From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 1 20:03:02 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A1C03A690E; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:03:02 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72DA33A6887 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:03:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.019 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.019 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.491, BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fTXJ06hM08TF for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:02:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.194]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3FACB3A6BA6 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:02:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (scmse2 [133.2.253.17]) by scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1241oOV003264 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 13:01:50 +0900 (JST) Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 0389_37f32bdc_f0de_11dd_bb09_0019b9e2b3d9; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 13:01:50 +0900 Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:45512) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id for from ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:53:34 +0900 Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090202101632.06cd6a48@localhost> X-Sender: duerst@localhost X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2009 12:51:41 +0900 To: "Phillips, Addison" , Randy Presuhn From: Martin Duerst In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017D9B8AC7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.a mazon.com> References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017D9B8AC7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Cc: "ltru@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Hello Addison, Many thanks for your work. I have looked at the changes, see below for comments. At 03:59 09/01/31, Phillips, Addison wrote: >All, > >I have just posted a draft-21 editor's copy on Inter-Locale. This has NOT >been submitted to the IETF yet, per the co-chair's instructions. This >version incorporates a few errata but not yet the reference to the Awfully >New IPR RFC. > > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.html > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.xml I have looked at this and at the diff, and have run the idnits tool. However, we now have an informative reference in a normative sentence: E. UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section 4 of [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5. Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language tags. My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had the same idea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645], we would replace it inline with the only instance left, resulting in something like: E. The UN numeric code or ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code (once assigned) for the Channel Islands MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5 (for historic details, see [RFC4645]). Can you please make such an update to your staging draft, so that we are ready to move forward when the copyright issues are solved. [there won't be any need to include a reference to a new RFC, you will just have to choose the right boilerplate] BTW, the "local diff" link in your popup (the one going to http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/rfcdiff.pyht.htm) still shows the diff between -19 and -20. Regards, Martin. >Regards (for the editors) > >Addison > >Addison Phillips >Globalization Architect -- Lab126 > >Internationalization is not a feature. >It is an architecture. #-#-# Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University #-#-# http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 1 20:40:19 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5B2B43A6870; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:40:19 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 18D823A6870 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:40:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.586 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.586 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.013, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nCGCBHOcLK1T for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:40:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C208B3A67C1 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:40:16 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,363,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="214057994" Received: from smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.10.25]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 02 Feb 2009 04:39:55 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n124dpph003486 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 2 Feb 2009 04:39:53 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:39:51 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Martin Duerst , Randy Presuhn Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:39:49 -0800 Thread-Topic: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... Thread-Index: AcmE6vwH2IMOm2xwSMqjsqe4Y076lgABQRNA Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DA5EFC3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017D9B8AC7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090202101632.06cd6a48@localhost> In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.20.2.20090202101632.06cd6a48@localhost> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: "ltru@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Hello Martin, Thanks for the note. > However, we now have an informative reference in a normative > sentence: > > E. UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for > countries > or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section > 4 of > [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered > into > the IANA registry via the process described in Section > 3.5. > Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form > language > tags. This is why the reference *was* normative, nu? > > My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had > the same idea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645], > we would replace it inline with the only instance left, resulting > in something like: > > E. The UN numeric code or ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code (once > assigned) > for the Channel Islands MAY be entered into the IANA > registry > via the process described in Section 3.5 (for historic > details, see [RFC4645]). I will make this change and post it in the morning. > > [there won't be any need to include a reference to a new RFC, > you will just have to choose the right boilerplate] > > > BTW, the "local diff" link in your popup (the one going to > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/rfcdiff.pyht.htm) still shows > the diff between -19 and -20. Yes. I need to fix it. Addison Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Sun Feb 1 23:45:22 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EAF753A68A5; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 23:45:22 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9E0B93A68A5 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 23:45:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.949 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.949 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GOUo2ajT8znJ for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 23:45:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from hermes.insee.fr (hermes.insee.fr [194.254.38.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A67F3A6782 for ; Sun, 1 Feb 2009 23:45:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from evariste.insee.fr (unknown [194.254.38.143]) by hermes.insee.fr (Insee Mail server) with ESMTP id 70C855DC01C for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 08:44:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B1DE794020 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 08:44:59 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at insee.fr Received: from evariste.insee.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (evariste.insee.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pQGmuCP3EWat for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 08:44:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra (unknown [194.254.38.144]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5886979401E for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 08:44:59 +0100 (CET) Received: from S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra ([10.90.200.51]) by s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Mon, 2 Feb 2009 08:44:59 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 08:44:59 +0100 Message-ID: <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD09A9@S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 thread-index: AcmEp6m3G6p+w5xARSeuzEnTfj6GEAAYllag References: From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2009 07:44:59.0295 (UTC) FILETIME=[2625D2F0:01C9850A] Cc: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org I agree with the proposition of John Cowan and Doug Ewell. Cordialement. G=E9rard LANG = -----Message d'origine----- De : ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de ltr= u-request@ietf.org Envoy=E9 : dimanche 1 f=E9vrier 2009 21:00 =C0 : ltru@ietf.org Objet : Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 Send Ltru mailing list submissions to ltru@ietf.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ltru-request@ietf.org You can reach the person managing the list at ltru-owner@ietf.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "R= e: Contents of Ltru digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Preferred-Value for YU? (John Cowan) 2. Re: Preferred-Value for YU? (Doug Ewell) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 15:31:41 -0500 From: John Cowan Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? To: Doug Ewell Cc: LTRU Working Group Message-ID: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii Doug Ewell scripsit: > In draft-4645bis, should we modify the record for subtag YU by = > removing the P-V of CS, since CS is itself deprecated with no P-V? +1 for removing CS. I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, RS, or SI." -- = John Cowan cowan@ccil.org http://ccil.org/~cowan This great college [Trinity], of this ancient university [Cambridge], has s= een some strange sights. It has seen Wordsworth drunk and Porson sober. And= here am I, a better poet than Porson, and a better scholar than Wordsworth= , somewhere betwixt and between. --A.E. Housman ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 14:19:42 -0700 From: "Doug Ewell" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: <06ADC800716A4308B24580EA88C2B992@DGBP7M81> Content-Type: text/plain; format=3Dflowed; charset=3D"utf-8"; reply-type=3Doriginal John Cowan wrote: > +1 for removing CS. Two assenting voices on a Saturday afternoon and no dissenting voices is en= ough to make this minor change to the draft. There will presumably be lots= of time for dissenters to make themselves heard. > I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, RS, = > or SI." I can do this. I suppose the precedent of having to provide informative ma= ppings every time ISO 3166 countries split or merge has already been set by= the CS and GB comments. I imagine when as the Netherlands Antilles contin= ue to get their own 3166 codes, the Registry will be expected to provide th= is sort of mapping back to AN, and we may need to retrofit comments onto BL= and MF as well. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.= ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ? ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru End of Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 *********************************** _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 02:13:50 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B58703A68A6; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 02:13:50 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A33703A68CF for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 02:13:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id K+vGA1BCW58F for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 02:13:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from 145.nexbyte.net (145.nexbyte.net [62.197.41.145]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A8E33A6768 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 02:13:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from Vickynew ([213.208.115.6]) by 145.nexbyte.net with MailEnable ESMTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 10:13:22 +0000 From: "Debbie Garside" To: "'Doug Ewell'" , "'LTRU Working Group'" References: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org> <06ADC800716A4308B24580EA88C2B992@DGBP7M81> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:05:55 -0000 Message-ID: <07b401c9851d$da86e870$0300a8c0@Vickynew> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcmD6ddUyKI6N9uCRY2zRKJSnlheEQBMfiqQ In-Reply-To: <06ADC800716A4308B24580EA88C2B992@DGBP7M81> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3350 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2033492895==" Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org --===============2033492895== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Doug I am not sure that I like the thought of deleting historical = information. I do see where you are coming from but, nevertheless, are we going to be missing a link in the chain by deleting "CS" from "YU"? I hate deleting information from databases! :-) What I would like to see is information added to the PV field for "YU" ( such as ":2006-10-05") to indicate when "CS" became invalid as the PV. However, I am, assuming that this would entail an update to 4646bis and = is, therefore, unlikely to be incorporated at this time. I would ask that you be careful to not inadvertently delete some of the = dots that join the Registry. However, I cannot, on this fine, cold, soon to = be snowy, Monday morning, think of a valid reason why other than on = principle - I'll try another coffee and maybe write again. :-) +1 to adding John's comment though. Best Debbie -----Original Message----- From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of = Doug Ewell Sent: 31 January 2009 21:20 To: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? John Cowan wrote: > +1 for removing CS. Two assenting voices on a Saturday afternoon and no dissenting voices is = enough to make this minor change to the draft. There will presumably be = lots of time for dissenters to make themselves heard. > I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, RS,=20 > or SI." I can do this. I suppose the precedent of having to provide informative = mappings every time ISO 3166 countries split or merge has already been=20 set by the CS and GB comments. I imagine when as the Netherlands=20 Antilles continue to get their own 3166 codes, the Registry will be=20 expected to provide this sort of mapping back to AN, and we may need to=20 retrofit comments onto BL and MF as well. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages =88 _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG.=20 Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.16/1926 - Release Date: = 30/01/2009 17:31 =20 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG.=20 Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.16/1929 - Release Date: = 01/02/2009 18:02 =20 --===============2033492895== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --===============2033492895==-- From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 02:18:23 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DDE53A6862; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 02:18:23 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 168783A6862 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 02:18:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.598 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.598 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.999, BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HTML_FONT_SIZE_LARGE=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Io-Vw3mI0IrN for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 02:18:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from 145.nexbyte.net (145.nexbyte.net [62.197.41.145]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9D133A6768 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 02:18:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from Vickynew ([213.208.115.6]) by 145.nexbyte.net with MailEnable ESMTP; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 10:17:47 +0000 From: "Debbie Garside" To: "'Phillips, Addison'" , "'LTRU Working Group'" References: <41a006820901301006p2988f383lddd7c5fa37ad6798@mail.gmail.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017D9B89F8@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:10:24 -0000 Message-ID: <07ba01c9851e$77e94860$0300a8c0@Vickynew> MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcmDBYYY67MBVxKoQFmCRPQgztfa0wAABGUAAIYqhmA= In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017D9B89F8@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3350 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Lowercase language names and the Registry X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1277792486==" Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --===============1277792486== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_07BB_01C9851E.77E94860" This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_07BB_01C9851E.77E94860 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Addison wrote: =20 >> So=85 to be clear, I favor putting *exactly* what ISO 639 has into = the initial registry unless it conflicts with a specific provision of = 4646bis =20 +1 =20 Debbie =20 =20 _____ =20 From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Phillips, Addison Sent: 30 January 2009 18:15 To: Gerard Meijssen; CE Whitehead Cc: ltru@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Lowercase language names and the Registry =20 The RFC says quite clearly that the =91Description=92 fields in the = registry exist only to provide for unambiguous identification of subtag meaning. = They should not be taken to be the localized name or in any particular = language. Mainly the registry mirrors whatever one of the ISO groups has put into their standards. 4646bis allows for some cleanup/editing by the LSR in = cases where the name has some sort of formatting problem (hence Doug=92s = inquiry). This is different from the goals of CLDR. People can and should rely on = CLDR to be correct in presentation. But we have already warned users NOT to = rely on the description fields in the registry. =20 Note that the registration process exists to allow users of the registry = to correct or add additional descriptive material. My tendency is to favor mirroring exactly what ISO 639 has in the =93initial=94 registry. If = someone feels strongly about it, they can petition ietf-languages@ to change it. That=92s what the process is for and I would tend to support corrections = that native language speakers feel strongly about. =20 So=85 to be clear, I favor putting *exactly* what ISO 639 has into the = initial registry unless it conflicts with a specific provision of 4646bis. =20 Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 =20 Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. =20 From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Gerard Meijssen Sent: Friday, January 30, 2009 10:07 AM To: CE Whitehead Cc: ltru@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Lowercase language names and the Registry =20 Hoi, If the list is ony to be used as a list with a local application, I = agree. When people want to use lists like this or the CLDR language list, they depend on the information to be right. It is not and people do. Thanks, Gerard 2009/1/30 CE Whitehead Hi. I think Leif and Doug get my vote here. =20 In a list I'd feel comfortable 'title-casing' the first word in French = (a language in which language names are also normally 'lower-cased'). But I'm not a native speaker. =20 =20 (NOTE: I found different conventions regarding titles online: HYPERLINK "http://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3Dhistoire+du+francais&btnG=3DSea= rch" \nhttp://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3Dhistoire+du+francais&btnG=3DSe= arch=20 HYPERLINK = "http://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3Dfrancais&btnG=3DSearch" \nhttp://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3Dfrancais&btnG=3DSearch [these = are not lists however, just titles]. when a French title appears on a book in the U.S. market, every word on = the book may be title-cased: HYPERLINK "http://shopping.msn.com/prices/allons-y-le-francais-par-etapes-with-audi= o-c d/itemid25043275/?itemtext=3Ditemname:allons-y-le-francais-par-etapes-wit= h-aud io-cd" \nhttp://shopping.msn.com/prices/allons-y-le-francais-par-etapes-with-aud= io- cd/itemid25043275/?itemtext=3Ditemname:allons-y-le-francais-par-etapes-wi= th-au dio-cd=20 Wikipedia has two conventions for lists in French it seems?: HYPERLINK "http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_de_langues_par_ordre_alphab%C3%A9tiqu= e" \nhttp://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_de_langues_par_ordre_alphab%C3%A9tiq= ue HYPERLINK "http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_des_langues_officielles" \nhttp://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_des_langues_officielles =20 in one the first word, whether the language name or a definite article preceding the name, is 'upper cased'; in the other list the names are = almost all 'lower cased') =20 =20 Thanks. =20 --C. E. Whitehead HYPERLINK "mailto:cewcathar@hotmail.com" \ncewcathar@hotmail.com=20 =20 =20 =20 From: Leif Halvard Silli =20 To: Doug Ewell Doug Ewell 2009-01-30 07.08: So far so good, but then the January 26 revision came along and = lowercased the Finnish and Swedish names, as the requestor originally suggested = (see HYPERLINK "http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2008-028.pdf" \nhttp://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2008-028.pdf):=20 =20 Finland-Swedish Sign Language finlandssvenskt teckenspr=E5k suomenruotsalainen viittomakieli [...] =20 I propose that for draft-4645bis and the Language Subtag Registry = generally, we introduce a rule that Description fields for language subtags be = modified from the ISO-provided name if necessary to ensure they begin with a = capital letter, unless the lowercase letter is considered necessary to spell the name correctly (as it is in "tlhIngan-Hol"). This is consistent with draft-4646bis, Section 3.1.5, which allows Description fields to be = "edited or modified" from the ISO rendering.=20 =20 Unless someone objects on-list to this rather pedantic suggestion, it = will be added to the next draft-4645bis.=20 In my view it is defendable to let language names begin with upper-case letter even in Scandinavian languages, as long as the names appears in a list -aka "menu" - as opposed to in a comma separated line of words. = Hence, I'm ok with it.=20 =20 -- leif halvard silli _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list HYPERLINK "mailto:Ltru@ietf.org"Ltru@ietf.org HYPERLINK "https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru" \nhttps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru =20 No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.15/1924 - Release Date: = 29/01/2009 17:57 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG.=20 Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.16/1929 - Release Date: = 01/02/2009 18:02 =20 ------=_NextPart_000_07BB_01C9851E.77E94860 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Addison wrote:

 

>> So… to be clear, I favor putting *exactly* what ISO 639 has into the initial registry = unless it conflicts with a specific provision of = 4646bis

 <= /o:p>

+1

 <= /o:p>

Debbie

 

 

From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Phillips, Addison
Sent: 30 January 2009 = 18:15
To: Gerard Meijssen; CE = Whitehead
Cc: ltru@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Ltru] = Lowercase language names and the Registry

 

The RFC = says quite clearly that the ‘Description’ fields in the registry exist = only to provide for unambiguous identification of subtag meaning. They should not be taken = to be the localized name or in any particular language. Mainly the registry = mirrors whatever one of the ISO groups has put into their standards. 4646bis = allows for some cleanup/editing by the LSR in cases where the name has some sort of formatting problem (hence Doug’s inquiry). This is different from = the goals of CLDR. People can and should rely on CLDR to be correct in presentation. = But we have already warned users NOT to rely on the description fields in the registry.

 <= /o:p>

Note that = the registration process exists to allow users of the registry to correct or = add additional descriptive material. My tendency is to favor mirroring = exactly what ISO 639 has in the “initial” registry. If someone feels = strongly about it, they can petition ietf-languages@ to change it. That’s what the process = is for and I would tend to support corrections that native language speakers feel = strongly about.

 <= /o:p>

So… = to be clear, I favor putting *exactly* = what ISO 639 has into the initial registry unless it conflicts with a specific = provision of 4646bis.

 <= /o:p>

Addison Phillips

Globalization Architect -- Lab126

 

Internationalization is not a feature.

It is an architecture.

 <= /o:p>

From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Gerard Meijssen
Sent: Friday, January 30, = 2009 10:07 AM
To: CE Whitehead
Cc: ltru@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Ltru] = Lowercase language names and the Registry

 

Hoi,
If the list is ony to be used as a list with a local application, I = agree. When people want to use lists like this or the CLDR language list, they = depend on the information to be right. It is not and people do.
Thanks,
       Gerard

2009/1/30 CE Whitehead <cewcathar@hotmail.com><= /o:p>


Hi.  I think Leif and Doug get my vote here.
 

In a list I'd feel =
comfortable 'title-casing' the first word in French (a language in which =
language names are also normally =
'lower-cased').
But I'm not a native =
speaker.  
 
(NOTE:  I found =
different conventions regarding titles =
online:
http://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3D=
histoire+du+francais&btnG=3DSearch =

http://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3D=
francais&btnG=3DSearch [these are not lists =
however, just titles].
when a French title appears =
on a book in the U.S. =
market, every word on the book may be =
title-cased:
http://shopping.msn.com/prices/allons-y-le-fr=
ancais-par-etapes-with-audio-cd/itemid25043275/?itemtext=3Ditemname:allon=
s-y-le-francais-par-etapes-with-audio-cd 
Wikipedia has two =
conventions for lists in French it =
seems?:
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_de_langues_par_ordre=
_alphab%C3%A9tique
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_des_langues_officiel=
les
 
in one the first word, =
whether the language name or a definite article preceding the name, is =
'upper cased'; in the other list the names are almost all 'lower =
cased')
 
 
Thanks.
 
--C. E. =
Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com 




 


 

 

From: Leif Halvard Silli <lhs at malform.no>
To: Doug Ewell <doug at ewellic.org> 

Doug Ewell 2009-01-30 =
07.08:

So far so good, but then the January 26 revision came along and lowercased the Finnish and Swedish names, as the requestor originally = suggested (see http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2008-028.pdf):= 

 
   Finland-Swedish Sign =
Language
   finlandssvenskt =
teckenspr=E5k
   suomenruotsalainen =
viittomakieli
   =
[...]
 

I propose that for draft-4645bis and the Language Subtag = Registry generally, we introduce a rule that Description fields for language = subtags be modified from the ISO-provided name if necessary to ensure they begin = with a capital letter, unless the lowercase letter is considered necessary to = spell the name correctly (as it is in "tlhIngan-Hol"). This is = consistent with draft-4646bis, Section 3.1.5, which allows Description fields to be "edited or modified" from the ISO rendering. = 

 

Unless someone objects on-list to this rather pedantic = suggestion, it will be added to the next draft-4645bis. =

In my view it is defendable to let language names begin with = upper-case letter even in Scandinavian languages, as long as the names appears in a = list -aka "menu" - as opposed to in a comma separated line of = words. Hence, I'm ok with it. 

 
--
leif =
halvard silli


_______________________________________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru

 


No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.15/1924 - Release Date: = 29/01/2009 17:57


No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG.
Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.16/1929 - Release Date: = 01/02/2009 18:02

------=_NextPart_000_07BB_01C9851E.77E94860-- --===============1277792486== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --===============1277792486==-- From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 07:54:13 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85A0C3A69F8; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 07:54:13 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A99903A69F8 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 07:54:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.208 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.208 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.232, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id F3FaRD8bSGqS for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 07:54:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-gx0-f21.google.com (mail-gx0-f21.google.com [209.85.217.21]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B20F93A68AC for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 07:54:11 -0800 (PST) Received: by gxk14 with SMTP id 14so1210308gxk.13 for ; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 07:53:51 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=L+ScYZT+1DuT2l2e+dfsYmo0TvZBrZS25dC6nTZQfrQ=; b=TPDpVFgabdRY/A4CXMlaQPgXAxakMj8mcpxUt0+johUzjRzG8pTtHLmbxdHk4IRPTH IzeLapZgvE0O8AlTD77LdSs5GbyY6Mnp72hQOlWKvmjZwg5j0FXD+RocZn9YusuzB8Ad ud8/+kd5Nljmar7ZWeVRhJ0gUnhKfWNMdqLxY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=rR2xs39NeWV7kuwtatdfDn8b+luD1nbNQ3AA3ggQtf9ZFowV7fUBYr8s/t8pa//T+F q8whRm9jkF7aqSw8zJFPDzUaAamuAjwh2PHQOZgmL6L3aqg96G7kulgdTQbwHfLAQ495 Y0ouaF6lVIWoK//y8I+oRB80fsScf4O4OO1Bc= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.132.2 with SMTP id f2mr1906723wfd.216.1233590031012; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 07:53:51 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org> References: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 07:53:50 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: a97bf809cce7206e Message-ID: <30b660a20902020753w5630db87u9d63bf55b480d2ad@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: John Cowan Cc: LTRU Working Group , Doug Ewell Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0331595254==" Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org --===============0331595254== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd179c498d4400461f18fa8 --000e0cd179c498d4400461f18fa8 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I agree about the comment. (Ideally we'd do the same for the other cases like that.) Mark On Sat, Jan 31, 2009 at 12:31, John Cowan wrote: > Doug Ewell scripsit: > > > In draft-4645bis, should we modify the record for subtag YU by removing > > the P-V of CS, since CS is itself deprecated with no P-V? > > +1 for removing CS. > > I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, RS, or > SI." > > -- > John Cowan cowan@ccil.org http://ccil.org/~cowan > This great college [Trinity], of this ancient university [Cambridge], > has seen some strange sights. It has seen Wordsworth drunk and Porson > sober. And here am I, a better poet than Porson, and a better scholar > than Wordsworth, somewhere betwixt and between. --A.E. Housman > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > --000e0cd179c498d4400461f18fa8 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree about the comment. (Ideally we'd do the same for the other case= s like that.)

Mark


On Sat, Jan 31, 2009 at 12:31, John Cowa= n <cowan@ccil.org> wrote:
Doug Ewell scripsit:

> In draft-4645bis, should we modify the record for subtag YU by removin= g
> the P-V of CS, since CS is itself deprecated with no P-V?

+1 for removing CS.

I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, R= S, or SI."

--
John Cowan    cowan@ccil.org    http:= //ccil.org/~cowan
This great college [Trinity], of this ancient university [Cambridge],
has seen some strange sights. It has seen Wordsworth drunk and Porson
sober. And here am I, a better poet than Porson, and a better scholar
than Wordsworth, somewhere betwixt and between.  --A.E. Housman
______________________________= _________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru

--000e0cd179c498d4400461f18fa8-- --===============0331595254== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --===============0331595254==-- From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 10:38:39 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 285543A6BAC; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:38:39 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96E1D3A6BAC for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:38:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.584 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.584 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.586, BAYES_50=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id j-I9XQOX0Db5 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:38:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from blu0-omc3-s19.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s19.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.94]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1115A3A6ABD for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:38:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from BLU109-W4 ([65.55.116.74]) by blu0-omc3-s19.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:38:08 -0800 Message-ID: X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11] From: CE Whitehead To: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 13:38:07 -0500 Importance: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 02 Feb 2009 18:38:08.0375 (UTC) FILETIME=[64A8E070:01C98565] Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2104163888==" Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org --===============2104163888== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_e704e503-30a1-4622-91d9-d7b46504bf8b_" --_e704e503-30a1-4622-91d9-d7b46504bf8b_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Addison=3B Are we taking substantial editorial corrections yet? Or are we = waiting for the copyright work around? =20 If we are taking substantial changes=2C I have one (I also have a few glari= ng typos): =20 http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt4.1.1 par 5=2C= last sentence { ORIGINAL TEXT } "For example=2C Romanian ('ro') and Mold= avian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage=2C but are far more closely rel= ated to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') =2C which do sha= re a macrolanguage." {! COMMENT: the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the subt= ags has now been deprecated=3B 'pes' and 'prs'=2C Eastern (Dari) and Wester= n Farsi=2C would be better examples I think} =20 Thanks. =20 --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com = --_e704e503-30a1-4622-91d9-d7b46504bf8b_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Addison=3B Are we taking substantial editorial =3Bcorrections yet? = =3B Or are we waiting for the copyright work around?
 =3B
If we are taking substantial changes=2C I have one (I also have a few glari= ng typos):
 =3B
http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt=

4.1.1 par 5=2C last sentence
 =3B
{ ORIGINAL TEXT } =3B
"For example=2C Romanian ('ro') and
 =3B =3B Molda= vian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage=2C but are far more
 =3B&nb= sp=3B closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') = =2C
 =3B =3B which do share a macrolanguage."

{! COMMENT: =3B the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of t= he subtags has now been deprecated=3B 'pes' and 'prs'=2C Eastern (Dari)&nbs= p=3Band Western Farsi=2C =3Bwould be better examples I think}
 =3B
Thanks.
 =3B
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com

= = --_e704e503-30a1-4622-91d9-d7b46504bf8b_-- --===============2104163888== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --===============2104163888==-- From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 12:26:56 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4342B3A6965; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:26:56 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D44AA3A6825 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:26:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.977 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.977 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.775, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id n34cm5Gw6gpZ for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:26:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.213]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A87F828C193 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:26:47 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:32817 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LU5Mo-0001kL-6k; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 21:26:04 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2009 21:25:52 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: CE Whitehead , Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... Thread-Index: AcmFdHFHjFk2U6GSfkuUwJ3EW7y1Tg== In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LU5Mo-0001kL-6k. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net 1LU5Mo-0001kL-6k 2f254cd00598146a115130f9a9c07171 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1318137208==" Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org > Detta meddelande r i MIME-format. P grund av att din e-postlsare inte frstr detta format, kommer hela eller delar av detta meddelande inte att vara lsbart. --===============1318137208== Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3316454762_136199442" > Detta meddelande r i MIME-format. P grund av att din e-postlsare inte frstr detta format, kommer hela eller delar av detta meddelande inte att vara lsbart. --B_3316454762_136199442 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Well, no, because pes and prs already share a macrolanguage, namely fas. See http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/macrolanguages.asp (as well as our own draft registry update). But I agree that the example you point at is no longer a good one. I can't really give another example (but I wonder how closely related the Frisian languages are, but they don't share a macrolanguage code...) /kent k Den 2009-02-02 19.38, skrev "CE Whitehead" : > Addison; Are we taking substantial editorial corrections yet? Or are we > waiting for the copyright work around? > > If we are taking substantial changes, I have one (I also have a few glaring > typos): > > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt > > 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and > Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far more > closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') , > which do share a macrolanguage." > > {! COMMENT: the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the subtags > has now been deprecated; 'pes' and 'prs', Eastern (Dari) and Western Farsi, > would be better examples I think} > > Thanks. > > --C. E. Whitehead > cewcathar@hotmail.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --B_3316454762_136199442 Content-type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... Well, no, because pes and prs already share a macrolanguage, namely fas. S= ee http://www.sil.o= rg/iso639-3/macrolanguages.asp (as well as our own draft registry update= ).

But I agree that the example you point at is no longer a good one. I can't = really give another example (but I wonder how closely related the Frisian la= nguages are, but they don't share a macrolanguage code...)

    /kent k



Den 2009-02-02 19.38, skrev "CE Whitehead" <cewcathar@hotmail.com>:

Addison; Are we taking substantial editori= al corrections yet?  Or are we waiting for the copyright work around?  
If we are taking substantial changes, I have one (I also have a few glaring= typos):
 
htt= p://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt

4.1.1 par 5, last sentence
 
{ ORIGINAL TEXT }
 
"For example, Romanian ('ro') and
   Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are fa= r more
   closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and = Wu ('wuu') ,
   which do share a macrolanguage."

{! COMMENT:  the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the= subtags has now been deprecated; 'pes' and 'prs', Eastern (Dari) and Wester= n Farsi, would be better examples I think}
 
Thanks.
 
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com


__________________________= _____________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/m= ailman/listinfo/ltru
--B_3316454762_136199442-- --===============1318137208== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --===============1318137208==-- From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 12:38:56 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58B063A6933; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:38:56 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5933F3A6825 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:38:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.743 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.743 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.744, BAYES_50=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fjuQGY+YCWEe for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:38:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47C053A6933 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:38:53 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=T/qpSsI3Qtf01kD3O4HMixiTlsroxKLP8IEDn9/4jNPT8HClOqN+8oYwH72Nh70K; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.166.188.94] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LU5Yw-0007MC-1a for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 15:38:34 -0500 Message-ID: <006601c98576$c5d9f300$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org> <30b660a20902020753w5630db87u9d63bf55b480d2ad@mail.gmail.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:42:31 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1733b4533b7fee3894296a1d99826f923e9350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.166.188.94 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Hi - As co-chair - I'd strongly prefer that "adjustments" to specific entries be handled on ietf-languages@iana.org rather than in the ltru WG. My reasoning: (1) It's time to finish gilding this lily. (2) The division of labor between the two groups gives questions of form and process to ltru, and of content to ietf-languages. The ONLY reason for "tweaking" an entry *here* that I could support on this list at this time is that our processes would not permit the change to be made via ietf-languages@iana.org. Randy > From: "Mark Davis" > To: "John Cowan" > Cc: "LTRU Working Group" ; "Doug Ewell" > Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 7:53 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? > > I agree about the comment. (Ideally we'd do the same for the other cases > like that.) > > Mark > > > On Sat, Jan 31, 2009 at 12:31, John Cowan wrote: > > > Doug Ewell scripsit: > > > > > In draft-4645bis, should we modify the record for subtag YU by removing > > > the P-V of CS, since CS is itself deprecated with no P-V? > > > > +1 for removing CS. > > > > I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, RS, or > > SI." > > > > -- > > John Cowan cowan@ccil.org http://ccil.org/~cowan > > This great college [Trinity], of this ancient university [Cambridge], > > has seen some strange sights. It has seen Wordsworth drunk and Porson > > sober. And here am I, a better poet than Porson, and a better scholar > > than Wordsworth, somewhere betwixt and between. --A.E. Housman > > _______________________________________________ > > Ltru mailing list > > Ltru@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 12:47:39 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 154DD28C1CC; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:47:39 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4496C28C233 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:47:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.996 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.996 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.603, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HJsVEhCFgNcK for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:47:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 394243A693A for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:47:37 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=jaiCnMUYdiexaHu7lpvi0qinRokrk7DMEMpakklCp3bgKO4x2SQTsYRvaKCNa5bg; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.166.188.94] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LU5hN-0004zs-UL for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 15:47:18 -0500 Message-ID: <009a01c98577$fe44e460$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:51:15 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173f8b3a14afab99768d305c4cad2f7d209350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.166.188.94 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Hi - As a technical contributor... Although the Romanian / Moldavian case has been overtaken by events, it still makes the point effectively. It's probably the most widely-known and least-contested such case. Consequently, I'd prefer leaving the text as-is. Randy > From: "Kent Karlsson" > To: "CE Whitehead" ; > Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 12:25 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... > > Well, no, because pes and prs already share a macrolanguage, namely fas. See > http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/macrolanguages.asp (as well as our own draft > registry update). > > But I agree that the example you point at is no longer a good one. I can't > really give another example (but I wonder how closely related the Frisian > languages are, but they don't share a macrolanguage code...) > > /kent k > > > > Den 2009-02-02 19.38, skrev "CE Whitehead" : > > > Addison; Are we taking substantial editorial corrections yet? Or are we > > waiting for the copyright work around? > > > > If we are taking substantial changes, I have one (I also have a few glaring > > typos): > > > > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt > > > > 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence > > > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > > > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and > > Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far more > > closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') , > > which do share a macrolanguage." > > > > {! COMMENT: the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the subtags > > has now been deprecated; 'pes' and 'prs', Eastern (Dari) and Western Farsi, > > would be better examples I think} > > > > Thanks. > > > > --C. E. Whitehead > > cewcathar@hotmail.com > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ltru mailing list > > Ltru@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 12:50:22 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7211228C233; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:50:22 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB92928C233 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:50:20 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.188 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.188 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.212, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 99j7BcErCv6i for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:50:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.175]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ECE5128C1CC for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:50:19 -0800 (PST) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so1873850wfd.31 for ; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 12:50:00 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=OUnZDdzecWgmfmyXqxhcNnQP/+8v7iEPPdh0Vk4pbJk=; b=E0151u6az9F5uEifrrBcqcgJGHJnmx5HoQXMD9AKyD0U2GVv5BsKxMHGV08ENFcR65 3kD7hXK75Fd4izYr8AFhCXXABOBAyTG5uASE3+Rt1w/g1MMU0sFFXd2CXJQmB31AdAzR Mn0g4rOHjMOhaxGvvEx6XbJjn+I3DhScsLWt4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=N5yGjWpTRQo/0GyMZIaTL/Zhp+oLJW8rDrOUX9lHQsBrjK/hMi3YToU5QCpjCL/t/V lNhwgPudzCwF1nWps3X62oWucox3bH7Vu6sNr/uKS4mc8Tx0m/UbqMY404eyBPJbYtiI gZjBIUvqYAA1ujvxxaMR4hwNePzzeT61kayCs= MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.142.80.7 with SMTP id d7mr1982429wfb.64.1233607799444; Mon, 02 Feb 2009 12:49:59 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <009a01c98577$fe44e460$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> References: <009a01c98577$fe44e460$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:49:59 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: fc0ca4e3b14892b3 Message-ID: <30b660a20902021249k354e398bt632e896886054582@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: Randy Presuhn Cc: ltru@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1906455782==" Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org --===============1906455782== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636ed6808ad94230461f5b214 --001636ed6808ad94230461f5b214 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit me too Mark On Mon, Feb 2, 2009 at 12:51, Randy Presuhn wrote: > Hi - > > As a technical contributor... > > Although the Romanian / Moldavian case has been overtaken by > events, it still makes the point effectively. It's probably the most > widely-known > and least-contested such case. Consequently, I'd prefer leaving the > text as-is. > > Randy > > > From: "Kent Karlsson" > > To: "CE Whitehead" ; > > Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 12:25 PM > > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... > > > > Well, no, because pes and prs already share a macrolanguage, namely fas. > See > > http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/macrolanguages.asp (as well as our own draft > > registry update). > > > > But I agree that the example you point at is no longer a good one. I > can't > > really give another example (but I wonder how closely related the Frisian > > languages are, but they don't share a macrolanguage code...) > > > > /kent k > > > > > > > > Den 2009-02-02 19.38, skrev "CE Whitehead" : > > > > > Addison; Are we taking substantial editorial corrections yet? Or are > we > > > waiting for the copyright work around? > > > > > > If we are taking substantial changes, I have one (I also have a few > glaring > > > typos): > > > > > > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt > > > > > > 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence > > > > > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > > > > > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and > > > Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far more > > > closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') > , > > > which do share a macrolanguage." > > > > > > {! COMMENT: the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the > subtags > > > has now been deprecated; 'pes' and 'prs', Eastern (Dari) and Western > Farsi, > > > would be better examples I think} > > > > > > Thanks. > > > > > > --C. E. Whitehead > > > cewcathar@hotmail.com > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Ltru mailing list > > > Ltru@ietf.org > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ltru mailing list > > Ltru@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > --001636ed6808ad94230461f5b214 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable me too

Mark


On Mon, Feb 2, 2009 at 12:51, Randy Pres= uhn <r= andy_presuhn@mindspring.com> wrote:
Hi -

As a technical contributor...

Although the Romanian / Moldavian case has been overtaken by
events, it still makes the point effectively.  It's probably the m= ost widely-known
and least-contested such case.  Consequently, I'd prefer leaving t= he
text as-is.

Randy

> From: "Kent Karlsson" <kent.karlsson14@comhem.se>
> To: "CE Whitehead" <cewcathar@hotmail.com>; <ltr= u@ietf.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 12:25 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated...
>
> Well, no, because pes and prs already share a macrolanguage, namely fa= s. See
> http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/macrolanguages.asp (as well as our o= wn draft
> registry update).
>
> But I agree that the example you point at is no longer a good one. I c= an't
> really give another example (but I wonder how closely related the Fris= ian
> languages are, but they don't share a macrolanguage code...)
>
>     /kent k
>
>
>
> Den 2009-02-02 19.38, skrev "CE Whitehead" <cewcathar@hotmail.com>:
>
> > Addison; Are we taking substantial editorial corrections yet? &nb= sp;Or are we
> > waiting for the copyright work around?
> >
> > If we are taking substantial changes, I have one (I also have a f= ew glaring
> > typos):
> >
> > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4= 646bis-21.txt
> >
> > 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence
> >
> > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> >
> > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and
> >    Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguag= e, but are far more
> >    closely related to each other than Cantonese ('y= ue') and Wu ('wuu') ,
> >    which do share a macrolanguage."
> >
> > {! COMMENT:  the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as = one of the subtags
> > has now been deprecated; 'pes' and 'prs', Eastern= (Dari) and Western Farsi,
> > would be better examples I think}
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > --C. E. Whitehead
> > cewcathar@hotmail.com
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ltru mailing list
> > Ltru@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>
>


---------------------------------------------------------------= -----------------


> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

_______________________________________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru

--001636ed6808ad94230461f5b214-- --===============1906455782== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --===============1906455782==-- From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 12:58:12 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F016228C249; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:58:12 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0EC03A67CF for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:58:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.669 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.669 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.070, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0i08EhuqcHbo for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:58:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B83F3A696B for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:58:10 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,367,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="183404127" Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 02 Feb 2009 20:57:41 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n12Kvd9f004392 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 2 Feb 2009 20:57:40 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:57:39 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 12:57:37 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? Thread-Index: AcmFdjscLu0hqu//Q0iZL3lfDSbUAAAAQ6PA Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DA5F7AB@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org> <30b660a20902020753w5630db87u9d63bf55b480d2ad@mail.gmail.com> <006601c98576$c5d9f300$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <006601c98576$c5d9f300$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org (as a contributor) Sadly, while I agree with Randy, a brief review suggests a problem. First, I agree that, since 'YU' is already in the registry, there is no reason why LTRU even *should* consider changing 4645bis. There is an extant registration process and it covers addition of comments, preferred-values, and such. However, 4646 clearly states that YU->CS cannot be changed at present. Section 3.1 says: -- The field 'Preferred-Value' MUST NOT be modified once created in the registry. -- I notice, however, that there may be a consistency problem in Section 3.1.7 of 4646bis-21, though. Specifically, it allows (MAY) a Preferred-Value to "migrate forward". But then uses perhaps-inappropriate normative language in the example covering regions: -- Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferred-Value for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'. -- LTRU made this change to avoid "chaining" of preferred-values in the future. But it looks inconsistent as written. Probably the first "MAY" should be changed to read "Changes to one subtag sometimes affects other subtags as well". Addison Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. > -----Original Message----- > From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf Of Randy Presuhn > Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 12:43 PM > To: LTRU Working Group > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? > > Hi - > > As co-chair - > I'd strongly prefer that "adjustments" to specific entries be > handled > on ietf-languages@iana.org rather than in the ltru WG. My > reasoning: > (1) It's time to finish gilding this lily. > (2) The division of labor between the two groups gives questions > of > form and process to ltru, and of content to ietf-languages. > > The ONLY reason for "tweaking" an entry *here* that I could support > on > this list at this time is that our processes would not permit the > change > to be made via ietf-languages@iana.org. > > Randy > > > From: "Mark Davis" > > To: "John Cowan" > > Cc: "LTRU Working Group" ; "Doug Ewell" > > > Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 7:53 AM > > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? > > > > I agree about the comment. (Ideally we'd do the same for the > other cases > > like that.) > > > > Mark > > > > > > On Sat, Jan 31, 2009 at 12:31, John Cowan wrote: > > > > > Doug Ewell scripsit: > > > > > > > In draft-4645bis, should we modify the record for subtag YU > by removing > > > > the P-V of CS, since CS is itself deprecated with no P-V? > > > > > > +1 for removing CS. > > > > > > I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, > RS, or > > > SI." > > > > > > -- > > > John Cowan cowan@ccil.org > http://ccil.org/~cowan > > > This great college [Trinity], of this ancient university > [Cambridge], > > > has seen some strange sights. It has seen Wordsworth drunk and > Porson > > > sober. And here am I, a better poet than Porson, and a better > scholar > > > than Wordsworth, somewhere betwixt and between. --A.E. Housman > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Ltru mailing list > > > Ltru@ietf.org > > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ltru mailing list > > Ltru@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 15:45:04 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BB2728C163; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 15:45:04 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@ietf.org Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 100003A6AAF; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 15:45:01 -0800 (PST) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20090202234502.100003A6AAF@core3.amsl.com> Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 15:45:02 -0800 (PST) Cc: ltru@ietf.org Subject: [Ltru] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-09.txt X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Language Tag Registry Update Working Group of the IETF. Title : Update to the Language Subtag Registry Author(s) : D. Ewell Filename : draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-09.txt Pages : 950 Date : 2009-2-2 This memo defines the procedure used to update the IANA Language Subtag Registry in conjunction with the publication of RFC 4646bis [RFC EDITOR NOTE: replace with actual RFC number], for use in forming tags for identifying languages. As an Internet-Draft, it also contained a complete replacement of the contents of the Registry to be used by IANA in updating it. To prevent confusion, this material was removed before publication. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-09.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-09.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2009-2-2154358.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --NextPart-- From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 18:59:44 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A22128C127; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 18:59:44 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C77483A6BDE for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 18:59:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.83 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.83 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.768, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dXLdbF3hQQOO for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 18:59:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from blu0-omc3-s18.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s18.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57B5B3A6BE0 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 18:59:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from BLU109-W18 ([65.55.116.72]) by blu0-omc3-s18.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Mon, 2 Feb 2009 18:59:20 -0800 Message-ID: X-Originating-IP: [70.88.11.82] From: CE Whitehead To: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 21:59:19 -0500 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: References: MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2009 02:59:20.0373 (UTC) FILETIME=[68F79E50:01C985AB] Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0288220800==" Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org --===============0288220800== Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_30dfa60b-f7fd-46de-96d1-a77688544d79_" --_30dfa60b-f7fd-46de-96d1-a77688544d79_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi=2C Kent=2C Sorry my mistake=3B [prs] and [pes] are subsumed by the macro-language [fa]= . I understand from Ethnologue that the Frisian languages are not always mutually comprehensible (http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=3Dfrs)=2C but yes=2C [frr](Northern Frisian) and [frs] (Eastern Frisian) do not share a macro-la= nguage. =20 What about Occitan/Provencal (oc) and Catalan (ca)? =20 The word=2C 'Adeu=2C' is almost the same in both. =20 =20 Type: language Subtag: oc Description: Occitan (post 1500) Added: 2005-10-16 Type: language Subtag: ca Description: Catalan Description: Valencian Added: 2005-10-16 Suppress-Script: Latn http://www.ethnologue.com/show_family.asp?subid=3D90062 http://oc.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occitan http://www.june29.com/HLP/lang/Catalan/webcat4.html To me the texts in Catalan and Provencal/Occitan are mostly mutually compre= hensible. Adeu is about the same in both According to the forums at wordreference http://forum.wordreference.com/showthread.php?t=3D446943 they are more or less intelligible--not a written match however like [ro] a= nd [mo] or [pes] and [prs] --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com=20 Date: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 21:25:52 +0100 From: kent.karlsson14@comhem.se To: cewcathar@hotmail.com=3B ltru@ietf.org > Well=2C no=2C because pes and prs already share a macrolanguage=2C namely= fas. See http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/macrolanguages.asp (as well as our ow= n draft registry=20 > update). > But I agree that the example you point at is no longer a good one. I can'= t really give another example (but I wonder how closely related the Frisian= languages are=2C but=20 > they don't share a macrolanguage code...) /kent k Den 2009-02-02 19.38=2C skrev "CE Whitehead" : >> Addison=3B Are we taking substantial editorial corrections yet? Or are = we waiting for the copyright work around? =20 >> If we are taking substantial changes=2C I have one (I also have a few gl= aring typos): =20 >> http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt >> 4.1.1 par 5=2C last sentence =20 { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 >> "For example=2C Romanian ('ro') and Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage=2C but are far more closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') =2C which do share a macrolanguage." >> {! COMMENT: the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the s= ubtags has now been deprecated=3B 'pes' and 'prs'=2C Eastern (Dari) and Wes= tern Farsi=2C would be better examples I think} =20 >> --C. E. Whitehead >> cewcathar@hotmail.com=20 --_30dfa60b-f7fd-46de-96d1-a77688544d79_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi=2C Kent=2C
Sorry my mistake=3B [prs] and [pes] are subsumed by the ma= cro-language [fa].

I understand from Ethnologue =3Bthat the Frisian languages are not always mutually comprehensible (http://www.ethnologue.com/show_language.asp?code=3Dfrs)=2C but yes=2C
[= frr](Northern Frisian) and [frs] (Eastern Frisian) do not share a macro-lan= guage.

 =3B
What about Occitan/Provencal (oc) and Catalan (ca)?
 =3B
The word=2C 'Adeu=2C' is almost the same in both.
 =3B
 =3B
Type: language
Subtag: oc
Description: Occitan (post 1500)
Added: = 2005-10-16
Type: language
Subtag: ca
Description: Catalan
Description: Valenc= ian
Added: 2005-10-16

Suppress-Script: Latn
http://= www.ethnologue.com/show_family.asp?subid=3D90062
http://oc.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occitan
http://www.june29.com/HLP/lang/Cata= lan/webcat4.html
To me the texts in Catalan and Provencal/Occitan are mo= stly mutually comprehensible.
Adeu is about the same in both

Acco= rding to the forums at wordreference
http://forum.wordreference.com/show= thread.php?t=3D446943
they are more or less intelligible--not a written = match however like [ro] and [mo] or [pes] and [prs]

--C. E. Whitehea= d
cewcathar@hotmail.com



Date: Mon=2C 2 Feb 2009 21:25:52 +0100

From: kent.karlsson14@comhem.= se
To: cewcathar@hotmail.com=3B ltru@ietf.org

>=3B Well=2C no=2C because pes and prs already share a macrolangu= age=2C namely fas. See http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/macrolanguages.asp (as well as our o= wn draft registry

>=3B u= pdate).

>=3B But I agree that the example you point at is no longe= r a good one. I can't really give another example (but I wonder how closely= related the Frisian languages are=2C but

>=3B they don't share a macrolanguage code...)

&nb= sp=3B =3B =3B =3B/kent k



Den 2009-02-02 19.38=2C= skrev "CE Whitehead" <=3Bcewcathar@hotma= il.com>=3B:
>=3B>=3B Addison=3B Are we taking= substantial editorial corrections yet?  =3BOr are we waiting for the c= opyright work around?
 =3B
>=3B>=3B If we are taking substant= ial changes=2C I have one (I also have a few glaring typos):
 =3B= >=3B>=3B http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt<= /a>

>=3B>=3B 4.1.1 par 5=2C last sentence
 =3B
{ ORIGI= NAL TEXT }
 =3B
>=3B>=3B "For example=2C Romanian ('ro') and<= br> =3B =3B =3BMoldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage=2C= but are far more
 =3B =3B =3Bclosely related to each other = than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') =2C
 =3B =3B =3Bwhich = do share a macrolanguage."

>=3B>=3B {! COMMENT:  =3Bthe [ro]= [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the subtags has now been depr= ecated=3B 'pes' and 'prs'=2C Eastern (Dari) and Western Farsi=2C would be b= etter examples I think}
 =3B

>=3B>=3B --C. E. Whitehead>=3B>=3B cewcathar@hotmail.com
= --_30dfa60b-f7fd-46de-96d1-a77688544d79_-- --===============0288220800== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --===============0288220800==-- From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Mon Feb 2 19:23:16 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F3D863A6A00; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 19:23:15 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 793B53A6A00 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 19:23:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.016 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.016 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.582, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id THiAfER8ueuQ for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 19:23:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.99]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id BCFD43A68B8 for ; Mon, 2 Feb 2009 19:23:12 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 20435 invoked from network); 3 Feb 2009 03:22:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.99) with ESMTP; 03 Feb 2009 03:22:51 -0000 Message-ID: <447D7EE9E72D4D748C3F733F9207CACD@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 20:21:43 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed" Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org IlBoaWxsaXBzLCBBZGRpc29uIiA8YWRkaXNvbiBhdCBhbWF6b24gZG90IGNvbT4gd3JvdGU6Cgo+ IEkgbm90aWNlLCBob3dldmVyLCB0aGF0IHRoZXJlIG1heSBiZSBhIGNvbnNpc3RlbmN5IHByb2Js ZW0gaW4gU2VjdGlvbiAKPiAzLjEuNyBvZiA0NjQ2YmlzLTIxLCB0aG91Z2guIFNwZWNpZmljYWxs eSwgaXQgYWxsb3dzIChNQVkpIGEgCj4gUHJlZmVycmVkLVZhbHVlIHRvICJtaWdyYXRlIGZvcndh cmQiLiBCdXQgdGhlbiB1c2VzIAo+IHBlcmhhcHMtaW5hcHByb3ByaWF0ZSBub3JtYXRpdmUgbGFu Z3VhZ2UgaW4gdGhlIGV4YW1wbGUgY292ZXJpbmcgCj4gcmVnaW9uczoKPgo+IC0tCj4gQ2hhbmdl cyB0byBvbmUgc3VidGFnIE1BWSBhZmZlY3Qgb3RoZXIgc3VidGFncyBhcyB3ZWxsOiB3aGVuIHBy b3Bvc2luZyAKPiBjaGFuZ2VzIHRvIHRoZSByZWdpc3RyeSwgdGhlIExhbmd1YWdlIFN1YnRhZyBS ZXZpZXdlciB3aWxsIHJldmlldyB0aGUgCj4gcmVnaXN0cnkgZm9yIHN1Y2ggZWZmZWN0cyBhbmQg cHJvcG9zZSB0aGUgbmVjZXNzYXJ5IGNoYW5nZXMgdXNpbmcgdGhlIAo+IHByb2Nlc3MgaW4gU2Vj dGlvbiAzLjUgKFJlZ2lzdHJhdGlvbiBQcm9jZWR1cmUgZm9yIFN1YnRhZ3MpLCBhbHRob3VnaCAK PiBhbnlvbmUgTUFZIHJlcXVlc3Qgc3VjaCBjaGFuZ2VzLiBGb3IgZXhhbXBsZToKPgo+IFN1cHBv c2UgdGhhdCBzdWJ0YWcgJ1hYJyBoYXMgYSBQcmVmZXJyZWQtVmFsdWUgb2YgJ1lZJy4gSWYgJ1lZ JyBsYXRlciAKPiBjaGFuZ2VzIHRvIGhhdmUgYSBQcmVmZXJyZWQtVmFsdWUgb2YgJ1paJywgdGhl biB0aGUgUHJlZmVycmVkLVZhbHVlIAo+IGZvciAnWFgnIE1VU1QgYWxzbyBjaGFuZ2UgdG8gYmUg J1paJy4KPiAtLQoKSW5kZWVkLCB0aGlzIGlzIHRoZSByZWFzb24gSSBzdWdnZXN0ZWQgdGhlIGNo YW5nZS4gIFdoaWxlIENTIGRvZXNuJ3QgCmhhdmUgYSBQcmVmZXJyZWQtVmFsdWUgb2YgaXRzIG93 biwgaXQgaXMgZGVwcmVjYXRlZCwgc28gaXQgc2VlbWVkIHdyb25nIAp0byBoYXZlIFlVIHBvaW50 IHRvIENTLgoKSSdtIG5vdCBlYWdlciB0byBjb250aW51ZSBnaWxkaW5nIHRoaXMgbGlseSBlaXRo ZXIsIGJ1dCB0aGlzIHNlZW1lZCBsaWtlIAphIHBvc3NpYmxlIGNvbmZvcm1hbmNlIHByb2JsZW0u ICBBbmQgR29kIGtub3dzIHdlIGhhdmUgdGltZSwgd2l0aCB0aGVzZSAKZW5kbGVzcyBwcm9jZWR1 cmFsIGRlbGF5cy4KCi0tCkRvdWcgRXdlbGwgICogIFRob3JudG9uLCBDb2xvcmFkbywgVVNBICAq ICBSRkMgNDY0NSAgKiAgVVROICMxNApodHRwOi8vd3d3LmV3ZWxsaWMub3JnCmh0dHA6Ly93d3cx LmlldGYub3JnL2h0bWwuY2hhcnRlcnMvbHRydS1jaGFydGVyLmh0bWwKaHR0cDovL3d3dy5hbHZl c3RyYW5kLm5vL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vaWV0Zi1sYW5ndWFnZXMgIMuGCgpfX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXwpMdHJ1IG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdApM dHJ1QGlldGYub3JnCmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHRydQo= From ltru-bounces@ietf.org Tue Feb 3 06:21:09 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru-archive@megatron.ietf.org Delivered-To: ietfarch-ltru-archive@core3.amsl.com Received: from [127.0.0.1] (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F70B28C0DF; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 06:21:09 -0800 (PST) X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0754228C0DF for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 06:21:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.449 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.449 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.500, BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, J_CHICKENPOX_14=0.6, J_CHICKENPOX_15=0.6, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6, J_CHICKENPOX_41=0.6, J_CHICKENPOX_91=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CPOivXYrG57R for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 06:21:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from mercure.insee.fr (mercure.insee.fr [81.255.68.34]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2ACC83A63EB for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 06:21:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from evariste.insee.fr (unknown [194.254.38.143]) by mercure.insee.fr (Insee Mail Server) with ESMTP id 5EB0C1339C3 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:20:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B9CA79401F for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:20:42 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at insee.fr Received: from evariste.insee.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (evariste.insee.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ThSearQRvk91 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:20:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra (unknown [194.254.38.144]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A21679401E for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:20:42 +0100 (CET) Received: from S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra ([10.90.200.51]) by s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:20:42 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 15:20:41 +0100 Message-ID: <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD09B5@S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 2 thread-index: AcmFH4vmCTsahx8iSjCs8B0BDfv9egA6Nqkg References: From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= To: , =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= X-OriginalArrivalTime: 03 Feb 2009 14:20:42.0184 (UTC) FILETIME=[986CEC80:01C9860A] Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 2 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sender: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Errors-To: ltru-bounces@ietf.org Dear All, Concerning the discussed point E, I would like to remark that the proposed = text is not so clearly evident, because: (i)- Channel Islands is not, and never was, an entry inside ISO 3166-1; (ii)- Isle of Man, that is also concerned by section 4 of [RFC4645], cannot= be considered as part of Channel Islands. Ilet me also add that, inside 9.1. Normative References dates given for par= ts 1,2 and 3 of ISO 639-1 should be precised, as is the case for ISO 639-5,= as: (i)- July 2002 for ISO 639-1; (ii)- October 1998 for ISO 639-2; (iii)- February 2007 for ISO 639-3; . Bien cordialement. G=E9rard LANG -----Message d'origine----- De : ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de ltr= u-request@ietf.org Envoy=E9 : lundi 2 f=E9vrier 2009 11:18 =C0 : ltru@ietf.org Objet : Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 2 Send Ltru mailing list submissions to ltru@ietf.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ltru-request@ietf.org You can reach the person managing the list at ltru-owner@ietf.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "R= e: Contents of Ltru digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... (Martin Duerst) 2. Re: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... (Phillips, Addison) 3. Re: Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 (Lang G?rard) 4. Re: Preferred-Value for YU? (Debbie Garside) 5. Re: Lowercase language names and the Registry (Debbie Garside) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 02 Feb 2009 12:51:41 +0900 From: Martin Duerst Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... To: "Phillips, Addison" , Randy Presuhn Cc: "ltru@ietf.org" Message-ID: <6.0.0.20.2.20090202101632.06cd6a48@localhost> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"us-ascii" Hello Addison, Many thanks for your work. I have looked at the changes, see below for comm= ents. At 03:59 09/01/31, Phillips, Addison wrote: >All, > >I have just posted a draft-21 editor's copy on Inter-Locale. This has = >NOT been submitted to the IETF yet, per the co-chair's instructions. = >This version incorporates a few errata but not yet the reference to the = >Awfully New IPR RFC. > > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.html > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.xml I have looked at this and at the diff, and have run the idnits tool. However, we now have an informative reference in a normative sentence: E. UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section 4 of [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5. Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language tags. My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had the same i= dea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645], we would replace = it inline with the only instance left, resulting in something like: E. The UN numeric code or ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code (once assigned) for the Channel Islands MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5 (for historic details, see [RFC4645]). Can you please make such an update to your staging draft, so that we are re= ady to move forward when the copyright issues are solved. [there won't be any need to include a reference to a new RFC, you will just= have to choose the right boilerplate] BTW, the "local diff" link in your popup (the one going to http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/rfcdiff.pyht.htm) still shows the diff betwe= en -19 and -20. Regards, Martin. >Regards (for the editors) > >Addison > >Addison Phillips >Globalization Architect -- Lab126 > >Internationalization is not a feature. >It is an architecture. #-#-# Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University #-#-# http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp = = ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 1 Feb 2009 20:39:49 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... To: Martin Duerst , Randy Presuhn Cc: "ltru@ietf.org" Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DA5EFC3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8" Hello Martin, Thanks for the note. > However, we now have an informative reference in a normative > sentence: > = > E. UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries > or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section > 4 of > [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered into > the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5. > Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language > tags. This is why the reference *was* normative, nu? = > = > My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had the = > same idea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645], we = > would replace it inline with the only instance left, resulting in = > something like: > = > E. The UN numeric code or ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code (once > assigned) > for the Channel Islands MAY be entered into the IANA = > registry > via the process described in Section 3.5 (for historic > details, see [RFC4645]). I will make this change and post it in the morning. > = > [there won't be any need to include a reference to a new RFC, you will = > just have to choose the right boilerplate] > = > = > BTW, the "local diff" link in your popup (the one going to > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/rfcdiff.pyht.htm) still shows the diff = > between -19 and -20. Yes. I need to fix it. Addison Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 08:44:59 +0100 From: Lang G?rard Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 To: Cc: Lang G?rard Message-ID: <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD09A9@S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" I agree with the proposition of John Cowan and Doug Ewell. Cordialement. G?rard LANG = -----Message d'origine----- De : ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de ltr= u-request@ietf.org Envoy? : dimanche 1 f?vrier 2009 21:00 ? : ltru@ietf.org= Objet : Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 Send Ltru mailing list submissions to ltru@ietf.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ltru-request@ietf.org You can reach the person managing the list at ltru-owner@ietf.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "R= e: Contents of Ltru digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Preferred-Value for YU? (John Cowan) 2. Re: Preferred-Value for YU? (Doug Ewell) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 15:31:41 -0500 From: John Cowan Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? To: Doug Ewell Cc: LTRU Working Group Message-ID: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii Doug Ewell scripsit: > In draft-4645bis, should we modify the record for subtag YU by = > removing the P-V of CS, since CS is itself deprecated with no P-V? +1 for removing CS. I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, RS, or SI." -- = John Cowan cowan@ccil.org http://ccil.org/~cowan This great college [Trinity], of this ancient university [Cambridge], has s= een some strange sights. It has seen Wordsworth drunk and Porson sober. And= here am I, a better poet than Porson, and a better scholar than Wordsworth= , somewhere betwixt and between. --A.E. Housman ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sat, 31 Jan 2009 14:19:42 -0700 From: "Doug Ewell" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: <06ADC800716A4308B24580EA88C2B992@DGBP7M81> Content-Type: text/plain; format=3Dflowed; charset=3D"utf-8"; reply-type=3Doriginal John Cowan wrote: > +1 for removing CS. Two assenting voices on a Saturday afternoon and no dissenting voices is en= ough to make this minor change to the draft. There will presumably be lots= of time for dissenters to make themselves heard. > I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, RS, = > or SI." I can do this. I suppose the precedent of having to provide informative ma= ppings every time ISO 3166 countries split or merge has already been set by= the CS and GB comments. I imagine when as the Netherlands Antilles contin= ue to get their own 3166 codes, the Registry will be expected to provide th= is sort of mapping back to AN, and we may need to retrofit comments onto BL= and MF as well. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.= ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ? ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru End of Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 1 *********************************** ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:05:55 -0000 From: "Debbie Garside" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? To: "'Doug Ewell'" , "'LTRU Working Group'" Message-ID: <07b401c9851d$da86e870$0300a8c0@Vickynew> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"windows-1250" Hi Doug I am not sure that I like the thought of deleting historical information. = I do see where you are coming from but, nevertheless, are we going to be mi= ssing a link in the chain by deleting "CS" from "YU"? I hate deleting information from databases! :-) What I would like to see is information added to the PV field for "YU" ( su= ch as ":2006-10-05") to indicate when "CS" became invalid as the PV. However, I am, assuming that this would entail an update to 4646bis and is,= therefore, unlikely to be incorporated at this time. I would ask that you be careful to not inadvertently delete some of the dot= s that join the Registry. However, I cannot, on this fine, cold, soon to b= e snowy, Monday morning, think of a valid reason why other than on principl= e - I'll try another coffee and maybe write again. :-) +1 to adding John's comment though. Best Debbie -----Original Message----- From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Dou= g Ewell Sent: 31 January 2009 21:20 To: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? John Cowan wrote: > +1 for removing CS. Two assenting voices on a Saturday afternoon and no dissenting voices is en= ough to make this minor change to the draft. There will presumably be lots= of time for dissenters to make themselves heard. > I'd propose adding a comment something like "See BA, HR, ME, MK, RS, = > or SI." I can do this. I suppose the precedent of having to provide informative ma= ppings every time ISO 3166 countries split or merge has already been set by= the CS and GB comments. I imagine when as the Netherlands Antilles contin= ue to get their own 3166 codes, the Registry will be expected to provide th= is sort of mapping back to AN, and we may need to retrofit comments onto BL= and MF as well. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.= ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ? _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. = Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.16/1926 - Release Date: 30/01/2009 17:31 = No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. = Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.16/1929 - Release Date: 01/02/2009 18:02 = ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Mon, 2 Feb 2009 10:10:24 -0000 From: "Debbie Garside" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Lowercase language names and the Registry To: "'Phillips, Addison'" , "'LTRU Working Group'" Message-ID: <07ba01c9851e$77e94860$0300a8c0@Vickynew> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Addison wrote: = >> So? to be clear, I favor putting *exactly* what ISO 639 has into the initial registry unless it conflicts with a specific provision of 4646bis = +1 = Debbie = = _____ = From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Phi= llips, Addison Sent: 30 January 2009 18:15 To: Gerard Meijssen; CE Whitehead Cc: ltru@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Lowercase language names and the Registry = The RFC says quite clearly that the ?Description? fields in the registry ex= ist only to provide for unambiguous identification of subtag meaning. They = should not be taken to be the localized name or in any particular language. Mainly the registry mirrors whatever one of the ISO groups has put into the= ir standards. 4646bis allows for some cleanup/editing by the LSR in cases w= here the name has some sort of formatting problem (hence Doug?s inquiry). This is different from the goals of CLDR. People can and should rely on CLD= R to be correct in presentation. But we have already warned users NOT to re= ly on the description fields in the registry. = Note that the registration process exists to allow users of the registry to= correct or add additional descriptive material. My tendency is to favor mi= rroring exactly what ISO 639 has in the ?initial? registry. If someone feel= s strongly about it, they can petition ietf-languages@ to change it. That?s what the process is for and I would tend to support corrections that= native language speakers feel strongly about. = So? to be clear, I favor putting *exactly* what ISO 639 has into the initia= l registry unless it conflicts with a specific provision of 4646bis. = Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 = Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. = From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ger= ard Meijssen Sent: Friday, January 30, 2009 10:07 AM To: CE Whitehead Cc: ltru@ietf.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Lowercase language names and the Registry = Hoi, If the list is ony to be used as a list with a local application, I agree. When people want to use lists like this or the CLDR language list, they dep= end on the information to be right. It is not and people do. Thanks, Gerard 2009/1/30 CE Whitehead Hi. I think Leif and Doug get my vote here. = In a list I'd feel comfortable 'title-casing' the first word in French (a l= anguage in which language names are also normally 'lower-cased'). But I'm not a native speaker. = = (NOTE: I found different conventions regarding titles online: HYPERLINK "http://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3Dhistoire+du+francais&btnG=3DSearc= h" \nhttp://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3Dhistoire+du+francais&btnG=3DSear= ch HYPERLINK "http://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3Dfrancais&btnG=3DSearch" \nhttp://www.google.com/search?hl=3Den&q=3Dfrancais&btnG=3DSearch [these ar= e not lists however, just titles]. when a French title appears on a book in the U.S. market, every word on the= book may be title-cased: HYPERLINK "http://shopping.msn.com/prices/allons-y-le-francais-par-etapes-with-audio-c d/itemid25043275/?itemtext=3Ditemname:allons-y-le-francais-par-etapes-with-= aud io-cd" \nhttp://shopping.msn.com/prices/allons-y-le-francais-par-etapes-with-audio- cd/itemid25043275/?itemtext=3Ditemname:allons-y-le-francais-par-etapes-with= -au dio-cd Wikipedia has two conventions for lists in French it seems?: HYPERLINK "http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_de_langues_par_ordre_alphab%C3%A9tique" \nhttp://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_de_langues_par_ordre_alphab%C3%A9tique HYPERLINK "http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_des_langues_officielles" \nhttp://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_des_langues_officielles = in one the first word, whether the language name or a definite article prec= eding the name, is 'upper cased'; in the other list the names are almost al= l 'lower cased') = = Thanks. = --C. E. Whitehead HYPERLINK "mailto:cewcathar@hotmail.com" \ncewcathar@hotmail.com = = = = From: Leif Halvard Silli To: Doug Ewell Doug Ewell 2009-01-30 07.08: So far so good, but then the January 26 revision came along and lowercased the Finnish and Swedish names, as the requestor originally suggested (see HYPERLINK "http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2008-028.pdf" \nhttp://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/2008-028.pdf): = = Finland-Swedish Sign Language finlandssvenskt teckenspr?k suomenruotsalainen viittomakieli [...] = I propose that for draft-4645bis and the Language Subtag Registry generally, we introduce a rule that Description fields for language subtags be modified from the ISO-provided name if necessary to ensure they begin with a capital letter, unless the lowercase letter is considered necessary to spell the name correctly (as it is in "tlhIngan-Hol"). This is consistent with draft-4646bis, Section 3.1.5, which allows Description fields to be "edited or modified" from the ISO rendering. = = Unless someone objects on-list to this rather pedantic suggestion, it will be added to the next draft-4645bis. = In my view it is defendable to let language names begin with upper-case letter even in Scandinavian languages, as long as the names appears in a list -aka "menu" - as opposed to in a comma separated line of words. Hence, I'm ok with it. = = -- leif halvard silli _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list HYPERLINK "mailto:Ltru@ietf.org"Ltru@ietf.org HYPERLINK "https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru" \nhttps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru = No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG. Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.15/1924 - Release Date: 29/01/2009 17:57 No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG. = Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.10.16/1929 - Release Date: 01/02/2009 18:02 = -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru End of Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 2 *********************************** _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 3 19:12:17 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 059443A6B39 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 19:12:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.038 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.038 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.561, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AY5vwpiRTgxj for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 19:12:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 234263A6B31 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 19:12:16 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=lUUsEsqJicad0j7gKj/M0W5SdVgZ7BfODdjezhoZrPEQF2NM3zOmiNNTlobs3SxG; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.137.214] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LUYB8-0000XB-3A for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 03 Feb 2009 22:11:54 -0500 Message-ID: <005001c98676$e4ca5ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org><30b660a20902020753w5630db87u9d63bf55b480d2ad@mail.gmail.com> <006601c98576$c5d9f300$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DA5F7AB@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 19:15:54 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1733924f84b26775fb5c785a8c607284a56350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.137.214 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2009 03:12:17 -0000 Hi - > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 12:57 PM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? ... > Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: > > Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferred-Value for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'. > -- > > LTRU made this change to avoid "chaining" of preferred-values in the future. But it looks inconsistent as written. Probably the first "MAY" should be changed to read "Changes to one subtag sometimes affects other subtags as well". ... As a technical contributor, I think the current language, while not ideal, is tolerable. One can read that first "MAY" with its strict RFC 2119 sense without anything "breaking." Consequently, I'd prefer to leave the text as-is. If there is a consensus for change, I could live with the proposed change only if it is modified to fix its verb-subject agreement problem, though I think it might be better stated as "Changes to the Preferred-Value of a subtag may have consequences for other subtags." Randy From doug@ewellic.org Tue Feb 3 21:19:19 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B5CF3A6BC9 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 21:19:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.034 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.034 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.564, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9t+Pq2C7kjN5 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 21:19:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth20.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth20.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.36]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4DFF13A6B93 for ; Tue, 3 Feb 2009 21:19:18 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 16143 invoked from network); 4 Feb 2009 05:18:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth20.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.36) with ESMTP; 04 Feb 2009 05:18:58 -0000 Message-ID: <1CFE093212414298946D5640A390EF31@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <20090131203141.GB11448@mercury.ccil.org> <06ADC800716A4308B24580EA88C2B992@DGBP7M81> <07b401c9851d$da86e870$0300a8c0@Vickynew> Date: Tue, 3 Feb 2009 22:12:47 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Feb 2009 05:19:19 -0000 Debbie Garside wrote: > I am not sure that I like the thought of deleting historical > information. I do see where you are coming from but, nevertheless, > are we going to be missing a link in the chain by deleting "CS" from > "YU"? > > I hate deleting information from databases! :-) If this were the sort of information that the Registry was designed to hold, then I would completely agree. But I'm not convinced that it is. We've already agreed that users of the Registry should not have to jump from one Preferred-Value to another before arriving at the "correct" value. One question to ask might be: If the user sees that "YU" is deprecated but has a Preferred-Value of "CS", then looks up "CS" and sees that it too is deprecated, but with no Preferred-Value, what good did it do to redirect the user in the first place? > What I would like to see is information added to the PV field for "YU" > (such as ":2006-10-05") to indicate when "CS" became invalid as the > PV. However, I am, assuming that this would entail an update to > 4646bis and is, therefore, unlikely to be incorporated at this time. Good guess. :-) -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From doug@ewellic.org Wed Feb 4 20:33:25 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B3BA83A67B3 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 20:33:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.844 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.844 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.660, BAYES_40=-0.185, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bfytCwvTvbua for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 20:33:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpout07.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout07-04.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.233]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id B142F3A6359 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 20:33:24 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 2182 invoked from network); 5 Feb 2009 04:33:03 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout07-04.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.233) with ESMTP; 05 Feb 2009 04:33:02 -0000 Message-ID: <4A369C9677DB45C8BCEEAD821ADA9EA4@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:32:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 04:33:25 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: >> Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when >> proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer will >> review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary >> changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for >> Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: > ... > > As a technical contributor, I think the current language, > while not ideal, is tolerable. One can read that first > "MAY" with its strict RFC 2119 sense without anything > "breaking." Consequently, I'd prefer to leave the text > as-is. I think what it shows is that not every "may" should be a "MAY." The sentence is supposed to say that changes to one subtag might affect other subtags, which is true. Turning it into a 2199 MAY makes it look normative, which is not right. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Wed Feb 4 21:06:05 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 492CC3A6B00 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:06:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.027 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.027 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.572, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HO6+9b-BSaIF for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:06:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2B2D3A6B45 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:06:03 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=p67BZqNTWM3kVGQPzmXuVmphVIjFdlI0bqP5teh1MFmTgfrfT43eCH/sR7rxctoW; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.35.216] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LUwQq-0004gx-0V for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2009 00:05:44 -0500 Message-ID: <000001c9874f$59a32500$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <4A369C9677DB45C8BCEEAD821ADA9EA4@DGBP7M81> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 20:54:13 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1736700e92bb27c1950b71f58b2eb7bca22350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.35.216 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 05:06:05 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:32 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? > > Randy Presuhn wrote: > > >> Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when > >> proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer will > >> review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary > >> changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for > >> Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: > > ... > > > > As a technical contributor, I think the current language, > > while not ideal, is tolerable. One can read that first > > "MAY" with its strict RFC 2119 sense without anything > > "breaking." Consequently, I'd prefer to leave the text > > as-is. > > I think what it shows is that not every "may" should be a "MAY." The > sentence is supposed to say that changes to one subtag might affect > other subtags, which is true. Turning it into a 2199 MAY makes it look > normative, which is not right. ... As a technical contributor: I don't see how a strict RFC 2119 reading of that text causes any problems. It says that it is permitted, but not required, for a change to one to have consequences for others. That is absolutely within the intent of the language. Though it might have started out as an "observation", the behavior is a logical consequence of other normatively specified behaviours. Putting the observation in normative terms is, at worst, redundant. If we were to eliminate all the redundant stuff from this document, we'd have a much slimmer specification, but doing so would not be worth the delay. Randy From addison@amazon.com Wed Feb 4 21:35:38 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E30A3A6A18 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:35:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.663 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.663 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.065, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zqTDBjg4gOxa for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:35:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E6EF03A6B4C for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:35:36 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,383,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="184690742" Received: from smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com ([172.20.19.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 05 Feb 2009 05:35:11 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n155ZB65003271 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Thu, 5 Feb 2009 05:35:11 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:35:10 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:35:08 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? Thread-Index: AcmHT2mYJaPCBenMQEWEm/mnpdTDrQAAyJ7A Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DC270C0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <4A369C9677DB45C8BCEEAD821ADA9EA4@DGBP7M81> <000001c9874f$59a32500$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <000001c9874f$59a32500$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 05:35:38 -0000 VGhlIHByb2JsZW0gaXNuJ3QgdGhhdCBpcyBzYXlzICJNQVkiLi4uIEJ1dCB0byBoYXZlIHNvbWV0 aGluZyBzYXkgIk1BWSIgZW5jbG9zZSBhbiBleGFtcGxlIHRoYXQgc2F5cyAiTVVTVCIgbWFrZXMg bm8gc2Vuc2UuIEl0IGlzbid0ICJNQVkiIGlmIHlvdSdyZSByZXF1aXJlZCB0byBkbyBpdC4gDQoN CkkgdGhpbmsgd2hhdCBpcyBpbnRlbmRlZC4uLiBhbmQgd2hhdCBtYWtlcyBzZW5zZS4uLiB3b3Vs ZCBiZSB0byBjaGFuZ2UgdGhlIDIxMTkga2V5d29yZCAiTUFZIiB0byB0aGUgcmVndWxhciB3b3Jk ICJjYW4iICh3aGljaCBpcyBiYXNpY2FsbHkgd2hhdCBJIHN1Z2dlc3RlZCBiZWZvcmUpLg0KDQpJ dCdzIGEgYnVnLiBJdCdzIG5vdCBhIGNyaXRpY2FsIGJ1Zy4gQW5kIHNpbmNlIHdlJ3JlIHN0dWNr IHdhaXRpbmcgZm9yIHRoZSBJRVRGIHRvIGZpZ3VyZSBvdXQgSVBSIGlzc3Vlcywgd2h5IG5vdCBj aGFuZ2UgdGhlIG9uZSB3b3JkIHRvIGZpeCBpdD8NCg0KQWRkaXNvbg0KDQpBZGRpc29uIFBoaWxs aXBzDQpHbG9iYWxpemF0aW9uIEFyY2hpdGVjdCAtLSBMYWIxMjYNCg0KSW50ZXJuYXRpb25hbGl6 YXRpb24gaXMgbm90IGEgZmVhdHVyZS4NCkl0IGlzIGFuIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZS4NCg0KPiAtLS0t LU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21h aWx0bzpsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIE9uDQo+IEJlaGFsZiBPZiBSYW5keSBQcmVzdWhu DQo+IFNlbnQ6IFdlZG5lc2RheSwgRmVicnVhcnkgMDQsIDIwMDkgODo1NCBQTQ0KPiBUbzogTFRS VSBXb3JraW5nIEdyb3VwDQo+IFN1YmplY3Q6IFJlOiBbTHRydV0gUHJlZmVycmVkLVZhbHVlIGZv ciBZVT8NCj4gDQo+IEhpIC0NCj4gDQo+ID4gRnJvbTogIkRvdWcgRXdlbGwiIDxkb3VnQGV3ZWxs aWMub3JnPg0KPiA+IFRvOiAiTFRSVSBXb3JraW5nIEdyb3VwIiA8bHRydUBpZXRmLm9yZz4NCj4g PiBTZW50OiBXZWRuZXNkYXksIEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDA0LCAyMDA5IDg6MzIgUE0NCj4gPiBTdWJqZWN0 OiBSZTogW0x0cnVdIFByZWZlcnJlZC1WYWx1ZSBmb3IgWVU/DQo+ID4NCj4gPiBSYW5keSBQcmVz dWhuIDxyYW5keSB1bmRlcnNjb3JlIHByZXN1aG4gYXQgbWluZHNwcmluZyBkb3QgY29tPg0KPiB3 cm90ZToNCj4gPg0KPiA+ID4+IENoYW5nZXMgdG8gb25lIHN1YnRhZyBNQVkgYWZmZWN0IG90aGVy IHN1YnRhZ3MgYXMgd2VsbDogd2hlbg0KPiA+ID4+IHByb3Bvc2luZyBjaGFuZ2VzIHRvIHRoZSBy ZWdpc3RyeSwgdGhlIExhbmd1YWdlIFN1YnRhZw0KPiBSZXZpZXdlciB3aWxsDQo+ID4gPj4gcmV2 aWV3IHRoZSByZWdpc3RyeSBmb3Igc3VjaCBlZmZlY3RzIGFuZCBwcm9wb3NlIHRoZSBuZWNlc3Nh cnkNCj4gPiA+PiBjaGFuZ2VzIHVzaW5nIHRoZSBwcm9jZXNzIGluIFNlY3Rpb24gMy41IChSZWdp c3RyYXRpb24NCj4gUHJvY2VkdXJlIGZvcg0KPiA+ID4+IFN1YnRhZ3MpLCBhbHRob3VnaCBhbnlv bmUgTUFZIHJlcXVlc3Qgc3VjaCBjaGFuZ2VzLiBGb3INCj4gZXhhbXBsZToNCj4gPiA+IC4uLg0K PiA+ID4NCj4gPiA+IEFzIGEgdGVjaG5pY2FsIGNvbnRyaWJ1dG9yLCBJIHRoaW5rIHRoZSBjdXJy ZW50IGxhbmd1YWdlLA0KPiA+ID4gd2hpbGUgbm90IGlkZWFsLCBpcyB0b2xlcmFibGUuICBPbmUg Y2FuIHJlYWQgdGhhdCBmaXJzdA0KPiA+ID4gIk1BWSIgd2l0aCBpdHMgc3RyaWN0IFJGQyAyMTE5 IHNlbnNlIHdpdGhvdXQgYW55dGhpbmcNCj4gPiA+ICJicmVha2luZy4iICBDb25zZXF1ZW50bHks IEknZCBwcmVmZXIgdG8gbGVhdmUgdGhlIHRleHQNCj4gPiA+IGFzLWlzLg0KPiA+DQo+ID4gSSB0 aGluayB3aGF0IGl0IHNob3dzIGlzIHRoYXQgbm90IGV2ZXJ5ICJtYXkiIHNob3VsZCBiZSBhICJN QVkuIg0KPiBUaGUNCj4gPiBzZW50ZW5jZSBpcyBzdXBwb3NlZCB0byBzYXkgdGhhdCBjaGFuZ2Vz IHRvIG9uZSBzdWJ0YWcgbWlnaHQNCj4gYWZmZWN0DQo+ID4gb3RoZXIgc3VidGFncywgd2hpY2gg aXMgdHJ1ZS4gIFR1cm5pbmcgaXQgaW50byBhIDIxOTkgTUFZIG1ha2VzDQo+IGl0IGxvb2sNCj4g PiBub3JtYXRpdmUsIHdoaWNoIGlzIG5vdCByaWdodC4NCj4gLi4uDQo+IA0KPiBBcyBhIHRlY2hu aWNhbCBjb250cmlidXRvcjogIEkgZG9uJ3Qgc2VlIGhvdyBhIHN0cmljdCBSRkMgMjExOQ0KPiBy ZWFkaW5nDQo+IG9mIHRoYXQgdGV4dCBjYXVzZXMgYW55IHByb2JsZW1zLiAgSXQgc2F5cyB0aGF0 IGl0IGlzIHBlcm1pdHRlZCwNCj4gYnV0IG5vdA0KPiByZXF1aXJlZCwgZm9yIGEgY2hhbmdlIHRv IG9uZSB0byBoYXZlIGNvbnNlcXVlbmNlcyBmb3Igb3RoZXJzLg0KPiBUaGF0IGlzDQo+IGFic29s dXRlbHkgd2l0aGluIHRoZSBpbnRlbnQgb2YgdGhlIGxhbmd1YWdlLiAgVGhvdWdoIGl0IG1pZ2h0 IGhhdmUNCj4gc3RhcnRlZCBvdXQgYXMgYW4gIm9ic2VydmF0aW9uIiwgdGhlIGJlaGF2aW9yIGlz IGEgbG9naWNhbA0KPiBjb25zZXF1ZW5jZQ0KPiBvZiBvdGhlciBub3JtYXRpdmVseSBzcGVjaWZp ZWQgYmVoYXZpb3Vycy4gIFB1dHRpbmcgdGhlIG9ic2VydmF0aW9uDQo+IGluIG5vcm1hdGl2ZSB0 ZXJtcyBpcywgYXQgd29yc3QsIHJlZHVuZGFudC4gIElmIHdlIHdlcmUgdG8NCj4gZWxpbWluYXRl DQo+IGFsbCB0aGUgcmVkdW5kYW50IHN0dWZmIGZyb20gdGhpcyBkb2N1bWVudCwgd2UnZCBoYXZl IGEgbXVjaA0KPiBzbGltbWVyIHNwZWNpZmljYXRpb24sIGJ1dCBkb2luZyBzbyB3b3VsZCBub3Qg YmUgd29ydGggdGhlIGRlbGF5Lg0KPiANCj4gUmFuZHkNCj4gDQo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+IEx0cnUgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQo+IEx0 cnVAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCj4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9sdHJ1 DQo= From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Wed Feb 4 21:52:25 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 490E93A6A18 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:52:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.059 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.059 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.540, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WGzja2hXhJeF for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:52:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3B9E3A6887 for ; Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:52:21 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=qC05Kdyswmb8nuuHwf7gCBp/7mC7NN4WE6tvkIt92zHAcNJT3zzBfhin4YfQQGhz; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.136.58] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LUx9d-0008Oe-W7 for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2009 00:52:02 -0500 Message-ID: <007c01c98755$d1681900$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <4A369C9677DB45C8BCEEAD821ADA9EA4@DGBP7M81> <000001c9874f$59a32500$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DC270C0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 21:51:39 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173f10fb9b5df6da3c243b727852edb662a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.136.58 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 05:52:25 -0000 Hi - As a technical contributor... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 9:35 PM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? > > The problem isn't that is says "MAY"... > But to have something say "MAY" enclose an example > that says "MUST" makes no sense. It isn't "MAY" if > you're required to do it. There currently is no "MUST" there. Do you mean we should replace the existing "will" with "MUST"? > I think what is intended... and what makes sense... would > be to change the 2119 keyword "MAY" to the regular word "can" > (which is basically what I suggested before). That has absolutely no effect on the normative requirements of the spec. Consequently, I could live with the change, though it seems quite pointless to me. > It's a bug. It's not a critical bug. I still don't see a bug there. What does the normative reading permit (or not permit) that is any different from what would (or would not) be permitted if the "MUST" were a "can"? > And since we're stuck waiting for the IETF to figure out > IPR issues, why not change the one word to fix it? As a co-chair... Because if we start making these sorts of trivial adjustments at this point, all sorts of other non-changes will come out of the woodwork. I've seen late-stage "editorial cleanup" introduce bugs too many times to be comfortable with that, and I'm extremely reluctant to ask people to read yet another version. At this stage my strong preference is to make changes only if something is demonstrably broken. Not merely ugly, but broken as in "it cannot possibly work" or "it does something the Internet cannot survive." But perhaps co-chair Martin might be persuaded... Randy From addison@amazon.com Thu Feb 5 07:15:37 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D37333A68E6 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 07:15:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.659 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.659 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.060, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tfDg9ToZTMRc for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 07:15:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16D3E3A6879 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 07:15:37 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,385,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="184880348" Received: from smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.18]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 05 Feb 2009 15:15:15 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n15FFDAk031503; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 15:15:13 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 07:15:03 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 07:15:02 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? Thread-Index: AcmHVePdePeTSMdZTWqzvY4DzTYVVwATmOSA Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DC2729F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <4A369C9677DB45C8BCEEAD821ADA9EA4@DGBP7M81> <000001c9874f$59a32500$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DC270C0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <007c01c98755$d1681900$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <007c01c98755$d1681900$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:15:37 -0000 PiA+DQo+ID4gVGhlIHByb2JsZW0gaXNuJ3QgdGhhdCBpcyBzYXlzICJNQVkiLi4uDQo+ID4gQnV0 IHRvIGhhdmUgc29tZXRoaW5nIHNheSAiTUFZIiBlbmNsb3NlIGFuIGV4YW1wbGUNCj4gPiB0aGF0 IHNheXMgIk1VU1QiIG1ha2VzIG5vIHNlbnNlLiBJdCBpc24ndCAiTUFZIiBpZg0KPiA+IHlvdSdy ZSByZXF1aXJlZCB0byBkbyBpdC4NCj4gDQo+IFRoZXJlIGN1cnJlbnRseSBpcyBubyAiTVVTVCIg dGhlcmUuICBEbyB5b3UgbWVhbiB3ZSBzaG91bGQNCj4gcmVwbGFjZSB0aGUgZXhpc3RpbmcgIndp bGwiIHdpdGggIk1VU1QiPw0KDQpUaGUgIk1VU1QiIGlzIGluIHRoZSBleGFtcGxlOg0KDQotLQ0K Q2hhbmdlcyB0byBvbmUgc3VidGFnIE1BWSBhZmZlY3Qgb3RoZXIgc3VidGFncyBhcyB3ZWxsOiB3 aGVuIHByb3Bvc2luZyBjaGFuZ2VzIHRvIHRoZSByZWdpc3RyeSwgdGhlIExhbmd1YWdlIFN1YnRh ZyBSZXZpZXdlciB3aWxsIHJldmlldyB0aGUgcmVnaXN0cnkgZm9yIHN1Y2ggZWZmZWN0cyBhbmQg cHJvcG9zZSB0aGUgbmVjZXNzYXJ5IGNoYW5nZXMgdXNpbmcgdGhlIHByb2Nlc3MgaW4gU2VjdGlv biAzLjUgKFJlZ2lzdHJhdGlvbiBQcm9jZWR1cmUgZm9yIFN1YnRhZ3MpLCBhbHRob3VnaCBhbnlv bmUgTUFZIHJlcXVlc3Qgc3VjaCBjaGFuZ2VzLiBGb3IgZXhhbXBsZToNCg0KICAgIFN1cHBvc2Ug dGhhdCBzdWJ0YWcgJ1hYJyBoYXMgYSBQcmVmZXJyZWQtVmFsdWUgb2YgJ1lZJy4gSWYgJ1lZJyBs YXRlciBjaGFuZ2VzIHRvIGhhdmUgYSBQcmVmZXJyZWQtVmFsdWUgb2YgJ1paJywgdGhlbiB0aGUg UHJlZmVycmVkLVZhbHVlIGZvciAnWFgnIE1VU1QgYWxzbyBjaGFuZ2UgdG8gYmUgJ1paJy4NCi0t DQo+IA0KPiBBcyBhIGNvLWNoYWlyLi4uDQo+IA0KPiBCZWNhdXNlIGlmIHdlIHN0YXJ0IG1ha2lu ZyB0aGVzZSBzb3J0cyBvZiB0cml2aWFsIGFkanVzdG1lbnRzDQo+IGF0IHRoaXMgcG9pbnQsIGFs bCBzb3J0cyBvZiBvdGhlciBub24tY2hhbmdlcyB3aWxsIGNvbWUgb3V0DQo+IG9mIHRoZSB3b29k d29yay4gIEkndmUgc2VlbiBsYXRlLXN0YWdlICJlZGl0b3JpYWwgY2xlYW51cCINCj4gaW50cm9k dWNlIGJ1Z3MgdG9vIG1hbnkgdGltZXMgdG8gYmUgY29tZm9ydGFibGUgd2l0aCB0aGF0LA0KPiBh bmQgSSdtIGV4dHJlbWVseSByZWx1Y3RhbnQgdG8gYXNrIHBlb3BsZSB0byByZWFkIHlldCBhbm90 aGVyDQo+IHZlcnNpb24uIEF0IHRoaXMgc3RhZ2UgbXkgc3Ryb25nIHByZWZlcmVuY2UgaXMgdG8g bWFrZQ0KPiBjaGFuZ2VzIG9ubHkgaWYgc29tZXRoaW5nIGlzIGRlbW9uc3RyYWJseSBicm9rZW4u ICBOb3QNCj4gbWVyZWx5IHVnbHksIGJ1dCBicm9rZW4gYXMgaW4gIml0IGNhbm5vdCBwb3NzaWJs eSB3b3JrIg0KPiBvciAiaXQgZG9lcyBzb21ldGhpbmcgdGhlIEludGVybmV0IGNhbm5vdCBzdXJ2 aXZlLiINCj4gQnV0IHBlcmhhcHMgY28tY2hhaXIgTWFydGluIG1pZ2h0IGJlIHBlcnN1YWRlZC4u Lg0KPiANCg0KSSdtIGFsc28gZmluZSB3aXRoIG5vdCBjaGFuZ2luZyBpdC4gSXQgaXNuJ3QgdGhh dCBpbXBvcnRhbnQuDQoNCkFkZGlzb24NCg== From cewcathar@hotmail.com Thu Feb 5 09:46:39 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 728F33A69F9 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 09:46:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.179 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.179 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.419, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ehb8h5b7IcNh for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 09:46:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from blu0-omc3-s27.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s27.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.102]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 362ED28C1A6 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 09:46:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from BLU109-W31 ([65.55.116.72]) by blu0-omc3-s27.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 5 Feb 2009 09:46:13 -0800 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_a4a2b284-5af2-4252-974c-910673906535_" X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11] From: CE Whitehead To: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:46:13 -0500 Importance: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 05 Feb 2009 17:46:13.0864 (UTC) FILETIME=[A3817680:01C987B9] Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 17:46:39 -0000 --_a4a2b284-5af2-4252-974c-910673906535_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable =20 Hi=2C all! =20 I too have a problem with words like 'will' (in the selection Addison has c= ited here). Since we have keywords like 'must=2C' 'should=2C' and 'may=2C' = I think we should stick to them here for clarity. For consistency we should stick with 'must' or 'should' in both sentences = I think (it seems to be either a 'must' or a 'should'. =20 =20 Now=2C regarding the 'may' sentence=2C and Addison's proposed change to it: =20 "Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well" Addison suggested: =20 > The problem isn't that is says "MAY"... But to have something say "MAY" e= nclose an example that says "MUST" makes no sense. It isn't "MAY" if you're= required to do it.=20 However=2C I do not see a problem or conflict here. The sentences with may= and those with 'will' or 'must' are referring to different concepts--the f= irst refers to what 'may' or 'can' or 'might' happen=3B the second to what = users/ietf 'will' or 'must' do (because of changes that 'may' or 'can' happ= en). =20 =20 But=2C I'm not sure if a keyword should be used here at all=2C because yes= =2C having the keyword 'may' here might cause confusion (if 'may' is used = as a keyword for what users are or ietf is permitted to do=2C and if 'shoul= d' or 'must' is used other times when there is a recommendation or a requir= ement that users/ietf do something--then we interpret the words 'may=2C' 's= hould=2C' and 'must' as being in opposition and they are not in opposition = here). =20 I am not sure if this is what is meant by the keyword 'may'--if the keyword= 'may' is not meant to say what 'may' or 'can' happen (rather than what use= rs 'may do' if they want to=2C that is=2C to indicate permission)=2C then t= his 'may=2C' at least in my opinion=2C should be changed to 'can' here to a= void confusion. =20 (NOTE: Regarding 'will=2C' 'may=2C' and 'can:' maybe it's the influence o= f a primary school grammar teacher=2C but to me=2C 'can' the verb is used w= hen "someone is able to do something or is capable of doing something=3B" '= can' says nothing about anyone's having permission to do something=3B just = about his/her/its having an underlying ability to do something.) =20 (QUESTION: By the way=2C is this the last call for editorial changes and c= orrections? Please let me know.) =20 Thanks. =20 --C. E. Whitehead=20 cewcathar@hotmail.com From: "Phillips=2C Addison" Date: Thu=2C 5 Feb 2009= 07:15:02 -0800 >> > >> > The problem isn't that is says "MAY"... >> > But to have something say "MAY" enclose an example >> > that says "MUST" makes no sense. It isn't "MAY" if >> > you're required to do it. >>=20 >> There currently is no "MUST" there. Do you mean we should >> replace the existing "will" with "MUST"? > The "MUST" is in the example: -- > Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when proposing ch= anges to the registry=2C the Language Subtag Reviewer will review the regis= try for such effects and propose the necessary changes using the process in= Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags)=2C although anyone MAY re= quest such changes. For example: > Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later = changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ'=2C then the Preferred-Value for '= XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'. -- >>=20 >> As a co-chair... >>=20 >> Because if we start making these sorts of trivial adjustments >> at this point=2C all sorts of other non-changes will come out >> of the woodwork. I've seen late-stage "editorial cleanup" >> introduce bugs too many times to be comfortable with that=2C >> and I'm extremely reluctant to ask people to read yet another >> version. At this stage my strong preference is to make >> changes only if something is demonstrably broken. Not >> merely ugly=2C but broken as in "it cannot possibly work" >> or "it does something the Internet cannot survive." >> But perhaps co-chair Martin might be persuaded... >>=20 > I'm also fine with not changing it. It isn't that important. > Addison --_a4a2b284-5af2-4252-974c-910673906535_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable  =3B
Hi=2C all!
 =3B
I =3Btoo have a problem with words like 'will' (in the selection = =3BAddison has cited here).
 =3B
Since we have =3Bkeywords li= ke 'must=2C' 'should=2C' and =3B'may=2C' I think we should stick to the= m here for clarity.
 =3B
For consistency we should stick with 'must' or 'should' in both= sentences I think (it seems to be either a 'must' or a 'should'. =3B&n= bsp=3B =3B
 =3B
Now=2C regarding =3Bthe =3B'may' =3Bsentence=2C and Addison's p= roposed change to it:
 =3B
"Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well"

Addison suggested:
 =3B
>=3B The problem isn't that is says "MAY"... But to have something say "M= AY" enclose an example that says "MUST" makes no sense. It isn't "MAY" if y= ou're required to do it.

