* and =
SAML&nbsp;identifiers</FONT></DIV>=0A=
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV></BODY></HTML>
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------_=_NextPart_001_01C81D8B.165103E3
Content-Type: text/plain;
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Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Content-Description: draft-hallambaker-algorithm-identifiers.txt
Content-Disposition: attachment;
	filename="draft-hallambaker-algorithm-identifiers.txt"

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FYI

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: 	I-D Action:draft-hallambaker-algorithm-identifiers-00.txt
Date: 	Sun, 04 Nov 2007 22:20:01 -0500
From: 	Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
Reply-To: 	internet-drafts@ietf.org
To: 	i-d-announce@ietf.org



A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.

	Title           : Cryptographic Algorithm Identifiers
	Author(s)       : P. Hallam-Baker
	Filename        : draft-hallambaker-algorithm-identifiers-00.txt
	Pages           : 9
	Date            : 2007-11-04

Preferred identifiers for cryptographic algorithms currently in use
in Internet standards.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-hallambaker-algorithm-identifiers-00.txt

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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to aclientviaPSKC?
Date: Thu, 8 Nov 2007 15:31:15 -0500
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From: "Doherty, Andrea" <adoherty@rsa.com>
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Philip,

Thank you for your proposal.  Here are a few comments:

1. By <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/> do you mean "PIN is enabled"?  Is
the reverse true, that <AccessRules userPIN=3D"false"/> indicates =
PINless
operation from a server's point of view?=20

2. Instead of <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>, providing a
PINUsageModeType would be more extensible and implementable:
<xs:complexType name=3D"PINUsageModeType">
	<xs:choice maxOccurs=3D"unbounded">
		<xs:element name=3D"Local"/>
		<xs:element name=3D"Prepend"/>
		<xs:element name=3D"Embed"/>
	</xs:choice>
</xs:complexType>

3. Anders brought to my attention that a local PIN is needed instead of
a server PIN in some scenarios.  The device issuer, in this case, would
also have a PIN policy that could differ from the policy of a server
PIN.  Anders provided the following example, which is taken from another
standardization effort in the workings ("PKI for Web 2.0"):

// The following is sent down to the client by the issuer:

<KeyGenerationRequest ...>

// Request a key without PIN protection.

  <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.1" KeyUsage=3D"encryption">
    <KeyAlgorithmData>
      <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
    </KeyAlgorithmData>
  </RequestedKey>

// Request a set of keys with PIN protection.
// The specified policy disallows 11122 but accepts 11223
// 654321 would not be accepted either (sequence)

  <PINProtection Type=3D"numeric" MinLength=3D"5" MaxLength=3D"8"
                 PatternRestrictions=3D"three-in-a-row  sequences">

// The next element is optional and is a way of grouping PINs
// so that the user either only has to specify a single PIN
// for a set of keys, or one unique PIN per key.

    <PINGroupProtection Shared=3D"true">

      <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.2" KeyUsage=3D"signature">
        <KeyAlgorithmData>
          <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
        </KeyAlgorithmData>
      </RequestedKey>
      <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.3" KeyUsage=3D"authentication">
        <KeyAlgorithmData>
          <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
        </KeyAlgorithmData>
      </RequestedKey>

    </PINGroupProtection>

  </PINProtection>

</KeyGenerationRequest>

Your thoughts?
Andrea=20

-----Original Message-----
From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]=20
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:16 AM
To: Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
Cc: M'Raihi, David; Bajaj,Siddharth; Johan Rydell
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to
aclientviaPSKC?

Andrea,
You are right I have not addressed the Pin policy issue.

I would like to though.=20

Since you seem to have a good idea of the requirements would you be able
to help?

I suggest we create a new type called PINPolicy that contains the data
required to be submitted.

So currently PIN usage I can think of is:
-KEY_ACCESS_CHECK (this check the pin on the device to allow access to a
key for algorithms)
-USED_IN_ALGO (used during calculation)

When you talk though about length I already have that in the <Usage>
part of the PIN 'key' see below

NEW->
       <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">
         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
         <Usage>
          <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>
         </Usage>
         <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>
         <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
           <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
           <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
         </Data>
       </Key>
<-NEW

Also when we talk about server verified pins in otps are we not really
talking about the otp algo or usage here?

I was wondering hence if our usage element for the otp key should be
augmented to contain and optional

<UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>

What do you think?

Philip


-----Original Message-----
From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]=20
Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:28 AM
To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a
clientviaPSKC?

Philip,
This looks ok except that a more complex PIN policy is needed (refer to
this comment I made to the previous version of the PSKC draft, Section
5.1.7:
"Recommend that you allow for a more complex PIN policy, esp., (a) how
the PIN is to be used in the OTP calculation (e.g., concatenated vs.
XOR's with the token code) and (b) PIN length. "

This doesn't seem to have been addressed yet based on feedback to my
review (see attached) and example below.  What is the status of this? =20
Andrea

-----Original Message-----
From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]=20
Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 11:48 AM
To: KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a
clientviaPSKC?

Gentlemen,
Since PSKC will be used also to bulk provision from manufacturing to a
validation server and some of these devices do have a PIN pad there is
the concept of an initial PIN.

Since we have not yet defined how this initial PIN is transmitted in the
PSKC spec I would like to put forward a proposal for inclusion in the
spec for specifying the transmission of PINs.

The PIN is effectively another shared secret hence I propose to treat it
as a key in itself.

This has the advantage that we can leverage the Usage part of the schema
that can define things like length and format (alphanumeric etc). we
also can set an expiry etc. It also leverages the fact that the PIN
itself will be encrypted in transport in the same manner as other key
material.

I hence propose to extend the KeyAlgorithmType with a new type called
'userPIN' (inline with the name used in the access rules element already
present)


As an example a KeyContainer with a non encrypted HOTP key and a 4 digit
numeric PIN (please note that the value and valuedigest are just copy
and paste) ( I put the new section with NEW-> and <-NEW lines before and
after):

   <?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?>
   <KeyContainer
   xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"
   xmlns:logo=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo"
   xmlns:ds=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#"
   xmlns:xsi=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"
   xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"
.\keyprov_pskc_schema_v1.1.xsd" version=3D"1.1">
     <EncryptionMethod algorithm=3D"NONE"/>
     <DigestMethod algorithm=3D"HMAC-SHA1"></DigestMethod>
     <Device>
       <DeviceId>
         <Manufacturer>Token Manufacturer</Manufacturer>
         <SerialNo>98765432187</SerialNo>
         <Expiry>01/01/2008</Expiry>
       </DeviceId>
       <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"HOTP"  KeyId=3D"98765432187">
         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
         <Usage>
          <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"6"/>
         </Usage>
NEW->
         <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/>
<-NEW
         <FriendlyName>MyFirstToken</FriendlyName>
         <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
           <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
           <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
         </Data>
         <Data Name=3D"COUNTER">
           <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
           <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
         </Data>
       </Key>
NEW->
       <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">
         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
         <Usage>
          <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>
         </Usage>
         <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>
         <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
           <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
           <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
         </Data>
       </Key>
<-NEW
     </Device>
   </KeyContainer>

Comments are welcome,

Philip

-----Original Message-----
From: Mingliang Pei [mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net]=20
Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 9:58 AM
To: keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a client
viaPSKC?


New submission from Mingliang Pei <mpei@verisign.com>:

PSKC provies support about carrying PIN usage policy. When PIN is used,
how do=20
you actually transfer the initial PIN using PSKC? Should PIN be treated
as=20
another credential, for example?

----------
assignedto: mpei
messages: 71
nosy: keyprov, mpei
priority: critical
status: chatting
title: How to transfer initial PIN to a client via PSKC?

_________________________________________________________
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<http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue28>
_________________________________________________________

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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to aclientviaPSKC?
Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 17:48:06 -0800
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From: "Pei, Mingliang" <mpei@verisign.com>
To: "Doherty, Andrea" <adoherty@rsa.com>,
	"Philip Hoyer" <philip.hoyer@actividentity.com>,
	"KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker" <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>,
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I have chatted with Philip / Salah about my comments this afternoon
while I was almost done my reply of this email. I sent it anyway now for
broad review. Our meeting minutes from Philip later will contain other
proposed changes in our discussion.

1. A PIN is associated with a key; we need to define a better way to
associate with them when we carry PIN in a separate Key type.

- The current proposal assumes that all keys in the same "Device" type
will associate to the PIN credential in the same Device.
- This has a limitation for "PREPEND" case where a device may have
multiple keys, and each key has its own PIN as part of server
authentication.

2. There is use case when a PIN is per device, instead of per key, for
the "Local" access usage.=20

So I prefer defining PIN credential inside DeviceType, and refered by
KeyType by an attribute or element, and DeviceType.

3. PIN policy is fine to have its own type. The AccessRule and
PINUsageModeType should combine to be a PIN usage policy. If we are
treating PIN as a separate credential, it is more consistent to make PIN
usage policy part of Usage, I think.

Thanks,

- Ming
=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]=20
> Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 12:31 PM
> To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20
> to aclientviaPSKC?
>=20
> Philip,
>=20
> Thank you for your proposal.  Here are a few comments:
>=20
> 1. By <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/> do you mean "PIN is=20
> enabled"?  Is the reverse true, that <AccessRules=20
> userPIN=3D"false"/> indicates PINless operation from a server's=20
> point of view?=20
>=20
> 2. Instead of <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>, providing=20
> a PINUsageModeType would be more extensible and implementable:
> <xs:complexType name=3D"PINUsageModeType">
> 	<xs:choice maxOccurs=3D"unbounded">
> 		<xs:element name=3D"Local"/>
> 		<xs:element name=3D"Prepend"/>
> 		<xs:element name=3D"Embed"/>
> 	</xs:choice>
> </xs:complexType>
>=20
> 3. Anders brought to my attention that a local PIN is needed=20
> instead of a server PIN in some scenarios.  The device=20
> issuer, in this case, would also have a PIN policy that could=20
> differ from the policy of a server PIN.  Anders provided the=20
> following example, which is taken from another=20
> standardization effort in the workings ("PKI for Web 2.0"):
>=20
> // The following is sent down to the client by the issuer:
>=20
> <KeyGenerationRequest ...>
>=20
> // Request a key without PIN protection.
>=20
>   <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.1" KeyUsage=3D"encryption">
>     <KeyAlgorithmData>
>       <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
>     </KeyAlgorithmData>
>   </RequestedKey>
>=20
> // Request a set of keys with PIN protection.
> // The specified policy disallows 11122 but accepts 11223 //=20
> 654321 would not be accepted either (sequence)
>=20
>   <PINProtection Type=3D"numeric" MinLength=3D"5" MaxLength=3D"8"
>                  PatternRestrictions=3D"three-in-a-row  sequences">
>=20
> // The next element is optional and is a way of grouping PINs=20
> // so that the user either only has to specify a single PIN=20
> // for a set of keys, or one unique PIN per key.
>=20
>     <PINGroupProtection Shared=3D"true">
>=20
>       <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.2" KeyUsage=3D"signature">
>         <KeyAlgorithmData>
>           <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
>         </KeyAlgorithmData>
>       </RequestedKey>
>       <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.3" KeyUsage=3D"authentication">
>         <KeyAlgorithmData>
>           <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
>         </KeyAlgorithmData>
>       </RequestedKey>
>=20
>     </PINGroupProtection>
>=20
>   </PINProtection>
>=20
> </KeyGenerationRequest>
>=20
> Your thoughts?
> Andrea=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:16 AM
> To: Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
> Cc: M'Raihi, David; Bajaj,Siddharth; Johan Rydell
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20
> to aclientviaPSKC?
>=20
> Andrea,
> You are right I have not addressed the Pin policy issue.
>=20
> I would like to though.=20
>=20
> Since you seem to have a good idea of the requirements would=20
> you be able to help?
>=20
> I suggest we create a new type called PINPolicy that contains=20
> the data required to be submitted.
>=20
> So currently PIN usage I can think of is:
> -KEY_ACCESS_CHECK (this check the pin on the device to allow=20
> access to a key for algorithms) -USED_IN_ALGO (used during=20
> calculation)
>=20
> When you talk though about length I already have that in the=20
> <Usage> part of the PIN 'key' see below
>=20
> NEW->
>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">
>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
>          <Usage>
>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>
>          </Usage>
>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>
>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
>          </Data>
>        </Key>
> <-NEW
>=20
> Also when we talk about server verified pins in otps are we=20
> not really talking about the otp algo or usage here?
>=20
> I was wondering hence if our usage element for the otp key=20
> should be augmented to contain and optional
>=20
> <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>
>=20
> What do you think?
>=20
> Philip
>=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:28 AM
> To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20
> to a clientviaPSKC?
>=20
> Philip,
> This looks ok except that a more complex PIN policy is needed=20
> (refer to this comment I made to the previous version of the=20
> PSKC draft, Section
> 5.1.7:
> "Recommend that you allow for a more complex PIN policy,=20
> esp., (a) how the PIN is to be used in the OTP calculation=20
> (e.g., concatenated vs.
> XOR's with the token code) and (b) PIN length. "
>=20
> This doesn't seem to have been addressed yet based on=20
> feedback to my review (see attached) and example below.  What=20
> is the status of this? =20
> Andrea
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]
> Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 11:48 AM
> To: KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20
> to a clientviaPSKC?
>=20
> Gentlemen,
> Since PSKC will be used also to bulk provision from=20
> manufacturing to a validation server and some of these=20
> devices do have a PIN pad there is the concept of an initial PIN.
>=20
> Since we have not yet defined how this initial PIN is=20
> transmitted in the PSKC spec I would like to put forward a=20
> proposal for inclusion in the spec for specifying the=20
> transmission of PINs.
>=20
> The PIN is effectively another shared secret hence I propose=20
> to treat it as a key in itself.
>=20
> This has the advantage that we can leverage the Usage part of=20
> the schema that can define things like length and format=20
> (alphanumeric etc). we also can set an expiry etc. It also=20
> leverages the fact that the PIN itself will be encrypted in=20
> transport in the same manner as other key material.
>=20
> I hence propose to extend the KeyAlgorithmType with a new=20
> type called 'userPIN' (inline with the name used in the=20
> access rules element already
> present)
>=20
>=20
> As an example a KeyContainer with a non encrypted HOTP key=20
> and a 4 digit numeric PIN (please note that the value and=20
> valuedigest are just copy and paste) ( I put the new section=20
> with NEW-> and <-NEW lines before and
> after):
>=20
>    <?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?>
>    <KeyContainer
>    xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"
>    xmlns:logo=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo"
>    xmlns:ds=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#"
>    xmlns:xsi=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"
>    xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"
> .\keyprov_pskc_schema_v1.1.xsd" version=3D"1.1">
>      <EncryptionMethod algorithm=3D"NONE"/>
>      <DigestMethod algorithm=3D"HMAC-SHA1"></DigestMethod>
>      <Device>
>        <DeviceId>
>          <Manufacturer>Token Manufacturer</Manufacturer>
>          <SerialNo>98765432187</SerialNo>
>          <Expiry>01/01/2008</Expiry>
>        </DeviceId>
>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"HOTP"  KeyId=3D"98765432187">
>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
>          <Usage>
>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"6"/>
>          </Usage>
> NEW->
>          <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/>
> <-NEW
>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstToken</FriendlyName>
>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
>          </Data>
>          <Data Name=3D"COUNTER">
>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
>          </Data>
>        </Key>
> NEW->
>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">
>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
>          <Usage>
>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>
>          </Usage>
>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>
>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
>          </Data>
>        </Key>
> <-NEW
>      </Device>
>    </KeyContainer>
>=20
> Comments are welcome,
>=20
> Philip
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mingliang Pei [mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net]
> Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 9:58 AM
> To: keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a=20
> client viaPSKC?
>=20
>=20
> New submission from Mingliang Pei <mpei@verisign.com>:
>=20
> PSKC provies support about carrying PIN usage policy. When=20
> PIN is used,
> how do=20
> you actually transfer the initial PIN using PSKC? Should PIN=20
> be treated
> as=20
> another credential, for example?
>=20
> ----------
> assignedto: mpei
> messages: 71
> nosy: keyprov, mpei
> priority: critical
> status: chatting
> title: How to transfer initial PIN to a client via PSKC?
>=20
> _________________________________________________________
> KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
> <http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue28>
> _________________________________________________________
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20

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Attendees: Ming Pei, Salah Machhani, Philip Hoyer

=20

*	Discussion about PIN provisioning , [Ming] PIN is a credential
but to which key does it belong? Do we need to build correlation between
to key and pin. Current Philip proposal allows only one PIN per device.
Ming proposed put PIN within key. But what happens if we only need to
transmit PINs and no key value? Create PIN schema object that uses
UsageType replaces access rules and can be set at Device and key level.
Philip raises that this is a lot of work. So create a PinPolicy that
refers to a key via the keyed hence the PinPolicy element can be
embedded in the Key object. Philip to draft new proposal email to list.
*	Discussed Magnus's email about use of xmlemc: Salah is worried
that now a document would be 3 levels deep: DSKPP->PSKC->XMLENC. Is
XMLEnc only used for defining container keys? Ming has concern about
importing the whole XMLEnc schema. We need to see an example container
document. Also discussed that spec would need to have a mandatory modes
for interoperability in temrs of XMLenc supported encryption methods
(PBE, symmetric key etc)
*	Philip asked if everyone is happy with URI being attribute or
should it be an element. Element normally provides more readability Ming
will do a check.
*	Philip noted that example in 10.1 in spec sent out by Ming has a
digest even if un-encrypted-> Ming to change.=20
*	Ming brought up that we should indicate more explicitly if a
data element is encrypted. Defer that until we decided on use of xmlenc
for value part. Current thought if value does not use xmlenc then we
should explicitly mention encryption with an optional encrypted=3D"true"
attribute in the data element.
*	Submission of new draft - Ming to check last submission date.
The following is a proposal of changes for next submission:

	*	URI - element or attribute
	*	Corrected example
	*	PinPolicy - possibly?

*	Authors would like to bring xmlenc discussion to IETF meeting so
we need examples
*	Need to star compiling list of open issues for IETF. (Philip
currently unable to attend but will assist Ming in creation of slides
for IETF meeting)
*	Ming to add missing Time based HOTP Data names eg 'TIME_DRIFT'
*	Authors decided that more discussions are needed hence another
meeting is scheduled for Wed 14th of November same time as Monday
meeting. Philip to send out meeting maker.

=20

=20

________________________________

=20

Philip Hoyer=20

=20

Senior Architect - Office of CTO

=20

ActivIdentity (UK)

109 Borough High Street

London SE1 1NL

=20

Telephone: +44 (0) 20 7744 6248

Direct: +44 (0) 20 7744 6455

Fax: +44 (0) 20 7744 6249

=20

Private and confidential: This message and any attachments may contain

privileged / confidential information. If you are not an intended
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style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Attendees: <st1:place w:st=3D"on"><st1:City =
w:st=3D"on">Ming</st1:City>
 <st1:State w:st=3D"on">Pei</st1:State></st1:place>, Salah Machhani, =
<st1:PersonName
w:st=3D"on">Philip Hoyer</st1:PersonName><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<ul style=3D'margin-top:0pt' type=3Ddisc>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Discussion about PIN
     provisioning , [Ming] PIN is a credential but to which key does it =
belong?
     Do we need to build correlation between to key and pin. Current =
Philip
     proposal allows only one PIN per device. Ming proposed put PIN =
within key.
     But what happens if we only need to transmit PINs and no key value? =
Create
     PIN schema object that uses UsageType replaces access rules and can =
be set
     at Device and key level. Philip raises that this is a lot of work. =
So
     create a PinPolicy that refers to a key via the keyed hence the =
PinPolicy
     element can be embedded in the Key object. Philip to draft new =
proposal
     email to list.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Discussed =
Magnus&#8217;s
     email about use of xmlemc: Salah is worried that now a document =
would be 3
     levels deep: DSKPP-&gt;PSKC-&gt;XMLENC. Is XMLEnc only used for =
defining
     container keys? Ming has concern about importing the whole XMLEnc =
schema.
     We need to see an example container document. Also discussed that =
spec
     would need to have a mandatory modes for interoperability in temrs =
of
     XMLenc supported encryption methods (PBE, symmetric key =
etc)<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Philip =
asked if
     everyone is happy with URI being attribute or should it be an =
element. Element
     normally provides more readability Ming will do a =
check.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Philip =
noted that
     example in 10.1 in spec sent out by Ming has a digest even if
     un-encrypted-&gt; Ming to change. <o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Ming =
brought up that
     we should indicate more explicitly if a data element is encrypted. =
Defer
     that until we decided on use of xmlenc for value part. Current =
thought if
     value does not use xmlenc then we should explicitly mention =
encryption
     with an optional encrypted=3D&#8221;true&#8221; attribute in the =
data element.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Submission of new
     draft &#8211; Ming to check last submission date. The following is =
a
     proposal of changes for next =
submission:<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <ul style=3D'margin-top:0pt' type=3Dcircle>
  <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
      lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>URI =
&#8211; element
      or attribute<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
  <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
      lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Corrected =
example<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
  <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level2 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
      lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>PinPolicy &#8211;
      possibly?<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 </ul>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Authors =
would like
     to bring xmlenc discussion to IETF meeting so we need =
examples<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Need to =
star
     compiling list of open issues for IETF. (Philip currently unable to =
attend
     but will assist Ming in creation of slides for IETF =
meeting)<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Ming to =
add missing Time
     based HOTP Data names eg =
&#8216;TIME_DRIFT&#8217;<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Authors =
decided that
     more discussions are needed hence another meeting is scheduled for =
Wed 14<sup>th</sup>
     of November same time as Monday meeting. Philip to send out meeting =
maker.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
</ul>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
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<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st=3D"on"><font size=3D2 =
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 lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
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Office of
CTO<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
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(<st1:country-region
w:st=3D"on"><st1:place =
w:st=3D"on">UK</st1:place></st1:country-region>)<o:p></o:p></span></font>=
</p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:Street w:st=3D"on"><st1:address =
w:st=3D"on"><font size=3D2
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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
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6248<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
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New submission from Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com>:

Which variant(s) is (are) the MUSTs for the client? for the server?
Same questions pertain to client authentication mechanisms, DSKPP-PRF=20
realization(s), encryptiong of the pseudorandom nonces sent from the client.

Also define whether each Appendix is informational or normative.

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title: Define Implementation Requirements for conformance

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Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com> added the comment:

Per comments received from Sean Turner and Hannes, we should specify what a=
re=20
MUSTs for conformance to the document, and which Annexes are informational =
and=20
which normative.  As Hannes noted, this will aid in making the document eas=
ier=20
for implementers to consume.  Here are Sean's specific questions, which I t=
hink=20
encapsulate all the conformance areas:

1 Which variant(s) is(are) the MUSTs for the client? for the server?  Does
someone claiming conformance to this document need to support 4, 2, and
1-pass or can they claim conformance for just 4, 2, or 1-pass?

2 (sec 4.3.1) Which of the 3 client authentication mechanism is the MUST and
which are the SHOULDs for the client? for the server?

3 (sec 4.5.1) What is the MUST DSKPP-PRF for the client? for the server? The
last sentence points to Annex E for realizations of the DSKPP-PRF but it is
unclear whether the appendix is normative and which realization is required.

4 (sec 4.7) What is the MUST algorithm for encryption of the pseudorandom
Nonces sent from the client?

5 Are Annexes A-E information or normative?  Please indicate as much.

To each point above, here are my comments.  Do you agree?

1=2E Variants that are MUSTS for the client are 4-pass or 2-pass (not sure =
if its=20
ok to state it this way though), and for the server are 4-pass and 2-pass.
2=2E The MAC is a MUST, the cert is a MAY.
3=2E The appendix is normative, and the two realizations therein are MUSTs =
for=20
implementation.
4=2E The MUST algorithm in sec 4.7 is XOR.  I think it was clear enough.
5=2E Some Annexes have been moved.  There are only now Appendix A (Integrat=
ion=20
with P11) and B (Example of DSKPP-PRF Realizations).  IMO Appendix A is=20
Informative and B is Normative.

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New submission from Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com>:

Should DSKPP support the following use cases:
1=2E Non-protected Transport Layer (Sec 3.9 of Oct 29, 2007 I-D)
2=2E Non-authenticated Transport Layer (Sec 3.10 of Oct 29, 2007 I-D)
Assuming a secure transport layer removed complexity from the document.

----------
assignedto: andrea
messages: 78
nosy: andrea, keyprov
priority: wish
status: unread
title: Are use cases involving non-authenticated and non-protected transpor=
t layer required?

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Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com> added the comment:

The question of expressing DSKPP using WSDL 2.0, and thereby including SOAP=20
binding in the core DSKPP document, was raised with the Apps AD. Hannes=20
summarized their comment, which was based on RFC 3205 (BCP 56) as follows:

WSDL Usage: Lisa and Chris do not see WSDL as something being=20
useful. In fact, I haven't found a person who argued in favor of WSDL.=20
Hence, I believe we should avoid it.

While the value of WSDL usage is controversial, e.g., BCP 56 is probably ou=
t-of-
date, the decision is to continue expressing DSKPP using XML, and keep the =
SOAP=20
binding description in a separate document (see draft-doherty-keyprov-ct-ki=
p-ws-
00).

----------
status: chatting -> done-cbb

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Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com> added the comment:

Salah Machani replaced K_AUTH with K_MAC and K_MAC=E2=80=99s in four-pass f=
or server=20
authentication and key confirmation in this version of the draft: draft-iet=
f-
keyprov-dskpp-01.txt.

----------
assignedto:  -> andrea
status: unread -> done-cbb

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Subject: Re: [KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we need to provide SOAP binding and where
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So why is WSDL not useful, it describes a interface and why wouldn't a =
SOAP
binding be useful  to implement that interface ?

Anthony Nadalin | Work 512.838.0085 | Cell 512.289.4122


|------------>
| From:      |
|------------>
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------=
--------------------------------------------------------------------|
  |Andrea Doherty <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>                          =
                                                                    |
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------=
--------------------------------------------------------------------|
|------------>
| To:        |
|------------>
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------=
--------------------------------------------------------------------|
  |keyprov@ietf.org, mpei@verisign.com                                 =
                                                                    |
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------=
--------------------------------------------------------------------|
|------------>
| Date:      |
|------------>
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------=
--------------------------------------------------------------------|
  |11/15/2007 10:58 AM                                                 =
                                                                    |
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------=
--------------------------------------------------------------------|
|------------>
| Subject:   |
|------------>
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------=
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  |[KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we need to provide SOAP binding and where if =
    so?                                                             |
  >--------------------------------------------------------------------=
--------------------------------------------------------------------|






Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com> added the comment:

The question of expressing DSKPP using WSDL 2.0, and thereby including =
SOAP

binding in the core DSKPP document, was raised with the Apps AD. Hannes=

summarized their comment, which was based on RFC 3205 (BCP 56) as follo=
ws:

WSDL Usage: Lisa and Chris do not see WSDL as something being
useful. In fact, I haven't found a person who argued in favor of WSDL.
Hence, I believe we should avoid it.

While the value of WSDL usage is controversial, e.g., BCP 56 is probabl=
y
out-of-
date, the decision is to continue expressing DSKPP using XML, and keep =
the
SOAP
binding description in a separate document (see
draft-doherty-keyprov-ct-kip-ws-
00).

----------
status: chatting -> done-cbb

_________________________________________________________
KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
<?http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue10>
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=

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<html><body>
<p>So why is WSDL not useful, it describes a interface and why wouldn't=
 a SOAP binding be useful  to implement that interface ?<br>
<br>
Anthony Nadalin | Work 512.838.0085 | Cell 512.289.4122<br>
<br>
<img width=3D"16" height=3D"16" src=3D"cid:1__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8a=
93df938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D"Inactive hide details for Andre=
a Doherty ---11/15/2007 10:58:23 AM---Andrea Doherty &lt;adoherty@rsa.c=
om&gt; added the comment:"><font color=3D"#424282">Andrea Doherty ---11=
/15/2007 10:58:23 AM---Andrea Doherty &lt;adoherty@rsa.com&gt; added th=
e comment:</font><br>
<br>

<table width=3D"100%" border=3D"0" cellspacing=3D"0" cellpadding=3D"0">=

<tr valign=3D"top"><td width=3D"1%"><img width=3D"96" height=3D"1" src=3D=
"cid:2__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8a93df938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D=
""><br>
<font size=3D"2" color=3D"#5F5F5F">From:</font></td><td width=3D"100%">=
<img width=3D"1" height=3D"1" src=3D"cid:2__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8a93=
df938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D""><br>
<font size=3D"2">Andrea Doherty &lt;hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net&gt;</font=
></td></tr>

<tr valign=3D"top"><td width=3D"1%"><img width=3D"96" height=3D"1" src=3D=
"cid:2__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8a93df938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D=
""><br>
<font size=3D"2" color=3D"#5F5F5F">To:</font></td><td width=3D"100%"><i=
mg width=3D"1" height=3D"1" src=3D"cid:2__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8a93df=
938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D""><br>
<font size=3D"2">keyprov@ietf.org, mpei@verisign.com</font></td></tr>

<tr valign=3D"top"><td width=3D"1%"><img width=3D"96" height=3D"1" src=3D=
"cid:2__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8a93df938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D=
""><br>
<font size=3D"2" color=3D"#5F5F5F">Date:</font></td><td width=3D"100%">=
<img width=3D"1" height=3D"1" src=3D"cid:2__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8a93=
df938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D""><br>
<font size=3D"2">11/15/2007 10:58 AM</font></td></tr>

<tr valign=3D"top"><td width=3D"1%"><img width=3D"96" height=3D"1" src=3D=
"cid:2__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8a93df938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D=
""><br>
<font size=3D"2" color=3D"#5F5F5F">Subject:</font></td><td width=3D"100=
%"><img width=3D"1" height=3D"1" src=3D"cid:2__=3D09BBF907DFCE23498f9e8=
a93df938@us.ibm.com" border=3D"0" alt=3D""><br>
<font size=3D"2">[KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we need to provide SOAP binding=
 and where if	so?</font></td></tr>
</table>
<hr width=3D"100%" size=3D"2" align=3D"left" noshade style=3D"color:#80=
91A5; "><br>
<br>
<br>
<tt><br>
Andrea Doherty &lt;adoherty@rsa.com&gt; added the comment:<br>
<br>
The question of expressing DSKPP using WSDL 2.0, and thereby including =
SOAP <br>
binding in the core DSKPP document, was raised with the Apps AD. Hannes=
 <br>
summarized their comment, which was based on RFC 3205 (BCP 56) as follo=
ws:<br>
<br>
WSDL Usage: Lisa and Chris do not see WSDL as something being <br>
useful. In fact, I haven't found a person who argued in favor of WSDL. =
<br>
Hence, I believe we should avoid it.<br>
<br>
While the value of WSDL usage is controversial, e.g., BCP 56 is probabl=
y out-of-<br>
date, the decision is to continue expressing DSKPP using XML, and keep =
the SOAP <br>
binding description in a separate document (see draft-doherty-keyprov-c=
t-kip-ws-<br>
00).<br>
<br>
----------<br>
status: chatting -&gt; done-cbb<br>
<br>
_________________________________________________________<br>
KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker &lt;hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net&gt;<br>
&lt;</tt><tt><a href=3D"http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue10"=
>http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue10</a></tt><tt>&gt;<br>
_________________________________________________________<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
KEYPROV mailing list<br>
KEYPROV@ietf.org<br>
</tt><tt><a href=3D"https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov">htt=
ps://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov</a></tt><tt><br>
</tt><br>
</body></html>=


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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we need to provide SOAP binding and
	whereif	so?
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 12:47:05 -0500
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Thread-Topic: [KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we need to provide SOAP binding and
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From: "Doherty, Andrea" <adoherty@rsa.com>
To: "Anthony Nadalin" <drsecure@us.ibm.com>,
	"KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker" <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
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I think it is useful.  That said, the issue is a bit complicated, esp.
as it stems from BCP 56.  Although you may have seen it already, check
out the email exchange on the KEYPROV mailing list on this issue (dated
9/30/07 - 10/9/07).  For example, here are two excerpts from the
exchange;

Chris Newman said,

I largely support BCP 56 and as an IESG member I consider it my duty and
within=20
my authority to enforce that BCP using my best judgment. However, some
of the=20
advice it gives could be updated to make it better and it could use
advice in=20
additional areas -- I would support an effort to revise it, although the

present HTTP WG proposal may not be the right place to do that work. I'm

uncomfortable when my best technical judgment disagrees with common
practice=20
and am unlikely to use my IESG authority to permanently block forward
progress=20
on a document in that case. However, when I'm aware of a BCP rule and
agree=20
with it, I consider it my duty at a minimum to verify the community
considered=20
the rule and had explicit community rough consensus to violate it.

Phillip Hallam-Baker:

Web Services is a standards based architecture with broad industry-wide
support. Keith's RFC was written in 2002 before the Web Services
architecture was developed. There is clearly a conflict between the
views being advance here and established practice for the design and
implementation of Web Services based specifications.

