Subject: [netmod] draft netmod charter update proposal

From: Kent Watsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Thu, 23 Feb 2017 00:25:13 +0000

Hi NETMOD WG,

Please find below the draft charter update which we provided to
our AD for review.  Comments are welcomed.  Authors, please note
the milestone dates.

Kent (and Lou)

Network Modeling (NETMOD)  
-------------------------

Charter

Current Status: Active

Chairs:
   Lou Berger <[email-masked]>
   Kent Watsen <[email-masked]>

Operations and Management Area Directors:
   Benoit Claise <[email-masked]>
   Joel Jaeggli <[email-masked]>

Operations and Management Area Advisor:
   Benoit Claise <[email-masked]>

Secretary:
   Zitao (Michael) Wang <[email-masked]>

Mailing Lists:
   General Discussion: [email-masked]
   To Subscribe:       https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
   Archive:            https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/netmod/

Description of Working Group:

   The Network Modeling (NETMOD) working group is responsible for the YANG
   data modeling language, and guidelines for developing YANG models.  The
   NETMOD working group addresses general topics related to the use of the
   YANG language and YANG models, for example, the mapping of YANG modeled
   data into various encodings.  Finally, the NETMOD working group also
   defines core YANG models used as basic YANG building blocks, and YANG
   models that do not otherwise fall under the charter of any other IETF
   working group.
  
The NETMOD WG is responsible for:

   a) Maintaining the data modeling language YANG.  This effort entails
      periodically updating the specification to address new requirements
      as they arise.

   b) Maintaining the guidelines for developing YANG models.  This effort
      is primarily driven by updates made to the YANG specification.

   c) Maintaining a conceptual framework in which YANG models are used.
      This effort entails describing the context that network management
      protocols (e.g., NETCONF, RESTCONF, CoAP, etc.) operate in, and
      how certain YANG statements interact in that context.

   d) Maintaining encodings for YANG modeled data.  This effort entails
      updating encodings already defined by the NETMOD working (XML and
      JSON) to accommodate changes to the YANG specification, and defining
      new encodings that are needed and yet do not fall under the charter
      of any other active IETF working group.

   e) Maintaining YANG models used as basic YANG building blocks.  This
      effort entails updating existing YANG models (ietf-yang-types and
      ietf-inet-types) as needed, as well as defining additional core YANG
      data models when necessary.

   f) Defining and maintaining YANG models that do not fall under the
      charter of any other active IETF working group.

   The NETMOD working group consults with the NETCONF working group to
   ensure that new requirements are and understood and can be met by
   the protocols developed within that working group (e.g., NETCONF
   and RESTCONF).  The NETMOD working group coordinates with other
   working groups on possible extensions to YANG to address new modeling
   requirements and, when needed, which group will run the process on a
   specific model.

   The NETMOD working group does not serve as a review team for YANG
   modules developed by other working groups. Instead, the YANG doctors,
   as organized by the OPS area director responsible for network
   management, will act as advisors for other working groups and provide
   YANG reviews for the OPS area directors.

Milestones:
  
   Done     - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-rfc6087bis to IESG for publication
   Mar 2016 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-yang-model-classification to IESG
              for publication
   Mar 2016 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-syslog-model to IESG for publication
   Mar 2016 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-acl-model to IESG for publication
   Mar 2017 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-entity to IESG for publication
   Oct 2017 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-intf-ext-yang to IESG for
              publication
   Oct 2017 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-schema-mount to IESG for publication
   Oct 2017 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-revised-datastores to IESG for
              publication
   Dec 2017 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-sub-intf-vlan-yang to IESG for
              publication

---

From: Robert Wilton <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2017 17:53:29 +0000

Hi Kent, Lou,

I think that it might possibly be a good idea to please align the 
timelines for:

   draft-ietf-netmod-intf-ext-yang
   draft-ietf-netmod-sub-intf-vlan-yang

because I think that it will be somewhat helpful to review both 
documents together.

Also, I just wanted to confirm that the datastore work is covered by 
this text:

Thanks,
Rob

On 23/02/2017 00:25, Kent Watsen wrote:
> _______________________________________________
> netmod mailing list
> [email-masked]
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/netmod
> .
>

---

From: Kent Watsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2017 20:31:04 +0000

Hi Rob,

> because I think that it will be somewhat helpful to review both 

Can you provide dates you think we can commit to?

>       how certain YANG statements interact in that context.

Yes indeed, or at least, that was the intention.  Here "conceptual framework"
and "context" are meant to be more all-encompassing than just the datastores
effort.  Makes sense, or needs clarification?

Thanks,
Kent // co-chair

---

From: "Mehmet Ersue" <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2017 21:37:25 +0100

Hi Kent, Lou,

>      how certain YANG statements interact in that context.