However=2C I do not see a problem =3Bor conflict here. =3B The sent= ences with may and those with 'will' or 'must' are referring to different c= oncepts--the first refers to what =3B'may' or 'can' or 'might' =3Bh= appen=3B the second to what users/ietf 'will' or 'must' do (because of chan= ges that 'may' or 'can' happen). =3B
 =3B
But=2C I'm not sure if a keyword should be used here at all=2C because yes= =2C having the keyword 'may' here might cause confusion =3B (if 'may' i= s used as a keyword =3Bfor what users are =3Bor ietf is =3Bperm= itted to do=2C and if 'should' or 'must' is used other times when there is = a recommendation or a requirement that users/ietf do something--then we int= erpret the words 'may=2C' 'should=2C' and 'must' =3Bas being in opposit= ion and they are not in opposition =3Bhere).
 =3B
I am not sure =3Bif this is what =3Bis meant by the keyword 'may'--= if =3Bthe keyword 'may' =3Bis not meant to say what 'may' or 'can'&= nbsp=3Bhappen (rather than what users 'may do' if they want to=2C that is= =2C to indicate permission)=2C then this =3B'may=2C' at least in my opi= nion=2C =3Bshould be changed =3Bto 'can' here to avoid confusion.  =3B
(NOTE: =3B Regarding 'will=2C' 'may=2C' and 'can:' =3B maybe it's t= he influence of =3Ba =3Bprimary school grammar teacher=2C but to me= =2C 'can' =3Bthe verb =3Bis used when =3B"someone is able to do= something or is capable of doing something=3B" =3B'can' says nothing a= bout anyone's having permission to do something=3B just about his/her/its h= aving =3Ban underlying ability to do something.)

 =3B
(QUESTION: =3B By the way=2C is this the last call for editorial change= s and corrections? =3B Please let me know.)
 =3B
Thanks.
 =3B
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com


From: "Phillips=2C Addison" <=3Baddison at amazon.com>=3B
Date: Thu= =2C 5 Feb 2009 07:15:02 -0800 


>=3B>=3B >=3B
>=3B>=3B >=3B The problem isn't that is says "MAY"...
>=3B>=3B >=3B But to have something say "MAY" enclose an example
>=3B>=3B >=3B that says "MUST" makes no sense. It isn't "MAY" if
>=3B>=3B >=3B you're required to do it.
>=3B>=3B=20
>=3B>=3B There currently is no "MUST" there.  Do you mean we should
>=3B>=3B replace the existing "will" with "MUST"?

>=3B The "MUST" is in the example:

--
>=3B Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when proposi=
ng changes to the registry=2C the Language Subtag Reviewer will review the =
registry for such effects and propose the necessary changes using the proce=
ss in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags)=2C although anyone M=
AY request such changes. For example:

>=3B    Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' l=
ater changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ'=2C then the Preferred-Value =
for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'.
--
>=3B>=3B=20
>=3B>=3B As a co-chair...
>=3B>=3B=20
>=3B>=3B Because if we start making these sorts of trivial adjustments
>=3B>=3B at this point=2C all sorts of other non-changes will come out
>=3B>=3B of the woodwork.  I've seen late-stage "editorial cleanup"
>=3B>=3B introduce bugs too many times to be comfortable with that=2C
>=3B>=3B and I'm extremely reluctant to ask people to read yet another
>=3B>=3B version. At this stage my strong preference is to make
>=3B>=3B changes only if something is demonstrably broken.  Not
>=3B>=3B merely ugly=2C but broken as in "it cannot possibly work"
>=3B>=3B or "it does something the Internet cannot survive."
>=3B>=3B But perhaps co-chair Martin might be persuaded...
>=3B>=3B=20

>=3B I'm also fine with not changing it. It isn't that important.

>=3B Addison

= --_a4a2b284-5af2-4252-974c-910673906535_-- From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 5 12:23:38 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B9883A6A03 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:23:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.339 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.339 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.260, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1OVBUdj2+4g9 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:23:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C0E23A6885 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:23:37 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=MF9Ah2W1d0bobewIoP2sGtErAsqdxB3Y1OS4mccFKx1/E93fyZaTWDttGlrXnhkX; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.31] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVAl5-0003uU-Sz for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:23:36 -0500 Message-ID: <002b01c987cf$93c04080$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <4A369C9677DB45C8BCEEAD821ADA9EA4@DGBP7M81><000001c9874f$59a32500$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DC270C0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <007c01c98755$d1681900$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DC2729F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:23:14 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1736f99e826493d99d4c99a97c8e182e367350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.31 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 20:23:38 -0000 Hi - As a technical contributor... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 7:15 AM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? > > > > > > > The problem isn't that is says "MAY"... > > > But to have something say "MAY" enclose an example > > > that says "MUST" makes no sense. It isn't "MAY" if > > > you're required to do it. > > > > There currently is no "MUST" there. Do you mean we should > > replace the existing "will" with "MUST"? > > The "MUST" is in the example: > > -- > Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: > > Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferred-Value for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'. I still see no real problem. Though it would have been incrementally better from a "standards stylistic" perspective to have not used "MUST" there, I do not see how its presence either requires any unintended behaviour or forbids anything we wanted to happen. This "MUST" is still congruent with the RFC 2119 sense. > > As a co-chair... > > > > Because if we start making these sorts of trivial adjustments > > at this point, all sorts of other non-changes will come out > > of the woodwork. I've seen late-stage "editorial cleanup" > > introduce bugs too many times to be comfortable with that, > > and I'm extremely reluctant to ask people to read yet another > > version. At this stage my strong preference is to make > > changes only if something is demonstrably broken. Not > > merely ugly, but broken as in "it cannot possibly work" > > or "it does something the Internet cannot survive." > > But perhaps co-chair Martin might be persuaded... > > > > I'm also fine with not changing it. It isn't that important. I'm not as concerned about whether this one change does or does not happen, as I am about fairness in process. If we incorporate this one, we need to work through all the other alleged typos, wording improvements, and related churn that anyone on the list might bring up. Our primary responsibility is to make sure that what we put out is technically correct, and that any changes reflect operational experience and other improvements / fixes called out in our charter. Frankly, editorial stuff worries me at this stage only if we have a situation where an ambiguity or error in the text has led to implementation or interoperability problems. If the WG (and my co-chair) feel that another round of editorial polishing would be time well spent, I can't overrule y'all. But I'd really like to keep the priority on making sure all the technical stuff has been dealt with. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 5 12:39:06 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 103583A6A93 for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:39:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.348 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.348 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.251, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 75QkBDdWj4Dn for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:39:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3CAD13A6ABA for ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:39:05 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=kpJkfsMcv06EaouDw4s437SZuMCBq7D39WBpT4dI/0KNtnJdQ+leMXf+rjPQeRn7; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.31] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVB05-0007uN-PN for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 05 Feb 2009 15:39:06 -0500 Message-ID: <003d01c987d1$bf8440c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:38:47 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1734990b65832a317d2272fa2513d71d855350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.31 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 05 Feb 2009 20:39:06 -0000 Hi - As a co-chair: > From: "CE Whitehead" > To: > Cc: ; > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 9:46 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? ... > (QUESTION: By the way, is this the last call for editorial changes and corrections? Please let me know.) ... The LAST CALL was issued on February 8, 2008. Note the year. Anything arriving now is really, really, really, really overdue. As should be clear from my recent remarks, though you MAY post your comments to this list, I will oppose making any changes that are not justified in terms of technical correctness, implementation of WG consensus, interoperability, or operational experience. Co-chair Martin might be more (or even less) inclined to allow these, but you should know where I stand. Of course, the editors are free to apply purely editorial fixes at their own convenience when it is necessary to update the drafts for other reasons, but I would expect them to be judicious in this matter, and to keep in mind that the RFC editor will also be going through the material when publication time arrives. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 5 21:39:27 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 196453A6A49; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 21:39:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.088 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.088 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.511, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YC3lC2Its-dZ; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 21:39:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0887F3A6A0A; Thu, 5 Feb 2009 21:39:26 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Xey8w7XuOq2PXnPJnfuRHjkujNMmhWmDo3NeqoOJCYpoTpE/J0Tn/vEMiLcQJ6pT; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.35.158] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVJQz-00042u-FP; Fri, 06 Feb 2009 00:39:25 -0500 Message-ID: <002b01c9881d$3b66ed00$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 21:39:07 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1733f1e7517696c76f545f3750e72786a01350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.35.158 Cc: agentx@ietf.org, Disman Subject: [Ltru] Fw: Last Call for Comments: Proposed work-around to the Pre-5378 Problem X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 05:39:27 -0000 Hi - Forwarded for your information. Please followup on the ietf@ietf.org list rather than on this mailing list. Randy ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ed Juskevicius" > To: ; ; ; ; ; > Cc: "Trustees" ; "Contreras,Jorge" > Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 9:28 PM > Subject: Last Call for Comments: Proposed work-around to the Pre-5378 Problem > > The IETF Trustees met via telechat on February 5th to decide on some > proposed revisions to the "Legal Provisions Relating to IETF Documents" > policy, based on comments received from the community in the last two > weeks. Please recall this work is being done to provide a work-around for > authors having the 'pre-5378 problem'. > > The telechat was productive. The Trustees reached consensus to do the > following: > > 1) Clarify the copyright text at the beginning of the BSD license in > Section 4.1 to read as follows: > > Copyright (c) IETF Trust and the persons identified as its > authors. All rights reserved. > 2) Replace the word "and" by the word "or" in one place so that the last > sentence of Section 6.c.iii becomes: > > Without obtaining an adequate license from the person(s) controlling the > copyright in such materials, this document may not be modified outside the > IETF Standards Process, and derivative works of it may not be created > outside the IETF Standards Process, except to format it for publication as > an RFC or to translate it into languages other than English. > > 3) Fix some nits with respect to the inappropriate use of square brackets > '[' and ']' in two places. > > > The IETF Trust website has been updated with a new version of the draft > "Legal Provisions Relating to IETF Documents" including the changes > described in this message. Please look for the documents dated 2009-02-05 > at: > http://trustee.ietf.org/policyandprocedures.html . > > If you have any final comments on this, please post them before the end of > February 7th. This is the last call for comments. > > > Regards, > > > Ed Juskevicius, on behalf of the IETF Trustees > edj.etc@gmail.com > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Ietf mailing list > Ietf@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf > From quaiouestenglish@yahoo.com Fri Feb 6 08:55:25 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC4083A67DA for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 08:55:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dgyWn1IY-tv5 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 08:55:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from web58206.mail.re3.yahoo.com (web58206.mail.re3.yahoo.com [68.142.236.144]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id ECB6C3A676A for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 08:55:24 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 51736 invoked by uid 60001); 6 Feb 2009 16:55:27 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Reply-To:Subject:To:Cc:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Message-ID; b=fs/VBE6WFTv0X3fRnEOoQ9I7wvCZyNMszgYoESgHdAUxVuYzZJMiJYP0Cl5CzueVNQIZhvh1ObmSwOf4sswImnzen7MncdeKXpmRr7o3B+0nauZkWm5Gn20iH6sWJ6FIAry/ALzqsHWTx9RtO/1uYuvyDwmtefwkeKSOw5pUkDI=; X-YMail-OSG: UibBrckVM1nDkN3D__TqdyZAlI.pQ.Gt867QVjirGjVw6ZweZKSgHS.c3QIF3iHYPJ8_psvqHlzvMW6ist2NMMehivvBSZwwX8u9PpJiTcIdzYH7mevPSoMgvBA9QbuHmeF0Xt2mxG1KpvmhJVny5W.dAvdAmKY0jKv95fGwgbP3sPcTIEC9mC8jPyBw3G_L5fur4NHtDyiH6_vlWz2lV525 Received: from [198.252.156.11] by web58206.mail.re3.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 06 Feb 2009 08:55:26 PST X-Mailer: YahooMailWebService/0.7.260.1 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 08:55:26 -0800 (PST) From: Edith Whitehead To: ltru@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Message-ID: <42550.50871.qm@web58206.mail.re3.yahoo.com> X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 14:26:50 -0800 Cc: cewcathar@hotmail.com Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list Reply-To: quaiouestenglish@yahoo.com List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 17:22:10 -0000 Randy, Addison, I agree with Randy that the text Addision cited does not need changing at this time, but at the same time I see Addison's point that the keyword 'MAY' is confusing here. Here the draft is talking about an event that might/may/can happen as a result of changes to the registry. It is not anything that anyone must or should or could do. No one does anything. It happens. (The wind blows; you could turn a fan on and make it blow of course but you get my point So the keyword MAY is confusing I think) Nitpicking I guess but . . . (Sorry to write from this account; unfortunately for some reason I can only log into help central of my hotmail account this morning; I cannot display my mail or send any or retrieve addresses from that account--which is a pain as I have an urgent/worry email to get to someone and can't remember the email address--which is in the other account) Thanks. (I do have a few corrections to the grammar; will send separately.) From: "Randy Presuhn" Date: Thu, 5 Feb 2009 12:23:14 -0800 > Hi - > As a technical contributor... >> From: "Phillips, Addison" >> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" >> Sent: Thursday, February 05, 2009 7:15 AM >> Subject: RE: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? >> >> > > >> > > The problem isn't that is says "MAY"... >> > > But to have something say "MAY" enclose an example >> > > that says "MUST" makes no sense. It isn't "MAY" if >> > > you're required to do it. >> > >> > There currently is no "MUST" there. Do you mean we should >> > replace the existing "will" with "MUST"? >> >> The "MUST" is in the example: >> >> -- >> Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: >> >> Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferred-Value for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'. >I still see no real problem. Though it would have been incrementally >better from a "standards stylistic" perspective to have not used >"MUST" there, I do not see how its presence either requires any I don't see this because this is not a 'must;' there are 2 issues: (1), changes to one subtag MAY (or CAN) affect other subtags (2), because of this, when a subtag changes, the language subtag reviewer MUST review the registry The first is a MAY. The second is a MUST. However I tend to agree with Addison that the first may not need a keyword; it's not something anyone does; it's something that happens (on its own). The keyword MAY seems out of place and confusing and I agree with Addison that it may be best replaced with 'can.' Thanks. --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com > Randy From quaiouestenglish@yahoo.com Fri Feb 6 09:31:09 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2350428C128 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 09:31:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.091 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.091 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.508, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id p0WU8j7mMfSh for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 09:31:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com (web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com [68.142.236.139]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 23FEE28C0FF for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 09:31:07 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 49995 invoked by uid 60001); 6 Feb 2009 17:31:09 -0000 DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=X-YMail-OSG:Received:X-Mailer:Date:From:Subject:To:Cc:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:Message-ID; b=0/G9GglCi7DNGUoFyiTecfxAhXoPn1RMuK2L/yHmFif+HnlTK9K/PyMpJtKCwuS9osKigIYZH1oIxd1Q8JbaOgObF9VqVyRugcqadEzptKhgiA7Abpkx+ND7htsojTBULSasnFIUGOOg5XlKlmQBx2kHp70TODmgcFGsAB8pOYc=; X-YMail-OSG: DUdOJDkVM1nqUjF12gdoEeTtg31OY0RFPGX6dW7HLOHve5m6VvvyMiwGIuAQIPIp3uQsBl2gVfgvdArOF_ISABAUN.G_BOjS8Kh.m_GWiMrxBrrmaiJ4s66zWxu6XhjWTLyKIQhr3q5LQoRFoyWlBoBC8ISocntSnkbkghy_Z.TZk2gSGBeuAs.h.ZwQe2YM95zVa0BkPRNeQFg- Received: from [70.88.11.82] by web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 06 Feb 2009 09:31:08 PST X-Mailer: YahooMailWebService/0.7.260.1 Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 09:31:08 -0800 (PST) From: Edith Whitehead To: ltru@ietf.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-ID: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> X-Mailman-Approved-At: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 14:27:21 -0800 Cc: cewcathar@hotmail.com Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 06 Feb 2009 17:31:09 -0000 Hi, sorry I must write from this email address.=20 (my hotmail account won't display or send mail only let me complain not sur= e for how long it will be that way) I went through the entire draft albeit late and have included most of my ed= its (except a few which were minor and picky) below. There were two glarin= g typos, then a third case with no subject antecedent (Section I) that MUST= be corrected in my opinion. The next section (II) has one item that really SHOULD be fixed because the = sense is not really clear. The next section (III) has a variety of changes I'd like to see including t= he correction of the 'mo' 'ro' example. Finally, a request for clarification about should, shall, and must, in sect= ion IV. Sorry to get these to you so late. That is my error. Please if you can at least look at section I and probably section II. Thanks & best wishes. --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com I. Changes that are absolutely essential--to make this grammatical--indicat= ed with=20 '!' before the number/location of the tex to be changed ! 4.1 par 3 =20 { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 " Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this document normatively but apply different rules to the ones given in this section MUST specify how language tag selection varies from the guidelines given here." =20 { ! CORRECTION: CHANGE: "different rules to the . . . " > "rules differen= t than those . . . " you can say : "rules different than," "rules different from," or "diffe= rent rules than," =20 but where do you get "different rules to"? It's not English. (the use of prepositions is a bit quirky from language to language) * * ?? Also, CHANGE: "apply" to "adhere to" or simply "follow" (I like "adher= e to" better; "apply" might be a word you use with applications and rules but I do not us= e it with anything but formatting, "formatting is applied . . ." * * ? Also, CHANGE: "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is more cohes= ive with 'those' because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that Halliday has ab= out cohesion too) } > "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this document normatively but adhere to rules different than those given in this secti= on . . . " =20 * * * ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet=20 {ORIGINAL TEXT } " Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the language a casual user might expect, especially if when relying on the subtag's description in the registry. " {! CORRECTION: delete either "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a bit redun= dant, right? } > "Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the language a cas= ual user might expect, especially when . . . " * * * ! 4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last sentence=20 {ORIGINAL TEXT} "o A language priority list [RFC4647] describing a user's language preferences. This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially- unrelated varieties, expressing a preference, rather than as a declaration about actual content." {! CORRECTION: delete "as"; you don't say "This is . . . as a declaratio= n . . . " here! The verb "is" is the verb that goes with both items (it 'i= s a . . . list' not 'a declaration')--with no "as" after either item; "Thi= s is a . . . list . . . " "rather than a declaration . . ."!} > "This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrelated varieties, e= xpressing a preference, rather than a declaration of actual content." =20 * * * ! 5.1, par 4, sentence 2 =20 { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate section; there= is no guarantee of the order of the records beyond grouping them together b= y 'Type'." {! COMMENT:/CORRECTION Here there is no subject antecedent for "grouping" = so I'm left wondering WHO will group the records by type, clearly ietf, an= d iana but there's no antecedent! So it's not good grammar at all to say "= beyond grouping them by type" The passive voice is a possible solution here= . Dometimes the passive is the clearest form to use, for example when ther= e is no real subject, and even sometimes simply to make it clear that the f= ocus is on the recipient of the action.=20 =20 ALSO, sometimes it is better to repeat an item referred to as a pronoun rat= her than constantly renaming it. Repeating it as a pronoun helps to establ= ish cohesion [see M.A.K. Halliday, "Cohesion in English" for more on this].= Thus I replaced the second occurance of "[the] records" here, in "of the r= ecords", with the pronoun "their" I suppose that referring to "records" as= "the records"--with a definite article--in the second instance also helps = to establish cohesion here but I prefer simply using the pronoun! Not sure= why . . . } =20 > "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate section; ther= e is no guarantee of their order beyond their being grouped together by 'Ty= pe'." =20 * * * END SECTION I CHANGES THAT ARE ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL * * * II. Changes that should be made but where the text is not glaringly ungram= matical; again indicated with a '!' because I really think these are important chang= es * * * =20 ! 4.4.2 Par 1, last sentence=20 =20 { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 " Such truncation MUST NOT permit a subtag to be chopped off in the middle or the formation of invalid tags (for example, one ending with the "-" character)." =20 {! COMMENT/CORRECTION: you need grammatical parallelism since both items a= re juxtaposed [as parallels] semantically here]--"to be chopped off in the = middle" and "invalid tags" However in truth, "being chopped off in the mid= dle" [that is in the middle of a subtag, or right after a hyphen] is a sema= ntic sub-category of "invalid tags" to juxtapose these as two different th= ings, you need a more specific phrase than "invalid tags" and it's this ph= rase that needs to be made syntactically parallel to ""to be chopped off in= the middle" And since it's better to use an active verb when possible I us= ed a gerund; I hope the subject antecedent to the gerund is clear here} =20 > "Such truncation MUST NOT permit the formation of invalid tags--either by= chopping a subtag off in the middle, or by leaving a singleton without any= subtag." * * * END SECTION II CHANGES THAT SHOULD BE MADE * * * III. Changes I'd like to see but that are not really 'should's just 'would= s-be-nice'-- indicated with a '?' before the number/location of the text to be changed ? 3.5 "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4, 2nd sentence { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 " Note that each response is not limited in size so that the request can adequately describe the registration." {COMMENTS: the word "response" is not clear here, and this sentence is awkw= ard and unclear as a whole. =20 CLARIFICATION?: I was not sure what fields you meant, but assumed you meant= fields 4-6?? CORRECTION: I indicated these field numbers in parentheses! I split the wh= ole into two sentences. (Phrases/words in brackets are optional ways to sa= y things; brackets should be removed of course.) } =20 > "There is no restriction on the amount of information that can be provide= d in the fields numbered 4-6 ("Intended meaning . . . ", "Reference . . . = ", "Any other relevant information . . . "). This permits an adequate [or = 'complete'?] description of the request [ or 'record being requested'?]" * * * ? 3.7 par 4 & 5 { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 " IANA will maintain a registry of allocated single-character (singleton) subtags. This registry MUST use the record-jar format described by the ABNF in Section 3.1. Upon publication of an extension as an RFC, the maintaining authority defined in the RFC MUST forward this registration form to iesg@ietf.org, who MUST forward the request to iana@iana.org. The maintaining authority of the extension MUST maintain the accuracy of the record by sending an updated full copy of the record to iana@iana.org with the subject line "LANGUAGE TAG EXTENSION UPDATE" whenever content changes. Only the 'Comments', 'Contact_Email', 'Mailing_List', and 'URL' fields MAY be modified in these updates. Failure to maintain this record, maintain the corresponding registry, or meet other conditions imposed by this section of this document MAY be appealed to the IESG [RFC2028] under the same rules as other IETF decisions (see [RFC2026]) and MAY result in the authority to maintain the extension being withdrawn or reassigned by the IESG." {COMMENT: the two maintaining authorities, IANA, and the individual author= ity, might be confused by readers here?? =20 =20 I'd use "maintaining authority" always to refer to the second; and IANA to refer to the first & no pronoun,& no ellipsis; thus, in paragraph 4, CORRECT:} =20 > "Failure on the part of the maintaining authority to maintain this record= . . . " =20 * * * ? 4.1 Par 5=20 =20 { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 " A subtag SHOULD only be used when it adds useful distinguishing information to the tag. Extraneous subtags interfere with the meaning, understanding, and processing of language tags. In particular, users and implementations SHOULD follow the 'Prefix' and 'Suppress-Script' fields in the registry (defined in Section 3.1): these fields provide guidance on when specific additional subtags SHOULD be used or avoided in a language tag." {COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 1: the way it's written, someone might interpret it as meaning that all subta= gs, including a primary language subtag, are optional, but a primary langua= ge subtag is really a good idea, a real SHOULD} =20 INSERT AT BEGINNING--replace sentence 1 with 2 sentences=20 > "All language tags--except those that are exclusively private use--SHOULD= include one (primary) language subtag. Any additional subtag SHOULD only = be included when it adds useful distinguishing information to the tag. " =20 * * ?? {A SECOND COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 3: word choice; change "follo= w" to "consult" I would never say "follow" for either unless I said "follow the guidelines . . ."; "consult" is the be= st word with "users" probably; not sure at all about implementations but I = would not say "follow"} > "In particular, both users and implementations SHOULD consult ['be guided= by'--in passive voice--is the only other option here] the 'Prefix' and 'Suppress-Script' fields in the registry (defined in Section 3.1): these fields provide guidance on when specific additional subtags SHOULD be used or avoided in a language tag." * * * ? 4.1 par 6 item 2 example second bullet last sentence=20 =20 { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 "(The tag "uz-Zxxx" could also be used where content is not written, as the subtag 'Zxxx' represents the "Code for unwritten documents".)" { COMMENT/CORRECTION I do not see what clarity or information the word 'cod= e' adds to this sentence so I CORRECTED it } > "The tag "uz-Zxxx" could also be used where content is not written as the script sub= tag 'Zxxx' is used to indicate unwritten documents"=20 =20 * * * ? 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence =20 { ORIGINAL TEXT } =20 "For example, Romanian ('ro') and Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far more closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') , which do share a macrolanguage." {! COMMENT: the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the subt= ags has now been deprecated; [ca] and [oc], 'Catalan' and 'Occitan'/'Proven= cal,' would be better examples; alternately you might choose [gsw] 'Alsatian' or 'Schwyzerd=FCtsch' and [s= wg] 'Swabian'--but I know less about Alsatian; There may be other possibilities; on a quick perusal of RFC 4645 I did not = find khmer, for example, though I discovered there are some maybe mutually = intelligible varieties any & know little about Asian languages anyway} * * * 4.2 par 5=20 { ORIGINAL TEXT } " This relationship is not guaranteed in all cases: specifically, languages that begin with the same sequence of subtags are NOT guaranteed to be mutually intelligible, although they might be. For example, the tag "az" shares a prefix with both "az-Latn" (Azerbaijani written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl" (Azerbaijani written using the Cyrillic script). A person fluent in one script might not be able to read the other, even though the linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts were read aloud) might be identical. Content tagged as "az" most probably is written in just one script and thus might not be intelligible to a reader familiar with the other script." {COMMENT/CORRECTION I found the language, 'this relationship is not guaran= teed,' kind of vague. Also I did not like the phrase, 'written in just one = script'--an example specifying one of the two scripts might help make this = sentence clearer to someone skimming this. I tried to rewrite this paragra= ph: I simplified the first sentence and used more specific language (the w= ord 'always' here, does refer the reader back to what's been said in the pa= ragraph above about the general relationship between language tags sharing = a prefix--one that we now see does not always guarantee mutual intelligibil= ity); I also rewrote slightly the second sentence, and inserted "however" (= to tie back to the previous statement) "only" into the fourth sentence.} =20 > ?? "Tags that share the same prefix are not always mutually intelligible.= For example, the prefix 'az' is shared by both "az-Latn" (Azerbaijani wr= itten using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl" (Azerbaijani written using the = Cyrillic script). A person fluent in one script might not be able to read t= he other, even though the linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts were read aloud) might be identical. However, content tagged as "az" most probably is= written in just one of these scripts and thus might not be intelligible to= a reader familiar with only the other script." =20 * * * ? 4.5 par 2 item 4 & par 4 "Example . . . " { ORIGINAL TEXT } " 4. Other subtags that have a Preferred-Value field in the IANA registry (see Section 3.1) MUST be replaced with their mapped value. Most of these are either Region subtags where the country name or designation has changed or clerical corrections to ISO 639-1. 5. If more than one extension subtag sequence exists, the extension sequences are ordered into case-insensitive ASCII order by singleton subtag (that is, the subtag sequence '-a-babble' comes before '-b-warble'). Example: The language tag "en-a-aaa-b-ccc-bbb-x-xyz" is in canonical form, while "en-b-ccc-bbb-a-aaa-X-xyz" is well-formed and potentially valid (extensions 'a' and 'b' are not defined as of the publication of this document) but not in canonical form (the extensions are not in alphabetical order). Example: Although the tag "en-BU" (English as used in Burma) maintains its validity, the language tag "en-BU" is not canonical because the 'BU' subtag has a canonical mapping to 'MM' (Myanmar)." =20 { COMMENT/CORRECTION: the first example actually goes with item 5 & the sec= ond with item 4 so it's confusing; I prefer to have the examples with the i= tems they illustrate; thus I'd move the second of the examples so that it f= ollowed item 4-- } =20 { Move : "Example: Although the tag 'en-BU' . . . "=20 =20 to right after item 4 } =20 > " 4. Other subtags that have a Preferred-Value field in the IANA registry (see Section 3.1) MUST be replaced with their mapped value. Most of these are either Region subtags where the country name or designation has changed or clerical corrections to ISO 639-1. Example: Although the tag "en-BU" (English as used in Burma) maintains its validity, the language tag "en-BU" is not canonical because the 'BU' subtag has a canonical mapping to 'MM' (Myanmar). 5. If more than one extension subtag sequence exists, the extension sequences are ordered into case-insensitive ASCII order by singleton subtag (that is, the subtag sequence '-a-babble' comes before '-b-warble'). Example: The language tag "en-a-aaa-b-ccc-bbb-x-xyz" is in canonical form, while "en-b-ccc-bbb-a-aaa-X-xyz" is well-formed and potentially valid (extensions 'a' and 'b' are not defined as of the publication of this document) but not in canonical form (the extensions are not in alphabetical order)." =20 * * * END SECTION III CHANGES I'D LIKE TO SEE * * * IV Requests for Clarification Only--indicated with '??' ?? 3.5 par 21 { ORIGINAL TEXT } "Registrations initiated due to the provisions of Section 3.3 or Section 3.4 SHALL NOT be rejected altogether (since they have to ultimately appear in the registry) and SHOULD be completed as quickly as possible. The review process allows list members to comment on the specific information in the form and the record it contains and thus help ensure that it is correct and consistent. The Language Subtag Reviewer MAY reject a specific version of the form, but MUST propose a suitable replacement, extending the review period as described above, until the form is in a format worthy of reviewer's approval and meets with rough consensus of the list." =20 {! COMMENT/CLARIFICATION ? Please explain "SHALL NOT" versus "MUST NOT"-- =20 * * * END SECTION IV CLARIFICATIONS * * * =20 These are all my comments; I've read all sections. =20 --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com=20 =0A=0A=0A From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 6 16:11:47 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABA393A6A30 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 16:11:47 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.481 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.481 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.118, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4Kf8UQvZNsJC for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 16:11:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0980A3A6B70 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 16:11:45 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=aGBoiV9ykXXpBN1eLedNGfptpss5YZqMc2v1kXi9vK0ZqDLbFjZBNCJNeiHIyZTj; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.204.55] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVanT-0003ha-Si for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 06 Feb 2009 19:11:48 -0500 Message-ID: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 16:11:29 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731f41c9f2215d5c6471de91464f52ebcc350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.55 Subject: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 00:11:47 -0000 Hi - Subject line changed for tracking sanity.... As a technical contributor... > From: "Edith Whitehead" > To: > Cc: ; ; ; > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 9:31 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated... ... > ! 4.1 par 3 > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > " Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this document > normatively but apply different rules to the ones given in this > section MUST specify how language tag selection varies from the > guidelines given here." > > { ! CORRECTION: CHANGE: "different rules to the . . . " > "rules different than those . . . " > you can say : "rules different than," "rules different from," or "different rules than," > but where do you get "different rules to"? It's not English. Nor is "different rules than". If folks feel a need for a change, "rules different from" would be more acceptible. ... > ?? Also, CHANGE: "apply" to "adhere to" or simply "follow" (I like "adhere to" better; > "apply" might be a word you use with applications and rules but I do not use it with anything but formatting, > "formatting is applied . . ." Disagree. I see no need for this change. ... > ? Also, CHANGE: "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is more cohesive with 'those' > because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that Halliday has about cohesion too) } Disagree. I see no need for this change. > "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this document > normatively but adhere to rules different than those given in this section . . . " This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong, and I cannot support it. ... > ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet > > {ORIGINAL TEXT } > " Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the > language a casual user might expect, especially if when > relying on the subtag's description in the registry. " > > {! CORRECTION: delete either "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a bit redundant, right? } Yup. However, the entire phrase "especially...registry" is not helpful to the sense of the paragraph in question. Consequently, I think that if a change is to be made, it would be better to delete everything from the comma to the word "registry". ... > ! 4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last sentence > > {ORIGINAL TEXT} > "o A language priority list [RFC4647] describing a user's language > preferences. This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially- > unrelated varieties, expressing a preference, rather than as a > declaration about actual content." ... > "This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrelated varieties, > expressing a preference, rather than a declaration of actual content." Yup. However, this sentence is entirely redundant, so if there is going to be a change, I'd rather just delete it. > ! 5.1, par 4, sentence 2 > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate section; there is > no guarantee of the order of the records beyond grouping them together by 'Type'." ... > "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate section; there > is no guarantee of their order beyond their being grouped together by 'Type'." Ok. This "can" probably should be a MAY, but it's not a big deal and it's not worth changing. ... > ! 4.4.2 Par 1, last sentence > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > " Such truncation MUST NOT > permit a subtag to be chopped off in the middle or the formation of > invalid tags (for example, one ending with the "-" character)." ... > "Such truncation MUST NOT permit the formation of invalid tags-- > either by chopping a subtag off in the middle, or by leaving a singleton without any subtag." Disagree. The original text is gramamtically and technically correct. The proposed text changes the meaning in a subtly incompatible way. Consider the case where chopping a subtag in the middle does *not* result in an invalid tag, but instead produces a tag containing a subtag not present in the original. .... > ? 3.5 "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4, 2nd sentence > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > " Note that each response is not limited in > size so that the request can adequately describe the registration." > > {COMMENTS: the word "response" is not clear here, and this sentence > is awkward and unclear as a whole. I think the sentence is abundantly clear in context, and see no need for change. ... > ? 3.7 par 4 & 5 ... > {COMMENT: the two maintaining authorities, IANA, and the individual > authority, might be confused by readers here?? ... Given the topic of the section, I find it difficult to imagine such confusion taking place. > "Failure on the part of the maintaining authority to maintain this record . . . " It's difficult to keep a straight face when reading the proposed replacement. ... > ? 4.1 Par 5 > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > " A subtag SHOULD only be used when it adds useful distinguishing > information to the tag. Extraneous subtags interfere with the > meaning, understanding, and processing of language tags. In > particular, users and implementations SHOULD follow the 'Prefix' and > 'Suppress-Script' fields in the registry (defined in Section 3.1): > these fields provide guidance on when specific additional subtags > SHOULD be used or avoided in a language tag." > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 1: > the way it's written, someone might interpret it as meaning that all subtags, > including a primary language subtag, are optional, but a primary language > subtag is really a good idea, a real SHOULD} > > INSERT AT BEGINNING--replace sentence 1 with 2 sentences > > "All language tags--except those that are exclusively private use-- > SHOULD include one (primary) language subtag. Any additional > subtag SHOULD only be included when it adds useful distinguishing > information to the tag. " Strongly disagree. This changes the sense of the text. [As co-chair: it took extensive discussion to reach agreement on this text, and I'm extremely relectuant to even consider changes to it unless something is demonstrably broken.] > ?? {A SECOND COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 3: word > choice; change "follow" to "consult" I would never say "follow" > for either unless I said "follow the guidelines . . ."; "consult" > is the best word with "users" probably; not sure at all about > implementations but I would not say "follow"} Disagree. While I appreciate the preference for "consult", it does not mean the same thing as "follow". ... > ? 4.1 par 6 item 2 example second bullet last sentence > > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > > "(The tag "uz-Zxxx" > could also be used where content is not written, as the subtag > 'Zxxx' represents the "Code for unwritten documents".)" > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION I do not see what clarity or information > the word 'code' adds to this sentence so I CORRECTED it } I believe it's a quote from the subtag's registry enty. > "The tag "uz-Zxxx" > could also be used where content is not written as the script subtag 'Zxxx' is used to indicate unwritten documents" I think this would be a step backwards, since it de-emphasizes the generative nature of subtags. ... > ? 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence > > ORIGINAL TEXT } > > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and > Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far more > closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu ('wuu') , > which do share a macrolanguage." > {! COMMENT: the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one of the > subtags has now been deprecated; [ca] and [oc], 'Catalan' and > 'Occitan'/'Provencal,' would be better examples; > alternately you might choose [gsw] 'Alsatian' or 'Schwyzerdtsch' > and [swg] 'Swabian'--but I know less about Alsatian; > There may be other possibilities; on a quick perusal of RFC 4645 > I did not find khmer, for example, though I discovered there are some > maybe mutually intelligible varieties any & know little about Asian > languages anyway} Strongly disagree. The example serves its purpose as it is, and none of the cases cited is as dramatic and clear-cut as that of Romanian and Moldavian. (Which explains nicely *why* the subtag met the fate that it did.) [As co-chair: there already seems to be a rough consensus to not change this section.] > 4.2 par 5 > { ORIGINAL TEXT } > " This relationship is not guaranteed in all cases: specifically, > languages that begin with the same sequence of subtags are NOT > guaranteed to be mutually intelligible, although they might be. For > example, the tag "az" shares a prefix with both "az-Latn" > (Azerbaijani written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl" > (Azerbaijani written using the Cyrillic script). A person fluent in > one script might not be able to read the other, even though the > linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts were read > aloud) might be identical. Content tagged as "az" most probably is > written in just one script and thus might not be intelligible to a > reader familiar with the other script." > {COMMENT/CORRECTION I found the language, 'this relationship > is not guaranteed,' kind of vague. Also I did not like the phrase, 'written > in just one script'--an example specifying one of the two scripts might help > make this sentence clearer to someone skimming this. I tried to rewrite > this paragraph: I simplified the first sentence and used more specific > language (the word 'always' here, does refer the reader back to what's > been said in the paragraph above about the general relationship between > language tags sharing a prefix--one that we now see does not always > guarantee mutual intelligibility); I also rewrote slightly the second sentence, > and inserted "however" (to tie back to the previous statement) > "only" into the fourth sentence.} > > ?? "Tags that share the same prefix are not always mutually intelligible. > For example, the prefix 'az' is shared by both "az-Latn" (Azerbaijani > written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl" (Azerbaijani written using > the Cyrillic script). A person fluent in one script might not be able to > read the other, even though the > linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts were read > aloud) might be identical. However, content tagged as "az" most > probably is written in just one of these scripts and thus might not > be intelligible to a reader familiar with only the other script." Disagree. The change to the first sentence makes it sound like mutual intelligibility is normally presumed when there is a shared prefix, and that cases like this are rare exceptions. The existing text is clearer and more to the point. > ? 4.5 par 2 item 4 & par 4 "Example . . . " ... > { COMMENT/CORRECTION: the first example actually goes with item > 5 & the second with item 4 so it's confusing; I prefer to have the examples > with the items they illustrate; thus I'd move the second of the examples > so that it followed item 4-- } I'm neutral on this proposal. I see the benefits to interspersing the examples with the list of rules, but I also see advantages to the current organization with the examples following the rules. I'm not persuaded at all that this is a change that in any way *needs* to be made. ... > ?? 3.5 par 21 ... > {! COMMENT/CLARIFICATION ? Please explain "SHALL NOT" versus "MUST NOT"-- This is spelled out in RFC 2119. Randy From doug@ewellic.org Fri Feb 6 20:26:28 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B915828C105 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 20:26:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.032 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.032 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.566, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id S5DZ8Dl40LXu for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 20:26:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth22.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth22.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C212428C0FF for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 20:26:27 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 29882 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2009 04:26:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth22.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.44) with ESMTP; 07 Feb 2009 04:26:29 -0000 Message-ID: <011A00757D32439AAE05CC83B6F7AD54@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:26:25 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 04:26:28 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: >> Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when >> proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer will >> review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary >> changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for >> Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: >> >> Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later >> changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferred-Value >> for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'. > > I still see no real problem. Though it would have been incrementally > better from a "standards stylistic" perspective to have not used > "MUST" there, I do not see how its presence either requires any > unintended behaviour or forbids anything we wanted to happen. This > "MUST" is still congruent with the RFC 2119 sense. The problem isn't with the MUST, but with the MAY that precedes it. As I remember the discussion from last year, we agreed that Preferred-Value references should -- nay, MUST -- be updated when necessary to get rid of these chains of pointers. This was an intentional change from RFC 4646. I can look up the discussion in the archives if needed. I remembered that I would have to change my app to meet this new requirement. The real problem is with the RFC 2119 MAY, which appears to contradict the MUST which follows, which would not have been seen as a problem if a regular old ordinary "may" had been used. While I don't insist on changing any of this text at this phenomenally late date, the fact remains that "MAY" in the sense of "is allowed or permitted to" is not the same as "may" in the sense of "could happen, or could possibly result in." It "may" snow in Denver this weekend. That is not an RFC 2119 "MAY"; nobody is granting permission to the heavens to drop fluffy cold white stuff on us. It is simply not correct to mechanically uppercase all occurrences of the word "may" in an Internet-Draft as though it always specifies an optional feature. As long as the currently proposed draft-4646bis text allows and supports the change I proposed for draft-4645bis, to remove the Preferred-Value for 'YU' which currently points to another deprecated subtag, I am fine with it. This is not a matter of editorial nitpicking; the 4645bis change raised a semantic question about the intent of the 4646bis passage. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From doug@ewellic.org Fri Feb 6 20:29:05 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 68CBE3A6C4F for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 20:29:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.048 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.048 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.550, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ErCzNPvVwo91 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 20:29:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpout10.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout10-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.235]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 9B8A43A6C31 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 20:29:04 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 31692 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2009 04:29:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout10.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.235) with ESMTP; 07 Feb 2009 04:29:06 -0000 Message-ID: <93A1CD4F2D9C44A998514BA7B0C75402@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:29:03 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 04:29:05 -0000 Randy Presuhn made numerous comments, some positive and some negative, about CE Whitehead's proposed editorial changes. I thought Randy had just gotten done saying that the time for editorial changes had passed. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 6 21:13:01 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC14A3A68F5 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:13:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.364 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.364 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.235, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Z7MInvmw6XJd for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:13:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEEF93A67A8 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:13:00 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=K+4rIwB0eh0SPsXmA03+vlOT+/DQItPU5RoK55UWiiSbP6mJt5H6l0pRviq40XVI; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.146.168] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVfUz-0002xH-8y for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 07 Feb 2009 00:13:01 -0500 Message-ID: <000601c988e2$b5d08d60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <011A00757D32439AAE05CC83B6F7AD54@DGBP7M81> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:12:43 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17383a3a357cf72b3b9f737e755cc3ae0f3350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.146.168 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 05:13:02 -0000 Hi - As a technical contributor... > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 8:26 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? > > Randy Presuhn wrote: > > >> Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when > >> proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer will > >> review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary > >> changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for > >> Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: > >> > >> Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later > >> changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferred-Value > >> for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'. > > > > I still see no real problem. Though it would have been incrementally > > better from a "standards stylistic" perspective to have not used > > "MUST" there, I do not see how its presence either requires any > > unintended behaviour or forbids anything we wanted to happen. This > > "MUST" is still congruent with the RFC 2119 sense. > > The problem isn't with the MUST, but with the MAY that precedes it. :-) Look further back in the exchange, and you'll see I was responding to a comment that the problem wasn't with the MAY, but with the MUST. > As I remember the discussion from last year, we agreed that > Preferred-Value references should -- nay, MUST -- be updated when > necessary to get rid of these chains of pointers. This was an > intentional change from RFC 4646. I can look up the discussion in the > archives if needed. I remembered that I would have to change my app to > meet this new requirement. That would have been a powerful argument against making the change in the first place. However, something about the claim doesn't add up. Code which is able to follow Preferred-Value chains will not have a problem with a registry in which such chains do not happen. > The real problem is with the RFC 2119 MAY, which appears to contradict > the MUST which follows, which would not have been seen as a problem if a > regular old ordinary "may" had been used. While I don't insist on > changing any of this text at this phenomenally late date, the fact > remains that "MAY" in the sense of "is allowed or permitted to" is not > the same as "may" in the sense of "could happen, or could possibly > result in." True, but the statement that a change is permitted to impact others is nonetheless true. > It "may" snow in Denver this weekend. That is not an RFC 2119 "MAY"; > nobody is granting permission to the heavens to drop fluffy cold white > stuff on us. > > It is simply not correct to mechanically uppercase all occurrences of > the word "may" in an Internet-Draft as though it always specifies an > optional feature. True, but it does not cause a problem in this case, and I think it's perfectly resonable to consider this an optional feature. > As long as the currently proposed draft-4646bis text allows and supports > the change I proposed for draft-4645bis, to remove the Preferred-Value > for 'YU' which currently points to another deprecated subtag, I am fine > with it. This is not a matter of editorial nitpicking; the 4645bis > change raised a semantic question about the intent of the 4646bis > passage. I think it's quite clear that the WG consensus was to permit changes to Preferred-Value information in cases like this, to avoid requiring implementations to walk pointer chains. It's a change I think we could have done without, but it was agreed and it's not time to second-guess it. I *still* don't see how the existing wording requires anything we wish to prohibit, or prohibits anything we wish to allow. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 6 21:22:57 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D9AF3A69BC for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:22:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.372 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.372 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.227, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zjqn4cQ8mTo3 for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:22:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CBF13A69ED for ; Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:22:25 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=WhmFXsIs+nUS8xgjY5lWMKpx1GcGXWEPSjxiHi4qpDXW+sdaM1oDog4TPGUfvZgD; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.146.168] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVfe3-00014G-4J for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 07 Feb 2009 00:22:23 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01c988e4$04c1caa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <93A1CD4F2D9C44A998514BA7B0C75402@DGBP7M81> Date: Fri, 6 Feb 2009 21:22:05 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173a3853eafab849bdba6e8cb507115e936350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.146.168 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bisi-d X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 05:22:57 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 8:29 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bisi-d > > Randy Presuhn made > numerous comments, some positive and some negative, about CE Whitehead's > proposed editorial changes. > > I thought Randy had just gotten done saying that the time for editorial > changes had passed. As co-chair: Yes, I thought I had made that point emphatically. As a technical contributor: I think it should also be quite clear that I do not think *any* of those changes are *necessary* at this stage. However, when someone makes the effort to do a careful review, I think we owe them the courtesy of at least reviewing the proposals and giving them a "sanity check" in case the editors find themselves in a position to incorporate such changes. As should be clear from my comments, it is possible for a well-intended "purely editorial" change to have unintended negative consequences. Consequently, (as a WG co-chair) I'd rather have comments on such proposals on the record, rather than leaving them entirely to the editors' discretion at this stage. Randy From cewcathar@hotmail.com Sat Feb 7 07:34:15 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F2F73A6C68 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2009 07:34:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.281 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.281 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.317, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PtjxEUeK6CMb for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2009 07:34:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from blu0-omc3-s33.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s33.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.108]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED3123A6C61 for ; Sat, 7 Feb 2009 07:34:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from BLU109-W56 ([65.55.116.73]) by blu0-omc3-s33.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Sat, 7 Feb 2009 07:34:17 -0800 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_e1d54034-98c5-496a-a8f3-8feeac284a9a_" X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11] From: CE Whitehead To: Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 10:34:16 -0500 Importance: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Feb 2009 15:34:17.0236 (UTC) FILETIME=[89A76540:01C98939] Cc: doug@ewellic.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 15:34:15 -0000 --_e1d54034-98c5-496a-a8f3-8feeac284a9a_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi=2C I tend to agree with Doug here that the problem is with "MAY=3B" howe= ver I do not support lower-casing it=2C preferring Addison's suggestion to = replace it with "can" (which is not a keyword) to avoid any confusion (othe= rwise it will look like a typo I think). Substituting "can" for "may" eliminates the "may" issue here=3B unless we w= ant to insist that we are granting permission for one change to affect othe= rs=2C then I see no reason whatsoever for "MAY" here=3B "can" will do. From: "Randy Presuhn" =20 Date: Fri=2C 6 Feb 2009 21:12:43 -0800 > Hi- > As a technical contributor... >> From: "Doug Ewell" >> To: "LTRU Working Group" >> Sent: Friday=2C February 06=2C 2009 8:26 PM >> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU? > >> Randy Presuhn wrote: >>=20 >>> >> Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when=20 >>> >> proposing changes to the registry=2C the Language Subtag Reviewer wi= ll=20 >> >> review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary=20 >> >> changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for= =20 >> >> Subtags)=2C although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: >> >> >> >> Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later= =20 >> >> changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ'=2C then the Preferred-Value= =20 >> >> for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'. >> > >> > I still see no real problem. Though it would have been incrementally= =20 >> > better from a "standards stylistic" perspective to have not used=20 >> > "MUST" there=2C I do not see how its presence either requires any=20 >> > unintended behaviour or forbids anything we wanted to happen. This=20 >> > "MUST" is still congruent with the RFC 2119 sense. Agreed "MUST" is what we want to say I think.=20 >> The problem isn't with the MUST=2C but with the MAY that precedes it. I think so too. >:-) Look further back in the exchange=2C and you'll see I was responding >to a comment that the problem wasn't with the MAY=2C but with the MUST. >> As I remember the discussion from last year=2C we agreed that=20 >> Preferred-Value references should -- nay=2C MUST -- be updated when=20 >> necessary to get rid of these chains of pointers. This was an=20 >> intentional change from RFC 4646. I can look up the discussion in the=20 >> archives if needed. I remembered that I would have to change my app to= =20 >> meet this new requirement. That makes sense. > That would have been a powerful argument against making the change > in the first place. However=2C something about the claim doesn't add up. > Code which is able to follow Preferred-Value chains will not have > a problem with a registry in which such chains do not happen. =20 >> The real problem is with the RFC 2119 MAY=2C which appears to contradict= =20 >> the MUST which follows=2C which would not have been seen as a problem if= a=20 >> regular old ordinary "may" had been used. While I don't insist on I lik= e Addison's "can" here. >> changing any of this text at this phenomenally late date=2C the fact=20 >> remains that "MAY" in the sense of "is allowed or permitted to" is not=20 >> the same as "may" in the sense of "could happen=2C or could possibly=20 >> result in." > True=2C but the statement that a change is permitted to impact others > is nonetheless true.Hmm. This is a fine point here. =20 >> It "may" snow in Denver this weekend. That is not an RFC 2119 "MAY"=3B= =20 >> nobody is granting permission to the heavens to drop fluffy cold white=20 >> stuff on us.This is my opinion too. >=20 >> It is simply not correct to mechanically uppercase all occurrences of=20 >> the word "may" in an Internet-Draft as though it always specifies an=20 >> optional feature. Again substituting "can" for "may" eliminates the "may" issue here=3B unles= s we wantto insist that we are granting permission for one change to affect= others=2C then I see no reason whatsoever for "MAY" here=3B"can" will do.= =20 --C. E. Whiteheadcewcathar@hotmail.com (ah my email is back working=3B hop= e the different account did not cause confusion)= --_e1d54034-98c5-496a-a8f3-8feeac284a9a_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi=2C I ten= d to agree with Doug here that the problem is with "MAY=3B" however I do no= t support lower-casing it=2C preferring Addison's suggestion to replace it = with "can" (which is not a keyword) to avoid any confusion (otherwise it wi= ll look like a typo I think).

Substituting "can" for "may" e= liminates the "may" issue here=3B unless we want to insist that we are granting permission for one= change to affect others=2C then I see no reason whatsoever for "MAY" here= =3B "can" will do.
<= /FONT>
From: "Randy Presuhn" <=3Brandy_presuhn at mindspring.com>=3B
Date: Fri=2C 6 Feb 2009 21:12:43 -0800 
>=3B Hi-

>=3B As a technical contributor...

>=3B>=3B From: "Doug Ewell" <=3Bdoug at ewellic.org>=3B
>=3B>=3B To: "LTRU Working Group" <=3Bltru at ietf.org>=3B
>=3B>=3B Sent: Friday=2C February 06=2C 2009 8:26 PM
>=3B>=3B Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU?
>=3B
>=3B>=3B Randy Presuhn <=3Brandy underscore presuhn at mindspring dot=
 com>=3B wrote:
>=3B>=3B=20
>=3B>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subt=
ags as well: when=20
>=3B>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B proposing changes to the registry=2C the La=
nguage Subtag Reviewer will=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B review the registry for such effects and propose =
the necessary=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registr=
ation Procedure for=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B Subtags)=2C although anyone MAY request such chan=
ges. For example:
>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of=
 'YY'. If 'YY' later=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ'=2C then=
 the Preferred-Value=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B>=3B for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'.
>=3B>=3B >=3B
>=3B>=3B >=3B I still see no real problem.  Though it would have been=
 incrementally=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B better from a "standards stylistic" perspective to have=
 not used=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B "MUST" there=2C I do not see how its presence either re=
quires any=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B unintended behaviour or forbids anything we wanted to h=
appen.  This=20
>=3B>=3B >=3B "MUST" is still congruent with the RFC 2119 sense.
Agreed "MUST" is what we want to say I think.=20
>=3B>=3B The problem isn't with the MUST=2C but with the MAY that prece=
des it.
I think so too.
>=3B:-) Look further back in the exchange=2C and you'll see I was respond=
ing
>=3Bto a comment that the problem wasn't with the MAY=2C but with the MUS=
T.

>=3B>=3B As I remember the discussion from last year=2C we agreed that=
=20
>=3B>=3B Preferred-Value references should -- nay=2C MUST -- be updated=
 when=20
>=3B>=3B necessary to get rid of these chains of pointers.  This was an=
=20
>=3B>=3B intentional change from RFC 4646.  I can look up the discussio=
n in the=20
>=3B>=3B archives if needed.  I remembered that I would have to change =
my app to=20
>=3B>=3B meet this new requirement.
That makes sense.
>=3B That would have been a powerful argument against making the change
>=3B in the first place.  However=2C something about the claim doesn't ad=
d up.
>=3B Code which is able to follow Preferred-Value chains will not have
>=3B a problem with a registry in which such chains do not happen.
=20
>=3B>=3B The real problem is with the RFC 2119 MAY=2C which appears to =
contradict=20
>=3B>=3B the MUST which follows=2C which would not have been seen as a =
problem if a=20
>=3B>=3B regular old ordinary "may" had been used.  While I don't insis=
t on 
I like Addison's "can" here.
>=3B>=3B changing any of this text at this phenomenally late date=2C th=
e fact=20
>=3B>=3B remains that "MAY" in the sense of "is allowed or permitted to=
" is not=20
>=3B>=3B the same as "may" in the sense of "could happen=2C or could po=
ssibly=20
>=3B>=3B result in."

>=3B True=2C but the statement that a change is permitted to impact other=
s
>=3B is nonetheless true.
Hmm.  This is a fine point here.
=20
>=3B>=3B It "may" snow in Denver this weekend.  That is not an RFC 2119=
 "MAY"=3B=20
>=3B>=3B nobody is granting permission to the heavens to drop fluffy co=
ld white=20
>=3B>=3B stuff on us.
This is my opinion too.
>=3B=20
>=3B>=3B It is simply not correct to mechanically uppercase all occurre=
nces of=20
>=3B>=3B the word "may" in an Internet-Draft as though it always specif=
ies an=20
>=3B>=3B optional feature.
Again substituting "can" for "may" eliminates the "may" issue here=3B unles=
s we want
to insist that we are granting permission for one chang=
e to affect others=2C then I see no reason whatsoever for "MAY" here=3B
"can" will do.
 =3B
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcat=
har@hotmail.com 
 =3B
(ah my email is back work=
ing=3B hope the different account did not cause confusion)

=

--_e1d54034-98c5-496a-a8f3-8feeac284a9a_--

From cewcathar@hotmail.com  Sat Feb  7 07:56:59 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 922513A69AD for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 07:56:59 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.068
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.068 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.930,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_35=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BCWT2R6XtiOo for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 07:56:58 -0800 (PST)
Received: from blu0-omc3-s30.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s30.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.105]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B88703A6857 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 07:56:57 -0800 (PST)
Received: from BLU109-W54 ([65.55.116.72]) by blu0-omc3-s30.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Sat, 7 Feb 2009 07:57:01 -0800
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_4d666cb3-2687-4e23-82ac-dc171b68166c_"
X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11]
From: CE Whitehead 
To: 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 10:57:00 -0500
Importance: Normal
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Feb 2009 15:57:01.0050 (UTC) FILETIME=[B68CE5A0:01C9893C]
Subject: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d (was Re: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated...)
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 15:56:59 -0000

--_4d666cb3-2687-4e23-82ac-dc171b68166c_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Hi=2C sorry for posting these at this date (this draft has lengthened subst=
antially because I was involved some in the 2008 editing at ietf??)
=20
(I had the idea from a previous message of Randy's that I could still post =
my editorial comments although they might not all be considered.)
=20
On the "different to"/"different from"/"different than" issue (4.1=2C par 3=
) sorry for not noticing that "different to" is British English (obviously =
I don't speak that & saw this usage as an error)=3B however "different from=
" is safest according to:
http://www.bartleby.com/68/37/1837.html
=20
You do absolutely need to change 4.1 paragraph 6 item 1 second bullet thoug=
h & that's one reason I decided to send these.
=20
(I also disagree with Randy's editing in one case=3B I do think you need to=
 change 5.1=2C paragraph 4=2C sentence 2=3B because grammatically "grouping=
" needs a subject antecedent here and does not have one.  However readers m=
ay figure out what is meant here because this is a common grammatical error=
.)
=20
=20
=20
. . .=20
> As a technical contributor...>> From: "Edith Whitehead" >> Sent: Friday=2C February 06=2C 2009 9:31 AM> ! 4.1   par 3=
>> { ORIGINAL TEXT }>> "   Standards=2C protocols=2C and applications that =
reference this document>    normatively but apply different rules to the on=
es given in this>    section MUST specify how language tag selection varies=
 from the>    guidelines given here.">> { ! CORRECTION:  CHANGE:  "differen=
t rules to the . . . " > "rules different than those . . . ">  you can say =
:  "rules different than=2C"  "rules different from=2C"  or "different rule=
s than=2C"> but where do you get "different rules to"?  It's not English.> =
Nor is "different rules than".  If folks feel a need for a change=2C> "rule=
s different from" would be more acceptible.
"different from" is fine=3B "different to" turns out to be British English =
(my mistake here).  "Different from" is safe in all usages apparently....>>=
  ?? Also=2C CHANGE: "apply" to "adhere to" or simply "follow"  (I like "ad=
here to" better=3B>> "apply" might be a word you use with applications and =
rules but I do not use it with anything but formatting=2C>> "formatting is =
applied . . ."> Disagree.  I see no need for this change.O.k....>>  ? Also=
=2C CHANGE:  "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is more cohesive w=
ith 'those'>> because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that H=
alliday has about cohesion too) }> Disagree.  I see no need for this change=
.O.k.> "Standards=2C protocols=2C and applications that reference this docu=
ment>   normatively but adhere to rules different than those given in this =
section . . . "> This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong=2C and I can=
not support it....>> ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet>>>> {ORIGINAL TEXT }>=
> " Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the>>           lan=
guage a casual user might expect=2C especially if when>>           relying =
on the subtag's description in the registry. ">>>> {! CORRECTION:  delete e=
ither "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a bit redundant=2C right? }> Yup.  =
However=2C the entire phrase "especially...registry" is not helpful> to the=
 sense of the paragraph in question.  Consequently=2C I think> that if a ch=
ange is to be made=2C it would be better to delete> everything from the com=
ma to the word "registry".
Fine.  You've got to make a change here.> ...> ! 4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last se=
ntence>> {ORIGINAL TEXT}>    "o  A language priority list [RFC4647] describ=
ing a user's language>        preferences.  This is a (possibly weighted) l=
ist of potentially->       unrelated varieties=2C expressing a preference=
=2C rather than as a>       declaration about actual content."> ...> "This =
is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrelated varieties=2C>  expre=
ssing a preference=2C rather than a declaration of actual content."> Yup.  =
However=2C this sentence is entirely redundant=2C so if there is going> to =
be a change=2C I'd rather just delete it.Unsure.>> ! 5.1=2C par 4=2C senten=
ce 2>>>> { ORIGINAL TEXT }>>>> " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in=
 the appropriate section=3B there is>>   no guarantee of the order of the r=
ecords beyond grouping them together by 'Type'.">> ...>> "Inserted records =
can be placed anywhere in the appropriate section=3B there>> is no guarante=
e of their order beyond their being grouped together by 'Type'.">Ok.  This =
"can" probably should be a MAY=2C but it's not a big deal and it's not>wort=
h changing.The problem is I don't know here who is "grouping" the records=
=3B there is no subject antecendent for the word "grouping" and it needs on=
e.
Anyway . . . it's not grammatically correct as it is now but readers may fi=
gure it out....>> ! 4.4.2 Par 1=2C last sentence>>>> { ORIGINAL TEXT }>>>> =
"  Such truncation MUST NOT>>    permit a subtag to be chopped off in the m=
iddle or the formation of>>    invalid tags (for example=2C one ending with=
 the "-" character)."...>> "Such truncation MUST NOT permit the formation o=
f invalid tags-->> either by chopping a subtag off in the middle=2C or by l=
eaving a singleton without any subtag."> Disagree.  The original text is gr=
amamtically and technically correct.> The proposed text changes the meaning=
 in a subtly  incompatible way.> Consider the case where chopping a subtag =
in the middle does *not*> result in an invalid tag=2C but instead produces =
a tag containing a subtag> not present in the original.
Hmm? O.k. > ....> ? 3.5  "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4=2C 2nd =
sentence>> { ORIGINAL TEXT }>> " Note that each response is not limited in>=
    size so that the request can adequately describe the registration.">> {=
COMMENTS: the word "response" is not clear here=2C and this sentence> is aw=
kward and unclear as a whole.I think the sentence is abundantly clear in co=
ntext=2C and see no need for change....> ? 3.7 par 4 & 5...> {COMMENT:  the=
 two maintaining authorities=2C IANA=2C and the individual> authority=2C mi=
ght be confused by readers here??...> Given the topic of the section=2C I f=
ind it difficult to imagine such confusion> taking place.O.k. I suggested t=
his change because people read these fast and want things to be ultra-clear=
 but fine at this date=3B no need to clean it up further at this date . . .=
The rest of my changes were not changes I considered that important & I do =
see your point in many case.
=20
=20
Thanks.
=20
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com=

--_4d666cb3-2687-4e23-82ac-dc171b68166c_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







Hi=2C sorry for posting these at this date (this draft has lengthened s=
ubstantially because I was involved some in the 2008 editing at ietf??)

 =3B

(I had the idea from a previous message of Randy's that I could still post =
my editorial comments although they might not all be considered.)

 =3B

On the "different to"/"different from"/"different than" issue (4.1=2C par 3=
) =3Bsorry for not noticing that =3B"different to" =3Bis Britis=
h English (obviously I don't speak that &=3B saw this usage as an error)=
=3B however "different from" is safest according to:

http://www.bartleby.com=
/68/37/1837.html

 =3B

You do absolutely need to change 4.1 paragraph 6 item 1 second bullet thoug=
h &=3B that's one reason I decided to send these.

 =3B

(I also disagree with Randy's editing in one case=3B I do think you need to=
 change 5.1=2C paragraph 4=2C sentence 2=3B because grammatically "grouping=
" needs a subject antecedent here and does not have one. =3B However re=
aders may figure out what is meant here because this is a common grammatica=
l error.)

 =3B

 =3B

 =3B

. . . 

>=3B As a technical contributor...

>=3B>=3B From: "Edith White=
head" <=3Bquaiouestenglish at yahoo.com>=3B
>=3B>=3B Sent: Frida=
y=2C February 06=2C 2009 9:31 AM

>=3B ! 4.1 =3B =3B par 3<=
BR>>=3B
>=3B { ORIGINAL TEXT }
>=3B
>=3B " =3B =3B=
 Standards=2C protocols=2C and applications that reference this document>=3B =3B =3B =3B normatively but apply different rules to th=
e ones given in this
>=3B =3B =3B =3B section MUST specify=
 how language tag selection varies from the
>=3B =3B =3B =
=3B guidelines given here."
>=3B
>=3B { ! CORRECTION: =3B CHA=
NGE: =3B "different rules to the . . . " >=3B "rules different than t=
hose . . . "
>=3B =3B you can say : =3B "rules different than=
=2C" =3B "rules different from=2C" =3B or "different rules than=2C"=

>=3B but where do you get "different rules to"? =3B It's not Engl=
ish.

>=3B Nor is "different rules than". =3B If folks feel a n=
eed for a change=2C
>=3B "rules different from" would be more acceptib=
le.

"different from" is fine=3B "different to" turns out to be British English =
(my mistake here). =3B "Different from" is safe in all usages apparentl=
y.
...
>=3B>=3B =3B ?? Also=2C CHANGE: "apply" to "adhere to"=
 or simply "follow" =3B (I like "adhere to" better=3B
>=3B>=3B "=
apply" might be a word you use with applications and rules but I do not use=
 it with anything but formatting=2C
>=3B>=3B "formatting is applied =
. . ."

>=3B Disagree. =3B I see no need for this change.
O.=
k.
...
>=3B>=3B =3B ? Also=2C CHANGE: =3B "the ones" to "=
those" (I think the the text is more cohesive with 'those'
>=3B>=3B =
because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that Halliday has ab=
out cohesion too) }

>=3B Disagree. =3B I see no need for this =
change.
O.k.
>=3B "Standards=2C protocols=2C and applications that =
reference this document
>=3B =3B =3B normatively but adhere to=
 rules different than those given in this section . . . "

>=3B Thi=
s proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong=2C and I cannot support it.
<=
BR>...
>=3B>=3B ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet
>=3B>=3B
=
>=3B>=3B {ORIGINAL TEXT }
>=3B>=3B " Note that some subtag seque=
nces might not represent the
>=3B>=3B =3B =3B =3B =
=3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B language a casual user =
might expect=2C especially if when
>=3B>=3B =3B =3B =3B&=
nbsp=3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B relying on the subt=
ag's description in the registry. "
>=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B {! CORR=
ECTION: =3B delete either "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a bit redun=
dant=2C right? }

>=3B Yup. =3B However=2C the entire phrase "e=
specially...registry" is not helpful
>=3B to the sense of the paragrap=
h in question. =3B Consequently=2C I think
>=3B that if a change i=
s to be made=2C it would be better to delete
>=3B everything from the =
comma to the word "registry".


Fine. =3B You've got to make a change here.
>=3B ...
>=3B ! 4=
.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last sentence
>=3B
>=3B {ORIGINAL TEXT}
>=
=3B =3B =3B =3B "o =3B A language priority list [RFC4647] d=
escribing a user's language
>=3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =
=3B =3B =3B preferences. =3B This is a (possibly weighted) list=
 of potentially-
>=3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =
unrelated varieties=2C expressing a preference=2C rather than as a
>=
=3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B declaration about actua=
l content."
>=3B ...
>=3B "This is a (possibly weighted) list of =
potentially unrelated varieties=2C
>=3B =3B expressing a preferenc=
e=2C rather than a declaration of actual content."

>=3B Yup. =
=3B However=2C this sentence is entirely redundant=2C so if there is going<=
BR>>=3B to be a change=2C I'd rather just delete it.
Unsure.
>=3B=
>=3B ! 5.1=2C par 4=2C sentence 2
>=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B { ORIGI=
NAL TEXT }
>=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B " Inserted records can be placed=
 anywhere in the appropriate section=3B there is
>=3B>=3B =3B&nb=
sp=3B no guarantee of the order of the records beyond grouping them togethe=
r by 'Type'."
>=3B>=3B ...
>=3B>=3B "Inserted records can be =
placed anywhere in the appropriate section=3B there
>=3B>=3B is no g=
uarantee of their order beyond their being grouped together by 'Type'."
=

>=3BOk. =3B This "can" probably should be a MAY=2C but it's not a=
 big deal and it's not
>=3Bworth changing.
The problem is I don't k=
now here who is "grouping" the records=3B there is no subject antecendent f=
or the word "grouping" and it needs one.

Anyway . . . it's not grammatically correct as it is now but readers may fi=
gure it out.
...
>=3B>=3B ! 4.4.2 Par 1=2C last sentence
>=
=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B { ORIGINAL TEXT }
>=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B=
 " =3B Such truncation MUST NOT
>=3B>=3B =3B =3B =3B=
 permit a subtag to be chopped off in the middle or the formation of
>=
=3B>=3B =3B =3B =3B invalid tags (for example=2C one ending w=
ith the "-" character)."
...
>=3B>=3B "Such truncation MUST NOT p=
ermit the formation of invalid tags--
>=3B>=3B either by chopping a =
subtag off in the middle=2C or by leaving a singleton without any subtag."<=
BR>
>=3B Disagree. =3B The original text is gramamtically and tech=
nically correct.
>=3B The proposed text changes the meaning in a subtl=
y =3B incompatible way.
>=3B Consider the case where chopping a su=
btag in the middle does *not*
>=3B result in an invalid tag=2C but ins=
tead produces a tag containing a subtag
>=3B not present in the origin=
al.

Hmm? 
O.k. 
>=3B ....
>=3B ? 3.5 =3B "Registration Procedu=
re for Subtags" Par 4=2C 2nd sentence
>=3B
>=3B { ORIGINAL TEXT }=

>=3B
>=3B " Note that each response is not limited in
>=3B&=
nbsp=3B =3B =3B size so that the request can adequately describe th=
e registration."
>=3B
>=3B {COMMENTS: the word "response" is not =
clear here=2C and this sentence
>=3B is awkward and unclear as a whole=
.

I think the sentence is abundantly clear in context=2C and see no =
need for change.
...

>=3B ? 3.7 par 4 &=3B 5
...
>=
=3B {COMMENT: =3B the two maintaining authorities=2C IANA=2C and the in=
dividual
>=3B authority=2C might be confused by readers here??
...<=
BR>
>=3B Given the topic of the section=2C I find it difficult to imag=
ine such confusion
>=3B taking place.
O.k. I =3Bsuggested this =
change =3Bbecause people read these fast and want things to be ultra-cl=
ear but fine at this date=3B no need to clean it up further at this date . =
. .
The rest of my changes were not changes I considered that important =
&=3B I do see your point in many case.

 =3B

 =3B

Thanks.

 =3B

--C. E. Whitehead

cewcathar@hotmail.com

=

--_4d666cb3-2687-4e23-82ac-dc171b68166c_--

From doug@ewellic.org  Sat Feb  7 08:24:29 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CB1F3A6C5B for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 08:24:29 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.063
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.063 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.535,  BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w2L1vUvPwv2G for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 08:24:28 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpout04.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout04-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.196]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3FF433A6A5A for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 08:24:28 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 30883 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2009 16:24:31 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout04.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.196) with ESMTP; 07 Feb 2009 16:24:30 -0000
Message-ID: <6CCA80F86D8F45B8AD4FE271C008FB35@DGBP7M81>
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 09:24:26 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Preferred-Value for YU?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 16:24:29 -0000

Randy Presuhn  wrote:

>> I remembered that I would have to change my app to meet this new 
>> requirement.
>
> That would have been a powerful argument against making the change in 
> the first place.  However, something about the claim doesn't add up. 
> Code which is able to follow Preferred-Value chains will not have a 
> problem with a registry in which such chains do not happen.

Sorry, I wasn't clear about which app I was referring to.  I meant the 
one I use to take the current 4646 Registry and the ISO 639-3 files and 
generate the new 4646bis Registry, which I then incorporate into 
successive draft-4645bis versions.  That one needed to be taught to snap 
the pointers.

I could have also chosen to treat the "no chains" passage as a 
validation point in my tag-generating app, and reject the Registry if 
P-Vs pointed to subtags with other P-Vs, but I think I decided not to do 
that.  I put that app largely on hold after the back-and-forth 
experience with extlangs, pending publication

>> While I don't insist on changing any of this text at this 
>> phenomenally late date, the fact remains that "MAY" in the sense of 
>> "is allowed or permitted to" is not the same as "may" in the sense of 
>> "could happen, or could possibly result in."
>
> True, but the statement that a change is permitted to impact others is 
> nonetheless true.

Who's doing the permitting?

In any case, as I said, I don't think it's something for which we need 
to hold up the IETF Last Call.  I don't see any reason to hold up the 
IETF Last Call, since the IETF is surely aware that the IPR boilerplate 
may have to be changed before publication anyway, but I suppose this 
group will find a reason to continue dragging its feet.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Sat Feb  7 10:53:33 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 590A53A6CF4 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 10:53:33 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.634
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.634 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.524, BAYES_05=-1.11]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wadR2gqJLoJE for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 10:53:32 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96D4B3A6CF2 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 10:53:32 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=swRlONlnXepQ7TpxjGyjFCLrA+qrVHsRG1Mm3QVY7Lw6Oyc2BUwpVq+sAj1dLH44; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [69.3.26.18] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVsJ3-0006Hx-KL for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 07 Feb 2009 13:53:33 -0500
Message-ID: <002601c98955$55ed2480$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 10:53:14 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17351d9f6b67b2488b018aac7e01ac446f2350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.18
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d (was Re: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated...)
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 18:53:33 -0000

Hi -

As co-chair...

> From: "CE Whitehead" 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2009 7:57 AM
> Subject: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d (was Re: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated...)
...
> (I had the idea from a previous message of Randy's that I could still
> post my editorial comments although they might not all be considered.)
...

A reasonable (and correct) surmise.

Randy


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Sat Feb  7 11:12:08 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11B783A6CFB for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 11:12:08 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.363
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.363 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.236,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9ikY99APxCji for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 11:12:07 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43AD33A6CF4 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 11:12:07 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=dhf6CDiGTyJToVL0Hn/KnJdlGPL9viX7YVO3I4xLMhY02xKASfjeUzeQAJR49rGg; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [69.3.26.18] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVsb4-00020v-GN for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 07 Feb 2009 14:12:10 -0500
Message-ID: <005f01c98957$f0052980$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 11:11:53 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1734a826d93db95f65f85ac33d9228e7e72350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.18
Subject: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 19:12:08 -0000

Hi -

As co-chair...

Today is the last day for comments on the revised procedures for
coping with RFC 5378.  After an initial flurry of comment on the
ietf@ietf.org list, things seems to have quieted down, and I expect
a re-revised version to appear soon.

Although the "Contributor non-exclusive license" form on the IETF Trust's
web site is still under revision, I see that as a non-issue for us,
since we've had the same editors for these documents since the
beginning, and Harald already signed off.

At this time, AFAIK, we're just waiting for the editors to decide that
they're comfortable with the re-revised IPR incantations before
posting the RFC 5378 compliant versions.  Martin has already prepared
the shepherding paperwork, so as soon as the posting is announced,
he can notify our area director of the hand-off to the IESG.

The IESG may have comments, which will be reviewed in the WG.
Resolution of those comments may require generating a new I-D,
which would be a good time for folding in any *PURELY* editorial
things that have come up.  We'll achieve much faster turnaround
if we have a good idea of what those changes would be even before
the IESG tosses it back to us.

When the IESG is happy, we move to IETF last call.  At this stage,
comments will show up on the ietf@ietf.org list.

Randy


From addison@amazon.com  Sat Feb  7 11:48:20 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06DED3A6C7E for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 11:48:20 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.654
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.654 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.055, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pHpwlye8AK9N for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 11:48:19 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2673F3A6A58 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 11:48:19 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,397,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="185965036"
Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 07 Feb 2009 19:48:20 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n17JmItJ018998 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sat, 7 Feb 2009 19:48:19 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Sat, 7 Feb 2009 11:48:18 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 11:48:16 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Where are we?
Thread-Index: AcmJV/0Py3ePrujgS2iBJKeNsf/2TAABAiQA
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81713@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <005f01c98957$f0052980$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <005f01c98957$f0052980$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 19:48:20 -0000
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From doug@ewellic.org  Sat Feb  7 13:04:27 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 392523A67AA for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:04:27 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.333
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.333 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.224, BAYES_05=-1.11, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hyY2hhDf8-6K for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:04:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.38]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 492613A6D0E for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:04:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 3774 invoked from network); 7 Feb 2009 21:04:29 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.38) with ESMTP; 07 Feb 2009 21:04:28 -0000
Message-ID: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81>
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 14:04:24 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 21:04:27 -0000

"Phillips, Addison"  wrote:

> I would like to request that the co-chairs use the issue tracker from 
> now to track proposed changes to the document and the dispositions 
> thereof. I don't want to miss anything in the limited number of new 
> I-Ds that we'll prepare and would like to have clear go/no-go 
> decisions on what to incorporate.

I second this request.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Sat Feb  7 13:39:27 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DC5A3A6B89 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:39:27 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.625
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.625 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.515, BAYES_05=-1.11]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yXKDRDuPHiXZ for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:39:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 541583A6765 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:39:26 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=TE2/ov7T5MOsuHzfVSutCpAoTcako3S0D3G0xtYp3smXinofE0PpK/ZG6jxPYexf; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [69.3.26.18] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LVutd-0003kh-GE for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 07 Feb 2009 16:39:29 -0500
Message-ID: <007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References:  <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81>
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 13:39:10 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173aef3e2ea7b0fdfe5886d5082142cb858350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.18
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 21:39:27 -0000

Hi -

> From: "Doug Ewell" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2009 1:04 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
>
> "Phillips, Addison"  wrote:
> 
> > I would like to request that the co-chairs use the issue tracker from 
> > now to track proposed changes to the document and the dispositions 
> > thereof. I don't want to miss anything in the limited number of new 
> > I-Ds that we'll prepare and would like to have clear go/no-go 
> > decisions on what to incorporate.
> 
> I second this request.

As co-chair...

This is fine with me!  The posted internet drafts are our baseline,
so I request that the editors post the differences between their working
copies and the posted drafts to the ltru@ietf.org mailing list. ONE change
per message, with an appropriate subject line, PLEASE.

Likewise, from the recent exchanges on this list, if there are any
proposals that anyone thinks still merit consideration, please post
them as well, again limiting yourselves to *ONE* proposed change
per message.

I will enter them into an issue tracker and publish access information.

Randy



From cewcathar@hotmail.com  Sat Feb  7 13:58:07 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D59083A6B89 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:58:07 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.127
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.127 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.871,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_35=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WgRUXrjH0nkh for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:58:06 -0800 (PST)
Received: from blu0-omc3-s1.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s1.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.76]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED2063A684A for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 13:58:05 -0800 (PST)
Received: from BLU109-W40 ([65.55.116.73]) by blu0-omc3-s1.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Sat, 7 Feb 2009 13:58:09 -0800
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_1d893a20-328f-4e30-839f-6ad6cfee7ec7_"
X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11]
From: CE Whitehead 
To: 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 16:58:08 -0500
Importance: Normal
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 07 Feb 2009 21:58:09.0309 (UTC) FILETIME=[29D6D4D0:01C9896F]
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d (was Re: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated...)
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 07 Feb 2009 21:58:07 -0000

--_1d893a20-328f-4e30-839f-6ad6cfee7ec7_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Hi.> Hi -

> As co-chair...

>> From: "CE Whitehead" 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Saturday=2C February 07=2C 2009 7:57 AM
>> Subject: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis =
i-d (was Re: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated...)
> ...
>> (I had the idea from a previous message of Randy's that I could still
>> post my editorial comments although they might not all be considered.)
>...

>A reasonable (and correct) surmise.

>Randy
Thanks very much for letting me comment.I do hope the real grammatical erro=
rs can be corrected4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet4.3 par 1 bullet 1 last se=
ntence (remove "as")
(I wish you'd consider 5.1 par 4 sentence 2=3B it's up to Randy of course=
=3B also 4.1 par 3  ["different rules to" > "rules different from"] if we w=
ant to make the usage country neutral.
(it seems that the 13th hour last call for this took place in November:
http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/current/msg11859.htmlI made comme=
nts right after that--a bit late--& was told at that time that only typos=
=2C spelling errors=2C obvious errors in grammar could be considered at tha=
t point=3B
I had not read the draft in full carefully at that point (I had to print a =
copy).
I should have submitted my major changes as soon as I did but somehow was e=
xpecting a new ietf last call this year
& finally asked permission to submit these=3B my mistake).
 --C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com




From: cewcathar@hotmail.comTo: ltru@ietf.orgSubject: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead=
's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d (was Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy =
of draft-4646bis updated...)Date: Sat=2C 7 Feb 2009 10:57:00 -0500

Hi=2C sorry for posting these at this date (this draft has lengthened subst=
antially because I was involved some in the 2008 editing at ietf??) (I had =
the idea from a previous message of Randy's that I could still post my edit=
orial comments although they might not all be considered.) On the "differen=
t to"/"different from"/"different than" issue (4.1=2C par 3) sorry for not =
noticing that "different to" is British English (obviously I don't speak th=
at & saw this usage as an error)=3B however "different from" is safest acco=
rding to:http://www.bartleby.com/68/37/1837.html You do absolutely need to =
change 4.1 paragraph 6 item 1 second bullet though & that's one reason I de=
cided to send these. (I also disagree with Randy's editing in one case=3B I=
 do think you need to change 5.1=2C paragraph 4=2C sentence 2=3B because gr=
ammatically "grouping" needs a subject antecedent here and does not have on=
e.  However readers may figure out what is meant here because this is a com=
mon grammatical error.)   . . . > As a technical contributor...>> From: "Ed=
ith Whitehead" >> Sent: Friday=2C February 0=
6=2C 2009 9:31 AM> ! 4.1   par 3>> { ORIGINAL TEXT }>> "   Standards=2C pro=
tocols=2C and applications that reference this document>    normatively but=
 apply different rules to the ones given in this>    section MUST specify h=
ow language tag selection varies from the>    guidelines given here.">> { !=
 CORRECTION:  CHANGE:  "different rules to the . . . " > "rules different t=
han those . . . ">  you can say :  "rules different than=2C"  "rules differ=
ent from=2C"  or "different rules than=2C"> but where do you get "different=
 rules to"?  It's not English.> Nor is "different rules than".  If folks fe=
el a need for a change=2C> "rules different from" would be more acceptible.=
"different from" is fine=3B "different to" turns out to be British English =
(my mistake here).  "Different from" is safe in all usages apparently....>>=
  ?? Also=2C CHANGE: "apply" to "adhere to" or simply "follow"  (I like "ad=
here to" better=3B>> "apply" might be a word you use with applications and =
rules but I do not use it with anything but formatting=2C>> "formatting is =
applied . . ."> Disagree.  I see no need for this change.O.k....>>  ? Also=
=2C CHANGE:  "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is more cohesive w=
ith 'those'>> because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that H=
alliday has about cohesion too) }> Disagree.  I see no need for this change=
.O.k.> "Standards=2C protocols=2C and applications that reference this docu=
ment>   normatively but adhere to rules different than those given in this =
section . . . "> This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong=2C and I can=
not support it....>> ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet>>>> {ORIGINAL TEXT }>=
> " Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the>>           lan=
guage a casual user might expect=2C especially if when>>           relying =
on the subtag's description in the registry. ">>>> {! CORRECTION:  delete e=
ither "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a bit redundant=2C right? }> Yup.  =
However=2C the entire phrase "especially...registry" is not helpful> to the=
 sense of the paragraph in question.  Consequently=2C I think> that if a ch=
ange is to be made=2C it would be better to delete> everything from the com=
ma to the word "registry".Fine.  You've got to make a change here.> ...> ! =
4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last sentence>> {ORIGINAL TEXT}>    "o  A language prior=
ity list [RFC4647] describing a user's language>        preferences.  This =
is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially->       unrelated varieties=2C=
 expressing a preference=2C rather than as a>       declaration about actua=
l content."> ...> "This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrela=
ted varieties=2C>  expressing a preference=2C rather than a declaration of =
actual content."> Yup.  However=2C this sentence is entirely redundant=2C s=
o if there is going> to be a change=2C I'd rather just delete it.Unsure.>> =
! 5.1=2C par 4=2C sentence 2>>>> { ORIGINAL TEXT }>>>> " Inserted records c=
an be placed anywhere in the appropriate section=3B there is>>   no guarant=
ee of the order of the records beyond grouping them together by 'Type'.">> =
...>> "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate section=
=3B there>> is no guarantee of their order beyond their being grouped toget=
her by 'Type'.">Ok.  This "can" probably should be a MAY=2C but it's not a =
big deal and it's not>worth changing.The problem is I don't know here who i=
s "grouping" the records=3B there is no subject antecendent for the word "g=
rouping" and it needs one.Anyway . . . it's not grammatically correct as it=
 is now but readers may figure it out....>> ! 4.4.2 Par 1=2C last sentence>=
>>> { ORIGINAL TEXT }>>>> "  Such truncation MUST NOT>>    permit a subtag =
to be chopped off in the middle or the formation of>>    invalid tags (for =
example=2C one ending with the "-" character)."...>> "Such truncation MUST =
NOT permit the formation of invalid tags-->> either by chopping a subtag of=
f in the middle=2C or by leaving a singleton without any subtag."> Disagree=
.  The original text is gramamtically and technically correct.> The propose=
d text changes the meaning in a subtly  incompatible way.> Consider the cas=
e where chopping a subtag in the middle does *not*> result in an invalid ta=
g=2C but instead produces a tag containing a subtag> not present in the ori=
ginal.Hmm? O.k. > ....> ? 3.5  "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4=
=2C 2nd sentence>> { ORIGINAL TEXT }>> " Note that each response is not lim=
ited in>    size so that the request can adequately describe the registrati=
on.">> {COMMENTS: the word "response" is not clear here=2C and this sentenc=
e> is awkward and unclear as a whole.I think the sentence is abundantly cle=
ar in context=2C and see no need for change....> ? 3.7 par 4 & 5...> {COMME=
NT:  the two maintaining authorities=2C IANA=2C and the individual> authori=
ty=2C might be confused by readers here??...> Given the topic of the sectio=
n=2C I find it difficult to imagine such confusion> taking place.O.k. I sug=
gested this change because people read these fast and want things to be ult=
ra-clear but fine at this date=3B no need to clean it up further at this da=
te . . .The rest of my changes were not changes I considered that important=
 & I do see your point in many case.  Thanks. --C. E. Whiteheadcewcathar@ho=
tmail.com=

--_1d893a20-328f-4e30-839f-6ad6cfee7ec7_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable






Hi.
>=3B Hi -

>=3B As co-chair...

>=3B>=3B From: "CE Whitehead" <=3Bcewcathar at hotmail.com>=3B
>=3B>=3B To: <=3Bltru at ietf.org>=3B
>=3B>=3B Sent: Saturday=2C February 07=2C 2009 7:57 AM
>=3B>=3B Subject: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes t=
o 4646bis i-d (was Re: Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated...)
>=3B ...
>=3B>=3B (I had the idea from a previous message of Randy's that I coul=
d still
>=3B>=3B post my editorial comments although they might not all be cons=
idered.)
>=3B...

>=3BA reasonable (and correct) surmise.

>=3BRandy

Thanks very much for letting me comment.
I do hope the=
 real grammatical errors can be corrected
4.1 par 6 item 1 second=
 bullet
4.3 par 1 bullet 1 last sentence (remove "as")

(I wish you'd consider 5.1 par 4 sentence 2=3B it's up to Randy =
of course=3B =3B
also 4.1 par 3  ["different rules to" >=3B=
 "rules different from"] if we want to make the usage country neutral.
(it seems that the 13th hour last call for this took place in November:

http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/curre=
nt/msg11859.html
I made comments r=
ight after that--a bit late--&=3B was told at that time that only typos=
=2C spelling errors=2C obvious errors in grammar could be considered at tha=
t point=3B

I had not read the draft in full carefully at th=
at point (I had to print a copy).

I should have submitted my major changes as soon=
 as I did but somehow was expecting a new ietf last call this year
&=3B finally asked permission to submit these=
=3B my mistake).


 =3B--C. E. Whitehead

cewcath=
ar@hotmail.com








From: cewcathar@hotmail.com
To: ltru@ietf.org
Subject: [Ltru] Edith W=
hitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d (was Re: [Ltru] Editor=
's copy of draft-4646bis updated...)
Date: Sat=2C 7 Feb 2009 10:57:00 -0=
500




Hi=2C sorry for posting these at this date (this draft has lengthened s=
ubstantially because I was involved some in the 2008 editing at ietf??)
=
 =3B
(I had the idea from a previous message of Randy's that I could=
 still post my editorial comments although they might not all be considered=
.)
 =3B
On the "different to"/"different from"/"different than" i=
ssue (4.1=2C par 3) =3Bsorry for not noticing that =3B"different to=
" =3Bis British English (obviously I don't speak that &=3B saw this =
usage as an error)=3B however "different from" is safest according to:
<=
A href=3D"http://www.bartleby.com/68/37/1837.html">http://www.bartleby.com/=
68/37/1837.html
 =3B
You do absolutely need to change 4.1 par=
agraph 6 item 1 second bullet though &=3B that's one reason I decided to=
 send these.
 =3B
(I also disagree with Randy's editing in one ca=
se=3B I do think you need to change 5.1=2C paragraph 4=2C sentence 2=3B bec=
ause grammatically "grouping" needs a subject antecedent here and does not =
have one. =3B However readers may figure out what is meant here because=
 this is a common grammatical error.)
 =3B
 =3B
 =3B. . . 
>=3B As a technical contributor...

>=3B>=3B From: =
"Edith Whitehead" <=3Bquaiouestenglish at yahoo.com>=3B
>=3B>=3B=
 Sent: Friday=2C February 06=2C 2009 9:31 AM

>=3B ! 4.1 =3B&nb=
sp=3B par 3
>=3B
>=3B { ORIGINAL TEXT }
>=3B
>=3B "&nbs=
p=3B =3B Standards=2C protocols=2C and applications that reference this=
 document
>=3B =3B =3B =3B normatively but apply different=
 rules to the ones given in this
>=3B =3B =3B =3B section =
MUST specify how language tag selection varies from the
>=3B =3B&n=
bsp=3B =3B guidelines given here."
>=3B
>=3B { ! CORRECTION:&=
nbsp=3B CHANGE: =3B "different rules to the . . . " >=3B "rules diffe=
rent than those . . . "
>=3B =3B you can say : =3B "rules diff=
erent than=2C" =3B "rules different from=2C" =3B or "different rule=
s than=2C"
>=3B but where do you get "different rules to"? =3B It'=
s not English.

>=3B Nor is "different rules than". =3B If folk=
s feel a need for a change=2C
>=3B "rules different from" would be mor=
e acceptible.
"different from" is fine=3B "different to" turns out to be=
 British English (my mistake here). =3B "Different from" is safe in all=
 usages apparently.
...
>=3B>=3B =3B ?? Also=2C CHANGE: "appl=
y" to "adhere to" or simply "follow" =3B (I like "adhere to" better=3B<=
BR>>=3B>=3B "apply" might be a word you use with applications and rules=
 but I do not use it with anything but formatting=2C
>=3B>=3B "forma=
tting is applied . . ."

>=3B Disagree. =3B I see no need for t=
his change.
O.k.
...
>=3B>=3B =3B ? Also=2C CHANGE: =
=3B "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is more cohesive with 'thos=
e'
>=3B>=3B because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea t=
hat Halliday has about cohesion too) }

>=3B Disagree. =3B I se=
e no need for this change.
O.k.
>=3B "Standards=2C protocols=2C and=
 applications that reference this document
>=3B =3B =3B normat=
ively but adhere to rules different than those given in this section . . . =
"

>=3B This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong=2C and I cann=
ot support it.

...
>=3B>=3B ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet<=
BR>>=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B {ORIGINAL TEXT }
>=3B>=3B " Note tha=
t some subtag sequences might not represent the
>=3B>=3B =3B&nbs=
p=3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B langua=
ge a casual user might expect=2C especially if when
>=3B>=3B =3B=
 =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B re=
lying on the subtag's description in the registry. "
>=3B>=3B
>=
=3B>=3B {! CORRECTION: =3B delete either "if" or "when" as "if when" =
seems a bit redundant=2C right? }

>=3B Yup. =3B However=2C the=
 entire phrase "especially...registry" is not helpful
>=3B to the sens=
e of the paragraph in question. =3B Consequently=2C I think
>=3B t=
hat if a change is to be made=2C it would be better to delete
>=3B eve=
rything from the comma to the word "registry".

Fine. =3B You've =
got to make a change here.
>=3B ...
>=3B ! 4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 las=
t sentence
>=3B
>=3B {ORIGINAL TEXT}
>=3B =3B =3B&nb=
sp=3B "o =3B A language priority list [RFC4647] describing a user's lan=
guage
>=3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B pre=
ferences. =3B This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially-
>=
=3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B =3B unrelated varieties=2C =
expressing a preference=2C rather than as a
>=3B =3B =3B =
=3B =3B =3B =3B declaration about actual content."
>=3B ..=
.
>=3B "This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrelated va=
rieties=2C
>=3B =3B expressing a preference=2C rather than a decla=
ration of actual content."