It is not helpful here if the IETF is going to insist on a separate
definition of Web Services specifications that is not in sync with where
the Web Services world is.

Either the BCP56 view is right in which case we need the proponents of
this view to be talking to the wider Web Services world (OASIS, W3C) and
arriving at a consensus position or the BCP56 view is obsolete and needs
to be updated.

In either case this is an issue that the IAB needs to address. BCP56 is
their work product, I believe. They need to be maintaining it.

In particular the idea that WSDL is somehow dispensible as a component
in the Web Services architecture is not a widely held position within
the Web Services world.=20

-- Andrea


________________________________

From: Anthony Nadalin [mailto:drsecure@us.ibm.com]=20
Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2007 12:05 PM
To: KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker
Cc: keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we need to provide SOAP binding and
whereif so?



So why is WSDL not useful, it describes a interface and why wouldn't a
SOAP binding be useful to implement that interface ?

Anthony Nadalin | Work 512.838.0085 | Cell 512.289.4122

 Andrea Doherty ---11/15/2007 10:58:23 AM---Andrea Doherty
<adoherty@rsa.com> added the comment:


=20
From:	=20
Andrea Doherty <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>=09

To:	=20
keyprov@ietf.org, mpei@verisign.com=09

Date:	=20
11/15/2007 10:58 AM=09

Subject:	=20
[KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we need to provide SOAP binding and where if so?=09
________________________________





Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com> added the comment:

The question of expressing DSKPP using WSDL 2.0, and thereby including
SOAP=20
binding in the core DSKPP document, was raised with the Apps AD. Hannes=20
summarized their comment, which was based on RFC 3205 (BCP 56) as
follows:

WSDL Usage: Lisa and Chris do not see WSDL as something being=20
useful. In fact, I haven't found a person who argued in favor of WSDL.=20
Hence, I believe we should avoid it.

While the value of WSDL usage is controversial, e.g., BCP 56 is probably
out-of-
date, the decision is to continue expressing DSKPP using XML, and keep
the SOAP=20
binding description in a separate document (see
draft-doherty-keyprov-ct-kip-ws-
00).

----------
status: chatting -> done-cbb

_________________________________________________________
KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
<http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue10>
_________________________________________________________

_______________________________________________
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<BODY>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D629512617-15112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>I think it is useful.&nbsp; That said,&nbsp;the =
issue is a=20
bit complicated, esp. as it stems from BCP 56.&nbsp; Although you may =
have seen=20
it already, check out the</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
class=3D629512617-15112007><SPAN=20
class=3D629512617-15112007><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>&nbsp;email=20
exchange on the KEYPROV mailing list on this issue (dated 9/30/07 -=20
10/9/07).&nbsp; For example, here are two excerpts from the=20
exchange;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<P><SPAN class=3D629512617-15112007><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2>Chris Newman said,</FONT></P>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D629512617-15112007>
<P><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>I largely support BCP 56 and as =
an IESG=20
member I consider it my duty and within <BR></FONT><FONT face=3D"Courier =
New"=20
size=3D2>my authority to enforce that BCP using my best judgment. =
However, some of=20
the <BR></FONT><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>advice it gives could =
be updated=20
to make it better and it could use advice in <BR></FONT><FONT =
face=3D"Courier New"=20
size=3D2>additional areas -- I would support an effort to revise it, =
although the=20
<BR></FONT><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>present HTTP WG proposal =
may not be=20
the right place to do that work. I'm <BR></FONT><FONT face=3D"Courier =
New"=20
size=3D2>uncomfortable when my best technical judgment disagrees with =
common=20
practice <BR></FONT><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>and am unlikely =
to use my=20
IESG authority to permanently block forward progress <BR></FONT><FONT=20
face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>on a document in that case. However, when =
I'm aware of=20
a BCP rule and agree <BR></FONT><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>with =
it, I=20
consider it my duty at a minimum to verify the community considered=20
<BR></FONT><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>the rule and had explicit =
community=20
rough consensus to violate it.</FONT></P></SPAN></DIV></FONT></SPAN>
<P><SPAN class=3D629512617-15112007><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>Phillip=20
Hallam-Baker:</FONT></SPAN></P><SPAN class=3D629512617-15112007>
<P><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>Web Services is a standards based =

architecture with broad industry-wide support. Keith's RFC was written =
in 2002=20
before the Web Services architecture was developed. There is clearly a =
conflict=20
between the views being advance here and established practice for the =
design and=20
implementation of Web Services based specifications.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>It is not helpful here if the =
IETF is going=20
to insist on a separate definition of Web Services specifications that =
is not in=20
sync with where the Web Services world is.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>Either the BCP56 view is right in =
which case=20
we need the proponents of this view to be talking to the wider Web =
Services=20
world (OASIS, W3C) and arriving at a consensus position or the BCP56 =
view is=20
obsolete and needs to be updated.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>In either case this is an issue =
that the IAB=20
needs to address. BCP56 is their work product, I believe. They need to =
be=20
maintaining it.</FONT></P>
<P><FONT size=3D2><FONT face=3D"Courier New">In particular the idea that =
WSDL is=20
somehow dispensible as a component in the Web Services architecture is =
not a=20
widely held position within the Web Services world.</FONT> </FONT></P>
<P><SPAN class=3D629512617-15112007><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>--=20
Andrea</FONT></SPAN></P></SPAN></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> Anthony Nadalin=20
[mailto:drsecure@us.ibm.com] <BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, November 15, =
2007 12:05=20
PM<BR><B>To:</B> KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker<BR><B>Cc:</B>=20
keyprov@ietf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: [KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we need =
to=20
provide SOAP binding and whereif so?<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<P>So why is WSDL not useful, it describes a interface and why wouldn't =
a SOAP=20
binding be useful to implement that interface ?<BR><BR>Anthony Nadalin | =
Work=20
512.838.0085 | Cell 512.289.4122<BR><BR><IMG height=3D16=20
alt=3D"Inactive hide details for Andrea Doherty ---11/15/2007 10:58:23 =
AM---Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com> added the comment:"=20
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08A3" width=3D16 border=3D0><FONT =
color=3D#424282>Andrea=20
Doherty ---11/15/2007 10:58:23 AM---Andrea Doherty =
&lt;adoherty@rsa.com&gt;=20
added the comment:</FONT><BR><BR>
<TABLE cellSpacing=3D0 cellPadding=3D0 width=3D"100%" border=3D0>
  <TBODY>
  <TR vAlign=3Dtop>
    <TD width=3D"1%"><IMG height=3D1 alt=3D"" =
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08AA"=20
      width=3D96 border=3D0><BR><FONT color=3D#5f5f5f =
size=3D2>From:</FONT></TD>
    <TD width=3D"100%"><IMG height=3D1 alt=3D"" =
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08AA"=20
      width=3D1 border=3D0><BR><FONT size=3D2>Andrea Doherty=20
      &lt;hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net&gt;</FONT></TD></TR>
  <TR vAlign=3Dtop>
    <TD width=3D"1%"><IMG height=3D1 alt=3D"" =
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08AA"=20
      width=3D96 border=3D0><BR><FONT color=3D#5f5f5f =
size=3D2>To:</FONT></TD>
    <TD width=3D"100%"><IMG height=3D1 alt=3D"" =
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08AA"=20
      width=3D1 border=3D0><BR><FONT size=3D2>keyprov@ietf.org,=20
      mpei@verisign.com</FONT></TD></TR>
  <TR vAlign=3Dtop>
    <TD width=3D"1%"><IMG height=3D1 alt=3D"" =
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08AA"=20
      width=3D96 border=3D0><BR><FONT color=3D#5f5f5f =
size=3D2>Date:</FONT></TD>
    <TD width=3D"100%"><IMG height=3D1 alt=3D"" =
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08AA"=20
      width=3D1 border=3D0><BR><FONT size=3D2>11/15/2007 10:58 =
AM</FONT></TD></TR>
  <TR vAlign=3Dtop>
    <TD width=3D"1%"><IMG height=3D1 alt=3D"" =
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08AA"=20
      width=3D96 border=3D0><BR><FONT color=3D#5f5f5f =
size=3D2>Subject:</FONT></TD>
    <TD width=3D"100%"><IMG height=3D1 alt=3D"" =
src=3D"cid:629512617@15112007-08AA"=20
      width=3D1 border=3D0><BR><FONT size=3D2>[KEYPROV] [issue10] Do we =
need to=20
      provide SOAP binding and where if =
so?</FONT></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<HR style=3D"COLOR: #8091a5" align=3Dleft width=3D"100%" noShade =
SIZE=3D2>
<BR><BR><BR><TT><BR>Andrea Doherty &lt;adoherty@rsa.com&gt; added the=20
comment:<BR><BR>The question of expressing DSKPP using WSDL 2.0, and =
thereby=20
including SOAP <BR>binding in the core DSKPP document, was raised with =
the Apps=20
AD. Hannes <BR>summarized their comment, which was based on RFC 3205 =
(BCP 56) as=20
follows:<BR><BR>WSDL Usage: Lisa and Chris do not see WSDL as something =
being=20
<BR>useful. In fact, I haven't found a person who argued in favor of =
WSDL.=20
<BR>Hence, I believe we should avoid it.<BR><BR>While the value of WSDL =
usage is=20
controversial, e.g., BCP 56 is probably out-of-<BR>date, the decision is =
to=20
continue expressing DSKPP using XML, and keep the SOAP <BR>binding =
description=20
in a separate document (see=20
draft-doherty-keyprov-ct-kip-ws-<BR>00).<BR><BR>----------<BR>status: =
chatting=20
-&gt;=20
done-cbb<BR><BR>_________________________________________________________=
<BR>KEYPROV=20
Roundup Issue Tracker =
&lt;hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net&gt;<BR>&lt;</TT><TT><A=20
href=3D"http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue10">http://www.tschof=
enig.com:8080/keyprov/issue10</A></TT><TT>&gt;<BR>_______________________=
__________________________________<BR><BR>_______________________________=
________________<BR>KEYPROV=20
mailing list<BR>KEYPROV@ietf.org<BR></TT><TT><A=20
href=3D"https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov">https://www1.ietf=
.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov</A></TT><TT><BR></TT><BR></BODY></HTML>

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Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com> added the comment:

According to discussions with Applications Area Director, we are doing fine=20
with the usage of XML and the registration of a new mime type.

As mentioned in early message, a special KEYPROV HTTP header definition is=20
neither required nor defined in DSKPP, and so this issue is done.

----------
status: chatting -> done-cbb

_________________________________________________________
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New submission from Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com>:

After some discussion on the mailing list, it appears that the current way =
of=20
defining the Authentication Code (AUTHCODE) is too specific for DSKPP, and =
that=20
it would be better to make the code more extensible/flexible for the=20
application.  Currently, the document (see Section 5.3.3) specifies the for=
mat=20
of AUTHCODE to be:
AUTHCODE =3D passwordLen || identifier || password || checksum

Two alternative proposals are:
(1) Use TLV for the format of AUTHCODE
 E.g. Tag =3D 0x01 =3D password
      Tag =3D 0x02 =3D identifier
      Tag =3D 0x03 =3D checksum
and then use one (or two) byte(s) to indicate the length of the V(alue)=20
field?

(2) AuthCode =3D Code  (unformatted)
  The spec always asks for an ID and code. ID field will be placed in Clien=
tID=20
element and Code is used to generate hash data for the AuthenticationData. =
It=20
is up to a service vendor how they will pass ID and code together or separa=
tely=20
to its end users and how they will choose to input to a client.

----------
assignedto: mpei
messages: 83
nosy: andrea, keyprov, mpei
priority: critical
status: chatting
title: Authentication Code Format

_________________________________________________________
KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
<http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue34>
_________________________________________________________

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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 15 18:02:09 2007
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Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue35] Schema Refinement
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New submission from Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com>:

Two possibilities for refinement:
1=2E Change elementDefault=3Dunqualified to qualified
   As noted by Anders Rundgren, the using "unqualified" is uncommon these d=
ays,=20
and not as clear.  He also noted that the elementDefault=3D"qualified" does=
 not=20
introduce any problems at all; you just use a blank prefix in an instance=20
document. Looks better than today and functions perfectly.  You can add=20
prefixes to really see where things belong.  That SAML doesn't have it is=20
probably because it is an old design and the 2.0 people didn't want to chan=
ge=20
this.

2=2E Remove use of schemaLocation in instance documents
   Anders noted that these are not found in PSKC or DS.

----------
assignedto: mpei
messages: 84
nosy: andrea, keyprov, mpei
priority: feature
status: chatting
title: Schema Refinement

_________________________________________________________
KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
<http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue35>
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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 15 18:05:23 2007
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From: Andrea Doherty <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
Date: Thu, 15 Nov 2007 22:42:36 +0000
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Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue36] App Review of HTTP definition
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New submission from Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com>:

Changes recommended per BCP 56 was for there to be:
1=2E New port number defined for DSKPP since the usage is different from or=
dinary=20
HTTP web browsing
2=2E Define a new URI scheme (DSKPP currently uses the HTTP/HTTPS scheme, w=
hich=20
does not appear to be inline with BCP 56).

Should these recommendations be adopted?

----------
assignedto: hannes
messages: 85
nosy: andrea, hannes, keyprov
priority: critical
status: chatting
title: App Review of HTTP definition

_________________________________________________________
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Mingliang Pei, Salah Machani, and I met via phone to discuss open
issues.  Our plan is to continue on Tuesday Nov 20 at 1PM ET (if
interested in participating, please let me know and I'll forward call-in
info).

In summary, we discussed the issues in the attached spreadsheet (this is
a roll-up of what is in the Issue Tracker).  In particular, we focused
on DSKPP and agreed that Issue #8, #10, #11, #14 were closed.  We also
discussed the AuthenticationData element, particularly the format of the
Authentication Code.  A new issue (#34) was added to the tracker.

Not listed specifically is the issue of Client Authentication.  Not only
the format of the Authentication Code, but how is it utilized, and
protected.  For example, the draft includes mention of signature-based
authentication data and HMAC(AuthCode), but not plaintext.  There is a
proposal on the one hand to remove the signature form, and a proposal on
the other hand to keep the signature form and add a plaintext form.  To
resolve the issue, the point was raised that Section 5.3 does not
adequately describe the use case for "Client Authentication" nor for
"User Authentication", nor even for these relative to each and to
"Device Authentication".  Taking a step back, then, Ming agreed to take
a stab at enhancing the section to better describe the use case.

Andrea
P.S. Note that Issues #32-#36 in the Issue Tracker are new.  Inputs for
these came directly out of exchanges on the mailing list, and are
important to consider for resubmission of the document.
 <<Issues Nov15 2007.xls>>=20


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Date: Fri, 16 Nov 2007 16:30:33 +0100
From: Thomas Roessler <tlr@w3.org>
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	mnystrom@rsa.com, pbaker@verisign.com, Hannes.Tschofenig@gmx.net
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Subject: [KEYPROV] Review of draft-ietf-keyprov-dskpp-01
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This is a review of draft-ietf-keyprov-dskpp-01.  It occasionally
strays into the PSKC draft; however, I haven't fully read that
document.

Specific observations on the HTTP binding:

- In 12.2.4, the spec says "Persistent connections as defined in
  HTTP/1.1 are assumed, but not required." Taken literally, I don't
  know what "assumed, but not required" means.

- The HTTP binding does not indicate whether it fully defines the
  behavior of the HTTP server that is appearing as part of the
  transactions, or whether the DSKPP server is identified by either
  a specific URI and/or Host.  Please clarify that in the HTTP
  binding part.  (4.3 -- and other places -- suggest that the DSKPP
  server is indeed identified by a specific URI, which would be just
  fine.)

- In 12.2.4, instead of talking about "POST operations", maybe say
  "DSKPP requests are mapped to HTTP requests with the POST method".

- For the 4-step protocol, it's probably worth calling out here how
  the different messages are bound together, as they may be
  transported through different connections.  In particular,
  KeyProvServerHello is bound to the preceding KeyProvClientHello by
  being transmitted in the corresponding HTTP response;
  KeyProvServerHello MUST have a sessionId attribute, and the
  sesionId on the subsequent KeyProvClientNonce MUST be identical.
  KeyProServerFinished is then once again bound to the rest through
  HTTP (and possibly through a sessionID).

- The HTTP binding does not cover content negotiation.  I'd suggest:
  "HTTP requests MAY include an HTTP Accept header field. This
  header field SHOULD have the value
  application/vnd.ietf.keyprov.dskpp+xml.  The Accept header MAY
  include additional content types defined by future versions of
  this protocol."
  
  (The server is allowed to downgrade [6.2.3], so if a future
  version uses a different content type, that should be in the
  client's request, along with the current one, *if* the client is
  willing to downgrade.)

- The examples in 12.2.8 don't match the requirements from 12.2.3.

- 12.2.7 is extremely fuzzy as to when the server-side
  initialization message may be sent.  As long as that's indeed in
  response to a specific user request with the appropriate Accept
  header (e.g., to a specific DSKPP server URL), the use of the 200
  code seems fine.  However, please clarify that using a 200 code
  combined with the DSKPP content type is *not* an appropriate means
  to trigger protocol initialization during a browsing session where
  the user's request was directed to some other resource.  (In that
  case, some 40x code might be much more appropriate.)

- It's not clear how one-step DSKPP would work over HTTP.  What kind
  of request does the client send to trigger that?  If that isn't
  intended to run over HTTP, please clarify.

- In 12.2.3, the spec says: "HTTP proxies MUST NOT cache responses
  carrying DSKPP messages. For this reason, the following holds:"
  That's a conformance requirement on HTTP proxies; don't do that.
  Instead: "In order to avoid caching of responses carrying DSKPP
  messages by proxies, the following holds:" (Also, note that POST
  invalidates cached entities.)

- In 12.2.5, "If the type of a DSKPP request cannot be determined,
  the DSKPP responder MUST return a 400 response." What precisely is
  meant by "type cannot be determined"?  (Example?)

Reviewing BCP56, I would suspect that there might be slight
differences of opinion on whether DSKPP should have a port and URI
scheme of its own. However, given that the protocol binding (with
the above clarifications) will be layered rather cleanly on HTTP,
and won't confuse URI-based addressing, I fail to see the benefit of
allocating a separate port and/or URI scheme. This binding looks
like it is implementable on top of a conventional Web server, which
would suggest sticking to port 80 and http (or port 443 and https).

Beyond that point, I do not see any significant disagreements
between the guidance in BCP56 and this draft.




Various other observations while going through the document...

- -00 included schema fragments in section 4.9.  These are gone in
  the corresponding sections in -01, making review of the schema for
  consistency with the human-readable text significantly harder. I'd
  recommend resurrecting the schema fragements in future iterations
  of the draft for ease of review.

  While dropping the schema fragments, *any* human-readable
  documentation for types such as AbstractRequestType type has been
  lost.

- Please say early on in the spec what name space prefixes are used
  in XML snippets throughout the document, and what they mean.

- What's the order relation for the various Version attributes?  Are
  they treated as decimal numbers, as strings, as a dot-separated
  pairs of two integers?  Is "01.00" the same as "1.0"?

- Trying to assemble the overall XML schema to validate some of the
  examples...

  * DSKPP imports the schema from PSKC, which in turn imports a
    schema for the urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo namespace,
    which apparently isn't available anywhere.
  
  * The DSKPP and PSKC drafts use inconsistent namespaces for PSKC,
    urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container vs
    urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:1.0:container

  * The DSKPP schema uses an extension construct like this one
    repeatedly (DeviceIdentifierDataType, KeyContainerType,
    PayloadType, KeyProvTriggerType):
  
    <xs:complexType name="DeviceIdentifierDataType">
      <xs:choice>
        <xs:element name="DeviceId" type="pskc:DeviceIdType"/>
        <xs:any namespace="##other" processContents="strict"/>
      </xs:choice>
    </xs:complexType>
    
    In conjunction with use of elementFormDefault="unqualified",
    that unfortunately leads to a non-deterministic content model,
    as DeviceId is not actually in the target namespace.

    One possible fix is to move away from
    elementFormDefault="unqualified".  (PSKC uses "qualified"
    anyway.)

- StatusCode is one out of a closed list of strings. For
  extensibility, it might be worth using URIs/URNs instead of text
  strings here, and defining StatusCode to be of type anyURI.

- Same for PlatformType.

- ProtocolVariantsType uses elements to identify supported protocol
  variants.  I wonder if having an extension point in the schema for
  future variants might be useful.  Also, why not use an URI-based
  extensibility pattern?

- In 11.3.3, ds:KeyInfoType is used for Payloads, and "only those
  choices of the ds:KeyInfoType that identify a symmetric key are
  allowed".  Does a ds:RetrievalMethod that points to a ds:KeyName
  elsewhere possibly identify a symmetric key?  Please be clearer
  about which parts of ds:KeyInfo you use here.
  
- Same in 11.2.3 for public keys.

- IdentifierType is limited to a maximum 128 characters in the
  schema, yet that limitation is nowhere found in the normative
  text.

- PSKC uses strings for algorithm identifiers, DSKPP uses URIs.  Why
  the inconsistency?  (I'd prefer URIs, for consistency with XML
  Signature, XML Encryption, and neighboring specs.)

- In section 6.2.2, the normative text defines <SupportedKeyTypes>, 
  <SupportedEncryptionAlgorithms>, <SupportedMacAlgorithms>,
  <Supported KeyContainers> as "a series of URIs..." -- that's
  actually not true, as each of these elements includes a sequence
  of container elements that in turn contain the URIs.  Please be
  precise when describing XML structures.

- In section 6.2.2.2, the text about 4 and 2 pass DSKPP seems
  confused:
  
	If the ProtocolVariantsType is not used, then the DSKPP
	server will proceed with ordinary 4-pass DSKPP.  However,
	it does not support 4-pass DSKPP, then the server MUST
	find a suitable two-pass variant or else the protocol run
	will fail.
	       
  I believe it's supposed to say "if no protocol variants are
  indicated, then the server will proceed with ordinary 4 pass, or
  maybe with 2 pass", or something like that.  Please phrase this
  more clearly.

  (Incidentally, what does it mean that the *type* is not used?)

- In 6.2.2.4, "An AuthenticationCode MAY or MAY NOT contain
  alphanumeric characters.." -- excuse me?

- same section, "A DSKPP client MAY contain Authentication Data
  consisting of signed data of client Nonce with a client
  certificate's private key." I believe this is supposed to describe
  a public key signature of the client Nonce.

- same section, "The element of ... have the following meaning" --
  make that "elements"

- same section, a lot of discussion that "certificate itself is
  typically sufficient"; "DeviceID, KeyID, and/or nonce provided in
  the <InitializationTriggerType> element ougth to be sufficient to
  identify the requester".  What's probably meant is that ClientID
  can be omitted if the requester can be identified otherwise.  If
  so, please say that.

- The security considerations are somewhat inconsistent in their
  attacker model.  In some cases, a man in the middle is assumed to
  have the capability to bypass TLS protection (e.g., 14.2.2); in
  other sections transport security is presented as a solution to
  concerns about the integrity of protocol exchanges (e.g., 14.2.4).

  It would contribute to the clarity of the security considerations
  if there was a clear discussion of the assumptions beforehand, and
  a consistent use of attacker models later on.

- While I've not worked this through fully, it appears that an
  active attacker can manipulate the SupportedKeyTypes and KeyType
  elements in the ClientHello and KeyProvServerHello messages,
  without the protocol failing, if both device and server support
  multiple key types with mutually interchangeable key material.
  That might lead to an inconsistent state, or possibly to the use
  of weak keys.  It might be useful to use the negotiated algorithm
  value as input into the MAC derivation mechanism.

- Finally, on yet another editorial note, the namespace in the
  schema and the one in the IANA considerations section are
  inconsistent.

Regards,
-- 
Thomas Roessler, W3C  <tlr@w3.org>

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Subject: [KEYPROV] Re: Review of draft-ietf-keyprov-dskpp-01
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On 2007-11-16 16:30:33 +0100, Thomas Roessler wrote:

> Reviewing BCP56, I would suspect that there might be slight
> differences of opinion on whether DSKPP should have a port and URI
> scheme of its own. However, given that the protocol binding (with
> the above clarifications) will be layered rather cleanly on HTTP,
> and won't confuse URI-based addressing, I fail to see the benefit of
> allocating a separate port and/or URI scheme. This binding looks
> like it is implementable on top of a conventional Web server, which
> would suggest sticking to port 80 and http (or port 443 and https).

> Beyond that point, I do not see any significant disagreements
> between the guidance in BCP56 and this draft.

... and reviewing the old discussion on apps-review (which I meant
to do before sending the review, but didn't), the disagreement might
in fact be not so slight.  So, apologies.

See in particular:

  http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/apps-review/current/msg00085.html

So, there are a number of criteria on the table here:

- BCP56 mainly talks about expected server implementation and
  network filtering.  In terms of server implementation, DSKPP
  sounds as though it could be implemented on top of an existing
  HTTP server; from my review, the layering is reasonably clean.
  Yes, there is separate code, but not in a way that's significantly
  different from any Web app.
  
  The possible arguments in favor of new methods don't sound like
  they apply (POST should be just fine), which leaves questions
  about network administrators and "different data sets" as the
  remaining ones.
  
  I don't understand what the "different data sets" criterion is
  even supposed to mean, and can't speak to the network
  administrators.

- In Chris' message (URL above), he writes:

> Unless the primary client for your protocol is a web browser, I
> would strongly encourage registering a separate port.
  
  There is indeed some indication in the specification that the
  protocol might at the very least be triggered through a
  traditional Web browser.  Besides that, any exchanges beyond a
  possible trigger message seem to involve dereferencing a URI with
  POST as the method anyway, so the port is configurable at that
  point, if the deployer so desires.
  
That, to me, suggests strongly that Chris' argument doesn't really
apply to the spec at hand.  To the more general statement that "At
this point it's inevitable we'll end up with intrusive firewalls on
port 80 that will break anything beyond stock browser-based HTTP",
I'd notice that POST with some XML content type and some XML content
is totally within the realm of "stock browser-based HTTP" today.

  http://www.w3.org/TR/XMLHttpRequest/

So, in summary, I don't see convincing reasons to urge the DSKPP
group to move this away from port 80.

Cheers,
-- 
Thomas Roessler, W3C  <tlr@w3.org>

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This is a review of draft-ietf-keyprov-dskpp-01.  It occasionally
strays into the PSKC draft; however, I haven't fully read that
document.

Specific observations on the HTTP binding:

- In 12.2.4, the spec says "Persistent connections as defined in
  HTTP/1.1 are assumed, but not required." Taken literally, I don't
  know what "assumed, but not required" means.

- The HTTP binding does not indicate whether it fully defines the
  behavior of the HTTP server that is appearing as part of the
  transactions, or whether the DSKPP server is identified by either
  a specific URI and/or Host.  Please clarify that in the HTTP
  binding part.  (4.3 -- and other places -- suggest that the DSKPP
  server is indeed identified by a specific URI, which would be just
  fine.)

- In 12.2.4, instead of talking about "POST operations", maybe say
  "DSKPP requests are mapped to HTTP requests with the POST method".

- For the 4-step protocol, it's probably worth calling out here how
  the different messages are bound together, as they may be
  transported through different connections.  In particular,
  KeyProvServerHello is bound to the preceding KeyProvClientHello by
  being transmitted in the corresponding HTTP response;
  KeyProvServerHello MUST have a sessionId attribute, and the
  sesionId on the subsequent KeyProvClientNonce MUST be identical.
  KeyProServerFinished is then once again bound to the rest through
  HTTP (and possibly through a sessionID).

- The HTTP binding does not cover content negotiation.  I'd suggest:
  "HTTP requests MAY include an HTTP Accept header field. This
  header field SHOULD have the value
  application/vnd.ietf.keyprov.dskpp+xml.  The Accept header MAY
  include additional content types defined by future versions of
  this protocol."
  
  (The server is allowed to downgrade [6.2.3], so if a future
  version uses a different content type, that should be in the
  client's request, along with the current one, *if* the client is
  willing to downgrade.)

- The examples in 12.2.8 don't match the requirements from 12.2.3.

- 12.2.7 is extremely fuzzy as to when the server-side
  initialization message may be sent.  As long as that's indeed in
  response to a specific user request with the appropriate Accept
  header (e.g., to a specific DSKPP server URL), the use of the 200
  code seems fine.  However, please clarify that using a 200 code
  combined with the DSKPP content type is *not* an appropriate means
  to trigger protocol initialization during a browsing session where
  the user's request was directed to some other resource.  (In that
  case, some 40x code might be much more appropriate.)

- It's not clear how one-step DSKPP would work over HTTP.  What kind
  of request does the client send to trigger that?  If that isn't
  intended to run over HTTP, please clarify.

- In 12.2.3, the spec says: "HTTP proxies MUST NOT cache responses
  carrying DSKPP messages. For this reason, the following holds:"
  That's a conformance requirement on HTTP proxies; don't do that.
  Instead: "In order to avoid caching of responses carrying DSKPP
  messages by proxies, the following holds:" (Also, note that POST
  invalidates cached entities.)

- In 12.2.5, "If the type of a DSKPP request cannot be determined,
  the DSKPP responder MUST return a 400 response." What precisely is
  meant by "type cannot be determined"?  (Example?)

Reviewing BCP56, I would suspect that there might be slight
differences of opinion on whether DSKPP should have a port and URI
scheme of its own. However, given that the protocol binding (with
the above clarifications) will be layered rather cleanly on HTTP,
and won't confuse URI-based addressing, I fail to see the benefit of
allocating a separate port and/or URI scheme. This binding looks
like it is implementable on top of a conventional Web server, which
would suggest sticking to port 80 and http (or port 443 and https).

Beyond that point, I do not see any significant disagreements
between the guidance in BCP56 and this draft.




Various other observations while going through the document...

- -00 included schema fragments in section 4.9.  These are gone in
  the corresponding sections in -01, making review of the schema for
  consistency with the human-readable text significantly harder. I'd
  recommend resurrecting the schema fragements in future iterations
  of the draft for ease of review.

  While dropping the schema fragments, *any* human-readable
  documentation for types such as AbstractRequestType type has been
  lost.

- Please say early on in the spec what name space prefixes are used
  in XML snippets throughout the document, and what they mean.

- What's the order relation for the various Version attributes?  Are
  they treated as decimal numbers, as strings, as a dot-separated
  pairs of two integers?  Is "01.00" the same as "1.0"?

- Trying to assemble the overall XML schema to validate some of the
  examples...

  * DSKPP imports the schema from PSKC, which in turn imports a
    schema for the urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo namespace,
    which apparently isn't available anywhere.
  
  * The DSKPP and PSKC drafts use inconsistent namespaces for PSKC,
    urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container vs
    urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:1.0:container

  * The DSKPP schema uses an extension construct like this one
    repeatedly (DeviceIdentifierDataType, KeyContainerType,
    PayloadType, KeyProvTriggerType):
  
    <xs:complexType name="DeviceIdentifierDataType">
      <xs:choice>
        <xs:element name="DeviceId" type="pskc:DeviceIdType"/>
        <xs:any namespace="##other" processContents="strict"/>
      </xs:choice>
    </xs:complexType>
    
    In conjunction with use of elementFormDefault="unqualified",
    that unfortunately leads to a non-deterministic content model,
    as DeviceId is not actually in the target namespace.

    One possible fix is to move away from
    elementFormDefault="unqualified".  (PSKC uses "qualified"
    anyway.)

- StatusCode is one out of a closed list of strings. For
  extensibility, it might be worth using URIs/URNs instead of text
  strings here, and defining StatusCode to be of type anyURI.

- Same for PlatformType.

- ProtocolVariantsType uses elements to identify supported protocol
  variants.  I wonder if having an extension point in the schema for
  future variants might be useful.  Also, why not use an URI-based
  extensibility pattern?

- In 11.3.3, ds:KeyInfoType is used for Payloads, and "only those
  choices of the ds:KeyInfoType that identify a symmetric key are
  allowed".  Does a ds:RetrievalMethod that points to a ds:KeyName
  elsewhere possibly identify a symmetric key?  Please be clearer
  about which parts of ds:KeyInfo you use here.
  
- Same in 11.2.3 for public keys.

- IdentifierType is limited to a maximum 128 characters in the
  schema, yet that limitation is nowhere found in the normative
  text.

- PSKC uses strings for algorithm identifiers, DSKPP uses URIs.  Why
  the inconsistency?  (I'd prefer URIs, for consistency with XML
  Signature, XML Encryption, and neighboring specs.)

- In section 6.2.2, the normative text defines <SupportedKeyTypes>, 
  <SupportedEncryptionAlgorithms>, <SupportedMacAlgorithms>,
  <Supported KeyContainers> as "a series of URIs..." -- that's
  actually not true, as each of these elements includes a sequence
  of container elements that in turn contain the URIs.  Please be
  precise when describing XML structures.

