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Subject: [link-relations] NEW RELATION - annotation-server (request for review)
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Hello Mark, Eran, Julian,

I just updated my http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-duerst-anno-link for 
the "annotation-server" link relationship. I would like to get your (and 
everybody else's on this list) input on it. The registration template is 
as follows:

 >>>>>>>>
    Relation Name:
       annotation-server

    Description:
       Designates an annotation server used to store annotations
       for the link's context.

    Reference:
       RFC YYYY [RFC Editor: Please replace with actual RFC number.]

    Notes:
       currently none

    Application Data:
       currently none
<<<<<<<<

I don't think I'm on this list, so please keep me in the cc.

Regards,    Martin.

From evnikita2@gmail.com  Thu Sep  8 08:58:46 2011
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Date: Thu, 08 Sep 2011 19:01:05 +0300
From: Mykyta Yevstifeyev <evnikita2@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [link-relations] NEW RELATION - annotation-server (request for review)
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Your draft makes normative reference to Annotea specification, but lacks 
of clear description how it is connected to it.  Also, a link to 
<http://www.w3.org/2001/Annotea/User/Protocol> is missing there.

Mykyta

08.09.2011 4:43, "Martin J. Dürst" wrote:
> Hello Mark, Eran, Julian,
>
> I just updated my http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-duerst-anno-link 
> for the "annotation-server" link relationship. I would like to get 
> your (and everybody else's on this list) input on it. The registration 
> template is as follows:
>
> >>>>>>>>
>    Relation Name:
>       annotation-server
>
>    Description:
>       Designates an annotation server used to store annotations
>       for the link's context.
>
>    Reference:
>       RFC YYYY [RFC Editor: Please replace with actual RFC number.]
>
>    Notes:
>       currently none
>
>    Application Data:
>       currently none
> <<<<<<<<
>
> I don't think I'm on this list, so please keep me in the cc.
>
> Regards,    Martin.
> _______________________________________________
> link-relations mailing list
> link-relations@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/link-relations
>


From maileko@gmail.com  Sun Sep 11 23:01:05 2011
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From: Maile Ohye <maileko@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [link-relations] [apps-discuss] Fwd: I-D Action: draft-ohye-canonical-link-relation-01.txt
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--bcaec521639dd5752504acb847ae
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Hi everyone,

Thanks for the feedback! I'll submit draft-02 which addresses the issues
below:

1. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93This isn't clear enough for abstract.  I
propose:

Abstract
RFC 5988 specified a way to define relationships betweeen links on the Web.
 This document describes a new type of such relationship, 'canonical', whic=
h
desigantes the preferred URI from a set of identical or vastly similar ones=
.

A similar text should go in the first paragraph of Introduction.=94

-- response by M. Ohye: =93Updated in abstract of draft-02.=94

2. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93 In Introduction:

making it possible for references to the context URI to be updated to
reference the designated URI.

Maybe you meant "target URI" instead "designated URI" (terminology from RFC
5988).

-- response by M. Ohye: =93Updated to =91target URI=92 in draft-02.=94

3. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93Section 3:

 The target/canonical URI MAY:

  o  Specify a URI Reference (see [RFC3986] Section 4.1) i.e., an absolute
URI or a relative reference

What you mean here?  If you wanted to show that canonical URI may be a
relative one, you should better write:

 The target/canonical URI MAY:

  o  Be a relative URI (see [RFC3986], Section 4.2);=94

-- response by M. Ohye: =93Added to draft-02.=94

4. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93The target/canonical URI SHOULD NOT designate=
:

  o  The source URI of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this refers to
     Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]) or a "300 Multiple Choices" URI
     (Section 10.3.1 of [RFC2616])

Here probably a typo happened; so please change to:

 The target/canonical URI SHOULD NOT designate:

  o  The URI which is a source of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this
     refers to 300 and 301 response codes, defined in Sections
     10.3.1 and 10.3.2 of RFC 2616 [RFC2616]);=94

-- response by M. Ohye: =93Changed to:

[ The source URI of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this refers to 300 and
301 response codes, defined in Sections 10.3.1 and 10.3.2 of <xref
target=3D"RFC2616"/>) ]

5. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93A URI that serves a 4xx error code (Section 1=
0.4
of [RFC2616]).

Again, HTTP-centric approach.  There are many other application-layer
protocols, for which URI schemes exist, and they aren't very likely to even
have the same req/response model as HTTP has.  As this is only available in
HTTP, I propose to exclude this bullet, unless you can reformulate it so
that it doesn't use HTTP-only feature.=94

-- response by J. Reschke: =93-1. This is useful information. Just because
something is specific doesn't mean it shouldn't be mentioned.=94
-- response by M. Ohye: =93Yes, we=92d like to include restrictions, even i=
f
they are HTTP-specific. Unfortunately, it would be difficult to mention the=
m
clearly while remaining HTTP-agnostic.=94

6. OPEN. M. Yevstifeyev: =93
o  The first page of a multi-page article or multi-page listing of
     items (since the first page is not a duplicate or a superset or
     the context URI).  For example, page2 and page3 of an article
     SHOULD NOT specify page1 as the canonical.

Here you may point to Section 6.12 of you reference [REC-html401-19991224],
which specifies the 'start' relation (
http://www.w3.org/TR/1999/REC-html401-19991224/types.html#idx-link_type),
used for this purpose.=94

-- response by J. Reschke: =93+-0.=94
-- response by M. Ohye: =93We=92d prefer not to clutter our point with a li=
nk to
the =91start=92 relation, but if we could add it in a footnote, that would =
be
fine.=94

7. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93In Section 5:

 2.  Permanent HTTP redirects (Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]), the
      traditional strong indicator that a URI's content has been
      permanently moved, could not be implemented in place of the
      canonical link relation.

