From nobody Sat Jan 3 22:21:02 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B80611A6F7C for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2015 22:21:00 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.211 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.211 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Q-sIsXFPNuHm for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2015 22:20:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 845EF1A6F7B for ; Sat, 3 Jan 2015 22:20:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml402-hub.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id BNO38572; Sun, 04 Jan 2015 06:20:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from SZXEMA413-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.82.72.72) by lhreml402-hub.china.huawei.com (10.201.5.241) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.158.1; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 06:20:56 +0000 Received: from SZXEMA506-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.4.42]) by SZXEMA413-HUB.china.huawei.com ([10.82.72.72]) with mapi id 14.03.0158.001; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 14:20:49 +0800 From: Jiangyuanlong To: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQH19mqFAxVOmoUEmhzRMRuIsjuZym6nIAgAijYZA= Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2015 06:20:49 +0000 Message-ID: <3B0A1BED22CAD649A1B3E97BE5DDD68B5A85C147@szxema506-mbs.china.huawei.com> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <4552F0907735844E9204A62BBDD325E76AB0363B@nkgeml512-mbx.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <4552F0907735844E9204A62BBDD325E76AB0363B@nkgeml512-mbx.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: zh-CN X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.66.76.118] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/jNBVaJ7Xpn_OdqCaVCSRVBlmuE8 Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2015 06:21:00 -0000 Support for adoption. Regards, Yuanlong >-----Original Message----- >From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant >Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:53 PM >To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org >Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of >draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > >Working Group, > >This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to >adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of >the PALS WG. > >Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working >group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical >motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that >the document should not be adopted as a working group document. > >In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will >run the poll until 16th January 2015. > >- Stewart > From nobody Sun Jan 4 00:09:41 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 018DC1A7003 for ; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 00:09:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.902 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.902 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id t0A28_eoCJG0 for ; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 00:09:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from emea01-am1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-am1on0754.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe00::754]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A56471A7001 for ; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 00:09:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.161.55.144) by DB3PR03MB0811.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.161.55.143) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.49.12; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 08:07:26 +0000 Received: from DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([25.161.55.144]) by DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([25.161.55.144]) with mapi id 15.01.0049.002; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 08:07:26 +0000 From: Alexander Vainshtein To: "pals@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQH19mqOoYZfDEAEKZ4t2u3wY2Rpyvpp4x Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2015 08:07:26 +0000 Message-ID: <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com>,<549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [5.153.9.206] authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com; x-dmarcaction: None x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:(3005003);SRVR:DB3PR03MB0811; x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DB3PR03MB0811; x-forefront-prvs: 0446F0FCE1 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(6009001)(377454003)(189002)(199003)(87936001)(101416001)(92566001)(2656002)(86362001)(19580405001)(19580395003)(71446004)(36756003)(76176999)(50986999)(54356999)(4396001)(2501002)(97736003)(21056001)(46102003)(68736005)(40100003)(15975445007)(102836002)(99396003)(122556002)(2950100001)(2900100001)(117636001)(110136001)(31966008)(230783001)(120916001)(77156002)(106356001)(62966003)(20776003)(106116001)(105586002)(66066001)(2351001)(64706001)(107046002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DB3PR03MB0811; H:DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ecitele.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: ecitele.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 04 Jan 2015 08:07:26.1656 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 2c514a61-08de-4519-b4c0-921fef62c42a X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DB3PR03MB0811 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/jIxml6aauP_fQeznTDic_SE2Nto Cc: "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "stbryant@cisco.com" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2015 08:09:35 -0000 Stewart and all,=0A= I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content per se.= =0A= However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already ado= pted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00. =0A= =0A= Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and both = seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different different = deployment scenarios.=0A= =0A= I would like to clarify that I do not actively object adoption of draft-sh= awam. =0A= The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG fe= els that this can be postponed. But I do not think that it can be avoided = altogether.=0A= =0A= Regards,=0A= Sasha=0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= =0A= ________________________________________=0A= From: Pals on behalf of Stewart Bryant =0A= Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM=0A= To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org=0A= Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pw= e3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft=0A= =0A= Working Group,=0A= =0A= This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to=0A= adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of=0A= the PALS WG.=0A= =0A= Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working=0A= group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical=0A= motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that=0A= the document should not be adopted as a working group document.=0A= =0A= In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will=0A= run the poll until 16th January 2015.=0A= =0A= - Stewart=0A= =0A= _______________________________________________=0A= Pals mailing list=0A= Pals@ietf.org=0A= https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals=0A= From nobody Sun Jan 4 03:07:41 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79DD11A7D83 for ; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 03:07:39 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id YPHcaKsQaMET for ; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 03:07:37 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wg0-x231.google.com (mail-wg0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c00::231]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5B02F1A7D82 for ; Sun, 4 Jan 2015 03:07:37 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wg0-f49.google.com with SMTP id n12so26132964wgh.36 for ; Sun, 04 Jan 2015 03:07:36 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:disposition-notification-to:date:from:reply-to :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=PY/+DDPkaww94TNBkGpjbLOt4KA//jDw9ZbMNZFzuqk=; b=IFK7kkLB/EXdXJoVq3ZeN0QWfWE8OxE+Ry1SfShSX9Pn8Zqm0Iy+d4w+XOa8wKC8r/ uLwxpTgD3NdslM4stEex/mZxHO7ioes1L07cAa7waBev2apnHUj/8K6QBQUZ2ZCRlZ8Z uOB/ObUEstdc07krGpQDHVnuWtBM4NqirAkQ9ORiWGw3BAlHIAOnlY2LC/o337Qpxeqf lCfFwYGFx5LwCjYlEEx8twEBWkfuOxBb9KQ9q4G/DIf9dJMkbHFSoh94hb4Xl0HSoTPL 6Xtm8z8e49BxutLAVpvL/z+NxcXGUaznFhhOXlgI798ua0G4UjcF9Lp1CdeNRnP9YlOn 07Mw== X-Received: by 10.194.89.3 with SMTP id bk3mr172022801wjb.92.1420369656072; Sun, 04 Jan 2015 03:07:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from McObelix.local (g215085.upc-g.chello.nl. [80.57.215.85]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id u18sm71127265wjq.42.2015.01.04.03.07.34 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sun, 04 Jan 2015 03:07:35 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <54A91EF5.1070500@gmail.com> Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2015 12:07:33 +0100 From: Huub van Helvoort User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.10; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: stbryant@cisco.com, draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org, "pals@ietf.org" References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/3JO7g9et2dZUa-g2OtLu76Juy9c Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: huubatwork@gmail.com List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 04 Jan 2015 11:07:39 -0000 All, I support the adoption (as co-author). Taking the opportunity to wish you a Happy and Healthy 2015, Huub. > Working Group, > > This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to > adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of > the PALS WG. > > Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working > group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical > motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that > the document should not be adopted as a working group document. > > In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will > run the poll until 16th January 2015. > > - Stewart > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals -- ***************************************************************** 请记住，你是独一无二的，就像其他每一个人一样 From nobody Mon Jan 5 07:41:02 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4D4CD1A01F0 for ; Mon, 5 Jan 2015 07:41:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.211 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.211 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0FJYf4xjQXUx for ; Mon, 5 Jan 2015 07:40:59 -0800 (PST) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B9A2D1A01BA for ; Mon, 5 Jan 2015 07:40:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml401-hub.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg02-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id BNP55923; Mon, 05 Jan 2015 15:40:57 +0000 (GMT) Received: from DFWEML705-CHM.china.huawei.com (10.193.5.142) by lhreml401-hub.china.huawei.com (10.201.5.240) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.158.1; Mon, 5 Jan 2015 15:40:56 +0000 Received: from DFWEML701-CHM.china.huawei.com ([10.193.5.50]) by dfweml705-chm ([10.193.5.142]) with mapi id 14.03.0158.001; Mon, 5 Jan 2015 07:40:42 -0800 From: Linda Dunbar To: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQH19nISKmzZd84k6B0wJxcscr85ynbrCQgAil14CAAaiXoA== Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2015 15:40:41 +0000 Message-ID: <4A95BA014132FF49AE685FAB4B9F17F645E8A68B@dfweml701-chm> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <4552F0907735844E9204A62BBDD325E76AB0363B@nkgeml512-mbx.china.huawei.com> <3B0A1BED22CAD649A1B3E97BE5DDD68B5A85C147@szxema506-mbs.china.huawei.com> In-Reply-To: <3B0A1BED22CAD649A1B3E97BE5DDD68B5A85C147@szxema506-mbs.china.huawei.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.47.136.47] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/jjO1_5KFjA8H8Tnv4jxyzr77218 Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 05 Jan 2015 15:41:01 -0000 Support for adoption. Regards, Linda Dunbar >-----Original Message----- >From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant >Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:53 PM >To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org >Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of=20 >draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > >Working Group, > >This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to adopt=20 >draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of the PALS WG. > >Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working=20 >group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical motivation=20 >for your support/not support, especially if you think that the document=20 >should not be adopted as a working group document. > >In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will=20 >run the poll until 16th January 2015. > >- Stewart > _______________________________________________ Pals mailing list Pals@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals From nobody Mon Jan 5 23:22:00 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A4A681A9109 for ; Mon, 5 Jan 2015 23:21:56 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5y7AwEAHtWSD for ; Mon, 5 Jan 2015 23:21:52 -0800 (PST) Received: from pipi.pi.nu (pipi.pi.nu [83.168.239.141]) (using TLSv1.1 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id F25C21A910A for ; Mon, 5 Jan 2015 23:21:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.12] (unknown [49.149.169.192]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: loa@pi.nu) by pipi.pi.nu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id CF66418013B8 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 08:21:49 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <54AB8D06.301@pi.nu> Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 15:21:42 +0800 From: Loa Andersson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.2; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: pals@ietf.org References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <4552F0907735844E9204A62BBDD325E76AB0363B@nkgeml512-mbx.china.huawei.com> <3B0A1BED22CAD649A1B3E97BE5DDD68B5A85C147@szxema506-mbs.china.huawei.com> <4A95BA014132FF49AE685FAB4B9F17F645E8A68B@dfweml701-chm> In-Reply-To: <4A95BA014132FF49AE685FAB4B9F17F645E8A68B@dfweml701-chm> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/cHm7YokA_G41qp7IMrr48wbqy9I Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 07:21:56 -0000 Folks, I'm a bit split about this, for working groups I chair or documents that I shepherd I normally count document authors supporting adoption as the default, i.e. no need to state it on the list. In the pals wg I see quite a bit of "support as co-author", I don't know if this adds anything. I anyone wonder I do of course support the adoption of the document. /Loa On 2015-01-05 23:40, Linda Dunbar wrote: > > Support for adoption. > > Regards, > Linda Dunbar > > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant >> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:53 PM >> To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org >> Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of >> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft >> >> >> Working Group, >> >> This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to adopt >> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of the PALS WG. >> >> Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working >> group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical motivation >> for your support/not support, especially if you think that the document >> should not be adopted as a working group document. >> >> In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will >> run the poll until 16th January 2015. >> >> - Stewart >> > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > -- Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 From nobody Tue Jan 6 02:20:44 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E60121A9144 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 02:20:41 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Sl5MXly3CP4V for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 02:20:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-wi0-x22d.google.com (mail-wi0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c05::22d]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A2C461A914A for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 02:20:39 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-wi0-f173.google.com with SMTP id r20so5016420wiv.12 for ; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 02:20:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:disposition-notification-to:date:from:reply-to :user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references:in-reply-to :content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=jeDtAkDfDB2XJct/vaChXBk6rIZDBEruJlmnGruPKR4=; b=HK/ZTo9J111UZKENaZcodO/5UFhWHf1ldnfWF0S0vZwnem7+gqKdyn3xl9bWBqaOpv 5qQugVz4By9o88Ug6UP1Y0i4KHUJKgVMGQnmWfGhMvsAubUE8oc7MVHk8Q9XyMhDAB5J ZPGbdAZjm5XS1dSZi74RMro/KSJc25YLkCm9woKD2IHIE3tbc3DMmxZSRoqohpp0jiSQ fWLRfJVyaT/hjl4n4/nO8FOtTHGSrhMZc/5ARIC5jNiNS/XR5EC6m1pdwhQKdUL9Y5RD Kzgsez1y/1fXZf0HQxBNK689UnosELqw4eqzE9UV2MXVICdNtIf7mlIH8rdr+X+yJGlF qJvQ== X-Received: by 10.180.97.195 with SMTP id ec3mr35982012wib.79.1420539638341; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 02:20:38 -0800 (PST) Received: from McObelix.local (g215085.upc-g.chello.nl. [80.57.215.85]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id x16sm13336267wia.15.2015.01.06.02.20.36 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 06 Jan 2015 02:20:37 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <54ABB6F2.2090508@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 11:20:34 +0100 From: Huub van Helvoort User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.10; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loa Andersson , pals@ietf.org References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <4552F0907735844E9204A62BBDD325E76AB0363B@nkgeml512-mbx.china.huawei.com> <3B0A1BED22CAD649A1B3E97BE5DDD68B5A85C147@szxema506-mbs.china.huawei.com> <4A95BA014132FF49AE685FAB4B9F17F645E8A68B@dfweml701-chm> <54AB8D06.301@pi.nu> In-Reply-To: <54AB8D06.301@pi.nu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/Q-hJf7RuuOWEyuQoZWb883Mx0CU Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: huubatwork@gmail.com List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 10:20:42 -0000 Hello Loa, You write: > I'm a bit split about this, for working groups I chair or documents > that I shepherd I normally count document authors supporting > adoption as the default, i.e. no need to state it on the list. I understand, and agree that this is logical. > In the pals wg I see quite a bit of "support as co-author", I don't > know if this adds anything. If anyone wonder I do of course support > the adoption of the document. I have noticed this "support as co-author" many times before in several WG lists I subscribed. That is why I did it too. I will try to remember that in the PALS is is not necessary. Cheers, Huub. -- ***************************************************************** 请记住，你是独一无二的，就像其他每一个人一样 From nobody Tue Jan 6 02:34:25 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21B0A1A916F for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 02:34:23 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QW23sdiHAkWi for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 02:34:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from pipi.pi.nu (pipi.pi.nu [83.168.239.141]) (using TLSv1.1 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6069D1A916B for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 02:34:21 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.1.12] (unknown [49.149.169.192]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) (Authenticated sender: loa@pi.nu) by pipi.pi.nu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id A4EEC18013B8; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 11:34:18 +0100 (CET) Message-ID: <54ABBA23.9030404@pi.nu> Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 18:34:11 +0800 From: Loa Andersson User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.2; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: huubatwork@gmail.com, pals@ietf.org References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <4552F0907735844E9204A62BBDD325E76AB0363B@nkgeml512-mbx.china.huawei.com> <3B0A1BED22CAD649A1B3E97BE5DDD68B5A85C147@szxema506-mbs.china.huawei.com> <4A95BA014132FF49AE685FAB4B9F17F645E8A68B@dfweml701-chm> <54AB8D06.301@pi.nu> <54ABB6F2.2090508@gmail.com> In-Reply-To: <54ABB6F2.2090508@gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/nVIRGZQ0uRJt2_VWEvjOJJu7gTs Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 10:34:23 -0000 Huub, On 2015-01-06 18:20, Huub van Helvoort wrote: > Hello Loa, > > You write: > >> I'm a bit split about this, for working groups I chair or documents >> that I shepherd I normally count document authors supporting >> adoption as the default, i.e. no need to state it on the list. > > I understand, and agree that this is logical. > >> In the pals wg I see quite a bit of "support as co-author", I don't >> know if this adds anything. If anyone wonder I do of course support >> the adoption of the document. > > I have noticed this "support as co-author" many times before > in several WG lists I subscribed. That is why I did it too. > I will try to remember that in the PALS is is not necessary. I can't say if it is necessary in pals - up to Andy and Stewart, but for mpls it is not necessary. /Loa > > Cheers, Huub. > > > -- Loa Andersson email: loa@mail01.huawei.com Senior MPLS Expert loa@pi.nu Huawei Technologies (consultant) phone: +46 739 81 21 64 From nobody Tue Jan 6 03:08:15 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 834461A1BC3; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 01:47:31 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -6.211 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-6.211 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, GB_I_INVITATION=-2, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id rOKLnrP8ABeO; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 01:47:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E51221A9122; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 01:47:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml401-hub.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id BQX93431; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 09:47:25 +0000 (GMT) Received: from SZXEMA412-HUB.china.huawei.com (10.82.72.71) by lhreml401-hub.china.huawei.com (10.201.5.240) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.3.158.1; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 09:47:24 +0000 Received: from SZXEMA504-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.8.250]) by SZXEMA412-HUB.china.huawei.com ([10.82.72.71]) with mapi id 14.03.0158.001; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 17:46:20 +0800 From: Fatai Zhang To: Loa Andersson , "mpls-chairs@tools.ietf.org" , "" , "'John Drake'" , "'Scott Mansfield'" , "'BRUNGARD, DEBORAH A'" , "teas-chairs@ietf.org" , "ccamp-chairs@tools.ietf.org" Thread-Topic: New Liaison Statement, "LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls" Thread-Index: AQHQKYmgRmMm1zVLtUicDVFbc6sta5yyS9kAgACLYRA= Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 09:46:19 +0000 Message-ID: References: <032501d02112$dcdd1a30$96974e90$@olddog.co.uk> <54AB9AA7.7040702@pi.nu> <54ABA9B6.4080800@pi.nu> In-Reply-To: <54ABA9B6.4080800@pi.nu> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.66.72.159] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/Vg88QRJ6PSXxG1NJKXQDwhGTZuE X-Mailman-Approved-At: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 03:08:12 -0800 Cc: "bess-chairs@ietf.org" , "ccamp-chairs@tools.ietf.org" , "pce-chairs@ietf.org" , "pals-chairs@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] New Liaison Statement, "LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls" X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 09:47:31 -0000 SGkgYWxsLA0KDQpQbGVhc2UgZm9yZ2l2ZSBtZSBmb3IgbXkgc3R1cGlkIHF1ZXN0aW9uLCA6LSkN Cg0KRG8gd2UganVzdCBuZWVkIG9uZSBzaW5nbGUgcmVzcG9uc2Ugb3IgbXVsdGlwbGUgcmVzcG9u c2VzIHBlciBXRz8NCg0KDQoNCg0KDQpCZXN0IFJlZ2FyZHMNCg0KRmF0YWkNCg0KDQotLS0tLU9y aWdpbmFsIE1lc3NhZ2UtLS0tLQ0KRnJvbTogTG9hIEFuZGVyc3NvbiBbbWFpbHRvOmxvYUBwaS5u dV0gDQpTZW50OiBUdWVzZGF5LCBKYW51YXJ5IDA2LCAyMDE1IDU6MjQgUE0NClRvOiBtcGxzLWNo YWlyc0B0b29scy5pZXRmLm9yZzsgPG1wbHMtYWRzQHRvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnPjsgJ0pvaG4gRHJh a2UnOyAnU2NvdHQgTWFuc2ZpZWxkJzsgJ0JSVU5HQVJELCBERUJPUkFIIEEnOyB0ZWFzLWNoYWly c0BpZXRmLm9yZzsgY2NhbXAtY2hhaXJzQHRvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnDQpDYzogcGNlLWNoYWlyc0Bp ZXRmLm9yZzsgcGFscy1jaGFpcnNAaWV0Zi5vcmc7IGJlc3MtY2hhaXJzQGlldGYub3JnOyBjY2Ft cC1jaGFpcnNAdG9vbHMuaWV0Zi5vcmcNClN1YmplY3Q6IFJlOiBOZXcgTGlhaXNvbiBTdGF0ZW1l bnQsICJMUyBvbiBJVFUtVCBTRzE1IE9UTlQgc3RhbmRhcmRpemF0aW9uIHdvcmsgcGxhbiB0byBt 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ICAgZW1haWw6IGxvYUBtYWlsMDEuaHVhd2VpLmNvbQ0KU2VuaW9yIE1QTFMgRXhwZXJ0ICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICBsb2FAcGkubnUNCkh1YXdlaSBUZWNobm9sb2dpZXMgKGNvbnN1 bHRhbnQpICAgICBwaG9uZTogKzQ2IDczOSA4MSAyMSA2NA0K From nobody Tue Jan 6 03:21:32 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 631361A3BA7 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 03:21:30 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.511 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.511 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qHP3xtmxqMEQ for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 03:21:26 -0800 (PST) Received: from aer-iport-4.cisco.com (aer-iport-4.cisco.com [173.38.203.54]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 639491A9162 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 03:21:26 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=1142; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1420543286; x=1421752886; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:mime-version:to:subject: references:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=jYI0ttJC3jvIsJxiGNlFXqOWVep+OLx8NFUFLtqGVbA=; b=cCJqPSepyRIl/mZpS7az8pTlDigMoJx9kTfCLQTE512BD87Ur71xxBW4 z9fkkjdMia9Q3ypKlq3EvFjEPJl1DsKhmwEiSo4O1IDUGHdEqJfRocLWJ KqlURpIT9rJUvbvKhdTSuCMGC3KJLq8GJ/QwBxrQ2BsRNFUu3aCf/sLIc k=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.07,707,1413244800"; d="scan'208";a="296928874" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-4.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP; 06 Jan 2015 11:21:24 +0000 Received: from [64.103.108.130] (dhcp-bdlk10-data-vlan301-64-103-108-130.cisco.com [64.103.108.130]) by aer-core-4.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t06BLOvF015784; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 11:21:24 GMT Message-ID: <54ABC534.8030204@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 11:21:24 +0000 From: Stewart Bryant User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Loa Andersson , huubatwork@gmail.com, pals@ietf.org References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <4552F0907735844E9204A62BBDD325E76AB0363B@nkgeml512-mbx.china.huawei.com> <3B0A1BED22CAD649A1B3E97BE5DDD68B5A85C147@szxema506-mbs.china.huawei.com> <4A95BA014132FF49AE685FAB4B9F17F645E8A68B@dfweml701-chm> <54AB8D06.301@pi.nu> <54ABB6F2.2090508@gmail.com> <54ABBA23.9030404@pi.nu> In-Reply-To: <54ABBA23.9030404@pi.nu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/zzDOWwPIiK7V69u0U0jqwZX2Kyc Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: stbryant@cisco.com List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 11:21:30 -0000 On 06/01/2015 10:34, Loa Andersson wrote: > Huub, > > On 2015-01-06 18:20, Huub van Helvoort wrote: >> Hello Loa, >> >> You write: >> >>> I'm a bit split about this, for working groups I chair or documents >>> that I shepherd I normally count document authors supporting >>> adoption as the default, i.e. no need to state it on the list. >> >> I understand, and agree that this is logical. >> >>> In the pals wg I see quite a bit of "support as co-author", I don't >>> know if this adds anything. If anyone wonder I do of course support >>> the adoption of the document. >> >> I have noticed this "support as co-author" many times before >> in several WG lists I subscribed. That is why I did it too. >> I will try to remember that in the PALS is is not necessary. > > I can't say if it is necessary in pals - up to Andy and Stewart, but for > mpls it is not necessary. > > /Loa > Speaking personally I am interested in authors saying that they do NOT support. However otherwise I take it as read that the authors support the draft. What I really want to know is whether non-authors support it. - Stewart From nobody Tue Jan 6 04:12:16 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D667C1AC437 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 04:12:10 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VomLUCD_cbO9 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 04:12:05 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qa0-x235.google.com (mail-qa0-x235.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c00::235]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 254D91AC43A for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 04:11:03 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qa0-f53.google.com with SMTP id j7so16036662qaq.26 for ; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 04:11:02 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=6Vs5KYmjuI+uNs4wsdnPH2U6eYjn4rCJAhL8XZAwRao=; b=w2E1K0B2gPf9lP5bDGgVyTZhj1QEn/3A9Qh1SHhKjGnVFkJDl7V7RJLnmiuin08n/y 2AU00PEJYLixWPlZ4QxgOxLmUczSuwVquqEnEj1Obln6KVLGzT8MMpRdqbelEXHUiTwk 8HOZxxPjCGNnBQRwUjYus5hKoSbyfd7OKZNMp7PrkQE7vRiRkGkiSJDvdII1gYXXVb7u BrmTUnhxlfYumlfwpSGaz4ndiM9qJvU+VWzmlz+cpUnDPIBJI8CSuZWN1wUkjf6qDpLR XQ+tPAF3jmAvprinN1szLDR3uJnh+87aMnhM3gPw7fB17r9Y4NljMu0+RVgsHaiKAQ1W k7BQ== X-Received: by 10.229.37.136 with SMTP id x8mr152421153qcd.30.1420546262265; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 04:11:02 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.140.101.106 with HTTP; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 04:10:41 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 07:10:41 -0500 Message-ID: To: Alexander Vainshtein Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a1133b5725976bb050bfab3cc Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/tqt8SzWL0KPNwAFl2bhAKmMXdQ4 Cc: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 12:12:11 -0000 --001a1133b5725976bb050bfab3cc Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Sasha, The difference is that this draft is a simple clarification of existing RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide end-to-end resiliency of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deployment of this draft. draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides resiliency at intermediate S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has the possibility to scale better in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. It could also provide faster protection switching as well. It would be up to the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy. Cheers, Andy On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein < Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote: > Stewart and all, > I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content per se. > However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already > adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00. > > Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and both > seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different different > deployment scenarios. > > I would like to clarify that I do not actively object adoption of > draft-shawam. > The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG > feels that this can be postponed. But I do not think that it can be > avoided altogether. > > Regards, > Sasha > > > > > ________________________________________ > From: Pals on behalf of Stewart Bryant < > stbryant@cisco.com> > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM > To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org > Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > Working Group, > > This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to > adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of > the PALS WG. > > Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working > group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical > motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that > the document should not be adopted as a working group document. > > In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will > run the poll until 16th January 2015. > > - Stewart > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > --001a1133b5725976bb050bfab3cc Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Sasha,

The difference is that this draf= t is a simple clarification of existing RFCs to make it clear how they can = be used to provide end-to-end resiliency of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of= at least one deployment of this draft.

draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides resiliency at interme= diate S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has the possibility to scale b= etter in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. It could also provide fas= ter protection switching as well. It would be up to the operator to decide = which solution they prefer to deploy.

Cheers,
Andy

<= /div>

On Sun= , Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.V= ainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:
Stewart and all,
I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content=C2= =A0 per se.
However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already= adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00.

Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and both = seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different different = deployment scenarios.

I would like to clarify that=C2=A0 I do not actively object adoption of dra= ft-shawam.
The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG fe= els that this can be postponed.=C2=A0 But I do not think that it can be avo= ided altogether.

Regards,
Sasha




________________________________________
From: Pals <pals-bounces@ietf.o= rg> on behalf of Stewart Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM
To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pw= e3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

Working Group,

This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to
adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of
the PALS WG.

Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working
group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Pl= ease give a technical
motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that
the document should not be adopted as a working group document.

