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See more at VisaRebates.com. http://www.visarebates.com/Index.cfm?ReferralID=markwitt Remove instructions; mailto:m58wd@yahoo.com/?subject=remove From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 1 14:39:06 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA28343 for ; Mon, 1 Jan 2001 14:39:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f01JSK328127; Mon, 1 Jan 2001 11:28:20 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f01Jb1w25722; Mon, 1 Jan 2001 11:37:01 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 11:37:01 -0800 (PST) From: Stig Venås Date: Mon, 1 Jan 2001 20:36:25 +0100 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: ldap_init() and IPv6 addresses Message-ID: <20010101203625.A25433@itea.ntnu.no> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i Resent-Message-ID: <"TIzqjB.A.oRG.cxNU6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com From draft-ietf-ldapext-ldap-c-api-05.txt: Parameters are: hostname Contains a space-separated list of hostnames or dotted strings representing the IP address of hosts running an LDAP server to connect to. Each hostname in the list MAY include a port number which is separated from the host itself with a colon (:) char- acter. The hosts will be tried in the order listed, stopping with the first one to which a successful connection is made. Note: A suitable representation for including a literal IPv6[10] address in the hostname parameter is desired, but has not yet been determined or implemented in practice. This has been implemented in OpenLDAP. The format chosen is based on the URL syntax in RFC 2732 which uses [] around the address, an example from the RFC: http://[FEDC:BA98:7654:3210:FEDC:BA98:7654:3210]:80/index.html So the format I suggest (and is implemented in OpenLDAP) would then be to write host and port as [FEDC:BA98:7654:3210:FEDC:BA98:7654:3210]:80. Just to make myself clear, here are some other examples: ldap_init("[FEDC:BA98:7654:3210:FEDC:BA98:7654:3210]", LDAP_PORT ) ldap_init("[FEDC:BA98::7654:3210] 127.0.0.1", LDAP_PORT ) ldap_init("[FEDC:BA98:7654:3210::1]:390 [FEDC:BA98:7654::1]:391", LDAP_PORT ) ldap_init("[FEDC:BA98:7654:3210::1]:390 [FEDC:BA98:7654:3210::1]", LDAP_PORT ) My question then, can we agree on this format and use it in the next revision of the draft, or is there anyone that doesn't like this? 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Best regards, Steve Wong From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 2 12:44:01 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA20454 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 12:44:01 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f02HQj311666; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 09:26:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f02Hecc18100; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 09:40:38 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 09:40:38 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A521251.C94DE1ED@worldspot.com> Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 09:39:29 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jim Sermersheim CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Java API: LDAPMessage accessor for LDAPException References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ltky7C.A.iaE.VKhU6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim Sermersheim wrote: > > Rob, > > There are (perhaps) dozens of extended operations that are not described in Internet-Drafts. Some of these, as well as possible future IETF documented extended operatoins, have the ability to not only return one of the well known (and limited) LDAP error values, but return other "extended" error information as well (in the value of the extended resonse). > > There must be some way of reading the information returned in the extended operation PDU whether or not an error value is present. To make the case more simple, the Java API is not allowing the client to read the entire allowable set of data being sent by the server. > > Jim Wouldn't such an extended operation return success as the LDAP return code (the extended operation was successfully delivered, processed, and a result returned), so there would be no exception? There is a difference between an LDAP protocol failure on the one hand and a privately defined operation result on the other. Rob > > >>> Rob Weltman 12/27/00 8:54:52 PM >>> > Jim Sermersheim wrote: > > > > I've heard a couple people ask how to solve this problem with synchronous calls: > > > > Client sends an extended operation to server. Server returns with extended response but an error condition is present. An LDAPException is thrown and caught by the application, but there is no way to read the extended response. > > > > Can we add a new method to LDAPException -- public LDAPMessage getLDAPMessage()? It would return null if no LDAPMessage is associated with the response. > > > > To date I've told people to use the async methods, but I'd rather the problem just be fixed. > > > > Jim > > Jim, > > In what cases is there a valid response message as well as an error condition? For the other operation types there is either one or the other. > > Rob From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 2 13:44:22 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id NAA21193 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 13:44:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f02IRn326534; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 10:27:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f02Ifgw27681; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 10:41:42 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 10:41:42 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010102094815.00a31700@pop.walltech.com> X-Sender: bgreenblatt@pop.walltech.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 09:49:26 -0800 To: Rob Weltman , Jim Sermersheim From: Bruce Greenblatt Subject: Re: Java API: LDAPMessage accessor for LDAPException Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com In-Reply-To: <3A521251.C94DE1ED@worldspot.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Resent-Message-ID: <"77m2xB.A.PwG.lDiU6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 09:39 AM 1/2/2001 -0800, Rob Weltman wrote: > Wouldn't such an extended operation return success as the LDAP return > code (the extended operation was successfully delivered, processed, and a > result returned), so there would be no exception? There is a difference > between an LDAP protocol failure on the one hand and a privately defined > operation result on the other. > >Rob > > I concur. There is a well defined mechanism for extensions to return privately defined operation results. Perhaps this needs to be made more explicit in the specification. ============================================== Bruce Greenblatt, Ph. D. Directory Tools and Application Services, Inc. http://www.directory-applications.com See my new Book on Internet Directories: http://www.phptr.com/ptrbooks/ptr_0139744525.html From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 2 19:19:51 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id TAA24334 for ; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 19:19:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0303g324412; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 16:03:42 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f030HZk20081; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 16:17:35 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 2 Jan 2001 16:17:35 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Tue, 02 Jan 2001 17:17:18 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: Cc: Subject: Re: Java API: LDAPMessage accessor for LDAPException Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f030HXv20047 Resent-Message-ID: <"Z2BoAC.A.f5E.e-mU6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >>>> Rob Weltman 1/2/01 10:39:29 AM >>> >Jim Sermersheim wrote: >> >> Rob, >> >> There are (perhaps) dozens of extended operations that are not described in Internet-Drafts. Some of these, as well as possible future IETF documented extended operatoins, have the ability to not only return one of the well known (and limited) LDAP error values, but return other "extended" error information as well (in the value of the extended resonse). >> >> There must be some way of reading the information returned in the extended operation PDU whether or not an error value is present. To make the case more simple, the Java API is not allowing the client to read the entire allowable set of data being sent by the server. >> >> Jim > > Wouldn't such an extended operation return success as the LDAP return code (the extended operation was successfully delivered, processed, and a result returned), so there would be no exception? There is a difference between an LDAP protocol failure on the one hand and a privately defined operation result on the other. > >Rob The particular extension that initially sparked this does not return success. Rather, it returns an error value and also returns additional information in the extended response value. One could imagine an extended operation that returns timeLimitExceeded along with some extra information about the amount of work done before time ran out. These types of extensions aren't trying to augment information surrounding protocol failures per se. They're either trying to augment infromation surrounding othr types of errors (like insufficientAccessRights, noSuchObject, limits, etc). The ability to do this does exist in the protocol as we know it today. It may be poor design on the extension writers behalf, but there isn't wording that I can find in the specification that warns or suggests not to do it. I believe that it is wrong for the API to hide this protocol information unless the specification explicitly states that when the extended response contains an ldapResult other than success (0), the response value MUST be empty (or ignored by clients). I just looked at a few I-Ds and it seems to date, this is something that is specified by the extension specification, not the protocol. While some I-Ds specify that the response value is to be ignored in the presence of any result other than success, the LBURP draft defines an extended operation that allows an other (80) result to signify and that more information is held in the extended response value. Whether this is a bad thing for extension writers to do is a discussion to be had at the protocol level. I don't think we should fix perceived shortcomings by restricting or augmenting the APIs. Until the protocol specification says something about this, I think the APIs need to allow access to this information. Jim > > >>> Rob Weltman 12/27/00 8:54:52 PM >>> > Jim Sermersheim wrote: > > > > I've heard a couple people ask how to solve this problem with synchronous calls: > > > > Client sends an extended operation to server. Server returns with extended response but an error condition is present. An LDAPException is thrown and caught by the application, but there is no way to read the extended response. > > > > Can we add a new method to LDAPException -- public LDAPMessage getLDAPMessage()? It would return null if no LDAPMessage is associated with the response. > > > > To date I've told people to use the async methods, but I'd rather the problem just be fixed. > > > > Jim > > Jim, > > In what cases is there a valid response message as well as an error condition? 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Per Section 301, Paragraph (a)(2)(c) of S. 1618 From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 3 03:10:19 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id DAA11498 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 03:10:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f037rI307284; Tue, 2 Jan 2001 23:53:18 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0387C214416; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 00:07:12 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 00:07:12 -0800 (PST) From: To: Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 00:53:54 Message-Id: <458.837227.599006@mail.mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"PCVPEB.A.-gD.v2tU6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit GET YOUR OWN 100 MEG WEBSITE FOR ONLY $11.95 PER MONTH TODAY! 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FOR DETAILS CALL 1 888 248 0765 if you are outside the USA, please fax 240 337 8325 Webhosting International From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 3 09:00:55 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id JAA21946 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 09:00:50 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f03Div302922; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 05:44:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f03Dwp628522; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 05:58:51 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 05:58:51 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 06:54:18 -0700 From: "Haripriya S" To: Subject: Re: Returning Partial Results for an operation Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_DF84BBF1.3051688C" Resent-Message-ID: <"i9bh-B.A.Y9G.aAzU6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_DF84BBF1.3051688C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable IMO I see two kinds of responses a server may want to return on receiving = an abandon: 1. A response to the abandon operation itself ( useful to clients to know = that abandon was received). 2. A partial/full response to the original operation which was abandoned ( = useful for sending accumulated partial results). While the first requires an extended request and response and the need for = the client to understand the same, the second may require a change to = rfc2251 sec. 4.11 alone: "In the event that a server receives an Abandon Request on a Search Operation in the midst of transmitting responses to the search, that server MUST cease transmitting entry responses to the abandoned request immediately, and MUST NOT send the SearchResponseDone." If the first MUST condition in the above passage is removed, and the = second one retained, the server will be able to send accumulated responses.= The above clause is for search, but the same also applies to other = requests returning partial responses. The clients should work with this change because, they "MUST be prepared = to receive results from operations it has abandoned" (4.11). Thanks and Regards, Haripriya >>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 12/23/00 01:51PM >>> I'd be happy to co-author an abandon I-D. The use of an control upon abandon to solicit an (extended? new?) response would likely not be supported by an client API. I believe an extended operation is the best approach. Kurt At 06:36 PM 12/22/00 -0700, Roger Harrison wrote: >Kurt, >=20 >I, too, have been considering the same thing because there are times when = it would be very nice to know an abandon has been received and handled.=20 >=20 >In a conversation I had with Haripriya, I suggested just such a thing, = and Haripriya suggested using a control to request a response for an = abandon operation. It sounds like Jim wouldn't mind seeing something in = this area as well. Should we write something up? If so, do you have an = opinion as to whether we should use a new extended abandon-with-response = operation or a control on the current abandon operation? >=20 >Roger > >>>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 12/20/00 09:35PM >>>=20 >At 09:44 PM 12/20/00 -0700, Haripriya S wrote:=20 >>Yes but it would then mandate that the server MUST send partial results = per entry immediately, and cannot bunch results even if a client wishes = so, because the state cannot be conveyed once an abandon is received.=20 > >Abandon semantics also require the server to defer returning=20 >return results of operations issues subsequent to the abandon=20 >operation until the operation being abandoned has been=20 >abandoned or has completed.=20 > >For this reason, I have been considering specifying a new=20 >abandon operation which, like the X.500 abandon operation,=20 >has a response.=20 > >Kurt=20 --=_DF84BBF1.3051688C Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
IMO I see two kinds of responses a server may want to return on = receiving=20 an abandon:
 
1. A response to the abandon operation itself ( useful to clients to = know=20 that abandon was received).
2. A partial/full response to the original operation which was = abandoned (=20 useful for sending accumulated partial results).
 
While the first requires an extended request and response and the = need for=20 the client to understand the same, the second may require a change to = rfc2251=20 sec. 4.11 alone:
 
 "In the event that a server receives an Abandon
  = =20 Request on a Search Operation in the midst of transmitting=20 responses
   to the search, that server MUST cease transmittin= g=20 entry responses to
   the abandoned request immediately, and = MUST=20 NOT send the
   SearchResponseDone."
 
If the first MUST condition in the above passage is removed, and the = second=20 one retained, the server will be able to send accumulated responses. = The=20 above clause is for search, but the same also applies to other = requests=20 returning partial responses.
 
The clients should work with this change because, they "MUST = be=20 prepared to receive results from operations it has abandoned" (4.11).
=
 
Thanks and Regards,
Haripriya
 
>>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" <Kurt@OpenLDAP.org> 12/23/00 = 01:51PM=20 >>>
I'd be happy to co-author an abandon I-D.

The use = of an=20 control upon abandon to solicit an
(extended? new?) response would = likely not=20 be supported
by an client API.

I believe an extended operation = is the=20 best approach.

Kurt




At 06:36 PM 12/22/00 -0700, = Roger=20 Harrison wrote:
>Kurt,
>
>I, too, have been considering = the=20 same thing because there are times when it would be very nice to know an = abandon=20 has been received and handled.
>
>In a conversation I had = with=20 Haripriya, I suggested just such a thing, and Haripriya suggested using = a=20 control to request a response for an abandon operation. It sounds like = Jim=20 wouldn't mind seeing something in this area as well.  Should we = write=20 something up? If so, do you have an opinion as to whether we should use a = new=20 extended abandon-with-response operation or a control on the current = abandon=20 operation?
>
>Roger
>
>>>> "Kurt D. = Zeilenga"=20 <Kurt@OpenLDAP.org> 12/20/00 09:35PM >>>
>At 09:44 = PM=20 12/20/00 -0700, Haripriya S wrote:
>>Yes but it would then = mandate=20 that the server MUST send partial results per entry immediately, and = cannot=20 bunch results even if a client wishes so, because the state cannot be = conveyed=20 once an abandon is received.
>
>Abandon semantics also = require the=20 server to defer returning
>return results of operations issues = subsequent=20 to the abandon
>operation until the operation being abandoned has = been=20
>abandoned or has completed.
>
>For this reason, I = have been=20 considering specifying a new
>abandon operation which, like the = X.500=20 abandon operation,
>has a response.
>
>Kurt=20

--=_DF84BBF1.3051688C-- From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 3 12:12:57 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA28780 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 12:12:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f03H0h308964; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 09:00:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f03H9Qc23269; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 09:09:26 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 09:09:26 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101031742.TAA27228@asprin.sbuys.co.za> From: "Jason M Nunes" Subject: Your Chance #3ED0 To: on29s@sbuys.co.za X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE VÐßD.1712.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 06:55:22 -0500 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0" Resent-Message-ID: <"DdMEQ.A.3qF.Ez1U6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME Message ------=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0" ------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ***** This is an HTML Message ! ***** ------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Executive Guild Membership ApplicationResponse-O-Matic Form

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------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0-- ------=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0-- From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 3 18:43:28 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA09820 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 18:43:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f03NSc323742; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 15:28:38 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f03NbKA20323; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 15:37:20 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 15:37:20 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 16:36:52 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: Cc: Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: draft Java-api-12 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_38635C8E.FF9EDCD5" Resent-Message-ID: <"A6cdmB.A.R9E.ue7U6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_38635C8E.FF9EDCD5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >>> Rob Weltman 27-Dec-00 10:53:27 PM >>> Steven Sonntag wrote: >=20 > Rob Weltman wrote: >=20 > > It might be better instead to eliminate the current unsolicited > > notification methods and instead have methods to add and remove > > listeners for usolicited notifications. The implementation can then > > discard unsolicited notifications if there are no listeners. For > > example (I haven't thought this through completely yet): > > > > LDAPConnection > > > > public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > Rob > > >=20 > It seems natural to me that if unsolicited notifications are enabled on > a > listener, that the method LDAPListener.getMessageIDs() would include > message ID 0 in the list of message IDs, and that > LDAPConnection.abandon(0) > and LDAPConnection.abandon(listener) could be used to removeUnsolicited > notifications from a listener or listeners. This raises some questions. >=20 > 1) Should getMessageIDs show messageID 0 when unsolicited notification > are enabled? (My vote is yes) >=20 > 2) Should the draft allow abandon to be used to remove unsolicited > notifications? > (this means that message ID 0 is treated like a message that never > completes) >=20 > 3) If number two is allowed, is removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener() > necessary? >=20 > -Steve I think it is easier for a client to handle unsolicited notifications as = out-of-band events rather than lumped together with "normal" solicited = responses. In almost all cases I would expect a client to want to know = immediately that an unsolicited notification had arrived rather than = having to poll and distinguish between solicited and unsolicited notificati= ons. The event listener model reflects the paradigm of immediate out-of-ban= d notification of unsolicited messages. Having the unsolicited messages = ALSO appear in the normal message queue is confusing, error-prone, and not = very useful as far as I can tell. Rob ........................................ What you say may be true, but - using the listener paradigm allows the developer to combine any combination of listeners, normal messages, and unsolicited messages. Why make an out of a special out of band API for something that could be handled naturally by the existing API. When you say the application wants to know immediately, you mean the unsolicited notification message should comes up first, i.e. returned to the application before other normal messages - correct? If the = unsolicited notification is mixed with other messages, the draft should specify that unsolicited messages are returned first. -Steve -Steve --=_38635C8E.FF9EDCD5 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


>>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> = 27-Dec-00=20 10:53:27 PM >>>
Steven Sonntag wrote:
>
> Rob = Weltman=20 wrote:
>
> >   It might be better instead to = eliminate=20 the current unsolicited
> > notification methods and instead = have=20 methods to add and remove
> > listeners for usolicited notificatio= ns.=20 The implementation can then
> > discard unsolicited notifications = if=20 there are no listeners. For
> > example (I haven't thought this = through=20 completely yet):
> >
> > LDAPConnection
> = >
>=20 > public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
>= ;=20 > LDAPResponseListener listener )
> >
> > public = void=20 removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> > LDAPResponseListener=20= listener )
> >
> > Rob
> >
>
> It = seems=20 natural to me that if unsolicited notifications are enabled on
> = a
>=20 listener, that the method LDAPListener.getMessageIDs() would include
>= ;=20 message ID 0 in the list of message IDs, and that
>=20 LDAPConnection.abandon(0)
> and LDAPConnection.abandon(listener) = could be=20 used to removeUnsolicited
> notifications from a listener or=20 listeners.  This raises some questions.
>
> 1) Should=20 getMessageIDs show messageID 0 when unsolicited notification
> = are=20 enabled?  (My vote is yes)
>
> 2) Should the draft = allow=20 abandon to be used to remove unsolicited
> notifications?
> = (this=20 means that message ID 0 is treated like a message that never
>=20 completes)
>
> 3) If number two is allowed, is=20 removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener()
> necessary?
> =
>=20 -Steve

  I think it is easier for a client to handle unsolicite= d=20 notifications as out-of-band events rather than lumped together with = "normal"=20 solicited responses. In almost all cases I would expect a client to want = to know=20 immediately that an unsolicited notification had arrived rather than = having to=20 poll and distinguish between solicited and unsolicited notifications. The = event=20 listener model reflects the paradigm of immediate out-of-band notification = of=20 unsolicited messages. Having the unsolicited messages ALSO appear in the = normal=20 message queue is confusing, error-prone, and not very useful as far as I = can=20 tell.

Rob
........................................
What you say may be true, but - using the listener paradigm allows=20 the
developer to combine any combination of listeners, normal messages,
and unsolicited messages.  Why make an out of a special out of = band=20 API
for something that could be handled naturally by the existing = API.
 
When you say the application wants to know immediately, you mean
=
the unsolicited notification message should comes up first, i.e.=20 returned
to the application before other normal messages - correct? If the= =20 unsolicited
notification is mixed with other messages, the draft should = specify=20 that
unsolicited messages are returned first.
 
