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From: ShaoWen Ma <mashaowen@gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 1 Apr 2018 20:19:05 +0800
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To: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Cc: Alankar Sharma <as3957@gmail.com>, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>,  Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>, "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>, rift@ietf.org
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Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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Yes, Support

Best Regards
Shaowen Ma

On Sat, Mar 31, 2018 at 5:51 AM, Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Yes, support  as co-author
>
> On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 2:18 PM, Alankar Sharma <as3957@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Yes support.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Alankar
>>
>> On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 3:56 PM, Greg Mirsky <gregimirsky@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, support
>>> Regards, Greg
>>>
>>> On Fri, 30 Mar 2018, 22:22 Jeff Tantsura, <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hi RIFT,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Request for WG adoption of draft-przygienda-rift-05.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The authors have requested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05
>>>> as the working group documents.
>>>>
>>>> Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 2018.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
>>>> this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The
>>>> response needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not
>>>> advance to the next stage until a response has been received from each
>>>> author and each individual that has contributed to the document.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Jeff & Jeffrey
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Rift mailing list
>>>> Rift@ietf.org
>>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Rift mailing list
>>> Rift@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Rift mailing list
>> Rift@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rift mailing list
> Rift@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>Yes, Support<br><br></div>Best Regards<br></div>=
Shaowen Ma<br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quot=
e">On Sat, Mar 31, 2018 at 5:51 AM, Tony Przygienda <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<=
a href=3D"mailto:tonysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com=
</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin=
:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr">Y=
es, support=C2=A0 as co-author<br></div><div class=3D"HOEnZb"><div class=3D=
"h5"><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Mar =
30, 2018 at 2:18 PM, Alankar Sharma <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:as3957@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">as3957@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:=
<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-lef=
t:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>Yes support.<=
br><br></div>Thanks,<br></div>Alankar<br></div><div class=3D"m_-57362964893=
35227186HOEnZb"><div class=3D"m_-5736296489335227186h5"><div class=3D"gmail=
_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 3:56 PM, Gre=
g Mirsky <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:gregimirsky@gmail.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">gregimirsky@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote c=
lass=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;=
padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"auto">Yes, support<div dir=3D"auto">Regards, =
Greg</div></div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div><div class=3D"m_-573629=
6489335227186m_-5976171785181789096h5"><div dir=3D"ltr">On Fri, 30 Mar 2018=
, 22:22 Jeff Tantsura, &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" targe=
t=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div></div></div><b=
lockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px =
#ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div class=3D"m_-5736296489335227186m_-59=
76171785181789096h5"><div link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72" lang=3D"EN-US"=
><div class=3D"m_-5736296489335227186m_-5976171785181789096m_63147656057170=
11151m_6047547065791405071WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Hi RIFT,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Request for WG adoption of =
draft-przygienda-rift-05.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><s=
pan style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"M=
soNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">The authors have requested the R=
IFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as the working group documents.<u></u=
><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">=
Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 2018.<u></u><u></u></spa=
n></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0=
<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">I=
f you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to this=
 email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The res=
ponse needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not adva=
nce to the next stage until a response has been received from each author a=
nd each individual that has contributed to the document.<u></u><u></u></spa=
n></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0=
<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">T=
hanks,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-s=
ize:11.0pt">Jeff &amp; Jeffrey<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div></div></div></div>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<span><br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">Rift@=
ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer no=
referrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/l<wbr>istinfo/rift=
</a><br>
</span></blockquote></div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">Rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/l<wbr>istinfo/rift</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>
</div></div><br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">Rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/l<wbr>istinfo/rift</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>
</div></div><br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org">Rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/rift</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

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Thread-Topic: RIFT binary package available for public download ... 
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Subject: [Rift] RIFT binary package available for public download ...
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From nobody Tue Apr 10 08:00:32 2018
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From: IETF Secretariat <ietf-secretariat-reply@ietf.org>
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Subject: [Rift] The RIFT WG has placed draft-przygienda-rift in state "Candidate for WG Adoption"
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The RIFT WG has placed draft-przygienda-rift in state
Candidate for WG Adoption (entered by Jeff Tantsura)

The document is available at
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-przygienda-rift/


From nobody Tue Apr 10 08:50:53 2018
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From: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 08:49:41 -0700
Message-ID: <CA+wi2hMkDsxUFF1OHuwBD-h2roA=SoJbfvO00XRenNBi=16UdA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
Cc: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>, "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/C050fb2Btyclb5N6Tw4iDNwGJf8>
Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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>From JNPR's side all relevant IPR has been disclosed and I'm not aware of
any further undisclosed IPR on the document ...

thanks

--- tony

On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 12:21 PM, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi RIFT,
>
>
>
> Request for WG adoption of draft-przygienda-rift-05.
>
>
>
> The authors have requested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as
> the working group documents.
>
> Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 2018.
>
>
>
> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
> this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The
> response needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not
> advance to the next stage until a response has been received from each
> author and each individual that has contributed to the document.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff & Jeffrey
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rift mailing list
> Rift@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>
>

--f403045c4434dfe6390569807aa6
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>From JNPR&#39;s side all relevant IPR has been d=
isclosed and I&#39;m not aware of any further undisclosed IPR on the docume=
nt ... <br><br></div>thanks <br><br></div>--- tony <br></div><div class=3D"=
gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 12:21 P=
M, Jeff Tantsura <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmai=
l.com" target=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><=
blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px=
 #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72" lang=
=3D"EN-US"><div class=3D"m_-1940154871942431269WordSection1"><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Hi RIFT,<u></u><u></u></span></p>=
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u=
></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Request=
 for WG adoption of draft-przygienda-rift-05.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></sp=
an></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">The authors =
have requested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as the working gr=
oup documents.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 20=
18.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size=
:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt">If you are listed as a document author or contributor=
 please respond to this email stating of whether or not you are aware of an=
y relevant IPR. The response needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The=
 document will not advance to the next stage until a response has been rece=
ived from each author and each individual that has contributed to the docum=
ent.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-siz=
e:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=
=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal=
"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Jeff &amp; Jeffrey<u></u><u></u></span><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u>=
</u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div></div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org">Rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/rift</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

--f403045c4434dfe6390569807aa6--


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From: Alia Atlas <akatlas@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Apr 2018 14:06:38 -0400
Message-ID: <CAG4d1rdzUkzL21amiJ69ZE2S71Mn59MQ50uqJAUZA=sLGW6xpw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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--0000000000005133de05698262f5
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As a co-author, of course I support.
To my knowledge, the existing IPR has been filed and I know of none that is
not.

Regards,
Alia

On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 3:21 PM, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi RIFT,
>
>
>
> Request for WG adoption of draft-przygienda-rift-05.
>
>
>
> The authors have requested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as
> the working group documents.
>
> Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 2018.
>
>
>
> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
> this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The
> response needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not
> advance to the next stage until a response has been received from each
> author and each individual that has contributed to the document.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff & Jeffrey
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rift mailing list
> Rift@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>
>

--0000000000005133de05698262f5
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<div dir=3D"ltr">As a co-author, of course I support.<div>To my knowledge, =
the existing IPR has been filed and I know of none that is not.</div><div><=
br></div><div>Regards,</div><div>Alia</div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"=
><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 3:21 PM, Jeff Tants=
ura <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=
=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote cl=
ass=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;p=
adding-left:1ex"><div lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72"><di=
v class=3D"m_4873266021866433982WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span =
style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Hi RIFT,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"Mso=
Normal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Request for WG adoptio=
n of draft-przygienda-rift-05.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">The authors have requested =
the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as the working group documents.<=
u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.=
0pt">Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 2018.<u></u><u></u>=
</span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.=
0pt">If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond t=
o this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. T=
he response needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will no=
t advance to the next stage until a response has been received from each au=
thor and each individual that has contributed to the document.<u></u><u></u=
></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.=
0pt">Thanks,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"=
font-size:11.0pt">Jeff &amp; Jeffrey<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"Ms=
oNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p><p=
 class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div></div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
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<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

--0000000000005133de05698262f5--


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From: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>
To: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
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Thread-Topic: Virtual interim meeting
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Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 12:43:32 +0000
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/5AWBE8ALCHzZ1j8kH6G4lAVHINM>
Subject: [Rift] Virtual interim meeting
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From: John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>
To: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
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Thread-Topic: WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/0Sh9H8PXsjS60f1kElzLVLC7VNA>
Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
To: John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
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Thread-Topic: WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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From: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 08:42:37 -0700
Message-ID: <CA+wi2hMpKxoRR7WHGh-Nm3Kz8M-1DqbgAxDqi9Gh3HOkZ4wSDA@mail.gmail.com>
To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
Cc: "6lo@ietf.org" <6lo@ietf.org>, Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>,  "draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org>, rift@ietf.org
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/BbFPdgbcYMspE7j3LU64TPoyyx0>
Subject: Re: [Rift] instance ID in rfc6775 update
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--94eb2c1cd46c431f1e0569a89dfc
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Yes, we do have discussions over RIFT where it seems a multi-plane or if
you want multi-topology concept as introduced originally in RFC5120 would
be helpful. RIFT can be very easily instantiated on multiple ports and with
that has no problem to run multi-instance/topology but the dataplane
correlation from the leaf would be very helpful. RIFT leaf implementation
is very "thin" and with that architectures that don't rely on either LOC-ID
or BGP overlays become feasible, albeit obviously not @ the scale something
like 2547bis or EVPN can operate.

So in short, I think I support this suggestion fully.

For the practical encoding, I suggest to choose TID=3D0 as "default
topology", i.e. "what you do today" and avoid an I bit which will cause an
encoding corner case if it's not set but TID<>0?

>From experience, 8 bits is just about enough but 12 bits are plenty for #
of topologies people sometimes think they need on building network
architectures ...

my 2c ...

--- tony

On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:23 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <
pthubert@cisco.com> wrote:

> Hi again
>
>
>
> A proposed text would be like:
>
>
>
>
>
>    0                   1                   2                   3
>
>    0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |     Type      |     Length    |    Status     |    Opaque     |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |  Rsvd | I |R|T|     TID       |     Registration Lifetime     |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |                                                               |
>
> ...             Registration Ownership Verifier                 ...
>
>   |                                                               |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
> =E2=80=A6.
>
>
>
> Opaque:
>
>        One-byte Opaque field; this is an octet that ND does not need to
> process
>
>        but that the 6LN wishes the 6LR to pass transparently to another
> process.
>
> I:
>
>        Two-bit Integer: A value of zero indicates that the Opaque field
> carries
>
>        an abstract index that is used to decide in which routing topology
> the
>
>        address is expected to be injected. In that case, the Opaque field
> is
>
>        passed to a routing process with the indication that this is a
> topology
>
>        information and the value of 0 indicates default. All other values
> are
>
>        reserved.
>
>
>
>
>
> Does that work?
>
>
>
> Pascal
>
>
>
> *From:* Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
> *Sent:* jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:40
> *To:* 6lo@ietf.org
> *Cc:* Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>; Tony Przygienda <
> tonysietf@gmail.com>; draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org
> *Subject:* instance ID in rfc6775 update
>
>
>
> Dear all :
>
>
>
> During a conversation on the RIFT protocol it appeared that there are use
> cases in RIFT to support host mobility with rfc6775-update.
>
> There is a caveat, though, which is in fact common with RPL. Both cases
> need a concept of multi topology routing.
>
> In the case of RPL, the topology is indexed by an instance ID. In the cas=
e
> of RIFT, there is a need for an index to a RIB, so one octet is probably
> enough.
>
> A suggestion is thus to use the reserved octet in the ARO to carry an
> instance ID, and use a bit to signal that this is what that field does, i=
n
> case there is a need later to overload it with something else.
>
>
>
> I understand this is coming late in the process; but then there is no
> logic associated to the change, this is just passing on an additional
> information that is useful for more than one candidate protocol.
>
>
>
> Please let me know if there is an issue pursuing this. If there is no
> opposition, my plan it currently to add this in rev-19.
>
>
>
> All the best,
>
>
>
> Pascal
>

--94eb2c1cd46c431f1e0569a89dfc
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>Yes, we do have discussions over RIFT where it s=
eems a multi-plane or if you want multi-topology concept as introduced orig=
inally in RFC5120 would be helpful. RIFT can be very easily instantiated on=
 multiple ports and with that has no problem to run multi-instance/topology=
 but the dataplane correlation from the leaf would be very helpful. RIFT le=
af implementation is very &quot;thin&quot; and with that architectures that=
 don&#39;t rely on either LOC-ID or BGP overlays become feasible, albeit ob=
viously not @ the scale something like 2547bis or EVPN can operate. <br><br=
></div>So in short, I think I support this suggestion fully. <br></div><div=
><br>For the practical encoding, I suggest to choose TID=3D0 as &quot;defau=
lt topology&quot;, i.e. &quot;what you do today&quot; and avoid an I bit wh=
ich will cause an encoding corner case if it&#39;s not set but TID&lt;&gt;0=
? <br><br></div><div>From experience, 8 bits is just about enough but 12 bi=
ts are plenty for # of topologies people sometimes think they need on build=
ing network architectures ... <br></div><div><br></div><div>my 2c ... <br><=
/div><div><br></div>--- tony <br><div><div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><=
div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:23 AM, Pascal Thubert (=
pthubert) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.com" targe=
t=3D"_blank">pthubert@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=
=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padd=
ing-left:1ex">





<div link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"m_-66935921116733213WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Hi again <u></u><u></u=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">A proposed text would =
be like:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 =
1<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Type=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Status=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Opaque=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<=
u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0 Rsvd | I |R|T|=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 TID=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Registration Lifetime=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
...=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 Registration Ownership Verifier=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ...<u></u><u></u></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=E2=80=A6.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
<u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
Opaque:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 One-byte Opaque field; this is an octe=
t that ND does not need to process<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 but that the 6LN wishes the 6LR to pas=
s transparently to another process.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
I:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Two-bit Integer: A value of zero indic=
ates that the Opaque field carries<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0an abstract index that is used to deci=
de in which routing topology the
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0address is expected to be injecte=
d. In that case, the Opaque field is<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 passed to a routing process with the i=
ndication that this is a topology<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 information and the value of 0 indicat=
es default. All other values are<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0reserved.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Does that work?<u></u>=
<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Pascal<u></u><u></u></=
span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></=
span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <br>
<b>Sent:</b> jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:40<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:6lo@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">6lo@ietf.org</=
a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Yan Filyurin &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yanf787@gmail.com" target=3D"=
_blank">yanf787@gmail.com</a>&gt;; Tony Przygienda &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:to=
nysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;; <a href=
=3D"mailto:draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-=
ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@<wbr>ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> instance ID in rfc6775 update<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div><div><div class=3D"h5">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR">Dear all=C2=A0:<u></u><u></u></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">During a conversation on the RIFT protocol it appear=
ed that there are use cases in RIFT to support host mobility with rfc6775-u=
pdate.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">There is a caveat, though, which is in fact common w=
ith RPL. Both cases need a concept of multi topology routing.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the case of RPL, the topology is indexed by an in=
stance ID. In the case of RIFT, there is a need for an index to a RIB, so o=
ne octet is probably enough.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">A suggestion is thus to use the reserved octet in th=
e ARO to carry an instance ID, and use a bit to signal that this is what th=
at field does, in case there is a need later to overload it with something =
else.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I understand this is coming late in the process; but=
 then there is no logic associated to the change, this is just passing on a=
n additional information that is useful for more than one candidate protoco=
l.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Please let me know if there is an issue pursuing thi=
s. If there is no opposition, my plan it currently to add this in rev-19.<u=
></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">All the best,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Pascal<u></u><u></u></p>
</div></div></div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></div>

--94eb2c1cd46c431f1e0569a89dfc--


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From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
To: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
CC: "6lo@ietf.org" <6lo@ietf.org>, Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>, "draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: instance ID in rfc6775 update
Thread-Index: AdPSYqpTuA/gdfvGSVe3wCALBC+A3gABgmjAAA2Fq4AACmizkA==
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 15:49:31 +0000
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Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 09:04:33 -0700
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To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
Cc: "6lo@ietf.org" <6lo@ietf.org>, Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>,  "draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Rift] instance ID in rfc6775 update
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OK, I read too fast then ;-)  The opaque is what we call TID then (topology
ID, I observe that we ran out of good 3 letter acronyms years ago ;-)

agreed with all ...

