From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sun Oct 1 10:23:24 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0EE7513307B for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 10:23:24 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.09 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.09 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=adobe.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Y7ov5xndo8uH for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 10:23:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EA4ED132EA7 for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 10:23:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3477AB81953; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 10:23:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BF278B81953 for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 10:23:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Authentication-Results: rfcpa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=adobe.com Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id w3yWxPENUNag for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 10:23:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM03-DM3-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-dm3nam03on0089.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.41.89]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 84675B81950 for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 10:23:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=adobe.com; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version; bh=N0e8GhHiSje9VUvuqiBc69DqzYB8KoJdko0vPSv7dlg=; b=ayOmhJiGA/WEYqLbhWFl7HPwSO72PHsE+Oki7ugYyIn5PpWs2h8qj/DsxsgM0pIAITppF14IKGqhv83wxQmDDGbYxheZxzTA+Nq+5nH5WnWHDXjU5BjZ6S8gVi6o+6fFAp2etsZ7+mIwdcdRVtfTxxx/4IMDzNV4nLN+NnPXNAo= Received: from BLUPR0201MB1505.namprd02.prod.outlook.com (10.163.119.16) by BLUPR0201MB1505.namprd02.prod.outlook.com (10.163.119.16) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P256) id 15.20.77.7; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 17:23:06 +0000 Received: from BLUPR0201MB1505.namprd02.prod.outlook.com ([10.163.119.16]) by BLUPR0201MB1505.namprd02.prod.outlook.com ([10.163.119.16]) with mapi id 15.20.0077.016; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 17:23:06 +0000 From: Leonard Rosenthol To: John Levine , "rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org" Thread-Topic: [rfc-i] character sets, Bug in RFC Search page... Thread-Index: AQHTOgLHAIZO7Aylw0O52itXVRl1sKLPP7ig Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2017 17:23:06 +0000 Message-ID: References: <20170926215743.GM31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <20170927175348.15593.qmail@ary.lan> In-Reply-To: <20170927175348.15593.qmail@ary.lan> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=lrosenth@adobe.com; x-originating-ip: [2601:80:4100:d372:4ccd:21d4:e513:1e2d] x-ms-publictraffictype: Email x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; BLUPR0201MB1505; 6:HqQYO0EUeP6t1aLqbU6KEpNULX3whY27q6EqQ3qABqZrw59oLOkftJwtBNn3xkz65M2rqxE3YOyj4Ui5S17bEQ66PF8DWVrftKV/RAGfZU0zuYyrq6Mu/es9wEsQBmOih5j6fiZyxMWKg4iEF69AY6AnsJlpGvt/YuFvG2L1wECrO56cjbOSZBLQm1qqLn0/Twcz4duHq0X8zKiZ0cmK4x0D0ut0aSLXJ3Ntu5fpu0bi1Hwp86fsNwgetwTfmayFqNA6H4e5yYGYMMXidFdjjU5AztSuwsZrGU6HtQwcydU+y9WjyFfJr/V9ep9I7cDdx+gLO+xL97AkSjELUDWCKQ==; 5:mgcZZDL6+3FIvlp2LxxB+UuvQ++Hw8joU4ps9fsoclS8OC/2n++YZ4Gecy1t08Fq+C1MbgigDWiBEGKIQ11IEUfapjCxNt6blDLDMpUUlEJkUj0nwpnBef4nhgrE7qUusX4q0fQnmADIeWYh0ttbJBuUFRSvaVqBRYTovSzo3c4=; 24:TeMUx0atCLz4c1/4+NRjpyJ2hJhCOMW1SujKkS6CNiC1YcBo4alMdNT+6MRCpzfiWb+AtuaR3rCA/m0sDpX0sNrsaLSs/jhkFi6A2yBtw+4=; 7:Q+vLAcFWNOD6hdsAMfQ8p3ETlC4t+VA42jPcqWaeRLkTrbP0fWnXaFOJxy7OcFrTgnifdOtNUELLTSJqGHbAyq42trT4qD9WhgG8MMvdGEBOcwdfIsmV9R1lk7+H9Zpbp0kr3k9F7uZ/X6O0r+dWVVYkx/ESf+FZRREYah8A3WC+e9t7gEHgApljhRy7wvIiCQs0jNy+ux2tlbqCkincOc5SIn22AfaoVNbxrEE/yQg= x-ms-exchange-antispam-srfa-diagnostics: SSOS; x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 9278fd96-3f75-40be-0f23-08d508f114a3 x-ms-office365-filtering-ht: Tenant x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(22001)(2017030254152)(48565401081)(2017052603199)(201703131423075)(201703031133081)(201702281549075); SRVR:BLUPR0201MB1505; x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: BLUPR0201MB1505: x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(189930954265078)(219752817060721); x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(100000700101)(100105000095)(100000701101)(100105300095)(100000702101)(100105100095)(61425038)(6040450)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(93006095)(93001095)(3002001)(10201501046)(100000703101)(100105400095)(6055026)(61426038)(61427038)(6041248)(201703131423075)(201702281528075)(201703061421075)(201703061406153)(20161123562025)(20161123555025)(20161123558100)(20161123560025)(20161123564025)(6072148)(201708071742011)(100000704101)(100105200095)(100000705101)(100105500095); SRVR:BLUPR0201MB1505; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(100000800101)(100110000095)(100000801101)(100110300095)(100000802101)(100110100095)(100000803101)(100110400095)(100000804101)(100110200095)(100000805101)(100110500095); SRVR:BLUPR0201MB1505; x-forefront-prvs: 0447DB1C71 x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10009020)(6009001)(346002)(376002)(39860400002)(377454003)(13464003)(189002)(199003)(305945005)(8676002)(7696004)(55016002)(54356999)(76176999)(10090500001)(9686003)(2501003)(99286003)(77096006)(25786009)(14454004)(86362001)(4326008)(6116002)(68736007)(189998001)(2906002)(110136005)(3280700002)(5660300001)(316002)(53936002)(6306002)(575784001)(6246003)(102836003)(101416001)(2900100001)(7736002)(3660700001)(6436002)(229853002)(6506006)(50986999)(478600001)(53546010)(8990500004)(97736004)(105586002)(74316002)(81166006)(81156014)(966005)(33656002)(8936002)(2950100002)(106356001)(45080400002); DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; SCL:1; SRVR:BLUPR0201MB1505; H:BLUPR0201MB1505.namprd02.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1; LANG:en; received-spf: None (protection.outlook.com: adobe.com does not designate permitted sender hosts) spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99 spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM MIME-Version: 1.0 X-OriginatorOrg: adobe.com X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 01 Oct 2017 17:23:06.8383 (UTC) X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: fa7b1b5a-7b34-4387-94ae-d2c178decee1 X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: BLUPR0201MB1505 Subject: Re: [rfc-i] character sets, Bug in RFC Search page... X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "tte@cs.fau.de" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" There is a standard BOM for UTF-8, just as there is for UCS2. Seems like a good idea, though most systems don't use it... Leonard -----Original Message----- From: rfc-interest [mailto:rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org] On Behalf Of John Levine Sent: Wednesday, September 27, 2017 1:54 PM To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Cc: tte@cs.fau.de Subject: Re: [rfc-i] character sets, Bug in RFC Search page... In article <20170926215743.GM31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> you write: >Given how browsers are quite inconsistent in the characer sets they >load, it would be nice to have explicit indication of the character >sets required to render a document. I've seen PDF documents where i had to go to page 100 before some crucial text was not rendered because it used some character set not available to me. Those are buggy PDFs. A PDF is supposed to contain all the fonts it uses beyond a small standard set, but there is a lot of PDF crudware that wrongly assumes that whatever fonts it finds on the machine where it's running will exist everywhere. >There is a lot of tool chains out there that will not render UTF-8 >correctly, therefore it is IMHO extremely viable to have a clear >indication of the minimum toolchain features required to render a >document correctly (in the first page header of an RFC wold be great). Hey, maybe we could put a couple of bytes at the begining that say this is a UTF-8 document. R's, John _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.rfc-editor.