In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will
run the poll until 16th January 2015.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals

--001a1133b5725976bb050bfab3cc-- From nobody Tue Jan 6 05:02:08 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C708B1ACCFE for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 05:02:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4q5A_b1UiCt0 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 05:01:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from emea01-am1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-am1on0712.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe00::712]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D2AE61ACC89 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 05:01:57 -0800 (PST) Received: from DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.161.55.144) by DB3PR03MB0809.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.161.55.141) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.49.12; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 12:59:52 +0000 Received: from DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([25.161.55.144]) by DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([25.161.55.144]) with mapi id 15.01.0049.002; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 12:59:52 +0000 From: Alexander Vainshtein To: "Andrew G. Malis" Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQH19mqOoYZfDEAEKZ4t2u3wY2Rpyvpp4xgANuN4CAAACO0A== Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 12:59:52 +0000 Message-ID: References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.234.56.21] authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com; x-dmarcaction: None x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:(3005003);SRVR:DB3PR03MB0809; x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DB3PR03MB0809; x-forefront-prvs: 0448A97BF2 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(51444003)(377454003)(252514010)(24454002)(189002)(199003)(66066001)(50986999)(76176999)(1411001)(19617315012)(106116001)(230783001)(110136001)(19580395003)(19580405001)(54356999)(105586002)(54606007)(19300405004)(101416001)(64706001)(19609705001)(20776003)(107046002)(106356001)(87936001)(2656002)(21056001)(19625215002)(86362001)(92566001)(122556002)(74316001)(40100003)(54206007)(99396003)(97736003)(93886004)(33656002)(4396001)(46102003)(16236675004)(31966008)(77156002)(2950100001)(68736005)(15975445007)(76576001)(120916001)(102836002)(62966003)(2900100001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DB3PR03MB0809; H:DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ecitele.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_DB3PR03MB081211483FD11BCF995099DC9D590DB3PR03MB0812eurp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: ecitele.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 06 Jan 2015 12:59:52.6851 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 2c514a61-08de-4519-b4c0-921fef62c42a X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DB3PR03MB0809 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/6h8PgyNaX9WGGZ1JG_WNwO9-YuM Cc: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." 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HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IsOAbsakXvFZ for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 07:28:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qc0-x236.google.com (mail-qc0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c01::236]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5589A1A8877 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 07:27:33 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qc0-f182.google.com with SMTP id r5so17126786qcx.13 for ; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 07:27:32 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=yLqDEnzKpvptkXRac9iwkk8H9tJInMKlg9VYUtrs9fo=; b=BBQ0Px/Jfeh72ZFv/6rU8Ip3GimzfU/+JX6Y0yJMnbUFsMieQfEFdTp/udzy2LgQU4 TsvvJWsmZpp2rv6ibPvTSFfI0sw8/qgf3eh/A0ZHy3olpI7pP3wJrv5zcsPKNnIANaN/ mKxGFVhZggv8S0h2ng47KSnw7ZTFwhIe6RjeWnZ0DSi/ao4z10Tp77K2EeT4o3Med6Jq jSCybazHMtVZLcfQnywN+phmdvVobK5SjIWDZcmxxOLxVKI90H3CHNj4IysMvtAtSxBc tP+QEjDi2Gbb0OYQpeoHYakH/XcZpo4U8LHnsWQjqGnUkk2nDV4EdfIr5VbrTvIpeBv9 TH8g== X-Received: by 10.229.35.74 with SMTP id o10mr134939008qcd.26.1420558052416; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 07:27:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.140.101.106 with HTTP; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 07:27:12 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <20141219211800.17387.25219.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> References: <20141219211800.17387.25219.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:27:12 -0500 Message-ID: To: "pals@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=047d7b471d5618e639050bfd7252 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/GgMZikbphkDojDZ1D84KluF8y40 Cc: Loa Andersson Subject: [Pals] Fwd: [mpls] New Liaison Statement, "LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls" X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 15:28:28 -0000 --047d7b471d5618e639050bfd7252 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable This liaison is also of interest to the pals WG. A point of contact will be appointed to coordinate a single response to the ITU-T from the IETF. Cheers, Andy ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Liaison Statement Management Tool Date: Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 4:18 PM Subject: [mpls] New Liaison Statement, "LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls" To: Loa Andersson , George Swallow , Ross Callon Cc: mpls@ietf.org, naotaka.morita@ntt-at.co.jp Title: LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls Submission Date: 2014-12-19 URL of the IETF Web page: http://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1369/ Please reply by 2015-06-07 From: ITU-T SG 15 (Greg Jones ) To: Multiprotocol Label Switching (Loa Andersson , George Swallow , Ross Callon ) Cc: Adrian Farrel ,Alia Atlas , mpls@ietf.org,John Drake ,Scott Mansfield Response Contact: naotaka.morita@ntt-at.co.jp Technical Contact: Purpose: For comment Body: Thank you for your previous review and comments on =E2=80=9COptical T= ransport Networks & Technologies standardization work plan.=E2=80=9D Attached is Issue 19, the = latest version that was updated by the SG15 meeting in December 2014. We appreciate your continued review and comments which allow us to keep the document up-to-date. Attach: =E2=88=92 OTNT standardization work plan, Issue 19 (TD282/PLEN Rev.1) Attachments: LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls https://datatracker.ietf.org/documents/LIAISON/liaison-2014-12-19-itu-t-sg-= 15-mpls-ls-on-itu-t-sg15-otnt-standardization-work-plan-to-mpls-attachment-= 1.zip _______________________________________________ mpls mailing list mpls@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls --047d7b471d5618e639050bfd7252 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
This liaison is also of interest to the pals WG.

<= /div>
A point of contact will be appointed to coordinate a single respo= nse to the ITU-T from the IETF.

Cheers,
= Andy

---------- Forward= ed message ----------
From: Liaison Statem= ent Management Tool <lsmt@ietf.org>
Date: Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 4:18 PM
S= ubject: [mpls] New Liaison Statement, "LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardi= zation work plan to mpls"
To: Loa Andersson <loa@pi.nu>, George Swallow <swallow@cisco.com>, Ross Callon <rcallon@juniper.net>
Cc: mpls@ietf.org, naotaka.morita@ntt-at.co.jp


Title: LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT st= andardization work plan to mpls
Submission Date: 2014-12-19
URL of the IETF Web page: http://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1369/
Please reply by 2015-06-07
From: ITU-T SG 15=C2=A0 (Greg Jones <greg.jones@itu.int>)
To: Multiprotocol Label Switching (Loa Andersson <loa@pi.nu>, George Swallow <swallow@cisco.com>, Ross Callon <rcallon@juniper.net>)
Cc: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.= co.uk>,Alia Atlas <akatlas@g= mail.com>,mpls@ietf.org,John Dr= ake <jdrake@juniper.net>,Sc= ott Mansfield <Scott.Mansfield@Ericsson.com>
Response Contact: naotaka.mo= rita@ntt-at.co.jp
Technical Contact:
Purpose: For comment

Body: Thank you for your previous review and comments on =E2=80=9COptical T= ransport Networks &
Technologies standardization work plan.=E2=80=9D Attached is Issue 19, the = latest version that was updated by the SG15 meeting in December 2014. We ap= preciate your continued review and comments which allow us to keep the docu= ment up-to-date.

Attach:
=E2=88=92 OTNT standardization work plan, Issue 19 (TD282/PLEN Rev.1)
Attachments:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://datatracker.ietf.= org/documents/LIAISON/liaison-2014-12-19-itu-t-sg-15-mpls-ls-on-itu-t-sg15-= otnt-standardization-work-plan-to-mpls-attachment-1.zip

_______________________________________________
mpls mailing list
mpls@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls

--047d7b471d5618e639050bfd7252-- From nobody Tue Jan 6 07:56:05 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9EE781A006F for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 07:56:02 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id X7IK7UH824_K for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 07:55:58 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qg0-x232.google.com (mail-qg0-x232.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c04::232]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7288E1A005F for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 07:55:58 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qg0-f50.google.com with SMTP id z60so16711181qgd.37 for ; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 07:55:57 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=P2Z97JrBlx4B9PhsLijU4o6ngDpI4oUQPMr3BYGoWcI=; b=vTXGx4ikCD92E4eDiGMU+jSmDs1iEt+l/bbNULsFWFGQZYWXg8vWhxay1EKO0xUvdv fDTsoJj8c+jfVCt8e59kS7vPGMuVs9gA5U9mZTuAPf1sricC3epk0FGqoA8pU2zlqFfi 25LYemvAPOL9PGamCnpTw5x+ZDh0NdbsRpYAlsv5A9Xmsl8vnd73dCMQDY2FCKo/fHzK K0aSWBxhzxyu2VbkF5bW5Iz607dzo33mlLrbA0TSLLXHI2WfrIhWehgs/ILD25JffXLO EgaJSqKufM5+9iKEAU7fCnwU3Hc0/s7yvDZhQRUWNa4ywPua4xno5uvpSM7SJyjEKuGo xJzA== X-Received: by 10.140.25.169 with SMTP id 38mr144486303qgt.57.1420559757443; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 07:55:57 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.140.101.106 with HTTP; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 07:55:35 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:55:35 -0500 Message-ID: To: Alexander Vainshtein Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c12cdcb98c7a050bfdd76a Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/qQKUShXn5-bje8LzmDQDyJPn5Rc Cc: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 15:56:02 -0000 --001a11c12cdcb98c7a050bfdd76a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Sasha, Thanks, the co-authors will address these questions following the adoption poll. Cheers, Andy On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 7:59 AM, Alexander Vainshtein < Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote: > Andy, > > Lots of thanks for a prompt response and a clarification. > > > > I think that it makes sense to add it (in some form) also to the draft > itself =E2=80=93 after adoption. Meanwhile I can safely support adoption = of this > draft as a WG document. > > > > I also have two technical questions regarding the draft (that could be > addressed after its adoption): > > > > 1. *S-PE bypass mode vs. segment-by-segment mode of static PW > status messages*: > > a. The draft is presented as an extension of the mechanism > presented in RFC 6870 for static PWs > > b. In RFC 6870 PW status TLV is carried across tLDP sessions and > hence it is inherently segment-by-segment (with S-PEs performing the PW > status relay function) =E2=80=93 because here are no E2E tLDP sessionsJ > > c. According to RFC 6478 MS-PWs can use static PW status messages > in two modes: > > i. Se= gment-by-segment > mode > > ii. S-P= E > bypass (T-PE-to-T-PE) mode > > d. Could you please clarify *which mode should be used in the draft*= ? > In particular, if S-PE bypass mode is used, does this imply an update of > RFC 6478? As per RFC, it is restricted to the case when T-PE support LDP = as > the PW setup and maintenance protocol. > > 2. *Applicability to =E2=80=9Cmixed mode=E2=80=9D MS-PWs*: > > a. One of the reasons for setting up MS-PWs is stitching between a > static segment (e.g., between the T-PE in the MPLS-TP domain to some > =E2=80=9Cgateway=E2=80=9D S-PE=E2=80=9D) and a signaled segment (e.., bet= ween the =E2=80=9Cgateway=E2=80=9D S-PE > and the T-PE in the IP/MPLS domain). > > b. In this case PW status TLV has to be propagated > segment-by-segment with S-PE of acting as relay > > c. Could you please clarify whether the draft is applicable to this > model, and, if yes (as I hope) provide some additional operational > considerations (if needed)? > > d. This question is to some extent related to update (or lack > thereof) of RFC 6478. The relevant use case would be a MS-PW that looks a= s > following: > > i. Se= gment > #1 =E2=80=93 signaled, from T-PE#1 to S-PE#1. T-PE#1 uses LDP as its PW s= etup and > maintenance protocol so it can request S-PE bypass mode even if 6478 is n= ot > updated > > ii. Seg= ment > #2 =E2=80=93 static, from S-PE#1 to S-PE#2 > > iii. Seg= ment > #3 =E2=80=93 signaled, from S-PE#2 to T-PE#2, T-PE#2 uses LDP as its PW s= etup and > maintenance protocol so it can request S-PE bypass mode even if 6478 is n= ot > updated. > > Regards, > > Sasha > > Email: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com > > Mobile: 054-9266302 > > > > *From:* Andrew G. Malis [mailto:agmalis@gmail.com] > *Sent:* Tuesday, January 06, 2015 2:11 PM > *To:* Alexander Vainshtein > *Cc:* pals@ietf.org; draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; > stbryant@cisco.com > *Subject:* Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > > > Sasha, > > > > The difference is that this draft is a simple clarification of existing > RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide end-to-end resilien= cy > of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deployment of this draft. > > > > draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides > resiliency at intermediate S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has the > possibility to scale better in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. I= t > could also provide faster protection switching as well. It would be up to > the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy. > > > > Cheers, > > Andy > > > > > > On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein < > Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote: > > Stewart and all, > I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content per s= e. > However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already > adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00. > > Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and bot= h > seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different differen= t > deployment scenarios. > > I would like to clarify that I do not actively object adoption of > draft-shawam. > The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG > feels that this can be postponed. But I do not think that it can be > avoided altogether. > > Regards, > Sasha > > > > > ________________________________________ > From: Pals on behalf of Stewart Bryant < > stbryant@cisco.com> > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM > To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org > Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > Working Group, > > This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to > adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of > the PALS WG. > > Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working > group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical > motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that > the document should not be adopted as a working group document. > > In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will > run the poll until 16th January 2015. > > - Stewart > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > > > --001a11c12cdcb98c7a050bfdd76a Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Sasha,

Thanks, the co-authors will addr= ess these questions following the adoption poll.

C= heers,
Andy

On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 7:59 AM, Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:

Andy,

Lots of thanks for a prom= pt response and a clarification.

=C2=A0

I think that it makes sen= se to add it (in some form) also to the draft itself =E2=80=93 after adopti= on. Meanwhile I can safely support adoption of this draft as a WG document.

=C2=A0

I also have two technical= questions regarding the draft (that could be addressed after its adoption)= :

=C2=A0

1.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 S-PE bypass mode vs. segment-by-segment mode of static PW status me= ssages:

a.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 The draft is presented as an extension of the mechanism presented in R= FC 6870 for static PWs

b.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 In RFC 6870 PW status TLV is carried across tLDP sessions and hence it= is inherently segment-by-segment (with S-PEs performing the PW status relay function) =E2=80=93 because here are no E2E tLDP sessi= onsJ

c.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 According to RFC 6478 MS-PWs can use static PW status messages in two = modes:

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 i.=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = Segment-by-segment mode

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0 ii.=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = S-PE bypass (T-PE-to-T-PE) mode

d.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Could you please clarify which mode should be used in the draft? In particular, if S-PE bypas= s mode is used, does this imply an update of RFC 6478? As per RFC, it is re= stricted to the case when T-PE support LDP as the PW setup and maintenance = protocol.

2.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Applicability to =E2=80=9Cmixed mode=E2=80=9D MS-PWs:

a.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 One of the reasons for setting up MS-PWs is stitching between a static= segment (e.g., between the T-PE in the MPLS-TP domain to some =E2=80=9Cgateway=E2=80=9D S-PE=E2=80=9D) and a signaled segment (e= .., between the =E2=80=9Cgateway=E2=80=9D S-PE and the T-PE in the IP/MPLS = domain).

b.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 In this case PW status TLV has to be propagated segment-by-segment wit= h =C2=A0S-PE of acting as =C2=A0relay

c.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Could you please clarify whether the draft is applicable to this model= , and, if yes (as I hope) provide some additional operational considerations (if needed)?

d.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 This question is to some extent related to update (or lack thereof) of= RFC 6478. The relevant use case would be a MS-PW that looks as following:

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 i.=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = Segment #1 =E2=80=93 signaled, from T-PE#1 to S-= PE#1. T-PE#1 uses LDP as its PW setup and maintenance protocol so it can request S-PE bypass mode e= ven if 6478 is not updated

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0 ii.=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = Segment #2 =E2=80=93 static, from S-PE#1 to S-PE= #2

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 iii.=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 = Segment #3 =E2=80=93 signaled, from S-PE#2 to T-= PE#2, T-PE#2 uses LDP as its PW setup and maintenance protocol so it can request S-PE bypass mode e= ven if 6478 is not updated.

Regards,

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Sasha

Email: Alexander.Vainshtein@ec= itele.com

Mobile: 054-9266302

=C2=A0

From: Andrew G= . Malis [mailto:agma= lis@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2015 2:11 PM
To: Alexander Vainshtein
Cc: pals@ietf.org= ; draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; stbryant@cisco.com
Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draf= t-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

=C2=A0

Sasha,

=C2=A0

The difference is that this draft is a simple clarif= ication of existing RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide e= nd-to-end resiliency of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deploy= ment of this draft.

=C2=A0

draft-ietf-pals-red= undancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides resiliency at intermedia= te S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has the possibility to scale bett= er in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. It could also provide faster protection switching as well. It w= ould be up to the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy.<= /span>

=C2=A0

Cheers,

Andy

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein= <= Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:

Stewart and all,
I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content=C2= =A0 per se.
However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already= adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00.

Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and both = seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different different = deployment scenarios.

I would like to clarify that=C2=A0 I do not actively object adoption of dra= ft-shawam.
The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG fe= els that this can be postponed.=C2=A0 But I do not think that it can be avo= ided altogether.

Regards,
Sasha




________________________________________
From: Pals <p= als-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Stewart Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM
To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-sha= wam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

Working Group,

This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to
adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of
the PALS WG.

Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working
group mailing list (pals= @ietf.org). Please give a technical
motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that
the document should not be adopted as a working group document.

In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will
run the poll until 16th January 2015.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals

=C2=A0


--001a11c12cdcb98c7a050bfdd76a-- From nobody Tue Jan 6 08:28:38 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D35721A017D for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 08:28:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id R5FPbOlCsCfs for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 08:28:27 -0800 (PST) Received: from emea01-am1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-am1on0712.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe00::712]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6B3071A0149 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 08:28:25 -0800 (PST) Received: from DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.161.55.144) by DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.161.55.144) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.49.12; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 16:28:01 +0000 Received: from DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([25.161.55.144]) by DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([25.161.55.144]) with mapi id 15.01.0049.002; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 16:28:01 +0000 From: Alexander Vainshtein To: "Andrew G. Malis" Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQH19mqOoYZfDEAEKZ4t2u3wY2Rpyvpp4xgANuN4CAAACO0IAAPkiAgAAI14A= Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 16:28:01 +0000 Message-ID: References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.234.56.21] authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com; x-dmarcaction: None x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:(3005003);SRVR:DB3PR03MB0812; x-forefront-prvs: 0448A97BF2 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(979002)(24454002)(51444003)(164054003)(199003)(189002)(377454003)(252514010)(106116001)(93886004)(105586002)(122556002)(110136001)(107046002)(19617315012)(106356001)(54206007)(4396001)(86362001)(20776003)(1411001)(76576001)(62966003)(230783001)(92566001)(31966008)(46102003)(2950100001)(2900100001)(68736005)(102836002)(87936001)(54356999)(2656002)(76176999)(66066001)(97736003)(120916001)(33656002)(40100003)(19609705001)(19625215002)(99396003)(21056001)(77156002)(19580405001)(64706001)(19580395003)(15975445007)(54606007)(19300405004)(74316001)(50986999)(101416001)(16236675004)(969003)(989001)(999001)(1009001)(1019001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DB3PR03MB0812; H:DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:ovrnspm; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ecitele.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_DB3PR03MB0812E49135AE64D8543989339D590DB3PR03MB0812eurp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: ecitele.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 06 Jan 2015 16:28:01.1347 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 2c514a61-08de-4519-b4c0-921fef62c42a X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DB3PR03MB0812 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/GbS3eef6R0PG3M8dwrUTtjAbMpc Cc: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." 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DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9oxvXXFgf1eA for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 09:25:28 -0800 (PST) Received: from aer-iport-1.cisco.com (aer-iport-1.cisco.com [173.38.203.51]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 197D41A1A8B for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 09:25:26 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=23283; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1420565129; x=1421774729; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:mime-version:to:cc:subject: references:in-reply-to; bh=wjK6+x/bwdT8RtlNWEk7Pf2YwfRml6h+UPzoKFKEYMU=; b=IH9/51tHi7g8J764DA9iFzQax/HNYjHidkdf979BWWd6y3yXDeUGr2vt 1supUlMAiU7Ow8SwIlRbUdO6S553AN608iY8/aeF+EkvU14NpOlhiGT0g n3iCxnoc15+1IVdG8kAFfJmSFUP2omA3Bnmj1ybEiCQ+rqiZnlJLakiEw Y=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.07,709,1413244800"; d="scan'208,217";a="302052400" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-1.cisco.com with ESMTP; 06 Jan 2015 17:25:26 +0000 Received: from [64.103.108.130] (dhcp-bdlk10-data-vlan301-64-103-108-130.cisco.com [64.103.108.130]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t06HPOOJ014457; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 17:25:24 GMT Message-ID: <54AC1A84.8060208@cisco.com> Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 17:25:24 +0000 From: Stewart Bryant User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "Carlos Pignataro (cpignata)" , "Andrew G. Malis" References: <7D4AE199-E16B-423F-95D2-AD39E79B1604@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <7D4AE199-E16B-423F-95D2-AD39E79B1604@cisco.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------000808010508080508000609" Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/DKx6hzJ6_v1D5e-jFdCYgmSdCt0 Cc: "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Soliciting reviews for draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: stbryant@cisco.com List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 17:25:32 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------000808010508080508000609 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I think that there is agreement that 1) We need Type4 2) We cannot mandate Type1 However where there is discussion over the migration strategy and how it is defined. I wonder if the WG would prefer a) I add more text on migration path, what we deprecate etc to this draft or b) That I split the problem and just create Type 4 here, and then write a draft on preferences, migration etc, etc. An uncontroversial RFC just creating Type 4 is probably feasible before the next IETF. - Stewart (as editor) On 24/12/2014 18:35, Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) wrote: > Andy, > > I took a very quick scan through this document, and have a number of > concerns. > > At the heart of the concerns, this document seems to be doing a number > of different things that are not reflected in the Title and Abstract. > While the title is VCCV Default CC Types, this document seems to be > doing much more than defining default CC Types, including: > 1. Defining a new CC Type 4 > 2. Setting a Default for when with and without CW (as per the Title), > but also > 3. Implicitly Obsoleting Type 2 and Type 3 (non-default) > 4. Requiring new hw capabilities for the Type 4. > > I believe those things should be explicitly done. > > Some more comments (including editorials) follow, prefaced with CMP: > > PWE3 T. Nadeau > Internet-Draft lucidvision > Updates: 4447, 5085 (if approved) L. Martini > > CMP: s/PWE3/PALS? > > > This document updates RFC4447 and RFC5085. > > CMP: More importantly, what exactly is this document updating on those > two? Adding a new CC Type does not mean update RFC 4447 or RFC 5085. I > Section listing the exact updates to those specs is necessary. My view > is that this doc can update 5085 (Section 7), but not sure how it > updates 4447. > > Note to be removed at publication: this document started out as > draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal and got to version -02. When PWE3 was > absorbed into PALS the next version published was draft-ietf-pals- > vccv-for-gal-00 > > CMP: I thought that initially, draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal-02 was > only defining the new CC Type 4, while draft-nadeau-pwe3-vccv2-00 > would do other updates including Defaults, obsoleting CC Types, etc. > > state. Operators have indicated in [RFC4377], and [RFC3916] that > such a tool is required for PW operation and maintenance. To this > end, the IETF's PWE3 Working Group defined the Virtual Circuit > Connectivity Verification Protocol (VCCV) in [RFC5085] . Since then a > number of interoperability issues have arisen with the protocol as it > is defined. > > CMP: I see the fact that PWE3 WG defined that RFC as a distractor, and > irrelevant in the larger scheme of things. Also, you should point to > [RFC7079] to describe and quantify the interop issues instead of just > saying they exist. Lastly, how creating a new CC Type not also create > intro issues? That should be answered. > > 7. Manageability Considerations > > By introducing default VCCV CC types, and improving the compatibility > with MPLS-TP, the compatibility of implementations is improved and > management and configuration of the network becomes simpler. > > CMP: This is a bold statement, that does not appear to be immediate. I > expect initially to see the manageability worst before it improves. > This is adding a new mode before letting time to remove all the other > ones. > > Thanks, > > Carlos. > > >> On Dec 22, 2014, at 9:33 AM, Andrew G. Malis > > wrote: >> >> PALSers, >> >> i know that you would all like a little something to distract you >> from the holidays ... :-). Well, maybe not. But anyway, Stewart >> recently revised the VCCV for GAL draft (see below), and while short >> (just four pages of real content), we would like to have a good >> indication that it represents WG consensus, so we need at least some >> of you out there to read it and comment, even if that comment is >> "I've reviewed it and looks great to me". As I noted, it's a short >> draft, so it shouldn't take all that long. >> >> You can read the draft at >> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00 . >> >> Thanks, >> Stewart and Andy >> >> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- >> From: > >> Date: Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 12:00 PM >> Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt >> To: i-d-announce@ietf.org >> Cc: pals@ietf.org >> >> >> A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts >> directories. >> This draft is a work item of the Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services >> Working Group of the IETF. >> >> Title : VCCV Default CC Types >> Authors : Thomas D. Nadeau >> Luca Martini >> Stewart Bryant >> Filename : draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt >> Pages : 8 >> Date : 2014-12-17 >> >> Abstract: >> This document specifies the default Virtual Circuit Connectivity >> Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type to be used when >> the pseudowire control word is present and when it is not present. A >> new VCCV control channel type using the Generic Associated Channel >> Label (RFC5586) is specified for use when the control word not >> present. >> >> This document updates RFC4447 and RFC5085. >> >> Note to be removed at publication: this document started out as >> draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal and got to version -02. When PWE3 was >> absorbed into PALS the next version published was draft-ietf-pals- >> vccv-for-gal-00 >> >> >> The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: >> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal/ >> >> There's also a htmlized version available at: >> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00 >> >> >> Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of >> submission >> until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org >> . >> >> Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: >> ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> I-D-Announce mailing list >> I-D-Announce@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce >> Internet-Draft >> >> directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html >> >> or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt >> _______________________________________________ >> Pals mailing list >> Pals@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals -- For corporate legal information go to: http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html --------------000808010508080508000609 Content-Type: text/html; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
I think that there is agreement that

1) We need Type4

2) We cannot mandate Type1

However where there is discussion over the migration strategy and how it is defined.

I wonder if the WG would prefer

a) I add more text on migration path, what we deprecate etc to this draft

or

b) That I split the problem and just create Type 4 here, and then write a draft
on preferences, migration etc, etc.

An uncontroversial RFC just creating Type 4 is probably feasible before the next
IETF.

- Stewart (as editor)


On 24/12/2014 18:35, Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) wrote:
Andy,

I took a very quick scan through this document, and have a number of concerns.

At the heart of the concerns, this document seems to be doing a number of different things that are not reflected in the Title and Abstract. While the title is VCCV Default CC Types, this document seems to be doing much more than defining default CC Types, including:
1. Defining a new CC Type 4
2. Setting a Default for when with and without CW (as per the Title), but also
3. Implicitly Obsoleting Type 2 and Type 3 (non-default)
4. Requiring new hw capabilities for the Type 4.

I believe those things should be explicitly done.

Some more comments (including editorials) follow, prefaced with CMP:

PWE3 T. Nadeau
Internet-Draft lucidvision
Updates: 4447, 5085 (if approved) L. Martini

CMP: s/PWE3/PALS? >

This document updates RFC4447 and RFC5085.

CMP: More importantly, what exactly is this document updating on those two? Adding a new CC Type does not mean update RFC 4447 or RFC 5085. I Section listing the exact updates to those specs is necessary. My view is that this doc can update 5085 (Section 7), but not sure how it updates 4447.

Note to be removed at publication: this document started out as
draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal and got to version -02. When PWE3 was
absorbed into PALS the next version published was draft-ietf-pals-
vccv-for-gal-00

CMP: I thought that initially,draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal-02 was only defining the new CC Type 4, whiledraft-nadeau-pwe3-vccv2-00 would do other updates including Defaults, obsoleting CC Types, etc.

state. Operators have indicated in [RFC4377], and [RFC3916] that
such a tool is required for PW operation and maintenance. To this
end, the IETF's PWE3 Working Group defined the Virtual Circuit
Connectivity Verification Protocol (VCCV) in [RFC5085] . Since then a
number of interoperability issues have arisen with the protocol as it
is defined.

CMP: I see the fact that PWE3 WG defined that RFC as a distractor, and irrelevant in the larger scheme of things. Also, you should point to [RFC7079] to describe and quantify the interop issues instead of just saying they exist. Lastly, how creating a new CC Type not also create intro issues? That should be answered.

7. Manageability Considerations

By introducing default VCCV CC types, and improving the compatibility
with MPLS-TP, the compatibility of implementations is improved and
management and configuration of the network becomes simpler.

CMP: This is a bold statement, that does not appear to be immediate. I expect initially to see the manageability worst before it improves. This is adding a new mode before letting time to remove all the other ones.

Thanks,

Carlos.


On Dec 22, 2014, at 9:33 AM, Andrew G. Malis <agmalis@gmail.com> wrote:

PALSers,

i know that you would all like a little something to distract you from the holidays ... :-). Well, maybe not. But anyway, Stewart recently revised the VCCV for GAL draft (see below), and while short (just four pages of real content), we would like to have a good indication that it represents WG consensus, so we need at least some of you out there to read it and comment, even if that comment is "I've reviewed it and looks great to me". As I noted, it's a short draft, so it shouldn't take all that long.


Thanks,
Stewart and Andy

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
Date: Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 12:00 PM
Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt
To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
Cc: pals@ietf.org


A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services Working Group of the IETF.

Title : VCCV Default CC Types
Authors : Thomas D. Nadeau
Luca Martini
Stewart Bryant
Filename : draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt
Pages : 8
Date : 2014-12-17

Abstract:
This document specifies the default Virtual Circuit Connectivity
Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type to be used when
the pseudowire control word is present and when it is not present. A
new VCCV control channel type using the Generic Associated Channel
Label (RFC5586) is specified for use when the control word not
present.

This document updates RFC4447 and RFC5085.