0 for default topology helps obviously because you say "0 on send, ignore
on receive" on a good spec so even if the other side is not aware of the
extension, good chance they'll send you 0 which you interpret as "hey,
default stuff" and life goes on in default topology

--- tony

On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 8:49 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <
pthubert@cisco.com> wrote:

> Hello Tony
>
>
>
> I agree that 0 is default, this helps for backward compatibility as well.
>
> Note that the field is not the TID (T is for transaction). I=E2=80=99m pr=
oposing
> to add a new Opaque field since what is carried is opaque to ND.
>
> New text would say:
>
>
>
>        A new Opaque field is introduced to carry opaque information in
> case the
>
>        registration is relayed to another process, e.g.; injected in a
> routing
>
>        protocol.
>
>        A new "I" field provides an abstract type for the opaque
> information, and
>
>        from which the 6LN derives to which other process the opaque is
> expected
>
>        to be passed.
>
>        A value of Zero for I indicates an abstract topological informatio=
n
> to
>
>        be passed to a routing process if the registration is
> redistributed.
>
>        In that case, a value of Zero for the Opaque field is
> backward-compatible
>
>        with the reserved fields that are overloaded, and the meaning is t=
o
> use
>
>        the default topology.
>
>
>
> 8  bits is what=E2=80=99s left in the option that we need to keep backwar=
ds
> compatible.
>
>
>
>    0                   1                   2                   3
>
>    0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |     Type      |     Length    |    Status     |    Opaque     |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |  Rsvd | I |R|T|     TID       |     Registration Lifetime     |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |                                                               |
>
> ...             Registration Ownership Verifier                 ...
>
>   |                                                               |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
> What do you think?
>
>
>
> Pascal
>
>
>
> *From:* Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
> *Sent:* jeudi 12 avril 2018 17:43
> *To:* Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert@cisco.com>
> *Cc:* 6lo@ietf.org; Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>;
> draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org; rift@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: instance ID in rfc6775 update
>
>
>
> Yes, we do have discussions over RIFT where it seems a multi-plane or if
> you want multi-topology concept as introduced originally in RFC5120 would
> be helpful. RIFT can be very easily instantiated on multiple ports and wi=
th
> that has no problem to run multi-instance/topology but the dataplane
> correlation from the leaf would be very helpful. RIFT leaf implementation
> is very "thin" and with that architectures that don't rely on either LOC-=
ID
> or BGP overlays become feasible, albeit obviously not @ the scale somethi=
ng
> like 2547bis or EVPN can operate.
>
> So in short, I think I support this suggestion fully.
>
>
> For the practical encoding, I suggest to choose TID=3D0 as "default
> topology", i.e. "what you do today" and avoid an I bit which will cause a=
n
> encoding corner case if it's not set but TID<>0?
>
> From experience, 8 bits is just about enough but 12 bits are plenty for #
> of topologies people sometimes think they need on building network
> architectures ...
>
>
>
> my 2c ...
>
>
>
> --- tony
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:23 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <
> pthubert@cisco.com> wrote:
>
> Hi again
>
>
>
> A proposed text would be like:
>
>
>
>
>
>    0                   1                   2                   3
>
>    0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |     Type      |     Length    |    Status     |    Opaque     |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |  Rsvd | I |R|T|     TID       |     Registration Lifetime     |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>   |                                                               |
>
> ...             Registration Ownership Verifier                 ...
>
>   |                                                               |
>
>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>
>
>
> =E2=80=A6.
>
>
>
> Opaque:
>
>        One-byte Opaque field; this is an octet that ND does not need to
> process
>
>        but that the 6LN wishes the 6LR to pass transparently to another
> process.
>
> I:
>
>        Two-bit Integer: A value of zero indicates that the Opaque field
> carries
>
>        an abstract index that is used to decide in which routing topology
> the
>
>        address is expected to be injected. In that case, the Opaque field
> is
>
>        passed to a routing process with the indication that this is a
> topology
>
>        information and the value of 0 indicates default. All other values
> are
>
>        reserved.
>
>
>
>
>
> Does that work?
>
>
>
> Pascal
>
>
>
> *From:* Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
> *Sent:* jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:40
> *To:* 6lo@ietf.org
> *Cc:* Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>; Tony Przygienda <
> tonysietf@gmail.com>; draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org
> *Subject:* instance ID in rfc6775 update
>
>
>
> Dear all :
>
>
>
> During a conversation on the RIFT protocol it appeared that there are use
> cases in RIFT to support host mobility with rfc6775-update.
>
> There is a caveat, though, which is in fact common with RPL. Both cases
> need a concept of multi topology routing.
>
> In the case of RPL, the topology is indexed by an instance ID. In the cas=
e
> of RIFT, there is a need for an index to a RIB, so one octet is probably
> enough.
>
> A suggestion is thus to use the reserved octet in the ARO to carry an
> instance ID, and use a bit to signal that this is what that field does, i=
n
> case there is a need later to overload it with something else.
>
>
>
> I understand this is coming late in the process; but then there is no
> logic associated to the change, this is just passing on an additional
> information that is useful for more than one candidate protocol.
>
>
>
> Please let me know if there is an issue pursuing this. If there is no
> opposition, my plan it currently to add this in rev-19.
>
>
>
> All the best,
>
>
>
> Pascal
>
>
>

--94eb2c197970b419750569a8ebcb
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>OK, I read too fast then ;-)=C2=A0 The opaq=
ue is what we call TID then (topology ID, I observe that we ran out of good=
 3 letter acronyms years ago ;-)<br><br></div>agreed with all ... <br><br><=
/div>0 for default topology helps obviously because you say &quot;0 on send=
, ignore on receive&quot; on a good spec so even if the other side is not a=
ware of the extension, good chance they&#39;ll send you 0 which you interpr=
et as &quot;hey, default stuff&quot; and life goes on in default topology <=
br><br></div>--- tony <br><div><div><div><div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><b=
r><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 8:49 AM, Pascal Thuber=
t (pthubert) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.com" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">pthubert@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote cla=
ss=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;pa=
dding-left:1ex">





<div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"m_-4982425300350964174WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d" lang=3D"FR">Hello Tony<u></u><u></u><=
/span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d" lang=3D"FR"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I agree that 0 is default, this helps=
 for backward compatibility as well.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Note that the field is not the TID (T=
 is for transaction). I=E2=80=99m proposing to add a new Opaque field since=
 what is carried is opaque to ND.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">New text would say:<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 A new Opaque field is=
 introduced to carry opaque information in case the<u></u><u></u></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 registration is relay=
ed to another process, e.g.; injected in a routing
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0protocol.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0A new &quot;I&qu=
ot; field provides an abstract type for the opaque information, and<u></u><=
u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 from which the 6LN de=
rives to which other process the opaque is expected<u></u><u></u></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 to be passed.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0A value of Zero =
for I indicates an abstract topological information to<u></u><u></u></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 be passed to a routin=
g process if the registration is redistributed.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0In that case, a =
value of Zero for the Opaque field is backward-compatible<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 with the reserved fie=
lds that are overloaded, and the meaning is to use<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 the default topology.=
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">8=C2=A0 bits is what=E2=80=99s left i=
n the option that we need to keep backwards compatible.<u></u><u></u></span=
></p><span class=3D"">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3<u></u><u>=
</u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2=
 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Type=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 Status=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Opaque=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 |=C2=A0 Rsvd | I |R|T|=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 TID=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Registration=
 Lifetime=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">...=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Registration Ownership Verifier=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0...=
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</span><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">What do you think?<u></u><u></=
u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Pascal<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;=
font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif"> Tony Przygienda &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:tonysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> jeudi 12 avril 2018 17:43<br>
<b>To:</b> Pascal Thubert (pthubert) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.c=
om" target=3D"_blank">pthubert@cisco.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:6lo@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">6lo@ietf.org</=
a>; Yan Filyurin &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yanf787@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank"=
>yanf787@gmail.com</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update=
@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@<wbr>ietf.org</a=
>; <a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: instance ID in rfc6775 update<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div><div><div class=3D"h5">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Yes, we do have discu=
ssions over RIFT where it seems a multi-plane or if you want multi-topology=
 concept as introduced originally in RFC5120 would be helpful. RIFT can be =
very easily instantiated on multiple
 ports and with that has no problem to run multi-instance/topology but the =
dataplane correlation from the leaf would be very helpful. RIFT leaf implem=
entation is very &quot;thin&quot; and with that architectures that don&#39;=
t rely on either LOC-ID or BGP overlays become
 feasible, albeit obviously not @ the scale something like 2547bis or EVPN =
can operate.
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">So in short, I think I support this suggestion fully=
. <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
For the practical encoding, I suggest to choose TID=3D0 as &quot;default to=
pology&quot;, i.e. &quot;what you do today&quot; and avoid an I bit which w=
ill cause an encoding corner case if it&#39;s not set but TID&lt;&gt;0?
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">From experience, 8 bits is just about enough but 12 =
bits are plenty for # of topologies people sometimes think they need on bui=
lding network architectures ...
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">my 2c ... <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">--- tony <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:23 AM, Pascal Thubert (pth=
ubert) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">pthubert=
@cisco.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Hi again
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">A proposed text would =
be like:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 =
1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Type=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Status=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Opaque=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<=
/span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0 Rsvd | I |R|T|=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 TID=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Registration Lifetime=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
...=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 Registration Ownership Verifier=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ...</span><u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=E2=80=A6.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
Opaque:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 One-byte Opaque field; this is an octe=
t that ND does not need to process</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 but that the 6LN wishes the 6LR to pas=
s transparently to another process.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
I:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Two-bit Integer: A value of zero indic=
ates that the Opaque field carries</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0an abstract index that is used to deci=
de in which routing topology the
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0address is expected to be injecte=
d. In that case, the Opaque field is</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 passed to a routing process with the i=
ndication that this is a topology</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 information and the value of 0 indicat=
es default. All other values are</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0reserved.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Does that work?</span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Pascal</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:40<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:6lo@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">6lo@ietf.org</=
a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Yan Filyurin &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yanf787@gmail.com" target=3D"=
_blank">yanf787@gmail.com</a>&gt;; Tony Przygienda &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:to=
nysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@<wbr>ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> instance ID in rfc6775 update<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR">Dear all=C2=A0:</span><u></u><u></=
u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">During a conversation on the RIFT protocol it appear=
ed that there are use cases in RIFT to support host mobility with rfc6775-u=
pdate.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">There is a caveat, though, which is in fact common w=
ith RPL. Both cases need a concept of multi topology routing.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the case of RPL, the topology is indexed by an in=
stance ID. In the case of RIFT, there is a need for an index to a RIB, so o=
ne octet is probably enough.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">A suggestion is thus to use the reserved octet in th=
e ARO to carry an instance ID, and use a bit to signal that this is what th=
at field does, in case there is a need later to overload
 it with something else.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I understand this is coming late in the process; but=
 then there is no logic associated to the change, this is just passing on a=
n additional information that is useful for more than
 one candidate protocol.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Please let me know if there is an issue pursuing thi=
s. If there is no opposition, my plan it currently to add this in rev-19.<u=
></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">All the best,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Pascal<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div></div></div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--94eb2c197970b419750569a8ebcb--


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To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
Cc: John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>, "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
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--f403045c8a3a79cc950569a90a36
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
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ok, chairs, so what's the policy, if in doubt disclose?

I don't see any danger if, as Pascal says, it has been all properly put out
for 6550 anyway ...

I read 6550 years ago and thought it a clever solution to a profitable,
highly constrained routing problem but I never thought that RIFT somehow
relates to it (except having had the realization reading RPL that it's ok
to not do a generic graph for everything I remember). I'm having fun
talking to Pascal now and discovering that we came from opposite side of
the engineering spectrum (RPL for overly meshed topology  that it prunues
and low speed/power and RIFT from pre-wired topology variants @ very high
speed & scalability) and the same branches of graph theory were attracting
both of us to solve the problems ;-)

thanks

--- tony

On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 6:53 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <
pthubert@cisco.com> wrote:

>
>
> IANAL:
>
> Though it is really far-fetched, there may be a conceptual inheritance
> from IPR disclosed by Cisco related to RPL (RFC 6550) for the concept of
> north/south split.
>
> Even so, that IPR was declared to the IETF and RAND terms were announced
> at the time.
>
>
>
> This being said:
>
> I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR.
>
>
>
> All the best;
>
>
>
> Pascal
>
>
>
> *From:* Rift <rift-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of *John E Drake
> *Sent:* jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:35
> *To:* Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>; rift@ietf.org
> *Cc:* rift-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
>
>
>
> I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR
>
>
>
> Yours Irrespectively,
>
>
>
> John
>
>
>
> *From:* Rift <rift-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of *Jeff Tantsura
> *Sent:* Friday, March 30, 2018 3:22 PM
> *To:* rift@ietf.org
> *Cc:* rift-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
>
>
>
> Hi RIFT,
>
>
>
> Request for WG adoption of draft-przygienda-rift-05.
>
>
>
> The authors have requested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as
> the working group documents.
>
> Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 2018.
>
>
>
> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
> this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. T=
he
> response needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not
> advance to the next stage until a response has been received from each
> author and each individual that has contributed to the document.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff & Jeffrey
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rift mailing list
> Rift@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>
>

--f403045c8a3a79cc950569a90a36
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>ok, chairs, so what&#39;s the policy, if in doub=
t disclose? <br><br></div><div>I don&#39;t see any danger if, as Pascal say=
s, it has been all properly put out for 6550 anyway ... <br><br></div><div>=
I read 6550 years ago and thought it a clever solution to a profitable, hig=
hly constrained routing problem but I never thought that RIFT somehow relat=
es to it (except having had the realization reading RPL that it&#39;s ok to=
 not do a generic graph for everything I remember). I&#39;m having fun talk=
ing to Pascal now and discovering that we came from opposite side of the en=
gineering spectrum (RPL for overly meshed topology=C2=A0 that it prunues an=
d low speed/power and RIFT from pre-wired topology variants @ very high spe=
ed &amp; scalability) and the same branches of graph theory were attracting=
 both of us to solve the problems ;-) <br></div><div><br></div>thanks <br><=
br></div>--- tony <br></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gm=
ail_quote">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 6:53 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <span=
 dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">pt=
hubert@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote"=
 style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"m_-1174719537194614173WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">IANAL=
:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">Thoug=
h it is really far-fetched, there may be a conceptual inheritance from IPR =
disclosed by Cisco related to RPL (RFC 6550) for the concept of north/south=
 split.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">Even =
so, that IPR was declared to the IETF and RAND terms were announced at the =
time.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">This =
being said:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">I=E2=
=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">All t=
he best;<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">Pasca=
l<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b>=
<span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"> Rift &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rift-bounces@i=
etf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>John E Drake<br>
<b>Sent:</b> jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:35<br>
<b>To:</b> Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" tar=
get=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf=
.org" target=3D"_blank">rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:rift-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift-c=
hairs@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05<u>=
</u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div><div><div class=3D"h5">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">I=E2=
=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">Yours=
 Irrespectively,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d">John<=
u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f497d"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">From:</span></b>=
<span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"> Rift &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rift-bounces@i=
etf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift-bounces@ietf.org</a>&gt;
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Jeff Tantsura<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 30, 2018 3:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift@ietf.org=
</a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:rift-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift-c=
hairs@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05<u></u>=
<u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Hi RIFT,<u></u><u><=
/u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Request for WG adop=
tion of draft-przygienda-rift-05.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">The authors have re=
quested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as the working group doc=
uments.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Please indicate sup=
port or no-support by April 15, 2018.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">If you are listed a=
s a document author or contributor please respond to this email stating of =
whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The response needs to be =
sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document
 will not advance to the next stage until a response has been received from=
 each author and each individual that has contributed to the document.<u></=
u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Thanks,<u></u><u></=
u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Jeff &amp; Jeffrey<=
u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u=
></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div></div></div>
</div>
</div>

