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Fri, 1 Jul 2016 12:45:59 +0000 Received: from DB4PR07MB348.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([10.141.234.148]) by DB4PR07MB348.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([10.141.234.148]) with mapi id 15.01.0506.017; Fri, 1 Jul 2016 12:45:59 +0000 From: Ingemar Johansson S To: Zaheduzzaman Sarker , "rmcat@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [rmcat] Question on draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 and bottleneck queue size Thread-Index: AQHR0XuQ/0dszrifsU2JoSwCExh7+5//VsFwgAAbVgCAAHRL8IAAUVKAgAF2PICAAdvT0A== Date: Fri, 1 Jul 2016 12:45:59 +0000 Message-ID: References: Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: yes X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: authentication-results: spf=none (sender IP is ) smtp.mailfrom=ingemar.s.johansson@ericsson.com; x-originating-ip: [192.176.1.85] x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 3e7f3499-b160-4e61-dea1-08d3a1ada73b x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; DB4PR07MB300; 6:1LKSLpNVhsWcSm7CnQI/odm2Z2p+0BJETsRejQ9OSOTKSs7hysGCTD00xBKNyDx8qUk57t9xej1/pfkPcsDJH8CfdIBN3jBTt59MwsBsGDFnfykUJ730yAvRlu8pXcsMURgifFO5CF/GzG/mIptvqiat95yHp4lRvMwxX8ibNV4A8EPlQUdajlxYl2Xa4rql744UcWpUphw2ErWy5v0bqo3UDoy4NdcBW+azjUtJCDL3j2JNVcYwD1moa/ilGjHLjLl+nJtHQuU7PCtKRninoXf/00IbbZyl9NWke1bSkwMPCenIptJwlV8vjct+o/kJ; 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 01 Jul 2016 12:46:07 -0000 ------=_NextPart_000_0469_01D1D3A7.4715DF70 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi Resend due to problems with readability in last email. If time permits, I will show examples at the RMCAT session. With the = change suggested by Xiaoqing (30-50kB object size) and 10s idle time, the link = is not fully saturated anymore. I still see that the media bitrate for both media flows go down to the lowest bitrate (150kbps) most of the time. A longer idle time gives a higher media bitrate.=20 /Ingemar From: Zaheduzzaman Sarker=20 Sent: den 29 juni 2016 12:02 To: Ingemar Johansson S ; mailto:rmcat@ietf.org Subject: RE: [rmcat] Question on draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 and bottleneck queue size Hi Ingemar, If you have any suggestion on the TCP model and if you can show some = results on the effect of different TCP short flow modeling (the one in eval-test draft, the one in eval-criteria draft and your suggestion) at the IETF96 meeting that will be really great. We can discuss and agree on changing = the model. The current convention is that all the modeling goes to the = eval-criteria draft hence we should remove the test specific information from section = 5.7 (I think it is there by mistake). Thanks for finding the discrepancies. BR Zahed From: Ingemar Johansson S=20 Sent: den 29 juni 2016 07:23 To: Zaheduzzaman Sarker ; mailto:rmcat@ietf.org Subject: RE: [rmcat] Question on draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 and bottleneck queue size The problem I see is that with the original settings in section 5.7 in draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 you have a number of TCP connections = (ranging from 1 to 10, depending on the randomized settings) that continuously slowstart into a quite low bitrate bottleneck (only 2Mbps). What you get = is a very bursty traffic pattern that will hit a delay sensitive congestion control quite badly with very low media bitrate as a result.=20 Changing to an object size distribution between 30 and 50kbps gives = bursty transmission too but that is still manageable as the TCP flows do not saturate the link. /Ingemar From: Zaheduzzaman Sarker=20 Sent: den 29 juni 2016 00:15 To: Ingemar Johansson S ; mailto:rmcat@ietf.org Subject: RE: [rmcat] Question on draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 and bottleneck queue size Hi, Not sure I understand the confusion. If there is no other traffic on the path except the TCP traffic the path capacity is supposed to filled up by the TCP traffic. By the way, the short flows are supposed to me modeled according to https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-criteria-04#section-6.1= May be we should remove the test specific information section for the eval-test draft. BR Zahed From: Ingemar Johansson S=20 Sent: den 28 juni 2016 22:48 To: Zaheduzzaman Sarker ; mailto:rmcat@ietf.org Subject: RE: [rmcat] Question on draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 and bottleneck queue size OK, then I get it, thanks.=20 Stumbled on another question, though.=20 When I run TC 5.7 (many small TCP flows), it seems like the TCP pressure becomes quite high. If I run completely without RMCAT flow the 2Mbps = link gets almost fully saturated 100% of the time.=20 The settings I use are Linux TCP with Cubic 10 FTP clients=20 =A0=A0100kB-1000kB file size (uniform distribution) =A0 Idle time between reads, 10s mean, exponentially distributed. Have I misunderstood the description for TC5.7 ? /Ingemar From: Zaheduzzaman Sarker=20 Sent: den 28 juni 2016 22:28 To: Ingemar Johansson S ; rmcat = WG (mailto:rmcat@ietf.org) Subject: RE: [rmcat] Question on draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 and bottleneck queue size Please see inline below. BR Zahed From: rmcat [mailto:rmcat-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Ingemar = Johansson S Sent: den 28 juni 2016 18:13 To: rmcat WG (mailto:rmcat@ietf.org) Subject: [rmcat] Question on draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 and = bottleneck queue size Hi The text in section 4.2 in draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 confuses me somewhat It mentions a bottleneck queue size of 300ms, given that the capacity changes this means that the queue size in bytes of a drop tail queue = should change as well or ? [Zaheduzzaman Sarker] No. Or is the intention that one use the Reference bottleneck capacity to compute a queue size=20 With a ref bottleneck capacity of 1Mbps [Zaheduzzaman Sarker] yes and 300ms queue size that would then mean=20 0.300*1e6 =3D 300000bits ? /Ingemar =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Ingemar Johansson=A0 M.Sc.=20 Master Researcher Ericsson AB Wireless Access Networks Labratoriegr=E4nd 11 971 28, Lule=E5, Sweden Phone +46-1071 43042 SMS/MMS +46-73 078 3289 mailto:ingemar.s.johansson@ericsson.com www.ericsson.com =A0=A0=A0 Real knowledge is to know the=20 =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0extent of one's ignorance =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0Confucius =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D ------=_NextPart_000_0469_01D1D3A7.4715DF70 Content-Type: application/pkcs7-signature; name="smime.p7s" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 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Tue, 05 Jul 2016 10:17:50 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <60cd16c84d9c4c47bd6d2b41ea319ccd@XCH-ALN-017.cisco.com> <1466220318694.38800@cisco.com> In-Reply-To: From: Stefan Holmer Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2016 17:17:40 +0000 Message-ID: To: Zaheduzzaman Sarker , Varun Singh , "Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu)" Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11469decf06ce90536e6a19b Archived-At: Cc: "rmcat@ietf.org" , "rmcat-chairs@tools.ietf.org" Subject: Re: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before IETF-96 X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2016 17:17:54 -0000 --001a11469decf06ce90536e6a19b Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Sorry for the late reply. If there is an interim I'll be able to attend. On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 4:57 PM Zaheduzzaman Sarker < zaheduzzaman.sarker@ericsson.com> wrote: > Hi all, > > Will there be any RMCAT interim? > > BR > > Zahed > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: rmcat [mailto:rmcat-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Varun Singh > > Sent: den 20 juni 2016 09:08 > > To: Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu) > > Cc: rmcat@ietf.org; rmcat-chairs@tools.ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before > IETF-96 > > > > I'll be there earlier, and I can share FEC + congestion control results > with the > > community. > > > > On Sat, Jun 18, 2016 at 6:25 AM, Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu) > > wrote: > > > I will only be attending IETF-96 remotely, due to travel constraints. > Hence > > won't be able to attend the interim in person if there is one. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Xiaoqing > > > > > > ________________________________________ > > > From: rmcat on behalf of Michael Ramalho > > > (mramalho) > > > Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2016 12:56 AM > > > To: rmcat-chairs@tools.ietf.org; rmcat@ietf.org > > > Subject: Re: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before > > > IETF-96 > > > > > > Martin/Others, > > > > > > I will be arriving that morning - thus only able to attend if it is an > afternoon > > meeting. > > > > > > Michael > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: rmcat [mailto:rmcat-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Martin > > > Stiemerling > > > Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2016 12:53 AM > > > To: rmcat@ietf.org > > > Subject: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before > > > IETF-96 > > > > > > Dear all, > > > > > > There has been some discussions offline if it would be benefical to > have an > > intermim meeting just before the IETF-96 meeting in Berlin, i.e., on > Sunday > > July 17. > > > > > > Please let the chairs know until June 22 if you would be attend such > interim > > meeting. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Martin > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > http://www.callstats.io > > --001a11469decf06ce90536e6a19b Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Sorry for the late reply. If there is an interim I'll = be able to attend.

On = Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 4:57 PM Zaheduzzaman Sarker <zaheduzzaman.sarker@ericsson.com> wrote= :
Hi all,

Will there be any RMCAT interim?