-Steve
 
-Steve
--=_38635C8E.FF9EDCD5-- From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 3 19:16:20 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id TAA10377 for ; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 19:16:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0400r308297; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:00:54 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f040EnU08006; Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:14:49 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 3 Jan 2001 16:14:49 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A53C034.736DFF2F@worldspot.com> Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 16:13:40 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Sonntag CC: robw@worldspot.com, ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: draft Java-api-12 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"eFfzb.A.08B.3B8U6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > >>> Rob Weltman 27-Dec-00 10:53:27 PM >>> > Steven Sonntag wrote: > > > > Rob Weltman wrote: > > > > > It might be better instead to eliminate the current unsolicited > > > notification methods and instead have methods to add and remove > > > listeners for usolicited notifications. The implementation can then > > > discard unsolicited notifications if there are no listeners. For > > > example (I haven't thought this through completely yet): > > > > > > LDAPConnection > > > > > > public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > Rob > > > > > > > It seems natural to me that if unsolicited notifications are enabled on > > a > > listener, that the method LDAPListener.getMessageIDs() would include > > message ID 0 in the list of message IDs, and that > > LDAPConnection.abandon(0) > > and LDAPConnection.abandon(listener) could be used to removeUnsolicited > > notifications from a listener or listeners. This raises some questions. > > > > 1) Should getMessageIDs show messageID 0 when unsolicited notification > > are enabled? (My vote is yes) > > > > 2) Should the draft allow abandon to be used to remove unsolicited > > notifications? > > (this means that message ID 0 is treated like a message that never > > completes) > > > > 3) If number two is allowed, is removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener() > > necessary? > > > > -Steve > > I think it is easier for a client to handle unsolicited notifications as out-of-band events rather than lumped together with "normal" solicited responses. In almost all cases I would expect a client to want to know immediately that an unsolicited notification had arrived rather than having to poll and distinguish between solicited and unsolicited notifications. The event listener model reflects the paradigm of immediate out-of-band notification of unsolicited messages. Having the unsolicited messages ALSO appear in the normal message queue is confusing, error-prone, and not very useful as far as I can tell. > > Rob........................................What you say may be true, but - using the listener paradigm allows thedeveloper to combine any combination of listeners, normal messages,and unsolicited messages. Why make an out of a special out of band APIfor something that could be handled naturally by the existing API. When you say the application wants to know immediately, you meanthe unsolicited notification message should comes up first, i.e. returnedto the application before other normal messages - correct? If the unsolicitednotification is mixed with other messages, the draft should specify thatunsolicited messages are returned first. > -Steve No, not at all. With an event listener model, a client that is interested in unsolicited notifications registers as an UnsolicitedNotificationListener. Immediately when an unsolicited notification arrives, a method of the client (e.g. messageReceived) is called with the unsolicited notification as parameter. That way the client is notified immediately and asynchronously rather than having to poll the message queue. Besides being simpler and more convenient for the client, it is much cleaner and less error-prone both for the client and for the implementor of the API. In-band responses are delivered in-band to the submitter of in-band requests; unsolicited notifications are delivered out-of-band to a requestor of unsolicited notifications. 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From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 4 14:05:54 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA13252 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 14:05:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f04Inq329568; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 10:49:52 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f04J3m629579; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 11:03:48 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 11:03:48 -0800 (PST) From: "Paul \(Enxi\) Chou" To: Subject: Ask for information about LDAP Server Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 14:05:57 -0500 Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook IMO, Build 9.0.2416 (9.0.2911.0) Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.50.4133.2400 Resent-Message-ID: <"cA5WpD.A.5NH.TkMV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Can anyone provide me some information about UNIX/Vxwork based LDAP software with a database which support/can be configured to LDAP schema (Policy Core LDAP Schema, etc.) ? Thanks! Paul +------------------------------------------------+ | Paul(enxi) Chou Software Engineer | | SS8 Networks Canada (Toronto) | | 55 Commerce Valley Drive West | | 5th Floor South | | THORNHILL, Ontario L3T 7B9 | | Tel:905-889-1357 Fax: 905-889-9853 | +------------------------------------------------+ From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 4 15:51:14 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id PAA15815 for ; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 15:51:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f04KZQ318340; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 12:35:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f04KnNs27307; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 12:49:23 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 12:49:23 -0800 (PST) Importance: Normal Subject: Re: ldap acl draft (06): browse needed ? To: Cc: From: George_Robert_Blakley_III@tivoli.com Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 14:52:09 -0600 Message-ID: X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on SCHub/Tivoli Systems(Release 5.0.4a |July 24, 2000) at 01/04/2001 02:48:32 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"aEaRXC.A.FpG.MHOV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Rob, The intent of the "browse" permission is not to prevent discovery of DNs; that is what "returnDN" permission is for. "browse" is to take care of the case where there is a hierarchy of entries and: (1) A subject "S" has authority to perform some operation (say "read") on an entry (call it "E") which is not the root (2) "S" has no permission to read or otherwise do anything to some entry "I" which is on the path between the root and "E" (3) "S" does not know or does not wish to use the explicit name of entry "E" An example of this case is when a subject "Bob" has "read" access to a leaf entry but no access to any other entry, and does not know the name of any entry in the hierarchy. Bob wishes to do a query on some attribute value. This query matches an attribute of "E", and hence (since Bob has permission to read E), E should be returned in response to the query. However, if Bob tries to execute the search starting at the only point he knows about (the root), the query will fail, because he has no permission to "I" or any other entry on the path between the root and "E". This is exactly analogous to the use of the "x" mode bit in the UNIX filesystem to allow users to traverse directories into which they cannot write and from which they cannot read. --bob Bob Blakley Chief Scientist, Security Tivoli Systems, Inc. ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com on 12/14/2000 09:22:38 PM Please respond to To: cc: Subject: ldap acl draft (06): browse needed ? The current acl draft proposes an entry level permission called "browseDN" (4.2.2). The idea behind this permssion is to able to set a policy saying something like "you can see this entry if you name it explicitly as the base of a search, otherwise not". At Pittsburgh people seemed to like this permission and I agreed to do a proposal for this....however, relative to a single "read" level permission that ignores scoping it does complicate things. The definition of the required permissions for search (5.2) already has to deal with a fair line up of other permssions (filter (presence and "the rest"), attribute level read, returnDN and discloseOnError). While providing more permssions certainly increases the flexibility of the model, it also makes it harder to understand and administrate, so my inclination is drop the browse permission in favour of a single "read" permission at the entry level. My question is do people feel strongly that the "browse" permission is required ? If so, please propose a compelling scenario that really needs this granularity of control of search permissions. I will then include this as a motivating example and propose a way to include it in the required permssions for search. Otherwise I intend to drop it for the 07 draft... Rob. From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 00:31:33 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id AAA23545 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:31:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f055FT300883; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 21:15:29 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f055TQ211946; Thu, 4 Jan 2001 21:29:26 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 4 Jan 2001 21:29:26 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 13:28:17 +0800 From: Zhang Dawei To: "Paul (Enxi) Chou" cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Ask for information about LDAP Server In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Resent-Message-ID: <"vPqoiC.A.Y6C.1uVV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com try OpenLDAP. Check for more information at the website http://www.openldap.org On Thu, 4 Jan 2001, Paul (Enxi) Chou wrote: > Hi, > > Can anyone provide me some information about UNIX/Vxwork based LDAP software > with a database which support/can be configured to LDAP schema (Policy Core > LDAP Schema, etc.) ? > > Thanks! > Paul > > +------------------------------------------------+ > | Paul(enxi) Chou Software Engineer | > | SS8 Networks Canada (Toronto) | > | 55 Commerce Valley Drive West | > | 5th Floor South | > | THORNHILL, Ontario L3T 7B9 | > | Tel:905-889-1357 Fax: 905-889-9853 | > +------------------------------------------------+ > > From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 03:11:33 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id DAA07481 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 03:11:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0580g305187; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:00:42 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0589RY12345; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:09:27 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:09:27 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:08:48 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101050808.f0588kB29954@xwing.netscape.com> From: livtom2001@XNDC.yahoo.com To: Friend.QVEF@netscape.com Subject: EARN UNLIMITED INCOME WORKING AT HOME -CJGX X-Reply-To: livtom2001@yahoo.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"k3jRh.A.YAD.1EYV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Friend, There is a possibility that we haven't met, but you were chosen by someone to receive this E-Mail because you are a motivated person. PLEASE, do yourself a favour and PRINT THIS! Read it thoroughly! Be sure you don't miss any of the points. Then put it down and walk away. THEN READ IT AGAIN! I am sending you a lot of information that is hard to absorb the first time you read it. If you don't believe this program will work for you, send it to 10-20 of your closest friends that you trust and ask them what they think. THIS REALLY WORKS! Have the faith, and don't miss this opportunity! GET INVOLVED and it will work for you as it does for us!!!!! Due to the popularity of this letter on the Internet, A MAJOR NIGHTLY NEWS program recently dedicated an entire show to the investigation of the program described below to see if it really can make people money. The show also investigated whether or not the program was legal. Their findings proved that there are absolutely no laws prohibiting the participation in the program. This has helped to show people that this is a simple, harmless and fun way to make some extra money at home. The results have been truly remarkable! So many people are participating that those involved are doing much better than ever before! Since everyone makes more as more people try it out, it's been very exciting! You will understand ONLY if you get involved! ********* THE ENTIRE PLAN IS HERE BELOW ********* *** PRINT THIS NOW FOR FUTURE REFERENCE!! *** $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ If you would like to make AT LEAST $50,000 in less than 90 days—READ ON! (If not, forward this to someone who would like to make this money... It works as designed, but only for those who follow it to the letter!) Please read this program...THEN READ IT AGAIN!! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ THIS IS A LEGITIMATE, LEGAL, MONEY MAKING OPPORTUNITY!! It does NOT require you to come into contact with people, either directly or by phone. Just follow the instructions, and you WILL make money. This simplified e-mail marketing program works perfectly 100% EVERY TIME! E-mail is the sales tool of the future. Take advantage of this virtually free method of advertising NOW!!! The longer you wait, the greater the competition!! Get your piece of this action NOW!!! Hello - My name is Johnathon Rourke, I'm from Rhode Island. The enclosed information is something I almost let slip through my fingers. Fortunately, sometime later I re-read everything and gave some thought and study to it. Two years ago, the corporation I worked for the past twelve years downsized and my position was eliminated. After unproductive job interviews, I decided to open my own business. Over the past year, I incurred many unforeseen financial problems. I owed my family, friends and creditors over $35,000. The economy was taking a toll on my business and I just couldn't seem to make ends meet. I had to refinance and borrow against my home to support my family and struggling business. AT THAT MOMENT something significant happened in my life. I am writing to share the experience in hopes that this could change your life FOREVER! FINANCIALLY$$$!!! In mid December, I received this program in my e-mail. Six months prior to receiving this program I had been sending away for information on various business opportunities. All of the programs I received, in my opinion, were not cost effective. They were either too difficult for me to comprehend, or the initial investment was too much for me to risk to see if they would work. But as I was saying, in December of 1997 I received this program. I didn't send for it, or ask for it, they just got my name off a mailing list! THANK GOODNESS FOR THAT!!! After reading it several times, to make sure I was reading it correctly, I couldn't believe my eyes! Here was a MONEY MAKING MACHINE I could start immediately without any debt. Like most of you I was still a little sceptical and a little worried about the legal aspects of it all. So I checked it out with the U.S. Post Office (1-800-725-2161 24-hrs) and they confirmed that it is indeed legal! After determining the program was LEGAL I decided "WHY NOT!?!??" Initially I sent out 10,000 e-mails. It cost me about $15 for my time on-line. The great thing about e-mail is that I don't need any money for printing to send out the program, and, because I also send the product (reports) by e-mail, my only expense is my time! In less than one week, I was starting to receive orders for REPORT #1! By January 13, I had received 26 orders for REPORT #1. Your goal is to RECEIVE at least 20 ORDERS FOR REPORT #1 WITHIN 2 WEEKS. IF YOU DON'T, SEND OUT MORE PROGRAMS UNTIL YOU DO. My first step in making $50,000 in 90 days was done. By January 30, I had received 196 orders for REPORT #2. Your goal is to RECEIVE AT LEAST 100+ ORDERS FOR REPORT #2 WITHIN 2 WEEKS. IF NOT, SEND OUT MORE PROGRAMS UNTIL YOU DO! ONCE YOU HAVE 100 ORDERS, THE REST IS EASY. RELAX, YOU WILL MAKE YOUR $50,000 GOAL." Well, I had 196 orders for REPORT #2--96 more than I needed. So I sat back and relaxed. By March 1, of my e-mailing of 10,000, I received $58,000 with more coming in every day! I paid off ALL my debts and bought a much needed, new car! Please take your time to read this plan. IT WILL CHANGE YOUR LIFE FOREVER$!!! Remember, it won't work if YOU don't try it! This program DOES work, BUT you must follow it EXACTLY! Especially the rules of not trying to place your name in a different place. It won't work and you'll lose out on A LOT of money! In order for this program to work, you must meet your goal of 20+ orders for REPORT #1, and 100+ orders for REPORT #2 and YOU WILL MAKE $50,000 or more in 90 days! I AM LIVING PROOF THAT IT WORKS!!! If you choose not to participate in this program, I am sorry. It really is a great opportunity with little cost or risk to you. If you choose to participate, follow the program and you will be on your way to financial security. If you are a fellow business owner and are in financial trouble like I was, or you want to start your own business, consider this a sign. I DID! $$ Sincerely, Johnathon Rourke A PERSONAL NOTE FROM THE ORIGINATOR OF THIS PROGRAM: By the time you have read the enclosed program and reports, you should have concluded that such a program, and one that is legal, could not have been created by an amateur. Let me tell you a little about myself. I had a profitable business for 10 years. Then in 1979 my business began falling off. I was doing the same things that were previously successful for me, but it wasn't working. Finally, I figured it out. It wasn't me, it was the economy. Inflation and recession had replaced the stable economy that had been with us since 1945. I don't have to tell you what happened to the unemployment rate... because many of you know from first-hand experience. There were more failures and bankruptcies than ever before. The middle class was vanishing. Those who knew what they were doing invested wisely and moved up. Those who did not, including those who never had anything to save or invest, were moving down into the ranks of the poor. As the saying goes, "THE RICH GET RICHER AND THE POOR GET POORER." The traditional methods of making money will never allow you to "move up" or "get rich"— inflation will see to that! You have just received information that can give you financial freedom for the rest of your life, with "NO RISK" and "JUST A LITTLE BIT OF EFFORT." You can make more money in the next few months than you have ever imagined. I should also point out that I would not see a penny of this money, nor anyone else who has provided a testimonial for this program. I have retired from the program after sending thousands and thousands of programs. Follow the program EXACTLY AS INSTRUCTED. Do not change it in any way. It works exceedingly well as it is now. Remember to e-mail a copy of this exciting report to everyone you can think of. One of the people you send this to may send out 50,000...and your name will be on every one of them! REMEMBER though, ----- the MORE YOU SEND OUT, the more potential customers you will reach. So my friend, I have given you the ideas, information, materials and OPPORTUNITY to become FINANCIALLY INDEPENDENT! IT IS UP TO YOU!! NOW DO IT!! BEFORE YOU delete this program from your in-box, as I almost did, take a little time to read it and REALLY THINK ABOUT IT. Get a pencil and figure out what could happen when YOU participate. Figure out the worst possible response and no matter how you calculate it, you will still make a LOT OF MONEY! You will definitely get back what you invested. Any doubts you have will vanish when your first orders come in. $$$ IT WORKS!!! $$$ Jody Jacobs Richmond, VA HERE'S HOW THIS AMAZING PROGRAM WILL MAKE YOU THOUSANDS OF DOLLAR$$$$!!!! This method of raising capital REALLY WORKS 100% EVERY TIME. I am sure that you could use up to $50,000 or more in the next 90 days! Before you say "BULL... ", please read this program carefully. This is not a chain letter, but a perfectly legal money making business, marketing informational business reports. As with all multi-level businesses, we build our business by recruiting new partners and selling our products. Every state in the USA allows you to recruit new multi-level business partners, and we sell and deliver a product for EVERY dollar received. YOUR ORDERS COME BY MAIL AND ARE FILLED BY E-MAIL, so you are not involved in personal selling. You do it privately in your own home, store or office. This is the EASIEST marketing plan anywhere! It is simply order filling by email! The product is informational and instructional material, keys to the secrets for everyone on how to open the doors to the magic world of E-COMMERCE , the information highway, the wave of the future! PLAN SUMMARY: (1) You order the 4 reports listed below ($5 each). They come to you by email. (2) SAVE A COPY OF THIS ENTIRE LETTER and put your name after Report #1. Move the other names down. (3) Via the Internet, access Yahoo.com or any of the other major search engines to locate hundreds of bulk email service companies (search for "bulk email") and have them send 25,000 - 50,000 emails for you (about $49+). (4) Orders will come to you by postal mail - simply email them the Report they ordered. Let me ask you - isn't this about as easy as it gets?!?!?! By the way there are over 50 MILLION email addresses with millions more joining the internet each year so don't worry about "running out" or "saturation". People are used to seeing and hearing the same advertisements every day on radio/TV. How many times have you received the same pizza flyers on your door? Then one day you are hungry for pizza and you order one. Same thing with this letter. I received this letter many times - then one day I decided it was time to try it. YOU CAN START TODAY - JUST DO THESE EASY STEPS: STEP #1. ORDER THE FOUR REPORTS Order the four reports shown on the list below (you can't sell them if you don't order them).—For each report, send $5.00 CASH, the NAME & NUMBER OF THE REPORT YOU ARE ORDERING, YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS, and YOUR NAME & RETURN ADDRESS (in case of a problem) to the person whose name appears on the list next to the report. MAKE SURE YOUR RETURN ADDRESS IS ON YOUR ENVELOPE IN CASE OF ANY MAIL PROBLEMS! Within a few days you will receive, by e-mail, each of the four reports. Save them on your computer so you can send them to the 1,000's of people who will order them from you. STEP #2. ADD YOUR MAILING ADDRESS TO THIS LETTER a. Look below for the listing of the four reports. b. After you've ordered the four reports, delete the name and address under REPORT #4. This person has made it through the cycle. c. Move the name and address under REPORT #3 down to REPORT #4. d. Move the name and address under REPORT #2 down to REPORT #3. e. Move the name and address under REPORT #1 down to REPORT #2. f. Insert your name/address in the REPORT #1 position. Please make sure you COPY ALL INFORMATION, every name and address, ACCURATELY! STEP #3. Take this entire letter, including the modified list of names, and save it to your computer. Make NO changes to these instructions. Now you are ready to use this entire email to send by email to prospects. Report #1 will tell you how to download bulk email software and email addresses so you can send it out to thousands of people while you sleep! Remember that 50,000+ new people are joining the Internet every month. Your cost to participate in this is practically nothing (surely you can afford $20 and initial bulk mailing cost). You obviously already have a computer and an Internet connection and e-mail is FREE! There are two primary methods of building your downline: METHOD #1: SENDING BULK E-MAIL Let's say that you decide to start small, just to see how it goes. We'll also assume that you, and all those involved, email out only 2,000 programs each. Let's also assume that the mailing receives a 0.5% response. The response could be much better! Also, many people will email out hundreds of thousands of programs instead of 2,000 (Why stop at 2000?). But continuing with this example, you send out only 2,000 programs. With a 0.5% response, that is only 10 orders for REPORT #1. Those 10 people respond by sending out 2,000 programs each for a total of 20,000. Out of those 0.5%, 100 people respond and order REPORT #2. Those 100 mail out 2,000 programs each for a total of 200,000. The 0.5% response to that is 1,000 orders for REPORT #3. Those 1,000 send out 2,000 programs each for a 2,000,000 total. The 0.5% response to that is 10,000 orders for REPORT #4. That's 10,000 $5 bills for you. CASH!!! Your total income in this example is $50 + $500 + $5,000 + $50,000 for a total of $55,550!!! REMEMBER FRIEND, THIS IS ASSUMING 1,990 OUT OF THE 2,000 PEOPLE YOU MAIL TO WILL DO ABSOLUTELY NOTHING AND TRASH THIS PROGRAM! DARE TO THINK FOR A MOMENT WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF EVERYONE, OR HALF SENT OUT 100,000 PROGRAMS INSTEAD OF 2,000. Many people will do just that and more! METHOD #2 - PLACING FREE ADS ON THE INTERNET Advertising on the Internet is very, very inexpensive, and there are HUNDREDS of FREE places to advertise. Let's say you decide to start small just to see how well it works. Assume your goal is to get ONLY 10 people to participate on your first level. (Placing a lot of FREE ads on the Internet will EASILY get a larger response.) Also assume that everyone else in YOUR ORGANIZATION gets ONLY 10 downline members. Look how this small number accumulates to achieve the STAGGERING results below: 1st level—your first 10 send you $5 ..................……....$50 2nd level--10 members from those 10 ($5 x 100)...........$500 3rd level--10 members from those 100 ($5 x 1,000)......$5,000 4th level--10 members from those 1,000 ($5 x 10,000)..$50,000 $$$$$$ THIS TOTALS -----------------------------------$55,550 $$$$$$ AMAZING ISN'T IT? Remember friends, this assumes that the people who participate only recruit 10 people each. Think for a moment what would happen if they got 20 people to participate! Most people get 100's of participants and many will continue to work this program, sending out programs WITH YOUR NAME ON THEM for YEARS! THINK ABOUT IT! People are going to get emails about this plan from YOU or SOMEBODY ELSE and many will work this plan - the question is - Don't you want YOUR NAME to be on the emails they will send out? * * * DON'T MISS OUT!!! * * * JUST TRY IT ONCE!!! * * * * * SEE WHAT HAPPENS!!! *** YOU'LL BE AMAZED!!!* * ALWAYS PROVIDE SAME-DAY SERVICE ON ALL ORDERS! This will guarantee that the e-mail THEY send out with YOUR name and address on it will be prompt because they can't advertise until they receive the report! GET STARTED TODAY: PLACE YOUR ORDER FOR THE FOUR REPORTS NOW. Notes: -- ALWAYS SEND $5 CASH (U.S. CURRENCY) FOR EACH REPORT. CHECKS NOT ACCEPTED. Make sure the cash is concealed by wrapping it in TWO sheets of paper. On one of those sheets of paper write: (a) The number & name of the report you are ordering (b) Your e-mail address, and (c) Your name & postal address. REPORT #1a "The Insider's Guide to Advertising for Free on the Internet" ORDER REPORT #1a FROM: Liviu Tomulescu P.O. Box 1365 West Perth WA 6872 Australia NOTE: I, (and every member listed below), am DEDICATED to helping you with this program so it will work for you also. This IS a TEAM EFFORT! We communicate by email and even by phone! TRY US!) REPORT #2a "The Insider's Guide to Sending Bulk E-mail on the Internet" ORDER REPORT #2a FROM: MARK GAUDIANO 133 Sutton Ave. Hopwood, Pa 15445 REPORT #3a "The Secrets to Multilevel Marketing on the Internet" ORDER REPORT #3a FROM: Kim Kerslake Bulford Road Rai Valley Marlborough 7156 New Zealand REPORT #4a "How to become a Millionaire utilizing the Power of Multilevel Marketing and the Internet" ORDER REPORT #4a FROM: DAVID TALTY P.O. Box 51 Rochester, MA 02770 ******* TIPS FOR SUCCESS ******* TREAT THIS AS YOUR BUSINESS! Be prompt, professional, and follow the directions accurately. —Send for the four reports IMMEDIATELY so you will have them when the orders start coming in because: When you receive a $5 order, you MUST send out the requested product/report. It is required for this to be a legal business and they need the reports to send out their letters (with your name on them!) ALWAYS PROVIDE SAME-DAY SERVICE ON THE ORDERS YOU RECEIVE. Be patient and persistent with this program - If you follow the instructions exactly - results WILL FOLLOW. $$$$ ******* YOUR SUCCESS GUIDELINES ******* Follow these guidelines to guarantee your success: If you don't receive 20 orders for REPORT #1 within two weeks, continue advertising or sending e-mails until you do. Then, a couple of weeks later you should receive at least 100 orders for REPORT#2. If you don't, continue advertising or sending e-mails until you do. Once you have received 100 or more orders for REPORT #2, YOU CAN RELAX, because the system is already working for you, and the cash will continue to roll in! THIS IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER: Every time your name is moved down on the list, you are placed in front of a DIFFERENT report. You can KEEP TRACK of your PROGRESS by watching which report people are ordering from you. To generate MORE INCOME, simply send another batch of e-mails or continue placing ads and start the whole process again! There is no limit to the income you will generate from this business! Before you make your decision as to whether or not you participate in this program, please answer one question. ARE YOU HAPPY WITH YOUR PRESENT INCOME OR JOB? If the answer is no, then please look at the following FACTS about this SUPER SIMPLE MLM program: 1.NO face-to-face selling, NO meetings, NO inventory! NO Telephone calls, NO big cost to start! Nothing to learn, NO skills needed! (Surely you know how to send email?) 2.No equipment to buy - you already have a computer and Internet connection - so you have everything you need to fill orders! 3.You are selling a product, which does NOT COST ANYTHING TO PRODUCE OR SHIP! (Emailing copies of the reports is FREE!) 4.All of your customers pay you in CA$H! This program will change your LIFE FOREVER!! Look at the potential for you to be able to quit your job and live a life of luxury you could only dream about! Imagine getting out of debt and buying the car and home of your dreams! Imagine being able to work a super-high paying LEISURELY EASY BUSINES FROM HOME! $$$ FINALLY MAKE SOME DREAMS COME TRUE! $$$ ACT NOW! Take your first step toward achieving financial independence. Order the reports and follow the program outlined above—SUCCESS will be your reward! Thank you for your time and consideration. PLEASE NOTE: If you need help with starting a business, registering a business name, learning how income tax is handled, etc., contact your local office of the Small Business Administration (a Federal Agency) 1-800-827-5722 for free help and answers to questions. Also, the Internal Revenue Service offers free help via telephone and free seminars about business tax requirements. Your earnings are highly dependent on your activities and advertising. The information contained on this site and in the report constitutes no guarantees, stated or implied. In the event that it is determined that this site or report constitutes a guarantee of any kind, that guarantee is now void. The earnings amounts listed on this site and in the report are estimates only. If you have any questions of the legality of this program, contact the Office of Associate Director for Marketing Practices, Federal Trade Commission, Bureau of Consumer Protection in Washington, DC. Under Bill s.1618 TITLE III passed by the 105th US Congress this letter cannot be considered Spam as long as the sender includes contact information and a method of removal. You can reply and request removal, however, this is a one-time e-mail transmission and as such no request for removal is necessary. From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 03:33:58 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id DAA07605 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 03:33:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f058N3307164; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:23:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f058Vl217367; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:31:47 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:31:47 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 00:31:18 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101050831.f058V7B05532@xwing.netscape.com> From: u'llmake@WDEN.more.netscape.com To: @netscape.com Subject: $100,000 to you in the next couple of months. -GBTU X-Reply-To: m58wd@yohoo.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"H-ZR_C.A.3OE.xZYV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Want to receive a large amount of money? Give away access to a Free Visa Card and get paid $2 down to 10 levels. Do the math, if everyone reffers only 5 people. You know 5 people that are in need of more money and a Visa Card, right? This can mean hundreds of thousands of dollars and more!! Send me an e-mail right now, and I'll get the info to you. mailto:redbaronm@yahoo.com?subject=moreinfo From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 08:57:00 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id IAA12630 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:57:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f05Des308323; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 05:40:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f05Dsrs28550; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 05:54:53 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 05:54:53 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101051351.f05Dp4E20429@smtp13.singnet.com.sg> X-Sender: try2k@email.com From: Webmaster To: "eweb8" Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 21:51:34 +0800 Subject: FREE VISA CARD Pays Up To 10 Level!!! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"y5Do7B.A.09G.sIdV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, Wishing you a happy and prosperous 2001! Take a quick look at the Free Visa Card program. They're giving away free Visa cards with free flight miles on any airline and paying MLM commissions to refer other Cardholders. They pay out on a huge 10-level plan ($10 for the first level and $2 on the next nine). You already know how many millions of dollars that kind of multiplication can generate. Nobody buys a thing. The money comes from the bank because of the value of cardholders. This thing is spreading like wildfire. Please check it out. Request for info! mailto:amzin@usa.com?subject=Vinfo pls! Regards. ...................................................................... To be removed from this mailing list please send mailto:holai@usa.com?subject=remove me! From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 10:32:38 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id KAA15031 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 10:32:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f05FGO317307; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 07:16:25 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f05FUNo27241; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 07:30:23 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 07:30:23 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 08:29:58 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: Cc: Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: draft Java-api-12 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_7D261F92.C5A4E733" Resent-Message-ID: <"-Byj1B.A.XpG.OieV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_7D261F92.C5A4E733 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >>> Rob Weltman 03-Jan-01 5:13:40 PM >>> Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > >>> Rob Weltman 27-Dec-00 10:53:27 PM >>> > Steven Sonntag wrote: > > > > Rob Weltman wrote: > > > > > It might be better instead to eliminate the current unsolicited > > > notification methods and instead have methods to add and remove > > > listeners for usolicited notifications. The implementation can then > > > discard unsolicited notifications if there are no listeners. For > > > example (I haven't thought this through completely yet): > > > > > > LDAPConnection > > > > > > public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > Rob > > > > > > > It seems natural to me that if unsolicited notifications are enabled = on > > a > > listener, that the method LDAPListener.getMessageIDs() would include > > message ID 0 in the list of message IDs, and that > > LDAPConnection.abandon(0) > > and LDAPConnection.abandon(listener) could be used to removeUnsolicited= > > notifications from a listener or listeners. This raises some = questions. > > > > 1) Should getMessageIDs show messageID 0 when unsolicited notification > > are enabled? (My vote is yes) > > > > 2) Should the draft allow abandon to be used to remove unsolicited > > notifications? > > (this means that message ID 0 is treated like a message that never > > completes) > > > > 3) If number two is allowed, is removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener()= > > necessary? > > > > -Steve > > I think it is easier for a client to handle unsolicited notifications = as out-of-band events rather than lumped together with "normal" solicited = responses. In almost all cases I would expect a client to want to know = immediately that an unsolicited notification had arrived rather than = having to poll and distinguish between solicited and unsolicited notificati= ons. The event listener model reflects the paradigm of immediate out-of-ban= d notification of unsolicited messages. Having the unsolicited messages = ALSO appear in the normal message queue is confusing, error-prone, and not = very useful as far as I can tell. > > Rob........................................What you say may be true, but = - using the listener paradigm allows thedeveloper to combine any combinatio= n of listeners, normal messages,and unsolicited messages. Why make an out = of a special out of band APIfor something that could be handled naturally = by the existing API. When you say the application wants to know immediately= , you meanthe unsolicited notification message should comes up first, i.e. = returnedto the application before other normal messages - correct? If the = unsolicitednotification is mixed with other messages, the draft should = specify thatunsolicited messages are returned first. > -Steve No, not at all. With an event listener model, a client that is interested= in unsolicited notifications registers as an UnsolicitedNotificationListen= er. Immediately when an unsolicited notification arrives, a method of the = client (e.g. messageReceived) is called with the unsolicited notification = as parameter. That way the client is notified immediately and asynchronousl= y rather than having to poll the message queue. Besides being simpler and = more convenient for the client, it is much cleaner and less error-prone = both for the client and for the implementor of the API. In-band responses = are delivered in-band to the submitter of in-band requests; unsolicited = notifications are delivered out-of-band to a requestor of unsolicited = notifications. Rob ................................................................ You are describing a callback mechanism, but the interface described in earlier e-mails, just registered an LDAPResponseListener which has no callback semantics associated with it. Are you thinking of a new kind of listener. In our previous discussion you suggested the following = API > > public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) Are you thinking of adding a method to LDAPResponseListener to register a callback method? -Steve --=_7D261F92.C5A4E733 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


>>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> = 03-Jan-01=20 5:13:40 PM >>>
Steve Sonntag wrote:

>
>
>= =20 >>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> 27-Dec-00 10:53:27 = PM=20 >>>
> Steven Sonntag wrote:
> >
> > Rob = Weltman=20 wrote:
> >
> > >   It might be better = instead to=20 eliminate the current unsolicited
> > > notification methods = and=20 instead have methods to add and remove
> > > listeners for=20 usolicited notifications. The implementation can then
> > > = discard=20 unsolicited notifications if there are no listeners. For
> > = >=20 example (I haven't thought this through completely yet):
> >=20 >
> > > LDAPConnection
> > >
> > > = public=20 LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> > = >=20 LDAPResponseListener listener )
> > >
> > > public = void=20 removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> > > LDAPResponseListen= er=20 listener )
> > >
> > > Rob
> > >
>= ;=20 >
> > It seems natural to me that if unsolicited notifications = are=20 enabled on
> > a
> > listener, that the method=20 LDAPListener.getMessageIDs() would include
> > message ID 0 in = the list=20 of message IDs, and that
> > LDAPConnection.abandon(0)
> = > and=20 LDAPConnection.abandon(listener) could be used to removeUnsolicited
>= >=20 notifications from a listener or listeners.  This raises some=20 questions.
> >
> > 1) Should getMessageIDs show = messageID 0=20 when unsolicited notification
> > are enabled?  (My vote = is=20 yes)
> >
> > 2) Should the draft allow abandon to be = used to=20 remove unsolicited
> > notifications?
> > (this means = that=20 message ID 0 is treated like a message that never
> >=20 completes)
> >
> > 3) If number two is allowed, is=20 removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener()
> > necessary?
>=20 >
> > -Steve
>
>   I think it is easier = for a=20 client to handle unsolicited notifications as out-of-band events rather = than=20 lumped together with "normal" solicited responses. In almost all cases I = would=20 expect a client to want to know immediately that an unsolicited notificatio= n had=20 arrived rather than having to poll and distinguish between solicited = and=20 unsolicited notifications. The event listener model reflects the paradigm = of=20 immediate out-of-band notification of unsolicited messages. Having the=20 unsolicited messages ALSO appear in the normal message queue is confusing,= =20 error-prone, and not very useful as far as I can tell.
>
>=20 Rob........................................What you say may be true, but - = using=20 the listener paradigm allows thedeveloper to combine any combination of=20 listeners, normal messages,and unsolicited messages.  Why make an out = of a=20 special out of band APIfor something that could be handled naturally by = the=20 existing API. When you say the application wants to know immediately, = you=20 meanthe unsolicited notification message should comes up first, i.e. = returnedto=20 the application before other normal messages - correct? If the=20 unsolicitednotification is mixed with other messages, the draft should = specify=20 thatunsolicited messages are returned first.
>  -Steve

&n= bsp;=20 No, not at all. With an event listener model, a client that is interested = in=20 unsolicited notifications registers as an UnsolicitedNotificationListener.= =20 Immediately when an unsolicited notification arrives, a method of the = client=20 (e.g. messageReceived) is called with the unsolicited notification as = parameter.=20 That way the client is notified immediately and asynchronously rather = than=20 having to poll the message queue. Besides being simpler and more convenient= for=20 the client, it is much cleaner and less error-prone both for the client = and for=20 the implementor of the API. In-band responses are delivered in-band to = the=20 submitter of in-band requests; unsolicited notifications are delivered=20 out-of-band to a requestor of unsolicited=20 notifications.

Rob
..............................................= ..................
 
You are describing a callback mechanism, but the interface described
in earlier e-mails, just registered an LDAPResponseListener which = has
no callback semantics associated with it.  Are you thinking of = a=20 new
kind of listener.  In our previous discussion you suggested = the=20 following API
 
> > public LDAPResponseListener=20 addUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> > LDAPResponseListener = listener=20 )
> >
> > public void=20 removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> > LDAPResponseListener=20= listener )
 
Are you thinking of adding a method to LDAPResponseListener to
register a callback method?
 
-Steve

--=_7D261F92.C5A4E733-- From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 11:23:58 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA15970 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 11:23:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f05GDH326871; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:13:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f05GM2Q16864; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:22:02 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:22:02 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101051620.f05GKeg13149@jupiter.accesscable.net> X-Sender: goldenhord@usa.net From: Maximum Profits To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 12:14:44 -0400 Subject: Company Seeking persons to place ads on Net.. 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From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 11:34:19 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA16164 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 11:34:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f05GIE325305; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:18:14 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f05GWDk21008; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:32:13 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:32:13 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A55F7F4.FCF5D7A7@worldspot.com> Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 08:36:04 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en-US,sv,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Sonntag CC: robw@worldspot.com, ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: draft Java-api-12 References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"UyIkED.A.-HF.McfV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > >>> Rob Weltman 03-Jan-01 5:13:40 PM >>> > Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > > > > > >>> Rob Weltman 27-Dec-00 10:53:27 PM >>> > > Steven Sonntag wrote: > > > > > > Rob Weltman wrote: > > > > > > > It might be better instead to eliminate the current unsolicited > > > > notification methods and instead have methods to add and remove > > > > listeners for usolicited notifications. The implementation can then > > > > discard unsolicited notifications if there are no listeners. For > > > > example (I haven't thought this through completely yet): > > > > > > > > LDAPConnection > > > > > > > > public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > > > Rob > > > > > > > > > > It seems natural to me that if unsolicited notifications are enabled on > > > a > > > listener, that the method LDAPListener.getMessageIDs() would include > > > message ID 0 in the list of message IDs, and that > > > LDAPConnection.abandon(0) > > > and LDAPConnection.abandon(listener) could be used to removeUnsolicited > > > notifications from a listener or listeners. This raises some questions. > > > > > > 1) Should getMessageIDs show messageID 0 when unsolicited notification > > > are enabled? (My vote is yes) > > > > > > 2) Should the draft allow abandon to be used to remove unsolicited > > > notifications? > > > (this means that message ID 0 is treated like a message that never > > > completes) > > > > > > 3) If number two is allowed, is removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener() > > > necessary? > > > > > > -Steve > > > > I think it is easier for a client to handle unsolicited notifications as out-of-band events rather than lumped together with "normal" solicited responses. In almost all cases I would expect a client to want to know immediately that an unsolicited notification had arrived rather than having to poll and distinguish between solicited and unsolicited notifications. The event listener model reflects the paradigm of immediate out-of-band notification of unsolicited messages. Having the unsolicited messages ALSO appear in the normal message queue is confusing, error-prone, and not very useful as far as I can tell. > > > > Rob........................................What you say may be true, but - using the listener paradigm allows thedeveloper to combine any combination of listeners, normal messages,and unsolicited messages. Why make an out of a special out of band APIfor something that could be handled naturally by the existing API. When you say the application wants to know immediately, you meanthe unsolicited notification message should comes up first, i.e. returnedto the application before other normal messages - correct? If the unsolicitednotification is mixed with other messages, the draft should specify thatunsolicited messages are returned first. > > -Steve > > No, not at all. With an event listener model, a client that is interested in unsolicited notifications registers as an UnsolicitedNotificationListener. Immediately when an unsolicited notification arrives, a method of the client (e.g. messageReceived) is called with the unsolicited notification as parameter. That way the client is notified immediately and asynchronously rather than having to poll the message queue. Besides being simpler and more convenient for the client, it is much cleaner and less error-prone both for the client and for the implementor of the API. In-band responses are delivered in-band to the submitter of in-band requests; unsolicited notifications are delivered out-of-band to a requestor of unsolicited notifications. > > Rob > ................................................................ You are describing a callback mechanism, but the interface describedin earlier e-mails, just registered an LDAPResponseListener which hasno callback semantics associated with it. Are you thinking of a newkind of listener. In our previous discussion you suggested the following API > > public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) Are you thinking of adding a method to LDAPResponseListener toregister a callback method? -Steve > It might be better to define a new interface for the callback. public void addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener listener ) public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener listener ) public interface LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener { public void messageReceived( LDAPMessage msg ); } Rob From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 12:06:36 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA16879 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 12:06:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f05Gtc306087; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 08:55:39 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f05H4NA16030; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 09:04:23 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 09:04:23 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 10:04:06 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: , Cc: "Alan Clark" Subject: Re: Fwd: Re: draft Java-api-12 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_6338019A.650447E0" Resent-Message-ID: <"zhiGPD.A.b5D.V6fV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_6338019A.650447E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This makes more sense to me now. Although both mechanisms work, the callback paradigm has the advantage of immediate notification to the application. Thanks for the clarification. I think this is a better way = to go. I also believe we should add Kurt's suggestion, that requests should not use message ID of 0 - i.e. let it be reserved for unsolicited = notifications. -Steve >>> Rob Weltman 05-Jan-01 9:36:04 AM >>> Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > >>> Rob Weltman 03-Jan-01 5:13:40 PM >>> > Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > > > > > >>> Rob Weltman 27-Dec-00 10:53:27 PM >>> > > Steven Sonntag wrote: > > > > > > Rob Weltman wrote: > > > > > > > It might be better instead to eliminate the current unsolicited > > > > notification methods and instead have methods to add and remove > > > > listeners for usolicited notifications. The implementation can = then > > > > discard unsolicited notifications if there are no listeners. For > > > > example (I haven't thought this through completely yet): > > > > > > > > LDAPConnection > > > > > > > > public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > > > Rob > > > > > > > > > > It seems natural to me that if unsolicited notifications are enabled = on > > > a > > > listener, that the method LDAPListener.getMessageIDs() would include > > > message ID 0 in the list of message IDs, and that > > > LDAPConnection.abandon(0) > > > and LDAPConnection.abandon(listener) could be used to removeUnsolicit= ed > > > notifications from a listener or listeners. This raises some = questions. > > > > > > 1) Should getMessageIDs show messageID 0 when unsolicited notificatio= n > > > are enabled? (My vote is yes) > > > > > > 2) Should the draft allow abandon to be used to remove unsolicited > > > notifications? > > > (this means that message ID 0 is treated like a message that never > > > completes) > > > > > > 3) If number two is allowed, is removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener= () > > > necessary? > > > > > > -Steve > > > > I think it is easier for a client to handle unsolicited notifications= as out-of-band events rather than lumped together with "normal" solicited = responses. In almost all cases I would expect a client to want to know = immediately that an unsolicited notification had arrived rather than = having to poll and distinguish between solicited and unsolicited notificati= ons. The event listener model reflects the paradigm of immediate out-of-ban= d notification of unsolicited messages. Having the unsolicited messages = ALSO appear in the normal message queue is confusing, error-prone, and not = very useful as far as I can tell. > > > > Rob........................................What you say may be true, = but - using the listener paradigm allows thedeveloper to combine any = combination of listeners, normal messages,and unsolicited messages. Why = make an out of a special out of band APIfor something that could be = handled naturally by the existing API. When you say the application wants = to know immediately, you meanthe unsolicited notification message should = comes up first, i.e. returnedto the application before other normal = messages - correct? If the unsolicitednotification is mixed with other = messages, the draft should specify thatunsolicited messages are returned = first. > > -Steve > > No, not at all. With an event listener model, a client that is = interested in unsolicited notifications registers as an UnsolicitedNotifica= tionListener. Immediately when an unsolicited notification arrives, a = method of the client (e.g. messageReceived) is called with the unsolicited = notification as parameter. That way the client is notified immediately and = asynchronously rather than having to poll the message queue. Besides being = simpler and more convenient for the client, it is much cleaner and less = error-prone both for the client and for the implementor of the API. = In-band responses are delivered in-band to the submitter of in-band = requests; unsolicited notifications are delivered out-of-band to a = requestor of unsolicited notifications. > > Rob > ................................................................ You are = describing a callback mechanism, but the interface describedin earlier = e-mails, just registered an LDAPResponseListener which hasno callback = semantics associated with it. Are you thinking of a newkind of listener. = In our previous discussion you suggested the following API > > public = LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) > > > > > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( > > > LDAPResponseListener listener ) Are you thinking of adding a method = to LDAPResponseListener toregister a callback method? -Steve > It might be better to define a new interface for the callback. public void addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener listener ) public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener listener ) public interface LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener { public void messageReceived( LDAPMessage msg ); } Rob --=_6338019A.650447E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This makes more sense to me now.  Although = both=20 mechanisms work,
the callback paradigm has the advantage of immediate=20= notification to the
application.  Thanks for the clarification.  = I think=20 this is a better way to go.
 
I also believe we should add Kurt's suggestion, that = requests=20 should
not use message ID of 0 - i.e. let it be reserved = for=20 unsolicited notifications.
 
-Steve


>>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> = 05-Jan-01=20 9:36:04 AM >>>
Steve Sonntag wrote:

>
>
>= =20 >>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> 03-Jan-01 5:13:40 = PM=20 >>>
> Steve Sonntag wrote:
>
> >
>=20 >
> > >>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> = 27-Dec-00=20 10:53:27 PM >>>
> > Steven Sonntag wrote:
> = >=20 >
> > > Rob Weltman wrote:
> > >
> > = >=20 >   It might be better instead to eliminate the current=20 unsolicited
> > > > notification methods and instead have = methods=20 to add and remove
> > > > listeners for usolicited = notifications.=20 The implementation can then
> > > > discard unsolicited=20 notifications if there are no listeners. For
> > > > = example (I=20 haven't thought this through completely yet):
> > > >
>= ;=20 > > > LDAPConnection
> > > >
> > > = >=20 public LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> = >=20 > > LDAPResponseListener listener )
> > > >
> = >=20 > > public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> > = >=20 > LDAPResponseListener listener )
> > > >
> > = >=20 > Rob
> > > >
> > >
> > > It = seems=20 natural to me that if unsolicited notifications are enabled on
> = > >=20 a
> > > listener, that the method LDAPListener.getMessageIDs() = would=20 include
> > > message ID 0 in the list of message IDs, and=20 that
> > > LDAPConnection.abandon(0)
> > > and=20 LDAPConnection.abandon(listener) could be used to removeUnsolicited
>= >=20 > notifications from a listener or listeners.  This raises some=20 questions.
> > >
> > > 1) Should getMessageIDs = show=20 messageID 0 when unsolicited notification
> > > are enabled?&nb= sp;=20 (My vote is yes)
> > >
> > > 2) Should the draft = allow=20 abandon to be used to remove unsolicited
> > >=20 notifications?
> > > (this means that message ID 0 is treated = like a=20 message that never
> > > completes)
> > >
> = >=20 > 3) If number two is allowed, is=20 removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener()
> > > necessary?
>= ;=20 > >
> > > -Steve
> >
> >   I = think=20 it is easier for a client to handle unsolicited notifications as out-of-ban= d=20 events rather than lumped together with "normal" solicited responses. In = almost=20 all cases I would expect a client to want to know immediately that an=20 unsolicited notification had arrived rather than having to poll and = distinguish=20 between solicited and unsolicited notifications. The event listener = model=20 reflects the paradigm of immediate out-of-band notification of unsolicited= =20 messages. Having the unsolicited messages ALSO appear in the normal = message=20 queue is confusing, error-prone, and not very useful as far as I can=20 tell.
> >
> > Rob........................................= What=20 you say may be true, but - using the listener paradigm allows thedeveloper = to=20 combine any combination of listeners, normal messages,and unsolicited=20 messages.  Why make an out of a special out of band APIfor something = that=20 could be handled naturally by the existing API. When you say the applicatio= n=20 wants to know immediately, you meanthe unsolicited notification message = should=20 comes up first, i.e. returnedto the application before other normal = messages -=20 correct? If the unsolicitednotification is mixed with other messages, the = draft=20 should specify thatunsolicited messages are returned first.
> = > =20 -Steve
>
>   No, not at all. With an event listener = model,=20 a client that is interested in unsolicited notifications registers as = an=20 UnsolicitedNotificationListener. Immediately when an unsolicited notificati= on=20 arrives, a method of the client (e.g. messageReceived) is called with = the=20 unsolicited notification as parameter. That way the client is notified=20 immediately and asynchronously rather than having to poll the message = queue.=20 Besides being simpler and more convenient for the client, it is much = cleaner and=20 less error-prone both for the client and for the implementor of the API. = In-band=20 responses are delivered in-band to the submitter of in-band requests;=20 unsolicited notifications are delivered out-of-band to a requestor of=20 unsolicited notifications.
>
> Rob
>=20 ................................................................ You = are=20 describing a callback mechanism, but the interface describedin earlier = e-mails,=20 just registered an LDAPResponseListener which hasno callback semantics=20 associated with it.  Are you thinking of a newkind of listener.  = In=20 our previous discussion you suggested the following API > > = public=20 LDAPResponseListener addUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> > = >=20 LDAPResponseListener listener )
> > >
> > > public = void=20 removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
> > > LDAPResponseListen= er=20 listener ) Are you thinking of adding a method to LDAPResponseListener=20 toregister a callback method? -Steve
>

  It might be = better to=20 define a new interface for the callback.

public void=20 addUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
   =20 LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener listener )

public void=20 removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener(
   =20 LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener listener )


public = interface=20 LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener {
   public void=20 messageReceived( LDAPMessage msg=20 );
}