Also too HTTP-centric approach.  The same as above applies.=94

-- response by J. Reschke: =93-1.=94

8. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93References:

Why make RFC 2616 and HTML4 spec Normative references?  Shouldn't
Informative be OK?=94

-- response by J. Reschke: =93For 2616 is makes sense if there are normativ=
e
constrains specific for HTTP.=94

Thanks again,
Maile

On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 12:40 AM, Mykyta Yevstifeyev <evnikita2@gmail.com>
wrote:
> 31.08.2011 9:20, Julian Reschke wrote:
>>
>> On 2011-08-31 06:34, Mykyta Yevstifeyev wrote:
>>>
>>> ...
>>> Section 3:
>>>
>>>>    The target/canonical URI MAY:
>>>>
>>>>    o  Specify a URI Reference (see [RFC3986] Section 4.1) i.e., an
>>>>       absolute URI or a relative reference
>>>
>>> What you mean here? If you wanted to show that canonical URI may be a
>>> relative one, you should better write:
>>>
>>>>    The target/canonical URI MAY:
>>>>
>>>>    o  Be a relative URI (see [RFC3986], Section 4.2);
>>
>> The original text seems to be clearer to me.
>
> It is already obvious that target URI must conform to RFC 3986
> <URI-Reference> from RFC 5988:
>
>>   Link           =3D "Link" ":" #link-value
>>   link-value     =3D "<" URI-Reference">" *( ";" link-param )
>
> and, correspondingly, the target URI *is* (rather than *MAY be*)
> <URI-Reference>.  If the authors want to clarify that target URI may be
> relative, my proposed text is better.
>
>>
>>> Ibid:
>>>
>>>>    o  A URI that serves a 4xx error code (Section 10.4 of [RFC2616]).
>>>
>>> Again, HTTP-centric approach. There are many other application-layer
>>> protocols, for which URI schemes exist, and they aren't very likely to
>>> even have the same req/response model as HTTP has. As this is only
>>> available in HTTP, I propose to exclude this bullet, unless you can
>>> reformulate it so that it doesn't use HTTP-only feature.
>>
>> -1. This is useful information. Just because something is specific
doesn't
>> mean it shouldn't be mentioned.
>
> From Section 10.4 of RFC 2616:
>
>>    The 4xx class of status code is intended for cases in which the
>>    client seems to have erred.
>
> So 4xx responses are used when something is wring with HTTP request.  I
> doubt there are alternatives of such definition in *all* protocols for
which
> the URI scheme has been specified.  Eg., FTP doesn't alter error
conditions
> caused by client or server; neither does TFTP and many others.
>
> We aren't defining the link relation fro 'http' and 'https' URIs only; it
is
> theoretically to allow any scheme, including not yet defined.
>
>>> In Section 5:
>>>
>>>>    2.  Permanent HTTP redirects (Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]), the
>>>>        traditional strong indicator that a URI's content has been
>>>>        permanently moved, could not be implemented in place of the
>>>>        canonical link relation.
>>>
>>> Also too HTTP-centric approach. The same as above applies.
>>
>> -1
>
> See above.
>
>>
>>> References:
>>>
>>> Why make RFC 2616 and HTML4 spec Normative references? Shouldn't
>>> Informative be OK?
>>
>> For 2616 is makes sense if there are normative constrains specific for
>> HTTP.
>
> See above as well.  Why tie ourselves with HTTP only?
>
> Mykyta
>
>>
>> > ...
>>
>> Best regards, Julian
>>
>
>

