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From: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
To: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Strong Technology Dependency
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Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2014 23:32:07 +0000
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From: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
To: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Issue of OAM information Information gathering Gathering from Service Function
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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2014 01:52:57 +0000
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--_000_7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E5543eusaamb103erics_--


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From: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
To: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Strong Technology Dependency
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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2014 02:33:08 +0000
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] Strong Technology Dependency
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From: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
To: Sam Aldrin <aldrin.ietf@gmail.com>, Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
Thread-Topic: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2014 03:09:00 +0000
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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From nobody Tue Jul  1 20:15:02 2014
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From: Sam Aldrin <aldrin.ietf@gmail.com>
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Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2014 20:14:50 -0700
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References: <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845491A9@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B9330016F2E@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA84573094@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B933001D499@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845756DA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457B68F@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E4426@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457BCE4@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E52E4@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C3FA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E55DB@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <772B4CEA-8B89-4F65-A33C-74F755412073@gmail.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C44B@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com>
To: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
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Cc: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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Hi Qin,

thanks for the reply
On Jul 1, 2014, at 8:09 PM, Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com> wrote:

> Hi, Sam:
> I think the open issue here is the definition of CC and CV in the =
RFC7276 is not consistent with what Greg see CC and CV(I potential agree =
with his observation,J).
> e.g., the definition of CC and CV doesn=E2=80=99t consider =
misconnection defect or defect entry and exit criteria?
> Therefore when we talk about whether BFC support CC or CV or whether =
IP Ping or LSP ping support CC or CV,
> The answer become fuzzy? Do we need to tweak RFC7276 or do we need to =
stick the definition of RFC7276?
Establishing definition is important before discussing what each of =
different tools could do.
If RFC7276 doesn=E2=80=99t define correctly, then right thing to do is =
get it fixed.
But if you want to define altogether a new term, then it is fine, but I =
am not a big fan of that.

cheers
-sam
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Time [mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Sam Aldrin
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5 =
10:54
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky
> =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: opsawg@ietf.org; time@ietf.org; Qin Wu
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Greg and Qin,
> =20
> Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its entirety due to various =
inline questions and responses.
> =20
> Is the confusion due to lack of right term to define OAM function(s) =
OR the existing OAM functions defined are not sufficient enough?
> I believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you think something =
missing?
> =20
> -sam
> On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, Gregory Mirsky =
<gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote:
>=20
>=20
> Hi Qin,
> if proactive continuity check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99=
s a requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. But that, =
IMO, will move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve =
learned from MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not require new =
definitions and can be usd for troubleshooting as-is, IMO.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Good point.
> So what you propose seems like we should integrate BFD with IP =
technology and accommodate the definitions (e.g., continuity defect, =
Misconnection Defect, defect entry , defect exit) used in RFC6428 which =
is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP encapsulation.
> Am my understanding correct?
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky =
[mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5 =
7:32
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> more in-lininess with the GIM2>> tag in dramatic red.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Greg:
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky =
[mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5 =
6:33
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> thank you for kind consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re =
agree on most so we can clip them and concentrate on few remaining.
> Please find my notes in-line and tagged GIM>> below.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 AM
> To: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Cc: Gregory Mirsky
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>Echo(Ping) does not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no =
definition of Misconnection defect.
> =20
> [Qin]:Not sure about this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for =
end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Therefore I think  IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I missing?
> GIM>> I think of CV as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular =
defect and has clear definition of defect entry and defect exit =
criteria. LSP Ping verifies consistency between control and data plane. =
That, IMO, is close to CV but without definition of defect state is not =
the CV.
> =20
> [Qin]: Interesting point, maybe we can category CV into strict CV and =
loose CV. I think you are talking about strict CV.
> Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be =
applied to any technologies, i.e., technology independent terminology.
> =20
> GIM2>> I think of them more from on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools =
POV. The latter is, IMO, defect detecting tool while the former is =
useful for troubleshooting, mostly.
> =20
> [...]
> =20
> Greg>Not, BFD and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same reason as =
for ICMP =E2=80=93 do definition of Misconnection defect. Besides, BFD =
Echo doesn=E2=80=99t work for multi-hop case but only for single hop.
> =20
> [Qin]: Not sure about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for =
end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Since BFD Echo is similar to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can =
provide CV.
> GIM>> Unlike LSP Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane =
vs. control plane. BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be =
accompanied with definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit =
conditions and how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So =
far applicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in =
RFC 6428, not been discussed in IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in =
MPLS-TP domains.
> =20
> [Qin]: So your point is the current BFD only can integrated into =
MPLS-TP to provide CV, am I right?
> What about RFC5885 =E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) =
for the Pseudowire Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D=
, can I understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?
> =20
> GIM2>> Not only in context of MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as =
Huub illustrated, that the right colored wire is plugged in. But except =
for MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is not being treated as a defect. the =
missing part =E2=80=93 definition of mis-connectivity defect entry and =
exit conditions in case of IP encapsulation of BFD control packet. =
Perhaps for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 definition given in RFC 6428 may be =
used as foundation but must be adopted to IP encapsulation. As for =
choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity verification=E2=80=9D vs. =
=E2=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D,  in RFC 5885 it may be debatable =
whether it is CV, considering possible use of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or =
only CC.
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CC through use of BFD
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and extension  to provide =
Source ID.
> =20
> [Qin]: Besides using BFD, is there any other way to provide CC or CV?
> GIM>> I think of CV as optional mode that may be realized with the =
help of CC mechanism. Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity defect, =
there must be definition of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD, =
CCM/ETH-CC or else (though not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =
=E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).
> =20
> [Qin] Yes, CC and CV can be complementary. We need to generalize these =
terms and apply them to various technologies.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Qin Wu
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8825=E6=97=A5=
 16:06
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [OPSAWG] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Mohamed:
> Thanks for details review to problem statement draft
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00
> and update I sent to you.
> =20
> Regarding strong technology dependency issue,
> Section 4.2 gives an address scheme  example to explain why the =
existing OAM mechanism has strong
> Technology as follows:
> =E2=80=9C
> Addressing scheme is a good example for an issue
> that has a high price for being non-generic.  Ping of IPv4 and IPv6
> looks different in the addressing scheme as well in the ICMP
> indication field, but they have the same OAM functionalities.
> =E2=80=9D
> You asked to clarify the exact point of this paragraph.
> I think what this paragraph said is
> For IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol =
[RFC4443] use different IP technology but share the same OAM function.
> =20
> But I agree with you address scheme is not a typical example for =
strong technology dependency.
> I think the typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are =
using different network technology but share the same OAM
> functionality, i.e., Path Discovery.  Another example is ICMP,BFD,LSP =
Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network technology but share
> the same functionality, i.e., continuity check. =20
> =20
> The following figure shows common OAM functionalities shared by =
various existing OAM protocols.
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |Continuity |  Connectivity|    Path      | Performance|
>    |        |  Check    |  Verification|  Discovery   | Monitoring |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | ICMP   |           |   Echo(Ping) |  Traceroute  |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | BFD    |  BFD      |   BFD Echo   |              |            |
>    |        | Control   |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | LSP    |           |              |              | - Delay    |
>    | Ping   |           |   Ping       |  Traceroute  | - Packet   |
>    |        |           |              |              |    Loss    |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | IPPM   |           |              |              |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | MPLS-TP|           |              |              |            |
>    | OAM    |  CC       |   CV         |  Traceroute  | -Delay     |
>    |        |           |              |              | -Packet    |
>    |        |           |              |              |   Loss     |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
> =20
> Hope this clarifies.
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com =
[mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8824=E6=97=A5=
 22:13
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Unified oam BOF proposal request in IETF 90
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> =20
> Please find attached a first set of comments.
> =20
> Cheers,
> Med
> _______________________________________________
> Time mailing list
> Time@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time


--Apple-Mail=_C203FD5F-3CF0-4E2E-BC0F-723A1CBFEB08
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: =
after-white-space;"><div><br></div>Hi Qin,<div><br></div><div>thanks for =
the reply<br><div><div>On Jul 1, 2014, at 8:09 PM, Qin Wu &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">bill.wu@huawei.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><div lang=3D"ZH-CN" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" =
style=3D"page: WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, Sam:<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I think the open issue here is the =
definition of CC and CV in the RFC7276 is not consistent with what Greg =
see CC and CV(I potential agree with his observation,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Wingdings; =
color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">J</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:=
 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">).<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">e.g., the definition of CC and CV doesn=E2=80=99t =
consider misconnection defect or defect entry and exit =
criteria?<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Therefore when we talk about whether BFC support CC =
or CV or whether IP Ping or LSP ping support CC or =
CV,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">The answer become fuzzy? Do we need to tweak RFC7276 =
or do we need to stick the definition of =
RFC7276?</span></div></div></div></blockquote>Establishing definition is =
important before discussing what each of different tools could =
do.</div><div>If RFC7276 doesn=E2=80=99t define correctly, then right =
thing to do is get it fixed.</div><div>But if you want to define =
altogether a new term, then it is fine, but I am not a big fan of =
that.</div><div><br></div><div>cheers</div><div>-sam</div><div><blockquote=
 type=3D"cite"><div lang=3D"ZH-CN" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" =
style=3D"page: WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:=
 10pt;"><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Time [<a =
href=3D"mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org">mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org</a>]<sp=
an class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">Sam Aldrin<br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:=
 10pt;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>2014</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span lang=3D"EN-US">7</span>=E6=9C=88=
<span lang=3D"EN-US">2</span>=E6=97=A5<span lang=3D"EN-US"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>10:54<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=
=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span=
 class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory =
Mirsky<br></span><b>=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a>; <a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">time@ietf.org</a>; Qin =
Wu<br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: =
[Time] Strong Technology =
Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin:=
 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">Greg and Qin,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its entirety due to =
various inline questions and =
responses.<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">Is the confusion due to lack of right term to define OAM =
function(s) OR the existing OAM functions defined are not sufficient =
enough?<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">I believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you =
think something missing?<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">-sam<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, =
Gregory Mirsky &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi =
Qin,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">if proactive =
continuity check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99s a =
requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. But that, IMO, =
will move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve =
learned from MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not require new =
definitions and can be usd for troubleshooting as-is, IMO.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
 style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky;<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">time@ietf.org</a>;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Good point.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">So what you propose seems =
like we should integrate BFD with IP technology and accommodate the =
definitions (e.g.,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 176, =
80);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">continuity =
defect, Misconnection Defect, defect entry , defect exit) used in =
RFC6428 which is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP =
encapsulation.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Am =
my understanding correct?</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Regards!</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">-Qin</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div =
style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, =
223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">Gregory Mirsky [<a href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 purple;">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">7</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">2</span>=E6=97=A5<spa=
n class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">7:32<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Qin Wu;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">RE: Strong =
Technology Dependency</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi Qin,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">more in-lininess with the =
GIM2&gt;&gt; tag in dramatic red.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
 style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky;<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, Greg:</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">Gregory Mirsky [<a href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 purple;">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">7</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">1</span>=E6=97=A5<spa=
n class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">6:33<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Qin Wu;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">RE: Strong =
Technology Dependency</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi Qin,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">thank you for kind =
consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re agree on most so we can =
clip them and concentrate on few remaining.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Please find my notes =
in-line and tagged GIM&gt;&gt; below.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
 style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 =
AM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br><b>Cc:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory =
Mirsky<br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[=E2=80=A6]</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;Echo(Ping) does =
not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no definition of =
Misconnection defect.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[Qin]:Not sure about this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for =
end-to-end</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp; Connectivity Verification between two LERs.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Therefore I think =
&nbsp;IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I missing?</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">GIM&gt;&gt; I think of CV =
as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular defect and has clear =
definition of defect entry and defect exit criteria. LSP Ping verifies =
consistency between control and data plane. That, IMO, is close to CV =
but without definition of defect state is not the CV.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Interesting point, =
maybe we can category CV into strict CV and loose CV. I think you are =
talking about strict CV.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be =
applied to any technologies, i.e., technology independent =
terminology.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: red;">GIM2&gt;&gt; I =
think of them more from on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools POV. The =
latter is, IMO, defect detecting tool while the former is useful for =
troubleshooting, mostly.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[...]</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Greg&gt;Not, BFD and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same =
reason as for ICMP =E2=80=93 do definition of Misconnection defect. =
Besides, BFD Echo doesn=E2=80=99t work for multi-hop case but only for =
single hop.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[Qin]: Not sure about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for =
end-to-end</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp; Connectivity Verification between two LERs.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Since BFD Echo is similar =
to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can provide CV.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">GIM&gt;&gt; Unlike LSP =
Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane vs. control plane. =
BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be accompanied with =
definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit conditions and =
how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So far =
applicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in RFC =
6428, not been discussed in IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in MPLS-TP =
domains.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[Qin]: So your point is the current BFD only can integrated into =
MPLS-TP to provide CV, am I right?</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">What about RFC5885 =
=E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) for the Pseudowire =
Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D, can I =
understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: red;">GIM2&gt;&gt; Not only in context of =
MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as Huub illustrated, that the right =
colored wire is plugged in. But except for MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is =
not being treated as a defect. the missing part =E2=80=93 definition of =
mis-connectivity defect entry and exit conditions in case of IP =
encapsulation of BFD control packet. Perhaps for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 =
definition given in RFC 6428 may be used as foundation but must be =
adopted to IP encapsulation. As for choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity=
 verification=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D, &nbsp;in =
RFC 5885 it may be debatable whether it is CV, considering possible use =
of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or only CC.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[=E2=80=A6]</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides =
CC through use of BFD</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and =
extension&nbsp; to provide Source ID.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Besides using BFD, =
is there any other way to provide CC or CV?</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">GIM&gt;&gt; I think of CV =
as optional mode that may be realized with the help of CC mechanism. =
Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity defect, there must be definition =
of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD, CCM/ETH-CC or else (though =
not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).</span><=
span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin] Yes, CC and CV can =
be complementary. We need to generalize these terms and apply them to =
various technologies.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">OPSAWG [<a href=3D"mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">Qin Wu<br></span><b><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">6</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">25</span>=E6=97=A5<sp=
an class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">16:06<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b>=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a><br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=
=A2=98<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">[OPSAWG] Strong =
Technology Dependency</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, Mohamed:</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Thanks for details review =
to problem statement draft</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><a =
href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 =
purple;">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00</sp=
an></a></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">and =
update I sent to you.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Regarding strong technology dependency issue,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Section 4.2 gives an =
address scheme&nbsp; example to explain why the existing OAM mechanism =
has strong</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Technology as follows:</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">=E2=80=9C</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
'Courier New';">Addressing scheme is a good example for an =
issue</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: 'Courier New';">that has a high price for being =
non-generic.&nbsp; Ping of IPv4 and IPv6</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
'Courier New';">looks different in the addressing scheme as well in the =
ICMP</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: 'Courier New';">indication field, but they have the same =
OAM functionalities.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">=E2=80=9D</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">You =
asked to clarify the exact point of this paragraph.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I think what this =
paragraph said is</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">For =
IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol [RFC4443] =
use different IP technology but share the same OAM function.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">But I agree with you =
address scheme is not a typical example for strong technology =
dependency.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I =
think the typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using =
different network technology but share the same OAM</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">functionality, i.e., Path =
Discovery.&nbsp; Another example is ICMP,BFD,LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM =
are using different network technology but share</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">the same functionality, =
i.e., continuity check. &nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The following figure =
shows common OAM functionalities shared by various existing OAM =
protocols.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|Continuity |&nbsp; Connectivity|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Path&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | Performance|</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp; Check&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; Verification|&nbsp; =
Discovery&nbsp;&nbsp; | Monitoring |</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | ICMP&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; Echo(Ping) |&nbsp; Traceroute&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; BFD Echo&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|</span>=
<span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
| Control&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | LSP&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | - Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | Ping&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; Ping&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp; =
Traceroute&nbsp; | - Packet&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | IPPM&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
MPLS-TP|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;|</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
OAM&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; CC&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; CV&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
Traceroute&nbsp; | -Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | -Packet&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hope this =
clarifies.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Regards!</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">-Qin</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div =
style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, =
223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;"><a href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>[<a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">6</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">24</span>=E6=97=A5<sp=
an class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">22:13<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Qin =
Wu<br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">RE: Unified oam =
BOF proposal request in IETF 90</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Hi Qin,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Please find attached a first set =
of comments.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, =
0);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, =
0);">Cheers,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Med</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;">_______________________________________________<br>Time =
mailing list<br><a href=3D"mailto:Time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">Time@ietf.org</a><br><a =
href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time</a></span></div></d=
iv></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>=

--Apple-Mail=_C203FD5F-3CF0-4E2E-BC0F-723A1CBFEB08--


From nobody Tue Jul  1 20:29:45 2014
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From: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
To: Sam Aldrin <aldrin.ietf@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
Thread-Index: AQHPkExClaEuAYsfAkmaJiSeVAvEmZuIxghggAF5cuCAAFSaoIABTXhQgAA373CAAAJR4P//fy4AgACIjQD//31WAIAAiTtg
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2014 03:29:30 +0000
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Cc: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2014 20:33:05 -0700
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References: <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845491A9@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B9330016F2E@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA84573094@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B933001D499@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845756DA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457B68F@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E4426@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457BCE4@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E52E4@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C3FA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E55DB@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <772B4CEA-8B89-4F65-A33C-74F755412073@gmail.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C44B@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <3C7BBD97-DED8-4835-B0C2-B4EE8FDB8969@gmail.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C48F@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com>
To: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
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Cc: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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Hi Qin,

RFC 7276 Sec 5.2, Table 4 does the same. :D

-sam
On Jul 1, 2014, at 8:29 PM, Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com> wrote:

> Sam:
> This issue is related to figure 1 we gave in the section 3.2 of =
draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-01(http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-ops=
awg-multi-layer-oam-01).
> We need to figure out whether the figure 1 needs to be updated given =
the definition of CC and CV.
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Time [mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Sam Aldrin
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5 =
11:15
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu
> =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: Gregory Mirsky; opsawg@ietf.org; time@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> =20
> thanks for the reply
> On Jul 1, 2014, at 8:09 PM, Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com> wrote:
>=20
>=20
> Hi, Sam:
> I think the open issue here is the definition of CC and CV in the =
RFC7276 is not consistent with what Greg see CC and CV(I potential agree =
with his observation,J).
> e.g., the definition of CC and CV doesn=E2=80=99t consider =
misconnection defect or defect entry and exit criteria?
> Therefore when we talk about whether BFC support CC or CV or whether =
IP Ping or LSP ping support CC or CV,
> The answer become fuzzy? Do we need to tweak RFC7276 or do we need to =
stick the definition of RFC7276?
> Establishing definition is important before discussing what each of =
different tools could do.
> If RFC7276 doesn=E2=80=99t define correctly, then right thing to do is =
get it fixed.
> But if you want to define altogether a new term, then it is fine, but =
I am not a big fan of that.
> =20
> cheers
> -sam
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Time [mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Sam Aldrin
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5 =
10:54
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky
> =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: opsawg@ietf.org; time@ietf.org; Qin Wu
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: Re: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Greg and Qin,
> =20
> Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its entirety due to various =
inline questions and responses.
> =20
> Is the confusion due to lack of right term to define OAM function(s) =
OR the existing OAM functions defined are not sufficient enough?
> I believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you think something =
missing?
> =20
> -sam
> On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, Gregory Mirsky =
<gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote:
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Hi Qin,
> if proactive continuity check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99=
s a requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. But that, =
IMO, will move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve =
learned from MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not require new =
definitions and can be usd for troubleshooting as-is, IMO.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Good point.
> So what you propose seems like we should integrate BFD with IP =
technology and accommodate the definitions (e.g., continuity defect, =
Misconnection Defect, defect entry , defect exit) used in RFC6428 which =
is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP encapsulation.
> Am my understanding correct?
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky =
[mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5 =
7:32
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> more in-lininess with the GIM2>> tag in dramatic red.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Greg:
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky =
[mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5 =
6:33
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> thank you for kind consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re =
agree on most so we can clip them and concentrate on few remaining.
> Please find my notes in-line and tagged GIM>> below.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 AM
> To: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Cc: Gregory Mirsky
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>Echo(Ping) does not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no =
definition of Misconnection defect.
> =20
> [Qin]:Not sure about this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for =
end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Therefore I think  IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I missing?
> GIM>> I think of CV as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular =
defect and has clear definition of defect entry and defect exit =
criteria. LSP Ping verifies consistency between control and data plane. =
That, IMO, is close to CV but without definition of defect state is not =
the CV.
> =20
> [Qin]: Interesting point, maybe we can category CV into strict CV and =
loose CV. I think you are talking about strict CV.
> Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be =
applied to any technologies, i.e., technology independent terminology.
> =20
> GIM2>> I think of them more from on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools =
POV. The latter is, IMO, defect detecting tool while the former is =
useful for troubleshooting, mostly.
> =20
> [...]
> =20
> Greg>Not, BFD and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same reason as =
for ICMP =E2=80=93 do definition of Misconnection defect. Besides, BFD =
Echo doesn=E2=80=99t work for multi-hop case but only for single hop.
> =20
> [Qin]: Not sure about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for =
end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Since BFD Echo is similar to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can =
provide CV.
> GIM>> Unlike LSP Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane =
vs. control plane. BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be =
accompanied with definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit =
conditions and how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So =
far applicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in =
RFC 6428, not been discussed in IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in =
MPLS-TP domains.
> =20
> [Qin]: So your point is the current BFD only can integrated into =
MPLS-TP to provide CV, am I right?
> What about RFC5885 =E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) =
for the Pseudowire Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D=
, can I understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?
> =20
> GIM2>> Not only in context of MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as =
Huub illustrated, that the right colored wire is plugged in. But except =
for MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is not being treated as a defect. the =
missing part =E2=80=93 definition of mis-connectivity defect entry and =
exit conditions in case of IP encapsulation of BFD control packet. =
Perhaps for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 definition given in RFC 6428 may be =
used as foundation but must be adopted to IP encapsulation. As for =
choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity verification=E2=80=9D vs. =
=E2=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D,  in RFC 5885 it may be debatable =
whether it is CV, considering possible use of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or =
only CC.
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CC through use of BFD
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and extension  to provide =
Source ID.
> =20
> [Qin]: Besides using BFD, is there any other way to provide CC or CV?
> GIM>> I think of CV as optional mode that may be realized with the =
help of CC mechanism. Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity defect, =
there must be definition of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD, =
CCM/ETH-CC or else (though not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =
=E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).
> =20
> [Qin] Yes, CC and CV can be complementary. We need to generalize these =
terms and apply them to various technologies.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Qin Wu
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8825=E6=97=A5=
 16:06
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [OPSAWG] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Mohamed:
> Thanks for details review to problem statement draft
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00
> and update I sent to you.
> =20
> Regarding strong technology dependency issue,
> Section 4.2 gives an address scheme  example to explain why the =
existing OAM mechanism has strong
> Technology as follows:
> =E2=80=9C
> Addressing scheme is a good example for an issue
> that has a high price for being non-generic.  Ping of IPv4 and IPv6
> looks different in the addressing scheme as well in the ICMP
> indication field, but they have the same OAM functionalities.
> =E2=80=9D
> You asked to clarify the exact point of this paragraph.
> I think what this paragraph said is
> For IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol =
[RFC4443] use different IP technology but share the same OAM function.
> =20
> But I agree with you address scheme is not a typical example for =
strong technology dependency.
> I think the typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are =
using different network technology but share the same OAM
> functionality, i.e., Path Discovery.  Another example is ICMP,BFD,LSP =
Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network technology but share
> the same functionality, i.e., continuity check. =20
> =20
> The following figure shows common OAM functionalities shared by =
various existing OAM protocols.
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |Continuity |  Connectivity|    Path      | Performance|
>    |        |  Check    |  Verification|  Discovery   | Monitoring |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | ICMP   |           |   Echo(Ping) |  Traceroute  |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | BFD    |  BFD      |   BFD Echo   |              |            |
>    |        | Control   |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | LSP    |           |              |              | - Delay    |
>    | Ping   |           |   Ping       |  Traceroute  | - Packet   |
>    |        |           |              |              |    Loss    |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | IPPM   |           |              |              |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | MPLS-TP|           |              |              |            |
>    | OAM    |  CC       |   CV         |  Traceroute  | -Delay     |
>    |        |           |              |              | -Packet    |
>    |        |           |              |              |   Loss     |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
> =20
> Hope this clarifies.
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com =
[mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8824=E6=97=A5=
 22:13
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Unified oam BOF proposal request in IETF 90
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> =20
> Please find attached a first set of comments.
> =20
> Cheers,
> Med
> _______________________________________________
> Time mailing list
> Time@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time


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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">Hi =
Qin,<div><br></div><div>RFC 7276 Sec 5.2, Table 4 does the same. =
:D</div><div><br></div><div>-sam<br><div><div>On Jul 1, 2014, at 8:29 =
PM, Qin Wu &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">bill.wu@huawei.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><div lang=3D"ZH-CN" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" =
style=3D"page: WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Sam:<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">This issue is related to figure 1 =
we gave in the section 3.2 of draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-01(<a =
href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-01" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-01<=
/a>).<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">We need to figure out whether the figure 1 needs to =
be updated given the definition of CC and =
CV.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:=
 10pt;"><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Time [<a =
href=3D"mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org">mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org</a>]<sp=
an class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">Sam Aldrin<br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:=
 10pt;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>2014</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span lang=3D"EN-US">7</span>=E6=9C=88=
<span lang=3D"EN-US">2</span>=E6=97=A5<span lang=3D"EN-US"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>11:15<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=
=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span=
 class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin =
Wu<br></span><b>=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory =
Mirsky; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a>; <a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">time@ietf.org</a><br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=
=98<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: [Time] Strong =
Technology Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></span></div></div></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></div></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Hi =
Qin,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">thanks for the =
reply<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">On Jul 1, 2014, at 8:09 PM, Qin Wu &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">bill.wu@huawei.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, =
Sam:</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I think the =
open issue here is the definition of CC and CV in the RFC7276 is not =
consistent with what Greg see CC and CV(I potential agree with his =
observation,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Wingdings; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">J</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">).</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">e.g., the definition of CC and CV =
doesn=E2=80=99t consider misconnection defect or defect entry and exit =
criteria?</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Therefore when we talk about =
whether BFC support CC or CV or whether IP Ping or LSP ping support CC =
or CV,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The answer =
become fuzzy? Do we need to tweak RFC7276 or do we need to stick the =
definition of RFC7276?</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US">Establishing definition is important before discussing =
what each of different tools could =
do.<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">If RFC7276 doesn=E2=80=99t define correctly, then right =
thing to do is get it fixed.<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">But if you want to define =
altogether a new term, then it is fine, but I am not a big fan of =
that.<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">cheers<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">-sam<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><blockquote =
style=3D"margin-top: 5pt; margin-bottom: 5pt;"><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Regards!</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">-Qin</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, =
223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">Time [<a href=3D"mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">mailto:time-bounces@ietf.org</a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">Sam Aldrin<br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">7</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">2</span>=E6=97=A5<spa=
n class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">10:54<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Gregory =
Mirsky<br></span><b>=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">opsawg@ietf.org</a>;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">time@ietf.org</a>; Qin Wu<br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98<span=
 lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Re: [Time] =
Strong Technology Dependency</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Greg and =
Qin,<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Couldn</span>=E2=80=99<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">t follow the thread to its entirety due to various inline =
questions and responses.<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Is the confusion due to lack =
of right term to define OAM function(s) OR the existing OAM functions =
defined are not sufficient =
enough?<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">I believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you =
think something missing?<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">-sam<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, =
Gregory Mirsky &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 purple;">gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><br><br><br><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi =
Qin,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">if =
proactive continuity check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99s =
a requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. But that, IMO, =
will move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve =
learned from MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not require new =
definitions and can be usd for troubleshooting as-is, IMO.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
 style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky;<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Good =
point.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">So =
what you propose seems like we should integrate BFD with IP technology =
and accommodate the definitions (e.g.,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(0, 176, 80);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">continuity defect, Misconnection Defect, defect entry , defect =
exit) used in RFC6428 which is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP =
encapsulation.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Am =
my understanding correct?</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Regards!</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">-Qin</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">Gregory Mirsky [<a href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 purple;">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">7</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">2</span>=E6=97=A5<spa=
n class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">7:32<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Qin Wu;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">RE: Strong =
Technology Dependency</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi =
Qin,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">more =
in-lininess with the GIM2&gt;&gt; tag in dramatic red.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
 style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky;<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, =
Greg:</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div=
 style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, =
223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">Gregory Mirsky [<a href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 purple;">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">7</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">1</span>=E6=97=A5<spa=
n class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">6:33<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Qin Wu;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">RE: Strong =
Technology Dependency</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi =
Qin,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">thank =
you for kind consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re agree on =
most so we can clip them and concentrate on few remaining.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Please find my notes =
in-line and tagged GIM&gt;&gt; below.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
 style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 =
AM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br><b>Cc:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory =
Mirsky<br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[=E2=80=A6]</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div=
 style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;Echo(Ping) does =
not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no definition of =
Misconnection defect.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]:Not sure about =
this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for end-to-end</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp; Connectivity =
Verification between two LERs.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Therefore I think =
&nbsp;IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I missing?</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">GIM&gt;&gt; I think of CV =
as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular defect and has clear =
definition of defect entry and defect exit criteria. LSP Ping verifies =
consistency between control and data plane. That, IMO, is close to CV =
but without definition of defect state is not the CV.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Interesting point, =
maybe we can category CV into strict CV and loose CV. I think you are =
talking about strict CV.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Alternatively, we may =
need a clear definition of CV that can be applied to any technologies, =
i.e., technology independent terminology.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: red;">GIM2&gt;&gt; I think of them more from =
on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools POV. The latter is, IMO, defect =
detecting tool while the former is useful for troubleshooting, =
mostly.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[...]</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Greg&gt;Not, BFD and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same =
reason as for ICMP =E2=80=93 do definition of Misconnection defect. =
Besides, BFD Echo doesn=E2=80=99t work for multi-hop case but only for =
single hop.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[Qin]: Not sure about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for =
end-to-end</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp; Connectivity Verification between two LERs.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Since BFD Echo is similar =
to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can provide CV.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">GIM&gt;&gt; Unlike LSP =
Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane vs. control plane. =
BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be accompanied with =
definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit conditions and =
how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So far =
applicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in RFC =
6428, not been discussed in IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in MPLS-TP =
domains.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[Qin]: So your point is the current BFD only can integrated into =
MPLS-TP to provide CV, am I right?</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">What about RFC5885 =
=E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) for the Pseudowire =
Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D, can I =
understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: red;">GIM2&gt;&gt; Not only in context of =
MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as Huub illustrated, that the right =
colored wire is plugged in. But except for MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is =
not being treated as a defect. the missing part =E2=80=93 definition of =
mis-connectivity defect entry and exit conditions in case of IP =
encapsulation of BFD control packet. Perhaps for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 =
definition given in RFC 6428 may be used as foundation but must be =
adopted to IP encapsulation. As for choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity=
 verification=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D, &nbsp;in =
RFC 5885 it may be debatable whether it is CV, considering possible use =
of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or only CC.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[=E2=80=A6]</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides =
CC through use of BFD</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides =
CV through use of BFD and extension&nbsp; to provide Source =
ID.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[Qin]: Besides using BFD, is there any other way to provide CC or =
CV?</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">GIM&gt;&gt; I think of CV as optional mode that may be realized =
with the help of CC mechanism. Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity =
defect, there must be definition of Mis-connection defect. It could be =
BFD, CCM/ETH-CC or else (though not sure whether there=E2=80=99s =
anything =E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin] Yes, CC and CV can =
be complementary. We need to generalize these terms and apply them to =
various technologies.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">OPSAWG [<a href=3D"mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">Qin Wu<br></span><b><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">6</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">25</span>=E6=97=A5<sp=
an class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">16:06<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b>=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a><br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=
=A2=98<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">[OPSAWG] Strong =
Technology Dependency</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, =
Mohamed:</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Thanks for details review to problem statement draft</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><a =
href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 =
purple;">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00</sp=
an></a></span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">and =
update I sent to you.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Regarding strong =
technology dependency issue,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Section 4.2 gives an =
address scheme&nbsp; example to explain why the existing OAM mechanism =
has strong</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Technology as follows:</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">=E2=80=9C</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
'Courier New';">Addressing scheme is a good example for an =
issue</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: 'Courier New';">that has a high price for being =
non-generic.&nbsp; Ping of IPv4 and IPv6</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
'Courier New';">looks different in the addressing scheme as well in the =
ICMP</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: 'Courier New';">indication field, but they have the =
same OAM functionalities.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">=E2=80=9D</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">You asked to clarify the =
exact point of this paragraph.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I think what this =
paragraph said is</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">For =
IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol [RFC4443] =
use different IP technology but share the same OAM function.</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">But I agree with you =
address scheme is not a typical example for strong technology =
dependency.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I =
think the typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using =
different network technology but share the same OAM</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">functionality, i.e., Path =
Discovery.&nbsp; Another example is ICMP,BFD,LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM =
are using different network technology but share</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">the same functionality, =
i.e., continuity check. &nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The following figure =
shows common OAM functionalities shared by various existing OAM =
protocols.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|Continuity |&nbsp; Connectivity|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Path&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
Performance|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp; Check&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; Verification|&nbsp; =
Discovery&nbsp;&nbsp; | Monitoring =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | ICMP&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; Echo(Ping) |&nbsp; Traceroute&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; BFD Echo&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|<o:p></=
o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
| Control&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | LSP&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | - Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | Ping&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; Ping&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp; =
Traceroute&nbsp; | - Packet&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | IPPM&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
MPLS-TP|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span=
 lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; | OAM&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
CC&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
CV&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
Traceroute&nbsp; | -Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | -Packet&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: =
12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hope this =
clarifies.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Regards!</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">-Qin</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div=
 style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, =
223); border-top-width: 1pt; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;"><div style=3D"margin: =
0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><b><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;"><a href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>[<a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt;">2014</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;">=E5=B9=B4<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">6</span>=E6=9C=88<span lang=3D"EN-US">24</span>=E6=97=A5<sp=
an class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">22:13<br></span><b>=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA<span =
lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">Qin =
Wu<br></span><b>=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US">&nbsp;</span></span><span lang=3D"EN-US">RE: Unified oam =
BOF proposal request in IETF 90</span></span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
=E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; =
text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Hi Qin,</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">&nbsp;</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93; text-align: =
justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Please find attached a first set =
of comments.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, =
0);">&nbsp;</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, =
0);">Cheers,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0cm 0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=
=E4=BD=93; text-align: justify;"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Med</span><span =
lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0cm =
0cm 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: =E5=AE=8B=E4=BD=93;"><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: Helvetica, =
sans-serif;">_______________________________________________<br>Time =
mailing list<br><a href=3D"mailto:Time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">Time@ietf.org</span></a><br><a =
href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time</span></a></span></div=
></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></blockquote></div=
><br></div></body></html>=

