From dromasca@avaya.com Tue Mar 3 05:55:27 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DA9073A6C54 for ; Tue, 3 Mar 2009 05:55:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.505 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.505 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.094, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 75OBa38ZjgeC for ; Tue, 3 Mar 2009 05:55:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com (co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com [198.152.13.100]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1A2953A69EB for ; Tue, 3 Mar 2009 05:55:27 -0800 (PST) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,296,1233550800"; d="scan'208";a="163355535" Received: from unknown (HELO co300216-co-erhwest.avaya.com) ([198.152.7.5]) by co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com with ESMTP; 03 Mar 2009 08:55:53 -0500 Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.14]) by co300216-co-erhwest-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 03 Mar 2009 08:55:53 -0500 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 14:55:37 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: OPS Area Office Hours Thread-Index: AcmcB7rUVqh8RVsZTuiYwRSMyb4KnQ== From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: "ops-area (IETF)" Subject: [OPS-AREA] OPS Area Office Hours X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 13:55:27 -0000 We plan for our traditional OPS Area open office hours at IETF-74 for Wednesday 3/25, 13:00-15:00 in the TBD IESG breakout room. This is subject to change, as the whole schedule is still preliminary.=20 Dan and Ron From dromasca@avaya.com Mon Mar 16 07:56:00 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 700C73A688C for ; Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:56:00 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.527 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.527 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.072, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id aOqe1bYwNd-q for ; Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:55:59 -0700 (PDT) Received: from de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com (de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com [198.152.71.100]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 56B883A6883 for ; Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:55:59 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,373,1233550800"; d="scan'208";a="140366268" Received: from unknown (HELO co300216-co-erhwest.avaya.com) ([198.152.7.5]) by de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com with ESMTP; 16 Mar 2009 10:56:39 -0400 Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.12]) by co300216-co-erhwest-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 16 Mar 2009 10:56:38 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 15:56:35 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Updated agenda for the OPSAREA open meeting at IETF-74 Thread-Index: AcmmR2bCmro27b+lSPeWk1MYZCufDA== From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: "ops-area (IETF)" Subject: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA open meeting at IETF-74 X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 14:56:00 -0000 An updated agenda for the meeting is available at=20 http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/09mar/agenda/opsarea.txt Dan From dromasca@avaya.com Wed Mar 18 05:38:06 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 496653A6A78 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 05:38:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.528 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.528 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.071, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id GTNmde89Cs0t for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 05:38:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com (co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com [198.152.13.100]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 74E3E3A6A86 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 05:38:05 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,384,1233550800"; d="scan'208";a="165059065" Received: from unknown (HELO co300216-co-erhwest.avaya.com) ([198.152.7.5]) by co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com with ESMTP; 18 Mar 2009 08:38:49 -0400 Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.12]) by co300216-co-erhwest-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 18 Mar 2009 08:38:48 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 13:38:16 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting Thread-Index: Acmnxmj1AtLB9Pg4QJi+CCyjHMUpNQ== From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: "ops-area (IETF)" Subject: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 12:38:06 -0000 An updated agenda for the Monday OPSAREA meeting is available at http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/09mar/agenda/opsarea.txt Dan From ietfdbh@comcast.net Wed Mar 18 07:06:39 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DFFE728C168 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:06:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.5 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.5 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.099, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZS+bn3ggsP3e for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:06:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from QMTA07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net (qmta07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.64]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D44463A687C for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:06:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from OMTA06.