- In section 6.2.2.2, the text about 4 and 2 pass DSKPP seems
  confused:
  
	If the ProtocolVariantsType is not used, then the DSKPP
	server will proceed with ordinary 4-pass DSKPP.  However,
	it does not support 4-pass DSKPP, then the server MUST
	find a suitable two-pass variant or else the protocol run
	will fail.
	       
  I believe it's supposed to say "if no protocol variants are
  indicated, then the server will proceed with ordinary 4 pass, or
  maybe with 2 pass", or something like that.  Please phrase this
  more clearly.

  (Incidentally, what does it mean that the *type* is not used?)

- In 6.2.2.4, "An AuthenticationCode MAY or MAY NOT contain
  alphanumeric characters.." -- excuse me?

- same section, "A DSKPP client MAY contain Authentication Data
  consisting of signed data of client Nonce with a client
  certificate's private key." I believe this is supposed to describe
  a public key signature of the client Nonce.

- same section, "The element of ... have the following meaning" --
  make that "elements"

- same section, a lot of discussion that "certificate itself is
  typically sufficient"; "DeviceID, KeyID, and/or nonce provided in
  the <InitializationTriggerType> element ougth to be sufficient to
  identify the requester".  What's probably meant is that ClientID
  can be omitted if the requester can be identified otherwise.  If
  so, please say that.

- The security considerations are somewhat inconsistent in their
  attacker model.  In some cases, a man in the middle is assumed to
  have the capability to bypass TLS protection (e.g., 14.2.2); in
  other sections transport security is presented as a solution to
  concerns about the integrity of protocol exchanges (e.g., 14.2.4).

  It would contribute to the clarity of the security considerations
  if there was a clear discussion of the assumptions beforehand, and
  a consistent use of attacker models later on.

- While I've not worked this through fully, it appears that an
  active attacker can manipulate the SupportedKeyTypes and KeyType
  elements in the ClientHello and KeyProvServerHello messages,
  without the protocol failing, if both device and server support
  multiple key types with mutually interchangeable key material.
  That might lead to an inconsistent state, or possibly to the use
  of weak keys.  It might be useful to use the negotiated algorithm
  value as input into the MAC derivation mechanism.

- Finally, on yet another editorial note, the namespace in the
  schema and the one in the IANA considerations section are
  inconsistent.

Regards,
-- 
Thomas Roessler, W3C  <tlr@w3.org>

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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 16 11:23:57 2007
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From: Thomas Roessler <tlr@w3.org>
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Subject: [KEYPROV] Re: Review of draft-ietf-keyprov-dskpp-01
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On 2007-11-16 16:30:33 +0100, Thomas Roessler wrote:

> Reviewing BCP56, I would suspect that there might be slight
> differences of opinion on whether DSKPP should have a port and URI
> scheme of its own. However, given that the protocol binding (with
> the above clarifications) will be layered rather cleanly on HTTP,
> and won't confuse URI-based addressing, I fail to see the benefit of
> allocating a separate port and/or URI scheme. This binding looks
> like it is implementable on top of a conventional Web server, which
> would suggest sticking to port 80 and http (or port 443 and https).

> Beyond that point, I do not see any significant disagreements
> between the guidance in BCP56 and this draft.

... and reviewing the old discussion on apps-review (which I meant
to do before sending the review, but didn't), the disagreement might
in fact be not so slight.  So, apologies.

See in particular:

  http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/apps-review/current/msg00085.html

So, there are a number of criteria on the table here:

- BCP56 mainly talks about expected server implementation and
  network filtering.  In terms of server implementation, DSKPP
  sounds as though it could be implemented on top of an existing
  HTTP server; from my review, the layering is reasonably clean.
  Yes, there is separate code, but not in a way that's significantly
  different from any Web app.
  
  The possible arguments in favor of new methods don't sound like
  they apply (POST should be just fine), which leaves questions
  about network administrators and "different data sets" as the
  remaining ones.
  
  I don't understand what the "different data sets" criterion is
  even supposed to mean, and can't speak to the network
  administrators.

- In Chris' message (URL above), he writes:

> Unless the primary client for your protocol is a web browser, I
> would strongly encourage registering a separate port.
  
  There is indeed some indication in the specification that the
  protocol might at the very least be triggered through a
  traditional Web browser.  Besides that, any exchanges beyond a
  possible trigger message seem to involve dereferencing a URI with
  POST as the method anyway, so the port is configurable at that
  point, if the deployer so desires.
  
That, to me, suggests strongly that Chris' argument doesn't really
apply to the spec at hand.  To the more general statement that "At
this point it's inevitable we'll end up with intrusive firewalls on
port 80 that will break anything beyond stock browser-based HTTP",
I'd notice that POST with some XML content type and some XML content
is totally within the realm of "stock browser-based HTTP" today.

  http://www.w3.org/TR/XMLHttpRequest/

So, in summary, I don't see convincing reasons to urge the DSKPP
group to move this away from port 80.

Cheers,
-- 
Thomas Roessler, W3C  <tlr@w3.org>

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Thomas - Thank you for your thorough review, and constructive comments.  =
We'll go through these and provide feedback/questions.

All - Thomas wrote:
- -00 included schema fragments in section 4.9.  These are gone in
  the corresponding sections in -01, making review of the schema for
  consistency with the human-readable text significantly harder. I'd
  recommend resurrecting the schema fragements in future iterations
  of the draft for ease of review.

  While dropping the schema fragments, *any* human-readable
  documentation for types such as AbstractRequestType type has been
  lost.

What are other views on this change in -01?  More feedback would be =
greatly appreciated.

Andrea=20

-----Original Message-----
From: Thomas Roessler [mailto:tlr@w3.org]=20
Sent: Friday, November 16, 2007 10:31 AM
To: Doherty, Andrea; smachani@diversinet.com; mpei@verisign.com; =
Nystr=F6m, Magnus; pbaker@verisign.com; Hannes.Tschofenig@gmx.net
Cc: apps-review@ietf.org; keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: Review of draft-ietf-keyprov-dskpp-01

This is a review of draft-ietf-keyprov-dskpp-01.  It occasionally
strays into the PSKC draft; however, I haven't fully read that
document.

Specific observations on the HTTP binding:

- In 12.2.4, the spec says "Persistent connections as defined in
  HTTP/1.1 are assumed, but not required." Taken literally, I don't
  know what "assumed, but not required" means.

- The HTTP binding does not indicate whether it fully defines the
  behavior of the HTTP server that is appearing as part of the
  transactions, or whether the DSKPP server is identified by either
  a specific URI and/or Host.  Please clarify that in the HTTP
  binding part.  (4.3 -- and other places -- suggest that the DSKPP
  server is indeed identified by a specific URI, which would be just
  fine.)

- In 12.2.4, instead of talking about "POST operations", maybe say
  "DSKPP requests are mapped to HTTP requests with the POST method".

- For the 4-step protocol, it's probably worth calling out here how
  the different messages are bound together, as they may be
  transported through different connections.  In particular,
  KeyProvServerHello is bound to the preceding KeyProvClientHello by
  being transmitted in the corresponding HTTP response;
  KeyProvServerHello MUST have a sessionId attribute, and the
  sesionId on the subsequent KeyProvClientNonce MUST be identical.
  KeyProServerFinished is then once again bound to the rest through
  HTTP (and possibly through a sessionID).

- The HTTP binding does not cover content negotiation.  I'd suggest:
  "HTTP requests MAY include an HTTP Accept header field. This
  header field SHOULD have the value
  application/vnd.ietf.keyprov.dskpp+xml.  The Accept header MAY
  include additional content types defined by future versions of
  this protocol."
 =20
  (The server is allowed to downgrade [6.2.3], so if a future
  version uses a different content type, that should be in the
  client's request, along with the current one, *if* the client is
  willing to downgrade.)

- The examples in 12.2.8 don't match the requirements from 12.2.3.

- 12.2.7 is extremely fuzzy as to when the server-side
  initialization message may be sent.  As long as that's indeed in
  response to a specific user request with the appropriate Accept
  header (e.g., to a specific DSKPP server URL), the use of the 200
  code seems fine.  However, please clarify that using a 200 code
  combined with the DSKPP content type is *not* an appropriate means
  to trigger protocol initialization during a browsing session where
  the user's request was directed to some other resource.  (In that
  case, some 40x code might be much more appropriate.)

- It's not clear how one-step DSKPP would work over HTTP.  What kind
  of request does the client send to trigger that?  If that isn't
  intended to run over HTTP, please clarify.

- In 12.2.3, the spec says: "HTTP proxies MUST NOT cache responses
  carrying DSKPP messages. For this reason, the following holds:"
  That's a conformance requirement on HTTP proxies; don't do that.
  Instead: "In order to avoid caching of responses carrying DSKPP
  messages by proxies, the following holds:" (Also, note that POST
  invalidates cached entities.)

- In 12.2.5, "If the type of a DSKPP request cannot be determined,
  the DSKPP responder MUST return a 400 response." What precisely is
  meant by "type cannot be determined"?  (Example?)

Reviewing BCP56, I would suspect that there might be slight
differences of opinion on whether DSKPP should have a port and URI
scheme of its own. However, given that the protocol binding (with
the above clarifications) will be layered rather cleanly on HTTP,
and won't confuse URI-based addressing, I fail to see the benefit of
allocating a separate port and/or URI scheme. This binding looks
like it is implementable on top of a conventional Web server, which
would suggest sticking to port 80 and http (or port 443 and https).

Beyond that point, I do not see any significant disagreements
between the guidance in BCP56 and this draft.




Various other observations while going through the document...

- -00 included schema fragments in section 4.9.  These are gone in
  the corresponding sections in -01, making review of the schema for
  consistency with the human-readable text significantly harder. I'd
  recommend resurrecting the schema fragements in future iterations
  of the draft for ease of review.

  While dropping the schema fragments, *any* human-readable
  documentation for types such as AbstractRequestType type has been
  lost.

- Please say early on in the spec what name space prefixes are used
  in XML snippets throughout the document, and what they mean.

- What's the order relation for the various Version attributes?  Are
  they treated as decimal numbers, as strings, as a dot-separated
  pairs of two integers?  Is "01.00" the same as "1.0"?

- Trying to assemble the overall XML schema to validate some of the
  examples...

  * DSKPP imports the schema from PSKC, which in turn imports a
    schema for the urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo namespace,
    which apparently isn't available anywhere.
 =20
  * The DSKPP and PSKC drafts use inconsistent namespaces for PSKC,
    urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container vs
    urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:1.0:container

  * The DSKPP schema uses an extension construct like this one
    repeatedly (DeviceIdentifierDataType, KeyContainerType,
    PayloadType, KeyProvTriggerType):
 =20
    <xs:complexType name=3D"DeviceIdentifierDataType">
      <xs:choice>
        <xs:element name=3D"DeviceId" type=3D"pskc:DeviceIdType"/>
        <xs:any namespace=3D"##other" processContents=3D"strict"/>
      </xs:choice>
    </xs:complexType>
   =20
    In conjunction with use of elementFormDefault=3D"unqualified",
    that unfortunately leads to a non-deterministic content model,
    as DeviceId is not actually in the target namespace.

    One possible fix is to move away from
    elementFormDefault=3D"unqualified".  (PSKC uses "qualified"
    anyway.)

- StatusCode is one out of a closed list of strings. For
  extensibility, it might be worth using URIs/URNs instead of text
  strings here, and defining StatusCode to be of type anyURI.

- Same for PlatformType.

- ProtocolVariantsType uses elements to identify supported protocol
  variants.  I wonder if having an extension point in the schema for
  future variants might be useful.  Also, why not use an URI-based
  extensibility pattern?

- In 11.3.3, ds:KeyInfoType is used for Payloads, and "only those
  choices of the ds:KeyInfoType that identify a symmetric key are
  allowed".  Does a ds:RetrievalMethod that points to a ds:KeyName
  elsewhere possibly identify a symmetric key?  Please be clearer
  about which parts of ds:KeyInfo you use here.
 =20
- Same in 11.2.3 for public keys.

- IdentifierType is limited to a maximum 128 characters in the
  schema, yet that limitation is nowhere found in the normative
  text.

- PSKC uses strings for algorithm identifiers, DSKPP uses URIs.  Why
  the inconsistency?  (I'd prefer URIs, for consistency with XML
  Signature, XML Encryption, and neighboring specs.)

- In section 6.2.2, the normative text defines <SupportedKeyTypes>,=20
  <SupportedEncryptionAlgorithms>, <SupportedMacAlgorithms>,
  <Supported KeyContainers> as "a series of URIs..." -- that's
  actually not true, as each of these elements includes a sequence
  of container elements that in turn contain the URIs.  Please be
  precise when describing XML structures.

- In section 6.2.2.2, the text about 4 and 2 pass DSKPP seems
  confused:
 =20
	If the ProtocolVariantsType is not used, then the DSKPP
	server will proceed with ordinary 4-pass DSKPP.  However,
	it does not support 4-pass DSKPP, then the server MUST
	find a suitable two-pass variant or else the protocol run
	will fail.
	      =20
  I believe it's supposed to say "if no protocol variants are
  indicated, then the server will proceed with ordinary 4 pass, or
  maybe with 2 pass", or something like that.  Please phrase this
  more clearly.

  (Incidentally, what does it mean that the *type* is not used?)

- In 6.2.2.4, "An AuthenticationCode MAY or MAY NOT contain
  alphanumeric characters.." -- excuse me?

- same section, "A DSKPP client MAY contain Authentication Data
  consisting of signed data of client Nonce with a client
  certificate's private key." I believe this is supposed to describe
  a public key signature of the client Nonce.

- same section, "The element of ... have the following meaning" --
  make that "elements"

- same section, a lot of discussion that "certificate itself is
  typically sufficient"; "DeviceID, KeyID, and/or nonce provided in
  the <InitializationTriggerType> element ougth to be sufficient to
  identify the requester".  What's probably meant is that ClientID
  can be omitted if the requester can be identified otherwise.  If
  so, please say that.

- The security considerations are somewhat inconsistent in their
  attacker model.  In some cases, a man in the middle is assumed to
  have the capability to bypass TLS protection (e.g., 14.2.2); in
  other sections transport security is presented as a solution to
  concerns about the integrity of protocol exchanges (e.g., 14.2.4).

  It would contribute to the clarity of the security considerations
  if there was a clear discussion of the assumptions beforehand, and
  a consistent use of attacker models later on.

- While I've not worked this through fully, it appears that an
  active attacker can manipulate the SupportedKeyTypes and KeyType
  elements in the ClientHello and KeyProvServerHello messages,
  without the protocol failing, if both device and server support
  multiple key types with mutually interchangeable key material.
  That might lead to an inconsistent state, or possibly to the use
  of weak keys.  It might be useful to use the negotiated algorithm
  value as input into the MAC derivation mechanism.

- Finally, on yet another editorial note, the namespace in the
  schema and the one in the IANA considerations section are
  inconsistent.

Regards,
--=20
Thomas Roessler, W3C  <tlr@w3.org>


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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Provisioning of Symmetric Keys Working Group of the IETF.


	Title           : Symmetric Key Package Content Type
	Author(s)       : S. Turner, et al.
	Filename        : draft-ietf-keyprov-symmetrickeyformat-01.txt
	Pages           : 8
	Date            : 2007-11-18

This document defines the symmetric key format content type.  It is 
transport independent. The Cryptographic Message Syntax [RFC3852] can 
be used to digitally sign, digest, authenticate, or encrypt this 
content type.

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PSKC v1.2 is submitted. - Ming

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v1.2

Greetings:

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=20
The attached version has been submitted to IETF. Here are the changes
made in 02 version:
=20
Changes from last version:
=20
1. Changed algorithm enumerations to URIs
2. Changed all attribute name initial from lower case to upper case
3. Changed VersionType to use 2 major digits and 3 minor digits. It is
consistent with DSKPP.
4. PSKC schema file to not use default namespace
5. Example fixed and validated against schema
6. Add name TIME_DRIFT for HOTP time based algorithm
7. Changed HOTP key algorithm URI from URN style to URL. This causes
some inconsistency with DSKPP v1.1 and we will align both specifications
in the next revision.
8. Added Logo in the common attribute section.
9. Added logo schema file content in the schema section.
10. A few typos.

There are some items that we didn't make into this revision such as how
to handle user PIN policy. We would like to discuss those items during
the next work group meeting in IETF.
=20
Please review this revision. Thank you,
=20
- Ming
=20

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.2995" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D764234409-19112007></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007>The =
attached version=20
has been submitted to IETF. Here are the changes made in 02=20
version:</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D764234409-19112007></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV><FONT><SPAN=20
class=3D764234409-19112007>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Changes from last version:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>1. Changed algorithm enumerations to =
URIs<BR>2.=20
Changed all attribute name initial from lower case to upper case<BR>3. =
Changed=20
VersionType to use 2 major digits and 3 minor digits. It is consistent =
with=20
DSKPP.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D764234409-19112007>4</SPAN>. PSKC=20
schema file to not use default namespace<BR><SPAN=20
class=3D764234409-19112007>5</SPAN>. Example fixed and validated against =

schema<BR><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007>6</SPAN>. Add name TIME_DRIFT =
for HOTP=20
time based algorithm<BR><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007>7</SPAN>. =
Changed HOTP=20
key algorithm URI from URN style to URL. This causes some inconsistency =
with=20
DSKPP v1.1 and we will align both specifications in the next =
revision.<BR><SPAN=20
class=3D764234409-19112007>8</SPAN>. Added Logo in the common attribute=20
section.<BR><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007>9</SPAN>. Added logo schema =
file=20
content in the schema section.<BR><SPAN =
class=3D764234409-19112007>10</SPAN>. A=20
few typos.<BR></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007><FONT face=3DArial =
size=3D2>There are some=20
items that we didn't make into this revision such as how to handle user =
PIN=20
policy. We would like to discuss those items during the next work group =
meeting=20
in IETF.</FONT></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV></FONT>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Please =
review this=20
revision. Thank you,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>-=20
Ming</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=3D764234409-19112007><FONT face=3DArial=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV></SPAN></FONT></BODY></HTML>

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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 19 04:56:17 2007
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Subject: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
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In one of email thread discussions with Hannes's comments, we exchanged
discussion about whether we should keep One Pass in this spec. I also
post this here for broad discussion and feedbacks.

There are a few concerns puzzling me about "One-pass" case.

1. Which use case listed in the spec does it try to address?

2. It looks to me that it increased complexity for interop and
documentation.

When we mention about binding with HTTP, for example, one pass is much
useful with HTTP. Two-pass could be used. As a client server protocol, a
Client always sends something to request; why not always send the hello
message.

Thomas's email today again asks for clarification what a client should
send with HTTP. I would feel that two-pass can be simply used instead.

3. If we don't use HTTP with One Pass, then what is it?
  =20
A different transport would obviously be necessary to make the "one
pass" really a "one pass".

I would prefer to simplify the spec by not supporting one-pass case. Or
we need to specify something for recommendation, and current spec lacks
it. Or I may haved missed some sections about its powerness.

Comments? Thanks,

- Ming

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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Mon Nov 19 09:16:16 2007
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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 09:15:18 -0500
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Ming,=20

The use case for 'one pass' is described in section 3.8 - SMS based
transport use case.  I agree with the assessment that 'one pass' is
redundant when using HTTP transport.  We should clarify in the spec that
the 'one pass' variant is applicable when SMS is used as transport and
revisit the definition of 'ServerFinished' message in 'one pass' to
ensure that the formatting and size is suitable for SMS transport. =20

Regards,


Salah
  =20
-----Original Message-----
From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]=20
Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 4:55 AM
To: keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?


In one of email thread discussions with Hannes's comments, we exchanged
discussion about whether we should keep One Pass in this spec. I also
post this here for broad discussion and feedbacks.

There are a few concerns puzzling me about "One-pass" case.

1. Which use case listed in the spec does it try to address?

2. It looks to me that it increased complexity for interop and
documentation.

When we mention about binding with HTTP, for example, one pass is much
useful with HTTP. Two-pass could be used. As a client server protocol, a
Client always sends something to request; why not always send the hello
message.

Thomas's email today again asks for clarification what a client should
send with HTTP. I would feel that two-pass can be simply used instead.

3. If we don't use HTTP with One Pass, then what is it?
  =20
A different transport would obviously be necessary to make the "one
pass" really a "one pass".

I would prefer to simplify the spec by not supporting one-pass case. Or
we need to specify something for recommendation, and current spec lacks
it. Or I may haved missed some sections about its powerness.

Comments? Thanks,

- Ming

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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
Date: Mon, 19 Nov 2007 11:35:21 -0800
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From: "Pei, Mingliang" <mpei@verisign.com>
To: "Salah Machani" <SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM>, <keyprov@ietf.org>
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Salah,

Thanks. Use case 3.8 was from earlier OATH DSKPP draft. In this case, a
user triggers a requesst from a wired client (e.g. desktop) to do
authentication, and asks a response to be sent via SMS. We had the
"SharedSecretDeliveryMethod" in a request to indicate whether a response
should be sent back in SMS or HTTP for this purpose. Considering the
complexity that additional information may need to be submitted in a
request with SMS preference, we decided to remove this negotiation. So I
thought that SMS support was going to be out of scope for the complexity
for now.

To clarify and complete the "one-pass" case in the spec associated with
SMS, shall we specify the additional information in ClientHello for the
wired side? I incline to think that the typical flow in this case is a
combo of two-pass HTTP and one-pass SMS response.

- Ming

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Salah Machani [mailto:SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM]=20
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:15 AM
> To: Pei, Mingliang; keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
>=20
> Ming,=20
>=20
> The use case for 'one pass' is described in section 3.8 - SMS=20
> based transport use case.  I agree with the assessment that=20
> 'one pass' is redundant when using HTTP transport.  We should=20
> clarify in the spec that the 'one pass' variant is applicable=20
> when SMS is used as transport and revisit the definition of=20
> 'ServerFinished' message in 'one pass' to ensure that the=20
> formatting and size is suitable for SMS transport. =20
>=20
> Regards,
>=20
>=20
> Salah
>   =20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 4:55 AM
> To: keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
>=20
>=20
> In one of email thread discussions with Hannes's comments, we=20
> exchanged
> discussion about whether we should keep One Pass in this spec. I also
> post this here for broad discussion and feedbacks.
>=20
> There are a few concerns puzzling me about "One-pass" case.
>=20
> 1. Which use case listed in the spec does it try to address?
>=20
> 2. It looks to me that it increased complexity for interop and
> documentation.
>=20
> When we mention about binding with HTTP, for example, one pass is much
> useful with HTTP. Two-pass could be used. As a client server=20
> protocol, a
> Client always sends something to request; why not always send=20
> the hello
> message.
>=20
> Thomas's email today again asks for clarification what a client should
> send with HTTP. I would feel that two-pass can be simply used instead.
>=20
> 3. If we don't use HTTP with One Pass, then what is it?
>   =20
> A different transport would obviously be necessary to make the "one
> pass" really a "one pass".
>=20
> I would prefer to simplify the spec by not supporting=20
> one-pass case. Or
> we need to specify something for recommendation, and current=20
> spec lacks
> it. Or I may haved missed some sections about its powerness.
>=20
> Comments? Thanks,
>=20
> - Ming
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> Notice to Recipient:  The information in this message is=20
> meant only for the intended recipient of the transmission and=20
> may contain confidential or privileged information.=20
>=20
> Any copying, retransmittal, taking of action in reliance on,=20
> or other use of the information in this communication by=20
> persons other than the addressees is prohibited. =20
>=20
> If you received this email in error, please immediately=20
> notify us and please delete or destroy all copies of this message.
>=20
> This message may have been altered without your or our=20
> knowledge and the sender does not accept any liability for=20
> any errors.  Thank you.
>=20
>=20
>=20

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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 20 06:01:03 2007
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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
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From: "Salah Machani" <SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM>
To: "Pei, Mingliang" <mpei@verisign.com>,
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Ming,


If there was a consensus to drop SMS support then we should remove the
use case in 3.8.  Otherwise, we need to have considerations in
specification for dskpp run over SMS.  Note that the SMS push with
ServerFinished data does not necessary need to be triggered by a
ClientHello from a desktop computer.  This could be sent to the phone as
a result of the user registering with the provisioning service through
the web or other channels. It will be a true 'one pass' as specified in
the draft.

Regards,

Salah

-----Original Message-----
From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]=20
Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 2:35 PM
To: Salah Machani; keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?


Salah,

Thanks. Use case 3.8 was from earlier OATH DSKPP draft. In this case, a
user triggers a requesst from a wired client (e.g. desktop) to do
authentication, and asks a response to be sent via SMS. We had the
"SharedSecretDeliveryMethod" in a request to indicate whether a response
should be sent back in SMS or HTTP for this purpose. Considering the
complexity that additional information may need to be submitted in a
request with SMS preference, we decided to remove this negotiation. So I
thought that SMS support was going to be out of scope for the complexity
for now.

To clarify and complete the "one-pass" case in the spec associated with
SMS, shall we specify the additional information in ClientHello for the
wired side? I incline to think that the typical flow in this case is a
combo of two-pass HTTP and one-pass SMS response.

- Ming

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Salah Machani [mailto:SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM]=20
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:15 AM
> To: Pei, Mingliang; keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
>=20
> Ming,=20
>=20
> The use case for 'one pass' is described in section 3.8 - SMS=20
> based transport use case.  I agree with the assessment that=20
> 'one pass' is redundant when using HTTP transport.  We should=20
> clarify in the spec that the 'one pass' variant is applicable=20
> when SMS is used as transport and revisit the definition of=20
> 'ServerFinished' message in 'one pass' to ensure that the=20
> formatting and size is suitable for SMS transport. =20
>=20
> Regards,
>=20
>=20
> Salah
>   =20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 4:55 AM
> To: keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
>=20
>=20
> In one of email thread discussions with Hannes's comments, we=20
> exchanged
> discussion about whether we should keep One Pass in this spec. I also
> post this here for broad discussion and feedbacks.
>=20
> There are a few concerns puzzling me about "One-pass" case.
>=20
> 1. Which use case listed in the spec does it try to address?
>=20
> 2. It looks to me that it increased complexity for interop and
> documentation.
>=20
> When we mention about binding with HTTP, for example, one pass is much
> useful with HTTP. Two-pass could be used. As a client server=20
> protocol, a
> Client always sends something to request; why not always send=20
> the hello
> message.
>=20
> Thomas's email today again asks for clarification what a client should
> send with HTTP. I would feel that two-pass can be simply used instead.
>=20
> 3. If we don't use HTTP with One Pass, then what is it?
>   =20
> A different transport would obviously be necessary to make the "one
> pass" really a "one pass".
>=20
> I would prefer to simplify the spec by not supporting=20
> one-pass case. Or
> we need to specify something for recommendation, and current=20
> spec lacks
> it. Or I may haved missed some sections about its powerness.
>=20
> Comments? Thanks,
>=20
> - Ming
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> Notice to Recipient:  The information in this message is=20
> meant only for the intended recipient of the transmission and=20
> may contain confidential or privileged information.=20
>=20
> Any copying, retransmittal, taking of action in reliance on,=20
> or other use of the information in this communication by=20
> persons other than the addressees is prohibited. =20
>=20
> If you received this email in error, please immediately=20
> notify us and please delete or destroy all copies of this message.
>=20
> This message may have been altered without your or our=20
> knowledge and the sender does not accept any liability for=20
> any errors.  Thank you.
>=20
>=20
>=20


Notice to Recipient:  The information in this message is meant only for t=
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 privileged information. =0D
Any copying, retransmittal, taking of action in reliance on, or other use=
 of the information in this communication by persons other than the addre=
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If you received this email in error, please immediately notify us and ple=
ase delete or destroy all copies of this message.=0D
This message may have been altered without your or our knowledge and the =
sender does not accept any liability for any errors.  Thank you.=0D


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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Tue Nov 20 13:43:09 2007
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Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue37] Should support for one-pass be removed from
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New submission from Andrea Doherty <adoherty@rsa.com>:

Ming wrote:

There are a few concerns puzzling me about "One-pass" case.

1=2E Which use case listed in the spec does it try to address?

2=2E It looks to me that it increased complexity for interop and
documentation.

3=2E If we don't use HTTP with One Pass, then what is it?
  =20
A different transport would obviously be necessary to make the "one
pass" really a "one pass".

I would prefer to simplify the spec by not supporting one-pass case. Or
we need to specify something for recommendation, and current spec lacks
it. Or I may haved missed some sections about its powerness.

----------
assignedto: mpei
messages: 86
nosy: andrea, keyprov, mpei
priority: feature
status: chatting
title: Should support for one-pass be removed from DSKPP document?

_________________________________________________________
KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
<http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue37>
_________________________________________________________

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Salah is correct that we should remove use case 3.8 from the DSKPP doc.
As was agreed at the meeting in Chicago, if someone wants to pick up the
use case and define how DSKPP can be extended/implemented to support it,
then they can create a separate document.
Andrea

-----Original Message-----
From: Salah Machani [mailto:SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM]=20
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 6:00 AM
To: Pei, Mingliang; keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?

Ming,


If there was a consensus to drop SMS support then we should remove the
use case in 3.8.  Otherwise, we need to have considerations in
specification for dskpp run over SMS.  Note that the SMS push with
ServerFinished data does not necessary need to be triggered by a
ClientHello from a desktop computer.  This could be sent to the phone as
a result of the user registering with the provisioning service through
the web or other channels. It will be a true 'one pass' as specified in
the draft.

Regards,

Salah

-----Original Message-----
From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]=20
Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 2:35 PM
To: Salah Machani; keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?


Salah,

Thanks. Use case 3.8 was from earlier OATH DSKPP draft. In this case, a
user triggers a requesst from a wired client (e.g. desktop) to do
authentication, and asks a response to be sent via SMS. We had the
"SharedSecretDeliveryMethod" in a request to indicate whether a response
should be sent back in SMS or HTTP for this purpose. Considering the
complexity that additional information may need to be submitted in a
request with SMS preference, we decided to remove this negotiation. So I
thought that SMS support was going to be out of scope for the complexity
for now.

To clarify and complete the "one-pass" case in the spec associated with
SMS, shall we specify the additional information in ClientHello for the
wired side? I incline to think that the typical flow in this case is a
combo of two-pass HTTP and one-pass SMS response.

- Ming

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Salah Machani [mailto:SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM]=20
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:15 AM
> To: Pei, Mingliang; keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
>=20
> Ming,=20
>=20
> The use case for 'one pass' is described in section 3.8 - SMS=20
> based transport use case.  I agree with the assessment that=20
> 'one pass' is redundant when using HTTP transport.  We should=20
> clarify in the spec that the 'one pass' variant is applicable=20
> when SMS is used as transport and revisit the definition of=20
> 'ServerFinished' message in 'one pass' to ensure that the=20
> formatting and size is suitable for SMS transport. =20
>=20
> Regards,
>=20
>=20
> Salah
>   =20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 4:55 AM
> To: keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
>=20
>=20
> In one of email thread discussions with Hannes's comments, we=20
> exchanged
> discussion about whether we should keep One Pass in this spec. I also
> post this here for broad discussion and feedbacks.
>=20
> There are a few concerns puzzling me about "One-pass" case.
>=20
> 1. Which use case listed in the spec does it try to address?
>=20
> 2. It looks to me that it increased complexity for interop and
> documentation.
>=20
> When we mention about binding with HTTP, for example, one pass is much
> useful with HTTP. Two-pass could be used. As a client server=20
> protocol, a
> Client always sends something to request; why not always send=20
> the hello
> message.
>=20
> Thomas's email today again asks for clarification what a client should
> send with HTTP. I would feel that two-pass can be simply used instead.
>=20
> 3. If we don't use HTTP with One Pass, then what is it?
>   =20
> A different transport would obviously be necessary to make the "one
> pass" really a "one pass".
>=20
> I would prefer to simplify the spec by not supporting=20
> one-pass case. Or
> we need to specify something for recommendation, and current=20
> spec lacks
> it. Or I may haved missed some sections about its powerness.
>=20
> Comments? Thanks,
>=20
> - Ming
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> Notice to Recipient:  The information in this message is=20
> meant only for the intended recipient of the transmission and=20
> may contain confidential or privileged information.=20
>=20
> Any copying, retransmittal, taking of action in reliance on,=20
> or other use of the information in this communication by=20
> persons other than the addressees is prohibited. =20
>=20
> If you received this email in error, please immediately=20
> notify us and please delete or destroy all copies of this message.
>=20
> This message may have been altered without your or our=20
> knowledge and the sender does not accept any liability for=20
> any errors.  Thank you.
>=20
>=20
>=20


Notice to Recipient:  The information in this message is meant only for
the intended recipient of the transmission and may contain confidential
or privileged information.=20

Any copying, retransmittal, taking of action in reliance on, or other
use of the information in this communication by persons other than the
addressees is prohibited. =20

If you received this email in error, please immediately notify us and
please delete or destroy all copies of this message.

This message may have been altered without your or our knowledge and the
sender does not accept any liability for any errors.  Thank you.