--bcaec521639dd5752504acb847ae
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Hi everyone,<div><br></div><div>Thanks for the feedback! I&#39;ll submit dr=
aft-02 which addresses the issues below:<br><br><div style=3D"font-family: =
Times; font-size: medium; background-color: transparent; "><span id=3D"inte=
rnal-source-marker_0.8895513017196208" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-famil=
y: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-s=
tyle: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: =
baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">1. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93This isn&#=
39;t clear enough for abstract. =A0I propose:</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: italic; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">Abstract<br class=3D"kix-line-break">
RFC 5988 specified a way to define relationships betweeen links on the Web.=
 =A0This document describes a new type of such relationship, &#39;canonical=
&#39;, which desigantes the preferred URI from a set of identical or vastly=
 similar ones.</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">A similar text should go in the first paragraph of Introduction.=94</span=
><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by M. Ohye: =93Updated in abstract of draft-02.=94</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">2. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93 In Introduction:</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: italic; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">making it possible for references to the context URI to be updated to ref=
erence the designated URI.</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">Maybe you meant &quot;target URI&quot; instead &quot;designated URI&quot;=
 (terminology from RFC 5988).</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by M. Ohye: =93Updated to =91target URI=92 in draft-02.=94</s=
pan><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">3. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93Section 3:</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: italic; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"> =A0The target/canonical URI MAY:<br class=3D"kix-line-break">
<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0o =A0Specify a URI Reference (see [RFC3=
986] Section 4.1) i.e., an absolute URI or a relative reference</span><span=
 style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); backgro=
und-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; te=
xt-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></s=
pan><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">What you mean here? =A0If you wanted to show that canonical URI may be a =
relative one, you should better write:</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: italic; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"> =A0The target/canonical URI MAY:<br class=3D"kix-line-break">
<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0o =A0Be a relative URI (see [RFC3986], =
Section 4.2);=94</span><br><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Ari=
al; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: =
normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseli=
ne; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by M. Ohye: =93Added to draft-02.=94</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">4. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93The target/canonical URI SHOULD NOT designa=
te:<br class=3D"kix-line-break">
<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0o =A0The source URI of a permanent redi=
rect (for HTTP, this refers to<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=
Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]) or a &quot;300 Multiple Choices&quot; URI<br c=
lass=3D"kix-line-break">
 =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0(Section 10.3.1 of [RFC2616])</span><br><span style=3D"font=
-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb=
(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:=
 none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">Here probably a typo happened; so please change to:</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"> =A0The target/canonical URI SHOULD NOT designate:<br class=3D"kix-line-b=
reak">
<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0o =A0The URI which is a source of a per=
manent redirect (for HTTP, this<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0=A0=A0=
=A0refers to 300 and 301 response codes, defined in Sections<br class=3D"ki=
x-line-break"> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A010.3.1 and 10.3.2 of RFC 2616 [RFC2616]);=94<=
br class=3D"kix-line-break">
</span><br><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0=
, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-var=
iant: normal; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space:=
 pre-wrap; ">-- response by M. Ohye: =93Changed to:</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">[ The source URI of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this refers to 300 an=
d 301 response codes, defined in Sections 10.3.1 and 10.3.2 of &lt;xref tar=
get=3D&quot;RFC2616&quot;/&gt;) ]</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">5. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font=
-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); =
font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; vertical-a=
lign: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">A URI that serves a 4xx error code=
 (Section 10.4 of [RFC2616]).</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-fa=
mily: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); fon=
t-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; vertical-alig=
n: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">Again, HTTP-centric approach. =A0There are many other application-layer p=
rotocols, for which URI schemes exist, and they aren&#39;t very likely to e=
ven have the same req/response model as HTTP has. =A0As this is only availa=
ble in HTTP, I propose to exclude this bullet, unless you can reformulate i=
t so that it doesn&#39;t use HTTP-only feature.=94</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by J. Reschke: =93-1. This is useful information. Just becaus=
e something is specific doesn&#39;t mean it shouldn&#39;t be mentioned.=94<=
/span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by M. Ohye: =93Yes, we=92d like to include restrictions, even=
 if they are HTTP-specific. Unfortunately, it would be difficult to mention=
 them clearly while remaining HTTP-agnostic.=94</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"></span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">6. OPEN. M. Yevstifeyev: =93=A0</span></div>
<div style=3D"background-color: transparent; "><span style=3D"font-size: 10=
pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255=
, 255); font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; ve=
rtical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">o =A0The first page of a m=
ulti-page article or multi-page listing of<br class=3D"kix-line-break">
 =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0items (since the first page is not a duplicate or a superse=
t or<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0the context URI). =A0For e=
xample, page2 and page3 of an article<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0=
=A0=A0=A0SHOULD NOT specify page1 as the canonical.</span><font class=3D"Ap=
ple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Ari=
al; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: =
normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseli=
ne; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">Here you may point to Section 6.12 of you reference [REC-html401-19991224=
], which specifies the &#39;start&#39; relation (</span><a href=3D"http://w=
ww.w3.org/TR/1999/REC-html401-19991224/types.html#idx-link_type" style=3D"f=
ont-family: Times; font-size: medium; "><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; fon=
t-family: Arial; color: rgb(92, 69, 32); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 25=
5); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: underline; v=
ertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">http://www.w3.org/TR/1999=
/REC-html401-19991224/types.html#idx-link_type</span></a><span style=3D"fon=
t-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rg=
b(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration=