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From: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
To: Sam Aldrin <aldrin.ietf@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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From nobody Tue Jul  1 22:46:41 2014
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From: Sam Aldrin <aldrin.ietf@gmail.com>
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Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2014 22:46:29 -0700
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References: <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845491A9@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B9330016F2E@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA84573094@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B933001D499@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845756DA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457B68F@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E4426@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457BCE4@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E52E4@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C3FA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E55DB@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <772B4CEA-8B89-4F65-A33C-74F755412073@gmail.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E56CF@eusaamb103.ericsson.se>
To: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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Hi Greg,

response inline.
On Jul 1, 2014, at 10:31 PM, Gregory Mirsky =
<gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote:

> Hi Sam,
> I don=E2=80=99t agree with all points of RFC 7276, in particular its =
use of Connectivity Verification for connectionless networks.
Well, if RFC7276 defined terms incorrectly, it should be fixed, rather =
than re-defining the meaning here. Else we will create confusion with =
multiple meanings and interpretations.

> I believe that in connectionless network only Continuity Check could =
be realized. Tools like ICMP and LSP ping verify not connection but =
correlation between control plane and data plane.
I don=E2=80=99t think you can equate LSP ping with ICMP. And I don=E2=80=99=
t agree that LSP ping only verifies CP to DP. For ex: RFC4379 response =
codes 4, 5, 9 etc do not correlate CP to DP, rather verify DP. Does that =
make it connection verification? As per RFC7276, answer is yes.=20
> To use CV to characterize them, IMO, confuses discussion and, I =
believe, we had it sorted during MPLS-TP work.
At least I am not confused if I use the existing definition of RFC7276. =
:D

-sam
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Sam Aldrin [mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:54 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky
> Cc: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Greg and Qin,
> =20
> Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its entirety due to various =
inline questions and responses.
> =20
> Is the confusion due to lack of right term to define OAM function(s) =
OR the existing OAM functions defined are not sufficient enough?
> I believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you think something =
missing?
> =20
> -sam
> On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, Gregory Mirsky =
<gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote:
>=20
>=20
> Hi Qin,
> if proactive continuity check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99=
s a requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. But that, =
IMO, will move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve =
learned from MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not require new =
definitions and can be usd for troubleshooting as-is, IMO.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Good point.
> So what you propose seems like we should integrate BFD with IP =
technology and accommodate the definitions (e.g., continuity defect, =
Misconnection Defect, defect entry , defect exit) used in RFC6428 which =
is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP encapsulation.
> Am my understanding correct?
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky =
[mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5 =
7:32
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> more in-lininess with the GIM2>> tag in dramatic red.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Greg:
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky =
[mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5 =
6:33
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> thank you for kind consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re =
agree on most so we can clip them and concentrate on few remaining.
> Please find my notes in-line and tagged GIM>> below.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 AM
> To: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Cc: Gregory Mirsky
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>Echo(Ping) does not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no =
definition of Misconnection defect.
> =20
> [Qin]:Not sure about this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for =
end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Therefore I think  IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I missing?
> GIM>> I think of CV as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular =
defect and has clear definition of defect entry and defect exit =
criteria. LSP Ping verifies consistency between control and data plane. =
That, IMO, is close to CV but without definition of defect state is not =
the CV.
> =20
> [Qin]: Interesting point, maybe we can category CV into strict CV and =
loose CV. I think you are talking about strict CV.
> Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be =
applied to any technologies, i.e., technology independent terminology.
> =20
> GIM2>> I think of them more from on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools =
POV. The latter is, IMO, defect detecting tool while the former is =
useful for troubleshooting, mostly.
> =20
> [...]
> =20
> Greg>Not, BFD and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same reason as =
for ICMP =E2=80=93 do definition of Misconnection defect. Besides, BFD =
Echo doesn=E2=80=99t work for multi-hop case but only for single hop.
> =20
> [Qin]: Not sure about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for =
end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Since BFD Echo is similar to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can =
provide CV.
> GIM>> Unlike LSP Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane =
vs. control plane. BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be =
accompanied with definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit =
conditions and how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So =
far applicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in =
RFC 6428, not been discussed in IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in =
MPLS-TP domains.
> =20
> [Qin]: So your point is the current BFD only can integrated into =
MPLS-TP to provide CV, am I right?
> What about RFC5885 =E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) =
for the Pseudowire Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D=
, can I understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?
> =20
> GIM2>> Not only in context of MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as =
Huub illustrated, that the right colored wire is plugged in. But except =
for MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is not being treated as a defect. the =
missing part =E2=80=93 definition of mis-connectivity defect entry and =
exit conditions in case of IP encapsulation of BFD control packet. =
Perhaps for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 definition given in RFC 6428 may be =
used as foundation but must be adopted to IP encapsulation. As for =
choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity verification=E2=80=9D vs. =
=E2=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D,  in RFC 5885 it may be debatable =
whether it is CV, considering possible use of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or =
only CC.
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CC through use of BFD
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and extension  to provide =
Source ID.
> =20
> [Qin]: Besides using BFD, is there any other way to provide CC or CV?
> GIM>> I think of CV as optional mode that may be realized with the =
help of CC mechanism. Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity defect, =
there must be definition of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD, =
CCM/ETH-CC or else (though not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =
=E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).
> =20
> [Qin] Yes, CC and CV can be complementary. We need to generalize these =
terms and apply them to various technologies.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Qin Wu
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8825=E6=97=A5=
 16:06
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [OPSAWG] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Mohamed:
> Thanks for details review to problem statement draft
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00
> and update I sent to you.
> =20
> Regarding strong technology dependency issue,
> Section 4.2 gives an address scheme  example to explain why the =
existing OAM mechanism has strong
> Technology as follows:
> =E2=80=9C
> Addressing scheme is a good example for an issue
> that has a high price for being non-generic.  Ping of IPv4 and IPv6
> looks different in the addressing scheme as well in the ICMP
> indication field, but they have the same OAM functionalities.
> =E2=80=9D
> You asked to clarify the exact point of this paragraph.
> I think what this paragraph said is
> For IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol =
[RFC4443] use different IP technology but share the same OAM function.
> =20
> But I agree with you address scheme is not a typical example for =
strong technology dependency.
> I think the typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are =
using different network technology but share the same OAM
> functionality, i.e., Path Discovery.  Another example is ICMP,BFD,LSP =
Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network technology but share
> the same functionality, i.e., continuity check. =20
> =20
> The following figure shows common OAM functionalities shared by =
various existing OAM protocols.
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |Continuity |  Connectivity|    Path      | Performance|
>    |        |  Check    |  Verification|  Discovery   | Monitoring |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | ICMP   |           |   Echo(Ping) |  Traceroute  |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | BFD    |  BFD      |   BFD Echo   |              |            |
>    |        | Control   |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | LSP    |           |              |              | - Delay    |
>    | Ping   |           |   Ping       |  Traceroute  | - Packet   |
>    |        |           |              |              |    Loss    |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | IPPM   |           |              |              |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | MPLS-TP|           |              |              |            |
>    | OAM    |  CC       |   CV         |  Traceroute  | -Delay     |
>    |        |           |              |              | -Packet    |
>    |        |           |              |              |   Loss     |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
> =20
> Hope this clarifies.
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com =
[mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8824=E6=97=A5=
 22:13
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Unified oam BOF proposal request in IETF 90
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> =20
> Please find attached a first set of comments.
> =20
> Cheers,
> Med
> _______________________________________________
> Time mailing list
> Time@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time


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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">Hi =
Greg,<div><br></div><div>response inline.<br><div><div>On Jul 1, 2014, =
at 10:31 PM, Gregory Mirsky &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com">gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</a=
>&gt; wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" =
style=3D"page: WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi Sam,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I don=E2=80=99t agree with all =
points of RFC 7276, in particular its use of Connectivity Verification =
for connectionless networks.</span></div></div></div></blockquote>Well, =
if RFC7276 defined terms incorrectly, it should be fixed, rather than =
re-defining the meaning here. Else we will create confusion with =
multiple meanings and interpretations.</div><div><br><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" =
style=3D"page: WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);"> I believe that in connectionless network only =
Continuity Check could be realized. Tools like ICMP and LSP ping verify =
not connection but correlation between control plane and data plane. =
</span></div></div></div></blockquote>I don=E2=80=99t think you can =
equate LSP ping with ICMP. And I don=E2=80=99t agree that LSP ping only =
verifies CP to DP. For ex: RFC4379 response codes 4, 5, 9 etc do not =
correlate CP to DP, rather verify DP. Does that make it connection =
verification? As per RFC7276, answer is yes.&nbsp;<br><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" =
style=3D"page: WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">To use CV to characterize them, IMO, confuses =
discussion and, I believe, we had it sorted during MPLS-TP =
work.</span></div></div></div></blockquote>At least I am not confused if =
I use the existing definition of RFC7276. =
:D</div><div><br></div><div>-sam<br><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div =
lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" style=3D"font-family: =
Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; =
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; =
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: =
none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; =
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" =
style=3D"page: WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Sam Aldrin [<a =
href=3D"mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.com">mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.com</a>]<sp=
an class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:54 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky<br><b>Cc:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin Wu; <a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">time@ietf.org</a>; <a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b><spa=
n class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: [Time] Strong =
Technology Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;">Greg =
and Qin,<o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;">Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its entirety due to =
various inline questions and responses.<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;">Is the confusion due to lack of right term to define =
OAM function(s) OR the existing OAM functions defined are not sufficient =
enough?<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;">I =
believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you think something =
missing?<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;">-sam<o:p></o:p></div></div><div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;">On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, Gregory Mirsky &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</a>&gt; =
wrote:<o:p></o:p></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><br><br><o:p></o:p></div><div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi Qin,</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">if proactive continuity =
check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99s a requirement to do =
proactive connectivity verification. But that, IMO, will move us into =
more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve learned from MPLS-TP. =
On-demand OAM tools would not require new definitions and can be usd for =
troubleshooting as-is, IMO.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky;<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">time@ietf.org</a>;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Good point.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">So what you propose seems =
like we should integrate BFD with IP technology and accommodate the =
definitions (e.g.,</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: =
rgb(31, 73, 125);">continuity defect, Misconnection Defect, defect entry =
, defect exit) used in RFC6428 which is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP =
encapsulation.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Am my understanding =
correct?</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Regards!</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">-Qin</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">Gregory Mirsky [<a =
href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">2014</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">=E5=B9=B4</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">7</span><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=9C=88</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">2</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">=E6=97=A5</span><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">7:32<br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">Qin Wu;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">RE: Strong Technology Dependency</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi Qin,</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">more in-lininess with the =
GIM2&gt;&gt; tag in dramatic red.</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky;<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, Greg:</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">Gregory Mirsky [<a =
href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">2014</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">=E5=B9=B4</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">7</span><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=9C=88</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">1</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">=E6=97=A5</span><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">6:33<br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">Qin Wu;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">RE: Strong Technology Dependency</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi Qin,</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">thank you for kind =
consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re agree on most so we can =
clip them and concentrate on few remaining.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Please find my notes =
in-line and tagged GIM&gt;&gt; below.</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;">Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 =
AM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br><b>Cc:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory =
Mirsky<br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[=E2=80=A6]</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;Echo(Ping) does =
not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no definition of =
Misconnection defect.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]:Not sure about =
this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for end-to-end</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp; Connectivity =
Verification between two LERs.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Therefore I think &nbsp;IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I =
missing?</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">GIM&gt;&gt; I think of CV =
as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular defect and has clear =
definition of defect entry and defect exit criteria. LSP Ping verifies =
consistency between control and data plane. That, IMO, is close to CV =
but without definition of defect state is not the CV.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Interesting point, =
maybe we can category CV into strict CV and loose CV. I think you are =
talking about strict CV.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be =
applied to any technologies, i.e., technology independent =
terminology.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: red;">GIM2&gt;&gt; I think of them more from =
on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools POV. The latter is, IMO, defect =
detecting tool while the former is useful for troubleshooting, =
mostly.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[...]</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;Not, BFD and BFD =
Echo do not provide CV for the same reason as for ICMP =E2=80=93 do =
definition of Misconnection defect. Besides, BFD Echo doesn=E2=80=99t =
work for multi-hop case but only for single hop.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Not sure about =
this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for end-to-end</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp; Connectivity =
Verification between two LERs.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Since BFD Echo is similar to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can =
provide CV.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">GIM&gt;&gt; Unlike LSP =
Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane vs. control plane. =
BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be accompanied with =
definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit conditions and =
how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So far =
applicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in RFC =
6428, not been discussed in IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in MPLS-TP =
domains.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: So your point is =
the current BFD only can integrated into MPLS-TP to provide CV, am I =
right?</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">What about RFC5885 =
=E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) for the Pseudowire =
Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D, can I =
understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: red;">GIM2&gt;&gt; Not only in context of =
MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as Huub illustrated, that the right =
colored wire is plugged in. But except for MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is =
not being treated as a defect. the missing part =E2=80=93 definition of =
mis-connectivity defect entry and exit conditions in case of IP =
encapsulation of BFD control packet. Perhaps for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 =
definition given in RFC 6428 may be used as foundation but must be =
adopted to IP encapsulation. As for choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity=
 verification=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D, &nbsp;in =
RFC 5885 it may be debatable whether it is CV, considering possible use =
of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or only CC.</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[=E2=80=A6]</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides =
CC through use of BFD</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and =
extension&nbsp; to provide Source ID.</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Besides using BFD, =
is there any other way to provide CC or CV?</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">GIM&gt;&gt; I think of CV =
as optional mode that may be realized with the help of CC mechanism. =
Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity defect, there must be definition =
of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD, CCM/ETH-CC or else (though =
not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).</span><=
span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin] Yes, CC and CV can =
be complementary. We need to generalize these terms and apply them to =
various technologies.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">OPSAWG [<a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></b></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">Qin Wu<br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">2014</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">=E5=B9=B4</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">6</span><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=9C=88</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">25</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">=E6=97=A5</span><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">16:06<br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;"><a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 purple;">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;"><a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a><br></span><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">[OPSAWG] Strong Technology =
Dependency</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, Mohamed:</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Thanks for details review =
to problem statement draft</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><a =
href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color:=
 =
purple;">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00</sp=
an></a></span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">and update I sent to =
you.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Regarding strong =
technology dependency issue,</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Section 4.2 gives an address scheme&nbsp; example to explain why =
the existing OAM mechanism has strong</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Technology as follows:</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">=E2=80=9C</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
'Courier New';">Addressing scheme is a good example for an =
issue</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
'Courier New';">that has a high price for being non-generic.&nbsp; Ping =
of IPv4 and IPv6</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
'Courier New';">looks different in the addressing scheme as well in the =
ICMP</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
'Courier New';">indication field, but they have the same OAM =
functionalities.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">=E2=80=9D</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">You asked to clarify the =
exact point of this paragraph.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I =
think what this paragraph said is</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">For =
IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol [RFC4443] =
use different IP technology but share the same OAM function.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">But I agree with you =
address scheme is not a typical example for strong technology =
dependency.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I think the typical =
example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network =
technology but share the same OAM</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">functionality, i.e., Path Discovery.&nbsp; Another example is =
ICMP,BFD,LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network technology =
but share</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">the same functionality, =
i.e., continuity check. &nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif; text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The following figure =
shows common OAM functionalities shared by various existing OAM =
protocols.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |Continuity |&nbsp; =
Connectivity|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Path&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
Performance|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
Check&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; Verification|&nbsp; =
Discovery&nbsp;&nbsp; | Monitoring |</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | ICMP&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; Echo(Ping) |&nbsp; Traceroute&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp; BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; BFD =
Echo&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|</span>=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | Control&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | LSP&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | - Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
Ping&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; Ping&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp; =
Traceroute&nbsp; | - Packet&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | IPPM&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
MPLS-TP|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;|</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
OAM&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; CC&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; CV&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
Traceroute&nbsp; | -Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | -Packet&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><s=
pan style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hope this =
clarifies.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Regards!</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">-Qin</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif;"><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;"><a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>[<a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;"><span style=3D"color: =
purple;">mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a>]<span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br></span><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">2014</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">=E5=B9=B4</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">6</span><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=9C=88</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">24</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">=E6=97=A5</span><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">22:13<br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">Qin Wu<br></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: SimSun;">RE: Unified oam BOF proposal request in IETF =
90</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', =
serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Hi Qin,</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Please find attached a first set =
of comments.</span><span style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">&nbsp;</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Cheers,</span><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times New Roman', serif; =
text-align: justify;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: =
'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Med</span><span style=3D"font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'Times =
New Roman', serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 9pt; font-family: =
Helvetica, =
sans-serif;">_______________________________________________<br>Time =
mailing list<br><a href=3D"mailto:Time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">Time@ietf.org</a><br><a =
href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time" style=3D"color: =
purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time</a></span></div></d=
iv></div></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>=

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References: <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845491A9@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B9330016F2E@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA84573094@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B933001D499@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845756DA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457B68F@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E4426@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457BCE4@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E52E4@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C3FA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E55DB@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <772B4CEA-8B89-4F65-A33C-74F755412073@gmail.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E56CF@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8EE0F85-4830-4674-908D-ABC775BDDF76@gmail.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E5726@eusaamb103.ericsson.se>
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From: Sam Aldrin <aldrin.ietf@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 1 Jul 2014 23:06:15 -0700
To: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/opsawg/94ooZ7bXdoRnHC_ckVmkNyFJi00
Cc: "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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Hi Greg,

That would be ideal. Thanks.

Sam

Sent from my iPad

> On Jul 1, 2014, at 11:02 PM, Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> w=
rote:
>=20
> Hi Sam,
> I=E2=80=99ll look into whether filing Errata is the best path.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Sam Aldrin [mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 10:46 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky
> Cc: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Greg,
> =20
> response inline.
> On Jul 1, 2014, at 10:31 PM, Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> w=
rote:
>=20
>=20
> Hi Sam,
> I don=E2=80=99t agree with all points of RFC 7276, in particular its use o=
f Connectivity Verification for connectionless networks.
> Well, if RFC7276 defined terms incorrectly, it should be fixed, rather tha=
n re-defining the meaning here. Else we will create confusion with multiple m=
eanings and interpretations.
>=20
>=20
> I believe that in connectionless network only Continuity Check could be re=
alized. Tools like ICMP and LSP ping verify not connection but correlation b=
etween control plane and data plane.
> I don=E2=80=99t think you can equate LSP ping with ICMP. And I don=E2=80=99=
t agree that LSP ping only verifies CP to DP. For ex: RFC4379 response codes=
 4, 5, 9 etc do not correlate CP to DP, rather verify DP. Does that make it c=
onnection verification? As per RFC7276, answer is yes.=20
>=20
> To use CV to characterize them, IMO, confuses discussion and, I believe, w=
e had it sorted during MPLS-TP work.
> At least I am not confused if I use the existing definition of RFC7276. :D=

> =20
> -sam
>=20
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Sam Aldrin [mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:54 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky
> Cc: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Greg and Qin,
> =20
> Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its entirety due to various inline q=
uestions and responses.
> =20
> Is the confusion due to lack of right term to define OAM function(s) OR th=
e existing OAM functions defined are not sufficient enough?
> I believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you think something missi=
ng?
> =20
> -sam
> On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> w=
rote:
>=20
>=20
>=20
> Hi Qin,
> if proactive continuity check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99s=
 a requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. But that, IMO, wil=
l move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve learned fr=
om MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not require new definitions and can be=
 usd for troubleshooting as-is, IMO.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Good point.
> So what you propose seems like we should integrate BFD with IP technology a=
nd accommodate the definitions (e.g., continuity defect, Misconnection Defec=
t, defect entry , defect exit) used in RFC6428 which is earlier applied to M=
PLS-TP to IP encapsulation.
> Am my understanding correct?
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky [mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsso=
n.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5 7:=
32
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> more in-lininess with the GIM2>> tag in dramatic red.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Greg:
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky [mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsso=
n.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5 6:=
33
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> thank you for kind consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re agree o=
n most so we can clip them and concentrate on few remaining.
> Please find my notes in-line and tagged GIM>> below.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 AM
> To: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Cc: Gregory Mirsky
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>Echo(Ping) does not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no def=
inition of Misconnection defect.
> =20
> [Qin]:Not sure about this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Therefore I think  IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I missing?
> GIM>> I think of CV as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular def=
ect and has clear definition of defect entry and defect exit criteria. LSP P=
ing verifies consistency between control and data plane. That, IMO, is close=
 to CV but without definition of defect state is not the CV.
> =20
> [Qin]: Interesting point, maybe we can category CV into strict CV and loos=
e CV. I think you are talking about strict CV.
> Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be applied to=
 any technologies, i.e., technology independent terminology.
> =20
> GIM2>> I think of them more from on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools POV. Th=
e latter is, IMO, defect detecting tool while the former is useful for troub=
leshooting, mostly.
> =20
> [...]
> =20
> Greg>Not, BFD and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same reason as for IC=
MP =E2=80=93 do definition of Misconnection defect. Besides, BFD Echo doesn=E2=
=80=99t work for multi-hop case but only for single hop.
> =20
> [Qin]: Not sure about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Since BFD Echo is similar to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can provide C=
V.
> GIM>> Unlike LSP Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane vs. co=
ntrol plane. BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be accompanied with=
 definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit conditions and how t=
he defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So far applicability of th=
e code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in RFC 6428, not been discussed i=
n IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in MPLS-TP domains.
> =20
> [Qin]: So your point is the current BFD only can integrated into MPLS-TP t=
o provide CV, am I right?
> What about RFC5885 =E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) for t=
he Pseudowire Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D, can=
 I understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?
> =20
> GIM2>> Not only in context of MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as Huub i=
llustrated, that the right colored wire is plugged in. But except for MPLS-T=
P mis-connectivity is not being treated as a defect. the missing part =E2=80=
=93 definition of mis-connectivity defect entry and exit conditions in case o=
f IP encapsulation of BFD control packet. Perhaps for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 d=
efinition given in RFC 6428 may be used as foundation but must be adopted to=
 IP encapsulation. As for choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity verificatio=
n=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D,  in RFC 5885 it may be de=
batable whether it is CV, considering possible use of ICMP and/or LSP ping, o=
r only CC.
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CC through use of BFD
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and extension  to provide Sour=
ce ID.
> =20
> [Qin]: Besides using BFD, is there any other way to provide CC or CV?
> GIM>> I think of CV as optional mode that may be realized with the help of=
 CC mechanism. Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity defect, there must be=
 definition of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD, CCM/ETH-CC or else (t=
hough not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).
> =20
> [Qin] Yes, CC and CV can be complementary. We need to generalize these ter=
ms and apply them to various technologies.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] =E4=BB=
=A3=E8=A1=A8 Qin Wu
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8825=E6=97=A5 1=
6:06
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [OPSAWG] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Mohamed:
> Thanks for details review to problem statement draft
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00
> and update I sent to you.
> =20
> Regarding strong technology dependency issue,
> Section 4.2 gives an address scheme  example to explain why the existing O=
AM mechanism has strong
> Technology as follows:
> =E2=80=9C
> Addressing scheme is a good example for an issue
> that has a high price for being non-generic.  Ping of IPv4 and IPv6
> looks different in the addressing scheme as well in the ICMP
> indication field, but they have the same OAM functionalities.
> =E2=80=9D
> You asked to clarify the exact point of this paragraph.
> I think what this paragraph said is
> For IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol [RFC4443] u=
se different IP technology but share the same OAM function.
> =20
> But I agree with you address scheme is not a typical example for strong te=
chnology dependency.
> I think the typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using di=
fferent network technology but share the same OAM
> functionality, i.e., Path Discovery.  Another example is ICMP,BFD,LSP Ping=
 and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network technology but share
> the same functionality, i.e., continuity check. =20
> =20
> The following figure shows common OAM functionalities shared by various ex=
isting OAM protocols.
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |Continuity |  Connectivity|    Path      | Performance|
>    |        |  Check    |  Verification|  Discovery   | Monitoring |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | ICMP   |           |   Echo(Ping) |  Traceroute  |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | BFD    |  BFD      |   BFD Echo   |              |            |
>    |        | Control   |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | LSP    |           |              |              | - Delay    |
>    | Ping   |           |   Ping       |  Traceroute  | - Packet   |
>    |        |           |              |              |    Loss    |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | IPPM   |           |              |              |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | MPLS-TP|           |              |              |            |
>    | OAM    |  CC       |   CV         |  Traceroute  | -Delay     |
>    |        |           |              |              | -Packet    |
>    |        |           |              |              |   Loss     |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
> =20
> Hope this clarifies.
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com [mailto:mohamed.=
boucadair@orange.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8824=E6=97=A5 2=
2:13
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Unified oam BOF proposal request in IETF 90
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> =20
> Please find attached a first set of comments.
> =20
> Cheers,
> Med
> _______________________________________________
> Time mailing list
> Time@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time
> =20