_______________________________________________
KEYPROV mailing list
KEYPROV@ietf.org
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov


_______________________________________________
KEYPROV mailing list
KEYPROV@ietf.org
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov



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Subject: FW: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
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Message bounced (see below); trying again...

-----Original Message-----
From: Doherty, Andrea=20
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 1:40 PM
To: 'Salah Machani'; Pei, Mingliang; keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?

Salah is correct that we should remove use case 3.8 from the DSKPP doc.
As was agreed at the meeting in Chicago, if someone wants to pick up the
use case and define how DSKPP can be extended/implemented to support it,
then they can create a separate document.
Andrea

-----Original Message-----
From: Salah Machani [mailto:SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM]=20
Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 6:00 AM
To: Pei, Mingliang; keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?

Ming,


If there was a consensus to drop SMS support then we should remove the
use case in 3.8.  Otherwise, we need to have considerations in
specification for dskpp run over SMS.  Note that the SMS push with
ServerFinished data does not necessary need to be triggered by a
ClientHello from a desktop computer.  This could be sent to the phone as
a result of the user registering with the provisioning service through
the web or other channels. It will be a true 'one pass' as specified in
the draft.

Regards,

Salah

-----Original Message-----
From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]=20
Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 2:35 PM
To: Salah Machani; keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?


Salah,

Thanks. Use case 3.8 was from earlier OATH DSKPP draft. In this case, a
user triggers a requesst from a wired client (e.g. desktop) to do
authentication, and asks a response to be sent via SMS. We had the
"SharedSecretDeliveryMethod" in a request to indicate whether a response
should be sent back in SMS or HTTP for this purpose. Considering the
complexity that additional information may need to be submitted in a
request with SMS preference, we decided to remove this negotiation. So I
thought that SMS support was going to be out of scope for the complexity
for now.

To clarify and complete the "one-pass" case in the spec associated with
SMS, shall we specify the additional information in ClientHello for the
wired side? I incline to think that the typical flow in this case is a
combo of two-pass HTTP and one-pass SMS response.

- Ming

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Salah Machani [mailto:SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM]=20
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 6:15 AM
> To: Pei, Mingliang; keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
>=20
> Ming,=20
>=20
> The use case for 'one pass' is described in section 3.8 - SMS=20
> based transport use case.  I agree with the assessment that=20
> 'one pass' is redundant when using HTTP transport.  We should=20
> clarify in the spec that the 'one pass' variant is applicable=20
> when SMS is used as transport and revisit the definition of=20
> 'ServerFinished' message in 'one pass' to ensure that the=20
> formatting and size is suitable for SMS transport. =20
>=20
> Regards,
>=20
>=20
> Salah
>   =20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]
> Sent: Monday, November 19, 2007 4:55 AM
> To: keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: [KEYPROV] Do we need "One-pass" support in DSKPP?
>=20
>=20
> In one of email thread discussions with Hannes's comments, we=20
> exchanged
> discussion about whether we should keep One Pass in this spec. I also
> post this here for broad discussion and feedbacks.
>=20
> There are a few concerns puzzling me about "One-pass" case.
>=20
> 1. Which use case listed in the spec does it try to address?
>=20
> 2. It looks to me that it increased complexity for interop and
> documentation.
>=20
> When we mention about binding with HTTP, for example, one pass is much
> useful with HTTP. Two-pass could be used. As a client server=20
> protocol, a
> Client always sends something to request; why not always send=20
> the hello
> message.
>=20
> Thomas's email today again asks for clarification what a client should
> send with HTTP. I would feel that two-pass can be simply used instead.
>=20
> 3. If we don't use HTTP with One Pass, then what is it?
>   =20
> A different transport would obviously be necessary to make the "one
> pass" really a "one pass".
>=20
> I would prefer to simplify the spec by not supporting=20
> one-pass case. Or
> we need to specify something for recommendation, and current=20
> spec lacks
> it. Or I may haved missed some sections about its powerness.
>=20
> Comments? Thanks,
>=20
> - Ming
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> Notice to Recipient:  The information in this message is=20
> meant only for the intended recipient of the transmission and=20
> may contain confidential or privileged information.=20
>=20
> Any copying, retransmittal, taking of action in reliance on,=20
> or other use of the information in this communication by=20
> persons other than the addressees is prohibited. =20
>=20
> If you received this email in error, please immediately=20
> notify us and please delete or destroy all copies of this message.
>=20
> This message may have been altered without your or our=20
> knowledge and the sender does not accept any liability for=20
> any errors.  Thank you.
>=20
>=20
>=20


Notice to Recipient:  The information in this message is meant only for
the intended recipient of the transmission and may contain confidential
or privileged information.=20

Any copying, retransmittal, taking of action in reliance on, or other
use of the information in this communication by persons other than the
addressees is prohibited. =20

If you received this email in error, please immediately notify us and
please delete or destroy all copies of this message.

This message may have been altered without your or our knowledge and the
sender does not accept any liability for any errors.  Thank you.



_______________________________________________
KEYPROV mailing list
KEYPROV@ietf.org
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov


_______________________________________________
KEYPROV mailing list
KEYPROV@ietf.org
https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov



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Thread-Topic: PSKC wrapped key question
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From: "James Holland" <james.holland@actividentity.com>
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------_=_NextPart_001_01C82BA1.E7C316C5
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Hi Ming,

=20

                I am a colleague of Philip Hoyer and I have a question =
about the mandatory digest of key material within the PSKC document. The =
latest draft state: -

=20

5.1.1.  Data (OPTIONAL)

=20

   Defines the data attributes of the symmetric key.  Each is a name

   value pair which has both a base64 encoded value and a base 64

   encoded ValueDigest.  The value can be encrypted.  If the container

   has been encrypted the ValueDigest MUST be populated with the digest

   of the unencrypted value.

=20

=20

In our scenario we receive a request from a 3rd party to generate a 3DES =
key in a HSM. In the request they pass a transport certificate that has =
their public RSA key. With this public RSA key we wrap the generated key =
for export to the requesting 3rd party. However, as we never have the =
generated key in =93plain=94 outside the HSM we cannot generate a digest =
of the key material it to be put into the PSKC document. The wrapped key =
is returned from the HSM in the  PSKC#8 format which we return in the =
document.

=20

So, in this scenario,  a man in the middle attack my intercept the =
request and return their own wrapped key within the document, as they =
too have the transport key. What would you recommend as a possible =
solution to this, if any?=20

=20

Also, in the scenario when there has been a key exchange ceremony =
between the two parties, would this be a valid case for no mandatory =
digest of the key material, with the wrapped key returned?

=20

=20

=20

Regards,

=20

James Holland



Product Architect - ActivIdentity

Mob: +44 787 6197 626

London Office Tel: +44 207 744 6460
Skype on HYPERLINK "callto://hoggmania/"callto://hoggmania/

=20

P Think before you print

=20

The information contained in this email message may be privileged, =
confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended =
recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly =
prohibited. If you think that you have received this email message in =
error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete the message =
and any attachments.

=20


No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.=20
Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.1/1140 - Release Date: =
19/11/2007 19:05
=20

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<p class=3DMsoNormal>Hi Ming,<o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I
am a colleague of Philip Hoyer and I have a question about the mandatory =
digest
of key material within the PSKC document. The latest draft state: =
-<o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><i>5.1.1.&nbsp; Data (OPTIONAL)<o:p></o:p></i></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><i><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></i></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><i>&nbsp;&nbsp; Defines the data attributes of the =
symmetric
key.&nbsp; Each is a name<o:p></o:p></i></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><i>&nbsp;&nbsp; value pair which has both a base64 =
encoded
value and a base 64<o:p></o:p></i></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><i>&nbsp;&nbsp; encoded ValueDigest.&nbsp; The =
value can be
encrypted.&nbsp; If the container<o:p></o:p></i></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><i>&nbsp;&nbsp; has been encrypted the ValueDigest =
MUST be
populated with the digest<o:p></o:p></i></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><i>&nbsp;&nbsp; of the unencrypted =
value.<o:p></o:p></i></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal>In our scenario we receive a request from a =
3<sup>rd</sup>
party to generate a 3DES key in a HSM. In the request they pass a =
transport
certificate that has their public RSA key. With this public RSA key we =
wrap the
generated key for export to the requesting 3<sup>rd</sup> party. =
However, as we
never have the generated key in &#8220;plain&#8221; outside the HSM we =
cannot
generate a digest of the key material it to be put into the PSKC =
document. The
wrapped key is returned from the HSM in the &nbsp;PSKC#8 format which we =
return
in the document.<o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal>So, in this scenario, &nbsp;a man in the middle =
attack my
intercept the request and return their own wrapped key within the =
document, as
they too have the transport key. What would you recommend as a possible
solution to this, if any? <o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal>Also, in the scenario when there has been a key =
exchange ceremony
between the two parties, would this be a valid case for no mandatory =
digest of
the key material, with the wrapped key returned?<o:p></o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Regards,<o:p>=
</o:p></span></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p>&nbsp;</=
o:p></span></b></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>James
Holland</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>
<br>
<b><o:p></o:p></b></span></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>Product
Architect - <span style=3D'color:#53AC4E'>Activ</span><span =
style=3D'color:#1C5394'>Identity</span></span></b><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>
</span><span =
style=3D'font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><br>
Mob: +44 787 6197 626<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:8.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>London
Office Tel: +44 207 744 6460<br>
Skype on <a href=3D"callto://hoggmania/"><span =
style=3D'color:blue'>callto://hoggmania/</span></a><o:p></o:p></span></p>=


<p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:6.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o=
:p></span></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:6.0pt;font-family:Webdings;
color:green'>P</span><b><span lang=3DEN-US =
style=3D'font-size:6.0pt;font-family:
"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> </span></b><b><span lang=3DEN-US
style=3D'font-size:6.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:green'>T=
hink
before you print</span></b><span =
style=3D'font-size:6.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:6.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o=
:p></span></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'font-size:6.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"'>The
information contained in this email message may be privileged, =
confidential and
protected from disclosure. If you are not the intended recipient, any
dissemination, distribution or copying is strictly prohibited. If you =
think
that you have received this email message in error, please notify the =
sender by
reply email and delete the message and any =
attachments.<o:p></o:p></span></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>

</div>

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<P><FONT SIZE=3D2>No virus found in this outgoing message.<BR>
Checked by AVG Free Edition.<BR>
Version: 7.5.503 / Virus Database: 269.16.1/1140 - Release Date: =
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Provisioning of Symmetric Keys Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Portable Symmetric Key Container
	Author(s)	: P. Hoyer, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-keyprov-portable-symmetric-key-container-02.txt
	Pages		: 47
	Date		: 2007-11-20
	
This document specifies a symmetric key format for transport and
   provisioning of symmetric keys (One Time Password (OTP) shared
   secrets or symmetric cryptographic keys) to different types of strong
   authentication devices.  The standard token format enables
   enterprises to deploy best-of-breed solutions combining components
   from different vendors into the same infrastructure.

   This work is a joint effort by the members of OATH (Initiative for
   Open AuTHentication) to specify a format that can be freely
   distributed to the technical community.  The authors believe that a
   common and shared specification will facilitate adoption of two-
   factor authentication on the Internet by enabling interoperability
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
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This draft is a work item of the Provisioning of Symmetric Keys Working
Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Portable Symmetric Key Container
	Author(s)	: P. Hoyer, et al.
	Filename	:
draft-ietf-keyprov-portable-symmetric-key-container-02.txt
	Pages		: 47
	Date		: 2007-11-20
=09
This document specifies a symmetric key format for transport and
   provisioning of symmetric keys (One Time Password (OTP) shared
   secrets or symmetric cryptographic keys) to different types of strong
   authentication devices.  The standard token format enables
   enterprises to deploy best-of-breed solutions combining components
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   This work is a joint effort by the members of OATH (Initiative for
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   distributed to the technical community.  The authors believe that a
   common and shared specification will facilitate adoption of two-
   factor authentication on the Internet by enabling interoperability
   between commercial and open-source implementations.

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Here is the agenda for the meeting:
http://www3.ietf.org/proceedings/07dec/agenda/keyprov.txt


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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to aclientviaPSKC?
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From: "Philip Hoyer" <philip.hoyer@actividentity.com>
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Andrea and Ming,
As we discussed in the PSKC call I would like to explain a new proposal.

I would like to keep the way to transmit the PIN value as a key.

We though want the flexibility to define possibly multiple PINs and
which keys are protected by the PIN.

Hence I would like to introduce an element called PINPolicy

<PINPolicy PINRef=3D"KeyId of the key containing the PIN">
	<PINUsageMode>
		Local
	</PINUsageMode>
</PINPolicy>

This will replace the accessrule element.


So to take the example of a PIN protected HOTP token with no encryption
based on the latest draft with highlights:

   <?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?>
   <KeyContainer
     xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0"
     xmlns:ds=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#"
     xmlns:xsi=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"
     xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0
       keyprov-pskc-1.0.xsd" Version=3D"1.0">
       <Device>
         <DeviceId>
           <Manufacturer>Token Manufacturer</Manufacturer>
           <SerialNo>98765432188</SerialNo>
           <Expiry>12/31/2012</Expiry>
         </DeviceId>
         <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#hotp"
           KeyId=3D"77654321871">
         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
           <Usage OTP=3D"true">
             <ResponseFormat Format=3D"DECIMAL" Length=3D"6"/>
           </Usage>
           <FriendlyName>MyFirstToken</FriendlyName>
           <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
             <Value>
               zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D
             </Value>
           </Data>
           <Data Name=3D"COUNTER">
             <Value>AAAAAAAAAAA=3D</Value>
           </Data>
           <Expiry>10/30/2012</Expiry>
	     <PINPolicy PINRef=3D"77654321872">
            	<PINUsageMode>Local</PINUsageMode>
           </PINPolicy>	=09
         </Key>
         <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#PIN"
           KeyId=3D"77654321872">
         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
           <Usage>
             <ResponseFormat Format=3D"DECIMAL" Length=3D"4"/>
           </Usage>
           <FriendlyName>RandomInitialTokenPIN</FriendlyName>
           <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
             <Value>
               zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D
             </Value>
           </Data>
         </Key>
       </Device>
   </KeyContainer>


In this way we can specifically say what keys are protected by which
PINs and re-use most of our constructs in Key that would apply to the
PIN such as the format the way to encrypt etc etc.

Thoughts?

Philip


-----Original Message-----
From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]=20
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 1:48 AM
To: Doherty, Andrea; Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker;
keyprov@ietf.org
Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to
aclientviaPSKC?


I have chatted with Philip / Salah about my comments this afternoon
while I was almost done my reply of this email. I sent it anyway now for
broad review. Our meeting minutes from Philip later will contain other
proposed changes in our discussion.

1. A PIN is associated with a key; we need to define a better way to
associate with them when we carry PIN in a separate Key type.

- The current proposal assumes that all keys in the same "Device" type
will associate to the PIN credential in the same Device.
- This has a limitation for "PREPEND" case where a device may have
multiple keys, and each key has its own PIN as part of server
authentication.

2. There is use case when a PIN is per device, instead of per key, for
the "Local" access usage.=20

So I prefer defining PIN credential inside DeviceType, and refered by
KeyType by an attribute or element, and DeviceType.

3. PIN policy is fine to have its own type. The AccessRule and
PINUsageModeType should combine to be a PIN usage policy. If we are
treating PIN as a separate credential, it is more consistent to make PIN
usage policy part of Usage, I think.

Thanks,

- Ming
=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]=20
> Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 12:31 PM
> To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20
> to aclientviaPSKC?
>=20
> Philip,
>=20
> Thank you for your proposal.  Here are a few comments:
>=20
> 1. By <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/> do you mean "PIN is=20
> enabled"?  Is the reverse true, that <AccessRules=20
> userPIN=3D"false"/> indicates PINless operation from a server's=20
> point of view?=20
>=20
> 2. Instead of <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>, providing=20
> a PINUsageModeType would be more extensible and implementable:
> <xs:complexType name=3D"PINUsageModeType">
> 	<xs:choice maxOccurs=3D"unbounded">
> 		<xs:element name=3D"Local"/>
> 		<xs:element name=3D"Prepend"/>
> 		<xs:element name=3D"Embed"/>
> 	</xs:choice>
> </xs:complexType>
>=20
> 3. Anders brought to my attention that a local PIN is needed=20
> instead of a server PIN in some scenarios.  The device=20
> issuer, in this case, would also have a PIN policy that could=20
> differ from the policy of a server PIN.  Anders provided the=20
> following example, which is taken from another=20
> standardization effort in the workings ("PKI for Web 2.0"):
>=20
> // The following is sent down to the client by the issuer:
>=20
> <KeyGenerationRequest ...>
>=20
> // Request a key without PIN protection.
>=20
>   <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.1" KeyUsage=3D"encryption">
>     <KeyAlgorithmData>
>       <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
>     </KeyAlgorithmData>
>   </RequestedKey>
>=20
> // Request a set of keys with PIN protection.
> // The specified policy disallows 11122 but accepts 11223 //=20
> 654321 would not be accepted either (sequence)
>=20
>   <PINProtection Type=3D"numeric" MinLength=3D"5" MaxLength=3D"8"
>                  PatternRestrictions=3D"three-in-a-row  sequences">
>=20
> // The next element is optional and is a way of grouping PINs=20
> // so that the user either only has to specify a single PIN=20
> // for a set of keys, or one unique PIN per key.
>=20
>     <PINGroupProtection Shared=3D"true">
>=20
>       <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.2" KeyUsage=3D"signature">
>         <KeyAlgorithmData>
>           <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
>         </KeyAlgorithmData>
>       </RequestedKey>
>       <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.3" KeyUsage=3D"authentication">
>         <KeyAlgorithmData>
>           <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>
>         </KeyAlgorithmData>
>       </RequestedKey>
>=20
>     </PINGroupProtection>
>=20
>   </PINProtection>
>=20
> </KeyGenerationRequest>
>=20
> Your thoughts?
> Andrea=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:16 AM
> To: Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
> Cc: M'Raihi, David; Bajaj,Siddharth; Johan Rydell
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20
> to aclientviaPSKC?
>=20
> Andrea,
> You are right I have not addressed the Pin policy issue.
>=20
> I would like to though.=20
>=20
> Since you seem to have a good idea of the requirements would=20
> you be able to help?
>=20
> I suggest we create a new type called PINPolicy that contains=20
> the data required to be submitted.
>=20
> So currently PIN usage I can think of is:
> -KEY_ACCESS_CHECK (this check the pin on the device to allow=20
> access to a key for algorithms) -USED_IN_ALGO (used during=20
> calculation)
>=20
> When you talk though about length I already have that in the=20
> <Usage> part of the PIN 'key' see below
>=20
> NEW->
>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">
>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
>          <Usage>
>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>
>          </Usage>
>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>
>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
>          </Data>
>        </Key>
> <-NEW
>=20
> Also when we talk about server verified pins in otps are we=20
> not really talking about the otp algo or usage here?
>=20
> I was wondering hence if our usage element for the otp key=20
> should be augmented to contain and optional
>=20
> <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>
>=20
> What do you think?
>=20
> Philip
>=20
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]
> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:28 AM
> To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20
> to a clientviaPSKC?
>=20
> Philip,
> This looks ok except that a more complex PIN policy is needed=20
> (refer to this comment I made to the previous version of the=20
> PSKC draft, Section
> 5.1.7:
> "Recommend that you allow for a more complex PIN policy,=20
> esp., (a) how the PIN is to be used in the OTP calculation=20
> (e.g., concatenated vs.
> XOR's with the token code) and (b) PIN length. "
>=20
> This doesn't seem to have been addressed yet based on=20
> feedback to my review (see attached) and example below.  What=20
> is the status of this? =20
> Andrea
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]
> Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 11:48 AM
> To: KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20
> to a clientviaPSKC?
>=20
> Gentlemen,
> Since PSKC will be used also to bulk provision from=20
> manufacturing to a validation server and some of these=20
> devices do have a PIN pad there is the concept of an initial PIN.
>=20
> Since we have not yet defined how this initial PIN is=20
> transmitted in the PSKC spec I would like to put forward a=20
> proposal for inclusion in the spec for specifying the=20
> transmission of PINs.
>=20
> The PIN is effectively another shared secret hence I propose=20
> to treat it as a key in itself.
>=20
> This has the advantage that we can leverage the Usage part of=20
> the schema that can define things like length and format=20
> (alphanumeric etc). we also can set an expiry etc. It also=20
> leverages the fact that the PIN itself will be encrypted in=20
> transport in the same manner as other key material.
>=20
> I hence propose to extend the KeyAlgorithmType with a new=20
> type called 'userPIN' (inline with the name used in the=20
> access rules element already
> present)
>=20
>=20
> As an example a KeyContainer with a non encrypted HOTP key=20
> and a 4 digit numeric PIN (please note that the value and=20
> valuedigest are just copy and paste) ( I put the new section=20
> with NEW-> and <-NEW lines before and
> after):
>=20
>    <?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?>
>    <KeyContainer
>    xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"
>    xmlns:logo=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo"
>    xmlns:ds=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#"
>    xmlns:xsi=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"
>    xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"
> .\keyprov_pskc_schema_v1.1.xsd" version=3D"1.1">
>      <EncryptionMethod algorithm=3D"NONE"/>
>      <DigestMethod algorithm=3D"HMAC-SHA1"></DigestMethod>
>      <Device>
>        <DeviceId>
>          <Manufacturer>Token Manufacturer</Manufacturer>
>          <SerialNo>98765432187</SerialNo>
>          <Expiry>01/01/2008</Expiry>
>        </DeviceId>
>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"HOTP"  KeyId=3D"98765432187">
>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
>          <Usage>
>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"6"/>
>          </Usage>
> NEW->
>          <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/>
> <-NEW
>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstToken</FriendlyName>
>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
>          </Data>
>          <Data Name=3D"COUNTER">
>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
>          </Data>
>        </Key>
> NEW->
>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">
>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>
>          <Usage>
>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>
>          </Usage>
>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>
>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">
>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>
>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>
>          </Data>
>        </Key>
> <-NEW
>      </Device>
>    </KeyContainer>
>=20
> Comments are welcome,
>=20
> Philip
>=20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mingliang Pei [mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net]
> Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 9:58 AM
> To: keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a=20
> client viaPSKC?
>=20
>=20
> New submission from Mingliang Pei <mpei@verisign.com>:
>=20
> PSKC provies support about carrying PIN usage policy. When=20
> PIN is used,
> how do=20
> you actually transfer the initial PIN using PSKC? Should PIN=20
> be treated
> as=20
> another credential, for example?
>=20
> ----------
> assignedto: mpei
> messages: 71
> nosy: keyprov, mpei
> priority: critical
> status: chatting
> title: How to transfer initial PIN to a client via PSKC?
>=20
> _________________________________________________________
> KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>
> <http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue28>
> _________________________________________________________
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20


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<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">Andrea and Ming,</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">As =
we discussed in the PSKC call I would like to explain a new =
proposal.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">I =
would like to keep the way to transmit the PIN value as a =
key.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">We =
though want the flexibility to define possibly multiple PINs and which =
keys are protected by the PIN.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">Hence I would like to introduce an element called =
PINPolicy</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&lt;PINPolicy PINRef=3D&quot;KeyId of the key containing the =
PIN&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"> <FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&lt;PINUsageMode&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">Local</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">&lt;/PINUsageMode&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&lt;/PINPolicy&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">This will replace the accessrule element.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">So =
to take the example of a PIN protected HOTP token with no encryption =
based on the latest draft</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT =
SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New"> with highlights</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">:</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;?xml version=3D&quot;1.0&quot; =
encoding=3D&quot;UTF-8&quot;?&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;KeyContainer</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
xmlns=3D&quot;urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0&quot;</FONT></=
SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; xmlns:ds=3D&quot;<A =
HREF=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig">http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmld=
sig</A>#&quot;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; xmlns:xsi=3D&quot;<A =
HREF=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance">http://www.w3.org/2001=
/XMLSchema-instance</A>&quot;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
xsi:schemaLocation=3D&quot;urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0</=
FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"fr"> <FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">keyprov-pskc-1.0.xsd&quot; =
Version=3D&quot;1.0&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"fr"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"fr"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;DeviceId&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"fr"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT><=
/SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"> <FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&lt;Manufacturer&gt;Token =
Manufacturer&lt;/Manufacturer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;SerialNo&gt;98765432188&lt;/SerialNo&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Expiry&gt;12/31/2012&lt;/Expiry&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/DeviceId&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D&quot;<A =
HREF=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#hotp">http://www.ietf.org/keypro=
v/pskc#hotp</A>&quot;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
KeyId=3D&quot;77654321871&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Usage OTP=3D&quot;true&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp; &lt;ResponseFormat Format=3D&quot;DECIMAL&quot; =
Length=3D&quot;6&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;MyFirstToken&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data Name=3D&quot;SECRET&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp; &lt;Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp; &lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data Name=3D&quot;COUNTER&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp; &lt;Value&gt;AAAAAAAAAAA=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Expiry&gt;10/30/2012&lt;/Expiry&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"> <FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">&lt;PINPolicy =
PINRef=3D&quot;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">77654321872</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT =
SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</=
FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&lt;PINUsageMode&gt;Local&lt;/PINUsageMode&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT><=
/SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"> <FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&lt;/PINPolicy&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"> =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"> <FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">&lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D&quot;<A =
HREF=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc">http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/psk=
c</A>#</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">PIN</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">&quot;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
KeyId=3D&quot;7765432187</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT =
SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">2</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT =
SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp; &lt;ResponseFormat Format=3D&quot;DECIMAL&quot; =
Length=3D&quot;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">4</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">Ra</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">n</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">domInitial</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT =
SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">Token</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">PIN</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data Name=3D&quot;SECRET&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp; &lt;Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp; &lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;/KeyContainer&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>
<BR>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">In =
this way we can specifically say what keys are protected by which PINs =
and re-use most of our</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"> <FONT SIZE=3D2 =
FACE=3D"Courier New">constructs in Key that would apply to the PIN such =
as the format the way to encrypt etc etc.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">Thoughts?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">Philip</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-us"><FONT =
SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">-----Original Message-----<BR>
From: Pei, Mingliang [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:mpei@verisign.com">mailto:mpei@verisign.com</A>]<BR>
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 1:48 AM<BR>
To: Doherty, Andrea; Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; =
keyprov@ietf.org<BR>
Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell<BR>
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to =
aclientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">I =
have chatted with Philip / Salah about my comments this =
afternoon</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">while I was almost done my reply of this email. I sent it anyway =
now for</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">broad review. Our meeting minutes from Philip later will contain =
other</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">proposed changes in our discussion.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">1. =
A PIN is associated with a key; we need to define a better way =
to</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">associate with them when we carry PIN in a separate Key =
type.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">- =
The current proposal assumes that all keys in the same =
&quot;Device&quot; type</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">will associate to the PIN credential in the same =
Device.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">- =
This has a limitation for &quot;PREPEND&quot; case where a device may =
have</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">multiple keys, and each key has its own PIN as part of =
server</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">authentication.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">2. =
There is use case when a PIN is per device, instead of per key, =
for</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">the &quot;Local&quot; access usage. </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">So =
I prefer defining PIN credential inside DeviceType, and refered =
by</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">KeyType by an attribute or element, and =
DeviceType.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">3. =
PIN policy is fine to have its own type. The AccessRule =
and</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">PINUsageModeType should combine to be a PIN usage policy. If we =
are</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">treating PIN as a separate credential, it is more consistent to =
make PIN</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">usage policy part of Usage, I think.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">Thanks,</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier New">- =
Ming</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; From: Doherty, Andrea [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:adoherty@rsa.com">mailto:adoherty@rsa.com</A>] =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 12:31 PM</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; =
keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan =
Rydell</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; to aclientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Philip,</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Thank you for your proposal.&nbsp; Here are a few =
comments:</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; 1. By &lt;AccessRules userPIN=3D&quot;true&quot;/&gt; do you =
mean &quot;PIN is </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; enabled&quot;?&nbsp; Is the reverse true, that &lt;AccessRules =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; userPIN=3D&quot;false&quot;/&gt; indicates PINless operation =
from a server's </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; point of view? </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; 2. Instead of &lt;UserPIN =
position=3D&quot;APPEND/PREPEND&quot;/&gt;, providing </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; a PINUsageModeType would be more extensible and =
implementable:</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;xs:complexType =
name=3D&quot;PINUsageModeType&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;xs:choice =
maxOccurs=3D&quot;unbounded&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;xs:element =
name=3D&quot;Local&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;xs:element =
name=3D&quot;Prepend&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;xs:element =
name=3D&quot;Embed&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/xs:choice&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;/xs:complexType&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; 3. Anders brought to my attention that a local PIN is needed =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; instead of a server PIN in some scenarios.&nbsp; The device =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; issuer, in this case, would also have a PIN policy that could =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; differ from the policy of a server PIN.&nbsp; Anders provided =
the </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; following example, which is taken from another =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; standardization effort in the workings (&quot;PKI for Web =
2.0&quot;):</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; // The following is sent down to the client by the =
issuer:</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;KeyGenerationRequest ...&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; // Request a key without PIN protection.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;RequestedKey ID=3D&quot;Key.1&quot; =
KeyUsage=3D&quot;encryption&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;RSA =
KeySize=3D&quot;2048&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;/RequestedKey&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; // Request a set of keys with PIN =
protection.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; // The specified policy disallows 11122 but accepts 11223 // =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; 654321 would not be accepted either =
(sequence)</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;PINProtection Type=3D&quot;numeric&quot; =
MinLength=3D&quot;5&quot; MaxLength=3D&quot;8&quot;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
PatternRestrictions=3D&quot;three-in-a-row&nbsp; =
sequences&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; // The next element is optional and is a way of grouping PINs =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; // so that the user either only has to specify a single PIN =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; // for a set of keys, or one unique PIN per =
key.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;PINGroupProtection =
Shared=3D&quot;true&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;RequestedKey =
ID=3D&quot;Key.2&quot; =
KeyUsage=3D&quot;signature&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;RSA KeySize=3D&quot;2048&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/RequestedKey&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;RequestedKey =
ID=3D&quot;Key.3&quot; =
KeyUsage=3D&quot;authentication&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;RSA KeySize=3D&quot;2048&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/RequestedKey&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/PINGroupProtection&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;/PINProtection&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;/KeyGenerationRequest&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Your thoughts?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Andrea </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; From: Philip Hoyer [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com">mailto:philip.hoyer@activi=
dentity.com</A>]</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:16 AM</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; To: Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; =
keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Cc: M'Raihi, David; Bajaj,Siddharth; Johan =
Rydell</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; to aclientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Andrea,</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; You are right I have not addressed the Pin policy =
issue.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; I would like to though. </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Since you seem to have a good idea of the requirements would =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; you be able to help?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; I suggest we create a new type called PINPolicy that contains =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; the data required to be submitted.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; So currently PIN usage I can think of is:</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; -KEY_ACCESS_CHECK (this check the pin on the device to allow =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; access to a key for algorithms) -USED_IN_ALGO (used during =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; calculation)</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; When you talk though about length I already have that in the =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;Usage&gt; part of the PIN 'key' see =
below</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; NEW-&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D&quot;userPIN&quot;&nbsp; =
KeyId=3D&quot;12345678&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;ResponseFormat format=3D&quot;DECIMAL&quot; =
length=3D&quot;4&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;MyFirstTokenInitialPIN&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></S=
PAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Data =
Name=3D&quot;SECRET&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p; =
&lt;Value&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></=
P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p; =
&lt;ValueDigest&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D&lt;/ValueDigest&gt;</FONT><=
/SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;-NEW</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Also when we talk about server verified pins in otps are we =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; not really talking about the otp algo or usage =
here?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; I was wondering hence if our usage element for the otp key =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; should be augmented to contain and optional</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;UserPIN =
position=3D&quot;APPEND/PREPEND&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; What do you think?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Philip</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; From: Doherty, Andrea [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:adoherty@rsa.com">mailto:adoherty@rsa.com</A>]</FONT></SPA=
N></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:28 AM</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; =
keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; =
M'Raihi,David</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; to a clientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Philip,</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; This looks ok except that a more complex PIN policy is needed =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; (refer to this comment I made to the previous version of the =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; PSKC draft, Section</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; 5.1.7:</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &quot;Recommend that you allow for a more complex PIN policy, =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; esp., (a) how the PIN is to be used in the OTP calculation =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; (e.g., concatenated vs.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; XOR's with the token code) and (b) PIN length. =
&quot;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; This doesn't seem to have been addressed yet based on =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; feedback to my review (see attached) and example below.&nbsp; =
What </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; is the status of this?&nbsp; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Andrea</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; From: Philip Hoyer [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com">mailto:philip.hoyer@activi=
dentity.com</A>]</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 11:48 AM</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; To: KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; =
keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; =
M'Raihi,David</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; to a clientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Gentlemen,</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Since PSKC will be used also to bulk provision from =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; manufacturing to a validation server and some of these =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; devices do have a PIN pad there is the concept of an initial =
PIN.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Since we have not yet defined how this initial PIN is =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; transmitted in the PSKC spec I would like to put forward a =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; proposal for inclusion in the spec for specifying the =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; transmission of PINs.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; The PIN is effectively another shared secret hence I propose =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; to treat it as a key in itself.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; This has the advantage that we can leverage the Usage part of =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; the schema that can define things like length and format =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; (alphanumeric etc). we also can set an expiry etc. It also =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; leverages the fact that the PIN itself will be encrypted in =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; transport in the same manner as other key =
material.</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; I hence propose to extend the KeyAlgorithmType with a new =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; type called 'userPIN' (inline with the name used in the =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; access rules element already</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; present)</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; As an example a KeyContainer with a non encrypted HOTP key =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; and a 4 digit numeric PIN (please note that the value and =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; valuedigest are just copy and paste) ( I put the new section =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; with NEW-&gt; and &lt;-NEW lines before and</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; after):</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;?xml version=3D&quot;1.0&quot; =
encoding=3D&quot;UTF-8&quot;?&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;KeyContainer</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
xmlns=3D&quot;urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container&quot;</FONT></SPAN=
></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
xmlns:logo=3D&quot;urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo&quot;</FONT></SPAN=
></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; xmlns:ds=3D&quot;<A =
HREF=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig">http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmld=
sig</A>#&quot;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; xmlns:xsi=3D&quot;<A =
HREF=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance">http://www.w3.org/2001=
/XMLSchema-instance</A>&quot;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
xsi:schemaLocation=3D&quot;urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container&quot;=
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; .\keyprov_pskc_schema_v1.1.xsd&quot; =
version=3D&quot;1.1&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;EncryptionMethod =
algorithm=3D&quot;NONE&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;DigestMethod =
algorithm=3D&quot;HMAC-SHA1&quot;&gt;&lt;/DigestMethod&gt;</FONT></SPAN><=
/P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;DeviceId&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Manufacturer&gt;Token =
Manufacturer&lt;/Manufacturer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;SerialNo&gt;98765432187&lt;/SerialNo&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Expiry&gt;01/01/2008&lt;/Expiry&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/DeviceId&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D&quot;HOTP&quot;&nbsp; =
KeyId=3D&quot;98765432187&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;ResponseFormat format=3D&quot;DECIMAL&quot; =
length=3D&quot;6&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; NEW-&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;AccessRules userPIN=3D&quot;true&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;-NEW</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;MyFirstToken&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Data =
Name=3D&quot;SECRET&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p; =
&lt;Value&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></=
P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p; =
&lt;ValueDigest&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D&lt;/ValueDigest&gt;</FONT><=
/SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Data =
Name=3D&quot;COUNTER&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p; =
&lt;Value&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></=
P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p; =
&lt;ValueDigest&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D&lt;/ValueDigest&gt;</FONT><=
/SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; NEW-&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D&quot;userPIN&quot;&nbsp; =
KeyId=3D&quot;12345678&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;ResponseFormat format=3D&quot;DECIMAL&quot; =
length=3D&quot;4&quot;/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;MyFirstTokenInitialPIN&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></S=
PAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Data =
Name=3D&quot;SECRET&quot;&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p; =
&lt;Value&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></=
P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p; =
&lt;ValueDigest&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D&lt;/ValueDigest&gt;</FONT><=
/SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;-NEW</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;/KeyContainer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Comments are welcome,</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Philip</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; -----Original Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; From: Mingliang Pei [<A =
HREF=3D"mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net">mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.ne=
t</A>]</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 9:58 AM</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; To: keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; client viaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; New submission from Mingliang Pei =
&lt;mpei@verisign.com&gt;:</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; PSKC provies support about carrying PIN usage policy. When =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; PIN is used,</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; how do </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; you actually transfer the initial PIN using PSKC? Should PIN =
</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; be treated</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; as </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; another credential, for example?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; ----------</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; assignedto: mpei</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; messages: 71</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; nosy: keyprov, mpei</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; priority: critical</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; status: chatting</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; title: How to transfer initial PIN to a client via =
PSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; =
_________________________________________________________</FONT></SPAN></=
P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker =
&lt;hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; &lt;<A =
HREF=3D"http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue28">http://www.tschof=
enig.com:8080/keyprov/issue28</A>&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; =
_________________________________________________________</FONT></SPAN></=
P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; =
_______________________________________________</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV mailing list</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; <A =
HREF=3D"https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov">https://www1.ietf=
.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov</A></FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; =
_______________________________________________</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV mailing list</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; <A =
HREF=3D"https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov">https://www1.ietf=
.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov</A></FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; =
_______________________________________________</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV mailing list</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; <A =
HREF=3D"https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov">https://www1.ietf=
.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov</A></FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; =
_______________________________________________</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV mailing list</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; KEYPROV@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; <A =
HREF=3D"https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov">https://www1.ietf=
.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov</A></FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"><FONT SIZE=3D2 FACE=3D"Courier =
New">&gt; </FONT></SPAN></P>