: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">), used for this=
 purpose.=94</span><br>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by J. Reschke: =93+-0.=94</span><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by M. Ohye: =93We=92d prefer not to clutter our point with a =
link to the =91start=92 relation, but if we could add it in a footnote, tha=
t would be fine.=94</span><br>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">7. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93In Section 5:</span><br>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: italic; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
"> =A02. =A0Permanent HTTP redirects (Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]), the<br =
class=3D"kix-line-break">
 =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0traditional strong indicator that a URI&#39;s content ha=
s been<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0permanently moved, co=
uld not be implemented in place of the<br class=3D"kix-line-break"> =A0=A0=
=A0=A0=A0=A0canonical link relation.</span><font class=3D"Apple-style-span"=
 size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(=
0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-va=
riant: normal; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space=
: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">Also too HTTP-centric approach. =A0The same as above applies.=94</span><b=
r>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by J. Reschke: =93-1.=94</span><br>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">8. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: =93References:</span><br>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">Why make RFC 2616 and HTML4 spec Normative references? =A0Shouldn&#39;t I=
nformative be OK?=94</span><br>
<font class=3D"Apple-style-span" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;=
 font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 2=
55); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; verti=
cal-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); ba=
ckground-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: norma=
l; text-decoration: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; =
">-- response by J. Reschke: =93For 2616 is makes sense if there are normat=
ive constrains specific for HTTP.=94</span></div>
<div style=3D"background-color: transparent; "><span style=3D"font-size: 10=
pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255=
, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; ve=
rtical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "><br>
</span></div><div style=3D"background-color: transparent; "><span style=3D"=
font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color:=
 rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decorat=
ion: none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Thanks again,=
</span></div>
<div style=3D"background-color: transparent; "><span style=3D"font-size: 10=
pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255=
, 255); font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; ve=
rtical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Maile</span></div>
<br>On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 12:40 AM, Mykyta Yevstifeyev &lt;<a href=3D"mai=
lto:evnikita2@gmail.com">evnikita2@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>&gt; 31.08.2=
011 9:20, Julian Reschke wrote:<br>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; On 2011-08-31 06:34=
, Mykyta Yevstifeyev wrote:<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; ...<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; Section 3:<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;=
<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0The target/canonical URI MAY:<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&g=
t;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0o =A0Specify a URI Reference (see [RFC3986] S=
ection 4.1) i.e., an<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0 =A0 absolute URI or a relative reference<br>&gt;&g=
t;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; What you mean here? If you wanted to show that canon=
ical URI may be a<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; relative one, you should better write:<br=
>&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0The target/canonical URI MAY:<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<b=
r>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0o =A0Be a relative URI (see [RFC3986], Section 4.=
2);<br>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; The original text seems to be clearer to me.<br=
>&gt;<br>
&gt; It is already obvious that target URI must conform to RFC 3986<br>&gt;=
 &lt;URI-Reference&gt; from RFC 5988:<br>&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; =A0 Link =A0 =A0 =
=A0 =A0 =A0 =3D &quot;Link&quot; &quot;:&quot; #link-value<br>&gt;&gt; =A0 =
link-value =A0 =A0 =3D &quot;&lt;&quot; URI-Reference&quot;&gt;&quot; *( &q=
uot;;&quot; link-param )<br>
&gt;<br>&gt; and, correspondingly, the target URI *is* (rather than *MAY be=
*)<br>&gt; &lt;URI-Reference&gt;. =A0If the authors want to clarify that ta=
rget URI may be<br>&gt; relative, my proposed text is better.<br>&gt;<br>
&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; Ibid:<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0o=
 =A0A URI that serves a 4xx error code (Section 10.4 of [RFC2616]).<br>&gt;=
&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; Again, HTTP-centric approach. There are many other=
 application-layer<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; protocols, for which URI schemes exist, and they aren&#39;t ve=
ry likely to<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; even have the same req/response model as HTTP =
has. As this is only<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; available in HTTP, I propose to exclud=
e this bullet, unless you can<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt; reformulate it so that it doesn&#39;t use HTTP-only feature.<b=
r>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; -1. This is useful information. Just because somethi=
ng is specific doesn&#39;t<br>&gt;&gt; mean it shouldn&#39;t be mentioned.<=
br>
&gt;<br>&gt; From Section 10.4 of RFC 2616:<br>&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0The =
4xx class of status code is intended for cases in which the<br>&gt;&gt; =A0=
 =A0client seems to have erred.<br>&gt;<br>&gt; So 4xx responses are used w=
hen something is wring with HTTP request. =A0I<br>
&gt; doubt there are alternatives of such definition in *all* protocols for=
 which<br>&gt; the URI scheme has been specified. =A0Eg., FTP doesn&#39;t a=
lter error conditions<br>&gt; caused by client or server; neither does TFTP=
 and many others.<br>
&gt;<br>&gt; We aren&#39;t defining the link relation fro &#39;http&#39; an=
d &#39;https&#39; URIs only; it is<br>&gt; theoretically to allow any schem=
e, including not yet defined.<br>&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; In Section 5:<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A02. =A0Permanent HTTP redirects (Sec=
tion 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]), the<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0tradition=
al strong indicator that a URI&#39;s content has been<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =
=A0 =A0 =A0 =A0permanently moved, could not be implemented in place of the<=
br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; =A0 =A0 =A0 =A0canonical link relation.<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;<br=
>&gt;&gt;&gt; Also too HTTP-centric approach. The same as above applies.<br=
>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; -1<br>&gt;<br>&gt; See above.<br>&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;<br>=
&gt;&gt;&gt; References:<br>
&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; Why make RFC 2616 and HTML4 spec Normative ref=
erences? Shouldn&#39;t<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; Informative be OK?<br>&gt;&gt;<br>&g=
t;&gt; For 2616 is makes sense if there are normative constrains specific f=
or<br>
&gt;&gt; HTTP.<br>&gt;<br>&gt; See above as well. =A0Why tie ourselves with=
 HTTP only?<br>&gt;<br>&gt; Mykyta<br>&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; &gt; ...=
<br>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; Best regards, Julian<br>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;<br>&gt;<b=
r>
<br></div>