--Apple-Mail-0410C318-B29E-49F5-B24D-A6C17B398B1D
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<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"content-type" content=3D"text/html; charset=3D=
utf-8"></head><body dir=3D"auto"><div>Hi Greg,</div><div><br></div><div>That=
 would be ideal. Thanks.</div><div><br></div><div>Sam<br><br>Sent from my iP=
ad</div><div><br>On Jul 1, 2014, at 11:02 PM, Gregory Mirsky &lt;<a href=3D"=
mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com">gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</a>&gt; wrot=
e:<br><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div>

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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Hi Sam,<o:p></o:p></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">I=E2=80=99ll look into whet=
her filing Errata is the best path.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,<o:p=
></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp; Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;=
Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-siz=
e:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> Sam Aldrin [=
<a href=3D"mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.com">mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 01, 2014 10:46 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Gregory Mirsky<br>
<b>Cc:</b> Qin Wu; <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">time@ietf.org</a>; <a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Hi Greg,<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">response inline.<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Jul 1, 2014, at 10:31 PM, Gregory Mirsky &lt;<a hr=
ef=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com">gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</a>&gt=
; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Hi Sam,</span><o:p></o:p></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">I don=E2=80=99t agree with a=
ll points of RFC 7276, in particular its use of Connectivity Verification fo=
r connectionless networks.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Well, if RFC7276 defined terms incorrectly, it should=
 be fixed, rather than re-defining the meaning here. Else we will create con=
fusion with multiple meanings and interpretations.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">I believe that in connectio=
nless network only Continuity Check could be realized. Tools like ICMP and L=
SP ping verify not connection but correlation between
 control plane and data plane. </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I don=E2=80=99t think you can equate LSP ping with IC=
MP. And I don=E2=80=99t agree that LSP ping only verifies CP to DP. For ex: R=
FC4379 response codes 4, 5, 9 etc do not correlate CP to DP, rather verify D=
P. Does that make it connection verification?
 As per RFC7276, answer is yes.&nbsp;<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">To use CV to characterize t=
hem, IMO, confuses discussion and, I believe, we had it sorted during MPLS-T=
P work.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">At least I am not confused if I use the existing defi=
nition of RFC7276. :D<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">-sam<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</sp=
an><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp; Greg</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;=
Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-co=
nverted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot=
;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0p=
t;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">Sam
 Aldrin [<a href=3D"mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.com">mailto:aldrin.ietf@gmail.c=
om</a>]<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, July=
 01, 2014 7:54 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory Mirsky<=
br>
<b>Cc:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin Wu; <a href=
=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">
time@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br=
>
<b>Subject:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Re: [Time]=
 Strong Technology Dependency</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Greg and Qin,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its entirety du=
e to various inline questions and responses.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Is the confusion due to lack of right term to define O=
AM function(s) OR the existing OAM functions defined are not sufficient enou=
gh?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you t=
hink something missing?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">-sam<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, Gregory Mirsky &lt;<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com"><span style=3D"color:purple">gregor=
y.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><br>
<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Hi Qin,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">if proactive continuity check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99s=
 a requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. But that,
 IMO, will move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve l=
earned from MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not require new definitions a=
nd can be usd for troubleshooting as-is, IMO.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;=
Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-co=
nverted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot=
;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0p=
t;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">Qin
 Wu [<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com"><span style=3D"color:purple">mail=
to:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp=
;</span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, July=
 01, 2014 7:33 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory Mirsky;=
<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:time@ie=
tf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span class=3D=
"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org"><spa=
n style=3D"color:purple">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong=
 Technology Dependency</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Good point.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">So what you propose seems like we should integrate BFD with IP technology a=
nd accommodate the definitions (e.g.,</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;=
font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#00B050">&nbsp;=
</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">continuity
 defect, Misconnection Defect, defect entry , defect exit) used in RFC6428 w=
hich is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP encapsulation.</span><o:p></o:p></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Am my understanding correct?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Regards!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">-Qin</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fon=
t-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</spa=
n></b><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><sp=
an class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fami=
ly:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:S=
imSun">Gregory
 Mirsky [<a href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com"><span style=3D"color=
:purple">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>]<span class=3D"apple-=
converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span></b><=
b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span clas=
s=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimS=
un">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">=
2014</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun=
;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=B9=B4</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt=
;font-family:SimSun">7</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;=
font-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=9C=88</span><span style=3D=
"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">2</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"=
font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=97=A5</s=
pan><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-f=
amily:SimSun">7:32<br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"appl=
e-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp=
;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">Qin
 Wu;<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:tim=
e@ietf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span clas=
s=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">=
<span style=3D"color:purple">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span></b><b><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-convert=
ed-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span><=
/span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">RE:
 Strong Technology Dependency</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Hi Qin,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">more in-lininess with the GIM2&gt;&gt; tag in dramatic red.</span><o:p></o=
:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;=
Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-co=
nverted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot=
;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0p=
t;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">Qin
 Wu [<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com"><span style=3D"color:purple">mail=
to:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp=
;</span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 3=
0, 2014 8:40 PM<br>
<b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory Mirsky;=
<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:time@ie=
tf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span class=3D=
"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org"><spa=
n style=3D"color:purple">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br>
<b>Subject:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong=
 Technology Dependency</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Hi, Greg:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fon=
t-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</spa=
n></b><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><sp=
an class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fami=
ly:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:S=
imSun">Gregory
 Mirsky [<a href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com"><span style=3D"color=
:purple">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</span></a>]<span class=3D"apple-=
converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span></b><=
b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span clas=
s=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimS=
un">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">=
2014</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun=
;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=B9=B4</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt=
;font-family:SimSun">7</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;=
font-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=9C=88</span><span style=3D=
"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">1</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"=
font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=97=A5</s=
pan><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-f=
amily:SimSun">6:33<br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"appl=
e-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp=
;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">Qin
 Wu;<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:tim=
e@ietf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<span clas=
s=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">=
<span style=3D"color:purple">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span></b><b><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-convert=
ed-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span><=
/span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">RE:
 Strong Technology Dependency</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Hi Qin,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">thank you for kind consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re agree o=
n most so we can clip them and concentrate on few remaining.</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Please find my notes in-line and tagged GIM&gt;&gt; below.</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;=
Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-co=
nverted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot=
;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0p=
t;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">Qin
 Wu [<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com"><span style=3D"color:purple">mail=
to:bill.wu@huawei.com</span></a>]<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp=
;</span><br>
<b>Sent:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 3=
0, 2014 12:39 AM<br>
<b>To:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mail=
to:time@ietf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">time@ietf.org</span></a>;<spa=
n class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf=
.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br>
<b>Cc:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory Mirsky<=
br>
<b>Subject:</b><span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong=
 Technology Dependency</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[=E2=80=A6]</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Greg&gt;Echo(Ping) does not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no d=
efinition of Misconnection defect.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[Qin]:Not sure about this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for end-to-end</s=
pan><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp; Connectivity Verification between two LERs.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Therefore I think &nbsp;IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I missing?</s=
pan><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#00B050=
">GIM&gt;&gt; I think of CV as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particul=
ar defect and has clear definition of defect entry and defect
 exit criteria. LSP Ping verifies consistency between control and data plane=
. That, IMO, is close to CV but without definition of defect state is not th=
e CV.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[Qin]: Interesting point, maybe we can category CV into strict CV and loos=
e CV. I think you are talking about strict CV.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be applied to=
 any technologies, i.e., technology independent terminology.</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:red">GI=
M2&gt;&gt; I think of them more from on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools POV. T=
he latter is, IMO, defect detecting tool while the former is
 useful for troubleshooting, mostly.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[...]</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Greg&gt;Not, BFD and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same reason as for=
 ICMP =E2=80=93 do definition of Misconnection defect. Besides, BFD
 Echo doesn=E2=80=99t work for multi-hop case but only for single hop.</span=
><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[Qin]: Not sure about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for end-to-end</s=
pan><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp; Connectivity Verification between two LERs.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Since BFD Echo is similar to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can provide C=
V.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#00B050=
">GIM&gt;&gt; Unlike LSP Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane v=
s. control plane. BFD could and may be used as CV if it would
 be accompanied with definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit c=
onditions and how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So far a=
pplicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in RFC 6428, n=
ot been discussed in IP or
 IP/MPLS networks but only in MPLS-TP domains.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[Qin]: So your point is the current BFD only can integrated into MPLS-TP t=
o provide CV, am I right?</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">What about RFC5885 =E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) for t=
he Pseudowire Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D,
 can I understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?</span><o=
:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:red">GI=
M2&gt;&gt; Not only in context of MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as Huu=
b illustrated, that the right colored wire is plugged in. But
 except for MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is not being treated as a defect. the m=
issing part =E2=80=93 definition of mis-connectivity defect entry and exit c=
onditions in case of IP encapsulation of BFD control packet. Perhaps for RFC=
s 5881, 5883, 5884 definition given in
 RFC 6428 may be used as foundation but must be adopted to IP encapsulation.=
 As for choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity verification=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=
=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D, &nbsp;in RFC 5885 it may be debatable wheth=
er it is CV, considering possible use of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or
 only CC.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[=E2=80=A6]</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides CC through use of BFD</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and extension&nbsp; to prov=
ide Source ID.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[Qin]: Besides using BFD, is there any other way to provide CC or CV?</spa=
n><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">GIM&gt;&gt; I think of CV as optional mode that may be realized with the h=
elp of CC mechanism. Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity
 defect, there must be definition of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD,=
 CCM/ETH-CC or else (though not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =E2=80=
=9Celse=E2=80=9D).</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">[Qin] Yes, CC and CV can be complementary. We need to generalize these ter=
ms and apply them to various technologies.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Greg</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fon=
t-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</spa=
n></b><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><sp=
an class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fami=
ly:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:S=
imSun">OPSAWG
 [<a href=3D"mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">ma=
ilto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org</span></a>]<span class=3D"apple-converted-space=
">&nbsp;</span></span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font=
-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8</span></b><spa=
n class=3D"apple-converted-space"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fa=
mily:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></b></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fa=
mily:SimSun">Qin
 Wu<br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span></b><=
b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span clas=
s=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimS=
un">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">=
2014</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun=
;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=B9=B4</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt=
;font-family:SimSun">6</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;=
font-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=9C=88</span><span style=3D=
"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">25</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D=
"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=97=A5</=
span><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;f=
ont-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-=
family:SimSun">16:06<br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"appl=
e-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp=
;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun"><a href=3D=
"mailto:time@ietf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">time@ietf.org</span></a>=
;<span class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a href=3D"mailto:opsawg=
@ietf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">opsawg@ietf.org</span></a><br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81</span></b><b><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-convert=
ed-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span><=
/span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun"><a href=3D"mailto:=
mohamed.boucadair@orange.com"><span style=3D"color:purple">mohamed.boucadair=
@orange.com</span></a><br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span></b><b><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-convert=
ed-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span><=
/span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">[OPSAWG]
 Strong Technology Dependency</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Hi, Mohamed:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Thanks for details review to problem statement draft</span><o:p></o:p></p>=

<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00">=
<span style=3D"color:purple">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-mult=
i-layer-oam-00</span></a></span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">and update I sent to you.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Regarding strong technology dependency issue,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Section 4.2 gives an address scheme&nbsp; example to explain why the exist=
ing OAM mechanism has strong</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Technology as follows:</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">=E2=80=9C</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">Addressing scheme is a good exa=
mple for an issue</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">that has a high price for being=
 non-generic.&nbsp; Ping of IPv4 and IPv6</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">looks different in the addressi=
ng scheme as well in the ICMP</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">indication field, but they have=
 the same OAM functionalities.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">=E2=80=9D</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">You asked to clarify the exact point of this paragraph.</span><o:p></o:p><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">I think what this paragraph said is</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">For IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol [RFC4443] u=
se different IP technology but share the same OAM function.</span><o:p></o:p=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">But I agree with you address scheme is not a typical example for strong te=
chnology dependency.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">I think the typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using di=
fferent network technology but share the same OAM</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">functionality, i.e., Path Discovery.&nbsp; Another example is ICMP,BFD,LSP=
 Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network technology
 but share</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">the same functionality, i.e., continuity check. &nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">The following figure shows common OAM functionalities shared by various ex=
isting OAM protocols.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |----=
----+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |Continuity |&nbsp; Connectivity|&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp; Path&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | Performance|</span><o:p>=
</o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; Check&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p; Verification|&nbsp; Discovery&nbsp;&nbsp; | Monitoring |</span><o:p></o:p=
></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; +----=
----+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; | ICM=
P&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |=
&nbsp;&nbsp; Echo(Ping) |&nbsp; Traceroute&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; +----=
----+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; | BFD=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; B=
FD Echo&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | Control&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; +----=
----+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; | LSP=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; | - Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; | Pin=
g&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |=
&nbsp;&nbsp; Ping&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp; Traceroute&nbs=
p; | - Packet&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; +----=
----+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; | IPP=
M&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp=
;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |----=
----+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; | MPL=
S-TP|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp=
;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;|</span><o=
:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; | OAM=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; CC&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nb=
sp; CV&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; Traceroute&nb=
sp; | -Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | -Packet&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |</span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |=
</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;&nbsp; +----=
----+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+</span><o:p></o:=
p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Hope this clarifies.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">Regards!</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">-Qin</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D=
">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0=
in 0in">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fon=
t-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</spa=
n></b><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><sp=
an class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-fami=
ly:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:S=
imSun"><a href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com"><span style=3D"color:=
purple">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a><span class=3D"apple-converte=
d-space">&nbsp;</span>[<a href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com"><span=
 style=3D"color:purple">mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</span></a>]<span=
 class=3D"apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span></b><=
b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span clas=
s=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimS=
un">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">=
2014</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun=
;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E5=B9=B4</span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt=
;font-family:SimSun">6</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;=
font-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=9C=88</span><span style=3D=
"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">24</span><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D=
"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=97=A5</=
span><span class=3D"apple-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;f=
ont-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-=
family:SimSun">22:13<br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"appl=
e-converted-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp=
;</span></span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">Qin
 Wu<br>
</span><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun;=
mso-fareast-language:ZH-CN">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span></b><b><span style=3D"f=
ont-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span class=3D"apple-convert=
ed-space"><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">&nbsp;</span><=
/span><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">RE:
 Unified oam BOF proposal request in IETF 90</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-family:&quot;Cal=
ibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:#003300">Hi Qin,</span><o:=
p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:#003300">&nbsp;</span><o:p=
></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:#003300">Please find attac=
hed a first set of comments.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:#003300">&nbsp;</span><o:p=
></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:#003300">Cheers,</span><o:=
p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"text-align:justify"><span style=3D"font-size=
:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;;color:#003300">Med</span><o:p></=
o:p></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:9.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">________________________________________=
_______<br>
Time mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Time@ietf.org"><span style=3D"color:purple">Time@ietf.org<=
/span></a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time"><span style=3D"color:=
purple">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time</span></a></span><o:p></o=
:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
</div>


</div></blockquote></body></html>=

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From: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
To: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Strong Technology Dependency
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From: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
To: Sam Aldrin <aldrin.ietf@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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From nobody Wed Jul  2 02:43:29 2014
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From: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
To: Sam Aldrin <aldrin.ietf@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
Thread-Index: AQHPkExClaEuAYsfAkmaJiSeVAvEmZuIxghggAF5cuCAAFSaoIABTXhQgAA373CAAAJR4IAASFgA///mGKCAAEoqgP//wMbQ
Date: Wed, 2 Jul 2014 06:02:00 +0000
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References: <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845491A9@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B9330016F2E@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA84573094@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B933001D499@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845756DA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457B68F@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E4426@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457BCE4@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E52E4@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C3FA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E55DB@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <772B4CEA-8B89-4F65-A33C-74F755412073@gmail.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E56CF@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8EE0F85-4830-4674-908D-ABC775BDDF76@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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References: <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845491A9@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B9330016F2E@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA84573094@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <787AE7BB302AE849A7480A190F8B933001D499@OPEXCLILM23.corporate.adroot.infra.ftgroup> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA845756DA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457B68F@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E4426@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457BCE4@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E52E4@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8457C3FA@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E55DB@eusaamb103.ericsson.se>
To: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [Time] Strong Technology Dependency
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	charset=utf-8

Greg and Qin,

Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its entirety due to various inline =
questions and responses.

Is the confusion due to lack of right term to define OAM function(s) OR =
the existing OAM functions defined are not sufficient enough?
I believe RFC7276 identified comprehensively. Do you think something =
missing?

-sam
On Jul 1, 2014, at 7:38 PM, Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> =
wrote:

> Hi Qin,
> if proactive continuity check viewed as not sufficient and there=E2=80=99=
s a requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. But that, =
IMO, will move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as we=E2=80=99ve =
learned from MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not require new =
definitions and can be usd for troubleshooting as-is, IMO.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Good point.
> So what you propose seems like we should integrate BFD with IP =
technology and accommodate the definitions (e.g., continuity defect, =
Misconnection Defect, defect entry , defect exit) used in RFC6428 which =
is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP encapsulation.
> Am my understanding correct?
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky =
[mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=882=E6=97=A5 =
7:32
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> more in-lininess with the GIM2>> tag in dramatic red.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 PM
> To: Gregory Mirsky; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Greg:
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Gregory Mirsky =
[mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B47=E6=9C=881=E6=97=A5 =
6:33
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu; time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> thank you for kind consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re =
agree on most so we can clip them and concentrate on few remaining.
> Please find my notes in-line and tagged GIM>> below.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> From: Qin Wu [mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]=20
> Sent: Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 AM
> To: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> Cc: Gregory Mirsky
> Subject: RE: Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>Echo(Ping) does not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no =
definition of Misconnection defect.
> =20
> [Qin]:Not sure about this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for =
end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Therefore I think  IP Ping can also provide CV, what am I missing?
> GIM>> I think of CV as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular =
defect and has clear definition of defect entry and defect exit =
criteria. LSP Ping verifies consistency between control and data plane. =
That, IMO, is close to CV but without definition of defect state is not =
the CV.
> =20
> [Qin]: Interesting point, maybe we can category CV into strict CV and =
loose CV. I think you are talking about strict CV.
> Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be =
applied to any technologies, i.e., technology independent terminology.
> =20
> GIM2>> I think of them more from on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools =
POV. The latter is, IMO, defect detecting tool while the former is =
useful for troubleshooting, mostly.
> =20
> [...]
> =20
> Greg>Not, BFD and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same reason as =
for ICMP =E2=80=93 do definition of Misconnection defect. Besides, BFD =
Echo doesn=E2=80=99t work for multi-hop case but only for single hop.
> =20
> [Qin]: Not sure about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for =
end-to-end
>   Connectivity Verification between two LERs.
> Since BFD Echo is similar to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also can =
provide CV.
> GIM>> Unlike LSP Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane =
vs. control plane. BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be =
accompanied with definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit =
conditions and how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So =
far applicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in =
RFC 6428, not been discussed in IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in =
MPLS-TP domains.
> =20
> [Qin]: So your point is the current BFD only can integrated into =
MPLS-TP to provide CV, am I right?
> What about RFC5885 =E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) =
for the Pseudowire Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D=
, can I understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide CV?
> =20
> GIM2>> Not only in context of MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as =
Huub illustrated, that the right colored wire is plugged in. But except =
for MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is not being treated as a defect. the =
missing part =E2=80=93 definition of mis-connectivity defect entry and =
exit conditions in case of IP encapsulation of BFD control packet. =
Perhaps for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 definition given in RFC 6428 may be =
used as foundation but must be adopted to IP encapsulation. As for =
choice of terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity verification=E2=80=9D vs. =
=E2=80=9Ccontinuity check=E2=80=9D,  in RFC 5885 it may be debatable =
whether it is CV, considering possible use of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or =
only CC.
> =20
> [=E2=80=A6]
> =20
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CC through use of BFD
> Greg>MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and extension  to provide =
Source ID.
> =20
> [Qin]: Besides using BFD, is there any other way to provide CC or CV?
> GIM>> I think of CV as optional mode that may be realized with the =
help of CC mechanism. Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity defect, =
there must be definition of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD, =
CCM/ETH-CC or else (though not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =
=E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).
> =20
> [Qin] Yes, CC and CV can be complementary. We need to generalize these =
terms and apply them to various technologies.
> =20
>                 Regards,
>                                 Greg
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Qin Wu
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8825=E6=97=A5=
 16:06
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: time@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org
> =E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [OPSAWG] Strong Technology Dependency
> =20
> Hi, Mohamed:
> Thanks for details review to problem statement draft
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00
> and update I sent to you.
> =20
> Regarding strong technology dependency issue,
> Section 4.2 gives an address scheme  example to explain why the =
existing OAM mechanism has strong
> Technology as follows:
> =E2=80=9C
> Addressing scheme is a good example for an issue
> that has a high price for being non-generic.  Ping of IPv4 and IPv6
> looks different in the addressing scheme as well in the ICMP
> indication field, but they have the same OAM functionalities.
> =E2=80=9D
> You asked to clarify the exact point of this paragraph.
> I think what this paragraph said is
> For IP ping, IPv4 Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol =
[RFC4443] use different IP technology but share the same OAM function.
> =20
> But I agree with you address scheme is not a typical example for =
strong technology dependency.
> I think the typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are =
using different network technology but share the same OAM
> functionality, i.e., Path Discovery.  Another example is ICMP,BFD,LSP =
Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network technology but share
> the same functionality, i.e., continuity check. =20
> =20
> The following figure shows common OAM functionalities shared by =
various existing OAM protocols.
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |Continuity |  Connectivity|    Path      | Performance|
>    |        |  Check    |  Verification|  Discovery   | Monitoring |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | ICMP   |           |   Echo(Ping) |  Traceroute  |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | BFD    |  BFD      |   BFD Echo   |              |            |
>    |        | Control   |              |              |            |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | LSP    |           |              |              | - Delay    |
>    | Ping   |           |   Ping       |  Traceroute  | - Packet   |
>    |        |           |              |              |    Loss    |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    | IPPM   |           |              |              |            |
>    |        |           |              |              |            |
>    |--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
>    | MPLS-TP|           |              |              |            |
>    | OAM    |  CC       |   CV         |  Traceroute  | -Delay     |
>    |        |           |              |              | -Packet    |
>    |        |           |              |              |   Loss     |
>    +--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+
> =20
> Hope this clarifies.
> =20
> Regards!
> -Qin
> =20
> =E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: mohamed.boucadair@orange.com =
[mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com]=20
> =E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2014=E5=B9=B46=E6=9C=8824=E6=97=A5=
 22:13
> =E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Qin Wu
> =E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: RE: Unified oam BOF proposal request in IETF 90
> =20
> Hi Qin,
> =20
> Please find attached a first set of comments.
> =20
> Cheers,
> Med
> _______________________________________________
> Time mailing list
> Time@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/time


--Apple-Mail=_E8E5664D-BCA7-4641-8E56-9313CAF8CEDB
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Type: text/html;
	charset=utf-8

<html><head><meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html =
charset=3Dutf-8"></head><body style=3D"word-wrap: break-word; =
-webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">Greg =
and Qin,<div><br></div><div>Couldn=E2=80=99t follow the thread to its =
entirety due to various inline questions and =
responses.</div><div><br></div><div>Is the confusion due to lack of =
right term to define OAM function(s) OR the existing OAM functions =
defined are not sufficient enough?</div><div>I believe RFC7276 =
identified comprehensively. Do you think something =
missing?</div><div><br></div><div>-sam</div><div><div><div>On Jul 1, =
2014, at 7:38 PM, Gregory Mirsky &lt;<a =
href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com">gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</a=
>&gt; wrote:</div><br class=3D"Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote =
type=3D"cite"><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" =
style=3D"font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; =
font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; =
line-height: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; =
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: =
0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"><div class=3D"WordSection1" =
style=3D"page: WordSection1;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Hi Qin,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">if proactive continuity check viewed as not sufficient and =
there=E2=80=99s a requirement to do proactive connectivity verification. =
But that, IMO, will move us into more narrow segment of use cases, as =
we=E2=80=99ve learned from MPLS-TP. On-demand OAM tools would not =
require new definitions and can be usd for troubleshooting as-is, =
IMO.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: solid none =
none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; =
padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Tuesday, July 01, 2014 7:33 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky; <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">time@ietf.org</a>; <a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b><spa=
n class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Good =
point.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">So what you =
propose seems like we should integrate BFD with IP technology and =
accommodate the definitions (e.g.,</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, =
176, 80);">&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">continuity defect, Misconnection Defect, defect entry , defect =
exit) used in RFC6428 which is earlier applied to MPLS-TP to IP =
encapsulation.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Am my =
understanding correct?<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: =
solid none none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: =
1pt; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory Mirsky [<a =
href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: =
underline;">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>2014<span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E5=B9=B4</span>7<span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=9C=88</span>2<spa=
n lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=97=A5</span><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>7:32<br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin Wu;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">time@ietf.org</a>;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span>&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Hi Qin,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">more in-lininess with the GIM2&gt;&gt; tag in dramatic =
red.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: solid none =
none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; =
padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 30, 2014 8:40 =
PM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory=
 Mirsky;<span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">time@ietf.org</a>;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span>&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, =
Greg:<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: solid none =
none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; =
padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory Mirsky [<a =
href=3D"mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: =
underline;">mailto:gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>2014<span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E5=B9=B4</span>7<span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=9C=88</span>1<spa=
n lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=97=A5</span><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>6:33<br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin Wu;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">time@ietf.org</a>;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span>&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Hi Qin,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">thank you for kind consideration of my comments. Glad we=E2=80=99re=
 agree on most so we can clip them and concentrate on few =
remaining.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Please find my notes in-line and tagged GIM&gt;&gt; =
below.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: solid none =
none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; =
padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, =
sans-serif;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin Wu [<a =
href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b>Sent:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Monday, June 30, 2014 12:39 =
AM<br><b>To:</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">time@ietf.org</a>;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b>Cc:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Gregory =
Mirsky<br><b>Subject:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Strong Technology =
Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span>&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[=E2=80=A6]<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;Echo(Ping) =
does not provide CV as IP is connectionless and has no definition of =
Misconnection defect.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]:Not sure =
about this. RFC7276 said LSP Ping is used for =
end-to-end<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp; =
Connectivity Verification between two LERs.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">Therefore I think &nbsp;IP Ping can also provide CV, what am =
I missing?<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">GIM&gt;&gt; I think =
of CV as proactive OAM mechanism that detects particular defect and has =
clear definition of defect entry and defect exit criteria. LSP Ping =
verifies consistency between control and data plane. That, IMO, is close =
to CV but without definition of defect state is not the =
CV.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Interesting =
point, maybe we can category CV into strict CV and loose CV. I think you =
are talking about strict CV.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Alternatively, we may need a clear definition of CV that can be =
applied to any technologies, i.e., technology independent =
terminology.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: red;">GIM2&gt;&gt; I =
think of them more from on-demand vs. proactive OAM tools POV. The =
latter is, IMO, defect detecting tool while the former is useful for =
troubleshooting, mostly.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[...]<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;Not, BFD =
and BFD Echo do not provide CV for the same reason as for ICMP =E2=80=93 =
do definition of Misconnection defect. Besides, BFD Echo doesn=E2=80=99t =
work for multi-hop case but only for single =
hop.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Not sure =
about this. RFC7276 said SP Ping is used for =
end-to-end<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp; =
Connectivity Verification between two LERs.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">Since BFD Echo is similar to LSP Ping, I think BFD Echo also =
can provide CV.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(0, 176, 80);">GIM&gt;&gt; Unlike =
LSP Ping BFD does not verify consistency of data plane vs. control =
plane. BFD could and may be used as CV if it would be accompanied with =
definition of Misconnection Defect, its Entry and Exit conditions and =
how the defect gets signaled, i.e. through Diag field. So far =
applicability of the code for Mis-connectivity defect, defined in RFC =
6428, not been discussed in IP or IP/MPLS networks but only in MPLS-TP =
domains.</span><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);"><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: So your =
point is the current BFD only can integrated into MPLS-TP to provide CV, =
am I right?<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">What about RFC5885 =
=E2=80=9CBidirectional Forwarding Detection (BFD) for the Pseudowire =
Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV)=E2=80=9D, can I =
understand it as BFD being integrated with PW to provide =
CV?<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: red;">GIM2&gt;&gt; =
Not only in context of MPLS-TP. In fact, BFD does ensures, as Huub =
illustrated, that the right colored wire is plugged in. But except for =
MPLS-TP mis-connectivity is not being treated as a defect. the missing =
part =E2=80=93 definition of mis-connectivity defect entry and exit =
conditions in case of IP encapsulation of BFD control packet. Perhaps =
for RFCs 5881, 5883, 5884 definition given in RFC 6428 may be used as =
foundation but must be adopted to IP encapsulation. As for choice of =
terms, =E2=80=9Cconnectivity verification=E2=80=9D vs. =E2=80=9Ccontinuity=
 check=E2=80=9D, &nbsp;in RFC 5885 it may be debatable whether it is CV, =
considering possible use of ICMP and/or LSP ping, or only =
CC.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">[=E2=80=A6]<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP =
provides CC through use of BFD<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">Greg&gt;MPLS-TP provides CV through use of BFD and =
extension&nbsp; to provide Source ID.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin]: Besides =
using BFD, is there any other way to provide CC or =
CV?<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">GIM&gt;&gt; I =
think of CV as optional mode that may be realized with the help of CC =
mechanism. Thus, in addition to Loss of Continuity defect, there must be =
definition of Mis-connection defect. It could be BFD, CCM/ETH-CC or else =
(though not sure whether there=E2=80=99s anything =
=E2=80=9Celse=E2=80=9D).<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">[Qin] Yes, CC and =
CV can be complementary. We need to generalize these terms and apply =
them to various technologies.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin:=
 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nb=
sp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: solid none =
none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; =
padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>OPSAWG [<a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org</a>]<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span></span></b>Qin =
Wu<br><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span>:=
</b><span class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>2014<span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E5=B9=B4</span>6<span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=9C=88</span>25<sp=
an lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=97=A5</span><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>16:06<br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">time@ietf.org</a>;<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: =
underline;">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</a><br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>[OPSAWG] Strong Technology =
Dependency<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in =
0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span>&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Hi, =
Mohamed:<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Thanks for details =
review to problem statement draft<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);"><a =
href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00" =
style=3D"color: purple; text-decoration: =
underline;">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00<=
/a><o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">and update I sent =
to you.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Regarding strong =
technology dependency issue,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">Section =
4.2 gives an address scheme&nbsp; example to explain why the existing =
OAM mechanism has strong<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: =
0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Technology as follows:<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin:=
 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: =
Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">=E2=80=9C<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: 'Courier New';">Addressing =
scheme is a good example for an issue<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: =
'Courier New';">that has a high price for being non-generic.&nbsp; Ping =
of IPv4 and IPv6<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: 'Courier New';">looks different =
in the addressing scheme as well in the ICMP<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-family: =
'Courier New';">indication field, but they have the same OAM =
functionalities.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">=E2=80=9D<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">You asked to =
clarify the exact point of this paragraph.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">I think what this paragraph said =
is<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">For IP ping, IPv4 =
Ping protocol [RFC792] and IPv6 ping protocol [RFC4443] use different IP =
technology but share the same OAM function.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">But I agree with =
you address scheme is not a typical example for strong technology =
dependency.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">I think the =
typical example is ICMP, LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different =
network technology but share the same OAM<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">functionality, i.e., Path Discovery.&nbsp; Another example is =
ICMP,BFD,LSP Ping and MPLS-TP OAM are using different network technology =
but share<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">the same =
functionality, i.e., continuity check. =
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">The following =
figure shows common OAM functionalities shared by various existing OAM =
protocols.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; =
font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |Continuity |&nbsp; =
Connectivity|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Path&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
Performance|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp; Check&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; Verification|&nbsp; =
Discovery&nbsp;&nbsp; | Monitoring |<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; =
font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | ICMP&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; Echo(Ping) |&nbsp; Traceroute&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; =
font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
BFD&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; BFD Echo&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|<o:p></=
o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: =
left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; | Control&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; =
font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
LSP&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | - Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | Ping&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp; Ping&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp; =
Traceroute&nbsp; | - Packet&nbsp;&nbsp; |<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; =
font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | IPPM&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; =
font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | =
MPLS-TP|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
&nbsp;&nbsp;|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; | OAM&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
CC&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; =
CV&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp; =
Traceroute&nbsp; | -Delay&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; | -Packet&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; |<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; =
|&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp; |&nbsp;&nbsp; Loss&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; =
|<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 12pt; font-family: =
SimSun;">&nbsp;&nbsp; =
+--------+-----------+--------------+--------------+------------+<o:p></o:=
p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: =
justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span =
style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">Hope this clarifies.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, =
73, 125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, =
125);">&nbsp;</span></div><div><div style=3D"border-style: solid none =
none; border-top-color: rgb(181, 196, 223); border-top-width: 1pt; =
padding: 3pt 0in 0in;"><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size: 10pt; =
font-family: SimSun;">=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span></b><b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;">:</span></b><span =
style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: SimSun;"><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: underline;">mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</a><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>[<a =
href=3D"mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com" style=3D"color: purple; =
text-decoration: =
underline;">mailto:mohamed.boucadair@orange.com</a>]<span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span><br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>2014<span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E5=B9=B4</span>6<span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=9C=88</span>24<sp=
an lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=97=A5</span><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>22:13<br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>Qin Wu<br><b><span =
lang=3D"ZH-CN">=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98</span>:</b><span =
class=3D"Apple-converted-space">&nbsp;</span>RE: Unified oam BOF =
proposal request in IETF 90<o:p></o:p></span></div></div></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: left; font-size: 10.5pt; =
font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span>&nbsp;</span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Hi =
Qin,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; =
color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; =
color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Please find attached a first set of =
comments.<o:p></o:p></span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; =
text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; =
color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">&nbsp;</span></div><div style=3D"margin: 0in 0in =
0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: 10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, =
sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; =
color: rgb(0, 51, 0);">Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></div><div =
style=3D"margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; text-align: justify; font-size: =
10.5pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif;"><span style=3D"font-size: =
10pt; font-family: 'Courier New'; color: rgb(0, 51, =
0);">Med<o:p></o:p></span></div></div>____________________________________=
___________<br>Time mailing list<br><a =
href=3D"mailto:Time@ietf.org">Time@ietf.org</a><br>https://www.ietf.org/ma=
ilman/listinfo/time</div></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>=