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Frfc-interest&data=02%7C01%7C%7Cbe3f71e51afd492186ab08d50819e6f5%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C636423829726381788&sdata=rmOSOTx4azrI97SsPWivmcIKHdwQy%2Fcfk7aA0hupTnc%3D&reserved=0 _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sun Oct 1 18:27:48 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A45B7134BE4 for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:27:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.089 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.089 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" On 2017/09/28 03:04, Toerless Eckert wrote: > On Wed, Sep 27, 2017 at 05:53:48PM -0000, John Levine wrote: >> Those are buggy PDFs. A PDF is supposed to contain all the fonts it >> uses beyond a small standard set, but there is a lot of PDF crudware >> that wrongly assumes that whatever fonts it finds on the machine where >> it's running will exist everywhere. > > I have stopped trying to really understand all those details for the last > two decades, but i fear what you describe sounds like the original intention > of adobe when they thought fonts embedded in PDFs could not be extracted > and (illegally) be reused outside of the PDF. Once that hack happened (2 decades ago ?), > the problem of licensed/payware fonts and their use has AFAIK lead to > less inclusion of fonts into PDF. For us, that should be irrelevant, because the fonts that we are (planning on) using are open source, and can be embedded without problems. Also, as far as I understand, the variant that we choose for the official PDFs actually requires that all fonts used (except for a very small base set) are included. Regards, Martin. P.S.: In addition, please note that font embedding usually uses subsetting, and our documents have very few non-ASCII characters, so the additional memory needed for font embedding isn't much of a deal. _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sun Oct 1 18:35:31 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11086134BEA for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:35:31 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.089 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.089 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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Mon, 2 Oct 2017 01:35:17 +0000 To: Matthew Kerwin , Toerless Eckert References: <7f679e5c-d0b7-f984-ca26-4f471fb20624@gmail.com> <20170926204142.GK31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <399BC245-AA68-44D8-A59B-623FEA412BB5@tzi.org> <20170926215743.GM31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> From: =?UTF-8?Q?Martin_J._D=c3=bcrst?= Organization: Aoyama Gakuin University Message-ID: <84085840-778b-136f-55ab-e8eddf3e1ae4@it.aoyama.ac.jp> Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 10:35:15 +0900 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Language: en-US X-Originating-IP: [133.2.210.64] X-ClientProxiedBy: OS2PR01CA0133.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com (10.174.152.27) To KAWPR01MB0241.jpnprd01.prod.outlook.com (10.161.28.140) X-MS-PublicTrafficType: Email X-MS-Office365-Filtering-Correlation-Id: 669b3c42-e598-489a-ca4c-08d50935d67b X-Microsoft-Antispam: UriScan:; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(22001)(2017030254152)(2017052603199)(201703131423075)(201703031133081)(201702281549075); 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X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: RFC Interest Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" On 2017/09/27 06:57, Toerless Eckert wrote: > There is a lot of tool chains out there that will not render UTF-8 correctly, > therefore it is IMHO extremely viable to have a clear indication of the > minimum toolchain features required to render a document correctly (in the first > page header of an RFC wold be great). First, most of the 'toolchain' doesn't render anything, and for most purposes, will just pass through UTF-8 if it passes through all 8 bits. Second, rendering usually works so that there might be something illegible, but the rest of the document (in ASCII) isn't affected. And the guidelines by the RFC editor are designed so that the document can still be read in such a case. Third, I think overall it's much easier to fix the remaining tool chains than to have everybody be detracted by additional distinctions that should be irrelevant in this day and age. Regards, Martin. _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sun Oct 1 18:57:33 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1D24F134BF9 for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:57:33 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 1xRQJwXw-ZYZ for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:57:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 9EA66134BFA for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:57:31 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 744ADB81346; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:57:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11535B81346 for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:57:28 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4zktY9BwzPNx for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:57:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:40]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2814EB81345 for ; Sun, 1 Oct 2017 18:57:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [131.188.34.77]) by faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4253B58C4D8; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 03:57:23 +0200 (CEST) Received: by faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix, from userid 10463) id 2C90CB0CD5D; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 03:57:23 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 03:57:23 +0200 From: Toerless Eckert To: "Martin J. D?rst" Message-ID: <20171002015722.GB31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> References: <7f679e5c-d0b7-f984-ca26-4f471fb20624@gmail.com> <20170926204142.GK31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <399BC245-AA68-44D8-A59B-623FEA412BB5@tzi.org> <20170926215743.GM31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <3e1448e4-a3f6-f713-e7a0-1bee437d208f@it.aoyama.ac.jp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <3e1448e4-a3f6-f713-e7a0-1bee437d208f@it.aoyama.ac.jp> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Subject: Re: [rfc-i] Bug in RFC Search page... X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: RFC Interest Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" Most users would not even be able to figure out why something is not diplsayed right with some tool unless they have some easy way to map the problem to some type of content that they are aware of. Therefore such a header would get very useful content information. On Mon, Oct 02, 2017 at 10:41:46AM +0900, Martin J. D?rst wrote: > On 2017/09/27 06:57, Toerless Eckert wrote: > > >There is a lot of tool chains out there that will not render UTF-8 correctly, > >therefore it is IMHO extremely viable to have a clear indication of the > >minimum toolchain features required to render a document correctly (in the first > >page header of an RFC wold be great). > > First, most of the 'toolchain' doesn't render anything, and for most > purposes, will just pass through UTF-8 if it passes through all 8 > bits. > > Second, rendering usually works so that there might be something > illegible, but the rest of the document (in ASCII) isn't affected. > And the guidelines by the RFC editor are designed so that the > document can still be read in such a case. > > Third, I think overall it's much easier to fix the remaining tool > chains than to have everybody be detracted by additional > distinctions that should be irrelevant in this day and age. > > Regards, Martin. > _______________________________________________ > rfc-interest mailing list > rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org > https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Mon Oct 2 07:59:25 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5D0D413468E for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:59:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.089 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.089 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (body has been altered)" header.d=adobe.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0xWMWjmwYyEb for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:59:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8CAF3134681 for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:59:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95A5BB80FF4; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:59:20 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2E323B80FD8 for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:59:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Authentication-Results: rfcpa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=adobe.com Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6M-MIlru7Nv6 for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:59:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from NAM01-SN1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-sn1nam01on0061.outbound.protection.outlook.com [104.47.32.61]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 8F5DAB80FB1 for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 07:59:16 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=adobe.com; s=selector1; h=From:Date:Subject:Message-ID:Content-Type:MIME-Version; bh=mOzAx429aYHiGl2uOSf51ZLjHMiPGzJVs/LbtjdzArc=; b=CCTP/0/UnOJhdGb3ApwFm30a4l/E4rtkRwx7NH9tEi5dOKTampMONiww2Y6zqMgwwIfDMPxz7H0JpGGOEFpRiGwhk2utdct8BjiJoEkcVOX1woYUiw3UViUzX8LlYkhx7uuQe1gc2uHCmwCXUM1zLm8RnY2S42uR6z8FO8u148s= Received: from BLUPR0201MB1505.namprd02.prod.outlook.com (10.163.119.16) by BLUPR0201MB1506.namprd02.prod.outlook.com (10.163.119.17) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P256) id 15.20.77.7; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 14:59:16 +0000 Received: from BLUPR0201MB1505.namprd02.prod.outlook.com ([10.163.119.16]) by BLUPR0201MB1505.namprd02.prod.outlook.com ([10.163.119.16]) with mapi id 15.20.0077.018; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 14:59:16 +0000 From: Leonard Rosenthol To: =?utf-8?B?TWFydGluIEouIETDvHJzdA==?