>=3B Yup. =3B However=2C this sente=
nce is entirely redundant=2C so if there is going
>=3B to be a change=
=2C I'd rather just delete it.
Unsure.
>=3B>=3B ! 5.1=2C par 4=2C=
 sentence 2
>=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B { ORIGINAL TEXT }
>=3B>=
=3B
>=3B>=3B " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the approp=
riate section=3B there is
>=3B>=3B =3B =3B no guarantee of t=
he order of the records beyond grouping them together by 'Type'."
>=3B=
>=3B ...
>=3B>=3B "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the =
appropriate section=3B there
>=3B>=3B is no guarantee of their order=
 beyond their being grouped together by 'Type'."

>=3BOk. =3B T=
his "can" probably should be a MAY=2C but it's not a big deal and it's not<=
BR>>=3Bworth changing.
The problem is I don't know here who is "groupi=
ng" the records=3B there is no subject antecendent for the word "grouping" =
and it needs one.
Anyway . . . it's not grammatically correct as it is n=
ow but readers may figure it out.
...
>=3B>=3B ! 4.4.2 Par 1=2C l=
ast sentence
>=3B>=3B
>=3B>=3B { ORIGINAL TEXT }
>=3B>=
=3B
>=3B>=3B " =3B Such truncation MUST NOT
>=3B>=3B =
=3B =3B =3B permit a subtag to be chopped off in the middle or the =
formation of
>=3B>=3B =3B =3B =3B invalid tags (for exam=
ple=2C one ending with the "-" character)."
...
>=3B>=3B "Such tr=
uncation MUST NOT permit the formation of invalid tags--
>=3B>=3B ei=
ther by chopping a subtag off in the middle=2C or by leaving a singleton wi=
thout any subtag."

>=3B Disagree. =3B The original text is gra=
mamtically and technically correct.
>=3B The proposed text changes the=
 meaning in a subtly =3B incompatible way.
>=3B Consider the case =
where chopping a subtag in the middle does *not*
>=3B result in an inv=
alid tag=2C but instead produces a tag containing a subtag
>=3B not pr=
esent in the original.
Hmm? 
O.k. 
>=3B ....
>=3B ? 3.5&nbs=
p=3B "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4=2C 2nd sentence
>=3B>=3B { ORIGINAL TEXT }
>=3B
>=3B " Note that each response is=
 not limited in
>=3B =3B =3B =3B size so that the request =
can adequately describe the registration."
>=3B
>=3B {COMMENTS: t=
he word "response" is not clear here=2C and this sentence
>=3B is awkw=
ard and unclear as a whole.

I think the sentence is abundantly clear=
 in context=2C and see no need for change.
...

>=3B ? 3.7 par 4=
 &=3B 5
...
>=3B {COMMENT: =3B the two maintaining authoriti=
es=2C IANA=2C and the individual
>=3B authority=2C might be confused b=
y readers here??
...

>=3B Given the topic of the section=2C I f=
ind it difficult to imagine such confusion
>=3B taking place.
O.k. =
I =3Bsuggested this change =3Bbecause people read these fast and wa=
nt things to be ultra-clear but fine at this date=3B no need to clean it up=
 further at this date . . .
The rest of my changes were not changes I co=
nsidered that important &=3B I do see your point in many case.
 =
=3B
 =3B
Thanks.
 =3B
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com


=

--_1d893a20-328f-4e30-839f-6ad6cfee7ec7_--

From cowan@ccil.org  Sat Feb  7 21:33:11 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A4C53A6873 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 21:33:11 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.554
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.554 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.045,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mULvqzhp0Z2Q for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 21:33:10 -0800 (PST)
Received: from earth.ccil.org (earth.ccil.org [192.190.237.11]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1287D3A67B4 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 21:33:10 -0800 (PST)
Received: from cowan by earth.ccil.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1LW2I2-0004gH-00; Sun, 08 Feb 2009 00:33:10 -0500
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 00:33:09 -0500
To: Randy Presuhn 
Message-ID: <20090208053308.GA24608@mercury.ccil.org>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11)
From: John Cowan 
Cc: ltru@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 05:33:11 -0000

Randy Presuhn scripsit:

> > { ! CORRECTION:  CHANGE:  "different rules to the . . . " > "rules different than those . . . "
> >  you can say :  "rules different than,"  "rules different from,"  or "different rules than,"
> > but where do you get "different rules to"?  It's not English.
> 
> Nor is "different rules than".  If folks feel a need for a change,
> "rules different from" would be more acceptible.

In fact all of "different from", "different to" and "different than"
are acceptable in standard English.  Check Merriam-Webster's (Concise)
Dictionary of English Usage, which is AFAIK the only evidence-based
usage guide.

In my experience, "different than" is more common in North America than
elsewhere, whereas "different to" is more common outside North America
than inside.  "Different from" is popular everywhere.

> This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong, and I cannot support it.

It's simply wrong to say it's simply wrong.

-- 
A mosquito cried out in his pain,               John Cowan
"A chemist has poisoned my brain!"              http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
        The cause of his sorrow                 cowan@ccil.org
        Was para-dichloro-
Diphenyltrichloroethane.                                (aka DDT)

From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Sat Feb  7 21:53:31 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 86F383A6B00 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 21:53:31 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.113
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.113 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.486,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id J2EGKzUZTLie for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 21:53:30 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93B3E3A6924 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 21:53:30 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=orhKkGUxX1z8wtcWCOY5glvuF2zQpMXEKCjKiL+vuzxgO+ctRqq3jxFfxlFwpkSb; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.136.92] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LW2bm-0007v2-4O for ltru@ietf.org; Sun, 08 Feb 2009 00:53:34 -0500
Message-ID: <000401c989b1$8969d180$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <20090208053308.GA24608@mercury.ccil.org>
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 21:53:14 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1732d2372efd9604b8c174848e679f3282e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.136.92
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 05:53:31 -0000

Hi -

> From: "John Cowan" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" 
> Cc: 
> Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2009 9:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d
...
> In fact all of "different from", "different to" and "different than"
> are acceptable in standard English.  Check Merriam-Webster's (Concise)
> Dictionary of English Usage, which is AFAIK the only evidence-based
> usage guide.

Harper's English Grammar only allows "different from".
But we all know about dueling authorities on English.  :-)

> In my experience, "different than" is more common in North America than
> elsewhere,

Though this North American finds it cringe-inducing,
he admits to hearing it with distressing frequency.

> whereas "different to" is more common outside North America
> than inside.

I don't recall ever *hearing* it used by a native speaker -
and I'm certain I'd notice, because for me it's even
more cringe-inducing than "different than".

>  "Different from" is popular everywhere.

(And in at least some grammars, it's the only form permitted.)

As co-chair:
Consequently, if the editors find it conventient to incorporate an editorial
correction here, they should take the "different from" route.

Randy


From doug@ewellic.org  Sat Feb  7 22:03:56 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 136813A6B4C for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 22:03:56 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.066
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.066 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.480, BAYES_00=-2.599, FAKE_REPLY_C=2.012, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 617vmJmOiJms for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 22:03:55 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpauth16.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth16.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 238B03A67D8 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 22:03:55 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 28979 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2009 06:03:57 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth16.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.22) with ESMTP; 08 Feb 2009 06:03:56 -0000
Message-ID: 
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 23:03:52 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 06:03:56 -0000

Randy Presuhn  wrote:

> The posted internet drafts are our baseline, so I request that the 
> editors post the differences between their working copies and the 
> posted drafts to the ltru at ietf.org mailing list.

For draft-4645bis, the posted draft at 
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-09.txt is 
the most recent; there is no working copy that is newer.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ 


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Sat Feb  7 22:16:11 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA9413A6D2D for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 22:16:11 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.136
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.136 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.463,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Lnxxqb0uvnIQ for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 22:16:11 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FCF33A6D29 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 22:16:11 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Z1GHABvxWiwP06pbsC/sQZiwep4AR54Q3uIUgT4CnObHnUB0gW47DmEipwsfByGt; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.136.92] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LW2xi-0000wO-QE for ltru@ietf.org; Sun, 08 Feb 2009 01:16:15 -0500
Message-ID: <00ef01c989b4$b4805e40$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Sat, 7 Feb 2009 22:15:56 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173e61e05daf0c2bf8a7e7a3b0e4162407c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.136.92
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 06:16:12 -0000

Hi -

> From: "Doug Ewell" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Saturday, February 07, 2009 10:03 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
...
> For draft-4645bis, the posted draft at 
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-09.txt is 
> the most recent; there is no working copy that is newer.

Thanks.  That makes life simpler.

Randy


From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp  Sat Feb  7 23:09:58 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91CEE3A6939 for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 23:09:58 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.054
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.054 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.456,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 23-3vvK6MATX for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 23:09:57 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.194]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32E9B3A6A6B for ; Sat,  7 Feb 2009 23:09:56 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (scmse2 [133.2.253.17]) by scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1879wp8028099 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 16:09:59 +0900 (JST)
Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 1851_7e82aaca_f5af_11dd_a22e_0019b9e2b3d9; Sun, 08 Feb 2009 16:09:58 +0900
Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:58240) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id  for  from ; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 16:00:50 +0900
Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090208153401.06a57f28@localhost>
X-Sender: duerst@localhost
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J
Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 15:36:40 +0900
To: "Phillips, Addison" , Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group
From: Martin Duerst 
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81713@EX-SEA5-D.ant.a mazon.com>
References: <005f01c98957$f0052980$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81713@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 07:09:58 -0000

Hello Addison,

At 04:48 09/02/08, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>Hi Randy,
>
>(as co-editor)
>
>Thanks for this update. I'm looking forward to the 5378 issue resolving 
>itself and am prepared to submit a new I-D with the proper IPR mumbles and 
>incantations.

Yes, that's exactly what's planned.


>That I-D will contain the text currently in the editor-copy 
>of draft-21 as hosted on inter-locale, which does not currently include 
>*any* new edits, including my recent proposal or any of the Edith Whitehead 
>proposals. The editors will, of course, modify this I-D if the co-chairs 
>determine a consensus exists to do so.

>I would like to request that the co-chairs use the issue tracker from now 
>to track proposed changes to the document and the dispositions thereof. I 
>don't want to miss anything in the limited number of new I-Ds that we'll 
>prepare and would like to have clear go/no-go decisions on what to incorporate.

Which issue tracker? I'll gladly use a home-made Web page the same
way as I did for RFC 4647, but unless it has been made significantly
more usable (by my standard, which may be arbitrary), I don't plan to
use the IETF tracker.

Regards,   Martin.



#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp     


From doug@ewellic.org  Sun Feb  8 08:16:43 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E46623A6BE2 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:16:43 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -0.124
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.124 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.397, BAYES_20=-0.74, FAKE_REPLY_C=2.012, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id px+MIBbOUzxi for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:16:43 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.31]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 2B3DA3A6A4D for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:16:43 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 21885 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2009 16:16:44 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.31) with ESMTP; 08 Feb 2009 16:16:43 -0000
Message-ID: <79C9309DE69E41CCBF88D80A2B417759@DGBP7M81>
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:16:38 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 16:16:44 -0000

To help find a way out of this, I suggest that any passages in 
draft-4646bis (or draft-4645bis, if you find any) that are indisputably 
incorrect in any flavor of English be corrected, and all other editorial 
changes be dismissed.

That is, a passage like "if when" should be corrected, by removing 
either "if" or "when."  But all occurrences of "different from/than/to" 
should be left as is.  (Like Randy, I hate "different than," but 
reasonable people do differ on this.)  And we should not entertain any 
questions of awkwardness or redundancy at this point.  We've had *years* 
to polish this draft.  Look at any 10 arbitrarily selected RFCs from the 
past decade; the style, grammar, and usage in draft-4646bis is certainly 
up to the standards of those documents.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ


From cowan@ccil.org  Sun Feb  8 08:39:41 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 76E353A6948 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:39:41 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.561
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.561 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.038,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DofV6c2mdlbo for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:39:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from earth.ccil.org (earth.ccil.org [192.190.237.11]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 909AC3A67F3 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:39:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from cowan by earth.ccil.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1LWCh6-0005y3-AU; Sun, 08 Feb 2009 11:39:44 -0500
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 11:39:44 -0500
To: Randy Presuhn 
Message-ID: <20090208163944.GB24608@mercury.ccil.org>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <20090208053308.GA24608@mercury.ccil.org> <000401c989b1$8969d180$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <000401c989b1$8969d180$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11)
From: John Cowan 
Cc: ltru@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 16:39:41 -0000

Randy Presuhn scripsit:

> Harper's English Grammar only allows "different from".
> But we all know about dueling authorities on English.  :-)

That's why I said "evidence-based".  To add a little more evidence from
Yahoo (Google's hit-count algorithm is known to be unreliable for large
numbers), "diffent from" gets 279 Mhits, "different than" gets 100 Mhits,
and "different to" gets 49 Mhits.  This is of course distorted by the
historical and continuing dominance of the U.S. on the Web.

-- 
Do I contradict myself?                         John Cowan
Very well then, I contradict myself.            cowan@ccil.org
I am large, I contain multitudes.               http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
        --Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass

From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Sun Feb  8 08:40:19 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D80A3A67F3 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:40:19 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.172
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.172 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.196, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PN-7uB+qG58G for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:40:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: from rv-out-0506.google.com (rv-out-0506.google.com [209.85.198.226]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7AE033A6A83 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 08:40:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: by rv-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id b25so1413179rvf.49 for ; Sun, 08 Feb 2009 08:40:21 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=2qI6D23M8BLOBC7uEHBwBPXoIij1bxT4atv+n+lYnMs=; b=F8e2QiJQy4Jyd8Brw6MmVTQ6PxBaecxgvx6Gl0lfALtLKPuPGJ/S+LQE3f85dVzevM jJK4rRtVKZ2A2X0MJQzuKi4BoELRFAAs9YaMi2WUPktDwhP9Ukg7PTdzcemALBF+qsj0 AMjSvu+iJsjBac9YN9EcHJt0TzZRO49a1Mp5k=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=Toa7ad7CYX8cdhKP7cq1KVZ6nfR5HbtVi6z2NZH/iWf/sOzfj3cZo1n9k4HmutTcON nQLptTu0I31dI1gQ83THyppxsYC7KlrZ/CuItkI37OpiT9mhcrJeDM1qkofQTkNqpMET WCCAW+d/+KG437s3DTMu7M+nSJVn/hzBO8Nak=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.142.102.5 with SMTP id z5mr2297810wfb.334.1234111221789; Sun,  08 Feb 2009 08:40:21 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <79C9309DE69E41CCBF88D80A2B417759@DGBP7M81>
References: <79C9309DE69E41CCBF88D80A2B417759@DGBP7M81>
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 08:40:21 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 6055be0b63b3e9d3
Message-ID: <30b660a20902080840r46716329t154fc0256a809561@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: Doug Ewell 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636e90f1dfcf3a904626ae82b
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 16:40:19 -0000

--001636e90f1dfcf3a904626ae82b
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I agree.

Mark


On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 08:16, Doug Ewell  wrote:

> To help find a way out of this, I suggest that any passages in
> draft-4646bis (or draft-4645bis, if you find any) that are indisputably
> incorrect in any flavor of English be corrected, and all other editorial
> changes be dismissed.
>
> That is, a passage like "if when" should be corrected, by removing either
> "if" or "when."  But all occurrences of "different from/than/to" should b=
e
> left as is.  (Like Randy, I hate "different than," but reasonable people =
do
> differ on this.)  And we should not entertain any questions of awkwardnes=
s
> or redundancy at this point.  We've had *years* to polish this draft.  Lo=
ok
> at any 10 arbitrarily selected RFCs from the past decade; the style,
> grammar, and usage in draft-4646bis is certainly up to the standards of
> those documents.
>
> --
> Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
> http://www.ewellic.org
> http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
> http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  =CB=86
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--001636e90f1dfcf3a904626ae82b
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I agree.

Mark



On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 08:16, Doug Ewell=
 <doug@ewellic.org=
> wrote:

To help find a way out of this, I suggest that any passages in draft-4646bi=
s (or draft-4645bis, if you find any) that are indisputably incorrect in an=
y flavor of English be corrected, and all other editorial changes be dismis=
sed.




That is, a passage like "if when" should be corrected, by removin=
g either "if" or "when."  But all occurrences of &=
quot;different from/than/to" should be left as is.  (Like Randy, =
I hate "different than," but reasonable people do differ on this.=
)  And we should not entertain any questions of awkwardness or redunda=
ncy at this point.  We've had *years* to polish this draft.  =
Look at any 10 arbitrarily selected RFCs from the past decade; the style, g=
rammar, and usage in draft-4646bis is certainly up to the standards of thos=
e documents.




--

Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645 &nb=
sp;*  UTN #14

http://www.ewellic.org=


http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html

http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages &n=
bsp;=CB=86



_______________________________________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru





--001636e90f1dfcf3a904626ae82b--

From doug@ewellic.org  Sun Feb  8 09:07:53 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7FCB3A689F for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:07:53 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.019
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.019 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.433, BAYES_00=-2.599, FAKE_REPLY_C=2.012, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Q1OU0e+O8V8f for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:07:53 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpauth16.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth16.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.22]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 0CDB93A680E for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:07:53 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 10403 invoked from network); 8 Feb 2009 17:07:56 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth16.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.22) with ESMTP; 08 Feb 2009 17:07:55 -0000
Message-ID: <2917706695F74F9E825CD5CC6EDC00E1@DGBP7M81>
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:07:50 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:07:53 -0000

Martin Duerst  wrote:

> Which issue tracker? I'll gladly use a home-made Web page the same way 
> as I did for RFC 4647, but unless it has been made significantly more 
> usable (by my standard, which may be arbitrary), I don't plan to use 
> the IETF tracker.

I don't know about Addison, but I was specifically referring to the 
issue tracker software that:

* was put into use at one point during LTRU 1.0
* generated two messages on the list for every issue
* was roundly criticized for that by list members
* was taken out of use after only a week or two

As long as it can be configured to generate only one list message per 
issue, and I don't see why it couldn't, I would much prefer this tool 
over a private Web page.  There really shouldn't be many issues at this 
point, so the problem of being bombarded with messages shouldn't arise.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ



From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:14:25 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 485E23A69A4 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:14:25 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.651
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.651 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.052, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zHVBKrBr97TD for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:14:24 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 904233A69A0 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:14:24 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="186270748"
Received: from smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.10.25]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:14:28 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HEQ7e028094 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:14:27 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:14:25 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Martin Duerst , Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:10:57 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Where are we?
Thread-Index: AcmJvE3XOo+SlsdNQSqDBuHPlu91hQAUzyYg
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817D7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <005f01c98957$f0052980$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81713@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090208153401.06a57f28@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.20.2.20090208153401.06a57f28@localhost>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:14:25 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:17:50 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29FFD3A6948 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:17:50 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.647
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.647 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.048, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id onbtBSwpkLKH for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:17:49 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 764FB3A690A for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:17:49 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="186272646"
Received: from smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com ([172.20.19.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:17:53 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HHrJe015994 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:17:53 GMT
Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.25) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.311.4; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:17:52 -0800
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:16:40 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:17:51 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Where are we?
Thread-Index: AcmJbJFy5HP31JvsT/KhTkfLniuN/gApBNhQ
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References:  <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81> <007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Where are we?
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:17:50 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:20:09 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A238B3A6A33 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:20:09 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.645
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.645 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.046, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id pQt3tFDCf6Js for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:20:08 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CEF1C3A690A for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:20:08 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="186273630"
Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:20:12 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HKBew026312 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL) for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:20:12 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:20:10 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: LTRU Working Group 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:20:09 -0800
Thread-Topic: draft-21 mod: change ref from 2434 to 5226
Thread-Index: AcmKEX6PDAULH627SqG4d8tvx8zw5w==
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DB@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: change ref from 2434 to 5226
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:20:09 -0000

W3RoaXMgaXMgdGhlIGZpcnN0IGVtYWlsIHJlcG9ydGluZyBjaGFuZ2VzIGJldHdlZW4gdGhlIGN1
cnJlbnQgb2ZmaWNpYWwgZHJhZnQsIHdoaWNoIGlzIGRyYWZ0LTIwLCBhbmQgdGhlIGVkaXRvciBj
b3B5LCB3aGljaCBpcyBkcmFmdC0yMV0NCg0KSXNzdWU6IHVwZGF0ZSByZWZlcmVuY2UgZnJvbSBS
RkMgMjQzNCB0byBSRkMgNTIyNg0KDQpSZXNvbHV0aW9uOiBjb21wbGV0ZWQgaW4gZHJhZnQtMjE7
IDI0MzQgd2FzIG9ic29sZXRlIGJ5IDUyMjYNCg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXph
dGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoNCkludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBh
IGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRlY3R1cmUuDQoNCg0K

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:21:57 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 578F33A6882 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:21:57 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.587
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.587 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.012, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YCyanmMtRGF8 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:21:56 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77EBE3A6840 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:21:56 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139445424"
Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:22:00 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HLxgC024235 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL) for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:22:00 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:21:58 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: LTRU Working Group 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:21:57 -0800
Thread-Topic: draft-21 mod: move 2860 ref to informative
Thread-Index: AcmKEb7lxYHtZdxCQXyxnqPBNCNBRw==
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DC@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move 2860 ref to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:21:57 -0000

SXNzdWU6IG1vdmUgdGhlIHJlZmVyZW5jZSB0byBSRkMgMjg2MCAiTWVtb3JhbmR1bSBvZgkgCQkN
CglVbmRlcnN0YW5kaW5nIENvbmNlcm5pbmcgdGhlIFRlY2huaWNhbCBXb3JrIG9mIHRoZQkJCQ0K
CUludGVybmV0IEFzc2lnbmVkIE51bWJlcnMgQXV0aG9yaXR5IiBmcm9tIG5vcm1hdGl2ZSB0byBp
bmZvcm1hdGl2ZQ0KDQpSZXNvbHV0aW9uOiBjb21wbGV0ZWQgaW4gZHJhZnQtMjEgYnkgcmVxdWVz
dCBvZiBvbmUgb2YgdGhlIGNvLWNoYWlycy4NCg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXph
dGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoNCkludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBh
IGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRlY3R1cmUuDQoNCg0K

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:23:40 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6EEC73A6A33 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:23:40 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.587
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.587 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.012, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W-LIijrDgK8H for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:23:39 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F4603A6990 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:23:39 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139446132"
Received: from smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.18]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:23:43 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HNgHW030186 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:23:42 GMT
Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.23) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.311.2; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:23:42 -0800
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:22:29 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: LTRU Working Group 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:23:40 -0800
Thread-Topic: draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
Thread-Index: AcmKEfxVixvYIDvUSFmsPzo9JFYwWA==
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:23:40 -0000

SXNzdWU6IG1vdmUgUkZDIDQ2NDUgcmVmZXJlbmNlIHRvIGluZm9ybWF0aXZlDQoNClJlc29sdXRp
b246IG1vdmVkIHRvIHRoZSBpbmZvcm1hdGl2ZSBzZWN0aW9uIGZyb20gdGhlIG5vcm1hdGl2ZSBz
ZWN0aW9uLiBUaGUgIm5vcm1hdGl2ZSIgbWF0ZXJpYWwgaW4gNDY0NSBpbiBxdWVzdGlvbiBpc24n
dCB1cCB0byB0aGUgc3RhbmRhcmQgb2YgaGF2aW5nIGEgbm9ybWF0aXZlIHJlZmVyZW5jZS4NCg0K
QWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoNCklu
dGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRlY3R1
cmUuDQoNCg0K

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:27:20 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A9303A6840 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:27:20 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.588
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.588 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.011, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1cw6evjvnitD for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:27:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A23823A6817 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:27:18 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="218528488"
Received: from smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.17]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:27:19 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HRJIr010628; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:27:19 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:27:18 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:27:17 -0800
Thread-Topic: "different from" issue
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBWYWDg
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DE@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] "different from" issue
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:27:20 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:29:08 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24E863A69A0 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:29:08 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.588
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.588 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.011, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bpww5Y1FUUX9 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:29:06 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67A2D3A6840 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:29:06 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="218529305"
Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:29:10 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HT9rp003651 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:29:10 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:29:09 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:29:07 -0800
Thread-Topic: change "apply"
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBWc0MQ
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] change "apply"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:29:08 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:30:15 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C66FE3A69BD for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:30:15 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.588
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.588 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.011, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Iizi8t-lf2AH for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:30:14 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9F4773A6840 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:30:14 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139448686"
Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:30:18 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HUH89000784 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:30:18 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:30:17 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:30:13 -0800
Thread-Topic: change "the ones"
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBWg3Tw
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E1@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] change "the ones"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:30:15 -0000

SXNzdWU6DQoNCj4gLi4uDQo+ID4gID8gQWxzbywgQ0hBTkdFOiAgInRoZSBvbmVzIiB0byAidGhv
c2UiIChJIHRoaW5rIHRoZSB0aGUgdGV4dCBpcw0KPiBtb3JlIGNvaGVzaXZlIHdpdGggJ3Rob3Nl
Jw0KPiA+IGJlY2F1c2UgaXQgcmVmZXJzIGJhY2sgdG8gJ3RoZSBydWxlcyctLXRoaXMgaXMgYW4g
aWRlYSB0aGF0DQo+IEhhbGxpZGF5IGhhcyBhYm91dCBjb2hlc2lvbiB0b28pIH0NCj4gDQo+IERp
c2FncmVlLiAgSSBzZWUgbm8gbmVlZCBmb3IgdGhpcyBjaGFuZ2UuDQo+IA0KDQpSZXNvbHV0aW9u
OiBubyBjaGFuZ2UuIFB1cmVseSBlZGl0b3JpYWwgcmVxdWVzdC4NCg==

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:31:32 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 448463A69FF for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:31:32 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.642
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.642 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.043, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CSL0xNMyQO84 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:31:31 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97F8D3A69A4 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:31:31 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="186278820"
Received: from smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.10.25]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:31:35 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HVYIr016571 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:31:35 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:31:33 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:31:32 -0800
Thread-Topic: change "than"
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBWjP+g
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E2@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] change "than"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:31:32 -0000

SXNzdWU6DQo+IA0KPiA+ICJTdGFuZGFyZHMsIHByb3RvY29scywgYW5kIGFwcGxpY2F0aW9ucyB0
aGF0IHJlZmVyZW5jZSB0aGlzDQo+IGRvY3VtZW50DQo+ID4gICBub3JtYXRpdmVseSBidXQgYWRo
ZXJlIHRvIHJ1bGVzIGRpZmZlcmVudCB0aGFuIHRob3NlIGdpdmVuIGluDQo+IHRoaXMgc2VjdGlv
biAuIC4gLiAiDQo+IA0KPiBUaGlzIHByb3Bvc2VkIHVzYWdlIG9mICJ0aGFuIiBpcyBzaW1wbHkg
d3JvbmcsIGFuZCBJIGNhbm5vdCBzdXBwb3J0DQo+IGl0Lg0KPiANCg0KUmVzb2x1dGlvbjogSXQn
cyBub3QgYWN0dWFsbHkgd3JvbmcsIGRlcGVuZGluZyBvbiB3aGljaCBncmFtbWFyaWFuIG9uZSB3
b3JzaGlwcy4gU2luY2UgdGhlIHRleHQgaXMgY2xlYXIsIG5vIGNoYW5nZS4NCg==

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:35:17 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F9993A689F for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:35:17 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.64
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.64 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.041, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jfJo5faIGO+j for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:35:16 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C37283A6826 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:35:16 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="186280798"
Received: from smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.10.25]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:35:20 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HZJCa020305 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:35:20 GMT
Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.311.2; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:35:18 -0800
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:34:07 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:35:18 -0800
Thread-Topic: change "if when"
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBWmO2g
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] change "if when"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:35:17 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:45:51 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C1EF3A6A33 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:45:51 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.589
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.589 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.010, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uNOcBRtxIceO for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:45:50 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E5103A6918 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:45:50 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139454466"
Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:45:54 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HjrS9022921 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:45:54 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:45:53 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:45:51 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: "language priority list"
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBWupSw
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E5@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: "language priority list"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:45:51 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:47:50 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A8483A6840 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:47:50 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.589
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.589 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.010, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0CN6MHe0Sfm6 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:47:49 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 983B93A6904 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:47:49 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="218539864"
Received: from smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.10.25]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:47:53 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HlqxZ001534 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:47:53 GMT
Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.24) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.311.4; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:47:52 -0800
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:46:40 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:47:50 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: record ordering instructions
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXGQUw
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:47:50 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:49:24 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D6933A69BD for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:49:24 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.59
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.59 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.009, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rbtH7Xa6zZHv for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:49:23 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 409173A6983 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:49:23 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139455728"
Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:49:27 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HnQqE026641 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:49:27 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:49:25 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:49:24 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: truncation
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXKpGg
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E8@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: truncation
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:49:24 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:53:20 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66F903A6A19 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:53:20 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.59
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.59 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.009, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DQiWJEcrqpcp for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:53:19 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 923483A69A0 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:53:19 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="218543263"
Received: from smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.17]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:53:23 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HrMRB003594; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:53:22 GMT
Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.23) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.311.2; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:53:22 -0800
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:52:10 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:53:17 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: use of word "response"
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXOJSw
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817EB@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: use of word "response"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:53:20 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:54:54 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36BFE3A69A0 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:54:54 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.59
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.59 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.009, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XvsoxAOszvUW for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:54:53 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6AC993A6A19 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:54:53 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139457948"
Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:54:55 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18Hss1e000607 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:54:55 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:54:53 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:54:53 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: "two authorities"
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXW3Ug
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817EF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: "two authorities"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:54:54 -0000

SXNzdWU6DQo+IA0KPiA+ID8gMy43IHBhciA0ICYgNQ0KPiAuLi4NCj4gPiB7Q09NTUVOVDogIHRo
ZSB0d28gbWFpbnRhaW5pbmcgYXV0aG9yaXRpZXMsIElBTkEsIGFuZCB0aGUNCj4gaW5kaXZpZHVh
bA0KPiA+IGF1dGhvcml0eSwgbWlnaHQgYmUgY29uZnVzZWQgYnkgcmVhZGVycyBoZXJlPz8NCj4g
Li4uDQo+IA0KDQpSYW5keSdzIGNvbW1lbnRzOg0KPiBHaXZlbiB0aGUgdG9waWMgb2YgdGhlIHNl
Y3Rpb24sIEkgZmluZCBpdCBkaWZmaWN1bHQgdG8gaW1hZ2luZSBzdWNoDQo+IGNvbmZ1c2lvbg0K
PiB0YWtpbmcgcGxhY2UuDQo+IA0KDQpSZXNvbHV0aW9uOiBubyBjaGFuZ2UuDQoNCg==

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:58:25 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9AFC33A6A8A for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:58:25 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.638
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.638 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.039, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eGuvu91CEPQf for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:58:24 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4AA53A6A4D for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:58:24 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="186292436"
Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:58:23 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18HwMt8004572 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:58:23 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:58:22 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:58:21 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: primary language SHOULD
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXaa3g
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: primary language SHOULD
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:58:25 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 09:59:40 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 899A43A6A8A for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:59:40 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.636
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.636 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.037, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8LfL7vMUm24h for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:59:39 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB00C3A6A33 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 09:59:39 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="186293079"
Received: from smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.18]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 17:59:44 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18Hxiph000758; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:59:44 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:59:44 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 09:59:42 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: change "follow" to "consult"
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXiQIg
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F1@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: change "follow" to "consult"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 17:59:40 -0000

PiANCj4gPiA/PyB7QSBTRUNPTkQgQ09NTUVOVC9DT1JSRUNUSU9OIGZvciBTZW50ZW5jZSAzOiAg
d29yZA0KPiA+IGNob2ljZTsgY2hhbmdlICJmb2xsb3ciIHRvICJjb25zdWx0IiAgSSB3b3VsZCBu
ZXZlciBzYXkgImZvbGxvdyINCj4gPiBmb3IgZWl0aGVyIHVubGVzcyBJIHNhaWQgImZvbGxvdyB0
aGUgZ3VpZGVsaW5lcyAuIC4gLiI7ICJjb25zdWx0Ig0KPiA+IGlzIHRoZSBiZXN0IHdvcmQgd2l0
aCAidXNlcnMiIHByb2JhYmx5OyBub3Qgc3VyZSBhdCBhbGwgYWJvdXQNCj4gPiBpbXBsZW1lbnRh
dGlvbnMgYnV0IEkgd291bGQgbm90IHNheSAiZm9sbG93In0NCj4gDQoNClJhbmR5J3MgY29tbWVu
dHM6DQoNCj4gRGlzYWdyZWUuICBXaGlsZSBJIGFwcHJlY2lhdGUgdGhlIHByZWZlcmVuY2UgZm9y
ICJjb25zdWx0IiwgaXQNCj4gZG9lcyBub3QgbWVhbiB0aGUgc2FtZSB0aGluZyBhcyAiZm9sbG93
Ii4NCj4gDQoNClJlc29sdXRpb246IG5vIGNoYW5nZS4NCg==

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 10:02:55 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C5BCE3A6A4D for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:02:55 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.59
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.59 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.009, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 7XBgvHN8AMLr for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:02:55 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E26EF3A6986 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:02:54 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="218549723"
Received: from smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com ([172.20.19.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 18:02:58 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18I2vT9028898 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 18:02:57 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:02:56 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:02:56 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: uz-Zxxx example
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXlOuA
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: uz-Zxxx example
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 18:02:55 -0000

PiA+ID8gNC4xIHBhciA2IGl0ZW0gMiBleGFtcGxlIHNlY29uZCBidWxsZXQgbGFzdCBzZW50ZW5j
ZQ0KPiA+DQo+ID4geyBPUklHSU5BTCBURVhUIH0NCj4gPg0KPiA+ICIoVGhlIHRhZyAidXotWnh4
eCINCj4gPiAgICAgICAgY291bGQgYWxzbyBiZSB1c2VkIHdoZXJlIGNvbnRlbnQgaXMgbm90IHdy
aXR0ZW4sIGFzIHRoZQ0KPiBzdWJ0YWcNCj4gPiAgICAgICAgICdaeHh4JyByZXByZXNlbnRzIHRo
ZSAiQ29kZSBmb3IgdW53cml0dGVuIGRvY3VtZW50cyIuKSINCj4gPg0KPiA+IHsgQ09NTUVOVC9D
T1JSRUNUSU9OIEkgZG8gbm90IHNlZSB3aGF0IGNsYXJpdHkgb3IgaW5mb3JtYXRpb24NCj4gPiB0
aGUgd29yZCAnY29kZScgYWRkcyB0byB0aGlzIHNlbnRlbmNlIHNvIEkgQ09SUkVDVEVEIGl0IH0N
Cj4gDQo+IEkgYmVsaWV2ZSBpdCdzIGEgcXVvdGUgZnJvbSB0aGUgc3VidGFnJ3MgcmVnaXN0cnkg
ZW50eS4NCj4gDQo+ID4gIlRoZSB0YWcgInV6LVp4eHgiDQo+ID4gICAgICAgICBjb3VsZCBhbHNv
IGJlIHVzZWQgd2hlcmUgY29udGVudCBpcyBub3Qgd3JpdHRlbiBhcyB0aGUNCj4gc2NyaXB0IHN1
YnRhZyAnWnh4eCcgaXMgdXNlZCB0byBpbmRpY2F0ZSB1bndyaXR0ZW4gZG9jdW1lbnRzIg0KDQpS
YW5keSdzIGNvbW1lbnQ6DQoNCj4gDQo+IEkgdGhpbmsgdGhpcyB3b3VsZCBiZSBhIHN0ZXAgYmFj
a3dhcmRzLCBzaW5jZSBpdCBkZS1lbXBoYXNpemVzIHRoZQ0KPiBnZW5lcmF0aXZlIG5hdHVyZQ0K
PiBvZiBzdWJ0YWdzLg0KPiANCg0KUmVzb2x1dGlvbjogbm8gY2hhbmdlLiBUaGlzIHRleHQgaXMg
dGhlIHJlc3VsdCBvZiBzZXZlcmFsIG1lc3NhZ2UgdGhyZWFkcyBlYXJsaWVyLiBBcyBSYW5keSBu
b3RlcywgdGhlIHRpdGxlIG9mIHRoZSBzdWJ0YWcgaXMgdGFrZW4gZGlyZWN0bHkgZnJvbSB0aGUg
cmVnaXN0cnksIGFzIHdlIGRvIHdpdGggb3RoZXIgc3VidGFnIGV4YW1wbGVzIGluIHRoZSBkb2N1
bWVudC4gDQo=

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 10:04:06 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C59FB3A6986 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:04:06 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.591
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.591 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.008, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iAvblyjAN+OH for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:04:06 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B25853A6983 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:04:05 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139462487"
Received: from smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com ([172.20.19.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 18:04:09 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18I48GD030092 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 18:04:08 GMT
Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.311.2; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:04:07 -0800
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:02:56 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:04:06 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: Romanian/Modolvan example
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXsdzQ
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F4@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: Romanian/Modolvan example
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 18:04:06 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 10:06:49 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 567AF3A69FF for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:06:49 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.591
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.591 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.008, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id emcgx6oUfsZP for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:06:48 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3536E3A6986 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:06:48 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139463665"
Received: from smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.17]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 18:06:51 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18I6pdZ017537; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 18:06:51 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:06:50 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:06:49 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: relationship guarantee
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBXu+eA
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: relationship guarantee
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 18:06:49 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 10:11:36 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF6253A6986 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:11:36 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.634
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.634 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.035, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NDDiNI8uD6Oh for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:11:36 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDBFD3A6931 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:11:35 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="186298638"
Received: from smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.18]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 18:11:40 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18IBemG014116; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 18:11:40 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:11:39 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:11:39 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBX1Gfw
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 18:11:36 -0000
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From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 10:12:35 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4A75D3A6A19 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:12:35 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.591
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.591 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.008, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id W66qIZP8cDr6 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:12:34 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 77B103A68CE for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:12:34 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="139466138"
Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 18:12:38 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18ICbup021567 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 8 Feb 2009 18:12:38 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:12:37 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:12:35 -0800
Thread-Topic: issue: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT
Thread-Index: AcmIuLQVoRPpi02FQ4Ce3a0/ts2ppQBX/59Q
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F9@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] issue: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 18:12:35 -0000

W3RoaXMgaXMgdGhlIGxhc3Qgb24gdGhpcyB0aHJlYWRdDQo+ID4gPz8gMy41IHBhciAyMQ0KPiAu
Li4NCj4gPiB7ISBDT01NRU5UL0NMQVJJRklDQVRJT04gPyAgUGxlYXNlIGV4cGxhaW4gIlNIQUxM
IE5PVCIgdmVyc3VzDQo+ICJNVVNUIE5PVCItLQ0KDQpSYW5keSdzIGNvbW1lbnRzOg0KPiANCj4g
VGhpcyBpcyBzcGVsbGVkIG91dCBpbiBSRkMgMjExOS4NCj4gDQoNClJlc29sdXRpb246IG5vdGhp
bmcgdG8gZG8gaGVyZS4NCg0K

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 10:22:57 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 31EE23A6983 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:22:57 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.591
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.591 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.008, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id FlnuqpLXcHe3 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:22:56 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5261D3A68CE for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 10:22:56 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="218560441"
Received: from smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.18]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 18:23:00 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18IMxFY024807 for ; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 18:22:59 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:22:59 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 10:22:57 -0800
Thread-Topic: editor's copy on inter-locale updated
Thread-Index: AcmKGkR7U+Osm5JURiy/dLpU/U3XoA==
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817FF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: [Ltru] editor's copy on inter-locale updated
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 18:22:57 -0000

DQoNCkFkZGlzb24gUGhpbGxpcHMNCkdsb2JhbGl6YXRpb24gQXJjaGl0ZWN0IC0tIExhYjEyNg0K
DQpJbnRlcm5hdGlvbmFsaXphdGlvbiBpcyBub3QgYSBmZWF0dXJlLg0KSXQgaXMgYW4gYXJjaGl0
ZWN0dXJlLg0KDQoNCg==

From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Sun Feb  8 11:18:10 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 225D23A68AE for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:18:10 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.158
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.158 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.182, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id i1PZsW-haW9R for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:18:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.170]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B3093A6839 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:18:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so1673305wfd.31 for ; Sun, 08 Feb 2009 11:18:13 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=bLf8ZUfVaqk3bnCZFoJesHjLpu00ibK74kJY24kAcPU=; b=l0CuwYJlDqd6UP4+mYgpSbcJLGwprVdh4nERYVYneN71qQE95TFWU3qHVhT6U+NGQb dsdJaDj3nrDBgH77gT8nDvUZ4rLOiMt55TrUDhEy32/z3e0QDQqOIycOlhFNq2fXWxF3 FYSXIKf0k+zHCNOD+24vCdwqtolvsGJ4HhGMQ=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=bw/n8phsiaAovv04K3kFYLSdDLIgz+P0rrYn+ISub2BNhN+7DTmqeLj3lg6WOdDqFG igx9FE33Lf9kQCykIbYmLqcY9i+GZU/+FUk+v7b5caCCrO9Pr3YsKRsmqJoe6TXq7Mzb mUeBv1dJf6zsDyA3Eo/S3vuU6Mygsmp5OenNg=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.142.125.9 with SMTP id x9mr2394241wfc.38.1234120693833; Sun,  08 Feb 2009 11:18:13 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817FF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817FF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 11:18:13 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 02dca50da9d6fad6
Message-ID: <30b660a20902081118p2c6dce70n8d4484a96c28143@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: "Phillips, Addison" 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd228b890e07a04626d1d23
Cc: "ltru@ietf.org" 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] editor's copy on inter-locale updated
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 19:18:10 -0000

--000e0cd228b890e07a04626d1d23
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

thanks for all your work. Is the diff up to date also?

Mark


On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 10:22, Phillips, Addison  wrote:

>
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--000e0cd228b890e07a04626d1d23
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

thanks for all your work. Is the diff up to date also?

Mark



On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 10:22, Phillips, =
Addison <addison=
@amazon.com> wrote:





Addison Phillips

Globalization Architect -- Lab126



Internationalization is not a feature.

It is an architecture.





_______________________________________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru





--000e0cd228b890e07a04626d1d23--

From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 11:19:11 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 638993A68AE for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:19:11 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.632
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.632 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.034, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wX+hM-+C0Jf2 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:19:10 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 400013A6839 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:19:10 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,400,1231113600";  d="scan'208,217";a="186325553"
Received: from smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.17]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Feb 2009 19:19:08 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n18JJ80Y023276; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 19:19:08 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 11:19:07 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Mark Davis 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 11:19:06 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] editor's copy on inter-locale updated
Thread-Index: AcmKIf3QgHjEmtd0SXGetzIV7g875gAAAjOg
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8180F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817FF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <30b660a20902081118p2c6dce70n8d4484a96c28143@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <30b660a20902081118p2c6dce70n8d4484a96c28143@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8180FEXSEA5Dantama_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Cc: "ltru@ietf.org" 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] editor's copy on inter-locale updated
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 19:19:11 -0000

--_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8180FEXSEA5Dantama_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
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=

--_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8180FEXSEA5Dantama_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
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--_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8180FEXSEA5Dantama_--

From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Sun Feb  8 11:24:50 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EA1C03A6B1A for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:24:50 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.146
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.146 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.170, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id q-17D61rWbw9 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:24:50 -0800 (PST)
Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.168]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 295D13A68AE for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 11:24:50 -0800 (PST)
Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so1674700wfd.31 for ; Sun, 08 Feb 2009 11:24:54 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=o6bEW0OrmENVZ0CLToWj7xCBDBmos45IcURE8T6ds9s=; b=fHan8WJia1ypUuv4nBCbkzpZK8zhCXcT+HiDMtc+J9WUcSno1zB5gxbihjpvSY2yNy PWGYUTNAY3mdV8zxqcsZ/qIqPhJruXvs6Bve92uEx7FYvDZgNTBbEze0a86lORACHQdC GaEISIlp6B9meBSyWvzu/Ndk1PLcRi8Ick7ZA=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=sOvi2HEBivgmp9OlsIdgA7qdrulPU32DEUyYE/chcjkACArn42yY025L+zj39bAHjq ZyfnKj5rKLgkM0OyrVR0thpric4aE5aWZy8k2t28X27lFOHRU8ArapfCnUyHtDMvgy1V inLyp1/yyQUxNA94IPE5XbA++lccPKNih/fbU=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.142.148.19 with SMTP id v19mr1120219wfd.16.1234121094565; Sun,  08 Feb 2009 11:24:54 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8180F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817FF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <30b660a20902081118p2c6dce70n8d4484a96c28143@mail.gmail.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8180F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 11:24:54 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 2b526a84ab4d546d
Message-ID: <30b660a20902081124u1f897359i528b86f7d1f39892@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: "Phillips, Addison" 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd3114473913d04626d35ed
Cc: "ltru@ietf.org" 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] editor's copy on inter-locale updated
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 19:24:51 -0000

--000e0cd3114473913d04626d35ed
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

All looks good to me.

Mark


On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 11:19, Phillips, Addison  wrote:

>  Hi Mark,
>
>
>
> The diff is generated when you click the link, so, yes it is.
>
>
>
> I have not placed a static diff on the site at this time.
>
>
>
> Addison
>
>
>
> Addison Phillips
>
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
>
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
>
> It is an architecture.
>
>
>
> *From:* mark.edward.davis@gmail.com [mailto:mark.edward.davis@gmail.com] *On
> Behalf Of *Mark Davis
> *Sent:* Sunday, February 08, 2009 11:18 AM
> *To:* Phillips, Addison
> *Cc:* ltru@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Ltru] editor's copy on inter-locale updated
>
>
>
> thanks for all your work. Is the diff up to date also?
>
> Mark
>
>  On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 10:22, Phillips, Addison 
> wrote:
>
>
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>
>
>

--000e0cd3114473913d04626d35ed
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

All looks good to me.

Mark



On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 11:19, Phillips, =
Addison <addison=
@amazon.com> wrote:

















Hi Mark,



 <=
/p>


The diff is ge=
nerated when you click the link, so, yes it is.



 <=
/p>


I have not pla=
ced a static diff on the site at this time.



 <=
/p>


Addison=




 <=
/p>


Addison Phillip=
s



Globalization A=
rchitect -- Lab126



 


Internationaliz=
ation is not a feature.



It is an archit=
ecture.



 <=
/p>











From: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
[mailto:ma=
rk.edward.davis@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Mark Davis

Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 11:18 AM

To: Phillips, Addison

Cc: ltru@ietf.org=


Subject: Re: [Ltru] editor's copy on inter-locale updated=










 



thanks for all your work. Is
the diff up to date also?



Mark










On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 10:22, Phillips, Addison <addison@amazon.com> wrote:







Addison Phillips

Globalization Architect -- Lab126



Internationalization is not a feature.

It is an architecture.





_______________________________________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru






 
















--000e0cd3114473913d04626d35ed--

From cewcathar@hotmail.com  Sun Feb  8 14:29:30 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 897853A69B7 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 14:29:30 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.478
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.478 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.120,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dVIpEXh3m3li for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 14:29:29 -0800 (PST)
Received: from blu0-omc3-s16.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s16.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.91]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C7BCB3A68B8 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 14:29:29 -0800 (PST)
Received: from BLU109-W38 ([65.55.116.74]) by blu0-omc3-s16.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Sun, 8 Feb 2009 14:29:33 -0800
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_3fd22064-28c9-4bdc-8e52-8779eb6f9a95_"
X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11]
From: CE Whitehead 
To: 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 17:29:33 -0500
Importance: Normal
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 08 Feb 2009 22:29:33.0685 (UTC) FILETIME=[B76D8A50:01C98A3C]
Subject: Re: [Ltru] "different from" issue & other editorial decisions (was Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to 4646bis i-d )
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 08 Feb 2009 22:29:30 -0000

--_3fd22064-28c9-4bdc-8e52-8779eb6f9a95_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Thanks (& especially thanks to Addison) for going through and responding to=
 all of my editorial comments at this late date.
=20
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com =

--_3fd22064-28c9-4bdc-8e52-8779eb6f9a95_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable






Thanks (&=3B especially thanks =3Bto Addison) for going through and =
responding to all of my editorial comments at this late date.

 =3B

--C. E. Whitehead

cewcathar@hotmail.com 

=

--_3fd22064-28c9-4bdc-8e52-8779eb6f9a95_--

From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp  Sun Feb  8 17:44:17 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A2673A67F6 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 17:44:17 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.07
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.07 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.440,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GtHTtbpMcaJE for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 17:44:16 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.195]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A84393A67D1 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 17:44:15 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.253.23]) by scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n191iJuF007674 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 10:44:19 +0900 (JST)
Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 4068_2abaf1d0_f64b_11dd_938b_001d0969ab06; Mon, 09 Feb 2009 10:44:19 +0900
Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:55634) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id  for  from ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 10:36:00 +0900
Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090209103548.05703158@localhost>
X-Sender: duerst@localhost
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 10:37:26 +0900
To: "Phillips, Addison" , LTRU Working Group 
From: Martin Duerst 
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DC@EX-SEA5-D.ant.a mazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DC@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move 2860 ref to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 01:44:17 -0000

Additional background info for everybody:

This request was made because RFC 2860 is Informational, and
normative references should be to documents on Standards Track
or similar, and this was caught by the ID-nits tool. Also,
these is nothing fundamentally normative about this reference.

Regards,   Martin.

At 02:21 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>Issue: move the reference to RFC 2860 "Memorandum of                   
>       Understanding Concerning the Technical Work of the                      
>       Internet Assigned Numbers Authority" from normative to informative
>
>Resolution: completed in draft-21 by request of one of the co-chairs.
>
>Addison Phillips
>Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
>Internationalization is not a feature.
>It is an architecture.
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ltru mailing list
>Ltru@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru


#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp     


From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp  Sun Feb  8 17:47:58 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 330A93A67F6 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 17:47:58 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.085
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.085 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.425,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xQYCSQ333bVV for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 17:47:57 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.195]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0BE73A67D1 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 17:47:56 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.253.23]) by scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n191m0Dv008575 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 10:48:01 +0900 (JST)
Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 4d23_aee85614_f64b_11dd_9f60_001d0969ab06; Mon, 09 Feb 2009 10:48:00 +0900
Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:44329) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id  for  from ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 10:39:40 +0900
Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090209104324.05702ed8@localhost>
X-Sender: duerst@localhost
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 10:47:37 +0900
To: "Phillips, Addison" , "ltru@ietf.org" 
From: Martin Duerst 
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817FF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.a mazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817FF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [Ltru] editor's copy on inter-locale updated
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 01:47:58 -0000

For everybody's information, this is
http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt,
and a diff is available at
http://tools.ietf.org/tools/rfcdiff/rfcdiff.pyht?url1=http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.txt&url2=http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt

Unless somebody actively disagrees (by sending a mail to the list),
we (the chairs) will take all the issues posted today as accepted
in the way they have been proposed by the editors.

Regards,    Martin.


At 03:22 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>
>
>Addison Phillips
>Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
>Internationalization is not a feature.
>It is an architecture.
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ltru mailing list
>Ltru@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru


#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp     


From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp  Sun Feb  8 18:07:10 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ACEE73A69A6 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 18:07:10 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.098
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.098 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.412,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xsv2b1MZklem for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 18:07:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.194]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 36FF53A69E3 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 18:07:08 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.253.23]) by scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1927BoP017003 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 11:07:11 +0900 (JST)
Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 1546_5ce20646_f64e_11dd_9421_001d0969ab06; Mon, 09 Feb 2009 11:07:11 +0900
Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:37210) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id  for  from ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 10:58:52 +0900
Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost>
X-Sender: duerst@localhost
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 11:06:05 +0900
To: "Phillips, Addison" , LTRU Working Group 
From: Martin Duerst 
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.a mazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 02:07:10 -0000

Hello Addison,

At 02:23 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>Issue: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>
>Resolution: moved to the informative section from the normative section. 
>The "normative" material in 4645 in question isn't up to the standard of 
>having a normative reference.

This is as requested by the chairs. However, it is incomplete.

On February 2nd, I wrote:

>>>>>>>>
I have looked at this and at the diff, and have run the idnits tool.

However, we now have an informative reference in a normative sentence:

       E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries
           or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section 4 of
           [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered into
           the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5.
           Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language
           tags.

My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had
the same idea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645],
we would replace it inline with the only instance left, resulting
in something like:

       E.  The UN numeric code or ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code (once assigned)
           for the Channel Islands MAY be entered into the IANA registry
           via the process described in Section 3.5 (for historic
           details, see [RFC4645]).

Can you please make such an update to your staging draft,
so that we are ready to move forward when the copyright
issues are solved.
>>>>>>>>

I haven't seen anybody reply to this except for Gerard Lang.

Can you please make the requested edit, or tell me why you
think it's not appropriate?

Regards,    Martin.


>Addison Phillips
>Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
>Internationalization is not a feature.
>It is an architecture.
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ltru mailing list
>Ltru@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru


#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp     


From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp  Sun Feb  8 18:20:45 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34D543A6AB6 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 18:20:45 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 1.411
X-Spam-Level: *
X-Spam-Status: No, score=1.411 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.699,  BAYES_50=0.001, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6AQg69ado8vA for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 18:20:44 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.194]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3ABBB3A6A96 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 18:20:43 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (scmse2 [133.2.253.17]) by scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1927CvF017008 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 11:07:12 +0900 (JST)
Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 065f_5d6fe1f0_f64e_11dd_872d_0019b9e2b3d9; Mon, 09 Feb 2009 11:07:12 +0900
Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:37210) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id  for  from ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 10:58:54 +0900
Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090209110318.05702bd0@localhost>
X-Sender: duerst@localhost
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 11:05:06 +0900
To: Lang G=?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCcVMbKEI=?=ard , , Lang G =?ISO-2022-JP?B?GyRCcVMbKEI=?=ard 
From: Martin Duerst 
In-Reply-To: <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD09B5@S90X2HUB1.ad.inse e.intra>
References:  <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD09B5@S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 2
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 02:20:45 -0000

At 23:20 09/02/03, Lang G$BqS(Bard wrote:
>Dear All,
>
>Concerning the discussed point E, I would like to remark that the proposed 
>text is not so clearly evident, because:
>(i)- Channel Islands is not, and never was, an entry inside ISO 3166-1;

That's exactyl why there is this special provision.

>(ii)- Isle of Man, that is also concerned by section 4 of [RFC4645], cannot 
>be considered as part of Channel Islands.

That's irrelevant. In RFC 4645, and potentially in the registry,
these are just four codes, for four regions, which could be anywhere
in the world.

Regards,    Martin.

>Ilet me also add that, inside 9.1. Normative References dates given for 
>parts 1,2 and 3 of ISO 639-1 should be precised, as is the case for ISO 
>639-5, as:
>(i)- July 2002 for ISO 639-1;
>(ii)- October 1998 for ISO 639-2;
>(iii)- February 2007 for ISO 639-3;
>.
>
>Bien cordialement.
>G$BqS(Bard LANG



#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp     


From addison@amazon.com  Sun Feb  8 20:43:35 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2FEB93A6961 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 20:43:35 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.292
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.292 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.293, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iST6bDcmAA1c for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 20:43:34 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8A953A6953 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 20:43:33 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,403,1231113600"; d="scan'208";a="218825004"
Received: from smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com ([172.20.19.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 09 Feb 2009 04:43:37 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n194hanA026377 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 9 Feb 2009 04:43:37 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Sun, 8 Feb 2009 20:43:36 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Martin Duerst , LTRU Working Group 
Date: Sun, 8 Feb 2009 20:43:34 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
Thread-Index: AcmKWyJBnWjUQ9qDTk+g2YEwuYcXSQAFHArA
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost>
In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 04:43:35 -0000
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=

From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp  Sun Feb  8 23:31:19 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 05A363A6B17 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 23:31:19 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.163
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.163 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.347,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5McMqs4Ribv4 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 23:31:17 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.195]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A5503A6827 for ; Sun,  8 Feb 2009 23:31:16 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.253.23]) by scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n197VIGZ028579 for ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 16:31:19 +0900 (JST)
Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 42dd_a3e2fb2c_f67b_11dd_8fee_001d0969ab06; Mon, 09 Feb 2009 16:31:18 +0900
Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:43159) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id  for  from ; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 16:22:55 +0900
Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost>
X-Sender: duerst@localhost
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J
Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 15:49:42 +0900
To: "Phillips, Addison" , LTRU Working Group 
From: Martin Duerst 
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.a mazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 07:31:19 -0000

Hello Addison,

At 13:43 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>I didn't make the change to the text in part because it was overlooked.

Okay, no problem.
 
>However, I'm also allergic to the text you propose. The reference to 4645 
>used to be normative because, in fact, it was normative in precisely this 
>spot. However, the Channel Islands related registrations were accomplished 
>in the 4646 era, so having a bit of "MAY" for them seems redundant.

That's not my understanding. Three registrations have been made,
but a fourth is still outstanding.

If I put together section 4 of RFC 4645:

>>>>
4.  Omitted Code Elements

   The following code elements from [UN_M.49] were not associated with
   [ISO3166-1] alpha-2 code elements.  Consequently, they were not
   assigned as subtags in the initial Language Subtag Registry, but were
   valid candidates for registration as region subtags, using the
   process in [RFC4646]:

      830   Channel Islands
      831   Guernsey
      832   Jersey
      833   Isle of Man

   The last three became ineligible for registration in April, 2006,
   when the [ISO3166-1] code elements GG, JE, and IM were assigned as
   region subtags.
>>>>

with section 2.2.4, point 4.E, of draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.txt
(as currently published):

>>>>
       E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries
           or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section 4 of
           [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered into
           the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5.
           Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language
           tags.
>>>>

then for me, the NET RESULT is that
      830   Channel Islands
is currently still available for registration. This matches the last
paragraph of section 4 of RFC 4645, as well as the current IANA registry,
which shows GG, JE, and IM as registered, but no registration for
"Channel Islands".

My reading of both 4645/4646 as well as the new drafts as published
(i.e. up to version -20), is that if somebody had a need to tag some language
(let's say English) with a region of "Channel Islands", then s/he could
apply to ietf-languages and require the code 830 to be enterend into
the IANA registry, and would then use en-830 for "English as used in
the Channel Islands".


>I therefore propose putting a version of your text shaped thusly:
>
>E. A few ISO 3166-1 codes, representing the Channel Islands, for which no 
>UN M.49 code was assigned are assigned in the registry. For historic 
>details, see [RFC 4645].
>
>This eliminates the (formerly necessary) normative reference and the 
>no-longer-appropriate normative languages.

In my reading, this eliminates too much, and is a (small but) substantive
change, for which it's way too late (unless somebody comes and claims
that this is really, really important and affects interoperability).

If you don't like the exact text I propose, please propose alternative
text that doesn't change the content.


Regards,    Martin.


>Addison
>
>
>Addison Phillips
>Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
>Internationalization is not a feature.
>It is an architecture.
>
>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Martin Duerst [mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp]
>> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 6:06 PM
>> To: Phillips, Addison; LTRU Working Group
>> Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to
>> informative
>> 
>> Hello Addison,
>> 
>> At 02:23 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>> >Issue: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>> >
>> >Resolution: moved to the informative section from the normative
>> section.
>> >The "normative" material in 4645 in question isn't up to the
>> standard of
>> >having a normative reference.
>> 
>> This is as requested by the chairs. However, it is incomplete.
>> 
>> On February 2nd, I wrote:
>> 
>> >>>>>>>>
>> I have looked at this and at the diff, and have run the idnits tool.
>> 
>> However, we now have an informative reference in a normative
>> sentence:
>> 
>>        E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for
>> countries
>>            or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section
>> 4 of
>>            [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered
>> into
>>            the IANA registry via the process described in Section
>> 3.5.
>>            Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form
>> language
>>            tags.
>> 
>> My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had
>> the same idea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645],
>> we would replace it inline with the only instance left, resulting
>> in something like:
>> 
>>        E.  The UN numeric code or ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code (once
>> assigned)
>>            for the Channel Islands MAY be entered into the IANA
>> registry
>>            via the process described in Section 3.5 (for historic
>>            details, see [RFC4645]).
>> 
>> Can you please make such an update to your staging draft,
>> so that we are ready to move forward when the copyright
>> issues are solved.
>> >>>>>>>>
>> 
>> I haven't seen anybody reply to this except for Gerard Lang.
>> 
>> Can you please make the requested edit, or tell me why you
>> think it's not appropriate?
>> 
>> Regards,    Martin.
>> 
>> 
>> >Addison Phillips
>> >Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>> >
>> >Internationalization is not a feature.
>> >It is an architecture.
>> >
>> >
>> >_______________________________________________
>> >Ltru mailing list
>> >Ltru@ietf.org
>> >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>> 
>> 
>> #-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
>> #-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp
>> mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp


#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp     


From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Mon Feb  9 09:02:16 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 173673A6A6A for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 09:02:16 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.835
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.835 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.541,  BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ATaHnXBmv7DG for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 09:02:12 -0800 (PST)
Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.174]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 982633A6AB3 for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 09:02:12 -0800 (PST)
Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so2096656wfd.31 for ; Mon, 09 Feb 2009 09:02:15 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=gcu0WdbY4D9ElkjicsGq/WdwMOE0E+YE5qSVKmfnBj0=; b=fPPVn0thhwm6QkZhNDqLp7hkgW7naAwYoD3HqavCoBlS0JdV5po/Ja0RQUuu2mWuXb JGAN+UkrQjVw5ITVJsXgVd5siO9jjbWtODJIemJzPH1kyzQgzV1+mSLTfsNbyH+31Vvw r5VcOAEPwbXN97uxDo2zTV9pWqOvqPpBiQ+H8=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=fHds1f+CYQbST6cGuktrAhfuXcZKIRJ/Z+VXWo3UOMEevtE8U6im6YBmltpqothNXI 8tSNRB4TUIKTLSpJOgGCkp+wTvuUDUNQJz7HwGwJ7keBinXseaJyzlFhjU/Pj2MrvqHa chu+MpPd+w9HZ2p+W6y6TtmXR5Xb7IGjKgXtk=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.142.245.5 with SMTP id s5mr2079595wfh.198.1234195493373; Mon,  09 Feb 2009 08:04:53 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost>
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 08:04:53 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 82e8fe103702f598
Message-ID: <30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: Martin Duerst 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd2e0d2f7477704627e877a
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 17:02:16 -0000

--000e0cd2e0d2f7477704627e877a
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Because the Channel Islands are equal to the Bailiwick of Guernsey plus the
Bailiwick of Jersey, I think the need for 830 has gone by (you may not
disagree with that - you did have a MAY - but just to be clear).

Back to the matter at hand, I think all of the suggestions are missing
something. This spec will live for a long time. Saying that the Channel
Islands MAY be registered will become false if and when a two letter code
for them appears. I would just delete E, since the issues are covered in the
other bullets.

Mark


On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 22:49, Martin Duerst  wrote:

> Hello Addison,
>
> At 13:43 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
> >I didn't make the change to the text in part because it was overlooked.
>
> Okay, no problem.
>
> >However, I'm also allergic to the text you propose. The reference to 4645
> >used to be normative because, in fact, it was normative in precisely this
> >spot. However, the Channel Islands related registrations were accomplished
> >in the 4646 era, so having a bit of "MAY" for them seems redundant.
>
> That's not my understanding. Three registrations have been made,
> but a fourth is still outstanding.
>
> If I put together section 4 of RFC 4645:
>
> >>>>
> 4.  Omitted Code Elements
>
>   The following code elements from [UN_M.49] were not associated with
>   [ISO3166-1] alpha-2 code elements.  Consequently, they were not
>   assigned as subtags in the initial Language Subtag Registry, but were
>   valid candidates for registration as region subtags, using the
>   process in [RFC4646]:
>
>      830   Channel Islands
>      831   Guernsey
>      832   Jersey
>      833   Isle of Man
>
>   The last three became ineligible for registration in April, 2006,
>   when the [ISO3166-1] code elements GG, JE, and IM were assigned as
>   region subtags.
> >>>>
>
> with section 2.2.4, point 4.E, of draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.txt
> (as currently published):
>
> >>>>
>       E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries
>           or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section 4 of
>           [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered into
>           the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5.
>           Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language
>           tags.
> >>>>
>
> then for me, the NET RESULT is that
>      830   Channel Islands
> is currently still available for registration. This matches the last
> paragraph of section 4 of RFC 4645, as well as the current IANA registry,
> which shows GG, JE, and IM as registered, but no registration for
> "Channel Islands".
>
> My reading of both 4645/4646 as well as the new drafts as published
> (i.e. up to version -20), is that if somebody had a need to tag some
> language
> (let's say English) with a region of "Channel Islands", then s/he could
> apply to ietf-languages and require the code 830 to be enterend into
> the IANA registry, and would then use en-830 for "English as used in
> the Channel Islands".
>
>
> >I therefore propose putting a version of your text shaped thusly:
> >
> >E. A few ISO 3166-1 codes, representing the Channel Islands, for which no
> >UN M.49 code was assigned are assigned in the registry. For historic
> >details, see [RFC 4645].
> >
> >This eliminates the (formerly necessary) normative reference and the
> >no-longer-appropriate normative languages.
>
> In my reading, this eliminates too much, and is a (small but) substantive
> change, for which it's way too late (unless somebody comes and claims
> that this is really, really important and affects interoperability).
>
> If you don't like the exact text I propose, please propose alternative
> text that doesn't change the content.
>
>
> Regards,    Martin.
>
>
> >Addison
> >
> >
> >Addison Phillips
> >Globalization Architect -- Lab126
> >
> >Internationalization is not a feature.
> >It is an architecture.
> >
> >
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Martin Duerst [mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp]
> >> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 6:06 PM
> >> To: Phillips, Addison; LTRU Working Group
> >> Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to
> >> informative
> >>
> >> Hello Addison,
> >>
> >> At 02:23 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
> >> >Issue: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
> >> >
> >> >Resolution: moved to the informative section from the normative
> >> section.
> >> >The "normative" material in 4645 in question isn't up to the
> >> standard of
> >> >having a normative reference.
> >>
> >> This is as requested by the chairs. However, it is incomplete.
> >>
> >> On February 2nd, I wrote:
> >>
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >> I have looked at this and at the diff, and have run the idnits tool.
> >>
> >> However, we now have an informative reference in a normative
> >> sentence:
> >>
> >>        E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for
> >> countries
> >>            or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section
> >> 4 of
> >>            [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered
> >> into
> >>            the IANA registry via the process described in Section
> >> 3.5.
> >>            Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form
> >> language
> >>            tags.
> >>
> >> My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had
> >> the same idea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645],
> >> we would replace it inline with the only instance left, resulting
> >> in something like:
> >>
> >>        E.  The UN numeric code or ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code (once
> >> assigned)
> >>            for the Channel Islands MAY be entered into the IANA
> >> registry
> >>            via the process described in Section 3.5 (for historic
> >>            details, see [RFC4645]).
> >>
> >> Can you please make such an update to your staging draft,
> >> so that we are ready to move forward when the copyright
> >> issues are solved.
> >> >>>>>>>>
> >>
> >> I haven't seen anybody reply to this except for Gerard Lang.
> >>
> >> Can you please make the requested edit, or tell me why you
> >> think it's not appropriate?
> >>
> >> Regards,    Martin.
> >>
> >>
> >> >Addison Phillips
> >> >Globalization Architect -- Lab126
> >> >
> >> >Internationalization is not a feature.
> >> >It is an architecture.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >_______________________________________________
> >> >Ltru mailing list
> >> >Ltru@ietf.org
> >> >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
> >>
> >>
> >> #-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
> >> #-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp
> >> mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp
>
>
> #-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
> #-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--000e0cd2e0d2f7477704627e877a
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Because the Channel Islands are equal to the Bailiwick of Guernsey plus the=
 Bailiwick of Jersey, I think the need for 830 has gone by (you may not dis=
agree with that - you did have a MAY - but just to be clear).

Back t=
o the matter at hand, I think all of the suggestions are missing something.=
 This spec will live for a long time. Saying that the Channel Islands MAY b=
e registered will become false if and when a two letter code for them appea=
rs. I would just delete E, since the issues are covered in the other bullet=
s.


Mark



On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 22:49, Martin Due=
rst <duerst@=
it.aoyama.ac.jp> wrote:

Hello Addison,




At 13:43 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:

>I didn't make the change to the text in part because it was overloo=
ked.




Okay, no problem.




>However, I'm also allergic to the text you propose. The reference t=
o 4645

>used to be normative because, in fact, it was normative in precisely th=
is

>spot. However, the Channel Islands related registrations were accomplis=
hed

>in the 4646 era, so having a bit of "MAY" for them seems redu=
ndant.




That's not my understanding. Three registrations have been made,<=
br>
but a fourth is still outstanding.



If I put together section 4 of RFC 4645:



>>>>

4.  Omitted Code Elements



   The following code elements from [UN_M.49] were not associated with=


   [ISO3166-1] alpha-2 code elements.  Consequently, they were no=
t

   assigned as subtags in the initial Language Subtag Registry, but we=
re

   valid candidates for registration as region subtags, using the

   process in [RFC4646]:



      830   Channel Islands

      831   Guernsey

      832   Jersey

      833   Isle of Man



   The last three became ineligible for registration in April, 2006,
   when the [ISO3166-1] code elements GG, JE, and IM were assigned as<=
br>
   region subtags.

>>>>



with section 2.2.4, point 4.E, of draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.txt

(as currently published):




>>>>

       E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code=
s for countries

           or areas listed as eligible for registr=
ation in Section 4 of

           [RFC4645] but not presently registered =
MAY be entered into

           the IANA registry via the process descr=
ibed in Section 3.5.

           Once registered, these codes MAY be use=
d to form language

           tags.

>>>>




then for me, the NET RESULT is that

      830   Channel Islands

is currently still available for registration. This matches the last

paragraph of section 4 of RFC 4645, as well as the current IANA registry,
which shows GG, JE, and IM as registered, but no registration for

"Channel Islands".



My reading of both 4645/4646 as well as the new drafts as published

(i.e. up to version -20), is that if somebody had a need to tag some langua=
ge

(let's say English) with a region of "Channel Islands", then =
s/he could

apply to ietf-languages and require the code 830 to be enterend into

the IANA registry, and would then use en-830 for "English as used in
the Channel Islands".






>I therefore propose putting a version of your text shaped thusly:

>

>E. A few ISO 3166-1 codes, representing the Channel Islands, for which =
no

>UN M.49 code was assigned are assigned in the registry. For historic
>details, see [RFC 4645].

>

>This eliminates the (formerly necessary) normative reference and the
>no-longer-appropriate normative languages.




In my reading, this eliminates too much, and is a (small but) substan=
tive

change, for which it's way too late (unless somebody comes and claims
that this is really, really important and affects interoperability).



If you don't like the exact text I propose, please propose alternative<=
br>
text that doesn't change the content.





Regards,    Martin.






>Addison

>

>

>Addison Phillips

>Globalization Architect -- Lab126

>

>Internationalization is not a feature.

>It is an architecture.

>

>

>> -----Original Message-----

>> From: Martin Duerst [mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp]

>> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 6:06 PM

>> To: Phillips, Addison; LTRU Working Group

>> Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to

>> informative

>>

>> Hello Addison,

>>

>> At 02:23 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:

>> >Issue: move RFC 4645 reference to informative

>> >

>> >Resolution: moved to the informative section from the normativ=
e

>> section.

>> >The "normative" material in 4645 in question isn'=
;t up to the

>> standard of

>> >having a normative reference.

>>

>> This is as requested by the chairs. However, it is incomplete.

>>

>> On February 2nd, I wrote:

>>

>> >>>>>>>>

>> I have looked at this and at the diff, and have run the idnits too=
l.

>>

>> However, we now have an informative reference in a normative

>> sentence:

>>

>>        E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-=
1 alpha-2 codes for

>> countries

>>            or areas listed as eligib=
le for registration in Section

>> 4 of

>>            [RFC4645] but not present=
ly registered MAY be entered

>> into

>>            the IANA registry via the=
 process described in Section

>> 3.5.

>>            Once registered, these co=
des MAY be used to form

>> language

>>            tags.

>>

>> My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had
>> the same idea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645]=
,

>> we would replace it inline with the only instance left, resulting<=
br>
>> in something like:

>>

>>        E.  The UN numeric code or ISO 316=
6-1 alpha-2 code (once

>> assigned)

>>            for the Channel Islands M=
AY be entered into the IANA

>> registry

>>            via the process described=
 in Section 3.5 (for historic

>>            details, see [RFC4645]).<=
br>
>>

>> Can you please make such an update to your staging draft,

>> so that we are ready to move forward when the copyright

>> issues are solved.

>> >>>>>>>>

>>

>> I haven't seen anybody reply to this except for Gerard Lang.
>>

>> Can you please make the requested edit, or tell me why you

>> think it's not appropriate?

>>

>> Regards,    Martin.

>>

>>

>> >Addison Phillips

>> >Globalization Architect -- Lab126

>> >

>> >Internationalization is not a feature.

>> >It is an architecture.

>> >

>> >

>> >_______________________________________________

>> >Ltru mailing list

>> >Ltru@ietf.org

>> >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru

>>

>>

>> #-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin=
 University

>> #-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp

>> mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.=
ac.jp





#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin Universi=
ty

#-#-#  htt=
p://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp



_______________________________________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru





--000e0cd2e0d2f7477704627e877a--

From addison@amazon.com  Mon Feb  9 09:06:20 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10BC43A69B1 for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 09:06:20 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -107.283
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-107.283 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.715, BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001,  J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rQL4AVBVPzoO for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 09:06:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 10CCD3A6857 for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 09:06:16 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.37,406,1231113600";  d="scan'208,217";a="140102827"
Received: from smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.18]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 09 Feb 2009 17:06:18 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-4104.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n19H6Gur013130; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 17:06:16 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:06:16 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Mark Davis , Martin Duerst 
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 09:06:15 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
Thread-Index: AcmK0CmzksQG8RNWSwOXc+zrcZ4f6gACC+Mg
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost> <30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6EXSEA5Dantama_"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 17:06:20 -0000

--_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6EXSEA5Dantama_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
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--_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6EXSEA5Dantama_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
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--_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6EXSEA5Dantama_--

From cowan@ccil.org  Mon Feb  9 10:57:16 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C20473A6A8F for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 10:57:16 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.567
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.567 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.032,  BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hrbniBt+WbrN for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 10:57:15 -0800 (PST)
Received: from earth.ccil.org (earth.ccil.org [192.190.237.11]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CE9B28C15C for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 10:56:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from cowan by earth.ccil.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1LWbIt-0002Gg-2Z; Mon, 09 Feb 2009 13:56:23 -0500
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 13:56:22 -0500
To: "Phillips, Addison" 
Message-ID: <20090209185621.GG24608@mercury.ccil.org>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost> <30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Disposition: inline
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11)
From: John Cowan 
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Feb 2009 18:57:17 -0000

Phillips, Addison scripsit:
> If a two letter code appears for 830, it can be registered “normally”: it is covered by existing rules. If we just eliminate “E” we eliminate the ability to (separately) register 830 as a subtag. I agree with Mark that no one needs that subtag—there exist the other Channel Island subtags and no one has registered ‘830’ having been given the opportunity.
> 
> So: +1 for eliminating “E” altogether.

+1

-- 
John Cowan         http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
But no living man am I!  You look upon a woman.  Eowyn I am, Eomund's daughter.
You stand between me and my lord and kin.  Begone, if you be not deathless.
For living or dark undead, I will smite you if you touch him.

From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp  Mon Feb  9 17:26:13 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CE7B28C2E5 for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 17:26:13 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -0.827
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.827 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.663,  BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2UP5Nuz6j3Ey for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 17:26:08 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.195]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 19A3F28C2D3 for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 17:26:07 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.253.23]) by scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1A1Q9s0000709 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 10:26:09 +0900 (JST)
Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 5275_cb61fe5a_f711_11dd_942a_001d0969ab06; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 10:26:08 +0900
Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:37069) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id  for  from ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 10:17:49 +0900
Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090210102251.162c8e20@localhost>
X-Sender: duerst@localhost
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 10:25:26 +0900
To: "Phillips, Addison" , Mark Davis 
From: Martin Duerst 
In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.a mazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost> <30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 01:26:13 -0000

I understand your reasoning, and content-wise I might even
agree, but it IS a normative change, and as a co-chair,
I don't want to go to another last call at this stage.
If nobody has figured out until now that this item might
be removed, then we can as well leave it in.

If Randy as a co-chair has another opinon, I'll defer to him
on this matter.

Regards,   Martin.s

At 02:06 09/02/10, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>If a two letter code appears for 830, it can be registered $Bc`WO(Bormally$Bc`Y(B it is covered by existing rules. If we just eliminate $Bc`W&c`Y(Bwe eliminate the ability to (separately) register 830 as a subtag. I agree with Mark that no one needs that subtag$Bc`GU(Bhere exist the other Channel Island subtags and no one has registered $Bc`O(B30$Bc`Q(Bhaving been given the opportunity.
> 
>So: +1 for eliminating $Bc`W&c`Y(Baltogether.
> 
>Addison Phillips
>Globalization Architect -- Lab126
> 
>Internationalization is not a feature.
>It is an architecture.
> 
>From: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com [mailto:mark.edward.davis@gmail.com] On Behalf Of Mark Davis
>Sent: Monday, February 09, 2009 8:05 AM
>To: Martin Duerst
>Cc: Phillips, Addison; LTRU Working Group
>Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
> 
>Because the Channel Islands are equal to the Bailiwick of Guernsey plus the Bailiwick of Jersey, I think the need for 830 has gone by (you may not disagree with that - you did have a MAY - but just to be clear).
>
>Back to the matter at hand, I think all of the suggestions are missing something. This spec will live for a long time. Saying that the Channel Islands MAY be registered will become false if and when a two letter code for them appears. I would just delete E, since the issues are covered in the other bullets.
>
>Mark
>
>On Sun, Feb 8, 2009 at 22:49, Martin Duerst <duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp> wrote:
>Hello Addison,
>
>At 13:43 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>>I didn't make the change to the text in part because it was overlooked.
>Okay, no problem.
>
>>However, I'm also allergic to the text you propose. The reference to 4645
>>used to be normative because, in fact, it was normative in precisely this
>>spot. However, the Channel Islands related registrations were accomplished
>>in the 4646 era, so having a bit of "MAY" for them seems redundant.
>That's not my understanding. Three registrations have been made,
>but a fourth is still outstanding.
>
>If I put together section 4 of RFC 4645:
>
>>>>>
>4.  Omitted Code Elements
>
>  The following code elements from [UN_M.49] were not associated with
>  [ISO3166-1] alpha-2 code elements.  Consequently, they were not
>  assigned as subtags in the initial Language Subtag Registry, but were
>  valid candidates for registration as region subtags, using the
>  process in [RFC4646]:
>
>     830   Channel Islands
>     831   Guernsey
>     832   Jersey
>     833   Isle of Man
>
>  The last three became ineligible for registration in April, 2006,
>  when the [ISO3166-1] code elements GG, JE, and IM were assigned as
>  region subtags.
>>>>>
>
>with section 2.2.4, point 4.E, of draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.txt
>(as currently published):
>
>>>>>
>      E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries
>          or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section 4 of
>          [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered into
>          the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5.
>          Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language
>          tags.
>>>>>
>then for me, the NET RESULT is that
>     830   Channel Islands
>is currently still available for registration. This matches the last
>paragraph of section 4 of RFC 4645, as well as the current IANA registry,
>which shows GG, JE, and IM as registered, but no registration for
>"Channel Islands".
>
>My reading of both 4645/4646 as well as the new drafts as published
>(i.e. up to version -20), is that if somebody had a need to tag some language
>(let's say English) with a region of "Channel Islands", then s/he could
>apply to ietf-languages and require the code 830 to be enterend into
>the IANA registry, and would then use en-830 for "English as used in
>the Channel Islands".
>
>
>>I therefore propose putting a version of your text shaped thusly:
>>
>>E. A few ISO 3166-1 codes, representing the Channel Islands, for which no
>>UN M.49 code was assigned are assigned in the registry. For historic
>>details, see [RFC 4645].
>>
>>This eliminates the (formerly necessary) normative reference and the
>>no-longer-appropriate normative languages.
>In my reading, this eliminates too much, and is a (small but) substantive
>change, for which it's way too late (unless somebody comes and claims
>that this is really, really important and affects interoperability).
>
>If you don't like the exact text I propose, please propose alternative
>text that doesn't change the content.
>
>
>Regards,    Martin.
>
>
>>Addison
>>
>>
>>Addison Phillips
>>Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>>
>>Internationalization is not a feature.
>>It is an architecture.
>>
>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Martin Duerst [mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp]
>>> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 6:06 PM
>>> To: Phillips, Addison; LTRU Working Group
>>> Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to
>>> informative
>>>
>>> Hello Addison,
>>>
>>> At 02:23 09/02/09, Phillips, Addison wrote:
>>> >Issue: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>>> >
>>> >Resolution: moved to the informative section from the normative
>>> section.
>>> >The "normative" material in 4645 in question isn't up to the
>>> standard of
>>> >having a normative reference.
>>>
>>> This is as requested by the chairs. However, it is incomplete.
>>>
>>> On February 2nd, I wrote:
>>>
>>> >>>>>>>>
>>> I have looked at this and at the diff, and have run the idnits tool.
>>>
>>> However, we now have an informative reference in a normative
>>> sentence:
>>>
>>>        E.  UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for
>>> countries
>>>            or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section
>>> 4 of
>>>            [RFC4645] but not presently registered MAY be entered
>>> into
>>>            the IANA registry via the process described in Section
>>> 3.5.
>>>            Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form
>>> language
>>>            tags.
>>>
>>> My understanding from previous discussions (both Randy and I had
>>> the same idea) was that for this instance of referencing [RFC4645],
>>> we would replace it inline with the only instance left, resulting
>>> in something like:
>>>
>>>        E.  The UN numeric code or ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code (once
>>> assigned)
>>>            for the Channel Islands MAY be entered into the IANA
>>> registry
>>>            via the process described in Section 3.5 (for historic
>>>            details, see [RFC4645]).
>>>
>>> Can you please make such an update to your staging draft,
>>> so that we are ready to move forward when the copyright
>>> issues are solved.
>>> >>>>>>>>
>>>
>>> I haven't seen anybody reply to this except for Gerard Lang.
>>>
>>> Can you please make the requested edit, or tell me why you
>>> think it's not appropriate?
>>>
>>> Regards,    Martin.
>>>
>>>
>>> >Addison Phillips
>>> >Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>>> >
>>> >Internationalization is not a feature.
>>> >It is an architecture.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >_______________________________________________
>>> >Ltru mailing list
>>> >Ltru@ietf.org
>>> >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>>>
>>>
>>> #-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
>>> #-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp
>>> mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp
>
>
>#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
>#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ltru mailing list
>Ltru@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
> 


#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp     


From doug@ewellic.org  Mon Feb  9 19:37:11 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DC9573A68C5 for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 19:37:11 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -0.714
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.714 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.716, BAYES_50=0.001, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PYzBmu7Q3pYW for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 19:37:11 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.99]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 174CA3A67DD for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 19:37:11 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 17239 invoked from network); 10 Feb 2009 03:37:13 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.99) with ESMTP; 10 Feb 2009 03:37:13 -0000
Message-ID: <80F2B1CE3B96415C9963360C8A21CB4D@DGBP7M81>
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 20:37:08 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 03:37:11 -0000

Re: draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative

I agree enthusiastically with deleting the reference to the whole 
Channel Islands thing.  That was always an ugly wart on RFC 4645, and 
it's virtually 100% irrelevant now.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Mon Feb  9 22:34:41 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A4D93A6C49 for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 22:34:41 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.191
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.191 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.192, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SrcE1e8my63R for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 22:34:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E3773A6BCF for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 22:34:40 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Po9HrE08dmHSUzlPXUVjgwYBgMqr3PcsfrAT0k09C646WIra15ZcjqEz9TjBnylh; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [66.167.204.131] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LWmCe-0002ZI-Nh for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 01:34:40 -0500
Message-ID: <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost><30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090210102251.162c8e20@localhost>
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 22:32:45 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1732411dd4275b89f0e6afa56bcd40c073c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.131
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 06:34:41 -0000

Hi -

> From: "Martin Duerst" 
> To: "Phillips, Addison" ; "Mark Davis" 
> Cc: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Monday, February 09, 2009 5:25 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>
> I understand your reasoning, and content-wise I might even
> agree, but it IS a normative change, and as a co-chair,
> I don't want to go to another last call at this stage.
> If nobody has figured out until now that this item might
> be removed, then we can as well leave it in.
> 
> If Randy as a co-chair has another opinon, I'll defer to him
> on this matter.
...

I'm also wary of introducing technical changes at this late stage,
particularly without any demonstrated need.  Please,let's just 
replace the paragraph with:

       E.  The UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands) and any corresponding
           ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code not presently registered MAY
           be entered into the IANA registry via the process described
           in Section 3.5.

(I deliberately lost the last sentence of the paragraph.  It
added nothing and would not be missed.)

Randy


From gerard.lang@insee.fr  Mon Feb  9 23:48:10 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 765903A68FD for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 23:48:10 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.399
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.399 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.950,  BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, J_CHICKENPOX_65=0.6, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wAQGVMrx9+zt for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 23:48:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mercure.insee.fr (mercure.insee.fr [81.255.68.34]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B5653A699D for ; Mon,  9 Feb 2009 23:48:08 -0800 (PST)
Received: from evariste.insee.fr (unknown [194.254.38.143]) by mercure.insee.fr (Insee Mail Server) with ESMTP id 67454133739 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:48:09 +0100 (CET)
Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D52379401F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:48:09 +0100 (CET)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at insee.fr
Received: from evariste.insee.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (evariste.insee.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VtiCvxEyhD7P for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:48:09 +0100 (CET)
Received: from s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra (unknown [194.254.38.144]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 212E279401E for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:48:09 +0100 (CET)
Received: from S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra ([10.90.200.51]) by s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:48:09 +0100
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 08:48:09 +0100
Message-ID: <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD09E4@S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra>
In-Reply-To: 
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
Thread-Topic: Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 21/// E: Channel Islands and co
thread-index: AcmK8TVBrvpt2mhVSMyYpAyS/03OQAAYjNbA
References: 
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= 
To: , =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= 
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 10 Feb 2009 07:48:09.0325 (UTC) FILETIME=[EAB819D0:01C98B53]
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 21/// E: Channel Islands and co
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 07:48:10 -0000

 My opinion is also thet E should be eliminated.
Let me precise that Channel Islands never was, is not yet and never will =
be (after the introduction of Guernsey and Jersey) an entry inside ISO =
3166-1.

-----Message d'origine-----
De : ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de =
ltru-request@ietf.org
Envoy=E9 : lundi 9 f=E9vrier 2009 21:00
=C0 : ltru@ietf.org
Objet : Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 21

Send Ltru mailing list submissions to
	ltru@ietf.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
	https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
	ltru-request@ietf.org

You can reach the person managing the list at
	ltru-owner@ietf.org

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than =
"Re: Contents of Ltru digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. Re: draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
      (John Cowan)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Mon, 9 Feb 2009 13:56:22 -0500
From: John Cowan 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to
	informative
To: "Phillips, Addison" 
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Message-ID: <20090209185621.GG24608@mercury.ccil.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dutf-8

Phillips, Addison scripsit:
> If a two letter code appears for 830, it can be registered ?normally?: =
it is covered by existing rules. If we just eliminate ?E? we eliminate =
the ability to (separately) register 830 as a subtag. I agree with Mark =
that no one needs that subtag?there exist the other Channel Island =
subtags and no one has registered ?830? having been given the =
opportunity.
>=20
> So: +1 for eliminating ?E? altogether.

+1

--=20
John Cowan         http://www.ccil.org/~cowan
But no living man am I!  You look upon a woman.  Eowyn I am, Eomund's =
daughter.
You stand between me and my lord and kin.  Begone, if you be not =
deathless.
For living or dark undead, I will smite you if you touch him.


------------------------------

_______________________________________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru


End of Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 21
************************************

From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se  Tue Feb 10 04:34:41 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F3AF28C16D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 04:34:41 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.333
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.333 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.333, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RSOIXAmWy7Eb for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 04:34:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 332D228C166 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 04:34:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33382 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LWrp3-0001KC-61 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:34:42 +0100
User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:34:39 +0100
From: Kent Karlsson 
To: LTRU Working Group 
Message-ID: 
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
Thread-Index: AcmLe/CQBmodJwn1dk+afL1Pc2n2wg==
In-Reply-To: <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Mime-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93
X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LWrp3-0001KC-61.
X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1LWrp3-0001KC-61 5e8cb21a6bdf391a10419c8a9cde8a4a
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 12:34:41 -0000

I agree.


Den 2009-02-10 07.32, skrev "Randy Presuhn" :

> I'm also wary of introducing technical changes at this late stage,
> particularly without any demonstrated need.  Please,let's just
> replace the paragraph with:
> 
>        E.  The UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands) and any corresponding
>            ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code not presently registered MAY
>            be entered into the IANA registry via the process described
>            in Section 3.5.
> 
> (I deliberately lost the last sentence of the paragraph.  It
> added nothing and would not be missed.)



From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Tue Feb 10 09:50:08 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9ED683A6C63 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 09:50:08 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.593
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.593 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.217, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oH78fnVQ1YBg for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 09:50:07 -0800 (PST)
Received: from qw-out-2122.google.com (qw-out-2122.google.com [74.125.92.27]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16D053A6C39 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 09:50:07 -0800 (PST)
Received: by qw-out-2122.google.com with SMTP id 3so194890qwe.31 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 09:50:09 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=plSUGpQO4af9h/MEJwRLsfoyoIiPyBKM3Lpx3j0hHwM=; b=cLUrOaqh9CCgOVNFaAvToNOoaEQCQGGD9pgFmp9h60GP85mYQTfOL7zh5Unv35mu5w NHKjBcpcnZtlrPkUsS1ch2k5hGZEayd/8XsPKO2f7BQ9RUU8V7Lt0RDHY1i1JL+tTOkh y7TN5MxZE8CAXQPFVS8jd8aYIwNMt9hPMs884=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=I4i5f66Kj5joQu7KzssVhi0nLsc4hXgVSw7ulxPkHz+WE1KMmn4a/OUA/VtS3Kl7kj jaP4eloUNKeXUMId1z0/kWqVSJf5awtTFPOKkOLmoPhbawXPPSbiPEivhf+Anf5Kzp5k BACaTEEiCcPMqWLnH7mqrMa+uJW6mTIKYeisA=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.142.43.7 with SMTP id q7mr381358wfq.229.1234288208564; Tue, 10  Feb 2009 09:50:08 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: 
References: <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> 
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 09:50:08 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: ea1d5b3ecac4dd7f
Message-ID: <30b660a20902100950l1e60583djf620f8162edfdea2@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: Kent Karlsson 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd3047038d1eb0462941e4d
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:50:08 -0000

--000e0cd3047038d1eb0462941e4d
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Just so we are all on the same page, the v21 text is:

UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries or areas listed
as eligible for registration in Section 4 of [RFC4645] (Ewell, D., "Initial
Language Subtag Registry," September
2006.)but
not presently registered MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the
process described in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for
Subtags).
Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language tags.

http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.html#region

I think the minimal change is:

UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries or areas listed
as eligible for registration in Section 4 of [RFC4645] (Ewell, D., "Initial
Language Subtag Registry," September
2006.)but
not presently registered MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the
process described in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for
Subtags),
subject to provision D. Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form
language tags.

While I think we are all clear that provision D limits provision E -- that
is, that if ISO adds a code XX for 830, then 830 could no longer be
registered -- we should make it very clear in the document. Once we do that,
we can leave the rest of the information alone.

Mark

[Side note for some future version -- NOT for now.

The MUSTs and MAYs on what can and cannot be added to the registry found in
various places:

   1. http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.html#sources
   2.
   http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.html#ianastability
   3.
   http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.html#registrationProc
   4. http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.html#possibleReg
   5. perhaps others

Part of it is that we want to give users of the registry information on what
can and cannot occur in the registry, and in other sections give the
Language Subtag Reviewer information on what he/she must/may do, and then in
other sections give those filling out the Registration form information on
what they can/may request. But that means that we have duplication in
various places, and it is hard to make sure that everything is covered
everywhere. Ideally we would have one place where all the restrictions were
set out, and we could just reference that.

End side note.]


On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 04:34, Kent Karlsson wrote:

> I agree.
>
>
> Den 2009-02-10 07.32, skrev "Randy Presuhn"  >:
>
> > I'm also wary of introducing technical changes at this late stage,
> > particularly without any demonstrated need.  Please,let's just
> > replace the paragraph with:
> >
> >        E.  The UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands) and any
> corresponding
> >            ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code not presently registered MAY
> >            be entered into the IANA registry via the process described
> >            in Section 3.5.
> >
> > (I deliberately lost the last sentence of the paragraph.  It
> > added nothing and would not be missed.)
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--000e0cd3047038d1eb0462941e4d
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Just so we are all on the same page, the v21 text is:

UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for count=
ries or areas listed as eligible for registration in Section 4 of [RFC4645] (Ewell, D., "Initial=
 Language Subtag Registry," September 2006.) b=
ut not presently registered MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the p=
rocess described in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags). Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language tags.


http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.html=
#region

I think the minimal change is:


UN numeric codes and ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 codes for countries or areas listed=
 as eligible for registration in Section 4 of [RFC4645]<=
span> (Ewell, D., "Initial Language Subtag Regi=
stry," September 2006.) but not presently regi=
stered MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in <=
a class=3D"info" href=3D"http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis=
-20.html#registrationProc">Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags), subject to=
 provision D. Once registered, these codes MAY be used to form language tag=
s.


While I think we are all clear that provision D limits provis=
ion E -- that is, that if ISO adds a code XX for 830, then 830 could no lon=
ger be registered -- we should make it very clear in the document. Once we =
do that, we can leave the rest of the information alone.


Mark

[Side note for some future version -- NOT for now.