Rob


--=_6338019A.650447E0-- From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 5 23:15:53 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id XAA29456 for ; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 23:15:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0644x319316; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 20:04:59 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f064DiM05854; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 20:13:44 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 20:13:44 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 20:13:31 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101060413.f064DUD15270@ywing.netscape.com> From: BEL.EADN@ywing.netscape.com To: Everyone.ILAI@netscape.com Subject: Twice Voted #1 Business -TKSE X-Reply-To: belbirkdale@hotmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jM6Ds.A.TaB.3tpV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Dear Friend: AS SEEN ON NATIONAL TV: ''Making over half million dollars every 4 to 5 months from your home for an investment of only $25 U.S. Dollars expense one time'' THANKS TO THE COMPUTER AGE AND THE INTERNET! BE A MILLIONAIRE LIKE OTHERS WITHIN A YEAR !! Before you say ''Bull'' , please read the following. This is the letter you have been hearing about on the news lately. Due to the popularity of this letter on the internet, a national weekly news program recently devoted an entire show to the investigation of this program described below , to see if it really can make people money. The show also investigated whether or not the program was legal. Their findings proved once and for all that there are ''absolutely NO laws prohibiting the participation in the program and if people can follow the simple instructions, they are bound to make some mega bucks with only $25 out of pocket cost''. DUE TO THE RECENT INCREASE OF POPULARITY & RESPECT THIS PROGRAM HAS ATTAINED, IT IS CURRENTLY WORKING BETTER THAN EVER. This is what one had to say: ''Thanks to this profitable opportunity. I was approached many times before but each time I passed on it. I am so glad I finally joined just to see what one could expect in return for the minimal effort and money required. To my astonishment, I received total $ 610,470.00 in 21 weeks, with money still coming in''. Pam Hedland, Fort Lee, New Jersey. -------------------------------------------------------------------------= Here is another testimonial: ''This program has been around for a long time but I never believed in it. But one day when I received this again in the mail I decided to gamble my $25 on it. I followed the simple instructions and walaa ..... 3 weeks later the money started to come in. First month I only made $240.00 but the next 2 months after that I made a total of $290,000.00. So far, in the past 8 months by re-entering the program,I have made over $710,000.00 and I am playing it again. The key to success in this program is to follow the simple steps and NOT change anything .'' More testimonials later but first, ****** PRINT THIS NOW FOR YOUR FUTURE REFERENCE ******* $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ If you would like to make at least $500,000 every 4 to 5 months easily and comfortably, please read the following...THEN READ IT AGAIN and AGAIN !!! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ FOLLOW THE SIMPLE INSTRUCTION BELOW AND YOUR FINANCIAL DREAMS WILL COME TRUE, GUARANTEED! INSTRUCTIONS: **** Order all 5 reports shown on the list below. **** For each report, send $5 CASH, THE NAME & NUMBER OF THE REPORT YOU ARE ORDERING and YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS to the person whose name appears ON THAT LIST next to the report. MAKE SURE YOUR RETURN ADDRESS IS ON YOUR ENVELOPE TOP LEFT CORNER in case of any mail problems. **** When you place your order, make sure you order each of the 5 reports. You will need all 5 reports so that you can save them on your computer and resell them. YOUR TOTAL COST $5 X 5 =3D $25.00. **** Within a few days you will receive, via e-mail, each of the 5 reports from these 5 different individuals. Save them on your computer so they will be accessible for you to send to the 1,000's of people who will order them from you. Also make a floppy of these reports and keep it on your desk in case something happens to your computer. ****.IMPORTANT - DO NOT alter the names of the people who are listed next to each report, or their sequence on the list, in any way other than what is instructed below in step '' 1 through 6 '' or you will loose out on majority of your profits. Once you understand the way this works, you will also see how it does not work if you change it. Remember, this method has been tested, and if you alter it, it will NOT work!!! People have tried to put their friends/relatives names on all five thinking they could get all the money. But it does not work this way. Believe us, we all have tried to be greedy and then nothing happened. So Do Not try to change anything other than what is = instructed. Because if you do, it will not work for you. Remember, honesty reaps the reward!!! 1.. After you have ordered all 5 reports, take this advertisement and REMOVE the name & address of the person in REPORT # 5. This person has made it through the cycle and is no doubt counting their fortune. 2.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 4 down TO REPORT # 5. 3.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 3 down TO REPORT # 4. 4.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 2 down TO REPORT # 3. 5.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 1 down TO REPORT # 2 6.... Insert YOUR name & address in the REPORT # 1 Position. PLEASE MAKE SURE you copy every name & address ACCURATELY ! ========================================================== Take this entire letter, with the modified list of names, and save it on your computer. DO NOT MAKE ANY OTHER CHANGES. Save this on a disk as well just in case if you loose any data. To assist you with marketing your business on the internet, the 5 reports you purchase will provide you with invaluable marketing information which includes how to send bulk e-mails legally, where to find thousands of free classified ads and much more. There are 2 Primary methods to get this venture going: METHOD # 1 : BY SENDING BULK E-MAIL LEGALLY ==================================================== Let's say that you decide to start small, just to see how it goes, and we will assume you and those involved after you send out only 5,000 e-mails each. Let's also assume that the mailing receive only a 0.2% response (the response could be much better but lets just say it is only 0.2% . Also many people will send out hundreds of thousands e-mails instead of only 5,000 each). Continuing with this example, you send out only 5,000 e-mails. With a 0.2% response, that is only 10 orders for report # 1. Those 10 people responded by sending out 5,000 e-mail each for a total of 50,000. Out of those 50,000 e-mails only 0.2% responded with orders. That's =3D 100 people responded and ordered Report # 2. Those 100 people mail out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of 500,000 e-mails. The 0.2% response to that is 1000 orders for Report # 3. Those 1000 people send out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of 5 million e-mails sent out. The 0.2% response to that is 10,000 orders for Report # 4. Those 10,000 people send out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of 50,000,000 (50 million) e-mails. The 0.2% response to that is 100,000 orders for Report # 5. THAT'S 100,000 ORDERS TIMES $5 EACH =3D $500,000.00 (half million). Your total income in this example is: 1..... $50 + 2..... $500 + 3..... $5,000 + 4..... $50,000 + 5..... $500,000 ......... Grand Total =3D $555,550.00 NUMBERS DO NOT LIE. GET A PENCIL & PAPER AND FIGURE OUT THE WORST POSSIBLE RESPONSES AND NO MATTER HOW YOU CALCULATE IT, YOU WILL STILL MAKE A LOT OF MONEY ! -------------------------------------------------------------------------= --- --------- REMEMBER FRIEND, THIS IS ASSUMING ONLY 10 PEOPLE ORDERING OUT OF 5,000 YOU MAILED TO. Dare to think for a moment what would happen if everyone, or half or even one 4th of those people mailed 100,000 e-mails each or more? There are over 150 million people on the internet worldwide and counting. Believe me, many people will do just that, and more! METHOD # 2 : BY PLACING FREE ADS ON THE INTERNET ==================================================== Advertising on the net is very very inexpensive and there are hundreds of FREE places to advertise. Placing a lot of free ads on the internet will easily get a larger response. We strongly suggest you start with Method # 1 and add METHOD # 2 as you go along. For every $5 you receive, all you must do is e-mail them the Report they ordered. That's it . Always provide same day service on all orders. This will guarantee that the e-mail they send out, with your name and address on it, will be prompt because they can not advertise until they receive the report. _____________________ AVAILABLE REPORTS_____________________ ORDER EACH REPORT BY ITS NUMBER & NAME ONLY. Notes: Always send $5 cash (U.S. CURRENCY) for each Report. Checks NOT accepted. Make sure the cash is concealed by wrapping it in at least 2 sheets of paper. On one of those sheets of paper, Write the NUMBER & the NAME of the Report you are ordering, YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS and your name and postal address. PLACE YOUR ORDER FOR THESE REPORTS NOW: ========================================================== REPORT # 1 : ''The Insider's Guide to Advertising for Free on the Net'' Order Report # 1 from: BEL P.O. Box 802 Capalaba Qld 4157 AUSTRALIA (Don't forget to use an airmail postage stamp!) __________________________________________________ REPORT # 2 : ''The Insider's Guide to Sending Bulk e-mail on the Net'' Order Report # 2 from : DA McKie 11 Burwana Pl Birkdale QLD 4159 AUSTRALIA (Don't forget to use an airmail postage stamp!) _________________________________________________ REPORT # 3 : ''The Secret to Multilevel marketing on the net'' Order Report # 3 from: ATA P.O. Box 813 Red Deer, AB, Canada T4N 5H2. __________________________________________________ REPORT # 4 : ''How to become a millionaire utilizing MLM & the Net'' Order Report # 4 from: OCC P.O. Box 1075 Auburn, AL 36831-1075 U.S.A. ____________________________________________________ REPORT # 5 : ''HOW TO SEND 1 MILLION E-MAILS FOR FREE'' Order Report # 5 from: R. Jones 446 S. Anaheim Hills Rd, #141B Anaheim, CA 92807-4858 U.S.A. __________________________________________________ $$$$$$$$$ YOUR SUCCESS GUIDELINES $$$$$$$$$$$ Follow these guidelines to guarantee your success: If you do not receive at least 10 orders for Report #1 within 2 weeks, continue sending e-mails until you do. After you have received 10 orders, 2 to 3 weeks after that you should receive 100 orders or more for REPORT # 2. If you did not, continue advertising or sending e-mails until you do. Once you have received 100 or more orders for Report # 2, YOU CAN RELAX, because the system is already working for you , and the cash will continue to roll in ! THIS IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER : Every time your name is moved down on the list, you are placed in front of a different report. You can KEEP TRACK of your PROGRESS by watching which report people are ordering from you. IF YOU WANT TO GENERATE MORE INCOME SEND ANOTHER BATCH OF E-MAILS AND START THE WHOLE PROCESS AGAIN. There is NO LIMIT to the income you can generate from this business !!! ____________________________________________________ FOLLOWING IS A NOTE FROM THE ORIGINATOR OF THIS PROGRAM: "You have just received information that can give you financial freedom for the rest of your life, with NO RISK and JUST A LITTLE BIT OF EFFORT. You can make more money in the next few weeks and months than you have ever imagined. Follow the program EXACTLY AS INSTRUCTED. Do Not change it in any way. It works exceedingly well as it is now. Remember to e-mail a copy of this exciting report after you have put your name and address in Report #1 and moved others to #2...........# 5 as instructed above. One of the people you send this to may send out 100,000 or more e-mails and your name will be on everyone of them. Remember though, the more you send out the more potential customers you will reach. So my friend, I have given you the ideas, information, materials and opportunity to become financially independent. IT IS UP TO YOU NOW ! ************** MORE TESTIMONIALS **************** '' My name is Mitchell. My wife , Jody and I live in Chicago. I am an accountant with a major U.S. Corporation and I make pretty good money. When I received this program I grumbled to Jody about receiving ''junk mail''. I made fun of the whole thing, spouting my knowledge of the population and percentages involved. I ''knew'' it wouldn't work. Jody totally ignored my supposed intelligence and few days later she jumped in with both feet. I made merciless fun of her, and was ready to lay the old ''I told you so'' on her when the thing didn't work. Well, the laugh was on me! Within 3 weeks she had received 50 responses. Within the next 45 days she had received a total of $ 147,200.00 all cash! I was shocked. I have joined Jody in her ''hobby''. Mitchell Wolf, M.D. , Chicago, Illinois ------------------------------------------------------------ '' Not being the gambling type, it took me several weeks to make up my mind to participate in this plan. But conservative that I am, I decided that the initial investment was so little that there was just no way that I wouldn't get enough orders to at least get my money back. I was surprised when I found my medium size post office box crammed with orders. I made $319,210.00 in the first 12 weeks. The nice thing about this deal is that it does not matter where people live. There simply isn't a better investment with a faster return and so big''. Dan Sondstrom, Alberta, Canada ----------------------------------------------------------- '' I had received this program before. I deleted it, but later I wondered if I should have given it a try. Of course, I had no idea who to contact to get another copy, so I had to wait until I was e-mailed again by someone else.........11 months passed then it luckily came again...... I did not delete this one! I made more than $490,000 on my first try and all the money came within 22 weeks''. Susan De Suza, New York, N.Y. ---------------------------------------------------- '' It really is a great opportunity to make relatively easy money with little cost to you. I followed the simple instructions carefully and within 10 days the money started to come in. My first month I made $ 20, 560.00 and by the end of third month my total cash count was $ 362,840.00. Life is beautiful, Thanx to internet''. Fred Dellaca, Westport, New Zealand ------------------------------------------------------------ ORDER YOUR REPORTS TODAY AND GET STARTED ON YOUR ROAD TO FINANCIAL FREEDOM ! =========================================================== If you have any questions of the legality of this program, contact the Office of Associate Director for Marketing Practices, Federal Trade Commission, Bureau of Consumer Protection, Washington, D.C. //////////////////////////////////////////////// ONE TIME MAILING, NO NEED TO REMOVE ////////////////////////////////////////////// This message is sent in compliance of the proposed bill SECTION 301. per Section 301, Paragraph (a)(2)(C) of S. 1618. Further transmission to you by the sender of this e-mail may be stopped at no cost to you by sending a reply to : belbirkdale@hotmail.com with the word Remove in the subject line. -------- T H E E N D --------- From list@netscape.com Sat Jan 6 02:29:32 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id CAA14001 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 02:29:31 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f067Ih329931; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 23:18:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f067RSU09553; Fri, 5 Jan 2001 23:27:28 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 23:27:28 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 5 Jan 2001 23:27:04 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101060727.f067R4B00644@xwing.netscape.com> From: dcc To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: ietf-ldapext, You Can Make Money and Automate Your Business X-Reply-To: dcc Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ietf-ldapext, What would a $2,000 check in the mail every 15th of the month do for you? How would you like to make this money stress free month after month. A stress Free system to keep you income growing. Get more information by sending a blank email to teamforce2@getresponse.com or take a look at http://pagina.de/cdc From list@netscape.com Sat Jan 6 07:27:54 2001 Received: from netscape.com ([205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA15117 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 07:27:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f06CBm302056; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 04:11:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f06CPmI25432; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 04:25:48 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 04:25:48 -0800 (PST) Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 04:25:17 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101061225.f06CPGB04979@xwing.netscape.com> From: neveraspam@DTUQ.yahoo.com To: My@xwing.netscape.com, New@xwing.netscape.com, Friend.MIWK@netscape.com Subject: Financial Education Equals Financial Independence -FMEJ X-Reply-To: neveraspam@yahoo.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"MoLYwC.A.tMG.K7wV6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Every month over 1,000,000 new Internet users come on-line. 950,000 of these people want to make a living from internet commerce. But they haven't got the slightest idea how to go about it. I am forming a small team of committed people who are really serious about their financial future. Do you really want to be financially free? Do you want to END your money pressures forever? Do you want to add an EXTRA SOURCE of INCOME to your life? If you answered "YES" to the above questions, you are serious about your financial future and I want to work DIRECTLY WITH YOU! I want to share one of my most rewarding money making opportunities with you. Go directly to http://www.skyboom.com/instantprofit3/submit.html CLICK HERE "I have never seen a faster, simpler way to create a stream of income" I know this sounds too good to be true. I was very skeptical at first; finally I agreed to check it out. As a test I selected a small group of people and introduced them to this incredible opportunity. Within a few short months several of them were earning extraordinary amounts of money. In the space of one short year some of them have become financially free. Needless to say the test WORKED, I was absolutely amazed. Would you like to learn to do the same as my original group? Once again, I am forming a small group of people to work with me. I WANT YOU to work with me and I WANT YOU to far exceed what my original group did! ARE YOU WILLING TO: 1. Talk to me personally about this opportunity? 2. Be a leader in my organization? 3. Train directly with me? 4. Be open minded and teachable? 5. Keep all my marketing information CONFIDENTIAL? If your interest in the phenomenal opportunity is at least a 7 on a scale of 1 to 10 go to my special web site at: http://www.skyboom.com/instantprofit3/submit.html CLICK HERE On that site you will receive FREE up to date special reports about e-commerce and owning your own business from home. You will then be forwarded to a special online presentation. I guarantee by the time you read the special reports and watch our presentation your interest level will be a "Rock Solid 10 out of 10". Respond immediately and let's get started now! http://www.skyboom.com/instantprofit3/submit.html CLICK HERE I look forward to working with you NO SPECIAL SKILLS OR EXPERIENCE REQUIRED. We will give you all the training and personal support you will need to ensure your success! This LEGITIMATE HOME-BASED INCOME OPPORTUNITY can put you back in Control of your Time, Your Finances, and Your Life! If you've tried other opportunities in the past that have failed to live up to their promises, THIS IS DIFFERENT THAN ANYTHING ELSE YOU'VE SEEN! YOUR FINANCIAL PAST DOES NOT HAVE TO BE YOUR FINANCIAL FUTURE! "All our dreams can come true - if we have the courage to pursue them" - Walt Disney To your success in life and business http://www.skyboom.com/instantprofit3/submit.html Thank you for your time ________________________________________________________________ Our research indicates this information may be of interest to you. If you have received this email by mistake or wish to be removed please send an email to mailto:neveraspam@yahoo.com with 'remove' in the subject line and you will NEVER receive another email from me. All removal requests are automatically removed. Thank you. This entire message is sent in compliance of the new e-mail bill: SECTION 301. Per Section 301, Paragraph (a) (2) (C) of S. 1618, ________________________________________________________________ From list@netscape.com Sat Jan 6 12:18:17 2001 Received: from netscape.com ([205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA16466 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 12:18:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f06H7R326976; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 09:07:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f06HGEA10706; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 09:16:14 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 09:16:14 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010106085618.00a805d0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 09:15:26 -0800 To: George_Robert_Blakley_III@tivoli.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: ldap acl draft (06): browse needed ? Cc: , In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"r-CVM.A.AnC.dL1V6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Bob, If I understand your suggestion properly, you wish to have a mechanism where return entries is controlled by controls placed upon 'intermediate' entries. I define an intermediate entry as any entry between the 'base' and matching entry excluding both. In implementations that I am familiar with, providing such functionality would be extremely difficult as they use indexing systems to locate matching entries and don't examine intermediate entries (or ACLs upon intermediate entries) to determine whether or not to returned matched entries. Doing so would be require significant redesign of such implementations. I would suggest that any ACL feature which required servers relying on the contents of intermediate entries be OPTIONAL. Kurt At 02:52 PM 1/4/01 -0600, George_Robert_Blakley_III@tivoli.com wrote: >Rob, > >The intent of the "browse" permission is not to prevent discovery of DNs; >that is what "returnDN" permission is for. > >"browse" is to take care of the case where there is a hierarchy of entries >and: > >(1) A subject "S" has authority to perform some operation (say "read") on >an entry (call it "E") which is not the root >(2) "S" has no permission to read or otherwise do anything to some entry >"I" which is on the path between the root and "E" >(3) "S" does not know or does not wish to use the explicit name of entry >"E" > >An example of this case is when a subject "Bob" has "read" access to a leaf >entry but no access to any other entry, >and does not know the name of any entry in the hierarchy. Bob wishes to do >a query on some attribute value. This query >matches an attribute of "E", and hence (since Bob has permission to read >E), E should be returned in response to the >query. > >However, if Bob tries to execute the search starting at the only point he >knows about (the root), the query will fail, because >he has no permission to "I" or any other entry on the path between the root >and "E". > >This is exactly analogous to the use of the "x" mode bit in the UNIX >filesystem to allow users to traverse directories into >which they cannot write and from which they cannot read. > >--bob > >Bob Blakley >Chief Scientist, Security >Tivoli Systems, Inc. > > >ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com on 12/14/2000 09:22:38 PM > >Please respond to > >To: >cc: >Subject: ldap acl draft (06): browse needed ? > > > > >The current acl draft proposes an entry level permission called "browseDN" >(4.2.2). The idea behind this permssion is to able to set a >policy saying something like "you can see this entry if you name it >explicitly as the base of a search, otherwise not". > >At Pittsburgh people seemed to like this permission and I agreed to do a >proposal for this....however, relative >to a single "read" level permission that ignores scoping it does complicate >things. The definition of the required permissions for >search (5.2) already has to deal with a fair line up of other permssions >(filter (presence and "the rest"), attribute level read, returnDN >and discloseOnError). While providing more permssions certainly increases >the flexibility of the model, >it also makes it harder to understand and administrate, so my inclination >is drop the browse permission in favour of a single "read" >permission at the entry level. > >My question is do people feel strongly that the "browse" permission is >required ? If so, please propose a compelling scenario that >really needs this granularity of control of search permissions. I will >then include this as a motivating example and propose a way to include >it in the required permssions for search. Otherwise I intend to drop it >for the 07 draft... > >Rob. From list@netscape.com Sat Jan 6 12:41:28 2001 Received: from netscape.com ([205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA16552 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 12:41:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f06HV8328536; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 09:31:08 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f06Hdtg14884; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 09:39:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 09:39:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010106092124.00a86580@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 09:39:10 -0800 To: "Haripriya S" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: abandon/cancel (Was: Returning Partial Results for an operation) Cc: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"v8IJKD.A.SoD.qh1V6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 06:54 AM 1/3/01 -0700, Haripriya S wrote: >IMO I see two kinds of responses a server may want to return on receiving an abandon: > >1. A response to the abandon operation itself ( useful to clients to know that abandon was received). >2. A partial/full response to the original operation which was abandoned ( useful for sending accumulated partial results). The X.500 abandon operation has a response and requires that the abandoned operation also has a response containing the 'abandoned' result. >While the first requires an extended request and response and the need for the client to understand the same, the second may require a change to rfc2251 sec. 4.11 alone: One must not confuse the existing LDAP abandon operation and a new operation implementing the X.500 semantics. I intend to call this new operation the 'Cancel' extended operation such that one will not (easily) confuse LDAP 'Abandon' requirements with its requirements. I do not believe any change to RFC 2251 will be need to fully specify a 'Cancel' operation which has semantics similar to the X.500 Abandon operation. 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From list@netscape.com Sat Jan 6 23:45:15 2001 Received: from netscape.com ([205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id XAA22052 for ; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 23:45:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f074YK301149; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 20:34:21 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f074h7c00926; Sat, 6 Jan 2001 20:43:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 6 Jan 2001 20:43:07 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 21:42:04 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: , Cc: , Subject: Re: ldap acl draft (06): browse needed ? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f074h5v00902 Resent-Message-ID: <"v5AGyD.A.MO.aP_V6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I agree with Kurt's view. At a point in NDS's past, we had to abandon the hierarchical, or tree-walk type of searching that required the browse permission due to the scalability and performance constraints it imposed. Jim >>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/6/01 10:15:26 AM >>> Bob, If I understand your suggestion properly, you wish to have a mechanism where return entries is controlled by controls placed upon 'intermediate' entries. I define an intermediate entry as any entry between the 'base' and matching entry excluding both. In implementations that I am familiar with, providing such functionality would be extremely difficult as they use indexing systems to locate matching entries and don't examine intermediate entries (or ACLs upon intermediate entries) to determine whether or not to returned matched entries. Doing so would be require significant redesign of such implementations. I would suggest that any ACL feature which required servers relying on the contents of intermediate entries be OPTIONAL. Kurt At 02:52 PM 1/4/01 -0600, George_Robert_Blakley_III@tivoli.com wrote: >Rob, > >The intent of the "browse" permission is not to prevent discovery of DNs; >that is what "returnDN" permission is for. > >"browse" is to take care of the case where there is a hierarchy of entries >and: > >(1) A subject "S" has authority to perform some operation (say "read") on >an entry (call it "E") which is not the root >(2) "S" has no permission to read or otherwise do anything to some entry >"I" which is on the path between the root and "E" >(3) "S" does not know or does not wish to use the explicit name of entry >"E" > >An example of this case is when a subject "Bob" has "read" access to a leaf >entry but no access to any other entry, >and does not know the name of any entry in the hierarchy. Bob wishes to do >a query on some attribute value. This query >matches an attribute of "E", and hence (since Bob has permission to read >E), E should be returned in response to the >query. > >However, if Bob tries to execute the search starting at the only point he >knows about (the root), the query will fail, because >he has no permission to "I" or any other entry on the path between the root >and "E". > >This is exactly analogous to the use of the "x" mode bit in the UNIX >filesystem to allow users to traverse directories into >which they cannot write and from which they cannot read. > >--bob > >Bob Blakley >Chief Scientist, Security >Tivoli Systems, Inc. > > >ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com on 12/14/2000 09:22:38 PM > >Please respond to > >To: >cc: >Subject: ldap acl draft (06): browse needed ? > > > > >The current acl draft proposes an entry level permission called "browseDN" >(4.2.2). The idea behind this permssion is to able to set a >policy saying something like "you can see this entry if you name it >explicitly as the base of a search, otherwise not". > >At Pittsburgh people seemed to like this permission and I agreed to do a >proposal for this....however, relative >to a single "read" level permission that ignores scoping it does complicate >things. The definition of the required permissions for >search (5.2) already has to deal with a fair line up of other permssions >(filter (presence and "the rest"), attribute level read, returnDN >and discloseOnError). While providing more permssions certainly increases >the flexibility of the model, >it also makes it harder to understand and administrate, so my inclination >is drop the browse permission in favour of a single "read" >permission at the entry level. > >My question is do people feel strongly that the "browse" permission is >required ? 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Best regards, Steve If this message gets to you in error please send us an e-mail with the subject "remove" on it. mailto:alucof@yahoo.com From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 9 09:33:11 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id JAA12525 for ; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 09:33:11 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f09EH0327997; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 06:17:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f09EV6E25476; Tue, 9 Jan 2001 06:31:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 06:31:06 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 9 Jan 2001 06:30:59 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101091430.f09EUnB17809@xwing.netscape.com> From: InquireToday@ispchannel.com To: @netscape.com Subject: Over35 Free Newsletter - Syndrome X X-Reply-To: InquireToday@ispchannel.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"5Mun0.A.gNG.pCyW6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Over35 Free Newsletter WHAT IS SYNDROME X? 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Subscribe, Questions, Suggestions: InquireToday@ispchannel.com From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 10 06:53:40 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id GAA13617 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 06:53:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0ABbtG08083; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:37:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0ABq3219119; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:52:03 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 03:52:03 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 13:49:17 +0200 Message-ID: To: moreinfo9998@aol.com From: Subject: Re: I saw your web site Resent-Message-ID: <"bLEe7B.A.dqE.izEX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Dear Web Merchant, My company has taken notice of your on-line presence and wanted to bring a few things to your attention. 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From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 10 07:39:43 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA14542 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 07:39:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0ACSls14960; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 04:28:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0ACbcQ28175; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 04:37:38 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 04:37:38 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 04:36:46 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101101236.f0ACakB10181@xwing.netscape.com> From: gpinfo4u@themail.com To: Information@xwing.netscape.com, Seeker@netscape.com Subject: Which turns you on? Time? Money? or Both?! X-Reply-To: "Gerry" gpinfo4u@themail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3sOAhC.A.t3G.QeFX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I received your e-mail address as someone interested in an Internet Business Opportunity. If I received your e-mail in error, or you are no longer interested, please click the reply button and type REMOVE" in the Subject Line and you will not be contacted again. Thank You If you own a home-based business or want one, and are trying to market it on the Internet, let me ask you a few questions: 1. Would you like to have the email address of EVERYONE who VISITS your home-based business website? 2. Would you like to have an automatic email responder system that sends each VISITOR follow-up messages over any period of time? 3. 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Porter From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 10 09:06:05 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id JAA16905 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 09:06:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0ADt4s22237; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 05:55:04 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0AE3tU18242; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 06:03:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 06:03:55 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <0000773a0715$00002dc2$00003eaa@> To: From: leah262@excite.com Subject: Don't miss the Internet wave Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 21:15:42 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Reply-To: remove101@excite.com Resent-Message-ID: <"mfaWeB.A.qcE.KvGX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
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From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 10 23:03:21 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id XAA12452 for ; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 23:03:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0B3qQs21062; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 19:52:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0B41IA12236; Wed, 10 Jan 2001 20:01:18 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 20:01:18 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: incomeforyoujan2001@hotmail.com From: Scott To: "Opportunity Seeker" Date: Wed, 10 Jan 2001 20:44:00 -0800 Subject: $2000+ Per Week & VACATIONS Reply-To: incomeforyoujan2001@hotmail.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: <20010111040111.GTDE4166.priv-edtnes09-hme0.telusplanet.net@localhost> Resent-Message-ID: <"cVtJVC.A.6-C.NATX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My name is Scott Klarenbach and I'm responding to your recent request for a business opportunity that you can grow from home. 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Guaranteed Minimum Monthly Income$$$ -QDOB X-Reply-To: rdbaronm@yahoo.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"AFpTwC.A.nPC.1baX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Have Your Downline Built BEFORE You Spend Any Money! This program even offers you a Monthly Guaranteed Minimum Income !! Guaranteed DOWNLINE, Guaranteed INCOME! It's International Don't miss out on this Great Opportunity to secure yourself a Guaranteed. Monthly Minimum Income!!! It's FREE to join our Post Launch Program !!! Your FREE membership # will also be entered into a lucky draw to WIN $100 to shop online !! ALL new members who join after you will be placed in ONE Straight Line down UNDER you. YOU can easily get 500-1,000 members under YOU in a month !! 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Call Now! 1-877-897-2871 From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 11 21:55:36 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA18843 for ; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 21:55:35 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0C2d8G20655; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:39:09 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0C2ebw01632; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:40:37 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:40:37 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 18:31:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101120231.f0C2Vd529923@ywing.netscape.com> From: ntlzj@hotmail.com To: aflxh@Cyberwavefriend.netscape.com Reply-To: ron02me2@n2mail.com Subject: EARN $1000 EVERY TIME SOMEONE SPENDS $89! [bjxum] Resent-Message-ID: <"8mHALD.A.cU.S6mX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com EARN $1000 EVERY TIME SOMEONE SPENDS $89! If YOU did not make at least $2,000 last week. then you'd be FOOLISH not to check this out! "I sent out a 1000 piece fax blast, got 25 calls, had 14 messages, and signed up 11 people! That's $11,000 in one week! Thank you God!" Derrick Alexander. - Atlanta,GA "WOW! I needed to make ALOT of MONEY immediately when I started, for some BILLS! Did I ever! My first DAY I made $6,000! Thanks to all the FREE tools and help from my sponsor, my life will never be the same!" David Webster. - Newport Beach,CA This is the most explosive income opportunity I've ever seen! It's NOT an MLM! There are NO MEETINGS, INVENTORY, or STRESS! You simply operate a wholesale/ retail business. You market a fabulous travel package that earns you $1000 PER SALE! 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Ron From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 12 01:07:57 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id BAA22792 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:07:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0C5piG05706; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 21:51:44 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0C65tc15315; Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:05:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:05:55 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 11 Jan 2001 22:05:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101120605.f0C65Jq22023@xwing.netscape.com> From: TDelaine@ltdlimited.com To: futurecustomer@netscape.com Subject: Decorative Russian Lacquer Art X-Reply-To: russianart@ltdlimited.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"2vreMC.A.ruD.B7pX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Please note: If you did not request this information simply delete this email or reply to the remove address at the bottom. Thank you! Dear Friend, This email is a special introduction to the world of Russian decorative art. This is your special opportunity to own a truly unique and special form of 21st Century dating back to the 1700's. Take a moment to read this special announcement. Artshop of Saint Petersburg http://www.ltdlimited.com/russianart/ Alexander Tikhonov and 40 local artisans in Saint Petersburg Russia established a joint venture with DeLaine LTD Limited to provide unique lacquer eggs and hand-made dolls. This venture began in 1999 and DeLaine LTD Limited has received numerous orders and inquiries on this unique decorative artwork. Additionally, DeLaine LTD Limited has also reached an agreement to feature the artwork of Nina Novikova. Nina has graciously made herself available to do custom paintings (from a scanned photograph) as well as her original paintings. You now have the opportunity to see art work that is, in the words of Alexander Tikhonov, "art for the people's sake!" This artwork is beautifully handcrafted and will enhance your home or office. DeLaine LTD Limited would like to invite you to visit Artshop of Saint Petersburg and discover the world of Russian decorative art. You can visit our web site at the link listed below. Secure ordering is available and we gladly accept Mastercard and Visa. Don't wait! Take this special introductory opportunity to own a wonderful piece of Russian decorative art today! Thank you for your time and we hope you will see this decorative art is truly something special. Enjoy! Note: If you would like to receive the Artshop of Saint Petersburg newsletter, follow the instructions on the left-hand side of the home page. Thanks again for your time! Artshop of Saint Petersburg http://www.ltdlimited.com/russianart/ "A Joint Venture between artisans of St. Petersburg and DeLaine LTD Limited. ____________________________________________________________ Best Wishes from your Friends at DeLaine LTD Limited! http://www.ltdlimited.com ____________________________________________________________ This message is sent in compliance of the new e-mail bill: Senate bill 1618, Title 3, section 301. ALL REMOVES TO THIS ADDRESS WILL BE HONORED Send your request to remove@ltdlimited.com and type Remove in the subject line of the message. Please do not send removes to the interested address as you may end up receiving the information. From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 12 04:30:01 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id EAA06476 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 04:30:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0C9INs24328; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:18:23 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0C9RHo22357; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:27:17 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:27:17 -0800 (PST) To: BEST-Satellite-deals@youmail.co-com.netscape.com Message-Id: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 02:23:55 -0700 Subject: Your FREE Satellite TV System with Installation From: Satellite33@excite.com Resent-Message-ID: <"8UojT.A.2cF.z3sX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT For a limited time, we'll give you this top-of-the-line Digital Satellite System absolutely FREE! 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Call Now! 1-877-897-2871 From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 12 05:10:34 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id FAA06691 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 05:10:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0C9sCG22603; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 01:54:12 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0CA8Oc01796; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 02:08:24 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 02:08:24 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 02:07:54 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101121007.f0CA7eq27543@xwing.netscape.com> From: zoran@australink.net To: @netscape.com Subject: Y.E.S. X-Reply-To: zoran@australink.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"BJlAhC.A.ib.VetX6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit WARNING If you don't read this important letter, it could cost you $70,000 this year! _/_/_/_/_/_/ Or you can click on the link for a shortcut to money. http://globalws.net/show.cgi/zoran Statistics: Every 11 seconds someone starts a new Home Based Business. 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And don't forget.....opportunity is usually disguised behind what most of us call HARD WORK!!! And here is the one for the road: Knock knock Who is there? Opportunity... impossible- Opportunity knocks only once. And I am Zoran, Your new friend from Aussieland From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 12 12:31:57 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA13207 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 12:31:56 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0CHKrs15374; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:20:53 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0CHTmI26069; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:29:48 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 09:29:48 -0800 (PST) From: Subject: Millionaires Made Monthly Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 02:56:55 Message-Id: <746.359873.387201@> Resent-Message-ID: <"jYTrG.A.CXG.K8zX6"@glacier> To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Dear Friends & Future Millionaire: AS SEEN ON NATIONAL TV: Making over half million dollars every 4 to 5 months from your home for an investment of only $25 U.S. Dollars expense one time THANK'S TO THE COMPUTER AGE AND THE INTERNET ! ================================================== BE A MILLIONAIRE LIKE OTHERS WITHIN A YEAR!!! Before you say ''Bull'', please read the following. This is the letter you have been hearing about on the news lately. Due to the popularity of this letter on the Internet, a national weekly news program recently devoted an entire show to the investigation of this program described below, to see if it really can make people money. The show also investigated whether or not the program was legal. Their findings proved once and for all that there are ''absolutely NO Laws prohibiting the participation in the program and if people can follow the simple instructions, they are bound to make some mega bucks with only $25 out of pocket cost''. DUE TO THE RECENT INCREASE OF POPULARITY & RESPECT THIS PROGRAM HAS ATTAINED, IT IS CURRENTLY WORKING BETTER THAN EVER. This is what one had to say: ''Thanks to this profitable opportunity. I was approached many times before but each time I passed on it. I am so glad I finally joined just to see what one could expect in return for the minimal effort and money required. To my astonishment, I received total $610,470.00 in 21 weeks, with money still coming in." Pam Hedland, Fort Lee, New Jersey. =================================================== Here is another testimonial: "This program has been around for a long time but I never believed in it. But one day when I received this again in the mail I decided to gamble my $25 on it. I followed the simple instructions and walaa ..... 3 weeks later the money started to come in. First month I only made $240.00 but the next 2 months after that I made a total of $290,000.00. So far, in the past 8 months by re-entering the program, I have made over $710,000.00 and I am playing it again. The key to success in this program is to follow the simple steps and NOT change anything.'' More testimonials later but first, ===== PRINT THIS NOW FOR YOUR FUTURE REFERENCE ====== $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ If you would like to make at least $500,000 every 4 to 5 months easily and comfortably, please read the following...THEN READ IT AGAIN and AGAIN!!! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ FOLLOW THE SIMPLE INSTRUCTION BELOW AND YOUR FINANCIAL DREAMS WILL COME TRUE, GUARANTEED! INSTRUCTIONS: =====Order all 5 reports shown on the list below ===== For each report, send $5 CASH, THE NAME & NUMBER OF THE REPORT YOU ARE ORDERING and YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS to the person whose name appears ON THAT LIST next to the report. MAKE SURE YOUR RETURN ADDRESS IS ON YOUR ENVELOPE TOP LEFT CORNER in case of any mail problems. === When you place your order, make sure you order each of the 5 reports. You will need all 5 reports so that you can save them on your computer and resell them. YOUR TOTAL COST $5 X 5=$25.00. Within a few days you will receive, vie e-mail, each of the 5 reports from these 5 different individuals. Save them on your computer so they will be accessible for you to send to the 1,000's of people who will order them from you. Also make a floppy of these reports and keep it on your desk in case something happen to your computer. IMPORTANT - DO NOT alter the names of the people who are listed next to each report, or their sequence on the list, in any way other than what is instructed below in step '' 1 through 6 '' or you will loose out on majority of your profits. Once you understand the way this works, you will also see how it does not work if you change it. Remember, this method has been tested, and if you alter, it will NOT work !!! People have tried to put their friends/relatives names on all five thinking they could get all the money. But it does not work this way. Believe us, we all have tried to be greedy and then nothing happened. So Do Not try to change anything other than what is instructed. Because if you do, it will not work for you. Remember, honesty reaps the reward!!! 1.... After you have ordered all 5 reports, take this advertisement and REMOVE the name & address of the person in REPORT # 5. This person has made it through the cycle and is no doubt counting their fortune. 2.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 4 down TO REPORT # 5. 3.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 3 down TO REPORT # 4. 4.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 2 down TO REPORT # 3. 5.... Move the name & address in REPORT # 1 down TO REPORT # 2 6.... Insert YOUR name & address in the REPORT # 1 Position. PLEASE MAKE SURE you copy every name & address ACCURATELY! ========================================================== **** Take this entire letter, with the modified list of names, and save it on your computer. DO NOT MAKE ANY OTHER CHANGES. Save this on a disk as well just in case if you loose any data. To assist you with marketing your business on the internet, the 5 reports you purchase will provide you with invaluable marketing information which includes how to send bulk e-mails, where to find thousands of free classified ads and much more. There are 2 Primary methods to get this venture going: METHOD # 1: BY SENDING BULK E-MAIL ========================================================== Let's say that you decide to start small, just to see how it goes, and we will assume You and those involved send out only 5,000 e-mails each. Let's also assume that the mailing receive only a 0.2% response (the response could be much better but lets just say it is only 0.2%. Also many people will send out hundreds of thousands e-mails instead of only 5,000 each). Continuing with this example, you send out only 5,000 e-mails. With a 0.2% response, that is only 10 orders for report # 1. Those 10 people responded by sending out 5,000 e-mail each for a total of 50,000. Out of those 50,000 e-mails only 0.2% responded with orders. That's=100 people responded and ordered Report # 2. Those 100 people mail out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of 500,000 e-mails. The 0.2% response to that is 1000 orders for Report # 3. Those 1000 people send out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of 5 million e-mails sent out. The 0.2% response to that is 10,000 orders for Report # 4. Those 10,000 people send out 5,000 e-mails each for a total of 50,000,000 (50 million) e-mails. The 0.2% response to that is 100,000 orders for Report # 5 THAT'S 100,000 ORDERS TIMES $5 EACH=$500,000.00 (half million). Your total income in this example is: 1..... $50 + 2..... $500 + 3..... $5,000 + 4 ... $50,000 + 5..... $500,000 ........ Grand Total=$555,550.00 NUMBERS DO NOT LIE. GET A PENCIL & PAPER AND FIGUREOUT THE WORST POSSIBLE RESPONSES AND NO MATTER HOW YOU CALCULATE IT, YOU WILL STILL MAKE A LOT OF MONEY ! ========================================================= REMEMBER FRIEND, THIS IS ASSUMING ONLY 10 PEOPLE ORDERING OUT OF 5,000 YOU MAILED TO. Dare to think for a moment what would happen if everyone or half or even one 4th of those people mailed 100,000e-mails each or more? There are over 150 million people on the Internet worldwide and counting. Believe me, many people will do just that, and more! METHOD # 2 : BY PLACING FREE ADS ON THE INTERNET ======================================================= Advertising on the net is very very inexpensive and there are hundreds of FREE places to advertise. Placing a lot of free ads on the Internet will easily get a larger response. We strongly suggest you start with Method # 1 and then METHOD # 2 as you go along. For every $5 you receive, all you must do is e-mail them the Report they ordered. That's it. Always provide same day service on all orders. This will guarantee that the e-mail they send out, with your name and address on it, will be prompt because they can not advertise until they receive the report. =========== AVAILABLE REPORTS ==================== ORDER EACH REPORT BY ITS NUMBER & NAME ONLY. Notes: Always send $5 cash (U.S. CURRENCY) for each Report. Checks NOT accepted. Make sure the cash is concealed by wrapping it in at least 2 sheets of paper. On one of those sheets of paper, Write the NUMBER & the NAME of the Report you are ordering, YOUR E-MAIL ADDRESS and your name and postal address. PLACE YOUR ORDER FOR THESE REPORTS NOW : ==================================================== REPORT # 1: "The Insider's Guide to Advertising for Free on the Net" Order Report #1 from: JL Ross 163 Fisher Parade Pakuranga, Auckland 1706 New Zealand ___________________________________________________________ REPORT # 2: "The Insider's Guide to Sending Bulk e-mail on the Net" Order Report # 2 from: S. R. 212 Woodland Drive McMinnville, Tn 37110 USA ____________________________________________________________ REPORT # 3: "Secret to Multilevel Marketing on the Net" Order Report # 3 from : Aaron Joseph PO Box 21155 Columbia Heights, MN 55412 USA ____________________________________________________________ REPORT # 4: "How to Become a Millionaire Utilizing MLM & the Net" Order Report # 4 from: C.J. Kalata P.O.Box 130157 Roseville, MN 55113-0002 USA ____________________________________________________________ REPORT #5: "How to Send Out 0ne Million e-mails for Free" Order Report # 5 from: R.B. Box 21115 Grande Prairie Alberta, T8V-6W7 Canada ____________________________________________________________ $$$$$$$$$ YOUR SUCCESS GUIDELINES $$$$$$$$$$$ Follow these guidelines to guarantee your success: === If you do not receive at least 10 orders for Report #1 within 2 weeks, continue sending e-mails until you do. === After you have received 10 orders, 2 to 3 weeks after that you should receive 100 orders or more for REPORT # 2. If you did not, continue advertising or sending e-mails until you do. === Once you have received 100 or more orders for Report # 2, YOU CAN RELAX, because the system is already working for you, and the cash will continue to roll in ! THIS IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER: Every time your name is moved down on the list, you are placed in front of a Different report. You can KEEP TRACK of your PROGRESS by watching which report people are ordering from you. IF YOU WANT TO GENERATE MORE INCOME SEND ANOTHER BATCH OF E-MAILS AND START THE WHOLE PROCESS AGAIN. There is NO LIMIT to the income you can generate from this business !!! ====================================================== FOLLOWING IS A NOTE FROM THE ORIGINATOR OF THIS PROGRAM: You have just received information that can give you financial freedom for the rest of your life, with NO RISK and JUST A LITTLE BIT OF EFFORT. You can make more money in the next few weeks and months than you have ever imagined. Follow the program EXACTLY AS INSTRUCTED. Do Not change it in any way. It works exceedingly well as it is now. Remember to e-mail a copy of this exciting report after you have put your name and address in Report #1 and moved others to #2 ...........# 5 as instructed above. One of the people you send this to may send out 100,000 or more e-mails and your name will be on every one of them. Remember though, the more you send out the more potential customers you will reach. So my friend, I have given you the ideas, information, materials and opportunity to become financially independent. IT IS UP TO YOU NOW ! ============ MORE TESTIMONIALS ================ "My name is Mitchell. My wife, Jody and I live in Chicago. I am an accountant with a major U.S. Corporation and I make pretty good money. When I received this program I grumbled to Jodyaboutreceiving ''junk mail''. I made fun of the whole thing,spoutingmy knowledge of the population and percentages involved. I ''knew'' it wouldn't work. Jody totally ignored my supposed intelligence and few days later she jumped in with both feet. I made merciless fun of her, and was ready to lay the old ''I told you so'' on her when the thing didn't work. Well, the laugh was on me! Within 3 weeks she had received 50 responses. Within the next 45 days she had received total $ 147,200.00 ........... all cash! I was shocked. I have joined Jody in her ''hobby''. Mitchell Wolf M.D., Chicago, Illinois ====================================================== ''Not being the gambling type, it took me several weeks to make up my mind to participate in this plan. But conservative that I am, I decided that the initial investment was so little that there was just no way that I wouldn't get enough orders to at least get my money back''. '' I was surprised when I found my medium size post office box crammed with orders. I made $319,210.00in the first 12 weeks. The nice thing about this deal is that it does not matter where people live. There simply isn't a better investment with a faster return and so big." Dan Sondstrom, Alberta, Canada ======================================================= ''I had received this program before. I deleted it, but later I wondered if I should have given it a try. Of course, I had no idea who to contact to get another copy, so I had to wait until I was e-mailed again by someone else.........11 months passed then it luckily came again...... I did not delete this one! I made more than $490,000 on my first try and all the money came within 22 weeks." Susan De Suza, New York, N.Y. ======================================================= ''It really is a great opportunity to make relatively easy money with little cost to you. I followed the simple instructions carefully and within 10 days the money started to come in. My first month I made $20,560.00 and by the end of third month my total cash count was $362,840.00. Life is beautiful, Thanx to internet.". Fred Dellaca, Westport, New Zealand ======================================================= ORDER YOUR REPORTS TODAY AND GET STARTED ON 'YOUR' ROAD TO FINANCIAL FREEDOM ! ======================================================= If you have any questions of the legality of this program, contact the Office of Associate Director for Marketing Practices, Federal Trade Commission, Bureau of Consumer Protection, Washington, D.C. From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 12 18:17:04 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA26787 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:17:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0CN0dG03097; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:00:39 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0CNEq211122; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:14:52 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 15:14:52 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101122314.f0CNEkq07609@xwing.netscape.com> X-Sender: wind-n-sea@usa.net From: Freesubmit Team To: "Opportunity Seeker" Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 17:14:45 -0600 Subject: FREE: Promote Your URL + Great Income Opportunity! MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 1 Resent-Message-ID: <"apZQuD.A.gtC.r_4X6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit IMPORTANT - FREE FOR A LIMITED TIME ONLY! We all know the hassle of submitting forms and entering your details countless of times to multiple search engines and FFA sites just to get your URL listed. What if you could submit to all those sites (7,304 sites to be exact), with just ONE submission? With our software "Always Freesubmit", you can submit your website's URL and ads to 1800+ search engines, FFA pages, Classified Ad sites, plus popular business related directories on the Net - a combined total of 7,304 unique locations, all for FREE! 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We honor all remove requests and do not sell or publish email addresses. From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 12 21:33:18 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA28442 for ; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 21:33:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0D2LDs21551; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:21:14 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0D2U8c00633; Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:30:08 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 18:30:08 -0800 (PST) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT Message-Id: From: Paging29@digiweb.nl Date: Sat, 13 Jan 2001 10:28:56 -0500 To: Thompson@essenet.it Subject: We want to give you a Brand New Free 2-Way Motorola Pager ... 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Per Section 301, Paragraph (a)(2)(C) of S. 1618, further transmissions to you by the sender of this email may be stopped at no cost to you by sending a reply to this email address with the word remove in the subject line. ************************************************************************* ************************************************************************* ** From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 14 13:25:57 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id NAA09744 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 13:25:57 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0EIEqs20014; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 10:14:52 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0EINnU23265; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 10:23:49 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 10:23:49 -0800 (PST) From: To: Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 09:37:22 Message-Id: <479.390212.718269@mail.mindspring.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"n31DvB.A.PrF.06eY6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit GET YOUR OWN 150 MEG WEBSITE FOR ONLY $11.95 PER MONTH TODAY! 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FOR DETAILS CALL 1 888 248 0765 if you are outside the USA, please fax 240 337 8325 Webhosting International From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 14 15:28:26 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id PAA10480 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 15:28:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0EKC3G02741; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 12:12:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0EKQK614317; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 12:26:20 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 12:26:20 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 12:26:15 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101142026.f0EKQEq20736@xwing.netscape.com> From: To: andkais77@gmx.net Subject: News Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"5JwTSC.A.bfD.rtgY6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by netscape.com id f0EKC3G02741 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by ietf.org id PAA10480 Hi Kalle! Mal wieder ein paar Surftips für Dich. Also wenn Du mich fragst die besten Maedels, 20 Studios mit Livebild und Chat im Netz findest Du unter http://www.lifegirl.de oder http://www.ero-channel.de oder http://www.stripline.de die beste Singleseite ist http://www.zweiherzen.de die verliebtesten Lesben sind unter http://www.lesbenhaus.de zu finden. Also Kalle nix wie hin. PS: Kannst mir ja nächsten Freitag von deinen tollen Erfahrungen berichten. --------------------------------------------------------------- unregistrierte Demoversion http://www.aquadrat.de/download/psmail.htm Referenz zu http://www.stripline.de Referenz zu http://www.selfproducer.de co. 2000 --------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 14 17:10:54 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id RAA10867 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 17:10:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0ELsVG07950; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 13:54:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0EM8m202032; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 14:08:48 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 14:08:48 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 14:08:42 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101142208.f0EM8gq20594@xwing.netscape.com> From: To: andkais77@gmx.net Subject: News Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"EXjDVB.A.ef.vNiY6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by netscape.com id f0ELsVG07950 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by ietf.org id RAA10867 Hi Kalle! Mal wieder ein paar Surftips für Dich. Also wenn Du mich fragst die besten Maedels, 20 Studios mit Livebild und Chat im Netz findest Du unter http://www.lifegirl.de oder http://www.ero-channel.de oder http://www.stripline.de die beste Singleseite ist http://www.zweiherzen.de die verliebtesten Lesben sind unter http://www.lesbenhaus.de zu finden. Also Kalle nix wie hin. PS: Kannst mir ja nächsten Freitag von deinen tollen Erfahrungen berichten. --------------------------------------------------------------- unregistrierte Demoversion http://www.aquadrat.de/download/psmail.htm Referenz zu http://www.stripline.de Referenz zu http://www.selfproducer.de co. 2000 --------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 14 18:20:05 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA11083 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 18:20:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0EN41G11600; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 15:04:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0ENIJ613663; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 15:18:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 15:18:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 15:18:14 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101142318.f0ENIE505106@ywing.netscape.com> From: To: andkais77@gmx.net Subject: Newslettet Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"TFc7O.A.KVD.6OjY6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by netscape.com id f0EN41G11600 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by ietf.org id SAA11083 Hi Kalle! Mal wieder ein paar Surftips für Dich. Also wenn Du mich fragst die besten Maedels, 20 Studios mit Livebild und Chat im Netz findest Du unter http://www.lifegirl.de oder http://www.ero-channel.de oder http://www.stripline.de die beste Singleseite ist http://www.zweiherzen.de die verliebtesten Lesben sind unter http://www.lesbenhaus.de zu finden. Also Kalle nix wie hin. PS: Kannst mir ja nächsten Freitag von deinen tollen Erfahrungen berichten. --------------------------------------------------------------- unregistrierte Demoversion http://www.aquadrat.de/download/psmail.htm Referenz zu http://www.stripline.de Referenz zu http://www.selfproducer.de co. 2000 --------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 14 19:20:39 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id TAA11437 for ; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 19:20:38 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0F04iG14724; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 16:04:44 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0F0J1k23874; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 16:19:01 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 16:19:01 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 16:18:54 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101150018.f0F0Isq26773@xwing.netscape.com> From: To: andkais77@gmx.net Subject: News Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Resent-Message-ID: <"AfvQsB.A.n0F.yHkY6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by netscape.com id f0F04iG14724 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by ietf.org id TAA11437 Hi Kalle! Mal wieder ein paar Surftips für Dich. Also wenn Du mich fragst die besten Maedels, 20 Studios mit Livebild und Chat im Netz findest Du unter http://www.lifegirl.de oder http://www.ero-channel.de oder http://www.stripline.de die beste Singleseite ist http://www.zweiherzen.de die verliebtesten Lesben sind unter http://www.lesbenhaus.de zu finden. Also Kalle nix wie hin. PS: Kannst mir ja nächsten Freitag von deinen tollen Erfahrungen berichten. --------------------------------------------------------------- unregistrierte Demoversion http://www.aquadrat.de/download/psmail.htm Referenz zu http://www.stripline.de Referenz zu http://www.selfproducer.de co. 2000 --------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 15 00:41:06 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id AAA15528 for ; Mon, 15 Jan 2001 00:41:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0F5UMs26795; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:30:23 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0F5dKI17861; Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:39:20 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:39:20 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 21:39:11 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101150539.f0F5dAq20903@xwing.netscape.com> From: zoran@australink.net To: @netscape.com Subject: Y.E.S. X-Reply-To: zoran@australink.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"X-mR9.A.xWE.H0oY6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit HELLO THERE. I am Zoran and I would like to introduce this brand spanking NEW bizop. My Wife Huang Jian and Myself with help of some of the best programers in the field, have just completed the FIRST in the World Global 2x2 Matrix. It is multiphase and multi entry, therefore UNLIMITED income. Fast return on investment. Please check it out on http://globalws.net/show.cgi/zoran We need help in launching it. Today is 15 of Jan. and we started it on the first. We have 60 people some in USA, some in Australia, Sudan Denmark and Philippines. Either way, please respond with either criticism or praise. 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Please type "Journey Within" on subject line. From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 16 07:27:16 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA08875 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 07:27:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0GCEjs13756; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 04:14:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0GCNiI27532; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 04:23:44 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 04:23:44 -0800 (PST) To: From: Subject: cash by fax info Message-Id: <200101161941625.SM00185@fdfs908092sdf> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 19:42:38 +0800 Resent-Message-ID: <"bQukGD.A.6tG.P1DZ6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com THIS IS THE NEW LINK. TYPO IN THE LAST ONE. http://www.geocities.com/cashbyfax22222/newest.html From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 16 21:12:07 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA25142 for ; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:12:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0H26Qs15769; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:06:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0H26RQ05955; Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:06:27 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 18:06:27 -0800 (PST) From: BMJHT@aol.com Message-ID: <7f.ee1e5e7.279657ea@aol.com> Date: Tue, 16 Jan 2001 21:05:30 EST Subject: MPS Router's by Motorola 6520 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 127 Resent-Message-ID: <"Qf7WW.A.xcB.i4PZ6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is there any interest in these routers for resale? I am curious as to how to get information on them? Thank you if you can help, thank you if you can't. Bruce Terwilliger From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 17 03:11:21 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id DAA14536 for ; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 03:11:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0H88Bs21552; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 00:08:11 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0H88Cc01779; Wed, 17 Jan 2001 00:08:12 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 00:08:12 -0800 (PST) Date: Wed, 17 Jan 2001 00:08:08 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101170808.f0H888Z22433@xwing.netscape.com> From: cashgenerator2002@yahoo.com To: @netscape.com Subject: CLEARLY SEE YOUR FUTURE! Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"Kp00FD.A.Rb.rLVZ6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