Note to be removed at publication: this document started out as
draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal and got to version -02. When PWE3 was
absorbed into PALS the next version published was draft-ietf-pals-
vccv-for-gal-00


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

_______________________________________________
I-D-Announce mailing list
I-D-Announce@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce
Internet-Draft directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html
or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt
_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals



_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals



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PC9zcGFuPg0KPC9ib2R5Pg0KPC9odG1sPg0K --_000_DB3PR03MB0812A49FBDC6C5E2359A98559D590DB3PR03MB0812eurp_-- From nobody Tue Jan 6 10:12:05 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0DE151A1AD9 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:12:04 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -104.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-104.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id IuUwcExkAmYD for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:12:01 -0800 (PST) Received: from usevmg21.ericsson.net (usevmg21.ericsson.net [198.24.6.65]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2D7841A1A70 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:12:01 -0800 (PST) X-AuditID: c6180641-f79916d00000623a-20-54abc77b36a1 Received: from EUSAAHC001.ericsson.se (Unknown_Domain [147.117.188.75]) by usevmg21.ericsson.net (Symantec Mail Security) with SMTP id 11.7E.25146.B77CBA45; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 12:31:07 +0100 (CET) Received: from EUSAAMB103.ericsson.se ([147.117.188.120]) by EUSAAHC001.ericsson.se ([147.117.188.75]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 13:11:59 -0500 From: Gregory Mirsky To: "Andrew G. Malis" , Alexander Vainshtein Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQH19l8/StDj2yjkiIW8rrHDFCKJywAAYAgANooYCAAA8V8A== Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 18:11:57 +0000 Message-ID: <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.117.188.9] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789eusaamb103erics_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Brightmail-Tracker: H4sIAAAAAAAAA+NgFprMIsWRmVeSWpSXmKPExsUyuXSPt2718dUhBmcnm1mcfn6KzWLq1g/M FpduiFus+beOyeLc0zmMDqweU35vZPXY9O84o8fOWXfZPZYs+cnk8eXyZ7YA1igum5TUnMyy 1CJ9uwSujIXTdrAX3KirmLXnL2MD45LqLkZODgkBE4lfp/uZIGwxiQv31rOB2EICRxglmrfm dDFyAdnLGCUmHvvIApJgEzCSeLGxhx3EFhFIkWg9foEZpIhZYC+jxLpdO1lBEsICBRIfvi9k gygqlHi3fyEzhO0ksW/zK0YQm0VAReJ5zwOwel4BX4ndV74wQmxezyhxe2YQiM0pECixdtN3 sMWMQNd9P7UG7FJmAXGJW0/mQ10tILFkz3lmCFtU4uXjf6wQtqLEvv7pQIdyANXnS5zeUgGx SlDi5MwnLBMYRWchmTQLoWoWkiqIsKbE+l36ENWKElO6H7JD2BoSrXPmsiOLL2BkX8XIUVqc WpabbmS4iREYi8ck2Bx3MC74ZHmIUYCDUYmHd4P/6hAh1sSy4srcQ4zSHCxK4rya1fOChQTS E0tSs1NTC1KL4otKc1KLDzEycXBKNTC2HVtwLe79GQ6GDbO1AjQKl9XOjfXMnxmVKZN7tXnV VeeniheEGr9+uxH54ev8kN3PeASUzqxy8A3O5tZVYV41MWwWl/LzXeVZX/6f/iNyaHIAP+sN KQ3B7gvHvR0XXo54KjPtsupac8uQjjLO9e/UTM+Yswqd19D6pxzU9HDu3gLl+uKyFxOVWIoz Eg21mIuKEwHxIyVopgIAAA== Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/7oGtjrOJ4j8CbEvFofYWnsCrJGk Cc: "pals@ietf.org" , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "stbryant@cisco.com" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." 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PC9wPg0KPC9kaXY+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvZGl2Pg0KPHAgY2xhc3M9Ik1zb05vcm1hbCI+PG86cD4m bmJzcDs8L286cD48L3A+DQo8L2Rpdj4NCjwvZGl2Pg0KPC9ib2R5Pg0KPC9odG1sPg0K --_000_7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789eusaamb103erics_-- From nobody Tue Jan 6 10:49:45 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 08DBA1A1B1B for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:49:44 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4A7jk6u4Xwd4 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:49:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qg0-x22b.google.com (mail-qg0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c04::22b]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id ECBDC1A1B24 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:49:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qg0-f43.google.com with SMTP id z107so17121968qgd.16 for ; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 10:49:40 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=d1SDdKKO3+lzNwjdtz6RekxMsJjelCAqastZeWeF7Gg=; b=EwLmrVmaOo9foTsMRpOXC7eBpDbiN+X7SS2x4p+QmTIlbpN+0CSHlpy8aembHlqZHG nmQgdUT5TcG7mOCv27zPF/lNqD8yDge2ywjmHaiX4OFBz+NWd9M3GJanUrgwiXmwkkXh hqC4SVJbwfF73+zQLdjClMDlaY1x/QSyKHau0m40AtUqT8Ygpp57wYnrsOwM2lMESYuz xbETWHWqCYp2Ykeost8GoGlZJKw8m234q7GJ7ZAwmn6n9fZT3e3THTtbUC+3uYhNrxYe zhDh05QWJ9mFSOw+s+Wp/lgJhk/4ORjL3rWTUgbvlfJpjbn26yqKDfvnzefSalVwLQap Kedg== X-Received: by 10.140.25.169 with SMTP id 38mr145868504qgt.57.1420570180000; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 10:49:40 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.140.101.106 with HTTP; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 10:49:19 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 13:49:19 -0500 Message-ID: To: Gregory Mirsky Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c12cdcf53b00050c00440a Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/THmXNoBJNpPj0cj0LLbgKtF_e-k Cc: Alexander Vainshtein , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" , "stbryant@cisco.com" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 18:49:44 -0000 --001a11c12cdcf53b00050c00440a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Greg, Thanks for your support, and yes we would, although we prefer standards track so that it would be marked as "Updates 6870" in the RFC database, so anyone implementing 6870 will also read it, and a reference added if there's ever a 6870-bis. Cheers, Andy On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Gregory Mirsky wrote: > Dear All, > > firstly, I support adoption of this document by the WG. > > > > Second, considering that the document doesn=E2=80=99t put forth any IANA = requests, > nor changes any earlier defined procedures but rather document > applicability of the RFC 6478, would authors consider Informational track > for this document? > > > > Regards, > > Greg > > > > *From:* Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Andrew G. Mali= s > *Sent:* Tuesday, January 06, 2015 4:11 AM > *To:* Alexander Vainshtein > *Cc:* stbryant@cisco.com; > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org > *Subject:* Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > > > Sasha, > > > > The difference is that this draft is a simple clarification of existing > RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide end-to-end resilien= cy > of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deployment of this draft. > > > > draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides > resiliency at intermediate S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has the > possibility to scale better in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. I= t > could also provide faster protection switching as well. It would be up to > the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy. > > > > Cheers, > > Andy > > > > > > On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein < > Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote: > > Stewart and all, > I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content per s= e. > However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already > adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00. > > Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and bot= h > seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different differen= t > deployment scenarios. > > I would like to clarify that I do not actively object adoption of > draft-shawam. > The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG > feels that this can be postponed. But I do not think that it can be > avoided altogether. > > Regards, > Sasha > > > > > ________________________________________ > From: Pals on behalf of Stewart Bryant < > stbryant@cisco.com> > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM > To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org > Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > Working Group, > > This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to > adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of > the PALS WG. > > Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working > group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical > motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that > the document should not be adopted as a working group document. > > In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will > run the poll until 16th January 2015. > > - Stewart > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > > > --001a11c12cdcf53b00050c00440a Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Greg,

Thanks for your support, and yes = we would, although we prefer standards track so that it would be marked as = "Updates 6870" in the RFC database, so anyone implementing 6870 w= ill also read it, and a reference added if there's ever a 6870-bis.

Cheers,
Andy

On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Greg= ory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote:

Dear All,

firstly, I support adopti= on of this document by the WG.

=C2=A0

Second, considering that = the document doesn=E2=80=99t put forth any IANA requests, nor changes any e= arlier defined procedures but rather document applicability of the RFC 6478, would authors consider Informational track for this document?=

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Regards,=

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Greg

=C2=A0

From: Pals [ma= ilto:pals-bounce= s@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Andrew G. Malis
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2015 4:11 AM
To: Alexander Vainshtein
Cc: stbryant= @cisco.com; draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.o= rg; pals@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draf= t-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

=C2=A0

Sasha,

=C2=A0

The difference is that this draft is a simple clarif= ication of existing RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide e= nd-to-end resiliency of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deploy= ment of this draft.

=C2=A0

draft-ietf-pals-red= undancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides resiliency at intermedia= te S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has the possibility to scale bett= er in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. It could also provide faster protection switching as well. It w= ould be up to the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy.<= /span>

=C2=A0

Cheers,

Andy

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein= <= Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:

Stewart and all,
I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content=C2= =A0 per se.
However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already= adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00.

Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and both = seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different different = deployment scenarios.

I would like to clarify that=C2=A0 I do not actively object adoption of dra= ft-shawam.
The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG fe= els that this can be postponed.=C2=A0 But I do not think that it can be avo= ided altogether.

Regards,
Sasha




________________________________________
From: Pals <p= als-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Stewart Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM
To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-sha= wam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

Working Group,

This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to
adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of
the PALS WG.

Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working
group mailing list (pals= @ietf.org). Please give a technical
motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that
the document should not be adopted as a working group document.

In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will
run the poll until 16th January 2015.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals

=C2=A0


--001a11c12cdcf53b00050c00440a-- From nobody Tue Jan 6 13:34:46 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 104661A1AA7 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 13:34:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CECKdT1CzkD7 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 13:34:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qc0-x22d.google.com (mail-qc0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c01::22d]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B631E1A86F0 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 13:34:40 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qc0-f173.google.com with SMTP id i17so81148qcy.18 for ; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 13:34:40 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=CSgD5o24KaOTz1rZwG4jzS1yV59IfFwS35GQilvE1B8=; b=Y1H8TL7rz5vsX4L/LOpP4hqaiTPk0cHMQjClsY5MKMTmKjuwunvdie41tb0r5hz66u Kl8M8l5P3XuGgEXFl6HUMvGzBOFHojkA+yR0Ux3azBrUdFAP946FxWxADqt7VKGTF2Hd nR6PoWaUakkEg5s8zGJ7ONRwryi7HM4xQ0tj60DcwA6xR54ikxD/u8qP9Q29RCh2T2sz tSupjeSv18otzCf8C/rF3+mYDWr3b1qFzPod3AAk89oy6pFeRmZ/ua0NV4ssPmlAauy2 1pwVxlxp7aQCF2BcTsGVG0DxU57IPEAGDBhflz6g3J+4EeWROZ4ulFChDkDQ0QjNIXX/ 21OA== X-Received: by 10.224.93.6 with SMTP id t6mr91474112qam.93.1420580079833; Tue, 06 Jan 2015 13:34:39 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.140.101.106 with HTTP; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 13:34:19 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2015 16:34:19 -0500 Message-ID: To: Alexander Vainshtein Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e014950280898ee050c029395 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/RpyEGtWaptxuR8Exh2Ma23Toni8 Cc: "Carlos Pignataro \(cpignata\)" , "pals@ietf.org" , Stewart Bryant Subject: Re: [Pals] Soliciting reviews for draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 21:34:45 -0000 --089e014950280898ee050c029395 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I agree with both Stuart and Sasha that an uncontroversial draft specifying Type 4 should be our first deliverable, followed by a separate draft on deployment and migration strategies. Cheers, Andy On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 12:38 PM, Alexander Vainshtein < Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote: > Stewart and all, > > From my POV splitting the problem and delivering a non- controversial > document that just defines VCCV Type 4 (covering such issues as Flow Labe= l, > ELI/EL etc.) is preferable, not in the least because it would onen the wa= y > for interoperable implementations being deployed. > > Discussion on migration strategies could then use actual Type 4 experienc= e > as a reference point > > My 2c, > > > > > Thumb typed on my LG, > Sasha > > ------ Original message ------ > *From: *Stewart Bryant > *Date: *06/01/2015 19:25 > *To: *Carlos Pignataro (cpignata);Andrew G. Malis; > *Cc: *pals@ietf.org; > *Subject:*Re: [Pals] Soliciting reviews for > draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt > > I think that there is agreement that > > 1) We need Type4 > > 2) We cannot mandate Type1 > > However where there is discussion over the migration strategy and how it > is defined. > > I wonder if the WG would prefer > > a) I add more text on migration path, what we deprecate etc to this draf= t > > or > > b) That I split the problem and just create Type 4 here, and then write a > draft > on preferences, migration etc, etc. > > An uncontroversial RFC just creating Type 4 is probably feasible before > the next > IETF. > > - Stewart (as editor) > > > On 24/12/2014 18:35, Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) wrote: > > Andy, > > I took a very quick scan through this document, and have a number of > concerns. > > At the heart of the concerns, this document seems to be doing a number > of different things that are not reflected in the Title and Abstract. Whi= le > the title is =E2=80=9CVCCV Default CC Types=E2=80=9D, this document seems= to be doing much > more than defining default CC Types, including: > 1. Defining a new CC Type 4 > 2. Setting a Default for when with and without CW (as per the Title), but > also > 3. Implicitly Obsoleting Type 2 and Type 3 (non-default) > 4. Requiring new hw capabilities for the Type 4. > > I believe those things should be explicitly done. > > Some more comments (including editorials) follow, prefaced with =E2=80= =9CCMP=E2=80=9D: > > PWE3 T. Nadeau > Internet-Draft lucidvision > Updates: 4447, 5085 (if approved) L. Martini > > CMP: s/PWE3/PALS? > > > This document updates RFC4447 and RFC5085. > > CMP: More importantly, what exactly is this document updating on those > two? Adding a new CC Type does not mean update RFC 4447 or RFC 5085. I > Section listing the exact updates to those specs is necessary. My view is > that this doc can update 5085 (Section 7), but not sure how it updates 44= 47. > > Note to be removed at publication: this document started out as > draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal and got to version -02. When PWE3 was > absorbed into PALS the next version published was draft-ietf-pals- > vccv-for-gal-00 > > CMP: I thought that initially, draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal-02 was only > defining the new CC Type 4, while draft-nadeau-pwe3-vccv2-00 would do oth= er > updates including Defaults, obsoleting CC Types, etc. > > state. Operators have indicated in [RFC4377], and [RFC3916] that > such a tool is required for PW operation and maintenance. To this > end, the IETF's PWE3 Working Group defined the Virtual Circuit > Connectivity Verification Protocol (VCCV) in [RFC5085] . Since then a > number of interoperability issues have arisen with the protocol as it > is defined. > > CMP: I see the fact that PWE3 WG defined that RFC as a distractor, and > irrelevant in the larger scheme of things. Also, you should point to > [RFC7079] to describe and quantify the interop issues instead of just > saying they exist. Lastly, how creating a new CC Type not also create int= ro > issues? That should be answered. > > 7. Manageability Considerations > > By introducing default VCCV CC types, and improving the compatibility > with MPLS-TP, the compatibility of implementations is improved and > management and configuration of the network becomes simpler. > > CMP: This is a bold statement, that does not appear to be immediate. I > expect initially to see the manageability worst before it improves. This = is > adding a new mode before letting time to remove all the other ones. > > Thanks, > > Carlos. > > > On Dec 22, 2014, at 9:33 AM, Andrew G. Malis wrote: > > PALSers, > > i know that you would all like a little something to distract you from > the holidays ... :-). Well, maybe not. But anyway, Stewart recently revis= ed > the VCCV for GAL draft (see below), and while short (just four pages of > real content), we would like to have a good indication that it represents > WG consensus, so we need at least some of you out there to read it and > comment, even if that comment is "I've reviewed it and looks great to me"= . > As I noted, it's a short draft, so it shouldn't take all that long. > > You can read the draft at > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00 . > > Thanks, > Stewart and Andy > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: > Date: Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 12:00 PM > Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt > To: i-d-announce@ietf.org > Cc: pals@ietf.org > > > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts > directories. > This draft is a work item of the Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services > Working Group of the IETF. > > Title : VCCV Default CC Types > Authors : Thomas D. Nadeau > Luca Martini > Stewart Bryant > Filename : draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt > Pages : 8 > Date : 2014-12-17 > > Abstract: > This document specifies the default Virtual Circuit Connectivity > Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type to be used when > the pseudowire control word is present and when it is not present. A > new VCCV control channel type using the Generic Associated Channel > Label (RFC5586) is specified for use when the control word not > present. > > This document updates RFC4447 and RFC5085. > > Note to be removed at publication: this document started out as > draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal and got to version -02. When PWE3 was > absorbed into PALS the next version published was draft-ietf-pals- > vccv-for-gal-00 > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal/ > > There's also a htmlized version available at: > http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00 > > > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of > submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. > > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ > > _______________________________________________ > I-D-Announce mailing list > I-D-Announce@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce > Internet-Draft > > directories: http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html > or ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing listPals@ietf.orghttps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > > > > -- > For corporate legal information go to: > http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/cri/index.html > > --089e014950280898ee050c029395 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I agree with both Stuart and Sasha that an uncontrove= rsial draft specifying Type 4 should be our first deliverable, followed by = a separate draft on deployment and migration strategies.

Cheers,
Andy


On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 12:38 PM, Ale= xander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>= wrote:

Stewart and all,

From my POV splitting the problem= and delivering a non- controversial document that just defines VCCV Type 4= (covering such issues as Flow Label, ELI/EL etc.) is preferable, not in th= e least because it would onen the way for interoperable implementations being deployed.

Discussion on migration strategie= s could then use actual Type 4 experience as a reference point

My 2c,

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

Thumb typed on my LG,
Sasha

------ Original message ------
From:=C2=A0Stewart Bryant
Date:=C2=A006/01/2015 19:25
To:=C2=A0Carlos Pignataro (cpignata);Andrew G. Malis;
Cc:=C2=A0pals@iet= f.org;
Subject:Re: [Pals] Soliciting reviews for draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-g= al-00.txt

I think that there is agreement that
1) We need Type4

2) We cannot mandate Type1

However where there is discussion over the migration strategy and how it is= defined.

I wonder if the WG would prefer

a) I add more text on migration path, what we deprecate =C2=A0etc to this d= raft

or

b) That I split the problem and just create Type 4 here, and then write a d= raft
on preferences, migration etc, etc.

An uncontroversial RFC just creating Type 4 is probably feasible before the= next
IETF.

- Stewart (as editor)


On 24/12/2014 18:35, Carlos Pignataro (cpignata) wrote:
Andy,

I took a very quick scan through this document, and have a number of c= oncerns.

At the heart of the concerns, this document seems to be doing a number= of different things that are not reflected in the Title and Abstract. Whil= e the title is =E2=80=9CVCCV Default CC Types=E2=80=9D, this document seems= to be doing much more than defining default CC Types, including:
1. Defining a new CC Type 4
2. Setting a Default for when with and without CW (as per the Title), = but also
3. Implicitly Obsoleting Type 2 and Type 3 (non-default)
4. Requiring new hw capabilities for the Type 4.

I believe those things should be explicitly done.

Some more comments (including editorials) follow, prefaced with =E2=80= =9CCMP=E2=80=9D:

PWE3 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0T. Nadeau
Internet-Draft =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0luc= idvision
Updates: 4447, 5085 (if approved) =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0L. Martini

CMP: s/PWE3/PALS? >

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0This document updates RFC4447 and RFC5085.

CMP: More importantly, what exactly is this document updating on those= two? Adding a new CC Type does not mean update RFC 4447 or RFC 5085. I Sec= tion listing the exact updates to those specs is necessary. My view is that= this doc can update 5085 (Section 7), but not sure how it updates 4447.

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Note to be removed at publication: this document sta= rted out as
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal and got to version -02.= =C2=A0 When PWE3 was
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0absorbed into PALS the next version published was dr= aft-ietf-pals-
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0vccv-for-gal-00

CMP: I thought that initially, draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal-02 was onl= y defining the new CC Type 4, while draft-nadeau-pwe3-vccv2-00 would do oth= er updates including Defaults, obsoleting CC Types, etc.

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0state.=C2=A0 Operators have indicated in [RFC4377], = and [RFC3916] that
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0such a tool is required for PW operation and mainten= ance.=C2=A0 To this
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0end, the IETF's PWE3 Working Group defined the V= irtual Circuit
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Connectivity Verification Protocol (VCCV) in [RFC508= 5] . Since then a
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0number of interoperability issues have arisen with t= he protocol as it
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0is defined.

CMP: I see the fact that PWE3 WG defined that RFC as a distractor, and= irrelevant in the larger scheme of things. Also, you should point to [RFC7= 079] to describe and quantify the interop issues instead of just saying the= y exist. Lastly, how creating a new CC Type not also create intro issues? That should be answered.

7.=C2=A0 Manageability Considerations

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0By introducing default VCCV CC types, and improving = the compatibility
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0with MPLS-TP, the compatibility of implementations i= s improved and
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0management and configuration of the network becomes = simpler.

CMP: This is a bold statement, that does not appear to be immediate. I= expect initially to see the manageability worst before it improves. This i= s adding a new mode before letting time to remove all the other ones.

Thanks,

Carlos.


On Dec 22, 2014, at 9:33 AM, Andrew G. Malis <agmalis@gmail.com> wrote:

PALSers,

i know that you would all like a little something to distract you from= the holidays ... :-). Well, maybe not. But anyway, Stewart recently revise= d the VCCV for GAL draft (see below), and while short (just four pages of r= eal content), we would like to have a good indication that it represents WG consensus, so we need= at least some of you out there to read it and comment, even if that commen= t is "I've reviewed it and looks great to me". As I noted, it= 's a short draft, so it shouldn't take all that long.


Thanks,
Stewart and Andy

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From:=C2=A0<internet-drafts@ietf.org>
Date: Wed, Dec 17, 2014 at 12:00 PM
Subject: I-D Action: draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt
To:=C2=A0i-d-ann= ounce@ietf.org
Cc:=C2=A0pals@ietf.org


A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies.
=C2=A0This draft is a work item of the Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services = Working Group of the IETF.

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Title =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: VCCV Default CC Types
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Authors =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: Thomas D. Nadeau
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0Luca Martini
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0Stewart Bryant
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Filename =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.txt
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Pages =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: 8
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Date =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0: 2014-12-17

Abstract:
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0This document specifies the default Virtual Circuit Conne= ctivity
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type to be = used when
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0the pseudowire control word is present and when it is not= present. =C2=A0A
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0new VCCV control channel type using the Generic Associate= d Channel
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Label (RFC5586) is specified for use when the control wor= d not
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0present.

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0This document updates RFC4447 and RFC5085.

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0Note to be removed at publication: this document started = out as
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0draft-ietf-pwe3-vccv-for-gal and got to version -02.=C2= =A0 When PWE3 was
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0absorbed into PALS the next version published was draft-i= etf-pals-
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0vccv-for-gal-00


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for= -gal/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n
until the htmlized version and diff are available at=C2=A0 tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp= .ietf.org/internet-drafts/

_______________________________________________
I-D-Announce mailing list
I-D-Announce@iet= f.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/i-d-announce
Internet-Draft directories:=C2=A0 http://www.ietf.org/shadow.html
or=C2=A0ftp://ftp.ietf.org/ietf/1shadow-sites.txt
_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals


=C2=A0

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
ht=
tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals



--=20
For corporate legal information go to:

http://www.cisco.com/web/about/doing_business/legal/c=
ri/index.html

--089e014950280898ee050c029395-- From nobody Tue Jan 6 15:32:17 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E05BE1A872D for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 15:32:15 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.692 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.692 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id v7aT1oDJ3UUV for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 15:32:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from fgwmail6.fujitsu.co.jp (fgwmail6.fujitsu.co.jp [192.51.44.36]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ADH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5914C1A6FE9 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 15:32:14 -0800 (PST) Received: from kw-mxoi1.gw.nic.fujitsu.com (unknown [10.0.237.133]) by fgwmail6.fujitsu.co.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 16E8F3EE0BB for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:32:13 +0900 (JST) Received: from s2.gw.fujitsu.co.jp (s2.gw.fujitsu.co.jp [10.0.50.92]) by kw-mxoi1.gw.nic.fujitsu.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 21047AC0250 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:32:12 +0900 (JST) Received: from dm.kawasaki.flab.fujitsu.co.jp (dm.kawasaki.flab.fujitsu.co.jp [10.25.192.105]) by s2.gw.fujitsu.co.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id C0DECE08007 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:32:11 +0900 (JST) X-SecurityPolicyCheck: OK by SHieldMailChecker v2.3.2 X-SHieldMailCheckerPolicyVersion: FJ-ISEC-20140924-1 X-SHieldMailCheckerMailID: affaae6a0e3445e39b30298f938add37 Message-ID: <54AC7098.7000206@jp.fujitsu.com> Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2015 08:32:40 +0900 From: Yuji Tochio User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: pals@ietf.org References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-2022-jp Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-TM-AS-MML: No Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/H4_7uWvjVxIUo9rDA3SjaIKvTvE Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 06 Jan 2015 23:32:16 -0000 Support Regards, Yuji On 2014/12/24 18:52, Stewart Bryant wrote: > > Working Group, > > This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to > adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of > the PALS WG. > > Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working > group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical > motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that > the document should not be adopted as a working group document. > > In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will > run the poll until 16th January 2015. > > - Stewart > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > From nobody Tue Jan 6 17:55:37 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E31B1A88A1 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 17:55:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2xlku_trmmxu for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 17:55:31 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpeg.etri.re.kr (smtpeg2.etri.re.kr [129.254.27.142]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 756C41A889F for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 17:55:30 -0800 (PST) Received: from SMTP3.etri.info (129.254.28.73) by SMTPEG2.etri.info (129.254.27.142) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.355.2; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 10:55:28 +0900 Received: from SMTP2.etri.info ([169.254.2.83]) by SMTP3.etri.info ([10.2.6.32]) with mapi id 14.01.0355.002; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 10:55:25 +0900 From: "Ryoo, Jeong-dong " To: "Andrew G. Malis" , Gregory Mirsky Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQH19m9g4LutGZMU6VuC0GfomWpJyvFVUAgANooICAAGTwgIAACnCAgAEH8SA= Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2015 01:55:24 +0000 Message-ID: <5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FAA16@SMTP2.etri.info> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789@eusaamb103.ericsson.se>, In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: ko-KR, en-US Content-Language: ko-KR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-new-displayname: UnlvbywgSmVvbmctZG9uZyA= x-originating-ip: [129.254.28.44] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FAA16SMTP2etriinfo_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/5lVcsc_SfqHy7kQsC6cDNVrY75U Cc: "stbryant@cisco.com" , Alexander Vainshtein , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." 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pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2DDED1A8941 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 19:24:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 3.811 X-Spam-Level: *** X-Spam-Status: No, score=3.811 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, CHARSET_FARAWAY_HEADER=3.2, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RELAY_IS_221=2.222, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BahMthIChUpS for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 19:24:43 -0800 (PST) Received: from cmccmta2.chinamobile.com (cmccmta2.chinamobile.com [221.176.66.80]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with SMTP id 365D71A0430 for ; Tue, 6 Jan 2015 19:24:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from spf.mail.chinamobile.com (unknown[172.16.121.17]) by rmmx-syy-dmz-app05-12005 (RichMail) with SMTP id 2ee554aca6f8e61-1358a; Wed, 07 Jan 2015 11:24:40 +0800 (CST) X-RM-TRANSID: 2ee554aca6f8e61-1358a X-RM-SPAM-FLAG: 00000000 Received: from chengweiqiang (unknown[10.2.43.145]) by rmsmtp-syy-appsvr09-12009 (RichMail) with SMTP id 2ee954aca6f82c5-9f911; Wed, 07 Jan 2015 11:24:40 +0800 (CST) X-RM-TRANSID: 2ee954aca6f82c5-9f911 From: =?gb2312?B?s8zOsMe/?= To: , , References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2015 11:24:51 +0800 Message-ID: <008b01d02a29$7fedc8e0$7fc95aa0$@com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="gb2312" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 12.0 Thread-Index: AdAfX2KUvK5TuI/jQBWPOoXdOKmjlQKyg3AQ Content-Language: zh-cn Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/ukfnIS8S9E2zNAvB-2E903nwJ6o Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2015 03:24:46 -0000 Support for adoption. Weiqiang Cheng -----Original Message----- From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:53 PM To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Working Group, This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of the PALS WG. Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that the document should not be adopted as a working group document. In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will run the poll until 16th January 2015. - Stewart _______________________________________________ Pals mailing list Pals@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals From nobody Wed Jan 7 08:25:43 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3D3821A8723 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:25:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id jjUybw9OTSJ0 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:25:39 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qg0-x22d.google.com (mail-qg0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c04::22d]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C68DC1A015F for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:25:38 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qg0-f45.google.com with SMTP id z107so1095573qgd.18 for ; Wed, 07 Jan 2015 08:25:38 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=V59WoKP18QTCuRCx/k2lN57U8vjc6IkbO96z6MzuUCE=; b=qPt//hBgzL57MugcIVl8p0WL9MbWABT/klUQAnqboxX8sZ8lio+Z9yNJIviNZ02Ue2 ZC+x3nh4SMzvBdgdB6gzNRq8cWpv/yyuNFnfUce6pSRPcLWsDDJxinr2C5hgm/pcoosq 1D+MgC4+DUU452yb1QsmeodWcCOdPerLf9PrWEVRx77btRBZXjo8fP2ar1+JQ2eXe1HP iwMYSYOsTP7HlPIDfkdci3ZdBA8pBF5SJh6tS+ixlKU+1UUOi/kYeg90jbUKApOJryme nS6My6u8tjcpo9fHwkYiEZDzHZHEYgtNR+6A1sTx70PkBMNzc1Jsalan8sryT0igXn08 Dr2Q== X-Received: by 10.224.69.1 with SMTP id x1mr6194665qai.32.1420647938004; Wed, 07 Jan 2015 08:25:38 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.140.101.106 with HTTP; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:25:17 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FAA16@SMTP2.etri.info> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FAA16@SMTP2.etri.info> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2015 11:25:17 -0500 Message-ID: To: "Ryoo, Jeong-dong" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c2068ab2200d050c125ff2 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/HjfbfLo6azpXZZNT39n7Dmz7gdQ Cc: Gregory Mirsky , "stbryant@cisco.com" , Alexander Vainshtein , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2015 16:25:42 -0000 --001a11c2068ab2200d050c125ff2 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jeong-dong, Thanks for your comment. In Section A.1, the PW status signaling approach is a "MUST" for code implementation, but not deployment in a network. This is so all implementations of the eventual RFC can interoperate using the PW status signaling approach as the common denominator, if the optional appendix hasn't been implemented by a particular vendor. Cheers, Andy On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 8:55 PM, Ryoo, Jeong-dong wrote: > Happy New Year! > > Although I have a question on the optional linear protection approach > specified in Appendix, which can be addressed after adoption, > I also support this document to be adopted as a WG draft. > > My question is about the first sentence in the third paragraph of Section > A.1. > I don't understand why the PW status signaling is required ("MUST") when > the MPLS-TP linear protection approach is used. > It does not seem correct technically. > > Best regards, > > Jeong-dong > > > > > > ------------------------------ > *=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : *"Andrew G. Malis" > *=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EB=82=A0=EC=A7=9C : *2015-01-07 03:49:55 ( +09:00 ) > *=EB=B0=9B=EB=8A=94 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : *Gregory Mirsky > *=EC=B0=B8=EC=A1=B0 : *Alexander Vainshtein , > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org < > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org>, pals@ietf.org < > pals@ietf.org>, stbryant@cisco.com > *=EC=A0=9C=EB=AA=A9 : *Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoptio= n of > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > > Greg, > > Thanks for your support, and yes we would, although we prefer standards > track so that it would be marked as "Updates 6870" in the RFC database, s= o > anyone implementing 6870 will also read it, and a reference added if > there's ever a 6870-bis. > > Cheers, > Andy > > On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Gregory Mirsky < > gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote: > >> Dear All, >> >> firstly, I support adoption of this document by the WG. >> >> >> >> Second, considering that the document doesn=E2=80=99t put forth any IANA >> requests, nor changes any earlier defined procedures but rather document >> applicability of the RFC 6478, would authors consider Informational trac= k >> for this document? >> >> >> >> Regards, >> >> Greg >> >> >> >> *From:* Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Andrew G. >> Malis >> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 06, 2015 4:11 AM >> *To:* Alexander Vainshtein >> *Cc:* stbryant@cisco.com; >> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org >> *Subject:* Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of >> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft >> >> >> >> Sasha, >> >> >> >> The difference is that this draft is a simple clarification of existing >> RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide end-to-end resilie= ncy >> of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deployment of this draft. >> >> >> >> draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides >> resiliency at intermediate S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has th= e >> possibility to scale better in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. = It >> could also provide faster protection switching as well. It would be up t= o >> the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy. >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> Andy >> >> >> >> >> >> On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein < >> Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote: >> >> Stewart and all, >> I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content per >> se. >> However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already >> adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00. >> >> Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and >> both seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different >> different deployment scenarios. >> >> I would like to clarify that I do not actively object adoption of >> draft-shawam. >> The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG >> feels that this can be postponed. But I do not think that it can be >> avoided altogether. >> >> Regards, >> Sasha >> >> >> >> >> ________________________________________ >> From: Pals on behalf of Stewart Bryant < >> stbryant@cisco.com> >> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM >> To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org >> Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of >> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft >> >> Working Group, >> >> This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to >> adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of >> the PALS WG. >> >> Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working >> group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical >> motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that >> the document should not be adopted as a working group document. >> >> In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will >> run the poll until 16th January 2015. >> >> - Stewart >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pals mailing list >> Pals@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals >> >> >> > > --001a11c2068ab2200d050c125ff2 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Jeong-dong,