<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org">Rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/rift</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

--f403045c8a3a79cc950569a90a36--


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Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 18:16:58 +0200
From: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
To: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>, "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
CC: John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>, "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
Message-ID: <DD574BA8-65C8-4855-BB06-4A41A5A9025F@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
References: <D4839F07-99C0-4009-B444-B54334A019FB@gmail.com> <DM5PR0501MB3831A0FF24B5FE6A8741A6BAC7BC0@DM5PR0501MB3831.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <8892bca2bacc47e6964c799be1acf8a1@XCH-RCD-001.cisco.com> <CA+wi2hOA=EJWO45P-pvMXzW1MNsJiRFejGMvN+FqvVyVTYJgwA@mail.gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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--B_3606401818_695322562
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	charset="UTF-8"
Content-transfer-encoding: quoted-printable

I think you should talk to J IPR person and ask for an assessment, I wouldn=
=E2=80=99t disclose before=20

=20

Cheers,

Jeff

From: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Date: Thursday, April 12, 2018 at 18:13
To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
Cc: John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.c=
om>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>, "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ie=
tf.org>
Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05

=20

ok, chairs, so what's the policy, if in doubt disclose?=20

I don't see any danger if, as Pascal says, it has been all properly put out=
 for 6550 anyway ...=20

I read 6550 years ago and thought it a clever solution to a profitable, hig=
hly constrained routing problem but I never thought that RIFT somehow relate=
s to it (except having had the realization reading RPL that it's ok to not d=
o a generic graph for everything I remember). I'm having fun talking to Pasc=
al now and discovering that we came from opposite side of the engineering sp=
ectrum (RPL for overly meshed topology  that it prunues and low speed/power =
and RIFT from pre-wired topology variants @ very high speed & scalability) a=
nd the same branches of graph theory were attracting both of us to solve the=
 problems ;-)=20

=20

thanks=20

--- tony=20

=20

On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 6:53 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert@cisco.=
com> wrote:

=20

IANAL:

Though it is really far-fetched, there may be a conceptual inheritance from=
 IPR disclosed by Cisco related to RPL (RFC 6550) for the concept of north/s=
outh split.=20

Even so, that IPR was declared to the IETF and RAND terms were announced at=
 the time.

=20

This being said:

I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR.

=20

All the best;

=20

Pascal

=20

From: Rift <rift-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of John E Drake
Sent: jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:35
To: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>; rift@ietf.org
Cc: rift-chairs@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05

=20

I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR

=20

Yours Irrespectively,

=20

John

=20

From: Rift <rift-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Jeff Tantsura
Sent: Friday, March 30, 2018 3:22 PM
To: rift@ietf.org
Cc: rift-chairs@ietf.org
Subject: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05

=20

Hi RIFT,

=20

Request for WG adoption of draft-przygienda-rift-05.

=20

The authors have requested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as th=
e working group documents.

Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 2018.

=20

If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to thi=
s email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The res=
ponse needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not advan=
ce to the next stage until a response has been received from each author and=
 each individual that has contributed to the document.

=20

Thanks,

Jeff & Jeffrey

=20

=20


_______________________________________________
Rift mailing list
Rift@ietf.org
https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift

=20


--B_3606401818_695322562
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<html xmlns:o=3D"urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w=3D"urn:schema=
s-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m=3D"http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/20=
04/12/omml" xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=3DC=
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--></style></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSe=
ction1><p class=3DMsoNormal>I think you should talk to J IPR person and ask fo=
r an assessment, I wouldn=E2=80=99t disclose before <o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNor=
mal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:black'>C=
heers,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:blac=
k'>Jeff</span><o:p></o:p></p><div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4D=
F 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'font-s=
ize:12.0pt;color:black'>From: </span></b><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color=
:black'>Tony Przygienda &lt;tonysietf@gmail.com&gt;<br><b>Date: </b>Thursday=
, April 12, 2018 at 18:13<br><b>To: </b>&quot;Pascal Thubert (pthubert)&quot=
; &lt;pthubert@cisco.com&gt;<br><b>Cc: </b>John E Drake &lt;jdrake@juniper.n=
et&gt;, Jeff Tantsura &lt;jefftant.ietf@gmail.com&gt;, &quot;rift@ietf.org&q=
uot; &lt;rift@ietf.org&gt;, &quot;rift-chairs@ietf.org&quot; &lt;rift-chairs=
@ietf.org&gt;<br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przyg=
ienda-rift-05<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;=
</o:p></p></div><div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0p=
t'><a name=3D"_MailOriginalBody">ok, chairs, so what's the policy, if in doubt=
 disclose? <o:p></o:p></a></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bo=
ttom:12.0pt'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>I don't see any da=
nger if, as Pascal says, it has been all properly put out for 6550 anyway ..=
. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-bookm=
ark:_MailOriginalBody'>I read 6550 years ago and thought it a clever solutio=
n to a profitable, highly constrained routing problem but I never thought th=
at RIFT somehow relates to it (except having had the realization reading RPL=
 that it's ok to not do a generic graph for everything I remember). I'm havi=
ng fun talking to Pascal now and discovering that we came from opposite side=
 of the engineering spectrum (RPL for overly meshed topology&nbsp; that it p=
runues and low speed/power and RIFT from pre-wired topology variants @ very =
high speed &amp; scalability) and the same branches of graph theory were att=
racting both of us to solve the problems ;-) <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><di=
v><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><o:p>&nbsp=
;</o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-bottom:12.0pt'><spa=
n style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>thanks <o:p></o:p></span></p></div>=
<p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>--- tony <o:=
p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_=
MailOriginalBody'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span =
style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 6:53 AM, Pasc=
al Thubert (pthubert) &lt;</span><a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.com" target=3D=
"_blank"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>pthubert@cisco.com</sp=
an><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'></span></a><span style=3D'mso-=
bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&gt; wrote:<o:p></o:p></span></p><blockquote sty=
le=3D'border:none;border-left:solid #CCCCCC 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;ma=
rgin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0in'><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-ma=
rgin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_Mai=
lOriginalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></span></=
p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:au=
to'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'=
>IANAL:</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top=
-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOrigina=
lBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Though it is really far-fetched, there ma=
y be a conceptual inheritance from IPR disclosed by Cisco related to RPL (RF=
C 6550) for the concept of north/south split. </span><o:p></o:p></span></p><=
p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'=
><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Ev=
en so, that IPR was declared to the IETF and RAND terms were announced at th=
e time.</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top=
-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOrigina=
lBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p cla=
ss=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><spa=
n style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>This be=
ing said:</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-t=
op-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOrigi=
nalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR.=
</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:au=
to;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>=
<span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoN=
ormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=
=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>All the best;<=
/span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:aut=
o;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><=
span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNo=
rmal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D=
'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Pascal</span><o=
:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-ma=
rgin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span sty=
le=3D'color:#1F497D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><div style=3D'border:non=
e;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><div><div style=3D'b=
order:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p clas=
s=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span=
 style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><b>From:</b> Rift &lt;</span><a href=
=3D"mailto:rift-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_M=
ailOriginalBody'>rift-bounces@ietf.org</span><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_Mail=
OriginalBody'></span></a><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&gt; <=
b>On Behalf Of </b>John E Drake<br><b>Sent:</b> jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:35<br=
><b>To:</b> Jeff Tantsura &lt;</span><a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com=
" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>jefftant.ietf=
@gmail.com</span><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'></span></a><sp=
an style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&gt;; </span><a href=3D"mailto:rift@=
ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>rift@=
ietf.org</span><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'></span></a><span=
 style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><br><b>Cc:</b> </span><a href=3D"mailt=
o:rift-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOrigi=
nalBody'>rift-chairs@ietf.org</span><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalB=
ody'></span></a><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><br><b>Subject:=
</b> Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05<o:p></o:p></sp=
an></p></div></div><div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:au=
to;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>=
&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:aut=
o;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><=
span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR</span><o:p=
></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-marg=
in-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span style=
=3D'color:#1F497D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal =
style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-=
bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>Yours Irrespectively=
,</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:a=
uto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'=
><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMso=
Normal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span styl=
e=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><span style=3D'color:#1F497D'>John</span><o=
:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;=
mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><sp=
an style=3D'color:#1F497D'>&nbsp;</span><o:p></o:p></span></p><div style=3D'bord=
er:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt'><div><div st=
yle=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><=
p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'=
><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><b>From:</b> Rift &lt;</span><=
a href=3D"mailto:rift-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D'mso-bookm=
ark:_MailOriginalBody'>rift-bounces@ietf.org</span><span style=3D'mso-bookmark=
:_MailOriginalBody'></span></a><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>=
&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jeff Tantsura<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 30, 201=
8 3:22 PM<br><b>To:</b> </span><a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank=
"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>rift@ietf.org</span><span sty=
le=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'></span></a><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_Ma=
ilOriginalBody'><br><b>Cc:</b> </span><a href=3D"mailto:rift-chairs@ietf.org" =
target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>rift-chairs@iet=
f.org</span><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'></span></a><span st=
yle=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><br><b>Subject:</b> [Rift] WG adoption =
call for draft-przygienda-rift-05<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><p class=3D=
MsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span s=
tyle=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DM=
soNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span st=
yle=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>Hi RIFT,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3D=
MsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span s=
tyle=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DM=
soNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span st=
yle=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>Request for WG adoption of draft-przygi=
enda-rift-05.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-=
alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginal=
Body'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-a=
lt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalB=
ody'>The authors have requested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 a=
s the working group documents.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=
=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookm=
ark:_MailOriginalBody'>Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 20=
18.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;m=
so-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&nbs=
p;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;ms=
o-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>If yo=
u are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to this emai=
l stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The response =
needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not advance to =
the next stage until a response has been received from each author and each =
individual that has contributed to the document.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p cla=
ss=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><spa=
n style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></p><p clas=
s=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span=
 style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p clas=
s=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span=
 style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>Jeff &amp; Jeffrey<o:p></o:p></span>=
</p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:=
auto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:a=
uto'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></span></=
p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'margin-botto=
m:12.0pt'><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><br>_________________=
______________________________<br>Rift mailing list<br></span><a href=3D"mailt=
o:Rift@ietf.org"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'>Rift@ietf.org<=
/span><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'></span></a><span style=3D'm=
so-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><br></span><a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mail=
man/listinfo/rift" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBo=
dy'>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift</span><span style=3D'mso-bookma=
rk:_MailOriginalBody'></span></a><span style=3D'mso-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody=
'><o:p></o:p></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'm=
so-bookmark:_MailOriginalBody'><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></span></p></div></div></bod=
y></html>

--B_3606401818_695322562--



From nobody Thu Apr 12 09:37:40 2018
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References: <f2519dd3dd364bbfad2d51a4febde366@XCH-RCD-001.cisco.com> <aa1366d50d9f4b58895209d1fe577690@XCH-RCD-001.cisco.com> <CA+wi2hMpKxoRR7WHGh-Nm3Kz8M-1DqbgAxDqi9Gh3HOkZ4wSDA@mail.gmail.com> <dc95e20fdecf426fa3c31d11f1e7e6a4@XCH-RCD-001.cisco.com> <CA+wi2hObjvaQPCkkQkAmS3F5kpVEEj8Wv7uxE=mQJdY0vzFUNw@mail.gmail.com>
From: Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2018 12:37:33 -0400
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To: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Cc: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>, "6lo@ietf.org" <6lo@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Rift] instance ID in rfc6775 update
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12 bit field would be more than enough plus it maps to all the schemas for
802.1q based topology separation.  This started out as an enterprise
networking discussion and it would be at the right scale for anyone in that
business without complaints and an easy way to scale with 2547, EVPN or
even Loc/Id (LISP, ILA, etc) methods.  It may be an interesting question
for people thinking of RIFT in DC microservice use cases.  And whether
there is even an opportunity to look at integration framework between
those.

Yan



On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
wrote:

> OK, I read too fast then ;-)  The opaque is what we call TID then
> (topology ID, I observe that we ran out of good 3 letter acronyms years a=
go
> ;-)
>
> agreed with all ...
>
> 0 for default topology helps obviously because you say "0 on send, ignore
> on receive" on a good spec so even if the other side is not aware of the
> extension, good chance they'll send you 0 which you interpret as "hey,
> default stuff" and life goes on in default topology
>
> --- tony
>
> On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 8:49 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <
> pthubert@cisco.com> wrote:
>
>> Hello Tony
>>
>>
>>
>> I agree that 0 is default, this helps for backward compatibility as well=
.
>>
>> Note that the field is not the TID (T is for transaction). I=E2=80=99m p=
roposing
>> to add a new Opaque field since what is carried is opaque to ND.
>>
>> New text would say:
>>
>>
>>
>>        A new Opaque field is introduced to carry opaque information in
>> case the
>>
>>        registration is relayed to another process, e.g.; injected in a
>> routing
>>
>>        protocol.
>>
>>        A new "I" field provides an abstract type for the opaque
>> information, and
>>
>>        from which the 6LN derives to which other process the opaque is
>> expected
>>
>>        to be passed.
>>
>>        A value of Zero for I indicates an abstract topological
>> information to
>>
>>        be passed to a routing process if the registration is
>> redistributed.
>>
>>        In that case, a value of Zero for the Opaque field is
>> backward-compatible
>>
>>        with the reserved fields that are overloaded, and the meaning is
>> to use
>>
>>        the default topology.
>>
>>
>>
>> 8  bits is what=E2=80=99s left in the option that we need to keep backwa=
rds
>> compatible.
>>
>>
>>
>>    0                   1                   2                   3
>>
>>    0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>>
>>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>   |     Type      |     Length    |    Status     |    Opaque     |
>>
>>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>   |  Rsvd | I |R|T|     TID       |     Registration Lifetime     |
>>
>>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>   |                                                               |
>>
>> ...             Registration Ownership Verifier                 ...
>>
>>   |                                                               |
>>
>>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>>
>>
>> Pascal
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
>> *Sent:* jeudi 12 avril 2018 17:43
>> *To:* Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert@cisco.com>
>> *Cc:* 6lo@ietf.org; Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>;
>> draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org; rift@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* Re: instance ID in rfc6775 update
>>
>>
>>
>> Yes, we do have discussions over RIFT where it seems a multi-plane or if
>> you want multi-topology concept as introduced originally in RFC5120 woul=
d
>> be helpful. RIFT can be very easily instantiated on multiple ports and w=
ith
>> that has no problem to run multi-instance/topology but the dataplane
>> correlation from the leaf would be very helpful. RIFT leaf implementatio=
n
>> is very "thin" and with that architectures that don't rely on either LOC=
-ID
>> or BGP overlays become feasible, albeit obviously not @ the scale someth=
ing
>> like 2547bis or EVPN can operate.
>>
>> So in short, I think I support this suggestion fully.
>>
>>
>> For the practical encoding, I suggest to choose TID=3D0 as "default
>> topology", i.e. "what you do today" and avoid an I bit which will cause =
an
>> encoding corner case if it's not set but TID<>0?
>>
>> From experience, 8 bits is just about enough but 12 bits are plenty for =
#
>> of topologies people sometimes think they need on building network
>> architectures ...
>>
>>
>>
>> my 2c ...
>>
>>
>>
>> --- tony
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:23 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <
>> pthubert@cisco.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi again
>>
>>
>>
>> A proposed text would be like:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>    0                   1                   2                   3
>>
>>    0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1
>>
>>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>   |     Type      |     Length    |    Status     |    Opaque     |
>>
>>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>   |  Rsvd | I |R|T|     TID       |     Registration Lifetime     |
>>
>>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>   |                                                               |
>>
>> ...             Registration Ownership Verifier                 ...
>>
>>   |                                                               |
>>
>>   +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
>>
>>
>>
>> =E2=80=A6.
>>
>>
>>
>> Opaque:
>>
>>        One-byte Opaque field; this is an octet that ND does not need to
>> process
>>
>>        but that the 6LN wishes the 6LR to pass transparently to another
>> process.
>>
>> I:
>>
>>        Two-bit Integer: A value of zero indicates that the Opaque field
>> carries
>>
>>        an abstract index that is used to decide in which routing topolog=
y
>> the
>>
>>        address is expected to be injected. In that case, the Opaque fiel=
d
>> is
>>
>>        passed to a routing process with the indication that this is a
>> topology
>>
>>        information and the value of 0 indicates default. All other value=
s
>> are
>>
>>        reserved.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Does that work?
>>
>>
>>
>> Pascal
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
>> *Sent:* jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:40
>> *To:* 6lo@ietf.org
>> *Cc:* Yan Filyurin <yanf787@gmail.com>; Tony Przygienda <
>> tonysietf@gmail.com>; draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org
>> *Subject:* instance ID in rfc6775 update
>>
>>
>>
>> Dear all :
>>
>>
>>
>> During a conversation on the RIFT protocol it appeared that there are us=
e
>> cases in RIFT to support host mobility with rfc6775-update.
>>
>> There is a caveat, though, which is in fact common with RPL. Both cases
>> need a concept of multi topology routing.
>>
>> In the case of RPL, the topology is indexed by an instance ID. In the
>> case of RIFT, there is a need for an index to a RIB, so one octet is
>> probably enough.
>>
>> A suggestion is thus to use the reserved octet in the ARO to carry an
>> instance ID, and use a bit to signal that this is what that field does, =
in
>> case there is a need later to overload it with something else.
>>
>>
>>
>> I understand this is coming late in the process; but then there is no
>> logic associated to the change, this is just passing on an additional
>> information that is useful for more than one candidate protocol.
>>
>>
>>
>> Please let me know if there is an issue pursuing this. If there is no
>> opposition, my plan it currently to add this in rev-19.
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>>
>>
>> Pascal
>>
>>
>>
>
>