BR

Zahed

> -----Original Message-----
> From: rmcat [mailto:rmcat-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Varun Singh
> Sent: den 20 juni 2016 09:08
> To: Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu) <xiaoqzhu@cisco.com>
> Cc: rmcat@ietf.org= ; rmca= t-chairs@tools.ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before IE= TF-96
>
> I'll be there earlier, and I can share FEC + congestion control re= sults with the
> community.
>
> On Sat, Jun 18, 2016 at 6:25 AM, Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu)
> <xiaoqzhu@c= isco.com> wrote:
> > I will only be attending IETF-96 remotely, due to travel constrai= nts.=C2=A0 Hence
> won't be able to attend the interim in person if there is one.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Xiaoqing
> >
> > ________________________________________
> > From: rmcat <rmcat-bounces@ietf.org> on behalf of Michael Ramalho
> > (mramalho)
> > Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2016 12:56 AM
> > To: rmcat-chairs@tools.ietf.org; rmcat@ietf.org
> > Subject: Re: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday befo= re
> > IETF-96
> >
> > Martin/Others,
> >
> > I will be arriving that morning - thus only able to attend if it = is an afternoon
> meeting.
> >
> > Michael
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: rmcat [mailto:rmcat-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Martin
> > Stiemerling
> > Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2016 12:53 AM
> > To: rmcat@iet= f.org
> > Subject: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before > > IETF-96
> >
> > Dear all,
> >
> > There has been some discussions offline if it would be benefical = to have an
> intermim meeting just before the IETF-96 meeting in Berlin, i.e., on S= unday
> July 17.
> >
> > Please let the chairs know until June 22 if you would be attend s= uch interim
> meeting.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> >=C2=A0 =C2=A0 Martin
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> http://www.callstats.io