The MUSTs and MAYs on what can and cannot =
be added to the registry found in various places:
    

  1. http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.html#sources<=
/a>
  2. http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20=
.html#ianastability
    3. 

  3. http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20.html=
#registrationProc
  4. http://inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf=
-ltru-4646bis-20.html#possibleReg
    5. 

  5. perhaps others
Part of i=
t is that we want to give users of the registry information on what can and=
 cannot occur in the registry, and in other sections give the Language Subt=
ag Reviewer information on what he/she must/may do, and then in other secti=
ons give those filling out the Registration form information on what they c=
an/may request. But that means that we have duplication in various places, =
and it is hard to make sure that everything is covered everywhere. Ideally =
we would have one place where all the restrictions were set out, and we cou=
ld just reference that.


End side note.]


On Tue, Feb=
 10, 2009 at 04:34, Kent Karlsson <kent.karlsson14@comhem.se> wrote:

I agree.





Den 2009-02-10 07.32, skrev "Randy Presuhn" <randy_presuhn@mindspring.com>:




> I'm also wary of introducing technical changes at this late stage,=


> particularly without any demonstrated need.  Please,let's jus=
t

> replace the paragraph with:

>

>        E.  The UN numeric code 830 (Channel I=
slands) and any corresponding

>            ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 code not p=
resently registered MAY

>            be entered into the IANA regi=
stry via the process described

>            in Section 3.5.

>

> (I deliberately lost the last sentence of the paragraph.  It

> added nothing and would not be missed.)






_______________________________=
________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru





--000e0cd3047038d1eb0462941e4d--

From addison@amazon.com  Tue Feb 10 13:01:58 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E14343A67AC for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:01:58 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.331
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.331 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.332, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_63=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lAYcTBOm5Ia6 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:01:58 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E664C3A693B for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:01:57 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,188,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="187461042"
Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 10 Feb 2009 21:01:59 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1AL1t47026422 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:01:56 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:01:55 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group 
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:01:52 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
Thread-Index: AcmLSa6HCkTPn1YIR8OEhKgNf69KoQAR1I+w
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DE68472@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost><30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090210102251.162c8e20@localhost> <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:01:59 -0000
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From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:16:28 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 529A228C1F4 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:16:28 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.105
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.105 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.494,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nSTPQzmjBVw8 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:16:27 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9C15928C1F3 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:16:27 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Xz2ldTw7OGynfZe6a35CRIodlCgj7xvHxNrEDvraAkE20Q+9U5nsAx3BT4z/0GUU; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LWzy3-0002Iv-2K for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:16:31 -0500
Message-ID: <005e01c98bc4$d3a61e60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost><30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><6.0.0.20.2.20090210102251.162c8e20@localhost> <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DE68472@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:16:22 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173d46eaff32336e36b299a91aa7a5a72df350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:16:28 -0000

Hi -

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 1:01 PM
> Subject: RE: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
...
> For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands), which was not registered at 
> the time this document was adopted and had, at that time, no corresponding ISO 3166-1 code, 
> MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5, provided no
> ISO 3166-1 code with that exact meaning has been previously registered.
...

As a technical contributor...
This proposed text looks very good to me.

As co-chair...
This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this paragraph
so far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's proposed text?

Randy


From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Tue Feb 10 13:26:49 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF9263A6B8F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:26:49 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.976
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.976 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EFtHYawISBTy for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:26:49 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-qy0-f11.google.com (mail-qy0-f11.google.com [209.85.221.11]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D3A713A6B5A for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:26:48 -0800 (PST)
Received: by qyk4 with SMTP id 4so203001qyk.13 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:26:51 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=PSe+D42CZHDEO771p/37L216EQBWFJlFXkgZze8wX60=; b=kv4NGwBhJJJGxpMVO3TbRIfp5Pc6lXFV4WtRUuSdG5mHU1Ol8F754tF90bF3jpvS1+ 4FoTMaJixLmnDsQb27zJtb/4SzlKOjVehu97irmEklydbKkxgFfgXActYwFKegewI7J3 lY2BJTZ1yJeyDMzhppSDlaFIjaz1iNCvBgrl0=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=pLTnS0ygEHRwWBDBuQvWFvrQe6mWWUSuteeWEwNOtAcB8TAb5z+5H4K6A29KYGfmG7 P6sJdAi7Wnd1AL99x5IYcctg3CxBkKQFQ0R5VG5e4flGbqfQmGmKT9OLbzPDu8aHfHs8 LMbTpqQaBcRoEa5ERIiLFiPamezRnSQzpe6Zo=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.142.164.10 with SMTP id m10mr1776331wfe.7.1234301210557; Tue,  10 Feb 2009 13:26:50 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <005e01c98bc4$d3a61e60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost> <30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090210102251.162c8e20@localhost> <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DE68472@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <005e01c98bc4$d3a61e60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:26:49 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: cff5857fe6cbf5f9
Message-ID: <30b660a20902101326i618abd4dme300dc3312d7f36@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: Randy Presuhn 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd24204337d7904629725b1
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:26:49 -0000

--000e0cd24204337d7904629725b1
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

no objections

Mark


On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 13:16, Randy Presuhn
wrote:

> Hi -
>
> > From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group"
> 
> > Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 1:01 PM
> > Subject: RE: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
> ...
> > For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands), which
> was not registered at
> > the time this document was adopted and had, at that time, no
> corresponding ISO 3166-1 code,
> > MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in
> Section 3.5, provided no
> > ISO 3166-1 code with that exact meaning has been previously registered.
> ...
>
> As a technical contributor...
> This proposed text looks very good to me.
>
> As co-chair...
> This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this paragraph
> so far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's proposed text?
>
> Randy
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--000e0cd24204337d7904629725b1
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

no objections

Mark



On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 13:16, Randy Pre=
suhn <=
randy_presuhn@mindspring.com> wrote:

Hi -



> From: "Phillips, Addison" <addison@amazon.com>

> To: "Randy Presuhn" <randy_presuhn@mindspring.com>; "LTRU Working Group&=
quot; <ltru@ietf.org>

> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 1:01 PM

> Subject: RE: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informati=
ve

...


> For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 =
(Channel Islands), which was not registered at

> the time this document was adopted and had, at that time, no correspon=
ding ISO 3166-1 code,

> MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in Sec=
tion 3.5, provided no

> ISO 3166-1 code with that exact meaning has been previously registered=
.


...



As a technical contributor...

This proposed text looks very good to me.



As co-chair...

This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this para=
graph

so far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's proposed t=
ext?




Randy



_______________________________________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru





--000e0cd24204337d7904629725b1--

From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:30:21 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79B0828C1FF for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:30:21 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.194
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.194 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.454, BAYES_20=-0.74]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5Ib9CBpeD0Sx for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:30:20 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B031828C216 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:30:20 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=EtmM738l0f3lqsIvII70dMXgn28W/JBMXFg0kNCn4++BZUKZT2PcZ/DPfe4bAmYS; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0BU-0002Fl-0B for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:30:24 -0500
Message-ID: <008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81> <007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:30:16 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173e1dda3f9d22718751c73108cdc4eecf7350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue Tracker
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:30:21 -0000

Hi -

I've begun entering the current issues into the tracker,
using the currently published internet drafts as our
baseline, and the recent postings to this list as input.

I'll send out issue number assignments in reponse to the
messages.  It will keep life simpler for all concerned
if you retain issue numbers in subject lines, and start
a new thread for each issue.

The summary of issues can be accessed at
http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/1

Randy


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:31:39 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 64E483A6852 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:31:39 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.107
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.107 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.492,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZFJyownsggae for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:31:37 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 88A303A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:31:37 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=S+nLoOST6d+FQ5+XtcRajN9DmO9sn77L2pjQJUGk5A+k6WxVl9prag+/kryFRfxs; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0Ci-0001ac-BH for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:31:40 -0500
Message-ID: <008901c98bc6$f1eb87a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DE@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:31:32 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731a2e0a2c2f84d47762c8e810f77f64e9350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:31:39 -0000

Hi -

I've assigned this #4

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:27 AM
> Subject: "different from" issue
>
> [now follow individual emails with the editor's proposed disposition for each issue raised]
>
> (editor hat ON)
>
> Issue: use of phrase "different rules to the ones"
>
> Resolution: no change. The sentence is clear and sufficiently grammatical.
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On
> > Behalf Of Randy Presuhn
> > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 4:11 PM
> > To: ltru@ietf.org
> > Subject: [Ltru] Edith Whitehead's proposed editorial changes to
> > 4646bis i-d
> >
> > Hi -
> >
> > Subject line changed for tracking sanity....
> >
> > As a technical contributor...
> >
> > > From: "Edith Whitehead" 
> > > To: 
> > > Cc: ; ;
> > ; 
> > > Sent: Friday, February 06, 2009 9:31 AM
> > > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Editor's copy of draft-4646bis updated...
> > ...
> > > ! 4.1   par 3
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "   Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this
> > document
> > >    normatively but apply different rules to the ones given in
> > this
> > >    section MUST specify how language tag selection varies from
> > the
> > >    guidelines given here."
> > >
> > > { ! CORRECTION:  CHANGE:  "different rules to the . . . " >
> > "rules different than those . . . "
> > >  you can say :  "rules different than,"  "rules different from,"
> > or "different rules than,"
> > > but where do you get "different rules to"?  It's not English.
> >
> > Nor is "different rules than".  If folks feel a need for a change,
> > "rules different from" would be more acceptible.
> >
> > ...
> > >  ?? Also, CHANGE: "apply" to "adhere to" or simply "follow"  (I
> > like "adhere to" better;
> > > "apply" might be a word you use with applications and rules but I
> > do not use it with anything but formatting,
> > > "formatting is applied . . ."
> >
> > Disagree.  I see no need for this change.
> >
> > ...
> > >  ? Also, CHANGE:  "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is
> > more cohesive with 'those'
> > > because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that
> > Halliday has about cohesion too) }
> >
> > Disagree.  I see no need for this change.
> >
> > > "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this
> > document
> > >   normatively but adhere to rules different than those given in
> > this section . . . "
> >
> > This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong, and I cannot support
> > it.
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet
> > >
> > > {ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > " Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the
> > >           language a casual user might expect, especially if when
> > >           relying on the subtag's description in the registry. "
> > >
> > > {! CORRECTION:  delete either "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a
> > bit redundant, right? }
> >
> > Yup.  However, the entire phrase "especially...registry" is not
> > helpful
> > to the sense of the paragraph in question.  Consequently, I think
> > that if a change is to be made, it would be better to delete
> > everything from the comma to the word "registry".
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last sentence
> > >
> > > {ORIGINAL TEXT}
> > >    "o  A language priority list [RFC4647] describing a user's
> > language
> > >        preferences.  This is a (possibly weighted) list of
> > potentially-
> > >       unrelated varieties, expressing a preference, rather than
> > as a
> > >       declaration about actual content."
> > ...
> > > "This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrelated
> > varieties,
> > >  expressing a preference, rather than a declaration of actual
> > content."
> >
> > Yup.  However, this sentence is entirely redundant, so if there is
> > going
> > to be a change, I'd rather just delete it.
> >
> > > ! 5.1, par 4, sentence 2
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > section; there is
> > >   no guarantee of the order of the records beyond grouping them
> > together by 'Type'."
> > ...
> > > "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > section; there
> > > is no guarantee of their order beyond their being grouped
> > together by 'Type'."
> >
> > Ok.  This "can" probably should be a MAY, but it's not a big deal
> > and it's not
> > worth changing.
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.4.2 Par 1, last sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "  Such truncation MUST NOT
> > >    permit a subtag to be chopped off in the middle or the
> > formation of
> > >    invalid tags (for example, one ending with the "-"
> > character)."
> > ...
> > > "Such truncation MUST NOT permit the formation of invalid tags--
> > > either by chopping a subtag off in the middle, or by leaving a
> > singleton without any subtag."
> >
> > Disagree.  The original text is gramamtically and technically
> > correct.
> > The proposed text changes the meaning in a subtly  incompatible way.
> > Consider the case where chopping a subtag in the middle does *not*
> > result in an invalid tag, but instead produces a tag containing a
> > subtag
> > not present in the original.
> >
> > ....
> > > ? 3.5  "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4, 2nd sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " Note that each response is not limited in
> > >    size so that the request can adequately describe the
> > registration."
> > >
> > > {COMMENTS: the word "response" is not clear here, and this
> > sentence
> > > is awkward and unclear as a whole.
> >
> > I think the sentence is abundantly clear in context, and see no
> > need for change.
> > ...
> >
> > > ? 3.7 par 4 & 5
> > ...
> > > {COMMENT:  the two maintaining authorities, IANA, and the
> > individual
> > > authority, might be confused by readers here??
> > ...
> >
> > Given the topic of the section, I find it difficult to imagine such
> > confusion
> > taking place.
> >
> > > "Failure on the part of the maintaining authority to maintain
> > this record  . . . "
> >
> > It's difficult to keep a straight face when reading the proposed
> > replacement.
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1 Par 5
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " A subtag SHOULD only be used when it adds useful distinguishing
> > >    information to the tag.  Extraneous subtags interfere with the
> > >    meaning, understanding, and processing of language tags.  In
> > >    particular, users and implementations SHOULD follow the
> > 'Prefix' and
> > >    'Suppress-Script' fields in the registry (defined in Section
> > 3.1):
> > >    these fields provide guidance on when specific additional
> > subtags
> > >    SHOULD be used or avoided in a language tag."
> > >
> > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 1:
> > >  the way it's written, someone might interpret it as meaning that
> > all subtags,
> > >  including a primary language subtag, are optional, but a primary
> > language
> > > subtag is really a good idea, a real SHOULD}
> > >
> > > INSERT AT BEGINNING--replace sentence 1 with 2 sentences
> > >
> > > "All language tags--except those that are exclusively private
> > use--
> > > SHOULD include one (primary) language subtag.  Any additional
> > > subtag SHOULD only be included when it adds useful distinguishing
> > > information to the tag. "
> >
> > Strongly disagree.  This changes the sense of the text.
> > [As co-chair: it took extensive discussion to reach agreement on
> > this text, and I'm extremely relectuant to even consider changes to
> > it unless something is demonstrably broken.]
> >
> > > ?? {A SECOND COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 3:  word
> > > choice; change "follow" to "consult"  I would never say "follow"
> > > for either unless I said "follow the guidelines . . ."; "consult"
> > > is the best word with "users" probably; not sure at all about
> > > implementations but I would not say "follow"}
> >
> > Disagree.  While I appreciate the preference for "consult", it
> > does not mean the same thing as "follow".
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1 par 6 item 2 example second bullet last sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "(The tag "uz-Zxxx"
> > >        could also be used where content is not written, as the
> > subtag
> > >         'Zxxx' represents the "Code for unwritten documents".)"
> > >
> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION I do not see what clarity or information
> > > the word 'code' adds to this sentence so I CORRECTED it }
> >
> > I believe it's a quote from the subtag's registry enty.
> >
> > > "The tag "uz-Zxxx"
> > >         could also be used where content is not written as the
> > script subtag 'Zxxx' is used to indicate unwritten documents"
> >
> > I think this would be a step backwards, since it de-emphasizes the
> > generative nature
> > of subtags.
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence
> > >
> > > ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and
> > >    Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far
> > more
> > >    closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu
> > ('wuu') ,
> > >   which do share a macrolanguage."
> > > {! COMMENT:  the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one
> > of the
> > > subtags has now been deprecated; [ca] and [oc], 'Catalan' and
> > > 'Occitan'/'Provencal,' would be better examples;
> > > alternately you might choose [gsw] 'Alsatian' or 'Schwyzerdütsch'
> > >  and [swg] 'Swabian'--but I know less about Alsatian;
> > > There may be other possibilities; on a quick perusal of RFC 4645
> > >  I did not find khmer, for example, though I discovered there are
> > some
> > >  maybe mutually intelligible varieties any & know little about
> > Asian
> > > languages anyway}
> >
> > Strongly disagree.  The example serves its purpose as it is,
> > and none of the cases cited is as dramatic and clear-cut
> > as that of Romanian and Moldavian.  (Which explains nicely
> > *why* the subtag met the fate that it did.)
> >
> > [As co-chair: there already seems to be a rough consensus
> > to not change this section.]
> >
> > > 4.2 par 5
> > >  { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > "   This relationship is not guaranteed in all cases:
> > specifically,
> > >    languages that begin with the same sequence of subtags are NOT
> > >    guaranteed to be mutually intelligible, although they might be.
> > For
> > >    example, the tag "az" shares a prefix with both "az-Latn"
> > >    (Azerbaijani written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl"
> > >    (Azerbaijani written using the Cyrillic script).  A person
> > fluent in
> > >    one script might not be able to read the other, even though
> > the
> > >    linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts
> > were read
> > >    aloud) might be identical.  Content tagged as "az" most
> > probably is
> > >    written in just one script and thus might not be intelligible
> > to a
> > >    reader familiar with the other script."
> > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION  I found the language, 'this relationship
> > > is not guaranteed,' kind of vague. Also I did not like the phrase,
> > 'written
> > > in just one script'--an example specifying one of the two scripts
> > might help
> > > make this sentence clearer to someone skimming this.  I tried to
> > rewrite
> > > this paragraph:  I simplified the first sentence and used more
> > specific
> > > language (the word 'always' here, does refer the reader back to
> > what's
> > > been said in the paragraph above about the general relationship
> > between
> > > language tags sharing a prefix--one that we now see does not
> > always
> > > guarantee mutual intelligibility); I also rewrote slightly the
> > second sentence,
> > > and inserted "however" (to tie back to the previous statement)
> > > "only" into the fourth sentence.}
> > >
> > > ?? "Tags that share the same prefix are not always mutually
> > intelligible.
> > >  For example, the prefix 'az' is shared by both  "az-Latn"
> > (Azerbaijani
> > > written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl" (Azerbaijani
> > written using
> > > the Cyrillic script). A person fluent in one script might not be
> > able to
> > > read the other, even though the
> > > linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts were
> > read
> > > aloud) might be identical. However, content tagged as "az" most
> > > probably is written in just one of these scripts and thus might
> > not
> > > be intelligible to a reader familiar with only the other script."
> >
> > Disagree.  The change to the first sentence makes it sound like
> > mutual intelligibility is normally presumed when there is a shared
> > prefix, and that cases like this are rare exceptions.  The existing
> > text
> > is clearer and more to the point.
> >
> > > ? 4.5 par 2  item 4 & par 4 "Example . . . "
> > ...
> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION: the first example actually goes with item
> > > 5 & the second with item 4 so it's confusing; I prefer to have
> > the examples
> > > with the items they illustrate; thus I'd move the second of the
> > examples
> > > so that it followed item 4-- }
> >
> > I'm neutral on this proposal.  I see the benefits to interspersing
> > the
> > examples with the list of rules, but I also see advantages to the
> > current organization with the examples following the rules.
> > I'm not persuaded at all that this is a change that in any way
> > *needs* to be made.
> >
> > ...
> > > ?? 3.5 par 21
> > ...
> > > {! COMMENT/CLARIFICATION ?  Please explain "SHALL NOT" versus
> > "MUST NOT"--
> >
> > This is spelled out in RFC 2119.
> >
> > Randy
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ltru mailing list
> > Ltru@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:32:32 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CB2C3A6D0F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:32:32 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.124
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.124 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.475,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5uQl8kVgrZTD for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:32:31 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 864FA3A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:32:31 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=kCDfvwaPyr9fayuVJX9zG+liJQmeOWHnU65SdKOL2T/yQVwLyWF1ljQiDPN4xn06; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0DY-0003U7-Rr for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:32:33 -0500
Message-ID: <008e01c98bc7$1148b460$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DB@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:32:25 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173f869da59470cedf6af095f35aa54a004350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #1: change ref from 2434 to 5226
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:32:32 -0000

Hi -

This was assigned issue #1.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:20 AM
> Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: change ref from 2434 to 5226
>
> [this is the first email reporting changes between the current official draft, which is draft-20, and the editor copy, which is
draft-21]
>
> Issue: update reference from RFC 2434 to RFC 5226
>
> Resolution: completed in draft-21; 2434 was obsolete by 5226
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru



From cowan@ccil.org  Tue Feb 10 13:32:42 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 469FE3A6852 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:32:42 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.696
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.696 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.097, BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bebc8FeUDz4k for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:32:41 -0800 (PST)
Received: from earth.ccil.org (earth.ccil.org [192.190.237.11]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 610C43A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:32:41 -0800 (PST)
Received: from cowan by earth.ccil.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0Dk-0003MJ-Cu; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:32:44 -0500
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:32:44 -0500
To: Randy Presuhn 
Message-ID: <20090210213244.GH13691@mercury.ccil.org>
References: <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DE68472@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <005e01c98bc4$d3a61e60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <005e01c98bc4$d3a61e60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11)
From: John Cowan 
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:32:42 -0000

Randy Presuhn scripsit:

> > For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands), which was not registered at 
> > the time this document was adopted and had, at that time, no corresponding ISO 3166-1 code, 
> > MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5, provided no
> > ISO 3166-1 code with that exact meaning has been previously registered.
> ...
> 
> As co-chair...
> This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this paragraph
> so far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's proposed text?

I'd strike "for historical reasons", which seems unnecessary to me.

-- 
What is the sound of Perl?  Is it not the       John Cowan
sound of a [Ww]all that people have stopped     cowan@ccil.org
banging their head against?  --Larry            http://www.ccil.org/~cowan

From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:33:10 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F6963A6D22 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:10 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.14
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.14 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.459,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id KqHeKx73STEG for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:09 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A3F463A6D1C for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:09 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=tkTf2tvlv6R75hjuMtnlGcGgLFFIBj4ieBlZQo4lcKW1m0mAs+Edc0Kb0Zsa570e; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0ED-0001fb-0K for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:33:13 -0500
Message-ID: <009301c98bc7$29371bc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DC@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:05 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1738ae03365f9381065976f83dc886d10ae350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #2:  move 2860 ref to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:33:10 -0000

Hi -

This was assigned issue #2.

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:21 AM
> Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move 2860 ref to informative
>
> Issue: move the reference to RFC 2860 "Memorandum of 
> Understanding Concerning the Technical Work of the 
> Internet Assigned Numbers Authority" from normative to informative
> 
> Resolution: completed in draft-21 by request of one of the co-chairs.
> 
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
> 
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:33:57 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB2A93A6D35 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:57 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.155
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.155 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.444,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DWmdm4p4yXmh for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:57 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 187B33A6D3E for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:57 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Y3CW5oxCrKAK2fQVGY/2Id6N+wKkMvKcW5oY243dkXNeWM8rHjUo3mKgHwVwCy16; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0Ey-00054a-GO for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:34:00 -0500
Message-ID: <009801c98bc7$45888f20$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:52 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17329e1135847780ed6a956d10a5d346f39350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #3: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:33:57 -0000

Hi -

this was assigned issue #3.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:23 AM
> Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>
> Issue: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>
> Resolution: moved to the informative section from the normative section. The "normative" material in 4645 in question isn't up to
the standard of having a normative reference.
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:34:56 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7B1373A6D56 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:34:56 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.169
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.169 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.430,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6RBAx4z2+3wl for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:34:54 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91C803A6D35 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:34:54 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=KFX3GA6mX1RtvDK4s3ZUj6jqnAHACSDFTAmQ734q0cgP6JTYkCMGtxnGU5n39ToK; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0Ft-0007Es-MP for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:34:58 -0500
Message-ID: <009d01c98bc7$679d88e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:34:49 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1732dba6267bdcca1808150aa233adf8790350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #5: change "apply"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:34:56 -0000

Hi -

This was assigned issue #5.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:29 AM
> Subject: change "apply"
>
> Issue:
>
> >
> > ...
> > >  ?? Also, CHANGE: "apply" to "adhere to" or simply "follow"  (I
> > like "adhere to" better;
> > > "apply" might be a word you use with applications and rules but I
> > do not use it with anything but formatting,
> > > "formatting is applied . . ."
> >
>
> Randy commented:
>
> > Disagree.  I see no need for this change.
>
> Resolution: no change. The editors don't see a reason to modify this.
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> >
> > ...
> > >  ? Also, CHANGE:  "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is
> > more cohesive with 'those'
> > > because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that
> > Halliday has about cohesion too) }
> >
> > Disagree.  I see no need for this change.
> >
> > > "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this
> > document
> > >   normatively but adhere to rules different than those given in
> > this section . . . "
> >
> > This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong, and I cannot support
> > it.
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet
> > >
> > > {ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > " Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the
> > >           language a casual user might expect, especially if when
> > >           relying on the subtag's description in the registry. "
> > >
> > > {! CORRECTION:  delete either "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a
> > bit redundant, right? }
> >
> > Yup.  However, the entire phrase "especially...registry" is not
> > helpful
> > to the sense of the paragraph in question.  Consequently, I think
> > that if a change is to be made, it would be better to delete
> > everything from the comma to the word "registry".
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last sentence
> > >
> > > {ORIGINAL TEXT}
> > >    "o  A language priority list [RFC4647] describing a user's
> > language
> > >        preferences.  This is a (possibly weighted) list of
> > potentially-
> > >       unrelated varieties, expressing a preference, rather than
> > as a
> > >       declaration about actual content."
> > ...
> > > "This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrelated
> > varieties,
> > >  expressing a preference, rather than a declaration of actual
> > content."
> >
> > Yup.  However, this sentence is entirely redundant, so if there is
> > going
> > to be a change, I'd rather just delete it.
> >
> > > ! 5.1, par 4, sentence 2
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > section; there is
> > >   no guarantee of the order of the records beyond grouping them
> > together by 'Type'."
> > ...
> > > "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > section; there
> > > is no guarantee of their order beyond their being grouped
> > together by 'Type'."
> >
> > Ok.  This "can" probably should be a MAY, but it's not a big deal
> > and it's not
> > worth changing.
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.4.2 Par 1, last sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "  Such truncation MUST NOT
> > >    permit a subtag to be chopped off in the middle or the
> > formation of
> > >    invalid tags (for example, one ending with the "-"
> > character)."
> > ...
> > > "Such truncation MUST NOT permit the formation of invalid tags--
> > > either by chopping a subtag off in the middle, or by leaving a
> > singleton without any subtag."
> >
> > Disagree.  The original text is gramamtically and technically
> > correct.
> > The proposed text changes the meaning in a subtly  incompatible way.
> > Consider the case where chopping a subtag in the middle does *not*
> > result in an invalid tag, but instead produces a tag containing a
> > subtag
> > not present in the original.
> >
> > ....
> > > ? 3.5  "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4, 2nd sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " Note that each response is not limited in
> > >    size so that the request can adequately describe the
> > registration."
> > >
> > > {COMMENTS: the word "response" is not clear here, and this
> > sentence
> > > is awkward and unclear as a whole.
> >
> > I think the sentence is abundantly clear in context, and see no
> > need for change.
> > ...
> >
> > > ? 3.7 par 4 & 5
> > ...
> > > {COMMENT:  the two maintaining authorities, IANA, and the
> > individual
> > > authority, might be confused by readers here??
> > ...
> >
> > Given the topic of the section, I find it difficult to imagine such
> > confusion
> > taking place.
> >
> > > "Failure on the part of the maintaining authority to maintain
> > this record  . . . "
> >
> > It's difficult to keep a straight face when reading the proposed
> > replacement.
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1 Par 5
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " A subtag SHOULD only be used when it adds useful distinguishing
> > >    information to the tag.  Extraneous subtags interfere with the
> > >    meaning, understanding, and processing of language tags.  In
> > >    particular, users and implementations SHOULD follow the
> > 'Prefix' and
> > >    'Suppress-Script' fields in the registry (defined in Section
> > 3.1):
> > >    these fields provide guidance on when specific additional
> > subtags
> > >    SHOULD be used or avoided in a language tag."
> > >
> > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 1:
> > >  the way it's written, someone might interpret it as meaning that
> > all subtags,
> > >  including a primary language subtag, are optional, but a primary
> > language
> > > subtag is really a good idea, a real SHOULD}
> > >
> > > INSERT AT BEGINNING--replace sentence 1 with 2 sentences
> > >
> > > "All language tags--except those that are exclusively private
> > use--
> > > SHOULD include one (primary) language subtag.  Any additional
> > > subtag SHOULD only be included when it adds useful distinguishing
> > > information to the tag. "
> >
> > Strongly disagree.  This changes the sense of the text.
> > [As co-chair: it took extensive discussion to reach agreement on
> > this text, and I'm extremely relectuant to even consider changes to
> > it unless something is demonstrably broken.]
> >
> > > ?? {A SECOND COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 3:  word
> > > choice; change "follow" to "consult"  I would never say "follow"
> > > for either unless I said "follow the guidelines . . ."; "consult"
> > > is the best word with "users" probably; not sure at all about
> > > implementations but I would not say "follow"}
> >
> > Disagree.  While I appreciate the preference for "consult", it
> > does not mean the same thing as "follow".
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1 par 6 item 2 example second bullet last sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "(The tag "uz-Zxxx"
> > >        could also be used where content is not written, as the
> > subtag
> > >         'Zxxx' represents the "Code for unwritten documents".)"
> > >
> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION I do not see what clarity or information
> > > the word 'code' adds to this sentence so I CORRECTED it }
> >
> > I believe it's a quote from the subtag's registry enty.
> >
> > > "The tag "uz-Zxxx"
> > >         could also be used where content is not written as the
> > script subtag 'Zxxx' is used to indicate unwritten documents"
> >
> > I think this would be a step backwards, since it de-emphasizes the
> > generative nature
> > of subtags.
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence
> > >
> > > ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and
> > >    Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far
> > more
> > >    closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu
> > ('wuu') ,
> > >   which do share a macrolanguage."
> > > {! COMMENT:  the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one
> > of the
> > > subtags has now been deprecated; [ca] and [oc], 'Catalan' and
> > > 'Occitan'/'Provencal,' would be better examples;
> > > alternately you might choose [gsw] 'Alsatian' or 'Schwyzerdütsch'
> > >  and [swg] 'Swabian'--but I know less about Alsatian;
> > > There may be other possibilities; on a quick perusal of RFC 4645
> > >  I did not find khmer, for example, though I discovered there are
> > some
> > >  maybe mutually intelligible varieties any & know little about
> > Asian
> > > languages anyway}
> >
> > Strongly disagree.  The example serves its purpose as it is,
> > and none of the cases cited is as dramatic and clear-cut
> > as that of Romanian and Moldavian.  (Which explains nicely
> > *why* the subtag met the fate that it did.)
> >
> > [As co-chair: there already seems to be a rough consensus
> > to not change this section.]
> >
> > > 4.2 par 5
> > >  { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > "   This relationship is not guaranteed in all cases:
> > specifically,
> > >    languages that begin with the same sequence of subtags are NOT
> > >    guaranteed to be mutually intelligible, although they might be.
> > For
> > >    example, the tag "az" shares a prefix with both "az-Latn"
> > >    (Azerbaijani written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl"
> > >    (Azerbaijani written using the Cyrillic script).  A person
> > fluent in
> > >    one script might not be able to read the other, even though
> > the
> > >    linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts
> > were read
> > >    aloud) might be identical.  Content tagged as "az" most
> > probably is
> > >    written in just one script and thus might not be intelligible
> > to a
> > >    reader familiar with the other script."
> > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION  I found the language, 'this relationship
> > > is not guaranteed,' kind of vague. Also I did not like the phrase,
> > 'written
> > > in just one script'--an example specifying one of the two scripts
> > might help
> > > make this sentence clearer to someone skimming this.  I tried to
> > rewrite
> > > this paragraph:  I simplified the first sentence and used more
> > specific
> > > language (the word 'always' here, does refer the reader back to
> > what's
> > > been said in the paragraph above about the general relationship
> > between
> > > language tags sharing a prefix--one that we now see does not
> > always
> > > guarantee mutual intelligibility); I also rewrote slightly the
> > second sentence,
> > > and inserted "however" (to tie back to the previous statement)
> > > "only" into the fourth sentence.}
> > >
> > > ?? "Tags that share the same prefix are not always mutually
> > intelligible.
> > >  For example, the prefix 'az' is shared by both  "az-Latn"
> > (Azerbaijani
> > > written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl" (Azerbaijani
> > written using
> > > the Cyrillic script). A person fluent in one script might not be
> > able to
> > > read the other, even though the
> > > linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts were
> > read
> > > aloud) might be identical. However, content tagged as "az" most
> > > probably is written in just one of these scripts and thus might
> > not
> > > be intelligible to a reader familiar with only the other script."
> >
> > Disagree.  The change to the first sentence makes it sound like
> > mutual intelligibility is normally presumed when there is a shared
> > prefix, and that cases like this are rare exceptions.  The existing
> > text
> > is clearer and more to the point.
> >
> > > ? 4.5 par 2  item 4 & par 4 "Example . . . "
> > ...
> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION: the first example actually goes with item
> > > 5 & the second with item 4 so it's confusing; I prefer to have
> > the examples
> > > with the items they illustrate; thus I'd move the second of the
> > examples
> > > so that it followed item 4-- }
> >
> > I'm neutral on this proposal.  I see the benefits to interspersing
> > the
> > examples with the list of rules, but I also see advantages to the
> > current organization with the examples following the rules.
> > I'm not persuaded at all that this is a change that in any way
> > *needs* to be made.
> >
> > ...
> > > ?? 3.5 par 21
> > ...
> > > {! COMMENT/CLARIFICATION ?  Please explain "SHALL NOT" versus
> > "MUST NOT"--
> >
> > This is spelled out in RFC 2119.
> >
> > Randy
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ltru mailing list
> > Ltru@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:35:51 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8DF93A6D56 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:35:51 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.182
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.182 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.417,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id s+ig6aUqQM3o for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:35:51 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E9083A6852 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:35:51 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=iznQn7tLB8kaGtOMHxB928RNzoUYU/4n1DSFkLAlDocce3AYQA49ZHK6oYNOSmy3; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0Go-0006E8-C2 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:35:54 -0500
Message-ID: <00a201c98bc7$89663760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E1@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:35:46 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1732773a8254bd14e851c172abd2699e699350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #6: change "the ones"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:35:51 -0000

Hi -

This was assigned issue #6.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:30 AM
> Subject: change "the ones?"
>
> Issue:
> 
> > ...
> > >  ? Also, CHANGE:  "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is
> > more cohesive with 'those'
> > > because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that
> > Halliday has about cohesion too) }
> > 
> > Disagree.  I see no need for this change.
> > 
> 
> Resolution: no change. Purely editorial request.
> 


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 13:36:43 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 107073A6A70 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:36:43 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.194
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.194 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.405,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TtbM1ANvpJ8a for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:36:42 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C0A13A6852 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:36:42 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=hk5eCx+lRl5w5WNuXlL6gBdQdUDHn+QuHSAaDs3zZDkqOKVp02ojvlvbzdadAFNh; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0Hd-00079d-M3 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:36:46 -0500
Message-ID: <00a701c98bc7$a7e930c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E2@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:36:37 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173251514a4505c9b28cc522e50fc9d3c32350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #4: change "than"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 21:36:43 -0000

Hi -

This thread is a duplicate of issue #4.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:31 AM
> Subject: change "than"
>
> Issue:
> > 
> > > "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this
> > document
> > >   normatively but adhere to rules different than those given in
> > this section . . . "
> > 
> > This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong, and I cannot support
> > it.
> > 
> 
> Resolution: It's not actually wrong, depending on which grammarian one worships. Since the text is clear, no change.
> 


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:13:46 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA9E73A6852 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:13:46 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.205
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.205 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.394,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cfYAfZyaJ5BG for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:13:46 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 219963A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:13:46 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Bf62q6rPOT+4EOSFnH9MbIpMncLxJSDvNY03BNBAc6S0dB9H69wndJnvedr5TKtQ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0rT-0005F5-BK for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:13:47 -0500
Message-ID: <00f301c98bcc$d44d6140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:13:39 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17324b90403529da66b6777ef747ff19f52350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #7: change "if when"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:13:46 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue number 7.

Randy
----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:35 AM
> Subject: change "if when"
>
> Issue:
> 
> > > ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet
> > >
> > > {ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > " Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the
> > >           language a casual user might expect, especially if when
> > >           relying on the subtag's description in the registry. "
> > >
> > > {! CORRECTION:  delete either "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a
> > bit redundant, right? }
> 
> Randy commented:
> > 
> > Yup.  However, the entire phrase "especially...registry" is not
> > helpful
> > to the sense of the paragraph in question.  Consequently, I think
> > that if a change is to be made, it would be better to delete
> > everything from the comma to the word "registry".
> 
> Resolution: Randy's suggestion is the best way to handle this bit of text. Removed as suggested.
> 
> 


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:17:41 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8414D3A6852 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:17:41 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.216
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.216 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.383,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LrwHjzWkNWuO for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:17:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BBF2B3A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:17:40 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Mt4Tu8MsKVWs5KGQIo7zwBeO4CMyzqaC7YCAsHmi+4ZfdTFaKCXImTVbWrcsznJK; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX0vI-0007q5-4a for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:17:44 -0500
Message-ID: <00fa01c98bcd$6145f120$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E5@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:17:36 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173da2ab473138989f6dd867297a8fa0046350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #8: "language priority list"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:17:41 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue number 8.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:45 AM
> Subject: issue: "language priority list"
>
> Issue:
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last sentence
> > >
> > > {ORIGINAL TEXT}
> > >    "o  A language priority list [RFC4647] describing a user's
> > language
> > >        preferences.  This is a (possibly weighted) list of
> > potentially-
> > >       unrelated varieties, expressing a preference, rather than
> > as a
> > >       declaration about actual content."
> > ...
> > > "This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrelated
> > varieties,
> > >  expressing a preference, rather than a declaration of actual
> > content."
>
> Randy commented:
> >
> > Yup.  However, this sentence is entirely redundant, so if there is
> > going to be a change, I'd rather just delete it.
> >
>
> Addison's comments (editor hat OFF): The section is called "lists of languages" and one might expect to find language priority
lists mentioned here. However, the actual context in which it appears (as an example of more than one language tag applied to a
single content item) is not appropriate.
>
> Resolution: Removed the example from the bulleted list.
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:27:05 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 127873A6CE8 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:27:05 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.227
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.227 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.372,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JnxZshWgbgNR for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:27:04 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C7A03A6CB3 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:27:04 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=M61qvsXa95dURY8D94BWUmGJ4V8zPGHzaCAik/UeXWgIA1nmX618s/1LUPjdOmGF; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX14N-0000Lc-JI for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:27:07 -0500
Message-ID: <010301c98bce$b132f380$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:26:59 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173bfbbcd108a3c30e4346107c5bc5859d5350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:27:05 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue #9.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:47 AM
> Subject: issue: record ordering instructions
>
> Issue:
> >
> > > ! 5.1, par 4, sentence 2
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > section; there is
> > >   no guarantee of the order of the records beyond grouping them
> > together by 'Type'."
> > ...
> > > "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > section; there
> > > is no guarantee of their order beyond their being grouped
> > together by 'Type'."
> >
>
> Randy's comments:
>
> > Ok.  This "can" probably should be a MAY, but it's not a big deal
> > and it's not
> > worth changing.
> >
>
> Resolution: Not changed. The "can" can be a MAY, but is not required to be. The proposed text might be slightly better, but is
entirely editorial.
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:30:11 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D96D83A6CEA for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:30:11 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.237
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.237 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.362,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id V67fV24WUzsX for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:30:10 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB4B33A6CE8 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:30:10 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=BLtpQEjoJMpaUquhxsRbJGATyJnP2QG/w+Z3cmIzIWiWECVAVzRjL1jS1Nju5Qo2; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX17M-0007LC-5o for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:30:12 -0500
Message-ID: <010c01c98bcf$1f549da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E8@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:30:04 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17313789ebeeb8599184be074bce5640777350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #10: truncation
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:30:11 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue #10.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:49 AM
> Subject: issue: truncation
>
> Issue:
> > ...
> > > ! 4.4.2 Par 1, last sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "  Such truncation MUST NOT
> > >    permit a subtag to be chopped off in the middle or the
> > formation of
> > >    invalid tags (for example, one ending with the "-"
> > character)."
> > ...
> > > "Such truncation MUST NOT permit the formation of invalid tags--
> > > either by chopping a subtag off in the middle, or by leaving a
> > singleton without any subtag."
> 
> Randy's comments:
> 
> > 
> > Disagree.  The original text is gramamtically and technically
> > correct.
> > The proposed text changes the meaning in a subtly  incompatible way.
> > Consider the case where chopping a subtag in the middle does *not*
> > result in an invalid tag, but instead produces a tag containing a
> > subtag
> > not present in the original.
> > 
> 
> Resolution: No change for the reasons given by Randy.
> 


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:34:17 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C975D3A6CA3 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:34:17 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.246
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.246 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.353,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0ohLP39cJVyG for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:34:17 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 120B63A6765 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:34:17 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=kaYyYL8br5EEZLP1AVvDie445+qiHk0vrqGQPZwWh2Q7t6Xf8YUKGBMbtMejkSpu; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1BM-0000e1-GM for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:34:20 -0500
Message-ID: <011501c98bcf$b35edec0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817EB@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:34:13 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1738e3af0af85d948d742dfdbb53b844b7e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #11: use of word "response"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:34:17 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue #11.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:53 AM
> Subject: issue: use of word "response"
>
> Issue:
> > ....
> > > ? 3.5  "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4, 2nd sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " Note that each response is not limited in
> > >    size so that the request can adequately describe the
> > registration."
> > >
> > > {COMMENTS: the word "response" is not clear here, and this
> > sentence
> > > is awkward and unclear as a whole.
>
> Randy's comments:
> >
> > I think the sentence is abundantly clear in context, and see no
> > need for change.
> > ...
> >
>
> Resolution: no change. The word "response" is not as clear as it could be, but the sense and meaning of the sentence are clear
enough.
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:37:34 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7750E28C1CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:37:34 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.255
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.255 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.344,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YKoBoksIw9ET for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:37:33 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8D2C128C20D for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:37:33 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=lVIWvWP8EbEVS55gksbkEeelcNck4ovKH86iap2CioHEn85PwhJqSwO6IyaeccIe; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1EW-00082d-T5 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:37:37 -0500
Message-ID: <011e01c98bd0$2879d020$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:37:29 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173b1646d2973e714ba8b740901c5b44151350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #12: primary language SHOULD
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:37:34 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue #12.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:58 AM
> Subject: issue: primary language SHOULD
>
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1 Par 5
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " A subtag SHOULD only be used when it adds useful distinguishing
> > >    information to the tag.  Extraneous subtags interfere with the
> > >    meaning, understanding, and processing of language tags.  In
> > >    particular, users and implementations SHOULD follow the
> > 'Prefix' and
> > >    'Suppress-Script' fields in the registry (defined in Section
> > 3.1):
> > >    these fields provide guidance on when specific additional
> > subtags
> > >    SHOULD be used or avoided in a language tag."
> > >
> > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 1:
> > >  the way it's written, someone might interpret it as meaning that
> > all subtags,
> > >  including a primary language subtag, are optional, but a primary
> > language
> > > subtag is really a good idea, a real SHOULD}
> > >
> > > INSERT AT BEGINNING--replace sentence 1 with 2 sentences
> > >
> > > "All language tags--except those that are exclusively private
> > use--
> > > SHOULD include one (primary) language subtag.  Any additional
> > > subtag SHOULD only be included when it adds useful distinguishing
> > > information to the tag. "
> >
>
> Randy's comments:
>
> > Strongly disagree.  This changes the sense of the text.
> > [As co-chair: it took extensive discussion to reach agreement on
> > this text, and I'm extremely relectuant to even consider changes to
> > it unless something is demonstrably broken.]
> >
>
> Addison's comments (sans editor hat): The grammar and text elsewhere covers the use (and occasional non-use) of primary language
subtags. I don't find this paragraph at all confusing.
>
> Resolution: no changes.
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:41:11 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2C0423A6A3B for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:41:11 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.263
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.263 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.336,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XGhSzDq3Dk3H for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:41:08 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E16A3A6765 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:41:08 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=aDs8/QnsMp8raN9CBd4HVJ0gwTU6OC8ehRpa6qtoa4bEcL1iTXDTiXg5ykagWCAN; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1Hz-0006Ps-NW for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:41:11 -0500
Message-ID: <012701c98bd0$a87b96a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817EF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:41:04 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173baa8f961fddfdb690a3af812d4ea8ea4350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #13: "two authorities"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:41:11 -0000

Hi -

Assigned #13.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:54 AM
> Subject: issue: "two authorities"
>
> Issue:
> > 
> > > ? 3.7 par 4 & 5
> > ...
> > > {COMMENT:  the two maintaining authorities, IANA, and the
> > individual
> > > authority, might be confused by readers here??
> > ...
> > 
> 
> Randy's comments:
> > Given the topic of the section, I find it difficult to imagine such
> > confusion
> > taking place.
> > 
> 
> Resolution: no change.
> 
> 


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:45:13 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 13A4028C124 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:45:13 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.271
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.271 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.328,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2upjUSIgM2B5 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:45:11 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0460E28C250 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:45:11 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=DE99n/hQqOFU2CP+Jl80nYQukKktG3odzfcQUg0qaB+x64j7bYT1ewT/b3lqkzsu; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1Lu-0006BU-8d for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:45:14 -0500
Message-ID: <012e01c98bd1$39156920$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F1@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:45:06 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17366b3029eace21e8a54b6ddd8c91aba43350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #14: change "follow" to "consult"
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:45:13 -0000

Hi -

Assigned #14.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:59 AM
> Subject: issue: change "follow" to "consult"
>
> > 
> > > ?? {A SECOND COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 3:  word
> > > choice; change "follow" to "consult"  I would never say "follow"
> > > for either unless I said "follow the guidelines . . ."; "consult"
> > > is the best word with "users" probably; not sure at all about
> > > implementations but I would not say "follow"}
> > 
> 
> Randy's comments:
> 
> > Disagree.  While I appreciate the preference for "consult", it
> > does not mean the same thing as "follow".
> > 
> 
> Resolution: no change.
> 


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:55:25 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1B3D3A6CDF for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:55:24 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.279
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.279 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.320,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gYAC+czUg79k for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:55:24 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44CC53A69E5 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:55:24 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=jTQenLpbfv/6q7J6c8VDMnZDjCqCtEB7laU2oqZBrv6B1Iv8Yz7evvnsocKazWU+; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1Vn-0006mj-LM for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:55:27 -0500
Message-ID: <013e01c98bd2$a6bd8100$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:55:19 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17333a71d7e0b31a6bea9171cea638999d7350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #15: uz-Zxxx example
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:55:25 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue #15.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 10:02 AM
> Subject: issue: uz-Zxxx example
>
> > > ? 4.1 par 6 item 2 example second bullet last sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "(The tag "uz-Zxxx"
> > >        could also be used where content is not written, as the
> > subtag
> > >         'Zxxx' represents the "Code for unwritten documents".)"
> > >
> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION I do not see what clarity or information
> > > the word 'code' adds to this sentence so I CORRECTED it }
> >
> > I believe it's a quote from the subtag's registry enty.
> >
> > > "The tag "uz-Zxxx"
> > >         could also be used where content is not written as the
> > script subtag 'Zxxx' is used to indicate unwritten documents"
>
> Randy's comment:
>
> >
> > I think this would be a step backwards, since it de-emphasizes the
> > generative nature
> > of subtags.
> >
>
> Resolution: no change. This text is the result of several message threads earlier. As Randy notes, the title of the subtag is
taken directly from the registry, as we do with other subtag examples in the document.
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 14:58:19 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CB953A6A8E for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:58:19 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.286
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.286 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.313,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LijvgoORrtMK for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:58:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 35E533A69E5 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:58:18 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Lw9NsmEiNLhTqNvTWsPs598Qzw2no1265WI3/xORn/Sokyi6zf4ogV8eTvWNrJo6; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1YZ-0003Xr-G7 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:58:19 -0500
Message-ID: <014501c98bd3$0d1c7960$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F4@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 14:58:12 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1735894efc4749f662642aea8792f02686c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #16: Romanian/Modolvan example
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 22:58:19 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue #16.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 10:04 AM
> Subject: issue: Romanian/Modolvan example
>
> > > ? 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence
> > >
> > > ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and
> > >    Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far
> > more
> > >    closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu
> > ('wuu') ,
> > >   which do share a macrolanguage."
> > > {! COMMENT:  the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one
> > of the
> > > subtags has now been deprecated; [ca] and [oc], 'Catalan' and
> > > 'Occitan'/'Provencal,' would be better examples;
> > > alternately you might choose [gsw] 'Alsatian' or 'Schwyzerdütsch'
> > >  and [swg] 'Swabian'--but I know less about Alsatian;
> > > There may be other possibilities; on a quick perusal of RFC 4645
> > >  I did not find khmer, for example, though I discovered there are
> > some
> > >  maybe mutually intelligible varieties any & know little about
> > Asian
> > > languages anyway}
>
> Randy's comments:
> >
> > Strongly disagree.  The example serves its purpose as it is,
> > and none of the cases cited is as dramatic and clear-cut
> > as that of Romanian and Moldavian.  (Which explains nicely
> > *why* the subtag met the fate that it did.)
> >
> > [As co-chair: there already seems to be a rough consensus
> > to not change this section.]
> >
>
> Resolution: no change; consensus decision by co-chair.
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 15:03:41 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3DDD33A69F5 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:03:41 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.293
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.293 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.306,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GxkvnEMkQWmK for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:03:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3966F3A697F for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:03:40 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=SBqj783vYNkhnY0RMSQ23QoabPbL3SqNUjX23F2XAFcMTfccTr9s8XboY7hBtALm; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1dn-0000UA-Lv for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:03:43 -0500
Message-ID: <015101c98bd3$ce4bbc40$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:03:36 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1732f25c9b6dfb2d339526bb3f3b1303485350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #17: relationship guarantee
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:03:41 -0000

Assigned issue #17.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 10:06 AM
> Subject: issue: relationship guarantee
>
> >
> > > 4.2 par 5
> > >  { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > "   This relationship is not guaranteed in all cases:
> > specifically,
> > >    languages that begin with the same sequence of subtags are NOT
> > >    guaranteed to be mutually intelligible, although they might be.
> > For
> > >    example, the tag "az" shares a prefix with both "az-Latn"
> > >    (Azerbaijani written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl"
> > >    (Azerbaijani written using the Cyrillic script).  A person
> > fluent in
> > >    one script might not be able to read the other, even though
> > the
> > >    linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts
> > were read
> > >    aloud) might be identical.  Content tagged as "az" most
> > probably is
> > >    written in just one script and thus might not be intelligible
> > to a
> > >    reader familiar with the other script."
> > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION  I found the language, 'this relationship
> > > is not guaranteed,' kind of vague. Also I did not like the phrase,
> > 'written
> > > in just one script'--an example specifying one of the two scripts
> > might help
> > > make this sentence clearer to someone skimming this.  I tried to
> > rewrite
> > > this paragraph:  I simplified the first sentence and used more
> > specific
> > > language (the word 'always' here, does refer the reader back to
> > what's
> > > been said in the paragraph above about the general relationship
> > between
> > > language tags sharing a prefix--one that we now see does not
> > always
> > > guarantee mutual intelligibility); I also rewrote slightly the
> > second sentence,
> > > and inserted "however" (to tie back to the previous statement)
> > > "only" into the fourth sentence.}
> > >
> > > ?? "Tags that share the same prefix are not always mutually
> > intelligible.
> > >  For example, the prefix 'az' is shared by both  "az-Latn"
> > (Azerbaijani
> > > written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl" (Azerbaijani
> > written using
> > > the Cyrillic script). A person fluent in one script might not be
> > able to
> > > read the other, even though the
> > > linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts were
> > read
> > > aloud) might be identical. However, content tagged as "az" most
> > > probably is written in just one of these scripts and thus might
> > not
> > > be intelligible to a reader familiar with only the other script."
>
> Randy's comments:
>
> >
> > Disagree.  The change to the first sentence makes it sound like
> > mutual intelligibility is normally presumed when there is a shared
> > prefix, and that cases like this are rare exceptions.  The existing
> > text
> > is clearer and more to the point.
> >
>
> Addison's comments (sans editor's hat): Note that this particular section has a long and distinguished history. Variations of it
appear not only in prior versions of BCP 47, but also in HTTP and elsewhere.
>
> Resolution: no change.
>
>



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 15:07:06 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B35493A6CDE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:07:06 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.3
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.3 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.299, BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 68MeRpfX9Qgd for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:07:06 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D85A33A6CD3 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:07:05 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=O081g3hk+tOjMSkJEGsDZO5dZxWVbl3T4Xt3kDx72Qh49G8qxxcaeMz9oY6VAOMT; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1h7-0002we-34 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:07:09 -0500
Message-ID: <015a01c98bd4$48cea680$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:07:00 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1730cdeddffdb3c9d8a31dc26c832deda3a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #18: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:07:06 -0000

hi -

Assigned issue #18.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 10:11 AM
> Subject: issue: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
>
> > > ? 4.5 par 2  item 4 & par 4 "Example . . . "
> > ...
> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION: the first example actually goes with item
> > > 5 & the second with item 4 so it's confusing; I prefer to have
> > the examples
> > > with the items they illustrate; thus I'd move the second of the
> > examples
> > > so that it followed item 4-- }
>
> Randy's comments:
> >
> > I'm neutral on this proposal.  I see the benefits to interspersing
> > the
> > examples with the list of rules, but I also see advantages to the
> > current organization with the examples following the rules.
> > I'm not persuaded at all that this is a change that in any way
> > *needs* to be made.
> >
>
> Resolution: no change. Interspersing the two list-external examples would require a significant edit of this section. While such
an edit would probably flow better, it isn't a requirement for readability.
>
>



From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Tue Feb 10 15:09:25 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 222063A6CD3 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:25 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.167
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.167 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.191, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dm8DKc0BBsaR for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:24 -0800 (PST)
Received: from an-out-0708.google.com (an-out-0708.google.com [209.85.132.249]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BEB73A6BE1 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:24 -0800 (PST)
Received: by an-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id b2so72845ana.4 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:27 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=4McTZSJMr0SUfrvP1Pee0krHpj+UObSNedQIszjji2s=; b=EB5yQLB03soNE+Ddg1608uKQrR3Ep1T/nYyXGebkzOeNRl5MyS0L5SYRGvYyLuOXTy YeZLUAo0769CZ703OzoCo27NF4XZ8WUoOP2gdF1blO+aIqIqJ/otufoW+gzh9GqDuKL9 3GJSxTN5uLqAz3e8y5K3ovE96ROMcNCATuZbo=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=wlZxO6AsfQ/8qrJBT1DeFpN8peILytmj3R7nPUbPH0+PGiv+3uNrdhrOdtxAGFeyeQ fUa7a7cdrYmv5Ra2JcvIlflMfYb9gOYdDI/CfU0xfCNyGwZ7AGkpiXNHWTz2oAXT5WV5 Da4S5ZjO2/FddEoGFtIxMycnc7kWZz0upk2kw=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.100.48.19 with SMTP id v19mr244314anv.129.1234307367392; Tue,  10 Feb 2009 15:09:27 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <015a01c98bd4$48cea680$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <015a01c98bd4$48cea680$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:27 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 8fcd18877055e351
Message-ID: <30b660a20902101509i24924345nff6b3e4a70e20e22@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: Randy Presuhn 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016e6509e8e2d57520462989403
Cc: ltru@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #18: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:09:25 -0000

--0016e6509e8e2d57520462989403
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Question: is there more than one person requesting any of these proposals in
these issues? If not, I suggest we close them all.

Mark


On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 15:07, Randy Presuhn
wrote:

> hi -
>
> Assigned issue #18.
>
> Randy
>
> > From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> > Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 10:11 AM
> > Subject: issue: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
> >
> > > > ? 4.5 par 2  item 4 & par 4 "Example . . . "
> > > ...
> > > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION: the first example actually goes with item
> > > > 5 & the second with item 4 so it's confusing; I prefer to have
> > > the examples
> > > > with the items they illustrate; thus I'd move the second of the
> > > examples
> > > > so that it followed item 4-- }
> >
> > Randy's comments:
> > >
> > > I'm neutral on this proposal.  I see the benefits to interspersing
> > > the
> > > examples with the list of rules, but I also see advantages to the
> > > current organization with the examples following the rules.
> > > I'm not persuaded at all that this is a change that in any way
> > > *needs* to be made.
> > >
> >
> > Resolution: no change. Interspersing the two list-external examples would
> require a significant edit of this section. While such
> an edit would probably flow better, it isn't a requirement for readability.
> >
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--0016e6509e8e2d57520462989403
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Question: is there more than one person requesting any of these proposals i=
n these issues? If not, I suggest we close them all.

M=
ark



On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 15:07, Randy Pre=
suhn <=
randy_presuhn@mindspring.com> wrote:

hi -



Assigned issue #18.



Randy



> From: "Phillips, Addison" <addison@amazon.com>

> To: "Randy Presuhn" <randy_presuhn@mindspring.com>; <ltru@ietf.org>

> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 10:11 AM

> Subject: issue: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples

>

> > > ? 4.5 par 2  item 4 & par 4 "Example . . . &qu=
ot;

> > ...

> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION: the first example actually goes with i=
tem

> > > 5 & the second with item 4 so it's confusing; I pref=
er to have

> > the examples

> > > with the items they illustrate; thus I'd move the second=
 of the

> > examples

> > > so that it followed item 4-- }

>

> Randy's comments:

> >

> > I'm neutral on this proposal.  I see the benefits to int=
erspersing

> > the

> > examples with the list of rules, but I also see advantages to the=


> > current organization with the examples following the rules.

> > I'm not persuaded at all that this is a change that in any wa=
y

> > *needs* to be made.

> >

>

> Resolution: no change. Interspersing the two list-external examples wo=
uld require a significant edit of this section. While such

an edit would probably flow better, it isn't a requirement for readabil=
ity.

>

>





_______________________________________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru





--0016e6509e8e2d57520462989403--

From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 15:09:47 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 625A23A6CD6 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:47 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.306
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.306 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.293,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YN-U+4X4DeQE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:46 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 967A83A6BE1 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:46 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=T7kpHielajiJw+9OlRoclZrgjLTOyr61JA4t/uxP4+FCXSGkYt3/XQHSrbxcAP0h; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1jh-0006a1-Mi for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:09:49 -0500
Message-ID: <016301c98bd4$a7f13420$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F9@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:09:41 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17338bd334c1066d77412bd19edc5f80784350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #19: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:09:47 -0000

Hi -

Assigned issue number 19.

Randy

----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 10:12 AM
> Subject: issue: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT
>
> [this is the last on this thread]
> > > ?? 3.5 par 21
> > ...
> > > {! COMMENT/CLARIFICATION ?  Please explain "SHALL NOT" versus
> > "MUST NOT"--
> 
> Randy's comments:
> > 
> > This is spelled out in RFC 2119.
> > 
> 
> Resolution: nothing to do here.
> 
> 


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 15:15:48 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 197843A6CD6 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:15:48 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.312
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.312 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.287,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8FTtqaJQtkZE for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:15:47 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4BEB83A6BE1 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:15:47 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=fO5touYyuyNMXcA/IiJE6Ln7OEZSWLZ8sqqQnhMOUwVwvrxCj2jAV4+8CEY5AC4I; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1pW-0005af-Te for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:15:51 -0500
Message-ID: <018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:15:43 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173c42b9758761d2570db447f738eaff0b6350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:15:48 -0000

Hi -

> From: "Randy Presuhn" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 1:30 PM
> Subject: [Ltru] Issue Tracker
...
I think all open issues have been entered into the issue tracker
at http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/1

Please review the list.  If you object to the editor's proposed
resolution for any issue, please speak up, identifying the
issue number in the subject line of your message.  As Martin
has already said, if we hear no objections, we will simply
follow the editor's proposed resolution.

If we have omitted any open issue from the list, please speak
up NOW.  Please use a separate message with an appropriate
subject line for EACH issue.

Randy
as ltru co-chair


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 15:22:04 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8B243A6D24 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:22:04 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.388
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.388 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.648, BAYES_20=-0.74]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Fn5xi6fRBjiT for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:22:04 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 44E853A6D1C for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:22:04 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=jjwwadL5adTZjMNKCbELeeqH801N+WGAuCZGBL50TrsSqgZn3/RVKOmynqJ7F8QO; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1vb-0005Ya-FH for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:22:07 -0500
Message-ID: <019701c98bd6$6023f040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DE@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <008901c98bc6$f1eb87a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:22:00 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173fc0a741105d70fa94a1405f4d1ee1195350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:22:05 -0000

Hi -

In section 4.1 paragraph 3 I'd still prefer replacing
"different rules to" with the more-widely acceptible
"different rules from".

Randy


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 15:26:20 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF05D3A6CD6 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:26:20 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.305
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.305 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.294,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PWnF24Dun6Ek for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:26:20 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED3223A6CD3 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:26:19 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=JuJ8hJQGSq+wF9K+lJs1Q6oMsAvcjSUjSdPB6jwkeedgF3uRsz3VZ7U+qNCHPfjD; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX1zj-0003ND-7f for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:26:23 -0500
Message-ID: <01a001c98bd6$f8dc0200$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <010301c98bce$b132f380$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:26:16 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173411be5a8848fd2102cb5849de086f422350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:26:20 -0000

Hi -

> > From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> > Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:47 AM
> > Subject: issue: record ordering instructions
> >
> > Issue:
> > >
> > > > ! 5.1, par 4, sentence 2
> > > >
> > > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > >
> > > > " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > > section; there is
> > > >   no guarantee of the order of the records beyond grouping them
> > > together by 'Type'."
> > > ...
> > > > "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > > section; there
> > > > is no guarantee of their order beyond their being grouped
> > > together by 'Type'."
> > >
> >
> > Randy's comments:
> >
> > > Ok.  This "can" probably should be a MAY, but it's not a big deal
> > > and it's not
> > > worth changing.
> > >
> >
> > Resolution: Not changed. The "can" can be a MAY, but is not required to be. The proposed text might be slightly better, but is
> entirely editorial.

I fear the proposed resolution, while addressing an aside in my comments,
missing the point of Edith's original comment, with which I agreed:
  "the order of the records beyond grouping them together by 'Type'." ->
  "their order beyond their being grouped together by 'Type'."

Randy




From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 15:32:17 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D0E33A687B for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:32:17 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.311
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.311 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.288,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ljJ0OIU6+CAc for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:32:16 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9CA773A67A1 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:32:16 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=YoGkh36XmVTgRoS0JL9Nf5pfN+MdusmTo9gLWKwsB/BuCgGiTS3D52HNG1eIixoe; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX25U-0001m2-33 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:32:20 -0500
Message-ID: <01ac01c98bd7$cd4d6240$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <015a01c98bd4$48cea680$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <30b660a20902101509i24924345nff6b3e4a70e20e22@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:32:12 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173613187f0da451c27de01fc2305968465350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #18: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:32:17 -0000

Hi -

> From: "Mark Davis" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" 
> Cc: 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 3:09 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #18: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
>
> Question: is there more than one person requesting any of these proposals in
> these issues?

Yes.  Some of the items are clearly in need of editorial fix and are
agreed.  Others (normative reference fixes) were requested by the
co-chairs in preparation for hand-off to the IESG.

> If not, I suggest we close them all.

I'd rather handle them individually, since at least some of them
I'm certain would be raised again by the IESG or IETF last call.
If we have deliberated on them individually as a WG, that at least
gives us some grounds for not making those changes later on.

Randy


From addison@amazon.com  Tue Feb 10 15:33:22 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7A7BE3A698C for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:33:22 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.602
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.602 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.003, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tRzYL1h7v2xA for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:33:21 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A7C03A687B for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:33:21 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,188,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="140909070"
Received: from smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.10.25]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 10 Feb 2009 23:33:24 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1ANXNnj004867 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:33:24 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:33:22 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:33:22 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue
Thread-Index: AcmL1magJ0mCUwHQR96nzsvXGKPJvgAAYHyA
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DE686E1@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DE@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <008901c98bc6$f1eb87a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <019701c98bd6$6023f040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <019701c98bd6$6023f040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:33:22 -0000

KGVkaXRvciBoYXQgT0ZGKQ0KDQpJIHdvbid0IG1pbmQgY2hhbmdpbmcgaXQuDQoNCkFkZGlzb24N
Cg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoN
CkludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRl
Y3R1cmUuDQoNCg0KPiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBsdHJ1LWJv
dW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21haWx0bzpsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIE9uDQo+IEJlaGFs
ZiBPZiBSYW5keSBQcmVzdWhuDQo+IFNlbnQ6IFR1ZXNkYXksIEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDEwLCAyMDA5IDM6
MjIgUE0NCj4gVG86IGx0cnVAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCj4gU3ViamVjdDogUmU6IFtMdHJ1XSBJc3N1ZSAj
NDogImRpZmZlcmVudCBmcm9tIiBpc3N1ZQ0KPiANCj4gSGkgLQ0KPiANCj4gSW4gc2VjdGlvbiA0
LjEgcGFyYWdyYXBoIDMgSSdkIHN0aWxsIHByZWZlciByZXBsYWNpbmcNCj4gImRpZmZlcmVudCBy
dWxlcyB0byIgd2l0aCB0aGUgbW9yZS13aWRlbHkgYWNjZXB0aWJsZQ0KPiAiZGlmZmVyZW50IHJ1
bGVzIGZyb20iLg0KPiANCj4gUmFuZHkNCj4gDQo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f
X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+IEx0cnUgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQo+IEx0cnVAaWV0Zi5v
cmcNCj4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9sdHJ1DQo=

From addison@amazon.com  Tue Feb 10 15:50:27 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4F583A687B for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:50:27 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -106.618
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.618 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.019, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Lm98KHiIeB4M for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:50:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5CF93A698C for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:50:26 -0800 (PST)
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,188,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="187519505"
Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 10 Feb 2009 23:50:29 +0000
Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1ANoQR7010729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:50:28 GMT
Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.29]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:50:20 -0800
From: "Phillips, Addison" 
To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" 
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:50:18 -0800
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
Thread-Index: AcmL1v6KysjRohxdS6S1p96RJviZ1wAAU7GQ
Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DE6870B@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <010301c98bce$b132f380$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <01a001c98bd6$f8dc0200$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
In-Reply-To: <01a001c98bd6$f8dc0200$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Accept-Language: en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
acceptlanguage: en-US
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:50:27 -0000
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From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Tue Feb 10 15:51:52 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB7A63A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:51:52 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.156
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.156 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.180, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QoOJiMGoDIBU for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:51:51 -0800 (PST)
Received: from an-out-0708.google.com (an-out-0708.google.com [209.85.132.245]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A957A3A6949 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:51:51 -0800 (PST)
Received: by an-out-0708.google.com with SMTP id b2so85894ana.4 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:51:54 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=nDfFJsDM4nYP3sxYfD+JT9xzCHbfAsdHR+QNB0Ls+aI=; b=vJn9u4VtYWZRFqgxxP31FmCq8FlzwOJYQoTniRaNAB+y7W36AmSQ/KAeuALAjEUI0u 9ivWyJ6tSQzX7IgHt5wjhZDK/svyXok6czdl3Zlg2+/SkKWsXTWRmUtxdpPLe7UqWweX ILrdBXuMaWc7sSDGdY52UFteZyWROVRZzbVB8=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=tnkOtDSVe6KYVGkDsCunRdfsZpJj462RWSXhR/lsIPpkg7pEW8J0lgKJfW93nbyG7D dSfGZeRM76/oxYAlMgWwZ6XP6CIBa1refwtBrdUVXXZ8SaDrlVOaaHvfY7XDI7cgE5XW R39CgqNpimEj2lVemltEHpB6TJ13z3tMctVNU=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.100.14.2 with SMTP id 2mr1856279ann.13.1234309914384; Tue, 10  Feb 2009 15:51:54 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <01ac01c98bd7$cd4d6240$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <015a01c98bd4$48cea680$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <30b660a20902101509i24924345nff6b3e4a70e20e22@mail.gmail.com> <01ac01c98bd7$cd4d6240$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:51:54 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 43068799dc7afa02
Message-ID: <30b660a20902101551s460044c7ubd1279741836661e@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: Randy Presuhn 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=0016e64652e2fd5cf40462992bb7
Cc: ltru@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #18: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:51:52 -0000

--0016e64652e2fd5cf40462992bb7
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

makes sense, thanks

Mark


On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 15:32, Randy Presuhn
wrote:

> Hi -
>
> > From: "Mark Davis" 
> > To: "Randy Presuhn" 
> > Cc: 
> > Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 3:09 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #18: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples
> >
> > Question: is there more than one person requesting any of these proposals
> in
> > these issues?
>
> Yes.  Some of the items are clearly in need of editorial fix and are
> agreed.  Others (normative reference fixes) were requested by the
> co-chairs in preparation for hand-off to the IESG.
>
> > If not, I suggest we close them all.
>
> I'd rather handle them individually, since at least some of them
> I'm certain would be raised again by the IESG or IETF last call.
> If we have deliberated on them individually as a WG, that at least
> gives us some grounds for not making those changes later on.
>
> Randy
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--0016e64652e2fd5cf40462992bb7
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

makes sense, thanks

Mark



On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 15:32, Randy Pre=
suhn <=
randy_presuhn@mindspring.com> wrote:

Hi -



> From: "Mark Davis" <mark@macchiato.com>


> To: "Randy Presuhn" <randy_presuhn@mindspring.com>


> Cc: <ltru@ietf.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 3:09 PM

> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #18: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples


>

> Question: is there more than one person requesting any of these propos=
als in

> these issues?




Yes.  Some of the items are clearly in need of editorial fix and=
 are

agreed.  Others (normative reference fixes) were requested by the

co-chairs in preparation for hand-off to the IESG.




> If not, I suggest we close them all.




I'd rather handle them individually, since at least some of them<=
br>
I'm certain would be raised again by the IESG or IETF last call.

If we have deliberated on them individually as a WG, that at least

gives us some grounds for not making those changes later on.



Randy




_______________________________________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru





--0016e64652e2fd5cf40462992bb7--

From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se  Tue Feb 10 15:55:02 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F019B3A687B for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:55:02 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.615
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.615 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.016, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HtUr7wo0Tm-A for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:55:02 -0800 (PST)
Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 179BB3A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 15:55:02 -0800 (PST)
Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:32905 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LX2RQ-0004bi-4f; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:55:00 +0100
User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:54:58 +0100
From: Kent Karlsson 
To: Randy Presuhn , 
Message-ID: 
Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
Thread-Index: AcmL2vqVS0BlcF5Cu0iqxj7fHq4iHg==
In-Reply-To: <01a001c98bd6$f8dc0200$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Mime-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit
X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93
X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LX2RQ-0004bi-4f.
X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1LX2RQ-0004bi-4f 1f0df7db80809f855fc39a599d46ae10
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 23:55:03 -0000

Den 2009-02-11 00.26, skrev "Randy Presuhn" :

> I fear the proposed resolution, while addressing an aside in my comments,
> missing the point of Edith's original comment, with which I agreed:
>   "the order of the records beyond grouping them together by 'Type'." ->
>   "their order beyond their being grouped together by 'Type'."

Well, I find the proposed replacement text to be a rather horrid formulation
(I'm not even sure it is proper English). The original is much better. If
you absolutely need to change that passage, I'd suggest "the order of the
records beyond the grouping by 'Type'.".

    /kent k



From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 16:34:07 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1716B3A6835 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:34:07 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.316
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.316 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.283,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kajVtzli46yN for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:34:06 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4829F3A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:34:06 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=CZGfIpgePDtp21tRidIWxwr2COCnoeV6kiuWJc99xmBTE9bq7Y/FstfOmQLRl8l+; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX33I-0007ZF-Up for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 19:34:09 -0500
Message-ID: <001101c98be0$6e356ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: 
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:33:57 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731927d9df5baa781e17ab8948334462aa350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:34:07 -0000

Hi -

> From: "Kent Karlsson" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 3:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
>
> Den 2009-02-11 00.26, skrev "Randy Presuhn" :
> 
> > I fear the proposed resolution, while addressing an aside in my comments,
> > missing the point of Edith's original comment, with which I agreed:
> >   "the order of the records beyond grouping them together by 'Type'." ->
> >   "their order beyond their being grouped together by 'Type'."
> 
> Well, I find the proposed replacement text to be a rather horrid formulation
> (I'm not even sure it is proper English).

I'm not sure what is meant by "proper" English, but at least it is
grammatically correct.

> The original is much better.

But not grammatical.  See Edith's original posting for a detailed
explanation why.

> If
> you absolutely need to change that passage, I'd suggest "the order of the
> records beyond the grouping by 'Type'.".

That'd be ok with me.

>     /kent k

Randy


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Tue Feb 10 16:36:19 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 427FC3A69F0 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:36:19 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.322
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.322 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.277,  BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E4jKbYdx3Hiz for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:36:18 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A1273A63CB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:36:18 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=RrxANd5CdfIHhV/4kDzJjuqByqq6Ba1KaJH7eB3wir3SiYewzXHu8Zm8MNiDbZZs; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [64.105.34.146] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LX35R-0008Ur-O1 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 19:36:21 -0500
Message-ID: <001201c98be0$bf224880$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: 
References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><010301c98bce$b132f380$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <01a001c98bd6$f8dc0200$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DE6870B@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:36:13 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731e0068f320e55f133bc31b850e4a987e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.146
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 00:36:19 -0000

Hi -

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 3:50 PM
> Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
...
> If we really must make such a minor edit, I would propose:
>
> --
> IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or modified record into the appropriate section of the language
subtag registry, grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted records can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section;
there is no guarantee that the registry's records are in any particular order other than their being grouped together by 'Type'.
Modified records overwrite the record they replace.
> --
>
> This would make clear that it is the registry's overall records (not just the inserted records) are meant; that there is no
guarantee about ordering; and that the Type groupings is what was meant by "appropriate section".
>
> I still propose that we not make this edit, since it really isn't necessary.
...

Addison's proposed text is also ok with me.  Although I understand the
grammatical problem with the existing text, I, too, am not fully
convinced that there is a *need* for a fix.  This is the kind of
problem that most native speakers would probably not even notice
in spoken English, and would catch in written material only upon
very careful examination.  My reason for posting was to make sure
that Edith's original comment was addressed, and not just my
side-remark.

Randy



From doug@ewellic.org  Tue Feb 10 17:59:42 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 354453A69C7 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:59:42 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.983
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.983 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.615,  BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id WIZQi0cVXRRZ for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:59:41 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpout10.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout10-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.235]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4B0E23A6883 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 17:59:41 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 26854 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2009 01:59:45 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout10.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.235) with ESMTP; 11 Feb 2009 01:59:44 -0000
Message-ID: 
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:59:40 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 01:59:42 -0000

Randy Presuhn  wrote:

>> For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands), 
>> which was not registered at the time this document was adopted and 
>> had, at that time, no corresponding ISO 3166-1 code, MAY be entered 
>> into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5, 
>> provided no ISO 3166-1 code with that exact meaning has been 
>> previously registered.
> ...
> This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this paragraph 
> so far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's proposed text?

I am fine with this, with or without "For historical reasons."

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ


From doug@ewellic.org  Tue Feb 10 18:01:36 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B00763A69C7 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:01:36 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.997
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.997 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.601,  BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kSqSUzwsITfH for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:01:36 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.31]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 071673A67FB for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:01:35 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 27989 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2009 02:01:39 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.31) with ESMTP; 11 Feb 2009 02:01:39 -0000
Message-ID: 
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 19:01:34 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 02:01:36 -0000

Randy Presuhn  wrote:

> In section 4.1 paragraph 3 I'd still prefer replacing
> "different rules to" with the more-widely acceptible
> "different rules from".

If changes are already going to be made, then I support this one and 
other "different than/different to" changes.  But I wouldn't institute a 
whole new round of changes just for this.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ


From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Tue Feb 10 18:24:28 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27AB23A6D1E for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:24:28 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.147
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.147 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.171, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dtF7-CoAmAZ2 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:24:27 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-qy0-f11.google.com (mail-qy0-f11.google.com [209.85.221.11]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 278143A6864 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:24:27 -0800 (PST)
Received: by qyk4 with SMTP id 4so797226qyk.13 for ; Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:24:29 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=dVnNdfXiNl6R9irSp7tgW610ikwEU7rGuMQC2faIGAo=; b=W7BYCgEyepvhyHZ30DtoXNpAndazJAHYvXU7qbzaQD7fySr9tBDPM7AyvCR5oGmEHj +12NK+T8mX9Y0MFNx9Iz9tghlQbYDpk/GH8qI/7Ol9okSHPnAV54rK8uN2it/tZMB5RL pHrxNTegjyIUNMNree40HQU+0U4m8PJA7Nxdc=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=MRGUYQvt4TGWxbs0INd5V7UzD+EZDtGAmoCIeyUHEMhxUlYdreTm917uDj18yQ5XxN bm8KfA7A+M7YG4YHrPpjZMOMj3O//N6jA3ul0L+KungcOE1lW2JAjgVnYBpg+6a66FtX u16p/jVcsaqNpiEbdlyBVQ+RytJo9w6k3qVxg=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.142.69.11 with SMTP id r11mr734777wfa.73.1234319069163; Tue,  10 Feb 2009 18:24:29 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: 
References:  
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 18:24:29 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 206135f9d10e2589
Message-ID: <30b660a20902101824x67aee945gc0ef83b0d8f551f4@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: Doug Ewell 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636e0abbca8314c04629b4d5b
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 02:24:28 -0000

--001636e0abbca8314c04629b4d5b
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Ditto

Mark


On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 17:59, Doug Ewell  wrote:

> Randy Presuhn  wrote:
>
>  For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands), which
>>> was not registered at the time this document was adopted and had, at th=
at
>>> time, no corresponding ISO 3166-1 code, MAY be entered into the IANA
>>> registry via the process described in Section 3.5, provided no ISO 3166=
-1
>>> code with that exact meaning has been previously registered.
>>>
>> ...
>> This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this paragraph s=
o
>> far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's proposed text?
>>
>
> I am fine with this, with or without "For historical reasons."
>
> --
> Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
> http://www.ewellic.org
> http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
> http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  =CB=86
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--001636e0abbca8314c04629b4d5b
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Ditto

Mark



On Tue, Feb 10, 2009 at 17:59, Doug Ewel=
l <doug@ewellic.or=
g> wrote:


Randy Presuhn <randy underscore presuhn at mindspr=
ing dot com> wrote:






For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands), which wa=
s not registered at the time this document was adopted and had, at that tim=
e, no corresponding ISO 3166-1 code, MAY be entered into the IANA registry =
via the process described in Section 3.5, provided no ISO 3166-1 code with =
that exact meaning has been previously registered.




...

This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this para=
graph so far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's prop=
osed text?





I am fine with this, with or without "For historical reasons."



--

Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645 &nb=
sp;*  UTN #14

http://www.ewellic.org=


http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html

http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages &n=
bsp;=CB=86



_______________________________________________



--001636e0abbca8314c04629b4d5b--

From gerard.lang@insee.fr  Wed Feb 11 03:22:33 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C54B53A694E for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 03:22:33 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.016
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.016 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.933,  BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vRL0Yo8y5KZC for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 03:22:31 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mercure.insee.fr (mercure.insee.fr [81.255.68.34]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7EEDB3A6956 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 03:22:30 -0800 (PST)
Received: from evariste.insee.fr (unknown [194.254.38.143]) by mercure.insee.fr (Insee Mail Server) with ESMTP id 2217D133781 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:22:32 +0100 (CET)
Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2C6779401E for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:22:31 +0100 (CET)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at insee.fr
Received: from evariste.insee.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (evariste.insee.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Tpb77CkvO2Wj for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:22:31 +0100 (CET)
Received: from s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra (unknown [194.254.38.144]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85A9D794020 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:22:29 +0100 (CET)
Received: from S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra ([10.90.200.51]) by s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:22:30 +0100
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5
Content-class: urn:content-classes:message
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 12:22:29 +0100
Message-ID: <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD09F1@S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra>
In-Reply-To: 
X-MS-Has-Attach: 
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: 
Thread-Topic: Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 24
thread-index: AcmLx5HP5jntuaz7QbW9nXhGYxKo8wAZrn3g
References: 
From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= 
To: , =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= 
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2009 11:22:30.0041 (UTC) FILETIME=[06B76090:01C98C3B]
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 24
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 11:22:33 -0000

Dear All,

Concerning the last proposition regarding "E" and Channel Islands, some =
more informations.

1-History: inside the first edition of ISO 3166 (1974), that only had =
the alpha-2 and the alpha-3 codes, the entry GB (United Kingdom of Great =
Britain and Northern Ireland) was commented by a remark "Includes =
Orkney, Shetland and Channel Islands and Isle of Man".
Inside the second edition of ISO 3166 (1981), that integrated as a third =
ISO 3166 country code the numeric-3 code M49 from the United Nations =
Statistics Division (UNSD), all entries of the M49 code became entries =
of ISO 3166, with the only exception (asked by GB) of both Channel =
Islands and Isle of Man, so that the remark concerning GB remained =
unchanged [By the way, and on the other hand, this integration comprised =
obtaining from UNSD numeric-3 code elements for all entries of the first =
edition of ISO 3166, like Bouvet Island (BV, BVT, 074) or Heard and =
McDonald Islands (HM, HMD, 334), that became new entries inside M49 ;but =
some of these new entries were almost immediatly (1982) suppressed from =
M49 !].
 Another interesting fact is that a paper version  (01/06/1992) prepared =
by UNSD of the "Standard country or area code for statistical use" (this =
is the initial official name of M49) included a line "833  Isle of Man  =
IM   IMY"  containing alpha-2 and alpha-3 ISO 3166 code elements that =
did not exist at this date (and were published by UNSD until 2000 at =
least), the alpha-2 being the correct would-be one, but not the alpha-3 =
!!
The remark concerning GB remained the same in the third edition (1988), =
but was precised in the fourth edition (1993) as follows:
"Includes Orkney Islands and Shetland Islands; the code elements are =
also applicable to the Channel Islands, and the Isle of Man which are =
direct dependancies of the British Crown", so as to allow GB to explain =
the fact that Channel Islands and Isle of Man are no really covered by =
the name "United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland"
Inside the fitfh edition (1997) of ISO 3166 (first edition of ISO =
3166-1), the remark concerning GB was simplified as follows: "Includes =
the Channel Islands, the Isle of Man".
On 29-03-2004, ISO 3166-1 Newsletter V-11 decided to create inside ISO =
3166-1 the three new entries GUERNSEY (GG, GGY, 831), ISLE of MAN (IM, =
IMN, 833) and JERSEY (JE, JEY, 832) and suppressed any remark concerning =
GB. At the same time UNSD, that had created the numeric-3 code elements =
831 and 832 at ISO 3166/MA request, added Guernsey and Jersey as two new =
entries inside M49 (but did not suppress the entry Channel Islands, as =
should, or could, have been the case). The sixth edition of ISO 3166 =
(second edition of ISO 3166-1), published on 15-11-2006, integrated the =
Newsletter V-11.
On 09-09-2008, ISO 3166-1 Newsletter VI-3 added a remark concerning GG =
as follows "The Bailiwick of Guersey also includes the islands of =
Alderney, Breqhou, Burhou, Herm, Jethou, Lihou, Little Sark and Sark".

2-Coherence: if it is correct that Channel Islands is today the only =
entry of M49 that is not an entry of ISO 3166-1, it must also be =
remarked that some entries of ISO 3166-1, like BV or HM, are no more =
today's entries for M49.
Moreover, M49 added to the section concerning "countries and =
territories" another section concerning macroregions and giving, on one =
side a list of geographical macro-regions (continents, subcontinents and =
continental regions, that is considered inside RFC 4646 (and also =
indirectly inside ISO 3166-1 because, as application of the clauses =
8.1.2 and 8.1.3 concerning user-assigned use of reserved code elements =
for aggregations of countries, ISO 3166/MA recommands alignment for such =
use with a notified assignation) and, on another side a list of economic =
grouping of countries (like developped, developping, least developped, =
landlocked, ..) that is not used by ISO 3166 or RFC 4646. .

3-Terminology: In the common terminology of ISO 3166 and ISO 639, a code =
is a table making a link between on one side a list of entries (Country =
names, Language names) and a corresponding list of code elements, built =
by use of a coding scheme defined by a syntactic format (like alpha-2, =
alpha-3 or numeric-3) and maybe other rules (like a visual association =
between the alphabetic code elements and the corresponding entry names). =
So that "830" is a "code element" and should not be considered as a =
"code".

4-Anyway, in my opinion, this text "E" could very well be suppressed.=20

Bien cordialement.
G=E9rard LANG

=20
-----Message d'origine-----
De : ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de =
ltru-request@ietf.org
Envoy=E9 : mardi 10 f=E9vrier 2009 22:36
=C0 : ltru@ietf.org
Objet : Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 24

Send Ltru mailing list submissions to
	ltru@ietf.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
	https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
	ltru-request@ietf.org

You can reach the person managing the list at
	ltru-owner@ietf.org

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than =
"Re: Contents of Ltru digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. Issue #1: change ref from 2434 to 5226 (Randy Presuhn)
   2. Re: draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
      (John Cowan)
   3. Issue #2:  move 2860 ref to informative (Randy Presuhn)
   4. Issue #3: move RFC 4645 reference to informative (Randy Presuhn)
   5. Issue #5: change "apply" (Randy Presuhn)
   6. Issue #6: change "the ones" (Randy Presuhn)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:32:25 -0800
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #1: change ref from 2434 to 5226
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
Message-ID: <008e01c98bc7$1148b460$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=3D"iso-8859-1"

Hi -

This was assigned issue #1.

Randy

----- Original Message -----=20
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:20 AM
> Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: change ref from 2434 to 5226
>
> [this is the first email reporting changes between the current=20
> official draft, which is draft-20, and the editor copy, which is
draft-21]
>
> Issue: update reference from RFC 2434 to RFC 5226
>
> Resolution: completed in draft-21; 2434 was obsolete by 5226
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru




------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 16:32:44 -0500
From: John Cowan 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to
	informative
To: Randy Presuhn 
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Message-ID: <20090210213244.GH13691@mercury.ccil.org>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3Dus-ascii

Randy Presuhn scripsit:

> > For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands),=20
> > which was not registered at the time this document was adopted and=20
> > had, at that time, no corresponding ISO 3166-1 code, MAY be entered=20
> > into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5, =
provided no ISO 3166-1 code with that exact meaning has been previously =
registered.
> ...
>=20
> As co-chair...
> This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this paragraph =

> so far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's proposed text?

I'd strike "for historical reasons", which seems unnecessary to me.

--=20
What is the sound of Perl?  Is it not the       John Cowan
sound of a [Ww]all that people have stopped     cowan@ccil.org
banging their head against?  --Larry            =
http://www.ccil.org/~cowan


------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:05 -0800
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #2:  move 2860 ref to informative
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
Message-ID: <009301c98bc7$29371bc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=3D"iso-8859-1"

Hi -

This was assigned issue #2.

----- Original Message -----=20
> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:21 AM
> Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move 2860 ref to informative
>
> Issue: move the reference to RFC 2860 "Memorandum of Understanding=20
> Concerning the Technical Work of the Internet Assigned Numbers=20
> Authority" from normative to informative
>=20
> Resolution: completed in draft-21 by request of one of the co-chairs.
>=20
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>=20
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>=20
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru



------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:33:52 -0800
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #3: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
Message-ID: <009801c98bc7$45888f20$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=3D"iso-8859-1"

Hi -

this was assigned issue #3.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "LTRU Working Group" 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:23 AM
> Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>
> Issue: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>
> Resolution: moved to the informative section from the normative=20
> section. The "normative" material in 4645 in question isn't up to
the standard of having a normative reference.
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru




------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:34:49 -0800
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #5: change "apply"
To: 
Message-ID: <009d01c98bc7$679d88e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=3D"utf-8"

Hi -

This was assigned issue #5.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:29 AM
> Subject: change "apply"
>
> Issue:
>
> >
> > ...
> > >  ?? Also, CHANGE: "apply" to "adhere to" or simply "follow"  (I
> > like "adhere to" better;
> > > "apply" might be a word you use with applications and rules but I
> > do not use it with anything but formatting,
> > > "formatting is applied . . ."
> >
>
> Randy commented:
>
> > Disagree.  I see no need for this change.
>
> Resolution: no change. The editors don't see a reason to modify this.
>
> Addison Phillips
> Globalization Architect -- Lab126
>
> Internationalization is not a feature.
> It is an architecture.
>
>
> >
> > ...
> > >  ? Also, CHANGE:  "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is
> > more cohesive with 'those'
> > > because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that
> > Halliday has about cohesion too) }
> >
> > Disagree.  I see no need for this change.
> >
> > > "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this
> > document
> > >   normatively but adhere to rules different than those given in
> > this section . . . "
> >
> > This proposed usage of "than" is simply wrong, and I cannot support=20
> > it.
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.1 par 6 item 1 second bullet
> > >
> > > {ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > " Note that some subtag sequences might not represent the
> > >           language a casual user might expect, especially if when
> > >           relying on the subtag's description in the registry. "
> > >
> > > {! CORRECTION:  delete either "if" or "when" as "if when" seems a
> > bit redundant, right? }
> >
> > Yup.  However, the entire phrase "especially...registry" is not=20
> > helpful to the sense of the paragraph in question.  Consequently, I=20
> > think that if a change is to be made, it would be better to delete=20
> > everything from the comma to the word "registry".
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.3 Par 1 Bullet 1 last sentence
> > >
> > > {ORIGINAL TEXT}
> > >    "o  A language priority list [RFC4647] describing a user's
> > language
> > >        preferences.  This is a (possibly weighted) list of
> > potentially-
> > >       unrelated varieties, expressing a preference, rather than
> > as a
> > >       declaration about actual content."
> > ...
> > > "This is a (possibly weighted) list of potentially unrelated
> > varieties,
> > >  expressing a preference, rather than a declaration of actual
> > content."
> >
> > Yup.  However, this sentence is entirely redundant, so if there is=20
> > going to be a change, I'd rather just delete it.
> >
> > > ! 5.1, par 4, sentence 2
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > section; there is
> > >   no guarantee of the order of the records beyond grouping them
> > together by 'Type'."
> > ...
> > > "Inserted records can be placed anywhere in the appropriate
> > section; there
> > > is no guarantee of their order beyond their being grouped
> > together by 'Type'."
> >
> > Ok.  This "can" probably should be a MAY, but it's not a big deal=20
> > and it's not worth changing.
> >
> > ...
> > > ! 4.4.2 Par 1, last sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "  Such truncation MUST NOT
> > >    permit a subtag to be chopped off in the middle or the
> > formation of
> > >    invalid tags (for example, one ending with the "-"
> > character)."
> > ...
> > > "Such truncation MUST NOT permit the formation of invalid tags--=20
> > > either by chopping a subtag off in the middle, or by leaving a
> > singleton without any subtag."
> >
> > Disagree.  The original text is gramamtically and technically=20
> > correct.
> > The proposed text changes the meaning in a subtly  incompatible way.
> > Consider the case where chopping a subtag in the middle does *not*=20
> > result in an invalid tag, but instead produces a tag containing a=20
> > subtag not present in the original.
> >
> > ....
> > > ? 3.5  "Registration Procedure for Subtags" Par 4, 2nd sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " Note that each response is not limited in
> > >    size so that the request can adequately describe the
> > registration."
> > >
> > > {COMMENTS: the word "response" is not clear here, and this
> > sentence
> > > is awkward and unclear as a whole.
> >
> > I think the sentence is abundantly clear in context, and see no need =

> > for change.
> > ...
> >
> > > ? 3.7 par 4 & 5
> > ...
> > > {COMMENT:  the two maintaining authorities, IANA, and the
> > individual
> > > authority, might be confused by readers here??
> > ...
> >
> > Given the topic of the section, I find it difficult to imagine such=20
> > confusion taking place.
> >
> > > "Failure on the part of the maintaining authority to maintain
> > this record  . . . "
> >
> > It's difficult to keep a straight face when reading the proposed=20
> > replacement.
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1 Par 5
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > " A subtag SHOULD only be used when it adds useful distinguishing
> > >    information to the tag.  Extraneous subtags interfere with the
> > >    meaning, understanding, and processing of language tags.  In
> > >    particular, users and implementations SHOULD follow the
> > 'Prefix' and
> > >    'Suppress-Script' fields in the registry (defined in Section
> > 3.1):
> > >    these fields provide guidance on when specific additional
> > subtags
> > >    SHOULD be used or avoided in a language tag."
> > >
> > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 1:
> > >  the way it's written, someone might interpret it as meaning that
> > all subtags,
> > >  including a primary language subtag, are optional, but a primary
> > language
> > > subtag is really a good idea, a real SHOULD}
> > >
> > > INSERT AT BEGINNING--replace sentence 1 with 2 sentences
> > >
> > > "All language tags--except those that are exclusively private
> > use--
> > > SHOULD include one (primary) language subtag.  Any additional=20
> > > subtag SHOULD only be included when it adds useful distinguishing=20
> > > information to the tag. "
> >
> > Strongly disagree.  This changes the sense of the text.
> > [As co-chair: it took extensive discussion to reach agreement on=20
> > this text, and I'm extremely relectuant to even consider changes to=20
> > it unless something is demonstrably broken.]
> >
> > > ?? {A SECOND COMMENT/CORRECTION for Sentence 3:  word choice;=20
> > > change "follow" to "consult"  I would never say "follow"
> > > for either unless I said "follow the guidelines . . ."; "consult"
> > > is the best word with "users" probably; not sure at all about=20
> > > implementations but I would not say "follow"}
> >
> > Disagree.  While I appreciate the preference for "consult", it does=20
> > not mean the same thing as "follow".
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1 par 6 item 2 example second bullet last sentence
> > >
> > > { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "(The tag "uz-Zxxx"
> > >        could also be used where content is not written, as the
> > subtag
> > >         'Zxxx' represents the "Code for unwritten documents".)"
> > >
> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION I do not see what clarity or information the=20
> > > word 'code' adds to this sentence so I CORRECTED it }
> >
> > I believe it's a quote from the subtag's registry enty.
> >
> > > "The tag "uz-Zxxx"
> > >         could also be used where content is not written as the
> > script subtag 'Zxxx' is used to indicate unwritten documents"
> >
> > I think this would be a step backwards, since it de-emphasizes the=20
> > generative nature of subtags.
> >
> > ...
> > > ? 4.1.1 par 5, last sentence
> > >
> > > ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > >
> > > "For example, Romanian ('ro') and
> > >    Moldavian ('mo') do not share a macrolanguage, but are far
> > more
> > >    closely related to each other than Cantonese ('yue') and Wu
> > ('wuu') ,
> > >   which do share a macrolanguage."
> > > {! COMMENT:  the [ro] [mo] example is a bit of a problem as one
> > of the
> > > subtags has now been deprecated; [ca] and [oc], 'Catalan' and=20
> > > 'Occitan'/'Provencal,' would be better examples; alternately you=20
> > > might choose [gsw] 'Alsatian' or 'Schwyzerd?tsch'
> > >  and [swg] 'Swabian'--but I know less about Alsatian; There may be =

> > > other possibilities; on a quick perusal of RFC 4645  I did not=20
> > > find khmer, for example, though I discovered there are
> > some
> > >  maybe mutually intelligible varieties any & know little about
> > Asian
> > > languages anyway}
> >
> > Strongly disagree.  The example serves its purpose as it is, and=20
> > none of the cases cited is as dramatic and clear-cut as that of=20
> > Romanian and Moldavian.  (Which explains nicely
> > *why* the subtag met the fate that it did.)
> >
> > [As co-chair: there already seems to be a rough consensus to not=20
> > change this section.]
> >
> > > 4.2 par 5
> > >  { ORIGINAL TEXT }
> > > "   This relationship is not guaranteed in all cases:
> > specifically,
> > >    languages that begin with the same sequence of subtags are NOT
> > >    guaranteed to be mutually intelligible, although they might be.
> > For
> > >    example, the tag "az" shares a prefix with both "az-Latn"
> > >    (Azerbaijani written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl"
> > >    (Azerbaijani written using the Cyrillic script).  A person
> > fluent in
> > >    one script might not be able to read the other, even though
> > the
> > >    linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts
> > were read
> > >    aloud) might be identical.  Content tagged as "az" most
> > probably is
> > >    written in just one script and thus might not be intelligible
> > to a
> > >    reader familiar with the other script."
> > > {COMMENT/CORRECTION  I found the language, 'this relationship is=20
> > > not guaranteed,' kind of vague. Also I did not like the phrase,
> > 'written
> > > in just one script'--an example specifying one of the two scripts
> > might help
> > > make this sentence clearer to someone skimming this.  I tried to
> > rewrite
> > > this paragraph:  I simplified the first sentence and used more
> > specific
> > > language (the word 'always' here, does refer the reader back to
> > what's
> > > been said in the paragraph above about the general relationship
> > between
> > > language tags sharing a prefix--one that we now see does not
> > always
> > > guarantee mutual intelligibility); I also rewrote slightly the
> > second sentence,
> > > and inserted "however" (to tie back to the previous statement)=20
> > > "only" into the fourth sentence.}
> > >
> > > ?? "Tags that share the same prefix are not always mutually
> > intelligible.
> > >  For example, the prefix 'az' is shared by both  "az-Latn"
> > (Azerbaijani
> > > written using the Latin script) and "az-Cyrl" (Azerbaijani
> > written using
> > > the Cyrillic script). A person fluent in one script might not be
> > able to
> > > read the other, even though the
> > > linguistic content (e.g., what would be heard if both texts were
> > read
> > > aloud) might be identical. However, content tagged as "az" most=20
> > > probably is written in just one of these scripts and thus might
> > not
> > > be intelligible to a reader familiar with only the other script."
> >
> > Disagree.  The change to the first sentence makes it sound like=20
> > mutual intelligibility is normally presumed when there is a shared=20
> > prefix, and that cases like this are rare exceptions.  The existing=20
> > text is clearer and more to the point.
> >
> > > ? 4.5 par 2  item 4 & par 4 "Example . . . "
> > ...
> > > { COMMENT/CORRECTION: the first example actually goes with item
> > > 5 & the second with item 4 so it's confusing; I prefer to have
> > the examples
> > > with the items they illustrate; thus I'd move the second of the
> > examples
> > > so that it followed item 4-- }
> >
> > I'm neutral on this proposal.  I see the benefits to interspersing=20
> > the examples with the list of rules, but I also see advantages to=20
> > the current organization with the examples following the rules.
> > I'm not persuaded at all that this is a change that in any way
> > *needs* to be made.
> >
> > ...
> > > ?? 3.5 par 21
> > ...
> > > {! COMMENT/CLARIFICATION ?  Please explain "SHALL NOT" versus
> > "MUST NOT"--
> >
> > This is spelled out in RFC 2119.
> >
> > Randy
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ltru mailing list
> > Ltru@ietf.org
> > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>




------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Tue, 10 Feb 2009 13:35:46 -0800
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
Subject: [Ltru] Issue #6: change "the ones"
To: 
Message-ID: <00a201c98bc7$89663760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=3D"utf-8"

Hi -

This was assigned issue #6.