--bcaec521639dd5752504acb847ae--

From julian.reschke@gmx.de  Mon Sep 12 02:28:39 2011
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Cc: draft-ohye-canonical-link-relation@tools.ietf.org, apps-discuss@ietf.org, "link-relations@ietf.org" <link-relations@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [link-relations] [apps-discuss] Fwd: I-D Action: draft-ohye-canonical-link-relation-01.txt
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On 2011-09-12 08:03, Maile Ohye wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> Thanks for the feedback! I'll submit draft-02 which addresses the issues
> below:
> ...

Thanks.

At this point I believe you should send a request for publication to the 
IESG (iesg@ietf.org). If all goes well, the next step will be an 
IETF-wide Last Call, which will provide opportunity for a final round of 
feedback.

Let's get this finished!

Best regards, Julian

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Maile,

Could you please justify why do you want to constrain the requirements 
of your document with HTTP model?

Mykyta Yevstifeyev

12.09.2011 9:03, Maile Ohye wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> Thanks for the feedback! I'll submit draft-02 which addresses the 
> issues below:
>
> 1. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “This isn't clear enough for abstract.  I 
> propose:
>
> Abstract
> RFC 5988 specified a way to define relationships betweeen links on the 
> Web.  This document describes a new type of such relationship, 
> 'canonical', which desigantes the preferred URI from a set of 
> identical or vastly similar ones.
>
> A similar text should go in the first paragraph of Introduction.”
>
> -- response by M. Ohye: “Updated in abstract of draft-02.”
>
> 2. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “ In Introduction:
>
> making it possible for references to the context URI to be updated to 
> reference the designated URI.
>
> Maybe you meant "target URI" instead "designated URI" (terminology 
> from RFC 5988).
>
> -- response by M. Ohye: “Updated to ‘target URI’ in draft-02.”
>
> 3. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “Section 3:
>
>  The target/canonical URI MAY:
>
>   o  Specify a URI Reference (see [RFC3986] Section 4.1) i.e., an 
> absolute URI or a relative reference
>
> What you mean here?  If you wanted to show that canonical URI may be a 
> relative one, you should better write:
>
>  The target/canonical URI MAY:
>
>   o  Be a relative URI (see [RFC3986], Section 4.2);”
>
> -- response by M. Ohye: “Added to draft-02.”
>
> 4. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “The target/canonical URI SHOULD NOT designate:
>
>   o  The source URI of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this refers to
>      Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]) or a "300 Multiple Choices" URI
>      (Section 10.3.1 of [RFC2616])
>
> Here probably a typo happened; so please change to:
>
>  The target/canonical URI SHOULD NOT designate:
>
>   o  The URI which is a source of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this
>      refers to 300 and 301 response codes, defined in Sections
>      10.3.1 and 10.3.2 of RFC 2616 [RFC2616]);”
>
> -- response by M. Ohye: “Changed to:
>
> [ The source URI of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this refers to 300 
> and 301 response codes, defined in Sections 10.3.1 and 10.3.2 of <xref 
> target="RFC2616"/>) ]
>
> 5. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “A URI that serves a 4xx error code 
> (Section 10.4 of [RFC2616]).
>
> Again, HTTP-centric approach.  There are many other application-layer 
> protocols, for which URI schemes exist, and they aren't very likely to 
> even have the same req/response model as HTTP has.  As this is only 
> available in HTTP, I propose to exclude this bullet, unless you can 
> reformulate it so that it doesn't use HTTP-only feature.”
>
> -- response by J. Reschke: “-1. This is useful information. Just 
> because something is specific doesn't mean it shouldn't be mentioned.”
> -- response by M. Ohye: “Yes, we’d like to include restrictions, even 
> if they are HTTP-specific. Unfortunately, it would be difficult to 
> mention them clearly while remaining HTTP-agnostic.”
>
> 6. OPEN. M. Yevstifeyev: “
> o  The first page of a multi-page article or multi-page listing of
>      items (since the first page is not a duplicate or a superset or
>      the context URI).  For example, page2 and page3 of an article
>      SHOULD NOT specify page1 as the canonical.
>
> Here you may point to Section 6.12 of you reference 
> [REC-html401-19991224], which specifies the 'start' relation 
> (http://www.w3.org/TR/1999/REC-html401-19991224/types.html#idx-link_type), 
> used for this purpose.”
>
> -- response by J. Reschke: “+-0.”
> -- response by M. Ohye: “We’d prefer not to clutter our point with a 
> link to the ‘start’ relation, but if we could add it in a footnote, 
> that would be fine.”
>
> 7. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “In Section 5:
>
>  2.  Permanent HTTP redirects (Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]), the
>       traditional strong indicator that a URI's content has been
>       permanently moved, could not be implemented in place of the
>       canonical link relation.
>
> Also too HTTP-centric approach.  The same as above applies.”
>
> -- response by J. Reschke: “-1.”
>
> 8. CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “References:
>
> Why make RFC 2616 and HTML4 spec Normative references?  Shouldn't 
> Informative be OK?”
>
> -- response by J. Reschke: “For 2616 is makes sense if there are 
> normative constrains specific for HTTP.”
>
> Thanks again,
> Maile
>
> On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 12:40 AM, Mykyta Yevstifeyev 
> <evnikita2@gmail.com <mailto:evnikita2@gmail.com>> wrote:
> > 31.08.2011 9:20, Julian Reschke wrote:
> >>
> >> On 2011-08-31 06:34, Mykyta Yevstifeyev wrote:
> >>>
> >>> ...
> >>> Section 3:
> >>>
> >>>>    The target/canonical URI MAY:
> >>>>
> >>>>    o  Specify a URI Reference (see [RFC3986] Section 4.1) i.e., an
> >>>>       absolute URI or a relative reference
> >>>
> >>> What you mean here? If you wanted to show that canonical URI may be a
> >>> relative one, you should better write:
> >>>
> >>>>    The target/canonical URI MAY:
> >>>>
> >>>>    o  Be a relative URI (see [RFC3986], Section 4.2);
> >>
> >> The original text seems to be clearer to me.
> >
> > It is already obvious that target URI must conform to RFC 3986
> > <URI-Reference> from RFC 5988:
> >
> >>   Link           = "Link" ":" #link-value
> >>   link-value     = "<" URI-Reference">" *( ";" link-param )
> >
> > and, correspondingly, the target URI *is* (rather than *MAY be*)
> > <URI-Reference>.  If the authors want to clarify that target URI may be
> > relative, my proposed text is better.
> >
> >>
> >>> Ibid:
> >>>
> >>>>    o  A URI that serves a 4xx error code (Section 10.4 of [RFC2616]).
> >>>
> >>> Again, HTTP-centric approach. There are many other application-layer
> >>> protocols, for which URI schemes exist, and they aren't very likely to
> >>> even have the same req/response model as HTTP has. As this is only
> >>> available in HTTP, I propose to exclude this bullet, unless you can
> >>> reformulate it so that it doesn't use HTTP-only feature.
> >>
> >> -1. This is useful information. Just because something is specific 
> doesn't
> >> mean it shouldn't be mentioned.
> >
> > From Section 10.4 of RFC 2616:
> >
> >>    The 4xx class of status code is intended for cases in which the
> >>    client seems to have erred.
> >
> > So 4xx responses are used when something is wring with HTTP request.  I
> > doubt there are alternatives of such definition in *all* protocols 
> for which
> > the URI scheme has been specified.  Eg., FTP doesn't alter error 
> conditions
> > caused by client or server; neither does TFTP and many others.
> >
> > We aren't defining the link relation fro 'http' and 'https' URIs 
> only; it is
> > theoretically to allow any scheme, including not yet defined.
> >
> >>> In Section 5:
> >>>
> >>>>    2.  Permanent HTTP redirects (Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]), the
> >>>>        traditional strong indicator that a URI's content has been
> >>>>        permanently moved, could not be implemented in place of the
> >>>>        canonical link relation.
> >>>
> >>> Also too HTTP-centric approach. The same as above applies.
> >>
> >> -1
> >
> > See above.
> >
> >>
> >>> References:
> >>>
> >>> Why make RFC 2616 and HTML4 spec Normative references? Shouldn't
> >>> Informative be OK?
> >>
> >> For 2616 is makes sense if there are normative constrains specific for
> >> HTTP.
> >
> > See above as well.  Why tie ourselves with HTTP only?
> >
> > Mykyta
> >
> >>
> >> > ...
> >>
> >> Best regards, Julian
> >>
> >
> >
>