<= span style=3D"font-family:=EA=B5=B4=EB=A6=BC;font-size:13px;line-height:20p= x">Thanks for your comment. In Section A.1, the PW status signaling approac= h is a "MUST" for code implementation, but not deployment in a ne= twork. This is so all implementations of the eventual RFC can interoperate = using the PW status signaling approach as the common denominator, if the op= tional appendix hasn't been implemented by a particular vendor.<= /div>

Cheers,
Andy

= On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 8:55 PM, Ryoo, Jeong-dong <ryoo@etri.re.kr> wrote:
Happy New Year!
=C2=A0
Although I have a question on the optional = linear protection approach specified in Appendix, which can be addressed af= ter adoption,
I also support this document to be adopted = as a WG draft.
=C2=A0
My question is about the first sentence in = the third paragraph of Section A.1.
I don't understand why the PW status si= gnaling is required=C2=A0("MUST") when the MPLS-TP linear protect= ion approach is used.
It does not seem correct technically.
=C2=A0
Best regards,
=C2=A0
Jeong-dong
=C2=A0


=C2=A0

=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : "Andrew G. Malis" = <agmalis@gmail.co= m>
=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EB=82=A0=EC=A7=9C : 2015-01-07 03:49:55 ( +09:00= )
=EB=B0=9B=EB=8A=94 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@er= icsson.com>
=EC=B0=B8=EC=A1=B0 : Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitel= e.com>, draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.or= g <draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org= >, pals@ietf.org = <pals@ietf.org>= ;, stbryant@cisco.c= om <stbryant= @cisco.com>
=EC=A0=9C=EB=AA=A9 : Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adop= tion of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft


Greg,

Thanks for your support, and yes we would, although we prefer standard= s track so that it would be marked as "Updates 6870" in the RFC d= atabase, so anyone implementing 6870 will also read it, and a reference add= ed if there's ever a 6870-bis.

Cheers,
Andy

On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Gregory Mirsky <= span dir=3D"ltr"> <gregor= y.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote:

Dear All,<= /p>

firstly, I support adoption of = this document by the WG.

=C2=A0

Second, considering that the do= cument doesn=E2=80=99t put forth any IANA requests, nor changes any earlier= defined procedures but rather document applicability of the RFC 6478, would authors consider Informational track for this document= ?

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Regards,

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0 Greg

=C2=A0

From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Andrew G. Malis
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2015 4:11 AM
To: Alexander Vainshtein
Cc: stbryant= @cisco.com; draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draf= t-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

=C2=A0

Sasha,

=C2=A0

The difference is that this draft is a simple clarif= ication of existing RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide e= nd-to-end resiliency of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deploy= ment of this draft.

=C2=A0

draft-ietf-pals-redun= dancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides resiliency at intermediate= S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has the possibility to scale better= in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. It could also provide faster protection switching as well. It woul= d be up to the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy.

=C2=A0

Cheers,

Andy

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein= <= Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:

Stewart and all,
I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content=C2= =A0 per se.
However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already= adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00.

Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and both = seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different different = deployment scenarios.

I would like to clarify that=C2=A0 I do not actively object adoption of dra= ft-shawam.
The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG fe= els that this can be postponed.=C2=A0 But I do not think that it can be avo= ided altogether.

Regards,
Sasha




________________________________________
From: Pals <p= als-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Stewart Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM
To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-sha= wam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

Working Group,

This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to
adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of
the PALS WG.

Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working
group mailing list (pals= @ietf.org). Please give a technical
motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that
the document should not be adopted as a working group document.

In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will
run the poll until 16th January 2015.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals

=C2=A0



--001a11c2068ab2200d050c125ff2-- From nobody Wed Jan 7 08:29:16 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 773FC1A01F2 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:29:13 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Qv1MrHSIFIKQ for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:29:11 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qc0-x22b.google.com (mail-qc0-x22b.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c01::22b]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D7C071A00DB for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:29:10 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qc0-f171.google.com with SMTP id r5so1133144qcx.16 for ; Wed, 07 Jan 2015 08:29:10 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=JS0ikZAoTGCFjYNVneSagMTOgDO2I/R2MjK6o2TBmSU=; b=Qa/iDFGQqy/ljXSE5CxZEw3JyYIia2svkNcDX9XsbRnX1n4u9yRvPMA1QiLUmF2UMz /GFT9SqEq5UFjaLqVhav+9neHIZohz/xJh0U1PyNejTR8R4fXhxYeFN7DjNSKviUq99W bMb9YCJZ/HzspncE7ntmaZ+NTnDrUD6ADF8Q+cCBEFnFvqM513R53dqTLIIh3KsVmA3G iOoqFoeP0ycRcF/BCRgjrp1ldcEgv1WwXyIUZj/SboADQNbMETf6rjVNSKx1hJo+7SLw fS9T2yjIIO//buniUfXuxORpTySDCdKy0Vhlwv3Tc/4soi7djl9rbxaJY7KvPeDo2P9o uLog== X-Received: by 10.140.101.105 with SMTP id t96mr5900583qge.9.1420648150053; Wed, 07 Jan 2015 08:29:10 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.140.101.106 with HTTP; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 08:28:49 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: References: <20141219211800.17387.25219.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2015 11:28:49 -0500 Message-ID: To: "pals@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c1678255b922050c126c73 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/XYcT5v05MUwkysiTPoyr-GQtAtQ Cc: Loa Andersson Subject: Re: [Pals] [mpls] New Liaison Statement, "LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls" X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 07 Jan 2015 16:29:13 -0000 --001a11c1678255b922050c126c73 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable I just saw that the ccamp email list will be used to collect comments on this liaison. Cheers, Andy On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 10:27 AM, Andrew G. Malis wrote: > This liaison is also of interest to the pals WG. > > A point of contact will be appointed to coordinate a single response to > the ITU-T from the IETF. > > Cheers, > Andy > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: Liaison Statement Management Tool > Date: Fri, Dec 19, 2014 at 4:18 PM > Subject: [mpls] New Liaison Statement, "LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT > standardization work plan to mpls" > To: Loa Andersson , George Swallow , Ross > Callon > Cc: mpls@ietf.org, naotaka.morita@ntt-at.co.jp > > > Title: LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls > Submission Date: 2014-12-19 > URL of the IETF Web page: http://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1369/ > Please reply by 2015-06-07 > From: ITU-T SG 15 (Greg Jones ) > To: Multiprotocol Label Switching (Loa Andersson , George > Swallow , Ross Callon ) > Cc: Adrian Farrel ,Alia Atlas , > mpls@ietf.org,John Drake ,Scott Mansfield > > Response Contact: naotaka.morita@ntt-at.co.jp > Technical Contact: > Purpose: For comment > > Body: Thank you for your previous review and comments on =E2=80=9COptical > Transport Networks & > Technologies standardization work plan.=E2=80=9D Attached is Issue 19, th= e latest > version that was updated by the SG15 meeting in December 2014. We > appreciate your continued review and comments which allow us to keep the > document up-to-date. > > Attach: > =E2=88=92 OTNT standardization work plan, Issue 19 (TD282/PLEN Rev.1) > Attachments: > > LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/documents/LIAISON/liaison-2014-12-19-itu-t-s= g-15-mpls-ls-on-itu-t-sg15-otnt-standardization-work-plan-to-mpls-attachmen= t-1.zip > > _______________________________________________ > mpls mailing list > mpls@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mpls > > --001a11c1678255b922050c126c73 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I just saw that the ccamp email list will be used to colle= ct comments on this liaison.

Cheers,
Andy


On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 10:27 AM, Andrew G. Malis <= ;agmalis@gmail.com> wrote:
Thi= s liaison is also of interest to the pals WG.

A point of= contact will be appointed to coordinate a single response to the ITU-T fro= m the IETF.

Cheers,
Andy

---------- Forw= arded message ----------
From: Liaison Sta= tement Management Tool <lsmt@ietf.org>
Date: Fri, Dec 19,= 2014 at 4:18 PM
Subject: [mpls] New Liaison Statement, "LS on ITU-= T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls"
To: Loa Andersson &l= t;loa@pi.nu>, George = Swallow <swallow@= cisco.com>, Ross Callon <rcallon@juniper.net>
Cc: mpls@ietf.org, naotaka.morita@ntt-at.co.jp

Title: LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls
Submission Date: 2014-12-19
URL of the IETF Web page: http://datatracker.ietf.org/liaison/1369/
Please reply by 2015-06-07
From: ITU-T SG 15=C2=A0 (Greg Jones <greg.jones@itu.int>)
To: Multiprotocol Label Switching (Loa Andersson <loa@pi.nu>, George Swallow <swallow@cisco.com>, Ross = Callon <rcallon= @juniper.net>)
Cc: Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk>,Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>,mpls@ietf.org,John Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>,Scott= Mansfield <Scott.Mansfield@Ericsson.com>
Response Contact: naotaka.morita@ntt-at.co.jp
Technical Contact:
Purpose: For comment

Body: Thank you for your previous review and comments on =E2=80=9COptical T= ransport Networks &
Technologies standardization work plan.=E2=80=9D Attached is Issue 19, the = latest version that was updated by the SG15 meeting in December 2014. We ap= preciate your continued review and comments which allow us to keep the docu= ment up-to-date.

Attach:
=E2=88=92 OTNT standardization work plan, Issue 19 (TD282/PLEN Rev.1)
Attachments:

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 LS on ITU-T SG15 OTNT standardization work plan to mpls
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://datatracker.ietf.= org/documents/LIAISON/liaison-2014-12-19-itu-t-sg-15-mpls-ls-on-itu-t-sg15-= otnt-standardization-work-plan-to-mpls-attachment-1.zip

_______________________________________________
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--001a11c1678255b922050c126c73-- From nobody Wed Jan 7 18:26:48 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7491E1A010C for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 18:26:42 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -101.91 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-101.91 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id wl7F2pRf4onb for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 18:26:36 -0800 (PST) Received: from smtpeg.etri.re.kr (smtpeg2.etri.re.kr [129.254.27.142]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 86DE71A0151 for ; Wed, 7 Jan 2015 18:26:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from SMTP1.etri.info (129.254.28.71) by SMTPEG2.etri.info (129.254.27.142) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 14.1.355.2; Thu, 8 Jan 2015 11:26:33 +0900 Received: from SMTP2.etri.info ([169.254.2.83]) by SMTP1.etri.info ([169.254.1.130]) with mapi id 14.01.0355.002; Thu, 8 Jan 2015 11:26:31 +0900 From: "Ryoo, Jeong-dong " To: "Andrew G. Malis" Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQH19m9g4LutGZMU6VuC0GfomWpJyvFVUAgANooICAAGTwgIAACnCAgAEH8SCAAGImgIABNFDL Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2015 02:26:31 +0000 Message-ID: <5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FBBB1@SMTP2.etri.info> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FAA16@SMTP2.etri.info>, In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: ko-KR, en-US Content-Language: ko-KR X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-new-displayname: UnlvbywgSmVvbmctZG9uZyA= x-originating-ip: [129.254.28.44] Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FBBB1SMTP2etriinfo_" MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/pals/lFc5tnyzIftKpZShKx9MNzgvxMQ Cc: Gregory Mirsky , "stbryant@cisco.com" , Alexander Vainshtein , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." 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L2h0bWw+DQo= --_000_5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FBBB1SMTP2etriinfo_-- From nobody Thu Jan 8 08:02:04 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42B8B1A8702 for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2015 08:01:57 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TFL3Sa-wARMi for ; Thu, 8 Jan 2015 08:01:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qc0-x233.google.com (mail-qc0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c01::233]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client 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-0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FBBB1@SMTP2.etri.info> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <1420358843752.4157@ecitele.com> <7347100B5761DC41A166AC17F22DF1121B8CB789@eusaamb103.ericsson.se> <5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FAA16@SMTP2.etri.info> <5B4A6CBE3924BB41A3BEE462A8E0B75A290FBBB1@SMTP2.etri.info> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2015 11:01:20 -0500 Message-ID: To: "Ryoo, Jeong-dong" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e01495028da8632050c262725 Archived-At: Cc: Gregory Mirsky , "stbryant@cisco.com" , Alexander Vainshtein , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 08 Jan 2015 16:01:57 -0000 --089e01495028da8632050c262725 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Jeong-dong, Thanks, we can get the wording corrected once we have a WG draft. Cheers, Andy On Wed, Jan 7, 2015 at 9:26 PM, Ryoo, Jeong-dong wrote: > Andrew, > > Thanks for your clarification. > > As any text in Appendix is well accepted as optional, informative > description, > that particular sentence misled me into thinking if the PW status > signaling is an essential prerequisite for the proper working of the line= ar > protection. > > May I suggest to modify that sentence to clarify its intention? > Something like, > OLD: > This Appendix is optional alternative approach to the one in > Section 2, therefore all implementations MUST include the approach in > Section 2 even if this alternative approach is used. > NEW: > This Appendix is optional alternative approach to the one in > Section 2. The approach in Section 2 MUST be implemented > to ensure interoperation between equipments, but MAY NOT be > used in a network when two T-PEs run this alternative approach. > > Best regards, > > Jeong-dong > > > > ------------------------------ > *=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : *"Andrew G. Malis" > *=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EB=82=A0=EC=A7=9C : *2015-01-08 01:25:41 ( +09:00 ) > *=EB=B0=9B=EB=8A=94 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : *=EB=A5=98=EC=A0=95=EB=8F=99 > *=EC=B0=B8=EC=A1=B0 : *Gregory Mirsky , Alex= ander Vainshtein > , > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org < > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org>, pals@ietf.org < > pals@ietf.org>, stbryant@cisco.com > > *=EC=A0=9C=EB=AA=A9 : *Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoptio= n of > draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft > > Jeong-dong, > > Thanks for your comment. In Section A.1, the PW status signaling > approach is a "MUST" for code implementation, but not deployment in a > network. This is so all implementations of the eventual RFC can > interoperate using the PW status signaling approach as the common > denominator, if the optional appendix hasn't been implemented by a > particular vendor. > > Cheers, > Andy > > On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 8:55 PM, Ryoo, Jeong-dong wrote: > >> Happy New Year! >> >> Although I have a question on the optional linear protection approach >> specified in Appendix, which can be addressed after adoption, >> I also support this document to be adopted as a WG draft. >> >> My question is about the first sentence in the third paragraph of Sectio= n >> A.1. >> I don't understand why the PW status signaling is required ("MUST") when >> the MPLS-TP linear protection approach is used. >> It does not seem correct technically. >> >> Best regards, >> >> Jeong-dong >> >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> *=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : *"Andrew G. Malis" >> *=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EB=82=A0=EC=A7=9C : *2015-01-07 03:49:55 ( +09:00 ) >> *=EB=B0=9B=EB=8A=94 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : *Gregory Mirsky >> *=EC=B0=B8=EC=A1=B0 : *Alexander Vainshtein , >> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org < >> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org>, pals@ietf.org < >> pals@ietf.org>, stbryant@cisco.com >> *=EC=A0=9C=EB=AA=A9 : *Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adopti= on of >> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft >> >> >> Greg, >> >> Thanks for your support, and yes we would, although we prefer standards >> track so that it would be marked as "Updates 6870" in the RFC database, = so >> anyone implementing 6870 will also read it, and a reference added if >> there's ever a 6870-bis. >> >> Cheers, >> Andy >> >> On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Gregory Mirsky < >> gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote: >> >>> Dear All, >>> >>> firstly, I support adoption of this document by the WG. >>> >>> >>> >>> Second, considering that the document doesn=E2=80=99t put forth any IAN= A >>> requests, nor changes any earlier defined procedures but rather documen= t >>> applicability of the RFC 6478, would authors consider Informational tra= ck >>> for this document? >>> >>> >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Greg >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] *On Behalf Of *Andrew G. >>> Malis >>> *Sent:* Tuesday, January 06, 2015 4:11 AM >>> *To:* Alexander Vainshtein >>> *Cc:* stbryant@cisco.com; >>> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org >>> *Subject:* Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of >>> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft >>> >>> >>> >>> Sasha, >>> >>> >>> >>> The difference is that this draft is a simple clarification of existing >>> RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide end-to-end resili= ency >>> of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deployment of this draft. >>> >>> >>> >>> draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides >>> resiliency at intermediate S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has t= he >>> possibility to scale better in a network with a large number of MS-PWs.= It >>> could also provide faster protection switching as well. It would be up = to >>> the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy. >>> >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> Andy >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein < >>> Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote: >>> >>> Stewart and all, >>> I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content per >>> se. >>> However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already >>> adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00. >>> >>> Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and >>> both seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different >>> different deployment scenarios. >>> >>> I would like to clarify that I do not actively object adoption of >>> draft-shawam. >>> The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the W= G >>> feels that this can be postponed. But I do not think that it can be >>> avoided altogether. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Sasha >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: Pals on behalf of Stewart Bryant < >>> stbryant@cisco.com> >>> Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM >>> To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org >>> Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of >>> draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft >>> >>> Working Group, >>> >>> This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to >>> adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of >>> the PALS WG. >>> >>> Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working >>> group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical >>> motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that >>> the document should not be adopted as a working group document. >>> >>> In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will >>> run the poll until 16th January 2015. >>> >>> - Stewart >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pals mailing list >>> Pals@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals >>> >>> >>> >> >> > --089e01495028da8632050c262725 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Jeong-dong,

Thanks, we can get the word= ing corrected once we have a WG draft.

Cheers,
Andy

On Wed, Jan 7, 2015 at 9:26 PM, Ryoo, Jeong-dong &l= t;ryoo@etri.re.kr&= gt; wrote:
Andrew,
=C2=A0
Thanks for your=C2=A0clarification.
=C2=A0
As any text in Appendix is well accepted as= optional,=C2=A0informative description,
that particular sentence misled me into thi= nking if the PW status signaling is an essential prerequisite for the prope= r working of the=C2=A0linear protection.
=C2=A0
May I suggest to modify that sentence to cl= arify its intention?
Something like,
OLD:
This Appendix is optional alternative appro= ach to the one in
Section 2, therefore all implementations MUST include the approach in
Section 2 even if this alternative approach is used.
NEW:
This Appendix is optional alternative appro= ach to the one in
Section 2. The approach in Section 2 MUST be implemented
to ensure interoperation between equipments= , but=C2=A0MAY NOT be
used=C2=A0in a network when two=C2=A0T-PEs= =C2=A0run=C2=A0this alternative approach.
=C2=A0
Best regards,
=C2=A0
Jeong-dong
=C2=A0
=C2=A0

=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : "Andrew G. Malis" = <agmalis@gmail.co= m>
=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EB=82=A0=EC=A7=9C : 2015-01-08 01:25:41 (= +09:00 )
=EB=B0=9B=EB=8A=94 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : =EB=A5=98=EC=A0=95=EB=8F=99 = <ryoo@etri.re.kr>
=EC=B0=B8=EC=A1=B0 : Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@ericsson.com>, A= lexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com>, dr= aft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org <draft-s= hawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org>, pals@ietf.org <pals@ietf.org>, stbryant@cisco.com <stbryant@cisco= .com>

=EC=A0=9C=EB=AA=A9 : Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adop= tion of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

Jeong-dong,

Thanks for your comment. In Section A.1, the PW status signaling a= pproach is a "MUST" for code implementation, but not deployment i= n a network. This is so all implementations of the eventual RFC can interoperate using the PW status signaling approach as the common = denominator, if the optional appendix hasn't been implemented by a part= icular vendor.

Cheers,
Andy

On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 8:55 PM, Ryoo, Jeong-dong= <ryoo@etri.re.kr> wrote:
Happy New Year!
=C2=A0
Although I have a question on the optional = linear protection approach specified in Appendix, which can be addressed af= ter adoption,
I also support this document to be adopted = as a WG draft.
=C2=A0
My question is about the first sentence in = the third paragraph of Section A.1.
I don't understand why the PW status si= gnaling is required=C2=A0("MUST") when the MPLS-TP linear protect= ion approach is used.
It does not seem correct technically.
=C2=A0
Best regards,
=C2=A0
Jeong-dong
=C2=A0


=C2=A0

=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : "Andrew G. Malis" = <agmalis@gmail.co= m>
=EB=B3=B4=EB=82=B8 =EB=82=A0=EC=A7=9C : 2015-01-07 03:49:55 ( +09:00= )
=EB=B0=9B=EB=8A=94 =EC=82=AC=EB=9E=8C : Gregory Mirsky <gregory.mirsky@er= icsson.com>
=EC=B0=B8=EC=A1=B0 : Alexander Vainshtein <Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitel= e.com>, draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org <draft= -shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org>, pals@ietf.org <pals@ietf.org>, stbryant@cisco.com<= /a> <stbryant@ci= sco.com>
=EC=A0=9C=EB=AA=A9 : Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adop= tion of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft


Greg,

Thanks for your support, and yes we would, although we prefer standard= s track so that it would be marked as "Updates 6870" in the RFC d= atabase, so anyone implementing 6870 will also read it, and a reference add= ed if there's ever a 6870-bis.

Cheers,
Andy

On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 1:11 PM, Gregory Mirsky <= span dir=3D"ltr"> <gregor= y.mirsky@ericsson.com> wrote:

Dear All,<= /p>

firstly, I support adoption of = this document by the WG.

=C2=A0

Second, considering that the do= cument doesn=E2=80=99t put forth any IANA requests, nor changes any earlier= defined procedures but rather document applicability of the RFC 6478, would authors consider Informational track for this document= ?

=C2=A0

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Regards,

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0 Greg

=C2=A0

From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Andrew G. Malis
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2015 4:11 AM
To: Alexander Vainshtein
Cc: stbryant= @cisco.com; draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draf= t-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

=C2=A0

Sasha,

=C2=A0

The difference is that this draft is a simple clarif= ication of existing RFCs to make it clear how they can be used to provide e= nd-to-end resiliency of static MS-PWs. I'm aware of at least one deploy= ment of this draft.

=C2=A0

draft-ietf-pals-redun= dancy-spe-00 is more involved, since it provides resiliency at intermediate= S-PEs rather than only end-to-end, but has the possibility to scale better= in a network with a large number of MS-PWs. It could also provide faster protection switching as well. It woul= d be up to the operator to decide which solution they prefer to deploy.

=C2=A0

Cheers,

Andy

=C2=A0

=C2=A0

On Sun, Jan 4, 2015 at 3:07 AM, Alexander Vainshtein= <= Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com> wrote:

Stewart and all,
I've read the draft, and I do not have any issues with its content=C2= =A0 per se.
However I'd like to understand better its relationship with the already= adopted draft-ietf-pals-redundancy-spe-00.

Both drafts are intended for the Standards track by their authors and both = seem to address the problem of S-PE failure even if in different different = deployment scenarios.

I would like to clarify that=C2=A0 I do not actively object adoption of dra= ft-shawam.
The clarification in question could be provided after adoption if the WG fe= els that this can be postponed.=C2=A0 But I do not think that it can be avo= ided altogether.

Regards,
Sasha




________________________________________
From: Pals <p= als-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Stewart Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 11:52 AM
To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-sha= wam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft

Working Group,

This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to
adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of
the PALS WG.

Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working
group mailing list (pals= @ietf.org). Please give a technical
motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that
the document should not be adopted as a working group document.