Randy

> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; 
> Sent: Sunday, February 08, 2009 9:30 AM
> Subject: change "the ones?"
>
> Issue:
>=20
> > ...
> > >  ? Also, CHANGE:  "the ones" to "those" (I think the the text is
> > more cohesive with 'those'
> > > because it refers back to 'the rules'--this is an idea that
> > Halliday has about cohesion too) }
> >=20
> > Disagree.  I see no need for this change.
> >=20
>=20
> Resolution: no change. Purely editorial request.
>=20



------------------------------

_______________________________________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru


End of Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 24
************************************

From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp  Wed Feb 11 03:57:27 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0DBB28C0EB for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 03:57:27 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.176
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.176 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.378,  BAYES_00=-2.599, DATE_IN_PAST_03_06=0.044, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8wYJqUmIoQZY for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 03:57:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.195]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1BBA628C0CF for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 03:57:25 -0800 (PST)
Received: from scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (scmse2 [133.2.253.17]) by scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1BBvSlJ007258 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 20:57:28 +0900 (JST)
Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 4687_27af7e72_f833_11dd_992e_0019b9e2b3d9; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 20:57:28 +0900
Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:60873) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id  for  from ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 20:49:08 +0900
Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090211165337.16381870@localhost>
X-Sender: duerst@localhost
X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 16:54:24 +0900
To: "Randy Presuhn" , "LTRU Working Group" 
From: Martin Duerst 
In-Reply-To: <005e01c98bc4$d3a61e60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209105223.05702950@localhost> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD8193E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090209153345.162baf70@localhost> <30b660a20902090804n1b3b3cd9m384f198c3d1c442e@mail.gmail.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD81CD6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090210102251.162c8e20@localhost> <000001c98b49$a01b7fc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DE68472@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <005e01c98bc4$d3a61e60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 11:57:27 -0000

Agreeing with Randy, both as a technical contributor and as a co-chair.

And fine with removing the "For historical reasons,", leaving that
to the editor to decide.

Regards,    Martin.

At 06:16 09/02/11, Randy Presuhn wrote:
>Hi -
>
>> From: "Phillips, Addison" 
>> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" 
>
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 10, 2009 1:01 PM
>> Subject: RE: [Ltru] draft-21 mod: move RFC 4645 reference to informative
>...
>> For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands), which 
>was not registered at 
>> the time this document was adopted and had, at that time, no 
>corresponding ISO 3166-1 code, 
>> MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in 
>Section 3.5, provided no
>> ISO 3166-1 code with that exact meaning has been previously registered.
>...
>
>As a technical contributor...
>This proposed text looks very good to me.
>
>As co-chair...
>This seems to be our best "minimum change" proposal for this paragraph
>so far.  Are there any objections to adopting Addison's proposed text?
>
>Randy
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ltru mailing list
>Ltru@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru


#-#-#  Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University
#-#-#  http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp       mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp     


From doug@ewellic.org  Wed Feb 11 06:08:51 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21DFA3A6800 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 06:08:51 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.01
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.01 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.588,  BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RjRaZx36NVbX for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 06:08:50 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpauth03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.183]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id ED6AD3A690E for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 06:08:49 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 3237 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2009 14:08:54 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.183) with ESMTP; 11 Feb 2009 14:08:53 -0000
Message-ID: <6B5159D53F8D4A43BDAE01FA5E17D94C@DGBP7M81>
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:08:49 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: [Ltru] Channel Islands background material (was: Re: Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 28)
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 14:08:51 -0000

Lang Gérard  wrote:

> On 29-03-2004, ISO 3166-1 Newsletter V-11 decided to create inside ISO 
> 3166-1 the three new entries GUERNSEY (GG, GGY, 831), ISLE of MAN (IM, 
> IMN, 833) and JERSEY (JE, JEY, 832) and suppressed any remark 
> concerning GB. At the same time UNSD, that had created the numeric-3 
> code elements 831 and 832 at ISO 3166/MA request, added Guernsey and 
> Jersey as two new entries inside M49 (but did not suppress the entry 
> Channel Islands, as should, or could, have been the case). The sixth 
> edition of ISO 3166 (second edition of ISO 3166-1), published on 
> 15-11-2006, integrated the Newsletter V-11.

We were there.  A fair amount of discussion during LTRU 1.0 revolved 
around the existence of four M.49 code elements that did not exist in 
3166-1.  It was considered important to have a way to distinguish 
language X (English?  French?  Dgèrnésiais?) as spoken in Guernsey from 
language X as spoken in the rest of the UK.  Numeric region subtags 
based on the M.49 code elements were our solution.

The introduction of the 3166-1 code elements GG and JE (and IM) made the 
original passage in RFC 4646 look very awkward.  The continued existence 
in M.49 of a "country" code element for "Channel Islands" as well as 
"Guernsey" and "Jersey" individually also adds a bit of weirdness.

> 2-Coherence: if it is correct that Channel Islands is today the only 
> entry of M49 that is not an entry of ISO 3166-1, it must also be 
> remarked that some entries of ISO 3166-1, like BV or HM, are no more 
> today's entries for M49.

But we aren't worried about this.  In the Language Subtag Registry, 
alpha-2 code elements based on 3166-1 take precedence over numeric code 
elements based on M.49.

> Moreover, M49 added to the section concerning "countries and 
> territories" another section concerning macroregions and giving, on 
> one side a list of geographical macro-regions (continents, 
> subcontinents and continental regions, that is considered inside RFC 
> 4646 (and also indirectly inside ISO 3166-1 because, as application of 
> the clauses 8.1.2 and 8.1.3 concerning user-assigned use of reserved 
> code elements for aggregations of countries, ISO 3166/MA recommands 
> alignment for such use with a notified assignation) and, on another 
> side a list of economic grouping of countries (like developped, 
> developping, least developped, landlocked, ..) that is not used by ISO 
> 3166 or RFC 4646. .

Because the developed/developing and island/landlocked distinctions have 
no conceivable relevance to language identification, whereas the 
geographical groupings do have relevance.  In particular, there is an 
established need for some applications to distinguish "Latin American 
Spanish" from Castilian as spoken in Spain, without breaking the former 
into Colombian Spanish, Venezuelan Spanish, Argentinian Spanish, etc. 
There are other examples.

> 3-Terminology: In the common terminology of ISO 3166 and ISO 639, a 
> code is a table making a link between on one side a list of entries 
> (Country names, Language names) and a corresponding list of code 
> elements, built by use of a coding scheme defined by a syntactic 
> format (like alpha-2, alpha-3 or numeric-3) and maybe other rules 
> (like a visual association between the alphabetic code elements and 
> the corresponding entry names). So that "830" is a "code element" and 
> should not be considered as a "code".

This is a useful distinction which is lost on many English speakers who 
don't work with ISO standards.  The English term "code element" is 
unwieldy and it is extremely common for English speakers to speak of the 
individual elements as "codes."  French benefits by having the two very 
short and convenient words "code" and "codet."

> 4-Anyway, in my opinion, this text "E" could very well be suppressed.

Glad we agree.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ


From cewcathar@hotmail.com  Wed Feb 11 07:30:36 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF1523A6CF8 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:30:36 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.24
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.24 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.758,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_75=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iI+kfPzWcBwv for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:30:35 -0800 (PST)
Received: from blu0-omc3-s13.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s13.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.88]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9754A3A6CA3 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:30:35 -0800 (PST)
Received: from BLU109-W21 ([65.55.116.72]) by blu0-omc3-s13.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:30:40 -0800
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_54ca115d-f2a9-457e-a838-e745cd68bce9_"
X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11]
From: CE Whitehead 
To: 
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 10:30:39 -0500
Importance: Normal
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2009 15:30:40.0223 (UTC) FILETIME=[B1F4D6F0:01C98C5D]
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 15:30:37 -0000

--_54ca115d-f2a9-457e-a838-e745cd68bce9_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Hi=2C all.  I am sorry I could not do a better job of revising this sentenc=
e.  But I'll try one more time.
=20
> From: "Randy Presuhn" =20
> To: =20
> Date: Tue=2C 10 Feb 2009 16:36:13 -0800=20
>> From: "Phillips=2C Addison" >> To: "Randy Presuhn=
" =3B >> Sent: Tuesday=
=2C February 10=2C 2009 3:50 PM>> Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue #9: record orde=
ring instructions...>> If we really must make such a minor edit=2C I would =
propose:>> -->> IANA will extract the record from the form and place the in=
serted or modified record into the appropriate section of the languagesubta=
g registry=2C grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted records =
can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section=3Bthere is no guarant=
ee that the registry's records are in any particular order other than their=
 being grouped together by 'Type'.Modified records overwrite the record the=
y replace.> -->>> This would make clear that it is the registry's overall r=
ecords (not just the >>inserted records) are meant=3B that there is noguara=
ntee about ordering=3B and that the Type groupings is what was meant by "ap=
propriate section".>
Addison this is very clear=3B however you are right=3B 'correct English gra=
mmar' tends to be a bit Latinate (& that is exactly what the use of the ger=
und "grouping" is here).  I do agree with Randy that there is a need for a =
fix.   Addison's rewrite is more informative=2C but Randy's rewrite gave me=
 an idea about what to do with "grouping."=20
=20
What about the following text (I dispensed with the gerund & used a simple =
passive verb)?:
=20
"IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or modif=
ied record into the appropriate section of the languagesubtag registry=2C g=
rouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted records can be placed a=
nywhere within the appropriate section=3Bthere is no guarantee that the reg=
istry's records will be placed in any particular order except that they wil=
l always be grouped by 'Type.'Modified records overwrite the record they re=
place."
=20
=20
{The above is wordy but explicit=3B I don't normally go for the passive but=
 it's o.k. sometimes=3B here it's not being used to get around to say who i=
s doing something=2C but rather to place the focus on the records--which is=
 o.k. One more alternative that is a bit shorter:
=20
IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or modifi=
ed record into the appropriate section of the languagesubtag registry=2C gr=
ouping the records by their 'Type' field.  Otherwise the records will not b=
e arranged in any particular order:  inserted records can be placed anywher=
e within the appropriate section (that is with other records of the same 'T=
ype').Modified records overwrite the record they replace."
}
=20
=20
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com=20
=20
>> I still propose that we not make this edit=2C since it really isn't nece=
ssary....> Addison's proposed text is also ok with me.  Although I understa=
nd thegrammatical problem with the existing text=2C I=2C too=2C am not full=
yconvinced that there is a *need* for a fix.  This is the kind ofproblem th=
at most native speakers would probably not even noticein spoken English=2C =
and would catch in written material only uponvery careful examination.  My =
reason for posting was to make surethat Edith's original comment was addres=
sed=2C and not just myside-remark.Randy=

--_54ca115d-f2a9-457e-a838-e745cd68bce9_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







Hi=2C all. =3B I am sorry I could not do a better job of revising t=
his sentence. =3B But I'll try one more time.


 =3B

>=3B From: "Randy Presuhn" <=3Brandy_presuhn at mindspring.com>=3B 

>=3B To: <=3Bltru at ietf.org=
>=3B 

>=3B Date: Tue=2C 10 Feb 2009 16:36:13 -0800 


>=3B>=3B From: "Phillips=2C Addison" <=3Baddison at amazon.com>=
=3B
>=3B>=3B To: "Randy Presuhn" <=3Brandy_presuhn at mindspring.c=
om>=3B=3B <=3Bltru at ietf.org>=3B
>=3B>=3B Sent: Tuesday=2C F=
ebruary 10=2C 2009 3:50 PM
>=3B>=3B Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue #9: re=
cord ordering instructions
...
>=3B>=3B If we really must make su=
ch a minor edit=2C I would propose:
>=3B
>=3B --
>=3B>=3B =
IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or modifi=
ed record into the appropriate section of the language
subtag registry=
=2C grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted records can be pla=
ced anywhere within the appropriate section=3B
there is no guarantee tha=
t the registry's records are in any particular order other than their being=
 grouped together by 'Type'.
Modified records overwrite the record they =
replace.
>=3B --
>=3B
>=3B>=3B This would make clear that =
it is the registry's overall records (not just the >=3B>=3Binserted rec=
ords) are meant=3B that there is no
guarantee about ordering=3B and that=
 the Type groupings is what was meant by "appropriate section".
>=3B
Addison this is very clear=3B however =3Byou are right=3B 'correct Engl=
ish grammar' tends to be a bit Latinate (&=3B that is exactly what =
=3Bthe use of the =3Bgerund "grouping" is =3Bhere). =3B I do&nb=
sp=3Bagree with Randy that there is a need for a fix. =3B =3B Addis=
on's rewrite is more informative=2C but Randy's rewrite gave me an idea abo=
ut what to do with "grouping." =3B

 =3B

What about the following text (I dispensed with the gerund &=3B used a s=
imple passive verb)?:

 =3B

"IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or modif=
ied record into the appropriate section of the language
subtag registry=
=2C grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted records can be pla=
ced anywhere within the appropriate section=3B
there is no guarantee tha=
t the registry's records =3Bwill be =3Bplaced =3Bin any particu=
lar order =3Bexcept that they =3Bwill always be grouped =3Bby '=
Type.'
Modified records overwrite the record they replace."

 =3B

 =3B

{The above =3Bis wordy but explicit=3B I don't normally go for the pass=
ive but it's o.k. sometimes=3B =3Bhere it's not being used to get aroun=
d to say who is doing something=2C but rather to place the focus on the rec=
ords--which is o.k. =3BOne more alternative that is a bit =3Bshorte=
r:

 =3B

IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or modifi=
ed record into the appropriate section of the language
subtag registry=
=2C grouping the records by their 'Type' field. =3B Otherwise the recor=
ds will not be =3Barranged in any particular order:  =3Binserted re=
cords can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section (that is with o=
ther records of the same 'Type').
Modified records overwrite the record =
they replace."

}

 =3B

 =3B

--C. E. Whitehead

cewcathar@hotmail.com 


 =3B


>=3B>=3B I still propose that we not make this edit=2C since it rea=
lly isn't necessary.
...

>=3B Addison's proposed text is also o=
k with me. =3B Although I understand the
grammatical problem with th=
e existing text=2C I=2C too=2C am not fully
convinced that there is a *n=
eed* for a fix. =3B This is the kind of
problem that most native spe=
akers would probably not even notice
in spoken English=2C and would catc=
h in written material only upon
very careful examination. =3B My rea=
son for posting was to make sure
that Edith's original comment was addre=
ssed=2C and not just my
side-remark.

Randy



=

--_54ca115d-f2a9-457e-a838-e745cd68bce9_--

From cewcathar@hotmail.com  Wed Feb 11 07:37:27 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 961A53A6D0B for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:37:27 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -0.28
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.28 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.282,  BAYES_50=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DrO0K1LYNDeC for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:37:27 -0800 (PST)
Received: from blu0-omc3-s28.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s28.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.103]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8DD93A6D0C for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:37:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from BLU109-W31 ([65.55.116.72]) by blu0-omc3-s28.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Wed, 11 Feb 2009 07:37:31 -0800
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_15a50914-c51d-4c66-9912-97134fb5adf1_"
X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11]
From: CE Whitehead 
To: 
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 10:37:31 -0500
Importance: Normal
In-Reply-To: 
References: 
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 11 Feb 2009 15:37:31.0533 (UTC) FILETIME=[A71DC3D0:01C98C5E]
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 15:37:27 -0000

--_15a50914-c51d-4c66-9912-97134fb5adf1_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Hi=2C I agree with Randy and Doug that the text should read "different from=
"(it's probably my U.S. dialect). Thanks=2C C. E. Whiteheadcewcathar@hotmai=
l.com =

--_15a50914-c51d-4c66-9912-97134fb5adf1_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable








Hi=2C I agree with Randy and Doug that the text should read "differ=
ent from"

(it's probably my U.S. dialect).

 =3B

Th=
anks=2C

 =3B

C. E. Whitehead

cewcathar@hotmail.com 





=

--_15a50914-c51d-4c66-9912-97134fb5adf1_--

From cewcathar@hotmail.com  Wed Feb 11 17:25:03 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 471BF3A6358 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:25:03 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.109
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.109 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-1.11, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lNFOS3gK16Vg for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:25:02 -0800 (PST)
Received: from blu0-omc3-s15.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s15.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.90]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EE083A6953 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:25:02 -0800 (PST)
Received: from BLU109-W7 ([65.55.116.72]) by blu0-omc3-s15.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:25:07 -0800
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_70b3288b-f269-41bf-b6cf-03734624bd1b_"
X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11]
From: CE Whitehead 
To: 
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 20:25:06 -0500
Importance: Normal
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2009 01:25:07.0098 (UTC) FILETIME=[BD120FA0:01C98CB0]
Subject: Re: [Ltru] [LTRU]Preferred-Value for YU
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 01:25:03 -0000

--_70b3288b-f269-41bf-b6cf-03734624bd1b_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Hi!Just a quick question=3B I did not see an issue number assigned for "[LT=
RU]Preferred-Value for YU?" (Addison & some others were concerned about whe=
ther the keyword "MAY" made sense in this particular usage??)  Is this issu=
e then resolved?  Or is it subsumbed under:=20
[Ltru] Issue #19: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT ?
=20
Thanks.
=20
(Hope this question makes sense at this time.  I guess this use of "MAY" ve=
rsus "can" could involve a "normative" and not just a strictly "editorial" =
change=3B however Randy logged just about everything else with an issue num=
ber . . . ??)
=20
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com
From: "Doug Ewell" =20
=20
Date: Sat=2C 7 Feb 2009 09:24:26 -0700 Re:  > Randy Presuhn  wrote:


>>> While I don't insist on changing any of this text at this phenomenally =
late date=2C the fact remains that "MAY" in the sense of "is allowed or per=
mitted to" is not the same as "may" in the sense of "could happen=2C or cou=
ld possibly result in."=20
>> True=2C but the statement that a change is permitted to impact others is=
=20
>> nonetheless true.=20
> Who's doing the permitting?
> In any case=2C as I said=2C I don't think it's something for which we nee=
d to hold up
> the IETF Last Call. I don't see any reason to hold up the IETF Last Call=
=2C since the
>  IETF is surely aware that the IPR boilerplate may have to be changed bef=
ore
>  publication anyway=2C but I suppose this group will find a reason to con=
tinue
> dragging its feet. =

--_70b3288b-f269-41bf-b6cf-03734624bd1b_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable






Hi!
Just a quick question=3B I did not see an issue number assigned for =
"[LTRU]Preferred-Value for YU?" (Addison &=3B some others were concerned=
 about whether =3Bthe keyword "MAY" made sense in this particular usage=
??) =3B Is =3Bthis issue then resolved? =3B Or is it subsumbed =
under: 

[Ltru] Issue #19: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT ?

 =3B

Thanks.

 =3B

(Hope this question makes sense at this time. =3B I guess this use of "=
MAY" versus "can" =3Bcould involve a "normative" and not just a strictl=
y "editorial" change=3B =3Bhowever Randy logged just about everything e=
lse with an issue number . . . ??)

 =3B

--C. E. Whitehead

cewcathar@hotmail.com

From: "Doug Ewell" <=3Bdou=
g at ewellic.org>=3B 

 =3B

Date: Sat=2C 7 Feb 2009 09:24:26 -0700 
Re: 
 =3B
>=
=3B Randy Presuhn <=3Brandy underscore presuhn at mindspring dot com>=
=3B wrote:



>=3B>=3B>=3B While I don't insist on changing any of this text at thi=
s phenomenally late date=2C the fact remains that "MAY" in the sense of "is=
 allowed or permitted to" is not the same as "may" in the sense of "could h=
appen=2C or could possibly result in." 


>=3B>=3B True=2C but the statement that a change is permitted to im=
pact others is 

>=3B>=3B nonetheless true. 

>=3B Who's doing the permitting?


>=3B In any case=2C as I said=2C I don't think it's something for whi=
ch we need to hold up

>=3B =3Bthe IETF Last Call. I don't see any reason to hold up the IET=
F Last Call=2C since the

>=3B  =3BIETF is surely aware that the IPR boilerplate may have to be=
 changed before

>=3B  =3Bpublication anyway=2C but I suppose this group will find a r=
eason to continue

>=3B =3Bdragging its feet. 


=

--_70b3288b-f269-41bf-b6cf-03734624bd1b_--

From doug@ewellic.org  Wed Feb 11 17:28:43 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 06F503A69EE for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:28:43 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: 0.002
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.002 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.001, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hwLw0l-gZK3t for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:28:42 -0800 (PST)
Received: from smtpauth03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.183]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 29F983A6358 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 17:28:42 -0800 (PST)
Received: (qmail 31658 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2009 01:28:47 -0000
Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth03.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.183) with ESMTP; 12 Feb 2009 01:28:46 -0000
Message-ID: <1E978B7D99AE46B99D4005142C9E4D39@DGBP7M81>
From: "Doug Ewell" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:26:24 -0700
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 01:28:43 -0000

CE Whitehead  wrote:

>> IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or 
>> modified record into the appropriate section of the language subtag 
>> registry, grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted 
>> records can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section; there 
>> is no guarantee that the registry's records are in any particular 
>> order other than their being grouped together by 'Type'. Modified 
>> records overwrite the record they replace.
>
> What about the following text (I dispensed with the gerund & used a 
> simple passive verb)?:
>
> "IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or 
> modified record into the appropriate section of the language subtag 
> registry, grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted records 
> can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section; there is no 
> guarantee that the registry's records will be placed in any particular 
> order except that they will always be grouped by 'Type.' Modified 
> records overwrite the record they replace."

I like this change; "except that" flows better than "other than."

> IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or 
> modified record into the appropriate section of the language subtag 
> registry, grouping the records by their 'Type' field.  Otherwise the 
> records will not be arranged in any particular order:  inserted 
> records can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section (that is 
> with other records of the same 'Type'). Modified records overwrite the 
> record they replace."

This is too much of a rewording, and the parenthetical phrase slowed me 
down, negating the benefit of fewer words.  Best to stick with the first 
rewording, if any.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Wed Feb 11 18:00:56 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A49A33A6999 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:00:56 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.999
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_24=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hmCAscrDxEqD for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:00:56 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBE913A67F6 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:00:55 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=suJtJXryiIIoNHtcVRkKfRFetlx+CBLbpUEP679k96YFnKG2ZLNM/wRfEcOtOVGl; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [69.3.144.118] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXQsu-0001Uc-GU for ltru@ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 21:01:00 -0500
Message-ID: <005c01c98cb5$ba186560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: 
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:00:47 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1738e360bc31b5ea86fd275769e6fa22d5d350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 69.3.144.118
Subject: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (Was Preferred-Value for YU)
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 02:00:56 -0000

Hi -

> From: "CE Whitehead" 
> To: 
> Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 5:25 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ltru] [LTRU]Preferred-Value for YU
>

> Hi!Just a quick question; I did not see an issue number assigned for
> "[LTRU]Preferred-Value for YU?" (Addison & some others were concerned
> about whether the keyword "MAY" made sense in this particular usage??)
>  Is this issue then resolved?  Or is it subsumbed under: 
> [Ltru] Issue #19: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT ?
...

As co-chair...

There were two issues in that thread.

One was whether it made sense to change the content of
a particular registry entry.  I believe the consensus was
that that was more properly left to ietf-languages@iana.org
Consequently I see no need to enter that in the issue tracker
at this time.

The second was whether there was a need to change the use of 2119
keywords in this passage:
   Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when
   proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer
   will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary
   changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure
   for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example:

   Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later
   changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferred-Value
   for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'.

I've created ticket #20 for this.  Re-scanning the thread didn't provide
me with obvious replacement text, (some have trouble with the MAY,
some have trouble with the MUST,  I think the text is tolerable as-is)
so someone who thinks there is a real problem here should supply
a specific proposal.

Randy


From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com  Wed Feb 11 18:06:54 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BBD703A69FB for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:06:54 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.369
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.369 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.630, BAYES_20=-0.74]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sMc48iF26NiK for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:06:54 -0800 (PST)
Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08BE63A67E9 for ; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:06:54 -0800 (PST)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=BxTpOSJj/iPFesMQC7MxE3lmkpkTh9YnxaLknYdiOckxxNCOY8AnA6SAFoqV2q3S; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP;
Received: from [69.3.144.118] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXQye-00057m-MQ for ltru@ietf.org; Wed, 11 Feb 2009 21:06:56 -0500
Message-ID: <006301c98cb6$90d3b5a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
From: "Randy Presuhn" 
To: "LTRU Working Group" 
References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Wed, 11 Feb 2009 18:06:48 -0800
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Priority: 3
X-MSMail-Priority: Normal
X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478
X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1735d16d9095088856fc2e05a74026bf17f350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c
X-Originating-IP: 69.3.144.118
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 02:06:54 -0000

Hi -

The issue list is at http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/1

Please review the list.  If you object to the editor's proposed
resolution for any issue, please speak up, identifying the
issue number in the subject line of your message.  As Martin
has already said, if we hear no objections, we will simply
follow the editor's proposed resolution.  At about 10:00 a.m.
Pacific time (about 16 hours from now) I will start closing
all the issues which have not received comment on the list,
as well as those issues on which we have reached a rough
consensus.

If we have omitted any open issue from the list, please speak
up NOW.  Please use a separate message with an appropriate
subject line for EACH issue.

Randy
as ltru co-chair


From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com  Thu Feb 12 06:35:45 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0750D3A6A08 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 06:35:45 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.376
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.376 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_24=0.6]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id RBlJhwMVDRZL for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 06:35:44 -0800 (PST)
Received: from el-out-1112.google.com (el-out-1112.google.com [209.85.162.178]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C68D53A6826 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 06:35:43 -0800 (PST)
Received: by el-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id r27so695016ele.13 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 06:35:48 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=RBfI0BaF/svq2iJvwEiE84zcQPgHyG4sgzkGLy+g/B8=; b=rTqvsfLJc6jph6xquAAHnRfxTypK9Ky8BnWbJPsNtlkqHB8ACbwqi1+I7sFFI2e+l8 XSOyBgM1gjT7a3yXHdxq+VvnsOA7/aCvExAjOocTiIKI+fF5r9pe+5Y5SfkttVzvrZzC FpHJi3UN24jlHdV/5W9/6w56eJihEYArphPsQ=
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=STG8baGfVhmbz5sRoei7zg6b25twxU9u0pMZvhrpLmEVO2rFpq7cLHZVDcraCaE4cQ zHUqhnFss/BHQR/IrZlBOavpqiRyTI77vFXTa0BHGBi+oaHSG400oSIEsvst2QE4nKgz x7SiY+ZfmeF//a67mx0h15yv4W+2Am9/mOU9Q=
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com
Received: by 10.142.134.20 with SMTP id h20mr481775wfd.342.1234449347665; Thu,  12 Feb 2009 06:35:47 -0800 (PST)
In-Reply-To: <005c01c98cb5$ba186560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
References:  <005c01c98cb5$ba186560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer>
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 06:35:47 -0800
X-Google-Sender-Auth: 24d18ef582233506
Message-ID: <30b660a20902120635w16a036c0t9a232fcbced7571b@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mark Davis 
To: Randy Presuhn 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd33226dc61360462b9a281
Cc: LTRU Working Group 
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (Was Preferred-Value for YU)
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 14:35:45 -0000

--000e0cd33226dc61360462b9a281
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I propose the following (I think basically what Addison had in mind)

  Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when
  proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer
  will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary
  changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure
  for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example:
=>
  Changes to one subtag can affect other subtags as well: when
 // MAY => can
  proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer
  MUST review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary
// will => MUST
  changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure
  for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example:

Mark


On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 18:00, Randy Presuhn
wrote:

> Hi -
>
> > From: "CE Whitehead" 
> > To: 
> > Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 5:25 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Ltru] [LTRU]Preferred-Value for YU
> >
>
> > Hi!Just a quick question; I did not see an issue number assigned for
> > "[LTRU]Preferred-Value for YU?" (Addison & some others were concerned
> > about whether the keyword "MAY" made sense in this particular usage??)
> >  Is this issue then resolved?  Or is it subsumbed under:
> > [Ltru] Issue #19: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT ?
> ...
>
> As co-chair...
>
> There were two issues in that thread.
>
> One was whether it made sense to change the content of
> a particular registry entry.  I believe the consensus was
> that that was more properly left to ietf-languages@iana.org
> Consequently I see no need to enter that in the issue tracker
> at this time.
>
> The second was whether there was a need to change the use of 2119
> keywords in this passage:
>   Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when
>   proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer
>   will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary
>   changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure
>   for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example:
>
>   Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY'. If 'YY' later
>   changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferred-Value
>   for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'.
>
> I've created ticket #20 for this.  Re-scanning the thread didn't provide
> me with obvious replacement text, (some have trouble with the MAY,
> some have trouble with the MUST,  I think the text is tolerable as-is)
> so someone who thinks there is a real problem here should supply
> a specific proposal.
>
> Randy
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ltru mailing list
> Ltru@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru
>

--000e0cd33226dc61360462b9a281
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

I propose the following (I think basically what Addison had in mind)
  Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when

   proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer

   will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary=


   changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure
   for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example=
:

=3D>
  Changes to one subtag can affect other subtags as well: w=
hen
 // MAY =3D> can

   proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer

   MUST review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary=

// will =3D> MUST

   changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure
   for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example=
:


Mark



On Wed, Feb 11, 2009 at 18:00, Randy Pre=
suhn <=
randy_presuhn@mindspring.com> wrote:

Hi -



> From: "CE Whitehead" <cewcathar@hotmail.com>

> To: <ltru@ietf.org>

> Sent: Wednesday, February 11, 2009 5:25 PM

> Subject: Re: [Ltru] [LTRU]Preferred-Value for YU

>



> Hi!Just a quick question; I did not see an issue number assigned for
> "[LTRU]Preferred-Value for YU?" (Addison & some others w=
ere concerned

> about whether the keyword "MAY" made sense in this particula=
r usage??)

>  Is this issue then resolved?  Or is it subsumbed under:

> [Ltru] Issue #19: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT ?

...



As co-chair...



There were two issues in that thread.



One was whether it made sense to change the content of

a particular registry entry.  I believe the consensus was

that that was more properly left to ietf-languages@iana.org

Consequently I see no need to enter that in the issue tracker

at this time.



The second was whether there was a need to change the use of 2119

keywords in this passage:

   Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when

   proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer

   will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary=


   changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure
   for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example=
:



   Suppose that subtag 'XX' has a Preferred-Value of 'YY&#=
39;. If 'YY' later

   changes to have a Preferred-Value of 'ZZ', then the Preferr=
ed-Value

   for 'XX' MUST also change to be 'ZZ'.



I've created ticket #20 for this.  Re-scanning the thread didn'=
;t provide

me with obvious replacement text, (some have trouble with the MAY,

some have trouble with the MUST,  I think the text is tolerable as-is)=


so someone who thinks there is a real problem here should supply

a specific proposal.



Randy



_______________________________________________

Ltru mailing list

Ltru@ietf.org

ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru





--000e0cd33226dc61360462b9a281--

From cewcathar@hotmail.com  Thu Feb 12 07:34:47 2009
Return-Path: 
X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B28053A67E4 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 07:34:47 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.854
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.854 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.744,  BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dMcWXwdFEmMq for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 07:34:46 -0800 (PST)
Received: from blu0-omc3-s28.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s28.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.103]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B68B3A67AD for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 07:34:46 -0800 (PST)
Received: from BLU109-W21 ([65.55.116.72]) by blu0-omc3-s28.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959);  Thu, 12 Feb 2009 07:34:51 -0800
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_0164b701-278c-402a-921a-447fa7a00524_"
X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11]
From: CE Whitehead 
To: 
Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 10:34:51 -0500
Importance: Normal
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2009 15:34:51.0995 (UTC) FILETIME=[726FF2B0:01C98D27]
Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions
X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list 
List-Unsubscribe: , 
List-Archive: 
List-Post: 
List-Help: 
List-Subscribe: , 
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:34:47 -0000

--_0164b701-278c-402a-921a-447fa7a00524_
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable


Hi.  I agree with Doug that "except that" does flow better than "other than=
" (plus this text gets rid of the gerund)=2C but Addison's rewrite is o.k. =
if that's what people want to go with.
Thanks.
=20
From: "Doug Ewell" =20
Date: Wed=2C 11 Feb 2009 18:26:24 -0700=20
 > CE Whitehead  wrote:
>>> IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or mo=
dified record into the appropriate section of the language subtag registry=
=2C grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted records can be pla=
ced anywhere within the appropriate section=3B there is no guarantee that t=
he registry's records are in any particular order other than their being gr=
ouped together by 'Type'. Modified records overwrite the record they replac=
e. >> What about the following text (I dispensed with the gerund & used a s=
imple passive verb)?:>> "IANA will extract the record from the form and pla=
ce the inserted or modified record into the appropriate section of the lang=
uage subtag registry=2C grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserte=
d records can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section=3B there is=
 no guarantee that the registry's records will be placed in any particular =
order except that they will always be grouped by 'Type.' Modified records o=
verwrite the record they replace." > I like this change=3B "except that" fl=
ows better than "other than."Agreed.
>> "IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or mo=
dified record into the appropriate section of the language subtag registry=
=2C grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Otherwise the records will =
not be arranged in any particular order: inserted records can be placed any=
where within the appropriate section (that is with other records of the sam=
e 'Type'). Modified records overwrite the record they replace."=20
> This is too much of a rewording=2C and the parenthetical phrase
> slowed me down=2C negating the benefit of fewer words. Best to stick
> with the first rewording=2C if any. O.k. on re-reading I tend to agree wi=
th Doug's judgement here.--C. E. Whiteheadcewcathar@hotmail.com
> Doug Ewell  *  Thornton=2C Colorado=2C USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14

--_0164b701-278c-402a-921a-447fa7a00524_
Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable







Hi.&n=
bsp=3B I agree with Doug that "except that" does flow better than "other th=
an" (plus this text gets rid of the gerund)=2C but Addison's rewrite is o.k=
. if that's what people want to go with.

Thanks.

 =3B

From: "Doug Ewell" <=3Bdoug at ewel=
lic.org>=3B 

Date: Wed=2C 11 Feb 2009 18:26:24 -0700 

 =3B
>=3B CE Whitehead <=3Bcewcathar =
at hotmail dot com>=3B wrote:
>=3B>=3B>=3B IANA will extract the record from the form and place=
 the inserted or modified record into the appropriate section of t=
he language subtag registry=2C grouping the records by their 'Type=
' field. Inserted records can be placed anywhere within the approp=
riate section=3B there is no guarantee that the registry's records=
 are in any particular order other than their being grouped togeth=
er by 'Type'. Modified records overwrite the record they replace. =

>=3B>=3B What about =
the following text (I dispensed with the gerund &=3B used a sim=
ple passive verb)?:
>=3B>=3B <=
/TT>"IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted =
or modified record into the appropriate section of the language su=
btag registry=2C grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inser=
ted records can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section=
=3B there is no guarantee that the registry's records will be plac=
ed in any particular order except that they will always be grouped=
 by 'Type.' Modified records overwrite the record they replace." <=
/TT>
>=3B I like this change=3B "except t=
hat" flows better than "other than."
Agreed.
>=3B>=3B "IANA will extract the record from the form and pla=
ce the inserted or modified record into the appropriate section of=
 the language subtag registry=2C grouping the records by their 'Ty=
pe' field. Otherwise the records will not be arranged in any parti=
cular order: inserted records can be placed anywhere within the ap=
propriate section (that is with other records of the same 'Type').=
 Modified records overwrite the record they replace." 
<=
PRE style=3D"MARGIN: 0em">

>=3B This is too much of a rewording=2C and the parenthetical phrase<=
/TT>

>=3B =3Bslowed me down=2C negating the benefit of fewer =
words. Best to stick

>=3B =3Bwith the first rewording=2C if any. 
O.k. on re-reading I tend to =
agree with Doug's judgement here.
--=
C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com
>=3B Doug Ewell  *  Thornton=2C Colorado=2C USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN =
#14
= --_0164b701-278c-402a-921a-447fa7a00524_-- From cewcathar@hotmail.com Thu Feb 12 07:50:18 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E94D3A6987 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 07:50:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.226 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.226 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.372, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4zaIo1evN0bU for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 07:50:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from blu0-omc3-s34.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s34.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.109]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 732FC3A6827 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 07:50:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from BLU109-W53 ([65.55.116.72]) by blu0-omc3-s34.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 12 Feb 2009 07:50:21 -0800 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_fe92e88a-48a9-4741-a9d7-df93303dbbf7_" X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11] From: CE Whitehead To: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 10:50:21 -0500 Importance: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 12 Feb 2009 15:50:21.0851 (UTC) FILETIME=[9CACB6B0:01C98D29] Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (Was Preferred-Value for YU) X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:50:18 -0000 --_fe92e88a-48a9-4741-a9d7-df93303dbbf7_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi=2C I like Mark's solution. Does changing "MAY" to "can" and "will" to "= MUST" consitute a normative change? Or just an editorial change? =20 (In any case=2C this is just a vote to say I like this proposed text=3B & n= ot to say whether or not the text should be changed at this point.) =20 Thanks. =20 Best=2C --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com From: Mark Davis =20 Cc: LTRU Working Group =20 Date: Thu=2C 12 Feb 2009 06:35:47 -0800=20 > I propose the following (I think basically what Addison had in mind) > C= hanges to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when proposing chan= ges to the registry=2C the Language Subtag Reviewer will review the regist= ry for such effects and propose the necessary changes using the process in= Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure for Subtags)=2C although anyone MAY r= equest such changes. For example: > =3D>> Changes to one subtag can affect other subtags as well: when> // M= AY =3D> can> proposing changes to the registry=2C the Language Subtag Revi= ewer> MUST review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary>= // will =3D> MUST> changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration= Procedure for Subtags)=2C although anyone MAY request such changes. For e= xample:> Mark= --_fe92e88a-48a9-4741-a9d7-df93303dbbf7_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi=2C =3BI like Mark's solution. =3B Does changi= ng "MAY" to "can" and "will" to "MUST" consitute a normative change? = =3B Or just an editorial change?

 =3B
(In any case=2C =3Bthis is just a vote to say I like this proposed text= =3B &=3B not to say whether or not the text should be changed at this po= int.)
 =3B
Thanks.
 =3B
Best=2C
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com
From: Mark Davis <=3Bmark at macchi= ato.com>=3B
Cc: LTRU Working Group <=3Bltru at = ietf.org>=3B
Date: Thu=2C 12 Feb 2009 06:35:47 -0800
>=3B I propose the following (I think basically what Addison had= in mind)

 =3B >=3B Changes to one subtag MAY affect other sub= tags as well: when
 =3B proposing changes to the registry=2C the Lan= guage Subtag Reviewer
 =3B will review the registry for such effects= and propose the necessary
 =3B changes using the process in Section= 3.5 (Registration Procedure
 =3B for Subtags)=2C although anyone MA= Y request such changes. For example:
>=3B =3D>=3B
>=3B =3B Changes to one subtag can affect other s= ubtags as well: when
>=3B =3B// MAY =3D>=3B can
>=3B = =3B proposing changes to the registry=2C the Language Subtag Reviewer
&g= t=3B =3B MUST review the registry for such effects and propose the nece= ssary
>=3B // will =3D>=3B MUST
>=3B =3B changes using the = process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure
 =3B for Subtags)=2C = although anyone MAY request such changes. For example:

&= gt=3B Mark

= --_fe92e88a-48a9-4741-a9d7-df93303dbbf7_-- From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 11:50:24 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D60853A6A0A for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:50:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.984 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.984 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.615, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8Fpw7GxTZ9HO for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:50:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 709F23A699F for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:50:23 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=YpVTwerVl1fkVAPeMgI70k4B7poDfeZLgYPqhdMh2mu1acbG6RmW9NX2BnWFm7Gb; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXhZs-0001k1-Mf for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 14:50:29 -0500 Message-ID: <008801c98d4b$24986300$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <005c01c98cb5$ba186560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <30b660a20902120635w16a036c0t9a232fcbced7571b@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:50:22 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1736e59156108c0468e6e687520caddf4ce350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (Was Preferred-Value for YU) X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:50:24 -0000 Hi - > From: "Mark Davis" > To: "Randy Presuhn" > Cc: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 6:35 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (Was Preferred-Value for YU) > > I propose the following (I think basically what Addison had in mind) > > Changes to one subtag MAY affect other subtags as well: when > proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer > will review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary > changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure > for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: > => > Changes to one subtag can affect other subtags as well: when > // MAY => can > proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer > MUST review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary > // will => MUST > changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure > for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: ... As a technical contributor: I could live with this. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 11:54:17 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED6553A6B71 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:54:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.189 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.189 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.410, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ndm5baEYkSRT for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:54:17 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F4EE3A685B for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:54:17 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=BaHyJynAZD8HKsE3sEwboOl2Z9fF13ryVGpdLAnSlFoliaZPgi6saePrlSWbFuZf; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXhde-0001K2-Lp for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 14:54:22 -0500 Message-ID: <00b101c98d4b$b187cb20$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 11:54:18 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1733bbd4cbba691b453bcaaa79beb005aa8350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (Was Preferred-Value for YU) X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 19:54:18 -0000 Hi - > From: "CE Whitehead" > To: > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 7:50 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (Was Preferred-Value for YU) > > Hi, I like Mark's solution. Does changing "MAY" to "can" > and "will" to "MUST" consitute a normative change? > Or just an editorial change? ... In this case I can't imagine how the change makes any normative difference whatsoever. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:04:22 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 688353A68E4 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:04:22 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.292 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.292 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.307, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5rHTPLsioz8S for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:04:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF6FF28C13B for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:04:04 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=K1H81XX40Rc0cGg72hidcyTViKXuOvGC03uSup8+jERi7DghS2kQRlSuSNEQFKGp; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXhn8-0002Y2-KI for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:04:10 -0500 Message-ID: <00c001c98d4d$0fe47b40$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DB@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <008e01c98bc7$1148b460$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:04:06 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173afac37d1602605d8816809127fdc251b350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #1: change ref from 2434 to 5226 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:04:22 -0000 Hi - As co-chair: Seeing no further comment, we'll accept the editor's proposed resolution. I've closed this report. To see all reports, including closed ones, use: http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/6 Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:05:01 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2630A28C152 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:05:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.292 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.292 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.307, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y4r74HfevDfg for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:05:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F38F328C13B for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:05:00 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=hQE2XY8p8uiep1FoyndTyKU3OTnzfsXi+N4tBOgWntfaQ+3MBuVC8ScAJH5HK6rk; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXho2-000836-G5 for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:05:06 -0500 Message-ID: <00c501c98d4d$316b8ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DC@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <009301c98bc7$29371bc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:05:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1739cd4889c45fbd3c4ba808b5ba5ffed96350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #2: move 2860 ref to informative X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:05:01 -0000 Hi - As co-chair: Seeing no further comment, we'll accept the editor's proposed resolution. I've closed this report. To see all reports, including closed ones, use: http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/6 Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:08:57 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38BE83A6B26 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:08:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.353 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.353 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.246, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ju97YpLk-WdM for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:08:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34DB83A6ABA for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:08:56 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Up7GaZJEfVcF7BqicSI2pNH0jAFQlYlN7fRKibREgE34W1wJcX1sakNwt7jYfmEa; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXhrn-0001md-Kn for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:08:59 -0500 Message-ID: <00ce01c98d4d$bc5bc9a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DD@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <009801c98bc7$45888f20$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:08:56 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173da12f8914d381ae01583d13f314c3fdb350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #3: move RFC 4645 reference to informative X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:08:57 -0000 Hi - As co-chair: Seeing no further comment, we'll accept the resolution discussed on the mailing list: > > For historical reasons, the UN numeric code 830 (Channel Islands), which was not registered at > > the time this document was adopted and had, at that time, no corresponding ISO 3166-1 code, > > MAY be entered into the IANA registry via the process described in Section 3.5, provided no > > ISO 3166-1 code with that exact meaning has been previously registered. "For historical reasons" may be omitted at the editor's discretion. I've updated the status to "closed". To see all reports, including closed ones, use: http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/6 Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:14:14 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B23A63A6BBA for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:14:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.394 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.394 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.205, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id do2NIpew8Azk for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:14:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24B003A6B78 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:14:09 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=YuDvflu+qjcsWoeefhNq4Wt4fjQRZJRVvrNamIe0Tj2kDdhjwB3GRmL1WGYd2Vrz; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXhws-0000e1-M2 for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:14:14 -0500 Message-ID: <00f301c98d4e$7813d160$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:14:10 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173f6190142c116c6a420106e5f61caaa84350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:14:14 -0000 Hi - We seem to have agreement to use "different from", so I've marked this issue "closed". Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:17:26 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D3463A6BA7 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:17:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.679 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.679 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.569, BAYES_05=-1.11] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CdmdGLRBJyMs for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:17:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 549073A6B94 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:17:25 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=pKEZhibGCmfKSHKNhLafSTSaaoP7Ojez2pOjm8ax7Be6YeGmRuOCW88R/M7EbZ7T; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXi02-0005RR-Sk for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:17:31 -0500 Message-ID: <00fa01c98d4e$ed2721a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <009d01c98bc7$679d88e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:17:27 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173292c44cd1c9737e292c781a433780162350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #5: change "apply" X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:17:26 -0000 Hi - There was no consensus to make a change, so we'll go with the editor's proposal to make no change here. I've closed this issue. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:19:32 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8240128C16E for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:19:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.352 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.352 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.247, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id owVp0GloFWke for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:19:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CF99528C0DE for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:19:31 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=NZ/ejh+bAnpfK/H5beX3Il51C2tvUWaqwG86IhtHddstD9+Esr/PfOPtKcd9sqZ/; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXi24-0001q4-IJ for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:19:37 -0500 Message-ID: <010101c98d4f$38167b20$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E1@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <00a201c98bc7$89663760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:19:32 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173b877c3b25a166d6e2ed75c013c85eb04350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #6: change "the ones" X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:19:32 -0000 Hi - Seeing no comment, we'll go with the editor's proposed resolution of "no change" for this issue. I've marked it "closed". Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:21:30 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD4DB28C12B for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:21:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.38 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.38 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.219, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fd4zC0CfDgoB for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:21:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0193228C218 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:21:29 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=AYlft/PDQmDXZz4NcT1wH2tTEfOdARxOWsEmISEjYi5N0+EDh/7GiMyndNhZJ7no; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXi3z-0001dg-Hj for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:21:35 -0500 Message-ID: <010801c98d4f$7eef13e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <00f301c98bcc$d44d6140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:21:32 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1738da6a06187d5f4baa536ca77c1bd35f6350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #7: change "if when" X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:21:30 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion, we'll accept the editor's proposed resolution. I've marked this issue closed. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:23:29 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E4BD28C12B for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:23:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.402 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.402 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.197, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uevQcs2YZ+7v for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:23:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 403E728C1A8 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:23:28 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=oFEjpKvHu/DzF3RbPz5gUzn6tidj6Q8pwmHWmbg8yc2O04D/5IQwu5U/RsZIvZ5G; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXi5r-0001zW-7f for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:23:31 -0500 Message-ID: <010d01c98d4f$c3f1b420$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E5@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <00fa01c98bcd$6145f120$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:23:27 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1734ccdc79737b75fb126757c4bb2d08336350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #8: "language priority list" X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:23:29 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further comment, we'll go with the editor's proposed resolution and remove the example. I've marked the issue "closed". Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:25:31 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D8A8728C12B for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:25:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.42 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.42 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.179, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zYzBVWmQ8SaD for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:25:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A4D23A6A5D for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:25:30 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=CqlKiBP/XiQDHJoQheFpVBa73KxEX52iTgdw2JURlvZpD/jjQV8CedOHgY5D6gQH; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXi7r-0008Mx-NK for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:25:35 -0500 Message-ID: <011201c98d50$0e1929c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817E8@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <010c01c98bcf$1f549da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:25:32 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173ec1767d3fbf7e733357223ee26991b36350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #10: truncation X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:25:31 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion of this issue, we'll go with the editor's proposed resolution of no change. I've closed the ticket. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:27:34 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 38F4928C13C for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:27:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.434 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.434 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.165, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5JI6VBqEAou0 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:27:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 83F2C28C21F for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:27:33 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Fee4ad9ASM0tp2zj+KxCKYRQt3H3E9ObEtNkLFnk6zw8P14Ldj5+nthTGe5gZ6ab; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXi9o-0008B6-U2 for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:27:37 -0500 Message-ID: <011901c98d50$5659de00$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817EB@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <011501c98bcf$b35edec0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:27:33 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17321ab8c620d701a1809591d0907e4b884350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #11: use of word "response" X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:27:34 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion, we'll go with the editor's proposed resolution of "no change". I've closed this ticket. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:29:23 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DBD4F3A6AEC for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:29:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.447 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.447 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.152, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uIf3C3VtFlZ5 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:29:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 287F53A6A5D for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:29:23 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=F5wTdGXP5DIa/nKFkOYggPrTcJgZ3Y+aXlFn7N5hkFFPVNfHRPwcvUc9EmjrnCiK; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXiBc-0007lB-Pm; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:29:29 -0500 Message-ID: <011e01c98d50$98c64300$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "Randy Presuhn" , References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F0@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <011e01c98bd0$2879d020$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:29:24 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731e7e26ea4c8994b69f51df2d5e0f0e21350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #12: primary language SHOULD X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:29:23 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion, we'll go with the editor's recommended resolution of "no change". I've marked this ticket "closed". Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:33:12 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4240128C246 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:33:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.458 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.458 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.141, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TL94THT20O82 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:33:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7135428C242 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:33:11 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=ZByIw+DXaaOVLNQ2PXxbQi5Q1oHnMPzOzGwpk412BSsAogodxRFs+Y/gRTjulvvn; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXiFI-0007c0-Ah for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:33:17 -0500 Message-ID: <012501c98d51$209b8420$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817EF@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <012701c98bd0$a87b96a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:33:12 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173ba1da225dcd46dea7910b92e425c613f350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #13: "two authorities" X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:33:12 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion, we'll go with the editor's proposed resolution of "no change". I've closed this report. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:34:37 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B81FC3A69C5 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:34:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.467 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.467 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.132, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BwgOJ2BBRnXN for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:34:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F34B53A69BB for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:34:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=lX/QlxPYUu1Q6xQyxi6wVMMAeJn0cG61clcWn8+t4W6uoWPSicV8TA/DnxRnB5JK; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXiGg-0004S2-Ej for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:34:42 -0500 Message-ID: <012a01c98d51$540a5340$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F1@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <012e01c98bd1$39156920$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:34:38 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173825713e41b0639623a75cad05ed1204c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #14: change "follow" to "consult" X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:34:37 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion, we'll go with the editor's proposed resolution of "no change". I've closed this report. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:36:15 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 340E83A6BCD for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:36:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.476 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.476 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.123, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mMV8zxFhnKnh for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:36:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 67C0A3A6BC6 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:36:14 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=uH6ap0QK5H5X+75BQ0wcC0oGv2MkvuTeIZlv2tfxAun8KnGKzJdox5UqqKinjC32; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXiIG-0000ei-1Q for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:36:20 -0500 Message-ID: <012f01c98d51$8e2f4620$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <013e01c98bd2$a6bd8100$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:36:16 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173872f32c18d47c1e2de435114645cc17e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #15: uz-Zxxx example X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:36:15 -0000 Hi - Seeing no discussion, we'll go with the editor's proposed resolution of "no change". I've marked this ticket "closed". Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:38:16 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EA3728C246 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:38:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.483 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.483 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.116, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3AOLaCGm0s0F for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:38:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5353D3A6BD2 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:38:12 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=kzC0UnLkdkCA5KcxuFklqAAVX5wnjR7mpN8aNOczlAZh28juoeX8B8S/isFJviRt; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXiK7-0005gF-Mq for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:38:16 -0500 Message-ID: <013401c98d51$d328bea0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F4@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <014501c98bd3$0d1c7960$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:38:12 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17342795854463fca458e54b813c3fbd46f350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #16: Romanian/Modolvan example X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:38:16 -0000 Hi - Resolution: no change. I've closed this ticket. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:39:56 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E52903A6AF2 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:39:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.489 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.489 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.110, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nJrEMf2o7pjY for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:39:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9AE13A6BD0 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:39:48 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=kb4vw0GxsfoSVe3S8yB2bJJ1vLYkXkFfJvz/NWNleDR3cBDC4zwV/kVA+cDEYA0S; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXiLi-0007P5-Dw for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:39:54 -0500 Message-ID: <013901c98d52$0dfd2b60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F6@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <015101c98bd3$ce4bbc40$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:39:50 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731a56fa99d62dc5f803f23bd90d121a4b350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #17: relationship guarantee X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:39:57 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion of this issue, I've marked it "closed" following the editor's recommendation of "no change". Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:41:14 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A846C3A69C5 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:41:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.495 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.495 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.104, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 65lonCPAqZNS for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:41:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDFB43A695C for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:41:13 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=s0XgUPr0er02jhZcUFD8qej01K+SHfFmnZwEbvzTiclxsmu3XKSo9CQ8JTRJPXN5; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXiN5-0001q0-IS for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:41:19 -0500 Message-ID: <013e01c98d52$40bc80a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com><003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F9@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <016301c98bd4$a7f13420$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:41:16 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17363bb85105e8316c2282c63aa768ae664350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #19: SHALL NOT vs. MUST NOT X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:41:14 -0000 Hi - I've closed this ticket. No action needed. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 12 12:45:04 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5FF4F3A68D2 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:45:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.099, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5doAnzFwNLDn for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:45:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6230A3A6BDA for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:45:03 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=kIaKd1HZmBbk93I+ODcwDewEm9TaAt4zsC5zgkG4hS6LBfLpjQqRQa/GNDwqDiz6; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.166] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXiQm-0007F4-VA for ltru@ietf.org; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 15:45:09 -0500 Message-ID: <014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 12:45:05 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173187a5eebe01d673b96389f4b9b068999350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.166 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 20:45:04 -0000 Hi - At this time only three issues remain open: #9, #18, and #20. http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/1 Please say what you need to say about any of these - I'll sort through and hopefully close them in about 20 hours. (09:00 pacific time Friday morning). Randy From doug@ewellic.org Thu Feb 12 21:05:55 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 478A53A6D47 for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 21:05:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.298 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.298 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5nJ5rvkc-riO for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 21:05:54 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.181]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 02B8B3A6B5B for ; Thu, 12 Feb 2009 21:05:53 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 30516 invoked from network); 13 Feb 2009 05:06:00 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.181) with ESMTP; 13 Feb 2009 05:05:59 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Thu, 12 Feb 2009 22:05:57 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: [Ltru] Another draft-4645bis needed X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 05:05:55 -0000 As it turns out, there will have to be a draft-4645bis-10 after all, for two reasons: (1) Even though I amended the text to include "International Sign" among the sign languages that are extlangs, I somehow managed to omit it from the Registry contents. (2) I had already made the change to region subtag YU to remove the Preferred-Value of CS and add John Cowan's comment, before Randy started using the issue tracker and making decisions. Randy says this is a matter for ietf-languages and not this list. Since 4646 doesn't permit Preferred-Values to be changed, I suppose it will just have to wait until 4646bis and the new Registry are published, and then be proposed on ietf-languages. In the meantime, I need to revert these changes in draft-4645bis. Additionally, ISO 639-3 has once again updated their data files, for the second time since the big annual update on January 20. Draft-4645bis doesn't have to be updated every time this happens, but as long as another revision is already needed, I may as well update the references. I don't know how many more 639-3 changes will come between now and draft publication; I imagine there will be quite a few. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 01:10:29 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F0EC83A6B70; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:10:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E9aixMDtVQvA; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:10:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C79C13A6AD2; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:10:28 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=JENpMo5x2DZKU/hT8OHde7O023SXCzohAf3qy/IoDxslZifsFuZZ7Pp11b3pd+DQ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.136.32] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXu4A-0001FE-DL; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:10:34 -0500 Message-ID: <00dc01c98dba$ed017920$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:10:32 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1732db42331c7c843cf8f6e41625930207d350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.136.32 Cc: agentx@ietf.org, Disman Subject: [Ltru] Fw: Last Call for Comments: Proposed work-around to the Pre-5378 Problem X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:10:30 -0000 Hi - Forwarded for your edification and enjoyment. Editors, note the effective date as well. Randy ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Ed Juskevicius" > To: ; ; ; ; ; > Cc: "Trustees" ; "Contreras,Jorge" > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 4:53 PM > Subject: Re: Last Call for Comments: Proposed work-around to the Pre-5378 Problem > > I am pleased to announce that the IETF Trustees have just finished work on a > revision to our "Legal Provisions Relating to IETF Documents" policy. The > revision includes optional new legend text in Section 6.c.iii of the > policy to serve as a work-around for people experiencing the "pre-5378 > problem." > > Please note the newly approved policy is dated 2009-02-12. Please also note > that the Effective Date of this revised policy has been set to 2009-02-15. > The old policy (effective from November 10, 2008) remains in force until > 00h00 UTC on February 15th. > > The approved text is available now on IETF Trust website at > http://trustee.ietf.org/policyandprocedures.html > > Please look for the document dated 2009-02-12, just below the heading > labeled "DRAFT Policy and Procedures Being Developed." > > On or shortly after February 15th, the Trust website will be updated so as > to archive all of the recent draft versions of the new policy, and to make > it easier to navigagte to the newly approved policy. > > Please review the new policy so you are aware of the latest copyright > statements and other boilerplate legend text that will be required on > all contributions to the IETF starting on February 15, 2009. > > Regards, and Thanks in advance, > > > Ed Juskevicius, on behalf of the IETF Trustees > edj.etc@gmail.com From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 01:20:24 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E8003A6AD2 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:20:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id NoVwwz8uZC2n for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:20:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6612E3A68E7 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:20:23 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=La+brYD5Sh7kn+1VOuomRFHpEWDxjBUVaK0349nE23/9z+HZAPhO+em3JPLwCIUg; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.136.32] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXuDl-0006vp-Qx for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:20:30 -0500 Message-ID: <00e301c98dbc$4f4d3dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:20:26 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173a7c10fc25ddb5fe7ad2e024107b84812350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.136.32 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #21: add "International Sign" to registry content X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:20:24 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 9:05 PM > Subject: [Ltru] Another draft-4645bis needed ... > (1) Even though I amended the text to include "International Sign" among > the sign languages that are extlangs, I somehow managed to omit it from > the Registry contents. ... This has been added as issue #21. The proposed resolution is to add the missing entry. I assume this will be utterly non-controversial. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 01:21:41 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AEB723A69B3 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:21:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id gCA1+lso0RlB for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:21:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0513A3A68E7 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:21:41 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=M+dYzzeNVBmkLuf2vZPw1Ra4M+E3ItoIIcqbtmMwprGQa8taup88jo57U2g4udBi; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.136.32] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXuF0-00075L-Um for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:21:47 -0500 Message-ID: <00e801c98dbc$7e3f1040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:21:45 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731166d2dc205f940aef53f1fb3af0b14a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.136.32 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:21:41 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 9:05 PM > Subject: [Ltru] Another draft-4645bis needed ... > (2) I had already made the change to region subtag YU to remove the > Preferred-Value of CS and add John Cowan's comment, before Randy started > using the issue tracker and making decisions. Randy says this is a > matter for ietf-languages and not this list. Since 4646 doesn't permit > Preferred-Values to be changed, I suppose it will just have to wait > until 4646bis and the new Registry are published, and then be proposed > on ietf-languages. In the meantime, I need to revert these changes in > draft-4645bis. ... I've added this as issue #22. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 01:24:30 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DE413A6C53 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:24:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bIR-qEhzQCYC for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:24:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BEBE93A69B3 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:24:22 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=BbPFpI6ouzQ/kvyE6bl6gQDyDU3zyoDm78nNL0eU8VA9saathGfRJqRV46nKXztI; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.137.208] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXuHa-0002oq-MA for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:24:26 -0500 Message-ID: <00ed01c98dbc$dd7266c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:22:45 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17345cce292df4bdb043adffca38ab29d3e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.137.208 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #23: incorporate 639-3 updates as of 2009-02-13 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:24:30 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 9:05 PM > Subject: [Ltru] Another draft-4645bis needed ... > Additionally, ISO 639-3 has once again updated their data files, for the > second time since the big annual update on January 20. Draft-4645bis > doesn't have to be updated every time this happens, but as long as > another revision is already needed, I may as well update the references. > I don't know how many more 639-3 changes will come between now and draft > publication; I imagine there will be quite a few. ... I've added this as issue #23. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 01:28:08 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B9923A6D3E for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:28:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vtesTFShwMRt for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:28:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A5CE3A68E7 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:28:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=I4YiBn0H3CIGP9+K2ozURD98egmv1EUZycVS6Lxh+lEEHafdDQK6XtMtU2jv2Jbe; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.137.208] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LXuLF-0002VL-JZ for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:28:13 -0500 Message-ID: <00f201c98dbd$64b83920$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 01:28:12 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173b95b40cf74da1ed2beffdfbf1a375278350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.137.208 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Another draft-4645bis needed X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 09:28:08 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 9:05 PM > Subject: [Ltru] Another draft-4645bis needed > > As it turns out, there will have to be a draft-4645bis-10 after all, for > two reasons: ... I've created three tickets for these issues. In my judgement as co-chair, these should all be rather non-controversial, so let's put them on a short timer: unless controversy erupts, I'll be closing these early Saturday morning (Feb. 14) California time. Randy From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Fri Feb 13 04:27:35 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5AF203A6877 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:27:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TJMx-28d-LKA for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:27:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 72A113A67CC for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 04:27:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33390 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LXx8s-00039O-3G for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 13:27:39 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 13:27:29 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS Thread-Index: AcmN1m+AnPipRiSQu0yy1DwLxwVj5A== In-Reply-To: <00e801c98dbc$7e3f1040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LXx8s-00039O-3G. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1LXx8s-00039O-3G b48b7c4ac4ff1bae36860e32366faa85 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 12:27:35 -0000 I would prefer not to revert this particular change (and I guess you mean "preferred-value for YU"). Doing so would go against the principle of shortcutting preferred-value chains, with the idea that a preferred value should always be a non-deprecated value. The added comment (for YU) is fine as it is in draft 9, and better than in this case a misleading Preferred-value. /kent k Den 2009-02-13 10.21, skrev "Randy Presuhn" : > Hi - > >> From: "Doug Ewell" >> To: "LTRU Working Group" >> Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 9:05 PM >> Subject: [Ltru] Another draft-4645bis needed > ... >> (2) I had already made the change to region subtag YU to remove the >> Preferred-Value of CS and add John Cowan's comment, before Randy started >> using the issue tracker and making decisions. Randy says this is a >> matter for ietf-languages and not this list. Since 4646 doesn't permit >> Preferred-Values to be changed, I suppose it will just have to wait >> until 4646bis and the new Registry are published, and then be proposed >> on ietf-languages. In the meantime, I need to revert these changes in >> draft-4645bis. > ... > > I've added this as issue #22. > > Randy > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 11:22:08 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AFB643A68F0 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:22:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hh9XXNoB6W2P for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:22:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E38A13A68BB for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:22:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=JiRxw97ensny4FiioQhN82y4NN9JyeU1Le6+IbURBj8ScqYOo9CjfZwQPr0xmQ+Q; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.11] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LY3c6-0003Vv-3V for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 14:22:14 -0500 Message-ID: <002301c98e10$5e46f7e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <00dc01c98dba$ed017920$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <30b660a20902130835x4b13edf5qcacfa85c83e0fa61@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:22:08 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173f69e40838d28ac5d36c4997940f14ab1350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.11 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Fw: Last Call for Comments: Proposed work-around to the Pre-5378 Problem X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:22:08 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... I'm putting my response to Mark's off-list question on the WG mailing list, since I think it's important to have a public record. > From: "Mark Davis" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "Phillips, Addison" ; "Doug Ewell" > Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 8:35 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Fw: Last Call for Comments: Proposed work-around to the Pre-5378 Problem > > So now that the dust has settled, what do I as an author have to do > regarding the IP statement? ... In my opinion, the "interesting" part for this working group starts at 5.c in http://trustee.ietf.org/docs/IETF-Trust-Legal-Provisions-Clean-2-12-09.pdf (bottom of page 4). If I were editing one of these documents, I would include the legend 6.c.iii along with the required legends. I don't know whether xml2rfc has been or will be updated to include an option to automatically include this incantation. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 11:28:14 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6683A3A67DD for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:28:14 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cOgIjqc7EfD3 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:28:13 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9C143A68BB for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:28:13 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=aRXqibV4+F4+S5LsHouG8cj65KRd8ZYoAid9HOpNxX0mjU2wONC6xoDDFrZCaS1K; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.11] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LY3hx-00006J-VF for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 14:28:18 -0500 Message-ID: <003501c98e11$39084000$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <005c01c98cb5$ba186560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><30b660a20902120635w16a036c0t9a232fcbced7571b@mail.gmail.com> <008801c98d4b$24986300$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:28:16 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173f45b8fbf406e642cc9c3e3df0488b9f5350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.11 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (WasPreferred-Value for YU) X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:28:14 -0000 Hi - As co-chair - it looks like we're ok with the proposal to resolve this problem with the proposed replacement text: > Changes to one subtag can affect other subtags as well: when > // MAY => can > proposing changes to the registry, the Language Subtag Reviewer > MUST review the registry for such effects and propose the necessary > // will => MUST > changes using the process in Section 3.5 (Registration Procedure > for Subtags), although anyone MAY request such changes. For example: So, I'm marking this one "closed". Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 11:30:40 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E69973A67DD for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:30:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id v6audhYlv9dj for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:30:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4B0033A68BB for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:30:40 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=PndDqJcvx9aV+l+mC/kE6FpqyNFebINqyNJUWjGDMtD3GfZO4hW0V3zseZ4UfW7G; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.11] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LY3kM-0006xf-TL for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 14:30:47 -0500 Message-ID: <004501c98e11$91ebaea0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <43530.48611.qm@web58201.mail.re3.yahoo.com> <003701c988b8$a0dd7dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817F7@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <015a01c98bd4$48cea680$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <30b660a20902101509i24924345nff6b3e4a70e20e22@mail.gmail.com> <01ac01c98bd7$cd4d6240$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <30b660a20902101551s460044c7ubd1279741836661e@mail.gmail.com> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:30:46 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173489ae3abccc3088638be99112fe53340350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.11 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #18: reorganize 4.5 par 2 examples X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:30:41 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... Seeing no further comment, let's go with the editor's proposed resolution of "no change" for this item. I've marked it "closed". Randy From addison@amazon.com Fri Feb 13 11:31:48 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7A403A6A1E for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:31:48 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZjCY+yPpT77B for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:31:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB0843A6A00 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:31:47 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,203,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="221303961" Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 13 Feb 2009 19:31:52 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1DJVppk003200 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:31:51 GMT Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.23) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.340.0; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:31:51 -0800 Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:30:37 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:31:50 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (WasPreferred-Value for YU) Thread-Index: AcmOET2fyqxSSivgSV+rZ9zE1vgGIAAAGG2w Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA0181C83307@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <005c01c98cb5$ba186560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><30b660a20902120635w16a036c0t9a232fcbced7571b@mail.gmail.com> <008801c98d4b$24986300$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <003501c98e11$39084000$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <003501c98e11$39084000$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 20: 3.1.7 consequence 2119 language (WasPreferred-Value for YU) X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:31:48 -0000 KERPTkUpDQoNCk1vZGlmaWVkIHRleHQgcmVhZHM6DQoNCjx0PkNoYW5nZXMgdG8gb25lIHN1YnRh ZyBjYW4gYWZmZWN0IG90aGVyIHN1YnRhZ3MgYXMgd2VsbDogd2hlbiBwcm9wb3NpbmcgY2hhbmdl cyB0byB0aGUgcmVnaXN0cnksIHRoZSBMYW5ndWFnZSBTdWJ0YWcgUmV2aWV3ZXIgTVVTVCByZXZp ZXcgdGhlIHJlZ2lzdHJ5IGZvciBzdWNoIGVmZmVjdHMgYW5kIHByb3Bvc2UgdGhlIG5lY2Vzc2Fy eSBjaGFuZ2VzIHVzaW5nIHRoZSBwcm9jZXNzIGluIDx4cmVmIHRhcmdldD0icmVnaXN0cmF0aW9u UHJvYyI+PC94cmVmPiwgYWx0aG91Z2ggYW55b25lIE1BWSByZXF1ZXN0IHN1Y2ggY2hhbmdlcy4g Rm9yIGV4YW1wbGU6PGxpc3Q+DQoNCkFkZGlzb24NCg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFs aXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoNCkludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5v dCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRlY3R1cmUuDQoNCg0KPiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFs IE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21haWx0bzpsdHJ1 LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIE9uDQo+IEJlaGFsZiBPZiBSYW5keSBQcmVzdWhuDQo+IFNlbnQ6 IEZyaWRheSwgRmVicnVhcnkgMTMsIDIwMDkgMTE6MjggQU0NCj4gVG86IExUUlUgV29ya2luZyBH cm91cA0KPiBTdWJqZWN0OiBSZTogW0x0cnVdIElzc3VlIDIwOiAzLjEuNyBjb25zZXF1ZW5jZSAy MTE5IGxhbmd1YWdlDQo+IChXYXNQcmVmZXJyZWQtVmFsdWUgZm9yIFlVKQ0KPiANCj4gSGkgLQ0K PiANCj4gQXMgY28tY2hhaXIgLSBpdCBsb29rcyBsaWtlIHdlJ3JlIG9rIHdpdGggdGhlIHByb3Bv c2FsIHRvDQo+IHJlc29sdmUgdGhpcyBwcm9ibGVtIHdpdGggdGhlIHByb3Bvc2VkIHJlcGxhY2Vt ZW50IHRleHQ6DQo+IA0KPiA+ICAgQ2hhbmdlcyB0byBvbmUgc3VidGFnIGNhbiBhZmZlY3Qgb3Ro ZXIgc3VidGFncyBhcyB3ZWxsOiB3aGVuDQo+ID4gIC8vIE1BWSA9PiBjYW4NCj4gPiAgIHByb3Bv c2luZyBjaGFuZ2VzIHRvIHRoZSByZWdpc3RyeSwgdGhlIExhbmd1YWdlIFN1YnRhZyBSZXZpZXdl cg0KPiA+ICAgTVVTVCByZXZpZXcgdGhlIHJlZ2lzdHJ5IGZvciBzdWNoIGVmZmVjdHMgYW5kIHBy b3Bvc2UgdGhlDQo+IG5lY2Vzc2FyeQ0KPiA+IC8vIHdpbGwgPT4gTVVTVA0KPiA+ICAgY2hhbmdl cyB1c2luZyB0aGUgcHJvY2VzcyBpbiBTZWN0aW9uIDMuNSAoUmVnaXN0cmF0aW9uDQo+IFByb2Nl ZHVyZQ0KPiA+ICAgZm9yIFN1YnRhZ3MpLCBhbHRob3VnaCBhbnlvbmUgTUFZIHJlcXVlc3Qgc3Vj aCBjaGFuZ2VzLiBGb3INCj4gZXhhbXBsZToNCj4gDQo+IFNvLCBJJ20gbWFya2luZyB0aGlzIG9u ZSAiY2xvc2VkIi4NCj4gDQo+IFJhbmR5DQo+IA0KPiBfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiBMdHJ1IG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiBMdHJ1QGlldGYu b3JnDQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHRydQ0K From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 11:39:59 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62B3F3A6A5A for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:39:59 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BGzWWZAwlEzJ for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:39:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A78973A69DA for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:39:58 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=NhulBNT8CxziGH0bz+w//H4ZYNf80HHOjvkGqKWmgIhlOteJ7Nb0ScvjXMvR7syB; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.11] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LY3tL-000159-1p for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 14:40:03 -0500 Message-ID: <007e01c98e12$dd541340$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:40:02 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173c1a64a73d3adc632beb8fa21f921ab8f350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.11 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:39:59 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... There were several more-or-less equivalent proposals, differing only in stylistic and grammatical fine points. It appears to me that we're in a "just pick one" situation, so we'll go with this text: IANA will extract the record from the form and place the inserted or modified record into the appropriate section of the language subtag registry, grouping the records by their 'Type' field. Inserted records can be placed anywhere within the appropriate section; there is no guarantee that the registry's records will be placed in any particular order except that they will always be grouped by 'Type.' Modified records overwrite the record they replace. I've marked the issue "closed." Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 11:42:37 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABA7C3A6B42 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:42:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id i2Qe1S9+jee6 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:42:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E84993A6A2E for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:42:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=eCaki0XzKvx/V0exa4vvbxrLlgxYcJb6cfaAHAh8cbtUK4ryRfKa5WwgV2brzM/L; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.11] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LY3vv-0006Tg-La for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 14:42:43 -0500 Message-ID: <008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:42:43 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731a7eddf078ff26e49e02373f62e229d0350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.11 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:42:37 -0000 Hi - All 4646bis isses are closed. At this time only three 4645bis issues remain open: #21, #22, and #23. For the list of open issues, see http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/1 For the list of all reports, including the closed ones, see http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/6 Randy From addison@amazon.com Fri Feb 13 11:45:32 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 631D73A6A2E for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:45:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id e5bTW7cDcZif for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:45:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90C153A69DA for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:45:31 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,203,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="188719214" Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 13 Feb 2009 19:45:36 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1DJjZe4007866 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:45:35 GMT Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.24) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.340.0; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:45:31 -0800 Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:44:18 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , "ltru@ietf.org" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 11:45:30 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions Thread-Index: AcmOEuEbry3weG0UQCS4IyNI+mNxSwAALxXA Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA0181C8332D@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <007e01c98e12$dd541340$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <007e01c98e12$dd541340$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #9: record ordering instructions X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 19:45:32 -0000 KERPTkUpIHZlcmJhdGltDQoNCkFkZGlzb24gUGhpbGxpcHMNCkdsb2JhbGl6YXRpb24gQXJjaGl0 ZWN0IC0tIExhYjEyNg0KDQpJbnRlcm5hdGlvbmFsaXphdGlvbiBpcyBub3QgYSBmZWF0dXJlLg0K SXQgaXMgYW4gYXJjaGl0ZWN0dXJlLg0KDQoNCj4gLS0tLS1PcmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlLS0tLS0N Cj4gRnJvbTogbHRydS1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYub3JnIFttYWlsdG86bHRydS1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYu b3JnXSBPbg0KPiBCZWhhbGYgT2YgUmFuZHkgUHJlc3Vobg0KPiBTZW50OiBGcmlkYXksIEZlYnJ1 YXJ5IDEzLCAyMDA5IDExOjQwIEFNDQo+IFRvOiBsdHJ1QGlldGYub3JnDQo+IFN1YmplY3Q6IFJl OiBbTHRydV0gSXNzdWUgIzk6IHJlY29yZCBvcmRlcmluZyBpbnN0cnVjdGlvbnMNCj4gDQo+IEhp IC0NCj4gDQo+IEFzIGNvLWNoYWlyLi4uDQo+IA0KPiBUaGVyZSB3ZXJlIHNldmVyYWwgbW9yZS1v ci1sZXNzIGVxdWl2YWxlbnQgcHJvcG9zYWxzLCBkaWZmZXJpbmcNCj4gb25seQ0KPiBpbiBzdHls aXN0aWMgYW5kIGdyYW1tYXRpY2FsIGZpbmUgcG9pbnRzLiAgSXQgYXBwZWFycyB0byBtZSB0aGF0 DQo+IHdlJ3JlDQo+IGluIGEgImp1c3QgcGljayBvbmUiIHNpdHVhdGlvbiwgc28gd2UnbGwgZ28g d2l0aCB0aGlzIHRleHQ6DQo+IA0KPiBJQU5BIHdpbGwgZXh0cmFjdCB0aGUgcmVjb3JkIGZyb20g dGhlIGZvcm0gYW5kIHBsYWNlIHRoZSBpbnNlcnRlZA0KPiBvcg0KPiAgbW9kaWZpZWQgcmVjb3Jk IGludG8gdGhlIGFwcHJvcHJpYXRlIHNlY3Rpb24gb2YgdGhlIGxhbmd1YWdlDQo+IHN1YnRhZw0K PiAgcmVnaXN0cnksIGdyb3VwaW5nIHRoZSByZWNvcmRzIGJ5IHRoZWlyICdUeXBlJyBmaWVsZC4g SW5zZXJ0ZWQNCj4gcmVjb3Jkcw0KPiBjYW4gYmUgcGxhY2VkIGFueXdoZXJlIHdpdGhpbiB0aGUg YXBwcm9wcmlhdGUgc2VjdGlvbjsgdGhlcmUgaXMgbm8NCj4gIGd1YXJhbnRlZSB0aGF0IHRoZSBy ZWdpc3RyeSdzIHJlY29yZHMgd2lsbCBiZSBwbGFjZWQgaW4gYW55DQo+IHBhcnRpY3VsYXINCj4g IG9yZGVyIGV4Y2VwdCB0aGF0IHRoZXkgd2lsbCBhbHdheXMgYmUgZ3JvdXBlZCBieSAnVHlwZS4n IE1vZGlmaWVkDQo+ICByZWNvcmRzIG92ZXJ3cml0ZSB0aGUgcmVjb3JkIHRoZXkgcmVwbGFjZS4N Cj4gDQo+IEkndmUgbWFya2VkIHRoZSBpc3N1ZSAiY2xvc2VkLiINCj4gDQo+IFJhbmR5DQo+IA0K PiANCj4gX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCj4g THRydSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj4gTHRydUBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9y Zy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2x0cnUNCg== From doug@ewellic.org Fri Feb 13 21:46:56 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DCC53A6A75 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 21:46:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.265 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.265 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.563, BAYES_40=-0.185, FAKE_REPLY_C=2.012, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OFGpb2BqMwky for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 21:46:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth19.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth19.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.30]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 2C93A3A69D5 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 21:46:55 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 13654 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2009 05:46:09 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth19.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.30) with ESMTP; 14 Feb 2009 05:46:09 -0000 Message-ID: <57D86EE5536C418DB43C96D67702DD66@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 22:46:07 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 05:46:56 -0000 Kent Karlsson wrote: > I would prefer not to revert this particular change (and I guess you > mean "preferred-value for YU"). That is correct; the change in question involves the subtag YU, which currently has a Preferred-Value of CS. > Doing so would go against the principle of shortcutting > preferred-value chains, with the idea that a preferred value should > always be a non-deprecated value. The added comment (for YU) is fine as it is in draft 9, and better than in this case a misleading Preferred-value. That's why I thought it should be changed here rather than by ietf-languages: because draft-4646bis more or less says it has to be. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 13 22:17:06 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 847DD3A6AB7 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 22:17:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IFdQ8GdUYZm3 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 22:17:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C72D73A67E7 for ; Fri, 13 Feb 2009 22:17:05 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=aR1h7vaQNIpwA37uMSOZp0oiEg+r5B4i5FXEu0fFzMSUx6DDFMM3WmliYnt4cm8/; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.34.233] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LYDpu-0003JX-Rp for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 01:17:11 -0500 Message-ID: <008601c98e6b$e016b840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 13 Feb 2009 22:17:11 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17345ec15d9923fad573ba2727f7485498e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.233 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 06:17:06 -0000 Hi - > From: "Kent Karlsson" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Friday, February 13, 2009 4:27 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS > > I would prefer not to revert this particular change (and I guess you mean > "preferred-value for YU"). Doing so would go against the principle of > shortcutting preferred-value chains, with the idea that a preferred value > should always be a non-deprecated value. The added comment (for YU) is fine > as it is in draft 9, and better than in this case a misleading > Preferred-value. ... Both as a technical contributor and as WG chair... My concern is that this WG should not be making changes to the content of existing registry entries unless absolutely necessary. Making changes to existing entries is properly the job of the LSR and ietf-languages@iana.org I agree that this is a corner case, due to the technical change in the handling of preferred-value chains. I'd be comfortable allowing the it *iff* the LSR and the good people on ietf-languages@iana.org agree to the change. Randy From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Sat Feb 14 08:05:41 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A61463A6909 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:05:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.676 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.676 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id c3RJHMAB2WT5 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:05:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.168]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E04453A6359 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:05:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so1886818wfd.31 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:05:48 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=yfM21iX7d9/j5C6/hAFRCByVI3VN2ChuD43rVLMpo3k=; b=QFV280+YlanVtnjTdkeYa0jKKopmHkWoS5ywRQN5+uGJef3DwksMvpCwVZPiLjU0CV 4vPorPviVQxNJyyEnAqKXBWS4nYDfTFGy7scdDhJIO6PpT70CLbKmKQfnmpXHsG9oZ4r UG9p36GRJbRGc/FBWRU/wY4mZ7nxo1PfEx5Qs= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=wJ8/HMQI0+0WrJNxXewXGGaDpx6jrQMjAgHVSDiXMBN/KtU2mIQm9k8Rp+JDmj4oe9 zcoxrJ5CmoS4UzT8fbx5EhPRRL0Og9lpTKFI6FEgH1dosAvw0o8vqMSYCnSkarkIg+kd jtj2vDlA7Ll9yjnb41Jr8qRS3yrfHbyr89db0= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Received: by 10.142.113.17 with SMTP id l17mr1464325wfc.293.1234627547685; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:05:47 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <008601c98e6b$e016b840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> References: <008601c98e6b$e016b840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:05:47 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 508673c950bd5d42 Message-ID: <30b660a20902140805t56c81c15p69e5ac2ccc4b9168@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: Randy Presuhn Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636e1faec68e46e0462e32070 Cc: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:05:41 -0000 --001636e1faec68e46e0462e32070 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I view this as part of the transition to the new version, which resolves recursive preference relationships. Mark On Fri, Feb 13, 2009 at 22:17, Randy Presuhn wrote: > > I would prefer not to revert this particular change (and I guess you mean > > "preferred-value for YU"). Doing so would go against the principle of > > shortcutting preferred-value chains, with the idea that a preferred value > > should always be a non-deprecated value. The added comment (for YU) is > fine > > as it is in draft 9, and better than in this case a misleading > > Preferred-value. > --001636e1faec68e46e0462e32070 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I view this as part of the transition to the new version, which resolves re= cursive preference relationships.

Mark


On Fri, Feb 13, 2009 at 22:17, Randy Pre= suhn <= randy_presuhn@mindspring.com> wrote:
> I would prefer not to revert this particular cha= nge (and I guess you mean
> "preferred-value for YU"). Doing so would go against the pri= nciple of
> shortcutting preferred-value chains, with the idea that a preferred va= lue
> should always be a non-deprecated value. The added comment (for YU) is= fine
> as it is in draft 9, and better than in this case a misleading
> Preferred-value.