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.62.51]) by QMTA07.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id Ua5t1b00D16LCl057e7PjV; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:07:24 +0000 Received: from Harrington73653 ([24.147.240.21]) by OMTA06.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net with comcast id Ue7M1b00Q0UQ6dC3Se7PBZ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:07:23 +0000 From: "David Harrington" To: "'Romascanu, Dan \(Dan\)'" , "'ops-area \(IETF\)'" References: Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:07:20 -0400 Message-ID: <022f01c9a7d2$dbb039e0$0600a8c0@china.huawei.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-reply-to: X-MIMEOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.3198 Thread-index: Acmnxmj1AtLB9Pg4QJi+CCyjHMUpNQAByFqg Subject: Re: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:06:40 -0000 Hi, This proposal does not seem to be OPS-area specific. Wouldn't the discussion of using double NATs for IPv4 address sharing be better done in the "Sharing of an IPv4 Address BOF" (SHARA BOF)? or the IPv6 Address Independence BOF? or the BEHAVE WG or SOFTWIRE WG? or the INTAREA meeting (where it is on the agenda already) These proposals seem much more oriented to INT or TSV areas than OPS. Why is this an OPS-area discussion? dbh > -----Original Message----- > From: ops-area-bounces@ietf.org > [mailto:ops-area-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Romascanu, Dan (Dan) > Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 8:38 AM > To: ops-area (IETF) > Subject: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting > > An updated agenda for the Monday OPSAREA meeting is available at > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/09mar/agenda/opsarea.txt > > Dan > _______________________________________________ > OPS-AREA mailing list > OPS-AREA@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ops-area > From dromasca@avaya.com Wed Mar 18 07:38:11 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D451A28C0E6 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:38:11 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.529 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.529 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.070, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G5vw1fdH3jJg for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:38:11 -0700 (PDT) Received: from de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com (de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com [198.152.71.100]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFFD728C15F for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:37:53 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,384,1233550800"; d="scan'208";a="140615668" Received: from unknown (HELO co300216-co-erhwest.avaya.com) ([198.152.7.5]) by de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com with ESMTP; 18 Mar 2009 10:38:36 -0400 Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.12]) by co300216-co-erhwest-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 18 Mar 2009 10:38:34 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 15:38:33 +0100 Message-ID: In-Reply-To: <022f01c9a7d2$dbb039e0$0600a8c0@china.huawei.com> X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting Thread-Index: Acmnxmj1AtLB9Pg4QJi+CCyjHMUpNQAByFqgAAHbNzA= References: <022f01c9a7d2$dbb039e0$0600a8c0@china.huawei.com> From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: "David Harrington" , "ops-area (IETF)" Cc: Mark Townsley , Jari Arkko , Ralph Droms Subject: Re: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:38:11 -0000 =20 Just for folks to follow, David refers to item #4 in the agenda - ISP Shared Addresses - Akira Nagakawa - 30 min My understanding is that the scope of the two drafts here is beyond the scope of SHARA and the other WGs you mention, and deals with shared ISP addresses space which is (also) an operators problem. But yes, it could have been in INTAREA as well. We discussed between the INT and OPS ADs where to deal with this in order to avoid duplication and we decided to have the discussion in the OPSAREA meeting, with only a short presentation in INTAREA (who meet just before OPS) that will just make sure that people there know where the bulk of the discussion is happening.=20 Dan > -----Original Message----- > From: David Harrington [mailto:ietfdbh@comcast.net]=20 > Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 4:07 PM > To: Romascanu, Dan (Dan); 'ops-area (IETF)' > Subject: RE: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting >=20 > Hi, >=20 > This proposal does not seem to be OPS-area specific.