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Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
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<div dir=3D"ltr">12 bit field would be more than enough plus it maps to all=
 the schemas for 802.1q based topology separation.=C2=A0 This started out a=
s an enterprise networking discussion and it would be at the right scale fo=
r anyone in that business without complaints and an easy way to scale with =
2547, EVPN or even Loc/Id (LISP, ILA, etc) methods.=C2=A0 It may be an inte=
resting question for people thinking of RIFT in DC microservice use cases.=
=C2=A0 And whether there is even an opportunity to look at integration fram=
ework between those.=C2=A0<br><br>Yan<br><br><br></div><div class=3D"gmail_=
extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 12:04 PM, Ton=
y Przygienda <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:tonysietf@gmail.com" t=
arget=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote c=
lass=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;=
padding-left:1ex"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>OK, I read too fast then =
;-)=C2=A0 The opaque is what we call TID then (topology ID, I observe that =
we ran out of good 3 letter acronyms years ago ;-)<br><br></div>agreed with=
 all ... <br><br></div>0 for default topology helps obviously because you s=
ay &quot;0 on send, ignore on receive&quot; on a good spec so even if the o=
ther side is not aware of the extension, good chance they&#39;ll send you 0=
 which you interpret as &quot;hey, default stuff&quot; and life goes on in =
default topology <br><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><br></f=
ont></span></div><span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888">--- tony <b=
r></font></span><div><div class=3D"h5"><div><div><div><div><div class=3D"gm=
ail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 8:49 AM, =
Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@=
cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">pthubert@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><b=
lockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px =
#ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"m_6306846922569678581m_-4982425300350964174WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d" lang=3D"FR">Hello Tony<u></u><u></u><=
/span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d" lang=3D"FR"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></spa=
n></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I agree that 0 is default, this helps=
 for backward compatibility as well.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Note that the field is not the TID (T=
 is for transaction). I=E2=80=99m proposing to add a new Opaque field since=
 what is carried is opaque to ND.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">New text would say:<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 A new Opaque field is=
 introduced to carry opaque information in case the<u></u><u></u></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 registration is relay=
ed to another process, e.g.; injected in a routing
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0protocol.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0A new &quot;I&qu=
ot; field provides an abstract type for the opaque information, and<u></u><=
u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 from which the 6LN de=
rives to which other process the opaque is expected<u></u><u></u></span></p=
>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 to be passed.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0A value of Zero =
for I indicates an abstract topological information to<u></u><u></u></span>=
</p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 be passed to a routin=
g process if the registration is redistributed.
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0In that case, a =
value of Zero for the Opaque field is backward-compatible<u></u><u></u></sp=
an></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 with the reserved fie=
lds that are overloaded, and the meaning is to use<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 the default topology.=
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">8=C2=A0 bits is what=E2=80=99s left i=
n the option that we need to keep backwards compatible.<u></u><u></u></span=
></p><span>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3<u></u><u>=
</u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2=
 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Type=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 Status=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Opaque=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 |=C2=A0 Rsvd | I |R|T|=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 TID=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Registration=
 Lifetime=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">...=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Registration Ownership Verifier=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0...=
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Co=
urier New&quot;">=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-=
+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
</span><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&=
quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">What do you think?<u></u><u></=
u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">Pascal<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot=
;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif">From:</span></b><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;=
font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif"> Tony Przygienda &lt;<a href=3D=
"mailto:tonysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> jeudi 12 avril 2018 17:43<br>
<b>To:</b> Pascal Thubert (pthubert) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.c=
om" target=3D"_blank">pthubert@cisco.com</a>&gt;<br>
<b>Cc:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:6lo@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">6lo@ietf.org</=
a>; Yan Filyurin &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yanf787@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank"=
>yanf787@gmail.com</a>&gt;; <a href=3D"mailto:draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update=
@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@<wbr>ietf.org</a=
>; <a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: instance ID in rfc6775 update<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div><div><div class=3D"m_6306846922569678581h5">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt">Yes, we do have discu=
ssions over RIFT where it seems a multi-plane or if you want multi-topology=
 concept as introduced originally in RFC5120 would be helpful. RIFT can be =
very easily instantiated on multiple
 ports and with that has no problem to run multi-instance/topology but the =
dataplane correlation from the leaf would be very helpful. RIFT leaf implem=
entation is very &quot;thin&quot; and with that architectures that don&#39;=
t rely on either LOC-ID or BGP overlays become
 feasible, albeit obviously not @ the scale something like 2547bis or EVPN =
can operate.
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">So in short, I think I support this suggestion fully=
. <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><br>
For the practical encoding, I suggest to choose TID=3D0 as &quot;default to=
pology&quot;, i.e. &quot;what you do today&quot; and avoid an I bit which w=
ill cause an encoding corner case if it&#39;s not set but TID&lt;&gt;0?
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">From experience, 8 bits is just about enough but 12 =
bits are plenty for # of topologies people sometimes think they need on bui=
lding network architectures ...
<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">my 2c ... <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">--- tony <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 7:23 AM, Pascal Thubert (pth=
ubert) &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">pthubert=
@cisco.com</a>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
<blockquote style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0c=
m 0cm 0cm 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;margin-right:0cm">
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Hi again
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">A proposed text would =
be like:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 1=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0 2=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 3</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 0 =
1</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Type=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Length=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Status=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Opaque=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |<=
/span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0 Rsvd | I |R|T|=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 TID=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Registration Lifetime=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
...=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
 Registration Ownership Verifier=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 ...</span><u></u><u>=
</u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 |=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=
=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0<wbr>=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 |</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 +-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wbr>+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-<wb=
r>+-+-+</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=E2=80=A6.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
Opaque:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 One-byte Opaque field; this is an octe=
t that ND does not need to process</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 but that the 6LN wishes the 6LR to pas=
s transparently to another process.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
I:</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 Two-bit Integer: A value of zero indic=
ates that the Opaque field carries</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0 =C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0an abstract index that is used to deci=
de in which routing topology the
</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0address is expected to be injecte=
d. In that case, the Opaque field is</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 passed to a routing process with the i=
ndication that this is a topology</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 information and the value of 0 indicat=
es default. All other values are</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;Courier New&quot;">=
=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0=C2=A0 =C2=A0reserved.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Does that work?</span>=
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Pascal</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u=
></u></p>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm =
4.0pt">
<div>
<div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm =
0cm 0cm">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Pascal Thubert (pthubert)
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:40<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:6lo@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">6lo@ietf.org</=
a><br>
<b>Cc:</b> Yan Filyurin &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:yanf787@gmail.com" target=3D"=
_blank">yanf787@gmail.com</a>&gt;; Tony Przygienda &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:to=
nysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;;
<a href=3D"mailto:draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"=
>draft-ietf-6lo-rfc6775-update@<wbr>ietf.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> instance ID in rfc6775 update<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR">Dear all=C2=A0:</span><u></u><u></=
u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span lang=3D"FR">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">During a conversation on the RIFT protocol it appear=
ed that there are use cases in RIFT to support host mobility with rfc6775-u=
pdate.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">There is a caveat, though, which is in fact common w=
ith RPL. Both cases need a concept of multi topology routing.
<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">In the case of RPL, the topology is indexed by an in=
stance ID. In the case of RIFT, there is a need for an index to a RIB, so o=
ne octet is probably enough.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">A suggestion is thus to use the reserved octet in th=
e ARO to carry an instance ID, and use a bit to signal that this is what th=
at field does, in case there is a need later to overload
 it with something else.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">I understand this is coming late in the process; but=
 then there is no logic associated to the change, this is just passing on a=
n additional information that is useful for more than
 one candidate protocol.<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Please let me know if there is an issue pursuing thi=
s. If there is no opposition, my plan it currently to add this in rev-19.<u=
></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">All the best,<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Pascal<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div></div></div>
</div>
</div>

</blockquote></div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
</blockquote></div><br></div>

--001a114aca0263a5e70569a95fc9--


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--f403045c4434f01bd20569a9ea15
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On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 5:43 AM, Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang <zzhang@juniper.net
> wrote:

> Hi,
>
>
>
> We are scheduling a virtual interim meeting with two two-hour sessions on
> May 2nd and May 3rd respectively, with the following agenda items:
>
>
>
> - Q&A on certain topics to help people better understand RIFT
>
> - Update on certain topics (e.g flooding reduction)
>

* and bandwidth balancing

We can also touch on transitive disaggregation where we're in the middle of
figuring out the most elegant way to solve it/write it down but I assume
there will be no time for that.

thanks

-- tony

--f403045c4434f01bd20569a9ea15
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo=
te">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 5:43 AM, Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang <span dir=3D"l=
tr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:zzhang@juniper.net" target=3D"_blank">zzhang@juni=
per.net</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D=
"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">







<div bgcolor=3D"white" link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"m_-4483828927450371228m_-4931020349367776872WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f4e79">Hi,<u=
></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:#1f4e79"><u></=
u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"m_-4483828927450371228m_-4931020349367776872MsoPlainText"><span=
 style=3D"color:#1f4e79">We are scheduling
</span><span style=3D"color:#1f4e79">a virtual interim meeting with two two=
-hour sessions on May 2nd and May 3rd respectively, with the following agen=
da items:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"m_-4483828927450371228m_-4931020349367776872MsoPlainText"><span=
 style=3D"color:#1f4e79"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"m_-4483828927450371228m_-4931020349367776872MsoPlainText"><span=
 style=3D"color:#1f4e79">- Q&amp;A on certain topics to help people better =
understand RIFT<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"m_-4483828927450371228m_-4931020349367776872MsoPlainText"><span=
 style=3D"color:#1f4e79">- Update on certain topics (<span class=3D"m_-4483=
828927450371228m_-4931020349367776872SpellE">e.g</span> flooding reduction)=
</span></p></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>* and bandwidth bal=
ancing <br><br></div><div>We can also touch on transitive disaggregation wh=
ere we&#39;re in the middle of figuring out the most elegant way to solve i=
t/write it down but I assume there will be no time for that. <br></div><div=
>=C2=A0<br></div><div>thanks <br><br></div><div>-- tony <br></div></div></d=
iv></div>

--f403045c4434f01bd20569a9ea15--


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Subject: [Rift] rift - New Meeting Session Request for IETF 102
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A new meeting session request has just been submitted by Jeff Tantsura, a Chair of the rift working group.


---------------------------------------------------------
Working Group Name: Routing In Fat Trees
Area Name: Routing Area
Session Requester: Jeff Tantsura

Number of Sessions: 1
Length of Session(s):  2 Hours
Number of Attendees: 80
Conflicts to Avoid: 
 First Priority: rtgwg lsr mpls rift pce idr spring lsvr
 Second Priority: bess bier teas ccamp  sfc
 Third Priority: bfd detnet nvo3 pim  netconf netmod


People who must be present:
  Alvaro Retana
  Zhaohui (Jeffrey) Zhang
  Jeff Tantsura

Resources Requested:

Special Requests:
  
---------------------------------------------------------


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An update to a meeting session request has just been submitted by Jeff Tantsura, a Chair of the rift working group.


---------------------------------------------------------
Working Group Name: Routing In Fat Trees
Area Name: Routing Area
Session Requester: Jeff Tantsura

Number of Sessions: 1
Length of Session(s):  2 Hours
Number of Attendees: 80
Conflicts to Avoid: 
 First Priority: rtgwg lsr bess bier idr spring lsvr
 Second Priority: teas ccamp sfc pce mpls
 Third Priority: bfd detnet nvo3 pim netconf netmod


People who must be present:
  Alvaro Retana
  Zhaohui (Jeffrey) Zhang
  Jeff Tantsura

Resources Requested:

Special Requests:
  
---------------------------------------------------------


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Date: Wed, 18 Apr 2018 14:36:26 -0400
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To: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
Cc: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>, "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>,  John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>, "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>,  "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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 We have an IPR, in the process of being filed over the next few days.