In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will
run the poll until 16th January 2015.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
ht= tps://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals

=C2=A0




--089e01495028da8632050c262725-- From nobody Mon Jan 12 02:53:57 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 777761A8ABF for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 02:53:46 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.211 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.211 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0LMUCaJTN0oN for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 02:53:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from lhrrgout.huawei.com (lhrrgout.huawei.com [194.213.3.17]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 67F791A87E2 for ; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 02:53:42 -0800 (PST) Received: from 172.18.7.190 (EHLO lhreml401-hub.china.huawei.com) ([172.18.7.190]) by lhrrg01-dlp.huawei.com (MOS 4.3.7-GA FastPath queued) with ESMTP id BRD13489; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 10:53:24 +0000 (GMT) Received: from LHREML504-MBS.china.huawei.com ([169.254.11.10]) by lhreml401-hub.china.huawei.com ([10.201.5.240]) with mapi id 14.03.0158.001; Mon, 12 Jan 2015 10:53:19 +0000 From: Italo Busi To: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft Thread-Index: AQHQKpccCmqCYKbYV0y1G7ifTnb1fpy3c3og Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2015 10:53:17 +0000 Message-ID: <91E3A1BD737FDF4FA14118387FF6766B010DB3C0@lhreml504-mbs.china.huawei.com> References: <548986EC.6050806@cisco.com> <549A8CEA.3010909@cisco.com> <008b01d02a29$7fedc8e0$7fc95aa0$@com> In-Reply-To: <008b01d02a29$7fedc8e0$7fc95aa0$@com> Accept-Language: zh-CN, en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.200.144.118] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 X-CFilter-Loop: Reflected Archived-At: Subject: Re: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as WG draft X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2015 10:53:46 -0000 Support > -----Original Message----- > From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant > Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 5:53 PM > To: draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org > Subject: [Pals] Poll to determine consensus for adoption of draft-shawam-= pwe3- > ms-pw-protection as WG draft >=20 >=20 > Working Group, >=20 > This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to adopt draft= - > shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of the PALS WG. >=20 > Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working group > mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical motivation for your > support/not support, especially if you think that the document should not= be > adopted as a working group document. >=20 > In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will run = the > poll until 16th January 2015. >=20 > - Stewart >=20 > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals >=20 >=20 >=20 From nobody Wed Jan 14 07:37:07 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27EC61A886C for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 07:37:01 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -14.51 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-14.51 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id QrbdCgGsOr_S for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 07:36:53 -0800 (PST) Received: from aer-iport-2.cisco.com (aer-iport-2.cisco.com [173.38.203.52]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C37E81A8990 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 07:36:52 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=40678; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1421249812; x=1422459412; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:mime-version:to:subject; bh=jwGjka/hg++7Etrc1FFJt1tMw21yXdkXECNlVOFwbaw=; b=edctL1mF1Xm23KNlHrJqSR7gws7mDnl8Z0fc7JIgIxmns1MjyGtCxlO3 LT0sRnK058XFqylaK/OcUdEjcHYPyXvvKgKwQr2XuEOxwucwE1PLPm1fu 4KLIalwf/ILcVaM1gGViHHmRK8T/kdavNJwXsWwlIO0+wm9BzMUZpXxTt o=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.07,756,1413244800"; d="scan'208,217";a="311626337" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-2.cisco.com with ESMTP; 14 Jan 2015 15:36:51 +0000 Received: from [64.103.108.131] (dhcp-bdlk10-vlan301-data-64-103-108-131.cisco.com [64.103.108.131]) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t0EFaoCF022504; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 15:36:51 GMT Message-ID: <54B68D13.9000707@cisco.com> Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2015 15:36:51 +0000 From: Stewart Bryant User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.10; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal@tools.ietf.org, "pals@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------090409070406080705000500" Archived-At: Subject: [Pals] Candidate draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01 X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: stbryant@cisco.com List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2015 15:37:01 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------090409070406080705000500 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Working Group/Co-authors Following discussion on the list I have edited draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal to just define the GAL VCCV CC Type 4. As suggested the plan will then be to write a new draft describing the migration strategy to type 1 and 4 only. There is some text in here on migration and I am torn between taking it out and leaving it in to explain why we are introducing the new CC type. Because of the extensive changes I thought it best to post this candidate to the list to make sure we are all on the same page. If this is going in the right direction I will upload it as a draft replacing draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00. I took Sasha's proposal of making FAT and GAL mutually exclusive which in my view usefully simplified that aspect of the design. I did quite a lot of work on the Capability Advertisment section which will need to be checked very carefully, in particular the handling of the error processing. I would appreciate a quick review to see whether this is what the WG was expecting, and then I can upload it ready for a detailed review if it is on the right lines. - Stewart PWE3 T. Nadeau Internet-Draft lucidvision Intended status: Standards Track L. Martini Expires: July 18, 2015 S. Bryant Cisco Systems January 14, 2015 Candidate for Using GAL as a VCCV Channel Indicator draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01 Abstract This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type for use with pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network. This new channel type uses the Generic Associated Channel Label (GAL) (RFC5586) to distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying user data. Status of This Memo This Internet-Draft is submitted in full conformance with the provisions of BCP 78 and BCP 79. Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering Task Force (IETF). Note that other groups may also distribute working documents as Internet-Drafts. The list of current Internet- Drafts is at http://datatracker.ietf.org/drafts/current/. Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum of six months and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other documents at any time. It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as reference material or to cite them other than as "work in progress." This Internet-Draft will expire on July 18, 2015. Copyright Notice Copyright (c) 2015 IETF Trust and the persons identified as the document authors. All rights reserved. This document is subject to BCP 78 and the IETF Trust's Legal Provisions Relating to IETF Documents (http://trustee.ietf.org/license-info) in effect on the date of publication of this document. Please review these documents carefully, as they describe your rights and restrictions with respect to this document. Code Components extracted from this document must include Simplified BSD License text as described in Section 4.e of Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 1] Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 the Trust Legal Provisions and are provided without warranty as described in the Simplified BSD License. Table of Contents 1. Introduction . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 2. Requirements Language . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 3. GAL VCCV Control Channel Type . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 4. FAT PWs . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 5. VCCV Capability Advertisement . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 6. Manageability Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 7. Security Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 8. IANA Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 8.1. MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Type 4 . . . . . . . . . . 5 8.2. LDP Status Code . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 9. Acknowledgments . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 10. References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 10.1. Normative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 10.2. Informative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 Authors' Addresses . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 1. Introduction This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV) [RFC5085] control channel (CC) type for use with pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network that do not use the PW Control Word (CW) [RFC4385]. This new VCCV CC type uses the Generic Associated Channel Label (GAL) [RFC5586] to distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying user data. This new VCCV CC type introduces compatibility with the method of MPLS Label Switched Path (LSP) Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (OAM) identification, particularly in MPLS-TP networks [RFC5921]. VCCV currently specifies three CC types. VCCV CC Type 1 uses the PW Control Word (CW) to distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying user data. VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 require IP encapsulation for OAM packets they carry. This was not an issue when [RFC5085] was designed, but is in conflict with the design goals of MPLS-TP [RFC5921] which does not otherwise require the availability of IP. VCCV CC Type 2 is not supported by multi-segment PWs (MS-PWs) [RFC6073]. A MS-PW operating without the CW therefore has to use VCCV CC Type 3 which identifies VCCV packets on the basis of TTL expiry. Whilst less of an issue with a single segment PW (SS-PW), on an MS-PW this need to be accurately set to cause TTL expiry at the egress Terminating Provider Edge (T-PE) [RFC6073]. In the event of a error in the setting of the PW LSE TTL this can result in VCCV packets leaking into the attachment circuit which may disrupt the operation of the PW, or the user service, and is a security risk. Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 2] Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 The new VCCV CC type defined in this specification addresses these problems for PWs that do not use the CW. For reasons of network efficiency and due to hardware constraints it is not possible to address these issue by mandating that all PWs use the PW CW, hence the introduction of this new VCCV CC type. 2. Requirements Language The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT", "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "NOT RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpreted as described in [RFC2119]. 3. GAL VCCV Control Channel Type When the PW CW is not used, the GAL VCCV Control Channel (CC) type defined in this section MAY be used. This is referred to as VCCV CC Type4 throughout the rest of this of this document. VCCV Type 4 uses the encapsulation shown in Figure 1. 0 1 2 3 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | PW LSE | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | GAL LSE | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ |0 0 0 1|Version| Reserved | Channel Type | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | | ~ VCCV Message Body ~ | | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Figure 1 The VCCV message body is preceded by a Generic Associated Channel Header as defined in [RFC5586], in which the Channel Type identifies the type and format of the OAM message carried in the VCCV message body. The GAL LSE MUST contain the GAL reserved label as defined in [RFC5586]. Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 3] Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 The PW LSE is constructed according to the existing procedures that apply to the type of pseudowire that is in use. Note that the inclusion of a GAL following the PW LSE over a label switched path subject to Equal-Cost Multi-path (ECMP) load balancing can cause the OAM packet to take a different path through the network from the corresponding PW data packets. If that is not acceptable, then an alternative VCCV type must be used. 4. FAT PWs [RFC6391] specifies that when the flow-aware transport (FAT) of pseudowires over an MPLS packet switched network has been signalled or configured, the Flow LSE MUST be present. It further specifies that "the flow label MUST NOT be an MPLS reserved label (values in the range 0..15) [RFC3032]", and that "If a flow LSE is present, it MUST be checked to determine whether it carries a reserved label. If it is a reserved label, the packet is processed according to the rules associated with that reserved label; otherwise, the LSE is discarded." This document specifies that if the flow-aware transport of pseudowires over an MPLS packet switched network has been signalled or configured then the presence of VCCV message is indicated by the use of a GAL in place of the flow LSE. This is consistent with [RFC6391], and the packet structure is identical to that shown in Figure 1. Note that the use of a GAL in place of the flow label over a label switched path subject to ECMP can cause the OAM packet to take a different path through the network from the corresponding PW data packets. If that is not acceptable, then an alternative VCCV type must be used. 5. VCCV Capability Advertisement The VCCV capability advertisement MUST match the c-bit setting that is advertised in the PW FEC element [RFC4447]. If the c-bit is set, indicating the use of the PW CW, then VCCV CC Type 4 MUST NOT be advertised. If the c-bit is not set, indicating that the PW CW is not in use, then an equipment supporting this specification MUST advertise VCCV CC Type 4. Advertisement of VCCV CC Types 1 and 4 are therefore mutually exclusive. A PE supporting VCCV CC Type 4 MAY advertise other VCCV CC types as defined in [RFC5085] . Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 4] Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 If the remote PE supports VCCV CC Type 4, and the PW CW is not in use, then the following capability advertisement precedence rules supersede those defined in Section 7 of [RFC5085] : 1. Type 4: GAL VCCV Control Channel. 2. Type 2: MPLS Router Alert Label. 3. Type 3: MPLS PW Label with TTL == 1. If the remote PE finds that VCCV CC Types 1 and 4 are both advertised, or that c-bit is set and VCCV CC Type 4 is advertised, then it should report the error to the operator through the management interface in use, and send a Label Release Message with a status code "VCCV Type Error". 6. Manageability Considerations Whilst the introduction of this additional VCCV CC type increases the number of VCCV CC types that the operator needs to manage, it addresses the issues with VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 described in Section 1, and is a necessary per-requisite of the long term strategy of the PALS working group to consolidate the VCCV channel types down to only VCCV CC Types 1 and 4. This consolidation and will be the subject of future work by the PALS working group. In the event of a misconfiguration of this VCCV CC type, the PW is taken out of service and the operator advised as described in Section 5. Attention is drawn to the possible absence of fate sharing between PW data packets and VCCV CC Type 4 packets described in Section 3 and Section 4. 7. Security Considerations This document does not by itself raise any new security considerations beyond those described in [RFC5085]. It addresses the possibility of packet leaking that can occur with VCCV CC Type 3. 8. IANA Considerations 8.1. MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Type 4 IANA is requested to assign a new bit from the MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Types registry in the PWE3-parameters name space in order to identify VCCV type 4. It is recommended that Bit 3 be assigned to this purpose which would have a value of 0x08. Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 5] Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Types Bit (Value) Description Reference ============ =========== ================== Bit X (0x0Y) Type 4 This Specification 8.2. LDP Status Code IANA is requested to assign a new Status Code from the Label Distribution Protocol (LDP) Parameters name space: Status Code Name Space Range/Value E Description Reference =========== = =============== ========= 0x000000xx 0 VCCV Type Error This Specification 9. Acknowledgments The authors wish to thank Alexander (Sasha) Vainshtein for his review comments and for his proposal to make the GAL and Flow labels mutually exclusive. This proposal let to a significant simplification of this design. 10. References 10.1. Normative References [RFC2119] Bradner, S., "Key words for use in RFCs to Indicate Requirement Levels", BCP 14, RFC 2119, March 1997. [RFC4385] Bryant, S., Swallow, G., Martini, L., and D. McPherson, "Pseudowire Emulation Edge-to-Edge (PWE3) Control Word for Use over an MPLS PSN", RFC 4385, February 2006. [RFC4447] Martini, L., Rosen, E., El-Aawar, N., Smith, T., and G. Heron, "Pseudowire Setup and Maintenance Using the Label Distribution Protocol (LDP)", RFC 4447, April 2006. [RFC5085] Nadeau, T. and C. Pignataro, "Pseudowire Virtual Circuit Connectivity Verification (VCCV): A Control Channel for Pseudowires", RFC 5085, December 2007. [RFC5586] Bocci, M., Vigoureux, M., and S. Bryant, "MPLS Generic Associated Channel", RFC 5586, June 2009. Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 6] Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 [RFC6073] Martini, L., Metz, C., Nadeau, T., Bocci, M., and M. Aissaoui, "Segmented Pseudowire", RFC 6073, January 2011. [RFC6391] Bryant, S., Filsfils, C., Drafz, U., Kompella, V., Regan, J., and S. Amante, "Flow-Aware Transport of Pseudowires over an MPLS Packet Switched Network", RFC 6391, November 2011. 10.2. Informative References [RFC5921] Bocci, M., Bryant, S., Frost, D., Levrau, L., and L. Berger, "A Framework for MPLS in Transport Networks", RFC 5921, July 2010. Authors' Addresses Thomas D. Nadeau lucidvision Email: tnadeau@lucidvision.com Luca Martini Cisco Systems Email: lmartini@cisco.com Stewart Bryant Cisco Systems Email: stbryant@cisco.com Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 7] --------------090409070406080705000500 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Working Group/Co-authors

Following discussion on the list I have edited draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal
to just define the GAL VCCV CC Type 4. As suggested the plan will then be
to write a new draft describing the migration strategy to type 1 and 4 only.
There is some text in here on migration and I am torn between taking it out
and leaving it in to explain why we are introducing the new CC type.

Because of the extensive changes I thought it best to post this candidate
to the list to make sure we are all on the same page. If this is going in
the right direction I will upload it as a draft replacing
draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.

I took Sasha's proposal of making FAT and GAL mutually exclusive which
in my view usefully simplified that aspect of the design.

I did quite a lot of work on the Capability Advertisment section which
will need to be checked very carefully, in particular the handling of the
error processing.

I would appreciate a quick review to see whether this is what the WG was
expecting, and then I can upload it ready for a detailed review if it
is on the right lines.

- Stewart



PWE3                                                           T. Nadeau
Internet-Draft                                               lucidvision
Intended status: Standards Track                              L. Martini
Expires: July 18, 2015                                         S. Bryant
                                                           Cisco Systems
                                                        January 14, 2015


          Candidate for Using GAL as a VCCV Channel Indicator
                    draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01

Abstract

   This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivity
   Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type for use with
   pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network.  This new channel type
   uses the Generic Associated Channel Label (GAL) (RFC5586) to
   distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying user data.

Status of This Memo

   This Internet-Draft is submitted in full conformance with the
   provisions of BCP 78 and BCP 79.

   Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering
   Task Force (IETF).  Note that other groups may also distribute
   working documents as Internet-Drafts.  The list of current Internet-
   Drafts is at http://datatracker.ietf.org/drafts/current/.

   Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum of six months
   and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other documents at any
   time.  It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as reference
   material or to cite them other than as "work in progress."

   This Internet-Draft will expire on July 18, 2015.

Copyright Notice

   Copyright (c) 2015 IETF Trust and the persons identified as the
   document authors.  All rights reserved.

   This document is subject to BCP 78 and the IETF Trust's Legal
   Provisions Relating to IETF Documents
   (http://trustee.ietf.org/license-info) in effect on the date of
   publication of this document.  Please review these documents
   carefully, as they describe your rights and restrictions with respect
   to this document.  Code Components extracted from this document must
   include Simplified BSD License text as described in Section 4.e of



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   the Trust Legal Provisions and are provided without warranty as
   described in the Simplified BSD License.

Table of Contents

   1.  Introduction  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   2
   2.  Requirements Language . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   3
   3.  GAL VCCV Control Channel Type . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   3
   4.  FAT PWs . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   4
   5.  VCCV Capability Advertisement . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   4
   6.  Manageability Considerations  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   5
   7.  Security Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   5
   8.  IANA Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   5
     8.1.  MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Type 4 . . . . . . . . . .   5
     8.2.  LDP Status Code . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   6
   9.  Acknowledgments . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   6
   10. References  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   6
     10.1.  Normative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   6
     10.2.  Informative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7
   Authors' Addresses  . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .   7

1.  Introduction

   This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivity
   Verification (VCCV) [RFC5085] control channel (CC) type for use with
   pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network that do not use the PW
   Control Word (CW) [RFC4385].  This new VCCV CC type uses the Generic
   Associated Channel Label (GAL) [RFC5586] to distinguish VCCV packets
   from packets carrying user data.  This new VCCV CC type introduces
   compatibility with the method of MPLS Label Switched Path (LSP)
   Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (OAM) identification,
   particularly in MPLS-TP networks [RFC5921].

   VCCV currently specifies three CC types.  VCCV CC Type 1 uses the PW
   Control Word (CW) to distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying
   user data.  VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 require IP encapsulation for OAM
   packets they carry.  This was not an issue when [RFC5085] was
   designed, but is in conflict with the design goals of MPLS-TP
   [RFC5921] which does not otherwise require the availability of IP.
   VCCV CC Type 2 is not supported by multi-segment PWs (MS-PWs)
   [RFC6073].  A MS-PW operating without the CW therefore has to use
   VCCV CC Type 3 which identifies VCCV packets on the basis of TTL
   expiry.  Whilst less of an issue with a single segment PW (SS-PW), on
   an MS-PW this need to be accurately set to cause TTL expiry at the
   egress Terminating Provider Edge (T-PE) [RFC6073].  In the event of a
   error in the setting of the PW LSE TTL this can result in VCCV
   packets leaking into the attachment circuit which may disrupt the
   operation of the PW, or the user service, and is a security risk.



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   The new VCCV CC type defined in this specification addresses these
   problems for PWs that do not use the CW.

   For reasons of network efficiency and due to hardware constraints it
   is not possible to address these issue by mandating that all PWs use
   the PW CW, hence the introduction of this new VCCV CC type.

2.  Requirements Language

   The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT",
   "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "NOT RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and
   "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpreted as described in
   [RFC2119].

3.  GAL VCCV Control Channel Type

   When the PW CW is not used, the GAL VCCV Control Channel (CC) type
   defined in this section MAY be used.  This is referred to as VCCV CC
   Type4 throughout the rest of this of this document.  VCCV Type 4 uses
   the encapsulation shown in Figure 1.

   0 1
                    2                   3
   0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1

   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
   |                            PW LSE                             |
   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
   |                           GAL LSE                             |
   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
   |0 0 0 1|Version|   Reserved    |        Channel Type           |
   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
   |                                                               |
   ~                        VCCV Message Body                      ~
   |                                                               |
   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

                                 Figure 1

   The VCCV message body is preceded by a Generic Associated Channel
   Header as defined in [RFC5586], in which the Channel Type identifies
   the type and format of the OAM message carried in the VCCV message
   body.

   The GAL LSE MUST contain the GAL reserved label as defined in
   [RFC5586].





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   The PW LSE is constructed according to the existing procedures that
   apply to the type of pseudowire that is in use.

   Note that the inclusion of a GAL following the PW LSE over a label
   switched path subject to Equal-Cost Multi-path (ECMP) load balancing
   can cause the OAM packet to take a different path through the network
   from the corresponding PW data packets.  If that is not acceptable,
   then an alternative VCCV type must be used.

4.  FAT PWs

   [RFC6391] specifies that when the flow-aware transport (FAT) of
   pseudowires over an MPLS packet switched network has been signalled
   or configured, the Flow LSE MUST be present.  It further specifies
   that "the flow label MUST NOT be an MPLS reserved label (values in
   the range 0..15) [RFC3032]", and that "If a flow LSE is present, it
   MUST be checked to determine whether it carries a reserved label.  If
   it is a reserved label, the packet is processed according to the
   rules associated with that reserved label; otherwise, the LSE is
   discarded."

   This document specifies that if the flow-aware transport of
   pseudowires over an MPLS packet switched network has been signalled
   or configured then the presence of VCCV message is indicated by the
   use of a GAL in place of the flow LSE.

   This is consistent with [RFC6391], and the packet structure is
   identical to that shown in Figure 1.

   Note that the use of a GAL in place of the flow label over a label
   switched path subject to ECMP can cause the OAM packet to take a
   different path through the network from the corresponding PW data
   packets.  If that is not acceptable, then an alternative VCCV type
   must be used.

5.  VCCV Capability Advertisement

   The VCCV capability advertisement MUST match the c-bit setting that
   is advertised in the PW FEC element [RFC4447].  If the c-bit is set,
   indicating the use of the PW CW, then VCCV CC Type 4 MUST NOT be
   advertised.  If the c-bit is not set, indicating that the PW CW is
   not in use, then an equipment supporting this specification MUST
   advertise VCCV CC Type 4.  Advertisement of VCCV CC Types 1 and 4 are
   therefore mutually exclusive.

   A PE supporting VCCV CC Type 4 MAY advertise other VCCV CC types as
   defined in [RFC5085] .




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   If the remote PE supports VCCV CC Type 4, and the PW CW is not in
   use, then the following capability advertisement precedence rules
   supersede those defined in Section 7 of [RFC5085] :

   1.  Type 4: GAL VCCV Control Channel.

   2.  Type 2: MPLS Router Alert Label.

   3.  Type 3: MPLS PW Label with TTL == 1.

   If the remote PE finds that VCCV CC Types 1 and 4 are both
   advertised, or that c-bit is set and VCCV CC Type 4 is advertised,
   then it should report the error to the operator through the
   management interface in use, and send a Label Release Message with a
   status code "VCCV Type Error".

6.  Manageability Considerations

   Whilst the introduction of this additional VCCV CC type increases the
   number of VCCV CC types that the operator needs to manage, it
   addresses the issues with VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 described in
   Section 1, and is a necessary per-requisite of the long term strategy
   of the PALS working group to consolidate the VCCV channel types down
   to only VCCV CC Types 1 and 4.  This consolidation and will be the
   subject of future work by the PALS working group.

   In the event of a misconfiguration of this VCCV CC type, the PW is
   taken out of service and the operator advised as described in
   Section 5.

   Attention is drawn to the possible absence of fate sharing between PW
   data packets and VCCV CC Type 4 packets described in Section 3 and
   Section 4.

7.  Security Considerations

   This document does not by itself raise any new security
   considerations beyond those described in [RFC5085].  It addresses the
   possibility of packet leaking that can occur with VCCV CC Type 3.

8.  IANA Considerations

8.1.  MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Type 4

   IANA is requested to assign a new bit from the MPLS VCCV Control
   Channel (CC) Types registry in the PWE3-parameters name space in
   order to identify VCCV type 4.  It is recommended that Bit 3 be
   assigned to this purpose which would have a value of 0x08.



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   MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Types

         Bit (Value)    Description   Reference
         ============   ===========   ==================
         Bit X (0x0Y)   Type 4        This Specification

8.2.  LDP Status Code

   IANA is requested to assign a new Status Code from the Label
   Distribution Protocol (LDP) Parameters name space:

   Status Code Name Space

         Range/Value  E  Description      Reference
         ===========  =  ===============  =========
         0x000000xx   0  VCCV Type Error  This Specification


9.  Acknowledgments

   The authors wish to thank Alexander (Sasha) Vainshtein for his review
   comments and for his proposal to make the GAL and Flow labels
   mutually exclusive.  This proposal let to a significant
   simplification of this design.

10.  References

10.1.  Normative References

   [RFC2119]  Bradner, S., "Key words for use in RFCs to Indicate
              Requirement Levels", BCP 14, RFC 2119, March 1997.

   [RFC4385]  Bryant, S., Swallow, G., Martini, L., and D. McPherson,
              "Pseudowire Emulation Edge-to-Edge (PWE3) Control Word for
              Use over an MPLS PSN", RFC 4385, February 2006.

   [RFC4447]  Martini, L., Rosen, E., El-Aawar, N., Smith, T., and G.
              Heron, "Pseudowire Setup and Maintenance Using the Label
              Distribution Protocol (LDP)", RFC 4447, April 2006.

   [RFC5085]  Nadeau, T. and C. Pignataro, "Pseudowire Virtual Circuit
              Connectivity Verification (VCCV): A Control Channel for
              Pseudowires", RFC 5085, December 2007.

   [RFC5586]  Bocci, M., Vigoureux, M., and S. Bryant, "MPLS Generic
              Associated Channel", RFC 5586, June 2009.





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   [RFC6073]  Martini, L., Metz, C., Nadeau, T., Bocci, M., and M.
              Aissaoui, "Segmented Pseudowire", RFC 6073, January 2011.

   [RFC6391]  Bryant, S., Filsfils, C., Drafz, U., Kompella, V., Regan,
              J., and S. Amante, "Flow-Aware Transport of Pseudowires
              over an MPLS Packet Switched Network", RFC 6391, November
              2011.

10.2.  Informative References

   [RFC5921]  Bocci, M., Bryant, S., Frost, D., Levrau, L., and L.
              Berger, "A Framework for MPLS in Transport Networks", RFC
              5921, July 2010.