=20 >=20 > Wouldn't the discussion of using double NATs for IPv4 address=20 > sharing be better done in the "Sharing of an IPv4 Address=20 > BOF" (SHARA BOF)? > or the IPv6 Address Independence BOF? > or the BEHAVE WG or SOFTWIRE WG? > or the INTAREA meeting (where it is on the agenda already) >=20 > These proposals seem much more oriented to INT or TSV areas than OPS. > Why is this an OPS-area discussion? >=20 > dbh=20 >=20 > > -----Original Message----- > > From: ops-area-bounces@ietf.org > > [mailto:ops-area-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Romascanu, Dan (Dan) > > Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 8:38 AM > > To: ops-area (IETF) > > Subject: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting > >=20 > > An updated agenda for the Monday OPSAREA meeting is available at=20 > > http://www.ietf.org/proceedings/09mar/agenda/opsarea.txt > >=20 > > Dan > > _______________________________________________ > > OPS-AREA mailing list > > OPS-AREA@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ops-area > >=20 >=20 >=20 From jari.arkko@piuha.net Wed Mar 18 07:55:41 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 442AF28C205 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:55:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.55 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.55 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.049, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vewcIuNrsmXd for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:55:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.piuha.net (p130.piuha.net [IPv6:2001:14b8:400::130]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F30FE28C0E6 for ; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:55:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.piuha.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.piuha.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 829CA19877C; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 16:56:23 +0200 (EET) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (unknown [IPv6:2001:14b8:400::130]) by smtp.piuha.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BB453198671; Wed, 18 Mar 2009 16:56:18 +0200 (EET) Message-ID: <49C10B73.8030300@piuha.net> Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 07:55:47 -0700 From: Jari Arkko User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.19 (X11/20090105) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: David Harrington References: <022f01c9a7d2$dbb039e0$0600a8c0@china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP Cc: Mark Townsley , Ralph Droms , "ops-area \(IETF\)" Subject: Re: [OPS-AREA] Updated agenda for the OPSAREA meeting X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:55:41 -0000 David, >> This proposal does not seem to be OPS-area specific. >> We needed a place to discuss it, and while there is no perfect place, it seemed that IETF guidance on address allocation issues is at least to an extent an operational question. >> Wouldn't the discussion of using double NATs for IPv4 address >> sharing be better done in the "Sharing of an IPv4 Address >> BOF" (SHARA BOF)? >> SHARA is about the sharing of a public address between multiple subscribers and about distributed NATs. Shared ISP addresses are a different issue; its about the use of the same private address space by multiple networks. >> or the IPv6 Address Independence BOF? >> No, 6AI is about possible addition of NAT functionality to IPv6. >> or the BEHAVE WG or SOFTWIRE WG? >> BEHAVE would be a potentially good place for this, but their agenda is already quite full for their protocol work. SOFTWIRE is not really dealing with address space allocation. There is also an argument that this is a big enough question to justify area-level discussion, as opposed to something being decided in a WG. We are talking about allocating one or several of the remaining /8s! >> or the INTAREA meeting (where it is on the agenda already) >> INTAREA would potentially be a good place for this as well (and we talked about it there the last time). However, the involved ADs talked about this and decided that OPSAREA would be a better place. Jari From dromasca@avaya.com Sun Mar 22 10:35:40 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27B993A689D for ; Sun, 22 Mar 2009 10:35:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.527 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.527 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.071, BAYES_00=-2.599, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iGu7cydY-8cE for ; Sun, 22 Mar 2009 10:35:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com (co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com [198.152.13.100]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6CA773A6AFC for ; Sun, 22 Mar 2009 10:35:39 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,403,1233550800"; d="scan'208,217";a="165471017" Received: from unknown (HELO nj300815-nj-erheast.avaya.com) ([198.152.6.5]) by co300216-co-outbound.net.avaya.com with ESMTP; 22 Mar 2009 13:36:27 -0400 Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.12]) by nj300815-nj-erheast-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 22 Mar 2009 13:36:27 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C9AB14.AE831AEC" Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 18:36:07 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: OPSAREA open office hours Thread-Index: AcmrFK5r59j9GIw/QDC4gFJfD0XWng== From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: Subject: [OPS-AREA] OPSAREA open office hours X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 17:35:40 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9AB14.AE831AEC Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This is a reminder that Ron and me will be holding the OPS Area open = hours at IETF 74 between 13:00 and 15:00 on Wednesday 3/25. The room is = Continental 7&8. Please come to discuss any issues related to the WGs, = and work in the OPS Area, or other IETF business.=20 Dan ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9AB14.AE831AEC Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable OPSAREA open office hours

This is a reminder that Ron and me will be holding the = OPS Area open hours at IETF 74 between 13:00 and 15:00 on Wednesday = 3/25. The room is Continental 7&8. Please come to discuss any issues = related to the WGs, and work in the OPS Area, or other IETF = business.