--001636e1faec68e46e0462e32070-- From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 14 08:10:29 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1DD103A6359 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:10:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.555 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.555 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.555, BAYES_05=-1.11] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id r2zSviU7+mC0 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:10:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 62C293A6909 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:10:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=VhR3KfztHvv1KPajxC9OuUYGZriLn85WrrrnOlxTdkUmUyDBJhmkjfuwLUc6XmPd; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.204.116] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LYN6A-0002t8-Vp for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 11:10:35 -0500 Message-ID: <000601c98ebe$c1f29200$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <00e301c98dbc$4f4d3dc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:10:27 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173b5febbda89bda12f33cc95ee5b2e8024350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.116 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #21: add "International Sign" to registry content X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:10:29 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion, I've marked this issue "closed", to be resolved as proposed by the editor. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 14 08:11:54 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 73B023A67B4 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:11:54 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.577 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.577 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.022, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cb5O5VSm1Vz2 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:11:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B4A1B3A6359 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:11:53 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=IczSL/SIEamwDFFCsGgul9zdUrW1C6YR+am8m8te4GpGLEx/X2tgPYYq/9aeKz0W; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.204.116] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LYN7X-0004yt-7n for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 11:11:59 -0500 Message-ID: <000b01c98ebe$f8100660$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <00ed01c98dbc$dd7266c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:12:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173b05f02ff4433f3a88fa697830c14c0d8350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.116 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #23: incorporate 639-3 updates as of 2009-02-13 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:11:54 -0000 Hi - Seeing no further discussion on this issue, I've marked it as "closed", to be resolved as proposed by the editor. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 14 08:13:44 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A88C3A6A5E for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:13:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.918 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.918 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.681, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wTzHOjZHXOUb for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:13:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 57AF43A6909 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:13:43 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=VHXigpxpgQw2sEknkDotWr59eleaOCaECk7Mxlbcb3FYklRZEz1UI1DgDqHSniap; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.204.116] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LYN9J-0005pa-2U for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 11:13:49 -0500 Message-ID: <001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 08:13:50 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173297d9266d323a85d3b76f678ada56319350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.116 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 16:13:44 -0000 Hi - All 4646bis isses are closed. At this time only one 4645bis issue remains open: #22. For the list of open issues, see http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/1 For the list of all reports, including the closed ones, see http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/6 Randy From doug@ewellic.org Sat Feb 14 11:03:44 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9A5F3A6C36 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 11:03:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.491 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.491 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.235, BAYES_20=-0.74, FAKE_REPLY_C=2.012, GB_I_LETTER=-2, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id OFCHpHmV7wGe for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 11:03:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.38]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C44663A6C35 for ; Sat, 14 Feb 2009 11:03:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 10762 invoked from network); 14 Feb 2009 19:03:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.38) with ESMTP; 14 Feb 2009 19:03:48 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 12:03:47 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 14 Feb 2009 19:03:44 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: > My concern is that this WG should not be making changes to the content > of existing registry entries unless absolutely necessary. Making > changes to existing entries is properly the job of the LSR and > ietf-languages at iana.org I agree, except when we (LTRU) write drafts that require such changes. As an example, we (LTRU) agreed that it was OK for draft-4645bis to reorder language subtags so the 2-letter subtags would appear before the 3-letter subtags, to reorder the Description fields so the ISO 639-3 reference name would come first, to un-invert the inverted names, and to reorder the fields within subtags to match the order in which they are defined in draft-4646bis. Each of these decisions required one or more changes to the content of existing entries. Do a diff between the current and draft-4645bis registries to see how many. Several Preferred-Value fields have already been changed: Current Registry: Type: grandfathered Tag: i-hak Description: Hakka Added: 1999-01-31 Preferred-Value: zh-hakka Deprecated: 2000-01-10 New Registry: Type: grandfathered Tag: i-hak Description: Hakka Added: 1999-01-31 Deprecated: 2000-01-10 Preferred-Value: hak > I agree that this is a corner case, due to the technical change in the > handling of preferred-value chains. I'd be comfortable allowing the > it *iff* the LSR and the good people on ietf-languages at iana.org > agree to the change. It might be a good idea to notify LSR and the good people on ietf-languages so they have a chance to reply. In any case, this issue appears not to be nearly as non-controversial as the other two. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From addison@amazon.com Sun Feb 15 11:20:53 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16EF33A6AED for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 11:20:53 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id u2W7r4tF4-TY for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 11:20:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32FAC3A6866 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 11:20:52 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,212,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="221967370" Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 15 Feb 2009 19:20:58 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1FJKtNk025895 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 15 Feb 2009 19:20:56 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 11:20:55 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 11:20:52 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue Tracker Thread-Index: AcmOvzvTZtqWv0scQBmk4W7536cWxQA4yThA Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 19:20:53 -0000 SGkgUmFuZHksDQoNCkNvdWxkIHlvdSBsZXQgbWUga25vdyB3aGVuIHRvIHN1Ym1pdCBkcmFmdC0y MT8gSSBhc3N1bWUgSSdsbCBuZWVkIHRoZSA1Mzc4IG11bWJsZXMgaW4gdGhlIG5ldyBkcmFmdC4N Cg0KVGhhbmtzLA0KDQpBZGRpc29uDQoNCkFkZGlzb24gUGhpbGxpcHMNCkdsb2JhbGl6YXRpb24g QXJjaGl0ZWN0IC0tIExhYjEyNg0KDQpJbnRlcm5hdGlvbmFsaXphdGlvbiBpcyBub3QgYSBmZWF0 dXJlLg0KSXQgaXMgYW4gYXJjaGl0ZWN0dXJlLg0KDQo+IC0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2FnZS0t LS0tDQo+IEZyb206IGx0cnUtYm91bmNlc0BpZXRmLm9yZyBbbWFpbHRvOmx0cnUtYm91bmNlc0Bp ZXRmLm9yZ10gT24NCj4gQmVoYWxmIE9mIFJhbmR5IFByZXN1aG4NCj4gU2VudDogU2F0dXJkYXks IEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDE0LCAyMDA5IDg6MTQgQU0NCj4gVG86IExUUlUgV29ya2luZyBHcm91cA0KPiBT dWJqZWN0OiBSZTogW0x0cnVdIElzc3VlIFRyYWNrZXINCj4gDQo+IEhpIC0NCj4gDQo+IEFsbCA0 NjQ2YmlzIGlzc2VzIGFyZSBjbG9zZWQuDQo+IA0KPiBBdCB0aGlzIHRpbWUgb25seSBvbmUgNDY0 NWJpcyBpc3N1ZSByZW1haW5zIG9wZW46ICMyMi4NCj4gDQo+IEZvciB0aGUgbGlzdCBvZiBvcGVu IGlzc3Vlcywgc2VlDQo+IGh0dHA6Ly90cmFjLnRvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL3dnL2x0cnUvdHJhYy9y ZXBvcnQvMQ0KPiANCj4gRm9yIHRoZSBsaXN0IG9mIGFsbCByZXBvcnRzLCBpbmNsdWRpbmcgdGhl IGNsb3NlZCBvbmVzLCBzZWUNCj4gaHR0cDovL3RyYWMudG9vbHMuaWV0Zi5vcmcvd2cvbHRydS90 cmFjL3JlcG9ydC82DQo+IA0KPiBSYW5keQ0KPiANCj4gX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCj4gTHRydSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj4gTHRydUBpZXRm Lm9yZw0KPiBodHRwczovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2x0cnUNCg== From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sun Feb 15 17:14:11 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E00A43A6B2B for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 17:14:11 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 90St-gzfKGE1 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 17:14:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CAF13A6AF4 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 17:14:11 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=fhfp3s2L6MN7919dw8UuAUOztKAfevaA9KJk80V2SvT/SLvhL961ZjnBcMVirGl/; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.164.80.197] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LYs3w-0007AM-8v for ltru@ietf.org; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 20:14:20 -0500 Message-ID: <004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 17:14:24 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17388db32c8ef33c65e8e7ac6abc783dacc350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.164.80.197 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 01:14:12 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2009 11:20 AM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue Tracker ... > Could you let me know when to submit draft-21? I assume I'll need the 5378 mumbles in the new draft. Since all 4646bis isses are closed, you may submit it at your earliest convenience. You will definitely need the 5378-style incantations, and I recommend including the 6.c.iii legend. Only 4645bis issue #22 remains open; as soon as that is resolved, Doug may submit that i-d as well. Martin will then make sure everything is still in synch with his document shepherd write-up, and hand it over to our AD and the IESG. Randy From addison@amazon.com Sun Feb 15 18:29:32 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 533C33A67DF for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 18:29:32 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G8Ml4rZyb+29 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 18:29:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B08C3A672F for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 18:29:31 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,214,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="189374993" Received: from smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.10.25]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 16 Feb 2009 02:29:40 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1G2Td0G003924 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 16 Feb 2009 02:29:39 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 18:29:38 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 18:29:34 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue Tracker Thread-Index: AcmP0+jzmf2lQiqLQRinyy49CfePmAACUahA Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9406@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 02:29:32 -0000 VGhhbmtzIFJhbmR5Lg0KDQpJIGRpZCBpbnN0YWxsIHRoZSBsYXRlc3QgeG1sMnJmYyBEVEQuIEl0 IGRvZXMgcHJvZHVjZSBzb21lIG9mIHRoZSBjb3JyZWN0IG1hZ2ljIG11bWJsZXMsIGJ1dCBub3Qg Ni5jLmlpaS4gU2luY2Ugd2UgaW5jbHVkZSB0aGUgNi5jLmlpaSBtdW1ibGUsIEkgaGF2ZSBhcHBs aWVkIHRoZSBub0Rlcml2YXRpdmVzMjAwODExIElQUiBkaXJlY3RpdmUuDQoNCkkgaGF2ZSBnZW5l cmF0ZWQgYSBuZXcgZHJhZnQtMjEsIHBsYWNpbmcgdGhlIDYuYy5paWkgbGVnZW5kIGludG8gdGhl IGFic3RyYWN0LiBJIHN0aWxsIG5lZWQgdG8gcnVuIGFsbCB0aGUgdG9vbHMgb24gaXQgYmVmb3Jl IHN1Ym1pc3Npb24uIEhvd2V2ZXIsIEkgaGF2ZSBqdXN0IG5vdyBwb3N0ZWQgdGhlIGRyYWZ0IGNv cGllcyB0byBpbnRlci1sb2NhbGUgc28gdGhhdCBvdGhlcnMgY2FuIHNlZS9kaWZmL2V0Yy4gdGhl bS4gSSBtYXkgbmVlZCB0byBtb3ZlIHRoZSA2LmMuaWlpIG11bWJsZSBpbnRvIHRoZSBjb3B5cmln aHQgbWFudWFsbHkgYmVmb3JlIHN1Ym1pc3Npb24uDQoNCkFkdmljZSBmcm9tIHRoZSBjby1jaGFp cnMgb24gdGhpcyBsYXN0IGFwcHJlY2lhdGVkLiBBbnlvbmUgZWxzZTogc2VuZCBub3RpY2Ugb2Yg bWlzdGFrZXMuIEJ1dCBkbyBpdCBTT09OLg0KDQogIGh0dHA6Ly93d3cuaW50ZXItbG9jYWxlLmNv bS9JRC9kcmFmdC1pZXRmLWx0cnUtNDY0NmJpcy0yMS54bWwNCiAgaHR0cDovL3d3dy5pbnRlci1s b2NhbGUuY29tL0lEL2RyYWZ0LWlldGYtbHRydS00NjQ2YmlzLTIxLmh0bWwNCiAgaHR0cDovL3d3 dy5pbnRlci1sb2NhbGUuY29tL0lEL2RyYWZ0LWlldGYtbHRydS00NjQ2YmlzLTIxLnR4dA0KDQpk aWZmOiAgaHR0cDovL3Rpbnl1cmwuY29tL2NtaGd5OCANCg0KQWRkaXNvbiANCg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQ aGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoNCkludGVybmF0aW9u YWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRlY3R1cmUuDQoNCg0K PiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5v cmcgW21haWx0bzpsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIE9uDQo+IEJlaGFsZiBPZiBSYW5keSBQ cmVzdWhuDQo+IFNlbnQ6IFN1bmRheSwgRmVicnVhcnkgMTUsIDIwMDkgNToxNCBQTQ0KPiBUbzog TFRSVSBXb3JraW5nIEdyb3VwDQo+IFN1YmplY3Q6IFJlOiBbTHRydV0gSXNzdWUgVHJhY2tlcg0K PiANCj4gSGkgLQ0KPiANCj4gQXMgY28tY2hhaXIuLi4NCj4gDQo+ID4gRnJvbTogIlBoaWxsaXBz LCBBZGRpc29uIiA8YWRkaXNvbkBhbWF6b24uY29tPg0KPiA+IFRvOiAiUmFuZHkgUHJlc3VobiIg PHJhbmR5X3ByZXN1aG5AbWluZHNwcmluZy5jb20+OyAiTFRSVSBXb3JraW5nDQo+IEdyb3VwIiA8 bHRydUBpZXRmLm9yZz4NCj4gPiBTZW50OiBTdW5kYXksIEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDE1LCAyMDA5IDExOjIw IEFNDQo+ID4gU3ViamVjdDogUkU6IFtMdHJ1XSBJc3N1ZSBUcmFja2VyDQo+IC4uLg0KPiA+IENv dWxkIHlvdSBsZXQgbWUga25vdyB3aGVuIHRvIHN1Ym1pdCBkcmFmdC0yMT8gSSBhc3N1bWUgSSds bCBuZWVkDQo+IHRoZSA1Mzc4IG11bWJsZXMgaW4gdGhlIG5ldyBkcmFmdC4NCj4gDQo+IFNpbmNl IGFsbCA0NjQ2YmlzIGlzc2VzIGFyZSBjbG9zZWQsIHlvdSBtYXkgc3VibWl0IGl0IGF0IHlvdXIN Cj4gZWFybGllc3QgY29udmVuaWVuY2UuICBZb3Ugd2lsbCBkZWZpbml0ZWx5IG5lZWQgdGhlIDUz Nzgtc3R5bGUNCj4gaW5jYW50YXRpb25zLCBhbmQgSSByZWNvbW1lbmQgaW5jbHVkaW5nIHRoZSA2 LmMuaWlpIGxlZ2VuZC4NCj4gDQo+IE9ubHkgNDY0NWJpcyBpc3N1ZSAjMjIgcmVtYWlucyBvcGVu OyBhcyBzb29uIGFzIHRoYXQgaXMgcmVzb2x2ZWQsDQo+IERvdWcgbWF5IHN1Ym1pdCB0aGF0IGkt ZCBhcyB3ZWxsLg0KPiANCj4gTWFydGluIHdpbGwgdGhlbiBtYWtlIHN1cmUgZXZlcnl0aGluZyBp cyBzdGlsbCBpbiBzeW5jaCB3aXRoIGhpcw0KPiBkb2N1bWVudCBzaGVwaGVyZCB3cml0ZS11cCwg YW5kIGhhbmQgaXQgb3ZlciB0byBvdXIgQUQgYW5kIHRoZQ0KPiBJRVNHLg0KPiANCj4gUmFuZHkN Cj4gDQo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+ IEx0cnUgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQo+IEx0cnVAaWV0Zi5vcmcNCj4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5v cmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9sdHJ1DQo= From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sun Feb 15 19:59:05 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 612363A6A0A for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 19:59:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.505 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.505 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.094, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TMmKLQcuxWYt for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 19:59:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6E4013A69B2 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 19:59:04 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=R9F8jqlJdXXG6nHGXAoOpC1ktXfLImKx4LrkJnvYu96PD3v51ry/fqatMDr4PAPJ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.146.170] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LYudT-0003sG-LD for ltru@ietf.org; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 22:59:11 -0500 Message-ID: <001601c98fea$edbd5fa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9406@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 19:59:09 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173a0f887e10936d0d37c111d90d79f6ccb350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.146.170 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 03:59:05 -0000 Hi - > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2009 6:29 PM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue Tracker ... > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some > of the correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Ok. I haven't seen any announcements from the tools folk, but I imagine they need at least a little time to add this stuff. > Since we include the 6.c.iii mumble, I have applied the > noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. I do not think we want that, since that would hamstring attempts to revised it in the future. The 6.c.iii incantation is a matter of whether we are willing to claim that all the contributors (whoever they may be) have made the broader grant of rights needed to allow the IETF to spin the document off to some other organization. That's different from disallowing the creation of derivative works, per 6.c.i of http://trustee.ietf.org/docs/IETF-Trust-License-Policy.pdf ... > I may need to move the 6.c.iii mumble into the copyright manually before submission. I don't recall anyone saying exactly where the incantation needs to go, but it would seem to make sense as the second paragraph of the "Status of this Memo" section or as a third paragraph in the copyright notice. Treating it as ordinary text before the absract might cause XML2RFC to do the right thing. Scanning the diffs, two potential problems jumped out at me: - The text put in for issue #1 (which was cast as just updating a reference) creates a technical change - It looks issue #3's agreed text didn't get put in. PLEASE post followup on these two issues (or on any other issues) in separate threads, including the issue number in the subject line. Randy From addison@amazon.com Sun Feb 15 21:30:50 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B6123A6BCC for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:30:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2eVa5zN3ex8C for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:30:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A0933A6BC8 for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:30:49 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,214,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="142835369" Received: from smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com ([172.20.19.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 16 Feb 2009 05:30:57 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1G5Uvmu005083 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 16 Feb 2009 05:30:57 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.22]) with mapi; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:30:57 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 21:30:54 -0800 Thread-Topic: IPR mumbles.. Thread-Index: AcmP6vCd6djNgQIiR7WSNd+Eyuhe/gAC/iPA Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D94C3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9406@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <001601c98fea$edbd5fa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <001601c98fea$edbd5fa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Ltru] IPR mumbles.. X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 05:30:50 -0000 SGkgUmFuZHksDQoNClRoYW5rcyBmb3IgdGhpcy4gDQoNCj4gDQo+ID4gU2luY2Ugd2UgaW5jbHVk ZSB0aGUgNi5jLmlpaSBtdW1ibGUsIEkgaGF2ZSBhcHBsaWVkIHRoZQ0KPiA+IG5vRGVyaXZhdGl2 ZXMyMDA4MTEgSVBSIGRpcmVjdGl2ZS4NCj4gDQo+IEkgZG8gbm90IHRoaW5rIHdlIHdhbnQgdGhh dCwgc2luY2UgdGhhdCB3b3VsZCBoYW1zdHJpbmcgYXR0ZW1wdHMgdG8NCj4gcmV2aXNlZCBpdCBp biB0aGUgZnV0dXJlLiANCg0KSSBkb24ndCB0aGluayB0aGF0J3MgZW50aXJlbHkgdHJ1ZS4gVGhl IElFVEYgU3RhbmRhcmRzIFByb2Nlc3MgaXMgZXhwbGljaXRseSBleGNsdWRlZCBmcm9tIHRoZSBk ZXJpdmF0aXZlIHdvcmtzIHRleHQsIGF0IGxlYXN0IGluIDYuYy5paWkuIEF0IHRoZSBzYW1lIHRp bWUsIDYuYy5paWkgaGFzIGFuIGV4cGxpY2l0IG5vLWRlcml2YXRpdmVzIHNlY3Rpb24gdG8gaXQu IElBTkFMLCBidXQgc2luY2UgNi5jLmlpaSBwcm9oaWJpdHMgZGVyaXZhdGl2ZXMsIEkgZG9uJ3Qg c2VlIGhvdyBJIGNhbiBjaGVjayAndHJ1c3QyMDA4MTEnPz8gQ2FuIEkgZ2V0IGd1aWRhbmNlIG9u IHRoaXM/IEluIHRoZSBtZWFudGltZSwgSSBjYW4gcmVtb3ZlIHRoZSBhZGRpdGlvbmFsIG5vLWRl cml2YXRpdmVzIHRleHQgYW5kIGp1c3QgdXNlIDYuYy5paWkuDQoNCj4gLi4uDQo+ID4gSSBtYXkg bmVlZCB0byBtb3ZlIHRoZSA2LmMuaWlpIG11bWJsZSBpbnRvIHRoZSBjb3B5cmlnaHQgbWFudWFs bHkNCj4gYmVmb3JlIHN1Ym1pc3Npb24uDQo+IA0KPiBJIGRvbid0IHJlY2FsbCBhbnlvbmUgc2F5 aW5nIGV4YWN0bHkgd2hlcmUgdGhlIGluY2FudGF0aW9uIG5lZWRzDQo+IHRvIGdvLCBidXQgaXQg d291bGQgc2VlbSB0byBtYWtlIHNlbnNlIGFzIHRoZSBzZWNvbmQgcGFyYWdyYXBoDQo+IG9mIHRo ZSAiU3RhdHVzIG9mIHRoaXMgTWVtbyIgc2VjdGlvbiBvciBhcyBhIHRoaXJkIHBhcmFncmFwaCBp bg0KPiB0aGUgY29weXJpZ2h0IG5vdGljZS4gIFRyZWF0aW5nIGl0IGFzIG9yZGluYXJ5IHRleHQg YmVmb3JlIHRoZQ0KPiBhYnNyYWN0IG1pZ2h0IGNhdXNlIFhNTDJSRkMgdG8gZG8gdGhlIHJpZ2h0 IHRoaW5nLg0KDQpJJ2xsIHRyeSBzb21lIHBlcm11dGF0aW9ucy4gTXkgZmlyc3QgYXR0ZW1wdCB3 YXNuJ3Qgc3VjY2Vzc2Z1bC4NCg0KPiANCj4gU2Nhbm5pbmcgdGhlIGRpZmZzLCB0d28gcG90ZW50 aWFsIHByb2JsZW1zIGp1bXBlZCBvdXQgYXQgbWU6DQo+ICAgIC0gVGhlIHRleHQgcHV0IGluIGZv ciBpc3N1ZSAjMSAod2hpY2ggd2FzIGNhc3QgYXMganVzdA0KPiAgICAgIHVwZGF0aW5nIGEgcmVm ZXJlbmNlKSBjcmVhdGVzIGEgdGVjaG5pY2FsIGNoYW5nZQ0KPiAgICAtIEl0IGxvb2tzIGlzc3Vl ICMzJ3MgYWdyZWVkIHRleHQgZGlkbid0IGdldCBwdXQgaW4uDQo+IA0KPiBQTEVBU0UgcG9zdCBm b2xsb3d1cCBvbiB0aGVzZSB0d28gaXNzdWVzIChvciBvbiBhbnkgb3RoZXIgaXNzdWVzKQ0KPiBp biBzZXBhcmF0ZSB0aHJlYWRzLCBpbmNsdWRpbmcgdGhlIGlzc3VlIG51bWJlciBpbiB0aGUgc3Vi amVjdCBsaW5lLg0KPiANCg0KQW55IHJlc3BvbnNlIGZyb20gbWUgd2lsbCBiZSB1bmRlciBzZXBh cmF0ZSBjb3Zlci4uLiBJIGhhdmUgbm90IGxvb2tlZCBhdCB0aGVzZSBpc3N1ZXMgYXMgb2YgeWV0 Lg0KDQpBZGRpc29uDQoNCkFkZGlzb24gUGhpbGxpcHMNCkdsb2JhbGl6YXRpb24gQXJjaGl0ZWN0 IC0tIExhYjEyNg0KDQpJbnRlcm5hdGlvbmFsaXphdGlvbiBpcyBub3QgYSBmZWF0dXJlLg0KSXQg aXMgYW4gYXJjaGl0ZWN0dXJlLg0KDQoNCg0K From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sun Feb 15 22:44:51 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2ABE83A693D for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 22:44:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 288jOkFwtkaT for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 22:44:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2EC0A3A6BFC for ; Sun, 15 Feb 2009 22:44:50 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=TtmNRzC0FUb2urblAyBYe0Zth3rlKlWUn+VeR15GMVkeZLY67TZ76lZpYqK3vFXQ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.137.30] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LYxDt-0006om-Cx for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 01:44:57 -0500 Message-ID: <000a01c99002$14e29de0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9406@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <001601c98fea$edbd5fa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D94C3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Sun, 15 Feb 2009 22:44:54 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173c1ec5a4d49fde0a381278a43c551eb20350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.137.30 Subject: Re: [Ltru] IPR mumbles.. X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 06:44:51 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Sunday, February 15, 2009 9:30 PM > Subject: IPR mumbles.. ... > > > Since we include the 6.c.iii mumble, I have applied the > > > noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. > > > > I do not think we want that, since that would hamstring attempts to > > revised it in the future. > > I don't think that's entirely true. The IETF Standards Process > is explicitly excluded from the derivative works text, at least > in 6.c.iii. At the same time, 6.c.iii has an explicit no-derivatives > section to it. IANAL, but since 6.c.iii prohibits derivatives, I > don't see how I can check 'trust200811'?? Can I get guidance > on this? In the meantime, I can remove the additional no-derivatives > text and just use 6.c.iii. ... 6.c.i and 6.c.iii differ *significantly* in the extent of their limitation on derivative works. The 6.c.i option is *not* appropriate for our purposes. It's intended for someone who wants to get something published as an RFC, but not allow derivative works other than RFC formatting and translations. The 6.c.iii option places a limitation on the development of derivative works *outside* the IETF process. The ability to produce derivative works outside the IETF process was something added with RFC 5378, and the necessary permissions were not in effect when contributions were made prior to RFC 5378. Thus a document which contains "pre-RFC 5378 material" can live up to RFC 5378's requirements only if: (a) all the contributors of the older material explicitly grant those rights (raising the question of who those contributors are and how to track them down) -or- (b) we put in the disclaimer acknowledging the situation, and effectively withdrawing the document for consideration for spin-off to some other standards body. (b) seems the correct choice in our case, and that is what the 6.c.iii option is for. The 6.c.iii text does *not* limit what we can do inside the IETF standards process. The limitation on derivative works in 6.c.iii would only kick in, for example, if the IETF were to hand off responsibility for the language subtag registry procedures to, say, the W3C. Otherwise, for our purposes everything else continues to work pretty much the way it always has. Randy From cewcathar@hotmail.com Mon Feb 16 09:01:19 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D71723A6CF0 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 09:01:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.35 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.35 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.248, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JALtl4VSOWKn for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 09:01:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from blu0-omc3-s18.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s18.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.93]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E2DCF3A6CDF for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 09:01:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from BLU109-W29 ([65.55.116.74]) by blu0-omc3-s18.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Mon, 16 Feb 2009 09:01:29 -0800 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_50c8e33d-650c-4930-ba0a-469062df53a5_" X-Originating-IP: [70.88.11.82] From: CE Whitehead To: Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:01:28 -0500 Importance: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 16 Feb 2009 17:01:29.0202 (UTC) FILETIME=[35DDCD20:01C99058] Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 17:01:19 -0000 --_50c8e33d-650c-4930-ba0a-469062df53a5_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi! Back to section 1=2C par. 3: "Standards=2C protocols=2C and applications that reference this document normatively but apply different rules to the ones given in this section MUST specify how language tag selection varies from the guidelines given here." I thought the issue tracker for issue 4 said "different to" would be replac= ed by the more widely used "different from"?? (http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/current/msg12171.html) I don't see this change in the text draft (http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/d= raft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt). (Otherwise looks really nice but I've just glanced at it.) Thanks! --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com --_50c8e33d-650c-4930-ba0a-469062df53a5_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi!

Back to section 1=2C par. 3:

   "Standards=2C protoc=
ols=2C and applications that reference this document
   normatively but =
apply different rules to the ones given in this
   section MUST specify =
how language tag selection varies from the
   guidelines given here."
I thought the issue tracker for issue 4 said "different to" would be r=
eplaced by the more widely used "different from"??
(http://www.ietf.org/=
mail-archive/web/ltru/current/msg12171.html)

I don't see this change=
 in the text draft (http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-=
21.txt).

(Otherwise looks really nice but I've just glanced at it.)<=
br>
Thanks!

--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com
<= br>
= --_50c8e33d-650c-4930-ba0a-469062df53a5_-- From addison@amazon.com Mon Feb 16 11:38:30 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D2DE3A6881 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:38:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id U7svWqHGDkMU for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:38:29 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E17B3A6B99 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:38:29 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,217,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="143151402" Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 16 Feb 2009 19:38:39 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.22]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1GJccRE022981 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:38:39 GMT Received: from ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com (10.248.180.20) by ex-hub-4101.ant.amazon.com (10.248.163.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.1.340.0; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:38:37 -0800 Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-pub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.180.20]) with mapi; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:37:24 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: "Phillips, Addison" , Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:38:35 -0800 Thread-Topic: issue #3 resolution Thread-Index: AcmP6vCd6djNgQIiR7WSNd+Eyuhe/gAC/iPAAB3LC3A= Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9A83@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9406@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <001601c98fea$edbd5fa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D94C3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D94C3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Ltru] issue #3 resolution X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:38:30 -0000 SSBpbnNlcnRlZCB0aGUgdGV4dCBpbiB0aGUgdGlja2V0IGludG8gbXkgZWRpdG9yJ3MgY29weS4g SSBkaWQgaW5jbHVkZSB0aGUgcGhyYXNlICJmb3IgaGlzdG9yaWNhbCBwdXJwb3NlcyIuDQoNCkFk ZGlzb24NCg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFi MTI2DQoNCkludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBh cmNoaXRlY3R1cmUuDQoNCg0KPiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBs dHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21haWx0bzpsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIE9uDQo+ IEJlaGFsZiBPZiBQaGlsbGlwcywgQWRkaXNvbg0KPiBTZW50OiBTdW5kYXksIEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDE1 LCAyMDA5IDk6MzEgUE0NCj4gVG86IFJhbmR5IFByZXN1aG47IExUUlUgV29ya2luZyBHcm91cA0K PiBTdWJqZWN0OiBbTHRydV0gSVBSIG11bWJsZXMuLg0KPiANCj4gSGkgUmFuZHksDQo+IA0KPiBU aGFua3MgZm9yIHRoaXMuDQo+IA0KPiA+DQo+ID4gPiBTaW5jZSB3ZSBpbmNsdWRlIHRoZSA2LmMu aWlpIG11bWJsZSwgSSBoYXZlIGFwcGxpZWQgdGhlDQo+ID4gPiBub0Rlcml2YXRpdmVzMjAwODEx IElQUiBkaXJlY3RpdmUuDQo+ID4NCj4gPiBJIGRvIG5vdCB0aGluayB3ZSB3YW50IHRoYXQsIHNp bmNlIHRoYXQgd291bGQgaGFtc3RyaW5nIGF0dGVtcHRzDQo+IHRvDQo+ID4gcmV2aXNlZCBpdCBp biB0aGUgZnV0dXJlLg0KPiANCj4gSSBkb24ndCB0aGluayB0aGF0J3MgZW50aXJlbHkgdHJ1ZS4g VGhlIElFVEYgU3RhbmRhcmRzIFByb2Nlc3MgaXMNCj4gZXhwbGljaXRseSBleGNsdWRlZCBmcm9t IHRoZSBkZXJpdmF0aXZlIHdvcmtzIHRleHQsIGF0IGxlYXN0IGluDQo+IDYuYy5paWkuIEF0IHRo ZSBzYW1lIHRpbWUsIDYuYy5paWkgaGFzIGFuIGV4cGxpY2l0IG5vLWRlcml2YXRpdmVzDQo+IHNl Y3Rpb24gdG8gaXQuIElBTkFMLCBidXQgc2luY2UgNi5jLmlpaSBwcm9oaWJpdHMgZGVyaXZhdGl2 ZXMsIEkNCj4gZG9uJ3Qgc2VlIGhvdyBJIGNhbiBjaGVjayAndHJ1c3QyMDA4MTEnPz8gQ2FuIEkg Z2V0IGd1aWRhbmNlIG9uDQo+IHRoaXM/IEluIHRoZSBtZWFudGltZSwgSSBjYW4gcmVtb3ZlIHRo ZSBhZGRpdGlvbmFsIG5vLWRlcml2YXRpdmVzDQo+IHRleHQgYW5kIGp1c3QgdXNlIDYuYy5paWku DQo+IA0KPiA+IC4uLg0KPiA+ID4gSSBtYXkgbmVlZCB0byBtb3ZlIHRoZSA2LmMuaWlpIG11bWJs ZSBpbnRvIHRoZSBjb3B5cmlnaHQNCj4gbWFudWFsbHkNCj4gPiBiZWZvcmUgc3VibWlzc2lvbi4N Cj4gPg0KPiA+IEkgZG9uJ3QgcmVjYWxsIGFueW9uZSBzYXlpbmcgZXhhY3RseSB3aGVyZSB0aGUg aW5jYW50YXRpb24gbmVlZHMNCj4gPiB0byBnbywgYnV0IGl0IHdvdWxkIHNlZW0gdG8gbWFrZSBz ZW5zZSBhcyB0aGUgc2Vjb25kIHBhcmFncmFwaA0KPiA+IG9mIHRoZSAiU3RhdHVzIG9mIHRoaXMg TWVtbyIgc2VjdGlvbiBvciBhcyBhIHRoaXJkIHBhcmFncmFwaCBpbg0KPiA+IHRoZSBjb3B5cmln aHQgbm90aWNlLiAgVHJlYXRpbmcgaXQgYXMgb3JkaW5hcnkgdGV4dCBiZWZvcmUgdGhlDQo+ID4g YWJzcmFjdCBtaWdodCBjYXVzZSBYTUwyUkZDIHRvIGRvIHRoZSByaWdodCB0aGluZy4NCj4gDQo+ IEknbGwgdHJ5IHNvbWUgcGVybXV0YXRpb25zLiBNeSBmaXJzdCBhdHRlbXB0IHdhc24ndCBzdWNj ZXNzZnVsLg0KPiANCj4gPg0KPiA+IFNjYW5uaW5nIHRoZSBkaWZmcywgdHdvIHBvdGVudGlhbCBw cm9ibGVtcyBqdW1wZWQgb3V0IGF0IG1lOg0KPiA+ICAgIC0gVGhlIHRleHQgcHV0IGluIGZvciBp c3N1ZSAjMSAod2hpY2ggd2FzIGNhc3QgYXMganVzdA0KPiA+ICAgICAgdXBkYXRpbmcgYSByZWZl cmVuY2UpIGNyZWF0ZXMgYSB0ZWNobmljYWwgY2hhbmdlDQo+ID4gICAgLSBJdCBsb29rcyBpc3N1 ZSAjMydzIGFncmVlZCB0ZXh0IGRpZG4ndCBnZXQgcHV0IGluLg0KPiA+DQo+ID4gUExFQVNFIHBv c3QgZm9sbG93dXAgb24gdGhlc2UgdHdvIGlzc3VlcyAob3Igb24gYW55IG90aGVyIGlzc3VlcykN Cj4gPiBpbiBzZXBhcmF0ZSB0aHJlYWRzLCBpbmNsdWRpbmcgdGhlIGlzc3VlIG51bWJlciBpbiB0 aGUgc3ViamVjdA0KPiBsaW5lLg0KPiA+DQo+IA0KPiBBbnkgcmVzcG9uc2UgZnJvbSBtZSB3aWxs IGJlIHVuZGVyIHNlcGFyYXRlIGNvdmVyLi4uIEkgaGF2ZSBub3QNCj4gbG9va2VkIGF0IHRoZXNl IGlzc3VlcyBhcyBvZiB5ZXQuDQo+IA0KPiBBZGRpc29uDQo+IA0KPiBBZGRpc29uIFBoaWxsaXBz DQo+IEdsb2JhbGl6YXRpb24gQXJjaGl0ZWN0IC0tIExhYjEyNg0KPiANCj4gSW50ZXJuYXRpb25h bGl6YXRpb24gaXMgbm90IGEgZmVhdHVyZS4NCj4gSXQgaXMgYW4gYXJjaGl0ZWN0dXJlLg0KPiAN Cj4gDQo+IA0KPiBfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f Xw0KPiBMdHJ1IG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiBMdHJ1QGlldGYub3JnDQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3Lmll dGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHRydQ0K From addison@amazon.com Mon Feb 16 11:41:34 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B7DB53A69CA for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:41:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y6+hJLWR2ny5 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:41:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CFAB83A6881 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:41:33 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,218,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="222411530" Received: from smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.10.25]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 16 Feb 2009 19:41:41 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-1104.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1GJff3x028410 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL) for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:41:41 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:41:40 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: LTRU Working Group Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:41:38 -0800 Thread-Topic: draft-21 prep: minor XML changes... Thread-Index: AcmQbpWSyQmE/uyfTR2ocuaSfsptaA== Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9A8E@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Ltru] draft-21 prep: minor XML changes... X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:41:34 -0000 SW4gcHJlcGFyaW5nIHRoZSBkcmFmdCwgSSBoYXZlIGluc2VydGVkIGEgPHdvcmtncm91cD4gWE1M IGVsZW1lbnQgaW50byB0aGUgZG9jdW1lbnQgc291cmNlLiBUaGlzIGlkZW50aWZpZXMgdGhlICJM YW5ndWFnZSBUYWcgVXBkYXRlIFdvcmtpbmcgR3JvdXAiIGFzIHRoZSB3b3JraW5nIGdyb3VwIHRo YXQgY3JlYXRlZCB0aGUgZG9jdW1lbnQuIEkgYWxzbyBjaGFuZ2VkIHRoZSA8YXJlYT4gZWxlbWVu dCBmcm9tIGhhdmluZyB0aGUgaW5jb3JyZWN0IG5vdGF0aW9uICJMVFJVIiB0byAiQXBwbGljYXRp b25zIiAod2hpY2ggaXMgd2hhdCBvdXIgY2hhcnRlciBzYXlzIG91ciBhcmVhIGlzKS4NCg0KQWRk aXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoNCkludGVy bmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRlY3R1cmUu DQoNCg0K From addison@amazon.com Mon Feb 16 11:48:19 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5EA7D3A6CD4 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:48:19 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id P0IqlEes-wsC for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:48:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E5BB3A6ADE for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:48:18 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,218,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="222414559" Received: from smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com ([10.248.183.17]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 16 Feb 2009 19:48:27 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-4103.sea5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1GJmP6W005544 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:48:25 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:48:24 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: "Phillips, Addison" , Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 11:48:23 -0800 Thread-Topic: issue #1 resolution[was: RE: IPR mumbles..] Thread-Index: AcmP6vCd6djNgQIiR7WSNd+Eyuhe/gAC/iPAAB3sTUA= Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9ABE@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9406@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <001601c98fea$edbd5fa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D94C3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D94C3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Ltru] issue #1 resolution[was: RE: IPR mumbles..] X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:48:19 -0000 KGVkaXRvciBoYXQgT0ZGKQ0KDQo+ID4gICAgLSBUaGUgdGV4dCBwdXQgaW4gZm9yIGlzc3VlICMx ICh3aGljaCB3YXMgY2FzdCBhcyBqdXN0DQo+ID4gICAgICB1cGRhdGluZyBhIHJlZmVyZW5jZSkg Y3JlYXRlcyBhIHRlY2huaWNhbCBjaGFuZ2UNCg0KSS4uLiBkb24ndCBleGFjdGx5IHNlZSBpdCB0 aGF0IHdheS4gUHJvY2Vzc2VzIGRvIGdldCB1cGRhdGVkIG92ZXIgdGltZS4gSW4gdGhpcyBjYXNl LCB0aGV5IHJlbmFtZWQgdGhlIHByb2Nlc3MgYnV0IGRvbid0IGFwcGVhciB0byBoYXZlIGNoYW5n ZWQgaXQgYXBwcmVjaWFibHkuIEl0IHN0aWxsIHJlcXVpcmVzIGFuIFJGQyB0byBnZXQgYSByZWdp c3RyeSBlbnRyeS4NCg0KQWRkaXNvbg0KDQpBZGRpc29uIFBoaWxsaXBzDQpHbG9iYWxpemF0aW9u IEFyY2hpdGVjdCAtLSBMYWIxMjYNCg0KSW50ZXJuYXRpb25hbGl6YXRpb24gaXMgbm90IGEgZmVh dHVyZS4NCkl0IGlzIGFuIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZS4NCg0KDQo+IC0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2Fn ZS0tLS0tDQo+IEZyb206IGx0cnUtYm91bmNlc0BpZXRmLm9yZyBbbWFpbHRvOmx0cnUtYm91bmNl c0BpZXRmLm9yZ10gT24NCj4gQmVoYWxmIE9mIFBoaWxsaXBzLCBBZGRpc29uDQo+IFNlbnQ6IFN1 bmRheSwgRmVicnVhcnkgMTUsIDIwMDkgOTozMSBQTQ0KPiBUbzogUmFuZHkgUHJlc3VobjsgTFRS VSBXb3JraW5nIEdyb3VwDQo+IFN1YmplY3Q6IFtMdHJ1XSBJUFIgbXVtYmxlcy4uDQo+IA0KPiBI aSBSYW5keSwNCj4gDQo+IFRoYW5rcyBmb3IgdGhpcy4NCj4gDQo+ID4NCj4gPiA+IFNpbmNlIHdl IGluY2x1ZGUgdGhlIDYuYy5paWkgbXVtYmxlLCBJIGhhdmUgYXBwbGllZCB0aGUNCj4gPiA+IG5v RGVyaXZhdGl2ZXMyMDA4MTEgSVBSIGRpcmVjdGl2ZS4NCj4gPg0KPiA+IEkgZG8gbm90IHRoaW5r IHdlIHdhbnQgdGhhdCwgc2luY2UgdGhhdCB3b3VsZCBoYW1zdHJpbmcgYXR0ZW1wdHMNCj4gdG8N Cj4gPiByZXZpc2VkIGl0IGluIHRoZSBmdXR1cmUuDQo+IA0KPiBJIGRvbid0IHRoaW5rIHRoYXQn cyBlbnRpcmVseSB0cnVlLiBUaGUgSUVURiBTdGFuZGFyZHMgUHJvY2VzcyBpcw0KPiBleHBsaWNp dGx5IGV4Y2x1ZGVkIGZyb20gdGhlIGRlcml2YXRpdmUgd29ya3MgdGV4dCwgYXQgbGVhc3QgaW4N Cj4gNi5jLmlpaS4gQXQgdGhlIHNhbWUgdGltZSwgNi5jLmlpaSBoYXMgYW4gZXhwbGljaXQgbm8t ZGVyaXZhdGl2ZXMNCj4gc2VjdGlvbiB0byBpdC4gSUFOQUwsIGJ1dCBzaW5jZSA2LmMuaWlpIHBy b2hpYml0cyBkZXJpdmF0aXZlcywgSQ0KPiBkb24ndCBzZWUgaG93IEkgY2FuIGNoZWNrICd0cnVz dDIwMDgxMSc/PyBDYW4gSSBnZXQgZ3VpZGFuY2Ugb24NCj4gdGhpcz8gSW4gdGhlIG1lYW50aW1l LCBJIGNhbiByZW1vdmUgdGhlIGFkZGl0aW9uYWwgbm8tZGVyaXZhdGl2ZXMNCj4gdGV4dCBhbmQg anVzdCB1c2UgNi5jLmlpaS4NCj4gDQo+ID4gLi4uDQo+ID4gPiBJIG1heSBuZWVkIHRvIG1vdmUg dGhlIDYuYy5paWkgbXVtYmxlIGludG8gdGhlIGNvcHlyaWdodA0KPiBtYW51YWxseQ0KPiA+IGJl Zm9yZSBzdWJtaXNzaW9uLg0KPiA+DQo+ID4gSSBkb24ndCByZWNhbGwgYW55b25lIHNheWluZyBl eGFjdGx5IHdoZXJlIHRoZSBpbmNhbnRhdGlvbiBuZWVkcw0KPiA+IHRvIGdvLCBidXQgaXQgd291 bGQgc2VlbSB0byBtYWtlIHNlbnNlIGFzIHRoZSBzZWNvbmQgcGFyYWdyYXBoDQo+ID4gb2YgdGhl ICJTdGF0dXMgb2YgdGhpcyBNZW1vIiBzZWN0aW9uIG9yIGFzIGEgdGhpcmQgcGFyYWdyYXBoIGlu DQo+ID4gdGhlIGNvcHlyaWdodCBub3RpY2UuICBUcmVhdGluZyBpdCBhcyBvcmRpbmFyeSB0ZXh0 IGJlZm9yZSB0aGUNCj4gPiBhYnNyYWN0IG1pZ2h0IGNhdXNlIFhNTDJSRkMgdG8gZG8gdGhlIHJp Z2h0IHRoaW5nLg0KPiANCj4gSSdsbCB0cnkgc29tZSBwZXJtdXRhdGlvbnMuIE15IGZpcnN0IGF0 dGVtcHQgd2Fzbid0IHN1Y2Nlc3NmdWwuDQo+IA0KPiA+DQo+ID4gU2Nhbm5pbmcgdGhlIGRpZmZz LCB0d28gcG90ZW50aWFsIHByb2JsZW1zIGp1bXBlZCBvdXQgYXQgbWU6DQo+ID4gICAgLSBUaGUg dGV4dCBwdXQgaW4gZm9yIGlzc3VlICMxICh3aGljaCB3YXMgY2FzdCBhcyBqdXN0DQo+ID4gICAg ICB1cGRhdGluZyBhIHJlZmVyZW5jZSkgY3JlYXRlcyBhIHRlY2huaWNhbCBjaGFuZ2UNCj4gPiAg ICAtIEl0IGxvb2tzIGlzc3VlICMzJ3MgYWdyZWVkIHRleHQgZGlkbid0IGdldCBwdXQgaW4uDQo+ ID4NCj4gPiBQTEVBU0UgcG9zdCBmb2xsb3d1cCBvbiB0aGVzZSB0d28gaXNzdWVzIChvciBvbiBh bnkgb3RoZXIgaXNzdWVzKQ0KPiA+IGluIHNlcGFyYXRlIHRocmVhZHMsIGluY2x1ZGluZyB0aGUg aXNzdWUgbnVtYmVyIGluIHRoZSBzdWJqZWN0DQo+IGxpbmUuDQo+ID4NCj4gDQo+IEFueSByZXNw b25zZSBmcm9tIG1lIHdpbGwgYmUgdW5kZXIgc2VwYXJhdGUgY292ZXIuLi4gSSBoYXZlIG5vdA0K PiBsb29rZWQgYXQgdGhlc2UgaXNzdWVzIGFzIG9mIHlldC4NCj4gDQo+IEFkZGlzb24NCj4gDQo+ IEFkZGlzb24gUGhpbGxpcHMNCj4gR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQo+ IA0KPiBJbnRlcm5hdGlvbmFsaXphdGlvbiBpcyBub3QgYSBmZWF0dXJlLg0KPiBJdCBpcyBhbiBh cmNoaXRlY3R1cmUuDQo+IA0KPiANCj4gDQo+IF9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fDQo+IEx0cnUgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQo+IEx0cnVAaWV0Zi5vcmcN Cj4gaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9sdHJ1DQo= From addison@amazon.com Mon Feb 16 12:01:55 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B78B43A67C1 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:01:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hZ1LeV2FY4p5 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:01:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EBAD828C111 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:01:48 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,218,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="222420572" Received: from smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com ([172.20.19.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 16 Feb 2009 20:01:58 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1GK1tNE010816 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL) for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 20:01:57 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:01:55 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: LTRU Working Group Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:01:53 -0800 Thread-Topic: idnits and editor's copy posted Thread-Index: AcmQcWmBVY7/X4RDTIeHrJOks8hmZQ== Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9B07@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Ltru] idnits and editor's copy posted X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 20:01:55 -0000 Li4uIHJhbiByZWxhdGl2ZWx5IGNsZWFubHkgYWdhaW5zdCBvdXIgbmV3IHRleHQuIEhvd2V2ZXIs IGl0IGNvbXBsYWlucyB0aGF0IHdlJ3JlIHVzaW5nIHRoZSAxMCBOb3ZlbWJlciAyMDA4IGNvcHly aWdodCBib2lsZXJwbGF0ZSByYXRoZXIgdGhhbiB0aGUgMTIgRmVidXJhcnkgMjAwOSBib2lsZXJw bGF0ZS4gU2luY2UgdG9kYXkgaXMgdGhlIDE2dGggb2YgRmVicnVhcnksIEkgc3VzcGVjdCB0aGF0 IHdlIG5lZWQgdG8gd2FpdCBmb3IgYSBuZXcgeG1sMnJmYy4gVGhpcyB3aWxsIGFsc28gZWxpbWlu YXRlIHRoZSBuZWVkIChJIHN1c3BlY3QpIGZvciBteSBzcGVjaWFsIG5vdGUuDQoNCkFyZSB0aGVy ZSBhbnkgKm90aGVyKiBjb21tZW50cyBvbiB0aGUgbmV3IGRyYWZ0PyBUaGUgZWRpdG9yJ3MgY29w eSBvbiBpbnRlci1sb2NhbGUgaXMgdXBkYXRlZC4gVGhlIGRpZmYgcmVtYWlucyBhdDoNCg0KICBo dHRwOi8vdGlueXVybC5jb20vY21oZ3k4DQoNCihmb3IgdGhlIGVkaXRvcnMpDQoNCkFkZGlzb24N Cg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoN CkludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRl Y3R1cmUuDQoNCg0K From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Mon Feb 16 13:24:44 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B175A3A6A0D for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 13:24:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.855 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.855 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.745, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ENomfGz5mRjV for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 13:24:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BD6B83A69C3 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 13:24:43 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=IKoF/Z9Q9At0GVDlWcFN0mgjb7rCDH0Ij4zvsqfB9/5pKCs96avxfqGDcLaxFyhI; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.166.188.57] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LZAxP-0006xS-IP for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 16:24:51 -0500 Message-ID: <001001c9907d$036915a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <9D735109FDC54820942807EF0FCF6A87@DGBP7M81><007f01c9896c$83ea1840$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA017DD817DA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><008401c98bc6$c47bc140$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><018601c98bd5$7fa6c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><014301c98d52$c97b3760$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><008301c98e13$3d36e3a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><001001c98ebf$39822ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D931A@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><004801c98fd3$e8518da0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer><4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9406@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com><001601c98fea$edbd5fa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D94C3@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9ABE@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 13:24:54 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173597fc453a0356947909ac203da3cedfa350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.166.188.57 Subject: Re: [Ltru] issue #1 resolution X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 21:24:44 -0000 Hi - Both as a technical contributor and as co-chair... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Phillips, Addison" ; "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 11:48 AM > Subject: issue #1 resolution[was: RE: IPR mumbles..] > > (editor hat OFF) > > > > - The text put in for issue #1 (which was cast as just > > > updating a reference) creates a technical change > > I... don't exactly see it that way. Processes do get updated > over time. In this case, they renamed the process but don't > appear to have changed it appreciably. It still requires an > RFC to get a registry entry. People of good will may have different interpretations of "appreciably." RFC 2434 said: IETF Consensus - New values are assigned through the IETF consensus process. Specifically, new assignments are made via RFCs approved by the IESG. Typically, the IESG will seek input on prospective assignments from appropriate persons (e.g., a relevant Working Group if one exists). RFC 5226 says: IETF Review - (Formerly called "IETF Consensus" in [IANA-CONSIDERATIONS]) New values are assigned only through RFCs that have been shepherded through the IESG as AD- Sponsored or IETF WG Documents [RFC3932] [RFC3978]. The intention is that the document and proposed assignment will be reviewed by the IESG and appropriate IETF WGs (or experts, if suitable working groups no longer exist) to ensure that the proposed assignment will not negatively impact interoperability or otherwise extend IETF protocols in an inappropriate or damaging manner. To ensure adequate community review, such documents are shepherded through the IESG as AD-sponsored (or WG) documents with an IETF Last Call. If there are no objections to this change (or if you think this is a non-change) then it's fine with me. I just want people to be clear about what the (non)changes are. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Mon Feb 16 17:13:24 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 852D03A694F for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 17:13:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.509 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.509 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.090, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ocBqeo7rQvp0 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 17:13:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6CB43A682A for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 17:13:23 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=WZqd8+k/L+LZ115jglGEkDhg5UckHbV+bTbPwXyJgJQ+WHTTzCrmU/uKczXy027c; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.26.151] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LZEWh-0005ub-Tv for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 20:13:32 -0500 Message-ID: <006201c9909c$f6acfdc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 17:13:37 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17374c1b65a02d1d7a1753a748a9b212e39350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.26.151 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 01:13:24 -0000 Hi - As co-chair: the editors are requested to make the agreed change. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "CE Whitehead" To: Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 9:01 AM Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue Hi! Back to section 1, par. 3: "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this document normatively but apply different rules to the ones given in this section MUST specify how language tag selection varies from the guidelines given here." I thought the issue tracker for issue 4 said "different to" would be replaced by the more widely used "different from"?? (http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/current/msg12171.html) I don't see this change in the text draft (http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt). (Otherwise looks really nice but I've just glanced at it.) Thanks! --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > From doug@ewellic.org Mon Feb 16 18:04:44 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 326553A67E2 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 18:04:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.186 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.186 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.188, BAYES_50=0.001, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bgai1H1VCAH6 for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 18:04:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpout05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout05-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.218]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3B5563A688C for ; Mon, 16 Feb 2009 18:04:42 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 9758 invoked from network); 17 Feb 2009 02:04:53 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.218) with ESMTP; 17 Feb 2009 02:04:52 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:04:50 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 02:04:44 -0000 "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some of the > correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Since we include the 6.c.iii > mumble, I have applied the noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. That would be exactly the wrong IPR statement to use in draft-4645bis, since one of its major raisons d'être is to allow IANA to create a derivative work, namely the replacement Language Subtag Registry. So I'm eagerly awaiting guidance on what statement I should use. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 17 10:42:02 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 076B63A6896 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:42:02 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.513 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.513 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.086, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GaGHTxjqzJRQ for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:42:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 39E533A6840 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:42:01 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=kdPilVm/FUIfYzFdv2nXiQTBaF2WyQTLJo/7O83IPMCZha8uv8fvbqHsZKZzzf/u; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.146.142] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LZUtY-0005hg-8X for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:42:12 -0500 Message-ID: <000401c9912f$762fbbe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:42:17 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731097754312a8c96d8c2f1ee9ae2c5d3e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.146.142 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 18:42:02 -0000 Hi - As co-chair: > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 6:04 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > > > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some of the > > correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Since we include the 6.c.iii > > mumble, I have applied the noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. > > That would be exactly the wrong IPR statement to use in draft-4645bis, > since one of its major raisons d'être is to allow IANA to create a > derivative work, namely the replacement Language Subtag Registry. So > I'm eagerly awaiting guidance on what statement I should use. ... noDerivatives200811 is definitely NOT the option to use. With regard to 4645bis, the question is whether Doug, as editor, sees a need for the 6.c.iii option. That's it, and it's his decision. If all (or practically all) the words are his, or were his in a previous incarnation, then there should be no need for the 6.c.iii text. Also worth keeping in mind: what is the likelihood that someone who contributed substantial text (not just an idea) to the development of 4645bis would sue if IANA used that text? What is the probability that such a litigant would prevail in court? Randy From addison@amazon.com Tue Feb 17 10:57:06 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5F29B3A6A72 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:57:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yhDwpmy0+EiT for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:57:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58E5E3A6989 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:57:05 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,224,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="223020379" Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 17 Feb 2009 18:57:16 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1HIvEPx030996 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Tue, 17 Feb 2009 18:57:15 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.28]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:57:14 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:57:00 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue Tracker Thread-Index: AcmRL4BT1Ro8ZqW8QFKuadd8CvtK9AAANofQ Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA0182728B0C@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <000401c9912f$762fbbe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <000401c9912f$762fbbe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 18:57:06 -0000 SSBoYXZlIG5vIG9iamVjdGlvbiB0byBvbWl0dGluZyB0aGUgNi5jLmlpaSBmcm9tIDQ2NDViaXMg KG9yIGluY2x1ZGluZyBpdCwgaWYgRG91ZyBwcmVmZXJzKS4gU2hvdWxkIE1hcmsgYW5kIEkgZmls ZSBhbnl0aGluZyByZWxhdGVkIHRvIDQ2NDViaXM/IEFmdGVyIGFsbCwgSSBzdXBwb3NlIG9uZSBj b3VsZCBvYmxpcXVlbHkgY29uc2lkZXIgZHJhZnQtbGFuZ3RhZyAod2F5IGJhY2sgYXQgdGhlIHN0 YXJ0IG9mIHRoaXMgcHJvamVjdCkgdG8gYmUgdGhlIHNvdXJjZSBvZiA0NjQ1IChuZWl0aGVyIG9m IHVzIGhhcyBldmVyIGVkaXRlZCB0aGUgZG9jdW1lbnQsIHBsZWFzZSBub3RlKS4NCg0KQWRkaXNv bg0KDQpBZGRpc29uIFBoaWxsaXBzDQpHbG9iYWxpemF0aW9uIEFyY2hpdGVjdCAtLSBMYWIxMjYN Cg0KSW50ZXJuYXRpb25hbGl6YXRpb24gaXMgbm90IGEgZmVhdHVyZS4NCkl0IGlzIGFuIGFyY2hp dGVjdHVyZS4NCg0KPiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBsdHJ1LWJv dW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21haWx0bzpsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIE9uDQo+IEJlaGFs ZiBPZiBSYW5keSBQcmVzdWhuDQo+IFNlbnQ6IFR1ZXNkYXksIEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDE3LCAyMDA5IDEw OjQyIEFNDQo+IFRvOiBMVFJVIFdvcmtpbmcgR3JvdXANCj4gU3ViamVjdDogUmU6IFtMdHJ1XSBJ c3N1ZSBUcmFja2VyDQo+IA0KPiBIaSAtDQo+IA0KPiBBcyBjby1jaGFpcjoNCj4gDQo+ID4gRnJv bTogIkRvdWcgRXdlbGwiIDxkb3VnQGV3ZWxsaWMub3JnPg0KPiA+IFRvOiAiTFRSVSBXb3JraW5n IEdyb3VwIiA8bHRydUBpZXRmLm9yZz4NCj4gPiBTZW50OiBNb25kYXksIEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDE2LCAy MDA5IDY6MDQgUE0NCj4gPiBTdWJqZWN0OiBSZTogW0x0cnVdIElzc3VlIFRyYWNrZXINCj4gPg0K PiA+ICJQaGlsbGlwcywgQWRkaXNvbiIgPGFkZGlzb24gYXQgYW1hem9uIGRvdCBjb20+IHdyb3Rl Og0KPiA+DQo+ID4gPiBJIGRpZCBpbnN0YWxsIHRoZSBsYXRlc3QgeG1sMnJmYyBEVEQuIEl0IGRv ZXMgcHJvZHVjZSBzb21lIG9mDQo+IHRoZQ0KPiA+ID4gY29ycmVjdCBtYWdpYyBtdW1ibGVzLCBi dXQgbm90IDYuYy5paWkuIFNpbmNlIHdlIGluY2x1ZGUgdGhlDQo+IDYuYy5paWkNCj4gPiA+IG11 bWJsZSwgSSBoYXZlIGFwcGxpZWQgdGhlIG5vRGVyaXZhdGl2ZXMyMDA4MTEgSVBSIGRpcmVjdGl2 ZS4NCj4gPg0KPiA+IFRoYXQgd291bGQgYmUgZXhhY3RseSB0aGUgd3JvbmcgSVBSIHN0YXRlbWVu dCB0byB1c2UgaW4gZHJhZnQtDQo+IDQ2NDViaXMsDQo+ID4gc2luY2Ugb25lIG9mIGl0cyBtYWpv ciByYWlzb25zIGQnw6p0cmUgaXMgdG8gYWxsb3cgSUFOQSB0byBjcmVhdGUNCj4gYQ0KPiA+IGRl cml2YXRpdmUgd29yaywgbmFtZWx5IHRoZSByZXBsYWNlbWVudCBMYW5ndWFnZSBTdWJ0YWcgUmVn aXN0cnkuDQo+IFNvDQo+ID4gSSdtIGVhZ2VybHkgYXdhaXRpbmcgZ3VpZGFuY2Ugb24gd2hhdCBz dGF0ZW1lbnQgSSBzaG91bGQgdXNlLg0KPiAuLi4NCj4gDQo+IG5vRGVyaXZhdGl2ZXMyMDA4MTEg aXMgZGVmaW5pdGVseSBOT1QgdGhlIG9wdGlvbiB0byB1c2UuDQo+IA0KPiBXaXRoIHJlZ2FyZCB0 byA0NjQ1YmlzLCB0aGUgcXVlc3Rpb24gaXMgd2hldGhlciBEb3VnLCBhcyBlZGl0b3IsDQo+IHNl ZXMgYSBuZWVkIGZvciB0aGUgNi5jLmlpaSBvcHRpb24uICBUaGF0J3MgaXQsIGFuZCBpdCdzIGhp cw0KPiBkZWNpc2lvbi4gIElmIGFsbCAob3IgcHJhY3RpY2FsbHkgYWxsKSB0aGUgd29yZHMgYXJl IGhpcywgb3INCj4gd2VyZSBoaXMgaW4gYSBwcmV2aW91cyBpbmNhcm5hdGlvbiwgdGhlbiB0aGVy ZSBzaG91bGQgYmUgbm8NCj4gbmVlZCBmb3IgdGhlIDYuYy5paWkgdGV4dC4NCj4gDQo+IEFsc28g d29ydGgga2VlcGluZyBpbiBtaW5kOiB3aGF0IGlzIHRoZSBsaWtlbGlob29kIHRoYXQgc29tZW9u ZQ0KPiB3aG8gY29udHJpYnV0ZWQgc3Vic3RhbnRpYWwgdGV4dCAobm90IGp1c3QgYW4gaWRlYSkg dG8gdGhlDQo+IGRldmVsb3BtZW50DQo+IG9mIDQ2NDViaXMgd291bGQgc3VlIGlmIElBTkEgdXNl ZCB0aGF0IHRleHQ/ICBXaGF0IGlzIHRoZQ0KPiBwcm9iYWJpbGl0eQ0KPiB0aGF0IHN1Y2ggYSBs aXRpZ2FudCB3b3VsZCBwcmV2YWlsIGluIGNvdXJ0Pw0KPiANCj4gUmFuZHkNCj4gDQo+IA0KPiBf X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiBMdHJ1IG1h aWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiBMdHJ1QGlldGYub3JnDQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxt YW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHRydQ0K From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 17 11:34:58 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDC693A6C23 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 11:34:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.517 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.517 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.082, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TKqPotTzxiHW for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 11:34:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B350F3A6882 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 11:34:57 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=ZrQu4AaeRbv7swATZjUFP9GeJ0P5n6wtkkVTQuABHgoguZy/nNTLwj4u7BsQLKoc; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.146.142] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LZVim-0004af-RQ for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 14:35:09 -0500 Message-ID: <000401c99136$dc59bd60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <000401c9912f$762fbbe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA0182728B0C@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 11:35:15 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1735e1f6c1f19803bd35eab7fd5b038199e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.146.142 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 19:34:59 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:57 AM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > I have no objection to omitting the 6.c.iii from 4645bis (or including it, > if Doug prefers). Should Mark and I file anything related to 4645bis? The "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" at http://trustee.ietf.org/licenses.html is still undergoing revision. If you like, you could fill it out and send it in when it becomes possible to do so. In the meantime, if you and Mark made clear on this list your intent to do so, that should be sufficient to make life easier for Doug. (BTW, I also intend to sign the "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" when it becomes available.) In Doug's case, if he is comfortable that the relevant contributors are willing to grant the same rights for their pre-RFC 5378 contributions as they now grant under the "NOTE WELL" currently in effect, (that's what signing the license accomplishes) then he doesn't need to do the 6.c.iii. The only reason I encourage doing 6.c.iii for *4646bis* is that there's a much larger set of contributors whose text may have made it verbatim into the document, and it's not immediately clear whether all of them have agreed / will agree to the RFC 5378 terms for their pre-RFC 5378 contributions. > After all, I suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag > (way back at the start of this project) to be the source of 4645 > (neither of us has ever edited the document, please note). In this particular case, since the issue is copyright, there is a concern only if significant text has been copied verbatim. If the authors of that earlier work can assure Doug that they agree to the 5378 terms, then there is no need for 6.c.iii, at least as far as those portions of the text are concerned. I hope this makes things clearer. (I also hope that I've understood the issues correctly. Martin, please speak up if I've mis-stated anything.) Randy From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Tue Feb 17 13:14:46 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 618A03A67D7 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:14:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.826 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.826 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.150, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wvRCw6XF3pzv for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:14:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from rv-out-0506.google.com (rv-out-0506.google.com [209.85.198.232]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E5E53A67A4 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:14:45 -0800 (PST) Received: by rv-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id l9so2106648rvb.49 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:14:56 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=DsgNzOCjXeLMnfuUReXbdT0J5YHpKrL2MaTnBD0txQg=; b=Vl/HQOSw9FQWTnXDx2LV0zqv2VgaIvdXhfOlFvsBnYPAoI2Aphmpbw8nGCzb+os0+b sY8yxhlcliWIwKptnRbP7QKgXgXCzF3TxY4o1SnVVs3pYWMVPA6QgBhTO4JeJnfEv0o3 e4yNY40jHB8vb7pce+z4xd0Q0IfxTjZw/hn8I= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=hH9JHVg9k4RtWH4CKMClea7pIghg+FKbsi2LkLEsyELPnmq6FFgpcXghnbfVXRAhF3 QYG9zWAh8aTJm18LIUfsri8qNyaRPdvQXXVAJIPG4YDieRTDJdG0kuCjqFh51aURh/es dzXBtc8yE1VmDL4INgQKKJvD0WJFaIivRnfvE= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Received: by 10.143.35.4 with SMTP id n4mr3151751wfj.177.1234905295996; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:14:55 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <000401c99136$dc59bd60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> References: <000401c9912f$762fbbe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA0182728B0C@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <000401c99136$dc59bd60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 13:14:55 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 1b40da8b6d1ccb8f Message-ID: <30b660a20902171314l27bbf092ue2c396bfdcfcf3fd@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: Randy Presuhn Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636e1fcd97fc847046323cbb6 Cc: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 21:14:46 -0000 --001636e1fcd97fc847046323cbb6 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > In the meantime, if you and Mark made clear on this list your intent to do so I do intend to file the Contributor Non-Exclusive License (assuming that the terms are not bizarre -- the whole roll-out of this new policy has been, let's say, suboptimal). Mark On Tue, Feb 17, 2009 at 11:35, Randy Presuhn wrote: > Hi - > > As co-chair... > > > From: "Phillips, Addison" > > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:57 AM > > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > > > I have no objection to omitting the 6.c.iii from 4645bis (or including > it, > > if Doug prefers). Should Mark and I file anything related to 4645bis? > > The "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" at > http://trustee.ietf.org/licenses.html > is still undergoing revision. If you like, you could fill it out and send > it in when it becomes possible to do so. In the meantime, if you and > Mark made clear on this list your intent to do so, that should be > sufficient > to make life easier for Doug. (BTW, I also intend to sign the "Contributor > Non-Exclusive License" when it becomes available.) > > In Doug's case, if he is comfortable that the relevant contributors > are willing to grant the same rights for their pre-RFC 5378 > contributions as they now grant under the "NOTE WELL" currently in > effect, (that's what signing the license accomplishes) then he doesn't > need to do the 6.c.iii. The only reason I encourage doing 6.c.iii for > *4646bis* is that there's a much larger set of contributors whose text > may have made it verbatim into the document, and it's not immediately clear > whether all of them have agreed / will agree to the RFC 5378 terms for > their pre-RFC 5378 contributions. > > > After all, I suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag > > (way back at the start of this project) to be the source of 4645 > > (neither of us has ever edited the document, please note). > > In this particular case, since the issue is copyright, there is > a concern only if significant text has been copied verbatim. > If the authors of that earlier work can assure Doug that they > agree to the 5378 terms, then there is no need for 6.c.iii, > at least as far as those portions of the text are concerned. > > I hope this makes things clearer. (I also hope that I've understood > the issues correctly. Martin, please speak up if I've mis-stated > anything.) > > Randy > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > --001636e1fcd97fc847046323cbb6 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable > In the meantime, if you and Mark made clear on this list your intent t= o do so

I do intend to file the Contributor Non-Exclusive License (a= ssuming that the terms are not bizarre -- the whole roll-out of this new po= licy has been, let's say, suboptimal).

Mark


On Tue, Feb 17, 2009 at 11:35, Randy Pre= suhn <= randy_presuhn@mindspring.com> wrote:
Hi -

As co-chair...

> From: "Phillips, Addison" <addison@amazon.com>
> To: "Randy Presuhn" <randy_presuhn@mindspring.com>; "LTRU Working = Group" <ltru@ietf.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:57 AM
> Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue Tracker
>
> I have no objection to omitting the 6.c.ii= i from 4645bis (or including it,
> if Doug prefers). Should Mark and I file anything related to 4645bis?<= br>
The "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" at http://trustee.ietf.org= /licenses.html
is still undergoing revision.  If you like, you could fill it out and = send
it in when it becomes possible to do so.  In the meantime, if you and<= br> Mark made clear on this list your intent to do so, that should be sufficien= t
to make life easier for Doug. (BTW, I also intend to sign the "Contrib= utor
Non-Exclusive License" when it becomes available.)

In Doug's case, if he is comfortable that the relevant contributors
are willing to grant the same rights for their pre-RFC 5378
contributions as they now grant under the "NOTE WELL" currently i= n
effect, (that's what signing the license accomplishes) then he doesn= 9;t
need to do the 6.c.iii.  The only reason I encourage doing 6.c.iii for=
*4646bis* is that there's a much larger set of contributors whose text<= br> may have made it verbatim into the document, and it's not immediately c= lear
whether all of them have agreed / will agree to the RFC 5378 terms for
their pre-RFC 5378 contributions.

> After all, I suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag
> (way back at the start of this project) to be the source of 4645
> (neither of us has ever edited the document, please note).

In this particular case, since the issue is copyright, there is
a concern only if significant text has been copied verbatim.
If the authors of that earlier work can assure Doug that they
agree to the 5378 terms, then there is no need for 6.c.iii,
at least as far as those portions of the text are concerned.

I hope this makes things clearer.  (I also hope that I've understo= od
the issues correctly.  Martin, please speak up if I've mis-stated<= br> anything.)

Randy

_______________________________________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru

--001636e1fcd97fc847046323cbb6-- From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp Tue Feb 17 18:54:02 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0370A3A6893 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 18:54:02 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bY3omiEorHmr for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 18:54:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.195]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6BD2E3A67D7 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 18:54:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (scmse2 [133.2.253.17]) by scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1I2sAqw018342 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 11:54:10 +0900 (JST) Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 7d16_6ac0e7e4_fd67_11dd_bc30_0019b9e2b3d9; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 11:54:10 +0900 Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:37810) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id for from ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 11:45:46 +0900 Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090218111257.08a4fef8@localhost> X-Sender: duerst@localhost X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 11:52:59 +0900 To: "Randy Presuhn" , "LTRU Working Group" From: Martin Duerst In-Reply-To: <000401c99136$dc59bd60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> References: <000401c9912f$762fbbe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA0182728B0C@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <000401c99136$dc59bd60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 02:54:02 -0000 Hello Randy, others, I agree with almost everything. On 4645bis, I'd note that: - The text in there is mostly if not completely fresh. - Some of the data part isn't fresh, but that's a mechanical compilation. - Based on the above and similar considerations, Doug already submitted an I-D without the pre-RFC 5378 escape hatch, so the decision has already been made. - If there is anything serious from the very early independent drafts that Addison and Mark wrote remaining in 4645bis, then what would be needed from Addison and Mark is just telling us (or Doug, to be specific) that they are okay for 4645bis without the escape hatch, which I think they have already done. Them signing the form is not a bad idea, but can be done separately. Regards, Martin. At 04:35 09/02/18, Randy Presuhn wrote: >Hi - > >As co-chair... > >> From: "Phillips, Addison" >> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > >> Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:57 AM >> Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue Tracker >> >> I have no objection to omitting the 6.c.iii from 4645bis (or including it, >> if Doug prefers). Should Mark and I file anything related to 4645bis? > >The "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" at http://trustee.ietf.org/licenses.html >is still undergoing revision. If you like, you could fill it out and send >it in when it becomes possible to do so. In the meantime, if you and >Mark made clear on this list your intent to do so, that should be sufficient >to make life easier for Doug. (BTW, I also intend to sign the "Contributor >Non-Exclusive License" when it becomes available.) > >In Doug's case, if he is comfortable that the relevant contributors >are willing to grant the same rights for their pre-RFC 5378 >contributions as they now grant under the "NOTE WELL" currently in >effect, (that's what signing the license accomplishes) then he doesn't >need to do the 6.c.iii. The only reason I encourage doing 6.c.iii for >*4646bis* is that there's a much larger set of contributors whose text >may have made it verbatim into the document, and it's not immediately clear >whether all of them have agreed / will agree to the RFC 5378 terms for >their pre-RFC 5378 contributions. > >> After all, I suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag >> (way back at the start of this project) to be the source of 4645 >> (neither of us has ever edited the document, please note). > >In this particular case, since the issue is copyright, there is >a concern only if significant text has been copied verbatim. >If the authors of that earlier work can assure Doug that they >agree to the 5378 terms, then there is no need for 6.c.iii, >at least as far as those portions of the text are concerned. > >I hope this makes things clearer. (I also hope that I've understood >the issues correctly. Martin, please speak up if I've mis-stated >anything.) > >Randy > >_______________________________________________ >Ltru mailing list >Ltru@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru #-#-# Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University #-#-# http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp From doug@ewellic.org Tue Feb 17 22:37:00 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 283303A6C40 for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 22:37:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.448 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.448 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.150, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 909X1TR1+Oew for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 22:36:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.39]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 26BD93A6C1F for ; Tue, 17 Feb 2009 22:36:58 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 27497 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2009 06:37:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth14.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.39) with ESMTP; 18 Feb 2009 06:37:08 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 23:36:23 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: [Ltru] IPR for draft-4645bis (was: Re: Issue Tracker) X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 06:37:00 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: > With regard to 4645bis, the question is whether Doug, as editor, sees > a need for the 6.c.iii option. That's it, and it's his decision. If > all (or practically all) the words are his, or were his in a previous > incarnation, then there should be no need for the 6.c.iii text. I would say that except for a few short passages, the text of draft-4645bis is essentially all mine. There are some sentences that deal with the RFC Editor removing the Registry contents before publication; these were contributed by one co-chair or the other. I think John Cowan contributed part of a sentence having to do with the new Registry being a complete replacement and not a set of changes to be applied by IANA. That's it. Of course, the draft does incorporate concepts and ideas (but not verbatim text) from many other list members. I think that's what an editor in a WG is supposed to do. > Also worth keeping in mind: what is the likelihood that someone who > contributed substantial text (not just an idea) to the development of > 4645bis would sue if IANA used that text? What is the probability > that such a litigant would prevail in court? I don't feel there's much to worry about. "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > Should Mark and I file anything related to 4645bis? After all, I > suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag (way back at the > start of this project) to be the source of 4645 (neither of us has > ever edited the document, please note). The concept of a separate Registry was described in draft-phillips-langtag well before it was decided to use an Internet-Draft to transmit the Registry contents to IANA (the first purpose of 4645), and also before it was decided to use the draft to explain the process of arriving at those contents (the second purpose). But I don't believe any version of draft-langtag went into anywhere near enough depth in these regards to be considered a Contribution toward 4645, let alone 4645bis. In any event, I don't expect Addison or Mark to sue me either. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From gerard.lang@insee.fr Wed Feb 18 00:20:45 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA8793A6A64 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 00:20:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.949 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.949 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_FR=0.35, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lzMv1nPpaw06 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 00:20:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from mercure.insee.fr (mercure.insee.fr [81.255.68.34]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 33E9D3A689F for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 00:20:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from evariste.insee.fr (unknown [194.254.38.143]) by mercure.insee.fr (Insee Mail Server) with ESMTP id A28E613374D for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 09:20:52 +0100 (CET) Received: from localhost (unknown [127.0.0.1]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id 50FD379401F for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 09:20:52 +0100 (CET) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at insee.fr Received: from evariste.insee.fr ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (evariste.insee.fr [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Vy+SHdkwZx4S for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 09:20:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra (unknown [194.254.38.144]) by evariste.insee.fr (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4A4D79401E for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 09:20:51 +0100 (CET) Received: from S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra ([10.90.200.50]) by s90x2smtp.ad.insee.intra with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Wed, 18 Feb 2009 09:20:52 +0100 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 09:20:52 +0100 Message-ID: <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD0A1E@S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra> In-Reply-To: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40 Thread-Index: AcmRNtuUxWmdrUKsTneyaBW8XI17CwAaCS/Q References: From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= To: X-OriginalArrivalTime: 18 Feb 2009 08:20:52.0210 (UTC) FILETIME=[CFFE9520:01C991A1] Cc: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Lang_G=E9rard?= Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 08:20:45 -0000 Dear All, 1-I have a question in relation with clause 15 B inside 3.4 Stability = of the IANA Registry Entries, concerning "narrowing" of the meaning = associated with a code element and how does this apply in the case of = "YU". >From the beginning and this is also the case inside ISO 3166 (1988), = third edition, (YU, YUG, 890) representing YUGOSLAVIA (The Socialisqt = Federative Repuiblic of Yugoslavia) covers the six Republics forminf = YUGOSLAVIA. But, on 1992-06-06, ISO 3166 created (HR, HRV, 191) for CROATIA, so that = Yu was left with only five Republics. The same happened when ISO 3166 created (BA, BIH, 070) for = BOSNIA-HERZEGOVINE and (SI, SVN, 705) for SLOVENIA on 1993-06-15 and = also after rthat created (Mk, MKD, 807) for MAKEDONIA, so that YU was = gradually narrowed from 6 to only 2 of the original Republics forming = YUGOSLAVIA, without any change of the country name. Only on 1993-07-15 intervened a minor change, transforming (YU, YUG, = 890) to (YU, YUG, 891) marking the "narrowing" of the considered = territory without any change of the country name., that only changed to = SERBIA AND MONTENEGRO on 2003-07-23 when (YU, YUG, 890) was deprecated.=20 How does clause 3.4 manage with this interesting case ? 2-Concerning point 9.1 of 4646bis-21, the dates for standards should be = aligned with precision : -ISO 639-1 July 2002; -ISO 639-2 October 1998 (Moreover "first edition", that is not included = in the standard's title should be deleted ); -ISO 639-3 February 2007; -ISO 646 December 1991. Cordialement. G=E9rard LANG -----Message d'origine----- De : ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de = ltru-request@ietf.org Envoy=E9 : mardi 17 f=E9vrier 2009 20:35 =C0 : ltru@ietf.org Objet : Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40 Send Ltru mailing list submissions to ltru@ietf.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ltru-request@ietf.org You can reach the person managing the list at ltru-owner@ietf.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than = "Re: Contents of Ltru digest..." Today's Topics: 1. idnits and editor's copy posted (Phillips, Addison) 2. Re: issue #1 resolution (Randy Presuhn) 3. Re: Issue #4: "different from" issue (Randy Presuhn) 4. Re: Issue Tracker (Doug Ewell) 5. Re: Issue Tracker (Randy Presuhn) 6. Re: Issue Tracker (Phillips, Addison) 7. Re: Issue Tracker (Randy Presuhn) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:01:53 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" Subject: [Ltru] idnits and editor's copy posted To: LTRU Working Group Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9B07@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8" ... ran relatively cleanly against our new text. However, it complains = that we're using the 10 November 2008 copyright boilerplate rather than = the 12 Feburary 2009 boilerplate. Since today is the 16th of February, I = suspect that we need to wait for a new xml2rfc. This will also eliminate = the need (I suspect) for my special note. Are there any *other* comments on the new draft? The editor's copy on = inter-locale is updated. The diff remains at: http://tinyurl.com/cmhgy8 (for the editors) Addison Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 13:24:54 -0800 From: "Randy Presuhn" Subject: Re: [Ltru] issue #1 resolution To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: <001001c9907d$036915a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8" Hi - Both as a technical contributor and as co-chair... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Phillips, Addison" ; "Randy Presuhn"=20 > ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 11:48 AM > Subject: issue #1 resolution[was: RE: IPR mumbles..] > > (editor hat OFF) > > > > - The text put in for issue #1 (which was cast as just > > > updating a reference) creates a technical change > > I... don't exactly see it that way. Processes do get updated over=20 > time. In this case, they renamed the process but don't appear to have=20 > changed it appreciably. It still requires an RFC to get a registry=20 > entry. People of good will may have different interpretations of "appreciably." RFC 2434 said: IETF Consensus - New values are assigned through the IETF consensus process. Specifically, new assignments are made via RFCs approved by the IESG. Typically, the IESG will seek input on prospective assignments from appropriate persons (e.g., a relevant Working Group if one exists). RFC 5226 says: IETF Review - (Formerly called "IETF Consensus" in [IANA-CONSIDERATIONS]) New values are assigned only through RFCs that have been shepherded through the IESG as AD- Sponsored or IETF WG Documents [RFC3932] [RFC3978]. The intention is that the document and proposed assignment will be reviewed by the IESG and appropriate IETF WGs (or experts, if suitable working groups no longer exist) to ensure that the proposed assignment will not negatively impact interoperability or otherwise extend IETF protocols in an inappropriate or damaging manner. To ensure adequate community review, such documents are shepherded through the IESG as AD-sponsored (or WG) documents with an IETF Last Call. If there are no objections to this change (or if you think this is a = non-change) then it's fine with me. I just want people to be clear = about what the (non)changes are. Randy ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 17:13:37 -0800 From: "Randy Presuhn" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue To: Message-ID: <006201c9909c$f6acfdc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1" Hi - As co-chair: the editors are requested to make the agreed change. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "CE Whitehead" To: Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 9:01 AM Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue Hi! Back to section 1, par. 3: "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this document normatively but apply different rules to the ones given in this section MUST specify how language tag selection varies from the guidelines given here." I thought the issue tracker for issue 4 said "different to" would be = replaced by the more widely used "different from"?? (http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/current/msg12171.html) I don't see this change in the text draft = (http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt). (Otherwise looks really nice but I've just glanced at it.) Thanks! --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ------- > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru >=20 ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:04:50 -0700 From: "Doug Ewell" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=3Dflowed; charset=3D"utf-8"; reply-type=3Doriginal "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some of the=20 > correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Since we include the 6.c.iii=20 > mumble, I have applied the noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. That would be exactly the wrong IPR statement to use in draft-4645bis,=20 since one of its major raisons d'?tre is to allow IANA to create a=20 derivative work, namely the replacement Language Subtag Registry. So=20 I'm eagerly awaiting guidance on what statement I should use. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ? ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:42:17 -0800 From: "Randy Presuhn" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: <000401c9912f$762fbbe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8" Hi - As co-chair: > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 6:04 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > > > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some of the > > correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Since we include the 6.c.iii > > mumble, I have applied the noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. > > That would be exactly the wrong IPR statement to use in draft-4645bis, > since one of its major raisons d'?tre is to allow IANA to create a > derivative work, namely the replacement Language Subtag Registry. So > I'm eagerly awaiting guidance on what statement I should use. ... noDerivatives200811 is definitely NOT the option to use. With regard to 4645bis, the question is whether Doug, as editor, sees a need for the 6.c.iii option. That's it, and it's his decision. If all (or practically all) the words are his, or were his in a previous incarnation, then there should be no need for the 6.c.iii text. Also worth keeping in mind: what is the likelihood that someone who contributed substantial text (not just an idea) to the development of 4645bis would sue if IANA used that text? What is the probability that such a litigant would prevail in court? Randy ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:57:00 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA0182728B0C@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8" I have no objection to omitting the 6.c.iii from 4645bis (or including = it, if Doug prefers). Should Mark and I file anything related to = 4645bis? After all, I suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag = (way back at the start of this project) to be the source of 4645 = (neither of us has ever edited the document, please note). Addison Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. > -----Original Message----- > From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf Of Randy Presuhn > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:42 AM > To: LTRU Working Group > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker >=20 > Hi - >=20 > As co-chair: >=20 > > From: "Doug Ewell" > > To: "LTRU Working Group" > > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 6:04 PM > > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > > > "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > > > > > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some of > the > > > correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Since we include the > 6.c.iii > > > mumble, I have applied the noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. > > > > That would be exactly the wrong IPR statement to use in draft- > 4645bis, > > since one of its major raisons d'?tre is to allow IANA to create > a > > derivative work, namely the replacement Language Subtag Registry. > So > > I'm eagerly awaiting guidance on what statement I should use. > ... >=20 > noDerivatives200811 is definitely NOT the option to use. >=20 > With regard to 4645bis, the question is whether Doug, as editor, > sees a need for the 6.c.iii option. That's it, and it's his > decision. If all (or practically all) the words are his, or > were his in a previous incarnation, then there should be no > need for the 6.c.iii text. >=20 > Also worth keeping in mind: what is the likelihood that someone > who contributed substantial text (not just an idea) to the > development > of 4645bis would sue if IANA used that text? What is the > probability > that such a litigant would prevail in court? >=20 > Randy >=20 >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 11:35:15 -0800 From: "Randy Presuhn" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: <000401c99136$dc59bd60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"utf-8" Hi - As co-chair... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working = Group" > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:57 AM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > I have no objection to omitting the 6.c.iii from 4645bis (or including = it, > if Doug prefers). Should Mark and I file anything related to 4645bis? The "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" at = http://trustee.ietf.org/licenses.html is still undergoing revision. If you like, you could fill it out and = send it in when it becomes possible to do so. In the meantime, if you and Mark made clear on this list your intent to do so, that should be = sufficient to make life easier for Doug. (BTW, I also intend to sign the = "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" when it becomes available.) In Doug's case, if he is comfortable that the relevant contributors are willing to grant the same rights for their pre-RFC 5378 contributions as they now grant under the "NOTE WELL" currently in effect, (that's what signing the license accomplishes) then he doesn't need to do the 6.c.iii. The only reason I encourage doing 6.c.iii for *4646bis* is that there's a much larger set of contributors whose text may have made it verbatim into the document, and it's not immediately = clear whether all of them have agreed / will agree to the RFC 5378 terms for their pre-RFC 5378 contributions. > After all, I suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag > (way back at the start of this project) to be the source of 4645 > (neither of us has ever edited the document, please note). In this particular case, since the issue is copyright, there is a concern only if significant text has been copied verbatim. If the authors of that earlier work can assure Doug that they agree to the 5378 terms, then there is no need for 6.c.iii, at least as far as those portions of the text are concerned. I hope this makes things clearer. (I also hope that I've understood the issues correctly. Martin, please speak up if I've mis-stated anything.) Randy ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru End of Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40 ************************************ From doug@ewellic.org Wed Feb 18 05:43:45 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 32B323A6D23 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 05:43:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.64 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.64 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.958, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wgZOGVijvnUd for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 05:43:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth22.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth22.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 266F33A6CB7 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 05:43:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 23459 invoked from network); 18 Feb 2009 13:43:55 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth22.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.44) with ESMTP; 18 Feb 2009 13:43:54 -0000 Message-ID: <62CEE4D227A942B5B2C3B7AB87ECC154@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 06:43:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: [Ltru] Narrowing of YU and title of ISO 639-2 (was: Re: Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40) X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 13:43:45 -0000 Lang Gérard wrote: > ... > Only on 1993-07-15 intervened a minor change, transforming (YU, YUG, > 890) to (YU, YUG, 891) marking the "narrowing" of the considered > territory without any change of the country name., that only changed > to SERBIA AND MONTENEGRO on 2003-07-23 when (YU, YUG, 890) was > deprecated. How does clause 3.4 manage with this interesting case ? I think BCP 47 avoids having to deal with this because the narrowing of "Yugoslavia," from six member republics to two, happened well before the publication of RFC 4646 in 2006. Before RFC 4646, language tags were defined as using ISO 3166 country code elements directly, and there was no claim that the language tagging spec would attempt to impose stability that wasn't present in the ISO standards. I don't know (or remember) exactly how we would handle a case like 'YU' in the future. Obviously the original meaning "language X as used in Yugoslavia" proved to be rather pointless, as the individual republics have since claimed that their usage of "Serbo-Croatian" constitutes not merely a separate language variety but a different language entirely. That might not be the case next time. > 2-Concerning point 9.1 of 4646bis-21, the dates for standards should > be aligned with precision : > -ISO 639-1 July 2002; > -ISO 639-2 October 1998 (Moreover "first edition", that is not > included in the standard's title should be deleted ); > -ISO 639-3 February 2007; > -ISO 646 December 1991. Gérard had already written to me privately to make the change in the title of ISO 639-2 in draft-4645bis. Co-chairs, please enter this into the issue tracker. I assume it would be non-controversial. As a side note, speaking as an individual, it is greatly appreciated if posters do NOT post the entire contents of a digest, including unrelated posts and headers, at the end of their messages. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Wed Feb 18 10:50:51 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D986C28C0EA for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 10:50:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AS-vakpesU3g for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 10:50:49 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7ABB028C0D0 for ; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 10:50:49 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Y0aJQf3NnGvipzGVxLTV5dQx4iYdK58yEe2BV/nwV7inSuz00cXFHseNCTYFoebJ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.136.108] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LZrVb-00014w-3o for ltru@ietf.org; Wed, 18 Feb 2009 13:50:59 -0500 Message-ID: <001101c991f9$dc17c7c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: References: <68723E6B2E0EDC4999504D17DDE8F94904AD0A1E@S90X2HUB1.ad.insee.intra> Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 10:51:06 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173e7834e57cfcd0c643047cdf8b7e3abd9350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.136.108 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2009 18:50:51 -0000 Hi - As co-chair: PLEASE, if you are raising (or attempting to re-open) issues, PLEASE use a different subject line for EACH issue for tracking sanity. Otherwise, I'll just assume this post was a bunch of rhetorical questions. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lang Grard" To: Cc: "Lang Grard" Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2009 12:20 AM Subject: Re: [Ltru] Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40 Dear All, 1-I have a question in relation with clause 15 B inside 3.4 Stability of the IANA Registry Entries, concerning "narrowing" of the meaning associated with a code element and how does this apply in the case of "YU". >From the beginning and this is also the case inside ISO 3166 (1988), third edition, (YU, YUG, 890) representing YUGOSLAVIA (The Socialisqt Federative Repuiblic of Yugoslavia) covers the six Republics forminf YUGOSLAVIA. But, on 1992-06-06, ISO 3166 created (HR, HRV, 191) for CROATIA, so that Yu was left with only five Republics. The same happened when ISO 3166 created (BA, BIH, 070) for BOSNIA-HERZEGOVINE and (SI, SVN, 705) for SLOVENIA on 1993-06-15 and also after rthat created (Mk, MKD, 807) for MAKEDONIA, so that YU was gradually narrowed from 6 to only 2 of the original Republics forming YUGOSLAVIA, without any change of the country name. Only on 1993-07-15 intervened a minor change, transforming (YU, YUG, 890) to (YU, YUG, 891) marking the "narrowing" of the considered territory without any change of the country name., that only changed to SERBIA AND MONTENEGRO on 2003-07-23 when (YU, YUG, 890) was deprecated. How does clause 3.4 manage with this interesting case ? 2-Concerning point 9.1 of 4646bis-21, the dates for standards should be aligned with precision : -ISO 639-1 July 2002; -ISO 639-2 October 1998 (Moreover "first edition", that is not included in the standard's title should be deleted ); -ISO 639-3 February 2007; -ISO 646 December 1991. Cordialement. Grard LANG -----Message d'origine----- De : ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] De la part de ltru-request@ietf.org Envoy : mardi 17 fvrier 2009 20:35 : ltru@ietf.org Objet : Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40 Send Ltru mailing list submissions to ltru@ietf.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to ltru-request@ietf.org You can reach the person managing the list at ltru-owner@ietf.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Ltru digest..." Today's Topics: 1. idnits and editor's copy posted (Phillips, Addison) 2. Re: issue #1 resolution (Randy Presuhn) 3. Re: Issue #4: "different from" issue (Randy Presuhn) 4. Re: Issue Tracker (Doug Ewell) 5. Re: Issue Tracker (Randy Presuhn) 6. Re: Issue Tracker (Phillips, Addison) 7. Re: Issue Tracker (Randy Presuhn) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 12:01:53 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" Subject: [Ltru] idnits and editor's copy posted To: LTRU Working Group Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA01824D9B07@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" ... ran relatively cleanly against our new text. However, it complains that we're using the 10 November 2008 copyright boilerplate rather than the 12 Feburary 2009 boilerplate. Since today is the 16th of February, I suspect that we need to wait for a new xml2rfc. This will also eliminate the need (I suspect) for my special note. Are there any *other* comments on the new draft? The editor's copy on inter-locale is updated. The diff remains at: http://tinyurl.com/cmhgy8 (for the editors) Addison Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 13:24:54 -0800 From: "Randy Presuhn" Subject: Re: [Ltru] issue #1 resolution To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: <001001c9907d$036915a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Hi - Both as a technical contributor and as co-chair... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Phillips, Addison" ; "Randy Presuhn" > ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 11:48 AM > Subject: issue #1 resolution[was: RE: IPR mumbles..] > > (editor hat OFF) > > > > - The text put in for issue #1 (which was cast as just > > > updating a reference) creates a technical change > > I... don't exactly see it that way. Processes do get updated over > time. In this case, they renamed the process but don't appear to have > changed it appreciably. It still requires an RFC to get a registry > entry. People of good will may have different interpretations of "appreciably." RFC 2434 said: IETF Consensus - New values are assigned through the IETF consensus process. Specifically, new assignments are made via RFCs approved by the IESG. Typically, the IESG will seek input on prospective assignments from appropriate persons (e.g., a relevant Working Group if one exists). RFC 5226 says: IETF Review - (Formerly called "IETF Consensus" in [IANA-CONSIDERATIONS]) New values are assigned only through RFCs that have been shepherded through the IESG as AD- Sponsored or IETF WG Documents [RFC3932] [RFC3978]. The intention is that the document and proposed assignment will be reviewed by the IESG and appropriate IETF WGs (or experts, if suitable working groups no longer exist) to ensure that the proposed assignment will not negatively impact interoperability or otherwise extend IETF protocols in an inappropriate or damaging manner. To ensure adequate community review, such documents are shepherded through the IESG as AD-sponsored (or WG) documents with an IETF Last Call. If there are no objections to this change (or if you think this is a non-change) then it's fine with me. I just want people to be clear about what the (non)changes are. Randy ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 17:13:37 -0800 From: "Randy Presuhn" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue To: Message-ID: <006201c9909c$f6acfdc0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hi - As co-chair: the editors are requested to make the agreed change. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "CE Whitehead" To: Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 9:01 AM Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #4: "different from" issue Hi! Back to section 1, par. 3: "Standards, protocols, and applications that reference this document normatively but apply different rules to the ones given in this section MUST specify how language tag selection varies from the guidelines given here." I thought the issue tracker for issue 4 said "different to" would be replaced by the more widely used "different from"?? (http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ltru/current/msg12171.html) I don't see this change in the text draft (http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt). (Otherwise looks really nice but I've just glanced at it.) Thanks! --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Mon, 16 Feb 2009 19:04:50 -0700 From: "Doug Ewell" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some of the > correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Since we include the 6.c.iii > mumble, I have applied the noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. That would be exactly the wrong IPR statement to use in draft-4645bis, since one of its major raisons d'?tre is to allow IANA to create a derivative work, namely the replacement Language Subtag Registry. So I'm eagerly awaiting guidance on what statement I should use. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ? ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:42:17 -0800 From: "Randy Presuhn" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: <000401c9912f$762fbbe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Hi - As co-chair: > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 6:04 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > > > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some of the > > correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Since we include the 6.c.iii > > mumble, I have applied the noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. > > That would be exactly the wrong IPR statement to use in draft-4645bis, > since one of its major raisons d'?tre is to allow IANA to create a > derivative work, namely the replacement Language Subtag Registry. So > I'm eagerly awaiting guidance on what statement I should use. ... noDerivatives200811 is definitely NOT the option to use. With regard to 4645bis, the question is whether Doug, as editor, sees a need for the 6.c.iii option. That's it, and it's his decision. If all (or practically all) the words are his, or were his in a previous incarnation, then there should be no need for the 6.c.iii text. Also worth keeping in mind: what is the likelihood that someone who contributed substantial text (not just an idea) to the development of 4645bis would sue if IANA used that text? What is the probability that such a litigant would prevail in court? Randy ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 10:57:00 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA0182728B0C@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" I have no objection to omitting the 6.c.iii from 4645bis (or including it, if Doug prefers). Should Mark and I file anything related to 4645bis? After all, I suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag (way back at the start of this project) to be the source of 4645 (neither of us has ever edited the document, please note). Addison Addison Phillips Globalization Architect -- Lab126 Internationalization is not a feature. It is an architecture. > -----Original Message----- > From: ltru-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:ltru-bounces@ietf.org] On > Behalf Of Randy Presuhn > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:42 AM > To: LTRU Working Group > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > Hi - > > As co-chair: > > > From: "Doug Ewell" > > To: "LTRU Working Group" > > Sent: Monday, February 16, 2009 6:04 PM > > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > > > "Phillips, Addison" wrote: > > > > > I did install the latest xml2rfc DTD. It does produce some of > the > > > correct magic mumbles, but not 6.c.iii. Since we include the > 6.c.iii > > > mumble, I have applied the noDerivatives200811 IPR directive. > > > > That would be exactly the wrong IPR statement to use in draft- > 4645bis, > > since one of its major raisons d'?tre is to allow IANA to create > a > > derivative work, namely the replacement Language Subtag Registry. > So > > I'm eagerly awaiting guidance on what statement I should use. > ... > > noDerivatives200811 is definitely NOT the option to use. > > With regard to 4645bis, the question is whether Doug, as editor, > sees a need for the 6.c.iii option. That's it, and it's his > decision. If all (or practically all) the words are his, or > were his in a previous incarnation, then there should be no > need for the 6.c.iii text. > > Also worth keeping in mind: what is the likelihood that someone > who contributed substantial text (not just an idea) to the > development > of 4645bis would sue if IANA used that text? What is the > probability > that such a litigant would prevail in court? > > Randy > > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2009 11:35:15 -0800 From: "Randy Presuhn" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue Tracker To: "LTRU Working Group" Message-ID: <000401c99136$dc59bd60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Hi - As co-chair... > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Tuesday, February 17, 2009 10:57 AM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Issue Tracker > > I have no objection to omitting the 6.c.iii from 4645bis (or including it, > if Doug prefers). Should Mark and I file anything related to 4645bis? The "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" at http://trustee.ietf.org/licenses.html is still undergoing revision. If you like, you could fill it out and send it in when it becomes possible to do so. In the meantime, if you and Mark made clear on this list your intent to do so, that should be sufficient to make life easier for Doug. (BTW, I also intend to sign the "Contributor Non-Exclusive License" when it becomes available.) In Doug's case, if he is comfortable that the relevant contributors are willing to grant the same rights for their pre-RFC 5378 contributions as they now grant under the "NOTE WELL" currently in effect, (that's what signing the license accomplishes) then he doesn't need to do the 6.c.iii. The only reason I encourage doing 6.c.iii for *4646bis* is that there's a much larger set of contributors whose text may have made it verbatim into the document, and it's not immediately clear whether all of them have agreed / will agree to the RFC 5378 terms for their pre-RFC 5378 contributions. > After all, I suppose one could obliquely consider draft-langtag > (way back at the start of this project) to be the source of 4645 > (neither of us has ever edited the document, please note). In this particular case, since the issue is copyright, there is a concern only if significant text has been copied verbatim. If the authors of that earlier work can assure Doug that they agree to the 5378 terms, then there is no need for 6.c.iii, at least as far as those portions of the text are concerned. I hope this makes things clearer. (I also hope that I've understood the issues correctly. Martin, please speak up if I've mis-stated anything.) Randy ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru End of Ltru Digest, Vol 48, Issue 40 ************************************ _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From doug@ewellic.org Fri Feb 20 05:24:46 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 724CC3A68BB for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 05:24:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.579 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.579 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.581, BAYES_50=0.001, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IJIVXAy9ca2k for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 05:24:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.31]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 611933A6838 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 05:24:45 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 27728 invoked from network); 20 Feb 2009 13:24:59 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth18.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.31) with ESMTP; 20 Feb 2009 13:24:59 -0000 Message-ID: <5E5035D7D38B41C7B12889AAA89CB840@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 06:24:02 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: [Ltru] Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 13:24:46 -0000 The ISO 639-5 data has finally, at long last, been made publicly available on the Web: http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/ I propose modifying the text and references in draft-4645bis to refer to this Web site and files taken from it, much the same way that it references the ISO 639-2 and 639-3 sites, instead of referring to PDF files and private agreements about how to handle "Galibi Carib." Please enter this into the issue tracker. These changes would not take long. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Fri Feb 20 07:43:37 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EEF3A28C255 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 07:43:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.876 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.876 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.100, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yOeUNUtCZ7Iw for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 07:43:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.168]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AF6628C253 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 07:43:37 -0800 (PST) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so1191101wfd.31 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 07:43:51 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=QQPkuSGb6sI6W/sgYOMtlM7CaBAVhDnJf45lR2OwEiw=; b=RFhmVmf32r4BX1bRiJImtQuokRRu9WjAWlKoAu4+ftCeYmy55JF/453J43lCpl019q RE/pp7o9Cyz49NPPEu6NEsp2VkpkmwgMWlk5Ko6mChjZBCX62HDbQ+oFjwVhLx4SRnmQ t0X34dYpsw4oDRUwCyaYiw85Fs/Ji38rJRH4Q= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=TM+aPRZIrHVOwAF4T0+cHO3GTUuPupKXKqKDWlFGjE66rTHa2pycZNMbPvtbrHif8X uUIlQ/TA/RSfEXssGlWvtRv3rshjrM/eMJowMJafBFH4k6KBmMRoaC9HYKyGWub1RN5p +8Yx5S9UwVVf4KwvdaOTrWKNHuK23EWCftxFc= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Received: by 10.142.106.19 with SMTP id e19mr462281wfc.228.1235144631078; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 07:43:51 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <5E5035D7D38B41C7B12889AAA89CB840@DGBP7M81> References: <5E5035D7D38B41C7B12889AAA89CB840@DGBP7M81> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 07:43:50 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 2663515cd46d04a9 Message-ID: <30b660a20902200743o4904274bl510efaec16e8ae1e@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: Doug Ewell Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001636e1fc01fb507f04635b84f1 Cc: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 15:43:38 -0000 --001636e1fc01fb507f04635b84f1 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree. Mark On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 05:24, Doug Ewell wrote: > The ISO 639-5 data has finally, at long last, been made publicly availabl= e > on the Web: > > http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/ > > I propose modifying the text and references in draft-4645bis to refer to > this Web site and files taken from it, much the same way that it referenc= es > the ISO 639-2 and 639-3 sites, instead of referring to PDF files and priv= ate > agreements about how to handle "Galibi Carib." Please enter this into th= e > issue tracker. These changes would not take long. > > -- > Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 > http://www.ewellic.org > http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html > http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages =CB=86 > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > --001636e1fc01fb507f04635b84f1 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree.