Thanks,
Alankar



On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 12:16 PM, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I think you should talk to J IPR person and ask for an assessment, I
> wouldn=E2=80=99t disclose before
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jeff
>
> *From: *Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
> *Date: *Thursday, April 12, 2018 at 18:13
> *To: *"Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
> *Cc: *John E Drake <jdrake@juniper.net>, Jeff Tantsura <
> jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>, "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>, "
> rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
>
>
>
> ok, chairs, so what's the policy, if in doubt disclose?
>
> I don't see any danger if, as Pascal says, it has been all properly put
> out for 6550 anyway ....
>
> I read 6550 years ago and thought it a clever solution to a profitable,
> highly constrained routing problem but I never thought that RIFT somehow
> relates to it (except having had the realization reading RPL that it's ok
> to not do a generic graph for everything I remember). I'm having fun
> talking to Pascal now and discovering that we came from opposite side of
> the engineering spectrum (RPL for overly meshed topology  that it prunues
> and low speed/power and RIFT from pre-wired topology variants @ very high
> speed & scalability) and the same branches of graph theory were attractin=
g
> both of us to solve the problems ;-)
>
>
>
> thanks
>
> --- tony
>
>
>
> On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 6:53 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <
> pthubert@cisco.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> IANAL:
>
> Though it is really far-fetched, there may be a conceptual inheritance
> from IPR disclosed by Cisco related to RPL (RFC 6550) for the concept of
> north/south split.
>
> Even so, that IPR was declared to the IETF and RAND terms were announced
> at the time.
>
>
>
> This being said:
>
> I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR.
>
>
>
> All the best;
>
>
>
> Pascal
>
>
>
> *From:* Rift <rift-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of *John E Drake
> *Sent:* jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:35
> *To:* Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>; rift@ietf.org
> *Cc:* rift-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
>
>
>
> I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR
>
>
>
> Yours Irrespectively,
>
>
>
> John
>
>
>
> *From:* Rift <rift-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of *Jeff Tantsura
> *Sent:* Friday, March 30, 2018 3:22 PM
> *To:* rift@ietf.org
> *Cc:* rift-chairs@ietf.org
> *Subject:* [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
>
>
>
> Hi RIFT,
>
>
>
> Request for WG adoption of draft-przygienda-rift-05.
>
>
>
> The authors have requested the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as
> the working group documents.
>
> Please indicate support or no-support by April 15, 2018.
>
>
>
> If you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to
> this email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. T=
he
> response needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not
> advance to the next stage until a response has been received from each
> author and each individual that has contributed to the document.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff & Jeffrey
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rift mailing list
> Rift@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rift mailing list
> Rift@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>
















<span style=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif">W=
e have an IPR, in the process of being filed over the next few days.<br><br=
></span></div><span style=3D"font-size:11pt;font-family:&quot;Calibri&quot;=
,sans-serif">Thanks,<br>Alankar<br><br></span>=C2=A0<br></div><div class=3D=
"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 12:16 =
PM, Jeff Tantsura <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gma=
il.com" target=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br>=
<blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1p=
x #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"=
EN-US"><div class=3D"m_-4335245975970406111WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNor=
mal">I think you should talk to J IPR person and ask for an assessment, I w=
ouldn=E2=80=99t disclose before <u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u=
></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:blac=
k">Cheers,<u></u><u></u></span></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=
=3D"color:black">Jeff</span><u></u><u></u></p><div style=3D"border:none;bor=
der-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class=3D"MsoNorma=
l"><b><span style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From: </span></b><span s=
tyle=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">Tony Przygienda &lt;<a href=3D"mailto=
:tonysietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">tonysietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br><b>D=
ate: </b>Thursday, April 12, 2018 at 18:13<br><b>To: </b>&quot;Pascal Thube=
rt (pthubert)&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cisco.com" target=3D"_bl=
ank">pthubert@cisco.com</a>&gt;<br><b>Cc: </b>John E Drake &lt;<a href=3D"m=
ailto:jdrake@juniper.net" target=3D"_blank">jdrake@juniper.net</a>&gt;, Jef=
f Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank"=
>jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;, &quot;<a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf.org" ta=
rget=3D"_blank">rift@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf.org=
" target=3D"_blank">rift@ietf.org</a>&gt;, &quot;<a href=3D"mailto:rift-cha=
irs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift-chairs@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=
=3D"mailto:rift-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift-chairs@ietf.org</a>=
&gt;<span class=3D""><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for dr=
aft-przygienda-rift-05<u></u><u></u></span></span></p></div><div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div><div><div><div><p class=3D"Mso=
Normal" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><a name=3D"m_-4335245975970406111__M=
ailOriginalBody">ok, chairs, so what&#39;s the policy, if in doubt disclose=
? <u></u><u></u></a></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"margin-b=
ottom:12.0pt"><span>I don&#39;t see any danger if, as Pascal says, it has b=
een all properly put out for 6550 anyway .... <u></u><u></u></span></p></di=
v><div><div class=3D"h5"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>I read 6550 year=
s ago and thought it a clever solution to a profitable, highly constrained =
routing problem but I never thought that RIFT somehow relates to it (except=
 having had the realization reading RPL that it&#39;s ok to not do a generi=
c graph for everything I remember). I&#39;m having fun talking to Pascal no=
w and discovering that we came from opposite side of the engineering spectr=
um (RPL for overly meshed topology=C2=A0 that it prunues and low speed/powe=
r and RIFT from pre-wired topology variants @ very high speed &amp; scalabi=
lity) and the same branches of graph theory were attracting both of us to s=
olve the problems ;-) <u></u><u></u></span></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNo=
rmal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal" sty=
le=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span>thanks <u></u><u></u></span></p></div></d=
iv></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>--- tony <u></u><u></u></span></p></d=
iv><div><div class=3D"h5"><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u=
></u></span></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>On Thu, Apr 12, 2018 at 6=
:53 AM, Pascal Thubert (pthubert) &lt;</span><a href=3D"mailto:pthubert@cis=
co.com" target=3D"_blank"><span>pthubert@cisco.com</span><span></span></a><=
span>&gt; wrote:<u></u><u></u></span></p><blockquote style=3D"border:none;b=
order-left:solid #cccccc 1.0pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 6.0pt;margin-left:4.8pt;=
margin-right:0in"><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"col=
or:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><s=
pan><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">IANAL:</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><p =
class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">Though it is really=
 far-fetched, there may be a conceptual inheritance from IPR disclosed by C=
isco related to RPL (RFC 6550) for the concept of north/south split. </span=
><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color=
:#1f497d">Even so, that IPR was declared to the IETF and RAND terms were an=
nounced at the time.</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=
<span><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><=
p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">This being said:<=
/span><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"=
color:#1f497d">I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR.</span><u></u><=
u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color:#1f497d"=
>=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span s=
tyle=3D"color:#1f497d">All the best;</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><p clas=
s=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u>=
</u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">P=
ascal</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span sty=
le=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><div style=3D"bo=
rder:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt"><div><div=
 style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in =
0in"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><b>From:</b> Rift &lt;</span><a href=3D"m=
ailto:rift-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span>rift-bounces@ietf.org<=
/span><span></span></a><span>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>John E Drake<br><b>Se=
nt:</b> jeudi 12 avril 2018 15:35<br><b>To:</b> Jeff Tantsura &lt;</span><a=
 href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank"><span>jefftant.i=
etf@gmail.com</span><span></span></a><span>&gt;; </span><a href=3D"mailto:r=
ift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span>rift@ietf.org</span><span></span></a>=
<span><br><b>Cc:</b> </span><a href=3D"mailto:rift-chairs@ietf.org" target=
=3D"_blank"><span>rift-chairs@ietf.org</span><span></span></a><span><br><b>=
Subject:</b> Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05<u></u=
><u></u></span></p></div></div><div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>=C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"col=
or:#1f497d">I=E2=80=99m not aware of any undisclosed IPR</span><u></u><u></=
u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=
=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span =
style=3D"color:#1f497d">Yours Irrespectively,</span><u></u><u></u></span></=
p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><=
u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><span style=3D"color:#=
1f497d">John</span><u></u><u></u></span></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><s=
pan><span style=3D"color:#1f497d">=C2=A0</span><u></u><u></u></span></p><di=
v style=3D"border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0=
pt"><div><div style=3D"border:none;border-top:solid #e1e1e1 1.0pt;padding:3=
.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span><b>From:</b> Rift &lt;</span=
><a href=3D"mailto:rift-bounces@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span>rift-boun=
ces@ietf.org</span><span></span></a><span>&gt; <b>On Behalf Of </b>Jeff Tan=
tsura<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, March 30, 2018 3:22 PM<br><b>To:</b> </span><=
a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span>rift@ietf.org</span=
><span></span></a><span><br><b>Cc:</b> </span><a href=3D"mailto:rift-chairs=
@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span>rift-chairs@ietf.org</span><span></span>=
</a><span><br><b>Subject:</b> [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-=
rift-05<u></u><u></u></span></p></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>=
=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Hi RIFT,<u></u>=
<u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span><=
/p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Request for WG adoption of draft-przygienda=
-rift-05.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>=C2=A0<u></u=
><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>The authors have requested =
the RIFT to adopt draft-przygienda-rift-05 as the working group documents.<=
u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Please indicate suppor=
t or no-support by April 15, 2018.<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoN=
ormal"><span>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>If=
 you are listed as a document author or contributor please respond to this =
email stating of whether or not you are aware of any relevant IPR. The resp=
onse needs to be sent to the RIFT mailing list. The document will not advan=
ce to the next stage until a response has been received from each author an=
d each individual that has contributed to the document.<u></u><u></u></span=
></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span>Thanks,<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
><span>Jeff &amp; Jeffrey<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><s=
pan>=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></span></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span>=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></span></p></div></div></div></div></div></div><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al" style=3D"margin-bottom:12.0pt"><span><br>______________________________=
<wbr>_________________<br>Rift mailing list<br></span><a href=3D"mailto:Rif=
t@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank"><span>Rift@ietf.org</span><span></span></a><s=
pan><br></span><a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" targe=
t=3D"_blank"><span>https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/rift</span><s=
pan></span></a><span><u></u><u></u></span></p></blockquote></div><p class=
=3D"MsoNormal"><span><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p></div></div></div></div=
></div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org">Rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/rift</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

--f403045dc984920afd056a23bb14--


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The Routing In Fat Trees (rift) Working Group will hold
a virtual interim meeting on 2018-05-02 from 11:00 to 13:00 America/New_York.

Agenda:
- Q&A on certain topics to help people better understand RIFT
- Update on certain topics (e.g flooding reduction)
- Deep discussions on certain topics
- Demo of the released RIFT binary package; feedback and related discussions, etc.
- Work assignments

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The Routing In Fat Trees (rift) Working Group will hold
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Subject: [Rift] IPR Disclosure Juniper's Statement about IPR related to draft-przygienda-rift
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Dear Tony Przygienda, Alankar Sharma, Alia Atlas, John Drake:


An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled "RIFT:
Routing in Fat Trees" (draft-przygienda-rift) was submitted to the IETF
Secretariat on  and has been posted on the "IETF Page of Intellectual
Property Rights Disclosures" (https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3167/). The
title of the IPR disclosure is "Juniper's Statement about IPR related to
draft-przygienda-rift"


Thank you

IETF Secretariat


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Dear Tony Przygienda, Alankar Sharma, Alia Atlas, John Drake:


An IPR disclosure that pertains to your Internet-Draft entitled "RIFT:
Routing in Fat Trees" (draft-przygienda-rift) was submitted to the IETF
Secretariat on  and has been posted on the "IETF Page of Intellectual
Property Rights Disclosures" (https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3168/). The
title of the IPR disclosure is "Comcast Cable Communications, LLC's
Statement about IPR related to draft-przygienda-rift"


Thank you

IETF Secretariat


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Date: Fri, 20 Apr 2018 12:48:14 -0700
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Thread-Topic: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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Dear RIFT,

=20

Please note =E2=80=93 during the adoption call, 2 new IPR disclosures have been m=
ade:

https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3168/

https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3167/

=20

The chairs would like to extend the call till Wednesday, April 25, so you=E2=80=
=99d have the possibility to review it.

=20

Have a great weekend!

=20

Cheers,

Jeff & Jeffrey

=20


--B_3607073296_606269451
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	charset="UTF-8"
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s-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m=3D"http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/20=
04/12/omml" xmlns=3D"http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=3DC=
ontent-Type content=3D"text/html; charset=3Dutf-8"><meta name=3DGenerator content=3D=
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--></style></head><body lang=3DEN-US link=3Dblue vlink=3Dpurple><div class=3DWordSe=
ction1><p class=3DMsoNormal>Dear RIFT,<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&=
nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Please note =E2=80=93 during the adoption call, =
2 new IPR disclosures have been made:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><a hr=
ef=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3168/"><span style=3D'font-family:"-webki=
t-standard",serif'>https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3168/</span></a><o:p></o=
:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><u><span style=3D'font-family:"-webkit-standard",ser=
if;color:blue'><a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3167/">https://data=
tracker.ietf.org/ipr/3167/</a></span></u><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><=
o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>The chairs would like to extend the c=
all till Wednesday, April 25, so you=E2=80=99d have the possibility to review it.<=
o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Hav=
e a great weekend!<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><di=
v><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:black'>Cheers,<o:p></o:p></span></p>=
</div><p class=3DMsoNormal><span style=3D'color:black'>Jeff &amp; Jeffrey</span>=
<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><a name=3D"_MailOriginalBody"><o:p>&nbs=
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From: "Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)" <naikumar@cisco.com>
To: "draft-przygienda-rift@ietf.org" <draft-przygienda-rift@ietf.org>
CC: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Clarification on North/South bound SPF 
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From: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2018 21:33:48 -0700
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To: "Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar)" <naikumar@cisco.com>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/MrvC1a1TrILS6EcU2q6WH-yw4Wg>
Subject: Re: [Rift] Clarification on North/South bound SPF
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Hey Nagendra, good drilling, good observations, let me expound a bit ;-)

a. "SPF" per se is a lie in the draft to seem more familiar to existing
stuff  than it is ;-), RIFT is loop free & with that RIFT CAN compute all
feasible paths, i.e. you could use a "modified kind of SPF" if you will
where you have a candidate list per level independent of distance (i.e. you
get all paths with all distances & you can use all of those). Draft doesn't
mention that, will probably do in the future but when you implement stuff
it becomes blatantly obvious what I mean ;-}
b. Your point 1: It's a bit more complicated albeit you are right.
i) when you're a leaf you do not strictly speaking have a S node TIE (since
it's not necessary) so you'd use your own (leaf's N node-tie & then use the
upper level's S node-tie [as you say]) to double-check the
bi-directionality.
c. as meta-point:
observe that N- and S-node-TIEs are fully symmetric right now (in terms of
adjacencies) for many reasons so it really doesn't matter which one you use
;-)
d. as meta-meta-point:
N- and S-node-TIEs are NOT fully symmetric  (if you read the schema you see
mysterious unexplained stuff in NodeTIEElement, this has to do with
something we call "transitive disaggregation" and will be added to the
draft. I'm discussing the math with Pascal and we try to find a simple
representation of it but in terms of SPF it plays no role).

I hope I clarified more than I confused here, otherwise just keep poking
;-)

--- tony


On Tue, Apr 24, 2018 at 2:40 PM, Nagendra Kumar Nainar (naikumar) <
naikumar@cisco.com> wrote:

> Hi Authors,
>
>
>
> While I am still reading, I thought of quickly clarifying a couple of
> points to better understand the remaining part of the draft =E2=98=BA
>
>
>
>    1. In Section 4.2.5.1, N-SPF is defined as below
>
>
>
> =E2=80=9CN-SPF uses northbound and east-west adjacencies in North Node TI=
Es
>
>    when progressing Dijkstra.=E2=80=9D
>
>
>
> Based on my reading so far, N-SPF is triggered to compute the path toward=
s
> upper level (Level0 to Level1 and so on) and I believe this requires N-SP=
F
> to be run on Node S-TIE and not Node N-TIE right?. Should it not be =E2=
=80=9CN-SPF
> uses northbound and east-west adjacencies in Node S-TIE when progressing
> Dijkstra=E2=80=9D?.
>
>
>
>    1. Similar one in Section 4.2.5.2 =E2=80=93 S-SPF should use soutbound
>    adjacencies in node N-TIE right?.
>
>
>
> Am I missing something?.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Nagendra
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rift mailing list
> Rift@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>
>

--f403045c44105e2801056aa4c905
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div>Hey Nagendra,=
 good drilling, good observations, let me expound a bit ;-)<br><br></div>a.=
 &quot;SPF&quot; per se is a lie in the draft to seem more familiar to exis=
ting stuff=C2=A0 than it is ;-), RIFT is loop free &amp; with that RIFT CAN=
 compute all feasible paths, i.e. you could use a &quot;modified kind of SP=
F&quot; if you will where you have a candidate list per level independent o=
f distance (i.e. you get all paths with all distances &amp; you can use all=
 of those). Draft doesn&#39;t mention that, will probably do in the future =
but when you implement stuff it becomes blatantly obvious what I mean ;-}<b=
r></div>b. Your point 1: It&#39;s a bit more complicated albeit you are rig=
ht.=C2=A0 <br></div>i) when you&#39;re a leaf you do not strictly speaking =
have a S node TIE (since it&#39;s not necessary) so you&#39;d use your own =
(leaf&#39;s N node-tie &amp; then use the upper level&#39;s S node-tie [as =
you say]) to double-check the bi-directionality. <br></div>c. as meta-point=
:<br></div>observe that N- and S-node-TIEs are fully symmetric right now (i=
n terms of adjacencies) for many reasons so it really doesn&#39;t matter wh=
ich one you use ;-) <br></div>d. as meta-meta-point:<br></div>N- and S-node=
-TIEs are NOT fully symmetric=C2=A0 (if you read the schema you see mysteri=
ous unexplained stuff in NodeTIEElement, this has to do with something we c=
all &quot;transitive disaggregation&quot; and will be added to the draft. I=
&#39;m discussing the math with Pascal and we try to find a simple represen=
tation of it but in terms of SPF it plays no role). <br><br></div>I hope I =
clarified more than I confused here, otherwise just keep poking ;-) <br><br=
></div>--- tony <br><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><br></div></div=
></div></div></div></div></div></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><=
div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Tue, Apr 24, 2018 at 2:40 PM, Nagendra Kumar N=
ainar (naikumar) <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:naikumar@cisco.com=
" target=3D"_blank">naikumar@cisco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote=
 class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc soli=
d;padding-left:1ex">