--001a11469decf06ce90536e6a19b-- From nobody Tue Jul 5 10:46:09 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D923812D686 for ; Tue, 5 Jul 2016 10:46:06 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6eXMa9b84DXb for ; Tue, 5 Jul 2016 10:46:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: from tiger.dc.kau.se (smtp.kau.se [193.10.220.38]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A3F5A12D198 for ; Tue, 5 Jul 2016 10:46:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Spam-Processed: mail.kau.se, Tue, 05 Jul 2016 19:45:56 +0200 (not processed: spam filter heuristic analysis disabled) X-MDRemoteIP: 193.11.155.22 X-MDArrival-Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2016 19:45:56 +0200 X-Authenticated-Sender: anna.brunstrom@kau.se X-Return-Path: anna.brunstrom@kau.se X-Envelope-From: anna.brunstrom@kau.se To: Zaheduzzaman Sarker , Varun Singh , "Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu)" References: <60cd16c84d9c4c47bd6d2b41ea319ccd@XCH-ALN-017.cisco.com> <1466220318694.38800@cisco.com> From: Anna Brunstrom Message-ID: Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2016 19:45:53 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Cc: "rmcat@ietf.org" , "rmcat-chairs@tools.ietf.org" Subject: Re: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before IETF-96 X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 05 Jul 2016 17:46:07 -0000 Hi all, As we had very few people available for the interim and also very few agenda requests, there will be no formal interim this time. BR, Anna & Martin On 2016-07-05 16:57, Zaheduzzaman Sarker wrote: > Hi all, > > Will there be any RMCAT interim? > > BR > > Zahed > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: rmcat [mailto:rmcat-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Varun Singh >> Sent: den 20 juni 2016 09:08 >> To: Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu) >> Cc: rmcat@ietf.org; rmcat-chairs@tools.ietf.org >> Subject: Re: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before IETF-96 >> >> I'll be there earlier, and I can share FEC + congestion control results with the >> community. >> >> On Sat, Jun 18, 2016 at 6:25 AM, Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu) >> wrote: >>> I will only be attending IETF-96 remotely, due to travel constraints. Hence >> won't be able to attend the interim in person if there is one. >>> Thanks, >>> Xiaoqing >>> >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: rmcat on behalf of Michael Ramalho >>> (mramalho) >>> Sent: Saturday, June 18, 2016 12:56 AM >>> To: rmcat-chairs@tools.ietf.org; rmcat@ietf.org >>> Subject: Re: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before >>> IETF-96 >>> >>> Martin/Others, >>> >>> I will be arriving that morning - thus only able to attend if it is an afternoon >> meeting. >>> Michael >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: rmcat [mailto:rmcat-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of Martin >>> Stiemerling >>> Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2016 12:53 AM >>> To: rmcat@ietf.org >>> Subject: [rmcat] Interst to have an rmcat interim Sunday before >>> IETF-96 >>> >>> Dear all, >>> >>> There has been some discussions offline if it would be benefical to have an >> intermim meeting just before the IETF-96 meeting in Berlin, i.e., on Sunday >> July 17. >>> Please let the chairs know until June 22 if you would be attend such interim >> meeting. >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Martin >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> http://www.callstats.io From nobody Tue Jul 5 21:34:07 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2A4F912B03F for ; Tue, 5 Jul 2016 21:34:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 5s_Tzuw7cRQw for ; Tue, 5 Jul 2016 21:34:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x236.google.com (mail-wm0-x236.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::236]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 0AFD112D596 for ; Tue, 5 Jul 2016 21:34:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x236.google.com with SMTP id a66so176778513wme.0 for ; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 21:34:02 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=to:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=sxUNVoAPg1PvEMNFoEJJ0GHf7kvhMbEaKj+NI1t/PN4=; b=lhz0ByAT1D7JKxv48g25SyQ+MfAqX/jRxDFBBX2uKmF7YJpp+bQwW7NNZQ4+nsXnpv tCQ9fosxLLiU1att4TLjK3wAQuT/4lht+QRsIrw9Eo1yVP6qT98iMgEA+wd+mbyL/hk6 NkZZub7Ix3iMKK0IkJ9UM4JQ2m9hUSJxTlx4IM3ciTYbAY1pn5EXaIApZZuDOUg0RYTy S10IeuIVUK6n6vnx7sxBwAdS9rlpTCm4YjMGqstz7lvCuISev1jNn9lN64bNJCt05g59 rpF2Hjc1GbUNjOVAdIfxAia+LrWn0zBG/FHSnZS7P/kBBzD+uhEFASZsFObgwIXt1a0l 1zRQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:to:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=sxUNVoAPg1PvEMNFoEJJ0GHf7kvhMbEaKj+NI1t/PN4=; b=AWL1995KXfpnMKc6nfrLYGmPsA05l3pkVWYyKqYwsn6MMTX8/XuExm5bS/c0+qB0hT MoXuyHMaDVyNPUKpm8TPprUDL2ChkYoOmBIOfBjHDHua463cmKGVXYX75vdacGtIUmYq 7hWRVNmdoKKGC5X2lb4RNKPVw+ZP8FQuVQekROItu3MT8F2WdWQdgTKkTI10yBmzkcuO uAz/77F3yXp15gZ5nxpLd2KNZefCEQAlg058Z+smmt4VgGf3lq0zqYPuAQ3pu0jFdyo3 DoKluSAkmioZuoyq8QdEB62R50EVAiYOSDNny7lDWUJaWQqs8/GmOeCzmiCrfh1m3k+z 184w== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tLsyOPLqS3VEaO8NMJMoivJua5ND5x21jVqRZlD5HZnHSIPq6puXMINHz9z+Kqn0A== X-Received: by 10.28.101.134 with SMTP id z128mr19411573wmb.71.1467779640215; Tue, 05 Jul 2016 21:34:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fbipool-clients-46-71.fbi.h-da.de ([2001:41b8:9bf:fda4::3]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id d4sm201136wjb.47.2016.07.05.21.33.58 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 05 Jul 2016 21:33:58 -0700 (PDT) To: rmcat@ietf.org From: Martin Stiemerling Message-ID: Date: Wed, 6 Jul 2016 06:33:56 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [rmcat] RMCAT draft agenda for IETF-96 X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 06 Jul 2016 04:34:05 -0000 Dear all, Please find here the draft agenda for the IETF-96 RMCAT meeting. Unfortunately, we did not get too many requests, but we will discuss all WG items at least briefly. The always up to date agenda is here: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/96/agenda/agenda-96-rmcat And here is a copy: Tuesday, July 19, 2016 (CEST) 10:00-12:30 Tuesday Morning session I Room: Potsdam II Chairs: Anna Brunstrom (anna.brunstrom@kau.se) Martin Stiemerling (mls.ietf@gmail.com) 0) Administrativa (5 minutes) -- chairs minute taker jabber scribe blue sheets note well 1) Update about working documents and way forward to complete them (30 minutes) draft-ietf-rmcat-cc-codec-interactions-02 draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-02 draft-ietf-rmcat-sbd-04 draft-ietf-rmcat-wireless-tests-02 draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 2) Framework document (10 minutes) -- chairs 3) Update on NADA performance evaluation (20 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de la Cruz draft-ietf-rmcat-nada 4) Update on RMCAT Video Traffic Models (15 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de la Cruz draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model 5) SCreAM present update, what is new? (10 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson draft-ietf-rmcat-scream-cc 6) Present test results for testcases outlined in section 5 in draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 (20 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson 7) Status of the feedback design team (20 Minutes) -- chairs 8) FEC + congestion control (20 minutes) -- Varun Singh Kind regards, Martin From nobody Fri Jul 8 04:43:11 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E886A12B00E for ; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 04:43:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.221 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.221 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=ericsson.onmicrosoft.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tOpesNvEmw7x for ; 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List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 11:47:28 -0000 SGkgYWxsLA0KDQpBIGRyYWZ0IG9uIGZyYW1ld29yayBmb3IgUk1DQVQgaGFzIGJlZW4gc3VibWl0 dGVkLg0KDQpCUg0KDQpYaWFvcWluZyBhbmQgWmFoZWQgDQoNCi0tLS0tT3JpZ2luYWwgTWVzc2Fn ZS0tLS0tDQpGcm9tOiBpbnRlcm5ldC1kcmFmdHNAaWV0Zi5vcmcgW21haWx0bzppbnRlcm5ldC1k cmFmdHNAaWV0Zi5vcmddIA0KU2VudDogZGVuIDcganVsaSAyMDE2IDIwOjIxDQpUbzogWGlhbnFp bmcgWmh1IDx4aWFvcXpodUBjaXNjby5jb20+OyBaYWhlZHV6emFtYW4gU2Fya2VyIDx6YWhlZHV6 emFtYW4uc2Fya2VyQGVyaWNzc29uLmNvbT47IFphaGVkdXp6YW1hbiBTYXJrZXIgPHphaGVkdXp6 YW1hbi5zYXJrZXJAZXJpY3Nzb24uY29tPjsgWGlhb3FpbmcgWmh1IDx4aWFvcXpodUBjaXNjby5j b20+DQpTdWJqZWN0OiBOZXcgVmVyc2lvbiBOb3RpZmljYXRpb24gZm9yIGRyYWZ0LXpodS1ybWNh dC1mcmFtZXdvcmstMDAudHh0DQoNCg0KQSBuZXcgdmVyc2lvbiBvZiBJLUQsIGRyYWZ0LXpodS1y bWNhdC1mcmFtZXdvcmstMDAudHh0IGhhcyBiZWVuIHN1Y2Nlc3NmdWxseSBzdWJtaXR0ZWQgYnkg WGlhbnFpbmcgWmh1IGFuZCBwb3N0ZWQgdG8gdGhlIElFVEYgcmVwb3NpdG9yeS4NCg0KTmFtZToJ CWRyYWZ0LXpodS1ybWNhdC1mcmFtZXdvcmsNClJldmlzaW9uOgkwMA0KVGl0bGU6CQlGcmFtZXdv cmsgZm9yIFJlYWwtdGltZSBNZWRpYSBDb25nZXN0aW9uIEF2b2lkYW5jZSBUZWNobmlxdWVzDQpE b2N1bWVudCBkYXRlOgkyMDE2LTA3LTA3DQpHcm91cDoJCUluZGl2aWR1YWwgU3VibWlzc2lvbg0K UGFnZXM6CQk4DQpVUkw6ICAgICAgICAgICAgaHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuaWV0Zi5vcmcvaW50ZXJuZXQt ZHJhZnRzL2RyYWZ0LXpodS1ybWNhdC1mcmFtZXdvcmstMDAudHh0DQpTdGF0dXM6ICAgICAgICAg aHR0cHM6Ly9kYXRhdHJhY2tlci5pZXRmLm9yZy9kb2MvZHJhZnQtemh1LXJtY2F0LWZyYW1ld29y ay8NCkh0bWxpemVkOiAgICAgICBodHRwczovL3Rvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnL2h0bWwvZHJhZnQtemh1 LXJtY2F0LWZyYW1ld29yay0wMA0KDQoNCkFic3RyYWN0Og0KICAgQ29uZ2VzdGlvbiBjb250cm9s IGlzIGFuIGVzc2VudGlhbCBlbGVtZW50IGluIGVuc3VyaW5nIGZhaXIgYmFuZHdpZHRoDQogICB1 c2FnZSBhbmQgcHJldmVudGluZyBjb25nZXN0aW9uIGNvbGxhcHNlIGZvciB0cmFmZmljIHNoYXJp bmcgdGhlDQogICBJbnRlcm5ldC4gIEZvciBpbnRlcmFjdGl2ZSByZWFsLXRpbWUgbWVkaWEgdHJh ZmZpYyBzdWNoIGFzIHZpZGVvDQogICBjb25mZXJlbmNpbmcsIGRlc2lnbiBvZiBjb25nZXN0aW9u IGNvbnRyb2wgc29sdXRpb24gYWxzbyBuZWVkcyB0bw0KICAgYWNjb3VudCBmb3IgbWFueSBvdGhl ciBmYWN0b3JzIHN1Y2ggYXMgdGhlIHJlcXVpcmVtZW50IGZvciBsb3cNCiAgIGxhdGVuY3kgcGFj a2V0IGRlbGl2ZXJ5IGFuZCBpbnRlcmFjdGlvbnMgd2l0aCBsaXZlIHZpZGVvIGVuY29kZXIuDQog ICBUaGlzIGRvY3VtZW50IGRlc2NyaWJlcyBhIGNvbW1vbiBmcmFtZXdvcmsgd2l0aCB0aGUgY29y ZSBmdW5jdGlvbmFsDQogICBidWlsZGluZyBibG9ja3MgZm9yIGEgcmVhbC10aW1lIG1lZGlhIGNv bmdlc3Rpb24gc29sdXRpb25zLg0KDQogICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAg ICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgDQoNCg0KUGxl YXNlIG5vdGUgdGhhdCBpdCBtYXkgdGFrZSBhIGNvdXBsZSBvZiBtaW51dGVzIGZyb20gdGhlIHRp bWUgb2Ygc3VibWlzc2lvbiB1bnRpbCB0aGUgaHRtbGl6ZWQgdmVyc2lvbiBhbmQgZGlmZiBhcmUg YXZhaWxhYmxlIGF0IHRvb2xzLmlldGYub3JnLg0KDQpUaGUgSUVURiBTZWNyZXRhcmlhdA0KDQo= From nobody Fri Jul 8 09:29:14 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietf.org Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id BFA7212D909; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 09:29:09 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.25.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20160708162909.32079.79295.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 09:29:09 -0700 Archived-At: Cc: rmcat@ietf.org Subject: [rmcat] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rmcat-gcc-02.txt X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 16:29:10 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques of the IETF. Title : A Google Congestion Control Algorithm for Real-Time Communication Authors : Stefan Holmer Henrik Lundin Gaetano Carlucci Luca De Cicco Saverio Mascolo Filename : draft-ietf-rmcat-gcc-02.txt Pages : 19 Date : 2016-07-08 Abstract: This document describes two methods of congestion control when using real-time communications on the World Wide Web (RTCWEB); one delay- based and one loss-based. It is published as an input document to the RMCAT working group on congestion control for media streams. The mailing list of that working group is rmcat@ietf.org. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rmcat-gcc/ There's also a htmlized version available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rmcat-gcc-02 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rmcat-gcc-02 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Jul 8 09:41:16 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietf.org Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 27D9C12D1A2; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 09:41:11 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.25.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20160708164111.32160.58041.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 09:41:11 -0700 Archived-At: Cc: rmcat@ietf.org Subject: [rmcat] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01.txt X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 16:41:11 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques of the IETF. Title : Modeling Video Traffic Sources for RMCAT Evaluations Authors : Xiaoqing Zhu Sergio Mena de la Cruz Zaheduzzaman Sarker Filename : draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01.txt Pages : 16 Date : 2016-07-08 Abstract: This document describes two reference video traffic source models for evaluating RMCAT candidate algorithms. The first model statistically characterizes the behavior of a live video encoder in response to changing requests on target video rate. The second model is trace- driven, and emulates the encoder output by scaling the pre-encoded video frame sizes from a widely used video test sequence. Both models are designed to strike a balance between simplicity, repeatability, and authenticity in modeling the interactions between a video traffic source and the congestion control module. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model/ There's also a htmlized version available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Jul 8 09:44:46 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E272312D7FB for ; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 09:44:44 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -15.947 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-15.947 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-1.426, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ay35rPQMKL7r for ; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 09:44:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from rcdn-iport-4.cisco.com (rcdn-iport-4.cisco.com [173.37.86.75]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 050D512D80A for ; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 09:44:42 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2872; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1467996282; x=1469205882; h=from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:references: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding:mime-version; bh=rukPWPetJNggWx0c4PV+xomkg6zsJxsNTf3XOtNxV1s=; b=BiaKd+TcLA678NWZm7oJsKknBT2IBHRwK9mkj2VY5rYEiAz5D0U5mZqr cOfdj56qQiChsoLAvD3hkZykEZVmQDIKMXm/1Kc6Qd+87/Lcu1QvS6U7e 8jd/hjAcH8rg8kpyMKcrYQHscdc5SRQ5aadzx1NtrzbYKxll6PRFsBCdk E=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0D/AQA7139X/4sNJK1bgz5WfAapGo90g?