Authors' Addresses

   Thomas D. Nadeau
   lucidvision

   Email: tnadeau@lucidvision.com


   Luca Martini
   Cisco Systems

   Email: lmartini@cisco.com


   Stewart Bryant
   Cisco Systems

   Email: stbryant@cisco.com



















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 --------------090409070406080705000500-- From nobody Wed Jan 14 12:34:31 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A78F1B2AA7 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 12:34:26 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nGGxVKnTfmqh for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 12:34:19 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qc0-x22c.google.com (mail-qc0-x22c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c01::22c]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8B8D61B2A71 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 12:34:06 -0800 (PST) Received: by mail-qc0-f172.google.com with SMTP id i8so529897qcq.3 for ; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 12:34:05 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=f8vV9JVhac3kuf1XOFg5l1toC4qLf/CGl4d/SoTObOw=; b=GGv1Eete6JXyrC1GePFDG6Uvw0zIBpYGnxtNpUQSNJf1Md58IrHG8+iwW3tbHlEEva cOQsEU5QG1f4CXuBL0VaNdZQcKOqES8Xr4Opv+IRGT1PruaQiGAuk3XCEmFuc6wygYik V5dbyFC0AjKtY7qJfiZl92AMKhixrEdxMSwNwEsmVSmlSFoe2dZesmpF3EToFYp6fz5I ltCgYaPX1nk9p7P0zvKJuJuWF9LnqXq9IDg113b+FE5sPfr5nkGhzhm4TKmS0vUQe6+R kic9vWI5o7TnlNM2xOI+WsgijZ/2sLJsTD2T8Eo+r3Iz1KZZACktypuIiqPB7jgc5j6k KYug== X-Received: by 10.140.101.105 with SMTP id t96mr9966845qge.9.1421267645672; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 12:34:05 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.140.101.106 with HTTP; Wed, 14 Jan 2015 12:33:45 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <54B68D13.9000707@cisco.com> References: <54B68D13.9000707@cisco.com> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2015 15:33:45 -0500 Message-ID: To: Stewart Bryant Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11c1678226b132050ca2a92a Archived-At: Cc: draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal@tools.ietf.org, "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Candidate draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01 X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 14 Jan 2015 20:34:26 -0000 --001a11c1678226b132050ca2a92a Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Stewart, Thanks, I just gave it a quick read-through and it looks (to me) like just what the WG has requested. I think the introductory text is at a good level to motivate the new VCCV type without getting into all of the details of migration. Cheers, Andy On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 10:36 AM, Stewart Bryant wrote: > Working Group/Co-authors > > Following discussion on the list I have edited draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal > to just define the GAL VCCV CC Type 4. As suggested the plan will then be > to write a new draft describing the migration strategy to type 1 and 4 > only. > There is some text in here on migration and I am torn between taking it out > and leaving it in to explain why we are introducing the new CC type. > > Because of the extensive changes I thought it best to post this candidate > to the list to make sure we are all on the same page. If this is going in > the right direction I will upload it as a draft replacing > draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00. > > I took Sasha's proposal of making FAT and GAL mutually exclusive which > in my view usefully simplified that aspect of the design. > > I did quite a lot of work on the Capability Advertisment section which > will need to be checked very carefully, in particular the handling of the > error processing. > > I would appreciate a quick review to see whether this is what the WG was > expecting, and then I can upload it ready for a detailed review if it > is on the right lines. > > - Stewart > > > > PWE3 T. Nadeau > Internet-Draft lucidvision > Intended status: Standards Track L. Martini > Expires: July 18, 2015 S. Bryant > Cisco Systems > January 14, 2015 > > > Candidate for Using GAL as a VCCV Channel Indicator > draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01 > > Abstract > > This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivity > Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type for use with > pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network. This new channel type > uses the Generic Associated Channel Label (GAL) (RFC5586) to > distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying user data. > > Status of This Memo > > This Internet-Draft is submitted in full conformance with the > provisions of BCP 78 and BCP 79. > > Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering > Task Force (IETF). Note that other groups may also distribute > working documents as Internet-Drafts. The list of current Internet- > Drafts is at http://datatracker.ietf.org/drafts/current/. > > Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum of six months > and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other documents at any > time. It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts as reference > material or to cite them other than as "work in progress." > > This Internet-Draft will expire on July 18, 2015. > > Copyright Notice > > Copyright (c) 2015 IETF Trust and the persons identified as the > document authors. All rights reserved. > > This document is subject to BCP 78 and the IETF Trust's Legal > Provisions Relating to IETF Documents > (http://trustee.ietf.org/license-info) in effect on the date of > publication of this document. Please review these documents > carefully, as they describe your rights and restrictions with respect > to this document. Code Components extracted from this document must > include Simplified BSD License text as described in Section 4.e of > > > > Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 1] > > Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 > > > the Trust Legal Provisions and are provided without warranty as > described in the Simplified BSD License. > > Table of Contents > > 1. Introduction . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 2 > 2. Requirements Language . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 > 3. GAL VCCV Control Channel Type . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 3 > 4. FAT PWs . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 > 5. VCCV Capability Advertisement . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4 > 6. Manageability Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 > 7. Security Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 > 8. IANA Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 5 > 8.1. MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Type 4 . . . . . . . . . . 5 > 8.2. LDP Status Code . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 > 9. Acknowledgments . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 > 10. References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 > 10.1. Normative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 6 > 10.2. Informative References . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 > Authors' Addresses . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 7 > > 1. Introduction > > This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivity > Verification (VCCV) [RFC5085] control channel (CC) type for use with > pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network that do not use the PW > Control Word (CW) [RFC4385]. This new VCCV CC type uses the Generic > Associated Channel Label (GAL) [RFC5586] to distinguish VCCV packets > from packets carrying user data. This new VCCV CC type introduces > compatibility with the method of MPLS Label Switched Path (LSP) > Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (OAM) identification, > particularly in MPLS-TP networks [RFC5921]. > > VCCV currently specifies three CC types. VCCV CC Type 1 uses the PW > Control Word (CW) to distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying > user data. VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 require IP encapsulation for OAM > packets they carry. This was not an issue when [RFC5085] was > designed, but is in conflict with the design goals of MPLS-TP > [RFC5921] which does not otherwise require the availability of IP. > VCCV CC Type 2 is not supported by multi-segment PWs (MS-PWs) > [RFC6073]. A MS-PW operating without the CW therefore has to use > VCCV CC Type 3 which identifies VCCV packets on the basis of TTL > expiry. Whilst less of an issue with a single segment PW (SS-PW), on > an MS-PW this need to be accurately set to cause TTL expiry at the > egress Terminating Provider Edge (T-PE) [RFC6073]. In the event of a > error in the setting of the PW LSE TTL this can result in VCCV > packets leaking into the attachment circuit which may disrupt the > operation of the PW, or the user service, and is a security risk. > > > > Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 2] > > Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 > > > The new VCCV CC type defined in this specification addresses these > problems for PWs that do not use the CW. > > For reasons of network efficiency and due to hardware constraints it > is not possible to address these issue by mandating that all PWs use > the PW CW, hence the introduction of this new VCCV CC type. > > 2. Requirements Language > > The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", "REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT", > "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMMENDED", "NOT RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and > "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpreted as described in > [RFC2119]. > > 3. GAL VCCV Control Channel Type > > When the PW CW is not used, the GAL VCCV Control Channel (CC) type > defined in this section MAY be used. This is referred to as VCCV CC > Type4 throughout the rest of this of this document. VCCV Type 4 uses > the encapsulation shown in Figure 1. > > 0 1 > 2 3 > 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 > > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > | PW LSE | > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > | GAL LSE | > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > |0 0 0 1|Version| Reserved | Channel Type | > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > | | > ~ VCCV Message Body ~ > | | > +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ > > Figure 1 > > The VCCV message body is preceded by a Generic Associated Channel > Header as defined in [RFC5586], in which the Channel Type identifies > the type and format of the OAM message carried in the VCCV message > body. > > The GAL LSE MUST contain the GAL reserved label as defined in > [RFC5586]. > > > > > > Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 3] > > Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 > > > The PW LSE is constructed according to the existing procedures that > apply to the type of pseudowire that is in use. > > Note that the inclusion of a GAL following the PW LSE over a label > switched path subject to Equal-Cost Multi-path (ECMP) load balancing > can cause the OAM packet to take a different path through the network > from the corresponding PW data packets. If that is not acceptable, > then an alternative VCCV type must be used. > > 4. FAT PWs > > [RFC6391] specifies that when the flow-aware transport (FAT) of > pseudowires over an MPLS packet switched network has been signalled > or configured, the Flow LSE MUST be present. It further specifies > that "the flow label MUST NOT be an MPLS reserved label (values in > the range 0..15) [RFC3032]", and that "If a flow LSE is present, it > MUST be checked to determine whether it carries a reserved label. If > it is a reserved label, the packet is processed according to the > rules associated with that reserved label; otherwise, the LSE is > discarded." > > This document specifies that if the flow-aware transport of > pseudowires over an MPLS packet switched network has been signalled > or configured then the presence of VCCV message is indicated by the > use of a GAL in place of the flow LSE. > > This is consistent with [RFC6391], and the packet structure is > identical to that shown in Figure 1. > > Note that the use of a GAL in place of the flow label over a label > switched path subject to ECMP can cause the OAM packet to take a > different path through the network from the corresponding PW data > packets. If that is not acceptable, then an alternative VCCV type > must be used. > > 5. VCCV Capability Advertisement > > The VCCV capability advertisement MUST match the c-bit setting that > is advertised in the PW FEC element [RFC4447]. If the c-bit is set, > indicating the use of the PW CW, then VCCV CC Type 4 MUST NOT be > advertised. If the c-bit is not set, indicating that the PW CW is > not in use, then an equipment supporting this specification MUST > advertise VCCV CC Type 4. Advertisement of VCCV CC Types 1 and 4 are > therefore mutually exclusive. > > A PE supporting VCCV CC Type 4 MAY advertise other VCCV CC types as > defined in [RFC5085] . > > > > > Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 4] > > Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 > > > If the remote PE supports VCCV CC Type 4, and the PW CW is not in > use, then the following capability advertisement precedence rules > supersede those defined in Section 7 of [RFC5085] : > > 1. Type 4: GAL VCCV Control Channel. > > 2. Type 2: MPLS Router Alert Label. > > 3. Type 3: MPLS PW Label with TTL == 1. > > If the remote PE finds that VCCV CC Types 1 and 4 are both > advertised, or that c-bit is set and VCCV CC Type 4 is advertised, > then it should report the error to the operator through the > management interface in use, and send a Label Release Message with a > status code "VCCV Type Error". > > 6. Manageability Considerations > > Whilst the introduction of this additional VCCV CC type increases the > number of VCCV CC types that the operator needs to manage, it > addresses the issues with VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 described in > Section 1, and is a necessary per-requisite of the long term strategy > of the PALS working group to consolidate the VCCV channel types down > to only VCCV CC Types 1 and 4. This consolidation and will be the > subject of future work by the PALS working group. > > In the event of a misconfiguration of this VCCV CC type, the PW is > taken out of service and the operator advised as described in > Section 5. > > Attention is drawn to the possible absence of fate sharing between PW > data packets and VCCV CC Type 4 packets described in Section 3 and > Section 4. > > 7. Security Considerations > > This document does not by itself raise any new security > considerations beyond those described in [RFC5085]. It addresses the > possibility of packet leaking that can occur with VCCV CC Type 3. > > 8. IANA Considerations > > 8.1. MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Type 4 > > IANA is requested to assign a new bit from the MPLS VCCV Control > Channel (CC) Types registry in the PWE3-parameters name space in > order to identify VCCV type 4. It is recommended that Bit 3 be > assigned to this purpose which would have a value of 0x08. > > > > Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 5] > > Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 > > > MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Types > > Bit (Value) Description Reference > ============ =========== ================== > Bit X (0x0Y) Type 4 This Specification > > 8.2. LDP Status Code > > IANA is requested to assign a new Status Code from the Label > Distribution Protocol (LDP) Parameters name space: > > Status Code Name Space > > Range/Value E Description Reference > =========== = =============== ========= > 0x000000xx 0 VCCV Type Error This Specification > > > 9. Acknowledgments > > The authors wish to thank Alexander (Sasha) Vainshtein for his review > comments and for his proposal to make the GAL and Flow labels > mutually exclusive. This proposal let to a significant > simplification of this design. > > 10. References > > 10.1. Normative References > > [RFC2119] Bradner, S., "Key words for use in RFCs to Indicate > Requirement Levels", BCP 14, RFC 2119, March 1997. > > [RFC4385] Bryant, S., Swallow, G., Martini, L., and D. McPherson, > "Pseudowire Emulation Edge-to-Edge (PWE3) Control Word for > Use over an MPLS PSN", RFC 4385, February 2006. > > [RFC4447] Martini, L., Rosen, E., El-Aawar, N., Smith, T., and G. > Heron, "Pseudowire Setup and Maintenance Using the Label > Distribution Protocol (LDP)", RFC 4447, April 2006. > > [RFC5085] Nadeau, T. and C. Pignataro, "Pseudowire Virtual Circuit > Connectivity Verification (VCCV): A Control Channel for > Pseudowires", RFC 5085, December 2007. > > [RFC5586] Bocci, M., Vigoureux, M., and S. Bryant, "MPLS Generic > Associated Channel", RFC 5586, June 2009. > > > > > > Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 6] > > Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 > > > [RFC6073] Martini, L., Metz, C., Nadeau, T., Bocci, M., and M. > Aissaoui, "Segmented Pseudowire", RFC 6073, January 2011. > > [RFC6391] Bryant, S., Filsfils, C., Drafz, U., Kompella, V., Regan, > J., and S. Amante, "Flow-Aware Transport of Pseudowires > over an MPLS Packet Switched Network", RFC 6391, November > 2011. > > 10.2. Informative References > > [RFC5921] Bocci, M., Bryant, S., Frost, D., Levrau, L., and L. > Berger, "A Framework for MPLS in Transport Networks", RFC > 5921, July 2010. > > Authors' Addresses > > Thomas D. Nadeau > lucidvision > > Email: tnadeau@lucidvision.com > > > Luca Martini > Cisco Systems > > Email: lmartini@cisco.com > > > Stewart Bryant > Cisco Systems > > Email: stbryant@cisco.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 7] > > > _______________________________________________ > Pals mailing list > Pals@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals > > --001a11c1678226b132050ca2a92a Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Stewart,

Thanks, I just gave it a quick= read-through and it looks (to me) like just what the WG has requested. I t= hink the introductory text is at a good level to motivate the new VCCV type= without getting into all of the details of migration.

=
Cheers,
Andy


On Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 10:36 AM, Stew= art Bryant <stbryant@cisco.com> wrote:
=20 =20 =20
Working Group/Co-authors

Following discussion on the list I have edited draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal
to just define the GAL VCCV CC Type 4. As suggested the plan will then be
to write a new draft describing the migration strategy to type 1 and 4 only.
There is some text in here on migration and I am torn between taking it out
and leaving it in to explain why we are introducing the new CC type.

Because of the extensive changes I thought it best to post this candidate
to the list to make sure we are all on the same page. If this is going in
the right direction I will upload it as a draft replacing
draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00.

I took Sasha's proposal of making FAT and GAL mutually exclusive which
in my view usefully simplified that aspect of the design.

I did quite a lot of work on the Capability Advertisment section which
will need to be checked very carefully, in particular the handling of the
error processing.

I would appreciate a quick review to see whether this is what the WG was
expecting, and then I can upload it ready for a detailed review if it
is on the right lines.

- Stewart



PWE3=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 T. Nadeau
Internet-Draft=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 lucidvision
Intended status: Standards Track=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 L. Martini
Expires: July 18, 2015=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 S. Bryant
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Cisco Systems
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 January 14, 2015


=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Candidate for = Using GAL as a VCCV Channel Indicator
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-= 01

Abstract

=C2=A0=C2=A0 This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivi= ty
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type for u= se with
=C2=A0=C2=A0 pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network.=C2=A0 Thi= s new channel type
=C2=A0=C2=A0 uses the Generic Associated Channel Label (GAL) (RFC5586= ) to
=C2=A0=C2=A0 distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying user data= .

Status of This Memo

=C2=A0=C2=A0 This Internet-Draft is submitted in full conformance wit= h the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 provisions of BCP 78 and BCP 79.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Internet-Drafts are working documents of the Internet Engineering
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Task Force (IETF).=C2=A0 Note that other groups may also= distribute
=C2=A0=C2=A0 working documents as Internet-Drafts.=C2=A0 The list of = current Internet-
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Drafts is at http://datatracker.ietf.org/drafts/current/<= /a>.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Internet-Drafts are draft documents valid for a maximum = of six months
=C2=A0=C2=A0 and may be updated, replaced, or obsoleted by other docu= ments at any
=C2=A0=C2=A0 time.=C2=A0 It is inappropriate to use Internet-Drafts a= s reference
=C2=A0=C2=A0 material or to cite them other than as "work in pro= gress."

=C2=A0=C2=A0 This Internet-Draft will expire on July 18, 2015.

Copyright Notice

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Copyright (c) 2015 IETF Trust and the persons identified= as the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 document authors.=C2=A0 All rights reserved.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 This document is subject to BCP 78 and the IETF Trust= 9;s Legal
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Provisions Relating to IETF Documents
=C2=A0=C2=A0 (http://trustee.ietf.org/license-info) in effect on the date= of
=C2=A0=C2=A0 publication of this document.=C2=A0 Please review these = documents
=C2=A0=C2=A0 carefully, as they describe your rights and restrictions= with respect
=C2=A0=C2=A0 to this document.=C2=A0 Code Components extracted from t= his document must
=C2=A0=C2=A0 include Simplified BSD License text as described in Sect= ion 4.e of



Nadeau, et al.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Expires July 18, 2015=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [Page 1]
=0C
Internet-Draft=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 GAL as a VCCV Channel=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 January 2015


=C2=A0=C2=A0 the Trust Legal Provisions and are provided without warr= anty as
=C2=A0=C2=A0 described in the Simplified BSD License.

Table of Contents

=C2=A0=C2=A0 1.=C2=A0 Introduction=C2=A0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . = . . . . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 2
=C2=A0=C2=A0 2.=C2=A0 Requirements Language . . . . . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 3
=C2=A0=C2=A0 3.=C2=A0 GAL VCCV Control Channel Type . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 3
=C2=A0=C2=A0 4.=C2=A0 FAT PWs . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 4
=C2=A0=C2=A0 5.=C2=A0 VCCV Capability Advertisement . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 4
=C2=A0=C2=A0 6.=C2=A0 Manageability Considerations=C2=A0 . . . . . . = . . . . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 5
=C2=A0=C2=A0 7.=C2=A0 Security Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 5
=C2=A0=C2=A0 8.=C2=A0 IANA Considerations . . . . . . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 5
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 8.1.=C2=A0 MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Ty= pe 4 . . . . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 5
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 8.2.=C2=A0 LDP Status Code . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 6
=C2=A0=C2=A0 9.=C2=A0 Acknowledgments . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 6
=C2=A0=C2=A0 10. References=C2=A0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 6
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 10.1.=C2=A0 Normative References . . . . . .= . . . . . . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 6
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 10.2.=C2=A0 Informative References . . . . .= . . . . . . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 7
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Authors' Addresses=C2=A0 . . . . . . . . . . . . . .= . . . . . . . . .=C2=A0=C2=A0 7

1.=C2=A0 Introduction

=C2=A0=C2=A0 This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivi= ty
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Verification (VCCV) [RFC5085] control channel (CC) type = for use with
=C2=A0=C2=A0 pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network that do no= t use the PW
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Control Word (CW) [RFC4385].=C2=A0 This new VCCV CC type= uses the Generic
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Associated Channel Label (GAL) [RFC5586] to distinguish = VCCV packets
=C2=A0=C2=A0 from packets carrying user data.=C2=A0 This new VCCV CC = type introduces
=C2=A0=C2=A0 compatibility with the method of MPLS Label Switched Pat= h (LSP)
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Operations, Administration, and Maintenance (OAM) identification,
=C2=A0=C2=A0 particularly in MPLS-TP networks [RFC5921].

=C2=A0=C2=A0 VCCV currently specifies three CC types.=C2=A0 VCCV CC T= ype 1 uses the PW
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Control Word (CW) to distinguish VCCV packets from packe= ts carrying
=C2=A0=C2=A0 user data.=C2=A0 VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 require IP encaps= ulation for OAM
=C2=A0=C2=A0 packets they carry.=C2=A0 This was not an issue when [RF= C5085] was
=C2=A0=C2=A0 designed, but is in conflict with the design goals of MP= LS-TP
=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC5921] which does not otherwise require the availabil= ity of IP.
=C2=A0=C2=A0 VCCV CC Type 2 is not supported by multi-segment PWs (MS= -PWs)
=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC6073].=C2=A0 A MS-PW operating without the CW theref= ore has to use
=C2=A0=C2=A0 VCCV CC Type 3 which identifies VCCV packets on the basi= s of TTL
=C2=A0=C2=A0 expiry.=C2=A0 Whilst less of an issue with a single segm= ent PW (SS-PW), on
=C2=A0=C2=A0 an MS-PW this need to be accurately set to cause TTL exp= iry at the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 egress Terminating Provider Edge (T-PE) [RFC6073].=C2=A0= In the event of a
=C2=A0=C2=A0 error in the setting of the PW LSE TTL this can result i= n VCCV
=C2=A0=C2=A0 packets leaking into the attachment circuit which may di= srupt the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 operation of the PW, or the user service, and is a secur= ity risk.



Nadeau, et al.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Expires July 18, 2015=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [Page 2]
=0C
Internet-Draft=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 GAL as a VCCV Channel=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 January 2015


=C2=A0=C2=A0 The new VCCV CC type defined in this specification addre= sses these
=C2=A0=C2=A0 problems for PWs that do not use the CW.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 For reasons of network efficiency and due to hardware constraints it
=C2=A0=C2=A0 is not possible to address these issue by mandating that= all PWs use
=C2=A0=C2=A0 the PW CW, hence the introduction of this new VCCV CC ty= pe.

2.=C2=A0 Requirements Language

=C2=A0=C2=A0 The key words "MUST", "MUST NOT", &q= uot;REQUIRED", "SHALL", "SHALL NOT",
=C2=A0=C2=A0 "SHOULD", "SHOULD NOT", "RECOMM= ENDED", "NOT RECOMMENDED", "MAY", and
=C2=A0=C2=A0 "OPTIONAL" in this document are to be interpre= ted as described in
=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC2119].

3.=C2=A0 GAL VCCV Control Channel Type

=C2=A0=C2=A0 When the PW CW is not used, the GAL VCCV Control Channel= (CC) type
=C2=A0=C2=A0 defined in this section MAY be used.=C2=A0 This is refer= red to as VCCV CC
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Type4 throughout the rest of this of this document.=C2= =A0 VCCV Type 4 uses
=C2=A0=C2=A0 the encapsulation shown in Figure 1.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0 3
=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 = 8 9 0 1

=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 PW LSE=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |
=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 GAL LSE=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |
=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
=C2=A0=C2=A0 |0 0 0 1|Version|=C2=A0=C2=A0 Reserved=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Channel Type=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |
=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |
=C2=A0=C2=A0 ~=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 VCCV Message Body=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0 ~
=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |
=C2=A0=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Figure 1

=C2=A0=C2=A0 The VCCV message body is preceded by a Generic Associate= d Channel
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Header as defined in [RFC5586], in which the Channel Typ= e identifies
=C2=A0=C2=A0 the type and format of the OAM message carried in the VC= CV message
=C2=A0=C2=A0 body.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 The GAL LSE MUST contain the GAL reserved label as defin= ed in
=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC5586].





Nadeau, et al.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Expires July 18, 2015=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [Page 3]
=0C
Internet-Draft=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 GAL as a VCCV Channel=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 January 2015


=C2=A0=C2=A0 The PW LSE is constructed according to the existing proc= edures that
=C2=A0=C2=A0 apply to the type of pseudowire that is in use.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Note that the inclusion of a GAL following the PW LSE ov= er a label
=C2=A0=C2=A0 switched path subject to Equal-Cost Multi-path (ECMP) lo= ad balancing
=C2=A0=C2=A0 can cause the OAM packet to take a different path throug= h the network
=C2=A0=C2=A0 from the corresponding PW data packets.=C2=A0 If that is= not acceptable,
=C2=A0=C2=A0 then an alternative VCCV type must be used.

4.=C2=A0 FAT PWs

=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC6391] specifies that when the flow-aware transport (= FAT) of
=C2=A0=C2=A0 pseudowires over an MPLS packet switched network has bee= n signalled
=C2=A0=C2=A0 or configured, the Flow LSE MUST be present.=C2=A0 It fu= rther specifies
=C2=A0=C2=A0 that "the flow label MUST NOT be an MPLS reserved l= abel (values in
=C2=A0=C2=A0 the range 0..15) [RFC3032]", and that "If a fl= ow LSE is present, it
=C2=A0=C2=A0 MUST be checked to determine whether it carries a reserv= ed label.=C2=A0 If
=C2=A0=C2=A0 it is a reserved label, the packet is processed accordin= g to the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 rules associated with that reserved label; otherwise, th= e LSE is
=C2=A0=C2=A0 discarded."

=C2=A0=C2=A0 This document specifies that if the flow-aware transport= of
=C2=A0=C2=A0 pseudowires over an MPLS packet switched network has bee= n signalled
=C2=A0=C2=A0 or configured then the presence of VCCV message is indic= ated by the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 use of a GAL in place of the flow LSE.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 This is consistent with [RFC6391], and the packet struct= ure is
=C2=A0=C2=A0 identical to that shown in Figure 1.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Note that the use of a GAL in place of the flow label ov= er a label
=C2=A0=C2=A0 switched path subject to ECMP can cause the OAM packet t= o take a
=C2=A0=C2=A0 different path through the network from the correspondin= g PW data
=C2=A0=C2=A0 packets.=C2=A0 If that is not acceptable, then an altern= ative VCCV type
=C2=A0=C2=A0 must be used.

5.=C2=A0 VCCV Capability Advertisement

=C2=A0=C2=A0 The VCCV capability advertisement MUST match the c-bit s= etting that
=C2=A0=C2=A0 is advertised in the PW FEC element [RFC4447].=C2=A0 If = the c-bit is set,
=C2=A0=C2=A0 indicating the use of the PW CW, then VCCV CC Type 4 MUS= T NOT be
=C2=A0=C2=A0 advertised.=C2=A0 If the c-bit is not set, indicating th= at the PW CW is
=C2=A0=C2=A0 not in use, then an equipment supporting this specificat= ion MUST
=C2=A0=C2=A0 advertise VCCV CC Type 4.=C2=A0 Advertisement of VCCV CC= Types 1 and 4 are
=C2=A0=C2=A0 therefore mutually exclusive.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 A PE supporting VCCV CC Type 4 MAY advertise other VCCV = CC types as
=C2=A0=C2=A0 defined in [RFC5085] .




Nadeau, et al.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Expires July 18, 2015=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [Page 4]
=0C
Internet-Draft=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 GAL as a VCCV Channel=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 January 2015


=C2=A0=C2=A0 If the remote PE supports VCCV CC Type 4, and the PW CW = is not in
=C2=A0=C2=A0 use, then the following capability advertisement precede= nce rules
=C2=A0=C2=A0 supersede those defined in Section 7 of [RFC5085] :

=C2=A0=C2=A0 1.=C2=A0 Type 4: GAL VCCV Control Channel.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 2.=C2=A0 Type 2: MPLS Router Alert Label.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 3.=C2=A0 Type 3: MPLS PW Label with TTL =3D=3D 1.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 If the remote PE finds that VCCV CC Types 1 and 4 are bo= th
=C2=A0=C2=A0 advertised, or that c-bit is set and VCCV CC Type 4 is advertised,
=C2=A0=C2=A0 then it should report the error to the operator through = the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 management interface in use, and send a Label Release Me= ssage with a
=C2=A0=C2=A0 status code "VCCV Type Error".

6.=C2=A0 Manageability Considerations

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Whilst the introduction of this additional VCCV CC type increases the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 number of VCCV CC types that the operator needs to manag= e, it
=C2=A0=C2=A0 addresses the issues with VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 describe= d in
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Section 1, and is a necessary per-requisite of the long = term strategy
=C2=A0=C2=A0 of the PALS working group to consolidate the VCCV channe= l types down
=C2=A0=C2=A0 to only VCCV CC Types 1 and 4.=C2=A0 This consolidation = and will be the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 subject of future work by the PALS working group.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 In the event of a misconfiguration of this VCCV CC type,= the PW is
=C2=A0=C2=A0 taken out of service and the operator advised as describ= ed in
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Section 5.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Attention is drawn to the possible absence of fate shari= ng between PW
=C2=A0=C2=A0 data packets and VCCV CC Type 4 packets described in Sec= tion 3 and
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Section 4.

7.=C2=A0 Security Considerations

=C2=A0=C2=A0 This document does not by itself raise any new security<= br> =C2=A0=C2=A0 considerations beyond those described in [RFC5085].=C2= =A0 It addresses the
=C2=A0=C2=A0 possibility of packet leaking that can occur with VCCV C= C Type 3.

8.=C2=A0 IANA Considerations

8.1.=C2=A0 MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Type 4

=C2=A0=C2=A0 IANA is requested to assign a new bit from the MPLS VCCV Control
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Channel (CC) Types registry in the PWE3-parameters name = space in
=C2=A0=C2=A0 order to identify VCCV type 4.=C2=A0 It is recommended t= hat Bit 3 be
=C2=A0=C2=A0 assigned to this purpose which would have a value of 0x0= 8.



Nadeau, et al.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Expires July 18, 2015=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [Page 5]
=0C
Internet-Draft=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 GAL as a VCCV Channel=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 January 2015


=C2=A0=C2=A0 MPLS VCCV Control Channel (CC) Types

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Bit (Value)=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Description=C2=A0=C2=A0 Reference
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=C2=A0=C2=A0 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=C2=A0=C2= =A0 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Bit X (0x0Y)=C2=A0= =C2=A0 Type 4=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 This Specification<= br>
8.2.=C2=A0 LDP Status Code

=C2=A0=C2=A0 IANA is requested to assign a new Status Code from the L= abel
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Distribution Protocol (LDP) Parameters name space:

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Status Code Name Space

=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Range/Value=C2=A0 E= =C2=A0 Description=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Reference
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=C2=A0 =3D=C2=A0 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=C2=A0 =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 0x000000xx=C2=A0=C2= =A0 0=C2=A0 VCCV Type Error=C2=A0 This Specification


9.=C2=A0 Acknowledgments

=C2=A0=C2=A0 The authors wish to thank Alexander (Sasha) Vainshtein f= or his review
=C2=A0=C2=A0 comments and for his proposal to make the GAL and Flow l= abels
=C2=A0=C2=A0 mutually exclusive.=C2=A0 This proposal let to a signifi= cant
=C2=A0=C2=A0 simplification of this design.

10.=C2=A0 References

10.1.=C2=A0 Normative References

=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC2119]=C2=A0 Bradner, S., "Key words for use in = RFCs to Indicate
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Requirement Levels", BCP 14, RFC 2119, March 1997.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC4385]=C2=A0 Bryant, S., Swallow, G., Martini, L., an= d D. McPherson,
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 "Pseudowire Emulation Edge-to-Edge (PWE3) Control Word for
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Use over an MPLS PSN", RFC 4385, February 2006.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC4447]=C2=A0 Martini, L., Rosen, E., El-Aawar, N., Sm= ith, T., and G.
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Heron, "Pseudowire Setup and Maintenance Using the Label
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Distribution Protocol (LDP)", RFC 4447, April 2006.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC5085]=C2=A0 Nadeau, T. and C. Pignataro, "Pseud= owire Virtual Circuit
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Connectivity Verification (VCCV): A Control Channel for
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Pseudowires", RFC 5085, December 2007.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC5586]=C2=A0 Bocci, M., Vigoureux, M., and S. Bryant,= "MPLS Generic
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Associated Channel", RFC 5586, June 2009.





Nadeau, et al.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Expires July 18, 2015=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [Page 6]
=0C
Internet-Draft=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 GAL as a VCCV Channel=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 January 2015


=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC6073]=C2=A0 Martini, L., Metz, C., Nadeau, T., Bocci= , M., and M.
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Aissaoui, "Segmented Pseudowire", RFC 6073, January 2011.

=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC6391]=C2=A0 Bryant, S., Filsfils, C., Drafz, U., Kom= pella, V., Regan,
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 J., and S. Amante, "Flow-Aware Transport of Pseudowires
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 over an MPLS Packet Switched Network", RFC 6391, November
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 2011.

10.2.=C2=A0 Informative References

=C2=A0=C2=A0 [RFC5921]=C2=A0 Bocci, M., Bryant, S., Frost, D., Levrau= , L., and L.
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 Berger, "A Framework for MPLS in Transport Networks", RFC
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0 5921, July 2010.