--------------040006070309090709030507
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<html>
  <head>
    <meta content="text/html; charset=windows-1252"
      http-equiv="Content-Type">
  </head>
  <body bgcolor="#FFFFFF" text="#000000">
    Maile,<br>
    <br>
    Could you please justify why do you want to constrain the
    requirements of your document with HTTP model?<br>
    <br>
    Mykyta Yevstifeyev<br>
    <br>
    12.09.2011 9:03, Maile Ohye wrote:
    <blockquote
cite="mid:CAGKau1HLOfew40y9dtZ6Q4guZ84adOFrwP8xLAHSKhE=uCZEUQ@mail.gmail.com"
      type="cite">Hi everyone,
      <div><br>
      </div>
      <div>Thanks for the feedback! I'll submit draft-02 which addresses
        the issues below:<br>
        <br>
        <div style="font-family: Times; font-size: medium;
          background-color: transparent; "><span
            id="internal-source-marker_0.8895513017196208"
            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0,
            0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
            normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
            vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">1.
            CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “This isn't clear enough for
            abstract.  I propose:</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Abstract<br
              class="kix-line-break">
            RFC 5988 specified a way to define relationships betweeen
            links on the Web.  This document describes a new type of
            such relationship, 'canonical', which desigantes the
            preferred URI from a set of identical or vastly similar
            ones.</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">A
            similar text should go in the first paragraph of
            Introduction.”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by M. Ohye: “Updated in abstract of draft-02.”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">2.
            CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “ In Introduction:</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">making
            it possible for references to the context URI to be updated
            to reference the designated URI.</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Maybe
            you meant "target URI" instead "designated URI" (terminology
            from RFC 5988).</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by M. Ohye: “Updated to ‘target URI’ in draft-02.”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">3.
            CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “Section 3:</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">
             The target/canonical URI MAY:<br class="kix-line-break">
            <br class="kix-line-break">
              o  Specify a URI Reference (see [RFC3986] Section 4.1)
            i.e., an absolute URI or a relative reference</span><span
            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0,
            0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
            normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
            vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">What
            you mean here?  If you wanted to show that canonical URI may
            be a relative one, you should better write:</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">
             The target/canonical URI MAY:<br class="kix-line-break">
            <br class="kix-line-break">
              o  Be a relative URI (see [RFC3986], Section 4.2);”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by M. Ohye: “Added to draft-02.”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">4.
            CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “The target/canonical URI SHOULD NOT
            designate:<br class="kix-line-break">
            <br class="kix-line-break">
              o  The source URI of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this
            refers to<br class="kix-line-break">
                 Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]) or a "300 Multiple
            Choices" URI<br class="kix-line-break">
                 (Section 10.3.1 of [RFC2616])</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Here
            probably a typo happened; so please change to:</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">
             The target/canonical URI SHOULD NOT designate:<br
              class="kix-line-break">
            <br class="kix-line-break">
              o  The URI which is a source of a permanent redirect (for
            HTTP, this<br class="kix-line-break">
                 refers to 300 and 301 response codes, defined in
            Sections<br class="kix-line-break">
                 10.3.1 and 10.3.2 of RFC 2616 [RFC2616]);”<br
              class="kix-line-break">
          </span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by M. Ohye: “Changed to:</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">[
            The source URI of a permanent redirect (for HTTP, this
            refers to 300 and 301 response codes, defined in Sections
            10.3.1 and 10.3.2 of &lt;xref target="RFC2616"/&gt;) ]</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">5.
            CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “</span><span style="font-size:
            10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);
            background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: italic;
            font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none; vertical-align:
            baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">A URI that serves a 4xx
            error code (Section 10.4 of [RFC2616]).</span><span
            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0,
            0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
            normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
            vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Again,
            HTTP-centric approach.  There are many other
            application-layer protocols, for which URI schemes exist,
            and they aren't very likely to even have the same
            req/response model as HTTP has.  As this is only available
            in HTTP, I propose to exclude this bullet, unless you can
            reformulate it so that it doesn't use HTTP-only feature.”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by J. Reschke: “-1. This is useful information.
            Just because something is specific doesn't mean it shouldn't
            be mentioned.”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by M. Ohye: “Yes, we’d like to include
            restrictions, even if they are HTTP-specific. Unfortunately,
            it would be difficult to mention them clearly while
            remaining HTTP-agnostic.”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">6.
            OPEN. M. Yevstifeyev: “ </span></div>
        <div style="background-color: transparent; "><span
            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0,
            0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
            italic; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
            vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">o  The
            first page of a multi-page article or multi-page listing of<br
              class="kix-line-break">
                 items (since the first page is not a duplicate or a
            superset or<br class="kix-line-break">
                 the context URI).  For example, page2 and page3 of an
            article<br class="kix-line-break">
                 SHOULD NOT specify page1 as the canonical.</span><font
            class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span style="font-size:
              10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);
              background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal;
              font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Here
            you may point to Section 6.12 of you reference
            [REC-html401-19991224], which specifies the 'start' relation
            (</span><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.w3.org/TR/1999/REC-html401-19991224/types.html#idx-link_type"
            style="font-family: Times; font-size: medium; "><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(92,
              69, 32); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: underline;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">http://www.w3.org/TR/1999/REC-html401-19991224/types.html#idx-link_type</span></a><span
            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0,
            0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
            normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
            vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">), used
            for this purpose.”</span><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by J. Reschke: “+-0.”</span><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by M. Ohye: “We’d prefer not to clutter our point