<div link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"m_5756870107955623546WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Hi Auth=
ors,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black">While I=
 am still reading, I thought of quickly clarifying a couple of points to be=
tter understand the remaining part of the draft
</span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Apple Color Emoji&=
quot;;color:black">=E2=98=BA</span><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:bl=
ack"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"1" type=3D"1">
<li class=3D"m_5756870107955623546MsoListParagraph" style=3D"color:black;ma=
rgin-left:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">In Section 4.2.5.1, N-SPF is defined as be=
low<u></u><u></u></span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black">=E2=80=
=9CN-SPF uses northbound and east-west adjacencies in North Node TIEs<u></u=
><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black">=C2=A0=
=C2=A0 when progressing Dijkstra.=E2=80=9D<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Based o=
n my reading so far, N-SPF is triggered to compute the path towards upper l=
evel (Level0 to Level1 and so on) and I believe this requires N-SPF to be r=
un on Node S-TIE and not Node N-TIE
 right?. Should it not be =E2=80=9CN-SPF uses northbound and east-west adja=
cencies in Node S-TIE when progressing Dijkstra=E2=80=9D?.<u></u><u></u></s=
pan></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<ol style=3D"margin-top:0in" start=3D"2" type=3D"1">
<li class=3D"m_5756870107955623546MsoListParagraph" style=3D"color:black;ma=
rgin-left:0in">
<span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt">Similar one in Section 4.2.5.2 =E2=80=93 S=
-SPF should use soutbound adjacencies in node N-TIE right?.<u></u><u></u></=
span></li></ol>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Am I mi=
ssing something?.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black"><u></u>=
=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Thanks,=
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;color:black">Nagendr=
a<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>

<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org">Rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/rift</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

--f403045c44105e2801056aa4c905--


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Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2018 16:00:25 +0200
From: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
To: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
CC: "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
Message-ID: <CC130A8E-D09A-446D-B12E-BB88F074C993@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
References: <D4839F07-99C0-4009-B444-B54334A019FB@gmail.com> <DM5PR0501MB3831A0FF24B5FE6A8741A6BAC7BC0@DM5PR0501MB3831.namprd05.prod.outlook.com> <8892bca2bacc47e6964c799be1acf8a1@XCH-RCD-001.cisco.com> <CA+wi2hOA=EJWO45P-pvMXzW1MNsJiRFejGMvN+FqvVyVTYJgwA@mail.gmail.com> <E745D52A-2B9C-46A9-BBF2-FF67FBA7309A@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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Dear RIFT,

=20

The draft has been adopted as the working group document.

Authors =E2=80=93 please re-publish.

=20

Thanks,

Jeff & Jeffry

From: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
Date: Friday, April 20, 2018 at 21:48
To: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
Cc: "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05

=20

Dear RIFT,

=20

Please note =E2=80=93 during the adoption call, 2 new IPR disclosures have been m=
ade:

https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3168/

https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3167/

=20

The chairs would like to extend the call till Wednesday, April 25, so you=E2=80=
=99d have the possibility to review it.

=20

Have a great weekend!

=20

Cheers,

Jeff & Jeffrey

=20


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ction1><p class=3DMsoNormal>Dear RIFT,<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&=
nbsp;</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>The draft has been adopted as the working =
group document.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Authors =E2=80=93 please re-publi=
sh.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoN=
ormal><span style=3D'color:black'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=3D=
MsoNormal><span style=3D'color:black'>Jeff &amp; Jeffry</span><o:p></o:p></p><=
div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in =
0in'><p class=3DMsoNormal><b><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>From: =
</span></b><span style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;color:black'>Jeff Tantsura &lt;jeff=
tant.ietf@gmail.com&gt;<br><b>Date: </b>Friday, April 20, 2018 at 21:48<br><=
b>To: </b>&quot;rift@ietf.org&quot; &lt;rift@ietf.org&gt;<br><b>Cc: </b>&quo=
t;rift-chairs@ietf.org&quot; &lt;rift-chairs@ietf.org&gt;<br><b>Subject: </b=
>Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p></div><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNorm=
al>Dear RIFT,<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p class=
=3DMsoNormal>Please note =E2=80=93 during the adoption call, 2 new IPR disclosures h=
ave been made:<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal><a href=3D"https://datatracker=
.ietf.org/ipr/3168/"><span style=3D'font-family:"-webkit-standard",serif'>http=
s://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3168/</span></a><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNorm=
al><u><span style=3D'font-family:"-webkit-standard",serif;color:blue'><a href=3D=
"https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3167/">https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/31=
67/</a></span></u><o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p =
class=3DMsoNormal>The chairs would like to extend the call till Wednesday, Apr=
il 25, so you=E2=80=99d have the possibility to review it.<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3D=
MsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>Have a great weekend!<o:p>=
</o:p></p><p class=3DMsoNormal>&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=3DMsoNormal><s=
pan style=3D'color:black'>Cheers,</span><o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=3DMsoNorma=
l><span style=3D'color:black'>Jeff &amp; Jeffrey</span><o:p></o:p></p><div><p =
class=3DMsoNormal><a name=3D"_MailOriginalBody">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></a></p></div><=
/div></body></html>

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From: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 25 Apr 2018 07:54:17 -0700
Message-ID: <CA+wi2hOHk5nsGCOvo5PydR19N=FUTADkXMvL7r2Z0PDan0m9Gw@mail.gmail.com>
To: Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
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--94eb2c1afb2a58e45c056aad74ef
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Done, please expect a major -01 update in next couple days that is largely
ready but was waiting for the adoption -00 track ...

thanks

--- tony

On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 7:00 AM, Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Dear RIFT,
>
>
>
> The draft has been adopted as the working group document.
>
> Authors =E2=80=93 please re-publish.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Jeff & Jeffry
>
> *From: *Jeff Tantsura <jefftant.ietf@gmail.com>
> *Date: *Friday, April 20, 2018 at 21:48
> *To: *"rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
> *Cc: *"rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [Rift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05
>
>
>
> Dear RIFT,
>
>
>
> Please note =E2=80=93 during the adoption call, 2 new IPR disclosures hav=
e been
> made:
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3168/
> <https://datatracker..ietf.org/ipr/3168/>
>
> *https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3167/
> <https://datatracker.ietf.org/ipr/3167/>*
>
>
>
> The chairs would like to extend the call till Wednesday, April 25, so
> you=E2=80=99d have the possibility to review it.
>
>
>
> Have a great weekend!
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Jeff & Jeffrey
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Rift mailing list
> Rift@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift
>
>

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div>Done, please expect a major -01 update in next c=
ouple days that is largely ready but was waiting for the adoption -00 track=
 ... <br><br></div>thanks <br><br></div>--- tony <br></div><div class=3D"gm=
ail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 7:00 AM, =
Jeff Tantsura <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.ietf@gmail.c=
om" target=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blo=
ckquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #c=
cc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-U=
S"><div class=3D"m_-7838020158297337542WordSection1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"=
>Dear RIFT,<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p=
><p class=3D"MsoNormal">The draft has been adopted as the working group doc=
ument.<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Authors =E2=80=93 please re-=
publish.<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p><d=
iv><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black">Thanks,<u></u><u></u>=
</span></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"color:black">Jeff &a=
mp; Jeffry</span><u></u><u></u></p><div style=3D"border:none;border-top:sol=
id #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span=
 style=3D"font-size:12.0pt;color:black">From: </span></b><span style=3D"fon=
t-size:12.0pt;color:black">Jeff Tantsura &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:jefftant.iet=
f@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank">jefftant.ietf@gmail.com</a>&gt;<br><b>Date: =
</b>Friday, April 20, 2018 at 21:48<br><b>To: </b>&quot;<a href=3D"mailto:r=
ift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift@ietf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mail=
to:rift@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift@ietf.org</a>&gt;<br><b>Cc: </b>&qu=
ot;<a href=3D"mailto:rift-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_blank">rift-chairs@ie=
tf.org</a>&quot; &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:rift-chairs@ietf.org" target=3D"_bla=
nk">rift-chairs@ietf.org</a>&gt;<span class=3D""><br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [R=
ift] WG adoption call for draft-przygienda-rift-05<u></u><u></u></span></sp=
an></p></div><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></p></div><p c=
lass=3D"MsoNormal">Dear RIFT,<u></u><u></u></p><div><div class=3D"h5"><p cl=
ass=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">Please not=
e =E2=80=93 during the adoption call, 2 new IPR disclosures have been made:=
<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><a href=3D"https://datatracker..ie=
tf.org/ipr/3168/" target=3D"_blank"><span style=3D"font-family:&quot;-webki=
t-standard&quot;,serif">https://datatracker.ietf.org/<wbr>ipr/3168/</span><=
/a><u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><u><span style=3D"font-family:&=
quot;-webkit-standard&quot;,serif;color:blue"><a href=3D"https://datatracke=
r.ietf.org/ipr/3167/" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/<wbr>i=
pr/3167/</a></span></u><u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></=
u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">The chairs would like to extend the cal=
l till Wednesday, April 25, so you=E2=80=99d have the possibility to review=
 it.<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNormal">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p><p cla=
ss=3D"MsoNormal">Have a great weekend!<u></u><u></u></p><p class=3D"MsoNorm=
al">=C2=A0<u></u><u></u></p><div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"colo=
r:black">Cheers,</span><u></u><u></u></p></div><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span=
 style=3D"color:black">Jeff &amp; Jeffrey</span><u></u><u></u></p><div><p c=
lass=3D"MsoNormal"><a name=3D"m_-7838020158297337542__MailOriginalBody">=C2=
=A0<u></u><u></u></a></p></div></div></div></div></div>
<br>______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
<a href=3D"mailto:Rift@ietf.org">Rift@ietf.org</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/rift</a><br>
<br></blockquote></div><br></div>

--94eb2c1afb2a58e45c056aad74ef--


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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Routing In Fat Trees WG of the IETF.

        Title           : RIFT: Routing in Fat Trees
        Authors         : Tony Przygienda
                          Alankar Sharma
                          Alia Atlas
                          John Drake
	Filename        : draft-ietf-rift-rift-00.txt
	Pages           : 67
	Date            : 2018-04-25

Abstract:
   This document outlines a specialized, dynamic routing protocol for
   Clos and fat-tree network topologies.  The protocol (1) deals with
   automatic construction of fat-tree topologies based on detection of
   links, (2) minimizes the amount of routing state held at each level,
   (3) automatically prunes the topology distribution exchanges to a
   sufficient subset of links, (4) supports automatic disaggregation of
   prefixes on link and node failures to prevent black-holing and
   suboptimal routing, (5) allows traffic steering and re-routing
   policies, (6) allows non-ECMP forwarding, (7) automatically re-
   balances traffic towards the spines based on bandwidth available and
   ultimately (8) provides mechanisms to synchronize a limited key-value
   data-store that can be used after protocol convergence to e.g.
   bootstrap higher levels of functionality on nodes.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rift-rift-00
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rift-rift-00


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/


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From: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/ee_qQYoDONOvTtYVIg5qHrb3yJI>
Subject: [Rift] RIFT minutes for IETF101
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Sorry for the late posting. Just realized it had not been done.

https://datatracker.ietf.org/meeting/101/materials/minutes-101-rift-00

Thanks for Olufemi Komolafe to take the notes!

Jeffrey

---------------------------------------------------------------------------=
----------

IETF 101 RIFT Meeting Notes

+ WG Status Update and charter discussion (Jeff Tantsura)

+ Motivation, Additional Requirements and Use Cases in User Access Networks=
 (Yan Filyurin)
Tony Przygienda: While network slicing merits discussion it is pointless to=
 attempt to redo RFC 2547 VPNs.
Yan Filyurin: Agree.  Not proposing to do so.

Tony Przygienda: How does default routing break tunnelling?
Yan Filyurin: Building the tunnel is easy, knowing how to forward into the =
tunnel is the challenge.  Aggregation means it can be difficult to know exa=
ctly what traffic should be forwarded into the tunnel.
Tony Przygienda: But tunnel destination endpoint more specific than default=
?
Agree to continue discussion offline.

Tony Przygienda: Is there really a problem handling mobile workloads?  Curr=
ently, a TIE will be flooded from each of the old and new locations. This s=
hould suffice.
Yan Filyurin: What about the workload moving to a new branch of the tree?
Tony Przygienda: Existing mechanisms handle this fine.
Agree to continue discussion offline.

+ draft-przygienda-rift (Tony Przygienda)
Tony Przygienda: Who has read the draft?  Who has read draft more than once=
?
??????: Perhaps should be asking who has *understood* the draft?
Tony Przygienda: Will present survey of RIFT, laying out landscape and emph=
asising areas needing attention and further work.   =20

+ draft-zhang-rift-yang (Sandy Zhang)
No questions or discussion.

+ draft-zzhang-bier-rift (Sandy Zhang)
Jeffrey Zhang: This work is not currently in charter and so the point is to=
 show how RIFT can easy work with other technologies, such as BIER.

+Wrap up (Jeff Tantsura)
Jeff Tantsura: Thanks for attending.  Goal of today's session was to give s=
ome background and introduction to RIFT.  Next meeting will focus more on t=
he appeal and potential of RIFT.


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From: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>
To: "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
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Thread-Topic: Slot on mobility for RIFT at the interim
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Dear chairs;

We were presented mobility use cases in London; Yan, Tony and I have been w=
orking on that Item and produced some ideas that I'd like to share during t=
he interim, so I can harden my slideware in time. There are a number of tra=
de offs which may call for more than one approach, and we could have an int=
eresting discussion around that.

Could you please carve, say, 30 minutes +-10 for this, in the agenda, prefe=
rably on Thursday?

Many thanks in advance,

Pascal


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<body lang=3D"EN-US" link=3D"#0563C1" vlink=3D"#954F72">
<div class=3D"WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear chairs;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We were presented mobility use cases in London; Yan,=
 Tony and I have been working on that Item and produced some ideas that I&#=
8217;d like to share during the interim, so I can harden my slideware in ti=
me. There are a number of trade offs which
 may call for more than one approach, and we could have an interesting disc=
ussion around that.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Could you please carve, say, 30 minutes &#43;-10 for=
 this, in the agenda, preferably on Thursday?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Many thanks in advance,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Pascal<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
</div>
</body>
</html>

--_000_3d5058e8835b4302acfa5b1240649007XCHRCD001ciscocom_--


From nobody Fri Apr 27 10:20:31 2018
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Subject: [Rift] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rift-rift-01.txt
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A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories.
This draft is a work item of the Routing In Fat Trees WG of the IETF.

