From nobody Wed Oct 1 18:41:30 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4E6591A8879; Wed, 1 Oct 2014 18:41:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tu9z2MHRgwc7; Wed, 1 Oct 2014 18:41:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 132831A8886; Wed, 1 Oct 2014 18:41:26 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.3.p2 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20141002014126.17552.37375.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2014 18:41:26 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/1j2B5I1EYX4u0W7xwHaIzSFnEvo Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: [precis] I-D Action: draft-ietf-precis-nickname-10.txt X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 02 Oct 2014 01:41:28 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings Working Group of the IETF. Title : Preparation and Comparison of Nicknames Author : Peter Saint-Andre Filename : draft-ietf-precis-nickname-10.txt Pages : 10 Date : 2014-10-01 Abstract: This document describes how to prepare and compare Unicode strings representing nicknames, primarily for use within textual chatrooms. This profile is intended to be used by messaging and text conferencing technologies such as the Extensible Messaging and Presence Protocol (XMPP), the Message Session Relay Protocol (MSRP), and Centralized Conferencing (XCON). The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-precis-nickname/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-nickname-10 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-precis-nickname-10 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Oct 10 19:14:38 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF71A1A0861; Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:14:35 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zb0lOFDuGvAK; Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:14:34 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8FA571A19E9; Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:14:32 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.3.p4 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20141011021432.24669.31967.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:14:32 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/5E4L5yAJTLtvMZh8IsGN6ro7GjI Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: [precis] I-D Action: draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-08.txt X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2014 02:14:36 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings Working Group of the IETF. Title : Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings Representing Usernames and Passwords Authors : Peter Saint-Andre Alexey Melnikov Filename : draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-08.txt Pages : 19 Date : 2014-10-10 Abstract: This document describes methods for handling Unicode strings representing usernames and passwords. This document obsoletes RFC 4013. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-08 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-08 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Oct 10 19:46:45 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 982601A1A1D for ; Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:46:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.601 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.601 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G7CfjSCkoyCm for ; Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:46:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ig0-f171.google.com (mail-ig0-f171.google.com [209.85.213.171]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D24CD1A1A1C for ; Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:46:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ig0-f171.google.com with SMTP id h15so4939149igd.10 for ; Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:46:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to :cc:subject:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=i34IaREqlobQpioSFf3vIr3u5+lk/n68tw//lx51rHk=; b=T2TuDLROCIeOacppujVhMQRH6aVbAh7AqVjNfkIbhsbvPMTCtZTIyUsXZyrt0LaBKr M0Lg2wHfCU5JIWPetG/yxivaYSkLFga9381LWLwhLPMYu9H8j1tDzF6pn2HUdEJAwZuY ILDOV7mkMEToDgZCb9qPkUCuYZtfDLNHrB1IqC8I3V3BGyMC1S0KjLYe7tq6JWcCKijX eZhjMoB1Rw2sc5KeFgEfTXhOw6DjybJP4vIbwj/E2PFW3FEDxWa88NYEmFxIoyC/yrCX KuqnPvoaJ4qwEWFIvzlsPnUXOGQztRnZK8HLg+21YoSDuXCyOTw5YRzSyCtF6qqY+yzw 4rcA== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQkFSW7ueEf0/Oa+ahRtElZORsifaoTpp1Dtt0FNcr+ElwoFx0+efFFaKzzagZxrxh0gkJ6C X-Received: by 10.50.118.72 with SMTP id kk8mr11914603igb.17.1412995601260; Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:46:41 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aither.local (c-73-34-202-214.hsd1.co.comcast.net. [73.34.202.214]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id o8sm3242635igh.12.2014.10.10.19.46.40 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Fri, 10 Oct 2014 19:46:40 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <54389A0F.5090000@andyet.net> Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2014 20:46:39 -0600 From: Peter Saint-Andre - &yet User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "precis@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/vswRAufEfrqfstatfB_KF2OJm74 Cc: Richard Barnes , 'Ben Campbell' Subject: [precis] PRECIS profile consistency X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sat, 11 Oct 2014 02:46:43 -0000 In his IETF Last Call feedback on draft-ietf-precis-framework (sent April 24, 2014), John Klensin wrote in part: ### (1) After the PRECIS WG task list settled down into its charter [2], the goal became, in essence, to replace Stringprep with something more explicitly rule-based and to update (or advise on) the various uses of Stringprep profiles. As described in the PRECIS charter, that approach noted the relationships among the various parts of the PRECIS work and called for handling the "framework, profile replacements, and guidelines ... in parallel as much as possible". The interrelated nature of the pieces makes it inappropriate for the IESG to approve the "framework" document for publication on the standards track at this time because doing so would foreclose some reasonable discussion of issues with the other specs -- exactly the situation the charter language was intended, at least in my recollection, to prevent. The approval and publication of RFC 6885 over a year ago has already been used that way. Some of the decisions reflected in the current draft illustration why more testing against specific profile examples and guidelines is important [5]. Recommendation: Tentatively approve the document now if that seems otherwise justified (I suggest below that it is not) but do not issue a Protocol Action Notice or handoff to the RFC Editor until after a sufficient number of of "profile replacements" and "guidelines" have been completed and examined through the IETF Last Call process to validate the "framework" provisions. The analogy of such a request to "running code" requirements should be obvious. ### In an effort to address this concern, I have been working to make all three of the existing profile documents consistent with each other and with the PRECIS framework: http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis/ http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-precis-nickname/ http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-xmpp-6122bis/ Although there are still some minor editorial inconsistencies (which I am working to address), I would appreciate feedback on these documents sooner rather than later. I shall also be contacting the chairs of the PRECIS and XMPP WGs about progressing all of these documents soon, so that we can make sure the "running code" of the profiles is consistent with the theory of the framework. Thanks, Peter -- Peter Saint-Andre https://andyet.com/ From nobody Wed Oct 22 19:38:48 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DB0A41A87EE for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:38:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.601 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.601 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_05=-0.5, J_CHICKENPOX_37=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eDavWBOH1aUG for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:38:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ig0-f173.google.com (mail-ig0-f173.google.com [209.85.213.173]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8C6FE1A87E8 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:38:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ig0-f173.google.com with SMTP id h18so2109949igc.12 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:38:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to :cc:subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=CKgs+phky9vOB3SoIu18Oh5/4VYMtZuPiVVAxdKpzrE=; b=MozMMnWy7hAhh+dFzrGX8++FucAmqwtb3ZGMgczF433Q5XmywEWO5hAZrQVaHXkqJs u6LZpHcChtjyhV/jFh8i92U3W67pUFjXQQM99ld5F3ndgrDWMPB54algXAk56ngVcY3J ROKA8Ao1kN0roh5N7GCfB/nGPxrqRMq+44ZccdC2xk3nE1K2zN3b7yLXQvn+tW47OZWJ GKe1X5NyZS1tQOJb7zcnXSWbIstRJK9mFX2cMAkaIUkng2NoFOmgDz5kptBOeMsUTpfU KP1FRA5/4LVzuILdfGmFTnd16/oll3qD340nblYBjBxiC8uNTsG3parRPlC+4uK2FM0G Rr5Q== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQkz3eHkivniMM88hATIMloQOF+NGkYrvV1m0y+q5RT4Q5I660uFCaMfbNgNTsUa8CkNcwm3 X-Received: by 10.50.4.35 with SMTP id h3mr38350769igh.37.1414031923009; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:38:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aither.local (c-73-34-202-214.hsd1.co.comcast.net. [73.34.202.214]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id o70sm304629ioe.25.2014.10.22.19.38.41 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:38:42 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <54486A2E.1080607@andyet.net> Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2014 20:38:38 -0600 From: Peter Saint-Andre - &yet User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Yutaka OIWA References: <531A09C7.7070904@stpeter.im> <5323B309.3070700@stpeter.im> <5330F9AB.30204@stpeter.im> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/PfTjWl-3ovnsbo047mlMeHk6V04 Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: Re: [precis] usernames in PRECIS and http-auth X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2014 02:38:46 -0000 [ Old thread alert! ] On 3/25/14, 12:52 AM, Yutaka OIWA wrote: > Dear Peter, > > I have a side question: looking into saslprepbis spec, > > username = userpart [1*(1*SP userpart)] > / userpart ’@’ domainpart > > userpart = 1*(idpoint) > > domainpart = IP-literal / IPv4address / ifqdn > > ifqdn = 1*1023(domainpoint) > > Is the set of strings generated by "userpart '@' domainpart" > the proper subset of the set generated by userpart rule? Yes, I think so. (Compare the derived property calculation rules in RFC 5892 against draft-ietf-precis-framework.) > If so, I will be more-than-80% happy by just removing the > redundant second line from the username rule. Do you mind if we explain in the text that it is possible to create such a construct? See also: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-framework-18#section-4.2 > We (from HTTP side) do not want any rule which may > even *seem* to