            with a link to the ‘start’ relation, but if we could add it
            in a footnote, that would be fine.”</span><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">7.
            CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “In Section 5:</span><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: italic; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">
             2.  Permanent HTTP redirects (Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]),
            the<br class="kix-line-break">
                  traditional strong indicator that a URI's content has
            been<br class="kix-line-break">
                  permanently moved, could not be implemented in place
            of the<br class="kix-line-break">
                  canonical link relation.</span><font
            class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span style="font-size:
              10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);
              background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style: normal;
              font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Also
            too HTTP-centric approach.  The same as above applies.”</span><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by J. Reschke: “-1.”</span><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">8.
            CLOSED. M. Yevstifeyev: “References:</span><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Why
            make RFC 2616 and HTML4 spec Normative references?
             Shouldn't Informative be OK?”</span><br>
          <font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><span
              style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0,
              0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
              normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
              vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "></span></font><br>
          <span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color:
            rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
            font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration:
            none; vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">--
            response by J. Reschke: “For 2616 is makes sense if there
            are normative constrains specific for HTTP.”</span></div>
        <div style="background-color: transparent; "><span
            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0,
            0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
            normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
            vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; "><br>
          </span></div>
        <div style="background-color: transparent; "><span
            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0,
            0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
            normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
            vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Thanks
            again,</span></div>
        <div style="background-color: transparent; "><span
            style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0,
            0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-style:
            normal; font-variant: normal; text-decoration: none;
            vertical-align: baseline; white-space: pre-wrap; ">Maile</span></div>
        <br>
        On Wed, Aug 31, 2011 at 12:40 AM, Mykyta Yevstifeyev &lt;<a
          moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:evnikita2@gmail.com">evnikita2@gmail.com</a>&gt;
        wrote:<br>
        &gt; 31.08.2011 9:20, Julian Reschke wrote:<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt; On 2011-08-31 06:34, Mykyta Yevstifeyev wrote:<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; ...<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; Section 3:<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;    The target/canonical URI MAY:<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;    o  Specify a URI Reference (see [RFC3986]
        Section 4.1) i.e., an<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;       absolute URI or a relative reference<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; What you mean here? If you wanted to show that
        canonical URI may be a<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; relative one, you should better write:<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;    The target/canonical URI MAY:<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;    o  Be a relative URI (see [RFC3986], Section
        4.2);<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt; The original text seems to be clearer to me.<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt; It is already obvious that target URI must conform to RFC
        3986<br>
        &gt; &lt;URI-Reference&gt; from RFC 5988:<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;   Link           = "Link" ":" #link-value<br>
        &gt;&gt;   link-value     = "&lt;" URI-Reference"&gt;" *( ";"
        link-param )<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt; and, correspondingly, the target URI *is* (rather than *MAY
        be*)<br>
        &gt; &lt;URI-Reference&gt;.  If the authors want to clarify that
        target URI may be<br>
        &gt; relative, my proposed text is better.<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; Ibid:<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;    o  A URI that serves a 4xx error code
        (Section 10.4 of [RFC2616]).<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; Again, HTTP-centric approach. There are many other
        application-layer<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; protocols, for which URI schemes exist, and they
        aren't very likely to<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; even have the same req/response model as HTTP has.
        As this is only<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; available in HTTP, I propose to exclude this
        bullet, unless you can<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; reformulate it so that it doesn't use HTTP-only
        feature.<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt; -1. This is useful information. Just because something
        is specific doesn't<br>
        &gt;&gt; mean it shouldn't be mentioned.<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt; From Section 10.4 of RFC 2616:<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;    The 4xx class of status code is intended for cases
        in which the<br>
        &gt;&gt;    client seems to have erred.<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt; So 4xx responses are used when something is wring with HTTP
        request.  I<br>
        &gt; doubt there are alternatives of such definition in *all*
        protocols for which<br>
        &gt; the URI scheme has been specified.  Eg., FTP doesn't alter
        error conditions<br>
        &gt; caused by client or server; neither does TFTP and many
        others.<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt; We aren't defining the link relation fro 'http' and 'https'
        URIs only; it is<br>
        &gt; theoretically to allow any scheme, including not yet
        defined.<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; In Section 5:<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;    2.  Permanent HTTP redirects (Section 10.3.2
        of [RFC2616]), the<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;        traditional strong indicator that a
        URI's content has been<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;        permanently moved, could not be
        implemented in place of the<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;        canonical link relation.<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; Also too HTTP-centric approach. The same as above
        applies.<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt; -1<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt; See above.<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; References:<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; Why make RFC 2616 and HTML4 spec Normative
        references? Shouldn't<br>
        &gt;&gt;&gt; Informative be OK?<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt; For 2616 is makes sense if there are normative
        constrains specific for<br>
        &gt;&gt; HTTP.<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt; See above as well.  Why tie ourselves with HTTP only?<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt; Mykyta<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt; &gt; ...<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;&gt; Best regards, Julian<br>
        &gt;&gt;<br>
        &gt;<br>
        &gt;<br>
        <br>
      </div>
    </blockquote>
    <br>
  </body>
</html>