Authors' Addresses

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Thomas D. Nadeau
=C2=A0=C2=A0 lucidvision

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Email: tnadeau@lucidvision.com


=C2=A0=C2=A0 Luca Martini
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Cisco Systems

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Email: lmartini@cisco.com


=C2=A0=C2=A0 Stewart Bryant
=C2=A0=C2=A0 Cisco Systems

=C2=A0=C2=A0 Email: stbryant@cisco.com



















Nadeau, et al.=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0= =C2=A0=C2=A0 Expires July 18, 2015=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2= =A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 [Page 7]

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by aer-core-2.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t0FDuvOU022309; Thu, 15 Jan 2015 13:56:58 GMT Message-ID: <54B7C72D.6020806@cisco.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2015 13:57:01 +0000 From: Stewart Bryant User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.10; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Alexander Vainshtein References: <54B68D13.9000707@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------090009010900040001060102" Archived-At: Cc: "draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Candidate draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01 X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: stbryant@cisco.com List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2015 13:57:04 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------090009010900040001060102 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Than you for looking at this Sasha I forgot one thing that you picked up on - MS-PW I have added a new section 5 When using VCCV CC Type 4 for MS-PWs, a PE transmitting the VCCV packet to a Switching PE (S-PE) MUST set the TTL to the appropriate value to expire at that S-PE. An S-PE that supports this specification MUST inspect packets PW packet that are received as a result of TTL expiry, determine whether a GAL follows the PW LSE. If a GAL is present the S-PE then processes the VCCV packet. An S-PE that does not support this specification would be expected to reject as malformed a VCCV CC Type 4 packet that was received. This is because the S-PE would expect the PW LSE to be bottom of stack (the non FAT case) and for the LSE at bottom of stack not to be a reserved label (both the FAT and the non-FAT cases). An S-PE that did not make this reserved label check would then find that the first nibble following the label stack was 0x1 and not the expected start of an IP packet. It would hence be expected to also reject the packet. This update to the behaviour of S-PEs is therefore backwards compatible. On 15/01/2015 10:03, Alexander Vainshtein wrote: > > Stewart, > > Lots of thanks for a very nice re-write of the draft that, from my > POV, resolves all outstanding technical issues raised so far and moved > discussion of operational issues ( consolidation of VCCV Types, > migration strategy etc.) out of scope of a clear-cut technical > specification. > > I have added a couple of minor comments */inline below/ *that > hopefully could be useful. Please feel free to use (or not to use) > them as you see fit. > > Regards, > > Sasha > > Email: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com > > Mobile: 054-9266302 > > > > VCCV currently specifies three CC types. VCCV CC Type 1 uses the PW > Control Word (CW) to distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying > user data. VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 require IP encapsulation for OAM > packets they carry. This was not an issue when [RFC5085] was > designed, but is in conflict with the design goals of MPLS-TP > [RFC5921] which does not otherwise require the availability of IP. > VCCV CC Type 2 is not supported by*/[[Sasha]] not applicable to? /* > yes - done > > multi-segment PWs (MS-PWs) > [RFC6073]. A MS-PW operating without the CW therefore has to use > VCCV CC Type 3 which identifies VCCV packets on the basis of TTL > expiry. Whilst less of an issue with a single segment PW (SS-PW), on > an MS-PW this need to be accurately set to cause TTL expiry at the > egress Terminating Provider Edge (T-PE) [RFC6073]. In the event of a > error in the setting of the PW LSE TTL this can result in VCCV > packets leaking into the attachment circuit which may disrupt the > operation of the PW, or the user service, and is a security risk. > > */[[Sasha]] Maybe you could add that VCCV Type 3 remains mandatory for > segment OAM of MS-PWs and that it is combined with VCCV Type 1 for > MS-PWs that use the CW – this is explicitly stated in RFC 6073./* > > I have added Note that VCCV CC Type 3 remains mandatory for multi-segment PW (MS-PW) OAM and it is currently combined with VCCV CC Type 1 for MS-PWs that use the CW [RFC6073]. This specification enables the combination of VCCV CC Type 3 with VCCV Type 4 for PWs that do not support the CW Section5] > Nadeau, et al. Expires July 18, 2015 [Page 2] > > Internet-Draft GAL as a VCCV Channel January 2015 > > > The new VCCV CC type defined in this specification addresses these > problems for PWs that do not use the CW. > > For reasons of network efficiency and due to hardware constraints it > is not possible to address these issue by mandating that all PWs use > the PW CW, hence the introduction of this new VCCV CC type. > > */[[Sasha]] Maybe you could add that PWs without the CW are already > widely deployed, and this is one of the reasons why mandating all PWs > use the CW is not realistic./* > > It now says: For reasons of network efficiency and due to hardware constraints it is not possible to address these issue by mandating that all PWs use the PW CW, hence the introduction of this new VCCV CC type. PWs without the CW are widely deployed, and hence mandating that all PWs use the CW is not a viable way to address this issue. > > > Note that the inclusion of a GAL following the PW LSE over a label > switched path subject to Equal-Cost Multi-path (ECMP) load balancing > can cause the OAM packet to take a different path through the network > from the corresponding PW data packets. If that is not acceptable, > then an alternative VCCV type must be used.*/[[Sasha]] Is this not > a MUST? /* > yes - and it's twin later > > > 6. Manageability Considerations > > Whilst the introduction of this additional VCCV CC type increases the > number of VCCV CC types that the operator needs to manage, it > addresses the issues with VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 described in > Section 1, and is a necessary per-requisite */[[Sasha]] > pre-requisite?/* > yes > > of the long term strategy > of the PALS working group to consolidate the VCCV channel types down > to only VCCV CC Types 1 and 4. This consolidation and*/[[Sasha]]? > Migration strategy? Something seems to be missing here. /* will be the > subject of future work by the PALS working group. > > */[[Sasha]] I am not sure that discussion of the PALS WG long-term > strategy in a standards track document is appropriate. The rationale > for introducing VCCV Type 4 is quite clear since it resolves specific > issues with VCCV Type 2 and VCCV Type 3./* > /*I have got rid of the long term strategy text. We can put it back if anyone objects during later stage review. */ > > *//* > > */Maybe it is worth mentioning that, just as VCCV Type 1, VCCV Type 4 > can be combined with VCCV Type 3 for segment OAM of MS-PWs./* > /*Already done.*/ > > *//* > I will leave it out there for another day to see if there are any more comments before I upload it. - Stewart --------------090009010900040001060102 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Than you for looking at this Sasha

I forgot one thing that you picked up on - MS-PW

I have added a new section 5

When using VCCV CC Type 4 for MS-PWs, a PE transmitting the
VCCV packet to a Switching PE (S-PE) MUST set the TTL to
the appropriate value to expire at that S-PE. An S-PE that
supports this specification MUST inspect packets PW packet
that are received as a result of TTL expiry, determine
whether a GAL follows the PW LSE. If a GAL is present
the S-PE then processes the VCCV packet.

An S-PE that does not support this specification would
be expected to reject as malformed a VCCV CC Type 4
packet that was received. This is because the S-PE
would expect the PW LSE to be bottom of stack (the
non FAT case) and for the LSE at bottom of stack not
to be a reserved label (both the FAT and the non-FAT
cases). An S-PE that did not make this reserved label
check would then find that the first nibble following
the label stack was 0x1 and not the expected start
of an IP packet. It would hence be expected to also
reject the packet. This update to the behaviour of
S-PEs is therefore backwards compatible.


On 15/01/2015 10:03, Alexander Vainshtein wrote:

Stewart,

Lots of thanks for a very nice re-write of the draft that, from my POV, resolves all outstanding technical issues raised so far and moved discussion of operational issues ( consolidation of VCCV Types, migration strategy etc.)  out of scope of a clear-cut technical specification.

 

I have added a couple of minor comments inline below that hopefully could be useful. Please feel free to use (or not to use) them as you see fit.

 

Regards,

       Sasha

Email: Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com

Mobile: 054-9266302

 



   VCCV currently specifies three CC types.  VCCV CC Type 1 uses the PW
   Control Word (CW) to distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying
   user data. VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 require IP encapsulation for OAM
   packets they carry.  This was not an issue when [RFC5085] was
   designed, but is in conflict with the design goals of MPLS-TP
   [RFC5921] which does not otherwise require the availability of IP.
   VCCV CC Type 2 is not supported by[[Sasha]] not applicable to?  

yes - done

multi-segment PWs (MS-PWs)
   [RFC6073].  A MS-PW operating without the CW therefore has to use
   VCCV CC Type 3 which identifies VCCV packets on the basis of TTL
   expiry.  Whilst less of an issue with a single segment PW (SS-PW), on
   an MS-PW this need to be accurately set to cause TTL expiry at the
   egress Terminating Provider Edge (T-PE) [RFC6073].  In the event of a
   error in the setting of the PW LSE TTL this can result in VCCV
   packets leaking into the attachment circuit which may disrupt the
   operation of the PW, or the user service, and is a security risk.

[[Sasha]] Maybe you could add that VCCV Type 3 remains mandatory for segment OAM of MS-PWs and that it is  combined with VCCV Type 1 for MS-PWs that use the CW – this is explicitly stated in RFC 6073.


I have added

Note that VCCV CC Type 3 remains mandatory for multi-segment PW (MS-PW)
OAM  and it is currently combined with VCCV CC Type 1 for MS-PWs that
use the CW [RFC6073]. This specification enables the combination of
VCCV CC Type 3 with VCCV Type 4 for PWs that do not support the CW
Section5]


Nadeau, et al.            Expires July 18, 2015                 [Page 2]

Internet-Draft            GAL as a VCCV Channel             January 2015


   The new VCCV CC type defined in this specification addresses these
   problems for PWs that do not use the CW.

   For reasons of network efficiency and due to hardware constraints it
   is not possible to address these issue by mandating that all PWs use
   the PW CW, hence the introduction of this new VCCV CC type.

[[Sasha]] Maybe you could add that PWs without the CW are already widely deployed, and this is one of the reasons why mandating all PWs use the CW is not realistic.


It now says:

For reasons of network efficiency and due to hardware constraints it is not
possible to address these issue by mandating that all PWs use the PW CW,
hence the introduction of this new VCCV CC type. PWs without the CW are
widely deployed, and hence mandating that all PWs use the CW is not a
viable way to address this issue.


   Note that the inclusion of a GAL following the PW LSE over a label
   switched path subject to Equal-Cost Multi-path (ECMP) load balancing
   can cause the OAM packet to take a different path through the network
   from the corresponding PW data packets.  If that is not acceptable,
   then an alternative VCCV type must be used.[[Sasha]] Is this not a MUST? 

yes - and it's twin later


6.  Manageability Considerations

   Whilst the introduction of this additional VCCV CC type increases the
   number of VCCV CC types that the operator needs to manage, it
   addresses the issues with VCCV CC Types 2 and 3 described in
   Section 1, and is a necessary per-requisite [[Sasha]] pre-requisite?

yes

of the long term strategy
   of the PALS working group to consolidate the VCCV channel types down
   to only VCCV CC Types 1 and 4.  This consolidation and[[Sasha]]? Migration strategy? Something seems to be missing here.   will be the
   subject of future work by the PALS working group.

[[Sasha]] I am not sure that discussion of the PALS WG long-term strategy in a  standards track document is appropriate. The rationale for introducing VCCV Type 4 is quite clear since it resolves specific issues with VCCV Type 2 and VCCV Type 3.

I have got rid of the long term strategy text. We can put it back if anyone objects
during later stage review.

Maybe it is worth mentioning that, just as VCCV Type 1, VCCV Type 4 can be combined with VCCV Type 3 for segment OAM of MS-PWs.

Already done.

I will leave it out there for another day to see if there are any more comments before I upload it.

- Stewart
--------------090009010900040001060102-- From nobody Thu Jan 15 07:35:47 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 51B481B2C62 for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2015 07:35:45 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.901 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.901 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y5HRVx2ggNpc for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2015 07:35:41 -0800 (PST) Received: from emea01-am1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-am1on0747.outbound.protection.outlook.com [IPv6:2a01:111:f400:fe00::747]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DA3861B2C5E for ; Thu, 15 Jan 2015 07:35:40 -0800 (PST) Received: from DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.161.55.144) by DB3PR03MB0811.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com (25.161.55.143) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.1.53.17; Thu, 15 Jan 2015 15:12:05 +0000 Received: from DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([25.161.55.144]) by DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com ([25.161.55.144]) with mapi id 15.01.0053.000; Thu, 15 Jan 2015 15:12:05 +0000 From: Alexander Vainshtein To: "stbryant@cisco.com" Thread-Topic: [Pals] Candidate draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01 Thread-Index: AQHQMA/5i86hJmZ/40iD4uDijbPVfJzA7i+QgABH9oCAABQU8A== Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2015 15:12:04 +0000 Message-ID: References: <54B68D13.9000707@cisco.com> <54B7C72D.6020806@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: <54B7C72D.6020806@cisco.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [147.234.56.21] authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=Alexander.Vainshtein@ecitele.com; x-dmarcaction-test: None x-microsoft-antispam: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:(3005004);SRVR:DB3PR03MB0811; x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:; x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0;PCL:0;RULEID:;SRVR:DB3PR03MB0811; x-forefront-prvs: 0457F11EAF x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10019020)(52044002)(252514010)(479174004)(24454002)(377454003)(199003)(189002)(2950100001)(2900100001)(19300405004)(62966003)(2501002)(106116001)(40100003)(19625215002)(101416001)(46102003)(33656002)(122556002)(54206007)(74316001)(106356001)(105586002)(76176999)(54606007)(50986999)(77156002)(2656002)(54356999)(66066001)(87936001)(102836002)(76576001)(19580405001)(19580395003)(15975445007)(110136001)(64706001)(92566002)(230783001)(86362001)(2351001)(97736003)(68736005)(16236675004); DIR:OUT; SFP:1102; SCL:1; SRVR:DB3PR03MB0811; H:DB3PR03MB0812.eurprd03.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; MLV:sfv; PTR:InfoNoRecords; A:1; MX:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: ecitele.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="_000_DB3PR03MB08127A5761DA74CE1544D6F09D4E0DB3PR03MB0812eurp_" MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: ecitele.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 15 Jan 2015 15:12:04.9770 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 2c514a61-08de-4519-b4c0-921fef62c42a X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: DB3PR03MB0811 Archived-At: Cc: "draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal@tools.ietf.org" , "pals@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [Pals] Candidate draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01 X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." 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2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 49CDF1ACEE4 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 12:00:38 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.999 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.999 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JH41Qcb5IhhP for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 12:00:35 -0800 (PST) Received: from mail-qa0-x22e.google.com (mail-qa0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400d:c00::22e]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 480BF1B2B53 for ; Fri, 16 Jan 2015 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<20150114224325.1801F1832B8@rfc-editor.org> From: "Andrew G. Malis" Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 15:00:02 -0500 Message-ID: To: "pals@ietf.org" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e01495028404d55050cca6c55 Archived-At: Subject: [Pals] Fwd: RFC 7436 on IP-Only LAN Service (IPLS) X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2015 20:00:38 -0000 --089e01495028404d55050cca6c55 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 I would like to congratulate Himanshu and co-authors on this RFC, it's been a long time in the making! Cheers, Andy ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: Date: Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 5:43 PM Subject: RFC 7436 on IP-Only LAN Service (IPLS) To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org, drafts-update-ref@iana.org, rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org A new Request for Comments is now available in online RFC libraries. RFC 7436 Title: IP-Only LAN Service (IPLS) Author: H. Shah, E. Rosen, F. Le Faucheur, G. Heron Status: Historic Stream: IETF Date: January 2015 Mailbox: hshah@ciena.com, erosen@juniper.net, flefauch@cisco.com, giheron@cisco.com Pages: 32 Characters: 74340 Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso: None I-D Tag: draft-ietf-l2vpn-ipls-16.txt URL: https://www.rfc-editor.org/info/rfc7436 A Virtual Private LAN Service (VPLS) is used to interconnect systems across a wide-area or metropolitan-area network, making it appear that they are on a private LAN. The systems that are interconnected may themselves be LAN switches. If, however, they are IP hosts or IP routers, certain simplifications to the operation of the VPLS are possible. We call this simplified type of VPLS an "IP-only LAN Service" (IPLS). In an IPLS, as in a VPLS, LAN interfaces are run in promiscuous mode, and frames are forwarded based on their destination Media Access Control (MAC) addresses. However, the maintenance of the MAC forwarding tables is done via signaling, rather than via the MAC address learning procedures specified in the IEEE's "Media Access Control (MAC) Bridges". This document specifies the protocol extensions and procedures for support of the IPLS service. The original intent was to provide an alternate solution to VPLS for those Provider Edge (PE) routers that were not capable of learning MAC addresses through data plane. This became a non-issue with newer hardware. The concepts put forth by this document are still valuable and are adopted in one form or other by newer work such as Ethernet VPN in L2VPN working group and possible data center applications. At this point, no further action is planned to update this document and it is published simply as a historic record of the ideas. This document is a product of the Layer 2 Virtual Private Networks Working Group of the IETF. HISTORIC: This memo defines a Historic Document for the Internet community. It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind. Distribution of this memo is unlimited. This announcement is sent to the IETF-Announce and rfc-dist lists. To subscribe or unsubscribe, see https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-dist For searching the RFC series, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/search For downloading RFCs, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc.html Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the author of the RFC in question, or to rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org. Unless specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for unlimited distribution. The RFC Editor Team Association Management Solutions, LLC --089e01495028404d55050cca6c55 Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
I would like to congratulate Himanshu and co-authors on th= is RFC, it's been a long time in the making!

Cheers,=
Andy

---------- Forward= ed message ----------
From: <rfc-editor@rfc-ed= itor.org>
Date: Wed, Jan 14, 2015 at 5:43 PM
Subject: R= FC 7436 on IP-Only LAN Service (IPLS)
To: ietf-announce@ietf.org, rfc-dist@rfc-editor.org
Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org, drafts-= update-ref@iana.org, rfc-e= ditor@rfc-editor.org


A new Request for Comments is now avail= able in online RFC libraries.


=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 RFC 7436

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Title:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 IP-Only LAN Service = (IPLS)
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Author:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0H. Shah, E. Rosen, =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 F. Le= Faucheur, G. Heron
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Status:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0Historic
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Stream:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0IETF
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Date:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0January 2015 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Mailbox:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 hshah@ciena.com,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 erosen@juniper.net,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 flefauch@cisco.com,
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 giheron@cisco.com
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pages:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 32
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Characters: 74340
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Updates/Obsoletes/SeeAlso:=C2=A0 =C2=A0None

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 I-D Tag:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 draft-ietf-l2vpn-ipls-16.= txt

=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 URL:=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 https://www.rfc-edit= or.org/info/rfc7436

A Virtual Private LAN Service (VPLS) is used to interconnect systems
across a wide-area or metropolitan-area network, making it appear that
they are on a private LAN.=C2=A0 The systems that are interconnected may themselves be LAN switches.=C2=A0 If, however, they are IP hosts or IP
routers, certain simplifications to the operation of the VPLS are
possible.=C2=A0 We call this simplified type of VPLS an "IP-only LAN Service" (IPLS).=C2=A0 In an IPLS, as in a VPLS, LAN interfaces are ru= n in
promiscuous mode, and frames are forwarded based on their destination
Media Access Control (MAC) addresses.=C2=A0 However, the maintenance of the=
MAC forwarding tables is done via signaling, rather than via the MAC
address learning procedures specified in the IEEE's "Media Access = Control
(MAC) Bridges".=C2=A0 This document specifies the protocol extensions = and
procedures for support of the IPLS service.

The original intent was to provide an alternate solution to VPLS for
those Provider Edge (PE) routers that were not capable of learning MAC
addresses through data plane.=C2=A0 This became a non-issue with newer
hardware.=C2=A0 The concepts put forth by this document are still valuable = and
are adopted in one form or other by newer work such as Ethernet VPN in
L2VPN working group and possible data center applications.=C2=A0 At this point, no further action is planned to update this document and it is
published simply as a historic record of the ideas.

This document is a product of the Layer 2 Virtual Private Networks Working = Group of the IETF.


HISTORIC: This memo defines a Historic Document for the Internet
community.=C2=A0 It does not specify an Internet standard of any kind.
Distribution of this memo is unlimited.

This announcement is sent to the IETF-Announce and rfc-dist lists.
To subscribe or unsubscribe, see
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For searching the RFC series, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/search
For downloading RFCs, see https://www.rfc-editor.org/rfc.html

Requests for special distribution should be addressed to either the
author of the RFC in question, or to rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org.=C2=A0 Unless
specifically noted otherwise on the RFC itself, all RFCs are for
unlimited distribution.


The RFC Editor Team
Association Management Solutions, LLC



--089e01495028404d55050cca6c55-- From nobody Wed Jan 21 08:01:40 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 23D9B1A1AE0; Wed, 21 Jan 2015 08:01:35 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id kRuRUWQ0Hq-8; Wed, 21 Jan 2015 08:01:32 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 953BB1A1AF1; Wed, 21 Jan 2015 08:01:32 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.10.0.p8 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20150121160132.15410.55577.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2015 08:01:32 -0800 Archived-At: Cc: pals@ietf.org Subject: [Pals] I-D Action: draft-ietf-pwe3-endpoint-fast-protection-02.txt X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2015 16:01:35 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services Working Group of the IETF. Title : PW Endpoint Fast Failure Protection Authors : Yimin Shen Rahul Aggarwal Wim Henderickx Yuanlong Jiang Filename : draft-ietf-pwe3-endpoint-fast-protection-02.txt Pages : 29 Date : 2015-01-21 Abstract: This document specifies a fast mechanism for protecting pseudowires against egress endpoint failures, including egress attachment circuit failure, egress PE failure, multi-segment PW terminating PE failure, and multi-segment PW switching PE failure. Designed on the basis of multi-homed CE, PW redundancy, upstream label assignment and context specific label switching, the mechanism enables local repair to be performed by the router upstream adjacent to a failure. In particular, the router can restore PW traffic in the order of tens of milliseconds, by transmitting the traffic to a protector through a pre-established bypass tunnel. Therefore, the mechanism can reduce traffic loss before global repair reacts to the failure and the network converges on the topology changes due to the failure. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pwe3-endpoint-fast-protection/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pwe3-endpoint-fast-protection-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-pwe3-endpoint-fast-protection-02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Wed Jan 21 14:41:09 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E8BFC1A0072; Wed, 21 Jan 2015 14:41:05 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.898 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.898 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id ZAnkq8wsIeqS; Wed, 21 Jan 2015 14:41:04 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F6E91A0076; Wed, 21 Jan 2015 14:41:04 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Andrew G. Malis" To: afarrel@juniper.net X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.10.0.p8 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20150121224104.29284.64145.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2015 14:41:04 -0800 Archived-At: Cc: iesg-secretary@ietf.org, pals@ietf.org, pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org, agmalis@gmail.com, draft-ietf-pwe3-iccp-stp.all@tools.ietf.org Subject: [Pals] Publication has been requested for draft-ietf-pwe3-iccp-stp-02 X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 21 Jan 2015 22:41:06 -0000 Andy Malis has requested publication of draft-ietf-pwe3-iccp-stp-02 as Proposed Standard on behalf of the PALS working group. Please verify the document's state at http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pwe3-iccp-stp/ From nobody Thu Jan 22 05:08:39 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7C6ED1ACC8B for ; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:48:52 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.899 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, TVD_SPACE_RATIO=0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id or93L_i30h-C; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:48:51 -0800 (PST) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 623071A19EF; Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:48:51 -0800 (PST) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To: agmalis@gmail.com, draft-ietf-pwe3-iccp-stp.all@tools.ietf.org, pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org, pals@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.10.0.p8 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20150122124851.4357.61641.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 04:48:51 -0800 From: IETF Secretariat Archived-At: X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 05:08:37 -0800 Subject: [Pals] ID Tracker State Update Notice: X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 22 Jan 2015 12:48:52 -0000 IESG state changed to AD Evaluation from Publication Requested ID Tracker URL: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pwe3-iccp-stp/ From nobody Mon Jan 26 07:48:30 2015 Return-Path: X-Original-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: pals@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E4EA61A90D6 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2015 07:48:27 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -11.81 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-11.81 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4aufmOxbFc4l for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2015 07:48:22 -0800 (PST) Received: from aer-iport-3.cisco.com (aer-iport-3.cisco.com [173.38.203.53]) (using TLSv1 with cipher RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 709DB1A90D2 for ; Mon, 26 Jan 2015 07:48:21 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=22569; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1422287301; x=1423496901; h=message-id:date:from:reply-to:mime-version:to:subject; bh=Fiphq20Xv89qjQfaU1eghA7RG3i1sDGpzwYSnHks55U=; b=b7dcgg6B/9CgHU6S6DDegL6B22VouRwM7Gd15l1XL02NjQZguf96cWRC Qu1LYUaXl3fUKl9p0gnfgF+pnr38e9IpZ1ziDK4DfQIunp2XyR1olyBlN Z1yNjHLmwJ/FIkCIbbdy5MpK2GTtyS3B7E3jRu3sTLZSr6g3Q5r2JV4rT Y=; X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.09,469,1418083200"; d="scan'208,217";a="323134693" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP; 26 Jan 2015 15:48:19 +0000 Received: from [10.147.62.73] (dhcp-bdlk10-vlan256-10-147-62-73.cisco.com [10.147.62.73]) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id t0QFmJXp030292; Mon, 26 Jan 2015 15:48:19 GMT Message-ID: <54C661C3.3050003@cisco.com> Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2015 15:48:19 +0000 From: Stewart Bryant User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.10; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: draft-ietf-l2vpn-mpls-tp-mac-wd@tools.ietf.org, "pals@ietf.org" , pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------010105050302070105040209" Archived-At: Subject: [Pals] Some comments on draft-ietf-l2vpn-mpls-tp-mac-wd-00.txt X-BeenThere: pals@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list Reply-To: stbryant@cisco.com List-Id: "Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services dicussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2015 15:48:28 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------010105050302070105040209 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, I have been looking at this draft and I have a few concerns which I think need to be addressed. I think that you need to take a careful look at the error cases and the MTU issues that arise as a result of the use of the ACK mechanism you designed to replace TCP. This system is rather different from the system that you cloned it from. Firstly the original was just sending status whereas you are potentially sending a long string of MAC addresses and secondly the original had a heartbeat that allowed it to eventually send the status, which you do not seem to have. In the LDP version the status always gets through and there is no MTU problem. I am fearful that if you implemented this it would mostly work but when some error case occurred you would get some very strange behavior that would be very difficult to debug, and would look like a s/w error when it was a protocol error. - Stewart === When the number of MAC addresses to be removed is large, empty MAC List TLV may be used. - I think that should be "the empty MAC" === A PW can be signaled via LDP or can be statically provisioned. In the case of static PW, LDP based MAC withdrawal mechanism cannot be - the LDP..... === 3. MAC Withdraw OAM Message A given MAC withdrawal notification is sent as a PW OAM message, and the sender keeps re-transmitting the message until it receives an ACK for that message. - OK, but you need a backoff mechanism which I do not see described ===== Once a receiver successfully remove MAC address(es) in response to a MAC address withdraw OAM message, it should not unnecessarily remove MAC address(es) upon getting refresh message(s). To facilitate this, the proposed mechanism uses sequence number, and defines a new TLV to carry the sequence number. - I think that using s/n is fine, but you do not need a TLV you can make it part of the MAC Withdraw OAM Message since it is always present. The way that you have the message designed below you always send 64 bits to send 32 bits. The format of the MAC address withdraw OAM message is shown in Figure 1. The PW OAM message header is exactly the same as what is defined in [RFC6478]. Since the MAC withdrawal PW OAM message is not refreshed forever. A MAC address withdraw OAM message MUST contain a "Sequence Number TLV" otherwise the entire message is dropped. - Suggest you just make it part of the non-TLV message. It MAY contain MAC Flush Parameter TLVs defined in [MAC-OPT] when static PWs are deployed in H-VPLS and PBB-VPLS scenarios. The first 2 bits of the sequence number TLV are reserved and MUST be set to 0 on transmit and ignored on receipt. - Why? 0 1 2 3 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ |0 0 0 1|Version| Reserved |0xZZ MAC Withdraw OAM Message | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Reserved | TLV Length |A|R| Flags | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ |Res| Sequence Number TLV (TBD) | Sequence Number TLV Length | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | Sequence Number | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ | | | MAC List TLV | ~ MAC Flush Parameter TLV (optional) ~ | | | | +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+ Figure 1: MAC Address Withdraw PW OAM Packet Format In this section, MAC List TLV and MAC Flush Parameter TLV are collectively referred to as "MAC TLV(s)". The processing rules of MAC List TLV are governed by [RFC4762], and the corresponding rules of MAC Flush Parameter TLV are governed by [MAC-OPT]. "TLV Length" is the total length of all TLVs in the message, and "Sequence Number TLV Length" is the length of the sequence number field. A single bit (called A-bit) is set to indicate if a MAC withdraw message is for ACK. Also, ACK does not include MAC TLV(s). Only half of the sequence number space is used. Modular arithmetic is used to detect wrapping of sequence number. When sequence number wraps, all MAC addresses are flushed and the sequence number is reset. - That sounds rather brutal. I am not sure how often this will happen but if you got rid of the TLV and used 64 bits the answer would be never. Given the rarity you might just take the PW down. A single bit (called R-bit) is set to indicate if the sender is requesting reset of the sequence numbers. The sender sets this bit when the Pseudowire is restarted and has no local record of send and expected receive sequence number. 4. Operation This section describes how the initial MAC withdraw OAM messages are sent and retransmitted, as well as how the messages are processed and retransmitted messages are identified. 4.1. Operation of Sender Each PW is associated with a counter to keep track of the sequence number of the transmitted MAC withdrawal messages. Whenever a node sends a new set of MAC TLVs, it increments the transmitted sequence number counter, and include the new sequence number in the message. The transmit sequence number is initialized to 1 at the onset. The sender expects an ACK from the receiver within a time interval which we call "Retransmit Time" which can be either a default (1 second) or configured value. - I think that you should include this in the message so both parties know the value. If the ACK does not arrive within the Retransmit Time, the sender retransmits the message with the same sequence number as the original message. The retransmission is ceased anytime when ACK is received or after three retries. - So what happens if three is not enough? I think that you need to continue and that is what your earlier text said. However I think you also need to back off the rate since it may be getting lost due to some congestion. This avoids unended retransmissions in the absence of acknowledgements. In addition, if during the period of retransmission, if a need to send a new MAC withdraw message with updated sequence number arises then retransmission of the older unacknowledged withdraw message is suspended and retransmit time for the new sequence number is initiated. In essence, sender engages in retrasmission logic only for the latest send withdraw message for a given PW. - So what happens to the MAC addresses in the old (lost message)? Are they concatenated with the new addresses or simply ignored? What happens when the MTU is exhausted - Something that will not happen with a TCP channel but will happen in an OAM channel? In the event that a Pseudowire was deleted and re-added or the router is restarted with configuration, the local node may lose information about the send sequence number of previous incarnation. This becomes problematic for the remote peer as it will continue to ignore the received MAC withdraw messages with lower sequence numbers. In such cases, it is desirable to reset the sequence numbers at both ends of the Pseudowire. The 'R' reset bit is set in the first MAC withdraw to notify the remote peer to reset the send and receive sequence numbers. The 'R' bit must be cleared in subsequent MAC withdraw messages after the acknowledgement is received - A case that you have not considered is late arrival of an OAM message - which can happen with FRR. Won't this reset the sequence numbers at the receiver? Do you always need to send the the R bit whenever there is a wrapped? 4.2. Operation of Receiver Each PW is associated with a register to keep track of the sequence number of the MAC withdrawal message received last. Whenever a MAC withdrawal message is received, and if the sequence number on the message is greater than the value in the register, the MAC Sivabalan, et al. Expires January 2, 2015 [Page 5] Internet-Draft MAC Withdrawal over Static Pseudowire July 2014 address(es) contained in the MAC TLV(s) is/are removed, and the register is updated with the received sequence number. The receiver sends an ACK whose sequence number is the same as that in the received message. If the sequence number in the received message is smaller than or equal to the value in the register, the MAC TLV(s) is/are not processed. - So if it were a superseded message those MACs are not withdrawn? However, an ACK with the received sequence number MUST be sent as a response. The receiver processes the ACK message as an acknowledgement for all the MAC withdraw messages sent up to the sequence number present in the ACK message and terminates retransmission. As mentioned above, since only half of the sequence number space is used, the receiver MUST use modular arithmetic to detect wrapping of the sequence number. - I do not understand how you distinguish a late from a wrap? A MAC withdraw message with 'R' bit set MUST be processed by resetting the send and receive sequence number first. The rest of MAC withdraw message processing is performed as described above. The acknowledgement is sent with 'R' bit cleared. 5. IANA Considerations The proposed mechanism requests IANA to a assign new channel type (recommended value 0x0028) from the registry named "Pseudowire Associated Channel Types". The description of the new channel type is "Pseudowire MAC Withdraw OAM Channel". IANA needs to create a new registry for Pseudowire Associated Channel TLVs, and create an entry for "Sequence Number TLV". The recommended value is 0x0001. - NO!!!!! we decided a long time ago that ACH TLVs would live in a registry associated with the channel type, not in a global registry, although in this case I do not think you need a registry at all. - Where does the MAC TLV get assigned? - Again do you need a TLV for the MAC addresses - why not a list length? +++++++++ --------------010105050302070105040209 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit 