= , "Toerless Eckert" , John Levine Thread-Topic: [rfc-i] character sets, Bug in RFC Search page... 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" QWNjb3JkaW5nIHRvIFJGQyA3OTk1Og0KRm9yIFJGQ3MsIHJlcXVpcmUgUERGL0EtMyB3aXRoIGNv bmZvcm1hbmNlIGxldmVsICJVIi4gIFRoaXMNCiAgICAgIGNhcHR1cmVzIHRoZSBhcmNoaXZhYmls aXR5IGFuZCBsb25nLXRlcm0gc3RhYmlsaXR5IG9mIFBERiAxLjcNCiAgICAgIGZpbGVzLCBtYW5k YXRvcnkgVW5pY29kZSBtYXBwaW5nIChTZWN0aW9ucyAxNC44LjIuNC4yICgiVW5pY29kZQ0KICAg ICAgTWFwcGluZyBpbiBUYWdnZWQgUERGIikgYW5kIDkuMTAuMiAoIk1hcHBpbmcgQ2hhcmFjdGVy IENvZGVzIHRvDQogICAgICBVbmljb2RlIFZhbHVlcyIpIG9mIFtQREZdKSwgYW5kIG1hbnkgb2Yg dGhlIHJlcXVpcmVtZW50IGZlYXR1cmVzLg0KDQpQREYvQS0zIHJlcXVpcmVzIHRoYXQgKmFsbCog Zm9udHMgYmUgZW1iZWRkZWQg4oCTIHNvIHRoaXMgc2hvdWxkIG5ldmVyIGJlIGEgcHJvYmxlbS4N Cg0KTGVvbmFyZA0KDQpPbiAxMC8xLzE3LCA5OjI4IFBNLCAicmZjLWludGVyZXN0IG9uIGJlaGFs ZiBvZiBNYXJ0aW4gSi4gRMO8cnN0IiA8cmZjLWludGVyZXN0LWJvdW5jZXNAcmZjLWVkaXRvci5v cmcgb24gYmVoYWxmIG9mIGR1ZXJzdEBpdC5hb3lhbWEuYWMuanA+IHdyb3RlOg0KDQogICAgDQog ICAgDQogICAgT24gMjAxNy8wOS8yOCAwMzowNCwgVG9lcmxlc3MgRWNrZXJ0IHdyb3RlOg0KICAg ID4gT24gV2VkLCBTZXAgMjcsIDIwMTcgYXQgMDU6NTM6NDhQTSAtMDAwMCwgSm9obiBMZXZpbmUg d3JvdGU6DQogICAgPj4gVGhvc2UgYXJlIGJ1Z2d5IFBERnMuICBBIFBERiBpcyBzdXBwb3NlZCB0 byBjb250YWluIGFsbCB0aGUgZm9udHMgaXQNCiAgICA+PiB1c2VzIGJleW9uZCBhIHNtYWxsIHN0 YW5kYXJkIHNldCwgYnV0IHRoZXJlIGlzIGEgbG90IG9mIFBERiBjcnVkd2FyZQ0KICAgID4+IHRo YXQgd3JvbmdseSBhc3N1bWVzIHRoYXQgd2hhdGV2ZXIgZm9udHMgaXQgZmluZHMgb24gdGhlIG1h Y2hpbmUgd2hlcmUNCiAgICA+PiBpdCdzIHJ1bm5pbmcgd2lsbCBleGlzdCBldmVyeXdoZXJlLg0K ICAgID4gDQogICAgPiBJIGhhdmUgc3RvcHBlZCB0cnlpbmcgdG8gcmVhbGx5IHVuZGVyc3RhbmQg YWxsIHRob3NlIGRldGFpbHMgZm9yIHRoZSBsYXN0DQogICAgPiB0d28gZGVjYWRlcywgYnV0IGkg ZmVhciB3aGF0IHlvdSBkZXNjcmliZSBzb3VuZHMgbGlrZSB0aGUgb3JpZ2luYWwgaW50ZW50aW9u DQogICAgPiBvZiBhZG9iZSB3aGVuIHRoZXkgdGhvdWdodCBmb250cyBlbWJlZGRlZCBpbiBQREZz IGNvdWxkIG5vdCBiZSBleHRyYWN0ZWQNCiAgICA+IGFuZCAoaWxsZWdhbGx5KSBiZSByZXVzZWQg b3V0c2lkZSBvZiB0aGUgUERGLiBPbmNlIHRoYXQgaGFjayBoYXBwZW5lZCAoMiBkZWNhZGVzIGFn byA/KSwNCiAgICA+IHRoZSBwcm9ibGVtIG9mIGxpY2Vuc2VkL3BheXdhcmUgZm9udHMgYW5kIHRo ZWlyIHVzZSBoYXMgQUZBSUsgbGVhZCB0bw0KICAgID4gbGVzcyBpbmNsdXNpb24gb2YgZm9udHMg aW50byBQREYuDQogICAgDQogICAgRm9yIHVzLCB0aGF0IHNob3VsZCBiZSBpcnJlbGV2YW50LCBi ZWNhdXNlIHRoZSBmb250cyB0aGF0IHdlIGFyZSANCiAgICAocGxhbm5pbmcgb24pIHVzaW5nIGFy ZSBvcGVuIHNvdXJjZSwgYW5kIGNhbiBiZSBlbWJlZGRlZCB3aXRob3V0IA0KICAgIHByb2JsZW1z LiBBbHNvLCBhcyBmYXIgYXMgSSB1bmRlcnN0YW5kLCB0aGUgdmFyaWFudCB0aGF0IHdlIGNob29z ZSBmb3IgDQogICAgdGhlIG9mZmljaWFsIFBERnMgYWN0dWFsbHkgcmVxdWlyZXMgdGhhdCBhbGwg Zm9udHMgdXNlZCAoZXhjZXB0IGZvciBhIA0KICAgIHZlcnkgc21hbGwgYmFzZSBzZXQpIGFyZSBp bmNsdWRlZC4NCiAgICANCiAgICBSZWdhcmRzLCAgIE1hcnRpbi4NCiAgICANCiAgICBQLlMuOiBJ biBhZGRpdGlvbiwgcGxlYXNlIG5vdGUgdGhhdCBmb250IGVtYmVkZGluZyB1c3VhbGx5IHVzZXMg DQogICAgc3Vic2V0dGluZywgYW5kIG91ciBkb2N1bWVudHMgaGF2ZSB2ZXJ5IGZldyBub24tQVND SUkgY2hhcmFjdGVycywgc28gdGhlIA0KICAgIGFkZGl0aW9uYWwgbWVtb3J5IG5lZWRlZCBmb3Ig Zm9udCBlbWJlZGRpbmcgaXNuJ3QgbXVjaCBvZiBhIGRlYWwuDQogICAgX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX18NCiAgICByZmMtaW50ZXJlc3QgbWFpbGlu ZyBsaXN0DQogICAgcmZjLWludGVyZXN0QHJmYy1lZGl0b3Iub3JnDQogICAgaHR0cHM6Ly9uYTAx LnNhZmVsaW5rcy5wcm90ZWN0aW9uLm91dGxvb2suY29tLz91cmw9aHR0cHMlM0ElMkYlMkZ3d3cu cmZjLWVkaXRvci5vcmclMkZtYWlsbWFuJTJGbGlzdGluZm8lMkZyZmMtaW50ZXJlc3QmZGF0YT0w MiU3QzAxJTdDJTdDZTRmM2MxNDk2NTFiNDEyZDhjOWIwOGQ1MDkzNGNhMzclN0NmYTdiMWI1YTdi MzQ0Mzg3OTRhZWQyYzE3OGRlY2VlMSU3QzAlN0MwJTdDNjM2NDI1MDQ0Nzk3ODMxMTUzJnNkYXRh PVBLeXlDUEhTQ1ZCb0xuNCUyQnhzeWRzQ2VYRVM2TGVrTGtBeWRpZU0xdmpldyUzRCZyZXNlcnZl ZD0wDQogICAgDQoNCl9fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fCnJmYy1pbnRlcmVzdCBtYWlsaW5nIGxpc3QKcmZjLWludGVyZXN0QHJmYy1lZGl0b3Iub3Jn Cmh0dHBzOi8vd3d3LnJmYy1lZGl0b3Iub3JnL21haWxtYW4vbGlzdGluZm8vcmZjLWludGVyZXN0 Cg== From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Mon Oct 2 08:46:45 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7DA51134597 for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:46:45 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Kqoz32b1Bbnj for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:46:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B02A11344CE for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:46:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CCB0FB814C2; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:46:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 542D3B814C2 for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:46:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id M2P2PxrGCMyn for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:46:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:40]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4F64BB814C1 for ; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 08:46:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:77]) by faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id 66E1358C4E7; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 17:46:35 +0200 (CEST) Received: by faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix, from userid 10463) id 53633B0CD6B; Mon, 2 Oct 2017 17:46:35 +0200 (CEST) Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2017 17:46:35 +0200 From: Toerless Eckert To: Leonard Rosenthol Message-ID: <20171002154635.GC31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> References: <20170926215743.GM31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <20170927175348.15593.qmail@ary.lan> <20170927180401.GY31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Subject: Re: [rfc-i] character sets, Bug in RFC Search page... X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: John Levine , "rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org" Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" Nice! = I just do not know why there seems to be disinterest to have human readable document format information/disclaimer. Heck, every other interest group has managed to get considerations & disclaimers into RFCs (security, IANA, TSV, rfc2119, et. pp). "This PDF RFC was created to ensure maximum compatibility. It requires no external data to display (such as fonts), and the formatting does ot use features newer than PDF 1.7 defined in 2007. If you encounter p= roblems with this document a viewer/renderer newer than 2012, please call 1-800-RFC= -EDIT" ;-P Cheers Toerless On Mon, Oct 02, 2017 at 02:59:16PM +0000, Leonard Rosenthol wrote: > According to RFC 7995: > For RFCs, require PDF/A-3 with conformance level "U". This > captures the archivability and long-term stability of PDF 1.7 > files, mandatory Unicode mapping (Sections 14.8.2.4.2 ("Unicode > Mapping in Tagged PDF") and 9.10.2 ("Mapping Character Codes to > Unicode Values") of [PDF]), and many of the requirement features. > = > PDF/A-3 requires that *all* fonts be embedded ??? so this should never be= a problem. > = > Leonard > = > On 10/1/17, 9:28 PM, "rfc-interest on behalf of Martin J. D=FCrst" wrote: > = > = > = > On 2017/09/28 03:04, Toerless Eckert wrote: > > On Wed, Sep 27, 2017 at 05:53:48PM -0000, John Levine wrote: > >> Those are buggy PDFs. A PDF is supposed to contain all the fonts = it > >> uses beyond a small standard set, but there is a lot of PDF crudwa= re > >> that wrongly assumes that whatever fonts it finds on the machine w= here > >> it's running will exist everywhere. > > = > > I have stopped trying to really understand all those details for th= e last > > two decades, but i fear what you describe sounds like the original = intention > > of adobe when they thought fonts embedded in PDFs could not be extr= acted > > and (illegally) be reused outside of the PDF. Once that hack happen= ed (2 decades ago ?), > > the problem of licensed/payware fonts and their use has AFAIK lead = to > > less inclusion of fonts into PDF. > = > For us, that should be irrelevant, because the fonts that we are = > (planning on) using are open source, and can be embedded without = > problems. Also, as far as I understand, the variant that we choose fo= r = > the official PDFs actually requires that all fonts used (except for a = > very small base set) are included. > = > Regards, Martin. > = > P.S.: In addition, please note that font embedding usually uses = > subsetting, and our documents have very few non-ASCII characters, so = the = > additional memory needed for font embedding isn't much of a deal. > _______________________________________________ > rfc-interest mailing list > rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org > https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fww= w.rfc-editor.org%2Fmailman%2Flistinfo%2Frfc-interest&data=3D02%7C01%7C%7Ce4= f3c149651b412d8c9b08d50934ca37%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7= C636425044797831153&sdata=3DPKyyCPHSCVBoLn4%2BxsydsCeXES6LekLkAydieM1vjew%3= D&reserved=3D0 > = > = > _______________________________________________ > rfc-interest mailing list > rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org > https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Mon Oct 2 09:09:52 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3C77013234B for ; 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02 Oct 2017 16:09:46 -0000 Date: 2 Oct 2017 12:09:45 -0400 Message-ID: From: "John R Levine" To: "Toerless Eckert" In-Reply-To: <20171002154635.GC31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> References: <20170926215743.GM31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <20170927175348.15593.qmail@ary.lan> <20170927180401.GY31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <20171002154635.GC31007@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> User-Agent: Alpine 2.21 (OSX 202 2017-01-01) MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [rfc-i] character sets, Bug in RFC Search page... X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: "rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" On Mon, 2 Oct 2017, Toerless Eckert wrote: > "This PDF RFC was created to ensure maximum compatibility. It requires > no external data to display (such as fonts), and the formatting > does ot use features newer than PDF 1.7 defined in 2007. If you encounter problems > with this document a viewer/renderer newer than 2012, please call 1-800-RFC-EDIT" "This RFC is in PDF/A-3, rather than what some randome buggy PDF software creates. If you encounter problems with this document using a viewer, you need a better viewer." There is no secret to creating PDFs that work, other the secret that you really should read the specs to know what to do. Regards, John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Taughannock Networks, Trumansburg NY Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Fri Oct 6 15:58:01 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C902F132F7C for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 15:58:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.889 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.889 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id yjq5ghtfhcNV for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 15:58:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 416BA1323B4 for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 15:58:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 25295B80CB8; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 15:57:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CBA54B80CB8 for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 15:57:50 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Authentication-Results: rfcpa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6Yy7F6xI2g4j for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 15:57:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pf0-x233.google.com (mail-pf0-x233.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c00::233]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C81B9B80CB7 for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 15:57:49 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pf0-x233.google.com with SMTP id p87so1164710pfj.3 for ; Fri, 06 Oct 2017 15:57:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=to:from:subject:organization:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=dk7iabGJfjAx3onlc4QB68OFv2AJZjgN8DKs/V+r2fM=; b=RVlGtkxyuv32Rv+iXSU73UIK7HgPMzYCfITteq6dw5ZH2cmErNJ1x4fxqVvV4GxG/z ueVNMbUdknd4qrYWuV3tnBpx0/AmjoOsl1Psh2Yd3SzWx/x6hXCNaDaqjBNQWFP/XncR 2dzkpU+3fIJahifov9xqRL0agE+vqm0FHkKOanS3MRF1BgJLxLCmIEPWp2jsGeoN7dZ4 0F5CwYnaBrt1jjjrA/mHt6bPRI9FwIPLvMWL/3bkWiHEaFPwC4VYwiLTyQvo/qt1oDDW f7p5lfUZDEgm6H/sanU/oUnk0CGHJaNZXVY8exiaMPMdL/znbiGryYs1O6ucJjPEKkPA 7Wng== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:to:from:subject:organization:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=dk7iabGJfjAx3onlc4QB68OFv2AJZjgN8DKs/V+r2fM=; b=eZoiPTKhZnpmlJs5jJd9rNFTdK7zQUHvn3rkEyeRk+c68Rrdr7MC9TNEe2/hPu/2kY eyFDIokyj9zsvXF+mO7keq+WNluTtsFG1tuVldLVVuy4eVSJZUEdRuqaakpjLK2vsy+V W5Xw3po5K6/RjJ5Tlv9gPe6LYdj565dEbiCns8LIylCHTIEDIqqB/alsQJiMgvmx9NnD mPyDur/wgvKeF9cYc0e3Lq/rv5BOmdJvLjGuWdassSIPda8vncfBkxi6MfQ0jsYYz34U VcssVMR0koD5Zf3DKg+h0m1m6J82w0fajF8GaCzbN+Q3pX7zAX+aJAXPFm34ZWLhUFyK KuDw== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaX4h3DiCYbEfYj8ZPFMIsTTWUUyQBVJN/XJy6c8wWod2df8DZ97 TyrICDBNxSWBOKfWHT+HPllQ6Q== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QAVVnffRS96AqI1iG3Ao8Abz//cUSY0FDw00czW18KyyCe+bzZXBCDzxUJgoKJKa9TFiuEOhA== X-Received: by 10.99.139.195 with SMTP id j186mr3210119pge.231.1507330676484; Fri, 06 Oct 2017 15:57:56 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2406:e007:6d3c:1:28cc:dc4c:9703:6781? ([2406:e007:6d3c:1:28cc:dc4c:9703:6781]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g16sm4450333pgn.43.2017.10.06.15.57.54 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 06 Oct 2017 15:57:55 -0700 (PDT) To: RFC Interest From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: University of Auckland Message-ID: Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2017 11:58:06 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Language: en-US Subject: [rfc-i] CMOS X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" The style guide says that the RFC Editor uses the Chicago Manual of Style, but I notice that it lives behind a paywall. What's a poor author supposed to do, when confronted with a review comment that is really a matter of style? I can't check the style guide. (In this case, I need to check the strange theory that "that" introduces a restrictive clause whereas "which" is non-restrictive, or maybe it's the other way round, and who cares anyway, because the meaning should be clear without such an implied semantic distinction?) ((In case it isn't obvious, I believe this is a distinction invented on the Western side of the Atlantic; it was certainly not something that, or which, I ever heard on the Eastern side.)) Regards Brian _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Fri Oct 6 16:10:38 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B345F132F7C for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 16:10:38 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.089 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.089 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (body has been altered)" header.d=yitter.info header.b=fbrwKPch; dkim=fail (1024-bit key) reason="fail (body has been altered)" header.d=yitter.info header.b=Kacr655l Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id VShNkpNqSAIi for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 16:10:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 442491323B4 for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 16:10:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 34CA8B80DEF; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 16:10:29 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id D17DBB80DED for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 16:10:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Authentication-Results: rfcpa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=yitter.info header.b=fbrwKPch; dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=yitter.info header.b=Kacr655l Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vTh9wvNxM_35 for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 16:10:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mx4.yitter.info (mx4.yitter.info [159.203.56.111]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C89C9B80DEC for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 16:10:26 -0700 (PDT) Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mx4.yitter.info (Postfix) with ESMTP id D4FDBBEDAD for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 23:10:33 +0000 (UTC) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yitter.info; s=default; t=1507331433; bh=s6NT74iK2cNlB5c/M9o1gqYT82p3bwj0U28RxQefN9U=; h=Date:From:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=fbrwKPcheYvve3hexqoXlOGWSn0t0+zAbihnR5rprU4tJWpi0khxusd4cq9397fwA AknvA5q6fpSWziK9DiX4/RXNGKsfvfwjNNtO4ySooE7kkh4Bw/jy1PqeWdf4eL3fEV 1L0LNAUk7Egl+j3srNXMRUtgeXOwDcUOoztzzXro= X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at crankycanuck.ca Received: from mx4.yitter.info ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (mx4.yitter.info [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id m2fIwezaxHr1 for ; Fri, 6 Oct 2017 23:10:32 +0000 (UTC) Date: Fri, 6 Oct 2017 19:10:31 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=yitter.info; s=default; t=1507331432; bh=s6NT74iK2cNlB5c/M9o1gqYT82p3bwj0U28RxQefN9U=; h=Date:From:To:Subject:References:In-Reply-To:From; b=Kacr655lWe1Vo2dm4ODM0E+KCa2GvOwEHU6by/NQxpPIrSs0OcE6Gsqes3m37TM4E gqgEusJ0TRaYcTemsthA3pkGKOEKUAgSzU1HXltwaJJCuDYnm+RKcn28/XX1orlBRS