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Please type "Journey Within" on subject line. From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 18 21:06:30 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA08088 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 21:06:29 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0J24JG25415; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:04:19 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0J24Ks00855; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:04:20 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:04:20 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A67A048.C291B0C2@openwave.com> Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:02:48 -0800 From: sanjay jain Reply-To: sanjay.jain@openwave.com Organization: Openwave Systems X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (WinNT; I) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ldapext Subject: a compare operation question ... Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"t7NIMB.A.DN.iC6Z6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit If the attribute used in the AVA in a compare operation
does not have an equality matching rule then is the compare
result FALSE (similar to search filter semantics) or is it
an error case ?

thanks
sanjay From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 18 21:57:24 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA09483 for ; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 21:57:24 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0J2t6s19705; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:55:06 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0J2t7624088; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:55:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:55:07 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010118183634.00ab0ba0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 18:54:12 -0800 To: sanjay.jain@openwave.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: a compare operation question ... Cc: ldapext In-Reply-To: <3A67A048.C291B0C2@openwave.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"7X3EDD.A.73F.Ky6Z6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 06:02 PM 1/18/01 -0800, sanjay jain wrote: >If the attribute used in the AVA in a compare operation >does not have an equality matching rule then is the compare >result FALSE (similar to search filter semantics) A search filter in this case would actually be Undefined. While search does not return entries where the filter evaluates to Undefined, compare returns true iff the assertion is true, false iff false, and an error if the assertion cannot be evaluated/reported for any reason. >or is it >an error case ? It's an error case, specifically inappropriateMatching. Kurt From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 19 00:47:28 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id AAA12182 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 00:47:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0J5hus12672; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 21:43:56 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0J5hvg14080; Thu, 18 Jan 2001 21:43:57 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 21:43:57 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Thu, 18 Jan 2001 22:43:35 -0700 From: "Vijay Kn" To: "<" Subject: Submission: draft-knvijay-ldapext-clientcachingproxy-01.txt Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_0C575CEA.36575A59" Resent-Message-ID: <"dgJFtB.A.ubD.cQ9Z6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_0C575CEA.36575A59 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable An update to the 'LDAP Client Caching Proxy Model ' draft was submitted to = IETF recently. Reviews/comments on the same are welcome. The I-D is available at:=20 http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-knvijay-ldapext-clientcachingprox= y-01.txt Regards Vijay --=_0C575CEA.36575A59 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

An update to the 'LDAP Client Caching Proxy Model ' = draft was=20 submitted to IETF recently. Reviews/comments on the same = are=20 welcome.
 
The I-D is available at:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-knvijay-ldapext-clientca= chingproxy-01.txt
 
Regards
Vijay
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Send Email Now To: Mailto:NewbieMoney1@newmail.net ====================================================================== To be unsubscribe from future mailings, click the link mailto:unsubscribe201@newmail.net ====================================================================== From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 19 10:27:15 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id KAA00524 for ; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 10:27:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0JFP7G17184; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 07:25:08 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0JFP8k03001; Fri, 19 Jan 2001 07:25:08 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 07:25:08 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <051301c0822c$0f37f030$779a6ac2@isocor.ie> From: "Damian Power" To: "IETF LDAPEXT" , "IETF LDAPBIS" Subject: Binary Syntax and the binary Attribute Type option Date: Fri, 19 Jan 2001 15:25:31 -0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 5.00.2314.1300 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Resent-Message-ID: <"ufCqfC.A.nu.SxFa6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, I have a question somewhat related to the "AttributeTypeValue and binary" thread currently on the ELSE and LDAPBIS lists, but different enough that I don't want to pollute that thread. Simply put, my question is this: given that an Attribute Type is defined as having Binary syntax (1.3.6.1.4.1.1466.115.121.1.5), is the ;binary option required when referring to that attribute in protocol? For example, attribute type "foo" has Binary syntax. If I request this attribute in a search, do I refer to it as "foo" or "foo;binary"? I don't believe the RFCs make a clear statement either way, so I'm looking to see if a particular interpretation has gained acceptance. My personal feeling is that the option should not be required. I accept that the presence/absence of the option doesn't affect the value returned. Regards, Damian. 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From list@netscape.com Sat Jan 20 22:45:08 2001 Received: from netscape.com ([205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id WAA03079 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 22:45:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0L3h2G00690; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 19:43:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0L3h3c21942; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 19:43:03 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 19:43:03 -0800 (PST) X-Apparently-From: Message-ID: <130262001102134737930@mail.yahoo.com> X-EM-Version: 5, 0, 0, 14 X-EM-Registration: #01B0530810E603002D00 From: "CC Group" Subject: Free Software Downloads For You ! 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PLUS - We'll give you FREE PROMOTIONAL SOFTWARE for just taking a peek ! Download this software and watch what happens !! http://freesoftware.ipfox.com _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From list@netscape.com Sat Jan 20 23:28:16 2001 Received: from netscape.com ([205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id XAA03241 for ; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 23:28:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0L4QBs27663; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 20:26:11 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0L4QCM29023; Sat, 20 Jan 2001 20:26:12 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 20 Jan 2001 20:26:12 -0800 (PST) From: Subject: FREE...Visa Card Pays Up To 10 Levels!!! Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:49:29 Message-Id: <275.391975.330071@server01> Resent-Message-ID: <"nTyN8D.A.NFH.iTma6"@glacier> To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Hi, Wishing you a happy and prosperous 2001! Take a quick look at the Free Visa Card program. They're giving away free Visa cards with free flight miles on any airline and paying MLM commissions to refer other Cardholders. They pay out on a huge 10-level plan ($10 for the first level and $2 on the next nine). You already know how many millions of dollars that kind of multiplication can generate. Nobody buys a thing. The money comes from the bank because of the value of cardholders. This thing is spreading like wildfire. Please check it out. Request for info! mailto:jona01@excite.com?subject=Vinfo pls! Regards. ................................................................ **This is a one-time mailing. There is no need to remove yourself to stop further mailings. From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 21 11:01:23 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA09534 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:01:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0LFxUG03390; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 07:59:35 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0LFxUk12635; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 07:59:30 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 07:59:30 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 07:58:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101211558.f0LFwtZ23291@xwing.netscape.com> From: malatras@SDUY.usa.net To: klm.SQXD@netscape.com Subject: NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! -UHQK Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"3eKxlC.A.JFD.hdwa6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! Dear friend, I received your e-mail as someone interested in Internet Business Opportunities. My name is Michalis Malatras. I have been a member of Streamline for about some months and it has been a great experience. Streamline has eliminated all the hassles of the other MLM companies, by giving you FREE tools you need to succeed, by helping you to build your downline with the trademarked Online Recruiter; the pressure of having to find people to sponsor is gone. I could do nothing and my business would grow, but with a little effort it could explode. 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My Warmest Regards, Michalis Malatras Streamline International Proud Member of the MainStream Success Team -------------------------------------------------------------------------- If I received your e-mail in error, or you are no longer interested, please accept our apologies. You can be removed at no cost to you simply by pressing "Reply" and place "Remove" in the Subject line. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 21 11:02:53 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA09545 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:02:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0LG0oG03863; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:00:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0LG0og13516; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:00:50 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:00:50 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:00:33 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101211600.f0LG0X524771@ywing.netscape.com> From: malatras@HFHP.usa.net To: klm.KRFM@netscape.com Subject: NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! -QQLV Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"B64wjB.A.6SD.xewa6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! Dear friend, I received your e-mail as someone interested in Internet Business Opportunities. My name is Michalis Malatras. I have been a member of Streamline for about some months and it has been a great experience. Streamline has eliminated all the hassles of the other MLM companies, by giving you FREE tools you need to succeed, by helping you to build your downline with the trademarked Online Recruiter; the pressure of having to find people to sponsor is gone. I could do nothing and my business would grow, but with a little effort it could explode. This is not something that happened to me ten years ago and now you are getting my success story. This is a business that I have just been involved with for the past months and it has already exceeded all my expectations! Streamline is by no means a get rich quick scheme. Streamline has married three of the hottest trends: Internet, Natural Wellness and MLM. The technology breakthrough of the internet has finally made MLM feasible and hassle free. It can happen -- the technology is there. $firstname. Please check out my JUST UPDATED WEBSITES to find out why so many are now beginning to achieve financial independence through Streamline. http://www.cyber-action.com/oed/mnm.html Once you are ready, you simply enroll online and get it all started today! Keep in mind that Streamline offers 30 days money back guarantee. The risk is none. My Warmest Regards, Michalis Malatras Streamline International Proud Member of the MainStream Success Team -------------------------------------------------------------------------- If I received your e-mail in error, or you are no longer interested, please accept our apologies. You can be removed at no cost to you simply by pressing "Reply" and place "Remove" in the Subject line. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 21 11:05:14 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA09556 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:05:13 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0LG3As29048; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:03:10 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0LG3A614611; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:03:10 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:03:10 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:02:42 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101211602.f0LG2fZ24487@xwing.netscape.com> From: malatras@NTOS.usa.net To: klm.IXMQ@netscape.com Subject: NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! -CKXA Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"-id5DB.A.BkD.9gwa6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! Dear friend, I received your e-mail as someone interested in Internet Business Opportunities. My name is Michalis Malatras. I have been a member of Streamline for about some months and it has been a great experience. Streamline has eliminated all the hassles of the other MLM companies, by giving you FREE tools you need to succeed, by helping you to build your downline with the trademarked Online Recruiter; the pressure of having to find people to sponsor is gone. I could do nothing and my business would grow, but with a little effort it could explode. This is not something that happened to me ten years ago and now you are getting my success story. This is a business that I have just been involved with for the past months and it has already exceeded all my expectations! Streamline is by no means a get rich quick scheme. Streamline has married three of the hottest trends: Internet, Natural Wellness and MLM. The technology breakthrough of the internet has finally made MLM feasible and hassle free. It can happen -- the technology is there. $firstname. Please check out my JUST UPDATED WEBSITES to find out why so many are now beginning to achieve financial independence through Streamline. http://www.cyber-action.com/oed/mnm.html Once you are ready, you simply enroll online and get it all started today! Keep in mind that Streamline offers 30 days money back guarantee. The risk is none. My Warmest Regards, Michalis Malatras Streamline International Proud Member of the MainStream Success Team -------------------------------------------------------------------------- If I received your e-mail in error, or you are no longer interested, please accept our apologies. You can be removed at no cost to you simply by pressing "Reply" and place "Remove" in the Subject line. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 21 11:17:46 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA09611 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:17:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0LGFhG05451; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:15:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0LGFig17287; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:15:44 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:15:44 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:15:26 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101211615.f0LGFP528424@ywing.netscape.com> From: malatras@EWXO.usa.net To: klm.KLQR@netscape.com Subject: NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! -NJHO Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"i2-WK.A.1NE.vswa6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! Dear friend, I received your e-mail as someone interested in Internet Business Opportunities. My name is Michalis Malatras. I have been a member of Streamline for about some months and it has been a great experience. Streamline has eliminated all the hassles of the other MLM companies, by giving you FREE tools you need to succeed, by helping you to build your downline with the trademarked Online Recruiter; the pressure of having to find people to sponsor is gone. I could do nothing and my business would grow, but with a little effort it could explode. This is not something that happened to me ten years ago and now you are getting my success story. This is a business that I have just been involved with for the past months and it has already exceeded all my expectations! Streamline is by no means a get rich quick scheme. Streamline has married three of the hottest trends: Internet, Natural Wellness and MLM. The technology breakthrough of the internet has finally made MLM feasible and hassle free. It can happen -- the technology is there. $firstname. Please check out my JUST UPDATED WEBSITES to find out why so many are now beginning to achieve financial independence through Streamline. http://www.cyber-action.com/oed/mnm.html Once you are ready, you simply enroll online and get it all started today! Keep in mind that Streamline offers 30 days money back guarantee. The risk is none. My Warmest Regards, Michalis Malatras Streamline International Proud Member of the MainStream Success Team -------------------------------------------------------------------------- If I received your e-mail in error, or you are no longer interested, please accept our apologies. You can be removed at no cost to you simply by pressing "Reply" and place "Remove" in the Subject line. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 21 11:48:24 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA09745 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 11:48:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0LGkNs01822; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:46:23 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0LGkNg22660; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:46:23 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:46:23 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 08:45:54 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101211645.f0LGjsZ04815@xwing.netscape.com> From: malatras@GJWJ.usa.net To: klm.ECQJ@netscape.com Subject: NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! -XJCJ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"4p3ZpC.A.yhF.eJxa6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit NEW "Internet" Work from home Program! MONEY NEVER STOPS! Dear friend, I received your e-mail as someone interested in Internet Business Opportunities. My name is Michalis Malatras. I have been a member of Streamline for about some months and it has been a great experience. Streamline has eliminated all the hassles of the other MLM companies, by giving you FREE tools you need to succeed, by helping you to build your downline with the trademarked Online Recruiter; the pressure of having to find people to sponsor is gone. I could do nothing and my business would grow, but with a little effort it could explode. This is not something that happened to me ten years ago and now you are getting my success story. This is a business that I have just been involved with for the past months and it has already exceeded all my expectations! Streamline is by no means a get rich quick scheme. Streamline has married three of the hottest trends: Internet, Natural Wellness and MLM. The technology breakthrough of the internet has finally made MLM feasible and hassle free. It can happen -- the technology is there. $firstname. Please check out my JUST UPDATED WEBSITES to find out why so many are now beginning to achieve financial independence through Streamline. http://www.cyber-action.com/oed/mnm.html Once you are ready, you simply enroll online and get it all started today! Keep in mind that Streamline offers 30 days money back guarantee. The risk is none. My Warmest Regards, Michalis Malatras Streamline International Proud Member of the MainStream Success Team -------------------------------------------------------------------------- If I received your e-mail in error, or you are no longer interested, please accept our apologies. You can be removed at no cost to you simply by pressing "Reply" and place "Remove" in the Subject line. -------------------------------------------------------------------------- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 21 20:11:39 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id UAA12298 for ; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 20:11:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0M19Us28169; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 17:09:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0M19Wk15563; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 17:09:32 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 17:09:32 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A6B893B.2C8EBA63@worldspot.com> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 17:13:31 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en-US,sv,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"V3Fe6.A.5yD.Lh4a6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit These are the issues that have been raised (that I am aware of) with the latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ldapext-ldap-java-api-12.txt), along with my own proposals for disposition. Nothing major, I don't think, and I'd like to conclude discussion on them in a week or so and update the Internet Draft. Rob 1.------------------------------------------------------------------- 4.23 public class LDAPNameFormSchema extends LDAPSchemaElement The LDAPNameFormSchema class represents the definition of a Name Form. It is used to discover or modify the allowed naming attributes for a particular object class. See [2] for a description of SAME form representation in LDAP. second to last line should be (error in caps) for a particular object class. See [2] for a description of NAME form Rob: typo 2.------------------------------------------------------------------- In sections 4.6.7, 4.26.1, 4.38.1, and 4.40.1, "host" is defined as a hostname or dotted string which may include trailing colon and port number. This does not allow IPv6 addresses to be specified, and should be changed to comply with RFC 2732: host = hostname | IPv4address | IPv6reference ipv6reference = "[" IPv6address "]" For example: "[FEDC:BA98:7654:3210:FEDC:BA98:7654:3210]:80" ldap://[3ffe:2a00:100:7031::1]:1050/o=abc Rob: OK 3.------------------------------------------------------------------- One change that I suggested was way off base now that I look at it again. That change is the change of values of the LDAP operation constants BIND_REQUEST 0 -> 0x60 etc. That is certainly one thing I didn't read carefully enough. Somehow I got it into my head that it was a numeric sequence, but on a more careful examination, the numbers come straight from RFC 2251. I think that next draft should put the numbers back the way they were before. We shouldn't be encoding the operation values with the ASN1 constructed, primitive bits, etc., just the operation value itself. Sorry for the miscue -Steve Rob: suggest reverting to the values listed in the prior draft. 4.a----------------------------------------------------------------- It might be better to eliminate the current unsolicited notification methods and instead have methods to add and remove listeners for usolicited notifications. The implementation can then discard unsolicited notifications if there are no listeners: In LDAPConnection: public void addUnsolicitedNotificationListener( LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener listener ) public void removeUnsolicitedNotificationListener( LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener listener ) New interface: public interface LDAPUnsolicitedNotificationListener { public void messageReceived( LDAPMessage msg ); } Rob: that's my proposal; it allows instant notification of unsolicited messages without polling, and I think that is what applications need. 4.b----------------------------------------------------------------- From Kurt: I believe there should be an explicit requirement: Implementations MUST generate requests with a non-zero message ID. Rob: agree 5.------------------------------------------------------------------- The draft is incorrect: LDAPEntry.getAttribute returns a single attribute, as does LDAPAttributeSet.getAttribute. Rob: typo 6.------------------------------------------------------------------- In the sample code for asynchronous search on in section 9.2 of IETF draft 12. The getReferrals() method should be used instead of getUrls(). Rob: agree 7.------------------------------------------------------------------- So shouldn't both the input stream and the output stream be set in one atomic operation so it is thread safe? Rob: I don't think there is a need for that. It is easy to add a synchronized wrapper for the two methods if a particular implementation needs to guard against (for example) different threads asynchronously changing the input stream but not the output stream. Actually, if an application has threads doing that, it's asking for trouble anyway. You really don't want one thread changing the input and output streams (even if they are done simultaneously) behind the back of another thread. From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 22 00:11:31 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id AAA16275 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 00:11:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0M59KG15040; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:09:20 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0M59Lk28342; Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:09:21 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 21:09:21 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101220509.f0M59JZ13260@xwing.netscape.com> Date: Sun, 21 Jan 2001 22:09:29 -0700 From: "Mike Grub" To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Sender: grubmike@hotmail.com Subject: Going Platinum !!! Miss This & Miss Out!!! 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Please visit: www.retirequickly.com/85037 to see and hear complete presentation. From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 22 12:50:10 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA10172 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 12:50:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0MHlrG22998; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:47:53 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0MHlqo28965; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:47:52 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 09:47:52 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 10:47:12 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: , Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_6D363621.5736662B" Resent-Message-ID: <"ZWxMwD.A.QCH.BJHb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_6D363621.5736662B Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Minor typo related to item 5. The description of attrName "See 4.3.5for the syntax and semantics" needs a space after 4.3.5 ...........................................................................= ...... 7. Bibliography [7] should refer to draft version 05 of the ldap-c-api ...........................................................................= ....... -Steve ------------------------ Steve Sonntag Novell, Inc., the leading provider of Net services software >>> Rob Weltman 21-Jan-01 6:13:31 PM >>> These are the issues that have been raised (that I am aware of) with the = latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-= ietf-ldapext-ldap-java-api-12.txt), along with my own proposals for = disposition. Nothing major, I don't think, and I'd like to conclude discussion on = them in a week or so and update the Internet Draft. Rob 5.------------------------------------------------------------------- The draft is incorrect: LDAPEntry.getAttribute returns a single attribute, = as does LDAPAttributeSet.getAttribute.=20 Rob: typo --=_6D363621.5736662B Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Minor typo related to item 5.  The = description of=20 attrName
 
"See 4.3.5for the syntax and semantics"
 
needs a space after 4.3.5
......................................................................= ...........
7. Bibliography
 
[7] should refer to draft version 05 of the ldap-c-api
......................................................................= ............
 