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From: Ulrich Herberg <ulrich@herberg.name>
To: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich)" <mehmet.ersue@nsn.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] Review of draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-01
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Hi Mehmet,

I finally got to reading your response, and I appreciate having
addressed all my comments. I am looking forward to see the new
revision.

Regards
Ulrich

On Tue, Jun 24, 2014 at 2:56 AM, Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich)
<mehmet.ersue@nsn.com> wrote:
> Hi Ulrich,
>
>
>
> sorry for the delay. Thank You for your valuable comments.
>
>
>
> Please find below a few answers to your questions on
> draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-01.
>
> I hope we can converge as it costs some time to discuss so many comments.
> Please ignore those where you accept my response.
>
> We are going to update the draft now along these lines.
>
>
>
>
>
> 1) 2.  Access Technologies
>
> UH> The abstract of this document states "This document discusses the use
> cases concerning the management of networks, where constrained devices ar=
e
> involved."
>
> How is this section 2 related to the use cases? What is the purpose of th=
is
> section?
>
> ME: We think this section is useful as an introduction to the technologie=
s
> mentioned in this draft.
>
>
>
> 2) 2.2.  Mobile Access Technologies
>
> UH> Why is mobile access technologies a different classification from
> constrained access technologies? First, I would say that the access
> technology itself (e.g., 802.15.4) is not mobile, it's the devices that a=
re
> mobile. Are these two sets distinct, i.e., is a device either mobile or
> constrained? Most likely it could be in both. Also, how is the mobility
> relevant? I understand that a dynamic topology can have an impact on
> management, but dynamicity can be caused by other factors than mobility,
> e.g., because of fluctuation of link quality.
>
> ME: Assumedly we both read something else under =E2=80=9CMobile Access
> Technologies=E2=80=9D. While I think on 3G and 4G at the first place, you=
 probably
> think on any access that allows some form of mobility. May be the title
> "Cellular Access Technologies" would be more appropriate.
>
>
>
> 3) 3.  Use Cases
>
> UH> Maybe add a sentence that it is not claimed that this is a complete
> list. There could be more use cases unknown to the WG.
>
> ME: Agree. Also change in the Abstract and the Introduction: s/the use
> cases/use cases/
>
>
>
> 4) 3.1.  Environmental Monitoring
>
> UH> What about monitoring? That seems also important in this use case.
>
> ME: This section particularly talks about monitoring.
>
>
>
> 5) Since these monitoring applications must be designed to tolerate a num=
ber
> of failures, the time scale for detecting and recording failures is for s=
ome
> of these applications likely measured in hours and repairs might easily t=
ake
> days.
>
> UH> Are we talking about "hardware" failures? I assume that in such
> scenarios, it may not be cost-effective (or in case of a natural disaster=
,
> not feasible) to repair the devices. If there are enough devices deployed=
, a
> defective device could just be left without being repaired. That also mea=
ns
> that the topology is created fully autonomously.
>
> ME: Any kind of failures. We also don=E2=80=99t recommend repairing such =
devices.
>
>
>
> 6) However, for certain environmental monitoring applications, much tight=
er
> time scales may exist and might be enforced by regulations (e.g., monitor=
ing
> of nuclear radiation).
>
> UH> In this text, and in general for the draft, maybe more explanations
> could be provided for each use case why classic Internet management is no=
t
> possible, e.g., why can't I just use SNMP/Netconf in this case?
>
> ME: This is discussed in ProbState draft. It can be mentioned here though=
.
> We think that we should focus on describing use cases and avoid discussin=
g
> all possible options per use case.
>
>
>
> 7) As such, the network in use might be based on a combination of fixed a=
nd
> wireless technologies,  which use robust networking equipment and support
> reliable communication.
>
> UH> If wireless technologies are used, how can robustness and reliable
> communication be guaranteed?
>
> ME/JS: Robust in a sense that the equipment is not affected by the
> environment. We think it is about 'reliability'. For sure with an inheren=
tly
> unreliable link, you can only achieve a certain level of reliability.
> However the text does not say 'guarantee', this is something you added.
>
> Reliable communication can be achieved via application layer transactions=
.
>
>
>
> 8) Devices that have energy management capability are defined as Energy
> Devices
>
> UH> Where is that defined? In the eman-framework draft?
>
> ME:  This has been defined in an early EMAN I-D and later got removed. It=
 is
> mentioned in RFC 6988 but not in draft-ietf-eman-framework. Perhaps we ca=
n
> use =E2=80=9Cdevices in the context of energy management=E2=80=9D.
>
>
>
> 9) It is assumed that Energy Management will apply to a large range of
> devices of all classes and networks topologies.
>
> UH> assumed by whom?
>
> ME: It is a general assumption of the editors. Change to: "it is generall=
y
> assumed"
>
>
>
> 10) . . . Specific energy management applications or network islands use
> their own management mechanisms.
>
> UH> This above text is well written and informative. But it is quite
> detailed about properties of energy management systems (could be shorted)=
,
> but does not talk much about management.
>
> ME: Agree, that it could be shortened.
>
>
>
> 11) 3.5.  Medical Applications
>
> UH> Again, there is little text about specific management requirements (a=
nd
> why classic management tools cannot be used). This text only mentions
> privacy and fault detection. There are many more aspects (see my previous
> comment above). Would it be helpful to have a more systematic approach
> throughout the draft? e.g., a list of management properties that each use
> case lists and discusses? (e.g., - delay: this use case has no specific
> delay requirements - fault tolerance: this use case... etc.)
>
>
>
> ME/JS: Such an approach might actually make sense but is also a lot of wo=
rk.
> On the other hand, this would likely be more informative than the long li=
st
> of requirements we have in the other I-D (and then we would be back to
> square one, merging the two documents at the end).
>
>
>
> 12) A building network can be composed of subnets, where a subnet covers =
a
> floor, an area on the floor, or a given functionality (e.g., security
> cameras).
>
> UH> I would be careful using the word subnet. Is this used as the IP subn=
et
> (i.e., IP prefix)?
>
> ME: I think the text is self-explanatory on its level. We can replace
> subnets with "network segments" (but then this might sound too
>
> layer two specific). Though we prefer network segments.
>
>
>
> 13) This leads to the need that some components and subsystems operate in
> constrained conditions and are separately certified.
>
> UH> I don't understand the meaning of the previous sentence.
>
>
>
> ME: I don=E2=80=99t know anymore who wrote this section but it could be p=
robably
> reworded as:
>
> =E2=80=9CThis leads to the need to certify components and subsystems oper=
ating in
> such constrained conditions based on specific requirements.=E2=80=9D
>
>
>
> 14) In the first case, there is a broader range of
>
>    possible solutions, which can be planned for the infrastructure of
>
>    the building.  In the second case the solution needs to be deployed
>
>    over an existing structure taking into account factors like existing
>
>    wiring, distance limitations, the propagation of radio signals over
>
>    walls and floors.  As a result, some of the existing WLAN solutions
>
>    (e.g., IEEE 802.11 or IEEE 802.15) may be deployed.
>
> UH> What is the relevance of the two cases? Even in the first case of a
> newly designed building, WLAN solutions may be deployed.
>
> ME: s/ structure / infra-structure /
>
> The issues in the second case, where an existing infra-structure existing
> wiring, distance limitations, etc. makes the deployment difficult.
>
>
>
> 15) During installation, the setting of parameters to common values to
> enable interoperability may occur (e.g., Trickle parameter values).
>
> UH> This needs more explanation how Trickle is used here (I am not sure i=
t
> is relevant here, but if so, needs to be explained).
>
> UH> Isn't installation a short, one-time occurrence compared to the long
> life-time of the network? Why is this relevant for the use case?
>
> ME: s/ to enable interoperability may occur (e.g., Trickle parameter
> values)./ to enable interoperability may be required./
>
>
>
> 16) UH> See previous comments for other use cases; there is not much text
> about management, and no systematic analysis regarding different manageme=
nt
> properties.
>
> ME: We will try to address this.
>
>
>
> 17) However, unlike a building automation system, the infrastructure in a
> home is operated in a considerably more ad-hoc manner, with no centralize=
d
> management system akin to a Building Automation System (BAS) available.
>
> UH> It depends. There are commercial systems available on the market with=
 a
> centralized controller (e.g., Lowes Iris). Often, cloud-based controllers
> are used as well.
>
> ME/JS/AS: Needs a rewording. However, this is an evolving market compared=
 to
> building automation. And yes, it is likely outsourced and cloud based whi=
le
> adoption of such an approach for classic building automation is likely mu=
ch
> slower because of more complicated legal and responsibility issues.
>
> It seems that home automation infrastructures are now deployed in a more
> ad-hoc manner, but most likely managed by a central management server
> (either at home or in the cloud).
>
>
>
> 18) Management responsibility typically rests within the organization
> running the transport application.
>
> UH> Who is that? Which transport application? In the example of an in-car
> network, I assume there is a variety of different sensors communicating w=
ith
> a variety of different servers and operators (e.g., safety sensors
> communicate with emergency services, entertainment devices with streaming=
 /
> content providers
>
> ME/JS: Transport systems and transport applications have been described a=
t
> the beginning of the section. In-car network is only a specifc part of it=
.
>
> In general Transport Applications need an IT infrastructure to run on e.g=
.
> in a train, bus or metro. We need to clarify this.
>
>
>
> 19) Scenarios consisting of vehicle-to-vehicle ad-hoc networks, a wired
> backbone with wireless last hops,
>
> UH> What is a "last hop"?
>
> ME/JS/AS: Change to "Scenarios consisting of vehicle-to-vehicle ad-hoc
> networks, which use a wired backbone with wireless access to vehicles."
>
>
>
> 20) it would be important for a NMS to be able to function with different
> architectures, since different manufacturers might have their own
> proprietary systems.
>
> UH> What kind of architectures? Do you mean management protocols?
>
> ME: s/ might have their own proprietary systems / might have their own
> proprietary systems relying on a specific Management Topology Option as
> described in [COM-REQ]./
>
>
>
> 21) Unlike some mobile networks, most vehicular networks are expected to
> have specific patterns in the mobility of the nodes.  Such patterns could
> possibly be exploited, managed and monitored by the NMS.
>
> UH> How so? Why?
>
> ME/JS: We can change: =E2=80=9Cmobile networks=E2=80=9D to =E2=80=9Cgener=
al cellular networks=E2=80=9D and
> if needed add "(people commuting to work)".
>
> You have a point that cell phones also have these patterns but likely mor=
e
> noise, since people also move without cars.
>
>
>
> 22) Constant changes in topology must also be contended with.
>
> UH> Is that the task of the NMS? Or rather the routing protocol?
>
> ME/JS: Constantly changing topology is an issue since topology needs to b=
e
> tracked in order to do management.
>
>
>
> 23) Auto-configuration of nodes in a vehicular network remains a challeng=
e
> since based on location, and access network, the vehicle might have
> different configurations that must be obtained from its management system=
.
>
> UH> Are we talking about auto-configuration of IP addresses? That was not
> addresses in any of the other use cases, and is a different (although ind=
eed
> challenging) kind of management (pre-deployment vs management during
> operation), likely not involving an NMS.
>
>
>
> ME: The text does not say anything on IP addresses. This is configuration=
 on
> application level. It could be reworded as =E2=80=9Cautimatic configurati=
on=E2=80=9D.
>
>
>
> 24) 5.  Security Considerations
>
> UH> This is a short section. Would be good to talk to someone from the SE=
C
> directorate ahead of a WGLC, to make sure this is sufficient.
>
> ME: The draft is Informational. We will seek for feedback on how to exten=
d
> the current section during WGLC.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
> Mehmet
>
>
>
> From: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of ext Ulrich
> Herberg
> Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2014 12:57 PM
> To: opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: [OPSAWG] Review of draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-01
>
>
>
> Hello,
>
> I have reviewed the draft in the subject (see attachment). It is interest=
ing
> to read and provides insights into management of constrained devices. Aga=
in,
> I am glad to see that the COMAN work has found a home in OPSAWG.
>
> I believe the draft needs some more work. I understand that the different
> sections have been written by different contributors, and each of them is
> very interesting to read. However, the draft would benefit from having th=
e
> editors unify the description of management properties and challenges. Ea=
ch
> use case picks a few different properties for management of the use case
> (e.g., acceptable delay, privacy etc). Maybe it would be beneficial to ag=
ree
> on a list of properties that each of the use cases must discuss. Also, it
> would be helpful for each use case to understand why we can't just use
> SMTP/Netconf.
>
> Use cases 3.8 and 3.9 seem redundant.
>
>
>
> Best regards
> Ulrich


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From: Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>
To: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Issue of OAM information Information gathering Gathering from Service Function
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Date: Thu, 3 Jul 2014 07:59:42 +0000
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--_000_7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B7E62A9eusaamb103erics_--


From nobody Thu Jul  3 17:15:37 2014
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From: Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>
To: "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
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Subject: [OPSAWG] Draft cutoff...
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Hi all,

Just a reminder that the draft cutoff is July 4th at 23:59UTC.

A number of folk indicated that they would like to rev their documents
before the coming meeting -- quick, fast like a bunny!

W


From nobody Fri Jul  4 01:07:03 2014
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From: Jiangyuanlong <jiangyuanlong@huawei.com>
To: "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: NFV data modeling
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From nobody Fri Jul  4 07:43:04 2014
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Subject: [OPSAWG] I-D Action: draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
 This draft is a work item of the Operations and Management Area Working Group Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : Management Information Base for Virtual Machines Controlled by a Hypervisor
        Authors         : Hirochika Asai
                          Michael MacFaden
                          Juergen Schoenwaelder
                          Keiichi Shima
                          Tina Tsou
	Filename        : draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01.txt
	Pages           : 56
	Date            : 2014-07-04

Abstract:
   This document defines a portion of the Management Information Base
   (MIB) for use with network management protocols in the Internet
   community.  In particular, this specifies objects for managing
   virtual machines controlled by a hypervisor (a.k.a. virtual machine
   monitor).


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01

A diff from the previous version is available at:
http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Fri Jul  4 07:50:38 2014
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Dear all,

Thanks to comments through the mailing list on the read-write objects in =
the MIB,
we have uploaded the new version of <draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib>.

The differences are derived from the discussion on this mailing list:
1) Replace the read-write MAX-ACCESS with the read-only MAX-ACCESS
  except for vmPerVMNotificationsEnabled and vmBulkNotificationsEnabled.
2) Add description stating "Changes to this object MUST NOT persist =
across
   re-initialization of the management system, e.g., SNMP agent." to =
these two
   read-write objects for clarification.

The security consideration is fixed according to these changes.  Some =
unclear
descriptions are also modified.

Thank you.
Hirochika


Begin forwarded message:

> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
> Subject: [OPSAWG] I-D Action: draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01.txt
> Date: July 4, 2014 11:43:01 PM GMT+09:00
> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
> Cc: opsawg@ietf.org
>=20
>=20
> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts =
directories.
> This draft is a work item of the Operations and Management Area =
Working Group Working Group of the IETF.
>=20
>        Title           : Management Information Base for Virtual =
Machines Controlled by a Hypervisor
>        Authors         : Hirochika Asai
>                          Michael MacFaden
>                          Juergen Schoenwaelder
>                          Keiichi Shima
>                          Tina Tsou
> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01.txt
> 	Pages           : 56
> 	Date            : 2014-07-04
>=20
> Abstract:
>   This document defines a portion of the Management Information Base
>   (MIB) for use with network management protocols in the Internet
>   community.  In particular, this specifies objects for managing
>   virtual machines controlled by a hypervisor (a.k.a. virtual machine
>   monitor).
>=20
>=20
> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib/
>=20
> There's also a htmlized version available at:
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01
>=20
> A diff from the previous version is available at:
> http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01
>=20
>=20
> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of =
submission
> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>=20
> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> OPSAWG mailing list
> OPSAWG@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg

--=20
Hirochika Asai <panda@hongo.wide.ad.jp>, The University of Tokyo


From nobody Fri Jul  4 09:58:27 2014
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Hi,

I think there is an undocumented security vulnerability.
Because we REQUIRE the read-write objects to not persist across reboots, =
an undetected reboot of the SNMP system shuts off notifications.
If an operator turns on notifications via the enable objects in this =
module, they presumably want to be told of certain events that might =
occur.
If notifications are used to report security issues, an attacker that =
can somehow cause the system to restart will disable notifications, =
presumably including those that warn an operator of an attack.
(as well as those that warn an operator of an undesirable operational =
state, such as interface down).
I think that=92s a problem.

I also question the use of MUST NOT persist.
How does an implementation allowing the enable setting to persist break =
the protocol or the managed entity?
I think an appropriate RFC2119 usage would be =93implementations MAY =
choose to not persist the values.=94

dbh

On Jul 4, 2014, at 10:50 AM, Hirochika Asai <panda@hongo.wide.ad.jp> =
wrote:

> Dear all,
>=20
> Thanks to comments through the mailing list on the read-write objects =
in the MIB,
> we have uploaded the new version of <draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib>.
>=20
> The differences are derived from the discussion on this mailing list:
> 1) Replace the read-write MAX-ACCESS with the read-only MAX-ACCESS
> except for vmPerVMNotificationsEnabled and vmBulkNotificationsEnabled.
> 2) Add description stating "Changes to this object MUST NOT persist =
across
>  re-initialization of the management system, e.g., SNMP agent." to =
these two
>  read-write objects for clarification.
>=20
> The security consideration is fixed according to these changes.  Some =
unclear
> descriptions are also modified.
>=20
> Thank you.
> Hirochika
>=20
>=20
> Begin forwarded message:
>=20
>> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
>> Subject: [OPSAWG] I-D Action: draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01.txt
>> Date: July 4, 2014 11:43:01 PM GMT+09:00
>> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
>> Cc: opsawg@ietf.org
>>=20
>>=20
>> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts =
directories.
>> This draft is a work item of the Operations and Management Area =
Working Group Working Group of the IETF.
>>=20
>>      Title           : Management Information Base for Virtual =
Machines Controlled by a Hypervisor
>>      Authors         : Hirochika Asai
>>                        Michael MacFaden
>>                        Juergen Schoenwaelder
>>                        Keiichi Shima
>>                        Tina Tsou
>> 	Filename        : draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01.txt
>> 	Pages           : 56
>> 	Date            : 2014-07-04
>>=20
>> Abstract:
>> This document defines a portion of the Management Information Base
>> (MIB) for use with network management protocols in the Internet
>> community.  In particular, this specifies objects for managing
>> virtual machines controlled by a hypervisor (a.k.a. virtual machine
>> monitor).
>>=20
>>=20
>> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
>> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib/
>>=20
>> There's also a htmlized version available at:
>> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01
>>=20
>> A diff from the previous version is available at:
>> http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01
>>=20
>>=20
>> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of =
submission
>> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.
>>=20
>> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
>> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
>> OPSAWG mailing list
>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>=20
> --=20
> Hirochika Asai <panda@hongo.wide.ad.jp>, The University of Tokyo
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> OPSAWG mailing list
> OPSAWG@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg


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dbh writes:
> I think there is an undocumented security vulnerability.
> Because we REQUIRE the read-write objects to not persist across reboots, =
an
> undetected reboot of the SNMP system shuts off notifications.
> If an operator turns on notifications via the enable objects in this modu=
le,
> they presumably want to be told of certain events that might occur.
> If notifications are used to report security issues, an attacker that can
> somehow cause the system to restart will disable notifications, presumabl=
y
> including those that warn an operator of an attack.
> (as well as those that warn an operator of an undesirable operational sta=
te,
> such as interface down).
> I think that=E2=80=99s a problem.
>=20
> I also question the use of MUST NOT persist.
> How does an implementation allowing the enable setting to persist break t=
he
> protocol or the managed entity?
> I think an appropriate RFC2119 usage would be =E2=80=9Cimplementations MA=
Y choose to
> not persist the values.=E2=80=9D

Implementations that support SET for these objects can store the values
in transient storage such that a restart of the agent itself does not=20
lose the configuration. One example implementation would be
writing the state to ramdisk which would persist across system reboot.
As usual sets can be complex to get right and its difficult to understand
what a mib module is telling you to do here.
Maybe some guidance on that point would be useful in the discussion.

Regarding notification state on/of and it being security issue, this isn't
only an issue in this mib module I think. Its common place problem with
with event/push only designs. We  could add text to explain that
any design that is 100% reliant  on notifications as the sole means=20
of maintaining distributed state is a failed design to begin with.=20
notification only designs must be bounded either by poll or reverse poll/pe=
riodic
event to detect a failure to receive notifications regardless of what cause=
d
the failure.

Cheers,
Mike MacFaden


From nobody Fri Jul  4 10:45:28 2014
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From: Michael MacFaden <mrm@vmware.com>
To: David Harrington <ietfdbh@comcast.net>
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One correction, left out the 'not', sorry to confuse:
line should have read:

  One example implementation would be writing the state to ramdisk 
  which would not persist across system reboot.

Mike


From nobody Fri Jul  4 12:09:00 2014
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From: "Black, David" <david.black@emc.com>
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Date: Fri, 4 Jul 2014 15:08:11 -0400
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
 This draft is a work item of the Operations and Management Area Working Group Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Problem Statement and Requirements
        Authors         : Mehmet Ersue
                          Dan Romascanu
                          Juergen Schoenwaelder
	Filename        : draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02.txt
	Pages           : 45
	Date            : 2014-07-04

Abstract:
   This document provides a problem statement, deployment and management
   topology options as well as the requirements for the management of
   networks where constrained devices are involved.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02

A diff from the previous version is available at:
http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
 This draft is a work item of the Operations and Management Area Working Group Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Use Cases
        Authors         : Mehmet Ersue
                          Dan Romascanu
                          Juergen Schoenwaelder
                          Anuj Sehgal
	Filename        : draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-02.txt
	Pages           : 25
	Date            : 2014-07-04

Abstract:
   This document discusses use cases concerning the management of
   networks, where constrained devices are involved.  A problem
   statement, deployment options and the requirements on the networks
   with constrained devices can be found in the companion document on
   "Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Problem Statement
   and Requirements".


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases/

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From: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich)" <mehmet.ersue@nsn.com>
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Dear OPSAWG Chairs,

we submitted v02 of the Coman drafts.

As discussed in IETF #89, the authors think that the two documents are read=
y for WGLC.
Please consider to start the WGLC procedure. Thank you.

Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Problem Statement and Requ=
irements
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02

Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Use Cases
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-02

Regards,
Mehmet




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1">
<meta name=3D"Generator" content=3D"Microsoft Exchange Server">
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<font face=3D"Consolas" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;">
<div>Dear OPSAWG Chairs,</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>we submitted v02 of the Coman drafts.</div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;">&nbs=
p;</span></font></div>
<div>As discussed in IETF #89, the authors think that the two documents are=
 ready for WGLC.</div>
<div>Please consider to start the WGLC procedure. Thank you.</div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Problem Statement and=
 Requirements</div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;"><a h=
ref=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02=
"><font face=3D"Consolas" size=3D"2" color=3D"blue"><span style=3D"font-siz=
e:10.5pt;"><u>http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-=
reqs-0</u></span></font><font face=3D"Consolas" size=3D"2" color=3D"blue"><=
span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;"><u>2</u></span></font></a><font face=3D"Co=
nsolas" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;">
</span></font></span></font></div>
<div>&nbsp;</div>
<div>Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Use Cases</div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;"><a h=
ref=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-02"><fo=
nt face=3D"Consolas" size=3D"2" color=3D"blue"><span style=3D"font-size:10.=
5pt;"><u>http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-0</u>=
</span></font><font face=3D"Consolas" size=3D"2" color=3D"blue"><span style=
=3D"font-size:10.5pt;"><u>2</u></span></font></a><font face=3D"Consolas" si=
ze=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;">
</span></font></span></font></div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"2" color=3D"#0000CC"><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:11pt;">&nbsp;</span></font></div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"2" color=3D"#0000CC"><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:11pt;">Regards,
<br>

Mehmet </span></font></div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"2" color=3D"#0000CC"><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:11pt;">&nbsp;</span></font></div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;">&nbs=
p;</span></font></div>
<div><font face=3D"Calibri" size=3D"2"><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;">&nbs=
p;</span></font></div>
</span></font>
</body>
</html>

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On Fri, Jul 04, 2014 at 11:50:29PM +0900, Hirochika Asai wrote:
> 
> The security consideration is fixed according to these changes.  Some unclear
> descriptions are also modified.
> 

I read this in the security considerations:

   When SNMPv3 strong security is not used, these objects
   should have access of read-only, not read-write.

There is a access mode that is implemented and then there is an access
policy that is runtime configured in VACM. What does this allude to?
I assume the most sensible interpretation is that this sentence tries
to give advice to the security administrator configuring VACM but then
this sentence should be more explicit, e.g.:

   When SNMPv3 strong security is not used, the access control model
   (e.g., the View-based Access Control Model [RFC3415]) should be
   configured to disallow write access.

And perhaps add:

   It is recommended that default access control configurations
   shipped with an implementation exclude write access to these
   objects.

/js

PS: From an SMIv2 perspective, it is odd that the MAX-ACCESS of some
    of the objects has been changed from read-write to read-only but
    it seems the "political climate" overrules what MAX-ACCESS used to
    mean in STD 58.

-- 
Juergen Schoenwaelder           Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH
Phone: +49 421 200 3587         Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany
Fax:   +49 421 200 3103         <http://www.jacobs-university.de/>


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Date: Sun, 06 Jul 2014 13:16:05 -0400
From: Tom Taylor <tom.taylor.stds@gmail.com>
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Subject: [OPSAWG] draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-00
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I submitted this draft to put a stake in the ground. Comments welcome. 
I'll be bugging people to find out whether the RFC 4663 plan worked or 
has had to be modified in practice.