= =?us-ascii?q?XskhXQCgSg4FAEBAQEBAQFlHAuETAEBBQ5XFBACAQgRBAEBCiUPIx0IAgQOBYg?= =?us-ascii?q?wDr4WAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBHIYnhE2EQYVbBY48ilgBhguIQ4FqT?= =?us-ascii?q?oQKiGqGWokzAR42g3FuiDN/AQEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.28,330,1464652800"; d="scan'208";a="123767288" Received: from alln-core-6.cisco.com ([173.36.13.139]) by rcdn-iport-4.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA; 08 Jul 2016 16:44:42 +0000 Received: from XCH-ALN-012.cisco.com (xch-aln-012.cisco.com [173.36.7.22]) by alln-core-6.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id u68Gig0L028286 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=FAIL); Fri, 8 Jul 2016 16:44:42 GMT Received: from xch-rcd-016.cisco.com (173.37.102.26) by XCH-ALN-012.cisco.com (173.36.7.22) with Microsoft SMTP Server (TLS) id 15.0.1210.3; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 11:44:41 -0500 Received: from xch-rcd-016.cisco.com ([173.37.102.26]) by XCH-RCD-016.cisco.com ([173.37.102.26]) with mapi id 15.00.1210.000; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 11:44:41 -0500 From: "Xiaoqing Zhu (xiaoqzhu)" To: "rmcat@ietf.org" Thread-Topic: [rmcat] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01.txt Thread-Index: AQHR2TeeP8RYGeYcaES2p3zUb0AiFqAOvNnX Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2016 16:44:41 +0000 Message-ID: <1467996279715.4522@cisco.com> References: <20160708164111.32160.58041.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> In-Reply-To: <20160708164111.32160.58041.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Accept-Language: en-US Content-Language: en-US X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: x-ms-exchange-transport-fromentityheader: Hosted x-originating-ip: [10.152.244.241] Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable MIME-Version: 1.0 Archived-At: Cc: "Sergio Mena de la Cruz \(semena\)" , Zaheduzzaman Sarker Subject: Re: [rmcat] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01.txt X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 16:44:45 -0000 Hi, =0A= =0A= Here is the new version of the video-traffic-model draft. The main update = is in Section 7, in which we now describe in detail how a hybrid approach c= an combine Statistical model for the transient state and Trace-based model = for steady-state. =0A= =0A= The example criteria for determining whether a target rate update should tr= igger transient state is based on our observations from the collection of x= 264 traces shared in the last meeting.=0A= =0A= Additional comments and input are welcome.=0A= =0A= Thanks,=0A= Xiaoqing =0A= ________________________________________=0A= From: rmcat on behalf of internet-drafts@ietf.org = =0A= Sent: Friday, July 8, 2016 11:41 AM=0A= To: i-d-announce@ietf.org=0A= Cc: rmcat@ietf.org=0A= Subject: [rmcat] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01.txt=0A= =0A= A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts director= ies.=0A= This draft is a work item of the RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques = of the IETF.=0A= =0A= Title : Modeling Video Traffic Sources for RMCAT Evaluati= ons=0A= Authors : Xiaoqing Zhu=0A= Sergio Mena de la Cruz=0A= Zaheduzzaman Sarker=0A= Filename : draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01.txt=0A= Pages : 16=0A= Date : 2016-07-08=0A= =0A= Abstract:=0A= This document describes two reference video traffic source models for=0A= evaluating RMCAT candidate algorithms. The first model statistically=0A= characterizes the behavior of a live video encoder in response to=0A= changing requests on target video rate. The second model is trace-=0A= driven, and emulates the encoder output by scaling the pre-encoded=0A= video frame sizes from a widely used video test sequence. Both=0A= models are designed to strike a balance between simplicity,=0A= repeatability, and authenticity in modeling the interactions between=0A= a video traffic source and the congestion control module.=0A= =0A= =0A= The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is:=0A= https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model/=0A= =0A= There's also a htmlized version available at:=0A= https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01=0A= =0A= A diff from the previous version is available at:=0A= https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model-01= =0A= =0A= =0A= Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submissio= n=0A= until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org.=0A= =0A= Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at:=0A= ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/=0A= =0A= From nobody Fri Jul 8 14:19:16 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietf.org Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC22A12D886; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 14:19:10 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.25.1 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20160708211910.32176.17880.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 14:19:10 -0700 Archived-At: Cc: rmcat@ietf.org Subject: [rmcat] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback-01.txt X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 21:19:11 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques of the IETF. Title : Using RTP Control Protocol (RTCP) Feedback for Unicast Multimedia Congestion Control Author : Colin Perkins Filename : draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback-01.txt Pages : 9 Date : 2016-07-08 Abstract: This memo discusses the types of congestion control feedback that it is possible to send using the RTP Control Protocol (RTCP), and their suitability of use in implementing congestion control for unicast multimedia applications. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback/ There's also a htmlized version available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback-01 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback-01 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ From nobody Fri Jul 8 14:21:10 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id AA73712D89D for ; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 14:21:08 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -4.2 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.2 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id iM6p_dKWlB9r for ; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 14:21:06 -0700 (PDT) Received: from haggis.mythic-beasts.com (haggis.mythic-beasts.com [IPv6:2a00:1098:0:86:1000:0:2:1]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C8CE812D88A for ; Fri, 8 Jul 2016 14:20:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [81.187.2.149] (port=39806 helo=[192.168.0.91]) by haggis.mythic-beasts.com with esmtpsa (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1bLdCL-0002LK-R0 for rmcat@ietf.org; Fri, 08 Jul 2016 22:20:34 +0100 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Mime-Version: 1.0 (Mac OS X Mail 9.3 \(3124\)) From: Colin Perkins In-Reply-To: <20160708211910.32176.17880.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Fri, 8 Jul 2016 22:20:31 +0100 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Message-Id: References: <20160708211910.32176.17880.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> To: rmcat WG X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.3124) X-BlackCat-Spam-Score: -28 X-Mythic-Debug: Threshold = On = Archived-At: Subject: Re: [rmcat] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback-01.txt X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 08 Jul 2016 21:21:09 -0000 This version updates the calculations, based on the format in = draft-dt-rmcat-feedback-message-00 Colin > On 8 Jul 2016, at 22:19, Internet-Drafts@ietf.org wrote: >=20 >=20 > A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts = directories. > This draft is a work item of the RTP Media Congestion Avoidance = Techniques of the IETF. >=20 > Title : Using RTP Control Protocol (RTCP) Feedback = for Unicast Multimedia Congestion Control > Author : Colin Perkins > Filename : draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback-01.txt > Pages : 9 > Date : 2016-07-08 >=20 > Abstract: > This memo discusses the types of congestion control feedback that it > is possible to send using the RTP Control Protocol (RTCP), and their > suitability of use in implementing congestion control for unicast > multimedia applications. >=20 >=20 > The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback/ >=20 > There's also a htmlized version available at: > https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback-01 >=20 > A diff from the previous version is available at: > https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=3Ddraft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback-01 >=20 >=20 > Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of = submission > until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. >=20 > Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: > ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/ >=20 --=20 Colin Perkins https://csperkins.org/ From nobody Tue Jul 12 04:29:13 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4713A12D0A8 for ; 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Tue, 12 Jul 2016 04:29:08 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fbipool-clients-45-108.fbi.h-da.de ([2001:41b8:9bf:fda2:d90:7b6d:f1b6:a9e9]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id 41sm1358826lft.20.2016.07.12.04.29.06 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 12 Jul 2016 04:29:07 -0700 (PDT) To: rmcat@ietf.org From: Martin Stiemerling Message-ID: <0683ef09-3ced-2e10-6fcc-cdace86acbe0@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 13:29:06 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [rmcat] Draft slides for RMCAT session at IETF-96 in Berlin due July 17th 6pm CEST X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 11:29:12 -0000 Dear all presenters, Please send your draft slides for the RMCAT session at IETF-96 in Berlin to Anna and me by Sunday, July 17th, 6 pm CEST. And do not forget to include slide numbers :) Thank you, Martin From nobody Tue Jul 12 04:46:27 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C935D12D7C3 for ; Tue, 12 Jul 2016 04:46:25 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lTYovY8TtoYB for ; Tue, 12 Jul 2016 04:46:24 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lf0-x231.google.com (mail-lf0-x231.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::231]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E389612D7C1 for ; Tue, 12 Jul 2016 04:46:23 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lf0-x231.google.com with SMTP id b199so10862816lfe.0 for ; Tue, 12 Jul 2016 04:46:23 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=uCDV+SZB64qRvI+OZZk9Lj2ut806UBHJb6ZezCqSRhw=; b=yQtk+Rc2AlasAeUBiz1LqhxYkpRgfZhXCb9N2glinr6Gg4iqkPPBZjWZzxfMjEErFB b9n94M6ojqzbnmWT2wwWhNIOFHdj/0HMGSX0dYOVbQnyjJixicNWZCMQc4q0yOIsBCJx Gqi2ac4Rk6FYHjR1lE8owdCMNYNAfab+GaqU/tWAuA2QBmzjDee8+CSd7pxQcM2FHcoa FDVdWYujjRY/GLN1/cqDFTirx5U5o9uajxC7P/DWMAEV2U3TK0T2HdNxTnjJqeDIr5fE opMbwn8bQtsB4QzLrazzSBxop7+Z8cY1HErACCBT8aCFFwigqnwJ4IvetDsaWZC0VTIK GpTg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=uCDV+SZB64qRvI+OZZk9Lj2ut806UBHJb6ZezCqSRhw=; b=DV81NIvKDpVBoqyiRr9EVzjLvIXFOjSNSUao8MIQEiYUNXEirnDEBPIw3c4zDDeOOd AvQ/G2gtxSOMqOIGCCjBuEcw2bVyApUbbO/vtkY4KebUiEKBdrhu20Pmt5zUYI/JowM0 nsLLNdAC3rPSjrE+GCAE8ZF40urepdijSme+GX3X50PavWjfzBM6B3SzRzKQUjb1QtyF xdqQpZ+1xY7wS0wX3rejQsCVlLCkRsibBqE3JQrzqMTRKcI6rXCukD9b/Jx6HqRaPSlN hlngbhjzUnhK5UyowevDDKvAKPPkpcQzq+b0tLcIS9+l7u3d3BG8fo77ew7bfR12fDgw zAFg== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tKgM23QM0KaQvMY1f+lQZr+5Bt4amLtEG5PyudlAGpe4RDo3VCvWoqv5lUEoqGleQ== X-Received: by 10.25.3.2 with SMTP id 2mr761246lfd.186.1468323982135; Tue, 12 Jul 2016 04:46:22 -0700 (PDT) Received: from fbipool-clients-45-108.fbi.h-da.de ([2001:41b8:9bf:fda2:d90:7b6d:f1b6:a9e9]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id u70sm323509lja.15.2016.07.12.04.46.20 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 12 Jul 2016 04:46:21 -0700 (PDT) To: Ingemar Johansson S , "rmcat WG (rmcat@ietf.org)" References: <81564C0D7D4D2A4B9A86C8C7404A13DA43DF3854@ESESSMB205.ericsson.se> From: Martin Stiemerling Message-ID: <3ee006e2-0da7-2d0a-64be-f54aa1c2f16b@gmail.com> Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 13:46:20 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <81564C0D7D4D2A4B9A86C8C7404A13DA43DF3854@ESESSMB205.ericsson.se> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [rmcat] SCReAM status and way forward X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 12 Jul 2016 11:46:26 -0000 Hi Ingemar, Am 20.05.16 um 12:51 schrieb Ingemar Johansson S: > Hi > > > > The SCReAM congestion control algorithm has undergone an update after > a review by Mirja Kühlewind, Stefan Holmer and Xiaoqing Zhu > (thanks!). > > There will likely be an additional update submitted in a few weeks. > > > > I have a few questions : > > Q1: > > Is this draft is now ready for WGLC ? This can be ready for WGLC, but it would be good to add a section about any experimentation needed or in which "areas" you are looking for feedback coming out of any deployment of SCReAM. This section is also usually appreciated by the IESG in order to make clear what experiments are still need for this experimental draft. Regards, Martin (rmcat co-chair) From nobody Mon Jul 18 07:27:31 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7F05212E26E for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 07:27:17 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id G9F6rOa9gXLj for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 07:27:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x22f.google.com (mail-wm0-x22f.