Dan

------_=_NextPart_001_01C9AB14.AE831AEC-- From dromasca@avaya.com Mon Mar 23 08:19:58 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1B81B3A6BFE for ; Mon, 23 Mar 2009 08:19:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.228 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.228 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.230, BAYES_50=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lFguZ5XxlRAM for ; Mon, 23 Mar 2009 08:19:57 -0700 (PDT) Received: from de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com (de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com [198.152.71.100]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 07F363A6A15 for ; Mon, 23 Mar 2009 08:19:56 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,408,1233550800"; d="scan'208,217";a="141029322" Received: from unknown (HELO co300216-co-erhwest.avaya.com) ([198.152.7.5]) by de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com with ESMTP; 23 Mar 2009 11:20:41 -0400 Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.12]) by co300216-co-erhwest-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 23 Mar 2009 11:20:41 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C9ABCA.EA1339FF" Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:20:35 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: call for volunteers - minutes and jabber scribe Thread-Index: AcmryunhBBGYvs2kQLaDRdUbJ3wO+g== From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: Subject: [OPS-AREA] call for volunteers - minutes and jabber scribe X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 15:19:58 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9ABCA.EA1339FF Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Please volunteer to take best effort minutes or be a jabber scribe at = the OPSAREA meeting this afternoon.=20 Beers available (after the meeting) :-)=20 Dan ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9ABCA.EA1339FF Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable call for volunteers - minutes and jabber scribe

Please volunteer to take best effort minutes or be a = jabber scribe at the OPSAREA meeting this afternoon.

Beers available (after the meeting) :-)

Dan

------_=_NextPart_001_01C9ABCA.EA1339FF-- From dromasca@avaya.com Tue Mar 24 09:33:43 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F27C73A66B4 for ; Tue, 24 Mar 2009 09:33:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.314 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.314 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-1.130, BAYES_40=-0.185, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CPq9AartBtan for ; Tue, 24 Mar 2009 09:33:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com (de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com [198.152.71.100]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C9DA83A6819 for ; Tue, 24 Mar 2009 09:33:41 -0700 (PDT) X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="4.38,413,1233550800"; d="scan'208,217";a="141159922" Received: from unknown (HELO co300216-co-erhwest.avaya.com) ([198.152.7.5]) by de307622-de-outbound.net.avaya.com with ESMTP; 24 Mar 2009 12:34:30 -0400 Received: from unknown (HELO 307622ANEX5.global.avaya.com) ([135.64.140.12]) by co300216-co-erhwest-out.avaya.com with ESMTP; 24 Mar 2009 12:34:30 -0400 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----_=_NextPart_001_01C9AC9E.641AB3D5" Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 17:34:24 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Topic: Reminder: OPS Area open Hours Thread-Index: AcmsnmP93XrHCp0wQae3l3I5nkyewQ== From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" To: Subject: [OPS-AREA] Reminder: OPS Area open Hours X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 16:33:43 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9AC9E.641AB3D5 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The OPS Area Open Hours will be hold on Wednesday 3/25 between 13:00 and = 15:00 hours in Continental 7 & 8.=20 Ron and Dan ------_=_NextPart_001_01C9AC9E.641AB3D5 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Reminder: OPS Area open Hours

The OPS Area Open Hours will be hold on Wednesday 3/25 = between 13:00 and 15:00 hours in Continental 7 & 8.