Tom Taylor

Title:

MIBs Passed From the IETF To IEEE 802.3 and Currently Documented In IEEE 
802.3.1-2013

Abstract:

    This document records the transfer of ownership of a number of MIBs
    relating to ethernet, from the IETF to IEEE 802.3.  Like RFC 4663, it
    describes the procedures associated with the transfer.  Unlike RFC
    4663, this documentation is retrospective in nature, since the
    transfer happened several years ago.  Deviations from the planned
    procedures described in RFC 4663 are noted for historical interest
    [in a later version of this draft - PTT].


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s/MIBs/MIB modules/g

And I would not have mind if the names of the IETF MIB modules
affected would have been listed in the abstract.

/js

On Sun, Jul 06, 2014 at 01:16:05PM -0400, Tom Taylor wrote:
> I submitted this draft to put a stake in the ground. Comments welcome. 
> I'll be bugging people to find out whether the RFC 4663 plan worked or 
> has had to be modified in practice.
> 
> Tom Taylor
> 
> Title:
> 
> MIBs Passed From the IETF To IEEE 802.3 and Currently Documented In IEEE 
> 802.3.1-2013
> 
> Abstract:
> 
>    This document records the transfer of ownership of a number of MIBs
>    relating to ethernet, from the IETF to IEEE 802.3.  Like RFC 4663, it
>    describes the procedures associated with the transfer.  Unlike RFC
>    4663, this documentation is retrospective in nature, since the
>    transfer happened several years ago.  Deviations from the planned
>    procedures described in RFC 4663 are noted for historical interest
>    [in a later version of this draft - PTT].
> 
> _______________________________________________
> OPSAWG mailing list
> OPSAWG@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg

-- 
Juergen Schoenwaelder           Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH
Phone: +49 421 200 3587         Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany
Fax:   +49 421 200 3103         <http://www.jacobs-university.de/>


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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Hi, Tissa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">There are many options for SFC OAM, BFD extension, Generic Header=
 extension, Generic TLV extension.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Unlike other existing OAM protocols, mechanisms and tools, SFC ne=
ed to address OAM for the technology that is above layer 3.<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">SFC haven=A1=AFt developed OAM protocol yet at the top of layer 3=
.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Before they developing OAM protocol, they need to figure out whet=
her they need to develop technology dependent OAM protocol,<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Or technology independent OAM protocol since SFC OAM and Overlay =
OAM share a lot of similarities(e.g., both can use overlay technology to st=
itch a set of overlay node or service
 node to form the end to end path). Why not build one protocol to support b=
oth?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">That=A1=AFs why we bring up transport independent OAM covering va=
rious heterogeneous network technologies and propose to consolidate OAM in =
both<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Management plane and data plane.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.or=
g/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-02">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft=
-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-02</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.or=
g/html/draft-king-opsawg-time-multi-layer-oam-use-case-01.txt">http://tools=
.ietf.org/html/draft-king-opsawg-time-multi-layer-oam-use-case-01.txt</a><o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Regarding flow-entropy, why not reuse entropy mechanisms in the e=
xisting underlying transport. How is flow entropy different from ECMP choic=
e you proposed in the draft.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">If my understanding is correct, IEEE 802.1ag only support Equal C=
ost Tree (ECT) mechanism instead of ECMP, IEEE802.1Qbp support ECMP,<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Are you proposing to combine ECT supported by IEEE 802.1ag with E=
CMP supported by IEEE 802.1Qbp and use them together at the same time in th=
e same network?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Also BFD and IEEE 802.1ag CFM share a lot of commonality, e.g., C=
CM-interval, BFD interval. If we integrate them together, we really need to=
 think about how to integrate them together
 in the management plane. Is there any common component we can define for b=
oth? How we define these component and make them more extensible.<o:p></o:p=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=
=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> Tissa S=
enevirathne (tsenevir) [mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com]
<br>
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=
=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-=
US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> 2014</span><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=C4=EA<span lang=3D"EN-U=
S">6</span>=D4=C2<span lang=3D"EN-US">30</span>=C8=D5<span lang=3D"EN-US">
 0:20<br>
</span><b>=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"=
EN-US"> Qin Wu; time@ietf.org<br>
</span><b>=B3=AD=CB=CD<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> netmod@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; trill@ietf.org; l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ie=
tf.org<br>
</span><b>=D6=F7=CC=E2<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Qin<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">There a=
re several way this is applicable to SFC<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 leve=
l1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">=
<span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New=
 Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"=
>SFC is underlayer independent , which means it can have all sorts of encap=
 types underneath, the model presented in tissa-netmod-oam, address exactly=
 that issue. Instead of re-inventing
 and re-implementing various different OAM the draft propose to integrate t=
hem at the management layer.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 leve=
l1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">=
<span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New=
 Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"=
>In this draft we define a flow-entropy as an opaque element that each of t=
he technology type can specify and include. If we look at draft-quinn-sfc-n=
sh-02.txt, it define a block that specifies
 SFC. SFC version of YANG &nbsp;can specify this as part of its flow entrop=
y. The beauty is that it is all up to the technology to specify that (size =
and shape is technology dependent) and base model is still intact.<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">With th=
e above in mind , can you please review draft-tissa-netmod-oam and see it i=
s flexible and extensible enough to for the purpose. If things are missing =
we can add and extend.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have =
requested netmod WG chairs for a presentation slot for further discussion o=
f the draft. &nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;"> Qin Wu [<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">mailto:=
bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 10, 2014 9:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir); <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">=
time@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">
nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">
l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><=
br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Hi, Tissa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Thanks for initiating discussion on this topic.<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Unified OAM for multi-Layer network is a good idea to me.<o:p></o=
:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00 we proposed in opsawg laid out=
 the an initial description of the problem.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">The question to</span><span lang=3D"EN-US">
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">draft-=
tissa-netmod-oam is<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">I am wondering how this generic Yang Model can be applied to SFC =
environment?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">How do you support the case where two endpoints support different=
 layer OAM or doesn=A1=AFt support any OAM at that layer.<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">BTW: I have cc=A1=AFed time mailing list since I believe this mai=
ling list is purposed to look for generic and integrated OAM covering vario=
us heterogeneous networking technologies.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=
=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> netmod =
[<a href=3D"mailto:netmod-bounces@ietf.org">mailto:netmod-bounces@ietf.org<=
/a>]
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B4=FA=
=B1=ED </span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-famil=
y:=CB=CE=CC=E5">Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=
=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-=
US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> 2014</span><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=C4=EA<span lang=3D"EN-U=
S">6</span>=D4=C2<span lang=3D"EN-US">11</span>=C8=D5<span lang=3D"EN-US">
 3:03<br>
</span><b>=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"=
EN-US"> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">
netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">
trill@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <=
a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
</span><b>=D6=F7=CC=E2<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> [netmod] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">All<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">We have published YANG model fo=
r OAM. #1 draft below place the generic framework for OAM, that can be augm=
ented for different technologies. #2 and #3 are application of the concept =
to NVO3 and TRILL,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 leve=
l1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span style=3D"mso-list:=
Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://datat=
racker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/do=
c/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 leve=
l1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span style=3D"mso-list:=
Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://datat=
racker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org=
/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 leve=
l1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span style=3D"mso-list:=
Ignore">3.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://datat=
racker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.or=
g/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Please review and share your co=
mments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Tissa<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
</body>
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From: "Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)" <tsenevir@cisco.com>
To: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: YANG models for OAM
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Date: Tue, 8 Jul 2014 14:47:59 +0000
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References: <FBEA3E19AA24F847BA3AE74E2FE193562EE91CDA@xmb-rcd-x08.cisco.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA84549D17@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com> <FBEA3E19AA24F847BA3AE74E2FE193562EEC1E8B@xmb-rcd-x08.cisco.com> <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA84580501@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] YANG models for OAM
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<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Qin<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">May be a point is miss=
ed here.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l2 level=
1 lfo5"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"m=
so-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Thought SFC ca=
n go up and down on layers, what controls that behavior ? Is=A1=AFnt it the=
 Service header ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l2 level=
1 lfo5"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"m=
so-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Is the OAM com=
es down to fault isolation, verification , monitoring etc for the specified=
 SH ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Like discussed before =
(many times) exact en-cap is less important what is important is to have a =
model that define OAM framework and scope. CFM to my opinion do an excellen=
t job in defining what is needed. Hence
 the choice of a similar model for the YANG Model.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">You have noted BFD and=
 CFM are similar because they have similar set of timers. That is a wrong c=
omparison. Have similar set of timers does not make two protocols the same.=
 What makes them is what framework they
 follows. &nbsp;We have used key word CFM here loosely. Though we borrow lo=
ts of concepts form CFM there are things that needed to be revisited.<o:p><=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have requested prese=
ntation slots in nvo3 and NETMOD working groups and will be going through i=
n details how each one of the technologies map to YANG model presented here=
.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> Qin Wu [=
mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 08, 2014 5:07 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir); time@ietf.org<br>
<b>Cc:</b> netmod@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; trill@ietf.org; l2vpn@ietf.org; =
opsawg@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Hi, T=
issa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">There=
 are many options for SFC OAM, BFD extension, Generic Header extension, Gen=
eric TLV extension.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Unlik=
e other existing OAM protocols, mechanisms and tools, SFC need to address O=
AM for the technology that is above layer 3.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">SFC h=
aven=A1=AFt developed OAM protocol yet at the top of layer 3.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Befor=
e they developing OAM protocol, they need to figure out whether they need t=
o develop technology dependent OAM protocol,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Or te=
chnology independent OAM protocol since SFC OAM and Overlay OAM share a lot=
 of similarities(e.g., both can use overlay technology to stitch a set of o=
verlay node or service node to form
 the end to end path). Why not build one protocol to support both?<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">That=
=A1=AFs why we bring up transport independent OAM covering various heteroge=
neous network technologies and propose to consolidate OAM in both<o:p></o:p=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Manag=
ement plane and data plane.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsaw=
g-multi-layer-oam-02">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-laye=
r-oam-02</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-king-ops=
awg-time-multi-layer-oam-use-case-01.txt">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-=
king-opsawg-time-multi-layer-oam-use-case-01.txt</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Regar=
ding flow-entropy, why not reuse entropy mechanisms in the existing underly=
ing transport. How is flow entropy different from ECMP choice you proposed =
in the draft.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">If my=
 understanding is correct, IEEE 802.1ag only support Equal Cost Tree (ECT) =
mechanism instead of ECMP, IEEE802.1Qbp support ECMP,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Are y=
ou proposing to combine ECT supported by IEEE 802.1ag with ECMP supported b=
y IEEE 802.1Qbp and use them together at the same time in the same network?=
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Also =
BFD and IEEE 802.1ag CFM share a lot of commonality, e.g., CCM-interval, BF=
D interval. If we integrate them together, we really need to think about ho=
w to integrate them together in the
 management plane. Is there any common component we can define for both? Ho=
w we define these component and make them more extensible.<o:p></o:p></span=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Regar=
ds!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">-Qin<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:SimSun">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font=
-family:SimSun"> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) [<a href=3D"mailto:tsenevir@=
cisco.com">mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com</a>]
<br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4</span>:</b> 2014<span lang=
=3D"ZH-CN">=C4=EA</span>6<span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=D4=C2</span>30<span lang=3D"=
ZH-CN">=C8=D5</span> 0:20<br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB</span>:</b> Qin Wu; <a href=3D"m=
ailto:time@ietf.org">time@ietf.org</a><br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=B3=AD=CB=CD</span>:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@i=
etf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>;
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill=
@ietf.org">
trill@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <=
a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=D6=F7=CC=E2</span>:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Qin<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">There are several way =
this is applicable to SFC<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level=
1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"m=
so-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">SFC is underla=
yer independent , which means it can have all sorts of encap types undernea=
th, the model presented in tissa-netmod-oam, address exactly that issue. In=
stead of re-inventing and re-implementing
 various different OAM the draft propose to integrate them at the managemen=
t layer.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level=
1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"m=
so-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">In this draft =
we define a flow-entropy as an opaque element that each of the technology t=
ype can specify and include. If we look at draft-quinn-sfc-nsh-02.txt, it d=
efine a block that specifies SFC.
 SFC version of YANG &nbsp;can specify this as part of its flow entropy. Th=
e beauty is that it is all up to the technology to specify that (size and s=
hape is technology dependent) and base model is still intact.<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">With the above in mind=
 , can you please review draft-tissa-netmod-oam and see it is flexible and =
extensible enough to for the purpose. If things are missing we can add and =
extend.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have requested netmo=
d WG chairs for a presentation slot for further discussion of the draft. &n=
bsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> Qin Wu [=
<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 10, 2014 9:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir); <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">=
time@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">
nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">
l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><=
br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Hi, T=
issa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Thank=
s for initiating discussion on this topic.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Unifi=
ed OAM for multi-Layer network is a good idea to me.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">draft=
-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00 we proposed in opsawg laid out the an initial=
 description of the problem.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">The q=
uestion to</span>
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">draft-tissa-netmod-oam is<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">I am =
wondering how this generic Yang Model can be applied to SFC environment?<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">How d=
o you support the case where two endpoints support different layer OAM or d=
oesn=A1=AFt support any OAM at that layer.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">BTW: =
I have cc=A1=AFed time mailing list since I believe this mailing list is pu=
rposed to look for generic and integrated OAM covering various heterogeneou=
s networking technologies.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Regar=
ds!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">-Qin<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:SimSun">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font=
-family:SimSun"> netmod [<a href=3D"mailto:netmod-bounces@ietf.org">mailto:=
netmod-bounces@ietf.org</a>]
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=B4=FA=B1=ED </span></b>Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevi=
r)<br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4</span>:</b> 2014<span lang=
=3D"ZH-CN">=C4=EA</span>6<span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=D4=C2</span>11<span lang=3D"=
ZH-CN">=C8=D5</span> 3:03<br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB</span>:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:ne=
tmod@ietf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>;
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill=
@ietf.org">
trill@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <=
a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=D6=F7=CC=E2</span>:</b> [netmod] YANG models for O=
AM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">All<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below=
 place the generic framework for OAM, that can be augmented for different t=
echnologies. #2 and #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<o:=
p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level=
1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=
=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ti=
ssa-netmod-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/</a=
><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level=
1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style=
=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ti=
ssa-nvo3-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-o=
am/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level=
1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">3.<span style=
=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ti=
ssa-trill-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang=
-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Please review and share your comments<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Tissa<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>

--_000_FBEA3E19AA24F847BA3AE74E2FE193562EEC5C77xmbrcdx08ciscoc_--


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From: "Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)" <tsenevir@cisco.com>
To: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: YANG models for OAM
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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">&#43;SFC working group=
.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> nvo3 [ma=
ilto:nvo3-bounces@ietf.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 08, 2014 7:48 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Qin Wu; time@ietf.org<br>
<b>Cc:</b> l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; netmod@ietf.org;=
 trill@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Qin<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">May be a point is miss=
ed here.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l2 level=
1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"m=
so-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Thought SFC ca=
n go up and down on layers, what controls that behavior ? Is=A1=AFnt it the=
 Service header ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l2 level=
1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"m=
so-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Is the OAM com=
es down to fault isolation, verification , monitoring etc for the specified=
 SH ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Like discussed before =
(many times) exact en-cap is less important what is important is to have a =
model that define OAM framework and scope. CFM to my opinion do an excellen=
t job in defining what is needed. Hence
 the choice of a similar model for the YANG Model.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">You have noted BFD and=
 CFM are similar because they have similar set of timers. That is a wrong c=
omparison. Have similar set of timers does not make two protocols the same.=
 What makes them is what framework they
 follows. &nbsp;We have used key word CFM here loosely. Though we borrow lo=
ts of concepts form CFM there are things that needed to be revisited.<o:p><=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have requested prese=
ntation slots in nvo3 and NETMOD working groups and will be going through i=
n details how each one of the technologies map to YANG model presented here=
.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> Qin Wu [=
<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 08, 2014 5:07 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir); <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">=
time@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">
nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">
l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><=
br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Hi, T=
issa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">There=
 are many options for SFC OAM, BFD extension, Generic Header extension, Gen=
eric TLV extension.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Unlik=
e other existing OAM protocols, mechanisms and tools, SFC need to address O=
AM for the technology that is above layer 3.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">SFC h=
aven=A1=AFt developed OAM protocol yet at the top of layer 3.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Befor=
e they developing OAM protocol, they need to figure out whether they need t=
o develop technology dependent OAM protocol,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Or te=
chnology independent OAM protocol since SFC OAM and Overlay OAM share a lot=
 of similarities(e.g., both can use overlay technology to stitch a set of o=
verlay node or service node to form
 the end to end path). Why not build one protocol to support both?<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">That=
=A1=AFs why we bring up transport independent OAM covering various heteroge=
neous network technologies and propose to consolidate OAM in both<o:p></o:p=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Manag=
ement plane and data plane.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsaw=
g-multi-layer-oam-02">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-laye=
r-oam-02</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-king-ops=
awg-time-multi-layer-oam-use-case-01.txt">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-=
king-opsawg-time-multi-layer-oam-use-case-01.txt</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Regar=
ding flow-entropy, why not reuse entropy mechanisms in the existing underly=
ing transport. How is flow entropy different from ECMP choice you proposed =
in the draft.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">If my=
 understanding is correct, IEEE 802.1ag only support Equal Cost Tree (ECT) =
mechanism instead of ECMP, IEEE802.1Qbp support ECMP,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Are y=
ou proposing to combine ECT supported by IEEE 802.1ag with ECMP supported b=
y IEEE 802.1Qbp and use them together at the same time in the same network?=
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Also =
BFD and IEEE 802.1ag CFM share a lot of commonality, e.g., CCM-interval, BF=
D interval. If we integrate them together, we really need to think about ho=
w to integrate them together in the
 management plane. Is there any common component we can define for both? Ho=
w we define these component and make them more extensible.<o:p></o:p></span=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Regar=
ds!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">-Qin<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:SimSun">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font=
-family:SimSun"> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) [<a href=3D"mailto:tsenevir@=
cisco.com">mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com</a>]
<br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4</span>:</b> 2014<span lang=
=3D"ZH-CN">=C4=EA</span>6<span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=D4=C2</span>30<span lang=3D"=
ZH-CN">=C8=D5</span> 0:20<br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB</span>:</b> Qin Wu; <a href=3D"m=
ailto:time@ietf.org">time@ietf.org</a><br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=B3=AD=CB=CD</span>:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@i=
etf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>;
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill=
@ietf.org">
trill@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <=
a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=D6=F7=CC=E2</span>:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Qin<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">There are several way =
this is applicable to SFC<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level=
1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"m=
so-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">SFC is underla=
yer independent , which means it can have all sorts of encap types undernea=
th, the model presented in tissa-netmod-oam, address exactly that issue. In=
stead of re-inventing and re-implementing
 various different OAM the draft propose to integrate them at the managemen=
t layer.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l1 level=
1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><span style=3D"m=
so-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&n=
bsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">In this draft =
we define a flow-entropy as an opaque element that each of the technology t=
ype can specify and include. If we look at draft-quinn-sfc-nsh-02.txt, it d=
efine a block that specifies SFC.
 SFC version of YANG &nbsp;can specify this as part of its flow entropy. Th=
e beauty is that it is all up to the technology to specify that (size and s=
hape is technology dependent) and base model is still intact.<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">With the above in mind=
 , can you please review draft-tissa-netmod-oam and see it is flexible and =
extensible enough to for the purpose. If things are missing we can add and =
extend.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have requested netmo=
d WG chairs for a presentation slot for further discussion of the draft. &n=
bsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></spa=
n></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> Qin Wu [=
<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 10, 2014 9:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir); <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">=
time@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">
nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">
l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><=
br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Hi, T=
issa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Thank=
s for initiating discussion on this topic.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Unifi=
ed OAM for multi-Layer network is a good idea to me.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">draft=
-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00 we proposed in opsawg laid out the an initial=
 description of the problem.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">The q=
uestion to</span>
<span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">draft-tissa-netmod-oam is<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">I am =
wondering how this generic Yang Model can be applied to SFC environment?<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">How d=
o you support the case where two endpoints support different layer OAM or d=
oesn=A1=AFt support any OAM at that layer.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p>=
&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">BTW: =
I have cc=A1=AFed time mailing list since I believe this mailing list is pu=
rposed to look for generic and integrated OAM covering various heterogeneou=
s networking technologies.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">Regar=
ds!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">-Qin<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:SimSun">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB</span></b><b><span style=3D"font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font=
-family:SimSun"> netmod [<a href=3D"mailto:netmod-bounces@ietf.org">mailto:=
netmod-bounces@ietf.org</a>]
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=B4=FA=B1=ED </span></b>Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevi=
r)<br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4</span>:</b> 2014<span lang=
=3D"ZH-CN">=C4=EA</span>6<span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=D4=C2</span>11<span lang=3D"=
ZH-CN">=C8=D5</span> 3:03<br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB</span>:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:ne=
tmod@ietf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>;
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill=
@ietf.org">
trill@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <=
a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
<b><span lang=3D"ZH-CN">=D6=F7=CC=E2</span>:</b> [netmod] YANG models for O=
AM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">All<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below=
 place the generic framework for OAM, that can be augmented for different t=
echnologies. #2 and #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<o:=
p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level=
1 lfo6"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=
=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ti=
ssa-netmod-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/</a=
><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level=
1 lfo6"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style=
=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ti=
ssa-nvo3-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-o=
am/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-.25in;mso-list:l0 level=
1 lfo6"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">3.<span style=
=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span><![endif]><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ti=
ssa-trill-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang=
-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Please review and share your comments<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Tissa<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>

--_000_FBEA3E19AA24F847BA3AE74E2FE193562EEC5C98xmbrcdx08ciscoc_--


From nobody Tue Jul  8 13:30:39 2014
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From: Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>
To: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich)" <mehmet.ersue@nsn.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] Coman Drafts v02
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Dear OpsAWG WG,

The authors of draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02 and
draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-02 have indicated that they believe
that the document is
ready, and have asked for Working Group Last Call.

The draft is available here:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02/
and here: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases/

Please review this draft to see if you think it is ready for publication
and send comments to the list, **clearly** stating your view.

IETF90 is Toronto is nearly upon us, and so folk are busy / may have
questions about this document. Because of this we are doing an
extended (3 week) WGLC  - It ends Tue 29-Jul-2014.


Thanks,
Warren Kumari
(as OpsAWG WG co-chair)

On Fri, Jul 4, 2014 at 5:01 PM, Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich)
<mehmet.ersue@nsn.com> wrote:
> Dear OPSAWG Chairs,
>
> we submitted v02 of the Coman drafts.
>
> As discussed in IETF #89, the authors think that the two documents are ready
> for WGLC.
> Please consider to start the WGLC procedure. Thank you.
>
> Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Problem Statement and
> Requirements
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02
>
> Management of Networks with Constrained Devices: Use Cases
> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases-02
>
> Regards,
> Mehmet
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OPSAWG mailing list
> OPSAWG@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>


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From: Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>
To: "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
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Subject: [OPSAWG] Process wonkery: Reminder about IPR relating to draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02
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Dear OpsAWG WG,

Be not alarmed.
This email was created to satisfy RFC 6702 "Promoting Compliance with
Intellectual Property Rights (IPR)"
(http://tools.ietf.org/rfc/rfc6702.txt).


The authors of draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02 and
draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases have asked for a Working Group Last
Call -- we would like to check whether any claims of Intellectual
Property Rights (IPR) on the document have not yet been disclosed.

Are you personally aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02 or
draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases?  If so, has this IPR been disclosed
in compliance with IETF IPR rules?
(See RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669, and 5378 for more details.)

If you are a document author or listed contributor on this document,
please reply to this email regardless of whether or not you are
personally aware of any relevant IPR.  We might not be able to advance
this document to the next stage until we have received a reply from
each author and listed contributor.

If you are on the OpsAWG WG email list but are not an author or listed
contributor for this document, you are reminded of your opportunity
for a voluntary IPR disclosure under BCP 79.  Please do not reply
unless you want to make such a voluntary disclosure.

Online tools for filing IPR disclosures can be found at
<http://www.ietf.org/ipr/file-disclosure>.

Thanks,
Warren Kumari
(as OpsAWG WG co-chair)


From nobody Tue Jul  8 18:28:20 2014
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From: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
To: "Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)" <tsenevir@cisco.com>, "time@ietf.org" <time@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: YANG models for OAM
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Hi, Tissa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">I don=A1=AFt think the idea you proposed have any inconsistency w=
ith what we are proposing in draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-02. But looks =
like we are debating something,</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-si=
ze:10.5pt;font-family:Wingdings;color:#1F497D">J</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
 style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">You and us are both looking for OAM consolidation in the manageme=
nt, in addition, we are looking for OAM consolidation in the data plane.<o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Please see my reply inline below.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=
=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> Tissa S=
enevirathne (tsenevir) [mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com]
<br>
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=
=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-=
US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> 2014</span><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=C4=EA<span lang=3D"EN-U=
S">7</span>=D4=C2<span lang=3D"EN-US">8</span>=C8=D5<span lang=3D"EN-US">
 22:48<br>
</span><b>=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"=
EN-US"> Qin Wu; time@ietf.org<br>
</span><b>=B3=AD=CB=CD<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> netmod@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; trill@ietf.org; l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ie=
tf.org<br>
</span><b>=D6=F7=CC=E2<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Qin<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">May be =
a point is missed here.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l2 leve=
l1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">=
<span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New=
 Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"=
>Thought SFC can go up and down on layers, what controls that behavior ? Is=
=A1=AFnt it the Service header ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">[Qin]: It is possible, but who control that behavior, it is the m=
anagement plane, the management plane need to interact with different layer=
 OAM in the data plane or
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Management plane need to interact with OAM protocol that is defin=
ed for SFC at the top of layer 3.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l2 leve=
l1 lfo2"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">=
<span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New=
 Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"=
>Is the OAM comes down to fault isolation, verification , monitoring etc fo=
r the specified SH ?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">[Qin]: =
Not clear whether SH is the only approach. OAM information can be put into =
BDF protocol or Generic TLV as well.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Like di=
scussed before (many times) exact en-cap is less important what is importan=
t is to have a model that define OAM framework and scope. CFM to my opinion=
 do an excellent job in defining what
 is needed. Hence the choice of a similar model for the YANG Model.<o:p></o=
:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">[Qin]: We are on the same page, but isn=A1=AFt more straightforwa=
rd and reasonable to define Generic OAM framework separated from Yang Data =
model for Generic OAM.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">That=A1=AFs what we like to propose in the draft-ww-opsawg-multi-=
layer-oam-02. Developing separate Architecture and Framework from Transport=
 Independent OAM Problem statement draft.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Generic OAM framework should also allow more interaction between =
data plane and management plane and more interworking between different lay=
er OAM protocol.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">You hav=
e noted BFD and CFM are similar because they have similar set of timers. Th=
at is a wrong comparison. Have similar set of timers does not make two prot=
ocols the same.
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">[Qin]: That=A1=AFs not what we are proposing, we hope in the mana=
gement plane there is some common components or elements that can be used b=
y not only BFD, but also CFM.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">What ma=
kes them is what framework they follows. &nbsp;We have used key word CFM he=
re loosely. Though we borrow lots of concepts form CFM there are things tha=
t needed to be revisited.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have =
requested presentation slots in nvo3 and NETMOD working groups and will be =
going through in details how each one of the technologies map to YANG model=
 presented here.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">[Qin]: That would be a very good survey, in my opinion, before go=
ing there, isn=A1=AFt more nice to have a gap analysis document to<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">a .Identify technology dependent and independent component<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">b. &nbsp;analyze and understand the different motivations and opp=
ortunities for optimisation of OAM in different technology networks,
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">and the trade-offs between those optimisations and the overall ad=
vantage of a generic OAM mechanism.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;"> Qin Wu [<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">mailto:=
bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 08, 2014 5:07 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir); <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">=
time@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">
nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">
l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><=
br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Hi, Tissa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">There are many options for SFC OAM, BFD extension, Generic Header=
 extension, Generic TLV extension.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Unlike other existing OAM protocols, mechanisms and tools, SFC ne=
ed to address OAM for the technology that is above layer 3.<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">SFC haven=A1=AFt developed OAM protocol yet at the top of layer 3=
.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Before they developing OAM protocol, they need to figure out whet=
her they need to develop technology dependent OAM protocol,<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Or technology independent OAM protocol since SFC OAM and Overlay =
OAM share a lot of similarities(e.g., both can use overlay technology to st=
itch a set of overlay node or service
 node to form the end to end path). Why not build one protocol to support b=
oth?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">That=A1=AFs why we bring up transport independent OAM covering va=
rious heterogeneous network technologies and propose to consolidate OAM in =
both<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Management plane and data plane.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.or=
g/html/draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-02">http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft=
-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-02</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://tools.ietf.or=
g/html/draft-king-opsawg-time-multi-layer-oam-use-case-01.txt">http://tools=
.ietf.org/html/draft-king-opsawg-time-multi-layer-oam-use-case-01.txt</a><o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Regarding flow-entropy, why not reuse entropy mechanisms in the e=
xisting underlying transport. How is flow entropy different from ECMP choic=
e you proposed in the draft.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">If my understanding is correct, IEEE 802.1ag only support Equal C=
ost Tree (ECT) mechanism instead of ECMP, IEEE802.1Qbp support ECMP,<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Are you proposing to combine ECT supported by IEEE 802.1ag with E=
CMP supported by IEEE 802.1Qbp and use them together at the same time in th=
e same network?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Also BFD and IEEE 802.1ag CFM share a lot of commonality, e.g., C=
CM-interval, BFD interval. If we integrate them together, we really need to=
 think about how to integrate them together
 in the management plane. Is there any common component we can define for b=
oth? How we define these component and make them more extensible.<o:p></o:p=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=
=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> Tissa S=
enevirathne (tsenevir) [<a href=3D"mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com">mailto:tsenev=
ir@cisco.com</a>]
<br>
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=
=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-=
US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> 2014</span><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=C4=EA<span lang=3D"EN-U=
S">6</span>=D4=C2<span lang=3D"EN-US">30</span>=C8=D5<span lang=3D"EN-US">
 0:20<br>
</span><b>=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"=
EN-US"> Qin Wu; <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">
time@ietf.org</a><br>
</span><b>=B3=AD=CB=CD<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">
netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">
trill@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <=
a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
</span><b>=D6=F7=CC=E2<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">Hi Qin<=
o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">There a=
re several way this is applicable to SFC<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 leve=
l1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">=
<span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New=
 Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"=
>SFC is underlayer independent , which means it can have all sorts of encap=
 types underneath, the model presented in tissa-netmod-oam, address exactly=
 that issue. Instead of re-inventing
 and re-implementing various different OAM the draft propose to integrate t=
hem at the management layer.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l1 leve=
l1 lfo4"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">=
<span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New=
 Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"=
>In this draft we define a flow-entropy as an opaque element that each of t=
he technology type can specify and include. If we look at draft-quinn-sfc-n=
sh-02.txt, it define a block that specifies
 SFC. SFC version of YANG &nbsp;can specify this as part of its flow entrop=
y. The beauty is that it is all up to the technology to specify that (size =
and shape is technology dependent) and base model is still intact.<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">With th=
e above in mind , can you please review draft-tissa-netmod-oam and see it i=
s flexible and extensible enough to for the purpose. If things are missing =
we can add and extend.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D">I have =
requested netmod WG chairs for a presentation slot for further discussion o=
f the draft. &nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"color:#1F497D"><o:p>&n=
bsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;"> Qin Wu [<a href=3D"mailto:bill.wu@huawei.com">mailto:=
bill.wu@huawei.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 10, 2014 9:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir); <a href=3D"mailto:time@ietf.org">=
time@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=
=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">
nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">
l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">opsawg@ietf.org</a><=
br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Hi, Tissa:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Thanks for initiating discussion on this topic.<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Unified OAM for multi-Layer network is a good idea to me.<o:p></o=
:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">draft-ww-opsawg-multi-layer-oam-00 we proposed in opsawg laid out=
 the an initial description of the problem.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">The question to</span><span lang=3D"EN-US">
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color:#1F497D">draft-=
tissa-netmod-oam is<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">I am wondering how this generic Yang Model can be applied to SFC =
environment?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">How do you support the case where two endpoints support different=
 layer OAM or doesn=A1=AFt support any OAM at that layer.<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">BTW: I have cc=A1=AFed time mailing list since I believe this mai=
ling list is purposed to look for generic and integrated OAM covering vario=
us heterogeneous networking technologies.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">Regards!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;color=
:#1F497D">-Qin<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=
=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> netmod =
[<a href=3D"mailto:netmod-bounces@ietf.org">mailto:netmod-bounces@ietf.org<=
/a>]
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B4=FA=
=B1=ED </span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-famil=
y:=CB=CE=CC=E5">Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=
=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-=
US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> 2014</span><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=C4=EA<span lang=3D"EN-U=
S">6</span>=D4=C2<span lang=3D"EN-US">11</span>=C8=D5<span lang=3D"EN-US">
 3:03<br>
</span><b>=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"=
EN-US"> <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">
netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">
trill@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <=
a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
</span><b>=D6=F7=CC=E2<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> [netmod] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">All<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">We have published YANG model fo=
r OAM. #1 draft below place the generic framework for OAM, that can be augm=
ented for different technologies. #2 and #3 are application of the concept =
to NVO3 and TRILL,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 leve=
l1 lfo6"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span style=3D"mso-list:=
Ignore">1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://datat=
racker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/do=
c/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 leve=
l1 lfo6"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span style=3D"mso-list:=
Ignore">2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://datat=
racker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org=
/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoListParagraph" style=3D"text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 leve=
l1 lfo6"><![if !supportLists]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><span style=3D"mso-list:=
Ignore">3.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbs=
p;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span></span></span><![endif]><span lang=3D"EN-US"><a href=3D"http://datat=
racker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.or=
g/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Please review and share your co=
mments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Tissa<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>