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::22f]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4C85312DF9B for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 06:53:04 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x22f.google.com with SMTP id o80so117995335wme.1 for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 06:53:04 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Xj5W5Vb7eOGJXUX1KZBpyWfsd71FpEL95rZVdRgOiz8=; b=k3tto7l8+9D14uxBKdLQBdxGv8y2zAOGjNz2/8L6ahkl7F20AUoYM0yPVpMUU+M2r7 rDSA1Gq1fzQk8PXmRkTxBPU4YfJg3cqdBjpyVicO6rX59/01IrH/HTqSmD9i3nFBYvh0 mBtVkzDdWJPgn9vUabu6qISiQBSHz30xTDgZHEKUi0wl4aJGMIcw0YmFrU4Cr2n9gDdJ twZLQKem0TmjjRHqUKEIFAQsnK1qnxY3cPBrtVplv6/uu1Tkp3OKFyKiUCZaFoCA76s9 mXVYIMe9H2q1q+TyK4QauucZs4Udp5+RDwHawbabkyFLapwB8VkBTLm3B1NYCQeVCbj7 FnKQ== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=Xj5W5Vb7eOGJXUX1KZBpyWfsd71FpEL95rZVdRgOiz8=; b=lqECen+x7xXSvPLZaLMCzR8ooKpYoV59quL4GGGM8YKjUiT4Q5gpwf0vEI2KglG1/L flrETgd3uhdKJHOAxxkTj+YZk0e3pCCcHflXm9PL6n+K42gmn5+p0625oytFKHeFx4OQ nbzzto8OlTUKc9u23IBiU32EiK1vqbB31UuqmgqfqilCkovdM9qPtV6FTmPdz4LVBGvm PzzFt4NBG8zeAY1Uld9+M6K6XSXt6WWjxFnS4IqRjjATzOcpy1vERmmNZgVAT0yQiWxk UiP+0zgzrvZ9kjuzQmc+6ZfsN1CQQ5bpDKal2QU1vpzQdxOlAgs6xXUVOtNYNQLsjqVJ Ok7g== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tKLvkF2zXnGY30xFF6DCUy947iusa9eGuIDqITejfKEwsxHBO92f9JXaP0KvPXz7A== X-Received: by 10.195.7.8 with SMTP id cy8mr1348691wjd.134.1468849982407; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 06:53:02 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2003:74:cf0f:5c53:ec0e:d4a3:523:f34f? (p2003000613606053EC0ED4A30523F34F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de. [2003:6:1360:6053:ec0e:d4a3:523:f34f]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id gr10sm1420309wjc.32.2016.07.18.06.53.00 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Jul 2016 06:53:01 -0700 (PDT) To: rmcat@ietf.org References: From: Martin Stiemerling Message-ID: Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2016 15:52:59 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: [rmcat] UPDATE Re: RMCAT draft agenda for IETF-96 X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2016 14:27:17 -0000 Dear all, Here is the updated agenda: Tuesday, July 19, 2016 (CEST) 10:00-12:30 Tuesday Morning session I Room: Potsdam II Chairs: Anna Brunstrom (anna.brunstrom@kau.se) Martin Stiemerling (mls.ietf@gmail.com) 0) Administrativa (5 minutes) -- chairs minute taker jabber scribe blue sheets note well 1) Update about working documents and way forward to complete them (30 minutes) draft-ietf-rmcat-cc-codec-interactions-02 draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-02 draft-ietf-rmcat-sbd-04 draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-criteria-05 draft-ietf-rmcat-wireless-tests-02 draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 draft-ietf-rmcat-gcc-02 2) Status of the feedback design team (25 Minutes) -- chairs includes update on draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback -- Colin Perkins 3) Framework document (10 minutes) -- Zaheduzzaman Sarker draft-zhu-rmcat-framework-00 4) Update on RMCAT Video Traffic Models (15 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de la Cruz draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model 5) Update on NADA performance evaluation (20 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de la Cruz draft-ietf-rmcat-nada 6) SCreAM present update, what is new? (10 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson draft-ietf-rmcat-scream-cc 7) Present test results for testcases outlined in section 5 in draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 (20 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson 8) Status of the feedback design team (25 Minutes) -- chairs includes update on draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback -- Colin Perkins 9) FEC + congestion control (20 minutes) -- Varun Singh Regards, Martin Am 06.07.16 um 06:33 schrieb Martin Stiemerling: > Dear all, > > Please find here the draft agenda for the IETF-96 RMCAT meeting. > > Unfortunately, we did not get too many requests, but we will discuss all > WG items at least briefly. > > The always up to date agenda is here: > https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/96/agenda/agenda-96-rmcat > > And here is a copy: > > Tuesday, July 19, 2016 (CEST) > 10:00-12:30 Tuesday Morning session I > Room: Potsdam II > > Chairs: > Anna Brunstrom (anna.brunstrom@kau.se) > Martin Stiemerling (mls.ietf@gmail.com) > > 0) Administrativa (5 minutes) -- chairs > minute taker > jabber scribe > blue sheets > note well > > 1) Update about working documents and way forward to complete them (30 > minutes) > draft-ietf-rmcat-cc-codec-interactions-02 > draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-02 > draft-ietf-rmcat-sbd-04 > draft-ietf-rmcat-wireless-tests-02 > draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 > > 2) Framework document (10 minutes) -- chairs > 3) Update on NADA performance evaluation (20 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de > la Cruz > draft-ietf-rmcat-nada > 4) Update on RMCAT Video Traffic Models (15 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de > la Cruz > draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model > 5) SCreAM present update, what is new? (10 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson > draft-ietf-rmcat-scream-cc > 6) Present test results for testcases outlined in section 5 in > draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 (20 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson > 7) Status of the feedback design team (20 Minutes) -- chairs > 8) FEC + congestion control (20 minutes) -- Varun Singh > > > Kind regards, > > Martin From nobody Mon Jul 18 08:00:28 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id CB12D12DBAD for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 08:00:27 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.7 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 0zcYCp-12Kc2 for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 08:00:25 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x234.google.com (mail-wm0-x234.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::234]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 063B112DBD2 for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 07:32:37 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x234.google.com with SMTP id f65so105837019wmi.0 for ; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 07:32:37 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=/zqZ0jr8HRB7N8iO8kSqTRBUq4loxlw1OfrToHogQ18=; b=wjmQ3EEEA0q7ehxpGkDRGFwefl8eF6jwhpCTveawyIqr7jERcQ5FamiQY8vIVM80HH sqXdSpeOsUOawqrLXVSXzxtlgVRIbRkxrkG0ypS/zMHbbxNq14Wd1bUTC/9FZhfAcum2 2biY/q5DEwdbgohB2r6dm2cwjoZVd4QBsbCHrQtV3qtcgIC7KufFiRx5yQKDRC8PlUJA JsY5PMsTvWdkFjtTfd3dpxkvxggnKfRk+R/fw/hINxFjlWwL8YfapIsXb0zGXlR7+Gf8 xUiwS9F95gVn5wgXnv7f9QfxZXv2and/oMNStnIuVP8DQ91NZ3X5aBKD7TKF+tEeH945 STkw== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=/zqZ0jr8HRB7N8iO8kSqTRBUq4loxlw1OfrToHogQ18=; b=T6oaz/wY0mDM3RZcmCDLr96N9l4M5QNlLz5UVQ0oMbaX0f0hNLQFjLyDO0dRb3Vh8j /IUqISChPRRYc0idp3y35ckVF1SUD7M9qT4Q6HWcR8ykaJGe9PuMCDBLLWWyV25czRxa 16ZpKs6mALJubYgYUvbr1St3jaCdSE+fx5/BtynPn/3kCflSRXmvz2UMazA4+0WltKgd 4OEXlBxUDU3/e/wnCh/FseWpxQXQaZDNi+wuC3l9Vw+/Z/l08d/yiMNDGUpgEv+Cj5w/ MdJJxwXpVwIU8V+8BEmqVaoGShyGWBPPT2hZMhjzpOUSi7U2v2idGbmX7OUhAjxkzzKj Nj6A== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tLvqkfu05Z32P84dfqfJ9aWjb1xLZ9E//GScOx3rh4/7lUiJA8nCHfhPvJvfoVXzA== X-Received: by 10.194.145.226 with SMTP id sx2mr1493813wjb.93.1468852355993; Mon, 18 Jul 2016 07:32:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2003:74:cf0f:5c53:ec0e:d4a3:523:f34f? (p2003000613606053EC0ED4A30523F34F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de. [2003:6:1360:6053:ec0e:d4a3:523:f34f]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id b186sm7282134wmg.23.2016.07.18.07.32.34 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 18 Jul 2016 07:32:34 -0700 (PDT) To: rmcat@ietf.org References: From: Martin Stiemerling Message-ID: <4179289c-9e21-2a36-7a6e-3821131d109b@gmail.com> Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2016 16:32:34 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [rmcat] UPDATE Re: RMCAT draft agenda for IETF-96 X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 18 Jul 2016 15:00:28 -0000 Please use the error free web version for your reference: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/96/agenda/agenda-96-rmcat Am 18.07.16 um 15:52 schrieb Martin Stiemerling: > Dear all, > > Here is the updated agenda: > > Tuesday, July 19, 2016 (CEST) > 10:00-12:30 Tuesday Morning session I > Room: Potsdam II > > Chairs: > Anna Brunstrom (anna.brunstrom@kau.se) > Martin Stiemerling (mls.ietf@gmail.com) > > 0) Administrativa (5 minutes) -- chairs > minute taker > jabber scribe > blue sheets > note well > > 1) Update about working documents and way forward to complete them (30 > minutes) > draft-ietf-rmcat-cc-codec-interactions-02 > draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-02 > draft-ietf-rmcat-sbd-04 > draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-criteria-05 > draft-ietf-rmcat-wireless-tests-02 > draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 > draft-ietf-rmcat-gcc-02 > > 2) Status of the feedback design team (25 Minutes) -- chairs > includes update on draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback -- Colin > Perkins > 3) Framework document (10 minutes) -- Zaheduzzaman Sarker > draft-zhu-rmcat-framework-00 > 4) Update on RMCAT Video Traffic Models (15 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de > la Cruz > draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model > 5) Update on NADA performance evaluation (20 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de > la Cruz > draft-ietf-rmcat-nada > 6) SCreAM present update, what is new? (10 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson > draft-ietf-rmcat-scream-cc > 7) Present test results for testcases outlined in section 5 in > draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 (20 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson > 8) Status of the feedback design team (25 Minutes) -- chairs > includes update on draft-ietf-rmcat-rtp-cc-feedback -- Colin > Perkins > 9) FEC + congestion control (20 minutes) -- Varun Singh > > Regards, > > Martin > > > Am 06.07.16 um 06:33 schrieb Martin Stiemerling: >> Dear all, >> >> Please find here the draft agenda for the IETF-96 RMCAT meeting. >> >> Unfortunately, we did not get too many requests, but we will discuss all >> WG items at least briefly. >> >> The always up to date agenda is here: >> https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/96/agenda/agenda-96-rmcat >> >> And here is a copy: >> >> Tuesday, July 19, 2016 (CEST) >> 10:00-12:30 Tuesday Morning session I >> Room: Potsdam II >> >> Chairs: >> Anna Brunstrom (anna.brunstrom@kau.se) >> Martin Stiemerling (mls.ietf@gmail.com) >> >> 0) Administrativa (5 minutes) -- chairs >> minute taker >> jabber scribe >> blue sheets >> note well >> >> 1) Update about working documents and way forward to complete them (30 >> minutes) >> draft-ietf-rmcat-cc-codec-interactions-02 >> draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-02 >> draft-ietf-rmcat-sbd-04 >> draft-ietf-rmcat-wireless-tests-02 >> draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 >> >> 2) Framework document (10 minutes) -- chairs >> 3) Update on NADA performance evaluation (20 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de >> la Cruz >> draft-ietf-rmcat-nada >> 4) Update on RMCAT Video Traffic Models (15 minutes) -- Sergio Mena de >> la Cruz >> draft-ietf-rmcat-video-traffic-model >> 5) SCreAM present update, what is new? (10 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson >> draft-ietf-rmcat-scream-cc >> 6) Present test results for testcases outlined in section 5 in >> draft-ietf-rmcat-eval-test-03 (20 minutes) -- Ingemar Johansson >> 7) Status of the feedback design team (20 Minutes) -- chairs >> 8) FEC + congestion control (20 minutes) -- Varun Singh >> >> >> Kind regards, >> >> Martin From nobody Tue Jul 19 01:57:23 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1C26012DD77 for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 01:57:21 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.699 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.699 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 6VegNqUixP9V for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 01:57:15 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-wm0-x230.google.com (mail-wm0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:400c:c09::230]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 197B512DD36 for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 01:57:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-wm0-x230.google.com with SMTP id o80so18113790wme.1 for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 01:57:03 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=n6jFaEpH6oOu2PYfr5pucSdy6fuRUvhLCbMMcXeU1Os=; b=wa4ei997fbmMAl+nAS6GmIcU5Qb4MivRnMvownSWYIOxwjeZYv/cxF3gNtW5lJqRE0 OGSstHT3WYGXFduOH0hg8tiSBZUP+3qexcKrnfn8gHMNxYrNmzlKmddABsCTARtm185S Rer51ws1MyL5dYd/kUrOodykD7jWXKfFY7suf0rIYELyL5ZDoNiTJFX9jyP3F+ClNAj/ sQ8UlkkfywV/MOt9H+DRvotrstQd6O4XfispP0pVaFF2SLxRhp+O1YFckSezsrMP+pyc afarD/Bg8nAhdSy90FUvwCJ9cU3hUbkK2rNjLg9YotN4XboPmTETHTy2eZdS5PsDtMA5 Wd/g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:from:date:message-id:subject:to; bh=n6jFaEpH6oOu2PYfr5pucSdy6fuRUvhLCbMMcXeU1Os=; b=JWwhDxxJzD6DwrJSXWygLvC+z3daqkMpH6pSGsWupUZDJRv9UZJIa2KVHtBaHgjsD/ NgKJy75MV9YUDbijzDOpNgEK0dF7+DRyLURSkyaYlLck6nEGikc2h51TU7gVubAXZ7vX lkr0vfoERuBWKXLGyg7QprAaDlF9zB7N0HJOtyNv33Gyz3eEN6dTVUoMD5GoAI4WPQhV qEFAvy85n2bxpDdbC2EauGR6OPbA7+GWxO94HUlljpo01mALBfWjJ/A4Jra/OJFMM9h8 IPFM0rJJ+CO5MqPXjFPWTrUffOLjxwdjA5DG/swYGH3q8aep/AYZfbZX/itFNFAg7i94 xjyw== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tKqmYkinKSSO7JrjZZky3thnCLik9aCOMhTea/nSMyojKJVAGSw6Km1PE9CKbqcx8spGsjDCjs17kzhsw== X-Received: by 10.28.13.1 with SMTP id 1mr2477222wmn.60.1468918621411; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 01:57:01 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Received: by 10.28.5.14 with HTTP; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 01:57:00 -0700 (PDT) From: Gaetano Carlucci Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2016 10:57:00 +0200 Message-ID: To: rmcat@ietf.org Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=001a11443734a224600537f9443f Archived-At: Subject: [rmcat] GCC presentation at ANRW 16 X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:57:22 -0000 --001a11443734a224600537f9443f Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi, I would like to share the paper and the slides we have presented at the Applied Networking Research Workshop 2016 . The paper discusses the mechanism we use to make GCC more robust over Wi-Fi networks. Paper link: https://irtf.org/anrw/2016/anrw16-final14.pdf Slides: https://irtf.org/anrw/2016/slides-anrw16-final14.pdf Thanks, Gaetano Carlucci. --001a11443734a224600537f9443f Content-Type: text/html; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Hi,