Mark


On Fri, Feb 20, 2009 at 05:24, Doug Ewel= l <doug@ewellic.or= g> wrote:
The ISO 639-5 data has finally, at long last, been made publicly available = on the Web:

http:/= /www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/

I propose modifying the text and references in draft-4645bis to refer to th= is Web site and files taken from it, much the same way that it references t= he ISO 639-2 and 639-3 sites, instead of referring to PDF files and private= agreements about how to handle "Galibi Carib."  Please ente= r this into the issue tracker.  These changes would not take long.

--
Doug Ewell  *  Thornton, Colorado, USA  *  RFC 4645 &nb= sp;*  UTN #14
http://www.ewellic.org=
http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages &n= bsp;=CB=86

_______________________________________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru

--001636e1fc01fb507f04635b84f1-- From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 20 10:16:15 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A00353A68AC for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 10:16:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.300, BAYES_50=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qVEtODa3wbHy for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 10:16:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9D7B43A66B4 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 10:16:14 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=rKjsj3fBdpLT9jD3QaPZgnkxstkyPiiA3gPdwvsrm20qZiIBIto7GNVc6pjuSv5U; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.34.66] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LaZvG-0007v1-Uv for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 13:16:27 -0500 Message-ID: <002601c99387$60c103e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <5E5035D7D38B41C7B12889AAA89CB840@DGBP7M81> Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 10:16:39 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173ed97927e8841ffd3cad7b2ddc59a735e350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.66 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 18:16:15 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 5:24 AM > Subject: [Ltru] Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis > > The ISO 639-5 data has finally, at long last, been made publicly > available on the Web: > > http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/ > > I propose modifying the text and references in draft-4645bis to refer to > this Web site and files taken from it, much the same way that it > references the ISO 639-2 and 639-3 sites, instead of referring to PDF > files and private agreements about how to handle "Galibi Carib." Please > enter this into the issue tracker. These changes would not take long. ... Added as issue #24. Randy From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Fri Feb 20 12:28:51 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9467B3A69CF for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 12:28:51 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wH5EEG+nNs5h for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 12:28:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 597B93A69E6 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 12:28:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33378 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LabyS-0002JC-4k; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 21:27:57 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 21:27:33 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Doug Ewell , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis Thread-Index: AcmTmajqejIhCA+n9EOH4G2g0J7T8Q== In-Reply-To: <5E5035D7D38B41C7B12889AAA89CB840@DGBP7M81> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LabyS-0002JC-4k. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1LabyS-0002JC-4k 1653ecf5147b74f35942717a0cded56c Subject: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 20:28:51 -0000 I agree, but I also note that there are some changes noted in http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/changes.php. Many of them refer only to the French name(s), which aren't picked up for LSR, but there are a few others that should be picked up. I see at least one, namely the English nam= e change for ngf. Maybe there are other differences not noted on the changes page. Especially since our current 639-5 data was picked up from an internal(?) draft document. /kent k Den 2009-02-20 14.24, skrev "Doug Ewell" : > The ISO 639-5 data has finally, at long last, been made publicly available on > the Web: http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/ I propose modifying the text > and references in draft-4645bis to refer to this Web site and files taken > from it, much the same way that it references the ISO 639-2 and 639-3 sites, > instead of referring to PDF files and private agreements about how to handle > "Galibi Carib." Please enter this into the issue tracker. These changes > would not take long. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 > * UTN=20 > #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.htm > l http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages > =96 _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing > list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From doug@ewellic.org Fri Feb 20 18:39:45 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 61B2E3A68AE for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 18:39:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.815 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.815 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.783, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0DRhyCwAu0Gy for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 18:39:44 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpout04.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout04-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.196]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 61F0D3A688F for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 18:39:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 20283 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2009 02:39:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout04.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.196) with ESMTP; 21 Feb 2009 02:39:53 -0000 Message-ID: <74260373C15A461DB20708564BB9A8E4@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:37:37 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Cc: Michael Everson , ISO639-3@sil.org, Kent Karlsson , "Rebecca S. Guenther" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 02:39:45 -0000 Kent Karlsson wrote: > I agree, but I also note that there are some changes noted in > http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/changes.php. Many of them refer > only to the French name(s), which aren't picked up for LSR, but there > are a few others that should be picked up. I see at least one, namely > the English name change for ngf. Kent raises an excellent point. Fortunately, your editor is on top of it. The changes from the original PDF chart are as follows: 1. 'car' for "Carib languages" has been deleted. This is consistent with the discussion I had with Rebecca Guenther and Joan Spanne, captured in the next-to-last paragraph of Section 2.3 in draft-4645bis. (Now that the decision is reflected in the standard, it'll be nice to get rid of that shady-sounding passage.) 2. 'day' for "Land Dayak languages" has been added. Since it was already in 639-2, it's already in draft-4645bis and marked as a collection. There are still two other collections, Bihari and Himachali, which are not in 639-5. 3. As Kent observed, 'ngf' has been renamed from "Trans New Guinea" to "Trans-New Guinea languages". This needs to be fixed in draft-4645bis-10. As a side note, in case anyone else spots this with a diff program, the ISO 639-5 file spells the names "Creoles and pidgins, English-based" and "Creoles and pidgins, French-based" with U+2011 NON-BREAKING HYPHEN. They didn't do this for "Creoles and pidgins, Portuguese-based", nor for any other name that involves a hyphen. As co-designated expert for RFC 4646 and the Language Subtag Reviewer's clerical assistant, I intend to convert these to ASCII hyphens in draft-4645bis, as described in draft-4646bis, Section 3.1.5, paragraph 9. (If anyone objects that I'm not the Reviewer, I can always ask him.) > Maybe there are other differences not noted on the changes page. I think I've got them all, but additional reviewing eyes are always welcome. > Especially since our current 639-5 data was picked up from an > internal(?) draft document. It was actually taken from an official PDF copy of the final approved standard, obtained through less-than-official channels. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 20 19:36:46 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F19D43A6800 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:36:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.088 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.088 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.511, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uidhwzOAo6VL for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:36:46 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0AC943A66B4 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:36:46 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=phCP2S+UpaElz9slyPZ6pYwElMlmTwYojx7Xug5Fhn58AfVoESX109yIc0u6c+NT; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.204.213] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Laifi-0000K1-Mg for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 22:36:58 -0500 Message-ID: <004001c993d5$b11302a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:37:15 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17383e74fcfef5c78a00f7bfa5618289404350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.213 Subject: [Ltru] Issue 25: change description of 'ngf' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 03:36:47 -0000 Hi - I've entered this as issue #25. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kent Karlsson" To: "Doug Ewell" ; "LTRU Working Group" Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 12:27 PM Subject: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis I agree, but I also note that there are some changes noted in http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/changes.php. Many of them refer only to the French name(s), which aren't picked up for LSR, but there are a few others that should be picked up. I see at least one, namely the English name change for ngf. Maybe there are other differences not noted on the changes page. Especially since our current 639-5 data was picked up from an internal(?) draft document. /kent k From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Fri Feb 20 19:41:36 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 29FC83A6893 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:41:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.89 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.89 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.891, BAYES_50=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4kxhBfT3D91a for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:41:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 85EAE3A66B4 for ; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:41:35 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=diyfjPkIcOm06h+yiKdztIzx2wHibPdJyTNcC9F+iZZf1hvl47+W6gDyR66iX0NI; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.204.213] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LaikO-0007DE-EF for ltru@ietf.org; Fri, 20 Feb 2009 22:41:48 -0500 Message-ID: <005001c993d6$5e4a93c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Fri, 20 Feb 2009 19:42:06 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1738eb80d881a4abdeb52ba8426128772f4350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.213 Subject: [Ltru] Current open issues X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 03:41:36 -0000 Hi - There are currently three open issues: #22, #24, and #25, all on 4645bis. If there are other issues that require action, PLEASE report them, ONE PER MESSAGE, with an appropriate subject line. Randy From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Sat Feb 21 04:31:27 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 37E453A68BD for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 04:31:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lmR7M-Q9FevW for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 04:31:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.213]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 69B243A6452 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 04:31:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:35505 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1Lar0N-0005n8-8Z; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:30:52 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:30:39 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Doug Ewell , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis Thread-Index: AcmUIDQO9poSCNNydkyynQraXOotyA== In-Reply-To: <74260373C15A461DB20708564BB9A8E4@DGBP7M81> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1Lar0N-0005n8-8Z. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net 1Lar0N-0005n8-8Z fbc853651857a3dacdc83125e251dafe Cc: Michael Everson , ISO639-3@sil.org, "Rebecca S. Guenther" Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 12:31:27 -0000 Den 2009-02-21 03.37, skrev "Doug Ewell" : > Kent Karlsson wrote: >=20 >> I agree, but I also note that there are some changes noted in >> http://www.loc.gov/standards/iso639-5/changes.php. Many of them refer >> only to the French name(s), which aren't picked up for LSR, but there >> are a few others that should be picked up. I see at least one, namely >> the English name change for ngf. >=20 > Kent raises an excellent point. Fortunately, your editor is on top of > it. The changes from the original PDF chart are as follows: >=20 > 1. 'car' for "Carib languages" has been deleted. This is consistent > with the discussion I had with Rebecca Guenther and Joan Spanne, > captured in the next-to-last paragraph of Section 2.3 in draft-4645bis. > (Now that the decision is reflected in the standard, it'll be nice to > get rid of that shady-sounding passage.) >=20 > 2. 'day' for "Land Dayak languages" has been added. Since it was Side remark: I have seen translations of this one as just "Dayak". But the Land Dayak languages appears to be a subset of the Dayak languages. At least according to Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dayak_languages, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bidayuh. (In addition there is the retired code dyk for Land Dayak [languages]...) > already in 639-2, it's already in draft-4645bis and marked as a > collection. There are still two other collections, Bihari and > Himachali, which are not in 639-5. I think this holds also for "chs", Chumash, which I gather is the code that is referred to in "1 retirement of a code element representing a language family whose constituents were already present in [the] code set. This code element will be recommended for inclusion in ISO 639-5". See http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/639-3_ChangeRequests_2008_Sum&add.pdf. (But at the moment chs is not covered by any part of 639, except as "retired"...) /kent k > 3. As Kent observed, 'ngf' has been renamed from "Trans New Guinea" to > "Trans-New Guinea languages". This needs to be fixed in > draft-4645bis-10. >=20 > As a side note, in case anyone else spots this with a diff program, the > ISO 639-5 file spells the names "Creoles and pidgins, English-based" and > "Creoles and pidgins, French-based" with U+2011 NON-BREAKING HYPHEN. > They didn't do this for "Creoles and pidgins, Portuguese-based", nor for > any other name that involves a hyphen. As co-designated expert for RFC > 4646 and the Language Subtag Reviewer's clerical assistant, I intend to > convert these to ASCII hyphens in draft-4645bis, as described in > draft-4646bis, Section 3.1.5, paragraph 9. (If anyone objects that I'm > not the Reviewer, I can always ask him.) >=20 >> Maybe there are other differences not noted on the changes page. >=20 > I think I've got them all, but additional reviewing eyes are always > welcome. >=20 >> Especially since our current 639-5 data was picked up from an >> internal(?) draft document. >=20 > It was actually taken from an official PDF copy of the final approved > standard, obtained through less-than-official channels. >=20 > -- > Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 > http://www.ewellic.org > http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html > http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages =96 >=20 >=20 From cewcathar@hotmail.com Sat Feb 21 07:52:44 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7E2A33A697D for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 07:52:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.412 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.412 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.186, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 56Kb5z013ZmV for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 07:52:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from blu0-omc3-s30.blu0.hotmail.com (blu0-omc3-s30.blu0.hotmail.com [65.55.116.105]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E7A83A63EC for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 07:52:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from BLU109-W39 ([65.55.116.74]) by blu0-omc3-s30.blu0.hotmail.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Sat, 21 Feb 2009 07:52:59 -0800 Message-ID: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_2b2f9b80-7508-4500-9038-efc46e8f678e_" X-Originating-IP: [198.252.156.11] From: CE Whitehead To: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:52:58 -0500 Importance: Normal MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginalArrivalTime: 21 Feb 2009 15:52:59.0272 (UTC) FILETIME=[78390080:01C9943C] Cc: iso639-3@sil.org, rgue@loc.gov Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 15:52:44 -0000 --_2b2f9b80-7508-4500-9038-efc46e8f678e_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi=2C Kent=2C Doug: =20 It seems to me that at ethnologue: Dayak=2C Land [dyk] is a subset of the Land Dayak group of languages: http://www.ethnologue.com/show_family.asp?subid=3D91242 =20 (There is also a separate group of languages there=2C Malayic Dayak which i= s under the group Malayik and not the group Land Dayak=3B both Malayik (in = the "Ibanic" group) and Land Dayak are classified as Malayo-Polynesian but = they are not the same--not in Wikipedia either=3B Wikipedia classifies both= as Dayak it seems. =20 So it may be just the naming that is different. =20 That's as near as I can make this classification out.) =20 Thanks. =20 --C. E. Whitehead cewcathar@hotmail.com =20 From: Kent Karlsson =20 Date: Sat=2C 21 Feb 2009 13:30:39 +0100=20 =20 >Side remark: I have seen translations of this one as just "Dayak". > But the Land Dayak languages appears to be a subset of the Dayak languages. At least according to Wikipedia: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dayak_languages=2C > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bidayuh. > (In addition there is the retired code dyk for Land Dayak [languages]...) --_2b2f9b80-7508-4500-9038-efc46e8f678e_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi=2C Kent=2C Doug:
 =3B
It seems to me that
at ethnologue:
Dayak=2C Land [dyk] is a subset of the Land Dayak group of languages:
http://= www.ethnologue.com/show_family.asp?subid=3D91242
 =3B
(There is also a separate group of languages there=2C Malayic Dayak which i= s under the group Malayik and not the group Land Dayak=3B both Malayik (in = the =3B"Ibanic" group) =3Band Land Dayak are classified as Malayo-P= olynesian but they are not the same--not in Wikipedia either=3B Wikipedia c= lassifies both as Dayak it seems.
 =3B
So it may be just the naming that is =3Bdifferent.
 =3B
That's as near as I can make this classification =3Bout.)
 =3B
Thanks.
 =3B
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com

&= nbsp=3B
From: Kent Karlsson <=3Bkent.karlsson14 at comhem.se>=3B
Date: Sat=2C 21 Feb 2009 13:30:39 +0100
 =3B
>=3BSide remark: I have seen translations of this one as just "Dayak".>=3B But the Land Dayak languages appears to be a subset of the Dayaklanguages. At least according to Wikipedia:
>=3B http://en.wikipedia.org= /wiki/Dayak_languages=2C
>=3B http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bidayuh.
&g= t=3B (In addition there is the retired code dyk for Land Dayak [languages].= ..)

 = --_2b2f9b80-7508-4500-9038-efc46e8f678e_-- From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 21 10:04:15 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CD1413A6A6D for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:04:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.042 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.042 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.557, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id P55wBrssXehK for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:04:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1826F3A6878 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:04:15 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=nTBhrgFkZaDriLjTZYBsYIzZAMlGzhUpgt4bjwz4Pt6ZENgA1RFQDYJLKRZyHUDn; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.149] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LawDG-0001mT-Id for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:04:30 -0500 Message-ID: <001f01c9944e$e2297ee0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <74260373C15A461DB20708564BB9A8E4@DGBP7M81> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:04:46 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1737b7753a2632ee4a0dc50d7981a940dc2350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.149 Subject: [Ltru] Issue 26: deletion of 'car' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:04:15 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Cc: "Michael Everson" ; ; "Kent Karlsson" ; "Rebecca S. Guenther" > Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 6:37 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis ... > 1. 'car' for "Carib languages" has been deleted. This is consistent > with the discussion I had with Rebecca Guenther and Joan Spanne, > captured in the next-to-last paragraph of Section 2.3 in draft-4645bis. > (Now that the decision is reflected in the standard, it'll be nice to > get rid of that shady-sounding passage.) This has been added as issue #26. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 21 10:07:03 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DF4C3A6AB7 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:07:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.121 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.121 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.478, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tH63wNqdL7Fs for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:07:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A9103A6AA3 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:07:02 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=tIc9TNrRUAXOLioyuZjRZ9zG8Cyf1SwkchV+oT1dQfA2e5cp1ztdeHRNGG+uj2bq; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.149] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LawFy-000420-6t for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:07:18 -0500 Message-ID: <002401c9944f$46e66000$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <74260373C15A461DB20708564BB9A8E4@DGBP7M81> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:07:35 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173228438744bdaba5cb2efc8f570e04cc1350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.149 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #27:addition of 'day' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:07:03 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Cc: "Michael Everson" ; ; "Kent Karlsson" ; "Rebecca S. Guenther" > Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 6:37 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis ... > 2. 'day' for "Land Dayak languages" has been added. Since it was > already in 639-2, it's already in draft-4645bis and marked as a > collection. There are still two other collections, Bihari and > Himachali, which are not in 639-5. ... I've added this as issue 27. As a technical contribtor: I really think this is a total non-issue, and am surprised that it was even raised at this time. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 21 10:09:04 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D80AB3A6ACA for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:09:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.181 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.181 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.418, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id M4HMxV4L7LQl for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:09:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD23D28C100 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:09:02 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=mo206XPsjjcnlybyjOK85BC1ZTenJOwvlJ8XRJX/O0pjw1Vv5xSGuOC+wvYYaXga; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.149] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LawHu-0005tv-C7 for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:09:18 -0500 Message-ID: <002701c9944f$8e900460$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <74260373C15A461DB20708564BB9A8E4@DGBP7M81> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:09:36 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1730eb081d656e25850f6dd5877b5c4ebb0350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.149 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #28: use ASCII hyphen X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:09:04 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Cc: "Michael Everson" ; ; "Kent Karlsson" ; "Rebecca S. Guenther" > Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 6:37 PM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis ... > As a side note, in case anyone else spots this with a diff program, the > ISO 639-5 file spells the names "Creoles and pidgins, English-based" and > "Creoles and pidgins, French-based" with U+2011 NON-BREAKING HYPHEN. > They didn't do this for "Creoles and pidgins, Portuguese-based", nor for > any other name that involves a hyphen. As co-designated expert for RFC > 4646 and the Language Subtag Reviewer's clerical assistant, I intend to > convert these to ASCII hyphens in draft-4645bis, as described in > draft-4646bis, Section 3.1.5, paragraph 9. (If anyone objects that I'm > not the Reviewer, I can always ask him.) ... I've added this as issue #28. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 21 10:13:16 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 036C33A693E for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:13:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.227 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.227 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.372, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8rn-9Tp7wgwj for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:13:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A73DD3A6878 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:13:14 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=ZGpm1wTUfMNuaVD8O3sOn0PF/OEIfSeOn63twzUeo/V1oF+4wF7YHQMNFw+5hifQ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.149] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LawLy-0007HC-78 for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:13:30 -0500 Message-ID: <002c01c99450$24a298a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:13:47 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173289b42d02b31026b51f3addb3875827c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.149 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:13:16 -0000 Hi - Reminder: PLEASE use a new (and appropriate) subject line when rasing new issues, and stick to one issue per message. PLEASE! > From: "Kent Karlsson" > To: "Doug Ewell" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Cc: "Michael Everson" ; ; "Rebecca S. Guenther" > Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 4:30 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis ... > I think this holds also for "chs", Chumash, which I gather is the code > that is referred to in "1 retirement of a code element representing a > language family whose constituents were already present in [the] code set. > This code element will be recommended for inclusion in ISO 639-5". See > http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/639-3_ChangeRequests_2008_Sum&add.pdf. > (But at the moment chs is not covered by any part of 639, except as > "retired"... It's not at all clear to me what the proposal is here, but I've entered this as issue #29. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 21 10:31:08 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9FDC13A693E for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:31:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.965 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.965 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.034, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id s--hc-EkAptL for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:31:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B86903A6920 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:31:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=gZ38w4Cm6P3tPM2R4u99DV+TNwGTNiW1WyD1XkvfsXcLKhScPieXw+4ADNcVx3L0; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.149] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LawdF-0005qC-Bn for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:31:21 -0500 Message-ID: <004701c99452$a2e4c2e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <005001c993d6$5e4a93c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:31:38 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173d2a17c2f9d6fd9fad2552fb04ec044f1350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.149 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Current open issues X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:31:08 -0000 Hi - As co-chair: There are currently SEVEN open issues on 4645bis. See the list at http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/1 If there are other issues that require action, PLEASE report them, ONE PER MESSAGE, with an appropriate subject line. I'm not happy that all this stuff is popping up just now, particularly since for some of these it is't at all clear what the proposed resolution is. Here's a summary how I'd like to procede. If you'd like to respond to any of these, PLEASE do it in the thread for the corresponding issue!!!! #22 - if we don't see some discussion and OK on the ietf-languages@iana.org list for making the changes to the preferred value for CS, we will REVERT the changes in the I-D, which will require the LSR to make the changes after the RFC is published. It seems more sensible to to not revert the changes, but I'm willing to take that path only with the blessing of the LSR. #24: we're awaiting a concrete textual proposal. If none appears by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, I will close it with no action to be taken by the editor. #25: If there are no objections to the editor's proposal by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, I propose accepting this proposed resolution. #26: we're awaiting a concrete textual proposal. If none appears by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, I will close it with no action to be taken by the editor. #27: we're awaiting a concrete textual proposal. If none appears by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, I will close it with no action to be taken by the editor. #28: If there are no objections to the editor's proposal by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, I propose accepting this proposed resolution. #29: we're awaiting a concrete textual proposal. If none appears by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, I will close it with no action to be taken by the editor. Randy From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Sat Feb 21 10:43:04 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C281F3A69F0 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:43:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ozQNEyKnxCDM for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:43:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A20CD3A6992 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:43:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33381 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LawoD-00037G-4Z; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:42:47 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:42:39 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue 26: deletion of 'car' Thread-Index: AcmUVCvQaj9XUuexoU6jjfdQ6WC4OQ== In-Reply-To: <001f01c9944e$e2297ee0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LawoD-00037G-4Z. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1LawoD-00037G-4Z f5dec93e8515315ee68a3e369164f144 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 26: deletion of 'car' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:43:04 -0000 This is not an issue. 'car' was deleted from 639-5, but not from 639-2 nor 639-3, and is present as it should be in 4645bis draft 9. Den 2009-02-21 19.04, skrev "Randy Presuhn" : > Hi - > >> From: "Doug Ewell" >> To: "LTRU Working Group" >> Cc: "Michael Everson" ; ; "Kent >> Karlsson" ; "Rebecca S. > Guenther" >> Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 6:37 PM >> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis > ... >> 1. 'car' for "Carib languages" has been deleted. This is consistent >> with the discussion I had with Rebecca Guenther and Joan Spanne, >> captured in the next-to-last paragraph of Section 2.3 in draft-4645bis. >> (Now that the decision is reflected in the standard, it'll be nice to >> get rid of that shady-sounding passage.) > > This has been added as issue #26. > > Randy > > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Sat Feb 21 10:45:38 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2AAB73A69F0 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:45:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id peJv-+VftNHv for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:45:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27AA43A6920 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:45:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33360 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1Lawqt-0004gQ-4t; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:45:27 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:45:26 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #27:addition of 'day' Thread-Index: AcmUVI9aegouBONuPkCJH1bTmUb8gQ== In-Reply-To: <002401c9944f$46e66000$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1Lawqt-0004gQ-4t. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1Lawqt-0004gQ-4t b9f936d5109a7e623c05f43578483e00 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #27:addition of 'day' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:45:38 -0000 This is not an issue. "day" is already present in 4645bis draft 9 as a collection. /kent k Den 2009-02-21 19.07, skrev "Randy Presuhn" : > Hi - > >> From: "Doug Ewell" >> To: "LTRU Working Group" >> Cc: "Michael Everson" ; ; "Kent >> Karlsson" ; "Rebecca S. > Guenther" >> Sent: Friday, February 20, 2009 6:37 PM >> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis > ... >> 2. 'day' for "Land Dayak languages" has been added. Since it was >> already in 639-2, it's already in draft-4645bis and marked as a >> collection. There are still two other collections, Bihari and >> Himachali, which are not in 639-5. > ... > > I've added this as issue 27. > > As a technical contribtor: > I really think this is a total non-issue, and am surprised that it was even > raised at this time. > > Randy > > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From doug@ewellic.org Sat Feb 21 10:48:44 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DA4B3A69F0 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:48:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.893 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.893 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.705, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sYr8qsoGqyJI for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:48:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpout07.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout07-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.230]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 4E2A93A6920 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:48:43 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 28770 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2009 18:48:58 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout07.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.230) with ESMTP; 21 Feb 2009 18:48:56 -0000 Message-ID: <89B24E60DFCC4008804F74D03E2F0222@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:48:53 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Cc: Kent Karlsson Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:48:44 -0000 Kent Karlsson wrote: >> 2. 'day' for "Land Dayak languages" has been added. Since it was > > Side remark: I have seen translations of this one as just "Dayak". But > the Land Dayak languages appears to be a subset of the Dayak > languages. At least according to Wikipedia: > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dayak_languages, > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bidayuh. > (In addition there is the retired code dyk for Land Dayak > [languages]...) At this point, as editor of the draft, I'm primarily interested in how the various ISO 639-* parts categorize and name the languages or groups and what the code elements are. If there are "better" categories or "better" names, I don't really want to know about them right now. :-) 'dyk' just looks to me like a duplicate that was recognized and retired. > I think this holds also for "chs", Chumash, which I gather is the code > that is referred to in "1 retirement of a code element representing a > language family whose constituents were already present in [the] code > set. This code element will be recommended for inclusion in ISO > 639-5". See > http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/639-3_ChangeRequests_2008_Sum&add.pdf. > (But at the moment chs is not covered by any part of 639, except as > "retired"...) Same as above. I would guess that 'chs' will appear in 639-5 sometime in the future, and so I would recommend against ietf-languages trying to register a variant for it. But there is no work for LTRU to do here. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Sat Feb 21 10:49:56 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 01F103A6A49 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:49:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HJ1+pgQYn2ST for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:49:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1E71A3A69F0 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:49:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:34444 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1Lawv6-0004s5-3c; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:49:48 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:49:47 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' Thread-Index: AcmUVSrr/IxnUCa0rE+W8cTUiB8wdA== In-Reply-To: <002c01c99450$24a298a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1Lawv6-0004s5-3c. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1Lawv6-0004s5-3c 347581d3e2bc6faa3d4cb866600f28fd Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:49:56 -0000 This is not an issue, just a note that chs has beed retired from 639-3, but has not yet appeared in 639-5 (which I gather was the intention), along with two other collection codes (in 639-2) that have not yet appeared in 639-5 (as Doug noted). The two latter are already noted as "collection" in 4645bis draft 9. /kent k Den 2009-02-21 19.13, skrev "Randy Presuhn" : > Hi - > > Reminder: PLEASE use a new (and appropriate) subject > line when rasing new issues, and stick to one issue per > message. PLEASE! > >> From: "Kent Karlsson" >> To: "Doug Ewell" ; "LTRU Working Group" >> Cc: "Michael Everson" ; ; "Rebecca S. >> Guenther" >> Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 4:30 AM >> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis > ... >> I think this holds also for "chs", Chumash, which I gather is the code >> that is referred to in "1 retirement of a code element representing a >> language family whose constituents were already present in [the] code set. >> This code element will be recommended for inclusion in ISO 639-5". See >> http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/cr_files/639-3_ChangeRequests_2008_Sum&add.pdf. >> (But at the moment chs is not covered by any part of 639, except as >> "retired"... > > It's not at all clear to me what the proposal is here, but I've entered this > as issue #29. > > Randy > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 21 10:52:35 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B9C463A6A49 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:52:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.268 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.268 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.331, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LpYr0c+qAOhV for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:52:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B1FDB3A6920 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:52:34 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=EPebXIHzHkQ5TF/okJTKM+MDFcTptDmGkSTKdoCKxKrOFmbiucAtrk/6Sqb2578S; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.149] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lawy2-0000XS-CE for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:52:50 -0500 Message-ID: <006201c99455$a3742a40$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:53:08 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17383b6f4120ec316b65f367fa08a018ebc350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.149 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 26: deletion of 'car' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:52:35 -0000 Hi - > From: "Kent Karlsson" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 10:42 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 26: deletion of 'car' > > This is not an issue. 'car' was deleted from 639-5, but not from 639-2 nor > 639-3, and is present as it should be in 4645bis draft 9. Doug was proposing changes to the next-to-last paragraph of Section 2.3 in draft-4645bis. That makes it an issue. Randy From doug@ewellic.org Sat Feb 21 10:57:27 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D38F03A6B78 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:57:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.957 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.957 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.641, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TmRkzo5J5vVu for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:57:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.99]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id E8CEA3A6867 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:57:26 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 21560 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2009 18:57:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth05.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.99) with ESMTP; 21 Feb 2009 18:57:40 -0000 Message-ID: <82E3F52B4B1F430BBF529264233C11E9@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:56:55 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #27:addition of 'day' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:57:27 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: >> 2. 'day' for "Land Dayak languages" has been added. Since it was >> already in 639-2, it's already in draft-4645bis and marked as a >> collection. There are still two other collections, Bihari and >> Himachali, which are not in 639-5. > ... > > I've added this as issue 27. > > As a technical contribtor: > I really think this is a total non-issue, and am surprised that it was > even raised at this time. I didn't raise it as an issue. I was trying to point out that I had done my job to detect and resolve any discrepancies between the old and new 639-5 data. 'day' and 'bh' and 'him' are already in the draft; we have no work to do here. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 21 10:57:28 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7834E3A6867 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:57:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.295 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.295 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.304, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oWK0eAHYaLo5 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:57:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B0E1F3A6B56 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:57:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=OHUhCs1u0EdDbZGeAnG1lBWPVN39H2+GfkM/PREELiNyybwhwM868mOxdZHVz6O4; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.149] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lax2l-00051s-B5 for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:57:43 -0500 Message-ID: <006901c99456$522dc780$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:58:01 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173dd84752bf9caae523881ed6623b7c809350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.149 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:57:28 -0000 Hi - > From: "Kent Karlsson" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 10:49 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' > > This is not an issue, just a note that chs has beed retired from 639-3, > but has not yet appeared in 639-5 (which I gather was the intention), along > with two other collection codes (in 639-2) that have not yet appeared in > 639-5 (as Doug noted). The two latter are already noted as "collection" in > 4645bis draft 9. ... What are you proposing that we DO about this situation? Does it require any change to any document we're working on here? I'm assuming that there was a reason for posting this to the list while we're trying (yes, we're really trying!) to wrap up the last call on this document. Randy From doug@ewellic.org Sat Feb 21 10:59:07 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C52EE28C0F3 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:59:07 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.011 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.011 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.587, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uiiypLLBsnXb for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:59:06 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth11.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth11.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.33]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id C7ABD3A6867 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:59:06 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 29396 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2009 18:59:22 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth11.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.33) with ESMTP; 21 Feb 2009 18:59:22 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:59:20 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 26: deletion of 'car' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:59:07 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: >> This is not an issue. 'car' was deleted from 639-5, but not from >> 639-2 nor 639-3, and is present as it should be in 4645bis draft 9. > > Doug was proposing changes to the next-to-last paragraph of Section > 2.3 in draft-4645bis. That makes it an issue. Correct. I contend that the paragraph is no longer relevant and should be deleted. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Sat Feb 21 11:09:38 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3478828C130 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:09:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id x+OyzLAu1j9Y for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:09:34 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4EA1928C122 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:09:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33696 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LaxE4-000124-5B; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 20:09:25 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 20:09:22 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' Thread-Index: AcmUV+dGgSxlsoKQHUmUQDeNAW3lYw== In-Reply-To: <006901c99456$522dc780$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LaxE4-000124-5B. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1LaxE4-000124-5B 0f3effeb787ea97c0a6c7af521df0dbe Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:09:38 -0000 Den 2009-02-21 19.58, skrev "Randy Presuhn" : > Hi - > >> From: "Kent Karlsson" >> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" >> >> Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 10:49 AM >> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' >> >> This is not an issue, just a note that chs has beed retired from 639-3, >> but has not yet appeared in 639-5 (which I gather was the intention), along >> with two other collection codes (in 639-2) that have not yet appeared in >> 639-5 (as Doug noted). The two latter are already noted as "collection" in >> 4645bis draft 9. > ... > > What are you proposing that we DO about this situation? > Does it require any change to any document we're working on here? > > I'm assuming that there was a reason for posting this to the > list while we're trying (yes, we're really trying!) to wrap > up the last call on this document. I did not realise that every sentence had to be an issue, or would be interpreted as an issue for LTRU. My apologies. /kent k > Randy > > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Sat Feb 21 11:10:37 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 87D823A687C for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:10:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.699, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id X2tQJlOBVDr6 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:10:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2F3703A69F0 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:10:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33688 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LaxF0-00059B-4u; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 20:10:23 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 20:10:17 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: CE Whitehead , Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis Thread-Index: AcmUWAgORw/z967n8kGjHQqtfv+Kew== In-Reply-To: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: multipart/alternative; boundary="B_3318091822_16351491" X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LaxF0-00059B-4u. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1LaxF0-00059B-4u 269a17e2ee0f9354a8aa1265cb58618a Cc: rgue@loc.gov, iso639-3@sil.org Subject: Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:10:37 -0000 > Detta meddelande r i MIME-format. P grund av att din e-postlsare inte frstr detta format, kommer hela eller delar av detta meddelande inte att vara lsbart. --B_3318091822_16351491 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit The code "dyk" is withdrawn, so it effectively isn't a language code. (Please note, there was no issue w.r.t. this.) /kent k Den 2009-02-21 16.52, skrev "CE Whitehead" : > Hi, Kent, Doug: > > It seems to me that > at ethnologue: > Dayak, Land [dyk] is a subset of the Land Dayak group of languages: > http://www.ethnologue.com/show_family.asp?subid=91242 > > (There is also a separate group of languages there, Malayic Dayak which is > under the group Malayik and not the group Land Dayak; both Malayik (in the > "Ibanic" group) and Land Dayak are classified as Malayo-Polynesian but they > are not the same--not in Wikipedia either; Wikipedia classifies both as Dayak > it seems. > > So it may be just the naming that is different. > > That's as near as I can make this classification out.) > > Thanks. > > --C. E. Whitehead > cewcathar@hotmail.com > > > From: Kent Karlsson > > Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:30:39 +0100 > >> >Side remark: I have seen translations of this one as just "Dayak". >> > But the Land Dayak languages appears to be a subset of the Dayak > languages. At least according to Wikipedia: >> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dayak_languages, >> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bidayuh. >> > (In addition there is the retired code dyk for Land Dayak [languages]...) > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru --B_3318091822_16351491 Content-type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable Re: [Ltru] Data update from ISO 639-5 to draft-4645bis
The code "dyk" is withdrawn, so it effectively isn't a language c= ode.

(Please note, there was no issue w.r.t. this.)

    /kent k

Den 2009-02-21 16.52, skrev "CE Whitehead" <cewcathar@hotmail.com>:

Hi, Kent, Doug:
 
It seems to me that
at ethnologue:
Dayak, Land [dyk] is a subset of the Land Dayak group of languages:
http://www.= ethnologue.com/show_family.asp?subid=3D91242
 
(There is also a separate group of languages there, Malayic Dayak which is = under the group Malayik and not the group Land Dayak; both Malayik (in the &= quot;Ibanic" group) and Land Dayak are classified as Malayo-Polynesian = but they are not the same--not in Wikipedia either; Wikipedia classifies bot= h as Dayak it seems.
 
So it may be just the naming that is different.
 
That's as near as I can make this classification out.)
 
Thanks.
 
--C. E. Whitehead
cewcathar@hotmail.com

 
From: Kent Karlsson <kent.karlsson14 at comhem.se <mailto:kent.karlsson14@DOMAIN.HIDDEN>= >
Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 13:30:39 +0100
 
>Side remark: I have seen translations of this one as just "Dayak&q= uot;.
> But the Land Dayak languages appears to be a subset of the Dayak
languages. At least according to Wikipedia:
> http://en.wikip= edia.org/wiki/Dayak_languages,
> http://en.wikipedia.org= /wiki/Bidayuh.
> (In addition there is the retired code dyk for Land Dayak [languages].= ..)


__________________________= _____________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/m= ailman/listinfo/ltru
--B_3318091822_16351491-- From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sat Feb 21 11:16:33 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43EBA28C0F3 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:16:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.319 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.319 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.280, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AE2L33tCR-H6 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:16:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8CC223A6A49 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:16:32 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=k3GhYFsvZgSf5aGrLhwjG7RX6CM2MdyoXp6a1rkJuWNN1kNDbuEfnov0JB/2ujZo; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.149] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LaxLE-0002yC-50 for ltru@ietf.org; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 14:16:48 -0500 Message-ID: <000601c99458$fc824b00$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:17:05 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173475a5cac0424a0a4f1e2a9f763b2126a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.149 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:16:33 -0000 Hi - > From: "Kent Karlsson" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working > Group" > Sent: Saturday, February 21, 2009 11:09 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' ... > I did not realise that every sentence had to be an issue, or would be > interpreted as an issue for LTRU. My apologies. ... I apologize for the harshness of my response. My frustration must be showing. Randy From doug@ewellic.org Sat Feb 21 11:21:25 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 43C923A69F0 for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:21:25 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.756 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.756 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.242, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_21=0.6, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZYoxP0MeaKAE for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:21:24 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.47]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 3B4AD28C10E for ; Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:21:24 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 19444 invoked from network); 21 Feb 2009 19:21:39 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.47) with ESMTP; 21 Feb 2009 19:21:38 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 12:19:28 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Current open issues X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 21 Feb 2009 19:21:25 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: > I'm not happy that all this stuff is popping up just now, > particularly since for some of these it is't at all clear > what the proposed resolution is. All of these except #22 are directly related to the ISO 639-5 Web site having just been rolled out. We could have avoided dealing with these issues if we hadn't let this project sit dormant for long periods of time. > #22 - if we don't see some discussion and OK on the > ietf-languages@iana.org list for making the > changes to the preferred value for CS, we will REVERT > the changes in the I-D, which will require the LSR to make > the changes after the RFC is published. It seems more > sensible to to not revert the changes, but I'm willing to > take that path only with the blessing of the LSR. I thought someone was going to notify the LSR and ietf-languages groups. I will do that. > #24: we're awaiting a concrete textual proposal. If none > appears by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, > I will close it with no action to be taken by the editor. I will send Old/New text to this list. > #25: If there are no objections to the editor's proposal by > Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, I propose > accepting this proposed resolution. I agree. > #26: we're awaiting a concrete textual proposal. If none > appears by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, > I will close it with no action to be taken by the editor. The IT is misleadingly named. There is no proposal to delete 'car' from the draft. It was deleted from 639-5 and there is a proposal to delete a paragraph in Section 2.3 of the draft that explained how we resolved a conflict that no longer exists. The textual proposal already on the table is very concrete -- "delete the paragraph" -- and I strongly support accepting it. > #27: we're awaiting a concrete textual proposal. If none > appears by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, > I will close it with no action to be taken by the editor. There is no issue. > #28: If there are no objections to the editor's proposal by > Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, I propose > accepting this proposed resolution. I agree. > #29: we're awaiting a concrete textual proposal. If none > appears by Monday afternoon (Pacific Time) February 23, > I will close it with no action to be taken by the editor. There is no issue. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From doug@ewellic.org Sun Feb 22 10:33:03 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AE4CC3A6848 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 10:33:03 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.144 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.144 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.405, BAYES_20=-0.74, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PwyWiwTLUUMu for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 10:33:02 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth19.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth19.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.30]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 48BE33A67F7 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 10:33:02 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 17276 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2009 18:33:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth19.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.30) with ESMTP; 22 Feb 2009 18:33:18 -0000 Message-ID: <43F727A86FF746D0A599A1C77B5C5A58@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 11:33:15 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 18:33:03 -0000 Proposed changes to address this issue: Section 2.1: OLD: The source data for [ISO639-5] used for this update was Table 3, "Language families and groups ordered by identifier", from the PDF version of the standard. NEW: The source data for [ISO639-5] used for this update consisted of one file, available from the official site of the ISO 639-5 Registration Authority. [RFC EDITOR NOTE: this file may be updated before approval of this memo.] o [iso639-5.tab.txt] is a list of all language code elements in [ISO639-5], including the alpha-3 code elements and English name for each code element. For example, this file includes an entry containing the code element 'ira' and the name "Iranian languages" (among other information). Section 2.1 again: OLD: Language code elements that were already retired in [ISO639-3] prior to IESG approval of this memo were not listed in these files, and consequently were not considered in this update. NEW: Language code elements that were already retired in all of the source standards prior to IESG approval of this memo were not listed in these files, and consequently were not considered in this update. Section 2.2: OLD: For each language in [ISO639-5] that was not already represented by a language subtag in the Language Subtag Registry, a new language subtag was added to the Registry, using the [ISO639-5] code element as the value for the Subtag field and the "English name" field as the Description field. Each of these languages was assigned a Scope value of "collection" in the Registry. NEW: For each language in [iso639-5.tab.txt] that was not already represented by a language subtag in the Language Subtag Registry, a new language subtag was added to the Registry, using the [ISO639-5] code element as the value for the Subtag field and the "English name" field as the Description field. Each of these languages was assigned a Scope value of "collection" in the Registry. Section 2.3: OLD: For each language in [ISO639-5] that was already represented in the Language Subtag Registry, the Description field was adjusted as necessary to match the "English name" field in [ISO639-5]. Names in inverted form were rearranged to remove the inversion. Each of these languages was assigned a Scope value of "collection". Existing language subtags whose code elements were assigned prior to the publication of [ISO639-3] or [ISO639-5] and which were identified by the [ISO639-3] Registration Authority as representing collections were also assigned a Scope value of "collection", even though they are not listed as such in [ISO639-5]. NEW: For each language in [iso639-5.tab.txt] that was already represented in the Language Subtag Registry, the Description field was adjusted as necessary to match the "English name" field in [iso639-5.tab.txt]. Names in inverted form were rearranged to remove the inversion. Each of these languages was assigned a Scope value of "collection". Existing language subtags whose code elements were assigned prior to the publication of [ISO639-3] or [ISO639-5] and which were identified by the [ISO639-3] Registration Authority as representing collections were also assigned a Scope value of "collection", even though they are not listed as such in [iso639-5.tab.txt]. Section 2.3 again: OLD: Note in particular that the change from [ISO639-2] names such as "Afro- Asiatic (Other)" to [ISO639-5] names such as "Afro-Asiatic languages" implies a broadening of scope for some of these subtags, designated "remainder groups" in [ISO639-5]. NEW: Note in particular that the change from [ISO639-2] names such as "Afro- Asiatic (Other)" to [ISO639-5] names such as "Afro-Asiatic languages" implies a broadening of scope for some of these subtags, designated "remainder groups" in [ISO639-5]. While [iso639-5.tab.txt] includes a field indicating which code elements are designated as "groups" or "remainder groups" in [ISO639-2], [draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-20] does not make this distinction, and consequently this field was not used in updating the Language Subtag Registry. Section 7.1: NEW: [iso639-5.tab.txt] International Organization for Standardization, ISO 639-5 code list, Tab-delimited text, February 2009, . -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From doug@ewellic.org Sun Feb 22 11:07:01 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C94E13A68AC for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 11:07:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.046 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.046 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.552, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yt9aUqOKhoUB for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 11:07:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.47]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id A14603A6818 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 11:07:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 6361 invoked from network); 22 Feb 2009 19:07:17 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.47) with ESMTP; 22 Feb 2009 19:07:16 -0000 Message-ID: <1D7C246596BB4179BFE3FE64F0F1426D@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 12:07:13 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: [Ltru] Possible issue: remove "first edition" from titles of standards X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 19:07:01 -0000 Gérard Lang has mentioned on at least two occasions (public and private) that the words "first edition" are not properly part of the title of ISO 639-2 and should not be cited as such, or at least not within the quotation marks, as we have it in both drafts. The ISO 639-2 Web site seems to corroborate this. Upon checking, I noticed that draft-4645bis also has "first edition" in the title of ISO 639-3. I don't have access to a paper copy of 639-3 and the Web site did not resolve the question for me of whether these words belong in the title. I leave it up to the co-chairs to decide whether it is worthwhile to open issues for this. I mention it here only so we don't get hit with it again during IETF LC, or in an appeal. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Sun Feb 22 11:43:00 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B61ED3A69F3 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 11:43:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.814 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.814 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.611, BAYES_00=-2.599, MIME_QP_LONG_LINE=1.396, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JpFI3HtMA1LE for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 11:42:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.213]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 180C53A699E for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 11:42:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33758 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LbK9O-0005U2-6n; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 20:38:06 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 20:37:56 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Doug Ewell , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Possible issue: remove "first edition" from titles of standards Thread-Index: AcmVJQ9Q+0kS6K+sMkmciq/yU1IkWA== In-Reply-To: <1D7C246596BB4179BFE3FE64F0F1426D@DGBP7M81> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LbK9O-0005U2-6n. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net 1LbK9O-0005U2-6n 6820cb32384b043dd7190226f44756df Subject: Re: [Ltru] Possible issue: remove "first edition" from titles of standards X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 19:43:00 -0000 Den 2009-02-22 20.07, skrev "Doug Ewell" : > G=E9rard Lang has mentioned on at least two occasions (public and private) = that > the words "first edition" are not properly part of the title of ISO 639-2 and > should not be cited as such, or at least not within the quotation marks, as > we have it in both drafts. The ISO 639-2 Web site seems to corroborate > this. Upon checking, I noticed that draft-4645bis also has "first edition" in > the title of ISO 639-3. I don't have access to a paper copy of 639-3 and > the Web site did not resolve the question for me of whether these words > belong in the title. I would have let this pass, but since you brought it up: It is never part of the title per se. In this case see http://www.iso.org/iso/search.htm?qt=3D639-3&searchSubmit=3DSearch&sort=3Drel&typ= e =3Dsimple&published=3Don, or (expanding the search) http://www.iso.org/iso/search.htm?qt=3D639&published=3Don&active_tab=3Dstandards. OLD TEXT: [ISO639-3] International Organization for Standardization, "ISO 639- 3:2007. Codes for the representation of names of languages - Part 3: Alpha-3 code for comprehensive coverage of languages, first edition", February 2007. NEW TEXT: [ISO639-3] International Organization for Standardization, ISO 639-3:2007, "Codes for the representation of names of languages -- Part 3: Alpha-3 code for comprehensive coverage of languages", first edition, February 2007. (The edition and date information could be left out for an edition generic reference. ISO standards use template text regarding such undated references.) Similarly for all other ISO standards references (but not for data files...). I by no means insist on fixing this, but if you do do a fix for this, there are several reference list entries to fix. Use the ISO site search feature... /kent k =20 > I leave it up to the co-chairs to decide whether it is > worthwhile to open issues for this. I mention it here only so we don't get > hit with it again during IETF LC, or in an appeal. -- Doug Ewell * > Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN > #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.htm > l http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages > =96 _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing > list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sun Feb 22 22:35:15 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0D8C3A6880 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:35:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.52 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.52 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.079, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w6FbM6iftSQW for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:35:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D840F3A677C for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:35:14 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=otIP/WL3qSVspsZH4Mp9DCHhvb8zDhgYQ2w1Ox85J448medx7rx4UQXqhJisFQHZ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.28.109] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbUPa-0008Mv-8d for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 01:35:30 -0500 Message-ID: <001301c99580$fa073a60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <43F727A86FF746D0A599A1C77B5C5A58@DGBP7M81> Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:35:52 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173652c6f897e7f04918c3bcdd1dca5c9db350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.28.109 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 06:35:15 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2009 10:33 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis > > Proposed changes to address this issue: Thank you for working through all these details! > Section 2.1: > > OLD: > > The source data for [ISO639-5] used for this update was Table 3, > "Language families and groups ordered by identifier", from the PDF > version of the standard. > > NEW: > > The source data for [ISO639-5] used for this update consisted of one > file, available from the official site of the ISO 639-5 Registration > Authority. [RFC EDITOR NOTE: this file may be updated before approval > of this memo.] As co-chair... >From a process point of view, I think we really need to pick a particular version (even just by saying that we used whatever was available on date FOO) so that IESG review, IETF last call, and the publication process are not on a moving target. If the ISO file changes during that period, someone can choose to request that those changes be incorporated as an IETF last call comment. As a technical contributor: Other than agreeing with the co-chair about the desirability of picking a date in the interest of stability during the IETF last call process, I have no problem with any of the editor's proposed changes for this issue. Randy Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Sun Feb 22 22:39:29 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A68E53A67A1 for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:39:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.523 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.523 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.076, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id bLePqV2G47ns for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:39:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 58CCB3A677C for ; Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:39:28 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=F/yHeBzaJ60SPb5LwoAqit3HxzUtRxZUaWo9pkzhFAwY8F4j382O7QtZ4j3dJI69; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.28.109] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbUTh-0002lG-KA for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 01:39:45 -0500 Message-ID: <001d01c99581$92422ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 22:40:08 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1732ebe20ee77c38dfb3c414926264f1a2b350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.28.109 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 06:39:29 -0000 Hi - I've added this as issue #30. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kent Karlsson" To: "Doug Ewell" ; "LTRU Working Group" Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2009 11:37 AM Subject: Re: [Ltru] Possible issue: remove "first edition" from titles of standards Den 2009-02-22 20.07, skrev "Doug Ewell" : > Grard Lang has mentioned on at least two occasions (public and private) that > the words "first edition" are not properly part of the title of ISO 639-2 and > should not be cited as such, or at least not within the quotation marks, as > we have it in both drafts. The ISO 639-2 Web site seems to corroborate > this. Upon checking, I noticed that draft-4645bis also has "first edition" in > the title of ISO 639-3. I don't have access to a paper copy of 639-3 and > the Web site did not resolve the question for me of whether these words > belong in the title. I would have let this pass, but since you brought it up: It is never part of the title per se. In this case see http://www.iso.org/iso/search.htm?qt=639-3&searchSubmit=Search&sort=rel&type =simple&published=on, or (expanding the search) http://www.iso.org/iso/search.htm?qt=639&published=on&active_tab=standards. OLD TEXT: [ISO639-3] International Organization for Standardization, "ISO 639- 3:2007. Codes for the representation of names of languages - Part 3: Alpha-3 code for comprehensive coverage of languages, first edition", February 2007. NEW TEXT: [ISO639-3] International Organization for Standardization, ISO 639-3:2007, "Codes for the representation of names of languages -- Part 3: Alpha-3 code for comprehensive coverage of languages", first edition, February 2007. (The edition and date information could be left out for an edition generic reference. ISO standards use template text regarding such undated references.) Similarly for all other ISO standards references (but not for data files...). I by no means insist on fixing this, but if you do do a fix for this, there are several reference list entries to fix. Use the ISO site search feature... /kent k > I leave it up to the co-chairs to decide whether it is > worthwhile to open issues for this. I mention it here only so we don't get > hit with it again during IETF LC, or in an appeal. -- Doug Ewell * > Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN > #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.htm > l http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages > - _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing > list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru _______________________________________________ Ltru mailing list Ltru@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp Mon Feb 23 00:34:05 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C277F3A6916 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 00:34:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 0.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id dXDU-EKBxOve for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 00:34:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.194]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0BF73A690A for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 00:34:03 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.253.23]) by scmailgw1.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1N8YKOW006114 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:34:20 +0900 (JST) Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse3.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 6d6c_c3fd80e4_0184_11de_9a0a_001d0969ab06; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:34:20 +0900 Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:52128) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id for from ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:25:55 +0900 Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090223171424.0745ee80@localhost> X-Sender: duerst@localhost X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 17:32:42 +0900 To: "Phillips, Addison" , "Mark Davis" From: Martin Duerst Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: LTRU Working Group Subject: [Ltru] Fwd: Re: [xml2rfc] New trust boilerplate dated 2009-02-12 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 08:34:05 -0000 Hello Addison, Mark, In the message below, you will find instructions for producing an acceptable Internet-Draft that clears the copyright issues that came up since last November. I therefore consider that issue to be solved. I propose that you submit draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt. I have checked your current http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt for ID Nits with http://tools.ietf.org/idnits?url=http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt, and there were note except for boilerplate-related ones, which should be solved by the instructions below. I propose that you reference draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-10.txt (*10*), because I expect the remaining issues on 4645bis to be solved quickly, and to use the 21/10 pair for submission to our AD and the IESG. Regards, Martin. >From: Cullen Jennings >To: Marshall Rose ,Julian Reschke >Date: Sun, 22 Feb 2009 21:51:17 -0700 >Subject: Re: [xml2rfc] New trust boilerplate dated 2009-02-12 >List-Archive: >List-Subscribe: >, >I modified the 1.34pre2 with a horrible hack that is no doubt the >wrong way to do it but if you use the version at > >http://svn.resiprocate.org/rep/ietf-drafts/xml2rfc/1.34pre2-fluffy/xml2rfc.tcl > >and run it with > ipr="pre5378Trust200902" >it will produce text which I believe is acceptable and looks something >like > >http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-jennings-http-srv-01.txt > >The id submission tool accepts this. > >Go publish some drafts. > >Cullen > >PS - Julian & Marshal - obviously I have contributed these changes >under same license. They are so trivial I am sure they are close to >useless - took my less than 10 minutes. But if they are useful to you >of course take them and I'm glad to provide them under any license you >want except GPL. > > >On Feb 22, 2009, at 6:51 PM, Marshall Rose wrote: > >> john - could you convey the following to whoever believes they are >> in charge: >> >> would that someone be so kind as to produce the exact instructions >> on what has to change in 1.34pre2, which is found at >http://xml.resource.org/experimental.html >> - in particular look at the first bullet point on that page to >> determine the additional values for the ipr attribute of the rfc >> element. >> >> julian is already working on this; however, i want to ensure that he >> and bill are comfortable that the instructions match their >> understanding of the work. >> >> if the instructions are intelligible to myself, i will endeavor to >> produce a 1.34pre3 for review this week. assuming that version >> proves acceptable, we will call it 1.34 and put it on the main site. >> >> thanks! >> >> /mtr >> >> >> > >_______________________________________________ >xml2rfc mailing list >xml2rfc@lists.xml.resource.org >http://lists.xml.resource.org/mailman/listinfo/xml2rfc #-#-# Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University #-#-# http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp From doug@ewellic.org Mon Feb 23 06:17:18 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DCA0E3A684D for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 06:17:18 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.081 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.081 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.517, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id HwAbaax14ZFr for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 06:17:18 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpout07.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout07-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.230]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id D9A4E3A67B6 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 06:17:17 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 3892 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2009 14:17:30 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout07.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.230) with ESMTP; 23 Feb 2009 14:17:29 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Doug Ewell" To: , "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 07:17:26 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Proposal to remove Preferred-Value field for region YU in LTRU X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:17:19 -0000 (cross-posted this one time only, since there are items of interest for both groups) Randy Presuhn wrote: > No, the issue (#22 on the ltru tracker) is whether to revert a change > made to the 4645bis draft. The consensus here is clearly to *not* do > so. The question some seem to be raising here is whether to start > adding comments for these cases where we are simply following the > 4646bis procedures for Preferred-value. I'd rather *not* go there, > unless someone specifically makes a request to do so on the ltru list. They already have. John Cowan requested this comment on LTRU on January 31, and at least three other participants expressed support on LTRU. But regardless, I will remove the Preferred-Value from "YU" in draft-10 (same as in draft-09), and per the co-chair's request I will *not* add the Comments field in draft-10. The Reviewer and ietf-languages list are welcome to consider adding the comment after the new draft is published. Please send any responses about the Preferred-Value to LTRU, and about the Comments field to ietf-languages. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From doug@ewellic.org Mon Feb 23 06:54:00 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6622E3A6877 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 06:54:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.105 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.105 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.519, BAYES_00=-2.599, FAKE_REPLY_C=2.012, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XLaqhbEL4Tai for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 06:53:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.181]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 71F363A6837 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 06:53:59 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 930 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2009 14:54:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.181) with ESMTP; 23 Feb 2009 14:54:15 -0000 Message-ID: <1D9770000A774D01BFC860F02AFEE0C3@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 07:53:33 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 14:54:00 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: >> NEW: >> >> The source data for [ISO639-5] used for this update consisted of one >> file, available from the official site of the ISO 639-5 Registration >> Authority. [RFC EDITOR NOTE: this file may be updated before >> approval of this memo.] > > As co-chair... > From a process point of view, I think we really need to pick a > particular version (even just by saying that we used whatever was > available on date FOO) so that IESG review, IETF last call, and the > publication process are not on a moving target. This is the same wording I have used all along for the ISO 639-3 data files. I'd love to pick one version and go with it, but our process is moving so glacially slow that I fully expect we will be on a moving target anyway. Remember that the 639-3 data files are updated several times a year, with one huge update (several dozen adds and deletes) and numerous interim releases (almost one per month during 2008 alone). Meanwhile, it has taken us more than three years since the 4646 Registry was published to get where we are today. If you want, I can delete the [RFC EDITOR NOTES] for these two data sets, and we can deal with it later if reviewers complain that our references are out of date. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From addison@amazon.com Mon Feb 23 08:06:25 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0001F28C14A for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 08:06:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GkmznWvYu7Fz for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 08:06:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75CC428C106 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 08:06:23 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,254,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="225505872" Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 23 Feb 2009 16:06:41 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1NG6bu4004847 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 23 Feb 2009 16:06:38 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.27]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 08:06:37 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Martin Duerst Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 08:06:34 -0800 Thread-Topic: Re: [xml2rfc] New trust boilerplate dated 2009-02-12 Thread-Index: AcmVkYhtZvR9sQX5SN2BfMQHg04SGAAPt8Cw Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019D325909@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <6.0.0.20.2.20090223171424.0745ee80@localhost> In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.20.2.20090223171424.0745ee80@localhost> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] [xml2rfc] New trust boilerplate dated 2009-02-12 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 16:06:25 -0000 SGVsbG8gTWFydGluLA0KDQpUaGFua3MgZm9yIHRoZSBub3RlLg0KDQpJIHdpbGwgdHJ5IHRvIGRv IHRoaXMgdG9kYXksIGFsdGhvdWdoIEkgd291bGQgcHJlZmVyIHRvIHVzZSB0aGUgb2ZmaWNpYWwg TVRSIHZlcnNpb24gKDEuMzQpLCB3aGljaCBsb29rcyB0byBiZSBhdmFpbGFibGUgbGF0ZSB0aGlz IHdlZWsgb3IgZWFybHkgbmV4dCB3ZWVrLg0KDQpBZGRpc29uDQoNCkFkZGlzb24gUGhpbGxpcHMN Ckdsb2JhbGl6YXRpb24gQXJjaGl0ZWN0IC0tIExhYjEyNg0KDQpJbnRlcm5hdGlvbmFsaXphdGlv biBpcyBub3QgYSBmZWF0dXJlLg0KSXQgaXMgYW4gYXJjaGl0ZWN0dXJlLg0KDQoNCj4gLS0tLS1P cmlnaW5hbCBNZXNzYWdlLS0tLS0NCj4gRnJvbTogTWFydGluIER1ZXJzdCBbbWFpbHRvOmR1ZXJz dEBpdC5hb3lhbWEuYWMuanBdDQo+IFNlbnQ6IE1vbmRheSwgRmVicnVhcnkgMjMsIDIwMDkgMTI6 MzMgQU0NCj4gVG86IFBoaWxsaXBzLCBBZGRpc29uOyBNYXJrIERhdmlzDQo+IENjOiBMVFJVIFdv cmtpbmcgR3JvdXANCj4gU3ViamVjdDogRndkOiBSZTogW3htbDJyZmNdIE5ldyB0cnVzdCBib2ls ZXJwbGF0ZSBkYXRlZCAyMDA5LTAyLTEyDQo+IA0KPiBIZWxsbyBBZGRpc29uLCBNYXJrLA0KPiAN Cj4gSW4gdGhlIG1lc3NhZ2UgYmVsb3csIHlvdSB3aWxsIGZpbmQgaW5zdHJ1Y3Rpb25zIGZvciBw cm9kdWNpbmcNCj4gYW4gYWNjZXB0YWJsZSBJbnRlcm5ldC1EcmFmdCB0aGF0IGNsZWFycyB0aGUg Y29weXJpZ2h0IGlzc3Vlcw0KPiB0aGF0IGNhbWUgdXAgc2luY2UgbGFzdCBOb3ZlbWJlci4NCj4g DQo+IEkgdGhlcmVmb3JlIGNvbnNpZGVyIHRoYXQgaXNzdWUgdG8gYmUgc29sdmVkLiBJIHByb3Bv c2UgdGhhdA0KPiB5b3Ugc3VibWl0IGRyYWZ0LWlldGYtbHRydS00NjQ2YmlzLTIxLnR4dC4gSSBo YXZlIGNoZWNrZWQgeW91cg0KPiBjdXJyZW50IGh0dHA6Ly93d3cuaW50ZXItbG9jYWxlLmNvbS9J RC9kcmFmdC1pZXRmLWx0cnUtNDY0NmJpcy0NCj4gMjEudHh0DQo+IGZvciBJRCBOaXRzIHdpdGgg aHR0cDovL3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2lkbml0cz91cmw9aHR0cDovL3d3dy5pbnRlci0NCj4gbG9j YWxlLmNvbS9JRC9kcmFmdC1pZXRmLWx0cnUtNDY0NmJpcy0yMS50eHQsDQo+IGFuZCB0aGVyZSB3 ZXJlIG5vdGUgZXhjZXB0IGZvciBib2lsZXJwbGF0ZS1yZWxhdGVkIG9uZXMsDQo+IHdoaWNoIHNo b3VsZCBiZSBzb2x2ZWQgYnkgdGhlIGluc3RydWN0aW9ucyBiZWxvdy4NCj4gDQo+IEkgcHJvcG9z ZSB0aGF0IHlvdSByZWZlcmVuY2UgZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1sdHJ1LTQ2NDViaXMtMTAudHh0DQo+ICgq MTAqKSwgYmVjYXVzZSBJIGV4cGVjdCB0aGUgcmVtYWluaW5nIGlzc3VlcyBvbiA0NjQ1YmlzIHRv DQo+IGJlIHNvbHZlZCBxdWlja2x5LCBhbmQgdG8gdXNlIHRoZSAyMS8xMCBwYWlyIGZvciBzdWJt aXNzaW9uDQo+IHRvIG91ciBBRCBhbmQgdGhlIElFU0cuDQo+IA0KPiBSZWdhcmRzLCAgICBNYXJ0 aW4uDQo+IA0KPiA+RnJvbTogQ3VsbGVuIEplbm5pbmdzIDxmbHVmZnlAY2lzY28uY29tPg0KPiA+ VG86IE1hcnNoYWxsIFJvc2UgPG1yb3NlQGRiYy5tdHZpZXcuY2EudXM+LEp1bGlhbiBSZXNjaGtl DQo+IDxqdWxpYW4ucmVzY2hrZUBnbXguZGU+DQo+ID5EYXRlOiBTdW4sIDIyIEZlYiAyMDA5IDIx OjUxOjE3IC0wNzAwDQo+ID5TdWJqZWN0OiBSZTogW3htbDJyZmNdIE5ldyB0cnVzdCBib2lsZXJw bGF0ZSBkYXRlZCAyMDA5LTAyLTEyDQo+ID5MaXN0LUFyY2hpdmU6IDxodHRwOi8vbGlzdHMueG1s LnJlc291cmNlLm9yZy9waXBlcm1haWwveG1sMnJmYz4NCj4gPkxpc3QtU3Vic2NyaWJlOg0KPiA+ PGh0dHA6Ly9saXN0cy54bWwucmVzb3VyY2Uub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8veG1sMnJmYz4s PG1haWx0bzp4DQo+IG1sMnJmYy1yZXF1ZXN0QGxpc3RzLnhtbC5yZXNvdXJjZS5vcmc/c3ViamVj dD1zdWJzY3JpYmU+DQo+IA0KPiA+SSBtb2RpZmllZCB0aGUgMS4zNHByZTIgd2l0aCBhIGhvcnJp YmxlIGhhY2sgdGhhdCBpcyBubyBkb3VidCB0aGUNCj4gPndyb25nIHdheSB0byBkbyBpdCBidXQg aWYgeW91IHVzZSB0aGUgdmVyc2lvbiBhdA0KPiA+DQo+ID5odHRwOi8vc3ZuLnJlc2lwcm9jYXRl Lm9yZy9yZXAvaWV0Zi1kcmFmdHMveG1sMnJmYy8xLjM0cHJlMi0NCj4gZmx1ZmZ5L3htbDJyZmMu dGNsDQo+ID4NCj4gPmFuZCBydW4gaXQgd2l0aA0KPiA+ICAgICBpcHI9InByZTUzNzhUcnVzdDIw MDkwMiINCj4gPml0IHdpbGwgcHJvZHVjZSB0ZXh0IHdoaWNoIEkgYmVsaWV2ZSBpcyBhY2NlcHRh YmxlIGFuZCBsb29rcw0KPiBzb21ldGhpbmcNCj4gPmxpa2UNCj4gPg0KPiA+aHR0cDovL3d3dy5p ZXRmLm9yZy9pbnRlcm5ldC1kcmFmdHMvZHJhZnQtamVubmluZ3MtaHR0cC1zcnYtMDEudHh0DQo+ ID4NCj4gPlRoZSBpZCBzdWJtaXNzaW9uIHRvb2wgYWNjZXB0cyB0aGlzLg0KPiA+DQo+ID5HbyBw dWJsaXNoIHNvbWUgZHJhZnRzLg0KPiA+DQo+ID5DdWxsZW4NCj4gPg0KPiA+UFMgLSBKdWxpYW4g JiBNYXJzaGFsIC0gb2J2aW91c2x5IEkgaGF2ZSBjb250cmlidXRlZCB0aGVzZSBjaGFuZ2VzDQo+ ID51bmRlciBzYW1lIGxpY2Vuc2UuIFRoZXkgYXJlIHNvIHRyaXZpYWwgSSBhbSBzdXJlIHRoZXkg YXJlIGNsb3NlDQo+IHRvDQo+ID51c2VsZXNzIC0gdG9vayBteSBsZXNzIHRoYW4gMTAgbWludXRl cy4gQnV0IGlmIHRoZXkgYXJlIHVzZWZ1bCB0bw0KPiB5b3UNCj4gPm9mIGNvdXJzZSB0YWtlIHRo ZW0gYW5kIEknbSBnbGFkIHRvIHByb3ZpZGUgdGhlbSB1bmRlciBhbnkgbGljZW5zZQ0KPiB5b3UN Cj4gPndhbnQgZXhjZXB0IEdQTC4NCj4gPg0KPiA+DQo+ID5PbiBGZWIgMjIsIDIwMDksIGF0IDY6 NTEgUE0sIE1hcnNoYWxsIFJvc2Ugd3JvdGU6DQo+ID4NCj4gPj4gam9obiAtIGNvdWxkIHlvdSBj b252ZXkgdGhlIGZvbGxvd2luZyB0byB3aG9ldmVyIGJlbGlldmVzIHRoZXkNCj4gYXJlDQo+ID4+ IGluIGNoYXJnZToNCj4gPj4NCj4gPj4gd291bGQgdGhhdCBzb21lb25lIGJlIHNvIGtpbmQgYXMg dG8gcHJvZHVjZSB0aGUgZXhhY3QNCj4gaW5zdHJ1Y3Rpb25zDQo+ID4+IG9uIHdoYXQgaGFzIHRv IGNoYW5nZSBpbiAxLjM0cHJlMiwgd2hpY2ggaXMgZm91bmQgYXQNCj4gPmh0dHA6Ly94bWwucmVz b3VyY2Uub3JnL2V4cGVyaW1lbnRhbC5odG1sDQo+ID4+ICAtIGluIHBhcnRpY3VsYXIgbG9vayBh dCB0aGUgZmlyc3QgYnVsbGV0IHBvaW50IG9uIHRoYXQgcGFnZSB0bw0KPiA+PiBkZXRlcm1pbmUg dGhlIGFkZGl0aW9uYWwgdmFsdWVzIGZvciB0aGUgaXByIGF0dHJpYnV0ZSBvZiB0aGUgcmZjDQo+ ID4+IGVsZW1lbnQuDQo+ID4+DQo+ID4+IGp1bGlhbiBpcyBhbHJlYWR5IHdvcmtpbmcgb24gdGhp czsgaG93ZXZlciwgaSB3YW50IHRvIGVuc3VyZQ0KPiB0aGF0IGhlDQo+ID4+IGFuZCBiaWxsIGFy ZSBjb21mb3J0YWJsZSB0aGF0IHRoZSBpbnN0cnVjdGlvbnMgbWF0Y2ggdGhlaXINCj4gPj4gdW5k ZXJzdGFuZGluZyBvZiB0aGUgd29yay4NCj4gPj4NCj4gPj4gaWYgdGhlIGluc3RydWN0aW9ucyBh cmUgaW50ZWxsaWdpYmxlIHRvIG15c2VsZiwgaSB3aWxsIGVuZGVhdm9yDQo+IHRvDQo+ID4+IHBy b2R1Y2UgYSAxLjM0cHJlMyBmb3IgcmV2aWV3IHRoaXMgd2Vlay4gYXNzdW1pbmcgdGhhdCB2ZXJz aW9uDQo+ID4+IHByb3ZlcyBhY2NlcHRhYmxlLCB3ZSB3aWxsIGNhbGwgaXQgMS4zNCBhbmQgcHV0 IGl0IG9uIHRoZSBtYWluDQo+IHNpdGUuDQo+ID4+DQo+ID4+IHRoYW5rcyENCj4gPj4NCj4gPj4g L210cg0KPiA+Pg0KPiA+Pg0KPiA+Pg0KPiA+DQo+ID5fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiA+eG1sMnJmYyBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj4gPnhtbDJy ZmNAbGlzdHMueG1sLnJlc291cmNlLm9yZw0KPiA+aHR0cDovL2xpc3RzLnhtbC5yZXNvdXJjZS5v cmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby94bWwycmZjDQo+IA0KPiANCj4gIy0jLSMgIE1hcnRpbiBKLiBE dSJyc3QsIEFzc29jLiBQcm9mZXNzb3IsIEFveWFtYSBHYWt1aW4gVW5pdmVyc2l0eQ0KPiAjLSMt IyAgaHR0cDovL3d3dy5zdy5pdC5hb3lhbWEuYWMuanANCj4gbWFpbHRvOmR1ZXJzdEBpdC5hb3lh bWEuYWMuanANCg0K From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Mon Feb 23 10:18:09 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E79D33A67D4; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:18:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.526 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.526 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.073, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id E4BEGtks-wqJ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:18:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E14513A679C; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:18:08 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=c5VpAnqzpDeYXPCH9SIe+LcEO0+yVWvHVwjp2vUAw1IEAy17IXw8KuMgHX/tbxLo; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Cc:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.28.69] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbfNo-0006d1-Nt; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:18:24 -0500 Message-ID: <000801c995e3$2a2d5aa0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:18:43 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1731dbac5a2a3222d883d8df52c1856a1f2350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.28.69 Cc: agentx@ietf.org, Disman Subject: [Ltru] Fw: Version of xml2rfc to produce drafts with new pre5378 IPR clause X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 18:18:10 -0000 Hi - fwd fyi Randy > From: "Cullen Jennings" > To: "IETF discussion list" ; "Working Group Chairs" > Sent: Sunday, February 22, 2009 10:32 PM > Subject: Version of xml2rfc to produce drafts with new pre5378 IPR clause > > > The XML2RFC folks are busy producing a good version of xml2rfc that > deals with the new license statements. However in the meantime I have > a hacked up version that does seem to work at least some of the time. > > You can find it at > http://svn.resiprocate.org/rep/ietf-drafts/xml2rfc/1.34pre2-fluffy/xml2rfc.tcl > > Hopefully this will soon be obsoleted when the real xml2rfc tool gets > updated. > > If you are trying to do a draft that has pre 5378 text in it, you can > set the ipr attribute in the element to ipr="pre5378Trust200902" > and it will produce a txt file that id submission tool will accept. > > Example xml at http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-jennings-http-srv-01.xml > and resulting txt file at > http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-jennings-http-srv-01.txt > > Cullen > > From addison@amazon.com Mon Feb 23 10:27:21 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D085F3A6359 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:27:21 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.299 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.299 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.300, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5YDKdMaoISkb for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:27:20 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C431F3A677C for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:27:20 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,255,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="192454547" Received: from smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com ([172.20.19.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 23 Feb 2009 18:27:38 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-0201.sea3.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1NIRcvX028092 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Mon, 23 Feb 2009 18:27:38 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.27]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:27:37 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: "Phillips, Addison" , Martin Duerst Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:27:36 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] [xml2rfc] New trust boilerplate dated 2009-02-12 Thread-Index: AcmVkYhtZvR9sQX5SN2BfMQHg04SGAAPt8CwAATr+JA= Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DBFABA2@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <6.0.0.20.2.20090223171424.0745ee80@localhost> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019D325909@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> In-Reply-To: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019D325909@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] [xml2rfc] New trust boilerplate dated 2009-02-12 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 18:27:21 -0000 SSBoYXZlIGdlbmVyYXRlZCBhIG5ldyBkcmFmdC0yMSBiYXNlZCBvbiB0aGUgdG9vbCBiZWxvdyBh bmQgcG9zdGVkIGl0IHRvIEludGVyLUxvY2FsZS4gSSBuZWVkIHRvIHVwZGF0ZSB0aGUgcmVmZXJl bmNlIHRvIDQ2NDViaXMtMTAgYW5kIGRvIHNvbWUgZmluYWwgY2hlY2tzLiBQbGVhc2UgYWR2aXNl IHdoZW4gcmVhZHkgZm9yIHN1Ym1pc3Npb24uDQoNCkFkZGlzb24NCg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlw cw0KR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoNCkludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0 aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRlY3R1cmUuDQoNCg0KPiAtLS0t LU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21h aWx0bzpsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIE9uDQo+IEJlaGFsZiBPZiBQaGlsbGlwcywgQWRk aXNvbg0KPiBTZW50OiBNb25kYXksIEZlYnJ1YXJ5IDIzLCAyMDA5IDg6MDcgQU0NCj4gVG86IE1h cnRpbiBEdWVyc3QNCj4gQ2M6IExUUlUgV29ya2luZyBHcm91cA0KPiBTdWJqZWN0OiBSZTogW0x0 cnVdIFt4bWwycmZjXSBOZXcgdHJ1c3QgYm9pbGVycGxhdGUgZGF0ZWQgMjAwOS0wMi0NCj4gMTIN Cj4gDQo+IEhlbGxvIE1hcnRpbiwNCj4gDQo+IFRoYW5rcyBmb3IgdGhlIG5vdGUuDQo+IA0KPiBJ IHdpbGwgdHJ5IHRvIGRvIHRoaXMgdG9kYXksIGFsdGhvdWdoIEkgd291bGQgcHJlZmVyIHRvIHVz ZSB0aGUNCj4gb2ZmaWNpYWwgTVRSIHZlcnNpb24gKDEuMzQpLCB3aGljaCBsb29rcyB0byBiZSBh dmFpbGFibGUgbGF0ZSB0aGlzDQo+IHdlZWsgb3IgZWFybHkgbmV4dCB3ZWVrLg0KPiANCj4gQWRk aXNvbg0KPiANCj4gQWRkaXNvbiBQaGlsbGlwcw0KPiBHbG9iYWxpemF0aW9uIEFyY2hpdGVjdCAt LSBMYWIxMjYNCj4gDQo+IEludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQo+ IEl0IGlzIGFuIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZS4NCj4gDQo+IA0KPiA+IC0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2Fn ZS0tLS0tDQo+ID4gRnJvbTogTWFydGluIER1ZXJzdCBbbWFpbHRvOmR1ZXJzdEBpdC5hb3lhbWEu YWMuanBdDQo+ID4gU2VudDogTW9uZGF5LCBGZWJydWFyeSAyMywgMjAwOSAxMjozMyBBTQ0KPiA+ IFRvOiBQaGlsbGlwcywgQWRkaXNvbjsgTWFyayBEYXZpcw0KPiA+IENjOiBMVFJVIFdvcmtpbmcg R3JvdXANCj4gPiBTdWJqZWN0OiBGd2Q6IFJlOiBbeG1sMnJmY10gTmV3IHRydXN0IGJvaWxlcnBs YXRlIGRhdGVkIDIwMDktMDItDQo+IDEyDQo+ID4NCj4gPiBIZWxsbyBBZGRpc29uLCBNYXJrLA0K PiA+DQo+ID4gSW4gdGhlIG1lc3NhZ2UgYmVsb3csIHlvdSB3aWxsIGZpbmQgaW5zdHJ1Y3Rpb25z IGZvciBwcm9kdWNpbmcNCj4gPiBhbiBhY2NlcHRhYmxlIEludGVybmV0LURyYWZ0IHRoYXQgY2xl YXJzIHRoZSBjb3B5cmlnaHQgaXNzdWVzDQo+ID4gdGhhdCBjYW1lIHVwIHNpbmNlIGxhc3QgTm92 ZW1iZXIuDQo+ID4NCj4gPiBJIHRoZXJlZm9yZSBjb25zaWRlciB0aGF0IGlzc3VlIHRvIGJlIHNv bHZlZC4gSSBwcm9wb3NlIHRoYXQNCj4gPiB5b3Ugc3VibWl0IGRyYWZ0LWlldGYtbHRydS00NjQ2 YmlzLTIxLnR4dC4gSSBoYXZlIGNoZWNrZWQgeW91cg0KPiA+IGN1cnJlbnQgaHR0cDovL3d3dy5p bnRlci1sb2NhbGUuY29tL0lEL2RyYWZ0LWlldGYtbHRydS00NjQ2YmlzLQ0KPiA+IDIxLnR4dA0K PiA+IGZvciBJRCBOaXRzIHdpdGgNCj4gaHR0cDovL3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2lkbml0cz91cmw9 aHR0cDovL3d3dy5pbnRlci0NCj4gPiBsb2NhbGUuY29tL0lEL2RyYWZ0LWlldGYtbHRydS00NjQ2 YmlzLTIxLnR4dCwNCj4gPiBhbmQgdGhlcmUgd2VyZSBub3RlIGV4Y2VwdCBmb3IgYm9pbGVycGxh dGUtcmVsYXRlZCBvbmVzLA0KPiA+IHdoaWNoIHNob3VsZCBiZSBzb2x2ZWQgYnkgdGhlIGluc3Ry dWN0aW9ucyBiZWxvdy4NCj4gPg0KPiA+IEkgcHJvcG9zZSB0aGF0IHlvdSByZWZlcmVuY2UgZHJh ZnQtaWV0Zi1sdHJ1LTQ2NDViaXMtMTAudHh0DQo+ID4gKCoxMCopLCBiZWNhdXNlIEkgZXhwZWN0 IHRoZSByZW1haW5pbmcgaXNzdWVzIG9uIDQ2NDViaXMgdG8NCj4gPiBiZSBzb2x2ZWQgcXVpY2ts eSwgYW5kIHRvIHVzZSB0aGUgMjEvMTAgcGFpciBmb3Igc3VibWlzc2lvbg0KPiA+IHRvIG91ciBB RCBhbmQgdGhlIElFU0cuDQo+ID4NCj4gPiBSZWdhcmRzLCAgICBNYXJ0aW4uDQo+ID4NCj4gPiA+ RnJvbTogQ3VsbGVuIEplbm5pbmdzIDxmbHVmZnlAY2lzY28uY29tPg0KPiA+ID5UbzogTWFyc2hh bGwgUm9zZSA8bXJvc2VAZGJjLm10dmlldy5jYS51cz4sSnVsaWFuIFJlc2Noa2UNCj4gPiA8anVs aWFuLnJlc2Noa2VAZ214LmRlPg0KPiA+ID5EYXRlOiBTdW4sIDIyIEZlYiAyMDA5IDIxOjUxOjE3 IC0wNzAwDQo+ID4gPlN1YmplY3Q6IFJlOiBbeG1sMnJmY10gTmV3IHRydXN0IGJvaWxlcnBsYXRl IGRhdGVkIDIwMDktMDItMTINCj4gPiA+TGlzdC1BcmNoaXZlOiA8aHR0cDovL2xpc3RzLnhtbC5y ZXNvdXJjZS5vcmcvcGlwZXJtYWlsL3htbDJyZmM+DQo+ID4gPkxpc3QtU3Vic2NyaWJlOg0KPiA+ DQo+ID48aHR0cDovL2xpc3RzLnhtbC5yZXNvdXJjZS5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby94bWwy cmZjPiw8bWFpbHRvOngNCj4gPiBtbDJyZmMtcmVxdWVzdEBsaXN0cy54bWwucmVzb3VyY2Uub3Jn P3N1YmplY3Q9c3Vic2NyaWJlPg0KPiA+DQo+ID4gPkkgbW9kaWZpZWQgdGhlIDEuMzRwcmUyIHdp dGggYSBob3JyaWJsZSBoYWNrIHRoYXQgaXMgbm8gZG91YnQNCj4gdGhlDQo+ID4gPndyb25nIHdh eSB0byBkbyBpdCBidXQgaWYgeW91IHVzZSB0aGUgdmVyc2lvbiBhdA0KPiA+ID4NCj4gPiA+aHR0 cDovL3N2bi5yZXNpcHJvY2F0ZS5vcmcvcmVwL2lldGYtZHJhZnRzL3htbDJyZmMvMS4zNHByZTIt DQo+ID4gZmx1ZmZ5L3htbDJyZmMudGNsDQo+ID4gPg0KPiA+ID5hbmQgcnVuIGl0IHdpdGgNCj4g PiA+ICAgICBpcHI9InByZTUzNzhUcnVzdDIwMDkwMiINCj4gPiA+aXQgd2lsbCBwcm9kdWNlIHRl eHQgd2hpY2ggSSBiZWxpZXZlIGlzIGFjY2VwdGFibGUgYW5kIGxvb2tzDQo+ID4gc29tZXRoaW5n DQo+ID4gPmxpa2UNCj4gPiA+DQo+ID4gPmh0dHA6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvaW50ZXJuZXQtZHJh ZnRzL2RyYWZ0LWplbm5pbmdzLWh0dHAtc3J2LQ0KPiAwMS50eHQNCj4gPiA+DQo+ID4gPlRoZSBp ZCBzdWJtaXNzaW9uIHRvb2wgYWNjZXB0cyB0aGlzLg0KPiA+ID4NCj4gPiA+R28gcHVibGlzaCBz b21lIGRyYWZ0cy4NCj4gPiA+DQo+ID4gPkN1bGxlbg0KPiA+ID4NCj4gPiA+UFMgLSBKdWxpYW4g JiBNYXJzaGFsIC0gb2J2aW91c2x5IEkgaGF2ZSBjb250cmlidXRlZCB0aGVzZQ0KPiBjaGFuZ2Vz DQo+ID4gPnVuZGVyIHNhbWUgbGljZW5zZS4gVGhleSBhcmUgc28gdHJpdmlhbCBJIGFtIHN1cmUg dGhleSBhcmUgY2xvc2UNCj4gPiB0bw0KPiA+ID51c2VsZXNzIC0gdG9vayBteSBsZXNzIHRoYW4g MTAgbWludXRlcy4gQnV0IGlmIHRoZXkgYXJlIHVzZWZ1bA0KPiB0bw0KPiA+IHlvdQ0KPiA+ID5v ZiBjb3Vyc2UgdGFrZSB0aGVtIGFuZCBJJ20gZ2xhZCB0byBwcm92aWRlIHRoZW0gdW5kZXIgYW55 DQo+IGxpY2Vuc2UNCj4gPiB5b3UNCj4gPiA+d2FudCBleGNlcHQgR1BMLg0KPiA+ID4NCj4gPiA+ DQo+ID4gPk9uIEZlYiAyMiwgMjAwOSwgYXQgNjo1MSBQTSwgTWFyc2hhbGwgUm9zZSB3cm90ZToN Cj4gPiA+DQo+ID4gPj4gam9obiAtIGNvdWxkIHlvdSBjb252ZXkgdGhlIGZvbGxvd2luZyB0byB3 aG9ldmVyIGJlbGlldmVzIHRoZXkNCj4gPiBhcmUNCj4gPiA+PiBpbiBjaGFyZ2U6DQo+ID4gPj4N Cj4gPiA+PiB3b3VsZCB0aGF0IHNvbWVvbmUgYmUgc28ga2luZCBhcyB0byBwcm9kdWNlIHRoZSBl eGFjdA0KPiA+IGluc3RydWN0aW9ucw0KPiA+ID4+IG9uIHdoYXQgaGFzIHRvIGNoYW5nZSBpbiAx LjM0cHJlMiwgd2hpY2ggaXMgZm91bmQgYXQNCj4gPiA+aHR0cDovL3htbC5yZXNvdXJjZS5vcmcv ZXhwZXJpbWVudGFsLmh0bWwNCj4gPiA+PiAgLSBpbiBwYXJ0aWN1bGFyIGxvb2sgYXQgdGhlIGZp cnN0IGJ1bGxldCBwb2ludCBvbiB0aGF0IHBhZ2UNCj4gdG8NCj4gPiA+PiBkZXRlcm1pbmUgdGhl IGFkZGl0aW9uYWwgdmFsdWVzIGZvciB0aGUgaXByIGF0dHJpYnV0ZSBvZiB0aGUNCj4gcmZjDQo+ ID4gPj4gZWxlbWVudC4NCj4gPiA+Pg0KPiA+ID4+IGp1bGlhbiBpcyBhbHJlYWR5IHdvcmtpbmcg b24gdGhpczsgaG93ZXZlciwgaSB3YW50IHRvIGVuc3VyZQ0KPiA+IHRoYXQgaGUNCj4gPiA+PiBh bmQgYmlsbCBhcmUgY29tZm9ydGFibGUgdGhhdCB0aGUgaW5zdHJ1Y3Rpb25zIG1hdGNoIHRoZWly DQo+ID4gPj4gdW5kZXJzdGFuZGluZyBvZiB0aGUgd29yay4NCj4gPiA+Pg0KPiA+ID4+IGlmIHRo ZSBpbnN0cnVjdGlvbnMgYXJlIGludGVsbGlnaWJsZSB0byBteXNlbGYsIGkgd2lsbA0KPiBlbmRl YXZvcg0KPiA+IHRvDQo+ID4gPj4gcHJvZHVjZSBhIDEuMzRwcmUzIGZvciByZXZpZXcgdGhpcyB3 ZWVrLiBhc3N1bWluZyB0aGF0IHZlcnNpb24NCj4gPiA+PiBwcm92ZXMgYWNjZXB0YWJsZSwgd2Ug d2lsbCBjYWxsIGl0IDEuMzQgYW5kIHB1dCBpdCBvbiB0aGUgbWFpbg0KPiA+IHNpdGUuDQo+ID4g Pj4NCj4gPiA+PiB0aGFua3MhDQo+ID4gPj4NCj4gPiA+PiAvbXRyDQo+ID4gPj4NCj4gPiA+Pg0K PiA+ID4+DQo+ID4gPg0KPiA+ID5fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fXw0KPiA+ID54bWwycmZjIG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiA+ID54bWwycmZjQGxpc3Rz LnhtbC5yZXNvdXJjZS5vcmcNCj4gPiA+aHR0cDovL2xpc3RzLnhtbC5yZXNvdXJjZS5vcmcvbWFp bG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby94bWwycmZjDQo+ID4NCj4gPg0KPiA+ICMtIy0jICBNYXJ0aW4gSi4gRHUi cnN0LCBBc3NvYy4gUHJvZmVzc29yLCBBb3lhbWEgR2FrdWluDQo+IFVuaXZlcnNpdHkNCj4gPiAj LSMtIyAgaHR0cDovL3d3dy5zdy5pdC5hb3lhbWEuYWMuanANCj4gPiBtYWlsdG86ZHVlcnN0QGl0 LmFveWFtYS5hYy5qcA0KPiANCj4gX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX18NCj4gTHRydSBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QNCj4gTHRydUBpZXRmLm9yZw0KPiBodHRw czovL3d3dy5pZXRmLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL2x0cnUNCg== From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Mon Feb 23 10:53:31 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 93C243A68B2 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:53:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.531 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.531 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.068, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id XpTsfJ5MtxCZ for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:53:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 97BEB3A6827 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:53:30 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=an27exGj/o1zRWNWUIigAJ8slDyciqnMb6oHU9NRv4j2UY7N/3aR1QDZRYxwYeOZ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.28.69] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lbfw4-0002Zi-H8 for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:53:48 -0500 Message-ID: <005f01c995e8$1d0ccfe0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:54:09 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1732e54803e40146834950874da035efd90350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.28.69 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #22: Proposal to remove Preferred-Value field for region YU in LTRU X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 18:53:31 -0000 Hi - Please keep in mind that issue #22 (which we are soundly rejecting) would have been a change from draft-09. Consequently, any comments *already* *there* should *stay*. Randy > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 6:17 AM > Subject: Re: Proposal to remove Preferred-Value field for region YU in LTRU > > (cross-posted this one time only, since there are items of interest for > both groups) > > Randy Presuhn wrote: > > > No, the issue (#22 on the ltru tracker) is whether to revert a change > > made to the 4645bis draft. The consensus here is clearly to *not* do > > so. The question some seem to be raising here is whether to start > > adding comments for these cases where we are simply following the > > 4646bis procedures for Preferred-value. I'd rather *not* go there, > > unless someone specifically makes a request to do so on the ltru list. > > They already have. John Cowan requested this comment on LTRU on January > 31, and at least three other participants expressed support on LTRU. > > But regardless, I will remove the Preferred-Value from "YU" in draft-10 > (same as in draft-09), and per the co-chair's request I will *not* add > the Comments field in draft-10. The Reviewer and ietf-languages list > are welcome to consider adding the comment after the new draft is > published. > > Please send any responses about the Preferred-Value to LTRU, and about > the Comments field to ietf-languages. > > -- > Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 > http://www.ewellic.org > http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html > http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf-languages mailing list > Ietf-languages@alvestrand.no > http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages > From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Mon Feb 23 10:59:10 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 673A43A69AD for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:59:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.533 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.533 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.066, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yNqiJ91eImkJ for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:59:09 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 756303A6827 for ; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:59:09 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=rEqh9C87mzfTtOuusb90rp7mmseOnr3hRY+61T02/8EM2DQiS4vffTR9cnm+pKCy; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.28.69] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lbg1X-00060d-AY for ltru@ietf.org; Mon, 23 Feb 2009 13:59:27 -0500 Message-ID: <008301c995e8$e7b1a4a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <1D9770000A774D01BFC860F02AFEE0C3@DGBP7M81> Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 10:59:49 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173bca5133917374f7a87962210da31037c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.28.69 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Feb 2009 18:59:10 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 6:53 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis > > Randy Presuhn wrote: > > >> NEW: > >> > >> The source data for [ISO639-5] used for this update consisted of one > >> file, available from the official site of the ISO 639-5 Registration > >> Authority. [RFC EDITOR NOTE: this file may be updated before > >> approval of this memo.] > > > > As co-chair... > > From a process point of view, I think we really need to pick a > > particular version (even just by saying that we used whatever was > > available on date FOO) so that IESG review, IETF last call, and the > > publication process are not on a moving target. > > This is the same wording I have used all along for the ISO 639-3 data > files. I'd love to pick one version and go with it, but our process is > moving so glacially slow that I fully expect we will be on a moving > target anyway. Remember that the 639-3 data files are updated several > times a year, with one huge update (several dozen adds and deletes) and > numerous interim releases (almost one per month during 2008 alone). > Meanwhile, it has taken us more than three years since the 4646 Registry > was published to get where we are today. > > If you want, I can delete the [RFC EDITOR NOTES] for these two data > sets, and we can deal with it later if reviewers complain that our > references are out of date. ... How about this: [RFC EDITOR NOTE: this file is updated from time to time. The version used in the preparation of this memo was the one in place on DATE.] Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:04:57 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8328B28C0DD for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:04:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.535 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.535 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.064, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aL8ej5DmGwnU for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:04:56 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBA5F28C0DB for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:04:56 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=BGCv2+yA1syjcrcwnfzV+C24gUnknPte+X7j0agatj+zVbE3ammunzPI1RjgUO+O; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [69.3.144.14] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbsHz-0001Wz-BD for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:05:15 -0500 Message-ID: <005a01c99656$adba6e80$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:05:36 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1739d31297f0c0daa512440d24f8ae08d69350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 69.3.144.14 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #22: revert preferred-value for CS X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:04:57 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... Based on the discussion here and the confirmation on the ietf-languages@iana.org list, I've closed this issue with a "won't fix" resolution. This means that the relevant entries (e.g. CS, YU) will stay as they already are in the -09 draft of 4645bis. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:13:40 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EB2DF3A682B for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:13:40 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.455 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.455 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.144, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id AuuKMD2t-ws1 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:13:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3ACA33A69B3 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:13:37 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=ZJ8nVNiIfb2Gqky6a/0o7+Ur9YF8itwT6nYNZnm9w1M9nacJQXNvYdasru+PK54u; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.34.239] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbsQN-0005QE-Qf for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:13:56 -0500 Message-ID: <006d01c99657$e5b16860$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <1D9770000A774D01BFC860F02AFEE0C3@DGBP7M81> <008301c995e8$e7b1a4a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:14:20 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173ba875d6edf46fe2a618184d6ac054f03350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.239 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:13:41 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... I've marked this issue as closed, using the editor's proposed text. Since no-one else seems to care about the sub-issue of the exact wording of the RFC editor note, I leave this to the editor's discretion, with the understanding that updates to the ISO web site cannot be "automatically" incorporated during IESG review and IETF last call, but rather can be folded in only as the result of a specific comment and with the agreement of the working group and document shepherd. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:17:50 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D12393A6893 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:17:50 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.724 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.724 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.614, BAYES_05=-1.11] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wsRSE6Mw+yFy for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:17:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 279A33A684F for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:17:50 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Dd0RAqe6hGakSSRSHMP0CRFOm3wG29Y9Lmb2APbJPSUQCUwdiyPuk99Z628q5Tjj; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.34.239] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbsUQ-0003FN-Ly for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:18:06 -0500 Message-ID: <007401c99658$7b4556c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <004001c993d5$b11302a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:18:31 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17380890dbc920884b0c151f6f9ba772aa4350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.239 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 25: change description of 'ngf' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:17:50 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... With no further discussion or objections, we'll accept the proposed resolution for this item. I've closed the issue in the tracker. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:20:28 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A3A23A684F for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:20:28 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.413 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.413 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.186, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aOJmcrElCryB for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:20:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A992828C0D6 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:20:27 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=fd0SLnJjYV7j4pZFygXX7MkVR9UySsmaRoffVxO45ll4Q76DwSy1aELmzC/Af1Ow; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.34.239] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbsX0-00046E-0Z for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:20:46 -0500 Message-ID: <008501c99658$da4f7a60$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:21:11 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173b979a894e3fb7f0935e3894078808b80350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.239 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue 26: deletion of 'car' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:20:28 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... The resolution for this issue is to delete the next-to-last paragraph of Section 2.3 in draft-4645bis. I've closed the issue in the tracker. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:22:37 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA62128C0DD for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:22:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.684 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.684 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.574, BAYES_05=-1.11] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DzQe6DGViGib for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:22:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F32AA3A684F for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:22:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=mOJdLl6wY4dx7Ug9PPNP20LNeVYlJXqwLRcGdnSF15DN5slZ1MRet/88plqLNU56; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.34.239] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbsZ5-0005Rw-Lv for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:22:55 -0500 Message-ID: <009c01c99659$278a4a80$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <82E3F52B4B1F430BBF529264233C11E9@DGBP7M81> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:23:20 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1730b8bd56759140eb5514b2565c75d7136350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.239 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #27:addition of 'day' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:22:37 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... Based on the discussion, I've closed this issue with a resolution of "no action needed". Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:24:33 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 24AD33A684F for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:24:33 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.384 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.384 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.215, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fSsWamVwLLOZ for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:24:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6276428C0D6 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:24:32 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=JJRn/qU+WEWYydvglyrhZe4rZhn95tqAgCsTkB33urJ7RgknJ/rtUU2MkN847RVQ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.34.239] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lbsaw-0006Rs-Mi for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:24:51 -0500 Message-ID: <00a101c99659$6c176ca0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <74260373C15A461DB20708564BB9A8E4@DGBP7M81> <002701c9944f$8e900460$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:25:15 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17365812e9b98e45005e5034fdf5c42b4da350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.239 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #28: use ASCII hyphen X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:24:33 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... Since there are no objections, we'll go with the editor's proposed resolution to this issue. I've closed the issue in the tracker. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:26:24 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 594FF28C0D6 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:26:24 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.4 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.4 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.199, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wzPlGU01yCKg for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:26:23 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A95543A684F for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:26:23 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=Jymo57Rc2Uv0vQSn+exw2f39YIuLLv62E4AG+FsDspc9UYaked/kF+0H9sub0Fk9; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.34.239] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lbsck-00072l-Br for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:26:42 -0500 Message-ID: <00ae01c99659$ae9dc240$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <000601c99458$fc824b00$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:27:07 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173d8107f103abd92b816398532eec2d3f1350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.34.239 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #29: handling 'chs' X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:26:24 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... Based on the discussion, the resolution for this item is "no action needed." I've closed the issue in the tracker. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:31:41 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 212E328C115 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:31:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.594 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.594 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.484, BAYES_05=-1.11] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y3HJZdOB43ME for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:31:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6B39328C110 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:31:40 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=RYy9odasr9YUEdqhhmdI43YAv3NZHe1FK377ifTdvdgXidFdOfFmqEIXDbLhILeN; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.204.24] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lbsho-0006oe-Us for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:31:57 -0500 Message-ID: <00b901c9965a$6a0b0560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <001d01c99581$92422ce0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:30:59 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173bf608d26839101a28d6723b4aa0535e2350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.24 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:31:41 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... Resolution: The editor will make the necessary corrections to ISO document titles in the references section. I've closed the issue. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 00:35:13 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 641D63A684F for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:35:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.306 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.306 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.293, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CKrQtx3DbhgZ for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:35:12 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.62]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EBCB3A685D for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:35:12 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=SUjfwq/ZuDL4zVZNw9gvOQ5q2tsGph4NcxM3Z4BK1chhcEKvLT/veftX6NyM7WHy; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.204.24] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-dupuy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LbslF-0003bg-4d for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 03:35:29 -0500 Message-ID: <00be01c9965a$e89b88a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 00:35:54 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173e71119beda3ce129836908c579df0e7c350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.204.24 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Current open issues X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:35:13 -0000 Hi - I'm happy to report that there are currently NO open issues for either 4645bis or 4646bis. The complete issue list is available at http://trac.tools.ietf.org/wg/ltru/trac/report/6 Randy From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Tue Feb 24 04:53:30 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DEB463A6933 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 04:53:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.444 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.444 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.155, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id i4gk5eeUTyaA for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 04:53:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.213]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0CF2B3A691D for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 04:53:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:32947 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1LbwlB-00034m-7a; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 13:51:42 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 13:51:36 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards Thread-Index: AcmWfqCGJHYdhqYMTEGioKyTFofxkw== In-Reply-To: <00b901c9965a$6a0b0560$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1LbwlB-00034m-7a. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp02.sth.basefarm.net 1LbwlB-00034m-7a d38afcbd710febba1812aba51bac03cb Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:53:30 -0000 I assume this goes for both 4645bis and 4646bis. /kent k Den 2009-02-24 09.30, skrev "Randy Presuhn" : > Hi - > > As co-chair... > > Resolution: The editor will make the necessary corrections to ISO > document titles in the references section. > > I've closed the issue. > > Randy > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru From doug@ewellic.org Tue Feb 24 05:41:49 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E5D53A68B5 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 05:41:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.082 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.082 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.516, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IZw+29hcfAhK for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 05:41:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpout09.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpout09-01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.14]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 5582E3A67A2 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 05:41:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 16886 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2009 13:42:07 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpout09.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.14) with ESMTP; 24 Feb 2009 13:42:06 -0000 Message-ID: From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:41:30 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #22: Proposal to remove Preferred-Value field for region YU in LTRU X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 13:41:49 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: > Please keep in mind that issue #22 (which we are soundly rejecting) > would have been a change from draft-09. > > Consequently, any comments *already* *there* should *stay*. Sigh. Wish you'd said that earlier before raising an objection to adding comments by policy (which was not being proposed anyway). Draft-4645bis-10 will remove the P-V and include the comment, just as draft-09 had it. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From doug@ewellic.org Tue Feb 24 06:06:01 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 959773A687E for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:06:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.109 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.109 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.489, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ThCGavbtH5Rc for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:06:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.47]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id CDC8C3A6872 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:06:00 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 3617 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2009 14:06:19 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth23.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.47) with ESMTP; 24 Feb 2009 14:06:19 -0000 Message-ID: <4FC41919806C42CEB058D9AC7B43B65D@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 07:06:15 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: [Ltru] Changes to ISO 15924 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:06:01 -0000 There have been several changes to ISO 15924, effective yesterday, February 23. Since changes to ISO 15924 don't happen all that often -- the last change set before this was 15 months ago -- these really should be reflected in draft-4645bis. I will write up a set of issues to address this. Apologies to Randy, who I know was happy to see the number of open issues briefly reduced to zero. For the official list of changes, see http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/codechanges.html . -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From doug@ewellic.org Tue Feb 24 06:09:36 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B690B3A6966 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:09:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.134 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.134 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.464, BAYES_00=-2.599, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vJh2kDkF4+ty for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:09:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.181]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 65C193A6956 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 06:09:35 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 28006 invoked from network); 24 Feb 2009 14:09:54 -0000 Received: from unknown (67.177.232.210) by smtpauth01.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.181) with ESMTP; 24 Feb 2009 14:09:53 -0000 Message-ID: <5E4C6981903A48CFB8833F64FD27EBC7@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 07:09:49 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:09:36 -0000 Randy Presuhn wrote: > Since no-one else seems to care about the sub-issue of the exact > wording of the RFC editor note, I'm planning to use the wording you proposed yesterday. > I leave this to the editor's discretion, with the understanding that > updates to the ISO web site cannot be "automatically" incorporated > during IESG review and IETF last call, but rather can be folded in > only as the result of a specific comment and with the agreement of the > working group and document shepherd. In that case, it would be nice (hoping against hope) if the review, LC, and RFC Editor processes could be expedited, so that the backlog of changes that ietf-languages has to make upon publication doesn't become too onerous. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From addison@amazon.com Tue Feb 24 08:17:17 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 443053A6AEF for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:17:17 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.566 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.566 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.033, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 94BuOqvlBruj for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:17:16 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 658343A69A6 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:17:16 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,259,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="226145800" Received: from smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com ([10.218.9.29]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 24 Feb 2009 16:17:32 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4103.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.24]) by smtp-in-5102.iad5.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1OGHSOb021012 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:17:30 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.27]) by ex-hub-4103.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.24]) with mapi; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:17:28 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 08:17:25 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Current open issues Thread-Index: AcmWWuuqJBNMQXDwRoOv3QdYSUgNSgAQEoDw Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DBFB60F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <00be01c9965a$e89b88a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <00be01c9965a$e89b88a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Current open issues X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 16:17:17 -0000 VGhlIGNvLWNoYWlyIGFubm91bmNlZDoNCg0KPiBJJ20gaGFwcHkgdG8gcmVwb3J0IHRoYXQgdGhl cmUgYXJlIGN1cnJlbnRseSBOTyBvcGVuIGlzc3Vlcw0KPiBmb3IgZWl0aGVyIDQ2NDViaXMgb3Ig NDY0NmJpcy4NCg0KWWF5LiBJJ20gc2l0dGluZyBvbiBkcmFmdC0yMSBhd2FpdGluZyBhIHN1Ym1p c3Npb24gcmVxdWVzdCBmcm9tIHRoZSBjby1jaGFpcnMuDQoNCkFkZGlzb24NCg0KQWRkaXNvbiBQ aGlsbGlwcw0KR2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBBcmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2DQoNCkludGVybmF0aW9u YWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuDQpJdCBpcyBhbiBhcmNoaXRlY3R1cmUuDQoNCg0K From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 10:41:12 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 075783A692D for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:41:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZB4mBVDGKGvI for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:41:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E0FAD3A690D for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:41:07 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=EX39j7pIsEwWU1wVqgfifPfcy0+5jRenjzO5O2SrRYNUQs1zqS8Bc6V5mQny8R1r; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.99] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lc2Dc-0001Zh-Q7 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 13:41:25 -0500 Message-ID: <002f01c996af$8d0184e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:41:46 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17396867d14d776a92604c4e3468f0a72f8350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.99 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 18:41:12 -0000 Hi - > From: "Kent Karlsson" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 4:51 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards > > I assume this goes for both 4645bis and 4646bis. ... The issue was only raised regarding 4645bis. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 10:45:16 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F3523A6B21 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:45:16 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id An0Pipx+sXwc for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:45:15 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A83E3A6B3C for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:45:15 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=W5jbn9rqsooIr51HlJ0BIKd6c0KTTgMxjku5DWDhFR1mcGaESJmNtKTK2eH9TNON; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.99] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lc2Hc-00026g-As for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 13:45:32 -0500 Message-ID: <004001c996b0$21dcd1a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:45:57 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1734cc17374fe9323c751b278bf1b94c208350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.99 Subject: [Ltru] Fw: Several ways you can publish I-Ds with pre 5378 content - TODAY X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 18:45:16 -0000 Hi fwd fyi Randy ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Cullen Jennings" > To: "Working Group Chairs" ; "IETF discussion list" > Sent: Monday, February 23, 2009 2:19 PM > Subject: Several ways you can publish I-Ds with pre 5378 content - TODAY > > > Method 1: (Not recommended) > > Go read the BCP and Trust statement and edit your .txt to have the > right text. > > > > Method 2: (Recommended for people using word template) > > Go look at a draft that did work, such as > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-jennings-http-srv-01 > > And copy the Copyright Notice section into your draft > > > > Method 3: XML2RFC approach recommended for folks that run xml2rfc > locally > > Get the very hacked version at > http://svn.resiprocate.org/rep/ietf-drafts/xml2rfc/1.34pre2-fluffy/xml2rfc.tcl > > This will soon be obsoleted when the real xml2rfc tool gets updated. > Don't worry, Julian, Bill, and Marshal are working on that. They will > produce something much better than my hack of xml2rfc > > Set the ipr attribute in the element to ipr="pre5378Trust200902" > and it will produce a txt file that id submission tool will accept. > > > > Method 4: XML2RFC approach for folks that run xml2rfc on the web > > Use the experimental version from http://xml.resource.org/experimental.html > . You can download the zip or tgz file on this page or use the online > version at this page. > > Make sure you have > > > somewhere above the element. > In the element, set the ipr attribute to ipr="trust200811" > Change your abstract to use a note. Do this by changing > This draft is about ... > To > This draft is about ... > And before this not insert a note like > This document may contain material from IETF > Documents or IETF Contributions published or made publicly available > before November 10, 2008. The person(s) controlling the copyright in > some of this material may not have granted the IETF Trust the right to > allow modifications of such material outside the IETF Standards > Process. Without obtaining an adequate license from the person(s) > controlling the copyright in such materials, this document may not be > modified outside the IETF Standards Process, and derivative works of > it may not be created outside the IETF Standards Process, except to > format it for publication as an RFC or to translate it into languages > other than English. > > You can seen the XML for an example I-D that does this at > http://svn.resiprocate.org/rep/ietf-drafts/fluffy/example.xml > > That should work - good luck > > > > > > > > > > > > From kent.karlsson14@comhem.se Tue Feb 24 10:50:47 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 500E43A68A7 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:50:47 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.459 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.459 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.140, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-1] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kX350HV2uSsm for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:50:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net (ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net [80.76.149.212]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5BAA83A6922 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 10:50:45 -0800 (PST) Received: from c83-248-191-93.bredband.comhem.se ([83.248.191.93]:33464 helo=[192.168.1.2]) by ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net with esmtp (Exim 4.68) (envelope-from ) id 1Lc2Ma-0001Kr-3W; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:50:40 +0100 User-Agent: Microsoft-Entourage/12.15.0.081119 Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:50:36 +0100 From: Kent Karlsson To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Message-ID: Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards Thread-Index: AcmWsMddl5o1rsL+Nk+U2taZiYQUFw== In-Reply-To: <002f01c996af$8d0184e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable X-Originating-IP: 83.248.191.93 X-Scan-Result: No virus found in message 1Lc2Ma-0001Kr-3W. X-Scan-Signature: ch-smtp01.sth.basefarm.net 1Lc2Ma-0001Kr-3W d72b9bc07ecdc00a1a0ecdecd4352972 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 18:50:47 -0000 But the same issue occurs also in the editors's working copy of draft 21 of 4646bis. For instance: [ISO639-2] International Organization for Standardization, =B3ISO 639-2:1998. Codes for the representation of names of languages -- Part 2: Alpha-3 code, first edition,=B2 1998. Fixing this in 4645bis but not in 4646bis seems inconsistent. /kent k Den 2009-02-24 19.41, skrev "Randy Presuhn" : > Hi - >=20 >> From: "Kent Karlsson" >> To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" >> >> Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 4:51 AM >> Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of >> standards >>=20 >> I assume this goes for both 4645bis and 4646bis. > ... >=20 > The issue was only raised regarding 4645bis. From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 11:19:09 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 526E128C15B for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:19:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qsDzfwoTV1EE for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:19:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.69]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 82AF028C102 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:19:08 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=R/g0pcKDHEeixkxgB9Xp8mICF+GtqqMN+Ga3UfrsmFiiC2P7RBtw+CamH50H/9yj; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.99] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-mealy.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lc2o8-0005sk-QN for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:19:09 -0500 Message-ID: <006501c996b4$d42453c0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:19:34 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17394764ba57d1bb9f6f8a21b3f0a696692350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.99 Subject: [Ltru] Issue #31: change titles of ISO docs X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:19:09 -0000 Hi - This has been entered into the tracker as issue #31. I again repeat my request that folks making requests for new issues do so with an appropriate subject line, rather than piggy-backing onto some other issue. Randy ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kent Karlsson" To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 10:50 AM Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #30: remove "first edition" from titles of standards But the same issue occurs also in the editors's working copy of draft 21 of 4646bis. For instance: [ISO639-2] International Organization for Standardization, ISO 639-2:1998. Codes for the representation of names of languages -- Part 2: Alpha-3 code, first edition, 1998. Fixing this in 4645bis but not in 4646bis seems inconsistent. /kent k From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 11:25:29 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74E083A6927 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:25:29 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.593 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.593 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.006, BAYES_00=-2.599, FAKE_REPLY_C=2.012] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ejA-FJKINL0o for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:25:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.67]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B855C28C113 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:25:28 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=CRHwF2gBsBz6T9RBAuOzlWm6bU8aVQf037BtKHU4i+6mS3DQfknAhZVBHgD7O7Ix; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.99] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-scoter.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lc2uU-00024C-Ni for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:25:42 -0500 Message-ID: <006e01c996b5$bef8e780$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:26:08 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173e7e80eb4959cf82d9d9d7903af31c007350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.99 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #31: change titles of ISO docs X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:25:29 -0000 Hi - As a technical contributor and as WG chair: I see no value whatsoever in waiting for a resolution to this issue before the editors submit their updated drafts. The "problem" causes no ambiguity, and has no impact whatsoever on implementations or interoperability. The editors of 4646bis may choose to fix (or not fix) this item at their own discretion. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 11:28:55 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D9D353A68CD for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:28:55 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.487 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.487 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.112, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zs32SXmUQRyE for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:28:55 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.68]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 288763A6826 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:28:55 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=mgnAKuaC4vA+0+lvK6cNlkRHl+UrgRVd2R9x9g1I6TIq2646HvZ5jkj+siLOlGjj; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.99] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-masked.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lc2xs-00021o-8H for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 14:29:12 -0500 Message-ID: <007301c996b6$3beef4a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <00be01c9965a$e89b88a0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DBFB60F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 11:29:38 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f1736063be290a6f99aca97523da5492e5d6350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.99 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Current open issues X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:28:55 -0000 Hi - > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Randy Presuhn" ; "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 8:17 AM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Current open issues ... > Yay. I'm sitting on draft-21 awaiting a submission request from the co-chairs. ... I think it's time to do it. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 12:04:30 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6DAE3A657C for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:04:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.498 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.498 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.101, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rN+hr0d3ZqVe for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:04:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.70]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id ABEB53A69A1 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:04:09 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=crETTWI/NVoVDqkyn93W/7/Em80KW7oYzYs+oX+lPIPUYcIIqTcze8LQHg+lrata; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.99] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-banded.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lc3W0-0006Dy-QN for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:04:29 -0500 Message-ID: <00d701c996bb$297739e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <5E4C6981903A48CFB8833F64FD27EBC7@DGBP7M81> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:04:54 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173902083474038f74e10a83a5a736c503a350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.99 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:04:30 -0000 Hi - > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 6:09 AM > Subject: Re: [Ltru] Issue #24: Add ISO 639-5 Web references to draft-4645bis ... > In that case, it would be nice (hoping against hope) if the review, LC, > and RFC Editor processes could be expedited, so that the backlog of > changes that ietf-languages has to make upon publication doesn't become > too onerous. ... This will depend on the self-discipline of those making comments. Perfection is antithetical to completion. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 12:25:37 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E24383A693E for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:25:37 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.508 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.508 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.091, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qt3KQc40XEsX for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:25:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.66]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A08883A692D for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:25:36 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=X/gXWM1Hm9BMsToq3KRBlmkROmcYl5Vvoe1YUSVyeZakYsGREaIDtlB22qBD1+7F; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.165.6.99] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-spurfowl.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lc3ql-0007qK-FP for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 15:25:55 -0500 Message-ID: <010101c996be$287cf400$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <4FC41919806C42CEB058D9AC7B43B65D@DGBP7M81> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 12:26:21 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173ee4b3d7c91baa36809e04d54514183b9350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.165.6.99 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Changes to ISO 15924 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:25:38 -0000 Hi - As co-chair... > From: "Doug Ewell" > To: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 6:06 AM > Subject: [Ltru] Changes to ISO 15924 > > There have been several changes to ISO 15924, effective yesterday, > February 23. Since changes to ISO 15924 don't happen all that often -- > the last change set before this was 15 months ago -- these really should > be reflected in draft-4645bis. I will write up a set of issues to > address this. Apologies to Randy, who I know was happy to see the > number of open issues briefly reduced to zero. > > For the official list of changes, see > http://www.unicode.org/iso15924/codechanges.html . ... Unless there are *strenuous* objections from the WG, here is how I suggest we procede: (1) that we hand off 4645bis to the IESG *without* these changes (2) that these changes be processed in the normal manner on the ietf-languages@iana.org list (3) if these changes are approved by the LSR *before* IESG approval of the draft, they will be incorporated into an updated I-D, before handover to IETF last call, consistent with the process documented in 4645bis 2.1, which states: The version of the Language Subtag Registry that was current at the time of IESG approval of this memo served as the starting point for this update. This version was created according to the process described in [RFC4645] and maintained according to the process described in [RFC4646]. (4) if the IESG finishes reviewing the draft before the LSR acts, then those changes will need to be re-applied as part of the registry update. This is no different from what would need to happen with any other subtag registration or modification requests processed during this time. Randy From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 19:58:10 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id EF9073A67DD for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:58:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.341 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.341 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.258, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cMETfxznzlLp for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:58:10 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB6F43A6A21 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:57:42 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=d1MtQX3Mz8vpkNLXMvHcot4h0BDMk9/h7ZGzyMCiCs4IPPEV3A2j/xc/kOtgjxgZ; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [66.167.206.189] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-curtail.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LcAuI-0004uc-3k for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 22:58:02 -0500 Message-ID: <002701c996fd$5261c040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 19:58:29 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173ca38f20183e3cca692bf87b87916c276350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 66.167.206.189 Subject: [Ltru] Fw: [xml2rfc] Several ways you can publish I-Ds with pre 5378 content- TODAY X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 03:58:11 -0000 Hi - Marshall Rose provides some help on xml2rfc: > briefly, you want to set the 'ipr' attribute of the element to > one of these values: > > trust200811 > noModificationTrust200811 > noDerivativesTrust200811 > trust200902 > noModificationTrust200902 > noDerivativesTrust200902 > pre5378Trust200902 > > the final value in the list above is probably the one of interest to > most folks. Randy From gerard.meijssen@gmail.com Tue Feb 24 20:01:08 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCC203A67DD for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:01:08 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.976 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.976 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kxBZiAN8oN81 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:01:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from fg-out-1718.google.com (fg-out-1718.google.com [72.14.220.156]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A01EB3A67CF for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:01:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by fg-out-1718.google.com with SMTP id l26so193755fgb.41 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:01:26 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=CB3KEdL4X7g920fd56G8+mW+ssJQ//wWsSRj+RkXVFA=; b=jFLQ6ZJzfGOLYlqYtGQ5Ut3Ls7HwYm6YAc6AXny/RbMAHGYAymgNqknEF5w3DfB8Fe FnJnoTJ02X4l4ak7BE25VBOJPuQ+AfEGLIkcPKnLSlZBXklEMqI41gT1rkZE5Kl6UH3M +7d788QwO0LuBmKYecDLEPzFeXNgjNSe/0VSM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=Mwsx3zSG1IU644Z/JAwXcOz2cmOMjzqz/Gdxb73KlR3KUQuyKVNsGIeS1U4Da172wS TPLZXS/tF/rqOUTvsf3tkIHBXLihIhK+2J4mxrHtWQ/qjlt6cDO8t2NLTu1vnT+kKsE0 3rVZyS+bzMZwTUKxsElmbN9aRWCgkQXGv5UGY= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: gerard.meijssen@gmail.com Received: by 10.86.3.4 with SMTP id 4mr180414fgc.66.1235534486276; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:01:26 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <002701c996fd$5261c040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> References: <002701c996fd$5261c040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 05:01:26 +0100 X-Google-Sender-Auth: b643b8b46876d509 Message-ID: <41a006820902242001n225736c9gc6b1cebf43ca95de@mail.gmail.com> From: Gerard Meijssen To: Randy Presuhn Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd2480429898a0463b64a2a Cc: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] Fw: [xml2rfc] Several ways you can publish I-Ds with pre 5378 content- TODAY X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 04:01:08 -0000 --000e0cd2480429898a0463b64a2a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hoi, This is a bit too obscure for me. Could you please explain ? Thanks, Gerard 2009/2/25 Randy Presuhn > Hi - > > Marshall Rose provides some help on xml2rfc: > > > briefly, you want to set the 'ipr' attribute of the element to > > one of these values: > > > > trust200811 > > noModificationTrust200811 > > noDerivativesTrust200811 > > trust200902 > > noModificationTrust200902 > > noDerivativesTrust200902 > > pre5378Trust200902 > > > > the final value in the list above is probably the one of interest to > > most folks. > > Randy > > _______________________________________________ > Ltru mailing list > Ltru@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > --000e0cd2480429898a0463b64a2a Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hoi,
This is a bit too obscure for me. Could you please explain ?
Tha= nks,
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Gerard