ORLeNG7hkEwJKNFwtXS38vhIt4G+kaCURMS/VY7o= From: Andrew Sullivan To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Message-ID: <20171006231031.tywtki2mzrz56zhe@mx4.yitter.info> References: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: Subject: Re: [rfc-i] CMOS X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" On Sat, Oct 07, 2017 at 11:58:06AM +1300, Brian E Carpenter wrote: > (In this case, I need to check the strange theory that "that" introduces > a restrictive clause whereas "which" is non-restrictive, or maybe it's > the other way round, and who cares anyway, because the meaning should be > clear without such an implied semantic distinction?) > > ((In case it isn't obvious, I believe this is a distinction invented on > the Western side of the Atlantic; it was certainly not something that, > or which, I ever heard on the Eastern side.)) You may think it was invented on the Western side of the Atlantic, but my Gowers Fowler discusses it in some detail. Best regards, A -- Andrew Sullivan ajs@anvilwalrusden.com _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sat Oct 7 12:45:18 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A0AF6134B5A for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 12:45:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id BPwa7c7Ksn2s for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 12:45:17 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E5F6B134301 for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 12:45:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F378EB805BD; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 12:45:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id F301EB805BD for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 12:45:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 3zw6va_2LIoA for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 12:45:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gal.iecc.com (gal.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:43:6f73:7461]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DF112B804E4 for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 12:45:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 17873 invoked from network); 7 Oct 2017 19:45:11 -0000 Received: from unknown (64.57.183.53) by gal.iecc.com with QMQP; 7 Oct 2017 19:45:11 -0000 Date: 7 Oct 2017 19:44:49 -0000 Message-ID: <20171007194449.13433.qmail@ary.lan> From: "John Levine" To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org In-Reply-To: Organization: X-Headerized: yes Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [rfc-i] CMOS X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" In article you write: >What's a poor author supposed to do, when confronted with a review comment >that is really a matter of style? I can't check the style guide. Could author take the editor's advice rather than arguing about nits? R's, John _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sat Oct 7 13:50:49 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1CAA913431A for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 13:50:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.889 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.889 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (2048-bit key) reason="fail (body has been altered)" header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id D0LMW0B0EJ9X for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 13:50:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 065B8132396 for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 13:50:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C815CB80146; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 13:50:37 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id EDC38B80121 for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 13:50:36 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Authentication-Results: rfcpa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id oHtAWug4ADcA for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 13:50:36 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-pg0-x22a.google.com (mail-pg0-x22a.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c05::22a]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E5D27B8011D for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 13:50:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pg0-x22a.google.com with SMTP id b192so8379793pga.2 for ; Sat, 07 Oct 2017 13:50:44 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:references:from:organization:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3YK3pfNtvSPOfn8Lqfl59hj68xEHBdVXfNUrm8aaAP0=; b=aELu7GY84hTo6+slQenI3nm8l+EniQCJO7K5jEFZc5Euv51ND1NPSXLH5YOWyO6l5m qLS9qIMRDimwOgLzCa98QytzH6PAlpWO75c/SwdN5u2xtpnumFyegTNVQCAYghO1NTth 7fJPYy1W0ecGpQY9gzLKcE/JGscVba8sZYUmT5yZ316c3SzOQuJQrQM1crZ8qAI1k14x LJ5pPCaciTYPiZ3GDEz/ch60I6uKvtFmpioe+J75Zu13Nyz7LlqGt+A6KGeTpNrkgGF+ xiDL+LEAbiPn6vBsgD+F/xQB8XTetd9HEUPtx1QfTFdBCnB9hGFikShOUqM/QTwbXbKZ EKWg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:organization :message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to :content-language:content-transfer-encoding; bh=3YK3pfNtvSPOfn8Lqfl59hj68xEHBdVXfNUrm8aaAP0=; b=CnOVRpniBGJG+/+rrrFJzFS3GIvZiBgQzZwR+s7VlsfRZkXR0UOzHryII87wQS5rit Ue57u+DaJnEb53XOb6h7FcfIjcJJHsuengua+pyBfFoGx7EBnOidX5assSzakWe6JlM1 oVnLmHQoXAJzhTQmbt0I0+RnXoJVNbfWGwyMpmXNdwbEcvXRr7fjTLTdlnup5EVT3JG+ cil5zunARt6aLMHBG1MBx5agdBR0bniuZ/r1PyGKRu/ofJCn7TTjPfFM4HExMX+PXAkQ RUWqb9HMpYLmIiqY66QhbLa4Jbw9gp3tk8QREQqiBmDOxwcjLZZD8M3OLHhCcSAfjMhT Mbaw== X-Gm-Message-State: AMCzsaVkPiEYCz2c4gn7h/iLtSYdcfazFzbCYSiL1osoXv5vvyxuDFZk aZEc+IcS+vvC+DniKo1nw3D1zg== X-Google-Smtp-Source: AOwi7QDW0TTNoyZjLkuPOjpqcvZvQpK6vBBVN1EvFcvonS5ZJpSp0e7b3Te5l5fPf+Qad7kJSHKQ4Q== X-Received: by 10.99.159.25 with SMTP id g25mr5528648pge.133.1507409442916; Sat, 07 Oct 2017 13:50:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2406:e007:6d3c:1:28cc:dc4c:9703:6781? ([2406:e007:6d3c:1:28cc:dc4c:9703:6781]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id w27sm9453030pfi.18.2017.10.07.13.50.40 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Sat, 07 Oct 2017 13:50:42 -0700 (PDT) To: John Levine , rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org References: <20171007194449.13433.qmail@ary.lan> From: Brian E Carpenter Organization: University of Auckland Message-ID: Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2017 09:50:53 +1300 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20171007194449.13433.qmail@ary.lan> Content-Language: en-US Subject: Re: [rfc-i] CMOS X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" On 08/10/2017 08:44, John Levine wrote: > In article you write: >> What's a poor author supposed to do, when confronted with a review comment >> that is really a matter of style? I can't check the style guide. > > Could author take the editor's advice rather than arguing about nits? Generally, yes, and I rarely have a quarrel with the RFC Editor's editing. But guidance at an earlier stage might be very useful for many of our authors, and something freely available on the web would be better than something behind a paywall. In any case, CMOS is far too long for most people to use as a quick reference. Brian _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sat Oct 7 18:45:18 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8AEC1321DC for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 18:45:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.089 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.089 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=fail (1536-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=iecc.com header.b=SASr1HxO; dkim=fail (1536-bit key) reason="fail (message has been altered)" header.d=taugh.com header.b=Mo7sIk7H Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 9JUH6KmhP196 for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 18:45:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C875A1321D8 for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 18:45:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C86BB80DCC; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 18:45:07 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6D9A8B80DCC for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 18:45:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Authentication-Results: rfcpa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1536-bit key) header.d=iecc.com header.b=SASr1HxO; dkim=pass (1536-bit key) header.d=taugh.com header.b=Mo7sIk7H Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id SKJ575gNry0i for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 18:45:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: from gal.iecc.com (gal.iecc.com [IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126:0:43:6f73:7461]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 391A5B80DCA for ; Sat, 7 Oct 2017 18:45:05 -0700 (PDT) Received: (qmail 79954 invoked from network); 8 Oct 2017 01:45:12 -0000 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=iecc.