-Steve
 
------------------------
Steve Sonntag
Novell, Inc., the = leading=20 provider of Net services software
 


>>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> = 21-Jan-01=20 6:13:31 PM >>>
  These are the issues that have been = raised=20 (that I am aware of) with the latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ldapext-ldap-jav= a-api-12.txt),=20 along with my own proposals for disposition.

  Nothing major, = I=20 don't think, and I'd like to conclude discussion on them in a week or so = and=20 update the Internet=20 Draft.

Rob



5.----------------------------------------= ---------------------------

The=20 draft is incorrect: LDAPEntry.getAttribute returns a single attribute, = as=20 does
LDAPAttributeSet.getAttribute.

Rob:=20 typo


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Rob,
 
In looking at the LDAPConnection object, I think the text should
=
be clarified as to which methods affect / apply to the global=20 connection
(the source object) v.s. an individual clone of the LDAPConnection =
object.  Here is my swag at it - omitting requests except = bind,=20 connect
& disconnect.
 
add/RemoveUnsolicitedNotificationListener - connection
bind - connection & and possibly clone - see note
          (Note: if=20 disconnected when attempting bind, the
          API attempts = a=20 reconnect which now makes it
          specific to = the=20 clone the bind is done on.  Is this
          the intended=20= behavior? - see 4.6.4 & 4.6.5.  I vote
          that bind does = not=20 attempt reconnect, but throws an
          exception=20 instead).
connect - clone
disconnect - clone
finalize - clone
getAuthenticationDN - connection
getAuthenticationMethod - connection
getAuthenticationPassword - connection
get/setConstraints - clone
getHost - connection
get/setInputStream - connection
get/setOutputStream - connection
getPort - connection
get/setProperty - clone
getProtocolVersion - connection
getResponseControls - clone
getSaslBindCallBackHandler - connection
getSaslBindProperties - connection
get/setSearchConstraints - clone
getSocketFactory - connection
setSocketFactory - static connection
isBound - connecton
isConnected - connection
is/startTLS - connection
 
-Steve
 
 
 
 
 
 
------------------------
Steve Sonntag
Novell, Inc., the = leading=20 provider of Net services software
 
 
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Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 22 21:27:16 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA19211 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 21:27:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0N2P9s26448; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:25:09 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0N2PAg16633; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:25:10 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:25:10 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010122172630.00a6f700@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:25:00 -0800 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Java LDAP API and the Java Community Process Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"cecruC.A.nDE.FuOb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com The Java Community Program is the recognized organization responsible for publishing Java API specifications. The JCP appears to independently review IETF Java API specifications prior to them becoming JCP approved specifications such as was done with RFC2853 (JCP 72), the Java GSSAPI API. Though the RFC2853 was adopted "as is", the JCP could have adopted it with changes. This clearly would have lead to interoperability problems between competing specifications. It is unclear whether RFC2853 should be progressed now that there is a JCP controlled revision process. If and when the IETF LDAP Java is published as an RFC, it would likely be submitted to the JCP for review. They may or may adopt it and if they do, they may make changes. This would lead to interoperability problems between competing specifications. The JCP has on going work in LDAP (JNDI) and related networking services (SASL, TLS). It seems reasonable to assume that the JCP would likely not accept an IETF Java API without change. To avoid problems caused by having two competing Java LDAP API specifications, I recommend this work be continued under the auspices of the JCP and removed from the WG charter. Kurt From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 22 21:44:52 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA20279 for ; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 21:44:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0N2glG03250; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:42:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0N2gmo21560; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:42:48 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:42:48 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A6CEF7C.E38C1366@worldspot.com> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 18:42:04 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Java LDAP API and the Java Community Process References: <5.0.2.1.0.20010122172630.00a6f700@router.boolean.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"GDQPJC.A.mQF.n-Ob6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In the Sun perception, there is no need for a Java LDAP API because of the existence of JNDI. There is almost zero possibility that a Java LDAP API would be considered by the JCP. Rob "Kurt D. Zeilenga" wrote: > > The Java Community Program is the recognized organization > responsible for publishing Java API specifications. > > The JCP appears to independently review IETF Java API > specifications prior to them becoming JCP approved > specifications such as was done with RFC2853 (JCP 72), the > Java GSSAPI API. Though the RFC2853 was adopted "as is", > the JCP could have adopted it with changes. This clearly > would have lead to interoperability problems between > competing specifications. It is unclear whether RFC2853 > should be progressed now that there is a JCP controlled > revision process. > > If and when the IETF LDAP Java is published as an RFC, > it would likely be submitted to the JCP for review. They > may or may adopt it and if they do, they may make changes. > This would lead to interoperability problems between > competing specifications. > > The JCP has on going work in LDAP (JNDI) and related > networking services (SASL, TLS). It seems reasonable to > assume that the JCP would likely not accept an IETF Java > API without change. > > To avoid problems caused by having two competing Java LDAP > API specifications, I recommend this work be continued under > the auspices of the JCP and removed from the WG charter. > > Kurt From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 01:49:49 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id BAA28898 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 01:49:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0N6m3s20328; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:48:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0N6m5g23526; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:48:05 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:48:05 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010122154103.00a31430@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 22:47:32 -0800 To: Rob Weltman From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com In-Reply-To: <3A6B893B.2C8EBA63@worldspot.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"EJxu2D.A.UvF.kkSb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 05:13 PM 1/21/01 -0800, Rob Weltman wrote: > These are the issues that have been raised (that I am aware of) with the latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ldapext-ldap-java-api-12.txt), along with my own proposals for disposition. I have a few other issues. Many of these have been discussed previously. The API appears to support both LDAPv2 and LDAPv3 but appears to assumes use of UTF-8 regardless of the protocol. LDAPv2 directoryStrings are restricted to T.61. In addition, certain LDAPv2 protocol strings (e.g. all LDAPStrings) are restricted to IA5. If LDAPv2 is to be support, it should be fully supported and a normative reference to LDAPv2 should be stated. If LDAPv2 is not to be supported, all mention of LDAPv2 should be stricken. I believe this API should not attempt to support both LDAPv2 and LDAPv3. As LDAPv2 will be moved to historical status upon publication of an LDAPv3 Draft Standard, I recommend this API support only LDAPv3. API contains a reference to RFC 1823, an Informational RFC. If this is non-normative, it should be noted. If normative, there is a standard track maturity issue in that RFC 1823 is informational. It appears to be normative to me. The abstract refers to the expired async API I-D unnecesarily. It appears that the API specification requires implementation of LDAP Language Tags, an extension to the "core" protocol specification. The core API should only require implementation of the "core" protocol specification. APIs for non-core extensions should be detailed in API extensions. Java, IIRC, uses UCS-2. LDAP allows the full (31-bit) set of ISO-10646-1 characters encoded in UTF-8. There should be some comment as what is to be done with characters outside of UCS-2 but with ISO-10646-1. There should be a normative reference to Java language specification(s) [core + required extensions (SASL/TLS)]. The relationship with JNDI should also be discussed. Appears the default behavior is to chase referrals. As I've noted previously on this list, this is not a wise default from a security perspective. The default should be not to chase referrals (period). LDAP_PARTIAL_RESULTS? There should be no mention of this. However, I note that the API should be capable of treating unrecognized result codes returned by servers (including those reserved by API specifications) as unknown errors. Missing normative references: Java API Spec Java SASL API Spec Java TLS API Spec ldaps (LDAP over SSL) RFC 2222, RFC 2829, RFC 2830 Kurt From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 02:07:04 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id CAA06354 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 02:07:03 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0N74vs22519; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:04:57 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0N74xo27355; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:04:59 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:04:59 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010122190659.00a9bec0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:04:45 -0800 To: Rob Weltman From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Java LDAP API and the Java Community Process Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com In-Reply-To: <3A6CEF7C.E38C1366@worldspot.com> References: <5.0.2.1.0.20010122172630.00a6f700@router.boolean.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"efmlK.A.JrG.a0Sb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 06:42 PM 1/22/01 -0800, Rob Weltman wrote: >In the Sun perception, there is no need for a Java LDAP API because of the existence of JNDI. I think it's fairly reasonable to prefer a Java Standard Extension, such as JNDI, over one which isn't. > There is almost zero possibility that a Java LDAP API would be considered by the JCP. There is zero possibility if it's not submitted to the JCP. I believe there is a significant possibility that JNDI will be extended by the JCP to incorporate most, if not all, of the functionality of the LDAPext LDAP API. It seems odd that we would recognize the JCP as the providing the definitive specification of the Java Language, numerous Internet protocol APIs, but not the LDAP API. In the end, there should be one Standard LDAP API. Whether we like it or not, that will be a JCP approved specification. If we want to have an impact upon this specification, we need to work within the JCP not outside it. Kurt From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 02:34:43 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id CAA06617 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 02:34:43 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0N7X3s24766; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:33:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0N7X5o04022; Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:33:05 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:33:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A6D3476.DD02FA52@worldspot.com> Date: Mon, 22 Jan 2001 23:36:22 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en-US,sv,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" CC: Rob Weltman , ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Java LDAP API and the Java Community Process References: <5.0.2.1.0.20010122172630.00a6f700@router.boolean.net> <5.0.2.1.0.20010122190659.00a9bec0@router.boolean.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"ObY6vC.A.k-.vOTb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Kurt D. Zeilenga" wrote: > > At 06:42 PM 1/22/01 -0800, Rob Weltman wrote: > >In the Sun perception, there is no need for a Java LDAP API because of the existence of JNDI. > > I think it's fairly reasonable to prefer a Java Standard Extension, > such as JNDI, over one which isn't. They serve different purposes. JNDI's purpose is not to expose the LDAP protocol, and that has important consequences. > > There is almost zero possibility that a Java LDAP API would be considered by the JCP. > > There is zero possibility if it's not submitted to the JCP. > > I believe there is a significant possibility that JNDI will be > extended by the JCP to incorporate most, if not all, of the > functionality of the LDAPext LDAP API. > > It seems odd that we would recognize the JCP as the providing > the definitive specification of the Java Language, numerous > Internet protocol APIs, but not the LDAP API. > > In the end, there should be one Standard LDAP API. Whether we > like it or not, that will be a JCP approved specification. If > we want to have an impact upon this specification, we need to > work within the JCP not outside it. I do work inside it. I'm spec lead for JSR 28 (SASL API), which started out as an Internet Draft. I've also been involved off and on with JNDI since the beginning of 1997, more in the beginning. JNDI and the Java LDAP API have branched off in different directions because they have different purposes in life. I wasn't willing to confine the API to what can be done with a generic directory interface because there were and are important LDAP features that developers want to exploit and which don't fit the JNDI template. And of course JNDI needs to abstract from the protocols it encapsulates in order to achieve its goals. Unfortunately not everyone realizes that. Rob From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 07:36:45 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA09557 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:36:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0NCYQG19195; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:34:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0NCYQ221678; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:34:26 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:34:26 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101231233.HAA09306@ietf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" To: IETF-Announce: ; CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Reply-to: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-zeilenga-ldap-cancel-00.txt Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:33:54 -0500 Sender: nsyracus@cnri.reston.va.us Resent-Message-ID: <"y8GsrD.A.cSF.RpXb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. Title : LDAP Cancel Extended Operation Author(s) : K. Zeilenga Filename : draft-zeilenga-ldap-cancel-00.txt Pages : 5 Date : 22-Jan-01 This specification describes an extended operation to cancel (or abandon) an outstanding operation. Unlike the LDAP Abandon operation [RFC2251] but like the DAP Abandon operation [X.511], this operation has a response to indicate whether or not the operation was successful. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-zeilenga-ldap-cancel-00.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-zeilenga-ldap-cancel-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-zeilenga-ldap-cancel-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20010122143409.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-zeilenga-ldap-cancel-00.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-zeilenga-ldap-cancel-00.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20010122143409.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 07:36:53 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA09586 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:36:52 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0NCYXG19300; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:34:33 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0NCYX621809; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:34:33 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 04:34:33 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101231233.HAA09290@ietf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" To: IETF-Announce: ; CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Reply-to: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpasswd-04.txt Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 07:33:49 -0500 Sender: nsyracus@cnri.reston.va.us Resent-Message-ID: <"I4CFLC.A.LUF.XpXb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. Title : LDAP Authentication Password Attribute Author(s) : K. Zeilenga Filename : draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpasswd-04.txt Pages : 9 Date : 22-Jan-01 This document describes schema in support of user/password authentication in a LDAP directory including the authPassword attribute type. This attribute type holds values derived from the user's password(s) (commonly using cryptographic strength one-way hash). authPassword is intended to used instead of userPassword. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpasswd-04.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpasswd-04.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpasswd-04.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Multipart/Alternative; Boundary="OtherAccess" --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; access-type="mail-server"; server="mailserv@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20010122143400.I-D@ietf.org> ENCODING mime FILE /internet-drafts/draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpasswd-04.txt --OtherAccess Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpasswd-04.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <20010122143400.I-D@ietf.org> --OtherAccess-- --NextPart-- From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 16:10:48 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id QAA24633 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 16:10:47 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0NL8YG08436; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:08:35 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0NL8aU24058; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:08:36 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:08:36 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:08:28 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101232108.f0NL8S521586@ywing.netscape.com> From: dcsenterprises2001@yahoo.com To: people.VRRI@netscape.com Subject: Hello X-Reply-To: dcsenterprises2001@yahoo.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"_rfZnC.A.e3F.RLfb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello, Would you consider granting me permisssion to send you information on an automated online business opportunity? David Dale dCs Enterprises dcsenterprises2001@yahoo.com From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 17:35:43 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id RAA25673 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:35:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0NMXQb02513; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:33:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0NLtJ617161; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:55:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:55:19 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010123134238.00adeaa0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:54:46 -0800 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: AuthPassword I-D: draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpasswd-04.txt Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"pvJga.A.oLE.C3fb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com The I-D has been updated to remove specific support for SASL. Though this attribute could be used to support SASL user/password authentications mechanisms such as DIGEST-MD5, it is unclear to me whether or not this is the best approach for these mechanisms. In addition, the I-D now includes a recommendation that hashed values be protected as if they were the actual plain text passwords. Your comments are solicited. From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 17:55:22 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id RAA25882 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:55:21 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0NMrlb06779; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 14:53:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0NLxEY18393; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:59:14 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:59:14 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010123135455.00ae0d00@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 13:59:17 -0800 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Cancel I-D: draft-zeilenga-ldap-cancel-00.txt Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"FCqWrD.A.9eE.u6fb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This draft describes an LDAPv3 extended operation intended to be used instead of the abandon operation in situations requiring a result indication. It's based on the X.511 abandon operation. Your comments are solicited. 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From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 20:49:21 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id UAA27877 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 20:49:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0O1keG03955; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:46:40 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0O1kfQ13294; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:46:41 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 17:46:41 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:04:12 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: , Cc: Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_02595884.6C0D5C17" Resent-Message-ID: <"1xf3zC.A.SPD.AQjb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_02595884.6C0D5C17 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Kurt, The default behavior for following referrals is specified in the LDAPConstraints object. The boolean doReferrals parameter controls whether referrals are followed or not. The default for this parameter is "FALSE", i.e. referrals are not automatically followed [period]. See also 4.7.8. -Steve >>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 22-Jan-01 11:47:32 PM >>> At 05:13 PM 1/21/01 -0800, Rob Weltman wrote: > These are the issues that have been raised (that I am aware of) with = the latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/dr= aft-ietf-ldapext-ldap-java-api-12.txt), along with my own proposals for = disposition. I have a few other issues. Many of these have been discussed previously. ............cut................ Appears the default behavior is to chase referrals. As I've noted previously on this list, this is not a wise default from a security perspective. The default should be not to chase referrals (period). .............cut................ Kurt --=_02595884.6C0D5C17 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Kurt,
 
The default behavior for following referrals is specified in
the LDAPConstraints object.  The boolean doReferrals parameter
controls whether referrals are followed or not.  The default
for this parameter is "FALSE", i.e. referrals are not
automatically followed [period].  See also 4.7.8.
 
-Steve

>>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" <Kurt@OpenLDAP.org>= ;=20 22-Jan-01 11:47:32 PM >>>
At 05:13 PM 1/21/01 -0800, Rob = Weltman=20 wrote:
>  These are the issues that have been raised (that I am = aware=20 of) with the latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ldapext-ldap-jav= a-api-12.txt),=20 along with my own proposals for disposition.

I have a few other=20 issues.  Many of these have been
discussed=20 previously.

............cut................

Appears the default behavior is to chase referrals.  As=20 I've
noted previously on this list, this is not a wise default = from
a=20 security perspective.  The default should be not to chase
referrals= =20 (period).
.............cut................

Kurt

--=_02595884.6C0D5C17-- From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 21:48:18 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA29396 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 21:48:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0O2kAb29684; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:46:11 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0O2kBw09334; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:46:11 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 18:46:11 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 10:56:10 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: , Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_297273D3.7F1E4F1C" Resent-Message-ID: <"GNQEUD.A.eRC.yHkb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_297273D3.7F1E4F1C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Rob, I think the wording for the method getResponseControls in the LDAPConnection class needs to be clarified slightly to clarify that it applies only to non search operations, e.g. "Returns the latest Server Controls for non search operations returned by a Directory Server with a response to an LDAP request from the current thread, or null if the latest response contained no Server Controls." -Steve ------------------------ Steve Sonntag Novell, Inc., the leading provider of Net services software >>> Rob Weltman 21-Jan-01 6:13:31 PM >>> These are the issues that have been raised (that I am aware of) with the = latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-= ietf-ldapext-ldap-java-api-12.txt), along with my own proposals for = disposition. Nothing major, I don't think, and I'd like to conclude discussion on = them in a week or so and update the Internet Draft. Rob --=_297273D3.7F1E4F1C Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Rob,
 
I think the wording for the method getResponseControls in the
LDAPConnection class needs to be clarified slightly to clarify
that it applies only to non search operations, e.g.
 
"Returns the latest Server Controls for non search  operations
returned by a Directory Server with a response to an LDAP
request from the current thread, or null if the latest
response contained no Server Controls."
 
-Steve
 
 
------------------------
Steve Sonntag
Novell, Inc., the = leading=20 provider of Net services software
 
 

>>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> 21-Jan-01 = 6:13:31=20 PM >>>
  These are the issues that have been raised (that = I am=20 aware of) with the latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ldapext-ldap-jav= a-api-12.txt),=20 along with my own proposals for disposition.

  Nothing major, = I=20 don't think, and I'd like to conclude discussion on them in a week or so = and=20 update the Internet Draft.

Rob


--=_297273D3.7F1E4F1C-- From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 23 22:40:24 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id WAA00972 for ; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 22:40:23 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0O3cFG20156; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:38:15 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0O3cHY27140; Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:38:17 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:38:17 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010123192837.00a86400@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 19:37:53 -0800 To: "Steve Sonntag" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Cc: , In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"mM71OB.A.ynG.o4kb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 10:04 AM 1/23/01 -0700, Steve Sonntag wrote: >The default behavior for following referrals is specified in >the LDAPConstraints object. The boolean doReferrals parameter >controls whether referrals are followed or not. The default >for this parameter is "FALSE", i.e. referrals are not >automatically followed [period]. See also 4.7.8. I was mislead by section 1 (top of page 10). A clarification in this paragraph as to the default behavior might be appropriate. Kurt From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 11:52:45 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA25314 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:52:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OGp1b19246; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:51:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OGp1k28966; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:51:01 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 08:51:01 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:50:28 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: , Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_FEA5A6C4.AECF9DF9" Resent-Message-ID: <"Q9Xor.A.UEH.0fwb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_FEA5A6C4.AECF9DF9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable LDAPReferralException=20 4.27 public class LDAPReferralException=20 extends LDAPException=20 =20 This exception, derived from LDAPException, is thrown when a server=20 returns a referral and automatic referral following has not been=20 enabled.=20 Add to the above or automatic referral following could not follow any referrals. -Steve --=_FEA5A6C4.AECF9DF9 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
LDAPReferralException
 
4.27 public class LDAPReferralException=20
            = ;     =20 extends LDAPException
   
   This = exception,=20 derived from LDAPException, is thrown when a server
   = returns a=20 referral and automatic referral following has not been
   = enabled.=20
Add to the above
 
    or automatic referral following could not follow = any=20 referrals.
 
-Steve
--=_FEA5A6C4.AECF9DF9-- From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 12:10:07 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA25663 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:10:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OH6xG24136; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:06:59 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OH6wI24226; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:06:58 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:06:58 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A6F0C9F.4B4D0333@worldspot.com> Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:10:55 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en-US,sv,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Sonntag CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"8UzY_.A.N5F.vuwb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Steve Sonntag wrote: > LDAPReferralException 4.27 public class LDAPReferralException > extends LDAPException > > This exception, derived from LDAPException, is thrown when a server > returns a referral and automatic referral following has not been > enabled.Add to the above or automatic referral following could not follow any referrals. -Steve That sounds hard to handle for a client. Are you thinking of the case where the referral points to a server which is inaccessible or which doesn't accept the credentials of the requestor? How would the client know which of those problems was being flagged if there is only a referral exception? And consequently, how would the client know what to do about it? Rob From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 12:33:19 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA26080 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:33:19 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OHVeb27211; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:31:40 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OHVeI04783; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:31:40 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 09:31:40 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: hahnt@us.ibm.com X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 From: "Timothy Hahn" Message-ID: Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:31:35 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D01MLC96/01/M/IBM(Release 5.0.6 |January 4, 2001) at 01/24/2001 12:31:36 PM, Serialize complete at 01/24/2001 12:31:36 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 006005F1852569DE_=" Resent-Message-ID: <"zkkr6D.A.dKB.7Fxb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 006005F1852569DE_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Greetings, In section 4.1, the existing return codes for the protocol are being added to with four additional values. The values seem appropriate only for the Cancel extended operation. I suggest that the existing return codes are not changed. Rather, I suggest that the Cancel Response contain: CancelResponseValue ::= SEQUENCE { cancelResultCode ENUMERATED { canceled (0), noSuchOperation (1), tooLate (2), cannotCancel (3) } } This way, the existing protocol data elements are not infringed upon by the added extended operation. My other commnets are editorial and will be sent directly to Kurt. Regards, Tim Hahn Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 fax: 607.752.3681 --=_alternative 006005F1852569DE_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Greetings,

In section 4.1, the existing return codes for the protocol are being added to with four additional values.  The values seem appropriate only for the Cancel extended operation.

I suggest that the existing return codes are not changed.  Rather, I suggest that the Cancel Response contain:

CancelResponseValue ::= SEQUENCE {
        cancelResultCode ENUMERATED {
                canceled (0),
                noSuchOperation (1),
                tooLate (2),
                cannotCancel (3)
        }
}

This way, the existing protocol data elements are not infringed upon by the added extended operation.

My other commnets are editorial and will be sent directly to Kurt.
Regards,
Tim Hahn

Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com
Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT)
phone: 607.752.6388     tie-line: 8/852.6388
fax: 607.752.3681 --=_alternative 006005F1852569DE_=-- From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 13:53:55 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id NAA27891 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:53:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OIokG14488; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:50:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OIol213825; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:50:47 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:50:47 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010124095004.00ab4bb0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 10:49:39 -0800 To: hahnt@us.ibm.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"KyhA4D.A.vXD.GQyb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Note that the 'canceled' resultCode is to be returned by canceled operation, not the cancel operation. I find it inappropriate to overload this condition onto any other resultCode. They already have defined semantics. The semantics of being canceled is orthogonal to these semantics. Hence, I believe adding an additional resultCode is, IMO, justified. I could make similar arguments with respect to the other result codes. However, I think the basic issue here is whether or not a protocol extension to LDAP can amend the ASN.1. I believe limited amendments can be made, including: - additional elements may be added to sequences, and - additional choices may be added, - additional values may be added to enumerations. The base specification states how implementations faced with unrecognized protocol elements should behave. However, I do believe that no extensions should be provided without mutual agreement of the protocol peers. Kurt At 12:31 PM 1/24/01 -0500, Timothy Hahn wrote: >Greetings, > >In section 4.1, the existing return codes for the protocol are being added to with four additional values. The values seem appropriate only for the Cancel extended operation. > >I suggest that the existing return codes are not changed. Rather, I suggest that the Cancel Response contain: > >CancelResponseValue ::= SEQUENCE { > cancelResultCode ENUMERATED { > canceled (0), > noSuchOperation (1), > tooLate (2), > cannotCancel (3) > } >} > >This way, the existing protocol data elements are not infringed upon by the added extended operation. > >My other commnets are editorial and will be sent directly to Kurt. > >Regards, >Tim Hahn > >Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com >Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) >phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 >fax: 607.752.3681 From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 14:07:06 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA28138 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:07:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OJ58G17108; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:05:09 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OJ58c20697; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:05:09 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:05:09 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:59:55 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: , Cc: Subject: Re: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0OJ57v20573 Resent-Message-ID: <"DhjozB.A.CDF.jdyb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/24/01 11:49:39 AM >>> >However, I think the basic issue here is whether or not a >protocol extension to LDAP can amend the ASN.1. I believe >limited amendments can be made, including: > - additional elements may be added to sequences, and I agree > - additional choices may be added, I agree > - additional values may be added to enumerations. I cannot find the clause that allows this, can you explain? Jim From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 14:07:30 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA28203 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:07:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OJ66G17734; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:06:07 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OJ66w21564; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:06:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:06:06 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: From: "John Liang" To: Subject: matching rule for server side sorting Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:05:51 -0500 Message-ID: <001401c08638$ab3b88b0$07a75b18@ne.mediaone.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2377.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 Resent-Message-ID: <"FdkztC.A.qQF.deyb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit HI there, For the matchingrule in the client request of server side sorting, is it the oid or the string name of this matchingrule? Let us say, for matchingrules: ( 2.5.13.18 NAME 'octetStringOrderingMatch' SYNTAX 1.3.6.1.4.1.1466.115.121.1.40 ). Is it 'octetStringOrderingMatch' or 1.3.6.1.4.1.1466.115.121.1.40? Thanks, -- John Liang From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 14:24:39 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA28464 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:24:39 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OJMfb24687; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:22:41 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OJMfY28538; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:22:41 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:22:41 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:16:34 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: Cc: Subject: Alias pointing to ancestor Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0OJMdv28499 Resent-Message-ID: <"GGrOPD.A.c9G._tyb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit A question has risen in the context of some interoperability tests regarding whether it is allowed to have an alias entry that points to an ancestor entry. I can't find any reference to this in X.501. I see in section 9.5 that an alias can point to a non-leaf, as well as to another alias, but it doesn't mention pointing to accentors. I assume it's disallowed, otherwise there should be an instruction regarding how circular dereferencing is to be handled. I couldn't find anything like that in X.511. Is any of this talked about and I'm just missing it? Jim From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 14:40:55 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA28694 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:40:54 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OJcfG24609; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:38:42 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OJcfA05527; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:38:41 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:38:41 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010124111050.00ada8a0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:36:57 -0800 To: "Jim Sermersheim" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Cc: , In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"YQ4_KC.A.FWB.A9yb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 11:59 AM 1/24/01 -0700, Jim Sermersheim wrote: >>>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/24/01 11:49:39 AM >>> > >>However, I think the basic issue here is whether or not a >>protocol extension to LDAP can amend the ASN.1. I believe >>limited amendments can be made, including: >> - additional elements may be added to sequences, and > >I agree This is explicit in RFC 2251, Section 4. >> - additional choices may be added, > >I agree There is no specific statement in RFC 2251 allowing such additions. >> - additional values may be added to enumerations. > >I cannot find the clause that allows this, can you explain? There is no specific statement in RFC 2251 allowing such additions. In my view, this I-D proposes a change to the LDAP protocol using one of the provided extension mechanism. That is, the changes are only visible when the extension is being used by mutual agreement of both peer. If an extension mechanism was not used, I would argue the version would have to be incremented. From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 14:58:10 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA29196 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:58:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OJuPb03153; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:56:25 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OJuPc14383; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:56:25 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 11:56:25 -0800 (PST) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 From: "Timothy Hahn" Message-ID: Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:56:19 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D01MLC96/01/M/IBM(Release 5.0.6 |January 4, 2001) at 01/24/2001 02:56:20 PM, Serialize complete at 01/24/2001 02:56:20 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 006D2F81852569DE_=" Resent-Message-ID: <"42MbMD.A.dgD.oNzb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 006D2F81852569DE_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Kurt, I see, from re-reading X.511 and the abandon description there that the original request should return the abandoned (in your description, canceled) indication. This would seem to force the issue of having to add a value to the resultCode enumeration in the LDAPResult sequence. While I am concerned about protocol element updates without some sort of version indication noting their addition, I understand your intent and your choice to augment the resultCode for the canceled value. And if we're updating resultCode anyway, adding in the other three doesn't seem that much more of a leap. The more general question of what are acceptable amendments to the ASN.1 is an interesting topic that I hope the list discusses. Regards, Tim Hahn Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 fax: 607.752.3681 To: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Note that the 'canceled' resultCode is to be returned by canceled operation, not the cancel operation. I find it inappropriate to overload this condition onto any other resultCode. They already have defined semantics. The semantics of being canceled is orthogonal to these semantics. Hence, I believe adding an additional resultCode is, IMO, justified. I could make similar arguments with respect to the other result codes. However, I think the basic issue here is whether or not a protocol extension to LDAP can amend the ASN.1. I believe limited amendments can be made, including: - additional elements may be added to sequences, and - additional choices may be added, - additional values may be added to enumerations. The base specification states how implementations faced with unrecognized protocol elements should behave. However, I do believe that no extensions should be provided without mutual agreement of the protocol peers. Kurt At 12:31 PM 1/24/01 -0500, Timothy Hahn wrote: >Greetings, > >In section 4.1, the existing return codes for the protocol are being added to with four additional values. The values seem appropriate only for the Cancel extended operation. > >I suggest that the existing return codes are not changed. Rather, I suggest that the Cancel Response contain: > >CancelResponseValue ::= SEQUENCE { > cancelResultCode ENUMERATED { > canceled (0), > noSuchOperation (1), > tooLate (2), > cannotCancel (3) > } >} > >This way, the existing protocol data elements are not infringed upon by the added extended operation. > >My other commnets are editorial and will be sent directly to Kurt. > >Regards, >Tim Hahn > >Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com >Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) >phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 >fax: 607.752.3681 --=_alternative 006D2F81852569DE_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Kurt,

I see, from re-reading X.511 and the abandon description there that the original request should return the abandoned (in your description, canceled) indication.

This would seem to force the issue of having to add a value to the resultCode enumeration in the LDAPResult sequence.

While I am concerned about protocol element updates without some sort of version indication noting their addition, I understand your intent and your choice to augment the resultCode for the canceled value.  And if we're updating resultCode anyway, adding in the other three doesn't seem that much more of a leap.