2009/2/25 Randy Presuhn <randy_presuhn@mindspring.com>
Hi -

Marshall Rose provides some help on xml2rfc:

> briefly, you want to set the 'ipr' attribute of the <rfc/&g= t; element to
> one of these values:
>
> =C2=A0trust200811
> =C2=A0noModificationTrust200811
> =C2=A0noDerivativesTrust200811
> =C2=A0trust200902
> =C2=A0noModificationTrust200902
> =C2=A0noDerivativesTrust200902
> =C2=A0pre5378Trust200902
>
> the final value in the list above is probably the one of interest to > most folks.

Randy

_______________________________________________
Ltru mailing list
Ltru@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru

--000e0cd2480429898a0463b64a2a-- From addison@amazon.com Tue Feb 24 20:06:36 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CE74F3A6A8B for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:06:36 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.569 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.569 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.030, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id moZ09X7-ZZKq for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:06:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-4101.amazon.com [72.21.198.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 777763A67CF for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:06:35 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,262,1233532800"; d="scan'208,217";a="147087626" Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-4101.iad4.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 25 Feb 2009 04:06:54 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1P46snL002735 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Wed, 25 Feb 2009 04:06:54 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.27]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:06:53 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Gerard Meijssen , Randy Presuhn Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:06:51 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Fw: [xml2rfc] Several ways you can publish I-Ds with pre 5378 content- TODAY Thread-Index: AcmW/b65Gb1Jqg7kSJ6ul0/bETIXVgAAHvgw Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DDAD19F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <002701c996fd$5261c040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <41a006820902242001n225736c9gc6b1cebf43ca95de@mail.gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <41a006820902242001n225736c9gc6b1cebf43ca95de@mail.gmail.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DDAD19FEXSEA5Dantama_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Cc: LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] Fw: [xml2rfc] Several ways you can publish I-Ds with pre 5378 content- TODAY X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 04:06:36 -0000 --_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DDAD19FEXSEA5Dantama_ Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 SXQgaGFzIHRvIGRvIHdpdGggaG93IHRoZSBlZGl0b3LigJlzIGdlbmVyYXRlIHRoZSBhY3R1YWwg dGV4dCBmcm9tIHRoZSBzb3VyY2UgWE1MLg0KDQpSYW5keToNCg0KSSBnZW5lcmF0ZWQgdGhlIHRl eHQgd2l0aCBwcmU1Mzc4VHJ1c3QyMDA5MDIgc2V0IGluIHRoZSBpcHIgYXR0cmlidXRlIGFuZCBp dCBsb29rcyB0byBkbyB0aGUgcmlnaHQgdGhpbmcuIENoZWNrIGludGVyLWxvY2FsZSAoaXTigJlz IHVwIGFnYWlu4oCmIGRhcm5lZCBlbGVjdHJpYyBmb2xrcyBmaW5hbGx5IHJlc3RvcmVkIHRoZSBw b3dlcikgZm9yIGFueSBwcm9ibGVtOg0KDQogIGh0dHA6Ly93d3cuaW50ZXItbG9jYWxlLmNvbS9J RC9kcmFmdC1pZXRmLWx0cnUtNDY0NmJpcy0yMS50eHQNCg0KQWRkaXNvbg0KDQpBZGRpc29uIFBo aWxsaXBzDQpHbG9iYWxpemF0aW9uIEFyY2hpdGVjdCAtLSBMYWIxMjYNCg0KSW50ZXJuYXRpb25h bGl6YXRpb24gaXMgbm90IGEgZmVhdHVyZS4NCkl0IGlzIGFuIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZS4NCg0KRnJv bTogbHRydS1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYub3JnIFttYWlsdG86bHRydS1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYub3JnXSBP biBCZWhhbGYgT2YgR2VyYXJkIE1laWpzc2VuDQpTZW50OiBUdWVzZGF5LCBGZWJydWFyeSAyNCwg MjAwOSA4OjAxIFBNDQpUbzogUmFuZHkgUHJlc3Vobg0KQ2M6IExUUlUgV29ya2luZyBHcm91cA0K U3ViamVjdDogUmU6IFtMdHJ1XSBGdzogW3htbDJyZmNdIFNldmVyYWwgd2F5cyB5b3UgY2FuIHB1 Ymxpc2ggSS1EcyB3aXRoIHByZSA1Mzc4IGNvbnRlbnQtIFRPREFZDQoNCkhvaSwNClRoaXMgaXMg YSBiaXQgdG9vIG9ic2N1cmUgZm9yIG1lLiBDb3VsZCB5b3UgcGxlYXNlIGV4cGxhaW4gPw0KVGhh bmtzLA0KICAgICAgR2VyYXJkDQoyMDA5LzIvMjUgUmFuZHkgUHJlc3VobiA8cmFuZHlfcHJlc3Vo bkBtaW5kc3ByaW5nLmNvbTxtYWlsdG86cmFuZHlfcHJlc3VobkBtaW5kc3ByaW5nLmNvbT4+DQpI aSAtDQoNCk1hcnNoYWxsIFJvc2UgcHJvdmlkZXMgc29tZSBoZWxwIG9uIHhtbDJyZmM6DQoNCj4g YnJpZWZseSwgeW91IHdhbnQgdG8gc2V0IHRoZSAnaXByJyBhdHRyaWJ1dGUgb2YgdGhlIDxyZmMv PiBlbGVtZW50IHRvDQo+IG9uZSBvZiB0aGVzZSB2YWx1ZXM6DQo+DQo+ICB0cnVzdDIwMDgxMQ0K PiAgbm9Nb2RpZmljYXRpb25UcnVzdDIwMDgxMQ0KPiAgbm9EZXJpdmF0aXZlc1RydXN0MjAwODEx DQo+ICB0cnVzdDIwMDkwMg0KPiAgbm9Nb2RpZmljYXRpb25UcnVzdDIwMDkwMg0KPiAgbm9EZXJp dmF0aXZlc1RydXN0MjAwOTAyDQo+ICBwcmU1Mzc4VHJ1c3QyMDA5MDINCj4NCj4gdGhlIGZpbmFs IHZhbHVlIGluIHRoZSBsaXN0IGFib3ZlIGlzIHByb2JhYmx5IHRoZSBvbmUgb2YgaW50ZXJlc3Qg dG8NCj4gbW9zdCBmb2xrcy4NCg0KUmFuZHkNCg0KX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCkx0cnUgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0DQpMdHJ1QGlldGYub3JnPG1h aWx0bzpMdHJ1QGlldGYub3JnPg0KaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5m by9sdHJ1DQoNCg== --_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DDAD19FEXSEA5Dantama_ Content-Type: text/html; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 PGh0bWwgeG1sbnM6dj0idXJuOnNjaGVtYXMtbWljcm9zb2Z0LWNvbTp2bWwiIHhtbG5zOm89InVy bjpzY2hlbWFzLW1pY3Jvc29mdC1jb206b2ZmaWNlOm9mZmljZSIgeG1sbnM6dz0idXJuOnNjaGVt YXMtbWljcm9zb2Z0LWNvbTpvZmZpY2U6d29yZCIgeG1sbnM6bT0iaHR0cDovL3NjaGVtYXMubWlj cm9zb2Z0LmNvbS9vZmZpY2UvMjAwNC8xMi9vbW1sIiB4bWxucz0iaHR0cDovL3d3dy53My5vcmcv VFIvUkVDLWh0bWw0MCI+DQoNCjxoZWFkPg0KPG1ldGEgaHR0cC1lcXVpdj1Db250ZW50LVR5cGUg Y29udGVudD0idGV4dC9odG1sOyBjaGFyc2V0PXV0Zi04Ij4NCjxtZXRhIG5hbWU9R2VuZXJhdG9y IGNvbnRlbnQ9Ik1pY3Jvc29mdCBXb3JkIDEyIChmaWx0ZXJlZCBtZWRpdW0pIj4NCjxzdHlsZT4N CjwhLS0NCiAvKiBGb250IERlZmluaXRpb25zICovDQogQGZvbnQtZmFjZQ0KCXtmb250LWZhbWls eToiTVMgTWluY2hvIjsNCglwYW5vc2UtMToyIDIgNiA5IDQgMiA1IDggMyA0O30NCkBmb250LWZh Y2UNCgl7Zm9udC1mYW1pbHk6UE1pbmdMaVU7DQoJcGFub3NlLTE6MiAyIDMgMCAwIDAgMCAwIDAg MDt9DQpAZm9udC1mYWNlDQoJe2ZvbnQtZmFtaWx5OlBNaW5nTGlVOw0KCXBhbm9zZS0xOjIgMiAz IDAgMCAwIDAgMCAwIDA7fQ0KQGZvbnQtZmFjZQ0KCXtmb250LWZhbWlseToiQXJpYWwgVW5pY29k ZSBNUyI7DQoJcGFub3NlLTE6MiAxMSA2IDQgMiAyIDIgMiAyIDQ7fQ0KQGZvbnQtZmFjZQ0KCXtm b250LWZhbWlseTpDYWxpYnJpOw0KCXBhbm9zZS0xOjIgMTUgNSAyIDIgMiA0IDMgMiA0O30NCkBm b250LWZhY2UNCgl7Zm9udC1mYW1pbHk6VGFob21hOw0KCXBhbm9zZS0xOjIgMTEgNiA0IDMgNSA0 IDQgMiA0O30NCkBmb250LWZhY2UNCgl7Zm9udC1mYW1pbHk6IlxAUE1pbmdMaVUiOw0KCXBhbm9z ZS0xOjIgMiAzIDAgMCAwIDAgMCAwIDA7fQ0KQGZvbnQtZmFjZQ0KCXtmb250LWZhbWlseToiTHVj aWRhIFNhbnMgVW5pY29kZSI7DQoJcGFub3NlLTE6MiAxMSA2IDIgMyA1IDQgMiAyIDQ7fQ0KQGZv bnQtZmFjZQ0KCXtmb250LWZhbWlseToiXEBBcmlhbCBVbmljb2RlIE1TIjsNCglwYW5vc2UtMToy IDExIDYgNCAyIDIgMiAyIDIgNDt9DQpAZm9udC1mYWNlDQoJe2ZvbnQtZmFtaWx5OiJcQE1TIE1p bmNobyI7DQoJcGFub3NlLTE6MiAyIDYgOSA0IDIgNSA4IDMgNDt9DQogLyogU3R5bGUgRGVmaW5p dGlvbnMgKi8NCiBwLk1zb05vcm1hbCwgbGkuTXNvTm9ybWFsLCBkaXYuTXNvTm9ybWFsDQoJe21h cmdpbjowaW47DQoJbWFyZ2luLWJvdHRvbTouMDAwMXB0Ow0KCWZvbnQtc2l6ZToxMi4wcHQ7DQoJ Zm9udC1mYW1pbHk6IlRpbWVzIE5ldyBSb21hbiIsInNlcmlmIjt9DQphOmxpbmssIHNwYW4uTXNv SHlwZXJsaW5rDQoJe21zby1zdHlsZS1wcmlvcml0eTo5OTsNCgljb2xvcjpibHVlOw0KCXRleHQt ZGVjb3JhdGlvbjp1bmRlcmxpbmU7fQ0KYTp2aXNpdGVkLCBzcGFuLk1zb0h5cGVybGlua0ZvbGxv d2VkDQoJe21zby1zdHlsZS1wcmlvcml0eTo5OTsNCgljb2xvcjpwdXJwbGU7DQoJdGV4dC1kZWNv cmF0aW9uOnVuZGVybGluZTt9DQpzcGFuLkVtYWlsU3R5bGUxNw0KCXttc28tc3R5bGUtdHlwZTpw ZXJzb25hbC1yZXBseTsNCglmb250LWZhbWlseToiQ2FsaWJyaSIsInNhbnMtc2VyaWYiOw0KCWNv bG9yOiMxRjQ5N0Q7fQ0KLk1zb0NocERlZmF1bHQNCgl7bXNvLXN0eWxlLXR5cGU6ZXhwb3J0LW9u bHk7fQ0KQHBhZ2UgU2VjdGlvbjENCgl7c2l6ZTo4LjVpbiAxMS4waW47DQoJbWFyZ2luOjcwLjg1 cHQgNzAuODVwdCA3MC44NXB0IDcwLjg1cHQ7fQ0KZGl2LlNlY3Rpb24xDQoJe3BhZ2U6U2VjdGlv bjE7fQ0KLS0+DQo8L3N0eWxlPg0KPCEtLVtpZiBndGUgbXNvIDldPjx4bWw+DQogPG86c2hhcGVk ZWZhdWx0cyB2OmV4dD0iZWRpdCIgc3BpZG1heD0iMTAyNiIgLz4NCjwveG1sPjwhW2VuZGlmXS0t PjwhLS1baWYgZ3RlIG1zbyA5XT48eG1sPg0KIDxvOnNoYXBlbGF5b3V0IHY6ZXh0PSJlZGl0Ij4N CiAgPG86aWRtYXAgdjpleHQ9ImVkaXQiIGRhdGE9IjEiIC8+DQogPC9vOnNoYXBlbGF5b3V0Pjwv eG1sPjwhW2VuZGlmXS0tPg0KPC9oZWFkPg0KDQo8Ym9keSBsYW5nPUVOLVVTIGxpbms9Ymx1ZSB2 bGluaz1wdXJwbGU+DQoNCjxkaXYgY2xhc3M9U2VjdGlvbjE+DQoNCjxwIGNsYXNzPU1zb05vcm1h bD48c3BhbiBzdHlsZT0nZm9udC1zaXplOjExLjBwdDtmb250LWZhbWlseToiQ2FsaWJyaSIsInNh bnMtc2VyaWYiOw0KY29sb3I6IzFGNDk3RCc+SXQgaGFzIHRvIGRvIHdpdGggaG93IHRoZSBlZGl0 b3LigJlzIGdlbmVyYXRlIHRoZSBhY3R1YWwgdGV4dCBmcm9tDQp0aGUgc291cmNlIFhNTC48bzpw PjwvbzpwPjwvc3Bhbj48L3A+DQoNCjxwIGNsYXNzPU1zb05vcm1hbD48c3BhbiBzdHlsZT0nZm9u dC1zaXplOjExLjBwdDtmb250LWZhbWlseToiQ2FsaWJyaSIsInNhbnMtc2VyaWYiOw0KY29sb3I6 IzFGNDk3RCc+PG86cD4mbmJzcDs8L286cD48L3NwYW4+PC9wPg0KDQo8cCBjbGFzcz1Nc29Ob3Jt YWw+PHNwYW4gc3R5bGU9J2ZvbnQtc2l6ZToxMS4wcHQ7Zm9udC1mYW1pbHk6IkNhbGlicmkiLCJz YW5zLXNlcmlmIjsNCmNvbG9yOiMxRjQ5N0QnPlJhbmR5OiA8bzpwPjwvbzpwPjwvc3Bhbj48L3A+ DQoNCjxwIGNsYXNzPU1zb05vcm1hbD48c3BhbiBzdHlsZT0nZm9udC1zaXplOjExLjBwdDtmb250 LWZhbWlseToiQ2FsaWJyaSIsInNhbnMtc2VyaWYiOw0KY29sb3I6IzFGNDk3RCc+PG86cD4mbmJz cDs8L286cD48L3NwYW4+PC9wPg0KDQo8cCBjbGFzcz1Nc29Ob3JtYWw+PHNwYW4gc3R5bGU9J2Zv bnQtc2l6ZToxMS4wcHQ7Zm9udC1mYW1pbHk6IkNhbGlicmkiLCJzYW5zLXNlcmlmIjsNCmNvbG9y OiMxRjQ5N0QnPkkgZ2VuZXJhdGVkIHRoZSB0ZXh0IHdpdGggcHJlNTM3OFRydXN0MjAwOTAyIHNl dCBpbiB0aGUgaXByDQphdHRyaWJ1dGUgYW5kIGl0IGxvb2tzIHRvIGRvIHRoZSByaWdodCB0aGlu Zy4gQ2hlY2sgaW50ZXItbG9jYWxlIChpdOKAmXMgdXAgYWdhaW7igKYNCmRhcm5lZCBlbGVjdHJp YyBmb2xrcyBmaW5hbGx5IHJlc3RvcmVkIHRoZSBwb3dlcikgZm9yIGFueSBwcm9ibGVtOjxvOnA+ PC9vOnA+PC9zcGFuPjwvcD4NCg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9TXNvTm9ybWFsPjxzcGFuIHN0eWxlPSdmb250 LXNpemU6MTEuMHB0O2ZvbnQtZmFtaWx5OiJDYWxpYnJpIiwic2Fucy1zZXJpZiI7DQpjb2xvcjoj MUY0OTdEJz48bzpwPiZuYnNwOzwvbzpwPjwvc3Bhbj48L3A+DQoNCjxwIGNsYXNzPU1zb05vcm1h bD48c3BhbiBzdHlsZT0nZm9udC1zaXplOjExLjBwdDtmb250LWZhbWlseToiQ2FsaWJyaSIsInNh bnMtc2VyaWYiOw0KY29sb3I6IzFGNDk3RCc+wqAgaHR0cDovL3d3dy5pbnRlci1sb2NhbGUuY29t L0lEL2RyYWZ0LWlldGYtbHRydS00NjQ2YmlzLTIxLnR4dDxvOnA+PC9vOnA+PC9zcGFuPjwvcD4N Cg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9TXNvTm9ybWFsPjxzcGFuIHN0eWxlPSdmb250LXNpemU6MTEuMHB0O2ZvbnQt ZmFtaWx5OiJDYWxpYnJpIiwic2Fucy1zZXJpZiI7DQpjb2xvcjojMUY0OTdEJz48bzpwPiZuYnNw OzwvbzpwPjwvc3Bhbj48L3A+DQoNCjxwIGNsYXNzPU1zb05vcm1hbD48c3BhbiBzdHlsZT0nZm9u dC1zaXplOjExLjBwdDtmb250LWZhbWlseToiQ2FsaWJyaSIsInNhbnMtc2VyaWYiOw0KY29sb3I6 IzFGNDk3RCc+QWRkaXNvbjxvOnA+PC9vOnA+PC9zcGFuPjwvcD4NCg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9TXNvTm9y bWFsPjxzcGFuIHN0eWxlPSdmb250LXNpemU6MTEuMHB0O2ZvbnQtZmFtaWx5OiJDYWxpYnJpIiwi c2Fucy1zZXJpZiI7DQpjb2xvcjojMUY0OTdEJz48bzpwPiZuYnNwOzwvbzpwPjwvc3Bhbj48L3A+ DQoNCjxwIGNsYXNzPU1zb05vcm1hbD48c3BhbiBzdHlsZT0nZm9udC1zaXplOjkuMHB0O2ZvbnQt ZmFtaWx5OiJMdWNpZGEgU2FucyBVbmljb2RlIiwic2Fucy1zZXJpZiI7DQpjb2xvcjojMUY0OTdE Jz5BZGRpc29uIFBoaWxsaXBzPG86cD48L286cD48L3NwYW4+PC9wPg0KDQo8cCBjbGFzcz1Nc29O b3JtYWw+PHNwYW4gc3R5bGU9J2ZvbnQtc2l6ZTo5LjBwdDtmb250LWZhbWlseToiTHVjaWRhIFNh bnMgVW5pY29kZSIsInNhbnMtc2VyaWYiOw0KY29sb3I6IzFGNDk3RCc+R2xvYmFsaXphdGlvbiBB cmNoaXRlY3QgLS0gTGFiMTI2PC9zcGFuPjxzcGFuIHN0eWxlPSdmb250LXNpemU6DQo5LjBwdDtm b250LWZhbWlseToiTHVjaWRhIFNhbnMgVW5pY29kZSIsInNhbnMtc2VyaWYiO2NvbG9yOiMxRjQ5 N0QnPjxvOnA+PC9vOnA+PC9zcGFuPjwvcD4NCg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9TXNvTm9ybWFsPjxzcGFuIHN0 eWxlPSdmb250LXNpemU6OS4wcHQ7Zm9udC1mYW1pbHk6Ikx1Y2lkYSBTYW5zIFVuaWNvZGUiLCJz YW5zLXNlcmlmIjsNCmNvbG9yOiMxRjQ5N0QnPjxvOnA+Jm5ic3A7PC9vOnA+PC9zcGFuPjwvcD4N Cg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9TXNvTm9ybWFsPjxzcGFuIHN0eWxlPSdmb250LXNpemU6OS4wcHQ7Zm9udC1m YW1pbHk6Ikx1Y2lkYSBTYW5zIFVuaWNvZGUiLCJzYW5zLXNlcmlmIjsNCmNvbG9yOiMxRjQ5N0Qn PkludGVybmF0aW9uYWxpemF0aW9uIGlzIG5vdCBhIGZlYXR1cmUuPG86cD48L286cD48L3NwYW4+ PC9wPg0KDQo8cCBjbGFzcz1Nc29Ob3JtYWw+PHNwYW4gc3R5bGU9J2ZvbnQtc2l6ZTo5LjBwdDtm b250LWZhbWlseToiTHVjaWRhIFNhbnMgVW5pY29kZSIsInNhbnMtc2VyaWYiOw0KY29sb3I6IzFG NDk3RCc+SXQgaXMgYW4gYXJjaGl0ZWN0dXJlLjxvOnA+PC9vOnA+PC9zcGFuPjwvcD4NCg0KPHAg Y2xhc3M9TXNvTm9ybWFsPjxzcGFuIHN0eWxlPSdmb250LXNpemU6MTEuMHB0O2ZvbnQtZmFtaWx5 OiJDYWxpYnJpIiwic2Fucy1zZXJpZiI7DQpjb2xvcjojMUY0OTdEJz48bzpwPiZuYnNwOzwvbzpw Pjwvc3Bhbj48L3A+DQoNCjxkaXYgc3R5bGU9J2JvcmRlcjpub25lO2JvcmRlci1sZWZ0OnNvbGlk IGJsdWUgMS41cHQ7cGFkZGluZzowaW4gMGluIDBpbiA0LjBwdCc+DQoNCjxkaXY+DQoNCjxkaXYg c3R5bGU9J2JvcmRlcjpub25lO2JvcmRlci10b3A6c29saWQgI0I1QzRERiAxLjBwdDtwYWRkaW5n OjMuMHB0IDBpbiAwaW4gMGluJz4NCg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9TXNvTm9ybWFsPjxiPjxzcGFuIHN0eWxl PSdmb250LXNpemU6MTAuMHB0O2ZvbnQtZmFtaWx5OiJUYWhvbWEiLCJzYW5zLXNlcmlmIic+RnJv bTo8L3NwYW4+PC9iPjxzcGFuDQpzdHlsZT0nZm9udC1zaXplOjEwLjBwdDtmb250LWZhbWlseToi VGFob21hIiwic2Fucy1zZXJpZiInPg0KbHRydS1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYub3JnIFttYWlsdG86bHRy dS1ib3VuY2VzQGlldGYub3JnXSA8Yj5PbiBCZWhhbGYgT2YgPC9iPkdlcmFyZA0KTWVpanNzZW48 YnI+DQo8Yj5TZW50OjwvYj4gVHVlc2RheSwgRmVicnVhcnkgMjQsIDIwMDkgODowMSBQTTxicj4N CjxiPlRvOjwvYj4gUmFuZHkgUHJlc3Vobjxicj4NCjxiPkNjOjwvYj4gTFRSVSBXb3JraW5nIEdy b3VwPGJyPg0KPGI+U3ViamVjdDo8L2I+IFJlOiBbTHRydV0gRnc6IFt4bWwycmZjXSBTZXZlcmFs IHdheXMgeW91IGNhbiBwdWJsaXNoIEktRHMgd2l0aA0KcHJlIDUzNzggY29udGVudC0gVE9EQVk8 bzpwPjwvbzpwPjwvc3Bhbj48L3A+DQoNCjwvZGl2Pg0KDQo8L2Rpdj4NCg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9TXNv Tm9ybWFsPjxvOnA+Jm5ic3A7PC9vOnA+PC9wPg0KDQo8cCBjbGFzcz1Nc29Ob3JtYWwgc3R5bGU9 J21hcmdpbi1ib3R0b206MTIuMHB0Jz5Ib2ksPGJyPg0KVGhpcyBpcyBhIGJpdCB0b28gb2JzY3Vy ZSBmb3IgbWUuIENvdWxkIHlvdSBwbGVhc2UgZXhwbGFpbiA/PGJyPg0KVGhhbmtzLDxicj4NCiZu YnNwOyZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyZuYnNwOyBHZXJhcmQ8bzpwPjwvbzpwPjwvcD4NCg0KPGRp dj4NCg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9TXNvTm9ybWFsPjIwMDkvMi8yNSBSYW5keSBQcmVzdWhuICZsdDs8YQ0K aHJlZj0ibWFpbHRvOnJhbmR5X3ByZXN1aG5AbWluZHNwcmluZy5jb20iPnJhbmR5X3ByZXN1aG5A bWluZHNwcmluZy5jb208L2E+Jmd0OzxvOnA+PC9vOnA+PC9wPg0KDQo8cCBjbGFzcz1Nc29Ob3Jt YWw+SGkgLTxicj4NCjxicj4NCk1hcnNoYWxsIFJvc2UgcHJvdmlkZXMgc29tZSBoZWxwIG9uIHht bDJyZmM6PGJyPg0KPGJyPg0KJmd0OyBicmllZmx5LCB5b3Ugd2FudCB0byBzZXQgdGhlICdpcHIn IGF0dHJpYnV0ZSBvZiB0aGUgJmx0O3JmYy8mZ3Q7IGVsZW1lbnQNCnRvPGJyPg0KJmd0OyBvbmUg b2YgdGhlc2UgdmFsdWVzOjxicj4NCiZndDs8YnI+DQomZ3Q7ICZuYnNwO3RydXN0MjAwODExPGJy Pg0KJmd0OyAmbmJzcDtub01vZGlmaWNhdGlvblRydXN0MjAwODExPGJyPg0KJmd0OyAmbmJzcDtu b0Rlcml2YXRpdmVzVHJ1c3QyMDA4MTE8YnI+DQomZ3Q7ICZuYnNwO3RydXN0MjAwOTAyPGJyPg0K Jmd0OyAmbmJzcDtub01vZGlmaWNhdGlvblRydXN0MjAwOTAyPGJyPg0KJmd0OyAmbmJzcDtub0Rl cml2YXRpdmVzVHJ1c3QyMDA5MDI8YnI+DQomZ3Q7ICZuYnNwO3ByZTUzNzhUcnVzdDIwMDkwMjxi cj4NCiZndDs8YnI+DQomZ3Q7IHRoZSBmaW5hbCB2YWx1ZSBpbiB0aGUgbGlzdCBhYm92ZSBpcyBw cm9iYWJseSB0aGUgb25lIG9mIGludGVyZXN0IHRvPGJyPg0KJmd0OyBtb3N0IGZvbGtzLjxicj4N Cjxicj4NClJhbmR5PGJyPg0KPGJyPg0KX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX188YnI+DQpMdHJ1IG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdDxicj4NCjxhIGhyZWY9Im1haWx0 bzpMdHJ1QGlldGYub3JnIj5MdHJ1QGlldGYub3JnPC9hPjxicj4NCjxhIGhyZWY9Imh0dHBzOi8v d3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHRydSIgdGFyZ2V0PSJfYmxhbmsiPmh0dHBz Oi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHRydTwvYT48bzpwPjwvbzpwPjwvcD4N Cg0KPC9kaXY+DQoNCjxwIGNsYXNzPU1zb05vcm1hbD48bzpwPiZuYnNwOzwvbzpwPjwvcD4NCg0K PC9kaXY+DQoNCjwvZGl2Pg0KDQo8L2JvZHk+DQoNCjwvaHRtbD4NCg== --_000_4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DDAD19FEXSEA5Dantama_-- From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Tue Feb 24 20:31:12 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 753343A6AA0 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:31:12 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.413 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.413 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.186, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5SINRkFGm8HU for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:31:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 779563A6A79 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:31:11 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=fSsOEz1tlffySKI0n8kqahKuD0E6PcAO9AZY6oGhaGILSVPOjUv742dYQsBA0idI; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:References:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [64.105.35.110] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1LcBQf-0004CO-03 for ltru@ietf.org; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 23:31:29 -0500 Message-ID: <000901c99701$fdae7480$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: <002701c996fd$5261c040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <41a006820902242001n225736c9gc6b1cebf43ca95de@mail.gmail.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DDAD19F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:31:54 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f17314060116f3c241151f7284737f9cbe25350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 64.105.35.110 Subject: [Ltru] Please submit the 4646bis draft X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 04:31:12 -0000 Hi - > From: "Phillips, Addison" > To: "Gerard Meijssen" ; "Randy Presuhn" > Cc: "LTRU Working Group" > Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 8:06 PM > Subject: RE: [Ltru] Fw: [xml2rfc] Several ways you can publish I-Ds with pre5378 content- TODAY > > It has to do with how the editor’s generate the actual text from the source XML. > > Randy: > > I generated the text with pre5378Trust200902 set in the ipr attribute > and it looks to do the right thing. Check inter-locale (it’s up again… > darned electric folks finally restored the power) for any problem: > > http://www.inter-locale.com/ID/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt ... I looked at it quickly, and the IPR material up front seemed ok to me, so I ask you to please submit it as an internet-draft. After the i-d appears, there will be a very brief window for sanity checking. The only comments I will entertain are claims that a specific point of WG consensus is not reflected in the document, or something is hopelessly broken in a way that demonstrably impairs interoperability. The sanity check will end when Martin, as document shepherd, hands it to the IESG. Randy From addison@amazon.com Tue Feb 24 21:41:26 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A03183A6AC9 for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:41:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.572 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.572 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.027, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id uBrHkXMTYqyg for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:41:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-2101.amazon.com [72.21.196.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3E5DA3A698B for ; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:41:25 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,263,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="226586490" Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-2101.iad2.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 25 Feb 2009 05:41:35 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com [10.248.163.23]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1P5fXP4009729 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL); Wed, 25 Feb 2009 05:41:33 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.27]) by ex-hub-4102.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.23]) with mapi; Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:41:32 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: Randy Presuhn , LTRU Working Group Date: Tue, 24 Feb 2009 21:41:30 -0800 Thread-Topic: [Ltru] Please submit the 4646bis draft Thread-Index: AcmXAfDmrT4xgmc1Qim1kUQxHJUclQACbe8w Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DDAD1FA@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> References: <002701c996fd$5261c040$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> <41a006820902242001n225736c9gc6b1cebf43ca95de@mail.gmail.com> <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DDAD19F@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> <000901c99701$fdae7480$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> In-Reply-To: <000901c99701$fdae7480$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [Ltru] Please submit the 4646bis draft X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 05:41:26 -0000 SSB3aWxsIHVwZGF0ZSB0aGUgZGF0ZSwgcmVnZW5lcmF0ZSwgYW5kIHN1Ym1pdCBpdCBpbiB0aGUg bW9ybmluZy4NCg0KQWRkaXNvbg0KDQpBZGRpc29uIFBoaWxsaXBzDQpHbG9iYWxpemF0aW9uIEFy Y2hpdGVjdCAtLSBMYWIxMjYNCg0KSW50ZXJuYXRpb25hbGl6YXRpb24gaXMgbm90IGEgZmVhdHVy ZS4NCkl0IGlzIGFuIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZS4NCg0KPiAtLS0tLU9yaWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0t LQ0KPiBGcm9tOiBsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21haWx0bzpsdHJ1LWJvdW5jZXNAaWV0 Zi5vcmddIE9uDQo+IEJlaGFsZiBPZiBSYW5keSBQcmVzdWhuDQo+IFNlbnQ6IFR1ZXNkYXksIEZl YnJ1YXJ5IDI0LCAyMDA5IDg6MzIgUE0NCj4gVG86IExUUlUgV29ya2luZyBHcm91cA0KPiBTdWJq ZWN0OiBbTHRydV0gUGxlYXNlIHN1Ym1pdCB0aGUgNDY0NmJpcyBkcmFmdA0KPiANCj4gSGkgLQ0K PiANCj4gPiBGcm9tOiAiUGhpbGxpcHMsIEFkZGlzb24iIDxhZGRpc29uQGFtYXpvbi5jb20+DQo+ ID4gVG86ICJHZXJhcmQgTWVpanNzZW4iIDxHZXJhcmRNQHdpa3Rpb25hcnl6Lm9yZz47ICJSYW5k eSBQcmVzdWhuIg0KPiA8cmFuZHlfcHJlc3VobkBtaW5kc3ByaW5nLmNvbT4NCj4gPiBDYzogIkxU UlUgV29ya2luZyBHcm91cCIgPGx0cnVAaWV0Zi5vcmc+DQo+ID4gU2VudDogVHVlc2RheSwgRmVi cnVhcnkgMjQsIDIwMDkgODowNiBQTQ0KPiA+IFN1YmplY3Q6IFJFOiBbTHRydV0gRnc6IFt4bWwy cmZjXSBTZXZlcmFsIHdheXMgeW91IGNhbiBwdWJsaXNoIEktDQo+IERzIHdpdGggcHJlNTM3OCBj b250ZW50LSBUT0RBWQ0KPiA+DQo+ID4gSXQgaGFzIHRvIGRvIHdpdGggaG93IHRoZSBlZGl0b3Li gJlzIGdlbmVyYXRlIHRoZSBhY3R1YWwgdGV4dCBmcm9tDQo+IHRoZSBzb3VyY2UgWE1MLg0KPiA+ DQo+ID4gUmFuZHk6DQo+ID4NCj4gPiBJIGdlbmVyYXRlZCB0aGUgdGV4dCB3aXRoIHByZTUzNzhU cnVzdDIwMDkwMiBzZXQgaW4gdGhlIGlwcg0KPiBhdHRyaWJ1dGUNCj4gPiBhbmQgaXQgbG9va3Mg dG8gZG8gdGhlIHJpZ2h0IHRoaW5nLiBDaGVjayBpbnRlci1sb2NhbGUgKGl04oCZcyB1cA0KPiBh Z2FpbuKApg0KPiA+IGRhcm5lZCBlbGVjdHJpYyBmb2xrcyBmaW5hbGx5IHJlc3RvcmVkIHRoZSBw b3dlcikgZm9yIGFueSBwcm9ibGVtOg0KPiA+DQo+ID4gICBodHRwOi8vd3d3LmludGVyLWxvY2Fs ZS5jb20vSUQvZHJhZnQtaWV0Zi1sdHJ1LTQ2NDZiaXMtMjEudHh0DQo+IC4uLg0KPiANCj4gSSBs b29rZWQgYXQgaXQgcXVpY2tseSwgYW5kIHRoZSBJUFIgbWF0ZXJpYWwgdXAgZnJvbnQgc2VlbWVk IG9rIHRvDQo+IG1lLA0KPiBzbyBJIGFzayB5b3UgdG8gcGxlYXNlIHN1Ym1pdCBpdCBhcyBhbiBp bnRlcm5ldC1kcmFmdC4NCj4gDQo+IEFmdGVyIHRoZSBpLWQgYXBwZWFycywgdGhlcmUgd2lsbCBi ZSBhIHZlcnkgYnJpZWYgd2luZG93IGZvciBzYW5pdHkNCj4gY2hlY2tpbmcuICBUaGUgb25seSBj b21tZW50cyBJIHdpbGwgZW50ZXJ0YWluIGFyZSBjbGFpbXMgdGhhdCBhDQo+IHNwZWNpZmljDQo+ IHBvaW50IG9mIFdHIGNvbnNlbnN1cyBpcyBub3QgcmVmbGVjdGVkIGluIHRoZSBkb2N1bWVudCwg b3INCj4gc29tZXRoaW5nDQo+IGlzIGhvcGVsZXNzbHkgYnJva2VuIGluIGEgd2F5IHRoYXQgZGVt b25zdHJhYmx5IGltcGFpcnMNCj4gaW50ZXJvcGVyYWJpbGl0eS4NCj4gVGhlIHNhbml0eSBjaGVj ayB3aWxsIGVuZCB3aGVuIE1hcnRpbiwgYXMgZG9jdW1lbnQgc2hlcGhlcmQsIGhhbmRzDQo+IGl0 DQo+IHRvIHRoZSBJRVNHLg0KPiANCj4gUmFuZHkNCj4gDQo+IA0KPiBfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fXw0KPiBMdHJ1IG1haWxpbmcgbGlzdA0KPiBM dHJ1QGlldGYub3JnDQo+IGh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LmlldGYub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vbHRy dQ0K From root@core3.amsl.com Wed Feb 25 10:15:01 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@ietf.org Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id EE98C3A6B1D; Wed, 25 Feb 2009 10:15:01 -0800 (PST) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20090225181501.EE98C3A6B1D@core3.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 10:15:01 -0800 (PST) Cc: ltru@ietf.org Subject: [Ltru] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-10.txt X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 18:15:02 -0000 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Language Tag Registry Update Working Group of the IETF. Title : Update to the Language Subtag Registry Author(s) : D. Ewell Filename : draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-10.txt Pages : 950 Date : 2009-2-25 This memo defines the procedure used to update the IANA Language Subtag Registry in conjunction with the publication of RFC 4646bis [RFC EDITOR NOTE: replace with actual RFC number], for use in forming tags for identifying languages. As an Internet-Draft, it also contained a complete replacement of the contents of the Registry to be used by IANA in updating it. To prevent confusion, this material was removed before publication. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-10.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-ltru-4645bis-10.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2009-2-25101344.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart-- From addison@amazon.com Thu Feb 26 10:07:58 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4CD693A67B6 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:07:58 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -106.499 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-106.499 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.100, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id mXOp5UXgreDS for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:07:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com (smtp-fw-9101.amazon.com [207.171.184.25]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8B3BF3A67A7 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:07:57 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,272,1233532800"; d="scan'208";a="194078061" Received: from smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com ([10.140.9.24]) by smtp-border-fw-out-9101.sea19.amazon.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 26 Feb 2009 18:08:16 +0000 Received: from ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com (ex-hub-4104.sea5.amazon.com [10.248.163.25]) by smtp-in-1105.vdc.amazon.com (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id n1QI8Fgl028387 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5 bits=128 verify=FAIL) for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:08:16 GMT Received: from EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.27]) by ex-hub-4104.ant.amazon.com ([10.248.163.25]) with mapi; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:08:15 -0800 From: "Phillips, Addison" To: LTRU Working Group Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:08:13 -0800 Thread-Topic: status of draft-21 Thread-Index: AcmYPTCL7AZx1PT1Rp6smeyy0/Mg4Q== Message-ID: <4D25F22093241741BC1D0EEBC2DBB1DA019DEFCB24@EX-SEA5-D.ant.amazon.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: acceptlanguage: en-US Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: [Ltru] status of draft-21 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:07:58 -0000 QWxsLA0KDQpJIGp1c3Qgbm93IHN1Ym1pdHRlZCBEcmFmdC0yMSAoc2luY2UgbXkgbWFpbCBzZXJ2 ZXIgaXMgaGF2aW5nIGlzc3VlcywgSSBzdWJtaXR0ZWQgaXQgYXMgTWFyaykuIEFsYXMsIGZvciB0 aGUgZmlyc3QgdGltZSwgdGhlIHN1Ym1pc3Npb24gdG9vbCBoYXMgZmFpbGVkIHRvIHJlY29nbml6 ZSB0aGUgYXV0aG9yJ3MgaW5mbyBpbiB0aGUgZG9jdW1lbnQuIFRoZXJlZm9yZSB0aGUgc3VibWlz c2lvbiB3YXMgZG9uZSB1c2luZyB0aGUgIm1hbnVhbCIgcHJvY2Vzcy4gV2hlbiB0aGUgSS1EIGhh bmRsZXJzIGdldCB0byBpdCwgaXQgc2hvdWxkIGJlIHBvc3RlZC4NCg0KUmVnYXJkcywNCg0KQWRk aXNvbiAoZm9yIHRoZSBlZGl0b3JzKQ0KDQpBZGRpc29uIFBoaWxsaXBzDQpHbG9iYWxpemF0aW9u IEFyY2hpdGVjdCAtLSBMYWIxMjYNCg0KSW50ZXJuYXRpb25hbGl6YXRpb24gaXMgbm90IGEgZmVh dHVyZS4NCkl0IGlzIGFuIGFyY2hpdGVjdHVyZS4NCg0K From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Thu Feb 26 10:49:06 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 733DE3A6BBC for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:49:06 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.157 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.157 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.331, BAYES_05=-1.11, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Zc9KM3iuuihq for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:49:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-ew0-f177.google.com (mail-ew0-f177.google.com [209.85.219.177]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B67E3A6847 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:49:00 -0800 (PST) Received: by ewy25 with SMTP id 25so823176ewy.37 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:49:20 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; bh=oSh/CxcEyx53LtJ/n84Djxgwkab+ERwFijfI/T7ewIU=; b=aH/RiwZ0CDn7WUlX8njP3LX0qYhKo6p2sOUf6q4giyk3ainbN0KKkQ+r5RNjHSkb3r RBr1SLOauoZsXChBZEyc7sj0RqUSAZi8celJG9O14NciplzV90/j2XSsRTNbG1KblEGo dh37GaP5lRU1GFIeQtlJ+RU4CfI87Z1Mp8Bw4= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject :from:to:cc:content-type; b=epgqVtwkh563TwAaA0N8M49KMeNGt8ki+wV8DaL16gnIyGyURK9jxbENb/83rnyet4 FpFMPLDJsVzvsRpmXXH87fPlVwUtkV7HJvKR13s3pFgJ0nWEOXg/7fxmMeN3WxK8Eu1l sY2qhyeMkK2/NheD4JtmrMCAKKh5f4qRAwcyk= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Received: by 10.142.237.20 with SMTP id k20mr798352wfh.127.1235674159755; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:49:19 -0800 (PST) Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 10:49:17 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: a0efd6ad2ad35c0a Message-ID: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: LTRU Working Group Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd32e0a59b37f0463d6cf3e Cc: Markus Scherer Subject: [Ltru] FYI: validating X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 18:49:06 -0000 --000e0cd32e0a59b37f0463d6cf3e Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit For those interested in validation: We were looking at validation of 7,000 base language entries and Markus had an idea. Algorithmically map the two-letter codes onto values from 0..675, and the three letter codes onto 676..18251. These numbers can be put into a bit-string of ~2K bytes. That allows for fast validation with a small table. Registered codes would need an exception table. One could do the same for region codes, about a 750 byte table. Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach. Mark --000e0cd32e0a59b37f0463d6cf3e Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable For those interested in validation:

We were looking at validation of= 7,000 base language entries and Markus had an idea. Algorithmically map th= e two-letter codes onto values from 0..675, and the three letter codes onto= 676..18251. These numbers can be put into a bit-string of ~2K bytes. That = allows for fast validation with a small table. Registered codes would need = an exception table. One could do the same for region codes, about a 750 byt= e table.

Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach.

Mark
--000e0cd32e0a59b37f0463d6cf3e-- From cowan@ccil.org Thu Feb 26 11:53:43 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4577F28C123 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 11:53:43 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IljCN0xiJdGG for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 11:53:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from earth.ccil.org (earth.ccil.org [192.190.237.11]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1EA2A3A677C for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 11:53:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from cowan by earth.ccil.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1LcmJ0-00078m-Vv; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 14:54:03 -0500 Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 14:54:02 -0500 To: Mark Davis Message-ID: <20090226195402.GB4353@mercury.ccil.org> References: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) From: John Cowan Cc: Markus Scherer , LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] FYI: validating X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 19:53:43 -0000 Mark Davis scripsit: > Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach. It so happens that except for Teng/Tfng, the second letter of the script code is redundant, so you can special-case those two, remove the second letter, and use the same algorithm as for ISO 639-2. You could incorporate this rule into the ISO 15924/JAC's standing rules. -- You know, you haven't stopped talking John Cowan since I came here. You must have been http://www.ccil.org/~cowan vaccinated with a phonograph needle. cowan@ccil.org --Rufus T. Firefly From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Thu Feb 26 13:01:42 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 213603A69A2 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:01:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.967 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.967 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.009, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LHYiopQYG9wv for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:01:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.172]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49EE13A67A7 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:01:41 -0800 (PST) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so821555wfd.31 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:02:03 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=mqNUKkL42YFp0wItbhSazM8IQVg8C22SpEgLgvYTG9E=; b=dYCnKImrUcmS8w5ybOWhJ1Y33O9SHMSR74WNCGN2jJSU8ZgQBdJ6u03PlV3muheZ1C 9/2pAJuLqdBb8r0V7uc9V3k9fWNqehI26Uyfq1SVCAFagCh49lOxjdSv8skJRSF37W8H ts0fq6ZyXDpUm0+PCCiyIVRaRTXgj/+RBSOyM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=l9sXZT9SQaQVaEnMpT11uANHANYhJElQGF0tFFC6qwQgk5IBMNSVvV/cU1nuKLN0rr rb2EwGEZGW3o7UmYh/YDnIOdPPsFW+hCJf1NbR4nRSJHwO2rbQWBWl3w6gCsA6mSHm9E IV4d/pgf7fZiFdIbOqjHGVjmXHeY8aAtUJi0g= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Received: by 10.142.230.11 with SMTP id c11mr846474wfh.219.1235682123010; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:02:03 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> References: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:02:02 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 14073e0f7d36c41d Message-ID: <30b660a20902261302re6597dbx73e9b8ae2e4d7cfe@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: LTRU Working Group Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd2301aff51ad0463d8a9ff Cc: ICU Core Subject: Re: [Ltru] FYI: validating X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:01:42 -0000 --000e0cd2301aff51ad0463d8a9ff Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Doug pointed out a math error; that the second table is a bit over 200 bytes. Mark On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 10:49, Mark Davis wrote: > For those interested in validation: > > We were looking at validation of 7,000 base language entries and Markus had > an idea. Algorithmically map the two-letter codes onto values from 0..675, > and the three letter codes onto 676..18251. These numbers can be put into a > bit-string of ~2K bytes. That allows for fast validation with a small table. > Registered codes would need an exception table. One could do the same for > region codes, about a 750 byte table. > > Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach. > > > Mark > --000e0cd2301aff51ad0463d8a9ff Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Doug pointed out a math error; that the second table is a bit over 200 byte= s.

Mark


On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 10:49, Mark Davi= s <mark@macchiat= o.com> wrote:
For those interested in validation:

We were looking at validation of= 7,000 base language entries and Markus had an idea. Algorithmically map th= e two-letter codes onto values from 0..675, and the three letter codes onto= 676..18251. These numbers can be put into a bit-string of ~2K bytes. That = allows for fast validation with a small table. Registered codes would need = an exception table. One could do the same for region codes, about a 750 byt= e table.

Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach.


Mark

--000e0cd2301aff51ad0463d8a9ff-- From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Thu Feb 26 13:05:26 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A292928C2F3 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:05:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.135 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.135 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.841, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oQr0Sw3xIjee for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:05:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.171]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BA403A696B for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:05:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so823355wfd.31 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:05:47 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=o40TWyT+2ohxnUmXxZhOcVZqT9V+HDNpszuQiC2kzB0=; b=NqOC8AasUsaYcNFTyzgqWcYHRYAAhVE/n8eDH6iGrnCT+ZoXpfHEPDQHrbhBlF6hOo j2GjHvwfnGaT9lXZvQoYV+UbmdzwIH/G0UF/eaIu5SN9s31Al15Jqte7blyoXx5SNjT2 O9aznEZFWOA0AxGDK1ZiC8f2Hncyx4ZQvUtwU= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=qOiavfldbhhIx6IxXrRSgtKTJnofPIwZCwnnVULfeOYS+3N6FoHJgUNwNnpZ187iI/ WuUY45KZTMLVlJ1W0PhtK2P1h8PStPRpEbn0gK7tlkAfB5JbnF2+acypt6URX6hPNuLy pURm/y7BXEZAGf22c/8eNXP4nW4d8zcHVKloU= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Received: by 10.142.166.2 with SMTP id o2mr856298wfe.58.1235682347357; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:05:47 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <20090226195402.GB4353@mercury.ccil.org> References: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> <20090226195402.GB4353@mercury.ccil.org> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 13:05:47 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: aff34c7f99a9e51e Message-ID: <30b660a20902261305p7cdb37aejffb53a6b9a875d8e@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: John Cowan Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd32cf65e97210463d8b7e0 Cc: Markus Scherer , LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] FYI: validating X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:05:26 -0000 --000e0cd32cf65e97210463d8b7e0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Theoretically. However, the JAC would have to buy off on that... Given so few scripts, probably a hash table would be fine, or one could try a trie. Mark On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 11:54, John Cowan wrote: > Mark Davis scripsit: > > > Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach. > > It so happens that except for Teng/Tfng, the second letter of > the script code is redundant, so you can special-case those > two, remove the second letter, and use the same algorithm > as for ISO 639-2. > > You could incorporate this rule into the ISO 15924/JAC's > standing rules. > > -- > You know, you haven't stopped talking John Cowan > since I came here. You must have been http://www.ccil.org/~cowan > vaccinated with a phonograph needle. cowan@ccil.org > --Rufus T. Firefly > --000e0cd32cf65e97210463d8b7e0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Theoretically. However, the JAC would have to buy off on that...

Giv= en so few scripts, probably a hash table would be fine, or one could try a = trie.

Mark


On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 11:54, John Cowa= n <cowan@ccil.org> wrote:
Mark Davis scripsit:

> Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach.

It so happens that except for Teng/Tfng, the second letter of
the script code is redundant, so you can special-case those
two, remove the second letter, and use the same algorithm
as for ISO 639-2.

You could incorporate this rule into the ISO 15924/JAC's
standing rules.

--
You know, you haven't stopped talking =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0 John Cowan
since I came here. You must have been =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 http://www.ccil.or= g/~cowan
vaccinated with a phonograph needle. =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2= =A0cowan@ccil.org
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0--Rufus T. Firefly

--000e0cd32cf65e97210463d8b7e0-- From duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp Thu Feb 26 19:52:38 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 732E428C2C0 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 19:52:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.49 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.49 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=1.000, BAYES_00=-2.599, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id cgWQkrSreJZd for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 19:52:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.251.195]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 697B428C286 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 19:52:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (scmse2 [133.2.253.17]) by scmailgw2.scop.aoyama.ac.jp (secret/secret) with SMTP id n1R3quuY001953 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 12:52:56 +0900 (JST) Received: from (unknown [133.2.206.133]) by scmse2.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 0ed2_1e251442_0482_11de_a701_0019b9e2b3d9; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 12:52:56 +0900 Received: from Tanzawa.it.aoyama.ac.jp ([133.2.210.1]:34876) by itmail.it.aoyama.ac.jp with [XMail 1.22 ESMTP Server] id for from ; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 12:44:30 +0900 Message-Id: <6.0.0.20.2.20090227114547.08cfe0d0@localhost> X-Sender: duerst@localhost X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Version 6J Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 11:46:14 +0900 To: Mark Davis , John Cowan From: Martin Duerst In-Reply-To: <30b660a20902261305p7cdb37aejffb53a6b9a875d8e@mail.gmail.co m> References: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> <20090226195402.GB4353@mercury.ccil.org> <30b660a20902261305p7cdb37aejffb53a6b9a875d8e@mail.gmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-2022-JP" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: Markus Scherer , LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] FYI: validating X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 03:52:38 -0000 At 06:05 09/02/27, Mark Davis wrote: >Theoretically. However, the JAC would have to buy off on that... > >Given so few scripts, probably a hash table would be fine, or one could try a trie. My guess would be that perfect hashing would be perfect for script codes :-). Regards, Martin. >Mark > > >On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 11:54, John Cowan <cowan@ccil.org> wrote: >>Mark Davis scripsit: >> >>> Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach. >> >>It so happens that except for Teng/Tfng, the second letter of >>the script code is redundant, so you can special-case those >>two, remove the second letter, and use the same algorithm >>as for ISO 639-2. >> >>You could incorporate this rule into the ISO 15924/JAC's >>standing rules. >> >>-- >>You know, you haven't stopped talking $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B John Cowan >>since I came here. You must have been $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B http://www.ccil.org/~cowan >>vaccinated with a phonograph needle. $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B cowan@ccil.org >>$B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B $B%D(B --Rufus T. Firefly > >_______________________________________________ >Ltru mailing list >Ltru@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru #-#-# Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University #-#-# http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp From mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Thu Feb 26 20:48:09 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 778993A6936 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:48:09 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.955 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.955 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.421, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, GB_I_LETTER=-2, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, J_CHICKENPOX_23=0.6] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 42kRC7ZmnRWl for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:48:08 -0800 (PST) Received: from wf-out-1314.google.com (wf-out-1314.google.com [209.85.200.169]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0A3593A67FF for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:48:07 -0800 (PST) Received: by wf-out-1314.google.com with SMTP id 27so1029595wfd.31 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:48:29 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:mime-version:sender:received:in-reply-to :references:date:x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc :content-type; bh=UE04DaFFtQDRJ1nbntNXcEAAPC1lk6Z0pSgrmUV258M=; b=om4Uy+YE9jMRm8NIY51Q+a1RNKsoL9538maFGWrVKrTIBY7BYVcm/xWHg91I+j3V8Q duqvIOQiQBrS1aeDinsE+aiOCajrmzS42iM1B9VdN/hDCqWi6uulHYR5JjyRSkdPfeH8 ENmc7SCmZ+Kg6HjPWQ/tf1vBwtKwCkDG4upTk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=mime-version:sender:in-reply-to:references:date :x-google-sender-auth:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:content-type; b=NeRGIAKmz+xXx6qMyixw2tgblfXx15jyeRTacS/cuXtVP9lBourva0V87ttEtM0KLj i6vszyEfGauBkOmKS9h1NoznnMsOyYEIr0ymdBi3glLWHhctuW9RDOn9BjXcps/aMmAb hTJBvZ8lnevyyEcijlYlzPbDbFUMiuFIpXcWo= MIME-Version: 1.0 Sender: mark.edward.davis@gmail.com Received: by 10.142.11.20 with SMTP id 20mr1066743wfk.62.1235710109828; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:48:29 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.20.2.20090227114547.08cfe0d0@localhost> References: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> <20090226195402.GB4353@mercury.ccil.org> <30b660a20902261305p7cdb37aejffb53a6b9a875d8e@mail.gmail.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090227114547.08cfe0d0@localhost> Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 20:48:29 -0800 X-Google-Sender-Auth: 9b7c853ef3b27aef Message-ID: <30b660a20902262048m72c6e2b7n86a367e57d304782@mail.gmail.com> From: Mark Davis To: Martin Duerst Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=000e0cd177ce24463a0463df2e44 Cc: Markus Scherer , LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] FYI: validating X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 04:48:09 -0000 --000e0cd177ce24463a0463df2e44 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Perfect hashing is not necessarily perfect (same with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuckoo_hashing). The extra complications of th= e hashing function cost something. Depending on size and behavior, it may or may not be better than a simple hash table. Mark On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 18:46, Martin Duerst wrote= : > At 06:05 09/02/27, Mark Davis wrote: > >Theoretically. However, the JAC would have to buy off on that... > > > >Given so few scripts, probably a hash table would be fine, or one could > try a trie. > > My guess would be that perfect hashing would be perfect for > script codes :-). > > Regards, Martin. > > > > >Mark > > > > > >On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 11:54, John Cowan < > cowan@ccil.org> wrote: > >>Mark Davis scripsit: > >> > >>> Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach. > >> > >>It so happens that except for Teng/Tfng, the second letter of > >>the script code is redundant, so you can special-case those > >>two, remove the second letter, and use the same algorithm > >>as for ISO 639-2. > >> > >>You could incorporate this rule into the ISO 15924/JAC's > >>standing rules. > >> > >>-- > >>You know, you haven't stopped talking =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 = =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 John Cowan > >>since I came here. You must have been =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 = =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 < > http://www.ccil.org/%7Ecowan>http://www.ccil.org/~cowan > >>vaccinated with a phonograph needle. =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 = =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 cowan@ccil.org>cowan@ccil.org > >>=E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 =E3=83=84 --Rufus T. Firefly > > > >_______________________________________________ > >Ltru mailing list > >Ltru@ietf.org > >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru > > > #-#-# Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin University > #-#-# http://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp > > --000e0cd177ce24463a0463df2e44 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Perfect hashing is not necessarily perfect (same with http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuckoo_hash= ing). The extra complications of the hashing function cost something. D= epending on size and behavior, it may or may not be better than a simple ha= sh table.

Mark


On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 18:46, Martin Du= erst <duerst= @it.aoyama.ac.jp> wrote:
At 06:05 09/02/27, Mark Davis wrote:
>Theoretically. However, the JAC would have to buy off on that...
>
>Given so few scripts, probably a hash table would be fine, or one could= try a trie.

My guess would be that perfect hashing would be perfect for
script codes :-).

Regards, =C2=A0 =C2=A0Martin.



>Mark
>
>
>On Thu, Feb 26, 2009 at 11:54, John Cowan <<mailto:cowan@ccil.org>cowan@ccil.org> wrote:
>>Mark Davis scripsit:
>>
>>> Script codes don't lend themselves to the same approach. >>
>>It so happens that except for Teng/Tfng, the second letter of
>>the script code is redundant, so you can special-case those
>>two, remove the second letter, and use the same algorithm
>>as for ISO 639-2.
>>
>>You could incorporate this rule into the ISO 15924/JAC's
>>standing rules.
>>
>>--
>>You know, you haven't stopped talking =E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3= =83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0John Cowan
>>since I came here. You must have been =E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2= =A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0<http://www.ccil.org/%7Ecowan>= http://www.ccil.= org/~cowan
>>vaccinated with a phonograph needle. =E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2= =A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 <mailto:cowan@ccil.org>cowan@ccil.org
>>=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 =C2=A0=E3=83=84 --Rufus T= . Firefly
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ltru mailing list
>Ltru@ietf.org
>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ltru


#-#-# =C2=A0Martin J. Du"rst, Assoc. Professor, Aoyama Gakuin Universi= ty
#-#-# =C2=A0htt= p://www.sw.it.aoyama.ac.jp =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 mailto:duerst@it.aoyama.ac.jp


--000e0cd177ce24463a0463df2e44-- From cowan@ccil.org Thu Feb 26 21:09:34 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80D9928C300 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:09:34 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.000, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZbFk7og3Pfha for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:09:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from earth.ccil.org (earth.ccil.org [192.190.237.11]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C05BF3A6823 for ; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:09:33 -0800 (PST) Received: from cowan by earth.ccil.org with local (Exim 4.63) (envelope-from ) id 1Lcuyp-0001XS-5A; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 00:09:47 -0500 Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 00:09:47 -0500 To: Martin Duerst Message-ID: <20090227050947.GF17782@mercury.ccil.org> References: <30b660a20902261049q2c6f3dcdi2ae30e578437c15c@mail.gmail.com> <20090226195402.GB4353@mercury.ccil.org> <30b660a20902261305p7cdb37aejffb53a6b9a875d8e@mail.gmail.com> <6.0.0.20.2.20090227114547.08cfe0d0@localhost> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <6.0.0.20.2.20090227114547.08cfe0d0@localhost> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.13 (2006-08-11) From: John Cowan Cc: Markus Scherer , LTRU Working Group Subject: Re: [Ltru] FYI: validating X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 05:09:34 -0000 Martin Duerst scripsit: > My guess would be that perfect hashing would be perfect for > script codes :-). That's what I thought too, but when I ran gperf, it insists on keeping the full unpacked table around as well, because even a perfect hash table may be passed a string that hashes to the same thing as one of the existing strongs, so you have to check against the source strings. positive. -- Only do what only you can do. John Cowan --Edsger W. Dijkstra's advice to a student in search of a thesis From randy_presuhn@mindspring.com Thu Feb 26 21:18:20 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7116E28C2F5; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:18:20 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.351 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.351 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.248, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kmLSMd7D5OcI; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:18:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net (elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net [209.86.89.65]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8A7BF28C2C3; Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:18:19 -0800 (PST) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=dk20050327; d=mindspring.com; b=doWwwWKnGGPPBsZ/yo0w4QzI1s2CfkokN0iOZ6XK2EbCC55o1AytrpIutE2Tg2Vq; h=Received:Message-ID:From:To:Subject:Date:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:X-Priority:X-MSMail-Priority:X-Mailer:X-MimeOLE:X-ELNK-Trace:X-Originating-IP; Received: from [68.166.37.212] (helo=oemcomputer) by elasmtp-kukur.atl.sa.earthlink.net with esmtpa (Exim 4.67) (envelope-from ) id 1Lcv7R-00038z-9A; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 00:18:41 -0500 Message-ID: <004b01c9989a$eca6a6e0$6801a8c0@oemcomputer> From: "Randy Presuhn" To: "Disman" , "LTRU Working Group" , Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2009 21:12:43 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2800.1478 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2800.1478 X-ELNK-Trace: 4488c18417c9426da92b9037bc8bcf44d4c20f6b8d69d8886924630f8852f173eb54700b99a5ac1ba947868cd632f687350badd9bab72f9c350badd9bab72f9c X-Originating-IP: 68.166.37.212 Subject: [Ltru] Fw: Initial Version I-D Submission Deadline Extended to March 4, 2009 X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 05:18:20 -0000 Hi - fwd fyi. Randy ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alexa Morris" > To: ; ; > Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2009 11:27 AM > Subject: Initial Version I-D Submission Deadline Extended to March 4, 2009 > > The IESG has extended the deadline for initial version (00) > submissions of Internet Drafts by 2 days (48 hours). The new deadline > is March 4, 2009 at 1700 Pacific (March 5, 2009 at 0100 UTC / GMT) > and the extension is for IETF 74 only. The deadline has been extended > due to the copyright legend text alternative being recently finalized, > approved and implemented. > > Please note that the date for updated I-D versions has NOT been > extended, and is still March 9, 2009. > > Regards, > Alexa > > ----------- > Alexa Morris / Executive Director / IETF > 48377 Fremont Blvd., Suite 117, Fremont, CA 94538 > Phone: +1.510.492.4089 / Fax: +1.510.492.4001 > Email: amorris@amsl.com > > Managed by Association Management Solutions (AMS) > Forum Management, Meeting and Event Planning > www.amsl.com > > _______________________________________________ > Ietf mailing list > Ietf@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf From doug@ewellic.org Fri Feb 27 05:44:49 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A16FA3A67D7 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 05:44:49 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.739 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.739 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_20=-0.74, GB_I_LETTER=-2, STOX_REPLY_TYPE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VbNoydBKTUws for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 05:44:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net [64.202.165.38]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 6F2CB3A67A4 for ; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 05:44:48 -0800 (PST) Received: (qmail 3500 invoked from network); 27 Feb 2009 13:45:10 -0000 Received: from unknown (24.8.48.189) by smtpauth21.prod.mesa1.secureserver.net (64.202.165.38) with ESMTP; 27 Feb 2009 13:45:10 -0000 Message-ID: <6BE3EC7BA0D64782B9FF4876BD7B7930@DGBP7M81> From: "Doug Ewell" To: "LTRU Working Group" References: Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 06:38:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="utf-8"; reply-type=original Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.5512 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 Subject: Re: [Ltru] FYI: validating X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 13:44:49 -0000 Mark Davis replied to John Cowan: >> It so happens that except for Teng/Tfng, the second letter of the >> script code is redundant, so you can special-case those two, remove >> the second letter, and use the same algorithm as for ISO 639-2. >> >> You could incorporate this rule into the ISO 15924/JAC's standing >> rules. > > Theoretically. However, the JAC would have to buy off on that... We are talking about optimizing a search for 130 region subtags, soon to be 133. This could be done by simply concatenating the subtags alphabetically into a 520- or 532-character string, and binary-searching it in chunks of 4. Asking the JAC to restrict code assignment to cater to a particular programming scenario, when ISO 15924 already provides numeric code elements, seems like a non-starter to me. -- Doug Ewell * Thornton, Colorado, USA * RFC 4645 * UTN #14 http://www.ewellic.org http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages ˆ From root@core3.amsl.com Fri Feb 27 10:30:02 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ltru@ietf.org Delivered-To: ltru@core3.amsl.com Received: by core3.amsl.com (Postfix, from userid 0) id 017CD28C15A; Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:30:01 -0800 (PST) From: Internet-Drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org Content-Type: Multipart/Mixed; Boundary="NextPart" Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-Id: <20090227183002.017CD28C15A@core3.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 10:30:02 -0800 (PST) Cc: ltru@ietf.org Subject: [Ltru] I-D ACTION:draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt X-BeenThere: ltru@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: Language Tag Registry Update working group discussion list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Feb 2009 18:30:02 -0000 --NextPart A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Language Tag Registry Update Working Group of the IETF. Title : Tags for Identifying Languages Author(s) : A. Phillips, M. Davis Filename : draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt Pages : 88 Date : 2009-2-27 This document describes the structure, content, construction, and semantics of language tags for use in cases where it is desirable to indicate the language used in an information object. It also describes how to register values for use in language tags and the creation of user-defined extensions for private interchange. A URL for this Internet-Draft is: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ Below is the data which will enable a MIME compliant mail reader implementation to automatically retrieve the ASCII version of the Internet-Draft. --NextPart Content-Type: Message/External-body; name="draft-ietf-ltru-4646bis-21.txt"; site="ftp.ietf.org"; access-type="anon-ftp"; directory="internet-drafts" Content-Type: text/plain Content-ID: <2009-2-27102827.I-D@ietf.org> --NextPart--