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type:user-agent; s=13850.59d98328.k1710; bh=I3Thw0YWUI7VUnGywK3mbIqxHNh06SH7Cp2gxo4KnbE=; b=SASr1HxO9PsNuvRKh9iw7htlHBDcf/Mv6k0SmLp48dBg3DVf6lvqBuwyhfeHEGJva0bzlKAK6mquf06QXKUiQGIwWZx5nPo93Xq+KjHEHvF4tc5cc55SxNxb+e6ScXhqzoe/No6IHo42qU3a9fLpoGWCfdKC1mo0Ihm2hHMcQZF9PXxCX4JFp+njfXmF5pcqGOggHLzSSQMXjFiFk5fGeRBVfYYGobpNHGzohz6+Z+wUqbBM/cRhfsuPlMxK6x3S DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple; d=taugh.com; h=date:message-id:from:to:cc:subject:in-reply-to:references:mime-version:content-type:user-agent; s=13850.59d98328.k1710; bh=I3Thw0YWUI7VUnGywK3mbIqxHNh06SH7Cp2gxo4KnbE=; b=Mo7sIk7HMWTvMSJVGIlFfzMexTa55q5sdGsriXWMWhUnl3qM6zpIczN4ZR/is0a5a9hvknEDPt5cl5rpsdA1arAzmqR+3Lqo8lsgxtvHzONjtsu/o2EiTwlxne1AxZqS2zUpp8oE44vr1oy94afzXhB1e6qwYIjEj3ebBqRUspbXVTbutR3OiJOZiZdKXft3GbhUEPz7XSHfv8T2pp21BZyPHHcVUmrtabMlqJypUXyjldRHhCK2T4x5Zc9V/mPj Received: from localhost ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) by imap.iecc.com ([IPv6:2001:470:1f07:1126::78:696d:6170]) with ESMTPS (TLS1.2/X.509/AEAD) via TCP6; 08 Oct 2017 01:45:12 -0000 Date: 7 Oct 2017 21:45:12 -0400 Message-ID: From: "John R Levine" To: "Brian E Carpenter" In-Reply-To: References: <20171007194449.13433.qmail@ary.lan> User-Agent: Alpine 2.21 (OSX 202 2017-01-01) MIME-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: [rfc-i] CMOS X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" On Sun, 8 Oct 2017, Brian E Carpenter wrote: >> Could author take the editor's advice rather than arguing about nits? > > Generally, yes, and I rarely have a quarrel with the RFC Editor's editing. > But guidance at an earlier stage might be very useful for many of our > authors, and something freely available on the web would be better than > something behind a paywall. In any case, CMOS is far too long for most > people to use as a quick reference. That's why we have copy editors, so authors don't have to worry about style nits. Perhaps the author could just take the editor's advice. I suspect I've dealt with at least as many copy editors as anyone else here, and that's what I always do. R's, John _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Tue Oct 17 13:36:21 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 91CE61330B1 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:36:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xiLPSVGB9gOa for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:36:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 33B471330AD for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:36:20 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id E41CCB814F8; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:35:58 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 42B44B814F4 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:35:57 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id zw9UdeVQnoBO for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:35:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [131.188.34.40]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6D5B4B814F0 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:35:54 -0700 (PDT) Received: from faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de [IPv6:2001:638:a000:4134::ffff:77]) by faui40.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix) with ESMTP id ED65958C4D2 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 22:36:10 +0200 (CEST) Received: by faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de (Postfix, from userid 10463) id D16F1B0CEE5; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 22:36:10 +0200 (CEST) Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 22:36:10 +0200 From: Toerless Eckert To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Message-ID: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Disposition: inline User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) Subject: [rfc-i] rfc2xml ? X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" Was there any better rfc2xml than the one on sourceforge ? That one didn't work that well for me ;-( Cheers Toerless _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Tue Oct 17 13:46:15 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 546F213219F for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:46:15 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id S8kb4zxqnDp2 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:46:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 04CB613209C for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:46:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB9FEB81645; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:45:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 54B7CB81644 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:45:52 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id CcTawKnFvuoe for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:45:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.15.19]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C2A7AB81643 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:45:50 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.178.20] ([93.217.74.136]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx001 [212.227.17.190]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0LZiLk-1dNkkk2D2C-00lVNQ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 22:46:06 +0200 To: Toerless Eckert , rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org References: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 22:46:05 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.4.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> Content-Language: en-US X-Provags-ID: V03:K0:hFSw90HhX/ztNwqgPo9W4DTe7fPzkRidyfr1VW0+0tI/7+MOiLc 63tH2vtT8t0T6fgfofhr7HLEXGDH/3KNeugtB2tLhJLv+UfGvSNttP3vHci1IUg1Uvm10N5 J5vKVxs/nenhLatrNe6j+T5+MwoszMvSDIwyGO5IkwNWY3eoL1dMTe8GTIoTW7pq1kuup97 0nc66D/nrNRf6zYxdadAA== X-UI-Out-Filterresults: notjunk:1;V01:K0:WjJ8PtnPIsg=:dpfcEpnhR40TVEGqJjS3/K AgT9eiRM5tTo+zQhoXaZggYeYmircqvr0cCl1qyNIlI7+NJqnxbRJ3z90UxbnYh2JiC42FT1l b9aL6rn5tWvbdYRZ53ac1CevvCLBycko2OIii9vAau+P0K46Aq8RD3adZeMmDAEYnl8qmWwch AzoBu1V4rNleFbwJJgPZMwM32Q1Np6a3Vynm86f25xGgqFCZKQcJtvEmC2idQisJ0hA55a73a plFB7obnNyf/OYT+cvfEH6hpTv4D9LSG/5iSM8QlnUdDyKtoJiPTDyh68e225EN/heolMGnCn Z9zh+OIxkGv441CCexccekGRXKArz8fcWxBe/QwKAuPUKDUgUgUJgotPzLrJPQtzzwh8fxNw2 +vhvjjIkOXZ5Q2cGS2Tcqnae2P7Wvbp2MpjjMBGeSKRKSK6budry50uJmCU/9KMTVuKZFEoaa MALCrmO5Ws1UMDqvFi7vbbeuEYfKBxAekI09PL+yykJ0tIlMO99LENGGDqFT28LAE1Mv1vjdx 2zHnYpbM5oWILtJ24ol0t/4fOMx9Bljqw01Nmu0PTrYcH+TlDbEh/IPGaB4mkBVJCVQ9f10ug SseisPFV0gULWk5wsdGcsaui+UFOAldeOi2XffmgcKL4bWqrzYHZw7hl2+ezeTKqtHtuJy4PL Pk0EGSOZ5tXis/rfT1um4DiKZY+ZSelN63aRWvK/XE8eVcy7F2k4wIzlM0XcccYmtYJ+wcBIZ Wxg+v07CF2hkp8IHN3ZyB1xkl2WmjQGey8dGfYJGsSr66p4iG8fiy3+daNxyYWkd3IchSb6/a 1TA2vzESYMZ8ImqTdpR3t12AaTYOuov7gx5WNC68m0zsP5NWYo= Subject: Re: [rfc-i] rfc2xml ? X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" On 2017-10-17 22:36, Toerless Eckert wrote: > Was there any better rfc2xml than the one on sourceforge ? > That one didn't work that well for me ;-( _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Tue Oct 17 13:47:40 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A727132939 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:47:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2uydZcyhVjqM for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:47:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 099D213209C for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:47:39 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0F969B81686; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:47:18 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2103DB81686 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:47:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sJeHxYjmM5p7 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:47:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zinfandel.tools.ietf.org (zinfandel.tools.ietf.org [IPv6:2001:1890:126c::1:2a]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4711BB81685 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:47:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h-99-61.a357.priv.bahnhof.se ([82.196.99.61]:58016 helo=[192.168.1.120]) by zinfandel.tools.ietf.