handle any characters (here, the @ mark) > specially than others. It's up to the application's own definition. Yes, and that's what the PRECIS framework says. > We're aware of some use case for which > the application defines a meaningful semantics > for strings with 2 @ marks. > (user@domain style identifier used for roaming accesses, > appended with another @provider-domain suffix. > So, the result is user@internal-domain@external-domain.) > > (Exception: the colon is special in HTTP Basic and Digest, > but I see it as a known technical issue of these and > should not be generalized for every HTTP authentication.) > > I have to (and will) dig in to the original Unicode table for > more analysis, but the thing I intuitively want seems to be > something between IdentifierClass and FreeFormClass. I think you want a username, if we adjust the saslprepbis definition slightly. > My answers to the Peter's questions: > >> "Y u taka O i w a" > > Current HTTP allows it, and we don't need to reject that mostly. Does the HTTPAUTH WG want to support everything that HTTP currently supports, or is it open to restricting things a bit more? Usernames like that don't make sense to me. However, I don't think I have a strong reason for disliking them, other than UX concerns. So I'm open to loosening the saslprepbis rules here, if only to prevent forking (or another profile just for HTTPAUTH). > (and saslprepbis's username acutally allows it except the last spaces.) > >> "♖♘♗♕♔♗♘♖" (i.e., the back line of white chess pieces) > > I have a 50-50 feeling on this, little bit offseted to accept. > It's really weired, *I* will never use this, but it's still harmless, I think. > Someone may be using this as a funny identifier. IMHO it's appropriate as a nickname but not as a username. But perhaps I'm being too strict. Note: if we allow those characters, then we're far beyond the PRECIS IdentifierClass (which forbids symbols). So if the HTTPAUTH WG wants to support symbols, it needs to profile the PRECIS FreeformClass. > I think I have to convince HTTP people that it's harmful. Well, it would require another profile, since we're not going to allow symbols into the PRECIS IdentifierClass. >> "mycatisa bby" (where those spaces are actually a tab) > > I think this should be either rejected or replaced with a single space. So no control characters. That's something. :-) > The support: most text input field of modern applications accepts > the top two, but for the last case some apps are rejecting TAB. > At least, almost all applications explicitly filter CR and LF out. OK. > I think we can declare that "CR, LF, TAB, SHY and NBSP are harmful > so we should handle it as a part of I18N string handling". > It's the purpose of PRECIS, I agree. > (and that's why I am strongly opposing against "just UTF-8" in HTTPAUTH WG). Has there been further discussion about this in the HTTPAUTH WG? I'm on that mailing list and I haven't seen much discussion on this topic. Peter -- Peter Saint-Andre https://andyet.com/ From nobody Wed Oct 22 19:58:53 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AF6DB1A87E6 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:58:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.001 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.001 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, J_CHICKENPOX_37=0.6, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id i-GXaSwzPoFm for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:58:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-ie0-f173.google.com (mail-ie0-f173.google.com [209.85.223.173]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BBBDA1A3BA3 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:58:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-ie0-f173.google.com with SMTP id tr6so167171ieb.4 for ; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:58:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to :subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=dQNNTYaSelBJFUxFcdeTFf/SlQ1dayOayYAs88FpYzA=; b=fZ1Q55IuKyWXaqf1CS4VT3TmxTVSAIxwJ2HHsWO6Adp4svgYXA+BlQ9rQBgk9heFjD NR5M/LrkzPEfLsrpevgJSpwdkijWAGJT8+Dj6fV63nzOqDEFBPF5DywphNtM76D4fbQ0 5/iCxsVe3a+A0ZAHw7j+uBhQjyI6IbWp/VT+NMyK6IznXw9C2RYcHcF9iZwROpmWQXxT xn3h4WTC1pV4vkmUH2uVB9rfrzyyf9pRkR+dOWHe1bDQQ3ToZKe1h6qVPINEt/IJ0pEO wLx5JfYVj/UkFUTrYsxqIgZJyZ8l8PwXPPMG+Itx3cuz2whEMstqiHijUqvBLmLhiS6v s56g== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnrj1YsFAc/zfM96ftnFrdTDeV+UCcl7rll4lKbPAnjrG4KQfRV788z6vWI4/bcUjoKrhh+ X-Received: by 10.50.117.73 with SMTP id kc9mr38855776igb.43.1414033128881; Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:58:48 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aither.local (c-73-34-202-214.hsd1.co.comcast.net. [73.34.202.214]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id th10sm564084igb.12.2014.10.22.19.58.47 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 22 Oct 2014 19:58:48 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <54486EE6.4030001@andyet.net> Date: Wed, 22 Oct 2014 20:58:46 -0600 From: Peter Saint-Andre - &yet User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Yutaka OIWA , precis@ietf.org References: In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/NnHya8nd6fTeBlPdbEya-4VPUpw Subject: Re: [precis] Examples in draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-07 X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2014 02:58:51 -0000 Hi Yutaka, sorry again for the seriously delayed reply... On 7/21/14, 7:51 AM, Yutaka OIWA wrote: > Dear all, > > I'm currently looking for how to harmonize http username profile candidate > with other framework profiles, especially with saslprepbis. > By