<P DIR=3DLTR><SPAN LANG=3D"en-gb"></SPAN></P>

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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Sat Nov 24 09:22:46 2007
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Provisioning of Symmetric Keys Working Group of the IETF.

	Title		: Portable Symmetric Key Container
	Author(s)	: P. Hoyer, et al.
	Filename	: draft-ietf-keyprov-portable-symmetric-key-container-02.txt
	Pages		: 47
	Date		: 2007-11-20
	
This document specifies a symmetric key format for transport and
   provisioning of symmetric keys (One Time Password (OTP) shared
   secrets or symmetric cryptographic keys) to different types of strong
   authentication devices.  The standard token format enables
   enterprises to deploy best-of-breed solutions combining components
   from different vendors into the same infrastructure.

   This work is a joint effort by the members of OATH (Initiative for
   Open AuTHentication) to specify a format that can be freely
   distributed to the technical community.  The authors believe that a
   common and shared specification will facilitate adoption of two-
   factor authentication on the Internet by enabling interoperability
   between commercial and open-source implementations.

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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to aclientviaPSKC?
Date: Sun, 25 Nov 2007 10:37:44 -0500
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Thread-Topic: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to
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From: "Salah Machani" <SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM>
To: "Philip Hoyer" <philip.hoyer@actividentity.com>,
	"Pei, Mingliang" <mpei@verisign.com>, "Doherty, Andrea" <adoherty@rsa.com>,
	"KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker" <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>,
	<keyprov@ietf.org>
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Cc: "Bajaj, Siddharth" <SBajaj@verisign.com>, "M'Raihi,
	David" <dmraihi@verisign.com>, Johan Rydell <Johan.Rydell@portwise.com>
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Philip,

=20

=20

Thanks for sending this. Just a couple of comments:

=20

=20

1.=09The purpose of the PINpolicy that is currently defined thought
the <accessRules> element is to indicate to the device client whether
the user must enter a PIN (local PIN)  in order to use the token secret
or not. I am for replacing the AccessRules definition with a new
PINPolicy taking into account other use cases but we need to make sure
that the original use case is still supported:  I am assuming in your
proposed definition the <PINPolicy> is optional and the PINRef is also
optional?  When the <PINPolicy> is omitted, it would imply that the user
PIN is not required and when included but the PINRef is omitted, it
would imply that a user PIN is required but there is no initial PIN. Is
this correct?=20

=20

2.=09In addition to the flexibility you indicated below, the proposed
definition implies also that you want to allow for the same initial PIN
to be used for multiple Token secrets in bulk provisioning scenario.
This could be achieved by defining the PINPolicy as follows:

<PINPolicy>

<PINUsageMode>Local</PINUsageMode>

<PINInitValue>zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D</PINInitValue>

</PINPolicy> =20

=09a.=09Is the reason you chose to use a reference to another
<key> element to avoid duplicating same PIN across multiple key data
blocks in the same the same container?

=20

3.=09What is the scope of the PINRef?  I am assuming this is within
the current PSKC container.  Could for example the PINref refer to a key
that has been provisioned from another 'previous' container?      =20

=20

4.=09if we use the <key> data to transmit the initial PIN as
proposed, we will need to add a new usage type to indicate the key data
value will be used as an initial pin to unlock the actual token secret.
I think it is better to have this explicit then implied by the PINRef
(being set to keyid).

=20

Regards,

=20

=20

Salah

=20

=20

=20

________________________________

From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]=20
Sent: Friday, November 23, 2007 11:08 AM
To: Pei, Mingliang; Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker;
keyprov@ietf.org
Cc: M'Raihi, David; Bajaj,Siddharth; Johan Rydell
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to
aclientviaPSKC?

=20

Andrea and Ming,

As we discussed in the PSKC call I would like to explain a new proposal.

I would like to keep the way to transmit the PIN value as a key.

We though want the flexibility to define possibly multiple PINs and
which keys are protected by the PIN.

Hence I would like to introduce an element called PINPolicy

<PINPolicy PINRef=3D"KeyId of the key containing the PIN">

        <PINUsageMode>

                Local

        </PINUsageMode>

</PINPolicy>

This will replace the accessrule element.

So to take the example of a PIN protected HOTP token with no encryption
based on the latest draft with highlights:

   <?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?>

   <KeyContainer

     xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0"

     xmlns:ds=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#"

     xmlns:xsi=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"

     xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0

       keyprov-pskc-1.0.xsd" Version=3D"1.0">

       <Device>

         <DeviceId>

           <Manufacturer>Token Manufacturer</Manufacturer>

           <SerialNo>98765432188</SerialNo>

           <Expiry>12/31/2012</Expiry>

         </DeviceId>

         <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#hotp"

           KeyId=3D"77654321871">

         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

           <Usage OTP=3D"true">

             <ResponseFormat Format=3D"DECIMAL" Length=3D"6"/>

           </Usage>

           <FriendlyName>MyFirstToken</FriendlyName>

           <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

             <Value>

               zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D

             </Value>

           </Data>

           <Data Name=3D"COUNTER">

             <Value>AAAAAAAAAAA=3D</Value>

           </Data>

           <Expiry>10/30/2012</Expiry>

             <PINPolicy PINRef=3D"77654321872">

                <PINUsageMode>Local</PINUsageMode>

           </PINPolicy>        =20

         </Key>

         <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#PIN"

           KeyId=3D"77654321872">

         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

           <Usage>

             <ResponseFormat Format=3D"DECIMAL" Length=3D"4"/>

           </Usage>

           <FriendlyName>RandomInitialTokenPIN</FriendlyName>

           <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

             <Value>

               zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D

             </Value>

           </Data>

         </Key>

       </Device>

   </KeyContainer>

=20

In this way we can specifically say what keys are protected by which
PINs and re-use most of our constructs in Key that would apply to the
PIN such as the format the way to encrypt etc etc.

Thoughts?

Philip

-----Original Message-----
From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]
Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 1:48 AM
To: Doherty, Andrea; Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker;
keyprov@ietf.org
Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell
Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to
aclientviaPSKC?

I have chatted with Philip / Salah about my comments this afternoon

while I was almost done my reply of this email. I sent it anyway now for

broad review. Our meeting minutes from Philip later will contain other

proposed changes in our discussion.

1. A PIN is associated with a key; we need to define a better way to

associate with them when we carry PIN in a separate Key type.

- The current proposal assumes that all keys in the same "Device" type

will associate to the PIN credential in the same Device.

- This has a limitation for "PREPEND" case where a device may have

multiple keys, and each key has its own PIN as part of server

authentication.

2. There is use case when a PIN is per device, instead of per key, for

the "Local" access usage.=20

So I prefer defining PIN credential inside DeviceType, and refered by

KeyType by an attribute or element, and DeviceType.

3. PIN policy is fine to have its own type. The AccessRule and

PINUsageModeType should combine to be a PIN usage policy. If we are

treating PIN as a separate credential, it is more consistent to make PIN

usage policy part of Usage, I think.

Thanks,

- Ming

=20

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]=20

> Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 12:31 PM

> To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org

> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell

> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20

> to aclientviaPSKC?

>=20

> Philip,

>=20

> Thank you for your proposal.  Here are a few comments:

>=20

> 1. By <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/> do you mean "PIN is=20

> enabled"?  Is the reverse true, that <AccessRules=20

> userPIN=3D"false"/> indicates PINless operation from a server's=20

> point of view?=20

>=20

> 2. Instead of <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>, providing=20

> a PINUsageModeType would be more extensible and implementable:

> <xs:complexType name=3D"PINUsageModeType">

>       <xs:choice maxOccurs=3D"unbounded">

>               <xs:element name=3D"Local"/>

>               <xs:element name=3D"Prepend"/>

>               <xs:element name=3D"Embed"/>

>       </xs:choice>

> </xs:complexType>

>=20

> 3. Anders brought to my attention that a local PIN is needed=20

> instead of a server PIN in some scenarios.  The device=20

> issuer, in this case, would also have a PIN policy that could=20

> differ from the policy of a server PIN.  Anders provided the=20

> following example, which is taken from another=20

> standardization effort in the workings ("PKI for Web 2.0"):

>=20

> // The following is sent down to the client by the issuer:

>=20

> <KeyGenerationRequest ...>

>=20

> // Request a key without PIN protection.

>=20

>   <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.1" KeyUsage=3D"encryption">

>     <KeyAlgorithmData>

>       <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>

>     </KeyAlgorithmData>

>   </RequestedKey>

>=20

> // Request a set of keys with PIN protection.

> // The specified policy disallows 11122 but accepts 11223 //=20

> 654321 would not be accepted either (sequence)

>=20

>   <PINProtection Type=3D"numeric" MinLength=3D"5" MaxLength=3D"8"

>                  PatternRestrictions=3D"three-in-a-row  sequences">

>=20

> // The next element is optional and is a way of grouping PINs=20

> // so that the user either only has to specify a single PIN=20

> // for a set of keys, or one unique PIN per key.

>=20

>     <PINGroupProtection Shared=3D"true">

>=20

>       <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.2" KeyUsage=3D"signature">

>         <KeyAlgorithmData>

>           <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>

>         </KeyAlgorithmData>

>       </RequestedKey>

>       <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.3" KeyUsage=3D"authentication">

>         <KeyAlgorithmData>

>           <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>

>         </KeyAlgorithmData>

>       </RequestedKey>

>=20

>     </PINGroupProtection>

>=20

>   </PINProtection>

>=20

> </KeyGenerationRequest>

>=20

> Your thoughts?

> Andrea=20

>=20

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]

> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:16 AM

> To: Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org

> Cc: M'Raihi, David; Bajaj,Siddharth; Johan Rydell

> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20

> to aclientviaPSKC?

>=20

> Andrea,

> You are right I have not addressed the Pin policy issue.

>=20

> I would like to though.=20

>=20

> Since you seem to have a good idea of the requirements would=20

> you be able to help?

>=20

> I suggest we create a new type called PINPolicy that contains=20

> the data required to be submitted.

>=20

> So currently PIN usage I can think of is:

> -KEY_ACCESS_CHECK (this check the pin on the device to allow=20

> access to a key for algorithms) -USED_IN_ALGO (used during=20

> calculation)

>=20

> When you talk though about length I already have that in the=20

> <Usage> part of the PIN 'key' see below

>=20

> NEW->

>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">

>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

>          <Usage>

>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>

>          </Usage>

>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>

>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>

>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>

>          </Data>

>        </Key>

> <-NEW

>=20

> Also when we talk about server verified pins in otps are we=20

> not really talking about the otp algo or usage here?

>=20

> I was wondering hence if our usage element for the otp key=20

> should be augmented to contain and optional

>=20

> <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>

>=20

> What do you think?

>=20

> Philip

>=20

>=20

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]

> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:28 AM

> To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org

> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David

> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20

> to a clientviaPSKC?

>=20

> Philip,

> This looks ok except that a more complex PIN policy is needed=20

> (refer to this comment I made to the previous version of the=20

> PSKC draft, Section

> 5.1.7:

> "Recommend that you allow for a more complex PIN policy,=20

> esp., (a) how the PIN is to be used in the OTP calculation=20

> (e.g., concatenated vs.

> XOR's with the token code) and (b) PIN length. "

>=20

> This doesn't seem to have been addressed yet based on=20

> feedback to my review (see attached) and example below.  What=20

> is the status of this? =20

> Andrea

>=20

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]

> Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 11:48 AM

> To: KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org

> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David

> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20

> to a clientviaPSKC?

>=20

> Gentlemen,

> Since PSKC will be used also to bulk provision from=20

> manufacturing to a validation server and some of these=20

> devices do have a PIN pad there is the concept of an initial PIN.

>=20

> Since we have not yet defined how this initial PIN is=20

> transmitted in the PSKC spec I would like to put forward a=20

> proposal for inclusion in the spec for specifying the=20

> transmission of PINs.

>=20

> The PIN is effectively another shared secret hence I propose=20

> to treat it as a key in itself.

>=20

> This has the advantage that we can leverage the Usage part of=20

> the schema that can define things like length and format=20

> (alphanumeric etc). we also can set an expiry etc. It also=20

> leverages the fact that the PIN itself will be encrypted in=20

> transport in the same manner as other key material.

>=20

> I hence propose to extend the KeyAlgorithmType with a new=20

> type called 'userPIN' (inline with the name used in the=20

> access rules element already

> present)

>=20

>=20

> As an example a KeyContainer with a non encrypted HOTP key=20

> and a 4 digit numeric PIN (please note that the value and=20

> valuedigest are just copy and paste) ( I put the new section=20

> with NEW-> and <-NEW lines before and

> after):

>=20

>    <?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?>

>    <KeyContainer

>    xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"

>    xmlns:logo=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo"

>    xmlns:ds=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#"

>    xmlns:xsi=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"

>    xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"

> .\keyprov_pskc_schema_v1.1.xsd" version=3D"1.1">

>      <EncryptionMethod algorithm=3D"NONE"/>

>      <DigestMethod algorithm=3D"HMAC-SHA1"></DigestMethod>

>      <Device>

>        <DeviceId>

>          <Manufacturer>Token Manufacturer</Manufacturer>

>          <SerialNo>98765432187</SerialNo>

>          <Expiry>01/01/2008</Expiry>

>        </DeviceId>

>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"HOTP"  KeyId=3D"98765432187">

>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

>          <Usage>

>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"6"/>

>          </Usage>

> NEW->

>          <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/>

> <-NEW

>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstToken</FriendlyName>

>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>

>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>

>          </Data>

>          <Data Name=3D"COUNTER">

>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>

>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>

>          </Data>

>        </Key>

> NEW->

>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">

>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

>          <Usage>

>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>

>          </Usage>

>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>

>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>

>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>

>          </Data>

>        </Key>

> <-NEW

>      </Device>

>    </KeyContainer>

>=20

> Comments are welcome,

>=20

> Philip

>=20

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Mingliang Pei [mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net]

> Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 9:58 AM

> To: keyprov@ietf.org

> Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a=20

> client viaPSKC?

>=20

>=20

> New submission from Mingliang Pei <mpei@verisign.com>:

>=20

> PSKC provies support about carrying PIN usage policy. When=20

> PIN is used,

> how do=20

> you actually transfer the initial PIN using PSKC? Should PIN=20

> be treated

> as=20

> another credential, for example?

>=20

> ----------

> assignedto: mpei

> messages: 71

> nosy: keyprov, mpei

> priority: critical

> status: chatting

> title: How to transfer initial PIN to a client via PSKC?

>=20

> _________________________________________________________

> KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>

> <http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue28>

> _________________________________________________________

>=20

> _______________________________________________

> KEYPROV mailing list

> KEYPROV@ietf.org

> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov

>=20

>=20

> _______________________________________________

> KEYPROV mailing list

> KEYPROV@ietf.org

> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov

>=20

>=20

> _______________________________________________

> KEYPROV mailing list

> KEYPROV@ietf.org

> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov

>=20

>=20

> _______________________________________________

> KEYPROV mailing list

> KEYPROV@ietf.org

> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov

>=20



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Attendees: Phillip Hallam-Baker [PHB], Ming Pei, Philip Hoyer     =20

=20

*	Discussed question about URI in attribute or element. PHB things
it is only matter of taste no best practice. So decision to leave for
now.
*	Submission of new spec, Ming will check current document and fix
examples over week end and submit.
*	Discussion about URI definition, where to put definition, in
original algorithm draft in keyprov documents or in the new draft from
Hallam Baker. PHB not really important where but that it is done.
Objective is to create new IANA registry for algorithms. Maybe better to
note the use of the algorithm in the keyprov drafts. PHB preference
using existing identifier without creating new ones. What do we do about
HOTP do we use OATH? Better not since HOTP now is RFC. [Ming] what about
internal structure. [PHB] do not create internal structure. [Ming]
should we use URN or URL? What about HOTP should the URL to the RFC?
[PHB] need to check what is preferred in IETF, there is no right or
wrong?
*	ACTION PHB to check what is best practice with IETF
*	What about namespace, currently we use URN. What is PHB opinion,
currently stick with URN. [PHB] prefers URN because of operational
issues since if URL are used some implementation pull the xsd. It makes
sense that for algorithms there is no need to pull the algorithm.

=20

=20

________________________________

=20

Philip Hoyer=20

=20

Senior Architect - Office of CTO

=20

ActivIdentity (UK)

109 Borough High Street

London SE1 1NL

=20

Telephone: +44 (0) 20 7744 6248

Direct: +44 (0) 20 7744 6455

Fax: +44 (0) 20 7744 6249

=20

Private and confidential: This message and any attachments may contain

privileged / confidential information. If you are not an intended
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=20


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<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Attendees: Phillip Hallam-Baker [PHB], =
<st1:place
w:st=3D"on"><st1:City w:st=3D"on">Ming</st1:City> <st1:State =
w:st=3D"on">Pei</st1:State></st1:place>,
<st1:PersonName w:st=3D"on">Philip =
Hoyer</st1:PersonName>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
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 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Discussed =
question
     about URI in attribute or element. PHB things it is only matter of =
taste
     no best practice. So decision to leave for =
now.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Submission of new
     spec, Ming will check current document and fix examples over week =
end and
     submit.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l0 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Discussion about URI
     definition, where to put definition, in original algorithm draft in =
keyprov
     documents or in the new draft from Hallam Baker. PHB not really =
important
     where but that it is done. Objective is to create new IANA registry =
for
     algorithms. Maybe better to note the use of the algorithm in the =
keyprov
     drafts. PHB preference using existing identifier without creating =
new ones.
     What do we do about HOTP do we use OATH? Better not since HOTP now =
is RFC.
     [Ming] what about internal structure. [PHB] do not create internal
     structure. [Ming] should we use URN or URL? What about HOTP should =
the URL
     to the RFC? [PHB] need to check what is preferred in IETF, there is =
no
     right or wrong?<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
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face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>ACTION =
PHB to check
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     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>What =
about
     namespace, currently we use URN. What is PHB opinion, currently =
stick with
     URN. [PHB] prefers URN because of operational issues since if URL =
are used
     some implementation pull the xsd. It makes sense that for =
algorithms there
     is no need to pull the algorithm.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
</ul>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st=3D"on"><font size=3D2 =
face=3D"Courier New"><span
 lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>Philip Hoyer</span></font></st1:PersonName><font
size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Senior Architect - =
Office of
CTO<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>ActivIdentity =
(<st1:country-region
w:st=3D"on"><st1:place =
w:st=3D"on">UK</st1:place></st1:country-region>)<o:p></o:p></span></font>=
</p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:Street w:st=3D"on"><st1:address =
w:st=3D"on"><font size=3D2
  face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>109
  Borough High Street</span></font></st1:address></st1:Street><font =
size=3D2
face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:City w:st=3D"on"><st1:place w:st=3D"on"><font =
size=3D2
  face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>London</span></font></st1:place></st1:City><font
size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New"'> SE1 1NL<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Telephone: +44 (0) =
20 7744
6248<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Direct: +44 (0) 20 =
7744 6455<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Fax: +44 (0) 20 =
7744 6249<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Private and =
confidential:
This message and any attachments may =
contain<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>privileged / =
confidential
information. If you are not an intended =
recipient,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>you must not copy, =
distribute,
discuss or take any action in reliance on =
it.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>If you have =
received this
communication in error, please notify the =
sender<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>and delete this =
message
immediately.</span></font><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
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style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to aclientviaPSKC?
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From: "Pei, Mingliang" <mpei@verisign.com>
To: "Philip Hoyer" <philip.hoyer@actividentity.com>,
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=20
It looks good for remote PIN usage case, i.e., one PIN per key where PIN
is used along with key for respective algorithm. Another point that we
touched was to handle a device PINPolicy in the following situation:
=20
- A PIN is provisioned and used to login to a device. The device may
contain multiple keys. It would be redundant to include PINPolicy in
each Key element for the m-key elements in a device. We may allow Device
element to have a PINPolicy where PINUsageMode =3D Local.
=20
Thus I consider a variation of this as follows.
=20
I:
=20
<Device>
    <LocalPINPolicy/>
    <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#PIN"     KeyId=3D1>...</Key>
    <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#HOTP" KeyId=3D"2"><Issuer>Issuer
1</Issuer></Key>
    <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#HOTP" KeyId=3D"3"><Issuer>Issuer
2</Issuer></Key>
</Device>
=20
II:
=20
<Device>
    <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#PIN" KeyId=3D"1"><PINPolicy =
RefId=3D"2"/></Key>
    <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#PIN" KeyId=3D"2"></Key>
</Device>
=20
I am not very satisfied with the two flavors of PINPolicy though.
Thoughts?
=20
- Ming


________________________________

	From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]=20
	Sent: Friday, November 23, 2007 8:08 AM
	To: Pei, Mingliang; Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue
Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
	Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell
	Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to
aclientviaPSKC?
=09
=09

	Andrea and Ming,

	As we discussed in the PSKC call I would like to explain a new
proposal.

=09

	I would like to keep the way to transmit the PIN value as a key.

	We though want the flexibility to define possibly multiple PINs
and which keys are protected by the PIN.

=09

	Hence I would like to introduce an element called PINPolicy

	<PINPolicy PINRef=3D"KeyId of the key containing the PIN">

	        <PINUsageMode>

	                Local

	        </PINUsageMode>

	</PINPolicy>

=09

	This will replace the accessrule element.

=09

	So to take the example of a PIN protected HOTP token with no
encryption based on the latest draft with highlights:

=09

	   <?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?>

	   <KeyContainer

	     xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0"

	     xmlns:ds=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#"

	     xmlns:xsi=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"

=09
xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0

	       keyprov-pskc-1.0.xsd" Version=3D"1.0">

	       <Device>

	         <DeviceId>

	           <Manufacturer>Token Manufacturer</Manufacturer>

	           <SerialNo>98765432188</SerialNo>

	           <Expiry>12/31/2012</Expiry>

	         </DeviceId>

	         <Key
KeyAlgorithm=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#hotp"

	           KeyId=3D"77654321871">

	         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

	           <Usage OTP=3D"true">

	             <ResponseFormat Format=3D"DECIMAL" Length=3D"6"/>

	           </Usage>

	           <FriendlyName>MyFirstToken</FriendlyName>

	           <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

	             <Value>

	               zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D

	             </Value>

	           </Data>

	           <Data Name=3D"COUNTER">

	             <Value>AAAAAAAAAAA=3D</Value>

	           </Data>

	           <Expiry>10/30/2012</Expiry>

	             <PINPolicy PINRef=3D"77654321872">

	                <PINUsageMode>Local</PINUsageMode>

	           </PINPolicy>        =20

	         </Key>

	         <Key
KeyAlgorithm=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#PIN"

	           KeyId=3D"77654321872">

	         <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

	           <Usage>

	             <ResponseFormat Format=3D"DECIMAL" Length=3D"4"/>

	           </Usage>

	           <FriendlyName>RandomInitialTokenPIN</FriendlyName>

	           <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

	             <Value>

	               zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D

	             </Value>

	           </Data>

	         </Key>

	       </Device>

	   </KeyContainer>


	In this way we can specifically say what keys are protected by
which PINs and re-use most of our constructs in Key that would apply to
the PIN such as the format the way to encrypt etc etc.

	Thoughts?

	Philip

=09

	-----Original Message-----
	From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]
	Sent: Tuesday, November 13, 2007 1:48 AM
	To: Doherty, Andrea; Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue
Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org
	Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell
	Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to
aclientviaPSKC?

=09

	I have chatted with Philip / Salah about my comments this
afternoon

	while I was almost done my reply of this email. I sent it anyway
now for

	broad review. Our meeting minutes from Philip later will contain
other

	proposed changes in our discussion.

	1. A PIN is associated with a key; we need to define a better
way to

	associate with them when we carry PIN in a separate Key type.

	- The current proposal assumes that all keys in the same
"Device" type

	will associate to the PIN credential in the same Device.

	- This has a limitation for "PREPEND" case where a device may
have

	multiple keys, and each key has its own PIN as part of server

	authentication.

	2. There is use case when a PIN is per device, instead of per
key, for

	the "Local" access usage.=20

	So I prefer defining PIN credential inside DeviceType, and
refered by

	KeyType by an attribute or element, and DeviceType.

	3. PIN policy is fine to have its own type. The AccessRule and

	PINUsageModeType should combine to be a PIN usage policy. If we
are

	treating PIN as a separate credential, it is more consistent to
make PIN

	usage policy part of Usage, I think.

	Thanks,

	- Ming

	=20

	> -----Original Message-----

	> From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]=20

	> Sent: Thursday, November 08, 2007 12:31 PM

	> To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker;
keyprov@ietf.org

	> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell

	> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20

	> to aclientviaPSKC?

	>=20

	> Philip,

	>=20

	> Thank you for your proposal.  Here are a few comments:

	>=20

	> 1. By <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/> do you mean "PIN is=20

	> enabled"?  Is the reverse true, that <AccessRules=20

	> userPIN=3D"false"/> indicates PINless operation from a server's=20

	> point of view?=20

	>=20

	> 2. Instead of <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>, providing=20

	> a PINUsageModeType would be more extensible and implementable:

	> <xs:complexType name=3D"PINUsageModeType">

	>       <xs:choice maxOccurs=3D"unbounded">

	>               <xs:element name=3D"Local"/>

	>               <xs:element name=3D"Prepend"/>

	>               <xs:element name=3D"Embed"/>

	>       </xs:choice>

	> </xs:complexType>

	>=20

	> 3. Anders brought to my attention that a local PIN is needed=20

	> instead of a server PIN in some scenarios.  The device=20

	> issuer, in this case, would also have a PIN policy that could=20

	> differ from the policy of a server PIN.  Anders provided the=20

	> following example, which is taken from another=20

	> standardization effort in the workings ("PKI for Web 2.0"):

	>=20

	> // The following is sent down to the client by the issuer:

	>=20

	> <KeyGenerationRequest ...>

	>=20

	> // Request a key without PIN protection.

	>=20

	>   <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.1" KeyUsage=3D"encryption">

	>     <KeyAlgorithmData>

	>       <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>

	>     </KeyAlgorithmData>

	>   </RequestedKey>

	>=20

	> // Request a set of keys with PIN protection.

	> // The specified policy disallows 11122 but accepts 11223 //=20

	> 654321 would not be accepted either (sequence)

	>=20

	>   <PINProtection Type=3D"numeric" MinLength=3D"5" MaxLength=3D"8"

	>                  PatternRestrictions=3D"three-in-a-row
sequences">

	>=20

	> // The next element is optional and is a way of grouping PINs=20

	> // so that the user either only has to specify a single PIN=20

	> // for a set of keys, or one unique PIN per key.

	>=20

	>     <PINGroupProtection Shared=3D"true">

	>=20

	>       <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.2" KeyUsage=3D"signature">

	>         <KeyAlgorithmData>

	>           <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>

	>         </KeyAlgorithmData>

	>       </RequestedKey>

	>       <RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.3" KeyUsage=3D"authentication">

	>         <KeyAlgorithmData>

	>           <RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/>

	>         </KeyAlgorithmData>

	>       </RequestedKey>

	>=20

	>     </PINGroupProtection>

	>=20

	>   </PINProtection>

	>=20

	> </KeyGenerationRequest>

	>=20

	> Your thoughts?

	> Andrea=20

	>=20

	> -----Original Message-----

	> From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]

	> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:16 AM

	> To: Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker;
keyprov@ietf.org

	> Cc: M'Raihi, David; Bajaj,Siddharth; Johan Rydell

	> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20

	> to aclientviaPSKC?

	>=20

	> Andrea,

	> You are right I have not addressed the Pin policy issue.

	>=20

	> I would like to though.=20

	>=20

	> Since you seem to have a good idea of the requirements would=20

	> you be able to help?

	>=20

	> I suggest we create a new type called PINPolicy that contains=20

	> the data required to be submitted.

	>=20

	> So currently PIN usage I can think of is:

	> -KEY_ACCESS_CHECK (this check the pin on the device to allow=20

	> access to a key for algorithms) -USED_IN_ALGO (used during=20

	> calculation)

	>=20

	> When you talk though about length I already have that in the=20

	> <Usage> part of the PIN 'key' see below

	>=20

	> NEW->

	>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">

	>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

	>          <Usage>

	>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>

	>          </Usage>

	>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>

	>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

	>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>

	>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>

	>          </Data>

	>        </Key>

	> <-NEW

	>=20

	> Also when we talk about server verified pins in otps are we=20

	> not really talking about the otp algo or usage here?