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1e4Yly-0007kw-32; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:47:34 -0700 To: Toerless Eckert , rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org References: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> From: Henrik Levkowetz Message-ID: <5fb251aa-b024-5ca7-198c-cd21159c63f1@levkowetz.com> Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 22:47:26 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 82.196.99.61 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org, tte@cs.fau.de X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2.1 (built Mon, 26 Dec 2011 16:24:06 +0000) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on zinfandel.tools.ietf.org) X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett Subject: Re: [rfc-i] rfc2xml ? X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0119941386450439506==" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --===============0119941386450439506== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="5iDvDrsq5nnhcC6nLJ0RQwKkrFoLK7sJ1" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --5iDvDrsq5nnhcC6nLJ0RQwKkrFoLK7sJ1 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="ICU2GD49q5XbVqjFei4bRNRLhcls0kLxe"; protected-headers="v1" From: Henrik Levkowetz To: Toerless Eckert , rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Message-ID: <5fb251aa-b024-5ca7-198c-cd21159c63f1@levkowetz.com> Subject: Re: [rfc-i] rfc2xml ? References: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> In-Reply-To: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> --ICU2GD49q5XbVqjFei4bRNRLhcls0kLxe Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Toerless, On 2017-10-17 22:36, Toerless Eckert wrote: > Was there any better rfc2xml than the one on sourceforge ? > That one didn't work that well for me ;-( Canonical location: https://pypi.python.org/pypi/xml2rfc/ The recommended way to install today is by using the 'pip' tool: https://pypi.python.org/pypi/pip https://pip.pypa.io/en/stable/installing/ Best regards, Henrik --ICU2GD49q5XbVqjFei4bRNRLhcls0kLxe-- --5iDvDrsq5nnhcC6nLJ0RQwKkrFoLK7sJ1 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJZ5mxeAAoJEE6bV0uPuxca604P/A88M7+VW9M7pLjWo15EfcRU cxQn3ifOtu2Kyo6uEPcd+cNjDniR/AMbPXESA+WRhLrDUFcvC26nt6D7g/qUk5Hi qQX1uscbJ0VE9l/6iJRkzAXx70vyYpdPkGOKPw8JMGYq5yNxbMvWImgvm+k8VThn J3Pnb61EkSPrImb+n+5eQ2VSQzMx9fMiXlmM0ngbS+NTNPADjmVdWUFRg5MVlNM3 62MEoDy1UOIyVI5WozNMwN37aGJI7gES1o7AP2F1FRa0K8FVXnolL6HHo8E9UGxt GEzIzyTRiZza6NaN6OAChW/iN92oxWk3q37toOi496K2DNZ7OZNvrRxZfNfx3iiB QMKtAzw/7QWbZ2ppSVzsKHW+lAo+V+q4JOYbgjiE3l+9TNjOFhCFrkrQxHs6Q8jB 4+uglATVPlfWYNEK2+ntAAWxixeqEPJm+tY0/TqYAn9nXexb80M44Ad+//7gkfFS HP0Rocrhtodj3S4A+TMbTmhgheYRkM/y03m66/drF7zOy7ogxBmkZjkH/GnNGb5y vvPx5ZHrr0iNgATOIfHAzYD32HIeYo1yPkqoDs1nvQyRiI7rd2R636kGVTNU+Av7 oWwR1joOnL+UveOCOozgsNd51jg73iRGXv4z+yLHcR+gZLLQSyGnFIf27FFs0A/F mqn0il+7pt/INpowxLOe =d8zc -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --5iDvDrsq5nnhcC6nLJ0RQwKkrFoLK7sJ1-- --===============0119941386450439506== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest --===============0119941386450439506==-- From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Tue Oct 17 13:49:02 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AD49D132331 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:49:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xoCznr_1ws16 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:49:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4DF9913219F for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:49:01 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 52F0CB8169C; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:48:40 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 20149B8169C for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:48:39 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id hcPQ4xS1VLVU for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:48:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zinfandel.tools.ietf.org (zinfandel.tools.ietf.org [IPv6:2001:1890:126c::1:2a]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2440EB81699 for ; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:48:38 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h-99-61.a357.priv.bahnhof.se ([82.196.99.61]:58020 helo=[192.168.1.120]) by zinfandel.tools.ietf.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1e4YnK-0007UZ-JL; Tue, 17 Oct 2017 13:48:58 -0700 To: Toerless Eckert , rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org References: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <5fb251aa-b024-5ca7-198c-cd21159c63f1@levkowetz.com> From: Henrik Levkowetz Message-ID: Date: Tue, 17 Oct 2017 22:48:50 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <5fb251aa-b024-5ca7-198c-cd21159c63f1@levkowetz.com> X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 82.196.99.61 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org, tte@cs.fau.de X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2.1 (built Mon, 26 Dec 2011 16:24:06 +0000) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on zinfandel.tools.ietf.org) X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett Subject: Re: [rfc-i] rfc2xml ? X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============1044694455259242471==" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --===============1044694455259242471== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="XQLKVemI9EJw7sKUBFIc0x9r9pLfMcnh9" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --XQLKVemI9EJw7sKUBFIc0x9r9pLfMcnh9 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="ajquDIMFOJAjJ3AqlxwLkJch1ClJB95XR"; protected-headers="v1" From: Henrik Levkowetz To: Toerless Eckert , rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Message-ID: Subject: Re: [rfc-i] rfc2xml ? References: <20171017203610.GF20090@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <5fb251aa-b024-5ca7-198c-cd21159c63f1@levkowetz.com> In-Reply-To: <5fb251aa-b024-5ca7-198c-cd21159c63f1@levkowetz.com> --ajquDIMFOJAjJ3AqlxwLkJch1ClJB95XR Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Bah. Wrong tool. Another try: Canonical location: https://pypi.python.org/pypi/id2xml/ The recommended way to install today is by using the 'pip' tool: https://pypi.python.org/pypi/pip https://pip.pypa.io/en/stable/installing/ Best regards, Henrik =20 On 2017-10-17 22:47, Henrik Levkowetz wrote: > Hi Toerless, >=20 > On 2017-10-17 22:36, Toerless Eckert wrote: >> Was there any better rfc2xml than the one on sourceforge ? >> That one didn't work that well for me ;-( >=20 > Canonical location: >=20 > https://pypi.python.org/pypi/xml2rfc/ >=20 > The recommended way to install today is by using the 'pip' tool: >=20 > https://pypi.python.org/pypi/pip > https://pip.pypa.io/en/stable/installing/ >=20 >=20 > Best regards, >=20 > Henrik >=20 --ajquDIMFOJAjJ3AqlxwLkJch1ClJB95XR-- --XQLKVemI9EJw7sKUBFIc0x9r9pLfMcnh9 Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJZ5myyAAoJEE6bV0uPuxcazp8P/i7gADG4ZGWp/0SIBuUUqrdB 6RcVL4CXIB7UnNlJbeDMg8k5H6JqkABCHGm7mjGUUC/wJSkPnphSBeBrqSgeD726 o1m8V/8EnmoNpUSxfHaVCQuaIonZuU3AD47etof4Ck6a+JPy+MS//u02kPyw5r5c SUKwa3hpVOQ1/pS6+0p4aaZGeeK3+Rr/1eMogE5utO0SFCpOICNVy3ZVRpvs04Wq x2I5o8hDL3NtvVhcGGH1RaLUEeyhT18njcyrBmKzJL6QHN2zMWjiG5TVNLSxgjlT 2SxVAZ6LK7VOrnipMSPSVfSbKoPPbZ1Vs86ISlCgfQYuYCjIYQRY+eoN0YcxRxAv hA8ihnTzk2i9AMfuz0Qd0gVGTjhcHdBE+QEoxhWwdZIWIdwbWZjWtkqrO3854Y98 CXXeZTl8l2hXl9fAJqHVetgQ4bNXH0OJCMlp9WB+uDqDCepzfZp4XTV9DmNWR4O8 kmjw2NuSOcmBT4+Lq42LDmlNIHcgeLfV8CLOoCZV6iIjiHSZKwsZykxzuQgO3/Zo 0RGRroqXaCC6X/pL1xbqpH1eiBCkJp3AVHJgugQx4w8XMOt/vFrMXVKvLu5Sjbb7 Dp6bj8BUvhUKuXrTZ5t6Blnl4zSBVQ5C+zYz7eeHuTDvEPRjVloeivn0P6Twi2Co 5f0tE954huxAdZ3ZgayJ =wjss -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --XQLKVemI9EJw7sKUBFIc0x9r9pLfMcnh9-- --===============1044694455259242471== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest --===============1044694455259242471==-- From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sat Oct 21 03:26:55 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 324D413305F for ; Sat, 21 Oct 2017 03:26:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -3.389 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.389 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_ADSP_CUSTOM_MED=0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN=0.199, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, FROM_LOCAL_NOVOWEL=0.5, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, T_DKIM_INVALID=0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Cc: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org, ietf@ietf.org Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" T24gMTQvMDkvMjAxNywgSGVhdGhlciBGbGFuYWdhbiAoUkZDIFNlcmllcyBFZGl0b3IpIDxyc2VA cmZjLWVkaXRvci5vcmc+IHdyb3RlOgoKPiB0aGUgZmlyc3QgUkZDIHRvIGJlIHB1Ymxpc2hlZCB3 aXRoIFVURi04IGVuY29kaW5nIGFuZCBpbmNsdWRlIGNoYXJhY3RlcnMgbm90IGluIHRoZQo+IGJh c2ljIEFTQ0lJIGNoYXJhY3RlciBzZXQuCgpJbnRlcmVzdGluZywgYW5kIGEgcXVpY2sgc2FuaXR5 IHRlc3Qgd2l0aApodHRwczovL3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2h0bWwvcmZjODE4NyB3b3JrcyBmb3Ig bWUgKD0gY2FuIHNlZSBhbiDigqwgaW4KMy4yLjMpLCB0aGF0IHNob3VsZCBhbHNvIGNvdmVyIGFs bCBXaWtpTWVkaWEgYW5kIE1lZGlhV2lraSBwcm9qZWN0cwpsaW5raW5nIHRvIHRvb2xzLmlldGYu b3JnIChub3QgbGltaXRlZCB0byBSRkNzLCBJLURzIGFyZSBhbHNvIG9mdGVuCmxpbmtlZCB2aWEg dG9vbHMuaWV0Zi5vcmcpLiBTbyBub3cgSSBjYW4gZmluYWxseSByZXBsYWNlIGFuIGFuY2llbnQK Y29weSBvZiB2aW50YWdlIDIwMDUgZHJhZnQtaG9mZm1hbi11dGY4LXJmY3MtMDEudHh0IGJ5IGEg bW9yZSB1cCB0bwpkYXRlIFJGQyA4MTQwIDstKQoKU2tlcHRpY2FsLCBtYXliZSB0aGUgVW5pY29k ZSBlbW9qaSBmb3IgOy0pIGRvZXMgbm90IHlldCB3b3JrCmV2ZXJ5d2hlcmUsIHNvbWUgZm9sa3Mg aW5jbHVkaW5nIG1lIGFyZSBzdGlsbCB1c2luZyBXaW5kb3dzIDcgYW5kIG5vdApwbGFubmluZyB0 byB1cGdyYWRlIGJlZm9yZSAyMDIwLgpfX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19fX19f