The more general question of what are acceptable amendments to the ASN.1 is an interesting topic that I hope the list discusses.
Regards,
Tim Hahn

Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com
Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT)
phone: 607.752.6388     tie-line: 8/852.6388
fax: 607.752.3681

To:        Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS
cc:        ietf-ldapext@netscape.com
Subject:        Re: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt



Note that the 'canceled' resultCode is to be returned by
canceled operation, not the cancel operation.  I find it
inappropriate to overload this condition onto any other
resultCode.  They already have defined semantics.  The
semantics of being canceled is orthogonal to these
semantics.  Hence, I believe adding an additional resultCode
is, IMO, justified.  I could make similar arguments
with respect to the other result codes.
However, I think the basic issue here is whether or not a
protocol extension to LDAP can amend the ASN.1.  I believe
limited amendments can be made, including:
       - additional elements may be added to sequences, and
       - additional choices may be added,
       - additional values may be added to enumerations.
The base specification states how implementations faced with
unrecognized protocol elements should behave.  However, I
do believe that no extensions should be provided without
mutual agreement of the protocol peers.
Kurt
At 12:31 PM 1/24/01 -0500, Timothy Hahn wrote:
>Greetings,
>
>In section 4.1, the existing return codes for the protocol are being added to with four additional values.  The values seem appropriate only for the Cancel extended operation.
>
>I suggest that the existing return codes are not changed.  Rather, I suggest that the Cancel Response contain:
>
>CancelResponseValue ::= SEQUENCE {
>        cancelResultCode ENUMERATED {
>                canceled (0),
>                noSuchOperation (1),
>                tooLate (2),
>                cannotCancel (3)
>        }
>}
>
>This way, the existing protocol data elements are not infringed upon by the added extended operation.
>
>My other commnets are editorial and will be sent directly to Kurt.
>
>Regards,
>Tim Hahn
>
>Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com
>Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT)
>phone: 607.752.6388     tie-line: 8/852.6388
>fax: 607.752.3681


--=_alternative 006D2F81852569DE_=-- From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 15:09:37 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id PAA29608 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:09:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OK7UG01128; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:07:30 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OK7VY19291; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:07:31 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 12:07:31 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: From: "Salter, Thomas A" To: Jim Sermersheim , ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Cc: d.w.chadwick@iti.salford.ac.uk Subject: RE: Alias pointing to ancestor Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:07:01 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2653.19) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Resent-Message-ID: <"M5Av6C.A.JtE.BYzb6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com (I glad to see you copied David Chadwick.) In his book, Understanding X.500, he states that the '93 standards allow for circular references and require the DSA to avoid looping by keeping track of which parts of the tree have already been searched. (Section 5.10, p.149) I can't find an explicit reference in the X.500 standards. The closest thing I found is the flowchart in Figure B.10 in Annex B of X.511. Next to a decision box labeled "alias object name to be considered?" is the note "e.g., not already included; does not lead to search loop". It thus appears the intent was to allow circular references. A related question that came up in interoperability testing some time ago had to do with order of the evaluation of search filters and dereferencing of aliases. The flowchart B.9 in X.511 clearly indicates that aliases are dereferenced before the search filters are applied. > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Sermersheim [mailto:JIMSE@novell.com] > Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2001 2:17 PM > To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com > Cc: d.w.chadwick@iti.salford.ac.uk > Subject: Alias pointing to ancestor > > > A question has risen in the context of some interoperability > tests regarding whether it is allowed to have an alias entry > that points to an ancestor entry. > > I can't find any reference to this in X.501. I see in > section 9.5 that an alias can point to a non-leaf, as well > as to another alias, but it doesn't mention pointing to accentors. > > I assume it's disallowed, otherwise there should be an > instruction regarding how circular dereferencing is to be > handled. I couldn't find anything like that in X.511. > > Is any of this talked about and I'm just missing it? > > Jim > From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 17:01:36 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id RAA01326 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:01:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0OLxoG20625; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:59:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0OLxos10228; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:59:50 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 13:59:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 14:58:05 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: Cc: , Subject: Re: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0OLxmv10204 Resent-Message-ID: <"ZF86dC.A.ifC.VB1b6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/24/01 12:36:57 PM >>> >In my view, this I-D proposes a change to the LDAP protocol >using one of the provided extension mechanism. That is, the >changes are only visible when the extension is being used >by mutual agreement of both peer. If an extension mechanism >was not used, I would argue the version would have to be >incremented. This may be a good philosophy, but before it's practiced in I-D's headed for standards track , I think this larger issue should be itself standardized. This kind of thing can be seen by people to extend past the three ammendments you outlined. For example, I remember one of the delete subtree drafts attempting to override protocol behavior (not just wire protocol). Jim From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 18:49:08 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA02340 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 18:49:08 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0ONj0G14466; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:45:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0ONj0E27294; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:45:00 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:45:00 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010124141802.00a56d60@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 15:44:17 -0800 To: "Jim Sermersheim" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Cc: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"hl9LQC.A.npG.6j2b6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 02:58 PM 1/24/01 -0700, Jim Sermersheim wrote: >>>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/24/01 12:36:57 PM >>> > >>In my view, this I-D proposes a change to the LDAP protocol >>using one of the provided extension mechanism. That is, the >>changes are only visible when the extension is being used >>by mutual agreement of both peer. If an extension mechanism >>was not used, I would argue the version would have to be >>incremented. > >This may be a good philosophy, but before it's practiced in I-D's headed for standards track, I think this larger issue should be itself standardized. Well, this I-D is certainly not the first I-D to require amendments to the ASN.1. There have been I-D published suggesting new CHOICEs and/or ENUMERATION values. I believe it a reasonable interpretation of RFC 2251 that such is allowed. I don't view anything in RFC 2251 as restricting the scope of what extensions might be engineered. Some extensions requires changes to the ASN.1. As long as these changes don't break interoperability with peers which do not implement the extension, there is no problem. One could argue that no changes to the ASN.1 is allowed as no extensibility markers were provided. If one were to take this stand, the following types of extensions would be disallowed: - additional PDUs (e.g.: partialExtendedResponse) - additional authentication methods (these exist) - additional search scopes (forthcoming) - additional filter choices (extensibleMatching is not necessarily extensible enough) But I note that 2251 failed to use extensibility markers even where it explicitly stated extensibility is allowed. I also note that disallowing additional result codes leads to overloading of existing result codes. This leads to significant interoperability problems as it becomes unclear as to which semantics were meant. > This kind of thing can be seen by people to extend past the three ammendments you outlined. I don't think you can stop folks from suggesting odd semantics. Luckily, we have a fairly active review community which keeps these from getting progressed on the standard track. I don't this I-D will have much impact on what others may or may not suggest otherwise. A revision to RFC 2251 might help (that's an LDAPbis issue). A informational guide on extension do's and don't might help (that's an LDAPext issue). From bounce-back@phl7.note.com Wed Jan 24 19:44:09 2001 Received: from phl7.note.com (phl7.note.com [207.8.131.194]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id TAA02608 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 19:44:09 -0500 (EST) Received: (qmail 24418 invoked by uid 712); 25 Jan 2001 00:44:04 -0000 Date: 25 Jan 2001 00:44:04 -0000 Message-ID: <20010125004404.24406.qmail@phl7.note.com> From: BOSA2001@AOL.COM To: X-Mailer: http://GetResponse.com v. 4.0 X-Originating-IP: not supplied X-Complaints-To: abuse@GetResponse.com X-Responder-ID: 101827 X-Remove-Address: ldapext-archive@odin.ietf.org Ref-id: 000 X-Response-ID: bosa.IMPORT.0.ldapext-archive@odin.ietf.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Subject: BETTER THAN VISA REBATES-MASTERGOLD GUARANTEED CARD APPROVAL No Credit or Bad Credit? It Doesn't Matter! 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 From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 20:02:33 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id UAA02810 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 20:02:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0P10Vb11827; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:00:32 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0P10Vk25542; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:00:31 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:00:31 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <6B33416BC4BBD411BCA6009027D0D18CDAFAE2@aspams01.ca.com> From: "Ramsay, Ron" To: hahnt@us.ibm.com, ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: RE: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 12:00:23 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Resent-Message-ID: <"FQ_bzD.A.zOG.uq3b6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com I think it is worth looking more closely at the result codes. cancelled is the result returned in the original request (success is the result returned in the abandon response but this doesn't appear). noSuchOperation, tooLate and cannotCancel are returned in the abandon response (there is no original request). Therefore, only 'cancelled' need ba added to RFC 2251. All the others could appear in a special CancelResponseValue ::= ENUMERATED { success(0), noSuchOperation(1), tooLate(2), cannotCancel(3) }. (I don't see any reason for the (redundant) SEQUENCE.) Ron. -----Original Message----- From: Timothy Hahn [mailto:hahnt@us.ibm.com] Sent: Thursday, 25 January 2001 4:32 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Greetings, In section 4.1, the existing return codes for the protocol are being added to with four additional values. The values seem appropriate only for the Cancel extended operation. I suggest that the existing return codes are not changed. Rather, I suggest that the Cancel Response contain: CancelResponseValue ::= SEQUENCE { cancelResultCode ENUMERATED { canceled (0), noSuchOperation (1), tooLate (2), cannotCancel (3) } } This way, the existing protocol data elements are not infringed upon by the added extended operation. My other commnets are editorial and will be sent directly to Kurt. Regards, Tim Hahn Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 fax: 607.752.3681 From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 20:17:33 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id UAA03055 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 20:17:32 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0P1Fob15205; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:15:50 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0P1FpM03785; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:15:51 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:15:51 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <6B33416BC4BBD411BCA6009027D0D18CDAFBED@aspams01.ca.com> From: "Ramsay, Ron" To: "Salter, Thomas A" , Jim Sermersheim , ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Cc: d.w.chadwick@iti.salford.ac.uk Subject: RE: Alias pointing to ancestor Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 12:15:35 +1100 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Resent-Message-ID: <"-v93qC.A.26.G53b6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Thomas, The centre of your argument here is how search results are collated in the presence of aliases. In this context it probably doesn't matter if they point up or point down. I think Jim was referring to the navigation issues of a chain of aliases actually pointing to a member of the chain. This was addressed in X.500 with the error aliasProblem. Ron. -----Original Message----- From: Salter, Thomas A [mailto:Thomas.Salter@unisys.com] Sent: Thursday, 25 January 2001 7:07 To: Jim Sermersheim; ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Cc: d.w.chadwick@iti.salford.ac.uk Subject: RE: Alias pointing to ancestor (I glad to see you copied David Chadwick.) In his book, Understanding X.500, he states that the '93 standards allow for circular references and require the DSA to avoid looping by keeping track of which parts of the tree have already been searched. (Section 5.10, p.149) I can't find an explicit reference in the X.500 standards. The closest thing I found is the flowchart in Figure B.10 in Annex B of X.511. Next to a decision box labeled "alias object name to be considered?" is the note "e.g., not already included; does not lead to search loop". It thus appears the intent was to allow circular references. A related question that came up in interoperability testing some time ago had to do with order of the evaluation of search filters and dereferencing of aliases. The flowchart B.9 in X.511 clearly indicates that aliases are dereferenced before the search filters are applied. > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Sermersheim [mailto:JIMSE@novell.com] > Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2001 2:17 PM > To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com > Cc: d.w.chadwick@iti.salford.ac.uk > Subject: Alias pointing to ancestor > > > A question has risen in the context of some interoperability > tests regarding whether it is allowed to have an alias entry > that points to an ancestor entry. > > I can't find any reference to this in X.501. I see in > section 9.5 that an alias can point to a non-leaf, as well > as to another alias, but it doesn't mention pointing to accentors. > > I assume it's disallowed, otherwise there should be an > instruction regarding how circular dereferencing is to be > handled. I couldn't find anything like that in X.511. > > Is any of this talked about and I'm just missing it? > > Jim > From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 20:37:47 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id UAA03263 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 20:37:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0P1YjG05365; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:34:46 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0P1Ykk12283; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:34:46 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:34:46 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010124171609.00aca300@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:31:15 -0800 To: "Ramsay, Ron" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: RE: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Cc: hahnt@us.ibm.com, ietf-ldapext@netscape.com In-Reply-To: <6B33416BC4BBD411BCA6009027D0D18CDAFAE2@aspams01.ca.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"k5kZsD.A.d_C.0K4b6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 12:00 PM 1/25/01 +1100, Ramsay, Ron wrote: >I think it is worth looking more closely at the result codes. > >cancelled is the result returned in the original request (success is the >result returned in the abandon response but this doesn't appear). > >noSuchOperation, tooLate and cannotCancel are returned in the abandon >response (there is no original request). > >Therefore, only 'cancelled' need ba added to RFC 2251. All the others could >appear in a special > > CancelResponseValue ::= ENUMERATED { success(0), noSuchOperation(1), >tooLate(2), cannotCancel(3) }. Yeah, but, the extendedResponse would need to return a resultCode. One could say it always returned success and the client should look at the response value for details. That is, the operation could return: success with response value success, success with response value noSuchOperation, success with tooLate, success with cannotCancel, protocolError, and other non-success resultCodes (especially in the face of extension by control) Overloading success is bad. Overloading other resultCodes is equally bad. IMO, adding new resultCodes is the most sound approach. PS: SEQUENCE provides extensibility From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 24 20:53:05 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id UAA03419 for ; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 20:53:04 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0P1ouG12899; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:50:56 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0P1ouc18505; Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:50:56 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 17:50:56 -0800 (PST) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: RE: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 From: "Timothy Hahn" Message-ID: Date: Wed, 24 Jan 2001 20:50:49 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D01MLC96/01/M/IBM(Release 5.0.6 |January 4, 2001) at 01/24/2001 08:50:52 PM, Serialize complete at 01/24/2001 08:50:52 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 0007D9B6852569DF_=" Resent-Message-ID: <"iiPubC.A.0gE.-Z4b6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 0007D9B6852569DF_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Ron, Sounds ok to me. Regards, Tim Hahn Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 fax: 607.752.3681 To: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS, ietf-ldapext@netscape.com cc: Subject: RE: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt I think it is worth looking more closely at the result codes. cancelled is the result returned in the original request (success is the result returned in the abandon response but this doesn't appear). noSuchOperation, tooLate and cannotCancel are returned in the abandon response (there is no original request). Therefore, only 'cancelled' need ba added to RFC 2251. All the others could appear in a special CancelResponseValue ::= ENUMERATED { success(0), noSuchOperation(1), tooLate(2), cannotCancel(3) }. (I don't see any reason for the (redundant) SEQUENCE.) Ron. -----Original Message----- From: Timothy Hahn [mailto:hahnt@us.ibm.com] Sent: Thursday, 25 January 2001 4:32 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Greetings, In section 4.1, the existing return codes for the protocol are being added to with four additional values. The values seem appropriate only for the Cancel extended operation. I suggest that the existing return codes are not changed. Rather, I suggest that the Cancel Response contain: CancelResponseValue ::= SEQUENCE { cancelResultCode ENUMERATED { canceled (0), noSuchOperation (1), tooLate (2), cannotCancel (3) } } This way, the existing protocol data elements are not infringed upon by the added extended operation. My other commnets are editorial and will be sent directly to Kurt. Regards, Tim Hahn Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 fax: 607.752.3681 --=_alternative 0007D9B6852569DF_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Ron,

Sounds ok to me.
Regards,
Tim Hahn

Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com
Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT)
phone: 607.752.6388     tie-line: 8/852.6388
fax: 607.752.3681

To:        Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS, ietf-ldapext@netscape.com
cc:        
Subject:        RE: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt



I think it is worth looking more closely at the result codes.
cancelled is the result returned in the original request (success is the
result returned in the abandon response but this doesn't appear).
noSuchOperation, tooLate and cannotCancel are returned in the abandon
response (there is no original request).
Therefore, only 'cancelled' need ba added to RFC 2251. All the others could
appear in a special
    CancelResponseValue ::= ENUMERATED { success(0), noSuchOperation(1),
tooLate(2), cannotCancel(3) }.
(I don't see any reason for the (redundant) SEQUENCE.)
Ron.
-----Original Message-----
From: Timothy Hahn [mailto:hahnt@us.ibm.com]
Sent: Thursday, 25 January 2001 4:32
To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com
Subject: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt


Greetings,
In section 4.1, the existing return codes for the protocol are being added
to with four additional values.  The values seem appropriate only for the
Cancel extended operation.
I suggest that the existing return codes are not changed.  Rather, I suggest
that the Cancel Response contain:
CancelResponseValue ::= SEQUENCE {
       cancelResultCode ENUMERATED {
               canceled (0),
               noSuchOperation (1),
               tooLate (2),
               cannotCancel (3)
       }
}
This way, the existing protocol data elements are not infringed upon by the
added extended operation.
My other commnets are editorial and will be sent directly to Kurt.
Regards,
Tim Hahn
Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com
Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT)
phone: 607.752.6388     tie-line: 8/852.6388
fax: 607.752.3681


--=_alternative 0007D9B6852569DF_=-- From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 07:05:46 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA23823 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 07:05:45 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PC3Wb16676; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 04:03:32 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PC3Yc22593; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 04:03:34 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 04:03:34 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101251154.f0PBsNL67746@smtp24.singnet.com.sg> X-Sender: eru1@apexmail.com From: Webmaster To: "eweb8" Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 19:50:21 +0800 Subject: HURRY! JOIN FREE!! The Payline has begun FREE AIRMILES and TONS OF CASH!! 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From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 11:23:44 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA03044 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:23:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PGLab14309; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:21:36 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PGLaE06561; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:21:36 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:21:36 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: From: "Salter, Thomas A" To: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" , "Ramsay, Ron" Cc: hahnt@us.ibm.com, ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: RE: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 10:20:28 -0600 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.2650.21) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Resent-Message-ID: <"QYZ_dB.A.HmB.OKFc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Perhaps you need one new result code of "error, see extended response". This is generic enough for use by all extended operations but doesn't overload the existed status codes. > -----Original Message----- > From: Kurt D. Zeilenga [mailto:Kurt@OpenLDAP.org] > Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2001 8:31 PM > To: Ramsay, Ron > Cc: hahnt@us.ibm.com; ietf-ldapext@netscape.com > Subject: RE: Comments on draft-seilenga-lldap-cancel-00.txt > > > At 12:00 PM 1/25/01 +1100, Ramsay, Ron wrote: > >I think it is worth looking more closely at the result codes. > > > >cancelled is the result returned in the original request > (success is the > >result returned in the abandon response but this doesn't appear). > > > >noSuchOperation, tooLate and cannotCancel are returned in > the abandon > >response (there is no original request). > > > >Therefore, only 'cancelled' need ba added to RFC 2251. All > the others could > >appear in a special > > > > CancelResponseValue ::= ENUMERATED { success(0), > noSuchOperation(1), > >tooLate(2), cannotCancel(3) }. > > Yeah, but, the extendedResponse would need to return a resultCode. > One could say it always returned success and the client should > look at the response value for details. That is, the operation > could return: > success with response value success, > success with response value noSuchOperation, > success with tooLate, > success with cannotCancel, > protocolError, and > other non-success resultCodes (especially in > the face of extension by control) > > Overloading success is bad. Overloading other resultCodes > is equally bad. > > IMO, adding new resultCodes is the most sound approach. > > PS: SEQUENCE provides extensibility > From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 11:56:31 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA03914 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:56:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PGsRb20529; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:54:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PGsRA24209; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:54:27 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 08:54:27 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 09:48:37 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: Cc: Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_82D9C5F8.D3B2E054" Resent-Message-ID: <"9xQMoB.A._5F.CpFc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_82D9C5F8.D3B2E054 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Actually, I was only taking the information given in the constructor and copying it to the introduction of the class. public LDAPReferralException(String message, LDAPException rootException) Constructs a default exception with a specified string as additional information and an exception that indicates a failure to follow a referral. This exception applies only to synchronous operations and is thrown only on receipt of a referral when the referral was not followed. As I was looking at this, I wondered if LDAPException is too restrictive. For example what is reported for a malformed URL? We cannot report MalformedURLException as it is of type Exception. Should the rootException be simply of type Exception? Should the ReferralException class use matchedDN to indicate which referral caused the problem, or is that overloading that field too = much. -Steve Rob Weltman wrote: > Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > LDAPReferralException 4.27 public class LDAPReferralException > > extends LDAPException > > > > This exception, derived from LDAPException, is thrown when a server > > returns a referral and automatic referral following has not been > > enabled.Add to the above or automatic referral following could = not follow any referrals. -Steve > > That sounds hard to handle for a client. Are you thinking of the case = where the referral points to a server which is inaccessible or which = doesn't accept the credentials of the requestor? How would the client know = which of those problems was being flagged if there is only a referral = exception? And consequently, how would the client know what to do about = it? > > Rob --=_82D9C5F8.D3B2E054 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Actually, I was only taking the information given in the constructorand=20 copying it to the introduction of the class.
 
  public LDAPReferralException(String=20 message,
          &nb= sp;            =         =20 LDAPException rootException)
 
   Constructs a default exception with a specified string = as=20 additional
   information and an exception that indicates a = failure=20 to follow a
   referral.  This exception applies only = to=20 synchronous operations and
   is thrown only on receipt of = a=20 referral when the referral was not
   followed.
 
As I was looking at this, I wondered if LDAPException is
too=20 restrictive.  For example what is reported for a malformed URL?
We= =20 cannot report MalformedURLException as it is of type Exception.
Should = the=20 rootException be simply of type Exception?
 
Should the ReferralException class use matchedDN to indicate
which= =20 referral caused the problem, or is that overloading that field too = much.
 
-Steve
 

Rob Weltman wrote:
 
> Steve Sonntag wrote:
>
> >  =20 LDAPReferralException 4.27 public class LDAPReferralException
>=20 >            = ;      =20 extends LDAPException
> >
> >    This=20 exception, derived from LDAPException, is thrown when a server
>=20 >    returns a referral and automatic referral following = has=20 not been
> >    enabled.Add to the=20 above     or automatic referral following could not = follow=20 any referrals. -Steve
>
>   That sounds hard to = handle for=20 a client. Are you thinking of the case where the referral points to a = server=20 which is inaccessible or which doesn't accept the credentials of the = requestor?=20 How would the client know which of those problems was being flagged if = there is=20 only a referral exception? And consequently, how would the client know = what to=20 do about it?
>
> Rob
 

 
--=_82D9C5F8.D3B2E054-- From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 14:11:35 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA06201 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:11:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PJ9GG11923; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:09:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PJ9G615783; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:09:16 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:09:16 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:49:18 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: , Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_742F3323.C5A4F675" Resent-Message-ID: <"c6XaF.A.V2D.bnHc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_742F3323.C5A4F675 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable That is only partially true. The connect call can get various IOExceptions= or UnknownHostException which gets generalized to a less specific - more = general error CONNECT_ERROR. Presumably, malformed URL could also be returned as CONNECT_ERROR, but I like more information rather that less, so I agree with your comment. This would also change the LDAPUrl class which has methods that return MalformedURLException. I think the method name should be more descriptive of its function: public String getFailedReferral() Is is correct to presume that the status for the operation that generated the referrals would the status of a referral that failed. In the case of search, should all other data be returned to the application before = throwing the Exception, or should the exception be thrown immediately? The desired behavior should be mentioned in the ID. -Steve >>> Rob Weltman 25-Jan-01 10:18:13 AM >>> It could be Exception rather than LDAPException, although it might be = better to add a result code for MalformedURL to LDAPException. LDAPExceptio= n encapsulates more semantic information about the types of referral = failures than other low-level exception classes. I wouldn't overload matchedDN for relaying the failed URL. It's meaning = is, if anything, the opposite: the part of the DN of the URL that did = match. Better to provide a new method to retrieve the invalid URL from = LDAPReferralException: public String getReferral() If there were multiple references processed, and all of them failed, = this would report one of them. Rob Steve Sonntag wrote: > Actually, I was only taking the information given in the constructor > and copying it to the introduction of the class. public LDAPReferralExc= eption(String message, > LDAPException rootException) = Constructs a default exception with a specified string as additional > information and an exception that indicates a failure to follow a > referral. This exception applies only to synchronous operations and > is thrown only on receipt of a referral when the referral was not > followed. As I was looking at this, I wondered if LDAPException is > too restrictive. For example what is reported for a malformed URL? > We cannot report MalformedURLException as it is of type Exception. > Should the rootException be simply of type Exception? Should the = ReferralException class use matchedDN to indicate > which referral caused the problem, or is that overloading that field too = much. -Steve > Rob Weltman wrote: > Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > > > LDAPReferralException 4.27 public class LDAPReferralException > > > extends LDAPException > > > > > > This exception, derived from LDAPException, is thrown when a = server > > > returns a referral and automatic referral following has not been > > > enabled.Add to the above or automatic referral following = could not follow any referrals. -Steve > > > > That sounds hard to handle for a client. Are you thinking of the = case where the referral points to a server which is inaccessible or which = doesn't accept the credentials of the requestor? How would the client know = which of those problems was being flagged if there is only a referral = exception? And consequently, how would the client know what to do about = it? > > > > Rob --=_742F3323.C5A4F675 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
That is only partially true.  The connect call can get various=20= IOExceptions or
UnknownHostException which gets generalized to a less specific - = more=20 general
error CONNECT_ERROR.  Presumably, malformed URL could also be=20 returned
as CONNECT_ERROR, but I like more information rather that less, so = I=20 agree
with your comment.  This would also change the LDAPUrl class = which=20 has
methods that return MalformedURLException.
 
I think the method name should be more descriptive of its function:
 
public String getFailedReferral()
 
Is is correct to presume that the status for the operation that=20 generated
the referrals would the status of a referral that failed.  In = the case=20 of
search, should all other data be returned to the application = before=20 throwing
the Exception, or should the exception be thrown immediately?
The desired  behavior should be mentioned in the ID.
 
-Steve
 
 
>>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> 25-Jan-01 = 10:18:13 AM=20 >>>
  It could be Exception rather than LDAPException, = although=20 it might be better to add a result code for MalformedURL to LDAPException.= =20 LDAPException encapsulates more semantic information about the types of = referral=20 failures than other low-level exception classes.

  I = wouldn't=20 overload matchedDN for relaying the failed URL. It's meaning is, if = anything,=20 the opposite: the part of the DN of the URL that did match. Better to = provide a=20 new method to retrieve the invalid URL from LDAPReferralException:

p= ublic=20 String getReferral()

  If there were multiple references = processed,=20 and all of them failed, this would report one of=20 them.

Rob


Steve Sonntag wrote:

>  = Actually, I=20 was only taking the information given in the constructor
> and = copying it=20 to the introduction of the class.   public=20 LDAPReferralException(String=20 message,
>          = ;            &n= bsp;         =20 LDAPException rootException)    Constructs a default = exception=20 with a specified string as additional
>    information= and=20 an exception that indicates a failure to follow a
>   = =20 referral.  This exception applies only to synchronous operations=20 and
>    is thrown only on receipt of a referral when = the=20 referral was not
>    followed. As I was looking at = this, I=20 wondered if LDAPException is
> too restrictive.  For example = what is=20 reported for a malformed URL?
> We cannot report MalformedURLExceptio= n as=20 it is of type Exception.
> Should the rootException be simply of = type=20 Exception? Should the ReferralException class use matchedDN to indicate
= >=20 which referral caused the problem, or is that overloading that field too = much.=20 -Steve
> Rob Weltman wrote: > Steve Sonntag wrote:
> = >
>=20 > >   LDAPReferralException 4.27 public class=20 LDAPReferralException
> >=20 >            = ;      =20 extends LDAPException
> > >
> > >   = This=20 exception, derived from LDAPException, is thrown when a server
> = >=20 >    returns a referral and automatic referral following = has=20 not been
> > >    enabled.Add to the=20 above     or automatic referral following could not = follow=20 any referrals. -Steve
> >
> >   That sounds = hard to=20 handle for a client. Are you thinking of the case where the referral = points to a=20 server which is inaccessible or which doesn't accept the credentials of = the=20 requestor? How would the client know which of those problems was being = flagged=20 if there is only a referral exception? And consequently, how would the = client=20 know what to do about it?
> >
> >=20 Rob




--=_742F3323.C5A4F675-- From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 14:27:07 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA06602 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:27:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PJP0b23993; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:25:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PJP0M26219; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:25:00 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 11:25:00 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: hahnt@us.ibm.com X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: comments on draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpassword-04.txt X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 From: "Timothy Hahn" Message-ID: Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:24:51 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D01MLC96/01/M/IBM(Release 5.0.6 |January 4, 2001) at 01/25/2001 02:24:56 PM, Serialize complete at 01/25/2001 02:24:56 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 006A7373852569DF_=" Resent-Message-ID: <"wnlsX.A.ZZG.L2Hc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 006A7373852569DF_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Greetings, Section 4.1, ABNF for authPasswordSyntax I think that the "[authInfo]" can safely be "authInfo" since the separators ($ signs) are not optional and the authInfo can be zero length based on the definition of schemeSpecificValue. Section 4.4 It would be nice to have a description for the attribute type. Also, in paragraph 3, explaining why no built-in matching rule is defined for the attribute type. With this said, what is the intent then of defining the "authPasswordMatch" matching rule? Requiring the use of extensible match in order to use the matching rule seems harder than is necessary. Why is it desireable to dis-allow modification of individual values (assuming that the underlying transport service guarantees confidentiality). Thanks, Tim Hahn Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 fax: 607.752.3681 --=_alternative 006A7373852569DF_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Greetings,

Section 4.1, ABNF for authPasswordSyntax

I think that the "[authInfo]" can safely be "authInfo" since the separators ($ signs) are not optional and the authInfo can be zero length based on the definition of schemeSpecificValue.

Section 4.4

It would be nice to have a description for the attribute type.

Also, in paragraph 3, explaining why no built-in matching rule is defined for the attribute type.  With this said, what is the intent then of defining the "authPasswordMatch" matching rule?  Requiring the use of extensible match in order to use the matching rule seems harder than is necessary.  Why is it desireable to dis-allow modification of individual values (assuming that the underlying transport service guarantees confidentiality).

Thanks,
Tim Hahn

Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com
Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT)
phone: 607.752.6388     tie-line: 8/852.6388
fax: 607.752.3681 --=_alternative 006A7373852569DF_=-- From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 16:38:08 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id QAA09364 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:38:07 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PLaLG06580; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:36:22 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PLaMk23650; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:36:22 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:36:22 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010125131311.00afae30@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:35:18 -0800 To: hahnt@us.ibm.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: comments on draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpassword-04.txt Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"GZY86C.A.QxF.VxJc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 02:24 PM 1/25/01 -0500, Timothy Hahn wrote: >Section 4.1, ABNF for authPasswordSyntax seems reasonable. >Section 4.4 >It would be nice to have a description for the attribute type. seems reasonable. >Also, in paragraph 3, explaining why no built-in matching rule is defined for the attribute type. I can add one which has an assertion syntax of authPasswordSyntax. >With this said, what is the intent then of defining the "authPasswordMatch" matching rule? To allow a client to assert that a password, not an authPasswordSyntax value, matches. >Requiring the use of extensible match in order to use the matching rule seems harder than is necessary. The authPasswordMatch as the EQUALITY matching rule would only allow one scheme per password. >Why is it desireable to dis-allow modification of individual values (assuming that the underlying transport service guarantees confidentiality). I'll remove this restriction and add an appropriate equality matching rule. From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 16:46:57 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id QAA09488 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:46:55 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PLigG08340; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:44:42 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PLigs27846; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:44:42 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:44:42 -0800 (PST) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Importance: Normal To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: comments on draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpassword-04.txt X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 From: "Timothy Hahn" Message-ID: Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:43:21 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D01MLC96/01/M/IBM(Release 5.0.6 |January 4, 2001) at 01/25/2001 04:43:24 PM, Serialize complete at 01/25/2001 04:43:24 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 00771C6A852569DF_=" Resent-Message-ID: <"k6gVIB.A.UxG.F5Jc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 00771C6A852569DF_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Kurt, Sounds good. Thanks, Tim Hahn Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 fax: 607.752.3681 To: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: comments on draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpassword-04.txt At 02:24 PM 1/25/01 -0500, Timothy Hahn wrote: >Section 4.1, ABNF for authPasswordSyntax seems reasonable. >Section 4.4 >It would be nice to have a description for the attribute type. seems reasonable. >Also, in paragraph 3, explaining why no built-in matching rule is defined for the attribute type. I can add one which has an assertion syntax of authPasswordSyntax. >With this said, what is the intent then of defining the "authPasswordMatch" matching rule? To allow a client to assert that a password, not an authPasswordSyntax value, matches. >Requiring the use of extensible match in order to use the matching rule seems harder than is necessary. The authPasswordMatch as the EQUALITY matching rule would only allow one scheme per password. >Why is it desireable to dis-allow modification of individual values (assuming that the underlying transport service guarantees confidentiality). I'll remove this restriction and add an appropriate equality matching rule. --=_alternative 00771C6A852569DF_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Kurt,

Sounds good.
Thanks,
Tim Hahn

Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com
Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT)
phone: 607.752.6388     tie-line: 8/852.6388
fax: 607.752.3681

To:        Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS
cc:        ietf-ldapext@netscape.com
Subject:        Re: comments on draft-zeilenga-ldap-authpassword-04.txt



At 02:24 PM 1/25/01 -0500, Timothy Hahn wrote:
>Section 4.1, ABNF for authPasswordSyntax
seems reasonable.

>Section 4.4
>It would be nice to have a description for the attribute type.
seems reasonable.
>Also, in paragraph 3, explaining why no built-in matching rule is defined for the attribute type.
I can add one which has an assertion syntax of authPasswordSyntax.
>With this said, what is the intent then of defining the "authPasswordMatch" matching rule?
To allow a client to assert that a password, not an authPasswordSyntax
value, matches.
>Requiring the use of extensible match in order to use the matching rule seems harder than is necessary.
The authPasswordMatch as the EQUALITY matching rule would only
allow one scheme per password.
>Why is it desireable to dis-allow modification of individual values (assuming that the underlying transport service guarantees confidentiality).
I'll remove this restriction and add an appropriate equality matching
rule.


--=_alternative 00771C6A852569DF_=-- From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 16:52:13 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id QAA09674 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:52:12 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PLo3b23739; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:50:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PLo3o00721; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:50:03 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 13:50:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:49:38 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: , Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_D78C906A.96F7A4CA" Resent-Message-ID: <"K8T80D.A.oK.I-Jc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_D78C906A.96F7A4CA Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable 4.6.22 getResponseControls .... The method always returns null for asynchronous requests. I believe what is meant here is that controls are never stored for asynchronous requests. I don't believe it means that if an application makes a synchronous request, then follows it up by an asynchronous request, that the asynchronous request destroys any control data stored from the synchronous request, i.e. stores null where the last control is saved for that thread. --=_D78C906A.96F7A4CA Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

 
4.6.22 getResponseControls
 
.... The method always returns null for asynchronous requests.
 
I believe what is meant here is that controls are never stored
for asynchronous requests.  I don't believe it means that
if an application makes a synchronous request, then
follows it up by an asynchronous request, that the
asynchronous request destroys any control data
stored from the synchronous request, i.e. stores null
where the last control is saved for that thread.
 
 
--=_D78C906A.96F7A4CA-- From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 17:02:38 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id RAA09819 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:02:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PM0Xb26334; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:00:33 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PM0XY05910; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:00:33 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:00:33 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:59:50 -0700 From: "Steve Sonntag" To: , Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_772C30F4.4425761C" Resent-Message-ID: <"Wx-QkB.A.EcB._HKc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_772C30F4.4425761C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable There are several methods that an application will never use: LDAPConnection.setInputStream LDAPConnection.getInputStream LDAPConnection.setOutputStream LDAPConnection.getOutputStream LDAPControl.newInstance It is my feeling that these should not be defined in the Java API draft, even though functions like these may be defined as public in some implementations. These implementions use these in the API itself,=20 but the application does not use them. These functions force an implementation style, but the draft should not force any style of implementation. The draft should define only the = application interfaces. These methods should be removed from the draft. -Steve ------------------------ Steve Sonntag Novell, Inc., the leading provider of Net services software --=_772C30F4.4425761C Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
 
 
There are several methods that an application will never use:
 
LDAPConnection.setInputStream
LDAPConnection.getInputStream
LDAPConnection.setOutputStream
LDAPConnection.getOutputStream
LDAPControl.newInstance
 
It is my feeling that these should not be defined in the Java API=20 draft,
even though functions like these may be defined as public = in
some implementations.  These implementions use these in the = API=20 itself,
but the application does not use them.
 