	>=20

	> I was wondering hence if our usage element for the otp key=20

	> should be augmented to contain and optional

	>=20

	> <UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/>

	>=20

	> What do you think?

	>=20

	> Philip

	>=20

	>=20

	> -----Original Message-----

	> From: Doherty, Andrea [mailto:adoherty@rsa.com]

	> Sent: Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:28 AM

	> To: Philip Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker;
keyprov@ietf.org

	> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David

	> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20

	> to a clientviaPSKC?

	>=20

	> Philip,

	> This looks ok except that a more complex PIN policy is needed=20

	> (refer to this comment I made to the previous version of the=20

	> PSKC draft, Section

	> 5.1.7:

	> "Recommend that you allow for a more complex PIN policy,=20

	> esp., (a) how the PIN is to be used in the OTP calculation=20

	> (e.g., concatenated vs.

	> XOR's with the token code) and (b) PIN length. "

	>=20

	> This doesn't seem to have been addressed yet based on=20

	> feedback to my review (see attached) and example below.  What=20

	> is the status of this? =20

	> Andrea

	>=20

	> -----Original Message-----

	> From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]

	> Sent: Friday, September 28, 2007 11:48 AM

	> To: KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org

	> Cc: Bajaj, Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David

	> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN=20

	> to a clientviaPSKC?

	>=20

	> Gentlemen,

	> Since PSKC will be used also to bulk provision from=20

	> manufacturing to a validation server and some of these=20

	> devices do have a PIN pad there is the concept of an initial
PIN.

	>=20

	> Since we have not yet defined how this initial PIN is=20

	> transmitted in the PSKC spec I would like to put forward a=20

	> proposal for inclusion in the spec for specifying the=20

	> transmission of PINs.

	>=20

	> The PIN is effectively another shared secret hence I propose=20

	> to treat it as a key in itself.

	>=20

	> This has the advantage that we can leverage the Usage part of=20

	> the schema that can define things like length and format=20

	> (alphanumeric etc). we also can set an expiry etc. It also=20

	> leverages the fact that the PIN itself will be encrypted in=20

	> transport in the same manner as other key material.

	>=20

	> I hence propose to extend the KeyAlgorithmType with a new=20

	> type called 'userPIN' (inline with the name used in the=20

	> access rules element already

	> present)

	>=20

	>=20

	> As an example a KeyContainer with a non encrypted HOTP key=20

	> and a 4 digit numeric PIN (please note that the value and=20

	> valuedigest are just copy and paste) ( I put the new section=20

	> with NEW-> and <-NEW lines before and

	> after):

	>=20

	>    <?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?>

	>    <KeyContainer

	>    xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"

	>    xmlns:logo=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo"

	>    xmlns:ds=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#"

	>    xmlns:xsi=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance"

	>
xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"

	> .\keyprov_pskc_schema_v1.1.xsd" version=3D"1.1">

	>      <EncryptionMethod algorithm=3D"NONE"/>

	>      <DigestMethod algorithm=3D"HMAC-SHA1"></DigestMethod>

	>      <Device>

	>        <DeviceId>

	>          <Manufacturer>Token Manufacturer</Manufacturer>

	>          <SerialNo>98765432187</SerialNo>

	>          <Expiry>01/01/2008</Expiry>

	>        </DeviceId>

	>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"HOTP"  KeyId=3D"98765432187">

	>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

	>          <Usage>

	>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"6"/>

	>          </Usage>

	> NEW->

	>          <AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/>

	> <-NEW

	>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstToken</FriendlyName>

	>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

	>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>

	>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>

	>          </Data>

	>          <Data Name=3D"COUNTER">

	>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>

	>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>

	>          </Data>

	>        </Key>

	> NEW->

	>        <Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"  KeyId=3D"12345678">

	>          <Issuer>Credential Issuer</Issuer>

	>          <Usage>

	>           <ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" length=3D"4"/>

	>          </Usage>

	>          <FriendlyName>MyFirstTokenInitialPIN</FriendlyName>

	>          <Data Name=3D"SECRET">

	>            <Value>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D</Value>

	>            <ValueDigest>WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D</ValueDigest>

	>          </Data>

	>        </Key>

	> <-NEW

	>      </Device>

	>    </KeyContainer>

	>=20

	> Comments are welcome,

	>=20

	> Philip

	>=20

	> -----Original Message-----

	> From: Mingliang Pei [mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net]

	> Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 9:58 AM

	> To: keyprov@ietf.org

	> Subject: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a=20

	> client viaPSKC?

	>=20

	>=20

	> New submission from Mingliang Pei <mpei@verisign.com>:

	>=20

	> PSKC provies support about carrying PIN usage policy. When=20

	> PIN is used,

	> how do=20

	> you actually transfer the initial PIN using PSKC? Should PIN=20

	> be treated

	> as=20

	> another credential, for example?

	>=20

	> ----------

	> assignedto: mpei

	> messages: 71

	> nosy: keyprov, mpei

	> priority: critical

	> status: chatting

	> title: How to transfer initial PIN to a client via PSKC?

	>=20

	> _________________________________________________________

	> KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker <hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net>

	> <http://www.tschofenig.priv.at:8080/keyprov/issue28>

	> _________________________________________________________

	>=20

	> _______________________________________________

	> KEYPROV mailing list

	> KEYPROV@ietf.org

	> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov

	>=20

	>=20

	> _______________________________________________

	> KEYPROV mailing list

	> KEYPROV@ietf.org

	> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov

	>=20

	>=20

	> _______________________________________________

	> KEYPROV mailing list

	> KEYPROV@ietf.org

	> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov

	>=20

	>=20

	> _______________________________________________

	> KEYPROV mailing list

	> KEYPROV@ietf.org

	> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov

	>=20

=09


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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN =
to aclientviaPSKC?</TITLE>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Dus-ascii">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.2900.3157" name=3DGENERATOR></HEAD>
<BODY>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>It looks good for remote PIN usage case, i.e., =
one PIN per=20
key where PIN is used along with key for respective algorithm. Another =
point=20
that we touched was to&nbsp;handle a device PINPolicy&nbsp;in the =
following=20
situation:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>- A&nbsp;PIN is provisioned and used to login =
to a device.=20
The device may contain multiple keys. It would be redundant to include =
PINPolicy=20
in each Key element for the m-key elements in a device. We may allow =
Device=20
element to have a PINPolicy where PINUsageMode =3D =
Local.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Thus I consider a variation of this as=20
follows.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>I:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&lt;Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
&lt;LocalPINPolicy/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key=20
KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#PIN"&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
KeyId=3D1&gt;...&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#HOTP"=20
KeyId=3D"2"&gt;&lt;Issuer&gt;Issuer=20
1&lt;/Issuer&gt;&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#HOTP"=20
KeyId=3D"3"&gt;&lt;Issuer&gt;Issuer=20
2&lt;/Issuer&gt;&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&lt;/Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>II:</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&lt;Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&nbsp; &nbsp; &lt;Key KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#PIN"=20
KeyId=3D"1"&gt;&lt;PINPolicy =
RefId=3D"2"/&gt;&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D"...#PIN"=20
KeyId=3D"2"&gt;&lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>&lt;/Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>I am not very satisfied with the two flavors of =
PINPolicy=20
though. Thoughts?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D220034119-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>- Ming</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
  <HR tabIndex=3D-1>
  <FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> Philip Hoyer=20
  [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com] <BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, =
November 23,=20
  2007 8:08 AM<BR><B>To:</B> Pei, Mingliang; Doherty, Andrea; KEYPROV =
Roundup=20
  Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org<BR><B>Cc:</B> Bajaj, Siddharth; =
M'Raihi,=20
  David; Johan Rydell<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to =
transfer=20
  initial PIN to aclientviaPSKC?<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
  <DIV></DIV><!-- Converted from text/rtf format -->
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>Andrea and=20
  Ming,</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>As =
we discussed in=20
  the PSKC call I would like to explain a new =
proposal.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>I =
would like to=20
  keep the way to transmit the PIN value as a key.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>We =
though want the=20
  flexibility to define possibly multiple PINs and which keys are =
protected by=20
  the PIN.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>Hence I would like=20
  to introduce an element called PINPolicy</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&lt;PINPolicy=20
  PINRef=3D"KeyId of the key containing the PIN"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</SPAN><SPAN =
lang=3Den-gb>=20
  <FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&lt;PINUsageMode&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN =
lang=3Den-gb>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>Local</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN =
lang=3Den-gb>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT=20
  face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>&lt;/PINUsageMode&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =

  lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&lt;/PINPolicy&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN =
lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>This will replace=20
  the accessrule element.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>So =
to take the=20
  example of a PIN protected HOTP token with no encryption based on the =
latest=20
  draft</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2> with=20
  highlights</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>:</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;?xml version=3D"1.0" encoding=3D"UTF-8"?&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;KeyContainer</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; xmlns:ds=3D"<A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig">http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmld=
sig</A>#"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; xmlns:xsi=3D"<A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance">http://www.w3.org/2001=
/XMLSchema-instance</A>"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container:1.0</FONT>=
</SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Dfr> <FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>keyprov-pskc-1.0.xsd" Version=3D"1.0"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Dfr><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Dfr><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;DeviceId&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Dfr><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FO=
NT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb> <FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&lt;Manufacturer&gt;Token=20
  Manufacturer&lt;/Manufacturer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;SerialNo&gt;98765432188&lt;/SerialNo&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Expiry&gt;12/31/2012&lt;/Expiry&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/DeviceId&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key=20
  KeyAlgorithm=3D"<A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#hotp">http://www.ietf.org/keypro=
v/pskc#hotp</A>"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  KeyId=3D"77654321871"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Usage=20
  OTP=3D"true"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;ResponseFormat Format=3D"DECIMAL" =
Length=3D"6"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;MyFirstToken&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data=20
  Name=3D"SECRET"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data=20
  Name=3D"COUNTER"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Value&gt;AAAAAAAAAAA=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Expiry&gt;10/30/2012&lt;/Expiry&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN =
lang=3Den-gb>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT=20
  face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb> <FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>&lt;PINPolicy=20
  PINRef=3D"</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>77654321872</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT =
face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb> &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&lt;PINUsageMode&gt;Local&lt;/PINUsageMode&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>=

  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FO=
NT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb> <FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&lt;/PINPolicy&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb>=20
  &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; </SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;</FONT></SPAN><S=
PAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb> <FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>&lt;Key =
KeyAlgorithm=3D"<A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc">http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/psk=
c</A>#</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>PIN</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  KeyId=3D"7765432187</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT =
face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>2</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;ResponseFormat Format=3D"DECIMAL" Length=3D"</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>4</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT =
face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>Ra</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =

  size=3D2>n</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>domInitial</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT =
face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>Token</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier =
New"=20
  size=3D2>PIN</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier =
New"=20
  size=3D2>&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data=20
  Name=3D"SECRET"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  zOkqJENSsh6b2hdXz1WBK/oprbY=3D</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/KeyContainer&gt;</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P><BR>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>In =
this way we can=20
  specifically say what keys are protected by which PINs and re-use most =
of=20
  our</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb> <FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>constructs=20
  in Key that would apply to the PIN such as the format the way to =
encrypt etc=20
  etc.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>Thoughts?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>Philip</FONT></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN><SPAN lang=3Den-us><FONT =
face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: Pei, Mingliang [<A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:mpei@verisign.com">mailto:mpei@verisign.com</A>]<BR>Sent: =

  Tuesday, November 13, 2007 1:48 AM<BR>To: Doherty, Andrea; Philip =
Hoyer;=20
  KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org<BR>Cc: Bajaj, =
Siddharth;=20
  M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell<BR>Subject: RE: [KEYPROV] [issue28] How =
to=20
  transfer initial PIN to aclientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN><SPAN=20
  lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>I =
have chatted=20
  with Philip / Salah about my comments this afternoon</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>while I was almost=20
  done my reply of this email. I sent it anyway now =
for</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>broad review. Our=20
  meeting minutes from Philip later will contain other</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>proposed changes=20
  in our discussion.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>1. =
A PIN is=20
  associated with a key; we need to define a better way =
to</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>associate with=20
  them when we carry PIN in a separate Key type.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>- =
The current=20
  proposal assumes that all keys in the same "Device" =
type</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>will associate to=20
  the PIN credential in the same Device.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>- =
This has a=20
  limitation for "PREPEND" case where a device may =
have</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>multiple keys, and=20
  each key has its own PIN as part of server</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>authentication.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>2. =
There is use=20
  case when a PIN is per device, instead of per key, =
for</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>the "Local" access=20
  usage. </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>So =
I prefer=20
  defining PIN credential inside DeviceType, and refered =
by</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>KeyType by an=20
  attribute or element, and DeviceType.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>3. =
PIN policy is=20
  fine to have its own type. The AccessRule and</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>PINUsageModeType=20
  should combine to be a PIN usage policy. If we are</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>treating PIN as a=20
  separate credential, it is more consistent to make =
PIN</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>usage policy part=20
  of Usage, I think.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2>-=20
  Ming</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; -----Original=20
  Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; From:=20
  Doherty, Andrea [<A=20
  href=3D"mailto:adoherty@rsa.com">mailto:adoherty@rsa.com</A>] =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Sent:=20
  Thursday, November 08, 2007 12:31 PM</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; To: Philip=20
  Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; =
keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Cc: Bajaj,=20
  Siddharth; M'Raihi, David; Johan Rydell</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Subject: RE:=20
  [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; to=20
  aclientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  Philip,</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Thank you for=20
  your proposal.&nbsp; Here are a few comments:</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; 1. By=20
  &lt;AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/&gt; do you mean "PIN is =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  enabled"?&nbsp; Is the reverse true, that &lt;AccessRules =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  userPIN=3D"false"/&gt; indicates PINless operation from a server's=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; point of=20
  view? </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; 2. Instead of=20
  &lt;UserPIN position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/&gt;, providing =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; a=20
  PINUsageModeType would be more extensible and =
implementable:</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &lt;xs:complexType name=3D"PINUsageModeType"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;xs:choice=20
  maxOccurs=3D"unbounded"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;xs:element name=3D"Local"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;xs:element name=3D"Prepend"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;xs:element name=3D"Embed"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;/xs:choice&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &lt;/xs:complexType&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; 3. Anders=20
  brought to my attention that a local PIN is needed </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; instead of a=20
  server PIN in some scenarios.&nbsp; The device </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; issuer, in=20
  this case, would also have a PIN policy that could </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; differ from=20
  the policy of a server PIN.&nbsp; Anders provided the =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; following=20
  example, which is taken from another </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  standardization effort in the workings ("PKI for Web =
2.0"):</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; // The=20
  following is sent down to the client by the issuer:</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &lt;KeyGenerationRequest ...&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; // Request a=20
  key without PIN protection.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;RequestedKey ID=3D"Key.1" =
KeyUsage=3D"encryption"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;RSA=20
  KeySize=3D"2048"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
&lt;/KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/RequestedKey&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; // Request a=20
  set of keys with PIN protection.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; // The=20
  specified policy disallows 11122 but accepts 11223 // =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; 654321 would=20
  not be accepted either (sequence)</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;PINProtection Type=3D"numeric" MinLength=3D"5" =
MaxLength=3D"8"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  PatternRestrictions=3D"three-in-a-row&nbsp; =
sequences"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; // The next=20
  element is optional and is a way of grouping PINs </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; // so that=20
  the user either only has to specify a single PIN </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; // for a set=20
  of keys, or one unique PIN per key.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;PINGroupProtection=20
  Shared=3D"true"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;RequestedKey =
ID=3D"Key.2"=20
  KeyUsage=3D"signature"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
=20
  &lt;RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/RequestedKey&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;RequestedKey =
ID=3D"Key.3"=20
  KeyUsage=3D"authentication"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
=20
  &lt;RSA KeySize=3D"2048"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/KeyAlgorithmData&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/RequestedKey&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/PINGroupProtection&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/PINProtection&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &lt;/KeyGenerationRequest&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Your=20
  thoughts?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Andrea=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; -----Original=20
  Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; From: Philip=20
  Hoyer [<A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com">mailto:philip.hoyer@activi=
dentity.com</A>]</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Sent:=20
  Thursday, October 18, 2007 6:16 AM</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; To: Doherty,=20
  Andrea; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; =
keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Cc: M'Raihi,=20
  David; Bajaj,Siddharth; Johan Rydell</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Subject: RE:=20
  [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; to=20
  aclientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  Andrea,</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; You are right=20
  I have not addressed the Pin policy issue.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; I would like=20
  to though. </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Since you=20
  seem to have a good idea of the requirements would </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; you be able=20
  to help?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; I suggest we=20
  create a new type called PINPolicy that contains </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; the data=20
  required to be submitted.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; So currently=20
  PIN usage I can think of is:</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  -KEY_ACCESS_CHECK (this check the pin on the device to allow=20
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; access to a=20
  key for algorithms) -USED_IN_ALGO (used during </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  calculation)</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; When you talk=20
  though about length I already have that in the </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; &lt;Usage&gt;=20
  part of the PIN 'key' see below</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  NEW-&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key=20
  KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"&nbsp; =
KeyId=3D"12345678"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
=20
  &lt;ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" =
length=3D"4"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;MyFirstTokenInitialPIN&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></S=
PAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data=20
  Name=3D"SECRET"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;Value&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></=
P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;ValueDigest&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D&lt;/ValueDigest&gt;</FONT><=
/SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &lt;-NEW</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Also when we=20
  talk about server verified pins in otps are we </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; not really=20
  talking about the otp algo or usage here?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; I was=20
  wondering hence if our usage element for the otp key =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; should be=20
  augmented to contain and optional</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; &lt;UserPIN=20
  position=3D"APPEND/PREPEND"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; What do you=20
  think?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  Philip</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; -----Original=20
  Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; From:=20
  Doherty, Andrea [<A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:adoherty@rsa.com">mailto:adoherty@rsa.com</A>]</FONT></SPA=
N></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Sent:=20
  Thursday, October 18, 2007 1:28 AM</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; To: Philip=20
  Hoyer; KEYPROV Roundup Issue Tracker; =
keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Cc: Bajaj,=20
  Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Subject: RE:=20
  [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; to a=20
  clientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  Philip,</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; This looks ok=20
  except that a more complex PIN policy is needed </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; (refer to=20
  this comment I made to the previous version of the </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; PSKC draft,=20
  Section</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  5.1.7:</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; "Recommend=20
  that you allow for a more complex PIN policy, </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; esp., (a) how=20
  the PIN is to be used in the OTP calculation </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; (e.g.,=20
  concatenated vs.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; XOR's with=20
  the token code) and (b) PIN length. "</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; This doesn't=20
  seem to have been addressed yet based on </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; feedback to=20
  my review (see attached) and example below.&nbsp; What =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; is the status=20
  of this?&nbsp; </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  Andrea</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; -----Original=20
  Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; From: Philip=20
  Hoyer [<A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com">mailto:philip.hoyer@activi=
dentity.com</A>]</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Sent: Friday,=20
  September 28, 2007 11:48 AM</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; To: KEYPROV=20
  Roundup Issue Tracker; keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Cc: Bajaj,=20
  Siddharth; Johan Rydell; M'Raihi,David</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Subject: RE:=20
  [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; to a=20
  clientviaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  Gentlemen,</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Since PSKC=20
  will be used also to bulk provision from </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; manufacturing=20
  to a validation server and some of these </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; devices do=20
  have a PIN pad there is the concept of an initial =
PIN.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Since we have=20
  not yet defined how this initial PIN is </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; transmitted=20
  in the PSKC spec I would like to put forward a </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; proposal for=20
  inclusion in the spec for specifying the </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; transmission=20
  of PINs.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; The PIN is=20
  effectively another shared secret hence I propose </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; to treat it=20
  as a key in itself.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; This has the=20
  advantage that we can leverage the Usage part of </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; the schema=20
  that can define things like length and format </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; (alphanumeric=20
  etc). we also can set an expiry etc. It also </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; leverages the=20
  fact that the PIN itself will be encrypted in </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; transport in=20
  the same manner as other key material.</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; I hence=20
  propose to extend the KeyAlgorithmType with a new </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; type called=20
  'userPIN' (inline with the name used in the </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; access rules=20
  element already</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  present)</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; As an example=20
  a KeyContainer with a non encrypted HOTP key </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; and a 4 digit=20
  numeric PIN (please note that the value and </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; valuedigest=20
  are just copy and paste) ( I put the new section </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; with NEW-&gt;=20
  and &lt;-NEW lines before and</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  after):</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;?xml version=3D"1.0"=20
  encoding=3D"UTF-8"?&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;KeyContainer</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  xmlns=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  xmlns:logo=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:logo"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; xmlns:ds=3D"<A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig">http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmld=
sig</A>#"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; xmlns:xsi=3D"<A=20
  =
href=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-instance">http://www.w3.org/2001=
/XMLSchema-instance</A>"</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
xsi:schemaLocation=3D"urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:keyprov:container"</FONT></S=
PAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  .\keyprov_pskc_schema_v1.1.xsd" version=3D"1.1"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;EncryptionMethod=20
  algorithm=3D"NONE"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;DigestMethod=20
  algorithm=3D"HMAC-SHA1"&gt;&lt;/DigestMethod&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;DeviceId&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Manufacturer&gt;Token =
Manufacturer&lt;/Manufacturer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;SerialNo&gt;98765432187&lt;/SerialNo&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Expiry&gt;01/01/2008&lt;/Expiry&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/DeviceId&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key=20
  KeyAlgorithm=3D"HOTP"&nbsp; =
KeyId=3D"98765432187"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
=20
  &lt;ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" =
length=3D"6"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  NEW-&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;AccessRules userPIN=3D"true"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &lt;-NEW</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;MyFirstToken&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data=20
  Name=3D"SECRET"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;Value&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></=
P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;ValueDigest&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D&lt;/ValueDigest&gt;</FONT><=
/SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data=20
  Name=3D"COUNTER"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;Value&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></=
P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;ValueDigest&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D&lt;/ValueDigest&gt;</FONT><=
/SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  NEW-&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;Key=20
  KeyAlgorithm=3D"userPIN"&nbsp; =
KeyId=3D"12345678"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Issuer&gt;Credential Issuer&lt;/Issuer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
=20
  &lt;ResponseFormat format=3D"DECIMAL" =
length=3D"4"/&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Usage&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;FriendlyName&gt;MyFirstTokenInitialPIN&lt;/FriendlyName&gt;</FONT></S=
PAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;Data=20
  Name=3D"SECRET"&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;Value&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDMrUnc=3D&lt;/Value&gt;</FONT></SPAN></=
P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  =
size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;=20
  =
&lt;ValueDigest&gt;WldjTHZwRm9YTkhBRytseDM=3D&lt;/ValueDigest&gt;</FONT><=
/SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Data&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/Key&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  &lt;-NEW</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/Device&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New"=20
  size=3D2>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&lt;/KeyContainer&gt;</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Comments are=20
  welcome,</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  Philip</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; -----Original=20
  Message-----</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; From:=20
  Mingliang Pei [<A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.net">mailto:hannes.tschofenig@gmx.ne=
t</A>]</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Sent: Friday,=20
  September 21, 2007 9:58 AM</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; To:=20
  keyprov@ietf.org</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; Subject:=20
  [KEYPROV] [issue28] How to transfer initial PIN to a =
</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; client=20
  viaPSKC?</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; New=20
  submission from Mingliang Pei =
&lt;mpei@verisign.com&gt;:</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt;=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; PSKC provies=20
  support about carrying PIN usage policy. When </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; PIN is=20
  used,</FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; how do=20
  </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; you actually=20
  transfer the initial PIN using PSKC? Should PIN </FONT></SPAN></P>
  <P dir=3Dltr><SPAN lang=3Den-gb><FONT face=3D"Courier New" =
size=3D2>&gt; be=20
  treated</FONT></SPAN></P>
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Thread-Topic: Comments on DSKPP and alignment issues
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From: "Pei, Mingliang" <mpei@verisign.com>
To: "Philip Hoyer" <philip.hoyer@actividentity.com>,
	"Doherty, Andrea" <adoherty@rsa.com>,
	"Salah" <smachani@diversinet.com>, <magnus@rsa.com>
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We have resolved most alignment issues between DSKPP and PSKC. There are
a few minor issues to resolve.
=20
1. KeyType as an element in DSKPP vs. KeyType as a type for key in PSKC.
=20
Proposal:
=20
Change DSKPP KeyType to be KeyAlgorithm. Notice that the actual value of
KeyType matches the attribute KeyAlgorithm of PSKC KeyType.
=20
<xs:element name=3D"KeyType"
  type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/>
=20
<KeyProvClientHello ...>
 <SupportedKeyTypes>
  <Algorithm>http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP</Algorithm>
=20
<Algorithm>http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/otps/schemas/2005/09/otps-wst#Secu
rID-AES</Algorithm>
 </SupportedKeyTypes>
=20
<KeyProvServerHello ...>
  <KeyAlgorithm>http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP</KeyAlgorithm>
  <.../>
<KeyProvServerHello>
=20
become
=20
<xs:element name=3D"KeyAlgorithm"
  type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/>
=20
<KeyProvClientHello ...>
 <SupportedKeyAlgorithms>
  <Algorithm>http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP</Algorithm>
=20
<Algorithm>http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/otps/schemas/2005/09/otps-wst#Secu
rID-AES</Algorithm>
 </SupportedKeyAlgorithms>
=20
Comments?
=20
2. (new) For element name convention about IDs, DSKPP currently uses
"xxxID" (e.g. KeyID) while PSKC uses "xxxId" (e.g., KeyId). Which style
do you vote for?
=20
Please see inline for status on the others.
=20
Thanks,
=20
- Ming


=09
________________________________


	From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]=20
	Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 12:26 PM
	To: Doherty, Andrea; Pei, Mingliang; Salah; magnus@rsa.com
	Cc: Shuh
	Subject: Comments on DSKPP and alignment issues

	Hi Andrea and others,

	=20

	Please find below an analysis for alignment points between DSKPP
and PSKC and a long overdue comment on the draft itself.

	=20

	Please review and then I would like to agree on what we should
tackle for the next two releases of the respective specs, end of this
month and end of next month.

	=20

	Feel free to post to the mailing list, I was not sure that I
immediately should.

	=20

	Philip

	=20

	Alignment points

	=20

	1) KeyType

	DSKPP

	The type of symmetric cryptographic methods for which the key
will be used (e.g., OATH HOTP or RSA SecurID authentication, AES
encryption, etc.)

	=20

	PSKC

	The KeyType represents the key entity in the KeyContainer.

	=20

	MP: TBD

	=20

	2) Key Container

	DSKPP

	Key Container       =20

	An object that encapsulates a symmetric key and its
configuration data

	(DSKPP Key Container is effectively the PSKC KeyType)

	=20

	PSKC

	The KeyContainerType represents the key container entity.  A
Container MAY contain more than one Device entity; each Device entity
MAY contain more than one Key entity.

	=20

	MP: PSKC KeyContainer is used.

	=20

	3) VersionType

	DSKPP:

	<xs:simpleType name=3D"VersionType">

	     <xs:restriction base=3D"xs:string">

	       <xs:pattern value=3D"\d{1,2}\.\d{1,3}"/>

	     </xs:restriction>

	   </xs:simpleType>

	=20

	PSKC

	<simpleType name=3D"VersionType" final=3D"restriction">

	                        <restriction base=3D"string">

	                                    <pattern
value=3D"\d{1,9}\.\d{0,9}"/>

	                        </restriction>

	</simpleType>

	=20

	MP: DSKPP version type is adopted.

	=20

	4) AlgorithmsType

	=20

	MP: Use URI in both DSKPP and PSKC.

	=20

	5) KeyID

	DSKPP base64binary

	PSKC string

	=20

	MP: Use "string" type.

	=20

	COMMENTS:

	4.2.2

	            Key wrapping normally is intended as a generic
mechanism that can be used with symmetric and asymmetric keys. Is there
a reason for the distinction between Key Transport and Key Wrap? These
methods need alignment with the protection mechanism s in PSKC so for
example a pre-shared key label or index should be supported.

	=20

	Two Pass DSKPP

	What about a use case where DSKPP server does not generate the
keys itself but wants to provision Ks (obtained form a credential
provider) directly to the device without derivation. Do we support this?
The other use case of this is that a key K is generated inside an HSM
and then exported WRAPPED, this key would then need to be provisioned
via DSKPP to the device without other derivations.

	=20

	4.3.1.1 Unless the use of the private key of the certificate is
protected with a credential like a PIN this would not authenticate the
user but only be a proof of possession of the device

	=20

	4.3.1.3 What hash algorithms are supported, should we define
that certain algorithms MUST be supported? Can the client transmit which
algorithm was used in case more than one is supported?

	=20

	General comments about authentication section 4.3

	There is a lot of work and a proliferation of protocols that has
been done for mutual authentication in the smart card world for the
setup of secure channel mechanisms. Global platform SCP01 and SCP02 are
some examples. I suggest we take this into consideration.

	Matter of fact if one would think of piggy backing those ideas
the authentication would be multiple pass and result in a generation of
secure communication session keys that can be used by DSKPP to protect
the payload or used to generate the keys.

	=20

	It is not very clearly defined what authentication is mandated
(eg proof of possession of device) whereas the initial statement talks
about user authentication.

	=20

	4.5.2=20

	The k is mandated as 16 octets, in section 4.6 the example is:=20

	=20

	K_TOKEN =3D DSKPP-PRF (R_C, "Key generation" || k || R_S, dsLen)

	=20

	So R_C representing k MUST be 16 octets=20

	=20

	But section 4.2.1 we state:

	"Based on information contained in the <ServerHello> message,
the cryptographic module generates a random nonce, R_C. The
length of the nonce R_C may depend on the selected key type."

	=20

	=20

	4.8.1.1

	Should we use whitespace characters in the string inputted into
MAC, I suggest '_' is better than whitespace ' ' since whitespace can be
represented by ASCII 32 and extended ASCII 255. So I suggest using
'MAC_1_computation' Same for all strings used as input into MACs.

	=20

	=20

	4.8.2.1

	"Further, the server is REQUIRED to include an identifier, ID_S,
for itself (via the key container) in the <ServerFinished> message."

	The format for ID_S is not defined. Also if the container is
PSKC where should this be set?

	=20

	=20

	4.9.1 and 4.9.2

	In other protocol work we had both the concept of a unique
request id and the concept of the session id. If we think that DSKPP
could also be bound over non session protocols then being able to
specify that the response is the response for a specific (identified by
the request Id coming back) request can be very useful. Please see OTPS
ValidationService for an example.

	=20

	4.9.5

	Since there is an authentication protocol happening is
'AuthenticationDataInvalid' enough? Is there a need to distinguish
between ClientId not found and wrong one time authentication code?=20

	=20

	4.9.7

	If more than one module is connected to the client do we need
the ability to pass the module number and slot number here? Even if
optionally?

	=20

	4.9.12

	ClientId, if this can represent the user, it might be a DN as in
RFC 2253, hence the identifier restriction of 128 characters might be
too small.

	<AuthenticationCertificate> if this is only the certificate as
transmitted in ds:KeyInfoType one does not know if the certificate was
PIN protected eg proof of user being present or not.

	=20

	4.10.3

	<SupportedKeyContainers> since PSKC is mandated we could make
the PSKC URI the default value in the schema

	What about versioning of the PSKC, do we drive it via the URI or
explicitely? In case versioning is driven via URI should we mention it
in the text?

	=20

	=20

	=20

	=20

	________________________________

	=20

	=20

	Philip Hoyer=20

	=20

	Senior Architect - Office of CTO

	=20

	ActivIdentity (UK)

	109 Borough High Street

	London SE1 1NL

	=20

	Telephone: +44 (0) 20 7744 6248

	Direct: +44 (0) 20 7744 6455

	Fax: +44 (0) 20 7744 6249

	=20

	Private and confidential: This message and any attachments may
contain

	privileged / confidential information. If you are not an
intended recipient,

	you must not copy, distribute, discuss or take any action in
reliance on it.

	If you have received this communication in error, please notify
the sender

	and delete this message immediately.