Ron and Dan

------_=_NextPart_001_01C9AC9E.641AB3D5-- From rbonica@juniper.net Thu Mar 26 14:51:21 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 48CC93A6B51 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:51:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.59 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.59 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.009, BAYES_00=-2.599, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id o5QApu3wa4L5 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:51:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from exprod7og102.obsmtp.com (exprod7og102.obsmtp.com [64.18.2.157]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 856123A6AA4 for ; Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:51:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from source ([66.129.224.36]) (using TLSv1) by exprod7ob102.postini.com ([64.18.6.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKScv5DsjDybQcC3cTevYN5uO4rnH6SylN@postini.com; Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:52:14 PDT Received: from p-emfe01-sac.jnpr.net (66.129.254.72) by P-EMHUB01-HQ.jnpr.net (172.24.192.35) with Microsoft SMTP Server id 8.1.340.0; Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:49:24 -0700 Received: from p-emlb01-sac.jnpr.net ([66.129.254.46]) by p-emfe01-sac.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:49:24 -0700 Received: from antipi.jnpr.net ([10.10.2.34]) by p-emlb01-sac.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.3959); Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:49:24 -0700 Received: from proton.jnpr.net ([10.10.2.37]) by antipi.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:49:22 -0400 Received: from [172.28.134.70] ([172.28.134.70] RDNS failed) by proton.jnpr.net with Microsoft SMTPSVC(6.0.3790.1830); Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:49:22 -0400 Message-ID: <49CBF85E.8020108@juniper.net> Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 14:49:18 -0700 From: Ron Bonica User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.21 (Windows/20090302) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "ops-area (IETF)" X-Enigmail-Version: 0.95.7 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-OriginalArrivalTime: 26 Mar 2009 21:49:22.0449 (UTC) FILETIME=[B938A010:01C9AE5C] Subject: [OPS-AREA] ISP Shared Addresses X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 21:51:21 -0000 Folks, At IETF 74, Akira Nagakawa delivered a presentation in which he suggested the allocation of address space to be shared by ISPs. The purpose of this email is to stimulate discussion on that topic. What do you folks think? Ron From bmanning@ISI.EDU Fri Mar 27 04:54:46 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 94B813A697B for ; Fri, 27 Mar 2009 04:54:46 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.599 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.599 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SxdD03rVEz1G for ; Fri, 27 Mar 2009 04:54:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from boreas.isi.edu (boreas.isi.edu [128.9.160.161]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E43923A685F for ; Fri, 27 Mar 2009 04:54:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: from boreas.isi.edu (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by boreas.isi.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id n2RBstMo017294 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Fri, 27 Mar 2009 04:54:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: (from bmanning@localhost) by boreas.isi.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8/Submit) id n2RBsr4a017256; Fri, 27 Mar 2009 04:54:53 -0700 (PDT) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 04:54:53 -0700 From: Bill Manning To: Ron Bonica Message-ID: <20090327115453.GA16160@boreas.isi.edu> References: <49CBF85E.8020108@juniper.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <49CBF85E.8020108@juniper.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.4.2.2i X-ISI-4-43-8-MailScanner: Found to be clean X-MailScanner-From: bmanning@boreas.isi.edu Cc: "ops-area \(IETF\)" Subject: Re: [OPS-AREA] ISP Shared Addresses X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 11:54:46 -0000 On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 02:49:18PM -0700, Ron Bonica wrote: > Folks, > > At IETF 74, Akira Nagakawa delivered a presentation in which he > suggested the allocation of address space to be shared by ISPs. > > The purpose of this email is to stimulate discussion on that topic. What > do you folks think? > > Ron > _______________________________________________ how is this any different than RFC 1918? -- --bill Opinions expressed may not even be mine by the time you read them, and certainly don't reflect those of any other entity (legal or otherwise). From brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com Sat Mar 28 14:51:56 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EBFC3A6B75 for ; Sat, 28 Mar 2009 14:51:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.413 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.413 