--_000_B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8458087Dnkgeml501mbschi_--


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Date: Wed, 9 Jul 2014 09:01:59 +0200
From: Juergen Schoenwaelder <j.schoenwaelder@jacobs-university.de>
To: Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>
Message-ID: <20140709070159.GB86182@elstar.local>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] Process wonkery: Reminder about IPR relating to draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02
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On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 04:34:19PM -0400, Warren Kumari wrote:
> 
> Are you personally aware of any IPR that applies to
> draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02 or
> draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases?  If so, has this IPR been disclosed
> in compliance with IETF IPR rules?
> (See RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669, and 5378 for more details.)
> 
> If you are a document author or listed contributor on this document,
> please reply to this email regardless of whether or not you are
> personally aware of any relevant IPR.  We might not be able to advance
> this document to the next stage until we have received a reply from
> each author and listed contributor.

I am not sure whether this is a reasonable question to ask for use
cases and requirements documents but in order to not complicate the
process, let me declare that I am personally not aware of IPR that
needs to be disclosed.

/js

-- 
Juergen Schoenwaelder           Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH
Phone: +49 421 200 3587         Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany
Fax:   +49 421 200 3103         <http://www.jacobs-university.de/>


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From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" <dromasca@avaya.com>
To: Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [OPSAWG] Process wonkery: Reminder about IPR relating to draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] Process wonkery: Reminder about IPR relating to draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02
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 Hi,

I am not aware about any IPR that applies to these two I-Ds.=20

Regards,

Dan


> -----Original Message-----
> From: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Warren
> Kumari
> Sent: Tuesday, July 08, 2014 11:34 PM
> To: opsawg@ietf.org
> Subject: [OPSAWG] Process wonkery: Reminder about IPR relating to draft-
> ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02
>=20
> Dear OpsAWG WG,
>=20
> Be not alarmed.
> This email was created to satisfy RFC 6702 "Promoting Compliance with
> Intellectual Property Rights (IPR)"
> (http://tools.ietf.org/rfc/rfc6702.txt).
>=20
>=20
> The authors of draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02 and draft-ietf-
> opsawg-coman-use-cases have asked for a Working Group Last Call -- we
> would like to check whether any claims of Intellectual Property Rights (I=
PR)
> on the document have not yet been disclosed.
>=20
> Are you personally aware of any IPR that applies to
> draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02 or draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-
> use-cases?  If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IP=
R
> rules?
> (See RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669, and 5378 for more details.)
>=20
> If you are a document author or listed contributor on this document, plea=
se
> reply to this email regardless of whether or not you are personally aware=
 of
> any relevant IPR.  We might not be able to advance this document to the
> next stage until we have received a reply from each author and listed
> contributor.
>=20
> If you are on the OpsAWG WG email list but are not an author or listed
> contributor for this document, you are reminded of your opportunity for a
> voluntary IPR disclosure under BCP 79.  Please do not reply unless you wa=
nt
> to make such a voluntary disclosure.
>=20
> Online tools for filing IPR disclosures can be found at
> <http://www.ietf.org/ipr/file-disclosure>.
>=20
> Thanks,
> Warren Kumari
> (as OpsAWG WG co-chair)
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> OPSAWG mailing list
> OPSAWG@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg


From nobody Wed Jul  9 10:39:46 2014
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From: Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>
To: Juergen Schoenwaelder <j.schoenwaelder@jacobs-university.de>, Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] Process wonkery: Reminder about IPR relating to draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02
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On Wed, Jul 9, 2014 at 3:01 AM, Juergen Schoenwaelder
<j.schoenwaelder@jacobs-university.de> wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 04:34:19PM -0400, Warren Kumari wrote:
>>
>> Are you personally aware of any IPR that applies to
>> draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-probstate-reqs-02 or
>> draft-ietf-opsawg-coman-use-cases?  If so, has this IPR been disclosed
>> in compliance with IETF IPR rules?
>> (See RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669, and 5378 for more details.)
>>
>> If you are a document author or listed contributor on this document,
>> please reply to this email regardless of whether or not you are
>> personally aware of any relevant IPR.  We might not be able to advance
>> this document to the next stage until we have received a reply from
>> each author and listed contributor.
>
> I am not sure whether this is a reasonable question to ask for use
> cases and requirements documents

Yeah, I hear you, but I've learnt that it is easier / safer to just
ask for *all* documents. I once had an issue where we adopted a
document, and then, just at WGLC the author suddenly popped up and
said that they had IPR, and that he'd "never heard of this having to
disclose IPR thing". This made for a fun few weeks - now I ask early
and often :-)

It would be unfortunate to adopt a requirements document and then only
later discover that the only realistic way to meet one of the
requirements is to use IPR that is owned by one of the authors.


> but in order to not complicate the
> process, let me declare that I am personally not aware of IPR that
> needs to be disclosed.

Thank you.
W


>
> /js
>
> --
> Juergen Schoenwaelder           Jacobs University Bremen gGmbH
> Phone: +49 421 200 3587         Campus Ring 1, 28759 Bremen, Germany
> Fax:   +49 421 200 3103         <http://www.jacobs-university.de/>


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From: "Ersue, Mehmet (NSN - DE/Munich)" <mehmet.ersue@nsn.com>
To: ext Warren Kumari <warren@kumari.net>, Juergen Schoenwaelder <j.schoenwaelder@jacobs-university.de>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
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From nobody Wed Jul  9 18:24:45 2014
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Message-ID: <53BDEB5E.8050508@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 10 Jul 2014 13:24:46 +1200
From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
Organization: University of Auckland
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Subject: [OPSAWG] OPS area BOF in Toronto
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Hi,

The Use Cases for Autonomic Networking (UCAN) BOF at 1 p.m.
on Wednesday in Toronto should be of interest. Quoting the BOF
description:

The fundamental goal of Autonomic Networking (AN) is self-management...
AN aims at putting the intelligence of today's operations back into
algorithms at the node level... The UCAN BOF is intended to expose
several use cases to community review... The next stage will be to
consolidate the use cases and to to extract common requirements for
an autonomic infrastructure.

Full description and reading list at
http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart#UCANApprovedforIETF90

Agenda and slides will be in the usual places.

     Brian + co-conspirators


From nobody Mon Jul 14 11:28:49 2014
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Thanks, Juergen. I'll incorporate the changes in a new version as soon 
as the embargo lifts.

Tom

On 06/07/2014 1:59 PM, Juergen Schoenwaelder wrote:
> s/MIBs/MIB modules/g
>
> And I would not have mind if the names of the IETF MIB modules
> affected would have been listed in the abstract.
>
> /js
>
> On Sun, Jul 06, 2014 at 01:16:05PM -0400, Tom Taylor wrote:
>> I submitted this draft to put a stake in the ground. Comments welcome.
>> I'll be bugging people to find out whether the RFC 4663 plan worked or
>> has had to be modified in practice.
>>
>> Tom Taylor
>>
>> Title:
>>
>> MIBs Passed From the IETF To IEEE 802.3 and Currently Documented In IEEE
>> 802.3.1-2013
>>
>> Abstract:
>>
>>     This document records the transfer of ownership of a number of MIBs
>>     relating to ethernet, from the IETF to IEEE 802.3.  Like RFC 4663, it
>>     describes the procedures associated with the transfer.  Unlike RFC
>>     4663, this documentation is retrospective in nature, since the
>>     transfer happened several years ago.  Deviations from the planned
>>     procedures described in RFC 4663 are noted for historical interest
>>     [in a later version of this draft - PTT].
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OPSAWG mailing list
>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>


From nobody Tue Jul 15 16:39:10 2014
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--_000_9904FB1B0159DA42B0B887B7FA8119CA5C842F1DAZFFEXMB04globa_
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Here are my comments from a first reading of draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ie=
ee80231-00.

Thanks to Tom Taylor for taking the burden of editing this document.

The comments are in the order of reading - I apologize if they are not too =
well structured, writing them during the IEEE 802 Plenary


1.       I believe that the scope should be similar to the one of RFC 4663,=
 and this should start from the title. I suggest Transferring MIB Work from=
 IETF Ethernet Interfaces and Hub MIB WG to IEEE 802.3 WG'

2.       Capitalize 'Ethernet' at all occurrence

3.       s/MIBs/MIB modules/

4.       In Section 1:



OLD:

   Some years later, another transfer of ownership took

   place, this time related to ethernet and directed to IEEE 802.3.



NEW:

   Some years later, another transfer of ownership took

   place, this time related to Ethernet-related MIB modules developed

   in the IETF Ethernet Interfaces and Hub MIB (hubmib) WG which were

   transferred to the IEEE 802.3 WG.



5.       Section 3.1 - replace text with: 'The content of Section 2.2 of [R=
FC4663] is accurate also for this document'

6.       Section 3.2 - replace text with: 'The IEEE 802.3 WG adopted the ap=
proach recommended in [RFC4663], Section 2.3 of developing an IEEE MIB modu=
le and defining new compliance clauses under the IEEE OID branch. Informati=
on about the IEEE 802.3 Management Registration Arcs can be found at http:/=
/www.ieee802.org/3/arcs/index.html'

7.       Section 3.3 - I suggest the following content:



   The Ethernet Interfaces and Hub MIB WG has completed its documents,

   and the WG was closed in September 2007.



   The mailing list staid open for a while, and was closed a few years

   later.



   The appropriate mailing list for IEEE 802.3 MIB modules discussion

   is STDS-802-3-MIB@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG.



   To see the general information about 802,1, including how they

   work and how to participate, go to http://www.ieee802.org/3/





8.       Section 3.1 - replace text with: 'The content of Section 5 of [RFC=
4663] is accurate also for this document, with the mention that 802.3 shoul=
d replace 802.1 wherever it occurs in text.'





Regards,



Dan



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<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Here are my comments from a first reading of draft-t=
aylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-00.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks to Tom Taylor for taking the burden of editin=
g this document.
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">The comments are in the order of reading &#8211; I a=
pologize if they are not too well structured, writing them during the IEEE =
802 Plenary<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo=
2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">1.<spa=
n style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&=
quot;">I believe that the scope should be similar to the one of RFC 4663, a=
nd this should start from the title. I suggest Transferring MIB Work from I=
ETF Ethernet Interfaces and Hub MIB WG to IEEE 802.3 WG&#8217;<o:p></o:p></=
span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo=
2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">2.<spa=
n style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&=
quot;">Capitalize &#8216;Ethernet&#8217; at all occurrence<o:p></o:p></span=
></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo=
2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">3.<spa=
n style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&=
quot;">s/MIBs/MIB modules/<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo=
2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">4.<spa=
n style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&=
quot;">In Section 1: <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;">OLD: <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot=
;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Some years later, another transfer of ownership took<o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot=
;">&nbsp;&nbsp; place, this time related to ethernet and directed to IEEE 8=
02.3.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<pre><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;">NEW: <o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot=
;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;Some years later, another transfer of ownership took<o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot=
;">&nbsp;&nbsp; place, this time related to Ethernet-related MIB modules de=
veloped<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot=
;">&nbsp;&nbsp; in the IETF Ethernet Interfaces and Hub MIB (hubmib) WG whi=
ch were<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoPlainText"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot=
;">&nbsp;&nbsp; transferred to the IEEE 802.3 WG.
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<pre><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo=
2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">5.<spa=
n style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&=
quot;">Section 3.1 &#8211; replace text with: &#8216;The content of Section=
 2.2 of [RFC4663] is accurate also for this document&#8217;<o:p></o:p></spa=
n></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo=
2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">6.<spa=
n style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&=
quot;">Section 3.2 &#8211; replace text with: &#8216;The IEEE 802.3 WG adop=
ted the approach recommended in [RFC4663], Section 2.3 of developing an IEE=
E MIB module and defining new compliance clauses under the IEEE OID branch.=
 Information about the IEEE 802.3 Management Registration Arcs can be found=
 at http://www.ieee802.org/3/arcs/index.html&#8217; &nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span=
></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo=
2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">7.<spa=
n style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&=
quot;">Section 3.3 &#8211; I suggest the following content: <o:p></o:p></sp=
an></pre>
<pre><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp; The Ethernet Interfaces and Hub MIB WG has completed its =
documents, <o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;and the WG was closed in September 2007.<o:p></o:p><=
/pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp; The mailing list staid open for a while, and was closed a=
 few years<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp; later. <o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp; The appropriate mailing list for IEEE 802.3 MIB modules d=
iscussion<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp; is STDS-802-3-MIB@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG.<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp; To see the general information about 802,1, including how=
 they<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre>&nbsp;&nbsp; work and how to participate, go to http://www.ieee802.org=
/3/<o:p></o:p></pre>
<pre><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></pre>
<pre><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo=
2"><![if !supportLists]><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><span style=3D"mso-list:Ignore">8.<spa=
n style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=
&nbsp;&nbsp; </span></span></span><![endif]><span dir=3D"LTR"></span><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&=
quot;">Section 3.1 &#8211; replace text with: &#8216;The content of Section=
 5 of [RFC4663] is accurate also for this document, with the mention that 8=
02.3 should replace 802.1 wherever it occurs in text.&#8217;<o:p></o:p></sp=
an></pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-fami=
ly:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pr=
e>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-fami=
ly:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pr=
e>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-fami=
ly:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></=
pre>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-fami=
ly:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pr=
e>
<pre style=3D"margin-left:36.0pt"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-fami=
ly:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">Dan<o:p></o:p></span></pre>
<pre><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;=
sans-serif&quot;"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></pre>
</div>
</body>
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--_000_9904FB1B0159DA42B0B887B7FA8119CA5C842F1DAZFFEXMB04globa_--


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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] PCAPNG standardisation
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Hi Michael,

You wrote:

    One of the most accepted packet interchange
    formats is the one defined by libpcap, which is rather old and is
    lacking in functionality for more modern applications particularly
    from the extensibility point of view.

Can you please expand.

Regards, Benoit
> On 26 Jun 2014, at 19:29, Michael Tuexen <Michael.Tuexen@lurchi.franken.de> wrote:
>
>> Dear all,
>>
>> I have submitted an ID describing the default packet format format
>> used by Wireshark for saving capture files:
>> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tuexen-opswg-pcapng-00.txt
> Wrong name... Use
> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tuexen-opsawg-pcapng-00.txt
>> Is there any interest in the WG to work on this and improve it?
>>
>> Any comments are welcome!
>>
>> Best regards
>> Michael
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OPSAWG mailing list
>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>>
> _______________________________________________
> OPSAWG mailing list
> OPSAWG@ietf.org
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Dear Hirochika,

Very sorry for the delay in getting back to you.

> Dear Joel and Benoit,
>
> Thank you.
>
> Since Joel has invited Benoit, another AD of OPS AREA, to this discussion,
> I summarize my question for clarity as follows:
>
> The IESG statement (*1) encourages to remove read-write access to objects
> related to configuration from MIB modules.  
That's not quite the message.
The IESG statement is there to discourage the specification of
completely new MIB modules with read-write objects (like a complete new
framework around SNMP) and to point to NETCONF/YANG instead, but the
IESG statement is not there to forbid the use of read-write objects.
There are cases where read-write objects are useful (ex: your
notifications in last version).
I believe that you try to find hard rules in this statement.

Regards, Benoit
> However, the scope of the
> nomenclature "configuration" is not clear to me.  In my understanding,
> "configuration" does not contain non-persistent (volatile) changes to objects,
> such as virtual machine administrative state (vmAdminState) in our I-D (*2).
> They does not affect the configuration but changes state of the target system.
> Therefore, I think they are not under "SNMP MIB modules creating and
> modifying configuration state" stated in the IESG statement.


>
> Is my understanding correct or not?
>
> (*1) http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/writable-mib-module.html
> (*2) http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-00
>
> Hirochika
>
>
> On May 27, 2014, at 3:55 AM, joel jaeggli <joelja@bogus.com> wrote:
>
>> yeah if you want to discuss it with the ops/management ADs and the
>> chairs that's fine.
>>
>> I don't think there's a reason to involve the whole iesg.
>>
>> Thanks
>> joel
>>
>> On 5/26/14, 10:48 AM, Hirochika Asai wrote:
>>> js and Joel,
>>>
>>> Thank you for your comments.
>>>
>>> I agree that the IESG statement seems to be talking about configuration,
>>> but I cannot definitely say that the objects I listed in my previous E-mail
>>> are out of the IESG statement's scope.
>>>
>>> I think it would be better to move this issue to the IESG, but I don't keep
>>> up the procedure.  May I, as an author of the draft, send an E-mail
>>> stating this issue to iesg@ietf.org, CCing WG? Or ask WG chairs to
>>> handle it?
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>> Hirochika
>>>
>>>
>>> On May 27, 2014, at 1:24 AM, joel jaeggli <joelja@bogus.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 5/26/14, 9:20 AM, Juergen Schoenwaelder wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, May 26, 2014 at 08:42:47AM -0700, joel jaeggli wrote:
>>>>>> On 5/26/14, 2:31 AM, Juergen Schoenwaelder wrote:
>>>>>>> Asai,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the IESG statement is here:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/writable-mib-module.html
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My reading is that it specifically talks about configuration. While
>>>>>>> the discussion started with "lets ban all write access", it may be
>>>>>>> important to note that the final statement does not say this. Hence,
>>>>>>> I am not sure we have to remove the MAX-ACCESS read-write.
>>>>>> some of the vm options do cause me existential peril. The remaining
>>>>>> one's however do not. so I think Juergen's assessment  is a correct one.
>>>>>> The statement seems to be serving it's purpose!
>>>>>>
>>>>> Joel, can you please decrypt your message so that it becomes perhaps
>>>>> actionable?
>>>> I'm agreeing with you.
>>>>
>>>>> /js
>>>>>
>>>>
>>


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--NextPart

A new Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Operations and Management Area Working Group Working Group of the IETF.

    Title         : IEEE 802.11 MAC Profile for CAPWAP
    Author(s)     : C. Shao, et al
    Filename      : draft-ietf-opsawg-capwap-hybridmac
    Pages         : 11 
    Date          : 2014-07-16 
    
   The CAPWAP protocol defines two entities: a Wireless Transmission
   Point (WTP) and an Access Controller (AC).  The CAPWAP protocol
   binding for IEEE 802.11 defines two MAC (Medium Access Control) modes
   for IEEE 802.11 WTP: Split and Local MAC, and describes the required
   functionality split between the WTP and AC for each mode.  However,
   in the split MAC mode, the partitioning of encryption/decryption
   functions are not been clearly clearly defined.  In the Split MAC
   mode description, IEEE 802.11 encryption is specified as located in
   either at the AC or the WTP, with no clear way for the AC to inform
   the WTP of where the encryption functionality should be located.
   This lack of specification leads to interoperability issues,
   especially when the AC and WTP come from different vendors.  To
   prevent interoperability issues, this specification defines an IEEE
   802.11 MAC profile message element in which each profile specifies an
   unambiguous division of encryption functionality between the WTP and
   AC.  The IEEE 802.11 MAC profile is used as follows: the WTP informs
   the AC of the supported profiles during the discovery or join process
   and the AC configures the WTP with one of the supported profiles when
   configuring the WLAN.

A URL for this Internet-Draft is:
https://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-opsawg-capwap-hybridmac-05.txt

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please plan on coming by the opsawg session (wed @9am) in Toronto and to ta=
ke
a few minutes telling the WG what the status is of your ID

Scott & Warren


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please plan on coming by the opsawg session (wed @9am) in Toronto and to ta=
ke
a few minutes telling the WG what the status is of your ID

Scott & Warren


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please plan on coming by the opsawg session (wed @9am) in Toronto and to ta=
ke
a few minutes telling the WG what the status is of your ID

Scott & Warren


From nobody Thu Jul 17 01:12:39 2014
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From: Michael Tuexen <Michael.Tuexen@lurchi.franken.de>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] PCAPNG standardisation
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On 16 Jul 2014, at 17:29, Benoit Claise <bclaise@cisco.com> wrote:

> Hi Michael,
>=20
> You wrote:
>=20
>   One of the most accepted packet interchange
>   formats is the one defined by libpcap, which is rather old and is
>   lacking in functionality for more modern applications particularly
>   from the extensibility point of view.
>=20
> Can you please expand.
Sure.

Every pcap file starts with a file header, which contains information
about the version, byte ordering, timestamp, snap length and the link
layer type of all packets. After the file header you have a sequence
of records. Every packet starts with a record header containing the
time and the length of the the record followed by the actual bytes of
the packet.

A pcapng file consists of a sequence of blocks. Each block has a length
field and a type field. This allows you to add additional blocks in the
future. A reader can also skip blocks he doesn't know. This gives you
extensibility. The blocks currently defined allow you to store more
information than a classical pcap file:
* You can store packets from different interfaces with different link
  layers.
* You can store information about packet drops between captured packets
  (like snoop).
* You can store statistical information about drop numbers during the =
capture
* You can store information about DNS names of node you capture traffic =
from.

Best regards
Michael
>=20
> Regards, Benoit
>> On 26 Jun 2014, at 19:29, Michael Tuexen =
<Michael.Tuexen@lurchi.franken.de> wrote:
>>=20
>>> Dear all,
>>>=20
>>> I have submitted an ID describing the default packet format format
>>> used by Wireshark for saving capture files:
>>> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tuexen-opswg-pcapng-00.txt
>> Wrong name... Use
>> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tuexen-opsawg-pcapng-00.txt
>>> Is there any interest in the WG to work on this and improve it?
>>>=20
>>> Any comments are welcome!
>>>=20
>>> Best regards
>>> Michael
>>>=20
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OPSAWG mailing list
>>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
>> OPSAWG mailing list
>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>>=20
>=20
>=20


From jasper@packet-foo.com  Thu Jul 17 00:22:51 2014
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References: <36334903-3B26-41FA-A9AE-35B5F74F88AC@lurchi.franken.de>  <52D6582A-1740-4601-9ABC-FFCCC3847461@lurchi.franken.de> <53C69A6B.1020604@cisco.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] PCAPNG standardisation
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Hi Benoit,

libpcap is a very basic format that can be used to store network
packet contents together with a very limited set of meta information,
mostly timestamps and length information.

More recent packet captures often require storing additional meta
information, like the number of packets that could not be captured for
performance reasons, lists of interfaces that the capture was
performed on, name resolution tables that allow displaying FQDNs
instead/together with IPs in network analysis solutions like
Wireshark, comments and annotations of packets, etc. PCAPng does allow
storing this kind of information and is designed to be extensible.

Cheers,
Jasper

Wednesday, July 16, 2014, 5:29:47 PM, you wrote:

> Hi Michael,

> You wrote:

>     One of the most accepted packet interchange
>     formats is the one defined by libpcap, which is rather old and is
>     lacking in functionality for more modern applications particularly
>     from the extensibility point of view.

> Can you please expand.

> Regards, Benoit
>> On 26 Jun 2014, at 19:29, Michael Tuexen <Michael.Tuexen@lurchi.franken.=
de> wrote:
>>
>>> Dear all,
>>>
>>> I have submitted an ID describing the default packet format format
>>> used by Wireshark for saving capture files:
>>> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tuexen-opswg-pcapng-00.txt
>> Wrong name... Use
>> http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-tuexen-opsawg-pcapng-00.txt
>>> Is there any interest in the WG to work on this and improve it?
>>>
>>> Any comments are welcome!
>>>
>>> Best regards
>>> Michael
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OPSAWG mailing list
>>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OPSAWG mailing list
>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>>


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------------0621D61A3313FF4E6--



From nobody Thu Jul 17 06:06:37 2014
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] ID status in Toronto
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Dear OPSAWG chairs,

Sure, we'll share the current status of the I-D.

Thank you.
Hirochika


On Jul 16, 2014, at 7:38 PM, "Bradner, Scott" <sob@harvard.edu> wrote:

> please plan on coming by the opsawg session (wed @9am) in Toronto and =
to take
> a few minutes telling the WG what the status is of your ID
>=20
> Scott & Warren

--=20
Hirochika Asai <panda@hongo.wide.ad.jp>, The University of Tokyo


From nobody Thu Jul 17 19:37:22 2014
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From: ramki Krishnan <ramk@Brocade.com>
To: "Bradner, Scott" <sob@harvard.edu>, "draft-ietf-opsawg-large-flow-load-balancing.all@tools.ietf.org" <draft-ietf-opsawg-large-flow-load-balancing.all@tools.ietf.org>
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Hi Scott,

We will certainly do.

Thanks,
Ramki

-----Original Message-----
From: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Bradner, Scott
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 4:38 PM
To: draft-ietf-opsawg-large-flow-load-balancing.all@tools.ietf.org
Cc: opsawg@ietf.org
Subject: [OPSAWG] ID status in Toronto

please plan on coming by the opsawg session (wed @9am) in Toronto and to ta=
ke a few minutes telling the WG what the status is of your ID

Scott & Warren

_______________________________________________
OPSAWG mailing list
OPSAWG@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg


From nobody Mon Jul 21 03:09:18 2014
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Version -01 received input on the procedural aspects from Dan Romascanu. 
It was reviewed by Dan, Juergen Schoenwaelder, and Howard Frazier of 
IEEE, and improved as a result. It may be ready for WGLC.

Tom Taylor


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: New Version Notification for 
draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-01.txt
Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2014 03:03:00 -0700
From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
To: Dan Romascanu <dromasca@avaya.com>, "Tom Taylor" 
<tom.taylor.stds@gmail.com>, Tom Taylor <tom.taylor.stds@gmail.com>, 
"Dan Romascanu" <dromasca@avaya.com>


A new version of I-D, draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-01.txt
has been successfully submitted by Tom Taylor and posted to the
IETF repository.