Hi, I have been looking at this draft and I have a few concerns which
I think need to be addressed.

I think that you need to take a careful look at the error
cases and the MTU issues that arise as a result of the use
of the ACK mechanism you designed to replace TCP.

This system is rather different from the system that you
cloned it from. Firstly the original was just sending status
whereas you are potentially sending a long string of MAC addresses
and secondly the original had a heartbeat that allowed
it to eventually send the status, which you do not seem to have.

In the LDP version the status always gets through and there
is no MTU problem.

I am fearful that if you implemented this it would mostly work
but when some error case occurred you would get some very strange
behavior that would be very difficult to debug, and would look
like a s/w error when it was a protocol error.

- Stewart 

===
When the number of MAC addresses to be removed is
   large, empty MAC List TLV may be used.  

- I think that should be "the empty MAC"
===

   A PW can be signaled via LDP or can be statically provisioned.  In
   the case of static PW, LDP based MAC withdrawal mechanism cannot be

- the LDP.....
===



3.  MAC Withdraw OAM Message


   A given MAC withdrawal notification is
   sent as a PW OAM message, and the sender keeps re-transmitting the
   message until it receives an ACK for that message.  

- OK, but you need a backoff mechanism which I do not see described

=====

   Once a receiver
   successfully remove MAC address(es) in response to a MAC address
   withdraw OAM message, it should not unnecessarily remove MAC
   address(es) upon getting refresh message(s).  To facilitate this, the
   proposed mechanism uses sequence number, and defines a new TLV to
   carry the sequence number.

- I think that using s/n is fine, but you do not need a TLV you
can make it part of the MAC Withdraw OAM Message since it is
always present. The way that you have the message designed below
you always send 64 bits to send 32 bits.
 
   The format of the MAC address withdraw OAM message is shown in
   Figure 1.  The PW OAM message header is exactly the same as what is
   defined in [RFC6478].  Since the MAC withdrawal PW OAM message is not
   refreshed forever.  A MAC address withdraw OAM message MUST contain a
   "Sequence Number TLV" otherwise the entire message is dropped.  

- Suggest you just make it part of the non-TLV message.

   It
   MAY contain MAC Flush Parameter TLVs defined in [MAC-OPT]  when
   static PWs are deployed in H-VPLS and PBB-VPLS scenarios.  The first
   2 bits of the sequence number TLV are reserved and MUST be set to 0
   on transmit and ignored on receipt.


- Why?



       0                   1                   2                   3
       0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
      |0 0 0 1|Version|   Reserved    |0xZZ MAC Withdraw OAM Message  |
      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
      |            Reserved           |  TLV Length   |A|R| Flags     |
      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
      |Res| Sequence Number TLV (TBD) |  Sequence Number TLV Length   |
      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
      |                        Sequence Number                        |
      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
      |                                                               |
      |                         MAC List TLV                          |
      ~                MAC Flush Parameter TLV (optional)             ~
      |                                                               |
      |                                                               |
      +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+


            Figure 1: MAC Address Withdraw PW OAM Packet Format

   In this section, MAC List TLV and MAC Flush Parameter TLV are
   collectively referred to as "MAC TLV(s)".  The processing rules of
   MAC List TLV are governed by [RFC4762], and the corresponding rules
   of MAC Flush Parameter TLV are governed by [MAC-OPT].

   "TLV Length" is the total length of all TLVs in the message, and
   "Sequence Number TLV Length" is the length of the sequence number
   field.

   A single bit (called A-bit) is set to indicate if a MAC withdraw
   message is for ACK.  Also, ACK does not include MAC TLV(s).

   Only half of the sequence number space is used.  Modular arithmetic
   is used to detect wrapping of sequence number.  When sequence number
   wraps, all MAC addresses are flushed and the sequence number is
   reset.

- That sounds rather brutal. I am not sure how often this will happen
but if you got rid of the TLV and used 64 bits the answer would be never.
Given the rarity you might just take the PW down. 

   A single bit (called R-bit) is set to indicate if the sender is
   requesting reset of the sequence numbers.  The sender sets this bit
   when the Pseudowire is restarted and has no local record of send and
   expected receive sequence number.


 4.  Operation

   This section describes how the initial MAC withdraw OAM messages are
   sent and retransmitted, as well as how the messages are processed and
   retransmitted messages are identified.

4.1.  Operation of Sender

   Each PW is associated with a counter to keep track of the sequence
   number of the transmitted MAC withdrawal messages.  Whenever a node
   sends a new set of MAC TLVs, it increments the transmitted sequence
   number counter, and include the new sequence number in the message.
   The transmit sequence number is initialized to 1 at the onset.

   The sender expects an ACK from the receiver within a time interval
   which we call "Retransmit Time" which can be either a default (1
   second) or configured value. 

- I think that you should include this in the message so both parties
know the value.

   If the ACK does not arrive within the
   Retransmit Time, the sender retransmits the message with the same
   sequence number as the original message.  The retransmission is
   ceased anytime when ACK is received or after three retries.  

- So what happens if three is not enough? I think that you need
to continue and that is what your earlier text said. However I think
you also need to back off the rate since it may be getting lost
due to some congestion.

   This
   avoids unended retransmissions in the absence of acknowledgements.
   In addition, if during the period of retransmission, if a need to
   send a new MAC withdraw message with updated sequence number arises
   then retransmission of the older unacknowledged withdraw message is
   suspended and retransmit time for the new sequence number is
   initiated.  In essence, sender engages in retrasmission logic only
   for the latest send withdraw message for a given PW.

- So what happens to the MAC addresses in the old (lost message)?
Are they concatenated with the new addresses or simply ignored?
What happens when the MTU is exhausted - Something that will not happen
with a TCP channel but will happen in an OAM channel?

   In the event that a Pseudowire was deleted and re-added or the router
   is restarted with configuration, the local node may lose information
   about the send sequence number of previous incarnation.  This becomes
   problematic for the remote peer as it will continue to ignore the
   received MAC withdraw messages with lower sequence numbers.  In such
   cases, it is desirable to reset the sequence numbers at both ends of
   the Pseudowire.  The 'R' reset bit is set in the first MAC withdraw
   to notify the remote peer to reset the send and receive sequence
   numbers.  The 'R' bit must be cleared in subsequent MAC withdraw
   messages after the acknowledgement is received


- A case that you have not considered is late arrival of an OAM 
message - which can happen with FRR. Won't this reset the sequence
numbers at the receiver?

Do you always need to send the the R bit whenever there is a wrapped?


 4.2.  Operation of Receiver

   Each PW is associated with a register to keep track of the sequence
   number of the MAC withdrawal message received last.  Whenever a MAC
   withdrawal message is received, and if the sequence number on the
   message is greater than the value in the register, the MAC



Sivabalan, et al.        Expires January 2, 2015                [Page 5]

Internet-Draft    MAC Withdrawal over Static Pseudowire        July 2014


   address(es) contained in the MAC TLV(s) is/are removed, and the
   register is updated with the received sequence number.  The receiver
   sends an ACK whose sequence number is the same as that in the
   received message.

   If the sequence number in the received message is smaller than or
   equal to the value in the register, the MAC TLV(s) is/are not
   processed. 

- So if it were a superseded message those MACs are not withdrawn?

   However, an ACK with the received sequence number MUST be
   sent as a response.  The receiver processes the ACK message as an
   acknowledgement for all the MAC withdraw messages sent up to the
   sequence number present in the ACK message and terminates
   retransmission.

   As mentioned above, since only half of the sequence number space is
   used, the receiver MUST use modular arithmetic to detect wrapping of
   the sequence number.

- I do not understand how you distinguish a late from a wrap?

   A MAC withdraw message with 'R' bit set MUST be processed by
   resetting the send and receive sequence number first.  The rest of
   MAC withdraw message processing is performed as described above.  The
   acknowledgement is sent with 'R' bit cleared.

5.  IANA Considerations

   The proposed mechanism requests IANA to a assign new channel type
   (recommended value 0x0028) from the registry named "Pseudowire
   Associated Channel Types".  The description of the new channel type
   is "Pseudowire MAC Withdraw OAM Channel".

   IANA needs to create a new registry for Pseudowire Associated Channel
   TLVs, and create an entry for "Sequence Number TLV".  The recommended
   value is 0x0001.

- NO!!!!! we decided a long time ago that ACH TLVs would live in a registry
associated with the channel type, not in a global registry, although in
this case I do not think you need a registry at all.

- Where does the MAC TLV get assigned?

- Again do you need a TLV for the MAC addresses - why not a list length?

+++++++++


 

  


--------------010105050302070105040209--


From nobody Tue Jan 27 03:16:54 2015
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
 This draft is a work item of the Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : LDP extensions for Pseudowire Binding to LSP Tunnels
        Authors         : Mach(Guoyi) Chen
                          Wei Cao
                          Attila Takacs
                          Ping Pan
	Filename        : draft-ietf-pals-mpls-tp-pw-over-bidir-lsp-00.txt
	Pages           : 15
	Date            : 2015-01-27

Abstract:
   Many transport services require that user traffic, in the forms of
   Pseudowires (PW), to be delivered on a single co-routed bidirectional
   LSP or two LSPs that share the same routes.  In addition, the user
   traffic may traverse through multiple transport networks.

   This document specifies an optional extension in LDP that enable the
   binding between PWs and the underlying LSPs.



The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pals-mpls-tp-pw-over-bidir-lsp/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-mpls-tp-pw-over-bidir-lsp-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Tue Jan 27 07:25:38 2015
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Subject: [Pals] draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection now a  WG draft
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On 24/12/2014 09:52, Stewart Bryant wrote:
>
> Working Group,
>
> This email starts a poll to see whether there is consensus to
> adopt draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection as a WG draft of
> the PALS WG.
>
> Please send your comments (support/not support) to the PALS working
> group mailing list (pals@ietf.org). Please give a technical
> motivation for your support/not support, especially if you think that
> the document should not be adopted as a working group document.
>
> In view of the long holiday season in some parts of the world I will
> run the poll until 16th January 2015.
>
> - Stewart
There is support to work on this draft in the WG.

Please will the authors post

draft-ietf-pals-ms-pw-protection with the same text as the
latest version of draft-shawam-pwe3-ms-pw-protection

Thanks

Stewart



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Subject: [Pals] IPR poll for draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00
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--089e0149d1ee54ed0a050da3e024
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Working Group,

The authors of http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00 have
told me as working group co-chair that this draft is ready for working
group last call.

Before starting the last call, I need to do an IPR poll.

Are you aware of any IPR that applies to
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00 ?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see
RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond
to this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR.
The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The documents
will not advance to the next stage until a response has been received from
each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author
or contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll and start WG last call when I have heard from all
authors and contributors.

Thanks,
Andy

--089e0149d1ee54ed0a050da3e024
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Working Group,
The authors of=C2=A0http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-g=
al-00=C2=A0have told me=C2=A0as working group co-chair that this draft =
is ready for working group last call.

Before starting the=C2=A0last call,=C2=A0I need to do an=
=C2=A0IPR=C2=A0poll.

Are you aware of any=C2=
=A0IPR=C2=A0that applies t=
o=C2=A0http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-00 ?

=
If so, has this=C2=A0IPR=
=C2=A0been disclosed in compliance with IETF=C2=A0IPR=C2=A0rules=C2=A0(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and =
5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or co=
ntributor please respond to=C2=A0this email stating of whether or not you a=
re aware of any relevant=C2=A0IPR=
. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The=C2=
=A0documents will not advance to the next stage until a response=C2=A0has b=
een received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on th=
e PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or=C2=A0contributor, t=
hen please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any=C2=A0IPR=C2=A0that has not yet been disclo=
sed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this=C2=A0poll=C2=A0and start WG last call=C2=
=A0when I have heard from=C2=A0all authors and contributors.

Thanks,=

Andy



--089e0149d1ee54ed0a050da3e024--


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Subject: [Pals] IPR Poll on draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination
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This mail starts an IPR poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
all authors/contributors by then.

- Stewart


From nobody Tue Jan 27 07:51:45 2015
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From: Stewart Bryant 
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Subject: [Pals] IPR Poll on draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection
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This mail starts an IPR poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
all authors/contributors by then.

- Stewart


From nobody Tue Jan 27 10:12:05 2015
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From: Shahram Davari 
To: "" 
Thread-Topic: IPR Poll on draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection
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Subject: Re: [Pals] IPR Poll on draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection
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Hi

I am not aware of any IPR related to this draft.=20

Regards,
Shahram


> On Jan 27, 2015, at 4:48 PM, Stewart Bryant  wrote:
>=20
> This mail starts an IPR poll on
> draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection.
>=20
> Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
> draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection?
>=20
> If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
> (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?
>=20
> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
> this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
> IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
> documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
> has been received from each author and each contributor.
>=20
> If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
> contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
> IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.
>=20
> I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
> all authors/contributors by then.
>=20
> - Stewart


From nobody Tue Jan 27 11:34:34 2015
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Subject: [Pals] I-D Action: draft-ietf-pals-ms-pw-protection-00.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
 This draft is a work item of the Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : S-PE Outage Protection for Static Multi-Segment Pseudowires
        Authors         : Andrew G. Malis
                          Loa Andersson
                          Huub van Helvoort
                          Jongyoon Shin
                          Lei Wang
                          Alessandro D'Alessandro
	Filename        : draft-ietf-pals-ms-pw-protection-00.txt
	Pages           : 8
	Date            : 2015-01-27

Abstract:
   In MPLS and MPLS-TP environments, statically provisioned Single-
   Segment Pseudowires (SS-PWs) are protected against tunnel failure via
   MPLS-level and MPLS-TP-level tunnel protection.  With statically
   provisioned Multi-Segment Pseudowires (MS-PWs), each segment of the
   MS-PW is likewise protected from tunnel failures via MPLS-level and
   MPLS-TP-level tunnel protection.  However, static MS-PWs are not
   protected end-to-end against failure of one of the switching PEs
   (S-PEs) along the path of the MS-PW.  This document describes how to
   achieve this protection by updating the existing procedures in RFC
   6870.  It also contains an optional approach based on MPLS-TP Linear
   Protection.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pals-ms-pw-protection/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-ms-pw-protection-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


From nobody Tue Jan 27 18:50:55 2015
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Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2015 10:50:41 +0800
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Subject: Re: [Pals] IPR Poll on draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination
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Hi

I am not aware of any IPR related to this draft. 

Regards,
Weiqiang Cheng

-----Original Message-----
From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant
Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2015 11:47 PM
To: draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination@tools.ietf.org
Cc: pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: [Pals] IPR Poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination

This mail starts an IPR poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
all authors/contributors by then.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals




From nobody Tue Jan 27 18:51:43 2015
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Hi

I am not aware of any IPR related to this draft. 

Regards,
Weiqiang Cheng


-----Original Message-----
From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant
Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2015 11:48 PM
To: draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection@tools.ietf.org
Cc: pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
Subject: [Pals] IPR Poll on draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection

This mail starts an IPR poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
all authors/contributors by then.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals




From nobody Wed Jan 28 01:00:43 2015
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From: "Wang Lei" 
To: , 
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Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2015 17:00:34 +0800
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I am not aware of any IPR related to this draft.

Lei Wang

-----=D3=CA=BC=FE=D4=AD=BC=FE-----
=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] =B4=FA=B1=ED =
Stewart Bryant
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2015=C4=EA1=D4=C227=C8=D5 23:48
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection@tools.ietf.org
=B3=AD=CB=CD: pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: [Pals] IPR Poll on =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection

This mail starts an IPR poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
all authors/contributors by then.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals




From nobody Wed Jan 28 01:01:17 2015
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From: "Wang Lei" 
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Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2015 17:01:13 +0800
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Subject: Re: [Pals] IPR Poll on draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination
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I am not aware of any IPR related to this draft.=20

Best Regards,

Lei Wang

-----=D3=CA=BC=FE=D4=AD=BC=FE-----
=B7=A2=BC=FE=C8=CB: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] =B4=FA=B1=ED =
Stewart Bryant
=B7=A2=CB=CD=CA=B1=BC=E4: 2015=C4=EA1=D4=C227=C8=D5 23:47
=CA=D5=BC=FE=C8=CB: =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination@tools.ietf.org
=B3=AD=CB=CD: pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
=D6=F7=CC=E2: [Pals] IPR Poll on =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination

This mail starts an IPR poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
all authors/contributors by then.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals




From nobody Wed Jan 28 01:01:26 2015
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Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2015 09:01:14 +0000
From: Stewart Bryant 
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To: "stbryant@cisco.com" , draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe@tools.ietf.org
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Subject: [Pals] draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe - IPR Poll prior to WGLC
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I am about to start the WG LC process on draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe
but first I have to confirm that there is no undisclosed IPR.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.


- Stewart


From nobody Wed Jan 28 02:09:00 2015
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From: "Lihan" 
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Subject: [Pals] =?utf-8?b?562U5aSNOiAgSVBSIFBvbGwgb24gZHJhZnQtY2hlbmctcHdl?= =?utf-8?q?3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection?=
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I don't aware of any IPR that applies to draft-cheng. Thank you!

Best regards,

                 Han Li
=20
********************************************************************
Han Li, Ph.D=20
China Mobile Research Institute
No.32 Xuanwumen west street,Xicheng District, Beijing 100053, China=20
Fax: +86 10 63135198=20
MOBILE: 13501093385=20
********************************************************************

-----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6-----
=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Stewart Bryant
=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2015=E5=B9=B41=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5 =
23:48
=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection@tools.ietf.org
=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [Pals] IPR Poll on =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection

This mail starts an IPR poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-protection?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
all authors/contributors by then.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals




From nobody Wed Jan 28 02:09:24 2015
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I don't aware of any IPR that applies to =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination. Thank you!

Best regards,

                 Han Li
=20
********************************************************************
Han Li, Ph.D=20
China Mobile Research Institute
No.32 Xuanwumen west street,Xicheng District, Beijing 100053, China=20
Fax: +86 10 63135198=20
MOBILE: 13501093385=20
********************************************************************


-----=E9=82=AE=E4=BB=B6=E5=8E=9F=E4=BB=B6-----
=E5=8F=91=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] =
=E4=BB=A3=E8=A1=A8 Stewart Bryant
=E5=8F=91=E9=80=81=E6=97=B6=E9=97=B4: 2015=E5=B9=B41=E6=9C=8827=E6=97=A5 =
23:47
=E6=94=B6=E4=BB=B6=E4=BA=BA: =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination@tools.ietf.org
=E6=8A=84=E9=80=81: pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
=E4=B8=BB=E9=A2=98: [Pals] IPR Poll on =
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination

This mail starts an IPR poll on
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination.

Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
draft-cheng-pwe3-mpls-tp-dual-homing-coordination?

If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules
(see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant
IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The
documents will not advance to the next stage until a response
has been received from each author and each contributor.

If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any
IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.

I will close this poll on 10/Feb/2015 or later if I have not heard from
all authors/contributors by then.

- Stewart

_______________________________________________
Pals mailing list
Pals@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals




From nobody Wed Jan 28 17:17:48 2015
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From: "Dongjie (Jimmy)" 
To: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe@tools.ietf.org" 
Thread-Topic: [Pals] draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe - IPR Poll prior to WGLC
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Subject: Re: [Pals] draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe - IPR Poll prior to WGLC
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Hi Stewart,=20

I am not aware of any IPR related to this draft.

Best regards,
Jie

> -----Original Message-----
> From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant
> Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2015 5:01 PM
> To: stbryant@cisco.com; draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe@tools.ietf.org
> Cc: pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.org
> Subject: [Pals] draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe - IPR Poll prior to WGLC
>=20
> I am about to start the WG LC process on draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe b=
ut
> first I have to confirm that there is no undisclosed IPR.
>=20
> Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to
> draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe?
>=20
> If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules (see=
 RFCs
> 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?
>=20
> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to t=
his
> email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The
> response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The documents will=
 not
> advance to the next stage until a response has been received from each au=
thor
> and each contributor.
>=20
> If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author or
> contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware of any =
IPR that
> has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.
>=20
>=20
> - Stewart
>=20
> _______________________________________________
> Pals mailing list
> Pals@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals


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From: "Wanghaibo (Rainsword)" 
To: "stbryant@cisco.com" , "draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe@tools.ietf.org" 
Thread-Topic: Re: [Pals] draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe - IPR Poll prior to WGLC
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Hi Stewart,



I am not aware of any IPR related to this draft.



Best regards,

Haibo Wang



> -----Original Message-----

> From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Stewart Bryant

> Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2015 5:01 PM

> To: stbryant@cisco.com; draft-ietf-pwe3-redund=
ancy-spe@tools.ietf.org

> Cc: pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@i=
etf.org

> Subject: [Pals] draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe - IPR Poll prior to

> WGLC

>

> I am about to start the WG LC process on

> draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe but first I have to confirm that there is =
no undisclosed IPR.

>

> Authors, are you aware of any IPR that applies to

> draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe?

>

> If so, has this IPR been disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules

> (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3669 and 5378 for more details)?

>

> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond

> to this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant

> IPR. The response needs to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The

> documents will not advance to the next stage until a response has been

> received from each author and each contributor.

>

> If you are on the PALS WG email list but are not listed as an author

> or contributor, then please explicitly respond only if you are aware

> of any IPR that has not yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules=
.

>

>

> - Stewart

>

> _______________________________________________

> Pals mailing list

> Pals@ietf.org

> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals



_______________________________________________

Pals mailing list

Pals@ietf.org

https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals


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Hi Stewart, 


 


I am not aware of any IPR re=
lated to this draft.


 


Best regards,


Haibo Wang=



 


> -----Original Message--=
---


> From: Pals [mailto:pals-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf O=
f Stewart Bryant


> Sent: Wednesday, Januar=
y 28, 2015 5:01 PM


> To: 
stbryant@cisco.com; 
draft-ietf-pwe3-redundancy-spe@tools.ietf.org


> Cc: 
pals-chairs@tools.ietf.org; pals@ietf.=
org


> Subject: [Pals] draft-i=
etf-pwe3-redundancy-spe - IPR Poll prior to



> WGLC<=
/p>

> 


> I am about to start the=
 WG LC process on



> draft-ietf-pwe3-redunda=
ncy-spe but first I have to confirm that there is no undisclosed IPR.<=
/o:p>


> 


> Authors, are you aware =
of any IPR that applies to



> draft-ietf-pwe3-redunda=
ncy-spe?


> 


> If so, has this IPR bee=
n disclosed in compliance with IETF IPR rules



> (see RFCs 3979, 4879, 3=
669 and 5378 for more details)?


> 


> If you are listed as a =
document author or contributor please respond



> to this email stating o=
f whether or not you are aware of any relevant



> IPR. The response needs=
 to be sent to the PALS WG mailing list. The



> documents will not adva=
nce to the next stage until a response has been



> received from each auth=
or and each contributor.


> 


> If you are on the PALS =
WG email list but are not listed as an author



> or contributor, then pl=
ease explicitly respond only if you are aware



> of any IPR that has not=
 yet been disclosed in conformance with IETF rules.


> 


> 


> - Stewart


> 


> _______________________=
________________________


> Pals mailing list<=
/o:p>


> Pals@ietf.org


> 
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals


 


____________________________=
___________________


Pals mailing list=



Pals@ietf.org


https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/pals


 






--_000_1E61161D6E31D849BEA887261DB60934341D19E6nkgeml506mbschi_--


From nobody Fri Jan 30 07:13:51 2015
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Subject: [Pals] I-D Action: draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
 This draft is a work item of the Pseudowire And LDP-enabled Services Working Group of the IETF.

        Title           : Using GAL as a VCCV Channel Indicator
        Authors         : Thomas D. Nadeau
                          Luca Martini
                          Stewart Bryant
	Filename        : draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01.txt
	Pages           : 8
	Date            : 2015-01-30

Abstract:
   This document specifies a new Virtual Circuit Connectivity
   Verification (VCCV) (RFC5085) control channel type for use with
   pseudowires (PW) carried over an MPLS network.  This new channel type
   uses the Generic Associated Channel Label (GAL) (RFC5586) to
   distinguish VCCV packets from packets carrying user data.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal/

There's also a htmlized version available at:
http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01

A diff from the previous version is available at:
http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-pals-vccv-for-gal-01


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/