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.186, BAYES_00=-2.599] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1ufNL5LI0ZzP for ; Sat, 28 Mar 2009 14:51:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from wa-out-1112.google.com (wa-out-1112.google.com [209.85.146.181]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D57173A6B6C for ; Sat, 28 Mar 2009 14:51:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: by wa-out-1112.google.com with SMTP id l35so881591waf.5 for ; Sat, 28 Mar 2009 14:52:51 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from :organization:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=aWQ64MNdP1Ng7SQyzu1fSwA6iA11+QqBiR5jcBTrOBk=; b=NOGaGffda9waaZEQfONcKxmX1aUT/lvBlHm0fsbaIE6cxyEjbFZZ+OgXPEfBFQnC5F EHniZ5FU4mGPG7Vo+oejS130ORfBydwLjGYBe/ZP7VEiUWCEDCJ5A2gIgsqA3SwMtIuG /ByZCJtyxVinTGOPEXCLW/rcGF7zp5EPt6ymM= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=gamma; h=message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc :subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; b=MWTtmf90/+l8vG+NMVydStQ5hIq9/wsY+lddA3U1L9/orpnDPD0z+oY9eQaNOKxwst Dn4D9ou8JOOcqexzmQ3uiVOE5q3cmam3A1NKjNq83Qfw+4uRufbWDcoORzqJfYckXewS vPMbwfR2FivmGYRT/+C988iLOwggHIiiSZJpQ= Received: by 10.114.152.17 with SMTP id z17mr2459634wad.73.1238277171921; Sat, 28 Mar 2009 14:52:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?67.99.199.148? ([67.99.199.148]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPS id m28sm2977490waf.2.2009.03.28.14.52.50 (version=SSLv3 cipher=RC4-MD5); Sat, 28 Mar 2009 14:52:51 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <49CE9C2A.80201@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 10:52:42 +1300 From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: University of Auckland User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Ron Bonica References: <49CBF85E.8020108@juniper.net> In-Reply-To: <49CBF85E.8020108@juniper.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Cc: "ops-area \(IETF\)" Subject: Re: [OPS-AREA] ISP Shared Addresses X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 21:51:56 -0000 Ron, I understand that some ISPs have a problem in this area, and that some existing CPEs may have a problem if an ISP switches to an RFC1918 prefix, but I think the arguments given in the ops-area session against the "Net 11" solution are pretty strong. I assume they will be summarised in the minutes? Brian On 2009-03-27 10:49, Ron Bonica wrote: > Folks, > > At IETF 74, Akira Nagakawa delivered a presentation in which he > suggested the allocation of address space to be shared by ISPs. > > The purpose of this email is to stimulate discussion on that topic. What > do you folks think? > > Ron > _______________________________________________ > OPS-AREA mailing list > OPS-AREA@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ops-area > From jari.arkko@piuha.net Mon Mar 30 03:59:06 2009 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Delivered-To: ops-area@core3.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91A903A69C5 for ; Mon, 30 Mar 2009 03:59:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.046 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.046 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.439, BAYES_00=-2.599, DATE_IN_PAST_12_24=0.992] Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 8K4GJPElkhz5 for ; Mon, 30 Mar 2009 03:59:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.piuha.net (p130.piuha.net [IPv6:2001:14b8:400::130]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 819BA3A6876 for ; Mon, 30 Mar 2009 03:59:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from smtp.piuha.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.piuha.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1287A1986CE; Mon, 30 Mar 2009 14:00:02 +0300 (EEST) Received: from [127.0.0.1] (unknown [IPv6:2001:14b8:400::130]) by smtp.piuha.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id AB33D19867A; Mon, 30 Mar 2009 14:00:01 +0300 (EEST) Message-ID: <49CF980B.9070901@piuha.net> Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 08:47:23 -0700 From: Jari Arkko User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.21 (X11/20090318) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Brian E Carpenter References: <49CBF85E.8020108@juniper.net> <49CE9C2A.80201@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <49CE9C2A.80201@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV using ClamSMTP Cc: "ops-area \(IETF\)" Subject: Re: [OPS-AREA] ISP Shared Addresses X-BeenThere: ops-area@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9 Precedence: list List-Id: OPS Area e-mail list List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 10:59:06 -0000 Brian, > I think the arguments > given in the ops-area session against the "Net 11" solution > are pretty strong. I agree. I was particularly interested to hear about home equipment generally defaulting to 192.168/16 space, which may open an ability to use 10/8 space on the ISP side. Of course there is no 100% guarantee that this will not cause problems. However, a new private address space would also cause problems, such as failures for mechanisms that rely on recognizing RFC 1918 address space as private address space. Jari