	=20


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<BODY lang=3DEN-US vLink=3Dpurple link=3Dblue>
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<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>We have =
resolved most=20
alignment issues between DSKPP and PSKC. There are a few minor issues to =

resolve.</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>1. =
KeyType as an=20
element in DSKPP vs. KeyType as a type for key in=20
PSKC.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>Proposal:</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></=
DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>Change =
DSKPP KeyType=20
to be KeyAlgorithm. Notice that the actual value of KeyType matches the=20
attribute KeyAlgorithm of PSKC =
KeyType.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D492102622-26112007><STRONG>&lt;xs:element=20
name=3D"KeyType"<BR>&nbsp;=20
type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/&gt;</STRONG></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></S=
PAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>&lt;KeyProvClientHello=20
...&gt;</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></S=
PAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>&nbsp;&lt;SupportedKeyTypes&gt;<BR>&nbsp;=20
&lt;Algorithm&gt;http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP&lt;/Algorithm&gt;<=
BR>&nbsp;=20
&lt;Algorithm&gt;http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/otps/schemas/2005/09/otps-wst=
#SecurID-AES&lt;/Algorithm&gt;<BR>&nbsp;&lt;/SupportedKeyTypes&gt;</SPAN>=
</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D492102622-26112007>&lt;KeyProvServerHello=20
...&gt;<BR>&nbsp;=20
&lt;KeyAlgorithm&gt;http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP&lt;/KeyAlgorith=
m&gt;</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>&nbsp;=20
&lt;.../&gt;</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>&lt;KeyProvServerHello&gt;</SPAN></FONT></FONT=
></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>become</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D492102622-26112007><STRONG>&lt;xs:element=20
name=3D"KeyAlgorithm"<BR>&nbsp;=20
type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/&gt;</STRONG></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></S=
PAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN =
class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT><FONT><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D492102622-26112007>&lt;KeyProvClientHello=20
...&gt;</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>&nbsp;&lt;SupportedKeyAlgorithms&gt;<BR>&nbsp;=
=20
&lt;Algorithm&gt;http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP&lt;/Algorithm&gt;<=
BR>&nbsp;=20
&lt;Algorithm&gt;http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/otps/schemas/2005/09/otps-wst=
#SecurID-AES&lt;/Algorithm&gt;<BR>&nbsp;&lt;/SupportedKeyAlgorithms&gt;</=
SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2>C<SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>omments?</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></FONT></FO=
NT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>2. (new) =
</SPAN>For=20
element name convention about IDs, DSKPP currently uses "xxxID" (e.g. =
KeyID)=20
while PSKC uses "xxxId" (e.g., KeyId). Which style do you vote=20
for?</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>Please see inline=20
for status on the others.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>- Ming</FONT></SPAN></DIV></DIV><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
  <HR tabIndex=3D-1 align=3Dcenter width=3D"100%" SIZE=3D2>
  </SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV class=3DSection1>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><B><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
  face=3DTahoma size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Tahoma">=20
  <st1:PersonName w:st=3D"on">Philip Hoyer</st1:PersonName>=20
  [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com] <BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Thursday, September 20, =
2007 12:26=20
  PM<BR><B><SPAN style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> Doherty, =
Andrea; Pei,=20
  Mingliang; Salah; magnus@rsa.com<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Cc:</SPAN></B> Shuh<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Comments on DSKPP and =
alignment=20
  issues</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Hi Andrea and=20
  others,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Please find below an =
analysis for=20
  alignment points between DSKPP and PSKC and a long overdue comment on =
the=20
  draft itself.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Please review and then I =
would=20
  like to agree on what we should tackle for the next two releases of =
the=20
  respective specs, end of this month and end of next=20
  month.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Feel free to post to the =
mailing=20
  list, I was not sure that I immediately =
should.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Philip<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><B><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB =

  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></B></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><B><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB =

  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Alignment=20
  points<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></B></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">1)=20
  KeyType<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">DSKPP<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The type of symmetric=20
  cryptographic methods for which the key will be used (e.g., OATH HOTP =
or RSA=20
  SecurID authentication,=20
  =
AES&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;=20
  encryption, etc.)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">PSKC<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The KeyType represents =
the key=20
  entity in the KeyContainer.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007><FONT color=3D#0000ff>MP:=20
  TBD</FONT></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">2) Key=20
  Container<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">DSKPP<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Key=20
  Container&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">An object that =
encapsulates a=20
  symmetric key and its configuration data<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">(DSKPP Key Container is=20
  effectively the PSKC KeyType)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">PSKC<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The KeyContainerType =
represents=20
  the key container entity.&nbsp; A Container MAY contain more than one =
Device=20
  entity; each Device entity MAY contain more than one Key=20
  entity.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007><FONT color=3D#0000ff>MP: PSKC KeyContainer =
is=20
  used.</FONT></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">3)=20
  VersionType<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">DSKPP:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&lt;xs:simpleType=20
  name=3D"VersionType"&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =

  &lt;xs:restriction base=3D"xs:string"&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;xs:pattern =
value=3D"\d{1,2}\.\d{1,3}"/&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =

  &lt;/xs:restriction&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/xs:simpleType&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">PSKC<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&lt;simpleType =
name=3D"VersionType"=20
  final=3D"restriction"&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =

  &lt;restriction base=3D"string"&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;pattern =
value=3D"\d{1,9}\.\d{0,9}"/&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =

  &lt;/restriction&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&lt;/simpleType&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007>MP: DSKPP version type is=20
  adopted.</SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4)=20
  AlgorithmsType<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007>MP: Use URI in both DSKPP and=20
  PSKC.</SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">5)=20
  KeyID<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">DSKPP=20
  base64binary<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">PSKC=20
  string<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007>MP: Use "string" =
type.</SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><B><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB =

  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">COMMENTS:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></B></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.2.2<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
=20
  Key wrapping normally is intended as a generic mechanism that can be =
used with=20
  symmetric and asymmetric keys. Is there a reason for the distinction =
between=20
  Key Transport and Key Wrap? These methods need alignment with the =
protection=20
  mechanism s in PSKC so for example a pre-shared key label or index =
should be=20
  supported.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Two Pass=20
  DSKPP<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">What about a use case =
where DSKPP=20
  server does not generate the keys itself but wants to provision Ks =
(obtained=20
  form a credential provider) directly to the device without derivation. =
Do we=20
  support this? The other use case of this is that a key K is generated =
inside=20
  an HSM and then exported WRAPPED, this key would then need to be =
provisioned=20
  via DSKPP to the device without other=20
derivations.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4.3.1.1 Unless the use =
of the=20
  private key of the certificate is protected with a credential like a =
PIN this=20
  would not authenticate the user but only be a proof of possession of =
the=20
  device<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4.3.1.3 What hash =
algorithms are=20
  supported, should we define that certain algorithms MUST be supported? =
Can the=20
  client transmit which algorithm was used in case more than one is=20
  supported?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">General comments about=20
  authentication section 4.3<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">There is a lot of work =
and a=20
  proliferation of protocols that has been done for mutual =
authentication in the=20
  smart card world for the setup of secure channel mechanisms. Global =
platform=20
  SCP01 and SCP02 are some examples. I suggest we take this into=20
  consideration.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Matter of fact if one =
would think=20
  of piggy backing those ideas the authentication would be multiple pass =
and=20
  result in a generation of secure communication session keys that can =
be used=20
  by DSKPP to protect the payload or used to generate the=20
  keys.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">It is not very clearly =
defined=20
  what authentication is mandated (eg proof of possession of device) =
whereas the=20
  initial statement talks about user=20
authentication.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4.5.2=20
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The k is mandated as 16 =
octets, in=20
  section 4.6 the example is: <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">K_TOKEN =3D DSKPP-PRF =
(R_C, "Key=20
  generation" || k || R_S, dsLen)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">So R_C representing k =
MUST be 16=20
  octets <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">But section 4.2.1 we=20
  state:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&#8220;Based on =
information contained in=20
  the &lt;ServerHello&gt; message, the cryptographic module generates a =
random=20
  nonce, R_C. The&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; length =
of the=20
  nonce R_C may depend on the selected key =
type.&#8221;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.8.1.1<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Should we use whitespace =

  characters in the string inputted into MAC, I suggest &#8216;_&#8217; =
is better than=20
  whitespace &#8216; &#8216; since whitespace can be represented by =
ASCII 32 and extended=20
  ASCII 255. So I suggest using &#8216;MAC_1_computation&#8217; Same for =
all strings used as=20
  input into MACs.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.8.2.1<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&#8220;Further, the =
server is REQUIRED=20
  to include an identifier, ID_S, for itself (via the key container) in =
the=20
  &lt;ServerFinished&gt; message.&#8221;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The format for ID_S is =
not=20
  defined. Also if the container is PSKC where should this be=20
  set?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4.9.1 and=20
  4.9.2<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">In other protocol work =
we had both=20
  the concept of a unique request id and the concept of the session id. =
If we=20
  think that DSKPP could also be bound over non session protocols then =
being=20
  able to specify that the response is the response for a specific =
(identified=20
  by the request Id coming back) request can be very useful. Please see =
OTPS=20
  ValidationService for an example.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.9.5<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Since there is an =
authentication=20
  protocol happening is &#8216;AuthenticationDataInvalid&#8217; enough? =
Is there a need to=20
  distinguish between ClientId not found and wrong one time =
authentication code?=20
  <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.9.7<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">If more than one module =
is=20
  connected to the client do we need the ability to pass the module =
number and=20
  slot number here? Even if optionally?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.9.12<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">ClientId, if this can =
represent=20
  the user, it might be a DN as in RFC 2253, hence the identifier =
restriction of=20
  128 characters might be too small.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&lt;AuthenticationCertificate&gt;=20
  if this is only the certificate as transmitted in ds:KeyInfoType one =
does not=20
  know if the certificate was PIN protected eg proof of user being =
present or=20
  not.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.10.3<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&lt;SupportedKeyContainers&gt;=20
  since PSKC is mandated we could make the PSKC URI the default value in =
the=20
  schema<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">What about versioning of =
the PSKC,=20
  do we drive it via the URI or explicitely? In case versioning is =
driven via=20
  URI should we mention it in the text?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">________________________________<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
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Thread-Topic: PSKC wrapped key question
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Hi James,
=20
This is a good case that you raised where a target key isn't revealed to
the server with HSM.
=20
For your first question, I think that it should rely on client
authentication. The transport certificate in a request isn't sufficient
for this purpose, I think. Anyone would be able to request a key,
including MITM.
=20
For the second question, we are actually pending on making a change that
doesn't use the presence of a ValueDigest to indicate "isEncryped". It
isn't natural other than the HSM case you raised. One proposal is to add
an attribute in DataType to indicate whether it is encrypted. We defered
this change in the current version in consideration of possible adoption
of XMLEnc that wouldn't need this change.
=20
For PKCS#8 format that your HSM returns, do you mean standard PKCS#1
http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmlenc#rsa-1_5 wrapped 3DES key data?
Currently encryption algorithm type is anyURI; this should give
sufficient flexibility to specify an algorithm.
=20
- Ming


________________________________

	From: James Holland [mailto:james.holland@actividentity.com]=20
	Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 10:18 AM
	To: Pei, Mingliang
	Cc: Philip Hoyer; shuh.chang@gemalto.com; keyprov@ietf.org
	Subject: PSKC wrapped key question
=09
=09

	Hi Ming,

	=20

	                I am a colleague of Philip Hoyer and I have a
question about the mandatory digest of key material within the PSKC
document. The latest draft state: -

	=20

	5.1.1.  Data (OPTIONAL)

	=20

	   Defines the data attributes of the symmetric key.  Each is a
name

	   value pair which has both a base64 encoded value and a base
64

	   encoded ValueDigest.  The value can be encrypted.  If the
container

	   has been encrypted the ValueDigest MUST be populated with the
digest

	   of the unencrypted value.

	=20

	=20

	In our scenario we receive a request from a 3rd party to
generate a 3DES key in a HSM. In the request they pass a transport
certificate that has their public RSA key. With this public RSA key we
wrap the generated key for export to the requesting 3rd party. However,
as we never have the generated key in "plain" outside the HSM we cannot
generate a digest of the key material it to be put into the PSKC
document. The wrapped key is returned from the HSM in the  PSKC#8 format
which we return in the document.

	=20

	So, in this scenario,  a man in the middle attack my intercept
the request and return their own wrapped key within the document, as
they too have the transport key. What would you recommend as a possible
solution to this, if any?=20

	=20

	Also, in the scenario when there has been a key exchange
ceremony between the two parties, would this be a valid case for no
mandatory digest of the key material, with the wrapped key returned?

	=20

	=20

	=20

	Regards,

	=20

	James Holland
=09
=09

	Product Architect - ActivIdentity
=09
	Mob: +44 787 6197 626

	London Office Tel: +44 207 744 6460
	Skype on callto://hoggmania/ <callto://hoggmania/>=20

	=20

	P Think before you print

	=20

	The information contained in this email message may be
privileged, confidential and protected from disclosure. If you are not
the intended recipient, any dissemination, distribution or copying is
strictly prohibited. If you think that you have received this email
message in error, please notify the sender by reply email and delete the
message and any attachments.

	=20


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=09


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<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Hi James,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>This is a good case that you raised where a =
target key=20
isn't revealed to the server with HSM.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>For your first question, I think that it should =
rely on=20
client authentication. The transport certificate in a request isn't =
sufficient=20
for this purpose, I think. Anyone would be able to request a key, =
including=20
MITM.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>For the second question, we are actually =
pending on making=20
a change that doesn't use the presence of a ValueDigest to indicate=20
"isEncryped". It isn't natural other than the HSM case you raised. One =
proposal=20
is to add an attribute in DataType to indicate whether it is encrypted. =
We=20
defered this change in the current version in consideration of possible =
adoption=20
of XMLEnc that wouldn't need this change.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>For PKCS#8 format that your HSM returns, do you =
mean=20
standard PKCS#1 <A=20
href=3D"http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmlenc#rsa-1_5">http://www.w3.org/2001/=
04/xmlenc#rsa-1_5</A>&nbsp;wrapped=20
3DES key data? Currently encryption algorithm type is anyURI; this =
should give=20
sufficient flexibility to specify an algorithm.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D115004923-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>- Ming</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
  <HR tabIndex=3D-1>
  <FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> James Holland=20
  [mailto:james.holland@actividentity.com] <BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, =
November=20
  20, 2007 10:18 AM<BR><B>To:</B> Pei, Mingliang<BR><B>Cc:</B> Philip =
Hoyer;=20
  shuh.chang@gemalto.com; keyprov@ietf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> PSKC =
wrapped key=20
  question<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
  <DIV></DIV>
  <DIV class=3DSection1>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal>Hi Ming,<o:p></o:p></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></P>
  <P=20
  =
class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  I am a colleague of Philip Hoyer and I have a question about the =
mandatory=20
  digest of key material within the PSKC document. The latest draft =
state:=20
  -<o:p></o:p></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><I>5.1.1.&nbsp; Data =
(OPTIONAL)<o:p></o:p></I></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><I><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></I></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><I>&nbsp;&nbsp; Defines the data attributes of =
the=20
  symmetric key.&nbsp; Each is a name<o:p></o:p></I></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><I>&nbsp;&nbsp; value pair which has both a =
base64 encoded=20
  value and a base 64<o:p></o:p></I></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><I>&nbsp;&nbsp; encoded ValueDigest.&nbsp; The =
value can be=20
  encrypted.&nbsp; If the container<o:p></o:p></I></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><I>&nbsp;&nbsp; has been encrypted the =
ValueDigest MUST be=20
  populated with the digest<o:p></o:p></I></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><I>&nbsp;&nbsp; of the unencrypted=20
value.<o:p></o:p></I></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal>In our scenario we receive a request from a =
3<SUP>rd</SUP>=20
  party to generate a 3DES key in a HSM. In the request they pass a =
transport=20
  certificate that has their public RSA key. With this public RSA key we =
wrap=20
  the generated key for export to the requesting 3<SUP>rd</SUP> party. =
However,=20
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HSM we cannot=20
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document. The=20
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we=20
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  <P class=3DMsoNormal>So, in this scenario, &nbsp;a man in the middle =
attack my=20
  intercept the request and return their own wrapped key within the =
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  they too have the transport key. What would you recommend as a =
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mandatory=20
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From: "Doherty, Andrea" <andrea.doherty@rsa.com>
To: "Pei, Mingliang" <mpei@verisign.com>,
	"Philip Hoyer" <philip.hoyer@actividentity.com>,
	"Salah" <smachani@diversinet.com>, <magnus@rsa.com>
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Ming, regarding #1 (KeyType), below, it would be good to get feedback
from others.  KeyType is more commonly used, and I would argue that it
would be clearer to implementers than KeyAlgorithm in the context that
we are using it. =20
=20
For those who missed this before, here is a previous email exchange that
Ming and I had on this topic:=20
=20
In a previous email exchange, I raised the point that -=20

	            #7, KeyType: A Google search was done and there were
610,000 hits on keyType.  However, there were only 9 hits on
keyAlgorithmType, of which 7 are from PSKC.  keyAlgorithmType is a
common notation in several APIs including PKCS#11.  What other aspects
of keyTypes are there than the algorithm?  For EncryptionAlgorithm,
etc., one cannot just say "Encryption", but possibly could say
"EncryptionMechanism".  If that was the case, then wouldn't it make more
sense to say keyMechanismType?
=09
	        *  As a guiding principal, I think that it is important
that KEYPROV docs rely on commonly used, rather than homegrown, types.
=09

Ming responded that -=20

	    The google search result is interesting about KeyType.
However, the numbers cannot justify the choice though. One reason is
that KeyType itself can have multiple meanings while KeyAlgorithm is
more specific to our purpose.
=09
	* Key may be database primary key; so KeyType was used by some
for database index reference.
	* Key can be also used for a hash table. Then key type for a
hash table has more reference.
	* Our particular refernece is for a "secret".
=09
	In the first page of the google search result, the first two /
PKSC11 class KeyType is the main one related. The rest is mostly not
relevant to our meaning of key.
	Anyway, I do see your point, and like to get broad opinions.
KeyType is intuitive to mean what kind of key, and I don't see strong
reasons. KeyAlgorithm is more specific to algorithms associated with a
key. We have an issue that KeyType is used differently in DSKPP and PSKC
that we need to resolve for a best fit. In PSKC, KeyType is a type to
define a Key. Key has an attribute called KeyAlgorithm. If we look at
JCE, there is definition of Key class. The attribute is algorithm, not a
type. So it looks natural. In DSKPP, KeyType is an element instead. Let
us try to not use the same word in two types of keyprov docs. In DSKPP,
KeyType is actually a AlgorithmType. See ServerHello definition below.

	  <xs:complexType name=3D"ServerHelloPDU">...
	         <xs:sequence minOccurs=3D"0">
	           <xs:element name=3D"KeyType"
	             type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/>
	           <xs:element name=3D"EncryptionAlgorithm"
	             type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/>
	           <xs:element name=3D"MacAlgorithm"
	             type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/>
=09
	For this reason, it seems to be also natural to change KeyType
to KeyAlgorithm, similar to the existing EncryptionAlgorithm in the same
block of definition about ServerHello. I am open for another better
choice.

Andrea

________________________________

From: Pei, Mingliang [mailto:mpei@verisign.com]=20
Sent: Monday, November 26, 2007 5:47 PM
To: Philip Hoyer; Doherty, Andrea; Salah; magnus@rsa.com
Cc: Shuh; keyprov@ietf.org
Subject: RE: Comments on DSKPP and alignment issues


We have resolved most alignment issues between DSKPP and PSKC. There are
a few minor issues to resolve.
=20
1. KeyType as an element in DSKPP vs. KeyType as a type for key in PSKC.
=20
Proposal:
=20
Change DSKPP KeyType to be KeyAlgorithm. Notice that the actual value of
KeyType matches the attribute KeyAlgorithm of PSKC KeyType.
=20
<xs:element name=3D"KeyType"
  type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/>
=20
<KeyProvClientHello ...>
 <SupportedKeyTypes>
  <Algorithm>http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP</Algorithm>
=20
<Algorithm>http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/otps/schemas/2005/09/otps-wst#Secu
rID-AES</Algorithm>
 </SupportedKeyTypes>
=20
<KeyProvServerHello ...>
  <KeyAlgorithm>http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP</KeyAlgorithm>
  <.../>
<KeyProvServerHello>
=20
become
=20
<xs:element name=3D"KeyAlgorithm"
  type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/>
=20
<KeyProvClientHello ...>
 <SupportedKeyAlgorithms>
  <Algorithm>http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP</Algorithm>
=20
<Algorithm>http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/otps/schemas/2005/09/otps-wst#Secu
rID-AES</Algorithm>
 </SupportedKeyAlgorithms>
=20
Comments?
=20
2. (new) For element name convention about IDs, DSKPP currently uses
"xxxID" (e.g. KeyID) while PSKC uses "xxxId" (e.g., KeyId). Which style
do you vote for?
=20
Please see inline for status on the others.
=20
Thanks,
=20
- Ming


=09
________________________________


=09

	From: Philip Hoyer [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com]=20
	Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 12:26 PM
	To: Doherty, Andrea; Pei, Mingliang; Salah; magnus@rsa.com
	Cc: Shuh
	Subject: Comments on DSKPP and alignment issues

	Hi Andrea and others,

	=20

	Please find below an analysis for alignment points between DSKPP
and PSKC and a long overdue comment on the draft itself.

	=20

	Please review and then I would like to agree on what we should
tackle for the next two releases of the respective specs, end of this
month and end of next month.

	=20

	Feel free to post to the mailing list, I was not sure that I
immediately should.

	=20

	Philip

	=20

	Alignment points

	=20

	1) KeyType

	DSKPP

	The type of symmetric cryptographic methods for which the key
will be used (e.g., OATH HOTP or RSA SecurID authentication, AES
encryption, etc.)

	=20

	PSKC

	The KeyType represents the key entity in the KeyContainer.

	=20

	MP: TBD

	=20

	2) Key Container

	DSKPP

	Key Container       =20

	An object that encapsulates a symmetric key and its
configuration data

	(DSKPP Key Container is effectively the PSKC KeyType)

	=20

	PSKC

	The KeyContainerType represents the key container entity.  A
Container MAY contain more than one Device entity; each Device entity
MAY contain more than one Key entity.

	=20

	MP: PSKC KeyContainer is used.

	=20

	3) VersionType

	DSKPP:

	<xs:simpleType name=3D"VersionType">

	     <xs:restriction base=3D"xs:string">

	       <xs:pattern value=3D"\d{1,2}\.\d{1,3}"/>

	     </xs:restriction>

	   </xs:simpleType>

	=20

	PSKC

	<simpleType name=3D"VersionType" final=3D"restriction">

	                        <restriction base=3D"string">

	                                    <pattern
value=3D"\d{1,9}\.\d{0,9}"/>

	                        </restriction>

	</simpleType>

	=20

	MP: DSKPP version type is adopted.

	=20

	4) AlgorithmsType

	=20

	MP: Use URI in both DSKPP and PSKC.

	=20

	5) KeyID

	DSKPP base64binary

	PSKC string

	=20

	MP: Use "string" type.

	=20

	COMMENTS:

	4.2.2

	            Key wrapping normally is intended as a generic
mechanism that can be used with symmetric and asymmetric keys. Is there
a reason for the distinction between Key Transport and Key Wrap? These
methods need alignment with the protection mechanism s in PSKC so for
example a pre-shared key label or index should be supported.

	=20

	Two Pass DSKPP

	What about a use case where DSKPP server does not generate the
keys itself but wants to provision Ks (obtained form a credential
provider) directly to the device without derivation. Do we support this?
The other use case of this is that a key K is generated inside an HSM
and then exported WRAPPED, this key would then need to be provisioned
via DSKPP to the device without other derivations.

	=20

	4.3.1.1 Unless the use of the private key of the certificate is
protected with a credential like a PIN this would not authenticate the
user but only be a proof of possession of the device

	=20

	4.3.1.3 What hash algorithms are supported, should we define
that certain algorithms MUST be supported? Can the client transmit which
algorithm was used in case more than one is supported?

	=20

	General comments about authentication section 4.3

	There is a lot of work and a proliferation of protocols that has
been done for mutual authentication in the smart card world for the
setup of secure channel mechanisms. Global platform SCP01 and SCP02 are
some examples. I suggest we take this into consideration.

	Matter of fact if one would think of piggy backing those ideas
the authentication would be multiple pass and result in a generation of
secure communication session keys that can be used by DSKPP to protect
the payload or used to generate the keys.

	=20

	It is not very clearly defined what authentication is mandated
(eg proof of possession of device) whereas the initial statement talks
about user authentication.

	=20

	4.5.2=20

	The k is mandated as 16 octets, in section 4.6 the example is:=20

	=20

	K_TOKEN =3D DSKPP-PRF (R_C, "Key generation" || k || R_S, dsLen)

	=20

	So R_C representing k MUST be 16 octets=20

	=20

	But section 4.2.1 we state:

	"Based on information contained in the <ServerHello> message,
the cryptographic module generates a random nonce, R_C. The
length of the nonce R_C may depend on the selected key type."

	=20

	=20

	4.8.1.1

	Should we use whitespace characters in the string inputted into
MAC, I suggest '_' is better than whitespace ' ' since whitespace can be
represented by ASCII 32 and extended ASCII 255. So I suggest using
'MAC_1_computation' Same for all strings used as input into MACs.

	=20

	=20

	4.8.2.1

	"Further, the server is REQUIRED to include an identifier, ID_S,
for itself (via the key container) in the <ServerFinished> message."

	The format for ID_S is not defined. Also if the container is
PSKC where should this be set?

	=20

	=20

	4.9.1 and 4.9.2

	In other protocol work we had both the concept of a unique
request id and the concept of the session id. If we think that DSKPP
could also be bound over non session protocols then being able to
specify that the response is the response for a specific (identified by
the request Id coming back) request can be very useful. Please see OTPS
ValidationService for an example.

	=20

	4.9.5

	Since there is an authentication protocol happening is
'AuthenticationDataInvalid' enough? Is there a need to distinguish
between ClientId not found and wrong one time authentication code?=20

	=20

	4.9.7

	If more than one module is connected to the client do we need
the ability to pass the module number and slot number here? Even if
optionally?

	=20

	4.9.12

	ClientId, if this can represent the user, it might be a DN as in
RFC 2253, hence the identifier restriction of 128 characters might be
too small.

	<AuthenticationCertificate> if this is only the certificate as
transmitted in ds:KeyInfoType one does not know if the certificate was
PIN protected eg proof of user being present or not.

	=20

	4.10.3

	<SupportedKeyContainers> since PSKC is mandated we could make
the PSKC URI the default value in the schema

	What about versioning of the PSKC, do we drive it via the URI or
explicitely? In case versioning is driven via URI should we mention it
in the text?

	=20

	=20

	=20

	=20

	________________________________

	=20

	=20

	Philip Hoyer=20

	=20

	Senior Architect - Office of CTO

	=20

	ActivIdentity (UK)

	109 Borough High Street

	London SE1 1NL

	=20

	Telephone: +44 (0) 20 7744 6248

	Direct: +44 (0) 20 7744 6455

	Fax: +44 (0) 20 7744 6249

	=20

	Private and confidential: This message and any attachments may
contain

	privileged / confidential information. If you are not an
intended recipient,

	you must not copy, distribute, discuss or take any action in
reliance on it.

	If you have received this communication in error, please notify
the sender

	and delete this message immediately.

	=20


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<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial><FONT size=3D2><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><SPAN=20
class=3D083473515-27112007>Ming, </SPAN><SPAN =
class=3D083473515-27112007>regarding=20
</SPAN><SPAN class=3D083473515-27112007>#1 (KeyType), below, it would be =
good to=20
get feedback from others.&nbsp; KeyType is more commonly used, and I =
would argue=20
that it would be clearer to implementers than KeyAlgorithm in the =
context that=20
we are using it.&nbsp; </SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial><FONT size=3D2><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><SPAN=20
class=3D083473515-27112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial><FONT size=3D2><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><SPAN=20
class=3D083473515-27112007>For those who missed this before, here is a =
previous=20
email exchange that Ming and I had on this topic:=20
</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D083473515-27112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D083473515-27112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>In a previous email exchange, I raised the =
point that -=20
</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN=20
  =
class=3D083473515-27112007>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  #7, KeyType: A Google search was done and there were 610,000 hits on=20
  keyType.&nbsp; However, there were only 9 hits on keyAlgorithmType, of =
which 7=20
  are from PSKC.&nbsp; keyAlgorithmType is a common notation in several =
APIs=20
  including PKCS#11.&nbsp; What other aspects of keyTypes are there than =
the=20
  algorithm?&nbsp; For EncryptionAlgorithm, etc., one cannot just say=20
  "Encryption", but possibly could say "EncryptionMechanism".&nbsp; If =
that was=20
  the case, then wouldn't it make more sense to say=20
  keyMechanismType?<BR><BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  *&nbsp;&nbsp;As a guiding principal, I think that it is important that =
KEYPROV=20
  docs rely on commonly used, rather than homegrown, =
types.<BR></SPAN><SPAN=20
  class=3D083473515-27112007></SPAN></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D083473515-27112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Ming&nbsp;responded that - </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr style=3D"MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN =
class=3D083473515-27112007>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; The=20
  google search result is interesting about KeyType. However, the =
numbers cannot=20
  justify the choice though. One reason is that KeyType itself can have =
multiple=20
  meanings while KeyAlgorithm is more specific to our purpose.<BR><BR>* =
Key may=20
  be database primary key; so KeyType was used by some for database =
index=20
  reference.<BR>* Key can be also used for a hash table. Then key type =
for a=20
  hash table has more reference.<BR>* Our particular refernece is for a=20
  "secret".<BR><BR>In the first page of the google search result, the =
first two=20
  / PKSC11 class KeyType is the main one related. The rest is mostly not =

  relevant to our meaning of key.<BR>Anyway, I do see your point, and =
like to=20
  get broad opinions. KeyType is intuitive to mean what kind of key, and =
I don't=20
  see strong reasons. KeyAlgorithm is more specific to algorithms =
associated=20
  with a key. We have an issue that KeyType is used differently in DSKPP =
and=20
  PSKC that we need to resolve for a best fit. In PSKC, KeyType is a =
type to=20
  define a Key. Key has an attribute called KeyAlgorithm. If we look at =
JCE,=20
  there is definition of Key class. The attribute is algorithm, not a =
type. So=20
  it looks natural. <FONT size=3D2><FONT size=3D3>In DSKPP, KeyType is =
an element=20
  instead. Let us try to not use the same word in two types of keyprov =
docs. In=20
  DSKPP, KeyType is actually a AlgorithmType. See ServerHello definition =

  below.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
  <P dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT size=3D2><FONT size=3D3>&nbsp; =
&lt;xs:complexType=20
  name=3D"ServerHelloPDU"&gt;</FONT></FONT><FONT size=3D2><FONT=20
  size=3D3>...<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <FONT =

  color=3D#ff0000><FONT color=3D#000000>&lt;xs:sequence=20
  =
minOccurs=3D"0"&gt;<BR></FONT><STRONG>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;xs:element=20
  =
name=3D"KeyType"<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/&gt;<BR></STRONG></FONT><STRONG>&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  </STRONG><FONT color=3D#00ff00><STRONG>&lt;xs:element=20
  name=3D"EncryptionAlgorithm"<BR></STRONG></FONT><FONT=20
  =
color=3D#00ff00>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  =
<STRONG>type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/&gt;</STRONG><BR></FONT>&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;xs:element=20
  =
name=3D"MacAlgorithm"<BR>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/&gt;<BR><BR>For this reason, it seems to =
be also=20
  natural to change KeyType to KeyAlgorithm, similar to the existing=20
  EncryptionAlgorithm in the same block of definition about ServerHello. =
I am=20
  open for another better =
choice.</FONT></FONT></P></BLOCKQUOTE></SPAN><SPAN=20
class=3D083473515-27112007></SPAN><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
size=3D2><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff>Andrea<SPAN=20
class=3D083473515-27112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT><BR>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> Pei, Mingliang =
[mailto:mpei@verisign.com]=20
<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, November 26, 2007 5:47 PM<BR><B>To:</B> Philip =
Hoyer;=20
Doherty, Andrea; Salah; magnus@rsa.com<BR><B>Cc:</B> Shuh;=20
keyprov@ietf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: Comments on DSKPP and alignment=20
issues<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>We have =
resolved most=20
alignment issues between DSKPP and PSKC. There are a few minor issues to =

resolve.</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>1. =
KeyType as an=20
element in DSKPP vs. KeyType as a type for key in=20
PSKC.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>Proposal:</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></=
DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>Change =
DSKPP KeyType=20
to be KeyAlgorithm. Notice that the actual value of KeyType matches the=20
attribute KeyAlgorithm of PSKC =
KeyType.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D492102622-26112007><STRONG>&lt;xs:element=20
name=3D"KeyType"<BR>&nbsp;=20
type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/&gt;</STRONG></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></S=
PAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>&lt;KeyProvClientHello=20
...&gt;</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></S=
PAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>&nbsp;&lt;SupportedKeyTypes&gt;<BR>&nbsp;=20
&lt;Algorithm&gt;http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP&lt;/Algorithm&gt;<=
BR>&nbsp;=20
&lt;Algorithm&gt;http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/otps/schemas/2005/09/otps-wst=
#SecurID-AES&lt;/Algorithm&gt;<BR>&nbsp;&lt;/SupportedKeyTypes&gt;</SPAN>=
</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D492102622-26112007>&lt;KeyProvServerHello=20
...&gt;<BR>&nbsp;=20
&lt;KeyAlgorithm&gt;http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP&lt;/KeyAlgorith=
m&gt;</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>&nbsp;=20
&lt;.../&gt;</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>&lt;KeyProvServerHello&gt;</SPAN></FONT></FONT=
></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>become</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D492102622-26112007><STRONG>&lt;xs:element=20
name=3D"KeyAlgorithm"<BR>&nbsp;=20
type=3D"dskpp:AlgorithmType"/&gt;</STRONG></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></S=
PAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV=
>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
size=3D+0><FONT=20
size=3D+0><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN =
class=3D492102622-26112007>&lt;KeyProvClientHello=20
...&gt;</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>&nbsp;&lt;SupportedKeyAlgorithms&gt;<BR>&nbsp;=
=20
&lt;Algorithm&gt;http://www.ietf.org/keyprov/pskc#HOTP&lt;/Algorithm&gt;<=
BR>&nbsp;=20
&lt;Algorithm&gt;http://www.rsa.com/rsalabs/otps/schemas/2005/09/otps-wst=
#SecurID-AES&lt;/Algorithm&gt;<BR>&nbsp;&lt;/SupportedKeyAlgorithms&gt;</=
SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2>C<SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007>omments?</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT face=3DArial><FONT =
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></FONT></FO=
NT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2><SPAN class=3D492102622-26112007>2. (new) =
</SPAN>For=20
element name convention about IDs, DSKPP currently uses "xxxID" (e.g. =
KeyID)=20
while PSKC uses "xxxId" (e.g., KeyId). Which style do you vote=20
for?</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2></FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff =
size=3D2>Please see inline=20
for status on the others.</FONT></SPAN></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><SPAN=20
class=3D492102622-26112007><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff=20
size=3D2></FONT></SPAN></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial><FONT=20
color=3D#0000ff><FONT size=3D2>Thanks,</FONT></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D437481922-26112007><FONT =
face=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>- Ming</FONT></SPAN></DIV></DIV><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=3Dltr=20
style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Times New Roman" size=3D3><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
  <HR tabIndex=3D-1 align=3Dcenter width=3D"100%" SIZE=3D2>
  </SPAN></FONT>
  <P></P></DIV>
  <DIV class=3DSection1>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal style=3D"MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><B><FONT =
face=3DTahoma=20
  size=3D2><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT=20
  face=3DTahoma size=3D2><SPAN style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Tahoma">=20
  <st1:PersonName w:st=3D"on">Philip Hoyer</st1:PersonName>=20
  [mailto:philip.hoyer@actividentity.com] <BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Thursday, September 20, =
2007 12:26=20
  PM<BR><B><SPAN style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> Doherty, =
Andrea; Pei,=20
  Mingliang; Salah; magnus@rsa.com<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Cc:</SPAN></B> Shuh<BR><B><SPAN=20
  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Comments on DSKPP and =
alignment=20
  issues</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Hi Andrea and=20
  others,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Please find below an =
analysis for=20
  alignment points between DSKPP and PSKC and a long overdue comment on =
the=20
  draft itself.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Please review and then I =
would=20
  like to agree on what we should tackle for the next two releases of =
the=20
  respective specs, end of this month and end of next=20
  month.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Feel free to post to the =
mailing=20
  list, I was not sure that I immediately =
should.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Philip<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><B><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB =

  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></B></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><B><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB =

  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">Alignment=20
  points<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></B></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">1)=20
  KeyType<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">DSKPP<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The type of symmetric=20
  cryptographic methods for which the key will be used (e.g., OATH HOTP =
or RSA=20
  SecurID authentication,=20
  =
AES&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;=20
  encryption, etc.)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">PSKC<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The KeyType represents =
the key=20
  entity in the KeyContainer.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007><FONT color=3D#0000ff>MP:=20
  TBD</FONT></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">2) Key=20
  Container<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">DSKPP<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Key=20
  Container&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">An object that =
encapsulates a=20
  symmetric key and its configuration data<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">(DSKPP Key Container is=20
  effectively the PSKC KeyType)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">PSKC<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The KeyContainerType =
represents=20
  the key container entity.&nbsp; A Container MAY contain more than one =
Device=20
  entity; each Device entity MAY contain more than one Key=20
  entity.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007><FONT color=3D#0000ff>MP: PSKC KeyContainer =
is=20
  used.</FONT></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">3)=20
  VersionType<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">DSKPP:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&lt;xs:simpleType=20
  name=3D"VersionType"&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =

  &lt;xs:restriction base=3D"xs:string"&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;xs:pattern =
value=3D"\d{1,2}\.\d{1,3}"/&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =

  &lt;/xs:restriction&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;/xs:simpleType&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">PSKC<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&lt;simpleType =
name=3D"VersionType"=20
  final=3D"restriction"&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =

  &lt;restriction base=3D"string"&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=20
  &lt;pattern =
value=3D"\d{1,9}\.\d{0,9}"/&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =

  &lt;/restriction&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&lt;/simpleType&gt;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007>MP: DSKPP version type is=20
  adopted.</SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4)=20
  AlgorithmsType<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007>MP: Use URI in both DSKPP and=20
  PSKC.</SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">5)=20
  KeyID<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">DSKPP=20
  base64binary<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">PSKC=20
  string<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007>MP: Use "string" =
type.</SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT color=3D#0000ff><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p><SPAN=20
  class=3D492102622-26112007></SPAN></o:p></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><B><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB =

  style=3D"FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">COMMENTS:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></B></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.2.2<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
=20
  Key wrapping normally is intended as a generic mechanism that can be =
used with=20
  symmetric and asymmetric keys. Is there a reason for the distinction =
between=20
  Key Transport and Key Wrap? These methods need alignment with the =
protection=20
  mechanism s in PSKC so for example a pre-shared key label or index =
should be=20
  supported.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Two Pass=20
  DSKPP<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">What about a use case =
where DSKPP=20
  server does not generate the keys itself but wants to provision Ks =
(obtained=20
  form a credential provider) directly to the device without derivation. =
Do we=20
  support this? The other use case of this is that a key K is generated =
inside=20
  an HSM and then exported WRAPPED, this key would then need to be =
provisioned=20
  via DSKPP to the device without other=20
derivations.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4.3.1.1 Unless the use =
of the=20
  private key of the certificate is protected with a credential like a =
PIN this=20
  would not authenticate the user but only be a proof of possession of =
the=20
  device<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4.3.1.3 What hash =
algorithms are=20
  supported, should we define that certain algorithms MUST be supported? =
Can the=20
  client transmit which algorithm was used in case more than one is=20
  supported?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">General comments about=20
  authentication section 4.3<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">There is a lot of work =
and a=20
  proliferation of protocols that has been done for mutual =
authentication in the=20
  smart card world for the setup of secure channel mechanisms. Global =
platform=20
  SCP01 and SCP02 are some examples. I suggest we take this into=20
  consideration.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Matter of fact if one =
would think=20
  of piggy backing those ideas the authentication would be multiple pass =
and=20
  result in a generation of secure communication session keys that can =
be used=20
  by DSKPP to protect the payload or used to generate the=20
  keys.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">It is not very clearly =
defined=20
  what authentication is mandated (eg proof of possession of device) =
whereas the=20
  initial statement talks about user=20
authentication.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4.5.2=20
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The k is mandated as 16 =
octets, in=20
  section 4.6 the example is: <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">K_TOKEN =3D DSKPP-PRF =
(R_C, "Key=20
  generation" || k || R_S, dsLen)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">So R_C representing k =
MUST be 16=20
  octets <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">But section 4.2.1 we=20
  state:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&#8220;Based on =
information contained in=20
  the &lt;ServerHello&gt; message, the cryptographic module generates a =
random=20
  nonce, R_C. The&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; length =
of the=20
  nonce R_C may depend on the selected key =
type.&#8221;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.8.1.1<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Should we use whitespace =

  characters in the string inputted into MAC, I suggest &#8216;_&#8217; =
is better than=20
  whitespace &#8216; &#8216; since whitespace can be represented by =
ASCII 32 and extended=20
  ASCII 255. So I suggest using &#8216;MAC_1_computation&#8217; Same for =
all strings used as=20
  input into MACs.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.8.2.1<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&#8220;Further, the =
server is REQUIRED=20
  to include an identifier, ID_S, for itself (via the key container) in =
the=20
  &lt;ServerFinished&gt; message.&#8221;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The format for ID_S is =
not=20
  defined. Also if the container is PSKC where should this be=20
  set?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">4.9.1 and=20
  4.9.2<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">In other protocol work =
we had both=20
  the concept of a unique request id and the concept of the session id. =
If we=20
  think that DSKPP could also be bound over non session protocols then =
being=20
  able to specify that the response is the response for a specific =
(identified=20
  by the request Id coming back) request can be very useful. Please see =
OTPS=20
  ValidationService for an example.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.9.5<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Since there is an =
authentication=20
  protocol happening is &#8216;AuthenticationDataInvalid&#8217; enough? =
Is there a need to=20
  distinguish between ClientId not found and wrong one time =
authentication code?=20
  <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.9.7<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">If more than one module =
is=20
  connected to the client do we need the ability to pass the module =
number and=20
  slot number here? Even if optionally?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.9.12<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">ClientId, if this can =
represent=20
  the user, it might be a DN as in RFC 2253, hence the identifier =
restriction of=20
  128 characters might be too small.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&lt;AuthenticationCertificate&gt;=20
  if this is only the certificate as transmitted in ds:KeyInfoType one =
does not=20
  know if the certificate was PIN protected eg proof of user being =
present or=20
  not.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">4.10.3<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial">&lt;SupportedKeyContainers&gt;=20
  since PSKC is mandated we could make the PSKC URI the default value in =
the=20
  schema<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">What about versioning of =
the PSKC,=20
  do we drive it via the URI or explicitely? In case versioning is =
driven via=20
  URI should we mention it in the text?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: =
Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
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  <P class=3DMsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st=3D"on"><FONT face=3D"Courier =
New"=20
  size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">Philip=20
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size=3D2><SPAN=20
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lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">Senior Architect =
- Office=20
  of CTO<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">ActivIdentity =
(<st1:place=20
  w:st=3D"on"><st1:country-region=20
  =
w:st=3D"on">UK</st1:country-region></st1:place>)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT>=
</P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><st1:Street w:st=3D"on"><st1:address =
w:st=3D"on"><FONT=20
  face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
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New"=20
  size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
New'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><st1:place w:st=3D"on"><st1:City =
w:st=3D"on"><FONT=20
  face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN lang=3DEN-GB=20
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  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
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  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">Telephone: +44 =
(0) 20 7744=20
  6248<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">Direct: +44 (0) =
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  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier New'">Fax: +44 (0) 20 =
7744=20
  6249<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
  style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Courier =
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  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
lang=3DEN-GB=20
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  <P class=3DMsoNormal><FONT face=3D"Courier New" size=3D2><SPAN =
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_______________________________________________
KEYPROV mailing list
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To: <mpei@verisign.com>, "Salah Machani" <SMachani@DIVERSINET.COM>,
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Attendees:

Ming Pei, Hannes Tschofenig, Salah Macchani, Phillip Hallam-Baker,
Philip Hoyer

=20

Issues to discuss at IETF meeting 3rd of December:

*	Xmlenc/xmldsig usage

	*	Salah did couple of tests in terms of hierarchy in terms
of supporting on mobile phones (without signature) and it was ok. Salah
in general ok with proposal. [Salah to capture issues].
	*	[Ming to review proposal and add comments on slide]
	*	Profiling the use of algorithms because of move to URIs=20
	*	PHB small preference for not using xmlenc because of
need of profiling. But on the other hand if things need to be done later
we could ride on that instead of extending keyprov.

*	PINPolicy=20
*	What about keyTemplate (have attributes) [Ming] agrees on Usage
PINPolicy, helps mostly for bulk, but size is not that critical. Nice to
have. Not necessary for single key. Not needed to present at IETF.
*	URI for algorithms especially specific ones. ACTION Philip
Hallam Baker to send slide content to Ming
*	Alignment of attributes between PSKC and ASN.1 spec. ACTION
Hannes to look at the issue. Philip's suggestion was to put the
definition in a specific section of PSKC spec referenced from ASN.1
spec.
*	Logotype how do we proceed=20

=20

Slides [Ming to collate]:[PHB] no specific format.[Hannes to upload]
first draft COB Wednesday.

*	Highlight with status update=20
*	Xmlenc/xmldsig [PH] to create draft [Ming to add and Salah to
review] =20
*	PINPolicy [PH] mention that this is being used in field
*	Ming to create slide of outstanding issues
*	Draft of profile for minimum algorithm support [Ming]
*	Logo type [Ming]

=20

ACTION: Ming to chat with Magnus, Andrea, Russ on the core issues we
need to make a conclusion on. Hannes to send mail with names.

=20

=20

________________________________

=20

Philip Hoyer=20

=20

Senior Architect - Office of CTO

=20

ActivIdentity (UK)

109 Borough High Street

London SE1 1NL

=20

Telephone: +44 (0) 20 7744 6248

Direct: +44 (0) 20 7744 6455

Fax: +44 (0) 20 7744 6249

=20

Private and confidential: This message and any attachments may contain

privileged / confidential information. If you are not an intended
recipient,

you must not copy, distribute, discuss or take any action in reliance on
it.

If you have received this communication in error, please notify the
sender

and delete this message immediately.

=20


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<body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue vlink=3Dpurple>

<div class=3DSection1>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Attendees:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:place w:st=3D"on"><st1:City w:st=3D"on"><font =
size=3D2
  face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Ming</span></font></st1:City=
><font
 size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>
 <st1:State w:st=3D"on">Pei</st1:State></span></font></st1:place><font =
size=3D2
face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>, Hannes
Tschofenig, Salah Macchani, Phillip Hallam-Baker, <st1:PersonName =
w:st=3D"on">Philip
 Hoyer</st1:PersonName><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Issues to discuss at IETF meeting =
3<sup>rd</sup> of
December:<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<ul style=3D'margin-top:0pt' type=3Ddisc>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Xmlenc/xmldsig =
usage<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <ul style=3D'margin-top:0pt' type=3Dcircle>
  <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level2 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
      lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Salah =
did couple of
      tests in terms of hierarchy in terms of supporting on mobile =
phones
      (without signature) and it was ok. Salah in general ok with =
proposal.
      [Salah to capture issues].<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
  <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level2 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
      lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>[Ming to =
review
      proposal and add comments on slide]<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
  <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level2 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
      lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Profiling the use
      of algorithms because of move to URIs =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
  <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level2 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
      lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>PHB =
small
      preference for not using xmlenc because of need of profiling. But =
on the
      other hand if things need to be done later we could ride on that =
instead
      of extending keyprov.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 </ul>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>PINPolicy =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>What =
about
     keyTemplate (have attributes) [Ming] agrees on Usage PINPolicy, =
helps
     mostly for bulk, but size is not that critical. Nice to have. Not
     necessary for single key. Not needed to present at =
IETF.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>URI for =
algorithms
     especially specific ones. ACTION Philip Hallam Baker to send slide =
content
     to Ming<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Alignment =
of
     attributes between PSKC and ASN.1 spec. ACTION Hannes to look at =
the issue.
     Philip&#8217;s suggestion was to put the definition in a specific =
section
     of PSKC spec referenced from ASN.1 =
spec.<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l3 level1 lfo3'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Logotype =
how do we
     proceed <o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
</ul>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Slides [Ming to collate]:[PHB] no specific
format.[Hannes to upload] first draft COB =
Wednesday.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<ul style=3D'margin-top:0pt' type=3Ddisc>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo6'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Highlight =
with
     status update <o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo6'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Xmlenc/xmldsig [PH]
     to create draft [Ming to add and Salah to review]&nbsp; =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo6'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>PINPolicy =
[PH]
     mention that this is being used in =
field<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo6'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Ming to =
create slide
     of outstanding issues<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo6'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Draft of =
profile for
     minimum algorithm support [Ming]<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
 <li class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-list:l1 level1 lfo6'><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
     lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>Logo type =
[Ming]<o:p></o:p></span></font></li>
</ul>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'>ACTION: Ming to chat with Magnus, Andrea, Russ =
on the
core issues we need to make a conclusion on. Hannes to send mail with =
names.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:
10.0pt;font-family:Arial'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>________________________________<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:PersonName w:st=3D"on"><font size=3D2 =
face=3D"Courier New"><span
 lang=3DEN-GB style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>Philip Hoyer</span></font></st1:PersonName><font
size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Senior Architect - =
Office of
CTO<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>ActivIdentity =
(<st1:country-region
w:st=3D"on"><st1:place =
w:st=3D"on">UK</st1:place></st1:country-region>)<o:p></o:p></span></font>=
</p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:Street w:st=3D"on"><st1:address =
w:st=3D"on"><font size=3D2
  face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>109
  Borough High Street</span></font></st1:address></st1:Street><font =
size=3D2
face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><st1:City w:st=3D"on"><st1:place w:st=3D"on"><font =
size=3D2
  face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'>London</span></font></st1:place></st1:City><font
size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span lang=3DEN-GB =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:
"Courier New"'> SE1 1NL<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Telephone: +44 (0) =
20 7744
6248<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Direct: +44 (0) 20 =
7744 6455<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Fax: +44 (0) 20 =
7744 6249<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>Private and =
confidential:
This message and any attachments may =
contain<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>privileged / =
confidential
information. If you are not an intended =
recipient,<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>you must not copy,
distribute, discuss or take any action in reliance on =
it.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>If you have =
received this
communication in error, please notify the =
sender<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New"'>and delete this =
message
immediately.</span></font><font size=3D2 face=3D"Courier New"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier =
New"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>

<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
lang=3DEN-GB
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></font></p>

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Hi all,

I read through draft-ietf-keyprov-portable-symmetric-key-container-02.txt.
I have a couple of comments.

* There are a couple of editorial issues but I will provide them to the 
authors offline.

* Structure of the document

I believe the structure and presentation of the document could be 
improved by re-arranging
sections and paragraphs it a bit.

Proposal for a modified ToC:

 o Introduction
 o Terminology
 o Use Cases
 o Requirements
 o Key Container
 
 [This is the part that is a bit tricky since you want to describe the 
data model in a way
  that the reader actually understands it. You would have to describe 
all attributes and
  elements in this section but the presentation style needs some 
discussion. ]
 
    o Introduction
      This section starts with the high-level overview of the structure 
of the key container.
      There is text to re-use already in Section 6 (and the 
corresponding figure as well.)
      This text would, for example, indicate  
       * what is the semantic if there are multiple <EncryptionMethod> 
elements within the <KeyContainer> element
       * what is the semantic if there are multiple <Device> elements 
within the <KeyContainer> element
      The text about the <KeyContainer> element is already in Section 6.4.1.
    o Device Element
      Text from Section 5.1 goes in here.
      The <DeviceId>, <Key> and <User> elements are child elements of 
the <device> element.
    o EncryptionMethod Element
      Text from Section 5.1.8 (and Section 6.1.7) goes in here.
    o DigestMethod Element
      Text from Section 5.1.9 (and Section 6.1.8) goes in here.
    o Signature Element
 o XML Schema
 o Security Considerations
 o IANA Considerations
 o References
      
 
 * Why is the <user> element a child element of the <device> element?
   Looking at the figure in Section 6 one would rather get the 
impression that the <user> element
   is a child element of the <KeyContainer> element that happens to have 
a relationship to the
   <device> element.
 * The <data> element is a bit strange. It is the attempt to map a TLV 
or AVP into XML.
   Here is an example (code snippet):

     <Data Name="COUNTER">
        <Value>AAAAAAAAAAA=</Value>
     </Data>

   Depending on the setting of the 'Name' attribute the value is 
interpreted in a different fashion.
   This is a somewhat strange usage of XML. Why don't you just define a 
new type that may contain
   different elements? This would also make the assignment of the data 
types a lot easier and
   would also offer extensibility in a nice fashion.
 * Section 7 contains two XML schemas. I would put them in two separate 
sub-sections since you
   may need to reference them separately in the IANA consideration section.
 * The IANA consideration section for the namespace registration and the 
schema registration is missing.
 * There are internationalization considerations when some of the fields 
are supposed to be processed
   by humans. Is this the case?
 * The Logo schema is pretty complex but it is not really well described 
in the document.
 * Section 5 and section 6 have a lot of overlap. The style is also 
somewhat different.
   Section 6 describes XML schema snippets. This is not good practice 
and not so helpful
   given that Section 7 lists the full schema anyway. It might be more 
helpful to provide
   more examples, if necessary.
   Some elements/attributes that are listed in Section 6 are not listed 
in Section 5 although
   it would be very useful (example: 'expiry').
 * There is no description of the examples. You don't need to put the 
examples in the appendix.
   It is fine to leave them in the main section since many readers are 
for sure going to look
   at the examples; if not only at the examples.
 * Section 5 has each element listed as (OPTIONAL) or (MANDATORY). This 
seems like a nice idea
   but was not done in a consistent fashion nor does it work well when 
you have dependencies to
   the occurrence of other elements/attributes/values.
 * XML element and XML attribute names are not used consistently in the 
same fashion.
 * With regard to the algorithm URIs there is no reference provided to 
Phillip's document.
   Don't you think that would be needed/useful?
 * What exactly is the <UserType> element used for?
 * References: You need to split the references into normative and 
informative references.
   At least the following references are hopefully informative -- 
otherwise we run into problems:
    - [CAP]
    - [OATH]
    - [OATHRefArch]
    - [OCRA]
    - [Schneier]
   Please double-check the other references.
   The reference style is also a bit strange (see, for example, the 
[DSKPP] reference).
   Are you using XML2RFC to edit the document?
   
Ciao
Hannes


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I ran into this document.
Since it also defines algorithm identifiers it is also of interest for 
the group.

Ciao
Hannes

-------- Original Message --------
Subject: 	I-D ACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt
Date: 	Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:15:01 -0500
From: 	Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts 
directories.


	Title		: Additional XML Security Uniform Resource Identifiers (URIs)
	Author(s)	: D. Eastlake 3rd
	Filename	: draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt
	Pages		: 25
	Date		: 2007-11-13
	
   This document expands and updates the list of URIs intended for use
   with XML Digital Signatures, Encryption, Canonnicalization, and Key
   Management specified in RFC 4051.  These URIs identify algorithms and
   types of information.



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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Thu Nov 29 12:07:55 2007
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PSKC currently cites some URIs from this document, for example, for the
later version of HMAC 256 that are not present in xmlenc and xmldsig
document at the time.

While we are creating a new URI document, should it become some kind of
extension of this doc or an inclusion of this doc? Extension doc would
list only ones that are not listed in this doc, xmlenc, and xmldsig
spec. Currently, it looks to be an "inclusion" where we list URIs, which
refer back to this document.=20

- Ming

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Hannes Tschofenig [mailto:Hannes.Tschofenig@gmx.net]=20
> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 5:53 AM
> To: keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: [KEYPROV] [Fwd:=20
> I-DACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt]
>=20
> I ran into this document.
> Since it also defines algorithm identifiers it is also of=20
> interest for the group.
>=20
> Ciao
> Hannes
>=20
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: 	I-D ACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt
> Date: 	Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:15:01 -0500
> From: 	Internet-Drafts@ietf.org
> Reply-To: 	internet-drafts@ietf.org
> To: 	i-d-announce@ietf.org
>=20
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line=20
> Internet-Drafts directories.
>=20
>=20
> 	Title		: Additional XML Security Uniform=20
> Resource Identifiers (URIs)
> 	Author(s)	: D. Eastlake 3rd
> 	Filename	: draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt
> 	Pages		: 25
> 	Date		: 2007-11-13
> =09
>    This document expands and updates the list of URIs intended for use
>    with XML Digital Signatures, Encryption, Canonnicalization, and Key
>    Management specified in RFC 4051.  These URIs identify=20
> algorithms and
>    types of information.
>=20
>=20
>=20
> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-eastlake-additional-
> xmlsec-uris-00.txt
>=20
> To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to=20
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>=20
> A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in
> http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html=20
> or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt
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> Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail.
>=20
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> In the body type:
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> =09
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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 30 06:39:51 2007
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> > PSKC currently cites some URIs from this document, for example, for the
> > later version of HMAC 256 that are not present in xmlenc and xmldsig
> > document at the time.
> >
> > While we are creating a new URI document, should it become some kind of
> > extension of this doc or an inclusion of this doc? Extension doc would
> > list only ones that are not listed in this doc, xmlenc, and xmldsig
> > spec. Currently, it looks to be an "inclusion" where we list URIs, which
> > refer back to this document.

draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris includes strong cryptographic
primitives. When I consider recent and few years future cryptographic
attack, I support PSKC document include this draft for hmac-sha256 or
later, and AES backup block cipher Camellia.

I suggest PSKC include following uris and reference:

Section 5.1.2.
http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#camellia128-cbc
http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#camellia192-cbc
http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#camellia256-cbc

Section 5.1.9.
For default support list:
http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#hmac-sha1
http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#hmac-sha256
http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#hmac-sha384
http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#hmac-sha512

Section 11:
Reference of draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt,

Thanks.

> > - Ming
> >
>> >> -----Original Message-----
>> >> From: Hannes Tschofenig [mailto:Hannes.Tschofenig at gmx.net]
>> >> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 5:53 AM
>> >> To: keyprov at ietf.org
>> >> Subject: [KEYPROV] [Fwd:
>> >> I-DACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt]
>> >>
>> >> I ran into this document.
>> >> Since it also defines algorithm identifiers it is also of
>> >> interest for the group.
>> >>
>> >> Ciao
>> >> Hannes
>> >>
>> >> -------- Original Message --------
>> >> Subject: 	I-D ACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt
>> >> Date: 	Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:15:01 -0500
>> >> From: 	Internet-Drafts at ietf.org
>> >> Reply-To: 	internet-drafts at ietf.org
>> >> To: 	i-d-announce at ietf.org
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line
>> >> Internet-Drafts directories.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 	Title		: Additional XML Security Uniform
>> >> Resource Identifiers (URIs)
>> >> 	Author(s)	: D. Eastlake 3rd
>> >> 	Filename	: draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt
>> >> 	Pages		: 25
>> >> 	Date		: 2007-11-13
>> >> 	
>> >>    This document expands and updates the list of URIs intended for use
>> >>    with XML Digital Signatures, Encryption, Canonnicalization, and Key
>> >>    Management specified in RFC 4051.  These URIs identify
>> >> algorithms and
>> >>    types of information.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
>> >> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-eastlake-additional-
>> >> xmlsec-uris-00.txt
>> >>
>> >> To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send a message to
>> >> i-d-announce-request at ietf.org with the word unsubscribe in
>> >> the body of
>> >> the message.
>> >> You can also visit
>> >> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce
>> >> to change your subscription settings.
>> >>
>> >> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the
>> >> username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After
>> >> logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then
>> >> "get draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt".
>> >>
>> >> A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in
>> >> http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html
>> >> or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt
>> >>
>> >> Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail.
>> >>
>> >> Send a message to:
>> >> 	mailserv at ietf.org.
>> >> In the body type:
>> >> 	"FILE
>> >> /internet-drafts/draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt".
>> >> 	
>> >> NOTE:	The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in
>> >> 	MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility.  To use this
>> >> 	feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE"
>> >> 	command.  To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or
>> >> 	a MIME-compliant mail reader.  Different MIME-compliant
>> >> mail readers
>> >> 	exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with
>> >> 	"multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split
>> >> 	up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on
>> >> 	how to manipulate these messages.
>> >>
>> >> Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader
>> >> implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the
>> >> Internet-Draft.
>> >>
>> >>


-- 
 - KATO Akihiro
  + NTT Software Corporation


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From keyprov-bounces@ietf.org Fri Nov 30 13:34:49 2007
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Subject: RE: [KEYPROV]
	[Fwd:I-DACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt]
Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2007 10:33:34 -0800
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Kato,

Thank you very much for the suggestions. For section 11, yes, we will
add the reference in next rev. For the additional algorithms to section=20
5.1.2 and 5.1.9, we like to hear more feedbacks in this thread and IETF
meeting next week. The list impacts interop scope.

- Ming

> -----Original Message-----
> From: KATO Akihiro [mailto:akato@po.ntts.co.jp]=20
> Sent: Friday, November 30, 2007 3:40 AM
> To: keyprov@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: [KEYPROV]=20
> [Fwd:I-DACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt]
>=20
> > > PSKC currently cites some URIs from this document, for=20
> example, for=20
> > > the later version of HMAC 256 that are not present in xmlenc and=20
> > > xmldsig document at the time.
> > >
> > > While we are creating a new URI document, should it=20
> become some kind=20
> > > of extension of this doc or an inclusion of this doc?=20
> Extension doc=20
> > > would list only ones that are not listed in this doc, xmlenc, and=20
> > > xmldsig spec. Currently, it looks to be an "inclusion"=20
> where we list=20
> > > URIs, which refer back to this document.
>=20
> draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris includes strong=20
> cryptographic primitives. When I consider recent and few=20
> years future cryptographic attack, I support PSKC document=20
> include this draft for hmac-sha256 or later, and AES backup=20
> block cipher Camellia.
>=20
> I suggest PSKC include following uris and reference:
>=20
> Section 5.1.2.
> http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#camellia128-cbc
> http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#camellia192-cbc
> http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#camellia256-cbc
>=20
> Section 5.1.9.
> For default support list:
> http://www.w3.org/2000/09/xmldsig#hmac-sha1
> http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#hmac-sha256
> http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#hmac-sha384
> http://www.w3.org/2001/04/xmldsig-more#hmac-sha512
>=20
> Section 11:
> Reference of draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt,
>=20
> Thanks.
>=20
> > > - Ming
> > >
> >> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> >> From: Hannes Tschofenig [mailto:Hannes.Tschofenig at gmx.net]
> >> >> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2007 5:53 AM
> >> >> To: keyprov at ietf.org
> >> >> Subject: [KEYPROV] [Fwd:
> >> >> I-DACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt]
> >> >>
> >> >> I ran into this document.
> >> >> Since it also defines algorithm identifiers it is also=20
> of interest=20
> >> >> for the group.
> >> >>
> >> >> Ciao
> >> >> Hannes
> >> >>
> >> >> -------- Original Message --------
> >> >> Subject: 	I-D=20
> ACTION:draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt
> >> >> Date: 	Tue, 13 Nov 2007 11:15:01 -0500
> >> >> From: 	Internet-Drafts at ietf.org
> >> >> Reply-To: 	internet-drafts at ietf.org
> >> >> To: 	i-d-announce at ietf.org
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line=20
> Internet-Drafts=20
> >> >> directories.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> 	Title		: Additional XML Security Uniform
> >> >> Resource Identifiers (URIs)
> >> >> 	Author(s)	: D. Eastlake 3rd
> >> >> 	Filename	:=20
> draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt
> >> >> 	Pages		: 25
> >> >> 	Date		: 2007-11-13
> >> >> =09
> >> >>    This document expands and updates the list of URIs=20
> intended for use
> >> >>    with XML Digital Signatures, Encryption,=20
> Canonnicalization, and Key
> >> >>    Management specified in RFC 4051.  These URIs identify=20
> >> >> algorithms and
> >> >>    types of information.
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
> >> >> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-eastlake-additional-
> >> >> xmlsec-uris-00.txt
> >> >>
> >> >> To remove yourself from the I-D Announcement list, send=20
> a message=20
> >> >> to i-d-announce-request at ietf.org with the word=20
> unsubscribe in=20
> >> >> the body of the message.
> >> >> You can also visit
> >> >> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/I-D-announce
> >> >> to change your subscription settings.
> >> >>
> >> >> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with=20
> >> >> the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address.=20
> >> >> After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get=20
> >> >> draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt".
> >> >>
> >> >> A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in=20
> >> >> http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or=20
> >> >> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt
> >> >>
> >> >> Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail.
> >> >>
> >> >> Send a message to:
> >> >> 	mailserv at ietf.org.
> >> >> In the body type:
> >> >> 	"FILE
> >> >> /internet-drafts/draft-eastlake-additional-xmlsec-uris-00.txt".
> >> >> =09
> >> >> NOTE:	The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in
> >> >> 	MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility.=20
>  To use this
> >> >> 	feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime"=20
> before the "FILE"
> >> >> 	command.  To decode the response(s), you will=20
> need "munpack" or
> >> >> 	a MIME-compliant mail reader.  Different=20
> MIME-compliant mail=20
> >> >> readers
> >> >> 	exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with
> >> >> 	"multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which=20
> have been split
> >> >> 	up into multiple messages), so check your local=20
> documentation on
> >> >> 	how to manipulate these messages.
> >> >>
> >> >> Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant=20
> mail reader=20
> >> >> implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII=20
> version of the=20
> >> >> Internet-Draft.
> >> >>
> >> >>
>=20
>=20
> --
>  - KATO Akihiro
>   + NTT Software Corporation
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> KEYPROV mailing list
> KEYPROV@ietf.org
> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/keyprov
>=20

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