I would like to share the paper and= the slides we have presented at the Applied Networking Research Workshop 2016.

The paper discusses the mechanism =C2=A0we use to make GCC more robus= t over Wi-Fi networks.


Thanks,
Gaetano Ca= rlucci.
--001a11443734a224600537f9443f-- From nobody Tue Jul 19 03:10:06 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 291EA12D0C1 for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 03:10:05 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -2.601 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.601 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=mozilla-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 2tXdrT3nYz9x for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 03:10:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from mail-lf0-x22e.google.com (mail-lf0-x22e.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4010:c07::22e]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 44FB212B006 for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 03:10:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-lf0-x22e.google.com with SMTP id l69so9571485lfg.1 for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 03:10:00 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=mozilla-com.20150623.gappssmtp.com; s=20150623; h=to:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding; bh=bcqHvHRSz8fGOaFOuPE41iJgULI94RRXJTTD0j/5hc4=; b=0lPRjhqWL7kWA6n0M3TP8VjeaFrrz7/FxtXp1vdLRagVbk76YagEsEm2NGDdtPmYbA Rudl7VDdqGfAefjaReeqF1M77OSaw8Almv42euvQe0PlnlP4Jq11mc/KiU7yuLkzV80x s/7+gsKLxHvBc37aLa92GADkEPjfQqkWsGmccgvR1z6x1Q9tK2RJABwEuraX2ENr79mg 4KRLZSX+eSkJtXzp6EVG37qLQzMgZNRqjSAXnx+TvrA/SjW5/WrK1wiBcqGf1VBvhW7C efROq5okq7YNiJkcaJKvaewPtW824rI+g6hZRB/BVEqjGJyxwelU6XU3HZ/6sNdsH/sI WMrg== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:to:from:subject:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:content-transfer-encoding; bh=bcqHvHRSz8fGOaFOuPE41iJgULI94RRXJTTD0j/5hc4=; b=exuDixQXgfEkOjJD3/nNfPaGCSYkGZdxtnPcP06GEMvd7p7Mf1tMQRIAalZ3DhLgmH 6F0vWx55xNioDrpUpXTMULPpe0jTo+uysCAg7rUsRuiPrTl6qXVuPN79L0FYmk+fXHhQ rCY2+uWqNabEG3sZTxZzbqkoEnTDXV+5nfauwGqhBUYnRP50uko/2cDPjSKvoea75OD6 3XV9z3MMaq/Z3Efn6IZ7OAry9GC31oMRRLmXsSnnPbDZih3rNYO+Uy0i+IsXiq49S6hG 7doRrw0t+GL3RDycumRggNeKi8BgZJjTBE0HTKUSUQ4c/T8NSjauMh4EiCVyXriKhEuz mfpw== X-Gm-Message-State: ALyK8tL1qOFzX2666Z8v3zSWvPztnI+w2Smep9rbNw0wJACO09EQ9WEwVFPOV9tIVJABWhrs X-Received: by 10.25.81.17 with SMTP id f17mr14895208lfb.206.1468922998037; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 03:09:58 -0700 (PDT) Received: from ?IPv6:2001:67c:1231:998:974:e0c6:6174:7a8a? ([2001:67c:1231:998:974:e0c6:6174:7a8a]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id g69sm172544lji.44.2016.07.19.03.09.56 for (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Tue, 19 Jul 2016 03:09:57 -0700 (PDT) To: rmcat@ietf.org From: Thomas Daede Message-ID: <9d6f7ebf-bea0-b804-9e85-cdf13022de67@mozilla.com> Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2016 03:09:55 -0700 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Archived-At: Subject: [rmcat] Test video sequence sources X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2016 10:10:05 -0000 Xiph.Org hosts a large selection of test video sequences, donated from various participants: https://media.xiph.org/video/derf/ There are longer videoconferencing sequences here, such as the Vidyo ones (600 frames), as well as many other types of content. - Thomas From nobody Tue Jul 19 05:57:10 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 933C412D7CF for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 05:57:09 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.919 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.919 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vZuB1CvBpHYH for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 05:57:03 -0700 (PDT) Received: from seagreen.cherry.relay.mailchannels.net (seagreen.cherry.relay.mailchannels.net [23.83.223.160]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id BEA3D12D82A for ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 05:53:48 -0700 (PDT) X-Sender-Id: wwwh|x-authuser|randell@jesup.org Received: from relay.mailchannels.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7473220ED8; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 12:53:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from rcentral501.webserversystems.com (ip-10-107-69-155.us-west-2.compute.internal [10.107.69.155]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 8BB0E20A66; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 12:53:41 +0000 (UTC) X-Sender-Id: wwwh|x-authuser|randell@jesup.org Received: from rcentral501.webserversystems.com (rcentral501.webserversystems.com [10.91.5.35]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.7.1); Tue, 19 Jul 2016 12:53:42 +0000 X-MC-Relay: Neutral X-MailChannels-SenderId: wwwh|x-authuser|randell@jesup.org X-MailChannels-Auth-Id: wwwh X-MC-Loop-Signature: 1468932821831:1803113992 X-MC-Ingress-Time: 1468932821831 Received: from pool-71-162-135-19.phlapa.fios.verizon.net ([71.162.135.19]:61757 helo=[192.168.1.12]) by rcentral501.webserversystems.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.87) (envelope-from ) id 1bPUXI-00037Q-V8; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:54:09 -0400 References: <4179289c-9e21-2a36-7a6e-3821131d109b@gmail.com> To: rmcat@ietf.org, Colin Perkins From: Randell Jesup Message-ID: Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:51:13 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <4179289c-9e21-2a36-7a6e-3821131d109b@gmail.com> Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------B5F4351E0D74365CEF037730" X-AuthUser: randell@jesup.org Archived-At: Subject: [rmcat] Colin's feedback bandwidth analysis X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2016 12:57:09 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------B5F4351E0D74365CEF037730 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Colin - thanks for the analysis! Agree with Mo that this implies we're way over the default 5% (which can be bumped, of course, but knowing how far we need to bump it is important). As for expected rates... I would expect a common range of rates (especially at the start of a stream) would be 200-500kbps @ 30fps, extending up to 1-3Mbps @ 30fps. I would expect to see bandwidths scale down to 40-50Kbps @ 30fps (I've deployed videophones operating well down to that (QCIF H264)). At the high end, I expect to scale up to 5+Mbps @ 30 or even 60fps. And there may be use for 60fps down in the 500Kbps-2Mbps range for some usecases. This speaks to: * improve compression of the feedback data (RLE the loss data (or huffman encode, etc), and delta-encode the arrival times). I was pretty sure we'd need to do this, and this confirms it. ** There's more to win with compressing the arrival times aggressively * negotiate the needed resolution and reporting intervals with the sender-side control in some manner. If need be, do it in-band in RTCP. ** while more painful in implementation, even the resolution/range of the timestamps could be negotiated * we should consider if there's a way to compress or omit the repeated information that's in every report that Colin enumerated ** list of streams etc rarely changes The bandwidth implications of this was part of why (for adaptation in the 30-250Kbps @ 30fps) I used sparse receiver-side congestion control in the Ojo, reporting only significant changes in derived bandwidth via RTCP. The challenge here will be to find a way to fit feedback needed for sender-side congestion control into the available bandwidth. I'm not concerned with having to increase the 5% default per se, but I am concerned with how much "goodput" we get in two-way traffic. I don't want 200Kbps @ 30 spending 50Kbps on feedback.... -- Randell Jesup -- rjesup a t mozilla d o t com Please please please don't email randell-ietf@jesup.org! Way too much spam --------------B5F4351E0D74365CEF037730 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Colin - thanks for the analysis!