Name:		draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231
Revision:	01
Title:		Transferring MIB Work from IETF Ethernet Interfaces and Hub MIB 
WG to IEEE 802.3 WG
Document date:	2014-07-21
Group:		Individual Submission
Pages:		6
URL: 
http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-01.txt
Status: 
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231/
Htmlized: 
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-01
Diff: 
http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-taylor-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-01

Abstract:
    This document records the transfer of ownership of the Ethernet-
    related MIB modules DOT3-OAM-MIB, SNMP-REPEATER-MIB, POWER-ETHERNET-
    MIB, DOT3-EPON-MIB, EtherLike-MIB, EFM-CU-MIB, ETHER-WIS and MAU-MIB
    from the IETF to the IEEE 802.3 Working Group.  This document also
    describes the procedures associated with the transfer, relying
    heavily on RFC 4663 (which records an earlier transfer to the IEEE
    802.1 Working Group) as the primary source.

 



Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

The IETF Secretariat




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From: t.petch <ietfc@btconnect.com>
To: Tom Taylor <tom.taylor.stds@gmail.com>, <opsawg@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] SYSLOG control MIB? (was Interest in a YANG module tomanage SYSLOG?)
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Tom

I do not know if you have seen

draft-wildes-netmod-syslog-model-02.txt

or its precursors.  It is a bit thin on description and so hard to tell
just what it is modelling and it does seem to go in a different
direction to your requirements but you never know, it might be subverted
to do what you want!

Tom Petch

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom Taylor" <tom.taylor.stds@gmail.com>
To: <opsawg@ietf.org>
Sent: Monday, April 07, 2014 1:58 PM
Subject: [OPSAWG] SYSLOG control MIB? (was Interest in a YANG module
tomanage SYSLOG?)


> My proposal for a Yang module for SYSLOG control (at the end of this
> message) drew no replies. Would people at least be interested in an
SNMP
> MIB that allowed monitoring of the controls? What I have in mind is
two
> tables, a basic SYSLOG control table and a rate-limited event report
> table. The contents of the tables would be as follows. The field names
> are taken from RFC 5424.
>
> Basic SYSLOG Control Table:
> --------------------------
>
> Key: combination of APP-NAME (general class of logs) and MSGID
(specific
> event type).
>
> Assigned PRI value
>
> Index into rate-limited table, or nil if not rate-limited
>
> Suppressed (TRUE/FALSE)
>
> If an event type is suppressed, the associated events are totally
> ignored by the log system, so the assigned PRI value is not meaningful
> and rate-limit value should be nil.
>
> Rate Limited Log Control Table:
> ------------------------------
>
> Key: table index
>
> APP-NAME
>
> MSGID
>
> Reporting interval time units: seconds, hours, days, busy period.
>
> Reporting interval value: integer
>
> Maximum reports per reporting interval: integer
>
> Count of observed events
>
> Count of reported events
>
> Comments?
>
> Tom Taylor
>
>
>
> Message previously sent (28 March)
> ==================================
>
> While working on draft-ietf-behave-syslog-nat-logging, I noted a
number
> of management requirements for SYSLOG that are really independent of
the
> particular application being logged. These include, for example, a
list
> of events for which the operator wants logging suppressed, or
> specifications for rate-limiting specific event reports. For more
> details see Section 6, particularly sub-section 6.1.3 of the draft
cited
> above.
>
> Would there be any interest in implementing or deploying a YANG module
> to provide the necessary controls if I created one?
>
> Tom Taylor
>
> _______________________________________________
> OPSAWG mailing list
> OPSAWG@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg


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Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2014 09:55:35 -0400
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] SYSLOG control MIB? (was Interest in a YANG module tomanage SYSLOG?)
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Thanks, I still intend to get onto this.

Tom Taylor

On 14-07-22 04:57 AM, t.petch wrote:
> Tom
>
> I do not know if you have seen
>
> draft-wildes-netmod-syslog-model-02.txt
>
> or its precursors.  It is a bit thin on description and so hard to tell
> just what it is modelling and it does seem to go in a different
> direction to your requirements but you never know, it might be subverted
> to do what you want!
>
> Tom Petch
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom Taylor" <tom.taylor.stds@gmail.com>
> To: <opsawg@ietf.org>
> Sent: Monday, April 07, 2014 1:58 PM
> Subject: [OPSAWG] SYSLOG control MIB? (was Interest in a YANG module
> tomanage SYSLOG?)
>
>
>> My proposal for a Yang module for SYSLOG control (at the end of this
>> message) drew no replies. Would people at least be interested in an
> SNMP
>> MIB that allowed monitoring of the controls? What I have in mind is
> two
>> tables, a basic SYSLOG control table and a rate-limited event report
>> table. The contents of the tables would be as follows. The field names
>> are taken from RFC 5424.
>>
>> Basic SYSLOG Control Table:
>> --------------------------
>>
>> Key: combination of APP-NAME (general class of logs) and MSGID
> (specific
>> event type).
>>
>> Assigned PRI value
>>
>> Index into rate-limited table, or nil if not rate-limited
>>
>> Suppressed (TRUE/FALSE)
>>
>> If an event type is suppressed, the associated events are totally
>> ignored by the log system, so the assigned PRI value is not meaningful
>> and rate-limit value should be nil.
>>
>> Rate Limited Log Control Table:
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Key: table index
>>
>> APP-NAME
>>
>> MSGID
>>
>> Reporting interval time units: seconds, hours, days, busy period.
>>
>> Reporting interval value: integer
>>
>> Maximum reports per reporting interval: integer
>>
>> Count of observed events
>>
>> Count of reported events
>>
>> Comments?
>>
>> Tom Taylor
>>
>>
>>
>> Message previously sent (28 March)
>> ==================================
>>
>> While working on draft-ietf-behave-syslog-nat-logging, I noted a
> number
>> of management requirements for SYSLOG that are really independent of
> the
>> particular application being logged. These include, for example, a
> list
>> of events for which the operator wants logging suppressed, or
>> specifications for rate-limiting specific event reports. For more
>> details see Section 6, particularly sub-section 6.1.3 of the draft
> cited
>> above.
>>
>> Would there be any interest in implementing or deploying a YANG module
>> to provide the necessary controls if I created one?
>>
>> Tom Taylor
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OPSAWG mailing list
>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
>


From nobody Tue Jul 22 11:33:22 2014
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From: Hirochika Asai <panda@hongo.wide.ad.jp>
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References: <291D9650-5AF9-4CE2-B74D-E7BB45239C94@hongo.wide.ad.jp> <20140526093137.GE6042@elstar.local> <538360F7.10307@bogus.com> <20140526162033.GA1312@elstar.local> <53836AB8.3020806@bogus.com> <078CE1DA-BBC2-4EB6-B90D-070EF4BB2CF3@hongo.wide.ad.jp> <53838E13.70503@bogus.com> <898AF5E1-3597-47EF-A4D9-8DC38FFCA55F@hongo.wide.ad.jp> <53C6ABBE.5000003@cisco.com>
To: Benoit Claise <bclaise@cisco.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] Read-write access in VMM-MIB
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Dear Benoit,

Thank you for your clarification. I understand that the IESG statement =
does
not forbid all the use of objects with read-write access, and our
vmPerVMNotificationsEnabled and vmBulkNotificationsEnabled can be
read-write.

Hirochika


On Jul 16, 2014, at 12:43 PM, Benoit Claise <bclaise@cisco.com> wrote:

> Dear Hirochika,
>=20
> Very sorry for the delay in getting back to you.
>=20
>> Dear Joel and Benoit,
>>=20
>> Thank you.
>>=20
>> Since Joel has invited Benoit, another AD of OPS AREA, to this =
discussion,
>> I summarize my question for clarity as follows:
>>=20
>> The IESG statement (*1) encourages to remove read-write access to =
objects
>> related to configuration from MIB modules. =20
> That's not quite the message.
> The IESG statement is there to discourage the specification of
> completely new MIB modules with read-write objects (like a complete =
new
> framework around SNMP) and to point to NETCONF/YANG instead, but the
> IESG statement is not there to forbid the use of read-write objects.
> There are cases where read-write objects are useful (ex: your
> notifications in last version).
> I believe that you try to find hard rules in this statement.
>=20
> Regards, Benoit
>> However, the scope of the
>> nomenclature "configuration" is not clear to me.  In my =
understanding,
>> "configuration" does not contain non-persistent (volatile) changes to =
objects,
>> such as virtual machine administrative state (vmAdminState) in our =
I-D (*2).
>> They does not affect the configuration but changes state of the =
target system.
>> Therefore, I think they are not under "SNMP MIB modules creating and
>> modifying configuration state" stated in the IESG statement.
>=20
>=20
>>=20
>> Is my understanding correct or not?
>>=20
>> (*1) http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/writable-mib-module.html
>> (*2) http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-00
>>=20
>> Hirochika
>>=20
>>=20
>> On May 27, 2014, at 3:55 AM, joel jaeggli <joelja@bogus.com> wrote:
>>=20
>>> yeah if you want to discuss it with the ops/management ADs and the
>>> chairs that's fine.
>>>=20
>>> I don't think there's a reason to involve the whole iesg.
>>>=20
>>> Thanks
>>> joel
>>>=20
>>> On 5/26/14, 10:48 AM, Hirochika Asai wrote:
>>>> js and Joel,
>>>>=20
>>>> Thank you for your comments.
>>>>=20
>>>> I agree that the IESG statement seems to be talking about =
configuration,
>>>> but I cannot definitely say that the objects I listed in my =
previous E-mail
>>>> are out of the IESG statement's scope.
>>>>=20
>>>> I think it would be better to move this issue to the IESG, but I =
don't keep
>>>> up the procedure.  May I, as an author of the draft, send an E-mail
>>>> stating this issue to iesg@ietf.org, CCing WG? Or ask WG chairs to
>>>> handle it?
>>>>=20
>>>> Thank you.
>>>> Hirochika
>>>>=20
>>>>=20
>>>> On May 27, 2014, at 1:24 AM, joel jaeggli <joelja@bogus.com> wrote:
>>>>=20
>>>>> On 5/26/14, 9:20 AM, Juergen Schoenwaelder wrote:
>>>>>> On Mon, May 26, 2014 at 08:42:47AM -0700, joel jaeggli wrote:
>>>>>>> On 5/26/14, 2:31 AM, Juergen Schoenwaelder wrote:
>>>>>>>> Asai,
>>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>> the IESG statement is here:
>>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>> http://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/writable-mib-module.html
>>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>>>> My reading is that it specifically talks about configuration. =
While
>>>>>>>> the discussion started with "lets ban all write access", it may =
be
>>>>>>>> important to note that the final statement does not say this. =
Hence,
>>>>>>>> I am not sure we have to remove the MAX-ACCESS read-write.
>>>>>>> some of the vm options do cause me existential peril. The =
remaining
>>>>>>> one's however do not. so I think Juergen's assessment  is a =
correct one.
>>>>>>> The statement seems to be serving it's purpose!
>>>>>>>=20
>>>>>> Joel, can you please decrypt your message so that it becomes =
perhaps
>>>>>> actionable?
>>>>> I'm agreeing with you.
>>>>>=20
>>>>>> /js
>>>>>>=20
>>>>>=20
>>>=20
>=20

--=20
Hirochika Asai <panda@hongo.wide.ad.jp>, The University of Tokyo


From nobody Tue Jul 22 11:52:09 2014
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From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" <dromasca@avaya.com>
To: "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>, "netconf@ietf.org" <netconf@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [ieee-ietf-coord] Liaison from IEEE 802.1 - Deterministic Networking
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Date: Tue, 22 Jul 2014 18:51:55 +0000
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Subject: [OPSAWG] FW: [ieee-ietf-coord] Liaison from IEEE 802.1 - Deterministic Networking
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From nobody Wed Jul 23 03:36:48 2014
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To: "Black, David" <david.black@emc.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] I-D Action: draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01.txt
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Thank you for your suggestion.  I'm sorry for my delayed response .

I understand "MUST NOT" isn't good for these objects.
Then, I'd like to discuss your suggested sentence in the WG meeting =
today.

Thank you.
Hirochika


On Jul 4, 2014, at 3:08 PM, "Black, David" <david.black@emc.com> wrote:

>>> I also question the use of MUST NOT persist.
>>> How does an implementation allowing the enable setting to persist =
break the
>>> protocol or the managed entity?
>>> I think an appropriate RFC2119 usage would be =
=1B$B!H=1B(Bimplementations MAY choose to
>>> not persist the values.=1B$B!I=1B(B
>>=20
>> Implementations that support SET for these objects can store the =
values
>> in transient storage such that a restart of the agent itself does not
>> lose the configuration. One example implementation would be
>> writing the state to ramdisk which would not persist across system =
reboot.
>> As usual sets can be complex to get right and its difficult to =
understand
>> what a mib module is telling you to do here.
>> Maybe some guidance on that point would be useful in the discussion.
>=20
> I concur w/Dave Harrington's original concern - "MUST NOT" seems =
excessive.
>=20
> Suggestion:
>=20
> OLD
>      Changes to this=09
> 	object MUST NOT persist across re-initialization of=09
> 	the management system, e.g., SNMP agent.
> NEW
>      Changes to this=09
> 	object may be lost when the management system, e.g., SNMP agent,
>      is re-initialized.
>=20
> I don't see the harm in persisting changes to notification enablement
> settings.  Mike's point seems to be that one cannot and should not =
rely
> on changes persisting, not that it's harmful or otherwise wrong to do =
so.
>=20
> Thanks,
> --David
>=20
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Michael =
MacFaden
>> Sent: Friday, July 04, 2014 1:43 PM
>> To: David Harrington
>> Cc: opsawg@ietf.org
>> Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] I-D Action: draft-ietf-opsawg-vmm-mib-01.txt
>>=20
>> dbh writes:
>>> I think there is an undocumented security vulnerability.
>>> Because we REQUIRE the read-write objects to not persist across =
reboots, an
>>> undetected reboot of the SNMP system shuts off notifications.
>>> If an operator turns on notifications via the enable objects in this =
module,
>>> they presumably want to be told of certain events that might occur.
>>> If notifications are used to report security issues, an attacker =
that can
>>> somehow cause the system to restart will disable notifications, =
presumably
>>> including those that warn an operator of an attack.
>>> (as well as those that warn an operator of an undesirable =
operational state,
>>> such as interface down).
>>> I think that=1B$B!G=1B(Bs a problem.
>>>=20
>>> I also question the use of MUST NOT persist.
>>> How does an implementation allowing the enable setting to persist =
break the
>>> protocol or the managed entity?
>>> I think an appropriate RFC2119 usage would be =
=1B$B!H=1B(Bimplementations MAY choose to
>>> not persist the values.=1B$B!I=1B(B
>>=20
>> Implementations that support SET for these objects can store the =
values
>> in transient storage such that a restart of the agent itself does not
>> lose the configuration. One example implementation would be
>> writing the state to ramdisk which would persist across system =
reboot.
>> As usual sets can be complex to get right and its difficult to =
understand
>> what a mib module is telling you to do here.
>> Maybe some guidance on that point would be useful in the discussion.
>>=20
>> Regarding notification state on/of and it being security issue, this =
isn't
>> only an issue in this mib module I think. Its common place problem =
with
>> with event/push only designs. We  could add text to explain that
>> any design that is 100% reliant  on notifications as the sole means
>> of maintaining distributed state is a failed design to begin with.
>> notification only designs must be bounded either by poll or reverse
>> poll/periodic
>> event to detect a failure to receive notifications regardless of what =
caused
>> the failure.
>>=20
>> Cheers,
>> Mike MacFaden
>>=20
>> _______________________________________________
>> OPSAWG mailing list
>> OPSAWG@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg
> _______________________________________________
> OPSAWG mailing list
> OPSAWG@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/opsawg

--=20
Hirochika Asai <panda@hongo.wide.ad.jp>, The University of Tokyo


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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [ieee-ietf-coord] Liaison from IEEE 802.1 - Deterministic Networking
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On 22 Jul 2014, at 14:51, Romascanu, Dan (Dan) <dromasca@avaya.com> =
wrote:

> < 20-slide introduction,

=85 which apparently can be found here:

=
http://www.ieee802.org/1/files/public/docs2014/tsn-nfinn-Deterministic-Net=
working-L2-L3-0714-v1.pdf

Gr=FC=DFe, Carsten


From nobody Thu Jul 24 06:28:56 2014
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
 This draft is a work item of the Operations and Management Area Working Group Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : Transferring MIB Work from IETF Ethernet Interfaces and Hub MIB WG to IEEE 802.3 WG
        Authors         : Tom Taylor
                          Dan Romascanu
	Filename        : draft-ietf-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-00.txt
	Pages           : 6
	Date            : 2014-07-24

Abstract:
   This document records the transfer of ownership of the Ethernet-
   related MIB modules DOT3-OAM-MIB, SNMP-REPEATER-MIB, POWER-ETHERNET-
   MIB, DOT3-EPON-MIB, EtherLike-MIB, EFM-CU-MIB, ETHER-WIS and MAU-MIB
   from the IETF to the IEEE 802.3 Working Group.  This document also
   describes the procedures associated with the transfer, relying
   heavily on RFC 4663 (which records an earlier transfer to the IEEE
   802.1 Working Group) as the primary source.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-mibs-to-ieee80231-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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To: "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: IANAifJackType for SFP-Direct connect?
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Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2014 20:03:17 +0000
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Hi,

Does anyone know when we'll see a new enumeration in IANAifJackType
for SFP+ Direct Attach[1]?

Thanks,
Mike MacFaden
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10-gigabit_Ethernet



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<div>Hi,</div>
<div><br>
</div>
Does anyone know when we'll see a new enumeration in IANAifJackType
<div>for&nbsp;<span style=3D"background-color: rgb(249, 249, 249); font-fam=
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<div>Thanks,</div>
<div>Mike MacFaden</div>
<div>[1]&nbsp;<a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10-gigabit_Ethernet" =
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From nobody Thu Jul 24 13:32:09 2014
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From: "Romascanu, Dan (Dan)" <dromasca@avaya.com>
To: Michael MacFaden <mrm@vmware.com>, "opsawg@ietf.org" <opsawg@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: IANAifJackType for SFP-Direct connect?
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Date: Thu, 24 Jul 2014 20:31:17 +0000
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] IANAifJackType for SFP-Direct connect?
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Did anybody enter a request with IANA?

Dan

From: OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Michael MacFaden
Sent: Thursday, July 24, 2014 11:03 PM
To: opsawg@ietf.org
Subject: [OPSAWG] IANAifJackType for SFP-Direct connect?

Hi,

Does anyone know when we'll see a new enumeration in IANAifJackType
for SFP+ Direct Attach[1]?

Thanks,
Mike MacFaden
[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10-gigabit_Ethernet



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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Did anybody enter a reque=
st with IANA?
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Dan<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span><=
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> OPSAWG [=
mailto:opsawg-bounces@ietf.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Michael MacFaden<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 24, 2014 11:03 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> opsawg@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> [OPSAWG] IANAifJackType for SFP-Direct connect?<o:p></o:p><=
/span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div name=3D"divtagdefaultwrapper" id=3D"divtagdefaultwrapper">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Hi,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Does anyone know when we'll see a new enumer=
ation in IANAifJackType
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">for&nbsp;</span><span style=3D"font-size:11.=
0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black;backgr=
ound:#F9F9F9">SFP&#43; Direct Attach[1]?</span><span style=3D"font-family:&=
quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></=
p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
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</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Mike MacFaden<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot=
;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">[1]&nbsp;<a href=3D"http://en.wikipedia.org/=
wiki/10-gigabit_Ethernet" target=3D"_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10=
-gigabit_Ethernet</a>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
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From nobody Fri Jul 25 10:13:41 2014
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Subject: [OPSAWG] I-D Action: draft-ietf-opsawg-capwap-alt-tunnel-01.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
 This draft is a work item of the Operations and Management Area Working Group Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : Alternate Tunnel Encapsulation for Data Frames in CAPWAP
        Authors         : Rong Zhang
                          Zhen Cao
                          Hui Deng
                          Rajesh S. Pazhyannur
                          Sri Gundavelli
                          Li Xue
	Filename        : draft-ietf-opsawg-capwap-alt-tunnel-01.txt
	Pages           : 13
	Date            : 2014-07-25

Abstract:
   CAPWAP defines a specification to encapsulate a station's data frames
   between the Wireless Transmission Point (WTP) and Access Controller
   (AC) using CAPWAP.  Specifically, the station's IEEE 802.11 data
   frames can be either locally bridged or tunneled to the AC.  When
   tunneled, a CAPWAP data channel is used for tunneling.  In many
   deployments it is desirable to encapsulate date frames to an entity
   different from the AC for example to an Access Router (AR).  Further,
   it may also be desirable to use different tunnel encapsulations to
   carry the stations' data frames.  This document provides a
   specification for this and refers to it as Alternate tunnel
   encapsulation.  The Alternate tunnel encapsulation allows 1) the WTP
   to tunnel non-management data frames to an endpoint different from
   the AC and 2) the WTP to tunnel using one of many known encapsulation
   types such as IP-IP, IP-GRE, CAPWAP.  The WTP may advertise support
   for Alternate tunnel encapsulation during the discovery or join
   process and AC may select one of the supported Alternate Tunnel
   encapsulation types while configuring the WTP.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-opsawg-capwap-alt-tunnel/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-opsawg-capwap-alt-tunnel-01

A diff from the previous version is available at:
http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-opsawg-capwap-alt-tunnel-01


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Fri Jul 25 11:03:03 2014
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Subject: [OPSAWG] Call for review draft-farrkingel-pce-abno-architecture
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Hi,

The authors of draft-farrkingel-pce-abno-architecture are in the process of
requesting AD-sponsored publication of draft-farrkingel-pce-abno-architecture

This I-D is a bit of an architecture and a bit an applicability statement. It is
also significantly about how to build and operate networks.

The last call will obviously pop out sometime, but it would be nice to have
review comments before then.

Thanks,
Adrian


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Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2014 15:17:56 -0700
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From: Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
To: "Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)" <tsenevir@cisco.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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--089e0122f5fa0f2f1a04ff84a517
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Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,
I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of these documents. OAM
is not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It even not limited to
continuity check. And in connectionless networks there would not be
connectivity verification. And the performance measurement is the big part
of OAM as well as protection coordination, defect alarms, and etc. Hence my
question, is it in plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective
documents?

Regards,
Greg


On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) <
tsenevir@cisco.com> wrote:

>  All
>
>
>
> We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic
> framework for OAM, that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 and
> #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,
>
>
>
> 1.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/
>
> 2.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/
>
> 3.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/
>
>
>
> Please review and share your comments
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Tissa
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nvo3 mailing list
> nvo3@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,<br></div>I&#39;v=
e read documents and would like to clarify scope of these documents. OAM is=
 not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It even not limited to conti=
nuity check. And in connectionless networks there would not be connectivity=
 verification. And the performance measurement is the big part of OAM as we=
ll as protection coordination, defect alarms, and etc. Hence my question, i=
s it in plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective documents?=
<br>
<br></div>Regards,<br></div>Greg<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><b=
r><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevi=
rathne (tsenevir) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tsenevir@cisco.co=
m" target=3D"_blank">tsenevir@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">All<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below=
 place the generic framework for OAM, that can be augmented for different t=
echnologies. #2 and #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<u>=
</u><u></u></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p><u></u><span>1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span></span><u></u><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa=
-netmod-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa=
-netmod-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><u></u><span>2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span></span><u></u><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa=
-nvo3-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ti=
ssa-nvo3-yang-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><u></u><span>3.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt &quot;Times New Roman&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span></span><u></u><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa=
-trill-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-t=
issa-trill-yang-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Please review and share your comments<u></u><u></u><=
/p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Thanks<span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"=
><u></u><u></u></font></span></p><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888=
888">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Tissa<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</font></span></div>
</div>

<br>_______________________________________________<br>
nvo3 mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

--089e0122f5fa0f2f1a04ff84a517--


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Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2014 15:53:06 -0700
From: Tissa Senevirathne <tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Greg=0A=0AYes it is, generic YANG model steup the base framework. It can be=
 extended to add tools as well as other elements as well technology deviati=
ons. Alarms etc either be part of this document will be a separate document=
 that specifies them. That is the reason we have designed the model as modu=
lar as possible and extensible as possible.=0A=0APlease let us know if any =
of the parts are not extensible or not modular enough.=0A=0AThanks=0ATissa=
=0A=0A=0AOn Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail=
.com> wrote:=0A =0A=0A=0AHi Tissa, authors, et. al,=0AI've read documents a=
nd would like to clarify scope of these documents. OAM is not limited to pi=
ng and traceroute functions. It even not limited to continuity check. And i=
n connectionless networks there would not be connectivity verification. And=
 the performance measurement is the big part of OAM as well as protection c=
oordination, defect alarms, and etc. Hence my question, is it in plans of t=
he authors to address all of OAM in respective documents?=0A=0ARegards,=0AG=
reg=0A=0A=0A=0A=0AOn Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tse=
nevir) <tsenevir@cisco.com> wrote:=0A=0AAll=0A>=A0=0A>We have published YAN=
G model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic framework for OAM, that c=
an be augmented for different technologies. #2 and #3 are application of th=
e concept to NVO3 and TRILL,=0A>=A0=0A>1.=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 http://datatracker=
.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/=0A>2.=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 http://datatrack=
er.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/=0A>3.=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0 http://data=
tracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/=0A>=A0=0A>Please review an=
d share your comments=0A>=A0=0A>Thanks=0A>Tissa=0A>=A0=0A>=A0=0A>__________=
_____________________________________=0A>nvo3 mailing list=0A>nvo3@ietf.org=
=0A>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3=0A>=0A>
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<html><body><div style=3D"color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:He=
lveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;fo=
nt-size:12pt"><div><span>Greg</span></div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0)=
; font-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica,=
 Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: =
transparent;"><span><br></span></div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); fon=
t-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Aria=
l, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: trans=
parent;"><span>Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the base framework. It c=
an be extended to add tools as well as other elements as well technology de=
viations. Alarms etc either be part of this document will be a separate doc=
ument that specifies them. That is the reason we have designed the model as=
 modular as possible and extensible as possible.</span></div><div
 style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNeue,=
 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-styl=
e: normal; background-color: transparent;"><br></div><div style=3D"color: r=
gb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue',=
 Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; backgro=
und-color: transparent;">Please let us know if any of the parts are not ext=
ensible or not modular enough.</div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font=
-size: 16px; font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial=
, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transp=
arent;"><br></div><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-=
family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande',=
 sans-serif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;">Thanks</di=
v><div style=3D"color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family:
 HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-s=
erif; font-style: normal; background-color: transparent;">Tissa</div> <div =
class=3D"qtdSeparateBR"><br><br></div><div class=3D"yahoo_quoted" style=3D"=
display: block;"> <div style=3D"font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue=
', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lucida Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div s=
tyle=3D"font-family: HelveticaNeue, 'Helvetica Neue', Helvetica, Arial, 'Lu=
cida Grande', sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div dir=3D"ltr"> <font size=
=3D"2" face=3D"Arial"> On Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky &lt;=
gregimirsky@gmail.com&gt; wrote:<br> </font> </div>  <br><br> <div class=3D=
"y_msg_container"><div id=3D"yiv8598694937"><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div=
><div>Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,<br clear=3D"none"></div>I've read document=
s and would like to clarify scope of these documents. OAM is not limited to=
 ping and traceroute functions. It even not limited to continuity check. An=
d in connectionless
 networks there would not be connectivity verification. And the performance=
 measurement is the big part of OAM as well as protection coordination, def=
ect alarms, and etc. Hence my question, is it in plans of the authors to ad=
dress all of OAM in respective documents?<br clear=3D"none">=0A<br clear=3D=
"none"></div>Regards,<br clear=3D"none"></div>Greg<br clear=3D"none"></div>=
<div class=3D"yiv8598694937gmail_extra"><br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"non=
e"><div class=3D"yiv8598694937gmail_quote">On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM=
, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a rel=3D"nofollow" s=
hape=3D"rect" ymailto=3D"mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank" href=
=3D"mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com">tsenevir@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br =
clear=3D"none">=0A<blockquote class=3D"yiv8598694937gmail_quote" style=3D"m=
argin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">=0A=0A=0A=0A=
=0A=0A<div class=3D"yiv8598694937yqt5900051142" id=3D"yiv8598694937yqt80699=
"><div lang=3D"EN-US">=0A<div>=0A<div class=3D"yiv8598694937MsoNormal">All<=
u></u><u></u></div>=0A<div class=3D"yiv8598694937MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u=
></u></div>=0A<div class=3D"yiv8598694937MsoNormal">We have published YANG =
model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic framework for OAM, that can=
 be augmented for different technologies. #2 and #3 are application of the =
concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<u></u><u></u></div>=0A=0A<div class=3D"yiv859869=
4937MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></div>=0A<div><u></u><span>1.<span style=
=3D"font:7.0pt;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=0A</span></span><u></u><a r=
el=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://datatracker=
.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draf=
t-tissa-netmod-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></div>=0A<div><u></u><span>2.<span sty=
le=3D"font:7.0pt;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=0A</span></span><u></u><a=
 rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://datatrack=
er.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc=
/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></div>=0A<div><u></u><span>3.<=
span style=3D"font:7.0pt;">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;=0A</span></span><=
u></u><a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"http://d=
atatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/">http://datatracker.iet=
f.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></div>=0A<div class=
=3D"yiv8598694937MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></div>=0A<div class=3D"yiv8=
598694937MsoNormal">Please review and share your comments<u></u><u></u></di=
v>=0A<div class=3D"yiv8598694937MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></div>=0A<di=
v class=3D"yiv8598694937MsoNormal">Thanks<span class=3D"yiv8598694937HOEnZb=
"><font color=3D"#888888"><u></u><u></u></font></span></div><span class=3D"=
yiv8598694937HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888">=0A</font></span><div class=3D=
"yiv8598694937MsoNormal">Tissa<u></u><u></u></div>=0A<div class=3D"yiv85986=
94937MsoNormal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></div>=0A<div class=3D"yiv8598694937Mso=
Normal"><u></u>&nbsp;<u></u></div>=0A</div>=0A</div></div>=0A=0A<br clear=
=3D"none">_______________________________________________<br clear=3D"none"=
>=0Anvo3 mailing list<br clear=3D"none">=0A<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rec=
t" ymailto=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"mailto:nvo3@i=
etf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a><br clear=3D"none">=0A<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=
=3D"rect" target=3D"_blank" href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/n=
vo3">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3</a><br clear=3D"none">=0A<b=
r clear=3D"none"></blockquote></div><br clear=3D"none"></div></div></div><b=
r><br></div>  </div> </div>  </div> </div></body></html>
--1735733242-2146564396-1406847186=:16320--


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From: "O'Connor, Don" <don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com>
To: Tissa Senevirathne <tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com>, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>, "Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)" <tsenevir@cisco.com>
Thread-Topic: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2014 23:31:58 +0000
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Tissa, Greg, all

Metro Ethernet Forum has already standardized Yang Modules for Ethernet Ser=
vice OAM Performance Monitoring and Fault Management. Please see MEF 38 and=
 39

http://metroethernetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications

Regards

Don

From: L2vpn [mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tissa Senevirathne
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 5:53 PM
To: Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)
Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; netmod@ietf.org; trill@=
ietf.org
Subject: Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM

Greg

Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the base framework. It can be extended =
to add tools as well as other elements as well technology deviations. Alarm=
s etc either be part of this document will be a separate document that spec=
ifies them. That is the reason we have designed the model as modular as pos=
sible and extensible as possible.