the way, while I reread the related drafts, > I reached to have a question on the examples shown in > Section 4.3 of current saslprepbis draft. > > +---------------------------------+---------------------------------+ > | 8 | <"juliet"@example.com> | Quotation marks (U+0022) in | > | | | userpart | > +---------------------------------+---------------------------------+ > | 9 | | Space (U+0020) in userpart | > +---------------------------------+---------------------------------+ > | 10| <@example.com> | Zero-length userpart | > +---------------------------------+---------------------------------+ > > The above three examples in the draft are stated invalid as "username"s. > > However, following the definition of IdentifierClass in the > draft-ietf-precis-framework-17, in Section 3.2.1, > the "idpoint" rule explicitly includes characters > <@> (U+0040) and <"> (U+0022), because > IdentifierClass "grandfathers" all ASCII printable > characters within U+0021 - U+007E. > Thus, the above three examples matches the > first rule of the username > username = userpart [1*(1*SP userpart)] > (with > userpart = 1*(idpoint) > as a subsidiary rule.) > > In Example 9, "foo" and "bar@example.com" > are two userpart components for the username. > So, these three examples seems to be valid "username"s. > > How can I understand this? Your understanding appears to be correct, and saslprepbis appears to be wrong. The portions of Examples 9 and 10 before the at-sign violate the userpart rule, but not the username rule. > > P.S. > If this way of parsing "userpart" component is intended one, > the second clause of the username rule > > userpart '@' domainpart > > seems to be redundant, because the domainpart > > domainpart = IP-literal / IPv4address / ifqdn > > seems to be included in userpart > (if my understanding of domainpoint (ifqdn) as a proper > subset of idpoint is correct). > At least, all valid examples 1 to 7 shown in the saslprepbis > draft is accepted by the _first_ clause of username rule, > as a single userpart. > > P.S. > Using the saslprepbis examples as inputs, > my intention for httpauthprep definition is as follows: > examples 1-10 valid, 11 invalid. That seems to be correct. > I'm almost neutral for 12. If HTTPAUTH wants to allow symbols, then it needs to make its own profile of the PRECIS FreeformClass. > At least it intends to grandfather all sequences of ASCII > character sequences in range U+0020 (SP) - U+007E (~), > except those with leading or trailing SPs. Agreed. Peter -- Peter Saint-Andre https://andyet.com/ From nobody Thu Oct 23 18:34:22 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8BE081AD6B9; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:34:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id EHe3kJs_s0Zt; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:34:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79A501AD6C9; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:34:13 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.4.p1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20141024013413.8852.15268.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:34:13 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/CKfA8cYzey_C21qYRCXwh9_tZlU Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: [precis] I-D Action: draft-ietf-precis-framework-19.txt X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2014 01:34:17 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings Working Group of the IETF. Title : PRECIS Framework: Preparation, Enforcement, and Comparison of Internationalized Strings in Application Protocols Authors : Peter Saint-Andre Marc Blanchet Filename : draft-ietf-precis-framework-19.txt Pages : 36 Date : 2014-10-23 Abstract: Application protocols using Unicode characters in protocol strings need to properly handle such strings in order to enforce internationalization rules for strings placed in various protocol slots (such as addresses and identifiers) and to perform valid comparison operations (e.g., for purposes of authentication or authorization). This document defines a framework enabling application protocols to perform the preparation, enforcements, and comparison of internationalized strings ("PRECIS") in a way that depends on the properties of Unicode characters and thus is agile with respect to versions of Unicode. As a result, this framework provides a more sustainable approach to the handling of internationalized strings than the previous framework, known as Stringprep (RFC 3454). This document obsoletes RFC 3454. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-precis-framework/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-framework-19 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-precis-framework-19 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Oct 23 18:34:27 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2B11E1AD6BF for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:34:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2thJLwAFDWc8; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:34:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 90C331AD6CB; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:34:13 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: precis-chairs@tools.ietf.org, draft-ietf-precis-framework@tools.ietf.org, precis@ietf.org, presnick@qti.qualcomm.com X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.4.p1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20141024013413.8852.29150.