Agree with Mo that this implies we're way over the default 5% (which can be bumped, of course, but knowing how far we need to bump it is important).

As for expected rates... I would expect a common range of rates (especially at the start of a stream) would be 200-500kbps @ 30fps, extending up to 1-3Mbps @ 30fps.=C2=A0 I would expect to see bandwidt= hs scale down to=C2=A0 40-50Kbps @ 30fps (I've deployed videophones operating well down to that (QCIF H264)).=C2=A0 At the high end, I ex= pect to scale up to 5+Mbps @ 30 or even 60fps.=C2=A0 And there may be use = for 60fps down in the 500Kbps-2Mbps range for some usecases.

This speaks to:
* improve compression of the feedback data (RLE the loss data (or huffman encode, etc), and delta-encode the arrival times).=C2=A0 I wa= s pretty sure we'd need to do this, and this confirms it.
** There's more to win with compressing the arrival times aggressively
* negotiate the needed resolution and reporting intervals with the sender-side control in some manner.=C2=A0 If need be, do it in-band i= n RTCP.
** while more painful in implementation, even the resolution/range of the timestamps could be negotiated
* we should consider if there's a way to compress or omit the repeated information that's in every report that Colin enumerated
** list of streams etc rarely changes

The bandwidth implications of this was part of why (for adaptation in the 30-250Kbps @ 30fps) I used sparse receiver-side congestion control in the Ojo, reporting only significant changes in derived bandwidth via RTCP.=C2=A0 The challenge here will be to find a way to= fit feedback needed for sender-side congestion control into the available bandwidth.=C2=A0 I'm not concerned with having to increase = the 5% default per se, but I am concerned with how much "goodput" we get in two-way traffic.=C2=A0 I don't want 200Kbps @ 30 spending 50Kbps o= n feedback....

--=20
Randell Jesup -- rjesup a t mozilla d o t com
Please please please don't email randell-ietf@jesup.org!  Way too=
 much spam
--------------B5F4351E0D74365CEF037730-- From nobody Tue Jul 19 08:21:44 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 9B99212E059; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:21:42 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -1.9 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id m66U0PXmJ0Ec; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:21:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: from beetle.oak.relay.mailchannels.net (beetle.oak.relay.mailchannels.net [23.83.215.15]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id B2EFB12E173; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 08:01:43 -0700 (PDT) X-Sender-Id: wwwh|x-authuser|randell@jesup.org Received: from relay.mailchannels.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8DC7C101101; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 15:01:42 +0000 (UTC) Received: from rcentral501.webserversystems.com (ip-10-229-2-62.us-west-2.compute.internal [10.229.2.62]) by relay.mailchannels.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 6443710187D; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 15:01:41 +0000 (UTC) X-Sender-Id: wwwh|x-authuser|randell@jesup.org Received: from rcentral501.webserversystems.com ([TEMPUNAVAIL]. [10.132.194.146]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384) by 0.0.0.0:2500 (trex/5.7.1); Tue, 19 Jul 2016 15:01:42 +0000 X-MC-Relay: Neutral X-MailChannels-SenderId: wwwh|x-authuser|randell@jesup.org X-MailChannels-Auth-Id: wwwh X-MC-Loop-Signature: 1468940501854:2267864172 X-MC-Ingress-Time: 1468940501854 Received: from pool-71-162-135-19.phlapa.fios.verizon.net ([71.162.135.19]:63492 helo=[192.168.1.12]) by rcentral501.webserversystems.com with esmtpsa (TLSv1.2:ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256:128) (Exim 4.87) (envelope-from ) id 1bPWX4-0000TR-VZ; Tue, 19 Jul 2016 11:02:03 -0400 References: <4179289c-9e21-2a36-7a6e-3821131d109b@gmail.com> To: rmcat@ietf.org, avtext@ietf.org From: Randell Jesup Message-ID: Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2016 10:59:07 -0400 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.3; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.1.1 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------774AE1A03009E75CEBC3D435" X-AuthUser: randell@jesup.org Archived-At: Subject: Re: [rmcat] Colin's feedback bandwidth analysis X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2016 15:21:43 -0000 This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------774AE1A03009E75CEBC3D435 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Adding avtext: On 7/19/2016 8:51 AM, Randell Jesup wrote: > Colin - thanks for the analysis! > > Agree with Mo that this implies we're way over the default 5% (which > can be bumped, of course, but knowing how far we need to bump it is > important). > > As for expected rates... I would expect a common range of rates > (especially at the start of a stream) would be 200-500kbps @ 30fps, > extending up to 1-3Mbps @ 30fps. I would expect to see bandwidths > scale down to 40-50Kbps @ 30fps (I've deployed videophones operating > well down to that (QCIF H264)). At the high end, I expect to scale up > to 5+Mbps @ 30 or even 60fps. And there may be use for 60fps down in > the 500Kbps-2Mbps range for some usecases. > > This speaks to: > * improve compression of the feedback data (RLE the loss data (or > huffman encode, etc), and delta-encode the arrival times). I was > pretty sure we'd need to do this, and this confirms it. > ** There's more to win with compressing the arrival times aggressively > * negotiate the needed resolution and reporting intervals with the > sender-side control in some manner. If need be, do it in-band in RTCP. > ** while more painful in implementation, even the resolution/range of > the timestamps could be negotiated > * we should consider if there's a way to compress or omit the repeated > information that's in every report that Colin enumerated > ** list of streams etc rarely changes I'll add: * at lower bandwidths relax the reporting interval to reduce effects of overhead and improve compression of the data, at the cost of less-reactive results in the congestion control ** Implies the need to test the algorithms for sensitivity to less-than-ideal feedback intervals * look at (with some annoying complexity implied) piggybacking this data on RTP packets in header extensions ** shares overhead with reverse-direction RTP (good), may add to delay in receiving them (bad), but given that packets may be queued in both directions, piggybacking may work well in practice at higher framerates. If we need to send feedback and the next anticipated packet going out isn't for a "while", we'd send an RTCP. If we're pacing packets out or likely to send one "soon" relative to the reporting frequency, piggyback it. ** size of the extension might be an issue (packet size limits) ** this definitely adds complexity, but can save a considerable amount of overhead > > The bandwidth implications of this was part of why (for adaptation in > the 30-250Kbps @ 30fps) I used sparse receiver-side congestion control > in the Ojo, reporting only significant changes in derived bandwidth > via RTCP. The challenge here will be to find a way to fit feedback > needed for sender-side congestion control into the available > bandwidth. I'm not concerned with having to increase the 5% default > per se, but I am concerned with how much "goodput" we get in two-way > traffic. I don't want 200Kbps @ 30 spending 50Kbps on feedback.... -- Randell Jesup -- rjesup a t mozilla d o t com Please please please don't email randell-ietf@jesup.org! Way too much spam --------------774AE1A03009E75CEBC3D435 Content-Type: text/html; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Adding avtext:

On 7/19/2016 8:51 AM, Randell Jesup wrote:
Colin - thanks for the analysis!