        Title           : RIFT: Routing in Fat Trees
        Authors         : Tony Przygienda
                          Alankar Sharma
                          Pascal Thubert
                          Alia Atlas
                          John Drake
	Filename        : draft-ietf-rift-rift-01.txt
	Pages           : 78
	Date            : 2018-04-27

Abstract:
   This document outlines a specialized, dynamic routing protocol for
   Clos and fat-tree network topologies.  The protocol (1) deals with
   automatic construction of fat-tree topologies based on detection of
   links, (2) minimizes the amount of routing state held at each level,
   (3) automatically prunes the topology distribution exchanges to a
   sufficient subset of links, (4) supports automatic disaggregation of
   prefixes on link and node failures to prevent black-holing and
   suboptimal routing, (5) allows traffic steering and re-routing
   policies, (6) allows non-ECMP forwarding, (7) automatically re-
   balances traffic towards the spines based on bandwidth available and
   ultimately (8) provides mechanisms to synchronize a limited key-value
   data-store that can be used after protocol convergence to e.g.
   bootstrap higher levels of functionality on nodes.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rift-rift-01
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rift-rift-01

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rift-rift-01


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
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--00000000000060255f056ad7ea5e
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

New version of rift-01 has been published right before the interim to make
for a good weekend reading ;-)

Significant amount of changes I'll summarize very quickly here:

a) Pascal Thubert/Cisco joined the author's list and already shaped good
amount of ideas, improved contained ones.
b) Flooding Reduction has been completely refactored and we have now for
5-level-folded-Clos (3-stages) variants optimal flooding reduction _and_
load balancing with any degree of redundancy desired. For >5-levels the
solution is very close to optimal. The reduction is applied in completely
unsynchronized, distributed fashion optionally by each node to provide max.
amount of robustness @ lowest complexity. The cost is a mildly increased
complexity of leaf implementation if the leaf participates in the
reduction. We will try to provide implementation in the next binary package
release here before IETF ...
c) Fabric northbound bandwidth balancing has been completely rewritten
based on first experiences. This new version is implemented already in the
distributed binary package on
https://www.juniper.net/us/en/dm/free-rift-trial/
d) system ID derivation has been moved to EUI-64 MA-L format
e) optional local-downstream label binding is included in LIEs now. This
has many use-cases as e.g. Adj-SIDs or separation of forwarding planes when
RIFT is running in multiple instances.
f) Optimized support for prefix mobility is included in its first
iteration. Pascal will talk during interim about added optional monotonic
clock on prefixes and further ideas to allow for minimum reaction time to
prefix moves on fabric.

at the same time, we have people attacking details of the FSM write-downs
to start to flesh detailed appendices, if more people are interested in
those, please ping me or chairs. Good learning experience, important part
of the spec when people start to implement it.

looking fwd' to the interim, lots of stuff to talk about

thanks

--- tony

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: <internet-drafts@ietf.org>
Date: Fri, Apr 27, 2018 at 10:20 AM
Subject: [Rift] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rift-rift-01.txt
To: i-d-announce@ietf.org
Cc: rift@ietf.org



A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts
directories.
This draft is a work item of the Routing In Fat Trees WG of the IETF.

        Title           : RIFT: Routing in Fat Trees
        Authors         : Tony Przygienda
                          Alankar Sharma
                          Pascal Thubert
                          Alia Atlas
                          John Drake
        Filename        : draft-ietf-rift-rift-01.txt
        Pages           : 78
        Date            : 2018-04-27

Abstract:
   This document outlines a specialized, dynamic routing protocol for
   Clos and fat-tree network topologies.  The protocol (1) deals with
   automatic construction of fat-tree topologies based on detection of
   links, (2) minimizes the amount of routing state held at each level,
   (3) automatically prunes the topology distribution exchanges to a
   sufficient subset of links, (4) supports automatic disaggregation of
   prefixes on link and node failures to prevent black-holing and
   suboptimal routing, (5) allows traffic steering and re-routing
   policies, (6) allows non-ECMP forwarding, (7) automatically re-
   balances traffic towards the spines based on bandwidth available and
   ultimately (8) provides mechanisms to synchronize a limited key-value
   data-store that can be used after protocol convergence to e.g.
   bootstrap higher levels of functionality on nodes.


The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/

There are also htmlized versions available at:
https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rift-rift-01
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rift-rift-01

A diff from the previous version is available at:
https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rift-rift-01


Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission
until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.

Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:
ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/

_______________________________________________
Rift mailing list
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--00000000000060255f056ad7ea5e
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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div><div><div><div>New version of rift-01 has b=
een published right before the interim to make for a good weekend reading ;=
-) <br><br></div>Significant amount of changes I&#39;ll summarize very quic=
kly here:<br><br></div>a) Pascal Thubert/Cisco joined the author&#39;s list=
 and already shaped good amount of ideas, improved contained ones.<br></div=
>b) Flooding Reduction has been completely refactored and we have now for 5=
-level-folded-Clos (3-stages) variants optimal flooding reduction _and_ loa=
d balancing with any degree of redundancy desired. For &gt;5-levels the sol=
ution is very close to optimal. The reduction is applied in completely unsy=
nchronized, distributed fashion optionally by each node to provide max. amo=
unt of robustness @ lowest complexity. The cost is a mildly increased compl=
exity of leaf implementation if the leaf participates in the reduction. We =
will try to provide implementation in the next binary package release here =
before IETF ... <br></div>c) Fabric northbound bandwidth balancing has been=
 completely rewritten based on first experiences. This new version is imple=
mented already in the distributed binary package on <a href=3D"https://www.=
juniper.net/us/en/dm/free-rift-trial/">https://www.juniper.net/us/en/dm/fre=
e-rift-trial/</a><br></div>d) system ID derivation has been moved to <span =
class=3D"gmail-insert">EUI-64 MA-L format<br></span></div><div><span class=
=3D"gmail-insert">e) optional local-downstream label binding is included in=
 LIEs now. This has many use-cases as e.g. Adj-SIDs or separation of forwar=
ding planes when RIFT is running in multiple instances.=C2=A0 <br></span></=
div><span class=3D"gmail-insert">f) Optimized support for prefix mobility i=
s included in its first iteration. Pascal will talk during interim about ad=
ded optional monotonic clock on prefixes and further ideas to allow for min=
imum reaction time to prefix moves on fabric. <br></span><div><div><div><di=
v><div><div><div><br></div><div>at the same time, we have people attacking =
details of the FSM write-downs to start to flesh detailed appendices, if mo=
re people are interested in those, please ping me or chairs. Good learning =
experience, important part of the spec when people start to implement it. <=
br></div><div><br></div><div>looking fwd&#39; to the interim, lots of stuff=
 to talk about <br><br></div><div>thanks <br><br></div><div>--- tony <br></=
div><div><br><div class=3D"gmail_quote">---------- Forwarded message ------=
----<br>From: <b class=3D"gmail_sendername"></b> <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a h=
ref=3D"mailto:internet-drafts@ietf.org">internet-drafts@ietf.org</a>&gt;</s=
pan><br>Date: Fri, Apr 27, 2018 at 10:20 AM<br>Subject: [Rift] I-D Action: =
draft-ietf-rift-rift-01.txt<br>To: <a href=3D"mailto:i-d-announce@ietf.org"=
>i-d-announce@ietf.org</a><br>Cc: <a href=3D"mailto:rift@ietf.org">rift@iet=
f.org</a><br><br><br><br>
A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director=
ies.<br>
This draft is a work item of the Routing In Fat Trees WG of the IETF.<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Title=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0:=
 RIFT: Routing in Fat Trees<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Authors=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0: Tony=
 Przygienda<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Alankar Sharma<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pascal Thubert<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Alia Atlas<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=
=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 John Drake<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Filename=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 : draft-iet=
f-rift-rift-01.txt<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Pages=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0:=
 78<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Date=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 :=
 2018-04-27<br>
<br>
Abstract:<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0This document outlines a specialized, dynamic routing protocol=
 for<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0Clos and fat-tree network topologies.=C2=A0 The protocol (1) d=
eals with<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0automatic construction of fat-tree topologies based on detecti=
on of<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0links, (2) minimizes the amount of routing state held at each =
level,<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0(3) automatically prunes the topology distribution exchanges t=
o a<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0sufficient subset of links, (4) supports automatic disaggregat=
ion of<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0prefixes on link and node failures to prevent black-holing and=
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0suboptimal routing, (5) allows traffic steering and re-routing=
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0policies, (6) allows non-ECMP forwarding, (7) automatically re=
-<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0balances traffic towards the spines based on bandwidth availab=
le and<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0ultimately (8) provides mechanisms to synchronize a limited ke=
y-value<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0data-store that can be used after protocol convergence to e.g.=
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0bootstrap higher levels of functionality on nodes.<br>
<br>
<br>
The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:<br>
<a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rift-rift/" rel=3D"n=
oreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/<wbr>doc/draft-ie=
tf-rift-rift/</a><br>
<br>
There are also htmlized versions available at:<br>
<a href=3D"https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rift-rift-01" rel=3D"nore=
ferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://tools.ietf.org/html/<wbr>draft-ietf-rift-=
rift-01</a><br>
<a href=3D"https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-ietf-rift-rift-01" r=
el=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://datatracker.ietf.org/<wbr>doc/h=
tml/draft-ietf-rift-rift-<wbr>01</a><br>
<br>
A diff from the previous version is available at:<br>
<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-rift-rift-01" rel=
=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?<wbr>url2=3D=
draft-ietf-rift-rift-01</a><br>
<br>
<br>
Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio=
n<br>
until the htmlized version and diff are available at <a href=3D"http://tool=
s.ietf.org" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=3D"_blank">tools.ietf.org</a>.<br>
<br>
Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:<br>
<a href=3D"ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/" rel=3D"noreferrer" target=
=3D"_blank">ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-<wbr>drafts/</a><br>
<br>
______________________________<wbr>_________________<br>
Rift mailing list<br>
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<a href=3D"https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rift" rel=3D"noreferrer" t=
arget=3D"_blank">https://www.ietf.org/mailman/<wbr>listinfo/rift</a><br>
</div><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>

--00000000000060255f056ad7ea5e--


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From: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>
To: "Pascal Thubert (pthubert)" <pthubert@cisco.com>, "rift-chairs@ietf.org" <rift-chairs@ietf.org>
CC: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: Slot on mobility for RIFT at the interim
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/fjXLQ6qgIpKCdjSS0VL3-YYDc6Q>
Subject: Re: [Rift] Slot on mobility for RIFT at the interim
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Hi Pascal,

Yes you're on!

Thanks!
Jeffrey

From: Pascal Thubert (pthubert) <pthubert@cisco.com>
Sent: Friday, April 27, 2018 1:12 PM
To: rift-chairs@ietf.org
Cc: rift@ietf.org
Subject: Slot on mobility for RIFT at the interim

Dear chairs;

We were presented mobility use cases in London; Yan, Tony and I have been w=
orking on that Item and produced some ideas that I'd like to share during t=
he interim, so I can harden my slideware in time. There are a number of tra=
de offs which may call for more than one approach, and we could have an int=
eresting discussion around that.

Could you please carve, say, 30 minutes +-10 for this, in the agenda, prefe=
rably on Thursday?

Many thanks in advance,

Pascal


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<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"List Continue"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"List Continue 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"List Continue 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"List Continue 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"List Continue 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Message Header"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"11" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"S=
ubtitle"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Salutation"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Date"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Body Text First Indent"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Body Text First Indent 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Note Heading"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Body Text 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Body Text 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Body Text Indent 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Body Text Indent 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Block Text"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Hyperlink"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"FollowedHyperlink"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"22" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"S=
trong"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"20" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"E=
mphasis"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Document Map"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Plain Text"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"E-mail Signature"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Top of Form"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Bottom of Form"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Normal (Web)"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Acronym"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Address"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Cite"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Code"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Definition"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Keyboard"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Preformatted"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Sample"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Typewriter"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"HTML Variable"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Normal Table"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"annotation subject"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"No List"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Outline List 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Outline List 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Outline List 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Simple 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Simple 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Simple 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Classic 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Classic 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Classic 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Classic 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Colorful 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Colorful 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Colorful 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Columns 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Columns 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Columns 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Columns 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Columns 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Grid 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Grid 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Grid 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Grid 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Grid 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Grid 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Grid 7"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Grid 8"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table List 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table List 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table List 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table List 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table List 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table List 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table List 7"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table List 8"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table 3D effects 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table 3D effects 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table 3D effects 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Contemporary"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Elegant"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Professional"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Subtle 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Subtle 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Web 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Web 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Web 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Balloon Text"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"39" Name=3D"Table Grid"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" UnhideWhenUsed=3D"true=
" Name=3D"Table Theme"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" Name=3D"Placeholder Te=
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<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"1" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"No=
 Spacing"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" Name=3D"Light Shading"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" Name=3D"Light List"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" Name=3D"Light Grid"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1"/=
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<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2"/=
>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" Name=3D"Medium List 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" Name=3D"Medium List 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" Name=3D"Dark List"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" Name=3D"Colorful Shading"/=
>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" Name=3D"Colorful List"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" Name=3D"Colorful Grid"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" Name=3D"Light Shading Acce=
nt 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" Name=3D"Light List Accent =
1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent =
1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 A=
ccent 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 A=
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<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Acce=
nt 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" SemiHidden=3D"true" Name=3D"Revision"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"34" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"L=
ist Paragraph"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"29" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"Q=
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<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"30" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"I=
ntense Quote"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Acce=
nt 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Acce=
nt 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Acce=
nt 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Acce=
nt 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 1=
"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" Name=3D"Colorful Shading A=
ccent 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" Name=3D"Colorful List Acce=
nt 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Acce=
nt 1"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" Name=3D"Light Shading Acce=
nt 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" Name=3D"Light List Accent =
2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent =
2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 A=
ccent 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 A=
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<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Acce=
nt 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Acce=
nt 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Acce=
nt 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Acce=
nt 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Acce=
nt 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 2=
"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" Name=3D"Colorful Shading A=
ccent 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" Name=3D"Colorful List Acce=
nt 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Acce=
nt 2"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" Name=3D"Light Shading Acce=
nt 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" Name=3D"Light List Accent =
3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent =
3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 A=
ccent 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 A=
ccent 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Acce=
nt 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Acce=
nt 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Acce=
nt 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Acce=
nt 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Acce=
nt 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 3=
"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" Name=3D"Colorful Shading A=
ccent 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" Name=3D"Colorful List Acce=
nt 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Acce=
nt 3"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" Name=3D"Light Shading Acce=
nt 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" Name=3D"Light List Accent =
4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent =
4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 A=
ccent 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 A=
ccent 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Acce=
nt 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Acce=
nt 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Acce=
nt 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Acce=
nt 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Acce=
nt 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 4=
"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" Name=3D"Colorful Shading A=
ccent 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" Name=3D"Colorful List Acce=
nt 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Acce=
nt 4"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" Name=3D"Light Shading Acce=
nt 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" Name=3D"Light List Accent =
5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent =
5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 A=
ccent 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 A=
ccent 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Acce=
nt 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Acce=
nt 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Acce=
nt 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Acce=
nt 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Acce=
nt 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 5=
"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" Name=3D"Colorful Shading A=
ccent 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" Name=3D"Colorful List Acce=
nt 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Acce=
nt 5"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"60" Name=3D"Light Shading Acce=
nt 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"61" Name=3D"Light List Accent =
6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"62" Name=3D"Light Grid Accent =
6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"63" Name=3D"Medium Shading 1 A=
ccent 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"64" Name=3D"Medium Shading 2 A=
ccent 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"65" Name=3D"Medium List 1 Acce=
nt 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"66" Name=3D"Medium List 2 Acce=
nt 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"67" Name=3D"Medium Grid 1 Acce=
nt 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"68" Name=3D"Medium Grid 2 Acce=
nt 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"69" Name=3D"Medium Grid 3 Acce=
nt 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"70" Name=3D"Dark List Accent 6=
"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"71" Name=3D"Colorful Shading A=
ccent 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"72" Name=3D"Colorful List Acce=
nt 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"73" Name=3D"Colorful Grid Acce=
nt 6"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"19" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"S=
ubtle Emphasis"/>
<w:LsdException Locked=3D"false" Priority=3D"21" QFormat=3D"true" Name=3D"I=
ntense Emphasis"/>
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or:#1F497D">Hi Pascal,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"mso-ascii-font-family:Calibri;mso-han=
si-font-family:Calibri;mso-bidi-font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;;col=
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si-font-family:Calibri;mso-bidi-font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;;col=
or:#1F497D">Yes you&#8217;re on!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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si-font-family:Calibri;mso-bidi-font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;;col=
or:#1F497D">Thanks!<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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si-font-family:Calibri;mso-bidi-font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;;col=
or:#1F497D">Jeffrey<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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si-font-family:Calibri;mso-bidi-font-family:&quot;Times New Roman&quot;;col=
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><b><span style=3D"mso-fareast-font-family:&quot;Time=
s New Roman&quot;">From:</span></b><span style=3D"mso-fareast-font-family:&=
quot;Times New Roman&quot;"> Pascal Thubert (pthubert) &lt;pthubert@cisco.c=
om&gt;
<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Friday, April 27, 2018 1:12 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> rift-chairs@ietf.org<br>
<b>Cc:</b> rift@ietf.org<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Slot on mobility for RIFT at the interim<o:p></o:p></span><=
/p>
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<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Dear chairs;<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">We were presented mobility use cases in London; Yan,=
 Tony and I have been working on that Item and produced some ideas that I&#=
8217;d like to share during the interim, so I can harden my slideware in ti=
me. There are a number of trade offs which
 may call for more than one approach, and we could have an interesting disc=
ussion around that.<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Could you please carve, say, 30 minutes &#43;-10 for=
 this, in the agenda, preferably on Thursday?
<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Many thanks in advance,<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal">Pascal<o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></p>
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--_000_CO2PR05MB2645E8F3B8FB8ACD6CAED292D48D0CO2PR05MB2645namp_--


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From: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>
To: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>, Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Thread-Topic: Question on database exchange process
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/amulH-PvPbvBeplHnN01VvVC9aA>
Subject: [Rift] Question on database exchange process
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Tony,

4.2.3.5.  Initial and Periodic Database Synchronization

   The initial exchange of RIFT is modeled after ISIS with TIDE being
   equivalent to CSNP and TIRE playing the role of PSNP.