--------------040006070309090709030507--

From julian.reschke@gmx.de  Mon Sep 12 05:57:56 2011
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On 2011-09-12 14:55, Mykyta Yevstifeyev wrote:
> Maile,
>
> Could you please justify why do you want to constrain the requirements
> of your document with HTTP model?
>
> Mykyta Yevstifeyev
> ...

I believe that while the link relation itself is not restricted to 
specific protocols, it still makes sense to explain how it should be 
used with HTTP URIs.

Best regards, Julian

From algermissen1971@me.com  Mon Sep 12 06:03:41 2011
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On Sep 12, 2011, at 2:59 PM, Julian Reschke wrote:

> On 2011-09-12 14:55, Mykyta Yevstifeyev wrote:
>> Maile,
>> 
>> Could you please justify why do you want to constrain the requirements
>> of your document with HTTP model?
>> 
>> Mykyta Yevstifeyev
>> ...
> 
> I believe that while the link relation itself is not restricted to specific protocols, it still makes sense to explain how it should be used with HTTP URIs.

IN that sense, it might maybe generally be a good idea to say a word about how the rel relates to the various interactions semantics such as retrieval, submission or replacement found in different protocols.


Jan




> 
> Best regards, Julian
> _______________________________________________
> link-relations mailing list
> link-relations@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/link-relations


From ed.summers@gmail.com  Mon Sep 12 07:49:10 2011
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Hi Martin,

Thanks for writing about your annotation-server link relation proposal
[1]. I wonder, have you put any thought into how it could be used with
annotation services other than Annotea? I happen to be monitoring a
project called the Open Annotation Collaboration (OAC) [2]. I
forwarded your message on to them, and got an interesting response [3]
asking if 'annotation-server' could be used with annotation services
other than Annotea.

Could the media type could be used to distinguish different annotation
services? Or would different rel values be needed?

//Ed

[1] http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/link-relations/current/msg00281.ht=
ml
[2] http://www.openannotation.org/
[3] https://groups.google.com/d/msg/oac-discuss/pqoIDO9AjPE/grHEwLm8fZcJ

On Wed, Sep 7, 2011 at 9:43 PM, "Martin J. D=FCrst"
<duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp> wrote:
> Hello Mark, Eran, Julian,
>
> I just updated my http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-duerst-anno-link for t=
he
> "annotation-server" link relationship. I would like to get your (and
> everybody else's on this list) input on it. The registration template is =
as
> follows:
>
>>>>>>>>>
> =A0 Relation Name:
> =A0 =A0 =A0annotation-server
>
> =A0 Description:
> =A0 =A0 =A0Designates an annotation server used to store annotations
> =A0 =A0 =A0for the link's context.
>
> =A0 Reference:
> =A0 =A0 =A0RFC YYYY [RFC Editor: Please replace with actual RFC number.]
>
> =A0 Notes:
> =A0 =A0 =A0currently none
>
> =A0 Application Data:
> =A0 =A0 =A0currently none
> <<<<<<<<
>
> I don't think I'm on this list, so please keep me in the cc.
>
> Regards, =A0 =A0Martin.
> _______________________________________________
> link-relations mailing list
> link-relations@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/link-relations
>

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Cc: "link-relations@ietf.org" <link-relations@ietf.org>, apps-discuss@ietf.org, Maile Ohye <maileko@gmail.com>, draft-ohye-canonical-link-relation@tools.ietf.org
Subject: Re: [link-relations] [apps-discuss] Fwd: I-D Action: draft-ohye-canonical-link-relation-01.txt
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12.09.2011 15:59, Julian Reschke wrote:
> On 2011-09-12 14:55, Mykyta Yevstifeyev wrote:
>> Maile,
>>
>> Could you please justify why do you want to constrain the requirements
>> of your document with HTTP model?
>>
>> Mykyta Yevstifeyev
>> ...
>
> I believe that while the link relation itself is not restricted to 
> specific protocols, it still makes sense to explain how it should be 
> used with HTTP URIs.

There are plenty of other URI schemes, beyond 'http' and 'https', and I 
don't see reasons we may overlook them defining semantics for these two 
only.  Otherwise, the authors should have "The 'canonical' link relation 
type for 'http' and 'https' URIs" rather than "The 'canonical' link 
relation type" in the title.

BTW, there already is a -02 version: 
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ohye-canonical-link-relation-02.  
However, there are still the two places where some requirements are 
constrained by HTTP protocol:

>     o  A URI that serves a 4xx error code (Section 10.4 of [RFC2616]).

and

>     2.  Permanent HTTP redirects (Section 10.3.2 of [RFC2616]), the
>         traditional strong indicator that a URI's content has been
>         permanently moved, could not be implemented in place of the
>         canonical link relation.

And I still think this HTTP-centric approach is unacceptable.

Mykyta Yevstifeyev

>
> Best regards, Julian
>