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:34:13 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/cjjpgyDTnSQAXkrs42rHx6K96PM Subject: [precis] New Version Notification - draft-ietf-precis-framework-19.txt X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2014 01:34:19 -0000 A new version (-19) has been submitted for draft-ietf-precis-framework: http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-ietf-precis-framework-19.txt Sub state has been changed to AD Followup from Revised ID Needed The IETF datatracker page for this Internet-Draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-precis-framework/ Diff from previous version: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-precis-framework-19 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. IETF Secretariat. From nobody Thu Oct 23 18:44:36 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5CEA1AD6B9; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:44:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Vd2pASg8dlQT; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:44:33 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9DFBF1A882F; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:44:31 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.4.p1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20141024014431.8852.92787.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:44:31 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/6FDCOqlrzUhWHvGT6MY-cOl6E-Y Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: [precis] I-D Action: draft-ietf-precis-nickname-11.txt X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2014 01:44:34 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings Working Group of the IETF. Title : Preparation and Comparison of Nicknames Author : Peter Saint-Andre Filename : draft-ietf-precis-nickname-11.txt Pages : 10 Date : 2014-10-01 Abstract: This document describes how to prepare and compare Unicode strings representing nicknames, primarily for use within textual chatrooms. This profile is intended to be used by messaging and text conferencing technologies such as the Extensible Messaging and Presence Protocol (XMPP), the Message Session Relay Protocol (MSRP), and Centralized Conferencing (XCON). The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-precis-nickname/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-nickname-11 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-precis-nickname-11 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Oct 23 18:53:56 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 990631AD6E8; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:53:51 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hpcLK7mLSH2E; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:53:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 80E221AD6F7; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:53:48 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: i-d-announce@ietf.org X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 5.6.4.p1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20141024015348.11372.99175.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2014 18:53:48 -0700 Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/aXiafCsvy2gMgmjSdKmres2k7MY Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: [precis] I-D Action: draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-09.txt X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2014 01:53:52 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings Working Group of the IETF. Title : Preparation, Enforcement, and Comparison of Internationalized Strings Representing Usernames and Passwords Authors : Peter Saint-Andre Alexey Melnikov Filename : draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-09.txt Pages : 19 Date : 2014-10-23 Abstract: This document describes methods for handling Unicode strings representing usernames and passwords. This document obsoletes RFC 4013. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis/ There's also a htmlized version available at: http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-09 A diff from the previous version is available at: http://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-09 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Thu Oct 23 19:09:44 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 987611A87D0 for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 19:09:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.601 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.601 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 54oUXJkAX_vl for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 19:09:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-yh0-f47.google.com (mail-yh0-f47.google.com [209.85.213.47]) (using TLSv1 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2DC971A884C for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 19:09:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-yh0-f47.google.com with SMTP id c41so1947037yho.20 for ; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 19:09:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to :subject:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=bt+r9vC786kURvyOhqdCKWqh4CJoM9Akj16XQMDOCtE=; b=h7Rp3KZxRjQtP7fRABMH2gOnLGx6mWLKOuuWw3ERhd269fWtDBjcDE8U75aqK+vHd8 0fImt6CW25IElGw7W3Dhi94cZoJyew7N6Pmzd2Z0ouFYPs7lSc6LcMu1XVAZw7wGEDZN dknAyKhV48V6J3jrJKIjYBquoJfrZTEqZmt1vzkCh+Ifty14LkMCRRttC+Qr1LNdFk7M Lrbe41wEXJKffGAoQxGAJgCx/MAbXBE0SvpD+i3t4n+dL99ZtzjubX5WoL3/bDxsRI4C uJ9Q6EP29BzBVu1+Cmp3ObQSXdlyHbZHST6CdlkIH1RLbh+Ug/ZuO4Gp6E9aF9n91ajv 2udg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQlpX3v3lx+GMwdy+8aPeu7bAR3u4rSblCylipYvFTy8gZ4I0HFHEe/mDHA55x7T4tDtjN7X X-Received: by 10.170.65.131 with SMTP id h125mr1524800ykh.68.1414116576157; Thu, 23 Oct 2014 19:09:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aither.local (c-73-34-202-214.hsd1.co.comcast.net. [73.34.202.214]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id mk5sm270582igb.15.2014.10.23.19.09.35 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Thu, 23 Oct 2014 19:09:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <5449B4DD.5070007@andyet.net> Date: Thu, 23 Oct 2014 20:09:33 -0600 From: Peter Saint-Andre - &yet User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "precis@ietf.