Please let us know if any of the parts are not extensible or not modular en=
ough.

Thanks
Tissa

On Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com<mail=
to:gregimirsky@gmail.com>> wrote:

Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,
I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of these documents. OAM=
 is not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It even not limited to co=
ntinuity check. And in connectionless networks there would not be connectiv=
ity verification. And the performance measurement is the big part of OAM as=
 well as protection coordination, defect alarms, and etc. Hence my question=
, is it in plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective documen=
ts?
Regards,
Greg

On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) <tsenevir@c=
isco.com<mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com>> wrote:
All

We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic fram=
ework for OAM, that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 and #3 =
are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,

1.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/
2.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/
3.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/

Please review and share your comments

Thanks
Tissa



_______________________________________________
nvo3 mailing list
nvo3@ietf.org<mailto:nvo3@ietf.org>
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<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Tissa, Greg, all<o:p></o:p>=
</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Metro Ethernet Forum has al=
ready standardized Yang Modules for Ethernet Service OAM Performance Monito=
ring and Fault Management. Please see MEF 38 and 39<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><a href=3D"http://metroethe=
rnetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications">http://metroethern=
etforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications</a><o:p></o:p></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Regards<o:p></o:p></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Don<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> L2vpn [m=
ailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tissa Senevirathne<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 31, 2014 5:53 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
<b>Cc:</b> l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; netmod@ietf.org;=
 trill@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Greg<o:p></o:p>=
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the ba=
se framework. It can be extended to add tools as well as other elements as =
well technology deviations. Alarms etc either be part of
 this document will be a separate document that specifies them. That is the=
 reason we have designed the model as modular as possible and extensible as=
 possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Please let us know if any of the parts are=
 not extensible or not modular enough.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Tissa<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">On=
 Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gregimi=
rsky@gmail.com">gregimirsky@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</span><span style=3D"f=
ont-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p><=
/o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div id=3D"yiv8598694937">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Hi Tissa, autho=
rs, et. al,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack">I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of these document=
s. OAM is not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It
 even not limited to continuity check. And in connectionless networks there=
 would not be connectivity verification. And the performance measurement is=
 the big part of OAM as well as protection coordination, defect alarms, and=
 etc. Hence my question, is it in
 plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective documents?<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Regards,<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Greg<o:p></o:p>=
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">On Tue, Jun 10,=
 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tsen=
evir@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">tsenevir@cisco.com</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o=
:p></span></p>
<div id=3D"yiv8598694937yqt80699">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">All<o:p></o:p><=
/span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">We have publish=
ed YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic framework for OAM, =
that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 and #3
 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">1.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-net=
mod-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-net=
mod-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">2.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo=
3-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-=
nvo3-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">3.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-tri=
ll-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa=
-trill-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Please review a=
nd share your comments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Tissa<o:p></o:p=
></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
nvo3 mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">nvo3@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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From: "Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)" <tsenevir@cisco.com>
To: "O'Connor, Don" <don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com>, Tissa Senevirathne <tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com>, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Don

I am aware of that, but this is different, MEF YANG model is specifically f=
or Ethernet and structure does not allow to bring different addressing sche=
mes other than MAC address. Additionally the proposed standard allow to add=
 flow entropies and facilitate nested OAM between different technologies. Y=
ou may have to read in to the details to see the actual differences.

From: O'Connor, Don [mailto:don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com]
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:32 PM
To: Tissa Senevirathne; Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)
Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; netmod@ietf.org; trill@=
ietf.org
Subject: RE: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM

Tissa, Greg, all

Metro Ethernet Forum has already standardized Yang Modules for Ethernet Ser=
vice OAM Performance Monitoring and Fault Management. Please see MEF 38 and=
 39

http://metroethernetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications

Regards

Don

From: L2vpn [mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Tissa Senevirathne
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 5:53 PM
To: Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)
Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org<mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org>; opsawg@ietf.org<mailto:opsawg@ie=
tf.org>; nvo3@ietf.org<mailto:nvo3@ietf.org>; netmod@ietf.org<mailto:netmod=
@ietf.org>; trill@ietf.org<mailto:trill@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM

Greg

Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the base framework. It can be extended =
to add tools as well as other elements as well technology deviations. Alarm=
s etc either be part of this document will be a separate document that spec=
ifies them. That is the reason we have designed the model as modular as pos=
sible and extensible as possible.

Please let us know if any of the parts are not extensible or not modular en=
ough.

Thanks
Tissa

On Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com<mail=
to:gregimirsky@gmail.com>> wrote:

Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,
I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of these documents. OAM=
 is not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It even not limited to co=
ntinuity check. And in connectionless networks there would not be connectiv=
ity verification. And the performance measurement is the big part of OAM as=
 well as protection coordination, defect alarms, and etc. Hence my question=
, is it in plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective documen=
ts?
Regards,
Greg

On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) <tsenevir@c=
isco.com<mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com>> wrote:
All

We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic fram=
ework for OAM, that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 and #3 =
are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,

1.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/
2.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/
3.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/

Please review and share your comments

Thanks
Tissa



_______________________________________________
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Don<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><br>
I am aware of that, but this is different, MEF YANG model is specifically f=
or Ethernet and structure does not allow to bring different addressing sche=
mes other than MAC address. Additionally the proposed standard allow to add=
 flow entropies and facilitate nested
 OAM between different technologies. You may have to read in to the details=
 to see the actual differences.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span><=
/p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> O'Connor=
, Don [mailto:don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:32 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne; Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<b=
r>
<b>Cc:</b> l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; netmod@ietf.org;=
 trill@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Tissa, Greg, all<o:p></o:p>=
</span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Metro Ethernet Forum has al=
ready standardized Yang Modules for Ethernet Service OAM Performance Monito=
ring and Fault Management. Please see MEF 38 and 39<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><a href=3D"http://metroethe=
rnetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications">http://metroethern=
etforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications</a><o:p></o:p></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Regards<o:p></o:p></span></=
p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Don<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> L2vpn [<=
a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org">mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tissa Senevirathne<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 31, 2014 5:53 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D=
"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">
netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a><b=
r>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Greg<o:p></o:p>=
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the ba=
se framework. It can be extended to add tools as well as other elements as =
well technology deviations. Alarms etc either be part of
 this document will be a separate document that specifies them. That is the=
 reason we have designed the model as modular as possible and extensible as=
 possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Please let us know if any of the parts are=
 not extensible or not modular enough.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Tissa<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">On=
 Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gregimi=
rsky@gmail.com">gregimirsky@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</span><span style=3D"f=
ont-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p><=
/o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div id=3D"yiv8598694937">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Hi Tissa, autho=
rs, et. al,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack">I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of these document=
s. OAM is not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It
 even not limited to continuity check. And in connectionless networks there=
 would not be connectivity verification. And the performance measurement is=
 the big part of OAM as well as protection coordination, defect alarms, and=
 etc. Hence my question, is it in
 plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective documents?<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Regards,<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Greg<o:p></o:p>=
</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">On Tue, Jun 10,=
 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tsen=
evir@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">tsenevir@cisco.com</a>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o=
:p></span></p>
<div id=3D"yiv8598694937yqt80699">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">All<o:p></o:p><=
/span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">We have publish=
ed YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic framework for OAM, =
that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 and #3
 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">1.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-net=
mod-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-net=
mod-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">2.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo=
3-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-=
nvo3-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">3.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-tri=
ll-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa=
-trill-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Please review a=
nd share your comments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Tissa<o:p></o:p=
></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
nvo3 mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">nvo3@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:=
p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
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From nobody Thu Jul 31 16:50:21 2014
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Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2014 16:48:36 -0700
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From: Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
To: "O'Connor, Don" <don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Hi Don,
thank you for the reference. And I'd point that ITU SG15 is working on
standardizing "generic protocol-neutral management information model" for
transport network, including OAM. Hence my question, What is the scope of
these documents?

Regards,
Greg


On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 4:31 PM, O'Connor, Don <don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com>
wrote:

>  Tissa, Greg, all
>
>
>
> Metro Ethernet Forum has already standardized Yang Modules for Ethernet
> Service OAM Performance Monitoring and Fault Management. Please see MEF 38
> and 39
>
>
>
> http://metroethernetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications
>
>
>
> Regards
>
>
>
> Don
>
>
>
> *From:* L2vpn [mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Tissa
> Senevirathne
> *Sent:* Thursday, July 31, 2014 5:53 PM
> *To:* Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)
>
> *Cc:* l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; netmod@ietf.org;
> trill@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the base framework. It can be extended
> to add tools as well as other elements as well technology deviations.
> Alarms etc either be part of this document will be a separate document that
> specifies them. That is the reason we have designed the model as modular as
> possible and extensible as possible.
>
>
>
> Please let us know if any of the parts are not extensible or not modular
> enough.
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Tissa
>
>
>
> On Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,
>
> I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of these documents.
> OAM is not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It even not limited to
> continuity check. And in connectionless networks there would not be
> connectivity verification. And the performance measurement is the big part
> of OAM as well as protection coordination, defect alarms, and etc. Hence my
> question, is it in plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective
> documents?
>
> Regards,
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) <
> tsenevir@cisco.com> wrote:
>
> All
>
>
>
> We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic
> framework for OAM, that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 and
> #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,
>
>
>
> 1.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/
>
> 2.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/
>
> 3.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/
>
>
>
> Please review and share your comments
>
>
>
> Thanks
>
> Tissa
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nvo3 mailing list
> nvo3@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3
>
>
>
>
>

--089e0122f5fa4a297104ff85e9c4
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>Hi Don,<br></div>thank you for the referenc=
e. And I&#39;d point that ITU SG15 is working on standardizing <span class=
=3D""> &quot;generic protocol-neutral management<em></em></span> informatio=
n model&quot; for transport network, including OAM. Hence my question, What=
 is the scope of these documents?<br>
<br></div>Regards,<br></div>Greg<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><b=
r><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 4:31 PM, O&#39;Connor,=
 Don <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d">Tissa, Greg, all<u></u><u><=
/u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d">Metro Ethernet Forum has al=
ready standardized Yang Modules for Ethernet Service OAM Performance Monito=
ring and Fault Management. Please see MEF 38 and 39<u></u><u></u></span></p=
>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d"><a href=3D"http://metroethe=
rnetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications" target=3D"_blank">=
http://metroethernetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications</a>=
<u></u><u></u></span></p>

<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d">Regards<u></u><u></u></span=
></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d">Don<u></u><u></u></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ar=
ial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span>=
</p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in =
0in 0in">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;"> L2vpn [m=
ailto:<a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">l2vpn-bou=
nces@ietf.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tissa Senevirathne<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 31, 2014 5:53 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)</span></p><div class=
=3D""><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">l2vpn@ietf.o=
rg</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">opsawg@ietf.or=
g</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">nvo3@ietf.org</a>=
; <a href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">netmod@ietf.org</a>;=
 <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">trill@ietf.org</a><br>

<b>Subject:</b> Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<u></u><u></u></div><p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Greg<u></u><u><=
/u></span></p>
</div><div><div class=3D"h5">
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the ba=
se framework. It can be extended to add tools as well as other elements as =
well technology deviations. Alarms etc either be part of
 this document will be a separate document that specifies them. That is the=
 reason we have designed the model as modular as possible and extensible as=
 possible.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Please let us know if any of the parts are=
 not extensible or not modular enough.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Tissa<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-size:=
10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">On=
 Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gregimi=
rsky@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">gregimirsky@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</spa=
n><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;c=
olor:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>

</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Hi Tissa, autho=
rs, et. al,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack">I&#39;ve read documents and would like to clarify scope of these docu=
ments. OAM is not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It
 even not limited to continuity check. And in connectionless networks there=
 would not be connectivity verification. And the performance measurement is=
 the big part of OAM as well as protection coordination, defect alarms, and=
 etc. Hence my question, is it in
 plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective documents?<u></u>=
<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Regards,<u></u>=
<u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Greg<u></u><u><=
/u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">On Tue, Jun 10,=
 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tsen=
evir@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">tsenevir@cisco.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><=
u></u></span></p>

<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">All<u></u><u></=
u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">We have publish=
ed YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic framework for OAM, =
that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 and #3
 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">1.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-net=
mod-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-net=
mod-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>

</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">2.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo=
3-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-=
nvo3-yang-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>

</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">3.</span><span =
style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif=
&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0
</span><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&qu=
ot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-tri=
ll-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa=
-trill-yang-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>

</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Please review a=
nd share your comments<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Tissa<u></u><u>=
</u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=C2=A0<u></u><u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
nvo3 mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">nvo3@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span style=3D"font-famil=
y:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><u></u>=C2=A0<u=
></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:b=
lack"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div></div></div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div><br></div>

--089e0122f5fa4a297104ff85e9c4--


From nobody Thu Jul 31 18:06:52 2014
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From: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
To: "O'Connor, Don" <don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com>, Tissa Senevirathne <tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com>, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>, "Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)" <tsenevir@cisco.com>
Thread-Topic: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2014 01:06:16 +0000
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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</head>
<body lang=3D"ZH-CN" link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">I think ME=
F more look at Yang data module for Y.1731, It is Ethernet technology speci=
fic Yang Data model.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp=
;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Regards!<o=
:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">-Qin<o:p><=
/o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSu=
n">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"=
EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun"> OPSAWG [mailto:opsawg=
-bounces@ietf.org]
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">=B4=FA=B1=ED =
</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSu=
n">O'Connor, Don<br>
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">=B7=A2=CB=CD=
=CA=B1=BC=E4<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" st=
yle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun"> 2014</span><span style=3D"font=
-size:10.0pt;font-family:SimSun">=C4=EA<span lang=3D"EN-US">8</span>=D4=C2<=
span lang=3D"EN-US">1</span>=C8=D5<span lang=3D"EN-US">
 7:32<br>
</span><b>=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"=
EN-US"> Tissa Senevirathne; Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
</span><b>=B3=AD=CB=CD<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; netmod@ietf.org; trill@ie=
tf.org<br>
</span><b>=D6=F7=CC=E2<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> Re: [OPSAWG] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Tissa, Greg,=
 all<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Metro Ethern=
et Forum has already standardized Yang Modules for Ethernet Service OAM Per=
formance Monitoring and Fault Management. Please see MEF 38
 and 39<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><a href=3D"h=
ttp://metroethernetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications">htt=
p://metroethernetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications</a><o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Regards<o:p>=
</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Don<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;"> L2vpn [<a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org">mail=
to:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tissa Senevirathne<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 31, 2014 5:53 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D=
"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">
netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a><b=
r>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Yes it is, generic YANG mod=
el steup the base framework. It can be extended to add tools as well as oth=
er elements as well technology deviations. Alarms etc either
 be part of this document will be a separate document that specifies them. =
That is the reason we have designed the model as modular as possible and ex=
tensible as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Please let us know if any o=
f the parts are not extensible or not modular enough.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Tissa<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;=
color:black">On Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:gregimirsky@gmail.com">gregimirsky@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</span><=
span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-s=
erif&quot;;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div id=3D"yiv8598694937">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black">I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of=
 these documents. OAM is not limited to ping and traceroute
 functions. It even not limited to continuity check. And in connectionless =
networks there would not be connectivity verification. And the performance =
measurement is the big part of OAM as well as protection coordination, defe=
ct alarms, and etc. Hence my question,
 is it in plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective document=
s?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">tsenevir@cisco.com</a>&gt;
 wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div id=3D"yiv8598694937yqt80699">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
All<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic fram=
ework for OAM, that can be augmented for different technologies.
 #2 and #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<o:p></o:p></sp=
an></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
1.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quo=
t;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/=
draft-tissa-netmod-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/=
draft-tissa-netmod-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
2.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quo=
t;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/=
draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/d=
oc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
3.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quo=
t;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/=
draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/=
doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Please review and share your comments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Tissa<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
nvo3 mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">nvo3@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
<o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
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From: Qin Wu <bill.wu@huawei.com>
To: "Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)" <tsenevir@cisco.com>, "O'Connor, Don" <don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com>, Tissa Senevirathne <tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com>, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Date: Fri, 1 Aug 2014 01:11:09 +0000
Message-ID: <B8F9A780D330094D99AF023C5877DABA8458DB1D@nkgeml501-mbs.china.huawei.com>
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<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Exactly, d=
ifferent layer may have different addressing schemes. But I am wondering wh=
ich layer the flow entropies are applied? L2, L3, MPLS layer?<o:p></o:p></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.5pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp=
;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=
=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> netmod =
[mailto:netmod-bounces@ietf.org]
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B4=FA=
=B1=ED </span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-famil=
y:=CB=CE=CC=E5">Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
</span><b><span style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=B7=A2=
=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></span></b><span lang=3D"EN-=
US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5"> 2014</span><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:=CB=CE=CC=E5">=C4=EA<span lang=3D"EN-U=
S">8</span>=D4=C2<span lang=3D"EN-US">1</span>=C8=D5<span lang=3D"EN-US">
 7:49<br>
</span><b>=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"=
EN-US"> O'Connor, Don; Tissa Senevirathne; Greg Mirsky<br>
</span><b>=B3=AD=CB=CD<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> l2vpn@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nvo3@ietf.org; netmod@ietf.org; trill@ie=
tf.org<br>
</span><b>=D6=F7=CC=E2<span lang=3D"EN-US">:</span></b><span lang=3D"EN-US"=
> Re: [netmod] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Don<o:p></=
o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><br>
I am aware of that, but this is different, MEF YANG model is specifically f=
or Ethernet and structure does not allow to bring different addressing sche=
mes other than MAC address. Additionally the proposed standard allow to add=
 flow entropies and facilitate nested
 OAM between different technologies. You may have to read in to the details=
 to see the actual differences.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp=
;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;"> O'Connor, Don [<a href=3D"mailto:don.oconnor@us.fujit=
su.com">mailto:don.oconnor@us.fujitsu.com</a>]
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:32 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Tissa Senevirathne; Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<b=
r>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D=
"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">
netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a><b=
r>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Tissa, Greg,=
 all<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Metro Ethern=
et Forum has already standardized Yang Modules for Ethernet Service OAM Per=
formance Monitoring and Fault Management. Please see MEF 38
 and 39<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><a href=3D"h=
ttp://metroethernetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications">htt=
p://metroethernetforum.org/carrier-ethernet/technical-specifications</a><o:=
p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Regards<o:p>=
</o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D">Don<o:p></o:=
p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-=
family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:#1F497D"><o:p>&nbsp;<=
/o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;fo=
nt-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;">From:</span></b><span =
lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Tahoma&quot;,&qu=
ot;sans-serif&quot;"> L2vpn [<a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org">mail=
to:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tissa Senevirathne<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, July 31, 2014 5:53 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Greg Mirsky; Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir)<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:l2vpn@ietf.org">l2vpn@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D=
"mailto:opsawg@ietf.org">
opsawg@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org">nvo3@ietf.org</a>; <a=
 href=3D"mailto:netmod@ietf.org">
netmod@ietf.org</a>; <a href=3D"mailto:trill@ietf.org">trill@ietf.org</a><b=
r>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [nvo3] YANG models for OAM<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Yes it is, generic YANG mod=
el steup the base framework. It can be extended to add tools as well as oth=
er elements as well technology deviations. Alarms etc either
 be part of this document will be a separate document that specifies them. =
That is the reason we have designed the model as modular as possible and ex=
tensible as possible.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Please let us know if any o=
f the parts are not extensible or not modular enough.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p=
>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helv=
etica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">Tissa<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-size:10.0pt;font-family:&quot;Arial&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;=
color:black">On Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:gregimirsky@gmail.com">gregimirsky@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</span><=
span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-s=
erif&quot;;color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div id=3D"yiv8598694937">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black">I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of=
 these documents. OAM is not limited to ping and traceroute
 functions. It even not limited to continuity check. And in connectionless =
networks there would not be connectivity verification. And the performance =
measurement is the big part of OAM as well as protection coordination, defe=
ct alarms, and etc. Hence my question,
 is it in plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective document=
s?<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Regards,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Greg<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">tsenevir@cisco.com</a>&gt;
 wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div id=3D"yiv8598694937yqt80699">
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
All<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic fram=
ework for OAM, that can be augmented for different technologies.
 #2 and #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<o:p></o:p></sp=
an></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
1.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quo=
t;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/=
draft-tissa-netmod-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/=
draft-tissa-netmod-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
2.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quo=
t;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/=
draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/d=
oc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
3.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-size:7.0pt;font-family:&quot;He=
lvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&=
nbsp;
</span><span lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quo=
t;sans-serif&quot;;color:black"><a href=3D"http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/=
draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://datatracker.ietf.org/=
doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Please review and share your comments<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Thanks<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
Tissa<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"background:white"><span lang=3D"EN-US" styl=
e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
f&quot;;color:black"><br>
_______________________________________________<br>
nvo3 mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">nvo3@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3" target=3D"_blank">ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3</a><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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e=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-serif&quot;;color:black">=
<o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt;background:white"><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US" style=3D"font-family:&quot;Helvetica&quot;,&quot;sans-seri=
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From nobody Thu Jul 31 18:43:29 2014
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Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2014 18:42:26 -0700
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From: Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
To: Tissa Senevirathne <tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com>
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Subject: Re: [OPSAWG] [nvo3] YANG models for OAM
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Hi Tissa,
I feel that clear definition of the scope of work is important. From
reading the documents, my impression, is that on-demand OAM tools that
support detection and localization of Loss of Continuity defect are in
scope while the rest of OAM is for further study. I think that it would
benefit the documents and discussion if scope be firmly set.

Regards,
Greg


On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 3:53 PM, Tissa Senevirathne <
tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Greg
>
> Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the base framework. It can be extended
> to add tools as well as other elements as well technology deviations.
> Alarms etc either be part of this document will be a separate document that
> specifies them. That is the reason we have designed the model as modular as
> possible and extensible as possible.
>
> Please let us know if any of the parts are not extensible or not modular
> enough.
>
> Thanks
> Tissa
>
>
>   On Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> Hi Tissa, authors, et. al,
> I've read documents and would like to clarify scope of these documents.
> OAM is not limited to ping and traceroute functions. It even not limited to
> continuity check. And in connectionless networks there would not be
> connectivity verification. And the performance measurement is the big part
> of OAM as well as protection coordination, defect alarms, and etc. Hence my
> question, is it in plans of the authors to address all of OAM in respective
> documents?
>
> Regards,
> Greg
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 10, 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) <
> tsenevir@cisco.com> wrote:
>
>  All
>
> We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic
> framework for OAM, that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 and
> #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,
>
> 1.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/
> 2.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/
> 3.      http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/
>
> Please review and share your comments
>
> Thanks
> Tissa
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nvo3 mailing list
> nvo3@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3
>
>
>
>
>

--047d7b34354c665c7504ff87809e
Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>Hi Tissa,<br></div>I feel that clear defini=
tion of the scope of work is important. From reading the documents, my impr=
ession, is that on-demand OAM tools that support detection and localization=
 of Loss of Continuity defect are in scope while the rest of OAM is for fur=
ther study. I think that it would benefit the documents and discussion if s=
cope be firmly set.<br>
<br></div>Regards,<br></div>Greg<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><b=
r><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 3:53 PM, Tissa Senevir=
athne <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com" =
target=3D"_blank">tissasenevirathne@yahoo.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div style=3D"color:#000;background-col=
or:#fff;font-family:HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Gra=
nde,sans-serif;font-size:12pt">
<div><span>Greg</span></div><div style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;f=
ont-family:HelveticaNeue,&#39;Helvetica Neue&#39;,Helvetica,Arial,&#39;Luci=
da Grande&#39;,sans-serif;font-style:normal;background-color:transparent">
<span><br></span></div><div style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-f=
amily:HelveticaNeue,&#39;Helvetica Neue&#39;,Helvetica,Arial,&#39;Lucida Gr=
ande&#39;,sans-serif;font-style:normal;background-color:transparent"><span>=
Yes it is, generic YANG model steup the base framework. It can be extended =
to add tools as well as other elements as well technology deviations. Alarm=
s etc either be part of this document will be a separate document that spec=
ifies them. That is the reason we have designed the model as modular as pos=
sible and extensible as possible.</span></div>
<div style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:HelveticaNeue,&#3=
9;Helvetica Neue&#39;,Helvetica,Arial,&#39;Lucida Grande&#39;,sans-serif;fo=
nt-style:normal;background-color:transparent"><br></div><div style=3D"color=
:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:HelveticaNeue,&#39;Helvetica Neue&#3=
9;,Helvetica,Arial,&#39;Lucida Grande&#39;,sans-serif;font-style:normal;bac=
kground-color:transparent">
Please let us know if any of the parts are not extensible or not modular en=
ough.</div><div style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:Helvet=
icaNeue,&#39;Helvetica Neue&#39;,Helvetica,Arial,&#39;Lucida Grande&#39;,sa=
ns-serif;font-style:normal;background-color:transparent">
<br></div><div style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font-size:16px;font-family:Helveti=
caNeue,&#39;Helvetica Neue&#39;,Helvetica,Arial,&#39;Lucida Grande&#39;,san=
s-serif;font-style:normal;background-color:transparent">Thanks</div><span c=
lass=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><div style=3D"color:rgb(0,0,0);font=
-size:16px;font-family:HelveticaNeue,&#39;Helvetica Neue&#39;,Helvetica,Ari=
al,&#39;Lucida Grande&#39;,sans-serif;font-style:normal;background-color:tr=
ansparent">
Tissa</div></font></span><div><div class=3D"h5"> <div><br><br></div><div st=
yle=3D"display:block"> <div style=3D"font-family:HelveticaNeue,&#39;Helveti=
ca Neue&#39;,Helvetica,Arial,&#39;Lucida Grande&#39;,sans-serif;font-size:1=
2pt">
 <div style=3D"font-family:HelveticaNeue,&#39;Helvetica Neue&#39;,Helvetica=
,Arial,&#39;Lucida Grande&#39;,sans-serif;font-size:12pt"> <div dir=3D"ltr"=
> <font face=3D"Arial"> On Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:17 PM, Greg Mirsky &lt=
;<a href=3D"mailto:gregimirsky@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">gregimirsky@gma=
il.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br>
 </font> </div>  <br><br> <div><div><div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>Hi=
 Tissa, authors, et. al,<br clear=3D"none"></div>I&#39;ve read documents an=
d would like to clarify scope of these documents. OAM is not limited to pin=
g and traceroute functions. It even not limited to continuity check. And in=
 connectionless
 networks there would not be connectivity verification. And the performance=
 measurement is the big part of OAM as well as protection coordination, def=
ect alarms, and etc. Hence my question, is it in plans of the authors to ad=
dress all of OAM in respective documents?<br clear=3D"none">

<br clear=3D"none"></div>Regards,<br clear=3D"none"></div>Greg<br clear=3D"=
none"></div><div><br clear=3D"none"><br clear=3D"none"><div>On Tue, Jun 10,=
 2014 at 12:03 PM, Tissa Senevirathne (tsenevir) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a r=
el=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:tsenevir@cisco.com" target=3D=
"_blank">tsenevir@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br clear=3D"none">

<blockquote style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-l=
eft:1ex">





<div><div lang=3D"EN-US">
<div>
<div>All<u></u><u></u></div>
<div><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></div>
<div>We have published YANG model for OAM. #1 draft below place the generic=
 framework for OAM, that can be augmented for different technologies. #2 an=
d #3 are application of the concept to NVO3 and TRILL,<u></u><u></u></div>


<div><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></div>
<div><u></u><span>1.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0
</span></span><u></u><a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://data=
tracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://data=
tracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-netmod-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></div>
<div><u></u><span>2.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0
</span></span><u></u><a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://data=
tracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://d=
atatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-nvo3-yang-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></div>
<div><u></u><span>3.<span style=3D"font:7.0pt">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0
</span></span><u></u><a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" href=3D"http://data=
tracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/" target=3D"_blank">http://=
datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-tissa-trill-yang-oam/</a><u></u><u></u></div=
>
<div><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></div>
<div>Please review and share your comments<u></u><u></u></div>
<div><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></div>
<div>Thanks<span><font color=3D"#888888"><u></u><u></u></font></span></div>=
<span><font color=3D"#888888">
</font></span><div>Tissa<u></u><u></u></div>
<div><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></div>
<div><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></div>
</div>
</div></div>

<br clear=3D"none">_______________________________________________<br clear=
=3D"none">
nvo3 mailing list<br clear=3D"none">
<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" href=3D"mailto:nvo3@ietf.org" target=3D"=
_blank">nvo3@ietf.org</a><br clear=3D"none">
<a rel=3D"nofollow" shape=3D"rect" href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/lis=
tinfo/nvo3" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/nvo3</a=
><br clear=3D"none">
<br clear=3D"none"></blockquote></div><br clear=3D"none"></div></div></div>=
<br><br></div>  </div> </div>  </div> </div></div></div></div></blockquote>=
</div><br></div>

--047d7b34354c665c7504ff87809e--