These functions force an implementation style, but the draft = should=20 not
force any style of implementation.  The draft should define only = the=20 application
interfaces.
 
These methods should be removed from the draft.
 
-Steve
 
------------------------
Steve Sonntag
Novell, Inc., the = leading=20 provider of Net services software
 
 
--=_772C30F4.4425761C-- From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 17:20:29 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id RAA10014 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 17:20:27 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PMIXb00691; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:18:33 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PMIWo16045; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:18:32 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:18:32 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A70A5CB.E434370C@worldspot.com> Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 14:16:44 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Sonntag CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"opqGGC.A.z3D.wYKc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That would kill interoperability. A SASL layer that worked with one implementation of the LDAP API would not work with another, and a control written for one implementation would not work with another implementation. Rob Steve Sonntag wrote: > There are several methods that an application will never use: LDAPConnection.setInputStreamLDAPConnection.getInputStreamLDAPConnection.setOutputStreamLDAPConnection.getOutputStreamLDAPControl.newInstance It is my feeling that these should not be defined in the Java API draft,even though functions like these may be defined as public insome implementations. These implementions use these in the API itself,but the application does not use them. These functions force an implementation style, but the draft should notforce any style of implementation. The draft should define only the applicationinterfaces. These methods should be removed from the draft. -Steve ------------------------ > Steve Sonntag > Novell, Inc., the leading provider of Net services software From list@netscape.com Thu Jan 25 18:02:42 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA10654 for ; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 18:02:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0PN0qG22483; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 15:00:52 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0PN0rg07449; Thu, 25 Jan 2001 15:00:53 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 15:00:53 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Thu, 25 Jan 2001 16:00:37 -0700 From: "Javed Khan" To: "Steve Sonntag" , Cc: Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_A3F8E431.A1C093D4" Resent-Message-ID: <"qiJfYB.A.H0B.kALc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_A3F8E431.A1C093D4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable There should not be any interoperability issues with controls if we remove the newInstance method. =20 The SDK has responsibility for creating the appropriate LDAPControl=20 object. How it creates it is up to the implementation. Of course,=20 depending upon controls that might have been registered the SDK might have to call a constructor of an application specified Class. But = again when and how this constructor get called is up to the implementation. Javed >>> Rob Weltman Thursday, January 25, 2001 3:16:44 PM = >>> That would kill interoperability. A SASL layer that worked with one = implementation of the LDAP API would not work with another, and a control = written for one implementation would not work with another implementation. Rob Steve Sonntag wrote: > There are several methods that an application will never use: = LDAPConnection.setInputStreamLDAPConnection.getInputStreamLDAPConnection.se= tOutputStreamLDAPConnection.getOutputStreamLDAPControl.newInstance It is = my feeling that these should not be defined in the Java API draft,even = though functions like these may be defined as public insome implementations= . These implementions use these in the API itself,but the application = does not use them. These functions force an implementation style, but the = draft should notforce any style of implementation. The draft should = define only the applicationinterfaces. These methods should be removed = from the draft. -Steve ------------------------ > Steve Sonntag > Novell, Inc., the leading provider of Net services software --=_A3F8E431.A1C093D4 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
There should not be any interoperability issues with = controls=20 if
we remove the newInstance method. 
 
The SDK has responsibility for = creating=20 the appropriate LDAPControl
object.  How it creates it is up to the=20 implementation.  Of course, 
depending upon controls that might have been = registered=20 the SDK
might have to call a constructor of an application = specified=20 Class.  But again
when and how this constructor get called is up to = the=20 implementation.
 
Javed
 
>>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> Thursday, January = 25,=20 2001 3:16:44 PM >>>
  That would kill interoperability. A = SASL=20 layer that worked with one implementation of the LDAP API would not work = with=20 another, and a control written for one implementation would not work = with=20 another implementation.

Rob

Steve Sonntag=20 wrote:

>    There are several methods that an=20 application will never use:=20 LDAPConnection.setInputStreamLDAPConnection.getInputStreamLDAPConnection.se= tOutputStreamLDAPConnection.getOutputStreamLDAPControl.newInstance=20 It is my feeling that these should not be defined in the Java API = draft,even=20 though functions like these may be defined as public insome=20 implementations.  These implementions use these in the API itself,but = the=20 application does not use them. These functions force an implementation = style,=20 but the draft should notforce any style of implementation.  The = draft=20 should define only the applicationinterfaces. These methods should be = removed=20 from the draft. -Steve ------------------------
> Steve Sonntag
&g= t;=20 Novell, Inc., the leading provider of Net services=20 software

--=_A3F8E431.A1C093D4-- From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 26 07:13:23 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA04790 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 07:13:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0QCBGG03991; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 04:11:16 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0QCBFE19586; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 04:11:15 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 04:11:15 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 04:11:12 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101261211.f0QCBCZ27898@xwing.netscape.com> From: cashgenerator2002@yahoo.com To: @netscape.com Subject: REMOTE CONTROL BUSINESS! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"jqVNND.A.wxE.ilWc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Amazing Automated Home Business NO selling! UNLIMITED income!! Click "Reply" for complete information From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 26 21:35:01 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA27958 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 21:35:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0R2WuG29914; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:32:56 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0R2Wvo16453; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:32:57 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:32:57 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101270232.SAA12019@fionn.es.net> To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: archives? minutes? Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 18:32:12 -0800 From: Michael Helm Resent-Message-ID: <"oJSk1B.A.wAE.YNjc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com I recently discovered I'd lost some mail from this list in the past few weeks. I was wondering if minutes from 49th IETF had appeared yet; also, noticed that the archives on innosoft have nothing past May 11 of 2000. (Is there another archive somewhere? I'd like to find ldapext mail from about San Diego IETF to 20 Jan 2001.) Thanks, ==mwh From list@netscape.com Fri Jan 26 22:27:15 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id WAA28145 for ; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 22:27:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0R3PcG04493; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:25:38 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0R3Pds29908; Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:25:39 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:25:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010126191820.00afc1e0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 19:24:10 -0800 To: Michael Helm From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: archives? minutes? Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com In-Reply-To: <200101270232.SAA12019@fionn.es.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"VWUdxC.A.CTH.y-jc6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 06:32 PM 1/26/01 -0800, Michael Helm wrote: >I recently discovered I'd lost some mail from this >list in the past few weeks. I was wondering if >minutes from 49th IETF had appeared yet; also, >noticed that the archives on innosoft have nothing >past May 11 of 2000. (Is there another >archive somewhere? I'd like to find ldapext mail from >about San Diego IETF to 20 Jan 2001.) 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Per Section 301, Paragraph (a)(2)(C) of S. 1618, further transmissions to you by the sender of this email may be stopped at no cost to you by sending a Reply to this email address with the word Remove in the subject line. ************************************************************************* ************************************************************************* ** From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 28 01:30:38 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id BAA25710 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 01:30:37 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0S6Stb16220; Sat, 27 Jan 2001 22:28:56 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0S6SvU27301; Sat, 27 Jan 2001 22:28:57 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 22:28:57 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A73BCEB.32B143A6@worldspot.com> Date: Sat, 27 Jan 2001 22:32:12 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en-US,sv,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Javed Khan , Steve Sonntag CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft References: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------1317FB6E82449AEB2C75450C" Resent-Message-ID: <"UJNljD.A.MqG.ow7c6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com --------------1317FB6E82449AEB2C75450C Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit OK, that's true. The SDK can instantiate response controls using the LDAPControl constructor signature, based on the control having been registered. So we can eliminate newInstance. newInstance was intended to take the BER-encoding of a control and instantiate a control, but we can assume that an SDK implementation has already parsed the BER into its components and will use the components to instantiate a control. But if we remove the other four methods (for getting and setting the input and output stream), how would one apply a SASL security layer? Rob Javed Khan wrote: > There should not be any interoperability issues with controls ifwe remove the newInstance method. The SDK has responsibility for creating the appropriate LDAPControlobject. How it creates it is up to the implementation. Of course,depending upon controls that might have been registered the SDKmight have to call a constructor of an application specified Class. But againwhen and how this constructor get called is up to the implementation. Javed >>> Rob Weltman Thursday, January 25, 2001 3:16:44 PM >>> > That would kill interoperability. A SASL layer that worked with one implementation of the LDAP API would not work with another, and a control written for one implementation would not work with another implementation. > > Rob > > Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > There are several methods that an application will never use: LDAPConnection.setInputStreamLDAPConnection.getInputStreamLDAPConnection.setOutputStreamLDAPConnection.getOutputStreamLDAPControl.newInstance It is my feeling that these should not be defined in the Java API draft,even though functions like these may be defined as public insome implementations. These implementions use these in the API itself,but the application does not use them. These functions force an implementation style, but the draft should notforce any style of implementation. The draft should define only the applicationinterfaces. These methods should be removed from the draft. -Steve ------------------------ > > Steve Sonntag > > Novell, Inc., the leading provider of Net services software > --------------1317FB6E82449AEB2C75450C Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   OK, that's true. The SDK can instantiate response controls using the LDAPControl constructor signature, based on the control having been registered. So we can eliminate newInstance. newInstance was intended to take the BER-encoding of a control and instantiate a control, but we can assume that an SDK implementation has already parsed the BER into its components and will use the components to instantiate a control.

  But if we remove the other four methods (for getting and setting the input and output stream), how would one apply a SASL security layer?

Rob
 

Javed Khan wrote:

 There should not be any interoperability issues with controls ifwe remove the newInstance method. The SDK has responsibility for creating the appropriate LDAPControlobject.  How it creates it is up to the implementation.  Of course,depending upon controls that might have been registered the SDKmight have to call a constructor of an application specified Class.  But againwhen and how this constructor get called is up to the implementation. Javed >>> Rob Weltman <robw@worldspot.com> Thursday, January 25, 2001 3:16:44 PM >>>
  That would kill interoperability. A SASL layer that worked with one implementation of the LDAP API would not work with another, and a control written for one implementation would not work with another implementation.

Rob

Steve Sonntag wrote:

>    There are several methods that an application will never use: LDAPConnection.setInputStreamLDAPConnection.getInputStreamLDAPConnection.setOutputStreamLDAPConnection.getOutputStreamLDAPControl.newInstance It is my feeling that these should not be defined in the Java API draft,even though functions like these may be defined as public insome implementations.  These implementions use these in the API itself,but the application does not use them. These functions force an implementation style, but the draft should notforce any style of implementation.  The draft should define only the applicationinterfaces. These methods should be removed from the draft. -Steve ------------------------
> Steve Sonntag
> Novell, Inc., the leading provider of Net services software
 


 
  --------------1317FB6E82449AEB2C75450C-- From list@netscape.com Sun Jan 28 07:27:49 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA07945 for ; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 07:27:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0SCOxG14657; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 04:24:59 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0SCOxw22787; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 04:24:59 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 04:24:59 -0800 (PST) Date: Sun, 28 Jan 01 15:38:27 EST From: superpomoter@email.com To: Friend@public.com Subject: Send Over 30 Million Spam Free Emails per Month!!!!!!! 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Visit Our Site At- http://www.geocities.com/superpromoter2001/ Webmaster From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 00:37:45 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id AAA14443 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 00:37:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0T5ZdG06968; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:35:39 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0T5Ze216761; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:35:40 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:35:40 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A750220.72AEA08A@worldspot.com> Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 21:39:44 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en-US,sv,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Steve Sonntag CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0T5Zdv16737 Resent-Message-ID: <"-tk6KC.A.nFE.sEQd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I'm changing the signature of LDAPReferralException to take Throwable as argument, and changing getFailureException() to getCause(), as per the new Java API for nested exceptions. As for specifying when a referral exception is thrown on search(), isn't the following text from the draft explicit enough? "If automatic referral following is disabled or a referral was not followed, next() will throw an LDAPReferralException when the referral is received." Rob Steve Sonntag wrote: > That is only partially true. The connect call can get various IOExceptions orUnknownHostException which gets generalized to a less specific - more generalerror CONNECT_ERROR. Presumably, malformed URL could also be returnedas CONNECT_ERROR, but I like more information rather that less, so I agreewith your comment. This would also change the LDAPUrl class which hasmethods that return MalformedURLException. I think the method name should be more descriptive of its function: public String getFailedReferral() Is is correct to presume that the status for the operation that generatedthe referrals would the status of a referral that failed. In the case ofsearch, should all other data be returned to the application before throwingthe Exception, or should the exception be thrown immediately?The desired behavior should be mentioned in the ID. -Steve >>> Rob Weltman 25-Jan-01 10:18:13 AM >>> > It could be Exception rather than LDAPException, although it might be better to add a result code for MalformedURL to LDAPException. LDAPException encapsulates more semantic information about the types of referral failures than other low-level exception classes. > > I wouldn't overload matchedDN for relaying the failed URL. It's meaning is, if anything, the opposite: the part of the DN of the URL that did match. Better to provide a new method to retrieve the invalid URL from LDAPReferralException: > > public String getReferral() > > If there were multiple references processed, and all of them failed, this would report one of them. > > Rob > > > Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > Actually, I was only taking the information given in the constructor > > and copying it to the introduction of the class. public LDAPReferralException(String message, > > LDAPException rootException) Constructs a default exception with a specified string as additional > > information and an exception that indicates a failure to follow a > > referral. This exception applies only to synchronous operations and > > is thrown only on receipt of a referral when the referral was not > > followed. As I was looking at this, I wondered if LDAPException is > > too restrictive. For example what is reported for a malformed URL? > > We cannot report MalformedURLException as it is of type Exception. > > Should the rootException be simply of type Exception? Should the ReferralException class use matchedDN to indicate > > which referral caused the problem, or is that overloading that field too much. -Steve > > Rob Weltman wrote: > Steve Sonntag wrote: > > > > > > > LDAPReferralException 4.27 public class LDAPReferralException > > > > extends LDAPException > > > > > > > > This exception, derived from LDAPException, is thrown when a server > > > > returns a referral and automatic referral following has not been > > > > enabled.Add to the above or automatic referral following could not follow any referrals. -Steve > > > > > > That sounds hard to handle for a client. Are you thinking of the case where the referral points to a server which is inaccessible or which doesn't accept the credentials of the requestor? How would the client know which of those problems was being flagged if there is only a referral exception? And consequently, how would the client know what to do about it? > > > > > > Rob > > > > From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 01:13:03 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id BAA15374 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 01:13:02 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0T6BHb28766; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:11:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0T6BJY24854; Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:11:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:11:19 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A750A58.D0D4F9B5@worldspot.com> Date: Sun, 28 Jan 2001 22:14:48 -0800 From: Rob Weltman X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en-US,sv,ja MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft References: <5.0.2.1.0.20010122154103.00a31430@router.boolean.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"bX6-kB.A.EEG.GmQd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit "Kurt D. Zeilenga" wrote: > > At 05:13 PM 1/21/01 -0800, Rob Weltman wrote: > > These are the issues that have been raised (that I am aware of) with the latest Java LDAP Internet Draft (http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ldapext-ldap-java-api-12.txt), along with my own proposals for disposition. > > I have a few other issues. Many of these have been > discussed previously. > > The API appears to support both LDAPv2 and LDAPv3 but appears > to assumes use of UTF-8 regardless of the protocol. LDAPv2 > directoryStrings are restricted to T.61. In addition, certain > LDAPv2 protocol strings (e.g. all LDAPStrings) are restricted > to IA5. If LDAPv2 is to be support, it should be fully > supported and a normative reference to LDAPv2 should be stated. > If LDAPv2 is not to be supported, all mention of LDAPv2 should > be stricken. I believe this API should not attempt to support > both LDAPv2 and LDAPv3. As LDAPv2 will be moved to historical > status upon publication of an LDAPv3 Draft Standard, I recommend > this API support only LDAPv3. It only supports LDAPv3. It explicitly supports only UTF-8, and it mentions LDAPv2 in pointing out that controls are not supported in LDAPv2. I'll remove that clarification. > API contains a reference to RFC 1823, an Informational RFC. > If this is non-normative, it should be noted. If normative, > there is a standard track maturity issue in that RFC 1823 is > informational. It appears to be normative to me. > > The abstract refers to the expired async API I-D unnecesarily. Yes, it is not necessary to reference either of those. > It appears that the API specification requires implementation > of LDAP Language Tags, an extension to the "core" protocol > specification. The core API should only require implementation > of the "core" protocol specification. APIs for non-core > extensions should be detailed in API extensions. They are very important to developers in environments where directory data is multi-lingual, and they have been heavily used to date. I think they should stay. > Java, IIRC, uses UCS-2. LDAP allows the full (31-bit) set of > ISO-10646-1 characters encoded in UTF-8. There should be some > comment as what is to be done with characters outside of UCS-2 > but with ISO-10646-1. Which characters are you thinking of? As far as I know none have yet been defined outside the lower 64k. If Unicode characters should be defined in the future beyond the 16-bit range, that will be a problem for all Java programs and for the Java language itself, not for LDAP in particular. Whatever solution is adopted for the Java language should also be adopted by any Java class libraries, including this one. > There should be a normative reference to Java language > specification(s) [core + required extensions (SASL/TLS)]. To what, more specifically? > The relationship with JNDI should also be discussed. Not relevant to this document. > Appears the default behavior is to chase referrals. As I've > noted previously on this list, this is not a wise default from > a security perspective. The default should be not to chase > referrals (period). Steve pointed out: At 10:04 AM 1/23/01 -0700, Steve Sonntag wrote: >The default behavior for following referrals is specified in >the LDAPConstraints object. The boolean doReferrals parameter >controls whether referrals are followed or not. The default >for this parameter is "FALSE", i.e. referrals are not >automatically followed [period]. See also 4.7.8. > LDAP_PARTIAL_RESULTS? There should be no mention of this. However, > I note that the API should be capable of treating unrecognized > result codes returned by servers (including those reserved by API > specifications) as unknown errors. I'll remove the reference to LDAP_PARTIAL_RESULTS, since an implementation of the API is no longer expected to work an LDAPv2 server. > Missing normative references: > Java API Spec ? > Java SASL API Spec What's the RFC number? > Java TLS API Spec What's the RFC number? > ldaps (LDAP over SSL) What's the RFC number? > RFC 2222, RFC 2829, RFC 2830 I'll add a reference to 2222 for SASL and to 2830 for TLS, but where would the reference to 2829 go? Rob > > Kurt From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 11:38:23 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id LAA05382 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 11:38:22 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0TGaGb25981; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 08:36:16 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0TGaGA03719; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 08:36:16 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 08:36:16 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010129071442.00a80420@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 08:34:50 -0800 To: Rob Weltman From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Open issues with the Java LDAP API draft Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com In-Reply-To: <3A750A58.D0D4F9B5@worldspot.com> References: <5.0.2.1.0.20010122154103.00a31430@router.boolean.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Ks57lC.A.T5._vZd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 10:14 PM 1/28/01 -0800, Rob Weltman wrote: >> It appears that the API specification requires implementation >> of LDAP Language Tags, an extension to the "core" protocol >> specification. The core API should only require implementation >> of the "core" protocol specification. APIs for non-core >> extensions should be detailed in API extensions. > > They are very important to developers in environments where directory data is multi-lingual, and they have been heavily used to date. I think they should stay. > > >> Java, IIRC, uses UCS-2. LDAP allows the full (31-bit) set of >> ISO-10646-1 characters encoded in UTF-8. There should be some >> comment as what is to be done with characters outside of UCS-2 >> but with ISO-10646-1. > > Which characters are you thinking of? RFC 2252, 6.2: Servers and clients MUST be prepared to receive encodings of arbitrary Unicode characters, including characters not presently assigned to any character set. >As far as I know none have yet been defined outside the lower 64k. >If Unicode characters should be defined in the future beyond the 16-bit range, that will be a problem for all Java programs and for the Java language itself, not for LDAP in particular. Yes. My point here is that the API is NOT prepared to receive encodings of arbitary Unicode characters. >Whatever solution is adopted for the Java language should also be adopted by any Java class libraries, including this one. Then state this in the I-D. >> There should be a normative reference to Java language >> specification(s) [core + required extensions (SASL/TLS)]. > > To what, more specifically? "The Java Language Specification", J. Gosling, et. al., Addison Wesley, Jun 2000. >> The relationship with JNDI should also be discussed. > > Not relevant to this document. I disagree. I believe IETF Standard Track documents should provide some background and intended use discussion when there are overlapping specifications. JNDI is a Java Standard Extension and this I-D overlaps greatly with it. >> Missing normative references: >> Java API Spec I should have said "Java Language Specification". See above. >> Java SASL API Spec > > What's the RFC number? RFC number not required. I suggest referring to the JCP approved specification. "Java SASL Specification", JCP JSR#28, as I believe this is what the I-D depends on. >> Java TLS API Spec > What's the RFC number? I suggest "Java Secure Socket Extension", ..., available at http://java.sun.com/ >> ldaps (LDAP over SSL) > > What's the RFC number? I don't have a suggestion here other than to remove support for ldaps (LDAP over SSL) [the isSecure() method] as this requires a normative reference to a specification with appropriate standard track maturity. >> RFC 2222, RFC 2829, RFC 2830 > > I'll add a reference to 2222 for SASL and to 2830 for TLS, but where would the reference to 2829 go? I would reference 2829 where you introduce LDAP SASL Bind and/or where you discuss authentication and authorization security considerations specific to the API. 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You would never receive this mail again. Check this out! It's Master card this time, it pays better than Visa. Visit http://www.hometown.aol.com/bosa2001 Or Send email to sign up at : bosa2001@aol.com Subject : MasterGold Card Application email body should be like this, Applicant's Name : Your Name Applicant's E-mail : Your email address Sponsor : Hoo Ing e-mail : hoo_ing@yahoo.com Start referring to your friends using this format until you get your ID. Each member that you refer and receive their card will make you USD20 each. Commission pays up to 12 level deep. It's free to apply. No annual fees. It's very new act quickly. regards, Hoo Ing From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 12:21:29 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA06213 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 12:21:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0THGsb03681; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:16:54 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0THGsg21218; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:16:54 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:16:54 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:16:32 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: Subject: Fix for VLV draft. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_E6BDA464.D1B09D63" Resent-Message-ID: <"BZnLtC.A.6KF.EWad6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_E6BDA464.D1B09D63 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going through = standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the following problem: >In section 3.2 we have details about what the virtualListViewResult >codes mean, but we still do not define what result code should be >returned in the actual SearchResult in the case where there is a value >other then success(0) in the virtualListViewResult. > >We should return something other then success(0)in the SearchResultDone >if there is a result code other then success(0) in the >virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should be defined (or >referenced) in the VLV draft. I propose that we fix this by inserting the following statement as = paragraph 4 of Section 3.2 If the LDAP SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other (80),=20 the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a non-zero=20 value in the virtualListViewResult field. If there are no objections, I'd like to add this and allow the draft to = progress. Jim --=_E6BDA464.D1B09D63 Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going through=20= standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the following problem:
 
>In section 3.2 we have details about what the=20 virtualListViewResult
>codes mean, but we still do not define what = result=20 code should be
>returned in the actual SearchResult in the case = where=20 there is a value
>other then success(0) in the=20 virtualListViewResult.
>
>We should return something other then success(0)in the=20 SearchResultDone
>if there is a result code other then success(0) = in=20 the
>virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should be = defined=20 (or
>referenced) in the VLV draft.
 
I propose that we fix this by inserting the following statement as=20 paragraph 4 of Section 3.2
If the LDAP SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other = (80),=20
the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a non-zero=20
value in the virtualListViewResult field.
If there are no objections, I'd like to add this and allow the draft = to=20 progress.
 
Jim
--=_E6BDA464.D1B09D63-- From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 12:49:37 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA06617 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 12:49:36 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0THkXG12949; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:46:34 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0THa6Y21829; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:36:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:36:06 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: From: "John Liang" To: "Jim Sermersheim" , Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 12:35:29 -0500 Message-ID: <000401c08a19$df585ee0$ba05400a@software.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0005_01C089EF.F68256E0" X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2377.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 In-Reply-To: Resent-Message-ID: <"-6j53.A.1UF.Foad6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C089EF.F68256E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I want to ask a few questions about this topic: 1> if the control is not critical, and there is an error in server side sorting control or virutal list view control, the server is supposed to send back all unsorted result. if the server returns all unsorted entries successfully, is LDAP searchResultDone message supposed to return LDAP_SUCCESS or other(80)? Must we include sssResponse and vlvResponse with corresponding error code? 2> if the control is critical, besides return LDAP_UNAVAILABLE_CRITICAL_EXTENSION, Must we return the corrseponding sssResponse and vlvResponse result code? Thanks, -- John Liang -----Original Message----- From: Jim Sermersheim [mailto:JIMSE@novell.com] Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 12:17 PM To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Fix for VLV draft. Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going through standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the following problem: >In section 3.2 we have details about what the virtualListViewResult >codes mean, but we still do not define what result code should be >returned in the actual SearchResult in the case where there is a value >other then success(0) in the virtualListViewResult. > >We should return something other then success(0)in the SearchResultDone >if there is a result code other then success(0) in the >virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should be defined (or >referenced) in the VLV draft. I propose that we fix this by inserting the following statement as paragraph 4 of Section 3.2 If the LDAP SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other (80), the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a non-zero value in the virtualListViewResult field. If there are no objections, I'd like to add this and allow the draft to progress. Jim ------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C089EF.F68256E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I want to ask a few = questions=20 about this topic:
 
1> if the = control is not=20 critical, and there is an error in server side sorting control=20
or virutal list = view control,=20 the server is supposed to send back all unsorted = result.
 
if the server = returns all=20 unsorted entries successfully,
is LDAP = searchResultDone=20 message supposed to return LDAP_SUCCESS or = other(80)?
Must we include = sssResponse and=20 vlvResponse with corresponding error code?
 
2> if the = control is=20 critical, besides return=20 LDAP_UNAVAILABLE_CRITICAL_EXTENSION,
Must we return the=20 corrseponding sssResponse and vlvResponse result = code?
 
Thanks,
--
John = Liang
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Sermersheim=20 [mailto:JIMSE@novell.com]
Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 = 12:17=20 PM
To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com
Subject: Fix for = VLV=20 draft.

Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going = through=20 standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the following = problem:
 
>In section 3.2 we have details about what the=20 virtualListViewResult
>codes mean, but we still do not define = what=20 result code should be
>returned in the actual SearchResult in = the case=20 where there is a value
>other then success(0) in the=20 virtualListViewResult.
>
>We should return something other then success(0)in the=20 SearchResultDone
>if there is a result code other then = success(0) in=20 the
>virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should = be=20 defined (or
>referenced) in the VLV draft.
 
I propose that we fix this by inserting the following statement = as=20 paragraph 4 of Section 3.2
If the LDAP SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other = (80),=20
the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a = non-zero=20
value in the virtualListViewResult field.
If there are no objections, I'd like to add this and allow the = draft to=20 progress.
 