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/xJJsqLMwJO5WFcuWcnIP6pk2YUA Subject: [precis] updated i18n I-Ds X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 24 Oct 2014 02:09:39 -0000 I have just updated the following I-Ds in an effort to address all list feedback (including IETF Last Call feedback from John Klensin on the framework back in April) and to harmonize the framework and the various profiles. https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-framework-19 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-saslprepbis-09 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-precis-nickname-11 https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-xmpp-6122bis-15 Feedback is requested so that we can finish off these documents in a comprehensive and coordinated manner. Note to WG chairs and area director: please consider whether these documents can be advanced together. Thanks! Peter -- Peter Saint-Andre https://andyet.com/ From nobody Sat Oct 25 20:37:01 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9A17A1A6F05 for ; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 20:36:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: 2.899 X-Spam-Level: ** X-Spam-Status: No, score=2.899 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, HELO_EQ_JP=1.244, HOST_EQ_JP=1.265, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5qx1hDrl5qYa for ; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 20:36:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scintmta01-14.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (scintmta01-14.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.253.64]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFC061A6EF4 for ; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 20:36:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from scmeg01-14.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (scmse.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp [133.2.253.15]) by scintmta01-14.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id 975D332E538; Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:36:09 +0900 (JST) Received: from itmail2.it.aoyama.ac.jp (unknown [133.2.206.134]) by scmeg01-14.scbb.aoyama.ac.jp with smtp id 09a2_2e7b_a4a9884c_49bb_4f5e_b88e_df27c29ecd57; Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:36:09 +0900 Received: from [133.2.249.71] (unknown [133.2.249.71]) by itmail2.it.aoyama.ac.jp (Postfix) with ESMTP id EC110BF535; Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:36:08 +0900 (JST) Message-ID: <544C6C28.5040007@it.aoyama.ac.jp> Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:36:08 +0900 From: =?UTF-8?B?Ik1hcnRpbiBKLiBEw7xyc3Qi?= Organization: Aoyama Gakuin University User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/31.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Peter Saint-Andre - &yet , Yutaka OIWA References: <531A09C7.7070904@stpeter.im> <5323B309.3070700@stpeter.im> <5330F9AB.30204@stpeter.im> <54486A2E.1080607@andyet.net> In-Reply-To: <54486A2E.1080607@andyet.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/Omti8kib-JuOT-dK13WEjJ2E1iU Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: Re: [precis] usernames in PRECIS and http-auth X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 03:36:59 -0000 Hello Peter, On 2014/10/23 11:38, Peter Saint-Andre - &yet wrote: > [ Old thread alert! ] > > On 3/25/14, 12:52 AM, Yutaka OIWA wrote: >> My answers to the Peter's questions: >> >>> "Y u taka O i w a" >> >> Current HTTP allows it, and we don't need to reject that mostly. > > Does the HTTPAUTH WG want to support everything that HTTP currently > supports, or is it open to restricting things a bit more? I think the main question here would be deployability. The server is under control of the person who decides what to allow, and clients get eventually updated. But introducing restrictions like this might mean upgrading *users*. Essentially, the server operator will have to mechanically check which user names won't work anymore in the new protocol, and then contact these users and ask them to change their user name or tell them that their user name was modified. Not all users might like that. > Has there been further discussion about this in the HTTPAUTH WG? I'm on > that mailing list and I haven't seen much discussion on this topic. Me neither. Regards, Martin. From nobody Sat Oct 25 21:45:20 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E9E601A6F41 for ; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 21:45:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -0.679 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.679 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_50=0.8, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Qfi4qh-Ibx-e for ; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 21:45:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from na3sys010aog110.obsmtp.com (na3sys010aog110.obsmtp.com [74.125.245.88]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8D46B1A6F3F for ; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 21:45:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-vc0-f174.google.com ([209.85.220.174]) (using TLSv1) by na3sys010aob110.postini.com ([74.125.244.12]) with SMTP ID DSNKVEx8Xanm913/8gfSW33SfVL/xB4UlbRN@postini.com; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 21:45:17 PDT Received: by mail-vc0-f174.google.com with SMTP id hq12so1447705vcb.19 for ; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 21:45:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=aist.go.jp; s=google; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=qJT9+bZV3OgrKeEa05FkMl2W1VDmW9oEzgHaj7f2A4I=; b=IHZBDw1GQ8v3OsooqZgWph9qQQ+u7AFa04vdXlGvoGjgGit+p+AuwbENv6lW33s9lk BWyjkA6AIcdLc/85y3TEsB74hmr/IIQ6dmTqzckAUL1Yhz8uowRdHrR43FzsZku6kqSB Cr4Lk5y0Pb+mrLWGfF8VJ15bWWK8FywuNsBF4= X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=qJT9+bZV3OgrKeEa05FkMl2W1VDmW9oEzgHaj7f2A4I=; b=M85bf9tTjW8sLamKygwO4gaajK+QBJiUhBBThoUPsvrbtwHo9kjsxfxVv476qVs5+0 UyCC2GBHXAEYJcvEklRFgPotSVU+5bsL3tL142lBSpSGeW069SAj58RVWaUdVT+cAriV e1zrNpIOeEzTlKywW6LrD1EPwM23l1BJiu4CFLkZWWmG2iU2rOUzgdCua+TP7P24dXYl 0jjSAp0iV+BskA022wAGfcfpZ1Um98kA/1pm8TkuDtYmC2Wo3ierGbY7GdPYzLizpoxS wO1p8ZGZolkba+k4Ipnt5VAk6AdNR1y5JAItmyM00DhkK90ymxDc4DdVoQiea0giQBtE YN0Q== X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQmFiZBLh8c6R/PRhKOIt5UzpVgs2G+AoqZrf7UpWmyg5T2ktXuS6/7/74HIQtRdM1deiuHlHHuAwWsKkcdw2nAZvm11v8HagXzok7FhZI0Ez/nhKZCUoIo5Ox1wmsohMUOk3eNrE90cz49rKE/QiYPtv5t3CA== X-Received: by 10.220.163.135 with SMTP id a7mr10452215vcy.3.1414298716508; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 21:45:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Received: by 10.220.163.135 with SMTP id a7mr10452207vcy.3.1414298716394; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 21:45:16 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.220.134.70 with HTTP; Sat, 25 Oct 2014 21:44:56 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <544C6C28.5040007@it.aoyama.ac.jp> References: <531A09C7.7070904@stpeter.im> <5323B309.3070700@stpeter.im> <5330F9AB.30204@stpeter.im> <54486A2E.1080607@andyet.net> <544C6C28.5040007@it.aoyama.ac.jp> From: Yutaka OIWA Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 13:44:56 +0900 Message-ID: To: =?UTF-8?Q?Martin_J=2E_D=C3=BCrst?= Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/Az6p4yIAEZZ_exsk88C-MfxfL64 Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: Re: [precis] usernames in PRECIS and http-auth X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 04:45:19 -0000 Hello Martin, > I think the main question here would be deployability. The server is unde= r control of the person who decides what to allow, and clients get eventual= ly updated. But introducing restrictions like this might mean upgrading *us= ers*. Yes. However, at the same time, the character set which is currently officially allowed on HTTP spec is ISO-8859-1 only, the ad-hoc handling of non-ISO-8859-1 characters on HTTP authentication at this moment is anyway not guaranteed to be interoperable. (And because of ad-hoc handling of non-ISO-8859-1 characters, The latter half of ISO-8859-1 is also not well interoperable in reality.) The HTTP community is going to adopt use of UTF-8 (with explicit flag for using that), and it will anyway break backward compatibility with non-ASCII usernames/passwords. (It will explicitly change encoding of non-ASCII, ISO-8859-1 characters.) It means that, at this moment, we CAN define the proper way of handling for non-ASCII UTF-8 strings (with possible smallest incompatibility with existing ad-hoc implementations), and it is the last possible moment to do that without severely breaking backward compatibility with spec-conformant implementations. Of course, it should not break any compatibility with existing ASCII printable username/passwords. 2014-10-26 12:36 GMT+09:00 "Martin J. D=C3=BCrst" : > Hello Peter, > > On 2014/10/23 11:38, Peter Saint-Andre - &yet wrote: >> >> [ Old thread alert! ] >> >> On 3/25/14, 12:52 AM, Yutaka OIWA wrote: > > >>> My answers to the Peter's questions: >>> >>>> "Y u taka O i w a" >>> >>> >>> Current HTTP allows it, and we don't need to reject that mostly. >> >> >> Does the HTTPAUTH WG want to support everything that HTTP currently >> supports, or is it open to restricting things a bit more? > > > I think the main question here would be deployability. The server is unde= r > control of the person who decides what to allow, and clients get eventual= ly > updated. But introducing restrictions like this might mean upgrading > *users*. > > Essentially, the server operator will have to mechanically check which us= er > names won't work anymore in the new protocol, and then contact these user= s > and ask them to change their user name or tell them that their user name = was > modified. Not all users might like that. > > >> Has there been further discussion about this in the HTTPAUTH WG? I'm on >> that mailing list and I haven't seen much discussion on this topic. > > > Me neither. > > > Regards, Martin. From nobody Sun Oct 26 09:11:37 2014 Return-Path: X-Original-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: precis@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 056461A0102 for ; Sun, 26 Oct 2014 09:11:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.011 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.011 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, MIME_8BIT_HEADER=0.3, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.01] autolearn=ham Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0AQ53XX9tNAG for ; Sun, 26 Oct 2014 09:11:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mailuogwdur.emc.com (mailuogwdur.emc.com [128.221.224.79]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2C0151A00C3 for ; Sun, 26 Oct 2014 09:11:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from maildlpprd52.lss.emc.com (maildlpprd52.lss.emc.com [10.106.48.156]) by mailuogwprd53.lss.emc.