X19fX19fX19fX19fXwpyZmMtaW50ZXJlc3QgbWFpbGluZyBsaXN0CnJmYy1pbnRlcmVzdEByZmMt ZWRpdG9yLm9yZwpodHRwczovL3d3dy5yZmMtZWRpdG9yLm9yZy9tYWlsbWFuL2xpc3RpbmZvL3Jm Yy1pbnRlcmVzdAo= From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Tue Oct 24 06:30:30 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE59613F409 for ; 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Tue, 24 Oct 2017 06:30:16 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vfifwfwW_Px5; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 06:30:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mout.gmx.net (mout.gmx.net [212.227.17.22]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 80658B81364; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 06:30:14 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.1.38] ([217.91.35.233]) by mail.gmx.com (mrgmx102 [212.227.17.168]) with ESMTPSA (Nemesis) id 0MJFBe-1e4FS00fYg-002q2c; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 15:29:50 +0200 To: "Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor)" , ietf@ietf.org, rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org References: <09b0ed8b-c47a-83c3-9174-cce990bdb145@rfc-editor.org> <69edbf4c-abd0-27ac-fa23-ac1b93180698@gmx.de> <4c9d1cb1-8776-4ee9-3dd3-f1902f09753b@rfc-editor.org> From: Julian Reschke Message-ID: <942f115f-0996-439b-531f-bd5f32dd62f1@gmx.de> Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 15:29:50 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; Format="flowed" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" On 2017-09-22 18:54, Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor) wrote: > ... > That's an excellent question. I think this is something to discuss with > both the IESG and the Tools Team, though I am fairly confident that > "right now" isn't possible. An idnits update is one of the tools > contracted for, and is not yet complete (see the expected timeline here: > https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/wiki/FormatToolsPlan). Also, > ... Currently says "End of January". Note that all I'm asking for is a way to disable the "all ASCII" check. > we've seen that the datatracker isn't rendering non-ASCII characters > correctly in the PDF automatically generated from RFC 8187 > (https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/ticket/2370). So, there is > still some work to do before this will all work. FWIW, this is not about the PDF (which is fine), but the fact that datatrackers's TXT-to-HTML conversion doesn't work properly (in contract to the one used for the HTML on tools.ietf.org). It would be awesome to see some progress here. Best regards, Julian _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest From rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Tue Oct 24 07:42:14 2017 Return-Path: X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AC3A213F802 for ; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:42:14 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.199 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.199 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id DTbmBmqDXE2V for ; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:42:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EF97C13F6C7 for ; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:42:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2CCD7B818AB; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:42:10 -0700 (PDT) X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 423FBB818AA; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:42:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id xqcjrY4fK3Kl; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:42:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from zinfandel.tools.ietf.org (zinfandel.tools.ietf.org [IPv6:2001:1890:126c::1:2a]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id EA40BB818A9; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:42:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from h-99-61.a357.priv.bahnhof.se ([82.196.99.61]:56800 helo=[192.168.1.120]) by zinfandel.tools.ietf.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1e70P9-0006fy-09; Tue, 24 Oct 2017 07:42:07 -0700 To: Julian Reschke , "Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor)" , ietf@ietf.org, rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org References: <09b0ed8b-c47a-83c3-9174-cce990bdb145@rfc-editor.org> <69edbf4c-abd0-27ac-fa23-ac1b93180698@gmx.de> <4c9d1cb1-8776-4ee9-3dd3-f1902f09753b@rfc-editor.org> <942f115f-0996-439b-531f-bd5f32dd62f1@gmx.de> From: Henrik Levkowetz Message-ID: Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2017 16:41:58 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <942f115f-0996-439b-531f-bd5f32dd62f1@gmx.de> X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: 82.196.99.61 X-SA-Exim-Rcpt-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org, ietf@ietf.org, rse@rfc-editor.org, julian.reschke@gmx.de X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: henrik@levkowetz.com X-SA-Exim-Version: 4.2.1 (built Mon, 26 Dec 2011 16:24:06 +0000) X-SA-Exim-Scanned: Yes (on zinfandel.tools.ietf.org) X-Clacks-Overhead: GNU Terry Pratchett Subject: Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII characters X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22 Precedence: list List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============2009882935105141293==" Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org Sender: "rfc-interest" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --===============2009882935105141293== Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="jgv37EXnQgNNSLbtcJXreP1bj4kIQk7jT" This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --jgv37EXnQgNNSLbtcJXreP1bj4kIQk7jT Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="TjBW68dxLThq9cWboBlTJBJmdoeKC9mwG"; protected-headers="v1" From: Henrik Levkowetz To: Julian Reschke , "Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor)" , ietf@ietf.org, rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org Message-ID: Subject: Re: [rfc-i] RFC Series publishes first RFC with non-ASCII characters References: <09b0ed8b-c47a-83c3-9174-cce990bdb145@rfc-editor.org> <69edbf4c-abd0-27ac-fa23-ac1b93180698@gmx.de> <4c9d1cb1-8776-4ee9-3dd3-f1902f09753b@rfc-editor.org> <942f115f-0996-439b-531f-bd5f32dd62f1@gmx.de> In-Reply-To: <942f115f-0996-439b-531f-bd5f32dd62f1@gmx.de> --TjBW68dxLThq9cWboBlTJBJmdoeKC9mwG Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Julian, On 2017-10-24 15:29, Julian Reschke wrote: > On 2017-09-22 18:54, Heather Flanagan (RFC Series Editor) wrote: >> ... >> That's an excellent question. I think this is something to discuss wit= h >> both the IESG and the Tools Team, though I am fairly confident that >> "right now" isn't possible. An idnits update is one of the tools >> contracted for, and is not yet complete (see the expected timeline her= e: >> https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/wiki/FormatToolsPlan). Also, > > ... >=20 > Currently says "End of January". Note that all I'm asking for is a way = > to disable the "all ASCII" check. It should be feasible to tweak the current idnits in this respect -- but that's going to permit non-ascii in a lot of places where the exact rules= would not permit non-ascii. Better checks will still have to wait for th= e new idnits. >> we've seen that the datatracker isn't rendering non-ASCII characters >> correctly in the PDF automatically generated from RFC 8187 >> (https://trac.tools.ietf.org/tools/ietfdb/ticket/2370). So, there is >> still some work to do before this will all work. >=20 > FWIW, this is not about the PDF (which is fine), but the fact that=20 > datatrackers's TXT-to-HTML conversion doesn't work properly (in contrac= t=20 > to the one used for the HTML on tools.ietf.org). >=20 > It would be awesome to see some progress here. It's on my to-do list, but not at the very top. Will see what I can do. Best regards, Henrik --TjBW68dxLThq9cWboBlTJBJmdoeKC9mwG-- --jgv37EXnQgNNSLbtcJXreP1bj4kIQk7jT Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- iQIcBAEBCAAGBQJZ71E2AAoJEE6bV0uPuxca9rQP/Rjrt7s4VWuH5oIjzs4MwxIm AkTFsXhNwZn9e3eAIo3r7RehcLiXlsPwYId+kUEhDjSvk7JfvF6GfjX1/8F3r48/ Nv3ItfA4c7YPRopx8AiK46gbXj2yu/HNWG3/M1DUERSnhQRxZpJQPYla7XaMZXmG oBfAn8H7orQnX1i5rfEL0u02Itx49Nfn8MREJ79DX4WIEKMPQX8BNXAuJ6LyFfv6 i+7evKp/eU30xE+ozOwR1Fa6qKam8L0LSvYogULLe/Z/eIlu4xJXKWIsVwzoOa7l 6zkRKvuxsAfwyVMfnVqpB3Ngs89OkguvRdb6Z1YOj5j4KsekQInFNs3I/thJH3mP eUi2aAOhN8OmOJSYzysbxjOXr4KcrAuU+FnY96G0vhDaUNmLQROQzBHQg8lC67Ld rQ7FqI/ZmIzjHMb9e0FssVfm6MWUX5hu4OMvoNWopJXNJWi829rtdMB8aWpqNCWT 8GnEF5GRx+E9ANafja3YIDL7JEr1ZDJWmsdhqcRvFXwkMxQx6EDAtUDzwfarzqm8 bWi1HhAMmj3Tr7CfJoismxMuNyFeMB+OpwURl94Ql+TOrsZiQIr+6riXYhMi8L5M JEQj5MqoJM3prqblBXFzBaAgGGniAMSW5SsSygxIx/kZ0FYRMc/MHX1EBYH5CQ14 aJv3avQ19YZ3LRFAymui =oZWA -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --jgv37EXnQgNNSLbtcJXreP1bj4kIQk7jT-- --===============2009882935105141293== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ rfc-interest mailing list rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest --===============2009882935105141293==--