Jim
------=_NextPart_000_0005_01C089EF.F68256E0-- From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 12:53:49 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id MAA06695 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 12:53:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0THphG14146; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:51:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0THpfo04422; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:51:41 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:51:41 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010129094003.00a927a0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 09:49:32 -0800 To: "Jim Sermersheim" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Fix for VLV draft. Cc: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"ec3FJB.A.oBB.j2ad6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com I think it's a bad idea to overload the semantics of the 'other' (or any other existing) result code. 'other' should only imply some implementation specific error. IIRC, Michael previously suggested introduction a new result code indicating that an error occurred during control processing. I believe we should pursue this approach. Kurt At 10:16 AM 1/29/01 -0700, Jim Sermersheim wrote: >Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going through standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the following problem: > >>In section 3.2 we have details about what the virtualListViewResult >>codes mean, but we still do not define what result code should be >>returned in the actual SearchResult in the case where there is a value >>other then success(0) in the virtualListViewResult. >> >>We should return something other then success(0)in the SearchResultDone >>if there is a result code other then success(0) in the >>virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should be defined (or >>referenced) in the VLV draft. > >I propose that we fix this by inserting the following statement as paragraph 4 of Section 3.2 >If the LDAP SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other (80), >the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a non-zero >value in the virtualListViewResult field. >If there are no objections, I'd like to add this and allow the draft to progress. > >Jim From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 13:06:11 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id NAA06926 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:06:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0TI46G16741; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:04:06 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0TI47I11895; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:04:07 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:04:07 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <3A75B08B.927732D1@netscape.com> Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:03:56 -0500 From: mcs@netscape.com (Mark C Smith) Organization: iPlanet E-Commerce Solutions X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.75 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jim Sermersheim CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Fix for VLV draft. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"T5BN_D.A.l5C.VCbd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I think you meant to say "section 5.2" not "section 3.2". I think your proposed change is okay. Another valid approach, and this is the one that is implemented in iPlanet's products, is to recommend that the client always examine the virtualListViewResult. A VLV client will need to parse the virtualListViewResponse upon success (to get the VLV offset information) or error (to find out if VLV control caused the error to be generated). So it would be sufficient IMHO to just say "a result code other than success SHOULD be returned in the SearchResultDone message if the virtualListViewResult is not success." -Mark Smith Netscape Jim Sermersheim wrote: > Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going through > standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the following > problem: >In section 3.2 we have details about what the > virtualListViewResult > >codes mean, but we still do not define what result code should be > >returned in the actual SearchResult in the case where there is a > value > >other then success(0) in the virtualListViewResult.>>We should return > something other then success(0)in the SearchResultDone > >if there is a result code other then success(0) in the > >virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should be defined > (or > >referenced) in the VLV draft. I propose that we fix this by inserting > the following statement as paragraph 4 of Section 3.2If the LDAP > SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other (80), > the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a non-zero > value in the virtualListViewResult field.If there are no objections, > I'd like to add this and allow the draft to progress. Jim From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 13:08:47 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id NAA06945 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:08:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0TI6bG17858; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:06:38 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0TI6cA13726; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:06:38 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:06:38 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010129094944.00a92360@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:05:42 -0800 To: From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Cc: "Jim Sermersheim" , In-Reply-To: <000401c08a19$df585ee0$ba05400a@software.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"CPzbxB.A.MWD.tEbd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com I think we have a general problem with this and other controls in behavior of critical vs. non-critical controls. Processing of a recognized and appropriate control should not depend on the control's criticality. If the control is recognized and supported but contains some error, I suggest the operation return an error. We had a good discussion regarding this general issue in regards to the DUPENT I-D which folks might want to review. At 12:35 PM 1/29/01 -0500, John Liang wrote: >I want to ask a few questions about this topic: > >1> if the control is not critical, and there is an error in server side sorting control >or virutal list view control, the server is supposed to send back all unsorted result. >if the server returns all unsorted entries successfully, >is LDAP searchResultDone message supposed to return LDAP_SUCCESS or other(80)? >Must we include sssResponse and vlvResponse with corresponding error code? > >2> if the control is critical, besides return LDAP_UNAVAILABLE_CRITICAL_EXTENSION, >Must we return the corrseponding sssResponse and vlvResponse result code? > >Thanks, >-- >John Liang >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Jim Sermersheim [mailto:JIMSE@novell.com] >>Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 12:17 PM >>To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com >>Subject: Fix for VLV draft. >> >>Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going through standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the following problem: >> >>>In section 3.2 we have details about what the virtualListViewResult >>>codes mean, but we still do not define what result code should be >>>returned in the actual SearchResult in the case where there is a value >>>other then success(0) in the virtualListViewResult. >>> >>>We should return something other then success(0)in the SearchResultDone >>>if there is a result code other then success(0) in the >>>virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should be defined (or >>>referenced) in the VLV draft. >> >>I propose that we fix this by inserting the following statement as paragraph 4 of Section 3.2 >>If the LDAP SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other (80), >>the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a non-zero >>value in the virtualListViewResult field. >>If there are no objections, I'd like to add this and allow the draft to progress. >> >>Jim From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 13:33:07 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id NAA07231 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:33:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0TIV1G23060; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:31:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0TIV1E29296; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:31:01 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 10:31:01 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: From: "John Liang" To: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Cc: "Jim Sermersheim" , Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:30:51 -0500 Message-ID: <000c01c08a21$9bc77d70$ba05400a@software.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2377.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.0.20010129094944.00a92360@router.boolean.net> Resent-Message-ID: <"VV5tn.A.5IH.jbbd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > -----Original Message----- > From: Kurt D. Zeilenga [mailto:Kurt@OpenLDAP.org] > Sent: Monday, January 29, 2001 1:06 PM > To: John.Liang@openwave.com > Cc: Jim Sermersheim; ietf-ldapext@netscape.com > Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. > > > I think we have a general problem with this and other controls > in behavior of critical vs. non-critical controls. > > Processing of a recognized and appropriate control should not > depend on the control's criticality. If the control is recognized > and supported but contains some error, I suggest the operation > return an error. So you mean the unsorted entries will be returned but there will be an error code in the LDAP searchResultDone message. Then in this case, do we need to send sssResponse and vlvResponse with the same error code? Sounds like a duplicate error code. > > We had a good discussion regarding this general issue in regards to > the DUPENT I-D which folks might want to review. > Where could i find more details about the discussion? Thanks, -- John Liang From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 14:18:01 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id OAA08007 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 14:18:00 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0TJFkG03793; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 11:15:46 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0TJFlk23932; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 11:15:47 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 11:15:47 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010129105501.00aa1920@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 11:14:46 -0800 To: From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Cc: "Jim Sermersheim" , In-Reply-To: <000c01c08a21$9bc77d70$ba05400a@software.com> References: <5.0.2.1.0.20010129094944.00a92360@router.boolean.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"oMud-.A.q1F.hFcd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 01:30 PM 1/29/01 -0500, John Liang wrote: >So you mean the unsorted entries will be returned but there will >be an error code in the LDAP searchResultDone message. I'm saying that a control TS which overloads the control criticality field is flawed and this flaw should be fixed. I have not yet made any suggestion on how it should be fixed. >> >> We had a good discussion regarding this general issue in regards to >> the DUPENT I-D which folks might want to review. >> >Where could i find more details about the discussion? In the archives: http://www.openldap.org/lists/ietf-ldapext/ Try searching for "dupent;criticality". From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 16:09:18 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id QAA10103 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:09:17 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0TL72G24775; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:07:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0TL72U22977; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:07:02 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:07:02 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 14:06:15 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: , Cc: Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0TL6pv22720 Resent-Message-ID: <"aywgcB.A.fkF.xtdd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >>>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/29/01 12:14:46 PM >>> >At 01:30 PM 1/29/01 -0500, John Liang wrote: >>So you mean the unsorted entries will be returned but there will >>be an error code in the LDAP searchResultDone message. > >I'm saying that a control TS which overloads the control >criticality field is flawed and this flaw should be fixed. >I have not yet made any suggestion on how it should be fixed. I agree. I don't believe the VLV draft overloads the criticality field. I don't think there is anything in the VLV spec that goes against the directions in 2251. That is, if the control is recognized and appropriate, it will be serviced (unless malformed. If it is not recognized or appropriate, it will either be ignored (false criticality), or the operation will fail (true criticality). If there is a problem while servicing the control (regardles of criticality), the operation will fail, and a VLVresponse will accompany the SearchResultDone message. If the problem that originated the failure was due to the processing of the VLV control, the virtualListViewResult is used to convey the problem. This is where the current contention lies with the draft. Jim From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 16:30:49 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id QAA10288 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 16:30:49 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0TLStb07419; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:28:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0TLSuE04141; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:28:56 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:28:56 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010129131344.00a7e820@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 13:27:58 -0800 To: "Jim Sermersheim" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Cc: , In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"wBTam.A.TAB.XCed6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 02:06 PM 1/29/01 -0700, Jim Sermersheim wrote: >>>>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/29/01 12:14:46 PM >>> >>At 01:30 PM 1/29/01 -0500, John Liang wrote: >>>So you mean the unsorted entries will be returned but there will >>>be an error code in the LDAP searchResultDone message. >> >>I'm saying that a control TS which overloads the control >>criticality field is flawed and this flaw should be fixed. >>I have not yet made any suggestion on how it should be fixed. > >I agree. I don't believe the VLV draft overloads the criticality field. I don't think there is anything in the VLV spec that goes against the directions in 2251. That is, if the control is recognized and appropriate, it will be serviced (unless malformed. If it is not recognized or appropriate, it will either be ignored (false criticality), or the operation will fail (true criticality). Just for clarity (I think we're agreeing): If the control is recognized and appropriate for the operation (e.g. it's a search control on a search operation), it will be processed. If the control is malformed, it should be processed as a protocol error. Though "appropriate"ness can be defined on a per control basis, one should be careful to distinguish "appropriate"ness and error conditions. "Appropriate"ness should be determined before any processing. >If there is a problem while servicing the control (regardles of criticality), the operation will fail, and a VLVresponse will accompany the SearchResultDone message. If the problem that originated the failure was due to the processing of the VLV control, the virtualListViewResult is used to convey the problem. This is where the current contention lies with the draft. Thanks for the clarification. From list@netscape.com Mon Jan 29 18:14:18 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA11804 for ; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 18:14:16 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0TNC3G17012; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 15:12:03 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0TNC4I25474; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 15:12:04 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 15:12:04 -0800 (PST) X-Sender: misterprivacy@hushmail.com From: Dave To: "customer" Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 14:25:17 -0500 Subject: I could go to JAIL for selling this CD! 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bnQuIiZuYnNwOyAtLSBVLlMuIENvbmdyZXNzLA0KPGJyPkguUi4gMTA2dGggQ09OR1JFU1Mg MmQgU2Vzc2lvbiBILiBSLiAzMTEzIFNlYy4gMiAoYSkzIEp1bHkNCjxicj4xOSwgMjAwMCBo dHRwOi8vd3d3LnNwYW1sYXdzLmNvbS9mZWRlcmFsL2hyMzExMy5odG1sDQo8YnI+KioqKioq KioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioqKioN Cjxicj4mbmJzcDsNCjxicj4mbmJzcDsNCjwvYm9keT4NCjwvaHRtbD4NCg== ------=_NextPart_000_001__10618077_51917.11-- From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 02:24:06 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id CAA01715 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 02:24:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0U7MHG09328; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 23:22:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0U7MJw03601; Mon, 29 Jan 2001 23:22:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 23:22:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Mon, 29 Jan 2001 23:22:10 -0800 (PST) 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Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0UIYRv14320 Resent-Message-ID: <"CxOAZC.A.cgD.1kwd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >>> "John Liang" 1/29/01 10:35:29 AM >>> >I want to ask a few questions about this topic: > >1> if the control is not critical, and there is an error in server side >sorting control >or virutal list view control, the server is supposed to send back all >unsorted result. No, during processing, if there is an error (due to the control being processed or otherwise), processing stops, and the searchResultDone is returned with (some) error code. >if the server returns all unsorted entries successfully, >is LDAP searchResultDone message supposed to return LDAP_SUCCESS or >other(80)? >Must we include sssResponse and vlvResponse with corresponding error code? If the server returns all unsorted entries successfully, it is because the server does not support the vlv and sss controls, and they are not marked critical. Thus they are ignored and the search is processed as if it never had the controls. There is no sss or vlv response code in this case because the server doesn't recognise them. >2> if the control is critical, besides return >LDAP_UNAVAILABLE_CRITICAL_EXTENSION, >Must we return the corrseponding sssResponse and vlvResponse result code? Yes. From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 13:48:35 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id NAA15299 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:48:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0UIjVG19485; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 10:45:32 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0UIjUc20453; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 10:45:30 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 10:45:30 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:45:16 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: Cc: Subject: Re: Fix for VLV draft. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0UIjSv20394 Resent-Message-ID: <"iMUXiC.A.6-E.Ivwd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit From my read of draft-armijo-ldap-control-error-00.txt, the proposal is to ammend RFC 2251 in a way that cannot be done. I may be misreading it. Maybe it intends to say that this result code MUST only be used when the operation is accompanied by a control that specifies its use. If this is the case, I think it should be re-worded, and progressed so that other I-Ds needing to consume it can be progressed. Otherwise, I don't mind introducing a new error code in the VLV draft itself that is only used in the presence of the VLV control. Jim >>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/29/01 10:49:32 AM >>> I think it's a bad idea to overload the semantics of the 'other' (or any other existing) result code. 'other' should only imply some implementation specific error. IIRC, Michael previously suggested introduction a new result code indicating that an error occurred during control processing. I believe we should pursue this approach. Kurt At 10:16 AM 1/29/01 -0700, Jim Sermersheim wrote: >Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going through standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the following problem: > >>In section 3.2 we have details about what the virtualListViewResult >>codes mean, but we still do not define what result code should be >>returned in the actual SearchResult in the case where there is a value >>other then success(0) in the virtualListViewResult. >> >>We should return something other then success(0)in the SearchResultDone >>if there is a result code other then success(0) in the >>virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should be defined (or >>referenced) in the VLV draft. > >I propose that we fix this by inserting the following statement as paragraph 4 of Section 3.2 >If the LDAP SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other (80), >the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a non-zero >value in the virtualListViewResult field. >If there are no objections, I'd like to add this and allow the draft to progress. > >Jim From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 15:01:26 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id PAA16711 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:01:26 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0UJxab10053; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:59:36 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0UJxZQ02005; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:59:35 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 11:59:35 -0800 (PST) Reply-To: From: "John Liang" To: "Jim Sermersheim" , Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:58:09 -0500 Message-ID: <001c01c08af6$f84e8fe0$ba05400a@software.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2377.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V5.00.2314.1300 In-Reply-To: Resent-Message-ID: <"4UG4z.A.Yd.h0xd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Sermersheim [mailto:jimse@novell.com] > Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 1:34 PM > To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com; John.Liang@openwave.com > Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. > > > >>> "John Liang" 1/29/01 10:35:29 AM >>> > >I want to ask a few questions about this topic: > > > >1> if the control is not critical, and there is an error in server side > >sorting control > >or virutal list view control, the server is supposed to send back all > >unsorted result. > > No, during processing, if there is an error (due to the control > being processed or otherwise), processing stops, and the > searchResultDone is returned with (some) error code. > > >if the server returns all unsorted entries successfully, > >is LDAP searchResultDone message supposed to return LDAP_SUCCESS or > >other(80)? > >Must we include sssResponse and vlvResponse with corresponding > error code? > > If the server returns all unsorted entries successfully, it is > because the server does not support the vlv and sss controls, and > they are not marked critical. Thus they are ignored and the > search is processed as if it never had the controls. There is no > sss or vlv response code in this case because the server doesn't > recognise them. Jim, It sounds different from RFC2891(LDAP Control Extension for Server Side Sorting of Search Results), chapter 2, item 4: 4 - If the server supports this sorting control but for some reason cannot sort the search results using the specified sort keys and the client specified FALSE for the control's criticality field, then the server should return all search results unsorted and include the sortKeyResponseControl in the searchResultDone message. It shows that if the server supportes this control, the unsorted result could be sent back under certain conditions. Any comments? Thanks, -- John Liang From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 16:49:54 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id QAA18058 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:49:53 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0ULlXb02908; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:47:33 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0ULlXg22556; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:47:33 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 13:47:33 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:47:20 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: , Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0ULlVv22523 Resent-Message-ID: <"4eQBeC.A.BgF.zZzd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >>> "John Liang" 1/30/01 12:58:09 PM >>> >> >>> "John Liang" 1/29/01 10:35:29 AM >>> >> >I want to ask a few questions about this topic: >> > >> >1> if the control is not critical, and there is an error in server side >> >sorting control >> >or virutal list view control, the server is supposed to send back all >> >unsorted result. >> >> No, during processing, if there is an error (due to the control >> being processed or otherwise), processing stops, and the >> searchResultDone is returned with (some) error code. >> >> >if the server returns all unsorted entries successfully, >> >is LDAP searchResultDone message supposed to return LDAP_SUCCESS or >> >other(80)? >> >Must we include sssResponse and vlvResponse with corresponding >> error code? >> >> If the server returns all unsorted entries successfully, it is >> because the server does not support the vlv and sss controls, and >> they are not marked critical. Thus they are ignored and the >> search is processed as if it never had the controls. There is no >> sss or vlv response code in this case because the server doesn't >> recognise them. > >Jim, > >It sounds different from RFC2891(LDAP Control Extension for Server >Side Sorting of Search Results), chapter 2, item 4: > >4 - If the server supports this sorting control but for some reason > cannot sort the search results using the specified sort keys and > the client specified FALSE for the control's criticality field, > then the server should return all search results unsorted and > include the sortKeyResponseControl in the searchResultDone > message. > >It shows that if the server supportes this control, the unsorted result >could be sent back under certain conditions. > >Any comments? Yes, I don't think we should have done that. I think we should have stated that an error is returned, and the client can re-try with a modified control. Jim From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 17:24:43 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id RAA18414 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:24:42 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0UMN2G29847; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:23:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0UMLus06805; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:21:56 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 14:21:56 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:20:30 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: Subject: Persistent Search questions Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0UMKkv06175 Resent-Message-ID: <"ooikXB.A.rkB.55zd6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit The persistent search control (draft-ietf-ldapext-psearch-03.txt) states in section 3 that the search operation is modified in such a way that the searcResultDone message is never sent. This implies that the size and time limits are ignored, but it's not explicitly stated. Can anyone confirm if this is the case? Also, there is a little blurb in the security considerations section about making sure access controls are checked for entries being returned. This is more of a question to other implementors, a server could: a) check access control information once at the beginning of the search, and use that information without refreshing it later (could speed response time, and "fix" authorization to a specific view, or it could b) recalculate access control information everytime an entry is to be returned (provides consistency over long persistent search sessions). My feeling is that b is better, does anyone expect a? Jim From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 18:19:30 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-47.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA19061 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:19:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0UNH8b21528; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:17:08 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0UNH9g04553; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:17:09 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:17:09 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010130150223.00a7d460@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:16:16 -0800 To: "Jim Sermersheim" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Cc: , In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"6jwg_.A.3GB.0t0d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 02:47 PM 1/30/01 -0700, Jim Sermersheim wrote: >>Any comments? > >Yes, I don't think we should have done that. I think we should have stated that an error is returned, and the client can re-try with a modified control. I concur and hope this will be resolved by a revision of the specification. I also note that it may be appropriate for LDAPbis WG to consider adding a statement to the TS to discourage further overloading of the criticality field. It should at least be covered in draft-greenblatt-ldapext-style-00.txt. And, BTW, "The criticality is FALSE (MAY be absent)" [VLV, 5.2] should actually be "The criticality SHALL be FALSE and, hence, absent." Per RFC2251, DEFAULT values are not present in the BER encoding of LDAP itself. Kurt From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 18:29:09 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA19167 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:29:09 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0UNRBG12477; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:27:11 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0UNRBE08411; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:27:11 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:27:11 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010130151824.00a86c10@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:26:08 -0800 To: "Jim Sermersheim" From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Persistent Search questions Cc: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"MNTSF.A.0CC.L30d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com At 03:20 PM 1/30/01 -0700, Jim Sermersheim wrote: >The persistent search control (draft-ietf-ldapext-psearch-03.txt) states in section 3 that the search operation is modified in such a way that the searcResultDone message is never sent. I would rather the spec state the operation never returns success, but may return non-success result codes. This would, amongst other things, allow the operation to be canceled (the cancel operation cannot cancel an operation which has no response). >This implies that the size and time limits are ignored, but it's not explicitly stated. Can anyone confirm if this is the case? I would rather size/time limits not be ignored in face of this control. >Also, there is a little blurb in the security considerations section about making sure access controls are checked for entries being returned. This is more of a question to other implementors, a server could: >a) check access control information once at the beginning of the search, and use that information without refreshing it later (could speed response time, and "fix" authorization to a specific view, or it could >b) recalculate access control information everytime an entry is to be returned (provides consistency over long persistent search sessions). > >My feeling is that b is better, does anyone expect a? I'd prefer not to mandate either a nor b as what is best is likely application/implementation specific. I would note that in our implementation, b) would likely be much easier to implement but I'd hate to wish b) on everyone. Likewise for a). From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 18:59:59 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA19417 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:59:58 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0UNvVG17663; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:57:31 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0UNvWE21834; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:57:32 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:57:32 -0800 (PST) X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.0.4633.0 content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 15:13:05 -0800 Message-ID: <96BABA22ECEAEA45B53D08D63E1B56785280F2@DF-SPIKE.platinum.corp.microsoft.com> Thread-Topic: Fix for VLV draft. Thread-Index: AcCK7c316kQQ+n6AQuWid8Lys4G1dwAIy3FQ From: "Michael Armijo" To: "Jim Sermersheim" , Cc: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 30 Jan 2001 23:13:07.0128 (UTC) FILETIME=[34680B80:01C08B12] Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0UNvVv21810 Resent-Message-ID: <"wMeigB.A.4UF.rT1d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Jim Sermersheim said - "Maybe it intends to say that this result code MUST only be used when the operation is accompanied by a control that specifies its use" I believe that may be the best way to go. I will review the current version and update the list with an updated draft. Michael > -----Original Message----- > From: Jim Sermersheim [mailto:jimse@novell.com] > Sent: Tuesday, January 30, 2001 10:45 AM > To: Kurt@OpenLDAP.org > Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com > Subject: Re: Fix for VLV draft. > > > From my read of draft-armijo-ldap-control-error-00.txt, the > proposal is to ammend RFC 2251 in a way that cannot be done. > I may be misreading it. > > Maybe it intends to say that this result code MUST only be > used when the operation is accompanied by a control that > specifies its use. If this is the case, I think it should be > re-worded, and progressed so that other I-Ds needing to > consume it can be progressed. > > Otherwise, I don't mind introducing a new error code in the > VLV draft itself that is only used in the presence of the VLV > control. > > Jim > > >>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/29/01 10:49:32 AM >>> > I think it's a bad idea to overload the semantics of the 'other' > (or any other existing) result code. 'other' should only imply > some implementation specific error. IIRC, Michael previously > suggested introduction a new result code indicating that an error > occurred during control processing. I believe we should pursue > this approach. > > Kurt > > At 10:16 AM 1/29/01 -0700, Jim Sermersheim wrote: > >Back in September, as the Virtual List View draft was going > through standardization process, Michael Armijo noted the > following problem: > > > >>In section 3.2 we have details about what the virtualListViewResult > >>codes mean, but we still do not define what result code should be > >>returned in the actual SearchResult in the case where there > is a value > >>other then success(0) in the virtualListViewResult. > >> > >>We should return something other then success(0)in the > SearchResultDone > >>if there is a result code other then success(0) in the > >>virtualListViewResult and what that result code is should > be defined (or > >>referenced) in the VLV draft. > > > >I propose that we fix this by inserting the following > statement as paragraph 4 of Section 3.2 > >If the LDAP SearchResultDone message has a resultCode of other (80), > >the virtualListViewResponse MAY be included and MAY hold a non-zero > >value in the virtualListViewResult field. > >If there are no objections, I'd like to add this and allow > the draft to progress. > > > >Jim > > From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 19:07:14 2001 Received: from netscape.com (h-205-217-237-46.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id TAA19459 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:07:14 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V05bG19277; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:05:37 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V05cQ25930; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:05:38 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 16:05:38 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 23 Jan 2001 23:30:42 -0500 (EST) From: rpznn@msn.com Message-Id: <200101240430.XAA02437@InterJet.liquidblue.com> To: bilno@Friendsonline.netscape.com Reply-To: ron09me2@n2mail.com Subject: PARTNERS WANTED!! [fdqbx] Resent-Message-ID: <"9fvBSC.A.4UG.Rb1d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Partners Wanted: Open a Secure Offshore Account With a minimum payment of $100.00 WITHOUT a social security number WITHOUT a credit check Work from the Privacy of your own Home Develop a secondary offshore income of $500 to $5,000 a day or more -- you decide! Unlimited global market, unlimited income, all confidential You can: Eliminate your debts. Secure your assets. Retain ALL your hard earned money Pass your wealth on to your heirs The Super Rich have done this for years..... Isn't it time YOU started? This offshore income plan clearly speaks for itself. Great incentive for new partners. For free Info, reply with "Send Offshore Info Please" in the subject. mailto:ron09me@n2mail.com?subject=Send_Offshore_Info_Please Please include your Name, E-mail address and phone number. 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From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 20:47:34 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id UAA20151 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:47:33 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V1iLb28583; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:44:23 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V1iMw08159; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:44:22 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:44:22 -0800 (PST) Importance: Normal To: Subject: Re: Persistent Search questions X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 5.0.3 (Intl) 21 March 2000 From: "Timothy Hahn" Message-ID: Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:44:02 -0500 X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on D01MLC96/01/M/IBM(Release 5.0.6a |January 22, 2001) at 01/30/2001 08:44:03 PM, Serialize complete at 01/30/2001 08:44:03 PM MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 000695ED852569E5_=" Resent-Message-ID: <"TAyMkB.A.N_B.132d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a multipart message in MIME format. --=_alternative 000695ED852569E5_= Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Jim, I would expect behavior as described in b) below. I cannot confirm that sizeLimit and timeLimit are ignored - but it seems reasonable. It also seems reasonable that there may be some other administrative configuration that implementations support to help reduce the thread of DOS attacks when employing this control. (I can envison 500,000 clients all setting up a persistent search to a single server ....) Regards, Tim Hahn Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT) phone: 607.752.6388 tie-line: 8/852.6388 fax: 607.752.3681 To: cc: Subject: Persistent Search questions The persistent search control (draft-ietf-ldapext-psearch-03.txt) states in section 3 that the search operation is modified in such a way that the searcResultDone message is never sent. This implies that the size and time limits are ignored, but it's not explicitly stated. Can anyone confirm if this is the case? Also, there is a little blurb in the security considerations section about making sure access controls are checked for entries being returned. This is more of a question to other implementors, a server could: a) check access control information once at the beginning of the search, and use that information without refreshing it later (could speed response time, and "fix" authorization to a specific view, or it could b) recalculate access control information everytime an entry is to be returned (provides consistency over long persistent search sessions). My feeling is that b is better, does anyone expect a? Jim --=_alternative 000695ED852569E5_= Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii"
Jim,

I would expect behavior as described in b) below.

I cannot confirm that sizeLimit and timeLimit are ignored - but it seems reasonable.  It also seems reasonable that there may be some other administrative configuration that implementations support to help reduce the thread of DOS attacks when employing this control.  (I can envison 500,000 clients all setting up a persistent search to a single server ....)
Regards,
Tim Hahn

Internet: hahnt@us.ibm.com
Internal: Timothy Hahn/Endicott/IBM@IBMUS or IBMUSM00(HAHNT)
phone: 607.752.6388     tie-line: 8/852.6388
fax: 607.752.3681

To:        <ietf-ldapext@netscape.com>
cc:        
Subject:        Persistent Search questions



The persistent search control (draft-ietf-ldapext-psearch-03.txt) states in section 3 that the search operation is modified in such a way that the searcResultDone message is never sent. This implies that the size and time limits are ignored, but it's not explicitly stated. Can anyone confirm if this is the case?
Also, there is a little blurb in the security considerations section about making sure access controls are checked for entries being returned. This is more of a question to other implementors, a server could:
a) check access control information once at the beginning of the search, and use that information without refreshing it later (could speed response time, and "fix" authorization to a specific view, or it could
b) recalculate access control information everytime an entry is to be returned (provides consistency over long persistent search sessions).
My feeling is that b is better, does anyone expect a?
Jim


--=_alternative 000695ED852569E5_=-- From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 21:00:20 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA20243 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:00:20 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V1wCb05263; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:58:12 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V1wDU13093; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:58:13 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:58:13 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010130175132.00a48410@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:57:18 -0800 To: From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: Re: Persistent Search questions In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Z3STSC.A.TMD.1E3d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com In regards to DoS attacks, seems you could really drive a server crazy by asking it to sort a persistent search. Kurt From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 21:08:26 2001 Received: from netscape.com (c3po.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA20309 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:08:25 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V26IG16083; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:06:18 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V26JY16242; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:06:19 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:06:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:06:06 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101310206.f0V266Z03038@xwing.netscape.com> From: rlssz@hotmail.com To: slbbc@MainOnlinefriend.netscape.com Reply-To: t2m34@bigfoot.com Subject: I'll Do All Of The Work! 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Dr. Jim "A Wise Person Investigates What a Fool Person Takes For Granted" PS: To be removed from the list, just put "Remove" in subject line and send. From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 21:09:10 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id VAA20323 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:09:10 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V272b07327; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:07:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V273U17000; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:07:03 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:07:03 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010130180034.00a81810@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 18:06:36 -0800 To: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: psearch, search references, aliases Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"Xv_8KD.A.PJE.GN3d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com What is the behavior of the psearch operation when, in the absence of ManageDsaIt, there are subordinate references (in scope) are added, deleted, or modified? What is the behavior of the psearch operation when there are aliases within scope and dereferencing during searching is enabled? Kurt From list@netscape.com Tue Jan 30 22:52:40 2001 Received: from netscape.com (c3po.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id WAA22968 for ; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 22:52:40 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V3orG27929; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:50:54 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V3otg19646; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:50:55 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 19:50:55 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 20:50:33 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: , Subject: Re: Persistent Search questions Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f0V3orv19622 Resent-Message-ID: <"p8MmB.A.syE.du4d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit cute, Kurt. seriously though, the psearch draft should probably have an "interaction with other controls" just to make sure ppl think about this kind of thing. >>> "Kurt D. Zeilenga" 1/30/01 6:57:18 PM >>> In regards to DoS attacks, seems you could really drive a server crazy by asking it to sort a persistent search. Kurt From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 00:08:06 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id AAA23758 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 00:08:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V55Xb27427; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:05:33 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V55ZQ07412; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:05:35 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:05:35 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <01C08B00.70137C80.andyhe@msn.com> From: andy herron To: "'Jim Sermersheim'" , "ietf-ldapext@netscape.com" , "John.Liang@openwave.com" Cc: "'aherron@u.washington.edu'" Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:05:55 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"v9t_8.A.izB.e05d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >>It sounds different from RFC2891(LDAP Control Extension for Server >>Side Sorting of Search Results), chapter 2, item 4: >> >>4 - If the server supports this sorting control but for some reason >> cannot sort the search results using the specified sort keys and >> the client specified FALSE for the control's criticality field, >> then the server should return all search results unsorted and >> include the sortKeyResponseControl in the searchResultDone >> message. >> >>It shows that if the server supportes this control, the unsorted result >>could be sent back under certain conditions. >> >>Any comments? > >Yes, I don't think we should have done that. I think we should have stated that an error >is returned, and the client can re-try with a modified control. > Jim & John, The original thinking in the sorting draft was that the client could ask for it to be sorted but not require it. The criticality field seemed at the time perfectly suited for this use. It could be that the client is capable of doing the sort but also "is hopeful" that the server already has the data indexed by the sort key so can simply run down the index when calculating/formatting the result set. There are some implementations where sorting is performed/allowed only on fields where there exists an index (meaning that the server is unwilling/unable to sort the result set itself). In these implementations, failing the entire search when the client was willing to have the result set unsorted seemed very reasonable. What do you gain by having the client resend the search query with a modified sort control? If the client wants this behavior, then the client should specify criticality as true. That was the logic when we wrote the draft oh so long ago. -Andy Herron formerly Microsoft Corp, currently residing at University of Washington From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 00:35:31 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id AAA23925 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 00:35:30 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V5XGb00829; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:33:16 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V5XHo13274; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:33:18 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 21:33:18 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101310449.FAA23218@SNI.sportline.de> From: "Wayne Green" Subject: Your Dream House #19C4 To: now03d@SNI.sportline.de X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE VÐßD.1712.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:24:25 -0500 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0" Resent-Message-ID: <"a8-wa.A.IPD.cO6d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME Message ------=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0" ------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable ***** This is an HTML Message ! ***** ------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

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Click Here ------=_NextPart_001_0080_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0-- ------=_NextPart_000_007F_01BDF6C7.FABAC1B0-- From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 02:37:48 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id CAA07733 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 02:37:48 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V7a4b10299; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:36:04 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V7a6I07316; Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:36:06 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 23:36:06 -0800 (PST) From: Stig Venås Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 08:35:48 +0100 To: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Persistent Search questions Message-ID: <20010131083548.B4217@itea.ntnu.no> References: <5.0.2.1.0.20010130175132.00a48410@router.boolean.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Mailer: Mutt 1.0i In-Reply-To: <5.0.2.1.0.20010130175132.00a48410@router.boolean.net>; from Kurt@OpenLDAP.org on Tue, Jan 30, 2001 at 05:57:18PM -0800 Resent-Message-ID: <"Mf5zRC.A.uxB.lB8d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com On Tue, Jan 30, 2001 at 05:57:18PM -0800, Kurt D. Zeilenga wrote: > In regards to DoS attacks, seems you could really drive a > server crazy by asking it to sort a persistent search. To be of any use in an open environment I think it must be possible with acls to specify who can make persistent search on what, and perhaps also how many simultaneous searches are allowed. As an administrator I wouldn't allow this for anonymous binds. There is a danger of DoS attacks even when not sorting. It might be because I haven't read all the details, but I fail to see how sorting can be of any use with persistent searches, except for possibly returning the entries already present. Stig From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 03:13:44 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id DAA07892 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 03:13:44 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0V8Bdb13426; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 00:11:39 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0V8Bfo16484; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 00:11:41 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 00:11:41 -0800 (PST) Sender: Robert.Byrne@france.Sun.COM Message-ID: <3A77C8AA.26208440@france.sun.com> Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 09:11:22 +0100 From: Rob Byrne Organization: Sun Microsystems X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (X11; I; SunOS 5.8 sun4u) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Jim Sermersheim CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Subject: Re: Persistent Search questions References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Resent-Message-ID: <"SMRxdC.A.SBE.7i8d6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim, Seems like a good rule here would be something like "an entry returned during a psearch operation must be subject to the same access controls that would be applied if the entry was being returned during a "one-off", normal search"....and that implies b). I do no think that performance is a big issue for psearches and a "fixed authorization" view sounds potentially dangerous. So I would be for mandating something like the statement above or b). Rob. Jim Sermersheim wrote: > > The persistent search control (draft-ietf-ldapext-psearch-03.txt) states in section 3 that the search operation is modified in such a way that the searcResultDone message is never sent. This implies that the size and time limits are ignored, but it's not explicitly stated. Can anyone confirm if this is the case? > > Also, there is a little blurb in the security considerations section about making sure access controls are checked for entries being returned. This is more of a question to other implementors, a server could: > a) check access control information once at the beginning of the search, and use that information without refreshing it later (could speed response time, and "fix" authorization to a specific view, or it could > b) recalculate access control information everytime an entry is to be returned (provides consistency over long persistent search sessions). > > My feeling is that b is better, does anyone expect a? > > Jim From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 07:17:35 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id HAA09662 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 07:17:34 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0VCFlb04528; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 04:15:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0VCFnA11639; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 04:15:49 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 04:15:49 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <200101311214.HAA09373@ietf.org> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" To: IETF-Announce: ; CC: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Reply-to: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org Subject: I-D ACTION:draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgmt-00.txt Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 07:14:49 -0500 Sender: nsyracus@cnri.reston.va.us Resent-Message-ID: <"hTMhQ.A.2zC.rHAe6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. Title : LDAP Extensions for Managing Replication Context and Replicas Author(s) : J. Khan, S. Sonntag Filename : draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgmt-00.txt Pages : 14 Date : 30-Jan-01 Version 3 of the LDAP Protocol provides a mechanism for sending and receiving extended LDAP requests. This document describes twelve extended operations supported by Novell eDirectory Servers. A client application can use these extensions to manage directory replication contexts (partitions) and replicas. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgmt-00.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP. Login with the username "anonymous" and a password of your e-mail address. After logging in, type "cd internet-drafts" and then "get draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgmt-00.txt". A list of Internet-Drafts directories can be found in http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt Internet-Drafts can also be obtained by e-mail. Send a message to: mailserv@ietf.org. In the body type: "FILE /internet-drafts/draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgmt-00.txt". NOTE: The mail server at ietf.org can return the document in MIME-encoded form by using the "mpack" utility. To use this feature, insert the command "ENCODING mime" before the "FILE" command. To decode the response(s), you will need "munpack" or a MIME-compliant mail reader. Different MIME-compliant mail readers exhibit different behavior, especially when dealing with "multipart" MIME messages (i.e. documents which have been split up into multiple messages), so check your local documentation on how to manipulate these messages. 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From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 15:59:29 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id PAA25588 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:59:28 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0VKvLb28366; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 12:57:21 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0VKvMM26650; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 12:57:22 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 12:57:22 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 13:56:56 -0700 From: "Javed Khan" To: , Subject: LDAP Extensions for Managing Replication Context and Replicas Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_673C2831.7C1D321B" Resent-Message-ID: <"SNkc6B.A.CgG.xwHe6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. --=_673C2831.7C1D321B Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts = directories. Please send comments to: Javed Khan (jkhan@novell.com) Steve Sonntag (vtag@novell.com) Thanks =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Title : LDAP Extensions for Managing Replication Context and=20 Replicas Author(s) : J. Khan, S. Sonntag Filename : draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgmt-00.txt Pages : 14 Date : 30-Jan-01 =20 Version 3 of the LDAP Protocol provides a mechanism for sending and receiving extended LDAP requests. This document describes twelve extended operations supported by Novell eDirectory Servers. A client application can use these extensions to manage directory replication contexts (partitions) and replicas. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgmt-00.txt --=_673C2831.7C1D321B Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts=20 directories.
 
Please send comments to:
 
Javed Khan (jkhan@novell.com)<= /DIV>
Steve Sonntag (vtag@novell.com)=
 
Thanks
=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

    Title        : = LDAP=20 Extensions for Managing Replication Context and=20
            = ;            &n= bsp;=20 Replicas
    Author(s)    : J. Khan, = S.=20 Sonntag
    Filename    :=20 draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgmt-00.txt
   =20 Pages        : 14
   =20 Date        : 30-Jan-01
   = =20
Version 3 of the LDAP Protocol provides a mechanism for sending=20 and
receiving extended LDAP requests.  This document describes=20 twelve
extended operations supported by Novell eDirectory Servers.
A= =20 client application can use these extensions to manage directory
replicat= ion=20 contexts (partitions) and replicas.
 
A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-khan-ldapext-replica-mgm= t-00.txt
 
 
 
 

 
--=_673C2831.7C1D321B-- From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 16:49:18 2001 Received: from netscape.com (c3po.netscape.com [205.217.237.46]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id QAA26365 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:49:18 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0VLkfG26264; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 13:46:46 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0VLkgw20115; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 13:46:42 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 13:46:42 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <0000495843b4$0000074f$000033ca@> To: From: jmwressell@earthlink.net Subject: BIZZ OPP & FREE Vacation 3 13258 Date: Tue, 30 Jan 2001 17:15:21 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Resent-Message-ID: <"bqAq3.A.75E.AfIe6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable GET YOUR FREE GIFT WHEN
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 From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 18:07:15 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id SAA27503 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 18:07:15 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f0VN4lb25562; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:04:47 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f0VN4mY24719; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:04:48 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:04:48 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <5.0.2.1.0.20010131141805.00a41ec0@router.boolean.net> X-Sender: guru@router.boolean.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 5.0.2 Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 15:03:59 -0800 To: rharrison@novell.com From: "Kurt D. Zeilenga" Subject: extended partial response Cc: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Resent-Message-ID: <"s3a8PC.A.7BG.PoJe6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Roger, A few comments... I'd like to see the Abstract (actually the whole document) generalized a bit more. It's a bit Extended Operation centric (which is understandable given its roots). In fact, I suggest that the PDU be referred to as simply as a "partial" response. I like to see a specific statement that this response PDU SHOULD be used instead extendedResponse to return partial search responses. Also, section 3 might provide a "Background and Intended Use" discussion. In particular, I'd like to see a brief discussion (not specification) of possible uses such as: 1) multiple response "extended operation" 2) subtree control w/ delete operation 3) progress responses (returns percent of operation completed) In section 4, you should state that partial responses generated due to control processing require an responseName. (With extended operations, the responseName is not necessarily needed). You might also note that responseNames of partial responses should not be published in the root DSE as they are always associated with some extendedRequest or control (who's OID should be published in the root DSE). Kurt From list@netscape.com Wed Jan 31 19:19:05 2001 Received: from netscape.com (r2d2.netscape.com [205.217.237.47]) by ietf.org (8.9.1a/8.9.1a) with SMTP id TAA28649 for ; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 19:19:05 -0500 (EST) Received: from aka.mcom.com (aka.mcom.com [205.217.237.180]) by netscape.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) with ESMTP id f110Gnb08170; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:16:49 -0800 (PST) Received: (from list@localhost) by aka.mcom.com (8.10.0/8.10.0) id f110GoU26545; Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:16:50 -0800 (PST) Resent-Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 16:16:50 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: X-Mailer: Novell GroupWise Internet Agent 5.5.5.1 Date: Wed, 31 Jan 2001 17:16:24 -0700 From: "Jim Sermersheim" To: , , Cc: Subject: RE: Fix for VLV draft. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by aka.mcom.com id f110Gmv26521 Resent-Message-ID: <"pvQA4C.A.feG.xrKe6"@glacier> Resent-From: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com X-Mailing-List: X-Loop: ietf-ldapext@netscape.com Precedence: list Resent-Sender: ietf-ldapext-request@netscape.com Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit >The original thinking in the sorting draft was that the client could ask >for it to be sorted but not require it. The criticality field seemed at >the time perfectly suited for this use. It could be that the client is >capable of doing the sort but also "is hopeful" that the server already has >the data indexed by the sort key so can simply run down the index when >calculating/formatting the result set. I think, these days if someone were to define a control, and they wanted this functionality, they'd be persuaded to add an option to the control data that provided it.