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.0/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.0) with ESMTP id s9QGBPms002009 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NO); Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:11:25 -0400 X-DKIM: OpenDKIM Filter v2.4.3 mailuogwprd53.lss.emc.com s9QGBPms002009 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=emc.com; s=jan2013; t=1414339886; bh=2KF/QMAQI4Ep9ZCCNFAnArff400=; h=From:To:CC:Subject:Date:Message-ID:References:In-Reply-To: Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding:MIME-Version; b=FmL5MGnVPNpYjkYFAqRY62AF7dXFCLoI/9KAXcjAtMsKhXsR0hqxMpi7/lgPjoKRj SUaz1BbBw2nUsFwfq6TnRCykRn8STAxatBv7pvlroGXCa3X0ycniTz5LFYyjt1vtbH +pyBgjjXnWmInmqd/Xs0jqT2GKblAvHrDvUuWzHY= X-DKIM: OpenDKIM Filter v2.4.3 mailuogwprd53.lss.emc.com s9QGBPms002009 Received: from mailusrhubprd03.lss.emc.com (mailusrhubprd03.lss.emc.com [10.253.24.21]) by maildlpprd52.lss.emc.com (RSA Interceptor); Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:10:54 -0400 Received: from mxhub36.corp.emc.com (mxhub36.corp.emc.com [10.254.93.84]) by mailusrhubprd03.lss.emc.com (Sentrion-MTA-4.3.0/Sentrion-MTA-4.3.0) with ESMTP id s9QGBDP3032385 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES128-SHA bits=128 verify=FAIL); Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:11:13 -0400 Received: from MXHUB101.corp.emc.com (10.253.50.15) by mxhub36.corp.emc.com (10.254.93.84) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 8.3.327.1; Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:11:13 -0400 Received: from MX104CL02.corp.emc.com ([169.254.8.131]) by MXHUB101.corp.emc.com ([::1]) with mapi id 14.03.0195.001; Sun, 26 Oct 2014 12:11:13 -0400 From: "Black, David" To: Yutaka OIWA , =?utf-8?B?TWFydGluIEouIETDvHJzdA==?= Thread-Topic: [precis] usernames in PRECIS and http-auth Thread-Index: Ac9H9vLTlz7zpFP2Qhy1afdPBLAFASmlQc4AAJjh5gAAAmcfAAAPa6MA Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 16:11:11 +0000 Message-ID: References: <531A09C7.7070904@stpeter.im> <5323B309.3070700@stpeter.im> <5330F9AB.30204@stpeter.im> <54486A2E.1080607@andyet.net> <544C6C28.5040007@it.aoyama.ac.jp> In-Reply-To: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-originating-ip: [10.238.44.101] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Sentrion-Hostname: mailusrhubprd03.lss.emc.com X-RSA-Classifications: public Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/obV-dIZJOM5f98DcO_JpanHWTuI Cc: "precis@ietf.org" Subject: Re: [precis] usernames in PRECIS and http-auth X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 26 Oct 2014 16:11:34 -0000 PiA+IEkgdGhpbmsgdGhlIG1haW4gcXVlc3Rpb24gaGVyZSB3b3VsZCBiZSBkZXBsb3lhYmlsaXR5 LiBUaGUgc2VydmVyIGlzIHVuZGVyDQo+IGNvbnRyb2wgb2YgdGhlIHBlcnNvbiB3aG8gZGVjaWRl 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[73.34.202.214]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id 64sm108261iol.37.2014.10.27.08.25.31 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Mon, 27 Oct 2014 08:25:32 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <544E63EB.4000904@andyet.net> Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2014 09:25:31 -0600 From: Peter Saint-Andre - &yet User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.9; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.6.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Yutaka OIWA , =?UTF-8?B?Ik1hcnRpbiBKLiBEw7xyc3Qi?= References: <531A09C7.7070904@stpeter.im> <5323B309.3070700@stpeter.im> <5330F9AB.30204@stpeter.im> <54486A2E.1080607@andyet.net> <544C6C28.5040007@it.aoyama.ac.jp> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/precis/C0hbCGk3H0G3GRNZOpEq4XiTEoU Cc: precis@ietf.org Subject: Re: [precis] usernames in PRECIS and http-auth X-BeenThere: precis@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list List-Id: Preparation and Comparison of Internationalized Strings List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 27 Oct 2014 15:25:42 -0000 On 10/25/14, 10:44 PM, Yutaka OIWA wrote: > Hello Martin, > >> I think the main question here would be deployability. The server is under control of the person who decides what to allow, and clients get eventually updated. But introducing restrictions like this might mean upgrading *users*. > > Yes. However, at the same time, the character set which is currently > officially allowed on HTTP spec is ISO-8859-1 only, the ad-hoc handling of > non-ISO-8859-1 characters on HTTP authentication at this moment > is anyway not guaranteed to be interoperable. > (And because of ad-hoc handling of non-ISO-8859-1 characters, > The latter half of ISO-8859-1 is also not well interoperable in reality.) > > The HTTP community is going to adopt use of UTF-8 (with explicit > flag for using that), and it will anyway break backward compatibility > with non-ASCII usernames/passwords. (It will explicitly change > encoding of non-ASCII, ISO-8859-1 characters.) > > It means that, at this moment, we CAN define the proper way of > handling for non-ASCII UTF-8 strings (with possible smallest > incompatibility with existing ad-hoc implementations), > and it is the last possible moment to do that > without severely breaking backward compatibility with > spec-conformant implementations. > > Of course, it should not break any compatibility with existing > ASCII printable username/passwords. I think it's probably best to have this discussion on the HTTPAUTH list. I will start a thread there. Peter -- Peter Saint-Andre https://andyet.com/