The point above sounds a bit vague and can be interpreted wrongly.
What exactly is meant by "the context that network management protocols
operate in"?

Actually since 2002, NETCONF WG is responsible to specify the configuration
protocols and the context and framework where they operate in.
I assume you rather mean bringing YANG and the protocols using it into
relation or showing how YANG is used together with a protocol, or?
To make it more clear please elaborate what exactly is in-scope and what is
out-of-scope.

We were discussing to specify the YANG language as generic as possible to be
used by many protocols and with this to remove NETCONF specific details.
If this is still the aim, we should add a statement on this.

I have to admit I found the old charter format, where current and planned WG
items are described, as very purposeful.
IOW I am missing a short target description of WG items and how they map to
the high-level descriptions in a)-f).
The draft titles in Milestones are unfortunately not very descriptive.

Thank you for your efforts,
Mehmet

> -----Original Message-----
> From: netmod [mailto:[email-masked]] On Behalf Of Kent Watsen
> Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2017 1:25 AM
> To: [email-masked]
> Cc: [email-masked]
> Subject: [netmod] draft netmod charter update proposal
> 
> 
> Hi NETMOD WG,
> 
> Please find below the draft charter update which we provided to our AD for
> review.  Comments are welcomed.  Authors, please note the milestone
> dates.
> 
> Kent (and Lou)
> 
> 
> 
>

---

From: Lou Berger <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2017 16:41:52 -0500

Hi Rob,

> effort.  Makes sense, or needs clarification?

Does this help?

  c) Maintaining a conceptual framework in which YANG models are
     used.  This effort entails describing the generic context in
     which YANG exists and how certain YANG statements interact in
     that context. An example of this is YANG's relationship with
     datastores.

Lou

---

From: Kent Watsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Mon, 27 Feb 2017 21:59:41 +0000

> What exactly is meant by "the context that network management protocols

Let's continue this discussion on the other thread with Rob Wilton.

> To make it more clear please elaborate what exactly is in-scope and 
> what is out-of-scope.

I think that the scope is covered in the other thread.

> We were discussing to specify the YANG language as generic as possible 
> to be used by many protocols and with this to remove NETCONF specific 
> details.  If this is still the aim, we should add a statement on this.

Correct, we’re trying to decouple NETMOD from this, which entails, in 
part, factoring-out some protocol specifics while factoring-in the
context that YANG expects to be used in.

Kent

---

From: Ladislav Lhotka <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2017 13:57:14 +0100

Hi,

the term "encoding" is somewhat misleading because in other contexts it
is used in the sense of a serialization format (e.g. character encoding)
whereas in our case XML, JSON, CBOR etc. each carry slightly different
information.

Even though some NETMOD RFCs have already used "encoding", I would
suggest to break with this tradition and use "representation"
instead. The latter term is already well established in HTTP/REST and
its meaning perfectly fits our purposes:

https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7231#section-3

Lada

-- 
Ladislav Lhotka, CZ.NIC Labs
PGP Key ID: 0xB8F92B08A9F76C67

---

From: Robert Wilton <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2017 16:08:10 +0000

>       that context. An example of this is YANG's relationship with
Yes, I think that this text is better.

Thanks,
Rob

---

From: Robert Wilton <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2017 16:21:50 +0000

> Can you provide dates you think we can commit to?
Please can you align them both to the Dec '17 date.

That would also give a clear run for schema mount and revised datastores 
in Oct '17.

Thanks,
Rob

---

From: Kent Watsen <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 28 Feb 2017 23:41:35 +0000

Hi NETMOD WG,

Please find below draft-2 having the following changes:
 - clarified responsibility 'c'
 - s/encoding/representation/g
 - moved intf-ext-yang from Oct to Dec

Any other comments?

Kent

Charter

Current Status: Active

Chairs:

Secretary:

Mailing Lists:

   The Network Modeling (NETMOD) working group is responsible for the YANG
   data modeling language, and guidelines for developing YANG models.  The
   NETMOD working group addresses general topics related to the use of the
   YANG language and YANG models, for example, the mapping of YANG modeled
   data into various representations.  Finally, the NETMOD working group 
   also defines core YANG models used as basic YANG building blocks, and 
   YANG models that do not otherwise fall under the charter of any other 
   IETF working group.

   c) Maintaining a conceptual framework in which YANG models are used.
      This effort entails describing the generic context that in YANG
      exists and how certain YANG statements interact in that context.
      An example of this is YANG's relationship with datastores.

   d) Maintaining representations for YANG modeled data.  This effort 
      entails updating representations already defined by the NETMOD 
      working (XML and JSON) to accommodate changes to the YANG 
      specification, and defining new representations that are needed,
      and yet do not fall under the charter of any other active IETF
      working group.

Milestones:
  
   Dec 2017 - Submit draft-ietf-netmod-intf-ext-yang to IESG for