Agree with Mo that this implies we're way over the default 5% (which can be bumped, of course, but knowing how far we need to bump it is important).

As for expected rates... I would expect a common range of rates (especially at the start of a stream) would be 200-500kbps @ 30fps, extending up to 1-3Mbps @ 30fps.=C2=A0 I would expect to see bandwidths scale down to=C2=A0 40-50Kbps @ 30fps (I've deployed videophones operating well down to that (QCIF H264)).=C2=A0 At the = high end, I expect to scale up to 5+Mbps @ 30 or even 60fps.=C2=A0 And t= here may be use for 60fps down in the 500Kbps-2Mbps range for some usecases.

This speaks to:
* improve compression of the feedback data (RLE the loss data (or huffman encode, etc), and delta-encode the arrival times).=C2=A0 I = was pretty sure we'd need to do this, and this confirms it.
** There's more to win with compressing the arrival times aggressively
* negotiate the needed resolution and reporting intervals with the sender-side control in some manner.=C2=A0 If need be, do it in-band= in RTCP.
** while more painful in implementation, even the resolution/range of the timestamps could be negotiated
* we should consider if there's a way to compress or omit the repeated information that's in every report that Colin enumerated ** list of streams etc rarely changes


I'll add:
* at lower bandwidths relax the reporting interval to reduce effects of overhead and improve compression of the data, at the cost of less-reactive results in the congestion control
** Implies the need to test the algorithms for sensitivity to less-than-ideal feedback intervals
* look at (with some annoying complexity implied) piggybacking this data on RTP packets in header extensions
** shares overhead with reverse-direction RTP (good), may add to delay in receiving them (bad), but given that packets may be queued in both directions, piggybacking may work well in practice at higher framerates.=C2=A0 If we need to send feedback and the next anticipate= d packet going out isn't for a "while", we'd send an RTCP.=C2=A0 If we'= re pacing packets out or likely to send one "soon" relative to the reporting frequency, piggyback it.
** size of the extension might be an issue (packet size limits)
** this definitely adds complexity, but can save a considerable amount of overhead


The bandwidth implications of this was part of why (for adaptation in the 30-250Kbps @ 30fps) I used sparse receiver-side congestion control in the Ojo, reporting only significant changes in derived bandwidth via RTCP.=C2=A0 The challenge here will be to find a way = to fit feedback needed for sender-side congestion control into the available bandwidth.=C2=A0 I'm not concerned with having to increas= e the 5% default per se, but I am concerned with how much "goodput" we get in two-way traffic.=C2=A0 I don't want 200Kbps @ 30 spending 50Kbps on feedback....

--=20
Randell Jesup -- rjesup a t mozilla d o t com
Please please please don't email randell-ietf@jesup.org!  Way too=
 much spam
--------------774AE1A03009E75CEBC3D435-- From nobody Wed Jul 20 02:53:07 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 96AA812DA34 for ; Wed, 20 Jul 2016 02:53:04 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com X-Spam-Flag: NO X-Spam-Score: -15.808 X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-15.808 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H4=-0.01, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=-0.01, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-1.287, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=cisco.com Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id PNzuw2qI-caW for ; Wed, 20 Jul 2016 02:53:00 -0700 (PDT) Received: from aer-iport-3.cisco.com (aer-iport-3.cisco.com [173.38.203.53]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id D1D9E12D16C for ; Wed, 20 Jul 2016 02:52:53 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=1653; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1469008373; x=1470217973; h=subject:to:references:from:message-id:date:mime-version: in-reply-to:content-transfer-encoding; bh=TdzSkwCkhDxerGU5DPwTPjoyYD8nFhxkbaoe+Elot0w=; b=LY+nhCfrgSAb/eNbTdU8YU4tIDNLylQQwwFpczLP9sNWSMGlwqD25tFC seVFnlvRYco5Wj5TCoqELl80UkzMNokMe792Srm1iQAIxG4pdjq2O0417 PdHZU80v8bwFLPXAV5hNh7ppLvkiIpT1hkNzaB+LLJPFbiqkUxL7Mak4I U=; X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: =?us-ascii?q?A0CrBACaSY9X/xbLJq1dhBV8umsehXwCg?= =?us-ascii?q?XoBAQEBAQFmJ4RdAQUjFUARCw4KAgIFFgsCAgkDAgECAUUGAQwIAQGILA6vR41?= =?us-ascii?q?0AQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBH4EBhSmETYdBgloBBIJolj6GE4hPgjqHGIVnk?= =?us-ascii?q?CBUg3U6ModwAQEB?= X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.28,393,1464652800"; d="scan'208";a="636867736" Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-3.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 20 Jul 2016 09:52:52 +0000 Received: from [10.61.217.139] ([10.61.217.139]) by aer-core-3.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id u6K9qpIk022082; Wed, 20 Jul 2016 09:52:51 GMT To: Thomas Daede , rmcat@ietf.org References: <9d6f7ebf-bea0-b804-9e85-cdf13022de67@mozilla.com> From: Sergio Mena Message-ID: <578F49F3.3090500@cisco.com> Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2016 11:52:51 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.8.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 In-Reply-To: <9d6f7ebf-bea0-b804-9e85-cdf13022de67@mozilla.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Archived-At: Subject: Re: [rmcat] Test video sequence sources X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 20 Jul 2016 09:53:05 -0000 Thomas, First of all, we would like to thank you for the pointer you provide. We have indeed explored the sequences available at xiph.org site in the past. Unfortunately the vidyo sequences (vidyo1, vidyo2, and vidyo3), do not fulfill 2 of our requirements for a sequnce that can be used for obtaning video traces. Those sequences are too short (they are around 10 secs long... we need 1 minute as a minimum, ideally 2 mins); they also have 720p resolution, so the traces obtained couldn't be used for simulating encoded 1080p video. Indeed, the long sequences we are using at the moment are also available at the page you point at (big_buck_bunny and elephants_dream). The problem with those sequences is that they are animations, so when we encoded them, we could see huge peaks at some frames sizes in the encoded traces (see the slides presented in IETF95 for further info). [As a reminder, our requirements are: (1) 1 min minimum length, ideally 2 min, (2) conferencing-style content, i.e., no scene cuts, (3) 1080p min resolution. We are conscious that these requirement at somewhat stringent (uncompressed video will amount to 10s of GB), so we are planning on generating our own sequence (didn't have the resources to do so, so far)] Thanks, Sergio On 19/07/16 12:09, Thomas Daede wrote: > Xiph.Org hosts a large selection of test video sequences, donated from > various participants: > > https://media.xiph.org/video/derf/ > > There are longer videoconferencing sequences here, such as the Vidyo > ones (600 frames), as well as many other types of content. > > - Thomas > > From nobody Thu Jul 28 04:37:17 2016 Return-Path: X-Original-To: rmcat@ietf.org Delivered-To: rmcat@ietfa.amsl.com Received: from ietfa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B473712DE1C; Thu, 28 Jul 2016 04:37:12 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: internet-drafts@ietf.org To: X-Test-IDTracker: no X-IETF-IDTracker: 6.29.0 Auto-Submitted: auto-generated Precedence: bulk Message-ID: <20160728113712.12941.63635.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2016 04:37:12 -0700 Archived-At: Cc: rmcat@ietf.org Subject: [rmcat] I-D Action: draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-03.txt X-BeenThere: rmcat@ietf.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 List-Id: "RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques \(RMCAT\) Working Group discussion list." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 28 Jul 2016 11:37:13 -0000 A New Internet-Draft is available from the on-line Internet-Drafts directories. This draft is a work item of the RTP Media Congestion Avoidance Techniques of the IETF. Title : Coupled congestion control for RTP media Authors : Safiqul Islam Michael Welzl Stein Gjessing Filename : draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-03.txt Pages : 23 Date : 2016-07-28 Abstract: When multiple congestion controlled RTP sessions traverse the same network bottleneck, it can be beneficial to combine their controls such that the total on-the-wire behavior is improved. This document describes such a method for flows that have the same sender, in a way that is as flexible and simple as possible while minimizing the amount of changes needed to existing RTP applications. It specifies how to apply the method for both the NADA and Google congestion control algorithms. The IETF datatracker status page for this draft is: https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc/ There's also a htmlized version available at: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-03 A diff from the previous version is available at: https://www.ietf.org/rfcdiff?url2=draft-ietf-rmcat-coupled-cc-03 Please note that it may take a couple of minutes from the time of submission until the htmlized version and diff are available at tools.ietf.org. Internet-Drafts are also available by anonymous FTP at: ftp://ftp.ietf.org/internet-drafts/