I suppose more details will be filled in (and this is one of the pieces for=
 which contribution work from WG members are welcome).

I am not very familiar with ISIS protocol details. I came from OSPF backgro=
und and ISO specs are not easily accessible - I assume there are many other=
s like me. On the other hand, people who are very familiar with ISIS detail=
s can easily dig into OSPF details.

With that, I am wondering if in general we could refer to OSPF instead of I=
SIS when there is not fundamental difference between the two - this will gr=
eatly help getting more people involved. Of course, if there are difference=
s and a design choice is made to go with ISIS style, then reference to ISIS=
 is in order.

In particular on this initial database exchange topic, the OSPF way uses a =
master/slave model:

       This sending and receiving of Database Description packets is
        called the "Database Exchange Process".  During this process,
        the two routers form a master/slave relationship.  Each Database
        Description Packet has a sequence number.  Database Description
        Packets sent by the master (polls) are acknowledged by the slave
        through echoing of the sequence number.  Both polls and their
        responses contain summaries of link state data.  The master is
        the only one allowed to retransmit Database Description Packets.
        It does so only at fixed intervals, the length of which is the
        configured per-interface constant RxmtInterval.

Does ISIS use the same?

Jeffrey


From nobody Mon Apr 30 08:58:49 2018
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From: Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2018 08:58:03 -0700
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To: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>
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Subject: Re: [Rift] Question on database exchange process
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--0000000000009eee22056b12ed0e
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"

OK, so ISO spec of ISIS is accessible for an obolus via e.g.
https://www.iso.org/standard/30932.html

It is probably not the easiest consumable spec so I suggest Hannes'
well-written, albeit by now in some respects dated book
https://www.springer.com/us/book/9781852338220  . AFAIR it was describing
the CSNP/PSNP mechanism quite well.

On the other hand, it may benefit to write the processing for TIRE/TIDE
stuff cleanly independentlyof the very old ISO doc so we have a public
domain doc as you say.

RIFT chose to do the database sync the ISIS way very conciously (and no, it
is quite different from OSPF, especially in the initial phase) since I
suffered somewhat prolonged exposure to both protocols ;-) & operationally
I think ISIS comes out on top here for many reasons, the OSPF initial sync
brings a somewhat complex behavior with it (well understood by now of
course) and in case of implementation problems a certain fragility since no
periodic database sanity check is exchanged between nodes. Generally, ISIS
synchronization is strongly self-stabilizing and works for many, even
fairly "loose" implementations. Flooding can start before initial CSNPs
completed, after and the only thing really is that PSNPs are both sent
reliably to request missing pieces (and even this and the ack'ing is
self-stabilizing when CSNPs reflect reception or presence of newer
versions).

Yes, we have people working on the LIE FSM now and I am perfectly happy to
suppo rt any volunteers who are willing to step up and start to formalize
an appendix with the flooding FSM/procedure. The FSM is fairly simple
albeit the set of procedures is a bit of a write-down.

Then, you can of course just play with the implementation and observe how
TIRE/TIDEs are generated to get a jest of it that way ;-)

thanks

--- tony


On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 5:55 AM, Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang <zzhang@juniper.net
> wrote:

> Tony,
>
> 4.2.3.5.  Initial and Periodic Database Synchronization
>
>    The initial exchange of RIFT is modeled after ISIS with TIDE being
>    equivalent to CSNP and TIRE playing the role of PSNP.
>
> I suppose more details will be filled in (and this is one of the pieces
> for which contribution work from WG members are welcome).
>
> I am not very familiar with ISIS protocol details. I came from OSPF
> background and ISO specs are not easily accessible - I assume there are
> many others like me. On the other hand, people who are very familiar with
> ISIS details can easily dig into OSPF details.
>
> With that, I am wondering if in general we could refer to OSPF instead of
> ISIS when there is not fundamental difference between the two - this will
> greatly help getting more people involved. Of course, if there are
> differences and a design choice is made to go with ISIS style, then
> reference to ISIS is in order.
>
> In particular on this initial database exchange topic, the OSPF way uses a
> master/slave model:
>
>        This sending and receiving of Database Description packets is
>         called the "Database Exchange Process".  During this process,
>         the two routers form a master/slave relationship.  Each Database
>         Description Packet has a sequence number.  Database Description
>         Packets sent by the master (polls) are acknowledged by the slave
>         through echoing of the sequence number.  Both polls and their
>         responses contain summaries of link state data.  The master is
>         the only one allowed to retransmit Database Description Packets.
>         It does so only at fixed intervals, the length of which is the
>         configured per-interface constant RxmtInterval.
>
> Does ISIS use the same?
>
> Jeffrey
>

--0000000000009eee22056b12ed0e
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><div><div><div>OK, so ISO spec of ISIS is accessible for a=
n obolus via e.g. <a href=3D"https://www.iso.org/standard/30932.html">https=
://www.iso.org/standard/30932.html</a><br><br></div>It is probably not the =
easiest consumable spec so I suggest Hannes&#39; well-written, albeit by no=
w in some respects dated book <a href=3D"https://www.springer.com/us/book/9=
781852338220">https://www.springer.com/us/book/9781852338220</a>=C2=A0 . AF=
AIR it was describing the CSNP/PSNP mechanism quite well. <br><br>On the ot=
her hand, it may benefit to write the processing  for TIRE/TIDE
 stuff cleanly independentlyof the very old ISO doc so we have a public=20
domain doc as you say. <br><br></div>RIFT chose to do the database sync the=
 ISIS way very conciously (and no, it is quite different from OSPF, especia=
lly in the initial phase) since I suffered somewhat prolonged exposure to b=
oth protocols ;-) &amp; operationally I think ISIS comes out on top here fo=
r many reasons, the OSPF initial sync brings a somewhat complex behavior wi=
th it (well understood by now of course) and in case of implementation prob=
lems a certain fragility since no periodic database sanity check is exchang=
ed between nodes. Generally, ISIS synchronization is strongly self-stabiliz=
ing and works=20
for many, even fairly &quot;loose&quot; implementations. Flooding can start=
 before
 initial CSNPs completed, after and the only thing really is that PSNPs are=
 both
 sent reliably to request missing pieces (and even this and the ack&#39;ing=
 is=20
self-stabilizing when CSNPs reflect reception or presence of newer versions=
). <br><br></div><div><div><div>Yes, we have people working on the LIE FSM =
now and I am perfectly happy to suppo rt any volunteers who are willing to =
step up and start to formalize an appendix with the flooding FSM/procedure.=
 The FSM is fairly simple albeit the set of procedures is a bit of a write-=
down. <br><br></div><div>Then, you can of course just play with the impleme=
ntation and observe how TIRE/TIDEs are generated to get a jest of it that w=
ay ;-)<br></div><div><br><div>thanks <br><br></div><div>--- tony <br></div>=
<div><br></div></div></div></div></div><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div =
class=3D"gmail_quote">On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 5:55 AM, Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zh=
ang <span dir=3D"ltr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:zzhang@juniper.net" target=3D"_=
blank">zzhang@juniper.net</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gma=
il_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-lef=
t:1ex">Tony,<br>
<br>
4.2.3.5.=C2=A0 Initial and Periodic Database Synchronization<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0The initial exchange of RIFT is modeled after ISIS with TIDE b=
eing<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0equivalent to CSNP and TIRE playing the role of PSNP.<br>
<br>
I suppose more details will be filled in (and this is one of the pieces for=
 which contribution work from WG members are welcome).<br>
<br>
I am not very familiar with ISIS protocol details. I came from OSPF backgro=
und and ISO specs are not easily accessible - I assume there are many other=
s like me. On the other hand, people who are very familiar with ISIS detail=
s can easily dig into OSPF details.<br>
<br>
With that, I am wondering if in general we could refer to OSPF instead of I=
SIS when there is not fundamental difference between the two - this will gr=
eatly help getting more people involved. Of course, if there are difference=
s and a design choice is made to go with ISIS style, then reference to ISIS=
 is in order.<br>
<br>
In particular on this initial database exchange topic, the OSPF way uses a =
master/slave model:<br>
<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0This sending and receiving of Database Descripti=
on packets is<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 called the &quot;Database Exchange Process&quot=
;.=C2=A0 During this process,<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the two routers form a master/slave relationshi=
p.=C2=A0 Each Database<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Description Packet has a sequence number.=C2=A0=
 Database Description<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 Packets sent by the master (polls) are acknowle=
dged by the slave<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 through echoing of the sequence number.=C2=A0 B=
oth polls and their<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 responses contain summaries of link state data.=
=C2=A0 The master is<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 the only one allowed to retransmit Database Des=
cription Packets.<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 It does so only at fixed intervals, the length =
of which is the<br>
=C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 =C2=A0 configured per-interface constant RxmtInterval.=
<br>
<br>
Does ISIS use the same?<br>
<span class=3D"HOEnZb"><font color=3D"#888888"><br>
Jeffrey<br>
</font></span></blockquote></div><br></div>

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Thread-Topic: [Rift] Question on database exchange process
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Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rift/va2xlc12fMvnmObz9v2WJFDSRJA>
Subject: Re: [Rift] Question on database exchange process
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From: "Les Ginsberg (ginsberg)" <ginsberg@cisco.com>
To: "Jeffrey (Zhaohui) Zhang" <zzhang@juniper.net>, Tony Przygienda <tonysietf@gmail.com>
CC: "rift@ietf.org" <rift@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Rift] Question on database exchange process
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Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2018 22:01:58 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Rift] Question on database exchange process
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On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 2:10 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <ginsberg@cisco.co=
m
> wrote:

> ISO 10589:2002 is available for free here:  http://standards.iso.org/ittf=
/
> PubliclyAvailableStandards/index.html
>

OK, I seemed to remember we had some kind of IETF effort ages ago to make
it freely available but forgot all details ... thanks Les.


>
>
> FWIW=E2=80=A6Having the ability to send periodic database summaries (AKA =
CSNP) is
> very handy =E2=80=93 IS-IS wins on that count.
>
>
>
> However, completing database exchange BEFORE advertising an adjacency
> avoids a number of startup issues =E2=80=93 so OSPF wins on that count.
>

well, nothing prevents you from implementing ISIS that way really AFAIR ;-)
And overload timeout is really working quite well AFAIR ...


>
>
> I haven=E2=80=99t dug deeply enough into RIFT to know exactly where you a=
re with
> these things, but if you want the best of both IGPs =E2=80=A6
>

CSNP/PSNP pretty much conceptually taken without modifications (TIRE/TIDE
are 1:1 the same things) since  I don't see how it can be done much better
after all those years playing with it ;-)

What is unnecessary these days (especially in DC) is the excessive shaping
OSPF/ISIS are doing due to the general nature of topologies/links they have
to support.
With modern link speeds & processors in data centers amazing flooding
throughput is possible IME and RIFT caters to that (especially if one uses
the optimal flooding reduction on top we just put out in -01 ;-).
In fact I did not put anything into the spec (yet) waiting for more
implementations and opinions albeit I do have ideas I tried & found working
;-) ...

--- tony

--0000000000009426c8056b185d98
Content-Type: text/html; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

<div dir=3D"ltr"><br><div class=3D"gmail_extra"><br><div class=3D"gmail_quo=
te">On Mon, Apr 30, 2018 at 2:10 PM, Les Ginsberg (ginsberg) <span dir=3D"l=
tr">&lt;<a href=3D"mailto:ginsberg@cisco.com" target=3D"_blank">ginsberg@ci=
sco.com</a>&gt;</span> wrote:<br><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D=
"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">





<div link=3D"blue" vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-US">
<div class=3D"m_8860105234837748551WordSection1">
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">ISO 10589:2002 is available for free =
here:=C2=A0
<a href=3D"http://standards.iso.org/ittf/PubliclyAvailableStandards/index.h=
tml" target=3D"_blank">http://standards.iso.org/ittf/<wbr>PubliclyAvailable=
Standards/<wbr>index.html</a></span></p></div></div></blockquote><div><br><=
/div><div>OK, I seemed to remember we had some kind of IETF effort ages ago=
 to make it freely available but forgot all details ... thanks Les.<br></di=
v><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 =
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div link=3D"blue" vlink=
=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-US"><div class=3D"m_8860105234837748551WordSection1"=
><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;C=
alibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">FWIW=E2=80=A6Having the ability to se=
nd periodic database summaries (AKA CSNP) is very handy =E2=80=93 IS-IS win=
s on that count.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">However, completing database exchange=
 BEFORE advertising an adjacency avoids a number of startup issues =E2=80=
=93 so OSPF wins on that count.</span></p></div></div></blockquote><div><br=
></div><div>well, nothing prevents you from implementing ISIS that way real=
ly AFAIR ;-) And overload timeout is really working quite well AFAIR ... <b=
r></div><div>=C2=A0</div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:=
0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div link=3D"blue" =
vlink=3D"purple" lang=3D"EN-US"><div class=3D"m_8860105234837748551WordSect=
ion1"><p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&q=
uot;Calibri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d"><u></u>=C2=A0<u></u></span></p>
<p class=3D"MsoNormal"><span style=3D"font-size:11.0pt;font-family:&quot;Ca=
libri&quot;,sans-serif;color:#1f497d">I haven=E2=80=99t dug deeply enough i=
nto RIFT to know exactly where you are with these things, but if you want t=
he best of both IGPs =E2=80=A6</span></p></div></div></blockquote><div><br>=
</div><div>CSNP/PSNP pretty much conceptually taken without modifications (=
TIRE/TIDE are 1:1 the same things) since=C2=A0 I don&#39;t see how it can b=
e done much better after all those years playing with it ;-)=C2=A0 <br><br>=
</div><div>What is unnecessary these days (especially in DC) is the excessi=
ve shaping OSPF/ISIS are doing due to the general nature of topologies/link=
s they have to support. <br>With modern link speeds &amp; processors in dat=
a centers amazing flooding throughput is possible IME and RIFT caters to th=
at (especially if one uses the optimal flooding reduction on top we just pu=
t out in -01 ;-). <br>In fact I did not put anything into the spec (yet) wa=
iting for more implementations and opinions albeit I do have ideas I tried =
&amp; found working ;-) ... <br><br></div><div>--- tony<br></div><div><br><=
/div><br></div></div></div>

--0000000000009426c8056b185d98--

